April 20, 2017 • 58 mins
As if Jamie and Caitlin wouldn't have Nikki Glaser on the show to talk about Clueless! AS IF.
(This episode contains spoilers)
Follow @NikkiGlaser on Twitter! While you're there, you should also follow @BechdelCast, @caitlindurante and @hamburgerphone
Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.com
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
On the dol Cast. The questions asked if movies have
women in um, are all their discussions just boyfriends and
husbands or do they have individualism? The patriarchy ze invest
start changing it with the Betel Cast. Oh that smells
so bad, I will go to the Vectel Cast. My
(00:21):
name is Jamie, my name is Caitlin. I just opened
a MIC's hard lemonade, and boy does it smell like
cough syruph? What did I get that? You got the
right flavor the strawberry lemonade. You got the right flavor
is that it's like sugar. It's like juice, um, juice
that makes you do bad things. This is the Vectel Cast.
Should we tell them what it is? We can. It's
a podcast about the representation and portrayal of women characters
(00:46):
in movies. It's inspired by the Bechtel Test. Wow, if
you don't know what it is, I'm about to tell you,
grow up. The It's a test that requires that two
women in a movie or show or something like that
speak to each other, and it has to be about
something other than a man. Preferably these people have names.
(01:07):
But sometimes that is asking too much. Sometimes it is
and that. That really is it? How are you? Are
you good? I'm good? Good? How are you? I'm great,
I'm glad we do this little check. It's never been better. Yeah,
all right, let's get to it. Yeah, let's do it.
Our guest is a very funny comedian. She had a
show on Comedy Central called not Safe Nicky Glazer. Hey,
(01:31):
guys here, thanks for having me. I'm a big fan
of this test. A good tests, and there's not many
tests that one can claim to be a fan of. No.
I think this is UM pregnancy tests, AIDS tests, and
then this one. Yeah that's all. You know what? One
time I took like an ap CALC test and I
(01:52):
aced it and I felt great about that test. Good.
How did you actually do on the AP exam? Though? Oh,
I never took any of the APE exam. I got
a five on the English and a two on the French.
It's literally like my only thing that I can brag
about scholastically. That's great, though otherwise I was pretty average.
I think I would have gotten like a two if
(02:13):
I took the API English test. Yeah, I just something
was right that day. It was I think it was
the day George Harrison died I remember driving to the test.
Maybe I don't know. Yeah, I just remember I took
a test on the day George Harrison died and I
was just like, my sweet lord, my s A t
UM I took as the SA T is at a
(02:34):
different school with like all these really cool girls that
I was afraid to talk to, and um, I got
my period and I didn't have a pat and I
was afraid to talk to them. So I free bled
during my s A t S and got the second
highest score in the entire high school. Yeah it was
not amazing. Yeah, I really drew from within that. Well
(02:55):
there's a tip for you. Para white jeans, Oh my god,
the worst. Why are we so embarrassed to ask for
That's another thing, Like they're making tampons just smaller and
smaller so we can just like palm them to each
other like drugs. Yeah, yeah, it's I always like parade
myne like I've got a tampon, Like it's so it's funny.
(03:17):
I I don't understand adult women who are still like
it's like like they'll disguise the packaging two so that
you think it could be something else. It's like, why
does that? Yeah, I'm like a big proponent of the maxipad.
That is like the thickness of war and peace, three
of them around at all times. I want there to
be a movie character that, like, instead of Edwards scissor Hands,
(03:39):
it's like Sally tampon hands, and then for each of
our five fingers, it's just a tampon, and I'm just like, hey,
she's very proud to display your Tampon's a friend to all. Yeah,
I know. On inside, Amy Schumer, Uh, they had a
commercial that was like a tampon saxophone, and it was
a saxophone that hid your tampon so it wouldn't be embarrassed,
but you could go to the bathroom with a huge
(04:01):
sex me too. It's great there. We haven't mentioned your
obo in a while. We haven't mentioned my obow in
a while. I mean, just an update on it. It's
still in the back seat of my car. I'm still
waiting for an oboe emergency. One day there will be
one and I will be there. It is amazing how
(04:22):
many Like when I'm hanging out with someone and I'll
try to bring it into conversation and be like, oh, yeah,
I've got an Obo in the back of my car.
If you ever need and obo, do you play the obo?
I used to, yeah in high school, and I remember
I forced my friend uh to listen to me play
a scale a couple of weeks ago. So still got it,
(04:44):
still resents all of that. I will I will honestly
call me at any hour of the day. That's friendship.
I'll come over. Is there any scale popular song that
has an oboe in it that you can just tell
me right now? Uh? There? I can think of a
bride eye song? Okay, which one make a plan to
Love Me from Cassaday Grafter? Okay? I don't know that one,
(05:05):
but not okay, I do know. Yeah, there's and it's
in Peter and the Wolf like it's the Duck, which
is pretty awful, and that's what they would call it. Okay.
So the answer my question was no, it's not a
popular instrument and people don't seem to ever want it around.
(05:26):
But in case they do, Sunday, you're prepared. There'll be
a day someday there'll be an orchestra in Trouble to
play a scale. Yeah. Hey, shall we talk about the movie? Fine?
The movie we're talking about today is Clueless, NICKI went,
had you first seen it? I saw it when I
was when it first came out, So what was that? Yeah,
(05:48):
so I was in sixth grade, like early sixth grade. Yeah,
I remember my dad took me and my friends and
I just loved it. And I didn't get all the
satire and actual humor until way later. It was just
like a fun you know ROMP totally. Yeah, what about you, Jamie?
I think I saw it. I saw it in middle
school originally. Again, I most likely watched the TBS cut
(06:14):
version of it, so who knows how much I actually saw. Um,
But there isn't that much like there's no it's just
where there's any like suggestion of sexuality is like, it's
not something I think would have to be censored on
the TBS just cuts it down for commercials and they
take out Like I would love to interview the person
who does the TBS cuts because like what an innovator
(06:37):
of the form. So many interesting corners got Uh yeah,
I mean there's I was like fine tuned to it
because I'm like, oh what did I miss? They say
ship quite a bit and I was like, oh, that
would have given me such a such a kick. But
now you gotta go to the mike's harder. That's why
I'm hitting the mics harder, so harder. It's bad. Um.
(07:01):
But yeah, I saw in middle school and I loved it,
and I haven't seen it in years. Yeah, I don't
think I saw it until I was maybe early college.
I watched it again, you know, to prep for this episode,
and I forgot that I liked this movie. It's good.
It's probably the movie I've seen more than any other movie, really,
and so I could recite it nice like. So that's
(07:22):
kind of aged really well to the fashion is still
good and Paul Rudd hasn't aged at all a day. God,
he's a mummy. You let's start that rumor. I'm always
like to start a good mummy rumor. Yeah, Paul, and
(07:44):
it's a complimentary rumor, but yeah, he's a mummy. I
like that you picked mummy and not vampire. Mummies are
like he wrapped himself. Definitely not a mummy because of
how he looks. Vampire. We could maybe because vampires are
young and mummies live forever. Oh, I guess they're like
dad and they just keep living. But there are they're
(08:05):
very stitched upping. I got a lot of bandages. They're
not known for looking young. I'm sticking with it cool.
I want Paul Rod to be my mommy. It's like
hey daddy, but hey mommy. I barely thought it was
(08:25):
gay in that movie. Like he comes off like I
thought he not in the movie because he's straight in
the movie. But like when he's like, we got Markie
marked to plant a celebrity tree. I always can play
that over and over. We got Marky Marked, I thought
was a reference to Boogie Nights. Turns out Clueless came
(08:47):
out two years before Marky Mark was nothing then, like
he was a joke. Then oh you got Marky Marked
and he was in Beetball Diaries a time from his
pants dropping schedule. But now it would be a huge
deal to get more Wahlberg to plan a celebrity trail.
That's why I thought it was a Bookie Nights thing.
I thought they were like, oh, he dropped his pants
and shows his big dick and Boogie Nights. I just
did that movie That's so funny a couple episodes ago. Yeah,
(09:11):
but no, it turns out they were foreshadowing Boogie Nights
and Clueless. Yes, so wow, what a what an innovative
movie Clueless it is. It's so good. Yeah, Paula Red
looks exactly the same as he probably did this morning,
given that he's a mummy. That's how mummies operate. Um,
Alicia Silverstone is so great, so good. I forgot that
(09:36):
there's a character in this movie with braces, Murray and
that really I'm keeping it real. I'm keeping it real.
I'm gonna just keep quoting it. I'm sorry, but like,
his gooey braces are so funny. Yeah, and I think
you never see that in high school movies. I'm assuming
that they were real or I don't know, maybe yeah,
(09:59):
good old I'm not sure. From Scrubs. Yeah, I kept
calling him Scrubs in my head. I had brunch next
to him one day in the Deep Deep Valley. I
was just going to say, I just had brunch next
to Breck and Meyer, who plays Travis we are brunching
with I had when I was deciding whether to move
(10:20):
here or not. I got two brunches in a row,
which kill me. That's not good. But both times Zach
Braff was there alone. Wow, he seemed like he was
like but he was projecting the confidence that like it
was on purpose. Gotcha. So did it pass the test?
(10:40):
I don't know it definitely, yeah it does. Wait, hold on,
let me try to think of who. So two women,
her and d Dion talk about getting the driver's license.
They I mean there's a test every few scenes, I
would say, really, yeah, I mean the three main characters,
it's Share played by at Leasta silver Stone, and they
(11:01):
do talk a lot about men, a lot, a lot.
I was thinking of all the conversations. I'm like, oh, yeah,
it's a lot about men. The first I don't know
what the first scene you picked up on, but my
mind was when d first gets into SHARE's car and
they have a talk about what they're wearing, which is,
you know, not the best, you know version of that,
but it does pass pretty quickly. Yeah. I forgot to
(11:23):
actually write down the scenes. I think I was like, oh,
I'm just gonna lose track, like why bother? But I
mean there's scenes where, yeah, they're talking about their clothes
and their grades driving, how to drive properly, neither none
of them can do very well. I love that the
scariest thing that could happen to any of these people
in this movie is getting on the freeway. So funny
and they and that brings them that that's such a
(11:45):
horrifying experience that her D and her boyfriend have sex
after that because they're so bonded from their trauma. So funny,
so good. Yeah, but yeah, I mean they're like and
then um, Share and Tie, like Bernie Murphy, talk an
awful lot about things that aren't men. So it passes
(12:06):
the test. Like I said, every few scenes, right, there's
I think that there is at least one scene even
though there's at least one scene with the teacher I
can't remember her name. Yeah, miss guys, miss guys. Yeah,
there's a few scenes with D and Share and talking
about the hurricane and um god, where was it? Something
beach beach disaster and she's like, Daddy, they lost everything
(12:31):
they need skis too, don't you think that includes sporting equipment?
Very good, Share, I love Shares, Dad love Dad. What
a great like. I mean, every the casting in that
movie is fantastic. It's wonderful. Yeah. Um and and just
like a good male parents like that doesn't happen a lot. Yes,
(12:55):
and she does have dead mommy syndrome. She does a
little Disney princess with no mommy. But but her mom
died in a lipos action accident, so I forgot about that.
That's so, and they have an oil painting of her
in their home. That's my dream, not a good oil painting.
I don't want my child to know me, and I
(13:16):
want there to be an oil painting in my home.
So real quick, I'll do a recap of this story.
There's no necessarily like cohesive narrative in terms of like
this character wants something and they're gonna go out and
get I mean, like they're in high school. They want
like a boyfriend, they want love, they want friendship. I
feel like Sharon wants to help. That's like her vague
(13:37):
and she wants a boyfriend right, and she wants to
have sex. That pretty much she wants to grow up.
She has a close friend named Dion, played by the
just wonderful Stay. I saw that coming. I used to
love her so much. That's upsetting. She pulled a Dennis Miller.
They go to high school together in Beverly Hills. Um
(13:58):
Shares dad is a litigator. He's like, you know, overprotective,
and he always wants her to argue her way out
of any problem she has and you know, they go
to high school. They have friends. Some of them are
like loser, stoner guys, some of them are popular boys.
They go to parties. I don't know, this is a
bad recap. There's a character with braces. The character and
(14:20):
she has a stepbrother who lives with her, who is
very annoying and then becomes kind of a player in
her group of friends. Right, So her like former stepbrother's right,
which is what makes this chart. Okay, who was like
the most freshman in college person of all time? And
(14:45):
this is the first time I watched this movie that
I was old enough to be able to appreciate that,
because I don't think I've seen it in a long time.
But I was like, all those vague like sociology quotes
are like the little good reading nic at the beginning,
right right, I was like, oh, you're nineteen. Yeah. So
Josh played by Paul rod um Is shares former step brother,
(15:10):
but his mom and her dad got married and then divorced,
so they're not related in any way anymore, which is
good because when they end up together she finds out
at the like towards the end of the movie, she's like,
oh my god, this whole time I've loved Josh. What
a great sequence I love like heads like, oh my god,
(15:35):
I love Josh. I'm madly crazy, but love in love
with something that in love with Josh and I don't
know how to tell him. And then she goes home
and she's so awkward around him, which is so great
because the second you start liking someone, you can't keep
it cool. No, not at all. And she's like, I
care about the news. I thought they declared peace in
(15:57):
the Middle East. But yeah, they have a great little
kiss at the end and they're like goes to like
playfully hit him and he's like, no, we're kissing. Oh
that's a good that's a good one. That was one
of the kisses I studied as a teen to be like,
how do you yes that? And can't hardly wait? Those
were my two kisses that I studied. And I was like, oh,
(16:17):
you have to like blink and like Jennifer of Hewitt
and that kissing study at kids learned from the Master.
Her body is a Wonderland? What movie is it? Where
like the boys are like you gotta make her look
up at the stars and then kisser is that that movie? Okay?
That comment, No, people somewhere out there's like knows that
(16:40):
movie and is happy said that tweet at us. Yeah,
I love share in Christians relations with you had my
best friend in high school. We ended up nicknaming each
other's sharing Christian because the syndrome of like I was
the last girl he asked out before he was like
okay all the time, and I'm like, oh good, I
(17:01):
broke you um and I love I love how you
know he we learned he's a gay character, and it's
and then they're just immediately friends for the rest of
the movie, and it's there's not a confrontation, there's like
nothing like that. Like Shaff for all of her weirdness,
is such an accepting, cool person and like doesn't I
(17:23):
don't know, like even when people funk up, she either
finds a way to help or cut them out of
her life in a kind of like I was like, man,
she manages her life more healthily than I do. She
does and she's uh for a popular girl, she's not
a bit And I think Dione has some of those
qualities of like judgmental, and especially with Britney Murphy's character
(17:45):
in the Beginning and Amber of Course, it is like
the villain character and she's a bit too and um,
but Share was always like so lovely and she's nice
to Travis after he gets sober, and like, you know,
I love and then I love the sequence where she
doesn't make over on Britney Marphine. Yeah god yeah. So
I have some conflicting thoughts about this movie because on
(18:06):
one hand, it's about and then someone else. We can
mostly do that, but um, on one hand, it's like
about this she's good, but she's also like kind of vapid,
slightly airheaded, but also kind of smart, materialistic, Beverly Hills
(18:27):
rich girl, and the movie does like satirize that, but
it also kind of glamorizes it. So part of me
is like, well, which is like probably why it's confusing
for like young people seeing it, being like I just
love it when they say as if and they like
don't get all the satire and the joke's sort of
poking fun at this lifestyle. It's not super over the satire,
(18:51):
but um, I don't know, Like it's also a movie
that celebrates female friendship and shows mostly them supporting each other. Um,
there is like kind of a rivalry between Share and Amber,
and then at one point Share and Tie get into
an argument and they say some kind of nasty things
to each other, but the tears up, but they make
(19:13):
up pretty quickly and they apologize and things go back
to being good again. So um, mostly it's yeah, it's
about Share just like supporting those around her, especially the
women in her life. So that's a refreshing thing to see,
especially for like a high school We talked about like
Heathers on an earlier episode, and that's a movie just
(19:33):
about how teenage girls are friends but they also hate
each other, right, So it's it was nice to see
a different version of high school relationships between women. And
I mean, I mean, if if we're getting into it,
I guess, I mean we can look at the whole
Brittany Murphy makeover seen is why are they trying to
(19:54):
change or totally why and and she's so and and
when they're actively pulling her away from Yeah, even though
it's like man connection that scene in the lunch line
where she was like I drew Marvin the Martian, I
was like, you little cute Stoner's so cute. That scene
is so cute. Didn't tra it and I just some
(20:17):
little guys over here are Yeah, got her a little.
Her accent is so funny, she's so good, she's amazing. Um,
this is amazing. Yeah. God, it just got sad me too.
I've heard that's really affected me. I was like, really bombed.
I mean not that other people don't, but it was
just like she was she would be like still working
(20:39):
a lot right now, she wouldn't be Stacy dashing Stacy. Also,
I looked at Stacy Dash was like twenty six when
she was in this movie, just and and she had
me full incredible. I mean, almost everyone else in this
movie is pretty age appropriate within a few years, with
the exception of Stacy Dash. It's crazy. Yeah, it's wild. Um.
(21:02):
And then she turned into a Republican, transphobe, racist. Maybe
she's a mummy, Maybe she's a mom. Always she's not
a good person, And that was so disappointing to learn.
You know what I was thinking about when you were
saying like some people maybe couldn't see the satire, and
I don't know that I saw it all. And I
(21:22):
did think some stuff was cool, like her closet was cool,
And I don't think they were even trying to make
that seem like the computer. I mean, like, oh my god,
that fact doesn't exist. Now makes me That scene where
she's like on the computer and there's a program that
like matches her outfits. I was like, that's what Ali
from Single White Female invented because we mentioned it computer. Yeah,
(21:49):
that's so funny, that's why. And that movie came out
before this, right, it was like one or nine. This
is our Pixar theory. Everything was connected. I really enjoyed
all the culture references in this movie. There's a two
thousand one the Space Honesty illusion where she's like waiting
for Christian to call her and it's her like it's
just like this on the list of the phone, and
(22:10):
then I always wondered what that was until obviously later,
but I was like, that was such a weird cinematic choice.
And then I was like, Okay, it is good she
finally calls. I liked when Murray was explaining to share
that Christian was gay and used like oh my like
(22:31):
friend of Dorothy that like the strikes and chicken holding. Yeah,
I just want to live in the world. Yeah, yeah,
I would just want to live in a world where
high school boy would have the vocabulary to be able
to say that to me. He gives about every boy
I had a crush on in high school. He gives
another funny speech where he keeps calling Dion he's like
(22:52):
a woman, and she's like, don't call me woman. Yeah,
and then he's just he says this whole thing like
blah blah blah, and it's it's there's something and then
but it doesn't have to have like misogynistic undertones or
something like that. I wish she's like speaking of vehicular sex.
I always thought I was like, what is vehicular sex? Like?
I thought that was I didn't understand what she was saying.
She's like, I found this in the back of your car,
(23:15):
and she's like it's one of your stringy things. She's like,
I don't where synthetic care. Oh man, there's so many
good lines. One of my favorites is they're like the
PC term for virgin is challenge. Oh. I was gonna
say one of my favorite trivia pieces of this whole
movie is when she's giving the R s v P.
It does not say R s v P on the
(23:36):
Statue of Liberty and she's calling them and she calls
the Haitians Haitians that actually she actually made that mistake
in like rehearsal, and they were like, don't tell her,
just let her do it. And then it was like,
it's a it's a nice little uh Easter egg. There's
some there's some fun. I love when Share her calls
(23:57):
Amber Amne, she's praying form for her, but when you
get closed, she's a total mess. Like, but that is
like one of the satirical things that you could argue
is like, oh, that would be so fun for a
young girl to hear. And it totally was and and
still is. But if you fail to see the irony
in it could maybe plant some seeds of meanness in
(24:19):
your tiny little brain. Yeah. I mean, I feel like
I was at a very impressionable age when I saw it,
when like I started becoming obsessed with celebrity stuff and
it became like I'm not good enough. And when I
saw that movie, there's wasn't anything in it that really
made me feel like I need to be like these people.
They were so outlandish and so far removed from what
I know. And I think as much as I admired
(24:41):
Share and thought she was pretty and had cool clothes, there,
I recognize I thought she was nice. I think in
the end, she was a nice person, and I didn't
like any of the meanness from the other girls. It
didn't make me want to be mean. But I'm a
nice I was a nice person, So who knows. And
there isn't as much of the meanness as you might
expect in this movie, like, for example, in Mean Girls,
(25:05):
there's a lot more as you might imagine. And I
feel like in a lot of movies about high school
high school students, high school women especially, there's just so
much pettiness and cattiness, and even if their friends are
still just nasty to each other. And it's also I
thinking towards the end, it's not the worst, even if
it's most likely inaccurate in every way, it's not the
(25:26):
worst thing to tell young audiences that being very nice,
you can be very nice and also be very popular.
Like I don't think that that's super normalized idea, especially
in you know, the nineties. So it was nice to
be like, Oh, she's a decent person, she cares about
the people around her, and she's the most popular girl
in school, which is kind of like the ending. I
(25:48):
do like when she's like she catches the bouquet and
she ends up with her ex step brother, which is
fine because there's total chemistry and they're not connected anymore.
But I love when you're like she kind of does
a switch rooney where you think, like, oh my god,
she's gonna get married. She's like, you gross, we're not
doing if we're not from Kentucky. Like because it is
(26:11):
funny because in my mind they're still together, but that
was they were in high school, like and he was
there's no way they're still together. But I'm like, they
found lasting love that will last forever, and it's so didn't.
But that's the sort of thing where like three years
from then, absolutely, that's like SHARE's party story of like, yeah,
I used to date my step brother, Like it's a
(26:32):
great party story from She might have gotten into stand
up because of that. Oh I wanted to talk about Um,
I forget what the name of that asshole character is.
He's obviously a piece of ship and oh there's a
definite rape. Yeah. I wanted to talk about that scene
(26:53):
because Share does the best she possibly can in that
situation in the moment, but it was like that was
like a scene that didn't register with me the first time.
I watched it in this time, we're like, oh my god,
like he's trying to rape her, and then she's like, no,
leave me alone, and he abandons her in the parking
lot of this liquor store. I passed all the time
(27:15):
all the time. I loved what I used to pass that.
I would be like, but it's a liah and a whata.
She's like, that's really expensive designer and he's like, I'm
gonna really blow your fucking head off. That's a great part.
But but I totally agree with you that that did
not stand out to me, is like really that horrible.
(27:35):
I was just like, he's a jerk or whatever. But
looking back, and I don't even think they intended it
for because I think back then in that was not
qualified as scenes like the boys were kiss a girl
and she didn't feel like kissing him, and but him
leaving her, like, yeah, it was that was traumatic. She
(27:56):
does say she's like, oh what a night this has become.
I was sat really harassed. Oh so she does call
it out. But because it seems like that, especially at
the time, they were just so normalized, we like see
seems like that from that era and even yeah, I
mean like I can't cite another one off the top
of my head, but for sure we've all seen that
exact scene a number of times and it's just like
(28:19):
the takeaways supposed to be like she rejected him, not
not that like he did anything. Extremely My first kiss
was actually very similar to that, and it scared me
off from boys for so long. I mean it was
already late. I was like sixteen when I had my
first kiss. But he just and I was like I
liked him, and we both were kind of like we
(28:39):
like each other, and we were like in his living
room just kind of like you know what, and he
just left across the room and like attacked my face
and I was like, get off, Like I was just
like and he got really upset and like went into
his kitchen, was like slamming cabinets and was drinking. I
found out. Then he drove me home. He drove me
home and was so pissed. We were like good friends,
(29:00):
just speeding like through suburbs, and he dropped me off
and I got one ft out of the car and
he starts speeding off and like I almost like ran
me over, which I wouldn't have done had it not
been so aggressive. Yes, he literally sprung across the room
and then I didn't and then I didn't kiss another
boy for like years. That would have been very traumatic.
(29:24):
I understand why first kisses are traumatic enough in nature,
and the thing is, until talking about it right now,
I didn't realize how traumatic it was and how like
it totally makes sense that I was like scared of
him and boys after that, because it was very similar
to the Elton situation. Was like get off and he's
like still trying. You're like, you know, I mean tell
(29:46):
him like three, It's called sucking blow Elton. It's a game.
It's like I know you wanted it, Oh god, Yeah.
And the fact that he does that in the first place,
back of the party is just like she's clearly grossed
out by it. And prior to that, there's a number
of scenes where something happens in class, like she gets
a good grade or like they and kisses her like
(30:11):
keeps just like it's usually on the cheek, but it's
a mushy kiss. It's always like for a while, because
I didn't remember what their relationship was when I was
rewatching the movie and didn't remember that well, I thought
he was her boyfriend because he just keeps hugging her
and using her. And then you're like, oh wait, he's
just a creepy dude who raises his hand in the
middle class and says the stupidest things right, and it's
(30:34):
not even funny, like when the stoner guy does it right. Yeah,
I love when the stoner guy gives a speech about
my luffins. And I'd like to thank the staff of
the McDonald's, without which I might never be like anyways,
shout out to him, Shout out to Travis. Fuck Elton
and fuck Elton man. I hated his character. I hated
(30:58):
as dumb, like when he's singing to the Cranberries when
they're driving before he assaults her, He's like done where
where It's just like what, He's such a creep. And then,
first of all, so the story goes that he she's
trying to hook him up with Tie, and she thinks
he's into Tie because she took a picture of Tie
and he put the picture in his locker and then
(31:19):
he goes, I put a picture you took in my locker,
Like that's not it doesn't make any make any sense.
It's a picture of another girl that doesn't doesn't make sense.
Maybe she took a picture of a tree and he
put that in his locker, but if you take a
picture like that was a bad excuse. And also he
brings class into that conversation too by basically saying, like
why would I be with Tie? She's yeah, you know
(31:42):
who is? And it's like the first we don't know?
You know? But I bet that's a scene that got
cut that was Yeah, maybe I want to see I mean,
we don't see a lot of parents in this movie.
The closest we get to seeing parents is a guy
from Princess Bride and his teacher girlfriend gets his name again,
(32:04):
Oh that actor's name he existed in a very specific
ten year period is yeah, and miss Geist I would
have loved to see her again. And she was great
with her stockings falling down, and and then I didn't
ever get any of the jokes where like Share makes
the fake love letter and she's like she does Shakespeare
(32:25):
quote and he's like, what is that? She goes? Did
you write that? She goes? No, Cliff's nuts. That's a book,
And I I forgot like when I started watching it, like,
oh yeah, clue, this is based on something it's based
on Emma is that you know, girl who hooks everyone up,
which makes sense for share, But there's also a ton
(32:47):
of Shakespeare references and I was like reading about it,
and I guess it's because there's parts of the movie
that are also taken from Titus Andronicus. But I don't
know what happens in that play. Father fact, I didn't
get that Christian was gay, like as a kid, and ever,
I don't think I just all of a sudden they
(33:07):
were friends because to me, he says he's gay, he is,
like he says it in a kind of there's a
lot of noise going over it, so you can't hear.
And if you don't know what Dorothy lover ticket holding whatever,
I wouldn't never references even I know, five or six
years ago, no idea. And then when he's watching he
wants to watch all those Tony Curtis movies. Like that's
(33:27):
a reference no one would get. I'm like, oh, he
just likes boring movies, right, like he wants to watch
Spartacus cool whatever. I kind of wish that Christian had
like come out to her, yes, Like I mean, it's
coming from a straight person who doesn't know anything about
the experience of coming out. But I think that would
have been a nice thing to see in because we
(33:49):
have to assume it happens, because it seems like by
the next time that character shows up after Chair fails
to have sex with him, there's like an understanding between
them and it's not going to be an issue again.
But yeah, I would have liked to see that. And
I don't know, like we're registered for me. I remember
when I heard Murray saying that stuff as a kid,
like Barbara streisand Judy Garland and all that stuff, like
(34:11):
this sounds like me. I love you know, though I'm
surprised that, um there wasn't more of a homophobia in
in his description of him. I mean there were like
funny you know, without saying gay. He made a bunch
of like did resort to like pretty stereotypical but not
(34:33):
harsh necessarily harsh. Yeah, And I don't and we never
saw him get any like they seem to accepting of him,
and like, you know, and then when he saves Tie
when they're at the mall, he like steps up as
like a fucking macho man in that scene, which I
really like. Yeah, and there's no yeah. Like Murray's description
definitely isn't perfect, but for I feel like just the
(34:55):
fact that his implication isn't like there was no just
sky yeah, which which is what you would kind of
expect out of like a straight male high school boy
like that. I did also appreciate that even though the
actress who plays this character turned out to be horrible,
but that they're one of the main characters was a
(35:16):
woman of color. That was nice. Yeah, that was great.
It's a good point. Speaking of Christian one of the
things I wanted to talk about was she before she
knows that he is gay and they're going on on
when she thinks it's a date. She comes down and
she's dressed in this little white dress, and then Josh
is like, you couldn't let her go out on that
(35:36):
talking to her dad because apparently she's dressed too scantily,
And it was just upsetting that to see Josh be like, oh,
she's like, the implication is, oh, she looks like a slut.
She's not, so her dad's like, cover that up. I
don't know. I guess that that didn't register with me
(35:57):
because I for sure heard that from my dad at
least once your dad is a pig, I mean, but
like not to give into the patriarchy, but like sometimes
like you can see my ass, you know, and I
wouldn't want my child. Yeah, I I get what you're saying,
(36:17):
and I also give what I think of what you
both are saying, and I agree with them because sometimes
I feel like women dressed in a certain way that
is uncomfortable for them out on the town and they're asked,
we'll be hanging out and it's like, you don't need
to do that to, you know, to impress this person.
But I also feel like where whatever you want, it
never it never struck me until you said that though,
(36:39):
and until you brought it up that it was a
little bit like stop dressing like a slut, because there
are a lot of indications of there's a lot of
that talk in the movie. I think that, like, um,
do they talk about Amber dressing like a slut? They
mentioned like she's like, oh I have enough from my
plastic surgeon that no balls should be thrown in my
face or something and really goes your social life. So
(37:04):
it's weird because a lot of it. The thing that
I would find weird about the scene is that, Like
Josh is the one who says, are you going to
let her go out like that? Like, basically her peer
is saying that, which felt weird. Well, we can assume
that because he likes her. They don't really, they might
not know they like each other yet, but they do.
(37:24):
He's just like, oh, I don't want her to be
sexual with anyone else. I want to be to be
sexual with me, So like, cover up your sexiness so
that I can have it later. I think it's a
very approach. Yeah, so he should just be okay with
whatever she wants to wear. Also, what she was wearing
in that scene is wasn't any cute. It was a
great outfit and it was I mean it was the
(37:46):
same thing that she's been wearing all along, Like the
same length of skirt dress. I mean, you know another
way that that kind of same. I keep getting these
scenes mixed up. His father of the Bride, do you
remember are you familiar with that movie? Well, her her
dad is she comes back home from college and she's
engaged to this guy, and her dad's like they're leaving
(38:08):
to go out after dinner her fiance and her dad's like,
it's a little cold, out there, you want to put
something on, like she's not like exposed, but he's like
She's like, no, dad, I'll be fine. And then her
boyfriend goes, it is a little cold. She goes, oh yeah,
I'll get my jacket, like she just instantly does it
for him, and that was like another kind of way
without making it about her being showing too much skin,
(38:29):
which reminds me of one of my favorite lines in
the movie when she's like explaining how you can get
a boy to like you. She's like, show a little
skin and that will make a boy picture you naked,
which reminds them of six. That is really fun. That
is totally a line that I took as actual advice,
like very obviously and exactly that that. So there's the
(38:53):
dangerous territory in that. That was stuff that though like, yeah,
in high school, I remember my my first school boyfriend,
who I feel like I site constantly on this podcast
so much. But there was like one time where we
both like saved up money from our part time jobs
to go to a seafood restaurant together because we had
(39:15):
both heard that oysters were an as We're like saved
up for weeks and we're like and we literally went
to the cheesecake factory, but they have oysters, and then
we're just like, oh, like maybe we're gonna kiss with
tongue tonight because we had all this fish. But stuff
like that, like I don't know where I would have
(39:35):
gotten that from, if not from a movie or a
book or something like that. Um, And that's like a
more innocent incarnation of taking stuff like that and trying
to like desperately trying to apply it to your real life.
But it does stick with you. It's weird. And like
how parents after they have sex, like on sitcoms, they're
always really happy the next morning. So you're like, oh,
(39:56):
if mom's ever happy she got laid last night, because
that's only way that a housewife can be prancing around
the house with a smile on her face as if
she got laid. That was always a thing like, So
I guess sex makes people happy, which I mean, it
doesn't not have to smoke a cigarette afterwards. So much
of that, but a great line from that also that
(40:17):
date scene was when she gets in the car with Christian,
who I think most people would have already figured out
as gay, and he's listening to Billy Holliday. Who is this?
She's like Billy Holiday, She's like I love him. Oh God,
so good. It's a great comedy. It's it's packed with
funny lines like joke, joke, joke, it's it's I love
(40:40):
that about it. And it's written and directed by a woman, Amyling.
And here's a fun reference to your least favorite episode ever, Caitlin.
Is that Amy Heckerling used to date Martin Breast, who
directed sag Connection Indoors. Oh my god? What else is
(41:07):
Amory Heroling Dunne. She also like helmed the TV spinoff
Let's See she was involved so she directed Fast Times
at Ridgemont High. She directed National Lampoon's European Vacation. She
directed Look Who's Talking? I loved it? And then she
later worked on A Night the Roxbury Loved It, directed
(41:31):
an episode of the first season of the Office, and
directed a little bit of Gossip Girl. All right. She
she had a good career to write something again, come on,
come back baby? Well hi are you Amy? Yeah? We're wealthy.
The other thing I wanted to mention is that the
like flirtatious banter that happens throughout the movie between Share
(41:53):
and Josh is a lot of nagging about her appearance,
which bothered me. You're really filling out that job that's
like his first and you know, I understand, like negging
is a concept of like flirting, especially if it's like
because it can't you know, it's not the best way
(42:16):
to flirt. I've for sure done it. It's for sure
been done to me, like it happens, and sometimes it
for sure works, and sometimes it does. Um. I love
being a bully. That's how I've gotten every person's heart.
And then I fixed that. But it's often at the
expense of her appearance or her just like, you know,
(42:40):
he's making fun of you go to the mall a lot.
You're just a stupid girl who shops and I don't know.
I mean, that is kind of her character. But then
she gets really affected by that kind of um insult
when she starts to like him, and she's like, I
want to seem more than that, and I am more
than that, and I think that that, Um, I like her.
(43:01):
Her rebellion of that concept that she's just like a
mall rat, I think is going in the right direction.
He was there at the dinner table and she's like,
I have direction. He's like, yeah, they're the mall, and
she's just like yeah. And then there's one point where
he's criticizing how like her effect on tie uh and
he says something like oh, yeah, there's been a lot
(43:22):
more bare midriff or like whatever, um, and she does
give it back to him. There's that time when they
get all the take out for shares dad, which, first
of all, I loved that she's such a good person
and has a great relationship with her dad. Um, but
where um he's he says like how many hours a
(43:43):
day he's been grooming and she sort of throws it
back to him. It's like, oh, you can't look as
perfect as you. So it's like there is a but
I feel like he makes more personal hits towards her
that almost always have to do with her appearance, where
like when she insults him, it's almost like, oh, yeah,
you read a lot of books or like it vague yeah,
(44:07):
and it could just be you know, the time, it
was the nineties, we were all terrible. But the other
thing I wanted to mention was on first glance, she
seems like a kind of a ditzy airhead, but she
gets good grades she gets like A in geometry. In fact,
I paused the part where you see her credit card
and like there's little comments on it. And under her
(44:31):
biology classes report card, Oh yeah, what did I say
in a credit card? Stop her report card? Yeah? And
under biology it says, uh, won't dissect anything, and then
under geometry geometry it says good shapes. Yeah, she's she's
(44:57):
not an airhead. She you know, her speech is she
gives in her debate class or whatever are seemed quite vapid.
But she's smart and like takes an active interest. I
do love that she negotiates her grades and all that
you're telling me you argued you away from a C
minus to a B plus. And then he's like, based
(45:18):
on the powers of persuasion. He's like, I couldn't be
prouder if they were based on an actual um. The
fact that she does take an active interest in her
grade and she's never I was impressed, because, like when
I was rewatching it, I'm like, oh, does her dad
ever try to force her into any sort of stereotypical world?
(45:38):
But he really doesn't like when he has that discussion
with Josh and share Um and shares like whatever, he's
a big geek and he's and but her dad just
as badly wants her to find what she wants to
do and have like a successful career, and you know,
she helps him with his health health and his lawyer
stuff at times, and it's like it does seem like
(46:01):
he's not for the most part or no more than
a normal good dad would be like an oppressive force
in her wife, which is kind of cool, right, Yeah.
I remember getting so anxious when she's doing all the
highlighting for her dad and then she fox it up
and that guy yells at her and leaves, and it
like if you guys were flirting the whole time, and
she's just like she feels really stupid. That gave me
(46:23):
so much anxiety, like as a as someone who's tempted
a lot and like fucked things up, like and like
having that feeling like, oh, I'm just a girl that
is so confused and like doesn't get it, Like there's
something there that makes me a little feel insecure totally.
And then um, Josh defends her. I kind of I
(46:43):
wish like she had defended herself, but you know, I
can't have everything. Um, he defends her, like arguing against
a lot of the things, a lot of like the
ammunition he used when he was like flirtatiously nagging her before,
like she's not just a dumb mom. Yeah, but yeah,
and then they go and they have that nice little kiss,
(47:04):
like you really like that. I just want Paul Rod
to kiss me. He's so, he's still sixteen a couple
of years gonna live for Breckon Meyer is still very
handsome too, but he like looks his age, which is
(47:26):
not that's not an assault. This is a little gossip,
But I saw him with a much younger lady when
I saw him at bruncheon. It looked like he was
taking his niece out o Brecon that's ft. I know,
maybe she's an old soul. Who's that? That's what they
all say. Who's that? Like superhero actor right now that's
(47:47):
standing like a nineteen year old. I was really enjoying
some recent coverage of that on like Pearance Hilton and
Jess Jared. Really yeah, there's like a major Oh, I
think it might be Henry Cavill, Superman who is dating
a teenager and like he's like doing his best to
explain it away and like my favorite Henry Cavil excuse
(48:09):
for dating a teenager was he was like, well, when
I was seventeen, I dated a thirty five year old
and it's like, oh, and Henry Cavitt, that's probably why
you're like this now like break the cycle, Superman, he
won't do it. Yeah, I'll tell you. Oh. He split
from his nineteen year old girlfriend in May of two
thou sixteen. Good for her. Does anyone have any thought
(48:31):
final thoughts about the movie before we rate it? We
rate it, we ate it. I think we talked about
every every scene, every single scene. Um great soundtrack Killers.
I was listening to it on the way over, just
like getting myself, am gonna be super Model? What a
(48:52):
great song that? And then later on the Lizzie McGuire
movie soundtrack really just guided me. Was it good? It's
real good. It's more early two thousands, but it's like
clueless for two thousand and three styles. I was just
recalling even Stevens, did you want to see Carls and Romana?
(49:13):
I know what happened to her. She's like a scientist now,
probably woman and stable. She was definitely a woman and
step by the way Christian calls shares legs, stems and
I was like, good, A stem mentioned we got it
in no steampunk in this movie. I was happy, um,
because usually the someone's the steampunk culture permeates all my
(49:36):
favorite films, and I'm triggeringly. I have to go on
a Walk is one of your favorite films? I do
know all the words to the themes, me too too.
I remember I specifically remember bragging about that at lunch once,
like my sophomore year, like, um, do you want me
to recite all the uto d No, you don't, none,
(50:02):
none of this soldiers. Look, it's like I told you,
I'm triggered in distress. Ye out of that dress when
they meet Jim West. Oh that's good. I had to
listen that song again. It's so terrible. Oh god, it's bad.
It's like tattooed into my brain. Maybe you self joke
about that song about how like that. I used to
(50:25):
do a joke about how whenever you break up, never
have whenever you pick a song with someone like your song,
just pick a terrible song so that like when you
hear it, you'll never yeah, you don't hear it, and
so just always pick uh Will Smith's Wild Wildlass because
no one feels I was like Jada Pickett. Smith could
break up with Will Smith and hear that song and
feel nothing, but it's so bad, So I like that.
(50:47):
I like that the Cisco's involved though, he goes goes Cisco. Yeah,
it's good too, the wow wow, and that's where he
went and disappeared because I haven't heard Cisco since. Dude, Cisco.
Maybe this gets back to my nine eleven anecdote. I
don't know if I've ever talked about it on the
cast before. When I saw the Backstreet Boys perform live
(51:10):
in Boston the night before nine eleven September, I was
at the show and Cisco opened Whoa. My mom made
me miss the first twenty minutes of the Backstreet Boys
because she had a crush on Cisco, and she's like,
we've got to get in mine to meet Cisco. I
remember being so mad. I was like, I don't want
to meet Cisco. I want to look at Nick Carter,
(51:30):
and my mom was like, we've got an Oh my god.
Your mom was definitely wearing a thong. She was horny
for Cisco, probably wearing like a tree or fours. Got
to get that coverage. Yeah, oh god, yeah, that's really cute.
It's wild. It was a simpler time. That literally was
(51:52):
the last the weaning hours of the simpler time. I
remember exactly what I was doing that night too. The
night before I was doing a French essay about terrorism.
Oddly enough, I had to look up Terroisma or whatever
heard it was. I don't remember what I was doing Patriot. Sorry,
(52:15):
shout out to Cisco wherever you are, if you're alive.
He's such a fan of podcast. We'd love to hear
from you. Hopefully you're into very specific podcast. Yeah, we
should get him as a guest. Uh. He seems like
a feminist totally Cisco, are you an ally? He wants
women to wear whatever they want. It's almost like a
drug stru drugs, like what what? What? God? Yeah, dumps
(52:37):
like a drug. Is a disgusting Oh my god, it's
so awful. And that's what me leads with. Yeah, is
it is that butt lay? Is that but cheeks? I'm
just I'm just picture. No, it's like a ship pooping.
That's what I as, a struck load of ship because
her asset that's so gross. I've never even put this together.
(52:58):
I thought like it was a part of my body.
Why mean, we're speculating that might not be what he meant,
but that is definitely what its like from it. That's
like the bridge. Yeah, he's like, now let me lead
up to this incredible like move that thing that and
then later Hot in Here, where I was like I
(53:19):
should that's Nellie, But I was like, I should date
a guy who is perpetually wearing a band aid on
his face. Oh? I love Nellie so much? He still do.
And good evolution we were that was my senior song
he got sensitive later on he did over and over again. Yeah,
that's what I was like, what's the sensitive my head?
(53:39):
With Tim McGraw, it's like, man, maybe the girl from
Hot in Here really broke his heart? Yeah, who knows.
Oh the guy took to prom was like, does fish
tanks in St. Louis? And he did Nellie's fish tanks? Yeah,
I gotta connection you guys. When there's a crack in
the fish tank? What they pull? What do they put
(54:00):
on it? Abandoned? Love it really straight? We're saying almost
all of let's write the movie. Okay, we write each
movie based on its portrayal of the women characters on
a scale of zero to five nipples, and if you
(54:24):
want to describe those nipples. So for me, I would
say because it does have like a nice portrayal of
female friendships, and the main character is a very nurturing
and supportive and nice person, which you might not expect
from a movie like this or a movie that takes
(54:45):
place in this setting. There's some things about it that like,
we're dated and could have been portrayed better. Um. Also,
the use of the R E T a R D
word happens. I've got to send you an episode of
Coast Coast to Coast I watched yesterday that really uses
that word with insane liberalism. But I think it was
(55:07):
when space Gast was about to be canceled, since they
were like, let's do it. I don't endorse it. But
other than that, though it, I think it does a
pretty good job portraying rich Beverly Hills High school women.
They need to be lifted up because they really do.
I would give it. I don't know. This is a
(55:29):
hard one for me. I'm going to be generous to this,
like it. I'm going to give it like a three
and a half. I think three and a half nipples
they belong to Paul Rudd, two of them are Paul
Rudd's angels mummy, yeah exactly. Then one and a half
of them are vampire Paul Rudd, which are like cold
(55:52):
but still nice. Yeah, I'm going to give it four uh,
and I'm going to give those four or nips to share.
His mom passed away and the nips that she was
having transplanted onto her body she was at the time
of her That's some risky surgery. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I
mean it might kill you, but the results are undeniable. Yeah,
(56:16):
I'm definitely gonna give it for just because of the
personal meaning it had to me as like a woman
in a in comedy and how funny that movie was
and how influential it was on my sense of humor,
and that a woman wrote it and that Share was
a popular girl who was actually nice and it it
didn't because of the female friendships and stuff. So and
(56:36):
all the nipples are everyone's nipples the world all around.
I just want to share them with the Francisco. Okay,
I dedicated my nipples to Cisco. I really hope he
has become a cult later or something like. Who knows
he's doing something good. Feel free to talk about anything
while I figure out what Cisco is currently? Uh, well, Nikki,
(56:58):
where can people find you online? Oh? Nicky Glazer on
Instagram and Twitter? And what did you find? In two
thousand and sixteen, Cisco provided his talent on an unusual
duet with country music singer Marie Osmond. Weird. Marie Osmond
is his Tim McGraw. Wow, what a career he's had.
(57:19):
He lives in Minnesota and he has appeared on What Swamp? Okay, Okay,
he's doing fine, Jamie. Anything you want to plug? Um, sure,
you can watch the cartoons that I always plug every week,
Boston pds Amboi Crimes Division. And then there's a new
one starting about popular Siamese twins who live underground, and
(57:45):
that'll be starting a couple of weeks and I think
probably by the time this episode comes out, So check
it out on Cafe Awesome. That's exciting. You can follow
me on Twitter at Caitlin Toronte, follow us on a
Bechdel cast as well. Can email us and then the
rate and review and subscribe. Nikki, thank you so much,
you guys, See you guys round Bye bye bye,
On the dol Cast. The questions asked if movies have
women in um, are all their discussions just boyfriends and
husbands or do they have individualism? The patriarchy ze invest
start changing it with the Betel Cast. Oh that smells
so bad, I will go to the Vectel Cast. My
(00:21):
name is Jamie, my name is Caitlin. I just opened
a MIC's hard lemonade, and boy does it smell like
cough syruph? What did I get that? You got the
right flavor the strawberry lemonade. You got the right flavor
is that it's like sugar. It's like juice, um, juice
that makes you do bad things. This is the Vectel Cast.
Should we tell them what it is? We can. It's
a podcast about the representation and portrayal of women characters
(00:46):
in movies. It's inspired by the Bechtel Test. Wow, if
you don't know what it is, I'm about to tell you,
grow up. The It's a test that requires that two
women in a movie or show or something like that
speak to each other, and it has to be about
something other than a man. Preferably these people have names.
(01:07):
But sometimes that is asking too much. Sometimes it is
and that. That really is it? How are you? Are
you good? I'm good? Good? How are you? I'm great,
I'm glad we do this little check. It's never been better. Yeah,
all right, let's get to it. Yeah, let's do it.
Our guest is a very funny comedian. She had a
show on Comedy Central called not Safe Nicky Glazer. Hey,
(01:31):
guys here, thanks for having me. I'm a big fan
of this test. A good tests, and there's not many
tests that one can claim to be a fan of. No.
I think this is UM pregnancy tests, AIDS tests, and
then this one. Yeah that's all. You know what? One
time I took like an ap CALC test and I
(01:52):
aced it and I felt great about that test. Good.
How did you actually do on the AP exam? Though? Oh,
I never took any of the APE exam. I got
a five on the English and a two on the French.
It's literally like my only thing that I can brag
about scholastically. That's great, though otherwise I was pretty average.
I think I would have gotten like a two if
(02:13):
I took the API English test. Yeah, I just something
was right that day. It was I think it was
the day George Harrison died I remember driving to the test.
Maybe I don't know. Yeah, I just remember I took
a test on the day George Harrison died and I
was just like, my sweet lord, my s A t
UM I took as the SA T is at a
(02:34):
different school with like all these really cool girls that
I was afraid to talk to, and um, I got
my period and I didn't have a pat and I
was afraid to talk to them. So I free bled
during my s A t S and got the second
highest score in the entire high school. Yeah it was
not amazing. Yeah, I really drew from within that. Well
(02:55):
there's a tip for you. Para white jeans, Oh my god,
the worst. Why are we so embarrassed to ask for
That's another thing, Like they're making tampons just smaller and
smaller so we can just like palm them to each
other like drugs. Yeah, yeah, it's I always like parade
myne like I've got a tampon, Like it's so it's funny.
(03:17):
I I don't understand adult women who are still like
it's like like they'll disguise the packaging two so that
you think it could be something else. It's like, why
does that? Yeah, I'm like a big proponent of the maxipad.
That is like the thickness of war and peace, three
of them around at all times. I want there to
be a movie character that, like, instead of Edwards scissor Hands,
(03:39):
it's like Sally tampon hands, and then for each of
our five fingers, it's just a tampon, and I'm just like, hey,
she's very proud to display your Tampon's a friend to all. Yeah,
I know. On inside, Amy Schumer, Uh, they had a
commercial that was like a tampon saxophone, and it was
a saxophone that hid your tampon so it wouldn't be embarrassed,
but you could go to the bathroom with a huge
(04:01):
sex me too. It's great there. We haven't mentioned your
obo in a while. We haven't mentioned my obow in
a while. I mean, just an update on it. It's
still in the back seat of my car. I'm still
waiting for an oboe emergency. One day there will be
one and I will be there. It is amazing how
(04:22):
many Like when I'm hanging out with someone and I'll
try to bring it into conversation and be like, oh, yeah,
I've got an Obo in the back of my car.
If you ever need and obo, do you play the obo?
I used to, yeah in high school, and I remember
I forced my friend uh to listen to me play
a scale a couple of weeks ago. So still got it,
(04:44):
still resents all of that. I will I will honestly
call me at any hour of the day. That's friendship.
I'll come over. Is there any scale popular song that
has an oboe in it that you can just tell
me right now? Uh? There? I can think of a
bride eye song? Okay, which one make a plan to
Love Me from Cassaday Grafter? Okay? I don't know that one,
(05:05):
but not okay, I do know. Yeah, there's and it's
in Peter and the Wolf like it's the Duck, which
is pretty awful, and that's what they would call it. Okay.
So the answer my question was no, it's not a
popular instrument and people don't seem to ever want it around.
(05:26):
But in case they do, Sunday, you're prepared. There'll be
a day someday there'll be an orchestra in Trouble to
play a scale. Yeah. Hey, shall we talk about the movie? Fine?
The movie we're talking about today is Clueless, NICKI went,
had you first seen it? I saw it when I
was when it first came out, So what was that? Yeah,
(05:48):
so I was in sixth grade, like early sixth grade. Yeah,
I remember my dad took me and my friends and
I just loved it. And I didn't get all the
satire and actual humor until way later. It was just
like a fun you know ROMP totally. Yeah, what about you, Jamie?
I think I saw it. I saw it in middle
school originally. Again, I most likely watched the TBS cut
(06:14):
version of it, so who knows how much I actually saw. Um,
But there isn't that much like there's no it's just
where there's any like suggestion of sexuality is like, it's
not something I think would have to be censored on
the TBS just cuts it down for commercials and they
take out Like I would love to interview the person
who does the TBS cuts because like what an innovator
(06:37):
of the form. So many interesting corners got Uh yeah,
I mean there's I was like fine tuned to it
because I'm like, oh what did I miss? They say
ship quite a bit and I was like, oh, that
would have given me such a such a kick. But
now you gotta go to the mike's harder. That's why
I'm hitting the mics harder, so harder. It's bad. Um.
(07:01):
But yeah, I saw in middle school and I loved it,
and I haven't seen it in years. Yeah, I don't
think I saw it until I was maybe early college.
I watched it again, you know, to prep for this episode,
and I forgot that I liked this movie. It's good.
It's probably the movie I've seen more than any other movie, really,
and so I could recite it nice like. So that's
(07:22):
kind of aged really well to the fashion is still
good and Paul Rudd hasn't aged at all a day. God,
he's a mummy. You let's start that rumor. I'm always
like to start a good mummy rumor. Yeah, Paul, and
(07:44):
it's a complimentary rumor, but yeah, he's a mummy. I
like that you picked mummy and not vampire. Mummies are
like he wrapped himself. Definitely not a mummy because of
how he looks. Vampire. We could maybe because vampires are
young and mummies live forever. Oh, I guess they're like
dad and they just keep living. But there are they're
(08:05):
very stitched upping. I got a lot of bandages. They're
not known for looking young. I'm sticking with it cool.
I want Paul Rod to be my mommy. It's like
hey daddy, but hey mommy. I barely thought it was
(08:25):
gay in that movie. Like he comes off like I
thought he not in the movie because he's straight in
the movie. But like when he's like, we got Markie
marked to plant a celebrity tree. I always can play
that over and over. We got Marky Marked, I thought
was a reference to Boogie Nights. Turns out Clueless came
(08:47):
out two years before Marky Mark was nothing then, like
he was a joke. Then oh you got Marky Marked
and he was in Beetball Diaries a time from his
pants dropping schedule. But now it would be a huge
deal to get more Wahlberg to plan a celebrity trail.
That's why I thought it was a Bookie Nights thing.
I thought they were like, oh, he dropped his pants
and shows his big dick and Boogie Nights. I just
did that movie That's so funny a couple episodes ago. Yeah,
(09:11):
but no, it turns out they were foreshadowing Boogie Nights
and Clueless. Yes, so wow, what a what an innovative
movie Clueless it is. It's so good. Yeah, Paula Red
looks exactly the same as he probably did this morning,
given that he's a mummy. That's how mummies operate. Um,
Alicia Silverstone is so great, so good. I forgot that
(09:36):
there's a character in this movie with braces, Murray and
that really I'm keeping it real. I'm keeping it real.
I'm gonna just keep quoting it. I'm sorry, but like,
his gooey braces are so funny. Yeah, and I think
you never see that in high school movies. I'm assuming
that they were real or I don't know, maybe yeah,
(09:59):
good old I'm not sure. From Scrubs. Yeah, I kept
calling him Scrubs in my head. I had brunch next
to him one day in the Deep Deep Valley. I
was just going to say, I just had brunch next
to Breck and Meyer, who plays Travis we are brunching
with I had when I was deciding whether to move
(10:20):
here or not. I got two brunches in a row,
which kill me. That's not good. But both times Zach
Braff was there alone. Wow, he seemed like he was
like but he was projecting the confidence that like it
was on purpose. Gotcha. So did it pass the test?
(10:40):
I don't know it definitely, yeah it does. Wait, hold on,
let me try to think of who. So two women,
her and d Dion talk about getting the driver's license.
They I mean there's a test every few scenes, I
would say, really, yeah, I mean the three main characters,
it's Share played by at Leasta silver Stone, and they
(11:01):
do talk a lot about men, a lot, a lot.
I was thinking of all the conversations. I'm like, oh, yeah,
it's a lot about men. The first I don't know
what the first scene you picked up on, but my
mind was when d first gets into SHARE's car and
they have a talk about what they're wearing, which is,
you know, not the best, you know version of that,
but it does pass pretty quickly. Yeah. I forgot to
(11:23):
actually write down the scenes. I think I was like, oh,
I'm just gonna lose track, like why bother? But I
mean there's scenes where, yeah, they're talking about their clothes
and their grades driving, how to drive properly, neither none
of them can do very well. I love that the
scariest thing that could happen to any of these people
in this movie is getting on the freeway. So funny
and they and that brings them that that's such a
(11:45):
horrifying experience that her D and her boyfriend have sex
after that because they're so bonded from their trauma. So funny,
so good. Yeah, but yeah, I mean they're like and
then um, Share and Tie, like Bernie Murphy, talk an
awful lot about things that aren't men. So it passes
(12:06):
the test. Like I said, every few scenes, right, there's
I think that there is at least one scene even
though there's at least one scene with the teacher I
can't remember her name. Yeah, miss guys, miss guys. Yeah,
there's a few scenes with D and Share and talking
about the hurricane and um god, where was it? Something
beach beach disaster and she's like, Daddy, they lost everything
(12:31):
they need skis too, don't you think that includes sporting equipment?
Very good, Share, I love Shares, Dad love Dad. What
a great like. I mean, every the casting in that
movie is fantastic. It's wonderful. Yeah. Um and and just
like a good male parents like that doesn't happen a lot. Yes,
(12:55):
and she does have dead mommy syndrome. She does a
little Disney princess with no mommy. But but her mom
died in a lipos action accident, so I forgot about that.
That's so, and they have an oil painting of her
in their home. That's my dream, not a good oil painting.
I don't want my child to know me, and I
(13:16):
want there to be an oil painting in my home.
So real quick, I'll do a recap of this story.
There's no necessarily like cohesive narrative in terms of like
this character wants something and they're gonna go out and
get I mean, like they're in high school. They want
like a boyfriend, they want love, they want friendship. I
feel like Sharon wants to help. That's like her vague
(13:37):
and she wants a boyfriend right, and she wants to
have sex. That pretty much she wants to grow up.
She has a close friend named Dion, played by the
just wonderful Stay. I saw that coming. I used to
love her so much. That's upsetting. She pulled a Dennis Miller.
They go to high school together in Beverly Hills. Um
(13:58):
Shares dad is a litigator. He's like, you know, overprotective,
and he always wants her to argue her way out
of any problem she has and you know, they go
to high school. They have friends. Some of them are
like loser, stoner guys, some of them are popular boys.
They go to parties. I don't know, this is a
bad recap. There's a character with braces. The character and
(14:20):
she has a stepbrother who lives with her, who is
very annoying and then becomes kind of a player in
her group of friends. Right, So her like former stepbrother's right,
which is what makes this chart. Okay, who was like
the most freshman in college person of all time? And
(14:45):
this is the first time I watched this movie that
I was old enough to be able to appreciate that,
because I don't think I've seen it in a long time.
But I was like, all those vague like sociology quotes
are like the little good reading nic at the beginning,
right right, I was like, oh, you're nineteen. Yeah. So
Josh played by Paul rod um Is shares former step brother,
(15:10):
but his mom and her dad got married and then divorced,
so they're not related in any way anymore, which is
good because when they end up together she finds out
at the like towards the end of the movie, she's like,
oh my god, this whole time I've loved Josh. What
a great sequence I love like heads like, oh my god,
(15:35):
I love Josh. I'm madly crazy, but love in love
with something that in love with Josh and I don't
know how to tell him. And then she goes home
and she's so awkward around him, which is so great
because the second you start liking someone, you can't keep
it cool. No, not at all. And she's like, I
care about the news. I thought they declared peace in
(15:57):
the Middle East. But yeah, they have a great little
kiss at the end and they're like goes to like
playfully hit him and he's like, no, we're kissing. Oh
that's a good that's a good one. That was one
of the kisses I studied as a teen to be like,
how do you yes that? And can't hardly wait? Those
were my two kisses that I studied. And I was like, oh,
(16:17):
you have to like blink and like Jennifer of Hewitt
and that kissing study at kids learned from the Master.
Her body is a Wonderland? What movie is it? Where
like the boys are like you gotta make her look
up at the stars and then kisser is that that movie? Okay?
That comment, No, people somewhere out there's like knows that
(16:40):
movie and is happy said that tweet at us. Yeah,
I love share in Christians relations with you had my
best friend in high school. We ended up nicknaming each
other's sharing Christian because the syndrome of like I was
the last girl he asked out before he was like
okay all the time, and I'm like, oh good, I
(17:01):
broke you um and I love I love how you
know he we learned he's a gay character, and it's
and then they're just immediately friends for the rest of
the movie, and it's there's not a confrontation, there's like
nothing like that. Like Shaff for all of her weirdness,
is such an accepting, cool person and like doesn't I
(17:23):
don't know, like even when people funk up, she either
finds a way to help or cut them out of
her life in a kind of like I was like, man,
she manages her life more healthily than I do. She
does and she's uh for a popular girl, she's not
a bit And I think Dione has some of those
qualities of like judgmental, and especially with Britney Murphy's character
(17:45):
in the Beginning and Amber of Course, it is like
the villain character and she's a bit too and um,
but Share was always like so lovely and she's nice
to Travis after he gets sober, and like, you know,
I love and then I love the sequence where she
doesn't make over on Britney Marphine. Yeah god yeah. So
I have some conflicting thoughts about this movie because on
(18:06):
one hand, it's about and then someone else. We can
mostly do that, but um, on one hand, it's like
about this she's good, but she's also like kind of vapid,
slightly airheaded, but also kind of smart, materialistic, Beverly Hills
(18:27):
rich girl, and the movie does like satirize that, but
it also kind of glamorizes it. So part of me
is like, well, which is like probably why it's confusing
for like young people seeing it, being like I just
love it when they say as if and they like
don't get all the satire and the joke's sort of
poking fun at this lifestyle. It's not super over the satire,
(18:51):
but um, I don't know, Like it's also a movie
that celebrates female friendship and shows mostly them supporting each other. Um,
there is like kind of a rivalry between Share and Amber,
and then at one point Share and Tie get into
an argument and they say some kind of nasty things
to each other, but the tears up, but they make
(19:13):
up pretty quickly and they apologize and things go back
to being good again. So um, mostly it's yeah, it's
about Share just like supporting those around her, especially the
women in her life. So that's a refreshing thing to see,
especially for like a high school We talked about like
Heathers on an earlier episode, and that's a movie just
(19:33):
about how teenage girls are friends but they also hate
each other, right, So it's it was nice to see
a different version of high school relationships between women. And
I mean, I mean, if if we're getting into it,
I guess, I mean we can look at the whole
Brittany Murphy makeover seen is why are they trying to
(19:54):
change or totally why and and she's so and and
when they're actively pulling her away from Yeah, even though
it's like man connection that scene in the lunch line
where she was like I drew Marvin the Martian, I
was like, you little cute Stoner's so cute. That scene
is so cute. Didn't tra it and I just some
(20:17):
little guys over here are Yeah, got her a little.
Her accent is so funny, she's so good, she's amazing. Um,
this is amazing. Yeah. God, it just got sad me too.
I've heard that's really affected me. I was like, really bombed.
I mean not that other people don't, but it was
just like she was she would be like still working
(20:39):
a lot right now, she wouldn't be Stacy dashing Stacy. Also,
I looked at Stacy Dash was like twenty six when
she was in this movie, just and and she had
me full incredible. I mean, almost everyone else in this
movie is pretty age appropriate within a few years, with
the exception of Stacy Dash. It's crazy. Yeah, it's wild. Um.
(21:02):
And then she turned into a Republican, transphobe, racist. Maybe
she's a mummy, Maybe she's a mom. Always she's not
a good person, And that was so disappointing to learn.
You know what I was thinking about when you were
saying like some people maybe couldn't see the satire, and
I don't know that I saw it all. And I
(21:22):
did think some stuff was cool, like her closet was cool,
And I don't think they were even trying to make
that seem like the computer. I mean, like, oh my god,
that fact doesn't exist. Now makes me That scene where
she's like on the computer and there's a program that
like matches her outfits. I was like, that's what Ali
from Single White Female invented because we mentioned it computer. Yeah,
(21:49):
that's so funny, that's why. And that movie came out
before this, right, it was like one or nine. This
is our Pixar theory. Everything was connected. I really enjoyed
all the culture references in this movie. There's a two
thousand one the Space Honesty illusion where she's like waiting
for Christian to call her and it's her like it's
just like this on the list of the phone, and
(22:10):
then I always wondered what that was until obviously later,
but I was like, that was such a weird cinematic choice.
And then I was like, Okay, it is good she
finally calls. I liked when Murray was explaining to share
that Christian was gay and used like oh my like
(22:31):
friend of Dorothy that like the strikes and chicken holding. Yeah,
I just want to live in the world. Yeah, yeah,
I would just want to live in a world where
high school boy would have the vocabulary to be able
to say that to me. He gives about every boy
I had a crush on in high school. He gives
another funny speech where he keeps calling Dion he's like
(22:52):
a woman, and she's like, don't call me woman. Yeah,
and then he's just he says this whole thing like
blah blah blah, and it's it's there's something and then
but it doesn't have to have like misogynistic undertones or
something like that. I wish she's like speaking of vehicular sex.
I always thought I was like, what is vehicular sex? Like?
I thought that was I didn't understand what she was saying.
She's like, I found this in the back of your car,
(23:15):
and she's like it's one of your stringy things. She's like,
I don't where synthetic care. Oh man, there's so many
good lines. One of my favorites is they're like the
PC term for virgin is challenge. Oh. I was gonna
say one of my favorite trivia pieces of this whole
movie is when she's giving the R s v P.
It does not say R s v P on the
(23:36):
Statue of Liberty and she's calling them and she calls
the Haitians Haitians that actually she actually made that mistake
in like rehearsal, and they were like, don't tell her,
just let her do it. And then it was like,
it's a it's a nice little uh Easter egg. There's
some there's some fun. I love when Share her calls
(23:57):
Amber Amne, she's praying form for her, but when you
get closed, she's a total mess. Like, but that is
like one of the satirical things that you could argue
is like, oh, that would be so fun for a
young girl to hear. And it totally was and and
still is. But if you fail to see the irony
in it could maybe plant some seeds of meanness in
(24:19):
your tiny little brain. Yeah. I mean, I feel like
I was at a very impressionable age when I saw it,
when like I started becoming obsessed with celebrity stuff and
it became like I'm not good enough. And when I
saw that movie, there's wasn't anything in it that really
made me feel like I need to be like these people.
They were so outlandish and so far removed from what
I know. And I think as much as I admired
(24:41):
Share and thought she was pretty and had cool clothes, there,
I recognize I thought she was nice. I think in
the end, she was a nice person, and I didn't
like any of the meanness from the other girls. It
didn't make me want to be mean. But I'm a
nice I was a nice person, So who knows. And
there isn't as much of the meanness as you might
expect in this movie, like, for example, in Mean Girls,
(25:05):
there's a lot more as you might imagine. And I
feel like in a lot of movies about high school
high school students, high school women especially, there's just so
much pettiness and cattiness, and even if their friends are
still just nasty to each other. And it's also I
thinking towards the end, it's not the worst, even if
it's most likely inaccurate in every way, it's not the
(25:26):
worst thing to tell young audiences that being very nice,
you can be very nice and also be very popular.
Like I don't think that that's super normalized idea, especially
in you know, the nineties. So it was nice to
be like, Oh, she's a decent person, she cares about
the people around her, and she's the most popular girl
in school, which is kind of like the ending. I
(25:48):
do like when she's like she catches the bouquet and
she ends up with her ex step brother, which is
fine because there's total chemistry and they're not connected anymore.
But I love when you're like she kind of does
a switch rooney where you think, like, oh my god,
she's gonna get married. She's like, you gross, we're not
doing if we're not from Kentucky. Like because it is
(26:11):
funny because in my mind they're still together, but that
was they were in high school, like and he was
there's no way they're still together. But I'm like, they
found lasting love that will last forever, and it's so didn't.
But that's the sort of thing where like three years
from then, absolutely, that's like SHARE's party story of like, yeah,
I used to date my step brother, Like it's a
(26:32):
great party story from She might have gotten into stand
up because of that. Oh I wanted to talk about Um,
I forget what the name of that asshole character is.
He's obviously a piece of ship and oh there's a
definite rape. Yeah. I wanted to talk about that scene
(26:53):
because Share does the best she possibly can in that
situation in the moment, but it was like that was
like a scene that didn't register with me the first time.
I watched it in this time, we're like, oh my god,
like he's trying to rape her, and then she's like, no,
leave me alone, and he abandons her in the parking
lot of this liquor store. I passed all the time
(27:15):
all the time. I loved what I used to pass that.
I would be like, but it's a liah and a whata.
She's like, that's really expensive designer and he's like, I'm
gonna really blow your fucking head off. That's a great part.
But but I totally agree with you that that did
not stand out to me, is like really that horrible.
(27:35):
I was just like, he's a jerk or whatever. But
looking back, and I don't even think they intended it
for because I think back then in that was not
qualified as scenes like the boys were kiss a girl
and she didn't feel like kissing him, and but him
leaving her, like, yeah, it was that was traumatic. She
(27:56):
does say she's like, oh what a night this has become.
I was sat really harassed. Oh so she does call
it out. But because it seems like that, especially at
the time, they were just so normalized, we like see
seems like that from that era and even yeah, I
mean like I can't cite another one off the top
of my head, but for sure we've all seen that
exact scene a number of times and it's just like
(28:19):
the takeaways supposed to be like she rejected him, not
not that like he did anything. Extremely My first kiss
was actually very similar to that, and it scared me
off from boys for so long. I mean it was
already late. I was like sixteen when I had my
first kiss. But he just and I was like I
liked him, and we both were kind of like we
(28:39):
like each other, and we were like in his living
room just kind of like you know what, and he
just left across the room and like attacked my face
and I was like, get off, Like I was just
like and he got really upset and like went into
his kitchen, was like slamming cabinets and was drinking. I
found out. Then he drove me home. He drove me
home and was so pissed. We were like good friends,
(29:00):
just speeding like through suburbs, and he dropped me off
and I got one ft out of the car and
he starts speeding off and like I almost like ran
me over, which I wouldn't have done had it not
been so aggressive. Yes, he literally sprung across the room
and then I didn't and then I didn't kiss another
boy for like years. That would have been very traumatic.
(29:24):
I understand why first kisses are traumatic enough in nature,
and the thing is, until talking about it right now,
I didn't realize how traumatic it was and how like
it totally makes sense that I was like scared of
him and boys after that, because it was very similar
to the Elton situation. Was like get off and he's
like still trying. You're like, you know, I mean tell
(29:46):
him like three, It's called sucking blow Elton. It's a game.
It's like I know you wanted it, Oh god, Yeah.
And the fact that he does that in the first place,
back of the party is just like she's clearly grossed
out by it. And prior to that, there's a number
of scenes where something happens in class, like she gets
a good grade or like they and kisses her like
(30:11):
keeps just like it's usually on the cheek, but it's
a mushy kiss. It's always like for a while, because
I didn't remember what their relationship was when I was
rewatching the movie and didn't remember that well, I thought
he was her boyfriend because he just keeps hugging her
and using her. And then you're like, oh wait, he's
just a creepy dude who raises his hand in the
middle class and says the stupidest things right, and it's
(30:34):
not even funny, like when the stoner guy does it right. Yeah,
I love when the stoner guy gives a speech about
my luffins. And I'd like to thank the staff of
the McDonald's, without which I might never be like anyways,
shout out to him, Shout out to Travis. Fuck Elton
and fuck Elton man. I hated his character. I hated
(30:58):
as dumb, like when he's singing to the Cranberries when
they're driving before he assaults her, He's like done where
where It's just like what, He's such a creep. And then,
first of all, so the story goes that he she's
trying to hook him up with Tie, and she thinks
he's into Tie because she took a picture of Tie
and he put the picture in his locker and then
(31:19):
he goes, I put a picture you took in my locker,
Like that's not it doesn't make any make any sense.
It's a picture of another girl that doesn't doesn't make sense.
Maybe she took a picture of a tree and he
put that in his locker, but if you take a
picture like that was a bad excuse. And also he
brings class into that conversation too by basically saying, like
why would I be with Tie? She's yeah, you know
(31:42):
who is? And it's like the first we don't know?
You know? But I bet that's a scene that got
cut that was Yeah, maybe I want to see I mean,
we don't see a lot of parents in this movie.
The closest we get to seeing parents is a guy
from Princess Bride and his teacher girlfriend gets his name again,
(32:04):
Oh that actor's name he existed in a very specific
ten year period is yeah, and miss Geist I would
have loved to see her again. And she was great
with her stockings falling down, and and then I didn't
ever get any of the jokes where like Share makes
the fake love letter and she's like she does Shakespeare
(32:25):
quote and he's like, what is that? She goes? Did
you write that? She goes? No, Cliff's nuts. That's a book,
And I I forgot like when I started watching it, like,
oh yeah, clue, this is based on something it's based
on Emma is that you know, girl who hooks everyone up,
which makes sense for share, But there's also a ton
(32:47):
of Shakespeare references and I was like reading about it,
and I guess it's because there's parts of the movie
that are also taken from Titus Andronicus. But I don't
know what happens in that play. Father fact, I didn't
get that Christian was gay, like as a kid, and ever,
I don't think I just all of a sudden they
(33:07):
were friends because to me, he says he's gay, he is,
like he says it in a kind of there's a
lot of noise going over it, so you can't hear.
And if you don't know what Dorothy lover ticket holding whatever,
I wouldn't never references even I know, five or six
years ago, no idea. And then when he's watching he
wants to watch all those Tony Curtis movies. Like that's
(33:27):
a reference no one would get. I'm like, oh, he
just likes boring movies, right, like he wants to watch
Spartacus cool whatever. I kind of wish that Christian had
like come out to her, yes, Like I mean, it's
coming from a straight person who doesn't know anything about
the experience of coming out. But I think that would
have been a nice thing to see in because we
(33:49):
have to assume it happens, because it seems like by
the next time that character shows up after Chair fails
to have sex with him, there's like an understanding between
them and it's not going to be an issue again.
But yeah, I would have liked to see that. And
I don't know, like we're registered for me. I remember
when I heard Murray saying that stuff as a kid,
like Barbara streisand Judy Garland and all that stuff, like
(34:11):
this sounds like me. I love you know, though I'm
surprised that, um there wasn't more of a homophobia in
in his description of him. I mean there were like
funny you know, without saying gay. He made a bunch
of like did resort to like pretty stereotypical but not
(34:33):
harsh necessarily harsh. Yeah, And I don't and we never
saw him get any like they seem to accepting of him,
and like, you know, and then when he saves Tie
when they're at the mall, he like steps up as
like a fucking macho man in that scene, which I
really like. Yeah, and there's no yeah. Like Murray's description
definitely isn't perfect, but for I feel like just the
(34:55):
fact that his implication isn't like there was no just
sky yeah, which which is what you would kind of
expect out of like a straight male high school boy
like that. I did also appreciate that even though the
actress who plays this character turned out to be horrible,
but that they're one of the main characters was a
(35:16):
woman of color. That was nice. Yeah, that was great.
It's a good point. Speaking of Christian one of the
things I wanted to talk about was she before she
knows that he is gay and they're going on on
when she thinks it's a date. She comes down and
she's dressed in this little white dress, and then Josh
is like, you couldn't let her go out on that
(35:36):
talking to her dad because apparently she's dressed too scantily,
And it was just upsetting that to see Josh be like, oh,
she's like, the implication is, oh, she looks like a slut.
She's not, so her dad's like, cover that up. I
don't know. I guess that that didn't register with me
(35:57):
because I for sure heard that from my dad at
least once your dad is a pig, I mean, but
like not to give into the patriarchy, but like sometimes
like you can see my ass, you know, and I
wouldn't want my child. Yeah, I I get what you're saying,
(36:17):
and I also give what I think of what you
both are saying, and I agree with them because sometimes
I feel like women dressed in a certain way that
is uncomfortable for them out on the town and they're asked,
we'll be hanging out and it's like, you don't need
to do that to, you know, to impress this person.
But I also feel like where whatever you want, it
never it never struck me until you said that though,
(36:39):
and until you brought it up that it was a
little bit like stop dressing like a slut, because there
are a lot of indications of there's a lot of
that talk in the movie. I think that, like, um,
do they talk about Amber dressing like a slut? They
mentioned like she's like, oh I have enough from my
plastic surgeon that no balls should be thrown in my
face or something and really goes your social life. So
(37:04):
it's weird because a lot of it. The thing that
I would find weird about the scene is that, Like
Josh is the one who says, are you going to
let her go out like that? Like, basically her peer
is saying that, which felt weird. Well, we can assume
that because he likes her. They don't really, they might
not know they like each other yet, but they do.
(37:24):
He's just like, oh, I don't want her to be
sexual with anyone else. I want to be to be
sexual with me, So like, cover up your sexiness so
that I can have it later. I think it's a
very approach. Yeah, so he should just be okay with
whatever she wants to wear. Also, what she was wearing
in that scene is wasn't any cute. It was a
great outfit and it was I mean it was the
(37:46):
same thing that she's been wearing all along, Like the
same length of skirt dress. I mean, you know another
way that that kind of same. I keep getting these
scenes mixed up. His father of the Bride, do you
remember are you familiar with that movie? Well, her her
dad is she comes back home from college and she's
engaged to this guy, and her dad's like they're leaving
(38:08):
to go out after dinner her fiance and her dad's like,
it's a little cold, out there, you want to put
something on, like she's not like exposed, but he's like
She's like, no, dad, I'll be fine. And then her
boyfriend goes, it is a little cold. She goes, oh yeah,
I'll get my jacket, like she just instantly does it
for him, and that was like another kind of way
without making it about her being showing too much skin,
(38:29):
which reminds me of one of my favorite lines in
the movie when she's like explaining how you can get
a boy to like you. She's like, show a little
skin and that will make a boy picture you naked,
which reminds them of six. That is really fun. That
is totally a line that I took as actual advice,
like very obviously and exactly that that. So there's the
(38:53):
dangerous territory in that. That was stuff that though like, yeah,
in high school, I remember my my first school boyfriend,
who I feel like I site constantly on this podcast
so much. But there was like one time where we
both like saved up money from our part time jobs
to go to a seafood restaurant together because we had
(39:15):
both heard that oysters were an as We're like saved
up for weeks and we're like and we literally went
to the cheesecake factory, but they have oysters, and then
we're just like, oh, like maybe we're gonna kiss with
tongue tonight because we had all this fish. But stuff
like that, like I don't know where I would have
(39:35):
gotten that from, if not from a movie or a
book or something like that. Um, And that's like a
more innocent incarnation of taking stuff like that and trying
to like desperately trying to apply it to your real life.
But it does stick with you. It's weird. And like
how parents after they have sex, like on sitcoms, they're
always really happy the next morning. So you're like, oh,
(39:56):
if mom's ever happy she got laid last night, because
that's only way that a housewife can be prancing around
the house with a smile on her face as if
she got laid. That was always a thing like, So
I guess sex makes people happy, which I mean, it
doesn't not have to smoke a cigarette afterwards. So much
of that, but a great line from that also that
(40:17):
date scene was when she gets in the car with Christian,
who I think most people would have already figured out
as gay, and he's listening to Billy Holliday. Who is this?
She's like Billy Holiday, She's like I love him. Oh God,
so good. It's a great comedy. It's it's packed with
funny lines like joke, joke, joke, it's it's I love
(40:40):
that about it. And it's written and directed by a woman, Amyling.
And here's a fun reference to your least favorite episode ever, Caitlin.
Is that Amy Heckerling used to date Martin Breast, who
directed sag Connection Indoors. Oh my god? What else is
(41:07):
Amory Heroling Dunne. She also like helmed the TV spinoff
Let's See she was involved so she directed Fast Times
at Ridgemont High. She directed National Lampoon's European Vacation. She
directed Look Who's Talking? I loved it? And then she
later worked on A Night the Roxbury Loved It, directed
(41:31):
an episode of the first season of the Office, and
directed a little bit of Gossip Girl. All right. She
she had a good career to write something again, come on,
come back baby? Well hi are you Amy? Yeah? We're wealthy.
The other thing I wanted to mention is that the
like flirtatious banter that happens throughout the movie between Share
(41:53):
and Josh is a lot of nagging about her appearance,
which bothered me. You're really filling out that job that's
like his first and you know, I understand, like negging
is a concept of like flirting, especially if it's like
because it can't you know, it's not the best way
(42:16):
to flirt. I've for sure done it. It's for sure
been done to me, like it happens, and sometimes it
for sure works, and sometimes it does. Um. I love
being a bully. That's how I've gotten every person's heart.
And then I fixed that. But it's often at the
expense of her appearance or her just like, you know,
(42:40):
he's making fun of you go to the mall a lot.
You're just a stupid girl who shops and I don't know.
I mean, that is kind of her character. But then
she gets really affected by that kind of um insult
when she starts to like him, and she's like, I
want to seem more than that, and I am more
than that, and I think that that, Um, I like her.
(43:01):
Her rebellion of that concept that she's just like a
mall rat, I think is going in the right direction.
He was there at the dinner table and she's like,
I have direction. He's like, yeah, they're the mall, and
she's just like yeah. And then there's one point where
he's criticizing how like her effect on tie uh and
he says something like oh, yeah, there's been a lot
(43:22):
more bare midriff or like whatever, um, and she does
give it back to him. There's that time when they
get all the take out for shares dad, which, first
of all, I loved that she's such a good person
and has a great relationship with her dad. Um, but
where um he's he says like how many hours a
(43:43):
day he's been grooming and she sort of throws it
back to him. It's like, oh, you can't look as
perfect as you. So it's like there is a but
I feel like he makes more personal hits towards her
that almost always have to do with her appearance, where
like when she insults him, it's almost like, oh, yeah,
you read a lot of books or like it vague yeah,
(44:07):
and it could just be you know, the time, it
was the nineties, we were all terrible. But the other
thing I wanted to mention was on first glance, she
seems like a kind of a ditzy airhead, but she
gets good grades she gets like A in geometry. In fact,
I paused the part where you see her credit card
and like there's little comments on it. And under her
(44:31):
biology classes report card, Oh yeah, what did I say
in a credit card? Stop her report card? Yeah? And
under biology it says, uh, won't dissect anything, and then
under geometry geometry it says good shapes. Yeah, she's she's
(44:57):
not an airhead. She you know, her speech is she
gives in her debate class or whatever are seemed quite vapid.
But she's smart and like takes an active interest. I
do love that she negotiates her grades and all that
you're telling me you argued you away from a C
minus to a B plus. And then he's like, based
(45:18):
on the powers of persuasion. He's like, I couldn't be
prouder if they were based on an actual um. The
fact that she does take an active interest in her
grade and she's never I was impressed, because, like when
I was rewatching it, I'm like, oh, does her dad
ever try to force her into any sort of stereotypical world?
(45:38):
But he really doesn't like when he has that discussion
with Josh and share Um and shares like whatever, he's
a big geek and he's and but her dad just
as badly wants her to find what she wants to
do and have like a successful career, and you know,
she helps him with his health health and his lawyer
stuff at times, and it's like it does seem like
(46:01):
he's not for the most part or no more than
a normal good dad would be like an oppressive force
in her wife, which is kind of cool, right, Yeah.
I remember getting so anxious when she's doing all the
highlighting for her dad and then she fox it up
and that guy yells at her and leaves, and it
like if you guys were flirting the whole time, and
she's just like she feels really stupid. That gave me
(46:23):
so much anxiety, like as a as someone who's tempted
a lot and like fucked things up, like and like
having that feeling like, oh, I'm just a girl that
is so confused and like doesn't get it, Like there's
something there that makes me a little feel insecure totally.
And then um, Josh defends her. I kind of I
(46:43):
wish like she had defended herself, but you know, I
can't have everything. Um, he defends her, like arguing against
a lot of the things, a lot of like the
ammunition he used when he was like flirtatiously nagging her before,
like she's not just a dumb mom. Yeah, but yeah,
and then they go and they have that nice little kiss,
(47:04):
like you really like that. I just want Paul Rod
to kiss me. He's so, he's still sixteen a couple
of years gonna live for Breckon Meyer is still very
handsome too, but he like looks his age, which is
(47:26):
not that's not an assault. This is a little gossip,
But I saw him with a much younger lady when
I saw him at bruncheon. It looked like he was
taking his niece out o Brecon that's ft. I know,
maybe she's an old soul. Who's that? That's what they
all say. Who's that? Like superhero actor right now that's
(47:47):
standing like a nineteen year old. I was really enjoying
some recent coverage of that on like Pearance Hilton and
Jess Jared. Really yeah, there's like a major Oh, I
think it might be Henry Cavill, Superman who is dating
a teenager and like he's like doing his best to
explain it away and like my favorite Henry Cavil excuse
(48:09):
for dating a teenager was he was like, well, when
I was seventeen, I dated a thirty five year old
and it's like, oh, and Henry Cavitt, that's probably why
you're like this now like break the cycle, Superman, he
won't do it. Yeah, I'll tell you. Oh. He split
from his nineteen year old girlfriend in May of two
thou sixteen. Good for her. Does anyone have any thought
(48:31):
final thoughts about the movie before we rate it? We
rate it, we ate it. I think we talked about
every every scene, every single scene. Um great soundtrack Killers.
I was listening to it on the way over, just
like getting myself, am gonna be super Model? What a
(48:52):
great song that? And then later on the Lizzie McGuire
movie soundtrack really just guided me. Was it good? It's
real good. It's more early two thousands, but it's like
clueless for two thousand and three styles. I was just
recalling even Stevens, did you want to see Carls and Romana?
(49:13):
I know what happened to her. She's like a scientist now,
probably woman and stable. She was definitely a woman and
step by the way Christian calls shares legs, stems and
I was like, good, A stem mentioned we got it
in no steampunk in this movie. I was happy, um,
because usually the someone's the steampunk culture permeates all my
(49:36):
favorite films, and I'm triggeringly. I have to go on
a Walk is one of your favorite films? I do
know all the words to the themes, me too too.
I remember I specifically remember bragging about that at lunch once,
like my sophomore year, like, um, do you want me
to recite all the uto d No, you don't, none,
(50:02):
none of this soldiers. Look, it's like I told you,
I'm triggered in distress. Ye out of that dress when
they meet Jim West. Oh that's good. I had to
listen that song again. It's so terrible. Oh god, it's bad.
It's like tattooed into my brain. Maybe you self joke
about that song about how like that. I used to
(50:25):
do a joke about how whenever you break up, never
have whenever you pick a song with someone like your song,
just pick a terrible song so that like when you
hear it, you'll never yeah, you don't hear it, and
so just always pick uh Will Smith's Wild Wildlass because
no one feels I was like Jada Pickett. Smith could
break up with Will Smith and hear that song and
feel nothing, but it's so bad, So I like that.
(50:47):
I like that the Cisco's involved though, he goes goes Cisco. Yeah,
it's good too, the wow wow, and that's where he
went and disappeared because I haven't heard Cisco since. Dude, Cisco.
Maybe this gets back to my nine eleven anecdote. I
don't know if I've ever talked about it on the
cast before. When I saw the Backstreet Boys perform live
(51:10):
in Boston the night before nine eleven September, I was
at the show and Cisco opened Whoa. My mom made
me miss the first twenty minutes of the Backstreet Boys
because she had a crush on Cisco, and she's like,
we've got to get in mine to meet Cisco. I
remember being so mad. I was like, I don't want
to meet Cisco. I want to look at Nick Carter,
(51:30):
and my mom was like, we've got an Oh my god.
Your mom was definitely wearing a thong. She was horny
for Cisco, probably wearing like a tree or fours. Got
to get that coverage. Yeah, oh god, yeah, that's really cute.
It's wild. It was a simpler time. That literally was
(51:52):
the last the weaning hours of the simpler time. I
remember exactly what I was doing that night too. The
night before I was doing a French essay about terrorism.
Oddly enough, I had to look up Terroisma or whatever
heard it was. I don't remember what I was doing Patriot. Sorry,
(52:15):
shout out to Cisco wherever you are, if you're alive.
He's such a fan of podcast. We'd love to hear
from you. Hopefully you're into very specific podcast. Yeah, we
should get him as a guest. Uh. He seems like
a feminist totally Cisco, are you an ally? He wants
women to wear whatever they want. It's almost like a
drug stru drugs, like what what? What? God? Yeah, dumps
(52:37):
like a drug. Is a disgusting Oh my god, it's
so awful. And that's what me leads with. Yeah, is
it is that butt lay? Is that but cheeks? I'm
just I'm just picture. No, it's like a ship pooping.
That's what I as, a struck load of ship because
her asset that's so gross. I've never even put this together.
(52:58):
I thought like it was a part of my body.
Why mean, we're speculating that might not be what he meant,
but that is definitely what its like from it. That's
like the bridge. Yeah, he's like, now let me lead
up to this incredible like move that thing that and
then later Hot in Here, where I was like I
(53:19):
should that's Nellie, But I was like, I should date
a guy who is perpetually wearing a band aid on
his face. Oh? I love Nellie so much? He still do.
And good evolution we were that was my senior song
he got sensitive later on he did over and over again. Yeah,
that's what I was like, what's the sensitive my head?
(53:39):
With Tim McGraw, it's like, man, maybe the girl from
Hot in Here really broke his heart? Yeah, who knows.
Oh the guy took to prom was like, does fish
tanks in St. Louis? And he did Nellie's fish tanks? Yeah,
I gotta connection you guys. When there's a crack in
the fish tank? What they pull? What do they put
(54:00):
on it? Abandoned? Love it really straight? We're saying almost
all of let's write the movie. Okay, we write each
movie based on its portrayal of the women characters on
a scale of zero to five nipples, and if you
(54:24):
want to describe those nipples. So for me, I would
say because it does have like a nice portrayal of
female friendships, and the main character is a very nurturing
and supportive and nice person, which you might not expect
from a movie like this or a movie that takes
(54:45):
place in this setting. There's some things about it that like,
we're dated and could have been portrayed better. Um. Also,
the use of the R E T a R D
word happens. I've got to send you an episode of
Coast Coast to Coast I watched yesterday that really uses
that word with insane liberalism. But I think it was
(55:07):
when space Gast was about to be canceled, since they
were like, let's do it. I don't endorse it. But
other than that, though it, I think it does a
pretty good job portraying rich Beverly Hills High school women.
They need to be lifted up because they really do.
I would give it. I don't know. This is a
(55:29):
hard one for me. I'm going to be generous to this,
like it. I'm going to give it like a three
and a half. I think three and a half nipples
they belong to Paul Rudd, two of them are Paul
Rudd's angels mummy, yeah exactly. Then one and a half
of them are vampire Paul Rudd, which are like cold
(55:52):
but still nice. Yeah, I'm going to give it four uh,
and I'm going to give those four or nips to share.
His mom passed away and the nips that she was
having transplanted onto her body she was at the time
of her That's some risky surgery. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I
mean it might kill you, but the results are undeniable. Yeah,
(56:16):
I'm definitely gonna give it for just because of the
personal meaning it had to me as like a woman
in a in comedy and how funny that movie was
and how influential it was on my sense of humor,
and that a woman wrote it and that Share was
a popular girl who was actually nice and it it
didn't because of the female friendships and stuff. So and
(56:36):
all the nipples are everyone's nipples the world all around.
I just want to share them with the Francisco. Okay,
I dedicated my nipples to Cisco. I really hope he
has become a cult later or something like. Who knows
he's doing something good. Feel free to talk about anything
while I figure out what Cisco is currently? Uh, well, Nikki,
(56:58):
where can people find you online? Oh? Nicky Glazer on
Instagram and Twitter? And what did you find? In two
thousand and sixteen, Cisco provided his talent on an unusual
duet with country music singer Marie Osmond. Weird. Marie Osmond
is his Tim McGraw. Wow, what a career he's had.
(57:19):
He lives in Minnesota and he has appeared on What Swamp? Okay, Okay,
he's doing fine, Jamie. Anything you want to plug? Um, sure,
you can watch the cartoons that I always plug every week,
Boston pds Amboi Crimes Division. And then there's a new
one starting about popular Siamese twins who live underground, and
(57:45):
that'll be starting a couple of weeks and I think
probably by the time this episode comes out, So check
it out on Cafe Awesome. That's exciting. You can follow
me on Twitter at Caitlin Toronte, follow us on a
Bechdel cast as well. Can email us and then the
rate and review and subscribe. Nikki, thank you so much,
you guys, See you guys round Bye bye bye,
The Bechdel Cast News
Hosts And Creators
Caitlin Durante
Jamie Loftus
Popular Podcasts
The Breakfast Club
The World's Most Dangerous Morning Show, The Breakfast Club, With DJ Envy And Charlamagne Tha God!
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
Decisions, Decisions
Welcome to "Decisions, Decisions," the podcast where boundaries are pushed, and conversations get candid! Join your favorite hosts, Mandii B and WeezyWTF, as they dive deep into the world of non-traditional relationships and explore the often-taboo topics surrounding dating, sex, and love. Every Monday, Mandii and Weezy invite you to unlearn the outdated narratives dictated by traditional patriarchal norms. With a blend of humor, vulnerability, and authenticity, they share their personal journeys navigating their 30s, tackling the complexities of modern relationships, and engaging in thought-provoking discussions that challenge societal expectations. From groundbreaking interviews with diverse guests to relatable stories that resonate with your experiences, "Decisions, Decisions" is your go-to source for open dialogue about what it truly means to love and connect in today's world. Get ready to reshape your understanding of relationships and embrace the freedom of authentic connections—tune in and join the conversation!