October 10, 2024 • 55 mins
We pick up where we left off in our previous episode and we continue the look at the highly debated and highly controversial Vince McMahon Netflix documentary. In episodes 4-6 we take it through the Chris Benoit tragedy through the finish.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:15):
Hey everyone, it is the Queen Extreme fran Scene and
you are listening to Eyes up Here with Francine on
the iHeartRadio network or wherever you get your podcasts. As always,
I am joined by my co host Chad. And Chad
we got carried away on this Tuesday episode that we
had we had to take it to Earth Day. I
thought we were going to be able to cover this
(00:36):
in about forty minutes, when we were not, and there
was so much that we had left to cover, so
we decided to make it a two parter. So, yeah,
how you doing.
Speaker 2 (00:46):
You are right, I'm doing great now. This is like
it was getting so like intense and you hit the
part where I was like, you know what, this is
where we have to start the next part of the
conversation because when Brett Hart puts that little nu I'll
get out there about Owen Hart's death, it's like that
to be is like for them to have that out
(01:07):
in the world, that's a huge thing to say. So
that's where we'll pick it up.
Speaker 1 (01:10):
Okay, So before we start, for anyone just tuning in,
if you have not listened to Tuesday's episode, I suggest
you go back and listen to that one first, and
then come back over here because we are talking about
the mister McMahon documentary that aired on Netflix, and we're
a little late to the party, I admit, but I
watched everything and we're giving our thoughts. So we did
(01:34):
one through four, and then in the middle of four
we had to stop because we had talked so long
we had to make it a two parter. So now
we're continuing episode four about Brett Hart. Episode four was
the Attitude Error, and Brett Hart made a very bold statement,
(01:56):
as I said in the last episode, he says, is
it because I left WWF that my brother, you know,
did they basically rig it to that Owen Heart would die?
He's insinuating that the cause of death was by WWF
(02:24):
because he walked out, and which I thought was ridiculous. Yeah, yeah,
Like is that revenge for me? On? Come on? Like, no,
not at all. And when he said that, I was flabbergasted.
I was like, do you really believe that they would
put a hit on someone just to get back at you? Terrible?
Speaker 2 (02:51):
Yeah, he did in the moment at least, yeah, at
least in that emotional like a couple of I mean,
could look in ninety nine, So we're a year and
a half for so removed from November ninety seven. He
was still at odds with Vince and the WWF, and
it was not pretty and they were still slinging mud
left and right. I mean, he had said some you know,
(03:12):
nasty stuff about Earl Hebner that was out there on
the sheets, you know, and they were just it was
not an easy time to be Brett Hart against the WWF.
So for him to feel that way at the time,
I'm sure was very you know, justified. And then you know,
i mean, throwing it out there, you know, you're gonna
(03:32):
have to hear the scrutiny. It's it's awful to hear
all that stuff back, and to watch all that stuff
back and see the clips of the guys and what
was going on backstage. I mean, it's it's incredible to
see that people had to live through all that live well.
Speaker 1 (03:49):
Here, yeah, here's here's the thing. And this is another
reason why I don't like Vince McMahon. At times, they
go over Owen Hart dying that evening on the pay
per view, right, tragic, tragic thing that happens live. You
(04:11):
tend to think of these guys and girls as your family.
I refer to ECW as my family. I mean, you know,
my extended family. These are my brothers. Right. How do
you think that they felt to learn that one of
their not only co workers, but brothers, so to speak,
(04:31):
just died in the ring and now you're expected to
go and wrestle in that very same ring where he
just passed away?
Speaker 2 (04:40):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (04:41):
How do you do that to somebody? And then they
go to Vince McMahon, Well, I'm a businessman, The show
must go on? Are you kidding me? I am sorry.
I think every person in that arena would have understood
that they would have to call the show because Owen
(05:02):
Hart just passed away. Yeah, how heartless that that? That?
Now that was the flip side of Vince Tommy enduring
an episode one I want to punch in an episode four.
My stomach turned like hearing him. I never heard him
(05:25):
say those words the show must go on? What if
God forbid Stephanire Shane was harnessed and they fell, would
the show go on?
Speaker 2 (05:36):
What Bret Hart says, Yeah, when Shane McMahon gets dropped
from the top of it.
Speaker 1 (05:41):
Was your child or something happened to Linda? Would the
show have went on. If the answer is yes, you
are a heartless bastard. To me, I don't know how
they worked. When they showed the promo from Jeff, oh
(06:01):
my god, my heart, yeah, oh my god. I felt
so bad for them.
Speaker 2 (06:07):
Here you go. First of all, First off, Owen Hart,
I'm praying for you, buddy. Next line, Valvenus, you've been
chasing these puppies around, I mean behind him.
Speaker 1 (06:17):
I understand they had to do what they had to do.
Their heart wasn't.
Speaker 2 (06:21):
Into this, no all.
Speaker 1 (06:24):
And anybody you could tell they showed, you know, multiple
performers in their face. How do you expect somebody to
perform that way? I didn't see this pay per view,
But was the rest of the show any good? I
can't imagine.
Speaker 2 (06:40):
Imaginable, horrible? And you're a blood stained in the ring
the whole time?
Speaker 1 (06:46):
That was now if you Blue Meanie went on a
tirade about this and said that wasn't Owen's blood.
Speaker 2 (06:53):
That was there.
Speaker 1 (06:54):
Okay, And and if you're interested, go over and listen
to his podcast because he or I think it's I
don't even know that. I think it's the one he
does with Conrad. But he made it a point to
say that wasn't Owen's blood, but that doesn't change the
fact that it was despicable that they still went on
(07:14):
with the show.
Speaker 2 (07:16):
It's not a good show. It's not a good show.
Speaker 1 (07:18):
Well, I don't expect it.
Speaker 3 (07:19):
To be a good show because somebody just died. Yeah,
it's disgusting, really really disgusting that. That is one of
the lowest things I think that ever happened in wrestling.
To go forbid something like that happens, and then to
keep working and making these people work. You get in
(07:42):
that ring, you look to your left or you're right,
and you know that Owen was just there prior and
now he's gone.
Speaker 1 (07:51):
That's despicable. I'm sorry.
Speaker 2 (07:53):
Comments from Martha Hart.
Speaker 1 (07:56):
Recent comments, Yeah, you want to read it.
Speaker 2 (07:59):
With the documentary. He fails to mention is that the
equipment used was never meant for a repelling stunt. Instead,
a harness meant for dragging stunt people behind cars on
movie shoots was used with a sailboat clip meant to
release onload with only six pounds of pressure. Had the
WWE hired qualified riggers who followed proper protocol that includes
redundancy at its typical practice and use it correct equipment.
(08:22):
Owen would not have died that night.
Speaker 1 (08:24):
Your god, unbelievable.
Speaker 2 (08:28):
I continue to hold the WWE and it's then management
responsible for Owen's death. I refuse to let vincick Man
or anyone else rewrite that history.
Speaker 1 (08:36):
Well she's allowed. You know, it's just a sad story
all around, and it just it could have been prevented. Again,
I mean, don't they did they do test runs? Did
they do a series of like.
Speaker 2 (08:56):
You'd have to watch that dark stand? I don't remember.
I think they did. I mean they always tested that
stuff out. They always did that was that was always
the thing. And you know they used the guys that
did stings repelling, you know from the ceiling for WCW.
They always tested that crap out. But whatever it was,
it just did not unclip.
Speaker 1 (09:18):
Oh makes my stomach sick. It was just so sad
to see his body lifeless in the ring, and then
they showed the boys just trying to get through the night.
My god. You know, you would think he would have
a little more remorse for somebody who died under his watch.
(09:41):
And that's all I'm going to say about that.
Speaker 2 (09:43):
Jerry Lawler. Jerry Lawler coming back to the announced booth
white as a ghost and then as it looks, it
does not look good. Yeah, I mean that is just
a clip that lives in infamy.
Speaker 1 (09:57):
All Right, we will go to episode five. Do you
have anything else to say?
Speaker 2 (10:02):
What else can you say?
Speaker 1 (10:04):
Okay, let's let's go to episode five. Episode five was
about his family. You get Paul Hayman talking about Vince's childhood. Again,
he does allude to the fact that he might have
been abused by his mother.
Speaker 2 (10:24):
Yeah, that's that's been said before.
Speaker 1 (10:26):
Many different ways, not just physical, right, which again makes
you think if he's suffering sexual abuse, you know, just
regular abuse by by beatings or whatever, if he didn't
(10:47):
get any counseling or any help, or is this why
he's treating women the way he is portraying them on TV?
You know, I just I'm not justifying it again, but
is this why his brain works the way he does?
You know what I mean, There's there's a there's a
root cause to this. There's a problem there. And again
(11:13):
I never knew of the upbringing that he had. But
to allude that your mother might have done despicable things
to you, that is that's heavy to have to carry.
That's a heavy load to carry.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
Yeah, that's that story has been out there for a
while too, that there's that that kind of abuse was
possibly happening, and does that answers a lot of questions.
If that's the case, that could be a lot of
what's going on.
Speaker 1 (11:43):
Well, here here we go. They talk about Triple H
and Stephanie getting together, and she says she doesn't want
to mention the one storyline that her dad brings up
to her that she said no. But then we go
to Vince and Vince goes, oh, is that the one
that I said I impregnated at my daughter? And I'm like,
(12:04):
oh my god, Like is it again? Is this where
it's stemming from sexual abuse as a child? And then
you think this is an appropriate thing to put on television? Gross?
Katie Vicangle, Gross, Like what do they think? What are
they thinking? At least Stephanie had enough sense to put
(12:25):
her foot down and say, no, Dad, that's pretty inappropriate,
Like I'm not doing that, you know what I mean?
That's disgusting.
Speaker 2 (12:33):
I can't they showed, I believe was it the one
clip of Stephanie the long shot where they pick up
her hanging over the desk, you know, and it's like
the shot coming up of her from behind or something,
and she's showing how they sexualized her over the years,
you know, and.
Speaker 1 (12:50):
She yeah, they might have. I don't remember that one.
They showed a lot of like Trish Stratus because she
was interviewed. They showed the bar looking like a dog.
Segment Stacy Keebler with her legs open and Vince's head
between when she gets hired for the job. She's sitting
on the desk and her legs are here and Vince's
(13:12):
lake between her, Vince making out with Sable, Vince making
out with Candice, Michelle, Vince making out with everybody, Sable, Sable.
Speaker 2 (13:26):
What do you think about Sable being brought up because
there was an allusion to uh, I guess maybe that's
we will hold off. We'll come back to see hold on. Yeah, yeah,
we'll come back to see.
Speaker 1 (13:37):
The first thing they're they're so they're covering is Shane
and excuse me, you're covering Stephanie and Triple H. And
they they go to mention that Shane McMahon is against
him being with her, which I found interesting. Shane did
not want Triple H dating his sister. Vince was pushing
for it. So I don't know if Shane had a
(13:59):
disliking to Triple H back in the day or if
he just didn't want the boys tarnishing his sister kind
of thing. But they talked about that a little bit.
They talked about how Vince was the cheerleader for Triple H.
They talked about Linda, and Linda not liking performing. She
(14:21):
said she was the worst out of the four. She
didn't want to be on camera, but Vince thought it
was important. Even though she wasn't the best at acting,
she was part of the family and it was important
to have her, you know, in the storyline. And they
showed when they apparently true strategy drugged Linda and she
(14:42):
was pushing around in the wheelchair and then them making
out in front of Linda, and you know, Linda's saying, well,
you know, it's part of the story. It's heat blah
blah blah, and everybody was okay with it, so let's
roll with it. And it's just like, okay, now, let
me just.
Speaker 2 (14:59):
Go the bark like a dog segment with Trish, Right, yeah, okay.
In thinking about it in the vein of a television
show are And I'm not trying to condone this and
saying this is a practice that if we would take
the real Trish Stratus person and say this is what
(15:20):
you have to do to keep your job. It was
being used in the form of television, right, did they
Did they mention how in the end Vince got his
comeupp ins and was made the fool in the storyline.
I don't think they did. No, they just brought up
that he made her bark like a dog and wolf
(15:41):
wolf Wolf, Vince was made to look like the asshole
at the end of it.
Speaker 1 (15:46):
They I do remember Trish saying it was it's a
form of heat and you're supposed to not and I
agree with her. You know, Vince being a heel and
putting Trish in that position, he got a lot of
heat for it. Yeah, as a woman, I can see
it in the sense of it is a TV show
(16:09):
and it's fine with Like I thought it was heat
too degrading to women. Yeah, but it's a it's again,
it's a TV show.
Speaker 2 (16:18):
Right, But we watch movies where they do things. I'm sorry,
we watched movies where they can do the same thing.
Speaker 1 (16:24):
I know, Like you've said it wasn't like the Janelle
Grant thing where he's defecating on her head and you know,
telling her to do certain things to certain people and
you know, pe you on command and all this weird stuff. No,
it was a segment for television and it got the
response that they wanted it to get. So are you
(16:45):
a feminist that that is against this stuff? Then, like
they said, turn the TV off, don't watch. It's that simple.
You know, I'm a woman. I didn't take offense to it.
I do think some things are poor taste, but that
really doesn't bother me. You know, it's degrading, yes, but
(17:06):
it you know, it got the reaction that they wanted.
Speaker 2 (17:09):
To right, Yeah, just what I was reading.
Speaker 1 (17:11):
You know, if I was interested position, I would have
did it. That segment I would have did. I would
have done it. You know. Yeah, there's far worse things
that people have done in wrestling that I would draw
the line out. But this, eh, it's he just my opinion,
(17:32):
don't come out me.
Speaker 2 (17:33):
Yeah, it's just like you know, people, he's done so
many bad things. When people use storyline stuff as a
example of the bad things, it's like follow the storyline.
He got made to look like the asshole at the end.
Speaker 1 (17:46):
So it's like he's weird sometimes with his storyline. So
you gotta admit, like it's part of this a fantasy
that he has in his head. He's literally making out
with the hottest girls in the company right over and
over again. He's booking this. Do you blame him? You know?
(18:12):
I mean he's got that power. You either make out
with mister McMahon or you're out the door. Kind of ill.
Speaker 2 (18:20):
And his talent relations guy is finding some of the
talent too, I mean.
Speaker 1 (18:26):
You know, what can I say? But they talk about
the family. They show old photos and video about Linda
and Vince getting married, which was nice to see. They
talk about the feud that the family had that you know,
picking side. Stephanie picked her dad's side while Shane went
(18:48):
with the mom. Then they get into Sable. This is
where they get into Sable and Vince goes to say
that he doesn't remember much about the lawsuit. Do you
believe it because I.
Speaker 2 (19:05):
Remember you remember to read a Chatterton and that it
was consensual from nineteen eighty five.
Speaker 1 (19:09):
But he doesn't remember about Sable, which.
Speaker 2 (19:12):
I could it be because of Sable's husband.
Speaker 1 (19:17):
Well, they alluded to, like could this be a real
affair or was it just a storyline? And there's a
I'm like, what, I've never heard of them having an affair,
have you. That's a yes.
Speaker 2 (19:32):
I mean things that are circulated.
Speaker 1 (19:36):
Okay, I've never read anything. I've never heard anything. Again,
I must be the naive one between the two of us,
because I don't hear anything. You're the one who gives
me all my gossip. So if you heard.
Speaker 2 (19:48):
Something, Chadster, here's a lot of things he doesn't say allegedly.
Speaker 1 (19:52):
See, this is the partnership that should not be because
if you do not share with your.
Speaker 2 (19:57):
Oh man, as there stuff I can't say. I was
born to secrecy till the end. You could never.
Speaker 1 (20:06):
Tell me that on the internet.
Speaker 2 (20:10):
No no, no, no, no no no no. You know
I have friends I don't and they've told me stuff
I have will never I can't share ever ever ever.
Speaker 1 (20:20):
All right, Well, Vince doesn't remember about the lawsuit, and
he looked a little, uh pissed off while he was
talking about it, and it was weird, so to speak.
So I don't know what he was alluding to. But
I've always heard that Vince was in love with sable
(20:42):
on a sheet, So take that for what you will. Uh.
They showed the Stock Exchange, New York Stock Exchange. Uh.
They talked about the downfall of w c W, talked
about Vince buying w c W the XFL, which was
a disaster. I didn't know how much of a disaster
(21:06):
it was. I knew, but I didn't know about the
time frame and you know how how it went down
seventy five percent since the first episode and all of
that stuff they had stats and him being interviewed about
it and looking extremely uncomfortable in the interview because the
guy was just rolling on him one thing after another.
Speaker 2 (21:28):
Do you remember you don't remember all that rollout of
the XFL. No, Because it was around the time of
ECW going out of business.
Speaker 1 (21:34):
I didn't really pay attention to the XFL. I knew
it was a football league, you know, when football wasn't
around that this came up, but I didn't know like
what it was actually or who was involved. I just
knew it was Vince's thing.
Speaker 2 (21:50):
Oh man, Yeah, So I recorded. I still have it
on tape. I transferred to DVD the first pregame show
and the first broadcasted game that they had on Network TV.
They have JR. And Jerry Lawler doing play by play
of one of the games. They have The Rock doing
the intro to the kickoff. Right, they have Jesse Ventura
(22:14):
as a color commentator on one of the other games. Right,
it is a WWF at the time show on Turf.
It's like, yeah, it's so bad. If you're a football fan,
you're trying to watch it. It's so But JR called
football legit, so it's like he's he knows what he's doing.
But it's just it's so. It's like the B team.
It's like watching like high school kids play professional football.
Speaker 1 (22:38):
They were showing clips and every clip was somebody missing
a ball.
Speaker 2 (22:43):
Oh so bad, throwing a ball.
Speaker 1 (22:45):
Bouncing off third head, trying to catch it, they missed
the play. Like they were basically saying everybody sucked in
the league.
Speaker 2 (22:53):
Yeah, it was.
Speaker 1 (22:54):
It was for football players who could not make it anywhere, right.
Speaker 2 (22:57):
Right, it was amateurs. I saw I was. I loved
it because Opie and Anthony did the pregame show from New York,
so I recorded it because it was like getting another
Opian Anthony show. But even they talked about how shitty
it was Okay, it's it's great. It's such a time
capsule if you look back at it.
Speaker 1 (23:14):
Yeah. So they they showed that, which again I didn't
know anything about it, and Bob Costas is just saying
that he was great.
Speaker 2 (23:24):
He was great.
Speaker 1 (23:26):
It was pretty funny to see him. Oh. They they
talked a little bit about them losing the w w
f UH the rights to use the initials to UH
the World Wildlife Fund and what else did oh talked
(23:46):
about John Cena? How John Cena's character wasn't really going
anywhere and he was on the version getting fired. But
then he was on a bus one day going to
a show and there were a bunch of guys in
the back of the bus and the rappin' and John's like, well,
I'm going to go on the back of the bus
(24:06):
and he starts freestyle and rapping. Little did he know
Stephanie McMahon was on the bus and stuff, and he
says to him, do you want to do that on television?
And John's like, hell, yeah, I want to do that
on television. And that saved his career because he was
on the chopping block. Yeah, that was an interesting tidbit.
Speaker 2 (24:24):
He was horribly lame before that, his character was so bland,
but well, he was prototypeing in Ov Dubb but when
they brought him up, he was just generic John Cena
with your local sports team's colors. Whenever he went to
you know, if he was in Philly he had the
green and white tights, and he was in New York
he had orange and blue tights. He was so generic
(24:48):
as just John Cena. It was awful. So yeah, that
was quite the transition.
Speaker 1 (24:54):
Right, And then they talk about Vince declining to buy
the UFC at the time, which he totally should have
bought it, but you know whatever, he didn't think it
was a big deal. And then the final thing about
this episode is Shane leaving w w E. They did
(25:14):
show a promo about Janelle Grant's lawsuit at the end
of this episode. So again, Shane McMahon, my favorite McMahon
always was, always is always will be. I should have
wore my darn it, I should have wore my Shane
McMahon jersey that I have from one.
Speaker 2 (25:33):
You have a Shane O mac jersey. I do.
Speaker 1 (25:36):
My husband bought it for me.
Speaker 2 (25:38):
Oh wow, look at you, Shane O mack.
Speaker 1 (25:40):
You I think it's I think it's the one from
one of the pay per views. I think there's like money,
here comes the money, or something's.
Speaker 2 (25:49):
On the back of it.
Speaker 1 (25:50):
But it's the cool one that buttons down the front
like a hockey jersey, but it buttons the baseball jersey.
I guess it is.
Speaker 2 (25:56):
Are we going to do the breaking news when he
debuts on AW or what?
Speaker 1 (26:00):
And is that I've been waiting with it.
Speaker 2 (26:02):
Coming, It's coming. It's definitely coming very soon.
Speaker 1 (26:05):
Well I can't wait for it to come because I'm like, wait,
I'm chomping at the bit to see him there. The
last episode was titled The Finish and it basically covers
the last ten years and Vince leaving. The first thing
(26:26):
that they show or clips from WrestleMania twenty three, and
they showed Donald Trump. They show a lot of Donald Trump,
And let me tell you something, whether you like him
or not, he was pretty damn good in the world
of professional wrestling. He was much deserving of his Hall
of Fame spot. Don't you think that.
Speaker 2 (26:47):
Was a great angle. We've got a lot of eyeballs.
Him and Vince had a great chemistry. He threw a
mean slap to Vince Yeah, and can't take a stunner.
Speaker 1 (26:56):
But no, but he got to shave his head, which
was cool.
Speaker 2 (27:00):
He got shave Vince's head. But he every time he
and he Hey bought Monday Night Raw later on, he
was he was always good. Did they show the clip
of him and the Boogeyman?
Speaker 1 (27:13):
I don't think so they showed they They showed a
lot of like the bald It was, yeah, like Vince was.
Vince was in front of a picture of Donald Trump
balled and then Trump was in front of a picture
of Vince ball Ye the face off, and then they
actually showed a little bit of the match, and then
they showed him shaven.
Speaker 2 (27:32):
Right, there's a there's a segment that maybe it's a
wrestlemate before perhaps, but there's a segment that Donald Trump
does with the Boogeyman, you know, when a Boogeyman does
like the creepy pop up from somewhere. Yeah, the comedic
timing is out of this world because Trump does like
one of those like looks at him. You know, Boogeyman
(27:54):
has to like scurry away because he does like you know,
it's just I'll send.
Speaker 1 (27:58):
It to you.
Speaker 2 (27:59):
It's very funny.
Speaker 1 (28:00):
Okay, all right, so after they show this, they show
the storyline about Vince wanting to die and when he
gets in the limo and they blow the limo up right,
and then it's like okay. They show like a visual
and a candlelight thing with Vince's picture and deceased two
(28:22):
thousand and seven or whatever it said on it. But
then that had the halt because Benoir, the stuff with
Chris Benoa happens, and at first they do a tribute
show because they didn't know the details of what happened.
But then as the story breaks, turns out we all
(28:44):
know the tragedy, you know, Vin, excuse me, Chris, Nancy
and their son died, and the story is told that
it was Chris taking everybody's life and then taking his own,
which is horrible, absolutely horrible. So you know, Vince didn't
(29:06):
want to go that route with you know, killing himself,
so they had to backtrack do something different.
Speaker 2 (29:15):
I was at the show where they played the Vince
graphic uh following the explosion, and it was such poor taste.
While the the it was all unfolding, it was I mean,
everybody hated it at the time. Nobody liked the storyline.
Nobody liked the angle. The biggest thing to come out
(29:37):
of it was that Paul London got a ton of
heat for smiling during the somber Yeah, the very somber
walk Vince had to the limo and Paul London big
grin on his face. But I remember it just like
people were booing the you know, the graphic when it
popped up. It just it was such a stupid angle
at the time, Yeah, made no because you know he
(29:57):
was going to come back, you know, like it was.
Speaker 4 (30:00):
It was.
Speaker 2 (30:00):
It was one of those things where were starting to
get like ridiculous what they were doing with mister McMahon,
because it's like, what else could you do with him?
He's already like lost a company ten million times, He's
fought every babyface as the evil owner of the company.
Now he's dead, and now he didn't come back. So
it's like when all the Benwa stuff happened on the Monday,
You're like, oh my god, well they got to scrap that.
Speaker 1 (30:22):
Yeah, exactly. And he goes on to say like how
people were calling to make sure he was alive, Like
Donald Trump called and said, is Vince okay? Are you okay?
And like some of the boys were like, did Vince die?
Is he okay? And it's like, dude, if you don't know,
that's work okay with Trump. But everybody else like, do
you think they would show his demise on television?
Speaker 2 (30:44):
Yeah, I mean it's.
Speaker 1 (30:45):
You know, it's corny, it's hokey.
Speaker 2 (30:48):
Right, and that's the kind of stuff like I just
shake my head when I hear this.
Speaker 1 (30:52):
I hear you. Well, they had Brian Gertchwitz, Brett, Steve,
everybody was sharing thoughts about, you know, Chris ben wom
what happened and this gets into this was really interesting interesting.
Chris Newinsky comes on, and you know, he's been an
(31:13):
advocate for CTE for like the longest time and has
been doing research for years, and he was one of
the first people that said that Ben Wall had CTE.
And this shocked me. When Steve Austin said he doesn't
believe in it, Yeah, I was shocked to hear that
because I think it's a real thing. Undertaker was saying
(31:36):
he was mad that you know, he's old school. He's
mad that the chair shots to the head were taken away,
but he does understand why because of you know, it
affecting people's brains and you take one too many chair shots.
That's not good so for but for Steve Austin to
(31:57):
say he doesn't believe in it that, I just was left.
I'm founded with that one.
Speaker 2 (32:02):
I was a shocker.
Speaker 1 (32:04):
Yeah, I thought that was kind of a weird. I mean,
you believe what you want to believe, but I don't know.
Speaker 2 (32:09):
And they show the clip. They show the Owen pile
driver that analyzed him broke his neck and uh, you
know when he said, oh, I was dumped on my
head once and that was you know, they showed the clip.
I would shudder to think that Steve Austin has had
many a concussion over his career, and you know, maybe
he's lucky enough to not suffer some of the effects
(32:31):
that some of the other guys do. Unfortunately, but it's
kind of well documented. Especially let's take wrestling out of
the equation. Okay, wam, it's gone. The NFL players that
are suffering now and who have passed away and have
documented CET A brain scan it is. I was shocked
(32:55):
by his comments that he was not believing in CT
and man effacts. Very surprised.
Speaker 1 (33:01):
Yeah, me too. I just was like, oh, come on,
like I usually agree with Steve on a lot of things,
but this one, I was just like bro wrong. CT
is a real thing. I remember. I remember before Shannon
pissed away Daphne, she told me, she said, I told
my father, I'm donating my brain. Yeah, she swore she
(33:23):
had CT. She swore she had it. I am not
sure if they ever went through with it, but I
remember her telling me over and over again, I have CT.
I know I have CT, and I'm just like sad.
Speaker 2 (33:39):
It's incredibly sad. I spoke with the guy who played
in the NFL last week and he was telling me,
you know, I asked, how do you feel? And he said, well,
outside of how many times I was hitting the head
during my career, I feel great. And he noticeably, and
I've worked with this guy in about two years, he
was noticeably slower in every respect that I had for
(34:02):
a question just in general, how are you or is
this date okay?
Speaker 1 (34:08):
And uh?
Speaker 2 (34:08):
And working with him two years ago, maybe even a
year and a half just and his response was, outside
of all the hits I took thirty years ago, I'm fine.
So that doesn't tell you that there's there's long term effects.
Super shocked by stone cold Steve.
Speaker 1 (34:24):
Austin, Yeah, that's pretty sad. Phil much Nick was in
this a lot. You don't like him?
Speaker 2 (34:32):
Eight his guns wrote, I wrote my senior my my
senior year in high school, like dissertation on how much
I disliked Phil much Nick.
Speaker 1 (34:40):
Okay, Well, in watching him on this doc, I I
kind of admire him for taking the initiative to tell
it like it is and to pull no punches as
a reporter. He just talks about the quality of life
changes he's seen in wrestlers over the years. And you
(35:01):
know it's true. The older we get, we're decaying faster
than the normal human being. It's trauma. But I don't
care how many people say, well, you go to wrestling school,
you learn how to take a bump. I don't care
if you learn how to take a bump. Taking a
bump is not normal. It is trauma on your body.
(35:26):
You just fall one time in regular life, and you
can screw up your whole skeletal system with one fall. Okay,
imagine doing it for a living and bumping night after
night after night after night. Some night you might fall
flat on your back. Some night you might hit your head.
Sometimes you might land on your shoulder, or your hip wrong,
(35:48):
or your tailbone. Your body will never be the same again.
Speaker 2 (35:54):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (35:55):
So compared to like a normal person, we're aging quicker
and our bodies are rapidly destroying themselves. It's just inevitable.
I'm never gonna get better. My neck is never gonna
get better. My back is never going to get better.
And I didn't do half the stuff that the pro
(36:17):
wrestlers who wrestled every single lean and took multiple bumps in.
I took maybe two three bumps a night for seven
years in a row, which is bad. You know, that's
not good. But when you're doing a match and bumping
twenty thirty times a night, that takes another level of
(36:38):
a toll on your body. Right, So you know, I
agree with Phil. Your way of life is not going
to be good when you're sixty, seventy eighty years old.
It's just it's proven. Look at most of these guys walking,
they can't even walk.
Speaker 2 (36:59):
Yeah, that's that's very true. Absolutely, Is that fair to say?
Speaker 1 (37:02):
I think that's a.
Speaker 2 (37:03):
Fairy fair fair to say. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (37:05):
So, you know, Phil Phill's on the money, and you
can't argue that fact. And I think every you know,
some wrestlers are luckier than others, but some are mostly
dependent on pain pills, which is sad, you know, because
that's when you see them. They're they're falling asleep at
their tables when they're supposed to sign and stuff, and
(37:28):
it's like, you know, people pin them. Oh you're a
drug addict, right, Well, why did I start to take
these drugs? Because my body is killing me and I
can't cope with the pain exactly, So how are you
supposed to live? You think a tile on all is
going to do it? No, it's not so if you
(37:48):
you don't walk these guys' shoes, you can't answer that question.
So you hear from Phil who you hate.
Speaker 2 (37:56):
Uh.
Speaker 1 (37:57):
Then we talk about the Undertaker and he talks belt
his his winning streak, ending that he didn't know I know,
they make it a thing.
Speaker 2 (38:07):
They didn't need to be on their like this is
where it was stupid, you know, and all those things
they threw in.
Speaker 1 (38:12):
Yeah, no, it wasn't stupid because he had a concussion.
Speaker 2 (38:17):
Okay, you know that all right? That part, yes, it
ties in.
Speaker 1 (38:19):
He had a concussion and he still went I think
he said like twenty twenty five minutes afterwards, and he
doesn't remember any of it.
Speaker 2 (38:27):
Okay, yeah, that parts the concussion.
Speaker 1 (38:30):
But then Vince says, well, he was traumatized by losing
the belt, that's why he didn't remember, Not because he
had a concussion. Vince tried to say he was so
upset because he had to drop the strap, that's why
he didn't remember the match, but Taker saying, no, I
hit my head. I had a concussion, and that's why
(38:52):
I don't remember any of the match. So they're talking
about CTE concussions. So yeah, it did happen.
Speaker 2 (38:59):
Okay, well I'm confused with another part.
Speaker 1 (39:01):
Then okay, but you know hearing Vince saying he was
too traumatized to remember, too traumatized by the loot, the
winning street coming to an end by losing. Are you
serious You can't admit that the guy had a concussion?
Does he think Taker was lying to him? Wasn't there
(39:21):
medical in the back telling him, yeah, you're concussed, you
have a concussion.
Speaker 2 (39:26):
If anybody was as loyal as Soldier to him, it
would be him. So the Undertaker, I think you listen
to what he was saying.
Speaker 1 (39:32):
For sure. God. So then they they say how they
have to go to PG programming. Now they talk about
the Women's Revolution for like a minute, and then they
showcase Shane McMahon coming back to WWE after several years
of being away and he gets to work with the
Undertaker at WrestleMania thirty two. Then Taker says he would
(39:57):
take a bullet for Vince, and it is very clear
that this was filmed. They keep saying this was filmed
before the Janelle Grand incident. So it's like, okay, you
would take a bullet for him? Would you take a
bullet for him? Now? Is anybody's opinion different now than
it was when you sat down and did this interview?
Speaker 2 (40:16):
I mean I listened to a lot of clips that
are out there from Undertaker's podcast, and I don't hear
him speak any differently.
Speaker 1 (40:24):
So he okay, so he's remaining a loyal soldier. But
there how about everybody else?
Speaker 2 (40:30):
You know, I'd venture to think that. I mean John Cena,
you know, in the very.
Speaker 1 (40:35):
Business, John Cena's back kind of you know, doing his
retirement thing.
Speaker 2 (40:41):
So you've seen it publicly said, you know, he felt
for Vince McMahon and what he was going through, and
that you know, he's he's there for his friends when
they need him and blah blah blah blah blah.
Speaker 1 (40:52):
So why would he say any different? Like I just said,
he's back with the company doing his whole retirement thing.
He's still when do you think that's with me? And
the first thing you think of is WWE. Even though
he's not physically a part of that you know company anymore,
he's still going to be a name associated to them.
(41:14):
So I don't think anybody that is involved with WWE
is going to talk about him negatively. I think fear
wise or anybody who thinks they can get a Legends deal,
or who think they can get something from the company,
you know what I mean. I think the people who
are vocal just don't give a shit and are telling
(41:38):
it like it is because they don't care. They have
nothing to lose. There's no dog in the game, right.
If you have something to gain from it, then you
have to watch your p's and q's because you still
have a big man there kind of sort of through
Triple H. You know, Stephanie pop Up. Is she going
(42:01):
to come back at some point? We don't know. No
one knows. So I feel like if you work for
that company, you have to dance around the subject and
that's why not a lot of people are going to
talk about it. But it's just funny because all of
these you know, these interviews were done before the news
(42:24):
came out, so you have to keep that in mind.
Vince was asked if he would retire, he said no.
Everybody else said they'd never see Vince retiring. What does
it go to him retiring in twenty twenty two only
to come back in twenty twenty three. And then they
(42:46):
interviewed Bruce Pritchard and he feels like they look back
on the whole doc and Bruce says, this is it's
a hip piece, just to make Vince look bad. And
then he goes into what Vince did for his wife
when his wife was sick, And I get that. I
(43:10):
get that Vince was good to him. I understand it.
He has a different relationship with Vince than a lot
of people do, so I can understand the loyalty. But
there's got to be part of you, even if you
don't want to say it publicly. There's got to be
a part that says this behavior is not right. But
(43:30):
can he say that publicly? Again, No, he cannot, even
though he might think it. He can't say it. I mean,
don't you even think McMahon questions what he did? You know,
do people who commit crimes show remorse afterwards and realize
(43:51):
what I did was wrong? Some do and some do.
Do you think Vince McMahon has a conscience. Do you
think the power or hungary maniac who ran that company
has a remorse about how he treated some of the employees,
some of the boys, some of the staff. I don't know.
(44:13):
I don't know. I don't know that person, but I
get where Pritchard's coming from because he has that different relationship.
So after they talked to Bruce, they say two days
after that the interview was filmed, all the details of
Janelle Grant's lawsuit become public, and then they talk about
(44:36):
Vincent's legacy in the business. This was again in twenty
twenty one and twenty twenty two, So you would come
to think what they answer different now? Is his legacy
tarnished because of everything that popped up, all that we know? Now?
Does that take away from what he did for the business.
(44:58):
My answer is no, it doesn't. I separate the two.
I can, just like with ben Law, I see a
brilliant performer in Chris and Law. Few could do it
better than him in the ring. As a person, it
was terrible what he did. And again, was it a
(45:21):
sickness due to CTE Will never know. We'll never know,
But poor Nancy and poor Daniel. My heart breaks for
those two. You know, it's like, just do it to yourself.
Don't hurt anybody else. You want to be gone, Just
just do it to yourself. You know they're innocent, innocent
(45:43):
little boy. But I can separate that and look at
his performance. Doesn't mean I have to like the person.
And this is the same with Vince McMahon. Vince McMahon
was a brilliant booker, a brilliant businessman. You know. He
came from dirt, poor nothing and made a multi billion
(46:05):
dollar company and carried it on his back. His character
was one of the best heels I've ever seen in
my life, and I loved to hate him. But as
a person, the more I find out, the more sick
(46:25):
I become. But I separate the two right, because that's
the only way you can. It doesn't because he's a
shitty person doesn't make his performance shitty. No, he was
brilliant before we found out he did all this stuff.
Why would you take the brilliant away from him? You can't.
(46:47):
You can't take away talent like that. So for me,
like I separate the two. But then you know, they
the episode just goes into Vince being on to investigation.
It talks about brock Lesnar being involved and that Janelle
Grant's lawsuit is on hold while federal investigation is still ongoing,
(47:09):
and that's how it ended. So I would have loved
for them to incorporate her. I get why she wasn't
on it. I understand all that, you know, she can't
talk about it or whatever, but I would have loved
more like maybe another part and they covered the lawsuit
and they covered what was in the paperwork, and you know,
(47:33):
because that stuff was just wow. I read her and
it was like wausers, you know what I mean. Interesting.
But overall for me not wanting to watch it, I
will say I did enjoy it. I did. I'm glad
I watched it. I was happy I watched it. For
(47:53):
all those who keep saying I'm not going to watch
it because it's things I already know, there might be
things you don't know or quote notes that you weren't
privy to prior, so I would definitely recommend it if
you're a wrestling fan, if you're a WWE fan, if
you're a Vincementman fan. I am happy I watched it.
I will admit the only reason why I did watch
(48:14):
it is to do this this podcast and do a
recap because everybody was asking me. But I'm glad I did.
And it was entertaining, and again, parts were endearing and
parts were I want to punch you in the face,
you know.
Speaker 2 (48:32):
So I love seeing the footage. I loved that backstage
footage that they showed that you I'd never seen before.
To me, I'm right where you are. It doesn't separate,
or it doesn't change. I separate the two, you know.
When I want to watch any kind of wrestling, I
(48:52):
put on old school, I put on stuff that I like.
I you know, it's still new to me, even though
I might have seen it a hundred million times. I
love it, and most of the time it's got Vince
McMahon's signature on it. So I can't do anything about that.
I can't change that. He created the world that made
me interested in the wrestling business. It made me Vince
(49:13):
McMahon's world made me interested in wrestling. Vince McMahon and
his world made me discover ECW and then WCW and
the nWo and everything else, and even every character I've
ever seen on TV is because I started watching what
he created. I can't separate that. I can't separate that,
(49:34):
and I can like what he did and not like
what he's done in his personal life, so I can separate.
He's not a great person, but he's the PT Barnum
of the pro wrestling world.
Speaker 4 (49:46):
Absolutely, yeah, And I think, you know, you need to
look at it with an open mind, because if you don't,
it's like you're never you don't meet your heroes kind
of thing.
Speaker 1 (49:58):
You're never gonna be able to separated, and then you
can't enjoy things anymore. You know, half of Hollywood are
dirt bags. Right. If I knew the legacy and the
person behind every motion picture, I wouldn't want to watch it.
You know, we talked about Ditty and all the stuff
(50:18):
that's going on with him, and you know, am I
not gonna listen to so and So's music because they
were at a ditty party. No, I'm still gonna listen
to whoever I like, but as a person, you know, sketchy, right,
same with Hollywood. You know, like there's certain people in
Hollywood that were on that list. Does that make them
(50:40):
a bad actor? Hell no, But as a person, whatever
they're doing, it makes me question their integrity. But it
still doesn't mean that, you know, they're all of a
sudden they're a shitty actor. Ah, they're still a good actor.
It's just that they're a shitty person. But I learned
(51:00):
how to separate the two a long time ago. Yeah,
so I don't know. Again, just my two cents. You
don't have to take my word as gold. You decide
what you want to decide to do. But overall, out
of five stars, i'd give this doc a solid four
(51:20):
because I did enjoy it. I just feel like they
could have included a little more, a little more with
Today's case I would have liked to see, but otherwise
interesting stuff.
Speaker 2 (51:36):
I didn't watch the whole thing, so inconclusive for me,
But what I saw I enjoyed, and everything that was
on there. You know, I've already heard before, so it's
just a elaborate retelling.
Speaker 1 (51:47):
It's okay, But.
Speaker 2 (51:49):
Liked what I saw, A good production value. You know.
And for those somebody said to me, I can't remember
if it was my brother. If you read me a
quote from somebody said, you gotta remember remember everybody who's
watching Netflix is about two percent of the actual wrestling fans.
So these are people discovering this for the first time.
Speaker 1 (52:07):
Interesting, Well, then they're really going to enjoy it because
they don't know anything. So there you go. So there's
our review. Do you agree with me? Do you disagree
with me? Let me know in the comments. If you
haven't followed me on iHeart, please look up eyes up
here with Francine and give us a follow. It's free.
(52:27):
If you're listening on Spotify, Apple, wherever you get your podcasts,
go ahead and subscribe on there. If you're not on
our YouTube channel, I don't know why you're not there,
but please go over to YouTube and ACWDVA, Franci and
exclamation Point and subscribe. It's also free, and if you
want to be a channel member, it's only five ninety
(52:49):
nine a month. You get exclusive videos, emojis and all
kinds of cool stuff, So go over there and subscribe
as well.
Speaker 2 (52:59):
Absolutely, yeah, but.
Speaker 1 (53:02):
You have anything to plug. I have a couple of
things really quickly if I.
Speaker 2 (53:06):
Could, Yeah, you know, just chatty and be young x
Oka Instagram. I be exclusives. Wrestle Caid coming up at
Thanksgiving weekend, I be exclusives. We'll present Kevin Thor in
the Big Vampire. Working on some cool stuff, some cool
photo ops possibly some Mordecai props coming, so working on that.
(53:30):
I'll have more on my social media in the coming weeks.
Speaker 1 (53:33):
All right, November is a very busy month for the Queen.
I have Rhode Island Comic Con November one, second and third.
I'll be signing along with the Dudley Boys, and I
think Ginger Mahaal will be with us as well. I think,
so come on out if you're in the Rhode Island area,
please come and see me. And then on November ninth,
(53:58):
I will be at the Big Event in uh where's
that at Long Island?
Speaker 2 (54:04):
Big Event Long Island, yep.
Speaker 1 (54:05):
Okay, Suffolk Suffolk Credit Union Arena in Brentwood, New York.
For more information, you could go to the Big Event
New York dot com and get your tickets there. And
that's on November ninth again, I think it's from like
ten to three or something. And then the Big One Wrestlcaide.
(54:28):
This is November twenty ninth to December first. I'll be
there that Friday and Saturday in Winston Salem, North Carolina,
Shane Douglas and I'll be kissing babies, signing anything you
bring us, and drinking cocktails. So come on out and
see us then, and across the born old social media
you can find me at ecw D Verfreed Scene. I
(54:51):
hope you're staying safe. I hope you were staying healthy,
and most of all, I hope you're staying extreme. Yeah.
(55:11):
H Francine Francis Francis, Queen Extreme Extreme, ties up here,
head head, The Queen Extreme.
Speaker 2 (55:22):
Podcast ties up here.
Speaker 1 (55:25):
Hey head, it's the Queen Extreme Podcast. It's the Queen
of Extreme.
Speaker 2 (55:30):
Bruni.
Speaker 1 (55:31):
In the letter she is the Woman of the dreams
lettond on the scene Francis
Hey everyone, it is the Queen Extreme fran Scene and
you are listening to Eyes up Here with Francine on
the iHeartRadio network or wherever you get your podcasts. As always,
I am joined by my co host Chad. And Chad
we got carried away on this Tuesday episode that we
had we had to take it to Earth Day. I
thought we were going to be able to cover this
(00:36):
in about forty minutes, when we were not, and there
was so much that we had left to cover, so
we decided to make it a two parter. So, yeah,
how you doing.
Speaker 2 (00:46):
You are right, I'm doing great now. This is like
it was getting so like intense and you hit the
part where I was like, you know what, this is
where we have to start the next part of the
conversation because when Brett Hart puts that little nu I'll
get out there about Owen Hart's death, it's like that
to be is like for them to have that out
(01:07):
in the world, that's a huge thing to say. So
that's where we'll pick it up.
Speaker 1 (01:10):
Okay, So before we start, for anyone just tuning in,
if you have not listened to Tuesday's episode, I suggest
you go back and listen to that one first, and
then come back over here because we are talking about
the mister McMahon documentary that aired on Netflix, and we're
a little late to the party, I admit, but I
watched everything and we're giving our thoughts. So we did
(01:34):
one through four, and then in the middle of four
we had to stop because we had talked so long
we had to make it a two parter. So now
we're continuing episode four about Brett Hart. Episode four was
the Attitude Error, and Brett Hart made a very bold statement,
(01:56):
as I said in the last episode, he says, is
it because I left WWF that my brother, you know,
did they basically rig it to that Owen Heart would die?
He's insinuating that the cause of death was by WWF
(02:24):
because he walked out, and which I thought was ridiculous. Yeah, yeah,
Like is that revenge for me? On? Come on? Like, no,
not at all. And when he said that, I was flabbergasted.
I was like, do you really believe that they would
put a hit on someone just to get back at you? Terrible?
Speaker 2 (02:51):
Yeah, he did in the moment at least, yeah, at
least in that emotional like a couple of I mean,
could look in ninety nine, So we're a year and
a half for so removed from November ninety seven. He
was still at odds with Vince and the WWF, and
it was not pretty and they were still slinging mud
left and right. I mean, he had said some you know,
(03:12):
nasty stuff about Earl Hebner that was out there on
the sheets, you know, and they were just it was
not an easy time to be Brett Hart against the WWF.
So for him to feel that way at the time,
I'm sure was very you know, justified. And then you know,
i mean, throwing it out there, you know, you're gonna
(03:32):
have to hear the scrutiny. It's it's awful to hear
all that stuff back, and to watch all that stuff
back and see the clips of the guys and what
was going on backstage. I mean, it's it's incredible to
see that people had to live through all that live well.
Speaker 1 (03:49):
Here, yeah, here's here's the thing. And this is another
reason why I don't like Vince McMahon. At times, they
go over Owen Hart dying that evening on the pay
per view, right, tragic, tragic thing that happens live. You
(04:11):
tend to think of these guys and girls as your family.
I refer to ECW as my family. I mean, you know,
my extended family. These are my brothers. Right. How do
you think that they felt to learn that one of
their not only co workers, but brothers, so to speak,
(04:31):
just died in the ring and now you're expected to
go and wrestle in that very same ring where he
just passed away?
Speaker 2 (04:40):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (04:41):
How do you do that to somebody? And then they
go to Vince McMahon, Well, I'm a businessman, The show
must go on? Are you kidding me? I am sorry.
I think every person in that arena would have understood
that they would have to call the show because Owen
(05:02):
Hart just passed away. Yeah, how heartless that that? That?
Now that was the flip side of Vince Tommy enduring
an episode one I want to punch in an episode four.
My stomach turned like hearing him. I never heard him
(05:25):
say those words the show must go on? What if
God forbid Stephanire Shane was harnessed and they fell, would
the show go on?
Speaker 2 (05:36):
What Bret Hart says, Yeah, when Shane McMahon gets dropped
from the top of it.
Speaker 1 (05:41):
Was your child or something happened to Linda? Would the
show have went on. If the answer is yes, you
are a heartless bastard. To me, I don't know how
they worked. When they showed the promo from Jeff, oh
(06:01):
my god, my heart, yeah, oh my god. I felt
so bad for them.
Speaker 2 (06:07):
Here you go. First of all, First off, Owen Hart,
I'm praying for you, buddy. Next line, Valvenus, you've been
chasing these puppies around, I mean behind him.
Speaker 1 (06:17):
I understand they had to do what they had to do.
Their heart wasn't.
Speaker 2 (06:21):
Into this, no all.
Speaker 1 (06:24):
And anybody you could tell they showed, you know, multiple
performers in their face. How do you expect somebody to
perform that way? I didn't see this pay per view,
But was the rest of the show any good? I
can't imagine.
Speaker 2 (06:40):
Imaginable, horrible? And you're a blood stained in the ring
the whole time?
Speaker 1 (06:46):
That was now if you Blue Meanie went on a
tirade about this and said that wasn't Owen's blood.
Speaker 2 (06:53):
That was there.
Speaker 1 (06:54):
Okay, And and if you're interested, go over and listen
to his podcast because he or I think it's I
don't even know that. I think it's the one he
does with Conrad. But he made it a point to
say that wasn't Owen's blood, but that doesn't change the
fact that it was despicable that they still went on
(07:14):
with the show.
Speaker 2 (07:16):
It's not a good show. It's not a good show.
Speaker 1 (07:18):
Well, I don't expect it.
Speaker 3 (07:19):
To be a good show because somebody just died. Yeah,
it's disgusting, really really disgusting that. That is one of
the lowest things I think that ever happened in wrestling.
To go forbid something like that happens, and then to
keep working and making these people work. You get in
(07:42):
that ring, you look to your left or you're right,
and you know that Owen was just there prior and
now he's gone.
Speaker 1 (07:51):
That's despicable. I'm sorry.
Speaker 2 (07:53):
Comments from Martha Hart.
Speaker 1 (07:56):
Recent comments, Yeah, you want to read it.
Speaker 2 (07:59):
With the documentary. He fails to mention is that the
equipment used was never meant for a repelling stunt. Instead,
a harness meant for dragging stunt people behind cars on
movie shoots was used with a sailboat clip meant to
release onload with only six pounds of pressure. Had the
WWE hired qualified riggers who followed proper protocol that includes
redundancy at its typical practice and use it correct equipment.
(08:22):
Owen would not have died that night.
Speaker 1 (08:24):
Your god, unbelievable.
Speaker 2 (08:28):
I continue to hold the WWE and it's then management
responsible for Owen's death. I refuse to let vincick Man
or anyone else rewrite that history.
Speaker 1 (08:36):
Well she's allowed. You know, it's just a sad story
all around, and it just it could have been prevented. Again,
I mean, don't they did they do test runs? Did
they do a series of like.
Speaker 2 (08:56):
You'd have to watch that dark stand? I don't remember.
I think they did. I mean they always tested that
stuff out. They always did that was that was always
the thing. And you know they used the guys that
did stings repelling, you know from the ceiling for WCW.
They always tested that crap out. But whatever it was,
it just did not unclip.
Speaker 1 (09:18):
Oh makes my stomach sick. It was just so sad
to see his body lifeless in the ring, and then
they showed the boys just trying to get through the night.
My god. You know, you would think he would have
a little more remorse for somebody who died under his watch.
(09:41):
And that's all I'm going to say about that.
Speaker 2 (09:43):
Jerry Lawler. Jerry Lawler coming back to the announced booth
white as a ghost and then as it looks, it
does not look good. Yeah, I mean that is just
a clip that lives in infamy.
Speaker 1 (09:57):
All Right, we will go to episode five. Do you
have anything else to say?
Speaker 2 (10:02):
What else can you say?
Speaker 1 (10:04):
Okay, let's let's go to episode five. Episode five was
about his family. You get Paul Hayman talking about Vince's childhood. Again,
he does allude to the fact that he might have
been abused by his mother.
Speaker 2 (10:24):
Yeah, that's that's been said before.
Speaker 1 (10:26):
Many different ways, not just physical, right, which again makes
you think if he's suffering sexual abuse, you know, just
regular abuse by by beatings or whatever, if he didn't
(10:47):
get any counseling or any help, or is this why
he's treating women the way he is portraying them on TV?
You know, I just I'm not justifying it again, but
is this why his brain works the way he does?
You know what I mean, There's there's a there's a
root cause to this. There's a problem there. And again
(11:13):
I never knew of the upbringing that he had. But
to allude that your mother might have done despicable things
to you, that is that's heavy to have to carry.
That's a heavy load to carry.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
Yeah, that's that story has been out there for a
while too, that there's that that kind of abuse was
possibly happening, and does that answers a lot of questions.
If that's the case, that could be a lot of
what's going on.
Speaker 1 (11:43):
Well, here here we go. They talk about Triple H
and Stephanie getting together, and she says she doesn't want
to mention the one storyline that her dad brings up
to her that she said no. But then we go
to Vince and Vince goes, oh, is that the one
that I said I impregnated at my daughter? And I'm like,
(12:04):
oh my god, Like is it again? Is this where
it's stemming from sexual abuse as a child? And then
you think this is an appropriate thing to put on television? Gross?
Katie Vicangle, Gross, Like what do they think? What are
they thinking? At least Stephanie had enough sense to put
(12:25):
her foot down and say, no, Dad, that's pretty inappropriate,
Like I'm not doing that, you know what I mean?
That's disgusting.
Speaker 2 (12:33):
I can't they showed, I believe was it the one
clip of Stephanie the long shot where they pick up
her hanging over the desk, you know, and it's like
the shot coming up of her from behind or something,
and she's showing how they sexualized her over the years,
you know, and.
Speaker 1 (12:50):
She yeah, they might have. I don't remember that one.
They showed a lot of like Trish Stratus because she
was interviewed. They showed the bar looking like a dog.
Segment Stacy Keebler with her legs open and Vince's head
between when she gets hired for the job. She's sitting
on the desk and her legs are here and Vince's
(13:12):
lake between her, Vince making out with Sable, Vince making
out with Candice, Michelle, Vince making out with everybody, Sable, Sable.
Speaker 2 (13:26):
What do you think about Sable being brought up because
there was an allusion to uh, I guess maybe that's
we will hold off. We'll come back to see hold on. Yeah, yeah,
we'll come back to see.
Speaker 1 (13:37):
The first thing they're they're so they're covering is Shane
and excuse me, you're covering Stephanie and Triple H. And
they they go to mention that Shane McMahon is against
him being with her, which I found interesting. Shane did
not want Triple H dating his sister. Vince was pushing
for it. So I don't know if Shane had a
(13:59):
disliking to Triple H back in the day or if
he just didn't want the boys tarnishing his sister kind
of thing. But they talked about that a little bit.
They talked about how Vince was the cheerleader for Triple H.
They talked about Linda, and Linda not liking performing. She
(14:21):
said she was the worst out of the four. She
didn't want to be on camera, but Vince thought it
was important. Even though she wasn't the best at acting,
she was part of the family and it was important
to have her, you know, in the storyline. And they
showed when they apparently true strategy drugged Linda and she
(14:42):
was pushing around in the wheelchair and then them making
out in front of Linda, and you know, Linda's saying, well,
you know, it's part of the story. It's heat blah
blah blah, and everybody was okay with it, so let's
roll with it. And it's just like, okay, now, let
me just.
Speaker 2 (14:59):
Go the bark like a dog segment with Trish, Right, yeah, okay.
In thinking about it in the vein of a television
show are And I'm not trying to condone this and
saying this is a practice that if we would take
the real Trish Stratus person and say this is what
(15:20):
you have to do to keep your job. It was
being used in the form of television, right, did they
Did they mention how in the end Vince got his
comeupp ins and was made the fool in the storyline.
I don't think they did. No, they just brought up
that he made her bark like a dog and wolf
(15:41):
wolf Wolf, Vince was made to look like the asshole
at the end of it.
Speaker 1 (15:46):
They I do remember Trish saying it was it's a
form of heat and you're supposed to not and I
agree with her. You know, Vince being a heel and
putting Trish in that position, he got a lot of
heat for it. Yeah, as a woman, I can see
it in the sense of it is a TV show
(16:09):
and it's fine with Like I thought it was heat
too degrading to women. Yeah, but it's a it's again,
it's a TV show.
Speaker 2 (16:18):
Right, But we watch movies where they do things. I'm sorry,
we watched movies where they can do the same thing.
Speaker 1 (16:24):
I know, Like you've said it wasn't like the Janelle
Grant thing where he's defecating on her head and you know,
telling her to do certain things to certain people and
you know, pe you on command and all this weird stuff. No,
it was a segment for television and it got the
response that they wanted it to get. So are you
(16:45):
a feminist that that is against this stuff? Then, like
they said, turn the TV off, don't watch. It's that simple.
You know, I'm a woman. I didn't take offense to it.
I do think some things are poor taste, but that
really doesn't bother me. You know, it's degrading, yes, but
(17:06):
it you know, it got the reaction that they wanted.
Speaker 2 (17:09):
To right, Yeah, just what I was reading.
Speaker 1 (17:11):
You know, if I was interested position, I would have
did it. That segment I would have did. I would
have done it. You know. Yeah, there's far worse things
that people have done in wrestling that I would draw
the line out. But this, eh, it's he just my opinion,
(17:32):
don't come out me.
Speaker 2 (17:33):
Yeah, it's just like you know, people, he's done so
many bad things. When people use storyline stuff as a
example of the bad things, it's like follow the storyline.
He got made to look like the asshole at the end.
Speaker 1 (17:46):
So it's like he's weird sometimes with his storyline. So
you gotta admit, like it's part of this a fantasy
that he has in his head. He's literally making out
with the hottest girls in the company right over and
over again. He's booking this. Do you blame him? You know?
(18:12):
I mean he's got that power. You either make out
with mister McMahon or you're out the door. Kind of ill.
Speaker 2 (18:20):
And his talent relations guy is finding some of the
talent too, I mean.
Speaker 1 (18:26):
You know, what can I say? But they talk about
the family. They show old photos and video about Linda
and Vince getting married, which was nice to see. They
talk about the feud that the family had that you know,
picking side. Stephanie picked her dad's side while Shane went
(18:48):
with the mom. Then they get into Sable. This is
where they get into Sable and Vince goes to say
that he doesn't remember much about the lawsuit. Do you
believe it because I.
Speaker 2 (19:05):
Remember you remember to read a Chatterton and that it
was consensual from nineteen eighty five.
Speaker 1 (19:09):
But he doesn't remember about Sable, which.
Speaker 2 (19:12):
I could it be because of Sable's husband.
Speaker 1 (19:17):
Well, they alluded to, like could this be a real
affair or was it just a storyline? And there's a
I'm like, what, I've never heard of them having an affair,
have you. That's a yes.
Speaker 2 (19:32):
I mean things that are circulated.
Speaker 1 (19:36):
Okay, I've never read anything. I've never heard anything. Again,
I must be the naive one between the two of us,
because I don't hear anything. You're the one who gives
me all my gossip. So if you heard.
Speaker 2 (19:48):
Something, Chadster, here's a lot of things he doesn't say allegedly.
Speaker 1 (19:52):
See, this is the partnership that should not be because
if you do not share with your.
Speaker 2 (19:57):
Oh man, as there stuff I can't say. I was
born to secrecy till the end. You could never.
Speaker 1 (20:06):
Tell me that on the internet.
Speaker 2 (20:10):
No no, no, no, no no no no. You know
I have friends I don't and they've told me stuff
I have will never I can't share ever ever ever.
Speaker 1 (20:20):
All right, Well, Vince doesn't remember about the lawsuit, and
he looked a little, uh pissed off while he was
talking about it, and it was weird, so to speak.
So I don't know what he was alluding to. But
I've always heard that Vince was in love with sable
(20:42):
on a sheet, So take that for what you will. Uh.
They showed the Stock Exchange, New York Stock Exchange. Uh.
They talked about the downfall of w c W, talked
about Vince buying w c W the XFL, which was
a disaster. I didn't know how much of a disaster
(21:06):
it was. I knew, but I didn't know about the
time frame and you know how how it went down
seventy five percent since the first episode and all of
that stuff they had stats and him being interviewed about
it and looking extremely uncomfortable in the interview because the
guy was just rolling on him one thing after another.
Speaker 2 (21:28):
Do you remember you don't remember all that rollout of
the XFL. No, Because it was around the time of
ECW going out of business.
Speaker 1 (21:34):
I didn't really pay attention to the XFL. I knew
it was a football league, you know, when football wasn't
around that this came up, but I didn't know like
what it was actually or who was involved. I just
knew it was Vince's thing.
Speaker 2 (21:50):
Oh man, Yeah, So I recorded. I still have it
on tape. I transferred to DVD the first pregame show
and the first broadcasted game that they had on Network TV.
They have JR. And Jerry Lawler doing play by play
of one of the games. They have The Rock doing
the intro to the kickoff. Right, they have Jesse Ventura
(22:14):
as a color commentator on one of the other games. Right,
it is a WWF at the time show on Turf.
It's like, yeah, it's so bad. If you're a football fan,
you're trying to watch it. It's so But JR called
football legit, so it's like he's he knows what he's doing.
But it's just it's so. It's like the B team.
It's like watching like high school kids play professional football.
Speaker 1 (22:38):
They were showing clips and every clip was somebody missing
a ball.
Speaker 2 (22:43):
Oh so bad, throwing a ball.
Speaker 1 (22:45):
Bouncing off third head, trying to catch it, they missed
the play. Like they were basically saying everybody sucked in
the league.
Speaker 2 (22:53):
Yeah, it was.
Speaker 1 (22:54):
It was for football players who could not make it anywhere, right.
Speaker 2 (22:57):
Right, it was amateurs. I saw I was. I loved
it because Opie and Anthony did the pregame show from New York,
so I recorded it because it was like getting another
Opian Anthony show. But even they talked about how shitty
it was Okay, it's it's great. It's such a time
capsule if you look back at it.
Speaker 1 (23:14):
Yeah. So they they showed that, which again I didn't
know anything about it, and Bob Costas is just saying
that he was great.
Speaker 2 (23:24):
He was great.
Speaker 1 (23:26):
It was pretty funny to see him. Oh. They they
talked a little bit about them losing the w w
f UH the rights to use the initials to UH
the World Wildlife Fund and what else did oh talked
(23:46):
about John Cena? How John Cena's character wasn't really going
anywhere and he was on the version getting fired. But
then he was on a bus one day going to
a show and there were a bunch of guys in
the back of the bus and the rappin' and John's like, well,
I'm going to go on the back of the bus
(24:06):
and he starts freestyle and rapping. Little did he know
Stephanie McMahon was on the bus and stuff, and he
says to him, do you want to do that on television?
And John's like, hell, yeah, I want to do that
on television. And that saved his career because he was
on the chopping block. Yeah, that was an interesting tidbit.
Speaker 2 (24:24):
He was horribly lame before that, his character was so bland,
but well, he was prototypeing in Ov Dubb but when
they brought him up, he was just generic John Cena
with your local sports team's colors. Whenever he went to
you know, if he was in Philly he had the
green and white tights, and he was in New York
he had orange and blue tights. He was so generic
(24:48):
as just John Cena. It was awful. So yeah, that
was quite the transition.
Speaker 1 (24:54):
Right, And then they talk about Vince declining to buy
the UFC at the time, which he totally should have
bought it, but you know whatever, he didn't think it
was a big deal. And then the final thing about
this episode is Shane leaving w w E. They did
(25:14):
show a promo about Janelle Grant's lawsuit at the end
of this episode. So again, Shane McMahon, my favorite McMahon
always was, always is always will be. I should have
wore my darn it, I should have wore my Shane
McMahon jersey that I have from one.
Speaker 2 (25:33):
You have a Shane O mac jersey. I do.
Speaker 1 (25:36):
My husband bought it for me.
Speaker 2 (25:38):
Oh wow, look at you, Shane O mack.
Speaker 1 (25:40):
You I think it's I think it's the one from
one of the pay per views. I think there's like money,
here comes the money, or something's.
Speaker 2 (25:49):
On the back of it.
Speaker 1 (25:50):
But it's the cool one that buttons down the front
like a hockey jersey, but it buttons the baseball jersey.
I guess it is.
Speaker 2 (25:56):
Are we going to do the breaking news when he
debuts on AW or what?
Speaker 1 (26:00):
And is that I've been waiting with it.
Speaker 2 (26:02):
Coming, It's coming. It's definitely coming very soon.
Speaker 1 (26:05):
Well I can't wait for it to come because I'm like, wait,
I'm chomping at the bit to see him there. The
last episode was titled The Finish and it basically covers
the last ten years and Vince leaving. The first thing
(26:26):
that they show or clips from WrestleMania twenty three, and
they showed Donald Trump. They show a lot of Donald Trump,
And let me tell you something, whether you like him
or not, he was pretty damn good in the world
of professional wrestling. He was much deserving of his Hall
of Fame spot. Don't you think that.
Speaker 2 (26:47):
Was a great angle. We've got a lot of eyeballs.
Him and Vince had a great chemistry. He threw a
mean slap to Vince Yeah, and can't take a stunner.
Speaker 1 (26:56):
But no, but he got to shave his head, which
was cool.
Speaker 2 (27:00):
He got shave Vince's head. But he every time he
and he Hey bought Monday Night Raw later on, he
was he was always good. Did they show the clip
of him and the Boogeyman?
Speaker 1 (27:13):
I don't think so they showed they They showed a
lot of like the bald It was, yeah, like Vince was.
Vince was in front of a picture of Donald Trump
balled and then Trump was in front of a picture
of Vince ball Ye the face off, and then they
actually showed a little bit of the match, and then
they showed him shaven.
Speaker 2 (27:32):
Right, there's a there's a segment that maybe it's a
wrestlemate before perhaps, but there's a segment that Donald Trump
does with the Boogeyman, you know, when a Boogeyman does
like the creepy pop up from somewhere. Yeah, the comedic
timing is out of this world because Trump does like
one of those like looks at him. You know, Boogeyman
(27:54):
has to like scurry away because he does like you know,
it's just I'll send.
Speaker 1 (27:58):
It to you.
Speaker 2 (27:59):
It's very funny.
Speaker 1 (28:00):
Okay, all right, so after they show this, they show
the storyline about Vince wanting to die and when he
gets in the limo and they blow the limo up right,
and then it's like okay. They show like a visual
and a candlelight thing with Vince's picture and deceased two
(28:22):
thousand and seven or whatever it said on it. But
then that had the halt because Benoir, the stuff with
Chris Benoa happens, and at first they do a tribute
show because they didn't know the details of what happened.
But then as the story breaks, turns out we all
(28:44):
know the tragedy, you know, Vin, excuse me, Chris, Nancy
and their son died, and the story is told that
it was Chris taking everybody's life and then taking his own,
which is horrible, absolutely horrible. So you know, Vince didn't
(29:06):
want to go that route with you know, killing himself,
so they had to backtrack do something different.
Speaker 2 (29:15):
I was at the show where they played the Vince
graphic uh following the explosion, and it was such poor taste.
While the the it was all unfolding, it was I mean,
everybody hated it at the time. Nobody liked the storyline.
Nobody liked the angle. The biggest thing to come out
(29:37):
of it was that Paul London got a ton of
heat for smiling during the somber Yeah, the very somber
walk Vince had to the limo and Paul London big
grin on his face. But I remember it just like
people were booing the you know, the graphic when it
popped up. It just it was such a stupid angle
at the time, Yeah, made no because you know he
(29:57):
was going to come back, you know, like it was.
Speaker 4 (30:00):
It was.
Speaker 2 (30:00):
It was one of those things where were starting to
get like ridiculous what they were doing with mister McMahon,
because it's like, what else could you do with him?
He's already like lost a company ten million times, He's
fought every babyface as the evil owner of the company.
Now he's dead, and now he didn't come back. So
it's like when all the Benwa stuff happened on the Monday,
You're like, oh my god, well they got to scrap that.
Speaker 1 (30:22):
Yeah, exactly. And he goes on to say like how
people were calling to make sure he was alive, Like
Donald Trump called and said, is Vince okay? Are you okay?
And like some of the boys were like, did Vince die?
Is he okay? And it's like, dude, if you don't know,
that's work okay with Trump. But everybody else like, do
you think they would show his demise on television?
Speaker 2 (30:44):
Yeah, I mean it's.
Speaker 1 (30:45):
You know, it's corny, it's hokey.
Speaker 2 (30:48):
Right, and that's the kind of stuff like I just
shake my head when I hear this.
Speaker 1 (30:52):
I hear you. Well, they had Brian Gertchwitz, Brett, Steve,
everybody was sharing thoughts about, you know, Chris ben wom
what happened and this gets into this was really interesting interesting.
Chris Newinsky comes on, and you know, he's been an
(31:13):
advocate for CTE for like the longest time and has
been doing research for years, and he was one of
the first people that said that Ben Wall had CTE.
And this shocked me. When Steve Austin said he doesn't
believe in it, Yeah, I was shocked to hear that
because I think it's a real thing. Undertaker was saying
(31:36):
he was mad that you know, he's old school. He's
mad that the chair shots to the head were taken away,
but he does understand why because of you know, it
affecting people's brains and you take one too many chair shots.
That's not good so for but for Steve Austin to
(31:57):
say he doesn't believe in it that, I just was left.
I'm founded with that one.
Speaker 2 (32:02):
I was a shocker.
Speaker 1 (32:04):
Yeah, I thought that was kind of a weird. I mean,
you believe what you want to believe, but I don't know.
Speaker 2 (32:09):
And they show the clip. They show the Owen pile
driver that analyzed him broke his neck and uh, you
know when he said, oh, I was dumped on my
head once and that was you know, they showed the clip.
I would shudder to think that Steve Austin has had
many a concussion over his career, and you know, maybe
he's lucky enough to not suffer some of the effects
(32:31):
that some of the other guys do. Unfortunately, but it's
kind of well documented. Especially let's take wrestling out of
the equation. Okay, wam, it's gone. The NFL players that
are suffering now and who have passed away and have
documented CET A brain scan it is. I was shocked
(32:55):
by his comments that he was not believing in CT
and man effacts. Very surprised.
Speaker 1 (33:01):
Yeah, me too. I just was like, oh, come on,
like I usually agree with Steve on a lot of things,
but this one, I was just like bro wrong. CT
is a real thing. I remember. I remember before Shannon
pissed away Daphne, she told me, she said, I told
my father, I'm donating my brain. Yeah, she swore she
(33:23):
had CT. She swore she had it. I am not
sure if they ever went through with it, but I
remember her telling me over and over again, I have CT.
I know I have CT, and I'm just like sad.
Speaker 2 (33:39):
It's incredibly sad. I spoke with the guy who played
in the NFL last week and he was telling me,
you know, I asked, how do you feel? And he said, well,
outside of how many times I was hitting the head
during my career, I feel great. And he noticeably, and
I've worked with this guy in about two years, he
was noticeably slower in every respect that I had for
(34:02):
a question just in general, how are you or is
this date okay?
Speaker 1 (34:08):
And uh?
Speaker 2 (34:08):
And working with him two years ago, maybe even a
year and a half just and his response was, outside
of all the hits I took thirty years ago, I'm fine.
So that doesn't tell you that there's there's long term effects.
Super shocked by stone cold Steve.
Speaker 1 (34:24):
Austin, Yeah, that's pretty sad. Phil much Nick was in
this a lot. You don't like him?
Speaker 2 (34:32):
Eight his guns wrote, I wrote my senior my my
senior year in high school, like dissertation on how much
I disliked Phil much Nick.
Speaker 1 (34:40):
Okay, Well, in watching him on this doc, I I
kind of admire him for taking the initiative to tell
it like it is and to pull no punches as
a reporter. He just talks about the quality of life
changes he's seen in wrestlers over the years. And you
(35:01):
know it's true. The older we get, we're decaying faster
than the normal human being. It's trauma. But I don't
care how many people say, well, you go to wrestling school,
you learn how to take a bump. I don't care
if you learn how to take a bump. Taking a
bump is not normal. It is trauma on your body.
(35:26):
You just fall one time in regular life, and you
can screw up your whole skeletal system with one fall. Okay,
imagine doing it for a living and bumping night after
night after night after night. Some night you might fall
flat on your back. Some night you might hit your head.
Sometimes you might land on your shoulder, or your hip wrong,
(35:48):
or your tailbone. Your body will never be the same again.
Speaker 2 (35:54):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (35:55):
So compared to like a normal person, we're aging quicker
and our bodies are rapidly destroying themselves. It's just inevitable.
I'm never gonna get better. My neck is never gonna
get better. My back is never going to get better.
And I didn't do half the stuff that the pro
(36:17):
wrestlers who wrestled every single lean and took multiple bumps in.
I took maybe two three bumps a night for seven
years in a row, which is bad. You know, that's
not good. But when you're doing a match and bumping
twenty thirty times a night, that takes another level of
(36:38):
a toll on your body. Right, So you know, I
agree with Phil. Your way of life is not going
to be good when you're sixty, seventy eighty years old.
It's just it's proven. Look at most of these guys walking,
they can't even walk.
Speaker 2 (36:59):
Yeah, that's that's very true. Absolutely, Is that fair to say?
Speaker 1 (37:02):
I think that's a.
Speaker 2 (37:03):
Fairy fair fair to say. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (37:05):
So, you know, Phil Phill's on the money, and you
can't argue that fact. And I think every you know,
some wrestlers are luckier than others, but some are mostly
dependent on pain pills, which is sad, you know, because
that's when you see them. They're they're falling asleep at
their tables when they're supposed to sign and stuff, and
(37:28):
it's like, you know, people pin them. Oh you're a
drug addict, right, Well, why did I start to take
these drugs? Because my body is killing me and I
can't cope with the pain exactly, So how are you
supposed to live? You think a tile on all is
going to do it? No, it's not so if you
(37:48):
you don't walk these guys' shoes, you can't answer that question.
So you hear from Phil who you hate.
Speaker 2 (37:56):
Uh.
Speaker 1 (37:57):
Then we talk about the Undertaker and he talks belt
his his winning streak, ending that he didn't know I know,
they make it a thing.
Speaker 2 (38:07):
They didn't need to be on their like this is
where it was stupid, you know, and all those things
they threw in.
Speaker 1 (38:12):
Yeah, no, it wasn't stupid because he had a concussion.
Speaker 2 (38:17):
Okay, you know that all right? That part, yes, it
ties in.
Speaker 1 (38:19):
He had a concussion and he still went I think
he said like twenty twenty five minutes afterwards, and he
doesn't remember any of it.
Speaker 2 (38:27):
Okay, yeah, that parts the concussion.
Speaker 1 (38:30):
But then Vince says, well, he was traumatized by losing
the belt, that's why he didn't remember, Not because he
had a concussion. Vince tried to say he was so
upset because he had to drop the strap, that's why
he didn't remember the match, but Taker saying, no, I
hit my head. I had a concussion, and that's why
(38:52):
I don't remember any of the match. So they're talking
about CTE concussions. So yeah, it did happen.
Speaker 2 (38:59):
Okay, well I'm confused with another part.
Speaker 1 (39:01):
Then okay, but you know hearing Vince saying he was
too traumatized to remember, too traumatized by the loot, the
winning street coming to an end by losing. Are you
serious You can't admit that the guy had a concussion?
Does he think Taker was lying to him? Wasn't there
(39:21):
medical in the back telling him, yeah, you're concussed, you
have a concussion.
Speaker 2 (39:26):
If anybody was as loyal as Soldier to him, it
would be him. So the Undertaker, I think you listen
to what he was saying.
Speaker 1 (39:32):
For sure. God. So then they they say how they
have to go to PG programming. Now they talk about
the Women's Revolution for like a minute, and then they
showcase Shane McMahon coming back to WWE after several years
of being away and he gets to work with the
Undertaker at WrestleMania thirty two. Then Taker says he would
(39:57):
take a bullet for Vince, and it is very clear
that this was filmed. They keep saying this was filmed
before the Janelle Grand incident. So it's like, okay, you
would take a bullet for him? Would you take a
bullet for him? Now? Is anybody's opinion different now than
it was when you sat down and did this interview?
Speaker 2 (40:16):
I mean I listened to a lot of clips that
are out there from Undertaker's podcast, and I don't hear
him speak any differently.
Speaker 1 (40:24):
So he okay, so he's remaining a loyal soldier. But
there how about everybody else?
Speaker 2 (40:30):
You know, I'd venture to think that. I mean John Cena,
you know, in the very.
Speaker 1 (40:35):
Business, John Cena's back kind of you know, doing his
retirement thing.
Speaker 2 (40:41):
So you've seen it publicly said, you know, he felt
for Vince McMahon and what he was going through, and
that you know, he's he's there for his friends when
they need him and blah blah blah blah blah.
Speaker 1 (40:52):
So why would he say any different? Like I just said,
he's back with the company doing his whole retirement thing.
He's still when do you think that's with me? And
the first thing you think of is WWE. Even though
he's not physically a part of that you know company anymore,
he's still going to be a name associated to them.
(41:14):
So I don't think anybody that is involved with WWE
is going to talk about him negatively. I think fear
wise or anybody who thinks they can get a Legends deal,
or who think they can get something from the company,
you know what I mean. I think the people who
are vocal just don't give a shit and are telling
(41:38):
it like it is because they don't care. They have
nothing to lose. There's no dog in the game, right.
If you have something to gain from it, then you
have to watch your p's and q's because you still
have a big man there kind of sort of through
Triple H. You know, Stephanie pop Up. Is she going
(42:01):
to come back at some point? We don't know. No
one knows. So I feel like if you work for
that company, you have to dance around the subject and
that's why not a lot of people are going to
talk about it. But it's just funny because all of
these you know, these interviews were done before the news
(42:24):
came out, so you have to keep that in mind.
Vince was asked if he would retire, he said no.
Everybody else said they'd never see Vince retiring. What does
it go to him retiring in twenty twenty two only
to come back in twenty twenty three. And then they
(42:46):
interviewed Bruce Pritchard and he feels like they look back
on the whole doc and Bruce says, this is it's
a hip piece, just to make Vince look bad. And
then he goes into what Vince did for his wife
when his wife was sick, And I get that. I
(43:10):
get that Vince was good to him. I understand it.
He has a different relationship with Vince than a lot
of people do, so I can understand the loyalty. But
there's got to be part of you, even if you
don't want to say it publicly. There's got to be
a part that says this behavior is not right. But
(43:30):
can he say that publicly? Again, No, he cannot, even
though he might think it. He can't say it. I mean,
don't you even think McMahon questions what he did? You know,
do people who commit crimes show remorse afterwards and realize
(43:51):
what I did was wrong? Some do and some do.
Do you think Vince McMahon has a conscience. Do you
think the power or hungary maniac who ran that company
has a remorse about how he treated some of the employees,
some of the boys, some of the staff. I don't know.
(44:13):
I don't know. I don't know that person, but I
get where Pritchard's coming from because he has that different relationship.
So after they talked to Bruce, they say two days
after that the interview was filmed, all the details of
Janelle Grant's lawsuit become public, and then they talk about
(44:36):
Vincent's legacy in the business. This was again in twenty
twenty one and twenty twenty two, So you would come
to think what they answer different now? Is his legacy
tarnished because of everything that popped up, all that we know? Now?
Does that take away from what he did for the business.
(44:58):
My answer is no, it doesn't. I separate the two.
I can, just like with ben Law, I see a
brilliant performer in Chris and Law. Few could do it
better than him in the ring. As a person, it
was terrible what he did. And again, was it a
(45:21):
sickness due to CTE Will never know. We'll never know,
But poor Nancy and poor Daniel. My heart breaks for
those two. You know, it's like, just do it to yourself.
Don't hurt anybody else. You want to be gone, Just
just do it to yourself. You know they're innocent, innocent
(45:43):
little boy. But I can separate that and look at
his performance. Doesn't mean I have to like the person.
And this is the same with Vince McMahon. Vince McMahon
was a brilliant booker, a brilliant businessman. You know. He
came from dirt, poor nothing and made a multi billion
(46:05):
dollar company and carried it on his back. His character
was one of the best heels I've ever seen in
my life, and I loved to hate him. But as
a person, the more I find out, the more sick
(46:25):
I become. But I separate the two right, because that's
the only way you can. It doesn't because he's a
shitty person doesn't make his performance shitty. No, he was
brilliant before we found out he did all this stuff.
Why would you take the brilliant away from him? You can't.
(46:47):
You can't take away talent like that. So for me,
like I separate the two. But then you know, they
the episode just goes into Vince being on to investigation.
It talks about brock Lesnar being involved and that Janelle
Grant's lawsuit is on hold while federal investigation is still ongoing,
(47:09):
and that's how it ended. So I would have loved
for them to incorporate her. I get why she wasn't
on it. I understand all that, you know, she can't
talk about it or whatever, but I would have loved
more like maybe another part and they covered the lawsuit
and they covered what was in the paperwork, and you know,
(47:33):
because that stuff was just wow. I read her and
it was like wausers, you know what I mean. Interesting.
But overall for me not wanting to watch it, I
will say I did enjoy it. I did. I'm glad
I watched it. I was happy I watched it. For
(47:53):
all those who keep saying I'm not going to watch
it because it's things I already know, there might be
things you don't know or quote notes that you weren't
privy to prior, so I would definitely recommend it if
you're a wrestling fan, if you're a WWE fan, if
you're a Vincementman fan. I am happy I watched it.
I will admit the only reason why I did watch
(48:14):
it is to do this this podcast and do a
recap because everybody was asking me. But I'm glad I did.
And it was entertaining, and again, parts were endearing and
parts were I want to punch you in the face,
you know.
Speaker 2 (48:32):
So I love seeing the footage. I loved that backstage
footage that they showed that you I'd never seen before.
To me, I'm right where you are. It doesn't separate,
or it doesn't change. I separate the two, you know.
When I want to watch any kind of wrestling, I
(48:52):
put on old school, I put on stuff that I like.
I you know, it's still new to me, even though
I might have seen it a hundred million times. I
love it, and most of the time it's got Vince
McMahon's signature on it. So I can't do anything about that.
I can't change that. He created the world that made
me interested in the wrestling business. It made me Vince
(49:13):
McMahon's world made me interested in wrestling. Vince McMahon and
his world made me discover ECW and then WCW and
the nWo and everything else, and even every character I've
ever seen on TV is because I started watching what
he created. I can't separate that. I can't separate that,
(49:34):
and I can like what he did and not like
what he's done in his personal life, so I can separate.
He's not a great person, but he's the PT Barnum
of the pro wrestling world.
Speaker 4 (49:46):
Absolutely, yeah, And I think, you know, you need to
look at it with an open mind, because if you don't,
it's like you're never you don't meet your heroes kind
of thing.
Speaker 1 (49:58):
You're never gonna be able to separated, and then you
can't enjoy things anymore. You know, half of Hollywood are
dirt bags. Right. If I knew the legacy and the
person behind every motion picture, I wouldn't want to watch it.
You know, we talked about Ditty and all the stuff
(50:18):
that's going on with him, and you know, am I
not gonna listen to so and So's music because they
were at a ditty party. No, I'm still gonna listen
to whoever I like, but as a person, you know, sketchy, right,
same with Hollywood. You know, like there's certain people in
Hollywood that were on that list. Does that make them
(50:40):
a bad actor? Hell no, But as a person, whatever
they're doing, it makes me question their integrity. But it
still doesn't mean that, you know, they're all of a
sudden they're a shitty actor. Ah, they're still a good actor.
It's just that they're a shitty person. But I learned
(51:00):
how to separate the two a long time ago. Yeah,
so I don't know. Again, just my two cents. You
don't have to take my word as gold. You decide
what you want to decide to do. But overall, out
of five stars, i'd give this doc a solid four
(51:20):
because I did enjoy it. I just feel like they
could have included a little more, a little more with
Today's case I would have liked to see, but otherwise
interesting stuff.
Speaker 2 (51:36):
I didn't watch the whole thing, so inconclusive for me,
But what I saw I enjoyed, and everything that was
on there. You know, I've already heard before, so it's
just a elaborate retelling.
Speaker 1 (51:47):
It's okay, But.
Speaker 2 (51:49):
Liked what I saw, A good production value. You know.
And for those somebody said to me, I can't remember
if it was my brother. If you read me a
quote from somebody said, you gotta remember remember everybody who's
watching Netflix is about two percent of the actual wrestling fans.
So these are people discovering this for the first time.
Speaker 1 (52:07):
Interesting, Well, then they're really going to enjoy it because
they don't know anything. So there you go. So there's
our review. Do you agree with me? Do you disagree
with me? Let me know in the comments. If you
haven't followed me on iHeart, please look up eyes up
here with Francine and give us a follow. It's free.
(52:27):
If you're listening on Spotify, Apple, wherever you get your podcasts,
go ahead and subscribe on there. If you're not on
our YouTube channel, I don't know why you're not there,
but please go over to YouTube and ACWDVA, Franci and
exclamation Point and subscribe. It's also free, and if you
want to be a channel member, it's only five ninety
(52:49):
nine a month. You get exclusive videos, emojis and all
kinds of cool stuff, So go over there and subscribe
as well.
Speaker 2 (52:59):
Absolutely, yeah, but.
Speaker 1 (53:02):
You have anything to plug. I have a couple of
things really quickly if I.
Speaker 2 (53:06):
Could, Yeah, you know, just chatty and be young x
Oka Instagram. I be exclusives. Wrestle Caid coming up at
Thanksgiving weekend, I be exclusives. We'll present Kevin Thor in
the Big Vampire. Working on some cool stuff, some cool
photo ops possibly some Mordecai props coming, so working on that.
(53:30):
I'll have more on my social media in the coming weeks.
Speaker 1 (53:33):
All right, November is a very busy month for the Queen.
I have Rhode Island Comic Con November one, second and third.
I'll be signing along with the Dudley Boys, and I
think Ginger Mahaal will be with us as well. I think,
so come on out if you're in the Rhode Island area,
please come and see me. And then on November ninth,
(53:58):
I will be at the Big Event in uh where's
that at Long Island?
Speaker 2 (54:04):
Big Event Long Island, yep.
Speaker 1 (54:05):
Okay, Suffolk Suffolk Credit Union Arena in Brentwood, New York.
For more information, you could go to the Big Event
New York dot com and get your tickets there. And
that's on November ninth again, I think it's from like
ten to three or something. And then the Big One Wrestlcaide.
(54:28):
This is November twenty ninth to December first. I'll be
there that Friday and Saturday in Winston Salem, North Carolina,
Shane Douglas and I'll be kissing babies, signing anything you
bring us, and drinking cocktails. So come on out and
see us then, and across the born old social media
you can find me at ecw D Verfreed Scene. I
(54:51):
hope you're staying safe. I hope you were staying healthy,
and most of all, I hope you're staying extreme. Yeah.
(55:11):
H Francine Francis Francis, Queen Extreme Extreme, ties up here,
head head, The Queen Extreme.
Speaker 2 (55:22):
Podcast ties up here.
Speaker 1 (55:25):
Hey head, it's the Queen Extreme Podcast. It's the Queen
of Extreme.
Speaker 2 (55:30):
Bruni.
Speaker 1 (55:31):
In the letter she is the Woman of the dreams
lettond on the scene Francis
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