Filmmaker Series: Cole Stratton on The Manchurian Candidate

Cole is back to dive into a four-part series on director John Frankenheimer with his classic political thriller, The Manchurian Candidate.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to Movie Crush, a production of I Heart Radio.

(00:30):
Hey everybody, and welcome to Movie Crush Friday. I guess
what is now a filmmaker series with Cole Stratton. Cole,
what did you just drink? What was that? Let's see,
I'm sweet and purely iced tea. It looks like Jack
Daniels totally. It's really black Bottle that was drinking a

(00:50):
handle in the morning. So yeah, Cole was back, which
I'm very excited about to have you in the regular rotation.
And we email back and forth about just some different
ideas for some kind of four to five episode series
and you threw out some filmmakers, you threw out sports movies,
you threw out a bunch of cool ideas, and we

(01:10):
zeroed in on John Frankenheimer. Yeah, oddly my favorite director.
It's weird, like the stuff that was my favorite or
the things that people would never ever associate me with,
like political thrillers and movies and searching for Bobby Fisher,
right exactly. It's like you're working comedy, right, Yeah. But
for some reason, uh, Frankenheimer was a huge deal to me,
coming like working at the video stores and coming through

(01:33):
film school and stuff like that. I just loved him,
so I tend to gravitate towards his movies. Well, let's
unpack that a little bit and talk about the man first,
because when you first threw that out, I was like,
oh yeah, totally Frankenheimer. And then I was looking over
his list of films and it's like, I don't I
think I just had him confused in my head with
other people. Um, I don't, maybe mke tiernan. I don't

(01:56):
know why, but when I saw the film list, there
was a bunch of in my head. And see, yeah,
he he worked a lot. I mean he came out
of um like live TV dramas like Playhouse ninety and
things like that. He was an assistant director to Sidney
Lament back then, which is hilarious because those two are
two of my favorite directors. So uh yeah, like he

(02:16):
just he's just he's kept making stuff and making stuff.
And there's a lot of stinkers in there too, but
there's a lot of great things as well. What's the
name is stinker? Oh boy? I landed Dr Moreau him,
But he says he himself like he was brought into that.
He says, it's the worst thing ever, he and Val
Kilmer did not get along. He famous, He said, Will

(02:38):
Rodgers did not never met Val Kilmer, um, because he's
met met at like every man he's ever met. Um,
so that it was just like a ship show. Yeah,
I don't think that was gonna be laid at his feet.
I mean that was just a notorious, uh terrible production. Yeah.
And Reindeer Games was one of his last movies, and
that's a it's not very it's kind of a historically

(03:02):
bad flop of a movie. And there's others mixed into
but he's just made a lot of really great action
movies and political thrillers. Yeah, I mean he came he's
he's known for the political thriller, which is one of
my favorite genres as well. Um, and he kind of
came up during the sort of peak of the Cold
War was when he first got going, which, Um, do

(03:23):
you know much about the guy and like why this
genre appealed to him so much? Um, I mean I
definitely know a bit about him. He Um, I don't
really know exactly why he ended up doing that, like
he I mean, obviously he was he came to prominence
in the like late fifties release sixties, so the atmosphere
in the country and in the world in general was
very politically charged. H The movie We're gonna talk about

(03:47):
came out in sixty two during the Cuban missile crisis, So, um,
I think he just always kind of gravitated towards that.
And he also was like a guy that a lot
of actors like Snatra, Bert Lancaster, people like that would
just bring in because I mean Lancaster said like, he's
a bit of a horror but he'll do what I
want basically about him. So yeah, like he I don't

(04:10):
I don't know why he gravitated towards it, but he
definitely made a mark in it. Yeah. Well the I mean,
first up, Um, I think we've settled on the four
which was I just gonna give you Carte blunch there
because he's your guy. Uh. And I think I've only
seen of those four films Ronan and I only saw
that once. Yeah, that Ronan was definitely a return to

(04:33):
form for me. I remember seeing that and it's being
like blown away, Like that's weird too. Is like I'm
not into cars. I'm not into car racying. My whole
thing with the car is like does it have a
good stereo and air conditioning. I'm good, Um, like that's
all I need. But for some reason, like his car chases,
like he's one of the best at that, and Ronan
and Grand Prix and much of other stuff too, Like

(04:53):
he's really good at lensing action in a way that's exciting,
but also you can see what the hell is going on,
which is huge to me because so many action movies
nowadays are like they cut so fast you can't tell
what's going on, Like I don't know who to root for.
I mean, that was my biggest problem with uh. I
think it's quantum of soulis there's that like Chase seen
at the beginning where they're jumping on top of like

(05:15):
the awnings and stuff like that too, and Bond and
the other guy are wearing clothing it's roughly the same,
and I'm like, I don't know if I should be
rooting for him to catch him right now or if
he's like I don't understand when they're in the car,
Like it's that's a huge thing for me. I like
to be able to track the action and have a
feel more realistic, which I think Frank and Hammer did
a really good job with Yeah, that's become a trend.

(05:37):
A negative trend I think in filmmaking is unfollowable action sequences.
It's really annoying. Yeah, And I think it's more thrilling
when the camera just sits there and it's back and
you actually see the hell's going on or it feels
more raw and real Like that's more exciting to me
than something that's so sensationalized, um that it's beyond belief.

(05:59):
I mean obvious. There's things to say about things like
Fast and the Furious whatever like that that are over
the top on purpose and it's completely ridiculous. But um, yeah,
I find the action more exciting when you can follow
it and it feels a little more like it's really happening. Well,
and a couple of trends I think um made it
tougher to follow, which was I mean, I guess handheld
isn't a trend, but it's always been around, but using

(06:22):
handheld for action, and then couple that with the weird
frame rate thing that kind of came in vogue. Uh,
those two things combine just make it really tough. I think.
I mean, I like Paul green Grass as a director,
but his stuff is like you gotta sit in the
back of the theater and take a drama I mean
pill because so handheld to the point of like, you know,

(06:43):
I get it, but you don't have to hand hold
every shot of everything. Yeah, I need to get my bearings.
You know, I'm not on a boat, right, And you
can still uh sort of give that energy or or
dictate that energy to the audience without making breething so
herkey jerky, yeah exactly. So we are starting off with

(07:04):
the Manchurian candidate from a movie that I again got
wrong in my head. I think I get this mixed
up in my brain with three days of the Condor
and I expected, uh, I guess color and something a
little more contemporary. And then when that beautiful black and

(07:26):
white came on the screen, Um, I had to adjust
my backlighting on the television very quickly because I try
and match it a little bit. Oh, here comes to
my daughter. You want to come say hi? Did she
come in last time? I think she did briefly. Yeah,
it's like that. It's like the Hitchcock cameo. You wanna
say hi to Cole, Hey there to see you. How

(07:51):
are you doing all right? This is gonna be a
brief cameo, Mr Hitchcock. I know I gave you per
mission to come down here occasionally, but could you just
say hi, and by all right, come on out with you?
Out with you? I gotta continue, please, I know, I'm sorry.

(08:17):
I know that hurt your feelings. Feelings are made to
be hurt. Are you gonna sit there? Huh? All right,
hold on, let me officially break here. Okay, So I'm
sure this is some kind of awkward transition because that

(08:37):
actually took more work than usual to get her out
of here. So sorry about that. Uh so, yeah, manchuring candidate.
I changed the movie background my back ladding on my
TV kind of too, hopefully sort of enhanced the movie.
And boy, that black and white with this that really
bright white backlight just looks so good. Screenshot. Even he

(08:59):
kept working in black and white until sixty six, that's
when his last one was Seconds was his last one
he did in black and white, and then for Grand
Prix went in color and never went back. But he
definitely worked in black and white a lot longer than
a lot of fell other filmmakers did at the time. Yeah,
that's a cool decision. I'm a big fan of Black
and White and it it just looks so good on
a good TV. Um, Frank Sinatra getting to see him.

(09:22):
You know, I haven't seen him in a ton of movies.
I think I saw Oceans eleven and um, I haven't
seen enough movies from this era. But Sinatrass he just
has a present studny he does. He's a movie star,
but he's actually a good actor too. I think that's
what people miss out on is you know, he's got
the persona of you know, he was a giant star

(09:44):
in every medium at the time too, and connected and
all that stuff too. Um, but he's actually a really
really fine actor. And I think this is the best
thing he's ever done. And I think he he believed
that as well. Yeah, he's on record it's kind of
saying this is the best thing he's done. And uh,
I know that. I'm sure you know the story. But
he kind of oddly bought the rights to this film

(10:06):
and kind of kept it under lock and key for
many years, isn't that right? Yeah, he shut it down
because it came out, Like John F. Kennedy was a
big fan of Like he helped get the movie made.
United Artists didn't really want to make it, um, because
it's very you know, it's I don't know what the
audience is for. This is very politically charged. It's you know,
obviously it's it's fairly liberal and his leanings. I guess

(10:27):
you'd say, um, but Sinatra is a big fan of that.
You took it to you A they weren't really crazy about.
And he got JFK to call you a there to
say I want to do this. Who's gonna play the
mother or whatever? And because the president endorsed it, you
a went ahead and made it. Uh, who are you
going to cast as a mother? That's my bad, Kennedy.

(10:48):
He better be a wicked good actor. You just have
to start every sentence with, um, So, who's the other actor?
Who's the guy who plays the lead? Uh? Laurence? Right?
And did you know the little tidbit about his daughter
in real life? Not so good? I'm glad I can
surprise you with something on this. Um. His daughter in

(11:11):
real life was Domino Harvey, the bounty hunter on whom
the movie Domino was based. That flop follow up by
Richard Kelly was that one of his movies was that?
Was that a Richard Kelly movie. I think it was.
I think it's what he did after like Donnie Darko

(11:32):
or something. I could be totally wrong on this, but
I had to look it up. Oh interesting. Um, yeah,
I knew it wasn't supposed to be very good movie.
But yeah, his daughter in real life was a bounty
hunter and she very sadly suffered from addiction and died.
I think overdosedin died from using drugs. But yeah, this
guy has is someone I haven't seen a lot either,

(11:55):
but he's got a somewhat stiff but big screen presence
as well. I think. Yeah. By the way, I just
looked it up, Richard Kelly wrote Domino Tony Scott directly. Okay,
so there we go sort of right. Um, Yeah, Lawrence
Harvey is actually really good actor. I think that was
part of this character was to be like, there's this

(12:15):
whole sequence in it where he talks when he gets drunk,
and he talks about how lovable he was at this
one time in this relationship. But his character is so
completely unlikable and unlovable and like, you know, hates his mom,
hates his situation, and you know that's the whole thing
about the brain watching and stuff too. Is is all
his his uh troopmates and stuff our program to say

(12:41):
this thing about him, which is you could never be
true because he's so the opposite of that. Yeah, and
to be fair, he hates his mom for a good reason.
The great Angela Lansbury. To see her in this kind
of role was really pretty fantastic. If you are surprised
by this movie, like I was, uh, never seen her

(13:02):
go dark like this, and boy she was. She was good. Yeah,
it's to me, it's my favorite villain performance in any
movie because it's so so You don't know that first
and form. I don't think I was spoiling anything. You've
had sixty years to watch this movie before or whatever,
but you know the fact that, like she she's so
good and so cool and controlling and this whole thing.

(13:26):
And she wasn't the first choice. Uh frank Sinatra wanted
Lucille Ball to play the role. Oh wow, And Frankenheimer
had to fight for her to do it because she
had done a movie with frankenheimmer right before this called
All Fall Down with Warren Beatty and even Re Saint
and Karl Malden. It's really really good movie. Too, and
Angelasbury was in that so he was like, I think
she's right for this and convinced them all to do it.

(13:48):
And thank god because it's she was nominated for an
Oscar for it. It's such a good performance. Yeah, she's
fantastic and you're right, and that you don't sort of
get the big reveal uh until the end that she
is actually sort of the American Uh. I mean, what
do you what do you call her? Like a sleeper agent?

(14:08):
Pretty much sleeper agent, So you don't really learn that.
But um, previous to that moment, she's still awful and
she's still this sort of behind the scenes puppeteer. Um.
For her husband, who was played by James Gregory. He
was fantastic as well, so good, such a good blow hard. Yeah. Yeah,
And it's interesting to see this movie, um and the

(14:31):
politics of it, uh just sort of I imagine there
are various points in history there where this movie was
pretty relevant. Yeah, And it's weird that so many years
later that it feels, especially now in the last couple
of years, like so many parallels to what's been going
on in our country that you know, I'm not a

(14:52):
political person, really, I tend to like, I have anxiety
issues and that just like really puts me on edge
even more so I try to like just associate myself
with it as much as like hand. But there's so
many parallels to this of the Soviets having a hand
and our election process, and it's just so creepy. And
the fact that like the main candidate, James Gregory's character

(15:14):
Island is just such a like it has absolutely no
he's a tool, Like he's he's completely vapid and stupid
and dumb and being manipulated by everyone around him. Yeah,
like it just yeah, it's just creepy as hell to me,
honest it is. And and he is a total uh
tool in the sense as of an implement, not like

(15:35):
a frat boy um. But he's so easily manipulated, but
still is so comfortable getting in front of a microphone
and just parroting whatever he's being told. It's almost like
he is brainwashed as well at times, right, I mean honestly,
like he is the Manchurian candidate really, like that is

(15:58):
who he is in a sense that like he's the
one that they're trying to get put into the White
House and all that stuff too. And because of all
the brainwashing, so um, and I just I think that
there's not a lot of humor in this movie, but
there's some in choice spots. And he has one of
my favorite things, which is he's constantly waffling on the
number of communists in the party, throwing numbers out, and

(16:20):
he gets really upset and he finally says angel Lands
brad Eleanor like, come on, can we just settle on
a number? And he's hitting ketchup out of a bottle,
and of course the next scene cuts straight to there
are fifties seven, Like it's so good it is, And
that's sort of a funny. I mean, this movie is
a satire in some ways too, or at least it
dabbles in there, like I don't think you can look

(16:41):
at a joke like behind fifty seven joke without it
clearly being satire of how just I don't know how
easily politics can be perverted totally, And that's still relevant today.
We still have ketchups, so you know, he was a visionary.
It's funny, right when they honed in on that bottle,

(17:04):
I was like, oh, yeah, it's it's gonna be fifty
seven for sure, and this is like smash cut fifty
seven Communists so good, and then that scene just kind
of phades out in a cacophony. It's literally just like
here's the here's the punge line. Let's move on. Yeah,
let's let's talk a little bit about and we'll get
into you know, we'll jump all over the place as

(17:24):
usual and talk about more of the acting roles. But
I want to talk a little bit about the just
the look of the movie. Um, aside from the beautiful
black and white, you've got some really just uh top
quality filmmaking going on with the use of deep focus
uh sort of a law citizen King. They do that
great deep focus shot a couple of times, which is
one of my favorite things that you don't see a

(17:45):
lot anymore. Oh yeah, fully, I mean there's the shots
are very carefully composed. You can tell. Um there's some
brilliant ones too. There's like the other Senator, like the
kind of hero senator in a sense, when he's talking
to Laurence Harving a flashback in the kitchen, there's these
wings behind him. It's like an evil thing, but it's
framed in a way that looks like he's an angel.

(18:07):
It's such a cool thing. And then later on there's
a similar shot, but Laurence Harvey's way underneath the wings
or like it's above him, like it's looking over him. Um, yes,
it's It was actually nominated. It was nominated for two
Oscars for angel Lance Brand also for editing, which is
great too. Yeah, yeah, I could totally see that. Um.
The other great standout visual sequence for me was when um,

(18:32):
in the in the press conference, when the senator is
sort of making that first accusation and Angela Lansbury sort
of in the wings and the crowd of the people,
and the way it's shot, it's what you're seeing on
these television monitors is playing out in real time right
behind them, And like, I don't know that I've ever

(18:52):
seen anything quite like that. To me, that like I
feel like that came out of his live TV background
in a sense that uh, he they basically like would
shoot plays live. That's kind of what that was back then,
Playhouse ninety or whatever. So in a sense that's what
he would be looking at. He would be seeing the
actors do this play and then he's looking at his
monitor or whatever. So I think it probably just kind

(19:14):
of came out of that as an idea for the shot,
and yeah, it's super cool. Yeah, it's one of my
favorite sequences of the movie. And just the controlled chaos
of that room. Uh, I mean it's not like hundreds
of people, but there's the way they make movies these
days is just I feel like you don't get a

(19:35):
lot of great stuff like this where you pack a
room with you know, a hundred people and and just
let this sort of chaos be what it is and
just capture it all on film. It really works. Yeah,
And honestly, like to me, the best shot sequence in
the whole thing is the brainwashing sequence when the camera

(19:55):
just keeps like revolving and rotating and going back and
forth from the old ladies giving the hydrangea lecture all
the way had out of Storm, which George rod took
that dialogue from an actual transcript of like a seed
meeting or something um and then it keeps rotating back
and forth between like the communist leaders and stuff and

(20:16):
what it really is happening, and the dialogue switching back
and forth, like it's really amazing. And Sinatra at the
time like he was kind of, you know, very much
in control of things in a lot of ways, and
he like wanted to see, uh like a see what
it was gonna look like at the end before he left.
They really quickly edited together what's gonna look like and
that's actually what they ended up using. Yeah, he was

(20:39):
known as one take Sinatra. Um. Of course he was
really like he wanted to just get it done and
get out. Like, he didn't do multiple takes that often
unless they really needed Almost every almost everything is that
he's in his a first take scene almost everything. Wow,
that's cool to know, and that doesn't surprise me either.
Frank seems like the kind of guy that doesn't suffer
the pits of a film set. Nope, I wish there

(21:02):
was more like him, you know what I mean, keep
it moving, And I guess that's how Eastwood shoots, Like
that's why he does a million movies and puts up
one of years. Like he sets it up, he does
one or two takes, he moves on. Yeah, I've heard
I've heard some stories about Eastwood sets and just how
great they are. No yelling, no like I think all
the they have very specific walkie talkie rules, which sounds silly,

(21:24):
but have you ever been on a film set, just
the hysteria that goes on with the walkie talkies can
can create this anxiety that he just doesn't want around,
right you know. Yeah, and Clint can call the shots
like that super cool. Um Yeah, but Frank definitely was
like in charge of all that kind of stuff and
movie stuff forward. He actually got hurt on this film,

(21:46):
um in a way that like his pinky has bent,
which if you see later interviews, for the rest of
his life from that from the karate fight sequence, which
is great, which is so ridiculous, but when he breaks
the board with his hand, it like broke his finger,
but they didn't have time to like let it heal
properly or whatever and put it in a splint or

(22:07):
whatever because they just needed to shoot the rest of
the movie at because they shot like thirty something days
or whatever, so it just never healed correctly. So he's
kind of hurt him for the rest of his life.
And you know, you could see it like he puts
a ring out or whatever to kind of draw attention
away from it. Yeah, that sequence is pretty fun. It's
um it's borderline Clusseau and and Cato evidently was the

(22:31):
first like karate scene in a major movie because it's
before the whole like kung fu crazy stuff of the
seventies happened and stuff like sixties. So it's I mean,
it's it's so ridiculous. It's cool, but it's also ridiculous.
You get why Henry Silva's character would do it, but like,
why the hell would Sinatra be doing karate as well? Yeah,

(22:52):
and we should go ahead and mention here. Uh, it
is not lost on us that this is a time
in Hollywood where they cast uh people of different races
to play the wrong race. And I don't think there
is there a true Asian actor in the movie. They
think the guy that played the doctor Yan Low, okay,

(23:13):
but other than that, I don't know. Henry Silva is
like Sicilian and Spanish, right, so that doesn't really match, right, Um,
But yeah, I mean, you know, nineteen two, so not exactly. Um.
Let's go back to that sequence though, the brainwashing sequence.
If you've if you're listening and you haven't seen this movie,

(23:35):
it is a sequence where we first sort of see
the group, the squad of soldiers uh being brainwashed or
having been brainwashed, and this is sort of a an
exhibition of like, look, what we've done with these men. Um,
but the way they do it is in their minds

(23:56):
and the soldier's minds. There at a garden club meeting
getting like you said, this lecture on hygiene fun with hydranges.
And if you've never seen this movie before, it's very
jarring because they don't let you know what's going on.
It just sort of cuts back and forth between these
two things and you're left to figure it out, which
I think is the exact right way to do it,

(24:17):
but it adds a really kind of strange, surrealist bent
to it. I think, oh fully, yeah. I mean that
they're they're brainwatched. I think that they're just waiting out
a storm. That's why they're there. They're having to like
sit there and they're all bored to tears by this
U and then it's just it's really it's dark as
hell that scene. I mean, the fact that they basically
the other communists people demand that they demonstrate that Lawrence

(24:40):
Harvey is indeed tool that they can use to carry
out violence. And uh, just you know, he has kills
two of his troopmates or troopmates. That's not the hard
word people from the same uh from the military group
of his um in weird ways. It's just I don't know,
it's really it's really dark. Yeah, we're too we're clearly

(25:01):
too peace nick liberals that can't even come up with
the word squad, squad, battalion. There you go, that's probably
what it is, you know, the group of guys who
go in and soldier fight, do all that stuff exactly. Um,
you've also got some cool Uh. The way they sort

(25:24):
of bring the story to the to the audience is
not on the nose, Like I said, You're kind of
left to figure that part out. You're left to figure
out these recurring dreams that keep happening with Frank Sinatra's character,
and uh, who's the other guy, Al Melvin his character

(25:44):
or that's the character's name, So you don't really know
what's going on. You're kind of piecing it together. And
I like how I felt confused at times, if that
makes any sense, Yeah, totally. I mean I think the
purpose the idea was that the audience will be as
disoriented as you know, as Laurence Harvey is, as a
Sinatra is trying to like figure things out as it

(26:04):
goes along. Um. And I think they do a good
job of explaining it eventually but not having like, you know,
so many monologue like a bond villain or something. Yeah,
I think it plays out in a good way. No,
I think you're right, because I think it's revealed sort
of at the end of Act one, or I guess
that that's the first plat point is that it's not

(26:26):
a shared dream, uh, and that he really did kill
these two soldiers. He doesn't realize it yet, but he
has really killed these guys in real life. Yeah. That's
what's like scary about the whole thing, is like he's
meant to carry out these awful acts and doesn't know
that he's done them, doesn't remember them. I mean, there's
you know, an Act three a thing where he you know,

(26:47):
ends up having to kill his new wife and the
senator and stuff, and you know, he's probably doesn't know
he's doing it, but you can sort of see that
he's sort of knows in a weird way because he's
walking out and there's tears streaming down his face. Yeah.
I notice that, so subconsciously he knows in some way,
but he just does his brain can't put it together
at least at that point. Yeah, and that Um, that's

(27:09):
a pretty shocking scene because you've got this great guy,
this liberal senator, Um, who is kind of stated very
plainly to Angela Landsbury that he will block the nomination.
And I guess this was back when you were nominated
for vice president, not just chosing as a running mate.
Is that the deal? I think? So, yeah, so block
this nomination? And um, so you know she likes to

(27:32):
have him taken out. And it may be wrong, but
is this the first shoot someone through the milk container
scene in movie history? It might be. Yeah, it's such
a cool shot too. It is great. Um and actually
in shocking too. Yeah, totally. And in that scene too,
like the one you're talking about where he tells Angela

(27:53):
Lansbury asks if Hill block the nomination, and he takes
a man and actually wrote it down. What he says,
because it's really apt to where we are now, was
if he were a paid Soviet agent, he wouldn't do
more damage to the nation than he already has. Yeah,
Like it's just that kind of thing. I was like,
Oh my god, Like, you know, you say what your
politics are or whatever, whether you believe what's going on

(28:14):
or whether you know you don't In terms of Trump
and all that kind of stuff too, just the seeds
of this, the idea of these things, the parallels. It's
just like so like wow, like how it's so weird
that it would be that parallel nowadays. Yeah, what's the
other quote? I thought I had it written down, but
the one chilling one from Land Spirit at the end.
Do you have that one written down? Because I can

(28:34):
look it up if not, and I know the write
it down, but yeah, the basic idea of like I
didn't know, wo be you and I'm gonna get them back.
I don't remember the exact term the quote, all right,
so I can't find the quote, but it's, uh, it's
basically sort of invokes the rep political rallies that we
see these days. Um, and it was. It was. It

(28:55):
was fairly chilling, but just one of many chilling lines
that she has in this movie. She's I think a
f I rated her a top twenty five all time.
Send him a villain, Yeah, for sure. And I mean
the last big scene she has when she is with
Lawrence Harvey um privately and it's kind of like this

(29:16):
is the most monologue of a villain thing that there's
in the movie. But she just sort of explains to
him that, like, I didn't know it's gonna be you
and they'll pay for this. I wanted an assassin this
whole thing. But then it zooms in and she kisses
him on the lips, but doesn't in a way that
um against Sinatra kind of talked to her about doing
this so it wouldn't have any problems with the sensor
board at the time. Uh, kind of cut her hands

(29:38):
around her mouth to sort of hide it. So you
know what's going on, but you don't explicitly see it.
And I guess in the book the Richard Connor's novel,
it's very explicitly stated that they're having a relationship, they're
in bed together, this whole thing, but you don't really
see it in the movie. In the movie at all,
Like it's sort of kind of about the left field
at this point when she like you know, literally kisses

(29:58):
him makes out with him first, and he was like whoa, mom,
Like that's yeah, kind of stirring on top of everything else. No,
for sure, I mean she says evil, evil, manipulative character
and she has uh, I mean, she's a sleeper agent
for the communist and then she she finds out her
son as the assassins doesn't stop it because it feels

(30:20):
like she probably could put the brakes on that, even
though they obviously used him very much purposefully because he
was her son. But when she plans set kiss on him,
just I didn't know what to think. I did not
see that coming. Yeah, it's kind of out of nowhere
in a sense because they don't really hint that it
at all. In fact, it's kind of hinted that they

(30:41):
just really dislike each other. I mean, especially he just
likes her, yeah, and she's just always kind of scolding
him or whatever. So it's really kind of comes out
of nowhere in a sense, but maybe explains a lot too.
I don't know, man, she was fantastic, big time creeps.
Anytime do you see the mom kiss a son like that?
It's slightly disturbing and also at the time to like,

(31:03):
she wasn't really didn't have the persona that she had
later in a sense she's kind of an actor then, um,
you know, now it's like, well, my god, why is
Mrs Potts kissing her? So? Why is she so evil?
You know? Murder? She wrote, like, you know, she's the
wholesome the mother, the wholesome lady, and now she's she's
like so messed up in this movie. It's amazing. Yeah.

(31:25):
I love it when an actor, especially back then, sort
of in the earlier days, place this much against type.
Totally kind of kind of a brave choice. Um Janet
Lee's character. We had someone on the movie crush page
asked what was the point of her character? Uh, and
this the listeners, She just didn't get it. And I'm
not fully sure I do either. Um. Let's talk about

(31:50):
her for a minute and her purpose. I know that
she struggled with the role because she felt that like
she didn't really know what her purpose was either. She
didn't really know how to play it. Um, but she
trusted Frankenheimer and Sinatra something that too, and they kind
of chatted through it and stuff. I think she was
just kind of there as a support mechanism for Sinatra

(32:12):
who's losing his mind, to be honest, um, because I
don't think he could have done everything that he did
in that movie without someone to kind of bounce ideas
off of and just kind of support him in this
and no, make let him know that he's not crazy.
I think literally, that's just what her part was, and
they gave her some fun dialogue and like some interesting

(32:35):
things to do, but ultimately, like, it's not a role
that was if you had to cut a role, you
could cut this. But also I could see why she's
in it. I mean generally this is, you know, at
the height of her popularity and stuff too, and I'm
sure that helped sell the movie and things. She's on
the poster, which is what's funny about it is it's
the three of them above the fold, and then the

(32:57):
first one is co starring Angela Lansbury. Where was I was, like,
I put all four of them above the fold there.
I'm sure, Oh totally wasn't a contract thing doing this. Um.
That first scene with Janet Lee, though, when she and
Sinantra first meet each other on the train, is really great.
And the way the dialogue is written, it's also sort
of confusing as to what's going on, and I've got

(33:18):
to think that was purposeful. Yeah, I think so too.
I mean I think he's he's so disoriented and so
like at the end of his rope at that point,
and he doesn't know what to think because he feels
that like his brain is telling him one thing that
like he adores Raymond Shaw, but it's also he also
knows that he doesn't and he doesn't know why that is,

(33:39):
and he's trying to figure all of that out. And
I think at that point she's just kind of a
respite for like, in between things. It's kind of a
break for him, and I think that kind of helps
him pump the brakes on everything and just take a breath.
In a sense. She doesn't really ask a lot of him.
She's just she's just kind of there to kind of

(34:00):
bounce things around with. And she does have a pretty
funny like joke about like the railway and I'm not
in the if you see if you're in the railway businesses,
you say you're in the railroad line or whatever. It's
kind of a throw away, a little fun bit there.
So she has some pretty good like kind of repartee
with him and stuff too. Um So I don't think

(34:20):
she's totally a thankless character, but I just I don't
think it's the most developed thing and the most necessary
to the plot mechanics of the film. Yeah, it's sort
of reminded me a little bit of the pulp fiction
of Bruce Willis and his wife, how he was out
kind of suffering through these big events, and he would

(34:43):
pop back in on her, and she was just sort
of this sort of calming, stable force who didn't fully
understand what was going on the whole time, right, which
is sort of one of the things I did appreciate
it for though in a sense is that there aren't
scenes of her going like this is nuts, you gotta
stop this, what's wrong with you? Like that's not there
at all, Like she literally is just understanding and it's

(35:04):
just trying to figure out what's going on with them
or whatever, versus like the thing at the time for
a lot of things would be like, oh, the wife
is yelling at me again or whatever. They completely avoids that,
which I appreciate, Yeah, totally. Uh. And the other female
lead in this and this movie is interesting because it has,
you know, for nine two has three uh, pretty prominent

(35:29):
female characters in the film. One is the villain, which
is sort of a bit of a uh switcher rou
and then you've got Janet Lee, and then you've got
Joscelyn played by Leslie Parrish as you know, who you
learned about in flashbacks, was had this sort of towards
summer fling uh with with Raymond, and then she comes

(35:54):
back again later very prominently as well. Yeah, it's sort
of like the flashback sequences. It's a shades of from
here to eternity. They're like wearing swimsuits in the summer
and playing in the banks and lying in the grass
and this whole thing, and and it's it's that sequence.
I think is is really great because it's the only
it's the first time and the only real time that

(36:15):
you see his that he does have a personality, that
he does have a heart, and he does have her
deeming qualities and stuff like that too. But the one
time he tries to act on it, the one time
he finally falls in love and starts to break out
of his shell, it's completely squashed by his mom that
he can't he can't stand up to her, and as

(36:36):
of writing a letter, and then you know, so that
you think that that would be like the only time
you'd see her, and then that would be over. But
then it becomes a plot mechanic, and you know, her
reintroduction is huge, especially the fact that she's wearing the
Queen of Diamonds costume, which, if anything that's if there's
a fourth female character in the movie, it's the Queen

(36:57):
of Diamonds, because it's such a huge it's the trigger mechanism.
And and then it makes you think, too when she
does show up at the party wearing that, because there's
so much going on, you like, oh, she in and
on too? Is she part of the handling? Like because
she's wearing that, Like, what's what are the odds of that?
I mean, obviously it's just a coincidence when you look
back at it, But it's that kind of paranoia that

(37:21):
is rampant in the film as it goes, like if
so and so is in on it, who else could
be in on it? And I think it's a movie
that a lot A move that a lot of political
thrillers nowadays fall into is that like every single person
is in on it in some way, shape or form,
because you wouldn't expect it. The best friend is too
oh my gosh, um almost to the point where it's

(37:42):
like it doesn't make any sense anymore when they start
to do that, but um, and this one it does
because it just gives you a little bit of a
ting of like who's on the level, who's not in
the level. Um. But yeah, it's it's crazy because she
really does bring out who he really is. Yeah, and
he's not allowed to be that person. Yeah, that's tough

(38:04):
stuff because he um to see him it's it's almost
jarring to see him happy and smiling and enjoying himself
after this whole kind of film thus far of him
being sort of zombified and brainwashed and uh, and it
makes it does so much. It shows that, and it
gives the audience this um a little bit of heart

(38:25):
for him. And then it also just solidisfies what an
awful human being his mom is that she squashes like
this only chance at love that he ever had. Uh.
And I was also I thought the misdirection was was
pretty brilliant. With her addressed as the Queen of Diamonds,
I thought for sure that she was in on it
when she walked in wearing that right. Yeah, I actually

(38:47):
think is a brilliant move. And then the whole thing
too of like the dialogue that they're programmed to say
whenever anybody asks them about Raymond Shaw is Raymond Shaw
is the kindest, bravest, warmest, wonderful human being I've ever
met in my life which is the exact opposite of
Raymond Shaw, and the fact that multiple characters do voice

(39:08):
this and almost like a program. It just reminds you
that sn L sketch for the if you remember this
thing where John Lovitz is a hypnotist and everybody they
asked all the audience members and it's like it was great,
it was better than cats. I think they all say
the same thing over and over because he's shymtising to
give him good reviews. It just reminds me of that
so much. Yeah, yeah, totally. Um, I wish John Levitt

(39:32):
would have been in this film. Alright, fantastic too, How
old too? My brother worked with him? Actually, yeah, yeah,
my brother was in a d for a while and
um went through the d G a trainee program for
a d S and worked on City Slickers too with
John Lovitt. And he was a good guy apparently. I

(39:54):
won't say who was not a good guy, but you
can take it to the guests. I could could guess
of what big star in that movie was not a
good guy. I may have dealt with that person as
wile at some point. So well, we'll have to swap
stories off air, you bet. Um. Yeah, I thought that
the double murder scene was really well executed. Um, for

(40:18):
some reason, I think I didn't think he was going
to go through with it. I thought that that was
the point in the movie where he would breakthrough and
just mentally sort of defeat the brainwashing. But it was.
It ended up being pretty shocking when he killed him
and then even more so when he killed her. Yeah,

(40:38):
it's messed up. I mean it's the fact that like
he it just shows you the power that they had
over him, is like there's his own brain, can't break it,
Like it takes Sinatra's Deck of all Queens. Yeah, and
that that's actually a a real stroke of mercy and
wonderfulness that Sinatra says, like do you forget this, that

(41:01):
this ever happened? Like he he keeps that out of
his brain. Yeah, that he killed Joscelyn and the Senator. Yeah,
I love that part, which I thought was pretty great. Yeah,
because you know, his character is the major is he
becomes kind of obsessed with this, but no one, uh,

(41:21):
no one believes him. Um, he's sort of being gaslighted
and he's on his own. It's not like they ever
really rally behind him until I guess the point where
he picks out the the bad guys from the from
the virtual lineup is the only time he's sort of
taken seriously about this, but he's still not given Like

(41:43):
the plane at the end, it made me so mad,
was uh, here's my phone. No, here's a phone number.
Just just call this if you feel like you're getting
into trouble or something. And the whole time I'm like, man,
why isn't someone tailing this guy who packs up a gun,
goes dresses up like a priest, Like it would be
so easy. And then I was sort of annoyed by that.

(42:05):
But then Frank Sinatra's character owns that dumb decision in
the movie and talks about what a dumb thing it was,
and I was like, okay, well that that kind of
made up for everything. And one thing I do like
about the fact that like nobody believes them or supports Sinatra.
Really they don't dwell on that. They don't make it
a thing. So many things in the political thrillers, it's
just a lot of like why won't you believe me?

(42:27):
I'm going crazy? And then just constantly running around. I
just hate that, like it's it's a troupe I don't
love of like the protagonists that is fully is right,
but everybody else thinks it's crazy and it just and
they have to go through the maccinations of it over
and over the fact that nobody supports him and believes him. Yeah,
and I think part of the key to that is

(42:48):
having someone like Frank Sinatra in that role, because you know,
it's Frank. He's cool and collected. He's not gonna do
that they if they asked him to, he wouldn't do
that on screen. Um. And it doesn't surprise me that
he had a lot to do with sort of how
this came together as a as a star and having
that kind of influence in the direction. Yeah, I mean,

(43:11):
he's he really is the perfect part, the perfect role.
I mean, he was the one. I think at first
they were thinking that he would do the Laurence Harvey
part and so interesting, and he was, but then he's like, no,
I want to do this others the sergeant role, which
I think is way better. Anyways, I have a hard
time picturing him in the Laurence Harvey role. Yeah, that

(43:34):
would be tough. I did not see the remake, and
I'm um, you know, as remakes go generally. I'm not
the biggest fan of remaking classic films, but I don't
think I remembered until I looked it up that it
was Jonathan Demi, who I love and have so much
respect for. Uh so I'm intrigued. Did you see it?

(43:55):
I did. It's not bad, It's not necessary. It's one
of those things where it's like, wiry make a perfect movie,
but it's not bad. I mean the pedigree of people
in it. Meryl Streep is in the Lance Bury role,
Denzel Washington and you know, Lee of Schreiber is the
Lawrence Harvey part. Like, it's it's not bad, it's it's
well done. I've only seen it once in the theater

(44:16):
when it came out because I have such a reverence
for this other movie. Yeah, so I might revisit it
one of these days, just because it's been, you know,
sixteen years since it came out. Um, but yeah, it's
not bad. They got the right people to do it. Yeah,
I think I might check it out. I did look
at the trailer because I just wasn't super familiar with

(44:37):
it when it came out. But it looks like that
they sort of morphed the Senator character into the Sun.
Is that right? I think so. I don't remember the
exact things that they changed, but it looks like Lee
of Schreiber is the politician I think it might be. Yeah,
and still has this controlling, manipulative mother. And Meryl Streep

(45:01):
I'm sure she's great in it, like all the actors
that got are fantastic. Yeah, I mean she's she's fantastic.
I mean obviously, like it doesn't have the same punch
as Landsbury did because I know what's coming the entire time,
right right, But yeah, but she's great. I mean, it's
it's not bad as far as remakes go. It's it's
a solid remake. Yeah, I'll have to check that out.

(45:22):
Jonathan Demi I think was a very undersung filmmaker in
a lot of ways. Yeah, he's great. Oh look, I
think I found the quote a nice so here it
is right here. Um, I shall force someone to take

(45:46):
the body away from him, and Johnny will really hit
those microphones and those cameras with blood all over him,
fighting off anyone who tries to help him, defending America,
even if it means his own death, rallying a nation
of television viewers to hysteria to sweep us up into
the White House with powers that will make martial law
seem like anarchy. That's right, that sounds familiar. That sure does.

(46:12):
I'm glad I found that because when that happened, I
was like, oh my god, I can't believe this was
made in nineteen two and she's talking about rallying a
nation of television viewers to hysteria. Uh yeah, man, it's
way ahead of its time. I think in a lot
of ways philosophically with its politics, it's creepy as hell.

(46:33):
It's so weird that it's the same and yet different. Now, Um,
I think too. Like I forgot to mention is that
Angela Lansbury was only three years older than Laurence Harvey
and had really which is which is tough. But if
you watched the movie, you don't really question it. It
doesn't seem She's one of those people who was sort

(46:54):
of locked in at When she was thirty, she looked fifty,
and when she was seventies she looked fifty, right exactly.
She just always looked the same. Yeah, she even had
the same haircut. She was good. I didn't watch Murder,
she wrote, believe it or not. I was. I'm like
the only human on the planet that never saw that show. Oh,
it's pretty good, no verd it's great. I think Josh

(47:16):
still loves it. He watches reruns. He thinks it's a
pretty good like comfort fruit show. There's um and there's
a Criterion version of Venturing which I have, and there's
some pretty good supplements on there. And one is it
does have an interview with Angela Lansbury when she talks
about it and how Frankenheimer fought to have her in
the movie, and um, how he was a joy to
work with for everybody because everybody just kind of trusted

(47:38):
him because he knew what he was doing. There's also
a thing on there where there's from because they rereleased,
so it disappeared from public view all these years. Sinatra
bought the rights back in Yanket. There's a bunch of
like differing versions of it. One is that he did
that out of respect to Kennedy and the assassination, because
that's a big that's the main thing in this movie

(47:59):
is like assassination of candidates, UM, which is you know
why at the end, it's kind of a great ending
in a sense that he redeems himself and in a
little way. But um, so it was politically controversial in
that sense. So he, out of respect to Kennedy, who's
they're very good friends, he just didn't want even though

(48:19):
he loved the movie and he thought it was great,
he just didn't think it should be seen. It just
felt not right, so he yanked it until they rereleased it. Now,
different versions say that, like, no, that's not true. It
aired on some cable television stuff like for the next
couple of years, that the reason it got pulled was

(48:41):
something to do with rights clearances or something. But that
doesn't feel like a good narrative to me, So I'm
gonna go with he pulled it for his buddy. Um.
But then when they released it eight it it was
kind of a success again. Um, it found a whole
new generation of viewers it has and neated with like

(49:01):
college kids, I guess. Um. And there's a supplement on
the criterion of Frankenheimer, George Oxelrod and Frank Sinatra talking
about it then. Um and like a brief little round
table the three of those guys, which is pretty fascinating
to look back. Now, where was this in Frankenheimer's career.
Was this one of his first films? It was pretty early. Yeah,

(49:24):
he had done a couple of movies before, but not many.
This is sort of sort of like the renaissance of
Frankenheimer on the next lea. He just ran off the
string of like four or five movies that are his best,
right all right? Then? Um, and it started with this one.
Really I'll Fall Down was right before it, even though
they're shot around the same time, but all fond just

(49:46):
came out first based on production issues. Um so yeah,
So like he did this and then was followed by
Seven Days in May, which is another great political thriller.
Um and the train and seconds and it's he just
a burmount of Alcatraz I think was right before this
or after this as well. Yeah, man, I don't know

(50:06):
why I haven't seen any Frankenheimer pictures. Uh, there's gonna
be a lot of fun. What else you got for
for Manchurian candidate? Oh, let's see, can't you think? In
your note? Um, well, there is the sequence of the
bartender actually triggering the thing, which I think is so
cool and so funny because it's like, why why wouldn't

(50:28):
that necessarily happen. Um, yeah, just play solitaire and you're
in big trouble, right, So, like he gets triggered and
then by the bartenders saying yeah, why don't pass time
play solitaire or whatever and stuff. He immediately sits down
at the bar, which is always creepy too, like in
the flashbast sequence, which just shows him without cards in
his hands, just like putting him down. And the fact

(50:50):
that he gets triggered at the bar immediately and says,
give me a deck of cards, and the guy gives
him the cards, and then he's continues his conversation. He
says like, yeah, I wy don't you just go jump
go to Central Park and drop in the lake. And
he immediately gets in a cab, goes to Central Park,
jumps in the lake. Um, And it just happens that
Sinatra shows up right before he goes and does that,
and so he sort of figures out that something is

(51:12):
amiss here more than yeah, that was a cool sequence
in Sinatra's uh what are you doing? Get out of there? Man? Right,
that's so good. Yeah, And it shot at uh Bethesda
Fountain in the boathouse there, right, So you know, so
many classic movie seeds a bit shot right there, and
they clearly emptied that area out because there's not another

(51:32):
human in frame right, which is crazy good stuff. It's
cool to see New York in sixty two as well,
just some great shots of the of the street and
kind of what's like real life going on. It is
fun to watch movies that take place in cities that
you know and love, UM from different time capsule. We
just watched I J Jenny. I never seen it, so

(51:53):
we watched it time after time. The Jack the Ripper
HD wells, Oh yeah, with Malcolm McDonald. Doubt man. That
was one of my HBO movies as a kid. I
watched that a dozen times. Me too. But it takes
place in San Francisco, UM, which obviously spent a lot
of time in And there's a little chase sequence in
the Embarcadero and this was filmed in seventy nine, and

(52:14):
the Embarcadero looks exactly the same, like it's doesn't really crazy.
It's always fun to walk to look back on that stuff. Man,
I'd love to see that again. Uh. I don't know
how you were as a kid, but when I first
got HBO, it was just like my life opened up
between that and MTV, and I would just watch I
mean movies that I'm looking back now. It's really funny

(52:35):
that a twelve year old was watched the movie rag
Time like five times, and movies like time after time.
I'd like to go back and revisit that one though.
That was a good one. It's good. It holds up
I think mostly um, but it's yeah, it's good, but definitely,
I mean, HBO raised me. I always say that, um,
because it's totally it's it's formed so much of my

(52:55):
movies that you know. My dad was into movies too,
and he really loved Enturi and I think he was
the one introduced me to it. Oh cool. Um. And
I used to have the re release poster hanging up
in my bedroom amongst other things and um, and then
I had actually framed at some point, and then in
college I had it up on the walls. And I
think my brother has it and it's up in his
place someplace. So oh nice. Yeah, that's cool. It's a

(53:19):
movie that I think. Um. I don't know the way
what the reaction was like in nineteen sixty two, but
uh imagine it was people didn't quite know what to
make of it back then. I think it did pretty well.
Obviously was critically acclaimed. It's not one of those movies
that was panning. Then later over it's like, oh wait,
it's actually good, um, because it did get I mean,

(53:39):
it's got the two Oscar Noms, which you know should
have had more. Um, Angela Lands Great by the way
lost to Petty Duke and the Miracle Worker. So you know, okay,
I won't begrudge that one, because that's the time you
look back on these classic performances and you see who
beat them and you're like, really, okay, yeah, I could
see Frank maybe getting a supporting act or not, just

(54:02):
because he was such a big movie star. Yeah, but
it wasn't nominated for Best Picture, which I think is
kind of criminal. But yeah, you know, at least it's
one of those things that like time has served it well.
It was proclaimed to them and it's a claim now. Yeah,
and it feels like a movie too that Um. You know,
some movies that are made back then are such a
part of the current zeitgeys that they just it's not

(54:24):
that they don't age well, they're just sort of locked
in time. But a movie like this it's like a
good um it's like reading Catcher in the Rye every
fifteen years or so. It's like got new relevance as
you get older and politics change and things. People come
and go, but the messages here are eerily relevant today.
You know, Russia and China and a pup puppet candidates

(54:48):
and uh, it's it's really good stuff. It is pretty crazy.
And I mean, like, one of the reasons I don't
really like politics is I feel like it's very divisive,
and I don't like things that don't bring people. I
prefer things that bring people together. I prefer things that like, hey,
we love this movie, so let's talk about it, and
other people can be like, yeah, I love the movie too.
Like I much prefer that versus like, hey, here's my

(55:10):
opinion on something. Well, yeah, I have the opposite opinion,
and instead of respecting your opinion, and I'm gonna yell
at you about your opinion and then yeah, it's the worst.
That's the worst thing. It's almost you know, it's almost
like somebody like, if you want to pop culture, it's
like when you know, Last Jedi came out or something,
and then the camps that you had on that instead
of people just being you know, happy that there's another

(55:30):
Star Wars movie that was me, let's just shoot all
over it or defend it to the end of time.
I don't know. I just prefer things that are that
bring people together. Yeah, when it comes to the Star
Wars stuff, I am, you know, raised on Star Wars
loved Uh. I love that stuff when I was a kid.
And now when I see those movies, I just go

(55:50):
in and I'm like, yeah, man, this is great, another
cool Star Wars movie. I don't I don't read too
much into it. None of them are the best movies
ever made. Uh. They're Star Wars movies and and I
like almost all of them. That's like a point my
dad made when I was growing up, when all they're
still making a ton of Star Trek movies. He's like,
some are gonna be good, some are gonna be bad,
but it's just another episode of Star Trek. And I

(56:11):
was like, yeah, that's a hundred percent true. And he
used to joke that the next Star Trek would be
Sulose birthday, Star Trek eight, Sulan's birthday or whatever. That
was a joke, but um, but yeah, like to me,
it's that's what it is. It's another episode and something
you like, and ultimately it doesn't what I don't they
are going to always make is like Okay, you didn't
like it or whatever. It doesn't tarnish or diminish the
movies you do. Like, they're not taking those movies and

(56:35):
burning them, being like, well we can't have both, so
you can no longer see the new Hope ever. Like
to me, that's the problem with that kind of thing.
And like, the reason I actually don't mind remakes at
half the time is is it brings attention to the
original film. And often they clean it up and they
put it on in a special edition in Blu ray
or like make it white screen like whatever. That's the

(56:55):
one reason that like I'm okay with the remakes is
it brings more people to the original. Yeah, and I
think I remember that happening when the remake of this
one came out. Um, yeah, I'm gonna check out that remake.
I'm down, cool, cool, cool, Yeah, you'd probably watch that too.
So what's the next on our list? Well, uh, we
have the train, we have seconds. Um, what was the

(57:20):
fourth one? I chose? I'm run in? Want to me?
Should we go in order. Sure, I think the train
would be the next chronologically, all right, I haven't seen it,
so that will be another great experience for me. Cool, cool, cool,
it's either the train or it's seconds. Definitely not running
run his last. Yes, I did see running once, but

(57:42):
again just once. Yeah, great movie. Alright, cool, Well, thanks
for coming in, and uh, I'm glad we're turning people
onto the work of John Frankenheimer. I think he is
a pretty undersung director as well. Great body of work.
But you know, even a movie guy like me has
is kind of unfamiliar worth a lot of it. So
good choice. Thanks. Thanks. I hope people actually like the
stuff and go check it out. Yeah. Absolutely. There were

(58:05):
some big manchuring candidate vans when I posted that this
is coming, so I think this will go over pretty well. Awesome.
I love it all right, thanks buddy, Yeah, thanks for
having me on. All right, we'll see you guys next week.

(58:27):
Movie Crush is produced, edited, and engineered by Ramsey Hunt
here in our home studio at pont City Market, Atlanta, Georgia.
For I Heart Radio. For more podcasts for my Heart Radio,
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