November 29, 2023 • 28 mins
Burden of Guilt has been turned into a docuseries, now streaming only on Paramount+. Available to watch HERE!
And make sure to binge all episodes of the podcast that inspired the show before you watch!
The jury from Jan Barry Sandlin’s second trial returns a verdict. When it seems like Tracyraquel would finally find justice for Matthew, the defense comes back with a new strategy. A new advocate steps in for Jan Barry Sandlin. Tracyraquel shares more about the two souls she feels are connected to her story.
If you would like to reach out to the Burden of Guilt Team, email us at burdenofguiltpod@gmail.com
If you or someone you know is a victim of domestic abuse, please reach out and call the National Domestic Violence Hotline at 1-800-799-7233.
To report a case of child abuse, please contact your local police department or call the Childhelp National Child Abuse Hotline at 1.800.422.4453.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hi, all, we have some exciting news to share. Paramount
Plus has turned Burden of Guilt into a docuseries. You
will get to meet the people involved, You'll hear from
the people who have never spoken before, and you get
to see where the story took place. We are so
proud and excited to share it with you. You can
(00:20):
stream it right now on Paramount Plus.
Speaker 2 (00:28):
After nine days in court, the State of Georgia versus
Jan Barry Sandlin for the murder of Matthew Goulder had
gone to the jury.
Speaker 3 (00:35):
Every juror in every criminal trial has the responsibility to
evaluate the evidence to make sure that the state has
proved the defendant's guilt beyond a reasonable doubts. So I
suspect that they were singularly focused on is there enough
evidence to demonstrate that Jan Barry Sandlin committed this crime?
Speaker 2 (00:59):
I'm Nancy glam and this is Burden of Guilt, Episode seven.
Are you kidding Me? After one day, on one night
the jury returned. Prosecutor Lie and Mangun didn't have any
idea which way the decision would go.
Speaker 3 (01:19):
There have been trials in the course of my life
where I thought I certainly had provided enough evidence to
demonstrate a defendant guilt and it was a not guilty verdict,
and then other ones that felt like a much closer
call that were a guilty verdict.
Speaker 4 (01:32):
Have you completed the verdict? Would you hand it to
the deputy and let him pass it to me?
Speaker 5 (01:36):
Please?
Speaker 4 (01:40):
This is a three count indict much. I'll read the
verdict on each of the three counts. Count one is
the malice murder count. The verdict of the jury. We
the jury found the defendant Jan Barry Sandlin not guilty
of count one.
Speaker 2 (01:55):
Lead Assistant District Attorney Jeff Brickman.
Speaker 6 (01:58):
When the verdict was rad count one malice murder, Jerry
found him not guilty.
Speaker 2 (02:04):
Malice murder, meaning that there was an intent to kill.
Speaker 6 (02:08):
My stomach dropped, Leanne's did everybody in our office? I
can assure you did. As a prosecutor. When count one
is not guilty, bad thoughts start happening.
Speaker 4 (02:18):
Count two is a fella in the murder. We the
jury find the defendant guilty of count two. Count three
is a fellow in the murder. Count We the jury
find the defendant guilty of Count three.
Speaker 2 (02:29):
Guilty with mandatory state sentencing guidelines. Judge Fuller went directly
to the next step.
Speaker 4 (02:36):
Council, what are your thoughts on sentence and of the states?
Speaker 5 (02:39):
Ready now if the court would let to proceed at this.
Speaker 2 (02:40):
Time, Defense counsel Krin Mall could not resist another chance
to show her disdain.
Speaker 5 (02:46):
You might as well the misery out of the way.
Speaker 2 (02:49):
You might as well get the misery out of the way.
If Karen thought it was misery, Racy Raquel thought it
was justice that was finally delivered for the vicious murder
of Matthew. It was the culmination of a decade's long
struggle with family secrets, a solitary search for answers, and
years of collecting evidence, and all this was due to
(03:12):
the work of one brave girl who never forgot her
baby brother.
Speaker 4 (03:18):
Saleh, You've been found guilty of two counts of fell
Any murder. Each of those two counts. Are are sent
you to life imprisonment.
Speaker 2 (03:29):
The court room was quiet. There were no eruptions. Len
Manguin describes the moment.
Speaker 3 (03:35):
It's hard because it's not a celebratory feeling when a
jury reaches a guilty verdict. I remember being glad for Tracy,
and glad for Kathy, and glad that the person who
was in my mind unquestionably responsible for Matthew's death, had
been found guilty.
Speaker 2 (03:53):
Local and national media covered the verdict. Tracy riquel wasn't
interested in notoriety. She didn't talk that day, but Kathy spoke.
Speaker 6 (04:02):
Kathy Allman says the trial has been emotionally draining, but
she finally feels relief after her ex husband's conviction.
Speaker 5 (04:09):
Yes, I'm most definite right, Ernie.
Speaker 7 (04:13):
He was on drugs at the time he beat me
for nine and a half years.
Speaker 5 (04:18):
That he's where he needs to be.
Speaker 1 (04:20):
Do you remember the moment you heard the judge say guilty.
Speaker 8 (04:24):
There was a huge sense of relief and validation.
Speaker 2 (04:29):
Knowing Tracy Riquela as I do now, I was unsurprised
when Leanne reached into her case file and pulled out
a card that she received after the trial. It's something
she's kept all these years and was happy to read
to us.
Speaker 3 (04:44):
Delianne, it has been more than a year since I
received that first phone call from you telling me you
would be handling this case. It was, after all worth it.
Good luck with your very bright future. I feel fortunate
to have known you. You helped me to heal and
to grow.
Speaker 5 (04:56):
Thank you.
Speaker 3 (04:57):
I will be telling my children about you best wishes,
Tracy Rain.
Speaker 2 (05:01):
Wouldn't it be nice if Jan Berry Sandlm was carted
off to prison and the story ended there well. Shortly
after Jan's conviction came the You've got to be kidding
me moment.
Speaker 8 (05:13):
After Jan's conviction, I got a phone call saying that
he'd been granted the new trial.
Speaker 9 (05:20):
In the motion for new trial, the defense attorney Corin
Mall said that she was incompetent.
Speaker 2 (05:28):
Listening to the trial. You could describe Carin in many ways,
but incompetent would not be one of them. Now, she
was saying, she provided Jan Barry Sanlm with ineffective assistance
of counsel. We told you that an autopsy had been
performed at the funeral home two days after Matthew died.
(05:50):
The autopsy was performed by doctor Robert Stivers. After Sandlm
was convicted, Doctor Stivers called public defender Malling why he
hadn't been contacted to testify during the trial. Even more puzzling,
why his calls to her directly during the trial had
been ignored. Stivers had taken photographs of Matthew with bruises
(06:14):
and stress fractures that he said indicated the death was
an accident. It was how he felt in nineteen seventy one,
and his feelings hadn't changed. Corin Male lobbied for a
new trial, saying she had failed her client by not
calling doctor Stivers to testify. Her excuse was that a
colleague told her that doctor Stivers was ill. Maybe that
(06:38):
was true, but Corin Maul struck everyone as someone who
would go to the ends of the earth for a client,
So it didn't really make sense.
Speaker 9 (06:48):
I know, miss mal she's a very good public defender,
and for her to say she was ineffective in that
second trial only because her client was found guilty of
a crime that he committed.
Speaker 2 (06:59):
Stivers had personal problems that derailed his career. Alcoholism lost
him his medical license. Could that be the reason he
wasn't previously called to testify? Did she view him as unreliable?
Speaker 9 (07:13):
Again? Judge Fuller granted.
Speaker 2 (07:15):
It, and that meant a third trial. The prosecutor's office
was flabbergasted. And as for Tracy Raquel.
Speaker 8 (07:24):
I just thought this is never going to end, like
we're just going to do this. I guess so okay,
And he had a new lawyer, and this lawyer had
taken the case because he wanted the publicity.
Speaker 2 (07:35):
Steve Sadau was a young, successful criminal defense attorney. He
took the case pro bono.
Speaker 10 (07:41):
The reason I got involved in the case is because
ego wise, I thought that I could try it better
than anyone else could, and if he stood any chance
to win, it would be with me.
Speaker 2 (07:52):
Decades later, Steve Sadao is still a force in Georgia.
Former President Donald Trump recently hired him to fight conspiration
charges associated with the twenty twenty election. This time there
was a new prosecution team, Ada Lawrence Delon opened with
this Matthew Stephen Golder laughed out loud for the first
(08:15):
time for his mother on December twenty seventh, nineteen seventy one.
Little did she know it would be his last. Defense
attorney Steve Saydau made his opening statement and immediately referenced
all the doubt the jury would confront no murder weapon,
no witness, no DNA. The jury would hear from doctor
(08:38):
Robert Stuivers, the medical examiner who had performed the autopsy
on Matthew just two days after he died.
Speaker 10 (08:45):
The state's case was clearly that Sandlin had done something.
I believe there was equal evidence based on his prior
statement to police that Tracy had, for whatever reason, accidentally
or otherwise pushed the baby out of the crew. That
doesn't make Tracy homicidal. It just means the incident or
(09:05):
event occurred.
Speaker 2 (09:07):
Steve Saido proved to be a thorough and well prepared attorney,
but Kathy seemed to get under his skin.
Speaker 10 (09:14):
Kathy was very emotional on the stand. I say this
with all due respect because I don't know her. She
played her part well.
Speaker 2 (09:22):
During the first two trials, Tracy Riquel had avoided any
direct contact with jan other than the threatening phone calls
he made to her home. This time was different.
Speaker 8 (09:33):
I was sitting on a bench outside the courtroom, and
I just happened to be sitting on the side that's
closest to where they bring the defend it out and out.
He came through the store to my right, and they
walked up to the elevator and pushed the button, and
he was kind of snickering and you know, happy as
(09:54):
can be. He didn't know it was there. I just
don't know what came over me. I stood up and
I stood there and as they stepped into the elevator.
They turned around, and I think all three of them
had a moment of shock. But he just looked like
a deer in headlights, which is not something I ever saw.
I just took two steps forward and just source stood there.
(10:16):
I didn't say anything, but it was kind of this
moment that yeah, I'm okay, I'm not afraid of you anymore.
Speaker 5 (10:24):
I mean, you never make the.
Speaker 8 (10:25):
Nightmares go away, but that person, you can't hurt me,
So I thought it was kind of a big moment
for me.
Speaker 2 (10:42):
Inside the courtroom, defense attorney Steve Saydau spent hours grilling
doctor Joe Burton. Still, no matter what the defense tried,
he was steadfast.
Speaker 11 (10:53):
I've never been certain about certain about a lot of things.
I do forensically, very few things, as a matter of fact,
But I'm as close to one hundred percent certain as
they could be that these fractures in this child, as
I see them, could not have occurred from falling out
of a bed onto a carpeted floor.
Speaker 2 (11:16):
The star witness for the defense was doctor Robert Stivers.
His absence from the first and second trials was the
reason for the third trial, and his appearance was not
without controversy. It was noted that he wasn't licensed at
the time of the trial. Nevertheless, he was accepted as
an expert witness by the court, and in his opinion,
(11:39):
Matthew's injuries had been the result of an accident. Tensions
were running high in the courthouse. While on a break,
Kathy let doctor Stivers know what she thought of his testimony.
Speaker 8 (11:53):
He went downstairs, you know, to leave the building for line,
and there were a few people in my family who,
you know, sort of gave him their two cents on
what he had said. And he came back to the
court room after lunch and told the judge and had
us all kicked out, so nobody was allowed in the
quirt room.
Speaker 2 (12:09):
The Kathy admitted to the judge she told doctor Stivers,
by God, you'll pay for what you've done. But now
Tracy Riquel couldn't be in the courtroom. She actually didn't
have to worry. Doctor Stivers was a witness, but not
a star. It wasn't smooth testimony, and it certainly didn't
rival the expert testimony of doctor Burton.
Speaker 10 (12:31):
The medical examiner's testimony was simply devastating, and we could
not overcome it. We didn't have an expert to do so,
couldn't find an expert to do so.
Speaker 2 (12:41):
Jan Berry Sandlin received a new trial, but was left
with the same outcome, guilty. He was convicted a second
time by a new jury.
Speaker 10 (12:51):
We could not find someone who would come in and
testify that the injuries were consistent with falling out of
a crew. The problem is finding an expert who's willing
to get on the witness stand and testify that under
these horrible circumstances this is a reasonable possibility and then
(13:16):
have to live with that as an expert. From that
point on.
Speaker 2 (13:18):
It also makes me wonder, why wouldn't anybody say that,
is it possible he couldn't have died from flying.
Speaker 12 (13:25):
Out of the crypt?
Speaker 10 (13:26):
Is certainly the state's position, and what the jury must
have ultimately believed is that they proved beyond a reasonable
doubt that it could not have happened the way Jan
Sandlin had previously said it did.
Speaker 2 (13:42):
District Attorney J.
Speaker 9 (13:43):
Tom Morgan, this case was not won or lost by
the attorneys, Mister sada Al, it's a great trial lawyer.
The jury looked at the evidence, and the evidence is
what convicted Jan Berry Sutlin.
Speaker 2 (13:58):
It was over. It was really over. In courtroom footage,
you can see Tracy Roquel seated near Cathy for the verdict.
After it was read, her head disappeared into her lap.
Cathy tried to comfort her and for a moment they
shared an embrace. But then you see Tracy Raquel slide
down the bench. It was like she suddenly remembered something
(14:22):
she couldn't trust that hug and the courtroom started to
empty out and in the footage you can also see
that jan Berry Sandlin had lost the swagger of the
first two trials and looked small. He stopped trying to
make eye contact with everyone and seemed intent on leaving
as quickly as he could. This wasn't fun for him anymore.
(14:42):
Tracy Raquel had a chief Justice for Matthew a second time,
but her work wasn't done. The feeling of relief was fleeting.
There were two other people Tracy Roquel had been thinking
about for years. They were close to her heart, and
although she had never met either of them, she felt
(15:02):
intimately connected to both. Tracy Riquel believes they both could
have been killed by her father. Neither one of them
has received the attention that Matthew's case has. One was
a police officer. I'll tell you about him in a bit.
The other was Jan's first wife, nineteen year old Nancy Tigeter.
Like Kathy, she was a teenager who fell for Jan
(15:25):
before she realized he was a violent man. Jan married
Nancy but was seeing Kathy on the side. Then Nancy
supposedly committed suicide by shooting herself in the abdomen. She
was pregnant with another man's baby at the time. We
met her best friend from high school at Jackie Wilson.
She had first hand knowledge of their relationship.
Speaker 12 (15:49):
Jan was abusive to her when they were in the
apartment when it was just her and him. And I
only know that because that's what she'd say. She said, No,
I can't. Jan wouldn't be tail out of me. What
way he'd hit her, I don't know. There was a
couple of times she had bruises on her face.
Speaker 2 (16:04):
According to Jackie, the night Nancy killed herself, she was
meeting with Jan to try and work out their differences.
Speaker 12 (16:11):
Nancy just thought that because she'd had Jaybird, she was
supposed to make it work.
Speaker 2 (16:19):
J Bird was Jay Salmon. Nancy and Jan's son.
Speaker 12 (16:23):
Jaybird is what his mommy called hi, but it's what
I'm called him since the day was born.
Speaker 2 (16:28):
Jackie Wilson was supposed to meet Nancy the morning after
she died.
Speaker 12 (16:33):
I went over to pick her up to go and
found out she wasn't here anymore.
Speaker 2 (16:39):
Jackie was pretty straightforward about her feelings about Jan.
Speaker 12 (16:45):
The reality was I wasn't there, so all I could
do was say, I don't want them around, and I
don't wanting around Jaybird either, And mister miss Tagatter told
me that they did not want Jay to dislike or
his father.
Speaker 2 (17:01):
In the conversation Tracy Raquel taped with Kathy, the topic
of Jan's first wife, Nancy, had surfaced. You heard this
in episode three, and the District Attorney's office also became
aware of the conversation when it happened.
Speaker 5 (17:16):
But you don't think he was responsible for killing her?
Speaker 7 (17:20):
Yes?
Speaker 2 (17:21):
I do.
Speaker 5 (17:22):
Do you mean you actually think he pulled the trigger.
Speaker 12 (17:26):
I don't know if he actually pulled the trigger or
if he talked her into pulling the trigger, but I
think either way he's responsible. Jan Sandlin, in my book,
either killed her himself or.
Speaker 11 (17:41):
Cost to happen.
Speaker 12 (17:44):
Just in my life, he was the last person that
actually saw her.
Speaker 2 (17:52):
Medical examiner doctor Joe Burton, was interested in investigating the case.
There was some suspicion aspects to her suicide. A sheet
was wrapped around her after she died. She had shot
herself in the abdomen. Investigator Jim Maybe found that very odd.
Speaker 7 (18:12):
Well, someone wants to commit suicide, they want no pain involved.
To shoot yourself in the abdomen. You might not die,
you might just sit there and suffer. That bothered me
my experience as a forensic death destigator. Of all the
cases that I've worked, which is over five thousand cases,
I've never had a woman sheet herself in the abdomen,
(18:35):
especially pregnant.
Speaker 2 (18:37):
And the suicide note didn't ring true.
Speaker 8 (18:40):
The suicide note was inconsistent, lots of misspellings, according to
her family, not consistent with who she was.
Speaker 2 (18:49):
While doctor Burton and Decab County were prepared to take
another look at Nancy's death, they ran into a wall.
Tercy Riquel explains.
Speaker 8 (18:58):
Nancy Taggert's family absolutely had an opportunity to reopen that
case after Matthew's case and her son my half brother.
He really wanted that and the family absolutely did not
want that. They didn't want to talk about it, and
because he loved them and was so close to them,
(19:20):
he just shut it down.
Speaker 2 (19:21):
The thought of recreating the crime scene and possibly exhuming
her body it was just too much for her parents.
People grieve in different ways, but Jan did not appear
to mourn the loss of his first wife, Nancy.
Speaker 8 (19:35):
He literally moved in with Kathy and Matthew and I
Right after that.
Speaker 2 (19:42):
Jan and Nancy's son Jay, respected his grandparents' wishes. They
were more like his parents. They had raised him. He
loved them. Now that they have passed, he would be
open to someone looking into his mother's death again. But
the team that was willing to do that twenty five
years ago is long go. But Tracy Raquel has not forgotten.
(20:03):
Let me talk to you about William David Corn. Okay,
William David Korn was a police officer who was shot
to death. His case was never solved, you wrote on
a Fallen Officer website. Officer William David Korn has been
linked to my soul, along with Matthew Golder and Nancy
Tegetter for forty two years. I spent nearly thirty years
(20:27):
fighting for justice for all three, but I was only
able to find it for Matthew. There's a connection between
them all. I'm sorry for the pain and unanswered questions
that Officer Korn's family still has. I was only two
years old when Officer William David Corn was killed. I
never knew him, but I've always loved him and always
(20:48):
will Signed Tracy Golder, someone who knows, and you wrote
that in twenty thirteen.
Speaker 8 (20:55):
My life growing up as a child, Kathy. You know,
there's very specific things that she has said, and that's her.
Speaker 5 (21:03):
Story, like it's never changed.
Speaker 8 (21:06):
Kathy always said that Jan was responsible for Nancy's death
because he came home to her that night.
Speaker 5 (21:14):
So I knew about Nancy Tageer like very very young.
Speaker 8 (21:18):
And then the other thing that Kathy would always say
is yeah, he also killed that police officer.
Speaker 2 (21:31):
You may remember, I went to speak with Kathy Ahman
to see what she had to say.
Speaker 7 (21:36):
I really can't get drawn into Tracy's fantasies anymore.
Speaker 5 (21:41):
She has been lying in torturing me for thirty years.
Speaker 12 (21:44):
I can't take it anymore.
Speaker 1 (21:45):
What do you mean, Kathy? What is she lying about.
Speaker 2 (21:49):
Everything that police Officer William David Korn was only twenty
four years old when he was shot through the heart
while moonlighting at an apartment complex as a security guard
in the evening. The Decab police chief thought he had
surprised some burglars in the clubhouse, but nothing was taken.
Speaker 7 (22:08):
Officer Corn was shot multiple times with his own handgun.
Speaker 2 (22:12):
Investigator Jim Maybe was also interested in the case.
Speaker 7 (22:17):
Before I came to the medical Examiner's office, I'd been
assigned a cold case file where a police officer had
been killed about the time that her baby brother had
been killed. And one of the people that I came
across who became a person of interest in that police
officer death was being salein.
Speaker 2 (22:36):
Although he died from a shot to the heart, the
killer shot him in the head after he was already dead.
Nobody really knows what the connection was between Jan Barry
Sandlin and William David Korn, but for Jim Maybe.
Speaker 8 (22:51):
Jim Maybe was very certain that Jan was a suspect.
In fact, he was assigned to that case.
Speaker 7 (23:00):
Me and my partner, you know, we started looking into it.
Speaker 5 (23:03):
Jim Maybe and I have talked about it over the years.
Speaker 8 (23:06):
He would warn me into the late nineties, into the
early two thousands, that this was too dangerous of a
subject to get into because it suspected that it had
to do with Dixie Mafia, because Jan was part of
that organization.
Speaker 5 (23:24):
I didn't even know who the Dixie Mafia was.
Speaker 2 (23:27):
Tracy Riquel's first husband had a relative in law enforcement,
and he gave her some information.
Speaker 8 (23:34):
His uncle was FBI and had done some looking into Jan.
He worked for the FBI for thirty years in organized crime,
so you knew all about how they worked and functioned.
Speaker 2 (23:45):
Tracy Riquel learned that the Dixie Mafia was an organized
crime group engaged in a laundry list of crimes including
illegal gambling, drug trafficking, prostitution, robbery, murder, arson, extortion, and fraud.
Their preferred method of murder was shooting, and sometimes local
police and politicians were mixed up in their ranks. Jim
(24:09):
Mape was set on questioning Jan Berry Sandlin about Officer
Korn's murder. Sandlan was already serving time in Florida for
the armed robbery conviction.
Speaker 7 (24:20):
We wanted to go to Florida and talk to him,
but we got it all together. Came in the next morning,
told Colonel what are Florida? He said, no, you're not. Huh.
He says, no, you're not. Why didn't he make sense?
We waited around, waited around. Captain never came and asked
us why we were going to first place? So you
(24:42):
could take it from there.
Speaker 2 (24:45):
Hundreds of police officers lined the streets for Officer Korn's funeral.
Governor Jimmy Carter donated state money for a reward leading
to information that would lead to the killer. Tracy Raquel
grew up feeling there were two people in her household
who knew what happened to Officer Korn. Kathy openly spoke
(25:06):
of the incident.
Speaker 8 (25:07):
She would say, he killed that police officer and then
we drove to Alabama and through the gun in a lake.
Speaker 2 (25:13):
Jan is still alive, still in prison, still aware. Since
the podcast started, Tracy Riquel has received a threat.
Speaker 8 (25:21):
The threat that I received was basically, if anything happens
to Jan, We're gonna set you on fire, watch you burn.
Speaker 2 (25:29):
What could Jan be worried about? Maybe knowing what Tracy
Riquel did for Matthew has made him realize she never
gives up and he may be held to account again.
On the next Burden of Guilt, I sit down with
Tracy Raquel, and we share some stories that are jaw dropping,
(25:54):
some things that we haven't talked about before.
Speaker 8 (25:57):
I remember Leanne and just calling me and saying, you're
not going to believe this.
Speaker 12 (26:05):
They got married, ladies and gentle when I present to you,
mister and missus Jane sadly.
Speaker 2 (26:13):
That's next time on Burden of Guilt. Stay tuned for
Burden of Guilt at documentary coming in twenty twenty four
and airing only on Paramount Plus. If you would like
to reach out to the Burden of Guilt team, email
us at Burden of guiltpod at gmail dot com. That's
(26:33):
Burden of Guilt pod at gmail dot com. If you
or someone you know is worried about maltreatment or suspect
that a child is being abused or neglected, call the
Child Help National Child Abuse Hotline. You can call or
text one eight hundred four a child. That's one eight
(26:55):
hundred four two two four four five three. One way
to show support is by subscribing to our show on
Apple Podcasts, and don't forget to rate and review Burden
of Guilt. Five star reviews go a long way. A
big thank you for listening, and also be sure to
(27:15):
check us out and follow us on Instagram at Glass Podcasts.
Burden of Guilt is a production of Glass Podcasts, a
division of Glass Entertainment Group, in partnership with iHeart Podcasts.
The show is hosted and executive produced by me Nancy Glass,
written and produced by Carrie Hartman and Andrea Gunning. Also
(27:37):
produced by Ben Fetterman, Lauren Murphy and associate producer Kristin Melchiori.
Our iHeart team is Ali Perry and Jessica Crincheck. Special
thanks to Tracy Riquel Burns and her husband Bart. Voice
acting in this episode was performed by Trey Morgan. Audio
editing and mixing by Matt Delvecchio. Burden of Guilt's theme
(27:59):
composed by Oliver Baines. Music library provided by my Music
and For more podcasts from iHeart, visit the iHeartRadio app,
Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts,
Hi, all, we have some exciting news to share. Paramount
Plus has turned Burden of Guilt into a docuseries. You
will get to meet the people involved, You'll hear from
the people who have never spoken before, and you get
to see where the story took place. We are so
proud and excited to share it with you. You can
(00:20):
stream it right now on Paramount Plus.
Speaker 2 (00:28):
After nine days in court, the State of Georgia versus
Jan Barry Sandlin for the murder of Matthew Goulder had
gone to the jury.
Speaker 3 (00:35):
Every juror in every criminal trial has the responsibility to
evaluate the evidence to make sure that the state has
proved the defendant's guilt beyond a reasonable doubts. So I
suspect that they were singularly focused on is there enough
evidence to demonstrate that Jan Barry Sandlin committed this crime?
Speaker 2 (00:59):
I'm Nancy glam and this is Burden of Guilt, Episode seven.
Are you kidding Me? After one day, on one night
the jury returned. Prosecutor Lie and Mangun didn't have any
idea which way the decision would go.
Speaker 3 (01:19):
There have been trials in the course of my life
where I thought I certainly had provided enough evidence to
demonstrate a defendant guilt and it was a not guilty verdict,
and then other ones that felt like a much closer
call that were a guilty verdict.
Speaker 4 (01:32):
Have you completed the verdict? Would you hand it to
the deputy and let him pass it to me?
Speaker 5 (01:36):
Please?
Speaker 4 (01:40):
This is a three count indict much. I'll read the
verdict on each of the three counts. Count one is
the malice murder count. The verdict of the jury. We
the jury found the defendant Jan Barry Sandlin not guilty
of count one.
Speaker 2 (01:55):
Lead Assistant District Attorney Jeff Brickman.
Speaker 6 (01:58):
When the verdict was rad count one malice murder, Jerry
found him not guilty.
Speaker 2 (02:04):
Malice murder, meaning that there was an intent to kill.
Speaker 6 (02:08):
My stomach dropped, Leanne's did everybody in our office? I
can assure you did. As a prosecutor. When count one
is not guilty, bad thoughts start happening.
Speaker 4 (02:18):
Count two is a fella in the murder. We the
jury find the defendant guilty of count two. Count three
is a fellow in the murder. Count We the jury
find the defendant guilty of Count three.
Speaker 2 (02:29):
Guilty with mandatory state sentencing guidelines. Judge Fuller went directly
to the next step.
Speaker 4 (02:36):
Council, what are your thoughts on sentence and of the states?
Speaker 5 (02:39):
Ready now if the court would let to proceed at this.
Speaker 2 (02:40):
Time, Defense counsel Krin Mall could not resist another chance
to show her disdain.
Speaker 5 (02:46):
You might as well the misery out of the way.
Speaker 2 (02:49):
You might as well get the misery out of the way.
If Karen thought it was misery, Racy Raquel thought it
was justice that was finally delivered for the vicious murder
of Matthew. It was the culmination of a decade's long
struggle with family secrets, a solitary search for answers, and
years of collecting evidence, and all this was due to
(03:12):
the work of one brave girl who never forgot her
baby brother.
Speaker 4 (03:18):
Saleh, You've been found guilty of two counts of fell
Any murder. Each of those two counts. Are are sent
you to life imprisonment.
Speaker 2 (03:29):
The court room was quiet. There were no eruptions. Len
Manguin describes the moment.
Speaker 3 (03:35):
It's hard because it's not a celebratory feeling when a
jury reaches a guilty verdict. I remember being glad for Tracy,
and glad for Kathy, and glad that the person who
was in my mind unquestionably responsible for Matthew's death, had
been found guilty.
Speaker 2 (03:53):
Local and national media covered the verdict. Tracy riquel wasn't
interested in notoriety. She didn't talk that day, but Kathy spoke.
Speaker 6 (04:02):
Kathy Allman says the trial has been emotionally draining, but
she finally feels relief after her ex husband's conviction.
Speaker 5 (04:09):
Yes, I'm most definite right, Ernie.
Speaker 7 (04:13):
He was on drugs at the time he beat me
for nine and a half years.
Speaker 5 (04:18):
That he's where he needs to be.
Speaker 1 (04:20):
Do you remember the moment you heard the judge say guilty.
Speaker 8 (04:24):
There was a huge sense of relief and validation.
Speaker 2 (04:29):
Knowing Tracy Riquela as I do now, I was unsurprised
when Leanne reached into her case file and pulled out
a card that she received after the trial. It's something
she's kept all these years and was happy to read
to us.
Speaker 3 (04:44):
Delianne, it has been more than a year since I
received that first phone call from you telling me you
would be handling this case. It was, after all worth it.
Good luck with your very bright future. I feel fortunate
to have known you. You helped me to heal and
to grow.
Speaker 5 (04:56):
Thank you.
Speaker 3 (04:57):
I will be telling my children about you best wishes,
Tracy Rain.
Speaker 2 (05:01):
Wouldn't it be nice if Jan Berry Sandlm was carted
off to prison and the story ended there well. Shortly
after Jan's conviction came the You've got to be kidding
me moment.
Speaker 8 (05:13):
After Jan's conviction, I got a phone call saying that
he'd been granted the new trial.
Speaker 9 (05:20):
In the motion for new trial, the defense attorney Corin
Mall said that she was incompetent.
Speaker 2 (05:28):
Listening to the trial. You could describe Carin in many ways,
but incompetent would not be one of them. Now, she
was saying, she provided Jan Barry Sanlm with ineffective assistance
of counsel. We told you that an autopsy had been
performed at the funeral home two days after Matthew died.
(05:50):
The autopsy was performed by doctor Robert Stivers. After Sandlm
was convicted, Doctor Stivers called public defender Malling why he
hadn't been contacted to testify during the trial. Even more puzzling,
why his calls to her directly during the trial had
been ignored. Stivers had taken photographs of Matthew with bruises
(06:14):
and stress fractures that he said indicated the death was
an accident. It was how he felt in nineteen seventy one,
and his feelings hadn't changed. Corin Male lobbied for a
new trial, saying she had failed her client by not
calling doctor Stivers to testify. Her excuse was that a
colleague told her that doctor Stivers was ill. Maybe that
(06:38):
was true, but Corin Maul struck everyone as someone who
would go to the ends of the earth for a client,
So it didn't really make sense.
Speaker 9 (06:48):
I know, miss mal she's a very good public defender,
and for her to say she was ineffective in that
second trial only because her client was found guilty of
a crime that he committed.
Speaker 2 (06:59):
Stivers had personal problems that derailed his career. Alcoholism lost
him his medical license. Could that be the reason he
wasn't previously called to testify? Did she view him as unreliable?
Speaker 9 (07:13):
Again? Judge Fuller granted.
Speaker 2 (07:15):
It, and that meant a third trial. The prosecutor's office
was flabbergasted. And as for Tracy Raquel.
Speaker 8 (07:24):
I just thought this is never going to end, like
we're just going to do this. I guess so okay,
And he had a new lawyer, and this lawyer had
taken the case because he wanted the publicity.
Speaker 2 (07:35):
Steve Sadau was a young, successful criminal defense attorney. He
took the case pro bono.
Speaker 10 (07:41):
The reason I got involved in the case is because
ego wise, I thought that I could try it better
than anyone else could, and if he stood any chance
to win, it would be with me.
Speaker 2 (07:52):
Decades later, Steve Sadao is still a force in Georgia.
Former President Donald Trump recently hired him to fight conspiration
charges associated with the twenty twenty election. This time there
was a new prosecution team, Ada Lawrence Delon opened with
this Matthew Stephen Golder laughed out loud for the first
(08:15):
time for his mother on December twenty seventh, nineteen seventy one.
Little did she know it would be his last. Defense
attorney Steve Saydau made his opening statement and immediately referenced
all the doubt the jury would confront no murder weapon,
no witness, no DNA. The jury would hear from doctor
(08:38):
Robert Stuivers, the medical examiner who had performed the autopsy
on Matthew just two days after he died.
Speaker 10 (08:45):
The state's case was clearly that Sandlin had done something.
I believe there was equal evidence based on his prior
statement to police that Tracy had, for whatever reason, accidentally
or otherwise pushed the baby out of the crew. That
doesn't make Tracy homicidal. It just means the incident or
(09:05):
event occurred.
Speaker 2 (09:07):
Steve Saido proved to be a thorough and well prepared attorney,
but Kathy seemed to get under his skin.
Speaker 10 (09:14):
Kathy was very emotional on the stand. I say this
with all due respect because I don't know her. She
played her part well.
Speaker 2 (09:22):
During the first two trials, Tracy Riquel had avoided any
direct contact with jan other than the threatening phone calls
he made to her home. This time was different.
Speaker 8 (09:33):
I was sitting on a bench outside the courtroom, and
I just happened to be sitting on the side that's
closest to where they bring the defend it out and out.
He came through the store to my right, and they
walked up to the elevator and pushed the button, and
he was kind of snickering and you know, happy as
(09:54):
can be. He didn't know it was there. I just
don't know what came over me. I stood up and
I stood there and as they stepped into the elevator.
They turned around, and I think all three of them
had a moment of shock. But he just looked like
a deer in headlights, which is not something I ever saw.
I just took two steps forward and just source stood there.
(10:16):
I didn't say anything, but it was kind of this
moment that yeah, I'm okay, I'm not afraid of you anymore.
Speaker 5 (10:24):
I mean, you never make the.
Speaker 8 (10:25):
Nightmares go away, but that person, you can't hurt me,
So I thought it was kind of a big moment
for me.
Speaker 2 (10:42):
Inside the courtroom, defense attorney Steve Saydau spent hours grilling
doctor Joe Burton. Still, no matter what the defense tried,
he was steadfast.
Speaker 11 (10:53):
I've never been certain about certain about a lot of things.
I do forensically, very few things, as a matter of fact,
But I'm as close to one hundred percent certain as
they could be that these fractures in this child, as
I see them, could not have occurred from falling out
of a bed onto a carpeted floor.
Speaker 2 (11:16):
The star witness for the defense was doctor Robert Stivers.
His absence from the first and second trials was the
reason for the third trial, and his appearance was not
without controversy. It was noted that he wasn't licensed at
the time of the trial. Nevertheless, he was accepted as
an expert witness by the court, and in his opinion,
(11:39):
Matthew's injuries had been the result of an accident. Tensions
were running high in the courthouse. While on a break,
Kathy let doctor Stivers know what she thought of his testimony.
Speaker 8 (11:53):
He went downstairs, you know, to leave the building for line,
and there were a few people in my family who,
you know, sort of gave him their two cents on
what he had said. And he came back to the
court room after lunch and told the judge and had
us all kicked out, so nobody was allowed in the
quirt room.
Speaker 2 (12:09):
The Kathy admitted to the judge she told doctor Stivers,
by God, you'll pay for what you've done. But now
Tracy Riquel couldn't be in the courtroom. She actually didn't
have to worry. Doctor Stivers was a witness, but not
a star. It wasn't smooth testimony, and it certainly didn't
rival the expert testimony of doctor Burton.
Speaker 10 (12:31):
The medical examiner's testimony was simply devastating, and we could
not overcome it. We didn't have an expert to do so,
couldn't find an expert to do so.
Speaker 2 (12:41):
Jan Berry Sandlin received a new trial, but was left
with the same outcome, guilty. He was convicted a second
time by a new jury.
Speaker 10 (12:51):
We could not find someone who would come in and
testify that the injuries were consistent with falling out of
a crew. The problem is finding an expert who's willing
to get on the witness stand and testify that under
these horrible circumstances this is a reasonable possibility and then
(13:16):
have to live with that as an expert. From that
point on.
Speaker 2 (13:18):
It also makes me wonder, why wouldn't anybody say that,
is it possible he couldn't have died from flying.
Speaker 12 (13:25):
Out of the crypt?
Speaker 10 (13:26):
Is certainly the state's position, and what the jury must
have ultimately believed is that they proved beyond a reasonable
doubt that it could not have happened the way Jan
Sandlin had previously said it did.
Speaker 2 (13:42):
District Attorney J.
Speaker 9 (13:43):
Tom Morgan, this case was not won or lost by
the attorneys, Mister sada Al, it's a great trial lawyer.
The jury looked at the evidence, and the evidence is
what convicted Jan Berry Sutlin.
Speaker 2 (13:58):
It was over. It was really over. In courtroom footage,
you can see Tracy Roquel seated near Cathy for the verdict.
After it was read, her head disappeared into her lap.
Cathy tried to comfort her and for a moment they
shared an embrace. But then you see Tracy Raquel slide
down the bench. It was like she suddenly remembered something
(14:22):
she couldn't trust that hug and the courtroom started to
empty out and in the footage you can also see
that jan Berry Sandlin had lost the swagger of the
first two trials and looked small. He stopped trying to
make eye contact with everyone and seemed intent on leaving
as quickly as he could. This wasn't fun for him anymore.
(14:42):
Tracy Raquel had a chief Justice for Matthew a second time,
but her work wasn't done. The feeling of relief was fleeting.
There were two other people Tracy Roquel had been thinking
about for years. They were close to her heart, and
although she had never met either of them, she felt
(15:02):
intimately connected to both. Tracy Riquel believes they both could
have been killed by her father. Neither one of them
has received the attention that Matthew's case has. One was
a police officer. I'll tell you about him in a bit.
The other was Jan's first wife, nineteen year old Nancy Tigeter.
Like Kathy, she was a teenager who fell for Jan
(15:25):
before she realized he was a violent man. Jan married
Nancy but was seeing Kathy on the side. Then Nancy
supposedly committed suicide by shooting herself in the abdomen. She
was pregnant with another man's baby at the time. We
met her best friend from high school at Jackie Wilson.
She had first hand knowledge of their relationship.
Speaker 12 (15:49):
Jan was abusive to her when they were in the
apartment when it was just her and him. And I
only know that because that's what she'd say. She said, No,
I can't. Jan wouldn't be tail out of me. What
way he'd hit her, I don't know. There was a
couple of times she had bruises on her face.
Speaker 2 (16:04):
According to Jackie, the night Nancy killed herself, she was
meeting with Jan to try and work out their differences.
Speaker 12 (16:11):
Nancy just thought that because she'd had Jaybird, she was
supposed to make it work.
Speaker 2 (16:19):
J Bird was Jay Salmon. Nancy and Jan's son.
Speaker 12 (16:23):
Jaybird is what his mommy called hi, but it's what
I'm called him since the day was born.
Speaker 2 (16:28):
Jackie Wilson was supposed to meet Nancy the morning after
she died.
Speaker 12 (16:33):
I went over to pick her up to go and
found out she wasn't here anymore.
Speaker 2 (16:39):
Jackie was pretty straightforward about her feelings about Jan.
Speaker 12 (16:45):
The reality was I wasn't there, so all I could
do was say, I don't want them around, and I
don't wanting around Jaybird either, And mister miss Tagatter told
me that they did not want Jay to dislike or
his father.
Speaker 2 (17:01):
In the conversation Tracy Raquel taped with Kathy, the topic
of Jan's first wife, Nancy, had surfaced. You heard this
in episode three, and the District Attorney's office also became
aware of the conversation when it happened.
Speaker 5 (17:16):
But you don't think he was responsible for killing her?
Speaker 7 (17:20):
Yes?
Speaker 2 (17:21):
I do.
Speaker 5 (17:22):
Do you mean you actually think he pulled the trigger.
Speaker 12 (17:26):
I don't know if he actually pulled the trigger or
if he talked her into pulling the trigger, but I
think either way he's responsible. Jan Sandlin, in my book,
either killed her himself or.
Speaker 11 (17:41):
Cost to happen.
Speaker 12 (17:44):
Just in my life, he was the last person that
actually saw her.
Speaker 2 (17:52):
Medical examiner doctor Joe Burton, was interested in investigating the case.
There was some suspicion aspects to her suicide. A sheet
was wrapped around her after she died. She had shot
herself in the abdomen. Investigator Jim Maybe found that very odd.
Speaker 7 (18:12):
Well, someone wants to commit suicide, they want no pain involved.
To shoot yourself in the abdomen. You might not die,
you might just sit there and suffer. That bothered me
my experience as a forensic death destigator. Of all the
cases that I've worked, which is over five thousand cases,
I've never had a woman sheet herself in the abdomen,
(18:35):
especially pregnant.
Speaker 2 (18:37):
And the suicide note didn't ring true.
Speaker 8 (18:40):
The suicide note was inconsistent, lots of misspellings, according to
her family, not consistent with who she was.
Speaker 2 (18:49):
While doctor Burton and Decab County were prepared to take
another look at Nancy's death, they ran into a wall.
Tercy Riquel explains.
Speaker 8 (18:58):
Nancy Taggert's family absolutely had an opportunity to reopen that
case after Matthew's case and her son my half brother.
He really wanted that and the family absolutely did not
want that. They didn't want to talk about it, and
because he loved them and was so close to them,
(19:20):
he just shut it down.
Speaker 2 (19:21):
The thought of recreating the crime scene and possibly exhuming
her body it was just too much for her parents.
People grieve in different ways, but Jan did not appear
to mourn the loss of his first wife, Nancy.
Speaker 8 (19:35):
He literally moved in with Kathy and Matthew and I
Right after that.
Speaker 2 (19:42):
Jan and Nancy's son Jay, respected his grandparents' wishes. They
were more like his parents. They had raised him. He
loved them. Now that they have passed, he would be
open to someone looking into his mother's death again. But
the team that was willing to do that twenty five
years ago is long go. But Tracy Raquel has not forgotten.
(20:03):
Let me talk to you about William David Corn. Okay,
William David Korn was a police officer who was shot
to death. His case was never solved, you wrote on
a Fallen Officer website. Officer William David Korn has been
linked to my soul, along with Matthew Golder and Nancy
Tegetter for forty two years. I spent nearly thirty years
(20:27):
fighting for justice for all three, but I was only
able to find it for Matthew. There's a connection between
them all. I'm sorry for the pain and unanswered questions
that Officer Korn's family still has. I was only two
years old when Officer William David Corn was killed. I
never knew him, but I've always loved him and always
(20:48):
will Signed Tracy Golder, someone who knows, and you wrote
that in twenty thirteen.
Speaker 8 (20:55):
My life growing up as a child, Kathy. You know,
there's very specific things that she has said, and that's her.
Speaker 5 (21:03):
Story, like it's never changed.
Speaker 8 (21:06):
Kathy always said that Jan was responsible for Nancy's death
because he came home to her that night.
Speaker 5 (21:14):
So I knew about Nancy Tageer like very very young.
Speaker 8 (21:18):
And then the other thing that Kathy would always say
is yeah, he also killed that police officer.
Speaker 2 (21:31):
You may remember, I went to speak with Kathy Ahman
to see what she had to say.
Speaker 7 (21:36):
I really can't get drawn into Tracy's fantasies anymore.
Speaker 5 (21:41):
She has been lying in torturing me for thirty years.
Speaker 12 (21:44):
I can't take it anymore.
Speaker 1 (21:45):
What do you mean, Kathy? What is she lying about.
Speaker 2 (21:49):
Everything that police Officer William David Korn was only twenty
four years old when he was shot through the heart
while moonlighting at an apartment complex as a security guard
in the evening. The Decab police chief thought he had
surprised some burglars in the clubhouse, but nothing was taken.
Speaker 7 (22:08):
Officer Corn was shot multiple times with his own handgun.
Speaker 2 (22:12):
Investigator Jim Maybe was also interested in the case.
Speaker 7 (22:17):
Before I came to the medical Examiner's office, I'd been
assigned a cold case file where a police officer had
been killed about the time that her baby brother had
been killed. And one of the people that I came
across who became a person of interest in that police
officer death was being salein.
Speaker 2 (22:36):
Although he died from a shot to the heart, the
killer shot him in the head after he was already dead.
Nobody really knows what the connection was between Jan Barry
Sandlin and William David Korn, but for Jim Maybe.
Speaker 8 (22:51):
Jim Maybe was very certain that Jan was a suspect.
In fact, he was assigned to that case.
Speaker 7 (23:00):
Me and my partner, you know, we started looking into it.
Speaker 5 (23:03):
Jim Maybe and I have talked about it over the years.
Speaker 8 (23:06):
He would warn me into the late nineties, into the
early two thousands, that this was too dangerous of a
subject to get into because it suspected that it had
to do with Dixie Mafia, because Jan was part of
that organization.
Speaker 5 (23:24):
I didn't even know who the Dixie Mafia was.
Speaker 2 (23:27):
Tracy Riquel's first husband had a relative in law enforcement,
and he gave her some information.
Speaker 8 (23:34):
His uncle was FBI and had done some looking into Jan.
He worked for the FBI for thirty years in organized crime,
so you knew all about how they worked and functioned.
Speaker 2 (23:45):
Tracy Riquel learned that the Dixie Mafia was an organized
crime group engaged in a laundry list of crimes including
illegal gambling, drug trafficking, prostitution, robbery, murder, arson, extortion, and fraud.
Their preferred method of murder was shooting, and sometimes local
police and politicians were mixed up in their ranks. Jim
(24:09):
Mape was set on questioning Jan Berry Sandlin about Officer
Korn's murder. Sandlan was already serving time in Florida for
the armed robbery conviction.
Speaker 7 (24:20):
We wanted to go to Florida and talk to him,
but we got it all together. Came in the next morning,
told Colonel what are Florida? He said, no, you're not. Huh.
He says, no, you're not. Why didn't he make sense?
We waited around, waited around. Captain never came and asked
us why we were going to first place? So you
(24:42):
could take it from there.
Speaker 2 (24:45):
Hundreds of police officers lined the streets for Officer Korn's funeral.
Governor Jimmy Carter donated state money for a reward leading
to information that would lead to the killer. Tracy Raquel
grew up feeling there were two people in her household
who knew what happened to Officer Korn. Kathy openly spoke
(25:06):
of the incident.
Speaker 8 (25:07):
She would say, he killed that police officer and then
we drove to Alabama and through the gun in a lake.
Speaker 2 (25:13):
Jan is still alive, still in prison, still aware. Since
the podcast started, Tracy Riquel has received a threat.
Speaker 8 (25:21):
The threat that I received was basically, if anything happens
to Jan, We're gonna set you on fire, watch you burn.
Speaker 2 (25:29):
What could Jan be worried about? Maybe knowing what Tracy
Riquel did for Matthew has made him realize she never
gives up and he may be held to account again.
On the next Burden of Guilt, I sit down with
Tracy Raquel, and we share some stories that are jaw dropping,
(25:54):
some things that we haven't talked about before.
Speaker 8 (25:57):
I remember Leanne and just calling me and saying, you're
not going to believe this.
Speaker 12 (26:05):
They got married, ladies and gentle when I present to you,
mister and missus Jane sadly.
Speaker 2 (26:13):
That's next time on Burden of Guilt. Stay tuned for
Burden of Guilt at documentary coming in twenty twenty four
and airing only on Paramount Plus. If you would like
to reach out to the Burden of Guilt team, email
us at Burden of guiltpod at gmail dot com. That's
(26:33):
Burden of Guilt pod at gmail dot com. If you
or someone you know is worried about maltreatment or suspect
that a child is being abused or neglected, call the
Child Help National Child Abuse Hotline. You can call or
text one eight hundred four a child. That's one eight
(26:55):
hundred four two two four four five three. One way
to show support is by subscribing to our show on
Apple Podcasts, and don't forget to rate and review Burden
of Guilt. Five star reviews go a long way. A
big thank you for listening, and also be sure to
(27:15):
check us out and follow us on Instagram at Glass Podcasts.
Burden of Guilt is a production of Glass Podcasts, a
division of Glass Entertainment Group, in partnership with iHeart Podcasts.
The show is hosted and executive produced by me Nancy Glass,
written and produced by Carrie Hartman and Andrea Gunning. Also
(27:37):
produced by Ben Fetterman, Lauren Murphy and associate producer Kristin Melchiori.
Our iHeart team is Ali Perry and Jessica Crincheck. Special
thanks to Tracy Riquel Burns and her husband Bart. Voice
acting in this episode was performed by Trey Morgan. Audio
editing and mixing by Matt Delvecchio. Burden of Guilt's theme
(27:59):
composed by Oliver Baines. Music library provided by my Music
and For more podcasts from iHeart, visit the iHeartRadio app,
Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts,
Host
Nancy Glass
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