Miracle on Ice with Jim Craig | 1980 Winter Olympics: Soviet Union vs. United States - Games with Names

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
You know, we're out celebrating. We're in blue Crush the
lore sweatsuits, and so Herber says, tomorrow morn is six
thirty am mid us in the hotel because the President
of the United States and the First Lady had invited
use of the White House. We got on this bus,
and this bus takes us to this little teeny airport
and there's an airplane wait for us. But it's no
Ardy airplane, it's Air Force one.

Speaker 2 (00:17):
How was that? Welcome to Games with Names. I'm Julian Edelman,
they're Jack and Kyler, and we are on a mission
to find the greatest game of all time. And on
today's episode, boy do we have a crazy one. We
are covering Miracle on Ice with the nineteen eighty national
team goalie and gold medal winner Jim Craig. We get

(00:43):
off to talk in one of the greatest upsets in sports.

Speaker 1 (00:46):
History, we executed the game plan flawlessly.

Speaker 2 (00:48):
And then we also get into what the movie got right.

Speaker 3 (00:51):
Wait, so the movie speech is actually fairly.

Speaker 1 (00:53):
Close, very close.

Speaker 2 (00:54):
Yes, again, what Herb Brooks is really like?

Speaker 1 (00:59):
If they don't like me, maybe they'll like each other.

Speaker 2 (01:02):
When Belichick wasn't there We're like this guy.

Speaker 1 (01:04):
Put money in the bank, and we relive.

Speaker 2 (01:06):
Some of the most iconic announcer calls in sports history.
Those are fun and we do an impression of them.

Speaker 4 (01:14):
The great band on the field. We gotta stick around,
You gotta stick around, a wild one. Let's go, Let's go.

Speaker 2 (01:19):
Games with Names is a production of iHeartRadio, February twenty second,
nineteen eighty Olympic Center, Lake Placid, New York.

Speaker 1 (01:32):
If we play the Russians ten times, they might beat
us nine, but not this time.

Speaker 2 (01:36):
Not tonight, boys, Tonight, we are the greatest hockey team
in the world. Do you believe in miracles? Yes, this
is a miracle on ice.

Speaker 1 (01:50):
Hell yeah, it was fun.

Speaker 2 (01:55):
Welcome to Games with Names today. We are looking at
miracle on the Soviet Union versus Team USA in the
nineteen eighty Winter Olympics with the one and only Jim
Craig now Jim the goalie. In one sentence, why is
this game so important to you?

Speaker 1 (02:16):
It's about believing in your dreams in the American way,
you know, to be able to have a dream and
make it come true and represent something much bigger than yourself.

Speaker 2 (02:25):
Yeah, is this the greatest game of all time.

Speaker 1 (02:28):
One of the things I always tell people, either you're
creating the future, you're living in the past. So you
always hope that there's a better game or a better
athlete or the sport keeps improving, right, And you know,
I always think in an era, you know, So to me,
life has chapters. Yeah, and you know, now I'm in
the Grandfather the chapter of my life. It's like fabulous,

(02:48):
And so I just think there's a chapter in time
during the Cold War? Was this was the greatest sports
moment ever? Now? Will it be? Or what that's for
other people to tell?

Speaker 2 (03:00):
Yeah? Now, now how often do you get asked about
this game every day? Every day? Do you like it?

Speaker 1 (03:06):
Well? It makes people happy, you know, and you're a
vehicle for doing something that is really important. You know,
you want a Super Bowl for the New England Patriots.
I represent a country and won a gold medal. Yeah,
it's a difference.

Speaker 2 (03:20):
There's a difference, especially where you guys are going through.

Speaker 1 (03:24):
Right and so, and during that period of time, I
think it's really special to you know, and I know
you know this, right, there is a difference between being
an underdog and a winning underdog. It's a mindset right.
And what I'm most proud of is our coach and
the players that I was fortunate enough to play with.

(03:44):
We were all winning underdogs, right, We weren't just underdogs
because underdogs have excuses. Winning underdog knows that the challenge
that they be putting up against is really pretty difficult.
Uh maybe it's halftime versus Atlanta for you. Yeah, but
that's the difference between people who know how to win.

(04:05):
And you know, one of my favorite sayings is winners win,
win is win.

Speaker 2 (04:10):
Now, what's the difference between a winning underdog and an underdog?

Speaker 1 (04:14):
Well, you've been in athletics long enough, and whether it's
athletics or sports or life, people have talent, but they
don't use that talent, you know. So being a Boston
fan that you know, you think of Dustin Dura, a
little teeny thing, and and and and when you look
at a guy like him, you say, he did all

(04:35):
this with this talent. Yeah, that's to me, that's the
winning underdog because he just doesn't he or she does
not take no for an answer. It's just it's this
mindset that they have that they're going to do whatever
it takes to win. And when you play sport long enough,
and you know, I think you're twelve fourteen years right. Injuries,

(04:58):
reinvent yourself, you know, you constantly have to figure out
how to stay valuable. And it doesn't matter how it is.
And that's that's the winning underdog. The underdog has an
excuse that I got injured, I'm not quite as fast,
you know, you know all those other things. The winning
underdog just says, no, No, winning is the most important thing,

(05:18):
and I just got to figure out how to do it.

Speaker 2 (05:19):
It's being to adjust.

Speaker 1 (05:21):
Yeah, it's adaptability. It's it's dealing with ego and conflict.
You know. I always say to people, ego is swagger,
conflict is changed. If you manage that, you'll always be relevant.

Speaker 2 (05:34):
I love that ego is swagger is swagger, and conflict
is changed. You got to manage both. Wow, you know, uh,
just looking into this whole matchup, I mean, you guys
are a bunch of average ads. You guys are twenty one.
You know, you're you're going against a team that's played
with each with each other for freaking thirty two years.
And the two things that you've brought up already, a

(05:56):
winning underdog and then ego is what Jackie change. No,
the conflict is changed, egoist wagger conflicts is changed. Yes,
I love that we're back. We're back now, Jim, Can
you explain to me a California kid? I grew up
in the Bay Area. When nineteen ninety four, the Sharks

(06:16):
are playing for the first time in the Cow Palace.
My dad rounded us up. We went in. We didn't
even get into the first period. We got lost because
of parking. Didn't know much about hockey. Go out to
New England and I didn't realize how hockey's in the
blood out there. Yeah, what was hockey for you as
a kid like that was that everything. Can you explain

(06:39):
the love of hockey from someone who's from the northeast.

Speaker 1 (06:43):
Baby, Well, so I'm one of eight, right, and so
hockey was a vehicle from me.

Speaker 2 (06:49):
Vehicle.

Speaker 1 (06:50):
Yeah. It was a place that where I could go
and skin in the ponds and didn't matter how much
money somebody else had or how big they were, because
I was good enough. So there was a bully out there,
you can knock him down, hit when he hit his
head on the ice. It hurt. It was an equalizer,
but it was never ever work. It was just something

(07:11):
that I was drawn to enjoyed.

Speaker 2 (07:15):
You know, I always explain to people that the reason
why I'm I'm so lucky. What you just said it
wasn't work. The reason why I'm so lucky is because
my passion crossed with my talent, so then it never
was work.

Speaker 1 (07:31):
Yeah, and I think he can add to that, Jules.
I think what happens is your passion crosses with the
talent as it's developing, and then there's always people who
tell you you can't do something that either motivates you
or shuts you down. And so to a winning underdog,
it motivates, right, And so you know, to me, it

(07:54):
was always great to be told that I wasn't good enough,
I wasn't big enough, I didn't come from the right area,
because that was fuel, that was something. And then not
having many options to get to where I wanted to go.
Then I never played the sport for the adulation.

Speaker 2 (08:11):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (08:13):
It was always a vehicle for me. You know. It
gave me opportunities that I never would have.

Speaker 2 (08:18):
The intrinsic rewards of proving people wrong. That's something that
I've made a living.

Speaker 1 (08:25):
Oh, and that's why I was so excited about being
here today. I thought there were so many parallels on.
You know, I would go to the Patriots practice and
I would see Bill and I would sit there and
I would I study people I love to watch, and
I would watch you go through your routine. But it
wasn't mundane. It was perfection right, and it was counting

(08:50):
steps and knowing steps. And you know, to me, it
was the you know, the learning that constantly, he constantly happens,
and some people don't put the time in to do that.
And you know, I remember one coach saml me one
day he goes, you know, goalies, just stop the puck,

(09:14):
and I would say, you know, no, a goalie's job
is to know all the strengths and all the weaknesses,
not only of his teammates but the people he plays against,
so that he can make your own skills better.

Speaker 2 (09:26):
Subconsciously. It's like deja vu. If you know the weaknesses
of each guy, then you know, if this guy is
struggling on defense, that there's probably that guy strengths to
do this little crust back and he loves to go
to that upper party.

Speaker 1 (09:39):
And now you go another Hoddle, look at Pradey and
say got him? Come on, let's go, I got I
got him. You know what I mean? You knew you
know what I mean? And you know that that comes
from paying attention to the smallest little details.

Speaker 2 (09:52):
Yeah, the smallest little details fundamentals.

Speaker 1 (09:55):
Yeah, and they change, you know, And how do you
stay relevant? Right? That's really important, you know, as a
speaker that speaks and does leadership with people, you know,
I'm dealing with five different generations from gen Z's the
millennials to you know, all these other ones. And so
how do you take this event and make it valuable?

(10:16):
You know, what pieces of information can you provide that
they can understand? And you know I always tell I
always suggest to people or invite them to think. This
way is I remember I was told my son, I
said that JD, did you talk to mom today? He goes, no,
I don't talk to her. I text. And then my

(10:37):
wife would say, you know, Jimmy, did you talk to
the kids? And I said yeah, and she'd say they
called you and I said, no, honey, I text Tail,
I text JD. And so everybody knows how to communicate,
but only in the way they want to communicate. And
so what happens I think today we really have to
pay attention, and the younger generation has to understand how

(10:59):
the older general communicates. Yeah, and the older generation has
to understand how the young com communicate. And then communication
is a pretty good thing. And in coaching and in
sports and dealing with over your twelve or fourteen years
of doing this thing, you saw coaches not be able
to get away with the things they used to do
because it didn't work. Yeah, and so stand relevant becomes

(11:22):
a really big deal.

Speaker 2 (11:23):
Yeah, you always have to evolve. And going into coaching,
you're talking about coach what you just said, being able
to make something digestible for five different generations and a
simple term. That's what a good coach does. What That's
what I always talk about with Belichick. He can make
all this complex talk and all this all we got

(11:46):
to do this, this, that, But at the end of
the day, he would get us three keys on each
side of the ball that we had to do and
most of the time, if we did those three things,
we would win. A good coach can communicate to all
in a simple form.

Speaker 1 (11:58):
You know what's interesting is I say there is no
loyalty in leadership, and so leadership is about being responsible
for the betterment of the team, not the individuals. And
if you want to be great at doing that, you
can't worry about being liked, right, but you have to
be respected. And so when I think of Belichick as

(12:20):
I know him and I look at her Brooks, it
was really interesting. The thing I think they both had
in common was if they knew the individual they would
deal with, say it was you, Jules was capable of
doing more, they would never let you do less. One
secondly is they would always put you in a position

(12:42):
if you were the tool for the team to be successful.
And at the end they really did care about you.
But they were serving two masters. One was winning and
the other one was developing. And so when I look
at herb he develop up players, and people would say
to me, was he's so hard? That's say, if he

(13:03):
took the time to spend all that with me to
make me better, I was pretty lucky because I always
had different goals. And you know, so I always tell
people you are what your goals are, and as soon
as you lose sight of a goal, then what are
you gonna do? You're gonna live in the past. It's
it's interesting. I remember I came down to a Patriots

(13:25):
practice once and I said, hey, Bill, you know you're
gonna you know, like wide receivers. He goes, I don't
need him. I got grounk, you know what I mean.
So he ranted himself. Then I say to him, you
know than coach. No. The other point was he would
he would say to him, you know, how's your defense

(13:46):
this year? He goes, it doesn't matter. Our office is
so good they won't be on the field, you know
what I mean? You know what I mean. So it
was always a way of winning, right, And you know,
when you think of catching after the ball and you
look at the way you Tom played, it was you
think about the relationship that a Belichick and a Brady
have is they both made each other better. Right. But

(14:12):
remember you got the opportunity because Bill saw something in
Tom and created a whole game plan around his abilities,
which is really kind of interesting. And I remember talking
to him and saying, you know, you know, Wes Welker,
well that's okay, we got air lift, you know what
I mean. And he knew it, you know what I mean.
He he knew that that was going to happen, and

(14:34):
that was going to you know, you know, transition.

Speaker 2 (14:37):
Yeah, Now, tell us more about this relationship with Bill.
How'd you guys become close?

Speaker 1 (14:44):
We're I was in Nantucket doing a charity.

Speaker 2 (14:46):
He's a mayor, mayor of Nantucke.

Speaker 1 (14:49):
The part that was it was interesting is we were
doing this fundraiser for charity on ice with aj mcclesco
and her family were really big and so there was
a charity of where they auctioned off fishing with both
Bill and I and they paid lots of money to
do this. And so I had never met Bill, and
so I when I got on the boat, we were

(15:11):
up fishing together, and he love us the fish. I
love the fish. And I said, hey, Bill, do you
mind getting I got a new profession. I would really
like to pick apart the Patriots, you know, I would
I like to go by player, And so I started
telling them some of my thoughts and then all of
a sudden he kind of really enjoyed it, and then
we became friends from then on.

Speaker 2 (15:31):
Awesome. See how many you used to come to our practices.
I think I remember you spoke. Yeah, I remember you
came and spoke to the team a couple of times.
The thing is we always had like you saw the
working environment. We'd have people there every once in a while,
but we were so focused on I mean, you saw
our practices. We practiced hard. I'm assuming that you guys
practiced pretty hard. Now, what are some of those similarities

(15:55):
that Bill and Herb had.

Speaker 1 (15:57):
Well, there's a saying that I like to use, don't
confus was being busy with being productive, and every one
of ours was really very productive. Right. And so what
Herb Brooks realized from the very get go was he
played in the World Championship. His biggest understanding was the
best players in the world didn't play for the National

(16:19):
Hockey League. They couldn't. There was a Cold War, so
the best players played for their countries. And so one
of his biggest things that I saw that was so different, Right,
Great coaches see trends before they become habits, and a
lot of it has nothing to do with their jobs.

(16:41):
It just they see trends, right, And so that was
one area that Bill and I really got into and liked.
But Herb saw that the Russians were the best conditioned
hockey team in the world, and all other teams got
close to them. But when it came time for the
third period, they just weren't in good enough shape. And

(17:03):
so he ran into a friend of his out of Minneapolis.
His name Jack Karine, and we called him Cardiac Jack.
And he, now you're talking forty five years ago, was
a hit type professional trainer. Had studied the Russians all

(17:23):
he had done. So he was talking about quick twitch
and slow twitch fiber and how it could be done,
and you know what year you had to do it,
and how old you had to be. And so Herb
Brooks was working on a deck with this guy and
he said to Jack, He said, Jack, what do we
have to do to beat the Russians? He goes, you

(17:45):
have to change everything you do. Now here's Herb Brooks
winning national titles in college and he says, what do
you mean by that? You have to get in shape.
And so Herb had a team doctor who I lived
with during the Olympics who had escaped from Lot and
his name was doctor Nagabots. And Doctor Nagabot spoke five

(18:06):
different languages Russians, you know. So Herb went and coached
in the World Championships a year before the Olympics. Had
Doc Nagabots talked to all these different coaches got all
their ideas and constantly got better and better at what
he did. And so I think the big part that

(18:30):
you know, you you see with the Belichicks of the
world and the other ones, is that there's always a
way to win. It's just never the same right, and
you have to see trends before they become habits that
you know. I could spend the whole day with you
telling you the things that Brooks did that were amazing,
But your place sports long enough to know there are
some coaches that are great preparing you all week, but

(18:53):
when the game starts, they opened they opened and closed
the door. They don't know how to do anything different.
Some people coach and they're not very good preparing, but
during the game they're really good at adjusting. Very few
are great at preparing and adjusting. And when you get
somebody like that, then then it's it's really special. Like
let's see, you're wearing o'callahan's jersey, right, Brooks would know

(19:16):
when O'Callahan was kind of doing something stupid and pull
him off the ice, you know what I mean, because
he knew it'd be he'd be so excited he's going
to get a penalty, So he had the ability with
Jack get off, you know what I mean? And and
he was that in tuned on intimidation of the referee,
intimidation of the other player. Uh, you know so many
of the other different things.

Speaker 2 (19:38):
Wow, freaking Herb is that is that story where he
made you guys run after the skate skate or sorry
football guy skate when he had you guys skate after
the match or Norway game? The Norway game? How many
did you do?

Speaker 1 (19:56):
So the bark is really interesting. This basically talks about
trend before they become habit. So Herb Brooks has challenged
and you just kind of put this in perspectives, right,
They didn't want him to be a coach. They wanted
to Park or Billy Clary. So he had to convince
him to be coach. Then the US Hockey was okay

(20:16):
with preparing to compete not win. And there's a huge difference.
So when we talk about underdog vers a winning underdog
is either your you know, I'll go to companies when
I speak to him, I'll say, okay, where are we
are you guys preparing to win or compete? Are you
looking to be bought? Are you acquiring? Right? Because this
is one or the other, right jewels. We played sixty

(20:41):
one games before the Olympics. No other Olympic team had
ever played more than eight. We played forty seven of
those sixty one on the road. We did it in
four months. The NHL played eighty games in nine right,
and so we practiced the day of a game. If
he didn't like how we played during the game, we

(21:02):
practiced after the game. And it always comes down to
the same thing. I always ask people what's the most
important thing in time management? What would your answer be? Productivity?
It's knowing how much time you have.

Speaker 2 (21:17):
Knowing how much time.

Speaker 1 (21:17):
You can't be productive unless you know how much time
you have. Herb Brooks had six months to get this
hoggy team ready to beat the greatest team in the world,
and so the tactics and the way he did things
were based on how much time he had. Right. So,
here we are, we're playing the Norwegians, we're playing we're
getting killed. As far as the schedule goes, we're going

(21:39):
back and forth. The accommodations we had is you had
three guys to a room, two guys got to bed,
and one guy didn't. And how that was decided was
if you were the smallest guy you got the copy right,
you're hanging stuff inside the locker room, you're lugging all
your own gear, you're trying to get it clean, you know.
So now we're playing a team that we think we're

(21:59):
better than that, and so we play. Don't take it
really that serious. We tie it. The trend is Brooks
knows we're going to play in the Olympics. It's going
to be the same thing. The Olympics back then wasn't
set up so for television. It was the real Olympics.
Yeah right, So it was how many goals for, how
many goals against? You know, and everything was metric.

Speaker 2 (22:22):
You guys beat the Russian right, and you could have
not placed the next week exactly.

Speaker 1 (22:26):
Yeah. Crazy. So Herbs says, you know, this is a
bad trend. You can't not take anybody nothing. So even
though we tied into Rwegians, he knew we were going
to play him in the Olympics, and so he stopped
the trend from becoming a habit. And we skated and skated.
But what he was doing that The Miracle Movie didn't
really do is one of our best players, a guy

(22:49):
named Mark Johnson, Mark Johnson. Yeah, and Mark Johnson's dad
was an incredible coach.

Speaker 3 (22:54):
It's a great day for hockey.

Speaker 1 (22:55):
Yeah, great day for hockey, right, you know, totally two
different press and all least you know, Mark's dad was positivity.
Brooks was, you know, more toughness, right, And I think
Herb wanted to break Mark that day and let him
know that his dad wasn't coaching him. So we skated
and skated until Mark Johnson slammed his tick against the boards.

(23:20):
That's how it really happened. And Mark Johnson is the
coolest guy you'll ever meet, never gets upset, So to
get him upset with something he.

Speaker 2 (23:28):
Liked, Now, when did you guys come together and like,
did you guys like Herb?

Speaker 1 (23:32):
To me? I always liked Herb. You know, I had
just lost my mother to cancer and I was there.
It was like it was a stepping stone to try
to make it to the National Hockey League. You know.
When Herb asked me to play in the World Championships
in Lenagrad, Moscow, I couldn't If somebody showed me in
the lineup, I wouldn't even know what he looked like,
you know what I mean? It was just you just played.

(23:54):
So to me, he always had my interest in heart
and working hard was just part of the deal.

Speaker 2 (24:05):
Yeah, but what about the boys, Like when you guys
are in the locker room and coach ain't there, Like
when Belichick wasn't there, were like, fuck this guy, this
guy's making us run the goddamn hill. It's week eighteen.
We got no knees. What's going on here?

Speaker 1 (24:17):
Yeah? Put money in the bank.

Speaker 2 (24:19):
When did that camaraderie with the guys come together?

Speaker 1 (24:22):
Strategy? It was his strategy. If they don't like me,
maybe they'll like.

Speaker 2 (24:27):
Each other because you guys are all from different places. Yeah,
we were going to get into that.

Speaker 1 (24:30):
But yeah, and and yeah, so you had a lot
of guys who had them for four years. You know,
basically it was Minnesota and four guys from BU.

Speaker 2 (24:39):
And then wasn't there Minnesota BU? And wasn't there the
Wisconsin boys?

Speaker 1 (24:43):
Yeah, a couple of basically you know for guys in
East Minnesota.

Speaker 2 (24:49):
BU when you're in Easton, was that like a big thing?
Like is that your dream when you were a kid
to play a BU?

Speaker 1 (24:54):
Do you want to hear the whole story? Let's here
and it's kind of interesting.

Speaker 2 (24:57):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (24:58):
So I'm Irish Catholic altar boy. Yeah, I live just
south of the city of Boston. So Boston College is
like a big deal BC. Yeah, that's where the Irish
guys go, right, And so I remember the priest one day,
Father Buckley said to me, Hey, Jimmy, I know you
really want to get a full scholarship to play hockey.

(25:20):
I help out if I bring in to meet the
head coach of Boston College. Yeah, so, I said, great.
Now the problem is, I'm a senior in high school.
I'm five foot three, I weigh one hundred and thirty pounds.

Speaker 2 (25:31):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (25:32):
So I get to meet coach Selaski and I look
in there and he looks at me like, how the
hell did this guy get in here? Right? This is
a big time pro. He's five foot three. He plays
for this place out in Easton called Olivar Aimes. You know,
we don't take anybody here unless they're at a private
prep school or they're play you know Triple A in Canada. Right. Yeah,

(25:56):
So I met him and I said, you know, coach,
I'd really like to be part of your program. And
he said, Jimmy, you're a fine young man, but I
think he should stick close to home. So that's when
I went back home. I mean, being one of eight,
we had no money, and so I took my pissed
you off, well, I took my goalie mask over, and

(26:18):
you know, the realization and reflection, And I really think
reflection is a really big part of growth, right, you
have to really reflect of where you are and are
you willing to do the work?

Speaker 2 (26:31):
Are you willing to do the work?

Speaker 1 (26:32):
Are you willing to do the work? And there's no guarantees.
So I brought my goalie mask into this place where
a guy named Ernie Higgins made all the professional goalie
mask and I was in there, and also Ernie's son
comes in Neil and says, Jimmy, where are you going
to school? And I said, you know, Neil, I don't know.
He goes, well, I just got my first coaching job.

(26:55):
So Neil was an All American goalie out of Boston College. Yeah,
he just playing in the pros in his first coaching job, right,
And he says, hey, I'd love to have you come
join me. I said, where's that? He said, Massive Siltate
Community College. It's in Brockton. I said, it's not even
safe there they practiced like at five o'clock in the morning.

(27:19):
I don't think you have enough jerseys for everybody, right,
And he looks at me and he says, listen, if
you don't think this is the best opportunity of your life,
and he wants you to come. So I went home
and I reflected, I said, well, where am I going
to go? Right? And then I changed my mindset, which
is something that was really valuable and it really helped me.

(27:39):
And I said, I'm going to have an All American
goalie who just finished the pros coaching mention me he
will never be down at this level ever. Again, this
is an incredible opportunity. Yeah, So I went there with
a different mindset. All of a sudden, I grew seven inches.
We wanted now Junior College championship. And at that last

(28:04):
game before the game started, Neil come up to me.
He says, well, Jimmy, the news and bad news. I go,
what's the good news? He goes, there's two scouts in
the stands. One's from Providence College and one's from Boston University.
And he said, you know, if you play well, you
got a chance. So I had like the game of
my life. I think there was five people in the stands.
Three of them were my family members, two of them

(28:26):
were Scouts. And that's when Jack Parker offered me a
full scholarship to Boston University. But joels it doesn't get
easier because he offered it. But the problem was he
had already given it away. And this kid, Mark Holden,
from the area, had a choice to go to Brown

(28:47):
or to go to be you. If he went to Brown,
I would go to be you. And so when Jack
said that to me, I said, I don't care if
he comes, and he started leaving. He goes no, Jimmy,
That's how it works. And the innocent part about that was,
what do I care my dreams. I want to play
in the Olympics. I want to be a pro. I
got to be better than everybody. It doesn't matter. And

(29:07):
if I compete, I compete. You can't decide you're not
going to compete. And so Holden decided to go to Brown.
And he didn't do it because it was an IVY
League school. He did it because BU had an All
American goalie. It was only a sophomore, and so he
figured he'd played quicker and so that was an opportunity,
and so in life you have to make the best

(29:29):
of the opportunities. So I remember going into bu I'd
never been in this city, I had never seen the trolley.
My poor mother brings me in. I'm scared shitless. Right.
I get there the first day and I meet one
of my teammates. His name is John Bethel. He's from
Point Claire. Quoteback at some place right. And John goes, Hey, Jimmy,
nice to meet you. He goes, welcome to the team.

(29:51):
I said, thanks, John. He goes, say where did you
go to school? I said, Massasoya. He goes, Is that
a private prep school in Connecticut? And I I said no.
He goes, is it a junior a team in Canada?
I said nope, it's a community college. And the point was,
you don't go to Boston University out of Massasoi community College.

(30:12):
It just doesn't happen. But the point was, and I
think you can relate to this is I tell people
when I speak to him, is every year you have
to make your team and earn your position. And if
you have that mentality and you don't use hope, because
I tell people, hope is not a strategy, right, preparation
is a strategy, you know, being a little smart, a

(30:34):
little better than you were the day before. So all
of a sudden, the All American goalie from Bu Lois
is his first game, second game, third game. Before you know,
they put me in and I just never looked back.
But timing is a big opportunity, having someone believing you
but putting the work in. I think, is it really?

Speaker 2 (30:52):
That's everything? I mean. I'm a Juco guy, I went
I went to Juco for a year and then went
to Kent State, and I relate to that, Uh, your
mentality when that scout came in or when who was it?
Uh the All American? What was his name? That the

(31:13):
coach that.

Speaker 1 (31:14):
Your junior Juco Neil Higgins?

Speaker 2 (31:16):
Is that when you first found out about your underdog
versus the winning underdog, because you said.

Speaker 1 (31:22):
It was really funny. Is you have a choice when
you have these dreams? Right? So, as a young boy
had three dreams really simple. I wanted to get a
full scholarship go to college because I wasn't going to
college I was. I wanted to play the Olympics and
represent our country. And I wanted to play in the
National Hogur League. And you know there's a saying I use.

(31:43):
If your dreams don't scare you, they're not big enough, right,
And so they're not big.

Speaker 2 (31:50):
Enough sayings in this baby real tag them up Baby.

Speaker 1 (31:54):
But the real meaning is is I don't look at
personal sacrifices something I did. I look at it as
an opportunity that somebody gave me. So when my mother
had to convince my father to put me into hockey,
and I'm wanna bate and spend that money, I didn't
have any personal sacrifice. She did and my father did.

(32:16):
And the people there when I look at community and
all those people who gave me rides and I went there,
didn't even know you needed equipment, And people never made
you feel embarrassed. All of a sudden, they gave you
some skates and they brought you this, and they brought
you there and then. So what happens to me is
one of the tools that I try to use is
I didn't have the courage to let people down, people

(32:40):
who believed in me. You know, I felt that I
used that as a tool. So when someone says to
you you can't what are you do? Just say, well,
Jules said, I can't do it. I guess I can't
do it. I'll say, well him right, I will do it,
and how are you going to do it? And that's
why failure isn't fatal, but being afraid to is.

Speaker 2 (33:01):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (33:02):
And when you all of a sudden reach a level
in the sport where you're not as good as people
think you are, that's pressure.

Speaker 2 (33:10):
Man, that's pressure.

Speaker 1 (33:12):
That's pressure because you can't be a winning underdog anymore.
You can't. You know. It's like that favorite poem, The
Man in the Mirror. I don't know if you've ever
read that one, but the net net is you can
fool everybody else in the whole world, but when you
look at yourself in the mirror, you can't full yourself right.
And so you know when you're done.

Speaker 2 (33:32):
That's when I felt it.

Speaker 1 (33:34):
You just know when you're done right, when.

Speaker 2 (33:36):
You're athletic performing. I mean that brings me back to
when you throw in the film and you don't recognize
that guy, And like you said, that's the real pressure,
because you've already set a standard of what you've performed
for them.

Speaker 1 (33:51):
Then you have to really what I call when I
wrote my first business book, there's a thing called managing
ego and conflict. Right, your ego is what gut you there,
but you have to be able to manage that, right,
And so when you get to that point is what
are you doing it for? Ye Are you doing it
for the adulation or you're doing it because you're the

(34:14):
best professional at that position?

Speaker 2 (34:17):
Right As an athlete that when you play professionally, you're
gonna feel pressure no matter where you are in your career.
When you're young guy trying to make a team, trying
to make the team, trying to earn a roll, trying
to earn roll your superstar, you're trying to stay that
you did that. But you know when you said, when
people say you can play and you eventually can't, that's

(34:39):
when you start feeling the pressure. In a paraphrase, I
remember that.

Speaker 1 (34:44):
It just jumps right out at you. It's not even
it's an aha moment.

Speaker 2 (34:47):
No, it's just one of those. But that's one of
the like, like you said, because your ego over the years,
that's like the biggest thing you have to swallow is
when you can't go out well.

Speaker 1 (34:58):
When you can't use it as a tool, and it
becomes really more you know, like I don't know, I
you know, I had back surgery and I used to
play golf really well, and that was how to play.
And it said, Jesus Christ, I'm not as good as
I used to be because I'm not as young as
I used to be. I'm not you know, you know
you are what you are day right, And you know

(35:20):
it's do you want to put the work in?

Speaker 2 (35:22):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (35:22):
You know you got to reinvent yourself? Right?

Speaker 2 (35:25):
Yeah, But even that point in my career, I was
putting in so much work. I was. You know, the
older you get, you got to work harder and harder
and harder, because, like you said, you got to continue
evolve and reinvent yourself every year. And when you can't
and you plateau, that means you're done well.

Speaker 1 (35:38):
I think. I think what's interesting with a Belichick and
a Brooks is they knew if that was a fuel
that was going to help you or hurt you, and
knew how to play that card on you.

Speaker 2 (35:50):
Oh, he played it on me all the contract negotiations,
team friendly deal. I'm the worst guy now, Herb. What's
the difference between Herb and your college coach Parker?

Speaker 1 (36:00):
Parker was an incredible competitor, and he knew how to
do things a certain way, and I'm sure he evolved
over time. But Brooks, Brooks created the future. You know,
he he saw things before they.

Speaker 2 (36:16):
Happened, you know, real deal.

Speaker 1 (36:19):
He is so organized. Brooks was so organized timing. And
you know, what we did was not a miracle. It
was hard work. But the reason why we won was
because we executed the game plan flawlessly. And that that
means certain people have to step up a certain timing.

(36:39):
I mean, we had a guy who just a recent
teammate recently passed away, Mark Wells. He was on the team,
not on the team. They brought him back, but her
brought him back to play against one player and he
Mark was incredible at that game, at that one player,
you know, and that's the vision that he had, you know,

(36:59):
when Callahan got hurt, and he was half the guy
he could be. He was such an important ingredient in
the locker room that he had to be there.

Speaker 2 (37:08):
He can't mess the function of the team up.

Speaker 1 (37:10):
Well, but you wanted to. But when you go there,
here you have Herb who could really make the general
manager really happy by getting one of his kids friends
in and doing politically correct thing. But that Herb didn't
care about that.

Speaker 2 (37:24):
There's no popularity in leadership right now.

Speaker 1 (37:27):
There's no loyalty in leadership. People look at loyalty as
though people aren't being loyal. I would challenge that. You know,
your old coach Belichick was incredibly loyal to you, do
anything for you, But it never felt like.

Speaker 2 (37:42):
That, Yeah, because you knew the winning was the number
one loyalty.

Speaker 1 (37:47):
Well, it's his job.

Speaker 2 (37:48):
This is his job. That's his job. Can you tell
us the story of the shamrocks on your mask? Irish Catholic?

Speaker 1 (37:54):
Is it just that it was good luck charm? The
shamrocks was my good luck charm. And so Jerry Cheevers
from the Bruins, he used to take stitches and put
him on his mask. And I said, well, I got
to come up with something. So it was the shamrocks.

Speaker 2 (38:09):
That's a swag right there, that's the ego swag. Baby.

Speaker 1 (38:13):
Yeah, back in the day. There was no painting of
the mask back then. But you know, sometimes you have
to give yourself something to be a winning underdog, right
and so remember when I told you that BC coach said,
you know you're a fine young man. You sit close

(38:33):
to home. Well. Boston University in the three years I
was there, played BC like fourteen times. We do, I
personally played it fourteen times. And after every game, there's
a tradition in hockey that you go and you shake
the other team's hands, and so coach Sedglaski was still

(38:56):
there when I was there, and so I remember after
every win, I'd go shake his hand and say, thank God,
it wasn't good enough to go to your school. And
one of them was a national title. Would beat BC
in the national title?

Speaker 2 (39:07):
Oh yeah, got it.

Speaker 1 (39:09):
So it's it's that type of thing it is, you know,
who is it that's gonna help you when you don't
feel like doing the work, you know. I remember when
Bob Wolf was my agent, he'd have this couple. I
forget what the pitcher's name was, but he had have
in his glove. These sons of bitches are taking money
out of my kid's mouth, and it look at it

(39:30):
gets so angry and it's roll the ball harder, you
know what I mean. So there's always a little something
that it has to get you, you know, going right.

Speaker 2 (39:40):
I used to put lily pads on my cleat for
my daughter. Her name's Lily. Yeah, yeah, yeah, you gotta
have something.

Speaker 1 (39:45):
We'll look down and say, what's the purpose?

Speaker 2 (39:47):
Right, what's the purpose?

Speaker 1 (39:49):
What's the purpose?

Speaker 2 (39:51):
We'll be right back after this quick break. Let's go
back to around February twenty second, nineteen eighty and we
like to go over pop culture. What was going around
in the world. Number one movie Cruising? Which one is that?
You guys? Al Pacina?

Speaker 1 (40:08):
You see that?

Speaker 2 (40:08):
Jim No, No, we're probably locked in ready for the
Soviets number one song, crazy little thing called Love by Queen?
No that one? You queen fan.

Speaker 1 (40:20):
I'm a fan of all good music.

Speaker 2 (40:21):
Yeah, there you go, me too, me too. Studio fifty
four had its closing party. Do you guys get to
hit that?

Speaker 1 (40:29):
After we've been there?

Speaker 2 (40:31):
You've been there? Oh how is Studio fifty four?

Speaker 1 (40:34):
It's not a diddy party?

Speaker 2 (40:41):
So that was a fun time. Yeah, different, Well what
was different about it?

Speaker 1 (40:46):
It was just probably like any place that goes on,
it was the thing to go, the thing to do.

Speaker 2 (40:51):
Yeah, now, did you guys who was the who was
the going out boys on the team.

Speaker 1 (40:56):
I'd rather keep that.

Speaker 2 (40:58):
We'll keep that. Billy Joel's fifty second Street wins a
Grammy for album in the year I Love Billy Your
good music. What was your life like around this time
in nineteen eighty What was going on around this time?
Do you have a girlfriend? Wife? Just everything was about hockey.

Speaker 1 (41:14):
You know, you're so entrenched in trying to create something,
be something that you know, You're very structured back then,
you know you have you know, the Olympics, but once
Olympics star was just crazy. You know, try to figure
out who you are and what you're doing. That's that
was a little more crazy time.

Speaker 2 (41:32):
In the sports world in nineteen eighty Super Bowl Champions,
nineteen seventy eight, nineteen eighty Steelers Earl Campbell was the MVP.
That guy was a load. Stanley Cup winners. Was the
New York Islanders? Did they go three in a row?
In this one? Four in a row? Holy shit? Heart
Memorial Trophy, Wayne Gretzki A great one. You have any

(41:52):
Gretzky stories, you know Gretzky All.

Speaker 1 (41:54):
No, Wayne, I remember it by my second game in
the NHL and playing with the Atlanta Flames and I've
never even been to the rink and they get there
and they have the Canadian nationally athm going on, and
I don't even know the flag is. I don't know
what ends my end. You know, it's the first time

(42:14):
I've been in the building. I'm playing, and so I
remember Wayne afterwards it was pissed at me because, you know,
I didn't look at the Canadian you know flag, and
I said, Wayne, I didn't even know where it was.
You know what I mean. The sport was a Canadian sport.
Our wind was not very well received. It wasn't entertaining
yet because there wasn't enough money to be entertainment. You

(42:36):
couldn't talk to your teammates, you know. It was. It
was really really different, and so it's so nice to
see the game change and and you know, basically now
all sports are entertainment.

Speaker 2 (42:49):
Did Gretzky score on you.

Speaker 1 (42:51):
I'm sure he has. I don't know how many times,
but I'm sure he has.

Speaker 2 (42:56):
Is he like the most electrifying guy that you played against?
Or who was some that you were like, it's gonna
be a fucking long night.

Speaker 1 (43:03):
You know? There was a guy that nobody really knew.
His name, kent to Nielsen. He played for the Flames.
He's a swite. He was just an incredible player. He
could do anything that he really wanted to do. You know,
Bossy was a great player. Gila Fleur was a great player.
You know, he had so many different players. The game

(43:25):
was a really wide open game there. When Wayne played,
he was very well protected, you know, so that really
helped our guy Mark Johnson was a great player. But
people got their names in the paper by beating people
up from our team, you know what I mean. And
so there was no safe things, and you know, it's
a big transition. All of us had gone to college

(43:45):
with college degrees. You know. The NHL wasn't used to that,
you know, Yeah, so it was a big transitional time.

Speaker 2 (43:51):
How's the game then changed? From the game now.

Speaker 1 (43:56):
Clutching and grabbing and you know, just you know, the
physicality that was done.

Speaker 2 (44:03):
It was different the equipment the past.

Speaker 1 (44:04):
Yeah, the equipment was so bad. You see goalies now
let it hit you. Didn't let it hit you. It hurt,
you know what I mean. Now they play to have
it hit them, you know what I mean. So much
of the game for a goalie was angles, you know,
so they would miss them that. I remember when I
first started. Our coach was Jerry Chievus and he said, hey, Jimmy,
if that shot is coming high and it's at your

(44:26):
shoulder and you're up by a couple to get your
shoulder out of the way. You get hurt. Who cares if
you win five to three or five to four. Don't
hurt yourself on that. Jesus, it was crazy.

Speaker 2 (44:38):
So you used to take that has to hurt all.

Speaker 1 (44:41):
It was like a pad, a felt pad.

Speaker 2 (44:45):
You could just darted up after a game. Oh my god,
Oh my god, those things that thing flies.

Speaker 1 (44:52):
Yeah. The pads that we had were made idea hide that.
You know, we're thirty pounds. The ones they have now
don't weigh five. No, they collapsed so they cover areas.
You know, it took us a year to break them in.

Speaker 2 (45:04):
You know you have your teeth? Yeah, did you wear mouthguard?
How come every hockey guy know that he doesn't have teeth?

Speaker 1 (45:10):
Well, because they were a goalie.

Speaker 2 (45:12):
The goalie has the mask. Yeah, I'm fucking What was
it like to see Kenmorrow go off and win for
Stanley Cups.

Speaker 1 (45:19):
Kenny Morrow is probably my closest friend and the best
guy in the world. He's he he is a guy
that is so humble, it's it's perfect. Yeah and then yeah,
so proud of him.

Speaker 2 (45:34):
You know, how come you guys were so close.

Speaker 1 (45:36):
We just hit it off, you know what I mean,
just started when we played over in the World Championships
in Moscow, and he's quiet, you know, really just goes
and gets his job done, kind of really good guy.

Speaker 3 (45:50):
Before we move on, I read that there was a
no beard, no facial hair rule.

Speaker 1 (45:55):
So you know, you always talk about Brooks and maybe
how he's a little different, and so Herb had this
saying that said, you know, no beard's on the team
except Kenny Morrill, who had one before he got here,
you know what I mean. And the reason being is
Kenny Morrow's beard wasn't just to grow a beard, it
was who he was. And so Herb had to figure

(46:16):
out that if you made Kenny Morrell shave his beard,
that was that was that was going to do something
to him other than letting somebody grow a beard. Right.

Speaker 2 (46:25):
So yeah, Jackie, let's break down this so be the way.

Speaker 1 (46:30):
They help you out here. This is all this, all
this work behind this scenes, jeezu, this is awesome.

Speaker 2 (46:36):
This is a team baby.

Speaker 1 (46:37):
Well listen, you're only as good as your team.

Speaker 2 (46:39):
Only as good as your team, That's right. The a
team over here did we get into the Soviets real quick,
Let's set the stage for the Soviets.

Speaker 4 (46:46):
These guys were the most dominant guys in hockey at
the time, won four straight gold medal sixty four, sixty eight,
seventy two, seventy six. They won all the three World
Championships since nineteen sixty three. They won all twelve matchups
with the US up until this point, led by goalie Triciak,
who was said to be the best goalie in the world.

(47:07):
Other notable guys Boris Makaylo of the captain. These guys were,
I mean, these guys were forced to be reckon with
the e Olympire at the time.

Speaker 1 (47:15):
Jills. What a lot of people don't know now is
when City Olympics and you play the Soviet Union, right,
you're playing just the Soviet Union. When the Soviet Union
Red Army team was put together at Donado, it was
the best Communist players in the world that they took
from every country. So you had people from Lafia, you
had people all over the place. So now they get

(47:37):
to represent their own countries and compete against them, but
they took the very best in all Communist countries. Jesus
and made them part of this Red Army team.

Speaker 2 (47:49):
So what's your perception of this specific team when you
guys sign or when you're going through your d your
your hell week, all your prep. This is a team
that everyone's got to be. What are the guys thinking
about this squad?

Speaker 1 (48:04):
In any sport, you're trying to be a professional at
you're maya people that are really good, right, and then
you emulate And you know, for me, you know, trying
to emulate someone wasn't just one player because his skills
wasn't good enough. You had to emulate people had all
these different skills and try to make them part of
your own, right. And so all of us are trying

(48:26):
to make it to the national honking. That's a goal
and these are stepping stones along the way. And so
like people will always ask us, you know, why did
you play the Russians in Madison Square Garden two days
before the Olympic Games. Well, the reason is either you're
preparing to win and compete, right. Our coach had never played,

(48:48):
never coached against them, so he had a coach against them.
We had never played against them, so we had to
play against them. And so as badly as we got
beat there were things that we learned, some things that
we could adjust to. So for me, right playing the
Russian team for one period of playing against the Russian

(49:11):
was like playing a whole game against someone else. So
I changed my strategy. I broke it in the three
games of four to five minute periods, and after every
period it took all my equipment off, put it back
on and refocus, and then I started to really kind
of get lays of focus on parts of the game
that I thought were really important first five minutes of

(49:32):
a period. As a goal you don't want to give
up a goal. You don't want to give up a
goal after your team scores a goal, and you certainly
don't want to give up a goal in the last
minute to take momentum away. So what I did is
I broke this game into three separate games of four
or five minute periods and had times the things to
focus at. And then my goal was don't give up

(49:52):
any goals in the third period. And you know, as
a goal you can't win a game, but you can
lose one. And I think how consistent a goalie plays,
not how many saves he makes, but how consistent your
team can rally around and get used to. You can't
get used to a guy that's a quarterback that's going
to go incredible. But then the next game throw five interceptions,

(50:17):
and so you have to know what you have. And
so I really believe that what happened was we broke
it down for you know, if you look at a
game and say, oh my god, I got to play
sixty minutes, it's like, oh, that's hard. But if you say, hey,
I got these little separate things and you can play
through those, I think it's important. Well look at you

(50:37):
when you guys came back from Atlanta game in the
second half. That's exactly what you did. Yeah, broke it
down into segments on I can't give up a one.
I got to score one. We're going to make this. Yeah,
we got time left, you know, And so you became
raised and focused.

Speaker 2 (50:52):
Yeah, you focused on one play at a time, because
you know, one big play is not going to get
you twenty four points. If we all collectively focus on
our job every single play, we're gonna give ourselves the
best possibility to win. You know. So did you admire
any of these these all players, all of them specifically?

(51:14):
Who was one?

Speaker 1 (51:14):
Was it the Chechiak. You just set the whole different standard.
You know, the way he worked, what he did, how
he did.

Speaker 2 (51:21):
Things, why what what what made him different? How did
he work?

Speaker 1 (51:25):
He kept on reinventing the position. You know, we used
to do a two legged pad stack save, and he
figured out how to go over and do it with
one leg and get up, you know. And the other
thing that I don't think gets a lot of credit for.
When he was a young goalie and his team wasn't
all that great, he won the games. But when he

(51:48):
got older and the team was really good, he had
to keep him in games until they felt like playing.
And and that is really hard. You know, when when
you look at goalies, you say, oh, man, he made
their twenty five saves and the other guy only had
twelve shots on him. That has nothing to do with it.
I mean to me, the way they evaluate goalies is obsolete.

(52:10):
You know, a shot on goal I did the stat
when I was younger. I say, you know, when you
have a really good high school team and they shoot
one hundred shots on a goalie in a practice, they
might only hit the net thirty times. When you have
a great college team and they take one hundred shots
on a goalie and a practice, they'll hit it maybe

(52:31):
eighty times. When you play in the pros and they
have one hundred shots, they hit it one hundred times.
So when you have a goalie and he's out there
and they're missing the net, it's because it's perfect positioning,
or they're passing the puck instead of shooting it when
they should because they don't want to shoot, and those
stats don't come up. And that's something that try to act.

(52:54):
I watched it and I noticed you know what I mean.

Speaker 2 (52:56):
Yeah, it's the hitting yard. It's like the Vince Wilfork
of hockey. This guy takes up a double team. He's
taking up six hundred pounds every play so his linebackers
can get free and make a tackle. But we don't
get a stat for that. It's kind of like a goalie. Now,
take us to the Olympic village and when you guys

(53:19):
are there, are you are you guys packed up with
your USA jackets on? And like you guys go to
the local fountain and you see, like is there like
the Russian hockey team over there, and you guys are
like looking at each other, or did you guys ever
cross pass.

Speaker 1 (53:33):
Our Olympic village turned into a prism. There was nothing
there any good. We lived in trailers, so our trailer
was myself, ARIZIONI, Billy Baker, and Phil for Koda. We
started the Olympics before the opening ceremonies and we played
every other day. There was absolutely no time for anything.

(53:55):
The only thing we went and saw was hiding. He
was just so great and up like that, So no,
there was no time.

Speaker 2 (54:02):
What about the Centipede video game? I heard you had
a little time for that.

Speaker 1 (54:06):
I love that, and you know it's really funny, and
maybe this has happened in your career. Right, You've got
some teammates who don't like it if you like other
players on other team because they're on the other team, right,
And to me, I just admired talent, right, And I
didn't care who they played for, because when it was
time to play, it was time to beat them. It

(54:28):
didn't matter who it was, and whether it was my brother,
it didn't matter. You know, when you compete, it's time
to compete, right, So we had I forget how to
pronounce his name, but we're playing Centipede. He wants to
turn and I say okay, you have a turn, and
we kind of said, well, okay, i'll see you tomorrow.
And I had won the game, and so I said,
you know, I'm going to do the same thing tomorrow

(54:49):
or something like that to him.

Speaker 2 (54:50):
For who was that one of the Soviets.

Speaker 1 (54:53):
Yeah, he was one of their best youngest player. To
forget what his name is, hey, Crewton to Anton to
cut your leg off?

Speaker 3 (55:04):
Macaroth, Macaroth future Hall of Famer.

Speaker 1 (55:07):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, he was just a great player.

Speaker 2 (55:09):
Did being a hockey player trump being from different countries
or did you guys like when you're in the Olympic village,
you guys are you know usay this? But if you
saw a hockey guy, you're like, oh, it's a hockey
it's one of our bros.

Speaker 1 (55:20):
We didn't really really see anything.

Speaker 2 (55:21):
You didn't see anything. Now, you always hear the crazy
stories about Olympic the.

Speaker 1 (55:26):
Ones who have one game and stayed there for two weeks.
I guess I have a little bit more time, you know,
and they don't have herb Brooks as a coach.

Speaker 2 (55:34):
Now, did you develop any relationships with these guys after
this game?

Speaker 1 (55:37):
Great story? So I'm coaching our kids in Rainham Mass
and I walk in and the guy who's running what
year is this? I leould say get married in eighty six?
It was probably early.

Speaker 2 (55:53):
Nineties, early nineties.

Speaker 1 (55:55):
And so the guy who runs the snack bars a
rush and his name is Vladimir. So he was great.
So I go in and Lahim said, hey, Jimmy, how
you doing this? Said good Blad. He goes, hey, you
don't have the only gold medalist in here today. I said, whoa,
that's great? Who else? And so he introduced me to
Vladimir Luchenko, who's a five time I mean one of

(56:17):
he's the bobby or of their defenceman over there. And
so Vladdie and I became like incredible friends. We coached
together for like over twelve years. I helped him get
the head coaching job for Europe for the Rangers, and
I learned so much about his life. Right, So I

(56:37):
remember one day we're going to walk our dogs, right,
and so I meet him over his house, right, So
I have this wymeranner, right, and you know, Hudson was
like a show dog. He won Westminster. I mean he's
a stud of a hunting dog. Right, So Vladimir shows
up he's a little Yorky, you know, and so I

(56:59):
you know, back then they kind of arranged marriages. So
Vladimir's wife was a ballerina, and you know, the Russians
thought was, well, you hitch up a you know, this
big strong guy with a ballerina, You're going to produce
a really great athlete, right. So I go to Vladdy, go, Laddie,
you know you have any any kids. He goes, yes,
what two daughters? I go, well, they must be a

(57:22):
good looking you guys. No, So he had a heavy
set daughter, you know what I mean. So anyway, we
became incredible friends, and he told me a story one time.
So I said, Vladimir, you know you you're one of
the youngest guys in the Russian run army team. He goes, yeah.
I said, did you did you ever get new equipment?
He says yeah. I said, was it brand new? He'sas, oh, no,

(57:44):
we never got a brand new equipment. I said, He
goes and he says, one day I got so excited him.
I get these new skates. I'm skating on the Baltic
Sea and he's skating around. Also he starts falling in,
falling in and He's a big man. He's like six three, right,
big strong guy. I said, he goes, I'm swimming so funny.
He said, gonna give up, I'm gonna drown. And he
said he's in four feet of water.

Speaker 2 (58:07):
You hockey guys going on that thin ice man. I
see that as a California kid, I see that ice.
Im bout it's crazy.

Speaker 1 (58:14):
Yeah, but he he was so great. We would play
like men's league game. I'd be a defenceman with him.
We play together every Christmas. We stay still stay in touch.

Speaker 2 (58:26):
Awesome.

Speaker 1 (58:27):
Yeah, and you know their way of life was being
a hockey player was the best. But it wasn't easy.

Speaker 2 (58:33):
Yeah, no, definitely not. I mean, ship, you don't score
a goal, you get your handschopped off. Let's jump into
the team, USA, Jackie.

Speaker 3 (58:40):
Just a real quick fun. You had a dog when
Westminster Dog Show?

Speaker 1 (58:44):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (58:44):
Wow, can you tell us about that a little bit more?

Speaker 1 (58:47):
Well, Hudson, he's no longer with us, he has passed away.
But he was the most bred Wimer aunder in the country.
He had won and uber he won best of Breed
and uh for wymer Anstminster.

Speaker 2 (59:00):
Yeah, what a stud? Did you walk him out there?

Speaker 1 (59:03):
Oh? On I didn't do that little try I'd be
afraid of falling down.

Speaker 2 (59:09):
That would have been incight to see. Yeah, Jackie set
the stage for Team USA.

Speaker 4 (59:13):
Let's talk about Team USA here as we know, led
by Herb Brooks, Craig Patrick, the assistant there held tryouts
famously seen in the movie Summer of nineteen seventy nine
out in Colorado Springs. We talked a little bit earlier.
Nine guys Minnesota b U four from BU nine for Minnesota.

Speaker 2 (59:31):
We had the East Coast first, the.

Speaker 4 (59:34):
Midwest rivalry going on there and the average age of
these guys twenty one college kids as opposed to the
Russians about twenty seven.

Speaker 2 (59:42):
And these were the comeback kids.

Speaker 4 (59:43):
Baby trailed in six of seven Olympic Games, wins, led
by Mike Ruzioni as a captain, famous cone headline. We
know about those guys, seventeen goals, twenty assists. That was Padlovich,
Harrington and Schneider.

Speaker 2 (01:00:00):
We talked about it.

Speaker 4 (01:00:00):
We always had like the legends here, but I mean,
all these guys are well, it's all legends getting more.

Speaker 2 (01:00:04):
Mark Johnson, Dave.

Speaker 4 (01:00:06):
Silk, Jack O'Callahan, Jim Craigan's the list goes on and on.

Speaker 2 (01:00:11):
Baby, So when you guys first go to tryouts, is
it pretty clicked up Boston Boys with the Boston Boys,
the fucking Midwest East or with the Midwest East?

Speaker 1 (01:00:21):
Absolutely?

Speaker 2 (01:00:22):
Absolutely?

Speaker 1 (01:00:23):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:00:23):
When did it break?

Speaker 1 (01:00:26):
Well, one thing I think that is a misknown work
to most people about how her picked this team. Right.
Everybody knows about the National Sports Festival now, right, and
that's where they bring the best athletes from around the
US and they get to showcase their talents for hopefully
being sponsored to go to the Olympics. Right, Yeah, Well,
Herb Brooks created that, and so what he did three

(01:00:50):
years before the Olympics, he had a lot of these
players played with four or five different teams like the
mid Atlantic, the East, the Midwest, and and he saw
all these players and he created a scouting of all
coaches to watch certain players. And so he had been
watching him for three years and so he really knew

(01:01:12):
it was going on for that. So jes maybe this
has happened in your career or not. But Herb Brooks
when he picked the initial twenty six guys, he picked
guys he knew never would make the team. But people
didn't understand why was to create a culture. You know,
less Oja was not going to make the team, but

(01:01:33):
he was going to help bridge the gap between the
guys from the East and the guys from the west.
Dave Dallach wasn't going to make the team, but he
was going to really show people, you know, a certain talent.
Then you had Jackie Hughes who made it so we
could play against these NHL teams because he was tough
and you know, there so every there was an ingredient

(01:01:53):
for everything that went on. And so when you know
you hear that saying I'm not looking for the best players,
I'm looking for the right players, it is because he
had a plan. Yeah, And so in this day and age,
especially when I'm speaking, is you see hr they don't
allow conflict to happen. And when you don't, it doesn't
go away, It just stays in festers. Right. So you

(01:02:17):
see this ocallahan fight versus McClanahan in the movie, right,
and if you really watch that clip, you'll see how
four or five times that was going to be stopped.
But as it plays through, now Brooks knows what he
has to do where the problems are, right, because if
not people are gonna split up and team up, and
this conflict will continue to go on. So I really

(01:02:41):
think conflict is a really important thing with every team.
You know, to let it happen so that you can
figure out what goes on.

Speaker 2 (01:02:49):
You get growth. Yes, that's how you get growth, because
if someone festers on something and implodes, then there will
be no communication. And that's when you know, you get
a blown coverage. And yeah, in in our sport. Now,
why did herb choose you?

Speaker 1 (01:03:05):
I think it's the winning underdog that I don't think
he knew how I were. I don't think he knew
if I would win in the biggest situations, but he
knew I wouldn't be nervous.

Speaker 2 (01:03:18):
He didn't take the test.

Speaker 1 (01:03:20):
Well, that's a much more complicated thing. So here, here's
a deal. He has this take home test. It's pretty simple.
I'm living with a team doctor doctor Nagabots, and my
mother had just passed, and so I used to call
home every night, checking in with my father. And this
one that I called home, he was crying. He still

(01:03:41):
had my mother's clothes in the closet. He had just
lost his job, and I felt really guilty about chasing
my career and not helping out the family, you know.
So that night I decided if I don't take the test,
I had made a promise to my mother. She said, listen,
no matter what happens to me, if you have a
chance to represent our country, you have to promise me

(01:04:03):
you will and you won't turn pro So I made
that promise, and so all of a sudden, now I said, well,
if I don't take this test, Herb Brooks will send
me home and then I'll just do whatever that does.

Speaker 2 (01:04:16):
Right.

Speaker 1 (01:04:17):
But the brilliance of Herb was I live with a
team doctor. The team doctor told her of everything that
was going on, and all he cared about is could
I do my job? And so in his own way,
he wanted people that would be more interested in the
team than themselves. And by showing that, you know, my

(01:04:38):
team was my family, right, and so I think it
really showed him a lot. So he asked me a question.
It was really interesting, two questions. He said, Jimmy, what
can I do to help? And I said, well, my
father needs a lull. So Herb worked to the people
in Minneapolis figured out how to get Alan. So that
kind of made me feel better. And the second question,

(01:05:00):
he says, can you do your job? I said, I
can do my job?

Speaker 2 (01:05:05):
Hell yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:05:06):
So the taking that test is a little different, but
Disney did ask if they could do it the way
it did because it kind of fit my character, you know,
so I have problem that.

Speaker 2 (01:05:16):
So when you make the team, you're finally on it,
are you fucking you gotta be pretty pumped and thinking
your mom's upstairs watching this that its been a special moment.

Speaker 1 (01:05:28):
It's just a step, you know, It's just you know,
when you have goals, it's just that you got to
hit one, you gotta hit another one, you got to
hit another one, and you know, uh, like people always
say about competition, right like Jana sec was a competition.
I didn't care if the harder he worked, the harder
I worked because I had more goals. If I can't

(01:05:50):
be better than him, then I can't get to where
I need to go. So there was never any jealousy.
It was I just needed to play better and always
get better.

Speaker 2 (01:06:00):
Right Yeah, when it's crazy exactly when I'm talking without
a doubt, when you're competing against another guy for something
that you both want, the time that you think about
those types of things where like people say, are you jealous?
Is that could be time used to make your craft better?

Speaker 1 (01:06:18):
Shit happens, right, if somebody's better, they're better. You know it,
they know it right, and you know, and I would
happen to think whether it's you or me, is there
was a way to make a save when you look
at the guy like is that the best you got?
And it pissed them off? There was you did the
same thing going around like come on, man, you can't
cover me. I mean, Larry Bird was the absolute best

(01:06:40):
trash talker in the whole world. But he did that
because he had he had to back it up, so
that was the fuel that he needed to do. It
doesn't matter what you have to put in the tank
to get that stuff right. But when you know you
don't have that in the tank anymore, that's when it's
really really Yeah, that's when it really sucks.

Speaker 2 (01:07:00):
Who's the team? Asshole me?

Speaker 1 (01:07:03):
You? Well, goalie is a different you know. I mean,
it's like you're not on the bench, you're not out
on the line. You're there. You're the coach on the
ice and trying to make each one of these guys
a little better. And you know, I think it was
the time of my life that it was like, it
wasn't fun. You know, I just lost my mother. Right,

(01:07:23):
what are you gonna do? And this is your vehicle.
You got to you gotta make the most of that time, right.

Speaker 2 (01:07:29):
Without a doubt. Who's the team? Who's the team?

Speaker 1 (01:07:31):
Prankster Davy Christian?

Speaker 2 (01:07:35):
What? What is what? Some of the he would do?

Speaker 1 (01:07:38):
Well, Rob McClanahan was a perfectionist, right, and so you
know Christian brothers made the sticks. So Robbie would have
eight or nine sticks taped up and they'd be absolutely perfect,
and right down by the blade they'd be a little
red little stick or you're plastic covering, right, So Davy
would take that off, take a hack, sar and sorry.
So it wouldn't quite break if you on it, but

(01:08:00):
if he went to shoot it, it would break, right,
And so Robbie was so particular about the thing. So
all of a sudden, Robbie goes goes to shoot stickering
pissed off, another one pissed off. And then he finds
out that Dave Davey had done that. And so we're
in Colorado Springs at the Broad Moor, and you know,
our travels are tough. We got tons of game, and

(01:08:24):
so all of a sudden, you know, Brooks is coming
in a little bit late, and Davy Christian and Pavliche
find that the figure skaters have their two two's right,
and so Davy Christian gets in this to two right
with Pavlage and Herb was talking about for checking right.

(01:08:45):
So Davy cut a Christian Brothers stick, taped it on
another one another one, so had a stick that reached
from here to the corner right. So he's out there
and that Herb comes out and he just couldn't do
anything but laugh. But that's kind of who Davey was.

Speaker 2 (01:08:58):
God you need a little of that, especially with that environment.
We always had our guy, the Matt Lights of the world,
that would do a fucking prank that all the boys
could just laugh. And you know, your guys are getting
yelled at, sweating together, you're leaning together. Ma'am.

Speaker 1 (01:09:15):
I did a prank on this one kid, who would
you know come in our day, you'd you'd break in
your goalie or your skates. They were really hard to
break in, so you would put steam in them and
then you tie them up as tight as you could.
And there was nothing more painful than what we call
lace bike. You know, all of a sudden you tight
your skate and you get lace bit. It's like, oh
my god, it's so painful. So there's this one kid,

(01:09:37):
uh Rory, and he was like helping the equipment manager
and he was a real fan. And I shouldn't have
done this, but I did. H He goes, Jimmy kids,
anything I do for it? He said, yeah, I go, Rory,
I've got these news skates. I need a bucket of steam.
He goes, well, where do I get that? I go,
do you ever see the zamboni when they come out
all that steam? Because you get down there, you capture

(01:09:58):
that steam and you get back. So three hours later
he comes back. I can't. I can't get your bucket.
This team I got orya right, No, I know.

Speaker 2 (01:10:11):
Oh Rory ror. Now before we jump into the game,
we have to hit one thing. What was up with
coach Herb's style? Like he was pretty fashionable? Yeah, like
did the boys talk about that?

Speaker 1 (01:10:24):
No? You know, he had so many guys who had
him for so long and other guys who you know,
love Parker, you know, you know.

Speaker 2 (01:10:32):
So, now, can I remember when Bill wants tried to
put on one of those old like those old hats. Yeah,
he put one of those on while we were traveling.
I mean, and I was in a certain bus where
he wasn't on the whole fucking bus is talking like,
what the fuck's Bill doing with this thing on? It
was a nineteen twenty two bro, Get out of here here.

(01:10:53):
Oh my gosh, what's the mattis Herb's ever been at you?

Speaker 1 (01:11:00):
I don't know, didn't really have that type of relationship
he was. He was more like a father figure to me,
you know what I mean.

Speaker 2 (01:11:09):
Goalie's probably different than the boy, you know what I mean, like.

Speaker 1 (01:11:13):
Not on the badge, right. I mean I had such
a relationship with him that if there was a guy
in the left face off circle that I knew couldn't
want to face off, I go change him, you know
what I mean, You know that type of thing. And
I used to stand on the front of the bus
in the well and just talk to him all the time.
And it was never to gain anything. I mean, your

(01:11:33):
goalie either the better one of you're not the better one.
It's it is what it is. But I always always
like to pick his mind on what he was doing. Yeah,
a lot.

Speaker 2 (01:11:42):
Not the whole team liked him.

Speaker 1 (01:11:43):
No, But you know it's interesting when her passed and
we were all at his funeral, if you said to
one of the players who was Herb's favorite, they would
have said themselves, every one of them, you know. So
that's the kind of influence he did have on them.

Speaker 2 (01:11:58):
That's awesome. That's awesome, Jack. Let's get in the game
lead up lead up to this game.

Speaker 1 (01:12:04):
We got the homework. Yeah, I tell you, I am propressed.

Speaker 2 (01:12:09):
Baby games and names Nutthouse. Let's go baby.

Speaker 4 (01:12:12):
We all know about the legendary tie with Norway and
the Herbies that came after those. That is part of
the lead up to this game.

Speaker 3 (01:12:20):
I still get shutters every time I hear goal line
because my coach made us run skate herbes.

Speaker 1 (01:12:25):
You know. As people don't understand is everybody thinks after
that game he was punishing the players. He wasn't. He
was developing the assistant coach. So watch it again and
you'll see how difficult it is her practice. Herb Kraig
Patrick was the nicest guy in the world, but he
didn't He always wanted to be one of the guys
because he had just finished playing and if you watch it,

(01:12:46):
he has the hardest time. And so Brooks is really
developing the assistant coach and he's doing it through the players,
which hurts the assistant coach the hardest because he's so
close to him. Got a calusel, Yeah, so's he's developing. Yeah,
And you know the thing that's kind of amazing about

(01:13:07):
Herb is when we were playing, there was no full
time goalie coaches, but Herb made Warren Strelo a full
time goalie coach. If Warren Strelo didn't have Herb Brooks,
he would have been a guy that never left the U,
showed up part time. Warren Strelo was a pioneer. And
now they have an award after him in the NHL

(01:13:27):
as one of the best goalie coach. So now that
position from a guy who saw the need of that
has gone. Craig Patricks is in the Hall of Fame
for a general manager. So he developed all of us
to this different thing and it's really amazing about and
that's why I'm such a fan of Herb Brooks.

Speaker 3 (01:13:49):
Can I just take a moment to give some love
to Craig Patrick. I'm a huge Penguins fan. He drafted
y Armor, Yager of Guinea Milk and Sidney Crosby and
Marc Andre Fleury. Most of those guys are still playing. Actually,
all those guys are still playing to this day.

Speaker 1 (01:14:00):
Kak Patrick is just the nicest man, and you know,
you know, the Leicester Patrick Award is from his family
and stuff like that. But coaches used to say, I skated,
I bagged our team just like you guys were there
and I looked at him. You don't even know what's
going on. You don't even know what happened there.

Speaker 3 (01:14:21):
Well, that was my coach out out coach Hazelton.

Speaker 1 (01:14:23):
You know, it's really interesting that most people don't know
is Buzz Snyder, Jack O'Callaghan and I didn't even play
that game. And so we were watching this game and
when it ended, he skated everybody and we tried to
go put our equipment on herb would and let us,
so we didn't skate that game.

Speaker 4 (01:14:43):
Well, then there was the famous ten to three beat
down at MSG.

Speaker 2 (01:14:49):
Right before the Boys headed to Lake Placid.

Speaker 4 (01:14:51):
The Team USA was seated seventh out of twelve teams
in pool play. We were in the Blue Division. Russia
was in the Red Division. Yes of course very fitting.

Speaker 2 (01:15:02):
In group play.

Speaker 4 (01:15:03):
The tie with Sweden two to two was big, gave,
you know, kind of galvanised the fans, gave a little
hope that this team's got some juice.

Speaker 2 (01:15:10):
Then the upset of Czechoslovakia.

Speaker 4 (01:15:11):
Seven to three, Norway beat Down five to one, Romania
seven to two, win and then beat West Germany four
to two.

Speaker 2 (01:15:18):
That was the US.

Speaker 4 (01:15:19):
Then over the Soviets were just putting up goals Man
sixteen nothing, beat Japan seventeen to four, beat the Netherlands
Poland eight to one, Finland four to two, Canada six
to four, and then a telling stat just to kind
of show the dominance of the Soviets at this time
in their matchups with the US. USSR had won twelve
matchups from nineteen sixty to nineteen eighty. That was every

(01:15:42):
time they faced the US with a gold differential of
a one seventeen to twenty six.

Speaker 2 (01:15:48):
So it was a little bit of a disparity there, jeez.
But not tonight, not tonight, Not tonight, boys, We already
kind of went over it. But seeing the Russians in
that ten to three defeat before the Games was a
great thing for the team because you got to have
a practice report, coaching against them, playing against them, feeling

(01:16:10):
their speed, feeling their style.

Speaker 1 (01:16:13):
You know, if you ever played golf, would you ever
play the golf tournament without having a practice round. Yeah, no,
you'd have to go see the golf court.

Speaker 2 (01:16:19):
Yeah. It's kind of like the Giants when they you know,
unfortunately they beat you know, the Patriots beat them in
two thousand and seven Week seventeen. I bet you that
game helped them so much, just to feel what it
was like playing against them, getting coaching against them.

Speaker 1 (01:16:35):
So you know, it's kind of interesting Patriots fan. Right.
So you now you got Randy Moss and you got Tom.
Tom never took anything other than what was available. But
sometimes when you have Randy Moss, you say, ft, I'm
going to show him I can do that, right Yeah,
And so that's to me, that's an example when he
didn't manage ego in conflict, right, Yeah, I'll show you.

(01:16:59):
And Randy was show you that we can do this
right and and versus spreading out, because now that's what
he was so famous about, right.

Speaker 2 (01:17:08):
Yeah, Now, what was the game plan after playing them
losing to them?

Speaker 1 (01:17:13):
Well, we knew we could skate with them, right, You
knew you could skate with when we played them at
Madison Square Garden. We should have went out there with
a notepad and pencil and asked them to have an autograph. Right,
we were in that much awe, right, Yeah, I remember
coach saying to me, Jimmy, just going this game. It
doesn't mean anything. You know, you're not going to play
the whole game, right, And so we're playing in the game,

(01:17:33):
and I think it's like in the second period and
Karl Maark comes down and he instead of just pushing
it in the net, he wants to embarrass me even more.
He goes around than that and he's going to step it,
and well, I get up really quickly and I caught
him with my stick right here. It cut him open, right,
even though we put it in next thing, you know,
the whole Russian bench goar. It means they're gonna shoot
in my head. Herb goes, come on, Jimmy, you're out.

(01:17:58):
So you know I didn't play. I think I played
a period and a half of that game.

Speaker 2 (01:18:02):
Need old Jimmy for the the real ones. Shout out
Herb for the force slide on that one.

Speaker 1 (01:18:07):
Yeah, they would have shot on your head. I mean
they were so good it was crazy.

Speaker 2 (01:18:12):
Now, how was herb pregame? Like, was he a speech
guy or did he just give you keys? Did he
raw you guys up?

Speaker 1 (01:18:20):
Never swore?

Speaker 2 (01:18:21):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (01:18:22):
Right, extremely prepared, right, I mean in every detail is incredible.
But the speech that you hear in the movie Miracle
is basically what he did. And he was our confidence,
you know what I mean. They're you know, they're ripe,
they're ready to be beaten. You guys have earned this,
you know all the things. But he never said you're
gonna win. So it's really interesting in words when you

(01:18:43):
pay attention to what actually is being said. There is
a way to beat this team. You guys have the ability,
you know what I mean, But you're not. This is
you're not going to just do this and beat I
mean you got to.

Speaker 2 (01:18:55):
Execute, you got to do it.

Speaker 1 (01:18:56):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:18:57):
Wait, so the movie speech is actually fairly.

Speaker 1 (01:18:59):
Close, very close.

Speaker 2 (01:19:00):
Yes, yeah, Wow, that's badass, Jake. Let's get in the game.
Let's go to like blasted air for this game.

Speaker 1 (01:19:06):
Baby.

Speaker 4 (01:19:06):
We got to start with who's on the call here?
Legendary al Michaels.

Speaker 2 (01:19:10):
Michaels, Yes, rid Man, young al.

Speaker 4 (01:19:12):
Michael back when he had the fro. I mean he
was about twelve years old in this one, but legendary.
This is at Olympic Center eighty six hundred. I think
the the ticket price was like sixty five bucks packed
to the gills.

Speaker 2 (01:19:26):
Soviet's get on the board for ast like five hundred.
That's probably four hundred bucks. Now you think about it,
sixty five then eighty, it probably like three hundred. It's
got to be something craazy.

Speaker 3 (01:19:35):
You say they were selling for three times as much outside.

Speaker 2 (01:19:37):
Yeah, so it's probably a thousand dollars ticket.

Speaker 1 (01:19:40):
Unreal.

Speaker 2 (01:19:42):
So what was the atmosphere like when you took the
Like was it just insane?

Speaker 1 (01:19:45):
Well, the first of all, you got to think the
way communication that everybody just listened to this podcast as
was even available. I mean you didn't even have cell phones, right,
so think about it, you don't even have a cell phone.
So telegrams are or what's it? So our from our
locker room five to the going in is plasted from

(01:20:07):
people who are selling sending telegraphs, telegrams to us, and
they're like incredibly motivating, right beat those call me bastards,
you know what I mean? The one I remember the most,
you know, I mean, I mean, this was much more
than a hockey game. And I I remember this. I
was always the first one out and so as you're
walking and I'm about to step on the ice, I

(01:20:29):
just slip cup and go, man, this is crazy, you
know what I mean, to have that much love from
the Americans and that much hate for the Russians from
the other people that were rooting for us. So you
have the whole whole world rooting for us, right, So
it was pretty amazing.

Speaker 4 (01:20:50):
Back to the back to this first period. Uh, the
Soviets strike first with the crew Toov goal. Then buzz
ties it up for the Americans. Makarov goal, were trading
goals here, down two one. The Americans are then Mark
Johnson that awesome goal right at the buzzer going into
the first break two to two.

Speaker 2 (01:21:08):
Can you walk us through that?

Speaker 1 (01:21:10):
Yeah, it was so, you know, it's really kind of
interesting about this is Tretiak's goal that he gives up
from Buzzy is a bad goal. I mean it's a
slapshot from the blue line off the angle right basically,
So that's a bad goal. So that's that's kind of good.
And then you know, you figure out you play it
till it's over. So I remember the puck's coming back,

(01:21:32):
and I'm yelling the Kenny Moore, I'm counting down, Kenny,
you got twenty seconds, you got nineteen seconds. And so
it's like okay. So every little detail not like okay, good,
we're only down two to one. It's not nothing was over.
And so Mark Johnson playing that through the end, and
the sloppiness of the rebound of Tretiak, the people who

(01:21:53):
even let him shoot it. I mean, there's a lot
of things that becomes very positive for us. Right end
of the period. They pulled Tretiak right.

Speaker 2 (01:22:03):
Now, what are you thinking when they pulled.

Speaker 1 (01:22:05):
Well, he gives he gives up two bad goals. They've
got the second goal. He Michigan has just beat the
NHL All Star sixth then other I think at the
end of the game, we had twelve shots on goal.
You could have put a go could have put a
pee wee goalie in there, you know what I mean.
That's and and what's happening now is Tretiak isn't the
future he was. He he's kind of in the past.

(01:22:28):
A lot of these players now they have a different coach.
And if you look at him. He coaches from the
front of the bench, not the back of the bench,
And they're thinking, you know, I don't need you anymore, Tretiak,
And I'm going to show you I don't need you.
And the rest of your players we got. You got
so many people ready to come take your jobs. You
don't have any idea, and so anybody can beat the

(01:22:48):
United States.

Speaker 2 (01:22:49):
So that was an internal battle.

Speaker 1 (01:22:51):
You think that was a power struggle.

Speaker 3 (01:22:53):
Wow, how did you take that last second goal?

Speaker 1 (01:22:56):
Like into intermission, was like, well, it's going to be
tied too, too to be down to you. You know,
who knows you're ever going to get another goal? You
know the line Brooks gives in the movie is you
score a goal and keep it, keep the puck, you
might not get another one.

Speaker 3 (01:23:10):
Was there a moment for you where you felt like, okay,
we can actually win this game.

Speaker 1 (01:23:13):
Well, see, it's a goalie. You don't think about winning
the game. You think about keeping them in the game, right,
you know, just keeping them close enough that you don't
want to get ahead of him and piss him off.
Right He kind of there's like a there's a nice
balance here, you know, tied where they think they're going
to be in the third period and just go do

(01:23:34):
it what they always do. Good Now the clock. So
when you're a great team, the amount of time in
the game works in your advantage for a really long
time until it doesn't, right, because then it shifts. Now
what happens is, you know, you get late in the
third period, right, you don't have that much time like

(01:23:59):
you did before. Right, Now, what happens everything starts to
ecal up because now you've got to shift against the shift,
and you have a coach and a team that is
not afraid of you. It's going to keep rolling out
all four lines. This guy cuts down his bench, he
goes from twenty players to his best ten. They don't
come off the ice. You've got ten passengers. Now you

(01:24:19):
don't have a team. Herb's roll and these guys through.
Everybody's playing, everybody's involved. And then are used to this
because the best conditioned team in the world at that
time was the United States. Let's go and Herb when
he said he's not looking for the best player's looking
for the right player. Every one of us knew how
to win. Everyone had won a national championship. And when

(01:24:42):
you win a Super Bowl or anything big. You have
to be part of something bigger than yourself. You have
to put your ego check in at the door. It
doesn't matter who it is, whatever your role is, be
thankful and just do.

Speaker 2 (01:24:57):
It right without a doubt, because you know, if you're
fortunate enough to win something at the highest level, you
get humbled and you realize how many things had to
happen for you to do that. Now, what was what
was Herb like in between the periods?

Speaker 1 (01:25:12):
He was great, you know what I mean. So some
coaches can make it nervous. Yeah, right, How many times
have you heard, well, our best players didn't play as
good as their best players. How about your coaching wasn't
as good as their coaching?

Speaker 2 (01:25:27):
Right?

Speaker 1 (01:25:28):
And so Herb, you know, he was our confidence. You know,
he believed in us, which gave us the opportunity to
do you know, some really good things. See. But the
other thing that's kind of interesting right in the US,
So you watch a Canadian type game, if a player
has a chance to shoot it, they just shoot it, right,
So the number of shots on goal, it's it's many

(01:25:51):
times as a guy can shoot the park. The Russians
never shot the puck unless they thought they could score.
So you might play a game against the Russian and
they might score seven goals and they might have only
had twenty one shots, right, But every twenty one shots
was because they really thought they could score. So it's
a totally different mentality. So when you look at the

(01:26:12):
number of shots that they had on goal, it wasn't
to just shoot. It wasn't the North American style of
play where they just say, well we lost, but we
outshot them by this, you know, not even the.

Speaker 2 (01:26:24):
Same game calculated everything. Now, what's up with you? And
you know when Scout was at the game, there's three
people in the crowd. You, you're, your parents, and two scouts.
You played your best game this game, you played your
best game National Championship. You played your best game.

Speaker 1 (01:26:43):
Well you ought to know about that.

Speaker 2 (01:26:45):
Well, I know what I did? What makes you so good?

Speaker 1 (01:26:48):
Well, it's just I think I just love that type
of pressure. Yeah, you know, you asked, why do you
think her picked you? Because that's kind of what it was,
you know what I mean. It's just I getting ready
three days before for it, maybe three weeks before. By
the time the game comes, I've already played it so
many times that that's what it is. I don't have
to I don't even have to worry. I visualized. I
never visualized losing. Never. Never, right. You know, my mother

(01:27:12):
used to tell my brothers to stay away from him.
It's two days before a game, you know what I mean.
But when I got to the room, you know, it's like,
I'm ready to go.

Speaker 2 (01:27:21):
That's exactly, and that's what I say. I always played, really,
I played my best games in the biggest moments because
I treated those moments like they were all the other moments.
But also it was my preparation, preparation, you know. It
was the work I put in before the game, the
visualization of before the game, the going over the tendency

(01:27:43):
reports of what their coverages were on third and three,
third and six, third and ten, plus knowing the play
call before it even came in, because I was so
dialed into my game plan that by the time I
ran it, it was deja vu.

Speaker 1 (01:27:56):
Yeah. Well, and I remember telling you when I went
to and I'd watch you do your steps, and i'd
watch you count them, and I'd watch how high you'd
lift your leg to fool guy and so nobody else
in the sidelines even knowing what goes on unless if
you can see it, you can be it. That's what
I always tell with something right, without a doubt. Yeah,

(01:28:18):
and so the part that was really interesting is, you know,
I knew if a left wing came down off the
left side that he was going to shoot across his
body eighty six percent of the time, right, and that
I didn't guess. But I was better prepared. You know.
Then I learned how to break my body down into
four separate parts, right, so that this side would only

(01:28:38):
move or this side would only move, or this bottom
would only move. But I would you know, really you know,
really be in balance.

Speaker 2 (01:28:45):
Yeah. Wow, Now how was the crowd going in this
this during this whole game? What was the crowd energy? Like?
Third period? Third period?

Speaker 1 (01:28:54):
I didn't listen to the crowd.

Speaker 2 (01:28:55):
See, I never heard, never heard a word.

Speaker 1 (01:28:58):
Yeah, just I just but I I knew that I
wanted them to shoot more on me. I didn't want
knock them to shoot on me, you know what I mean.
I wanted more shots.

Speaker 2 (01:29:06):
Why you wanted to make more blocks.

Speaker 1 (01:29:08):
I wanted to be in the game.

Speaker 2 (01:29:10):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:29:10):
I didn't want to be standing there and say, oh
my god, you know, come on, keep it calling just
keep going, Come on.

Speaker 3 (01:29:15):
Thirty nine shots, that's in the game.

Speaker 4 (01:29:17):
Yeah, speaking of more shots, the second period was was
like sixteen to three. The Russians out shot us H
and we got a goal that puts them back ahead.

Speaker 2 (01:29:27):
That's the that's the goal.

Speaker 1 (01:29:29):
Yeah, he faked me out about four times before you
decided to put it in. But I remember, I was
so pissed off at Billy Baker because he's lugging up
the side and he should have got the puck in
and he didn't. They stole it. They caught him out
of a break. I had no time to get set.
This guy's coming at me a million miles an hour
in the net. I'm picking that.

Speaker 2 (01:29:50):
But you you short memory. You got to get back
into it.

Speaker 1 (01:29:54):
Yeah. I always tell people, how would you like a
job that every time you made a mistake, right, a
big red light went on. Right, they took you a
mistake and put it up on the scoreboards. They said,
who scored the goal, who helped him score the goal,
what time they scored the goal, and if you missed it,
they showed again on the jumbo truck. Right. So you
got to have a different skin.

Speaker 2 (01:30:11):
You got it. Life of a goalie life of a goalie,
which are very you know, goalies like kickers, like pictures.
They're always a little on their own. They're in their
own world, you know what I mean. Just you have
to be a different kind of psychology makeup to be
a goalie. I bet.

Speaker 1 (01:30:29):
Oh yeah, I'm a Gemini. My wife likes one of me.

Speaker 2 (01:30:32):
Yeah, so am I too.

Speaker 3 (01:30:34):
She was a Gemini. We don't like either of them.

Speaker 2 (01:30:38):
Speak for yourself, brother, walk us through the third period.
Johnson Mark Johnson ties it up to.

Speaker 1 (01:30:45):
Mark Johnson is just a great player. You know, when
you think about hockey IQ or your football IQ, his
IQ is off the charts, you know what I mean. Uh,
just a little guy too, I mean not big, you know,
but just a fabulous player. What he did is he performed,
you know, and that's why he was Magic Johnson. Before

(01:31:06):
Magic Johnson was Magic Johnson. That's what we always say
to him. You know, the real Magic Johnson is Mark Johnson.

Speaker 2 (01:31:12):
Heh yeah, freaking Mark, that's the right baby shout out. Now,
what about the go ahead goal by Mike Well.

Speaker 1 (01:31:21):
You know, it's really funny. Is a lot of people
don't know the story, but you know, Mike had worked
so hard all all his career to get to this opportunity, right,
and you know, the threats to him being cut were
really real. They're gonna bringing Neil Brodn's brother or somebody, right.
And so here you have a Buzzy Snyder who his
nickname was the babbitt Rabbit because he was so fast, right,

(01:31:44):
but he couldn't go for a long time. Right, So
here in this game, and all of a sudden you
got Buzzy the Babbit rabbits going around the rink like twice.
He's out of gas. He's yelling left wing, left wing,
and nobody's ready. Mike jumps out over the boards, comes
into the play late Pavlets is on a stick and boom,
it's a goal.

Speaker 2 (01:32:05):
Wow.

Speaker 1 (01:32:06):
You know, I don't know if you're a fan of
the Vikings, you know those things. But destiny, you know,
I really think that was Mike's destiny.

Speaker 2 (01:32:12):
Talk about let's go, let's go seize our own opportunity.
I see it. I'm out. That's kind of like when
West would get knocked out over the middle. I'd be
putting up my fucking chin strap going out there, and
the guy would shake it off. I'm like, would have
had some opportunity. Now you guys are up in the
third period, you go up, you get the two unanswered

(01:32:36):
last ten minutes. What's going like, how are we feeling?
What are we doing to keep ourselves mentally in the game.
You were talking your first two minutes or your first
five minutes of each period's huge your last two minutes
of each period. This is your last ten minutes against
the Soviets. What's the mindset going to this?

Speaker 1 (01:32:54):
So it's really kind of interesting. Is when I started
the game, I would tie everything up to slow them down,
to give us a chance to get in. So if
I had a chance to tie the puck up, I
would tie it up. Last ten minutes is I didn't
tie that puck up at all, kept it going, kept
it going. Didn't want them to realize there's only ten
minutes left. Oh my god, there's seven minutes left. And

(01:33:16):
so before you know it, they had guys on the
ice doing two minute shifts right, and because their egos,
you know, I've done this, will do this. I'm the guy.
We're going to stay out there. Almost like to me,
what I was saying to you would Brady, I want
to throw it to Moss because I can't. Right, well,
these guys going to and so the last ten minutes
of the game is you'll hear Brooks say play your game. Well,

(01:33:39):
I'm doing the same thing is keep it going, keep
it going. If you ever watch at the end of
this game, the clip of just before El Michael goes
do you believe in miracles? And that puck's going around,
we got ten seconds that you notice that nobody ties
that up, right, that's because I'm screaming, don't tie it up,
don't tie it up. They'll get a whistle, they'll get

(01:34:01):
a face off, they'll get another guy on then it
Now it's about executing them there that they're in panic mode. Right,
So the really end of the game was a strategy
of don't tie the puck up, where the beginning of
the game was slow the game down.

Speaker 2 (01:34:15):
Now do you practice the situation? Is that like something
for me?

Speaker 1 (01:34:19):
That's a feel, that's a feel, you know, because.

Speaker 2 (01:34:21):
We practice for minute offense they call it. Yeah, So
whether a team's up or teams down, how are you
going to be getting defensive calls from them? Do you
have to Are you trying to eat the clock? You're
trying to score like that's a specific situation we used
to practice. I was just wondering, do you guys I don't.

Speaker 1 (01:34:38):
Think at that time, Like you know, I'll watch a
game in the National Hockey League and somebody said, well,
you know, look that's say they're going with me, and
I'd say, well, he made that say because he didn't
tie it up, you know, and he should have tied
it up back there. So you know, everything is situational.
So for me, I try to have high hockey IQ
in the goal and say, you know, do we want

(01:35:01):
face sauce? Well, if if you're if you play lacrosse right,
and your sentiment is the best one in the in
the thing, you want to have face sauce because that's
how you can unscore a goal, right, But if your
guy can't take face sauce, then you don't want them right. Well,
at the end of the game, we don't want them
to know how much time it is because you can

(01:35:22):
feel that they're in panic mode. Their coach has lost
the bench, the players are now going to do what
they want to do. They don't having a rhythm to them.
We got a nice rhythm going on, and I don't
want us to know that there's very little time left,
you know what I mean. I wanted to run out
on them before they know that the.

Speaker 2 (01:35:38):
Hell you keep them keep the energy up, so last
last minute. You see, it's the last minute. It's trickling down.
You're probably getting more and more intense, more and more
focused when it when the clock hits zero. What's the
first thing that comes to your mind?

Speaker 1 (01:35:56):
My mother?

Speaker 2 (01:35:56):
Yeah, it's badass.

Speaker 1 (01:35:58):
Yeah, No, I started immediately. You know, you can see
that thing in the stands of me looking for my
father is because I wanted to show respect. The opportunity
that I was given was because of my mother, right,
And so even though she wasn't there, she was there,
right and for my father not to give up after
losing his spouse for that many years and to be there.

(01:36:20):
And ABC had moved my father, see, so he wasn't
where he should have been. They moved him for television.
I didn't know that about he had heart attack. They game.
It was pretty intense, right, So I'm trying to find it.
But no, immediately my mother and you know, it's funny
jewels and honestly, got truth is I saw everybody in
that moment who you know the first time I played

(01:36:41):
with the Bears, and the guy who's from the community
gave me rides, and I saw all these people that
kind of like flashed through for this journey that I
was fortunate enough to be on, through their sacrifices.

Speaker 2 (01:36:54):
That's what people don't realize. It takes. Takes a whole
lot of people for you know, every one of those
guys that were on the ice, and everyone has a
different situation, but there's a lot of people in those
camps that you know, your old coaches, your old Oh
my god, that's pretty awesome that you've thought about those
people that helped you get to where you're at.

Speaker 1 (01:37:14):
Your mom, I got to share this one story. Right,
we're going out. We're gonna be playing the Russians, right,
and so you've got the Secret Service around, and you
got all these uh these New York State troopers, right,
and all of a sudden, the State comes and goes, hey, god, Jimmy,
what you know. I'm silly because I always had the
first seat ready to go out, right. So he goes, listen,

(01:37:36):
there's a guy out here. His name is Andy Filey.
He says, he's your goalie coach from bu and he's
got his daughter. They don't have a ticket. What do
you want to do? I said, get him in? So
this just before the game. But he drove all the
way up from you know, looking crazy Lynn Mass to
be there.

Speaker 2 (01:37:53):
That sounds like someone from Lynn Mass. Yeah, we'll just
take our chances on it. We'll go up there. They'll
get us in. That's Lynn Mass, got us baby.

Speaker 1 (01:38:00):
Lynn City has said you never come out the way
you went.

Speaker 2 (01:38:05):
We all know if you've been in Boston. Now, what's
the biggest misconception of about this game?

Speaker 1 (01:38:11):
That our team wasn't as good as it was? I mean,
you know, the Americans hadn't made the NHL yet, so
there's a lot of really great players on that team.
Our team is a really good team.

Speaker 3 (01:38:23):
Do you believe in the line like doesn't line of
the movies like Tonight, You're the greatest team in the world.

Speaker 1 (01:38:27):
He believed it, you know what I mean? Yeah? And
you know, if you go back and listen to some
of the words, because I'm a word guy, you were
meant to be here, this time is yours, you know,
And and he was setting a mindset up for people
to believe, right, And you know, I always tell people. Uh,

(01:38:48):
the impossible becomes possible when you believe, right. And and
to me, you know, when I prepared for my work
and I came up with that quote, it was because
that's how I felt from this man.

Speaker 2 (01:39:03):
Yeah, we were down twenty eight to three. I was
just continually saying, you gotta believe.

Speaker 1 (01:39:11):
Well, you know, it's so funny my signature that I do.
I believe believe. But it was funny. We were watching
this game. My family and I were over. My sister
wants to have a party. They were over there and
people now aren't paying attention to the game, and I'm saying,
you know the patios, I'll play them. They just everything
went wrong and so anyway, I'm I leave. I said

(01:39:32):
to my wife, I gotta got idea. I'm going home
on the watch this game. This is still a game, right,
And so I remember calling my son, huge, huge fan, JD. Right,
and I said, JD, it is not over. They need
to score in their first position, and you know, it
kind of went over there, drop a third down and
you know what I loved, and this is the winning

(01:39:54):
underdog because you asked me to explain that when that
prick that owns the place came down and started celebrating
a little bit beforehand. It was like, you, come on, guys,
you can't let this guy do that. You know, you
just can't let this guy do that.

Speaker 2 (01:40:07):
Right without a doubt. I mean, there was a lot
of people on those sidelines.

Speaker 1 (01:40:11):
So I gotta tell you a fun story. So bursh rights.
My son wants to meet Tom right in the absolute
worst way, right, So we kind of get this thing arranged.
And so I'm on the sidelines and Birds come over
and he goes and my son's right beside me, and
he gets to go out and my son starts coming.

(01:40:31):
He goes, no, no, you can't come. So I go out
in the middle. I'm talking to Tom. Feels good as whistle.
He's slipping around, going back and fucking back, and Jad's going,
what happened? What just happened? I go, JD, I have
no idea, you know what I mean. So I don't
think my son's ever forgiven me for that.

Speaker 2 (01:40:48):
Oh tell him my parents. I played on the team
for twelve years. My parents never went on the field one.
So wow, that's just how it was. Yeah, you got
to be an Olympian or something to get on that field. Crazy, right, crazy,
Now locker room after the game, boys are having fun.
What are you guys drinking?

Speaker 1 (01:41:08):
Myself and Mark Johnson was taking in because you have
a drug test. So they always go to the person
that's in their mind, I guess would be the high
performing person. And so the guys to celebrate, we're sitting there,
we're trying to drink beers and so we can take
a leak, you know what I mean. And so it
was really funny. But yeah, you know what's interesting is

(01:41:32):
when herb got this coaching job. You had the US
you know, US Hockey, and if you watch the movie,
how they all questioned whatever else he did? Right, So
when the game ends and we win, you know, you
got want the Vice president's in there and we're on
the phone with the President of the United States and

(01:41:52):
all these guys who doubted her at the beginning, Who
is the part of that committee? Try to commit her with?
Get out? You wouldn't let him in? Hell?

Speaker 2 (01:42:01):
Yeah, I love that fucking when he was right, man,
he believed in it, leaven the system.

Speaker 3 (01:42:07):
Man.

Speaker 2 (01:42:07):
I just I mean, you guys still had another game,
so I'm I'm sure it was hard to really really celebrate,
but once it was over and you guys finally got
the gold after the next match. That that relief and
all the grind, the grind that you did for six months,
the eighty eight games or sixty games you guys played

(01:42:27):
in three months. Like anytime we won a super Bowl,
it was almost like the relief and like you you're
just so yes, you're excited that you won, but the
job was done. It's more of that, we got the
job fucking done, and that's like and there's no more
pressure for that year. So like that's when you feel.

(01:42:48):
That's like that the happiness that I felt out of
our championships were the job's done, we got it done.

Speaker 1 (01:42:55):
What was well? It was that specifically, but there was
such a whirldwind and we were in such a bubble.
We really didn't know what was happening. And then everything
happened so quickly, all of a sudden, these guys you've
been with forever, you'll never see again, so would you.
You know, no team's the same every year, but you
have a you've got a nucleus of the guys you're
gonna come back and see you've got a contract. This

(01:43:17):
is over right, and you know and now you're going
to go to different teams with different expectations, and you're
going to be competing each other, and not everybody is
rooting for you. It will never ever be the same.

Speaker 2 (01:43:28):
Never be the same, never never, Yeah, is there like
a group chat between the guys now, where like here is?

Speaker 1 (01:43:34):
You know, you know it's so funny is you didn't
have permission to appreciate what you did because we weren't
established in the National Hockey League. And and you know,
I remember I'd go to every town and after every
interview would be there and I'd be sitting with Hall
of famers on the team, and people would come up
and ask for my autograph, and I'd be so embarrassed

(01:43:54):
that I would sign it and I would just give
them back, and then they'd get pissed that I didn't
hand it to everybody. Oh something, I don't want this,
you know what I mean. And so it was very,
very uncomfortable.

Speaker 2 (01:44:04):
I can only imagine. And it was on tape. So like,
who'd you call after the game because there was a
two hour delay, right, Well, let me explain it for
our fan.

Speaker 3 (01:44:14):
So this game was famously not broadcast live, broadcast live today.
It was a whole thing. So the game happened at
five pm Eastern. It played on national television at eight
pm Eastern, so there's a three hour gap.

Speaker 2 (01:44:28):
So did you call anyone?

Speaker 1 (01:44:30):
Everybody who meant anything? Was there?

Speaker 2 (01:44:32):
Everyone who meant anyone? Who's there? Yeah, that's all that matters.

Speaker 1 (01:44:36):
And you know what it's I agree. I remember after
we win the gold medal, it were at Lake Placidic.
Have you ever been to Lake class I haven't. It's
a little teeny village. It's crazy, it's it's uh, it's
where you go to fulfill your dreams Now, I am
in that going there. I mean, it's it's cool place. Right.
So we have myself, Arizione, Jim Lampley, Jim McKay, and

(01:45:01):
we're walking down Main Street and it's snowing and there's
just you know, people around you. So you're in the
middle of snow and that you got this chant, Usa Usa.
Now do you know where that chant came from? No,
we're playing against Finland in the Olympic Games. It's Finland's

(01:45:21):
winning two to one, and two part time firefighters from
Lake Blassett get in the game and it's quiet and
the Olympics haven't even started yet, and they start the
chant USA. And so the chant Usa was started by
two firefighters from Lake Blasa.

Speaker 2 (01:45:38):
Yea, let's go that rocks. I can't I can't even imagine.

Speaker 1 (01:45:43):
And now you think about the chant and you know
how it's used and you know, to be have those
guys that you know remember agents buy flags, they give
it to people. Now they tell them where the were it.
They know a camera it's going to be on. The
flag that was draped around me came from guy's house.
He brought it from an addict from you know where

(01:46:05):
his father or something was in the war, you know
what I mean, didn't sell them there. So you see
all these flags. This is patriotism. This is this is
like you.

Speaker 3 (01:46:13):
Know where that flag is now?

Speaker 2 (01:46:15):
Yep, you still have it.

Speaker 1 (01:46:16):
Yep.

Speaker 2 (01:46:18):
That's awesome. You know what, like I can't even imagine.
Like football, we we don't get to ever represent our country.
You know, they got the they got the flag coming
in which if flag was going while I was playing
in my prime, I would have jumped over in the
flag leagues just to try to get that. Just because
of that chant you're getting to go out and compete

(01:46:38):
for your country.

Speaker 1 (01:46:39):
But that the other part. Now the game the Olympics
have changed because now you have professional athletes, which I
the Olympics. When we played the Russians, that's what they did.
They basically were a professional, but they didn't have an option, right,
so it isn't like they could come over and play
and then we could only represent. So guys that were

(01:47:00):
or on our team made a sacrifice not to turn
pro to choose the Olympics. None of these professional athletes
have to do that anymore. Hey, listen, I'm gonna wait
a year before i go make all kinds of money
because I'm gonna play any Olympic games. And then they
argue about whether they're gonna wear the Nike Swish because
that's who's paying them. And I'm not gonna wear the
Olympic thing. It's like and I'm not going to stay

(01:47:22):
in the village because that's not good enough for me.
And you know, I'll go if I get TV rights
so that I can be you know, it's lost the
meaning of what these games are. And you know, I
in a lot of the speech that I do, I'll
show a photo of people countries at the games and
they'll say, you know, the USSR here, USA is here,

(01:47:44):
There might be in another country there, And I'll tell people,
look at that photo, what do you say? And you
know a lot of people will think, well, these are
Olympians preparing to win a gold medal. I got no.
Some are there and they're just happy to be there.
There are preparing to compete, but some are there are
preparing to win. And it doesn't matter. It's life. It's

(01:48:07):
really what it is. You know, some people happy to
say I played in a Super Bowl? Who would be
happy with just playing in one? You know what I mean?
I mean that's when we're trying to describe what a
winning underdog is. It'd be like, are you kidding me?
I had that opportunity and I didn't take full advantage
of it. That'd be crazy. And that's the discipline that

(01:48:31):
teams have that have great locker rooms have. They don't
let those players not get ready. Yeah, you know, it's like, hey,
you know, you better be ready.

Speaker 2 (01:48:40):
We might need you without a doubt. Everyone's got a role. Yep,
what's the Aftermac Jackskie?

Speaker 4 (01:48:45):
Yeah, put a bow on this game? The USA one
four to three. Jim save thirty six of thirty nine shots.
Mark Johnson two goals, Mike Ruzioni with the game winner,
and then, as we mentioned earlier, the US would go
on to beat Finland for the gold medal.

Speaker 2 (01:49:01):
The whole system was, It's a whole We.

Speaker 4 (01:49:03):
Could do a whole episode on how kind of confusing
convoluted the whole tournament setup was. Jim would finish as
the tournament's top goalie, saving with a save percentage of
point nine.

Speaker 2 (01:49:15):
To one six. Let's go baby.

Speaker 4 (01:49:17):
The Soviet Union would go on to women next two
gold medals in eighty four and in eighty eight. Thirteen
members of this team would go on to play in
the NHL. Jim played for the Flames of Bruins and
the North Stars. Yeah, this one's iconic, Baby.

Speaker 2 (01:49:33):
What's the best perk you got from being a gold medalist? Especially?
I mean the perks that you got from this. You
guys defeated the Russian you guys saved the Cold War?
Like this is this is a different kind of perk
than like now.

Speaker 1 (01:49:46):
So we flew on Air Force one, that's how was
that incredible? So first of all, it's a political thing
now to bring a team into the White.

Speaker 2 (01:49:59):
House without it, doubt I went to twice.

Speaker 1 (01:50:02):
So it wasn't with us. So all of a sudden,
Herbs telling us, hey, guys, you know we're out celebrating.
We're in blue crush the lord sweatsuits. We haven't shaved
in thirteen days. Right, We've got nothing. Everything's packed, right,
And so Herbs says, tomorrow morning, sixth thirty am made us,
you know, at the in the hotel, right. And so
one of the guys goes what for? He goes, how

(01:50:23):
because the President of the United States and the first
lady had invited you to the White House, right, And
we go, shit, what are we gonna wear? Right? So
we stayed up all night. We get there, and all
of a sudden we get on this bus and this
bus takes us to this little teeny airport in Saraenac Lake,
and there's an airplane waiting for us. But it's no
dy airplane, it's Air Force one.

Speaker 2 (01:50:44):
Jesus.

Speaker 1 (01:50:45):
So I get up and they put me in. I
sit right in President Kardi set where he sits there, right,
and we take off and all of a sudden, this
marine in perfect shape comes up to me. He says,
mister Craig, I go yes, He goes, is there anything
I can do for you? I said, this surely is
What's that? I said, I'd like to call home and
tell my dad where I'm at.

Speaker 2 (01:51:03):
Now.

Speaker 1 (01:51:03):
The cell phone hasn't even been in vent. I'm a
wise ass from Boston. I think it's pretty funny. Next thing,
he walks up the aisle of air Force one has
this great big box, and he says, what's your telephone number?
So I tell him next years and of couse, the
phone's busy. My father's telling the whole world that his
son and nineteen other guys and want to gold medal.
So I go, oh darn, And the guy the marine says,

(01:51:25):
no worries. Next thing you hear is a mister Craig,
the White House operator, your son would like to speak
to you. My dad goes, got that shit. You know
you never believed it, but you know, uh, that was
that was a pretty cool thing.

Speaker 2 (01:51:37):
Wow, that is awesome? Is it? Food good?

Speaker 1 (01:51:40):
Yeah? Because Carter said, hey, Jimmy, is there any special
meal you can get from me? I said, yeah, lobsters.

Speaker 2 (01:51:46):
Let's go from Boston. What do you expense lobster? That
is awesome, coolest piece of Rebelia's that you got from that,
the flag, maybe the flag that you got.

Speaker 1 (01:51:57):
Flag is awesome. I have trad X goalie stick that
he played in Wow, which was really kind of cool,
you know, But I have the memories. That's the greatest thing.

Speaker 2 (01:52:11):
I have, without a doubt. Let's score the game, gre
This's got to be the greatest upset in the history
of the not for me to say, I think it is.
For me, it is, I mean just because of the story.
And it's probably he doesn't want to hear that because
they probably thought they were the best team. But with
the stakes, with everything that was going on in like

(01:52:32):
the unfairness of the Russians getting to compete for fucking
like thirty years together, these are the teams like twenty
eight year olds pros. That's crazy to me.

Speaker 3 (01:52:41):
Do you think USA will ever win a gold medal again?

Speaker 1 (01:52:43):
Well, they don't even underdogs anymore. I mean, the USA
hockey players as good as anybody, and we got more people,
so I would expect they certainly should.

Speaker 2 (01:52:54):
Right, what's your thoughts on US hockey right now?

Speaker 1 (01:52:57):
The great players and winning something that big, you have
to have a group of guys that are willing to
do what it takes to win right, and you know
that's going to be interesting on how it is. But
from a talent standpoint, they're not underdogs anymore.

Speaker 3 (01:53:22):
The development program probably came out of what you guys
did and all the interest and they make that.

Speaker 1 (01:53:26):
Well what it's really interesting the USA Hockey only because
Dave Ogan is a really good friend of mine, and
you try to run USA Hockey a nonprofit and you
start to understand how you get the money. Well, they
started getting the money for that program from the National
Hockey League, who gave it to the Canadian program. So
the US program had to get better in order to

(01:53:48):
get more money. And so that's where a lot of
the money comes from, right. And so the greatness about
this game now is people are playing it everywhere. And
what I love and I think what our team really
helped was with women and ice hockey and how great
those women players are, which is just such a great thing.

(01:54:08):
You know, made everybody want to be a hockey.

Speaker 2 (01:54:11):
Player without a doubt. It's great. That's great the game
and he left over questions.

Speaker 4 (01:54:16):
Jackie, Jim Kyler and I were arguing about this a
little bit earlier, but after the dust settled and he
got the gold medal.

Speaker 2 (01:54:23):
Was there ever a moment where you and her bellied
up to the bar and shared a beer together?

Speaker 1 (01:54:26):
Oh?

Speaker 2 (01:54:27):
Yeah, yeah, baby.

Speaker 1 (01:54:29):
You know, every relationship is based on the need of
the person you're having that relationship with, you know, And
I would venture to guess that your relationship would just say,
Belichick is different now than it was when you were
playing a doubt, Yeah, and how you can help him now?
He's probably more vulnerable than he would have been if

(01:54:50):
he was your coach, right, So it's yeah, you know.
I just always think that your life is full of
different chapters of your life, right, And as I said
to now, is mind now as a grandfather, it's like
the greatest chapter. Right. But the part that I think
is important is you want to write these chapters. You
want to be in charge of these chapters. Right. You
don't want to try to live from the past. And

(01:55:13):
so people might say, well, you make a living out
of what goes on. No, I spend a ton of
time being relevant and taking what I've learned in business
and in life and from being a parent and make
it useful and try to provide people with tools. And
you know, one thing I always say to people, you
never tell people what you to do, right, Because to me,

(01:55:34):
when somebody tells me something, that means I'm not smart
enough to understand what they think is right. I like
to invite people to think differently, right, be curious, right.
And so it's really kind of interesting. And so when
I watched your show and how you guys prepared, and
I saw all the work that's going to be done,
you know, as part behind the scenes or on the scene,
it was really interesting to me. Right, And I've got

(01:55:56):
some ideas for my own business from seeing what you
guys do.

Speaker 2 (01:56:00):
Oh, you need someone to produce and we got a
production company. Yeah, no, I got it all right, let's
name the game. Do you have any specific names for
this game? Where is Miracle on Ice? Pretty good?

Speaker 1 (01:56:10):
I think that's about it.

Speaker 2 (01:56:12):
Just making sure, just making sure. Is this the greatest
game of all time? Let's score it. Jim steaks zero
to ten Decimal's okay? The stakes of this game that
technically wasn't the final, but a huge bump in the
road to get to the fight.

Speaker 1 (01:56:29):
Yeah. So I mean if you don't you know, it's
like if you don't win, you don't go on, right, Yeah,
So you know, I'll tell you a story where we're
after the first period, after the second period of the
game against Finland for the gold medal, and we're losing
two to one. Well, we've gone from the underdog to
the favorite. The whole place is bulling us, right, you know,

(01:56:53):
we've gone like, hey man, you'd be the rest, You
could beat anybody, right, and it's no, you can't. Right.
So it just shows you'll fickle the thing is and
how strong the players were.

Speaker 2 (01:57:03):
To be able to stay focused without a doubt.

Speaker 1 (01:57:07):
So, am I supposed to give a number to this number?

Speaker 2 (01:57:09):
One to ten Decimal's okay, Jim, So this.

Speaker 1 (01:57:11):
Is gotta be a nine point eight.

Speaker 2 (01:57:14):
I like that. I would say a nine point eight two.

Speaker 3 (01:57:18):
Jack with a nine point four I had a nine
point I mean we have.

Speaker 2 (01:57:21):
The Cold War, Okay, this is goddamn Russian.

Speaker 3 (01:57:23):
Countries on the line.

Speaker 2 (01:57:24):
The star power of this game zero to ten decimal's okay.

Speaker 1 (01:57:29):
Well, so the star power is lopsided, right, So it's
it's more Russians and then there is the unknown, right yeah,
So I mean it doesn't get any bigger star power
in the particular sport that you're dealing with. So you
know that's gonna be really up there too, So give

(01:57:50):
that a nine to five.

Speaker 3 (01:57:51):
Nice some hall of famers from both sides, her Brooks
Hall of Fame.

Speaker 2 (01:57:55):
I'm going eight point nine.

Speaker 1 (01:57:56):
But the other part is they would have been Hall
of famers. They just couldn't have.

Speaker 2 (01:58:00):
Yeah, they probably all would have been Hall of Fame.

Speaker 1 (01:58:02):
So here's something kind of interesting, right. So there is
the Hockey Hall of Fame, and then there's the International
Ice Hockey Hall of Fame. Right, Well, I am fortunate
enough to be an international I Classic fan. You would
never be able to get in there now unless you
are a superstar in the NHL and the other ones.
But so when you look to the star power the

(01:58:23):
people on that Russian team, every one of them is
in the International Ice Hockey Hall, which is higher than
the Hockey Hall of Fame. So when you're looking at
their their credentials is pretty high.

Speaker 3 (01:58:34):
Put a number on a bunch of fucking legends. Yeah,
that's crazy Jack Jack's number. Seven points there.

Speaker 2 (01:58:40):
I went with the I was kind of the Russian
judge here, if you will.

Speaker 3 (01:58:43):
I had an eight point one.

Speaker 2 (01:58:45):
The gameplay of the game, the back and forthness, the
entertainment value for the the viewer as a player, your
gameplay zero to ten decimals.

Speaker 1 (01:58:56):
Okay, well, I gotta believe from everybody who's ever told
me it was like they were, they were like absolutely ontense.

Speaker 2 (01:59:05):
So it's a ten edge of your seat all games.
I'm going, without a doubt, a nine point two point
two jack.

Speaker 1 (01:59:15):
And I don't want to have it overrated because it's
the game I played in.

Speaker 3 (01:59:19):
I usually give people ship for overrating games they played
in the Miracle on Ice.

Speaker 1 (01:59:25):
When I look at gameplay, I'm not talking about me.

Speaker 2 (01:59:27):
I'm talking about just a game in general, and the
name of the game, Miracle and Ice. You're actually grading
the name of the game and the cultural.

Speaker 1 (01:59:35):
Impact, cultural impact, cultural impact. So is it two questions
or is it one?

Speaker 2 (01:59:42):
It's one just the name of the game.

Speaker 1 (01:59:45):
I don't think the name of the game does it
justice because I don't really think it was a miracle.
I like it, So the name of the game, for
people who don't know what the work and things have
put in would have ranked much higher for me. But
it wasn't a miracle, so I don't know what else
I would call it. But I'll give that a seven.

Speaker 2 (02:00:08):
And for me, I'm not a hockey guy. I became
a hockey guy when I went to Boston and started
living around a bunch of hockey dudes and worked out
with hockey guys. But I knew what the fucking miracle
and ice was. That is a nine point two.

Speaker 3 (02:00:23):
I gave it a teen jack with a perfect ten,
perfect ten.

Speaker 2 (02:00:26):
All right, let's clip it up. Let's see. This could
be a high ranks. This could be This is gonna
be high, baby, This could be the highest honor of
the games.

Speaker 3 (02:00:32):
We buckle up nine point one six.

Speaker 2 (02:00:36):
Where does it go on all of our games that
we've done.

Speaker 3 (02:00:38):
It's fourth, just ahead of the Snowball game two thousand
and one AFC Division around Patriots versus Raiders, and just
below the Malcolm Butler game Super Bowl forty nine Seattle
versus Patriots.

Speaker 2 (02:00:48):
This isn't a Patriot bias podcast either. If you if
you see the top five games, only a little bit
so fourth not bad, that's insane. How many games have
we done now?

Speaker 3 (02:00:58):
Seventy seventy eight?

Speaker 2 (02:01:00):
I believe seventy eight games.

Speaker 3 (02:01:01):
These are all are seventy good place for it?

Speaker 2 (02:01:05):
Is this our no, this is our second, This is
our first Olympics, first Olympics. Wow, did we miss anything?

Speaker 1 (02:01:12):
Now, you guys are great. You guys have done so
much homework and your intentions are good. There's not a
show like yours. It's special. Right, we appreciate thank you
to commend you for that because it's not easy. It
takes a lot more work, right.

Speaker 2 (02:01:30):
You know what this know where this came up out
of Kyler. He was we were all talking right before
Thanksgiving around this time. We went down to the local
He went to his local bar, and some guy came
up to him and he's like, you play on this
high school team. Remember this one game, And nothing's more
fun than talking about historical games with people that were

(02:01:53):
in it or involved with it, and then scoring the game.
So it's it's a fun thing. And we that that
means so much the people right here, you see these guys,
well you just said.

Speaker 1 (02:02:04):
Listen, I've done this for a long time. Right. There's
always hidden agendas, right, there's always about ratings, and there's
there's quick ways to do it, and there's right ways
to do it. You guys are doing it the right way, right,
and you'll get more people who come on because you're

(02:02:25):
doing the right thing. And so your name matches up
to what you do, so it's impressive.

Speaker 2 (02:02:30):
We appreciate going from you.

Speaker 3 (02:02:31):
That means the world, and I just want to take
over one second. I'm a Massachusetts kid. I played hockey
my whole life, like I went to high school when
the miracle came out, like this game means a lot
to like the Massachusetts hockey identity. And just thanks for
being here because I really appreciate it.

Speaker 2 (02:02:45):
This was this is gonna be huge. Thank you very much.

Speaker 1 (02:02:48):
I've always wanted to meet you, so that's even more cool.

Speaker 2 (02:02:52):
I feel like we've kind of met. We've rubbed shoulders
in practice.

Speaker 1 (02:02:55):
But you know how, I just remember the one time
you know, sit with Dyll you need to dry this
EFFI soo okay, So I don't know if you remember this,
but I go in I'm speaking, and so Tom is
right in front of me, and Jimmy Garoppolo is right here.
And this guy, Rick Kimbo is really good friends with
the Brady's because he flies Tom's dad in to see
all the games. This guy brought linked in publics. He's

(02:03:16):
got all kinds of money, right, So I go, Bill,
So you know what can I do? You know how
hard do you want this to go? Do you think? Said? Okay?
So I remember I said, hey, Tom, you know this
really means a lot to you because you've been here
now and you have won, and you know how hard
it is, and you know you come from a great

(02:03:39):
family and I know your mom and dad is so
it's really good. I go, Jimmy, I go, what do
you do? Do you bring Tom? Show the bads outside?
And when he's on a TV thing, stick a head
in so people go look it? Or are you preparing
to take his job like he did Drew blood cells.
That's how I started the thing.

Speaker 2 (02:03:55):
I remember that now.

Speaker 1 (02:03:57):
And then the other product that was really fun is
I remember saying how many how many people here are
rookies and you know they all raised you know, all
these people get up and raised here, and I go,
you're not rookies. You're New England Patriots. And the expectation
that Belichick has for you is not of a rookie
because rookies make mistakes and he's not going to have you.

(02:04:19):
You're a New England Patriot right the other day you
were a rookie, but you made this team today. And
so the mindset that I always felt that you guys
had was the matter. If you're a rookie, you're a
teammate and you're expected to do your job, and if
you're put in there, you need to execute and there's
no excuse for it. I don't give you a rookie.
I don't care if you're hurt. I don't care if

(02:04:40):
you're tired. Right, So it's really kind of interesting.

Speaker 2 (02:04:43):
No, yeah, that was I do remember that because everyone
didn't know if you could like laugh or like oh uh, you.

Speaker 1 (02:04:53):
Know, it's funny. Is there's teams that you coach, and
sometimes there are teams that you can only make. A
football team is so big you can't coach that team.
You have to manage that well.

Speaker 2 (02:05:05):
You got to rely on your individual coaches. It's a
true team. Yeah, you can't micro man like. That's why
you know. Bill's also great at that.

Speaker 1 (02:05:13):
I go, so it is bratty like the team shit. No, no,
we can even understand how he gets it, you know,
does what he does. He didn't mean he would do it.
Then he would say Slater was the guy, or Slater
is the guy.

Speaker 3 (02:05:26):
We've got his in Halo over here.

Speaker 2 (02:05:27):
Yeah, he was my I lived with Matthew Slater for
four years. You know, we bunked up before we had money.
Go check out Jim. I mean you're gonna probably see
him at a business talk or something. Thank you so much.
We appreciate you coming. We'll be right back after this
quick break. Man, I just wanted to just go scream

(02:05:49):
USA for the next two days. All timer can't do
games with names.

Speaker 4 (02:05:53):
We can't be on the search for the greatest game
of all time without doing miraquan Ice.

Speaker 2 (02:05:57):
You can't. That was unreal, unreal.

Speaker 3 (02:06:00):
That should have been higher.

Speaker 2 (02:06:02):
Should Yeah, I do feel a little embarrassed at our
top four fucking Patriots games.

Speaker 3 (02:06:08):
Yeah, you gotta start texting non Patriots people.

Speaker 4 (02:06:10):
I know who van Oi KVN Baby, he's still had
that balling.

Speaker 3 (02:06:15):
I think almost cried like three times that episode. But
like man as like a Massachusetts hockey guy, Like that
was just fucking surreal, sharp guy.

Speaker 2 (02:06:24):
Yeh knows that, Like he's really taking his time and
his experience, and he's even said he even said it
to reflect and he's very thankful for everything that has
happened in his life. And I really can I really
liked that and that was really refreshing for me. You know,
because sometimes it doesn't matter who you are in your

(02:06:46):
life or what's going on. You could have everything in
the world. Sometimes you don't feel great about what's going
on or this that when you sit next to a
guy like Jim Craig, it make you feel great about
ship sandwich you're about to eat.

Speaker 3 (02:07:03):
Hey, who knew so close with coach Belichick?

Speaker 2 (02:07:06):
I know. Crazy.

Speaker 3 (02:07:07):
As soon as you said then Tucket, it's.

Speaker 4 (02:07:09):
Like, oh yeah, yeah, yeah, what do you say to
Boston College?

Speaker 1 (02:07:16):
Right?

Speaker 2 (02:07:16):
Broking like a true area based So Boston College is
like at that time was better than be you.

Speaker 3 (02:07:22):
They're both.

Speaker 2 (02:07:23):
That's crazy, I think for a Catholic guy guy.

Speaker 3 (02:07:26):
Yeah, bus a little bit or B's a little bit more.

Speaker 2 (02:07:28):
Wow, that's man. That was fucking awesome. That was all time.

Speaker 1 (02:07:33):
Man, that was all time.

Speaker 4 (02:07:34):
And it feels nice to be the glazy and not
the glazers. Sometimes itels pretty nice. He was glazing you
collective glazeslazing out in the best way possible. I think about,
you know, every time my daughter orders a donut, she's
like that, my favorite is a La donut.

Speaker 2 (02:07:52):
Do you believe in miracles? That is such an iconic answer, sane,
it's not a miracle. Okay, work on ie yah, hardwork
on ice, hard work on the same ring to it.

Speaker 1 (02:08:04):
I don't know.

Speaker 2 (02:08:05):
But because I'm Al Michael's iconic fucking miracle call, I
think we should go relive some of the other greatest
iconic sports calls. Yes, in the history of the game.
Starting it off. Who wants to start this, bad boy?
I'll start it off, all right?

Speaker 3 (02:08:21):
All right?

Speaker 2 (02:08:22):
Down goes Fraser, Down goes Fraser, Down goes Fraser. The
heavyweight champion is taking the Mandatari eight count. And then
that was epic bro. That is Howard Cosel from the
nineteen seventy three Heavyweight Championship Fraser versus Foreman when Foreman

(02:08:42):
knocked down Joe Fraser and then went on to win
in a second round. E Ko, Down goes Fraser.

Speaker 4 (02:08:50):
And that's an whole time like that one just pops
up in random conversations, no matter what.

Speaker 3 (02:08:56):
Do you think, if Fraser didn't go down, we get a.

Speaker 2 (02:09:00):
Like Frazers Hobbleders hobbled. I wonder, I wonder we got
to that's a whole nother wee could maybe be a
Frasier Grill. Maybe they would go after him instead. It
was supposed to go to Hulk. I think the story well, yeah,
he's probably hating that.

Speaker 4 (02:09:18):
Yeah, the story was, I think his son was sick
at school, so Hulk missed the phone call to go
pick up his son Nick from school, and then they
ended up sticking Hulk.

Speaker 2 (02:09:26):
With like a grill. Yeah it was it, Hogan grill.
We should have I guess.

Speaker 1 (02:09:30):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (02:09:31):
Wow, man, that that the stranglehold of the Foreman grill
had on American household.

Speaker 2 (02:09:37):
It is incredible. Frozen patties I put on that thing.
Oh my god. College, Oh my god. And I think
it was so dirty when you had it in college.

Speaker 3 (02:09:50):
You're a little Thank god that low.

Speaker 2 (02:09:54):
That's the next one you got, The next one I got.

Speaker 4 (02:09:56):
You got to get this next one from Kevin Harlan.
All right, shall I do this one? This is a
long one.

Speaker 2 (02:10:02):
It's a long one. That's why I'm not going it.
Oh boy.

Speaker 4 (02:10:06):
This one is from a Rams forty nine Ers Monday
Night football game twenty sixteen. There's eleven thirty four left
in the game. The Rams are in Levi's Stadium playing
the forty nine Fortyners are hosting.

Speaker 2 (02:10:18):
They're up twenty one.

Speaker 1 (02:10:19):
Nothing.

Speaker 2 (02:10:20):
This has been like bad game.

Speaker 4 (02:10:22):
Overall, it's just like kind of boring, nothing much going on,
punt fest, blowout, as we can tell by the score
of twenty one nothing, and a man runs onto the field.
Kevin Harlan with an iconic call, Hey, somebody has run
out on the field. Some goofball and a hat and
a red shirt. Now he takes off the shirt. He's
running down the middle of the of the fifty. He's

(02:10:42):
at the thirty. He's bare chested, banging on his chest.
Now he runs the opposite way. He runs to the fifty,
he runs to the forty. The guy is drunk, but
there he goes the twenty. They're chasing him. They're not
gonna get him, waving his arms, bare chested. Somebody stop
that man. Oh, they got him. They're coming from the left. Oh,
they tackle him at the forty yard line. That was

(02:11:03):
the most exciting thing that happened tonight. The man is drunk,
but there you go, like it's just so good that
normally they cut away from this and the NFL wants
nothing to do with it.

Speaker 2 (02:11:14):
The broadcast wants nothing to do with that. You can
still go in the official NFL YouTube page and watch
this clip.

Speaker 3 (02:11:19):
This is a radio. This is a radio broadcast.

Speaker 2 (02:11:22):
Yeah, the man is drunk.

Speaker 3 (02:11:24):
Man is drunk, start showing.

Speaker 2 (02:11:27):
I don't know why a show. It's fine, it's probably
never know because if something that And then also there's
gonna be one of these times some crazy happens, maybe
titty out a d L. I gotta say too.

Speaker 4 (02:11:42):
I'm a streaking purist, baby, you gotta let you gotta
hang on baby.

Speaker 3 (02:11:45):
Oh yeah, you can't just put your shirt behind him?

Speaker 2 (02:11:47):
Yeah, come on, then you're just a jackass. Be a
real streaker.

Speaker 4 (02:11:51):
I have prideate baby, I'm an old school, old school goy.

Speaker 2 (02:11:54):
Got you want to get what? I don't know either,
you'll mean it.

Speaker 3 (02:11:58):
I want ah.

Speaker 2 (02:12:00):
I like the Kirk Gibson. That's a Kurt Della Russa
was named after him? Was he really? Yeah, Kirk, I know,
but his dad wanted it different. But it was named
after Kurt or kirk oh sacks fighting on deck? But
that game right now? Is that that fight? High fly
ball to right field? She is gone, folks, and then he.

Speaker 1 (02:12:23):
Man.

Speaker 2 (02:12:23):
The situation here was Dodgers Athletics World Series Game one,
nineteen eighty eight.

Speaker 4 (02:12:28):
LA trailed four to three. Kirk Gibson kids. Kurt the
pinch hit with a three to two count, two outs
man on first. That's like the situation you always drop
up in the backyard.

Speaker 1 (02:12:39):
Hurt Kirk.

Speaker 3 (02:12:40):
He'd been bobbled.

Speaker 2 (02:12:41):
He could barely run. Got hurt the series before this,
you know, he was like a fucking crazy three sport athlete.
I heard he was like an insane football player. I
did not know that. I heard he could have been
like a crazy I think he was like a stud stud.
He was a stud. Halick stole the ball. Career put
in a ball of play. Yeah, we gotta gets out,

(02:13:01):
but Havelick steals it. Have Lick stole the ball.

Speaker 1 (02:13:03):
I've Liix stole the ball.

Speaker 2 (02:13:05):
It's all over.

Speaker 4 (02:13:06):
Shout out to Johnny Mose. That's our main man, Hondo
John halcheck that one just I mean.

Speaker 2 (02:13:12):
I just mess up that Hala check.

Speaker 1 (02:13:14):
I think you did.

Speaker 2 (02:13:15):
But it's all gonna be. You're putting the ball in play.
He gets out, but have the check steals it. Have
a check stone the ball, have the check stone the ball.
It's all over. I did it justice. That was awesome.

Speaker 4 (02:13:26):
Game seven of the Eastern Conference Finals nineteen sixty five
six or Celtics the Sea's going to beat quilt the still.
Casey Jones ribbled out the clock in that one. Johnny
most immortalized that call.

Speaker 3 (02:13:38):
I'll do this one fourth and five. The national championship
is on the line. Right here, He's going for the corner.
He's got it.

Speaker 4 (02:13:47):
That's the iconic call from Keith Jackson. Twenty six seconds left.
Texas has the ball, fourth and five from the USC
nine yard line. USC was leading thirty eight thirty three
at the time. This was for the whole kitting kaboodle
O six Rose Bowl USC Texas a game we must
do on this podcast.

Speaker 2 (02:14:06):
We got in this part we Vince Young, Yes, Vince
Young and McConaughey.

Speaker 3 (02:14:12):
That would be epics.

Speaker 2 (02:14:15):
Ready, I got I got got this last one. I
got this last one. All right, you got to do
this one. They get it back now to the thirty.
They're down to the twenty. Oh no, the badness on
the field. He's gonna go into the end zone. He's
got in the end zone. Will it count? The Bears
have scorned the Bats out of the field. There's are

(02:14:37):
flags all over the place. Everyone is feeling around the field.

Speaker 3 (02:14:40):
The Bears is one the Bears have worn.

Speaker 2 (02:14:44):
Oh my god, the most exciting, sensational, dramatic, god breaking, exciting,
chilli finishing the history of college football. The bat is
off the field.

Speaker 4 (02:14:55):
You put your whole back into that one. Oh my god,
eat your heart out, Joe Starkey.

Speaker 2 (02:14:59):
That was awesome. I remember watching this one. I'm not
watching it, but this is I grew up in the
I was just gonna say, how how important was this
in the Bay Area as a legendary game aka the play,
aka the Big Game? You know, considering this was like
what year was this? This was like, yeah, this is
before me, but like everyone around knew this play. Uh

(02:15:21):
not a big college football area, pro sport town, right,
but you know I knew that everyone knew this play.
Everyone knew this play. It was crazy and I lost
my voice from that. That was awesome.

Speaker 4 (02:15:32):
I'll get it was quarterback Ron Rivera was in this game,
and I still don't understand why he had to knockout
and the trombone play.

Speaker 3 (02:15:44):
Here's here's the real question. Let's say you're returning ant
and this happens. What do you what are you doing?

Speaker 2 (02:15:53):
If I'm returning to punt and this happens, I'm using
the guys as defenders.

Speaker 3 (02:15:58):
Like you're like taking the band down like a referee.

Speaker 2 (02:16:00):
Broy, this guy's on. You gotta use the referee as
as a Sometimes you pick a little something. You're using
whatever's on the field. Don't don't get mad at me.
You're the player. People are on the field.

Speaker 4 (02:16:15):
Put them on skates, weaving through them, and that's Stanford band.
You know, there's some there's some wild give.

Speaker 2 (02:16:21):
Those are fun. That was so fun. These are these
are some iconic calls that just like we said, they
elevate the.

Speaker 3 (02:16:27):
Moment and and we can we just do al Michael's
real quick just because we're here.

Speaker 2 (02:16:30):
Yes, yes, do you believe in miracles?

Speaker 3 (02:16:35):
Yes?

Speaker 2 (02:16:37):
I love that one. But I was not tonight by.

Speaker 3 (02:16:42):
I was so happy to hear that how faithful. Most
of the Miracle movie was to Yeah.

Speaker 2 (02:16:48):
Stuff that happened, fucking Disney. Tip your cap to Disney.

Speaker 3 (02:16:52):
That little Craig Patrick story about the springs.

Speaker 1 (02:16:54):
That was interesting.

Speaker 2 (02:16:55):
That was interesting. Yeah, you know what, it wasn't about
putting the boys in developing the boys. I was developing
the coach. Sometimes the coach needs to be developing the boys.
Getting the way of it, Jim Craig watch I fucking
love Jim Craig. What a fucking what an episode. Thanks
again to Jim Craig. Thank Jim iconic man, iconic not

(02:17:18):
like an old bosson accent either, that's true. You can
hear it a little thing.

Speaker 1 (02:17:23):
You know.

Speaker 2 (02:17:23):
He lives in Florida. Now he probably hushes it up
a little, but I bet you get a little Grandpa's
old cough medicine. He sounds like he's from fucking right
out in Southee. I bet back in those are turning
into hrs are turning.

Speaker 3 (02:17:35):
And also shout out to my dad and my dad's friend,
Brian Raymond. I was texting them for a lot of
information for this game. My dad's friend when the team,
when the USA beat Russia, him and his buddy got
in a truck and drove to Lake Placid, the Never Places.

Speaker 2 (02:17:48):
They didn't do anything.

Speaker 3 (02:17:49):
They slept in the back of their truck. They smelt
like gasoline. They able to sneak into the gold medal
not the gold medal game, but the bronze medal game,
and they were there for the metal ceremony. He wanted
me to ask Jim, if you smell gas I didn't
think it was appropriate Let's shout out Brian out shout
out tunk Man.

Speaker 2 (02:18:06):
Well Jim, Jim's goalie coach or what he say he
had is some coach just drove right up. It was
your was your dad from Lynn, Massachusetts like those people.

Speaker 3 (02:18:16):
Not far off the city?

Speaker 2 (02:18:18):
Baby, Hey Lovelynlyn. That was awesome. That's been another episode
of Games with Names. Subscribe on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or
wherever you listen to your podcast. Comment a game you
want us to do and remember, rate and review. Remember
to follow Games with Names on YouTube, Instagram, x TikTok,

(02:18:39):
and Snapchat. Leave a message on the old hotline and
that number is four two four two nine one two
two nine zero. We'll see you guys next week. Games
with Names of the production of iHeart Radio. For more
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Miracle on Ice with Jim Craig | 1980 Winter Olympics: Soviet Union vs. United States

Episode Transcript

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Julian Edelman

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Miracle on Ice with Jim Craig | 1980 Winter Olympics: Soviet Union vs. United States