3 & Out - Raiders fire Antonio Pierce, Tom Brady will interview coaches, Importance of ownership

John reacts to Mark Davis and the Las Vegas Raiders firing first time head coach Antonio Pierce after a disappointing 4-13 season. He also discusses Tom Brady’s influence on the decision as part owner of the Raiders and how he will help conduct his first NFL coaching search. Next, John dives into the importance of ownership in the NFL and how certain owners aren't right for the NFL and are holding their teams back from winning.

Lastly, John answers your questions during this episode's mailbag segment.

5:50 - Antonio Pierce fired

32:58 - Ownership in the NFL

42:05 - Mailbag

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:01):
The volume What is going on? Everybody? John middlecop three
and out podcast? How are we doing? My people? We

(00:22):
had some breaking news on about Tuesday around lunch. I
actually just got out of a long sauna trying to
sweat out this cold flu from hell, not sure it's working.
Saw on my phone that Antonio Pierce, the Raiders head coach,
has been fired one and done and Tom Brady will

(00:46):
help Mark Davis find a new coach and obviously influence
the firing. So I want to dive in. I obviously
have an experience, spent years around the Raiders when I
worked in radio, and just lay out some thoughts on
that situ and I think a solution that can help
Mark Davis, who, let's face it, is currently one of
the worst owners in the NFL, despite going from poor

(01:10):
in Oakland where he played in the biggest dump you've
ever seen. If you had ever been to the Coliseum,
I promise you this, you didn't miss much to now
an incredible stadium on the strip in Las Vegas where
money just flows, but it doesn't change the fact that
the team can't win anything. Ever, so we will dive

(01:30):
in to the Raiders. There was also a general manager surprise.
I guess I'm not super dialed in to the Tennessee
reddit boards. But the Titans fired Ran Carthen who was
just hired a couple of years ago. From what I
was told, he got a six year contract and was

(01:52):
fired this morning after hiring a coach I don't know,
a year ago. So you just get some of these teams, man,
these own it's really I mean, can you imagine what
like Andy Reid and Brett Veacher thinking today. It's just
not a fair fight. So we'll dive into that. We'll
do a little mail bag as well at John Middlecoff.
At John Middlecoff is the Instagram fire in those dms.

(02:15):
I'm gonna have Jackson on tomorrow because we got a
playoff game Thursday. We got a playoff game Friday, so
we'll do some college football tomorrow. But obviously there's just
a lot going on right now in the NFL, so
I wanted to wanted to hit on these stories as
they were breaking. Like I said, mailbag, subscribe to the
podcast if you listen on Collins YouTube page. Thanks for

(02:38):
everyone that's watching the YouTube page we got that. Subscribe
to that as well. All of our content is video
and audio. We like being multi dimensional here, like Lamar Jackson.
We can run and pass before we get an Antonio Pierce.
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(03:43):
the lowest price guaranteed. For a long time, when I
lived in the Bay Area, I was known as a
Raider hater and people thought that I have like a
vandetta toward the Raiders and specifically Mark Davis. So I
just want to lay something out. When I worked for
the a radio station in the Bay Area that I
think is still alive, might might have gone under I'm

(04:04):
not quite sure, but when I was there, they had
the Raiders and we like they we were the official
radio station of the Raiders, so their games were on there,
and by like my second year working there, I was
hosting the postgame So I was going to all the games,
hosting the postgame shows. During training camp. They used to
have training camp in Napa and we were host shows,

(04:26):
you know, from Charles Woodson to Sea Bass to Derek
Carr to you name it. Like you'd have the players,
the coaches, Mark Davis would come hang out and it
was always it was It was awesome if you love football, regardless,
like the team was really really bad, but it's just
really cool being that close up personal, you know, having

(04:46):
coming from an NFL background. When I worked at a
team to transition to doing that, I really enjoyed it. Now,
the problem is when you do a postgame show and
the team really sucks you just it's hard, you know.
And the guy I was working for at the time said,
let it loose, do not hold back, and what are
you gonna say when they're three and thirteen, you know,
four and twelve. This at the time when they were

(05:08):
playing sixteen games. And the reality is is when you
host a postgame show, especially a home game, the owner
listens as he drives home, and I, you know, i'd
get word that Mark would get mad over the things
I would say. I know, the president of the team
got really mad at me a couple times for saying that, hey,

(05:28):
they could go winless. At the time, they were zero
to ten, and I kind of laid out their last
six games. I think they ended up going three and
three down the stretch, but they were This was a
road game, so I was back in the Bay Area
and the dude called my phone and just I didn't
pick up, but lit into my voicemail about like how
negative I am. And again, they're oh to ten at

(05:48):
the time, and I think they had an interim coach,
Tony Sperano rip but it's it's people get very sensitive
in that organization, and I'm sure that's true in a
lot of different organization, but specifically with anything related to
the you know, the Raiders and the property revolving around
their games, which can be difficult because they have consistently

(06:10):
sucked for the majority of my life and definitely the
majority of my adult life post John Gruden. I think
they've made the playoffs twice in well over multiple decades,
and I think they've only had two winning records during
that time. But I do believe this. I have no
ill will toward Mark Davis or toward the franchise. In
twenty twenty five, my life has been dramatically better off

(06:34):
ever since then, right, So I this is not personal,
And I do think one Marks a nice guy. He's
easy to talk to and bullshit with, and I do
think he loves football. He means well trying to do this.
He gives a lot of effort, you know, trying to
make the Raiders right and filling in for his father, Al,

(06:56):
who is one of the most legendary sports persons in
the history of American professional sports. In just probably the
history of American sports in general, right, So it's those
shoes are hard to fill. And if you're my age
or younger, the Al Davis you remember, you know, the
guy in the two thousands, his body was falling apart,

(07:19):
it was really ugly. Is not the guy that helped
define the sport of football and was one of the
pillars of the guy that built the business that we
all see and know now and anyone especially of a
certain age, guys over sixty that have coached in the
NFL for a long time, the Andy Reids, the Bill Belichicks,
those type guys, you get them talking about Al Davis.

(07:42):
They revered the man and because of what he stood
for and you know, the sport that he helped build
up to create and give them a lane to make
fifteen to twenty million dollars coaching football. And I think
there's a powerful history behind the Raiders that when I
was around, and I'm a forty nine er guy, like
most people in California like, it's heavily split. And I

(08:03):
think a huge reason for that is over the last
thirty years, the Raiders have mainly sucked and you know,
the Niners. When I was a kid, were rattling off
super Bowls in northern California, and then even in the
mid nineties they won a Super Bowl, and then since
they've made seven conference championships in the last fifteen years,
and the Raiders have just sucked. So part of gaining
fans over time is like winning plants. The Patriots have

(08:27):
way more fans now than they did thirty years ago.
Right the reason the Packers and the pain and the
Pittsburgh Steelers have a lot of fans. They've been winning
for decades. That's how you build up a fucking business.
And the Raiders have struggled with that and the old
adage that money doesn't buy you happiness. What was going
on before they moved to Vegas. I'm going a long

(08:47):
winded way before we talk about how they or i
mean Antonio Pierce is like their business was not sustainable
in Oakland, just like Joe Lacobs wasn't. Just like obviously
the o'klan A's was not that area. It's they should dynamite.
All the teams are gone now. I would dynamite the
whole thing and blow it up. They played in the
worst stadium you've ever seen, and they weren't making any

(09:11):
money relative to these other franchises. So they make the
move to Vegas and they are flushed with cash unlike
they ever could have dreamed of in the Bay Area.
Partly because even if things were going well, the forty
nine ers are like the Yankees. They they take up
so much oxygen and surround so much of the cash.

(09:31):
The people with the money associate with them and funnel
jed the money that was never gonna happen to Mark.
So going to Vegas was an incredible business move. But
literally nothing has changed. Like I said, his heart's in
the right place. He is a terrible owner since he
bought the team, or I mean since his father died
and he took over. The Raiders are sixty eight and

(09:52):
one to eleven, and they run through coaches like you know,
you do a gallon of milk if you've got a
couple of little It's it's insane how quickly they go
through coaches. When he tries to do the right thing.
Give John Gruden ten years, one hundred million dollars, that
blows up in his face when he hires Josh McDaniels
a coach. Did feel like he had rebilitated his entire life.

(10:13):
That blows up in his face when he listens to
DeVante Adams and Max Crosby, who a year ago most
people would say two of the better players in the league,
and they're like, we want Antonio Pierce to be our
head coach. He's like, okay, I'll just I'll lean with
these guys. Six months later, Davante Adams is like, I
don't even like this guy anymore. I want out in

(10:35):
mid season. Max Crosby's like, yeah, if this doesn't we
don't figure this shit out, I'm gonna want out. Good life. Lesson,
don't listen to your players. This ain't the NBA. Like
hire the right coach because you believe he's the right coach.
Don't try to right or wrong because you probably regret
not hiring rich Passacia when Gruden got fired and he
led you to the playoffs. This was not that Richard

(10:55):
coach in the NFL for a long time. Antonio Pierce
was coaching at Arizona State a couple of years ago.
It was an absolute joke of a program when Herm
Edwards was there. Such a joke that Herm Edwards coaching
college football for five fucking years, gets fired. ESPN takes
them back and they're like, yeah, we don't even We
don't think you know anything about college. The guy literally
just spent five years coaching college. I had been told

(11:18):
the guy didn't even know half the roster's names of
the players on his team. And listen, I'm not anti
Herm Edwards, but like that operation was an embarrassment. Then
Antonio Pierce goes from linebacker coach to head coach immediately,
and I'd be lying if I watch much Raider football
last couple of years, but I follow a lot of
people that cover and watch the Raiders really closely. It

(11:40):
wasn't going well. Now. Would Bill Walsh have won eleven
games with this team? Of course not. But can you
keep Antonio Pierce? And this is two sided, right Like
I think Mark Davis is just completely in over his
head and I think it's a complete disaster right now.
But I also think when you see Andy Reid, Sean Payton,
and Jim Harbaugh in your division, Antonio Pierce can't be

(12:04):
your head coach. It just can't happen because you got
no shot. It'd be like going on a seal team
six mission and you're going and I hand you a
NERF gun. Everyone else is fucking locked and loaded with
real weapons, and I give you a NERF gun. You
get killed, you get wiped out. And that was going
to happen if Antonio Piers stayed when you just looked

(12:26):
at their division and last year the bluster and everyone
pound in their chests smoking cigars after they beat the
Chiefs on Christmas. Like how that age. The Chiefs went
on to win the Super Bowl. The Raiders stayed being
a joke. Now here's the thing, and I give Mark
Davis credit for this. Mark Davis has always liked the players.
He was always really good friends with the players, from

(12:47):
what I've been told, when he was younger and now
was the owner, He's always had a natural inclination when
he took over, Like Marcel Reese, the Pro Bowl fullback,
when I first got around the team, was like his
good buddy. I was part of the team for a
long time. And obviously he leaned on Max Crosby and
DeVante Adams. Now that blows up in your face, and
I think he realized, like I just can't be listening
to players. I need someone in my life that is

(13:10):
not putting on helmets in a pad for my team
because they're gonna have a bias and an agenda. And
Tom Brady, while a former player, now is in business
and now has an equity partnership you know for how
big one percent, two percent, half percent. I don't have
the financials in front of me, but he clearly owns
a tiny little piece of the Raiders. And from what

(13:31):
I had been told, Mark Davis is the one that
made that happen. He went after Tom. He created that
relationship because it's important to him. He wants to, like one,
gain some positive momentum. He's really trying it, just nothing works.
And it was reported by Schefter that Tom Brady is
going to be part of these interviews, just like it
was reported earlier this year that Tom Brady's gonna start

(13:53):
interviewing quarterbacks like at the Combine. Here's what I think
big pictures should happen. And if I'm Mark Davis, I
push for this. Listen, Tom, like Tom Brady, you're calling games,
not because you want to call games. They gave you
thirty seven million dollars, they paid you ten million dollars.
You would not do it. So we have to acknowledge
you're doing it for the money. And listen, I'm pro

(14:17):
Tom Brady. He's not good at TV, He's not good
at all, and he's no dummy. He has to know
that he's not natural at it. It feels clunky, it
just doesn't really work, and it's hard to give up
a job that pays you thirty seven million dollars a year,
and he's under contract for nine more years after this year.
He never made that much money a year playing quarterback

(14:40):
in the NFL, so he's being paid an astronomical amount
of money. I'm as pro capitalism as any human. I
understand why. It's like, even if this sucks, we all
have a price, and we would do things that we
don't want to do for a certain amount of money.
We'd suck it up. But there is an opportunity here
that if you're Mark Davis, why don't you just make
him the football a grand poopa of the organization. Why

(15:02):
don't you just give him like a John Elway type
role like Tom? What is the price it would cost
us to make you the president of the team or
the president of all a football operation. We have seen
Bill Parcells do it before, we saw Home Run do
it before, we saw elway do it. Why don't you
just do it? Because I already want you playing a

(15:24):
role in who my head coach is gonna be. I
already want you playing a role in who my quarterback's
gonna be. I've proven that I have no clue what
I'm doing, absolutely none, And I went from living the equivalent.
And I've been there too. I've lived in some shitty apartments.
I have lived in some really really shitty apartments. Honestly,
not even that long ago. When I was in the

(15:45):
Bay Area, when my buddy got married or got engaged,
he's like, I was living in the city in the
suite apartment with him. He's like, hey man, you gotta go.
And I started looking around. I started seeing the prices
of like, I can't afford any of these single bedrooms.
So I had to move outside the city this one
the city was booming, like twenty thirteen, and just lived
in this shittle Now it was close to the water,
so that part was cool, but it was a terrible place.

(16:06):
And ten years later I live in a golfing gated community.
But money doesn't change, like the way I feel every
morning when I get up, like changing homes, like I
was happy many days in that really crappy apartment. Like
money does not change. If you're an unhappy person, you
will stay an unhappy person. If you're a happy person,
you will stay a happy person whether you got ten bucks. Obviously,

(16:29):
there are some things that become easier in life, but
just in terms of like your everyday operation, you are
who you are at a certain time. And Mark Davis
went from an NFL standpoint being broke to now being
flushed with cash in Vegas and nothing has changed. Absolutely
nothing has changed. They are still one of the laughing

(16:49):
stocks of the league. They just happen to have this
sweet stadium on the strip that's really cool. But their
team blows and the consumer if you put them on
after like week three, will watch another game. They're unwatchable.
They're an awful product. And he has been the one
consistent thing with this team for the last whatever fourteen years.

(17:12):
And to me, if you're him, this is an easy one. Tom.
What can I do to make this worth it for you?
What can I pay you? Do you need thirty million dollars?
You need fifty million dollars? Can we do some sort
of bump inequity? Because I know this for myself, I'm
an incentive laced individual. When I have skin in the game,

(17:32):
I work harder. If you just paid me a salary,
whatever that salary may be a million dollars, ten million dollars,
one hundred grand, fifty grand, whatever it is, after a
certain point, I would kind of get bored. But when
I have incentives, when I have, the harder I work,
the more money I can make. I know most people
in sales can relate to this. That gets me going,

(17:54):
even though the actual dollars that come my way don't
really change the way I feel. But if I'm Tom Brady,
who clearly likes money given the lifestyle, he leads like,
can we bump up some of this equity that you
have to make this hay over the course of the
next ten years. If you hit these incentives as a team,

(18:14):
maybe you get an extra couple of points on the
team like why don't we do something like what can
we do to make it worth your while? Because I
have proven I have no clue. I've tried to hire
a former legend here, blew up in my face. I've
tried to hire the hot offensive coordinator, blew up in
my face. I hired the interim that my star players wanted.

(18:36):
They couldn't stand the guy. Six months later, and one
thing I heard with Antonio Pierce is that when he
became the head coach, he changed a little bit. When
he became the full time, got a big head, got cocky,
and I think that turned off some people. And listen,
that's it was a lot happening really really fast. And
clearly he grew up a Raider fan from southern California.
But it was a disaster, it really was. And this

(19:00):
team now is a complete joke. It really is. Before
when I first was around him, they were a joke
with no money. They were the poorest team in the NFL.
Now they're no longer that, but there's still a joke
on the field. So it's like, you got your stadium
figured out, you got your windfall of cash figured out.

(19:21):
How do we just become competitive? I'm not talking compete
for Super Bowls? How do we just compete on a
yearly basis to be above five hundred, to try to
make wild cards every year? How do we do that?
And I'm not saying Tom Brady knows what he's doing,
but every single person they hire fails, And I just
think you gotta give a guy a chance that has

(19:44):
seen winning at the highest level for multiple decades, and
given his position, it was much closer to a coach,
front office individual than it was just some random player
on the team, given the hours that he put in,
given his dead and let's face it, Tom Brady's a
football guy. He's a football junkie. He's trying to get

(20:07):
his fix with this television gig. No chance's working. I
listen to him, I hear him. It just sounds like
he's trying his hardest. They're paying him thirty seven million
dollars to put a smile on his face. It's not
for him. He's a smart guy. He knows it. He's
not natural at that. It's not his gig, but like

(20:28):
running a football team, being around football every single day,
going to practice, dealing with the coaches, it's what he
knows better than anything. So if I'm Mark Davis, I
just beg Tom Brady and we try to figure out
some sort of number to make this worthwhile and to
leave the Fox situation and just do this full time

(20:50):
because he's already dabbling. And listen, he starts interviewing coaches
and this is also a problem you got this guy.
This is you know when we talk about the different
connections of these owners, being like, wait, Tom's a part
owner of the Raiders and he's calling games. We have
to let him in our facility. And now he's gonna

(21:10):
start interviewing our coordinators. You know, if they interview let's
say six seven guys, they're only gonna hire one, so
he's able to price some information out. Like and that
was a famous Al Davis thing is he would interview
a ton of people. He wasn't even interested in highering half.
He would just get notes from them. He would just
use it as like a you know, a CIA mission

(21:32):
to accumulate information. And I just wonder if these owners,
Like if I owned another team and the Raiders wanted
to interview my coordinator, I'd be like, especially if I'm
an NFC team, if I'm like the fucking Lions, It's like, wait,
you're just gonna interview Ben Johnson, Near and Glenn and
find out the way we do things, Like no, we
already don't allow you into the building. Now you're gonna
bring this guy in and Tom's gonna conduct the interview. Obviously,

(21:55):
the Raider fans are very loyal group to passionate group.
I've always disagreed with the league as better when the
Raiders are good, Like, the league has never been more
popular and it's never gained more popular over these last
the Internet era, and the Raiders have been irrelevant, So
like that's just factually incorrect. But I do think there

(22:16):
is something about the Colors and the edge to the
franchise that is just long gone. I mean, whatever we
see in this operation is just bad football. It's unwatchable.
It's an unwatchable product. And the crazy thing is, over
the last couple of years, like they've acquired good players
like Davante and his prime Max Crosby now brock Bauers,

(22:39):
they had Josh Jacobs, Like they get good players here
and there, but just nothing ever works and something's bad luck.
Like obviously Mark, you know the NFL leaking all Gruden's
emails that led to him getting fired. He's not Mark's fault. Obviously,
you could argue that Josh McDaniels had already proven who
he was. Now I'd say that was like a decade

(23:00):
in between each other. Just turns out he was just
as bad and people couldn't stand the guy, and he's
he had one of the great pr campaigns of pretending
he had changed when it turns out no, he was
exactly the same. And they were in a tough spot
when they hired Antonio Pearson. You got those two guys
baking you. But I don't think any organization worth their
salt would let the star player on the team determine

(23:24):
who the head coach is gonna be. And a year
later that clearly blew up in their face. The stadium's awesome.
We know their practice facility. I remember Andy Reid said
at the Super Bowl, He's like, this is the nicest
thing I've ever seen. Remember Belichick was there for something
and was blown away. He's like, this is this is
the most beautiful. I mean, it's second to none what
they're dealing with. But like I said, you can take

(23:48):
you can take the gutter rat and put him in
the high rise penthouse. It doesn't make that person no
longer a gutter rat. And right now the Raiders are
just like the gutter rats of the NFL. And I
think the only way they could change is to make
Tom Brady the lead dog on this run point run
the organization. Obviously, you have to financially make it worth

(24:11):
his while. But given that he already owns a percentage
of the team, albeit small, I think there is a
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Speaker 1 (25:58):
You know, speaking of just ownership, I think one theme
is just because you make money on your own doesn't
mean you're gonna know what you're doing when you run
a sports team. Dan Snyder was a self made guy,
was a billionaire by the time he was like thirty
two or thirty three, so like he was an incredible
business story. And he's easily one of the worst owners

(26:19):
we've ever seen in all of sports. And we have
seen guys get handed organizations from their family and run
good organizations like Clark Hunt didn't buy the chiefs Lamar
did his dad, and he's done a really good job
over the last decade, working hand in hand with Andy Reid.
Jeffrey Learc was born into money, you know, Jed York

(26:40):
was handed the team from his parents, and since he's
been the boss, they've made seventy conference championships. So just
because you're an owner's kid or a rich guy's kid
doesn't mean you can't function. But I think we've seen
a theme of some of these kids that one might
not like football is as much as their parents did,

(27:02):
and two just be completely over their skis. Like the
Tennessee Titans right now are run by Amy, the daughter
of the former owner that that passed away several years back,
and I think it's clear at this point in time
that she has absolutely no clue what she's doing. A
year ago she fired Vrabel, who is the number one

(27:24):
candidate on the open market. Two years ago, she hired
rand Carthin from the forty nine ers and gave him
a six year contract to be the GM. Two years later,
he got fired. I can't even imagine. I've been fired twice.
One time my contract technically ran out. The other time
I still had, like, I don't know if it was
six months or four months. But I remember the feeling

(27:45):
of just like getting paid. I didn't have to do anything,
and I was making eighty grand at the time. I
can't even imagine what it's like to be being like, wait,
I make three million dollars a year, and they owe
me this, They owe me twelve million dollars more. So
every two weeks they're gonna me a check or put
a direct deposit into my account and I don't have
to do shit. Incredible feeling, even though if you're ambitious, like,

(28:08):
it's not what you want, but listen, it could be
way worse. I mean, there are a lot of people
struggling in society that would die for that opportunity. So
he gets paid to go away for years, But how
could someone a year ago basically go, hey, we're gonna
go with this guy, We're gonna get rid of Rabel
and then a year later fire And I was texting

(28:29):
some people that know him, and I've I don't know
Ran at really at all. We have DMed over the years,
just kind of pleasantries, congrats and just yes a little bit.
But from all accounts, I've never heard a bad word
about the guy, and I've heard people think he's pretty
good at his job and just really good like people.

(28:50):
Motivator guy, I mean, former player, just kind of kind
of gets it. And by all accounts, he was the
guy leading the Will Levis push, which obviously was a disaster.
And sometimes listen, you miss on a player, it sucks,
and sometimes you miss on a guy like Will Levis
that embarrasses everybody. So that might have been just a
situation that I can't look at you the same because

(29:11):
you were the guy banging the table for Will Levis.
But regardless, what could have changed in the last year
to go from we're going all in on you, We're
letting you pick the coach He got to hire Brian
Callahan last year. Think about that, he hired the coach
last year, to now go we're gonna fire you, we're

(29:32):
gonna keep the coach, We're gonna hire another GM, and
everything's gonna be off kilter. You can't run an organization
like that. These teams have no chance none. It's how
do you compete with the Ravens who just every year
Eric Tacosta, Steve Bushatti, John Harbaugh. How could the Chiefs

(29:53):
just Brett Veach, Andy Reid Malmes Lamar, Like, how could
you even dream of competing with them? It's impossible. It
literally is not possible, And it's not random that they
have the number one pick overall. Just like next year,
if you have to go, Are the Titans gonna be
any good? Probably not? Like are the Giants gonna be

(30:16):
any good? Probably not? Are the Raiders gonna be any good?
Probably not? Are the Falcons finally gonna win? Probably not.
It's the same thing over and over and over again,
and it starts with ownership. It's why when I hear
people say the Bears is a good job, bull shit?

(30:38):
Working for the mccaskey's a mom and pop shop that
has like seven people that have direct lines to him
and a president do you kind of have to answer
to It's not a good job. That's a terrible gig.
We think we talked so much about good jobs, Like, well,
they got a quarterback, do they got talents? Like? Do
they got draft picks? They got cap space? Who is

(30:59):
then who owns the team? And what do I have
to do with that guy? Same thing with the Jets,
Like got a lot of pieces, okay, but Woody Johnson
owns the team. Good luck dealing with that the Jags
they got what an ownership that is consistently a shepherd

(31:20):
losing after losing after losing teams, Like all they do
is lose, under shot con every time you hear them,
you're like, I guy seems nice, guy, seems impressive, obviously
self made, great American business story. Yet every time during
the fall you watch his teams, they just lose. And
then where do they draft really high all the time?

(31:41):
It's like they're teams full of top picks. Well yeah,
because they picked them because they always lose. So I
think we spend so much time what about this quarterback?
What about this cap space? Who's the owner? And if
you got a crapy owner, you got no shot. If
Tom Brady didn't exist, I would say it is a
that the Raiders are going to continue to suck. But

(32:02):
like maybe he just passes it off a little bit
and maybe they got a chance. Maybe they can't overcome
that because maybe Mark's still involved. The Raiders ethos that
comes from the Davis family is not something you can shake.
And maybe that was really important pre Internet, but post
Internet it's they just can't overcome it. And I say
the same thing with the Titans, for whatever reason, this

(32:23):
lady like she owns the team. You got an uphill battle.
It is going to be really, really difficult because clearly
she's got people in her ear. Clearly she changes her
mind all the time. And I'm not against changing your mind.
I do it all the time with takes. Like information
is fluid. But unless something crazy comes out, like you

(32:45):
just went all in on this guy a year ago,
what could possibly have changed? And now you have a
guy who is doing interviews for the GM who used
to be a scout. Just just a bizarre, poor run organization.
And I think the parallels of a lot of these
are kids that are completely over their head, that have

(33:08):
no clue what they're doing. They just inherit this three, four, five,
six billion dollar team. Everyone's watching you. It's it's not
an enviable position if you're not just a football addict.
Even if you were, it'd be really challenging. You become
a public facing figure, a ton of pressure. You have
a community or a city depending on you, You have

(33:32):
millions of fans that you know. I would say, invest
a lot of energy and time into your successes, and
I think it can overwhelm people. And I think we
see a consistent theme that these owners, some of them
are just completely overwhelmed and lost to see. Okay, let's

(34:03):
dive into a little thing we like to call the
middle Cough mail bag at John Middlecoff at JOHB. Middlecoff
is my Instagram. Firing those dms. Get your questions answered
here on the pod. Question for the bag? Should major
sports leagues explore a tax mindful salary cap? For example,

(34:24):
twenty five milli in Tennessee and twenty five milli in
New York are very different numbers, So should the New
York teams have a larger cap to offset state taxes? Well,
if you think about it, let's use Let's use the Jets, Giants, Rams,
and Niners against the Titans. They all get the same
amount of money from the league, right, The money that

(34:46):
pays for the players is the television money. And when
they get that money from the league, let's just let's
just pick a number this offseason. Say it's four hundred
million dollars. Could be more, could be less. I'm just
picking that number. Well, my salary caps two hundred and
fifty million dollars. So the money I get for as
the Titans and the money I get as the forty

(35:06):
nine ers is the exact same, So I can't control
my state income tax, right, federal income tax are the same.
All these guys at the highest level pay like thirty
thirty seven percent, thirty eight percent. Obviously, when you're in
a place at California, in New York, that number then
goes above fifty percent, but in Tennessee that number zero.
So it's an enormous swing. But the teams in the

(35:30):
states don't control that, and they don't pay that. The
player does, aka the employee, So why would they want
to be like, well, let's say twenty million in Tennessee
would actually be thirty million dollars. Again, this might not
be exact or twenty five million dollars for the forty
nine ers or rams, so I got to spend more money,

(35:52):
yet we're both getting the same amount of money for
that person to then pay the government. There's a long
winded way of saying. The owners wouldn't want that because
that would their expenses would be higher, but it wouldn't
change anything. So I think I see what you're saying,
and if I was a player, I would want that,

(36:13):
But if I was an owner, I would not because
the taxes don't impact like my profitability, especially like the
Niners and Rams are proving like they can win. The
Yankees are proven they can win. So I hear what
you're saying, but I think that's something that's talked about
on the internet that is just not only not realistic,

(36:34):
the people in charge would not want it because their
expenses would rise, but their profits would not, so it
would just be less money coming in right and more
going out. I listen to your take on Bulky and
how he is a good politician. What is your take
on Telesco? As you said, Bulky survived a bunch of

(36:55):
coaches being fired with the Niners, but te LESCo was
with the Chargers forever and he is lasting with the Raiders. Now.
Is te LESCo a good politician? As a Charger fan,
I always thought he was terrible and made no moves
during the season to try and improve the weakness in
the roster. I don't know him personally. I actually always

(37:16):
thought he's pretty solid. I always thought the Chargers teams
their downfall was the coach, not the roster, and the
coach was the Spanos families choosing. I think if you
gave te LESCo Harbaugh over the last five or eight years,
they would have won a lot. And I can't speak

(37:40):
to this situation in with the Raiders. I had heard
when he got fired from the Chargers that he was
cool with he had made a decent amount of money
and just take a deep breath. You know that industry
can wear you out. And what I had heard is
that Mark da pays him a lot of money, like

(38:02):
offered him a job that I'm sure when he got
fired he didn't expect to get. You know, he got
fired the day after he lost the Raiders like seventy
to ten. And Mark Davis is I think he's one
of the higher paid gms in the league. So you
have year one like one of the best players in
the league. Last year brock Bowers was his first pick.

(38:22):
So I just wonder, now, just because you survive when
the coach gets fired, does not mean you'll survive. We'll
see who they end up hiring, what Tom Brady's role is.
So I guess it's a long way of saying I
have a better understanding of Bulky than I do till

(38:42):
I don't know much about tillasco beside just him picking players.
What are your thoughts on this. Basically, should the Vikings
look to trade JJ McCarthy for a first round pick
this year? Why would I trade a first round pick
for a rookie that was a project to begin with
with a pull? That doesn't make sense. Also, do you

(39:03):
think he would be the first pick this year? I don't.
Out of all the quarterbacks drafted last year, he was
the worst one in the biggest project. Cam Ward and
Shadour both have bigger arms. JJ has a bigger arm
than Shador Cam's. I would say cam Ward is a
better prospect than JJ McCarthy. I would say most people

(39:23):
would probably say JJ McCarthy is every bit as good,
if not better, prospect than Shaudor. I'm talking about coming
out of college this. You know, they showed JJ McCarthy
during the Vikings Lions game and I wasn't super locked in,
like obviously he had a big bushy Harry looked like
a surfer. And then the day after I saw on

(39:44):
Instagram someone like took elongated video of they what they
had shown on Sunday Night Football And I didn't catch
this during the game, but he looks like he's lost
twenty pounds. I gotta what was his way at the combine.
My guess would be two hundred and fifteen pounds. He

(40:04):
was just when he came out of college for Harbaugh.
I thought he was like big and strapped and looked good.
So he was two hundred and twenty pounds at the
NFL Combine. I would guess on the video that I
saw on Instagram of what they showed him on Sunday
Night Football, that he might have weighed one hundred and
ninety pounds. And I would imagine with a major knee injury,

(40:26):
you know, lifting and eating, and it's just his routine
has dramatically changed. He did not look good. I do
not think, given his knee injury and given that video
that I saw, that they could trade him for a
first round pick right now. So I don't even think
that's an option. And I've said over and over the Viking,
why would you trade him? If you were the Vikings.

(40:48):
Even if we end up rolling with Darnald like I
still might keep him around. It's not like he's breathing
down Darnald's neck. I'm a Bears fan, and I don't
know if you heard the reports that run. I mean,
the great part is about the Internet. You see all
the reports. I mean, I don't miss much. There's a
lot going on, you know, I've been People are like,

(41:09):
can you break down all the candidates the teams? Like,
I'm not doing that. It's hard to keep up with.
There's so many rumors flying. There's so much going on
right now you almost gotta let it breathe. And for me,
it's not like I'm kind of just talking about it all.
I do get like in an individual, if you're a
Bears fan and you're seeing who we're interviewing, or a

(41:30):
Jets fan seeing who we're interviewing, it could just be
a lot just because it's name after name after name. Now,
the Jets is probably different than most because they're interviewing
gms and coaches. The Bears, you're just gonna be interviewing coaches.
But Ryan Poles is urging the front office to go
in a different direction than Ben Johnson for fear that

(41:50):
Ben may force him out. My question for you is,
if this is true, would you force Poles out in
order to get Ben Johnson? Or do you think the
Bears should stick with Ryan and whoever he decides. There
was a viral yesterday when did I go to the gym,
probably early morning, like nine o'clock, and I just had

(42:15):
to get my blood flown. Hadn't worked out much in
the last week, hadn't really done anything. I had gone
for one walk in a week, and on that walk,
I was really far away from my house and I
had some serious stomach problems and I was like, oh
my god, I'm in major trouble. And while there is

(42:38):
a golf course, and because we're in the desert, these
things called washes. It's the desert, so it's like not
trees and like soft bushes. It's not really an area
where I was in trouble. And I thought about Colin
Maria to come pick me up, but I wasn't gonna
have enough time. And there's this one like communal pool

(42:58):
that basically has a spaw. It's like a little park,
but as a little pool, it's nice, has a spa
that I think sometimes people use it spaws in their
backyard in like a barbecue area. And luckily people were
there and I walked in. The gate was open because
I didn't have a key, the bathroom was locked, so
I had I was in such pain. I was just
I had no choice. It was very awkward. I asked

(43:20):
the people in the spa if I could use their
key to use a bathroom. Luckily I did, and I
tied myself because I didn't want to be in there
like five minutes. These people like touching our keys, but
I don't know how I got off. So I'm at
the gym watching I click on an NFL network and
it's Shod Cone and Trent Bulkey, basically two boxes. You know,

(43:42):
it looks like Trent's at the office, Shods probably at
one of his fifteen homes, and he's sitting at his house,
and you know he has behind him. Clearly he doesn't
want everyone to see how Richie is or something. So
it's all like you know, the fake green screen where
it's just nothing and basically every question is just for
Shod Khan and Trent is just sitting there. It was

(44:04):
extremely awkward, and I watched him for like ten minutes.
I'm like, this is They're just asking him the same
question over and over and over. Why are you keeping
Trent Bulky? Why are you keeping treb Balky? Why did
you fire the coach and keep the GM? And I
missed this question by Sako Viral yesterday is. Someone asked
Sead that if you hire a coach and that coach

(44:24):
is the guy you want, but the thing he wants
is for Bulky to be gone, what would you do?
And Seod was like, yeah, we'd probably have to listen
to him. So eventually said like, if we hire a
guy that doesn't want Trent, that yeah, fire Trent. It
was just and Trent's just staring there into the zoom.
I think it is very, very difficult to make these

(44:45):
weird marriages happen. And sometimes you just get a GM
who is looking for a coach, right, Like, I'm just
trying to hire a coach and have a coaching relationship
with the guy, right, That's what we thought last year
when ran Carthin hired Brian Callahan. Your later he's fired
and now they're going to be in this weird spot.

(45:06):
But it's like if I'm a coach like Ben Johnson
and I get hired to Ryan Poles and I don't
know the guy, and everyone in the city is asking
for him to be fired, and it's like, is this
a healthy way to go? And I just came from
a team organizationally that believed in building the line of
scrimmage and this guy drafted a wide receiver over offensive lineman.

(45:29):
What if philosophically we don't even view football the same.
But it's the Bears. I like Caleb and I want
this job. Well, my question would be if I'm a
McCaskey or I guess Kevin Warren is like, well, do
you have a personnel guy? And if you do, who
is it? Like? Part of it is I don't want

(45:49):
to work with this guy, but I got to have
my own guy. So are you bringing someone to the
table or are you just like, I'm not comfortable doing
this cause all reports are the Jags job's enticing. I
kind of call bullshit. It's enticing. I don't even it's
a good job, not for my vantage point, but it's
really negative when you got a factor in Bulky. So

(46:13):
it's like Shod's already acknowledged that if you bring someone
else to the table. Listen. So if I'm Ben Johnson,
am I better off just going to Jacksonville where I
could bring my own guy and get Bulky fired where
the Bears are going to force polls onto me. But again,
all this stuff's job preservation. Most people listening right now,
if you've worked in some sort of corporate office setting.

(46:36):
You have worked around a ton of people, and money's
all relative. Ryan Poll's making millions of dollars, You've probably
worked around people that made fifty grand, one hundred grand,
two hundred grand whatever to do the same shit, What
do I have to do so I don't get fired?
It's actually less about how do we win? And I'm

(46:58):
not even saying that this is that story might be true,
might not be. But if I'm Ryan Poles and I
know that I hire somebody. But if I'm gonna hire
the best coach possible and I've already got win that
that guy doesn't want to work with me, well why
would I want to hire that guy when I'm gonna
lose my job? Then I if I'm not, If it's

(47:18):
not my job, I don't give a fuck about the Bears.
I've already had to endure Kevin Warren and all this bullshit.
I've got to deal with it. And who knows, you know,
did he want Eba Fluci not. It's hard to get
to the bottom of these stories with the Bears. But
I do think it's just a basic human reaction. If
you have a role and they tell you if you hire,

(47:40):
you got these ten options. If you hire two of
those ten options, they're gonna want you gone. I think
most of us, again, it's whether you're a GM or
whether you're just a middle manager at a company, would
probably avoid that person if it if it like like

(48:00):
ended your job. It's one thing, it's like, hey, listen,
you're gonna have to learn to work with this guy.
That's like a basic we're all taught that at a
young age in like school, Like learn to get along
with this person, be nicer to this person. You're gonna
have to have a group project with these three people.
It's another thing if like we hire this guy, you
are fired, Like I don't think most people are signing

(48:23):
up for that. I also think this time of year
it's like a wildfire. These stories just gain momentum, and
it's like these big fires. It's like wind and trees
and it's just it's just engulfs and it's you just

(48:45):
can't see it. You don't even know what to believe.
And something like the bears, this stuff is just just
encapsulate you. There's not a story that could come out
right now about the bear situation that we wouldn't believe
even completely false rumors. If I just told if you're

(49:05):
a Bears fan, and I said, I said, tomorrow, there's
gonna be a headline. Caleb Williams demands of trade. Tomorrow,
there's a headline. Ryan Poles has resigned. Tomorrow, there's a headline.
Mike Vrabel reports he will take the Bear's job, but

(49:27):
he won't work for Kevin Warren. Like, all these things
are believable, and that's Ryan Poles does not want Ben
Johnson because he'd want him fired. And that's just kind
of where we're at. I think with this coaching search
in general, I mean, all these teams fall under that
kind of umbrella. Since there is no salary cap in
the NFL for coaches, could the Lions offer Ben Johnson

(49:51):
head coach money to stay in Detroit. I'm sure a
stock will keep rising with this team instead of trying
to fix another franchise wait for the perfect fit. They
could pay him more than Dan Campbell if they want.
I think probably a decade ago. Jerry Jones did that
with Jason Garrett. Remember Miami wanted to hire him and

(50:15):
at the time they were offering him like five million
dollars and Jerry Jones. Match didn't pay him five million
dollars to be the offensive coordinator. I think a couple
of years ago Josh McDaniels was making like eight million
dollars to be the Patriot offensive coordinator. You do whatever
you want. But part of Ben Johnson is if he

(50:36):
takes a head coaching job. Obviously the money factors in,
but it's like, I want to be the boss. I
want to be the guy giving the team speech. I
want to be the guy with the GM picking the
player on the draft. I want to be the guy
picking the guys in free agency. Ben Johnson's making millions
of dollars right now. I would imagine Ben Johnson over

(50:59):
the last three years has made ten million dollars eight
million dollars, Like he's a multi millionaire today and clearly
set up. If you wanted to stay with Detroit, they'd
probably pay him eight nine million dollars. If he became
a head coach, he could make twelve to fifteen million dollars.
So he is going to be flush with money. That
is not going to be his problem if he takes

(51:21):
a head coaching job. He is just tired. You know,
when you watch hard knocks and the coaching staffs in
the meeting room, and there's that long ass meeting table,
you know, in like a just in one of those
you know they call it like a staff room in football,
but a lot of these, a lot of companies I'm

(51:42):
sure you guys work for, have the same. And there's
just a meeting or a room where you meet that
is equipped to handle a lot of people. It's basically
like a long, long dinner table, but for work. And
you know who sits at the head of the table
the head coach odd in hard knocks. Who are the
two guys at the head the head of the table?

(52:04):
They actually had kind of like a wider one. It
was Ryan Poles and Eberflus. Like part of the ambition
to be the lead dog is to sit in that
seat and see what it is like, like can I
get it done as the headman. That's you know, this

(52:25):
is a very very ambitious profession coaching, and I would
say scouting executives, you aspire to keep working up the ladder.
And you know, in coaching, the pinnacle of the job,
of a potential job is being a head coach. Obviously

(52:46):
it pays the most, but it also like you get
the most responsibility, and you want to test your ability
do you have it in the bag or not? And
as we've seen, regardless how old you are, you've seen
most people fail because it's really really hard, and it
like Ben Johnson no scheme, like I don't have any

(53:09):
question marks like can Ben Johnson handle developing a game plan?
Can he lead the team? Can he build a team?
Can he handle controversial shit? Like when a star wide
receiver and his brother I guess, you know, I don't
know if i'd call Jameson Williams a star but highly

(53:30):
drafted receiver and his brother get pulled over with a
couple of loaded glocks about two in the morning, even
though he's a receiver and he's the offensive coordinator. You
know whose problem that is not? It's not Ben Johnson's.
Dan Campbell deals with that. You know, when Jamison Williams
throws the ball at the referee or the opposing player,

(53:53):
and the referee standing right there and they pull him
out of the game, and Antoine Randall l and they
starts screaming at each other. You know his problem that
is not Ben Johnson's Campbell deals with that. And that's
what's so hard. About being a coach. Think of the
shit that like Andy Reid and Bill Belichick for the
last Tomlin and Harball for the last twenty plus years,

(54:16):
those guys have had to deal with separate from football.
I'm talking DUI's, I'm talking bad injuries. I'm talking I
saw this year with the forty nine ers, t Various
Ward's one year old daughter just died. Trent Williams's wife
miscarried both twins. Ricky pearsall got shot. This type stuff. Honestly,

(54:44):
even in most industries you don't have to deal with.
It's hard. You're dealing with young people with a ton
of money, public facing, you know, individuals. It's a challenge.
So it's why I'm always hesitant. I'm always hesitant with
draft picks. Last year with the quarterbacks, everyone's like Caleb
can't miss. There's no such thing as can't miss. It

(55:07):
does not exist. It never hasn't never will I was
texting with a friend that works in the league today
and we were texting about ran Carthin and he had
a good line. He said, drafting, hiring a general manager,
hiring a podcaster. No matter what it is, human selection

(55:28):
is very difficult and imperfect. It's why they're the draft
will always have a huge bus rate. You're dealing with
human beings. It's why hiring a head coaches will always
have a huge bus rate. It's why people that just
hire whatever company you work for that hire people like

(55:51):
there's a lot of turnover in most jobs. In most jobs,
I was industries, I worked in in radio, in football,
hellid podcasting. I've seen people come and go from podcasting.
It's there is no direct correlation. If you do this,
this and that, it's gonna one hundred percent work. Unlike

(56:11):
if I just acquire you know, a company, and I
just see your books, I got a pretty good idea.
If we just keep doing this, we're gonna keep making money.
But when you hire an individual, whether it's a player
to play a position, whether it's a coach to be
a head coach, a coordinator, whether it's a GM from
being an assistant GM, you have absolutely no clue. You

(56:35):
can accumulate the most information possible and try to I
would say, like mitigate the percentage chances of failure. But
when they hire Joe Shane and Brian Dable, you would
have been like, I don't know if the resume could
get that much better. Brian Dabele had better or Belichick.

(56:57):
Then he left to go work for Saban. Then he
went a non Belichick Saban guy and just went to
work for Sean McDermott when they drafted Josh Allen and
for years just started at the bottom, turned him into
a star or what was part of it? Colin plays
Obviously Josh gets creditude. It's like he'd work for Belichick,

(57:17):
understands that, work for Saban, understands that, and then just
goes completely off and goes work for a n Andy
Reid guy and starts kicking ass. And I'm pretty sure
Joe Shane what his background was before Buffalo. I'm pretty
sure he worked for Carolina. It worked from Miami. So
Shane's resume is not quite as good as his ay ball,

(57:38):
but that was his guy. Then you put him together
and it's been a complete failure. But how could anyone
when those two guys were hired, and I'm thinking like
that was a pretty good higher. You watched Joe Shane
looks the part, skinny, good head of hair, articulate, speaks
well in front of a podium, and a couple of

(57:58):
years later you're watching hard On actually like, oh my god,
this is the biggest disaster I've ever seen. I watched
those guys interact. I'm like, this is not gonna work.
They got no fucking clue what they were doing. But
how would you have thought that when they hired it.
It was like, this guy's been an executive in the
league forever. This guy's worked for the best and the brightest,
and now just coached one of the biggest projects in

(58:20):
the history of the league into startom. Yeah. I probably
would have hired him too. Huge fan from Montana question
for the Mailbag. Football is my life and I'm a
Titans fan, so my life sucks as they just fired
the GM garbage franchise. Do you think it's possible the
coach is also in trouble because as soon as they

(58:41):
got the number one pick, they decided to get the
temperature read on Prime. Feels like they just do crazy
shit and hope it works. Yeah, man, I think there
are some elements to like the Jets and the Raiders.
You just don't really know what you're doing and you

(59:02):
just kind of keep your fingers crossed. You make these
hires and you just hope and pray and you know
Belichick before he took the North Carolina job, and he
was doing all the media. He used to use the
saying when he described Woody Johnson, ready fire aim. That's
what a lot of these franchises feel like. They're doing

(59:26):
a lot of ready fire aim. And I think the Titans, Uh,
I mean, if they hired Dion, that'd be pretty nuts.
Uh and Shador. I also think it's one thing Dion
Shador in the Big twelve that would have a chance,

(59:47):
Like it was really cool. As someone I've said this
over and over, like I'm sappy when it comes to
father son moments and that that final visual of those
two guys Shiloh two, Like, listen to someone that lots
their dad, that's that's all fucking awesome. As someone that
wants to have children here relatively soon, it's a powerful

(01:00:09):
relationship and you get to coach your son in college
and then have success. I would say the chance is
if they just got the band back together with the Titans,
that it would go well. I think that'd be pretty challenging.
But who knows. Maybe I'm just I doubted them at
Colorado wo't have worked. I would say I haven't read

(01:00:30):
any rumors that like Dion's gonna go to the Titans,
But at this point in time, when it comes to Tennessee,
how could you. I would imagine everything's on the table.
Started listening this offseason, Seahawks fan, I'm curious about your
final grade take on McDonald. You've spoken highly of them
this season, and I mostly agree. However, I'm sitting here

(01:00:54):
watching this meaningless Week eighteen game as the second string
Rams are more less having their way with the Hawks defense.
As I typed this, the Rams just scored and went
for two to tie the game in the third quarter.
I may be spoiled by the LB days, but I
expect more from this team and I've seen way too

(01:01:16):
much over the season to be excited for our future
with Mike. I'm hopeful, but not excited. Side note, Casey
second string is getting blanketed by Denver. Isn't that closer
to what this highly rated defense team should be doing
as well? The difference, though, is Denver had something to
play for. Denver was playing to get into the playoffs.

(01:01:40):
You guys were eliminated last weekend. So we talk about
human beings. If I'm a human being on Seattle, this
game means nothing. No one will ever discuss Remember that
tenth win you guys had, or remember the year that
you didn't beat the Rams and you won the nine

(01:02:01):
games once you missed the playoffs, and your season was
where you were at, you were whatever nine and you
were nine and seven going into that game. The game
honestly could not have met any less. It was no
different than all the teams that had absolutely nothing to
play for with shitty records, and you're playing their backups.

(01:02:23):
So put yourself in one of those players situations. Your season,
you battled, you screwed up a couple weeks ago, cost
you the playoffs, but you've had a solid season, you
get eliminated from the playoffs, and then Sean McVay, like Monday, goes,
we are punting on this game. So if you're a player,
especially a young player, is gonna be on the team

(01:02:44):
next year, do you think you gave the same effort
on Wednesday, Thursday and Friday as you did a month
ago when your season was really alive. It probably had
a little substitute teacher type feel to it. It probably
had a little like I'm not gonna be as focused
as much I might leave the office a little early,

(01:03:06):
basically winter breaks starting. So I don't judge him on
the Rams game at all. You went ten and seven
your quarterbacks Geno Smith. The defense is a lot better.
He fired the offensive Coordinator'd be interesting to see who
he hires, So I would say I would be bullish
on Mike McDonald. Moving forward, What do you think of

(01:03:29):
Josh McDaniels as the offensive coordinator for the Bears if
Rabel or Flores or hired as the head coach. The
idea being that if it works out, there is little
chance that Josh would leave to become a head coach,
given that he has done so poorly in the past.
There's zero chances nobody, at least in the pros maybe college.

(01:03:54):
I wouldn't in college, but I'm just saying the NFL
nobody's hiring Josh McDaniels. He's had two jobs. He did
not make it to year two in either and two
desperate teams. They both ran him out of town. One
of the great con jobs in recent memory, the Josh
McDaniels PR team a couple of years before he got

(01:04:17):
the Raider job. I I bought it hook line and Sinker.
I'm like this guy, change man. He looked in the mirror.
He started writing a journal of positive thoughts. I remember
reading like a Dan Pompeii article. I'm my god, this
is kind of got me. I'm like, Josh, we've been there, man.
Sometimes he's got to look in the mirror and make
a change. Then it turns out he did not change. Uh.

(01:04:42):
I've seen a lot of rumors that Vrabel would make
Uh McDaniels his offensive coordinator. I can't speak to those
two relationship. Same with Flores obviously and Josh worked together
for a long time. I don't know, I would say
Josh besides, I've seen him do some hits with Colin

(01:05:02):
has been pretty off the grid, so his work as
an offensive coordinator was pretty good. Now, granted, you know
one thing I was thinking. It actually crossed my mind,
probably sometime in the last week. Even if Josh changed,
like became a better guy, maybe humility as he got

(01:05:26):
older wasn't his cocky or whatever. In theory, he could
coach Tom Brady really hard, So he coached Tom Brady,
which meant he could coach everyone else on the offense
like it was nineteen sixty eight, nineteen seventy five, he
could be and listen, the offense can be like you

(01:05:47):
go to a Niners practice. Kyle Shanahan isn't writing perty
debo in Trent Williams not saying he doesn't coach them,
but it's like he's he picks the spots. Sean McVeigh,
I'm not saying these guys aren't hard on people, but
you treat different people different ways. That is not the

(01:06:07):
way New England operated. Tom Brady was the tip of
the spear and he got yelled at just as loudly,
if not harder, than other guys. It was intense. Well,
most places no one has Tom Brady, so you get
to these other places and it just overwhelms guys. And
that's where Rabel. People used Rabel as being a Belichick guy.

(01:06:29):
Rabel just played for Belichick. Rabel coach for Urban Meyer
and Bill O'Brien. Mike Vrabel did not coach for him.
He was not going to coaching meetings, he was not
game planning Monday and Tuesday with the staff. That's when
he was a player. So I think Mike Rabel got
the best of both worlds. He saw what it takes,

(01:06:51):
like the intensity of practice, but then he saw other
stuff as a coach. Well, Josh, I mean, let's face it,
the majority of what he knows as a coach is
under Bilt, and he's kind of proven that the only
way in coach is that way. Now it's a little
easier to do that when Mike Frable is your head coach.

(01:07:11):
The thing with Flores, and I think there's been you know,
could Flores because he's buddy with Ryan Poles. It's well documented,
which I thought kind of funny how mean Flores was
the Tua and I think it stems from Flores did
not think Tua could play, which, listen, Flores was wrong.

(01:07:32):
It's not like two was great, but two was definitely
way better than Flores thought. But Flores was a dick
to him and the staff. Can you imagine I've seen
some funny memes. Can you imagine Flores de calebing. One
thing with Tua is like to it played for Saban.
One thing I respect about to it like two was

(01:07:53):
fucking mentally tough. Might not be good enough, but no
one questions Tua's like metal capabilities of like handling some shit.
I think that's a pretty big question mark with Caleb
and for most of Caleb's life, like everyone's been on
their knees giving him a reach around. You play for Saban,
like it was an intense environment for Tua to a

(01:08:16):
hand in Brian Flores and like I would say, handled
it relatively well. Caleb would never have experienced anything like
Brian Flores. I don't think that would work. I don't
see how Brian Flores could hold it in either, Like
it would be difficult. That feels like a bad marriage.

(01:08:39):
That feels like a marriage that I don't know, I'd
have a hard I don't think Brian Flores and Caleb.
I just don't think Brian Flores could be nice to him.
I don't think he'd be able to look at him
after what he just witnessed on film and the way
Caleb kind of carries himself. It's like, Caleb, your shit,
don't think anymore, buddy. Half the people that talk about

(01:09:03):
football calling you a bust, Like let's let's take any
breath here, let's relax. Flora's come in fucking like a
drill instructor. He'd be in that guy shit. Twenty four
to seven, klem My quit. He was like, I'm out,
I'm just I'm rich. Uh nil, I'm done with this.

(01:09:24):
I could see Caleb demanding a trade before, like training camp, Okay,
we'll get out of here on that, and uh, actually,
that'd be awesome. I would pay to see that. That'd
be an awesome hard knocks even though they were just
on hard knocks. He wouldn't get him again. Would be
Floras and Caleb Williams. Sign me up, Audios, Talk to
you guys soon. The volume