December 22, 2024 • 24 mins
Dan, born and raised in Auckland, left high school at 15 and completed a butchery apprenticeship. He earned a Bachelor of Arts and a Bachelor of Commerce (Hons) from the University of Auckland, and a Master of Public Policy in Economics from Harvard University on a Fulbright Scholarship.
Elected to Parliament in 2018 and re-elected in 2023, Dan is the Chair of the Māori Affairs Select Committee and a member of the Economic Development Select Committee. Before Parliament, he worked as a management consultant, senior executive, and economist for the OECD and other organisations.
Dan lives in Birkenhead with his wife Courtney, their dog Mylo, and family.
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Speaker 1 (00:09):
You're listening to a podcast from News talk S ed B.
Follow this and our wide range of podcasts now on iHeartRadio,
Real Conversation, Real Connection. It's Real life with John Cowan
on News Talks ed B.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
Gooday, welcome to real life. My guest tonight was a
high school dropout at fifteen and now he has four
degrees behind him, including a master's from Harvard, and is
in his second term as MP for Northcote. Welcome to
the honorable Dan Bidwa.
Speaker 3 (00:38):
Get a John. Good to have you here and Merry
Christmas here.
Speaker 2 (00:41):
And to you and your family. And that's the thing
I can say family now an't because you've propagated.
Speaker 3 (00:49):
Yes, I have joined the ranks of parenthood and in
my sleep couldn't be any worse. But no, it's a
true joy and a blessing. So we're absolutely wrapped up
your parents.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
That's the standard line that you have to give it
as a dad, an actual fact. You know, I worked
at the parenting place for many years and I reckon
the first year of your first baby is the hardest
year of your life. Yes, and if you're still upright
and conscious, you're probably doing quite well. Amy see how
you get on adrenaline.
Speaker 3 (01:20):
And absolutely, and my wife's doing a great job and
we're very lucky to have a baby that sleep, So
it's just fantastic.
Speaker 2 (01:29):
And you being an overachiever yourself with all these degrees
and things, as Noah doing an excellent job of being
a baby he is.
Speaker 3 (01:37):
He isn't quite reading the economics one oh one for
four year olds yet, but we're working on it. But
no he's just moving ahead and leaps and bounds. Seven
months old and nearly to the crawling stage, so you're
reaching all of his milestones quite nicely.
Speaker 2 (01:52):
You're saying that he sleeps well. I guess you could
be reading in parliamentary briefings to help them sleep.
Speaker 3 (01:57):
That will help them sleep very much. We're tuning into
watch his Dad in Parliament will also help them sleep.
Speaker 2 (02:03):
So are you getting a break yourself over Christmas?
Speaker 3 (02:06):
Look, we are. We're Parliament's just wrapped up for the
year and so we're not back in parliament until the
end of January. I'm back at work on the thirteenth,
so we've got a few weeks off and I'm just
looking forward to having a break. It has been a
long year for many John and I'm just looking forward
to having but a family time and rest and relaxation.
Speaker 2 (02:26):
Now, your baby, Noah, yes, is about the same age
that you were when your life changed quite profoundly.
Speaker 3 (02:35):
Yeah, it's often a conversation with my wife that brings
us to this point. But I was adopted at nine
months and my son is seven months, and we often compare,
you know, what was life for me at nine months
versus the privileges that Noah has at seven months old.
And so I was very lucky to be adopted into
a working class family, but a loving family. And having
(02:58):
gone down the road and actually found my real parents,
so I just realized how lucky I am. I've had
the upbringing. But Noah, my son is extremely fortunate to
have my wife and I and just the warmth of
a loving family. Yeah, and I'm cognizant and not everybody
has that in New Zealand and around the world.
Speaker 2 (03:18):
Right now. You've often said that the family that you
were adopted into was wonderful, loving and secure and gave
you lots of attention. It's right, And yet you've also
described yourself as troubled, naughty, the bottom of the class. Okay,
those things are often associated with kids that don't get
a grid start. Have you got any good reasons, any
(03:42):
understanding about why you were going down that route?
Speaker 3 (03:45):
Yeah, look, it just goes to show you that, you know,
delinquency can happen in any socio economic class. And for me,
it was as much my own fault as it was
the environment that I was in. So, you know, I
messed around with the wrong kids at high school and
you know, started smoking on the field, and just one
(04:06):
thing led to another, and so yeah, it wasn't really
heading down a good path. But you know, the family
I grew up in was a family of just loving
values and loving attention, and so I had all the
right conditions there, but I wasn't able to ultimately, you know,
take advantage of that because of my own mistakes in life.
Speaker 2 (04:28):
Actually, it's it's almost typical that kids that have been
adopted during they hit adolescence. I take it you were
aware that you were adopted as you're an adolescent. They
sometimes I don't know what it is, confusion seeking identity
or something that kicks over into troubled behavior. To think
that might have been.
Speaker 3 (04:47):
Part Yeah, look, you know, and you've got a certain
interest in education. I know, John and you know, the
research is well founded that people that come from adopted
families have have challenges with education. I probably exhibited a
bit of learning difficulties in there. So my wife likes
to think I'm probably you know, ADHD or something, so
maybe young diagnosed so things things like that. Probably some
(05:12):
learning difficulties there. But ultimately you've just got to take responsibility, John,
And I'm very fortunate to have studied the things I have.
Speaker 2 (05:19):
And well, you know, yeah, I mean your academic engine
did eventually get started, and it's been revving. I mean,
four degrees, including a master's from Harvard that's not to
be sneezed at. And then it's been the fuel of
your career. What do you think could have happened at
school earlier because you did drop out at fifteen. Yes,
(05:40):
you'd been suspended twice, and so I don't imagine there
was great howls of distress when you did walk out
the school gates. Yes, yeah, But is there anything the
school could have done earlier in your education career that
you think may have just turned your academic interests on earlier?
Speaker 3 (05:57):
I probably, having reflected on this, I could have gone
to a school that could pare academics with the real world.
More so, I often used to complain that mathematics was
far too theoretical. It ended up john that I loved mathematics,
and that's why I stated economics, but I didn't like
a lack of application to the real world and that's
(06:17):
why working. And I had the chance to work at
a local butcher shop that the Principle got me into
when I was fourteen that had an immediate application of
real world theory to real world life. And so I
think that what does our education need to be in
the future. It needs to make sure that we're making
(06:39):
that leap between theory and application so that kids see
the reasoning and why things are the way they are.
Speaker 2 (06:46):
I'm glad you credit the Principle with something that was
significant in your education, and so he helped you get
into a trade that's right.
Speaker 3 (06:55):
Well, at the time, I think he probably just saw
me as heading down the wrong path, and he said
to the local butcher shop, I wanted you to take
this man on to teach them some things. And he's
been caught stealing at high school and see what you
can do with him. So the local butcher took me on.
He took him knife to my hand. You wouldn't get
away with us these days. But you know, he basically
(07:17):
said a nine certain terms, don't steal from me, or
you'll get it.
Speaker 2 (07:21):
But that was actually the kind of I would listen
to a man a sharp knife.
Speaker 3 (07:25):
That was the kind of discipline that I needed at fifteen,
to say, hey, pull up your socks, chap, you can
do more with your life, but play by the rules
and work out and you'll get ahead.
Speaker 2 (07:36):
And that's turned into an apprenticeship, that's right.
Speaker 3 (07:38):
Yeah, And you know I had a bit of an
excusion cancer in between them.
Speaker 2 (07:44):
I was going to say, you're only what two weeks
into your apprenticeship, that's right.
Speaker 3 (07:48):
And then got diagnosed with cancer. So I had to
leave my apprenticeship and go and have chemotherapy and that
took me out for six months and came back with,
you know, high energy, wanting to become a butcher. So
that's that's what got me started in the butchery trade.
Speaker 2 (08:07):
So, as well as probably nearly killing you, cancer in
some ways changed your life, John.
Speaker 3 (08:14):
It was the best thing that could have happened to me.
I was heading down a pretty rough path, a path
of probably eventual you know, corrections ending up in the
corrections facilities. I had been arrested for petty crime, but
it was the best thing because it made me realize, Hey,
(08:36):
life is short. You could finish your life in a
couple of years or now, or in forty years time,
so let's make it matter.
Speaker 2 (08:45):
I'd like to think that a teenager shouldn't have to
think about mortality and death, but you obviously did have
to because this was a This wasn't just a This
was a serious dose of cancer, wasn't it.
Speaker 3 (08:56):
It was It was a ung sarcoma. But you know,
it's I think you know a lot of people out
there can identify with this, right if you if you've
had a loved one that's had cancer or any other
kind of serious illness in life, it shocks your system
and there's something unique in that, you know. I think
Steve Jobs is famously quoted around you know you will
(09:17):
die someday, and make each day count. So I think
what I've tried to do with my life since cancer
is make every day count and make sure that I'm
living life to the fullest and giving back and making
a difference to those around me. And that's what I
try and do.
Speaker 2 (09:33):
You can actually remember in your illness making those sorts
of rearrangements to the food your.
Speaker 3 (09:39):
Brain absolutely, and that's what got me thinking, well, I'd
like to go into business, get through my apprenticeship, maybe
owner run a supermarket, and see where I get to.
So that was kind of the path I charted for me.
And so you know, I did my apprenticeship in two
years and then started making my way in the management
realm in at the time it was wool worse and
(10:02):
now it's back to wool worst because the company's changed.
But then realize, hey, look I should probably go and
study because I lacked some skills in the business field
there to actually succeed.
Speaker 2 (10:17):
Sorry to wallow in just one, one little chapter of
your life, but I know that you had a Catholic
upbringing you into Catholic school before you got to high
school and things, and so you're faced with something as
you know, as a young person with cancer, the idea
that you could die was on the table. Walk me
(10:38):
through what you would have been thinking about that. Did
faith matter to you? Then?
Speaker 3 (10:42):
If faith has always met it in some way, shape
or form, John, as you said, my family's Catholic I've
been a Catholic primary school, and my wife's family is Catholic.
And even our son is named in a biblical sense
Noah for Noah's role in Noah's Ark, And so your
(11:02):
faith has always met it And I'm never going to
be a Bible basher there, John, But for me, it's
about just living the values of Christianity. And to me
it's about you know, service, service above self, others above self, uh,
you know, making a difference, making an impact. And so
(11:26):
I think those sort of values from our faith have
always had a role to play in thinking about, you know,
what I'm doing in life and is it making a difference.
Speaker 2 (11:38):
So you got the suprenticeship, you became, you got your
ticket as a butcher within a butchery within a supermarket.
That's right, supermarket that you.
Speaker 3 (11:49):
A double seven if if your listeners remember that and
new market.
Speaker 2 (11:53):
Right, but that was the same supermarket chain. You eventually
became part of the executive of.
Speaker 3 (11:59):
No So I yeah, yeah, so that that. I went
to university and I thought I'll be here for three years,
get a Bachelor of Commerce, and then go back to
the meat retailing industry or the souper market industry. The
time I spent at university was actually five years. I
(12:20):
then went into that.
Speaker 2 (12:21):
You came out with two degrees, yeah, two degrees and honors, yeah,
conjointing and honors.
Speaker 3 (12:26):
And then went into work for Deloitte, which is kind
of what any big aspiring commerce graduate would know. Is
just you want to get into banking and consulting. And
for me, banking had no appeal, so consulting was really
what I wanted to do. And that took me over
to the to the States, study public policy again for
(12:47):
my master's.
Speaker 2 (12:50):
Racing down this track, yes, yeah, to come back to you,
to get from butchery to academics. Yes, again, someone stepped in.
You had your principal gave your tap you towards the
trud yeah, and someone gave you a tap towards academics.
Speaker 1 (13:05):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (13:06):
That was an American guy who became my mentor for
my early stages. He was an executive at that time.
Speaker 2 (13:13):
Will worse. I wonder if you've spent time in America.
I wonder if Americans have got a different attitude when
it comes to entrepreneurial lighting the fire on these sorts
of things.
Speaker 3 (13:24):
I think New Zealanders have that, but America is next
level entrepreneurialism and next level excitement and go get him attitude.
And you know, I've spent a few years in the States,
as my wife has, and I think, you know, even
the Prime Minister has. And I think what's quite clear
is the you know, nobody owes you anything in life,
(13:47):
You've actually got to go out there and make a
thing of it yourself. And that it's that kind of
mindset I think that pervades most US states and individuals.
We have that in New Zealand. John, don't get me wrong,
but it's just it's a whole nother way of operating
in the States.
Speaker 2 (14:06):
And my guest tonight is MP for Northcote, our Dan Bidoir,
the honorable Dan Bidoir, And after the break we'll be
talking about his adventures overseas, some of the perspectives he
gained on New Zealand, about New Zealand while in Kazakhstan
and Malaysia and Ukraine in these other places. So stay
turned back with Dan Bidoir in just a.
Speaker 1 (14:27):
Bit intelligent interviews with interesting people. It's real life on
news Talk ZB.
Speaker 2 (14:34):
Welcome back to real life. I'm John Cown talking with
the honorable Dan Bidoir, whose lonely days ended earlier this year.
Oh no, look twenty twenty two.
Speaker 3 (14:44):
Was it twenty twenty twenty twenty two? Yes, nineteenth and
November that's right, Yes, Yeah, got married to the love
of my life and winning that song is my wedding song,
ed to James.
Speaker 2 (14:57):
Yeah, and that's very romantic. Was that your dance?
Speaker 3 (15:00):
It was our dance song? No, but we we really
consulted the song playlist heavily to work out one that
we both loved, and we both settle on this one.
And just you know, just an amazing woman that I
met and amazing mum, and so yeah, this song reminds
me of her and love I have.
Speaker 2 (15:21):
Yeah, Okay, you spent a lot of time overseas, probably
on your own, were you lonely?
Speaker 3 (15:28):
Yes?
Speaker 2 (15:29):
I was.
Speaker 3 (15:29):
So it's spent nothing about total of seven years all
up overseas and mostly in North America, Europe and Southeast Asia. Look,
I think you know, the world is a big place.
It's an amazing You could just continuously travel, right, you know,
you could just travel all your life and still not
(15:51):
reach every country, right, So it's an amazing experience.
Speaker 2 (15:56):
You've picked a fear few off that probably.
Speaker 3 (15:58):
Mid forties in terms of countries. But you know, it
sounds like a lot, but that's a lot. Well, it's
only you know, it's how many countries in the world
depending on how you take the UN definition or not.
But there's still a huge amount of countries that I
haven't been to. But you know, real great privilege to
live overseas, but it's given me an opportunity to look
(16:20):
at what are the strengths and opportunities for New Zealand.
Speaker 2 (16:24):
So when you say so when you're in somewhere like Kazakhstan, yes, well,
what are you doing in Kazakhstan? Yeah?
Speaker 3 (16:30):
Well I asked myself that question many times, but I
was working as an economist of the OECD and it
was focused on emerging market so countries that have the
potential to become developed and want the prestige and status
of being called an Oe city country, but not I'm
not quite there, So I need advice and guidance on
what are the kind of policies they need to put
(16:51):
in place.
Speaker 2 (16:51):
Okay, when you're looking at the at their standards and
things that are not perhaps at OECDS level, what are
you thinking about New Zealand when you're sitting in a
place like that.
Speaker 3 (17:01):
Look, I think gives me a great privilege of having
grown up and lived and you know, being raised in
New Zealand. We've got a lot of strengths. We're a
democratic country. There's actually very few in the in the
world at the moment where we have a liberal Western
democracy in the institutions that that comes with. Again, not
(17:22):
many countries have that. We have people that I think
are recently entrepreneurial and you know, fear minded. You know,
everybody wants a fear go much like Australians, right, So
I think there's on these legion there's a lot of
great strengths, a beautiful country, fantastic food. The list goes
(17:43):
on the missed opportunities. In my view, John is around
the economy and the incomes that we provide for those
that live and work in New Zealand. And having lived
o across the world, you know, there are a lot
of wealthier countries and ours, and I just think that
there's a huge amount of opportunity for us to grow
(18:06):
our economic grow incomes and grow the standard of living
that results from that higher incomes.
Speaker 2 (18:13):
Now, your first foray into politics was while you're still
at university.
Speaker 3 (18:19):
It was John and to be honest, it wasn't party politics.
It wasn't party politics, but it was student politics, and
that was probably where I thought my foreign into politics
would end. If I'm honest, I didn't have the greatest
experience of politicians in student politics. So why am I
here nearly twenty years later. Well, ultimately it's about making
(18:43):
a difference.
Speaker 2 (18:44):
So saying that being student president wasn't wasn't much fun.
Going digging back through the files, I see you quoted
on all sorts of things, interestingly, often in support of
Labor Party politics. We won't mention that too much, but
that you didn't enjoy the politics back then.
Speaker 3 (19:03):
Summer it was a fun year. I had a lot
of fun, a lot of people, and it is a
contributing factor to the successes that I've had since then professionally.
So you know, on a whole, I think that was
a great experience. But when I mentioned the fore anti politics,
I mean at the time it was the Labor government
and I just saw a huge amount of waste in
(19:24):
poor policy. Thinking the year that I was President of
the year about the interest rey student loan skin came
in and my economics had was going off in terms
of the impact that that would have on the fiscal account.
So look, I just think I wasn't that inspired by
the politicians that i'd met.
Speaker 2 (19:46):
So how have you ended up getting tipped for standing
for the by election in Northcote.
Speaker 3 (19:50):
Well, look, ultimately, john I spent some time overseas and
I thought, hey, I want to make a difference to
New Ziala. How do you make that difference in a
shorter space of time. There are a lot of ways
to make a difference to this country, but for me,
it was entering public life and ultimately about meanting better
policies to get us to a greater position.
Speaker 2 (20:11):
You're going to be a party. Yeah, well we can
thank your grandmother for that. I can. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (20:16):
You know, well my grandmother she had she was from
a very poor family, part marty, on a widow's pension
for most of her life, but she always believed in
a hand up, not a handout. And you know, if
she were here today, I think she'd be proud of
my affiliation to the National Party because of the values
of the National Party and the way they aren't to hers.
(20:37):
But ultimately, Johnna, you know I came back. I wanted
to make a difference. National's values aligned with my values,
and that's what brought me to the National Party. And
I failed first first attempt. I went from my seat
where I was initially My good colleague Simeon Brown won
(20:58):
that and he's doing a great job as a minister.
But then won the selection to contest the Northcote by election,
and you got North Cote. As you know, it's a reasonably.
Speaker 2 (21:10):
Bell weather seat.
Speaker 3 (21:11):
So I lost that seat and came back three years later.
Speaker 2 (21:14):
I mean it's interesting you could say, oh, look at him,
he's on a rocket sled heading upwards. But natural fact,
and I mean, you've got enough wins in various areas
of your life for this not to sound rude, but
you've actually had a fair amount of failures too, haven't you.
I mean it was you took a couple of tries
to become student president. It took you got into parliament,
(21:34):
you got knocked out of parliament, and even the full
Bright scholarship you got exactly you didn't get that first off. Yes,
this translates into something in you.
Speaker 3 (21:43):
Yeah, well, I think hopefully that took her to my
character and I've always believed that actually the character is
most shown. One's characters most shining when you fail. When
you succeed, it's very easy to speak from the throne
of success, but when you fail, actually it's about how
do you turn things around? And so you know, for me,
(22:06):
it's about taking your failures, learning as much as you
can from them, and coming out of them a better
a person, a better leader, and a better more you know,
confident being from that. So that's what I've tried to do.
Speaker 2 (22:24):
And spend the three years that you were out of parliament, well,
I spent a few of those time sulking why did
I lease a seat?
Speaker 3 (22:32):
John?
Speaker 2 (22:33):
But waiting for your character to kick it?
Speaker 3 (22:37):
Easier said than done, John, But look, no, inos honesty.
I went back to the commercial world and did a
bit of work in the financial sector, which was actually great.
But I did some got married, as you.
Speaker 2 (22:50):
Know, well that's a good profitable because I imagine there's
a parliamentary and you probably didn't have a lot of
dating time. So that, yeah, you go, that reversal stood,
and that did you in good stead?
Speaker 3 (23:06):
Yeah, And then I you know, I found my real
parents as well, and so I went on a journey
to as I'm being adopted. I've found my real parents
and that took me about a year from from the
start to actually having a phone call with my mother
and then finding my father as well.
Speaker 2 (23:20):
So has that signed off? Something? Isn't you look yet? Has?
Speaker 1 (23:24):
It?
Speaker 3 (23:25):
Wasn't a pretty ending, but I think it's to me.
It's given me a greater sense of who I am,
the background of my DNA and even the little things
why I do little things here and there. But it's
also connected with me with parliamentarians across the house saedde John.
So I'm actually related to Pennahernad. We we're from the
(23:46):
same eye up in and also Agent Rula for their
former Speaker of the House. So I've got some illustrious connections.
Unfortunately just not in the National Party right.
Speaker 2 (23:59):
I'm afraid we have to call it quits at that.
My guest tonight, Dan Bidoir, if you'd like to carry
on the conversation with about politics and things, Roxburgh is
with you up till midnight tonight and you could call
in and talk about these things. But Dan, thank you
so much. We're going out on another song You've picked
Michael Bouble singing Home.
Speaker 3 (24:18):
Thanks John, and Merry Christmas to you and to all
your listeners out there.
Speaker 2 (24:22):
Thank you.
Speaker 1 (24:23):
For more from News Talk sed B. Listen live on
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You're listening to a podcast from News talk S ed B.
Follow this and our wide range of podcasts now on iHeartRadio,
Real Conversation, Real Connection. It's Real life with John Cowan
on News Talks ed B.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
Gooday, welcome to real life. My guest tonight was a
high school dropout at fifteen and now he has four
degrees behind him, including a master's from Harvard, and is
in his second term as MP for Northcote. Welcome to
the honorable Dan Bidwa.
Speaker 3 (00:38):
Get a John. Good to have you here and Merry
Christmas here.
Speaker 2 (00:41):
And to you and your family. And that's the thing
I can say family now an't because you've propagated.
Speaker 3 (00:49):
Yes, I have joined the ranks of parenthood and in
my sleep couldn't be any worse. But no, it's a
true joy and a blessing. So we're absolutely wrapped up
your parents.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
That's the standard line that you have to give it
as a dad, an actual fact. You know, I worked
at the parenting place for many years and I reckon
the first year of your first baby is the hardest
year of your life. Yes, and if you're still upright
and conscious, you're probably doing quite well. Amy see how
you get on adrenaline.
Speaker 3 (01:20):
And absolutely, and my wife's doing a great job and
we're very lucky to have a baby that sleep, So
it's just fantastic.
Speaker 2 (01:29):
And you being an overachiever yourself with all these degrees
and things, as Noah doing an excellent job of being
a baby he is.
Speaker 3 (01:37):
He isn't quite reading the economics one oh one for
four year olds yet, but we're working on it. But
no he's just moving ahead and leaps and bounds. Seven
months old and nearly to the crawling stage, so you're
reaching all of his milestones quite nicely.
Speaker 2 (01:52):
You're saying that he sleeps well. I guess you could
be reading in parliamentary briefings to help them sleep.
Speaker 3 (01:57):
That will help them sleep very much. We're tuning into
watch his Dad in Parliament will also help them sleep.
Speaker 2 (02:03):
So are you getting a break yourself over Christmas?
Speaker 3 (02:06):
Look, we are. We're Parliament's just wrapped up for the
year and so we're not back in parliament until the
end of January. I'm back at work on the thirteenth,
so we've got a few weeks off and I'm just
looking forward to having a break. It has been a
long year for many John and I'm just looking forward
to having but a family time and rest and relaxation.
Speaker 2 (02:26):
Now, your baby, Noah, yes, is about the same age
that you were when your life changed quite profoundly.
Speaker 3 (02:35):
Yeah, it's often a conversation with my wife that brings
us to this point. But I was adopted at nine
months and my son is seven months, and we often compare,
you know, what was life for me at nine months
versus the privileges that Noah has at seven months old.
And so I was very lucky to be adopted into
a working class family, but a loving family. And having
(02:58):
gone down the road and actually found my real parents,
so I just realized how lucky I am. I've had
the upbringing. But Noah, my son is extremely fortunate to
have my wife and I and just the warmth of
a loving family. Yeah, and I'm cognizant and not everybody
has that in New Zealand and around the world.
Speaker 2 (03:18):
Right now. You've often said that the family that you
were adopted into was wonderful, loving and secure and gave
you lots of attention. It's right, And yet you've also
described yourself as troubled, naughty, the bottom of the class. Okay,
those things are often associated with kids that don't get
a grid start. Have you got any good reasons, any
(03:42):
understanding about why you were going down that route?
Speaker 3 (03:45):
Yeah, look, it just goes to show you that, you know,
delinquency can happen in any socio economic class. And for me,
it was as much my own fault as it was
the environment that I was in. So, you know, I
messed around with the wrong kids at high school and
you know, started smoking on the field, and just one
(04:06):
thing led to another, and so yeah, it wasn't really
heading down a good path. But you know, the family
I grew up in was a family of just loving
values and loving attention, and so I had all the
right conditions there, but I wasn't able to ultimately, you know,
take advantage of that because of my own mistakes in life.
Speaker 2 (04:28):
Actually, it's it's almost typical that kids that have been
adopted during they hit adolescence. I take it you were
aware that you were adopted as you're an adolescent. They
sometimes I don't know what it is, confusion seeking identity
or something that kicks over into troubled behavior. To think
that might have been.
Speaker 3 (04:47):
Part Yeah, look, you know, and you've got a certain
interest in education. I know, John and you know, the
research is well founded that people that come from adopted
families have have challenges with education. I probably exhibited a
bit of learning difficulties in there. So my wife likes
to think I'm probably you know, ADHD or something, so
maybe young diagnosed so things things like that. Probably some
(05:12):
learning difficulties there. But ultimately you've just got to take responsibility, John,
And I'm very fortunate to have studied the things I have.
Speaker 2 (05:19):
And well, you know, yeah, I mean your academic engine
did eventually get started, and it's been revving. I mean,
four degrees, including a master's from Harvard that's not to
be sneezed at. And then it's been the fuel of
your career. What do you think could have happened at
school earlier because you did drop out at fifteen. Yes,
(05:40):
you'd been suspended twice, and so I don't imagine there
was great howls of distress when you did walk out
the school gates. Yes, yeah, But is there anything the
school could have done earlier in your education career that
you think may have just turned your academic interests on earlier?
Speaker 3 (05:57):
I probably, having reflected on this, I could have gone
to a school that could pare academics with the real world.
More so, I often used to complain that mathematics was
far too theoretical. It ended up john that I loved mathematics,
and that's why I stated economics, but I didn't like
a lack of application to the real world and that's
(06:17):
why working. And I had the chance to work at
a local butcher shop that the Principle got me into
when I was fourteen that had an immediate application of
real world theory to real world life. And so I
think that what does our education need to be in
the future. It needs to make sure that we're making
(06:39):
that leap between theory and application so that kids see
the reasoning and why things are the way they are.
Speaker 2 (06:46):
I'm glad you credit the Principle with something that was
significant in your education, and so he helped you get
into a trade that's right.
Speaker 3 (06:55):
Well, at the time, I think he probably just saw
me as heading down the wrong path, and he said
to the local butcher shop, I wanted you to take
this man on to teach them some things. And he's
been caught stealing at high school and see what you
can do with him. So the local butcher took me on.
He took him knife to my hand. You wouldn't get
away with us these days. But you know, he basically
(07:17):
said a nine certain terms, don't steal from me, or
you'll get it.
Speaker 2 (07:21):
But that was actually the kind of I would listen
to a man a sharp knife.
Speaker 3 (07:25):
That was the kind of discipline that I needed at fifteen,
to say, hey, pull up your socks, chap, you can
do more with your life, but play by the rules
and work out and you'll get ahead.
Speaker 2 (07:36):
And that's turned into an apprenticeship, that's right.
Speaker 3 (07:38):
Yeah, And you know I had a bit of an
excusion cancer in between them.
Speaker 2 (07:44):
I was going to say, you're only what two weeks
into your apprenticeship, that's right.
Speaker 3 (07:48):
And then got diagnosed with cancer. So I had to
leave my apprenticeship and go and have chemotherapy and that
took me out for six months and came back with,
you know, high energy, wanting to become a butcher. So
that's that's what got me started in the butchery trade.
Speaker 2 (08:07):
So, as well as probably nearly killing you, cancer in
some ways changed your life, John.
Speaker 3 (08:14):
It was the best thing that could have happened to me.
I was heading down a pretty rough path, a path
of probably eventual you know, corrections ending up in the
corrections facilities. I had been arrested for petty crime, but
it was the best thing because it made me realize, Hey,
(08:36):
life is short. You could finish your life in a
couple of years or now, or in forty years time,
so let's make it matter.
Speaker 2 (08:45):
I'd like to think that a teenager shouldn't have to
think about mortality and death, but you obviously did have
to because this was a This wasn't just a This
was a serious dose of cancer, wasn't it.
Speaker 3 (08:56):
It was It was a ung sarcoma. But you know,
it's I think you know a lot of people out
there can identify with this, right if you if you've
had a loved one that's had cancer or any other
kind of serious illness in life, it shocks your system
and there's something unique in that, you know. I think
Steve Jobs is famously quoted around you know you will
(09:17):
die someday, and make each day count. So I think
what I've tried to do with my life since cancer
is make every day count and make sure that I'm
living life to the fullest and giving back and making
a difference to those around me. And that's what I
try and do.
Speaker 2 (09:33):
You can actually remember in your illness making those sorts
of rearrangements to the food your.
Speaker 3 (09:39):
Brain absolutely, and that's what got me thinking, well, I'd
like to go into business, get through my apprenticeship, maybe
owner run a supermarket, and see where I get to.
So that was kind of the path I charted for me.
And so you know, I did my apprenticeship in two
years and then started making my way in the management
realm in at the time it was wool worse and
(10:02):
now it's back to wool worst because the company's changed.
But then realize, hey, look I should probably go and
study because I lacked some skills in the business field
there to actually succeed.
Speaker 2 (10:17):
Sorry to wallow in just one, one little chapter of
your life, but I know that you had a Catholic
upbringing you into Catholic school before you got to high
school and things, and so you're faced with something as
you know, as a young person with cancer, the idea
that you could die was on the table. Walk me
(10:38):
through what you would have been thinking about that. Did
faith matter to you? Then?
Speaker 3 (10:42):
If faith has always met it in some way, shape
or form, John, as you said, my family's Catholic I've
been a Catholic primary school, and my wife's family is Catholic.
And even our son is named in a biblical sense
Noah for Noah's role in Noah's Ark, And so your
(11:02):
faith has always met it And I'm never going to
be a Bible basher there, John, But for me, it's
about just living the values of Christianity. And to me
it's about you know, service, service above self, others above self, uh,
you know, making a difference, making an impact. And so
(11:26):
I think those sort of values from our faith have
always had a role to play in thinking about, you know,
what I'm doing in life and is it making a difference.
Speaker 2 (11:38):
So you got the suprenticeship, you became, you got your
ticket as a butcher within a butchery within a supermarket.
That's right, supermarket that you.
Speaker 3 (11:49):
A double seven if if your listeners remember that and
new market.
Speaker 2 (11:53):
Right, but that was the same supermarket chain. You eventually
became part of the executive of.
Speaker 3 (11:59):
No So I yeah, yeah, so that that. I went
to university and I thought I'll be here for three years,
get a Bachelor of Commerce, and then go back to
the meat retailing industry or the souper market industry. The
time I spent at university was actually five years. I
(12:20):
then went into that.
Speaker 2 (12:21):
You came out with two degrees, yeah, two degrees and honors, yeah,
conjointing and honors.
Speaker 3 (12:26):
And then went into work for Deloitte, which is kind
of what any big aspiring commerce graduate would know. Is
just you want to get into banking and consulting. And
for me, banking had no appeal, so consulting was really
what I wanted to do. And that took me over
to the to the States, study public policy again for
(12:47):
my master's.
Speaker 2 (12:50):
Racing down this track, yes, yeah, to come back to you,
to get from butchery to academics. Yes, again, someone stepped in.
You had your principal gave your tap you towards the
trud yeah, and someone gave you a tap towards academics.
Speaker 1 (13:05):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (13:06):
That was an American guy who became my mentor for
my early stages. He was an executive at that time.
Speaker 2 (13:13):
Will worse. I wonder if you've spent time in America.
I wonder if Americans have got a different attitude when
it comes to entrepreneurial lighting the fire on these sorts
of things.
Speaker 3 (13:24):
I think New Zealanders have that, but America is next
level entrepreneurialism and next level excitement and go get him attitude.
And you know, I've spent a few years in the States,
as my wife has, and I think, you know, even
the Prime Minister has. And I think what's quite clear
is the you know, nobody owes you anything in life,
(13:47):
You've actually got to go out there and make a
thing of it yourself. And that it's that kind of
mindset I think that pervades most US states and individuals.
We have that in New Zealand. John, don't get me wrong,
but it's just it's a whole nother way of operating
in the States.
Speaker 2 (14:06):
And my guest tonight is MP for Northcote, our Dan Bidoir,
the honorable Dan Bidoir, And after the break we'll be
talking about his adventures overseas, some of the perspectives he
gained on New Zealand, about New Zealand while in Kazakhstan
and Malaysia and Ukraine in these other places. So stay
turned back with Dan Bidoir in just a.
Speaker 1 (14:27):
Bit intelligent interviews with interesting people. It's real life on
news Talk ZB.
Speaker 2 (14:34):
Welcome back to real life. I'm John Cown talking with
the honorable Dan Bidoir, whose lonely days ended earlier this year.
Oh no, look twenty twenty two.
Speaker 3 (14:44):
Was it twenty twenty twenty twenty two? Yes, nineteenth and
November that's right, Yes, Yeah, got married to the love
of my life and winning that song is my wedding song,
ed to James.
Speaker 2 (14:57):
Yeah, and that's very romantic. Was that your dance?
Speaker 3 (15:00):
It was our dance song? No, but we we really
consulted the song playlist heavily to work out one that
we both loved, and we both settle on this one.
And just you know, just an amazing woman that I
met and amazing mum, and so yeah, this song reminds
me of her and love I have.
Speaker 2 (15:21):
Yeah, Okay, you spent a lot of time overseas, probably
on your own, were you lonely?
Speaker 3 (15:28):
Yes?
Speaker 2 (15:29):
I was.
Speaker 3 (15:29):
So it's spent nothing about total of seven years all
up overseas and mostly in North America, Europe and Southeast Asia. Look,
I think you know, the world is a big place.
It's an amazing You could just continuously travel, right, you know,
you could just travel all your life and still not
(15:51):
reach every country, right, So it's an amazing experience.
Speaker 2 (15:56):
You've picked a fear few off that probably.
Speaker 3 (15:58):
Mid forties in terms of countries. But you know, it
sounds like a lot, but that's a lot. Well, it's
only you know, it's how many countries in the world
depending on how you take the UN definition or not.
But there's still a huge amount of countries that I
haven't been to. But you know, real great privilege to
live overseas, but it's given me an opportunity to look
(16:20):
at what are the strengths and opportunities for New Zealand.
Speaker 2 (16:24):
So when you say so when you're in somewhere like Kazakhstan, yes, well,
what are you doing in Kazakhstan? Yeah?
Speaker 3 (16:30):
Well I asked myself that question many times, but I
was working as an economist of the OECD and it
was focused on emerging market so countries that have the
potential to become developed and want the prestige and status
of being called an Oe city country, but not I'm
not quite there, So I need advice and guidance on
what are the kind of policies they need to put
(16:51):
in place.
Speaker 2 (16:51):
Okay, when you're looking at the at their standards and
things that are not perhaps at OECDS level, what are
you thinking about New Zealand when you're sitting in a
place like that.
Speaker 3 (17:01):
Look, I think gives me a great privilege of having
grown up and lived and you know, being raised in
New Zealand. We've got a lot of strengths. We're a
democratic country. There's actually very few in the in the
world at the moment where we have a liberal Western
democracy in the institutions that that comes with. Again, not
(17:22):
many countries have that. We have people that I think
are recently entrepreneurial and you know, fear minded. You know,
everybody wants a fear go much like Australians, right, So
I think there's on these legion there's a lot of
great strengths, a beautiful country, fantastic food. The list goes
(17:43):
on the missed opportunities. In my view, John is around
the economy and the incomes that we provide for those
that live and work in New Zealand. And having lived
o across the world, you know, there are a lot
of wealthier countries and ours, and I just think that
there's a huge amount of opportunity for us to grow
(18:06):
our economic grow incomes and grow the standard of living
that results from that higher incomes.
Speaker 2 (18:13):
Now, your first foray into politics was while you're still
at university.
Speaker 3 (18:19):
It was John and to be honest, it wasn't party politics.
It wasn't party politics, but it was student politics, and
that was probably where I thought my foreign into politics
would end. If I'm honest, I didn't have the greatest
experience of politicians in student politics. So why am I
here nearly twenty years later. Well, ultimately it's about making
(18:43):
a difference.
Speaker 2 (18:44):
So saying that being student president wasn't wasn't much fun.
Going digging back through the files, I see you quoted
on all sorts of things, interestingly, often in support of
Labor Party politics. We won't mention that too much, but
that you didn't enjoy the politics back then.
Speaker 3 (19:03):
Summer it was a fun year. I had a lot
of fun, a lot of people, and it is a
contributing factor to the successes that I've had since then professionally.
So you know, on a whole, I think that was
a great experience. But when I mentioned the fore anti politics,
I mean at the time it was the Labor government
and I just saw a huge amount of waste in
(19:24):
poor policy. Thinking the year that I was President of
the year about the interest rey student loan skin came
in and my economics had was going off in terms
of the impact that that would have on the fiscal account.
So look, I just think I wasn't that inspired by
the politicians that i'd met.
Speaker 2 (19:46):
So how have you ended up getting tipped for standing
for the by election in Northcote.
Speaker 3 (19:50):
Well, look, ultimately, john I spent some time overseas and
I thought, hey, I want to make a difference to
New Ziala. How do you make that difference in a
shorter space of time. There are a lot of ways
to make a difference to this country, but for me,
it was entering public life and ultimately about meanting better
policies to get us to a greater position.
Speaker 2 (20:11):
You're going to be a party. Yeah, well we can
thank your grandmother for that. I can. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (20:16):
You know, well my grandmother she had she was from
a very poor family, part marty, on a widow's pension
for most of her life, but she always believed in
a hand up, not a handout. And you know, if
she were here today, I think she'd be proud of
my affiliation to the National Party because of the values
of the National Party and the way they aren't to hers.
(20:37):
But ultimately, Johnna, you know I came back. I wanted
to make a difference. National's values aligned with my values,
and that's what brought me to the National Party. And
I failed first first attempt. I went from my seat
where I was initially My good colleague Simeon Brown won
(20:58):
that and he's doing a great job as a minister.
But then won the selection to contest the Northcote by election,
and you got North Cote. As you know, it's a reasonably.
Speaker 2 (21:10):
Bell weather seat.
Speaker 3 (21:11):
So I lost that seat and came back three years later.
Speaker 2 (21:14):
I mean it's interesting you could say, oh, look at him,
he's on a rocket sled heading upwards. But natural fact,
and I mean, you've got enough wins in various areas
of your life for this not to sound rude, but
you've actually had a fair amount of failures too, haven't you.
I mean it was you took a couple of tries
to become student president. It took you got into parliament,
(21:34):
you got knocked out of parliament, and even the full
Bright scholarship you got exactly you didn't get that first off. Yes,
this translates into something in you.
Speaker 3 (21:43):
Yeah, well, I think hopefully that took her to my
character and I've always believed that actually the character is
most shown. One's characters most shining when you fail. When
you succeed, it's very easy to speak from the throne
of success, but when you fail, actually it's about how
do you turn things around? And so you know, for me,
(22:06):
it's about taking your failures, learning as much as you
can from them, and coming out of them a better
a person, a better leader, and a better more you know,
confident being from that. So that's what I've tried to do.
Speaker 2 (22:24):
And spend the three years that you were out of parliament, well,
I spent a few of those time sulking why did
I lease a seat?
Speaker 3 (22:32):
John?
Speaker 2 (22:33):
But waiting for your character to kick it?
Speaker 3 (22:37):
Easier said than done, John, But look, no, inos honesty.
I went back to the commercial world and did a
bit of work in the financial sector, which was actually great.
But I did some got married, as you.
Speaker 2 (22:50):
Know, well that's a good profitable because I imagine there's
a parliamentary and you probably didn't have a lot of
dating time. So that, yeah, you go, that reversal stood,
and that did you in good stead?
Speaker 3 (23:06):
Yeah, And then I you know, I found my real
parents as well, and so I went on a journey
to as I'm being adopted. I've found my real parents
and that took me about a year from from the
start to actually having a phone call with my mother
and then finding my father as well.
Speaker 2 (23:20):
So has that signed off? Something? Isn't you look yet? Has?
Speaker 1 (23:24):
It?
Speaker 3 (23:25):
Wasn't a pretty ending, but I think it's to me.
It's given me a greater sense of who I am,
the background of my DNA and even the little things
why I do little things here and there. But it's
also connected with me with parliamentarians across the house saedde John.
So I'm actually related to Pennahernad. We we're from the
(23:46):
same eye up in and also Agent Rula for their
former Speaker of the House. So I've got some illustrious connections.
Unfortunately just not in the National Party right.
Speaker 2 (23:59):
I'm afraid we have to call it quits at that.
My guest tonight, Dan Bidoir, if you'd like to carry
on the conversation with about politics and things, Roxburgh is
with you up till midnight tonight and you could call
in and talk about these things. But Dan, thank you
so much. We're going out on another song You've picked
Michael Bouble singing Home.
Speaker 3 (24:18):
Thanks John, and Merry Christmas to you and to all
your listeners out there.
Speaker 2 (24:22):
Thank you.
Speaker 1 (24:23):
For more from News Talk sed B. Listen live on
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