September 4, 2024 • 21 mins
Today, we’re hopping on the Maná hate-train for a couple stops, diving into the most popular arguments from critics and rock fans who claim the band isn’t “rock enough,” whatever that means. But love them or hate them, there’s one thing no one can deny: Maná left an indelible mark on Spanish-speaking music. Sure, they might not melt faces with power chords or spark satanic panic, but through their journey we learned that a group of young people can still change the world.
Lilliana Vazquez and Joseph Carrillo are the hosts of Becoming An Icon with production support by Nick Milanes, Santiago Sierra, Rodrigo Crespo, Evelyn Uribe and Edgar Esteban of Sonoro Media in partnership with iHeart Radio's My Cultura Podcast network.
If you want to support the podcast, please rate and review our show.
Follow Lilliana Vazquez on Instagram and Twitter @lillianavazquez
Follow Joseph Carrillo on Instagram @josephcarrillo
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
Joseph, have you ever heard the expression the power of
a pass?
Speaker 2 (00:06):
Oh? No, I haven't really really what does this mean?
It's funny.
Speaker 1 (00:13):
It comes up a lot, like I think, for like
people that are saying no to projects or opportunities. It
sometimes it's more powerful to say no or be a
no show than to actually accept something that's given to you.
Speaker 2 (00:28):
Okay, got it, got it? Okay. I like that power
of the past, the power of the past. I have
passed on some things, so I do know what you mean.
Speaker 1 (00:36):
What have you passed on?
Speaker 2 (00:38):
You know, different opportunities that I don't care to speak
on or or regret. It just wasn't for me at
the time, Like I mean this, this is crazy. I
was asked to do someone's residency in Vegas and I
was just really I couldn't do it. It just the
person didn't really seem stable at the time, and so
(00:58):
I passed on it. And I'm really glad I did. See.
Speaker 1 (01:02):
I love hearing that because most times I feel like
you passed because of like gut checks. You're like, huh,
you know what, something doesn't feel right about that. I'm
just not going to do it. And on September third,
two thousand and three, Manna of All People were a
no show at the Grands. Well, okay, not one hundred
percent of no show, not one hundred percent of pass,
but like a ninety percent pass because Alex Gonzalez, the
(01:25):
drummer and his wife did actually show up.
Speaker 2 (01:27):
Okay, the drummer's going to come through with your dervs.
Honey partied like a rock star. Now.
Speaker 1 (01:33):
The group had one Best Rock Album by a duo
or group for their six studio album, two thousand and
two's Revolution More, an album that, while still sounding very
much like Mana, sought to revisit the formative sound and
spirit of the sixties and seventies.
Speaker 2 (01:50):
Carlo Santana, who the band had played with on his
mega alternate album Supernatural, even jambed with them on the
opening track Housticia Tierra Ilbertad, and.
Speaker 1 (02:00):
This track actually Sawmana at I think their most politically
vocal in years, invoking bunch of villa and emilianosab at
them and imploring respect for indigenous peoples and sympathy for migrants.
Speaker 2 (02:12):
And they kept the conscious vibes up with Boba Juan,
a song for migrants lost to the System. Although per usual,
the love songs got the most play.
Speaker 1 (02:22):
So days after the Grammys, frontman Farah Veda would say,
there are many more talented people than Mana who don't
win Grammys. I congratulate those who won and those who didn't.
The Beatles never won a Grammy, and they are the.
Speaker 2 (02:36):
Greatest part though, like still Lana no Grammy.
Speaker 1 (02:42):
I know. Listen, they don't get it right all the time.
Most of the time.
Speaker 2 (02:46):
One might argue, we don't know.
Speaker 1 (02:47):
But over the year that followed, Mana released a Greatest
Hits compilation and a DVD. Wait, seriously, do you remember DVDs?
Speaker 2 (02:55):
Dude? I think no. I threw them away. I was
going to say I still have some, but you don't.
But I do not.
Speaker 1 (03:01):
But he doesn't Anyway. Their DVD was of the Revolution
that mord World tour. Then they took a hiatus. No
one would hear from Mana in close to five years.
Speaker 2 (03:12):
A blow for the fans and a sigh of relief
for the haters.
Speaker 1 (03:17):
Listen, hater, no hate. The rock scene that Manna was
a product of, the same one that Fara gave the
nod to in his interview post Grammys.
Speaker 2 (03:24):
It kept on a chicken, including artists that Mana had
played with time to see what our old boo Vampido
is up to.
Speaker 1 (03:32):
Since his departure from the group in the mid nineties,
Cesa El Vambido Lopez and keyboardist Evan Gonzalez had been
keeping pretty busy. After leaving Mana, they returned to his
band asulio Leta.
Speaker 2 (03:46):
The band was well like in Mexico, but struggled with
its LABELMI. Eventually, Vampido left joined another band.
Speaker 1 (03:53):
Haguaas Haguadas was kind of a super group. They were
built from the pieces of another recently broken up band,
Guy Fans, the much beloved alternative rock group from Mexico City.
Speaker 2 (04:06):
I love them. Howatas wouldn't reach the legendary status of
Guy Fans, but they did get some international airplay, and
the fans were still shouting.
Speaker 1 (04:16):
Is there a T shirt that says that I feel
like you need it for the right anyway? The band
was nominated a number of times for Premiozo Nuestro, but
they never won. That's why it's easy to imagine that
when Ferro n Vera mentioned deserving bands that never won awards,
he was nodding to peers like this, but.
Speaker 2 (04:37):
The scene wasn't nodding back.
Speaker 1 (04:40):
Today, we're going to ride the mana Hate train for
just a couple more stops before we join the band
post Hiaus. I'm your host, Liliana Ooscaz.
Speaker 2 (04:56):
And I'm Joseph Carrio, and this is becoming an i Con.
Speaker 1 (05:00):
A weekly podcast where we give you the rundown on
how today's most famous Latin v stars have shaped pop culture.
Speaker 2 (05:07):
And given the world some extra level.
Speaker 1 (05:10):
Sit back and get comfortable.
Speaker 2 (05:12):
Because we are going in the only way we know how,
with when unassas.
Speaker 1 (05:20):
And a lot of opinions as we relive their greatest
achievements on our journey to find out what makes them
so iconic. Before we get into it, Joseph, I think
it's time to play a little game.
Speaker 2 (05:42):
Okay, Jigsaw, what you got.
Speaker 1 (05:46):
I'm going to read the name of an artist, Okay,
and then you're gonna tell me if, by your Joseph
Carrio rock standards, Okay, they're actually rock or not?
Speaker 2 (05:57):
Right? Okay, hold on, but are they going to be
like weird kind two things that I don't know.
Speaker 1 (06:01):
Listen if you answer who that is? Okay as well?
Speaker 2 (06:06):
All right, Okay, I'm nervous.
Speaker 1 (06:08):
Okay, rock or not the Police, Rock, the Red Hot
Chili Peppers, Rock, Cold Play, No Jon Jet and the
Black Hearts.
Speaker 2 (06:23):
I don't know who that is, but I'm gonna say
yes because I've heard of Jone Jet and I feel
like people from the seventies.
Speaker 1 (06:28):
Liked her and that was rock okay, ac DC, Rock, Fleetwood,
Mac Soft Rock Okay. Now Miley Cyrus during her Plastic
Hearts era, I Hate you Pop Rock Okay, Toto.
Speaker 2 (06:46):
The Little Dog, Olivia Rodrigo. Olivia Rodrigo is kind of
like what would aleanis Morrisett be Now, should alternative rock
alternative pop? Or would that be like? I don't know,
but yes, she's rock because she plays the electric guitar,
and I associate that with rock.
Speaker 1 (07:07):
Okay, listen, I love your reasoning. So electric guitar is
the common thread to all of these You hear an
electric guitar when you think of these bands?
Speaker 2 (07:16):
Yeah, yes, I love yours. You know what.
Speaker 1 (07:20):
Yes, I'm going to call up Domas Mier and be like,
Joseph needs a job at Rolling Stone, you know, because
his criteria for rock or not needs to be a
whole entire section of the magazine is true, our friend,
So to bring it back to Mana way way back
in twenty twenty.
Speaker 2 (07:40):
Who I mean?
Speaker 1 (07:41):
Okay, fine, I get you. It is a year that
we do not talk about. Okay, we have forgotten it,
but that being said. In twenty twenty, Netflix release a
documentary called Break It All The History of Rock in
Latin America, and it traces the long lineage of Latin
rock from Richie Valens lab Bamba all the way through
rock music's underground role during dictatorships throughout South America and
(08:05):
then taking it to rock and Bligioma eighties and beyond.
Speaker 2 (08:10):
And when the documentary counted Manah among the all stars
of Latin rock, the internet they had something to say.
Speaker 1 (08:18):
The hashtags for the doc were flooded with tweets and
Instagram posts that insisted Mana nos rock. Many of the
posts outright mocked the documentary, and plenty criticized it for
giving Mana a bigger spotlight than other artists.
Speaker 2 (08:35):
Especially bands like I Find This, whom the posters held
up as the real ogs with an influence on the
culture that Mana could never claim.
Speaker 1 (08:44):
Mana, they argued, was a little bit more pop than rock,
just like Mana's success didn't happen overnight. This conversation didn't
suddenly start up because of a Netflix documentary.
Speaker 2 (08:57):
It is no fun being late toward beef, and Netflix
was decades late. This goes back all the way to Mana's.
Speaker 1 (09:04):
Heyday in the early mid nineties, when Mana was sailing
into the mainstream with Rayandolsol, the rock scene in Mexico
was consolidating into two camps. You had groups like Tifonis,
instrumentally driven yet melodic, maybe even prog rock esque, but
still a very far cry from the pop that dominated
(09:24):
Mexican radio.
Speaker 2 (09:26):
Then you had the boys who kept it nasty nasty girl,
like the Bodio rockers, who were loud, rowdy, and often political.
Speaker 1 (09:35):
There's a bit of prog rock versus punt rock, hair
metal versus grunge thing happening here, and the gen uxters
know what I'm talking about.
Speaker 2 (09:43):
But whichever camp you fell into, one thing was for sure.
Mana's name stays out your mouth unless you're throwing shape.
Speaker 1 (09:51):
It would be like wearing your cold Plate T shirt
to a nine inch nail show like that is not
gonna fly.
Speaker 2 (09:59):
Or wearing Emerged to Nixtena show during the Stripped tour.
Speaker 1 (10:04):
Yeah No, We're not doing that, and Mana was at
best considered rock that was inoffensive enough for your parents
to actually let you listen to them.
Speaker 2 (10:14):
And at worst, Mana was rock Fressa, which is rock
for rich Normy's aka Fressa's, which is to say, it's
kind of not really rock at all.
Speaker 1 (10:24):
Case in point, Joseph's favorite band, the Barrio rockers Molotov
released an album titled Donde hug on las ninyas where
will the Girls Play, in a parody of Manna's Breakout.
Speaker 2 (10:37):
The cover is a classic nineties edgeword ick featuring a
schoolgirl laying back in a car seat with her panties
around pernis.
Speaker 1 (10:45):
I mean, seriously, tell me you're in a band full
of straight boys, not men boys without telling me you're
in a band full of straight boys, Like what the
fuck is that?
Speaker 2 (10:55):
Hey? Straight boys? Are you guys? Okay?
Speaker 1 (10:58):
Taste aside, though, what this represents is clear. In the
og days of Latin rock, you risk life and limb
for the music. Playing the music was a transgression, so
the music itself should be transgressive.
Speaker 2 (11:11):
Okay, rock is rebellion, so it should sound that way.
Speaker 1 (11:14):
Or at least that's how so many in the rock
scene saw it. Here's the thing about rock versus soft rock,
versus alt rock, versus pop rock. You can apply the
same argument to pretty much every single genre of music, right, Like,
is it like gangster rap or is it hip hop?
(11:37):
Is it reggaeton or is it salsa or is it
salsa romantica? Like just be inclusive.
Speaker 2 (11:45):
Right Well, Also, I kind of feel like this is
where someone like a bad Bunny comes in right where
you know, you just change sound altogether.
Speaker 1 (11:54):
Well, I think what to me, the tipping point for
whether something gets classified as like the quote unquote harder
genre has nothing to do with the sound, has nothing
to do with the music. It has to do with
how commercial and how financially fruitful said band is. Because
let's be honest, at a certain point, you can be
(12:16):
the hardest rocker in the world, but if you are
flying on private jets and staying at the Four Seasons,
a little bit of your heart does go away. So
I do think that a lot of these distinctions between
like underground and like progressive rock and like all of
that changes when things become more commercial. It's part of
(12:36):
the commercialization of music.
Speaker 2 (12:38):
Well, here's the thing now that I have had an
herbal refreshment, and I'm thinking, I just I wonder if genres,
like you know, how it's like, what's harder, what's this,
what's hip hop, what's whatever? It's like? Can't we just
relate the instruments to be that one thing, like going
back to a guitar, how I relate rock? Like, what
does it matter? Off long is if it has these
three or four instruments, wouldn't make it that whether it's
(12:59):
mean stream or not. Just curious.
Speaker 1 (13:01):
I totally understand what you're saying, But I think no,
because I think think about so many different types of music, Like,
for example, like if country music is using an accordion, right,
that's country music with an accordion, But so is like
all the Northenol bands that we talked about, So is
it all country? I think what happens is music and
(13:22):
instruments make a sound. All of those sounds and how
they're assembled becomes I think, more of the music and
less about the instrument. So I think it's people have
a problem when things go too commercial. They want to
be haters, and then they're like, oh, you're not rock enough,
you're not reggaeton enough, you're not hip hop enough, but
(13:43):
at the core they are. And most of these bands
that we've covered had to really like fight their way
up the music food change. So there's nothing more hardcore
than that. When you're playing at a bar for like tips,
that's pretty hardcore and I'm going to get arrested for
it exactly. Anyway, point is with any pop culture debate,
the shit gets messy, right, it's a little schoolyard ish
(14:05):
and it's hard to draw straight lines.
Speaker 2 (14:08):
I mean, really, how many online arguments are just cafeteria
fights that someone decided to post.
Speaker 1 (14:13):
About Exactly what a genre represents and what its artists
stand for don't always have to line up with how
the genre.
Speaker 2 (14:22):
Sounds, okay? And what does Manas stand for? Well, we'll
get into it.
Speaker 1 (14:37):
The world had not heard from Mana since they took
their final bow on the Revolution the More tour in
two thousand and three.
Speaker 2 (14:45):
Unbeknownst to the general public, however, they had been writing
new materials since as early as two thousand and five.
Speaker 1 (14:51):
In an interview, Pharaoh Veda compared Mana's time in the
limelight as a bullet train, hundreds of shows in more
than forty countries.
Speaker 2 (14:59):
Not to mention Revolving Dora bandmates.
Speaker 1 (15:01):
I feel like I just watched the Bullet Train movie.
Speaker 2 (15:04):
Did you? I don't know or okay?
Speaker 1 (15:07):
Anyway, point is it was exhausting but fun and you
want to do nothing afterwards.
Speaker 2 (15:12):
Got it?
Speaker 1 (15:12):
Unlike Mana, who wrote about sixty songs in the years
spanning between Revolution and their follow up Amar Escombatier to
love is to Battle.
Speaker 2 (15:22):
And Mana switched it up, y'all. Instead of a love song,
the lead single was about infidelity, Escandalo and pitch.
Speaker 1 (15:31):
I know all about that shit, not just infidelity but
sliding into someone else's DMS in two thousand and six.
Speaker 2 (15:40):
When I tell you, I know all about that trust.
So anyway. In an interview, Orvetta revealed that Labios Comparatidos
was inspired first by a friend who was cheated on
before Olvera himself got played, ending an eight month relationship
and discovering his partner had a side keys dude.
Speaker 1 (16:00):
Quote the internet chat text messages, you can be in
any country and chat with a girl from the other
side of the world.
Speaker 2 (16:08):
Bonacito doesn't even know about liking another girl's Instagram post yet.
Speaker 1 (16:12):
Too real, and so was Labius Comparatidos, which sat at
the top of Latin radio charts for eight straight weeks.
Speaker 2 (16:19):
Amadis Kumbaratid reached number four on the Billboard Top two
hundred Albums in the US at the time, the highest
charting Spanish language release in the US, surpassed only by
Shaquida's Picasti and Oral Volume one that same year, coming.
Speaker 1 (16:34):
In second place after Shaki is an honor anyone should
be thankful for and to support the album Mana I'm
barked on their biggest tour yet, not in terms of
show dates but production size.
Speaker 2 (16:47):
More than sixty tons of equipment, which look is probably
nothing compared to the Renaissance World Tour, but you gotta
hand it to Mana.
Speaker 1 (16:55):
The world was ready to welcome Manna back with open arms.
The enterk of the crowd over one hundred and sixteen
shows shocked the band night after night over the course
of a year and a half.
Speaker 2 (17:06):
Since then, the band's popularity and esteem has only grown
with the twenty eleven albums Dramailus and twenty fifteens Gama
and Sendida. The first saw a Mana that was willing
to experiment with different sounds.
Speaker 1 (17:19):
Well the second saw the band finally putting the sounds
of the Latin rock scene in the foreground and closing
the record with their most political message yet, a cover
of Los Diigres del Norte somos mass Americanos.
Speaker 2 (17:34):
Do you know? Prussella frontera la frontera mecruso.
Speaker 1 (17:42):
But this wasn't the only time Manna has tried to
affect change in the world. In the twenty tens, Mana
had become a bit more politically vocal, but that doesn't
(18:02):
mean they didn't try to use their platform for good
before then.
Speaker 2 (18:06):
The environmental anthem VVT seen idea from nineteen ninety two
is fat More was kind of like a public promise
to the environmentalists, because four years later the bands put
their money where their mouth was.
Speaker 1 (18:17):
In nineteen ninety six, Manna launch the Selva Negra Ecological Foundation,
an environmental organization dedicated to protecting endangered species, restoring ecosystems,
and promoting environmental education.
Speaker 2 (18:30):
Wow. Since its launch, Selba Negata has supported the sea
turtle population by incubating and releasing eight million tortugas.
Speaker 1 (18:39):
They've also blanded more than eight hundred thousand trees, an
extensive work to preserve Mexican forests and work to foster
climate change education in Mexico.
Speaker 2 (18:48):
But they're not just looking after turtles and trees. The
foundation also provides support to immigrant communities in the US
and Latin America.
Speaker 1 (18:56):
Olvera says we don't see the planet as a country,
see it as a single territory.
Speaker 2 (19:02):
But speaking of territory, venoor Veda also came out in
support of Puerto Rican independence in two thousand and seven.
Speaker 1 (19:08):
And the same year the band criticized Mexico's poor sex
education and contraceptive access. Around the same time, the band
met with then Secretary of State Hillary Clinton to share
their perspective on immigration. But the cause that's perhaps closest
to lead vocalist fair Old Vetta's heart might be the
one we haven't mentioned.
Speaker 2 (19:30):
While awards may not be a priority for Mana, in
twenty twenty one, the band did show up to receive
the Icon Award at the twenty twenty one Billboard Latin
Music Awards.
Speaker 1 (19:41):
The band thanked their fans for thirty five years of
support before performing on a candle at stage for an
acoustic take on elre Lo Hukul.
Speaker 2 (19:50):
Joining them with a twelve year old's vocalist named Mabel.
Shortly before the Billboard Awards, the band had appeared with
Mabel for an artist panel honoring single mothers.
Speaker 1 (20:00):
Fair and Mabel shared something in common. Both were raised
by single moms. At the age of seven, Fair's father
passed away. El re Locuku is reflection on what it's
like to grow up in his absence.
Speaker 2 (20:11):
After Mabel one is singing competition in Mexico, Fer pulled
up Carlo Santana and invited her to perform the song
with Manat at the upcoming awards ceremony.
Speaker 1 (20:21):
Fair would say, when you see your mom working every day,
working very hard, it sets an example set obdam It's
the best example more than school of what makes you strong,
hardworking and a fighter live and I think that feeds art.
Speaker 2 (20:35):
Their performance with Mabel shows one thing that rockers of
all stripes can rally around, hope for the next generation.
Speaker 1 (20:45):
Mana began their career playing in cebee bars, where their
shows would routinely be interrupted by the police, and both
the motive and the goal of those crackdowns was fear.
Speaker 2 (20:55):
The authorities were afraid that young people can make change happen,
so they try to make young people too afraid to.
Speaker 1 (21:01):
Try Now might not melt your face with power cords
or send anyone's parents into a satanic panic, but their
success is proof that the authorities are right about one thing,
that a group of young people can change the world.
(21:22):
On the next, Becoming an Icon Mexico's Mariachi Man's man
e Is Chadro De Wentitan, Vicente Fernands. Becoming an Icon
is presented by Sonoo and Iheart's Michael Duda podcast network.
(21:42):
Listen to Becoming an Icon on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcast,
or wherever you get your podcasts.
Joseph, have you ever heard the expression the power of
a pass?
Speaker 2 (00:06):
Oh? No, I haven't really really what does this mean?
It's funny.
Speaker 1 (00:13):
It comes up a lot, like I think, for like
people that are saying no to projects or opportunities. It
sometimes it's more powerful to say no or be a
no show than to actually accept something that's given to you.
Speaker 2 (00:28):
Okay, got it, got it? Okay. I like that power
of the past, the power of the past. I have
passed on some things, so I do know what you mean.
Speaker 1 (00:36):
What have you passed on?
Speaker 2 (00:38):
You know, different opportunities that I don't care to speak
on or or regret. It just wasn't for me at
the time, Like I mean this, this is crazy. I
was asked to do someone's residency in Vegas and I
was just really I couldn't do it. It just the
person didn't really seem stable at the time, and so
(00:58):
I passed on it. And I'm really glad I did. See.
Speaker 1 (01:02):
I love hearing that because most times I feel like
you passed because of like gut checks. You're like, huh,
you know what, something doesn't feel right about that. I'm
just not going to do it. And on September third,
two thousand and three, Manna of All People were a
no show at the Grands. Well, okay, not one hundred
percent of no show, not one hundred percent of pass,
but like a ninety percent pass because Alex Gonzalez, the
(01:25):
drummer and his wife did actually show up.
Speaker 2 (01:27):
Okay, the drummer's going to come through with your dervs.
Honey partied like a rock star. Now.
Speaker 1 (01:33):
The group had one Best Rock Album by a duo
or group for their six studio album, two thousand and
two's Revolution More, an album that, while still sounding very
much like Mana, sought to revisit the formative sound and
spirit of the sixties and seventies.
Speaker 2 (01:50):
Carlo Santana, who the band had played with on his
mega alternate album Supernatural, even jambed with them on the
opening track Housticia Tierra Ilbertad, and.
Speaker 1 (02:00):
This track actually Sawmana at I think their most politically
vocal in years, invoking bunch of villa and emilianosab at
them and imploring respect for indigenous peoples and sympathy for migrants.
Speaker 2 (02:12):
And they kept the conscious vibes up with Boba Juan,
a song for migrants lost to the System. Although per usual,
the love songs got the most play.
Speaker 1 (02:22):
So days after the Grammys, frontman Farah Veda would say,
there are many more talented people than Mana who don't
win Grammys. I congratulate those who won and those who didn't.
The Beatles never won a Grammy, and they are the.
Speaker 2 (02:36):
Greatest part though, like still Lana no Grammy.
Speaker 1 (02:42):
I know. Listen, they don't get it right all the time.
Most of the time.
Speaker 2 (02:46):
One might argue, we don't know.
Speaker 1 (02:47):
But over the year that followed, Mana released a Greatest
Hits compilation and a DVD. Wait, seriously, do you remember DVDs?
Speaker 2 (02:55):
Dude? I think no. I threw them away. I was
going to say I still have some, but you don't.
But I do not.
Speaker 1 (03:01):
But he doesn't Anyway. Their DVD was of the Revolution
that mord World tour. Then they took a hiatus. No
one would hear from Mana in close to five years.
Speaker 2 (03:12):
A blow for the fans and a sigh of relief
for the haters.
Speaker 1 (03:17):
Listen, hater, no hate. The rock scene that Manna was
a product of, the same one that Fara gave the
nod to in his interview post Grammys.
Speaker 2 (03:24):
It kept on a chicken, including artists that Mana had
played with time to see what our old boo Vampido
is up to.
Speaker 1 (03:32):
Since his departure from the group in the mid nineties,
Cesa El Vambido Lopez and keyboardist Evan Gonzalez had been
keeping pretty busy. After leaving Mana, they returned to his
band asulio Leta.
Speaker 2 (03:46):
The band was well like in Mexico, but struggled with
its LABELMI. Eventually, Vampido left joined another band.
Speaker 1 (03:53):
Haguaas Haguadas was kind of a super group. They were
built from the pieces of another recently broken up band,
Guy Fans, the much beloved alternative rock group from Mexico City.
Speaker 2 (04:06):
I love them. Howatas wouldn't reach the legendary status of
Guy Fans, but they did get some international airplay, and
the fans were still shouting.
Speaker 1 (04:16):
Is there a T shirt that says that I feel
like you need it for the right anyway? The band
was nominated a number of times for Premiozo Nuestro, but
they never won. That's why it's easy to imagine that
when Ferro n Vera mentioned deserving bands that never won awards,
he was nodding to peers like this, but.
Speaker 2 (04:37):
The scene wasn't nodding back.
Speaker 1 (04:40):
Today, we're going to ride the mana Hate train for
just a couple more stops before we join the band
post Hiaus. I'm your host, Liliana Ooscaz.
Speaker 2 (04:56):
And I'm Joseph Carrio, and this is becoming an i Con.
Speaker 1 (05:00):
A weekly podcast where we give you the rundown on
how today's most famous Latin v stars have shaped pop culture.
Speaker 2 (05:07):
And given the world some extra level.
Speaker 1 (05:10):
Sit back and get comfortable.
Speaker 2 (05:12):
Because we are going in the only way we know how,
with when unassas.
Speaker 1 (05:20):
And a lot of opinions as we relive their greatest
achievements on our journey to find out what makes them
so iconic. Before we get into it, Joseph, I think
it's time to play a little game.
Speaker 2 (05:42):
Okay, Jigsaw, what you got.
Speaker 1 (05:46):
I'm going to read the name of an artist, Okay,
and then you're gonna tell me if, by your Joseph
Carrio rock standards, Okay, they're actually rock or not?
Speaker 2 (05:57):
Right? Okay, hold on, but are they going to be
like weird kind two things that I don't know.
Speaker 1 (06:01):
Listen if you answer who that is? Okay as well?
Speaker 2 (06:06):
All right, Okay, I'm nervous.
Speaker 1 (06:08):
Okay, rock or not the Police, Rock, the Red Hot
Chili Peppers, Rock, Cold Play, No Jon Jet and the
Black Hearts.
Speaker 2 (06:23):
I don't know who that is, but I'm gonna say
yes because I've heard of Jone Jet and I feel
like people from the seventies.
Speaker 1 (06:28):
Liked her and that was rock okay, ac DC, Rock, Fleetwood,
Mac Soft Rock Okay. Now Miley Cyrus during her Plastic
Hearts era, I Hate you Pop Rock Okay, Toto.
Speaker 2 (06:46):
The Little Dog, Olivia Rodrigo. Olivia Rodrigo is kind of
like what would aleanis Morrisett be Now, should alternative rock
alternative pop? Or would that be like? I don't know,
but yes, she's rock because she plays the electric guitar,
and I associate that with rock.
Speaker 1 (07:07):
Okay, listen, I love your reasoning. So electric guitar is
the common thread to all of these You hear an
electric guitar when you think of these bands?
Speaker 2 (07:16):
Yeah, yes, I love yours. You know what.
Speaker 1 (07:20):
Yes, I'm going to call up Domas Mier and be like,
Joseph needs a job at Rolling Stone, you know, because
his criteria for rock or not needs to be a
whole entire section of the magazine is true, our friend,
So to bring it back to Mana way way back
in twenty twenty.
Speaker 2 (07:40):
Who I mean?
Speaker 1 (07:41):
Okay, fine, I get you. It is a year that
we do not talk about. Okay, we have forgotten it,
but that being said. In twenty twenty, Netflix release a
documentary called Break It All The History of Rock in
Latin America, and it traces the long lineage of Latin
rock from Richie Valens lab Bamba all the way through
rock music's underground role during dictatorships throughout South America and
(08:05):
then taking it to rock and Bligioma eighties and beyond.
Speaker 2 (08:10):
And when the documentary counted Manah among the all stars
of Latin rock, the internet they had something to say.
Speaker 1 (08:18):
The hashtags for the doc were flooded with tweets and
Instagram posts that insisted Mana nos rock. Many of the
posts outright mocked the documentary, and plenty criticized it for
giving Mana a bigger spotlight than other artists.
Speaker 2 (08:35):
Especially bands like I Find This, whom the posters held
up as the real ogs with an influence on the
culture that Mana could never claim.
Speaker 1 (08:44):
Mana, they argued, was a little bit more pop than rock,
just like Mana's success didn't happen overnight. This conversation didn't
suddenly start up because of a Netflix documentary.
Speaker 2 (08:57):
It is no fun being late toward beef, and Netflix
was decades late. This goes back all the way to Mana's.
Speaker 1 (09:04):
Heyday in the early mid nineties, when Mana was sailing
into the mainstream with Rayandolsol, the rock scene in Mexico
was consolidating into two camps. You had groups like Tifonis,
instrumentally driven yet melodic, maybe even prog rock esque, but
still a very far cry from the pop that dominated
(09:24):
Mexican radio.
Speaker 2 (09:26):
Then you had the boys who kept it nasty nasty girl,
like the Bodio rockers, who were loud, rowdy, and often political.
Speaker 1 (09:35):
There's a bit of prog rock versus punt rock, hair
metal versus grunge thing happening here, and the gen uxters
know what I'm talking about.
Speaker 2 (09:43):
But whichever camp you fell into, one thing was for sure.
Mana's name stays out your mouth unless you're throwing shape.
Speaker 1 (09:51):
It would be like wearing your cold Plate T shirt
to a nine inch nail show like that is not
gonna fly.
Speaker 2 (09:59):
Or wearing Emerged to Nixtena show during the Stripped tour.
Speaker 1 (10:04):
Yeah No, We're not doing that, and Mana was at
best considered rock that was inoffensive enough for your parents
to actually let you listen to them.
Speaker 2 (10:14):
And at worst, Mana was rock Fressa, which is rock
for rich Normy's aka Fressa's, which is to say, it's
kind of not really rock at all.
Speaker 1 (10:24):
Case in point, Joseph's favorite band, the Barrio rockers Molotov
released an album titled Donde hug on las ninyas where
will the Girls Play, in a parody of Manna's Breakout.
Speaker 2 (10:37):
The cover is a classic nineties edgeword ick featuring a
schoolgirl laying back in a car seat with her panties
around pernis.
Speaker 1 (10:45):
I mean, seriously, tell me you're in a band full
of straight boys, not men boys without telling me you're
in a band full of straight boys, Like what the
fuck is that?
Speaker 2 (10:55):
Hey? Straight boys? Are you guys? Okay?
Speaker 1 (10:58):
Taste aside, though, what this represents is clear. In the
og days of Latin rock, you risk life and limb
for the music. Playing the music was a transgression, so
the music itself should be transgressive.
Speaker 2 (11:11):
Okay, rock is rebellion, so it should sound that way.
Speaker 1 (11:14):
Or at least that's how so many in the rock
scene saw it. Here's the thing about rock versus soft rock,
versus alt rock, versus pop rock. You can apply the
same argument to pretty much every single genre of music, right, Like,
is it like gangster rap or is it hip hop?
(11:37):
Is it reggaeton or is it salsa or is it
salsa romantica? Like just be inclusive.
Speaker 2 (11:45):
Right Well, Also, I kind of feel like this is
where someone like a bad Bunny comes in right where
you know, you just change sound altogether.
Speaker 1 (11:54):
Well, I think what to me, the tipping point for
whether something gets classified as like the quote unquote harder
genre has nothing to do with the sound, has nothing
to do with the music. It has to do with
how commercial and how financially fruitful said band is. Because
let's be honest, at a certain point, you can be
(12:16):
the hardest rocker in the world, but if you are
flying on private jets and staying at the Four Seasons,
a little bit of your heart does go away. So
I do think that a lot of these distinctions between
like underground and like progressive rock and like all of
that changes when things become more commercial. It's part of
(12:36):
the commercialization of music.
Speaker 2 (12:38):
Well, here's the thing now that I have had an
herbal refreshment, and I'm thinking, I just I wonder if genres,
like you know, how it's like, what's harder, what's this,
what's hip hop, what's whatever? It's like? Can't we just
relate the instruments to be that one thing, like going
back to a guitar, how I relate rock? Like, what
does it matter? Off long is if it has these
three or four instruments, wouldn't make it that whether it's
(12:59):
mean stream or not. Just curious.
Speaker 1 (13:01):
I totally understand what you're saying, But I think no,
because I think think about so many different types of music, Like,
for example, like if country music is using an accordion, right,
that's country music with an accordion, But so is like
all the Northenol bands that we talked about, So is
it all country? I think what happens is music and
(13:22):
instruments make a sound. All of those sounds and how
they're assembled becomes I think, more of the music and
less about the instrument. So I think it's people have
a problem when things go too commercial. They want to
be haters, and then they're like, oh, you're not rock enough,
you're not reggaeton enough, you're not hip hop enough, but
(13:43):
at the core they are. And most of these bands
that we've covered had to really like fight their way
up the music food change. So there's nothing more hardcore
than that. When you're playing at a bar for like tips,
that's pretty hardcore and I'm going to get arrested for
it exactly. Anyway, point is with any pop culture debate,
the shit gets messy, right, it's a little schoolyard ish
(14:05):
and it's hard to draw straight lines.
Speaker 2 (14:08):
I mean, really, how many online arguments are just cafeteria
fights that someone decided to post.
Speaker 1 (14:13):
About Exactly what a genre represents and what its artists
stand for don't always have to line up with how
the genre.
Speaker 2 (14:22):
Sounds, okay? And what does Manas stand for? Well, we'll
get into it.
Speaker 1 (14:37):
The world had not heard from Mana since they took
their final bow on the Revolution the More tour in
two thousand and three.
Speaker 2 (14:45):
Unbeknownst to the general public, however, they had been writing
new materials since as early as two thousand and five.
Speaker 1 (14:51):
In an interview, Pharaoh Veda compared Mana's time in the
limelight as a bullet train, hundreds of shows in more
than forty countries.
Speaker 2 (14:59):
Not to mention Revolving Dora bandmates.
Speaker 1 (15:01):
I feel like I just watched the Bullet Train movie.
Speaker 2 (15:04):
Did you? I don't know or okay?
Speaker 1 (15:07):
Anyway, point is it was exhausting but fun and you
want to do nothing afterwards.
Speaker 2 (15:12):
Got it?
Speaker 1 (15:12):
Unlike Mana, who wrote about sixty songs in the years
spanning between Revolution and their follow up Amar Escombatier to
love is to Battle.
Speaker 2 (15:22):
And Mana switched it up, y'all. Instead of a love song,
the lead single was about infidelity, Escandalo and pitch.
Speaker 1 (15:31):
I know all about that shit, not just infidelity but
sliding into someone else's DMS in two thousand and six.
Speaker 2 (15:40):
When I tell you, I know all about that trust.
So anyway. In an interview, Orvetta revealed that Labios Comparatidos
was inspired first by a friend who was cheated on
before Olvera himself got played, ending an eight month relationship
and discovering his partner had a side keys dude.
Speaker 1 (16:00):
Quote the internet chat text messages, you can be in
any country and chat with a girl from the other
side of the world.
Speaker 2 (16:08):
Bonacito doesn't even know about liking another girl's Instagram post yet.
Speaker 1 (16:12):
Too real, and so was Labius Comparatidos, which sat at
the top of Latin radio charts for eight straight weeks.
Speaker 2 (16:19):
Amadis Kumbaratid reached number four on the Billboard Top two
hundred Albums in the US at the time, the highest
charting Spanish language release in the US, surpassed only by
Shaquida's Picasti and Oral Volume one that same year, coming.
Speaker 1 (16:34):
In second place after Shaki is an honor anyone should
be thankful for and to support the album Mana I'm
barked on their biggest tour yet, not in terms of
show dates but production size.
Speaker 2 (16:47):
More than sixty tons of equipment, which look is probably
nothing compared to the Renaissance World Tour, but you gotta
hand it to Mana.
Speaker 1 (16:55):
The world was ready to welcome Manna back with open arms.
The enterk of the crowd over one hundred and sixteen
shows shocked the band night after night over the course
of a year and a half.
Speaker 2 (17:06):
Since then, the band's popularity and esteem has only grown
with the twenty eleven albums Dramailus and twenty fifteens Gama
and Sendida. The first saw a Mana that was willing
to experiment with different sounds.
Speaker 1 (17:19):
Well the second saw the band finally putting the sounds
of the Latin rock scene in the foreground and closing
the record with their most political message yet, a cover
of Los Diigres del Norte somos mass Americanos.
Speaker 2 (17:34):
Do you know? Prussella frontera la frontera mecruso.
Speaker 1 (17:42):
But this wasn't the only time Manna has tried to
affect change in the world. In the twenty tens, Mana
had become a bit more politically vocal, but that doesn't
(18:02):
mean they didn't try to use their platform for good
before then.
Speaker 2 (18:06):
The environmental anthem VVT seen idea from nineteen ninety two
is fat More was kind of like a public promise
to the environmentalists, because four years later the bands put
their money where their mouth was.
Speaker 1 (18:17):
In nineteen ninety six, Manna launch the Selva Negra Ecological Foundation,
an environmental organization dedicated to protecting endangered species, restoring ecosystems,
and promoting environmental education.
Speaker 2 (18:30):
Wow. Since its launch, Selba Negata has supported the sea
turtle population by incubating and releasing eight million tortugas.
Speaker 1 (18:39):
They've also blanded more than eight hundred thousand trees, an
extensive work to preserve Mexican forests and work to foster
climate change education in Mexico.
Speaker 2 (18:48):
But they're not just looking after turtles and trees. The
foundation also provides support to immigrant communities in the US
and Latin America.
Speaker 1 (18:56):
Olvera says we don't see the planet as a country,
see it as a single territory.
Speaker 2 (19:02):
But speaking of territory, venoor Veda also came out in
support of Puerto Rican independence in two thousand and seven.
Speaker 1 (19:08):
And the same year the band criticized Mexico's poor sex
education and contraceptive access. Around the same time, the band
met with then Secretary of State Hillary Clinton to share
their perspective on immigration. But the cause that's perhaps closest
to lead vocalist fair Old Vetta's heart might be the
one we haven't mentioned.
Speaker 2 (19:30):
While awards may not be a priority for Mana, in
twenty twenty one, the band did show up to receive
the Icon Award at the twenty twenty one Billboard Latin
Music Awards.
Speaker 1 (19:41):
The band thanked their fans for thirty five years of
support before performing on a candle at stage for an
acoustic take on elre Lo Hukul.
Speaker 2 (19:50):
Joining them with a twelve year old's vocalist named Mabel.
Shortly before the Billboard Awards, the band had appeared with
Mabel for an artist panel honoring single mothers.
Speaker 1 (20:00):
Fair and Mabel shared something in common. Both were raised
by single moms. At the age of seven, Fair's father
passed away. El re Locuku is reflection on what it's
like to grow up in his absence.
Speaker 2 (20:11):
After Mabel one is singing competition in Mexico, Fer pulled
up Carlo Santana and invited her to perform the song
with Manat at the upcoming awards ceremony.
Speaker 1 (20:21):
Fair would say, when you see your mom working every day,
working very hard, it sets an example set obdam It's
the best example more than school of what makes you strong,
hardworking and a fighter live and I think that feeds art.
Speaker 2 (20:35):
Their performance with Mabel shows one thing that rockers of
all stripes can rally around, hope for the next generation.
Speaker 1 (20:45):
Mana began their career playing in cebee bars, where their
shows would routinely be interrupted by the police, and both
the motive and the goal of those crackdowns was fear.
Speaker 2 (20:55):
The authorities were afraid that young people can make change happen,
so they try to make young people too afraid to.
Speaker 1 (21:01):
Try Now might not melt your face with power cords
or send anyone's parents into a satanic panic, but their
success is proof that the authorities are right about one thing,
that a group of young people can change the world.
(21:22):
On the next, Becoming an Icon Mexico's Mariachi Man's man
e Is Chadro De Wentitan, Vicente Fernands. Becoming an Icon
is presented by Sonoo and Iheart's Michael Duda podcast network.
(21:42):
Listen to Becoming an Icon on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcast,
or wherever you get your podcasts.
Hosts And Creators
Lilliana Vazquez
Joseph Carrillo
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