On personal relationships and recognizing your luck.
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Speaker 1 (00:12):
This week on the Hot Edgy Couple Network. I mean
it's very two is the year of the Hot Edgy couple.
We've had a lot of hot edgy couple news. It's
the Hot Edgy Alternative Couple Network. And a few weeks ago,
Courtney Kardashian got engaged to Travis Barker. Her style has changed.
(00:36):
She's part of a hot edgy couple. Machine Gone Kelly
and Megan Fox hanging out together with Courtney and Travis
founded the Hot Edgy Couple Club. And then Megan Fox
and Machine Gone Kelly joined and the four of them
hang out in this hot edgy couple tattooed musical ault club.
(01:00):
Is a lot of black worn, it's a lot of
sexy skin shown. Uh, it's just really super edgy. And
Kim Kardashian and Pete Davidson have joined the Hot Edgy
Couple Club. They're now members. Kim is wearing black sweatshirts
and leather leggings and just eating pizza and going to
(01:22):
write aid and just with Pete Davidson, who's also tatted up.
If you're not tatted up and edgy, don't call me back.
Kanye and Julia Fox have joined the Hot Edgy Couple Club.
It's like the Hot Edgy Couple competition now because you
got Kanye, But Julia Fox, who's now the new h person.
(01:42):
She's walking and looking at the paparazzi and saying, fuck off.
I'm wearing black dentle fluss out of my pants and
you can fuck right off because I met Kanye last
night at Jiffy. Relationship, went through the drive through, and
we'll be engaged within a fortnite. I'm sure she has
(02:04):
a tattoo. I don't know that she does, but I
mean if she's. If not, she should be getting one
soon because she and Kanye are just coming up. They
did like the Chia pet of Hot Edgy Couple Relationships.
It was like I met you, I plucked you under
your z eve. By Valentine's Day, we're gonna be right
where Travis and Courtney are because we are part of
(02:25):
the Hot Edgy Couple Club and we are coming in
on fuego. So there are four couples that are members
of the Hot Edgy Couple Club. So who's next. Chloe
is now single, She's got to find herself a tatted
out musician. I don't know what's going on with Kylie.
I don't know. She just had a baby, so she
really cannot be eligible for the hot Edgy couple club.
(02:47):
But I mean it doesn't have to be just Kardashians. Obviously,
so many people. But I mean hot edgy couple is in.
Preppies not in. I don't think like you know, wealthy
hedge fund types are in. I don't think like pretty
boy actors are in. I don't think comedians are in.
This is just like edgy hot couple musicians. Well, actually no,
Pete Davidson's a comedian, but he's not he fits better
(03:09):
in like the hot edgy pizza tatted up musician club.
Pete's more of like an outlier in the comedy section,
but still he's a comedian. So who is next to
enter the hot edgy couple Club? I would like to
know because it's a big trend and it's not slowing
down anytime soon. First, Travis and Courtney got engaged, Machine Gun,
(03:32):
Kelly and Megan Fox recently got engaged. I mean as
Kanye getting engaged to Julia Fox by Valentine's Day, or
I mean, I do not believe the Kim Kardashian will
get engaged. I just don't. I don't think anytime soon.
I think she's just having fun. I like this on her.
I like this look on her. I just like she
looks like. I'm a billionaire. I've done it. I've dumbao
everybody's wanting me to do. I played the Fame Game
(03:54):
and I won. I'm in the Hall of Fame of
the Fame Game. I created the Fame Game, I am
the Fame Game. And now I'm doing the thrifty ice
cream pizza game in Staten Island because guess what I won,
and I'm doing it my way. And Megan Fox and
Machine Gon Kelly got engaged and drank each other's blood,
which is very common. I woke up this morning and
(04:14):
instead of chocolate Domona milk, I put Paul's blood right
into that blender with a frozen banana, some protein powder
and some way protein and chia seeds, and I just
drank his goddamn blood because that's what people do. Now,
if you're in the Hot Edgy Couple club, you drink
one another's blood. Get with the motherfucking program. What I
(04:35):
think is that these four couples are founding members of
the Hot Edgy Couple Club just like the Soho House.
They're founding members, initial members, that street cred they belong um.
I don't even know if Kim and Pete Pete Davidson
are founding members. Travis and courtney'r founding members, machine Gun Kelly, Yeah,
I'll give it to them for members. In order to join,
(04:55):
you have to A have a piercing and or attached
to B have some musical talent, be very interested own
your own musical instruments, but be very very interested in
the music world, or very close and adjacent see where
scantily clad sexually provocative clothing d drink the blood of
(05:21):
your partner. Be a member of the Kardashian family. We
are now accepting applications for the Hot Edgy Couple Club.
Apply only if you meet those requirements. Does anybody want
the information on how to join the Hot Edgy Couple Club.
I I'm dating a man from Massachusetts who I do
(05:44):
not believe is eligible for the Hot Edgy Couple Club,
and frankly I'm not eligible, so we'll have to live
vicariously through all of you. My guest today is cam Pagoula.
She is the president of the Buffalo Bills and Buffalo Sabers,
making her the first woman to be president of an
NFL and NHL team. She is also the CEO of
(06:07):
her management company, Pagoula Sports and Entertainment. Along with her husband,
they have become titans in the sports world and are
also incredible philanthropists. I am fascinated by her life story,
from her adoption to her working with her husband to
her groundbreaking role in the NFL. You are going to
love this one and leave this one inspired and maybe
(06:29):
even be a Bills fan. In fact, they just beat
the Patriots in an amazing win, and she knew it.
She just felt it ahead of time. So from an
orphan to being one of the baddest bees in the business.
Kim Pagoula, So where are you? I am in Florida?
(06:59):
I chickened out. I know it's like five degrees up
in Buffalo. Um, but I'm down here in Florida. This
is where we um, It's our domicile. I guess you
could say. So I came here after our regular season
when on Saturday. Nice So where in Florida? Oh? Okay,
so I was going to ask about I just it
(07:20):
jumped off the page reading about you obviously that you
are adopted and your childhood, which I want to get into,
but that you never you wanted to go to Alaska
and you couldn't afford it, so you stayed in upstate
New York. And that sort of really seems to have
navigated your entire life, like it seems to have been
(07:41):
a path that has been very very clear. So could
you tell me a little bit about that? Oh, yeah,
of course. So you know, when after I graduated college,
you know, I was always like I told my parents,
I'm I'm not gonna get married young. I'm gonna like
see the world. I'm gonna do all these crazy things.
And uh, and so going to Alaska, I heard that,
(08:02):
you know, you could go there and make a lot
of money, um, working in a canning factory or some something,
you know, much more than minimum wage. Here, a whole
new place. My my girlfriend and I kind of this
grand scheme. Um. I think my parents were really worried
that I actually was going to do it. But I
actually met somebody that is not my husband, UM, a
(08:22):
few weeks before that before I pulled the plug on that,
and so UM, I ended up working for my husband. Um,
and the rest is history. So yeah, those little life
decisions that you don't you think are meaningless when you're young,
sometimes do kind of, you know, give you a path
through the rest of your life. So how many years
(08:43):
ago was that? That was thirty? Okay, okay, So who's
your husband and what was he doing then? And and
then let's get into that because we're working with your
husband is one thing. Working with someone you're dating and
and marrying them and then being partners in this way
is very interesting, your partners in everything. So let's talk
(09:06):
about that for a second. Oh, yes, yes, definitely. So
my husband and I my husband's name is Terry. Um,
we are eighteen years age difference. So I have kids
that are older than when when Terry and I met.
So we I met when I was twenty one and
he was thirty nine. Wow, that's that's that's I didn't
even know that. That's that's controversial. Back then, well and
(09:28):
back then thirty years ago, it was it was you know,
I wasn't seeing a lot. Now you see a lot
especially here, especially here in Boca. You see a lot
of that in Boca. Yeah, But but back then, and um,
you know, my my, my family was a little bit worried.
He was divorced, had two children, um of his own,
(09:49):
and had his own business. Um, yet about I say,
seven employees at the time when I met him, And UM,
I think there was you know, my family very conservative,
very faith based growing up, and so the idea of
of young and I was the only girl in the family,
and so the idea of me dating someone uh that
(10:10):
was that much older who's already divorced, has kids, plus um,
the you know, the age difference in the fact. Then
you know, I started working for him at the time.
UM didn't go over all that well at the at
the beginning. Um, but again, it's been such a great journey.
Like I said, his business was oil and gas and
that was in Pennsylvania and that was about you said,
(10:31):
around seven employees at the time when I came in,
and um, I came in only temporarily. But um kind
of you know, things developed and I choose that path
instead of you know, going to Alaska and and other things. Now,
so he had only seven employees, So he was successful,
but not I guess uber successful you can speak. I
(10:54):
don't know that. I actually don't know the answer. But uh,
were you judged for that. Did you feel you had
to prove yourself because now you're dating someone older who
is successful. Uh so, so how does that all work?
How do you do that without being distracted like doing
it for the wrong reasons, wanting to be successful for
yourself and not just to show everybody? So how do
(11:15):
you navigate that? Oh? All all of that? Um, I
will say, even though thirty years ago it wasn't the
success that the people that know us now, um would
see it as. But but certainly, you know, um, you know,
he was in control of his own life. And you know,
when you're twenty one and out of college, I mean,
your life is is you know, you're at zero right um,
(11:35):
trying to find a job, forteresting or sending out all
your your resumes everywhere. So certainly, and as I said,
the reason I wanted to go to Alaska because you know,
I want to see the world, want to see you know,
I have whatever, have a career and do all these things. Um.
And then I ended up settling really you know, locally, um,
in this small town where his business was. Um. Of course,
(11:59):
you know, when when I came to work for him,
I started out at that point he was doing some
investor relations. So he was drilling oil and gas wells
in Pennsylvania, but then was raising funds um for that,
and so I was kind of his like marketing communications
lays on and and at that time that really wasn't
even a role that most you know, companies, especially one
(12:19):
of his size, really had. UM. But yeah, I would
be you know, I would be plotting charts. You know,
back then computer and iPhones and all this stuff. Technology
was not it was not as big, and so I
would be you know, hand plotting charts. I would be
taking out the garbage. I'd be doing basically, you know,
kind of whatever was needed um at the time. And
(12:41):
so of course I never wanted to say no because
to your point, you know, you're just trying to kind
of prove yourself and making sure that people realize, well,
you know, I have some value. It's not just the girlfriend, um,
you know, because say probably wasn't easy. But UM, but
you know, I I grew up where I had a
really good sense of myself, UM, and I think that's
(13:03):
where it really you know, I don't want I don't
know if it's confidence, I don't know, it's just UM,
had a good set of really core values that I
felt like, okay, as long as I felt I was
doing the right things for the right reasons. Um, then
you know what others perceived of me was. Um, you know,
I didn't really care. I do remember that he had
(13:23):
a friend which we've lost touch long time ago, but
he he bet us that we would not our relationship
would not last. Um, I think for like nine months.
That are you know at that he beat us like
a trip somewhere, exotic trip somewhere, that our relationship wouldn't
last nine months. Um. So going on, let's see twenty
we're at twenty nine years now, we certainly beat that. Odd.
(13:47):
Did you get the trip? No? We lost touch, and
you know that's annoying. Tell me it was you a trip.
That's ridiculous. I don't like that. I would I'll take
the trip. I'll call him up and tell him you
said you'd give it to me. I get the trip.
The funny part two is, uh, Bethany is you know
I'm wife number two? Right? So there's you know, obviously,
I know divorced unfortunately is commonplace now, but even thirty
(14:10):
years ago was more of an up and coming trend.
You know, he was married for seventeen years beforehand, and
I thought at that time I was like, oh, my gosh,
how do you beat seventeen years of marriage from you know,
someone else? And so that was kind of like another
thought that was a little bit more. Um, I guess,
I guess me. But um, but you know, like I said,
(14:31):
we're at twenty nine right now. So but when that
day came, when it was like when we hit our
seventeenth anniversary, I was like super excited, like, oh, that's
so nice. Seventeen I moved from from from wife number
two backup to wife number one. That's amazing. And yeah,
and you didn't need to work, you chose to work.
That says a lot anyway, Um, how did you both
(14:53):
get into owning sports teams? And? Um, for example, I
know I've met Robert Kraft. He told me about he
and his wife decided to get well. Actually, no, he
came home and told his wife he had bought the
Patriots and it was for not a big number considering
what sports teams are worth now, and I think she
(15:14):
was probably nervous about it, but it ended up being
an amazing investment. It used to be sort of that
owners did it sort of like owning horses is like
a passion project, but it wasn't necessarily a business unto itself.
I also know Steve Cohen who owns the Mets, and
you know, it's a whole juggernaut business. So I'm sort
of interested in that. What made you It used to
(15:35):
be a vanity project and not not a business in
my opinion, and it's really a major, major business now.
So how did that whole thing get started? And I'm
my correct or, Am I incorrect? No? You know what,
you're correct, And I think it's like with anything in life,
you know, a little luck and timing also goes along
with it. Um at that point where my husband had
(15:56):
sold his business, and you know, we took maybe a
year off, but you know, we're not people that just
consider around and and really do nothing. And one of
the things, you know, even the first day I met him,
Um he was a season ticket holder. Um he was
a hockey fan of the Buffalo Sabers at the time,
and um we would that would be day night as
(16:17):
we drive up and his his kids used to live
in Buffalo as well, so going to Buffalo, Um was
a you know, it was a weekly thing. And then
especially attending UM hockey games at that time going from
where where were you coming from? We were in a
town called only in New York, which was about maybe, UM,
I'm gonna say, an hour and ten minutes south of Buffalo.
(16:37):
So you guys are small town people ultimately people. Yes, yes,
interesting um and so UM. So we were always attending
UM sporting events, especially hockey games. And then at that
time really is when the Bills kind of really made
their big UM Super Bowl runs the four years so
so football UM, you know obviously big in the Buffalo
(16:59):
western New York area. UM. And so you know that
was always you know, part of us really starting out
just as a fan. UM. And then when you know,
we were like thinking, okay, what are we gonna do
with the second half of our life? UM he you know,
we said, wow, we always want to own a sports team,
and so we actually bought the hockey team first, okay,
(17:19):
and then at that time when we bought the hockey team,
there was actually a rule that the NFL no longer
has where you're not allowed to have to UM, you
can't have two professional teams UM that are not in
the same market. So meaning that the only team that
we could because we already had the Buffalo Sabers in
the National Hockey League. The only team football, if we
(17:41):
ever want to get into football, was going to be
in Uh. So you add, literally you could only buy
one team in your own hometown. So it's limited choice.
The rule no longer exists, but it did at the time. Um.
And honestly, back then, you know the bills. Um. You know,
we did not think about the Bills when we bought
the hockey team, but then after we bought the hockey
(18:03):
team and we were spending more time up there, and
then of course kind of that whole um, the idea
kind of came to light, and especially with the passing
of the previous owner who had only been the owner
of the team since inception. UM. So we you know,
we really set to ourselves, there's only thirty two of
these teams, like this opportunity is, especially one that's in
(18:24):
our current market that we could um only comes you
know once in a lifetime, if at all. Um. And
so we decided to make the jump. And I do remember,
you know, my husband saying to me, though, like listen,
we we both have to be on board. And I'm
gonna need you to be you know, to be a
big part of this because I can't do this myself. Um,
(18:46):
and so he Actually it's a lot of work. My
friend Alex Cohen works on the Mets, works on the Mets. Funday,
it's a job for her as much as I mean,
it's a big it's a lot of work. So it's
most people probably think it's just like a cute thing.
Oh I on a sports team. It is a business.
You know. Usually you know, the wife just gets you know,
isn't really into the operations of the team. Um, Usually
(19:08):
it's more of the husband. Um. But I remember him.
I remember we were talking with our attorneys and our
cowins and talking through some of the legalities, and you know,
they said, well, okay, how do you want the ownership
to be split? Um? Do you want to be pent
terry or how does the how does it between the
two of you? You're saying, yes, yes, how do we leave?
Let me how hold on? Before you get there? This
(19:30):
is an interesting question because without being sensitive, it sounds
like you guys are going to be together the rest
of your life. So you're out of those woods. But
back then, how many years ago is that? Oh? So
that was what about eight years ago. So eight years ago. Okay,
so you're not talking about a professional sports team, so
it's an asset. So you're having like sort of it's
sort of like a pre nup of a sports team
(19:50):
conversation in the middle of your marriage. So explain. So now,
I just wanted to frame that that way because it's
you're not just the cute little wife. It's going to
help out. You're now a partner in this team. So
that is interesting. Yeah, And when we bought the hockey team,
we were we were in a I don't know why,
we were trying to get it passed through pretty quickly.
So one of the ways that we did that was
(20:11):
just because my husband had the quote bigger asset because
of um because of the company that was in his
name beforehand. And so even though I had worked at
the company for I can't since I met him, um
for multiple years. Um He So the hockey team actually
ended up being in his name, A hundred pisette, right,
no issues. I honestly didn't really care um Oka, and
(20:34):
so when actually the football came around, I just assumed
that that was going to be the same. And my
husband's like, no, just let's make it fifty fifty. Um.
It was his idea. And you know what to me,
like you said, we're gonna be here together for the
rest of our lives, and we had already gone through. UM.
You know what I thought at the time was the
bigger Um Hampson in our marriage. And so I didn't
(20:55):
think anything of it. I didn't realize until it got
Paul Black that that was a big deal. Um. When
we had you know, when it got announced that we
had purchased the Buffalo Bills. Um, and there was at ownership, UM,
you get viewed so much differently. You get really you
get viewed as the partners, so you're baller. He became
(21:17):
a boss bitch baller even at the even at the
league level. And there's only really one controlling owner. Um,
who has to have you know, thirty percent of the team. Um,
so he is the controlling owner. But um, but because
of that fifty fifty kind of ownership, like you know,
I am, I am there all the time. I mean
(21:37):
I deal with the league. They view me as as
owner even though I'm not. Like I said that, you know,
we've got two representatives of the club. Um. But that
was a big deal. Um, and I didn't I didn't
think of it at the time, but it really was
a big deal to the outside world. Um. On the
ownership there, am I allowed to know numbers just so
(22:10):
people can understand how the business has changed. What it
was purchased for, and what it's worth now that's all
public information. Yes, we purchased it for yes probably, Um,
we've purchased it for one point four billion back in
h I believe, okay, And what's it worth it now?
It's worth what someone's gonna pay you for. So I
actually I don't know what that is. But based on
(22:31):
other teams like what it teams like that getting now like, um,
you know what. Honestly, Bethany, I hate to say because
I really don't know. I don't know either. I'm not
like baiting you into something I don't actually. In terms
of our market um, and you know part of the
history of the team itself, Um, we're we're called the
bottom quartile among the other clubs. So in terms of
(22:52):
market sise, revenue things like that, Um, we're we're at
the bottom. So our value probably is a lot of
difference obviously than say the Cowboys or the Patriots, due
to the championships that they've had as well, so in
the city that they're that they're in. So honestly, I
really can't tell you a number. But do you think
it's a great business? Do you feel like it was
a good business purchase? Has it been a successful business
(23:15):
for you? Oh? Um? Oh no, I definitely. I remember
when at the time, you know, everything was done and
we we had a company, Allen and Company that was
kind of negotiated on our behalf of the deal, and
you know, everything was set, but but you know the
price right, like it's a blank line. Okay, what is
your actual bid? Because this was really a bid process,
(23:38):
so you're biding against other people and um, and it
was just like okay, And I remember, you know, I'm
saying listen. At at one point too, we feel that
um and this is you know, Allen and Company. This
is kind of our representative saying um. At one point too,
we think, you know about we're present sure that you'd
(23:59):
win the bid. At at one point too, at one
point for we're a hundred percent sure you're going to
win the bid. Um and and we said, you know what,
I'd rather go with the odds of a and so
you know, I guess, you know, somebody say we overpaid
at that time, and I do remember. Unfortunately he's no
longer with us, but Bob mcneir, who was the owner
(24:21):
of the Houston Texans at the time, was one of
the league's owner that we had talked to in this
whole process of buying a team, and he said, you know,
I know you're gonna whatever you bid on it, you're
gonna think that you spent way too much money. But
I will tell you that in a few years you
realize you did it. Um And he was, and he
was right, Well, that's an interesting investment style. So you're
(24:43):
talking about a lot more money than the people listening
have to spend. But I remember I purchased a house
in the Hampton's years ago, and I had an accepted
offer and I didn't know that much about residential real
estate then and I didn't know anything like I know now.
Was the second purchase I've ever made. And um, I
had accepted offer, and we didn't get the contract in
right away. And of course that real estate broker, because
(25:04):
they can be the most challenging people in the world,
business wise and ethics wise, shopped the house to other people,
using my my offer as you know, as a stalking horse,
and they came back and said, this other person is
willing to pay, and I think it was like two
hundred and seventy five dollars and I was furious. I
(25:25):
was emotional. I didn't want I'm not doing this because
I felt taken. I didn't like that feeling. But I
remember my friends saying, in several years, if you think
the house is amazing and you think it's great value,
in several years, you're not going to remember that money.
And that was a lot. That's a lot of money.
But it's totally true. The house is worth probably two
and a half times or two and a quarter times
(25:47):
what it was worth then. So sometimes you can't. You
have to not be emotional and so literal about these
business decisions if you know, you got to make quick decisions,
and you can't think that way. So it's the very
small version of what you're talking talking about. But I get, well,
you know, the Hamptons is it is a you know,
there's only so many homes in the Hampton's right, it's
such a desirable place. And same with you know, an
(26:10):
NFL club, there's not that many of them, they don't
always come on the market, and I could, like you know,
I said before, timing, um and a little luck sometimes
you know, has to go away. I don't think that
anyone who has been successful can say that it was
all just based on on work. I mean there was,
there's always a little bit of luck and timing that
goes with it. But it sounds like decisiveness too, So like,
(26:32):
for example, um and having a little bit of courage.
I had another place in New York City, and to
your point, I thought the place was amazing and it's
sucked potential for a renovation, and it was I said
full price, I'll pay. I didn't make an offer. I
just said i'll pay. I didn't want to risk there
might have been nobody else looking at it. It It was
a very problem apartment. But when you want something in business,
(26:55):
you can't play around, because if it's something like the
team for you in one town where you only have
one choice, or if it's an apartment, or if it's
a business deal, sometimes you just have to say I
have to have the courage to just make the decision
right now and know the value, and that is worth
about more now. So those decisions can be good, it
(27:18):
can't be penny wise and dollar foolish. Well, and you know,
I am a big advocate of sports, whether it's it's
not just in professional but whether it's you know, when
you're little, in high school college. Um, my oldest daughter,
our oldest daughter, Jesse, is a professional tennis player. And
so we have kind of really spent a lot of
our married life, um in that sports realm Um. We
(27:39):
before that, we used to be a partner in in
a football agency where we represent the clients. Um. So
we you know, we uh we donated um hockey uh
an arena at Penn State, my husband's alma mater. So
we have always been involved in the sports aspect of it.
So again you know where like you said, opportunity, the
passion that we half for sports, um, the timing of everything,
(28:03):
and then again being fortunate to you know, all the
hard work um we thought was done, um when building
up the business that we were able to sell to
provide us the resources and buy the football and the
hockey team. But um, but yeah, not realizing a lot
more work was ahead of us. But um, but yeah,
(28:24):
I totally agree with you on that. Well. So also
it's it's on brand. You're involved in sports, you're involved
in your community, you're involved in What I mean is
it's on brand that everything you're doing is sort of
in that area where you grew up, where you have roots,
where you know people, where you know who to trust,
and you're you're trusted there and your that's your community,
(28:46):
and it's all on brand to sort of be in
all aspects of sports, and your philanthropy is connected to sports,
because it's okay to make whatever your philanthropy is connect
to your business. Meaning it's just not all you're adhering
to the line and all of it is on brand,
it's cohesive. You're not just choosing to to to make
(29:08):
a difference in a charity that has nothing to do
with everything else that you do, because then it's more
easier for people to understand the narrative of what you do.
I feel, yes, no, definitely, And listen, you know, obviously,
I do think that when you're doing charitable giving, um,
that it does lend to what you're really passionate about
and saying that has a meaning for you. UM. And again,
(29:29):
like I said, because of of what we've seen in
experience raising an athlete of our own and and the
folks that we have. Um. And I've seen firsthand, like
if if you come to a game, I mean I
I just I have so many memories and experiences of
of what football, what hockey, what's even sports? Um does
to bring a family together, to bring friends together, to
(29:52):
bring a community together. It's part of the American way
of life really. But yes, as an individual, you know,
seen a firsthand the intangibles and the importance of health
and wellness and taking care of your body, things that
you know, when I was younger, I never thought of like, um,
but you know, athletes these days just how important it
(30:13):
is to them. So um, I'm a huge advocate that.
You know, sports is such a you know, a positive
influence and many in so many ways. And it crosses gender,
acrosses age, acrosses communities. UM. So I mean that's just it.
It's easier to to celebrand, as you said that you're
(30:34):
passionate about do something where you can really have an impact.
I used to donate to several different charities, thinking that
was good to spread it out, and then someone said
to me, you should be focusing on one thing where
you can really create the most impact, and we've done
incredible things with disaster relief all over the world. So
I I agree, and that's on brand for me too.
It's sort of like pulling a quick business together and
(30:55):
just executing relief, uh, you know, a relief effort in
no time. So let's talk about your childhood a little bit,
because that jumps off the page. I mean, you definitely
(31:17):
did not have a traditional childhood. You don't have a
basic story. So it sounds um scary and a little
lonely and and you must have had so many questions
growing up. So can you describe, um, your upbringing, your
start to this crazy life. Yeah, so my crazy life
(31:38):
um um. So basically, I you know, was born in
South Korea, um, and was adopted really by this actually
a set of a Canadian family who I moved to
the U. S Um. My adoptive parents actually had to
become US citizens in order for for them to adopt me.
And if you you know, we talked about thirty years ago,
(32:00):
but you know we're talking way way longer. Uh. You know,
you didn't have emails, and you weren't like you know,
I didn't have phone calls and your cell phone and
all those things. And so my parents, you know, wanted
to adopt a girl from from South Korea or actually
they I think they just wanted to adopt anybody. And uh,
and they were mailing back and forth and um, and
(32:22):
so I was actually born in South Korea. I was
left at the doorstep of a police station. At that time,
I'm like, this is Us. That's like the movie show
This is Us, which we're watching with Brent. You know what,
I have not seen that show. It's the same The
guy I was dropped up at a fire station was okay,
all right, I have seen that that show yet. And
I I keep thinking, Okay, I need to binge this
(32:43):
show because I've heard such great things about it. But
again I started, so, don't ruin it for me. Well,
but but but adoption is a big part of it
and in multiple situations. Okay, sorry. So then I was adopted,
and I know I needna go I had before I
jumped back, because I did go to Korea for the
first time since I was born. Um about I'm gonna
say three years ago, and um, and found out some
(33:06):
really great stuff. So I did find out that Okay,
I was dropped off at the orphanage Um, I thought
I was dropped off as a baby, but actually I
was dropped off when I was roughly around four, four
years old, um, and so I had a life before
I got dropped off, right um. And then I was
only in the orphanage for a short period of time.
(33:27):
I think I believe then that usually what the police
would do is they would bring you to an orphanage
and you would stay there for um, you know, like
six months in case the parents came back, right uh.
And so but in order for the me to be
um in the orphanage, as an orphan, um, I had
to have a name and I had to have a birthday,
(33:48):
so they would make one up at four. That's interesting
that it wouldn't. You wouldn't know what your name was before.
I Yeah, I don't. I don't remember. And when I
got dropped off off, I didn't. There was no name,
no address, no nothing, and so they just guessed them
my birthday and they and they made up my my name,
which I did. I found that out like three years ago.
(34:10):
So my god was that. Yeah. So I keep telling
my family that I'm actually a year younger than I
actually am. But but I you know, I but I
my birthday is what I've always celebrated since then, so
it's gonna be hard to change my birthday. But but yeah,
that was an interesting that I won, that I had
a life before I, UM, before I was adopted in
(34:31):
or before I was went to the orphanage. UM. And
then the fact that you know, kind of my identity
as you could saw you could say that most people
rely on is there when they were born and what
their their name was, UM is completely made up by
someone who I have no clue who they are. So UM,
that was an interesting factor that I found out a
(34:52):
few years ago. That sounds emotional, you know what it was?
It was weird. I don't know why I always felt
that I was I thought I was the baby. I
don't I don't know why. I never even never rang.
And I said to my dad because he actually came,
my adopted deck actually came on the trip with me,
and and he said, well, you you really never asked
any questions and we would try to tell you, but
(35:13):
you just you didn't really want to know anything. So
I said, okay, I just you know, UM. But you know,
I think really credit to I think, you know, my
family and my parents had two older brothers UM at
the time, UM of of just creating such a great,
loving home, that UM that just raised me like you know,
(35:35):
like their own and of course you know it just
it UM. And so I never felt the need to
go find my parents, never felt the need to go
you know, I didn't. I didn't have that longing. And
and honestly, and going back to Korea, I had it
so good. Why why would I want to know? UM?
(35:56):
Because you know the life that and and I tell
people all the time, you know, if they asked me,
well what you know, what what is one thing that
you can point to that has led to your success
or to where you are now whatever? And I always say,
it has to be my parents, because they chose me,
UM to be part of their family. And just to
think where would I be now? UM. I did get
(36:19):
an opportunity to go back to It wasn't exactly the
same orphanage, but the same UM company that UM that
did it. And so you know, you saw kids in
that same orphanage that was literally the same situation I
was in, and it was just crazy to think, Okay,
wonder where they will be, you know, in fifty years,
thirty years, UM because you know, like I said, being
(36:41):
adopted is a single most important part of my life
right now. Interesting. It just it put me into uh
complete path that um, you know, I can say I
wouldn't even have the opportunity beyond the path that I'm
at now without the adoption. Wow, that's amazing And just
(37:02):
that because I think my daughter who's eleven, remembers before
four and five. So I wonder if you have flashes
or if you'll be hypnotized, if you'll be dreaming in
some weird flash, will happen. I've had I've talked to
people that because I love health and wellness and kind
of the bio hacking and all that stuff, I'm always
like into that stuff. And I've had people that say, um,
(37:22):
recently something about like you can actually pass on trauma
that you even if you don't remember, through generations, which
I did not realize that that that could happen, but
this that you actually can pass on trauma through generations
and and doing things like you know, hypnosis and and
other you know, rieky and other things can help. But
(37:45):
I don't know, I just have never You may not
want to poke the bear in the zoo. Yeah, I
just I've been happy with my life that I'm like, Okay,
why do I want to invite unknowns? I you know,
I agree no bad will against you know, my birth parents.
Is I have no bad will against South Korea? Or
just so I've been agree I understand that. Like someone
(38:07):
talked about going back because she had to figure out
stuff and she had a lot of trauma and her
life in doing ayahuasca. This woman who was on here,
who's amazing, who's climbed the seven summits, but it's it's
opening Pandora's box, and not everyone wants to do that.
There are many areas in my life where I'm always
nervous to do that because I don't need to go
back and see everything. So I think that's an interesting conversation.
(38:28):
But it's also very television in Hollywood movie to make
it like everybody who's adopted is always just longing for
their long lost parents, and you're an example that that's
not always the case. The last topic I guess is
I guess your partnership overall, it's a relationship partnership, it's
a business partnership. So what are the tenants or you know,
(38:51):
what are the what are the rules and the tips
and the things that you've learned over the years that
make a partnership work in marriage and a long successful relationship.
You know. Um, you're probably gonna laugh. And my kids,
you know, laugh when I when I say that, when
people ask me that question, and I say, and I say,
(39:11):
you know what, agree on what your expectations are of
each other? Before? Um, you know? And and I laughed
my kids and saying, listen, you know, I don't expect
anything from your dad. Therefore I am always you know, surprised.
I'm always excited if he goes over that level of expectations.
But I don't expect, expect, expect it, so therefore I
(39:31):
don't get upset. Um. Now I realized, you know, not everyone,
can you know, put that bar that low? Um. But
I said, well, as long as you guys and and
my actually my oldest daughters got married this uh this year,
And I said that, you know, if you can come
to an agreement and what is expected. If I expected
my husband to be you know, home every night at
(39:52):
five o'clock to take out the trash, to plan this,
to do our budgets, to do you know other things, um,
I would be upset and disappoint in it all the
time and not be happy, um, but knowing, um, but
knowing what I can expect for him, and then um,
when he does something unexpected, it's just a nice surprise. UM.
So I think a lot of times that's what usually happens.
(40:14):
When you know, friends are talking or complaining about their
spouse or boyfriend of things like that. Usually it's because
they're you know, what one expects of the other is
not in alignment. Um. So from a marriage standpoint, I
think that's that's big. But I know people have always
said to me like, oh my gosh, how could you
spend you know, work with your husband, and like you're
all the time you do the same thing. Um. It's
(40:36):
not for everybody, but it really for us. Um, you know.
And I think I'm going to give him the credit
for it because he was older. I'm younger, I can
be a little bit more molded. But you know, he
really said that that expectation of us being partners, even
from day one, even from when I was you know two,
we got I got married at twenty three, Um, even
(40:59):
when I was twenty three years old. Um, that idea
that we were we were partners and so everything he
involved me and everything that he did now was I.
You know, certainly there's other people that he had that
were more experts, whether you're talking legal, accounting, finance, whatever,
but um, but it was never, never afraid to share
(41:19):
all that with me, to have me in meetings even
right now in hockey meetings, football meetings, draft I am
there and um. And he set that tone right from
from day one of being there and I And when
people talk to me, and especially women about being a
woman and a female and a male dominated you know
um area like sports. UM, I always tell them listening, listen,
(41:41):
it's not an opportunity to bashed men because we all
need them in some way and they can be your
biggest advocate. You got to find the right ones. But
I know that my husband has been the biggest advocate
for me and has taught me so many things um. UM.
And really that started with him just you actually accepting
me as as a true partner. UM. No matter what
(42:04):
the percentages are you know, of of anything, it's just
um and wanting me to be in those conversations, in
those meetings knowing the information. UM. Now, unfortunately, there's so
much to do that I don't have time to be
in those conversations anymore and I have to prioritize UM.
But he's, like I said, from day one to even today,
(42:26):
like there's no um you know, like I'm not It's
not that I'm not invited to anything that he is
a part of. It doesn't matter if his football or
if his business or um, whatever it is. You feel
totally respected in your relationship and your partnership. That's amazing. Well,
it was amazing to talk to you, uh and so interesting.
I get to learn so much each time I have
(42:47):
a conversation like this. So congratulations on all of your
success personally and professionally. Well, thank you, Bethany, appreciated being
on the show. And we have a big game this
weekend on Saturday night at a fifteen so um, hoping
for a big one and to continue our playoff run. Fantastic. Well,
hopefully I'll get to meet you in person one of
these days, maybe at a game or otherwise. Anytime accepted
(43:09):
will be five degrees, so you may want to take
another game while go to an away game. There you go. Okay, awesome,
thank you, Thank you so much, Bethany. That was a
really interesting conversation. That's a woman who started with unfortunate
circumstances and is really appreciative of her life and as
managed to have a successful business and personal relationship with
(43:34):
her husband, raise a great family, and just really chooses
to work and chooses to create value as a woman
and be taken seriously. And not that many women owners
OFFL teams, so that's pretty cool.
This week on the Hot Edgy Couple Network. I mean
it's very two is the year of the Hot Edgy couple.
We've had a lot of hot edgy couple news. It's
the Hot Edgy Alternative Couple Network. And a few weeks ago,
Courtney Kardashian got engaged to Travis Barker. Her style has changed.
(00:36):
She's part of a hot edgy couple. Machine Gone Kelly
and Megan Fox hanging out together with Courtney and Travis
founded the Hot Edgy Couple Club. And then Megan Fox
and Machine Gone Kelly joined and the four of them
hang out in this hot edgy couple tattooed musical ault club.
(01:00):
Is a lot of black worn, it's a lot of
sexy skin shown. Uh, it's just really super edgy. And
Kim Kardashian and Pete Davidson have joined the Hot Edgy
Couple Club. They're now members. Kim is wearing black sweatshirts
and leather leggings and just eating pizza and going to
(01:22):
write aid and just with Pete Davidson, who's also tatted up.
If you're not tatted up and edgy, don't call me back.
Kanye and Julia Fox have joined the Hot Edgy Couple Club.
It's like the Hot Edgy Couple competition now because you
got Kanye, But Julia Fox, who's now the new h person.
(01:42):
She's walking and looking at the paparazzi and saying, fuck off.
I'm wearing black dentle fluss out of my pants and
you can fuck right off because I met Kanye last
night at Jiffy. Relationship, went through the drive through, and
we'll be engaged within a fortnite. I'm sure she has
(02:04):
a tattoo. I don't know that she does, but I
mean if she's. If not, she should be getting one
soon because she and Kanye are just coming up. They
did like the Chia pet of Hot Edgy Couple Relationships.
It was like I met you, I plucked you under
your z eve. By Valentine's Day, we're gonna be right
where Travis and Courtney are because we are part of
(02:25):
the Hot Edgy Couple Club and we are coming in
on fuego. So there are four couples that are members
of the Hot Edgy Couple Club. So who's next. Chloe
is now single, She's got to find herself a tatted
out musician. I don't know what's going on with Kylie.
I don't know. She just had a baby, so she
really cannot be eligible for the hot Edgy couple club.
(02:47):
But I mean it doesn't have to be just Kardashians. Obviously,
so many people. But I mean hot edgy couple is in.
Preppies not in. I don't think like you know, wealthy
hedge fund types are in. I don't think like pretty
boy actors are in. I don't think comedians are in.
This is just like edgy hot couple musicians. Well, actually no,
Pete Davidson's a comedian, but he's not he fits better
(03:09):
in like the hot edgy pizza tatted up musician club.
Pete's more of like an outlier in the comedy section,
but still he's a comedian. So who is next to
enter the hot edgy couple Club? I would like to
know because it's a big trend and it's not slowing
down anytime soon. First, Travis and Courtney got engaged, Machine Gun,
(03:32):
Kelly and Megan Fox recently got engaged. I mean as
Kanye getting engaged to Julia Fox by Valentine's Day, or
I mean, I do not believe the Kim Kardashian will
get engaged. I just don't. I don't think anytime soon.
I think she's just having fun. I like this on her.
I like this look on her. I just like she
looks like. I'm a billionaire. I've done it. I've dumbao
everybody's wanting me to do. I played the Fame Game
(03:54):
and I won. I'm in the Hall of Fame of
the Fame Game. I created the Fame Game, I am
the Fame Game. And now I'm doing the thrifty ice
cream pizza game in Staten Island because guess what I won,
and I'm doing it my way. And Megan Fox and
Machine Gon Kelly got engaged and drank each other's blood,
which is very common. I woke up this morning and
(04:14):
instead of chocolate Domona milk, I put Paul's blood right
into that blender with a frozen banana, some protein powder
and some way protein and chia seeds, and I just
drank his goddamn blood because that's what people do. Now,
if you're in the Hot Edgy Couple club, you drink
one another's blood. Get with the motherfucking program. What I
(04:35):
think is that these four couples are founding members of
the Hot Edgy Couple Club just like the Soho House.
They're founding members, initial members, that street cred they belong um.
I don't even know if Kim and Pete Pete Davidson
are founding members. Travis and courtney'r founding members, machine Gun Kelly, Yeah,
I'll give it to them for members. In order to join,
(04:55):
you have to A have a piercing and or attached
to B have some musical talent, be very interested own
your own musical instruments, but be very very interested in
the music world, or very close and adjacent see where
scantily clad sexually provocative clothing d drink the blood of
(05:21):
your partner. Be a member of the Kardashian family. We
are now accepting applications for the Hot Edgy Couple Club.
Apply only if you meet those requirements. Does anybody want
the information on how to join the Hot Edgy Couple Club.
I I'm dating a man from Massachusetts who I do
(05:44):
not believe is eligible for the Hot Edgy Couple Club,
and frankly I'm not eligible, so we'll have to live
vicariously through all of you. My guest today is cam Pagoula.
She is the president of the Buffalo Bills and Buffalo Sabers,
making her the first woman to be president of an
NFL and NHL team. She is also the CEO of
(06:07):
her management company, Pagoula Sports and Entertainment. Along with her husband,
they have become titans in the sports world and are
also incredible philanthropists. I am fascinated by her life story,
from her adoption to her working with her husband to
her groundbreaking role in the NFL. You are going to
love this one and leave this one inspired and maybe
(06:29):
even be a Bills fan. In fact, they just beat
the Patriots in an amazing win, and she knew it.
She just felt it ahead of time. So from an
orphan to being one of the baddest bees in the business.
Kim Pagoula, So where are you? I am in Florida?
(06:59):
I chickened out. I know it's like five degrees up
in Buffalo. Um, but I'm down here in Florida. This
is where we um, It's our domicile. I guess you
could say. So I came here after our regular season
when on Saturday. Nice So where in Florida? Oh? Okay,
so I was going to ask about I just it
(07:20):
jumped off the page reading about you obviously that you
are adopted and your childhood, which I want to get into,
but that you never you wanted to go to Alaska
and you couldn't afford it, so you stayed in upstate
New York. And that sort of really seems to have
navigated your entire life, like it seems to have been
(07:41):
a path that has been very very clear. So could
you tell me a little bit about that? Oh, yeah,
of course. So you know, when after I graduated college,
you know, I was always like I told my parents,
I'm I'm not gonna get married young. I'm gonna like
see the world. I'm gonna do all these crazy things.
And uh, and so going to Alaska, I heard that,
(08:02):
you know, you could go there and make a lot
of money, um, working in a canning factory or some something,
you know, much more than minimum wage. Here, a whole
new place. My my girlfriend and I kind of this
grand scheme. Um. I think my parents were really worried
that I actually was going to do it. But I
actually met somebody that is not my husband, UM, a
(08:22):
few weeks before that before I pulled the plug on that,
and so UM, I ended up working for my husband. Um,
and the rest is history. So yeah, those little life
decisions that you don't you think are meaningless when you're young,
sometimes do kind of, you know, give you a path
through the rest of your life. So how many years
(08:43):
ago was that? That was thirty? Okay, okay, So who's
your husband and what was he doing then? And and
then let's get into that because we're working with your
husband is one thing. Working with someone you're dating and
and marrying them and then being partners in this way
is very interesting, your partners in everything. So let's talk
(09:06):
about that for a second. Oh, yes, yes, definitely. So
my husband and I my husband's name is Terry. Um,
we are eighteen years age difference. So I have kids
that are older than when when Terry and I met.
So we I met when I was twenty one and
he was thirty nine. Wow, that's that's that's I didn't
even know that. That's that's controversial. Back then, well and
(09:28):
back then thirty years ago, it was it was you know,
I wasn't seeing a lot. Now you see a lot
especially here, especially here in Boca. You see a lot
of that in Boca. Yeah, But but back then, and um,
you know, my my, my family was a little bit worried.
He was divorced, had two children, um of his own,
(09:49):
and had his own business. Um, yet about I say,
seven employees at the time when I met him, And UM,
I think there was you know, my family very conservative,
very faith based growing up, and so the idea of
of young and I was the only girl in the family,
and so the idea of me dating someone uh that
(10:10):
was that much older who's already divorced, has kids, plus um,
the you know, the age difference in the fact. Then
you know, I started working for him at the time.
UM didn't go over all that well at the at
the beginning. Um, but again, it's been such a great journey.
Like I said, his business was oil and gas and
that was in Pennsylvania and that was about you said,
(10:31):
around seven employees at the time when I came in,
and um, I came in only temporarily. But um kind
of you know, things developed and I choose that path
instead of you know, going to Alaska and and other things. Now,
so he had only seven employees, So he was successful,
but not I guess uber successful you can speak. I
(10:54):
don't know that. I actually don't know the answer. But uh,
were you judged for that. Did you feel you had
to prove yourself because now you're dating someone older who
is successful. Uh so, so how does that all work?
How do you do that without being distracted like doing
it for the wrong reasons, wanting to be successful for
yourself and not just to show everybody? So how do
(11:15):
you navigate that? Oh? All all of that? Um, I
will say, even though thirty years ago it wasn't the
success that the people that know us now, um would
see it as. But but certainly, you know, um, you know,
he was in control of his own life. And you know,
when you're twenty one and out of college, I mean,
your life is is you know, you're at zero right um,
(11:35):
trying to find a job, forteresting or sending out all
your your resumes everywhere. So certainly, and as I said,
the reason I wanted to go to Alaska because you know,
I want to see the world, want to see you know,
I have whatever, have a career and do all these things. Um.
And then I ended up settling really you know, locally, um,
in this small town where his business was. Um. Of course,
(11:59):
you know, when when I came to work for him,
I started out at that point he was doing some
investor relations. So he was drilling oil and gas wells
in Pennsylvania, but then was raising funds um for that,
and so I was kind of his like marketing communications
lays on and and at that time that really wasn't
even a role that most you know, companies, especially one
(12:19):
of his size, really had. UM. But yeah, I would
be you know, I would be plotting charts. You know,
back then computer and iPhones and all this stuff. Technology
was not it was not as big, and so I
would be you know, hand plotting charts. I would be
taking out the garbage. I'd be doing basically, you know,
kind of whatever was needed um at the time. And
(12:41):
so of course I never wanted to say no because
to your point, you know, you're just trying to kind
of prove yourself and making sure that people realize, well,
you know, I have some value. It's not just the girlfriend, um,
you know, because say probably wasn't easy. But UM, but
you know, I I grew up where I had a
really good sense of myself, UM, and I think that's
(13:03):
where it really you know, I don't want I don't
know if it's confidence, I don't know, it's just UM,
had a good set of really core values that I
felt like, okay, as long as I felt I was
doing the right things for the right reasons. Um, then
you know what others perceived of me was. Um, you know,
I didn't really care. I do remember that he had
(13:23):
a friend which we've lost touch long time ago, but
he he bet us that we would not our relationship
would not last. Um, I think for like nine months.
That are you know at that he beat us like
a trip somewhere, exotic trip somewhere, that our relationship wouldn't
last nine months. Um. So going on, let's see twenty
we're at twenty nine years now, we certainly beat that. Odd.
(13:47):
Did you get the trip? No? We lost touch, and
you know that's annoying. Tell me it was you a trip.
That's ridiculous. I don't like that. I would I'll take
the trip. I'll call him up and tell him you
said you'd give it to me. I get the trip.
The funny part two is, uh, Bethany is you know
I'm wife number two? Right? So there's you know, obviously,
I know divorced unfortunately is commonplace now, but even thirty
(14:10):
years ago was more of an up and coming trend.
You know, he was married for seventeen years beforehand, and
I thought at that time I was like, oh, my gosh,
how do you beat seventeen years of marriage from you know,
someone else? And so that was kind of like another
thought that was a little bit more. Um, I guess,
I guess me. But um, but you know, like I said,
(14:31):
we're at twenty nine right now. So but when that
day came, when it was like when we hit our
seventeenth anniversary, I was like super excited, like, oh, that's
so nice. Seventeen I moved from from from wife number
two backup to wife number one. That's amazing. And yeah,
and you didn't need to work, you chose to work.
That says a lot anyway, Um, how did you both
(14:53):
get into owning sports teams? And? Um, for example, I
know I've met Robert Kraft. He told me about he
and his wife decided to get well. Actually, no, he
came home and told his wife he had bought the
Patriots and it was for not a big number considering
what sports teams are worth now, and I think she
(15:14):
was probably nervous about it, but it ended up being
an amazing investment. It used to be sort of that
owners did it sort of like owning horses is like
a passion project, but it wasn't necessarily a business unto itself.
I also know Steve Cohen who owns the Mets, and
you know, it's a whole juggernaut business. So I'm sort
of interested in that. What made you It used to
(15:35):
be a vanity project and not not a business in
my opinion, and it's really a major, major business now.
So how did that whole thing get started? And I'm
my correct or, Am I incorrect? No? You know what,
you're correct, And I think it's like with anything in life,
you know, a little luck and timing also goes along
with it. Um at that point where my husband had
(15:56):
sold his business, and you know, we took maybe a
year off, but you know, we're not people that just
consider around and and really do nothing. And one of
the things, you know, even the first day I met him,
Um he was a season ticket holder. Um he was
a hockey fan of the Buffalo Sabers at the time,
and um we would that would be day night as
(16:17):
we drive up and his his kids used to live
in Buffalo as well, so going to Buffalo, Um was
a you know, it was a weekly thing. And then
especially attending UM hockey games at that time going from
where where were you coming from? We were in a
town called only in New York, which was about maybe, UM,
I'm gonna say, an hour and ten minutes south of Buffalo.
(16:37):
So you guys are small town people ultimately people. Yes, yes,
interesting um and so UM. So we were always attending
UM sporting events, especially hockey games. And then at that
time really is when the Bills kind of really made
their big UM Super Bowl runs the four years so
so football UM, you know obviously big in the Buffalo
(16:59):
western New York area. UM. And so you know that
was always you know, part of us really starting out
just as a fan. UM. And then when you know,
we were like thinking, okay, what are we gonna do
with the second half of our life? UM he you know,
we said, wow, we always want to own a sports team,
and so we actually bought the hockey team first, okay,
(17:19):
and then at that time when we bought the hockey team,
there was actually a rule that the NFL no longer
has where you're not allowed to have to UM, you
can't have two professional teams UM that are not in
the same market. So meaning that the only team that
we could because we already had the Buffalo Sabers in
the National Hockey League. The only team football, if we
(17:41):
ever want to get into football, was going to be
in Uh. So you add, literally you could only buy
one team in your own hometown. So it's limited choice.
The rule no longer exists, but it did at the time. Um.
And honestly, back then, you know the bills. Um. You know,
we did not think about the Bills when we bought
the hockey team, but then after we bought the hockey
(18:03):
team and we were spending more time up there, and
then of course kind of that whole um, the idea
kind of came to light, and especially with the passing
of the previous owner who had only been the owner
of the team since inception. UM. So we you know,
we really set to ourselves, there's only thirty two of
these teams, like this opportunity is, especially one that's in
(18:24):
our current market that we could um only comes you
know once in a lifetime, if at all. Um. And
so we decided to make the jump. And I do remember,
you know, my husband saying to me, though, like listen,
we we both have to be on board. And I'm
gonna need you to be you know, to be a
big part of this because I can't do this myself. Um,
(18:46):
and so he Actually it's a lot of work. My
friend Alex Cohen works on the Mets, works on the Mets. Funday,
it's a job for her as much as I mean,
it's a big it's a lot of work. So it's
most people probably think it's just like a cute thing.
Oh I on a sports team. It is a business.
You know. Usually you know, the wife just gets you know,
isn't really into the operations of the team. Um, Usually
(19:08):
it's more of the husband. Um. But I remember him.
I remember we were talking with our attorneys and our
cowins and talking through some of the legalities, and you know,
they said, well, okay, how do you want the ownership
to be split? Um? Do you want to be pent
terry or how does the how does it between the
two of you? You're saying, yes, yes, how do we leave?
Let me how hold on? Before you get there? This
(19:30):
is an interesting question because without being sensitive, it sounds
like you guys are going to be together the rest
of your life. So you're out of those woods. But
back then, how many years ago is that? Oh? So
that was what about eight years ago. So eight years ago. Okay,
so you're not talking about a professional sports team, so
it's an asset. So you're having like sort of it's
sort of like a pre nup of a sports team
(19:50):
conversation in the middle of your marriage. So explain. So now,
I just wanted to frame that that way because it's
you're not just the cute little wife. It's going to
help out. You're now a partner in this team. So
that is interesting. Yeah, And when we bought the hockey team,
we were we were in a I don't know why,
we were trying to get it passed through pretty quickly.
So one of the ways that we did that was
(20:11):
just because my husband had the quote bigger asset because
of um because of the company that was in his
name beforehand. And so even though I had worked at
the company for I can't since I met him, um
for multiple years. Um He So the hockey team actually
ended up being in his name, A hundred pisette, right,
no issues. I honestly didn't really care um Oka, and
(20:34):
so when actually the football came around, I just assumed
that that was going to be the same. And my
husband's like, no, just let's make it fifty fifty. Um.
It was his idea. And you know what to me,
like you said, we're gonna be here together for the
rest of our lives, and we had already gone through. UM.
You know what I thought at the time was the
bigger Um Hampson in our marriage. And so I didn't
(20:55):
think anything of it. I didn't realize until it got
Paul Black that that was a big deal. Um. When
we had you know, when it got announced that we
had purchased the Buffalo Bills. Um, and there was at ownership, UM,
you get viewed so much differently. You get really you
get viewed as the partners, so you're baller. He became
(21:17):
a boss bitch baller even at the even at the
league level. And there's only really one controlling owner. Um,
who has to have you know, thirty percent of the team. Um,
so he is the controlling owner. But um, but because
of that fifty fifty kind of ownership, like you know,
I am, I am there all the time. I mean
(21:37):
I deal with the league. They view me as as
owner even though I'm not. Like I said that, you know,
we've got two representatives of the club. Um. But that
was a big deal. Um, and I didn't I didn't
think of it at the time, but it really was
a big deal to the outside world. Um. On the
ownership there, am I allowed to know numbers just so
(22:10):
people can understand how the business has changed. What it
was purchased for, and what it's worth now that's all
public information. Yes, we purchased it for yes probably, Um,
we've purchased it for one point four billion back in
h I believe, okay, And what's it worth it now?
It's worth what someone's gonna pay you for. So I
actually I don't know what that is. But based on
(22:31):
other teams like what it teams like that getting now like, um,
you know what. Honestly, Bethany, I hate to say because
I really don't know. I don't know either. I'm not
like baiting you into something I don't actually. In terms
of our market um, and you know part of the
history of the team itself, Um, we're we're called the
bottom quartile among the other clubs. So in terms of
(22:52):
market sise, revenue things like that, Um, we're we're at
the bottom. So our value probably is a lot of
difference obviously than say the Cowboys or the Patriots, due
to the championships that they've had as well, so in
the city that they're that they're in. So honestly, I
really can't tell you a number. But do you think
it's a great business? Do you feel like it was
a good business purchase? Has it been a successful business
(23:15):
for you? Oh? Um? Oh no, I definitely. I remember
when at the time, you know, everything was done and
we we had a company, Allen and Company that was
kind of negotiated on our behalf of the deal, and
you know, everything was set, but but you know the
price right, like it's a blank line. Okay, what is
your actual bid? Because this was really a bid process,
(23:38):
so you're biding against other people and um, and it
was just like okay, And I remember, you know, I'm
saying listen. At at one point too, we feel that
um and this is you know, Allen and Company. This
is kind of our representative saying um. At one point too,
we think, you know about we're present sure that you'd
(23:59):
win the bid. At at one point too, at one
point for we're a hundred percent sure you're going to
win the bid. Um and and we said, you know what,
I'd rather go with the odds of a and so
you know, I guess, you know, somebody say we overpaid
at that time, and I do remember. Unfortunately he's no
longer with us, but Bob mcneir, who was the owner
(24:21):
of the Houston Texans at the time, was one of
the league's owner that we had talked to in this
whole process of buying a team, and he said, you know,
I know you're gonna whatever you bid on it, you're
gonna think that you spent way too much money. But
I will tell you that in a few years you
realize you did it. Um And he was, and he
was right, Well, that's an interesting investment style. So you're
(24:43):
talking about a lot more money than the people listening
have to spend. But I remember I purchased a house
in the Hampton's years ago, and I had an accepted
offer and I didn't know that much about residential real
estate then and I didn't know anything like I know now.
Was the second purchase I've ever made. And um, I
had accepted offer, and we didn't get the contract in
right away. And of course that real estate broker, because
(25:04):
they can be the most challenging people in the world,
business wise and ethics wise, shopped the house to other people,
using my my offer as you know, as a stalking horse,
and they came back and said, this other person is
willing to pay, and I think it was like two
hundred and seventy five dollars and I was furious. I
(25:25):
was emotional. I didn't want I'm not doing this because
I felt taken. I didn't like that feeling. But I
remember my friends saying, in several years, if you think
the house is amazing and you think it's great value,
in several years, you're not going to remember that money.
And that was a lot. That's a lot of money.
But it's totally true. The house is worth probably two
and a half times or two and a quarter times
(25:47):
what it was worth then. So sometimes you can't. You
have to not be emotional and so literal about these
business decisions if you know, you got to make quick decisions,
and you can't think that way. So it's the very
small version of what you're talking talking about. But I get, well,
you know, the Hamptons is it is a you know,
there's only so many homes in the Hampton's right, it's
such a desirable place. And same with you know, an
(26:10):
NFL club, there's not that many of them, they don't
always come on the market, and I could, like you know,
I said before, timing, um and a little luck sometimes
you know, has to go away. I don't think that
anyone who has been successful can say that it was
all just based on on work. I mean there was,
there's always a little bit of luck and timing that
goes with it. But it sounds like decisiveness too, So like,
(26:32):
for example, um and having a little bit of courage.
I had another place in New York City, and to
your point, I thought the place was amazing and it's
sucked potential for a renovation, and it was I said
full price, I'll pay. I didn't make an offer. I
just said i'll pay. I didn't want to risk there
might have been nobody else looking at it. It It was
a very problem apartment. But when you want something in business,
(26:55):
you can't play around, because if it's something like the
team for you in one town where you only have
one choice, or if it's an apartment, or if it's
a business deal, sometimes you just have to say I
have to have the courage to just make the decision
right now and know the value, and that is worth
about more now. So those decisions can be good, it
(27:18):
can't be penny wise and dollar foolish. Well, and you know,
I am a big advocate of sports, whether it's it's
not just in professional but whether it's you know, when
you're little, in high school college. Um, my oldest daughter,
our oldest daughter, Jesse, is a professional tennis player. And
so we have kind of really spent a lot of
our married life, um in that sports realm Um. We
(27:39):
before that, we used to be a partner in in
a football agency where we represent the clients. Um. So
we you know, we uh we donated um hockey uh
an arena at Penn State, my husband's alma mater. So
we have always been involved in the sports aspect of it.
So again you know where like you said, opportunity, the
passion that we half for sports, um, the timing of everything,
(28:03):
and then again being fortunate to you know, all the
hard work um we thought was done, um when building
up the business that we were able to sell to
provide us the resources and buy the football and the
hockey team. But um, but yeah, not realizing a lot
more work was ahead of us. But um, but yeah,
(28:24):
I totally agree with you on that. Well. So also
it's it's on brand. You're involved in sports, you're involved
in your community, you're involved in What I mean is
it's on brand that everything you're doing is sort of
in that area where you grew up, where you have roots,
where you know people, where you know who to trust,
and you're you're trusted there and your that's your community,
(28:46):
and it's all on brand to sort of be in
all aspects of sports, and your philanthropy is connected to sports,
because it's okay to make whatever your philanthropy is connect
to your business. Meaning it's just not all you're adhering
to the line and all of it is on brand,
it's cohesive. You're not just choosing to to to make
(29:08):
a difference in a charity that has nothing to do
with everything else that you do, because then it's more
easier for people to understand the narrative of what you do.
I feel, yes, no, definitely, And listen, you know, obviously,
I do think that when you're doing charitable giving, um,
that it does lend to what you're really passionate about
and saying that has a meaning for you. UM. And again,
(29:29):
like I said, because of of what we've seen in
experience raising an athlete of our own and and the
folks that we have. Um. And I've seen firsthand, like
if if you come to a game, I mean I
I just I have so many memories and experiences of
of what football, what hockey, what's even sports? Um does
to bring a family together, to bring friends together, to
(29:52):
bring a community together. It's part of the American way
of life really. But yes, as an individual, you know,
seen a firsthand the intangibles and the importance of health
and wellness and taking care of your body, things that
you know, when I was younger, I never thought of like, um,
but you know, athletes these days just how important it
(30:13):
is to them. So um, I'm a huge advocate that.
You know, sports is such a you know, a positive
influence and many in so many ways. And it crosses gender,
acrosses age, acrosses communities. UM. So I mean that's just it.
It's easier to to celebrand, as you said that you're
(30:34):
passionate about do something where you can really have an impact.
I used to donate to several different charities, thinking that
was good to spread it out, and then someone said
to me, you should be focusing on one thing where
you can really create the most impact, and we've done
incredible things with disaster relief all over the world. So
I I agree, and that's on brand for me too.
It's sort of like pulling a quick business together and
(30:55):
just executing relief, uh, you know, a relief effort in
no time. So let's talk about your childhood a little bit,
because that jumps off the page. I mean, you definitely
(31:17):
did not have a traditional childhood. You don't have a
basic story. So it sounds um scary and a little
lonely and and you must have had so many questions
growing up. So can you describe, um, your upbringing, your
start to this crazy life. Yeah, so my crazy life
(31:38):
um um. So basically, I you know, was born in
South Korea, um, and was adopted really by this actually
a set of a Canadian family who I moved to
the U. S Um. My adoptive parents actually had to
become US citizens in order for for them to adopt me.
And if you you know, we talked about thirty years ago,
(32:00):
but you know we're talking way way longer. Uh. You know,
you didn't have emails, and you weren't like you know,
I didn't have phone calls and your cell phone and
all those things. And so my parents, you know, wanted
to adopt a girl from from South Korea or actually
they I think they just wanted to adopt anybody. And uh,
and they were mailing back and forth and um, and
(32:22):
so I was actually born in South Korea. I was
left at the doorstep of a police station. At that time,
I'm like, this is Us. That's like the movie show
This is Us, which we're watching with Brent. You know what,
I have not seen that show. It's the same The
guy I was dropped up at a fire station was okay,
all right, I have seen that that show yet. And
I I keep thinking, Okay, I need to binge this
(32:43):
show because I've heard such great things about it. But
again I started, so, don't ruin it for me. Well,
but but but adoption is a big part of it
and in multiple situations. Okay, sorry. So then I was adopted,
and I know I needna go I had before I
jumped back, because I did go to Korea for the
first time since I was born. Um about I'm gonna
say three years ago, and um, and found out some
(33:06):
really great stuff. So I did find out that Okay,
I was dropped off at the orphanage Um, I thought
I was dropped off as a baby, but actually I
was dropped off when I was roughly around four, four
years old, um, and so I had a life before
I got dropped off, right um. And then I was
only in the orphanage for a short period of time.
(33:27):
I think I believe then that usually what the police
would do is they would bring you to an orphanage
and you would stay there for um, you know, like
six months in case the parents came back, right uh.
And so but in order for the me to be
um in the orphanage, as an orphan, um, I had
to have a name and I had to have a birthday,
(33:48):
so they would make one up at four. That's interesting
that it wouldn't. You wouldn't know what your name was before.
I Yeah, I don't. I don't remember. And when I
got dropped off off, I didn't. There was no name,
no address, no nothing, and so they just guessed them
my birthday and they and they made up my my name,
which I did. I found that out like three years ago.
(34:10):
So my god was that. Yeah. So I keep telling
my family that I'm actually a year younger than I
actually am. But but I you know, I but I
my birthday is what I've always celebrated since then, so
it's gonna be hard to change my birthday. But but yeah,
that was an interesting that I won, that I had
a life before I, UM, before I was adopted in
(34:31):
or before I was went to the orphanage. UM. And
then the fact that you know, kind of my identity
as you could saw you could say that most people
rely on is there when they were born and what
their their name was, UM is completely made up by
someone who I have no clue who they are. So UM,
that was an interesting factor that I found out a
(34:52):
few years ago. That sounds emotional, you know what it was?
It was weird. I don't know why I always felt
that I was I thought I was the baby. I
don't I don't know why. I never even never rang.
And I said to my dad because he actually came,
my adopted deck actually came on the trip with me,
and and he said, well, you you really never asked
any questions and we would try to tell you, but
(35:13):
you just you didn't really want to know anything. So
I said, okay, I just you know, UM. But you know,
I think really credit to I think, you know, my
family and my parents had two older brothers UM at
the time, UM of of just creating such a great,
loving home, that UM that just raised me like you know,
(35:35):
like their own and of course you know it just
it UM. And so I never felt the need to
go find my parents, never felt the need to go
you know, I didn't. I didn't have that longing. And
and honestly, and going back to Korea, I had it
so good. Why why would I want to know? UM?
(35:56):
Because you know the life that and and I tell
people all the time, you know, if they asked me,
well what you know, what what is one thing that
you can point to that has led to your success
or to where you are now whatever? And I always say,
it has to be my parents, because they chose me,
UM to be part of their family. And just to
think where would I be now? UM. I did get
(36:19):
an opportunity to go back to It wasn't exactly the
same orphanage, but the same UM company that UM that
did it. And so you know, you saw kids in
that same orphanage that was literally the same situation I
was in, and it was just crazy to think, Okay,
wonder where they will be, you know, in fifty years,
thirty years, UM because you know, like I said, being
(36:41):
adopted is a single most important part of my life
right now. Interesting. It just it put me into uh
complete path that um, you know, I can say I
wouldn't even have the opportunity beyond the path that I'm
at now without the adoption. Wow, that's amazing And just
(37:02):
that because I think my daughter who's eleven, remembers before
four and five. So I wonder if you have flashes
or if you'll be hypnotized, if you'll be dreaming in
some weird flash, will happen. I've had I've talked to
people that because I love health and wellness and kind
of the bio hacking and all that stuff, I'm always
like into that stuff. And I've had people that say, um,
(37:22):
recently something about like you can actually pass on trauma
that you even if you don't remember, through generations, which
I did not realize that that that could happen, but
this that you actually can pass on trauma through generations
and and doing things like you know, hypnosis and and
other you know, rieky and other things can help. But
(37:45):
I don't know, I just have never You may not
want to poke the bear in the zoo. Yeah, I
just I've been happy with my life that I'm like, Okay,
why do I want to invite unknowns? I you know,
I agree no bad will against you know, my birth parents.
Is I have no bad will against South Korea? Or
just so I've been agree I understand that. Like someone
(38:07):
talked about going back because she had to figure out
stuff and she had a lot of trauma and her
life in doing ayahuasca. This woman who was on here,
who's amazing, who's climbed the seven summits, but it's it's
opening Pandora's box, and not everyone wants to do that.
There are many areas in my life where I'm always
nervous to do that because I don't need to go
back and see everything. So I think that's an interesting conversation.
(38:28):
But it's also very television in Hollywood movie to make
it like everybody who's adopted is always just longing for
their long lost parents, and you're an example that that's
not always the case. The last topic I guess is
I guess your partnership overall, it's a relationship partnership, it's
a business partnership. So what are the tenants or you know,
(38:51):
what are the what are the rules and the tips
and the things that you've learned over the years that
make a partnership work in marriage and a long successful relationship.
You know. Um, you're probably gonna laugh. And my kids,
you know, laugh when I when I say that, when
people ask me that question, and I say, and I say,
(39:11):
you know what, agree on what your expectations are of
each other? Before? Um, you know? And and I laughed
my kids and saying, listen, you know, I don't expect
anything from your dad. Therefore I am always you know, surprised.
I'm always excited if he goes over that level of expectations.
But I don't expect, expect, expect it, so therefore I
(39:31):
don't get upset. Um. Now I realized, you know, not everyone,
can you know, put that bar that low? Um. But
I said, well, as long as you guys and and
my actually my oldest daughters got married this uh this year,
And I said that, you know, if you can come
to an agreement and what is expected. If I expected
my husband to be you know, home every night at
(39:52):
five o'clock to take out the trash, to plan this,
to do our budgets, to do you know other things, um,
I would be upset and disappoint in it all the
time and not be happy, um, but knowing, um, but
knowing what I can expect for him, and then um,
when he does something unexpected, it's just a nice surprise. UM.
So I think a lot of times that's what usually happens.
(40:14):
When you know, friends are talking or complaining about their
spouse or boyfriend of things like that. Usually it's because
they're you know, what one expects of the other is
not in alignment. Um. So from a marriage standpoint, I
think that's that's big. But I know people have always
said to me like, oh my gosh, how could you
spend you know, work with your husband, and like you're
all the time you do the same thing. Um. It's
(40:36):
not for everybody, but it really for us. Um, you know.
And I think I'm going to give him the credit
for it because he was older. I'm younger, I can
be a little bit more molded. But you know, he
really said that that expectation of us being partners, even
from day one, even from when I was you know two,
we got I got married at twenty three, Um, even
(40:59):
when I was twenty three years old. Um, that idea
that we were we were partners and so everything he
involved me and everything that he did now was I.
You know, certainly there's other people that he had that
were more experts, whether you're talking legal, accounting, finance, whatever,
but um, but it was never, never afraid to share
(41:19):
all that with me, to have me in meetings even
right now in hockey meetings, football meetings, draft I am
there and um. And he set that tone right from
from day one of being there and I And when
people talk to me, and especially women about being a
woman and a female and a male dominated you know
um area like sports. UM, I always tell them listening, listen,
(41:41):
it's not an opportunity to bashed men because we all
need them in some way and they can be your
biggest advocate. You got to find the right ones. But
I know that my husband has been the biggest advocate
for me and has taught me so many things um. UM.
And really that started with him just you actually accepting
me as as a true partner. UM. No matter what
(42:04):
the percentages are you know, of of anything, it's just
um and wanting me to be in those conversations, in
those meetings knowing the information. UM. Now, unfortunately, there's so
much to do that I don't have time to be
in those conversations anymore and I have to prioritize UM.
But he's, like I said, from day one to even today,
(42:26):
like there's no um you know, like I'm not It's
not that I'm not invited to anything that he is
a part of. It doesn't matter if his football or
if his business or um, whatever it is. You feel
totally respected in your relationship and your partnership. That's amazing. Well,
it was amazing to talk to you, uh and so interesting.
I get to learn so much each time I have
(42:47):
a conversation like this. So congratulations on all of your
success personally and professionally. Well, thank you, Bethany, appreciated being
on the show. And we have a big game this
weekend on Saturday night at a fifteen so um, hoping
for a big one and to continue our playoff run. Fantastic. Well,
hopefully I'll get to meet you in person one of
these days, maybe at a game or otherwise. Anytime accepted
(43:09):
will be five degrees, so you may want to take
another game while go to an away game. There you go. Okay, awesome,
thank you, Thank you so much, Bethany. That was a
really interesting conversation. That's a woman who started with unfortunate
circumstances and is really appreciative of her life and as
managed to have a successful business and personal relationship with
(43:34):
her husband, raise a great family, and just really chooses
to work and chooses to create value as a woman
and be taken seriously. And not that many women owners
OFFL teams, so that's pretty cool.
Host
Bethenny Frankel
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