Killer Mike | Ep. 141 | ALL THE SMOKE Full Episode | SHOWTIME Basketball

ALL THE SMOKE rolls on, Matt and Stak are joined by rapper, actor and social activist, Killer Mike to chop it up. Killer Mike opens up about his rap journey, including his early career hits with OutKast. Plus, he discusses his acting career and his social activism. 

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:05):
M hm m hm. Welcome back to another edition of

(00:26):
All the Smoke. Jack's been a good day, man. We've
had some some good guests, some great conversations, and we
get to finish it off strong. Oh you're Mike. Great
way to finish it. Lame it on the weed, not
his heart. That's right. We got a special guest man
fresh off Coachella. Uh, someone we look up to, UH
learn a lot from and it's an honor to have

(00:47):
him sit down on this couch with us. Man, kill
the Mike. Welcome to the show. Bro. Yes, let the
boy take you too. Seriously, it's my birthday. Fault twining off. Yeah,
we got him a haircut in here, you know what
I mean. We took here and you know you came,
You came and got pamper. We want to take care
of you. Forward to man, what y'all did for me today.
My goal is to take to every NBA arena. Man.

(01:10):
We have a swag shop, you know what I mean,
and it's blossoming and Stay Farm arena. But I want
to be in all of them. I want to be
in Dallas. Talk to us what that explained to people
aren't familiar what that is? Well, usually you know, as
a man, you go to barbershop. That's the one hour
a week it belongs to you if you're a hip woman,

(01:30):
because a lot of women come and get the eyebrows,
get their face. That's the place where you ain't got
to worry about argue in which points of who's shoving
into now, because you're coming in there, you running the floor.
Like so, barbershop is a special kind of culture. Really
is a country club of working class man. And I
thought that you should be shave Washington groom there total
you know. So me and my wife started barbershop about
nineteen years ago near the Atlanta Airport. It grew to

(01:51):
Edgewood Avenue, which, like the bar Dish in Atlanta, got
invited to gore and stay farm. Now I aim is
to make that forty five minutes the one hour a
week you get just about you come in listening to
dope music, get a shot, get a straight raye shaver,
hot tiger on your face. You and your son come in.
Add to the culture. Next week you might have a
T shirt with something you said on it. You know,
do the problem with you. It is made fun the

(02:12):
people by the people there. We we gotta buy later. Yes,
we got some cusho and ensure people too, so just
so we go, oh yeah, you gotta hear the cushat
some boys. You gotta do some cushot. We'll give you
tick because you're a guest, but we know we'll do
it after. We gotta get on. Put you good with

(02:34):
you good shouts out of the big ball, low back now. Man.
But the shop, the shop is so so successful, man,
you know, I live in Atlanta. It shot so successful
that motherfucker's tried to vandalize it and tried to shut
it down just because it was doing so much business
and was appreciated so much by the community. They tried it. Well,
Ama go on saying the devil state business young man. Unfortunately,
man who's played with mental illness and he um, he

(02:55):
just kind of cracked the kind of fixated on me
and a couple other people. But you know, I just
pray for him. But really, you know, I really pray
for him because the community didn't appreciate it, you know,
and he not as melanated as we are, so he
kind of stand out in the crowd. I wouldn't want
that to happen to him. We just mentioned you just
came back from Coachella. What was that experience? Like, Man,
we haven't been up for three years. We have been

(03:16):
on post. We are when I say we are in
a roup group, some people don't know. So it took
me two years become overnight success. And I just say
that because a lot of times a player, you might
go to a team you don't want to be with.
But you build something in your team and change something
your character. It grow you that journey. Then you might
peeve it and get traded someone else. So you might
bring a championship there and change the culture that My

(03:37):
career was like that. I came out in a real
big way without cans and a lot of great things
happening early, and then I chose are going to independent
around So about two thousand eleven, I met a guy
named LP, guy named Jason DeMarco put us together. Um
he was at the Cartoon Network at the time where
adults whim. He put us in a room together. You
just say, man, y'all should be working. And it turned
out to be like putting ice Cube in a room

(03:59):
with Chuck the in the Bombs card. You know what
Chuck saying? You know you should work with the Bombs
Card and me and A L created an album called
Rap Music. This is a tenth year that record came out.
That record changed the trajectory of my career. You know.
The year before that, I had a song called Rick
Flair and Rolling Stone that was like top fifty songs
of the year, and I was like, man, you gotta
keep pushing. That year that album hit and then hit

(04:22):
in a way like like this is another killer Mike.
It's not just a guy who is a protege of
one of the greatest rap roots in the world. This
is something new. Right after that, LP and I decided
to do essentially what was the mixtape called Run the
Jews one. Running Jules one put us in rooms. What
we were doing three to five people, but it was consistent.
Then all of a sudden, over a couple of months
and three to five hundred turning eight hundred to thousand.

(04:45):
You go back, you do Rund the Jews two, and
now you're Mound Juice and Running Jus four brings us
to opening for Raging and Some Machine for their reunion tour,
which you take us through April of next year, has
us on in mid day at Coachella UM both weekend,
and it has us marching back out in our own
solo shows and festival and well due shows and festivals.
And then ten years after rap music and ten nine

(05:07):
years after former you know, Run the Jewels were one
of the most tour bands in the world, and it's
just amazing, you know what I mean. So I'm blessed
happy to be here. And that's why Folks is gonna
be a lot more internal with me because we got
Coachell after this in a few days. Beautiful. You mentioned
during your set we need to change this country. Can
you elaborate on that we do. We don't have to
fight twenty years to progress two years, so there are

(05:29):
certain things that we could do, you know, with everyone
right now raving Oh, the Biden administration is a potentially
going to get fed on decriminalization of marijuana. Sanders would
have did it in a strugle pin by taking it often.
And we need to start insisting that people that we
vote for our support from a local level up. So
I see a president's name because they get your attention.

(05:51):
Who's your prosecutor, who's your mayor going to appoint police chief,
who's your city councilperson who's running for Senate right now
in Atlanta? You know, in terms of George who's running
for Centing? Who are you gonna support? And why you
know what I'm saying, you gotta start saying this. Who's
running for lieutenant governor? Everyone knows that camping Abrams are
probably gonna fight it out November. This who's gonna be like?

(06:12):
But we have a young man running for lieutenant governor
named Kwamie and I mean Quansa. I'm sorry, Quansa is
running and Quansa wants to decriminalize instantly. He's for a
more progressive marijuana stands. But what does that matter? Like,
you get to smoke anyway? You rich? You nobody tripping? Yeah,
but more than smoke. Country folks got land. You might
have fifty acres, you might have a hundred acres. We

(06:34):
might have four acres between us. That qualifies us to
get government grants and laws considerations to start growing himp.
So if I never get high again, I'm still gonna
need some hemp ro. I'm going to the the time my
boat at the fishing port. You know, I'm still have
the opportunity to make money. So we should be focused
on those things and we should be pushing the line
on this thing. So when I say this country needs
to change, we can get fast about our ship. You

(06:54):
know when I'm where I'm from, if all people told
you do something, you got about the business doing it.
Fin what switch got hit to you? Then you might
have to walk and get the switch. And what I'm
saying the black cooke is and working glass people period.
You need to start requiring the pace that your grandparents
required of you when you were a child growing up

(07:15):
in the South. From the skeeper's bitch. And if you
don't know what I'm talking about, called somebody country into
we don't have to wait. We live in a country
where the states still kills people, and often times we
figure out it's wrong. So I'm just saying, until we
get that perfected, let's not kill people, no matter the crime.
And trust me, there are people I feel like should
be dead. But a man in South Carolina gets to

(07:36):
choose whether he dies by a lecture chair or firing
s card, and he chose firing s card. We have
a record call letter to the firing card. What would
you say to them? And that record? I challenge you
all to go listen to it's a great record. I
think y'all find some solids and peace in it. But
I thought about this two thousand twenty two man. And
it's a man sitting here deciding, you know, if I'm
gonna die by a lot of people say, oh my, well,

(07:56):
that's right there, you know, that's that's But man, it's
someone and I family has done something terrible, somebody you love.
He's done something terrible enough to die for. About other cultures,
they have things, and It'slam. You could die for the
things of Christianity you've died for. Look at the siw
You died in Christianity. You hadn't even committed no sins,

(08:17):
you know. He just protested banks and seeing human beings,
a boy the state. So when you start to really
think about our country, how christian we claim to be,
how tolerant we claimed to bring, how liberal we claim
to be. If you hold it up against the mirror,
you can you can say we probably need to change
things by ourself. And I love, you know, I love
the country I've you know, my people have been a
cornerstone to be on this country. So you talk about
me going to Frederi Dugald's high school and understanding the

(08:38):
importance of that makes me very proud to be a
part of the lantage of this country. But doesn't mean
we can't do better immediacy. Let's go talk about the Atlanta. Yeah,
you're growing up in a TIL. I've been living in
a Til. It's when it's something pleasures. I didn't grow
up there, but it's home now. I love the city.
But tell, but tell, talk to us about the Lanta
of your brain. Man. You know how you on your press,

(09:00):
your media runs. You know you from me where you're from,
so you go on your meteor and you think everybody everything.
I didn't realize being Southern was major difference, and I
didn't realize being Atlanta, you know, intensify something difference. Tell
us a lot of a lot of folks in the South,
they don't they don't, they don't bother with won't make

(09:20):
people to accept them. They accept themselves. And I don't
mean across color, right, And we want my grands about
your color. You're kind of He knew who he was.
He didn't care what you thought on you know, and
if if you insisted too much, you was gonna get
some pushed back. My grandmother they say when she was
a girl, she preferred working in the field. She didn't
want to be nobody's cooking stuff. But I realized how

(09:41):
much we meant to when I realized she cooked for us.
You know, so she said, I have a responsibilities children.
But I grew up in the neighborhood kind of car
your Heights. It was found in the nineteen forty six
by black people for black people. Everybody lived there. Dr
King's parents to working class folks like my grandparents. And
what I learned was when Dr King said the content

(10:01):
of your character, I really understood it because my grandparents
and the people who lived around me didn't give me
a booget man to be afraid. You know. Now, we
knew we were competing because we got told. You know, y'all,
I didn't have three white teachers in my whole life.
That's how black my world was. So we got told
very early. You know, their kids in North full thing.
You know it's called for wife, and they're there right now.

(10:23):
They're not playing in their classroom. So we have a
sense of honor about being when I say we you know,
I went to school with n n C A Champion
U C L A Cameron Dollar now coaches and Seat
don't want school. Stanley Pritchard played for Miami Dolphin, Atlanta Falcons.
Robert Hicks, my best friend, says kind of going. I
played with Buffalo Bills, get past off of Athletics Chief

(10:46):
Judge Arser Jackson and the cav County Dean rah and
be Yard Georgia tech like I went to school some
heavyweight man, but we were just working class kids. But
we got a healthy sense of being competent and confident
really early. So for me, when I blossomthing got out
in the world, I didn't realize how black folks didn't
grow up like that, and I didn't realize the world

(11:07):
and operate like that. So it took some adjusting for me.
Once I started getting famous, I guess and started moving around.
But it's been cool. It's been a cool ride. Man.
I appreciate Drey and being you change in my life
because I got into Moorhouse, stupidest thing I could have done.
Drop out, and then I found myself, you know, looking
around working at all those are like ship I fucked

(11:28):
up and toying, you know, in particular big Boy Champion
to me, to Dre and Regina Davenport, who was like
the product manager at the time. They gave me an
opportunity to change my life and the ride started, and
I've been on a twenty year run thanks to mentorship
with people like Pamp and Bunn, you know, Balling g.
I just want to show a lot of reverence for
people like you know, Tony Draper, j Prince, Like it's
a whole history of when people say, Mike you small,

(11:51):
You're not like southern Southern. I was kind of country
ship they say this. I think that's it's almost assulting
because I didn't grow up under the tutelage of some
of the greatest people, like you know. I challenge people
just man, go back and listen to old Southern discographies,
like the music has been one hunting. You've been getting
lessons in the music, like the ship you for sucking
around and learn listening to you know, even at that time,

(12:12):
like what too Short was saying on right, too Short
saying be about your money like a million you know,
even one from the South. It was linked. The Bay
Area was linked. I just think I think the South
and you know, the Third Coast movement of that so
had a lot of do putting me here. You know.
I love the music, love my upbringing. Just proud to
be here today. Probably stone and talking a little long.
But how was it growing up with young parents? Man?

(12:35):
Thank god they didn't raise me. I tell them, yeah,
I told that later that thenice, I told it all
the whole. On the other side, listen, y'all kids out
there sucking many slow down, man and show you a lot.
Going to say, stay child as long as you can.
I my dad would say, say, you know he's child.

(12:56):
Put you back ten years find you know, man, So
you have to you know, I said I messed around.
My dad had folk children. I did the same thing.
I ain't mad, but the amount of work I've had
to do to support him, and the time it took
away from him. Like I'm bringing all my kids out
the Coachella for the first time this week, the youngest
when he is fifteen years old. Her name is Michael.

(13:16):
And then I have a son named pony Boy he's
twenty years have a twenty four year old daughter named
a nine year boy. Leave. Okay, you know the thing
about it is you you get to working so hard
you you missed part to the growth. So that's why
I just want to tell young men out there that
birth control by see if see if you can get
on County services, get yourself for free. Ye out here

(13:38):
to tell you, boy, they would have control. Whatever was
ship out of it A fucking fucking yeah. The game
a billionaire what you're talking about touched the billion right now. Man,
I don't pay the half a million, so I know
that light wunning for you. I might pass out. I
did a half I got five girls, two boys expensive,

(14:01):
so I know you. Oh my god, please don't remind me.
Make to That's that's the whole that's the that's the
whole downfall there. Yeah, man, you can't get Yeah. I
will say this, though we we understand the tactical advantage
to the advantage, when when we be advantaging. You know,
you know were I told my daughter my daughter ex

(14:22):
boyfriend told him. I liked them both kids, but you
know his child. You know, you don't never think he's
gonna last. Were you telling me they're gonna last? Because
usually don't, but you're gonna remain friends. But I told him,
I said, hey, man, I say now, I'm gonna tell
you she in a great situation because she got me.
She got a auntie. She gotta love it. Mama, Grandma,
I say you messed around and get a pregnant, she's
gonna be straight. I'm gonna here to tell you know,
she don't get pissed because you got good health. And

(14:44):
if y'all ain't you gonna go down there, she's gonna
put your ass on the You know, I talked to
like a plate like a home water, don't you know?
So he Thank god they didn't ever do that. But
you know, I tell my children, stay my child as
long as she can. I don't before you have because
my parents were sixteen and nineteen when I was born,

(15:05):
and my grandpa my grandparents were fifty four and forty four,
and thank god my forty for your grandmother wanted another child,
so I was just hers. By the time my mom married,
I have two dads. I'm blessed with two fathers. By
the time she married my second father, you know, and
my grandmother just told him go figure out how to
be a wife, and I'm gonna raise him. And then

(15:25):
when my sisters were born, she actually my sisters be
heaver to be raised me. So we've been on our
grandparents all right. We had an RV. We got to
go to Florida and Tennessee. We gotta going to church trips.
You know. Our mama, man, she was you know, she
was young and working. We was like, man, thank god,
we have to be you know, we wanted to last.
Key to nothing. My grandfather asked my grandmother, she was
a nurse. This is a lot of women. I'd be

(15:45):
hearing all of the arguments on online. But all my
teachers were married to working class man. So all my
teachers had degreed but to me, and they were married
to with plumbers and carpenters and locksmith owners and stuff.
My grandmother was a nurse. My grandfather troll dump trumps,
which was good money. You know, you're driving trucks and whatnot.
But I just want to encourage us, you know, do that,
do some of that, you know, look outside your level

(16:06):
or whatever I mean, because my my my grandmother could
read right. My grandfather was functionally literate and could count
any money just spread on the table. So they balanced
each other well. But I remember when he came to it,
he said, hey, you know, and this is like we
watched no fall. This is when the crack era was
starting exploding. She said, I want I want you here.
When the kids come out of school, I don't want you.

(16:27):
I don't want you gone. And she did that until
we were old enough to kind of see after ourselves.
But I really kind of learned a lot from them,
and I'm glad at all I saw that. Because my
parents were so young. My my dad's might say, yah,
y'all really was good at was sucking and fighting, that's
what y'all did. But my grandparents, I got a chance
to see two people statement, but beyond the stability. I

(16:47):
got the chance to see people tease each other, disagree
with each other, but love each other every night, you know,
love each other. And they were united, you know. Whatever
you asked, my grandfather wasn't talk to my wife about
it first, even if he had his mind made up.
You know what, I'm just gonna tell the hey, this
what I decided. You were never gonna get them, you know, ununified.
And I've tried to model my own life and marriage

(17:08):
has that. I tried my wife like this wee Sunday.
I tried when the music coming to play, nine years old,
sat Boys run DM seed cool Ruky not what you know.
I'm fat. I'll talk on man, Man, I remember, man,
I missed the fat human man. I saw a little
I couldn't break that. I couldn't figure out the back spin.

(17:30):
I was like, fun, this ship I ain't rerun, so
I said, man, I could probably do that cool rock
ski though, but when I've seen running, I've seen run.
Don see though, man black down them suits which which
run the jewels. We rocked them black denim suits and
I'm chained and they looked like like what I was
liking outside. I was like, that's it. That that was it,

(17:51):
and just the whole depth day and run with what
they was able to do. When they wrote out l
cool man curse blowing stuff, I looked at like my
mom stuff, so like all the Pepper curse blow Hudini
my mom was. She was like she was a hustle
like her home girls, the fly girls. She listened that.
But when it came to light, just that stuff that
was that ain't ohay. He was hitting there withssy. That
was just like, man, it's me. And then when I

(18:12):
heard six in the morning, I was like, this is
like I six in the morning police had my door
Freshda squeaking across the bathroom floor out my back windows
where I made my skate, when I was like the
funk like it was a movie and end up of
course iced T and then when I heard a Cube

(18:34):
and then the greatest rapper all times, scar Face when
I heard Brad Jordan's changed, like like what he encompasses
is an MC is so underappreciated in terms of he's
had a year Chris has eight seven and never dropped
the Wag album, Like not even debatable. You know what
I'm saying. When you are in scarface, you are in

(18:55):
scarface against Scarface. I've argued with scar Face about what
is his most classic album. We argued over that, like
he said, you know one work and I'm like, no
funk that you got this recketivity, laughing, like how are
you gonna he's I'm a fan, but what he what
he was able to do. I used to battle tapes,
me and my me and my boy mark Man and
Rico and Kim just to listen to the j Prince

(19:17):
and trolls five times the rest of the tape place
the wisdom he was getting, you know what I'm saying.
So as a kid just hip hop at nine years old,
I got turned on to it. By time I was
too I turned out it was it was what I
was about. I was gonna be a rapper. I was
gonna figure that out. Yeah, me being from Texas to
I know how important scar faces not telling me so

(19:37):
to the rap culture, but to us, you know, he
definitely the guard you know, the Golden Port in Texas.
I mean as far as rapping. So many rappers that
come up now to to this day that's way younger
than him. If you asked them who was the man
in Houston, They're all gonna praise one first. You know
what I'm saying, Brad Jordan, And now you're going to
listen to all your top the people you call your

(19:59):
goats have all nodded to him. It's nodded to him.
Drey and Big dalcast and added to jay Z is
not a to him, like like man the stuff him
Ja and bean Z Like. I think that that every
generation should always be reminded to go back and listen
to Brad the same way you may know col Trane,

(20:19):
but you have to be reminded sometimes go back and
listening to that love of Supreme so you really understand
like what jazz can do. You know, go back and
listen to someone. These moms go back and go back
and remember that it's a culture. It's not just the moment.
It's not just hot now. There is literally a culture.
Boy Meets a Girl man that that record. My wife,
me and her ride sometimes and she plays it like

(20:40):
we ride sometimes we're writing her beans we play. We'll
play on some Sinatra, we'll play some Dean, you know,
we'll play something that we we played, trying to play
some alternative stuff besides just what you're hearing on radio
or what even I'm doing. And she'll always on the
ride back play that Boy Meets Girls, essentially about a
strip on the deep one talking about cocaine and heir man.
But it's such a beautiful story, Shakespearean like the way

(21:03):
he tells it, you know what I mean. And so
I think this as an mc man, he's he's like
high art and fine literature even musically what he's on
in terms of producing, in terms of you know, we
know Mike Dean and many of us for the sound.
He's helped Kanye Cray, Mike Dean. Also the co craft
of that corner stone with that rapp list sound was

(21:23):
when he and Face when they're doing together. So you
even hearing face. In my opinion, you know his his
reaching going even beyond lyricism and it's just producing and sound. Yeah.
I got a two or three songs with him. That's fun,
Like maybe two days in studio with him just picking
his brain. And then we shot the video. And when
we shot the video by the Donald Sterling, it's face

(21:44):
so nobody want to speak by the time, but he
pulled it out. We're gonna do it. You're back to player.
We're gonna speak on it. But he dope. Man, don't
you touched on earlier about attending more House. What was
that experience like? And hel come it didn't last that long.

(22:06):
I was the most beautiful, beautiful, beautiful time in my life.
Man on a Bassador andrewyan Form, Mayor of Atlanta, man
creating in scholarship to me here and then all I
had to do was read his autobiography and get inspired
by and I did it, told him what I thought
about it, and he and his former wife on his
current wife's Carol. His former wife is um She the

(22:27):
late Jean child Young who taught my mother and mentor
me and was just an amazing human being. As as
his andy. They made sure I got him more house
um nat and working my butt off and getting my
grays up. My founier year high school and I met
the Ceel Reddick there, who's half of the Peat Buddies
who produced Kryptonite, who introduced me the Big Boys. I
was supposed to be there, you know. I met friends

(22:49):
I've had for life there. But I knew after the
first year that I was like, this is not what
I want to do. Not that I didn't want to
graduate more because I promised with my grandmother I would
and I still am, but I was like, I don't
want to be doing this now. I really want to
be in the music industry. There was so much opportunity
growing in Atlanta at that time. You got Eric Sermon
down there who tang like. I had a store down there, too,

(23:10):
Short was living. It was just opportunity was everywhere, just
so I was like, man, I'd rather go about the
beings and figure it out. The dumbest decision I could have,
I ended up getting a record of the same yea
I would have graduated, you know what I mean. So
I encourage your brothers, and if you're in there just
sticking there, you know, and if you can't get in
there yet, just go to trade school, spending may teen
months in there, come out making top dollar and still go.

(23:30):
You know what I'm saying. But I just, um, I
really dropped the ball and making that decision. But you
know I'm stubborn this ship. So once I made a decision,
I wasn't gonna quickly. Yeah, I wasn't gonna let nobody
to tell on my grandmama. I told you so. Now.
So she got a chance to call all her friends
and said, I told you so, and so you see
my baby. He got a grammy baby he got You
can come see it if you want to, you know

(23:51):
what I mean. That made me feel good, you know
what I mean, because I know she called some ship
for that one. From definitely first impression of big boy
and man these names rich they had, Alexis Man, he
had Alexis got there rut that all I don't want
d D had a cat like first we had like
a land cruiser or some ship. Don't he have nickels

(24:13):
wearing the fucking Jordan's like niggas one just these niggas
rich man, like God, damn these niggad rich. But you
know getting it. I really, man, I'm gonna tell you
what I really when I really my thoughts are like
Dre was. Dre was arts as fun, he was kind,
he was humble, He's very intuitive. He was a good

(24:33):
person in his intent, you know what I'm saying. But
you could you could tell he was like an only child.
So he went with two munch of all the hanging
ship like he would hang out. But then he'll be
like Batman, he'll fading out, he'll goes out of sithing,
you know what I mean. So you ended up being
around big in terms of studio and business more and
you gotta I got a chance to see, like, oh, Ship,

(24:55):
this is what it's like to be young and lead,
you know what I mean? Like because he he had
an opportunity to lead, and he stepped up in terms
of business. He got business I think before a lot
of us did. And was it was a dog kunnel
or now having trailers for movie production and stuff. I
was always impressed with his maturity from a business standpoint.

(25:16):
Both of them were genius. His money because Trey's mother
goblins and dead and Sharon Benjamin was just an incredible woman.
And you know it took one mishout or some tax stuff,
and they they both tell the story going on the run,
getting that money up on you know, and never you know,
falling um in a rearge of any type. And it
was because Trey's mom was just a genius about making

(25:37):
sure that business were taken care of and I watched
her to do that, and I watched big when you
went to a hell of a businessman. So I've always
been It's like Jamal Mashburn, like a lot of people
can play basketball, a lot of people made a lot
of money, but Jamal, watching his interviews, seemed to have
called early that there this is gonna end one day,
and I should be playing some seeds right now that
are gonna grow. So I've always been impressed by that.

(25:58):
And from an artistic standpoint, just outc asks as a
collective man, I've always been impressing. I've used it in
terms of being a member around the Jewls with don't
let ship define you, like I remember Bunning calling me
telling me one day, like the beauty of what y'all
boys have is is undefinable, So do whatever the fun
y'all want. Y'all ain't got to be locked in the sound.
And that's what I learned from watching Trey and Big together.

(26:18):
And I got a chance to watch them together from
e t Elliens forward and and and seeing the way
they worked. It's just been amazing. And I'm like everybody else,
like I want to see Outcasts tour like the rollers
dollars for the next thirty or forty yells and so
I want to be able to take my kids the
Outcast concert. I pray. All you can do is as
a fan. I hope they did it for us a

(26:38):
few years ago. So you know, maybe again Big Big
not just doing dogs. He got alls now, yeah he
got he got I think he got tigers. Um, he
got like eighty thousand all of French bulldogs. Like yeah,
like he was here. Let's see it. Seeing ahead of
the curb around the corner is an understatement, especially, yeah,
eighty thousand all the dolls I paid it, thou all

(26:59):
they better have a motor, you know, yeah, for free
the whole world. You want to grant me for that?
How did your life change after? That? Took some anxiety off,
Like if I'm ever win one, because I want one,
and I know I wrapped my ass off, like that's
my type. Like if I've just been like on in
the background, Oh you know what I'm saying now, I wrapped,
I still it off my mother. I was in the game,

(27:22):
so but I want more. Man, I didn't run the
Jewels deserved, So that's that's my focus now, Like has
run the Jewels, you know, it's killing Mike. What am
I gonna do? But that decision to stay in the
studio that and that night showed me anything as possible.
When you went to work, everybody was went to the
strip club, I think I think everybody was hanging out,
and Big was like, um, you might want to hang

(27:42):
around and see about getting on Nelson because I seen
somebody else was scheduled to get on it. Maybe maybe
give or something. And I hung around. I dropped the
first and when when they came back, they told me
they was keeping it and something else is supposed to
be the single. And then they called and told me
it was gonna be the single. When Brian Barber shouts
out to Brian shot the video and life haven't been
the same since. And I can say with the ups

(28:03):
and the downs, you know, I've always there's always been
somebody at the front of a restaurant that remembered the video.
They're like me and you know so well. I was
up a dial Yah. You had a chance to be
on Blueprint too with j C. How was working? How
was it working with old Man? I can honestly say
I love of God Man whole solid as they come
in terms of the times I've dealt with him because

(28:24):
I appreciate the way he's dealt with me. He's never
dealt with me as over. You've never been kind of sending.
I remember after we did the verses on the Blueprint.
I remember he called being on the bus sage, I
want you to jump on this record with me, and
Big said, well, you don't know if Drada he said, no,
I want you on the young boy you got over
that might do something. So I was like I heard.
I was like, oh ship. I just went to the

(28:44):
whatever the flip thing was at the time I just
started writing. You know, that was when I still wrote
the verse is probably double that. I just used the
sex and Night had and Shantadas took me up to
meet and chopped it up. Wouldn't want me to the
studio chopped up, and I was like, I got the bird.
I dropped it. When I get back to Atlanta. Did
In in Atlanta popped up It's on there. But we
were in MTV and I've seen him coming a whole

(29:07):
bunch of people around him, you know, and he's not
like you know, fans stuff, just the people in the
office fanning out like it's hold in the building. And
I was just learning a while, I don't want to ball,
and he said, oh, you ain't gonna speak to me,
and I'll put you on my record and everything. One
of the funniest moments of my life. Man, you know
what I'm saying, because you know, I would imagine it's
like a vet when you were rookie. You know what
you're coming out of You're gonna talk to you. I

(29:29):
was just overcome with with with you know, with with
graciousness for him. He's always been like that, you know
what I mean. So I just I like hold of
a lot. I really respect him a lot. I respect
I respect the inspiration he's given other people to become business.
After winning a Grammy working with Hole, you dropped your
studio Albumster in two thousand three. When you dropped the album,

(29:51):
you feel like you had already made it. No no, no, no, no,
no no, because this isn't you know. I went old,
this is in the air on people selling Timillion record.
I had flopped. But that's what a guy named David
the Globia records tell me about the profit and laws.
She showed me that I had actually profited, and Bunna
hit me and say, that's a good thing. You don't
want to be in the law section. It was the

(30:11):
labor the alley it this way. So bunn really walked
me through a few years of trying to end deciphon
this to it. I want to stay on a major label?
Do I want to? So by the time he came around,
I think Virgin made an offer winch Ams over there.
I walked away from the offer. I think they was
offering me like a hundred and twenty thousand all advanced
and a charger at the time or something right, And
I think I pressed the line on about the charge

(30:32):
to get a nigga call to you the lead with
the boy gotta got a call, you know, sound like
trying like I've seen the other lead. But they did it.
But I really didn't want the deal. And I remember
Bear coming to me every day like Mike and they
offering you, like, you know, they put another third or
fourth on what they was on for you listen, and
I was like, I just didn't want it. And I
was like, I think I'll do better doing it this

(30:53):
other way. Now, I didn't know the other way it
was gonna turn into the lyard. She was a fucking Greek,
fucking illage, you know. Just I didn't know I was
gonna lose people to death. I didn't know one of
the first grind time producers gonna get life in prison.
You know. I didn't know that friends was gonna show
themselves to be folds. I don't know I was gonna
lose you know, I fall out with my friends who

(31:15):
had changed my life with a record deal and take
years to me. I didn't know all that. Like, but
I can say coming out the other side and the
opportunity to repair those friendships, get an opportunity to grow
as a leader, to to grow beyond what you think
abouts is, to really bet on myself and win, and that,
you know, to have the pleasure to tell him, you know,
one of my trusted attorneys and my friend who says, man,

(31:36):
I couldn't believe you walked away from hunting and saying saying, yeah,
that's about what I get on the date. Then I'm like,
so I turned away from a show him being proud
of saying I'm glad you had afforded to to do
it because it's scary. Man. You know it's scary and
it's not all you know. I'm not one to say
the labels are bag. I heard gonna say something incredibly

(31:59):
intelligent man, and he's a smart kid, but you get
sold so so used to just handle jam Is. It's
a pleasure for me to see him do interviews because
he's a brilliant kid. Him thug savage, like brilliant kids Atlanta.
Sometimes you'll be so busy jam and you don't really
realize you're listening to a brilliant mind too. But Donal
was like, man, you look at the label when you're
talking to Lebron, it's like you're looking at like a

(32:19):
partnership that's taking a risk on YouTube. And now the
artists have gotten more savvy in terms of getting their
masters back and things of their nature. Now lawyers are
bullying up for that. But with on Lebron said, you know,
you come to the rookie, you take the work of contracts,
say it after them three years you will make him dump.
You were in dunk truck. And that's that's that's the
type of certain type of confidence in yourself, you know.
And I had that confidence again. I didn't know what

(32:40):
was gonna take for years or two, but man, I
wouldn't trade it because of the wisdom of my game.
And on the other side of the person than human being,
I am is it's much more stable with what I
have than I would have been at that time. Where
did your love music come from? Whould like do? Who?
Did you autilize you face? Terms of I wanted to
be chante in terms of my love for music, though

(33:04):
that's just come from being Southern mina grandmother would take
us to these small and Pentecostal churches. Ain't got no
ac condition. But the rhythm sections, the same hym section
that were playing in the club the night before, you know,
the same folks is playing at the gambul And house.
Your grandfather got you here with the shot house. So
I fell in love with blues and gospel first because
that's what I heard, because that's what they played. And

(33:26):
then I fell in love past blues and gospel. I
started listening like Big Man Chance things of that nature.
But my mom when my mom left, when my grandmother,
I'm living with my grandmother, and my mom left me
a record collection like Curtis Mayfield, Osley Brothers, you know,
Schaft sound track, Superflies. She just left and she just
showed me, you know how how to put it on.

(33:47):
And I just sit in the dark room and just listen,
listen and still do. So, you know, music is it's
just in my bones, just what it's what you do,
whether you're cleaning up, whether you're getting around, moving around,
you know. Just usually if I get up the first
I'm gonna play some gospel of some blues and we
get the rap by now Jack got to shoot him up,
Bang bang, going to six G K yes t G.

(34:12):
That's gospel. I mean blues. I've been get to my
pimp you I live, YEA know about PIMPC Then, man,
how we call with the name killer Mike, I did
the name giving me. I would have been like fly
fat Boy. I was battle rapping and dude ain't double

(34:33):
d stood up after I went through about like ten
of them dudes. Just like man, these kids are killing
say Mike's a killer, and then next week I can't
kill at New York, dudes called me killer killer Mike.
That was it. I've been obviously, I figured I earned it,
so you might as keep it. Yeah, it's not who
is double D? Double D's a DJ, some famous DJA. Yeah,

(34:55):
that's all about that. Yeah. Then ran through all the
strip clubs and then lit them up. Man being one
of the most famous names DJ in the last thirty
years in that city. We got great DJ from funky DJ,
Cutt Matter Swift whose outcast official DJs my home. What
we got Man? We got two many name DJ who
created with t I b High but tumping t I

(35:15):
created the trap scenes. The DJ is very important from
old Miami culture of course, Memphis culture of course, DJ
screw Houston culture, texts culture like the DJ is still
very important in the South. Street Man, come on with
the legend my friend, my real friend Street to call
you at five in the morning to give your life advice.

(35:36):
Fishing Man, rest in peace. Yeah, I'm glad I sent
him that verse Man back in December when he wanted it. Man. Yeah,
what pushed you to joint Tan Grand Hustle? No way,
that's my friend, Man, and I just you know how
you been on your your asked for a minute, you
start to get up. You're like, man, if I could
scale up a little bit, I can do a little better.

(35:56):
So him and Jason g I just asked, manuse do
some distribution through y'all. I need some help. And Man,
I remember telling to like, man, I wish I did
this ship a few years ago, and he was like, shoot,
all you had to do was asks. And that's really
what I started to really understand that you have advocans
and the allies in the closed mouth don't get fans.
So if you need something and you know you can

(36:17):
do the job, just as you know what I mean.
And and Tip has been a friend over twenty years
at this point, but that really taught me, you know
what I mean, if you need man actual friends. How
cool is it to get your pistol on your fist
gesture in the Marvel Comics art talk about that? He said,
I laughed forever twelve years old. Man, I believe in

(36:39):
keeping that Twitter. You know that twelve thirteen. I'm sure
at one point you didn't know if you like basketball, toys, girls,
comic but you know what the funk you like the
most You're just like all these things like my fire,
So really for it with the comics is like that
for me, for me like to be featured man and
there for like, get the funk out of here. Man,
it's like you want to go back and here the

(37:00):
twelve you eight, all this ship canna work out. Yeah,
the girl with the big teed you're gonna marry her.
The comic you're gonna be an. So it's just a
twelve y'all happy. Yeah, you touched out a little bit more,
But I want to elaborate. You talked about going on

(37:20):
tour with Rage and me will start wind Man. That
starts we out of here in June. Okay. Yeah, we're
gonna go over to London, I think, do ten eleven
dates over there and in Europe, and then come back
over here, take the continual the United States by Storm,
take a break in the winter, then get back on
there and go through next April to be a whole year. Yeah,
beautiful and thank man, Thank Rage Man. You know, they
one of the greatest bands in the world, you know

(37:42):
what I mean. So it's it's comparable to someone saying, well, yeah,
y'all going out and opening prob it's a beautiful thing.
I was put in the position with Georgie, with George Floyd,
I had no idea what I was doing. I wasn't
educated or nothing. But you you one of those people
that I look up to that's always been educated. Always
your mind. But the disition between when you speak, you

(38:03):
know what you're talking about, you know what I mean.
I just I just admired you from that standpoint. I
want to know what was going through your mind doing
that whole process. You ain't ever met me, but we
have text before, the publicist before and you gave me
some some great advice. But what was going through your
mind in the whole time again again again, you know,

(38:25):
again and again and again. You know it's first of all, man,
I think we just I just want to appreciate you
for your transparency to the process. I want to appreciate
you for being willing to stand because you know, people
think a lot of times because you don't speak a
certain way, or you don't know a certain thing, or
you haven't come up through certain channels, you don't have
the right to family. Blu Hamer wasn't taught to speak

(38:46):
in college, But you don't know you know Google Fanily.
You know Reverend James Orange, who's my personal friend and
taught me to organize. Who was played by the brother
olmartin the movie Selman. You know it's who talking persons
student the stock Can taught me to organize. You know,
brother was a brilliant brother man, was a statesman, a
spoken but was salt of the earth Alabama. And I

(39:06):
just say that because you have people like Testling Figura
out there that are working their ass off. She's right
down there in Houston right now. You know, she's Air
Force trained, veteran, yet big and and and and she's
solid to earth and speaking educated. You know, she can
talk up or down. How many you know what I mean?
You know, but the brother Cronk is doing this thing,
but testing them particularly um I look at because she's

(39:30):
a person that we need to be surrounding. Like Debora
in the Bible, we saw talking, she starts talking, we
all need to be paying attention. We all need to
be supporting her. Because the beautiful thing about brothers like
you stepping up and bringing the capital you bring from
being an admired athlete is if you look at this
like wrong, you look at a movie like Gladiator. The

(39:51):
people that are running us. So the people that are
the Caesars and the senators. If you notice they closed,
don't get there. They don't give a fuck, they don't
They are an oligarch. Look that word up. In this country,
we are the people in the stands cheering for you
guys on the behalf of whatever nation state, kill them killing.
We're in Texas killing, We're in Georgia, who runs the
Southeast Conference? All that ship. But oftentimes the oligarchy of

(40:15):
that class tries to get us to forget your individuality.
You're just supposed to be beast in a in a
member of a team that I'm cheering for blood for.
But what you do, what Jim Brown, did you know
what athletes do when they do this is they stand
up and they bring the attention and focus to what
needs to be focused on. And then what we have

(40:39):
to do is what they did in the sixties, what
they did as far back, is wrong, and what we
should be suing now is that after we say our
truth that this is wrong, something must be done about it.
Past that motherfucker like a no. Look to people like
Tesla because she has the facts, just the numbers, and
she's gonna nail their motherfucking as of a cross, because

(41:01):
that's what organizing is. You are a mobilizer. You're supposed
to be there. Your heart and conscious told you to
be there, and you're doing the exact same thing that
Dr King did when he had become so big he
couldn't be there on a weekly meeting every week. That's
what Snick was doing, That's what stokely called Michael John
Lewis was doing. King was going around rallying and making

(41:22):
sure bread was getting bread for the bread basket, making
sure that numbers were up in other places. Still an organizing,
but his part of it was the mobilization of getting
people there. And that's what your presence does, that's what
your voice does, and that's why we need more athletes
to be properly informed by the people who do the
work first. So get informed by your testlin is getting

(41:42):
informed by your organizations that are doing the work. Then
we know what our points are to say us as
athletes and entertainers, we say that, and then we passed
the by all like a no. Look that the people
was supposed to be So I think you did an
amazing job. And now I've always wanted to tell you
that too. You know, you you don't you don't know.
You brought a seriousness to it that didn't allow people

(42:03):
throughout the South to bullshit and people paid attention, you know.
And I say that because what we're from, we've seen
that a lot more a lott than people. You know.
That means that, that means a lot, bro Because like
you know, Bunning bunts up said some of me, some
important words. He's something in text before I went to Minnesota.
He was like, everything you've been through builty for this moment,

(42:24):
and he wanted to talk about brought uthor. He was
talking about the brawl and everything. You know. So just
to hear that from guys like, yeah, who, I look
up to it and a lot absolutely what y'all well
done man and everybody y'all follow testing figure on and
she yeah, she don't take no, she don't say no.
Super ship climbing, y'all need to get on here, y'alla.

(42:45):
She was gonna get on boys podcast. She's yeah. On Instagram,
you said you have you have you feel like you
have to be politically active? Yeah, you say that because
because politics affect now I pay top a lot of taxes.
Don't we pay by having when we're making taxes? So yeah,
already athletes make a hundred million dollars, Like then they
can bring home fifty for himself. You started telling my child,

(43:06):
I support ALAM. Yeah, so because my money pays My
money pays for the suits. So I want to know
what the fun is going on. And I mean that
on a very local level. And you know, the best
news I woke up to last week was to see
the mayor of Andre Dickens, who's from my neighborhood. Um,
that really was a ground swell that brought me over

(43:27):
to support him. Brothers like Zach who got the restaurant
Local Green down there. You know what my man Famou
famous artists down their both friends was like, check this
guy out. Already knew him and loved him as a
city council person, got down with him. I was whiskasine
at first, Casine got knocked out of primaries, gotten hind Andre,
We got on bringing there. The first thing he was
one of the first thing he was doing was taking

(43:47):
care of parks and filling potholes, Like like, you don't
know what that means to a neighborhood, that that really
came out and for years had been acquired peaceful neighbor
with all of a sudden potholes, handing up your grandmother's
man on cousin with the rims man. But he started
to fulfill the promise. You know, he started, and that's
a very little thing, but he said he was gonna
do it. That's a big thing, and he did it.

(44:10):
You know, when I look at our Republican governor who
appointed a Democrat over a committee that is specifically in
charge of making sure that people who are getting out
of prison have basic minimal needs so they're not increasing
the recidivism rate, that program comes directly out of a
black Democratic judge named Asha Jackson went to school of

(44:30):
me Superior Superior Judge UM in the Cab County. That
young woman created a program to direct people out of
jail and through a system over nine or twelve months
that put them back on a course for a solid life.
Got picked up statewide because a Republican saw the value
in it and appointed another black woman. You get what
I'm saying. So for me, it's pragmatic because locally you're

(44:52):
just making deals. You're trying to make it work. But
to make sure the community gets something out of it.
So for me, all politics is local. It's sex. See
the argue of who the president was and who you
think is racist and all that Trump as ship. But
I'm from the South. We've dealt with a lot of races.
You know, Linda Bade Johnson was act but in the
South level, yeah exactly. I believe that locally that some

(45:16):
things can be done that are that are gonna make
places like Jackson, Mississippi, Birmingham, Alabama, Tampa, Florida. When you
start what Jackson, Mississippi, Jacksonville, Florida, I think you can
start seeing those places get more progressive and to become
more equitable in terms of money. And I don't mean
giving nobody no money. I mean giving us contracts. You know,
if if if I don't tend tractor trailers, I can
own a hunter tractor trailers. And if I can home

(45:36):
the toun of tractor trailers, I can get the government
contract and moves oranges up and down Florida's coast. And
why shouldn't it be one of us. We don't lay
it on the farms picking them. Our fathers taught us
how to drive a truck. All we have to do
is be organized enough to have a collective to say, now,
if we make up this percentage of Florida, then these
percentage of truck should behind us. In Georgia the thirty five.

(45:57):
You know, we get less than two percent of the
statewide contracts in Georgia. Now, in my lifetime, i'd like
to see that move to somewhere between seven and a
half of ten percent. But we gotta target those things too.
You know, I put up something on my Instagram last week.
It was a brick and mortar class. All the students
and it were white. So that means we should be
bringing back brick and mortar classes. We should be bringing

(46:19):
back carpentry class and mechanical drafting to school's named out
the book to Washington for school's named after Frederick Douglass.
For school's named after CEO Harper. We have to start
thinking that intent. When they talk about building infrastructure, they're
talking about building highways, they're talking about refurbishing curves and
talking about building roads. Your sons, and I'm talking to
black people right now, can do this work. Look Jr.

(46:40):
May not make the pros, but his strong ass can
lay some concrets and he's gonna get paid a hundred
thousands better for doing it. He's gonna still have be
able to buy you that car. He's gonna be able
to take here of them chilling he made because he
looked like he's dressing like a dope boy. Even though
you're going to drug. He's gonna be able to have
a stable woman and in the house and married at
Girlly had him. He is back, but he's only gonna

(47:01):
do it if we start make sure these boys in
trade schools early six teen. I noticed the other day, Uh,
I follow god name Mr Checkpoint and always the police.
Good dude man talked to us a little bit about

(47:21):
that because he had he was so proud when he
had you. He posted what you said about him on
his thought following this little crazy white white of caliphrazy.
He's crazy at and I mean that in the best
and it's I think maybe his honors grand on her
grandmother would feed the meters when he was younger, though
someone taught him justice early that. You know, citizens do
non't matter what you think of your politicians government. It

(47:42):
is always the government against you to some degree. Well, Mike,
what do you mean by that? The government dude, any
time you get a speeding ticket and they just said
what you We're gonna charge you and pay you for that.
That's not about saving lives and make you slow down.
That's about adding additional taxes to your life. In my opinion,
if we know you gotta part, do you want to
stay building? If I gotta park, they go see us

(48:02):
to my county commissioner, Why do I have to pay?
I already pay taxes. And if you set up a
punitive system that makes me have to pay a hundred
bucks or twenty five bucks even because I didn't feed
it with two dollars, you're making twenty three dollars off
my mistakes. So someone in his life was a justice
warrior and he has turned into one of epay proportions.

(48:22):
He does everything from feed parking meters to ask police
but why they don't have their video camerazon police of
having to literally come up with counter ways. And this
is me, you know, sitting here just like amazed that
he's been able to cause this much routing, this with
just a camera phone, but showing people how unjust the

(48:42):
laws can be. Well not even just the police, the
rule because a lot of times cops don't want you know,
cops just got to write to smoke weed and something.
I think you know a lot of cops that feel
like locking things up. But if you got to make
that quote to keep your job, you gotta make that
quota to keep your job. So from for me, I
see a lot of times it's less about the individual

(49:04):
in the uniform and what the power of the uniform
grants you that unif the states should fear the people
and not the other way around. And right now we
we we we got that turned around, especially in communities
that look like shut up, Mr checkpoint and always always
feel the police check him out. We shouted him out
from the stage and shout two you running Glover and

(49:25):
a former mayor, Andrew Young founded Greenwood, a banking system.
Talked to us how that thought came about and where
you guys currently are with the process when the cards
are rolled out. So if you signed up, your car
is gonna be coming soon, please use it. But in
the fintech world, everybody's everything is coming here. Our kids
listen to music here, my kids. You know it's PayPal,

(49:46):
cash aft and the fintech thing. So Greenwood was a
part of TOAs Oklahoma, where free blacks win. They built
a thriving community themselves, and it was destroyed and encouraged
the destruction by local menis path all these in government.
And it was this bank, in the spirit of doing
for self, created a platform with working class folks, be

(50:08):
you black, Latino, poor, and working class white people. It
gives you an opportunity to have a real banking system
in your hand, to have a real bank account. It's
federally insured. It gives you an opportunity to build credit,
gives you an opportunity. Um they're gonna roll out a
loan system soon. And what it did was Andy went
to India and he got a chance to see instead
of getting paid paper, women get a card to be

(50:30):
paid on, Whereas if they were cashing for paper, they
would have punitive things. Jet cashing places you get charged.
These women, because of the money they saved, were able
to start saving silks, saving fabrics, making garments, just creating
extra income for themselves and lifting themselves out of the
dirt and wretched poverty. And this can happen here if

(50:50):
check cashing places aren't literally swiping and taking, you have
an opportunity to save, to put away money. You have
an opportunity to single mother or young father, the head
of a family, to start to build your credit, to
start to look toward owner ship versus rental. So I
just wanted to be a part of something that actually
helped our people helped themselves. Because you can't save and
charity us out of the whole we're in. There has

(51:12):
to be some real economic interests and viability. That's why
I believe in things like reparations. Whether it be when
do we get them, I don't know, But until then,
what I do know is you can reparate yourself by
spending less than you earn, by focusing on by ownership,
by not having children before you ready, by further in
your education, be that college or trade school, and by
partnering with other people so that you're not taking off

(51:33):
the financial risk yourself. And that's just commons working kind
of ship switching gears. Do you keep up with NBA? Yeah?
I like it, but I've been on the run. Man,
have we been rehearsing? I like my guys. I like
the Hawks. How do you feel about trading hawks right now? Now?
I like trail a lot, I like columns a lot
as well, and they're gonna get out of this series.
If we don't get out of this series, we're gonna
come out wiser and come back stronger. You know. I

(51:54):
think that all. I think that we're gonna become a
better defensive team in the next couple of years. I
think that I think that Atlanta hasn't had a true
superstar um since Dominique. But I also would like to say, man,
I want to tip my hat to a lot of
a lot of old Hawks from you know, Jamal just
got out of there. You know what I'm saying, Like,
man show it's amazing shots, amazing Atlantic and Hawk. So

(52:18):
we've had some We've had a lot of people of
good integrity. You know, Trade sound special, he's crazy, he
can throw that thing from anywhere. He's Yeah, now I agree.
I agree. We met trying to get the right small
for the two card and it's gonna it's gonna go stupid.
And so you do know you you do you know
what you're talking about? Yeah, yeah, y'all, I'll just get
high rounded. Yeah, you said Kobe is your favorite player?

(52:38):
You have any Kobe stories? Okay, so we we till
called me? He said, Hey, I said what's up? He say, fat, Well,
I'm in the studio Kobe up here, Come come come
meet him. I was like, hell, yeah, let's do it
because everybody who knows we know, like I really, man,
I really loved Kobe, you know, really, So I get
my wife with me. Man, you know I'm very attractive
white man. I married married a girl looked like man

(52:59):
piece carrot cake. Man. I mean, no surgery needed. She
came already sing right, you know what I mean. I
know she liked tall nigger that can dunce. I had
to hate you know what I'm saying. But listen, no man,
especially so we were that. I asked the con I said,

(53:25):
I say, I say, you say, dog hold him like
who I got to watch? I say, dog, I've been
I'm the dude in the room talking about he better,
he better than anybody like on that dude to them
and he said he's summon tells his kid on watching
he said, he said he really thin. He's small though,
if he can stay healthy. Now I'm for people, so
call me on TV. He had on the cape and

(53:45):
a mask. But I'm sure you got some tensities when
you've seen him. He thin, like not frail, but just
like man, I could not like yeah, like he was thin.
So I'm like, who the fund is he talking about?
Because I'm looking at him and I'm really tripping that
he's not huge. Yeah, And I'm thinking, so, I'm like,

(54:09):
I'm this much of a fan that I'm read playing
plays in my head like this motherfucker did that. And
I'm a Trail s Freewell fan too. Down the Trail
has some size making a movie, but I'm just like
this stick up compared to a trade, he is not
even that. And as on process and that he says,
as this kid at Golden State, Steph Curry, m hm,

(54:29):
And I said, who he says, Steph Curry. I saw
the scene him player, I say, but he the one
he said. I'm telling you he don't want all they
gotta do. Stay here that day, start watching step He
has never disappointed it. And that ship was like Yoda
telling you about this kid, and ain't Luke. You know
what I'm saying, He's gonna Koby Man. Meeting Kobe was

(54:51):
a big deal. And then when it was time to
take pictures, met him, tipped meet him, tipping my wife
just like my wife smiled a little too hard, I said,
you know this, she read it like Lebrons, you don't.
I hate it. I hate it like and she was pissed.
So I was like, so heye, But that he was.
He was man, he was he was such a you know,
he was really you know, I just believe in heroes.

(55:13):
I don't want to well it's comic books, parables and stuff.
I believe in heroes. And Kobe really was a hero.
He was a guy who, no matter what where you
are on the Jordan debate, he had the audacity and
the tenacity to want to be better than his master.
Like when you think about that on some Kung Fu
movie ship, you know, he wanted to be better than

(55:35):
his master. That is that, you know, the type of
self discipline like I'm still trying to have the dup
discipline just to do it every day at the morning.
But the self discipline it takes to want to be
better than your idol, that's that's something. That's something you know,
that's herculean ship. You know. When they asked m J
about it, he said, the only person that can beat
and probably Kovid. Yeah, still all his moves, you think,

(56:00):
I don't know, I want my guys to win. Of course,
I know it's a long shot, but you know, I
don't I don't know, I don't know, I don't know.
But you know what though, if my guys aren't in it,
I do want to see I want to see Chris
Paul Walker. I love Chris Man And yeah, I hate
it when the leave blocked him from going out to
play with Kobe. But I really think that he's he
defines character, you know what I mean? So, yeah, like

(56:22):
he is the point guard, you know, he makes the
team better around him. He's clutched when he needs to be.
And just like he reminds me of like when you
watch those old tapes of Kareem and An interview or
Jim an interview, just once he's done playing the character
some man, great leader. Yeah, I really I really respect
and I'd like to see him get one. Yeah, you're

(56:44):
on the board of the Homies in art I am
talking about that. How did you come about man? Rand
Suffolk who is the director and Mukol who's an amazing artist.
They approached me about it three years ago and I
agree that. And what was amazing is I came out
of Frederick U those high schools Arts and Talent program.
Little y'ally's father is a photographer who also comes out

(57:05):
of that program. Little John's person who comes out of
the arts program, arts program, you know. So it's like
it's a it's a big deal because all our teachers
wanted to us to find something we can attach to
and take us all the way, you know. So getting
an opportunity to be on the education board, not only
just on the board, but on the committee that specifically
deals with education to make sure that a museum and

(57:27):
a major metropolitan city that has an over fifty percent
African American participation ship stays like that in grows. It's
just an amazing opportunity. And I think that you know,
you hear what rappers aren't doing from people complaining on
a daily basis, But you know, I think that's something
to be celebrated, you know. And not only am I
on the board of the high I make sure my
daughter gets to the Apex Museum and learns about African

(57:47):
American coach and make sure when I'm in cities visiting,
you know, we go to the museums. So I'm just
a believer that the arts can inspire children. You know,
if you want a cheap date or great out in
as a parent, go to the museum. You know, take
your day to the museum. You don't tell us out
let let let that currently we even the last should
be seeing something. Artists again. Take the babies. There many

(58:10):
grass grass on hot wing. He's out the words, sir,
you collect hot wheels. I do love the must the cars. Hello, Hello,
a death story. I just made my grandma. I remember
she was taking to kmart when I was a kid,
and if I ain't no food, I got a hot Yeah,
I'm saying, if I had the food, I gotta ask
for him. So I figured the hot wheels was the
easier way to go. But at my barber shop, when

(58:33):
we first opened our shop on the south side of
thirty sixty one Roseville Highway in Atlanta, the old shop,
the prodect shop that had been there, hadn't left the
best reputation, so when we were trying to attract new customers,
I remember one day, just sitting there, me and the
barber's I was like, man, I got an idea, say
everybody give me ten dollars. I ran too, the like
the dollar story, got hot wheels, and I said, all
your kid customers when you cut the hair giving this

(58:54):
at the end of the I said, the one dollar investment,
it's gonna bring you nilars every time, and after that
it's just are flourishing, start growing, and then you know,
I love real muscle cars. So you know, I put
my cars in front of my shops. I just bought
about thirty thousand square foot house space. We're probably do
something cool in the car world with that, you know,
with its villains. So you know, I just I mean,
I love cars. I love going fast. Um not teen

(59:18):
seven put g n x is is one of the ones.
It's called to me and all the car Now you know,
I'm gonna have one before I get out of here.
And I think I'm gonna finding by myself a demon
this year. Like I was thinking the other night. I
was like, man, I could die. The kids didn't Want'm
gonna spend all this goddamn and I still ain't gonna
be Then got my demon opening the restaurant. Yeah, bank
Head seafood Man, fifty year old restaurant. It was the

(59:38):
oldest restaurant on that strip or bank Head. Miss Helen
Harden owned it from Mount Olive Baptist Church. Shouts out
to Miss Harden and we bought it till called me
like I said, you said, we want to do something together,
let's do it. We got it. We don't went through
a lot of ups and downs getting cleared. We don't
went through a lot of fights. But man, it's coming
and I'm proud of us. You know. See, I've been
in the Lanta a long time. See it's hollow way on.

(01:00:02):
I've been out of that projects and all that knocked down.
Now you know what I mean. You gotta be from
the eight you do. Now we call some help to
I want to tell athletes and entertainers man like, and
the lawyers out there, and you know in the cities
that we need to start sitting down with some committees

(01:00:22):
and figuring out your to me in cities, especially through
the South, your athletes and entertainers should be looked at
as a wave of potential business people and if we
partner with them, then we have an opportunity to build
business into communities and brands that are gonna be better.
We got a lot of pushback from people who weren't
legacy restaurants in the community. At some point um the

(01:00:45):
legacy people, the people have been in fifty sixty years,
were like, we're proud of y'all, like, like the community
really arranged you guys, y'all doing this, And then we
got some pushbacks some other places because of rappers, because
of reputation, because of other things. And I just thought
that was shameful because in in my opinion, when people
are heroes from a from a local place, whether it's
the athletes that are brought there to perform athletics or

(01:01:06):
the people that grow out of there and perform music,
if cities and private sector partner with these people and
you create a business class and an economic class that
creates jobs and creates more opportunity, you create stronger cities,
You create strong economics. And I think that we have
the potential again to create more Jamal mash Barns, more Magic,
johnsins more Shaquille o'neils. And if we do that, we'll

(01:01:28):
hear less stories of who lost it all, and we're
less complaints of what rappers aren't doing. But that only
happens when everybody buys into it and everybody does it.
So you know, I want to challenge people to do
with Atlanta is doing, because it seems to me that
people in Atlanta are are cooperating in the way that
Andrew Young wanted us to. He's doing an amazing job

(01:01:48):
him ask him and his business partner Suit you know,
shouts out of them, Jeezy, you know, you know, amazing jobs.
So I'm just I'm just I'm happy to see you know,
even if you look at man, what what Gucci has
been able to do in terms of record deals people like,
you know, people have been really really generous with the
opportunity What what Thug has been able to do operative people,
you know, and the people that that he's helping now

(01:02:10):
opening and you know, babies opening restaurants. So for me, Man,
I just want to see more and more on a
plethora of that. And I want to see another seat.
I want to see them because I want to see
them Dallas, want to see them, want to see it
in Austin, want to see it in places so that
there's a whole new fifty year economy that's created around it.
Like people see this side of the camera, there's three
people talking who entertain y'all. On the other side of

(01:02:32):
this campra that dozens of people that are making this happen.
So that's a bigger economy. And I think that I
think that when this country understands, especially when the African
American community is strong economically, the entire country is stronger.
That's to me, that's hard Achilles Hill. And like you said,
it's getting better. But we never learned to do this.
We've always been for fighting for ourselves and surviving, so

(01:02:53):
we've never thought to come together together. We're so much stronger,
so much stronger. They gotta do it, like you said,
they gotta do it in the hometowns like where we're from.
A perfect example Bun in Houston. They showed Bunn the
love and Houston that pulled author should be showing him.
You know what I'm saying for them for what he do.
You know what I'm saying. And I think that's why
people go elsewhere, because they get more love and appreciate
from other places than where they come from. But but

(01:03:15):
it's it's it's amazing because it comes back because Bunn
is caught. He inspired you. You're inspiring someone. The legacy continue.
You know, if you never if you don't have big
Boy one half of out cash from Savannah, do you
get camouflaged, get a growing you know, music scene and
Savannay and so for me, man, I'm just I just say, man,
if you escape in small towns in your mind, don't

(01:03:36):
forget to go back and leave the expation. Don't forget that.
Like Andrean James is one of my Euros forever because
he has never left. He's always planning and inspired. Whether
it was that he talked about the activity center he
started three guys who playing the pros and now came
through that center. You know, man, come on, man, that's
that's his own private y m c A. You know
what I mean, that's a that's a beautiful thing. Well,

(01:03:57):
Uncle Luke has been able to do with football and
South Flora. Forget what he did, you know, we often
forget what we did rather in terms protecting our First
Amendment rights in the nineties, but the amount of young
men whose life he's touched through athletics and just you know,
and what athletics you had to be doing good in school,
just making you incredible young men and me and fit
to marry going out what Snoop has been able to do.
So I just applaud this man, and I think the

(01:04:19):
more we grow because we've only been free sixty years,
I had sixty years of free so you know, when
you think about that's not a very long time, you know,
So don't let don't be too hard on ourselves. Let's
support the things that we know we're gonna grow like viola,
you know, and let's let's keep pushing shouts out down. Definitely, definitely, man,
We appreciate your time. We've got a quick hitters, first
team to come to mind and let us know. But
I'm gonna let you start. If you could be remembered

(01:04:41):
by any bar a lyric that you ever dropped, what
would it be if any man the first verse of
untitled you were witnessing elegance in the form of a
black elephant smoking white rhine on terrorists like slang like
my king by terrorists? Will my woman be caretta take
my name and cherish it? Or wish Jackie yell Trump

(01:05:03):
to Kennedy remarry it? My sister say, is necessary on
some clear patrickship. I tenued to agree because the thought
is so disparaging. My grandmother says, no, never that exactly.
Then I say, Then I say no, I tend to
agree because the thought of so disparaging. The Lord, give
a load you got to carry it like Mary did.
That's why I'm giving honor to all these baby mamas.

(01:05:24):
It takes a woman's wound that to make a christ
of dollar Loma the world. I take the child, turn
the challenge to a monster. The world had taken, I'd
say the world might take the child turned the challenge
to a monster. The lord to take a monster and
fashion him a saint. I present you Malcolm X was
older saying that he can't, saying that he won't when
I know he will. But you usually don't know what
you until you being killed. Real. That was my thoughts

(01:05:47):
of what I thought Dr King would be thinking as
he laid out down. That's tough. I'm gonna put you
on the spot right here. You guys have your own
unique sound out there in Atlanta. Who is your round
Mount Rushmore Ever letter artists, Oh black, it'll be. It'll
be a hundred people on the when putting forehead the
whole mountains like a big super faith. But I will

(01:06:11):
say I'm honored to be on the arm on the
cover that Slam magazine. But they put up something like
a basketball team. They had me down there looking like
powerful and I got a weight loss goal now including
your Body of Work. One album you can listen to
from top to bottom, no skips excluding My Body of
Work Man, any and every scar Face album. I'm gonna

(01:06:35):
go with. My favorite s car Face album is to Fix.
He always says that are you Mine is on I
would say a man made is potentially Yeah, yeah yeah.
One quote you lived by man, do what you want
to do because you're gonna wake up dead one day.
Do what you wanna do because you're gonna wake up
dead one day. Man. That's that's solid. Five dinner guests

(01:06:58):
dead are Alive. I generally get Dad all lie, deep conversation,
some good free let's see drinks. Say that dead all live,
I go, I go dr King, Frederick Douglas, Eugene Davis,
Patrese from Mumba and Hurston. Three women at the table,

(01:07:24):
Well Zoro Zoros. It was the only one. But I
think she's just toughest ship she We don't be mostly
listening to her and she wrote like her for Riddy
and so I just love to hear our top country.
Last question, if you can see one guest on All
the Smoke on the show, who would it be? But
before you answer, you have to help us get your
ass on the show. Oh man, I just called to

(01:07:46):
your roman. Tell me need to do y'all show. Yeah, yeah,
we need that. He's about to call him right now.
You can't turn that down. Hey, so you don't get
no realdy to kill Mike. Mike depicts the pall. Yeah,
do we call him right quick? You see, I gotta see.
I mean he might be working. Tell tell Joe we

(01:08:07):
did we did with Joe broken up sports podcast. Let's see,
let's see, let's see you Joe come over here smoking joint.
Willers talking about when he said niggah man, Joe didn't
killed man working, damn Joe. So I can ask act.
I love to see y'all talking, So I can ask
me to say nigger, nigger? Which one did you say?

(01:08:28):
Don't that I want to I want to say this far.
I want to say this far. I'll be triguing, like
because white folks ain't got that. We used to be
taught that the turn cracker came from a whip cracker
that black people made up. But we didn't make that up.
Real white folks made up nigga and cracker. When I say,

(01:08:49):
real white folksy a lot of folks. If you know
about the landing, you know about cabbage Town. Cabbage Town,
they gentrified, pody fled in the black neighborhoods. Cabbage towns
are all white neighbors. I don't pull working class white folks.
And the meals would bring them up and use them,
pay them a meal, money, overcharged them at the store.
They mean they didn't pay them in American money. They
pay them in like a food stamp. So the first
people to get gentrified and pushed out the city weren't

(01:09:11):
even black. It was white, but it was poor. They
put them out in, pushed them further down to Clayton
counter places like that. But the term cracker comes from
the master class in the South, these real white folks,
the folks that was related to the folks they were
breaking away from. So the people that first took the
Thirteen Colleagues and ship, a lot of them was cousins
the Royalty and ship. They just weren't high enough on

(01:09:32):
the royalty ladder, so they were still against ship. And
also they just found them another land to take. And
we're falling off away from a military standpoint. Y'all got
across this ocean, we got most sniper rifles because we
are and funck y'all, you know what I mean, We
took it. But crackers was a term given to those
people who weren't cosmopolitan. They weren't very learned that with
gypsy slights moved around. So white folks named y'all crackers,

(01:09:55):
the same white folks that named us niggas. And the
thing they had in common is they used cheap and
free labor from niggas and crackers. And because niggas and
cracker has been fighting so long from everywhere the South, Mississippi,
East Alabama where's Georgia, Niggas and crackers predominantly have stayed
poor in places like Mississippi, places like Alabama, and now
the federal government and local municipalities fight over slave label.

(01:10:17):
To see, you're gonna cut the grass for free, because
niggas and crackers still fighting against one another. But we're
both doing that fighting for the people that name us both.
And that's the real white folks when they were all
the planter class. So that's just for y'all, niggas and crackers.
And know something, thank yall, Showtime Basketball, YouTube and the

(01:10:42):
Heart platform, Black effects Man. We'll see you all next week,