August 15, 2023 • 46 mins
Robert sits down with Gare and James to talk about Bronze Age Pervert and a surprisingly influential new family of far right memes.
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Speaker 1 (00:09):
It could happen here a podcast about frustrating people and
frustrating times. That's not all it's about. Sometimes we talk
about nice things like like raising sheep or unionization efforts,
you know, the endless struggle of working people to better
the world. But not today. Today we're having a real,
(00:30):
real piece of ship episode about a real piece of ship,
and it's gonna make everybody unhappy. Hello Garrison, Hello James.
How are you both doing today?
Speaker 2 (00:38):
So much better for hearing that, Robert, Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, I.
Speaker 3 (00:42):
Just ready to have a fine evening here, ye about
something that's probably very fun.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
Yeah, going to be good. You don't have you don't
have your soda stream? Disappointed in you?
Speaker 1 (00:54):
James and I are now so toa stream pilled.
Speaker 3 (00:56):
Not I've not gotten the company so to stream yet
that has must generation.
Speaker 1 (01:02):
Yeah, the unfortunately the company beverage is is Billy Beer.
Uh Billy Carter Jimmy Carter's Brothers beer that was on
sale for roughly a year in the nineteen seventies.
Speaker 2 (01:15):
Is it made of peanuts? If only?
Speaker 4 (01:18):
No?
Speaker 1 (01:18):
So today let's start. I got a question for you.
Have either of you seen the Barbie movie?
Speaker 2 (01:24):
Yes?
Speaker 5 (01:25):
I have.
Speaker 1 (01:26):
I was it well done, Gear.
Speaker 2 (01:28):
Oh I didn't go buddy sold gear.
Speaker 3 (01:31):
The said dress thing was was nice.
Speaker 5 (01:34):
It was.
Speaker 6 (01:34):
It was a great lesson in like liberal recuperation. I'm sure,
I'm sure.
Speaker 3 (01:38):
I'm sure it'll be great for like kids who like
don't know who like don't know what feminism is.
Speaker 6 (01:44):
But but yeah.
Speaker 1 (01:45):
Yeah, it seems I have not watched it either. It
doesn't seem like my kind of movie. But it seems
broadly act correct me if I'm wrong here, that it
has what you might call like very very modest and
fairly mainstream approachable feminist message. Yeah, yeah, that seems like
it's fair, which most people would not be particularly angry about.
(02:07):
But a sizable chunk of the very online right, the
chunk of the right, particularly that makes their living by
having takes on shit has has has been up in
arms ever since it came out, and particularly ever since
it made more than a billion dollars in the box office.
I'm sure a lot of people are aware that our
old friend Ben Shapiro filmed a forty two minute video
(02:28):
tearing it apart and his signature preteen stolen Valor voice boy.
Speaker 3 (02:41):
After I watched the movie, me and some friends tried
to watch the Ben Shapiro video for fun. We made
it like six minutes in, and that everyone forced me
to stop.
Speaker 1 (02:50):
Intolerable shit. Cowards. Cowards are cowards. But that's yeah. So
elsewhere in the right and kind of the less mainstream
acceptable chunks of what we'd call the insurgent right around here,
various thought leaders attempted to declare the movie stealth conservative
propaganda as a way of insisting that its success was
really due to it being anti woke. That's silly too.
(03:12):
None of this is worth discussing in detail. I promise
you all, this is not going to be a podcast
about the fucking Barbie movie. None of this is worth
discussing in detail, save to say that Shapiro's anger at
the movie, and particularly its comic relief character Kin, seems
to have been the more wide spread response from those
kinds of people. Now, because I have made, over the
years a lot of poor decisions in my browsing and
(03:34):
engaging habits. Over the years, Twitter sends me a lot
of weirdo right wing responses to everything that happens in
the world, including this movie and one of these posts
that I caught somewhere in late July or on the
twenty second, twenty third caught my eye. Now this post
features a vapor wave filtered kin photoshopped in front of
a burning Viking long house, accompanied by the text exit
(03:58):
the long house. Now, when you see something like this
and you don't know what they're getting at, like, you
have two choices. If you're like, you get like, I
don't know, kids, a really demanding job, anything at all
going on in your personal life, you scroll right past it.
If you're me, you spend like four and a half
hours reading various fascist essays about feminism to try to
(04:23):
figure out what the fuck a longhouse has to do
with the Barbie movie. Now, the guy who had made
this post is a low level fascist political columnist named Lomez.
He is, he's kind of on me. He's a little
bit of volapild. He's he doesn't he's not like a
very major figure. He's kind of several steps below anyone
(04:45):
you've heard of. I would say, like two or three
steps standard deviations of fame below like Jack Pisobiec. But
his writing has a degree of purchase among the kinds
of conservatives who trick Ron DeSantis into running in comprehensible
campaign ads with son rads in them he has. He's like,
he's got a little bit of influence among that kind
of crew, and he's sort of in the conversation with
(05:06):
a lot of those people. I took notice of his
post because I'd seen the term long house being used
by a couple of these guys off and on, and
because Lomes's post got like three thousand something likes, which
meant that, yeah, there's some community out there that gets
what he's talking about. So on a whim, I clicked
to view the quote tweets for this post, and I
(05:27):
found a post by a user named Siege, which is
of course a reference to a book about carrying out
acts of terrorism in order to bring about a white
Ethno state. The post says, Kin is you. He is
an exaggerated Western man in the twenty first century, anxious, confused,
chasing women who don't care about him. He exits the
long House and discovers his own will to power. Like you,
(05:50):
he decides to bring this knowledge back to his fellow man,
and it's you know, I'm gonna I'll show you guys
this this post here. It's pretty pretty Nazi. Yeah, pretty
pretty Nazi.
Speaker 2 (06:02):
It's not the best work on Ken, like he guys
looks like a blob.
Speaker 1 (06:05):
No, I will say I have a little bit of
respect for the craft here that he didn't just go
to an ai that looks like somebody like crudely cut
a picture of kin that they have like uh uh,
color inverted and then photoshopped it into a picture of
a long house with a fire behind it.
Speaker 2 (06:24):
It's too.
Speaker 6 (06:27):
I will say. Uh.
Speaker 3 (06:29):
Sieg's description of Ken from the from the from the
Barbie movie is pretty accurate to what's in the film.
Speaker 1 (06:35):
M that's good. So what is the long house? What
the fuck does a long house have to do with
what are otherwise pretty standard neo Nazi esque messaging about,
you know, the decadence and failure of modern man and
all that kind of shit. And is this dumb fascist
memes something that you need to care about now? Unfortunately
(06:57):
the answer to that is yes, because all of this
ties back to one extremely influential, insurgent right wing ideologue
whose followers have been close to the presidency once before
and may yet find themselves there again. That asshole is
an mi I T graduate named Kostin Alamaru who posts
online under variations of the name Bronze Age Pervert. You guys,
(07:20):
how aware are you of Bronze Age Pervert or BAP
as he's often known.
Speaker 2 (07:27):
I've heard of BAP, but maybe only in passing because
I wasn't familiar with Bronze age pervert. Thank you, yeah,
thank you for sharing with me today.
Speaker 1 (07:36):
Robert, Oh, oh, You're going to be so much less happy, Garrison,
are you familiar with this fella?
Speaker 3 (07:41):
I think I may have only seen stuff from him
in passing. I'm not I'm not overly familiar.
Speaker 5 (07:46):
Now.
Speaker 1 (07:47):
Yeah, that was kind of my experience until like a
month or so ago when I started really digging into
the guy. And I don't feel better as a result
of having done that. But uh, yeah, we know that
this guy's actual name is Kostin Alamariu because of a
very recent Atlantic articles, like a month ago, that this
guy got revealed in this article because this writer for
(08:08):
The Atlantic was a friend of his, like at mit,
like it was just somebody who like and recognized his
voice on a podcast. Now, this article, I find it
frustrating for a number of reasons. I don't think it's
great analysis of BAP's work or what people find appealing
in it or a particularly honest, intellectual look at what
(08:28):
this guy has to say. But it does have some
interesting reveals, including the fact that Bronze Age Pervert's first
public media appearance was a parody audio tour for an
exhibition at the Boston Museum of Fine Arts, written by
bj Novak, who played Ryan in the Office. Yeah, so
that's that's odd, and it's one of those BJ Novak
(08:52):
is not a stealth Nazi, don't worry. But the video
or the thing that they put together does kind of
fit it for like a fascist art project. And I'm
going to read how The Atlantic describes this audio tour
they put together together, or put that they assembled together.
Novak had recruited a Romanian classmate with a deep voice,
(09:13):
and together they'd recorded an audio tour for the exhibition
Tales from the Land of Dragons a Thousand Years of
Chinese Painting, with the help of friends. They then slipped
cassettes containing their tour into the museum's official audio guides.
Art lovers must have wondered about the thick Eastern European
accent that greeted them over the twang of a Chinese
string instrument. The Romanians soon became opinionated. Personally, he said,
(09:33):
I think this painting is a piece of crap. Then deranged,
he alluded to his disgusting anatomical abnormalities. He called his
listeners decadent imperialist maggots, and confessed a desire to smash
a glass case with a sledgehammer and rip a scroll
to shreds with my teeth, which, by the way, are
extremely long and sharp, more like fangs than human teeth.
At last, he offered an interlude of idiot music while
(09:55):
he fumbled with his script. This should keep you occupied,
you drooling, imbecile, he bellowed at the listeners, by now
either amused or complaining to management. So there's like there's
like little little whiffs of degenerate art stuff in there,
but it's also just kind of like they like a
little bit like Max head roomy kind of stuff, like
(10:16):
where you're kind of tricking people into into into consuming
this like parody artwork thing. Like again, I think this
was a pretty innocent joke on Novak's fall part. But
Costin number one probably got picked for this because he's
a he's he's got a thick Romanian accent that he
very much plays up. He was noted in this time
as kind of talking like Dracula deliberately. He also would
(10:39):
always wear these like long and elaborate black coats, so
that he kind of looked like a Dracula type figure,
like he was, you know, he was he was doing
a bit. He was putting on like a That was
the image he wanted to He wanted to portray himself
as to people as kind of like mysterious and Eastern
European sort of sort of figure.
Speaker 2 (10:59):
Now.
Speaker 1 (10:59):
Costin first started posting as bronze age pervert on a
series of obscure web forums in twenty ten. In the
November of twenty thirteen, he joined Twitter and immediately fell
in with a loose community that some people call frog Twitter.
And these are you know who these guys are. It's
like a general term for anonymous alt right adjacent posters
with like pepe avatars. Yeah, and the other group the
(11:22):
kind of related people that he fell in with and
that he started to have traction with our adherents to
a fascist philosopher known as Curtis Jarvin or Minsius Moldbug.
Curtis is his real name. Minsius Moldbug is the pseudonym.
He wrote under now I know it's a it's these.
Speaker 2 (11:40):
People this shit, man, it's just so pathetic, like play
Dungeons and Dragons.
Speaker 1 (11:47):
Just a solid twenty percent of our fascist problems are
like people didn't get a reliable D and D group
early enough, like a lot of these I think Balder's
Gate three is gonna save us from a lot of
these guys in the future.
Speaker 2 (12:01):
The Antifa computer game. Yeah.
Speaker 5 (12:04):
So.
Speaker 1 (12:05):
Curtis Yarvin aka Mensius is a UC Berkeley graduate in
computer science who joined the tech industry and got pilled
on a strain of anti democratic libertarian theory.
Speaker 2 (12:17):
This is this is like a this is a pathway, man, Yeah,
this is perfect well.
Speaker 1 (12:21):
Bronze age pervert also goes into tech after graduating from
m i T. Right, and like, you know, a decent
number of these guys come out of like Stanford and shit,
like it's all, uh, it's all these guys who are,
in fact, to some extent, like intellectual elites, bronze age perverts.
Dad is a teacher at mi T, like just kind
of like you look at like Stephen Miller's background, Right,
(12:42):
A lot of these guys come out of like liberal
academia families. But anyway, it's very common. Yeah. Curtis comes
out of uh yeah, gets into the tech industry and
he writes a book kind of while he's he's working
and like he's a he's a founder and stuff for
some company. He writes a book in two thousand and
one titled Democracy, The God That Failed, follows it up
(13:06):
with a series of blog essays, and his writing becomes
very influential amongst Silicon Valley proto fascists. Jarvin's ideas in
brief is that the US is run and a lot
of Western society is really run by what he calls
the Cathedral, which is a mix of professors and journalists
who act as a Brahmin class dominating the United States
(13:26):
with a progressive state religion. He sees their egalitarian impulses
as toxic the destruction of natural civic order, and advocates
for his followers to design new architectures of exit to
replace the Cathedral with what is effectively a right wing dictatorship.
The number one supporter of Curtis Yarvin's ideas and financial
(13:47):
backer of him is Peter Teel Teal has a funded
Jarvin's work as a big fan of what he has
to say and his philosophy, which is generally referred to
as the Dark Enlightenment. And this is when we're talking
about dark Enlightenment, we're talking like mid aughts is kind
of when this stuff starts to really take off. This
is before the alt right that kind of becomes really
(14:09):
well known nationwide. Is A is A is a major term.
This is like in the pre and right around gamer
Gate period is when he's really starting to take off
with a lot of folks. And he certainly he feeds
into the alt right to Trump, you know, and to
that period of time, but he's much more on the
the pseudo intellectual end of things as opposed to the
(14:30):
like hitting folks in the street end of things. That's
what he gets a lot of Peter Teel money. So
uh yeah, Bronze Age Pervert is kind of a he
He espouses a philosophy that rhymes with with moldbugs with
Yarvin's philosophy in many ways, but where Yarvin dresses his
words and is writing up in a costume version of
(14:52):
mainstream academic discourse, Bronze Age Pervert is unapot apologetically online
and weird and he writes, like somebody who spends too
much fucking time on the Internet. A lot of his
stuff is cloaked in things that are like half jokes,
or at least want to be have plausible deniability of jokes,
so that like, if you take them seriously, he can
make fun of you for falling for the bit. But
(15:14):
he describes himself on Twitter as an aspiring nudist, bodybuilder,
free speech and anti zeno estrogen activist, So just just
the most irritating.
Speaker 2 (15:24):
Kind of guy, the normal guy.
Speaker 1 (15:28):
Much of his politics centers around a worship of ancient Greece,
which he believes settled on these scientifically ideal human form.
He believes men should engage in bodybuilding and nude sunbathing
to emulate the Greeks, And you'll see sometimes his followers
be like, oh, you're an idiot if you fell for that.
But legitimately half of what this guy posts about is
(15:49):
just pictures of bodybuilders, and his pictures of himself being
looking very jacked like he's he's it's it's that. If
that's all a bit, then all he has is this
silly bit, because it is it is dominant in his content.
BAP's ancient Greek or baps. Ancient Greeks are incredibly straight
and hate women with a passion. One of those things
(16:11):
is more or less right Greek, like upperclass Greeks, not
super pro women, yeah, not woke. The Cathedral, in his eyes,
is an oppressive dictatorship of femininity, if not always of
women over masculinity. Cancel culture is a particular topic of
his ire, and he seems to see it as basically
(16:34):
these that there are traditionally feminine methods of argumentation and conflict,
whether or not women are the ones doing them in
any given situation. Cancel culture is like the purest expression
of this, and he believes that these kind of feminine
methods of conflict destroy masculinity and make cultural progress impossible.
They chain men to this kind of like he sees,
(16:56):
you know how a lot of anarchists will talk about
how ancient society, these hunter gatherer societies, and like we're
often more egalitarian than a lot of like medieval societies,
classical societies, and this is often a lot of folks
do make the mistake of like idealizing these cultures. But
like that's a thing that gets talked about a lot
positively by by by some anarchists and I think obviously
(17:20):
worth studying. He takes the opposite tact of like these
ancient cultures like light, like people lived in the fucking
mud and were miserable, and it was because they were't
a galitarian. It was because the women were dominating the men. Right,
this is going to lead us to the long house
in short order, but we have somewhare to cover right here.
So he focuses a huge amount on anti egalitarian arguments
(17:44):
and on supporting a culture dominated by strong, beautiful, powerful
people who look like Greek statues and suppress women and
anyone else who doesn't look sexy. Basically, you get to
feel like that's a big part of it to this guy,
like he wants he wants a dictatorship of hot, violent men.
That's that's a big part of what he argues with.
(18:06):
Has he watched Lenny riefenstyles Olympia because this scene, Oh god, yeah,
I feel like that's playing in the back of his
fucking mind at all times.
Speaker 2 (18:15):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (18:15):
Now, Bapp argues that the state in its present form
preserves the lives of the weak and feeble minded, allowing
them to oppress the naked Aryan bodybuilders who by all
rights ought to run things. The prime repository of his
philosophy is his twenty eighteen book Bronze Age Mindset, which
was at one point in the top one hundred and
(18:36):
fifty books on Amazon. A former Trump White House official
Toad Politico in twenty nineteen, if you're a young person, intelligent,
adjacent in some way to the right, it's very likely
you would have heard of it. In chapter thirty five
of his book Bronze Age, the Bronze Age Mindset bap
rights quote, should the tyranny that has descended on our
(18:57):
age ever gain the power it seeks and then be
challenged enough to feel itself in danger? The mass annihilations
that will be carried out by homosexual, transsexual, and especially
lesbian commissars will exceed in scale and cruelty anything that
has yet happened in known history. Imagine lesbian Mulata commissars
with young Martin sheen face and haircut manning the future.
(19:18):
Bergen Belson's installations that will span tens of miles.
Speaker 2 (19:22):
Yep, sending you to the transgender goolag.
Speaker 1 (19:25):
Yeah, it's it's it's something else, and it's very funny
because like that fucking the Atlantic writer here like talks
about how he's he's got this like almost hypnotizing quality
to his writing, and he's he's got this really like, uh,
fascinating mind that you just want to engage with, and
it's I'll read you a fucking quote from this guy's
(19:49):
profile on Bronze Age pervert and try not to gag.
I consider myself a connoisseur of brilliant lunatics, and I
have a high tolerance for their lunacy if it has
compensating virtues of say humor or ingenuity. But even I
find back worrisome what starts as comedy can become something
more sinister and bap shtick. Well sometimes hilarious shows every
(20:12):
sign of transforming into a mode of new far right radicalism.
He goes on at a various point to be like, yeah,
he likes this book that I like. So I was
willing to put up with the fact that he was
he was bigoted for years because like we would talk
about literature together, you know, I just had so much
respect for his mind that I was willing to be
(20:33):
strung along for a long time. I don't I find
this guy kind.
Speaker 6 (20:36):
Of connoisseur yea a connoisseur of pig shit.
Speaker 1 (20:42):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (20:43):
I really love sifting through all the different types of
donkey dogs.
Speaker 1 (20:47):
Yeah, I just can't stick quite enough shit.
Speaker 2 (20:51):
Uh you know what make you become a connish there
of dog shit? Internet content?
Speaker 1 (21:00):
What what? James what? James?
Speaker 3 (21:03):
What?
Speaker 5 (21:03):
Will?
Speaker 2 (21:03):
Well, it's it's a Washington State Highway patrol.
Speaker 1 (21:06):
Uh, that's that's I hope they are ready for the
lesbian commissars. Oh you know, I know, I am.
Speaker 5 (21:16):
Yeah, there the work police.
Speaker 1 (21:31):
Ah. And we'll back.
Speaker 2 (21:34):
We're back, We're back back, We're back.
Speaker 1 (21:38):
We're back.
Speaker 5 (21:39):
Oh.
Speaker 1 (21:39):
Yeah. So it was Joseph Conrad's novel Nostromo that that
this Atlantic writer and uh and Bronze Age Pervitt both loved. Yeah, yeah,
here origin another fucking paragraph. For many years we corresponded.
Costin's messages arrived regularly, and the tone ranged from friendly
and inquisitive to boorish and insulting. I went to South
America on assignment. He sent long messages extolling the issues
(22:00):
of Joseph Conrad's Nostromo, which is selt there set there.
A friend who reads books like Nostromo and can talk
about them is a friend worth putting.
Speaker 2 (22:08):
Up with South America. It's fucking not even a fucking country.
Speaker 1 (22:13):
Just yeah, incredible generally South America. And like right after that,
he says, after about ten years, he took to calling
my friends and then he uses a series of slurs.
At some point he had begun bodybuilding, and he sent
me a picture of himself shirtless with the message, do
you like this pic of me?
Speaker 2 (22:35):
Again? A cure guy.
Speaker 1 (22:38):
It's just a just a real genius, so Bronze writings, Yeah,
he's substating one of the one of the Greeks he's
obsessed with because he's he claims it, like frames himself
as an expert on Greek society, which he portrays as
something of a paradise. But he only knows about like
(22:58):
six guys and one of the as Alcibiades and Alcibietes,
was an Athenian general and a statesman who was a
big player in the Peloponnesian War. He defected from Athens
to Sparta and then from Sparta to the Persian Empire
before being recalled and reinstated as an Athenian general. He
is a real motherfucker and an interesting guy. And because
(23:19):
he was so interesting and kind of he was very
charismatic in his own time, and this kind of like
very shady figure two, he becomes an early celebrity. He's
like one of the first famous people that's really out there.
And a big part of why he stays famous is
that Plato will write a lot about him and Socrates, right,
and Plato's at writing a after they're dead, So a
(23:41):
lot of Alcabietes is like a character written by Plato
as opposed to the actual historical fact about the dude.
It's also worth noting, given how anti queer bap is,
that Alcibiades and Socrates were lovers. Socrates was like famously
kind of a simp for Alcabieties, while also was kind
of a piece of shit to Socrates. A lot of
(24:04):
fun stories about that. But these guys were not at
all straight.
Speaker 2 (24:09):
Yeah, I mean, pederaste was an institution in anteen Greece.
That pederaste is the same as being.
Speaker 1 (24:15):
No, no, I don't I don't think that's the same
as what was going on with these two dudes.
Speaker 2 (24:18):
Yeah, these dudes are just.
Speaker 1 (24:20):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, happy for mm hmm. Bronze age perverts.
Rants are profoundly silly to anyone who wasn't a deranged
chud obsessing over white girls don't like him while shooting
steroids into his ass. But because that's a fertile demographic,
he has influence among some important conservatives.
Speaker 2 (24:38):
Form the White House in the technical sense of the word.
Speaker 4 (24:41):
Yeah not not after all those steroids, yeah hit testuestering
too much.
Speaker 1 (24:46):
Well, and none of these guys will let themselves touch
a walms because they're they're so they're so horrified by
the concept of women. So former White House speech writer
Darren Beattie followed him on Twitter and in a acted
with his writing, as did Minnesota State Senator Roger Chamberlain.
Curtis Jarvin called him his White House cell leader. This
(25:07):
is interesting to me because BAP himself has encouraged his
young followers to avoid supporting him in public and instead
of hide their sympathies while taking positions in the government
to institute his ideas. It's also worth noting that you
can find some fans of Bronze age pervert on the
so called anti woke left. There's clips out there from
the red Scare podcast which the less set about the better,
(25:29):
where the two hosts read segments of his book with
a what seems like a degree of appreciation, calling it
the good kind of racist.
Speaker 5 (25:37):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (25:39):
Does that also makes sense in terms of their condess
they're like anti feminist stuff that they do.
Speaker 1 (25:44):
Yes, Yes, And I think his his writings, he has
a very like florid purple prose style. I don't think
it's good writing. I don't find it particularly engaging. It's
very channy and kind of exhausting. But people who are
dumbfall for it. So yeah, yeah, he's hit his demo.
Speaker 2 (26:04):
Well.
Speaker 1 (26:05):
Now. His influence is significant enough that some conservatives have
sought to explain it. I found a fun write up
on americanmind dot org that describes his appeal this way. So,
what exactly is the teaching of Bronze age mindset and
why is it so attractive to so many young men?
The answer, I think is simple. It is a revitalized
paganism obsessed with strength and beauty. It appeals to today's
(26:25):
young men because these things, strength and beauty are exactly
what contemporary society has tried so hard to deny them.
The gospel of son and steel, of vitalism, and strength
and power are exactly would have been denied to the
boys of the Western world and their spirits militate against this.
Everything great ever achieved, Bap tells us, was done through
strong friendships between two men or brotherhoods of men. And
(26:46):
this includes all great political things, all acts of political
freedom and power. Now I should note part of what
he Bap gets at when he's talking about how these
strong groups friendships of between two men or small brother
the hoods of men. He is a big advocate and
one of the reasons why he is popular among like
the Adam Waffen set is he's a big advocate of
(27:06):
his followers forming small two, three, four man groups and
training with weapons together and preparing for the future, you know,
day of the rope style thing. He doesn't use that term,
but he's he's speaking to those people from like a
more educated mindset. And there's I think an extent to
which you could see his writing as trying to pull
in that kind of educated upper crust kids of the
(27:28):
upper middle class, you know, with ivy League educations who
go into politics, trying to draw them in closer to
the actual violent insurgent right at least in terms of
the sympathies of their ideas. And support for methods of
organizing that are more traditionally found against you know, the
I Loham City set, right. I think there is a
(27:50):
degree of that going on here now. Bronze Age Pervert
is more supportive of Trump than a lot of these guys,
largely because he finds him funny and sees him as
an avatar of disruption and destruction.
Speaker 6 (28:03):
Yeah. I think it's it's like an accelerationist support.
Speaker 1 (28:06):
Yeah, exactly exactly, which is actually honestly that there's that's
perfectly logical because Trump is accelerating both the death of
the kind of conservatism that is state loyal that is
sort of system loyal, right, the George W. Bush kind
of conservatism, which.
Speaker 6 (28:23):
Is a conservative system that's like the two thousands.
Speaker 2 (28:26):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (28:26):
Yeah, and Trump is has done damage, terrible damage to
that and damage to the structure of the state in
the hole. So it doesn't it's to perfectly logical for
him to support Trump. He's not like, this is not
inconsistent with the other things that he talks about. One
of the people that that Atlantic writer talked to is
Michael Anton, a former Trump administration national security official who
(28:47):
wrote a twenty nineteen essay in the Claremont Review of
Books about Bronze Age Pervert. He acknowledges that Bapp's work
is racist, anti Semitic, anti democratic, misogynistic, and homophobic, but
suggested that like, you know that that's all, that's not
you know, that's not necessarily what he really believes. Maybe
it is, but the big reason why he does this
(29:09):
is it key. It distracts leftists from his like his
more serious, like secret heresies that are like the real, deep, dark,
arcane wisdom at the center of it, like hang out
with your bros and trading with guns or whatever, or yeah,
like heiden the fucking government and waiting for the right
(29:29):
moment to strike, but then blow it all up when
you make an ad for Ronda Santis. That kind of
cleverness anyway. Anton writes that Bronze Age Pervert quote speaks
directly to a youthful dissatisfaction, especially among white males, with
equality is propagandized and imposed in our day, a hectoring, vindictive, resentful, leveling,
hypocritical equality that punishes excellence and publicly denies all differences,
(29:53):
while at the same time elevating and enriching a decadent
incompetent and corrupt elite.
Speaker 2 (29:58):
There you go.
Speaker 1 (30:10):
So what does all this have to do with long houses? Well,
let's finally get to that. Longhouse describes a category of
dwellings that have existed on basically every land mass and
the planet in some form, stretching back to the Neolithic period.
These are, in general, large halls, sometimes with private family
rooms built into them, sometimes with communal sleeping arrangements, but
(30:31):
always organized around a large, single communal hall. In ancient days,
these are where feasts would be held and where groups
of families or tribes would huddle together in long, cold winters.
Bronze Age Pervert conceives of the long house as an
example of the miserable lives primitive and shameful cultures not
his beloved Greeks lived in before modernity. In his writing,
(30:51):
he makes it clear that his fear is rule by
degenerates and our fallen modernity will cause society to regress
to this prehistoric misery. Now, the heart of his hatred
of what he calls long house culture is that, in
his mind, these dwellings were dominated by women who forced
men to live inside the smoky, cloying, stinking confines this
is not really accurate to any kind of history. I
(31:13):
expect his conception here comes largely from the fact that
long houses are often suspected because we know relatively little
about many of the cultures that had them, are often
suspected of having been organized among matrilineal lines. In other words,
if you, as a dude, merry a lady, you move
into her family's long house. Right, this does sink out.
There are modern cultures that lived that had long houses
(31:34):
or have long houses who also live this way, the
Iroquois being a good example. Right, there was a long
house culture and where which house lived in was matrilineal.
But it is a mistake to characterize matrilineal as meaning
like the women are completely in charge, because they were
not an Iroquois culture, nor many other cultures where longhouses existed.
(31:55):
Vikings lived in longhouses, and you might recognize there's a
society is not precisely anti masculine.
Speaker 2 (32:03):
Yeah, the Vikings, Yeah.
Speaker 1 (32:05):
The woke vikings. So this is more of a problem though,
with the conceptions of the longhouse that are spread by
Bab's followers, because again he's using it as a shorthand
for the fact that this kind of like prehistoric darkness
of egalitarianism is going to destroy the only thing that,
in his view, can bring progress, which is small groups
(32:25):
of beautiful men enforcing their will through violence. Right, that's
what he talks about when he's talking about the Long House.
His followers tend to use the Long House as a
short end, more of a shorthand for the kind of
stuff Curtis Yarvin gets at with the cathedral, a catch
all term for progressive modernity, women who get to say
no to sex and have their own credit cards, trans
(32:47):
people on hormones, vegan meat, substitutes, and yes, the Barbie movie.
Speaker 5 (32:51):
Now.
Speaker 1 (32:51):
I open this episode with a post about that movie
by Lomez, an adherent of Baptism who wrote an interminable
article on the Long House for a website called First Things,
which describes itself as America's most influential journal of religion
and public life.
Speaker 5 (33:09):
I love it is.
Speaker 2 (33:10):
Yeah, I bet it is, buddy, And you can tell
because they always let you know straightaway. Yeah that's true.
Speaker 1 (33:14):
Yeah, Yeah, they really got to hit that up for you.
I'm going to quote from that now. Even for those
of us who use it, the Longhouse evades easy summary
ambivalent to its core. The term is at once politically
earnest and the punchline to an elaborate in joke. Its
definition must remain elastic lest it lose its power to
lampoon the vast constellation of social forces it reviles. It
(33:34):
refers at once to our increasingly degraded mode of technocratic government,
but also to wokeness to the progressive, liberal, and secular
values that pervade all major institutions. The most important feature
of the long House, and why it makes such a
resonant and controversial symbol of our current circumstances, is the
ubiquitous rule of the den mother. More than anything, the
long House refers to the remarkable over correction of the
(33:56):
last two generations towards social norms centering femine in needs
and feminine methods for controlling, directing, and modeling behavior. As
of twenty twenty two, women held fifty two percent of
professional managerial roles in the US. Women earn more than
fifty seven percent of bachelor degrees, sixty one percent of
master's degrees, and fifty four percent of doctoral degrees, and
(34:17):
because they're overrepresented in professions such as human resource management,
and compliance officers that determined workplace behavioral norms. They have
an outsized influence and professional culture, which itself has an
outsized influence on American culture more generally so. The Wawright
taken over human resources, he sounds like he lost to
(34:38):
fight with his fosaurus when he's writing that, Like, yeah,
at every point, like he's just using unnecessarily long word. Yeah,
it's it's I mean, it's also just like women have
are dominating society because they they're getting more bachelor's degrees.
Speaker 2 (34:54):
Yep, that's what it is.
Speaker 1 (34:56):
Huh okay, uh huh.
Speaker 2 (34:57):
Yeah, that's a famous to useful Baptist which always leads
to employment.
Speaker 1 (35:01):
And position to tremendous wealth.
Speaker 5 (35:04):
Oh.
Speaker 1 (35:04):
Also, and the idea that like human resources are in
some degree to somehow setting the terms culturally as opposed
to responding to the needs of corporations to mitigate risk, right,
Like r's that's what HR actually is. It's not setting
an agenda, it is avoiding lawsuits, it is minimizing exposure whatever.
Speaker 5 (35:28):
Ye.
Speaker 1 (35:28):
Lomez also goes on to quote Richard Hanania, an influential
conservative thought leader who is revealed recently to be a
neo Nazi or at least someone who regularly wrote neo
Nazi things in neo Nazi parts of the web and
wants to be seen as respectable. Now, well, we'll talk
about him later. Lomez approvingly notes that Hanania echoes a
bapist talking point when he discusses how female domination of
(35:51):
HR has given them control over public and private institutions.
Now again, the way Lomez is talking about this shit
is not actually in line with how Bronze age Pervert
conceives of the long House. And one of the funnier
results of everything that I've been talking about today is
that Bronze age Pervert now spends much of his time
on Twitter angrily tweeting at his followers that they're using
(36:14):
the longhouse wrong. I'm gonna read you a post. It
is from July twenty seventh, longhouse has gone crazy, out
of control. Usually misused. It's not a synonym for feminism
or matriarchy, nor for group consensus, though those are part
of the story. It's a concrete image from pre airy
in Europe of lower life and of most traditional societies.
(36:36):
Baby got away from you. Yeah, And some of his
ire is likely due to the fact that his followers,
who are largely very young, tend to apply what they
see as his analysis to children's movies. Here's a real
good one. Yeah, this is a it's a post for
(36:58):
a picture of like the female villain from the movie
Tangled by Activated Sleeper. If you want a good example
of the nebulous long house, look no further than mother
gothal Fane narcissism driven by resentment and envy of the young,
whose primary and most effective weapons are gaslighting, manipulation, and
the rhetoric of fanatical safety ism. It's good stuff.
Speaker 3 (37:20):
Thank you, Activated Sleeper, for you Activated Sleeper exposing that
great cutting, cutting commentary on the twenty twelves Tangled.
Speaker 2 (37:35):
Now.
Speaker 1 (37:36):
One of my favorite recent examples of how many of
these guys use the long house was a post in
the off my Chest reddit which went viral on Twitter.
The post is by a woman who says that she
interrupted her husband while he was telling a story, and
he was like, hold up, Tony Minner, talking as like
a joke, and she got angry at this and they
had a fight. One popular bapist response to this story,
(37:58):
fifteen hundred likes in counting when I found it, stated
men attempt to take one comedic step out of the
long house, and the locks get ten times bigger.
Speaker 2 (38:06):
Jesus Christ. It is.
Speaker 1 (38:09):
It is very silly to like bring up actual history
with this, but one of the points you'll find and
like writing about long houses traditionally is that because everyone
was cooped up in the winter comes spring, the women
were generally like doing everything they good to get the
men to fucking leave and go hunter something. They get
the fuck out of that, get out of here, like,
go do something else. We need something, need like a
(38:31):
fucking week or two without you hanging around. Go to yeah,
go to war, do something. Jesus Christ. Nobody likes being
cooped up in a fucking long house anyway. That's that's
the long house. That's uh, bronze age pervert. It is
kind of worth noting because these guys are convinced that,
(38:52):
like they are the intellectual vanguard of this movement that's
going to overturn what is classically described as lib rualism,
this idea that like people have like rights that are
worth protecting, and shit, that that's a failed idea. It's
obviously failed. Look at how ugly buildings are today, and
they'll post some picture of like the Chicago World's Fair.
(39:15):
These people are like weirdly adjacent to the the the
Tataria conspiracy theory that one hundred years ago the world
was ruled by this like vast advanced Russian empire that
made all the nice buildings, and then World War Two
was a secret excuse for the rulers of the world
to destroy all the good architecture, and that's why buildings
are ugly.
Speaker 3 (39:36):
I definitely seen like this bad guy in those in
those like circles of people who are like like culture
critic or like Greek Greek enjoyer or whatever. Ye, like, yeah,
those pictures of like like old expensive architecture stuff and
mixed in with like like either like uh mostly mostly
(39:56):
like brutalist or like moderness architecture.
Speaker 6 (39:58):
Be like what happened?
Speaker 1 (40:00):
What which way? Well, for one thing, like the society
that people like you insisted upon this one in which
like value is maximized at all costs. So we we
took windows out of my school that was built in
that brutalist periods because.
Speaker 3 (40:17):
It because like it's like because some like prince bankrupted
their country building this pretty building, and that's why we
don't do that anymore.
Speaker 1 (40:29):
Like you thought, like, yeah, jacked dudes with guns should
run everything started a series of wars that bankrupted those
countries and they had to sell their nice buildings to
the Americans. Why we got the London Bridge, I assume.
Speaker 3 (40:44):
But it's it's definitely all that all in like in
that in that same rough rough Twitter mill you. I mean,
it's certainly now that you've explained all of this at
longhou stuff, it certainly makes sense why they're kind of
fawning over the Barbie movie.
Speaker 6 (40:59):
And I mean very.
Speaker 3 (41:00):
Clearly Ken is going to become one of these like
a memeable characters because of what he does in the film.
It's he's he's going to join the pantheon of like
American Psycho and uh, all.
Speaker 6 (41:11):
Of Ryan Gosling's other roles.
Speaker 5 (41:15):
It is.
Speaker 3 (41:15):
It is fascinating how right Goslin kind of has become
like the literal poster child for much of like the
dissident like anti feminist rite just because of the types
of roles that he's taken.
Speaker 6 (41:27):
But yeah, I mean, it's it's.
Speaker 1 (41:29):
Really questionary tale male actors.
Speaker 3 (41:32):
It certainly makes sense in context of the Barbie Movie
in terms of how they kind of structured all of
the like social critique in that in that movie. But
but yeah, this is very silly. I mean, uh, it's
I'm excited I won't have to hear much more about
like the uh the stunning poetic prose of Bronze Age.
Speaker 2 (41:54):
Perfect. Yeah, fucking the Atlantic every time. Never.
Speaker 1 (41:59):
It's so like weird because there's there's this whole thing
that opens the article where he's talking about how like,
you know, the the first strains of this new anti democratic,
you know, anti liberal thinking in academia came out through
philosophy students who you know, realized that their professors just
took for granted, you know, the the truth about things
(42:20):
like the value of human rights and didn't weren't ready
for their arguments against them. And it was these like
these people who didn't want to be told not to
think in certain ways. No, man, they were assholes. They're
asshole rich kids who needed somebody to hit him in
the fucking face. They need they need a folding chair
deployed on them, Like yeah, yeah, you.
Speaker 2 (42:41):
Got to see.
Speaker 3 (42:42):
I demand to shutdown of all coastal universities until we
figure out what the fuck is going on.
Speaker 1 (42:47):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I'm sorry if you were pretending that
you are, like somehow in the insurgent underground, uh as
the son of an M I T professor, going Tom
I T yourself like you fucking dilat that's all. That's
all this fucker is is a diletant, and that's all
most of the people following are. It's a mix of
dilettants and guys who are going to shoot up walmarts anyway, right, cool.
Speaker 6 (43:13):
Give him a follow, Give a follow.
Speaker 2 (43:15):
Yeah, yeah, I'm checking out activated sleeper and I've learned
a lot already. So oh yeah, yeah, you're getting pilled
by him? Yeah yeah, yeah, pretty much. I you know,
as much as one can be hill by a fourteen
year old. But uh yeah, really interesting stuff here. I
think fair to say that this is an insight into
(43:36):
a world. Oh buddy, fuck me, all right, yeah wait,
we're not talking about that. We are not talking about
his bedroom wall by everyone.
Speaker 1 (43:43):
Oh oh wait, now I got a lotch James, what
did you We can bleep it.
Speaker 6 (43:47):
You have to at least tell us what you Oh wow,
his his pinned.
Speaker 4 (43:52):
It's fucking I'm not sure it's get veteran playing. Yeah,
what's on the veteran. And what looks like is that
a German national about like a German? Is that Imperial Germany?
Speaker 1 (44:05):
Yeah? I think this guy is a kaiser Reich.
Speaker 6 (44:08):
Dude, this is certainly impressive.
Speaker 1 (44:13):
I'm sure.
Speaker 6 (44:13):
I'm sure he's getting all the ladies in there.
Speaker 1 (44:16):
I gotta I gotta show you guys this pinned tweet
and then I'll read it. It's all caps. Let me
tell you how much I want a FED post. There
are a hundred billion neurons within my brain. If a
FED post was written on each and every one those neurons,
it would not equal one billionth of the compulstion I
feel feel the FED post at this micro instant fed post,
(44:37):
FED post that means posting about doing a terrorism So.
Speaker 3 (44:41):
That this is the type of tweet that could either
come from the sun, like like mentally unwell leftist.
Speaker 5 (44:50):
Yeah yeah yeah.
Speaker 2 (44:54):
The flag he has, just to be clear, it's a
franco Is flag of Spain, which, okay, it's something that
good we will have to talk about, which is the
American right has been embracing franco As like based and
good uh for a while now, like as this kind
of returned to Catholic tradition and like it's just anti
(45:14):
woke crusader.
Speaker 6 (45:16):
I do call it.
Speaker 3 (45:17):
The suggestion follows here on Activit Sleepers Page, son Optimist.
Speaker 1 (45:23):
Aleric, the Barbarian Impernter Philippus.
Speaker 6 (45:28):
These people are such birds.
Speaker 1 (45:31):
Here's he's reached a post from Bronze Age Jacob Eurowski.
Jews are like the one ring for politics.
Speaker 3 (45:40):
I think I think, I think I think reached the
I think we reached peak peak.
Speaker 6 (45:47):
I don't think.
Speaker 2 (45:47):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (45:49):
I hope you've all learned a lot from this. Have
a wonderful week, every wonderful week, and funk you for
making me write this to our listeners. It could happen
here as a production of cool Zone Media. For more
podcasts from cool Zone Media, visit our website Coolzonemedia dot com,
(46:09):
or check us out on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,
or wherever you listen to podcasts.
Speaker 3 (46:14):
You can find sources for It could Happen here, updated
monthly at Coolzonmedia dot com slash sources.
Speaker 6 (46:19):
Thanks for listening.
It could happen here a podcast about frustrating people and
frustrating times. That's not all it's about. Sometimes we talk
about nice things like like raising sheep or unionization efforts,
you know, the endless struggle of working people to better
the world. But not today. Today we're having a real,
(00:30):
real piece of ship episode about a real piece of ship,
and it's gonna make everybody unhappy. Hello Garrison, Hello James.
How are you both doing today?
Speaker 2 (00:38):
So much better for hearing that, Robert, Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, I.
Speaker 3 (00:42):
Just ready to have a fine evening here, ye about
something that's probably very fun.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
Yeah, going to be good. You don't have you don't
have your soda stream? Disappointed in you?
Speaker 1 (00:54):
James and I are now so toa stream pilled.
Speaker 3 (00:56):
Not I've not gotten the company so to stream yet
that has must generation.
Speaker 1 (01:02):
Yeah, the unfortunately the company beverage is is Billy Beer.
Uh Billy Carter Jimmy Carter's Brothers beer that was on
sale for roughly a year in the nineteen seventies.
Speaker 2 (01:15):
Is it made of peanuts? If only?
Speaker 4 (01:18):
No?
Speaker 1 (01:18):
So today let's start. I got a question for you.
Have either of you seen the Barbie movie?
Speaker 2 (01:24):
Yes?
Speaker 5 (01:25):
I have.
Speaker 1 (01:26):
I was it well done, Gear.
Speaker 2 (01:28):
Oh I didn't go buddy sold gear.
Speaker 3 (01:31):
The said dress thing was was nice.
Speaker 5 (01:34):
It was.
Speaker 6 (01:34):
It was a great lesson in like liberal recuperation. I'm sure,
I'm sure.
Speaker 3 (01:38):
I'm sure it'll be great for like kids who like
don't know who like don't know what feminism is.
Speaker 6 (01:44):
But but yeah.
Speaker 1 (01:45):
Yeah, it seems I have not watched it either. It
doesn't seem like my kind of movie. But it seems
broadly act correct me if I'm wrong here, that it
has what you might call like very very modest and
fairly mainstream approachable feminist message. Yeah, yeah, that seems like
it's fair, which most people would not be particularly angry about.
(02:07):
But a sizable chunk of the very online right, the
chunk of the right, particularly that makes their living by
having takes on shit has has has been up in
arms ever since it came out, and particularly ever since
it made more than a billion dollars in the box office.
I'm sure a lot of people are aware that our
old friend Ben Shapiro filmed a forty two minute video
(02:28):
tearing it apart and his signature preteen stolen Valor voice boy.
Speaker 3 (02:41):
After I watched the movie, me and some friends tried
to watch the Ben Shapiro video for fun. We made
it like six minutes in, and that everyone forced me
to stop.
Speaker 1 (02:50):
Intolerable shit. Cowards. Cowards are cowards. But that's yeah. So
elsewhere in the right and kind of the less mainstream
acceptable chunks of what we'd call the insurgent right around here,
various thought leaders attempted to declare the movie stealth conservative
propaganda as a way of insisting that its success was
really due to it being anti woke. That's silly too.
(03:12):
None of this is worth discussing in detail. I promise
you all, this is not going to be a podcast
about the fucking Barbie movie. None of this is worth
discussing in detail, save to say that Shapiro's anger at
the movie, and particularly its comic relief character Kin, seems
to have been the more wide spread response from those
kinds of people. Now, because I have made, over the
years a lot of poor decisions in my browsing and
(03:34):
engaging habits. Over the years, Twitter sends me a lot
of weirdo right wing responses to everything that happens in
the world, including this movie and one of these posts
that I caught somewhere in late July or on the
twenty second, twenty third caught my eye. Now this post
features a vapor wave filtered kin photoshopped in front of
a burning Viking long house, accompanied by the text exit
(03:58):
the long house. Now, when you see something like this
and you don't know what they're getting at, like, you
have two choices. If you're like, you get like, I
don't know, kids, a really demanding job, anything at all
going on in your personal life, you scroll right past it.
If you're me, you spend like four and a half
hours reading various fascist essays about feminism to try to
(04:23):
figure out what the fuck a longhouse has to do
with the Barbie movie. Now, the guy who had made
this post is a low level fascist political columnist named Lomez.
He is, he's kind of on me. He's a little
bit of volapild. He's he doesn't he's not like a
very major figure. He's kind of several steps below anyone
(04:45):
you've heard of. I would say, like two or three
steps standard deviations of fame below like Jack Pisobiec. But
his writing has a degree of purchase among the kinds
of conservatives who trick Ron DeSantis into running in comprehensible
campaign ads with son rads in them he has. He's like,
he's got a little bit of influence among that kind
of crew, and he's sort of in the conversation with
(05:06):
a lot of those people. I took notice of his
post because I'd seen the term long house being used
by a couple of these guys off and on, and
because Lomes's post got like three thousand something likes, which
meant that, yeah, there's some community out there that gets
what he's talking about. So on a whim, I clicked
to view the quote tweets for this post, and I
(05:27):
found a post by a user named Siege, which is
of course a reference to a book about carrying out
acts of terrorism in order to bring about a white
Ethno state. The post says, Kin is you. He is
an exaggerated Western man in the twenty first century, anxious, confused,
chasing women who don't care about him. He exits the
long House and discovers his own will to power. Like you,
(05:50):
he decides to bring this knowledge back to his fellow man,
and it's you know, I'm gonna I'll show you guys
this this post here. It's pretty pretty Nazi. Yeah, pretty
pretty Nazi.
Speaker 2 (06:02):
It's not the best work on Ken, like he guys
looks like a blob.
Speaker 1 (06:05):
No, I will say I have a little bit of
respect for the craft here that he didn't just go
to an ai that looks like somebody like crudely cut
a picture of kin that they have like uh uh,
color inverted and then photoshopped it into a picture of
a long house with a fire behind it.
Speaker 2 (06:24):
It's too.
Speaker 6 (06:27):
I will say. Uh.
Speaker 3 (06:29):
Sieg's description of Ken from the from the from the
Barbie movie is pretty accurate to what's in the film.
Speaker 1 (06:35):
M that's good. So what is the long house? What
the fuck does a long house have to do with
what are otherwise pretty standard neo Nazi esque messaging about,
you know, the decadence and failure of modern man and
all that kind of shit. And is this dumb fascist
memes something that you need to care about now? Unfortunately
(06:57):
the answer to that is yes, because all of this
ties back to one extremely influential, insurgent right wing ideologue
whose followers have been close to the presidency once before
and may yet find themselves there again. That asshole is
an mi I T graduate named Kostin Alamaru who posts
online under variations of the name Bronze Age Pervert. You guys,
(07:20):
how aware are you of Bronze Age Pervert or BAP
as he's often known.
Speaker 2 (07:27):
I've heard of BAP, but maybe only in passing because
I wasn't familiar with Bronze age pervert. Thank you, yeah,
thank you for sharing with me today.
Speaker 1 (07:36):
Robert, Oh, oh, You're going to be so much less happy, Garrison,
are you familiar with this fella?
Speaker 3 (07:41):
I think I may have only seen stuff from him
in passing. I'm not I'm not overly familiar.
Speaker 5 (07:46):
Now.
Speaker 1 (07:47):
Yeah, that was kind of my experience until like a
month or so ago when I started really digging into
the guy. And I don't feel better as a result
of having done that. But uh, yeah, we know that
this guy's actual name is Kostin Alamariu because of a
very recent Atlantic articles, like a month ago, that this
guy got revealed in this article because this writer for
(08:08):
The Atlantic was a friend of his, like at mit,
like it was just somebody who like and recognized his
voice on a podcast. Now, this article, I find it
frustrating for a number of reasons. I don't think it's
great analysis of BAP's work or what people find appealing
in it or a particularly honest, intellectual look at what
(08:28):
this guy has to say. But it does have some
interesting reveals, including the fact that Bronze Age Pervert's first
public media appearance was a parody audio tour for an
exhibition at the Boston Museum of Fine Arts, written by
bj Novak, who played Ryan in the Office. Yeah, so
that's that's odd, and it's one of those BJ Novak
(08:52):
is not a stealth Nazi, don't worry. But the video
or the thing that they put together does kind of
fit it for like a fascist art project. And I'm
going to read how The Atlantic describes this audio tour
they put together together, or put that they assembled together.
Novak had recruited a Romanian classmate with a deep voice,
(09:13):
and together they'd recorded an audio tour for the exhibition
Tales from the Land of Dragons a Thousand Years of
Chinese Painting, with the help of friends. They then slipped
cassettes containing their tour into the museum's official audio guides.
Art lovers must have wondered about the thick Eastern European
accent that greeted them over the twang of a Chinese
string instrument. The Romanians soon became opinionated. Personally, he said,
(09:33):
I think this painting is a piece of crap. Then deranged,
he alluded to his disgusting anatomical abnormalities. He called his
listeners decadent imperialist maggots, and confessed a desire to smash
a glass case with a sledgehammer and rip a scroll
to shreds with my teeth, which, by the way, are
extremely long and sharp, more like fangs than human teeth.
At last, he offered an interlude of idiot music while
(09:55):
he fumbled with his script. This should keep you occupied,
you drooling, imbecile, he bellowed at the listeners, by now
either amused or complaining to management. So there's like there's
like little little whiffs of degenerate art stuff in there,
but it's also just kind of like they like a
little bit like Max head roomy kind of stuff, like
(10:16):
where you're kind of tricking people into into into consuming
this like parody artwork thing. Like again, I think this
was a pretty innocent joke on Novak's fall part. But
Costin number one probably got picked for this because he's
a he's he's got a thick Romanian accent that he
very much plays up. He was noted in this time
as kind of talking like Dracula deliberately. He also would
(10:39):
always wear these like long and elaborate black coats, so
that he kind of looked like a Dracula type figure,
like he was, you know, he was he was doing
a bit. He was putting on like a That was
the image he wanted to He wanted to portray himself
as to people as kind of like mysterious and Eastern
European sort of sort of figure.
Speaker 2 (10:59):
Now.
Speaker 1 (10:59):
Costin first started posting as bronze age pervert on a
series of obscure web forums in twenty ten. In the
November of twenty thirteen, he joined Twitter and immediately fell
in with a loose community that some people call frog Twitter.
And these are you know who these guys are. It's
like a general term for anonymous alt right adjacent posters
with like pepe avatars. Yeah, and the other group the
(11:22):
kind of related people that he fell in with and
that he started to have traction with our adherents to
a fascist philosopher known as Curtis Jarvin or Minsius Moldbug.
Curtis is his real name. Minsius Moldbug is the pseudonym.
He wrote under now I know it's a it's these.
Speaker 2 (11:40):
People this shit, man, it's just so pathetic, like play
Dungeons and Dragons.
Speaker 1 (11:47):
Just a solid twenty percent of our fascist problems are
like people didn't get a reliable D and D group
early enough, like a lot of these I think Balder's
Gate three is gonna save us from a lot of
these guys in the future.
Speaker 2 (12:01):
The Antifa computer game. Yeah.
Speaker 5 (12:04):
So.
Speaker 1 (12:05):
Curtis Yarvin aka Mensius is a UC Berkeley graduate in
computer science who joined the tech industry and got pilled
on a strain of anti democratic libertarian theory.
Speaker 2 (12:17):
This is this is like a this is a pathway, man, Yeah,
this is perfect well.
Speaker 1 (12:21):
Bronze age pervert also goes into tech after graduating from
m i T. Right, and like, you know, a decent
number of these guys come out of like Stanford and shit,
like it's all, uh, it's all these guys who are,
in fact, to some extent, like intellectual elites, bronze age perverts.
Dad is a teacher at mi T, like just kind
of like you look at like Stephen Miller's background, Right,
(12:42):
A lot of these guys come out of like liberal
academia families. But anyway, it's very common. Yeah. Curtis comes
out of uh yeah, gets into the tech industry and
he writes a book kind of while he's he's working
and like he's a he's a founder and stuff for
some company. He writes a book in two thousand and
one titled Democracy, The God That Failed, follows it up
(13:06):
with a series of blog essays, and his writing becomes
very influential amongst Silicon Valley proto fascists. Jarvin's ideas in
brief is that the US is run and a lot
of Western society is really run by what he calls
the Cathedral, which is a mix of professors and journalists
who act as a Brahmin class dominating the United States
(13:26):
with a progressive state religion. He sees their egalitarian impulses
as toxic the destruction of natural civic order, and advocates
for his followers to design new architectures of exit to
replace the Cathedral with what is effectively a right wing dictatorship.
The number one supporter of Curtis Yarvin's ideas and financial
(13:47):
backer of him is Peter Teel Teal has a funded
Jarvin's work as a big fan of what he has
to say and his philosophy, which is generally referred to
as the Dark Enlightenment. And this is when we're talking
about dark Enlightenment, we're talking like mid aughts is kind
of when this stuff starts to really take off. This
is before the alt right that kind of becomes really
(14:09):
well known nationwide. Is A is A is a major term.
This is like in the pre and right around gamer
Gate period is when he's really starting to take off
with a lot of folks. And he certainly he feeds
into the alt right to Trump, you know, and to
that period of time, but he's much more on the
the pseudo intellectual end of things as opposed to the
(14:30):
like hitting folks in the street end of things. That's
what he gets a lot of Peter Teel money. So
uh yeah, Bronze Age Pervert is kind of a he
He espouses a philosophy that rhymes with with moldbugs with
Yarvin's philosophy in many ways, but where Yarvin dresses his
words and is writing up in a costume version of
(14:52):
mainstream academic discourse, Bronze Age Pervert is unapot apologetically online
and weird and he writes, like somebody who spends too
much fucking time on the Internet. A lot of his
stuff is cloaked in things that are like half jokes,
or at least want to be have plausible deniability of jokes,
so that like, if you take them seriously, he can
make fun of you for falling for the bit. But
(15:14):
he describes himself on Twitter as an aspiring nudist, bodybuilder,
free speech and anti zeno estrogen activist, So just just
the most irritating.
Speaker 2 (15:24):
Kind of guy, the normal guy.
Speaker 1 (15:28):
Much of his politics centers around a worship of ancient Greece,
which he believes settled on these scientifically ideal human form.
He believes men should engage in bodybuilding and nude sunbathing
to emulate the Greeks, And you'll see sometimes his followers
be like, oh, you're an idiot if you fell for that.
But legitimately half of what this guy posts about is
(15:49):
just pictures of bodybuilders, and his pictures of himself being
looking very jacked like he's he's it's it's that. If
that's all a bit, then all he has is this
silly bit, because it is it is dominant in his content.
BAP's ancient Greek or baps. Ancient Greeks are incredibly straight
and hate women with a passion. One of those things
(16:11):
is more or less right Greek, like upperclass Greeks, not
super pro women, yeah, not woke. The Cathedral, in his eyes,
is an oppressive dictatorship of femininity, if not always of
women over masculinity. Cancel culture is a particular topic of
his ire, and he seems to see it as basically
(16:34):
these that there are traditionally feminine methods of argumentation and conflict,
whether or not women are the ones doing them in
any given situation. Cancel culture is like the purest expression
of this, and he believes that these kind of feminine
methods of conflict destroy masculinity and make cultural progress impossible.
They chain men to this kind of like he sees,
(16:56):
you know how a lot of anarchists will talk about
how ancient society, these hunter gatherer societies, and like we're
often more egalitarian than a lot of like medieval societies,
classical societies, and this is often a lot of folks
do make the mistake of like idealizing these cultures. But
like that's a thing that gets talked about a lot
positively by by by some anarchists and I think obviously
(17:20):
worth studying. He takes the opposite tact of like these
ancient cultures like light, like people lived in the fucking
mud and were miserable, and it was because they were't
a galitarian. It was because the women were dominating the men. Right,
this is going to lead us to the long house
in short order, but we have somewhare to cover right here.
So he focuses a huge amount on anti egalitarian arguments
(17:44):
and on supporting a culture dominated by strong, beautiful, powerful
people who look like Greek statues and suppress women and
anyone else who doesn't look sexy. Basically, you get to
feel like that's a big part of it to this guy,
like he wants he wants a dictatorship of hot, violent men.
That's that's a big part of what he argues with.
(18:06):
Has he watched Lenny riefenstyles Olympia because this scene, Oh god, yeah,
I feel like that's playing in the back of his
fucking mind at all times.
Speaker 2 (18:15):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (18:15):
Now, Bapp argues that the state in its present form
preserves the lives of the weak and feeble minded, allowing
them to oppress the naked Aryan bodybuilders who by all
rights ought to run things. The prime repository of his
philosophy is his twenty eighteen book Bronze Age Mindset, which
was at one point in the top one hundred and
(18:36):
fifty books on Amazon. A former Trump White House official
Toad Politico in twenty nineteen, if you're a young person, intelligent,
adjacent in some way to the right, it's very likely
you would have heard of it. In chapter thirty five
of his book Bronze Age, the Bronze Age Mindset bap
rights quote, should the tyranny that has descended on our
(18:57):
age ever gain the power it seeks and then be
challenged enough to feel itself in danger? The mass annihilations
that will be carried out by homosexual, transsexual, and especially
lesbian commissars will exceed in scale and cruelty anything that
has yet happened in known history. Imagine lesbian Mulata commissars
with young Martin sheen face and haircut manning the future.
(19:18):
Bergen Belson's installations that will span tens of miles.
Speaker 2 (19:22):
Yep, sending you to the transgender goolag.
Speaker 1 (19:25):
Yeah, it's it's it's something else, and it's very funny
because like that fucking the Atlantic writer here like talks
about how he's he's got this like almost hypnotizing quality
to his writing, and he's he's got this really like, uh,
fascinating mind that you just want to engage with, and
it's I'll read you a fucking quote from this guy's
(19:49):
profile on Bronze Age pervert and try not to gag.
I consider myself a connoisseur of brilliant lunatics, and I
have a high tolerance for their lunacy if it has
compensating virtues of say humor or ingenuity. But even I
find back worrisome what starts as comedy can become something
more sinister and bap shtick. Well sometimes hilarious shows every
(20:12):
sign of transforming into a mode of new far right radicalism.
He goes on at a various point to be like, yeah,
he likes this book that I like. So I was
willing to put up with the fact that he was
he was bigoted for years because like we would talk
about literature together, you know, I just had so much
respect for his mind that I was willing to be
(20:33):
strung along for a long time. I don't I find
this guy kind.
Speaker 6 (20:36):
Of connoisseur yea a connoisseur of pig shit.
Speaker 1 (20:42):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (20:43):
I really love sifting through all the different types of
donkey dogs.
Speaker 1 (20:47):
Yeah, I just can't stick quite enough shit.
Speaker 2 (20:51):
Uh you know what make you become a connish there
of dog shit? Internet content?
Speaker 1 (21:00):
What what? James what? James?
Speaker 3 (21:03):
What?
Speaker 5 (21:03):
Will?
Speaker 2 (21:03):
Well, it's it's a Washington State Highway patrol.
Speaker 1 (21:06):
Uh, that's that's I hope they are ready for the
lesbian commissars. Oh you know, I know, I am.
Speaker 5 (21:16):
Yeah, there the work police.
Speaker 1 (21:31):
Ah. And we'll back.
Speaker 2 (21:34):
We're back, We're back back, We're back.
Speaker 1 (21:38):
We're back.
Speaker 5 (21:39):
Oh.
Speaker 1 (21:39):
Yeah. So it was Joseph Conrad's novel Nostromo that that
this Atlantic writer and uh and Bronze Age Pervitt both loved. Yeah, yeah,
here origin another fucking paragraph. For many years we corresponded.
Costin's messages arrived regularly, and the tone ranged from friendly
and inquisitive to boorish and insulting. I went to South
America on assignment. He sent long messages extolling the issues
(22:00):
of Joseph Conrad's Nostromo, which is selt there set there.
A friend who reads books like Nostromo and can talk
about them is a friend worth putting.
Speaker 2 (22:08):
Up with South America. It's fucking not even a fucking country.
Speaker 1 (22:13):
Just yeah, incredible generally South America. And like right after that,
he says, after about ten years, he took to calling
my friends and then he uses a series of slurs.
At some point he had begun bodybuilding, and he sent
me a picture of himself shirtless with the message, do
you like this pic of me?
Speaker 2 (22:35):
Again? A cure guy.
Speaker 1 (22:38):
It's just a just a real genius, so Bronze writings, Yeah,
he's substating one of the one of the Greeks he's
obsessed with because he's he claims it, like frames himself
as an expert on Greek society, which he portrays as
something of a paradise. But he only knows about like
(22:58):
six guys and one of the as Alcibiades and Alcibietes,
was an Athenian general and a statesman who was a
big player in the Peloponnesian War. He defected from Athens
to Sparta and then from Sparta to the Persian Empire
before being recalled and reinstated as an Athenian general. He
is a real motherfucker and an interesting guy. And because
(23:19):
he was so interesting and kind of he was very
charismatic in his own time, and this kind of like
very shady figure two, he becomes an early celebrity. He's
like one of the first famous people that's really out there.
And a big part of why he stays famous is
that Plato will write a lot about him and Socrates, right,
and Plato's at writing a after they're dead, So a
(23:41):
lot of Alcabietes is like a character written by Plato
as opposed to the actual historical fact about the dude.
It's also worth noting, given how anti queer bap is,
that Alcibiades and Socrates were lovers. Socrates was like famously
kind of a simp for Alcabieties, while also was kind
of a piece of shit to Socrates. A lot of
(24:04):
fun stories about that. But these guys were not at
all straight.
Speaker 2 (24:09):
Yeah, I mean, pederaste was an institution in anteen Greece.
That pederaste is the same as being.
Speaker 1 (24:15):
No, no, I don't I don't think that's the same
as what was going on with these two dudes.
Speaker 2 (24:18):
Yeah, these dudes are just.
Speaker 1 (24:20):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, happy for mm hmm. Bronze age perverts.
Rants are profoundly silly to anyone who wasn't a deranged
chud obsessing over white girls don't like him while shooting
steroids into his ass. But because that's a fertile demographic,
he has influence among some important conservatives.
Speaker 2 (24:38):
Form the White House in the technical sense of the word.
Speaker 4 (24:41):
Yeah not not after all those steroids, yeah hit testuestering
too much.
Speaker 1 (24:46):
Well, and none of these guys will let themselves touch
a walms because they're they're so they're so horrified by
the concept of women. So former White House speech writer
Darren Beattie followed him on Twitter and in a acted
with his writing, as did Minnesota State Senator Roger Chamberlain.
Curtis Jarvin called him his White House cell leader. This
(25:07):
is interesting to me because BAP himself has encouraged his
young followers to avoid supporting him in public and instead
of hide their sympathies while taking positions in the government
to institute his ideas. It's also worth noting that you
can find some fans of Bronze age pervert on the
so called anti woke left. There's clips out there from
the red Scare podcast which the less set about the better,
(25:29):
where the two hosts read segments of his book with
a what seems like a degree of appreciation, calling it
the good kind of racist.
Speaker 5 (25:37):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (25:39):
Does that also makes sense in terms of their condess
they're like anti feminist stuff that they do.
Speaker 1 (25:44):
Yes, Yes, And I think his his writings, he has
a very like florid purple prose style. I don't think
it's good writing. I don't find it particularly engaging. It's
very channy and kind of exhausting. But people who are
dumbfall for it. So yeah, yeah, he's hit his demo.
Speaker 2 (26:04):
Well.
Speaker 1 (26:05):
Now. His influence is significant enough that some conservatives have
sought to explain it. I found a fun write up
on americanmind dot org that describes his appeal this way. So,
what exactly is the teaching of Bronze age mindset and
why is it so attractive to so many young men?
The answer, I think is simple. It is a revitalized
paganism obsessed with strength and beauty. It appeals to today's
(26:25):
young men because these things, strength and beauty are exactly
what contemporary society has tried so hard to deny them.
The gospel of son and steel, of vitalism, and strength
and power are exactly would have been denied to the
boys of the Western world and their spirits militate against this.
Everything great ever achieved, Bap tells us, was done through
strong friendships between two men or brotherhoods of men. And
(26:46):
this includes all great political things, all acts of political
freedom and power. Now I should note part of what
he Bap gets at when he's talking about how these
strong groups friendships of between two men or small brother
the hoods of men. He is a big advocate and
one of the reasons why he is popular among like
the Adam Waffen set is he's a big advocate of
(27:06):
his followers forming small two, three, four man groups and
training with weapons together and preparing for the future, you know,
day of the rope style thing. He doesn't use that term,
but he's he's speaking to those people from like a
more educated mindset. And there's I think an extent to
which you could see his writing as trying to pull
in that kind of educated upper crust kids of the
(27:28):
upper middle class, you know, with ivy League educations who
go into politics, trying to draw them in closer to
the actual violent insurgent right at least in terms of
the sympathies of their ideas. And support for methods of
organizing that are more traditionally found against you know, the
I Loham City set, right. I think there is a
(27:50):
degree of that going on here now. Bronze Age Pervert
is more supportive of Trump than a lot of these guys,
largely because he finds him funny and sees him as
an avatar of disruption and destruction.
Speaker 6 (28:03):
Yeah. I think it's it's like an accelerationist support.
Speaker 1 (28:06):
Yeah, exactly exactly, which is actually honestly that there's that's
perfectly logical because Trump is accelerating both the death of
the kind of conservatism that is state loyal that is
sort of system loyal, right, the George W. Bush kind
of conservatism, which.
Speaker 6 (28:23):
Is a conservative system that's like the two thousands.
Speaker 2 (28:26):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (28:26):
Yeah, and Trump is has done damage, terrible damage to
that and damage to the structure of the state in
the hole. So it doesn't it's to perfectly logical for
him to support Trump. He's not like, this is not
inconsistent with the other things that he talks about. One
of the people that that Atlantic writer talked to is
Michael Anton, a former Trump administration national security official who
(28:47):
wrote a twenty nineteen essay in the Claremont Review of
Books about Bronze Age Pervert. He acknowledges that Bapp's work
is racist, anti Semitic, anti democratic, misogynistic, and homophobic, but
suggested that like, you know that that's all, that's not
you know, that's not necessarily what he really believes. Maybe
it is, but the big reason why he does this
(29:09):
is it key. It distracts leftists from his like his
more serious, like secret heresies that are like the real, deep, dark,
arcane wisdom at the center of it, like hang out
with your bros and trading with guns or whatever, or yeah,
like heiden the fucking government and waiting for the right
(29:29):
moment to strike, but then blow it all up when
you make an ad for Ronda Santis. That kind of
cleverness anyway. Anton writes that Bronze Age Pervert quote speaks
directly to a youthful dissatisfaction, especially among white males, with
equality is propagandized and imposed in our day, a hectoring, vindictive, resentful, leveling,
hypocritical equality that punishes excellence and publicly denies all differences,
(29:53):
while at the same time elevating and enriching a decadent
incompetent and corrupt elite.
Speaker 2 (29:58):
There you go.
Speaker 1 (30:10):
So what does all this have to do with long houses? Well,
let's finally get to that. Longhouse describes a category of
dwellings that have existed on basically every land mass and
the planet in some form, stretching back to the Neolithic period.
These are, in general, large halls, sometimes with private family
rooms built into them, sometimes with communal sleeping arrangements, but
(30:31):
always organized around a large, single communal hall. In ancient days,
these are where feasts would be held and where groups
of families or tribes would huddle together in long, cold winters.
Bronze Age Pervert conceives of the long house as an
example of the miserable lives primitive and shameful cultures not
his beloved Greeks lived in before modernity. In his writing,
(30:51):
he makes it clear that his fear is rule by
degenerates and our fallen modernity will cause society to regress
to this prehistoric misery. Now, the heart of his hatred
of what he calls long house culture is that, in
his mind, these dwellings were dominated by women who forced
men to live inside the smoky, cloying, stinking confines this
is not really accurate to any kind of history. I
(31:13):
expect his conception here comes largely from the fact that
long houses are often suspected because we know relatively little
about many of the cultures that had them, are often
suspected of having been organized among matrilineal lines. In other words,
if you, as a dude, merry a lady, you move
into her family's long house. Right, this does sink out.
There are modern cultures that lived that had long houses
(31:34):
or have long houses who also live this way, the
Iroquois being a good example. Right, there was a long
house culture and where which house lived in was matrilineal.
But it is a mistake to characterize matrilineal as meaning
like the women are completely in charge, because they were
not an Iroquois culture, nor many other cultures where longhouses existed.
(31:55):
Vikings lived in longhouses, and you might recognize there's a
society is not precisely anti masculine.
Speaker 2 (32:03):
Yeah, the Vikings, Yeah.
Speaker 1 (32:05):
The woke vikings. So this is more of a problem though,
with the conceptions of the longhouse that are spread by
Bab's followers, because again he's using it as a shorthand
for the fact that this kind of like prehistoric darkness
of egalitarianism is going to destroy the only thing that,
in his view, can bring progress, which is small groups
(32:25):
of beautiful men enforcing their will through violence. Right, that's
what he talks about when he's talking about the Long House.
His followers tend to use the Long House as a
short end, more of a shorthand for the kind of
stuff Curtis Yarvin gets at with the cathedral, a catch
all term for progressive modernity, women who get to say
no to sex and have their own credit cards, trans
(32:47):
people on hormones, vegan meat, substitutes, and yes, the Barbie movie.
Speaker 5 (32:51):
Now.
Speaker 1 (32:51):
I open this episode with a post about that movie
by Lomez, an adherent of Baptism who wrote an interminable
article on the Long House for a website called First Things,
which describes itself as America's most influential journal of religion
and public life.
Speaker 5 (33:09):
I love it is.
Speaker 2 (33:10):
Yeah, I bet it is, buddy, And you can tell
because they always let you know straightaway. Yeah that's true.
Speaker 1 (33:14):
Yeah, Yeah, they really got to hit that up for you.
I'm going to quote from that now. Even for those
of us who use it, the Longhouse evades easy summary
ambivalent to its core. The term is at once politically
earnest and the punchline to an elaborate in joke. Its
definition must remain elastic lest it lose its power to
lampoon the vast constellation of social forces it reviles. It
(33:34):
refers at once to our increasingly degraded mode of technocratic government,
but also to wokeness to the progressive, liberal, and secular
values that pervade all major institutions. The most important feature
of the long House, and why it makes such a
resonant and controversial symbol of our current circumstances, is the
ubiquitous rule of the den mother. More than anything, the
long House refers to the remarkable over correction of the
(33:56):
last two generations towards social norms centering femine in needs
and feminine methods for controlling, directing, and modeling behavior. As
of twenty twenty two, women held fifty two percent of
professional managerial roles in the US. Women earn more than
fifty seven percent of bachelor degrees, sixty one percent of
master's degrees, and fifty four percent of doctoral degrees, and
(34:17):
because they're overrepresented in professions such as human resource management,
and compliance officers that determined workplace behavioral norms. They have
an outsized influence and professional culture, which itself has an
outsized influence on American culture more generally so. The Wawright
taken over human resources, he sounds like he lost to
(34:38):
fight with his fosaurus when he's writing that, Like, yeah,
at every point, like he's just using unnecessarily long word. Yeah,
it's it's I mean, it's also just like women have
are dominating society because they they're getting more bachelor's degrees.
Speaker 2 (34:54):
Yep, that's what it is.
Speaker 1 (34:56):
Huh okay, uh huh.
Speaker 2 (34:57):
Yeah, that's a famous to useful Baptist which always leads
to employment.
Speaker 1 (35:01):
And position to tremendous wealth.
Speaker 5 (35:04):
Oh.
Speaker 1 (35:04):
Also, and the idea that like human resources are in
some degree to somehow setting the terms culturally as opposed
to responding to the needs of corporations to mitigate risk, right,
Like r's that's what HR actually is. It's not setting
an agenda, it is avoiding lawsuits, it is minimizing exposure whatever.
Speaker 5 (35:28):
Ye.
Speaker 1 (35:28):
Lomez also goes on to quote Richard Hanania, an influential
conservative thought leader who is revealed recently to be a
neo Nazi or at least someone who regularly wrote neo
Nazi things in neo Nazi parts of the web and
wants to be seen as respectable. Now, well, we'll talk
about him later. Lomez approvingly notes that Hanania echoes a
bapist talking point when he discusses how female domination of
(35:51):
HR has given them control over public and private institutions.
Now again, the way Lomez is talking about this shit
is not actually in line with how Bronze age Pervert
conceives of the long House. And one of the funnier
results of everything that I've been talking about today is
that Bronze age Pervert now spends much of his time
on Twitter angrily tweeting at his followers that they're using
(36:14):
the longhouse wrong. I'm gonna read you a post. It
is from July twenty seventh, longhouse has gone crazy, out
of control. Usually misused. It's not a synonym for feminism
or matriarchy, nor for group consensus, though those are part
of the story. It's a concrete image from pre airy
in Europe of lower life and of most traditional societies.
(36:36):
Baby got away from you. Yeah, And some of his
ire is likely due to the fact that his followers,
who are largely very young, tend to apply what they
see as his analysis to children's movies. Here's a real
good one. Yeah, this is a it's a post for
(36:58):
a picture of like the female villain from the movie
Tangled by Activated Sleeper. If you want a good example
of the nebulous long house, look no further than mother
gothal Fane narcissism driven by resentment and envy of the young,
whose primary and most effective weapons are gaslighting, manipulation, and
the rhetoric of fanatical safety ism. It's good stuff.
Speaker 3 (37:20):
Thank you, Activated Sleeper, for you Activated Sleeper exposing that
great cutting, cutting commentary on the twenty twelves Tangled.
Speaker 2 (37:35):
Now.
Speaker 1 (37:36):
One of my favorite recent examples of how many of
these guys use the long house was a post in
the off my Chest reddit which went viral on Twitter.
The post is by a woman who says that she
interrupted her husband while he was telling a story, and
he was like, hold up, Tony Minner, talking as like
a joke, and she got angry at this and they
had a fight. One popular bapist response to this story,
(37:58):
fifteen hundred likes in counting when I found it, stated
men attempt to take one comedic step out of the
long house, and the locks get ten times bigger.
Speaker 2 (38:06):
Jesus Christ. It is.
Speaker 1 (38:09):
It is very silly to like bring up actual history
with this, but one of the points you'll find and
like writing about long houses traditionally is that because everyone
was cooped up in the winter comes spring, the women
were generally like doing everything they good to get the
men to fucking leave and go hunter something. They get
the fuck out of that, get out of here, like,
go do something else. We need something, need like a
(38:31):
fucking week or two without you hanging around. Go to yeah,
go to war, do something. Jesus Christ. Nobody likes being
cooped up in a fucking long house anyway. That's that's
the long house. That's uh, bronze age pervert. It is
kind of worth noting because these guys are convinced that,
(38:52):
like they are the intellectual vanguard of this movement that's
going to overturn what is classically described as lib rualism,
this idea that like people have like rights that are
worth protecting, and shit, that that's a failed idea. It's
obviously failed. Look at how ugly buildings are today, and
they'll post some picture of like the Chicago World's Fair.
(39:15):
These people are like weirdly adjacent to the the the
Tataria conspiracy theory that one hundred years ago the world
was ruled by this like vast advanced Russian empire that
made all the nice buildings, and then World War Two
was a secret excuse for the rulers of the world
to destroy all the good architecture, and that's why buildings
are ugly.
Speaker 3 (39:36):
I definitely seen like this bad guy in those in
those like circles of people who are like like culture
critic or like Greek Greek enjoyer or whatever. Ye, like, yeah,
those pictures of like like old expensive architecture stuff and
mixed in with like like either like uh mostly mostly
(39:56):
like brutalist or like moderness architecture.
Speaker 6 (39:58):
Be like what happened?
Speaker 1 (40:00):
What which way? Well, for one thing, like the society
that people like you insisted upon this one in which
like value is maximized at all costs. So we we
took windows out of my school that was built in
that brutalist periods because.
Speaker 3 (40:17):
It because like it's like because some like prince bankrupted
their country building this pretty building, and that's why we
don't do that anymore.
Speaker 1 (40:29):
Like you thought, like, yeah, jacked dudes with guns should
run everything started a series of wars that bankrupted those
countries and they had to sell their nice buildings to
the Americans. Why we got the London Bridge, I assume.
Speaker 3 (40:44):
But it's it's definitely all that all in like in
that in that same rough rough Twitter mill you. I mean,
it's certainly now that you've explained all of this at
longhou stuff, it certainly makes sense why they're kind of
fawning over the Barbie movie.
Speaker 6 (40:59):
And I mean very.
Speaker 3 (41:00):
Clearly Ken is going to become one of these like
a memeable characters because of what he does in the film.
It's he's he's going to join the pantheon of like
American Psycho and uh, all.
Speaker 6 (41:11):
Of Ryan Gosling's other roles.
Speaker 5 (41:15):
It is.
Speaker 3 (41:15):
It is fascinating how right Goslin kind of has become
like the literal poster child for much of like the
dissident like anti feminist rite just because of the types
of roles that he's taken.
Speaker 6 (41:27):
But yeah, I mean, it's it's.
Speaker 1 (41:29):
Really questionary tale male actors.
Speaker 3 (41:32):
It certainly makes sense in context of the Barbie Movie
in terms of how they kind of structured all of
the like social critique in that in that movie. But
but yeah, this is very silly. I mean, uh, it's
I'm excited I won't have to hear much more about
like the uh the stunning poetic prose of Bronze Age.
Speaker 2 (41:54):
Perfect. Yeah, fucking the Atlantic every time. Never.
Speaker 1 (41:59):
It's so like weird because there's there's this whole thing
that opens the article where he's talking about how like,
you know, the the first strains of this new anti democratic,
you know, anti liberal thinking in academia came out through
philosophy students who you know, realized that their professors just
took for granted, you know, the the truth about things
(42:20):
like the value of human rights and didn't weren't ready
for their arguments against them. And it was these like
these people who didn't want to be told not to
think in certain ways. No, man, they were assholes. They're
asshole rich kids who needed somebody to hit him in
the fucking face. They need they need a folding chair
deployed on them, Like yeah, yeah, you.
Speaker 2 (42:41):
Got to see.
Speaker 3 (42:42):
I demand to shutdown of all coastal universities until we
figure out what the fuck is going on.
Speaker 1 (42:47):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I'm sorry if you were pretending that
you are, like somehow in the insurgent underground, uh as
the son of an M I T professor, going Tom
I T yourself like you fucking dilat that's all. That's
all this fucker is is a diletant, and that's all
most of the people following are. It's a mix of
dilettants and guys who are going to shoot up walmarts anyway, right, cool.
Speaker 6 (43:13):
Give him a follow, Give a follow.
Speaker 2 (43:15):
Yeah, yeah, I'm checking out activated sleeper and I've learned
a lot already. So oh yeah, yeah, you're getting pilled
by him? Yeah yeah, yeah, pretty much. I you know,
as much as one can be hill by a fourteen
year old. But uh yeah, really interesting stuff here. I
think fair to say that this is an insight into
(43:36):
a world. Oh buddy, fuck me, all right, yeah wait,
we're not talking about that. We are not talking about
his bedroom wall by everyone.
Speaker 1 (43:43):
Oh oh wait, now I got a lotch James, what
did you We can bleep it.
Speaker 6 (43:47):
You have to at least tell us what you Oh wow,
his his pinned.
Speaker 4 (43:52):
It's fucking I'm not sure it's get veteran playing. Yeah,
what's on the veteran. And what looks like is that
a German national about like a German? Is that Imperial Germany?
Speaker 1 (44:05):
Yeah? I think this guy is a kaiser Reich.
Speaker 6 (44:08):
Dude, this is certainly impressive.
Speaker 1 (44:13):
I'm sure.
Speaker 6 (44:13):
I'm sure he's getting all the ladies in there.
Speaker 1 (44:16):
I gotta I gotta show you guys this pinned tweet
and then I'll read it. It's all caps. Let me
tell you how much I want a FED post. There
are a hundred billion neurons within my brain. If a
FED post was written on each and every one those neurons,
it would not equal one billionth of the compulstion I
feel feel the FED post at this micro instant fed post,
(44:37):
FED post that means posting about doing a terrorism So.
Speaker 3 (44:41):
That this is the type of tweet that could either
come from the sun, like like mentally unwell leftist.
Speaker 5 (44:50):
Yeah yeah yeah.
Speaker 2 (44:54):
The flag he has, just to be clear, it's a
franco Is flag of Spain, which, okay, it's something that
good we will have to talk about, which is the
American right has been embracing franco As like based and
good uh for a while now, like as this kind
of returned to Catholic tradition and like it's just anti
(45:14):
woke crusader.
Speaker 6 (45:16):
I do call it.
Speaker 3 (45:17):
The suggestion follows here on Activit Sleepers Page, son Optimist.
Speaker 1 (45:23):
Aleric, the Barbarian Impernter Philippus.
Speaker 6 (45:28):
These people are such birds.
Speaker 1 (45:31):
Here's he's reached a post from Bronze Age Jacob Eurowski.
Jews are like the one ring for politics.
Speaker 3 (45:40):
I think I think, I think I think reached the
I think we reached peak peak.
Speaker 6 (45:47):
I don't think.
Speaker 2 (45:47):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (45:49):
I hope you've all learned a lot from this. Have
a wonderful week, every wonderful week, and funk you for
making me write this to our listeners. It could happen
here as a production of cool Zone Media. For more
podcasts from cool Zone Media, visit our website Coolzonemedia dot com,
(46:09):
or check us out on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,
or wherever you listen to podcasts.
Speaker 3 (46:14):
You can find sources for It could Happen here, updated
monthly at Coolzonmedia dot com slash sources.
Speaker 6 (46:19):
Thanks for listening.
It Could Happen Here News
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Robert Evans
Garrison Davis
James Stout
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