Jane's Revenge

We discuss the new pro-choice direct action group who carried out a Molotov attack on a Wisconsin anti abortion group headquarters.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:05):
If I know one thing about diseases, it's that their
home bodies. No, it's fine, we make it. They just
want to netflix and chill. You just line up the
entire population of the US in a line across the
US and we shoot any deer that tries across the line.
I think we should do the reverse and have deer
shoot people who tried across the line. It's the only
thing that can protect us from the dangerous east. No, No,

(00:28):
that look, look, well, I guess it works in east
and in the west. We have to maintain the right
to arm bears. Yeah, I'm I'm of the opinion, given
how dry it is in New Mexico, that we need
to sink every part of the country east of New
Mexico to give it a coast that can that can
keep it moist. I wonder how much of this is
going to get in the final cut. Well, if you

(00:50):
live east of New Mexico, welcome to the ocean. That's
my suggestion. Um, speaking of people east of New Mexico,
this is it could happen here a podcast where some
of the listeners are east of New Mexico. Even though
I don't recommend that. Um, I'm Robert Evans on on
the call with me is Christopher Wong, Garrison Davis, Sharene,

(01:11):
Lnnie Units, and then our producers Sophie. Today we're talking
about terrorism. Yeah, we can do it in a little
NPR voice. So uh recently, the same week as the
Supreme Court leaked a document stating that they would be
taking out Roe v. Wade and ushering in an era
of theocratic fascism in a number of states. UH, an

(01:34):
individual or individuals unknown in Wisconsin attacked an anti choice
headquarters building with a Molotov cocktail and spray painted graffiti
on the side saying if abortion isn't safe, then you aren't.
Either that same group or individuals claiming to be from them,
UH later reached out to me through an intermediary and
sent a manifesto of sorts about the attack, promising follow

(01:56):
up attacks within thirty days. But they wrote, but they
wrote in cursive, so who can say, who can say
if this actually happened. So we'll talk first. I want
to just go over first what what happened in like
factual terms, and then we'll talk about the discourse around it.
So basically, there's this attack on this um anti choice

(02:18):
like advocacy organizations, headquarters and fucking Wisconsin. UM. It was
seemed to be a pretty good molotov and that, like Garrison,
you and I have watched a number of people failed
to properly utilize. I watched a few people get get ignited.

(02:38):
I've seen a couple of not cops get ignited by
molotsovs UM. They're they're they're not like people can suck
them up easily. Whoever did this did not suck them up.
It was seemed to be at the moment, no one
has been arrested. Now, it's possible by the time this drops,
Wisconsin police will be like, oh no, there was totally
surveillance footage and they fucked up and we just caught them. UM.

(03:00):
But at the moment, it doesn't look like that's the case.
So it looks like this is somebody who carried out
or some buddies, because it's entirely possible is multiple people,
but carry it out UM a very effective like action
that did material damage to UM, part of kind of
the physical infrastructure of the anti choice movement UM and

(03:22):
ended without anyone getting caught. So that's the fact of
the actual attack itself. UM. A person who claiming to
be affiliated with the individuals or group here did this.
Reached out to a source of mind who I'm keeping anonymous,
but somebody who I've known for a while with a
very good track record of being accurate, and said, hey,

(03:45):
these individual slash individuals have a communicate they would like
put out UM and I was sent on a non
files link, which is a link. If you view it
in a normal browser you'll get some fucked up ship.
Don't put it in a normal browser, I specified like
you're supposed to. If you put it in Tour, it
will download a text file, right, UM. And the text
file is the communic A. So using the Tour browser

(04:09):
for that link, you can get a text file in
which they lay out number one. They named themselves UM
and the name they've chosen for their group is Jane's Revenge,
which is a reference to the Jane Collective UM, which
was a pro choice group in the late sixties early
seventies that UM provided women with access to contraception and

(04:30):
abortion illegally. A bunch of them went to jail. Uh
they were pardoned after Roe v. Wade. If I'm not
mistaken or at least the click yeah, yeah, very well timed. UM.
So they're calling themselves Jane's Revenge, and they basically said, hey,
if you are an organization in the anti choice movement,

(04:50):
you have thirty days to close down your operations otherwise
there will be follow up attacks. They specifically noted the
long and it's at this point like a forty years
long history of tear wrist attacks from the anti choice movement,
many of which have assassinated doctors, something like sixteen people
have been killed, UM, dozens of bombs and bombing attempts,
something like a hundred acid attacks. So they made a

(05:13):
note of all that and said that like, basically we
will be UM, we will be responding in kind and
UH attacks after this initial attack will be correspondingly more severe. UM.
They also claimed to have a pretty wide geographic reach,
said they had folks in a number of cities, UM,
and that yeah, there's going to be follow up attacks UM,

(05:33):
and they're prepared to defend their bodily autonomy with violence.
So that's that's the gist of what was claimed in
the communic a UM. In terms of what I think
about its legitimacy, UM, I don't have any reason to
believe they're not representing the individual or individuals who carried
out that attack in Wisconsin, based on the timing of

(05:56):
when the communic was made, and based on the fact
that the community is pretty consistent with what we saw
from the actual action. Right, So, among other things that
you can tell from the physical action that was taken
is that, um, the individual or individuals who did this
were pretty well organized. They carried out a competent action,
and they thought there was a value in very clear

(06:17):
messaging because there's clear messaging surrounding the attack. The communicate
is very clear messaging. It does not sound like a
right winger writing up a fake communicate. It's very um.
It takes great pains to both connect itself to history,
to frame its violence within the context of the violence
perpetuated by the anti choice movement for decades UM, and

(06:39):
just in general, it's the communication seems consistent with the
action that we saw in Wisconsin. Now cannot say, we
cannot say, I cannot say to a statement of certainty
whether or not it's legitimate. One helpful thing they did
is place state that there would be another more attacks
in thirty days. So we're kind of waiting if thirty

(07:00):
days pass and there's never any kind of follow up
attacks by this group, then we can probably assume that
this was either somebody bullshitting or that the heat got
to too much for them and they decided not to
carry out follow up attacks. UM. But we're all kind
of in this holding pattern now to see what happens.
My personal speculation is that UM, they were exaggerating a

(07:22):
number of things. UM. I think that the their claims
about having members in a number of states in a
capacity to strike in a number of states was more
aspirational than literal UM. In that I suspect the people
behind this attack, in this communicate are hoping that by
UM carrying out attacks, they can inspire other people to

(07:42):
carry out attacks and credit it to the same organization, right,
which is not an uncommon tactic in the history of terrorism.
And again, this is terrorism. Like that doesn't mean I
don't think, uh, there have a point or that it's
like fundamentally unjust. Terrorism is just like a set of
tactics that different groups can use, and it can be
ethical or unethical depending on how you you choose to

(08:03):
do that. You can attack purely infrastructure, UM in a
terrorist manner, And I don't think that's necessarily unethical. And
you can also attack civilians um in a terrorist manner,
and I think that is unethical. At this moment, these
people have not done anything I view is inherently unethical.
They burned a building, um, which I think is often
justified and is in this case justified. So that's that's

(08:23):
my opinion on the matter. Let's open it up on
the point you kind of closed with. I mean, yeah,
they showed effective direct action. They did a physical thing.
Maltovs are not the best way to do like to
like arsenal building, but they are good for a very
quick attack. Um. It caused this whole media thing, right,
there's a lot a lot of people talking about it,
then releasing the communicate through someone who can give it

(08:44):
a lot of visibility. Uh, and then by by doing
it with this with this name Jane's revenge and saying
in thirty days there will be more attacks in different cities,
the messages that yeah, like you can One way to
look at this is if if they don't have tons
of like you know, members are allies that they know
across different cities, is that and anyone can do this,

(09:05):
Like anyone can do this and call themselves by that
name and be a part of this larger thing like
it's you if you, if you spread it around, then
that it can become like this, this thing that anyone
can gloam onto. It doesn't need to be you don't
need to be a part of a member of a
specific group. You can just do stuff and release communicates
safely and add add on to the to the to

(09:28):
the specter. Yeah. Um, it's not hard to set up
like a text drop in the same manner that did
they did. It is relatively secure. Like there's no perfect
if you are committing terrorism, there is no perfect manner
to issue a statement. Um, but of the different things
they could have chosen, this is relatively secure, especially doing

(09:49):
it through an intermediary. I haven't had direct contact with
these people, but um, we should probably note that there's
a huge discourse that started before the communic A came
out arguing that this is like a false flag attack. Yeah,
that's yes, that in a long line of calling a

(10:09):
pretty pretty well planned out direct action. When it actually happens,
people will defalse to calling it an op. We're calling
it a false flag from a very people like there's
there's like there's like libs who say, oh, this is
a staged thing to make our movement look bad. There's
tank kis who think it's like the CIA planning something.
There's random other folks who are like, hey, I don't

(10:31):
know if it's legit. I think maybe it's like some
it's a lot of people get verius various justifications for
calling pretty effective acts of direct action UM and questioning
questioning their legitimacy. I think some of this comes from

(10:57):
because there's obviously there's the bad faith elements of this UM,
but I think the good faith folks who questioned it,
there's a lot of learned helplessness. There this idea that
because somebody did carry out a pretty successful direct action
attack that kind of did what its intention was, then
it has to have been the FBI or whoever, right,

(11:18):
because obviously the left could never have pulled off something
as as cunning as throwing a single molotov at a
building and spray painting the side of it, you know, UM.
And I I do think that that's a problem. Whether
or not you think the solution to issues like the
right wing attack on reproductive healthcare come from direct action.

(11:39):
The fact that folks almost can't conceive of effective action
being taken by the left without the FEDS being involved.
Is really an issue. Yeah, and this was a huge
thing during one of the things that we saw there.
There were so many just weird conspiracy theories, and then
the every thing that happened very quickly was people became
convinced almost immediately that any one doing anything was it

(12:01):
was a federal infiltrator. And you've got people, you got
crowds turning people over to the the police. You got people
on Twitter like trying to track down um, like who
was throwing malltops and videos and like one of the
people they caught they turned over the police it turned
out had been had been the girlfriend is someone who
got killed by the cops. And so, I mean the stuff,
this stuff has has, the stuff has real world consequences.

(12:23):
It has already like sent people to jail, it has
it has this normostmobilizing effect of me, I don't remember people.
Two people remember the okay, the two to two big Okay,
the two big Twitter conspiracies were um bricks bricks and
Who's yeah, yeah, yeah, there's hoping that people like people

(12:47):
would see a powers never seen right next to a
next to a construction site, Like, how are all these
pallets of bricks showing up this? There's like a construction
side of block away. You're like, who's distributing the fireworks?
How do these fireworks get here? Never mind June. The

(13:07):
history of like like the FBI, some people will mistakenly
like throw the CIA in there. The CIA doesn't really
tend to do like the domestic facory. Um, they're international facory.
But like, if you look at the history of the
FBI fucking with left wing social movements, it's not by
handing out brick palettes. Yeah, but that's not what they do.
We have a lot of documentation about what they do

(13:29):
and it's not bricks. And if there is some secret
group who's maliciously giving out bricks so people attack, throw
them through windows or throw them at cop cars, like
who cares? Like bricks are getting throw a cop cars.
It doesn't matter where they come from like that, people
are still choosing to do action. Yeah. The best example
of this is is the Russian Revolution n No. Five.

(13:51):
The Russian Revolution of N five was started by a
guy who was a police agent. Like his whole thing
is he was he was he was working to create
like like you is that could be controlled by the state.
An he marched a bunch of people into a square
and the police shot them. And that's how and that's what.
That's literally how the Russian revolutions started. Like it doesn't.
It doesn't like there's there's a there's a point. Okay,
they're they're like, there's two layers of this. One is

(14:13):
that like they're they're almost is never a conspiracy going
on into If the conspiracy is we want to push
people towards doing things, it almost it doesn't. There's a
point at which it stops mattering because a lot a
lot of people forget about atoms rights. When you're talking
about these types of things. Usually the more simple the answer,

(14:33):
the more likely it is. The more the less involved parties,
the more likely the more likely it is. So if
there's a choice between rad people fucking up an anti
choice headquarters versus a government conspiracy to do false league
operations to make the anti choice to make the abortion
movement look bad, like one of those is much more

(14:54):
simple and much more likely, And it's people just deciding
to do stuff because guess what you can you can
actually do that you don't need to allow these these
weird narratives to to like to justify your uncomfortableness at
like at forms of radical direct action, because it's it's
people use that false flag idea, so so they don't
need to actually engage with what direct action will mean

(15:16):
and if it is someone's moral imperative to physically attack
like physical manifestations of these sources of oppression. Yeah, I
think you're right on the money there. I think one
of the things that's most frustrating to me about this
is it kind of suggests that a sizeable chunk of
people who ostensibly consider themselves on the left are like
focusing their time not on doing anything and not on

(15:40):
taking any action to materially change the conditions they're angry
at um, but are instead looking for reasons to disavow
other folks on the left, And that that's like the
primary which is if you again, if you like, look
at what we know Herbert Hoover. Herbert Hoover was saying
about the FBI's co Intel Pro program was the all
of co intel Pro, Right, that's what if That's what

(16:02):
exactly what I was thinking. I'm just like, I feel
like this promotes I don't know a morality like race
or like just like competition where the only thing it
does is just promote in fighting. When you have this,
like you're on your morality horse. But I think if
you actually support real change, you have to come to

(16:26):
terms with like you have to do illegal things and
like holding on too, like these made up laws that
someone made up about like how to achieve change is useless.
And there's I mean, like dividing up a side that's
supposed to be going for the same thing. Like that's exactly. Yeah,
it's just it's a missing point and people don't really Yeah,

(16:47):
if you look at the right, you've got all these
folks who were like legal and whatnot, uh proponents of
of ending reproductive health care access and any of the
folks who are doing repeated acts of terrorism. And the
folks who were on the legal side of things didn't
disavow those people. They were often affiliated with churches that

(17:07):
did shoot like auction off the possessions of like extremists
who had murdered doctors and ship like they were like
even the most they would do is just not directly
talk about those people. They didn't disavow them. They didn't
like attack it because they understood that a diversity of
tactics was going to be how they achieved their goals.

(17:28):
That it was a mix of pushing for these legal
changes and carrying out so many terroristic attacks that it
frightened people away from supporting um abortion service providers and
other kind of reproductive health care service providers. US difference
between the right and the left, though, like Democratic Republicans
are really good at uniting on this big picture, and

(17:48):
I feel like Democrats are not. I feel like they
just uh, I don't know. It's too there's too much
in fighting, and that's why it's always fractured. Part of
it is that on the Republican side you have Republicans
and you have the far right who are also Republicans.
And even though a lot of folks on the far
right bitch about the centrists in their up like the

(18:09):
folks who are closer to the center, they all get
in line for really radical stuff, Like the center of
the Republican Party always yields to the radicals, whereas Democrats
do not acknowledge leftists as having anything to do with
with the Democratic Party or democratic politics other than the
yell at them when they don't vote. Um. And on

(18:30):
the other hand of things, there's a lot of folks
on the left who hate liberals more than they hate fascists,
you know. Um, and it's it's I think one of
those is a bigger problem than the other. I think
that the failure of the democratic establishment to like deal
with the left at all, um or make any kind
of progress, uh, that could be seen as as actually

(18:52):
left wing actually much more um. Yeah. But but I
think I think there's they're they're I think they're structural
reasons for that, which is okay. If if you look
at what is the basis of conservative alliance, right, if
you're a conservative, you know, okay, if if you're from
this sort of like moderate business wing at the party,
if you're from the fascist wing at the party, right,
you can have one judge who gives both of you

(19:13):
the things that you want, right, Because if you're if
you're like the Koke brothers, the thing that you want
is the regulation. Right, you want to be able to
just like dump poison into the environment. If you're ON,
If you're ON, if you're an evangelical, the thing that
you want is uh, you know, to no one can
ever have an abortion again. And you know if if
if you're like a fascist, I don't know, maybe you
want like we don't give food to immigrant children anymore,

(19:36):
so they start to death. And one judge can give
you all of those same things because the the sort
of the the class and social issues of the Republican
base can all be fused together without harboring each other.
But the problem with with with this with the Democratic
Party is that like the Democratic Party's basis is like
what's left of the union movement, but then also like

(19:59):
a bunch of corporations to banks and like weapons manufacturers
and stuff. But then also like a bunch of angry
students and also like a bunch of people from different
minority groups, and all of these people like have different interests,
and you know, in the Democratic Party ultimately like the thing,
the thing that they care about is keeping capitalism going.
And you know, if if they have to like if

(20:20):
that means that yeah, I mean, well okay, if if
your things you want to keep capital isn't going, like
of course you're just gonna throw your left wing out
to the wolves, right like it. It makes sense for
them to do this because because the part of their
base that actually matters. Isn't like the labor movement, it's
like it's Goldman Sachs. I think that one of the

(20:40):
other things that that causes people to have this like
immediately anyhow someone does someone does. Like people remember like
when when Nancy Pelosi's driveway got graffitied, like that was
like that's never never, that's horrible. Don't graffiti and Nancy
pelosis driveway, that's evil? Yeah, like it's nicest you did

(21:01):
nicest there. Yeah, everyone lost in mind and was like, oh,
this is obviously a false flag, and it's like what
you know. But the reason they do this is because
they have they have like democrat optics brain where like
instead of anything being about politics, every everything is just
about optics and optics and how does it look? How
does it look? How does it look? Like? The only
people who care about this are like weird pundits. But

(21:24):
because because everyone's so sort of absorbed in like the
Twitter media spear, like they think that like the actual
general public cares about the things that pundits care about
because the only thing they're seeing is pundits writing angry articles.
But like nobody cared like zero people, especially the graffiti thing.
Because man, people like dissect how someone sprayed an anarchist a.

(21:44):
It's like if you're not aware, like a chunk of
the discourse, are e it being a false flag or whatever?
Was that the Yeah, but that they did they did
as they did like the key a inside the inside
the circle. Um. And it's wild because I mean spray painting.

(22:06):
What they said like if if abortions aren't safe, then
you are either in cursive is a genius move. It's
great because if you spray painted in some like random
punk fond that's easy to be ignored like oh, it's
just people doing like whatever. People pray many stuff, but
doing it like methodically in cursive is is actually a
really good choice because you're like, oh, it's like we're
dealing with adults. It's like like the type of things

(22:28):
that people will go through their minds when they look
at it is great. Um. And it's just a weird
denial to assume that no one who takes radical direct
action whatever write in cursive. It's just it's like the
most the most brainworms thing. And it's also like it's
also very clear, like like okay, so I am very
bad at spray painting, right, but like I have I
have used a spray paint can and well, this isn't

(22:52):
I was I was I was making I was making
banners for stuff. So this wasn't even like this wasn't
even crimes. But this is just like regular spray painting.
It's like that is hard, Like writing that incursive and
having it look that nice with the spray bait can
is like difficult, which you know, if if if you
think about this about five seconds, this makes it more
likely that has actually left as doing this because it's

(23:12):
like what, okay, hold on, So the anti abortion people
have one person who's really really good at graffiti and
this person that they've beside. Yeah, they anchist school and
secret to like learning. It's like it's nonsense, but it's
like people. People just people want everything to sort of
like like And I think this is the other angle

(23:33):
of this is that people think that like have this
wild overassessment of the capacity of the state. Yeah, and
they think that anytime something looks slightly weird, it's like, oh,
it must be the state. Like like one of the
one of the things that happened with with the Brooklyn
shooting tube was like you had all these people that
there's a tweet going around that was like, Oh, the
cameras just happened. All all the cameras, all the cameras

(23:55):
in New York were working except the exact one that
would have caught the shooter. And this is this is
like you want circled around this And everyone was like,
oh my god, this is a false flag. And then
know it turned out that like the guy had literally
called the police, but the police were so incompetent that
like other people like saw him on the street and
got to him before like the cops did. And and
like the camera it turned out wasn't even like the

(24:16):
camera that was out wasn't even the camera that like
like they had him on camera. It was a different camera.
But it was like everyone everyone just immediately has this
like conspiracy brain thing where they see like one thing
out of context that looks slightly weird and they go,
oh my god, this whole thing is is is a
state like c A like so depressing. It's so depressing

(24:37):
because it's such it's so depowering your specific You're like
it ties into the learned helpless this thing that Robert mentioned,
like you're convincing yourself that we don't have power to
change things that we cannot take any physical action to
change things. UM. And that's not great mentality to have
if you want to improve the world or if you

(24:57):
want to if you want to destroy the things that
harve you, UM, you do. You don't want to fall
into that that specific like I don't have any power
mindset because you turns out you can do stuff. Things happened,
you can. People threw a ball off and broke windows
and cool people sometimes do cool things, yes, just like

(25:20):
the past people stuff Yes. Plug Sophie, Sophie, Sophie, Sophie, Sophie.

(25:42):
One of the things that's interesting to me, and it
it might hold some lessons for folks thinking about radical
direct action and what gets attention and what doesn't. So
obviously this attack has garnered a lot of national attention,
right the fact that I think it's because there was
both an attack and a message was another attack. And

(26:02):
it's not a that this had anything to do with
the pro choice movement, UM, but I suspect it does.
The Attorney General Virginia Jason Miarez UM on the tenth
of May there was a someone shot into his office,
like a bullet was found in the office. Um, it

(26:23):
was probably fired when no one was there. We don't
really know more than that. It is unclear as to
whether or not this is involved with things. But three
days before the shot was fired into his office, he
had basically Catholic groups had been planning big masses to
celebrate the leaked draft opinion, and protesters had been organizing
to protest the Catholic masses, and he had threatened to

(26:44):
charge people who protested masses. Um, because he believes the
right to freedom of religion trump's the right of free speech.
So it's kind of like a fucked up situation. People
got angry at me ares um. And it seems kind
of noteworthy that someone shot into this office three days
after this. I mean, also, I mean there's been a
lot of stuff, like on on May eight, there was

(27:07):
an attack on the organ Rights to Life building. Yes, yes, yes,
there was certainly a pro choice Yeah, yeah, there was there.
There was There was at least two multop cocktails throne
and there was a break and inside. So it's like,
you can do things. You don't have no power, like
you can physical you can interact with the politics in

(27:28):
a physical way. Um, people do interact with politics in
a physical way. Yeah, and and people people have this
assumption that like this is going to be incredibly unpopular.
And again I want to point out burning the third precinct.
How to higher approve of rating that both presidential candidates,
which I mean I I again tend to advocate in
we should elect the burning of the third Precinct in

(27:49):
Minneapolis as president. Look every look, the way that works
is the burning of the precinct takes office and then
every day you burn another precinct. That's so that you
can actually have a president. Well, that is how you
fill the cabinet. Yeah, there needs to yeah, yeah, yeah,
you have to eat well. Yeah, all all all the
staff positions filled with the health and the Health and

(28:12):
Human Services Secretary will be the West Los Angeles police
station and so forth. Yes, I'm really excited to see
which one gets picked for the Housing Secretary. I am
just on my on my toes, just exciting. Democracy can
be quite far. Electoralism has some has some really cool,
really cool points. Yeah, hey, you you too could go

(28:32):
in front of the National Labor Relations Board, and the
National Labor Relations Board is just seven is just seven
on fire police stations, charred really win. So yeah, we
just we just want we wanted to at least talk
about this because if whenever a cool thing happens and
a large swath of of of people who are ostensibly

(28:53):
leftists or even or even anarchists default to calling anything
cool of all flag or up, it's like, well, like
what do you want? Like you want people just to
stay at home all the time and not do anything? Like,
what's what's the end goal here? If you're calling everything
that happens enough. Yeah, and also just like if you're

(29:14):
going to if you're worried about ops and thinking of
suggesting that something might be what is your line? Is
it just that people broke a law? Are you saying
that if people do illegal things, that's always like a
government op? Because that doesn't seem like yourself an anarchist,
doesn't seem like a good strategy. Yeah, especially when it

(29:36):
comes to reproductive rights, like you're gonna have to do
illegal things if people are gonna have to break exactly, Yeah,
pick and choose. I'm a hundred percent convinced that like
all of these people, if they'd seen John Brown would
have been completely convinced the John Brown, Oh John Brown
was for sure the FBI. He founded it the original

(29:56):
op John Brown. I think that there's an aspect there
of also like okay, if if if you're on Twitter right,
mostly are not doing politics, and the thing that you're
actually doing on Twitter is trying to feel smarter for
everyone else. And if you're the person that's like, oh, hey,
look all these people believe that this thing wasn't an

(30:18):
OP or like oh I yeah, it's like and it's like, yeah, okay,
you you very quickly like spiral into just like every
all all the all the sheeple tours smart fight this suspicious.
You're like it's it's like it's it's just a bad
like looking at an element of event and going oh,

(30:39):
this is weird, but in a way that is oh hauh,
isn't this weird? It must be the government, Like that's
that's just a bad way of thinking. Like in in
the mirror hours, in the mirror minutes after anonymous people
broke into the Portland Plice Association headquarters back in I
think was July, just in mirror hours, people were calling

(30:59):
it a false flag, that the police were dressed up
the black block the people and started protesting the FEDS yes,
they alleged that this was like I guess the FBI
or Homeland Security trying to get protesters angry at the
cops again, which is I mean, for one thing, if
actually happened, if there were to be a point where

(31:22):
the left wing had the FBI fighting or the FBI
or Homeland Security whatever, fighting with local police over who
was getting protested, that's a win, that's a that's a big,
solid capital dub for the But people like the FBI
is a block breaking into the police union building and
trying to light it on fire, you're like, well doing

(31:44):
doing less physical, let's be honest, doing less damage to
that police union building that I have seen my friends
do when attempting to deep fry French fries, Like I
have watched people do more damage to their living rooms
than that protested to the people. Astonishing because like there
was so many people at that act, so many people
using the moment to to actually gain like physical political

(32:05):
power for a brief a brief moment um, and to
take that away from them is just as a bizarre impulse,
and I would like to see it end, especially as
we're going to see, hopefully see that people will realize
that that that direct action is going to become more
and more important for securing your personal rights and securing

(32:26):
your personal freedom. And also I would say these people, Okay,
if you want to be completely sure if that something
is happening is not an OP, do it yourself. Stop
yelling about it on Twitter. Do it yourself. Then you'll
know it's not an OP as a general rule. As
a general rule, look at France. What do the French
do whenever something they consider a right gets taken away

(32:48):
from them? They burn downtown Paris down, They light banks
on fire. They like Paris. Everyone who has gets selected
to a position of power in France knows that if
they cross certain lines, the capital will be ungovernable. Um
and there's a reason why French people have such quality healthcare.

(33:09):
Well with with with that note, I mean, I can't
believe we're ending on the note be be like the French.
I just is the friendship made a lot of good calls,
a lot of bad ones to not trying to whitewash France,
but there's a there's a number of things they got
spot on. Anyway, we will we will be counting down
the days until that thirty day marker, and who knows,

(33:31):
maybe other attacks will happen with people also calling themselves
Jaan's revenge because and obviously this is something that we
as journalists have no opinion on one way or the other.
We're just reporting, just pure reporting. Anyway, Listen to listen
to people who did cool stuff, to to hear about
the Jaane collective, and maybe also recreationally read about what

(33:54):
different civilian groups are doing in Ukraine and the degree
to which of wide variety of incredibly available tools um
can can be repurposed in neat ways. All Right, I
think I think that I think that's the stude. That's
a good d It could happen here as a production

(34:15):
of cool Zone Media. For more podcasts from cool Zone Media,
visit our website cool zone media dot com, or check
us out on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts,
or wherever you listen to podcasts. You can find sources
for It could Happen here, updated monthly at cool zone
Media dot com slash sources. Thanks for listening,