Grease with Gracie Gillam

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
On the Beck Dol Cast, the questions asked if movies
have women in them, are all their discussions just boyfriends
and husbands, or do they have individualism? The patriarchy zef
invest start changing it with the bel cast. Tell me more,
tell me more? Is this the Beck Dol Cast? Okay, Okay,

(00:22):
I like this. You know, I'll be, I could be.
I could be a greaser. You could be you are supposed.
The thing that frustrates me about the Tea Birds is
that they have such good outfits, but then they're just
rampant misogynists. It's such a waste of a good outfit,
and they have the most the funniest um, the funniest voices. Yeah,

(00:43):
there's a They've got a lot going for them, and
then it's all squandered. The waste of a powerful aesthetic.
It's used for evil. That's true. Hello and welcome to
the Backtel Cast. My name is Caitlin Doronte Ames Jamie Loftus.
Sorry for totally bailing on the singing. You know, I'm

(01:04):
I'm used to it by now. Is that true before? No?
But I'm thinking so, I'm thinking back to our recent
Beauty and the Beast episode where you fully commit to
the song too much and pissing my pants laughing the
entire time. So it's not good singing. So we are there.

(01:26):
The Bechtel cast. We examine movies through an intersectional feminist lens,
using the Bechtel test simply as a jumping off point. Jamie,
what is it the Bechtel test? What is it? Well,
since you asked the Bechtel test, there's a media metric
invented by queer cartoonist Alison Bechdel, sometimes called the Bechdel

(01:48):
Wallace test, that, for our purposes, requires that two characters
with names of a marginalized gender speak to each other
about something other than uh may in it sounds like
it should be easy enough, but a lot of things
don't pass, and then some things that do pass. I'm
not foreshadowing in anyway. Um, some things that do pass

(02:09):
are still like really really not. It doesn't you know,
it doesn't vouch for content. It's not a metric that
vouches for content, But true, what was the worst one?
What the all time worst one? Is? Still? She's all
that right where it's like, oh yeah, Claire Duval is
like down you should kill yourself and Rachelieu cooks like, oh, no,

(02:30):
is that I forget how that comes? No? Thank you,
I don't remember. Well, h we have an amazing guest today.
I'm so existed. We do. She's an actor. You know
her from z Nation and Teen Beach Movie, which is
my favorite d com of all time. It's Gracie Gillum. Hi, everybody, welcome, Welcome,

(02:54):
I'm so active here. Wow? What so let's talk Greece,
shall we? I feel like your character in the Team
Beach movies is kind of like a grease or girl,
like a pink lady almost right, Yeah, definitely, it's all
coming together. Went back and watched it and I was like, wait,

(03:14):
it's all connected, It's all connected. And then well, Team
Beach movie is really supposed to take place like the
movie within a movie is more of a Frankie in
a Net movie. And then Greece definitely has Frankie avalon
and it and then has a joke about a Nets tips.
So it's pretty much the same movie as Team Beach movie,
same energy, energy, same energy. So apart from that, what

(03:40):
is your relationship with Greece? The movie? Grease the property
in general, tell us everything grease the word uh, Greece
is the word is the word? Is the word? Um?
Greece is a VHS tape that I had growing up.
It's a movie my dad I think went out of
his way to see three or more times in a theater.

(04:02):
I think it was serving me early, outdated, surface level
feminism in a way that really I loved as a child.
So I've seen this movie way more times than I
could possibly count. And then my high school ended up
doing Greece, even though it was kind of a fancy
arts high school that wouldn't do a show like Greece,

(04:22):
but Governor Rick Perry was going to cut arts funding
for the entire state of Texas, so we had to
prove that we could make money during the spring we
did Greece. That is so bleak. You're like forced to
do Greece so that you can continue to get an
arts education. Very chill, Rick Perry, very chill. Um. It
is how I got my first Hollywood agent as he

(04:45):
saw me play Rizzo in Greece and gave me his
business card after the show. What you got discovered through
Greece in Texas. It's a really old school kind of
story that's beautiful, And you played Rizzo. That's amazing. Yeah,
You're like, here's my card, kid, And I was like,

(05:06):
I have a four point three to g p A,
I'm going to college guy, And then I didn't nice
love that colleges a scam. So you know, I have
not seen Greece since I performed it my senior year
of high school. So I, oh, sorry, I have rewatched
it for this podcast. I've watched it a few times

(05:27):
within the span of a very few days. WHOA that
is like that's like a very deep relationship with Greece,
Like we can't follow that. Yeah, yeah, Jamie, what's your
pitiful history with It's nothing, No, it's um, it's just less.
My grand should be. Really, my grandma had the vhs

(05:52):
and she would make us watch like she's like two
vhs and one was Greece and one was River Dance,
and so I would always choose Greece, just kind of
like because I didn't want to watch River Dance. Um.
So I've seen that. I've seen the movie a bunch,
but then I feel like I've seen so many community
performances of it, Like my school didn't do it, but
like friends schools did it, and like summer theater always

(06:15):
would do Grease, and so I think I've seen the
movie a ton and then like five or six different
local productions and they're all mixed up in my head.
And yeah, I think I think that's that's kind of it.
I still the music is still so goddamn catchy. I know. Yeah, Caitlyn,
what's your history with it? I didn't grow up with

(06:37):
this movie. In fact, I'm not even sure I might
not have seen it until so it's kind of hard
to know because it's so cultural, like Osmo City for sure,
and like the songs would especially like Summer Nights and
You're the one that I want, and like maybe Grease Lightning,
and like some of the more popular songs devoted to you,

(06:57):
Like there's so many that you're just like, even if
you haven't been within ten feet of this movie, you
know what it sounds though with that song, those songs
would like play it like school Dances in our cafeteria
and like junior high and stuff like that. But I
don't think I really saw I don't think I really
saw the movie for the first time until honestly, I don't.
I think I may be like watched it once in college,

(07:19):
but then I rewatched it when we covered Greece too,
which we have done on the podcast years ago with
follow in Georgia. Yes, you know, for some reason we're like,
screw Grease, We're going to cover Greece too first, and
then we'll get to the first Greece four full years later.

(07:39):
How it was intended. Um So, I really have little
exposure to the movie itself, but I know the characters
like Danny Zuko and Sandy and Rizzo like their iconic characters.
The songs are iconic. It was yeah, very much just
like a cultural osmosis thing. It also was like re
released in theater several times for different you know, like anniversaries,

(08:03):
and it's definitely like one of those like Unkillable Proper
because there's like I was looking online to see because
I remember there was like one of those TV stage
productions that starred Vanessa Hudgens a couple of years ago.
As Sandy can't say, I watched it well because there
was only one Vanessa Hudgens in it, and it's like,
if you're not going to have more than one Vanessa
Hudgens in your movie, why bother wast waste my time?

(08:26):
She's doing one accent one accent per movie. I just
know she's capable of so much more, and so I
can't watch it. Um. But then there's also like a
new series, a paramount series called Grease, Rise of the
Pink Ladies coming out like next year, and then there's
another there's a prequel about the summer where they're loving

(08:50):
and it's like it's very interesting to me because in
like researching like where is I was like, I don't
know where grease discourses, I guess, and it seems to
be both like very like it is like not a
hot take by any means to say, like most of
Greece's plot points age exceptionally badly, but then also they're
still like making grease stuff. It's weird, but also at

(09:14):
the same by that same token, I could see, like
by nineteen eight standards and like the stage production first
one up and I think seventy one, I could see
like some components of the story being like kind of
progressive and maybe even like feminists for that time. Very

(09:35):
second wavy. Yeah, so you know it's it's a it's
nestled in an interesting place in history, and yeah, we're
we're still uh you know, adapting it to prequels and uh,
spinoffs and all kinds of stuff. So I truly can't
think of I'm like, what, Maybe it will be great,
but I'm like, who cares about the summer? Where they love?

(09:58):
And I learned everything I needed to know. And in
the first minute, right he's on the beach. It was summer,
they were loving. That's all I needed to know. But
what about those summer nights. Don't you want to know
about the summer nights? You're right, I didn't know enough.
I only saw them during the day and that was

(10:18):
That's what I'm saying. Um, well, should I dive into
the recap and we'll go from there. Yeah, let's party. Okay,
So we are in the late nineteen fifties. I think
we're in California in the movie, although it's not fully specified,
I feel like they're the race at the end, they're

(10:38):
like driving along the l A l A River. Yeah,
I think that I looked at I don't I know
that the stage play takes place in correct New York. Okay,
it's supposed to be upstate in New York, which is
why everyone in the play is like pretty explicitly Italian.
That makes so much more sense because explicitly a schell

(11:02):
it kind of This is a horrible connection, but it
kind of reminded me because I thought they were in
Socall in this movie, but I wasn't sure. I also
saw somewhere that it was supposed to be Delaware, and
I don't even know what Delaware looks like. So well,
Google has a beach like that. But maybe they were
vacationing the same place. Yeah, I well, the one of

(11:24):
the writers of the stage production based off of his
high school in Chicago. But yeah, for I don't know, yeah,
the movie. I googled like, where does Grease the movie
take place? And then someone like California came up, But
it was just because I think it was just shot
in California. I don't. It looks like California, but they
all sound like they have fifties New York New York. Right.

(11:46):
It reminds me of really terrible connection, but it reminds
me of really where. It's like Ben Affleck's Grace. Have
you seen Gelie? I'm sorry, definitely don't watch it. It
starts like Ben Affleck. It's another movie that takes place
in l A where like Ben Affleck has this like

(12:09):
weird Newsy's accent. The whole time. We were like, how
is this possible? He's wearing like a heavy coat the
whole movie, even though it's agree he's wearing a leather coat.
He's has his hair all slipped back. It's out of control. Um. Anyway,
so we are in an unclear location. Um, But Danny

(12:32):
Zuko that's John Travolta of course, and Sandy is Olivia
Newton John are teenagers who have just spent a romantic
summer together at the beach, but the romance has to
come to an end because Sandy has to go back
to Australia. I love that. I didn't realize that she
is not Australian in the in the play, and it's
just because Olivia Newton John couldn't do a passable American American.

(12:56):
I love it and the play. It's a surprise that
he is at that school because he lies about going
to a private school to her over the summer. So interesting,
that's a more effective plot point. Yeah, she was going
to go to the Catholic girls school and he was
going to go to the boys school or whatever, and
they both end up at the public school, but because

(13:17):
that's where he actually does so was he trying to
make him seem like a higher class, like a higher
economic class than he is and like less of us? Lad?
I guess yeah, sure love it. Um. First we cut
to right l High. It's the first day of senior
year for Danny and his greaser friends who call themselves

(13:38):
the t Birds, which also thirty five years old. There's
it's been held back so much. Even watching this movie
on in three a DP on to be I was like,
these these men are simply not seventeen air forty, especially
who was like the word like one of the most

(14:00):
misogynistic guy. This is not helpful, But I think his
name is Sunny Sonny the Dog. Yeah. First of all
upsetting for me because I already lived with a misogynist
named Sonny and it's my dad. But that the guy
who plays Sonny especially, I'm like, you're a father, Like
what do you? How did you? But then you're like, oh,

(14:21):
he's a he's a good dancer. He's a good dancer.
I think he's actually thirty one in that movie, although
I agree that he looks thirty eight. Rough break, rough break.
For Sonny, he's had a difficult life. Maybe yeah. Well,
in addition to Sonny, there's k Nicky and Putsy and Duty.
They run with a group of girls called the Pink Ladies.

(14:44):
Rizzo is the leader. Uh Stalkard Channing plays this rendition
of of Rizzo. Gracie Gillum has played an incredible version
of Rizzo, just saying many icons have played this role. Um.
And then there's also Jan Marty and Frenchy and French.
She introduces the Pink Ladies to Sandy, who ended up

(15:06):
not going back to Australia and who is instead going
to high school at Rydel this year. Um. But Danny
and Sandy don't know yet that they are both at
the same school. Then we get the Summer Night Song
where Danny tells the t Birds about the girl he
met over the summer, and Sandy tells the Pink Ladies
about the boy she met and that his name is

(15:26):
Danny Zuko and they're like, oh, oh, no scandal. Then
at a football game, the Pink Ladies are like, hey, Sandy,
look who it is, and it's Danny. But Danny, because
he's in front of his like tough guy friends, he
feels that he can't be vulnerable and show his feelings
for Sandy, so he plays it all cool and aloof

(15:48):
like he doesn't really care about her, which of course
hurts Sandy's feelings, and she runs off. She loves Sandy
does be running off. She runs off so many times.
She's just like, exit left. I can't handle this. She
is exiting the scene constantly. There. I liked that. That

(16:10):
was another fun like place where the whole Australia thing
um just sounds really bizarre. Where he's like, how did
you like? How are you here? I thought you were
going back to Australia. She's like, we change change. You
moved to like Echo Park instead of home to Australia. Wild,

(16:31):
I know. Um. So Sandy is very sad she has
run off, and to cheer her up French she invites
Sandy over to her house for like a pink lady's sleepover,
But then they all just end up like mocking Sandy
for being like a goody two shoes, and then the
tea birds show up, and then Rizzo goes off with

(16:52):
Knicky and then they have unprotected sex in the back
of his car. Meanwhile, Sandy is still sad about Danny
being a jerk. So she sings a song about being
hopelessly devoted to him. It's cute. I like the end
where it's like the water and then you just see
a John Travolta floating in the water and you're like, oh,

(17:13):
that's I love how she puts Marty's nice stationary into
a cave pool and then he leaves it like an asshole.
What a weird choice, Sandy. Someone had to clean that up, Sandy.
And then she runs off, and she loves to run off.

(17:33):
It is stunning how many I should have counted. She
runs off so much. I I think I have a
pretty good count in the recap alone here. But um so, Meanwhile,
so there's this other group. There's like a rival group
of Greaser's called the Scorpions, which is just like a
Jets and Sharks thing, right, Yeah, I think I think

(17:56):
maybe the Scorpions don't go to Rydell or some thing.
I'm not totally sin. You can't not be going to
ride all. That's not good. Their leader is someone who
I think is named Leo. I don't know if they
even never say his name. In the movie. They call
him crater Face. I think maybe that's his nickname. Anyway,
there's this guy who bangs up Kinnicky's car, so the

(18:19):
Tea Birds have to fix up this car. And this
is when we get the Grease Lightning song, which I
think is also the name of the car. A lot
of stuff around this that is pretty unclear for me,
as you can tell um that dance sequence is still
so good and the outfits the tea though, when the
Tea Birds do the outfit change in Grease Lightning, I'm like,

(18:39):
where do I get a silver one es for men?
Like I really want that? Something that I find fascinating
about this type of movie featuring this type of character
who are like these like macho grease or tough guys,
the kind of like cognitive dissonance of then them busting

(19:00):
out into like choreographed songs with like these flashy outfits
and they're dancing and they're singing, but it's like they're
supposed to be these like tough masculine guys, and like,
I just think that that dissonance is very funny. Chats
and Sharks Baby the best, Like that's like the most
iconic like like hyper masculinity and uh, while also like

(19:25):
effortlessly executing a dance right, very masculine combing of the hair,
you know how it's supermanly to constantly be grooming yourself.
Um um okay. So meanwhile, Danny goes and tries to
apologize to Sandy for being all aloof like he was,

(19:46):
but Sandy's like, screw you, I'm dating Tom. Now, who
is this football jock? So Danny starts to try to
be a jock also to impress Sandy, and then we
get this very long sequence where he tries a bunch
of different sports and sucks at all of them. I
did not remember that sequence at all. I honestly didn't

(20:07):
remember because I think that there's so much like valid conversation,
but like a lot of conversation about how Sandy changes
for Danny. I forgot that he also tries to change
everything about himself. The tone of it's a little different,
but like it's just I was like, oh right, huh okay,
I yeah, I totally did not remember that that happens.
Does that happen in the play as well? No, you

(20:29):
can't have that many costume changes in a play. Also,
plays don't really have fun and games sections the way
that movies do, and kind of a very literal fun
and game section of this movie. Yeah, he's just playing
a bunch of different games. It's just like John Travolta
in a series of different pairs of shorts and the

(20:50):
play it's just track. Yeah, And there's kind of no
metaphor for the long distance running that the coach kind
of gives where you go like, oh, because he has
to go long distance running because Sandy is a long
game win. Oh. I didn't even catch that. And the
movie it does the passage of time in a way

(21:10):
that I didn't get until I watched this with my
boyfriend because he was like, oh, because he's trying out
for sports in season order, and so he starts off
with like a false sport and then he's in track
and that gets us to it being the spring Dance
about so this is a year long quest for him. Yeah. Yeah,

(21:31):
he like grows and changes actually for a long time
if he's doing these different sports. And that's our passage
of time in the plot, which is so bizarre because yeah,
like the the beginning of the movie, it's their first
day of school. The end of the movie, it's like
their graduation basically, But the movie seems like it takes
place over the course of like a week, so it's
really more dissonance that I can't really wrap my head around.

(21:55):
But yeah, so in the movie, he does land on track,
which we don't even find out until the end, but
we see him kind of like practicing track and Sandy
sees this and she is impressed because I guess she
loves jocks. I guess she loves athletes. Yeah. Also, the
other started, so much of this movie is weird at

(22:16):
this school, Like cheerleaders and jocks are like not cool
or they're like less cool. They're not cool by the
greaser standards. So yeah, right right, it's like it's an
all the kids running high school never heard of it,
Like pretty fascinating concept, but I can't relate. Well that's

(22:37):
another I'm like, are they like, how popular are they?
Is it just that we because we are following their story,
you know, we're seeing it through their perspectives, so they're like, Oh,
these must be like the cool kids around. But are
they I don't know. I don't know. It seems like
they're ruled the school with an iron fist, maybe because
I could because they're thirty years old that much. Well,

(23:00):
that's true. Because the the the cheerleader girl. I think Patty, Yeah,
Patty like it's throwing herself at Danny Zuko, so yeah yeah,
and she wants Rizzo to like think she's cool kind
of when she comes up to the lunch table and
it's like trying to fit in with the I think
the pink ladies ruled the school with an iron fist.

(23:21):
I like, I'll allow it. I mean horny all kids
running the school as a concept, I like same. So
Sandy is now impressed with Danny again and she's like, Hey,
there's this dance coming up. You should take me to it,
and he's like okay. But before that, Danny takes Sandy

(23:42):
to this diner, but Danny is embarrassed because his friends
are there, and things kind of fall apart for everyone.
We also get the Beauty School dropout song because there's
a random subplot where French she has dropped out of
high school to go to beauty school. Then the dance
happens where the National Bandstand TV show is there to

(24:03):
televise this like dance competition, and Danny ends up winning
the competition, but it's by dancing with another girl cha chaw.
So Sandy sees this dance with Cha Chaw and she'll
never guess what she does. She gets jealous and runs off.
So another very weird scene. Yeah. Then we cut to

(24:26):
a drive in movie theater and Rizzo she thinks she
might be pregnant. The whole school finds out about it
in like ten seconds. I think we're missing that. Marty
alludes to the host of the dance trying to drug
her or successfully, and it just gets brushed rider reased
right past. Put an aspirin in my drink and I

(24:49):
was like, I don't think that was an aspirin, Like
maybe brush up and not brush over that. Yeah, there's
so many things that people just like in this movie.
And then you're like, is that going to come back?
Like that was really fucked up? And then it never
comes back Like they didn't think that was sucked up.
They just thought that was a joke that was normal

(25:12):
in night, I guess. So. So Danny and Sandy are
also at the drive in and Danny gives her his
class ring and then he tries to force himself on
her and she doesn't want that, so she runs off again.
That's one of the running off that I'm very I
was like, Okay, that's that's a good that's a good

(25:32):
run off Sometimes and she runs away, I'm like where
are you going? But then that time you're like, oh
that is you do run away? Yeah you do. We
also get a song here that I feel like, it's
not very memorable. I totally forgot about it. It's yeah,
I mean it is like objectively watching that of like
he forces himself on his girlfriend and then sings a
whole song about like why is she so Like it's

(25:55):
when he's supposed to reflect and learn about his mistakes
in the plot for us to like him at the end,
and instead he just complains about it and what will
they say Monday at school? And he obviously means like
she left me, that's embarrassing. Not they saw me assault
somebody and she screamed and ran away. How embarrassing? Like

(26:15):
that that I told I had no recollection of that song,
And it is so jarring to listen to now because
and it also sounds like at certain parts of like yeah,
he's kind of like blaming her for making him look
bad because he's it's not an introspective song. He's just
like that song was wild and it's like Danny go home,

(26:45):
take a long, hard look in the mirror, like figure,
Danny needs to work on himself, and also that like
men working on themselves in this movie means joining the
track team. It's like a sure, okay, I guess okay.

(27:07):
So then we cut to the next day, or what
it might be the next day, it might be five
weeks later, We're not sure whatever, but um Sandy tries
to extend an olive branch to Rizz. Oh. I think
it's implied that she heard that Rizzle might be pregnant,
so she's trying to reach out, and I really like that.

(27:28):
In between, I was like, I do I love Sandy.
I just wish that she could stay the way she is.
She's a sweetheart. She's very she's very quick to scare,
but she's but she's like such a sweet kind person.
I think she has scary parents. It's implied by the
movie and more explicitly implied by the play that she's

(27:48):
pretty afraid of her parents. I didn't pick up on
that watching me, and I don't know what she's gonna
do with all that hair spray. At the end of
the movie, she gonna have to shower. French cheese house
and get in trouble for having wet hair. She's gonna
have to live a double life now. Her parents were like, hey,
you thought you were going back home to your home

(28:10):
in Australia. Too bad, you live in the United States
now in some city. We don't know where we are, Okay.
So in the play I'm sorry to be in the
play a guy, but in the place I want to
know and the play, Sandy is going to go to
the private Christian school, but then her dad gets in
a fight with the nun lady there about her patent

(28:32):
leather shoes because the school is claiming that that means
that people can see up her skirt because her shoes
are too shiny. But her dad is obviously the kind
of rageful person that can't take that criticism and so
pulled her from the school and center to public schooling.
See I think like again, it's like knowing that framework
helps you understand Sandy a little bit better, because in

(28:55):
the in this movie, it seems like she is just
like that's just what she's like. She's like kind of
conservative and how she dresses and behaves, and then everyone's
like that sucks. You have to change but it's like
if there was a context, any context for like she
is behaving that way out of reaction to something else
and like wants to live in like a more sexually freeway.

(29:19):
That's that makes more sense, I don't think. But the
movie don't do that. The movie is for prude self,
is her true self, and it makes a no case
against that. Yeah, yeah, damn, that did I I did
not know that she had a scary I mean, that's
it's just mildly implied by the play, but it's definitely
more present rageful parents. Okay, So Sandy has kind of

(29:46):
like extended in olive branch to Rizzo, and then Rizzo
sings a song about how there are worse things that
she could do. Then it is time for thunder Road,
which is a race between the t birds and the
Scorpions and KNICKI was supposed to race against the head
Scorpion guy, but he gets bonked on the head, so

(30:07):
Danny has to race and classic jacket guy injury, so
Danny races against the scorpion instead, and Sandy is there
to watch. She sees Danny Wynn and then she gets
an idea, which is awful idea. Sandy gets a terrible,

(30:29):
awful ideas, a terrible idea. She runs off to execute
this idea, which is to change anything about herself. She's
there to help her, and she basically changes her entire
look and her entire personality, and she shows up at
the school carnival looking like a greas Or girl, all
decked out in black leather, and Danny is like, oh,

(30:52):
hubble hubba, and he takes off his letterman cardigan. I
feel like that because he's wearing like I didn't need
to change. I did forget that he showed up prepared
to change everything about himself. But then she shows up
already having changed everything about herself, and then he immediately
is like, fuck it, we're both Danny again. Forget about

(31:12):
that ship away, never a discussion. I was like, well, okay,
but but then it's like, but then they're only ever
like happy when they're themselves with each other. So I
don't like, how was that whole thing at the unnecessary?
He liked, He liked how she was exactly I don't.
It's yeah, there's a lot to talk about there. So

(31:34):
she shows up all completely different. Danny likes it. They
saying you're the one that I want to each other. Um,
and there's some other kind of date moll stuff like
pregnant those shouts from a ferris wheel. It turns out
him was a false a law. That was the most
abrupt resolution to what was like a pretty large plot points,

(31:58):
like Jess kidding Eddie is like, Whooo, I'm gonna make
an honest woman out of you? Does that? Wait? Does
that happen in the play? Did you get to yell
from a distance? Um? There's definitely no ferris wheel in
the play, And no, that ending is a little different, um,
And it sort of isn't brought up that much except
for after they've sung and it's the end. She's like, hey,

(32:21):
can we go to the pharmacy? I think I'm getting
my friend? And that's like the third to last or
fourth the last line of the whole play, Like her period.
She's getting her period? Okay, while all right, but she's
not she doesn't know she isn't pregnant. Oh, she just
thinks that she's going to get her friend. You can

(32:42):
sometimes you feel it coming on, you know, Oh yeah
for sure. But I don't know how you know that
if you've never known what pregnancy feels like. Hey, CONNICKI,
can we stop at the drug store. I think I'm
getting my friend. CONNICKI puts an arm around her, and
all the kids smile and cheer for Rizzo French. The
whole crowd together again. I could cry Jan Jimmie too, Sandy. Yeah, curtain.

(33:08):
Now that's plot resolution in the movie. The last thing
we see is Danny and Sandy flying into the sky
in Danny's convertible in the fantasy car. Because that's not
what the real grease lightning looks like. That's what it
looks like in the fantasy Yes, do they all die?

(33:31):
That's the best fan theory. Are we going to get
into the fan theory? Oh? We could well before we
do that. That's the end of the movie. So let's
take a quick break and then we will come right
back to discuss. So what do we want to talk about? First? Wait,
what is this fan theory? I would love to hear.

(33:52):
I would love to hear the fan theories just to
get things all heated up. Well, there's a really popular
fan theory. Okay, that's Sandy dies in the beginning sequence
and the whole thing is her coma dream until she
finally properly dies. At the end, and then that's why

(34:14):
there's the shot of the heavenly clouds, So that theory
being that when they get splashed in the footage, she
actually drowns instead of him just lying about because he sings,
she nearly drowned, And so that fan theory takes Zuko's
obvious lie about saving her life and says that's true

(34:36):
and the whole thing makes sense, and that's why they're
singing because she's either been dead the whole time or
in a coma, and then she dies at the end. God. Wait,
that's fan theories always like scramble my brain because I'm like,
there's no way. But then also it's like, why is
there a shot of them flying into the clouds? Then
I don't know. I did. I did, Like I remember, like,

(34:58):
especially when I was a kid, I did not question it.
I was like, Yeah, they're so happy, they're so happy
she changed everything about herself and now a car can fly,
Like that's the power of women changing for people. Uh well,
shall we shall we talk about that because that is
kind of one of the most glaring things, I mean,

(35:20):
one of many glaring things of this movie. And I
think it's like the most popular criticism of the movie
now too right, Yeah, because to me, so like a
main arc of this movie is like Danny kind of
being in this prison of his own toxic masculinity and
like needing to learn that it's okay to be emotionally

(35:41):
vulnerable and to like let his friends know that he
cares about a girl. Watching him reach these conclusions and
how he goes about doing that is like not handled
the best. But I was like, okay, like this movie
it does have more of a commentary on toxic masculinity
then I remembered. So I was like, okay, yeah, that

(36:04):
this is something. But then he comes to this realization,
but it doesn't really matter because Sandy has just completely
changed everything about herself for this guy, and he is like, okay, great,
thanks for doing that. We can be in love now.

(36:24):
It's really bizarre. I feel like watching through it these
like two times to get Ready, it was like I
think that, like the popular criticism is like a little
overly simplistic, because you're right that, like they it's just weird,
Like this movie starts saying a lot of things and
then kind of doesn't finish saying any of them, and
then at the end they like, actually the status quo

(36:45):
was fine, Like it's just bizarre because it's like there
were moments where you were like, oh, that seems like
an intentional like this like hyper masculine life that Danny's
living is like affecting him negatively and like he's he's
not his like most authentic self when he's like with
the t birds, and it's clear that the movie wants

(37:06):
you to think that way. But then like in the
back half of the movie, they're kind of like, but
fuck it, who cares? Like it's so weird. It's but
I feel like the conversation is started, but then it's
just like abandoned, and it was what is like okay
question for the group? What is the like what is
what are you supposed to think? At the end of

(37:28):
this movie, Like now I was like being like what
what was that movie about? You know, it's just everything
he does that we are like, oh, Danny, why did
you do that? Stop? That is like it is because
he's trying to maintain this persona, maintain this like macho
persona of toxic masculinity to like impress his his guy friends,

(37:52):
his tough greaser boys. And when he like very clearly
wants to be able to be emotionally vulnerable and too
like like him be on the beach exactly, although he
doesn't suck up stuff on the beach too. Or he's like,
I'm going to kiss you and she's like, no, Danny,
don't spoil it. Yeah, only making it better. Yeah, And

(38:15):
it's like he forces himself onto her in the first scene,
the first scene, in the driving scene, in many scenes. Um,
and there's a lot to talk about there as well.
But yeah, it's just the takeaway seems like true like
either it just is like the takeaway seems just like
and the status quote is fine the whole time, and

(38:37):
and it's and that's fine. It's just well yeah. So
one of the writers of the original production, Jim Jacobs,
and I'm pulling this from our favorite scholarly journal Wikipedia,
So and I wasn't able to find exactly where what
this original quote was or what the original source was,

(38:57):
so kind of take this with a grain of salt.
But according to Wikipedia, if you look at the Grease
Musical page, it says that Jacobs has described the stage
productions basic plot as a subversion of common troops of
like fifties movies where in fifties movies, like the female

(39:18):
lead would often kind of transform this alpha male into
a more sympathetic and sensitive character. So Jim Jacobs was
trying to subvert that and make it so that like
the story is not doing good and like he stays
unsympathetic and she has to change to conform to his

(39:41):
fantasies and to his desires. It's and it's like, why
would you why would you subvert that? Like, yeah, it's
it's kind of saying like the movie is saying slut
shamming is bad, you know what's good? Prude shaming? Right,
Like it's just in like okay, having the context of

(40:02):
that attempted inversion, I feel like it's it's kind of
follows the same logic of why a lot of these
like all female reboots don't work is like let's just
have let's just um gender swap this premise and then
not resolve any of the harmful aspects of the premise um,
which it doesn't. It doesn't work, like and I guess

(40:26):
it is like very second wave feminism to me to
to have that kind of like rooted in sexual freedom
and like not shaming women for having sex but then
also like outwardly shaming any woman who doesn't feel that way,
or like just assuming that, well, now every woman has

(40:48):
to be extremely horny and if you're not, like you're
stuck in the past, you better have sex right now
or John Travolta will force it. Like it's also worth
mentioning that Danny's you Go is an incredible slut shamer,
and he seems to devalue anyone that he's already slept with,
and we see that consistently. Yes, it's like we see

(41:10):
him at school for the first time and he says, oh,
same old broads everyone's made it with, Like he dismisses
them is unworthy because he's already slept with them. And
he does that with Rizzo, he does that with cha Chaw,
and it leaves me wondering what how he's going to
treat Sandy when he finally sleeps with her, right, And
it seems like part of my okay, So part of

(41:31):
how I was reading his like determination to win her
over was connected to, like, I think that there's just
like a lot of Madonna hore stuff going on here
where part of why he's pursuing Sandy. So aggressively is
because she will not have sex with him and like
that and just like kind of yeah, it's like valuing

(41:51):
her exactly and where like he see he perceives her
as this like oh if I can get this girl,
It's it's almost like the cruel intentions thing where Ryan
Phillippi is aggressively pursuing Reese Witherspoon because she's this like
ultra virgin type and that's why he's interested in her
because like she like she'll never give it up, but

(42:12):
if he can manage to do it, then he's like
the Gaul like the King of the World kind of thing.
Not to quote Titanic, of course, but a sleep Titanic
a perfect movie. This I feel like, I mean, we
have no choice but to assume that that's what Danny
sees in Sandy because so little there's like zero time
spent in the movie showing why they like each other

(42:34):
or what is compatible about them, So like that's just
what I assume that. That was another like point that
I felt like the movie started to make and then
completely abandoned, was that double standard, because the movie seems aware,
like very aware of the double standard of how sexually
active like teen boys and sexually active teen girls are

(42:56):
treated very differently, and that's mostly through iconic Grace character Rizzo,
where it's like Rizzo is like that the character where
you get that split most clearly demonstrated to you, where
you know, it's like she um thinks that she's pregnant
and like is just kind of left completely to her

(43:17):
own devices. She's shamed for it, she's cast out for it,
and the movie want you to think, like, that's not okay,
that's not right, but then it never never resolves in
any meaningful way. She they're like, oh, just kidding, and
we're not going to talk about the fact that you
were ready to the whole school, was you know, ready
to completely ostracize her if if it wasn't a false

(43:38):
alarm or like it's just bizarre. But there's another interesting
thing happening there too. She has unprotected sex with Kinnicky
he finds out about her pregnancy her Gregnancy scare sorry,
she's she's almost heavy with Greg, but he I think

(44:02):
un maybe not unlike Danny, but there's like, I think
an interesting comparison to be made between Danny and CONNICKI,
where Knick is like, hey, I heard you might be
knocked up. What can I do to help? And she's like,
it's not even your problem, right, I wasn't expecting that either.
She's like, it's not your problem. It was someone else's problem.

(44:23):
But she doesn't quite say that, like and she kind
of uses it. She says it was don't worry about it, CONNICKI,
it was somebody else's mistake, And I think that is
sort of like I think CONNICKI kind of takes it
as it's not his kid. But I think I think
that Stoker Channing subtext is it was my mistake. I

(44:43):
don't want your father. Yeah, because that line is different
than the play. Interesting. I never thought for a second
that she like had sex with someone else and she
thinks it might be like someone else might be the father.
It's it's clear to me that like he is the
father if she is pregnant, but she's more just like

(45:03):
lashing out sort of thing. But I found it interesting
that like he was like, I don't run away from
my mistakes, Like I'm going to be here from you,
you know, like we'll figure this out. But she kind
of dismisses him, so he you know, he runs off.
He's like He almost like skips away. He's like, oh right,
no responsibilities. Another interesting thing about that is that, um

(45:28):
so a lot of the like these tea Bird guys
are all about like, how can I exert my masculinity?
How can I demonstrate my masculinity? Oh, they're in prison.
In prison, They're like, but if they're like, oh, if
I've made it with a girl, if I've had sex before,
that just shows how awesome I am, which is like
a very like standard thing, right. But when we see

(45:49):
him and Rizzo kissing in the backseat of his car,
she's like, do you have you know, something for protection?
He pulls out a condom. It immediately breaks because he's like,
I bought this in this seventh grade, implying this he's
never had sex before. Yeah, so, I mean, I don't know.
There's just something fascinating to me about Kinnicki where he
is kind of like putting on this persona of like, yeah,

(46:12):
I'm a greaser boy, I'm a tiber blah blah blah.
But he also is like he seems less concerned than
Danny does about being emotionally attentive to like to the
girl he likes. Yeah, I mean the bar is on
the floor for these guys. But like KINNICKI is like,
I guess he's definitely not the worst one I got.

(46:33):
I I totally forgot the whole like implication that that
was his first time having sex too, and that's like
another like that's like starting something interesting of like, oh,
there's some double standards ap play here, but then it's
just like nothing happening. But I do. I mean, it's like,
I Rizzo was my favor as a kid because she's

(46:57):
cool and she smokes a cigarette, and that is what
being cool means, um in a movie. Even though I
remember my mom being because my mom smokes cigarettes like
a fiend. Umill she was. She was like, that's what
happened to me. I started smoking cigarettes as a teenager,
just like Rizzo, and look at me now, I'm a disaster,

(47:18):
you know. So she so she used Rizzo as an
anti smoking ad. She's like, oh, Rizzo thought she was
so cool, but she wasn't Jamie. Um. But I like,
I I really like how complex Rizzo is, even though
it feels like especially the movie doesn't take advantage of

(47:39):
how complex her character is because she often even when
people offer her help, she it seems like, I guess
I'm curious. Maybe I'm reading too much into it, but
it just seems like she has like a lot of
internalized shame and is like unable to accept help from
others even when it's well intended, and like she just

(48:01):
seems to have like a lot of I don't know, Yeah,
it seems like she holds a lot of shame and
that's why she pushes Sandy away and Sandy offers to
be her friend, That's why she pushes Knicky away, and
I don't know, I feel like it's kind of rare
in a teen musical to see a character with deep
internalized shame. I wish it like went somewhere, but I
just yeah, Rizzo's interesting. There's one of the only things

(48:26):
that we really know about Rizzo and Kinnicki's relationship is
that they're having a giant fight in front of their
friends that is upsetting enough to her so that she
throws a milkshake at him. You know nothing about that fight.
It never gets rid of. Daniel day Lewis like my cake,
you have um. Yeah, so we know that their relationship

(48:49):
isn't perfect before she gets pregnant, and then their problems
are solved by her not being pregnant. H right, and
it still doesn't I don't know like it. Sandy is
a saint first all being nice to Rizzo after how
cruel like Rizzo is so mean to her all the
time from the moment they meet. But it's it's like

(49:10):
I almost wanted more of like a moment of like
understanding or reconciliation with them. I guess they sort of
have it there in that scene where Rizzo is like, oh,
I will never accept help because of that's just who
I am. But thanks anyways, But I mean, it's like,
I can't. It's just like an interesting plot point to

(49:31):
have someone take out their frustrations on another teen girl,
um for something that they're insecure about in themselves, because
I feel like that happens in real life at times.
And it's like, but you have to say something about you.
I don't know. Yeah, there's sort of an absence of

(49:51):
commentary a lot of the time in a movie that
you would expect there to be more commentary. I guess
maybe not not know, maybe my hopes are too high.
I'm a Rizzo stand I'm just like Rizzo. People are
reaching out to you off take and take someone's hand.
But she isn't pregnant, so then her life is perfect. Perfect.

(50:14):
Let's take another quick break and then we'll come back
for more discussion, and we're back part well to kind
of just continue a little bit on the Rizzo conversation,
she she sort of almost uses Sandy. She's like trying
to get back at Danny I thing for for like

(50:37):
kind of leaving her high and dry sort of thing,
and she knows that like Danny's gonna react the way
he reacts at that like football game bonfire thing. I
just feel so bad for Sandy because she's like using
her as a as a pawn. And then there's also
this like component with that Patty Simcox like popular girl
cheerleader character where Rizzo's like, oh, I'm this is what

(51:01):
the other girls are like, and I'm not like the
other childs. And that plays in to what to me
is like this this movie is sort of like an
encapsulation of like white fifties like suburban Americana, where there

(51:22):
are these archetypes that we see of teenage boys and
teenage girls. Where we have of the boys, there's like
the greaser type, the jocks who we see and like Tom.
And then there's like the nerd type because there's this
Eugene character who like kind of comes and goes. And
then with the girls, we have, um, kind of the
greaser girls who don't have a hobby of their own.

(51:46):
They're not actually fixing up cars the way the boy
the greaser boys are, but they just like run with
that crowd like the pink ladies. Yeah, okay, I guess
they're not like greaser girls, but it's like the right,
but they run with that crowd their hair, so there
they seem to like I mean, it's like it's kind

(52:06):
of framed that they they they exist because their friends,
but also just kind of to date the tea birds.
Like that's just kind of what that's why they unionize.
I don't know, did they unionize. I Well, they do
wear their own merch, so that's true. That's true. They
at least have a tea public ye, and so do

(52:28):
the tea birds. Um. But yeah, that kind I was like, oh,
like they hang with the greaser boys who have this
hobby of like fixing up old cars, but what are
the girls, what's their hobby? Anyway, Then we've got like
the Patty simcocks, like cheerleader girl. And then we've got
like the goody two shoes type, which is sandy. So

(52:49):
there's all these archetypes which fit into this perception that
I think still exists today of like the fifties it
was this the good old days. You know, every toodle, skirts, milkshake, yeah, everyone,
you know, mary couples, didn't slept in different beds, no
one had sex, and everything was hunky dory. And like

(53:11):
Greece shows a different side of this like common misconception.
I think the movie sort of seeks in the in
the play like seeks to be like, hey, no, like
teens have always been this way, like you know, they
get into trouble, they have sex, their horny there, you know,
doing all stuff. But it's also like Greece is still

(53:33):
preserving this idea of like white fifties middle class Americana,
and it like does nothing to like challenge that status quo.
There's just like, yeah, like the fact that this is
like it comes out in seventy eight, it's about so
it's already a period piece, and it's like, I don't

(53:56):
know just even like writing wise, if you're going to
make a period piece, then you should probably try to
say something about the time that you're um and not
just be like and everything was way better twenty years ago.
Like there's just even though it's like the the idea
of the fifties is very clearly represented here, there's no

(54:16):
there's no commentary on it really like there's no there's
nothing being I don't know, like it just again it's
it's like, well, what, why does this movie take place
in the fifties, Why is it important that it does?
Is there anything about this culture that is like it's
just really bizarre? And then yeah, they're romanticizing of the
fifties in particular, I mean most romanticizing the past is

(54:40):
just like ten Miles Bad Road. But um, but like
the fifties in particular, it was like a like uniquely
oppressive time in the US for like anyone who wasn't
Danny Zuko basically like it's very like high schools were
mostly not even integrated, and women were like being encouraged

(55:04):
to stay at home and not have jobs, like it
was worse than ten years before in like Cartierra was
also it was like totally like restrictive time. But the
fat but the but the looks were good and so that,
and we all like milkshakes, so you know, there's a
little push and pull there. But it's like romanticizing the

(55:25):
fifties is always I don't know, I can't, I can't
get there. But also I guess you know, people seeing
this movie in may have been alive for it, um
and but they're like what, like what is the thing?
They're like, oh, remember when women couldn't have jobs and
schools were still segregated. I'm like that, huh why. So

(55:47):
apparently this play got written at a time at the
very beginning of there being this fifties fanaticism in the seventies,
And I don't know how the writers in particular felt
about it, but definitely the seventies became hugely pop, but
the fifties become hugely popular in the seventies, I think,
sort of as a reaction to how socially liberal the

(56:08):
seventies were becoming. And that's where the Also, the show
was written without music right after somebody with a good
sense read it was like this made needs something, maybe
needs a little more than this plot. I've definitely never
seen a non musical stage version of it. No, I

(56:29):
don't think it got very far before they put music
in it. That's that's so interesting. I had no idea. Well,
and I haven't read or seen I don't think any
stage versions of this, and the stage version that premiered
had music in it, but it was originally written without it,
So like the like before it was brought to Broadway,

(56:51):
got it? I have the I I've read, and Gracie,
you can speak to this better than I can't having
just reread it. But like I've read that, um, the
movie is like a pretty sanitized version of the play,
where the play does seem to attempt to touch on
more kind of social issues and like some class stuff

(57:14):
and like more about like teen sexuality, and maybe in
a more meaningful way. Maybe not. I'm not sure, but
I think one of the main criticisms of the movie
was that it was a kind of watered down version
in terms of it's like social commentary. Got it of
the of the stage production. They definitely in the movie
took away moments of Danny actually being nice to her

(57:37):
that exists in the play, And they also took away
Sandy sticking up for herself when when Rizzo sings, look
at me, I'm Sandra d and the diner, Sandy walks
in on it and literally attacks Rizzo, and the boys
have to pull the two apart, and then they try
to fight again and they have to be pulled apart again.

(57:58):
So Sandy is willing to beat somebody up about her emotions,
and that is very absent in the film. Yeah, all
stuff that would have been great. Yeah, it's like because
we we don't see him be very nice to her,
and it's like it's truly only like moments of a
couple of seconds and never when anyone is looking, which
is like, well, it's also never when anyone is looking

(58:19):
into play. He's only nice to her in private, but
he says more things that are nice, so like, oh
that I mean again, I have to keep reminding myself
that this, like this came out over forty years ago.
It is about a time period that's like sixty years ago,
you know there. But like, I'm just like, why did
they end up together? Why did Sandy just like put

(58:41):
up with this horrible He's mistreated her so much the
entire story And then she's like, well, I better change
everything about myself so that he'll like me and then
maybe he'll treat me better. But probably not he does
stop touching her. He does, he doesn't touch her without
her initiating it during or the one that I want
so was she had to change everything about herself so

(59:04):
that she that was what made him respect to consent
was her changing her entire personality. She had to dress
up like a literal dominatrix with tight leather pants in
order for him to listen when she's like, don't touch me. Yeah, yeah,
it's it's it's tough. It's tough there, and I get

(59:26):
and I get, like, I like their romance is very
simple and for like the kind of movie it is
like most I don't know, I don't even mind a
movie musical couple being like pretty simple and just being
told like they like each other, and like, I don't
really care that much about that. It's just the fact

(59:47):
that we only see him be not nice to her
and then her have to and any time she acts
in like quote unquote defiance towards him, anytime she just
does her own thing, or like goes in dates Tom
goes in immediately gets on the cheerleading squad at a
new school. What an amazing life. Um, even though she's

(01:00:07):
pretty bad, she sucks' but I was like, oh, wow,
she's really struggling to fit in. Just kidding, she's immediately
the most popular girl at school. Um. But yeah, just
the fact that we never see him treat her, well,
I don't know, this movie is so weird, but I
like all the music so much. Um, but it doesn't it.

(01:00:29):
I feel like it is. Even if even though it's
a very simple relationship and we're just told they like
each other how they were at the beginning of the movie,
if we're taking that at face value, that the way
the movie plays out is still kind of makes no
sense because he like he liked her when she was
like a very passive sweetheart at the beginning of the movie.
But then she's like, now I'm a dominatrix, and he's like, actually,

(01:00:53):
I like this because I don't think you like her.
Right Well, it's like it's like, now that my friends
are around and we're wearing the same outfit, now they
can respect that I like you, Sandy. So it's fine
if I show that I like I Just like, I
don't follow the logic at all. Yeah, right, when you're
about to not be in that social situation too, Right,

(01:01:17):
right when it doesn't matter, and but no, they're they're
like double down. At the end, they're like, we're never
gonna leave our hometowns ever, we're always gonna, We're gonna,
which is like fine, but also just a very aggressive
ending message to the movie. I think, okay, isolating the
music and taking it away because to me, they're like

(01:01:39):
the song and dance numbers. And this is coming from
someone who doesn't like musicals generally, those are the best
parts of this movie. If you take those away and
just like examine beat for beat the plot and like
the different like character arcs and stuff like that, this
movie makes no fucking sense, Like and it's it's like
it's a it's a badly written story. Just like there's

(01:02:00):
no lesson that anyone really learns. There's no growth demonstrated,
which is so weird because there's so many characters who
are like edging on learning a lesson and then they
just don't. Yeah, like you said, like it seems like
things are being set up for again, Like yeah, the
setup of like Danny Zuko being a prisoner of his

(01:02:22):
own toxic masculinity and like it seems like he's going
to have to learn how to break out of that
and like grow past that, and then it just doesn't happen,
and he just keeps like forcing himself on Sandy and
mistreating her throughout the entire story and then complaining when
she doesn't respond if you like, stop embarrassing me, like

(01:02:44):
or French, she is going to choose her own life path.
But then an angel comes and is mean to her.
So then she goes and graduated high school, which it
seems almost like the theme is going to be anybody
can pass high school because that's on the announcements at
a crucial time, and it's like kind of reinstated, like
stay in class, you can pass. And then that doesn't

(01:03:08):
really seem to end up being meaningful. I feel like
I felt for Frenchie has such an incomplete story, But
I like Frenchie. I like that she's like trying to
do her own things, trying to figure herself out, and
then she fails once and Frankie Avalon so mean to her.

(01:03:29):
He's just so great outfit, though no customer would go
to you unless she was a hooker. Like just again,
I was just like a yikes, that line, that line
a disaster. And then on top first of all, um
I know it wasn't of the time, but I thought
frenchice hair was cute. But the pink, the pink. I

(01:03:49):
was like, Okay, you just have to move to two
one and you're going to be the most popular girl.
You're gonna be the most popular thirty year old in school.
But even in that song, I feel like it's implied
in one of the lyrics that she should go back
to graduate high school and then not get a job
and kind of be a housewife, where he basically says like,

(01:04:11):
you're not cut out for a job, so go finish.
First says, go finish high school and you can join
the steno pool. He's like, you can't be a hairdresser,
but you could be a stenographer. But then later he
implies that she couldn't hold a job and she's just
not cut out for it. It's so sad every time
that scene it the way that that song is set up,
at least in the movie, I you always think that

(01:04:33):
the older waitress is going to be singing to Frenchie
and that she's going to end up being the fairy godmother.
If I ever staged with this show, I'm stealing that idea.
That's so good, I always like, because it's always she
was like, well, I don't know. I was like, Oh,
she's about to turn around and it's going to be
sequence and she's gonna tell Frenchie how she's made it

(01:04:54):
in her life. And then but then it's just like,
oh no, here's here's a character we've never met and
we never see again, telling her she could never hold
a job, like you know, poor French. There's also I mean,
we touched on this, but the one of the other
pink ladies, Marty, we touched on how an adult man

(01:05:15):
praise on her and apparently tries to roofy her, and
that just gets completely blown past and played off as
a joke. In the play, he is scripted as going
around the dance feeling people up. That is a part
of the stage directions in the place that he's like
watching people dance, and then he is occasionally like copying
a field horrifying. It's funny. Sexual violence from old people's

(01:05:41):
funny lious. It's because it's like in or they like
it was a simpler time. I'm like, I'm pretty sure
people were also doing that in ninety eight, so maybe
it was just at his hands. Slithered down and rubbed
one of the girls across the ass or nonchalantly trying

(01:06:01):
to quote cop of Field is in the stage direction. Uh.
Interesting note on Marty. In the play, she is explicitly
engaged to the marine, and then she has a song
about it, and then they've changed it in the movie
so that she's in penpal relationships with lots and lots

(01:06:22):
of men, which is more of a comedic beat and
not a song beat, and has also been used. I
read and watched a few arguments as to why this
is a highly feminist film, and one of the points
that has made is that these women don't seem interested
in domesticity or having babies, are getting married, which is
less true in the play because Marty is engaged and

(01:06:44):
I guess she seems like a little bit more like
she's living in an exciting like because she has multiple
men in her life that are across the sea, but
it doesn't seem like they have career interests either, So
I don't really think that that argument has a like
to and on. I think it makes sense to me
in like the framework of like what second wave feminism

(01:07:06):
seemed to mostly be, where it's like still very like it.
I feel like second way feminism in particular kind of
really enables a lot of like rape culture because because
it's like it rejects domesticity, it encourages women to, you know,
at least on paper, um like have sex with whoever

(01:07:27):
they want and like get a job if you want,
like have more freedom. But in a way that almost
like endorses all this gross behavior from men and framing
it as like no women are allowed to enjoy it.
You don't have to pretend that you don't like it
because you're approved, And it's like almost I don't know,
it's I'm telling you I don't like it, Yeah, exact exactly.

(01:07:50):
I'm like, but what if? But what if? What if
you meant it? Like there's also like a during that
beat when she's like, oh, like I'm dating a Marine
and a whole bunch of other guys too. She puts
on this robe and she's like, yeah, Bobby got it
from me and Korea, and then I forget which one
it is. But someone's like, you're not dating a Korean,

(01:08:12):
are you? And she's like, no, he's in Marines, So
it's like, of course I'm not dating a Korean. You stupid,
Like Okay, so there's there's like, yeah, there's that racist joke.
There was like the like little homophobic moment at the
dance I'll look inna you Eugene. Yeah whatever, Yeah, and

(01:08:35):
then there's just like a ton of I mean, and again,
this is like the most basic criticism of Greece. I
don't even want to harp on it, but like, the
amount of like rape culture in this movie is so wild.
It's like that's that's all of the T Birds just
just like their character. It's barely worth mentioning. But like

(01:08:56):
the I mean, what is worth mentioning? But it's like
this has been already mentioned and a million times by
a million people. But like the lyric, dude she put
up a fight and it's like yeah, that's like God,
the debate, I mean, it's like at this point it's like, yeah,
that's rave culture. I don't know why it's an argument this.
I'm there are certain like arguments that people are never

(01:09:17):
sick of having that it's like can we just can
we just put it to rest? It's obviously a very
rape line, and um, I don't like, what's the argument, right? Well,
but yeah, all the T Birds, I mean that all
the tea birds are are in a prison that they
have constructed them. Well, like again, there's a moment that

(01:09:39):
I'm like, oh this this could be fun or there
could there could have been more commentary on this where
Knnicki is trying to ask Danny Zuko if he'll be
his like driving buddy. So I don't even know what
He's like, you will you be my shuck in in
command for thunder borderline like a romantic moment only sort
of makes sense. What's happening. I don't know what he's

(01:10:01):
asking it, but he's basically just like will you be
there for me? Bro? And will you be my second?
At Thunder Road? It's like do you want me to
be in the passenger seat? Like what are you asking? Anyway?
And so he didn't you also didn't understand that because
I was like because Danny zo like react, so he's
so thrilled. I'm like, what the what? What's the question?
Does that mean you'll fill in for me in case

(01:10:21):
I get my head bombed by a car door and
I'm unwilling to raise? Is that what he's preparing for?
I guess like can you be my study? So weird
because like Danny doesn't even know what he's asking it
first either, but then he's like, oh yeah, and then
they like so once you realize and get embarrassed, yeah,
they hug and then there's like this nice, tender moment

(01:10:43):
of like platonic male friendship. And then they realize what
they're doing and that they're like you know, grease or
guy friends are also right there watching, So then they
pull apart. They start like you know, coming back, slicking
back their hair and like resuming their like you know,
macho persona, and like, can't we talk more about that?
Like why can't the movie explore that more? And then

(01:11:05):
but it's just like this fleeting moment they really cannot explore.
They cannot male friendship. I wanted to go back to
the Pink Ladies to Jan because there's a there's a
strange thing happening there, and I didn't even realize what
was happening until like halfway through the movie. So basically
there's a scene at the diner where she starts talking

(01:11:27):
to one of the t birds and I truly have
no idea which one it is. Putsy the blonde guy
right whose character is Roger, and the play and Roger
is also supposed to be fat, so there's supposed to
be two fat characters, and then the movie there's one
fat character and no fat acts and actually no fact
that was so confusing. Okay, so what basically what happens

(01:11:48):
here is that jan is talking to Petsy and they
start kind of like flirting and connecting, and Putsy is like,
I've always seen you as more than just fat, and
she's like, oh things, and You're just like what what
did what what are you talking about? Because Jan, that
is not fat, not fat, the actor is not fat.

(01:12:09):
But then when I went back and rewatched the movie,
I realized that she is apparently supposed to be coded
as fat because she is wearing baggy clothes and she's
always eating. Yeah, which if I didn't notice that on
the first watch, and then I had to rewind when
it hit that point, I was like, what was this
signal to us in anyway? But it is. It is

(01:12:30):
in the way that they like, like, you're like in
the way that she is eating sometimes, because right, because like,
if you're fat, you're always eating. That's what the movie,
which is like the laziest plot point in the book.
Also the fact that in the play, they were that
whole implication that like fat people can only date other
fat people, Like that's another exhausting like yeah, there's three

(01:12:54):
times more jokes, so oh no, yeah, it's it's pretty bad.
I guess I'm bad that those aren't included like in
the movie. It was just very jarring, especially especially because
then it's like the sad thing where she when they
say explicitly that this is supposed to be a fat character,
and then you're like huh, and then she implies that

(01:13:16):
she's been like starving herself and she's been like dieting,
and that now that she's dieting, a boy likes her,
Like you're just like fuck. And then at the very end,
when there's like the whole like carnival dance sequence, she's
in like a form fitting dress, and I think it's
the implication is, oh, she's lost weight. I think that
that's how the actor looks there. That's just how she's

(01:13:38):
always looked the whole time. I was just like I
could not even begin to wrap my head around what
the intention was of any of that. But I was like,
I think the movie is trying to tell us that
this character was supposed to be fat even though the
actor is thin, but we're supposed to think she's fat
because she's eating all the time. I was just like,

(01:14:00):
what choice is this? I was so CONFA, that was
a very confusing plot point to take in. I mean,
that's I vaguely now that you say that there's more
jokes in this stage show. That kind of brings a
bell to like productions of it I've seen before, which
is also just like, especially when you're like often casting

(01:14:20):
kids in that show, incredibly cruel and fucked up to do. Yikes, Um,
that was weird. I thought her like I didn't know
because I was like, there are all these like stock characters,
and there's a wide I'm like, the most I can
kind of say, for like, there are different types of

(01:14:40):
women in this movie, but it's just kind of like
a lot of different types of female stock characters. Yeah,
it's archetypes. It's not there's a wide provide range of
archetypes for in this movie. I thought that she was
at first, I was like jan is a. I went
a for a direction like, oh, she's wearing glasses, so

(01:15:02):
the movie wants me to think that she liked school,
But apparently that's not what I was to think. Oh, no,
I think wears glasses. Who wears glasses? Marty? Oh she
has the horn from glasses at the beginning, Yeah, she
has glasses in the first scenes. I was like, got it, books,
But I was wrong. I was smarted by a different thing.

(01:15:25):
Don't they make me look smarter? No, I can still
see your face. Ye. Hey, here's something though. The mechanic
at their school who helps Knicky fix up his car
is a woman, Mrs Murdoch. So do think she's the
shop teacher? I guess I think so. Yeah, she gets

(01:15:47):
a matching outfit, but that's not a role that a
woman would traditionally play as like a shop teacher, like
an auto mechanic, especially during that time. So I was like, okay,
that's something. Yeah, that's something. That's something. I liked her outfit.

(01:16:08):
I just I love all the outfits, all the outfits.
Cannot argue with them. Um, I just have a couple
of other really quick just again, like the promotion of
rape culture that this movie likes to do a little
gloss of really quickly. Um, there's the I think it's
which I forget which tea bird it is? Again, they

(01:16:28):
all just sort of blend together for me, but one
of them is like looking up a girl's skirt on
the bleachers, and like one of his friends does the
absolute bare minimum to like stop him and call him
out on it, but it's too embarrass Petsy, It's not
to stop it from happening. It's ok because he got caught. Yeah, yeah, okay.
That makes just go like a um. And then there's

(01:16:54):
also a moment where it's like during or after the
Summer Night's Song, where Sandy has said how great this
boy was that she met, and then Rizzo says, oh,
you know, this is supposed to be true love, but
he didn't even lay a hand on you. Sounds like
a so like the girls, unfortunately, are also kind of
like have been conditioned to buy into this rape culture

(01:17:17):
idea that if like a man isn't throwing himself on
you and assaulting you constantly, he must not like you.
I think it's also connected to Gracie what you were
saying earlier about how like that is kind of like
what is supposed to make this movie feminist for its time,
is like, oh, they're not prudes, so therefore, like that's feminist.

(01:17:40):
When you're like, no, this could actually be encouraging some
pretty like harmful. It's so I don't know. Summer Nights
is the wildest song of all time because it's so
catchy and I love it so much. But it's like
they're just it's just like people singing in this like
cell of gender normativity that they've created. Yipes. Yeah, Well,

(01:18:02):
does anyone have any other thoughts? Um? Should we talk
about chaw chaw our Only she's not explicitly a character
of color in the play, Okay, but then she's kind
of our only character, Like that's on our only speaking
character of color. I think I thought she's a Italian. Oh,

(01:18:28):
she's supposed to be Italian in the movie too. I
think based on the last name. I read a whole
bunch of criticism about her character from that standpoint. Okay, yeah,
because I I know that the actor who played cha
Shaw is Mexican Italian. Yeah, I'd like to know more
about the criticism around it, because that whole I mean,
the way that that character is treated at every stage

(01:18:50):
is I mean, she shows up, she is immediately a villain.
She's one of um, you know, Danny Zuko's discarded women.
But what what is? What is some of the criticism
around around that bend. You know, it was it wasn't
like a super in depth article, but it was pretty
much just you know, they refer to her um I
forget which is the plane, which is the movie, but
they refer to her chest hair. At one point in

(01:19:12):
the play they call her a gorilla. That and ends
in the movie where like she gives because she's like
sort of dating crater Face sometimes, I think, and she
like pulls a little necklace out of her like cleavage
or something like that and gives her like a little
charm or something and gives it to him. And then
one of the pink ladies is like, oh, she just

(01:19:34):
pulled chest gave him some chest hair or something like that.
Oh I missed that line. That's yeah horrible. Yeah, it's
it's worse than the play. But we could talk a
little bit if we want to about women are kind
of mean to each other. Like for it being an
explicit clique and group, there is not a lot of

(01:19:56):
supporting each other's wants and needs going on. Even among
the pink ladies there especially mean to each other, Like
and they're supposed to be friends, they're pretty mean to
each other. Marty doesn't keep her secret and like even
like the principle is really mean to the office administrator.
Oh yeah, yeah, I had. I had a few notes

(01:20:16):
about that as well, where it was like there is
no support within this group that we're being presented as,
like oh, look at like visually they're presented as being
very close with each other, but they can't talk to
each other. Like Rizzo is like kind of drowning in
her own like shame and insecurity, and she can't communicate
honestly with anybody. French. She doesn't tell anyone that she's

(01:20:40):
dropping out of beauty school because I guess she doesn't
like trust her friends enough to share that information. She
only shares it with a waitress who immediately leaves the scene.
Like that made me sad. I was like, wow, no
one has Like everyone is very isolated for a group
that we're supposed to be like rooting for as best
friends like that, and and then and then Sandy too,

(01:21:02):
where they immediately except for Frenchie who doesn't really who
does who also joins in too bully Sandy when it's convenient,
but they immediately isolate Sandy as well. And it's again
it's like there there is. There's not even really an
attempt at a comment on it where there's no yeah,

(01:21:23):
there's just never any resolution, Like it's just like and
that's just the way things are. Women get jealous of
each other and they're catty and they're mean, and that's
just what they're like. And meanwhile men are horny and
it's like, yeah, we gotta yeah with with with no
attempts to even try to explore like what the context

(01:21:45):
for any of that might be, or like it's it's
the thing we talked about all the time where it's
like men have seen women being mean to each other.
They can't imagine why that would be, but they've noticed it,
so they're like, well, women are just mean to each other,
and like not stopping to say for a second that
it might be because our patriarchal society means that women
have to compete with each other for the very limited

(01:22:08):
resources and opportunities that are ever allotted to women. But
men are just like, nah, it's probably because women hate
each other because they're all petty, right, which, like this
movie would be I think like able to tackle if
it wanted to to. It's like I don't mind seeing

(01:22:28):
like teen girls in conflict with each other. There's a
lot of movies that do that very well and like
have it makes sense and you understand the argument and like,
but this is this one just just presents it as
like this is just what happens. It makes me say
they're also alone, Like they really are so like in
terms of like emotionally and like who either are able

(01:22:51):
to open up to. I can't even really think of
two characters that I'm like, oh, there's a strong bond
of trust and affection between these characters. Like no one
can be their authentic self with anyone else in the
entire movie. It's really I don't feel sad. It's trying
to be critical of a world in which everyone is

(01:23:12):
so busy performing their assigned genders and fitting into society
that look at these cool people. They're on the outskirts
of society and they aren't doing that, but they're also
busy performing their alternative versions of gender identity that they
are doing the exact same thing as their peers right exactly.
So it's really depressing. As a god boomers are they're

(01:23:34):
hurting so much. Yeah, yeah, like I just no one
can be themselves in this movie. Because everyone is so
so focused on performing for each other and rejecting people
for arbitrary reasons. And I understand that that's like a

(01:23:55):
pretty authentic adolescent experience for a lot of means, especially
like in the seventies, especially in the fifties. You know,
Like again, I keep having having to remind myself, like
this was all stuff from decades and decades ago, and
therefore we can't have high hopes for it. But if
you're gonna explore the like turmoil and pain that like

(01:24:19):
a team goes through with like trying to figure out
their identity and like behaviors that manifest because of like
their internalized misogyny or because of their you know, the
prison of their toxic masculinity. Like, then again, I think
the bottom line for this movie is like it starts
to try to make some arguments or like make some commentary,

(01:24:42):
but never there's like absolutely no follow through. Mmma. That's
how it gets solved in the end A booget boogety
boggety boget cheap we do well well hell like hell,

(01:25:02):
everyone is so trapped except I mean, if I was Sandy,
I would be thrilled to be you know, flying into
the sun and burning to her risk, Like at that point, sure,
why not? Clearly no one here is going to ever
learn a goddamn thing. I do. Like when when Frenchy
is like men of rats, No they're fleas on rats. No,

(01:25:23):
they're a me bis on fleas all rats, and then
she says the only girl a guy can depend on
is her daddy, And I'm like, like, the only man
a girl can depend on is her daddy, which no,
thank you, unless she at least has a good relationship
with her dad. Yeah, I don't have an emotionally honest
but apparently she can't because she didn't tell him that

(01:25:45):
you know, about any beauty school thing. She only tells
and she has to, Like French she has to make
someone up to have a conversation with anyone, and that
person also bullies her. Maybe yeah, maybe Frankie Avalon is
her dad, and he has so many children it's probably true.

(01:26:06):
I know I'm supposed to know who Frankie Avalon is,
but I truly have no idea. It's okay, thank you
so much. He's not in the best early nineteen sixties
b to writing movies, Like if I was to recommend one,
I would say watch The Jama Party. His characters also
really mean in those movies, Like you're supposed to like
him and want him to be with a net, but
he's an asshole in all of the movies and he's terrible.

(01:26:28):
God damn it, Rats there abase on Rats. There's one
theory that I wanted to bring up, and that's, uh,
the interpretation that the reason Rizzo is so glib about
her pregnancy being a false alarm is that that isn't
what happened. And and you know, she kind of she

(01:26:49):
has a line. The movie is so different than the play,
but she has a line after Patty runs by giggling
at her and Sandy tries to be nice, and she's like,
you think, I don't know what people are saying about me, right,
and that could be just that she's pregnant, but then
she I don't know. I think that's a fun interpretation.
I think it's an interpretation that has sort of been

(01:27:10):
concocted after the fact to try to make it seem
like a more feminist movie than the filmmakers intended for
it to be. Like, I don't think that that's the
movie is intent is that she had an abortion, but
if you watch it with that in mind, you're like, oh, yeah,
you could totally see that. That's that's, at least in
the performance, an option of interpretation, And that does seem

(01:27:31):
like something like that feels kind of aligned with Rizzo's character,
Like she deals with her problems on her own and
she doesn't ask for any help or support that she
might actually need. I mean, that's that's interesting, I kind
of I mean that plot point would make more sense
than just being like just kidding. Yeah. Well, she says

(01:27:51):
she missed a period, which that seems severe, and the
play she's just five days late, which is not that
big a deal, right, I missed a period, Yeah, is
a little different. And then she's like, turns out it
was a false alarm and that could be a lie.
I want Risso to be able to talk to someone

(01:28:12):
that isn't via just bullying the girl closest to her.
Rizzo's also trapped in this very strange everyone it's toxic
feminine toughness. Yeah. Yeah, it is like she can only
express herself but listen to hurt people. Hurt people. It
really is true, Rizzo. I just yeah, and then yeah,

(01:28:38):
it's like the women don't push back like it's weird.
It's like the pink ladies seem like aware that they
know of the double standard of like girls are s
if they have sex, guys are amazing if they have sex.
But then they still slut shame each other anyways, almost
in a way that's like it strikes me as like

(01:28:58):
a little coping mechanism of like, well, no one's ever gonna,
you know, not shame us, so let's also slunch shame
each other, like if you can't beat them, I don't know,
I want to see these girls down. Let's yeah. The
last thing I wanted to bring up was just there's
always this um when I was just looking into, like

(01:29:21):
I was trying to look into, like what does like
a teenager right now think of Greece. It seems like
for all of the many many, many many reboots of
Greece it has happened that have happened, it seems like
teenagers kind of don't aren't very receptive to the movie
now and they buy in larger like yuck, like I
don't you know, they have no nostalgic attachment to it

(01:29:43):
um and don't seem that interested and so as recently
as like a couple of days ago. Um, I guess
the BBC like played Greece on like one of their
larger channels, and there was like this big Twitter backlash
of like stop showing this movie on t BE we
hate it. Like there was a really big like everything

(01:30:03):
about this is like misogynist and gross and it scares
me when there's only white people in a movie, like
teenagers do not like this movie and good, like great
for them, but then they're still but they're still making
a lot, so it's like there's a little bit of
dissonance there. And then Olivia Newton John was asked to
comment on this last year, which is like, well, this

(01:30:27):
usually doesn't go well. Um, and it didn't. It didn't
go that well. Um, yeah, she was. She was asked
by The Guardian of like, you know, like Greece has
gotten all this feminist, you know, criticism over the years.
What do you think And she said, it's a movie.

(01:30:47):
It's a story from the fifties where things were different.
Everyone forgets that at the end he changes for her too.
There's nothing deep in there about the me too movement.
I agree with that last part. Uh, it's just a girl,
she said, It's just a girl who loves a guy
and she thinks if he if she does that, he'll
like her, and he thinks if he does that, she'll

(01:31:08):
like him. I think that's pretty real. People do that
for each other. It was a fun love story. And
I see what she's saying there of like it's a
it's an extremely goofy movie. Don't take it too seriously.
But it's like it's such a famous I don't know.
I feel like that's like basic media literacy, Olivia. If

(01:31:31):
people are beat over the head with the message of
your movie, it's impactful. And so, yeah, she's fine. And
I also there was there was like a lot written
about how her career changed in a very sandy ish
way after Greece came out, where she had she had
like done some She had released a couple of successful
albums before Greece, but they were more kind of like

(01:31:54):
they just weren't like explicitly sexual songs. They were pretty
like just pure songs about love of blah blah blah.
And then after Greece came out, they kind of pivoted
her image to be like really sexually driven. And so
in the early eighties there's like let's get physical and
her next album is called Totally Hot, and like her

(01:32:14):
image was kind of pivoted in a in a sandy
ish way. That's all I got. Life imitating art maybe,
Um does this movie pass the Bechdel test? It does?
It does. Right near the beginning, Sandy asks French, she
do I look okay? French she? Frenchie says, sure, you

(01:32:37):
look good. Sandy says, I'm really nervous, you know, and
so Frenchie says, you look terrific. Yeah, they like they have.
I don't know. I mean, it's like there there was
more exchanges between the girls in this movie that passed
than I thought. What They spend a lot of time
talking about guys, like a lot of time, and then

(01:32:59):
they also have they also talk a lot about just
like a little more interesting, like how they feel they're
perceived by other people. Um, but they usually are talking
about how I don't know. And then a lot of
the passes are them bullying each other? Yes, but they do.
Like women are talking a lot in this movie, more
than I like remembered their being. There's a lot of

(01:33:21):
conversations between women. It's just sometimes they're just bullying each other. Yeah,
so you know, not ideal, but they do talk to
each other. Uh, let's write the movie on our nipple
scale zero to five nipples based on an examination of
intersectional feminism. I will have to give this I think

(01:33:45):
like a point five. And again, like everyone's gonna be like,
but it came out a million years ago, like you
have to consider the historical context, and yes, that is true.
But I also feel like this movie started like it
felt like it was equipped to like make some commentary.
And if you're going to do like a fifties nostalgia

(01:34:09):
story and you have hindsight of what the fifties were like,
and you you want to comment on that, like we've said,
it feels like the movie feels equipped to make some
of that commentary because it starts to and then it
just completely bails on it halfway through or not even
like it builds on it after like twenty minutes, and

(01:34:31):
then it's like, well, wouldn't it be fun if we
just keep seeing Danny Zuko mistreating his love interest and
then until she decides that it doesn't actually matter to her,
until she stops running away from him, and then and
then puts on some other pants and changes her entire
personality and that's what enables them to be together. Question Mark,

(01:34:56):
It's just yeah, obviously it doesn't um hold up by
our standards today. I do see some of the arguments
that it would have been perceived as, yeah, like second
wave feminist at the time, but thankfully we have moved
past that and progressed beyond that at least a little bit.

(01:35:17):
So um yeah, even with all the you know, the
historical context in mind, I have to give it a
point five and I'll give my nipple to Rizzo. I
feel like she was the most interesting and complex character,
and she she deserves better, and I wish we had

(01:35:38):
gotten more from her and for her. Stucker Channing is
also so great. I'm always I'm never not so jarred
by how dirty she's done by that whoever illustrated the
title credits, so just not how she looks. And they
made they shrink her mouth down to like five percent

(01:36:00):
of its size, and then they're like, oh, you know
how Stockard Channing has a tiny mouth, and you're like,
I don't know that, No, no, I don't know that.
Very weird. They also make Sandy look like just a
generic animated princess without any of her flaws caricatured at all,
and like her face would be easy to do that too.

(01:36:20):
It's not like she looks just like a far away
drawing of Cinderella. Yeah, there's some animation choices in the
beginning as much as like that. I love the animation
style of that sequence. Um, but the way they draw
some of the actors is questionable. Um. Yeah, I guess
I'll go with point five as well. I feel like

(01:36:43):
the I mean, I I see the second wave feminism
arguments there, but it also ends up being like, oh,
women are allowed to have sex now, they're still going
to get shamed for it aggressively by each other and
by everyone around them and assaulted constantly. But I mean,
after revisiting this movie, I feel like the even the
fact that it's like a movie made about the fifties

(01:37:04):
in the seventies, that almost makes it like I view
it a little like less well historically, because it's like
a movie made in a more sexually liberal, progressive time
as nostalgia for when that wasn't true, and in a
way that is completely uncritical of that era. So I
just it's just all very weird. Um. And it is

(01:37:28):
definitely like extremely impactful to this day, to the point
where it's like, Helen, you don't even know if you've
seen it, because it's so like maybe you have movie
you haven't. It's so like ingrained into American culture and
also just kind of pedals this like false image of
what the fifties were, which we're like, not really a

(01:37:49):
good time while also trying to like not do that
but then like still doing that. I just yeah, the
period choices of it just are very weird. Um, but
the music slabs, the outfits are incredible, and they're like,
the performances are good. It's just man, so much potential.

(01:38:10):
I like that they start saying things. But then there's
also that definitely that vibe that we talked about sometimes
of like uh, man, like an adult man desperately trying
to write a teenage girl and completely like it was
an attempt. Yeah, I don't know, some half formed thoughts,
but and and it's still fun to watch. I don't know,

(01:38:32):
but I'll give it a have nipple for our purposes. Um.
And also just I mean it goes without saying that.
Literally At one point I was like, is this not
an integrated high school in like canonically? But there are
There are a few black students at the school, but
it's they don't even have grounds. But it's so aggressively

(01:38:52):
white that I looked it up. Yeah yeah, yeah, not
even to meat. Yeah, it's so that's also, I mean,
it's like I understand where the teens are coming from.
That's a very jarring thing to see and not have
addressed in any way. I don't know. Romanticizing is just
like a bad idea. It's'm gonna give it, give it

(01:39:14):
half a nipple, and I'll also give it to Rizzo,
but I'll give it to Vanessa hudgens Is Rizzle. Oh,
good grief, Gracie, what about you? Rizzo too? Rizzo again?
That was supposed to be a princess switched again that play.
I'm gonna change it. I'm gonna give my half nipple
to Rizzo, but Rizzo the rat, the muppet, Oh my gosh,

(01:39:39):
rat different. My strategy is, I'm going to give out
some nipples and then I'm going to take some nipples away.
Please love this. I'm gonna give a nipple to the
opening sequence because it's fabulous. Um. I have this little
addition subtraction thing I've written that involves taking away nipples

(01:40:00):
for soccer Channing's drawing, but it adds up to the
same amount, and I'm gonna go past it. I'm going
to give a nipple to look at me, I'm Sandra
d because out of the context of her making kind
of making fun of a real person. I think it
is kind of a feminist moment, at least the messaging
of that song. Taking out of its context, I'm going

(01:40:22):
to take away a nipple for looping together Danny pressing
himself on Sandy, and they'm going to take away a
nipple from the t birds showing patties panties to the camera. Yes,
I forgot about that. Yeah, that's an assault we didn't
touch on. I didn't even remember them all. Yeah, that's bad.

(01:40:44):
Um and whatever. I'm going to give it a nipple.
I'm gonna give it a nipple. Give it a nipple.
I feel like if I give it less than a nipple,
my dad will feel sad. Understood, well, Gracie, thank you
so much for being here, Thank you for having me.
This is awesome. What a fun summer night we've had. UM.

(01:41:09):
Where can people follow you online and plug anything you'd
like to plug? Um? I am at Gracie Gillham g
R A C I E G I L L A
m Um. I have a movie circle circling around on
Lifetime Channel right now. I don't know when it's airing,
but it is called Stolen in Plain Sight. Um. You
can look out for a movie called super Host coming

(01:41:31):
up pretty soon for that. Yeah, awesome, Thank you again
so much for being here. You can follow us on
Twitter and Instagram at becketel Cast. You can go to
our Patreon ak Matreon at patreon dot com slash pecketel Cast.
It's only five dollars a month and it gets you

(01:41:53):
to bonus episodes plus the entire back catalog of our
bonus episodes. This month, we're doing to Amy Oh wait,
what are we calling it? She can do it all month?
What can she do month? It's doing to Amy Adams. Yes,
I'm going to call it Adams June. Okay, Adams June, which,
of course we are observing in January. So Amy Adams

(01:42:16):
Drama Arrival, Jeremy Renner okay. And then Amy Adams Comedy Enchanted,
I'm excited, she can do it all. And then our
t Public store t public dot com slash the Beechtel
cast for all of your March needs. And with that,

(01:42:38):
let's get getting the convertible. We're fine into the sun
from room. By bye.

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