In this episode, Doug is joined by NFL Insider Jordan Schultz to discuss how he navigated growing up as the son of Starbucks founder Howard Schultz, when he found out his dad bought the Sonics, his experience playing AAU withBrandon Roy and Martell Webster, why he decided not to walk on at the University of Washington, the blowback from his father selling the team, his transition into the media, why he decided to transition from NBA to NFL Insider, and his inside info on the KD/Nets Drama.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:06):
Hey, what up? Welcome in. I'm Doug Goli. This is
all ball. We got some great stuff for you. Jordan's
Schultz is our guest and the next couple of pods. Jordan,
of course you've seen him on ESPN Uh you go
back to all the different things he's done and now
as the ultimate kind of sports insider. Wait, do you
hear what he believes is the next step for him?
(00:27):
Plus what was it like growing up as Howard Schultz
son during the rise of Starbucks in Seattle? And oh yeah,
by the way, during the five years in which his
dad owned the Seattle SuperSonics. We'll get to all of
it upcoming. First, a quick thought on Kevin Durant and
the fact that he's gonna have to stay in Brooklyn.
And look, I continue to believe this that you've got
(00:50):
guys that they don't like the way k d has
handled things, And that's that's reasonable. It's very reasonable to
say I don't love how he's handled it. You know,
I thought bark he went, he went top rope and
it's not really called for like, Look, Barkley wasn't how
it ended in Philadelphia wasn't great. He wanted to be
traded um and I love everybody knows I've loved Charles.
We've had him on this pod. Who doesn't Who doesn't
(01:12):
love Charles Barkley and his honest commentary. But like, look,
he didn't hate in Oklahma City. He was just frustrated
by the ceiling of that team. Why can't we just
be honest. It was not a team built for the
twenty one century of all the shooting. They just didn't
have it. Now, they had a victory Oladipo right before
he left, and I'm thinking that team might have been
(01:33):
good enough, But it was a team that was built
to beat the Lakers. Two big guys, right, two big guys.
You had Ibaka and you had and he had Kendrick
Perkins and then later Steven Adams as well. So in
an era in which teams started playing small ball or
playing with one big guy, they had to. They were
built to beat the Spurs, built to beat the Lakers,
(01:55):
and not built to beat the Warriors. So I think
ultimately that caught up with him. He just didn't have
enough quality shooting, not just Russell Westbrook, but you forget
there was Andre Robertson before he got hurt. Great defender
couldn't shoot at all. You had too many guys that
couldn't shoot. So when we look back and we say, hey,
he never liked he loved Oklahoma City. He was a
leader there. He had great seasons there. He led the
(02:16):
league in scoring there. But he I think he inherently knew, like, man,
I I just feel like I can't win and I
can't be me. And his goal he said, and he
stated this was to prove he was the best against
the best, and he did that the finals MVP two
consecutive years, matching up with Lebron James was the better
player than Lebron James in both those series, and then
when he came back in the NBA Finals his third year.
(02:36):
But it wasn't a great fit and it was one
of those could they make it work? Yeah, But I
do think that k D knew what he thought was
best for him. He made a mistake tying his wagon
to Kyrie. But we should also point out that when
he tied his ship to Kyrie, even though people thought
Kyrie was aloof and hard to deal with. This is
way before we got to COVID stuff. There's a lot
(02:59):
of weird off that took place. So I'm not giving
Katie a total pass for his behavior, but I do
I understand it, or at least I articulate that understand
it more publicly than than most people do. That said,
like we still haven't seen what this team looks like
whole He gives Sean Marks the rest of the off
season to fix it, to figure it out, and you
see what it looks like. And then if you don't,
(03:19):
if you don't win this year, in Kyrie's last year,
you can't get along. If Steve Steve Nash can't show
that he can be a coach, well then by all means,
but Steve Nash has yet to have a training camp
with all three stars competing and playing camp put his
system that way. Can't make good season, massive dramatic change
and expect to have a system put in. That's just
a fact. All right. Let's get to Jordan Schultz, who
(03:41):
joins us now on the All Ball podcast. By now,
everyone knows who you are and when they google, they
know who your family is, but they don't actually know you.
All right, Like that's you haven't had I don't feel
like you had the this is who I am sort
of thing, you know, not just playing in college, but
(04:02):
growing up? What was your life growing up? Give me
a I'll close my eyes paint the picture of your
childhood at like ten? Wellhood ten? Um, well apprecy, sure
you have me on the show. Love All Ball. I've
been listening for a long time and love all the
hoop talks, especially when you get into the West Coast stuff.
So this is a real pleasure. Um, my life at
(04:23):
ten was I think at that point pretty normal in
terms of you know, I was having very similar experiences
as my friends growing up in Seattle. I think for
me when it really changed was probably late middle school,
early high school fourteen, fifteen sixteen, for a variety of reasons. Um,
(04:44):
you know, but my parents did a really good job
of making sure that my experiences as a kid mirrored
my peers. And what I mean by that is it
was clear that we were, as a family, really blessed.
But you know, if he flew on a plane, they
would fly first class. My sister and I would fly
in the back of the plane. Um. If anytime we
(05:07):
did dinners, we always contributed to the cleaning up and
the cooking. Um. They're just they tried to keep it
as normal as possible, but I think by default, when
Starbucks really exploded in the late nineties early two thousand's,
I was coming of age as well, and life got
really big at that point, and so things started to change.
(05:29):
But go back, go back for me a little bit though. Okay, so,
but in its infancy, like when you would describe, Hey,
what does your dad do? Like obviously had a family
phrase for this because I was so embarrassed by it
that I never want anybody to know Doug. So the
family phrase we came up with, really my mom and
(05:50):
I came up with, was he's in retail, he's already
And then if people ask more, we'd say, you know,
he does some brick and mortar and the and the
s Attle community and they're trying to expand to the
national That's what we say. So did you know, like
what did you were you aware of of of when
(06:10):
it went from being Seattle based, you know too, to
grow like, were you aware of these things? And you
know what was was your dad telling you these things?
Are you listening to conversations? It was that I think
I think I became hyper aware of everything because for
a couple of reasons, One growing up in that environment,
You're naturally super aware of how everyone else is looking
(06:34):
at you. So my reactions to meeting people, um, for
the first time, or am I say my my response
to meeting people for the first time was a go
above and beyond be respectful. Um. I just always felt
like I was being watched. You know, when when we
had when he had the Sonics, which he bought in
a one I think it was I was fourteen, So
(06:56):
we we were at these games and on the on
the court, and I felt like the whole arena was
looking down and it was they were looking for me.
You know, this is ridiculous. They were looking for me
to like make a mistake and someone was gonna was
gonna see something I did that wasn't supper, respectful or positive.
So I was super hyper aware as a result of
(07:17):
what I was of how I was conducting myself. But
but did you tell you, like, hey, I'm gonna buy
the signs that conversation just walk in one day, go
like I bought the Sonics. I made the varsity as
a freshman, which was a big deal. And what high
school in high school? Yeah, but you know what high
school university prep. So you know, like you know the
(07:38):
Seattle Preps O days, Rainder Beaches. We played all those
schools in middle school, but by the time we got
to high school, our school was Class one A. Those
were all three as we were, we were a lot smaller. Um,
so you make make the high school arsity? Yeah, my
dad says to me, Um, I think it might have been.
It was right around then, because I remember in my
(08:00):
head like varsity Sonics. So he comes, I'll never forget.
He picked me up for practice because I couldn't drive yet,
and he said on the way home, there's something really
important I need to discuss with you. I think it's
a good thing, but you're the person that I'm going
to talk to first out than Mom. And I was
so confused, and he says, Um, this is gonna He
(08:23):
prefaces it by saying, Duck, this is gonna change your
life in our life forever, and he kind of like
beat around the bush because I think he wanted to
set it up. That's how he Then he goes, I
think I'm gonna buy the Sonics and I'll never forget.
He waited till the till the second we got into
the driveway to tell me, and we were parked in
our driveway in Seattle and he's and he tells me that,
(08:45):
and I, I was so confused, but so excited. You know,
that's every kid's dream. I mean, it's not even a dream,
it's ridicululous. And he said, what do you think? And
obviously I was all in. And when do I get
to meet Gary Payton? That was the first question. When
when do I get to meet Cheap and Sean Kimp?
And is Debt look a nice guy? And he was like,
I don't know these guys, but but I was so
(09:05):
fired up. So I think for me being hyper aware
of what I was saying earlier, my dad buying the
Sonics also was right around when they went to Asia,
which I think was two thousand or so, when they
really exploded internationally in the Asian Going to Asia and
having really the whole content, but especially China explode with
(09:29):
Starbucks was simultaneous with me becoming of age realizing that
things were different, and then obviously the Sonics was like
the whole. It was like the next level. Fox Sports
Radio has the best sports talk lineup in the nation.
Catch all of our shows at Fox sports radio dot
com and within the I Heart radio app search f
s R to listen live. How do you how do
(09:52):
you go through high school? Like this, Like that's a
real question, Okay, I mean, like for people who are
are putting this all together. Starbucks exploding, your dad owns
the Sonics in Seattle's and you're a high school set
not not not a big case but but but like
you know, I mean, this is and you have to
(10:13):
go to high school and play high school basketball and
you have Sholtz in the back of year, but everybody
knows everybody, you know. Yeah, it was. I hate to
say it was challenging because it's just I just hate
(10:34):
saying that, you know why, because you don't have to.
It's so everything has like here's the way of looking
at It's like we talked about this in sports all
the time. It's just as hard to maintain a level
of excellence as it is too. It's actually probably easier
to get there than it is to stay there. Like
to climb. The climb is kind of the easy part
(10:54):
because people are telling you can't and you have that.
Then when you do it, everybody tells you how great
you are. Now you gotta go do it again. In
so for you and again, this is not a lodder.
You climbed is a lot of your dad climbed. But
it's it's it's challenging. Right everybody thinks you're spoiled, rich kid.
Everybody has an opinion of you before they even meet you,
right they that's really the hard part. They have an
(11:16):
opinion of you before they meet you. And I'm wondering,
you know, you're already still a teenager. How did you
handle all that? I? Um, I really so. All My
best friends were from kindergarten. There was like four five
of us kindergarten, maybe first grade, and so I leaned
on them a lot, and it was really important to
(11:36):
me to have that because I think they were the
only ones I trusted. We all played basketball together. We're
kind of like our little own little click um and
I didn't venture very far out from that when we
started playing au basketball and made it a little bit
more difficult because now we were in interested in gyms
and people were relentless with not the making fun of
(12:00):
but at the asking questions. You know, everybody wanted ticket, everyone,
everyone wanted to have a business idea. When I was
fourteen or fifteen, that was really hard to hear, um,
you know, like I remember one of my coaches like
wanted This sounds insane, but one of my au coaches
wanted to know if I could set him up potentially
(12:22):
to be a Sonics assistant. I didn't even know how
to handle that. I was so confused. I went home.
My dad was like, I'm not gonna say his name.
He was like that guy, hell no, you know, like,
oh my god, I thought, I thought somebody hits you up,
Like can I get one? You have to have like
a card where I get like Doug, that's is there
a car? No, that's that's that's that's a given. Come on,
(12:45):
you have you have auto reload on your Starbucks app.
I don't. I'm gonna tell you why. Um, that's a given.
The Starbucks Starbucks thing is a given. And when you
go and I going to the store with you so
I can get free stuff? You know, can I get
a free card? That's a given? No, I had my dad.
I would I would ask my dad as a as
a kid, but that's when I was younger, like nine ten,
(13:07):
and he would say, it's a public company. Everyone has
to pay, and the most important person to pay is me. Arguably,
because that's what everyone sees and it sets the wrong precedent,
especially for the employees and the customers. So you know,
I never that that was less the big deal. That
was already like hit home for me. So it was,
but I was used to people asking about Starbucks. The
(13:27):
kicker was the sonic stuff. And by the time I
was a sophomore, you know, starting and having some success,
it was like any time we'd go play any other
high school, I would hear the chance frappuccino when I
was in the free throw line. Uh, Tullies, Tullies is better. Uh.
Little Latte was a big one. Little Lotte. Uh. So
(13:52):
I I think I just it was a lot to handle.
I definitely leaned on my parents. I did not have
a big group of friends, and that was that was helpful.
But yeah, I hate to say it was tough because
I recognized the how fortunate it was. Okay, Um, what
what was the decision like in terms of college where
(14:15):
to go? Where to play? You know, do you go?
Do you stay home? And you know, walk on you
dub That's what I wanted. You team. We had Brandon
Roy and Martell Webster in our programs. So I grew
up playing with those guys. You know, Marvin Williams, parents Williams,
all these great players, you know, all these guys. Um,
(14:39):
And what happened was, Um, I'll never forget we my
senior year, our school had never been down state, and
I had the best game of my life and we
went and I took us down state and I had
a tape of the game. Life is how many points
my high my high? Yeah, total in high school was
(15:02):
forty two my junior year, but on eleven threes, so
I took a lot of three. I was. I wasn't
very athletic, I was. I was ahead of my time
with video. I seen video you shoot shooting? Yeah, he
really knows well and you gotta you gotta be Is
there a Jim at the house? About? There was a
(15:24):
we had a basketball hoop outside right on the lake
and there was a there were lights. I would shoot
there every night. Every night, every night I would go
out there. What what what like Washington? We were We
were like two miles away from Husky Stadium. Bro. I
grew up right by you. I was a huge Husky fan,
which brings me to what I was saying, Brandon going
(15:45):
to Martelli committed to you, dub I really wanted to
play there. You know, I didn't really I knew I
wasn't going to get a scholarship, but I thought Romar
when he saw this tape, and I remember he told us, uh,
you could, you could come, come, but I promise you
you'll never play, and that really hurt me. I was like,
(16:05):
I can't do that. And so what I did was, UM,
I probably had about fifteen schools that I was talking to,
anywhere from low major D one, D two all the
way down to D three, and I took some visits.
I went up to Western Washington, you know which one
of D two national title. UM. I was definitely interested
(16:26):
in all these you know, mid level schools. Ultimately, I
was like, I'm gonna go play with Lambent D three,
great coach, it's a perfect fit. We go there to
do the summer camp going into my freshman year, and
I say I can't. I can't go to school in
Salem Morgan. I had like a meltdown. I come back.
I tell my parents that are like, what are you
gonna do? And I was like, I gotta start contacting
(16:48):
these coaches, but there are no spots left. This is
like August, this is like this time. And so finally
we reached out to Seattle. You you know, Joe Colero,
h he didn't can be very much. They they were
like recruiting me, why don't you like you? I just
think he didn't. I think he had some preconcying notions
and also he didn't like on an athletic shooting guards.
(17:13):
So but he was like, listen, why don't you come in?
And I know who you are? And he did not
recruit me because I know who you are, why don't
you come in? And that open run with the guys.
I played really well in the summer for like a
couple of weeks and then said, guys said, you fit
right in. You could be an invite to walk on.
So that's why I did. I went to Seattle you
red shirted um. And then after my second year, I realized,
(17:34):
you know, I wasn't ever going to play a whole
lot here, and so then I transferred to Occidental another
D three and uh and went there in l A.
I think also I wasn't ready to leave Seattle for
whatever reason. But by the time my junior year came around,
I really was ready to leave. I like, I think
I needed that extra year or two of a safety
net of being close to home because the campus was
(17:55):
seven minutes from my house. And then eventually I left.
Did you live at home? No, I lived in the dorms,
so my freshman year. In my sophomore year, I lived
in an apartment. But I mean I was home once
or twice a week, So it was very it was
it was not the kind of college experience and you
dub probably would have been like that too, for better
or worse. So you go to Accidental and now it's
a completely different experience, right that even even if a
(18:18):
couple of guys know a little bit about you, nobody,
in fact is nobody knows right l A. Nobody knows
nobody gives this ship right like you. But but but
but I'm guessing there was probably sometimes you kind of
missed some of that, right that, I mean miss people
like it's free. It's freeing it first, because you can
kind of create a whole new personal, whole new life.
(18:41):
On the other hand, it's not the worst thing in
the world when everybody knows you and and kind of
knows you. In the basketball scene, the Baskett i didn't.
I didn't miss not I didn't miss being known as
Howard's son. I was really over that I missed that
great Seattle organic basketball scene because it was incredible. That
(19:01):
was the real explosion of Seattle basketball. You know, it
was right on the heels of Jamal making it. You
had Nate, Nate and Um Brandon. He had so many
great players, and we all played at this small grammar
Sea Grammar School gym in Seattle, you know, five six
days a week. We played there every single day together.
There were drills threes, five ones. I played with Brandon
(19:24):
every day and I missed that because once I got
to l A, that was all evaporated. And on top
of that, my best friend was well on his way
to becoming a dominant D three player. He ended up
playing in Europe, so he was having all the success
and I wasn't having success. And I also thought that
by going from Seattle, you which is now Division one
and then was basically going to Division one was division two.
(19:47):
I thought by going to D three, I would just dominate,
and that didn't happen. So it was a big wake
up call for me. What was what was the conversation
like when you're dad told you was selling the Sonics.
Oh that that was. That wasn't just one conversation, Doug,
because it was it was a lot in the works,
and it all happened right as I was transferring to Occidental,
(20:10):
So it was like my junior year a lot. That
was a lot going on. Basically they had for those
who don't know, almost from the get go, they tried
to get into arena because Kirina was owned by the city.
They wanted a similar deal kind of was what the
Seahawks and Mariners had. The city didn't want to pay,
and he knew it wasn't sustainable to stay in KI Arena.
(20:30):
And I think, also, why why didn't they want to
pay because they already the Mariners and Seahawks, and they thought,
you know this, there's another billionaire. He can pay for
his own arena. Right. So KI Arena is nice, it's
really nice, but it wasn't It was built right before
the mega suite arena. It was so it's really small.
(20:52):
Seventeen thousand didn't really have big suites, so it was
it was losing. They were losing a lot of money.
And he also so dug to be totally canned the
NBA lifestyle, at least at that point, had really worn
on him. The reason he bought the Sonics was twofold. One.
He loves sports, he loves basketball. But secondly, and I
would argue more importantly, he wanted to turn the Sonics
(21:13):
into that Starbucks type of atmosphere where everybody is equally
valued and everyone has a voice, and and he he
can never get there. Um, he could just never get
there with the with the with the team, with the
with the league. But but but because but there there's
still people to this day for losing the team never stopped. Yeah, yeah,
(21:35):
I mean I I got so used to that. I mean,
I don't think I've ever said this, so this is
some breaking news. Um, I don't even want to say it.
But I actually had I had security with me in
Seattle during that because I think it was my sophomore
year of college. I had security with me because we
were getting death threats and people were yelling at me
because people knew who I was, so I couldn't really
(21:57):
go anywhere without people saying stuff to me. So not
only they, but that once he had to get security
from my sister and me, and she was in high
school it was. It was really it was. It was
a tough time because Um and everyone I knew was
coming after him, so by default they were coming after
me trying to get to him. Um. But I know
people blame him. They'll never stop blaming him. And Uh,
(22:19):
he's apologized saying he should have been more patient. The
truth is he uh when he sold it to Clay,
when he told it to Clay Bennett, they had been
told that they were going to try to keep the
team in Seattle. It came out through emails and it
was an investigation and almost a federal lawsuit that they
weren't and they had. I think in retrospect, my dad
(22:40):
would have tried more. But I think he was a
combination of he was really frustrated with not getting support
from the council, city council, and also I think he
was so frustrated with the state of the of the
of the league and the fact that the team wasn't
performing the way he wanted. No people forget that that
was kind of a dark in the India, right, It
was a dark air in the NBA. That was during
(23:02):
the time when you had the Nets Spurs, the lowest
rated finals ever. That was when they had the institute
the dress code because they had gotten out of control.
Was post Jordan era, and it was it was it
was like people don't it's like football, yeah right, And
I grew up in in Orange County, southern California. The
Rams and the Raiders left and people like man two
(23:23):
teams left, like nobody cared. Like the NFL was different
then the NBA then post Jordan was different. With Jordan,
it was the biggest league after Jordan's it fell apart.
So it's it's really interesting. Okay, so you go to Occidental,
But you did have a really good career. When did
it turn? When did it change? Ah? I had really
good games. I don't know if my career was sustained.
(23:45):
Uh who is your coach? Brian knew all he's still there.
He also didn't like me very much. You know, youven
say if you put half as much effort into your
defense as you're shooting, you could be all American. Now
you never said um I had. I think what happened
was um I. Once I got there, I got out
(24:08):
of that Seattle, once I got comfortable enough in l A,
um I got a better shape. I started paying attention
to more all that stuff um and started becoming a
somewhat important part of the team. We were nationally ranked
in the in the D three level, you know, top fifteen,
and we went to the tournament a couple of years
and so I never started. But there were games that
(24:32):
I had big games. I think one my I think
one game I went, I had like a seven of
eight for three games. We played rus of San Diego
the yearly, but you kind of the tournament. I had
an awesome game. I made a ton of threes. So
you know, for me, it was always it really was
down to was I making shots and what kind of
shape was I in so that I could at least
be adequate defensively. But I again, I never felt this
(24:55):
is this is unfortunate, and I think everybody wants this.
I never felt like I had a buy in from
my college coach. I know you've talked a lot about
coach Sudden what he meant to you in the program.
I never had that, you know, But I I would
also tell you and candidly, like you know, for me,
I think he bought into he knew what I could
(25:16):
do whatever. I'm sure he was frustrated with my shooting Uh, well,
it's because I didn't make it right. And so he's
just like and and he would take me out if
I missed. So the easy, the easy deal is like
if I just don't shoot and they can't take me out, right,
if I stay in, then we're better. I'm out playing
with the point guard doesn't shoot totally, but it does
(25:38):
get to a point though, where guys get frustrated. We're like, yo,
you gotta shoot the ball. And I'm like, you gotta
talk to the old man, because if I shoot the
ball and I missed, I'm coming out. And I know
that and I feel that, so I do, like I
just wish I was able to articulate to him because
we didn't have a good relationship to sit down and
me like, listen, I'm gonna take three spots and that's
(25:59):
all I'm gonna work on. And if I take those
shots I missed, you leave me in. Let's take other
shots to take. And had I done that and established
I can make these for you, but you didn't and
and and uh, I would have, I would have played
more minutes. I think we would have had even more
success than we had. You get done playing. Now, what's
(26:19):
the plan when I got done. I graduated a year
late because I had read shirt in my freshman year.
Totally honest, like academics. You know, ox Hills are really
good school. I always say, like it was, it was
really hard, so I took my time. Um, when I graduated,
my girlfriend winded up. Mary, what did you do during
that year when you're not playing? Uh? Because there was
(26:43):
another year? Right you you went to you went to
school after your eligibility inspired But I had decided I
wasn't going to play a fifth year because I was
just so frustrated at that point and I never felt okay,
so so you but you did go to school and
I went to school. I actually got super fat. I
blew up. I stopped working out. Uh put a lot
(27:03):
of weight. Let's super what's super fat for you? It's
so bad. I'm I got up to the fattest, the
heaviest ever was I've never said this. This is another first.
I was to seventy one. Holy shit, how to are
you under six three? Yeah? Yeah? I really big? Okay,
(27:25):
so like, no, you're doing Everybody goes said that you're
missing on like sixty pounds. That's a lot of that's
a lot of What was your biggest vice, what was
the worst thing. I'm not a I'm not a big
there's ferry, ferry. I love ice cream, of course. What
(27:50):
were your what were your toppings? The Kiwi strawberry yogurt
chips and I'm so sick. I would say it was
a Peakberry in Pasadena where I was living. I would
go this is my I would go to get Thai food,
which is also bad for you, and then I would
go to the Pinkberry and I would get a large
to go in a large to eat as I was there. Yeah, sick, sick.
(28:12):
I'm ice cream fanatic. I can put on weight really
fast because I could eat so much whatever you want
to call it. You know like when old when a
running back you see them thirty years later and you're like,
what happens all belly? That's what I was. So I
could hide it. But but you're liken't think about that. Yeah, okay,
(28:36):
so so you so you graduate? I graduated? You still
have the year was? Yeah, I just like messed around.
I didn't but internships really competitively. I was at Fox
sports dot Com. I did an internship with the l
A Times, So those were huge internships. From me. I
stayed in l a for for the summer um and
so when I did, and then it really cemented further
(29:00):
admitted that I wanted to be in sports media and
then I could. I could do it. And so when
I graduated, my girlfriend who I ended up marrying, said
to me, I'm gonna I want to go to New
York City and I like, I'm going to New York
City And I was like I wanted back to Seattle
or maybe saying no, and she was like, I'm I
think you should try it for sports media. And regardless,
(29:22):
I'm going, I hope you come. So I wasn't. I
wasn't gonna let I wasn't gonna be long distance with
her because I was really in love with her, and
I also knew that she was right with the sports
media element. I knew that was the best place for
New York City. I followed Um City followed New York City.
(29:43):
What was your what was your first gig there. I've
worked at a company called youth Star, which was it
was like a video game system where you can superimpose
yourself into old movies and reenact them. It was cool,
but actually one one problem was, uh when The New
(30:04):
York Times tech guy reviewed it. I think there was
like a really big bug in the system and like
broke his computer and the company just imploded. So I
so so so see here two seventy two, did you
start losing weight? Yeah? I started to get down there,
you know, two five to forty five, I got. I got,
(30:24):
you know, all the way down to you know, to
to twenty and right now I'm probably five. So I
got you kicked the Pinkberry. Is Pinkberry forever or is
it like a once a month? I do? I do
it now. It's not Perry now. It's just like one
of the many New York ice cream reeves. And I
don't just order. I'll wear like six pints and it's
like the one I'm gonna get you. I'm gonna get you.
(30:45):
So so I'm gonna get you McConnell's viroment. Baby. I'm
a big fan, I know, I said, I said. I
said something nice about them on on the Dan Patrick Show,
and I got like ten pints. It's great ice cream,
great ice cream, just to show you, like, you know,
(31:06):
you can get that ship. And I'm ice cream kind
of serve. So I discovered them and like, I don't know,
every three months, I'll get like a six points from
them ships Greater's, Greater's ice cream. McConnell was, Greater is
a little heavier, but I love Greaters. I love that
black raspberry fudge. Yeah, that's like their signature one. That's
really good. Well what happened, Okay, so what happened was
(31:28):
basically um, once once once that come. While I was
doing the Youth Start thing, I was simultaneously working not
getting paid, but I was writing a blog called ten
Feet High for a website that and I grew it
to like I don't know, fifty subscribers or something. It
did really well, and it got named Best Sports Blogs
(31:51):
of two thousand ten because I was writing it while
I was also working for this other company. Whenever I time,
I would just write, And eventually that led to an
opportunity of a house remember them as a as a
copy editor, and I did a lot of those like
late graveyard ships. But it was a year of that
learning how to edit stories, how to put them on
a site. And then a year after that, Tough Post
(32:11):
brought me in to be their sports columnist and that
was my so called you know, first break to really
right Uh stories, Now, when you're working for our post,
did they tell you like, is there a you have
to you have to take a left leaning land to
every story? Like is there is there any sort of
pressure to it? Um? They told you without telling you.
In other words, it's like, um, you know you you
(32:35):
sit in with meetings with Ari on the big you
know media, big media discussions, and there we all kinds
of discussions about everything but sports, which also made me
realize how insignificant sports was to them. But you know,
women's rights, female empowerment, um, you know, everything that everything
left that you could possibly imagine, um, voting, LGBT and
(33:00):
que it was. It dominated the discussions. Don't forget plus
plus Latin actually doesn't didn't exist then, but everything possible
we we hit on and and it. It was really
interesting for me to learn about that, even though I
wasn't writing about it. But I had never had that
kind of perspective. Um. It's also the first real news
(33:21):
corporation I was in it that was they were monsters,
you know. But but I think it's I think it's
interesting though that like one of the things I've struggled with,
and I again I'm not putting words in your mouth
or things thoughts in your brain. But I struggle with
the it's like two different worlds. It's in that world
of politics. You know, there's race and politics and religion,
(33:43):
and it can be very divisive. Whereas you know, you
grew up in Seattle, and you know, like rand Roy's
one of your best friends. You're going like race doesn't
really sports and especially and especially West Coast, Like it's
still a little bit in the South and maybe a
little bit in the Northeast the times whatever, But in
sports and in Seattle and on the West Coast, it
(34:04):
doesn't feel like it's or to me, it was never
a thing. Just wasn't um What was that like for you?
I think um sports is an unbelievable conquer of racism.
It provides a true even playing field where skin color,
(34:27):
sexual orientation, none of it matters. If you can play,
you can play, if you're a teammate. And I ate
that up. That was crucial to my development. And you know,
I remember like like after our au practices, like you know,
giving Brandon or Martella right home and and dropping them
off at their place and seeing the dichotomy between where
(34:48):
I was growing up and where they grew up. And
then you know, I had him over the house, and
you know, for me it was normal to live there,
and for them, you know, I remember when they first
came over, it was like so differ friends and seeing
how they reacted that was really important for me because
it made me appreciate that much more what I was experiencing.
So with basketball, yeah, I think you're right, especially Yeah,
(35:11):
the West Coast. I mean basketball in Seattle is so
important and significant that and you have you have like
the godfathers that have really brought it along. You see that,
you see Jamal's proramerg the crossover. I mean, it's massive now.
And so I was at the real beginning of that,
you know, when like Jamal and Aaron Brooks and all
(35:32):
those were stucky they were all coming up, and so
I was so invested in it that I think it
really did help me, um emotionally. The racism that I
experienced or that I saw wasn't in Seattle growing up.
It was it wasn't in l A. It's it's been
in pockets in New York City. Um, certainly, And it
(35:53):
feels weird to say that because it's a melting plot,
but there's so many people and there's it's I've seen
it in your more than any other place, m Um.
I think also, I think also just gonna say, you know,
the whole, the whole idea that I came from where
(36:14):
I came from, and like you that you're not gonna
be spoiled or entitled. I've I just I've I've realized
that's impossible because I I've always parents were always like,
don't be spoiled, don't be titled, don't be that little
rich kid. You don't want to be that. But there's
(36:34):
just certain things that I do and say that I
catch myself, but I see like that's a byproduct of
how I was raised, and I'm probably always gonna have that.
I'm realistic, but you're always also gonna be judged by
that as well. People assume and people assume a negative
stereotype even if it doesn't actually exist. Yeah, I mean,
(36:58):
so there's that's that's when when I and I say
how it was raised, I meant really how I were
the way manner which I grew up. But my when
I went when I met my wife and I met
my girlfriend, her dad didn't want to meet me because
he just assumed that you know, what do you assumed?
And we've become really close subsequently, but and he's apologized.
(37:19):
But that's happened a lot. And that's why I said,
I'm so engaged with with what people are perceiving. And
I will go I will do things that nobody else
will do. I feel like when I when I when
I meet with's somebody for the first time, or I
need to make an impression that's so positive in my
mind because I know what they want to think, I
know where they want to go. You've done a really
(37:41):
remarkable job in sports media of having connections in multiple sports, right,
Like we all start and mask like and look, I've
done national radio for twenty years and I've done a
TV TV show, my own other TV shows. Whatever. You're
still and I don't think it's necessary, and you have stereotype,
but you still get kind of typecast as you're a
(38:03):
basketball guys, right, But you've done a really impressive job
of creating alliances and connections in all sports. The things
that you break, the stories that you know, the depth
that you provide. How do you have you been able
to do that? I really appreciate that. It means a lot. Um,
and I I think you were on ESPN when I
(38:24):
was in college. What what what you were you on
ESPN two oh three? Oh I started there, oh two
oh three to two thousand and twelve. Yeah, I was.
I was in high school when you were on the SPAN,
So I was watching you, not not the Days through Douglas. No,
it's okay, I mean it's it's really it's a weird.
It's been a very interesting existence, you know. And I
(38:48):
remember you were definitely one of the guys that I
was like, I I want to do that, you know,
the Eisans Scott's Mains, Patricks, the you know. I watched
ESPN religiously. So to answer your question, Um, I was
so desperate and hungry to be successful in the space
(39:09):
that when I first jumped into it, and I love
sports so much. When I first jumped into it, I decided,
I'm gonna do everything, especially basketball, football. But I'm not
gonna I'm not gonna pigeonholed myself. I'm gonna just do
all the sports. And because I can do it, because
I love all sports, and nobody knows sports like me.
Everyone thinks and within that I started developing relationships over
(39:32):
time with different people in different leagues, across different sports,
and I think, um as I've grown in the space,
especially over the last several years here, is that I
really want to do it through the lens of the athlete,
because that's how I always identified myself. And I think
also one thing that I haven't talked about a love publicly,
(39:55):
but it's important for me, is that when we have
the Sonics, I saw firsthand and the way the Seattle
media would just hammer guys um oftentimes unwarranted and it it.
I hated it, and I because I knew a lot
of the guy I was friendly with all with all
of them, and at one at one point in college,
I was working out with them, so I was around it,
(40:16):
and I saw what they put into it to get
to try and have success in that league and what
it was, how mentally draining, physically, emotionally, what it did
to their families. So when I saw the way media
would ruthlessly go after guys, I I just decided that's
how I was never gonna be was through the opposite.
I was gonna pump guys up. I was gonna try
(40:38):
to present through the lens of the athlete, what's under
the helmet or what's that person going through? And so
I think that's really helped me having a clear cut mission,
and then over the last year, finally making the decision
after so many conversations with different executives and even family
of you cannot do, as my parents would say, you
can't dance everyone's wedding, pick one thing. So I've really
(41:00):
league picked the NFL ironically to be an insider in
that sport, while still providing basketball commentary, maybe some reporting,
and using those relationships to help advance the story. But
knowing that I'm going to really focus on the NFL,
I think has been really helpful. M Well, what I
(41:20):
what I realized why, was that the NFL is even
all a basketball guy through and through, and that's my
favorite sport. Football. The NFL really is the true three
sport in terms of media interests. All the way that
the league has marketed events to combine the Senior Bowl,
of the Draft, everything about it. It's just the calendar
(41:42):
goes NonStop. And I think also I realized, if I'm
gonna break stories, just the numbers game of it is
much more, much more um opportunistic in the NFL because
there's some more players. You have your act to fifty three,
your practice bad guys. In the NBA, it's like twelve guys,
and there's so many more agents in the NFL. There's more,
(42:04):
there's more executives. There's just more opportunity, just more. There's
just more. There's just more. There's just more. I I
totally get. Here's the other part that that you should
think about using word because people will use against you
why you're a basketball guy like okay, but if you
look at the people in the news breaking space, right,
(42:26):
they're not athletes at all, They're just reporters. So having
an athletic background actually is you can relate and understand
more of the athletes. You can relate and understand more
with the agents. But like I'll just say, like I
got to do a TV game for Fox the Bears
versus the Dolphins a couple of years ago, and I'll
(42:47):
never forget I walk, I walk into beating in Dave
or going comes out and use the quarterbacks coach with
the Bears. Okay, and I remember David were going from
playing LOUISVILLI played in the NFL obviously, and all he
want to talk about with Louisville. Who that's it, right.
He's like, I'll tell you everything you want to know
about Travisky, but you gotta tell me everything about the hoops, right.
(43:08):
And so we sat and talked for like an hour
and literally every person I've I've met in the NFL,
you know, I live in UH in Orange County, close
to the right, real close to the Chargers, right basically
in between the Rams and the and the Chargers. UH
do camp and the Chargers until they moved to Elsa Gando.
This is where they operate their headquarters out of Customation.
(43:30):
And every time I walk into their building or go
to their practice one of these systems, one of the
players comes up and they want to They want to
talk hoops, and it's a it's a way in to
their world by letting you by talking that I do
want to ask. You must feel it, they know it,
and I think, because I think also taking it a
(43:52):
step further beyond just the sports, is that because I
was able, because I grew up the way I did,
there's a I think there's a sophistication to it being
in the room, as being in the same room as
like world leaders and pop stars, and mega athletes made
me so much more comfortable as a young man to
(44:14):
now be in this position to see the athlete as
a human being first and not be intimidated. I think
that's been really important as well. Yeah, the lack of
intimidations that is a is a huge, huge element to it,
and it also brings the level of sophistication that you're
not just going to put out there any message they
want out there. You know, there has to be a
(44:34):
you know, I can't be used in this thing like
everything it's it's it's a genuine has to be a
genuine relationship. You are close, I know on some level
to the nets durant situation. How did that happen? How
did they? How did that happen? Where they're not they're gonna,
at least for now stayed again. Well, I think everyone
(44:57):
within the NETS organization number one was really disappointed with
how things ended with James Harden. You know he when
the Nets got him. I remember talking to to them
two players and they're like the thing and being like
there's only one ball, how's this gonna work? And guys,
we're talking to c J him saying James just a
(45:17):
hooper he'll figure it out, and for a long time
he did. But him not being in good shape, not
showing up that war on that team. So you had
that and the number two Kyrie not getting a vaccination.
Whether or not you whether you agree with him or not,
is in material. But he got hurt. He got hurt
when they're being they're beating the Bucks, he gets hurt. Right,
(45:40):
they doesn't get vaccine. And the part to it that
I've been told, which is a real thing, is like
they never had the group together in training camp. So
you can't have a system if you don't have time
to put in the system. And with a coach who,
even though his basketball knowledge is superior, his coaching knowledge
is Nathan. So I think Steve became the puppets not
(46:04):
the right word, I've heard that, but he became very
easily moved around and it became clear that that he
was just there to make sure everything ran as well
as it could. But when so when Kyrie gets hurt,
doesn't get back, he's not there, he's not even the
building that he's playing at home, and he's not traveling.
That wore down that team as well. And I think ultimately,
(46:26):
you know Kevin I think what people don't understand about
Kevin Durant maybe they do now you tell me, is
is just how much he cares and how sensitive is
he's a really I think I'm biased, but I think
Kevin is a great guy. But he but he's sensitive
and in a good way. He cares what people are
saying clearly, and he sees everything. He's so he's really
(46:50):
shrewd and smart with how he he listens and he
sees and hears everything. So when you see him clapping
back on social that's him genuinely caring. I think ultimately,
when James gets traded, they had this hope we can
salvage this thing with Ben Simmons. But from what I
was told from from the nets was that Simmons between
(47:13):
the back and some of the emotional stuff, he was
just never there. It was never gonna happen. So there
was so much negative energy in that whole operation. That's
where you saw Kevin this summer saying I want to
be somewhere else, and candidly, I think it's now come out.
But I remember at the time Rich Kleiman said telling me,
you know, I've been clearer with him. I want I
(47:35):
prefer he stayed in Brooklyn, and you know, this is
his decision, this is the impasse. But I think ultimately
this was always the most likely scenario, and I think
it's the best scenario in terms of you know, being
trying to be successful in that next year if they're
both healthy, well, Kyrie Brie in Brooklyn next year, Yeah,
I think he will be because here's you know, I've
(47:58):
been critical with Sean Marks full disclosure. I don't know
if you have a relationship with him. I've been critical
of him for not really having a culture Kyrie. But
they had the culture before they brought these two guys in.
That was the whole thing was they had had a culture.
Huh before they brought Kyriean k D and Kyrie in, Right,
they had a great culture. How do you build a
(48:21):
culture when point guards not there? And how to build
a culture when the point guard says, we don't really
need a head coach? How to be able a culture
when I need the point guard when the point guard
comes in and look, I think, how he's an incredible talent,
but he was the one who said, like, basically, half
these guys won't be here when we're any good anyway, right,
it's it's it's impossible to build a culture like that. Yeah.
(48:42):
I was critical of the move when they fired Kenny.
I didn't get that and like it at all. I
understood why they hired Steve, But to me, they need
and meet they needed and need a head coach who
has real head coach sperience, students and can say oh
to Kevin or no to Kyrie. But ultimately, if you're
asking me right now, I believe that Kyrie will be
(49:04):
there next year, the Net the next the Nets know
that if Kyrie and Kevin are both right, they it's
so hard not to see what that elevator could be
because I could be that. That was That was my
statement on my last pod, which which was which is like, look,
anybody who says that you know what it looks like,
you're lying because no one knows. You never had never
(49:26):
had a training camp with all three stars there ever
you know, and so give it a legit chance to
see what it looks like, and then if it doesn't work,
you break them apart. Yeah, I mean, you go back
to the Milwaukee series where Harden's basically we'll play on
one leg. They almost beat the Bucks obviously Kevin's foot
on the three point line. Whatever Milwaukee wins it. I mean,
how it's different is this conversation if they end up
(49:46):
winning the title that year, Kyrie doesn't get hurt it said,
It's like it's a different it's a different play. All right,
here's what we're gonna do. This is a part one. Okay, Well,
anytime in the next couple of days, we'll figure out
part two. Okay, I want to get into how does
you dub basketball get fitched? I want to get into Okay,
I want to get we'll have we gotta have a
(50:07):
Brandon Roy what could he have been? Kind of discussion,
and then we gotta figure out, um, this bringing everybody
wants to bring a team back to Seattle, what does
that actually look like? Yeah, I mean these are all
three of them can be their own pots. So I
am all in bro al right, I cannot believe you
were You shared that you were too seventy two when
you're in college it was one point five. Actually, well,
(50:33):
you know what the worst part is. The body PA
percentage was like I want to say, it was like
thirty thirty one. Damn, dude, just let yourself go. But
then you know. You know, my dad said, I'm never
are we start recording? Yeah, my dad said, I came
home for like Christmas or spring breaking and and see
me because I wasn't playing games. You know, they would
(50:53):
come when I was octinal they come to seven five
six seven games years so they hadn't come, and um,
I came home and I walked in the door and
he did a double take and he was like, are
you trying to play backup? Fullback for the Huskies? And
when my dad gave me that ship, and then my
mom was like, I agree, I knew I had a problem.
(51:15):
So that was that was actually when I started to lose.
All right, fair enough, thank you for thank you for
all this disclosing all this stuff that will forever be used. Yeah,
exactly good in the court of public Go Marris, we'll
do We'll do part two soon. Thanks for joining me.
By wow, that was a great part one. Part two
(51:37):
will get to when, the when and how the Sonics
will come back, Jordan versus Lebron and the difference in
breaking news in the NBA and breaking news in the
NFL reminded. The Doug Gotting Show is twelve to three
Pacific Coast time three to six Eastern on Fox Sport Tradio,
Fox Sport Trade, dot Com, the I Heart Radio app,
and I believe serious sex m although they screwed around
with the channels, and we'll tell you when they get
(51:58):
it all figured out. I'm Doug Gottlib. This is all
bold
Hey, what up? Welcome in. I'm Doug Goli. This is
all ball. We got some great stuff for you. Jordan's
Schultz is our guest and the next couple of pods. Jordan,
of course you've seen him on ESPN Uh you go
back to all the different things he's done and now
as the ultimate kind of sports insider. Wait, do you
hear what he believes is the next step for him?
(00:27):
Plus what was it like growing up as Howard Schultz
son during the rise of Starbucks in Seattle? And oh yeah,
by the way, during the five years in which his
dad owned the Seattle SuperSonics. We'll get to all of
it upcoming. First, a quick thought on Kevin Durant and
the fact that he's gonna have to stay in Brooklyn.
And look, I continue to believe this that you've got
(00:50):
guys that they don't like the way k d has
handled things, And that's that's reasonable. It's very reasonable to
say I don't love how he's handled it. You know,
I thought bark he went, he went top rope and
it's not really called for like, Look, Barkley wasn't how
it ended in Philadelphia wasn't great. He wanted to be
traded um and I love everybody knows I've loved Charles.
We've had him on this pod. Who doesn't Who doesn't
(01:12):
love Charles Barkley and his honest commentary. But like, look,
he didn't hate in Oklahma City. He was just frustrated
by the ceiling of that team. Why can't we just
be honest. It was not a team built for the
twenty one century of all the shooting. They just didn't
have it. Now, they had a victory Oladipo right before
he left, and I'm thinking that team might have been
(01:33):
good enough, But it was a team that was built
to beat the Lakers. Two big guys, right, two big guys.
You had Ibaka and you had and he had Kendrick
Perkins and then later Steven Adams as well. So in
an era in which teams started playing small ball or
playing with one big guy, they had to. They were
built to beat the Spurs, built to beat the Lakers,
(01:55):
and not built to beat the Warriors. So I think
ultimately that caught up with him. He just didn't have
enough quality shooting, not just Russell Westbrook, but you forget
there was Andre Robertson before he got hurt. Great defender
couldn't shoot at all. You had too many guys that
couldn't shoot. So when we look back and we say, hey,
he never liked he loved Oklahoma City. He was a
leader there. He had great seasons there. He led the
(02:16):
league in scoring there. But he I think he inherently knew, like, man,
I I just feel like I can't win and I
can't be me. And his goal he said, and he
stated this was to prove he was the best against
the best, and he did that the finals MVP two
consecutive years, matching up with Lebron James was the better
player than Lebron James in both those series, and then
when he came back in the NBA Finals his third year.
(02:36):
But it wasn't a great fit and it was one
of those could they make it work? Yeah, But I
do think that k D knew what he thought was
best for him. He made a mistake tying his wagon
to Kyrie. But we should also point out that when
he tied his ship to Kyrie, even though people thought
Kyrie was aloof and hard to deal with. This is
way before we got to COVID stuff. There's a lot
(02:59):
of weird off that took place. So I'm not giving
Katie a total pass for his behavior, but I do
I understand it, or at least I articulate that understand
it more publicly than than most people do. That said,
like we still haven't seen what this team looks like
whole He gives Sean Marks the rest of the off
season to fix it, to figure it out, and you
see what it looks like. And then if you don't,
(03:19):
if you don't win this year, in Kyrie's last year,
you can't get along. If Steve Steve Nash can't show
that he can be a coach, well then by all means,
but Steve Nash has yet to have a training camp
with all three stars competing and playing camp put his
system that way. Can't make good season, massive dramatic change
and expect to have a system put in. That's just
a fact. All right. Let's get to Jordan Schultz, who
(03:41):
joins us now on the All Ball podcast. By now,
everyone knows who you are and when they google, they
know who your family is, but they don't actually know you.
All right, Like that's you haven't had I don't feel
like you had the this is who I am sort
of thing, you know, not just playing in college, but
(04:02):
growing up? What was your life growing up? Give me
a I'll close my eyes paint the picture of your
childhood at like ten? Wellhood ten? Um, well apprecy, sure
you have me on the show. Love All Ball. I've
been listening for a long time and love all the
hoop talks, especially when you get into the West Coast stuff.
So this is a real pleasure. Um, my life at
(04:23):
ten was I think at that point pretty normal in
terms of you know, I was having very similar experiences
as my friends growing up in Seattle. I think for
me when it really changed was probably late middle school,
early high school fourteen, fifteen sixteen, for a variety of reasons. Um,
(04:44):
you know, but my parents did a really good job
of making sure that my experiences as a kid mirrored
my peers. And what I mean by that is it
was clear that we were, as a family, really blessed.
But you know, if he flew on a plane, they
would fly first class. My sister and I would fly
in the back of the plane. Um. If anytime we
(05:07):
did dinners, we always contributed to the cleaning up and
the cooking. Um. They're just they tried to keep it
as normal as possible, but I think by default, when
Starbucks really exploded in the late nineties early two thousand's,
I was coming of age as well, and life got
really big at that point, and so things started to change.
(05:29):
But go back, go back for me a little bit though. Okay, so,
but in its infancy, like when you would describe, Hey,
what does your dad do? Like obviously had a family
phrase for this because I was so embarrassed by it
that I never want anybody to know Doug. So the
family phrase we came up with, really my mom and
(05:50):
I came up with, was he's in retail, he's already
And then if people ask more, we'd say, you know,
he does some brick and mortar and the and the
s Attle community and they're trying to expand to the
national That's what we say. So did you know, like
what did you were you aware of of of when
(06:10):
it went from being Seattle based, you know too, to
grow like, were you aware of these things? And you
know what was was your dad telling you these things?
Are you listening to conversations? It was that I think
I think I became hyper aware of everything because for
a couple of reasons, One growing up in that environment,
You're naturally super aware of how everyone else is looking
(06:34):
at you. So my reactions to meeting people, um, for
the first time, or am I say my my response
to meeting people for the first time was a go
above and beyond be respectful. Um. I just always felt
like I was being watched. You know, when when we
had when he had the Sonics, which he bought in
a one I think it was I was fourteen, So
(06:56):
we we were at these games and on the on
the court, and I felt like the whole arena was
looking down and it was they were looking for me.
You know, this is ridiculous. They were looking for me
to like make a mistake and someone was gonna was
gonna see something I did that wasn't supper, respectful or positive.
So I was super hyper aware as a result of
(07:17):
what I was of how I was conducting myself. But
but did you tell you, like, hey, I'm gonna buy
the signs that conversation just walk in one day, go
like I bought the Sonics. I made the varsity as
a freshman, which was a big deal. And what high
school in high school? Yeah, but you know what high
school university prep. So you know, like you know the
(07:38):
Seattle Preps O days, Rainder Beaches. We played all those
schools in middle school, but by the time we got
to high school, our school was Class one A. Those
were all three as we were, we were a lot smaller. Um,
so you make make the high school arsity? Yeah, my
dad says to me, Um, I think it might have been.
It was right around then, because I remember in my
(08:00):
head like varsity Sonics. So he comes, I'll never forget.
He picked me up for practice because I couldn't drive yet,
and he said on the way home, there's something really
important I need to discuss with you. I think it's
a good thing, but you're the person that I'm going
to talk to first out than Mom. And I was
so confused, and he says, Um, this is gonna He
(08:23):
prefaces it by saying, Duck, this is gonna change your
life in our life forever, and he kind of like
beat around the bush because I think he wanted to
set it up. That's how he Then he goes, I
think I'm gonna buy the Sonics and I'll never forget.
He waited till the till the second we got into
the driveway to tell me, and we were parked in
our driveway in Seattle and he's and he tells me that,
(08:45):
and I, I was so confused, but so excited. You know,
that's every kid's dream. I mean, it's not even a dream,
it's ridicululous. And he said, what do you think? And
obviously I was all in. And when do I get
to meet Gary Payton? That was the first question. When
when do I get to meet Cheap and Sean Kimp?
And is Debt look a nice guy? And he was like,
I don't know these guys, but but I was so
(09:05):
fired up. So I think for me being hyper aware
of what I was saying earlier, my dad buying the
Sonics also was right around when they went to Asia,
which I think was two thousand or so, when they
really exploded internationally in the Asian Going to Asia and
having really the whole content, but especially China explode with
(09:29):
Starbucks was simultaneous with me becoming of age realizing that
things were different, and then obviously the Sonics was like
the whole. It was like the next level. Fox Sports
Radio has the best sports talk lineup in the nation.
Catch all of our shows at Fox sports radio dot
com and within the I Heart radio app search f
s R to listen live. How do you how do
(09:52):
you go through high school? Like this, Like that's a
real question, Okay, I mean, like for people who are
are putting this all together. Starbucks exploding, your dad owns
the Sonics in Seattle's and you're a high school set
not not not a big case but but but like
you know, I mean, this is and you have to
(10:13):
go to high school and play high school basketball and
you have Sholtz in the back of year, but everybody
knows everybody, you know. Yeah, it was. I hate to
say it was challenging because it's just I just hate
(10:34):
saying that, you know why, because you don't have to.
It's so everything has like here's the way of looking
at It's like we talked about this in sports all
the time. It's just as hard to maintain a level
of excellence as it is too. It's actually probably easier
to get there than it is to stay there. Like
to climb. The climb is kind of the easy part
(10:54):
because people are telling you can't and you have that.
Then when you do it, everybody tells you how great
you are. Now you gotta go do it again. In
so for you and again, this is not a lodder.
You climbed is a lot of your dad climbed. But
it's it's it's challenging. Right everybody thinks you're spoiled, rich kid.
Everybody has an opinion of you before they even meet you,
right they that's really the hard part. They have an
(11:16):
opinion of you before they meet you. And I'm wondering,
you know, you're already still a teenager. How did you
handle all that? I? Um, I really so. All My
best friends were from kindergarten. There was like four five
of us kindergarten, maybe first grade, and so I leaned
on them a lot, and it was really important to
(11:36):
me to have that because I think they were the
only ones I trusted. We all played basketball together. We're
kind of like our little own little click um and
I didn't venture very far out from that when we
started playing au basketball and made it a little bit
more difficult because now we were in interested in gyms
and people were relentless with not the making fun of
(12:00):
but at the asking questions. You know, everybody wanted ticket, everyone,
everyone wanted to have a business idea. When I was
fourteen or fifteen, that was really hard to hear, um,
you know, like I remember one of my coaches like
wanted This sounds insane, but one of my au coaches
wanted to know if I could set him up potentially
(12:22):
to be a Sonics assistant. I didn't even know how
to handle that. I was so confused. I went home.
My dad was like, I'm not gonna say his name.
He was like that guy, hell no, you know, like,
oh my god, I thought, I thought somebody hits you up,
Like can I get one? You have to have like
a card where I get like Doug, that's is there
a car? No, that's that's that's that's a given. Come on,
(12:45):
you have you have auto reload on your Starbucks app.
I don't. I'm gonna tell you why. Um, that's a given.
The Starbucks Starbucks thing is a given. And when you
go and I going to the store with you so
I can get free stuff? You know, can I get
a free card? That's a given? No, I had my dad.
I would I would ask my dad as a as
a kid, but that's when I was younger, like nine ten,
(13:07):
and he would say, it's a public company. Everyone has
to pay, and the most important person to pay is me. Arguably,
because that's what everyone sees and it sets the wrong precedent,
especially for the employees and the customers. So you know,
I never that that was less the big deal. That
was already like hit home for me. So it was,
but I was used to people asking about Starbucks. The
(13:27):
kicker was the sonic stuff. And by the time I
was a sophomore, you know, starting and having some success,
it was like any time we'd go play any other
high school, I would hear the chance frappuccino when I
was in the free throw line. Uh, Tullies, Tullies is better. Uh.
Little Latte was a big one. Little Lotte. Uh. So
(13:52):
I I think I just it was a lot to handle.
I definitely leaned on my parents. I did not have
a big group of friends, and that was that was helpful.
But yeah, I hate to say it was tough because
I recognized the how fortunate it was. Okay, Um, what
what was the decision like in terms of college where
(14:15):
to go? Where to play? You know, do you go?
Do you stay home? And you know, walk on you
dub That's what I wanted. You team. We had Brandon
Roy and Martell Webster in our programs. So I grew
up playing with those guys. You know, Marvin Williams, parents Williams,
all these great players, you know, all these guys. Um,
(14:39):
And what happened was, Um, I'll never forget we my
senior year, our school had never been down state, and
I had the best game of my life and we
went and I took us down state and I had
a tape of the game. Life is how many points
my high my high? Yeah, total in high school was
(15:02):
forty two my junior year, but on eleven threes, so
I took a lot of three. I was. I wasn't
very athletic, I was. I was ahead of my time
with video. I seen video you shoot shooting? Yeah, he
really knows well and you gotta you gotta be Is
there a Jim at the house? About? There was a
(15:24):
we had a basketball hoop outside right on the lake
and there was a there were lights. I would shoot
there every night. Every night, every night I would go
out there. What what what like Washington? We were We
were like two miles away from Husky Stadium. Bro. I
grew up right by you. I was a huge Husky fan,
which brings me to what I was saying, Brandon going
(15:45):
to Martelli committed to you, dub I really wanted to
play there. You know, I didn't really I knew I
wasn't going to get a scholarship, but I thought Romar
when he saw this tape, and I remember he told us, uh,
you could, you could come, come, but I promise you
you'll never play, and that really hurt me. I was like,
(16:05):
I can't do that. And so what I did was, UM,
I probably had about fifteen schools that I was talking to,
anywhere from low major D one, D two all the
way down to D three, and I took some visits.
I went up to Western Washington, you know which one
of D two national title. UM. I was definitely interested
(16:26):
in all these you know, mid level schools. Ultimately, I
was like, I'm gonna go play with Lambent D three,
great coach, it's a perfect fit. We go there to
do the summer camp going into my freshman year, and
I say I can't. I can't go to school in
Salem Morgan. I had like a meltdown. I come back.
I tell my parents that are like, what are you
gonna do? And I was like, I gotta start contacting
(16:48):
these coaches, but there are no spots left. This is
like August, this is like this time. And so finally
we reached out to Seattle. You you know, Joe Colero,
h he didn't can be very much. They they were
like recruiting me, why don't you like you? I just
think he didn't. I think he had some preconcying notions
and also he didn't like on an athletic shooting guards.
(17:13):
So but he was like, listen, why don't you come in?
And I know who you are? And he did not
recruit me because I know who you are, why don't
you come in? And that open run with the guys.
I played really well in the summer for like a
couple of weeks and then said, guys said, you fit
right in. You could be an invite to walk on.
So that's why I did. I went to Seattle you
red shirted um. And then after my second year, I realized,
(17:34):
you know, I wasn't ever going to play a whole
lot here, and so then I transferred to Occidental another
D three and uh and went there in l A.
I think also I wasn't ready to leave Seattle for
whatever reason. But by the time my junior year came around,
I really was ready to leave. I like, I think
I needed that extra year or two of a safety
net of being close to home because the campus was
(17:55):
seven minutes from my house. And then eventually I left.
Did you live at home? No, I lived in the dorms,
so my freshman year. In my sophomore year, I lived
in an apartment. But I mean I was home once
or twice a week, So it was very it was
it was not the kind of college experience and you
dub probably would have been like that too, for better
or worse. So you go to Accidental and now it's
a completely different experience, right that even even if a
(18:18):
couple of guys know a little bit about you, nobody,
in fact is nobody knows right l A. Nobody knows
nobody gives this ship right like you. But but but
but I'm guessing there was probably sometimes you kind of
missed some of that, right that, I mean miss people
like it's free. It's freeing it first, because you can
kind of create a whole new personal, whole new life.
(18:41):
On the other hand, it's not the worst thing in
the world when everybody knows you and and kind of
knows you. In the basketball scene, the Baskett i didn't.
I didn't miss not I didn't miss being known as
Howard's son. I was really over that I missed that
great Seattle organic basketball scene because it was incredible. That
(19:01):
was the real explosion of Seattle basketball. You know, it
was right on the heels of Jamal making it. You
had Nate, Nate and Um Brandon. He had so many
great players, and we all played at this small grammar
Sea Grammar School gym in Seattle, you know, five six
days a week. We played there every single day together.
There were drills threes, five ones. I played with Brandon
(19:24):
every day and I missed that because once I got
to l A, that was all evaporated. And on top
of that, my best friend was well on his way
to becoming a dominant D three player. He ended up
playing in Europe, so he was having all the success
and I wasn't having success. And I also thought that
by going from Seattle, you which is now Division one
and then was basically going to Division one was division two.
(19:47):
I thought by going to D three, I would just dominate,
and that didn't happen. So it was a big wake
up call for me. What was what was the conversation
like when you're dad told you was selling the Sonics.
Oh that that was. That wasn't just one conversation, Doug,
because it was it was a lot in the works,
and it all happened right as I was transferring to Occidental,
(20:10):
So it was like my junior year a lot. That
was a lot going on. Basically they had for those
who don't know, almost from the get go, they tried
to get into arena because Kirina was owned by the city.
They wanted a similar deal kind of was what the
Seahawks and Mariners had. The city didn't want to pay,
and he knew it wasn't sustainable to stay in KI Arena.
(20:30):
And I think, also, why why didn't they want to
pay because they already the Mariners and Seahawks, and they thought,
you know this, there's another billionaire. He can pay for
his own arena. Right. So KI Arena is nice, it's
really nice, but it wasn't It was built right before
the mega suite arena. It was so it's really small.
(20:52):
Seventeen thousand didn't really have big suites, so it was
it was losing. They were losing a lot of money.
And he also so dug to be totally canned the
NBA lifestyle, at least at that point, had really worn
on him. The reason he bought the Sonics was twofold. One.
He loves sports, he loves basketball. But secondly, and I
would argue more importantly, he wanted to turn the Sonics
(21:13):
into that Starbucks type of atmosphere where everybody is equally
valued and everyone has a voice, and and he he
can never get there. Um, he could just never get
there with the with the with the team, with the
with the league. But but but because but there there's
still people to this day for losing the team never stopped. Yeah, yeah,
(21:35):
I mean I I got so used to that. I mean,
I don't think I've ever said this, so this is
some breaking news. Um, I don't even want to say it.
But I actually had I had security with me in
Seattle during that because I think it was my sophomore
year of college. I had security with me because we
were getting death threats and people were yelling at me
because people knew who I was, so I couldn't really
(21:57):
go anywhere without people saying stuff to me. So not
only they, but that once he had to get security
from my sister and me, and she was in high
school it was. It was really it was. It was
a tough time because Um and everyone I knew was
coming after him, so by default they were coming after
me trying to get to him. Um. But I know
people blame him. They'll never stop blaming him. And Uh,
(22:19):
he's apologized saying he should have been more patient. The
truth is he uh when he sold it to Clay,
when he told it to Clay Bennett, they had been
told that they were going to try to keep the
team in Seattle. It came out through emails and it
was an investigation and almost a federal lawsuit that they
weren't and they had. I think in retrospect, my dad
(22:40):
would have tried more. But I think he was a
combination of he was really frustrated with not getting support
from the council, city council, and also I think he
was so frustrated with the state of the of the
of the league and the fact that the team wasn't
performing the way he wanted. No people forget that that
was kind of a dark in the India, right, It
was a dark air in the NBA. That was during
(23:02):
the time when you had the Nets Spurs, the lowest
rated finals ever. That was when they had the institute
the dress code because they had gotten out of control.
Was post Jordan era, and it was it was it
was like people don't it's like football, yeah right, And
I grew up in in Orange County, southern California. The
Rams and the Raiders left and people like man two
(23:23):
teams left, like nobody cared. Like the NFL was different
then the NBA then post Jordan was different. With Jordan,
it was the biggest league after Jordan's it fell apart.
So it's it's really interesting. Okay, so you go to Occidental,
But you did have a really good career. When did
it turn? When did it change? Ah? I had really
good games. I don't know if my career was sustained.
(23:45):
Uh who is your coach? Brian knew all he's still there.
He also didn't like me very much. You know, youven
say if you put half as much effort into your
defense as you're shooting, you could be all American. Now
you never said um I had. I think what happened
was um I. Once I got there, I got out
(24:08):
of that Seattle, once I got comfortable enough in l A,
um I got a better shape. I started paying attention
to more all that stuff um and started becoming a
somewhat important part of the team. We were nationally ranked
in the in the D three level, you know, top fifteen,
and we went to the tournament a couple of years
and so I never started. But there were games that
(24:32):
I had big games. I think one my I think
one game I went, I had like a seven of
eight for three games. We played rus of San Diego
the yearly, but you kind of the tournament. I had
an awesome game. I made a ton of threes. So
you know, for me, it was always it really was
down to was I making shots and what kind of
shape was I in so that I could at least
be adequate defensively. But I again, I never felt this
(24:55):
is this is unfortunate, and I think everybody wants this.
I never felt like I had a buy in from
my college coach. I know you've talked a lot about
coach Sudden what he meant to you in the program.
I never had that, you know, But I I would
also tell you and candidly, like you know, for me,
I think he bought into he knew what I could
(25:16):
do whatever. I'm sure he was frustrated with my shooting Uh, well,
it's because I didn't make it right. And so he's
just like and and he would take me out if
I missed. So the easy, the easy deal is like
if I just don't shoot and they can't take me out, right,
if I stay in, then we're better. I'm out playing
with the point guard doesn't shoot totally, but it does
(25:38):
get to a point though, where guys get frustrated. We're like, yo,
you gotta shoot the ball. And I'm like, you gotta
talk to the old man, because if I shoot the
ball and I missed, I'm coming out. And I know
that and I feel that, so I do, like I
just wish I was able to articulate to him because
we didn't have a good relationship to sit down and
me like, listen, I'm gonna take three spots and that's
(25:59):
all I'm gonna work on. And if I take those
shots I missed, you leave me in. Let's take other
shots to take. And had I done that and established
I can make these for you, but you didn't and
and and uh, I would have, I would have played
more minutes. I think we would have had even more
success than we had. You get done playing. Now, what's
(26:19):
the plan when I got done. I graduated a year
late because I had read shirt in my freshman year.
Totally honest, like academics. You know, ox Hills are really
good school. I always say, like it was, it was
really hard, so I took my time. Um, when I graduated,
my girlfriend winded up. Mary, what did you do during
that year when you're not playing? Uh? Because there was
(26:43):
another year? Right you you went to you went to
school after your eligibility inspired But I had decided I
wasn't going to play a fifth year because I was
just so frustrated at that point and I never felt okay,
so so you but you did go to school and
I went to school. I actually got super fat. I
blew up. I stopped working out. Uh put a lot
(27:03):
of weight. Let's super what's super fat for you? It's
so bad. I'm I got up to the fattest, the
heaviest ever was I've never said this. This is another first.
I was to seventy one. Holy shit, how to are
you under six three? Yeah? Yeah? I really big? Okay,
(27:25):
so like, no, you're doing Everybody goes said that you're
missing on like sixty pounds. That's a lot of that's
a lot of What was your biggest vice, what was
the worst thing. I'm not a I'm not a big
there's ferry, ferry. I love ice cream, of course. What
(27:50):
were your what were your toppings? The Kiwi strawberry yogurt
chips and I'm so sick. I would say it was
a Peakberry in Pasadena where I was living. I would
go this is my I would go to get Thai food,
which is also bad for you, and then I would
go to the Pinkberry and I would get a large
to go in a large to eat as I was there. Yeah, sick, sick.
(28:12):
I'm ice cream fanatic. I can put on weight really
fast because I could eat so much whatever you want
to call it. You know like when old when a
running back you see them thirty years later and you're like,
what happens all belly? That's what I was. So I
could hide it. But but you're liken't think about that. Yeah, okay,
(28:36):
so so you so you graduate? I graduated? You still
have the year was? Yeah, I just like messed around.
I didn't but internships really competitively. I was at Fox
sports dot Com. I did an internship with the l
A Times, So those were huge internships. From me. I
stayed in l a for for the summer um and
so when I did, and then it really cemented further
(29:00):
admitted that I wanted to be in sports media and
then I could. I could do it. And so when
I graduated, my girlfriend who I ended up marrying, said
to me, I'm gonna I want to go to New
York City and I like, I'm going to New York
City And I was like I wanted back to Seattle
or maybe saying no, and she was like, I'm I
think you should try it for sports media. And regardless,
(29:22):
I'm going, I hope you come. So I wasn't. I
wasn't gonna let I wasn't gonna be long distance with
her because I was really in love with her, and
I also knew that she was right with the sports
media element. I knew that was the best place for
New York City. I followed Um City followed New York City.
(29:43):
What was your what was your first gig there. I've
worked at a company called youth Star, which was it
was like a video game system where you can superimpose
yourself into old movies and reenact them. It was cool,
but actually one one problem was, uh when The New
(30:04):
York Times tech guy reviewed it. I think there was
like a really big bug in the system and like
broke his computer and the company just imploded. So I
so so so see here two seventy two, did you
start losing weight? Yeah? I started to get down there,
you know, two five to forty five, I got. I got,
(30:24):
you know, all the way down to you know, to
to twenty and right now I'm probably five. So I
got you kicked the Pinkberry. Is Pinkberry forever or is
it like a once a month? I do? I do
it now. It's not Perry now. It's just like one
of the many New York ice cream reeves. And I
don't just order. I'll wear like six pints and it's
like the one I'm gonna get you. I'm gonna get you.
(30:45):
So so I'm gonna get you McConnell's viroment. Baby. I'm
a big fan, I know, I said, I said. I
said something nice about them on on the Dan Patrick Show,
and I got like ten pints. It's great ice cream,
great ice cream, just to show you, like, you know,
(31:06):
you can get that ship. And I'm ice cream kind
of serve. So I discovered them and like, I don't know,
every three months, I'll get like a six points from
them ships Greater's, Greater's ice cream. McConnell was, Greater is
a little heavier, but I love Greaters. I love that
black raspberry fudge. Yeah, that's like their signature one. That's
really good. Well what happened, Okay, so what happened was
(31:28):
basically um, once once once that come. While I was
doing the Youth Start thing, I was simultaneously working not
getting paid, but I was writing a blog called ten
Feet High for a website that and I grew it
to like I don't know, fifty subscribers or something. It
did really well, and it got named Best Sports Blogs
(31:51):
of two thousand ten because I was writing it while
I was also working for this other company. Whenever I time,
I would just write, And eventually that led to an
opportunity of a house remember them as a as a
copy editor, and I did a lot of those like
late graveyard ships. But it was a year of that
learning how to edit stories, how to put them on
a site. And then a year after that, Tough Post
(32:11):
brought me in to be their sports columnist and that
was my so called you know, first break to really
right Uh stories, Now, when you're working for our post,
did they tell you like, is there a you have
to you have to take a left leaning land to
every story? Like is there is there any sort of
pressure to it? Um? They told you without telling you.
In other words, it's like, um, you know you you
(32:35):
sit in with meetings with Ari on the big you
know media, big media discussions, and there we all kinds
of discussions about everything but sports, which also made me
realize how insignificant sports was to them. But you know,
women's rights, female empowerment, um, you know, everything that everything
left that you could possibly imagine, um, voting, LGBT and
(33:00):
que it was. It dominated the discussions. Don't forget plus
plus Latin actually doesn't didn't exist then, but everything possible
we we hit on and and it. It was really
interesting for me to learn about that, even though I
wasn't writing about it. But I had never had that
kind of perspective. Um. It's also the first real news
(33:21):
corporation I was in it that was they were monsters,
you know. But but I think it's I think it's
interesting though that like one of the things I've struggled with,
and I again I'm not putting words in your mouth
or things thoughts in your brain. But I struggle with
the it's like two different worlds. It's in that world
of politics. You know, there's race and politics and religion,
(33:43):
and it can be very divisive. Whereas you know, you
grew up in Seattle, and you know, like rand Roy's
one of your best friends. You're going like race doesn't
really sports and especially and especially West Coast, Like it's
still a little bit in the South and maybe a
little bit in the Northeast the times whatever, But in
sports and in Seattle and on the West Coast, it
(34:04):
doesn't feel like it's or to me, it was never
a thing. Just wasn't um What was that like for you?
I think um sports is an unbelievable conquer of racism.
It provides a true even playing field where skin color,
(34:27):
sexual orientation, none of it matters. If you can play,
you can play, if you're a teammate. And I ate
that up. That was crucial to my development. And you know,
I remember like like after our au practices, like you know,
giving Brandon or Martella right home and and dropping them
off at their place and seeing the dichotomy between where
(34:48):
I was growing up and where they grew up. And
then you know, I had him over the house, and
you know, for me it was normal to live there,
and for them, you know, I remember when they first
came over, it was like so differ friends and seeing
how they reacted that was really important for me because
it made me appreciate that much more what I was experiencing.
So with basketball, yeah, I think you're right, especially Yeah,
(35:11):
the West Coast. I mean basketball in Seattle is so
important and significant that and you have you have like
the godfathers that have really brought it along. You see that,
you see Jamal's proramerg the crossover. I mean, it's massive now.
And so I was at the real beginning of that,
you know, when like Jamal and Aaron Brooks and all
(35:32):
those were stucky they were all coming up, and so
I was so invested in it that I think it
really did help me, um emotionally. The racism that I
experienced or that I saw wasn't in Seattle growing up.
It was it wasn't in l A. It's it's been
in pockets in New York City. Um, certainly, And it
(35:53):
feels weird to say that because it's a melting plot,
but there's so many people and there's it's I've seen
it in your more than any other place, m Um.
I think also, I think also just gonna say, you know,
the whole, the whole idea that I came from where
(36:14):
I came from, and like you that you're not gonna
be spoiled or entitled. I've I just I've I've realized
that's impossible because I I've always parents were always like,
don't be spoiled, don't be titled, don't be that little
rich kid. You don't want to be that. But there's
(36:34):
just certain things that I do and say that I
catch myself, but I see like that's a byproduct of
how I was raised, and I'm probably always gonna have that.
I'm realistic, but you're always also gonna be judged by
that as well. People assume and people assume a negative
stereotype even if it doesn't actually exist. Yeah, I mean,
(36:58):
so there's that's that's when when I and I say
how it was raised, I meant really how I were
the way manner which I grew up. But my when
I went when I met my wife and I met
my girlfriend, her dad didn't want to meet me because
he just assumed that you know, what do you assumed?
And we've become really close subsequently, but and he's apologized.
(37:19):
But that's happened a lot. And that's why I said,
I'm so engaged with with what people are perceiving. And
I will go I will do things that nobody else
will do. I feel like when I when I when
I meet with's somebody for the first time, or I
need to make an impression that's so positive in my
mind because I know what they want to think, I
know where they want to go. You've done a really
(37:41):
remarkable job in sports media of having connections in multiple sports, right,
Like we all start and mask like and look, I've
done national radio for twenty years and I've done a
TV TV show, my own other TV shows. Whatever. You're
still and I don't think it's necessary, and you have stereotype,
but you still get kind of typecast as you're a
(38:03):
basketball guys, right, But you've done a really impressive job
of creating alliances and connections in all sports. The things
that you break, the stories that you know, the depth
that you provide. How do you have you been able
to do that? I really appreciate that. It means a lot. Um,
and I I think you were on ESPN when I
(38:24):
was in college. What what what you were you on
ESPN two oh three? Oh I started there, oh two
oh three to two thousand and twelve. Yeah, I was.
I was in high school when you were on the SPAN,
So I was watching you, not not the Days through Douglas. No,
it's okay, I mean it's it's really it's a weird.
It's been a very interesting existence, you know. And I
(38:48):
remember you were definitely one of the guys that I
was like, I I want to do that, you know,
the Eisans Scott's Mains, Patricks, the you know. I watched
ESPN religiously. So to answer your question, Um, I was
so desperate and hungry to be successful in the space
(39:09):
that when I first jumped into it, and I love
sports so much. When I first jumped into it, I decided,
I'm gonna do everything, especially basketball, football. But I'm not
gonna I'm not gonna pigeonholed myself. I'm gonna just do
all the sports. And because I can do it, because
I love all sports, and nobody knows sports like me.
Everyone thinks and within that I started developing relationships over
(39:32):
time with different people in different leagues, across different sports,
and I think, um as I've grown in the space,
especially over the last several years here, is that I
really want to do it through the lens of the athlete,
because that's how I always identified myself. And I think
also one thing that I haven't talked about a love publicly,
(39:55):
but it's important for me, is that when we have
the Sonics, I saw firsthand and the way the Seattle
media would just hammer guys um oftentimes unwarranted and it it.
I hated it, and I because I knew a lot
of the guy I was friendly with all with all
of them, and at one at one point in college,
I was working out with them, so I was around it,
(40:16):
and I saw what they put into it to get
to try and have success in that league and what
it was, how mentally draining, physically, emotionally, what it did
to their families. So when I saw the way media
would ruthlessly go after guys, I I just decided that's
how I was never gonna be was through the opposite.
I was gonna pump guys up. I was gonna try
(40:38):
to present through the lens of the athlete, what's under
the helmet or what's that person going through? And so
I think that's really helped me having a clear cut mission,
and then over the last year, finally making the decision
after so many conversations with different executives and even family
of you cannot do, as my parents would say, you
can't dance everyone's wedding, pick one thing. So I've really
(41:00):
league picked the NFL ironically to be an insider in
that sport, while still providing basketball commentary, maybe some reporting,
and using those relationships to help advance the story. But
knowing that I'm going to really focus on the NFL,
I think has been really helpful. M Well, what I
(41:20):
what I realized why, was that the NFL is even
all a basketball guy through and through, and that's my
favorite sport. Football. The NFL really is the true three
sport in terms of media interests. All the way that
the league has marketed events to combine the Senior Bowl,
of the Draft, everything about it. It's just the calendar
(41:42):
goes NonStop. And I think also I realized, if I'm
gonna break stories, just the numbers game of it is
much more, much more um opportunistic in the NFL because
there's some more players. You have your act to fifty three,
your practice bad guys. In the NBA, it's like twelve guys,
and there's so many more agents in the NFL. There's more,
(42:04):
there's more executives. There's just more opportunity, just more. There's
just more. There's just more. There's just more. I I
totally get. Here's the other part that that you should
think about using word because people will use against you
why you're a basketball guy like okay, but if you
look at the people in the news breaking space, right,
(42:26):
they're not athletes at all, They're just reporters. So having
an athletic background actually is you can relate and understand
more of the athletes. You can relate and understand more
with the agents. But like I'll just say, like I
got to do a TV game for Fox the Bears
versus the Dolphins a couple of years ago, and I'll
(42:47):
never forget I walk, I walk into beating in Dave
or going comes out and use the quarterbacks coach with
the Bears. Okay, and I remember David were going from
playing LOUISVILLI played in the NFL obviously, and all he
want to talk about with Louisville. Who that's it, right.
He's like, I'll tell you everything you want to know
about Travisky, but you gotta tell me everything about the hoops, right.
(43:08):
And so we sat and talked for like an hour
and literally every person I've I've met in the NFL,
you know, I live in UH in Orange County, close
to the right, real close to the Chargers, right basically
in between the Rams and the and the Chargers. UH
do camp and the Chargers until they moved to Elsa Gando.
This is where they operate their headquarters out of Customation.
(43:30):
And every time I walk into their building or go
to their practice one of these systems, one of the
players comes up and they want to They want to
talk hoops, and it's a it's a way in to
their world by letting you by talking that I do
want to ask. You must feel it, they know it,
and I think, because I think also taking it a
(43:52):
step further beyond just the sports, is that because I
was able, because I grew up the way I did,
there's a I think there's a sophistication to it being
in the room, as being in the same room as
like world leaders and pop stars, and mega athletes made
me so much more comfortable as a young man to
(44:14):
now be in this position to see the athlete as
a human being first and not be intimidated. I think
that's been really important as well. Yeah, the lack of
intimidations that is a is a huge, huge element to it,
and it also brings the level of sophistication that you're
not just going to put out there any message they
want out there. You know, there has to be a
(44:34):
you know, I can't be used in this thing like
everything it's it's it's a genuine has to be a
genuine relationship. You are close, I know on some level
to the nets durant situation. How did that happen? How
did they? How did that happen? Where they're not they're gonna,
at least for now stayed again. Well, I think everyone
(44:57):
within the NETS organization number one was really disappointed with
how things ended with James Harden. You know he when
the Nets got him. I remember talking to to them
two players and they're like the thing and being like
there's only one ball, how's this gonna work? And guys,
we're talking to c J him saying James just a
(45:17):
hooper he'll figure it out, and for a long time
he did. But him not being in good shape, not
showing up that war on that team. So you had
that and the number two Kyrie not getting a vaccination.
Whether or not you whether you agree with him or not,
is in material. But he got hurt. He got hurt
when they're being they're beating the Bucks, he gets hurt. Right,
(45:40):
they doesn't get vaccine. And the part to it that
I've been told, which is a real thing, is like
they never had the group together in training camp. So
you can't have a system if you don't have time
to put in the system. And with a coach who,
even though his basketball knowledge is superior, his coaching knowledge
is Nathan. So I think Steve became the puppets not
(46:04):
the right word, I've heard that, but he became very
easily moved around and it became clear that that he
was just there to make sure everything ran as well
as it could. But when so when Kyrie gets hurt,
doesn't get back, he's not there, he's not even the
building that he's playing at home, and he's not traveling.
That wore down that team as well. And I think ultimately,
(46:26):
you know Kevin I think what people don't understand about
Kevin Durant maybe they do now you tell me, is
is just how much he cares and how sensitive is
he's a really I think I'm biased, but I think
Kevin is a great guy. But he but he's sensitive
and in a good way. He cares what people are
saying clearly, and he sees everything. He's so he's really
(46:50):
shrewd and smart with how he he listens and he
sees and hears everything. So when you see him clapping
back on social that's him genuinely caring. I think ultimately,
when James gets traded, they had this hope we can
salvage this thing with Ben Simmons. But from what I
was told from from the nets was that Simmons between
(47:13):
the back and some of the emotional stuff, he was
just never there. It was never gonna happen. So there
was so much negative energy in that whole operation. That's
where you saw Kevin this summer saying I want to
be somewhere else, and candidly, I think it's now come out.
But I remember at the time Rich Kleiman said telling me,
you know, I've been clearer with him. I want I
(47:35):
prefer he stayed in Brooklyn, and you know, this is
his decision, this is the impasse. But I think ultimately
this was always the most likely scenario, and I think
it's the best scenario in terms of you know, being
trying to be successful in that next year if they're
both healthy, well, Kyrie Brie in Brooklyn next year, Yeah,
I think he will be because here's you know, I've
(47:58):
been critical with Sean Marks full disclosure. I don't know
if you have a relationship with him. I've been critical
of him for not really having a culture Kyrie. But
they had the culture before they brought these two guys in.
That was the whole thing was they had had a culture.
Huh before they brought Kyriean k D and Kyrie in, Right,
they had a great culture. How do you build a
(48:21):
culture when point guards not there? And how to build
a culture when the point guard says, we don't really
need a head coach? How to be able a culture
when I need the point guard when the point guard
comes in and look, I think, how he's an incredible talent,
but he was the one who said, like, basically, half
these guys won't be here when we're any good anyway, right,
it's it's it's impossible to build a culture like that. Yeah.
(48:42):
I was critical of the move when they fired Kenny.
I didn't get that and like it at all. I
understood why they hired Steve, But to me, they need
and meet they needed and need a head coach who
has real head coach sperience, students and can say oh
to Kevin or no to Kyrie. But ultimately, if you're
asking me right now, I believe that Kyrie will be
(49:04):
there next year, the Net the next the Nets know
that if Kyrie and Kevin are both right, they it's
so hard not to see what that elevator could be
because I could be that. That was That was my
statement on my last pod, which which was which is like, look,
anybody who says that you know what it looks like,
you're lying because no one knows. You never had never
(49:26):
had a training camp with all three stars there ever
you know, and so give it a legit chance to
see what it looks like, and then if it doesn't work,
you break them apart. Yeah, I mean, you go back
to the Milwaukee series where Harden's basically we'll play on
one leg. They almost beat the Bucks obviously Kevin's foot
on the three point line. Whatever Milwaukee wins it. I mean,
how it's different is this conversation if they end up
(49:46):
winning the title that year, Kyrie doesn't get hurt it said,
It's like it's a different it's a different play. All right,
here's what we're gonna do. This is a part one. Okay, Well,
anytime in the next couple of days, we'll figure out
part two. Okay, I want to get into how does
you dub basketball get fitched? I want to get into Okay,
I want to get we'll have we gotta have a
(50:07):
Brandon Roy what could he have been? Kind of discussion,
and then we gotta figure out, um, this bringing everybody
wants to bring a team back to Seattle, what does
that actually look like? Yeah, I mean these are all
three of them can be their own pots. So I
am all in bro al right, I cannot believe you
were You shared that you were too seventy two when
you're in college it was one point five. Actually, well,
(50:33):
you know what the worst part is. The body PA
percentage was like I want to say, it was like
thirty thirty one. Damn, dude, just let yourself go. But
then you know. You know, my dad said, I'm never
are we start recording? Yeah, my dad said, I came
home for like Christmas or spring breaking and and see
me because I wasn't playing games. You know, they would
(50:53):
come when I was octinal they come to seven five
six seven games years so they hadn't come, and um,
I came home and I walked in the door and
he did a double take and he was like, are
you trying to play backup? Fullback for the Huskies? And
when my dad gave me that ship, and then my
mom was like, I agree, I knew I had a problem.
(51:15):
So that was that was actually when I started to lose.
All right, fair enough, thank you for thank you for
all this disclosing all this stuff that will forever be used. Yeah,
exactly good in the court of public Go Marris, we'll
do We'll do part two soon. Thanks for joining me.
By wow, that was a great part one. Part two
(51:37):
will get to when, the when and how the Sonics
will come back, Jordan versus Lebron and the difference in
breaking news in the NBA and breaking news in the
NFL reminded. The Doug Gotting Show is twelve to three
Pacific Coast time three to six Eastern on Fox Sport Tradio,
Fox Sport Trade, dot Com, the I Heart Radio app,
and I believe serious sex m although they screwed around
with the channels, and we'll tell you when they get
(51:58):
it all figured out. I'm Doug Gottlib. This is all
bold
Host
Doug Gottlieb
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