Point Break with Anita Sarkeesian

FBI agents Caitlin Durante and Jamie Loftus go undercover with special guest Anita Sarkeesian to infiltrate the patriarchy and dissect the gender roles in Point Break. 

(This episode contains spoilers)

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
On the Beck Doll Cast, the questions asked if movies
have women in them, are all their discussions just boyfriends
and husbands? What do they have? Individualism, the patriarchy, zef
invest start changing it with the Beck del Cast. Hi,
and welcome to the Beck Doel Cast. My name is
Caitlin Darante, name Shamie Loftez, and we talk about the

(00:21):
representation and portrayal of women in mainstream movies and in
this the podcast that we host every week, every freaking week, diligently.
We're coming up on a hundred. We are coming up
on a hunting up on a hondy, So be ready
for a special hundred episode. You celebrate, well, you crack
on Mike's hard lemonade. You. That's the only way I

(00:45):
could think about to celebrate our hondredth episodes. Pretty much.
It will you ice producer Aristotle, because we did this morning. However,
it is morning. It's so he's going to hold up
for a while. But also, you know, we would have
respected his choice to be est at the all of
an am if that was you know, the worst things
have happened. Sure, So we based our discussion from the

(01:06):
jumping off point of the Bechtel test. The Becktel test,
of course, being the test invented jokingly and then later
seriously by cartoonist Alison Bechdel that requires that any piece
of media have two female characters with names talk about
something other than a man for two lines of dialogue.

(01:27):
Super low bar, but hardly anything passes. Shall we try it?
Let's try it? Okay, Hey Caitlin, Hey Jamie, getting iced rules?
I love being iced. Awesome. The scene doesn't have to
be compelling, it just has to occur. So cool. Well,
I'm so excited for our guest today and the movie

(01:50):
Recovering Today. I've never seen before, and I didn't ruined
my life. I'm changed. I've fully changed. It took me
three sittings to watch this whole movie because it's just
so there's so much happened. I loved it. Yeah, it
starts wild. Yes, let's introduce our guest. Yes, let's do it.
Our guest today. She is a media critic and the

(02:10):
co host of the feminist Frequency radio podcast Anita Sarcasian. Hella, Welcome.
I was not informed that you've never seen this movie before.
I'm so excited now. I've never seen a thing in
my entire life. This was like just a thrill ride
from start to finish. Every every line is screamed, every

(02:33):
line because unbelievable. It's crazy how Catherine Bigelow directed a
Michael Bay movie. There's so there's so many twists and turns,
like I had to keep reminding myself, like, no, this
movie was directed by a woman. But then how is
all of this happening? Like there, there's just there's so much.

(02:53):
It might be the film with the most best single
one liners. Yeah, terribly cheesy, wonderful one liners in this
is just mind bottling. This also, and not only does
it have like kind of the tone and feel of
like an early Michael Bay movie, it also has the

(03:14):
veneers of any Michael Bay movie. There's a lot of teeth,
capped teeth, a lot of caps. I know that I
maybe this is a new little I'm feeling a little
assaulted that this is being compared to any Michael Bay movie,
even though I understand it. It's just it's making me
a little sad. Well back covered We've covered what to
Michael Bay movies on the We've covered Transformers, and we've

(03:35):
covered The Rock, The Rock his wife, Uh two very
different Michael bay movies. I'm always on this new proposed
segment Vineer watch Jamie's Vneer Corner, where I keep track
of all the Hollywood teeth. Refer back to our Transformers
episode for more discussion on Michael Baye and teeth addict. No,

(03:58):
it's Bruckheimer. Bruckheimer's addicted to Veneers. He can't sleep without,
he can't come without thinking about Veneers. So, Anita, what
is your history and relationship with Point Break? First, you
have seen it a lot, I don't remember. This is
one of those movies that's just been like around and
you just like, I know I had seen it, and

(04:20):
then I've seen it a bunch of times. And I'm
also slightly obsessed with Patrick Swayze, not really, I just
I like him in a couple of movies and now
think that I'm obsessed with him because of that, but
don't know that much about him. So you're burying the lead.
You love Patrick Swayze. I would like to pick a
fight with whoever has already done dirty Dancing on your podcast,

(04:41):
because that's really what I want to talk about, because
The Very Dancing Legit is my favorite movie, and you know,
Patrick Swayze is also in that. So these two are
my like late eighties, early nineties like favorite go to films,
and they both happened to start this amazing, wonderful buff man. Yeah,
I love him as far as I know, Patrick Swayze.
We are. It's it's okay to love Patrick Swayze. Yeah,

(05:04):
well he's no longer with us. He can't funk up
now exactly, and so far he was married for like
thirty four years. I don't know if that means anything,
because it doesn't always. But you know, there have been
no accusations that have come up against Patrick Swayze, which
I don't know if that would be useful to anyone
at this point anyways, But Swayze can't I'm your dead baby.
He's gonna always be body or Johnny Castle to me,

(05:28):
You just Johnny Castle. Hard to take that away. These names,
the names Johnny Castle, Utah, Danny Ocean, Larry Jealie, what
are these names? I would also like to point out
that if you've never seen Point Break the film, does
that mean you've also never experienced Point Break Live? That's yeah,

(05:49):
what is that? Do you know about Point Break Live?
I don't know about Point Break Live. So Point Break
Live was this live theater show that was around for many,
many years and it was a recreation of the movie
live in a theater. And the way that it worked
was the role of Canoe was cast every performance and

(06:13):
the way it would be cast is that people in
the audience would come up to the stage and do
their best canoe impression. The audience would vote for their
favorite canoe and then that person would be in the
show for the night. And the way that they would
be in the show is that someone walks out with
que cards and they read off of the que cards.
The other amazing thing is that the live show turns
the homo erotic subtext of Point Break into text, which

(06:37):
is so good. The other thing is that they will
sell you one dollar poncho before you enter the theater
because they actually like splash the Oh my god, I
feel like homoerotic theater with a splash zone is the
show I want to see every single time, every single time.

(06:58):
That's unbelievable. I'm so bummed for all of the people
who didn't experience this show live. Yeah, so you're a
huge fan of the movie Point Break, I am. I
am a solid fan, Okay, like I've got facts about
the movie, behind the scenes info, and Jamie, you had
never seen it. I didn't grow up with this movie either.
I didn't see it until I think last year on Thanksgiving.

(07:20):
I had always heard of it, of course, but didn't
know really what I thought the reputation that it had
is that it was like a solid, like really cool
action movie. And did not realize how cheesy it is
and like how corny all the dialogue is and all
the performances are. So I posted on Facebook and I
was like, why did no one tell me how lame

(07:40):
Point Break is? And I've never gotten so much vitriol
hatred about anything I've ever said. I think it's one
of those things where like when you watch movies that
you watched as a kid and like experienced them when
they came out or when you're you know of that
time period, if you've never watched them but heard the hype, right,
because Point Break is a cult classic at this point,

(08:02):
it's really hard to watch it as an adult, Like
they just don't hold the same nostalgic appeal and I could.
That's why I'm super fascinated by the fact that you
hadn't seen it, and like, your interpretation of it is
going to be wildly different than mine because I have
all these like emotional attachments to it. I write no emotions,
but I ever but no, I I don't have an

(08:24):
emotional attachment, but this is this is one of those movies.
And I guess I'm trying to think of a movie
that we've done. This is similar to it where it's
like the problems are so clear, they're handed to you
on a platter of like, yeah, here's something awful, stare
at it, cheer for it, even and but it's but

(08:45):
it's such a fun movie where I couldn't. I was
smiling for so much of this movie because it's just
there are so many things. Whe'm like, this is so
poorly acted that I thought it was like a plot point,
but it wasn't. Of like when Gary Busey's in the
car laughing at Calvin and jobs like that, so he's
like cackling, It was like, is he I thought he

(09:07):
was hiding something? Oh? I thought I was like, oh,
he's he's laughing too hard at the comic because he
doesn't want to be emotionally vulnerable with Kianu, right, now,
but no, he really just thought the comic was so
funny too, and he wanted to meatball sandwiches and we
had to watch Kanu order the meatball sandwiches for a
whole scene of like why it was so just this

(09:29):
movie is so weird. It's a weird movie. The question
is, is is the movie self aware of being so cheesy?
Like did they know they were making a cheesy movie? No,
I think that's it. I think they were, like they
probably knew that, Like some of the lines were like
a little corny, young full of come right. But I
think that they thought that that was kind of cool

(09:52):
at the time. They're like, We're just, yeah, we're making
this cool action movie. It's about surfers, it's about bank robbers.
We're gonna have Gary Busey and Keanu ree Kind and
each other. Like I really think the people behind this
movie thought they were making I mean, because it was
the early nineties, Like I don't know that aesthetic was
like considered cool back then. And now we rewatch it

(10:12):
and we're like, oh, this is the cheesiest content I've
ever seen. Maybe, I mean, I a wild stretch of opinion.
I don't think this movie is trying to comment on
literally anything except perhaps surfers are cool. Uh, And maybe
that's kind of why I'm I don't feel that bad
that I enjoyed it so much in spite of all

(10:33):
the very clear issues. Is like, this movie thinks it's
fucking awesome and it's not, and that's funny. I mean,
don't get me wrong, I think the movie is very cheesy,
but I also think it's very fun to watch, like
it is a fun romp. So a little bit about
before we get into the recap, the like context of
this movie is fast. I mean, it's it's directed by

(10:55):
Katherine Bigelow, which I mean, if we could make a
list of movies I least suspected to have a female
director because it's not a shitty, conservative, fucking pro war movie.
That's I mean, Katherine Bigelow is like a polarizing figure,
but I mean this movie is so silly for her too,

(11:17):
Like it's silly and dumb as fuck. And this movie
I didn't realize that this movie came out the same
weekend as Terminator, to which was directed by her then
husband James Cameron. So there's isn't that. I just thought
that was interesting. So they were competing at the box
office together. Ye, term or two. I don't know the figures,
but I'm guessing at crushed Terminator two. Well, well, point

(11:40):
Break was second, but significant second. However, you know that
probably that makes sense cinematically, that makes sense. But yeah, so,
and I guess James Cameron also did some of the
work on this script, which you know, James Cameron knows
how to write a cheesy fucking movie, So that tracks
for me. God, his I'll never I know, I bring

(12:02):
it up every other episode, but his like first draft
of the two thousand two Spider Man movies, still just
like makes me craninge so hard every time I think
about it. Whereas I was like, oh god, James Cameron
wrote forty pages about a teenagers. Come, why did he
do that? That's so gross? Anyways, Well, should I do
the recap of Point Break? Okay? So Point Break is

(12:25):
about our hero Johnny Utah. He is a rookie FBI
agent assigned to his first case in the bank robbery
Department UM and he gets partnered up with Papa's who's
played by Gary Busey, and they're trying to catch a
group of bank robbers called the ex presidents because they
like all wear masks of like Reagan Nixon, lb J

(12:50):
and I think Jimmy Carter. And they go around and
they rob all these banks, and Bucy has this theory
that they are surfers in addition into being bank rubbers.
Um so the most logical conclusion, Well, there's some clues.
You know, they have a tan line. There's some like
sex wax that they used to like wax up their boards. Literally.

(13:17):
So Johnny Utah goes undercover and starts to learn how
to serve, to try to like infiltrate or like figure
out who the suspects might be. As you do, and
you don't make up an alias or anything, you use
your real name. We'll get we'll get there. Because he's
constantly getting into fights, He's constantly screaming, being very disrupt

(13:42):
of like I mean Kanu really, I mean, he blows
it a lot, but he really blows it in this one,
which is too bad because Kanu I feel like everyone
loves Kia, like he is a beloved person who blows
it regularly. Yeah, but I like Kiana reefs. Refer back

(14:05):
to the Matrix episode. We all I used to sell
that Kiana is Sudoku puzzles. Now that you are a hacker,
you really need to watch that movie, Jamie. I know,
I know, I so much has changed for for newer
Bectel cast listeners. That's the one episode where I didn't
watch the movie, and I'm lying for the entire episode
about knowing what you haven't seen the matrix. I still

(14:28):
have not seen the whole podcast. No, wow, I have
so much respect for you. You want to go back
and really grasping at straws. I mean I didn't, I
didn't notice you. You did something to make me not know.
I can still feel the sweat on my body from
that day. That was a stressful day. Okay, So anyway,
so Johnny Utah, he's going undercover as a surfer and

(14:50):
he's really bad at it. So he gets this woman
Tyler to start teaching him, and then LORI, Petty, what's up?
Petty rules Tyler. She's not like the other girl, right,
She's a cool chick. She's cool, she's she's a guy
scal she can be like, oh masculinity, but like still
be down but like, I'm cool, but I'm still best

(15:13):
friends with all these bank rubbers because okay, so she's
friends with this group of people. Body is there. They're
like elsa male played by Patrick Swayzy. Body, what did
they call him? Boda Riffith Bosa? Where did he get
that name? He's This actually reminds me of one of

(15:35):
my dear friend's father is in a southern California surfer
cult called the Barbecue Surfers, and I was like getting
major BBQ surfer vibes from And I would say honestly
that the BBQ Surfers were a more efficient cult than
the one in Point Break, because they also are not
very efficient at all. So Johnny Uta starts hanging out

(15:57):
with like Body and his pals. He tells everyone his
real name and they recognize him as a college football player,
so like, yeah, bro, come and hang out with us,
Like you're so cool, bro. Meanwhile, they're like still trying
to figure out who the ex presidents are and Johnny's like, Oh,
it's these like bad dudes. There's like this group of
four guys war Child and Bunker and like some other

(16:17):
dudes and they raid their house. But what's up the
Red Hot Peppers. Yeah, he's a singing in the Red
Hot Chili Peppers. My favorite part of the whole movie
is when he shoots himself in the foot. He's the
guy with the crazy hair with its like braids down
the side and then like a long pony on top
of setting information. Wow. Okay, okay, okay, So that doesn't

(16:43):
work out. And then Johnny he's hanging out with Bodie
and pals some more, and he's like one of Bodie's boys,
one of Bodi's boys, and he's like, oh my god,
Bodie and the boys are the ex presidents. And then
also meanwhile, Johnny and Tyler are getting a little closer.
They have some sex on the beach, and oh my god,

(17:04):
that scene where their first kissing is so funny because
they're both like you can tell just the actors like
Lori Petty and Kanu Reeves as individuals are struggling to
stay on their boards, like they're bobbing up and down
and like trying to deliver lines to each other. And
then he like he touches her leg, but I feel
like he's also trying to steady himself. And then she

(17:26):
kisses him, but they're both still bobbing. I was like,
this is not a hot kiss even remotely. Everyone is
so cold and nervous, and you see her lip chattering,
like I know that they acknowledge that it's cold. But y'all,
if you don't live in southern California, I don't know
if you understand how fucking cold the ocean is all
the time, especially at night. Maybe one of my least

(17:46):
favorite movie kisses of all time. It was I mean, like,
you know, it was a consenting kiss, right, not a
surprise kiss. But it was bad. It was bad because
he touches her leg and he's like goose bumps. Is
if like that's his like sweet pickup line and then

(18:07):
they kiss. It's very romantic. I don't know what you're
talking about. So also, who the funk? As an adult?
Doesn't know that you don't funk on the beach, Like
just you don't. You've done it once as a teenager,
and then you never do it again because it's the
most awful thing I've never sucked on the beach. That
sounds cool, You go do it, and then you'll learn

(18:27):
why you never funk on the beach. Okay, it's the messiest,
it's the worst. You stand everywhere forever. Good of the
barbecue surfers, so Johnny's like, oh my god, my Bodie
boys are the bank robbers. They catch them mid robbery,
so he blows his cover and then he's like, oh no,
what do I do? And they capture Tyler because they're like,

(18:51):
we got to use her as like leverage to like
get him to stop chasing them. And then they're like, Johnny,
come with us to go skydiving, and then also come
with us to go on a bank robber and it's
like this is where I was like the whole plane sequence.
I was like, why is this what is happening? He

(19:14):
accompanies them on. They're like, you have to come with
us on this bank robbery or we're gonna kill Tyler.
So he's like okay, and they do it, but a
lot of things go wrong and some people die and
then Bros dies and it's so fucking sad, dude, right,
So they like escape and Johnny is like, I gotta

(19:36):
go after them, so he like tries to catch him
at the airport. They escape, He goes after them. Still,
there's more skydiving, and then finally like they released Tyler,
but body and the remaining boys get away and then
we cut to the next line pick up the body,

(19:57):
and then the end of the movie is Annie confronting
Bodie on the beach in Australia and he's like, I
got you now, and he's like, no, man, I can't
be in a cage. Just let me kid one least
wave dog please. It's like, okay, broke sounds fair broke,
and then Body effectively kills himself by surfing spectacular surfing

(20:19):
before Keiana Reeves says via contillos its an it's a
It's an epic line in the movie. So good on
on that spectacular surfing suicide. Note, Let's take a quick
break and we will be back in a second, and

(20:41):
we're back from the dead. We did it. We're Body's ghost. Yeah,
we did it. So now you know what happens in
the movie, right, But I feel that we still have
not scratched this, not even close. The first thing I
do want to say is that, so, Jamie, you know
how your form Twitter handle was Hamburger phone inspired by

(21:03):
the movie Juno Rest in Paradise. Yes, this movie point
Break has inspired me to create a new Twitter handle
for myself, football helmet, alarm, clock there and iconic crop.
So yeah, that's my new Twitter handle, so follow me
at football helmet alarm clock. I have okay it genuinely

(21:26):
and Caitlyn we talked about this a couple of days ago.
It took me three days to watch this movie, like
when did you stop? Like what parts did you stop at?
What inspired the brakes? It was never because I was angry.
It was never because I was upset. I would just
be like, I'm just I'm full. I feel like I
just ate a whole meal and I need to rest.

(21:48):
Like the first night, I got twenty five minutes in
and there was just like a line that Gary Busey screamed,
which does not narrow it down at all. It's Oh,
it's when Gary Busey says twenty two and puts up
two fingers. That's when I shut it up. The first
time he says twenty two, and yet his hand says yeah,

(22:12):
I didn't get very far. And then I watched the
most of it, and then oh, I stopped again when
Patrick Swayzey's bro died and he was so freaking sad
and he was like my bro, my fallen bro. And
then I watched like the last ten minutes like this morning.
The third day, Yeah, one of the first things I
want to say is that, so this is directed by

(22:32):
Katherine Bigelow. As we mentioned, I find it interesting that
a movie directed by a woman is not immune to
a lot of the misogyny and problems that most movies
that are directed by men have, because, like like you said, Jamie,
this movie kind of hits all the marks of like
there's you know, a woman captured to advance the story.

(22:53):
There's like some male gaze shots. There's like all this
kind of weird like an underdeveloped romance. There's all this stuff,
so much male kidnapping. Remember the scene where Kanu is
uh staring at Tyler changing and it's just like panning
her body, and then they pan her body again in
the video where she's like all of a sudden in

(23:13):
a nighty because we've ever seen her in a fucking
like lingerie little nighty and the cat down her leg
right like cool. And then there's so much more male
gaze with the The only other women in the movie
are the women in the house that gets rated um,
and they're like, you know, naked in the shower, that
naked chick fucking whales onto those dudes. Though, if feminist

(23:35):
icon woman who tries to kill Kana rees with the
golf club or whatever. But also the only people of
color are in that villain like in that house of
like the bad bad I don't understand the spiritual side.
They're not searchers like body, you know, right right, yeah,
there's and any people of color in this really almost

(23:56):
universally are demonized um as like these aren't I'm sorry,
keep saying the barbecue servers, these aren't like these are
the cool surfers. I hope that like the barbecue surfers
are okay with me. Given anyways, everyone everyone go to
this just be about barbecue. Everyone find out what surf
cult I'm most closely affiliated with. Um But then they're like, oh,

(24:18):
but then there's the meth surfers and they're bad, And
that's the only time you really see people of color
in the Intern. There's also a character named Alvarez who's
one of the other FBI agents, but he's like antagonistic
toward Papas and Johnny Utah, so he's also kind of villainized,
right yeah. Where it's like, you know, every time a
person of color appears in this movie, it's to get
in the way of Kia news development as a character.

(24:42):
Although Kiano is mixed, he is part Chinese and part
Native Hawaiian. Yeah yeah, and then as well as being
I think English, Irish and Portuguese. So I just wanted
to acknowledge that. But I'll say that I think because
he can pass is white, he is still able to

(25:03):
like get cast in all the big roles in Hollywood,
because usually Hollywood does not know what to do with
people who look ethnically ambiguous. Ever heard of it? Ever
heard of the podcast on how Stuff? What's Up? Network?
Check it out? Well, that's I I didn't know that
about cut. Yeah. I feel like the rock is like

(25:24):
a like an exception to the rule, but it's an
exception to most rules of course. But yeah, so I
just wanted to acknowledge that Kiano is mixed. You are heard,
Thank you. Getting back to the Katherine Bigelow thing, it's
it's tricky because Katherine Bigelow, I feel, and if you
have different examples to share, but like she's the most
frequently cited female director. When people are like, well women

(25:48):
don't direct movies enough, they're like, like, that's the exact
because it's always the margin of error, right, every time.
Every time we talk about like marginalized folks, they're like
the margin of error, right, like the one the name, Yeah,
so everything's fine now exactly. She's yeah, she's one of
maybe a handful of like women directors who are like

(26:10):
kind of household names. It's like her Sofia Coppola, Ava
duvern name Patty Jenkins, and you can Patty Jenkins like that,
and then like Nora Ephron and like Nancy Myers. But
that's kind And that's the thing is like women can
make sexist media too, just because like it's really important
that like there's a lot of internalized depression and that

(26:33):
like just because you're a woman doesn't mean that you're
automatically a feminist or making feminist media. And it's also
like part of the problem with the Bechdel Test. Like
so before before I was known for video games, like
the Bechdel Test, videos that I made were the like
the things that people knew me for. So I got
asked about it all the fucking time, which I was like,
oh my god, it's not it does not mean anything
as feminist, Like it doesn't mean it's good. It's just

(26:56):
literally giving you a tool to recognize that, like, we
got a problem exactly right. The Sex and the City
movies pass the backdel test, and that's not really what
we're going the pantheon of womanhood like I got. I
actually got so annoyed that people would pull it out
all the time that I, um, I added my own rule,

(27:17):
which didn't pick up. But whatever, It's fine. I will
want to um where the women have to talk for
over a minute, because most of the movies that pass
just passed because there was literally one sentence, right, just
one conversation. Absolutely, and sometimes by characters we never see
again who have nothing like that. That conversation won't have
anything to do with advancing the story in any way. Yeah, well,

(27:37):
and and yet this is a bit of a sidebar.
But what is your history with like, I mean, I'm
curious about your history of people getting in your mentions
about the Bechtel test specifically, like because there, Yeah, how
is your like your attitude shifted towards it through the years,
because I know you've been putting up with people forever.
I don't know what you're talking about. Twitter's beautiful haven

(28:00):
of just wonderful, tolerant, constructive criticism. Yeah, I just so I,
so I made a video. It was like a really
short one to two minute long video that explained what
the Becktealth test was and showed examples that did really well.
Because you know, giving people these like very simple media
literacy tools to start recognizing how to look at media
differently is really mind opening and expanding for a lot

(28:23):
of folks. And that's great, Like the this test is
very useful and a very very one on one level, right,
which we've always said, yeah, which I think you do
hilariously at the intro of your podcast. Um, but the
thing is that everyone was like every time you talk
about anything, they're like, well, does a test pass the
test as a pass the test as a pass the
test as if that is a marker of like actual

(28:45):
criticism of a film, right, And So I think there's
there's value in it, but it's not like the end
all be all, Like it doesn't give us that much
information other than showing us a wide scale pattern within
Hollywood totally, right. So I you know, I think that
we can use it, and I think that like, you know,
being able to integrate it in ways that you're using
it it like it's really helpful, but it's not like

(29:08):
the end of the end. It's not like, you know,
you've you figured out the Becktel test in every movie
and therefore we're done here kind of thing, or like
if every movie passes it, it automatically means that it's
like not oppressive, which is also not true exactly. And
we've we've seen some wild passes. Yeah, but wasn't She's
all that where the only time it passes in the

(29:29):
whole movie is one when one female character is telling
another female character that they should fucking kill themselves. Like,
there's there's some there's some wild passes. We'll link that
out as well, because we want our listeners to be
as familiar with your work as possible. Yes, thank you,
but yeah, and that's why we talk about, of course,

(29:49):
not only whether or not a movie passes the Bectel tests,
but a whole slew of other things. For example, should
we just get into Tyler. Yeah, let's get into Tyler.
So she is the only main female character in the
whole story. There's a few other women who pop up
here and there, usually in the background, or if they

(30:10):
do have any sort of significant screen time, they are
either naked or selling a sandwich. Oh is that a woman.
I don't even notice. It's because yes there is. Her
name is miss deerin the is she named? But is
she named in the movie? I think they call her
miss Deer? But all right, I don't know for sure.

(30:31):
She's she's a hacker and she wants to fun Keanu,
and that's what we know about her. That's pretty much it.
So this movie is one of the Brazilian examples of
a man trying to get closer to a woman by
lying to her or manipulating her. So for the betterment

(30:52):
of the world, right to stop, justified exactly, and don't worry.
He never like it's never in the way their relationship
plays out, that's never really resolved at all, because she's
kidnapped before it can be a discussion, and she does
confront him, but his pillow. Yeah, she knows how to

(31:14):
aim a gun. What was she trying to kill She
wasn't trying to kill him, just trying to I'm not
sure she could have. If he moved an inch, she
would have killed him. Yeah, So basically, so here's how
their relationship plays out. He's trying to surf. He's extremely
bad at it. He nearly drowns she swoops in and
saves his life. So we see an example of a
woman saving a man. It's not that common because usually

(31:35):
men are saving women in movies. Um, save very little mermaid, right. Um.
Then she screams at him. She's like, you have no
business being out here, basically telling him that he's not
good enough. But then he basically stocks her and it's like,
you need to teach me how to surf. Yeah, he
goes to her job. I liked that. We saw that
she has a job, we know what she does. Like that,

(31:57):
I was like, okay, movie, most movies don't get that
far before that, though, he is so that We talked
about this a little bit already. But the shot of her,
she's changing out of her swimsuit, as the audience were like, hmm,
this is extremely male gaze oriented. And then we cut
to a shot of Keanu literally gazing at her through

(32:19):
binoculars and we're like, oh, whoa, Okay, so this is
like doubling down on the male gaze. That's wild. But
don't worry, no commentary is made, no none whatsoever. So
then so he's like following her, stalking her, and then
he approaches her at work, it's like, you have to
teach me how to surf. She is reluctant at first,
but then he uses the information that he learned about
her from which hacker. That scene is also great because

(32:42):
Gary Busey's like, oh, this is your surfing contact, female
D nineteen pounds, hares blue eyes. Do you have to
say a hundred nineteen pounds? Do we all need to
be triggered? Like what? Why? And he's so offended that
she's a woman. Gary Busey was like, oh, he found
a woman to help me, which is crazy because in
real life, Gareb you see, loves and respects Mester. Right.

(33:08):
So then so he uses this information that he finds
out about her, which is that her parents died in
a plane crash, to sort of like leverage against her,
to be like, well, like, my parents died in a
car crash, so you just don't know what. It's like,
I'm finally doing something for myself. And then she falls
for it and agrees to start helping him. She's teaching
him how to surf, and then they get romantically involved,

(33:31):
because you can't have a movie where there's just a
man and a woman on a professional basis or a
friendship basis, they have to start having sex. There's a weird,
awkward kiss. They're sex on the beach. He keeps lying.
There's a long shot of Kianu just thinking while she sleeps.

(33:54):
Remember when he tries to tell her and she's like literally,
she says, you look like you are are about to
tell me something, and then you don't. And then he's like,
I'm going to tell you the thing, and she's like
puts her finger on his lips and he's like, no, no,
it's okay, don't tell me. She tries to shoot him morning,
and you're like, wait, what a lot of inconsistencies. So yeah,

(34:16):
what happens there is that he's, I guess, trying to
tell her that he's working undercover as an FBI agent
to try to find these bank robbers. She's like, some
other time, don't tell me now. Then we cut to
a scene which I would argue as a weird like
that just as bad writing and weird for the character
because a second ago she wants to know so badly,

(34:40):
but then her loins overcome her because he's like this
is so hard for me, and she's like men are
so bad at this. Further perpetuating the stereotype that men
are bad at talking about whatever. But I mean, if
you had representation of men in movies talking about their
feelings and their you know, vulnerabilities and stuff like that,
maybe it wouldn't be so hard for men to do that.

(35:01):
There's more ways, you know, you could. There's also surfing.
I really expressed myself best through my surfing, surfing, his art, surfing,
his life. So he doesn't tell her what his deal is,
but she finds out because he leaves his badge lying
around and I do want to get into the list
of all the reasons why he is a terrible undercover agent.

(35:22):
But did she say he's a lawyer, because he's like
I went to law school. My parents wanted me to
go to law school. Oh. I thought she was saying
I found out you're a lawyer. And I was like, no,
that's the lie that he fed her. Got it Okay?
So she finds his badge and then she tries to
she shoots at him, but the movie frames it because

(35:43):
she's like, you lied to me, or your parents even dead?
Tell me if your parents are dead, and then she leaves,
but the movie frames it as though we are supposed
to feel sorry for Johnny Utah for like having been
found out, rather than us feeling sorry for Tyler for
being lied to. Having her traumatic past leverages against her
because surf crime. Yeah, but it's because like the narrative

(36:06):
has her go absolutely berserk and nearly shoot him, so
we're like, oh, she's crazy. We're supposed to feel sorry
for john Utah, which is not great. Yeah, that the
way that scene it's so weird because it's like, I
feel like we probably all watched that scene kind of
the same way of like, again, it was an irrational

(36:27):
story choice to have her shoot a gun like that
doesn't line up with who we know that character to be,
you know, and every other example we've seen her try
to talk to him, and it's so it's weird that
all of a sudden they're like, no, she's she's mad
and she's crazy and we're about to kidnap her anyway,
so might as well give her a gun. Yeah, it's like,
how do we make her seem the most betrayed right

(36:49):
that she's like totally whack a doodle, Like this is
the way chicks react, and you know, bullshit, and they're
like the big climactic like scenes at the end. So
it's super inconsistent, right, But also like, I don't know,
I feel like I'm so much worth forgiving of a
lot of this stuff in this film only because like
it's so off the rails in every conceivable way from

(37:10):
the get go that you're like, oh, sure of course
she shoots the gut whatever. I do agree that everyone
is operating at and eleven for the duration of this
that it's not it's by far not the craziest thing
that happens. No, But then what's like super sexist? Then
of course we get the third act cop out of Oh,

(37:31):
let's kidnap the only female character in the movie as
leverage so that there's something for the boys to fight for.
And and then the next time we see her where
she's not you know, like bound and gagged on Patrick
Swayzy's creepy van computer or was like what was that
plugged into? What is It's not a wireless computer you have?

(37:54):
But and the whole thing where he's like Rosie, he's
just has this gift where he can just go blank.
I couldn't do it, man, she was my woman, but
like he can do it, and it's okay, and you're like,
what is happening right now? Right? Yeah, that's the other thing.
So the movie establishes that Tyler and Bodie used to
go out and have a romantic relationship, which means that

(38:17):
like the writers when they're trying to like characterize her
and like trying to figure out, okay, like who is
she in the story? Like what purpose does she serve? Like,
they had to write in that she is Bodie's ex girlfriend,
which is like not necessary for the story at all.
It's just weird. Yeah, for whatever reason they're I mean,
this happens a lot where they're like, well, why would

(38:38):
this woman exist in this story? Better make her the
ex girl, like, better established her relationship to a man
in this story. But it doesn't serve the story at all.
It could easily just been that they were friends or
they hang out in the same surfing circle, pushing the
point to write, Like in the party scene where he's
like doing the tequila shots of that woman, he says
to Johnny, Utah, what's mine is yours? And you're like,

(39:02):
because women be property, the property of the men. In
the game of patriarchy, women are not the opposing team.
They are the ball and the scene very much illustrates that. Yes,
I feel like that from a story perspective, that wasn't
even really necessary because you know, in one of the
things this movie I thought did right, we do know

(39:24):
a little bit about Tyler, Like I think we know
enough about her that we don't really need that element
where we know, you know a little bit about her
past where she has like you know, she is an orphan.
That's more than we know about a lot of female protagonists.
We know that she has a job and a hobby,
and we know that of course she is not like
the other girls. I suspect it's also I mean, like, okay,

(39:47):
we're talking about, you know, a very cliched story with
the three act arc or whatever is how you talk
about stories. I totally up. It's fine, keep moving, But
I suspect there's a thing where instead of just being like, oh,
she's a really good surfer and she just is down,
she like hangs out with a surfing group, like they
have to justify her involvement as an ex or else.

(40:09):
Why would there be some woman here, Why would a
woman be a good surfer? Why is a woman hanging
out in this house? That's not just background decoration. I
think that that's like too much forethought for the writers.
But I suspect that would be the you know, they
just did it because that's what you do. You just
write women as the love interest. But I suspect, like,
if you really force someone to explain it, that would

(40:29):
be the excuse, because otherwise, why would she even be there.
God's depressing, Like she could not have come to surfing
on her own. Yeah. And I think the other thing too,
is that her character is very indicative of like the
sort of rise that we start seeing in the nineties
of perceived quote unquote strong female characters, where you know,

(40:49):
you have these women who are very conventionally attractive and
they they're sort of mouthy, right, Like she can kind
of she's kind of like tough and cool like we're
talking about earlier, um, but is still put in her place.
She's still a love interest. She's still like kind of
this side character in this this story about two men. Yeah,
she basically only exists in the narrative in the context

(41:11):
of her relationship to the men who are the main characters. Yeah,
but she's like, you know, cool, right, because she gets
to comment on like you know, they're they're talking about
if you die doing what you love, it's worth it,
and she's like too much testosterone for me. Yeah, Like
she'll make these these like comments about masculinity and she's like,
you know, she'll she'll talk back, um, and she'll be

(41:33):
quote unquote tough. But like that doesn't really matter because
she's not important enough and she doesn't get to do
anything with that. It's not actualized. Right, that never really
pays because she's like big wave riding is for mucho
assholes with a death wish, which is what happens at
the end of the movie where does kill himself on

(41:53):
a big wave. But I mean, yeah, like her like
headstrongness so to speak, doesn't necessarily play into the narrative.
It just gives her a little bit more characterization, but right,
it's not necessarily important to the events of this story. Yeah, yeah, totally.
And I feel like, you know, at the time, it
was probably like man like, she's a really cool female

(42:15):
character in comparison to all of the lack of options
that we have in media during that time period, you know,
especially because she's sad, short hair, she's got short hair, baldist,
woman in charge there's not even enough. But there's not
even another woman. There's not another woman. I have a
very important question. What does speak into the microphone squid brain? Mean? Wait,

(42:40):
at what point does that happen? Bucy says it when
he like sticks a gun into someone's face, and I
was like, speak into the microphone, squid brain, Like, really,
how do you say that and not just have like
a word cloud of insane things that you can say
at any given moment. I mean, it probably means the
same thing is I'm so hungry I could eat the

(43:01):
as end out of a rhino. Or it means the
same thing as vanish like a virgin on prom night,
Or it means the same thing as are you through?
Mr Wizard? Let me know if you find Jimmy Hoffa
under the seat while you're at it, like his line
to Sea World Kid. I did particularly like when Keanu

(43:25):
said are we going to jump or jerk off? When
they're all like dying on the plane. That was definitely
a good They also said, uh, when they're skydiving and
they're like debating like whether or not they should pull
the rip chord, someone says we're gonna be meat waffles.
Just what end on that note, We're gonna take another

(43:46):
quick break and we'll be back in a second, and
we are back. Um, I want to talk about So
they're is a trend in this movie and across a
bunch of movies where like during the bank robbing scenes
or in like other movies, if you see like a

(44:08):
hostage situation, I feel like women are more commonly threatened
with violence or they're like thrown all around a lot more.
They're screamed at more, they're like guns are pointed at
them more, they're like thrown to the floor more. And
I think the reason this happens, the reason this choice
is made, is that women are perceived by society as

(44:30):
being weaker and more delicate, So when they're threatened, it
like heightens the tension more than it would if it
was like a big, macho guy being thrown to the ground,
because the implications always like she can't fight back, right exactly.
So it's like the filmmaker's idea of like how can
we like heighten the tension of this scene or how
can we like really amplify the stakes. It's so ridiculous

(44:52):
about that is in that scene that you're talking about,
he's like, lady open up the vault, and she's like,
Mr Manager has the keys, and so he's like, we
just missed your manager. So then he's like, here, do
whatever they want and gives her the keys to go
and do the things so that it perpetuates exactly what
you're talking about, as opposed to the dude with the

(45:13):
keys just opening up the fucking vault right, like he
just passes it off to her like that, what's come on?
It's so yeah, it's bizarre. And then if you just
see just like different moments of like extras, just like
women being thrown violently to the floor, pushed around a
gun how to her head? Like we see this all
the time in movies like this, if there's like a
bank robbery or something, and we perceive women as a

(45:36):
society to be weaker because maybe we just see so
much representation on screen of like quote unquote weak women
who can't fight back or who you know, are super
scared or whatever. But like, I don't know, like if
we see stronger and more fearless women on screen, this
wouldn't keep happening. Yeah, Well, and also challenging the notion

(45:59):
of what string means, right, and I think we're seeing
we are seeing more media that's doing that that like
this historical notion of strength and toughness that comes from
like male masculinity and like the hero hero archetype um women,
they just threw onto female roles and was like, now
you're strong. But like we I think we're slowly starting

(46:20):
to see more female characters who are more nuanced, who
are more flawed, who are more complex, and where strength
comes from things that aren't just like physical violence or
like stoicness. Yeah. And I would extend that same line
of thought to the chase scene as well, because you
see women sort of threatened with the possibility of violence,
but also it's like, oh, we're running through their house

(46:41):
without you know, asking to come in, so of course
they're going to be naked because we need an excuse
for nudity to appear. That always reminds me of die Hard,
uh in the first scene of die Hard, where there's
no reason for a woman to be topless, but they
find a reason, Like we'll just have her be having
sex with a random man. We will not see his
he's he's wearing a shirt. She's totally topless, So yeah,

(47:05):
I mean it's just it's like every movie tries to
throw in and this happens in video games all the
fucking time, where it's like, oh, there has to be
a strip club scene. Of course, yeah, there'll be like
a business meeting at a strip club in movies where
it's like, why are you meeting here? It's just it's
like an excuse for titties. And it's also like a
shorthand for like, these guys are cool, like or or

(47:28):
or villain is I want to go back really cool?
We didn't. We didn't talk about where the Tyler's storyline
leaves off, which is also baffed and frustrating because I
just want to make sure we hit on it. So
Tyler is kidnapped by Swaysy's meanest boy and uh, the
one who would actually kill her Rosie so yes, and

(47:51):
and Swaysie's character, in order to keep the audience on
board enough with him as a character, does this weird
thing where he's like, yeah, I can never kill her.
Fortunately I know someone who could though, and you're just like, okay,
I guess he's like, but I don't actually wanted to die,
like please Bedrock, sweetie. But we see Tyler at the end,

(48:14):
she's released or she you know, and she's wearing this
virginal slip, and she's wearing the white slip runs into
Keyanu's arm. Keep in mind the last time they saw
each other, she was shooting him exactly. And then you
see what one of my favorite shitty dumb sequences in
the scene was, which was him calling her on the
phone over and over trying to apologize and just grappling

(48:38):
with this. And he was just like, he's a tyler.
I'm so sorry, these are so messed up. I was
afraid you'd leave. And then he says and I quote, fuck,
why can't I ever say what I really mean? And
he puts the phone down, and I continues to do
the message. I was just like, you did nothing up.

(49:00):
That's on the message. Funk, my kid? Is he what
they really mean? So good? I prepped you for that.
Remember I would remember that I like pay attention. Yeah
that was the line. Oh that I like how old?
It is so funny. But but she doesn't talk to
him because we were to assume she gets kidnapped immediately

(49:22):
after running out of her own house naked with a
gun whatever, But we we don't see her again. She
runs into Kanu's arms, and as a call back to
a problematic scene Plissa earlier in the movie, she's about
to tell him that she loves him, and then he
goes some other time, So she runs into his arms
to say that she loves him, even though that doesn't

(49:43):
make any logical sense, and then he goes shut up,
and then she starts to make out with his neck
while he has a conversation with another character. It's that's
the last time was here. Yeah, that's it, Bye bye.
We have to watch the pat Patrick Swayze commits surfing suicide.

(50:04):
So the thing about the last scene, which again you
just gotta not ask questions about this movie, which is
the complete opposite of what we've been doing for an hour.
But so the FBI has no jurisdiction internationally. Oh yeah,
somehow Keanu reeves the rookie cop that he's already hated

(50:26):
by his boss, gets to travel around the world trying
to track down this one dude that robbed some banks.
A couple of times he finds him, then he lets
him go, and then he's like, I'm done, and he
throws his badge into the ocean, as if he wasn't
already fired, right did he quit? Like, I don't know
what that like. That's insinuation is that he's like, I

(50:49):
did the one thing I needed to do and now
I can quit. And you're like, like, you didn't do it,
but you didn't do it? Is his death satisfaction to you?
Is that? What? Like what you've been seeking for a year?
I I interpreted it as well. No, Actually that wouldn't
make sense either, where he's like he wanted to watch
Patrick Swayzey die, but he didn't want to be the

(51:11):
one to do it himself. Maybe I think he just
wanted justice quote unquote right, like you're a bad guy,
so you have to be taken down and like people
died and ship, right and so but he's still Kanu
has a soft heart and was like it's okay that
you die doing brain Yeah. And also in the year

(51:32):
he's traveling around the world. What's Tyler doing? Right? Is
she there? Where they break up? Like immediately after if
she had any sense, she would be like, I'm sorry,
I was just overcome with emotion because I was kidnapped.
But like, yeah, this doesn't make a lot of sense. Well,
they're they're romantic relationship is very similar to ones that
we see in movies all the time, where it's so underdeveloped.

(51:53):
We're not really sure why they like each other, aside
from the fact that they're both attractive people and that
they're near each other. So like, I guess you could
argue that she feels a connection to him because he
had a similar experience with the death of his parents,
which he didn't actually have, and he was just lying
to her about that. But like, other than that, she
like very quickly falls in love with him. They've only
been dating for like two weeks, Like the timeline on

(52:16):
this movie is pretty short, so when you're on the
beach though, but like body says something to Johnny Utah
where he's just like, you know, she does love your man,
Like she never felt that way about me, like I
can tell. So it's just like, well, why do you
love him again? Like it's just the I know, I

(52:36):
know why she like opens up to him, and that's
because he lies to her about dead parents. Because when
you have a trauma and someone else has the same trauma,
you immediately fall in love with You have to be
in love. That's that's what the movies of timing and
if they're lying about it too late. You're already in love.
You can't get out of that. I would like to

(52:57):
see how many scenes Keanu Reeves is in and where
he it's that last scene, you know, like where she
runs up and they're like kissing and they're like, we
love each other after this horrible thing just happened, because
it's the exact same scene in Speed Ye yeah, and
they make the joke and Speed about how like relationships
that are built on whatever, fucking like a trauma bond,

(53:18):
like yeah, it never lasts, and they're like's to love you?
I just like, how many movies does that happen in
with Kenna Reeves? I would like that super cut. So
if somebody could make that in sentence to me, I
would really appreciate. It's the implication there that someone can
only fall in love with Kanary as if they've recently
been through a tragedy, like you can't fall in love
with them in regular life. Well, in the Matron she

(53:39):
falls in them because that was a prophecy. Well, I
haven't seen that movies just as important as talking about
the only female character in the movie. I do think
that it's interesting to explore a little bit just how
masculinity is in hyper masculinity is portrayed in this particular
movie because the two cents real friendships between men that

(54:02):
we see in this movie are Swayzy Abusey, I don't know,
but give me that Kianu Abusi and Kianu and Swayze
two very different friendships, but both are rooted in hyper
masculine like adrenaline rushes, where like Abusey and Keanu get
off on the adrenaline rush of like police where the police,

(54:26):
and then Swayzie and Keanu get off on like surfing
and planes, and like it's two different types of the
same relation planes surfing and planes. They're like we're recreational
testosterone and we're professional testosterone. And you know, it's like
the Swayze is the weekend guy or whatever. But I don't,

(54:48):
I don't know. It's just weird to see both friendships
are based in the same like they're always doing stuff
instead of talking about stuff. And that's also the root
of most of their problem. This is because they're always
doing stuff and not talking about stuff. I don't know.
It's definitely a very specific type of masculinity. The whole
film is that is the same kind of like bullshit,

(55:09):
which hilariously Tyler tries to call out, but also doesn't
matter at all, right, Like it it's just so yeah,
it's such a throwaway line. The only way she calls
it out too, is by like stating it and then
leaving this scene, right and so continue but this time
without me, and she's still friends with them, so like,
if she was that bothered by it, she wouldn't be

(55:30):
hanging out with these guys, but she remains friends with them,
so it's like, Okay, well, you're not that disgusted by
their toxic masculinity, So it's just like, what's the point
then if you're gonna have a character make a comment
on it, but then like there's no follow through or
there's no repercussions. It's a it's like a have your
cake and eat it. To kind of where we were
talking about this recently in the Aladdin episode, where it's

(55:53):
like there's a bunch of like Disney Renaissance princesses that
are like kind of what you're saying earlier, inn to
of like here's a character who will technically say some
of the right things, but they're saying that has no
impact on what happens. So it's you know, it's almost
for like male creatives to be like, well we said so,

(56:13):
and it's like, yeah, but it had no impact and
nothing happened as a result of it. So why say
it other than to be able to say you said
it later? You mean when Princess Jasmine says I am
not surprised to be one and then Aladdin wins her, yeah,
twenty minutes later. Yeah. Yeah. It's like, just like, I
don't know if there's like a name for for when
that happens, but it happens so frequently, and especially in

(56:36):
movies of this era. And then also, okay, so are
we It sounds like Point Break Live references this the
like homoerotic undertones direct me to them, Like where where
the specific moments people pick out in this movie as
that is it the holding hands jumping out of the
plane scene. I thought they were going to try to

(56:57):
kill Kianu in that scene. That's where I went into
that scene, being like, they're going to kill him and
then it turns out that they're just they're friends. That
scene makes no sense in the movie. It doesn't need
to be there. It's so serves no purpose. Except to
maybe that it pays off a little later when they
go sky diving again, but that also doesn't need to happen.
Like I think someone was just like, we gotta sky

(57:20):
diving in this surfing movie. I'm trying to remember now
because when I just watched it again yesterday, and I
feel like I've watched it so many times that I
don't even notice it anymore. But I know for sure
them like being on top of each other in the
sky and being like pull the cord. No, you pull
the cord. You pull the cord. Now you pull the
cord um, and and because Swayze is like he's so,

(57:43):
here's the thing is I think Patrick Swayze is just
like the cats me out. Speaking of cats, cats do
have eight nipples, as this cat facts with Caitlin Go.
He's just he's so like kind of hippy dippy that
he's just like he's got a lot of charm and
ship it. And so I think he's just like hey
kind of all the time. And Kanu is trying to

(58:05):
like get close to that, and so there's just moments
where you're like I can see this fan fiction very clearly, right,
Like it's just kind of around, So I feel very
underprepared because I feel like I should know the answer
to this. Oh no, no, I mean that was where
I was guessing it was, but I just didn't know
if there was anything I was missing. Yeah, And also
the other thing is like I always feel like Tina

(58:26):
Belcher watching this movie because I'm like butts so many
look at all of the butts, the butt that says
I'm not a crook. It's like, this is a wild
but Yeah. And I mean, and their friendship it's weird
because it's made to be the kind of the purer
of the two friendships, but it's also kind of sold
up by the fact that Patrick Swayzy is also an

(58:46):
unrepentant criminal and kind of an anarchist. And he says
the line you project strength to avoid conflict, which really
just like boils down a lot of male character motivation
down in a pretty crystallized way. I don't know, it's
it's a weird friendship. And then Kanu also needs the

(59:06):
satisfaction of watching Patrick swayzey die via surfing, and you know,
he's just got to get that justice because you know,
the victims here are the banks. We all feel so
sorry for the banks that got robbed. He's got to
make sure that there's justice. I would like to know
the psychological profiles of how they determined which president they

(59:27):
all wanted to be. Also addendum or additional statement is
that they very specifically created that flaming gas station scenes
so that they could have Ronald Reagan with a giant
fucking blowtorch, like blowing forge or yeah, which I mean.
And I enjoyed watching that, sure, I thought it was fun.

(59:49):
I think that some of the like the homoerotic stuff
people talk about in terms of like masculine relationships and
like masculine love and like the close like trying to
get close or trying to figure out how to be
close one another. And clearly Johnny Utah has some like
admiration and interest in being more like body right, like

(01:00:09):
even though he's trying to like take him down, he's
like like he's like I'm fucking surfing and like hanging
out and having a really good time with them and
like trying to get in on this inner circle in
a way that's like you could almost see the extension
of like I want to be this guy and like
I want to be with him or I want to
be him or I don't know the difference between these things.
You know, well, we all want to be BODI, so

(01:00:30):
I get it clearly, especially with the banks. Yeah, those banks,
the banks. I want to go through my list of
all the reasons why Johnny Utah and Papas are terrible
at being undercover FBI agents, So real quick, Okay. So
they both show up in suits looking exactly like cops

(01:00:52):
to a surf shop to buy a surfboard. Then they're
both of the beach. There's people all around who can
hear Johnny say, you're telling me that the FBI is
going to pay me to learn how to surf, so,
you know, everyone like they're just in plain sight, everyone
can hear, and he's, you know, screaming about being in
the FBI. Then after Tyler saves him, he screams out

(01:01:14):
his real name and she's like, I don't care, which
I loved. Yeah, And then a bunch of people who
turn out to be the people that he is trying
to take down as the ex presidents all recognize him
as a college football star and they know his real name.
If they just did a little bit of research, they
could like figure out that he's in the FBI. We

(01:01:36):
know computers exist because there's a hacker and there's uh,
Patrick Swayzey's trunk computer. I was actually thinking about this though,
because I was like, oh, this was like pre wide
scale adoption of the Internet, so you couldn't just google him,
and he was in the FBI, so I was a
little I was slightly more forgiving about that, even though
it's clearly stupid. But then there's some other stuff that happens,

(01:01:58):
which like Papa's is near the beach, parked in what's
clearly like an undercover cop car, scoping things out with
binoculars in plain sight, and then Johnny is talking to
him on a walkie talkie in the middle of the beach,
again in plain sight. So they're just like, yeah, let's
use our like binoculars and walkie talking us just where

(01:02:20):
everyone can see us. They both miss the bank robbery
that's taking place like a hundred yards away because they're
so focused on sandwiches. I was like, surely the sandwiches
will become relevant at some point. They never do. He's like,
I need to meatball sandwiches. He we see him order
them meat ball sandwiches. He comes back with the meat

(01:02:40):
po sandwiches because he's like, man, maybe I should have
gotten three meat bos sandwiches. Um those okay? So Kiano
orders to meat ball sandwiches, one tune a sandwich for himself,
and two lemonades and it only cost four in today's money.
I did the inflation calculator. That's it have went to

(01:03:01):
fourteen dollars and thirty two cents, which is still very
cheap for three sandwiches and two lemonades. Like, what's that
all about? What area of l A are they? And
truly the point is is that they are extremely bad.
And then like Johnny Utah leaves his badge out where
Tyler can find it. He's so bad, it's not everyone

(01:03:21):
knows his identity and he basically tells every single person
in the movie that he is an undercover FBI agent.
This movie is so well, I mean, this is this
is a movie that is not progressive in literally any way.
The world did not move forward really in any way
because it was made. However, I really enjoyed it and

(01:03:42):
I would recommend people watch it and watch it with friends. Yeah,
I agree, we should find the people who do Point
Break Live to come back for like one reunion for
us that would be amazing. Yeah, and the fact that
it did inspire media spinoffs like that also make me
happy it exists. Yeah. Yeah, And um, what's this base
hot Fuzz which I actually haven't seen. Oh yes, there's

(01:04:03):
so much of Point Breaking that one of the characters
is like talking to Simon Peg and he's just like,
if you ever pulled out your gun and then shot
it into the air and went ah, And then he doesn't,
But then that character gets to do it later in
the movie. It's great. Um. One last thing I wanted
to say is that I do think it's cool that

(01:04:24):
a woman got to direct like a popular action movie
in the early nineties. Um, because that's a genre that
women usually do not get to direct, because in the
off chance that a woman is hired to direct a movie,
it's usually either a rom com or like a romantic drama.
I was like, oh man, this is so cool that
like a woman directed Point Break. You know of a

(01:04:46):
famous popular action flick that resonates with a lot of
especially men. So I was like, Okay, that's cool. But
as we've said, like, I was counter that with being
like I would wager that the reason she got to
do that is because she played the game and directed
it like most men would exactly at that time. I
don't know, because again this is a Michael Bay movie

(01:05:08):
in that the actors are almost always screaming their lines.
The lines are extremely corny and terrible. The line reads
are bad, and there's like over the top action sequences.
Like everything screams Michael Bay. I mean you didn't love
the line? I guess we must have an asshole shortage.
Not so far, I love every single line. I still thinking,

(01:05:32):
ha ha ha ha ha ha. This Calvin and Hobbs
is funny. Hey, get me a meat boss switch. Still
one of the wilder trains of thoughts I've ever encountered.
Does anyone have any other thoughts about the movie? I
mean so many? Like do vaults just have small piles

(01:05:53):
of money in them? That would have vaults actually looks like?
I think that's an important question. Yeah, just unsealed lose money.
It's just like the floor is covered in pennies in
this version of the basically The Cave of Wonders. Yes,
if you haven't seen point breaks added to the list
when you go to revisit cult classics, this is definitely

(01:06:15):
one to make sure you catch and don't add me
when you don't like it. I don't want to hear.
I don't want to hear about it. Shall we determine
whether or not this movie passes the Bechtel test? Yeah, no, no,
obviously not even close to Women do not even interact.
I think the only scene where there are two women

(01:06:37):
in the same scene together is when they do the raid.
For like all those aggro surfer dudes, one of them
is the party scene. Oh, that is right, but I
don't think any women interact there. I'd like to propose
a new addendum to the Bechtel tests, which is that
if a woman talks to a meatball sandwich, it passes. Yeah,

(01:07:02):
it passed. Even if the meat sandwich does not verbally respond.
Even if the meat ball sandwich identifies male, it passes.
I will bat I will send that motion, thank you
so much. But yeah, so women do not interact at all.
There's the scene in like the Raid, where there's one
woman who's wearing a bikini and woman one woman who

(01:07:24):
is wearing nothing, and uh, they're both I guess they're
fighting off the FBI. That I mean, we didn't that
scene is just wild. All the men are dressed like
fully dressed, not even like partially dressed, and all the
women are not, which is amusing in the opposite of
the definition of that word. Yeah. Yeah, it doesn't make
any sense why they're both barely wearing anything or wearing

(01:07:47):
nothing at all. But so yeah, does not pass the
Bechdel test. Let's rate the movie on our nipple scale
serie to five nipples based on its portrayal and representation
of women. Um, I'm going to have to give this
like a half nipple. Yeah. I suppose that Tyler, if
you just sort of isolate her and take the things

(01:08:08):
that she says in terms of like not being impressed
with toxic masculinity and like not wanting to be around
too much test tossterone and you know, being an athlete
women athletes, that's pretty cool. We don't get to see
that much in film. You know, she's good at what
she does, like a man needs her to help him
learn how to surf, but those just feel like you

(01:08:29):
see her doing it, and it's like usually when you yeah,
like when you hear that women are good at a
thing that you don't, you just hear it. You don't
actually see it, so that you know, that's one thing,
and there is the absence unless I miss something, There
is the absence of that moment that I was kind
of waiting for, which is like the moment where we
see her because surfing and all the dudes are like, whoa,
she can do? Well we do because that that that

(01:08:51):
was a moment I was waiting for that fortunately did
not come. That's true, it's nice, but those things all
feel like shallow victories, especially with Whoa not even in turns,
but considering all the other things that happened in the movie,
where like basically her existence in the story is only

(01:09:11):
to be the romantic interest and then to later be
kidnapped and used as leverage for the male hero, the
male gaze shots of pretty much all the women you
see in the movie, which is again hardly any of them,
the total lack of women of color, just everything about

(01:09:32):
it is not handled well. So um, her treatment in
the movie is like very very stereotypical like action movies,
and it does feel weird that coming from a movie
directed by a woman. It's a bizarre paradox. Yeah, she's
basically mistreated or her character is mishandled in every regard

(01:09:55):
throughout the whole movie, and it gets one half nipple
from me, And I will give that half nipple too.
I'll give it just right back to Lori Petty. Good
for her. Yeah, I'm gonna give the movie one nipple,
even for the reasons you stated. I also think that
this is an example of, you know, the fact that
just because a woman is in a key creative role

(01:10:18):
in the movie does not mean that it's a feminist text, uh,
and that that is just a thing that exists in
the world. Not all women are feminists, and not all
media created by women are pro woman, just on the
merit that it was created by a woman, which is
unfortunate but true. I also could understand I'd be interested

(01:10:39):
in hearing Katherine Bigela speak on this now. But you know,
I mean, there's a number of reasons I could I
could guess why her movies were not treating women especially
well at this particular point in history. Um, would the
job have been taken from her if she had brought
stuff up with it? You know, I'd be interested in
hearing more about what she thought. But yeah, I mean,

(01:11:00):
I think you covered it pretty succinctly, Caitlin. Uh, And
I would just like to bring up the fact that
there was a female hacker, and uh, that is I
don't even think she was hacking. I think she was
just looking up information on their database that they had
easy access to. Well, as a hacker, I can say
that googling is actually hacking. So giving your data to

(01:11:23):
Google is hacking, and giving your data to Zuckerberg and
Bezos is hacking. So I'm a hacker just by having
a Facebook profile. Do you have a computer, Yes, then
you're a hacker there. Uh so, and then of course
feminist icon woman who sells me ball sandwiches. So so
I'll give it one nipple, and I'm going to give

(01:11:45):
the nipple to the bill sandwich. Great, yeah, Anita, Uh,
can we give minus nipples? I guess that would be
the absence of women. You can do whatever. You know,
there were there were women. There bodies were in this movie.
I will do one, maybe three quarters of it. I

(01:12:07):
literally when you said half nipple, grabbed my chest because
I felt the pain of just putting that out there. Okay,
I'll round up to one nipple, just because I really
like Lori Petty, you know, like I remember, you know,
like tank Girl and stuff like so I just have
fond memories of her, and I think she tries to
push back, even though she can't really because she's a
fictional character and they wrote a shitty role for her.

(01:12:29):
But I appreciate the attempts, and I appreciate her being
good at surfing, because when you see women who are
good at surfing. But I also grew clearly everything else.
You all said that this is super objectifying and male
gazey and the absence women in general in any important role.
So you know you don't watch Point Break for the women. Yeah,

(01:12:52):
you watch it for hacking, and specially for the scenes
where there's hacking. Well, adya, thank you so much for
for coming on. This was one of my favorite movies
I've ever seen in my life. I'm so glad I
could have hide that for you. I didn't realize that
was true until it's coming out of my mouth. Wait,

(01:13:15):
except you watched it in three parts, it would take
me three days to watch it literally. Anytime. That said,
it is one of my favorite movies of all time.
Oh Alpha Billina, No, Alpha Billina could have been any
of the surfers body Yeah, give me a topless Molina
in films? Also, where's the chest hair in the movie?

(01:13:36):
And everyone is a very smooth movie. Can I just
say a very smooth movie? Yes, not a criticism, just
some observation. I think Alpha Blina could have really brought
some representation of Harry cha hair. Thank you so much
for being here. Where can people follow you online? Is
there anything you would like to plug? Yeah, I am

(01:13:59):
at Twitter. I'm I'm at Twitter. Please tweet at Twitter
if you'd like to get a hold of me. Um,
I'm on Twitter at any to Sarkasian. You can find
out more about Feminist Frequency and our podcast about pop
culture and feminism at Feminist Frequency dot com. And I
have a book coming out. It's called History Versus Women,

(01:14:19):
The Defiant Lives that They Don't Want You to Know,
comes out October two, and it's about women who have
been written out of history and we wrote them back in.
That's amazing. Congratulations, Thank you great. You can follow the
Bechtel Cast on all the social media platforms Instagram, Twitter,
of Facebook, which means we are also hackers because we
have those accounts. So I mean, I don't think you

(01:14:40):
need to say that I'm one of the world's most
famous hackers. Well, I'm saying like the Bechtel Cast the end,
because I'm using a conglomerate. We also our hackers culture.
Hack us by following us on Twitter at Bechtel Cast.
Could luck hacking us? Okay? You can? So you can

(01:15:02):
also hack us by subscribing to our Matreon. It's five
dollars a month and you get to bonus episodes every
single month on Patreon dot com slash pectel Cast, and
you can rate and review us on iTunes. That helps
us out a lot, especially if you give us five
stars or five nipples. Yeah, and you can go to
our website pectel cast dot com. We have episodes there,

(01:15:24):
we have merched there, we have all kinds of goodies. Guys.
Do you guys want to go hit the board? Yeah?
I'm actually only if we can hang out with the
barbecue servers. Oh my god, I gotta call my boys.
I'm actually gonna stay indoors and uh surf the web
surfs up dogs. Okay, bye bye bye