Kerre Woodham: The chaos in Parliament was a reflection of us

Crikey, when I suggested yesterday that it might be a good idea if you've never seen Parliament TV, you could always tune in and see the first reading of the Treaty Principles Bill.  

Crikey, I expected fireworks but not quite to the level that was on display yesterday. The House was temporarily suspended as the legislation was being voted on, after members of the Te Pati Māori performed a haka in front of the bill's author David Seymour. Gerry Brownlee cleared the public gallery, suspended the House, and once order was restored about 20 minutes later, Te Pati Māori's Hana-Rawhiti Maipi-Clarke was “named” for starting the haka with the speaker. Gerry Brownlee called her behaviour appalling, disrespectful, and grossly disorderly. Being “named” is one of the most serious punishments in Parliament. If you're named, you are suspended for 24 hours, and your pay is docked. Doesn't happen terribly often – former National Party MP Nick Smith was named three times in his parliamentary career, but apart from Smith, it really is a pretty rare punishment.  

Newstalk ZB's political commentator Barry Soper said the behaviour was the worst he's seen in 40 years of covering politics. Former Speaker of the House Sir Lockwood Smith said he too thought it was the worst he'd ever seen.  

“That would have to be as bad as I've ever seen. I guess, you know my feeling after it was just one of real sadness, you know? Real sadness to see Parliament treated that way. You know, you can't blame the Speaker – I don't think you can blame Gerry at all. I think in the end he had no choice but to suspend the House and let things settle down, have the gallery cleared. I think, you know, some of the rot has started a way back – the whole standard of the place has been lowered in, you know, recent years. And I think you know, this is just when, once you start letting things slip, it just, you know, another inch happens or another centimetre and so it goes on.” 

Well, the bill isn't going anywhere, but not until there's been six months of public submissions. ACT, National and NZ First agreed to support it to a first reading as part of the coalition negotiations – one of the dead rats they had to swallow to form a government. And look at the latest poll, the major parties have gained. Nationals up 3.9%, Labours up 1.2%, ACT and Te Pati Māori are both down. That says to me we don't like extremism, we don't like political opportunists making hay, we don't like people at the very extreme of politics. For the most part, we want a relatively quiet life. We just want to be able to send our kids to school and know they'll be educated. We want to be able to ensure that we can go shopping and not be mugged, that we can sleep safely in our own homes, that we can drive from point A to point B without falling down a pothole the size of a three-story skyscraper. We all want the opportunity to be able to work, look after ourselves and if the worst comes to the worst, fate deals this a cruel blow, there will be a safety net there. Oh, and it, you know, perhaps if we have an accident, there's a health system that can pick up the pieces there too.  

The extremism doesn't, for the most part, win votes. I've had David Seymour on here before and put to him that this whole Treaty Principles Bill was a huge part of campaigning and yet on voting day, on Election Day, ACT didn't get nearly the votes they thought they were going to get. National made it very clear they were not going to support the bill. They had to, in the end, form a government to first reading. They didn't want a bar of it. And neither do, I would argue, most New Zealanders of whatever ethnicity you might be.  

But come back to Lockwood Smith's point when it comes to Parliament, are MPs really role models and exemplars of behaviour we should all be seeking to emulate? Sir Lockwood Smith seemed to think so, tha

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:06):
You're listening to the Kerry Wood of Mornings podcast from
News Talk, said B.

Speaker 2 (00:12):
Craikey. When I suggested it might be a good idea
yesterday if you've never seen Parliament heavy thought, well you
could always tune in if you've never watched it before
and see the first reading of the Treaty Principal's Bill. Crikey,
I expected fireworks, not quite to the level that was
on display yesterday. The House was temporarily suspended as the

(00:33):
legislation was being voted on after members of the Maori
Party performed a haker in front of the bill's author
David Seymour. Jerry Browne cleared the public gallery, suspended the
house and once order was restored about twenty minutes later,
Tati Mahi's Hannah raffittimp Clark was named and inverted Commas

(00:54):
for starting the haker, with the Speaker Jerry Browne, calling
her behavior appalling, disrespectful and grossly disorderly. Being named is
one of the most serious punish in Parliament. If you're named,
you're suspended for twenty four hours, your pay is docked.
Doesn't happen terribly often. Former National Party MP Nick Smith

(01:18):
was named three times in his parliamentary career. Apart from Smith,
it really is a pretty rare punishment. News Talk said
b's political commentator Barry Soper said the behavior was the
worst he's seen in forty years of covering politics. Former
Speaker of the House Sir Lockwood Smith said he too
thought it was the worst I've ever seen.

Speaker 3 (01:39):
That would have to be as bad as I've ever seen.
I guess you know. My feeling after it was just
one of real sadness, real sadness to see Parliament treated
that way. You know, you can't blame the speaker. I
think you can blame jury at all. I think at
the end he had no choice but suspend the House
and let things settle down and have the gallery cleared.

(02:01):
I think, you know, some of the rot has started
a way back. The whole standard of the place has
been lowered in recent years, and I think, you know
this is just when once you start letting slipped it,
just another inch happens, or another centimeter, and so it
goes on.

Speaker 2 (02:22):
Well, the bill isn't going anywhere, but not not until
there's been six months of public submissions. National and New
Zealand first agreed to support it to a first reading
as part of the coalition negotiations, one of the dead
rats they had to swallow to form a government. And
look at the latest poll, the major parties have gained.

(02:45):
Nationals up three point nine percent, Labour's up one point two,
Act and Tamari are both down. That says to me,
we don't like extremism. We don't like political opportunists making hay,
we don't like people at the very extreme of politics.

(03:09):
For the most part, we want a relatively quiet life.
You know, we just want to be able to send
our kids to school and know they'll be educated. We
want to be able to ensure that we can go
shopping and not be mugged. That we can sleep safely
in our own homes, that we can drive from point

(03:32):
A to point B without falling down a pothole the
size of a three story skyscraper. We all want the
opportunity to be able to work, look after ourselves, and
if the worst comes to the worst fate deals us
a cruel blow, there will be a safety net there. Oh,
and perhaps if we have an accident, there's a health

(03:52):
system that can pick up the pieces there too. The
extremism doesn't for the most part win votes. I've had
David Seymour on here before and I said to him,
I put to him that this whole treaty, principle's will
was a huge part of ACTS campaigning, and yet on

(04:14):
voting day. On election day, ACT didn't get nearly the
votes they thought they were going to get. National made
it very clear they were not going to support the
bill they had to in the end former government to
first reading they didn't want a bar of it, and

(04:35):
neither do I would argue neither to most New Zealanders
of whatever ethnicity you might be. But come back to
lockwood Smith's point, when it comes to Parliament, our MP's
really role models and exempt lars of behavior we should
all be seeking to emulate. Sir lockwood Smith seemed to

(04:58):
think so that there's a standard within Parliament that needs
to be set and maintained for the good of society.
I don't think that's true. I think they are representatives
of New Zealand and as such they represent us, and
we have become more tribal, less likely to debate an issue,
more entrenched in our beliefs. If you don't support me,

(05:21):
you're against me, less likely to listen and agree to disagree.
What we saw in Parliament is pretty much what you
see on social media every day. People yelling at each other,
not listening, not debating, just taking a stance and sticking

(05:47):
to it. And that's fair enough. Everybody is entitled to
their own opinion. Everybody is entitled to put forward a proposition.
You can hear the other side out and you can
maintain your own position if that's what you wish to do.
You can change your mind if you But David Seymour

(06:09):
knew exactly what he was doing. Oh hey, I'm just
putting it up there for discussion. Oh come on, it
was political opportunism. He got exactly what he knew would happen.
He's not stupid. He's many things, but he is not stupid.
So all we saw in Parliament, I think is a

(06:31):
reflection of what we see just about every single day
in social media on the text machine. We've seen it
over numerous different issues. I think this and if you
don't think like me stuff. Yeah, no such thing as

(06:51):
debate anymore.

Speaker 1 (06:53):
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