March 5, 2025 • 61 mins
Before The Chosen made him a household name, Jonathan Roumie was at his lowest point—out of money, out of options, and questioning everything. In this episode of Arroyo Grande, Roumie shares the powerful moment he surrendered control, placed his faith in God, and saw his life transform in ways he never expected. From struggling actor to portraying Jesus in one of the most successful faith-based series of all time, hear how "giving in" to divine direction led him to being Chosen.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
I got to the point where I was completely out
of money, I was massively in debt, I was out
of food. And the moment I let go of the
control that I had imposed upon myself and I gave
it over to God, that's when things turned around. Like
that very day, and then a few months later I
booked The Chosen, and here we are five seasons later.
Speaker 2 (00:21):
You're playing Jesus over a long haul. Did you ever
say maybe I shouldn't do this.
Speaker 1 (00:27):
I remember in the first season, I became very self
aware of the fact that I was now preaching parables
and I hadn't done that yet. Kind of got overwhelmed,
and I thought to myself, I shouldn't be saying these words,
like I'm not worthy to be doing this, and.
Speaker 2 (00:44):
I'm Raven Arroyo. Welcome to Arroyo Grande. Jonathan Roomy or
streaming Jesus, depending on your perspective, is coming out to
talk about the new season of The Chosen, how playing
Jesus has changed him and the faith that sustains his work.
(01:07):
Subscribing like the Arroyo Grande podcast. Get your notifications, go
ahead click them now. Why do you want to miss
an episode? First, a little free flow. Did you see
Luigi Maggioni being dragged into the Manhattan Criminal Court the
other day? Now, when an accused murderer is paraded into court,
a normal person says, I'm glad they got him in chains,
throw the book at him. He's charged with shooting a
(01:30):
healthcare ceo in the back, and they have the receipts.
But for the one hundred plus women lining the hallways
of the Manhattan Criminal Court and millions more looking in
on social media, they could care less. They weren't looking
at Luigi's ankle cuffs. They were looking at his designer loafers.
Within twenty four hours of his court appearance, searches of
(01:53):
Luigi Maggione's loafers leapt one thousand, four hundred percent. The
Luigi Acts have turned this murder suspect into a heart prompt.
They obsess over his outfits. They're selling out Luigi's sweaters.
They wear their free Luigi gear at every appearance. Mobs
of protesters were outside the courthouse demanding Maggioni's freedom. One
(02:17):
of these geniuses called Luigi quote the new Martin Luther King.
Last time I checked, Martin Luther King was shot. He
didn't shoot others, and what civil right is Maggioni fighting
for exactly? Unibrows. I don't follow the reasoning, but the
Maggioni protesters are also following in their obsessions footsteps. They're
(02:41):
actually calling for the death of other healthcare CEOs. They're
demanding the freedom of a guy who's accused of shooting
a CEO and think others should die. Got it. One
of Maggioni's fangirls said she has Luigi fever. No, my dear,
it's more like a Luigi play, because you were lionizing
(03:01):
this Ivy League gunslinger, pretending he's a Baltimore version of
James Bond when he's probably just another justsgruntled lunatic who
decided to kill somebody who ran a company he didn't like.
Imagine if we all do that, And if you were
a sixty year old guy with a beer belly, I
doubt if you'd be googling his sweaters. Consider the superficiality,
(03:23):
the stupidity of someone buying Luigi Maggioni's loafers. Why would
any sane person want to literally and figuratively walk in
the shoes of a murderer? And after the Super Bowl
loss of the Kansas City Chiefs, there was massive speculation
that Travis Kelsey would retire from the NFL, but fear not.
(03:46):
Like Groundhog Day, Kelsey saw no shadows at all, and
he announced that he's returning to the Chiefs next season,
which means there'll be eighteen more weeks of unbroken tailor
swift and just in time for Land. Christianity is bouncing back.
According to Pew's research. Their latest study, sixty two percent
(04:07):
of people in the United States define themselves as Christian. Now,
this is a turnabout from a decline in twenty twenty.
The so called nons, those with no religious affiliation, have
completely stalled, dropping by a point. And among the young
this is fascinating. Among those eighteen to twenty four year olds,
fifty seven percent of both young men and women are
(04:31):
equally invested in daily prayer and believe in God. That
is a closing of the gender gap that we've never seen,
and it shows young men are more engaged than in
years past. Surprise, the religion rooted in resurrection is rising again.
Speaking of that, to the deep dive, the Chosen has
(04:54):
become a global sensation, viewed by hundreds of millions of people.
Part of the reason for that'sc excess is Jonathan Roumy's
portrayal of Jesus. He sat down with me to discuss
the fifth season of the show, which covers the Last
Supper and leads to the Passion. He told me about
his first hesitation playing the role, how it changed him,
(05:16):
where that accent came from, and what he wants to
do after Jesus. Here's Jonathan Roumy tell me, Jonathan Roumy,
I'm so glad you're here. Thank you for being on
the show. You grew up in New York, Yes, went
to school in New York. How did that shape you
for what you're doing now?
Speaker 1 (05:35):
I think, like the Sinatra song goes, if I can
make it here, I can make it anywhere, And it
gives you a certain edge and a boldness and a
toughness and a resilience and an ability to survive that
I think you don't get too many other places. It's
a challenge. So I grew up mostly in the suburbs.
(05:55):
I started in the city, moved to the suburbs, ended
up back in the city, and the city was my speed.
It just felt right to me, and I felt like
this is what a city should be. And then when
you travel to other cities, you're like, oh, this isn't
really the lights are all city, you know, they closed
(06:16):
by ten?
Speaker 2 (06:16):
Like, how is that where a diner? Where is there
a diner here somewhere? Yeah, you enrolled in the school
of Visual Arts and you're studying film. What drew you
to that?
Speaker 1 (06:29):
I was always fascinated by film. I had spent most
of my younger years as a visual artist.
Speaker 2 (06:36):
And well, that's right, you were creating it still create
I mean you did it for the Jesus Revolution movie. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (06:42):
Yeah, I was allowed the ability to collaborate on the
mantle that I wore in that and that movie. So
I was I was very much into illustration and painting,
and I thought maybe I would go into that, but
movies just really just stole focus for me, and I thought,
(07:04):
I think I want to work in films, in visual
effects or in the visual arts behind films. And then
when I went to film school, I started, you know,
I had to take acting, I had to take directing,
and I started enjoying the process of working with actors
and the process of acting myself I found terrifying. But
(07:27):
I thought if I was gonna be a director, which
is something that I seriously considered while in film school.
I thought, I think I should experience what it's like
to be put in that position. So once I got
out of school, I wanted to get more experience knowing
what the actor goes through so that it would make
(07:48):
me a more proficient director when the time came.
Speaker 2 (07:52):
How did you do that?
Speaker 1 (07:54):
I started, well, I started by trying to find my
way in the voiceover industry. So there was I had
a penchant for impressions and dialects and and I'm I'm
a pretty good mimic. Yeah, And so I reached out
(08:16):
to this casting director for a show that MTV was
doing at the time called Celebrity death Match. Oh yeah,
you remember that show.
Speaker 2 (08:23):
Which was celebrity voices in a death.
Speaker 1 (08:25):
Match, in a death match and fight to the death
in all sorts of crazy ways. And and I just
wrote to this casting director and I thought, you know, well,
maybe this is a good way to try to get
some acting experience without having to go full on, you know,
full full frontal way in theater or on television or
anything like their even commercials. And and so I started
(08:47):
working in voiceover and then that same casting director presented
me with my first opportunity for an on camera promotional video,
like a promo for the Video Music Awards one year,
and I never auditioned for anything on camera before, and
I ended up booking it, and I thought, this is
this is weird. This isn't how I thought. I didn't
(09:09):
expect to get it. I just thought, well, it'd be
kind of cool just to try. And so when I
actually booked it, I thought, oh, maybe, I don't know,
maybe God's got a plan that this is part of
my career path here or something. And then that led
to more commercials and more voiceover, and then I did
my first play and then I really got hooked and
(09:30):
that was it. Yeah, and then I started trying to
find ways to make it.
Speaker 2 (09:34):
More right and then you're out. You're out in La.
Speaker 1 (09:37):
Years later, I moved to LA. I moved to LA
in twenty ten. Oh boy. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (09:43):
And then there was a long up and down drought
period in LA, which drought, which happens to a lot
of actors.
Speaker 1 (09:50):
LA is a dry place.
Speaker 2 (09:52):
It is a very dry place, this is true.
Speaker 1 (09:54):
But droughts for decades.
Speaker 2 (09:55):
Yeah, in more ways than one.
Speaker 1 (09:57):
Yeah. So yeah, So for eight years iggled in LA
before things turned around for me.
Speaker 2 (10:02):
But you said, and you said that life backed me
into a corner in twenty eighteen or so. How did
that happen?
Speaker 1 (10:13):
Well, I was trying to balance several different side jobs
and none of them were none of them were allowing
me to make enough money to just do one thing
and pursue acting. I had to I had to do
many different things, and so I had to I had
(10:33):
to spread my energy in a number of different ways
just to survive. And it got to the point.
Speaker 3 (10:40):
Where I couldn't get arrested for the survival jobs like
I would I would call up these you know, these
folks that that would hire me in a number of
different you know, contractor positions, and I couldn't.
Speaker 1 (10:55):
There was nothing happening. And so and for like two weeks,
three weeks, this happened, and I thought it was very bizarre,
and I thought, what's going on? Like this is unseasonably dry.
It was an unseasonable dry spell for me with just
(11:16):
trying to survive. And I got to the point where
I was completely out of money. I was massively in debt,
I was out of food, and I didn't know what
else to do, then to just you know, drop to
my knees in prayer and at that point just pour
my heart out to God and ask him why he
(11:37):
brought me to this place if it wasn't for you know,
this purpose to pursue acting full time. And I had
got tastes of what a career could look like, but
it never really panned out to anything beyond just an
episode of television here and there. And then that day
I experienced this financial miracle that to me was a
(11:59):
sign that the moment I let go of the control
that I had imposed upon myself, imposed upon my career
to try to be uh responsible for everything that took place,
for everything that happened, the moment I let go of
that and I and I gave it over to God,
that's when things turned around like that very day in
(12:21):
a very dramatic way. And then a few months later
I booked The Chosen and here we are five seasons later, amazing.
Speaker 2 (12:29):
What's the takeaway for other people looking in on that?
I mean, at times those dark valleys are really where
you find you can't see the light except through a.
Speaker 1 (12:39):
Dark valley like that, right right? I think the takeaway
Raymond would be that you have to put your faith
in something bigger than yourself. You have to you have
to really commit to an idea that's that's bigger than yourself.
(13:00):
And for me, that was the Divine power as God
in my life as somebody that had a profession of
faith as a Catholic Christian, I had to really put
my money where my mouth was and believe the things
that my faith told me that I believe that that
(13:23):
were true. If I didn't believe them, then why practice
my faith? But if I if I did, if I
was practicing my faith, then I had to really examine
whether or not I believe those things were true. Did
I believe that God is in charge my life? Do
I stand on his promises for all the things that
he said that if I give him my burdens and
(13:46):
my yoke, that he can carry it for me or
with me? And do I trust him? Do I trust
them in the unknown, in the circumstances that are sometimes
overwhelming and beyond me. And when I could finally answer
truthfully and holy and completely, yes I trust him, That's
(14:09):
when everything changed.
Speaker 2 (14:11):
And then Jesus literally and figuratively stalks you really from
that moment to this. I mean, look, I saw you
in a traveling production playing Jesus on the road. How
did that come to be? Tell us a little about that,
and more importantly from again, this is just my own curiosity.
(14:32):
How did your portrayal of Jesus or understanding of him
change from that traveling production to today? Or did it?
Speaker 1 (14:43):
It's a good question. So that started, that traveling show
started five years before the Chosen Yeah, six months after
I filmed my portion of that show. Because it was
essentially projected high in the actress on a screen, so
this actress would would essentially interact with the characters on
(15:06):
the screen of which I was playing. It was Jesus
for the first time. And six months later I auditioned
for a short film for Dallas Jenkins. The creative had
chosen about the two Thieves called the Two Thieves Crucified
alongside Jesus and.
Speaker 2 (15:24):
How did that? How did you meet him? How did
that happen?
Speaker 1 (15:27):
So that audition came through I think one of my
agents at the time, and it was just they were
casting out of Los Angeles. He was based in Chicago,
and they said, hey, here's here's a short film audition.
It was like they would pay me something crazy like
a few hundred bucks a day, and they would fly
me at him like I'd love to get flown out
(15:47):
for a job like it.
Speaker 2 (15:48):
Why not?
Speaker 1 (15:48):
Why not? I was? That was that was big, big
time for me at the time. And so I auditioned,
and I auditioned initially for one of the Thieves, which
I didn't get because two days later after that audition,
they said, hey, they want you to read for Jesus.
And I'm like, ah, Jesus got like five lines the thief.
Theb is like, it's all about art, It's all about
the penitent theeb. It's an amazing art. But I had
(16:12):
just played Jesus in the right show and I was thought, well,
I'd love to play Jesus again. Maybe see what I
can come up with this time. And uh, And I
ended up booking that and from that began this, you
know what is now a ten year relationship with Dallas.
Jenkins did two more short films for his church and
that in that Vein, and then a year and a
half later he called me for the Chosen.
Speaker 2 (16:34):
For the pilot for the Chosen? What was it that
was the Shepherd? Was that called?
Speaker 1 (16:38):
So? What was that so no, so, so he called
me for the the main series for the Chosen eight months.
Nine months before that, he did a pilot called The
Shepherd for his It was probably his the last film
he did for his church's Christmas service on the heels
(16:59):
of his own kind of struggle and failure with his
feature film at the time, and so he dumped all
his energy into that short film. That short film gets
released and goes viral. They use that as the basis
to crowdfod on four episodes and then eight episodes once
the first season of it Chosen. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (17:21):
So I'm gonna go back to my earlier question, how
did it change your portrayal change?
Speaker 1 (17:25):
I think it's become more refined. I think obviously, I've
become much more comfortable in the character. Every season, I'm
more comfortable in the skin, so to speak, of the character,
because it's it's like putting on a familiar coat and
just like a cozy little.
Speaker 4 (17:42):
Coat and or tunic or in the case maybe Yeah,
And I think those those kinds of roles once when
you have that.
Speaker 1 (17:55):
Much time to spend with a character, with that direct
with one director, and for me and Dallas, it's been
ten years even though we're five seasons into the show,
you know, there's a certain familiarity and a certain and
I mean even between the Traveling Show and the short
film the I noticed I can see that my accent
(18:21):
was much more settled in, Like I really found the
subtlety of the accent because I think in the Traveling
Show it was the first time I ever tried it.
Nobody had ever done a Middle Eastern accent.
Speaker 2 (18:32):
That's what I was going to ask you. Where did it
come from? Where did the accent originate? Did you hear
it somewhere? Did somebody?
Speaker 1 (18:38):
So I grew up with that accent. So I grew
up with a Middle Eastern accent. So my father's from
Egypt in the accent is a combination of my father's
accent and my aunt was from Palestine, sort of a
meld of the two of them. So he's got a
very for my years, a very light accent. She's got
a thicker accent, and so I just kind of blended
the two and that became the basis for the role
(19:01):
for me, for Jesus for the first one. And then
I noticed when I did it again, I kind of
lightened up on it because there were some things that
if I spoke with a heavy Middle Eastern accent, not
every not the average American from Middle America, they might
not understand some of the words I'd say because it's thick.
And so I just streamlined it a bit more. And
(19:21):
that sort of has stayed the same.
Speaker 2 (19:23):
M You know, it reminds me. I did Carol O'Connor's
last interview, who famously played Archie Bunker, of course, and
of course you know he spoke nothing. Why he was
a very refined man. And I said, where did this
accent come from? Guess where it came from?
Speaker 1 (19:37):
Queens?
Speaker 2 (19:38):
His mother?
Speaker 1 (19:38):
His mother, his mother who.
Speaker 2 (19:40):
Had a gigger right ear, couldn't he said she would
imitate all the girls down at the market. And then
he took a little of James Cagney and a little
of Jackie Gleeson whom he knew, and came up with
Archie Bunker. So the lab was very similar to the
roomy method.
Speaker 1 (19:55):
That's amazing, that's fascinating on her.
Speaker 2 (19:57):
Well, it comes. You know, we're borrowings things, you see, things,
you try them on. It's an it is an awkward
and odd art. I mean, you're taking things from life
and you're trying them in. Sometimes they work, sometimes they don't.
But when you're dealing with a role like Jesus, there
are such expectations Jonathan that had to be overwhelming. When
(20:19):
you got into the series business. It's not you're not
playing him in a film or one off. You're playing
over a long haul. Did you ever say maybe I
shouldn't do this.
Speaker 1 (20:31):
I never said that I shouldn't do it. I remember
in the first season. I definitely when I had my
first big speech in front of maybe about fifty or
one hundred extras, I became very self aware of the
fact that I was now preaching parables and I hadn't
done that yet. So I was preaching from various parables,
(20:56):
and I suddenly became self aware that the of the
words that I was saying and what I was actually doing,
and how people were looking at me, and it kind
of drew me out of the scene for a second
where I kind of I kind of got overwhelmed, and
I thought to myself, I shouldn't be saying these words,
(21:17):
like I shouldn't be here doing this because it feels
I'm not worthy to be doing this, like to be
playing Jesus for the world to see it just all
of a sudden, it felt like way too much. And
so Dallas, we were shooting the scene and we were
getting the shot and we were trying he was trying
(21:38):
to move on, and I was pretty unsettled, and I
at one point I said to him, I'm like, hey, hey,
can we just can we slow down a second? I
just need I need a minute. And he's like, yeah, well,
what's wrong? And we went aside and I took him
aside and I just confided in him. I said, this
is what I'm going through. I don't feel worthy to
be saying these words, like I'm having a hard time
(22:03):
right now. And I was starting to panic a little bit,
and he just very gently was like, he put his
hand on my shoulders, like, listen, man, none of us
are worthy, but we're here because we're meant to be
telling this story and giving me the story to the world.
So you're basically he said, like, you're right where you're
(22:23):
supposed to be. And that kind of brought me back
to reality and I thought, yeah, yeah, there's the reason
I got cast is Jesus for the chosen and somebody
else didn't, So God put me in this position. And
so I just got to honor that and accept it
and know that it might be scary at times. Like
(22:44):
you know, in season five, we just portrayed the Last
Supper and the Garden of gethsemone, and at that point
I went into those scenes and like, you gotta help me.
I have no idea what I'm doing, Like, I have
no idea what you went through for this, Like how
do you recreate the moment in the Garden of gets Sementy?
Speaker 2 (23:02):
Well, I was going to ask you, how do you
prepare for that? I mean, how do you prepare for
this as an actor? I mean it's let's let's just
take that Gardner get Semite. Here's your script, Jonathan. Yeah,
where do.
Speaker 1 (23:13):
You start on my knees in prayer? I mean, that's
honestly that that that's the first place I started. And
I read this and I'm I'm overwhelmed just reading it,
and it's because it's so beautifully written, feels very authentic.
But then I also know there's so much of that
(23:35):
moment that is just a mystery. Right, all of those moments,
there's mystery in each and every one of them. It's
the mystery of faith, right, Yeah, And we and we
have to we have to trust that everything unfolded the
way God meant it to unfold. But living two thousand
years later, that's it's not always easy to understand how
(23:55):
it unfolded. So and I search for the how. I
have to start in prayer and just ask for guidance
and wisdom and inspiration and you know, flurries of the
(24:17):
Holy Spirit whenever it's it makes meaningful sense to try
to tap into it, or it's it's beyond description. Really,
it's beyond a comprehension.
Speaker 2 (24:28):
And do you find it in the moment? Do you
find it when you're on sex?
Speaker 1 (24:32):
Yeah? Some things I do. I mean I don't you know,
you have a plan and then best laid plan.
Speaker 2 (24:38):
Sometimes, yeah, you throw them out pretty quickly.
Speaker 1 (24:41):
Yeah, you you. The thing that makes any performance works
is spontaneity, living in the moment, being present in that
moment to whatever external stimulus they find its way into
the scene. And it could be being overwhelmed with emotion
(25:02):
and something that you've said ten times and it hasn't
done anything. On the eleventh time, all of a sudden,
it's like the floodgates and you're like, where did that come?
From I don't know. That's holy Spirit, that's inspiration, it's God,
it's it's the art. It's it's doing it ten times
and just maybe just being and getting out of the way,
getting out of the way and just exhausted and finally
(25:24):
you're like free to just be. So Yeah, it is.
It is a strange art, but that's that's the excitement
of doing it.
Speaker 2 (25:34):
How how has Jesus changed for you in these five seasons?
I know this last season had to be emotionally. You're
playing a different part of Jesus here. And this is
no longer really the public ministry. This is the private
the beginning of the private torture.
Speaker 1 (25:52):
Yeah, Jus.
Speaker 2 (26:00):
Run for a long My house should be called a
house of prayer, but you make it a den of feet?
By what authority are you doing these things?
Speaker 1 (26:17):
My own?
Speaker 2 (26:19):
How did it change? I know it had to shift
your understanding of Him and what he personally went through
in these moments.
Speaker 1 (26:30):
Yeah, I think Jesus doesn't change. I change my understanding
hopefully increases in the search to in the seeking of
(26:51):
this communion, this emotional communion, the spiritual communion with his
experience on earth. I think I have to be open
to the possibilities of gaining deeper insights as to what
he might have went through. And for me, I guess
(27:12):
the way that I would describe that for this past
season would be a deeper connection to his pain and
his loneliness and his isolation, especially with his friends, the
(27:35):
people that he spent three years with, and then knowing
that they're for the most part, all of them are
going to lead in his hour of need, and knowing
that before they know it, and trying to reconcile and
(27:56):
not show that. And then especially with regards to Judas,
knowing that he was chosen, and he was picked and
he did signs and wonders, you know, when he was
sent out just like the rest of them did and
didn't work out for them coming back.
Speaker 2 (28:17):
Yeah, well this is always I mean, this is to
me just looking at this, I always marvel it the
guts it takes to play a role like this. I
look at you in Cavisel and I go, oh, that's
tough stuff, because you're dealing with a character. If I
can use the term, he's got complete understanding. I mean
(28:37):
you think of the child Jesus. Yeah, I'm always a
marvel a gas at the child Jesus because at some
point at the age of reason, church fathers believe he
looks at the adults and he suddenly I mean the
reason he's preaching in the temple at twelve is because
he was probably giving orders to the family at mine.
You know, his understanding of what was happening, and the
humility of the parents to sit back urgin Mary and
(29:00):
Joseph to look at this and go, WHOA, what do
we This is nobody signed up for anything like this before.
So as he reaches we miss an email or something.
Is there a God for this kid? I mean the
depth of that, the humility of that too, And I'm
sure this is the same thing you're getting at. He
knows when he looks in the eyes, in the hearts
(29:20):
of these people, he knows. And how do you portray
that as an actor? I love you, but I know
what you're going to do. Yeah, come back, but I
know where you're going. That's a difficult thing to play.
Speaker 1 (29:33):
Yeah. Yeah. In fact, I think that we recently released
that very scene where it's sort of a precursor to
the betrayal and what was Judas trying to do? What
was Judas hoping to accomplish with Jesus as the Messiah figurehead,
(29:56):
the Davidic understanding of a Messiah versus Jesus was actually
going to do as Messiah, and what would that conversation
have looked like, and what happens after that conversation and
what happens with Jesus and what happens with Judas and
so yeah, that scenes actually on the live stream that
(30:16):
we just had all that. It's really I think there
was a moment where that was one of those scenes
where four or five takes or ten takes before I
didn't have that reaction at the end, and you know,
to give too much away, And then there was one
(30:37):
take where all of a sudden, the reality of my
friend knowing that I've lost him was too much to bear,
and I wept for him. And I didn't know. I
think we had talked about it, and I didn't think
that they were going to use that because I thought
(30:58):
it might be a little too early. But when I
saw it in the cutouts, like it works great because
it's that's exactly what we're talking about, Like, how could
he what would he have felt going through the human
part of him, the fully completely human part of him,
what would he experience knowing that that's happening and he
knows it's going to happen.
Speaker 2 (31:20):
And answer me, give me an honest answer on this.
The worst and the best part of the fifth season.
Worst part first, because I love bad news up front.
Speaker 1 (31:29):
The worst part, the worst part of the season, like
in the story.
Speaker 2 (31:36):
No, in the shooting, in the world, in the work.
This is an easy as for you.
Speaker 1 (31:41):
Gosh, sixteen page scenes, I mean, more dialogue than I've
ever had in my life. But also simultaneously that becomes
the best part because these scenes are amazing. Yeah, I
mean Jesus essentially flipping tables in the marketplace, Like when
(32:07):
when do you get to how often have we seen that?
Speaker 2 (32:09):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (32:10):
Portrayed not very often, very rare, And so I kind
of feel and we build up to it in a
way that it's right out of scripture, and you see
for the first time in many cases, how he got
to that point, why he got to that point, what
drove him to that point, knowing when he did get
(32:30):
to that point that that was going to seal the deal.
Yeah yeah, and then there was no turning back. He
knew he had. So we sort of chart.
Speaker 2 (32:39):
All of that you've also you've also been playing a
very loving, concerned connected Jesus. That scene had to be
very different for you.
Speaker 1 (32:52):
With the fury.
Speaker 2 (32:53):
The race's justifiable line.
Speaker 1 (32:56):
Is great though, that's so fun.
Speaker 2 (32:59):
You've been building up.
Speaker 1 (33:00):
I've seen it all, man, I've been waiting for that.
But it's the it's the righteous wrath of God seeing
his people being just completely taken advantage of by people
who profess to be priests, you know, high priests that
are just just completely and he snaps, yeah, yeah, I
(33:24):
mean taking advantage of is I mean extortion? It was
extortion for the poorest of the poor during this this
wholy during the passover, right like the most holy time,
where people had nothing were being extorted. I think fifty
sixty times, you know what they would pay for an
animal for sacrifice, and like just the taxation. There was
(33:49):
so much that just drove him to say, that's all
I can stand. I can't stand no more.
Speaker 2 (33:56):
That's it.
Speaker 1 (33:57):
That's it.
Speaker 2 (33:58):
Does your team ever look you and say, Jonathan, let's
be very careful about this Jesus thing. No more Jesus
is no more holy men. Is that part of the conversation?
Not yet, not yet.
Speaker 1 (34:14):
No no, because I mean.
Speaker 2 (34:16):
Because it's not on one off. I'm going to say
this again. Yeah, you're not playing him in one film,
You're playing him over many years, so multiple generations are
getting a taste of you in this role, and you
are so identified with that role. Is that a concern
for you as an actor?
Speaker 1 (34:35):
You know? I think I gave up that concern when
I got the job. When when this job came to me,
I had nothing, and I knew that anything that came
to me was from God's hand, and that whatever he
willed for my life, whatever he wanted me to do,
(34:57):
whatever came to me, I would always kind of discern
it through him and say, is Sis, what do you
think should we do this one? You know? So would
I do another long form series as a as a
preacher type? Probably not. I'd like to do other things.
(35:17):
I think when you've played Jesus as far as holy
man goes, I mean, where can I go into there?
And quite little like yeah, so, you know, But for
films I have, I mean, I've got ideas and other
projects that I'm working on that that are relating to
(35:37):
the stories, wonderful stories of various holy Men throughout history
that are just fascinating. That would be fascinating to play more,
most likely films, but not not TV.
Speaker 2 (35:51):
Serious Okay, but you'd be open to playing other saintly figures.
Speaker 1 (35:56):
Sure, Sure, if the script is great, it's got to
be great.
Speaker 2 (36:01):
Yeah, tell me about Solomeo, this new Kevin James movie,
a rom com to rom com, and you play.
Speaker 1 (36:08):
A non saint, not a holy man. I play. I
play a guy who's one half of a couple that
is in this story. So basically, Solomeo is the story
of a guy played by Kevin James, Matt who gets
(36:28):
stood up on his wedding day by his fiance in Rome.
So he gets convinced to go on his honeymoon anyway
because it's a non refundable package. Of course, so he's
got the package, he might as well while he's figuring
out what went wrong, take the trip, and there he
(36:51):
meets these two kind of quirky, wacky couples that are
part of this same package of honeymooners, American honeymooners in Rome.
Speaker 2 (37:00):
I see that.
Speaker 1 (37:01):
See he's by himself doing all these things like tandem
bike riding by himself, rowing a canoe in like this
lover's pond by himself, and so we're like, we need
to fix that guy and help them. And so I
played Neil, a therapist who sees Matt as an opportunity
(37:22):
to fix him. Little do we know, I'm actually a
physical therapist, not a psychotherapist. But I've got some delusions
of grandeur and hilarity ensuit and.
Speaker 2 (37:32):
You're doing your Did you enjoy it playing the comedy?
Speaker 1 (37:36):
It was a blast? Yeah. I mean I started in comedy,
you know, Celebrity Deathmatch and then a lot of the
most of the on camera TV projects that I've had
common comedies.
Speaker 2 (37:48):
Well, the comedic touch helps for Jesus too. I see
the I see the comedy glint. When you played Jesus,
which is just a human will it humanizes that's right,
it makes him human. Without that, he's he's a little untouchable.
Speaker 1 (38:01):
He's so remote, but it becomes too mystical and not human, right,
you know, like when you start denying Jesus is humanity,
that's a problem. If you deny his divinity, it's a problem.
You have to accept the hypostatic union of fully god
fully man minus the sin, and there you have Jesus.
And so that's the balance of playing him well.
Speaker 2 (38:23):
I like that you bring that little touch to it.
It makes it a full portrait. Tell me about Unbound.
This is an organization you get involved with in twenty nineteen.
Speaker 1 (38:33):
That's right?
Speaker 2 (38:35):
Why how did this come to be? You sponsor a child?
How does that work?
Speaker 1 (38:40):
So in twenty nineteen, I in an attempt to, I think,
just show gratitude to God for what he had given
me in this first season of The Chosen and how
people were starting to find it and I was getting
back on my feet. I wanted to make sure that
I that I remembered to take care of the less fortunate,
(39:05):
because got took care of me when I was in
dire need, and so I could I couldn't avoid feeling
that I had to do something as well. So I
found I looked up charities that were the top rated charities,
and Unbounds like in the top five or something at
the time. And they are an organization that was started
(39:29):
forty something years ago by Catholic lay people and they
basically have children that you can sponsor by in foreign countries,
in foreign countries and third world countries that need you know,
any everything from school supplies to the ability to go
to school, to food, to all sorts of needs. And
(39:52):
for a very meager amount, you basically sponsor a child
or an elderly person, which not too many other charities do.
There aren't a whole other a whole lot of charities
that are sponsoring both children and elderly people. As they
get older, they you know, they don't have anybody to
look after them. So I started sponsoring this this child,
(40:13):
this boy from Tanzania, and yeah, for a small sum
you basically they get to go to school, they get
food put on their table. It creates this opportunity not
just for the child, but for the family now to
be able to have resources to budget. And then they're
part of this community of sponsored families that can essentially
(40:37):
dig themselves out of abject poverty. They clean water, they
do have these water projects, they have these these oversight
groups with these mothers that learn to essentially pool finances
and invest and it changes the lives of these like
communities like and in this past summer, I actually got
(40:58):
to go.
Speaker 2 (40:58):
To Tanzania and.
Speaker 1 (41:00):
And Rwanda because about a year ago I also decided
to sponsor their millionth child from Rwanda, this little girl
in Rwanda. So this summer.
Speaker 2 (41:10):
Did you meet them boat?
Speaker 1 (41:11):
I got to meet them both, so and it was
it was life changing. I mean, to see how your
your support is actually translating is unbelievable. And the families
like you're they consider you're part of their family because
of what you're doing for them, and how how just
(41:32):
irrevocably their lives are changed for the better. And so
I can I can't. I can't champion them enough to
you know, there's there's so many children about I think
twenty thousand kids last I heard, if I'm not mistaken,
that still needs sponsorship. And if yeah, if you want
to make a massive difference in the world and a
(41:54):
child's life and a family's life and a community's life, run,
don't walk.
Speaker 2 (41:59):
That's what we have such plenty in America.
Speaker 1 (42:01):
Oh my god, we don't.
Speaker 2 (42:03):
We're ignorant to they that we have. Yeah, and you
go to these other countries and you realize what a
small amount of money transforms, not only a family of community,
remakes a community. I mean, and like you said, something
as simple as clean water has such an enormous impact
on a group of people. They can also suddenly live
(42:24):
closer together, and it's something we take for granted. I'm
noticing your your hoodie.
Speaker 1 (42:29):
As I saw this. Yes, oh, this whole thing.
Speaker 2 (42:31):
Yes, if it's a symbol, to hell with it. The
famous Flannery O'Connor line, which she someone challenged her on
the reality of the Ucherus. Catholics believe, we're taught. I
believe it is the actual body and blood of Jesus
as affected from bread at the Mass, at each and
every mass, which is what well you would know.
Speaker 1 (42:53):
Which Jesus said, that's right, and he said it, he
said it right on your back. This so this is
the front. This is another color, okay.
Speaker 2 (43:00):
And then it was a symbol, to hell with it.
Speaker 1 (43:02):
And then you have John, oh, the.
Speaker 2 (43:04):
Actress six John six, Yeah, amen, I say to you.
Speaker 1 (43:08):
Yeah, So that's from the Bread of Life discourse, so
that that essentially was the genesis of our belief carried
through to the Last Supper. And then Flannery was at
a party with some socialites, non Catholic socialites, and they
referenced the Eucharist as a pretty good symbol you know
(43:31):
of you know, of Jesus, and she just blurred out, well,
if it's a symbol, to hell with it. Because the
Eucharist was everything for her. She was a daily communicant.
She went to Mass every day, and she was fiery
and when it came to defending the true Presence, that
was her thing.
Speaker 2 (43:51):
And you first wore this. I first saw you wearing
it at a big eucharistic congress in the United States,
which you know, thousands of people came out in Indiana, right.
Speaker 1 (44:02):
Yeah, Indianapolis, sixty thousand, India.
Speaker 2 (44:06):
Why did you choose that this was your design?
Speaker 1 (44:08):
Yes? Yeah, so I had I wore a white T shirt.
I had a white and a black T shirt. I
had these, just two T shirts made just because I thought,
you know what, I just finished that week filming The
Last Supper, and I thought, what could I do that?
Just like I don't have time to shop to make
an outfit for us, you know. So I called up
my my buddies at work with us on the shows,
and I said, can you just make me a T
(44:29):
shirt and put this on it and then on the
back let me I'll send you some scripture and they
I mocked it up for them and I sent them
to design and they printed it out. I actually got
it from one of the guys that was working with me.
I hadn't even seen it ahead of time. I said,
just send it with Paul, And so Paul showed up
and gave me the T shirt and I just wore them.
(44:50):
I'm like, this is great. And then people kind of
went that so they wanted their own. The next day
there were shops on Etsy making knockoffs. I'm like, well,
give a guy chance. Let me get into the game
a little bit. You know, if they want people want
the real thing, the thing that I wore, to the
exact specifications, I can do that.
Speaker 2 (45:07):
The Roomy Edition, the Roomy Edition.
Speaker 1 (45:09):
Yeah, in fact, in here, Oh do.
Speaker 2 (45:13):
You have is it? Is it your own brand? Let
me see look at that with his own John hancockresses
Jonathan Roomy original. That's right, settle, settle in place, So
settle for knockoffs, ladies and gentlemen, when place they get it.
You know, I was watching you.
Speaker 1 (45:30):
That's my website. But we were, oh, what is the
website Jonathanroomy dot com.
Speaker 2 (45:34):
Easy, Jonathan Roomy dot com. You can't miss that. I
want to forget it. We were in New York probably
almost a year ago now, and for uh lent right, Yes,
you and Mark were in town for near fox. People
swarm you when you go to these restaurants. I know
what that eucherst to Congress. You couldn't walk in broad daylight.
(45:56):
They were everybody wants a picture. You are not Now,
you don't naturally take to that part of this. Would
you consider yourself an introvert?
Speaker 1 (46:07):
I an introvert with a side of extrovert. What does
that mean?
Speaker 2 (46:12):
So?
Speaker 1 (46:13):
If I had to put it's funny. I got challenged
on this very recently in an interview, and I said,
I'm more of not by I said I was more
of an introvert, and this gentleman said, I believe everything
except that part. I said, well, here's how I described it.
If you have a scale on one side, there's extrovert,
(46:34):
on another side there's introvert, it kind of slides, so
there's extrovert with a little introvert, a little extrovert with
big introvert. And that's kind of where I live. I'm
more introvert and I like to be left alone.
Speaker 2 (46:48):
You're like your privacy, I do.
Speaker 1 (46:49):
I get anxious when people just start coming up to
me because I'm like, what's going to happen. Sometimes people
they don't necessarily from.
Speaker 2 (46:57):
Around so hard, boundaries so hard.
Speaker 1 (47:00):
Yeah, and they mean well, they mean well.
Speaker 2 (47:02):
I will say this, this is a TV thing. Yeah,
I would argue there's a TV thing. John, Really well,
I'm you know, people ask me what are you? I'm
a handbone, so it doesn't matter to me. I've always
none of this, None of this disturbs me, or word
that they want to come up in piss or slaber
or grab it. You're a pure extrovert. No, I'm not.
I'm actually in spirit. I'm a lot like you.
Speaker 1 (47:23):
See, I think you're on the other side. You're like
extrovert with a bit of interroment.
Speaker 2 (47:27):
Yes, I'm a hermit. When I create. I like to
be alone and have my space, particularly when i'm writing.
And Rebecca, my wife, will tell you, you know, thirty years
she knows you don't go and hear the office when
he's creating. Just stay away. But Moses is in there
with the bush. Don't get burned. But I do find TV.
Speaker 1 (47:46):
It's you.
Speaker 2 (47:46):
And I have friends who are in film, and I
have been at dinners with people in film and we're
together and people will come up and want to take
your picture, please sign something? Can you do video for
my aunt? She loves you. Every night she goes to
bed with you. She needs to hear you right now, ramon.
And this guy is like an Academy Award winner, nothing, Hello,
(48:09):
how are you? And they leave him. They don't, They
don't disturb him at all. Lucky because you're on TV.
Speaker 1 (48:14):
They feel they know you.
Speaker 2 (48:15):
They feel they know you.
Speaker 1 (48:16):
Every week you're with them in their house, and you
are too.
Speaker 2 (48:19):
You're Jesus for them over And it's over the long haul.
It's not on a big screen. It's not for two hours.
It's for a long period of time. It builds an
intimacy that they they absorb and I honor when I
see them. But I but it disturbed. I have colleagues
who it disturbs. They they see it, Oh my god.
They literally go to hiding. They'll hide in bathrooms, they'll
(48:41):
hide in kitchens.
Speaker 1 (48:42):
I was recently, I was recently in a place. I
don't want to say too much. I don't want to
give anything.
Speaker 2 (48:48):
Okay, I don't get details now.
Speaker 1 (48:50):
I was in a place where I was walking with
a friend and I knew if we went one direction,
I would run into more people. And then were walking.
I'm like, oh, there's a side door, and I'm like
starting to make for the side door and he's walking
that way. I'm like, oh gosh, I'm like okay. So
I had to follow him and to shake some hands,
(49:11):
but I was just like, no, we're gonna We're gonna
do this. Okay, Hey, how are you meet you?
Speaker 2 (49:19):
So it's part of it.
Speaker 1 (49:20):
I mean, it is part of the it's part of
what you sign up for.
Speaker 2 (49:22):
It's part of what you sign up for it, and
I always, I always look at it. I interviewed Mother
Teresa many years ago, and Mother Teresa, there was a mob.
Speaker 1 (49:34):
Of people in Brooklyn, Wow.
Speaker 2 (49:36):
And she pulled up and I was in the car
with her little bus. And they said, Mother, we'll go
around back. And she said, no, stop, stop, stop. She
stood up and they said, but Mother, all the people
are here. She said, we have to be here for
the people. Well, this is Jesus here for oh. And
she went out and she shook hands and old babies
(49:56):
and took pictures.
Speaker 1 (49:57):
And he hated it.
Speaker 2 (49:59):
She told me on the bus, you hated it. She said,
every flashbulb I offer up to God. I asked him
for a soul out of purgatory for every flashbulb I
have to look at that. That was her kind of
spiritual way of dealing with it. She was a real introvert,
but she kind of threw herself out there. That was
a big lesson to me, and so I've always.
Speaker 1 (50:19):
Kind of that's really given me something. Yeah, thank you
for that.
Speaker 2 (50:23):
Mother Angelica had a similar approach. I'll tell you that
story later. She was very sick, and I said, why
why don't you go now? And because a bus pulled up,
a big tour bus of people wanted to see her
and couldn't get into the studio her at her network
at EWT, and she was already in her car. I
was closing the door and she put her hand up,
pulled herself out. I said, I said, you can't. You
(50:44):
got to go. It's cold out here. Your asthma's going
to air. She said, they're old, They've come a long way.
She stood up. I said, you're old and you've got
a long way to go, and she said shut up.
When she sat on the hoot of a car Jonathan
for forty five minutes taking picture signing autographs until like
eleven thirty. When I watched that, I thought, you can
take a picture in it, so I think of them
(51:07):
always when I see the crowds. So that'll give you
some inspiration, right.
Speaker 1 (51:12):
I think I think that. Yeah, that's I think I
need to hear that.
Speaker 2 (51:15):
Tell me you said, I read somewhere you want to
do an Exorcist movie. Why haven't we seen enough Pope's Exorcist,
The Exorcist, Exorcist Resurrection, Exorcistism, Emily Rose.
Speaker 1 (51:28):
Aren't we done? I don't know. I mean I think
I think there's there's always room. How many authentic portrayals
of priests? Yeah, in an Exorcist film? Have you seen.
Speaker 2 (51:45):
My friend Bill Blade is just what the original? Yeah? Right?
Speaker 1 (51:48):
Yeah, yeah, So I think there's something to be said
for like, you know, Father Damien in the film, like
he felt like a real guy with that. That's the
kind of a story, like a holy man, you know
what I mean.
Speaker 2 (52:06):
But with flaws.
Speaker 1 (52:07):
He's flaws. He's fighting himself, he's struggling, but he's called
to something greater than himself and he sacrifices himself. What
a beautiful story that is and so well done.
Speaker 5 (52:17):
It's not about the theatrics, it's not about the spinning
and the thing and the crawling on them, Like who cares, Like,
where's the human drama in these movies? You know, it's
not just jump scarce, Like, I'm not interested in jump scares.
Speaker 2 (52:29):
Well, that's why the most recent one failed. That Resurrection
movie was a disaster and they threw the iconography off,
which is a Catholic ritual of exorcism. That's what Bill
Bladie wrote, when you disturb that, Yeah, you're okay, tell
me what do you want to do next? What do
you want to do after the chosen? Have you thought
(52:49):
that far down the line? Yeah?
Speaker 1 (52:51):
Yeah, I'm developing a couple of different projects that that
I think could work again. You know, some fantastic stories
of some holy folks that would work as really great
films and I think would be compelling. And they have
a phenomenal story about the triumph of the human spirit
with the help of God in very extreme circumstances. So yeah,
(53:16):
I'm working on We always need those stories.
Speaker 2 (53:18):
Yeah, and more of them. Okay, this is our annual routine,
a Royal Grande questionnaire. I asked this of everybody. These
are fast questions. You can go as long or short
as you want. Okay, and the light is burning, so
here we go. Who is the person you most admire.
Speaker 1 (53:38):
Jonathan Roumy person I most admire. There's two, and it
would have to be my parents. I think, knowing the
circumstances that they overcame to make it to the United
States and to raise a family, and to basically just
(53:59):
do everything in service to making sure their children had
a better life.
Speaker 2 (54:03):
Who's the person you most despise?
Speaker 1 (54:06):
Oh the devil? Mm yeah, okay, so I was trying
to get my way.
Speaker 2 (54:12):
I know the feeling. I met him once or twice
or maybe more than that. Uh, what's your best feature?
Speaker 1 (54:21):
My best feature? And I think it would be I
trust people pretty quickly, and I opened myself up to people.
Speaker 2 (54:29):
What's your worst feature?
Speaker 1 (54:31):
I trust people pretty quickly. I opened myself up to people.
Speaker 2 (54:35):
When I when someone first asked me that question and said,
what's your best feature? I thought physical? I think, well,
my lips, I don't know my hands, I don't know
what I but everybody asked it to they go to
something much.
Speaker 1 (54:47):
Deeper because it sounds prideful to answer it.
Speaker 2 (54:49):
Other Wise, always think what it is. Thank you, John.
I think Jonathan Ruby just said I'm pride thank you. Well,
that's the last question.
Speaker 1 (54:55):
That's That's how I can't. I couldn't allow myself to
answer it any other way.
Speaker 2 (55:01):
Yeah, you wanted to say your hair go ahead, but
your fee would say oh people, people would say, would
not the makeup lady? Anyway? Your favorite meal?
Speaker 1 (55:15):
See, I just was in Italy. It's a combination of
steak impasta.
Speaker 2 (55:21):
Okay, well that's a good place to be. I'd say pizza.
I love pizza. Anyway. What do you fear?
Speaker 1 (55:27):
What do you fear not fulfilling my potential?
Speaker 2 (55:34):
The greatest virtue is what Jonathan humility? M M mother
of all, mother of all the virtues, the word you
could not live without. I won't beleeve you.
Speaker 1 (55:55):
That was it.
Speaker 2 (55:56):
Okay, we'll leave that there. Then, family, If you could
do anything else, if you couldn't do this, what would
you do? Visual art?
Speaker 1 (56:06):
Maybe musician? Oh yeah, maybe I would be I would
have pursued being a drummer in a band a little
more stringently. I love music. Music. Music affects me in
a way that none of the arts do. It's just.
Speaker 5 (56:23):
It's it's uh, there's no thoughts, takes offense, yeah, almost,
It's a feeling.
Speaker 1 (56:27):
It's a feeling. Yeah, you can't just doesn't nothing else comparison.
Speaker 2 (56:31):
What's the best advice you ever got and from whom
the best advice I ever got?
Speaker 1 (56:41):
Uh, that's a tough one. Yeah. I think that the
best advice I got was get a spiritual director.
Speaker 2 (56:53):
Yeah, when did that come?
Speaker 1 (56:59):
Don't one? I have now my priest, that spiritual director
that I have now, I've had him the longest. But
the initial advice I got probably was twenty years ago,
and it was many many years before I could find somebody.
I was moving around a lot, and I just wasn't
settled in my faith and I didn't look as hard.
(57:22):
So I think once once I was in La my faith.
Funny enough, you know, people think people think of Hollywood
in LA as a godless place, and there's a lot
of influence, a lot of dark influences in those areas
in that city, but there's also a lot of light
and a lot of people searching for the light, and
(57:43):
a lot of people fighting the darkness. And the communities
that I had, the faith communities that I built and
I had and grew a part of, were communities of light.
And through those communities I found my spiritual director has
been probably about six seven years now. Yeah, what's your
biggest regret. I think my biggest regret would be that
(58:17):
I didn't find I didn't surrender sooner to God. But also,
on the other hand, it's hard to it's hard to
admit that because it's hard to think that that is
actually true, because you know, I believe this was my
(58:40):
path right. God allowed me to wander, neander until I
got to this point in my life where I finally
recognized that I couldn't do this without him, and that's
when I was ready for this next step. So I
don't know that I can really say that I have
a regret, a deep regret.
Speaker 2 (59:02):
What happens when this is over?
Speaker 1 (59:05):
This interview probably get some neat.
Speaker 2 (59:07):
Don't be a smart ass. What happens when the.
Speaker 1 (59:09):
Life is over?
Speaker 2 (59:11):
Ah?
Speaker 1 (59:12):
Would you say this, Raymond?
Speaker 2 (59:14):
You have to interpretation.
Speaker 1 (59:17):
That's why I said dinner when this is over. I
hope that when this is over, we we go on
to the the real life, the real phase of our existence,
the real purpose of our existence, which would be for
(59:39):
me to find to be reunified with our creator, the
source of all life.
Speaker 2 (59:48):
I'm so grateful for your time and for your being here.
It's always a joy. Thank you, Joey.
Speaker 1 (59:54):
Thanks Brandon.
Speaker 2 (59:54):
Pleasure, always a pleasure, Pleasure to my friend. Cannot wait
to see the next season. You Okay, here's the hole.
The faith of Jonathan Rumy is so interesting to me
this Lenten season for Christians at least, it's all about surrender,
and it is fascinating to see the surrender of Rumi.
He was literally at the end of his rope, when
(01:00:16):
he had nowhere else to go, when he put his trust,
as he said, in something bigger than himself, in God,
even when he saw no path and look at the
one that he was led to. Suddenly, the first part
of The Chosen Season five hits theaters on March twenty eighth,
and it's streaming on Amazon. I hope you'll come back
(01:00:38):
to the Arroyo Grande soon. Why live a dry, narrow,
constricted life when if you fill it with good things
that can flow into a broad, thriving Arroyo Grande. I'm
reading an Arroyo. Make sure you subscribe and like this episode.
Thanks for diving in. We'll see you next time. Arroyo
Grande is produced in partnership with iHeart Podcasts and is
(01:01:01):
available on the iHeartRadio Apple wherever you get your podcasts,
I got to the point where I was completely out
of money, I was massively in debt, I was out
of food. And the moment I let go of the
control that I had imposed upon myself and I gave
it over to God, that's when things turned around. Like
that very day, and then a few months later I
booked The Chosen, and here we are five seasons later.
Speaker 2 (00:21):
You're playing Jesus over a long haul. Did you ever
say maybe I shouldn't do this.
Speaker 1 (00:27):
I remember in the first season, I became very self
aware of the fact that I was now preaching parables
and I hadn't done that yet. Kind of got overwhelmed,
and I thought to myself, I shouldn't be saying these words,
like I'm not worthy to be doing this, and.
Speaker 2 (00:44):
I'm Raven Arroyo. Welcome to Arroyo Grande. Jonathan Roomy or
streaming Jesus, depending on your perspective, is coming out to
talk about the new season of The Chosen, how playing
Jesus has changed him and the faith that sustains his work.
(01:07):
Subscribing like the Arroyo Grande podcast. Get your notifications, go
ahead click them now. Why do you want to miss
an episode? First, a little free flow. Did you see
Luigi Maggioni being dragged into the Manhattan Criminal Court the
other day? Now, when an accused murderer is paraded into court,
a normal person says, I'm glad they got him in chains,
throw the book at him. He's charged with shooting a
(01:30):
healthcare ceo in the back, and they have the receipts.
But for the one hundred plus women lining the hallways
of the Manhattan Criminal Court and millions more looking in
on social media, they could care less. They weren't looking
at Luigi's ankle cuffs. They were looking at his designer loafers.
Within twenty four hours of his court appearance, searches of
(01:53):
Luigi Maggione's loafers leapt one thousand, four hundred percent. The
Luigi Acts have turned this murder suspect into a heart prompt.
They obsess over his outfits. They're selling out Luigi's sweaters.
They wear their free Luigi gear at every appearance. Mobs
of protesters were outside the courthouse demanding Maggioni's freedom. One
(02:17):
of these geniuses called Luigi quote the new Martin Luther King.
Last time I checked, Martin Luther King was shot. He
didn't shoot others, and what civil right is Maggioni fighting
for exactly? Unibrows. I don't follow the reasoning, but the
Maggioni protesters are also following in their obsessions footsteps. They're
(02:41):
actually calling for the death of other healthcare CEOs. They're
demanding the freedom of a guy who's accused of shooting
a CEO and think others should die. Got it. One
of Maggioni's fangirls said she has Luigi fever. No, my dear,
it's more like a Luigi play, because you were lionizing
(03:01):
this Ivy League gunslinger, pretending he's a Baltimore version of
James Bond when he's probably just another justsgruntled lunatic who
decided to kill somebody who ran a company he didn't like.
Imagine if we all do that, And if you were
a sixty year old guy with a beer belly, I
doubt if you'd be googling his sweaters. Consider the superficiality,
(03:23):
the stupidity of someone buying Luigi Maggioni's loafers. Why would
any sane person want to literally and figuratively walk in
the shoes of a murderer? And after the Super Bowl
loss of the Kansas City Chiefs, there was massive speculation
that Travis Kelsey would retire from the NFL, but fear not.
(03:46):
Like Groundhog Day, Kelsey saw no shadows at all, and
he announced that he's returning to the Chiefs next season,
which means there'll be eighteen more weeks of unbroken tailor
swift and just in time for Land. Christianity is bouncing back.
According to Pew's research. Their latest study, sixty two percent
(04:07):
of people in the United States define themselves as Christian. Now,
this is a turnabout from a decline in twenty twenty.
The so called nons, those with no religious affiliation, have
completely stalled, dropping by a point. And among the young
this is fascinating. Among those eighteen to twenty four year olds,
fifty seven percent of both young men and women are
(04:31):
equally invested in daily prayer and believe in God. That
is a closing of the gender gap that we've never seen,
and it shows young men are more engaged than in
years past. Surprise, the religion rooted in resurrection is rising again.
Speaking of that, to the deep dive, the Chosen has
(04:54):
become a global sensation, viewed by hundreds of millions of people.
Part of the reason for that'sc excess is Jonathan Roumy's
portrayal of Jesus. He sat down with me to discuss
the fifth season of the show, which covers the Last
Supper and leads to the Passion. He told me about
his first hesitation playing the role, how it changed him,
(05:16):
where that accent came from, and what he wants to
do after Jesus. Here's Jonathan Roumy tell me, Jonathan Roumy,
I'm so glad you're here. Thank you for being on
the show. You grew up in New York, Yes, went
to school in New York. How did that shape you
for what you're doing now?
Speaker 1 (05:35):
I think, like the Sinatra song goes, if I can
make it here, I can make it anywhere, And it
gives you a certain edge and a boldness and a
toughness and a resilience and an ability to survive that
I think you don't get too many other places. It's
a challenge. So I grew up mostly in the suburbs.
(05:55):
I started in the city, moved to the suburbs, ended
up back in the city, and the city was my speed.
It just felt right to me, and I felt like
this is what a city should be. And then when
you travel to other cities, you're like, oh, this isn't
really the lights are all city, you know, they closed
(06:16):
by ten?
Speaker 2 (06:16):
Like, how is that where a diner? Where is there
a diner here somewhere? Yeah, you enrolled in the school
of Visual Arts and you're studying film. What drew you
to that?
Speaker 1 (06:29):
I was always fascinated by film. I had spent most
of my younger years as a visual artist.
Speaker 2 (06:36):
And well, that's right, you were creating it still create
I mean you did it for the Jesus Revolution movie. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (06:42):
Yeah, I was allowed the ability to collaborate on the
mantle that I wore in that and that movie. So
I was I was very much into illustration and painting,
and I thought maybe I would go into that, but
movies just really just stole focus for me, and I thought,
(07:04):
I think I want to work in films, in visual
effects or in the visual arts behind films. And then
when I went to film school, I started, you know,
I had to take acting, I had to take directing,
and I started enjoying the process of working with actors
and the process of acting myself I found terrifying. But
(07:27):
I thought if I was gonna be a director, which
is something that I seriously considered while in film school.
I thought, I think I should experience what it's like
to be put in that position. So once I got
out of school, I wanted to get more experience knowing
what the actor goes through so that it would make
(07:48):
me a more proficient director when the time came.
Speaker 2 (07:52):
How did you do that?
Speaker 1 (07:54):
I started, well, I started by trying to find my
way in the voiceover industry. So there was I had
a penchant for impressions and dialects and and I'm I'm
a pretty good mimic. Yeah, And so I reached out
(08:16):
to this casting director for a show that MTV was
doing at the time called Celebrity death Match. Oh yeah,
you remember that show.
Speaker 2 (08:23):
Which was celebrity voices in a death.
Speaker 1 (08:25):
Match, in a death match and fight to the death
in all sorts of crazy ways. And and I just
wrote to this casting director and I thought, you know, well,
maybe this is a good way to try to get
some acting experience without having to go full on, you know,
full full frontal way in theater or on television or
anything like their even commercials. And and so I started
(08:47):
working in voiceover and then that same casting director presented
me with my first opportunity for an on camera promotional video,
like a promo for the Video Music Awards one year,
and I never auditioned for anything on camera before, and
I ended up booking it, and I thought, this is
this is weird. This isn't how I thought. I didn't
(09:09):
expect to get it. I just thought, well, it'd be
kind of cool just to try. And so when I
actually booked it, I thought, oh, maybe, I don't know,
maybe God's got a plan that this is part of
my career path here or something. And then that led
to more commercials and more voiceover, and then I did
my first play and then I really got hooked and
(09:30):
that was it. Yeah, and then I started trying to
find ways to make it.
Speaker 2 (09:34):
More right and then you're out. You're out in La.
Speaker 1 (09:37):
Years later, I moved to LA. I moved to LA
in twenty ten. Oh boy. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (09:43):
And then there was a long up and down drought
period in LA, which drought, which happens to a lot
of actors.
Speaker 1 (09:50):
LA is a dry place.
Speaker 2 (09:52):
It is a very dry place, this is true.
Speaker 1 (09:54):
But droughts for decades.
Speaker 2 (09:55):
Yeah, in more ways than one.
Speaker 1 (09:57):
Yeah. So yeah, So for eight years iggled in LA
before things turned around for me.
Speaker 2 (10:02):
But you said, and you said that life backed me
into a corner in twenty eighteen or so. How did
that happen?
Speaker 1 (10:13):
Well, I was trying to balance several different side jobs
and none of them were none of them were allowing
me to make enough money to just do one thing
and pursue acting. I had to I had to do
many different things, and so I had to I had
(10:33):
to spread my energy in a number of different ways
just to survive. And it got to the point.
Speaker 3 (10:40):
Where I couldn't get arrested for the survival jobs like
I would I would call up these you know, these
folks that that would hire me in a number of
different you know, contractor positions, and I couldn't.
Speaker 1 (10:55):
There was nothing happening. And so and for like two weeks,
three weeks, this happened, and I thought it was very bizarre,
and I thought, what's going on? Like this is unseasonably dry.
It was an unseasonable dry spell for me with just
(11:16):
trying to survive. And I got to the point where
I was completely out of money. I was massively in debt,
I was out of food, and I didn't know what
else to do, then to just you know, drop to
my knees in prayer and at that point just pour
my heart out to God and ask him why he
(11:37):
brought me to this place if it wasn't for you know,
this purpose to pursue acting full time. And I had
got tastes of what a career could look like, but
it never really panned out to anything beyond just an
episode of television here and there. And then that day
I experienced this financial miracle that to me was a
(11:59):
sign that the moment I let go of the control
that I had imposed upon myself, imposed upon my career
to try to be uh responsible for everything that took place,
for everything that happened, the moment I let go of
that and I and I gave it over to God,
that's when things turned around like that very day in
(12:21):
a very dramatic way. And then a few months later
I booked The Chosen and here we are five seasons later, amazing.
Speaker 2 (12:29):
What's the takeaway for other people looking in on that?
I mean, at times those dark valleys are really where
you find you can't see the light except through a.
Speaker 1 (12:39):
Dark valley like that, right right? I think the takeaway
Raymond would be that you have to put your faith
in something bigger than yourself. You have to you have
to really commit to an idea that's that's bigger than yourself.
(13:00):
And for me, that was the Divine power as God
in my life as somebody that had a profession of
faith as a Catholic Christian, I had to really put
my money where my mouth was and believe the things
that my faith told me that I believe that that
(13:23):
were true. If I didn't believe them, then why practice
my faith? But if I if I did, if I
was practicing my faith, then I had to really examine
whether or not I believe those things were true. Did
I believe that God is in charge my life? Do
I stand on his promises for all the things that
he said that if I give him my burdens and
(13:46):
my yoke, that he can carry it for me or
with me? And do I trust him? Do I trust
them in the unknown, in the circumstances that are sometimes
overwhelming and beyond me. And when I could finally answer
truthfully and holy and completely, yes I trust him, That's
(14:09):
when everything changed.
Speaker 2 (14:11):
And then Jesus literally and figuratively stalks you really from
that moment to this. I mean, look, I saw you
in a traveling production playing Jesus on the road. How
did that come to be? Tell us a little about that,
and more importantly from again, this is just my own curiosity.
(14:32):
How did your portrayal of Jesus or understanding of him
change from that traveling production to today? Or did it?
Speaker 1 (14:43):
It's a good question. So that started, that traveling show
started five years before the Chosen Yeah, six months after
I filmed my portion of that show. Because it was
essentially projected high in the actress on a screen, so
this actress would would essentially interact with the characters on
(15:06):
the screen of which I was playing. It was Jesus
for the first time. And six months later I auditioned
for a short film for Dallas Jenkins. The creative had
chosen about the two Thieves called the Two Thieves Crucified
alongside Jesus and.
Speaker 2 (15:24):
How did that? How did you meet him? How did
that happen?
Speaker 1 (15:27):
So that audition came through I think one of my
agents at the time, and it was just they were
casting out of Los Angeles. He was based in Chicago,
and they said, hey, here's here's a short film audition.
It was like they would pay me something crazy like
a few hundred bucks a day, and they would fly
me at him like I'd love to get flown out
(15:47):
for a job like it.
Speaker 2 (15:48):
Why not?
Speaker 1 (15:48):
Why not? I was? That was that was big, big
time for me at the time. And so I auditioned,
and I auditioned initially for one of the Thieves, which
I didn't get because two days later after that audition,
they said, hey, they want you to read for Jesus.
And I'm like, ah, Jesus got like five lines the thief.
Theb is like, it's all about art, It's all about
the penitent theeb. It's an amazing art. But I had
(16:12):
just played Jesus in the right show and I was thought, well,
I'd love to play Jesus again. Maybe see what I
can come up with this time. And uh, And I
ended up booking that and from that began this, you
know what is now a ten year relationship with Dallas.
Jenkins did two more short films for his church and
that in that Vein, and then a year and a
half later he called me for the Chosen.
Speaker 2 (16:34):
For the pilot for the Chosen? What was it that
was the Shepherd? Was that called?
Speaker 1 (16:38):
So? What was that so no, so, so he called
me for the the main series for the Chosen eight months.
Nine months before that, he did a pilot called The
Shepherd for his It was probably his the last film
he did for his church's Christmas service on the heels
(16:59):
of his own kind of struggle and failure with his
feature film at the time, and so he dumped all
his energy into that short film. That short film gets
released and goes viral. They use that as the basis
to crowdfod on four episodes and then eight episodes once
the first season of it Chosen. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (17:21):
So I'm gonna go back to my earlier question, how
did it change your portrayal change?
Speaker 1 (17:25):
I think it's become more refined. I think obviously, I've
become much more comfortable in the character. Every season, I'm
more comfortable in the skin, so to speak, of the character,
because it's it's like putting on a familiar coat and
just like a cozy little.
Speaker 4 (17:42):
Coat and or tunic or in the case maybe Yeah,
And I think those those kinds of roles once when
you have that.
Speaker 1 (17:55):
Much time to spend with a character, with that direct
with one director, and for me and Dallas, it's been
ten years even though we're five seasons into the show,
you know, there's a certain familiarity and a certain and
I mean even between the Traveling Show and the short
film the I noticed I can see that my accent
(18:21):
was much more settled in, Like I really found the
subtlety of the accent because I think in the Traveling
Show it was the first time I ever tried it.
Nobody had ever done a Middle Eastern accent.
Speaker 2 (18:32):
That's what I was going to ask you. Where did it
come from? Where did the accent originate? Did you hear
it somewhere? Did somebody?
Speaker 1 (18:38):
So I grew up with that accent. So I grew
up with a Middle Eastern accent. So my father's from
Egypt in the accent is a combination of my father's
accent and my aunt was from Palestine, sort of a
meld of the two of them. So he's got a
very for my years, a very light accent. She's got
a thicker accent, and so I just kind of blended
the two and that became the basis for the role
(19:01):
for me, for Jesus for the first one. And then
I noticed when I did it again, I kind of
lightened up on it because there were some things that
if I spoke with a heavy Middle Eastern accent, not
every not the average American from Middle America, they might
not understand some of the words I'd say because it's thick.
And so I just streamlined it a bit more. And
(19:21):
that sort of has stayed the same.
Speaker 2 (19:23):
M You know, it reminds me. I did Carol O'Connor's
last interview, who famously played Archie Bunker, of course, and
of course you know he spoke nothing. Why he was
a very refined man. And I said, where did this
accent come from? Guess where it came from?
Speaker 1 (19:37):
Queens?
Speaker 2 (19:38):
His mother?
Speaker 1 (19:38):
His mother, his mother who.
Speaker 2 (19:40):
Had a gigger right ear, couldn't he said she would
imitate all the girls down at the market. And then
he took a little of James Cagney and a little
of Jackie Gleeson whom he knew, and came up with
Archie Bunker. So the lab was very similar to the
roomy method.
Speaker 1 (19:55):
That's amazing, that's fascinating on her.
Speaker 2 (19:57):
Well, it comes. You know, we're borrowings things, you see, things,
you try them on. It's an it is an awkward
and odd art. I mean, you're taking things from life
and you're trying them in. Sometimes they work, sometimes they don't.
But when you're dealing with a role like Jesus, there
are such expectations Jonathan that had to be overwhelming. When
(20:19):
you got into the series business. It's not you're not
playing him in a film or one off. You're playing
over a long haul. Did you ever say maybe I
shouldn't do this.
Speaker 1 (20:31):
I never said that I shouldn't do it. I remember
in the first season. I definitely when I had my
first big speech in front of maybe about fifty or
one hundred extras, I became very self aware of the
fact that I was now preaching parables and I hadn't
done that yet. So I was preaching from various parables,
(20:56):
and I suddenly became self aware that the of the
words that I was saying and what I was actually doing,
and how people were looking at me, and it kind
of drew me out of the scene for a second
where I kind of I kind of got overwhelmed, and
I thought to myself, I shouldn't be saying these words,
(21:17):
like I shouldn't be here doing this because it feels
I'm not worthy to be doing this, like to be
playing Jesus for the world to see it just all
of a sudden, it felt like way too much. And
so Dallas, we were shooting the scene and we were
getting the shot and we were trying he was trying
(21:38):
to move on, and I was pretty unsettled, and I
at one point I said to him, I'm like, hey, hey,
can we just can we slow down a second? I
just need I need a minute. And he's like, yeah, well,
what's wrong? And we went aside and I took him
aside and I just confided in him. I said, this
is what I'm going through. I don't feel worthy to
be saying these words, like I'm having a hard time
(22:03):
right now. And I was starting to panic a little bit,
and he just very gently was like, he put his
hand on my shoulders, like, listen, man, none of us
are worthy, but we're here because we're meant to be
telling this story and giving me the story to the world.
So you're basically he said, like, you're right where you're
(22:23):
supposed to be. And that kind of brought me back
to reality and I thought, yeah, yeah, there's the reason
I got cast is Jesus for the chosen and somebody
else didn't, So God put me in this position. And
so I just got to honor that and accept it
and know that it might be scary at times. Like
(22:44):
you know, in season five, we just portrayed the Last
Supper and the Garden of gethsemone, and at that point
I went into those scenes and like, you gotta help me.
I have no idea what I'm doing, Like, I have
no idea what you went through for this, Like how
do you recreate the moment in the Garden of gets Sementy?
Speaker 2 (23:02):
Well, I was going to ask you, how do you
prepare for that? I mean, how do you prepare for
this as an actor? I mean it's let's let's just
take that Gardner get Semite. Here's your script, Jonathan. Yeah,
where do.
Speaker 1 (23:13):
You start on my knees in prayer? I mean, that's
honestly that that that's the first place I started. And
I read this and I'm I'm overwhelmed just reading it,
and it's because it's so beautifully written, feels very authentic.
But then I also know there's so much of that
(23:35):
moment that is just a mystery. Right, all of those moments,
there's mystery in each and every one of them. It's
the mystery of faith, right, Yeah, And we and we
have to we have to trust that everything unfolded the
way God meant it to unfold. But living two thousand
years later, that's it's not always easy to understand how
(23:55):
it unfolded. So and I search for the how. I
have to start in prayer and just ask for guidance
and wisdom and inspiration and you know, flurries of the
(24:17):
Holy Spirit whenever it's it makes meaningful sense to try
to tap into it, or it's it's beyond description. Really,
it's beyond a comprehension.
Speaker 2 (24:28):
And do you find it in the moment? Do you
find it when you're on sex?
Speaker 1 (24:32):
Yeah? Some things I do. I mean I don't you know,
you have a plan and then best laid plan.
Speaker 2 (24:38):
Sometimes, yeah, you throw them out pretty quickly.
Speaker 1 (24:41):
Yeah, you you. The thing that makes any performance works
is spontaneity, living in the moment, being present in that
moment to whatever external stimulus they find its way into
the scene. And it could be being overwhelmed with emotion
(25:02):
and something that you've said ten times and it hasn't
done anything. On the eleventh time, all of a sudden,
it's like the floodgates and you're like, where did that come?
From I don't know. That's holy Spirit, that's inspiration, it's God,
it's it's the art. It's it's doing it ten times
and just maybe just being and getting out of the way,
getting out of the way and just exhausted and finally
(25:24):
you're like free to just be. So Yeah, it is.
It is a strange art, but that's that's the excitement
of doing it.
Speaker 2 (25:34):
How how has Jesus changed for you in these five seasons?
I know this last season had to be emotionally. You're
playing a different part of Jesus here. And this is
no longer really the public ministry. This is the private
the beginning of the private torture.
Speaker 1 (25:52):
Yeah, Jus.
Speaker 2 (26:00):
Run for a long My house should be called a
house of prayer, but you make it a den of feet?
By what authority are you doing these things?
Speaker 1 (26:17):
My own?
Speaker 2 (26:19):
How did it change? I know it had to shift
your understanding of Him and what he personally went through
in these moments.
Speaker 1 (26:30):
Yeah, I think Jesus doesn't change. I change my understanding
hopefully increases in the search to in the seeking of
(26:51):
this communion, this emotional communion, the spiritual communion with his
experience on earth. I think I have to be open
to the possibilities of gaining deeper insights as to what
he might have went through. And for me, I guess
(27:12):
the way that I would describe that for this past
season would be a deeper connection to his pain and
his loneliness and his isolation, especially with his friends, the
(27:35):
people that he spent three years with, and then knowing
that they're for the most part, all of them are
going to lead in his hour of need, and knowing
that before they know it, and trying to reconcile and
(27:56):
not show that. And then especially with regards to Judas,
knowing that he was chosen, and he was picked and
he did signs and wonders, you know, when he was
sent out just like the rest of them did and
didn't work out for them coming back.
Speaker 2 (28:17):
Yeah, well this is always I mean, this is to
me just looking at this, I always marvel it the
guts it takes to play a role like this. I
look at you in Cavisel and I go, oh, that's
tough stuff, because you're dealing with a character. If I
can use the term, he's got complete understanding. I mean
(28:37):
you think of the child Jesus. Yeah, I'm always a
marvel a gas at the child Jesus because at some
point at the age of reason, church fathers believe he
looks at the adults and he suddenly I mean the
reason he's preaching in the temple at twelve is because
he was probably giving orders to the family at mine.
You know, his understanding of what was happening, and the
humility of the parents to sit back urgin Mary and
(29:00):
Joseph to look at this and go, WHOA, what do
we This is nobody signed up for anything like this before.
So as he reaches we miss an email or something.
Is there a God for this kid? I mean the
depth of that, the humility of that too, And I'm
sure this is the same thing you're getting at. He
knows when he looks in the eyes, in the hearts
(29:20):
of these people, he knows. And how do you portray
that as an actor? I love you, but I know
what you're going to do. Yeah, come back, but I
know where you're going. That's a difficult thing to play.
Speaker 1 (29:33):
Yeah. Yeah. In fact, I think that we recently released
that very scene where it's sort of a precursor to
the betrayal and what was Judas trying to do? What
was Judas hoping to accomplish with Jesus as the Messiah figurehead,
(29:56):
the Davidic understanding of a Messiah versus Jesus was actually
going to do as Messiah, and what would that conversation
have looked like, and what happens after that conversation and
what happens with Jesus and what happens with Judas and
so yeah, that scenes actually on the live stream that
(30:16):
we just had all that. It's really I think there
was a moment where that was one of those scenes
where four or five takes or ten takes before I
didn't have that reaction at the end, and you know,
to give too much away, And then there was one
(30:37):
take where all of a sudden, the reality of my
friend knowing that I've lost him was too much to bear,
and I wept for him. And I didn't know. I
think we had talked about it, and I didn't think
that they were going to use that because I thought
(30:58):
it might be a little too early. But when I
saw it in the cutouts, like it works great because
it's that's exactly what we're talking about, Like, how could
he what would he have felt going through the human
part of him, the fully completely human part of him,
what would he experience knowing that that's happening and he
knows it's going to happen.
Speaker 2 (31:20):
And answer me, give me an honest answer on this.
The worst and the best part of the fifth season.
Worst part first, because I love bad news up front.
Speaker 1 (31:29):
The worst part, the worst part of the season, like
in the story.
Speaker 2 (31:36):
No, in the shooting, in the world, in the work.
This is an easy as for you.
Speaker 1 (31:41):
Gosh, sixteen page scenes, I mean, more dialogue than I've
ever had in my life. But also simultaneously that becomes
the best part because these scenes are amazing. Yeah, I
mean Jesus essentially flipping tables in the marketplace, Like when
(32:07):
when do you get to how often have we seen that?
Speaker 2 (32:09):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (32:10):
Portrayed not very often, very rare, And so I kind
of feel and we build up to it in a
way that it's right out of scripture, and you see
for the first time in many cases, how he got
to that point, why he got to that point, what
drove him to that point, knowing when he did get
(32:30):
to that point that that was going to seal the deal.
Yeah yeah, and then there was no turning back. He
knew he had. So we sort of chart.
Speaker 2 (32:39):
All of that you've also you've also been playing a
very loving, concerned connected Jesus. That scene had to be
very different for you.
Speaker 1 (32:52):
With the fury.
Speaker 2 (32:53):
The race's justifiable line.
Speaker 1 (32:56):
Is great though, that's so fun.
Speaker 2 (32:59):
You've been building up.
Speaker 1 (33:00):
I've seen it all, man, I've been waiting for that.
But it's the it's the righteous wrath of God seeing
his people being just completely taken advantage of by people
who profess to be priests, you know, high priests that
are just just completely and he snaps, yeah, yeah, I
(33:24):
mean taking advantage of is I mean extortion? It was
extortion for the poorest of the poor during this this
wholy during the passover, right like the most holy time,
where people had nothing were being extorted. I think fifty
sixty times, you know what they would pay for an
animal for sacrifice, and like just the taxation. There was
(33:49):
so much that just drove him to say, that's all
I can stand. I can't stand no more.
Speaker 2 (33:56):
That's it.
Speaker 1 (33:57):
That's it.
Speaker 2 (33:58):
Does your team ever look you and say, Jonathan, let's
be very careful about this Jesus thing. No more Jesus
is no more holy men. Is that part of the conversation?
Not yet, not yet.
Speaker 1 (34:14):
No no, because I mean.
Speaker 2 (34:16):
Because it's not on one off. I'm going to say
this again. Yeah, you're not playing him in one film,
You're playing him over many years, so multiple generations are
getting a taste of you in this role, and you
are so identified with that role. Is that a concern
for you as an actor?
Speaker 1 (34:35):
You know? I think I gave up that concern when
I got the job. When when this job came to me,
I had nothing, and I knew that anything that came
to me was from God's hand, and that whatever he
willed for my life, whatever he wanted me to do,
(34:57):
whatever came to me, I would always kind of discern
it through him and say, is Sis, what do you
think should we do this one? You know? So would
I do another long form series as a as a
preacher type? Probably not. I'd like to do other things.
(35:17):
I think when you've played Jesus as far as holy
man goes, I mean, where can I go into there?
And quite little like yeah, so, you know, But for
films I have, I mean, I've got ideas and other
projects that I'm working on that that are relating to
(35:37):
the stories, wonderful stories of various holy Men throughout history
that are just fascinating. That would be fascinating to play more,
most likely films, but not not TV.
Speaker 2 (35:51):
Serious Okay, but you'd be open to playing other saintly figures.
Speaker 1 (35:56):
Sure, Sure, if the script is great, it's got to
be great.
Speaker 2 (36:01):
Yeah, tell me about Solomeo, this new Kevin James movie,
a rom com to rom com, and you play.
Speaker 1 (36:08):
A non saint, not a holy man. I play. I
play a guy who's one half of a couple that
is in this story. So basically, Solomeo is the story
of a guy played by Kevin James, Matt who gets
(36:28):
stood up on his wedding day by his fiance in Rome.
So he gets convinced to go on his honeymoon anyway
because it's a non refundable package. Of course, so he's
got the package, he might as well while he's figuring
out what went wrong, take the trip, and there he
(36:51):
meets these two kind of quirky, wacky couples that are
part of this same package of honeymooners, American honeymooners in Rome.
Speaker 2 (37:00):
I see that.
Speaker 1 (37:01):
See he's by himself doing all these things like tandem
bike riding by himself, rowing a canoe in like this
lover's pond by himself, and so we're like, we need
to fix that guy and help them. And so I
played Neil, a therapist who sees Matt as an opportunity
(37:22):
to fix him. Little do we know, I'm actually a
physical therapist, not a psychotherapist. But I've got some delusions
of grandeur and hilarity ensuit and.
Speaker 2 (37:32):
You're doing your Did you enjoy it playing the comedy?
Speaker 1 (37:36):
It was a blast? Yeah. I mean I started in comedy,
you know, Celebrity Deathmatch and then a lot of the
most of the on camera TV projects that I've had
common comedies.
Speaker 2 (37:48):
Well, the comedic touch helps for Jesus too. I see
the I see the comedy glint. When you played Jesus,
which is just a human will it humanizes that's right,
it makes him human. Without that, he's he's a little untouchable.
Speaker 1 (38:01):
He's so remote, but it becomes too mystical and not human, right,
you know, like when you start denying Jesus is humanity,
that's a problem. If you deny his divinity, it's a problem.
You have to accept the hypostatic union of fully god
fully man minus the sin, and there you have Jesus.
And so that's the balance of playing him well.
Speaker 2 (38:23):
I like that you bring that little touch to it.
It makes it a full portrait. Tell me about Unbound.
This is an organization you get involved with in twenty nineteen.
Speaker 1 (38:33):
That's right?
Speaker 2 (38:35):
Why how did this come to be? You sponsor a child?
How does that work?
Speaker 1 (38:40):
So in twenty nineteen, I in an attempt to, I think,
just show gratitude to God for what he had given
me in this first season of The Chosen and how
people were starting to find it and I was getting
back on my feet. I wanted to make sure that
I that I remembered to take care of the less fortunate,
(39:05):
because got took care of me when I was in
dire need, and so I could I couldn't avoid feeling
that I had to do something as well. So I
found I looked up charities that were the top rated charities,
and Unbounds like in the top five or something at
the time. And they are an organization that was started
(39:29):
forty something years ago by Catholic lay people and they
basically have children that you can sponsor by in foreign countries,
in foreign countries and third world countries that need you know,
any everything from school supplies to the ability to go
to school, to food, to all sorts of needs. And
(39:52):
for a very meager amount, you basically sponsor a child
or an elderly person, which not too many other charities do.
There aren't a whole other a whole lot of charities
that are sponsoring both children and elderly people. As they
get older, they you know, they don't have anybody to
look after them. So I started sponsoring this this child,
(40:13):
this boy from Tanzania, and yeah, for a small sum
you basically they get to go to school, they get
food put on their table. It creates this opportunity not
just for the child, but for the family now to
be able to have resources to budget. And then they're
part of this community of sponsored families that can essentially
(40:37):
dig themselves out of abject poverty. They clean water, they
do have these water projects, they have these these oversight
groups with these mothers that learn to essentially pool finances
and invest and it changes the lives of these like
communities like and in this past summer, I actually got
(40:58):
to go.
Speaker 2 (40:58):
To Tanzania and.
Speaker 1 (41:00):
And Rwanda because about a year ago I also decided
to sponsor their millionth child from Rwanda, this little girl
in Rwanda. So this summer.
Speaker 2 (41:10):
Did you meet them boat?
Speaker 1 (41:11):
I got to meet them both, so and it was
it was life changing. I mean, to see how your
your support is actually translating is unbelievable. And the families
like you're they consider you're part of their family because
of what you're doing for them, and how how just
(41:32):
irrevocably their lives are changed for the better. And so
I can I can't. I can't champion them enough to
you know, there's there's so many children about I think
twenty thousand kids last I heard, if I'm not mistaken,
that still needs sponsorship. And if yeah, if you want
to make a massive difference in the world and a
(41:54):
child's life and a family's life and a community's life, run,
don't walk.
Speaker 2 (41:59):
That's what we have such plenty in America.
Speaker 1 (42:01):
Oh my god, we don't.
Speaker 2 (42:03):
We're ignorant to they that we have. Yeah, and you
go to these other countries and you realize what a
small amount of money transforms, not only a family of community,
remakes a community. I mean, and like you said, something
as simple as clean water has such an enormous impact
on a group of people. They can also suddenly live
(42:24):
closer together, and it's something we take for granted. I'm
noticing your your hoodie.
Speaker 1 (42:29):
As I saw this. Yes, oh, this whole thing.
Speaker 2 (42:31):
Yes, if it's a symbol, to hell with it. The
famous Flannery O'Connor line, which she someone challenged her on
the reality of the Ucherus. Catholics believe, we're taught. I
believe it is the actual body and blood of Jesus
as affected from bread at the Mass, at each and
every mass, which is what well you would know.
Speaker 1 (42:53):
Which Jesus said, that's right, and he said it, he
said it right on your back. This so this is
the front. This is another color, okay.
Speaker 2 (43:00):
And then it was a symbol, to hell with it.
Speaker 1 (43:02):
And then you have John, oh, the.
Speaker 2 (43:04):
Actress six John six, Yeah, amen, I say to you.
Speaker 1 (43:08):
Yeah, So that's from the Bread of Life discourse, so
that that essentially was the genesis of our belief carried
through to the Last Supper. And then Flannery was at
a party with some socialites, non Catholic socialites, and they
referenced the Eucharist as a pretty good symbol you know
(43:31):
of you know, of Jesus, and she just blurred out, well,
if it's a symbol, to hell with it. Because the
Eucharist was everything for her. She was a daily communicant.
She went to Mass every day, and she was fiery
and when it came to defending the true Presence, that
was her thing.
Speaker 2 (43:51):
And you first wore this. I first saw you wearing
it at a big eucharistic congress in the United States,
which you know, thousands of people came out in Indiana, right.
Speaker 1 (44:02):
Yeah, Indianapolis, sixty thousand, India.
Speaker 2 (44:06):
Why did you choose that this was your design?
Speaker 1 (44:08):
Yes? Yeah, so I had I wore a white T shirt.
I had a white and a black T shirt. I
had these, just two T shirts made just because I thought,
you know what, I just finished that week filming The
Last Supper, and I thought, what could I do that?
Just like I don't have time to shop to make
an outfit for us, you know. So I called up
my my buddies at work with us on the shows,
and I said, can you just make me a T
(44:29):
shirt and put this on it and then on the
back let me I'll send you some scripture and they
I mocked it up for them and I sent them
to design and they printed it out. I actually got
it from one of the guys that was working with me.
I hadn't even seen it ahead of time. I said,
just send it with Paul, And so Paul showed up
and gave me the T shirt and I just wore them.
(44:50):
I'm like, this is great. And then people kind of
went that so they wanted their own. The next day
there were shops on Etsy making knockoffs. I'm like, well,
give a guy chance. Let me get into the game
a little bit. You know, if they want people want
the real thing, the thing that I wore, to the
exact specifications, I can do that.
Speaker 2 (45:07):
The Roomy Edition, the Roomy Edition.
Speaker 1 (45:09):
Yeah, in fact, in here, Oh do.
Speaker 2 (45:13):
You have is it? Is it your own brand? Let
me see look at that with his own John hancockresses
Jonathan Roomy original. That's right, settle, settle in place, So
settle for knockoffs, ladies and gentlemen, when place they get it.
You know, I was watching you.
Speaker 1 (45:30):
That's my website. But we were, oh, what is the
website Jonathanroomy dot com.
Speaker 2 (45:34):
Easy, Jonathan Roomy dot com. You can't miss that. I
want to forget it. We were in New York probably
almost a year ago now, and for uh lent right, Yes,
you and Mark were in town for near fox. People
swarm you when you go to these restaurants. I know
what that eucherst to Congress. You couldn't walk in broad daylight.
(45:56):
They were everybody wants a picture. You are not Now,
you don't naturally take to that part of this. Would
you consider yourself an introvert?
Speaker 1 (46:07):
I an introvert with a side of extrovert. What does
that mean?
Speaker 2 (46:12):
So?
Speaker 1 (46:13):
If I had to put it's funny. I got challenged
on this very recently in an interview, and I said,
I'm more of not by I said I was more
of an introvert, and this gentleman said, I believe everything
except that part. I said, well, here's how I described it.
If you have a scale on one side, there's extrovert,
(46:34):
on another side there's introvert, it kind of slides, so
there's extrovert with a little introvert, a little extrovert with
big introvert. And that's kind of where I live. I'm
more introvert and I like to be left alone.
Speaker 2 (46:48):
You're like your privacy, I do.
Speaker 1 (46:49):
I get anxious when people just start coming up to
me because I'm like, what's going to happen. Sometimes people
they don't necessarily from.
Speaker 2 (46:57):
Around so hard, boundaries so hard.
Speaker 1 (47:00):
Yeah, and they mean well, they mean well.
Speaker 2 (47:02):
I will say this, this is a TV thing. Yeah,
I would argue there's a TV thing. John, Really well,
I'm you know, people ask me what are you? I'm
a handbone, so it doesn't matter to me. I've always
none of this, None of this disturbs me, or word
that they want to come up in piss or slaber
or grab it. You're a pure extrovert. No, I'm not.
I'm actually in spirit. I'm a lot like you.
Speaker 1 (47:23):
See, I think you're on the other side. You're like
extrovert with a bit of interroment.
Speaker 2 (47:27):
Yes, I'm a hermit. When I create. I like to
be alone and have my space, particularly when i'm writing.
And Rebecca, my wife, will tell you, you know, thirty years
she knows you don't go and hear the office when
he's creating. Just stay away. But Moses is in there
with the bush. Don't get burned. But I do find TV.
Speaker 1 (47:46):
It's you.
Speaker 2 (47:46):
And I have friends who are in film, and I
have been at dinners with people in film and we're
together and people will come up and want to take
your picture, please sign something? Can you do video for
my aunt? She loves you. Every night she goes to
bed with you. She needs to hear you right now, ramon.
And this guy is like an Academy Award winner, nothing, Hello,
(48:09):
how are you? And they leave him. They don't, They
don't disturb him at all. Lucky because you're on TV.
Speaker 1 (48:14):
They feel they know you.
Speaker 2 (48:15):
They feel they know you.
Speaker 1 (48:16):
Every week you're with them in their house, and you
are too.
Speaker 2 (48:19):
You're Jesus for them over And it's over the long haul.
It's not on a big screen. It's not for two hours.
It's for a long period of time. It builds an
intimacy that they they absorb and I honor when I
see them. But I but it disturbed. I have colleagues
who it disturbs. They they see it, Oh my god.
They literally go to hiding. They'll hide in bathrooms, they'll
(48:41):
hide in kitchens.
Speaker 1 (48:42):
I was recently, I was recently in a place. I
don't want to say too much. I don't want to
give anything.
Speaker 2 (48:48):
Okay, I don't get details now.
Speaker 1 (48:50):
I was in a place where I was walking with
a friend and I knew if we went one direction,
I would run into more people. And then were walking.
I'm like, oh, there's a side door, and I'm like
starting to make for the side door and he's walking
that way. I'm like, oh gosh, I'm like okay. So
I had to follow him and to shake some hands,
(49:11):
but I was just like, no, we're gonna We're gonna
do this. Okay, Hey, how are you meet you?
Speaker 2 (49:19):
So it's part of it.
Speaker 1 (49:20):
I mean, it is part of the it's part of
what you sign up for.
Speaker 2 (49:22):
It's part of what you sign up for it, and
I always, I always look at it. I interviewed Mother
Teresa many years ago, and Mother Teresa, there was a mob.
Speaker 1 (49:34):
Of people in Brooklyn, Wow.
Speaker 2 (49:36):
And she pulled up and I was in the car
with her little bus. And they said, Mother, we'll go
around back. And she said, no, stop, stop, stop. She
stood up and they said, but Mother, all the people
are here. She said, we have to be here for
the people. Well, this is Jesus here for oh. And
she went out and she shook hands and old babies
(49:56):
and took pictures.
Speaker 1 (49:57):
And he hated it.
Speaker 2 (49:59):
She told me on the bus, you hated it. She said,
every flashbulb I offer up to God. I asked him
for a soul out of purgatory for every flashbulb I
have to look at that. That was her kind of
spiritual way of dealing with it. She was a real introvert,
but she kind of threw herself out there. That was
a big lesson to me, and so I've always.
Speaker 1 (50:19):
Kind of that's really given me something. Yeah, thank you
for that.
Speaker 2 (50:23):
Mother Angelica had a similar approach. I'll tell you that
story later. She was very sick, and I said, why
why don't you go now? And because a bus pulled up,
a big tour bus of people wanted to see her
and couldn't get into the studio her at her network
at EWT, and she was already in her car. I
was closing the door and she put her hand up,
pulled herself out. I said, I said, you can't. You
(50:44):
got to go. It's cold out here. Your asthma's going
to air. She said, they're old, They've come a long way.
She stood up. I said, you're old and you've got
a long way to go, and she said shut up.
When she sat on the hoot of a car Jonathan
for forty five minutes taking picture signing autographs until like
eleven thirty. When I watched that, I thought, you can
take a picture in it, so I think of them
(51:07):
always when I see the crowds. So that'll give you
some inspiration, right.
Speaker 1 (51:12):
I think I think that. Yeah, that's I think I
need to hear that.
Speaker 2 (51:15):
Tell me you said, I read somewhere you want to
do an Exorcist movie. Why haven't we seen enough Pope's Exorcist,
The Exorcist, Exorcist Resurrection, Exorcistism, Emily Rose.
Speaker 1 (51:28):
Aren't we done? I don't know. I mean I think
I think there's there's always room. How many authentic portrayals
of priests? Yeah, in an Exorcist film? Have you seen.
Speaker 2 (51:45):
My friend Bill Blade is just what the original? Yeah? Right?
Speaker 1 (51:48):
Yeah, yeah, So I think there's something to be said
for like, you know, Father Damien in the film, like
he felt like a real guy with that. That's the
kind of a story, like a holy man, you know
what I mean.
Speaker 2 (52:06):
But with flaws.
Speaker 1 (52:07):
He's flaws. He's fighting himself, he's struggling, but he's called
to something greater than himself and he sacrifices himself. What
a beautiful story that is and so well done.
Speaker 5 (52:17):
It's not about the theatrics, it's not about the spinning
and the thing and the crawling on them, Like who cares, Like,
where's the human drama in these movies? You know, it's
not just jump scarce, Like, I'm not interested in jump scares.
Speaker 2 (52:29):
Well, that's why the most recent one failed. That Resurrection
movie was a disaster and they threw the iconography off,
which is a Catholic ritual of exorcism. That's what Bill
Bladie wrote, when you disturb that, Yeah, you're okay, tell
me what do you want to do next? What do
you want to do after the chosen? Have you thought
(52:49):
that far down the line? Yeah?
Speaker 1 (52:51):
Yeah, I'm developing a couple of different projects that that
I think could work again. You know, some fantastic stories
of some holy folks that would work as really great
films and I think would be compelling. And they have
a phenomenal story about the triumph of the human spirit
with the help of God in very extreme circumstances. So yeah,
(53:16):
I'm working on We always need those stories.
Speaker 2 (53:18):
Yeah, and more of them. Okay, this is our annual routine,
a Royal Grande questionnaire. I asked this of everybody. These
are fast questions. You can go as long or short
as you want. Okay, and the light is burning, so
here we go. Who is the person you most admire.
Speaker 1 (53:38):
Jonathan Roumy person I most admire. There's two, and it
would have to be my parents. I think, knowing the
circumstances that they overcame to make it to the United
States and to raise a family, and to basically just
(53:59):
do everything in service to making sure their children had
a better life.
Speaker 2 (54:03):
Who's the person you most despise?
Speaker 1 (54:06):
Oh the devil? Mm yeah, okay, so I was trying
to get my way.
Speaker 2 (54:12):
I know the feeling. I met him once or twice
or maybe more than that. Uh, what's your best feature?
Speaker 1 (54:21):
My best feature? And I think it would be I
trust people pretty quickly, and I opened myself up to people.
Speaker 2 (54:29):
What's your worst feature?
Speaker 1 (54:31):
I trust people pretty quickly. I opened myself up to people.
Speaker 2 (54:35):
When I when someone first asked me that question and said,
what's your best feature? I thought physical? I think, well,
my lips, I don't know my hands, I don't know
what I but everybody asked it to they go to
something much.
Speaker 1 (54:47):
Deeper because it sounds prideful to answer it.
Speaker 2 (54:49):
Other Wise, always think what it is. Thank you, John.
I think Jonathan Ruby just said I'm pride thank you. Well,
that's the last question.
Speaker 1 (54:55):
That's That's how I can't. I couldn't allow myself to
answer it any other way.
Speaker 2 (55:01):
Yeah, you wanted to say your hair go ahead, but
your fee would say oh people, people would say, would
not the makeup lady? Anyway? Your favorite meal?
Speaker 1 (55:15):
See, I just was in Italy. It's a combination of
steak impasta.
Speaker 2 (55:21):
Okay, well that's a good place to be. I'd say pizza.
I love pizza. Anyway. What do you fear?
Speaker 1 (55:27):
What do you fear not fulfilling my potential?
Speaker 2 (55:34):
The greatest virtue is what Jonathan humility? M M mother
of all, mother of all the virtues, the word you
could not live without. I won't beleeve you.
Speaker 1 (55:55):
That was it.
Speaker 2 (55:56):
Okay, we'll leave that there. Then, family, If you could
do anything else, if you couldn't do this, what would
you do? Visual art?
Speaker 1 (56:06):
Maybe musician? Oh yeah, maybe I would be I would
have pursued being a drummer in a band a little
more stringently. I love music. Music. Music affects me in
a way that none of the arts do. It's just.
Speaker 5 (56:23):
It's it's uh, there's no thoughts, takes offense, yeah, almost,
It's a feeling.
Speaker 1 (56:27):
It's a feeling. Yeah, you can't just doesn't nothing else comparison.
Speaker 2 (56:31):
What's the best advice you ever got and from whom
the best advice I ever got?
Speaker 1 (56:41):
Uh, that's a tough one. Yeah. I think that the
best advice I got was get a spiritual director.
Speaker 2 (56:53):
Yeah, when did that come?
Speaker 1 (56:59):
Don't one? I have now my priest, that spiritual director
that I have now, I've had him the longest. But
the initial advice I got probably was twenty years ago,
and it was many many years before I could find somebody.
I was moving around a lot, and I just wasn't
settled in my faith and I didn't look as hard.
(57:22):
So I think once once I was in La my faith.
Funny enough, you know, people think people think of Hollywood
in LA as a godless place, and there's a lot
of influence, a lot of dark influences in those areas
in that city, but there's also a lot of light
and a lot of people searching for the light, and
(57:43):
a lot of people fighting the darkness. And the communities
that I had, the faith communities that I built and
I had and grew a part of, were communities of light.
And through those communities I found my spiritual director has
been probably about six seven years now. Yeah, what's your
biggest regret. I think my biggest regret would be that
(58:17):
I didn't find I didn't surrender sooner to God. But also,
on the other hand, it's hard to it's hard to
admit that because it's hard to think that that is
actually true, because you know, I believe this was my
(58:40):
path right. God allowed me to wander, neander until I
got to this point in my life where I finally
recognized that I couldn't do this without him, and that's
when I was ready for this next step. So I
don't know that I can really say that I have
a regret, a deep regret.
Speaker 2 (59:02):
What happens when this is over?
Speaker 1 (59:05):
This interview probably get some neat.
Speaker 2 (59:07):
Don't be a smart ass. What happens when the.
Speaker 1 (59:09):
Life is over?
Speaker 2 (59:11):
Ah?
Speaker 1 (59:12):
Would you say this, Raymond?
Speaker 2 (59:14):
You have to interpretation.
Speaker 1 (59:17):
That's why I said dinner when this is over. I
hope that when this is over, we we go on
to the the real life, the real phase of our existence,
the real purpose of our existence, which would be for
(59:39):
me to find to be reunified with our creator, the
source of all life.
Speaker 2 (59:48):
I'm so grateful for your time and for your being here.
It's always a joy. Thank you, Joey.
Speaker 1 (59:54):
Thanks Brandon.
Speaker 2 (59:54):
Pleasure, always a pleasure, Pleasure to my friend. Cannot wait
to see the next season. You Okay, here's the hole.
The faith of Jonathan Rumy is so interesting to me
this Lenten season for Christians at least, it's all about surrender,
and it is fascinating to see the surrender of Rumi.
He was literally at the end of his rope, when
(01:00:16):
he had nowhere else to go, when he put his trust,
as he said, in something bigger than himself, in God,
even when he saw no path and look at the
one that he was led to. Suddenly, the first part
of The Chosen Season five hits theaters on March twenty eighth,
and it's streaming on Amazon. I hope you'll come back
(01:00:38):
to the Arroyo Grande soon. Why live a dry, narrow,
constricted life when if you fill it with good things
that can flow into a broad, thriving Arroyo Grande. I'm
reading an Arroyo. Make sure you subscribe and like this episode.
Thanks for diving in. We'll see you next time. Arroyo
Grande is produced in partnership with iHeart Podcasts and is
(01:01:01):
available on the iHeartRadio Apple wherever you get your podcasts,
Host
Raymond Arroyo
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