April 10, 2025 • 57 mins
John discusses the impact of franchise changing players and how a guy like Steph Curry is more impactful to the Warriors than LeBron James is to the Lakers. Next, John talks about the Nuggets firing Mike Malone and how that firing could indirectly be tied to the Rams and that operation.
Lastly, John answers your questions during this episode's mailbag segment.
5:02 - Changing a franchise
15:17 - Mike Malone fired in Denver
20:33 - Handling the top draft pick
23:41 - Microsoft
34:47 - Mailbag
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
The volume. What is going on everybody? How are we doing?
Hopefully everyone is having a great day. Masters is off
(00:21):
and running. Hopefully if you've gambled like I have, o
our bets are looking promising. Can't win it all on Thursday,
but you definitely can't lose it. I'll promise you that
we're gonna dive into a couple of different things today.
Something I noticed last night at the Warriors game in
regards to Steph Curry and how it's just so different
from a lot of other sports, specifically football. Something draft wise.
(00:45):
We try to do something every single day in regards
to the draft, and the Nuggets fired Mike Malone yesterday
in the NBA, and I do wonder if it was
because in a weird way of Sean McVeigh. So we'll
touch on some different things. Obviously slow a couple of
weeks in the world of football as teams are meeting
(01:09):
draft wise, getting ready for a couple of weeks, but
everyone's kind of hunkered down in their facility, really trying
to dial in that draft board, which is always a
fun time of year. But you know, for us content creators, podcasters,
i'd like some more explosive stories but nothing really is
going on, but we will talk some sports. But before
we do, you know, I got to tell you about
(01:31):
my friends, my partners in the official ticketing app of
this podcast. Went to a sporting event for the first
time in a while last night thanks to my buddy Mark,
who took me and my wife to the Sun's game,
which was really the Warriors game. Had a great time
and it got me thinking, like, sometimes it's just nice
to mix up your routine, get out of the house,
(01:51):
especially for us podcasters, put on some real clothes. The
only time we do that, at least in my world
is when I play golf. Other than that, I'm basically
wearing this same thing on a daily basis and just
interact with the people and get out there. And you're like,
you know what, you guys should do that too. So
if you want to go to an NBA playoff game
starts in a week. You want to go to an
NHL playoff game, I would guess it starts relatively soon.
(02:13):
You want to go to a baseball game, Major League
Baseball off and running concert season right around the corner,
people I heard we were talking about it last night.
Carrie Underwood had a residency in Vegas. I've never heard
anybody that has gone to Vegas, whether it be at
the Sphere, which I've heard is incredible, or just seen
someone in a residency situation, like you know, the Eagles
(02:36):
or Celine Dion back that didn't have a great time.
Sometimes just going to a concert is a great way
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You know, it's funny when I got out of football,
I mean, the first time I ever went to an
NFL games when I worked for the Eagles. I never
got to go to one growing up, and the first
time I had been to NBA in baseball games in
my youth. But my introduction to them once I got
(03:21):
into kind of the radio world and I left football
was really cool because you know, in the NFL or
even college football game day is no different. High school
is very serious. There's not a lot of bullshitting going
on on a football field an hour two hours before
(03:41):
a game. It's a very very serious environment. And I
remember when I started working in radio that I got
credentials to go to the Giants and this is when
they were really good, like Buster Posey, Brandon Crawford, who
actually sat next to last night at the Sun's game,
really cool dude. And the NBA games where the Warriors
at the time were coached by Mark Jackson and kind
(04:03):
of this up and coming team. But I remember going
to a lot of these games because you could just
go to batting practice three hours or two hours before
the game and just talk with Buster Posey standing there
and you just have a conversation or Hunter Pence or whoever.
Same thing. In the NBA, you could just get there early.
This is when they were really young, like have a
conversation with Klay Thompson about football, and it was like, God,
(04:24):
this is a completely different world at the professional level
than the NFL, where it's like you would never ever,
you know, if you didn't know them, go up to
a player when he's like warming up an hour before
the game, like, Hey, Carson Palmer, what do you think
is like, get out of my way, bro. Same thing
with coaches, if you don't know them, it's you're probably
(04:46):
not striking up a conversation, right. It's a tense environment.
So it was very, very cool to see something else.
And the one thing with football that's you know, and
I would say baseball a little bit too, is the franchise.
Like Aaron Judge, it's clearly one of the greatest Yankees
of all time, but if he disappeared tomorrow, the Yankees
(05:06):
will find another player and their brand like overall, the
power of the brand no different than the Lakers with
Lebron it was one of the great players of all time.
The Lakers brand was enormous before him, it'll be enormous
after him. Why because it's been built up for decades
and decades and decades. I remember, listen, I've been to
a lot of games in with the Niners or the
(05:28):
Raiders and seeing the Steelers and especially the Packers, and
it's amazing how big and rabid their fan base is
and how national it is. So when you go to
a game against the Packers of the Steelers. If your
team is bad, they are going to have a home
field advantage. And I definitely saw with the Raiders and
some of their bad teams, the Steelers it's like, this
(05:49):
is a Steeler home game. Same thing with the Packers.
It's because for decades upon decades upon decades, for countless
different groups of players, they have built the brand. And
it is the Steelers. That is the Packers, that is
the Cowboys, hell, that is the forty nine Ers. I
grew up on Steve Young and Jerry Rice. They were
(06:10):
not the forty nine Ers right in terms of like
the Niners. Since then they moved transitioned to Jeff Garcia,
then they got Harbaugh and Kyle Shanahan. They've had other successes,
like the brand really took off with Bill Walsh and
Joe Montana. And I think sometimes individuals can pierce through that.
And I would say the best example when I was
(06:32):
a child was Michael Jordan. Like, I'm not a Bills
or a Bulls historian, but I don't think the Bulls
were that important before he got there, and he turned
the Bulls into one of the greatest cash cow brands
you've ever seen. And it was simply because of Michael Jordan.
It wasn't the franchise, it wasn't the ownership. It was
one individual in basketball way more than football. Like if
(06:54):
Drake May, if Drake May never wins the Super Bowl,
but he just becomes let's say they're playing styles are different,
but let's just say like the level of like Philip Rivers, right,
he just has like a really good player, pro Bowl
level guy can win with them. If you're well run,
the Patriots will be fine, they'll sell out, they'll be
a really big deal. They'll be playing on primetime, and
(07:14):
it's like, yeah, he's not Tom Brady, but the brand
of the thing will not change and it will be
worth billions upon billions of dollars. Last night, I'm sitting there,
I'm next to Brandon Crawford, who was this starting shortstop
for multiple World Series teams with the Giants. He went
to multiple All Star Games, like he was part of
He wasn't actually part of the first World Series in
(07:36):
San Francisco Giant history, which was in twenty ten, but
he's part of the second and the third, and he
was a really really big deal and a very important piece,
and he was imported of this legendary kind of group
of players. But like, ultimately the Giants were built on
Willie Mays, on Supaida, on will Clark on obviously Barry Bonds,
and they'll be good again, and they'll be built on
(07:57):
other players and the brand will maintain. I'm watching Steph
Curry last night and I'm looking around and it is
just packed, and I mean packed with Warriors fans. When
we first got to the game where we go to
the bar to grab a Bruski and I hear this
eruption and I look over and I see the TV
and he had just hit a shot. Step had hit
(08:18):
a shot and he's on the road. You could argue
that since Michael Jordan, there has not been a more
important player to their franchise than Steph Curry, because even
Kobe Bryant, which was very important to the Lakers brand,
like the first couple championship, Shaq was the more important
player or definitely his equal, and he was more famous
at the time. But even that version of those guys,
(08:40):
the Lakers brand was fucking enormous. It was the biggest
brand in the NBA then it is definitely the biggest
brand now with Lebron like and once Lebron leaves with Luca,
it'll be fine. I'm watching Steph Curry and I go
if he disappeared tomorrow. This franchise that is now most
of my life. Like I grew up closer to Sacramento
and I was I'm really an NBA no mad fan,
(09:03):
grew up in the nineties fan of Michael Jordan like
most people. Then the Kings got good, joined them, and
then when I got into the radio thing and I
was around Steph and Clay, I was like, I love
these guys and Draymond and they start kicking as they're
just a fun watch, but their whole it feels like
the whole franchise value is Steph Curry. The Indianapolis Colts.
They say, the home that Peyton Manning built and the
(09:23):
Colt's dome is pretty cool and obviously anyone that's been
there in the town, it's easy to navigate even when
it's cold because of the convention center kind of set up,
and you never have to leave. They cut them, and
then Andrew Luck came in and they started winning, and
they would have been fine if Andrew Luck hadn't just
got a snowboarding accident and tapped out, but like the
(09:44):
franchise moved on right Like when Steph Curry retires or
an injury en into his career or whatever, like the
worst their value as a franchise to me would get
cut immediately in half somehow. Currently they're one of the
most valuable franchise in all of sports. I don't think
we've ever seen, beside Michael Jordan, like what Lebron did. Yeah,
(10:05):
he re awoke the Lakers brand, but the brand was
already there. It's a worldwide brand. The Warriors were a joke.
They were They had a local following, but the franchise,
for most of my life fucking sucked, were completely irrelevant. Yeah,
they had some Bay Area fans, they were not a
national brand. There is not a more national brand than
this guy. And one difference of him and Lebron, which
(10:28):
are obviously the two most important guys of their era,
is Lebron's a nomad as well. He goes to Cleveland,
leaves Cleveland, comes back to Cleveland, goes to la It's
like he just kind of steps been with one franchise
the whole time, and he's driven that thing up like
a rocket ship. And I just in my life. I don't.
He'd have to be on the short list of like
(10:49):
most entertaining athletes any sport, it doesn't get any better.
And when it comes to the value, like you can't
even compare him to NFL players because they are one
hundred percent replaceable. Obviously, Brady wins Super Bowl and twenty
with Tampa, which was a really big deal. Then the
next couple of years they make the playoffs whatever. Then
they institute or implement and signed Baker Mayfield, put him in.
(11:11):
They keep winning, and everyone's like, oh, Baker's really cool,
he's fun. He's vice of Baker Jerseys. Doesn't even kip
a peat, Like there is nobody that is filling that
guy's shoes, just like Michael Jordan, the Bulls were one
hundred ft when he retired. That is gonna be the Warriors,
and he is obviously spectacular player. I just don't think
(11:32):
we've ever in a law, at least in the Internet age,
anything quite like him. You know, maybe Lebron would have
been that, he would have been that with Cleveland, but
he's bounced on him twice and didn't even hesitate to
see you. I mean, part of Steph's brand power and
value to the franchise has been his loyalty to the
franchise and never even entertained bouncing. But man, you watch
(11:56):
this guy take this brand that was, let's face it,
dog shit and basically turned it into the Yankees the
Lakers like an NFL team quickly. Everywhere he goes, everyone's
wearing his jersey. It's it's wild. Ten years ago, you
couldn't have paid anyone to attend a Warriors game on
(12:16):
the road. I mean now it's like they are paying
to see this guy who's still thirty seven thirty eight,
and I mean last night. It's funny. You know, in football,
you can get your ass kicked and you can kind
of like tap out toward the end of the game,
but you have to try early on or you will
get hurt. In baseball, I was taught this early on
(12:36):
in my radio career. It's hard to say a team
like isn't trying, because that's what you look like when
you don't get any hits. So if you get one hit,
it looks like you're not trying. You're just getting mowed
down by the pitcher. Like that's part of the sport.
In basketball, it's very evidence like Yeah, these guys like
Bradley Beal is just not trying out there, like on
the effort level. Like you can just tell on a
(12:58):
basketball court, like it's one thing to just lose or
even get kind of worked, it's another thing like not
even have effort. And watching this was an eye opening experience.
I mean, the Warriors just absolutely toyed with them. But
speaking of basketball, you know the Nuggets, they fired their
head coach yesterday, And a lot of these owners now
(13:20):
own multiple franchises, right they might own a basketball on
an NFL team, or a baseball on an NFL team,
or a soccer team and an NFL team, So if
you coach for one of the teams, like you're always
gonna be judged by like if they own three teams,
whoever is doing the best. The teams that aren't doing
(13:43):
as well are gonna be judged based on the teams
doing the best. And the Kronkys have this huge portfolio
of the Avs, obviously, the Nuggets and the Rams. And
I remember when Kronky Move moved the Rams from Saint
Louis and everyone freaked out. It's like, guys, you guys
stole the Rams from Los Angeles, Like I understand even
(14:07):
if the right move was to leave Oakland to go
to Vegas, financially, it changed Mark Davis's life. But like
Oakland when like that was the Raiders home where they started,
and like I understand them being bitter and furious when
they left, Like the Saint Louis fans, like they're moving
back to their home now. Stan Kronkey, Missouri guy, he's
(14:28):
just a businessman. He just like, yeah, it's better off,
more lucrative in LA. And he's not wrong. But you
lost a team that you stole. It's like if you
start sleeping with someone who's married, she marries you, and
then she leaves you for someone else, Like, can you
really be that bitter? Like shouldn't you have seen this
coming early on? And Mike Malone gets fired. Listen, I
(14:50):
heard Bill Simmons a while back say, liked, the NFL
owners are by far the craziest. They do all this
batshit crazy stuff. The NBA is firing coaches. Two coaches
they're headed right to the playoffs. Got fired one with
like three weeks left, the other guy with a week
left in the season. Can you imagine in the NFL
if a team like the Nuggets that have the best
(15:10):
player in the world, who are a good team going
through a little rough stretch, just like two weeks left
in the season, fired the coach at like nine and six.
It's like, guys, they're going to the playoff that I'd
be insane. But in basketball it's like, yeah, kind of
crazy league. But if you're the Kronky family. And I
was thinking about this because I remember when Jim Harbaugh
(15:33):
and Trent Balkey were at odds in getting in fights,
and this happened sometimes in football. Right, the GM and
the head coach are at odds. And I've seen some
people whenever this happens in sports, like, isn't it the
owner's job to figure it out with those guys? And
I would push back if I'm an owner and I'm
paying my coach and my GM millions of dollars each.
(15:56):
And both these guys are somewhere in the age of
between forty and sixties, right, these are adults. It's one
thing with a player, right, players are in their twenties.
People are highly emotional. It's a tough pressure pack position.
Like sometimes you have to intervene, maybe sit down with
(16:16):
them and their agent. You get involved. Totally understand. If
I owned a team in any of these sports and
my GM and head coach we're not getting along, I'm
doing one of two things. I look at them both, like,
it is not my job to figure this out. You
two are adults. You guys either get along. I'm either
gonna pick whoever I like the most out of you
(16:36):
two if this is a power struggle, or I'm gonna
fire you both. But it is not my job to
basically be your parent and figure it out. And it
was pretty clear, you know, I've read some articles with
the nuggets that these two guys hated each other. And
if you're the Kronkey family and you see Sean McVeigh in,
(16:59):
less sneed flip teams around the way they act, just
how professional they are, I would have zero patients. And
I like Mike Malone. I think he's an entertaining personality.
But when you start walking around like your shit, don't
snak even if your GM's an idiot, and you won't
listen to anybody and your team's not really listening to you, Like,
it's not my job to figure out your relationship with
(17:22):
your GM. Either figure it out or if you get
fired like, I'm sorry, I feel little to no empathy.
But when I have Sean McVeigh and less sneed. As
the example, if I was the Cronky family, like, that's
kind of what I would be looking for, and I
would have little to no patients of like I gotta
hold your two hands. You guys are both I don't
(17:43):
know how old Calvin Booth is. I would imagine over fifty.
I know Mike Malone's like fifty three. I have to
sit down and have a pow wow to make you
guys like each other? Is this sixth grade? Like what
the fuck are we doing? So when I see these
guys fired and you read some of these articles, like
of course, now you could argue the timings insane, but
terms of like getting rid of them, both totally understand.
(18:04):
Like I think some of these coaches in front office
people that get to be like this power struggle and
this ego attacking each other don't realize how stupid they
look on the outside sometimes and how the fight tends
to take both guys down. It's rare that you just
get one winner and then that guy just gets to
(18:26):
win forever. Every once in a while it happens but
for the most part, even if the guy wins in
the short term, he usually goes down in the next
couple of years. I remember last year, my guy Adam
Peters took a lot of crap because he brought in
all the quarterbacks at the same time, and he took
him to top Golf, and everyone on the internet was
talking crap. They were all, this guy know what he's doing,
(18:49):
like why are you doing this? Why don't you bring
him in one by one? And it clearly was the
right move because he brought them all in together. He
got a feel for how they acted. He almost like
it was like an alpha test who was rise above
them all? And he clearly made a choice that through
one year, looks like the right choice. You could argue,
Ryan Poles, why didn't you bring in all these guys?
(19:09):
You just went with the easy thing, like Caleb Williams.
I'm not saying it's the wrong choice, but looking back,
Ryan Poles should have brought every single one of these quarterbacks,
especially the top three guys, into his building, and he didn't.
I would take the approach if I were these gms
and spy Tech is currently doing it. He brought Jackson
(19:30):
Dart which obviously he's not gonna take it six, but
would he take the guy in the second round? Could
they trade up and get but Ashon Genty and Will
Campbell at the same time. And I do wonder if
you bring in the guys at the same time and
just watch the way they interact together, you might get
a better field than if you bring them in individually. Now,
sometimes just logistically they're coming from the same training area,
(19:53):
that's the dates that fit for them, so sometimes it's
not as deep as they're trying to figure out and
let the cream rise when they walk in the building.
But I think the no brainer move, especially if you're
drafting really high, would be to bring in is many
of the guys that are on you know, the potential
(20:14):
list of people you would pick all in together and
get a feel for, like when they're at breakfast, when
they're at lunch, when they're walking around the building all
at once instead of because sometimes like if you just
if you're a single guy and you dated for women, right,
and I said you had a date Monday, you had
a date Tuesday, you had a date Thursday, and you
had a date Saturday, there's a chance if Saturday just goes, oh,
(20:36):
pretty good, even if you liked some of the ones
earlier in the week, that's just the fresher experience, and
sometimes that changes the way you look at it. So
when they're all there at once, when they all leave,
like you kind of have I would say, somewhat of
a gut feeling when they're taking off of what you
felt when you were around them all. And these are
(20:56):
very very difficult decisions because we won't know if you're
right or wrong for years moving forward. But when it
comes to pulling the trigger, when you're drafting really high,
you better get it right because ideally, if you start winning,
you're not going to draft this high again. So you
get the opportunity to take really talented players. You get
(21:17):
the chance to pick between the group right, and there's
a chance the team ten slots below you will draft
a better player, but it's not because they had more options.
They actually have less. Like you have options to players
that they probably would have picked if they were given
the chance, instead of the guy that they actually took
that turned out to be good. So you just I
(21:37):
think bringing guys in together is the right move. Okay,
let's end on this. Welcome to chasing challenges brought to
you by Microsoft. In the NFL. Just like in business,
overcoming obstacles is key to success. Microsoft empowers business decision
makers with AI solutions, simplified cloud and data management, and trustworthy,
(21:57):
responsible technology to turn challenges into opportunities. In this segment,
we explore some of the biggest challenges being faced in
the NFL and how they can be overcome. Whatever challenge
you're facing, Microsoft empowers you with the expertise to say
bring it on. This week, we're discussing the challenge faced
by the Atlanta Falcons. Listen, what they did last year
(22:20):
is still a head scratcher to give Cousins that much
money to then draft Michael Pennix, and now they're in
this situation with Michael Pennix as their starter OTAs and
the off season starting and Raheem Morris and Kirk Cousins
is not coming around. Now you cannot go into training camp.
I don't care what you say and how much money
(22:41):
Arthur Blank is and how big of a pro Kirk
Cousins is. With Cousins showing up on your roster, you
have to find a way to get rid of them.
And Raheem Morris basically admitted kirk Cousins showed top doughtas
he's not going to be around and I think in
a perfect world they trade him during the draft. But
(23:01):
here's the thing, and this is the challenge of being
a head coach, and this was the problem once they
made this decision, because when they drafted Michael Pennox and
they said, well, we're just trying to load up the
quarterback room, which we understand you didn't have the thought
of drafting Michael Pennock when you signed Kirk Cousins and
gave him a no trade clause, or else you never
would have give him the no trade class. But you
(23:23):
guys fell in love with them after you signed Kirk Cousins,
and now you're in this predicament. But you don't control
the Kirk Cousins trade because I'm sure there are some
teams interested right now and are saying, hey, wait till
after the draft and then we can rekindle and restart
our trade talks and figure out a way to get
Cousins on a roster. But that's not a lot of teams.
(23:44):
It's got to be a short list, especially given that
you're gonna have to take on some of his salary,
even if the Atlanta Falcons eats some But what if
those teams and let's just say it's two or three
all end up with quarterbacks relatively hell, not even in
the first round, but in the second, in the third round,
what if they're not interested in them anymore? And now
you're in a position where you don't have a trade target.
(24:06):
So you're gonna be staring down the off season gun
barrel of like, are you gonna start training camp with
him still on the roster and trying to give the
keys to this franchise to a young quarterback and make
Cousins show up and have this weird kind of halo
hanging over your offense in the quarterback room. You can't
do that. That's just bad business. That's just bad ball,
(24:30):
that's just bad management. So this is one of those
situations from a challenge for the Atlanta Falcons is kind
of out of their control. They better just keep their
fingers crossed and pray that the teams that have some
interest currently in Cousins do not fill their quarterback needs
(24:51):
in late April. That's it for this week's Chasing Challengers.
Remember Microsoft's AI solutions and power you to take bold
steps and make informed decisions, speaking new ideas to help
drive your business forward. With Microsoft as your trusted partner,
you can navigate your journey with confidence, finding innovative solutions,
and reaching new possibilities. Visit Microsoft dot com Slash Challengers
(25:14):
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Speaker 1 (26:47):
Okay, let's uh, let's bang out a few mailbag questions
at John middlecoff is the Instagram fire in those dms.
I think I'm going to do a big, big mail
bag for Friday, so I'll just bang out of a
couple here. Do you guys know the drill to slide
into my dms and get your questions answered on the show?
Calvin a big fan for about a year now, and
(27:11):
this is coming from a packers guy. What steps and
moves do you think we as a team need to
make to push us over the edge. Well, I would
say you're not quite to the edge. You were one
and done this year. Obviously against the champs. Last year
it felt like you were better, even though your defense
(27:33):
wasn't as good. I think we talked about the Packers
a lot, you guys, obviously worldwide fan base here to
go from far to Rogers to now this. It looked
like they did it again right after the Cowboy game,
and then even after last season ended, even he I
know he I think his season ended with a pick
(27:55):
against the Niners his first year starting, but it was like, Okay,
the future is bright. And then last year he got
injured against the Eagles, and it just kind of made
for a bizarre season. I've seen they you know, it's listen,
you're not gonna bring in anyone on one of those
thirty visits that you're not interested in. So anytime you
see them bring in a wide receiver, I think it's
(28:17):
fair to say the Packers are gonna take a wide
receiver in the first couple rounds. They've had success in
the second round, right, Davante pretty sure Jordi was a
second round pick. Might have been third round pick. Pretty
sure he's a second round pick, though those doesn't get
much better in second round picks Jordy Nelson and DeVante Adams,
so you don't always need to draft those guys really high.
But the thing with the Packers, like your expectations next
(28:39):
year is to compete for the NFC, and DeVante's career
didn't really get going until like second year, middle the
second year, and by the third year he took off.
So sometimes it takes it takes a little time. I
just think the offense has got to be more dynamic,
and whether that's some of the guys are already on
(29:00):
the roster taking big steps, maybe you become just a true,
true run heavy team, which I think Lafleur doesn't mind doing.
It's kind of his background. I mean, Aaron Jones obviously,
Josh Jacobs a stud. I'm trying to see what how
many what were Jacob's stats last year. I know he missed,
(29:22):
was he injured? I know he missed games with the Raiders,
but so Jacobs, he played in every game. I mean,
Jacobs was excellent. He averaged four and a half yards
of carry at three hundred carries, seven touchdowns, thirteen hundred yards.
I mean he's a big time player. Your backup running
back in five hundred yards. I mean you, guys, how
many teams in the league ran for more yards than
(29:47):
the Packers. I can't imagine it was many. I would
have been you guys were near the top in total
yards and you were you only the Bucks who had
an unreal rushing offense Washington whose quarterback also runs the
Eagles and the Ravens, which makes sense, so your rushing
(30:08):
offense is excellent. I would just keep leaning into that. Now,
you know the couple games when Malik started too, but
I would lean into that with Jordan love Is, take
the pressure off him like you do, not make him
try to play like Joe Burrow. So I would just
keep doing what you're doing and the defense gets better
and which was took steps last year under half Lee.
(30:29):
I'd be bullish if I was a backup fan, I
really would. I got so many Stanley's and hydros. My
question is do you ever plan on expanding the type
of content you make? I understand you are a podcaster,
but have you ever thought about making video essays where
you dive deeper into a topic or a story? With editing.
(30:51):
It doesn't have to be that. But I was wondering
if you've thought about it, you have thought about a lot.
We've dabbled a little bit in it, probably dabble a
little bit more. I just look at it like this
is going really well, and I just try to put
all my energy into this and then dabble a little
bit on the side. We've done golf videos in the past,
plan on doing much more of those this summer and
(31:14):
once it gets I mean, it's ninety degrees where I'm at.
But I have some big ideas and it's just about
doing them. But yeah, I mean I have to. You know,
this sounds cheesy, but like you, there's a strong balance
of like, this is the main thing, and this is
what pays the bills and why we're in business. So
(31:35):
I take so much energy doing this. And listen, I
don't act like I'm digging digits here. I'm not acting
like it's it's physically demanding, but mentally, I do spend
a lot of time and energy in this, and it
actually is much more time consuming in the off season
because there's not as much going on. But you know,
we plan on doing some interview stuff don't. I don't
(31:57):
do many interviews. I mean, as you guys know, this
is not like an interview heavy podcasts. This is just me.
So we plan on doing some of that stuff, which
is which is a little different which we've done in
the past. But yeah, expanding content. We're always I mean,
any idea is it's the best part about the Internet.
Do whatever we want. This is not you know, corporate America. Here,
we can do whatever whenever, at any moment, right as
(32:21):
long as I'm taking care of our our business partners
so that there aren't any restrictions. And uh, we just
keep we just keep firing. Assuming they couldn't jam you
on the line. If you had to get open and
catch a pass, which one of these three corners would
you want to try to go against Sauce Gardner, Derek
Stingley or Trent McDuffie. Thanks, I would love to play
(32:45):
golf with Sauce. That guy is a junkie. Sauce has
really grown on me, you know, I just see his
love of golf. He's a junkie, and so I appreciate
him his game. On the other hand, it's I think
it's pretty hard to just be a full press super
(33:07):
physical corner in this day and age, because one so
many wide receivers are really fast. So if the referees
aren't allowing you to just maul them at the line,
and you aren't, like Derek Stingley is an elite athlete,
like his strength of his game is going to be
just to say, in your hip pocket. McDuffie is just
an all around really good player, also a solid athlete.
(33:31):
You know Sauce against me, like could I get open?
I couldn't get open on any of these people. I
appreciate these questions. I think in a weird way, you
were almost underestimating even I think Sauce. If I had
to pick these three guys, like Who'd I want on
my team, I would go Stingley, McDuffie, Sauce. But I
(33:52):
mean Sauce's first two years he was an All Pro
in the NFL, So I mean the very high standards
for these three cats, and Stingly had obviously a breakout season.
But nobody, and I mean nobody who is not like
a Division one wide receiver is getting open on any
of these guys, regardless of a jam Sauce relative to
(34:13):
like Justin Jefferson or Jamar Chase or you know, you
name some of the best receivers inly Aj Brown. Yeah,
it's gonna be DeVante Smith. It's gonna be difficult against me,
against you. Against normal people, you would have not a
shot on God's green Earth to get an ounce of space.
But if my life depended on it, you'd have to
(34:35):
choose Sauce because he's the least of the three. I
would say, fluid athlete, you would have and I mean
no chance and I mean absolutely zero negative Niche against
Derek Stingley his ability and athletic ability. It's like it's
(34:59):
like prime r So Westbrook or something. I have a
question pertaining to the popularity of baseball. Why is it
that people are saying it's dying, boring sport in comparison
to football. I live in Washington and went to my
first Mariner game last night in like ten years. I
was expecting it to be low attendance and low energy.
Yet there was like thirty thousand people and a shitload
(35:21):
of energy, which was surprising because it was Tuesday night
against the Astros. Not to mention we suck right now.
Just curious. The stigma I think that's really driven is
one the television the explosion of television sports talk, which
you know Collins obviously his show is he does, I
(35:43):
mean his podcast. What we do on the volume is
obviously different from what they do at The Herd, which
is a television show. First take, those type things are
basically driven all by football and then the NBA, Like
I think that baseball has got lost in that world.
And then in the podcast world, all the big podcasts
(36:04):
don't really talk about baseball. Obviously there are some baseball podcasts,
but like big quote unquote sports podcasts are just not
talking any baseball until the playoffs. So when that happens,
there becomes a stigma that it just is kind of irrelevant.
Where I'd argue the NBA and is this someone that
(36:24):
just went to a game? You turn on these television shows,
no one is. It's pretty rare that, like you're really
breaking down a game like you would in football. It's
talking like where is Jokic gonna demand a trade to? Now,
no one gets a bigger heart on than basketball people
when a disaster happens with a franchise and they have
(36:45):
a star player, like is this guy gonna demand a trade?
It's an immediate conversation, where is Yokic gonna go. It's
like his coach got fired two minutes ago and now
he's gonna ask for a trade. But that's the conversation,
and that to me, drives basketball talk and baseball talk.
It just doesn't exist. I also think most of these
(37:06):
people aren't watching games anymore, so you just talk about
what you watch. And I think a lot of people
in the space of talking about just general sports don't
watch any baseball. They basically have to go all in
on football. And you know, for me, for example, like
I don't really even talk like I used to just
(37:26):
do a general radio show before I got into podcasting,
and then all I got into football and it got
so big. It's like why do not I just talk
more football? And then we started doing a football show
basically every day. And the reason I do golf is
it's a little bit of a passion project slash like,
you know, for business opportunities. But it's because I watch,
you know, it wasn't someone's like you should do that.
It's like, no, I'm just going to do that because
(37:47):
I watch I don't really watch other sports unless it's
like March madness or maybe the NBA playoffs or the
Baseball playoffs. I do. I watch those type things when
I feel like a lot of consumers are And I
think that's where a lot of people have kind of
turned when it came to, you know, when it came
to talking about baseball, and I think the ratings reflected
(38:09):
that in terms of those shows. Now locally, you know,
do you think the Yankees kind of matter in New
York or the Dodgers matter in LA? It's if the
Giants are good, they I know, they really matter in
San Francisco, Philly. I mean the big markets are you know, Chicago,
the Cubs. Yeah. I think baseball has become a very
localized sport, but it's become very very lucrative. I mean,
(38:31):
these guys are making the top players five hundred to
seven hundred million dollars. Now it's over like twenty five
year contracts, but still any buzz on Gavin Bartholomew pit
tight end, small town kid who grew up in my
own town, went to high school, super nice, high character dude.
I saw him run the forty in the low four
to sevens. I was just wondering if you've heard his
(38:54):
name being brought up. I have not sometimes you know,
I'm not I'm not in the weeds as much. And
one thing I learned doing this is like the difference
when you work in football and you're really close to it,
you're so you're just nerding out on all these players
(39:15):
and you're just so in on the fifth, sixth, seventh
round picks, and then once you get doing my job
and you realize that when you're in it, but you
don't have a choice because you still got to write
these guys up and follow their careers. Half the people
that and you know this, whoever your team is, it's
like it's you get excited about third round pick, a
fourth round pick, and then all of a sudden they
(39:36):
are not playing it all come the fall and two
undrafted free agents are in their spots. It's like I've
seen it so many times, is like you get so
excited on about guys on the second and third day,
and you just the guy you get really excited about
turns out to be the one that isn't as good
as the guy that no one talked about in the
fifth round who becomes like an all pro by his
(39:57):
third year. And I just think the draft is such
a crapshoot, especially this upcoming draft, like no one seems
to know how it's gonna shake out. I recently saw
a post joking about predicting the Luck Belichick rivalry being
the Stanford and UNC in both being acc opponents. Would
(40:19):
be absolutely insane to tell someone in twenty eighteen, do
you have any wild card predictions of college or NFL
guys switching like this? Do you think stuff like this
will happen in a few years with the landscape of
both leagues? Totally agree. One thing that has changed in
college football is one of these GM's jobs didn't exist,
(40:42):
and two the amount of money these programs can pay.
Belichick makes ten million dollars and he's not even he's
kind of like got a discount. He's paying like four
guys on his staff seven figures, and that includes his
GM Mike Lombardi. Well, these GM jobs didn't exist, So
I think I just saw Jim Naggy, who ran the
(41:05):
Senior Bowl, who is a longtime scout, is now the
GM of the Oklahoma Sooners, and the guy who just
got hired to run the Senior Bowl had previously been
the GM of like Auburn, and I don't know, some
other major program and these guys are making so much
money that these jobs didn't exist. So I think we're
going to see more and more that If I would
(41:25):
have told you five years ago that the Colorado Buffaloes
are going to be coached by Dion Sanders as the
head coach, with Pat Shermer as the offensive coordinator, Marshall
Fulk as the running back coach, and Warren Sapp as
the defensive line coach, you'd be like, what are you
talking about? And that's something that's actually happening. So one
(41:47):
thing we've learned now long enough in sports, but specifically
with this explosion in college football, you never know, and
we've seen it occasionally back in the day. Right Saban
just left the Dolphins to go back to or not
too back, but to Bama. Patrino left on the Falcons
when Vick got arrested and he went to was it
(42:10):
Arkansas Louisville? I forget Patrino, crazy cat, but good the
offensive coach. It was pretty jarring when that happens. Now,
if you told me that someone got fired this offseason,
I mean, Ron Rivera is the GM of cal Ron
Rivera was the head coach of the Washington football team
(42:30):
like eighteen months ago. I just think it's really really
hard to predict. The Belichick thing is crazy, But part
of that is I think he clearly knew that he
wasn't going to get a job or didn't want any
of the jobs that people would have even been interested
in hiring him. Where do you rank Sirianni? This is
(42:55):
David from Georgia. Where do you rank Sirianni among the
best coach in the NFL? Just curious. Hopefully you see
this and I look forward to the answer soon. It's
a great question. Anything I say is gonna sound like
I'm a hater or talking shit when he's a Super
Bowl champ. So there's a short list of human beings
(43:17):
that can say I was a head coach for a
team that won a Super Bowl. There's probably even a
shorter list of guys that say I'm a head coach
that went to multiple Super Bowls. Think about this. Pete Carroll,
who's a legendary coach, who is a should be a
first ballot Hall of Famer, And if you combine like
basketball does, pro and college, he's had one of the
(43:38):
most legendary coaching careers. He's been a head coach for
the Jets, the Patriots, Seattle, the Trojans, and the Raiders.
He's been a head coach of five different places. They're
all pretty important. And he's been a two super Bowls total,
and Sirianni's also been a two in three years. So
it's like Sirianni and Pete Carroll have the same super
(44:01):
Bowl resume. They're one and one. Think about that. But
if you told me I was the GM and all
the coaches were free, right, all thirty two and assistance,
I could hire whoever I wanted in the pros, not
college like I had to hire or playing NFL football higher.
(44:24):
I don't think he goes that high now. I don't
think he goes like twenty eight. But who are you
taking him over? Like, think about this, he's had more
success than Dan Campbell. But if all things were equal,
Like you don't get Howie Roseman, how it's not a
(44:45):
package deal. This isn't Shaq and Kobe, You skt one.
You s get Sirianni. If you or me or the GM,
are you hiring Sirianni over Dan Campbell? Cause you're not
taking him over the Harrorbob Brothers would say that a
lot of the offensive guys that call plays. If I'm
starting from scratch, like I don't have a two hundred
(45:08):
million dollar offense, we all have starting from the same point,
and how he is not existing, I'm the GM, I
would be really inclined to obviously hire you know, clearly
people would take Andy Reid over Sirianni, but would be
to hire the coaches that can also call the place.
So it's weird. It's like what he did is impressive,
(45:30):
but it does feel like an organizational thing, which again,
if you're him, who gives a shit? Now where it
does matter is where's his contract extension? Does Jeffrey Learry
believe in him? Because if he does, he should give
him four years, sixty million dollars fifteen million dollars a
year or something extension. Shouldn't that already be done by
(45:50):
now and maybe gets done? But has Jeffrey Learry giving
him that? Because I saw I headlined recently like it's
going to happen, And again I feel like a hater.
The guy won the Super Bowl, so who cares if
you're him, but no one's going to consider him near
the top I just I don't think much change is
because Jalen Hurts and that defense dominated the Chiefs. I'm
(46:14):
currently a senior in college and graduating in a month
with a degree in marketing. Congratulations. I've been wanting to
get into sports media and especially the football world for
a while now. I make content and write my own
stories for my team, the Denver Broncos. I've had an
intro call with ESPN, but doesn't seem like anything is
going to come from it. Just hoping you could provide
(46:35):
me some career advice in pursuing this career. I make
content and write my own stories. I think you just
keep doing that until something breaks Like this, what you are,
the world you're playing in. You know, people my age
you didn't even exist, so we would have no choice
(46:56):
but to keep contacting people because you couldn't just create
your own stuff. And I think the power of any
content you're creating, like I would quadruple down on that
if you have time and then just be. You got
to be guerrilla warfare, reaching out to people, emailing people, dming,
doing whatever it takes because in a weird way, being
(47:19):
a young guy out of college like you need them.
They don't need you, but once you're there, maybe they
realized they really needed you. But there's no way for
you to convince them that they need you without complete
guerrilla warfare just to get on their radar. So you know,
I can't speak they've never worked at ESPN or any
of these fox but you just got to be relentless
(47:43):
in your pursuit and eventually, you know, ideally something will break.
And while you're relentless in your pursuit, you can create
your own stuff. Question for the pod, Well, we see
a coach get fired, like Mike Malone in the NFL,
someone who's won at the highest level and continues to win,
but has lost the locker room and is a few
games away from the playoffs. I just I have a
(48:06):
hard time seeing it. You know, with three games left
or whatever, a week left in the season, it would
probably be the equivalent of a team I don't know,
maybe ten and ten and five that has a playoff
berth locked up firing their coach with two weeks because
they were ten and three and lost two games. I
(48:28):
just now here's the thing. In the NBA, you think
they fire him without Nicola, as Michael Malone called him,
saying I want him to stay, because if Jokic wanted
him to, say, what do you think happens? He's not fired.
We're in football. You're not exactly polling the locker room.
Though sometimes it happens. Jeffrey Leary famously did with Chip Kelly,
(48:50):
dragged him out of the building. Mark Davis did it
with Josh McDaniels fired him on Halloween. So it can happen,
but usually it's firing at it. I don't want to
say out of nowhere, but during the season. It's typically
with bad teams. But it usually happens because either the
owner's turned on you or the players have turned on
(49:11):
you and they've gone to the owner. In basketball, that's
the only way it happens. No one gets fired in
the NBA at the highest level, they have star player
on the team without you going through the star player.
That's the way it works. The question I have for
(49:38):
the mail bag is regarding the Chargers, with it seeming
likely that we will look to take a tight end,
either Warren or Loveland. You see it worth them trading
back in the late first round and getting a defensive
tackle to replace Ford who they lost in free agency,
or Abuca out of Ohio State, so you can give
(50:01):
Herbert another weapon in the pass game to go with mcaukee.
Both were huge pains in the butt for Harbaugh at
Michigan to deal with. Harmon was at Michigan State before transferring. Plus,
I think the biggest strength is Harbaugh being a recent
out of college game is being able to identify the
higher end talent. If so, would multiple twos and a
fourth to potential third be worth it? So, if so
(50:26):
would multiple twos and a fourth? I think you just
rely on Harbaugh's knowledge. I think I got water all
over me of the draft in terms of like knowing
these players really well. And I'm not opposed to trading
up if I'm a team like the Chargers in the
second round, But I'm also not blowing all my draft
(50:48):
capital for one individual player. Like we're not a player away.
We're four or five I mean really competing in the AFC.
Like really, we're a player away from being a little
bit better, but we're three or four or high end
starters away from competing for a super Bowl. And I
think sometimes when you make the move to trade up
and you get rid of future picks, it can limit
(51:10):
your ability harbut knows all these guys. He's recruitable, He's
been in their living rooms, he's coached or coached against
a lot of them, because, like you said, Ohio State,
but other guys in the Big Ten, Penn State guys.
You know, there's a lot of good players from the
Big Ten. And they've played you know, Alabama last year,
They've played in bowl games in previous years. Like, he
(51:31):
just knows this landscape really really well. So I would
have a hard time unless it was just a can't
miss thing. Okay, a couple more, do you think Jayden
Daniels will have a sophomore slump? As the media saying,
who's saying that? I haven't seen anyone saying that. But
(51:53):
I thought CJ. I spring with a little money on
the Texans to be the number one seed. I thought
they had added to their defense. CJ was just a star.
And then all of a sudden, the offensive line is
terrible and they don't. So you can never predict these things.
So the thing about sports, it's just such a on
(52:14):
the fly, fluid reality show. You can take educated guesses.
Like the only thing we know is Chiefs are gonna
be good. Eagles by okay, but a lot of who
knows rams probably starts slow. Longtime listener loved the show.
I was listening to your podcast Thursday, the day of Friday.
I'm a big movie watcher, and I listened to your
segment about Val Kilmer. Mark Wahlberg was the star of
(52:36):
Boogie Knights. VAL's big role was as Jim Morrison in
the movie The Doors. I felt was his best performance. Yeah,
I think the porn movie that I talked about with
Val Kilmer was not Boogie Knights. It was called Wonderland.
I mean, Boogie Knights was a major hit. Wonderland was not,
(52:58):
and he played like Wahlberg played fictional character. To my knowledge, right,
Dirk Diggler was not an actual porn star. Val Kilmer
in the movie. I think it was like two or
oh one played John Holmes, who was a legitimate porn
star I think in like the eighties or nineties. So
(53:19):
if I said Boogie Knights, I didn't mean that I
was talking about a different movie. But I enjoyed the
movie Val Kilmer did. Obviously, It's not Boogie Knights, but
it was good, and I recom I think it's called Wonderland.
I think again, I looked it up a couple of
weeks ago. It's success. I don't think it was a
successful movie. I don't even think a lot of people
(53:41):
saw it. I don't even know how I ended up
seeing it. I just remember watching it and liking it.
But I listened to I've listened to a lot of
Val Kilmer content, and I do think what made him.
You know, he's such a big star, not like Arnold
Schwarzenegger or Sylvester Stallone, Tom Cruise or Tom Hanks some
(54:01):
of the other people during his era, but I mean
he was pretty famous. I mean he had starring roles
with Tom Cruise, with de Niro and Pacino with Kurt Douglas.
I mean, he he had some huge, huge movies, but
he was always like the number two. He's just like
one of the truly great. And listen, not everyone can
be Michael Jordan or Steph Curry. Being Scottie Pippen or
(54:23):
Klay Thompson is a pretty good living. You become pretty legendary.
And I think that, like in terms of movies, that's
kind of what he was. Like. He wasn't a star quarterback,
but he was like the Hall of Fame tight end
or like the Hall of Fame guard right, just it
doesn't get any better, and having that guy on your team,
but he couldn't carry your team, but you wanted him
(54:45):
on your team. And then I was listening to Simmons
did like a long pod on him. I guess he
he was pretty difficult to work with in his prime.
And Kyle Rant on that podcast of Good Morning Football
had a good point and I completely agree with him.
It's like I kind of missed the days when just
(55:08):
some stars and this is why Aaron Rodgers is good
for business. Not everyone can be the same. It's a
problem with like the PGA Tour once liv took all
the bad boys. All your guys are kind of boring.
Like I like some guys to be wild card human beings.
It's what makes Hollywood great. Like, not everyone's a straight arrow.
Some of these guys are fucking batshit crazy ego maniacs.
(55:32):
Don't listen to anybody got drug problems. The NBA used
to be full the NBA I grew up on in
the nineties. I was like, we were talking about this
last night was full of complete nut jobs. I mean
people just doing crazy things on and off the court
and the league benefited from that. The NFL has always
(55:53):
had that Hollywood kind of feels boring now, like I
need a little bit more like don't know what's gonna
happen here, Like you know who's good for business Mike Tyson,
because you've got no clue what is coming. And then
you think like, Okay, he's gonna knock Jake Paul out
and they're like, no, he actually can't move. But it
(56:14):
was so Mike Tyson's so crazy, you just assumed and
I kind of did too. They're like, I can see
him knocking them out. And then you're like five minutes
into the fight, as it's trying to stream, you're like, hey,
he's got no shot. And if it is true, the
Val Kilmer was really difficult to work with. I miss
some of just stars, whether it's athletes, whether it's musicians.
(56:36):
I mean, think about how many musicians. Some of the
stories that are famous of guys just like burning down
a hotel room or just doing things that you know
Ozzy Osbourne, like blowing a line of fire, ants biting
off birds heads. Kind of missed those days of just
(56:57):
no clue what's happening with just superstars in whatever entertainment industry.
It feels like we've kind of gotten boring that way,
which is understandable. There is more money than ever on
the line for all these human beings, so it's like,
be on your best behavior. Be on your best behavior
is kind of boring entertainment. So if al Kilmer truly
(57:18):
was Rip a wild card to deal with, he was
clearly pretty talented. Now what was he? A star like
Scottie Pippen Jordan disappeared like bulls weren't win the title.
Could Val Kilmer carry the movie as the star? Probably not.
It's not really his thing. It's definitely not what he
excelled at. Now, maybe he'd say I never got the
right role, and maybe that's true, but you could argue
(57:40):
he is definitely of his era the greatest supporting actor,
and honestly, it might not even be close. It might
not even be close. He's kind of like the Scottie
Pip in Hollywood in the nineties. The volume
The volume. What is going on everybody? How are we doing?
Hopefully everyone is having a great day. Masters is off
(00:21):
and running. Hopefully if you've gambled like I have, o
our bets are looking promising. Can't win it all on Thursday,
but you definitely can't lose it. I'll promise you that
we're gonna dive into a couple of different things today.
Something I noticed last night at the Warriors game in
regards to Steph Curry and how it's just so different
from a lot of other sports, specifically football. Something draft wise.
(00:45):
We try to do something every single day in regards
to the draft, and the Nuggets fired Mike Malone yesterday
in the NBA, and I do wonder if it was
because in a weird way of Sean McVeigh. So we'll
touch on some different things. Obviously slow a couple of
weeks in the world of football as teams are meeting
(01:09):
draft wise, getting ready for a couple of weeks, but
everyone's kind of hunkered down in their facility, really trying
to dial in that draft board, which is always a
fun time of year. But you know, for us content creators, podcasters,
i'd like some more explosive stories but nothing really is
going on, but we will talk some sports. But before
we do, you know, I got to tell you about
(01:31):
my friends, my partners in the official ticketing app of
this podcast. Went to a sporting event for the first
time in a while last night thanks to my buddy Mark,
who took me and my wife to the Sun's game,
which was really the Warriors game. Had a great time
and it got me thinking, like, sometimes it's just nice
to mix up your routine, get out of the house,
(01:51):
especially for us podcasters, put on some real clothes. The
only time we do that, at least in my world
is when I play golf. Other than that, I'm basically
wearing this same thing on a daily basis and just
interact with the people and get out there. And you're like,
you know what, you guys should do that too. So
if you want to go to an NBA playoff game
starts in a week. You want to go to an
NHL playoff game, I would guess it starts relatively soon.
(02:13):
You want to go to a baseball game, Major League
Baseball off and running concert season right around the corner,
people I heard we were talking about it last night.
Carrie Underwood had a residency in Vegas. I've never heard
anybody that has gone to Vegas, whether it be at
the Sphere, which I've heard is incredible, or just seen
someone in a residency situation, like you know, the Eagles
(02:36):
or Celine Dion back that didn't have a great time.
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You know, it's funny when I got out of football,
I mean, the first time I ever went to an
NFL games when I worked for the Eagles. I never
got to go to one growing up, and the first
time I had been to NBA in baseball games in
my youth. But my introduction to them once I got
(03:21):
into kind of the radio world and I left football
was really cool because you know, in the NFL or
even college football game day is no different. High school
is very serious. There's not a lot of bullshitting going
on on a football field an hour two hours before
(03:41):
a game. It's a very very serious environment. And I
remember when I started working in radio that I got
credentials to go to the Giants and this is when
they were really good, like Buster Posey, Brandon Crawford, who
actually sat next to last night at the Sun's game,
really cool dude. And the NBA games where the Warriors
at the time were coached by Mark Jackson and kind
(04:03):
of this up and coming team. But I remember going
to a lot of these games because you could just
go to batting practice three hours or two hours before
the game and just talk with Buster Posey standing there
and you just have a conversation or Hunter Pence or whoever.
Same thing. In the NBA, you could just get there early.
This is when they were really young, like have a
conversation with Klay Thompson about football, and it was like, God,
(04:24):
this is a completely different world at the professional level
than the NFL, where it's like you would never ever,
you know, if you didn't know them, go up to
a player when he's like warming up an hour before
the game, like, Hey, Carson Palmer, what do you think
is like, get out of my way, bro. Same thing
with coaches, if you don't know them, it's you're probably
(04:46):
not striking up a conversation, right. It's a tense environment.
So it was very, very cool to see something else.
And the one thing with football that's you know, and
I would say baseball a little bit too, is the franchise.
Like Aaron Judge, it's clearly one of the greatest Yankees
of all time, but if he disappeared tomorrow, the Yankees
(05:06):
will find another player and their brand like overall, the
power of the brand no different than the Lakers with
Lebron it was one of the great players of all time.
The Lakers brand was enormous before him, it'll be enormous
after him. Why because it's been built up for decades
and decades and decades. I remember, listen, I've been to
a lot of games in with the Niners or the
(05:28):
Raiders and seeing the Steelers and especially the Packers, and
it's amazing how big and rabid their fan base is
and how national it is. So when you go to
a game against the Packers of the Steelers. If your
team is bad, they are going to have a home
field advantage. And I definitely saw with the Raiders and
some of their bad teams, the Steelers it's like, this
(05:49):
is a Steeler home game. Same thing with the Packers.
It's because for decades upon decades upon decades, for countless
different groups of players, they have built the brand. And
it is the Steelers. That is the Packers, that is
the Cowboys, hell, that is the forty nine Ers. I
grew up on Steve Young and Jerry Rice. They were
(06:10):
not the forty nine Ers right in terms of like
the Niners. Since then they moved transitioned to Jeff Garcia,
then they got Harbaugh and Kyle Shanahan. They've had other successes,
like the brand really took off with Bill Walsh and
Joe Montana. And I think sometimes individuals can pierce through that.
And I would say the best example when I was
(06:32):
a child was Michael Jordan. Like, I'm not a Bills
or a Bulls historian, but I don't think the Bulls
were that important before he got there, and he turned
the Bulls into one of the greatest cash cow brands
you've ever seen. And it was simply because of Michael Jordan.
It wasn't the franchise, it wasn't the ownership. It was
one individual in basketball way more than football. Like if
(06:54):
Drake May, if Drake May never wins the Super Bowl,
but he just becomes let's say they're playing styles are different,
but let's just say like the level of like Philip Rivers, right,
he just has like a really good player, pro Bowl
level guy can win with them. If you're well run,
the Patriots will be fine, they'll sell out, they'll be
a really big deal. They'll be playing on primetime, and
(07:14):
it's like, yeah, he's not Tom Brady, but the brand
of the thing will not change and it will be
worth billions upon billions of dollars. Last night, I'm sitting there,
I'm next to Brandon Crawford, who was this starting shortstop
for multiple World Series teams with the Giants. He went
to multiple All Star Games, like he was part of
He wasn't actually part of the first World Series in
(07:36):
San Francisco Giant history, which was in twenty ten, but
he's part of the second and the third, and he
was a really really big deal and a very important piece,
and he was imported of this legendary kind of group
of players. But like, ultimately the Giants were built on
Willie Mays, on Supaida, on will Clark on obviously Barry Bonds,
and they'll be good again, and they'll be built on
(07:57):
other players and the brand will maintain. I'm watching Steph
Curry last night and I'm looking around and it is
just packed, and I mean packed with Warriors fans. When
we first got to the game where we go to
the bar to grab a Bruski and I hear this
eruption and I look over and I see the TV
and he had just hit a shot. Step had hit
(08:18):
a shot and he's on the road. You could argue
that since Michael Jordan, there has not been a more
important player to their franchise than Steph Curry, because even
Kobe Bryant, which was very important to the Lakers brand,
like the first couple championship, Shaq was the more important
player or definitely his equal, and he was more famous
at the time. But even that version of those guys,
(08:40):
the Lakers brand was fucking enormous. It was the biggest
brand in the NBA then it is definitely the biggest
brand now with Lebron like and once Lebron leaves with Luca,
it'll be fine. I'm watching Steph Curry and I go
if he disappeared tomorrow. This franchise that is now most
of my life. Like I grew up closer to Sacramento
and I was I'm really an NBA no mad fan,
(09:03):
grew up in the nineties fan of Michael Jordan like
most people. Then the Kings got good, joined them, and
then when I got into the radio thing and I
was around Steph and Clay, I was like, I love
these guys and Draymond and they start kicking as they're
just a fun watch, but their whole it feels like
the whole franchise value is Steph Curry. The Indianapolis Colts.
They say, the home that Peyton Manning built and the
(09:23):
Colt's dome is pretty cool and obviously anyone that's been
there in the town, it's easy to navigate even when
it's cold because of the convention center kind of set up,
and you never have to leave. They cut them, and
then Andrew Luck came in and they started winning, and
they would have been fine if Andrew Luck hadn't just
got a snowboarding accident and tapped out, but like the
(09:44):
franchise moved on right Like when Steph Curry retires or
an injury en into his career or whatever, like the
worst their value as a franchise to me would get
cut immediately in half somehow. Currently they're one of the
most valuable franchise in all of sports. I don't think
we've ever seen, beside Michael Jordan, like what Lebron did. Yeah,
(10:05):
he re awoke the Lakers brand, but the brand was
already there. It's a worldwide brand. The Warriors were a joke.
They were They had a local following, but the franchise,
for most of my life fucking sucked, were completely irrelevant. Yeah,
they had some Bay Area fans, they were not a
national brand. There is not a more national brand than
this guy. And one difference of him and Lebron, which
(10:28):
are obviously the two most important guys of their era,
is Lebron's a nomad as well. He goes to Cleveland,
leaves Cleveland, comes back to Cleveland, goes to la It's
like he just kind of steps been with one franchise
the whole time, and he's driven that thing up like
a rocket ship. And I just in my life. I don't.
He'd have to be on the short list of like
(10:49):
most entertaining athletes any sport, it doesn't get any better.
And when it comes to the value, like you can't
even compare him to NFL players because they are one
hundred percent replaceable. Obviously, Brady wins Super Bowl and twenty
with Tampa, which was a really big deal. Then the
next couple of years they make the playoffs whatever. Then
they institute or implement and signed Baker Mayfield, put him in.
(11:11):
They keep winning, and everyone's like, oh, Baker's really cool,
he's fun. He's vice of Baker Jerseys. Doesn't even kip
a peat, Like there is nobody that is filling that
guy's shoes, just like Michael Jordan, the Bulls were one
hundred ft when he retired. That is gonna be the Warriors,
and he is obviously spectacular player. I just don't think
(11:32):
we've ever in a law, at least in the Internet age,
anything quite like him. You know, maybe Lebron would have
been that, he would have been that with Cleveland, but
he's bounced on him twice and didn't even hesitate to
see you. I mean, part of Steph's brand power and
value to the franchise has been his loyalty to the
franchise and never even entertained bouncing. But man, you watch
(11:56):
this guy take this brand that was, let's face it,
dog shit and basically turned it into the Yankees the
Lakers like an NFL team quickly. Everywhere he goes, everyone's
wearing his jersey. It's it's wild. Ten years ago, you
couldn't have paid anyone to attend a Warriors game on
(12:16):
the road. I mean now it's like they are paying
to see this guy who's still thirty seven thirty eight,
and I mean last night. It's funny. You know, in football,
you can get your ass kicked and you can kind
of like tap out toward the end of the game,
but you have to try early on or you will
get hurt. In baseball, I was taught this early on
(12:36):
in my radio career. It's hard to say a team
like isn't trying, because that's what you look like when
you don't get any hits. So if you get one hit,
it looks like you're not trying. You're just getting mowed
down by the pitcher. Like that's part of the sport.
In basketball, it's very evidence like Yeah, these guys like
Bradley Beal is just not trying out there, like on
the effort level. Like you can just tell on a
(12:58):
basketball court, like it's one thing to just lose or
even get kind of worked, it's another thing like not
even have effort. And watching this was an eye opening experience.
I mean, the Warriors just absolutely toyed with them. But
speaking of basketball, you know the Nuggets, they fired their
head coach yesterday, And a lot of these owners now
(13:20):
own multiple franchises, right they might own a basketball on
an NFL team, or a baseball on an NFL team,
or a soccer team and an NFL team, So if
you coach for one of the teams, like you're always
gonna be judged by like if they own three teams,
whoever is doing the best. The teams that aren't doing
(13:43):
as well are gonna be judged based on the teams
doing the best. And the Kronkys have this huge portfolio
of the Avs, obviously, the Nuggets and the Rams. And
I remember when Kronky Move moved the Rams from Saint
Louis and everyone freaked out. It's like, guys, you guys
stole the Rams from Los Angeles, Like I understand even
(14:07):
if the right move was to leave Oakland to go
to Vegas, financially, it changed Mark Davis's life. But like
Oakland when like that was the Raiders home where they started,
and like I understand them being bitter and furious when
they left, Like the Saint Louis fans, like they're moving
back to their home now. Stan Kronkey, Missouri guy, he's
(14:28):
just a businessman. He just like, yeah, it's better off,
more lucrative in LA. And he's not wrong. But you
lost a team that you stole. It's like if you
start sleeping with someone who's married, she marries you, and
then she leaves you for someone else, Like, can you
really be that bitter? Like shouldn't you have seen this
coming early on? And Mike Malone gets fired. Listen, I
(14:50):
heard Bill Simmons a while back say, liked, the NFL
owners are by far the craziest. They do all this
batshit crazy stuff. The NBA is firing coaches. Two coaches
they're headed right to the playoffs. Got fired one with
like three weeks left, the other guy with a week
left in the season. Can you imagine in the NFL
if a team like the Nuggets that have the best
(15:10):
player in the world, who are a good team going
through a little rough stretch, just like two weeks left
in the season, fired the coach at like nine and six.
It's like, guys, they're going to the playoff that I'd
be insane. But in basketball it's like, yeah, kind of
crazy league. But if you're the Kronky family. And I
was thinking about this because I remember when Jim Harbaugh
(15:33):
and Trent Balkey were at odds in getting in fights,
and this happened sometimes in football. Right, the GM and
the head coach are at odds. And I've seen some
people whenever this happens in sports, like, isn't it the
owner's job to figure it out with those guys? And
I would push back if I'm an owner and I'm
paying my coach and my GM millions of dollars each.
(15:56):
And both these guys are somewhere in the age of
between forty and sixties, right, these are adults. It's one
thing with a player, right, players are in their twenties.
People are highly emotional. It's a tough pressure pack position.
Like sometimes you have to intervene, maybe sit down with
(16:16):
them and their agent. You get involved. Totally understand. If
I owned a team in any of these sports and
my GM and head coach we're not getting along, I'm
doing one of two things. I look at them both, like,
it is not my job to figure this out. You
two are adults. You guys either get along. I'm either
gonna pick whoever I like the most out of you
(16:36):
two if this is a power struggle, or I'm gonna
fire you both. But it is not my job to
basically be your parent and figure it out. And it
was pretty clear, you know, I've read some articles with
the nuggets that these two guys hated each other. And
if you're the Kronkey family and you see Sean McVeigh in,
(16:59):
less sneed flip teams around the way they act, just
how professional they are, I would have zero patients. And
I like Mike Malone. I think he's an entertaining personality.
But when you start walking around like your shit, don't
snak even if your GM's an idiot, and you won't
listen to anybody and your team's not really listening to you, Like,
it's not my job to figure out your relationship with
(17:22):
your GM. Either figure it out or if you get
fired like, I'm sorry, I feel little to no empathy.
But when I have Sean McVeigh and less sneed. As
the example, if I was the Cronky family, like, that's
kind of what I would be looking for, and I
would have little to no patients of like I gotta
hold your two hands. You guys are both I don't
(17:43):
know how old Calvin Booth is. I would imagine over fifty.
I know Mike Malone's like fifty three. I have to
sit down and have a pow wow to make you
guys like each other? Is this sixth grade? Like what
the fuck are we doing? So when I see these
guys fired and you read some of these articles, like
of course, now you could argue the timings insane, but
terms of like getting rid of them, both totally understand.
(18:04):
Like I think some of these coaches in front office
people that get to be like this power struggle and
this ego attacking each other don't realize how stupid they
look on the outside sometimes and how the fight tends
to take both guys down. It's rare that you just
get one winner and then that guy just gets to
(18:26):
win forever. Every once in a while it happens but
for the most part, even if the guy wins in
the short term, he usually goes down in the next
couple of years. I remember last year, my guy Adam
Peters took a lot of crap because he brought in
all the quarterbacks at the same time, and he took
him to top Golf, and everyone on the internet was
talking crap. They were all, this guy know what he's doing,
(18:49):
like why are you doing this? Why don't you bring
him in one by one? And it clearly was the
right move because he brought them all in together. He
got a feel for how they acted. He almost like
it was like an alpha test who was rise above
them all? And he clearly made a choice that through
one year, looks like the right choice. You could argue,
Ryan Poles, why didn't you bring in all these guys?
(19:09):
You just went with the easy thing, like Caleb Williams.
I'm not saying it's the wrong choice, but looking back,
Ryan Poles should have brought every single one of these quarterbacks,
especially the top three guys, into his building, and he didn't.
I would take the approach if I were these gms
and spy Tech is currently doing it. He brought Jackson
(19:30):
Dart which obviously he's not gonna take it six, but
would he take the guy in the second round? Could
they trade up and get but Ashon Genty and Will
Campbell at the same time. And I do wonder if
you bring in the guys at the same time and
just watch the way they interact together, you might get
a better field than if you bring them in individually. Now,
sometimes just logistically they're coming from the same training area,
(19:53):
that's the dates that fit for them, so sometimes it's
not as deep as they're trying to figure out and
let the cream rise when they walk in the building.
But I think the no brainer move, especially if you're
drafting really high, would be to bring in is many
of the guys that are on you know, the potential
(20:14):
list of people you would pick all in together and
get a feel for, like when they're at breakfast, when
they're at lunch, when they're walking around the building all
at once instead of because sometimes like if you just
if you're a single guy and you dated for women, right,
and I said you had a date Monday, you had
a date Tuesday, you had a date Thursday, and you
had a date Saturday, there's a chance if Saturday just goes, oh,
(20:36):
pretty good, even if you liked some of the ones
earlier in the week, that's just the fresher experience, and
sometimes that changes the way you look at it. So
when they're all there at once, when they all leave,
like you kind of have I would say, somewhat of
a gut feeling when they're taking off of what you
felt when you were around them all. And these are
(20:56):
very very difficult decisions because we won't know if you're
right or wrong for years moving forward. But when it
comes to pulling the trigger, when you're drafting really high,
you better get it right because ideally, if you start winning,
you're not going to draft this high again. So you
get the opportunity to take really talented players. You get
(21:17):
the chance to pick between the group right, and there's
a chance the team ten slots below you will draft
a better player, but it's not because they had more options.
They actually have less. Like you have options to players
that they probably would have picked if they were given
the chance, instead of the guy that they actually took
that turned out to be good. So you just I
(21:37):
think bringing guys in together is the right move. Okay,
let's end on this. Welcome to chasing challenges brought to
you by Microsoft. In the NFL. Just like in business,
overcoming obstacles is key to success. Microsoft empowers business decision
makers with AI solutions, simplified cloud and data management, and trustworthy,
(21:57):
responsible technology to turn challenges into opportunities. In this segment,
we explore some of the biggest challenges being faced in
the NFL and how they can be overcome. Whatever challenge
you're facing, Microsoft empowers you with the expertise to say
bring it on. This week, we're discussing the challenge faced
by the Atlanta Falcons. Listen, what they did last year
(22:20):
is still a head scratcher to give Cousins that much
money to then draft Michael Pennix, and now they're in
this situation with Michael Pennix as their starter OTAs and
the off season starting and Raheem Morris and Kirk Cousins
is not coming around. Now you cannot go into training camp.
I don't care what you say and how much money
(22:41):
Arthur Blank is and how big of a pro Kirk
Cousins is. With Cousins showing up on your roster, you
have to find a way to get rid of them.
And Raheem Morris basically admitted kirk Cousins showed top doughtas
he's not going to be around and I think in
a perfect world they trade him during the draft. But
(23:01):
here's the thing, and this is the challenge of being
a head coach, and this was the problem once they
made this decision, because when they drafted Michael Pennox and
they said, well, we're just trying to load up the
quarterback room, which we understand you didn't have the thought
of drafting Michael Pennock when you signed Kirk Cousins and
gave him a no trade clause, or else you never
would have give him the no trade class. But you
(23:23):
guys fell in love with them after you signed Kirk Cousins,
and now you're in this predicament. But you don't control
the Kirk Cousins trade because I'm sure there are some
teams interested right now and are saying, hey, wait till
after the draft and then we can rekindle and restart
our trade talks and figure out a way to get
Cousins on a roster. But that's not a lot of teams.
(23:44):
It's got to be a short list, especially given that
you're gonna have to take on some of his salary,
even if the Atlanta Falcons eats some But what if
those teams and let's just say it's two or three
all end up with quarterbacks relatively hell, not even in
the first round, but in the second, in the third round,
what if they're not interested in them anymore? And now
you're in a position where you don't have a trade target.
(24:06):
So you're gonna be staring down the off season gun
barrel of like, are you gonna start training camp with
him still on the roster and trying to give the
keys to this franchise to a young quarterback and make
Cousins show up and have this weird kind of halo
hanging over your offense in the quarterback room. You can't
do that. That's just bad business. That's just bad ball,
(24:30):
that's just bad management. So this is one of those
situations from a challenge for the Atlanta Falcons is kind
of out of their control. They better just keep their
fingers crossed and pray that the teams that have some
interest currently in Cousins do not fill their quarterback needs
(24:51):
in late April. That's it for this week's Chasing Challengers.
Remember Microsoft's AI solutions and power you to take bold
steps and make informed decisions, speaking new ideas to help
drive your business forward. With Microsoft as your trusted partner,
you can navigate your journey with confidence, finding innovative solutions,
and reaching new possibilities. Visit Microsoft dot com Slash Challengers
(25:14):
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Speaker 1 (26:47):
Okay, let's uh, let's bang out a few mailbag questions
at John middlecoff is the Instagram fire in those dms.
I think I'm going to do a big, big mail
bag for Friday, so I'll just bang out of a
couple here. Do you guys know the drill to slide
into my dms and get your questions answered on the show?
Calvin a big fan for about a year now, and
(27:11):
this is coming from a packers guy. What steps and
moves do you think we as a team need to
make to push us over the edge. Well, I would
say you're not quite to the edge. You were one
and done this year. Obviously against the champs. Last year
it felt like you were better, even though your defense
(27:33):
wasn't as good. I think we talked about the Packers
a lot, you guys, obviously worldwide fan base here to
go from far to Rogers to now this. It looked
like they did it again right after the Cowboy game,
and then even after last season ended, even he I
know he I think his season ended with a pick
(27:55):
against the Niners his first year starting, but it was like, Okay,
the future is bright. And then last year he got
injured against the Eagles, and it just kind of made
for a bizarre season. I've seen they you know, it's listen,
you're not gonna bring in anyone on one of those
thirty visits that you're not interested in. So anytime you
see them bring in a wide receiver, I think it's
(28:17):
fair to say the Packers are gonna take a wide
receiver in the first couple rounds. They've had success in
the second round, right, Davante pretty sure Jordi was a
second round pick. Might have been third round pick. Pretty
sure he's a second round pick, though those doesn't get
much better in second round picks Jordy Nelson and DeVante Adams,
so you don't always need to draft those guys really high.
But the thing with the Packers, like your expectations next
(28:39):
year is to compete for the NFC, and DeVante's career
didn't really get going until like second year, middle the
second year, and by the third year he took off.
So sometimes it takes it takes a little time. I
just think the offense has got to be more dynamic,
and whether that's some of the guys are already on
(29:00):
the roster taking big steps, maybe you become just a true,
true run heavy team, which I think Lafleur doesn't mind doing.
It's kind of his background. I mean, Aaron Jones obviously,
Josh Jacobs a stud. I'm trying to see what how
many what were Jacob's stats last year. I know he missed,
(29:22):
was he injured? I know he missed games with the Raiders,
but so Jacobs, he played in every game. I mean,
Jacobs was excellent. He averaged four and a half yards
of carry at three hundred carries, seven touchdowns, thirteen hundred yards.
I mean he's a big time player. Your backup running
back in five hundred yards. I mean you, guys, how
many teams in the league ran for more yards than
(29:47):
the Packers. I can't imagine it was many. I would
have been you guys were near the top in total
yards and you were you only the Bucks who had
an unreal rushing offense Washington whose quarterback also runs the
Eagles and the Ravens, which makes sense, so your rushing
(30:08):
offense is excellent. I would just keep leaning into that. Now,
you know the couple games when Malik started too, but
I would lean into that with Jordan love Is, take
the pressure off him like you do, not make him
try to play like Joe Burrow. So I would just
keep doing what you're doing and the defense gets better
and which was took steps last year under half Lee.
(30:29):
I'd be bullish if I was a backup fan, I
really would. I got so many Stanley's and hydros. My
question is do you ever plan on expanding the type
of content you make? I understand you are a podcaster,
but have you ever thought about making video essays where
you dive deeper into a topic or a story? With editing.
(30:51):
It doesn't have to be that. But I was wondering
if you've thought about it, you have thought about a lot.
We've dabbled a little bit in it, probably dabble a
little bit more. I just look at it like this
is going really well, and I just try to put
all my energy into this and then dabble a little
bit on the side. We've done golf videos in the past,
plan on doing much more of those this summer and
(31:14):
once it gets I mean, it's ninety degrees where I'm at.
But I have some big ideas and it's just about
doing them. But yeah, I mean I have to. You know,
this sounds cheesy, but like you, there's a strong balance
of like, this is the main thing, and this is
what pays the bills and why we're in business. So
(31:35):
I take so much energy doing this. And listen, I
don't act like I'm digging digits here. I'm not acting
like it's it's physically demanding, but mentally, I do spend
a lot of time and energy in this, and it
actually is much more time consuming in the off season
because there's not as much going on. But you know,
we plan on doing some interview stuff don't. I don't
(31:57):
do many interviews. I mean, as you guys know, this
is not like an interview heavy podcasts. This is just me.
So we plan on doing some of that stuff, which
is which is a little different which we've done in
the past. But yeah, expanding content. We're always I mean,
any idea is it's the best part about the Internet.
Do whatever we want. This is not you know, corporate America. Here,
we can do whatever whenever, at any moment, right as
(32:21):
long as I'm taking care of our our business partners
so that there aren't any restrictions. And uh, we just
keep we just keep firing. Assuming they couldn't jam you
on the line. If you had to get open and
catch a pass, which one of these three corners would
you want to try to go against Sauce Gardner, Derek
Stingley or Trent McDuffie. Thanks, I would love to play
(32:45):
golf with Sauce. That guy is a junkie. Sauce has
really grown on me, you know, I just see his
love of golf. He's a junkie, and so I appreciate
him his game. On the other hand, it's I think
it's pretty hard to just be a full press super
(33:07):
physical corner in this day and age, because one so
many wide receivers are really fast. So if the referees
aren't allowing you to just maul them at the line,
and you aren't, like Derek Stingley is an elite athlete,
like his strength of his game is going to be
just to say, in your hip pocket. McDuffie is just
an all around really good player, also a solid athlete.
(33:31):
You know Sauce against me, like could I get open?
I couldn't get open on any of these people. I
appreciate these questions. I think in a weird way, you
were almost underestimating even I think Sauce. If I had
to pick these three guys, like Who'd I want on
my team, I would go Stingley, McDuffie, Sauce. But I
(33:52):
mean Sauce's first two years he was an All Pro
in the NFL, So I mean the very high standards
for these three cats, and Stingly had obviously a breakout season.
But nobody, and I mean nobody who is not like
a Division one wide receiver is getting open on any
of these guys, regardless of a jam Sauce relative to
(34:13):
like Justin Jefferson or Jamar Chase or you know, you
name some of the best receivers inly Aj Brown. Yeah,
it's gonna be DeVante Smith. It's gonna be difficult against me,
against you. Against normal people, you would have not a
shot on God's green Earth to get an ounce of space.
But if my life depended on it, you'd have to
(34:35):
choose Sauce because he's the least of the three. I
would say, fluid athlete, you would have and I mean
no chance and I mean absolutely zero negative Niche against
Derek Stingley his ability and athletic ability. It's like it's
(34:59):
like prime r So Westbrook or something. I have a
question pertaining to the popularity of baseball. Why is it
that people are saying it's dying, boring sport in comparison
to football. I live in Washington and went to my
first Mariner game last night in like ten years. I
was expecting it to be low attendance and low energy.
Yet there was like thirty thousand people and a shitload
(35:21):
of energy, which was surprising because it was Tuesday night
against the Astros. Not to mention we suck right now.
Just curious. The stigma I think that's really driven is
one the television the explosion of television sports talk, which
you know Collins obviously his show is he does, I
(35:43):
mean his podcast. What we do on the volume is
obviously different from what they do at The Herd, which
is a television show. First take, those type things are
basically driven all by football and then the NBA, Like
I think that baseball has got lost in that world.
And then in the podcast world, all the big podcasts
(36:04):
don't really talk about baseball. Obviously there are some baseball podcasts,
but like big quote unquote sports podcasts are just not
talking any baseball until the playoffs. So when that happens,
there becomes a stigma that it just is kind of irrelevant.
Where I'd argue the NBA and is this someone that
(36:24):
just went to a game? You turn on these television shows,
no one is. It's pretty rare that, like you're really
breaking down a game like you would in football. It's
talking like where is Jokic gonna demand a trade to? Now,
no one gets a bigger heart on than basketball people
when a disaster happens with a franchise and they have
(36:45):
a star player, like is this guy gonna demand a trade?
It's an immediate conversation, where is Yokic gonna go. It's
like his coach got fired two minutes ago and now
he's gonna ask for a trade. But that's the conversation,
and that to me, drives basketball talk and baseball talk.
It just doesn't exist. I also think most of these
(37:06):
people aren't watching games anymore, so you just talk about
what you watch. And I think a lot of people
in the space of talking about just general sports don't
watch any baseball. They basically have to go all in
on football. And you know, for me, for example, like
I don't really even talk like I used to just
(37:26):
do a general radio show before I got into podcasting,
and then all I got into football and it got
so big. It's like why do not I just talk
more football? And then we started doing a football show
basically every day. And the reason I do golf is
it's a little bit of a passion project slash like,
you know, for business opportunities. But it's because I watch,
you know, it wasn't someone's like you should do that.
It's like, no, I'm just going to do that because
(37:47):
I watch I don't really watch other sports unless it's
like March madness or maybe the NBA playoffs or the
Baseball playoffs. I do. I watch those type things when
I feel like a lot of consumers are And I
think that's where a lot of people have kind of
turned when it came to, you know, when it came
to talking about baseball, and I think the ratings reflected
(38:09):
that in terms of those shows. Now locally, you know,
do you think the Yankees kind of matter in New
York or the Dodgers matter in LA? It's if the
Giants are good, they I know, they really matter in
San Francisco, Philly. I mean the big markets are you know, Chicago,
the Cubs. Yeah. I think baseball has become a very
localized sport, but it's become very very lucrative. I mean,
(38:31):
these guys are making the top players five hundred to
seven hundred million dollars. Now it's over like twenty five
year contracts, but still any buzz on Gavin Bartholomew pit
tight end, small town kid who grew up in my
own town, went to high school, super nice, high character dude.
I saw him run the forty in the low four
to sevens. I was just wondering if you've heard his
(38:54):
name being brought up. I have not sometimes you know,
I'm not I'm not in the weeds as much. And
one thing I learned doing this is like the difference
when you work in football and you're really close to it,
you're so you're just nerding out on all these players
(39:15):
and you're just so in on the fifth, sixth, seventh
round picks, and then once you get doing my job
and you realize that when you're in it, but you
don't have a choice because you still got to write
these guys up and follow their careers. Half the people
that and you know this, whoever your team is, it's
like it's you get excited about third round pick, a
fourth round pick, and then all of a sudden they
(39:36):
are not playing it all come the fall and two
undrafted free agents are in their spots. It's like I've
seen it so many times, is like you get so
excited on about guys on the second and third day,
and you just the guy you get really excited about
turns out to be the one that isn't as good
as the guy that no one talked about in the
fifth round who becomes like an all pro by his
(39:57):
third year. And I just think the draft is such
a crapshoot, especially this upcoming draft, like no one seems
to know how it's gonna shake out. I recently saw
a post joking about predicting the Luck Belichick rivalry being
the Stanford and UNC in both being acc opponents. Would
(40:19):
be absolutely insane to tell someone in twenty eighteen, do
you have any wild card predictions of college or NFL
guys switching like this? Do you think stuff like this
will happen in a few years with the landscape of
both leagues? Totally agree. One thing that has changed in
college football is one of these GM's jobs didn't exist,
(40:42):
and two the amount of money these programs can pay.
Belichick makes ten million dollars and he's not even he's
kind of like got a discount. He's paying like four
guys on his staff seven figures, and that includes his
GM Mike Lombardi. Well, these GM jobs didn't exist, So
I think I just saw Jim Naggy, who ran the
(41:05):
Senior Bowl, who is a longtime scout, is now the
GM of the Oklahoma Sooners, and the guy who just
got hired to run the Senior Bowl had previously been
the GM of like Auburn, and I don't know, some
other major program and these guys are making so much
money that these jobs didn't exist. So I think we're
going to see more and more that If I would
(41:25):
have told you five years ago that the Colorado Buffaloes
are going to be coached by Dion Sanders as the
head coach, with Pat Shermer as the offensive coordinator, Marshall
Fulk as the running back coach, and Warren Sapp as
the defensive line coach, you'd be like, what are you
talking about? And that's something that's actually happening. So one
(41:47):
thing we've learned now long enough in sports, but specifically
with this explosion in college football, you never know, and
we've seen it occasionally back in the day. Right Saban
just left the Dolphins to go back to or not
too back, but to Bama. Patrino left on the Falcons
when Vick got arrested and he went to was it
(42:10):
Arkansas Louisville? I forget Patrino, crazy cat, but good the
offensive coach. It was pretty jarring when that happens. Now,
if you told me that someone got fired this offseason,
I mean, Ron Rivera is the GM of cal Ron
Rivera was the head coach of the Washington football team
(42:30):
like eighteen months ago. I just think it's really really
hard to predict. The Belichick thing is crazy, But part
of that is I think he clearly knew that he
wasn't going to get a job or didn't want any
of the jobs that people would have even been interested
in hiring him. Where do you rank Sirianni? This is
(42:55):
David from Georgia. Where do you rank Sirianni among the
best coach in the NFL? Just curious. Hopefully you see
this and I look forward to the answer soon. It's
a great question. Anything I say is gonna sound like
I'm a hater or talking shit when he's a Super
Bowl champ. So there's a short list of human beings
(43:17):
that can say I was a head coach for a
team that won a Super Bowl. There's probably even a
shorter list of guys that say I'm a head coach
that went to multiple Super Bowls. Think about this. Pete Carroll,
who's a legendary coach, who is a should be a
first ballot Hall of Famer, And if you combine like
basketball does, pro and college, he's had one of the
(43:38):
most legendary coaching careers. He's been a head coach for
the Jets, the Patriots, Seattle, the Trojans, and the Raiders.
He's been a head coach of five different places. They're
all pretty important. And he's been a two super Bowls total,
and Sirianni's also been a two in three years. So
it's like Sirianni and Pete Carroll have the same super
(44:01):
Bowl resume. They're one and one. Think about that. But
if you told me I was the GM and all
the coaches were free, right, all thirty two and assistance,
I could hire whoever I wanted in the pros, not
college like I had to hire or playing NFL football higher.
(44:24):
I don't think he goes that high now. I don't
think he goes like twenty eight. But who are you
taking him over? Like, think about this, he's had more
success than Dan Campbell. But if all things were equal,
Like you don't get Howie Roseman, how it's not a
(44:45):
package deal. This isn't Shaq and Kobe, You skt one.
You s get Sirianni. If you or me or the GM,
are you hiring Sirianni over Dan Campbell? Cause you're not
taking him over the Harrorbob Brothers would say that a
lot of the offensive guys that call plays. If I'm
starting from scratch, like I don't have a two hundred
(45:08):
million dollar offense, we all have starting from the same point,
and how he is not existing, I'm the GM, I
would be really inclined to obviously hire you know, clearly
people would take Andy Reid over Sirianni, but would be
to hire the coaches that can also call the place.
So it's weird. It's like what he did is impressive,
(45:30):
but it does feel like an organizational thing, which again,
if you're him, who gives a shit? Now where it
does matter is where's his contract extension? Does Jeffrey Learry
believe in him? Because if he does, he should give
him four years, sixty million dollars fifteen million dollars a
year or something extension. Shouldn't that already be done by
(45:50):
now and maybe gets done? But has Jeffrey Learry giving
him that? Because I saw I headlined recently like it's
going to happen, And again I feel like a hater.
The guy won the Super Bowl, so who cares if
you're him, but no one's going to consider him near
the top I just I don't think much change is
because Jalen Hurts and that defense dominated the Chiefs. I'm
(46:14):
currently a senior in college and graduating in a month
with a degree in marketing. Congratulations. I've been wanting to
get into sports media and especially the football world for
a while now. I make content and write my own
stories for my team, the Denver Broncos. I've had an
intro call with ESPN, but doesn't seem like anything is
going to come from it. Just hoping you could provide
(46:35):
me some career advice in pursuing this career. I make
content and write my own stories. I think you just
keep doing that until something breaks Like this, what you are,
the world you're playing in. You know, people my age
you didn't even exist, so we would have no choice
(46:56):
but to keep contacting people because you couldn't just create
your own stuff. And I think the power of any
content you're creating, like I would quadruple down on that
if you have time and then just be. You got
to be guerrilla warfare, reaching out to people, emailing people, dming,
doing whatever it takes because in a weird way, being
(47:19):
a young guy out of college like you need them.
They don't need you, but once you're there, maybe they
realized they really needed you. But there's no way for
you to convince them that they need you without complete
guerrilla warfare just to get on their radar. So you know,
I can't speak they've never worked at ESPN or any
of these fox but you just got to be relentless
(47:43):
in your pursuit and eventually, you know, ideally something will break.
And while you're relentless in your pursuit, you can create
your own stuff. Question for the pod, Well, we see
a coach get fired, like Mike Malone in the NFL,
someone who's won at the highest level and continues to win,
but has lost the locker room and is a few
games away from the playoffs. I just I have a
(48:06):
hard time seeing it. You know, with three games left
or whatever, a week left in the season, it would
probably be the equivalent of a team I don't know,
maybe ten and ten and five that has a playoff
berth locked up firing their coach with two weeks because
they were ten and three and lost two games. I
(48:28):
just now here's the thing. In the NBA, you think
they fire him without Nicola, as Michael Malone called him,
saying I want him to stay, because if Jokic wanted
him to, say, what do you think happens? He's not fired.
We're in football. You're not exactly polling the locker room.
Though sometimes it happens. Jeffrey Leary famously did with Chip Kelly,
(48:50):
dragged him out of the building. Mark Davis did it
with Josh McDaniels fired him on Halloween. So it can happen,
but usually it's firing at it. I don't want to
say out of nowhere, but during the season. It's typically
with bad teams. But it usually happens because either the
owner's turned on you or the players have turned on
(49:11):
you and they've gone to the owner. In basketball, that's
the only way it happens. No one gets fired in
the NBA at the highest level, they have star player
on the team without you going through the star player.
That's the way it works. The question I have for
(49:38):
the mail bag is regarding the Chargers, with it seeming
likely that we will look to take a tight end,
either Warren or Loveland. You see it worth them trading
back in the late first round and getting a defensive
tackle to replace Ford who they lost in free agency,
or Abuca out of Ohio State, so you can give
(50:01):
Herbert another weapon in the pass game to go with mcaukee.
Both were huge pains in the butt for Harbaugh at
Michigan to deal with. Harmon was at Michigan State before transferring. Plus,
I think the biggest strength is Harbaugh being a recent
out of college game is being able to identify the
higher end talent. If so, would multiple twos and a
fourth to potential third be worth it? So, if so
(50:26):
would multiple twos and a fourth? I think you just
rely on Harbaugh's knowledge. I think I got water all
over me of the draft in terms of like knowing
these players really well. And I'm not opposed to trading
up if I'm a team like the Chargers in the
second round, But I'm also not blowing all my draft
(50:48):
capital for one individual player. Like we're not a player away.
We're four or five I mean really competing in the AFC.
Like really, we're a player away from being a little
bit better, but we're three or four or high end
starters away from competing for a super Bowl. And I
think sometimes when you make the move to trade up
and you get rid of future picks, it can limit
(51:10):
your ability harbut knows all these guys. He's recruitable, He's
been in their living rooms, he's coached or coached against
a lot of them, because, like you said, Ohio State,
but other guys in the Big Ten, Penn State guys.
You know, there's a lot of good players from the
Big Ten. And they've played you know, Alabama last year,
They've played in bowl games in previous years. Like, he
(51:31):
just knows this landscape really really well. So I would
have a hard time unless it was just a can't
miss thing. Okay, a couple more, do you think Jayden
Daniels will have a sophomore slump? As the media saying,
who's saying that? I haven't seen anyone saying that. But
(51:53):
I thought CJ. I spring with a little money on
the Texans to be the number one seed. I thought
they had added to their defense. CJ was just a star.
And then all of a sudden, the offensive line is
terrible and they don't. So you can never predict these things.
So the thing about sports, it's just such a on
(52:14):
the fly, fluid reality show. You can take educated guesses.
Like the only thing we know is Chiefs are gonna
be good. Eagles by okay, but a lot of who
knows rams probably starts slow. Longtime listener loved the show.
I was listening to your podcast Thursday, the day of Friday.
I'm a big movie watcher, and I listened to your
segment about Val Kilmer. Mark Wahlberg was the star of
(52:36):
Boogie Knights. VAL's big role was as Jim Morrison in
the movie The Doors. I felt was his best performance. Yeah,
I think the porn movie that I talked about with
Val Kilmer was not Boogie Knights. It was called Wonderland.
I mean, Boogie Knights was a major hit. Wonderland was not,
(52:58):
and he played like Wahlberg played fictional character. To my knowledge, right,
Dirk Diggler was not an actual porn star. Val Kilmer
in the movie. I think it was like two or
oh one played John Holmes, who was a legitimate porn
star I think in like the eighties or nineties. So
(53:19):
if I said Boogie Knights, I didn't mean that I
was talking about a different movie. But I enjoyed the
movie Val Kilmer did. Obviously, It's not Boogie Knights, but
it was good, and I recom I think it's called Wonderland.
I think again, I looked it up a couple of
weeks ago. It's success. I don't think it was a
successful movie. I don't even think a lot of people
(53:41):
saw it. I don't even know how I ended up
seeing it. I just remember watching it and liking it.
But I listened to I've listened to a lot of
Val Kilmer content, and I do think what made him.
You know, he's such a big star, not like Arnold
Schwarzenegger or Sylvester Stallone, Tom Cruise or Tom Hanks some
(54:01):
of the other people during his era, but I mean
he was pretty famous. I mean he had starring roles
with Tom Cruise, with de Niro and Pacino with Kurt Douglas.
I mean, he he had some huge, huge movies, but
he was always like the number two. He's just like
one of the truly great. And listen, not everyone can
be Michael Jordan or Steph Curry. Being Scottie Pippen or
(54:23):
Klay Thompson is a pretty good living. You become pretty legendary.
And I think that, like in terms of movies, that's
kind of what he was. Like. He wasn't a star quarterback,
but he was like the Hall of Fame tight end
or like the Hall of Fame guard right, just it
doesn't get any better, and having that guy on your team,
but he couldn't carry your team, but you wanted him
(54:45):
on your team. And then I was listening to Simmons
did like a long pod on him. I guess he
he was pretty difficult to work with in his prime.
And Kyle Rant on that podcast of Good Morning Football
had a good point and I completely agree with him.
It's like I kind of missed the days when just
(55:08):
some stars and this is why Aaron Rodgers is good
for business. Not everyone can be the same. It's a
problem with like the PGA Tour once liv took all
the bad boys. All your guys are kind of boring.
Like I like some guys to be wild card human beings.
It's what makes Hollywood great. Like, not everyone's a straight arrow.
Some of these guys are fucking batshit crazy ego maniacs.
(55:32):
Don't listen to anybody got drug problems. The NBA used
to be full the NBA I grew up on in
the nineties. I was like, we were talking about this
last night was full of complete nut jobs. I mean
people just doing crazy things on and off the court
and the league benefited from that. The NFL has always
(55:53):
had that Hollywood kind of feels boring now, like I
need a little bit more like don't know what's gonna
happen here, Like you know who's good for business Mike Tyson,
because you've got no clue what is coming. And then
you think like, Okay, he's gonna knock Jake Paul out
and they're like, no, he actually can't move. But it
(56:14):
was so Mike Tyson's so crazy, you just assumed and
I kind of did too. They're like, I can see
him knocking them out. And then you're like five minutes
into the fight, as it's trying to stream, you're like, hey,
he's got no shot. And if it is true, the
Val Kilmer was really difficult to work with. I miss
some of just stars, whether it's athletes, whether it's musicians.
(56:36):
I mean, think about how many musicians. Some of the
stories that are famous of guys just like burning down
a hotel room or just doing things that you know
Ozzy Osbourne, like blowing a line of fire, ants biting
off birds heads. Kind of missed those days of just
(56:57):
no clue what's happening with just superstars in whatever entertainment industry.
It feels like we've kind of gotten boring that way,
which is understandable. There is more money than ever on
the line for all these human beings, so it's like,
be on your best behavior. Be on your best behavior
is kind of boring entertainment. So if al Kilmer truly
(57:18):
was Rip a wild card to deal with, he was
clearly pretty talented. Now what was he? A star like
Scottie Pippen Jordan disappeared like bulls weren't win the title.
Could Val Kilmer carry the movie as the star? Probably not.
It's not really his thing. It's definitely not what he
excelled at. Now, maybe he'd say I never got the
right role, and maybe that's true, but you could argue
(57:40):
he is definitely of his era the greatest supporting actor,
and honestly, it might not even be close. It might
not even be close. He's kind of like the Scottie
Pip in Hollywood in the nineties. The volume
Host
John Middlekauff
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