April 8, 2025 • 33 mins
Today on “Happy Hour,” former Bachelor Clayton Echard sits down with Joe and Serena for an emotional tell-all. Clayton reveals the reality of living with the immense criticism and how the Internet’s commentary on his journey has affected him. We also discuss his personal growth, delve into his creativity, and hear how he combats the continuous negativity he experiences online. Plus, we get a glimpse into how Clayton might have done things differently on his season. Tune in now and be sure to subscribe so you never miss an episode — including part two dropping later this week!
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:02):
Hey, everyone, welcome back to bet your Happy Hour. I'm
Joe and I'm Serena, and we are here today with
our guest, Clayton Eckert said, do I say your last name? Eckert?
Speaker 2 (00:10):
Yeah, now you said it right, Good on you. People
don't get it right. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (00:14):
I could see well, yeah, I could see that, but
I've I've heard it before, so I guess that's a
little uh, it's kind of like a cheap code. Anyways,
how are you.
Speaker 2 (00:22):
I'm good. It's good too. When was did we do this?
Like three years ago? It was probably the last time
that we hopped on a podcast together.
Speaker 3 (00:28):
Yeah, it's been a while. I actually don't know if
we've had you on since, like after AFR with you
and Susie together.
Speaker 1 (00:36):
Yeah, we had my first interview with you, Clayton was
on Clickbait, like I want to.
Speaker 3 (00:44):
Say, after Michelle season.
Speaker 1 (00:46):
Probably, no, it was. It was before The Bachelor aired,
but you had already filmed and you were probably not
in the best headspace.
Speaker 2 (00:59):
Well, I met you guys, and then was in the
hotel lobby, right we all.
Speaker 3 (01:03):
Had drinks, yes, because we were at Michelle's finale where
they announced you as the Bachelor. And we all went
out for drinks after, which was very fun.
Speaker 2 (01:14):
I probably wasn't enjoy to be around, just because I
was really swimming upstream at that point, like really in
a bad headspace and trying to hold it together. But
I feel like people could still feel my pain.
Speaker 3 (01:27):
Yeah, I feel like you were. You'd finish filming. There
was definitely a level of excitement because obviously you've just
been announced. It was like the start of everything. But
I remember you were like I'm reading everything and we
were like, Clayton, don't do it, and You're like, I
have to do it.
Speaker 2 (01:44):
Yeah I did. I don't do it as much, but
I did because I was a people pleaser. I have
a little bit of a little bit of that in
me still. But I was searching for answers of how,
like how I could please everybody. That's what it was
rooted in. I was like, I'm looking for criticism, but
constructive criticism, and I want to see what people are
(02:06):
saying and see if I can fix it. And I
guess after about two and a half years that I
realized I can't control that.
Speaker 3 (02:12):
Yeah, but also so normal, I mean, the internet's commentary
on you can feel all consuming when it's attitude.
Speaker 2 (02:19):
I mean, you guys get it. It feels you go from
hardly anybody knowing you to like it feels as if
the world knows you and everyone's talking about your business
and you go out to eat and you get a
picture taken and it finds its way online. And that
happened with my dating life post show. I went on
a date in Kentucky and next thing you know, I'm
(02:40):
on the JumboTron and then it's posted online. And I mean,
you guys get it. It's like it's just a lot
to basically be like, Okay, now everything I'm doing is
being analyzed, and you know, I want to be portrayed
in a good light. I don't think anybody's just like, hey,
I want to destroy my reputation. That's like my whole
goal wasn't mine, but it felt like I was in
jeopardy of doing so. I was like hyper sensitive to
(03:04):
everything that was being said.
Speaker 1 (03:05):
Did you were you aware of any of that before
going on the show. Did you realize how much of
your privacy was going to be jeopardized by doing this show?
Speaker 2 (03:14):
No? I mean this is where you know some people
could say that, I mean it was ignorance. I was
based in ignorance a thousand percent. I knew about the
show growing up. I had exces that watched at my
mom's her favorite show, so I was very aware of
like how the show, you know. I was aware of
of its presence, but I wasn't aware of like the
ins and outs. And I said to myself when I
(03:37):
got brought on and then they made me the Bachelor,
I was like, I don't want to talk to anybody
that's went on prior because I don't want to be
influenced in theory that would like that sounded good. I
was like, I want to just be myself, so I
don't want to like talk to any prior Bachelor or
bacheybt that too.
Speaker 1 (03:52):
I get that because you want to, you want to
you want to be original too.
Speaker 2 (03:56):
Yeah, I thought, yeah. But I will say though, that
it was rooted in and ignorance, and I thought that
I had to really incorrect assumption that most of the
people that went on reality television I couldn't relate to.
I thought, Oh, You're different than most of these people,
And what I found is I'm not. I actually have
a lot in common with most of the people that
go on reality television, so you know, but that was
(04:16):
a place where I thought, again my ego. I thought
that I was a I don't want to say above.
I just thought I was so different and I'm like
talking to these people isn't going to do anything good
for me. And you know that was an ego, you know,
thought process, and that really came back to bite me.
And it also like place I placed myself in a
place where like I felt like I couldn't relate to anybody.
(04:37):
It's like, well, that's because you're not willing to like
talk to the people that can relate to you. So yeah,
I basically said, I'll do this all on my own
and I'll and I'll be able to like have you know,
be successful because I looked at the track record and
I was like, it's a low success rate. Most people
don't make this work. So therefore I need to like
go do my own thing. And you know that was stupid.
Speaker 3 (04:57):
At what point do you feel like that mentality shifted
and you start to realize you were connecting with these
people that you felt like you were so different from,
and do you think it hindered you because you didn't
think you would be capable of making the mistakes that
had been made in the past.
Speaker 2 (05:16):
Yeah, I had an inflated ego. I just wasn't willing
to admit it or was aware of it. And so
I mean I meant well, but I would say that
I probably didn't open up until about like six or
eight months ago. I had this mindset shift where I realized,
I'm like, dude, you got to stop trying to fight
this and basically separate yourself from this experience. For one,
(05:39):
it's done a lot of really great things for you.
It's it made you live this really unique life, which
is awesome. You know, like I don't. I get to
live a very fun and exciting life that brings a
lot of unknowns. So I was like, you know, hey, listen,
like this has changed your life for the better. I
found my sense of self through it all. But then
I started realizing, I'm like, you keep trying. You know,
you're pushing away p people that one probably realize you're
(06:03):
doing it and they're just giving you your distance. But
also too, it's like nobody else can understand what we've
went through until they've lived it. And so I was like,
you know, if you want to feel like you have
a community, then you've got to stop running from that.
And so I've been like more open now with like
having conversations with people and realizing that I'm like, these
people aren't your enemies, you know there they can be
(06:23):
your friends. And there's a lot of great qualities and
people that go on TV. I think, you know, you're
a risk A lot of people that go on TV
or risk takers. They're willing to step into unknown environments
and you know, they're creative and they're you know, they
have they have an very open mind, which those are
the people that I like to associate with. Nowadays, I'm like,
it's it's I realize that there's a lot of that
(06:47):
kind of type of person within the reality TV world.
Speaker 1 (06:51):
I think you're like everything you're saying really, I mean
I could really relate to it as well. And I
think it happens to most people that go on the
show and a either become the lead or or get
big after the show. And like for me, when I
when I was like, oh, I want to be successful
in this, now you look at it like I have
(07:13):
to separate myself from everyone else to show that I'm different,
Like I'm I'm not that I'm bigger than the show,
but I'm so much more than the show. I could
do so much more outside of the Bachelor world. And
then you almost it ends up hindering yourself.
Speaker 3 (07:32):
Because alienating your alienating yourself.
Speaker 1 (07:35):
Yeah, and it is. It's it's usually like you said it,
it's all it's all ego driven. You're like, I'm bigger
than this.
Speaker 2 (07:42):
Yeah, I mean it's it's hard because also too, I
mean there's a comparison culture that I mean, I find
myself always getting wrapped up into from one season to
the next. You know that it's hard because you know,
like you try to avoid it, but I get compared
to every bachelor, you know, every every seasons, like this
(08:03):
guy's better than him. You know he's been and so,
you know, my sense itself for a while getting rocked,
you know, especially like Joey. I mean was you know,
I mean the most beloved bachelor that I'm aware of
in recent history, and and so you know, there was
like this I see online, we love Joey. He's so
much better than Clayton, and you know, like I started
to even find myself being envious of him, and I
(08:24):
had to basically check myself and say it's not his
fault that like he's you know, got you know, he's
in the position that he's in and I've briefly interacted
with him and he seems like a nice guy. So
but it's it's hard because like, yeah, you're in this
environment where there's been I guess what, twenty nine other
bachelors or twenty eight, and it's it's it's like you
(08:45):
want to like just be able to be yourself and
not focus on anything else. But like once we're in it,
you're it's like you're you're never let go from it,
and people will bring you up and it's like it
never ends. But again there's a positive to that. It's like,
you know, the opportunities. I think people were surprised as
I came back recently for a fr like why would
he come back on this experience after what you know
the show did to him? And I think for me,
(09:07):
it's like, you know, there's there's a sense of accountability,
like I, you know, also played a part in the
way that I was you know, portrayed on TV. So
I'm like they also gave there was a it was
a big blessing. I mean, the things that have come
from it, Like, you know, I don't hate this show.
I you know, I hated the producers at one point
for sure, but then I realized I was like Clayton,
I mean, you know, they're not monsters, like they have
(09:29):
to create an entertaining TV show. And also like, you know,
you didn't have a body double. You were in there
doing that all those things.
Speaker 1 (09:36):
When did you come to that realization?
Speaker 2 (09:39):
I think like six eight months ago. Yeah, I don't
just yeah that recently. Yeah, I mean I yeah, I
for so long went back and forth. I mean when
I first came off TV, people asked me, you know
how I felt about everything, and I said, oh, you know,
it's there's more than you know, the edits is. There's
more than just the edit. You know. That was my
way of pushing blame on the producers. But I had
(10:01):
a producer one day bring up to me. He said, hey,
you know, you want to take credit for all the
good things that were showing on the show, but the
second that something goes south, you you don't want to
take credit for it. You know some of these dates
that you went on, like did you plan those dates?
And I was like, I don't know, and they're like, well, yeah,
so you take credit for those dates, but you don't
take credit for the negative stuff, Like how does that
(10:21):
that fair? And I was like, no, that's true, Like
you know.
Speaker 3 (10:23):
So it was a great point app to a lot
of people that have been on the show.
Speaker 2 (10:27):
Yeah, like people when they have a you know, they
look really great. They take this, you know, a woman
or the girl takes a guy on this extravagant date
and everyone's like that's so sweet. It's like, yeah, but
did you really plan all that out or were you
just the one that showed up for the date? Right?
Like you're getting all that credit. And so there's a
lot of people when they come off TV that want
to take credit for all the good but then they
want to say no, like the producers made me do that,
And it's like, okay, but the else the producers may
(10:49):
maybe also influenced you to do that those good things too.
Speaker 1 (10:52):
So that's why that's why I always I've always been
a big advocate of not reading comments because I don't
even want to read the good ones because if I'm
going to accept all the good things people are saying
about me, and how do I brush off the bad?
Like if I'm going to accept the good, then I
need to accept the bad. And I know how much
like you could read one hundred great comments like Clayton's
(11:12):
the best, Clayton's the best, but it's that one comment
that's going to just drive you totally insane.
Speaker 2 (11:18):
Yeah, right, I think I said at one point in
my head it was like one negative comment held the
way to fifty positive comments. I mean, it got true.
I would see in my DM somebody saying like I
think you're awesome, and I wouldn't even read the message.
But then i'd see like you pieces, you know, like
you know what, and I'd click in on it because
I was like, what are they saying? You know, so
I would start skipping past the positive comments because again
(11:41):
I was just looking for how can I get as
a people pleaser? How can I get everybody to like me?
Why does this person hate me? And you know, then
I got to a place where I realized that people
don't actually hate me. They hate what I remind them of.
You know. So a lot of times when i'd respond
back to these people and say, hey, like, just you're
entitled to your opinion, but why did you feel the
need to end me this, like why why just why
(12:01):
send it in the first place. And I actually I
had a lot of people that would respond back and say,
you know what, you reminded me of an ex boyfriend
or somebody, you know, a guy if in my high
school and I'm just really projecting my own insecurities onto
or some variation of that comment. So then I realized
I was like, Okay, people don't know me. There was
a podcast I listened to and it was a really good,
cool quote which shifted my narrative. They said, if you
(12:24):
have a problem with me, call me. And if you
don't have my phone number, you don't know me well
enough to have a problem with me. I think, Yeah,
when I heard that quote, that was like, that's when
I was I was really able to let go of
a lot of like the opinions of strangers because I
was like, that's such a good that's a good point.
You know, if you don't have my phone number, you
don't know me, so you know, you you can't judge me,
(12:45):
or you can, but like, really you don't know what
you're judging. You're judging you know, a version of me,
but that's not the complete version. So yeah, So it
was you know a lot of like little things over
time in these last two and a half years that
I started to like incorporate or leap year and then
it shifted my narrative slowly. So when the show reached
out recently, it was like, yeah, we'd like for you
(13:06):
to come out. It wasn't I was. I was at
a place where I was healed, and I'm like, hey,
I don't have any anger resentment towards you guys. I
don't you know, want to burn a bridge. And like
it's fun to go back and you know, sit there
and be like, oh, wow, I did this three years ago, right,
Like it's just it's it's something that is unique that
like we've done, and you know, it's it's fun to
(13:27):
like go back in time and sometimes and just like
relive those moments just because it's like it'll be a
point in my life where I don't get to Yeah.
Speaker 3 (13:34):
You talked about comparison.
Speaker 1 (13:36):
Well, not to cut you off, but very impressed. Congratulations.
You really seem to have like you like beat it,
like mentally you are in a just a way better place.
And when we first, like when we hung out in
Paradise when we were there to film like you really,
I feel like you've really like, yeah, you figured it out.
Speaker 2 (13:57):
I've just got into a good I found self love
and self confidence, which again stemmed from all of the
catalyst was the TV show and the negative blowback. So
I think like it the version of me on The
Bachelor wasn't the real version of me. I would say,
it was like the fabricated version or the facade that
I built that I thought, you know, the large majority
of people would you know, accept And this goes back
(14:19):
when I was in medical sales. You know, I was
told by a coworker to essentially blend that. You know,
if you stand out in the o R, you're not
doing your job right. You should just blend in. And
so that's kind of the approach that I took to life.
I don't want to stand out. I just want to
you know, be present, make my money, and go through
life that way. But you know, I have this creative
side of me that's like, no, I want to express
myself and you know, I don't want to like confine
(14:40):
myself to a box. I want to just be me.
And so when everybody seemingly hated me when I came
off the show, I was like, well, I hate myself too.
I don't even like this version of me. So you know,
either build back up the same version that everyone doesn't like,
or build back up the real version of you. And
so I decided to build up the real version of me.
And I was like, okay, what would I do if
(15:00):
people if I didn't care about other people's opinions, And
dancing was one of the things. Getting earrings was one
of the things, you know, switching you having a hairstyle
was one of the things. I had a buzz cut
for so long because it was again it was like
that's what a typical white dude don't have, or like
a short little head of hair, and I was like, no,
I want to like have style, Like I like mullets,
you know, I like having you know, the earrings. I
think they look cool. And so I just started doing
(15:22):
all these things and then like it attracted the people
that I wanted in my life. Like I connected with
one of my good friends now because I was out
of a bar and he had an earring. He had
earrings in a mullet, and so like we happen to
have a lot in common. We started talking about mindfulness
and mental health. And I was like, look like it's
now effortless, Like I don't have to try to wake
up and be somebody. I can just be me, which
(15:43):
is so much easier. So yeah, I mean, thank you
for acknowledging that you see some growth. I certainly feel it,
and that's, you know why I want other people to
like kind of see my progression and realize that like,
no matter how far down like the valley, you get,
like there's a way out, you just have to, like,
you know, put in the effort day in and day out.
So I'm happy with where I'm at, but it certainly
(16:05):
there's more room for growth.
Speaker 1 (16:15):
Sorry to cut you out, No, you're good.
Speaker 3 (16:16):
I was gonna just bring it back to the panel
for a second because you did mention the sense of
comparison of like we love this person and also we
still hate Clayton, or like this person is so much
better than Clayton. I mean, like the messaging is so.
Speaker 1 (16:32):
Which is just which is unfair. It is unfair and
it is it's just like it's just mean. It's like
why it's it's ridiculous.
Speaker 3 (16:39):
But to segue from kind of that internet mentality that
we see going onto this panel, do you feel, how
do you approach this panel without it feeling like I'm
here to represent Like, well, Grant's about to do something bad,
(17:01):
but at least he didn't do what I did and
kind of like almost put yourself in harm's way for
a continuation of this like negative comparison that you're stuck in. Yeah,
that's your mental approach when you, you know, step into
this panel. And what do you want your like your
goal to be with, you know, because I think I
would be nervous about that if I was in your shoes.
Speaker 2 (17:23):
Yeah, that's a great question, And that's certainly a perspective
that you know, I considered. I thought, hey, okay, they
want to bring me on to essentially let people know
that like it's possible to fall in love with multiple people,
but also in a way like remind everyone that I'm
the guy that you know, broke the record or whatever
for most people that I fell in love with. So
it's like reminding everybody that, oh that this guy sucked,
(17:46):
you know. And you know, that was certainly like something
that crossed my mind. But then you know, I thought
about it and I was like, no, dude, you did this,
and that was real, you know, and you fell in
love with each of the women for their their unique characteristics.
And you know, again, I'm mad. I'm mad at myself
that I apologized after the show on certain things that
(18:07):
I that I'm I'm not sorry for. I was basically
apologizing because I wanted people all. I was like, oh,
everyone seems to be mad at me. Let me just apologize.
And at one point I was like, oh, no, I
didn't fall in love with all three of them. I
just fell in love with one, you know. And you know,
I was hurtful to the women that you know that
I expressed feelings of love towards, and I was like,
that's that's not true. You did fall in love with
all three of them, so you know, but again, I
(18:28):
was just saying whatever I could say to get people
to like me. So you know, when I as I
was like going into afar this last one, I just
I reminded myself that I was like Clayton, you know,
you did at the time what you thought was best,
and and so you made decisions and stand by them.
I mean, I don't regret any of the things that
I did. I would do them differently now three years later.
(18:51):
But in hindsight, like I look back at that whole
experience and I'm like, you know, you're you weren't a
monster like half the people said you were. You were
you didn't mean you know, you know, anything, you did
what you thought was best. So ultimately, give yourself grace.
And I'm not embarrassed by anything that I did. I
think I was received poorly, but like, okay, so what
I mean. You know, I took the actions and I
(19:13):
can live by them. So going on Afar, I was like,
just be you, you know, and they told me like, hey,
you got like twenty seconds to respond, so don't don't
start blabbering like you you know, everyone knows that I
talked Tom long winded, So I was like, hey, I'll
say my little twenty seconds and smile and that'll be it.
And that's what I did.
Speaker 3 (19:29):
Do you feel like at any point you were like
losing sight of who you were as a person due
to your people pleasing tendencies? After the show thousand.
Speaker 2 (19:38):
Percent, you know, I every day I woke up, I
was just reading new comments and then taking them to
heart and saying, okay, this they these people think I'm stupid,
So how do I prove that I'm not stupid, you know.
Like I remember a point when before it was revealed
that Susan and I were together, I was dropping like
subtle clues on my Instagram, like I would like make
(20:00):
a post alluding to the fact that I may be
with somebody. Like there was a post where I was
like staying at the edge of the bed and like
Susie's leg was like you could see the outline of
a leg. Potentially it might be there, may not be.
I also had another post where I was like looking
back at the camera and I said, looking back at
my past, present and future. And I was because people
(20:20):
said I was stupid. I was like dropping clues and
nobody was figuring it out, and I'm like, you're all
so stupid that like IM just toying with you all.
But again, my ego is just like you're not stupid
because you're over here playing games with these people. And again,
like I was just like wasting time playing games when
it was like this, Like I mean, it was just
(20:40):
like what are you doing this for?
Speaker 3 (20:41):
You know, And it was trying to prove it to
them or yourself.
Speaker 2 (20:45):
Both both, but really myself. Yeah, you know, I yeah,
I was trying to prove to myself that I had
value and that I was actually inquisitive and smart and
I had emotional intelligence. But you know, the reality was
is like I mean I had I don't think I
had the emotional intelligence that I definitely, I mean, I
(21:06):
definitely didn't have like what like I do today and
I still have a long ways to go. But I
grew up in an environment wheally on household of three boys,
you know, no sisters. You know, basically everything we did
was physical and never talked about emotions. You know, my
dad was old school, and so it was like, yeah,
a lot of these things I was trying to prove
to people I had, but then I realized what I
did and didn't possess, you know. And there was a
(21:27):
lot of constructive criticism where people are like, hey, you know,
he meant well, but ultimately, I don't think he's aware
of the fact that, like we understand where he was
coming from. He's but you know, ultimately, like he keeps
trying to explain why he did what he did as
opposed to just take accountability. And you know that that
was a comment that was said multiple times that really
hit me. I'm like oh, so I'm trying to be
(21:47):
right because the people pleaser oftentimes wants to be right right.
I feel like if I had, you know, I had
so many times to be wrong in front of it
in someone's you know, somebody's perspective before they basically canceled
me out of their life. Like that's the way that
I used to think, if I'm wrong enough times, this
person like all right, strike three year out. So you know,
I always felt like I had to be right. Well,
then like as I started to progress mentally, I realized,
(22:08):
I'm like, no, it's not about being right, it's about understanding,
you know, and taking accountability. Like that's the next level
of mental maturity that like you have to you know,
work be able to get to. So yeah, I it's
just been like I think reading the comments was both
destructive but also what I needed because I needed people
(22:30):
to hold me accountable and I wasn't holding myself accountable.
Speaker 1 (22:34):
I also think it plays a part, and I think
grants a little similar to you in this area where
you guys, both you you lested like midway through the show,
right like you you you went home like what like
six or seven.
Speaker 2 (22:49):
Eight, So you know, in that respect.
Speaker 1 (22:52):
You don't you don't have as much experience on the
show where I do think like the contestants at either
get heartbroken like at the very end, like a Joey
who could then go on the bachelorm and be like, okay,
like let me like actually look at what happened to
me this experience, and now I could do it differently
(23:12):
or at least like know how other people feel in
this process where when you get when you get picked
off at the middle and then you get thrown as
the bachelor. You I could see you looking at it
like can't you even really can you really fall in
love on the show? Like was I really in love
with Michelle? Like I just don't know if you even
take it as seriously go in with.
Speaker 3 (23:34):
Like much less information to work with.
Speaker 2 (23:36):
Yeah, yeah, I agree with you, guys. I mean I
never fell in love with Michelle, so I kind of
just was like, oh, all right, yeah, this is what
I thought reality television was, like you go on here,
you know, I got knocked out in the top eight
or whatever, and I was like all right. So then
when I became the Bachelor, I was like, well, you know,
hopefully within these thirty women there's at least one person
that I'll have interest in. But I remember thinking like,
(23:56):
I don't know, like I'm kind of picky, I have
a certain you know type, or I'm looking for something,
and I mean a single still at twenty eight years
of age, so like, obviously I haven't settled down for
what reasons, while I haven't found exactly what I'm looking for.
So yeah, I went in being like maybe you know,
but there's this I was. I was nervous night one.
I'm like, I don't know if I'll be interested in
any of these girls, like before I saw them, and
(24:17):
then the second they started stepping out the limo, I
was like, all right, I'm like.
Speaker 3 (24:21):
There because you're like I've been on one season and
I didn't fall in love, so there's no like reassurance
like I know that I can fall in love in
this environment. So I feel like you're going in with
that mentality of like we'll see if I could even
fall in love. You probably go in like no guards
up to an extent. You're like, I'll throw my heart
out there, no problem, Like what's the risk because you're
(24:43):
coming off of a season where you were not necessarily heartbroken,
and then it kind of you know, we hit the
other end of the scale with you.
Speaker 2 (24:52):
Yeah. Yeah, Well I fought it until the last second
because you know, I had I think I had five
women or something that like start expressing their feelings towards me.
And then I was like, oh, I'm not opening up still.
I knew in the back of my head. I like,
I was asked early on by a producer like, you,
could you see yourself fall in love with multiple people?
I said no. They said why is that? I said,
(25:13):
because that'll be an absolute mess if I get to
that place, I won't know how to navigate that. And
then I did it, and it's like, you know, I
and I you know, I'm even mentioned that on I
far recently, but that was the truth. Like I remember
I was coming down in an elevator and Raykivic Iceland
and I started hysterically laughing, and they're like, what are
you laughing at. I wasn't on camera at this point,
and I said, I'm soft and they were like why.
(25:35):
I said, because I just realized I fell in love
with multiple women. And they were like, get them into
you know, get them into a room, you know. But
I was laughing because I was like I'm seriously so screwed.
And you know, typically humor is a way to like divert,
you know, away from feeling like you're under in a
threat or you know, like a versus coming. And it's
(25:56):
like I would I was just like laughing. But then
I realized. I was like, I have to tell these women,
you know, you do feel love towards each of them,
and it's three people, so it was, yeah, it was
like this weird feeling. And at that point, I mean,
there was maybe like I don't know, seven days left,
so I was like, not only do like I did,
I just realize this, but now I have to go
tell them all right away. But I was excited. I
(26:17):
was like, I get to tell people I love them,
you know, so like in that moment, I was like
so excited. So I go tell them and it's met well,
and they're excited, you know, because a couple of them
were like, hey, if you don't tell me soon, I'm
going to close off. So I was like, yeah, I
also like need like I get that, like you've told me,
but I haven't told you, so naturally you're going to
pull back, and I don't want that to happen. You know,
I want you to. I want to fully open up
(26:37):
to you and vice versa. But I knew things were again,
Like my head like was all over the place. I
remember I was on a date with one of them,
and I remember looking at them and being like, I
don't want this to end, you know, I want to
like date all three of these women. And I was like,
you can't do that, you know. It's like that's how
crazy my mind was, Like I was like, I just
want to.
Speaker 3 (26:52):
Keep doing it on the next season of Wise.
Speaker 1 (27:02):
Wait, how how do you think so where you're at
mentally today? Yeah, how do you think you would handle
the situation? Now? If you were the bachelor and you
and you would fall for multiple women you're near the end?
Speaker 2 (27:17):
Well, I would communicate times one thousand, I think, you know,
that's where and I think it's shared responsibility. I do
wish a couple of women would have been more you know, communicative.
I felt like they could have done more. But on
the same front, I should have asked more questions. You know,
I wasn't asking enough, so this time around, you know,
if I were to do it a second time, I
would ask way more questions, you know, so that there
(27:38):
aren't any surprises. Would I hold myself back from like
following form multiple people? No, Now I would do if
I fell in love again with multi people, I would
do it. I mean it's it's if you give yourself permission,
you can't do it. And I don't think like the
the the environment allows for it, you know, like the
if you do it correctly. In my opinion, if you
if you are you know, play the batchel for a
(28:00):
role as it should be whatching got on? Is there
right a wrong way to do it? But I'm like,
if you're gonna date multiple people, then you should be
also willing to like stay open to all thirty of
those people or however many. So falling in love with
multiple people if you're doing it correctly is just inevitable
in my in my opinion. But I mean again, I
could you could find a bachelor, they'd be like, no,
you find one person, zero went on them. I just
(28:21):
that's just not the way I'm hardwired. I mean, but
I also I'm a monogamous person. I don't never date
multiple people a multiple you know, in real life, and
don't plan on it. But I would still find myself
being like, yeah, this this show allows you where else
can you go? And I say this, this is the
one thing where like it tricked my brain where I
was like, this doesn't make any sense. I was on
a group date. I kiss this girl. We keep talking,
(28:43):
you know, her and I are off alone. Another girl
comes in. It's like, hey, can I steal you? She
goes away. Her and I start talking. About five or
six minutes in, I go in for the kiss. She
stops me. She goes hold on, wipes off my lips
you have lipstick on your lips, and then goes in
and kisses me. I'm like, I just from my brain
being like, Okay, things just don't This isn't real world,
as in, like things op differently here, like that would
(29:05):
never fly in the real world, but because like you're
you're in this environment where you're given permission by the women.
Speaker 4 (29:12):
I don't know why that story has rattled me like
I was on the show, but I'm like, whoa, it's
just like such a like specific example of yeah, exactly
what you're saying something that would never fly in the
real world, but that it could totally happen multiple times
when you're the bachelor.
Speaker 2 (29:29):
So when you give yourself permission, and I was given
permission by all the women, the producers, and the audience
at the time didn't exist. It was, you know, just filming.
So it's like I was given permission, and I finally
gave myself permission to be like, Okay, I'm going to
compartmentalize each of these relationships. When I'm with this person,
I'm one hundred percent with them. When i'm with this person,
I'm one hundred percent with them, and then when I'm alone,
(29:49):
that's when I have to take the time to like
break down each of the relationships. But you know, I
I still do this day. I'm like I stand by that.
I think like I did it the way that I
think the show certainly wants it to be done. But
I was like, hey, like this would not fly in
the real world, but we're not in the real world,
so I this is the way that like this makes
sense to me, and I want to, you know, give
(30:09):
this a fair shot, and I don't want to leave
anything on the table. So yeah, but that tripped my
mind of it was there's it was instances like that
where I was just like, yeah, like Clayton, you can't
take real world values and and like situations and apply
them to this environment. It does not fit.
Speaker 1 (30:26):
So yeah, I mean that, Yeah, that makes total sense
because you basically, like, as you're going through it, you
have to remind yourself that like this is okay, Like
it's okay to fall in love with multiple women, like
it's okay.
Speaker 3 (30:37):
To do things that feel abnormal.
Speaker 1 (30:40):
But then the audience watches it back and they're like, no,
actually it wasn't okay, you fuckingn asshole, Like you shouldn't
have done that, and you're like wait, but everybody said
it was okay. And then all the girls that were
giving you validation are also jumping in on the on
the audience train and they're like, yeah, Clayton, you're an asshole,
Like you are an asshole.
Speaker 2 (30:58):
And then you're like, oh yeah, it's like it's a
pile on you know, and it's it's that's when it's hard,
because you're like, wait, like you were okay with it,
you know then, but you're not okay with it now,
you know. But then there was again, there was so
many experiences, like there was a women when I was
had my women tell all. There was a girl that
I was out on the boat with in San Diego
(31:18):
a week prior with friends and hey, Clayton, Oh my gosh,
so great to see you. Hugs me. We're hanging out,
we're talking, and then come women tell all she's at
my throat, I mean, only on full attack. And then
at the end of it, she comes up to me
and was like, hey, sab you ben. I was like,
what was that, And she's like, oh, Clayton, it's just TV,
Like come on now, like you you like, don't take
(31:38):
it too seriously.
Speaker 3 (31:39):
And I was like, no, it was easy for you
to say you're getting attacked.
Speaker 2 (31:43):
Public kill it on a boat, and then you're call
me an idiot you know, later like I just but
then again, now I understand that, and I think again,
I say all these things and someone might be like, see, Walt,
reality television is not real. I'm like, no, that's not true.
I also don't stand by that. I'm like, you know,
I there was times when I had to play a role,
but eighty percent of the time I was I was me,
you know, or it was uninfluenced or you know, like
(32:05):
just went in and was you know. I'm like, okay, yeah, sure,
Like there's certain times where we have to maybe play
up a narrative, but overall, I was like, at the end,
it was what you saw was real. So there's absolutely
real elements to it. But you know again, like some
people have motives and they I don't think that's just
shocked anybody, And so I had to realize that. I'm like, oh,
people are playing roles here. Not everybody, but some are,
and so this becomes this whole psychological game of like
(32:27):
who's here for the right reasons who's not? And I
think that's what's enticing. I'm like, oh, it was kind
of fun until it wasn't.
Speaker 1 (32:34):
It's also, yeah, people experience it differently. Like I went
home night one and I remember going home being like, yeah,
like it because of my ego, because I was so
embarrassed to go home night one. In my head, I'm like, well,
that show's like fake, like it's all bullshit. And then
when I go back on and I make it all
(32:55):
the way to the end, I'm like, oh, this is actually,
this is real. I have so I could see how
a girl that goes home whatever week three on your
show is like friends with you in the real world,
but like it's just TV. We're just putting on a show.
Because everyone people have different experiences. Okay, I think that's
a good place to stop the first half. Thank you
(33:15):
everyone for listening to Bachelor Happy Hour, and make sure
you stay tuned because we will have Part two with
Clayton coming up very soon.
Speaker 2 (33:23):
Thank you so much for listening.
Speaker 1 (33:24):
Bye.
Hey, everyone, welcome back to bet your Happy Hour. I'm
Joe and I'm Serena, and we are here today with
our guest, Clayton Eckert said, do I say your last name? Eckert?
Speaker 2 (00:10):
Yeah, now you said it right, Good on you. People
don't get it right. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (00:14):
I could see well, yeah, I could see that, but
I've I've heard it before, so I guess that's a
little uh, it's kind of like a cheap code. Anyways,
how are you.
Speaker 2 (00:22):
I'm good. It's good too. When was did we do this?
Like three years ago? It was probably the last time
that we hopped on a podcast together.
Speaker 3 (00:28):
Yeah, it's been a while. I actually don't know if
we've had you on since, like after AFR with you
and Susie together.
Speaker 1 (00:36):
Yeah, we had my first interview with you, Clayton was
on Clickbait, like I want to.
Speaker 3 (00:44):
Say, after Michelle season.
Speaker 1 (00:46):
Probably, no, it was. It was before The Bachelor aired,
but you had already filmed and you were probably not
in the best headspace.
Speaker 2 (00:59):
Well, I met you guys, and then was in the
hotel lobby, right we all.
Speaker 3 (01:03):
Had drinks, yes, because we were at Michelle's finale where
they announced you as the Bachelor. And we all went
out for drinks after, which was very fun.
Speaker 2 (01:14):
I probably wasn't enjoy to be around, just because I
was really swimming upstream at that point, like really in
a bad headspace and trying to hold it together. But
I feel like people could still feel my pain.
Speaker 3 (01:27):
Yeah, I feel like you were. You'd finish filming. There
was definitely a level of excitement because obviously you've just
been announced. It was like the start of everything. But
I remember you were like I'm reading everything and we
were like, Clayton, don't do it, and You're like, I
have to do it.
Speaker 2 (01:44):
Yeah I did. I don't do it as much, but
I did because I was a people pleaser. I have
a little bit of a little bit of that in
me still. But I was searching for answers of how,
like how I could please everybody. That's what it was
rooted in. I was like, I'm looking for criticism, but
constructive criticism, and I want to see what people are
(02:06):
saying and see if I can fix it. And I
guess after about two and a half years that I
realized I can't control that.
Speaker 3 (02:12):
Yeah, but also so normal, I mean, the internet's commentary
on you can feel all consuming when it's attitude.
Speaker 2 (02:19):
I mean, you guys get it. It feels you go from
hardly anybody knowing you to like it feels as if
the world knows you and everyone's talking about your business
and you go out to eat and you get a
picture taken and it finds its way online. And that
happened with my dating life post show. I went on
a date in Kentucky and next thing you know, I'm
(02:40):
on the JumboTron and then it's posted online. And I mean,
you guys get it. It's like it's just a lot
to basically be like, Okay, now everything I'm doing is
being analyzed, and you know, I want to be portrayed
in a good light. I don't think anybody's just like, hey,
I want to destroy my reputation. That's like my whole
goal wasn't mine, but it felt like I was in
jeopardy of doing so. I was like hyper sensitive to
(03:04):
everything that was being said.
Speaker 1 (03:05):
Did you were you aware of any of that before
going on the show. Did you realize how much of
your privacy was going to be jeopardized by doing this show?
Speaker 2 (03:14):
No? I mean this is where you know some people
could say that, I mean it was ignorance. I was
based in ignorance a thousand percent. I knew about the
show growing up. I had exces that watched at my
mom's her favorite show, so I was very aware of
like how the show, you know. I was aware of
of its presence, but I wasn't aware of like the
ins and outs. And I said to myself when I
(03:37):
got brought on and then they made me the Bachelor,
I was like, I don't want to talk to anybody
that's went on prior because I don't want to be
influenced in theory that would like that sounded good. I
was like, I want to just be myself, so I
don't want to like talk to any prior Bachelor or
bacheybt that too.
Speaker 1 (03:52):
I get that because you want to, you want to
you want to be original too.
Speaker 2 (03:56):
Yeah, I thought, yeah. But I will say though, that
it was rooted in and ignorance, and I thought that
I had to really incorrect assumption that most of the
people that went on reality television I couldn't relate to.
I thought, Oh, You're different than most of these people,
And what I found is I'm not. I actually have
a lot in common with most of the people that
go on reality television, so you know, but that was
(04:16):
a place where I thought, again my ego. I thought
that I was a I don't want to say above.
I just thought I was so different and I'm like
talking to these people isn't going to do anything good
for me. And you know that was an ego, you know,
thought process, and that really came back to bite me.
And it also like place I placed myself in a
place where like I felt like I couldn't relate to anybody.
(04:37):
It's like, well, that's because you're not willing to like
talk to the people that can relate to you. So yeah,
I basically said, I'll do this all on my own
and I'll and I'll be able to like have you know,
be successful because I looked at the track record and
I was like, it's a low success rate. Most people
don't make this work. So therefore I need to like
go do my own thing. And you know that was stupid.
Speaker 3 (04:57):
At what point do you feel like that mentality shifted
and you start to realize you were connecting with these
people that you felt like you were so different from,
and do you think it hindered you because you didn't
think you would be capable of making the mistakes that
had been made in the past.
Speaker 2 (05:16):
Yeah, I had an inflated ego. I just wasn't willing
to admit it or was aware of it. And so
I mean I meant well, but I would say that
I probably didn't open up until about like six or
eight months ago. I had this mindset shift where I realized,
I'm like, dude, you got to stop trying to fight
this and basically separate yourself from this experience. For one,
(05:39):
it's done a lot of really great things for you.
It's it made you live this really unique life, which
is awesome. You know, like I don't. I get to
live a very fun and exciting life that brings a
lot of unknowns. So I was like, you know, hey, listen,
like this has changed your life for the better. I
found my sense of self through it all. But then
I started realizing, I'm like, you keep trying. You know,
you're pushing away p people that one probably realize you're
(06:03):
doing it and they're just giving you your distance. But
also too, it's like nobody else can understand what we've
went through until they've lived it. And so I was like,
you know, if you want to feel like you have
a community, then you've got to stop running from that.
And so I've been like more open now with like
having conversations with people and realizing that I'm like, these
people aren't your enemies, you know there they can be
(06:23):
your friends. And there's a lot of great qualities and
people that go on TV. I think, you know, you're
a risk A lot of people that go on TV
or risk takers. They're willing to step into unknown environments
and you know, they're creative and they're you know, they
have they have an very open mind, which those are
the people that I like to associate with. Nowadays, I'm like,
it's it's I realize that there's a lot of that
(06:47):
kind of type of person within the reality TV world.
Speaker 1 (06:51):
I think you're like everything you're saying really, I mean
I could really relate to it as well. And I
think it happens to most people that go on the
show and a either become the lead or or get
big after the show. And like for me, when I
when I was like, oh, I want to be successful
in this, now you look at it like I have
(07:13):
to separate myself from everyone else to show that I'm different,
Like I'm I'm not that I'm bigger than the show,
but I'm so much more than the show. I could
do so much more outside of the Bachelor world. And
then you almost it ends up hindering yourself.
Speaker 3 (07:32):
Because alienating your alienating yourself.
Speaker 1 (07:35):
Yeah, and it is. It's it's usually like you said it,
it's all it's all ego driven. You're like, I'm bigger
than this.
Speaker 2 (07:42):
Yeah, I mean it's it's hard because also too, I
mean there's a comparison culture that I mean, I find
myself always getting wrapped up into from one season to
the next. You know that it's hard because you know,
like you try to avoid it, but I get compared
to every bachelor, you know, every every seasons, like this
(08:03):
guy's better than him. You know he's been and so,
you know, my sense itself for a while getting rocked,
you know, especially like Joey. I mean was you know,
I mean the most beloved bachelor that I'm aware of
in recent history, and and so you know, there was
like this I see online, we love Joey. He's so
much better than Clayton, and you know, like I started
to even find myself being envious of him, and I
(08:24):
had to basically check myself and say it's not his
fault that like he's you know, got you know, he's
in the position that he's in and I've briefly interacted
with him and he seems like a nice guy. So
but it's it's hard because like, yeah, you're in this
environment where there's been I guess what, twenty nine other
bachelors or twenty eight, and it's it's it's like you
(08:45):
want to like just be able to be yourself and
not focus on anything else. But like once we're in it,
you're it's like you're you're never let go from it,
and people will bring you up and it's like it
never ends. But again there's a positive to that. It's like,
you know, the opportunities. I think people were surprised as
I came back recently for a fr like why would
he come back on this experience after what you know
the show did to him? And I think for me,
(09:07):
it's like, you know, there's there's a sense of accountability,
like I, you know, also played a part in the
way that I was you know, portrayed on TV. So
I'm like they also gave there was a it was
a big blessing. I mean, the things that have come
from it, Like, you know, I don't hate this show.
I you know, I hated the producers at one point
for sure, but then I realized I was like Clayton,
I mean, you know, they're not monsters, like they have
(09:29):
to create an entertaining TV show. And also like, you know,
you didn't have a body double. You were in there
doing that all those things.
Speaker 1 (09:36):
When did you come to that realization?
Speaker 2 (09:39):
I think like six eight months ago. Yeah, I don't
just yeah that recently. Yeah, I mean I yeah, I
for so long went back and forth. I mean when
I first came off TV, people asked me, you know
how I felt about everything, and I said, oh, you know,
it's there's more than you know, the edits is. There's
more than just the edit. You know. That was my
way of pushing blame on the producers. But I had
(10:01):
a producer one day bring up to me. He said, hey,
you know, you want to take credit for all the
good things that were showing on the show, but the
second that something goes south, you you don't want to
take credit for it. You know some of these dates
that you went on, like did you plan those dates?
And I was like, I don't know, and they're like, well, yeah,
so you take credit for those dates, but you don't
take credit for the negative stuff, Like how does that
(10:21):
that fair? And I was like, no, that's true, Like
you know.
Speaker 3 (10:23):
So it was a great point app to a lot
of people that have been on the show.
Speaker 2 (10:27):
Yeah, like people when they have a you know, they
look really great. They take this, you know, a woman
or the girl takes a guy on this extravagant date
and everyone's like that's so sweet. It's like, yeah, but
did you really plan all that out or were you
just the one that showed up for the date? Right?
Like you're getting all that credit. And so there's a
lot of people when they come off TV that want
to take credit for all the good but then they
want to say no, like the producers made me do that,
And it's like, okay, but the else the producers may
(10:49):
maybe also influenced you to do that those good things too.
Speaker 1 (10:52):
So that's why that's why I always I've always been
a big advocate of not reading comments because I don't
even want to read the good ones because if I'm
going to accept all the good things people are saying
about me, and how do I brush off the bad?
Like if I'm going to accept the good, then I
need to accept the bad. And I know how much
like you could read one hundred great comments like Clayton's
(11:12):
the best, Clayton's the best, but it's that one comment
that's going to just drive you totally insane.
Speaker 2 (11:18):
Yeah, right, I think I said at one point in
my head it was like one negative comment held the
way to fifty positive comments. I mean, it got true.
I would see in my DM somebody saying like I
think you're awesome, and I wouldn't even read the message.
But then i'd see like you pieces, you know, like
you know what, and I'd click in on it because
I was like, what are they saying? You know, so
I would start skipping past the positive comments because again
(11:41):
I was just looking for how can I get as
a people pleaser? How can I get everybody to like me?
Why does this person hate me? And you know, then
I got to a place where I realized that people
don't actually hate me. They hate what I remind them of.
You know. So a lot of times when i'd respond
back to these people and say, hey, like, just you're
entitled to your opinion, but why did you feel the
need to end me this, like why why just why
(12:01):
send it in the first place. And I actually I
had a lot of people that would respond back and say,
you know what, you reminded me of an ex boyfriend
or somebody, you know, a guy if in my high
school and I'm just really projecting my own insecurities onto
or some variation of that comment. So then I realized
I was like, Okay, people don't know me. There was
a podcast I listened to and it was a really good,
cool quote which shifted my narrative. They said, if you
(12:24):
have a problem with me, call me. And if you
don't have my phone number, you don't know me well
enough to have a problem with me. I think, Yeah,
when I heard that quote, that was like, that's when
I was I was really able to let go of
a lot of like the opinions of strangers because I
was like, that's such a good that's a good point.
You know, if you don't have my phone number, you
don't know me, so you know, you you can't judge me,
(12:45):
or you can, but like, really you don't know what
you're judging. You're judging you know, a version of me,
but that's not the complete version. So yeah, So it
was you know a lot of like little things over
time in these last two and a half years that
I started to like incorporate or leap year and then
it shifted my narrative slowly. So when the show reached
out recently, it was like, yeah, we'd like for you
(13:06):
to come out. It wasn't I was. I was at
a place where I was healed, and I'm like, hey,
I don't have any anger resentment towards you guys. I
don't you know, want to burn a bridge. And like
it's fun to go back and you know, sit there
and be like, oh, wow, I did this three years ago, right,
Like it's just it's it's something that is unique that
like we've done, and you know, it's it's fun to
(13:27):
like go back in time and sometimes and just like
relive those moments just because it's like it'll be a
point in my life where I don't get to Yeah.
Speaker 3 (13:34):
You talked about comparison.
Speaker 1 (13:36):
Well, not to cut you off, but very impressed. Congratulations.
You really seem to have like you like beat it,
like mentally you are in a just a way better place.
And when we first, like when we hung out in
Paradise when we were there to film like you really,
I feel like you've really like, yeah, you figured it out.
Speaker 2 (13:57):
I've just got into a good I found self love
and self confidence, which again stemmed from all of the
catalyst was the TV show and the negative blowback. So
I think like it the version of me on The
Bachelor wasn't the real version of me. I would say,
it was like the fabricated version or the facade that
I built that I thought, you know, the large majority
of people would you know, accept And this goes back
(14:19):
when I was in medical sales. You know, I was
told by a coworker to essentially blend that. You know,
if you stand out in the o R, you're not
doing your job right. You should just blend in. And
so that's kind of the approach that I took to life.
I don't want to stand out. I just want to
you know, be present, make my money, and go through
life that way. But you know, I have this creative
side of me that's like, no, I want to express
myself and you know, I don't want to like confine
(14:40):
myself to a box. I want to just be me.
And so when everybody seemingly hated me when I came
off the show, I was like, well, I hate myself too.
I don't even like this version of me. So you know,
either build back up the same version that everyone doesn't like,
or build back up the real version of you. And
so I decided to build up the real version of me.
And I was like, okay, what would I do if
(15:00):
people if I didn't care about other people's opinions, And
dancing was one of the things. Getting earrings was one
of the things, you know, switching you having a hairstyle
was one of the things. I had a buzz cut
for so long because it was again it was like
that's what a typical white dude don't have, or like
a short little head of hair, and I was like, no,
I want to like have style, Like I like mullets,
you know, I like having you know, the earrings. I
think they look cool. And so I just started doing
(15:22):
all these things and then like it attracted the people
that I wanted in my life. Like I connected with
one of my good friends now because I was out
of a bar and he had an earring. He had
earrings in a mullet, and so like we happen to
have a lot in common. We started talking about mindfulness
and mental health. And I was like, look like it's
now effortless, Like I don't have to try to wake
up and be somebody. I can just be me, which
(15:43):
is so much easier. So yeah, I mean, thank you
for acknowledging that you see some growth. I certainly feel it,
and that's, you know why I want other people to
like kind of see my progression and realize that like,
no matter how far down like the valley, you get,
like there's a way out, you just have to, like,
you know, put in the effort day in and day out.
So I'm happy with where I'm at, but it certainly
(16:05):
there's more room for growth.
Speaker 1 (16:15):
Sorry to cut you out, No, you're good.
Speaker 3 (16:16):
I was gonna just bring it back to the panel
for a second because you did mention the sense of
comparison of like we love this person and also we
still hate Clayton, or like this person is so much
better than Clayton. I mean, like the messaging is so.
Speaker 1 (16:32):
Which is just which is unfair. It is unfair and
it is it's just like it's just mean. It's like
why it's it's ridiculous.
Speaker 3 (16:39):
But to segue from kind of that internet mentality that
we see going onto this panel, do you feel, how
do you approach this panel without it feeling like I'm
here to represent Like, well, Grant's about to do something bad,
(17:01):
but at least he didn't do what I did and
kind of like almost put yourself in harm's way for
a continuation of this like negative comparison that you're stuck in. Yeah,
that's your mental approach when you, you know, step into
this panel. And what do you want your like your
goal to be with, you know, because I think I
would be nervous about that if I was in your shoes.
Speaker 2 (17:23):
Yeah, that's a great question, And that's certainly a perspective
that you know, I considered. I thought, hey, okay, they
want to bring me on to essentially let people know
that like it's possible to fall in love with multiple people,
but also in a way like remind everyone that I'm
the guy that you know, broke the record or whatever
for most people that I fell in love with. So
it's like reminding everybody that, oh that this guy sucked,
(17:46):
you know. And you know, that was certainly like something
that crossed my mind. But then you know, I thought
about it and I was like, no, dude, you did this,
and that was real, you know, and you fell in
love with each of the women for their their unique characteristics.
And you know, again, I'm mad. I'm mad at myself
that I apologized after the show on certain things that
(18:07):
I that I'm I'm not sorry for. I was basically
apologizing because I wanted people all. I was like, oh,
everyone seems to be mad at me. Let me just apologize.
And at one point I was like, oh, no, I
didn't fall in love with all three of them. I
just fell in love with one, you know. And you know,
I was hurtful to the women that you know that
I expressed feelings of love towards, and I was like,
that's that's not true. You did fall in love with
all three of them, so you know, but again, I
(18:28):
was just saying whatever I could say to get people
to like me. So you know, when I as I
was like going into afar this last one, I just
I reminded myself that I was like Clayton, you know,
you did at the time what you thought was best,
and and so you made decisions and stand by them.
I mean, I don't regret any of the things that
I did. I would do them differently now three years later.
(18:51):
But in hindsight, like I look back at that whole
experience and I'm like, you know, you're you weren't a
monster like half the people said you were. You were
you didn't mean you know, you know, anything, you did
what you thought was best. So ultimately, give yourself grace.
And I'm not embarrassed by anything that I did. I
think I was received poorly, but like, okay, so what
I mean. You know, I took the actions and I
(19:13):
can live by them. So going on Afar, I was like,
just be you, you know, and they told me like, hey,
you got like twenty seconds to respond, so don't don't
start blabbering like you you know, everyone knows that I
talked Tom long winded, So I was like, hey, I'll
say my little twenty seconds and smile and that'll be it.
And that's what I did.
Speaker 3 (19:29):
Do you feel like at any point you were like
losing sight of who you were as a person due
to your people pleasing tendencies? After the show thousand.
Speaker 2 (19:38):
Percent, you know, I every day I woke up, I
was just reading new comments and then taking them to
heart and saying, okay, this they these people think I'm stupid,
So how do I prove that I'm not stupid, you know.
Like I remember a point when before it was revealed
that Susan and I were together, I was dropping like
subtle clues on my Instagram, like I would like make
(20:00):
a post alluding to the fact that I may be
with somebody. Like there was a post where I was
like staying at the edge of the bed and like
Susie's leg was like you could see the outline of
a leg. Potentially it might be there, may not be.
I also had another post where I was like looking
back at the camera and I said, looking back at
my past, present and future. And I was because people
(20:20):
said I was stupid. I was like dropping clues and
nobody was figuring it out, and I'm like, you're all
so stupid that like IM just toying with you all.
But again, my ego is just like you're not stupid
because you're over here playing games with these people. And again,
like I was just like wasting time playing games when
it was like this, Like I mean, it was just
(20:40):
like what are you doing this for?
Speaker 3 (20:41):
You know, And it was trying to prove it to
them or yourself.
Speaker 2 (20:45):
Both both, but really myself. Yeah, you know, I yeah,
I was trying to prove to myself that I had
value and that I was actually inquisitive and smart and
I had emotional intelligence. But you know, the reality was
is like I mean I had I don't think I
had the emotional intelligence that I definitely, I mean, I
(21:06):
definitely didn't have like what like I do today and
I still have a long ways to go. But I
grew up in an environment wheally on household of three boys,
you know, no sisters. You know, basically everything we did
was physical and never talked about emotions. You know, my
dad was old school, and so it was like, yeah,
a lot of these things I was trying to prove
to people I had, but then I realized what I
did and didn't possess, you know. And there was a
(21:27):
lot of constructive criticism where people are like, hey, you know,
he meant well, but ultimately, I don't think he's aware
of the fact that, like we understand where he was
coming from. He's but you know, ultimately, like he keeps
trying to explain why he did what he did as
opposed to just take accountability. And you know that that
was a comment that was said multiple times that really
hit me. I'm like oh, so I'm trying to be
(21:47):
right because the people pleaser oftentimes wants to be right right.
I feel like if I had, you know, I had
so many times to be wrong in front of it
in someone's you know, somebody's perspective before they basically canceled
me out of their life. Like that's the way that
I used to think, if I'm wrong enough times, this
person like all right, strike three year out. So you know,
I always felt like I had to be right. Well,
then like as I started to progress mentally, I realized,
(22:08):
I'm like, no, it's not about being right, it's about understanding,
you know, and taking accountability. Like that's the next level
of mental maturity that like you have to you know,
work be able to get to. So yeah, I it's
just been like I think reading the comments was both
destructive but also what I needed because I needed people
(22:30):
to hold me accountable and I wasn't holding myself accountable.
Speaker 1 (22:34):
I also think it plays a part, and I think
grants a little similar to you in this area where
you guys, both you you lested like midway through the show,
right like you you you went home like what like
six or seven.
Speaker 2 (22:49):
Eight, So you know, in that respect.
Speaker 1 (22:52):
You don't you don't have as much experience on the
show where I do think like the contestants at either
get heartbroken like at the very end, like a Joey
who could then go on the bachelorm and be like, okay,
like let me like actually look at what happened to
me this experience, and now I could do it differently
(23:12):
or at least like know how other people feel in
this process where when you get when you get picked
off at the middle and then you get thrown as
the bachelor. You I could see you looking at it
like can't you even really can you really fall in
love on the show? Like was I really in love
with Michelle? Like I just don't know if you even
take it as seriously go in with.
Speaker 3 (23:34):
Like much less information to work with.
Speaker 2 (23:36):
Yeah, yeah, I agree with you, guys. I mean I
never fell in love with Michelle, so I kind of
just was like, oh, all right, yeah, this is what
I thought reality television was, like you go on here,
you know, I got knocked out in the top eight
or whatever, and I was like all right. So then
when I became the Bachelor, I was like, well, you know,
hopefully within these thirty women there's at least one person
that I'll have interest in. But I remember thinking like,
(23:56):
I don't know, like I'm kind of picky, I have
a certain you know type, or I'm looking for something,
and I mean a single still at twenty eight years
of age, so like, obviously I haven't settled down for
what reasons, while I haven't found exactly what I'm looking for.
So yeah, I went in being like maybe you know,
but there's this I was. I was nervous night one.
I'm like, I don't know if I'll be interested in
any of these girls, like before I saw them, and
(24:17):
then the second they started stepping out the limo, I
was like, all right, I'm like.
Speaker 3 (24:21):
There because you're like I've been on one season and
I didn't fall in love, so there's no like reassurance
like I know that I can fall in love in
this environment. So I feel like you're going in with
that mentality of like we'll see if I could even
fall in love. You probably go in like no guards
up to an extent. You're like, I'll throw my heart
out there, no problem, Like what's the risk because you're
(24:43):
coming off of a season where you were not necessarily heartbroken,
and then it kind of you know, we hit the
other end of the scale with you.
Speaker 2 (24:52):
Yeah. Yeah, Well I fought it until the last second
because you know, I had I think I had five
women or something that like start expressing their feelings towards me.
And then I was like, oh, I'm not opening up still.
I knew in the back of my head. I like,
I was asked early on by a producer like, you,
could you see yourself fall in love with multiple people?
I said no. They said why is that? I said,
(25:13):
because that'll be an absolute mess if I get to
that place, I won't know how to navigate that. And
then I did it, and it's like, you know, I
and I you know, I'm even mentioned that on I
far recently, but that was the truth. Like I remember
I was coming down in an elevator and Raykivic Iceland
and I started hysterically laughing, and they're like, what are
you laughing at. I wasn't on camera at this point,
and I said, I'm soft and they were like why.
(25:35):
I said, because I just realized I fell in love
with multiple women. And they were like, get them into
you know, get them into a room, you know. But
I was laughing because I was like I'm seriously so screwed.
And you know, typically humor is a way to like divert,
you know, away from feeling like you're under in a
threat or you know, like a versus coming. And it's
(25:56):
like I would I was just like laughing. But then
I realized. I was like, I have to tell these women,
you know, you do feel love towards each of them,
and it's three people, so it was, yeah, it was
like this weird feeling. And at that point, I mean,
there was maybe like I don't know, seven days left,
so I was like, not only do like I did,
I just realize this, but now I have to go
tell them all right away. But I was excited. I
(26:17):
was like, I get to tell people I love them,
you know, so like in that moment, I was like
so excited. So I go tell them and it's met well,
and they're excited, you know, because a couple of them
were like, hey, if you don't tell me soon, I'm
going to close off. So I was like, yeah, I
also like need like I get that, like you've told me,
but I haven't told you, so naturally you're going to
pull back, and I don't want that to happen. You know,
I want you to. I want to fully open up
(26:37):
to you and vice versa. But I knew things were again,
Like my head like was all over the place. I
remember I was on a date with one of them,
and I remember looking at them and being like, I
don't want this to end, you know, I want to
like date all three of these women. And I was like,
you can't do that, you know. It's like that's how
crazy my mind was, Like I was like, I just
want to.
Speaker 3 (26:52):
Keep doing it on the next season of Wise.
Speaker 1 (27:02):
Wait, how how do you think so where you're at
mentally today? Yeah, how do you think you would handle
the situation? Now? If you were the bachelor and you
and you would fall for multiple women you're near the end?
Speaker 2 (27:17):
Well, I would communicate times one thousand, I think, you know,
that's where and I think it's shared responsibility. I do
wish a couple of women would have been more you know, communicative.
I felt like they could have done more. But on
the same front, I should have asked more questions. You know,
I wasn't asking enough, so this time around, you know,
if I were to do it a second time, I
would ask way more questions, you know, so that there
(27:38):
aren't any surprises. Would I hold myself back from like
following form multiple people? No, Now I would do if
I fell in love again with multi people, I would
do it. I mean it's it's if you give yourself permission,
you can't do it. And I don't think like the
the the environment allows for it, you know, like the
if you do it correctly. In my opinion, if you
if you are you know, play the batchel for a
(28:00):
role as it should be whatching got on? Is there
right a wrong way to do it? But I'm like,
if you're gonna date multiple people, then you should be
also willing to like stay open to all thirty of
those people or however many. So falling in love with
multiple people if you're doing it correctly is just inevitable
in my in my opinion. But I mean again, I
could you could find a bachelor, they'd be like, no,
you find one person, zero went on them. I just
(28:21):
that's just not the way I'm hardwired. I mean, but
I also I'm a monogamous person. I don't never date
multiple people a multiple you know, in real life, and
don't plan on it. But I would still find myself
being like, yeah, this this show allows you where else
can you go? And I say this, this is the
one thing where like it tricked my brain where I
was like, this doesn't make any sense. I was on
a group date. I kiss this girl. We keep talking,
(28:43):
you know, her and I are off alone. Another girl
comes in. It's like, hey, can I steal you? She
goes away. Her and I start talking. About five or
six minutes in, I go in for the kiss. She
stops me. She goes hold on, wipes off my lips
you have lipstick on your lips, and then goes in
and kisses me. I'm like, I just from my brain
being like, Okay, things just don't This isn't real world,
as in, like things op differently here, like that would
(29:05):
never fly in the real world, but because like you're
you're in this environment where you're given permission by the women.
Speaker 4 (29:12):
I don't know why that story has rattled me like
I was on the show, but I'm like, whoa, it's
just like such a like specific example of yeah, exactly
what you're saying something that would never fly in the
real world, but that it could totally happen multiple times
when you're the bachelor.
Speaker 2 (29:29):
So when you give yourself permission, and I was given
permission by all the women, the producers, and the audience
at the time didn't exist. It was, you know, just filming.
So it's like I was given permission, and I finally
gave myself permission to be like, Okay, I'm going to
compartmentalize each of these relationships. When I'm with this person,
I'm one hundred percent with them. When i'm with this person,
I'm one hundred percent with them, and then when I'm alone,
(29:49):
that's when I have to take the time to like
break down each of the relationships. But you know, I
I still do this day. I'm like I stand by that.
I think like I did it the way that I
think the show certainly wants it to be done. But
I was like, hey, like this would not fly in
the real world, but we're not in the real world,
so I this is the way that like this makes
sense to me, and I want to, you know, give
(30:09):
this a fair shot, and I don't want to leave
anything on the table. So yeah, but that tripped my
mind of it was there's it was instances like that
where I was just like, yeah, like Clayton, you can't
take real world values and and like situations and apply
them to this environment. It does not fit.
Speaker 1 (30:26):
So yeah, I mean that, Yeah, that makes total sense
because you basically, like, as you're going through it, you
have to remind yourself that like this is okay, Like
it's okay to fall in love with multiple women, like
it's okay.
Speaker 3 (30:37):
To do things that feel abnormal.
Speaker 1 (30:40):
But then the audience watches it back and they're like, no,
actually it wasn't okay, you fuckingn asshole, Like you shouldn't
have done that, and you're like wait, but everybody said
it was okay. And then all the girls that were
giving you validation are also jumping in on the on
the audience train and they're like, yeah, Clayton, you're an asshole,
Like you are an asshole.
Speaker 2 (30:58):
And then you're like, oh yeah, it's like it's a
pile on you know, and it's it's that's when it's hard,
because you're like, wait, like you were okay with it,
you know then, but you're not okay with it now,
you know. But then there was again, there was so
many experiences, like there was a women when I was
had my women tell all. There was a girl that
I was out on the boat with in San Diego
(31:18):
a week prior with friends and hey, Clayton, Oh my gosh,
so great to see you. Hugs me. We're hanging out,
we're talking, and then come women tell all she's at
my throat, I mean, only on full attack. And then
at the end of it, she comes up to me
and was like, hey, sab you ben. I was like,
what was that, And she's like, oh, Clayton, it's just TV,
Like come on now, like you you like, don't take
(31:38):
it too seriously.
Speaker 3 (31:39):
And I was like, no, it was easy for you
to say you're getting attacked.
Speaker 2 (31:43):
Public kill it on a boat, and then you're call
me an idiot you know, later like I just but
then again, now I understand that, and I think again,
I say all these things and someone might be like, see, Walt,
reality television is not real. I'm like, no, that's not true.
I also don't stand by that. I'm like, you know,
I there was times when I had to play a role,
but eighty percent of the time I was I was me,
you know, or it was uninfluenced or you know, like
(32:05):
just went in and was you know. I'm like, okay, yeah, sure,
Like there's certain times where we have to maybe play
up a narrative, but overall, I was like, at the end,
it was what you saw was real. So there's absolutely
real elements to it. But you know again, like some
people have motives and they I don't think that's just
shocked anybody, And so I had to realize that. I'm like, oh,
people are playing roles here. Not everybody, but some are,
and so this becomes this whole psychological game of like
(32:27):
who's here for the right reasons who's not? And I
think that's what's enticing. I'm like, oh, it was kind
of fun until it wasn't.
Speaker 1 (32:34):
It's also, yeah, people experience it differently. Like I went
home night one and I remember going home being like, yeah,
like it because of my ego, because I was so
embarrassed to go home night one. In my head, I'm like, well,
that show's like fake, like it's all bullshit. And then
when I go back on and I make it all
(32:55):
the way to the end, I'm like, oh, this is actually,
this is real. I have so I could see how
a girl that goes home whatever week three on your
show is like friends with you in the real world,
but like it's just TV. We're just putting on a show.
Because everyone people have different experiences. Okay, I think that's
a good place to stop the first half. Thank you
(33:15):
everyone for listening to Bachelor Happy Hour, and make sure
you stay tuned because we will have Part two with
Clayton coming up very soon.
Speaker 2 (33:23):
Thank you so much for listening.
Speaker 1 (33:24):
Bye.
Hosts And Creators
Joe Amabile
Susan Noles
Serena Pitt
Kathy Swarts
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