March 4, 2025 • 8 mins
The PM ponders Trump, tariffs, a four-year parliamentary term, raising the age of eligibility for National Super to 67, and we salute "Sandwich-gate".
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Wednesdays on the Country, the PM kicks off the show.
I was going to kick off with sandwich Kate. I'm
coming back to that one because there are bigger fish
to fry Prime Minister around the world. Gee, it's getting
messy with Trump and his tariffs in Ukraine, you name it.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
Well, Look, I mean I saw the announcement yesterday or
preach from President Trump around agricultural tariffs. But you know,
the question for us, we need to see the detail.
Is it specific? Is it universal to all countries. We
actually have quite a balanced trade arrangement or relation a
management between both US and New Zealand. But look, we
(00:37):
instructed our officials several weeks ago to engage with the
administration on agricultural tariffs. And of course you know I'm
an engaged I would gage directly with President Trump if
we see any of our agricultural traders at RESK. But look,
we need to see the detail first. You know, often
there's a pronouncement on social media and it's important we
actually see the detail and actually what does get implemented.
Speaker 1 (00:58):
Finally, okay, hypothetic he chucks the terrify on I don't
know ten percent. On April the second, do we put
a reciprocal terror on us stuff.
Speaker 2 (01:07):
Yeah, look, I'm not going to speculate on that because
I genuinely you know, you know, I spend every day
instead of giving a running commentary on pronouncements from the
new government. You know, the reality is I need to
make sure that actually see the detail and then we
actually respond properly with that, because as I said, you know,
we actually have a very balanced trade relationship, particularly agriculture
(01:29):
and actually a lot of agricultural products. Remember we have
you know, even if take beef, you know, it actually
helps their market because we have a different quality of
beef product and they've got to hang a lot of
hamburgers that's held on Americans, and you know, this terrifying
ends up hurting them ultimately. And so let's just see
exactly what gets implemented. As I said, our officials, we
(01:50):
instructed them probably four or five weeks ago, engage with
the government and over there on this particular issue, and
let's just see where it all gets to. Having said
all that, we're ready to respond with an intervention from
myself to make the case for why we would not
feel it would be fair. The other thing, I'd just
say is in a universal setting obviously gets applied to everybody.
(02:11):
It's about our relative competitiveness and what is a very
very large market, and so you know how it's applied,
whether it's specific to certain countries, whether it's universally applied
across all countries. That kind of matters to sort of
see how it shakes down.
Speaker 1 (02:25):
Are you an unlucky prime minister? Every time you seem
to come up with a good news story or a
good news news trade deal, you get swamped by other
bad news.
Speaker 2 (02:34):
What do you mean?
Speaker 1 (02:37):
I'm talking about your trip to Vietnam that was highly successful?
Speaker 2 (02:40):
Was it not? Was it was great? It was really
really good. I mean we you know, just for your listeners.
You know, Vietnam is like the fourteenth largest trading partner.
It's the fastest growing economy in our region. It's been
growing at five to six per seed every year for
twenty five years. It's about to start growing at seven
to nine percent. It will genuinely become sort of a
Singapore Taiwan, you know, South Korea type economy. And they're
(03:02):
moving from low income to middleland come and often with
a high income. But man, they love New Zealand products
and so this trip was actually quite interesting because it
was a big focus on education. In fact, that's a
really big focus for Vietnam. They do an incredible job
on educating their own people. They've got a university that
started in ten seventy six, so they're just really it's
embedded in their culture about educate, educate, educate. But it
(03:24):
was a big showcase on our traditional food and beverage
and you know number one and dairy, but I think
you know we're number two, just behind the Americans on apples,
for example. There's still huge opportunity in red meat there.
So it was a real traditional you know, let's make
sure they understand the quality of our food and produce
and as they get from low income to middle income,
(03:45):
they want better quality food. And so I did everything, Jamie,
I did everything I could to sell on New Zealand
products and services from our great farmers, shamelessly war hats,
I ate snails. I did whatever it took to try
and make sure we could sell something. And we had
a really good business delegation representing other sector as well.
So it was really awesome. It was a really great group.
Speaker 1 (04:07):
Okay, Sandwich Gate not a mile away, but just before
we do a four year term for parliament National super
at sixty seven, two quick fixes for the New Zealand economy.
Do you agree?
Speaker 2 (04:18):
Yeah, Look, I mean the benefit of you personally. Look,
I'm in favor of a four year term. We've got
a bill that actually is an act which is going
to get a chance to go before the Select Committee.
There will also be a chance for all the parties
to sort of say is that the right approach or
is there a simpler approach and they can look at
all of that. But the other pieces. Yeah, and that's
(04:41):
ultately we will get to. But right now, the New
Zealand people want me focused every day on not four
year terms, but actually on fixing the economy and making
sure we deal with the cost of looking on National
super as you know, that's very much our policy. You know,
I think you know, people are aging well, quality of
life is going up, the living longer, race time in
age of sixty seven. Having said that, you've got New
(05:03):
Zealand First, who are diametrically opposed and also the Labor Party.
So those are things that we just have not been
able to agree in the coalition for sure.
Speaker 1 (05:12):
Well, hey Winston, Winston's agent quite well, do you have
to wait till well he pops off the perch?
Speaker 2 (05:18):
Do you will you make the case that about it?
Speaker 1 (05:21):
But I've tried to.
Speaker 2 (05:22):
I think it makes real sense. I mean, as we
said before the election, you know, it's ever our living
standard that has gone out. People are working longer, they
are actually healthier at the same age to say their
parents were or their grandparents were, And many other countries
frankly around the world have sixty seven. So I'm even
getting close to the seventy. So yeah, I mean I
(05:43):
think it makes sense, but that's not something that politically
has been agreed between different parties.
Speaker 1 (05:48):
Sandwich gate, make a marmite sandwich and put an apple
in the bag? Did you guys workshop? This is this
a result of a focus group? And I say that
because Nikola Willis said exactly the same thing this time
a week ago when she was filling in for you
on this show while you were doing God's work in Vietnam.
Speaker 2 (06:07):
No we all. I was like, no, no, no, we didn't.
But there's just that that's what I got for my lunch.
And we had a chat about what did you actual
here for lunches and stuff? And everyone had had sort
of slightly different ones, but I had, you know, I
was just I was. Every day it was a cheese
and mumu sandwich with an apple. Occasionally Mumboud makes baking
it which don as well on into a little lunch box.
(06:27):
And once a term I think I'd allowed to go
buy a pie and chocolate zapp and my custom square
and that was it. So I just my point's pretty simple,
which is, like, you know, I think parents should be
feeding their own kids. I'd rather the state didn't have
to do so it should be frankly apparential responsibility. But
lot the reality is, Jamie, we do have kids that
(06:48):
are coming to school with no lunch. I'm not willing
to go hungry because if the research shows if they're
not learning, if they're not learning them, they're not failing
in school. Umploughted my welfare and for the limits adoption.
So yep, some of the squall lunches aren't scratched. David
was across the issue. I've got every confidence, go go
get sorted. But you know, if you're if you're unhappy
(07:09):
with it, frankly, you know, ever since making my light
sandwich and duck and apple on the bag, Hey.
Speaker 1 (07:14):
Is this the dynamic, new hard hitting Crystopher Luxeen was saying,
is this the real Christopher Luxe? And standing up? Please?
Are no more dancing on a pin over Andrew Bailey,
you know you got a workshop and then you're going
to go hard at it.
Speaker 2 (07:27):
Well, look, but I just think this is I think
you know, that's what I believe. But I mean, just
say on the dry daily thing. Look, yep, answered the
question from Hosking better. But the point is also I
had an individual who had just resigned and given up
a mess, significant decision, a tough one, very emotional one,
and the last thing is someone piling on and that
was my you know the reason why my answer in
(07:50):
the way that I did. Yep, could have answered better,
should have answered it better. But look, yeah, the bottom
line is we've got a lot to focus on, and
we're a government that is just trying to drive every
single day to get things order to give them a
mess that women here did. So Yep, it's hard and
it's tough, and there's lots for us to do, but
that's what we're focused on.
Speaker 1 (08:07):
Is that focusing on or focusing grouping on anyhow, Look,
I'm being cheeky there, and I should recur.
Speaker 2 (08:12):
I know you want to make that point, but we
don't do that.
Speaker 1 (08:14):
You don't do focus groups.
Speaker 2 (08:16):
No, no, we got back on track because that just
came out of a conversation I have on my team,
So that's how stuff happens.
Speaker 1 (08:22):
Good on you, look, I really appreciate your time on
the country.
Speaker 2 (08:25):
Thank you, Goodness for you.
Speaker 1 (08:25):
Ma
Wednesdays on the Country, the PM kicks off the show.
I was going to kick off with sandwich Kate. I'm
coming back to that one because there are bigger fish
to fry Prime Minister around the world. Gee, it's getting
messy with Trump and his tariffs in Ukraine, you name it.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
Well, Look, I mean I saw the announcement yesterday or
preach from President Trump around agricultural tariffs. But you know,
the question for us, we need to see the detail.
Is it specific? Is it universal to all countries. We
actually have quite a balanced trade arrangement or relation a
management between both US and New Zealand. But look, we
(00:37):
instructed our officials several weeks ago to engage with the
administration on agricultural tariffs. And of course you know I'm
an engaged I would gage directly with President Trump if
we see any of our agricultural traders at RESK. But look,
we need to see the detail first. You know, often
there's a pronouncement on social media and it's important we
actually see the detail and actually what does get implemented.
Speaker 1 (00:58):
Finally, okay, hypothetic he chucks the terrify on I don't
know ten percent. On April the second, do we put
a reciprocal terror on us stuff.
Speaker 2 (01:07):
Yeah, look, I'm not going to speculate on that because
I genuinely you know, you know, I spend every day
instead of giving a running commentary on pronouncements from the
new government. You know, the reality is I need to
make sure that actually see the detail and then we
actually respond properly with that, because as I said, you know,
we actually have a very balanced trade relationship, particularly agriculture
(01:29):
and actually a lot of agricultural products. Remember we have
you know, even if take beef, you know, it actually
helps their market because we have a different quality of
beef product and they've got to hang a lot of
hamburgers that's held on Americans, and you know, this terrifying
ends up hurting them ultimately. And so let's just see
exactly what gets implemented. As I said, our officials, we
(01:50):
instructed them probably four or five weeks ago, engage with
the government and over there on this particular issue, and
let's just see where it all gets to. Having said
all that, we're ready to respond with an intervention from
myself to make the case for why we would not
feel it would be fair. The other thing, I'd just
say is in a universal setting obviously gets applied to everybody.
(02:11):
It's about our relative competitiveness and what is a very
very large market, and so you know how it's applied,
whether it's specific to certain countries, whether it's universally applied
across all countries. That kind of matters to sort of
see how it shakes down.
Speaker 1 (02:25):
Are you an unlucky prime minister? Every time you seem
to come up with a good news story or a
good news news trade deal, you get swamped by other
bad news.
Speaker 2 (02:34):
What do you mean?
Speaker 1 (02:37):
I'm talking about your trip to Vietnam that was highly successful?
Speaker 2 (02:40):
Was it not? Was it was great? It was really
really good. I mean we you know, just for your listeners.
You know, Vietnam is like the fourteenth largest trading partner.
It's the fastest growing economy in our region. It's been
growing at five to six per seed every year for
twenty five years. It's about to start growing at seven
to nine percent. It will genuinely become sort of a
Singapore Taiwan, you know, South Korea type economy. And they're
(03:02):
moving from low income to middleland come and often with
a high income. But man, they love New Zealand products
and so this trip was actually quite interesting because it
was a big focus on education. In fact, that's a
really big focus for Vietnam. They do an incredible job
on educating their own people. They've got a university that
started in ten seventy six, so they're just really it's
embedded in their culture about educate, educate, educate. But it
(03:24):
was a big showcase on our traditional food and beverage
and you know number one and dairy, but I think
you know we're number two, just behind the Americans on apples,
for example. There's still huge opportunity in red meat there.
So it was a real traditional you know, let's make
sure they understand the quality of our food and produce
and as they get from low income to middle income,
(03:45):
they want better quality food. And so I did everything, Jamie,
I did everything I could to sell on New Zealand
products and services from our great farmers, shamelessly war hats,
I ate snails. I did whatever it took to try
and make sure we could sell something. And we had
a really good business delegation representing other sector as well.
So it was really awesome. It was a really great group.
Speaker 1 (04:07):
Okay, Sandwich Gate not a mile away, but just before
we do a four year term for parliament National super
at sixty seven, two quick fixes for the New Zealand economy.
Do you agree?
Speaker 2 (04:18):
Yeah, Look, I mean the benefit of you personally. Look,
I'm in favor of a four year term. We've got
a bill that actually is an act which is going
to get a chance to go before the Select Committee.
There will also be a chance for all the parties
to sort of say is that the right approach or
is there a simpler approach and they can look at
all of that. But the other pieces. Yeah, and that's
(04:41):
ultately we will get to. But right now, the New
Zealand people want me focused every day on not four
year terms, but actually on fixing the economy and making
sure we deal with the cost of looking on National
super as you know, that's very much our policy. You know,
I think you know, people are aging well, quality of
life is going up, the living longer, race time in
age of sixty seven. Having said that, you've got New
(05:03):
Zealand First, who are diametrically opposed and also the Labor Party.
So those are things that we just have not been
able to agree in the coalition for sure.
Speaker 1 (05:12):
Well, hey Winston, Winston's agent quite well, do you have
to wait till well he pops off the perch?
Speaker 2 (05:18):
Do you will you make the case that about it?
Speaker 1 (05:21):
But I've tried to.
Speaker 2 (05:22):
I think it makes real sense. I mean, as we
said before the election, you know, it's ever our living
standard that has gone out. People are working longer, they
are actually healthier at the same age to say their
parents were or their grandparents were, And many other countries
frankly around the world have sixty seven. So I'm even
getting close to the seventy. So yeah, I mean I
(05:43):
think it makes sense, but that's not something that politically
has been agreed between different parties.
Speaker 1 (05:48):
Sandwich gate, make a marmite sandwich and put an apple
in the bag? Did you guys workshop? This is this
a result of a focus group? And I say that
because Nikola Willis said exactly the same thing this time
a week ago when she was filling in for you
on this show while you were doing God's work in Vietnam.
Speaker 2 (06:07):
No we all. I was like, no, no, no, we didn't.
But there's just that that's what I got for my lunch.
And we had a chat about what did you actual
here for lunches and stuff? And everyone had had sort
of slightly different ones, but I had, you know, I
was just I was. Every day it was a cheese
and mumu sandwich with an apple. Occasionally Mumboud makes baking
it which don as well on into a little lunch box.
(06:27):
And once a term I think I'd allowed to go
buy a pie and chocolate zapp and my custom square
and that was it. So I just my point's pretty simple,
which is, like, you know, I think parents should be
feeding their own kids. I'd rather the state didn't have
to do so it should be frankly apparential responsibility. But
lot the reality is, Jamie, we do have kids that
(06:48):
are coming to school with no lunch. I'm not willing
to go hungry because if the research shows if they're
not learning, if they're not learning them, they're not failing
in school. Umploughted my welfare and for the limits adoption.
So yep, some of the squall lunches aren't scratched. David
was across the issue. I've got every confidence, go go
get sorted. But you know, if you're if you're unhappy
(07:09):
with it, frankly, you know, ever since making my light
sandwich and duck and apple on the bag, Hey.
Speaker 1 (07:14):
Is this the dynamic, new hard hitting Crystopher Luxeen was saying,
is this the real Christopher Luxe? And standing up? Please?
Are no more dancing on a pin over Andrew Bailey,
you know you got a workshop and then you're going
to go hard at it.
Speaker 2 (07:27):
Well, look, but I just think this is I think
you know, that's what I believe. But I mean, just
say on the dry daily thing. Look, yep, answered the
question from Hosking better. But the point is also I
had an individual who had just resigned and given up
a mess, significant decision, a tough one, very emotional one,
and the last thing is someone piling on and that
was my you know the reason why my answer in
(07:50):
the way that I did. Yep, could have answered better,
should have answered it better. But look, yeah, the bottom
line is we've got a lot to focus on, and
we're a government that is just trying to drive every
single day to get things order to give them a
mess that women here did. So Yep, it's hard and
it's tough, and there's lots for us to do, but
that's what we're focused on.
Speaker 1 (08:07):
Is that focusing on or focusing grouping on anyhow, Look,
I'm being cheeky there, and I should recur.
Speaker 2 (08:12):
I know you want to make that point, but we
don't do that.
Speaker 1 (08:14):
You don't do focus groups.
Speaker 2 (08:16):
No, no, we got back on track because that just
came out of a conversation I have on my team,
So that's how stuff happens.
Speaker 1 (08:22):
Good on you, look, I really appreciate your time on
the country.
Speaker 2 (08:25):
Thank you, Goodness for you.
Speaker 1 (08:25):
Ma
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