Ep. 54: Genuine Outlaws - Rough Men, Part 2

On this episode of the Bear Grease Podcast, we’re going to continue building a
biographical sketch of Louie Dale and Charley Edwards, two Southern characters known for being turkey hunting outlaws, but also beloved men in their community – by most. We’ll be diving into the moonshine incident and give some backing for why people said they were “rough men” – you’re going to hear about some fighting and gun play, so if you’re sensitive to such talk – be advised - but if you want a small picture into the American south, these guys deliver. These men were connected to the land and it shaped their identity. Host Clay Newcomb, having known them his whole life, Is unashamed by how much he liked these guys, but conflicted because he disagreed with some stuff they did. Life is a paradox and linear equations built for judgement don’t always add up. This episode is a sketch of two modern colorful characters. Their lives were just straight up entertaining and intriguing, we doubt you’re gunna want to miss it….Hey, and if you’ll stick around the very end…You’ll hear Clay and game warden Jimmy Martin relive a run in they had when Clay was 16 years old.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:05):
They run one vehicle up behind him and running another
one up and parked in front of the car and
open fire. Dad bailed out and he said, he he said,
I just ran, he said, and I ran hard. He said.
There was two ba bar fences. I don't remember jumping
any one of them. On this episode of the Bargaras Podcast,

(00:26):
we're going to continue building a biographical sketch of Louis
Dell and Charlie Edwards, two Southern characters known for being
turkey hunting outlaws, but also beloved men in their community.
By most we'll be diving into the Moonshine incident and
giving some backing for why people said they were rough men.

(00:49):
You're gonna hear about some fighting and some gun plays,
so if you're sensitive to such talk, be advised. But
if you want a picture into the American South, these
guys will deliver. These men were connected to the land
and it shaped their identity. Having known them my whole life,
I'm unashamed by how much I like these guys, but

(01:11):
conflicted by how much I disagree with some of the
stuff they did. Life is a paradox, and linear equations
built for judgment don't always add up. This episode is
a character sketch of two modern colorful characters. Their lives
were just straight up entertaining and intriguing. I doubt you're

(01:33):
gonna want to miss this one. And hey, stick around
to the very end and you'll hear me and Game
Warden Jimmy Martin relive the run in that I had
with him when I was sixteen years old. According to
game laws, they were poaching. According to our forefathers, they

(01:53):
were doing what they were supposed to. They grew up
with that mentality right Eron's Valley, and it still exists
to point we're more civilized now. Yeah. Yeah. My name

(02:13):
is Clay Nukelem and this is the Bear Grease Podcast,
where we'll explore things forgotten but relevant, search for insight
and unlikely places, and where we'll tell the story of
Americans who lived their lives close to the land. Presented
by f HF Gear American Maid, purpose built hunting and

(02:34):
fishing gear that's designed to be as rugged as the
places we explore. In Part one of our Genuine Outlaw series,
we introduced you to two brothers by the name of

(02:55):
Louis Dell and Charlie Edwards from Big Fork Arkansas in
the western wah Hitals. If you haven't listened to it,
you've got to for all this to make sense. Charlie
passed away in at the age of seventy three, and
Louis del in one at the age of seventy six.
I expressed my inner conflict in telling their story because

(03:17):
there is a risk of glamorizing breaking the laws and outlawing,
but being true to our mission. I love telling the
stories of people who live their lives close to the land,
especially in the South, and without a doubt, my whole life,
I've been intrigued by these men. I think it's an

(03:38):
apropos time to clarify the intent of telling this story.
It is not to decide if breaking game laws is
right or wrong. We all know the answer to that.
What it is is an intriguing look into human nature.
Often we gravitate towards stories that are far outside of
our personal experience. I've never been an intentional law breaker

(04:02):
or fighter, but these boys were. They're real deal characters
that shaped my view of rural Arkansas. You see, I
grew up in the same community as Louis Dell and Charlie,
and I was heavily influenced by my father, Gary Knucom,
a small town banker who would come home from work
and tell me stories about people he had met and

(04:23):
done business with. At the time, he nor I would
know how influential his storytelling would be in my life.
It taught me to value people of all types, and
he told me stories about Louis Dell and Charlie. But
the knowledge of these stories didn't push me to want
to break game laws. It was clear he valued them
for other reasons, and he still does. A window into

(04:46):
their life gave me a broader picture of the reality
of the world, a world that he knew I would
have to live in. The intent of exploring this story
is to help us evaluate our own biases, to search
for oocracies, and to see the bigger story that most
people have. Humans can't be described in totality by a

(05:07):
single descriptor or label. Life is sometimes gray. We don't
function well in those gray areas. Lastly, I hope this
story fortifies a culture of putting the wildlife resource first
by obeying science back to game laws. Being a poacher
isn't complex. You either is one or you ain't one.

(05:28):
But this story about Louis Dell and Charlie. Their life
is complex, and I'm not trying to decide whether I'm
okay with people being outlaws. I'm trying to make sense
of why people love them so much, and in the
same breath, understand how they were such rough characters. A

(05:50):
little backstory from episode one, we learned that the Edwards
brothers came from a family of moonshiners, and their uncle
and his coon dog were killed by police in the
ninth twenty six traffic stop gone Bad. These men were
known for killing a lot of turkeys and evading the
law with almost a supernatural ease, and they worked hard
at everything they did, including outlaw on we learned they

(06:15):
were generous and forthright, genuine even people used to the
scripture of pure But one thing is for sure, you
didn't want to cross them. Here's Stony Edwards, the son
of Charlie. He'll get us going into a string of
stories highlighting their rougher side. Get ready for a few rumbles.

(06:41):
They were as nice as can be, either one of them,
but they didn't have a whole lot of push to
The fuse was about that long and as long as
everything was going good and you were treating them as
well as they would treat using. You're fine, but then
you get on the bad side. And we were rough fellers.
I mean, they didn't believe in I will call the

(07:05):
law on you. They were gonna take care of it
theirselfs Do you remember several years ago there what was
the guy's name, How big old boy? Are you? Hard mercer? Well,
you know Pete Hillard and Jackie Ryan. They got this
great idea to call on Gloodell because they knew that

(07:27):
that would stir him up. And I don't remember who
they put, Oh they did. They got on the phone. Well,
we lived over here at dill Back Place at the time,
and I was about twenty, I guess, and here come
Uncloodell sliding into the yard. I mean he said, y'all
get in. We got take care of Now. You think

(07:50):
I'm joking, But when we left the house, every one
of us had a gunning ring. This wasn't gonna be
no barroom brawl crap. This was well, we got down
there and it was Jackie and peace and uh so Louis,
I mean Louis Dell was ready to it was. He
was ready for a shootout whatever it was gonna take

(08:11):
him and Dad both were really hard people are That's
how they came off. When you grow up like they did, though,
it was you gotta have that shell out there. That
was their protection. And then when they left here and
went to the city, they were dumb hillbillies according to
the city people, but they had that shell. Well. Everything

(08:33):
with them, too, was a fight. They didn't believe in
all the talking stuff. You just got walked. I mean,
I know, I've heard stories of a lot of our fights. Yeah,
if only that phone call could have been recorded. Whatever
they said pushed Louis Dell to the edge. These brothers
had a stark and temperamental sense of justice. They didn't

(08:56):
do well with a lot of talking. Here's knee Old Taylor,
a good friend of the brothers. You know, Old Lois
del There's a lot of people that morning, Mike lud
mad h. I'm gonna tell you what, And you could
make him mad pretty easy. Charlie it was hard to
make mad, but Charlie is the one he wanted to watch.

(09:18):
He got mad because he was tougher and mean. Really,
everyone I spoke with said the same thing about Charlie.
He was tough here's Stony And for a little info,
The Candle Light is a bar on the edge of Oklahoma.
I was probably six and he had been over at

(09:41):
the Candlelight. They were shooting pool, which my dad loved
shoot pulling, and he had won a few games. And
he always wore a great, big old black leather cowboy hat.
I mean I remember him wearing one till the brim
on it was just nobs and he had sewed it
back together himself to three times. He was over there

(10:02):
that night and Uh, a man stood up and said,
I bet I can knock cut some hat off and
he won't do a thing about it. Well, he made
about two steps across the floor before Dad hit him
with a Q stick and he went down. He was done.
A couple of weeks later, they cornered Dad to go,
you know, bear to go, and uh went shooting at him. Well,

(10:24):
Dad bailed out of the car and off out across
the retaliating for what had happened. Well, they they run
one vehicle up behind him and running another one up
and parked in front of the car and opened fire.
And yeah, he Dad bailed out and he said he
he said, I just ran He said and I ran

(10:45):
hard and said. A couple of hours later he was
coming back. I want to get back to the car,
you know, And uh he said, there was two baby
our fences. I don't remember jumping in one of them.
Dad got into uh more of that stuff, and uh,
Uncle Adelle did. Uncle Ade was a little he was

(11:05):
just as rough, but he was a little more settled
about it. But as far as their heart went, they
do anything for for a friend or for somebody that
needed them. But they didn't want everybody to know about
it because that would affect that shell that they wouldn't
be tough guys. Anymore. Interesting analysis from Stony about them

(11:28):
developing a hardened shell. It seems the catalysts of this
hardness worked both ways. It made them deeply loyal and
devoted to friends, and it made them dangerous if you
cross them. Y'all remember Andy Brown here he is recalling
a story of a bar fight in Texas. If you remember,

(11:48):
these brothers worked out of state a fair bit in
the city. Oh Loudell talk hells a story about what
they were down there in DALYs of work. He said,
got that other one night, so it went to a
bar and he said, we walked in. He said, I
ain't been that bar ten minutes he said, he said, oh,
broke loose back there in the dangpool room. He said.

(12:10):
I looked around, and I said, where Charlie. He said,
he said he went back there and he said here
old Charlie that he said, Man, he's find the big
old boys. And he said, he said that old boy
and he whooped, he said, and he said about that time,
he said that old boy went to screaming and take

(12:31):
it on. And he said he finally looked. He said,
old Charlie was just taking bitens clugs out of me.
Tried to get away from him. Uh, it doesn't and
he whooped. He said, he went to their blugs out
of him. Wow, I can imagine a few people got

(12:54):
surprised by these outwardly unassuming hillbillies. You remember were Stoney
mentioning Jackie Ryan Prank calling Louis Dell, Well, this is
Jackie telling a story about the brothers. I was doing
a job in Dallas and they went down to a
club and uh, Charlie playing pool and and uh he

(13:16):
got in fat. I mean they getting he gets uh
you know it over money. I'm sure they're probably having
a bed. And Charlie he was good a bought both
of them is good pool shooters. And uh, but but
he gets in the fat in there, and there was
other people around and and uh, Louie got out there
truck and got his pistol and and I think the
fat he had moved outside or got outside, and there

(13:39):
was people around him while he was at the pistol
out and and Ann was keeping everybody off of them
while they was fat, and you know, and make sure
nobody get it bobbed, you know. And uh, I think
Charlie had used cuesdick on the game, you know. And
and there there was another part of it where he uh,
he chumped down on he's there. I know he did,

(14:01):
but he's uh. And Charlie had fathered face and they
he been a chunk guys there, that's what he did.
These guys weren't afraid to pull a gun or to
bite you. They played by their own rules. Like Andy said,
that's just the way it happened. Here's Andy with another one.

(14:22):
They were Dallas or Fort Worth putting in drop ceilings
for Walmart store, and uh, anyway, everything was kind of
open and anyway they had some old boys come in
there and kind of put in on them, and uh,
it was Charlie in Louddale in Vernon, Ryan Vernon was
working with him. This guy was yeen with with Loue Dell.

(14:42):
He was up on the scissor lift and Vernon said,
the whole time he's y yang and telling Loudell what
he's gonna do to him. He said, Charlie is slipping
up on that guy. He said he's got a claw Himer.
He said, he's got it in his hand. In Vernon.
Of course, Vernon says he's watching all this and watching
Charlie and he said, Charlie walks up behind that guy,

(15:04):
he said, with a claw in and he draws back
and Vernon said, I went, oh, whoa, whoa like it,
you know, And that guy saw him, but he said
Charlie was fixing and knocked him in the head with
that claw. Hammer said, but anyway, the guy kept telling
on Liddell, I'm gonna go get get my bunch and
I'll be back. And Loudelle said, that's exactly what you
guys need to do. And he said when that guy

(15:25):
walked off, Loudelle got down off his sister left, went
to his truck and I don't know, Clay, if you've
ever heard about the trust and the stories, he had
a rifle, that's all he ever deer hunted with. And anyway,
he went and got the five, put it on. The
sister left and got back up in the deal and
just kept working. And he kept working. But Loudell was

(15:45):
a great shot. I mean, when you run, when you
run deer with dogs, you've gotta be And then boys,
they wouldn't knew what happened if they had come back.
They never came back. No, they never come back. Thank god.
You know Verdon is scared to death or gonna come up. Yeah. Man,
it sounds like you wouldn't want to cross these boys.
And I'll tell you another thing that would not be

(16:06):
advisable would be messing with their dogs. This is a
longtime friend of the Edwards brothers, Jerry Dean Pickett. Well,
it was a dear season and we had been running
the dogs. There's a gap in there dogs. When I
was gap. We didn't kill the deer, but anyway, the

(16:26):
dog was checking it out. He had him with tracking
colors on and we come around are catching the dogs
and he said, one of my dog right up here,
on the right up here, and we drove up this
feller's house. He got out and he said, with my
dogs around here, right here close. He said, yeah, your
colors were on the woodpile. He said, I killed your

(16:46):
dog up there, and yeah, LOUI ain't never threatened him,
He never said nothing, but he just kept walking to him.
And when he got hands of him, he spatted him
when bouncing across him. Rocks and as a feller from
Texas hunting with this other fellow, I don't forgot his name,
and uh, Louis went to working on him. I'm telling you,

(17:09):
working on him. You're you're here, you're watching. I'm standing
right there and that other feller standing of workers. I
knew what was fending to happen when he said he
kill that dog, and I figured the other feller getting it,
but he didn't. Finally he hollered the whole hold Louis,
he didn't kill you, dough. So he stopped and he
told me, said asked him a question, He said, why

(17:30):
did you tell me you killed my dog? He never
would say, tell him, so he got his collar. He
got off fellow and he told him he said, I'm
going back to my house. My dog don't come home.
I'm coming back over and finished when I started, and
that's how Louis said, went on to the house. Sure enough,
the dog did come home. So so the guy was

(17:52):
just messing with Louis. Well, I guess, but Loui Dea
was't the type that you can mess with. He wasn't
gonna argue with you. It was just him and Charlie both.
You know, they didn't mind falling down the dirt, will
you if that's what you want to do. Now that
that's the part of them, I'm still trying to put
together the pieces because they were such like you get

(18:13):
this one feeling that they were just the nicest guys
in the world, which they were. I want to hear
how you connect the nicest guy in the world to
a guy that'll just fight you in a second? How
did that? How does that? Have you ever been in
there where people go to argon and you know, carrying on? Well,

(18:33):
I just want to time Charlie want nobody to tangle with.
So Charlie was the was a real tough guy, and
Louis was bad. But Charlie got more scrapped and Louis
did if you gen the beer, join or anywhere and
you got to won't argue with him. It was just
on Well, they shaved me three years old. He was
still laying block. Charlie was really he was still land

(18:57):
block at seventy three years that he was drown How
how big were they? You know? I knew when I
was a kid. Louis was about my side. Carl It
was a little bit taller than Louis and he was.
They were both solid, yea stocky guys. Hands would big.

(19:20):
Both of them had big hand when you shook hands,
whether you could feel it. I find it a healthy
practice to peer into a world foreign too your own.
I've never been a fighter, nor would I condone violence
as a productive means of solving disputes. But I do
admire their certainty to continue on in our study of

(19:42):
these brothers. I'm gonna read from a newspaper clipping from
the nineteen nine edition of the Mina Star. The headline
of this newspaper says big fort Man arrested and charged
with a legal whiskey still operation. A big fort Man
has been released a ten thousand dollar property bond after
being charged with the operation of the legal whisky whiskey

(20:04):
still near the Polk Pike County line. Louis D. Edwards, forty,
will be arraigned Monday in Polk County Circuit courts, according
to Polk County Sheriff Fred Niblock. Niblock said it is
the first still confiscated in Polk County in approximately eleven years.
Officers also confiscated three hundred and five pounds of what

(20:25):
is believed to be deer meat, fifty to seventy five
pounds of what is believed to be turkey meat, along
with fifty two turkey beards at the house. According to the
the Arkansas Game and Fish Commission, Enforcement officers officers found
an operational whiskey still, a hundred and sixty five gallons
of fermating mash, and partially filled wooden barrel containing approximately

(20:45):
twenty gallons of whiskey at edwards residence in Big Fork,
according to Nibblock. Also found were several gallon and half
gallon jars of whiskey. The officers sees the loaded shotgun
and several cartons of rifle and shot ammunition at the site,
along with the nineteen four Chevrolet four wheel drive pickup
containing a bottle of what the officers believed to be

(21:08):
illegal whiskey. Also confiscated where sugar yeast, corn starter mash,
and utensils believed to have been used in the illegal
production of whiskey. Hey had a really nice set up.
I'll be dar Do you remember that as a kid.
I wasn't a kid. I was in the United States
Army when that What year was that? N Here's Neil

(21:31):
Taylor with what happened in the Moonshine raid. There was
a guy come over to buy some fish. You know,
Louie used to raise catfish. Louie had a little steel
learned in the fish room, and they were just making
it for himself and mainly a few of his friends
out there. You know. Hey gave us old boys un well,

(21:53):
they got drunk, got caught, told the more he got it,
you know. So they sent a sheriff Montgomery count here
over in pair of camouflage and talking about turkey hunting,
you know, and and one off knew any place had some. Well,
Louis gave him a court a game shot. That's good

(22:13):
that can I buy something? And not that I ain't
gonna sell it to you, but he said, I'll give
you a chuard of it. And Old Fred Neblake he
was sheriff and it was re election and he thought
that that would get him reelected. Oh, it was kind
of a political move. Well to some extent it was
he and they were just after and you know the

(22:33):
game Mordens eight was all in it in Ah. Oh.
Look he was there at the house one morning and
he's camo overalls and barefoot didn't and all of a sudden,
long cars started pulling up in the front yard. Old
went out there and Old Fred he stepped out. He said,
what't going on? Fred? And I was I was kind

(22:57):
of afraid going out there, you know what he might do.
And he's, well, look you know what we heard. You
had some uh well that he was making whiskey out here,
and Laris said, so he said, are you the smile
said the best whiskey you ever tasted. And so they

(23:22):
coming learned. Of course the game wardens they had there's
been they had been after him all his life, and
they coming there and they took Mete out of the
freezers and they got turkey beards he kept through the years.
And I don't know they had him for about twenty
thousand dollars worth of game violations, and he was up.

(23:42):
They heading to jail. I took him to jail, of course,
and as upper and coming in, and I said, Lari said,
we've got you for this, this, this now. If you'll
plead guilty to the here said we'll drop it down
to in thousand and he said, boys, he said, I'm
not going to plead guilty to it. Fine. It wound up.
They didn't. I like it, coughed him about Tian Graham

(24:05):
on Whishkey making for the record. The idea that the
raid was a political move by the sheriff isn't really
known for sure, but it was the speculation of many.
The Moonshine raid also included a game and fish raid. However,
all the wildlife violations were dropped. It's unclear to me

(24:25):
if it was because of faulty procedure in the raid
making the evidence unusable in court, or if they just
couldn't prove that all the wildlife was taken illegally. According
to the family, the game and fish had to bring
back all the meat and return it to the Edwards freezer.
So according to the law, Louis del was innocent of

(24:47):
the wildlife violations. On a completely irrelevant and tragic side note,
Sheriff Fred Niblock would later become the mayor of Cove, Arkansas,
and in night he was murdered by a disgruntled seventy
eight year old man upset about an eighteen dollar water bill.

(25:08):
The story made national news because the murderer had ridden
his lawnmower to the city hall and also used it
as a getaway vehicle. David Letterman made a joke about
the incident on his Late night show, bringing Arkansas into
the national spotlight for the eccentric murder. I bet you
weren't expecting that. Here's some more of the back story

(25:32):
on Louis Dell's moonshining from Jerry Deane Pickett that paints
a little different light on it. For some info, Mr
Mack was Louis Dell's father who only had one hand.
Mr Mack he had done his grandpa and his daddy
and the old mate whiskey, and Mr Mack had a recipe.
And Louis Dale told me all along. He said, you know,

(25:55):
I ain't never made no whiskey, but I'd like to
make it one time. Just see if I can, and
so he ended up getting to steal. He was making whiskey.
He was already making it out there and buying his
house In't it a little garage I called it. He
wasn't making it to sell or make a living. He
just making it see if he could make Him and

(26:16):
Charlie I think he'd ruined about Tim Gallands at the time.
Did that bother him that he got that they busted
him for that? No, really, it just I mean he
had to pay a lot of money though didn't well,
he had to get a lawyer affirt Main and they
had to go to court and all that, But it
didn't bother He wasn't mad about that. I mean, but
Louis never I never heard him say a horse word

(26:39):
against none of them he called him really so he
just was kind of okay with him. Yeah, he got
Uh was he embarrassed about it? You think? Just kind
of like just another day on Edwards Farm. He wanted
to see if he could make it. But they wasn't
making it to make money. They just Louis wanted just
he wanted to see if he could make it. Yeah,

(27:00):
I've tried several times to get him to give me
Max recipe, and he's to say, oh, jee, you don't
need that his recipe. It just gets you intro him.
That's all he would. He wouldn't give you till the
day he died. He never give me that recipe. Everybody
agrees that Louis Dell never made moonshine again. If you remember,

(27:25):
on the first episode the game Warden, Jimmy Martin made
some statements about how he never caught Louis Dell and Charlie,
which was correct because during his career nobody ever caught him. However,
before Jimmy Martin became a game warden, they were caught
for illegal turkey hunting when they were young. Here's Neil
Taylor telling about the brothers getting caught. Let me go back,

(27:49):
let me go back. Before we was at just a
minute ago. I said that Louis never got caught. In Charlie,
they did get caught one time when they first started.
Really I guess say turkey hunted all her life off. No,
but when they really took off serious about it. Uh,
he had no toy Yoda, and he had take that
thing where a billy goat couldn't go. You could look

(28:11):
at the body work on it until it But they
went up as old skid trail top of the mountain
and they drought turkey hunting and they killed one. But
anyhow they called. They had parked down and walked up
the mountain, was hidding the brush around a Loulie struck,
he haven't Charlie come out, and they put the bird
under the hood and stuff started getting the truck, and

(28:31):
they come out and rested them, you know, and old
Charlie out And I could nobody tell it like Charlie did,
he said. After they rode as a tickets, he said,
the dumb ass old bees ask us for a ride
back down the mountain. Louie said, well, sure, you give
you a ride, just crawling the biker. Old Charlie, you

(28:56):
get tick, will tell me, he said. Louise hearted up
and backed up, trying ran. He said he looked over
it when he said, Charlie, you better hang on. He said,
Louis forward that thing, and he said we went off
of that dad gum mounting on that good trail on
hitting him was wasshed out place, and he said, you

(29:16):
looked back her in the back. He said, they had
all be with her hands and hair stuck up in
the air on their back one time, he said, next
time they'd become down on her ants. He said, it's
a wander at and killed. He said, you know when
they stopped at the bottom, he said, has sound grateful.

(29:37):
They didn't even think us for giving him a ride.
So they did get caught. And I don't want to
take lightly these guys disregard for the law or putting
someone in danger, But that doesn't erase for me how
interesting this story is. If there was a movie about
these guys, which there probably should be, this would probably

(29:57):
be your favorite scene. I I'm just trying to figure
all this out because I don't think any of us
would condone such behavior or do it ourselves, but it's
no doubt intriguing. Author Mark Bowden, in his book Killing Pablo,
gave some insight into the irony of our intrigue with outlaws.

(30:18):
Here's the quote from the book, quote the ones immortalized
by Hollywood al Capone Body and Clyde Jesse James. Large
numbers of average people rooted for them and followed their
bloody exploits with some measure of delight. Their acts, however
selfish or senseless, were invested with social meaning. Their crimes

(30:41):
and violence were blows struck against distant oppressive power. Their
stealth and cunning and avoiding soldiers and police were celebrated,
these being the time honored tactics of the powerless man.
That sounds familiar in dearmot to an outlaw is the

(31:02):
time honored tactic of the powerless. We'll hear a lot
more about this in later episodes. Here's stody was some
more interesting intel. They got caught again, So they did
get caught. That was the one time they got caught. All.
Dad got caught another time. He'd been hunting down here. Oh,

(31:23):
there used to be an old man lived down here
named Fred Ferguson, And Dad had went in behind his
house that morning and he killed him a good gobbler.
And when he come back out, which Fred was about
seventy five or eight years old, then he stopped at
Fred's and cleaned it and gave Fred the bird. Well,
then Dad went home. Well, I guess the game, and

(31:45):
Fish had heard him shoot or seen him to leave Fred's.
And they went in and searched and found that turkey
and told Fred called Charlie and tell him get come
over here. And take his ticket, or we're gonna take
you to jail. And Dad got in his truck and
go back over there. Kind got his ticket. Dad told me,
he said, have dollars that average apter list and thirty

(32:07):
cents a bird today if you get caught. The law
confiscates vehicles, guns and all kinds of stuff, along with
fines that can cripple a man, which we all believe
is a good thing. Again, I think Charlie's sentiment clearly
shows this was a different era. Back then, it was
just a ticket and a three fine. I'll let you

(32:29):
do the math on how many turkeys Charlie claim to kill.
This also gives us a one time glimpse into what
these guys did with some of the meat. In this case,
Charlie gave it to the elderly landowner. If you remember,
the game warden didn't think they killed as many turkeys
as people believed because of the unsolved issue about what

(32:49):
was done with all the meat. However, one thing every
single person agreed on is that they would never waste
any meat. Here's Neil giving us some insight on some
of what they did with it. You know, I know
that a lot of old people old ladies and stuff.
And even if something old men, they got too old,

(33:11):
get out. Louis would take them, dear mate, he'd take
them turkey breast when he when he gave somebody like
get the mayor, you hey, might give a show for
the refs too. Yeah, but them old people like it.
He took the best cuts to him. He'd take him
if he took them tender on something, onom he took
them a young tender one, or he'd give them the breast. Yeah, turkey.

(33:36):
When I mentioned to somebody about their ethic around meat,
they said, turkey poachers only take the breasts. Well, I
wanted to get to the bottom of this. Here's Jerry Deane.
I've heard it said that he had a really strong
ethic for not wasting meat. He would not hunt nothing
anything they're waste. I mean a lot of these people

(33:59):
take the breast out of a turkey and throw the
rest of the way. No, no, we we take all
the dark legion. Really, so, even even if he was
illegally killed a turkey and was sneaking it out in
his pants pockets, he was taking the drumsticks and the
thighs and everything. You didn't leave nothing but the God.
I had another person off the record confirmed to me

(34:21):
that they always took the entire turkey and never just
breasted it out. I got a question for you. Have
you ever breasted out of turkey and not used the
thighs and drumsticks? Be honest, because I sure have. With
today's wild game movement, most people are now keeping and
using the dark meat on a turkey. Back in the day,
I'm telling you they didn't do that. But these boys

(34:44):
were doing this long before it was cool. Again, I'm
not saying that made poaching right. That's not what I'm
saying at all. I'm just saying it's an interesting point.
Here's Stoney with some more details. We ate everything. I
I've had a lot of friends that would go hunting
with us and they would sit there and bone out

(35:04):
of deer. Oh most of them don't take ribs, and
they don't take necks, And there's not a lot of
meat on ribs or necks either one. But when we
get home, what we don't eat, our dogs do. Because
we've got a cook pot that's as big as this table.
We'll take ribs, we take coon carcasses, possum carcasses. We

(35:26):
don't skin coons and woods. We'll bring them home, skin
them out. Carcass goes in the freezer when we've got
enough in there. We filled pot up that potle feed
dogs for about two weeks. When they were growing up.
That's all the dogs eight was. There was dog food
stuff when I was a kid, that pot cooking in
the front yard and they just build a big pine

(35:48):
not fire into that pot. So they had a really
strong thing about not wasting meat. None of it goes
to waste. As long as they knew you were taking
it to eat, that they did not have a problem.
Was it. Here's Stoney talking about the only time they
turned somebody else into the game and fish. They came

(36:09):
from a different era and just had a mentality about
taking more game than they were allotted. Like why did
why do you think they thought they could do that?
And what would they have been mad at somebody else
if somebody else has been like that, Like if there
had been another another guy a couple of mountains over
that was just as big a big outlaws them. I've

(36:30):
seen them turn one person in and my whole life
they called they went drove out and called game fish
on that was wasting meat. We were hunting down on
South Boundary. That was the only year we camped down there.
And there were some people camped down just below us,
and they had four carcasses laying there and they had

(36:52):
they hadn't even skin them, and they cut back straps
out of them, and the whole rest of the deers
were all four deer were laying there. And my uncle
drew by that and he said that ain't you on fly?
And he drove from there to Langley and called game
fish and had got him upburn and they got rope takes.

(37:13):
Interesting stuff. These next two stories are just straight up
entertaining that continued to paint a picture who these characters were.
Here's Andy Brown. I don't know he just I'm missing
my missing every day, you know, I think about everybody's
got a Louis Hill story, and you know, I've one

(37:33):
of the funniest stories and of all time probably this.
If If I had this on tape, I would I
would have been a millionaire because back when I first
went to work for the company I worked for, I
had insured a house that Louisdell owned over between Big
FOURK and Opal. Charlie lived in it with his wife
and so when I insured it, we had a field man,

(37:55):
Charles glide when he's one of the greatest guys I've
ever met in my life. And so we pulled up
over to Charlie's got out and they had a rot
water dog that you could road. I mean, he was
a monster. Step on the porch, you know, but I mean,
you know. We get by the roight waller dog and
we go in and I said to Charlie, I said,

(38:15):
I said, we need to look at your breaker box.
And he I can't remember what his wife's name was,
but she was really nice. He said, take him in
there and sho him where the breaker box is. So
we walk in this We walk in this bedroom and
there's this big old cage, I mean a big cage,
and breaker box is over on the wall that anyway,

(38:38):
Charlie goes over and looks at it and takes a
picture of it, and in about that time, this fox
squirrel comes running out on this They got this tree
for li Liam's cut. This fox girl comes running out
there and I said, I said, oh, you've got a
pet squirrel and she says, oh yeah, she says this thing. Thanks,
I'm a smarma, and she just reaches over and opens
up the cage. That squirrel just hops up on her shoulder,

(39:01):
on her It's sitting there popping to stay like that,
and Charlie is standing about about eighteen inches from her.
And Charlie's dressed nice. He's got his tie on and
his white shirt and his knit pants. And about that
time Charlie goes, oh, that's a nice squirrel, And about
that time that thing just hops over on charts. Oh, man,

(39:29):
old Charlie. He just froze. He just stiffened up. And
when she when she reached to get that squirrel, that squirrel,
Clay just ringed him like a dead snack. He had
no stiff pants up. And when it did, he just
stiffened up like anyone. He screamed like a walk anywhe

(40:00):
she got to squirrel over the closing anything like that,
I was out of control. I couldn't even catch my breath.
But anyway, that's a story, but that's hilarious. So they
had a pet fox girl. Oh, he screamed like a wildcat.

(40:22):
I'll never in my life forget Andy Belly laughing about
this thirty years after it happened. Here's another interesting story
about Louis Dell's appreciation of rattlesnakes and the Edwards brother's
choice of footwear. This is Jackie Ryan, the guy that
nearly got shot when he prank called Louis Dell. We

(40:44):
was turkey out one morning, coming off a mountain and
and I mean we should have ratt I mean just
we went airborne to old same time, but uh, huge
rattler and they rattle return and we scattered. Well, I
mean he should leave it, baby, don't don't mess with it. Said,
he could have been at either one of us, you know.

(41:05):
And uh he's told me stories here just not there
or four year ago or if five, maybe about one. Uh,
he was a word turkey on one morning and daylight
and and uh he heard some rustling in the leaves
and and he should do was a monster one come
right up between his legs, him sitting there against tree

(41:27):
that he had set out on it. It was just
cold that morning, you know, it was early spring. And uh,
he just didn't never believe in killing rattlesnakes. I've seen
him catch one. We've been aware of fishing on the
cost Tot And he was out there barefooted at at dark.
It was just after dark and and got him a
stick and fork of stick, and he caught that thing

(41:50):
and got it by the bash of the head and
put it back to the truck and carried it back
and were with him a word baylock. I mean, I
never didn't even kill one, so he turned it loose. Yeah,
he likes trattle snakes. I like that. I like rattle
snakes too. And he wore tennis shoes every I mean
when he went a hunting most every time he went,
he wore tennis shoes. Did he really, Oh? Yeah, yeah,

(42:12):
he didn't hunting boots. No, did he not know he'd
wear tennis shoes old Tam, he did, but he kind
of hunt and he did. He wore tennis shoes. This
is new news to me. He always had crossing creeks
and getting wet and I didn't care about that. He
weighed right out in it didn't matter, and just wear

(42:32):
wet tennis shoes. And I'm sure cotton socks he probably didn't. Yeah,
I don't remember exactly what socks she wore, but I
know he wore them tennis shoes old time. And he
did that in Colorado too, did he really? Yeah, he'd
wear tennis shoes. I don't remember him wearing many boots.
He did backed years ago work in boots. I don't
think he done a whole lot in boots. Really, he

(42:53):
didn't even work in leather. But he wore tennis shoes
most of the time. Oh my, okay, Jackie, you don't
know what you've done, because this recks my philosophy. I
have a really strong philosophy on footwear. And you are
well inside the bounds. You're wearing a beautiful pair of
probably red wing boots. I don't know if it was Okay, okay,

(43:14):
I got my schnays one. I don't like to go
anywhere where I don't have a good leather boot on me.
Was he ever bit by a snake that you know?
Not that I know of. I heard Charlie was one
time a squirrel hunt, and they said he'd squirrel barefooted,
you know, because where you slip around and got bit

(43:35):
by a copy head. But I mean that just want
hunted squirrels barefoot. Yeah, I believe it. And I think
they had competitions. I mean, you know, they was they
were competitive with each other, and you know, and and
I think Louie always thought Charlie but a squirrel hunter,
and he was that maybe not on anything else but squirrels.

(43:57):
I think it's you know, he thought, butter squirrel on it.
I wouldn't want have been a squirrel in the woods.
Louis Dell was a woodsman in the truest sense of
the word. He knew the woods like the back of
his hand and how to gain resource from it. He
spent more time in the woods in a year than

(44:18):
most people would in a lifetime. To hear that he
wore tennis shoes kind of puts all our fancy gear
into perspective. I had a question for Stony about some
of the deer's uncle and dad killed. Honestly, I was
hoping to see some of the racks. I was very
surprised at what he said. Did Uh did your dad

(44:40):
or Louis Dell ever kill any I mean, I know
they did, real big bucks. Oh yeah, have you got
some of their horns? Still you don't have any of
their horns? Uh? Gloodell's got two deer hanging on his wall.
About four years ago, we had been running all morning
and we got back to his house and I heard
two him dogs, three of my dogs. They've been running

(45:02):
five hours and I heard him come across the mountain
up there, and Uncle, I'll run to the truck and
got his gun, and uh, he said, they'll come out
at the crowd down there, and I said, all right,
well it's a cross three hundred yards. Well, we looked
up and here coming this buck across the field and
he's coming right straight at us. Well, he got out
there and turned broadside, and Uncle I said shoot him,

(45:25):
and I said I I can't. He's a hundred and
fifty hundred and sixty yards and he's out of my
He's got a six meli mate in his hand. I
said you shoot him and he boom. He turned the
circle there and fell over and then and he was
he's a nice, nice eleven point. And I told Uncle
and I said, we need to go get that one mounted. Well,

(45:46):
we we sat down right there before we even went
to the deer, because Dan's still hear the dogs. There
was a mile behind him. He can still hear dogs running.
And I said, they'll be out here in a minute.
Let them let them find him, you know. And directly
here you see all three of them coming across the
field right up there and circling in that deer. And
we went ahead and drove out there then. And I

(46:08):
don't know if he was more proud of the deer
or the dogs, because he sat there petting on him
and feeding him liver. And you need, you need to
put that deer in this uh gas station. Uncloud Hell's
got three sets of horns that he's kept his entire life.
Ones is both kill elk five to five elk that
buck there and then year before last he killed a

(46:31):
nice nine point. They saw off horns and just keep
him in the barn or something. Yeah, but they gave
him way over the years. Yeah, dad killed a killed
a thirteen point. They had a twenty three inside spread
and uh, my nephew came came from Tulsa, and Dad
gave him the horns. And they killed a lot of

(46:51):
nice ones over the years. But the horns just didn't
mean much to him. It didn't mean anything. Give they
give away their deer horns. They just when we're deer
camp during that week, it's all important, the big bucks,
who killed the biggest buck. When we go home that night,
the last night of camp, none of it matters anymore.

(47:12):
In fact, when we're packing up camp. Oh, you can
have them horned I feel on them. That was surprising
to me that they didn't care about the horns. It
doesn't fit the stereotypical ideas we have about quote poachers,
but it does fit the character of Louis Dell and Charlie.
I'd sooner give away my truck than a set of

(47:32):
white tail antlers. Does that make me a trophy hunter?
Louis Dell and Charlie were serious deer hunters, and the
only way they cared about killing one is if it
was in front of a dog. And for the purpose
of the expansion of our worldview, I'll mention this dog
deer hunters have often been known to think that still hunters,

(47:53):
tree stand hunters, guys that hunt over corn piles and
food plots aren't real sport wortsman. They believe it takes
more skill and dedication to craft to kill a deer
in front of a dog, and when you hear their side,
it's hard to argue with the purpose of this is
not to incite an argument or debate of whether the

(48:15):
doctrine is right or wrong, because there isn't an answer.
I've always talked about supporting all legal methods of hunting.
Stuff like this teaches me the world is much bigger
than my small window into it and my personal preferences
in my style of hunting, and I respect the way
a man wants to hunt as long as it's within

(48:36):
the boundaries of the law. What Stony is about to
say is controversial, but he's speaking for his own father
and uncle, who can no longer speak for themselves, and
I think he's got the right to express the mechanics
of their mentality. For anybody to hang a poacher stigma
on them, I believe it's wrong. According to UH game laws,

(49:02):
they were poaching. According to our forefathers, they were doing
what they were supposed to. I mean that, and that's
the way they looked at it. If I come into
your house and tell you how to eat your corn,
you know you have to have this much butter on it,
and you can only have ten pieces. You're gonna tell
me to go to when they come into our home,

(49:24):
which I'm sorry. These mountains are their home, all of them,
not just the land they own. All these mountains are
their home. When you come into their home and say, well,
here's all these, dear, you can only kill this one
or this one, but leave all these alone. They're gonna
tell you to go to if you go back far enough.
Our country is founded on that very principle. Those guys

(49:46):
got tired of England telling them what they could and
could not have. Well, the people that moved in here
weren't very far removed from those people that told England
go to So they grew up with that mental to
your Eron's Valley, and it still exists to a point.
We're more civilized now. Yeah, the need isn't there now.

(50:13):
I asked Neil Taylor a question about how the community
dealt with these guys killing more than their share. How
do you how did people perceive that, because everybody knew
that these were turkeys that you know, they were taking
away more than their share. What was your perception of
the way people in the community handled that. Well, I

(50:34):
may not everybody knew it. You know, people's way of
thinking change from time to time. From when you was
a kid, you already see a huge difference in how
people thinks and takes different things. Yeah, it's totally different.
There were still enough of the old timers back that
so they didn't care. There was plenty of turkeys for

(50:56):
them and everybody else too. And there wasn't there that
many turkey hunters back right, I could go out and
go hunting and never see a vehicle hardly. Now you
go out there and there's four or five vehicles where
you've been scouting. On opening the morning, you know, a
lot of people started coming in from the city, you know,

(51:16):
and there was a few people that didn't like it
at all. I mean, you know, you know what you
said about how people's mentalities change over time, that's a
that's a very real thing that's hard to calibrate. Like
I think today, I feel like today, even though certainly
there's still people that break the law, it's much more

(51:37):
common for people to pretty much obey the law. And
there's a lot of reasons for that. You know, people
are more educated about the science of game management, even
if they're ones are not back then to call call
a game ward and you had to go to the
house now and they can't take a picture of you
and your tags right there, you call right there and

(51:58):
follow you know, right, Okay, So yeah, technology has made
enforcement easier, which has made people be more apt to
obey the law. But I don't think that that's as much.
Is is what some people thinks it is. I think
it's uh. The mentality of thinking what Neil is tapping

(52:18):
into is true. We have too many examples throughout history
of a shifting value system, and it doesn't make what
happened before necessarily right. It just helps us make sense
of how some stuff happened. I wanted to ask Stony
something and I had no idea what he would say.

(52:39):
What are the things that you you would pound the
table for for your kids or grandkids in terms of
the values that they had that you would want them
to have. I want my kids to be law abiding
in in this day and time. You go buy a car, well,

(52:59):
if you met us up the game and fish can
take that car back in their prime when this was
going on, game fish didn't have that power. I mean,
you get a fine, all right, we'll pay it and
go on. I want my kids pounding the table for
their guns, and my boys believing their guns, and I
want them to pound on the table for their right

(53:21):
to hunt, had to hunt the ways they want to
bid bows and arrows or guns or black powder or
spear checking. I mean, but I also want them to
pound the table for conservation. There's a touch of that
bear grease redemption that we've all been looking for inside

(53:41):
of that. It's pretty powerful to hear Stony, Charlie's son
say that about conservation. It took this family a little
bit longer to get there, But I think the Edwards
have shifted their positions in a lot of ways. Here's
Jerry Deane. They may have been some game warned. It
could have called him when he was young. I'd like

(54:04):
to seeing them because they have been too. They probably
some of them set out there the last fifteen years
trying to catch him, and even home eating breakfast. Undoubtedly
the last fifteen years of their lives, Louis Dell and
Charlie slowed down on violating game lass. Many people said

(54:25):
this it would be a cute bota in this story
to say that they had a change of heart, that
they could look back and say that they've done stuff wrong.
But I don't really know if that's true. Perhaps they
just simply slowed down physically, or maybe the penalties for
game violations increased to the point that they couldn't risk
losing it all. Will never really know. Would it change

(54:48):
the way that you feel about them at the end
of the story, if they'd realized the error of their
ways and changed. I guess the game of fish will
always know him is outlaw. Well, I get a lot
of other people of outlaw suit. But the world will
be a whole lot better if everybody would like old Lois.

(55:09):
That's all I can say about to get. If I
were falling on a rope somewhere, he'd be the one
I wanted on the end of the rope, I want anything.
Pire's Neil with a very interesting take on Louis Dell
and Charlie Well. A lot of people that laugh at this,

(55:31):
and I find it kind of comical, but it's the truth.
They kind of they was kind of modern day Robin Hood.
Tell me what you mean by that, Well, you know,
I mean Robin Hood. He was an outlaw by the government.
He would killed the king's game, and he robbed from
the rich. Louis didn't rob, but in a way he

(55:52):
did rob some games from some people. People might think
but he but he gave a lot of meat away.
Like I said, old people on fixed incomes, okay, you know,
and you could always count on him to help you.
They're kind will never be again. It was pretty much
the last of a of a tie of people and

(56:16):
I miss them. Oh, Louis, you know, hey, he was
quick to get mad, but he was quick to laugh,
you know, quick to forgive. Why won't there be other
people like them? Well, it's just it takes the times
that they lived through will never be again. You know,

(56:36):
that's what develops the power person. What they are and
what they've lived through. Like I said, the mentality and
and the thoughts of the people that raised them and
they grew up around or them, people are no more. Man,
I don't know what to say. I've had a lot

(56:58):
of people that I question why I highlighted these men,
But I've also had a lot of people that I
trust thank me for it. As we come to the
close of this biography section of this series, I'm still conflicted.
But I have noted one thing. People that knew these
men were much more apt to extend mercy to them.

(57:21):
And I'm not saying that mercy means condoning illegal activity.
It just means they weren't ready to lock them up.
People that never knew these men were much more likely
to want justice. I envisioned some other podcaster making a
series on some outlaws that I didn't know. Maybe some
hellbillies from Alabama that just wore the turkeys out. I

(57:45):
have a feeling I might be like, how the heck
could these guys use their platform to highlight those heathen criminals.
These guys are the biggest threat to the North American
model of wildlife conservation I've ever seen. Lock them up. Honestly,
I might say that, but I think we're all full

(58:05):
of paradoxus. And I think that face to face human
relationship with other people means all the difference in a
whole bunch of stuff, and that's what makes life interesting.
One thing is for sure. We're entertained and intrigued by
outlaws for better or worse. And after exploring the fullness

(58:28):
of these guys stories, I am still proud to have
known these men, and I think their story is of
great value. Man, thanks so much for listening to Bear Grease.
On the next episode, we're gonna find out why we
love outlaws, and I don't want to leave you with

(58:49):
a nondescript cliffhanger, but I really doubt you're gonna want
to miss the next episode. Please leave us a review
on iTunes and share this podcast with a friend. We've
got our famous bear grease hats back in stock at
the meat Eater dot com, so check that out too.

(59:09):
But hey, now I want to give you some of
that bonus material. This is some interesting stuff that I
couldn't fit into the main podcast. You guys remember the
game Ward and Jimmy Martin from the first episode, who
spent his whole career chasing Louis Dell and Charlie Well.
After our interview, I asked him if he remembered the
time that he stopped me. He said he had zero

(59:33):
recollection of it, so I proceeded to tell him the story.
I do want to tell you about our run in
that you don't remember. Listen to this. I've never told
this story publicly. I was sixteen years old and it
was a Friday night, and I had a blue tick

(59:56):
coonhound named Thunder, and he got loose. I heard him
way off somewhere, treed long like I'll just as far
as I could hear. Somehow I knew he was treed
down in this hollow and it was it wasn't coon season,
I want to say, it was this summer, and I
had my coon light that had my pistol attached to

(01:00:17):
the belt. All in one deal and and when I
I had to go get the dog, and I grabbed
my coon belt and I had my pistol on there
and my light, and I jumped on a fore wheeler.
And now this is where the story gets interesting. I
had decided that if there was a coon in the tree,
I was gonna shoot him, just I was. It was

(01:00:38):
a young dog and he's treed down there, and it's
just like it's in my heart. I was like, I'm
gonna shoot this coon, but I wasn't coon hunting. Well,
I jump on my dad's fore wheeler and it didn't
have lights, no lights on the fore wheeler. So I'm
running with a head lamp, my coon lamp shining, riding

(01:00:59):
a fore wheeler. Well, to get to the dog, I
had to jump out on the highway, and I was
riding is after dark, and I'm riding in the ditch
of the highway going down to get to my neighbor's land.
And he he would have known, you know, it's been
a good friend of mine. And I was gonna drive
down to his driveway and then go into the woods

(01:01:19):
and get the dog. Well, as soon as I get
out onto the highway, there's one truck coming and it's you.
And so you see this coon light coming down the
road and you're like, what's going on? Anyway? I see
you turn around you put on your lights, and I
just go, oh no. And you come over to me
and you say, son, what are you doing? And and

(01:01:43):
I was honestly, was just like honest to a fault.
I said, sir, I'm coon hunting. And I didn't even
have I mean, I was sixteen, so I just didn't
have the wherewithal to like really give you the whole
story of what was happening. And I just told you
I was coon hunting, and you said, is it coon season?
And I said I don't think so. And you pulled

(01:02:05):
out your book and you look through and you knew
it wasn't coon season, but you look through and you said,
look here, well it turns out it's not. And uh
and you said, well, take off your gun and your
light belt and give it to me. And so I
gave you my gun on my light belt. That's right.
And I didn't tell you that and uh. And you

(01:02:27):
said meet me at the courthouse tomorrow at noon. And
so you get in the truck with my light and
drive off and then I've got a fourth of no
lights and I drive all the way home with no lights.
And then uh so the next day, I mean, you
treated me with complete respect. The next day, I show

(01:02:49):
up at the courthouse and I'm scared to death, you know.
And I really didn't break the law on purpose. I
mean I I've always been, even since a kid, straight laced.
I mean, now I broke I've road claws on accident
and some on purpose. That you know it's happened. So
I meet you at the courthouse and you you've probably

(01:03:10):
got a little more of the story from me. And
you said, Clay, I was on my way last night
to break up a party out at ink At at
the river down there somewhere, and he said, and here
you are, minding your own business, coon hunting, he said,

(01:03:30):
And you you reached in and grabbed the belt and
gave it to me and said, I just said, going
your way. So you didn't give me a ticket. So
you have no recollection though, man, that it happened just
like that. Oh man. I was a nervous wreck that night.
Lucky for me, Jimmy showed me mercy. I had another

(01:03:53):
question for Jimmy about Louis Dell and Charlie. Were they
the most notorious guys you ever chased guests in your time?
They would have been in Polk County, but there were
lots of others in other candies. Of course, my district
was six counties is that we worked. So we worked
some good ones out of Scott County and Yale County,
and we had Louis Dale's, but they were in other counties.

(01:04:15):
The other ones that I ran into them and I
had to help work on weren't as likable as Charlie
and Louis Dell, if that's a good way to put it.
They the others were just out for what they could get,
and if they weren't making money, well they just they
just didn't enjoy what they were doing. They were just
doing it to get even. I guess in these other

(01:04:37):
candia they were getting as much as they could get.
But Louis if, Loui Delle and Charlie may have been
getting as much as they can get, but they you
liked him for it. You guys remember Uncle Andy from
the first podcast. He was a ten year old brother
of Carl Edwards that was killed by police. He was
involved in that shootout. Here's Jerry Deane. So you knew

(01:05:00):
the Edwards. Yeah? Yeah, did he have part of his
ear shot off? Sir? What what? What part of his
ear was shot up? Was the top part of his ear? Yeah? Me?
And then he was uncle and that's what ruby. Here's
another interesting clip from Jerry Deane about Louis Dell's character.

(01:05:22):
Jolly was fine fellow, but he uh, he wasn't worried
about material things. Louis had the best business mind and
he had done well, you know, with his job. And
he treated everybody worked for the way he wanted to
be treated. I mean you would you wentn't out nothing
when you worked for Louis, and he paid good money.

(01:05:43):
He took care of his workers. He took care of everybody. Yeah,
Louis was fine feller and most people thought he was
out law. But if you ever had anybody you wanted
as your friend, he'd be the man to pick. I
had heart surgery ten years go. Louis told me, And
most people don't know it, but he told me. He said,

(01:06:04):
don't worry about nothing, you need anything, you know, I
pay forward. I'm here and he offered to pay my bills. Yeah,
he pushed that type. And but let me tell you something.
Money didn't mean nothing. Damn. That's why he was. That's
why he could be so generous. You feel like it's
because money didn't Well he wasn't. He wasn't a multimillionaire.

(01:06:25):
But I guess you'd say, uh, he made money, money
didn't make him. You understand. Yeah, he's really something. Everybody
would have met him and my daddy, finest two fellers
I ever met. Here's jerry On Louis del as a
dog man. Lou Dell would have been just an all

(01:06:47):
around woodsman. Correct. Tell me about the kind of dogs
he had? Oh man, like what what types of that
he had squirreled off? He had squirreled? Oh dear though
whom no, I'm man hog dog hog dog Louie probably had.
It's one time. He probably had twenty dolluh. He still

(01:07:08):
had good score though when he passed away. He kept
dogs all the live. He's a dog man. Here's jerry
On Louis Dell's willingness to take people hunting. We'll probably
learn on a later episode how willing he was to
even entertain undercover officers too. No doubt Louis Dell and
Charlie shared their passion for turkey hunting with anyone that

(01:07:31):
wanted to go. Some of the turkey ounors wouldn't even
to tell you where they gonna go turkey hunting. If
they heard the turkey Louis tell you, say, go right
of where they went there. He'd tell anybody for the
turkeys that you know. He wasn't no tyke to be
staying you about anything. He'd take them. People that never
had even turkey hunt, He take them and put them
out there and uh let him kill one. And most

(01:07:54):
turkey owners ain't that way. Yeah, exactly. And that's another
thing about Louis there's a lot of young boys like
John now that Louis Elle has told how to to
turkey on and he just wasn't his family know it was.
Anybody that wants to come, he he teaches what he could.
Thanks so much for listening, guys. We'll check in with

(01:08:17):
it next week on the Bear Grease Render