January 13, 2025 • 52 mins
She’s a mom of two, gorgeous supermodel, and has an acting resume that’s just as impressive as her latest memoir. Brooke Shields joins Jess to discuss what it’s really like getting older as a female in Hollywood and why the industry is in a league of its own.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hello, call it Crude.
Speaker 2 (00:01):
Camila and I are devastated by the fires and are
heart broken by the tragedy and the loss that Southern
California is currently experiencing.
Speaker 3 (00:10):
This episode was recorded before the fires here in Los Angeles,
and we will be dedicating a future episode to talk
all about it.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
Call It What It Is with Jessica Capshaw and Camil Luddington,
an iHeartRadio podcast.
Speaker 1 (00:35):
Well, Hello, hello, hello.
Speaker 2 (00:37):
And welcome to another episode of Call It What It Is.
You might have noticed that I said hello, Hello, hello,
and welcome to another episode of Call It What It Is,
because today I am missing one half of my heart,
the peanut butter to my jelly, the lemon to my lime.
Speaker 1 (00:58):
The what's the word?
Speaker 2 (01:01):
Inimitable Camilla Lettington. She would love that I said that,
and then she'd probably toss me a fake insult. But anyways,
today it is just me, or rather you get all
of me on a very special episode with the one
and only Brookshields.
Speaker 1 (01:19):
Brook Shields is.
Speaker 2 (01:21):
Honestly, I don't know that you could relegate one job
title to Brookshields.
Speaker 1 (01:26):
She's got lots.
Speaker 2 (01:28):
I feel like I first came to know her, or
like the first imprinted image is her in those sweet
ass tight Calan kline jeans on some giant billboard somewhere,
with her hair blowing in the wind, and that gorgeous
face and those shiny eyes and that bold brow and
just all of it was extra extra fantastic. That's the
(01:52):
feeling I feel like I first saw her, and then
I remember being new to the business and looking up
to her and seeing her around town, and she was
always so kind and lovely. And then I've continued to
run into her and have marveled and watched her weave
her way through many, many different jobs. She most recently
(02:18):
can be seen on and around town by the way,
in a bikini, flanked by her two gorgeous daughters who
are now in college, and after she has started an
inspirational community for women called Beginning is Now that is
transitioning into commence and basically just on the forefront of
all the things that I find myself wanting to talk
(02:40):
about as well. So please please welcome Brookshields. Well, first
of all, I'm so bummed because my partner in crime, Camilla,
got like a like like she's a real doctor or something,
got called into work at Gray's Anatomy so she's not
here with us today. And then I said, well, I
gotta say since I since I know Brooke, it's really
(03:01):
her loss, and there's just.
Speaker 1 (03:02):
More of you for me to have.
Speaker 3 (03:05):
We can handle this. We can totally handle it.
Speaker 1 (03:08):
We can talk and talk.
Speaker 2 (03:09):
Well, I was going to start with no matter who
was on I have a very for some reason, there's
like these memories of certain people that just get crystallized
and cemented in my brain. And I have this memory
of I don't know, I mean, being sort of feeling
still new and certainly not established on any level, and
(03:30):
going to one of those parties in Beverly Hills at
the new protest store, where you know, we'd all dressed
up and we'd been sent clothes, and while it seems
like it's glamorous, there's something super insecure about it. You're like,
am I wearing the right thing? Does this even look good?
Speaker 1 (03:44):
Who? Am I?
Speaker 2 (03:45):
Existential crises happen on the way there, all of it.
But I remember getting there and there's so many people there,
and it was a really fabulous party, and I came
around a corner and I saw you, and you were
definitely in the middle of doing something important, right like
you were you were there was photos being taken or whatever,
but you turned around and when your eyes met mine,
you just smiled and it was just like the warmest
(04:08):
ray of light and it was like an eyeball hug.
It was like, and I don't know, I don't know
how to like, I'm clearly making a mountain out of this,
but for whatever reason, that eyeball hug meant some sort
of confirmation of belonging for me at this party.
Speaker 3 (04:22):
All well, I think, you know, I do remember that,
and it's so funny you say, I was in the
middle of doing something important, like getting my picture taken,
which is I know, I know, but you know it's
very important. And I remember thinking, oh, I shouldn't have
picked this dress. This is a stupid dress to pick.
This is so not like chic. It's just too like
colorful and patterny. But that was the theme because they
(04:44):
projected all the patterns on the wall. It was like
this larger than life thing. And you know, I also
am so honestly a fan of people that I'm a
fan of that I watch like I'm a person who
if you come into my living room in any capacity,
I too feel like I know you, and I am like,
(05:04):
I'm a fan and I know you, and I take
it all very personally and like people do. And I remember,
you know, just going like, oh, oh good, she's here,
like okay, this is really cool and I don't really
really know her, but but okay, she looked beautiful and
I'm here, and why not just like have fun with it?
(05:26):
Like it just I think it just normalized it all
in a moment because we did make eye contact. And
normally when you go into those places, people are like this, yeah, yeah,
and they're out somebody else and nobody's looking like if
they shake your hand, they're like looking at who's more
famous over there? And yeah, you know, and it's.
Speaker 1 (05:45):
Yeah, like a l it is.
Speaker 2 (05:48):
But you know what, you bring up something that I
think is actually, I just think you're in such a
unique position of I'm I'm gonna even I'm going to
use the W word. I feel like you're going to
have some wisdom on this, which is we talk a
lot because we have write in and call in, and
we sort of were like, you know, we think we're
not at all, so we think we can give everyone,
you know, we think we at least have some kind
of answer, but so often what people are reporting and
(06:12):
feeling is self doubt, and so you brought up like, ah,
the first thing that came to mind, like top of mine,
was like, my dress is stupid, right, Like I'm not
wearing the right thing. And it's funny because we just
heard Demi Moore talk about this in her acceptance speech
the other night in the Golden Gumbs, where it's like
there's always going to be somebody, and sometimes it's you
that makes you feel not good enough or like the
(06:35):
dress you picked.
Speaker 3 (06:36):
Was rodd or not really deserving of being there or
And I think that's the plight of an actress or
a creative. You know, I've just recently read this beautiful
book on Margaret Wise Brown, who wrote run Away Bunny
and Good Night Moon. Yeah, and you know, and she
(06:57):
was made to feel less than because she wasn't an
adult writer. And she you know, she's one of the
most prolific children's book writers and one of the most
poetic sort of extraordinary minds. And you watch her Insecurity
blossom Insecurity's blossom at certain points and you think, like, wow,
this has been happening since the dawn of time, Like
(07:20):
is it a writer passage. What if we don't get
through it? What if we choose to stay in that
place of anxiety and insecurity and self doubt? And like
is that fair for us? And like you kind of
have to at least these conversations are now starting to
be had a little bit differently.
Speaker 2 (07:38):
Yeah, when those conversations are happening, do you find in
those moments of self doubt do you have are you
figuring out what your prescription is?
Speaker 3 (07:46):
Like?
Speaker 1 (07:47):
Is it?
Speaker 2 (07:47):
Is it talking to yourself? Is it phoning a friend?
Speaker 3 (07:50):
Is it? Sometimes it's and I said this today to
my older daughter. Sometimes it's as simple as saying nope, nope, nope, nope, nope, cancel, cancel, nope, nope, nope, nope,
nope no and shift and go like puppies kiddies from
my laundry, and you distract and then you kind of
(08:12):
like shift, and then I start usually thinking of like, Okay,
you're fifty nine years old, are yes still going to
do this shift to yourself? Are yes still going to
let it take your time? Or are you going to
just say okay, that's a part of what happens to me.
But can I make it fuel me to ask more
(08:36):
questions about what I want my future. You know, I
want this job. Howboud I ask for that job? Or
how about I put myself out there? Or how a
would I say? You know what, I'm going to say
yes to that because it's something that is out of
my comfort zone. I'm going to learn and then you
you sort of make it a little bit more proactive.
(08:56):
And in that period of time when you realize the
world hasn't imploded because you're wearing the wrong dress and
that nobody really cares what dress you aren't wearing because
they're worried about their own outfit, you start to just
go like, oh, oh, I want to release myself from
this because nothing is coming out of it that is productive. Yeah,
(09:19):
and sometimes there is a productivity in feeling insecure because
it causes me at times to take on things that
I'm afraid of, you know, So you have to kind
of be willing to be honest about what it is. Okay,
golden gloves aren't perfect example, right, you know the way
(09:41):
she was talking about her trajectory, her history, and how
riddled with that that she was insecure. Right, So I
can look at somebody like that, and I can look
at them as a contemporary and say, yeah, I get it.
I get it, and you know I do want that validation.
(10:01):
But I'm not but but my not but forgetting it
tonight to the last night whatever doesn't take it away
from me. Like when you're young, you sort of think
there's a limited allotment of finance.
Speaker 2 (10:16):
Yeah, yeah, that people are allowed.
Speaker 3 (10:19):
And yes there's certain roles and we all don't get
them because some adult gets them. Whatever.
Speaker 2 (10:24):
That's the nature so many times, Brooks, so many times.
Speaker 3 (10:27):
Majority the majority of my life.
Speaker 1 (10:32):
I know, talk about daughter talk.
Speaker 2 (10:34):
I say it all the time, especially when those daughters
paint me with like you're perfect. I'm like, do you
know how many do you know the percentage of jobs
I've actually gotten? Two percentage of jobs I have auditioned.
Speaker 3 (10:43):
For, I've gotten two.
Speaker 2 (10:45):
I gets like point two percent I've gotten too. I mean,
I might as well have never got a job in
my life. I've never worked. You made me think of
(11:06):
you made me think well. I mean, I love Taylor Swift.
I don't know where you land on, Taylor.
Speaker 3 (11:10):
But oh I had the best time in my life
there at the dancing with her mother.
Speaker 2 (11:14):
It was serial Yeah mom, I mean she's the best.
She's the best. She was so kind to my daughter.
She gave her the bracelet off her wrist.
Speaker 3 (11:23):
She gave one to my daughters too. I was like, oh,
I mean, she's taken that friendship bracelet thing.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
And Poppy looked at me and was like, is this
for real?
Speaker 1 (11:33):
And like should I take it?
Speaker 2 (11:34):
And I was like, yes, you should, and you should
say thank you, ma'am, thank you.
Speaker 3 (11:38):
You should give her one of yours.
Speaker 1 (11:39):
Yeah, oh no, she was. She was the initial offerer.
Speaker 2 (11:42):
But I remember watching the documentary and then again, who
knows why these things stick in her head, but I
remember when she was talking about her relationship with food
and when she had a thorny one and when she
was not that was not sustainable and that was not
literally nutritive. And I remember her saying, always fact check me,
because sometimes I remember things differently than they are. But
(12:03):
I remember her saying that her mantra in those moments
of self doubt about that particular issue was we're not
going to do that.
Speaker 1 (12:12):
We're not going to do that.
Speaker 2 (12:13):
We're not going to do that anymore. We're just not
going to do that anymore. And I remember, I mean,
it was definitely for me reserved. I think I had
more of it younger, but holy me, I still have.
I still have a storage room for I remember, especially
in the moments of you know, kind of having to
show up to something, being on the you know, going
into an audition or something, and catching a reflection of
(12:33):
myself in the in the window, you know, as I
walked away from my car, and I remember being the
thoughts that went through my mind were so unkind to
that reflection, and I remember being like, what is going on?
Why am I being so unkind to myself? And it's
only making the self doubt worse. It's not setting me
up for success an X, Y and Z and all that.
(12:53):
And then I remember thinking different way in if anyone
spoke to if I spoke to anyone the way that
I speak to myself, right, I would have I would
have zero friends, and I have a lot of friends.
And I'm so grateful for my friends and I feel
so supportive. So what if I treated myself like I
(13:17):
was my friend?
Speaker 3 (13:19):
Mm hmm.
Speaker 2 (13:20):
And it really did like that for me. The self
doubt exactly what you said, like the conversations with yourself
interrupting the cycle saying nope, like, nope, not on my watch,
Like you're not going to fucking say that to her,
not on my watch.
Speaker 3 (13:33):
You know. And what's interesting is the two things that
you've just said, you've kind of spoken in third person.
And I think that that's a really interesting psychology that
makes it easier for us to take said mantra. Because
if if if we go back to our normal of
(13:55):
our normal tapes and we say I, and it's like, well,
I look fat, I look stupid, I look old, I'm
too tall, i'm too short, I'm too lily, that it
immediately goes right back in. But if we say no,
we're not going to do that. We are a team here,
and this is collected, like and when you say I'm
(14:17):
going to speak to myself, you're creating just enough distance
so that our psyche can make it less self induced.
If you think about the way the synapses work and
the way that the brain works, like that stuff is
so interesting to me because that is what I think
(14:38):
is a really healthy way of doing it. I mean,
I had something one time similar. It was I don't
look in the mirror, right Like I refuse to look
in the mirror for years and years and years now
I do, but for years I didn't. I wouldn't. I
wouldn't look in the mirror. I wouldn't like and in
dance class, I would just fall flat on my cocksit
(15:00):
and I would be in such pain. And then I
was doing this movie where I was I had to
be like walk in looking like ba vum and kind
of sexy and sort of like great, but I had
to deliver some tippid line of something. I don't know
what it was. And I was so out of like
(15:25):
my own periphery that I didn't I was so unaware
of where I was coming from that repeatedly I kept
running into the wall and it was funny because it
was like, oh, look how clumsy she is. She should
probably be a comedian, Like oh look how Yeah, you
think she's a supermodel, but she's really a you know, klutz.
(15:47):
And that was just you know, that was where the
crew went and everybody because I think they were embarrassed
for me. But I remember thinking like, oh, that's so
interesting because you weren't willing to take in who you
were enough to understand your peripheral, Like I physically walked
(16:08):
into the wall. Five takes in a row, and then
I started thinking, oh my god, I've got a neurological problem,
like this is crazy. And then I took a dance
class and my teacher was like, if you don't spot
and look at yourself, you're never going to be able
to turn. You will never be able to make a
(16:30):
turn on stage if you don't have a focal point.
And while we're in class, the focal point is the
mirror and if you can't handle what you see in
the mirror, then you shouldn't be dancing at all. And
it was like really tough. It was like harsh, and
I was like, I don't want to. He goes, nobody cares.
They're looking at their own faces in the mirror. If
(16:53):
you don't do it, you're on your own and don't
I don't know, Like he was so frustrated with me,
but it was like love and it was It reminded
me of that Dove ad where the women described themselves
to an artist who's behind a black curtain and then
describes a woman that they were part of it. And
in every case, the way they described themselves was witchy
(17:16):
and hard and angry and mean, and the way the
other person described them was like regal and strong jaw
and ye yeah, fierce, and you just kind of go like, Okay,
we've been doing this to ourselves for quite some time.
Are we going to stop that behavior?
Speaker 2 (17:35):
Yeah, because you're the only one that can do. You
remember a time where that was a daily, daily like
the hardest for you, or like the lesson that you
needed to learn to get past it to move on
to the next thing.
Speaker 3 (17:49):
I mean, I think there was a when I was
on Broadway. I was so one of the times I
was on Broadway, I was so it was so precious
to me doing a Wonderful Town, which was a musical
comedy where I had to sing, dance and be comedic
and all of this at the same time. And I
(18:11):
remember thinking, like, you were going to have to use
these six months, eight shows a week to stop sabotaging
yourself and stop and like and stop doing those ritualistic
OCD things that you do because you feel like if
you don't put your miscra on in the same period
(18:34):
of time that you count to put your lip on,
like whatever the thing was, I had frenzied myself into control.
I'm going to.
Speaker 2 (18:41):
Step on control, needing control.
Speaker 3 (18:45):
And so I went in one day and I started
absolutely doing everything out of order, and I waited till
the last minute to get to the theater, and I
did all these things that would have been like made
me not like really struggle, and I was fine. I
was fine on mistakes. The world didn't fall apart. Yeah,
(19:05):
And I thought, think of all the time you waste
trying to control yourself, when if you just were awake
enough to stay in the moment, you'd probably be okay.
Speaker 1 (19:17):
Yeah, but it's but you need to prove it to yourself.
Speaker 3 (19:19):
I needed to go through the discomfort of like, yeah,
you know, being chicken lit alone, the world's guy's going
to fall apart.
Speaker 1 (19:27):
Yeah, yeah, for sure, for sure.
Speaker 2 (19:29):
And it's funny because you know you were talking about
talking to your daughter, and you know, I've got three
daughters and a son, and and I think you so
badly want to just like hook up like a connector
where you can like download all of this stuff we're
talking about so you can like spare them these moments
that they go through.
Speaker 1 (19:50):
And then you have this moment of.
Speaker 2 (19:52):
Realization where it's like, oh, just like you said, like
I wouldn't count insecuritys, like I wouldn't put in.
Speaker 3 (19:59):
My positive.
Speaker 2 (20:01):
But if you can, if you can contextualize it, if
you can synthesize it in your body and then have
it come out as humility, right instead of insecurity. Maybe
it's just like me understanding that, you know, not it's
the opposite of grandiose, like I'm not all that in
a bag of chips, but I'm pretty proud of myself.
Speaker 3 (20:17):
I also think humility can be a dangerous word if
not mind appropriately, because humility can in some instances. And
I've learned this because of self deprecation. Right, I've taken
self deprecation to like a whole new level of like
it's who I am. And when you do that too
(20:39):
much to yourself, over the course of years, you start
seeing yourself as less than right if you're not careful. Right, Yeah, yeah,
I I do think that there's a uh. I like
the word humility better than I like the word humble.
But I do feel like our humility needs to be
extended to ourselves, not necessarily to the outside, because you know,
(21:05):
I took it to such a I would I would
like back out of rooms or come in and say
I'm sorry, or instead of just excuse me, everything was
I'm sorry, I'm sorry, and I was like apologizing for
living and then you start feeling like, oh god, I
don't know why I feel so bad about myself. Yeah,
so's so I try to say to my girls, you know,
(21:28):
respect is a huge, huge thing to integrate into your lives.
And that is respect for yourself without arrogance, because I
used to I used to equate that with arrogance and
respect for others, others, time, others, you know, feelings at
that moment. Just try to be aware of them, don't
(21:49):
undermine yourself so much to uphold them. But again, you know,
really try to listen, listen to Okay, so you're nervous
about this, right, My daughter went into like a really
kind of interesting job where she had to be in
service and I said, you know, make yourself indispensable and
(22:14):
and she's like, well, that's I can't think of myself
that way. And I said, no, no, don't walk in
thinking you're better than everybody. Walk in and say how
can I help you this job? What can I do
in this position to make your said job more you know,
run smoothly? And I said, in over time, you will
(22:35):
start feeling needed for the right reasons, and then your
own self worth will kind of find its spot and
you're never going to be arrogant. It's not in your DNA,
you know what.
Speaker 2 (22:47):
I think that that's also it's sometimes I feel really
small in the world, and I feel like the problems
are all too big, and I do tend to feel
comforted by getting really small in like what can I affect?
You know, like I really I personally, there's not a
(23:10):
lot I can do about things that are happening across
the world or or things that are just bigger balls
to unwind. But I can smile at a stranger. I
can make someone feel valued and and and special, and
that is really important to do when you can, when
you have the power to do it, it's really important
(23:31):
to do well.
Speaker 3 (23:32):
It's Taylor's mom giving our daughters stuff in the gold bracelet.
Like it's if they're gestures. Yeah, you know, it's like
if I'm walking on the street, and you know, I
mean usually it goes like this, someone will say, oh,
you're still beautiful.
Speaker 2 (23:50):
Yeah, it's one of those other than you're actually beautiful.
Speaker 3 (23:53):
Yeah, No, I've gotten or you're you're actually pretty in person.
I got one or it was favorite anyway. They're just
it's these crazy things. But when someone when anybody says
anything complimentary, I immediately turn it back around and I
say you are so beautiful. And it never fails. The
(24:17):
person will go thank you, thank you, Brooke, and I'll
be like, have the right day, and I walk on.
And it's just it's that it a little goes a
long way. And I think that there are symbols of that,
whether it's Taylor Swift and her front of bracelets or
the messaging in her songs, or how she treats what
(24:37):
looks like she treats every fan. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (24:40):
No, well she's role modeling goodness and that that wasn't.
Speaker 3 (24:44):
That's so necessary.
Speaker 2 (24:46):
It didn't used to be so cool to be kind,
And now it does feel like there's a culture and
a and a and a movement toward kindness, not in
all circles, but in quite a few. Okay, I have
(25:11):
a question because I was also thinking about you. Oh,
I've been thinking about you for a couple of days
because I knew I was guess you, and I was
thinking just looking back, looking back and looking forward. You
really have touched in so many different aspects of entertainment.
Like you have done so many things, and I find
(25:33):
you in conversation and whenever I run into you, I'm
always so happy because I find you and everything you're
saying about yourself, I absolutely I know it's true. But
there's this there's this willingness that I see in you
that's like, Okay, I mean, you know, I know you
wouldn't say this, but you know you're You're the Calvin
Klein gorgeous, gorgeous gorgeousness, and the winds are blowing and
(25:55):
the hair is blowing and all the things, and you're
so beautiful. And there's this there's this aspect of entertainment,
right because we're creating these big images and then it's like, oh, hey,
so what about being you know, what about being on
a TV show?
Speaker 1 (26:07):
There's Brooke, she's willing. Yes, you're at a TV show.
You're making people.
Speaker 2 (26:10):
Laugh, you're singing and dancing on stage. Yes, there you are.
And I think that that's not a very common thing
to be so willing, and I love it. I think
it's I'm using it as a compliment, by the way,
because I find that, you know, one of the biggest
disruptors to life is people who are unwilling, like unwilling
to just go. You know, there're the people whenever you
(26:30):
ask them, they're like no, You're like, oh, I just
want you to jump in, But do you have do
you know where your willingness came from?
Speaker 3 (26:39):
You?
Speaker 1 (26:39):
Did you were you?
Speaker 3 (26:40):
Just?
Speaker 1 (26:40):
Were you born?
Speaker 3 (26:41):
Like that?
Speaker 1 (26:41):
Did you see it go the other way? And you're like,
uh ah, I'm going to be I'm going to jump in.
Speaker 2 (26:45):
Like where did that adventure and where did that willingness
come from?
Speaker 3 (26:50):
Well, thank you for that. That is a very positive
view of I fit well, how I've chosen to live
my life. But I think it's because I don't I
don't like limitations that are put on me by other
people who have no idea what my capacity is. I
(27:11):
don't even understand maybe my capability or my talent or
my capacity or whatever it is. And so when you
get denied access, which we've talked about before, but when
when you are not picked, overlooked, not chosen whatever, this
crazy thing that we as actresses are subjected to, and
(27:33):
you've been on some pedestal that you really didn't mean,
not asked to be on it, and then you're knocked
off it and they just are thriving on that watching
you kind of flail in their opinion, you know, the
public opinion or press or whatever. You start to say like,
am I going to let myself be limited constantly by
(27:56):
something that I have no control over? Or I'm just
going to keep saying yes, especially if I'm afraid. And
you know, it's not like, oh, by choice, I chose
not to be in films anymore, and I was going
to go be on television or being on Broadway. Those
were things that were the only ones available to me.
Speaker 2 (28:18):
But imagine if you hadn't been willing.
Speaker 3 (28:21):
You know, part of it is like, oh, I got
so happy, I got in divited to that party, and
it just I felt like, I think every opportunity that
I've gotten has been a gift because they don't come often,
you know, they don't come all the time or often,
and I think.
Speaker 2 (28:39):
That sometimes you have to make them. I mean, look
at them. Listen, I'm looking at your whole life and
on pieces of paper and notes and all the things
that i've you know, that I've just seen you do.
And there's a lot, you know, I mean, there's a
lot of redirection, and there's a lot of you know, passion, and.
Speaker 3 (28:55):
You know what, people say it's reinvention, and I always say, like,
you know what, I wasn't broken enough to need to
be reinvented. I just needed to keep being revealed and
like I'll raise my hand and I'll be like, oh,
could I want to try that? Yeah, just because I've
(29:16):
I've felt the success like and I felt it in
college more than anything. You know, I tried out for
a dance company and I did university.
Speaker 2 (29:25):
So it's always good to say because it's just really impressive.
Speaker 3 (29:29):
Well, but like I didn't get into this dance company
and I didn't get into this singing group, and I
just remember feeling like such a failure and thinking like
how can I be an actress and not know how
to do this? Like what is wrong with me? Maybe
I am just a celebrity and I am just this.
Maybe I'm sort of smart, but like and so I thought, okay,
(29:50):
well what are you going to do about it? And
I spent that summer taking dance lessons, taking singing lessons,
And I went back and I got into the dance
company and I got into the musical theater group, and
I had a whole life that wasn't afforded to me
before because I hadn't worked hard enough for it. Maybe
(30:11):
I don't know.
Speaker 1 (30:12):
Yeah, but you were also you were willing to.
Speaker 2 (30:14):
You were willing to, you were willing to take the
know and like direct yourselves into having earned it.
Speaker 1 (30:20):
It sounds like I was willing to fail.
Speaker 2 (30:22):
I think, yeah, yeah, you have to. You have to
be real willing to fail in life. That's the thing
I think some people don't get when they when they
when they talk about the self doubt. I think it's
it's really important what you just said. If you doubt
yourself all the time, Okay, fine, that's being human. But
I find that a lot of people who get stuck
in that decide to just stop trying, to like stop doing,
(30:46):
to stop moving forward. And I think it's like that's
where you.
Speaker 1 (30:49):
I love all this.
Speaker 2 (30:50):
I love this is My favorite thing about Instagram is
all the sayings. I take screenshots of them all and
I put them in my little pocket and I go, like,
you know what I mean, Like you know, if you
if you don't ask the answers, usually I always know,
or if you don't ask the answers always going to
be no.
Speaker 1 (31:02):
Right, It's like, yes, you have to keep going.
Speaker 2 (31:04):
You have to, you have to keep going forward, and
then you'll sort of earn the confidence because you'll know
that you can do it.
Speaker 3 (31:14):
And also you say, I say that to my girls,
I'm like, I can guarantee you won't get into that
college if you don't apply. Yeah, Like I can guarantee it.
Speaker 1 (31:21):
Like, yeah, it's one of the shots you don't take.
I'm telling you. I've got a lot of them. I've
got a lot of them. I'll get on my phone.
I got a whole file.
Speaker 3 (31:29):
I have those dads that have it at the bottom,
you know. And it's like it's always like somebody really
cool has said it in like the early nineteen hundreds
and you're just like, yes, what would you do if
you knew you could not fail?
Speaker 2 (31:40):
And you're like, yeah, yeah, all of them, all of them,
all of them. Okay, So if you if you, I
mean you, you didn't know you couldn't fail. But in
this now, in the beginning is now phase, what is
the thing that is top of mind for you right now?
Like what's the thing I always find that there's like
something that comes up and it's like the thing you
can't stop talking.
Speaker 3 (31:59):
About is that when you are a part of something
like a startup, you have to know that part of it.
So part of what you were talking about before is
accepting victimhood. I think it's when we choose not to
move through something and we choose to be a martyr
(32:20):
about it or a victim to it, right, And you
can say, whatever it is sucks, but what am I
going to do about it? And when you are part
of something like a company that you have decided to
start and you put your money into it, and then
you lose that money and then you have to get
more money and then you spend that money, but you
(32:42):
all the while you're kind of blindly saying to yourself,
I believe in the mission, I believe in the vision.
I'm not going to let go. I'm not going to
let go. I've heard these stories. I've heard people say
we failed and we pulled ourselves up, and we did.
And that has been the thing that has been the
most sort of a chute for me is taking those
(33:02):
moments where I am unable to sleep and I'm afraid
and i'm and money is looming as a problem. But
you know that the larger message that you started this
whole thing for is the thing that you cannot deny.
That is to be that afraid and keep forging ahead,
(33:27):
and then to look back four years later and say,
look how far we've come. Look at what just the
last seven months have been. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (33:37):
I remember running into you by the way in New
York City. I was with a friend and you were
at Cafe Cliney and you were like, I'm starting something.
It's really exciting, I'm figuring it out. I don't know
you were. It was a table of I feel like
you had like maybe four people around you, and it
was just like I remember being like, I can't wait
to see what this is.
Speaker 3 (33:59):
Well, I went to interest was it started for the
right reasons, and the community that was built out of
beginning is now.
Speaker 4 (34:06):
Has now become a fully more fully flushed out whole
vision and mission for women over forty to really help
solve problems that they're encountering.
Speaker 2 (34:21):
Which problem is are you all do you feel like
is being solved that you're most proud of?
Speaker 3 (34:25):
At first, it was the community like you are not alone.
I am not alone. I am pissed that only one
percent of all marketing and advertisement has women sixty plus
in it. That is unheard of.
Speaker 4 (34:40):
You know.
Speaker 3 (34:40):
I'm when people say, oh, do you think Hollywood's changing
in their writing stories for women of a certain age,
And I say yes, like it's great. But here's to me,
we are actually even more interesting than the divorcee who
now is sleeping with a twenty year old, Like, we
are actually these unbelievable women that have so much that
(35:02):
we bring to the table. And when you I've recently
been able to work with some actresses who are older,
and they come to the table with everything, including their
little girl selves and their insecurities, including their knowledge and
their history and their experience, and you say to yourself, like,
(35:24):
that is what's becoming a part of the conversation. So like,
to me, that's been the most rewarding is having conversations
with women all over the world and they're still saying
like thank you, we didn't feel represented. But now let's
look at these these things we're encountering and not look
(35:44):
at them like oh, it's the beginning of the end
and you're decrepit, but like, let's look at them and
let's solve these problems.
Speaker 1 (35:52):
Well how about look at them.
Speaker 2 (35:53):
I mean, we have there's so many other cultures that
put such a huge value on age and maturity, right.
Speaker 3 (36:00):
The ones, Yes, here's the cheap in the everything and
that you know.
Speaker 2 (36:05):
Absolutely and now I mean, you know, I think, I mean,
I'm just such a huge fan and I've of self
care and I you know, I'm on most to do lists.
I put myself last because I also am like in
the thick of it with the kids and everything else.
But I I find that, you know, the more that
we have the access and proximity to being able to
(36:26):
take care of ourselves, It's like I'm looking at all
these just women that are not only you know, have
have more experience and have different experience and bring all
this value. But they're also going like, and I'm going
to be I'm going to I'm going to value my health.
I'm going to value being fit. I'm going to value
how I feed myself. I'm going to speak about myself kindly.
(36:50):
I'm going to you know, I'm going to bring all
these lessons and I'm going to share them with everyone.
I think that that's I feel like that's happening in
a really big way. Maybe I just wasn't around it
because as I was around all people that were you know, younger,
But I just I find that it's so universal these days,
like it feels like it's you're really much around it.
Speaker 3 (37:09):
Well. I also think that like we call at commence,
we call ourselves a care brand, and our whole motto
is take care. And when I say that, there's a
narrative different reasons that that sort of you know, brings
up and we're so talks about it's like, take care
of yourself because you deserve it. Take the care that's
(37:32):
available to you from the people who feed you positively
in your life, you know, take care to not play
those tapes over in your head that diminish your value
in your own eye, you know, take the take yourself
and care for yourself and say, like that group of girls,
I don't feel good about myself when I'm when I'm
(37:54):
around them or that person or or that job or
that doesn't me It doesn't help me, and I leave
feeling smaller. So that means to me, that's really understanding
what it means to take care of ourselves so that
we can how do we want to live our lives
(38:14):
in the most care generating way, you know, And that's
our whole vision, you know, we say it commenced, like
we want to encourage women to live, and we say
fearlessly and we say optimistically and joyfully. But it's not
a pressure. It's that you've earned this position in your
(38:38):
actual life because you've done so much for so many
other people. You've come so far, and you deserve to
care about who you are as a person and feel
really good about that. Like you deserve to love yourself.
Like it sounds like another magnet on a refrigerator, but
it's a real thing. And when you start that. I
(39:01):
remember saying to myself once I was going into some
job that I felt in over my head about and
and I like, I just felt like I was sort
of going to drown in it. And I said, I
wonder how you would walk into the room if you
really just said you're enough. Brooke, Like, yeah, it sounds
(39:22):
like dorky, but you're kind of like, oh, I might
just be good enough. Yeah, be alive. Where you know,
we're not taught that as younger people.
Speaker 2 (39:46):
Did you have anyone when you were younger that felt
wise in that in the way that like that could
that that.
Speaker 1 (39:51):
Sort of pulled you up?
Speaker 2 (39:54):
That was like, Brooke, there's this there's this other way
of looking at it.
Speaker 3 (39:59):
I mean, actually, no, I think most of the people
that I sort of like my mother who I looked
up to, I felt responsible for keeping her alive like
so that that comes with a lot of self doubt
in other ways.
Speaker 2 (40:13):
Well an a codependency, so.
Speaker 3 (40:15):
Yeah, for sure and in an ameshment, but there were
some male relationships that I had that sort of reverted
the mirror back to me and said, you know, I
want you to see yourself the way I see you,
like this is what I fell in love with. I'd
like you to see that person because if you knew
(40:36):
her like, if you knew her, bless them like her
like And you know, one of my early early relationships
that I was able to be that was a huge
part of it, one of my more serious relationships. None
of them worked out in the long run. I mean, thankfully.
Speaker 2 (40:54):
Isn't that amazing how that's such a gift where it
doesn't work out and you're like killing yourself. Well, I
have a question when you were in your when you
were starting out, And again, by the way, I maybe
I'm making this up, but I feel like I I
remember seeing the billboards like I actually remember the Calvin
Kline billboards being oh I remember those being up. But
at that part of your life, who was like your
(41:17):
super biggest like who was who was like the crushworthiest?
Speaker 1 (41:22):
Like who were you like? Because you were like you
were kind of.
Speaker 2 (41:25):
The tippy top, Like what is the tippy top? Like
you workus again, I think a wind machine, fology wherever
you went. In my mind, that's the story I'm making up.
Speaker 1 (41:32):
You would just walk down the street.
Speaker 2 (41:34):
It would be like, oh, Brook, good Brook.
Speaker 3 (41:37):
Yeah, that's the way I. I slept my best, so
I got out of bed. I had a wind machine
put in my bedroom, just like I loved No. I
mean it was funny because I liked certain movies right,
but I like I loved the fact that John travill
To dance the way he did like Robin Williams, like
(41:58):
so funny, genius. My my life is like like I
I went like Comedians, like I went any sexy Lucille Ball,
I went like I. I didn't have heart throbs as
much because most of the heart throbs I had already
worked with.
Speaker 1 (42:17):
And they were kind of boring.
Speaker 3 (42:19):
They were just such work was sweet, but they were.
Speaker 2 (42:24):
True big generalization alert But yes, the more handsome, the
more boring or a lot of work are.
Speaker 3 (42:33):
Just boys, and they needed so much attention, and I
was just like, uh, hi, I'm not playing this game anymore.
And so I got like so just like like little girl,
I'm like, they bother me. I don't like, you know,
and everybody's like, oh my god, everybody's in love with them,
and I'm just like, oh, rolling my eyes, like you know,
(42:57):
and like the little sister that is just so over
the sibling that's getting all the attention, and you're just
kind of you get petulant about it, you know. So
I wasn't. I didn't fall into the same category of
heart throbs, you know, because my heart throbs were like
David Cassidy and you know, Scott Beao and late Garrett BeO.
(43:20):
I mean, you were like, it's so funny like to
now look back and you just kind of go like, oh,
those are my scrap books of you know, heart throbs.
Speaker 1 (43:30):
Did you ever get to meet? Did you ever did you.
Speaker 3 (43:33):
Ever send one of them? I met every one of them.
Speaker 1 (43:35):
And okay, so so don't you don't need to name names.
Speaker 2 (43:37):
But like percentage wise mostly lived up to the hype
or mostly didn't.
Speaker 3 (43:43):
You know, not the same kind of hype that we
were all putting them up against. Yeah, they just got
to be too human too quickly. Yeah. But I remember
Scott Bao gave me a corsage on my wrist and
I was like, oh, he's.
Speaker 2 (44:02):
And I was like, yeah, at the beginning of a date,
like he pulled up and had a corsage.
Speaker 3 (44:07):
Yeah, like there's We went to some party and.
Speaker 1 (44:10):
I was gonna say, were you going to a dance?
Speaker 3 (44:11):
It wasn't a prom or anything. It was just like
a party I think in Hollywood, and like the Scottie
brothers were I don't know.
Speaker 2 (44:17):
Do you think his mom called him and was like,
I'm sure you got to pick up you got to
pick up a corsage. Yeah, you're on a date with Brickshews.
You gotta have a corsage, yeah, she probably.
Speaker 1 (44:28):
And did you wear it? Did you want to wear
it with pride? Okay?
Speaker 3 (44:31):
I love it?
Speaker 2 (44:32):
I love it?
Speaker 1 (44:33):
Okay, great, I love it.
Speaker 3 (44:35):
Well.
Speaker 1 (44:36):
I love chatting with you.
Speaker 2 (44:37):
I really do anytime anywhere, by accident or on purpose.
And thank you so much for spending this time with me.
Speaker 3 (44:44):
Thank you, thank you so much for having me And
tell your partner in crime that we missed her.
Speaker 2 (44:50):
I know, I know she's gonna be she well, she
already is so bummed. We talked about it and I
was like, but.
Speaker 3 (44:55):
She's making a difference. She's making you guys authentic.
Speaker 2 (44:59):
I know she's responding to some medical you know, major
minor medical drama, which is awesome.
Speaker 3 (45:05):
I know, how great to be able to be called
in for that. I know.
Speaker 2 (45:08):
Guess she's given America what she wants. She said it
was because someone uh got sick after the holidays. And
then I talked to last night and her voice sounded
funny and I was like, why does your voice sound funny?
And she's like, because I'm sick, and I was like, okay,
so everybody's sick.
Speaker 1 (45:22):
It's just like I remember having.
Speaker 2 (45:25):
I mean, I know you have these stories, but I
remember being shocked by it. I remember calling up our
main producer, who was like the line producer, and being like,
I'm really sick, Like I do not feel well.
Speaker 3 (45:36):
I felt like.
Speaker 2 (45:37):
Swallowing glass shards. And he was like, so, okay, but
what are you trying to say. I think I don't
think I should be at work, like I think I'm
really sick, and he was like, okay, but then I'll
call a doctor. I'll call a doctor, and the doctors
would come.
Speaker 3 (45:53):
And give you a B twelve shot.
Speaker 1 (45:54):
Yeah, they'd give you a B twelve shot to I
don't know. I mean, I guess, I don't know.
Speaker 2 (45:59):
Yeah, lob you this was pre COVID, so it wasn't
even like they said, like, and maybe you should put
on my mask so you don't give everyone else on
the set strep throat. But yeah, I remember, just like
that show must go on.
Speaker 3 (46:11):
Yeah, I got I found out I was pregnant right
before I started Chicago on Broadway, and I remember thinking like,
oh god, oh god, I'm going to get tired. And
I and I I didn't tell anybody, and I just
told my and I said, went to my doctor and
I'm like, I'm supposed to go do this show. And
he said, well, knowing you, you will work out during pregnancy,
(46:34):
so just don't work out in addition to the show.
And I he's like, because your body's going to be
able to be fine because you've worked out through your
other pregnancy and that's what you do, so just don't
overdo it and don't work out in addition to and
then when I started to show, I had to like
(46:54):
take my more drone person aside and say like, hey,
you know those like waists and and she goes, I
see nothing, I know nothing. I think you've been eating
too many pieces of candy. And I'm just gonna I'm
gonna let your costumes out. And she didn't tell anybody,
but we had to keep it a secret. And and
(47:17):
then finally I was like nearing the end of my
run and it was obvious like that I was, you know,
she was.
Speaker 1 (47:28):
Troublemaker, that.
Speaker 3 (47:30):
Totally. But another thing too, It's like I just recently
had to call a big meeting with everybody because I
was starting to get unhealthy because of my schedule. And
every day more is added to it, and there's more
and more and more and more, and it's for the
book tour and it's for this and it's for that,
and everybody's just doing their job, and I keep thinking, oh,
(47:52):
they're going to see that. I'm starting to like pray here.
And and I woke up like New Year's Day kind
of after sort of separating myself for a bit, and
I was thinking, no, they're not, they're not. They are
not going to think of you and be like, oh,
well she might be overextended. No, they think, oh, we
(48:15):
got to add this, we got to do this, we
got to and if I I just called them all
and I said I'm done. Don't add another thing to
my schedule nothing. I said, I have two jobs coming
up that I need to have priority emotionally. I need
to be able to prepare for them. They are creative.
They have nothing to do with the book, the company equity. No, No,
(48:38):
they are my creative life. And if I don't keep
nurturing my creative life as an actress, I will become
bitter to all of your departments and I will become
difficult and I will say no before you even ask me.
And if you want to get your pound of flesh
out of me, this is what I need. And it
(48:59):
was so interesting to be this age and finally, you know,
and they all responded with great, we get it. Yeah yeah,
And I was like, damn it, Why did I do this?
But I earlier?
Speaker 2 (49:11):
Yeah, it's called boundaries.
Speaker 1 (49:12):
Found not good at them?
Speaker 2 (49:13):
But you know what you yeah? Yeah, I mean listen,
I always say. I mean, I'm a recovering people pleaser,
I'm a fixer. I to you know, single mom, codependent,
like all the stuff, and you just look at how
and I never I don't bemoan it and I don't
complain about it. It's how I was put together. And
(49:35):
I more just go like, oh well, I understand. Like,
by the way, maybe my tone is going to be
different because I'm not mad at you all for putting
it on my schedule. I'm more like, I see how
this happened. I was I'm going to do about it,
and you were being.
Speaker 1 (49:49):
You and now I'm going to just hit the reset
button and be like, we're going to do it different
from here on out.
Speaker 3 (49:54):
Yeah. Yeah, I'm going to do that anymore. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (49:57):
No, but I'll take it all on. I'll take it all.
Speaker 2 (50:00):
But you know what that being said, it's the blessing
and the curse because it's what I love about myself
so much, and it's also what can make things a
little tough sometimes.
Speaker 3 (50:09):
Yeah. And if you you know, when you start to
if you start to become a victim to it, then
it's on you to go, oh yeah, it doesn't fit anymore.
It used to feel me and now I don't like
the way that feels. I want to still be me,
but I'm just gonna carve it out a little differently.
Speaker 2 (50:25):
Yeah, yeah, and sometimes take a minute to do that.
I feel like, you know, I mean, everyone talks about this,
but everyone's just so in a rush. They like want
their answer for everything. Now you have to do it now,
and now we have all these smartphones so we actually
can do it now. And you can literally be sitting there.
Speaker 3 (50:41):
I know.
Speaker 2 (50:41):
And now I watched my fourteen year old Like, they
expect it from me. They expect how productive I can be.
They expect me to be able to order the thing.
Speaker 1 (50:52):
While calling the guy to then fix the thing.
Speaker 2 (50:56):
And it all happens so quick because I.
Speaker 3 (50:59):
Can't have before and you can.
Speaker 2 (51:01):
Yeah yeah, and now I'm like, oh right, this might
be yours to do.
Speaker 1 (51:05):
How about you take this?
Speaker 3 (51:06):
Yeah, I love you.
Speaker 2 (51:07):
Mommy loves you.
Speaker 3 (51:09):
You call well, no, you're eighteen, you actually have to
be the one to call.
Speaker 2 (51:15):
Yeah, Mommy loves you.
Speaker 1 (51:19):
This is Mommy loving you.
Speaker 3 (51:21):
Bye bye, oh boy, oh my god.
Speaker 2 (51:26):
Okay, Well I could talk to you all day, but
I think actually your people want you to go back
to work.
Speaker 3 (51:30):
Okay, I have to go back to work. I got
my next whatever it is.
Speaker 1 (51:35):
Yeah, I adore you.
Speaker 2 (51:36):
I like watching you in all the different iterations of you.
Certainly not reinventions, but thank you for allowing the world
access to the different parts of you. And and I'm
just grateful for you.
Speaker 3 (51:49):
Thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you. Happy New
Year and all the above stuff.
Speaker 2 (51:54):
Happy New Year, thanks bye bye.
Speaker 3 (52:00):
The ste took a
Speaker 2 (52:02):
Step and took him the feet
Hello, call it Crude.
Speaker 2 (00:01):
Camila and I are devastated by the fires and are
heart broken by the tragedy and the loss that Southern
California is currently experiencing.
Speaker 3 (00:10):
This episode was recorded before the fires here in Los Angeles,
and we will be dedicating a future episode to talk
all about it.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
Call It What It Is with Jessica Capshaw and Camil Luddington,
an iHeartRadio podcast.
Speaker 1 (00:35):
Well, Hello, hello, hello.
Speaker 2 (00:37):
And welcome to another episode of Call It What It Is.
You might have noticed that I said hello, Hello, hello,
and welcome to another episode of Call It What It Is,
because today I am missing one half of my heart,
the peanut butter to my jelly, the lemon to my lime.
Speaker 1 (00:58):
The what's the word?
Speaker 2 (01:01):
Inimitable Camilla Lettington. She would love that I said that,
and then she'd probably toss me a fake insult. But anyways,
today it is just me, or rather you get all
of me on a very special episode with the one
and only Brookshields.
Speaker 1 (01:19):
Brook Shields is.
Speaker 2 (01:21):
Honestly, I don't know that you could relegate one job
title to Brookshields.
Speaker 1 (01:26):
She's got lots.
Speaker 2 (01:28):
I feel like I first came to know her, or
like the first imprinted image is her in those sweet
ass tight Calan kline jeans on some giant billboard somewhere,
with her hair blowing in the wind, and that gorgeous
face and those shiny eyes and that bold brow and
just all of it was extra extra fantastic. That's the
(01:52):
feeling I feel like I first saw her, and then
I remember being new to the business and looking up
to her and seeing her around town, and she was
always so kind and lovely. And then I've continued to
run into her and have marveled and watched her weave
her way through many, many different jobs. She most recently
(02:18):
can be seen on and around town by the way,
in a bikini, flanked by her two gorgeous daughters who
are now in college, and after she has started an
inspirational community for women called Beginning is Now that is
transitioning into commence and basically just on the forefront of
all the things that I find myself wanting to talk
(02:40):
about as well. So please please welcome Brookshields. Well, first
of all, I'm so bummed because my partner in crime, Camilla,
got like a like like she's a real doctor or something,
got called into work at Gray's Anatomy so she's not
here with us today. And then I said, well, I
gotta say since I since I know Brooke, it's really
(03:01):
her loss, and there's just.
Speaker 1 (03:02):
More of you for me to have.
Speaker 3 (03:05):
We can handle this. We can totally handle it.
Speaker 1 (03:08):
We can talk and talk.
Speaker 2 (03:09):
Well, I was going to start with no matter who
was on I have a very for some reason, there's
like these memories of certain people that just get crystallized
and cemented in my brain. And I have this memory
of I don't know, I mean, being sort of feeling
still new and certainly not established on any level, and
(03:30):
going to one of those parties in Beverly Hills at
the new protest store, where you know, we'd all dressed
up and we'd been sent clothes, and while it seems
like it's glamorous, there's something super insecure about it. You're like,
am I wearing the right thing? Does this even look good?
Speaker 1 (03:44):
Who? Am I?
Speaker 2 (03:45):
Existential crises happen on the way there, all of it.
But I remember getting there and there's so many people there,
and it was a really fabulous party, and I came
around a corner and I saw you, and you were
definitely in the middle of doing something important, right like
you were you were there was photos being taken or whatever,
but you turned around and when your eyes met mine,
you just smiled and it was just like the warmest
(04:08):
ray of light and it was like an eyeball hug.
It was like, and I don't know, I don't know
how to like, I'm clearly making a mountain out of this,
but for whatever reason, that eyeball hug meant some sort
of confirmation of belonging for me at this party.
Speaker 3 (04:22):
All well, I think, you know, I do remember that,
and it's so funny you say, I was in the
middle of doing something important, like getting my picture taken,
which is I know, I know, but you know it's
very important. And I remember thinking, oh, I shouldn't have
picked this dress. This is a stupid dress to pick.
This is so not like chic. It's just too like
colorful and patterny. But that was the theme because they
(04:44):
projected all the patterns on the wall. It was like
this larger than life thing. And you know, I also
am so honestly a fan of people that I'm a
fan of that I watch like I'm a person who
if you come into my living room in any capacity,
I too feel like I know you, and I am like,
(05:04):
I'm a fan and I know you, and I take
it all very personally and like people do. And I remember,
you know, just going like, oh, oh good, she's here,
like okay, this is really cool and I don't really
really know her, but but okay, she looked beautiful and
I'm here, and why not just like have fun with it?
(05:26):
Like it just I think it just normalized it all
in a moment because we did make eye contact. And
normally when you go into those places, people are like this, yeah, yeah,
and they're out somebody else and nobody's looking like if
they shake your hand, they're like looking at who's more
famous over there? And yeah, you know, and it's.
Speaker 1 (05:45):
Yeah, like a l it is.
Speaker 2 (05:48):
But you know what, you bring up something that I
think is actually, I just think you're in such a
unique position of I'm I'm gonna even I'm going to
use the W word. I feel like you're going to
have some wisdom on this, which is we talk a
lot because we have write in and call in, and
we sort of were like, you know, we think we're
not at all, so we think we can give everyone,
you know, we think we at least have some kind
of answer, but so often what people are reporting and
(06:12):
feeling is self doubt, and so you brought up like, ah,
the first thing that came to mind, like top of mine,
was like, my dress is stupid, right, Like I'm not
wearing the right thing. And it's funny because we just
heard Demi Moore talk about this in her acceptance speech
the other night in the Golden Gumbs, where it's like
there's always going to be somebody, and sometimes it's you
that makes you feel not good enough or like the
(06:35):
dress you picked.
Speaker 3 (06:36):
Was rodd or not really deserving of being there or
And I think that's the plight of an actress or
a creative. You know, I've just recently read this beautiful
book on Margaret Wise Brown, who wrote run Away Bunny
and Good Night Moon. Yeah, and you know, and she
(06:57):
was made to feel less than because she wasn't an
adult writer. And she you know, she's one of the
most prolific children's book writers and one of the most
poetic sort of extraordinary minds. And you watch her Insecurity
blossom Insecurity's blossom at certain points and you think, like, wow,
this has been happening since the dawn of time, Like
(07:20):
is it a writer passage. What if we don't get
through it? What if we choose to stay in that
place of anxiety and insecurity and self doubt? And like
is that fair for us? And like you kind of
have to at least these conversations are now starting to
be had a little bit differently.
Speaker 2 (07:38):
Yeah, when those conversations are happening, do you find in
those moments of self doubt do you have are you
figuring out what your prescription is?
Speaker 3 (07:46):
Like?
Speaker 1 (07:47):
Is it?
Speaker 2 (07:47):
Is it talking to yourself? Is it phoning a friend?
Speaker 3 (07:50):
Is it? Sometimes it's and I said this today to
my older daughter. Sometimes it's as simple as saying nope, nope, nope, nope, nope, cancel, cancel, nope, nope, nope, nope,
nope no and shift and go like puppies kiddies from
my laundry, and you distract and then you kind of
(08:12):
like shift, and then I start usually thinking of like, Okay,
you're fifty nine years old, are yes still going to
do this shift to yourself? Are yes still going to
let it take your time? Or are you going to
just say okay, that's a part of what happens to me.
But can I make it fuel me to ask more
(08:36):
questions about what I want my future. You know, I
want this job. Howboud I ask for that job? Or
how about I put myself out there? Or how a
would I say? You know what, I'm going to say
yes to that because it's something that is out of
my comfort zone. I'm going to learn and then you
you sort of make it a little bit more proactive.
(08:56):
And in that period of time when you realize the
world hasn't imploded because you're wearing the wrong dress and
that nobody really cares what dress you aren't wearing because
they're worried about their own outfit, you start to just
go like, oh, oh, I want to release myself from
this because nothing is coming out of it that is productive. Yeah,
(09:19):
and sometimes there is a productivity in feeling insecure because
it causes me at times to take on things that
I'm afraid of, you know, So you have to kind
of be willing to be honest about what it is. Okay,
golden gloves aren't perfect example, right, you know the way
(09:41):
she was talking about her trajectory, her history, and how
riddled with that that she was insecure. Right, So I
can look at somebody like that, and I can look
at them as a contemporary and say, yeah, I get it.
I get it, and you know I do want that validation.
(10:01):
But I'm not but but my not but forgetting it
tonight to the last night whatever doesn't take it away
from me. Like when you're young, you sort of think
there's a limited allotment of finance.
Speaker 2 (10:16):
Yeah, yeah, that people are allowed.
Speaker 3 (10:19):
And yes there's certain roles and we all don't get
them because some adult gets them. Whatever.
Speaker 2 (10:24):
That's the nature so many times, Brooks, so many times.
Speaker 3 (10:27):
Majority the majority of my life.
Speaker 1 (10:32):
I know, talk about daughter talk.
Speaker 2 (10:34):
I say it all the time, especially when those daughters
paint me with like you're perfect. I'm like, do you
know how many do you know the percentage of jobs
I've actually gotten? Two percentage of jobs I have auditioned.
Speaker 3 (10:43):
For, I've gotten two.
Speaker 2 (10:45):
I gets like point two percent I've gotten too. I mean,
I might as well have never got a job in
my life. I've never worked. You made me think of
(11:06):
you made me think well. I mean, I love Taylor Swift.
I don't know where you land on, Taylor.
Speaker 3 (11:10):
But oh I had the best time in my life
there at the dancing with her mother.
Speaker 2 (11:14):
It was serial Yeah mom, I mean she's the best.
She's the best. She was so kind to my daughter.
She gave her the bracelet off her wrist.
Speaker 3 (11:23):
She gave one to my daughters too. I was like, oh,
I mean, she's taken that friendship bracelet thing.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
And Poppy looked at me and was like, is this
for real?
Speaker 1 (11:33):
And like should I take it?
Speaker 2 (11:34):
And I was like, yes, you should, and you should
say thank you, ma'am, thank you.
Speaker 3 (11:38):
You should give her one of yours.
Speaker 1 (11:39):
Yeah, oh no, she was. She was the initial offerer.
Speaker 2 (11:42):
But I remember watching the documentary and then again, who
knows why these things stick in her head, but I
remember when she was talking about her relationship with food
and when she had a thorny one and when she
was not that was not sustainable and that was not
literally nutritive. And I remember her saying, always fact check me,
because sometimes I remember things differently than they are. But
(12:03):
I remember her saying that her mantra in those moments
of self doubt about that particular issue was we're not
going to do that.
Speaker 1 (12:12):
We're not going to do that.
Speaker 2 (12:13):
We're not going to do that anymore. We're just not
going to do that anymore. And I remember, I mean,
it was definitely for me reserved. I think I had
more of it younger, but holy me, I still have.
I still have a storage room for I remember, especially
in the moments of you know, kind of having to
show up to something, being on the you know, going
into an audition or something, and catching a reflection of
(12:33):
myself in the in the window, you know, as I
walked away from my car, and I remember being the
thoughts that went through my mind were so unkind to
that reflection, and I remember being like, what is going on?
Why am I being so unkind to myself? And it's
only making the self doubt worse. It's not setting me
up for success an X, Y and Z and all that.
(12:53):
And then I remember thinking different way in if anyone
spoke to if I spoke to anyone the way that
I speak to myself, right, I would have I would
have zero friends, and I have a lot of friends.
And I'm so grateful for my friends and I feel
so supportive. So what if I treated myself like I
(13:17):
was my friend?
Speaker 3 (13:19):
Mm hmm.
Speaker 2 (13:20):
And it really did like that for me. The self
doubt exactly what you said, like the conversations with yourself
interrupting the cycle saying nope, like, nope, not on my watch,
Like you're not going to fucking say that to her,
not on my watch.
Speaker 3 (13:33):
You know. And what's interesting is the two things that
you've just said, you've kind of spoken in third person.
And I think that that's a really interesting psychology that
makes it easier for us to take said mantra. Because
if if if we go back to our normal of
(13:55):
our normal tapes and we say I, and it's like, well,
I look fat, I look stupid, I look old, I'm
too tall, i'm too short, I'm too lily, that it
immediately goes right back in. But if we say no,
we're not going to do that. We are a team here,
and this is collected, like and when you say I'm
(14:17):
going to speak to myself, you're creating just enough distance
so that our psyche can make it less self induced.
If you think about the way the synapses work and
the way that the brain works, like that stuff is
so interesting to me because that is what I think
(14:38):
is a really healthy way of doing it. I mean,
I had something one time similar. It was I don't
look in the mirror, right Like I refuse to look
in the mirror for years and years and years now
I do, but for years I didn't. I wouldn't. I
wouldn't look in the mirror. I wouldn't like and in
dance class, I would just fall flat on my cocksit
(15:00):
and I would be in such pain. And then I
was doing this movie where I was I had to
be like walk in looking like ba vum and kind
of sexy and sort of like great, but I had
to deliver some tippid line of something. I don't know
what it was. And I was so out of like
(15:25):
my own periphery that I didn't I was so unaware
of where I was coming from that repeatedly I kept
running into the wall and it was funny because it
was like, oh, look how clumsy she is. She should
probably be a comedian, Like oh look how Yeah, you
think she's a supermodel, but she's really a you know, klutz.
(15:47):
And that was just you know, that was where the
crew went and everybody because I think they were embarrassed
for me. But I remember thinking like, oh, that's so
interesting because you weren't willing to take in who you
were enough to understand your peripheral, Like I physically walked
(16:08):
into the wall. Five takes in a row, and then
I started thinking, oh my god, I've got a neurological problem,
like this is crazy. And then I took a dance
class and my teacher was like, if you don't spot
and look at yourself, you're never going to be able
to turn. You will never be able to make a
(16:30):
turn on stage if you don't have a focal point.
And while we're in class, the focal point is the
mirror and if you can't handle what you see in
the mirror, then you shouldn't be dancing at all. And
it was like really tough. It was like harsh, and
I was like, I don't want to. He goes, nobody cares.
They're looking at their own faces in the mirror. If
(16:53):
you don't do it, you're on your own and don't
I don't know, Like he was so frustrated with me,
but it was like love and it was It reminded
me of that Dove ad where the women described themselves
to an artist who's behind a black curtain and then
describes a woman that they were part of it. And
in every case, the way they described themselves was witchy
(17:16):
and hard and angry and mean, and the way the
other person described them was like regal and strong jaw
and ye yeah, fierce, and you just kind of go like, Okay,
we've been doing this to ourselves for quite some time.
Are we going to stop that behavior?
Speaker 2 (17:35):
Yeah, because you're the only one that can do. You
remember a time where that was a daily, daily like
the hardest for you, or like the lesson that you
needed to learn to get past it to move on
to the next thing.
Speaker 3 (17:49):
I mean, I think there was a when I was
on Broadway. I was so one of the times I
was on Broadway, I was so it was so precious
to me doing a Wonderful Town, which was a musical
comedy where I had to sing, dance and be comedic
and all of this at the same time. And I
(18:11):
remember thinking, like, you were going to have to use
these six months, eight shows a week to stop sabotaging
yourself and stop and like and stop doing those ritualistic
OCD things that you do because you feel like if
you don't put your miscra on in the same period
(18:34):
of time that you count to put your lip on,
like whatever the thing was, I had frenzied myself into control.
I'm going to.
Speaker 2 (18:41):
Step on control, needing control.
Speaker 3 (18:45):
And so I went in one day and I started
absolutely doing everything out of order, and I waited till
the last minute to get to the theater, and I
did all these things that would have been like made
me not like really struggle, and I was fine. I
was fine on mistakes. The world didn't fall apart. Yeah,
(19:05):
And I thought, think of all the time you waste
trying to control yourself, when if you just were awake
enough to stay in the moment, you'd probably be okay.
Speaker 1 (19:17):
Yeah, but it's but you need to prove it to yourself.
Speaker 3 (19:19):
I needed to go through the discomfort of like, yeah,
you know, being chicken lit alone, the world's guy's going
to fall apart.
Speaker 1 (19:27):
Yeah, yeah, for sure, for sure.
Speaker 2 (19:29):
And it's funny because you know you were talking about
talking to your daughter, and you know, I've got three
daughters and a son, and and I think you so
badly want to just like hook up like a connector
where you can like download all of this stuff we're
talking about so you can like spare them these moments
that they go through.
Speaker 1 (19:50):
And then you have this moment of.
Speaker 2 (19:52):
Realization where it's like, oh, just like you said, like
I wouldn't count insecuritys, like I wouldn't put in.
Speaker 3 (19:59):
My positive.
Speaker 2 (20:01):
But if you can, if you can contextualize it, if
you can synthesize it in your body and then have
it come out as humility, right instead of insecurity. Maybe
it's just like me understanding that, you know, not it's
the opposite of grandiose, like I'm not all that in
a bag of chips, but I'm pretty proud of myself.
Speaker 3 (20:17):
I also think humility can be a dangerous word if
not mind appropriately, because humility can in some instances. And
I've learned this because of self deprecation. Right, I've taken
self deprecation to like a whole new level of like
it's who I am. And when you do that too
(20:39):
much to yourself, over the course of years, you start
seeing yourself as less than right if you're not careful. Right, Yeah, yeah,
I I do think that there's a uh. I like
the word humility better than I like the word humble.
But I do feel like our humility needs to be
extended to ourselves, not necessarily to the outside, because you know,
(21:05):
I took it to such a I would I would
like back out of rooms or come in and say
I'm sorry, or instead of just excuse me, everything was
I'm sorry, I'm sorry, and I was like apologizing for
living and then you start feeling like, oh god, I
don't know why I feel so bad about myself. Yeah,
so's so I try to say to my girls, you know,
(21:28):
respect is a huge, huge thing to integrate into your lives.
And that is respect for yourself without arrogance, because I
used to I used to equate that with arrogance and
respect for others, others, time, others, you know, feelings at
that moment. Just try to be aware of them, don't
(21:49):
undermine yourself so much to uphold them. But again, you know,
really try to listen, listen to Okay, so you're nervous
about this, right, My daughter went into like a really
kind of interesting job where she had to be in
service and I said, you know, make yourself indispensable and
(22:14):
and she's like, well, that's I can't think of myself
that way. And I said, no, no, don't walk in
thinking you're better than everybody. Walk in and say how
can I help you this job? What can I do
in this position to make your said job more you know,
run smoothly? And I said, in over time, you will
(22:35):
start feeling needed for the right reasons, and then your
own self worth will kind of find its spot and
you're never going to be arrogant. It's not in your DNA,
you know what.
Speaker 2 (22:47):
I think that that's also it's sometimes I feel really
small in the world, and I feel like the problems
are all too big, and I do tend to feel
comforted by getting really small in like what can I affect?
You know, like I really I personally, there's not a
(23:10):
lot I can do about things that are happening across
the world or or things that are just bigger balls
to unwind. But I can smile at a stranger. I
can make someone feel valued and and and special, and
that is really important to do when you can, when
you have the power to do it, it's really important
(23:31):
to do well.
Speaker 3 (23:32):
It's Taylor's mom giving our daughters stuff in the gold bracelet.
Like it's if they're gestures. Yeah, you know, it's like
if I'm walking on the street, and you know, I
mean usually it goes like this, someone will say, oh,
you're still beautiful.
Speaker 2 (23:50):
Yeah, it's one of those other than you're actually beautiful.
Speaker 3 (23:53):
Yeah, No, I've gotten or you're you're actually pretty in person.
I got one or it was favorite anyway. They're just
it's these crazy things. But when someone when anybody says
anything complimentary, I immediately turn it back around and I
say you are so beautiful. And it never fails. The
(24:17):
person will go thank you, thank you, Brooke, and I'll
be like, have the right day, and I walk on.
And it's just it's that it a little goes a
long way. And I think that there are symbols of that,
whether it's Taylor Swift and her front of bracelets or
the messaging in her songs, or how she treats what
(24:37):
looks like she treats every fan. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (24:40):
No, well she's role modeling goodness and that that wasn't.
Speaker 3 (24:44):
That's so necessary.
Speaker 2 (24:46):
It didn't used to be so cool to be kind,
And now it does feel like there's a culture and
a and a and a movement toward kindness, not in
all circles, but in quite a few. Okay, I have
(25:11):
a question because I was also thinking about you. Oh,
I've been thinking about you for a couple of days
because I knew I was guess you, and I was
thinking just looking back, looking back and looking forward. You
really have touched in so many different aspects of entertainment.
Like you have done so many things, and I find
(25:33):
you in conversation and whenever I run into you, I'm
always so happy because I find you and everything you're
saying about yourself, I absolutely I know it's true. But
there's this there's this willingness that I see in you
that's like, Okay, I mean, you know, I know you
wouldn't say this, but you know you're You're the Calvin
Klein gorgeous, gorgeous gorgeousness, and the winds are blowing and
(25:55):
the hair is blowing and all the things, and you're
so beautiful. And there's this there's this aspect of entertainment,
right because we're creating these big images and then it's like, oh, hey,
so what about being you know, what about being on
a TV show?
Speaker 1 (26:07):
There's Brooke, she's willing. Yes, you're at a TV show.
You're making people.
Speaker 2 (26:10):
Laugh, you're singing and dancing on stage. Yes, there you are.
And I think that that's not a very common thing
to be so willing, and I love it. I think
it's I'm using it as a compliment, by the way,
because I find that, you know, one of the biggest
disruptors to life is people who are unwilling, like unwilling
to just go. You know, there're the people whenever you
(26:30):
ask them, they're like no, You're like, oh, I just
want you to jump in, But do you have do
you know where your willingness came from?
Speaker 3 (26:39):
You?
Speaker 1 (26:39):
Did you were you?
Speaker 3 (26:40):
Just?
Speaker 1 (26:40):
Were you born?
Speaker 3 (26:41):
Like that?
Speaker 1 (26:41):
Did you see it go the other way? And you're like,
uh ah, I'm going to be I'm going to jump in.
Speaker 2 (26:45):
Like where did that adventure and where did that willingness
come from?
Speaker 3 (26:50):
Well, thank you for that. That is a very positive
view of I fit well, how I've chosen to live
my life. But I think it's because I don't I
don't like limitations that are put on me by other
people who have no idea what my capacity is. I
(27:11):
don't even understand maybe my capability or my talent or
my capacity or whatever it is. And so when you
get denied access, which we've talked about before, but when
when you are not picked, overlooked, not chosen whatever, this
crazy thing that we as actresses are subjected to, and
(27:33):
you've been on some pedestal that you really didn't mean,
not asked to be on it, and then you're knocked
off it and they just are thriving on that watching
you kind of flail in their opinion, you know, the
public opinion or press or whatever. You start to say like,
am I going to let myself be limited constantly by
(27:56):
something that I have no control over? Or I'm just
going to keep saying yes, especially if I'm afraid. And
you know, it's not like, oh, by choice, I chose
not to be in films anymore, and I was going
to go be on television or being on Broadway. Those
were things that were the only ones available to me.
Speaker 2 (28:18):
But imagine if you hadn't been willing.
Speaker 3 (28:21):
You know, part of it is like, oh, I got
so happy, I got in divited to that party, and
it just I felt like, I think every opportunity that
I've gotten has been a gift because they don't come often,
you know, they don't come all the time or often,
and I think.
Speaker 2 (28:39):
That sometimes you have to make them. I mean, look
at them. Listen, I'm looking at your whole life and
on pieces of paper and notes and all the things
that i've you know, that I've just seen you do.
And there's a lot, you know, I mean, there's a
lot of redirection, and there's a lot of you know, passion, and.
Speaker 3 (28:55):
You know what, people say it's reinvention, and I always say, like,
you know what, I wasn't broken enough to need to
be reinvented. I just needed to keep being revealed and
like I'll raise my hand and I'll be like, oh,
could I want to try that? Yeah, just because I've
(29:16):
I've felt the success like and I felt it in
college more than anything. You know, I tried out for
a dance company and I did university.
Speaker 2 (29:25):
So it's always good to say because it's just really impressive.
Speaker 3 (29:29):
Well, but like I didn't get into this dance company
and I didn't get into this singing group, and I
just remember feeling like such a failure and thinking like
how can I be an actress and not know how
to do this? Like what is wrong with me? Maybe
I am just a celebrity and I am just this.
Maybe I'm sort of smart, but like and so I thought, okay,
(29:50):
well what are you going to do about it? And
I spent that summer taking dance lessons, taking singing lessons,
And I went back and I got into the dance
company and I got into the musical theater group, and
I had a whole life that wasn't afforded to me
before because I hadn't worked hard enough for it. Maybe
(30:11):
I don't know.
Speaker 1 (30:12):
Yeah, but you were also you were willing to.
Speaker 2 (30:14):
You were willing to, you were willing to take the
know and like direct yourselves into having earned it.
Speaker 1 (30:20):
It sounds like I was willing to fail.
Speaker 2 (30:22):
I think, yeah, yeah, you have to. You have to
be real willing to fail in life. That's the thing
I think some people don't get when they when they
when they talk about the self doubt. I think it's
it's really important what you just said. If you doubt
yourself all the time, Okay, fine, that's being human. But
I find that a lot of people who get stuck
in that decide to just stop trying, to like stop doing,
(30:46):
to stop moving forward. And I think it's like that's
where you.
Speaker 1 (30:49):
I love all this.
Speaker 2 (30:50):
I love this is My favorite thing about Instagram is
all the sayings. I take screenshots of them all and
I put them in my little pocket and I go, like,
you know what I mean, Like you know, if you
if you don't ask the answers, usually I always know,
or if you don't ask the answers always going to
be no.
Speaker 1 (31:02):
Right, It's like, yes, you have to keep going.
Speaker 2 (31:04):
You have to, you have to keep going forward, and
then you'll sort of earn the confidence because you'll know
that you can do it.
Speaker 3 (31:14):
And also you say, I say that to my girls,
I'm like, I can guarantee you won't get into that
college if you don't apply. Yeah, Like I can guarantee it.
Speaker 1 (31:21):
Like, yeah, it's one of the shots you don't take.
I'm telling you. I've got a lot of them. I've
got a lot of them. I'll get on my phone.
I got a whole file.
Speaker 3 (31:29):
I have those dads that have it at the bottom,
you know. And it's like it's always like somebody really
cool has said it in like the early nineteen hundreds
and you're just like, yes, what would you do if
you knew you could not fail?
Speaker 2 (31:40):
And you're like, yeah, yeah, all of them, all of them,
all of them. Okay, So if you if you, I
mean you, you didn't know you couldn't fail. But in
this now, in the beginning is now phase, what is
the thing that is top of mind for you right now?
Like what's the thing I always find that there's like
something that comes up and it's like the thing you
can't stop talking.
Speaker 3 (31:59):
About is that when you are a part of something
like a startup, you have to know that part of it.
So part of what you were talking about before is
accepting victimhood. I think it's when we choose not to
move through something and we choose to be a martyr
(32:20):
about it or a victim to it, right, And you
can say, whatever it is sucks, but what am I
going to do about it? And when you are part
of something like a company that you have decided to
start and you put your money into it, and then
you lose that money and then you have to get
more money and then you spend that money, but you
(32:42):
all the while you're kind of blindly saying to yourself,
I believe in the mission, I believe in the vision.
I'm not going to let go. I'm not going to
let go. I've heard these stories. I've heard people say
we failed and we pulled ourselves up, and we did.
And that has been the thing that has been the
most sort of a chute for me is taking those
(33:02):
moments where I am unable to sleep and I'm afraid
and i'm and money is looming as a problem. But
you know that the larger message that you started this
whole thing for is the thing that you cannot deny.
That is to be that afraid and keep forging ahead,
(33:27):
and then to look back four years later and say,
look how far we've come. Look at what just the
last seven months have been. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (33:37):
I remember running into you by the way in New
York City. I was with a friend and you were
at Cafe Cliney and you were like, I'm starting something.
It's really exciting, I'm figuring it out. I don't know
you were. It was a table of I feel like
you had like maybe four people around you, and it
was just like I remember being like, I can't wait
to see what this is.
Speaker 3 (33:59):
Well, I went to interest was it started for the
right reasons, and the community that was built out of
beginning is now.
Speaker 4 (34:06):
Has now become a fully more fully flushed out whole
vision and mission for women over forty to really help
solve problems that they're encountering.
Speaker 2 (34:21):
Which problem is are you all do you feel like
is being solved that you're most proud of?
Speaker 3 (34:25):
At first, it was the community like you are not alone.
I am not alone. I am pissed that only one
percent of all marketing and advertisement has women sixty plus
in it. That is unheard of.
Speaker 4 (34:40):
You know.
Speaker 3 (34:40):
I'm when people say, oh, do you think Hollywood's changing
in their writing stories for women of a certain age,
And I say yes, like it's great. But here's to me,
we are actually even more interesting than the divorcee who
now is sleeping with a twenty year old, Like, we
are actually these unbelievable women that have so much that
(35:02):
we bring to the table. And when you I've recently
been able to work with some actresses who are older,
and they come to the table with everything, including their
little girl selves and their insecurities, including their knowledge and
their history and their experience, and you say to yourself, like,
(35:24):
that is what's becoming a part of the conversation. So like,
to me, that's been the most rewarding is having conversations
with women all over the world and they're still saying
like thank you, we didn't feel represented. But now let's
look at these these things we're encountering and not look
(35:44):
at them like oh, it's the beginning of the end
and you're decrepit, but like, let's look at them and
let's solve these problems.
Speaker 1 (35:52):
Well how about look at them.
Speaker 2 (35:53):
I mean, we have there's so many other cultures that
put such a huge value on age and maturity, right.
Speaker 3 (36:00):
The ones, Yes, here's the cheap in the everything and
that you know.
Speaker 2 (36:05):
Absolutely and now I mean, you know, I think, I mean,
I'm just such a huge fan and I've of self
care and I you know, I'm on most to do lists.
I put myself last because I also am like in
the thick of it with the kids and everything else.
But I I find that, you know, the more that
we have the access and proximity to being able to
(36:26):
take care of ourselves, It's like I'm looking at all
these just women that are not only you know, have
have more experience and have different experience and bring all
this value. But they're also going like, and I'm going
to be I'm going to I'm going to value my health.
I'm going to value being fit. I'm going to value
how I feed myself. I'm going to speak about myself kindly.
(36:50):
I'm going to you know, I'm going to bring all
these lessons and I'm going to share them with everyone.
I think that that's I feel like that's happening in
a really big way. Maybe I just wasn't around it
because as I was around all people that were you know, younger,
But I just I find that it's so universal these days,
like it feels like it's you're really much around it.
Speaker 3 (37:09):
Well. I also think that like we call at commence,
we call ourselves a care brand, and our whole motto
is take care. And when I say that, there's a
narrative different reasons that that sort of you know, brings
up and we're so talks about it's like, take care
of yourself because you deserve it. Take the care that's
(37:32):
available to you from the people who feed you positively
in your life, you know, take care to not play
those tapes over in your head that diminish your value
in your own eye, you know, take the take yourself
and care for yourself and say, like that group of girls,
I don't feel good about myself when I'm when I'm
(37:54):
around them or that person or or that job or
that doesn't me It doesn't help me, and I leave
feeling smaller. So that means to me, that's really understanding
what it means to take care of ourselves so that
we can how do we want to live our lives
(38:14):
in the most care generating way, you know, And that's
our whole vision, you know, we say it commenced, like
we want to encourage women to live, and we say
fearlessly and we say optimistically and joyfully. But it's not
a pressure. It's that you've earned this position in your
(38:38):
actual life because you've done so much for so many
other people. You've come so far, and you deserve to
care about who you are as a person and feel
really good about that. Like you deserve to love yourself.
Like it sounds like another magnet on a refrigerator, but
it's a real thing. And when you start that. I
(39:01):
remember saying to myself once I was going into some
job that I felt in over my head about and
and I like, I just felt like I was sort
of going to drown in it. And I said, I
wonder how you would walk into the room if you
really just said you're enough. Brooke, Like, yeah, it sounds
(39:22):
like dorky, but you're kind of like, oh, I might
just be good enough. Yeah, be alive. Where you know,
we're not taught that as younger people.
Speaker 2 (39:46):
Did you have anyone when you were younger that felt
wise in that in the way that like that could
that that.
Speaker 1 (39:51):
Sort of pulled you up?
Speaker 2 (39:54):
That was like, Brooke, there's this there's this other way
of looking at it.
Speaker 3 (39:59):
I mean, actually, no, I think most of the people
that I sort of like my mother who I looked
up to, I felt responsible for keeping her alive like
so that that comes with a lot of self doubt
in other ways.
Speaker 2 (40:13):
Well an a codependency, so.
Speaker 3 (40:15):
Yeah, for sure and in an ameshment, but there were
some male relationships that I had that sort of reverted
the mirror back to me and said, you know, I
want you to see yourself the way I see you,
like this is what I fell in love with. I'd
like you to see that person because if you knew
(40:36):
her like, if you knew her, bless them like her
like And you know, one of my early early relationships
that I was able to be that was a huge
part of it, one of my more serious relationships. None
of them worked out in the long run. I mean, thankfully.
Speaker 2 (40:54):
Isn't that amazing how that's such a gift where it
doesn't work out and you're like killing yourself. Well, I
have a question when you were in your when you
were starting out, And again, by the way, I maybe
I'm making this up, but I feel like I I
remember seeing the billboards like I actually remember the Calvin
Kline billboards being oh I remember those being up. But
at that part of your life, who was like your
(41:17):
super biggest like who was who was like the crushworthiest?
Speaker 1 (41:22):
Like who were you like? Because you were like you
were kind of.
Speaker 2 (41:25):
The tippy top, Like what is the tippy top? Like
you workus again, I think a wind machine, fology wherever
you went. In my mind, that's the story I'm making up.
Speaker 1 (41:32):
You would just walk down the street.
Speaker 2 (41:34):
It would be like, oh, Brook, good Brook.
Speaker 3 (41:37):
Yeah, that's the way I. I slept my best, so
I got out of bed. I had a wind machine
put in my bedroom, just like I loved No. I
mean it was funny because I liked certain movies right,
but I like I loved the fact that John travill
To dance the way he did like Robin Williams, like
(41:58):
so funny, genius. My my life is like like I
I went like Comedians, like I went any sexy Lucille Ball,
I went like I. I didn't have heart throbs as
much because most of the heart throbs I had already
worked with.
Speaker 1 (42:17):
And they were kind of boring.
Speaker 3 (42:19):
They were just such work was sweet, but they were.
Speaker 2 (42:24):
True big generalization alert But yes, the more handsome, the
more boring or a lot of work are.
Speaker 3 (42:33):
Just boys, and they needed so much attention, and I
was just like, uh, hi, I'm not playing this game anymore.
And so I got like so just like like little girl,
I'm like, they bother me. I don't like, you know,
and everybody's like, oh my god, everybody's in love with them,
and I'm just like, oh, rolling my eyes, like you know,
(42:57):
and like the little sister that is just so over
the sibling that's getting all the attention, and you're just
kind of you get petulant about it, you know. So
I wasn't. I didn't fall into the same category of
heart throbs, you know, because my heart throbs were like
David Cassidy and you know, Scott Beao and late Garrett BeO.
(43:20):
I mean, you were like, it's so funny like to
now look back and you just kind of go like, oh,
those are my scrap books of you know, heart throbs.
Speaker 1 (43:30):
Did you ever get to meet? Did you ever did you.
Speaker 3 (43:33):
Ever send one of them? I met every one of them.
Speaker 1 (43:35):
And okay, so so don't you don't need to name names.
Speaker 2 (43:37):
But like percentage wise mostly lived up to the hype
or mostly didn't.
Speaker 3 (43:43):
You know, not the same kind of hype that we
were all putting them up against. Yeah, they just got
to be too human too quickly. Yeah. But I remember
Scott Bao gave me a corsage on my wrist and
I was like, oh, he's.
Speaker 2 (44:02):
And I was like, yeah, at the beginning of a date,
like he pulled up and had a corsage.
Speaker 3 (44:07):
Yeah, like there's We went to some party and.
Speaker 1 (44:10):
I was gonna say, were you going to a dance?
Speaker 3 (44:11):
It wasn't a prom or anything. It was just like
a party I think in Hollywood, and like the Scottie
brothers were I don't know.
Speaker 2 (44:17):
Do you think his mom called him and was like,
I'm sure you got to pick up you got to
pick up a corsage. Yeah, you're on a date with Brickshews.
You gotta have a corsage, yeah, she probably.
Speaker 1 (44:28):
And did you wear it? Did you want to wear
it with pride? Okay?
Speaker 3 (44:31):
I love it?
Speaker 2 (44:32):
I love it?
Speaker 1 (44:33):
Okay, great, I love it.
Speaker 3 (44:35):
Well.
Speaker 1 (44:36):
I love chatting with you.
Speaker 2 (44:37):
I really do anytime anywhere, by accident or on purpose.
And thank you so much for spending this time with me.
Speaker 3 (44:44):
Thank you, thank you so much for having me And
tell your partner in crime that we missed her.
Speaker 2 (44:50):
I know, I know she's gonna be she well, she
already is so bummed. We talked about it and I
was like, but.
Speaker 3 (44:55):
She's making a difference. She's making you guys authentic.
Speaker 2 (44:59):
I know she's responding to some medical you know, major
minor medical drama, which is awesome.
Speaker 3 (45:05):
I know, how great to be able to be called
in for that. I know.
Speaker 2 (45:08):
Guess she's given America what she wants. She said it
was because someone uh got sick after the holidays. And
then I talked to last night and her voice sounded
funny and I was like, why does your voice sound funny?
And she's like, because I'm sick, and I was like, okay,
so everybody's sick.
Speaker 1 (45:22):
It's just like I remember having.
Speaker 2 (45:25):
I mean, I know you have these stories, but I
remember being shocked by it. I remember calling up our
main producer, who was like the line producer, and being like,
I'm really sick, Like I do not feel well.
Speaker 3 (45:36):
I felt like.
Speaker 2 (45:37):
Swallowing glass shards. And he was like, so, okay, but
what are you trying to say. I think I don't
think I should be at work, like I think I'm
really sick, and he was like, okay, but then I'll
call a doctor. I'll call a doctor, and the doctors
would come.
Speaker 3 (45:53):
And give you a B twelve shot.
Speaker 1 (45:54):
Yeah, they'd give you a B twelve shot to I
don't know. I mean, I guess, I don't know.
Speaker 2 (45:59):
Yeah, lob you this was pre COVID, so it wasn't
even like they said, like, and maybe you should put
on my mask so you don't give everyone else on
the set strep throat. But yeah, I remember, just like
that show must go on.
Speaker 3 (46:11):
Yeah, I got I found out I was pregnant right
before I started Chicago on Broadway, and I remember thinking like,
oh god, oh god, I'm going to get tired. And
I and I I didn't tell anybody, and I just
told my and I said, went to my doctor and
I'm like, I'm supposed to go do this show. And
he said, well, knowing you, you will work out during pregnancy,
(46:34):
so just don't work out in addition to the show.
And I he's like, because your body's going to be
able to be fine because you've worked out through your
other pregnancy and that's what you do, so just don't
overdo it and don't work out in addition to and
then when I started to show, I had to like
(46:54):
take my more drone person aside and say like, hey,
you know those like waists and and she goes, I
see nothing, I know nothing. I think you've been eating
too many pieces of candy. And I'm just gonna I'm
gonna let your costumes out. And she didn't tell anybody,
but we had to keep it a secret. And and
(47:17):
then finally I was like nearing the end of my
run and it was obvious like that I was, you know,
she was.
Speaker 1 (47:28):
Troublemaker, that.
Speaker 3 (47:30):
Totally. But another thing too, It's like I just recently
had to call a big meeting with everybody because I
was starting to get unhealthy because of my schedule. And
every day more is added to it, and there's more
and more and more and more, and it's for the
book tour and it's for this and it's for that,
and everybody's just doing their job, and I keep thinking, oh,
(47:52):
they're going to see that. I'm starting to like pray here.
And and I woke up like New Year's Day kind
of after sort of separating myself for a bit, and
I was thinking, no, they're not, they're not. They are
not going to think of you and be like, oh,
well she might be overextended. No, they think, oh, we
(48:15):
got to add this, we got to do this, we
got to and if I I just called them all
and I said I'm done. Don't add another thing to
my schedule nothing. I said, I have two jobs coming
up that I need to have priority emotionally. I need
to be able to prepare for them. They are creative.
They have nothing to do with the book, the company equity. No, No,
(48:38):
they are my creative life. And if I don't keep
nurturing my creative life as an actress, I will become
bitter to all of your departments and I will become
difficult and I will say no before you even ask me.
And if you want to get your pound of flesh
out of me, this is what I need. And it
(48:59):
was so interesting to be this age and finally, you know,
and they all responded with great, we get it. Yeah yeah,
And I was like, damn it, Why did I do this?
But I earlier?
Speaker 2 (49:11):
Yeah, it's called boundaries.
Speaker 1 (49:12):
Found not good at them?
Speaker 2 (49:13):
But you know what you yeah? Yeah, I mean listen,
I always say. I mean, I'm a recovering people pleaser,
I'm a fixer. I to you know, single mom, codependent,
like all the stuff, and you just look at how
and I never I don't bemoan it and I don't
complain about it. It's how I was put together. And
(49:35):
I more just go like, oh well, I understand. Like,
by the way, maybe my tone is going to be
different because I'm not mad at you all for putting
it on my schedule. I'm more like, I see how
this happened. I was I'm going to do about it,
and you were being.
Speaker 1 (49:49):
You and now I'm going to just hit the reset
button and be like, we're going to do it different
from here on out.
Speaker 3 (49:54):
Yeah. Yeah, I'm going to do that anymore. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (49:57):
No, but I'll take it all on. I'll take it all.
Speaker 2 (50:00):
But you know what that being said, it's the blessing
and the curse because it's what I love about myself
so much, and it's also what can make things a
little tough sometimes.
Speaker 3 (50:09):
Yeah. And if you you know, when you start to
if you start to become a victim to it, then
it's on you to go, oh yeah, it doesn't fit anymore.
It used to feel me and now I don't like
the way that feels. I want to still be me,
but I'm just gonna carve it out a little differently.
Speaker 2 (50:25):
Yeah, yeah, and sometimes take a minute to do that.
I feel like, you know, I mean, everyone talks about this,
but everyone's just so in a rush. They like want
their answer for everything. Now you have to do it now,
and now we have all these smartphones so we actually
can do it now. And you can literally be sitting there.
Speaker 3 (50:41):
I know.
Speaker 2 (50:41):
And now I watched my fourteen year old Like, they
expect it from me. They expect how productive I can be.
They expect me to be able to order the thing.
Speaker 1 (50:52):
While calling the guy to then fix the thing.
Speaker 2 (50:56):
And it all happens so quick because I.
Speaker 3 (50:59):
Can't have before and you can.
Speaker 2 (51:01):
Yeah yeah, and now I'm like, oh right, this might
be yours to do.
Speaker 1 (51:05):
How about you take this?
Speaker 3 (51:06):
Yeah, I love you.
Speaker 2 (51:07):
Mommy loves you.
Speaker 3 (51:09):
You call well, no, you're eighteen, you actually have to
be the one to call.
Speaker 2 (51:15):
Yeah, Mommy loves you.
Speaker 1 (51:19):
This is Mommy loving you.
Speaker 3 (51:21):
Bye bye, oh boy, oh my god.
Speaker 2 (51:26):
Okay, Well I could talk to you all day, but
I think actually your people want you to go back
to work.
Speaker 3 (51:30):
Okay, I have to go back to work. I got
my next whatever it is.
Speaker 1 (51:35):
Yeah, I adore you.
Speaker 2 (51:36):
I like watching you in all the different iterations of you.
Certainly not reinventions, but thank you for allowing the world
access to the different parts of you. And and I'm
just grateful for you.
Speaker 3 (51:49):
Thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you. Happy New
Year and all the above stuff.
Speaker 2 (51:54):
Happy New Year, thanks bye bye.
Speaker 3 (52:00):
The ste took a
Speaker 2 (52:02):
Step and took him the feet
Hosts And Creators
Jessica Capshaw
Camilla Luddington
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