Ep. 208 Thai Randolph is a groundbreaking CEO, award-winning producer, and serial entrepreneur who has mastered the art of turning culture into capital. As the co-founder and former CEO of HARTBEAT, Thai led the merger of Kevin Hart’s entertainment companies into a $650 million media empire, raising one of the largest funding rounds ever by a Black woman in the process.
Follow Will Lucas on Instagram: @willlucas
Follow Black Tech Green Money: @blacktechgreenmoney, @btgmpodcast
Learn more at AfroTech.com
Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.com
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
I'm with Lucas and this is black Tech, Green money.
Ty Randolph is a groundbreaking CEO, award winning producer, serial
entrepreneur who is mastered the art attorning culture in the Capitol.
As the co founder and former CEO of Heartbeat, Ty
led the merger of Kevin Hart's entertainment companies into a
six hundred and fifty million dollar media empire, basically one
(00:24):
of the largest funding rounds ever by a Black homan.
In the process, she's a strategic force behind brands, platforms,
and partnerships that move culture. From working with Fortune one
hundred companies like JP, Morgan, Chase, and p ANDNG to
empowering the next generation of black entrepreneurs through her work
with Brain Trusting Rock to Bells TIS double bottom line
(00:45):
approach enters both on purpose and profit, creating a blueprint
for building wealth and opportunity through technology, media and unapologetic
black creativity. So you built cultural capital into ekan capital
across your career, and it's very impressive, and I wonder, like,
what are some of the things you've learned about how
(01:06):
to make that happen.
Speaker 2 (01:09):
It's so interesting.
Speaker 3 (01:10):
You know, first, thanks for acknowledging that right, Like, I
think that so often cultural capital is so undervalue, even
though it's required to drive every type of consumption across
the board, every single you know trend and you know.
Speaker 2 (01:31):
All of these trends across popular culture.
Speaker 3 (01:33):
But when you start talking about investing in cultural capital
or translating that to you know, economic capital, somehow there.
Speaker 2 (01:40):
Seems to be a disconnect.
Speaker 3 (01:41):
And what I found is that we could have all
the influence in the world, but without the infrastructure, it's
really difficult to scale that. And so what I've prided
myself on is partnering with creators, partnering with you know, institutions,
partnering with makers and entrepreneurs to really figure out how
to translate all of that influence into not just actual investment,
(02:03):
but sort of real equity and real enterprise on the
other side of that. And I think that's been the case,
like really driving the business case around cultural capital in.
Speaker 2 (02:12):
A way that should be completely intuitive because we all
experience it every day.
Speaker 3 (02:16):
The kind of packaging and harnessing that and then translating
that into IRR and rois is what's been you know,
kind of the secret sauce behind it.
Speaker 1 (02:26):
So when you're going to corporations necessarily to tell these stories,
you know, w y W number one, like what do
you think corporations should be doing to invest back in
that cultural capital? And how do we position ourselves as
creators to communicate in their language.
Speaker 3 (02:42):
As a project manager, I had to learn was how
to deliver, to to handle all these logistics, to influence
multiple stakeholders, get things done on time, above expectation, under budget,
and so much of that orientation, and to do so
in a way that was really driving value for everyone involved.
Speaker 2 (03:01):
And I think that value creation and that sort.
Speaker 3 (03:04):
Of like project and constituent management carry you know, through
and it actually helped me to platform a lot of
not just the creative endeavors I wanted to pursue, but
the creative endeavors for others. It was that sort of
how do we bring this all together and make a
story of it, How do we make the trains around
on time? And how do we ultimately show the value
for what we're creating. And so I would encourage every creator,
(03:28):
regardless of the vertical or industry, to really get smart
about sort of like you know, how you manage your resources,
how you influence everyone at the table and in order
to influence them, you have to understand what motivates them
and when it comes to investment, is ultimately returned.
Speaker 1 (03:45):
You said a few things that I want to dig
in on. You know, you talked about data and knowing
those numbers and the ROI which and we're talking about
creators here. If I'm if I am in my own
world an influencer, I have you know, my TikTok, I
got my Instagram? At what point am I in a
position to go to a brand? How is it follower count?
(04:06):
Is it views on my stuff? Because I know a
lot of people who want to be there, but they
don't have the big numbers like you know the artists.
Speaker 3 (04:14):
Absolutely, it's value creation, right, So it's oftentimes it doesn't.
Speaker 2 (04:20):
You know, brands aren't just looking for who has the
biggest audience.
Speaker 1 (04:24):
Though.
Speaker 3 (04:24):
Reach is important because your audience should be some indication
of how many people you'll be able to activate and
in service of some call to action from a brand.
So that's why the follower account matters. But if you've
got a really engaged audience and you've got deep penetration
and authenticity, we often see more results coming from folks
(04:44):
who just have very deep residency. It's the reason why
you know you'll see creators, influencers or even cultural leaders
both going to market in the same vertical, you know,
whether it be spirits or fash or beauty. And you
often see outside results from folks that aren't the largest
(05:05):
and what is it. They're the most authentic and they
are better activators in that particular space. They can influence
their audience through their relationship with them to take.
Speaker 2 (05:15):
Action on something.
Speaker 3 (05:17):
And so regardless of the audience size, I think you
have to what do you brands want. Brands want to
start from the top of the funnel. They want to
gain awareness, right, They want to get folks to interact,
So they want people to know about their brands. Then
they want folks to think favorably about their brands. They
want them to interact and engage, and then ultimately they
(05:37):
want them to purchase or invest in those brands and
to keep coming again and doing the same thing. And
so along that funnel, think about with your audience, where
can you move the needle right and if you can
prove real qualified actions and real qualified conversions. And often
creators start by seeing how they're able to get their
audience to activate around a small all to action. You know,
(06:00):
if you're a comedian, are people coming to see you
at the you know, at the local comedy show. And
if you can prove to a brand that your voice
and your content and your engagement with them is going
to lead to action on behalf of the brand, regardless
of the size of the audience, brands are going to
take out.
Speaker 1 (06:19):
You know, a lot of your work, Heartbeat Included, has
been rooted in digital innovation, and I wonder what your
thoughts are on how technology may be shaping the future
of content. You know, there are so many creators who
are just going straight to YouTube or straight to you know,
these other publishing platforms and don't need traditional media that way.
Speaker 2 (06:41):
Yeah, it's interesting.
Speaker 3 (06:44):
So you know, on the we're one where you know,
in the midst of the greatest technological revolution of in
history and the speed of innovation has accelerated so fast.
When you think about predominant forms of media and how
long radio was a predominant form of media, how long
television was the predominant form of media, or you know,
(07:05):
once you got the Internet, how long it took to percolate.
We're just seeing methods of communication and forms of consumption
being interrupted in displace much faster down just because technology
is accelerating new things faster better. So what does that
mean for creator? So a ton of opportunity if you
think about Napster and what it did to music, right, So,
(07:26):
first there was you know, a huge much like the
same reaction we're having to AI right now from a
creative community. I'm going to do be disenter, you know,
disintimediated from my audience. I'm not going to be able
to sell albums anymore. Folks aren't going to be able
to experience a body of work in the way that
I intended.
Speaker 2 (07:46):
And a lot of those things are true for a time, right.
Speaker 3 (07:50):
But on the other side of that came a huge
democratization of music and it meant that you could be
you know, the innovation that came after it.
Speaker 2 (07:58):
From you you know, Spotify and YouTube and SoundCloud.
Speaker 3 (08:01):
It meant that discovery was not limited to you know,
a specific few A and R channels. It meant that
reaching an audience was not you know, you didn't have
to be on a national broadcast or have a music
video playing on one of the top cable networks in
order to do so.
Speaker 2 (08:17):
So there was a huge amount of disruption and disintermediation.
Speaker 3 (08:20):
There was a huge amount of opportunity, and we're seeing
the same thing but just you know, amplified what seems
like one hundred x right now. So is there a
ton of you know, protection and rights concerns around nil
and voice and all of the above and the rise
of AI, Well, contracts look different, absolutely, But it also
(08:41):
means that creators are able to do things.
Speaker 2 (08:44):
That were once reserved for studios.
Speaker 3 (08:46):
Right it means you know, creators, you know, the cost
of content production, the cost of creativity goes down, but
they're also.
Speaker 2 (08:54):
Threats to the craft.
Speaker 3 (08:55):
And you know, when you think about building careers digitally,
there there is still you.
Speaker 2 (09:02):
Know a sense of you know, how was that home.
Speaker 3 (09:05):
Some of the talent that you know, I've had the
good fortune to partner with, you know, have built their
careers over decades, right like honing it on stage, honing
it with direct to audience engagement, and there's it's very
different when you're doing that through a screen. Is it
any less valuable? You know, maybe not to the existing audience,
(09:25):
but there is a difference. And so, you know, I
think how craft is developed and how career is developed
or monetized with two different questions, and so so I
think there could be these these threats to craft. But
it also when so much is digitized, this this craft
holds more weight, right like what you put into that
(09:46):
work and how you develop that that you start to
place a premium on it. But you know the net
net is tons more access and more opportunity, but also
more competition right in the market as a result of it.
Speaker 1 (09:58):
Yeah, I want to go a step deeper because you
make me think about it. I grew up in a
church and I remember there were people. Yeah, there are people,
and I'm sure you've seen who could sing better than
anybody who's got a record deal, you know, but they're
never going to get one for whatever reason. And I wonder,
then listening to you talk, just because you're good or
talented doesn't mean you know how to get found. And
(10:19):
I wonder, like what your thoughts are on how do
people get found? Because you're to your point like it's
more competition now, like the landscape is completely changed. And
to add on to that question, like did COVID change
any of that? Because now we don't need to be
necessarily in New York or in LA or in some
of these places. Right necessarily, I.
Speaker 3 (10:40):
Was actually floored by the amount of innovation that's happening
in the classroom. Is such a young age now in
so many of these schools, and we're based in LA
but you know, you've got six and seven year olds
who are doing podcasting and.
Speaker 2 (10:54):
These very advanced team studios.
Speaker 3 (10:56):
But in doing so, they're learning how to craft story
around themselves and actually thinking about how to monetize and
how to promote. Those both scary and wildly enlightening on
the other side. And so I'll say there's a difference.
I don't even know what the term is, right, if
we were beyond digital natives, you know, like it's a
(11:20):
complete digital first generation. And so I would say, I
think that this next generation is much more savvy about
discovery and promotion than than perhaps those who are.
Speaker 2 (11:31):
Doing it right now at the moment, you know, are.
Speaker 3 (11:34):
That being said, what is required, what it means to
be a storyteller, what it means to be a creator
at this moment, I believe means being part artists, part scientists.
Right before I think we were and again, I was
a film major, and you know, I thought that I
was going to have this like really beautiful romantic career
(11:55):
in the art. And and I think, you know, I've
had the exact career I was supposed to have. And
I younifasted myself a storyteller and a business builder and
that artists and scientists, and so you know, you need
to be engaged in story and you need to make
meaning of things, and you also have to figure out,
you know, how to mechanize that in order to get
(12:17):
it seen and to for it to be consumed. Even
if you're not directly involved in digital distribution, if you
are telling story in any form, if you're creating in
any form, you at least need to understand how it
will ultimately be distributed or consumed.
Speaker 2 (12:31):
Right, so you have some context with with what you're creating.
And I think that's what I would say.
Speaker 3 (12:36):
I would say that it is that is the mandate now,
right to know the what and to be committed to
the what and doing it in a way that is
uniquely you that only.
Speaker 2 (12:45):
You can put your footprint on. But really understanding the how.
Speaker 3 (12:48):
As well, And I don't know that that was as important,
and you know sort of previous generations.
Speaker 1 (12:54):
You know, you mentioned your kids in the kind of
education they're getting today versus how we grew up, you know,
when we were going on. I mean, they asked you
you want to be a fireman, you want to be
a police officer, these sorts of things. And these kids
now want to be mister beasts and they want to
be you know, YouTubers and Kaya sanin I Show Speed
and all these guys. And I wonder what Ty thinks
(13:15):
about if her seven year old concerns like I want
to be a YouTuber therefore like nothing, I don't care
about anything else. This is where I'm going.
Speaker 3 (13:23):
H m hm.
Speaker 2 (13:26):
So that's happened. I don't know too many parents from
whom that hasn't just because of them. We you know,
we try to be you know, really good stewards and
not over index on on screen time.
Speaker 3 (13:38):
But as a parent, forget about you know, the executive,
the entrepreneur. As a parent, I I definitely have serious concerns,
and not just about technology, but what technology unlocked. So
clearly there's safety concerns and you want to be really vigilant.
There's a level of discernment concerns what's real and what's
(13:59):
not that I think we're dealing with for the first time,
like now with AI, like you're watching you know, if
if someone's consuming something and they don't have a point
of reference for it in the real world, or what
is the real world anymore? As a parent, right, there
are these big kind of ethical considerations. But I think
that when you talk about creators so often, what we're
(14:20):
defaulting to in that discussion can be some kind of influence. Right.
But like what we found our the conversation we have
found ourselves having with our seven year old.
Speaker 2 (14:30):
To see his picture right there, like a smart kid,
was the difference between like fame and.
Speaker 3 (14:40):
Validation and the making of something right. And so it's
so you know, what do you want to make and
what do you want to contribute, and you know, how
do you want to be in the world versus how
many people know you and how do you want to
be seen? And that's a pressure that was not on
that children are facing in mass It's ampletely unrealistic pressure
(15:01):
that everyone should have this level of fame and notoriety.
And you know, I'm no psychologists, but I just wonder
what that's doing to the psyche. And so as a parent,
I'm really guarding against that. But I think it's a
bigger question for us as a creative community, right like
where does where?
Speaker 2 (15:20):
What is the role of craft now?
Speaker 3 (15:22):
Philosophical and ethical conversations, And what I've come to is,
I just want my child to be very curious minded,
to be you know, to have a critical eye right
and discerning, and to to be a deep thinker and
to understand and to be a deep thinker and a
(15:42):
continuous learner, because I think that those are the and
and you start to default to the fundamentals, like, you know,
I want you to appreciate philosophy.
Speaker 2 (15:51):
You should really be thinking about, you know, sort of
like how you show.
Speaker 3 (15:55):
Up in the world and what it means to be,
you know, a good citizen of the world, because there's
so much more access right like everything that we kind
of imagine they're able to do and touch.
Speaker 2 (16:09):
In a much more accessible way.
Speaker 3 (16:11):
And so then you just have to have a higher
level of discernment and critical thinking skills.
Speaker 1 (16:18):
What would you study today, knowing what you now know
about ties place in the world, your contribution that you
wanted to make, wealth creation, even what choice would you
make today?
Speaker 2 (16:33):
That's so interesting?
Speaker 4 (16:36):
I would say I would probably go on to film
school like I never did. I never got an be
a I would go to film school, but it would
be I would I would do that, I would study philosophy.
Speaker 2 (16:46):
And I say that because I think film school is just.
Speaker 3 (16:51):
A more accessible way of There are lots of ways
into philosophy and there is a deep study of like
how humans behave and how story is passed down and
you know, how humans make meaning of things that happens
in filmmaking, but that happens in philosophy. Because I think
it's I think you have to just have a real
(17:12):
perspective on where all this goes and why all this
is and because the tools are there. I'm so excited.
Speaker 2 (17:19):
About how AI is and not just AI AI are,
and how AI.
Speaker 3 (17:25):
Has also let so many technologies now have its moment,
you know, I think for it, take VR for instance,
it's having a QR code moment. Like I used to
work in marketing for years, like ten years, I worked
for ad agencies and we were always you know, seduced
to putting QR codes on anything that folks couldn't access.
And it took the smartphone to really unlock that, Like
(17:46):
you had to have the technology accessible to really be
able for it to drive mass adoption and the moment
in time, right, it was like the smartphone plus COVID
and all of a sudden, QR codes we've been talking
about for like fifteen years.
Speaker 2 (17:57):
Had a real use case.
Speaker 3 (18:00):
So what AI has done for so many technologies really
making them more scalable and accessible, and so many of
the ideas that we had, you know, can now unlock
in real time. That's that's really really exciting. And so
the things and I used to have the saying in
every job, no matter what it was, you know, independent
of AI, I would say, let the machines do what
(18:21):
the machines could do, so the people could do what
the people could do. So I didn't want to spend
my time on spreadsheets or doing you know, task.
Speaker 2 (18:28):
That could be automated.
Speaker 3 (18:30):
And now they're big thinking human task that can be automated.
Speaker 2 (18:37):
And so the question becomes what do the people do
in this this ecosystem?
Speaker 3 (18:41):
And so one is to have experience, right, so you
think think differently about you know, what we experienced in
the real world. How we bring a human lens to
the life lived, right, Like we're the ones who get
to live this life.
Speaker 2 (18:55):
How you bring the human experience to that, but service
has become so much more important.
Speaker 3 (19:01):
We spend so much time in a virtual world, so
the time that we spend together becomes so important. Happen
on the board of Rock to Bell's, and you know,
they do a lot of experiences. We just announced we're
bringing back our annual Rock the Bells Fest, And there's
something about getting people in a room consuming music together
(19:23):
and having a shared experience together that you know can
can just not be replaced. It can be augmented, it
can be amplified, but you can't really duplicate it completely.
And so you know, I think so I would really
so when when so as machines become smarter. Going back
to the question, what would I study, it would probably
be philosophy to think, as things evolve, how do we
(19:44):
evaluate ourselves, what responsibilities do we have?
Speaker 2 (19:47):
Where are the lines around ethix that kind of thing.
Speaker 1 (19:50):
Yes, I'm been thinking about something you said a minute
ago in finding your unique voice in media and marketing
in a cet like, I can't be Kevin Hart, I
can't be Kai Sanid, I can't.
Speaker 2 (20:03):
Be those guys.
Speaker 1 (20:04):
But I think about also, how do you, as a
person in your position advise people to find their voice
and have confidence in their voice when they may not
have the traction in the early days, to continue to
have the confidence that they will ultimately make it.
Speaker 3 (20:21):
I mean, there's so many proof points in use cases
around us. You look at someone like Adoche, you look
at Tabitha Brown, where it was it was it was
that being left of center or outside of what everyone
was saying.
Speaker 2 (20:37):
It was that that breaks through. And when the algorithm
feeds you sameness, distinction is a delicacy, right, It's such
a premium.
Speaker 3 (20:46):
And so you know, you might be able to press copy,
paste and repeat on whatever the person besides you is doing.
Speaker 2 (20:54):
But the chances that that will.
Speaker 3 (20:56):
Scale, like they're just very few proof points of a
I'm going to copy what that person did that is
breaking through now because there's so much Now, could you
have moderate success or could you attribute a follower account
by following the algorithm? Sure, But when you think about
what it means to build a brand today, whether that's
a personal brand, a creative brand, a brand and business,
(21:18):
it's going to require some distinction. It's much harder to
break through. And so I would say that like your
uniqueness is all you have, it's like your number one quality.
And it's counterintuitive because you know, being on platforms, consuming media,
you'll be you know, enticed to think that like, let
me just you know, double click on this.
Speaker 2 (21:40):
But everyone who we want to emulate has stepped outside
of the box, right, And.
Speaker 3 (21:46):
So I really love seeing people you know, champing creativity
and uniqueness in this space where you know, it's essentially
it can become, if we're not careful, a platform on
which we mass produce creativity. And really, what I think
the promise of all of this new technology is, particularly
ai The promise is to be able, especially when we
talk about folks who have been you know, disenfranchised, under
(22:12):
invested in in the past, you know, black folks, women,
There is there is this, there is this promise. We'll see,
we'll see if it is you know, fulfilled. That this
could be a great equalizer in certain ways. Right, we
can start businesses with fewer resources, you know, we can
scale ideas in faster ways to have a more competitive edge.
(22:32):
And that's where you know, not to replace the creative
parts of ourselves, but to really scale you know, where
we had those production challenges, right, really scale where we
had those you know, sort of resource challenges and unlock
all these amazing and brilliant ideas that we had and so,
(22:53):
you know, working on some things now that will you know,
specifically for us, you know, making help, trying to make
or that we have a voice and we're represented. Because
while there is that great promise, one of the great
threats is if you look at where the investment in
the Internet went right during you know, instead of dot
com and post dot com and who which innovators were platforms,
(23:15):
they look exactly like those who where the investment is
trending now and who's being platformed. And so not only
do we need to make sure that we're adopting because
you know, there are disparities in our adoption of any
of these tools and technologies, we have to make sure
that regarding the investment, there were scaling platforms that we
own with these and so there's.
Speaker 2 (23:34):
Again the two sided coin.
Speaker 3 (23:36):
There's a huge promise or potential should I say, for
a great democrazation and acceleration, but we really have to
make sure that we're counted because it could just as
easily be that this is the next big, you know
revolution where we're sort of sidelined and.
Speaker 1 (23:55):
I'm glad you brought up the legendary James Todd Smith,
U Jay, because I had a question. I was thinking
about him, and I remember going to a conference that
he spoke at some time ago, and he was on
stage and he was talking about the business side of
the music business, and he I remember him saying that
the word business is longer than the word music, and
(24:15):
that's really where your attention should be if you're going
to be an artist. And then listening to you talk,
you talk a lot about how artists need to understand
creators need to understand that data, they need to understand
the ROI but a lot of them, as you know
I have, they they're just creators, like they have no
clue what the numbers mean. And there's a there's another
rapper who I won't mention the name, but I remember
(24:37):
him saying that he didn't he no longer believed artists
need managers. They needed coos.
Speaker 2 (24:44):
That was his thought.
Speaker 1 (24:46):
And I'm like this, I can see that. I can
I get it. I get the sentiment. I will say that,
And so I wonder your thoughts on how creators who
may not have the I'm just funny, I'm just looking
and can act a little like how to figure that
stuff out?
Speaker 3 (25:02):
Right?
Speaker 2 (25:03):
Look, I think so one you know, Todd has had.
Speaker 3 (25:07):
A forty year career in music, and it's it's interesting,
you know, sort of working closely with someone like that,
because the number of times that you have to talk
about a continuous learner, right, and someone who's just like
relentlessly curious is probably you know, one of his just
most admirable attributes, like the willingness to be able to
(25:29):
like to continue to learn, and I wouldn't even say
reinvent yourself, but to continue to learn and leverage everything
that you learn in service and perpetuating.
Speaker 2 (25:37):
Your art and your craft and your life's work.
Speaker 3 (25:39):
Right to continue you know, you've got this mission, you've
got this vision, and you just take everything that you
come across over the course of decades and you continue
to put that back in and then you form these
ideas like the one that you just express based on
everything that you're learning.
Speaker 2 (25:52):
I really don't think you.
Speaker 3 (25:53):
Can afford today to be just a creator and not
a have some business acumen. And I say that because
if we look twenty years ago, but even ten years ago,
creators you can say creators have an opportunity to promote
themselves across social Instagram and you know TikTok and now,
(26:17):
but they.
Speaker 2 (26:17):
Almost have an obligation to now, right, Like you have
to be able to put the workout.
Speaker 3 (26:22):
Even the machines that organize around us, the labels, the managers,
the agents, they're still going to require you to be
able to like they have to market you through a stream.
And those streams are analytical in nature, right, their algorithmic
in nature, and so it would be just very I
don't it be very difficult?
Speaker 2 (26:39):
Now? Does that mean that everyone has to be digital first?
Speaker 3 (26:41):
Does that mean that everyone has to take the same
approach to promotion or that everyone has to say, Okay,
I'm going to build an enterprise, you know, around myself.
Maybe not right, They're going to be different flavors, just
like in business, pure entrepreneurs operate on different levels of scale.
But creativity in a digital age is inherently entrepreneurial period,
(27:04):
regardless of how. And so there's certain tools that you'll
have to use. And I talk about this sort of
like spectrum regarding deal structures and return or levels of
entrepreneurship in creativity, and particularly when it comes to partner
with brands and so you know, on the one hand,
but you could sort of extract that and apply it
(27:26):
to any type of partnership. You start out with endorsement,
I do a thing, I get paid for think, and
that's fine.
Speaker 2 (27:33):
But you still, even in this.
Speaker 3 (27:36):
You know ecosystem, have to understand the economics of even
how endorsements are calculated to make sure that you're thinking
about it the right way, because to your earlier point,
those endorsement deals might be influenced by your reach, it
might be influenced by the amount of and it's definitely
going to be an influenced by the amount of return
that you're able to drive. So you start with endorsement,
and then you move down the spectrum to equity. So
(27:58):
folks say, look, I'm.
Speaker 2 (28:00):
I'm driving a lot of value for you.
Speaker 3 (28:03):
I want participation and how this thing performs beyond just
you know sort of you know what I did in
this specific campaign or what I did in the specific transaction.
And then you have you know, really innovative entrepreneurs and
creators who are now saying, no, I am because of
how influence Because influencers shifted away from institutions to individuals
(28:25):
and these individual brands are now some of the fastest
grown entrant in segments. You talked about mister Beasts and
you know, think about when was the last time the chocolate.
Speaker 2 (28:36):
Industry was disrupted or so you or or look at
you know.
Speaker 3 (28:41):
Kim Kardashjeriniki right now, I mean you see these incredible
or I mean there's across the border. Look at someone
like Tabitha Brown, who is innovating across so many different
verticals where it could have been pure endorsement, and I'm
sure she still has some endorsements, but where it's okay,
Like I know that through my passion, my voice, my
specific point of view, I'm able to drive these returns.
(29:03):
And then you get all the way to enterprise. And
I don't really care where you play on that spectrum,
but what you notice is there's some inherent business acumunity.
Even if you have a team managing all of that
for you, that's required to know how to navigate along
that path. And so again, you could be a comedian
starting out in the club. You could be a visual artist.
(29:24):
So many of the artists that you know, so many
of the visual artists that I discovered I find on
Instagram and so if.
Speaker 2 (29:29):
We think just as users, how it end.
Speaker 3 (29:32):
I will say, I think the distinction between creator and
consumer has also collapsed.
Speaker 2 (29:38):
Right, Like you talked about our children coming to us
and saying here's what I want to do.
Speaker 3 (29:42):
It's because every single time we post everything, single time
we share, we're contributing to the creator economy. So there's
not that distinction, and creators want to consumers want to
have a voice and expect more buy in and expect
to be able to direct more.
Speaker 2 (29:57):
And so I think all of this just leads to.
Speaker 3 (29:59):
An owner ship economy where we're all having to become
and have an opportunity to be a lot more savvy
around where we invest our time, our attention, and ultimately
our money.
Speaker 1 (30:11):
All Right, last one, what is the best career advice
you've received that would be helpful to this audience?
Speaker 3 (30:18):
M So it's interesting because I think I said it
and I actually had to find myself taking my own advice.
I always said my career was a river, not a ladder.
And I think that you know, whether you're in corporate
or you're a creator, it's really important to think that
I named my son Nile, and it's you know, I
wanted him to.
Speaker 2 (30:40):
For a number of reasons.
Speaker 3 (30:42):
But you know, I think there's a fluidity to to
to how particularly now when things are changing so fast.
Speaker 2 (30:50):
Before you could go to practice a craft, you were marketing.
You know, you get your MBA and you know you
could be a CpG marketer for twenty years and not.
Speaker 3 (30:59):
You go to some professional development classes, but you don't
really have to innovate a tunnel on what.
Speaker 2 (31:03):
Is that you're doing.
Speaker 3 (31:04):
And now we have to be these continuous learners. And
I found that, you know, I told you I wanted
to go to film school first. I ended up, you know,
doing aerospace and defense marketing. I would have crafted it
out in a much more linear way if I was,
you know, going from point eight to point B. But
every single you know bend in the river, every single
(31:26):
time there was you know, things sped up, slowed down.
It all contributed to where I am now. And every
one of those experiences was so meaningful. You kind of
like like a river, you pick up deposits all along
the way. And so I always say to be focused
on where you want to go and really flexible on
how you get there.
Speaker 2 (31:44):
And that's that served me.
Speaker 1 (31:46):
All Black tech, Green money is a production to Blavity
Afro Tech on the Black Effect Podcast Network and night
Hire Media. It's produced by Morgan Debonne and me Well Lucas,
with the additional production support by Kate McDonald s J McGee.
Special thank you to Michael Davis in Lovebeach. Learn more
about my guess of the tech distruct as an innovators
at afrotech dot com. The video version of this episode
(32:08):
will drop to Black Tech Green Money on YouTube, so
tap in, enjoy your Black Tech Green Money, share us
to somebody go get your money. Peace and love,
I'm with Lucas and this is black Tech, Green money.
Ty Randolph is a groundbreaking CEO, award winning producer, serial
entrepreneur who is mastered the art attorning culture in the Capitol.
As the co founder and former CEO of Heartbeat, Ty
led the merger of Kevin Hart's entertainment companies into a
six hundred and fifty million dollar media empire, basically one
(00:24):
of the largest funding rounds ever by a Black homan.
In the process, she's a strategic force behind brands, platforms,
and partnerships that move culture. From working with Fortune one
hundred companies like JP, Morgan, Chase, and p ANDNG to
empowering the next generation of black entrepreneurs through her work
with Brain Trusting Rock to Bells TIS double bottom line
(00:45):
approach enters both on purpose and profit, creating a blueprint
for building wealth and opportunity through technology, media and unapologetic
black creativity. So you built cultural capital into ekan capital
across your career, and it's very impressive, and I wonder, like,
what are some of the things you've learned about how
(01:06):
to make that happen.
Speaker 2 (01:09):
It's so interesting.
Speaker 3 (01:10):
You know, first, thanks for acknowledging that right, Like, I
think that so often cultural capital is so undervalue, even
though it's required to drive every type of consumption across
the board, every single you know trend and you know.
Speaker 2 (01:31):
All of these trends across popular culture.
Speaker 3 (01:33):
But when you start talking about investing in cultural capital
or translating that to you know, economic capital, somehow there.
Speaker 2 (01:40):
Seems to be a disconnect.
Speaker 3 (01:41):
And what I found is that we could have all
the influence in the world, but without the infrastructure, it's
really difficult to scale that. And so what I've prided
myself on is partnering with creators, partnering with you know, institutions,
partnering with makers and entrepreneurs to really figure out how
to translate all of that influence into not just actual investment,
(02:03):
but sort of real equity and real enterprise on the
other side of that. And I think that's been the case,
like really driving the business case around cultural capital in.
Speaker 2 (02:12):
A way that should be completely intuitive because we all
experience it every day.
Speaker 3 (02:16):
The kind of packaging and harnessing that and then translating
that into IRR and rois is what's been you know,
kind of the secret sauce behind it.
Speaker 1 (02:26):
So when you're going to corporations necessarily to tell these stories,
you know, w y W number one, like what do
you think corporations should be doing to invest back in
that cultural capital? And how do we position ourselves as
creators to communicate in their language.
Speaker 3 (02:42):
As a project manager, I had to learn was how
to deliver, to to handle all these logistics, to influence
multiple stakeholders, get things done on time, above expectation, under budget,
and so much of that orientation, and to do so
in a way that was really driving value for everyone involved.
Speaker 2 (03:01):
And I think that value creation and that sort.
Speaker 3 (03:04):
Of like project and constituent management carry you know, through
and it actually helped me to platform a lot of
not just the creative endeavors I wanted to pursue, but
the creative endeavors for others. It was that sort of
how do we bring this all together and make a
story of it, How do we make the trains around
on time? And how do we ultimately show the value
for what we're creating. And so I would encourage every creator,
(03:28):
regardless of the vertical or industry, to really get smart
about sort of like you know, how you manage your resources,
how you influence everyone at the table and in order
to influence them, you have to understand what motivates them
and when it comes to investment, is ultimately returned.
Speaker 1 (03:45):
You said a few things that I want to dig
in on. You know, you talked about data and knowing
those numbers and the ROI which and we're talking about
creators here. If I'm if I am in my own
world an influencer, I have you know, my TikTok, I
got my Instagram? At what point am I in a
position to go to a brand? How is it follower count?
(04:06):
Is it views on my stuff? Because I know a
lot of people who want to be there, but they
don't have the big numbers like you know the artists.
Speaker 3 (04:14):
Absolutely, it's value creation, right, So it's oftentimes it doesn't.
Speaker 2 (04:20):
You know, brands aren't just looking for who has the
biggest audience.
Speaker 1 (04:24):
Though.
Speaker 3 (04:24):
Reach is important because your audience should be some indication
of how many people you'll be able to activate and
in service of some call to action from a brand.
So that's why the follower account matters. But if you've
got a really engaged audience and you've got deep penetration
and authenticity, we often see more results coming from folks
(04:44):
who just have very deep residency. It's the reason why
you know you'll see creators, influencers or even cultural leaders
both going to market in the same vertical, you know,
whether it be spirits or fash or beauty. And you
often see outside results from folks that aren't the largest
(05:05):
and what is it. They're the most authentic and they
are better activators in that particular space. They can influence
their audience through their relationship with them to take.
Speaker 2 (05:15):
Action on something.
Speaker 3 (05:17):
And so regardless of the audience size, I think you
have to what do you brands want. Brands want to
start from the top of the funnel. They want to
gain awareness, right, They want to get folks to interact,
So they want people to know about their brands. Then
they want folks to think favorably about their brands. They
want them to interact and engage, and then ultimately they
(05:37):
want them to purchase or invest in those brands and
to keep coming again and doing the same thing. And
so along that funnel, think about with your audience, where
can you move the needle right and if you can
prove real qualified actions and real qualified conversions. And often
creators start by seeing how they're able to get their
audience to activate around a small all to action. You know,
(06:00):
if you're a comedian, are people coming to see you
at the you know, at the local comedy show. And
if you can prove to a brand that your voice
and your content and your engagement with them is going
to lead to action on behalf of the brand, regardless
of the size of the audience, brands are going to
take out.
Speaker 1 (06:19):
You know, a lot of your work, Heartbeat Included, has
been rooted in digital innovation, and I wonder what your
thoughts are on how technology may be shaping the future
of content. You know, there are so many creators who
are just going straight to YouTube or straight to you know,
these other publishing platforms and don't need traditional media that way.
Speaker 2 (06:41):
Yeah, it's interesting.
Speaker 3 (06:44):
So you know, on the we're one where you know,
in the midst of the greatest technological revolution of in
history and the speed of innovation has accelerated so fast.
When you think about predominant forms of media and how
long radio was a predominant form of media, how long
television was the predominant form of media, or you know,
(07:05):
once you got the Internet, how long it took to percolate.
We're just seeing methods of communication and forms of consumption
being interrupted in displace much faster down just because technology
is accelerating new things faster better. So what does that
mean for creator? So a ton of opportunity if you
think about Napster and what it did to music, right, So,
(07:26):
first there was you know, a huge much like the
same reaction we're having to AI right now from a
creative community. I'm going to do be disenter, you know,
disintimediated from my audience. I'm not going to be able
to sell albums anymore. Folks aren't going to be able
to experience a body of work in the way that
I intended.
Speaker 2 (07:46):
And a lot of those things are true for a time, right.
Speaker 3 (07:50):
But on the other side of that came a huge
democratization of music and it meant that you could be
you know, the innovation that came after it.
Speaker 2 (07:58):
From you you know, Spotify and YouTube and SoundCloud.
Speaker 3 (08:01):
It meant that discovery was not limited to you know,
a specific few A and R channels. It meant that
reaching an audience was not you know, you didn't have
to be on a national broadcast or have a music
video playing on one of the top cable networks in
order to do so.
Speaker 2 (08:17):
So there was a huge amount of disruption and disintermediation.
Speaker 3 (08:20):
There was a huge amount of opportunity, and we're seeing
the same thing but just you know, amplified what seems
like one hundred x right now. So is there a
ton of you know, protection and rights concerns around nil
and voice and all of the above and the rise
of AI, Well, contracts look different, absolutely, But it also
(08:41):
means that creators are able to do things.
Speaker 2 (08:44):
That were once reserved for studios.
Speaker 3 (08:46):
Right it means you know, creators, you know, the cost
of content production, the cost of creativity goes down, but
they're also.
Speaker 2 (08:54):
Threats to the craft.
Speaker 3 (08:55):
And you know, when you think about building careers digitally,
there there is still you.
Speaker 2 (09:02):
Know a sense of you know, how was that home.
Speaker 3 (09:05):
Some of the talent that you know, I've had the
good fortune to partner with, you know, have built their
careers over decades, right like honing it on stage, honing
it with direct to audience engagement, and there's it's very
different when you're doing that through a screen. Is it
any less valuable? You know, maybe not to the existing audience,
(09:25):
but there is a difference. And so, you know, I
think how craft is developed and how career is developed
or monetized with two different questions, and so so I
think there could be these these threats to craft. But
it also when so much is digitized, this this craft
holds more weight, right like what you put into that
(09:46):
work and how you develop that that you start to
place a premium on it. But you know the net
net is tons more access and more opportunity, but also
more competition right in the market as a result of it.
Speaker 1 (09:58):
Yeah, I want to go a step deeper because you
make me think about it. I grew up in a
church and I remember there were people. Yeah, there are people,
and I'm sure you've seen who could sing better than
anybody who's got a record deal, you know, but they're
never going to get one for whatever reason. And I wonder,
then listening to you talk, just because you're good or
talented doesn't mean you know how to get found. And
(10:19):
I wonder, like what your thoughts are on how do
people get found? Because you're to your point like it's
more competition now, like the landscape is completely changed. And
to add on to that question, like did COVID change
any of that? Because now we don't need to be
necessarily in New York or in LA or in some
of these places. Right necessarily, I.
Speaker 3 (10:40):
Was actually floored by the amount of innovation that's happening
in the classroom. Is such a young age now in
so many of these schools, and we're based in LA
but you know, you've got six and seven year olds
who are doing podcasting and.
Speaker 2 (10:54):
These very advanced team studios.
Speaker 3 (10:56):
But in doing so, they're learning how to craft story
around themselves and actually thinking about how to monetize and
how to promote. Those both scary and wildly enlightening on
the other side. And so I'll say there's a difference.
I don't even know what the term is, right, if
we were beyond digital natives, you know, like it's a
(11:20):
complete digital first generation. And so I would say, I
think that this next generation is much more savvy about
discovery and promotion than than perhaps those who are.
Speaker 2 (11:31):
Doing it right now at the moment, you know, are.
Speaker 3 (11:34):
That being said, what is required, what it means to
be a storyteller, what it means to be a creator
at this moment, I believe means being part artists, part scientists.
Right before I think we were and again, I was
a film major, and you know, I thought that I
was going to have this like really beautiful romantic career
(11:55):
in the art. And and I think, you know, I've
had the exact career I was supposed to have. And
I younifasted myself a storyteller and a business builder and
that artists and scientists, and so you know, you need
to be engaged in story and you need to make
meaning of things, and you also have to figure out,
you know, how to mechanize that in order to get
(12:17):
it seen and to for it to be consumed. Even
if you're not directly involved in digital distribution, if you
are telling story in any form, if you're creating in
any form, you at least need to understand how it
will ultimately be distributed or consumed.
Speaker 2 (12:31):
Right, so you have some context with with what you're creating.
And I think that's what I would say.
Speaker 3 (12:36):
I would say that it is that is the mandate now,
right to know the what and to be committed to
the what and doing it in a way that is
uniquely you that only.
Speaker 2 (12:45):
You can put your footprint on. But really understanding the how.
Speaker 3 (12:48):
As well, And I don't know that that was as important,
and you know sort of previous generations.
Speaker 1 (12:54):
You know, you mentioned your kids in the kind of
education they're getting today versus how we grew up, you know,
when we were going on. I mean, they asked you
you want to be a fireman, you want to be
a police officer, these sorts of things. And these kids
now want to be mister beasts and they want to
be you know, YouTubers and Kaya sanin I Show Speed
and all these guys. And I wonder what Ty thinks
(13:15):
about if her seven year old concerns like I want
to be a YouTuber therefore like nothing, I don't care
about anything else. This is where I'm going.
Speaker 3 (13:23):
H m hm.
Speaker 2 (13:26):
So that's happened. I don't know too many parents from
whom that hasn't just because of them. We you know,
we try to be you know, really good stewards and
not over index on on screen time.
Speaker 3 (13:38):
But as a parent, forget about you know, the executive,
the entrepreneur. As a parent, I I definitely have serious concerns,
and not just about technology, but what technology unlocked. So
clearly there's safety concerns and you want to be really vigilant.
There's a level of discernment concerns what's real and what's
(13:59):
not that I think we're dealing with for the first time,
like now with AI, like you're watching you know, if
if someone's consuming something and they don't have a point
of reference for it in the real world, or what
is the real world anymore? As a parent, right, there
are these big kind of ethical considerations. But I think
that when you talk about creators so often, what we're
(14:20):
defaulting to in that discussion can be some kind of influence. Right.
But like what we found our the conversation we have
found ourselves having with our seven year old.
Speaker 2 (14:30):
To see his picture right there, like a smart kid,
was the difference between like fame and.
Speaker 3 (14:40):
Validation and the making of something right. And so it's
so you know, what do you want to make and
what do you want to contribute, and you know, how
do you want to be in the world versus how
many people know you and how do you want to
be seen? And that's a pressure that was not on
that children are facing in mass It's ampletely unrealistic pressure
(15:01):
that everyone should have this level of fame and notoriety.
And you know, I'm no psychologists, but I just wonder
what that's doing to the psyche. And so as a parent,
I'm really guarding against that. But I think it's a
bigger question for us as a creative community, right like
where does where?
Speaker 2 (15:20):
What is the role of craft now?
Speaker 3 (15:22):
Philosophical and ethical conversations, And what I've come to is,
I just want my child to be very curious minded,
to be you know, to have a critical eye right
and discerning, and to to be a deep thinker and
to understand and to be a deep thinker and a
(15:42):
continuous learner, because I think that those are the and
and you start to default to the fundamentals, like, you know,
I want you to appreciate philosophy.
Speaker 2 (15:51):
You should really be thinking about, you know, sort of
like how you show.
Speaker 3 (15:55):
Up in the world and what it means to be,
you know, a good citizen of the world, because there's
so much more access right like everything that we kind
of imagine they're able to do and touch.
Speaker 2 (16:09):
In a much more accessible way.
Speaker 3 (16:11):
And so then you just have to have a higher
level of discernment and critical thinking skills.
Speaker 1 (16:18):
What would you study today, knowing what you now know
about ties place in the world, your contribution that you
wanted to make, wealth creation, even what choice would you
make today?
Speaker 2 (16:33):
That's so interesting?
Speaker 4 (16:36):
I would say I would probably go on to film
school like I never did. I never got an be
a I would go to film school, but it would
be I would I would do that, I would study philosophy.
Speaker 2 (16:46):
And I say that because I think film school is just.
Speaker 3 (16:51):
A more accessible way of There are lots of ways
into philosophy and there is a deep study of like
how humans behave and how story is passed down and
you know, how humans make meaning of things that happens
in filmmaking, but that happens in philosophy. Because I think
it's I think you have to just have a real
(17:12):
perspective on where all this goes and why all this
is and because the tools are there. I'm so excited.
Speaker 2 (17:19):
About how AI is and not just AI AI are,
and how AI.
Speaker 3 (17:25):
Has also let so many technologies now have its moment,
you know, I think for it, take VR for instance,
it's having a QR code moment. Like I used to
work in marketing for years, like ten years, I worked
for ad agencies and we were always you know, seduced
to putting QR codes on anything that folks couldn't access.
And it took the smartphone to really unlock that, Like
(17:46):
you had to have the technology accessible to really be
able for it to drive mass adoption and the moment
in time, right, it was like the smartphone plus COVID
and all of a sudden, QR codes we've been talking
about for like fifteen years.
Speaker 2 (17:57):
Had a real use case.
Speaker 3 (18:00):
So what AI has done for so many technologies really
making them more scalable and accessible, and so many of
the ideas that we had, you know, can now unlock
in real time. That's that's really really exciting. And so
the things and I used to have the saying in
every job, no matter what it was, you know, independent
of AI, I would say, let the machines do what
(18:21):
the machines could do, so the people could do what
the people could do. So I didn't want to spend
my time on spreadsheets or doing you know, task.
Speaker 2 (18:28):
That could be automated.
Speaker 3 (18:30):
And now they're big thinking human task that can be automated.
Speaker 2 (18:37):
And so the question becomes what do the people do
in this this ecosystem?
Speaker 3 (18:41):
And so one is to have experience, right, so you
think think differently about you know, what we experienced in
the real world. How we bring a human lens to
the life lived, right, Like we're the ones who get
to live this life.
Speaker 2 (18:55):
How you bring the human experience to that, but service
has become so much more important.
Speaker 3 (19:01):
We spend so much time in a virtual world, so
the time that we spend together becomes so important. Happen
on the board of Rock to Bell's, and you know,
they do a lot of experiences. We just announced we're
bringing back our annual Rock the Bells Fest, And there's
something about getting people in a room consuming music together
(19:23):
and having a shared experience together that you know can
can just not be replaced. It can be augmented, it
can be amplified, but you can't really duplicate it completely.
And so you know, I think so I would really
so when when so as machines become smarter. Going back
to the question, what would I study, it would probably
be philosophy to think, as things evolve, how do we
(19:44):
evaluate ourselves, what responsibilities do we have?
Speaker 2 (19:47):
Where are the lines around ethix that kind of thing.
Speaker 1 (19:50):
Yes, I'm been thinking about something you said a minute
ago in finding your unique voice in media and marketing
in a cet like, I can't be Kevin Hart, I
can't be Kai Sanid, I can't.
Speaker 2 (20:03):
Be those guys.
Speaker 1 (20:04):
But I think about also, how do you, as a
person in your position advise people to find their voice
and have confidence in their voice when they may not
have the traction in the early days, to continue to
have the confidence that they will ultimately make it.
Speaker 3 (20:21):
I mean, there's so many proof points in use cases
around us. You look at someone like Adoche, you look
at Tabitha Brown, where it was it was it was
that being left of center or outside of what everyone
was saying.
Speaker 2 (20:37):
It was that that breaks through. And when the algorithm
feeds you sameness, distinction is a delicacy, right, It's such
a premium.
Speaker 3 (20:46):
And so you know, you might be able to press copy,
paste and repeat on whatever the person besides you is doing.
Speaker 2 (20:54):
But the chances that that will.
Speaker 3 (20:56):
Scale, like they're just very few proof points of a
I'm going to copy what that person did that is
breaking through now because there's so much Now, could you
have moderate success or could you attribute a follower account
by following the algorithm? Sure, But when you think about
what it means to build a brand today, whether that's
a personal brand, a creative brand, a brand and business,
(21:18):
it's going to require some distinction. It's much harder to
break through. And so I would say that like your
uniqueness is all you have, it's like your number one quality.
And it's counterintuitive because you know, being on platforms, consuming media,
you'll be you know, enticed to think that like, let
me just you know, double click on this.
Speaker 2 (21:40):
But everyone who we want to emulate has stepped outside
of the box, right, And.
Speaker 3 (21:46):
So I really love seeing people you know, champing creativity
and uniqueness in this space where you know, it's essentially
it can become, if we're not careful, a platform on
which we mass produce creativity. And really, what I think
the promise of all of this new technology is, particularly
ai The promise is to be able, especially when we
talk about folks who have been you know, disenfranchised, under
(22:12):
invested in in the past, you know, black folks, women,
There is there is this, there is this promise. We'll see,
we'll see if it is you know, fulfilled. That this
could be a great equalizer in certain ways. Right, we
can start businesses with fewer resources, you know, we can
scale ideas in faster ways to have a more competitive edge.
(22:32):
And that's where you know, not to replace the creative
parts of ourselves, but to really scale you know, where
we had those production challenges, right, really scale where we
had those you know, sort of resource challenges and unlock
all these amazing and brilliant ideas that we had and so,
(22:53):
you know, working on some things now that will you know,
specifically for us, you know, making help, trying to make
or that we have a voice and we're represented. Because
while there is that great promise, one of the great
threats is if you look at where the investment in
the Internet went right during you know, instead of dot
com and post dot com and who which innovators were platforms,
(23:15):
they look exactly like those who where the investment is
trending now and who's being platformed. And so not only
do we need to make sure that we're adopting because
you know, there are disparities in our adoption of any
of these tools and technologies, we have to make sure
that regarding the investment, there were scaling platforms that we
own with these and so there's.
Speaker 2 (23:34):
Again the two sided coin.
Speaker 3 (23:36):
There's a huge promise or potential should I say, for
a great democrazation and acceleration, but we really have to
make sure that we're counted because it could just as
easily be that this is the next big, you know
revolution where we're sort of sidelined and.
Speaker 1 (23:55):
I'm glad you brought up the legendary James Todd Smith,
U Jay, because I had a question. I was thinking
about him, and I remember going to a conference that
he spoke at some time ago, and he was on
stage and he was talking about the business side of
the music business, and he I remember him saying that
the word business is longer than the word music, and
(24:15):
that's really where your attention should be if you're going
to be an artist. And then listening to you talk,
you talk a lot about how artists need to understand
creators need to understand that data, they need to understand
the ROI but a lot of them, as you know
I have, they they're just creators, like they have no
clue what the numbers mean. And there's a there's another
rapper who I won't mention the name, but I remember
(24:37):
him saying that he didn't he no longer believed artists
need managers. They needed coos.
Speaker 2 (24:44):
That was his thought.
Speaker 1 (24:46):
And I'm like this, I can see that. I can
I get it. I get the sentiment. I will say that,
And so I wonder your thoughts on how creators who
may not have the I'm just funny, I'm just looking
and can act a little like how to figure that
stuff out?
Speaker 3 (25:02):
Right?
Speaker 2 (25:03):
Look, I think so one you know, Todd has had.
Speaker 3 (25:07):
A forty year career in music, and it's it's interesting,
you know, sort of working closely with someone like that,
because the number of times that you have to talk
about a continuous learner, right, and someone who's just like
relentlessly curious is probably you know, one of his just
most admirable attributes, like the willingness to be able to
(25:29):
like to continue to learn, and I wouldn't even say
reinvent yourself, but to continue to learn and leverage everything
that you learn in service and perpetuating.
Speaker 2 (25:37):
Your art and your craft and your life's work.
Speaker 3 (25:39):
Right to continue you know, you've got this mission, you've
got this vision, and you just take everything that you
come across over the course of decades and you continue
to put that back in and then you form these
ideas like the one that you just express based on
everything that you're learning.
Speaker 2 (25:52):
I really don't think you.
Speaker 3 (25:53):
Can afford today to be just a creator and not
a have some business acumen. And I say that because
if we look twenty years ago, but even ten years ago,
creators you can say creators have an opportunity to promote
themselves across social Instagram and you know TikTok and now,
(26:17):
but they.
Speaker 2 (26:17):
Almost have an obligation to now, right, Like you have
to be able to put the workout.
Speaker 3 (26:22):
Even the machines that organize around us, the labels, the managers,
the agents, they're still going to require you to be
able to like they have to market you through a stream.
And those streams are analytical in nature, right, their algorithmic
in nature, and so it would be just very I
don't it be very difficult?
Speaker 2 (26:39):
Now? Does that mean that everyone has to be digital first?
Speaker 3 (26:41):
Does that mean that everyone has to take the same
approach to promotion or that everyone has to say, Okay,
I'm going to build an enterprise, you know, around myself.
Maybe not right, They're going to be different flavors, just
like in business, pure entrepreneurs operate on different levels of scale.
But creativity in a digital age is inherently entrepreneurial period,
(27:04):
regardless of how. And so there's certain tools that you'll
have to use. And I talk about this sort of
like spectrum regarding deal structures and return or levels of
entrepreneurship in creativity, and particularly when it comes to partner
with brands and so you know, on the one hand,
but you could sort of extract that and apply it
(27:26):
to any type of partnership. You start out with endorsement,
I do a thing, I get paid for think, and
that's fine.
Speaker 2 (27:33):
But you still, even in this.
Speaker 3 (27:36):
You know ecosystem, have to understand the economics of even
how endorsements are calculated to make sure that you're thinking
about it the right way, because to your earlier point,
those endorsement deals might be influenced by your reach, it
might be influenced by the amount of and it's definitely
going to be an influenced by the amount of return
that you're able to drive. So you start with endorsement,
and then you move down the spectrum to equity. So
(27:58):
folks say, look, I'm.
Speaker 2 (28:00):
I'm driving a lot of value for you.
Speaker 3 (28:03):
I want participation and how this thing performs beyond just
you know sort of you know what I did in
this specific campaign or what I did in the specific transaction.
And then you have you know, really innovative entrepreneurs and
creators who are now saying, no, I am because of
how influence Because influencers shifted away from institutions to individuals
(28:25):
and these individual brands are now some of the fastest
grown entrant in segments. You talked about mister Beasts and
you know, think about when was the last time the chocolate.
Speaker 2 (28:36):
Industry was disrupted or so you or or look at
you know.
Speaker 3 (28:41):
Kim Kardashjeriniki right now, I mean you see these incredible
or I mean there's across the border. Look at someone
like Tabitha Brown, who is innovating across so many different
verticals where it could have been pure endorsement, and I'm
sure she still has some endorsements, but where it's okay,
Like I know that through my passion, my voice, my
specific point of view, I'm able to drive these returns.
(29:03):
And then you get all the way to enterprise. And
I don't really care where you play on that spectrum,
but what you notice is there's some inherent business acumunity.
Even if you have a team managing all of that
for you, that's required to know how to navigate along
that path. And so again, you could be a comedian
starting out in the club. You could be a visual artist.
(29:24):
So many of the artists that you know, so many
of the visual artists that I discovered I find on
Instagram and so if.
Speaker 2 (29:29):
We think just as users, how it end.
Speaker 3 (29:32):
I will say, I think the distinction between creator and
consumer has also collapsed.
Speaker 2 (29:38):
Right, Like you talked about our children coming to us
and saying here's what I want to do.
Speaker 3 (29:42):
It's because every single time we post everything, single time
we share, we're contributing to the creator economy. So there's
not that distinction, and creators want to consumers want to
have a voice and expect more buy in and expect
to be able to direct more.
Speaker 2 (29:57):
And so I think all of this just leads to.
Speaker 3 (29:59):
An owner ship economy where we're all having to become
and have an opportunity to be a lot more savvy
around where we invest our time, our attention, and ultimately
our money.
Speaker 1 (30:11):
All Right, last one, what is the best career advice
you've received that would be helpful to this audience?
Speaker 3 (30:18):
M So it's interesting because I think I said it
and I actually had to find myself taking my own advice.
I always said my career was a river, not a ladder.
And I think that you know, whether you're in corporate
or you're a creator, it's really important to think that
I named my son Nile, and it's you know, I
wanted him to.
Speaker 2 (30:40):
For a number of reasons.
Speaker 3 (30:42):
But you know, I think there's a fluidity to to
to how particularly now when things are changing so fast.
Speaker 2 (30:50):
Before you could go to practice a craft, you were marketing.
You know, you get your MBA and you know you
could be a CpG marketer for twenty years and not.
Speaker 3 (30:59):
You go to some professional development classes, but you don't
really have to innovate a tunnel on what.
Speaker 2 (31:03):
Is that you're doing.
Speaker 3 (31:04):
And now we have to be these continuous learners. And
I found that, you know, I told you I wanted
to go to film school first. I ended up, you know,
doing aerospace and defense marketing. I would have crafted it
out in a much more linear way if I was,
you know, going from point eight to point B. But
every single you know bend in the river, every single
(31:26):
time there was you know, things sped up, slowed down.
It all contributed to where I am now. And every
one of those experiences was so meaningful. You kind of
like like a river, you pick up deposits all along
the way. And so I always say to be focused
on where you want to go and really flexible on
how you get there.
Speaker 2 (31:44):
And that's that served me.
Speaker 1 (31:46):
All Black tech, Green money is a production to Blavity
Afro Tech on the Black Effect Podcast Network and night
Hire Media. It's produced by Morgan Debonne and me Well Lucas,
with the additional production support by Kate McDonald s J McGee.
Special thank you to Michael Davis in Lovebeach. Learn more
about my guess of the tech distruct as an innovators
at afrotech dot com. The video version of this episode
(32:08):
will drop to Black Tech Green Money on YouTube, so
tap in, enjoy your Black Tech Green Money, share us
to somebody go get your money. Peace and love,
Host
Will Lucas
Popular Podcasts
Las Culturistas with Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang
Ding dong! Join your culture consultants, Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang, on an unforgettable journey into the beating heart of CULTURE. Alongside sizzling special guests, they GET INTO the hottest pop-culture moments of the day and the formative cultural experiences that turned them into Culturistas. Produced by the Big Money Players Network and iHeartRadio.
40s and Free Agents: NFL Draft Season
Daniel Jeremiah of Move the Sticks and Gregg Rosenthal of NFL Daily join forces to break down every team's needs this offseason.
Crime Junkie
Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies! Crime Junkie is presented by audiochuck Media Company.