April 8, 2025 • 41 mins
During a track meet between Memorial High School and Centennial High School in Frisco, Texas, light rain begins to fall, and athletes take cover under tents with their respective teams at Kuykendall Stadium.
Memorial High School athlete Austin Metcalf finds Centennial High School athlete Karmelo Anthony under the Memorial High School tent and tells him he needs to move from under his team's tent.
When Anthony refuses, words are exchanged, and Anthony tells Metcalf, "Touch me and see what happens."
Centennial High School's Karmelo Anthony allegedly reaches inside his bag, grabs a knife, stabs Austin Metcalf in the chest, and runs away. As Metcalf's twin brother, Hunter, comes to his brother's aid, witnesses point out Anthony to a nearby middle school resource officer, who chases the suspect down.
The school resource officer confronts Karmelo Anthony, telling him to put his hands up in the air. Anthony tells the officer, "I was protecting myself," claiming Metcalf "put his hands on" him. Anthony hears the officer say he has the "alleged stabbing suspect" in custody, and Anthony replies, "I'm not alleged. I did it." Anthony claims self-defense.
Joining Nancy Grace today:
-
Lisa Herrick - Board-certified Juvenile Attorney, Partner at Varghese Summersett, and Former Juvenile Prosecutor; Instagram & X: versustexas, Facebook and Youtube: Varghese Summersett
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Dr. John Delatorre - Licensed Psychologist and Mediator (specializing in forensic psychology); Psychological Consultant to Project Absentis: a nonprofit organization that searches for missing persons; Twitter, IG, and TikTok - @drjohndelatorre
-
Barry Hutchison - Former 26-year Law Enforcement Veteran and Detective, Owner & Chief Investigator for Barry & Associates Investigative Services located in Kansas & Missouri
-
Dr. Kendall Crowns - Chief Medical Examiner Tarrant County (Ft Worth), NEW Podcast [launching on April 14]; Lecturer: Burnett School of Medicine at TCU (Texas Christian University)
-
Katy Barber - Senior Digital Content Producer at My San Antonio
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.
Speaker 2 (00:07):
Sick conspiracies growing abounding on the Internet after Texas twin
Austin Metcalf football star stabbed dead at his high school
track meet. I'm Nancy Grace, this is crime Stories. Thank
you for being with us.
Speaker 3 (00:26):
Austin Medcalf is a seventeen year old straight a student
and football star at Frisco Memorial High School. But what
is supposed to start out as an ordinary track of
year ends in tragedy for the prodigious athlete.
Speaker 2 (00:40):
Two twin brothers scrubbed in sunshine. One bleeds out dead
in the arms of his twin brother as we go
to air tonight. What I perceive to be an outrageous defense.
Speaker 1 (00:57):
First of all, listen to this well.
Speaker 4 (00:59):
His brother was holding him, trying to hold the blood in,
and he passed. My son watched his brother die in
his arms.
Speaker 5 (01:10):
During a track meet between Memorial High School and Centennial
High School in Frisco, Texas, a light rain begins to
fall and athletes take cover under tents with their respective
teams at Kukendall Stadium. Memorial High School athlete Austin Metcalf
finds Centennial High School athlete Carmelo Anthony under the Memorial
High School tent and tells him he needs to move
from under his team's tent. When Anthony refuses, words are
(01:33):
exchanged and Anthony tells Metcalf, touch me and see what happens.
Speaker 2 (01:37):
He first heard from the victim's father that from our
friends at Fox four joining us an all star panel
to make sense of.
Speaker 1 (01:44):
A senseless and brutal stabbing.
Speaker 2 (01:47):
I cannot get the image out of my mind of
this star athlete bleeding out dead as his twin brother
tried to stop the bleeding, holding him in his arms.
You know, I've been to plenty of high school track events,
my son has been involved in track from the get go,
(02:11):
and I can't even imagine a fatal stabbing over a
seat in a tent straight out to special guests joining us.
Katie Barber, Senior digital content producer at my San Antonio
dot Com.
Speaker 1 (02:29):
Katie, thank you for being with us.
Speaker 2 (02:31):
What do we believe happened that led up to the
horrible stabbing death of this young star athlete? Literally scrubbed
and sunshine? And why did the suspect have a knife
at a track meet?
Speaker 6 (02:47):
It's really not clear why he had a knife at
the track meet on April second, but unfortunately he did.
Speaker 7 (02:55):
One witness told police that they.
Speaker 6 (02:56):
Were sitting with Metcalf under their school tent when some
they didn't know now identified as Carmelo Anthony came over
to them, and he is allegedly when I grabbed the
bag when he was confronted and reached inside and said,
touch me and see what happens.
Speaker 1 (03:12):
Okay, what wait?
Speaker 2 (03:13):
Hold on, Katie Barbara joining me from my San Antonio
dot com.
Speaker 1 (03:17):
Who said what? Who sat down where? Who said what?
And who said touch me and see what happens? Give
me proper names.
Speaker 6 (03:25):
One witness told an officer that they were sitting with
Metcalf under the school's tent when Carmelo Anthony came over
to them. While they were in the tent, The witness said,
Metcalf told Anthony to leave the tent, and when he
did that, Anthony grabbed his bag, opened it, reached inside
and said touch me and see what happens. And then
police said in the doctor that no one believed that
(03:47):
they he had a weapon at the time.
Speaker 2 (03:49):
Well, somebody had a weapon because Austin stabbed dead to
Lisa Herrick, joining US veteran Jevenile attorney partner at Vargie Somerset.
Speaker 1 (04:03):
This is important.
Speaker 2 (04:04):
Former juvenile prosecutor, Lisa, thank you for being with us.
Speaker 8 (04:08):
Thank Nancy.
Speaker 2 (04:09):
That's enough time to form premeditation right there now. I
know that you defend juveniles after having been a juvenile prosecutor,
But the reality is, under the black and white letter
of the law, okay, premeditation, the intent to kill, or
the intent to commit any act can be formed in
(04:31):
the blink of an eye, the twinkling of a moment,
the time it takes you to raise the gun and
pull the trigger. The law does not require a long
drawn out period for a premeditation or planning.
Speaker 1 (04:43):
Mensrea Malissa forethought.
Speaker 2 (04:45):
For instance, say long drawn out period, I'm poisoning someone
every single day, just a tiny bit of arsenic and
then they die. It can be formed just like that.
Speaker 1 (04:55):
Why do I care?
Speaker 2 (04:57):
Because premeditation or Malisa fourth thought, mince raya is a
key factor, the critical ingredient in a murder one prosecution,
isn't it.
Speaker 1 (05:09):
Absolutely?
Speaker 9 (05:10):
Intent is one of the main elements of a murder
or an assault, an aggravated assault with a deadly weapon
that turns into a murder. Because in Texas. We have
a number of different ways that murder can be committed,
or the language for a murder can be alleged, one
of which can be that you intend for a person
to die, but another can be that your actions, your
(05:33):
intentional or knowing actions, are such that you would know
that a person would die. So stabbing someone in the heart,
you would certainly know that a person would die if
you stab someone in the heart, and that knowledge or
that intent, like you said.
Speaker 2 (05:47):
Okay, hold on, Lisa, Harriet joining me veteran, try a lawyer.
Speaker 1 (05:51):
Lisa, You're absolutely correct.
Speaker 2 (05:53):
And I've got a great example, because when I speak
to juries very often or really, anybody can't tell I
can't state that this was my idea. I got it
from someone in the New Testament. I like to give examples, Okay, stories.
For instance, if I take a gun and point it
right over at my executive producer right here, Jackie, and
(06:17):
pull the trigger and then say, oh, I just meant
to scare her. I didn't mean to kill her. The
law presumes you intend the natural consequence of your act.
You don't have to say I will now kill you, bam.
The law presumes you intend.
Speaker 1 (06:39):
The natural consequence of your act.
Speaker 2 (06:41):
So when you take the time to go to your
duffel bag, your athletic bag, unzip it, get out a knife,
and then stab someone. And then we have the previous
threat touch me, touch me, and see what's.
Speaker 1 (06:55):
Going to happen.
Speaker 2 (06:57):
All of that adds together to make a premeditated murder case.
Now you have not only prosecuted jeevenile cases felonies, which
is a whole other animal prosecuting injevenile court, GV Court
versus big court. What's your defense in this case, Lisa?
What would your defense possibly be? Is it true that
(07:20):
a stand your ground defense is brewing?
Speaker 1 (07:23):
How can that percolate? That didn't happen?
Speaker 9 (07:25):
A standard ground defense is hard in this fact situation
because stand your ground law presumes that the victim is
somewhere that they are not supposed to be. Right, you're
defending your space when standard ground law applies. And certainly
Austin was in a place where he was allowed to be.
Now I think Carmelo probably was allowed to be where
(07:48):
he was as well. It's a public place right. But
in order to claim standard ground and in order to
use that as your defense, you have to be defending
your space and so I know Carmelo saying that Austin
put hands on him. But deadly force is self defense
theory that is supposed to be used. Deadly force meets
(08:11):
deadly force. The self defense is not ka.
Speaker 2 (08:16):
Lisa, again, you're absolutely correct regarding the letter of the law.
I like to use this example. You can't slap me
and then I shoot you down with an oozy okay.
As for instance, I can't battle back against your fly
swatter with a machine gun. So you said it deadly
(08:38):
force equals deadly force. But here isn't it true that
Austin Metcalf was unarmed, So to introduce a deadly weapon
that's deadly force versus no force.
Speaker 1 (08:52):
Correct?
Speaker 9 (08:52):
And even more so self defense without a deadly weapon.
Regular self defense is not a justifiable fence to use
against words alone. The law says that words are not
sufficient provocation to use self defense.
Speaker 1 (09:06):
Listen to this.
Speaker 8 (09:06):
Everybody was able to Seema son holy gurney with a
huge hole and blood all over him, and they were
pumping him.
Speaker 4 (09:14):
He wasn't breathing and his eyes would rolled back in
his head.
Speaker 3 (09:17):
Centennial High School's Carmelo Anthony reaches inside his bag, grabs
a knife and stabs Austin Metcalf in the chest underneath
the memorial's high school pop up tent, and then he
runs away as Metcalf's twin brother, Hunter comes to his
brother's aid. Witnesses point out Anthony to a nearby middle
school resource officer, who chases the suspect down.
Speaker 2 (09:37):
At first, you were hearing Austin's father speaking to our
friends at Fox for the family.
Speaker 1 (09:44):
Devastated.
Speaker 2 (09:44):
I cannot even imagine what it would be like for
the father to see this, much less the twin brother
holding Austin in his arms trying to stop the blood.
I wouldn't have understood it if I didn't have twins
of my own. They're practically joined at the hip and
(10:05):
minor boy girl much less boy boy or girl girl
that play all their sports together, that do everything together.
Having your twin bleed out dead in your arms, let
me go straight out to a special guest joining us.
Also like Lisa Herrick joining us from this jurisdiction, Doctor
(10:30):
Kimdall Crowns with US Chief Medical Examiner Terran County. That's
Fort Worth never like a business in that Morgue, esteemed
lecturer at the Burnett School of Medicine at TCU, Texas
Christian University, and launching a brand new podcast, Make Him
in the Morgue, April fourteen, Doctor Kimdall Crowns, I know
(10:53):
you've studied the case very carefully. Was there a way
his twin brother could have saved Austin?
Speaker 10 (11:01):
I know there wouldn't have been because the stab wound
was in the heart unless he could be gotten to
an emergency room like immediately, and they may have been
able to save him, but more likely than not, he
was going to die anyway. That type of injury to
the heart, there's just really no coming back unless you're
basically in ther when you get stabbed. Explain why, Because
(11:24):
it's your heart, it's you know, it's all your blood's
coming through there, it's all being pumped out. And then
when you have an aw hole in your heart, it's
bleeding into your chest cavity and you have to close
that hole up in the heart, so you'd have to
crack the chest open, get in there and try and
fix the heart, and there's just so much blood loss
because of the size of the hole. It's it's near
(11:45):
impossible to save that individual. And just putting pressure on
it at the scene. All that's going to create is
they're just going to bleed into their chest cavity.
Speaker 2 (11:53):
I'm just thinking about what you're saying, doctor Kingdall Crowns.
Because Katie Barber was awesome and stabbed in the heart.
Speaker 7 (12:03):
The arrest document states seem is stabbed in the chest.
Speaker 2 (12:06):
So interesting, I wonder how close to the heart he
was stabbed.
Speaker 1 (12:13):
So okay, daughter killo Crowns.
Speaker 2 (12:15):
Let's digest that not stabbed in the heart stab in
the chest.
Speaker 1 (12:20):
Does that make a difference in your analysis?
Speaker 10 (12:22):
So it depends on where exactly in the chest you
go up. But if you're kind of in the midline
or to the left, that's going to be the heart.
You go up a little higher, it's the aorda, which
is the main vessel coming off the heart. They're going
to bleed out again in just a matter of minutes
from that as well. There's no saving them at the scene.
You go to a little to the side one way
(12:42):
or another, you've punctured at the chest, punctured the lung,
and that'll cause a collapse lung that causes a lot
of hemorrhage. That one you may be able to save
the person if you can get him to the.
Speaker 1 (12:53):
Hospital fast enough.
Speaker 10 (12:55):
But from all the information I've seen, it doesn't sound
like it got stabbed in the chest in the area
of a lung. It's more probably centralized it.
Speaker 6 (13:02):
In the heart.
Speaker 1 (13:09):
Crime stories with Nancy Grace, not General Crowns.
Speaker 2 (13:16):
If I were explaining this to a jury, okay, I
would take everything that you just said and paraphrase it
in openings and closings, and I would repeat it and
practically every one of my questions that I asked you
on the stand, and of course a shortened way. But
you're saying, there's no way, twin brother Hunter could have
(13:37):
saved Austin, because even if Hunter could have pushed down
where Austin was bleeding, and so it would look like
to the naked eye that he had stopped the bleeding,
the bleeding would still be happening underneath the skin, and
the blood would then be pumping straight into the lungs.
(14:00):
So he would die on his own blunt and his lungs.
I mean, there's no way he could have saved him.
Speaker 1 (14:08):
Are you sure? Do you feel confident in that?
Speaker 10 (14:11):
Yes, I feel very confident in that. If he puts
his hand on his chest and he continues bleeding into
his chest cavity. It's going to fill up his chest
cavity and it's going to make it hard for him
to breathe, and he'll basically die from the lack of oxygen.
That actually takes longer. From the descriptions I've read from
the scene, he kind of dies in a matter of minutes.
(14:32):
To me, that sounds like a major vessel was hit
or the heart and he was going to die no
matter what was done.
Speaker 5 (14:38):
Seventeen year old Austin Metcalf is being held by his
twin brother, Hunter, who is trying to stop the bleeding
after seventeen year old Carmelo Anthony allegedly stabs Austin in
the chest, piercing his heart. First responders arrive and take
over treatment of Austin. As officers roundup eyewitnesses to the
event to find out what happened. Hunter Metcalf is so
distraught he can barely speak to police, but officers locate
(15:01):
about two dozen student athletes and four coaches who witness
the stabbing and begin taking statements.
Speaker 2 (15:07):
How could a beautiful, young first grade teacher be stabbed
twenty times, including in the back, allegedly die of suicide. Yes,
that was a medical examiner's official ruling after a closed
door meeting he first named it a homicide. Why what
happened to Ellen Greenberg? A huge American miscarriage of justice.
(15:32):
For an in depth look at the facts, see what
Happened to Ellen on Amazon? All proceeds to the National
Center for Missing and Exploited Children.
Speaker 3 (15:47):
Witnesses report of squabble overseating at a track meet tent
resulting in the fatal stabbing of football star Austin Metcalf.
The suspect a fellow seventeen year old student athlete.
Speaker 1 (16:00):
Listen to Austin's brother.
Speaker 11 (16:02):
First off, I didn't know what to do, and then
I saw my fall over there.
Speaker 2 (16:16):
The mother, Megan Metcalf, and so much pain she can't
even stand to hear the brother Hunter describe what happened.
That is from our friends at the Will Caine Show
over on Fox joining me an All Star panel. To
Kad Barber joining me from my San Antonio dot com,
(16:39):
Katy explain to me the logistics of what Hunter, the
twin brother just said.
Speaker 1 (16:45):
Where was he, what did he observe.
Speaker 2 (16:47):
And what if anything did he do when he saw
his brother stabbed. I don't know if he saw the
actual stabbing or saw his brother gushing blood.
Speaker 1 (16:57):
I'm not sure. Please explain.
Speaker 7 (16:59):
Yeah, when arrived they immediately They said they could.
Speaker 6 (17:04):
See blood on and around him. They coordinated with officers
to secure the area. He said that he whipped around.
In another interview, he said he didn't see the stabbing
take place, but he was turning around quickly and saw
the aftermath and held him in his arms after the stabbing,
but did not see it take place.
Speaker 7 (17:23):
He said that in an interview after the.
Speaker 2 (17:24):
Event, he says, at first he froze for just a
moment and didn't know what to do. Then he actually
saw brother Austin fall and ran to him and grabbed
him and.
Speaker 1 (17:37):
Tried to stop the flow of blood. A joining me.
Speaker 2 (17:42):
Doctor John Delatory, psychologist, mediator specializing in forensic psychology, dodgre.
Speaker 1 (17:50):
Delatory, thank you for being with us. What is that
human reaction when you freeze for just one moment?
Speaker 12 (17:57):
Well to trauma response number one. It's the idea that
what you're seeing your brain can't interpret immediately. It's seeing,
it's witnessing everything that's happening. But it's such a difficult
thing for your brain to interpret because of the trauma
associated with it. He's seeing his brother get stabbed, he's
(18:18):
seeing the blood, he's seeing all of this stuff, but
his body isn't recognizing what it needs to do because
it doesn't know what it needs to do, because it's
never seen anything like this before. And so he's trying
to catch up with what his eyes are looking at.
And because it's his brother, and because of the connection
(18:41):
these two have, it becomes that much more difficult.
Speaker 3 (18:45):
Now.
Speaker 12 (18:45):
Once he does catch up, he's able to catch his brother,
he's able to do what he can. But he's not
a doctor, he's not a paramedic, he's not an EMT.
That's his brother, and the trauma of all of this
unfolding is all so impairing his ability to do what
it needs to do. Call the police, call for other people, right.
(19:06):
A lot of the witnesses have to do those kinds
of things because Hunter is so focused on trying to
save his brother.
Speaker 1 (19:13):
A school resource officer, first of the sayne take a
listen to what the suspect says.
Speaker 13 (19:18):
A school resource officer is first on the scene and
confronts Carmelo Anthony, telling the suspect to put his hands
up in the air. Anthony tells the officer, I was
protecting myself, claiming metcalf quote put his hands on him.
Speaker 1 (19:31):
Anthony.
Speaker 13 (19:32):
Here's the officer saying he has the alleged stabbing suspect
in custody, and Anthony replies, I'm not alleged I did it.
Speaker 1 (19:39):
Wow, I'm not alleged I did it.
Speaker 2 (19:42):
Joining me now in addition to our other guest, Barry Hutchinson,
renowned law enforcement that of twenty six years detective now
chief operator of Arry In Associates Investigative Services. Very thank
you for being with us. Did you hear what the
suspect said? Keeping in mind that at this juncture the
(20:03):
suspect is innocent until proven guilty. But very earlier we
heard that there are about two dozen witnesses. This is
a high school track meet, for Pete's sake, that said,
did you hear what the suspect said? And I quote,
I was protecting myself that Austin quote put his hands
(20:26):
on me, and that would be suspect Carmelo Anthony, Austin
put his hands on Carmelo Anthony. According to Anthony Anthony,
here's the school resource officer say he has the alleged
stabbing suspect and responds, I'm not alleged I did it.
Speaker 14 (20:45):
Yeah, that's a pretty damning utterance from an evidentiary value.
And you know, he pretty much admitted to the crime
by making that statement.
Speaker 2 (20:56):
O Kate, Barry, Barry, I know that. I just read
you what he said. I'm asking you what the state
is going to do to prove that and what the
defense is going to do to try to get away
from it.
Speaker 14 (21:11):
Well, the witnesses are going to contradict what he says anyway,
and you know.
Speaker 7 (21:15):
There's twelve of those folks.
Speaker 14 (21:17):
Apparently or more, and they're going to make a statement
that contradicts what he says. It's pretty much going to
outweigh what he says. The state's going to move forward
with prosecution. From that point. His defense is going to
be that it's you know what he said originally, that
it was self defense, that he was in fear of
his life, which it's going to be awful hard to
substantiate that, as you addressed earlier, without the threat of
(21:39):
equal violence to substantiate him using deadly.
Speaker 2 (21:43):
Forced Lisa here joining me, veteran trial lawyer in this jurisdiction, Lisa,
explain again in a nutshell what is now emerging as
the defense? And you know what, I haven't even gotten
to these sick conspiracy theories that are multi applying promulgating online.
Speaker 1 (22:02):
Get to that in a moment.
Speaker 2 (22:03):
But I pray that Austin's parents have not seen what
is being said online. It's total bs technical legal term.
But Lisa, in a nutshell, in regular people talk, do
not throw a Latin phrase at me, Lisa, Rick and
I know that you can stand your ground?
Speaker 1 (22:23):
How and the hay is that going to apply here?
Speaker 2 (22:26):
We normally think of it as, let's just say somebody
tries to break in your house, you don't have to run.
Speaker 1 (22:33):
You can shoot them right then and there.
Speaker 2 (22:36):
If you're so disposed standing your ground, You're in a
place you're supposed to be, you have authority to be there,
and no one can make you leave. Now, explain how
that's going to work. In a high school track tent.
Speaker 9 (22:50):
Right, stand your ground. We commonly use the phrase no
duty to retreat, so it some places will, like some
jurisdiction will require that you attempt to remove yourself from
the danger. That's not the case in Texas, in Texas,
if you're presented with a threat, with a danger, you
have the right to defend yourself and stand your ground.
(23:11):
Means you don't have to try to leave the danger first.
Speaker 2 (23:13):
Well, I'm reading the supplemental arrest report and the narrative
is written by Officer Eduardo Cortes.
Speaker 1 (23:22):
Cortes states suspect was on the track at the north end.
Speaker 2 (23:29):
There was a chain link that separated officer Cortes from
the suspect. Cortes gives the suspect instructions to keep his
hands in the air, and at this time suspect verbally said,
out loud, and this is considered a voluntary statement, quote,
(23:51):
I was protecting myself.
Speaker 1 (23:54):
Cortes goes on to note he had.
Speaker 2 (23:56):
Not questioned the suspect about the incident, but suspect blurted
that out. Then stated, while walking him off the track,
suspects states, quote.
Speaker 1 (24:09):
He put his hands on me.
Speaker 2 (24:13):
Katie Barber joining me, senior digital content producer my san
Antonio dot Com.
Speaker 1 (24:19):
Katie.
Speaker 2 (24:20):
My understanding from having read the police reports and the
witness statements is that the suspect goes under the other
size tent right the other school's tent at that point,
Austin says, this isn't your tent, get.
Speaker 1 (24:37):
Out of here.
Speaker 2 (24:39):
At that point, at that point, what does the suspect do?
Speaker 6 (24:46):
Police says that when he's told to move out of
the tent, that he grabbed his bag, opened it and
reached inside. And this is when he tells Austin touch
me and see what happens. According to police, so naturally
Austin touched him, Yeah, exactly. Police say that he proceeded
to touch Carmelo, and then Carmelo then postures and tells
(25:10):
Anthony and tells Austin to punch him and see what
happens A short time later.
Speaker 2 (25:15):
A police don't say, so you're understanding, Katie Barber, were
any punches THROWNE Did Austin ever hit the suspect hit?
Speaker 7 (25:25):
It doesn't say.
Speaker 6 (25:26):
It says he grabbed Anthony after that threat to tell
him to move, but it doesn't.
Speaker 7 (25:30):
But police do not say. Witnesses did not tell police
that he was punched.
Speaker 6 (25:35):
But when he was grabbed by Austin is when he
pulled out the knife and stabbed him once in the chest,
is what police say.
Speaker 7 (25:43):
A witness reported.
Speaker 3 (25:45):
A police escort Carmelo Anthony to a squad car. Anthony
says he put his hands on me. I told him
not to. Anthony also asks officers if the victim was
going to be okay and if what happened could be
considered self defense. Officer take evidence photos showing blood on
Anthony's hands, but don't find the knife on him.
Speaker 2 (26:04):
How could a beautiful, young first grade teacher be stabbed
twenty times, including in the back, allegedly die of suicide. Yes,
that was the medical examiner's official ruling after a closed
door meeting. He first named it a homicide. Why what
happened to Ellen Greenberg? A huge American miscarriage of justice?
(26:30):
For an in depth look at the facts, see what
Happened to Ellen on Amazon? All proceeds to the National
Center for Missing and Exploited Children. How does a teen boy,
a twin star athlete in Texas end up stabbed dead
(26:53):
at a track mate of all places?
Speaker 1 (26:57):
Listen to US's dad.
Speaker 15 (26:59):
Great harting true up with me and him and Austin,
and I'm gonna come over and see you this week
and so call look forward to it. Hey, I love you, dad,
That's the love you Tucson. Those were the last words ever.
Speaker 1 (27:14):
Heard from me.
Speaker 2 (27:15):
The fauthor and the twin speaking to our friends at
Dallas Morning News. What about the blood evidence in this case?
With conflicting witness reports, with the suspect claiming self defenses
stand your ground although no punches were seen thrown, that
(27:35):
blood evidence becomes critical. Remember it was raining.
Speaker 1 (27:40):
The track meet is outside.
Speaker 5 (27:42):
Listen as law enforcement and paramedics arrive on scene. The
rain is falling harder. One officer moves the memorial tent
over the victim of medics trained to save his life,
and finding the bloody knife in the stands, quickly takes
photos of it before the rain could wash away all
the blood. A blue tarp is used to cover the
knife in an effort to preserve the evidence, and because
it was so windy, the officer uses a nearby backpack
(28:05):
to weigh down the tarp. He doesn't realize at the
time the backpack belongs to suspect Carmelo Anthony photo.
Speaker 1 (28:14):
No juris don't want.
Speaker 2 (28:16):
Just a photo, They want DNA DEYOXURII, boat and nucleic
acid straight out to renowned medical examiner, doctor Kendall Crowns.
Joining us from this jurisdiction of Texas. Doctor Kendall crowns
the murder what we believe to be the murder weapon,
a knife covered in blood had been thrown or obscured,
(28:41):
let me just say euphemistically, and it was pouring rain.
What's the likelihood that we can get DNA off that knife?
Because the state needs the suspects DNA and the victims
DNA off that knife, Well, they.
Speaker 10 (28:57):
Should probably still be able to get DNA from it,
unless it was scrubbed clean with a cleanser or a
soap of something of that nature. There's probably still enough
DNA on the handle and on the knife itself to
be able to get a good DNA sample. Also, you
have to figure because of the contact between the two boys,
there's probably a way of getting DNA from the victim
(29:20):
as well.
Speaker 1 (29:21):
Kat Barber, where exactly was the knife discovered?
Speaker 7 (29:24):
It was discovered in.
Speaker 6 (29:25):
The bleachers on the north side of the stage at stadium,
which is where.
Speaker 1 (29:29):
Well the hey did he get in the bleachers? Katie?
Speaker 7 (29:32):
He ran off after the stabbing.
Speaker 6 (29:35):
It didn't quite say a total direction, but he did
run off, and it's presumed that he threw the knife
when he ran off, because he didn't have the weapon
on him.
Speaker 7 (29:43):
When he was detained.
Speaker 2 (29:44):
Right a minute, right there, Katie barbermisan Antonio dot Com
to doctor John Delatory. If someone attacked me, and I
thought back, I wouldn't take off running and then hide
the weapon.
Speaker 12 (30:00):
Yeah, you wouldn't. But here's the thing is that if
Anthony saw a bunch of other people, dozens of other
people that were also around and in that tent, he
might have felt overwhelmed. He might have felt scared. He
could have done all of these things just as a
matter of panic. So he runs off, knowing that he
shouldn't have stabbed this person, but he did it anyway.
(30:21):
He throws a knife away, he takes off thinking that
he's going to get very far. There's all kinds of
things that could be happening, because it does not appear
as though he intended to go to that track meet
with the specific purpose to kill Austin Metcalf. It does
seem like things were going on underneath that tent that
neither one of these two boys were prepared for, and
(30:44):
both are now suffering the consequences, with Austin having lost
his life for some kind of nonsense.
Speaker 2 (30:50):
Lisa Herrik, you see where this is going. This state
is going to argue to a jury. He ran off
and disposed of the weapon because he knew what he'd
was wrong, and then immediately began forming a defense in
his mind and even asked law enforcement, Hey, could that
be self defense?
Speaker 1 (31:10):
You think that's self defense?
Speaker 9 (31:11):
There are a couple of things that cut in favor
of the self defense argument, and those are that he
did run away if he was scared, and he so
he he stabs scared.
Speaker 2 (31:26):
Isn't he the one that said touch me and find out?
Is he the one that say, go, oh, punch me,
just see what happens. That doesn't sound scared to me.
Speaker 9 (31:33):
I don't disagree with you, but getting into his mind
for a moment, and the argument that the defense is
going to make right, they have to come up with.
Speaker 1 (31:40):
Someone do I have to get in his mind.
Speaker 9 (31:42):
So if he'll say I was scared, I stabbed him.
I felt like the danger was subdued enough that I
could now safely escape, then I can see how running
away would cut in favor of self defense. I can
see what you're saying.
Speaker 1 (31:58):
How running away? Okay, I don't sign up.
Speaker 2 (32:00):
You just said, have you ever heard the phrase word salad?
Because I just heard one. Okay, wait a minute, what
did you say about the threat was subdued?
Speaker 1 (32:10):
You mean he stabbed Austin in the chest? Is that
what you're talking about? So if the threat is subdued,
why run then?
Speaker 9 (32:20):
Because there were plenty of other people around who were
potentially new dangers, right, people who saw him.
Speaker 2 (32:27):
So now I don't know what you're saying. You're making
that up like a good defense attorney. What other people
presented a danger? Nobody?
Speaker 1 (32:37):
What are you serious?
Speaker 8 (32:39):
Well?
Speaker 1 (32:39):
I mean he he.
Speaker 2 (32:40):
Stabs Austin dead, and then he is in danger of
what retribution?
Speaker 9 (32:45):
People who want to hurt him now that Carmelo hurt
their friend was able to.
Speaker 8 (32:49):
Seem my son on the gurney with a huge hole
and blow all over him, and they were pumping him.
Speaker 4 (32:56):
He wasn't breathing, His eyes would rolled back in his head.
Speaker 2 (32:58):
From our friends at Fox for Crime Stories with Nancy Grace,
how could a beautiful, young first grade teacher be stabbed
twenty times, including in the back, allegedly die of suicide? Yes,
(33:25):
that was the medical examiner's official ruling after a closed
door meeting. He first named it a homicide. Why what
happened to Ellen Greenberg? A huge American miscarriage of justice.
For an in depth look at the facts, see what
Happened to Ellen on Amazon. All proceeds to the National
(33:50):
Center for Missing and Exploited Children. How does a teen
boy literally scrubbed in sunshine, great grade, star athlete, beloved
twin brother.
Speaker 1 (34:04):
How does he end up stabbed dead at a high
school track meet.
Speaker 2 (34:12):
No one saw punches being thrown, nothing like that. The
suspect and the victim had never even met, according to sources.
Speaker 11 (34:22):
Listen, and then I went my head around and then Alsodden,
I see him running on the bleach, gut in his chest.
He just bought of us are out, he said the South.
Speaker 2 (34:33):
There you see Austin's brother Hunter speaking out from our
friends at the Wheal Kane Show on Fox. Why ask why?
How many times has that been said in a courtroom?
Speaker 1 (34:45):
A million? But as you all know.
Speaker 2 (34:48):
The state is never required to show motive. Teams kill
for apparently no reason at all.
Speaker 1 (34:56):
Listen.
Speaker 5 (34:57):
High school Spanish teacher Noi mcgrabory is known for end
enjoying an afternoon walk at a park in Fairfield, Iowa.
When she turns up missing, Retracing her steps begins in
the park The body is found covered by a tarp, wheelbarrow,
and railroad ties, and she suffered head trauma. Cops don't
have to look much further than incriminating social media posts
of two sixteen year old students, Jeremy Goodell and Willard Miller,
(35:20):
from the school where Graver teaches.
Speaker 2 (35:22):
One of the high schoolers thought they might get a
bad grade, and so two of.
Speaker 1 (35:29):
Them go and murder the teacher. Yes, so a murder
over what I c minus.
Speaker 2 (35:38):
Then there is another star student all A's, that commits
murder Derrick Rossa.
Speaker 16 (35:45):
I need to know if your mom is is greeting,
She said, miss I have the gun with me.
Speaker 4 (35:52):
I was going to shoot myself that I didn't want to.
Speaker 15 (35:55):
I have more family members.
Speaker 16 (35:57):
They can take care of my sister.
Speaker 1 (35:58):
I just take th man I told my friend about
it was that bad?
Speaker 2 (36:02):
That is teen boy Derek Rosa. We still don't know
any motive as to why he killed his mother and
then sent the photo of her sleeping in bed now
dead to friends, then asking was that bad that I
killed her and sent photos to friends? So a teen
(36:24):
kills for what motive?
Speaker 1 (36:26):
None? And there's more.
Speaker 5 (36:28):
Tristan Bailey last scene wearing her cheerleader uniform, went missing
on Mother's Day in Jacksonville, Florida. Surveillance video shows her
at one fifteen am. She's walking with a fourteen year
old classmate, Aidan Fucci. When police pick up Fucci for questioning,
he posts a photo of himself in the back of
a police car giving the V sign with the caption,
hey guys, has anybody seen Tristan lately? He also posted
(36:51):
a Snapchat video having fun in a beep cop car.
Tristan's body is discovered in a secluded wooded area. She's
been stabbed one hundred and five fourteen times.
Speaker 2 (37:01):
This little girl was not raped, was not assaulted. There
was no robbery, So what was the motive? Apparently none
and more.
Speaker 5 (37:10):
Jay Williams is fifteen years old. The day he and
sixteen year old Randy Thompson le were a fellow classmate
Michael Russell to his own home, where they stab him
multiple times in the chest, back, and neck. Russell's mother
returns home from running errands and finds his lifeless body
in the backyard. Williams and Thompson say they wanted to
see what it felt like to kill someone.
Speaker 2 (37:30):
Lisa Herrick joining us that are in trial lawyer in
this jurisdiction of Texas. So number one for Austin. Even
if this did happen to have touched the suspect on
the shoulder and said get out of our tent, that
is not going to justify under self defense a deadly
(37:51):
attack with a knife.
Speaker 1 (37:54):
And as far as motive.
Speaker 2 (37:56):
You just heard all of those similar cases where teens kill,
they don't really have a motive.
Speaker 1 (38:01):
The state doesn't have to prove motive, do they. The
state does not have to prove motive.
Speaker 9 (38:06):
And that's mainly because it is nearly impossible to get
into the mind of a charged a defendant unless they
tell you what they were thinking. In this case, we
know that Carmelo is going to claim self depends, but
we don't know what he was actually thinking, and so
the state wouldn't be able to prove a motive without
knowing what he was actually thinking.
Speaker 2 (38:26):
How could a beautiful, young first grade teacher be stabbed
twenty times, including in the back, allegedly die of suicide. Yes,
that was a medical examiner's official ruling after a closed
door meeting. He first named it a homicide. Why what
happened to Ellen? Greenberg a huge American miscarriage of justice.
(38:52):
For an in depth look at the facts, see what
Happened to Ellen on Amazon. All proceeds to the National
Center for Missing and Exploited Children. Teen boy Austin Metcalf
stamped dead at a high school track mate. Apparently no
(39:15):
justification for the stabbing, but at this hour, evil sick
conspiracy theories are promulgating online, including a fake autopsy report Katie.
Speaker 6 (39:27):
Yes, the fake autopsy report that has been police have
warned about. Police have issued multiple warnings publicly on their
social media channels about false statements from the police chief
that have not come from him, as well as this
medical report that shows the primary cause of death being
(39:48):
a drug overdose with the secondary cause of death being
a stab wound. Police have said that that report has
not been released, so any sort of images purporting to
be the auto report are not true.
Speaker 2 (40:01):
Texas Police as we go to air warning about misinformation
being promulgated online.
Speaker 1 (40:07):
They are also warning.
Speaker 2 (40:09):
People Katie Barber not to disseminate the false theories under
threat of what hampering, a hampering or handering a police investigation.
Speaker 6 (40:20):
Yes, and they've also said that people who are pretending
to be officials. Like propagating this information can also be
charged with a third degree felony of impersonating a public servant.
So there are charges at play, and they are investigating
with the FBI into these matters.
Speaker 2 (40:38):
What kind of an evil, sick person would create a
fake autopsy report suggesting that this boy, a star athlete,
died of a drug overdose. But obviously it's someone that
is signing with the suspect and trying to tarnish the
(40:58):
reputation of a young boy, a young boy with all
as star athlete and beloved Twin.
Speaker 1 (41:06):
Speaking of Twin, listen to his brother Hunter.
Speaker 16 (41:09):
We're just one person. We did everything the same. We're
just exactly a light Twighton. We had no we had
a couple of differences, but most of the stuff we
did together and the stuff we had, it's just we
fell as one person. So it's like we just connected
so well and everything we did.
Speaker 2 (41:23):
If you know or think you know anything about this case,
the state is still building its case.
Speaker 1 (41:30):
The defense is starting to build their case.
Speaker 2 (41:33):
Please dial nine seven two two nine two six thousand,
repeat two nine two six one thousand.
Speaker 1 (41:43):
Nancy Grace signing off, goodbye,
Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.
Speaker 2 (00:07):
Sick conspiracies growing abounding on the Internet after Texas twin
Austin Metcalf football star stabbed dead at his high school
track meet. I'm Nancy Grace, this is crime Stories. Thank
you for being with us.
Speaker 3 (00:26):
Austin Medcalf is a seventeen year old straight a student
and football star at Frisco Memorial High School. But what
is supposed to start out as an ordinary track of
year ends in tragedy for the prodigious athlete.
Speaker 2 (00:40):
Two twin brothers scrubbed in sunshine. One bleeds out dead
in the arms of his twin brother as we go
to air tonight. What I perceive to be an outrageous defense.
Speaker 1 (00:57):
First of all, listen to this well.
Speaker 4 (00:59):
His brother was holding him, trying to hold the blood in,
and he passed. My son watched his brother die in
his arms.
Speaker 5 (01:10):
During a track meet between Memorial High School and Centennial
High School in Frisco, Texas, a light rain begins to
fall and athletes take cover under tents with their respective
teams at Kukendall Stadium. Memorial High School athlete Austin Metcalf
finds Centennial High School athlete Carmelo Anthony under the Memorial
High School tent and tells him he needs to move
from under his team's tent. When Anthony refuses, words are
(01:33):
exchanged and Anthony tells Metcalf, touch me and see what happens.
Speaker 2 (01:37):
He first heard from the victim's father that from our
friends at Fox four joining us an all star panel
to make sense of.
Speaker 1 (01:44):
A senseless and brutal stabbing.
Speaker 2 (01:47):
I cannot get the image out of my mind of
this star athlete bleeding out dead as his twin brother
tried to stop the bleeding, holding him in his arms.
You know, I've been to plenty of high school track events,
my son has been involved in track from the get go,
(02:11):
and I can't even imagine a fatal stabbing over a
seat in a tent straight out to special guests joining us.
Katie Barber, Senior digital content producer at my San Antonio
dot Com.
Speaker 1 (02:29):
Katie, thank you for being with us.
Speaker 2 (02:31):
What do we believe happened that led up to the
horrible stabbing death of this young star athlete? Literally scrubbed
and sunshine? And why did the suspect have a knife
at a track meet?
Speaker 6 (02:47):
It's really not clear why he had a knife at
the track meet on April second, but unfortunately he did.
Speaker 7 (02:55):
One witness told police that they.
Speaker 6 (02:56):
Were sitting with Metcalf under their school tent when some
they didn't know now identified as Carmelo Anthony came over
to them, and he is allegedly when I grabbed the
bag when he was confronted and reached inside and said,
touch me and see what happens.
Speaker 1 (03:12):
Okay, what wait?
Speaker 2 (03:13):
Hold on, Katie Barbara joining me from my San Antonio
dot com.
Speaker 1 (03:17):
Who said what? Who sat down where? Who said what?
And who said touch me and see what happens? Give
me proper names.
Speaker 6 (03:25):
One witness told an officer that they were sitting with
Metcalf under the school's tent when Carmelo Anthony came over
to them. While they were in the tent, The witness said,
Metcalf told Anthony to leave the tent, and when he
did that, Anthony grabbed his bag, opened it, reached inside
and said touch me and see what happens. And then
police said in the doctor that no one believed that
(03:47):
they he had a weapon at the time.
Speaker 2 (03:49):
Well, somebody had a weapon because Austin stabbed dead to
Lisa Herrick, joining US veteran Jevenile attorney partner at Vargie Somerset.
Speaker 1 (04:03):
This is important.
Speaker 2 (04:04):
Former juvenile prosecutor, Lisa, thank you for being with us.
Speaker 8 (04:08):
Thank Nancy.
Speaker 2 (04:09):
That's enough time to form premeditation right there now. I
know that you defend juveniles after having been a juvenile prosecutor,
But the reality is, under the black and white letter
of the law, okay, premeditation, the intent to kill, or
the intent to commit any act can be formed in
(04:31):
the blink of an eye, the twinkling of a moment,
the time it takes you to raise the gun and
pull the trigger. The law does not require a long
drawn out period for a premeditation or planning.
Speaker 1 (04:43):
Mensrea Malissa forethought.
Speaker 2 (04:45):
For instance, say long drawn out period, I'm poisoning someone
every single day, just a tiny bit of arsenic and
then they die. It can be formed just like that.
Speaker 1 (04:55):
Why do I care?
Speaker 2 (04:57):
Because premeditation or Malisa fourth thought, mince raya is a
key factor, the critical ingredient in a murder one prosecution,
isn't it.
Speaker 1 (05:09):
Absolutely?
Speaker 9 (05:10):
Intent is one of the main elements of a murder
or an assault, an aggravated assault with a deadly weapon
that turns into a murder. Because in Texas. We have
a number of different ways that murder can be committed,
or the language for a murder can be alleged, one
of which can be that you intend for a person
to die, but another can be that your actions, your
(05:33):
intentional or knowing actions, are such that you would know
that a person would die. So stabbing someone in the heart,
you would certainly know that a person would die if
you stab someone in the heart, and that knowledge or
that intent, like you said.
Speaker 2 (05:47):
Okay, hold on, Lisa, Harriet joining me veteran, try a lawyer.
Speaker 1 (05:51):
Lisa, You're absolutely correct.
Speaker 2 (05:53):
And I've got a great example, because when I speak
to juries very often or really, anybody can't tell I
can't state that this was my idea. I got it
from someone in the New Testament. I like to give examples, Okay, stories.
For instance, if I take a gun and point it
right over at my executive producer right here, Jackie, and
(06:17):
pull the trigger and then say, oh, I just meant
to scare her. I didn't mean to kill her. The
law presumes you intend the natural consequence of your act.
You don't have to say I will now kill you, bam.
The law presumes you intend.
Speaker 1 (06:39):
The natural consequence of your act.
Speaker 2 (06:41):
So when you take the time to go to your
duffel bag, your athletic bag, unzip it, get out a knife,
and then stab someone. And then we have the previous
threat touch me, touch me, and see what's.
Speaker 1 (06:55):
Going to happen.
Speaker 2 (06:57):
All of that adds together to make a premeditated murder case.
Now you have not only prosecuted jeevenile cases felonies, which
is a whole other animal prosecuting injevenile court, GV Court
versus big court. What's your defense in this case, Lisa?
What would your defense possibly be? Is it true that
(07:20):
a stand your ground defense is brewing?
Speaker 1 (07:23):
How can that percolate? That didn't happen?
Speaker 9 (07:25):
A standard ground defense is hard in this fact situation
because stand your ground law presumes that the victim is
somewhere that they are not supposed to be. Right, you're
defending your space when standard ground law applies. And certainly
Austin was in a place where he was allowed to be.
Now I think Carmelo probably was allowed to be where
(07:48):
he was as well. It's a public place right. But
in order to claim standard ground and in order to
use that as your defense, you have to be defending
your space and so I know Carmelo saying that Austin
put hands on him. But deadly force is self defense
theory that is supposed to be used. Deadly force meets
(08:11):
deadly force. The self defense is not ka.
Speaker 2 (08:16):
Lisa, again, you're absolutely correct regarding the letter of the law.
I like to use this example. You can't slap me
and then I shoot you down with an oozy okay.
As for instance, I can't battle back against your fly
swatter with a machine gun. So you said it deadly
(08:38):
force equals deadly force. But here isn't it true that
Austin Metcalf was unarmed, So to introduce a deadly weapon
that's deadly force versus no force.
Speaker 1 (08:52):
Correct?
Speaker 9 (08:52):
And even more so self defense without a deadly weapon.
Regular self defense is not a justifiable fence to use
against words alone. The law says that words are not
sufficient provocation to use self defense.
Speaker 1 (09:06):
Listen to this.
Speaker 8 (09:06):
Everybody was able to Seema son holy gurney with a
huge hole and blood all over him, and they were
pumping him.
Speaker 4 (09:14):
He wasn't breathing and his eyes would rolled back in
his head.
Speaker 3 (09:17):
Centennial High School's Carmelo Anthony reaches inside his bag, grabs
a knife and stabs Austin Metcalf in the chest underneath
the memorial's high school pop up tent, and then he
runs away as Metcalf's twin brother, Hunter comes to his
brother's aid. Witnesses point out Anthony to a nearby middle
school resource officer, who chases the suspect down.
Speaker 2 (09:37):
At first, you were hearing Austin's father speaking to our
friends at Fox for the family.
Speaker 1 (09:44):
Devastated.
Speaker 2 (09:44):
I cannot even imagine what it would be like for
the father to see this, much less the twin brother
holding Austin in his arms trying to stop the blood.
I wouldn't have understood it if I didn't have twins
of my own. They're practically joined at the hip and
(10:05):
minor boy girl much less boy boy or girl girl
that play all their sports together, that do everything together.
Having your twin bleed out dead in your arms, let
me go straight out to a special guest joining us.
Also like Lisa Herrick joining us from this jurisdiction, Doctor
(10:30):
Kimdall Crowns with US Chief Medical Examiner Terran County. That's
Fort Worth never like a business in that Morgue, esteemed
lecturer at the Burnett School of Medicine at TCU, Texas
Christian University, and launching a brand new podcast, Make Him
in the Morgue, April fourteen, Doctor Kimdall Crowns, I know
(10:53):
you've studied the case very carefully. Was there a way
his twin brother could have saved Austin?
Speaker 10 (11:01):
I know there wouldn't have been because the stab wound
was in the heart unless he could be gotten to
an emergency room like immediately, and they may have been
able to save him, but more likely than not, he
was going to die anyway. That type of injury to
the heart, there's just really no coming back unless you're
basically in ther when you get stabbed. Explain why, Because
(11:24):
it's your heart, it's you know, it's all your blood's
coming through there, it's all being pumped out. And then
when you have an aw hole in your heart, it's
bleeding into your chest cavity and you have to close
that hole up in the heart, so you'd have to
crack the chest open, get in there and try and
fix the heart, and there's just so much blood loss
because of the size of the hole. It's it's near
(11:45):
impossible to save that individual. And just putting pressure on
it at the scene. All that's going to create is
they're just going to bleed into their chest cavity.
Speaker 2 (11:53):
I'm just thinking about what you're saying, doctor Kingdall Crowns.
Because Katie Barber was awesome and stabbed in the heart.
Speaker 7 (12:03):
The arrest document states seem is stabbed in the chest.
Speaker 2 (12:06):
So interesting, I wonder how close to the heart he
was stabbed.
Speaker 1 (12:13):
So okay, daughter killo Crowns.
Speaker 2 (12:15):
Let's digest that not stabbed in the heart stab in
the chest.
Speaker 1 (12:20):
Does that make a difference in your analysis?
Speaker 10 (12:22):
So it depends on where exactly in the chest you
go up. But if you're kind of in the midline
or to the left, that's going to be the heart.
You go up a little higher, it's the aorda, which
is the main vessel coming off the heart. They're going
to bleed out again in just a matter of minutes
from that as well. There's no saving them at the scene.
You go to a little to the side one way
(12:42):
or another, you've punctured at the chest, punctured the lung,
and that'll cause a collapse lung that causes a lot
of hemorrhage. That one you may be able to save
the person if you can get him to the.
Speaker 1 (12:53):
Hospital fast enough.
Speaker 10 (12:55):
But from all the information I've seen, it doesn't sound
like it got stabbed in the chest in the area
of a lung. It's more probably centralized it.
Speaker 6 (13:02):
In the heart.
Speaker 1 (13:09):
Crime stories with Nancy Grace, not General Crowns.
Speaker 2 (13:16):
If I were explaining this to a jury, okay, I
would take everything that you just said and paraphrase it
in openings and closings, and I would repeat it and
practically every one of my questions that I asked you
on the stand, and of course a shortened way. But
you're saying, there's no way, twin brother Hunter could have
(13:37):
saved Austin, because even if Hunter could have pushed down
where Austin was bleeding, and so it would look like
to the naked eye that he had stopped the bleeding,
the bleeding would still be happening underneath the skin, and
the blood would then be pumping straight into the lungs.
(14:00):
So he would die on his own blunt and his lungs.
I mean, there's no way he could have saved him.
Speaker 1 (14:08):
Are you sure? Do you feel confident in that?
Speaker 10 (14:11):
Yes, I feel very confident in that. If he puts
his hand on his chest and he continues bleeding into
his chest cavity. It's going to fill up his chest
cavity and it's going to make it hard for him
to breathe, and he'll basically die from the lack of oxygen.
That actually takes longer. From the descriptions I've read from
the scene, he kind of dies in a matter of minutes.
(14:32):
To me, that sounds like a major vessel was hit
or the heart and he was going to die no
matter what was done.
Speaker 5 (14:38):
Seventeen year old Austin Metcalf is being held by his
twin brother, Hunter, who is trying to stop the bleeding
after seventeen year old Carmelo Anthony allegedly stabs Austin in
the chest, piercing his heart. First responders arrive and take
over treatment of Austin. As officers roundup eyewitnesses to the
event to find out what happened. Hunter Metcalf is so
distraught he can barely speak to police, but officers locate
(15:01):
about two dozen student athletes and four coaches who witness
the stabbing and begin taking statements.
Speaker 2 (15:07):
How could a beautiful, young first grade teacher be stabbed
twenty times, including in the back, allegedly die of suicide. Yes,
that was a medical examiner's official ruling after a closed
door meeting he first named it a homicide. Why what
happened to Ellen Greenberg? A huge American miscarriage of justice.
(15:32):
For an in depth look at the facts, see what
Happened to Ellen on Amazon? All proceeds to the National
Center for Missing and Exploited Children.
Speaker 3 (15:47):
Witnesses report of squabble overseating at a track meet tent
resulting in the fatal stabbing of football star Austin Metcalf.
The suspect a fellow seventeen year old student athlete.
Speaker 1 (16:00):
Listen to Austin's brother.
Speaker 11 (16:02):
First off, I didn't know what to do, and then
I saw my fall over there.
Speaker 2 (16:16):
The mother, Megan Metcalf, and so much pain she can't
even stand to hear the brother Hunter describe what happened.
That is from our friends at the Will Caine Show
over on Fox joining me an All Star panel. To
Kad Barber joining me from my San Antonio dot com,
(16:39):
Katy explain to me the logistics of what Hunter, the
twin brother just said.
Speaker 1 (16:45):
Where was he, what did he observe.
Speaker 2 (16:47):
And what if anything did he do when he saw
his brother stabbed. I don't know if he saw the
actual stabbing or saw his brother gushing blood.
Speaker 1 (16:57):
I'm not sure. Please explain.
Speaker 7 (16:59):
Yeah, when arrived they immediately They said they could.
Speaker 6 (17:04):
See blood on and around him. They coordinated with officers
to secure the area. He said that he whipped around.
In another interview, he said he didn't see the stabbing
take place, but he was turning around quickly and saw
the aftermath and held him in his arms after the stabbing,
but did not see it take place.
Speaker 7 (17:23):
He said that in an interview after the.
Speaker 2 (17:24):
Event, he says, at first he froze for just a
moment and didn't know what to do. Then he actually
saw brother Austin fall and ran to him and grabbed
him and.
Speaker 1 (17:37):
Tried to stop the flow of blood. A joining me.
Speaker 2 (17:42):
Doctor John Delatory, psychologist, mediator specializing in forensic psychology, dodgre.
Speaker 1 (17:50):
Delatory, thank you for being with us. What is that
human reaction when you freeze for just one moment?
Speaker 12 (17:57):
Well to trauma response number one. It's the idea that
what you're seeing your brain can't interpret immediately. It's seeing,
it's witnessing everything that's happening. But it's such a difficult
thing for your brain to interpret because of the trauma
associated with it. He's seeing his brother get stabbed, he's
(18:18):
seeing the blood, he's seeing all of this stuff, but
his body isn't recognizing what it needs to do because
it doesn't know what it needs to do, because it's
never seen anything like this before. And so he's trying
to catch up with what his eyes are looking at.
And because it's his brother, and because of the connection
(18:41):
these two have, it becomes that much more difficult.
Speaker 3 (18:45):
Now.
Speaker 12 (18:45):
Once he does catch up, he's able to catch his brother,
he's able to do what he can. But he's not
a doctor, he's not a paramedic, he's not an EMT.
That's his brother, and the trauma of all of this
unfolding is all so impairing his ability to do what
it needs to do. Call the police, call for other people, right.
(19:06):
A lot of the witnesses have to do those kinds
of things because Hunter is so focused on trying to
save his brother.
Speaker 1 (19:13):
A school resource officer, first of the sayne take a
listen to what the suspect says.
Speaker 13 (19:18):
A school resource officer is first on the scene and
confronts Carmelo Anthony, telling the suspect to put his hands
up in the air. Anthony tells the officer, I was
protecting myself, claiming metcalf quote put his hands on him.
Speaker 1 (19:31):
Anthony.
Speaker 13 (19:32):
Here's the officer saying he has the alleged stabbing suspect
in custody, and Anthony replies, I'm not alleged I did it.
Speaker 1 (19:39):
Wow, I'm not alleged I did it.
Speaker 2 (19:42):
Joining me now in addition to our other guest, Barry Hutchinson,
renowned law enforcement that of twenty six years detective now
chief operator of Arry In Associates Investigative Services. Very thank
you for being with us. Did you hear what the
suspect said? Keeping in mind that at this juncture the
(20:03):
suspect is innocent until proven guilty. But very earlier we
heard that there are about two dozen witnesses. This is
a high school track meet, for Pete's sake, that said,
did you hear what the suspect said? And I quote,
I was protecting myself that Austin quote put his hands
(20:26):
on me, and that would be suspect Carmelo Anthony, Austin
put his hands on Carmelo Anthony. According to Anthony Anthony,
here's the school resource officer say he has the alleged
stabbing suspect and responds, I'm not alleged I did it.
Speaker 14 (20:45):
Yeah, that's a pretty damning utterance from an evidentiary value.
And you know, he pretty much admitted to the crime
by making that statement.
Speaker 2 (20:56):
O Kate, Barry, Barry, I know that. I just read
you what he said. I'm asking you what the state
is going to do to prove that and what the
defense is going to do to try to get away
from it.
Speaker 14 (21:11):
Well, the witnesses are going to contradict what he says anyway,
and you know.
Speaker 7 (21:15):
There's twelve of those folks.
Speaker 14 (21:17):
Apparently or more, and they're going to make a statement
that contradicts what he says. It's pretty much going to
outweigh what he says. The state's going to move forward
with prosecution. From that point. His defense is going to
be that it's you know what he said originally, that
it was self defense, that he was in fear of
his life, which it's going to be awful hard to
substantiate that, as you addressed earlier, without the threat of
(21:39):
equal violence to substantiate him using deadly.
Speaker 2 (21:43):
Forced Lisa here joining me, veteran trial lawyer in this jurisdiction, Lisa,
explain again in a nutshell what is now emerging as
the defense? And you know what, I haven't even gotten
to these sick conspiracy theories that are multi applying promulgating online.
Speaker 1 (22:02):
Get to that in a moment.
Speaker 2 (22:03):
But I pray that Austin's parents have not seen what
is being said online. It's total bs technical legal term.
But Lisa, in a nutshell, in regular people talk, do
not throw a Latin phrase at me, Lisa, Rick and
I know that you can stand your ground?
Speaker 1 (22:23):
How and the hay is that going to apply here?
Speaker 2 (22:26):
We normally think of it as, let's just say somebody
tries to break in your house, you don't have to run.
Speaker 1 (22:33):
You can shoot them right then and there.
Speaker 2 (22:36):
If you're so disposed standing your ground, You're in a
place you're supposed to be, you have authority to be there,
and no one can make you leave. Now, explain how
that's going to work. In a high school track tent.
Speaker 9 (22:50):
Right, stand your ground. We commonly use the phrase no
duty to retreat, so it some places will, like some
jurisdiction will require that you attempt to remove yourself from
the danger. That's not the case in Texas, in Texas,
if you're presented with a threat, with a danger, you
have the right to defend yourself and stand your ground.
(23:11):
Means you don't have to try to leave the danger first.
Speaker 2 (23:13):
Well, I'm reading the supplemental arrest report and the narrative
is written by Officer Eduardo Cortes.
Speaker 1 (23:22):
Cortes states suspect was on the track at the north end.
Speaker 2 (23:29):
There was a chain link that separated officer Cortes from
the suspect. Cortes gives the suspect instructions to keep his
hands in the air, and at this time suspect verbally said,
out loud, and this is considered a voluntary statement, quote,
(23:51):
I was protecting myself.
Speaker 1 (23:54):
Cortes goes on to note he had.
Speaker 2 (23:56):
Not questioned the suspect about the incident, but suspect blurted
that out. Then stated, while walking him off the track,
suspects states, quote.
Speaker 1 (24:09):
He put his hands on me.
Speaker 2 (24:13):
Katie Barber joining me, senior digital content producer my san
Antonio dot Com.
Speaker 1 (24:19):
Katie.
Speaker 2 (24:20):
My understanding from having read the police reports and the
witness statements is that the suspect goes under the other
size tent right the other school's tent at that point,
Austin says, this isn't your tent, get.
Speaker 1 (24:37):
Out of here.
Speaker 2 (24:39):
At that point, at that point, what does the suspect do?
Speaker 6 (24:46):
Police says that when he's told to move out of
the tent, that he grabbed his bag, opened it and
reached inside. And this is when he tells Austin touch
me and see what happens. According to police, so naturally
Austin touched him, Yeah, exactly. Police say that he proceeded
to touch Carmelo, and then Carmelo then postures and tells
(25:10):
Anthony and tells Austin to punch him and see what
happens A short time later.
Speaker 2 (25:15):
A police don't say, so you're understanding, Katie Barber, were
any punches THROWNE Did Austin ever hit the suspect hit?
Speaker 7 (25:25):
It doesn't say.
Speaker 6 (25:26):
It says he grabbed Anthony after that threat to tell
him to move, but it doesn't.
Speaker 7 (25:30):
But police do not say. Witnesses did not tell police
that he was punched.
Speaker 6 (25:35):
But when he was grabbed by Austin is when he
pulled out the knife and stabbed him once in the chest,
is what police say.
Speaker 7 (25:43):
A witness reported.
Speaker 3 (25:45):
A police escort Carmelo Anthony to a squad car. Anthony
says he put his hands on me. I told him
not to. Anthony also asks officers if the victim was
going to be okay and if what happened could be
considered self defense. Officer take evidence photos showing blood on
Anthony's hands, but don't find the knife on him.
Speaker 2 (26:04):
How could a beautiful, young first grade teacher be stabbed
twenty times, including in the back, allegedly die of suicide. Yes,
that was the medical examiner's official ruling after a closed
door meeting. He first named it a homicide. Why what
happened to Ellen Greenberg? A huge American miscarriage of justice?
(26:30):
For an in depth look at the facts, see what
Happened to Ellen on Amazon? All proceeds to the National
Center for Missing and Exploited Children. How does a teen boy,
a twin star athlete in Texas end up stabbed dead
(26:53):
at a track mate of all places?
Speaker 1 (26:57):
Listen to US's dad.
Speaker 15 (26:59):
Great harting true up with me and him and Austin,
and I'm gonna come over and see you this week
and so call look forward to it. Hey, I love you, dad,
That's the love you Tucson. Those were the last words ever.
Speaker 1 (27:14):
Heard from me.
Speaker 2 (27:15):
The fauthor and the twin speaking to our friends at
Dallas Morning News. What about the blood evidence in this case?
With conflicting witness reports, with the suspect claiming self defenses
stand your ground although no punches were seen thrown, that
(27:35):
blood evidence becomes critical. Remember it was raining.
Speaker 1 (27:40):
The track meet is outside.
Speaker 5 (27:42):
Listen as law enforcement and paramedics arrive on scene. The
rain is falling harder. One officer moves the memorial tent
over the victim of medics trained to save his life,
and finding the bloody knife in the stands, quickly takes
photos of it before the rain could wash away all
the blood. A blue tarp is used to cover the
knife in an effort to preserve the evidence, and because
it was so windy, the officer uses a nearby backpack
(28:05):
to weigh down the tarp. He doesn't realize at the
time the backpack belongs to suspect Carmelo Anthony photo.
Speaker 1 (28:14):
No juris don't want.
Speaker 2 (28:16):
Just a photo, They want DNA DEYOXURII, boat and nucleic
acid straight out to renowned medical examiner, doctor Kendall Crowns.
Joining us from this jurisdiction of Texas. Doctor Kendall crowns
the murder what we believe to be the murder weapon,
a knife covered in blood had been thrown or obscured,
(28:41):
let me just say euphemistically, and it was pouring rain.
What's the likelihood that we can get DNA off that knife?
Because the state needs the suspects DNA and the victims
DNA off that knife, Well, they.
Speaker 10 (28:57):
Should probably still be able to get DNA from it,
unless it was scrubbed clean with a cleanser or a
soap of something of that nature. There's probably still enough
DNA on the handle and on the knife itself to
be able to get a good DNA sample. Also, you
have to figure because of the contact between the two boys,
there's probably a way of getting DNA from the victim
(29:20):
as well.
Speaker 1 (29:21):
Kat Barber, where exactly was the knife discovered?
Speaker 7 (29:24):
It was discovered in.
Speaker 6 (29:25):
The bleachers on the north side of the stage at stadium,
which is where.
Speaker 1 (29:29):
Well the hey did he get in the bleachers? Katie?
Speaker 7 (29:32):
He ran off after the stabbing.
Speaker 6 (29:35):
It didn't quite say a total direction, but he did
run off, and it's presumed that he threw the knife
when he ran off, because he didn't have the weapon
on him.
Speaker 7 (29:43):
When he was detained.
Speaker 2 (29:44):
Right a minute, right there, Katie barbermisan Antonio dot Com
to doctor John Delatory. If someone attacked me, and I
thought back, I wouldn't take off running and then hide
the weapon.
Speaker 12 (30:00):
Yeah, you wouldn't. But here's the thing is that if
Anthony saw a bunch of other people, dozens of other
people that were also around and in that tent, he
might have felt overwhelmed. He might have felt scared. He
could have done all of these things just as a
matter of panic. So he runs off, knowing that he
shouldn't have stabbed this person, but he did it anyway.
(30:21):
He throws a knife away, he takes off thinking that
he's going to get very far. There's all kinds of
things that could be happening, because it does not appear
as though he intended to go to that track meet
with the specific purpose to kill Austin Metcalf. It does
seem like things were going on underneath that tent that
neither one of these two boys were prepared for, and
(30:44):
both are now suffering the consequences, with Austin having lost
his life for some kind of nonsense.
Speaker 2 (30:50):
Lisa Herrik, you see where this is going. This state
is going to argue to a jury. He ran off
and disposed of the weapon because he knew what he'd
was wrong, and then immediately began forming a defense in
his mind and even asked law enforcement, Hey, could that
be self defense?
Speaker 1 (31:10):
You think that's self defense?
Speaker 9 (31:11):
There are a couple of things that cut in favor
of the self defense argument, and those are that he
did run away if he was scared, and he so
he he stabs scared.
Speaker 2 (31:26):
Isn't he the one that said touch me and find out?
Is he the one that say, go, oh, punch me,
just see what happens. That doesn't sound scared to me.
Speaker 9 (31:33):
I don't disagree with you, but getting into his mind
for a moment, and the argument that the defense is
going to make right, they have to come up with.
Speaker 1 (31:40):
Someone do I have to get in his mind.
Speaker 9 (31:42):
So if he'll say I was scared, I stabbed him.
I felt like the danger was subdued enough that I
could now safely escape, then I can see how running
away would cut in favor of self defense. I can
see what you're saying.
Speaker 1 (31:58):
How running away? Okay, I don't sign up.
Speaker 2 (32:00):
You just said, have you ever heard the phrase word salad?
Because I just heard one. Okay, wait a minute, what
did you say about the threat was subdued?
Speaker 1 (32:10):
You mean he stabbed Austin in the chest? Is that
what you're talking about? So if the threat is subdued,
why run then?
Speaker 9 (32:20):
Because there were plenty of other people around who were
potentially new dangers, right, people who saw him.
Speaker 2 (32:27):
So now I don't know what you're saying. You're making
that up like a good defense attorney. What other people
presented a danger? Nobody?
Speaker 1 (32:37):
What are you serious?
Speaker 8 (32:39):
Well?
Speaker 1 (32:39):
I mean he he.
Speaker 2 (32:40):
Stabs Austin dead, and then he is in danger of
what retribution?
Speaker 9 (32:45):
People who want to hurt him now that Carmelo hurt
their friend was able to.
Speaker 8 (32:49):
Seem my son on the gurney with a huge hole
and blow all over him, and they were pumping him.
Speaker 4 (32:56):
He wasn't breathing, His eyes would rolled back in his head.
Speaker 2 (32:58):
From our friends at Fox for Crime Stories with Nancy Grace,
how could a beautiful, young first grade teacher be stabbed
twenty times, including in the back, allegedly die of suicide? Yes,
(33:25):
that was the medical examiner's official ruling after a closed
door meeting. He first named it a homicide. Why what
happened to Ellen Greenberg? A huge American miscarriage of justice.
For an in depth look at the facts, see what
Happened to Ellen on Amazon. All proceeds to the National
(33:50):
Center for Missing and Exploited Children. How does a teen
boy literally scrubbed in sunshine, great grade, star athlete, beloved
twin brother.
Speaker 1 (34:04):
How does he end up stabbed dead at a high
school track meet.
Speaker 2 (34:12):
No one saw punches being thrown, nothing like that. The
suspect and the victim had never even met, according to sources.
Speaker 11 (34:22):
Listen, and then I went my head around and then Alsodden,
I see him running on the bleach, gut in his chest.
He just bought of us are out, he said the South.
Speaker 2 (34:33):
There you see Austin's brother Hunter speaking out from our
friends at the Wheal Kane Show on Fox. Why ask why?
How many times has that been said in a courtroom?
Speaker 1 (34:45):
A million? But as you all know.
Speaker 2 (34:48):
The state is never required to show motive. Teams kill
for apparently no reason at all.
Speaker 1 (34:56):
Listen.
Speaker 5 (34:57):
High school Spanish teacher Noi mcgrabory is known for end
enjoying an afternoon walk at a park in Fairfield, Iowa.
When she turns up missing, Retracing her steps begins in
the park The body is found covered by a tarp, wheelbarrow,
and railroad ties, and she suffered head trauma. Cops don't
have to look much further than incriminating social media posts
of two sixteen year old students, Jeremy Goodell and Willard Miller,
(35:20):
from the school where Graver teaches.
Speaker 2 (35:22):
One of the high schoolers thought they might get a
bad grade, and so two of.
Speaker 1 (35:29):
Them go and murder the teacher. Yes, so a murder
over what I c minus.
Speaker 2 (35:38):
Then there is another star student all A's, that commits
murder Derrick Rossa.
Speaker 16 (35:45):
I need to know if your mom is is greeting,
She said, miss I have the gun with me.
Speaker 4 (35:52):
I was going to shoot myself that I didn't want to.
Speaker 15 (35:55):
I have more family members.
Speaker 16 (35:57):
They can take care of my sister.
Speaker 1 (35:58):
I just take th man I told my friend about
it was that bad?
Speaker 2 (36:02):
That is teen boy Derek Rosa. We still don't know
any motive as to why he killed his mother and
then sent the photo of her sleeping in bed now
dead to friends, then asking was that bad that I
killed her and sent photos to friends? So a teen
(36:24):
kills for what motive?
Speaker 1 (36:26):
None? And there's more.
Speaker 5 (36:28):
Tristan Bailey last scene wearing her cheerleader uniform, went missing
on Mother's Day in Jacksonville, Florida. Surveillance video shows her
at one fifteen am. She's walking with a fourteen year
old classmate, Aidan Fucci. When police pick up Fucci for questioning,
he posts a photo of himself in the back of
a police car giving the V sign with the caption,
hey guys, has anybody seen Tristan lately? He also posted
(36:51):
a Snapchat video having fun in a beep cop car.
Tristan's body is discovered in a secluded wooded area. She's
been stabbed one hundred and five fourteen times.
Speaker 2 (37:01):
This little girl was not raped, was not assaulted. There
was no robbery, So what was the motive? Apparently none
and more.
Speaker 5 (37:10):
Jay Williams is fifteen years old. The day he and
sixteen year old Randy Thompson le were a fellow classmate
Michael Russell to his own home, where they stab him
multiple times in the chest, back, and neck. Russell's mother
returns home from running errands and finds his lifeless body
in the backyard. Williams and Thompson say they wanted to
see what it felt like to kill someone.
Speaker 2 (37:30):
Lisa Herrick joining us that are in trial lawyer in
this jurisdiction of Texas. So number one for Austin. Even
if this did happen to have touched the suspect on
the shoulder and said get out of our tent, that
is not going to justify under self defense a deadly
(37:51):
attack with a knife.
Speaker 1 (37:54):
And as far as motive.
Speaker 2 (37:56):
You just heard all of those similar cases where teens kill,
they don't really have a motive.
Speaker 1 (38:01):
The state doesn't have to prove motive, do they. The
state does not have to prove motive.
Speaker 9 (38:06):
And that's mainly because it is nearly impossible to get
into the mind of a charged a defendant unless they
tell you what they were thinking. In this case, we
know that Carmelo is going to claim self depends, but
we don't know what he was actually thinking, and so
the state wouldn't be able to prove a motive without
knowing what he was actually thinking.
Speaker 2 (38:26):
How could a beautiful, young first grade teacher be stabbed
twenty times, including in the back, allegedly die of suicide. Yes,
that was a medical examiner's official ruling after a closed
door meeting. He first named it a homicide. Why what
happened to Ellen? Greenberg a huge American miscarriage of justice.
(38:52):
For an in depth look at the facts, see what
Happened to Ellen on Amazon. All proceeds to the National
Center for Missing and Exploited Children. Teen boy Austin Metcalf
stamped dead at a high school track mate. Apparently no
(39:15):
justification for the stabbing, but at this hour, evil sick
conspiracy theories are promulgating online, including a fake autopsy report Katie.
Speaker 6 (39:27):
Yes, the fake autopsy report that has been police have
warned about. Police have issued multiple warnings publicly on their
social media channels about false statements from the police chief
that have not come from him, as well as this
medical report that shows the primary cause of death being
(39:48):
a drug overdose with the secondary cause of death being
a stab wound. Police have said that that report has
not been released, so any sort of images purporting to
be the auto report are not true.
Speaker 2 (40:01):
Texas Police as we go to air warning about misinformation
being promulgated online.
Speaker 1 (40:07):
They are also warning.
Speaker 2 (40:09):
People Katie Barber not to disseminate the false theories under
threat of what hampering, a hampering or handering a police investigation.
Speaker 6 (40:20):
Yes, and they've also said that people who are pretending
to be officials. Like propagating this information can also be
charged with a third degree felony of impersonating a public servant.
So there are charges at play, and they are investigating
with the FBI into these matters.
Speaker 2 (40:38):
What kind of an evil, sick person would create a
fake autopsy report suggesting that this boy, a star athlete,
died of a drug overdose. But obviously it's someone that
is signing with the suspect and trying to tarnish the
(40:58):
reputation of a young boy, a young boy with all
as star athlete and beloved Twin.
Speaker 1 (41:06):
Speaking of Twin, listen to his brother Hunter.
Speaker 16 (41:09):
We're just one person. We did everything the same. We're
just exactly a light Twighton. We had no we had
a couple of differences, but most of the stuff we
did together and the stuff we had, it's just we
fell as one person. So it's like we just connected
so well and everything we did.
Speaker 2 (41:23):
If you know or think you know anything about this case,
the state is still building its case.
Speaker 1 (41:30):
The defense is starting to build their case.
Speaker 2 (41:33):
Please dial nine seven two two nine two six thousand,
repeat two nine two six one thousand.
Speaker 1 (41:43):
Nancy Grace signing off, goodbye,
Host
Nancy Grace
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