September 7, 2019 • 49 mins
Food waste is a global problem, but most of it happens locally — in our homes. Anney and Lauren chat with food historian Dr. Julia Skinner about fun and tasty ways to prevent waste and preserve abundance.
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Speaker 1 (00:08):
Hello, and welcome to save a Protection of I Heart
Radio and Stephanie dat Amnneries and I'm Lauren foc Obam
and today we're talking about food waste. Yes, and we've
really need to talk about this for a while. Um,
but it's one of those things where you always kind
of put it off because it's really depressing. It is,
and we have to talk about the depressing things. But
(00:28):
sometimes it's more fun to talk about rubarb. Honestly, definitely true,
definitely true. Oh what could you do with rubarb? Oh?
All kinds of things, I'm sure. But we're getting ahead
of ourselves because Okay, the fun part about food waste
is that we can help solve it by making delicious
stuff out of things that would otherwise go to waste
in our own kitchens. Um. But the sad part is
(00:52):
how much is going to waste on a local, national,
and global scale. Absolutely very sad. So I guess we
should get to a question, sure, food waste, what is it? Well? Uh,
food waste is food that is produced and then not consumed.
(01:18):
Um that furthermore, is not turned into anything else. Uh,
and is is and goes to waste, just gets thrown out. Yeah,
And it is perhaps a larger problem than I I
can conceive of, because about a third of the food
(01:41):
that the world produces every year goes uneaten one point
three billion tons worth UM as of August of nineteen.
Wasting all of that food costs it's nty billion dollars
every year and is responsible for eight percent of our
total greenhouse gas emissions. And that is that's a bunch
of numbers that are kind of unimaginable, Like I don't
(02:03):
have a good concept of what one point three billion
tons of food is UM, nor how much ninety billion
dollars is. That's an amount of money that I don't
I think the twenty bucks is a lot. So I'm like, oh, okay,
so let's break that down into a more digestible amount.
Perhaps pun not intended, but I'm going to go with it.
In North America, the World Bank estimates that one fred
(02:27):
and twenty calories worth of food per person per day
are wasted. That's a whole extra person's worth of calories
going to waste for every person UM. In other parts
of the world, it's it's more like four hundred and
fifteen to seven hundred and fifty calories. Like we in particular,
(02:48):
have a lot of work to do. Yeah. Um. And
another set I saw thrown around a lot of food waste.
Was a country, it would be the third largest greenhouse
gas emetter, behind China and the United States. The global
annual value of food waste is one trillion dollars. Who
so it's huge. Yeah. Um. In the U s alone
(03:12):
is ofen we uh, farms, businesses, consumers. We spent two
eighteen billion dollars on food we don't actually eat. It's
one point three percent of our of our gross domestic product. Wo. Um,
that is wasted by businesses, ten perent by farms two
(03:33):
during manufacturing, but in our homes. Um. So we invited
a friend to come joints today. Who's who's been working
on waste reduction in our own home and has started
teaching classes on it. Dr Julia Skinner of Root Kitchens. Yeah.
(03:53):
You might remember Julia from our episode on teatime from July. Um,
apple ply are our apple? Right? Yeah? She We had
a video where we did a medieval inspired apple pie.
It was delicious. It was difficult to eat, perhaps so
good a man. The video features are cat quick crag.
(04:14):
It was it was wonderful it was wonderful. Um. But
before we get Julia on here talking about what you
perhaps can do about it, let's talk about what can
be done about food waste on that larger scale, that
other that is not us, that's that's industry and businesses
(04:35):
and stuff. Um. So many many cultures are in fact
taking on food waste on a national legislative scale. In
South Korea, for example, the disposal of food waste in
landfills was outlawed in two thousand five, and between then
and UM, South Korea managed to reduce home and restaurant
food waste by over and they started recycling their food
(04:59):
waste as compost or or animal feed. So good steps, yes,
the right direction, absolutely UM. Japan and Taiwan similarly recycle
up to a third of their food waste is animal feed.
The EU, the European Union, has a Waste Directive in
place that aims to prevent all biodegradable waste, including food,
(05:20):
from going to landfills. By however, efforts are being made
kind of sporadically across member nations. As perhaps you might expect,
there are still laws on the books preventing surplus food
from going to animals for feed. Due to outdated disease
control laws. And this is kind of at the heart
of a lot of the problems of these laws that
(05:41):
certainly in the past we're good for preventing disease breakout.
You don't want that. Nobody wants sick cows, nobody wants
sick people. Let's not know, but you know, modern times,
modern transportation UM on a more global scale UM In
the United Nations Food and Agriculture Organization, the f AO
(06:02):
included food waste and food loss in this larger set
of sustainable development goals for Yes. Within those goals, Target
twelve point three is uh by have per capita global
food waste that have cut in half yet at the
retail and consumer levels, and reduce food losses along production
(06:24):
and supply chains, including post harvest losses. And there are
a whole bunch of of suggestions and goals for how
to do that. But based on that, the United States
created the US twenty thirty Food Loss and Waste Reduction Goal,
same target. There's also nonprofits working, but yeah, changes are
being proposed across the entire food supply chain. Here UM
(06:46):
stuff like a food and material scientists are working on
ways of better storing and packaging foods before they reach consumers.
There's conversations about expiration date labeling standard station something that
we talked about way back when in our Expiry Date episode. Yeah,
I know that there was a lot of attention. When
(07:09):
you know, whenever John Oliver does a piece on something
was attention gets pointed towards it for a brief moment. Well,
I don't know how brief, but anyway, about how we
can't donate a lot of the food, even if it's
sometimes even if it's like packaged to people who are hungry. Um.
And I remember and when I was in college, my
um my room what are they called, the first who
(07:32):
ran the hallway the r A S Yeah whatever. She
was so sweet and she had this whole day where
we like put on hairnets, we put on gloves, and
we made sandwiches for the homeless and we went to
donate them and they said we can't donate them because
of the law. Um. So I know there's talk about
changing things like that. And I understand, like you said,
about concerns of um disease or food poison bacteria, whatever
(07:56):
it might be, but it seems like there must be
a way an intersection where we could do better than
than just throwing it away. Yeah. Um. In a report
by the World Resources Institute that was released August twenty
nine of this year, so just a few days ago
as of this recording. Um. This team of researchers, this
huge team of researchers recommended things like like education for
(08:19):
produced purchasers and consumers too to underline the inherent quality
and foods that aren't currently being bought and sold for
what are essentially cosmetic reasons like bruising on fruit or
weird looking apples. Um uh. And then also like the
construction of processing facilities near farms to create salable value
(08:43):
added products. Um. From what's still unmarketable after that education, Uh,
can stuff process it into other stuff? Make I don't know,
lip bomb. Uh. Lip bomb is going to come back
in a moment. It will make sense soon, it will um. Yeah,
what's still unmarketable? Um, And from various byproducts make I
(09:03):
don't know, makes some, makes some, make some Sara Kraut delicious,
make some hots again yeah um. And then also just
to further education for consumers about how to store and
use foods, which brings us to Julia. So we're going
to come in with an interview with her, but first
(09:26):
we're going to take a quick break for a word
from our sponsor. And we're back. Thank you sponsor. And
here's our conversation with Julia. Hi, Hi Julia, how are you? Hi?
(09:47):
I'm good? How are you doing? Just all right? How?
Hi Annie? How are you? I am tired. I'm not
gonna try to, but I am very excited to see you.
But one, because you bought gifts, you came with gif always.
Plus absolutely, this isn't the only reason we keep inviting,
not at all, not at all, but a main one.
(10:10):
It's a side perk for sure. And also we love
having you your good friend of ours. Always good conversation. Yeah,
and the and the food gifts that you brought with
you today are our food waste related because that's what
we're talking about. Yeah, so you brought I'm just gonna
talk about it just because it's sitting right in front
of me and I'm about to accidentally drink it at
(10:31):
any given moment. So, so we've got a watermelon pickle. Yeah,
So it's a watermelon rind. So historically people would pickle
the rind and then um, just to use up all
parts of the watermelon. And then I also brought lip
bomb that I made out of food scraps, out of
lavender and out of apple cores. It smells delightful. It
does smell delightful. We just did an episode on lavender.
(10:51):
So oh yeah, yeah, ties In, I was mistaken that
it would keep the lions away, but I still like
the smell. That's good, yeah, my favorite. Uh what what
got you into food preservation and waste avoidance to begin with?
So in my early early adulthood, I was pretty broke
(11:15):
all the time, and I like, so all of my
food came from food banks, and I I didn't yet
really know how to cook or do anything, and so
it's like I was just eating this food bank food
and I was like, wow, you know, I'm really tired
of eating like a can of corn for dinner. Like
there has to be some other way I can get
about affording to eat and um. And so I, uh,
(11:38):
what I ended up doing was learning how to garden,
talking to friends who were farmers, things like that, learning
how to preserve food, all these things, and then slowly
started to incorporate that myself into my own life. And
I also got on EBT rather than just going to
the food bank. So I actually got to do things
like purchase fresh vegetables, which was super cool, and said
(11:59):
that I like, I can preserve these vegetables and then
eat them and have a nutrient perhaps um. And so
that's kind of how I started getting into that, and
I've been doing that ever since at this point like
fifteen sixteen years goodness. Yeah, so a while, Um, and
your your background is in is in history? Your food historian? Yeah? Um?
(12:22):
How does that provide a lens for your for your
work and all of this? So I first encountered food
history as an area of study in two thousand eight,
which was when I was um, still doing this, like
you know, on EBT and still kind of finding my
feet financially. Um. And so I was still really trying
to reduce my own food waste, and I was finding
that it was hard for me to do that sustainably.
(12:46):
Like it was because I'd be like, oh gosh, this
just feels really overwhelming. I feel really anxious about whether
or not I'm doing this right, etcetera, etcetera, or like
I'm tired and maybe I don't want to think about
like what to do with all of these peels today. Um,
And so it started. It started out kind of in
that space, and then as I discovered historic food, I
(13:08):
was like, oh wow, I can use this as a
way to actually make doing this fun. So like I'm like, oh, hey,
look at all these ways that people did this historically.
Now I can go through this, um, you know, through
finding what to do out with these peels and actually
be like, oh wow, apple scrap vinegar amazing, let's make that.
And then I can learn all this history stuff and
make this. So it ended up making it go from
(13:32):
being just a you know, a thing I had to
do because I was broke, to a thing I actually
liked doing. So it was it was exciting. Yeah, absolutely,
I feel I feel like that tiredness is a pretty
core part of why I don't more of that. So yeah,
that's like most people I talked to and they're I'm like, yeah,
why do you not or why like why do you
(13:54):
not waste food or why do you feel like you're
not able to cut down on waste? And They're just like, oh,
it's just so much work, and I'm like it doesn't
have to be. But we all like what we feel
like that and it's overwhelming and it makes you anxious,
so I get it. So so this is this is
like a ridiculously big question, but kind of in review, Um,
(14:17):
how have waste preservation techniques and technologies changed throughout human history?
All of it? Well, so, so like before the Industrial Revolution,
we're mostly looking at waste on like a town or
household level. You know, you don't have like a factory
(14:37):
that's producing so so so much stuff for people, um,
you know, for thousands of people in different towns around
the world. Um, so you're just like, okay, what do
we do at the household level, like the kind of
stuff I teach, like what a restaurant does or a
home cook does or whatever. And so you see things
like pre industrial Revolution, there are some guidelines and things
(14:59):
that people would share, um that when we did the
apple pie making things. That same book, UM has a
bunch of food waste stuff in it. So most of
it's like feeding these scraps to livestock or like maybe
a couple of recipes for using them in their mostly
livestock feeding. But um, which makes sense given what the
(15:21):
book was. Yeah, so you mostly see that, and then um,
so we see people also preserving things of course to
get through the winter and stuff like that, you know,
so that they don't go hungry. Um. But then when
we get to the Industrial Revolution, we see all of this, Um.
We see both changes in transportation and in food preservation,
(15:43):
so you can can all of this stuff and then
suddenly it can go all around the country on the railroads,
and so you have kind of this new way of
engaging with food and food waste. And so it was
really I think we were only thinking about waste if
it could be used for another product they can make
money off of, so like hot dogs or something or
(16:04):
like I'm not a margarine expert, but I seem to
recall it margarine was initially like some waste product of
something else. I don't know if that's true, maybe fact
check that. But but you know, through through the grapevine,
I have been told this, um. And yeah, so we
had to start thinking in a much larger scale about
(16:26):
what waste looked like. Um. And then now you know,
today we're so used to all of the packaging waste
and all of the whatever that it's just a totally
different world that started with the Industrial Revolution, but is
so different from you know, historically, how really much of
our waste operations have looked. Um. Yeah, it's it's like
an entirely different concept of what abundance means, of what
(16:48):
what food and hunger since the Industrial Revolution. So yeah,
the Industrial Revolution, like I said, you know, we have
the railroad technologies and all the canning and all of that,
and so then once we get to the world where
two period, then we also have you know, kind of
this increased abundance. The US is you know, really wealthy
and all of that, and so it's we're like, oh,
(17:11):
we have all these convenience products. They're being marketed as
like the hot new thing, and everybody's like I want
the hot new thing. Let's have lime jello with like
whatever and it for dinner. That sounds great. Um. And
so then abundance, like the concept of abundance and hunger
and all of this meant instead of having a pantry
full of stuff that like say you can or your
(17:31):
family caned and like fresh vegetables and like cured meats
and kind of the stuff that we would historically see, Um,
you know, an abundant pantry was just like a bunch
of cans that you bought it of store that were
stuff that people made, like they grew it far away,
they canned it far away, you went to this really
sterile environment and went and picked it up and then
put it in your house. And so it's this really
(17:53):
disconnecting way of being feeling like things are abundant and
it feels like you have to rely externally on like
somebody else to produce this stuff, like we don't know
how to like, Okay, well I don't know how to
can this, so now I'm at the whim of whoever
is making these cans rather than knowing how to do
it yourself. So yeah, it's I feel like we're kind
(18:13):
of coming full circle and a lot of people are
like wanting to homesteadying and all these other slow food
and all these other things that try to reconnect them,
uh and move them away from just the like can
of food or box of mac and cheese or whatever. Yeah,
because it's um. When I really started thinking about it,
(18:34):
it really kind of creeped me out. The next time
that I like walked into a supermarket and I was like,
these products are You just walk into the protucy and
you're like, these products are from all over the world.
There's no good reason why I should be getting a
fresh tomato in December. Uh. And and there's there's no
good reason why I should have seventy eight fresh chickens
(18:57):
to choose from. Yeah, like that's why. Yeah. And then
like all the packaging that they're wrapped in and everything,
it's like why is the tomato now in like plastic wrap?
Like why like does it need to be Yeah, it's
it's in this clamshell because you know, because you have
to transport it from Chile, and so of course it's
in a clam shell. We don't want it to get bruised,
right because an ugly tomato or a bruised tomato was
(19:19):
completely useless. Yeah, it'll just get thrown out. Anyways. Yeah,
you talked, you talked a little bit about this, but um,
but how have you in I don't want to say,
like your lifetime, Like how how have you in our
our lifetimes? Um, seen this change like like personally like
like not even I guess from or yeah, yeah, like
you spoke to how when you were a younger adult
(19:41):
you started exploring this, but um, but yeah, what what
have you what have you seen the community in general?
Do so? I think when I was a kid in
the eighties, Um, people still seemed pretty invested in prepackaged
food and didn't seem I mean, obviously this isn't a
hard fast role for everybody because that's not possible. Um,
(20:03):
but um, but people still seemed pretty okay with prepackaged
food and that convenience kind of being the norm. Like
convenient food is better food, whether or not the food
itself is better. Um. And now I feel like we're
seeing more and eagerness to try new things. We're seeing
people wanting more flavors, more different preparations, wanting to know
(20:25):
where their foods from just in the past, say, you know,
twenty and especially the last ten years. And so it's
like we're seeing that and I think that's great because
it means, you know, people are exploring and learning, but
they're also open to having conversations about things like food
waste and about um, different ways of preparing food and
engaging with food. And it's not like, you know, if
(20:46):
I tried to have that conversation with like, you know,
say like my grandma in the fifties or something, she
would be like, I don't have a lot of social
context for this, you know, like I understand that, like
wasting food is bad and I compost and stuff, but
we're not having cultural, you know, large scale conversations about it. Um. Yeah,
I I think I mean, did did your andy, did
(21:09):
did your family or did your did your immediate family
or did your grandparents? Um? Do any like composting any
canning of their own? I I have no idea how
like connected to the land your family was. Like I
remember my my mom's parents had a small garden out back,
and they would they would compost, and they would, uh,
at the very least make fresh food out of I
don't think they did a lot of canning, but they
(21:31):
would the very least make fresh food out of what
they had, maybe maybe a jar pickles here and there.
But how about you, oh man, my family didn't really
do any of that. Um. But my neighbor was a survivalist.
Who Ever wondered where I learned to throw knives and axes,
it was him, I have wondered question. It's a fair question.
(21:59):
But he did. He really did, and he was all
about it, and he had he had gardens, and he
would can and he did it in a much more
of a different sense of like it's a bomb shelter.
It could happen, but he would give me cans of stuff.
And I do think it's the when someone gives you
something like the gifts that you bring it does have
(22:20):
a more important as more value to me because someone
made it, and I would assume you're not trying to
murder me. That's false. But it feels like harder to
throw away, I guess, opposed to like something I just
(22:40):
bought at the store, maybe on a whim. And I
don't really I don't really know about this. Yeah, yeah, totally. Um,
so how can how can people start? It seems again
like like I'm tired and it seems very daunting to
to even get started thinking about being less wasteful and
(23:04):
and and producing something useful and good and fun. Um
what do um? What do you need to get started?
I mean not much, which is nice, Like it's we
already have all of the tools we need to do
this by virtue of things that like, you know, different
ways of cooking that have been passed down to us,
by virtue of just the ingredients that we have, So
(23:26):
we have all of the base stuff there. Um, So
I tell people, like one of the critical things instead
of just being like trying to do everything at once
because you'll go nuts, probably is so I'll tell them,
you know, find one or two things that interest you.
Start there. So like something as simple as taking you know,
citrus peels or something and infusing them in vinegar and
(23:48):
then using it to cook or clean with, or you know,
taking like veggie scraps and saving them in your freezer
and making stock out of them once you have like
a chicken carcass or something like simple stuff like that. Um.
And then it's like if you find something that interests you,
like with the historic stuff I do, it's like, okay,
well this is nice because then you have this larger
(24:09):
kind of perspective that you can um fit fit this into.
So like, oh, I'm interested in I don't know, medieval food,
let's say, and it's like, okay, well how did people
do this in the Middle Ages? And let's find out
And you know, now it becomes a project and makes
it actually fun and interesting and isn't just like okay, well,
here's like a recipe that you're never going to implement
(24:29):
because you're exhausted. Yeah. Uh, do you do you have
any do you have any favorites? Any? Um? Any and
anything that you're just like constantly doing or that you
really look forward to. I make a lot of ferments
fermented food all the time, so um, anything from like
pickling stems and ends like broccoli stems and stuff like
(24:52):
that make really good pickles, um, sauer kraut e things. Um,
just because it's kind of easy to grate up a
bunch of tables and mash them together and then ferment them. Um.
I make a lot of meat too, So if I
have like mushy fruit or something, I'll just like take
it and put it into a container with some honey
and some water, and I'm just like, oh, let's see,
(25:14):
like this might be terrible, but it might be good.
Like we'll find out most of the time it's good.
If it's terrible, I just turned it into vinegar and
use it to clean my house. Yeah. Yeah. Uh my
brain just went so many, so many lovely pieces. I
was like, I was like, what would that like like
weird like citron peel and and mushy apple. Yeah, do
(25:38):
as a bathroom cleaner? That sounds lovely? Yeah it does.
It makes your house smell really nice. Yeah, not good
to taste probably, well, it depends but yeah, sometimes good
to taste, sometimes not not really at all. Do you
do you have any weird weird ones? So, like, um,
home craft stuff is one of the ones that I
(25:59):
think is kind of weird because I think people, um,
when you say food waste, people assume that you're limited
to doing this in the kitchen, like doing a reuse
in the kitchen. But of course people have used food
scraps for all sorts of things throughout history to you know,
you know, gardening of course, compost and all of that,
um and livestock feed and stuff, but also like dies
(26:21):
and inks, um, like those lip bombs that I made,
All all kinds of stuff like that are all you know,
just food scrap based. And that's one of my favorite
things to do. Is like I make dies probably every week,
and I'm like running out of pieces of fabric to
die with these with these things, and so I'm like
I have to go buy more, like T shirts or something.
(26:44):
Oh that's a fun problem to have, it is, I
like it. Uh, Okay, you spoke a little bit about
lacto fermentation and and just sort of like putting stuff
in a jar and letting it do its thing. That
seems daunting to me because I'm like, that seems like
a good way for me to give myself food. Point snaing. Um,
but I understand on like a scientific level that it's
(27:04):
actually relatively difficult to do. So if you know what
you're doing, could you could you could you walk us
through the process of not giving yourself replicing. Yeah, So basically, um,
one of the main things you want to do is
make sure that all of your substrates, so that's just
the fruit or vegetable um, stays completely under the brine um.
Lacto fermentation is anaerobic, and so the instant that you
(27:26):
introduce air, you introduce like the possibility for molds and
other stuff you don't want to grow on that. If
it's just a brine um, you know, it'll it'll be
safe if it's all under there. So usually I'll put
it in a jar and wait it or you know,
put an airlock on it, or there's any number of
things you can do. UM you do that, let it sit,
(27:48):
like check it every day, just make sure you know, know,
like little pieces of cabbage have float it up to
the top, or like nothing's molding or nothing. You know,
it feels like it's going off, you gonna try to
limit the amount of air that's getting in there. So
if you have the container all the way full, that's best. Um,
and you know you can always There's a ton of
(28:09):
great resources out there. I mean, obviously the art of
fermentation is kind of the gold standard that a lot
of people use, but there's a lot of others. Um
Ferment Works has several different really good uh fermentation books,
and there's a lot of other other good folks out
there as well. Um. Yeah, speaking of are are there
what are some other resources if unless that's your list excellent? Yeah?
(28:38):
What are what are some other resources that that people
can go to if they want to learn more about
all of this? So, um, oddly enough or maybe not
oddly enough, I've found a lot of really good stuff
on Instagram that like so different Instagram, not like not
even necessarily like influencers quote unquote, like people who are
(28:58):
like well known, although sometimes hims, but just like people
who are really passionate about this stuff. So Pascal Bowder
is somebody who does a lot with um Wild Foods,
and he's working a lot with UM Wild invasives right now,
and he's been really pivotal in. One of the things
that I teach is thinking of wild invasive plants as
(29:19):
food waste because we can go out and we can
like forage this stuff. It's free food, and it's so
much better to do to try to population control, um
you know, garlic mustard or something in that way as
opposed to like spraying it or um you know, mowing
it and you know with a gas mower or whatever.
So um, so that's been really good. Um Zero waste
(29:43):
chef is another one. And there's a lot of other
there's like a lot of homesteading and kind of um
no waste kind of accounts out there. Various fermentation folks.
The Ferment Lady is a good one. Um yeah. Um. Also,
the James Beard Foundation has a have a free online
class for culinary instructors. It's you can you can definitely
(30:05):
pull stuff out of it as a home cook and
stuff too, but it's geared towards you instructors of culinary
schools and they have a cookbook and some other stuff
and it's called the Waste Not Initiative. So that's cool.
And so I've also um for folks that want to
do the kind of stuff I'm talking about. I also
have UM an online class that people can can take
(30:28):
called Preserving Abundance, And so I cover all the stuff
I just talked about, beverages and vinegars and sauerkraut and
making lip balm and hot sauce. There's hot sauce. Um. Yeah,
And it all uses food waste and uses that kind
of um, you know, using historic recipes and perspectives to
(30:49):
kind of shift your mindset about food waste so it
feels less scary. What is what is to you that
that mindset that you kind of need to get into
in order to in order to embark on this. I mean,
I think it's it's kind of re empowering ourselves to see,
(31:10):
like like internalizing our ability to create our food and
to work with our food waste as opposed to like
how I was talking about with cans, and like if
you only know canned food that somebody else's canned, like,
then you're at the whim of that person to preserve
any food that you want that's not fresh. And so
there's kind of that perspective of like, you know, what
(31:31):
skills don't I have that I want to make the
food that I want to eat and then there's also
this like, um, this idea of I'm still trying to
figure out exactly like the most sustinct way to say,
but this idea of um of thinking of food abundance
(31:53):
within like the entire ingredients. So for example, if you
have a carrot, you're thinking about the tops and you know,
the peels and the carrot, and like the whole thing
gives you different things to play with and things to do,
so it's not like you look at it and you
throw the tops in the trash and then you know,
peel it and then use it and you have like
two thirds of the thing is gone. So thinking about
(32:14):
abundance in that way, UM, I think it's a really
good way to get um, get people to start thinking
in that direction. And also when you do that, you
can be like, okay, well what is this like? You know,
what are these peels like? Or what is this you
know these carrot tops? Oh, I've made you know, a
pesto out of whatever before I can take these and
(32:34):
chop them up and make something like that, yeah, or
even just use them as a as a car And
I don't think that I knew that carrot tabs are
edible until about a year ago, and I was like, oh,
these are delicious, Like you can you can just kind
of throw them in a a in a super stew
the way that you would personally. It adds a tiny
bit of a kick, a little like weird bitterness, which
I love. Yeah, so yeah, weird bitterness, weird bitterness. It's delicious.
(32:59):
The show cheerfully weird bitterness here. Um uh where? Uh? Well,
is there is there anything else that you want to
to talk about? Any maybe any like a like favorite
(33:20):
weird historical things you got super excited about or I've
so I've started making this thing called Tarhana, which is
a soup powder. It's like a dried soup powder. It's
Turkish and I've had it like I've had the soup before,
but I didn't know anything about the soup powder, and
still started researching the history of different ferments and I
(33:41):
was like, oh God, I didn't realize that this this
thing is so wonderful. And yes, so you take it's
got several different microbial processes going on. So there's yogurt
in there, and there's also flour and so you have
lactic acid fermentation as well as yeast fermentation. Happening, and
it's just basically it's yogurt, flower legumes, usually chickpeas, um,
(34:06):
I think some grains sometimes sometimes people like break up
old bread in it, veggies, herbs. It is many things
there and they're all smooshed together and then um fermented
and then rolled into balls and sun dried and then
crumbled and you have like an instant soup powder and
it's been around for hundreds of years and it's amazing
(34:29):
and like it's sour and lovely and like vegetable and
it's really really nutritious. Yeah. It sounds like a beautiful
version of like a hot and sour soup. Yeah. Yeah,
it's amazing. Wow. Uh. You also were posting on some
kind of social media the other day about about garum
(34:49):
am I saying that that you made and also a
beef stock version. Yeah yeah so um yeah so fish
sauce and then like beef sauce delicious. No, no it is, No,
it was actually really good. Um. I haven't found out
(35:10):
really an appetizing way to like describe it yet, but
it's really nice. Like so the one I made, I
took um maple sugar and beef um, just like beef
scraps and salt, and some show you that I made
to like a soy sauce, made soy sauce and packed
all in a jar and let it sit for a
while and then had that and then similar for the fish,
(35:31):
except for without the sugar on those ones. Um, when
you're when you're doing these projects, how long running are
some of them? I mean, like like if you want
to start with like a I mean a quick pickle
isn't quite the same thing, but you know that can
be done in like right minutes, right, yeah. And like
some ferments, I mean I'll make um, like fermented pestos
(35:52):
and things, and I'll let them sit for a day, um,
you know, things like sauerkraud or whatever, maybe a couple
of weeks, um a month, kind of depending how sour
you like it. Some of the stuff I do sits
for like over a year, and that's a little excessive
for most people probably who like I don't know, live
with other people and who you know, maybe those other
people want to use the counterspace for something besides like
(36:15):
jars of rotting fish. But for me it works very well,
so um, but yeah, for you can you know, you
can use as little or as much time as you
want to make this stuff. Yeah, Um, is there anything
else that you would like to talk about that we
didn't ask you? I can't think of anything now, Okay, hooray,
(36:38):
Yeah yeah Annie, did did you have anything else? I
have a question because recently on the other show I Do,
we did an episode on environmentalism the difference between men
and women, and there's been all of this study that
not not only does it hurt women more, but it
also falls to women to do a lot of that work.
(37:00):
Is the recycling in the house and of this type
of stuff we're talking about. Um, And so I can
imagine thinking like if you have a family and I
had I have a friend who I think their family
did this really well where they taught the children like
you're going to help withs right, It's really important for
you to know where food is coming from and kind
(37:20):
of reconnecting to your your family and the food. So
I just I'm curious, like if you have any if
you have any tips or or away for someone listening.
It's like, I would love to do that, but I've
got how I'm busy living this all right. Um. You know,
I don't know if you have any thoughts on that.
I mean, I like kind of what you talked about
(37:42):
about your friend, you know, dividing up the labor among
people in the household, and of course that requires having
a household where people are willing to pitch in, which
is a thing. Um, but if you do, um, you
know that seems good. I mean. And also just maybe
sticking to the simpler stuff like maybe maybe trying to
make homemade fish saw us doesn't feel super accessible, but
like you know, taking a jar and dropping some scraps
(38:04):
in it and dumping some oil on it and having
a flavored oil does um. So kind of just like
work within your own limitations and boundaries, like don't you
know they aren't necessarily limitations, they're just kind of the
you know, structure of your life. So I think there's
plenty of stuff you can do. But um, yeah, as
far as the gender dynamics and everything, I mean, yeah,
(38:25):
I definitely think just like with any kitchen thing, women
have a lot more expectations placed on us to have
to make all of this and whatever. So when I
work with a lot of home cooks, I'm like, I
try to make it like is like non daunting as possible.
Because everybody is like I already worked like eighty hours
a week and do a million things, and I don't
have time for this. Frankly, that's that's fair. Yeah, yeah,
(38:51):
and uh, I don't know. The thing that I'm trying
to work on for myself right now is just being
self aware about it, just like being like, Okay, well
I have this amount of rosemary, but I bought her
that I just harvested, and rather than letting it go
moldy in the fridge, just like being self aware that
it's there and then I'm not going to cook with
it again, and just being like, oh, just put just
(39:12):
put that in oil, just put or salt or sugar
or whatever, vinegar or literally anything, then letting bacteria eat
it before or in this case, yeah, mold data before um,
and just trying to change that mindset of just like
Kneil will deal with it later, like later as now. Yeah. Yeah,
I don't know. Yeah, And it's it's a struggle because
again we've, like many of us, weren't raised to have
(39:34):
to think in that way. We were just raised to
kind of be like, if you need more, the stores
right there, and you can just go get more and
it's like clamshell box with like you know whatever, Like
you know, we were just trained that way. So to
try to untrain ourselves, I mean it's taken me years
and I still sometimes do it. We're I'll be like
I just honestly want like this grossbox mac and cheese
and whatever, and like there's absolutely nothing wrong with like,
(39:57):
you know, want eating whatever. But like but also it's
like I've it's still kind of a symbol to me
of how deeply ingrained just that sort of eating and
that sort of perspective perspective about the world is in
me and everybody. Yeah. Yeah, I think when I was
growing up, we had a list. We had a list
(40:18):
of five meals and we just rotated. Yeah, yeah, that's
what we ate. Um. But I think I would have
really enjoyed having kind of that experimental attitude you're talking
about it, like, let's just see what happens with this,
and if you have maybe a plan in place, if
you have like a structure, if this looks like it's
going to go bad, it goes here. If if you
just have that, I would hope that it would make
(40:39):
it easier. Yeah, now it helps, Like once I learned
how to do multiple different kinds of things. So I
learned how to make vinegar and stuff rather than just
knowing how to bake mead. Then it was like if
the mead messed up, it wasn't just like okay, we'll
throw it all in the trash like yeah. I was like, okay,
well I can I can make this into vinegar. I can.
You know, I can either use of vinegar and food
(41:02):
if it tastes good, If it doesn't but it smells nice,
I can use it in my house. And if it,
you know, doesn't really smell great and doesn't taste good,
I can use it um as natural weed killer in
my yard. So like it always has some place it
can go. Yeah yeah, oh no, it's something about that
hierarchy just made me really happy. Is it good for eating?
(41:24):
Is it good for cleaning? Is it good for killing?
Good stuff? And then the killing? Um? Well, where where
can people find you? So? Um? I'm on social media
at at root kitchens and at book as Julia is
my personal one. If you like cat pictures mostly yeah
excellent um and then root hyphen kitchens dot com um
(41:47):
that classes root hyphen kitchens dot com slash p a
for people that want to check that out. Cool, Thank
you so much. Yeah, thank you. That concludes our conversation
with Julia. Um and oh man, I am so excited
too to start doing weird stuff. Oh yeah, you always
(42:09):
talk about getting the goggle. Well it's mostly me if
you go along with it, which I appreciate. But you
can get your goggles out, get your apron on and
just try some stuff. Yeah. And like, I love the idea.
I love how she reframed it and thinking of thinking
of it in a fun, experimental way of reconnecting to
your roots. Julia, that for you, um, instead of thinking
(42:31):
of this is just another thing that I have to
do now, right exactly. Um and yeah, if anyone not
to not to push it, like we're not. She's not
sponsoring us, just just a friend of ours. If you
are curious about the classes that she was talking about,
because yeah, she she is running running some food waste
prevention and reframing abundance kind of classes, you can she
(42:55):
she give us a discount code, yeah, if you'd like to.
If you'd like to use that, you'll get five bucks off.
So it's pretty cool. You can go to root Dash
Kitchens slash p a that's P is in pineapple and
A is an atom. Uh. And then a checkout you
would enter code savor. Yes, and that is s A
v O R because we do have people who have
(43:17):
spelled it with are you. Oh no, I'm not about
it at all. I like a U in a word.
It seems I don't know, refined. It does seem refined.
It's like the R E instead of the E R.
But I do like the A better than the E.
And gray, Okay, these are a very important point. These
(43:41):
are I haven't have your preferences. You do. I haven't
thought that hard about gray, but I but I appreciate
that you have think about it later. So anyway, Yeah,
root Dash Kitchens slash p A entered the code savor
and checkout if you'd like to check that out. Um,
and yeah, that that is our That is our little
conversation about FOD waste for today. For today. Yes, and
(44:03):
we've got a little bit more for you. But first
we've got one more quick break for a word from
our sponsor. And we're back, Thank you sponsor. Yes, and
we're back with listen. Yes, it was supposed to be
(44:31):
the permentation of the lid. Okay, there was some some
special stunts for that one, and he did a spinny
doo in her in her in her studio chair and
didn't knock anything off the table, so it was very impressed.
There's a lot of wires involved. It's indicative of how
(44:51):
tired I am. I feel like that's how my mind
is working now. It's the spinning of the top. Well,
there you go, there you go. I hope, I hope
you get to go home and happen. Now me two friends.
But before that, Chad wrote, I was out for a
walk during a break at work listening to the episode
(45:13):
and literally laughed out loud after listening to Annie's account
of the meatless meatballs and remembering a time when my
mom made wheat balls. Back when I was in high school,
my mom started incorporating our food storree supply foods into
random meals here and they're so she could see how
things did or did not work or if or if not.
My brothers liked and would eat the creations. This brings
(45:35):
me to the infamous wheatballs night. One day, my mom
cooked raw wheat in a croc pot until it puffed
until until it was puffed wheat and for some reason
then decided to make these puffs of grain into wheatballs
to go with our spaghetti. They were terrible, all calfs
love you, Mom, Smiley place. After that night, wheatballs never
(45:58):
made it onto the dinner table again. And after hearing
Annie's account, I paused the episode and how to text
my mom about this memory that we still laugh at
to this day. Wheat fall, seat falls and then in
the spaghetti right. Oh no. I appreciate the again. The creativity, yeah,
willingness to try a new things, absolutely, inventiveness. Come on,
(46:20):
that's great. It is great. And also as it doesn't
turn out, it's great to be able to laugh at
your mistakes and blunders as well. It's true this is
a learning lesson many levels. Come on. Thomas wrote, I
love the podcast thought on right and from Scotland after
your fish and Chips episode. Loved it by the way,
thank you. So. I was born in Witness, just outside
(46:41):
of Liverpool and grew up on proper, fresh and delicious
true fish and chips. Six years ago I moved to Scotland,
which if you didn't know, there have been some rivalries
between the two nations throughout history. But I am pleased
to say that the Scottish welcomed me with open arms.
Mostly within my first year here, still being in high school,
I remember getting into my first fight. I was told
(47:02):
that fish and chips was a Scottish dish and that
the English had no place in claiming it was theirs.
By the end of it, I all decided enough was enough.
I must try these so called fish and chips, I thought,
so that night I went down to my local chippy
short for fish and chip shop. What I discovered was
horrifying away with just simply fish and chips and instead
what is called a fish supper, essentially the same thing,
(47:24):
lashings of brown sauce and the worst of it all,
battered effing mars bars. Six years on and now being
twenty and a little more mature, I realized that at
a certain point, as mentioned in the episode, at a
certain point anything fried tastes good. But I still stand
by my view that only the English can do true
(47:46):
fish and chips. To quote mel Gibson, sort of they
may take our lives, but the Scottish can't do fish
and chips. Very good impression, Lauren mailed mailed it. I
thought I was watching the movie second, it's the makeup
that I brought that I thought, Yeah, see we really
(48:08):
went all in. I did a stunt, she bought make up.
Very believable, just saying teter right. I love that. That's
these little food rivalries brown sauce. I don't even know
what that is, gosh, but yes. Thank you to both
of them for writing in. Yes, and if you would
(48:30):
like to write to us you can. Our email is
Hello at savor pod dot com. We're also on social media.
You can find us on Instagram, Facebook, and Twitter at
savor pod. We do hope to hear from you. Savor
is production of iHeart Radio and Stuff Media. For more
podcasts from my Heart Radio, you can visit the I
Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to
your favorite shows. Thanks as always to our superproducers Dylan
(48:53):
Bagan and Andrew Howard. Thanks to you for listening, and
we hope that lots more good things are coming your
way
Hello, and welcome to save a Protection of I Heart
Radio and Stephanie dat Amnneries and I'm Lauren foc Obam
and today we're talking about food waste. Yes, and we've
really need to talk about this for a while. Um,
but it's one of those things where you always kind
of put it off because it's really depressing. It is,
and we have to talk about the depressing things. But
(00:28):
sometimes it's more fun to talk about rubarb. Honestly, definitely true,
definitely true. Oh what could you do with rubarb? Oh?
All kinds of things, I'm sure. But we're getting ahead
of ourselves because Okay, the fun part about food waste
is that we can help solve it by making delicious
stuff out of things that would otherwise go to waste
in our own kitchens. Um. But the sad part is
(00:52):
how much is going to waste on a local, national,
and global scale. Absolutely very sad. So I guess we
should get to a question, sure, food waste, what is it? Well? Uh,
food waste is food that is produced and then not consumed.
(01:18):
Um that furthermore, is not turned into anything else. Uh,
and is is and goes to waste, just gets thrown out. Yeah,
And it is perhaps a larger problem than I I
can conceive of, because about a third of the food
(01:41):
that the world produces every year goes uneaten one point
three billion tons worth UM as of August of nineteen.
Wasting all of that food costs it's nty billion dollars
every year and is responsible for eight percent of our
total greenhouse gas emissions. And that is that's a bunch
of numbers that are kind of unimaginable, Like I don't
(02:03):
have a good concept of what one point three billion
tons of food is UM, nor how much ninety billion
dollars is. That's an amount of money that I don't
I think the twenty bucks is a lot. So I'm like, oh, okay,
so let's break that down into a more digestible amount.
Perhaps pun not intended, but I'm going to go with it.
In North America, the World Bank estimates that one fred
(02:27):
and twenty calories worth of food per person per day
are wasted. That's a whole extra person's worth of calories
going to waste for every person UM. In other parts
of the world, it's it's more like four hundred and
fifteen to seven hundred and fifty calories. Like we in particular,
(02:48):
have a lot of work to do. Yeah. Um. And
another set I saw thrown around a lot of food waste.
Was a country, it would be the third largest greenhouse
gas emetter, behind China and the United States. The global
annual value of food waste is one trillion dollars. Who
so it's huge. Yeah. Um. In the U s alone
(03:12):
is ofen we uh, farms, businesses, consumers. We spent two
eighteen billion dollars on food we don't actually eat. It's
one point three percent of our of our gross domestic product. Wo. Um,
that is wasted by businesses, ten perent by farms two
(03:33):
during manufacturing, but in our homes. Um. So we invited
a friend to come joints today. Who's who's been working
on waste reduction in our own home and has started
teaching classes on it. Dr Julia Skinner of Root Kitchens. Yeah.
(03:53):
You might remember Julia from our episode on teatime from July. Um,
apple ply are our apple? Right? Yeah? She We had
a video where we did a medieval inspired apple pie.
It was delicious. It was difficult to eat, perhaps so
good a man. The video features are cat quick crag.
(04:14):
It was it was wonderful it was wonderful. Um. But
before we get Julia on here talking about what you
perhaps can do about it, let's talk about what can
be done about food waste on that larger scale, that
other that is not us, that's that's industry and businesses
(04:35):
and stuff. Um. So many many cultures are in fact
taking on food waste on a national legislative scale. In
South Korea, for example, the disposal of food waste in
landfills was outlawed in two thousand five, and between then
and UM, South Korea managed to reduce home and restaurant
food waste by over and they started recycling their food
(04:59):
waste as compost or or animal feed. So good steps, yes,
the right direction, absolutely UM. Japan and Taiwan similarly recycle
up to a third of their food waste is animal feed.
The EU, the European Union, has a Waste Directive in
place that aims to prevent all biodegradable waste, including food,
(05:20):
from going to landfills. By however, efforts are being made
kind of sporadically across member nations. As perhaps you might expect,
there are still laws on the books preventing surplus food
from going to animals for feed. Due to outdated disease
control laws. And this is kind of at the heart
of a lot of the problems of these laws that
(05:41):
certainly in the past we're good for preventing disease breakout.
You don't want that. Nobody wants sick cows, nobody wants
sick people. Let's not know, but you know, modern times,
modern transportation UM on a more global scale UM In
the United Nations Food and Agriculture Organization, the f AO
(06:02):
included food waste and food loss in this larger set
of sustainable development goals for Yes. Within those goals, Target
twelve point three is uh by have per capita global
food waste that have cut in half yet at the
retail and consumer levels, and reduce food losses along production
(06:24):
and supply chains, including post harvest losses. And there are
a whole bunch of of suggestions and goals for how
to do that. But based on that, the United States
created the US twenty thirty Food Loss and Waste Reduction Goal,
same target. There's also nonprofits working, but yeah, changes are
being proposed across the entire food supply chain. Here UM
(06:46):
stuff like a food and material scientists are working on
ways of better storing and packaging foods before they reach consumers.
There's conversations about expiration date labeling standard station something that
we talked about way back when in our Expiry Date episode. Yeah,
I know that there was a lot of attention. When
(07:09):
you know, whenever John Oliver does a piece on something
was attention gets pointed towards it for a brief moment. Well,
I don't know how brief, but anyway, about how we
can't donate a lot of the food, even if it's
sometimes even if it's like packaged to people who are hungry. Um.
And I remember and when I was in college, my
um my room what are they called, the first who
(07:32):
ran the hallway the r A S Yeah whatever. She
was so sweet and she had this whole day where
we like put on hairnets, we put on gloves, and
we made sandwiches for the homeless and we went to
donate them and they said we can't donate them because
of the law. Um. So I know there's talk about
changing things like that. And I understand, like you said,
about concerns of um disease or food poison bacteria, whatever
(07:56):
it might be, but it seems like there must be
a way an intersection where we could do better than
than just throwing it away. Yeah. Um. In a report
by the World Resources Institute that was released August twenty
nine of this year, so just a few days ago
as of this recording. Um. This team of researchers, this
huge team of researchers recommended things like like education for
(08:19):
produced purchasers and consumers too to underline the inherent quality
and foods that aren't currently being bought and sold for
what are essentially cosmetic reasons like bruising on fruit or
weird looking apples. Um uh. And then also like the
construction of processing facilities near farms to create salable value
(08:43):
added products. Um. From what's still unmarketable after that education, Uh,
can stuff process it into other stuff? Make I don't know,
lip bomb. Uh. Lip bomb is going to come back
in a moment. It will make sense soon, it will um. Yeah,
what's still unmarketable? Um, And from various byproducts make I
(09:03):
don't know, makes some, makes some, make some Sara Kraut delicious,
make some hots again yeah um. And then also just
to further education for consumers about how to store and
use foods, which brings us to Julia. So we're going
to come in with an interview with her, but first
(09:26):
we're going to take a quick break for a word
from our sponsor. And we're back. Thank you sponsor. And
here's our conversation with Julia. Hi, Hi Julia, how are you? Hi?
(09:47):
I'm good? How are you doing? Just all right? How?
Hi Annie? How are you? I am tired. I'm not
gonna try to, but I am very excited to see you.
But one, because you bought gifts, you came with gif always.
Plus absolutely, this isn't the only reason we keep inviting,
not at all, not at all, but a main one.
(10:10):
It's a side perk for sure. And also we love
having you your good friend of ours. Always good conversation. Yeah,
and the and the food gifts that you brought with
you today are our food waste related because that's what
we're talking about. Yeah, so you brought I'm just gonna
talk about it just because it's sitting right in front
of me and I'm about to accidentally drink it at
(10:31):
any given moment. So, so we've got a watermelon pickle. Yeah,
So it's a watermelon rind. So historically people would pickle
the rind and then um, just to use up all
parts of the watermelon. And then I also brought lip
bomb that I made out of food scraps, out of
lavender and out of apple cores. It smells delightful. It
does smell delightful. We just did an episode on lavender.
(10:51):
So oh yeah, yeah, ties In, I was mistaken that
it would keep the lions away, but I still like
the smell. That's good, yeah, my favorite. Uh what what
got you into food preservation and waste avoidance to begin with?
So in my early early adulthood, I was pretty broke
(11:15):
all the time, and I like, so all of my
food came from food banks, and I I didn't yet
really know how to cook or do anything, and so
it's like I was just eating this food bank food
and I was like, wow, you know, I'm really tired
of eating like a can of corn for dinner. Like
there has to be some other way I can get
about affording to eat and um. And so I, uh,
(11:38):
what I ended up doing was learning how to garden,
talking to friends who were farmers, things like that, learning
how to preserve food, all these things, and then slowly
started to incorporate that myself into my own life. And
I also got on EBT rather than just going to
the food bank. So I actually got to do things
like purchase fresh vegetables, which was super cool, and said
(11:59):
that I like, I can preserve these vegetables and then
eat them and have a nutrient perhaps um. And so
that's kind of how I started getting into that, and
I've been doing that ever since at this point like
fifteen sixteen years goodness. Yeah, so a while, Um, and
your your background is in is in history? Your food historian? Yeah? Um?
(12:22):
How does that provide a lens for your for your
work and all of this? So I first encountered food
history as an area of study in two thousand eight,
which was when I was um, still doing this, like
you know, on EBT and still kind of finding my
feet financially. Um. And so I was still really trying
to reduce my own food waste, and I was finding
that it was hard for me to do that sustainably.
(12:46):
Like it was because I'd be like, oh gosh, this
just feels really overwhelming. I feel really anxious about whether
or not I'm doing this right, etcetera, etcetera, or like
I'm tired and maybe I don't want to think about
like what to do with all of these peels today. Um,
And so it started. It started out kind of in
that space, and then as I discovered historic food, I
(13:08):
was like, oh wow, I can use this as a
way to actually make doing this fun. So like I'm like, oh, hey,
look at all these ways that people did this historically.
Now I can go through this, um, you know, through
finding what to do out with these peels and actually
be like, oh wow, apple scrap vinegar amazing, let's make that.
And then I can learn all this history stuff and
make this. So it ended up making it go from
(13:32):
being just a you know, a thing I had to
do because I was broke, to a thing I actually
liked doing. So it was it was exciting. Yeah, absolutely,
I feel I feel like that tiredness is a pretty
core part of why I don't more of that. So yeah,
that's like most people I talked to and they're I'm like, yeah,
why do you not or why like why do you
(13:54):
not waste food or why do you feel like you're
not able to cut down on waste? And They're just like, oh,
it's just so much work, and I'm like it doesn't
have to be. But we all like what we feel
like that and it's overwhelming and it makes you anxious,
so I get it. So so this is this is
like a ridiculously big question, but kind of in review, Um,
(14:17):
how have waste preservation techniques and technologies changed throughout human history?
All of it? Well, so, so like before the Industrial Revolution,
we're mostly looking at waste on like a town or
household level. You know, you don't have like a factory
(14:37):
that's producing so so so much stuff for people, um,
you know, for thousands of people in different towns around
the world. Um, so you're just like, okay, what do
we do at the household level, like the kind of
stuff I teach, like what a restaurant does or a
home cook does or whatever. And so you see things
like pre industrial Revolution, there are some guidelines and things
(14:59):
that people would share, um that when we did the
apple pie making things. That same book, UM has a
bunch of food waste stuff in it. So most of
it's like feeding these scraps to livestock or like maybe
a couple of recipes for using them in their mostly
livestock feeding. But um, which makes sense given what the
(15:21):
book was. Yeah, so you mostly see that, and then um,
so we see people also preserving things of course to
get through the winter and stuff like that, you know,
so that they don't go hungry. Um. But then when
we get to the Industrial Revolution, we see all of this, Um.
We see both changes in transportation and in food preservation,
(15:43):
so you can can all of this stuff and then
suddenly it can go all around the country on the railroads,
and so you have kind of this new way of
engaging with food and food waste. And so it was
really I think we were only thinking about waste if
it could be used for another product they can make
money off of, so like hot dogs or something or
(16:04):
like I'm not a margarine expert, but I seem to
recall it margarine was initially like some waste product of
something else. I don't know if that's true, maybe fact
check that. But but you know, through through the grapevine,
I have been told this, um. And yeah, so we
had to start thinking in a much larger scale about
(16:26):
what waste looked like. Um. And then now you know,
today we're so used to all of the packaging waste
and all of the whatever that it's just a totally
different world that started with the Industrial Revolution, but is
so different from you know, historically, how really much of
our waste operations have looked. Um. Yeah, it's it's like
an entirely different concept of what abundance means, of what
(16:48):
what food and hunger since the Industrial Revolution. So yeah,
the Industrial Revolution, like I said, you know, we have
the railroad technologies and all the canning and all of that,
and so then once we get to the world where
two period, then we also have you know, kind of
this increased abundance. The US is you know, really wealthy
and all of that, and so it's we're like, oh,
(17:11):
we have all these convenience products. They're being marketed as
like the hot new thing, and everybody's like I want
the hot new thing. Let's have lime jello with like
whatever and it for dinner. That sounds great. Um. And
so then abundance, like the concept of abundance and hunger
and all of this meant instead of having a pantry
full of stuff that like say you can or your
(17:31):
family caned and like fresh vegetables and like cured meats
and kind of the stuff that we would historically see, Um,
you know, an abundant pantry was just like a bunch
of cans that you bought it of store that were
stuff that people made, like they grew it far away,
they canned it far away, you went to this really
sterile environment and went and picked it up and then
put it in your house. And so it's this really
(17:53):
disconnecting way of being feeling like things are abundant and
it feels like you have to rely externally on like
somebody else to produce this stuff, like we don't know
how to like, Okay, well I don't know how to
can this, so now I'm at the whim of whoever
is making these cans rather than knowing how to do
it yourself. So yeah, it's I feel like we're kind
(18:13):
of coming full circle and a lot of people are
like wanting to homesteadying and all these other slow food
and all these other things that try to reconnect them,
uh and move them away from just the like can
of food or box of mac and cheese or whatever. Yeah,
because it's um. When I really started thinking about it,
(18:34):
it really kind of creeped me out. The next time
that I like walked into a supermarket and I was like,
these products are You just walk into the protucy and
you're like, these products are from all over the world.
There's no good reason why I should be getting a
fresh tomato in December. Uh. And and there's there's no
good reason why I should have seventy eight fresh chickens
(18:57):
to choose from. Yeah, like that's why. Yeah. And then
like all the packaging that they're wrapped in and everything,
it's like why is the tomato now in like plastic wrap?
Like why like does it need to be Yeah, it's
it's in this clamshell because you know, because you have
to transport it from Chile, and so of course it's
in a clam shell. We don't want it to get bruised,
right because an ugly tomato or a bruised tomato was
(19:19):
completely useless. Yeah, it'll just get thrown out. Anyways. Yeah,
you talked, you talked a little bit about this, but um,
but how have you in I don't want to say,
like your lifetime, Like how how have you in our
our lifetimes? Um, seen this change like like personally like
like not even I guess from or yeah, yeah, like
you spoke to how when you were a younger adult
(19:41):
you started exploring this, but um, but yeah, what what
have you what have you seen the community in general?
Do so? I think when I was a kid in
the eighties, Um, people still seemed pretty invested in prepackaged
food and didn't seem I mean, obviously this isn't a
hard fast role for everybody because that's not possible. Um,
(20:03):
but um, but people still seemed pretty okay with prepackaged
food and that convenience kind of being the norm. Like
convenient food is better food, whether or not the food
itself is better. Um. And now I feel like we're
seeing more and eagerness to try new things. We're seeing
people wanting more flavors, more different preparations, wanting to know
(20:25):
where their foods from just in the past, say, you know,
twenty and especially the last ten years. And so it's
like we're seeing that and I think that's great because
it means, you know, people are exploring and learning, but
they're also open to having conversations about things like food
waste and about um, different ways of preparing food and
engaging with food. And it's not like, you know, if
(20:46):
I tried to have that conversation with like, you know,
say like my grandma in the fifties or something, she
would be like, I don't have a lot of social
context for this, you know, like I understand that, like
wasting food is bad and I compost and stuff, but
we're not having cultural, you know, large scale conversations about it. Um. Yeah,
I I think I mean, did did your andy, did
(21:09):
did your family or did your did your immediate family
or did your grandparents? Um? Do any like composting any
canning of their own? I I have no idea how
like connected to the land your family was. Like I
remember my my mom's parents had a small garden out back,
and they would they would compost, and they would, uh,
at the very least make fresh food out of I
don't think they did a lot of canning, but they
(21:31):
would the very least make fresh food out of what
they had, maybe maybe a jar pickles here and there.
But how about you, oh man, my family didn't really
do any of that. Um. But my neighbor was a survivalist.
Who Ever wondered where I learned to throw knives and axes,
it was him, I have wondered question. It's a fair question.
(21:59):
But he did. He really did, and he was all
about it, and he had he had gardens, and he
would can and he did it in a much more
of a different sense of like it's a bomb shelter.
It could happen, but he would give me cans of stuff.
And I do think it's the when someone gives you
something like the gifts that you bring it does have
(22:20):
a more important as more value to me because someone
made it, and I would assume you're not trying to
murder me. That's false. But it feels like harder to
throw away, I guess, opposed to like something I just
(22:40):
bought at the store, maybe on a whim. And I
don't really I don't really know about this. Yeah, yeah, totally. Um,
so how can how can people start? It seems again
like like I'm tired and it seems very daunting to
to even get started thinking about being less wasteful and
(23:04):
and and producing something useful and good and fun. Um
what do um? What do you need to get started?
I mean not much, which is nice, Like it's we
already have all of the tools we need to do
this by virtue of things that like, you know, different
ways of cooking that have been passed down to us,
by virtue of just the ingredients that we have, So
(23:26):
we have all of the base stuff there. Um, So
I tell people, like one of the critical things instead
of just being like trying to do everything at once
because you'll go nuts, probably is so I'll tell them,
you know, find one or two things that interest you.
Start there. So like something as simple as taking you know,
citrus peels or something and infusing them in vinegar and
(23:48):
then using it to cook or clean with, or you know,
taking like veggie scraps and saving them in your freezer
and making stock out of them once you have like
a chicken carcass or something like simple stuff like that. Um.
And then it's like if you find something that interests you,
like with the historic stuff I do, it's like, okay,
well this is nice because then you have this larger
(24:09):
kind of perspective that you can um fit fit this into.
So like, oh, I'm interested in I don't know, medieval food,
let's say, and it's like, okay, well how did people
do this in the Middle Ages? And let's find out
And you know, now it becomes a project and makes
it actually fun and interesting and isn't just like okay, well,
here's like a recipe that you're never going to implement
(24:29):
because you're exhausted. Yeah. Uh, do you do you have
any do you have any favorites? Any? Um? Any and
anything that you're just like constantly doing or that you
really look forward to. I make a lot of ferments
fermented food all the time, so um, anything from like
pickling stems and ends like broccoli stems and stuff like
(24:52):
that make really good pickles, um, sauer kraut e things. Um,
just because it's kind of easy to grate up a
bunch of tables and mash them together and then ferment them. Um.
I make a lot of meat too, So if I
have like mushy fruit or something, I'll just like take
it and put it into a container with some honey
and some water, and I'm just like, oh, let's see,
(25:14):
like this might be terrible, but it might be good.
Like we'll find out most of the time it's good.
If it's terrible, I just turned it into vinegar and
use it to clean my house. Yeah. Yeah. Uh my
brain just went so many, so many lovely pieces. I
was like, I was like, what would that like like
weird like citron peel and and mushy apple. Yeah, do
(25:38):
as a bathroom cleaner? That sounds lovely? Yeah it does.
It makes your house smell really nice. Yeah, not good
to taste probably, well, it depends but yeah, sometimes good
to taste, sometimes not not really at all. Do you
do you have any weird weird ones? So, like, um,
home craft stuff is one of the ones that I
(25:59):
think is kind of weird because I think people, um,
when you say food waste, people assume that you're limited
to doing this in the kitchen, like doing a reuse
in the kitchen. But of course people have used food
scraps for all sorts of things throughout history to you know,
you know, gardening of course, compost and all of that,
um and livestock feed and stuff, but also like dies
(26:21):
and inks, um, like those lip bombs that I made,
All all kinds of stuff like that are all you know,
just food scrap based. And that's one of my favorite
things to do. Is like I make dies probably every week,
and I'm like running out of pieces of fabric to
die with these with these things, and so I'm like
I have to go buy more, like T shirts or something.
(26:44):
Oh that's a fun problem to have, it is, I
like it. Uh, Okay, you spoke a little bit about
lacto fermentation and and just sort of like putting stuff
in a jar and letting it do its thing. That
seems daunting to me because I'm like, that seems like
a good way for me to give myself food. Point snaing. Um,
but I understand on like a scientific level that it's
(27:04):
actually relatively difficult to do. So if you know what
you're doing, could you could you could you walk us
through the process of not giving yourself replicing. Yeah, So basically, um,
one of the main things you want to do is
make sure that all of your substrates, so that's just
the fruit or vegetable um, stays completely under the brine um.
Lacto fermentation is anaerobic, and so the instant that you
(27:26):
introduce air, you introduce like the possibility for molds and
other stuff you don't want to grow on that. If
it's just a brine um, you know, it'll it'll be
safe if it's all under there. So usually I'll put
it in a jar and wait it or you know,
put an airlock on it, or there's any number of
things you can do. UM you do that, let it sit,
(27:48):
like check it every day, just make sure you know, know,
like little pieces of cabbage have float it up to
the top, or like nothing's molding or nothing. You know,
it feels like it's going off, you gonna try to
limit the amount of air that's getting in there. So
if you have the container all the way full, that's best. Um,
and you know you can always There's a ton of
(28:09):
great resources out there. I mean, obviously the art of
fermentation is kind of the gold standard that a lot
of people use, but there's a lot of others. Um
Ferment Works has several different really good uh fermentation books,
and there's a lot of other other good folks out
there as well. Um. Yeah, speaking of are are there
what are some other resources if unless that's your list excellent? Yeah?
(28:38):
What are what are some other resources that that people
can go to if they want to learn more about
all of this? So, um, oddly enough or maybe not
oddly enough, I've found a lot of really good stuff
on Instagram that like so different Instagram, not like not
even necessarily like influencers quote unquote, like people who are
(28:58):
like well known, although sometimes hims, but just like people
who are really passionate about this stuff. So Pascal Bowder
is somebody who does a lot with um Wild Foods,
and he's working a lot with UM Wild invasives right now,
and he's been really pivotal in. One of the things
that I teach is thinking of wild invasive plants as
(29:19):
food waste because we can go out and we can
like forage this stuff. It's free food, and it's so
much better to do to try to population control, um
you know, garlic mustard or something in that way as
opposed to like spraying it or um you know, mowing
it and you know with a gas mower or whatever.
So um, so that's been really good. Um Zero waste
(29:43):
chef is another one. And there's a lot of other
there's like a lot of homesteading and kind of um
no waste kind of accounts out there. Various fermentation folks.
The Ferment Lady is a good one. Um yeah. Um. Also,
the James Beard Foundation has a have a free online
class for culinary instructors. It's you can you can definitely
(30:05):
pull stuff out of it as a home cook and
stuff too, but it's geared towards you instructors of culinary
schools and they have a cookbook and some other stuff
and it's called the Waste Not Initiative. So that's cool.
And so I've also um for folks that want to
do the kind of stuff I'm talking about. I also
have UM an online class that people can can take
(30:28):
called Preserving Abundance, And so I cover all the stuff
I just talked about, beverages and vinegars and sauerkraut and
making lip balm and hot sauce. There's hot sauce. Um. Yeah,
And it all uses food waste and uses that kind
of um, you know, using historic recipes and perspectives to
(30:49):
kind of shift your mindset about food waste so it
feels less scary. What is what is to you that
that mindset that you kind of need to get into
in order to in order to embark on this. I mean,
I think it's it's kind of re empowering ourselves to see,
(31:10):
like like internalizing our ability to create our food and
to work with our food waste as opposed to like
how I was talking about with cans, and like if
you only know canned food that somebody else's canned, like,
then you're at the whim of that person to preserve
any food that you want that's not fresh. And so
there's kind of that perspective of like, you know, what
(31:31):
skills don't I have that I want to make the
food that I want to eat and then there's also
this like, um, this idea of I'm still trying to
figure out exactly like the most sustinct way to say,
but this idea of um of thinking of food abundance
(31:53):
within like the entire ingredients. So for example, if you
have a carrot, you're thinking about the tops and you know,
the peels and the carrot, and like the whole thing
gives you different things to play with and things to do,
so it's not like you look at it and you
throw the tops in the trash and then you know,
peel it and then use it and you have like
two thirds of the thing is gone. So thinking about
(32:14):
abundance in that way, UM, I think it's a really
good way to get um, get people to start thinking
in that direction. And also when you do that, you
can be like, okay, well what is this like? You know,
what are these peels like? Or what is this you
know these carrot tops? Oh, I've made you know, a
pesto out of whatever before I can take these and
(32:34):
chop them up and make something like that, yeah, or
even just use them as a as a car And
I don't think that I knew that carrot tabs are
edible until about a year ago, and I was like, oh,
these are delicious, Like you can you can just kind
of throw them in a a in a super stew
the way that you would personally. It adds a tiny
bit of a kick, a little like weird bitterness, which
I love. Yeah, so yeah, weird bitterness, weird bitterness. It's delicious.
(32:59):
The show cheerfully weird bitterness here. Um uh where? Uh? Well,
is there is there anything else that you want to
to talk about? Any maybe any like a like favorite
(33:20):
weird historical things you got super excited about or I've
so I've started making this thing called Tarhana, which is
a soup powder. It's like a dried soup powder. It's
Turkish and I've had it like I've had the soup before,
but I didn't know anything about the soup powder, and
still started researching the history of different ferments and I
(33:41):
was like, oh God, I didn't realize that this this
thing is so wonderful. And yes, so you take it's
got several different microbial processes going on. So there's yogurt
in there, and there's also flour and so you have
lactic acid fermentation as well as yeast fermentation. Happening, and
it's just basically it's yogurt, flower legumes, usually chickpeas, um,
(34:06):
I think some grains sometimes sometimes people like break up
old bread in it, veggies, herbs. It is many things
there and they're all smooshed together and then um fermented
and then rolled into balls and sun dried and then
crumbled and you have like an instant soup powder and
it's been around for hundreds of years and it's amazing
(34:29):
and like it's sour and lovely and like vegetable and
it's really really nutritious. Yeah. It sounds like a beautiful
version of like a hot and sour soup. Yeah. Yeah,
it's amazing. Wow. Uh. You also were posting on some
kind of social media the other day about about garum
(34:49):
am I saying that that you made and also a
beef stock version. Yeah yeah so um yeah so fish
sauce and then like beef sauce delicious. No, no it is, No,
it was actually really good. Um. I haven't found out
(35:10):
really an appetizing way to like describe it yet, but
it's really nice. Like so the one I made, I
took um maple sugar and beef um, just like beef
scraps and salt, and some show you that I made
to like a soy sauce, made soy sauce and packed
all in a jar and let it sit for a
while and then had that and then similar for the fish,
(35:31):
except for without the sugar on those ones. Um, when
you're when you're doing these projects, how long running are
some of them? I mean, like like if you want
to start with like a I mean a quick pickle
isn't quite the same thing, but you know that can
be done in like right minutes, right, yeah. And like
some ferments, I mean I'll make um, like fermented pestos
(35:52):
and things, and I'll let them sit for a day, um,
you know, things like sauerkraud or whatever, maybe a couple
of weeks, um a month, kind of depending how sour
you like it. Some of the stuff I do sits
for like over a year, and that's a little excessive
for most people probably who like I don't know, live
with other people and who you know, maybe those other
people want to use the counterspace for something besides like
(36:15):
jars of rotting fish. But for me it works very well,
so um, but yeah, for you can you know, you
can use as little or as much time as you
want to make this stuff. Yeah, Um, is there anything
else that you would like to talk about that we
didn't ask you? I can't think of anything now, Okay, hooray,
(36:38):
Yeah yeah Annie, did did you have anything else? I
have a question because recently on the other show I Do,
we did an episode on environmentalism the difference between men
and women, and there's been all of this study that
not not only does it hurt women more, but it
also falls to women to do a lot of that work.
(37:00):
Is the recycling in the house and of this type
of stuff we're talking about. Um, And so I can
imagine thinking like if you have a family and I
had I have a friend who I think their family
did this really well where they taught the children like
you're going to help withs right, It's really important for
you to know where food is coming from and kind
(37:20):
of reconnecting to your your family and the food. So
I just I'm curious, like if you have any if
you have any tips or or away for someone listening.
It's like, I would love to do that, but I've
got how I'm busy living this all right. Um. You know,
I don't know if you have any thoughts on that.
I mean, I like kind of what you talked about
(37:42):
about your friend, you know, dividing up the labor among
people in the household, and of course that requires having
a household where people are willing to pitch in, which
is a thing. Um, but if you do, um, you
know that seems good. I mean. And also just maybe
sticking to the simpler stuff like maybe maybe trying to
make homemade fish saw us doesn't feel super accessible, but
like you know, taking a jar and dropping some scraps
(38:04):
in it and dumping some oil on it and having
a flavored oil does um. So kind of just like
work within your own limitations and boundaries, like don't you
know they aren't necessarily limitations, they're just kind of the
you know, structure of your life. So I think there's
plenty of stuff you can do. But um, yeah, as
far as the gender dynamics and everything, I mean, yeah,
(38:25):
I definitely think just like with any kitchen thing, women
have a lot more expectations placed on us to have
to make all of this and whatever. So when I
work with a lot of home cooks, I'm like, I
try to make it like is like non daunting as possible.
Because everybody is like I already worked like eighty hours
a week and do a million things, and I don't
have time for this. Frankly, that's that's fair. Yeah, yeah,
(38:51):
and uh, I don't know. The thing that I'm trying
to work on for myself right now is just being
self aware about it, just like being like, Okay, well
I have this amount of rosemary, but I bought her
that I just harvested, and rather than letting it go
moldy in the fridge, just like being self aware that
it's there and then I'm not going to cook with
it again, and just being like, oh, just put just
(39:12):
put that in oil, just put or salt or sugar
or whatever, vinegar or literally anything, then letting bacteria eat
it before or in this case, yeah, mold data before um,
and just trying to change that mindset of just like
Kneil will deal with it later, like later as now. Yeah. Yeah,
I don't know. Yeah, And it's it's a struggle because
again we've, like many of us, weren't raised to have
(39:34):
to think in that way. We were just raised to
kind of be like, if you need more, the stores
right there, and you can just go get more and
it's like clamshell box with like you know whatever, Like
you know, we were just trained that way. So to
try to untrain ourselves, I mean it's taken me years
and I still sometimes do it. We're I'll be like
I just honestly want like this grossbox mac and cheese
and whatever, and like there's absolutely nothing wrong with like,
(39:57):
you know, want eating whatever. But like but also it's
like I've it's still kind of a symbol to me
of how deeply ingrained just that sort of eating and
that sort of perspective perspective about the world is in
me and everybody. Yeah. Yeah, I think when I was
growing up, we had a list. We had a list
(40:18):
of five meals and we just rotated. Yeah, yeah, that's
what we ate. Um. But I think I would have
really enjoyed having kind of that experimental attitude you're talking
about it, like, let's just see what happens with this,
and if you have maybe a plan in place, if
you have like a structure, if this looks like it's
going to go bad, it goes here. If if you
just have that, I would hope that it would make
(40:39):
it easier. Yeah, now it helps, Like once I learned
how to do multiple different kinds of things. So I
learned how to make vinegar and stuff rather than just
knowing how to bake mead. Then it was like if
the mead messed up, it wasn't just like okay, we'll
throw it all in the trash like yeah. I was like, okay,
well I can I can make this into vinegar. I can.
You know, I can either use of vinegar and food
(41:02):
if it tastes good, If it doesn't but it smells nice,
I can use it in my house. And if it,
you know, doesn't really smell great and doesn't taste good,
I can use it um as natural weed killer in
my yard. So like it always has some place it
can go. Yeah yeah, oh no, it's something about that
hierarchy just made me really happy. Is it good for eating?
(41:24):
Is it good for cleaning? Is it good for killing?
Good stuff? And then the killing? Um? Well, where where
can people find you? So? Um? I'm on social media
at at root kitchens and at book as Julia is
my personal one. If you like cat pictures mostly yeah
excellent um and then root hyphen kitchens dot com um
(41:47):
that classes root hyphen kitchens dot com slash p a
for people that want to check that out. Cool, Thank
you so much. Yeah, thank you. That concludes our conversation
with Julia. Um and oh man, I am so excited
too to start doing weird stuff. Oh yeah, you always
(42:09):
talk about getting the goggle. Well it's mostly me if
you go along with it, which I appreciate. But you
can get your goggles out, get your apron on and
just try some stuff. Yeah. And like, I love the idea.
I love how she reframed it and thinking of thinking
of it in a fun, experimental way of reconnecting to
your roots. Julia, that for you, um, instead of thinking
(42:31):
of this is just another thing that I have to
do now, right exactly. Um and yeah, if anyone not
to not to push it, like we're not. She's not
sponsoring us, just just a friend of ours. If you
are curious about the classes that she was talking about,
because yeah, she she is running running some food waste
prevention and reframing abundance kind of classes, you can she
(42:55):
she give us a discount code, yeah, if you'd like to.
If you'd like to use that, you'll get five bucks off.
So it's pretty cool. You can go to root Dash
Kitchens slash p a that's P is in pineapple and
A is an atom. Uh. And then a checkout you
would enter code savor. Yes, and that is s A
v O R because we do have people who have
(43:17):
spelled it with are you. Oh no, I'm not about
it at all. I like a U in a word.
It seems I don't know, refined. It does seem refined.
It's like the R E instead of the E R.
But I do like the A better than the E.
And gray, Okay, these are a very important point. These
(43:41):
are I haven't have your preferences. You do. I haven't
thought that hard about gray, but I but I appreciate
that you have think about it later. So anyway, Yeah,
root Dash Kitchens slash p A entered the code savor
and checkout if you'd like to check that out. Um,
and yeah, that that is our That is our little
conversation about FOD waste for today. For today. Yes, and
(44:03):
we've got a little bit more for you. But first
we've got one more quick break for a word from
our sponsor. And we're back, Thank you sponsor. Yes, and
we're back with listen. Yes, it was supposed to be
(44:31):
the permentation of the lid. Okay, there was some some
special stunts for that one, and he did a spinny
doo in her in her in her studio chair and
didn't knock anything off the table, so it was very impressed.
There's a lot of wires involved. It's indicative of how
(44:51):
tired I am. I feel like that's how my mind
is working now. It's the spinning of the top. Well,
there you go, there you go. I hope, I hope
you get to go home and happen. Now me two friends.
But before that, Chad wrote, I was out for a
walk during a break at work listening to the episode
(45:13):
and literally laughed out loud after listening to Annie's account
of the meatless meatballs and remembering a time when my
mom made wheat balls. Back when I was in high school,
my mom started incorporating our food storree supply foods into
random meals here and they're so she could see how
things did or did not work or if or if not.
My brothers liked and would eat the creations. This brings
(45:35):
me to the infamous wheatballs night. One day, my mom
cooked raw wheat in a croc pot until it puffed
until until it was puffed wheat and for some reason
then decided to make these puffs of grain into wheatballs
to go with our spaghetti. They were terrible, all calfs
love you, Mom, Smiley place. After that night, wheatballs never
(45:58):
made it onto the dinner table again. And after hearing
Annie's account, I paused the episode and how to text
my mom about this memory that we still laugh at
to this day. Wheat fall, seat falls and then in
the spaghetti right. Oh no. I appreciate the again. The creativity, yeah,
willingness to try a new things, absolutely, inventiveness. Come on,
(46:20):
that's great. It is great. And also as it doesn't
turn out, it's great to be able to laugh at
your mistakes and blunders as well. It's true this is
a learning lesson many levels. Come on. Thomas wrote, I
love the podcast thought on right and from Scotland after
your fish and Chips episode. Loved it by the way,
thank you. So. I was born in Witness, just outside
(46:41):
of Liverpool and grew up on proper, fresh and delicious
true fish and chips. Six years ago I moved to Scotland,
which if you didn't know, there have been some rivalries
between the two nations throughout history. But I am pleased
to say that the Scottish welcomed me with open arms.
Mostly within my first year here, still being in high school,
I remember getting into my first fight. I was told
(47:02):
that fish and chips was a Scottish dish and that
the English had no place in claiming it was theirs.
By the end of it, I all decided enough was enough.
I must try these so called fish and chips, I thought,
so that night I went down to my local chippy
short for fish and chip shop. What I discovered was
horrifying away with just simply fish and chips and instead
what is called a fish supper, essentially the same thing,
(47:24):
lashings of brown sauce and the worst of it all,
battered effing mars bars. Six years on and now being
twenty and a little more mature, I realized that at
a certain point, as mentioned in the episode, at a
certain point anything fried tastes good. But I still stand
by my view that only the English can do true
(47:46):
fish and chips. To quote mel Gibson, sort of they
may take our lives, but the Scottish can't do fish
and chips. Very good impression, Lauren mailed mailed it. I
thought I was watching the movie second, it's the makeup
that I brought that I thought, Yeah, see we really
(48:08):
went all in. I did a stunt, she bought make up.
Very believable, just saying teter right. I love that. That's
these little food rivalries brown sauce. I don't even know
what that is, gosh, but yes. Thank you to both
of them for writing in. Yes, and if you would
(48:30):
like to write to us you can. Our email is
Hello at savor pod dot com. We're also on social media.
You can find us on Instagram, Facebook, and Twitter at
savor pod. We do hope to hear from you. Savor
is production of iHeart Radio and Stuff Media. For more
podcasts from my Heart Radio, you can visit the I
Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to
your favorite shows. Thanks as always to our superproducers Dylan
(48:53):
Bagan and Andrew Howard. Thanks to you for listening, and
we hope that lots more good things are coming your
way
Savor News
Hosts And Creators
Anney Reese
Lauren Vogelbaum
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