February 4, 2024 • 38 mins
Amelia Earhart was a pioneer in aviation. However, she would not live to her 40th birthday. During an attempt at becoming the first woman to complete a circumnavigational flight of the globe in 1937, Earhart and her navigator Fred Noonan, disappeared over the central Pacific Ocean near Howland Island. Her disappearance remains one of the great unsolved mysteries of the 20th century. For 87 years people have been trying to find her plane, a twin-engine Lockheed 10E Electra. Newt’s guest is Tony Romeo, CEO of Deep Sea Vision. He discusses the search for Earhart’s plane and his recent discovery.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:04):
On this episode of Nuts World. Amelia Earhart was a
pioneer in aviation. In nineteen twenty eight, publisher George Putnam
picked Earhart to become the first woman to cross the
Atlantic by plane as a passenger. When her flight landed
in Wales, she became a media sensation and a symbol
of what women could achieve. In nineteen thirty two, she
(00:26):
became the first woman to fly solo across the Atlantic
as a pilot. Her awards included the American Distinguished Flying
Cross and the Cross of the French Legion of Honor. However,
Earhart would not live to her fortieth birthday. During an
attempt of becoming the first woman to complete a circumnavigational
flight of the globe in nineteen thirty seven, Earhart and
(00:49):
her navigator Fred Noonan disappeared over the Central Pacific Ocean
near Holland Island. The two were last seen in Lay
in New Guinea on July second, nineteen thirty seven, on
the last landstop before Holland Island and one of their
final legs of their flight. Her disappearance remains one of
(01:10):
the great unsolved mysteries of the twentieth century. For eighty
seven years, people have been trying to find her plane,
a twin engine Lockheed ten E Electra. Here to talk
about the search for Earhart's plane and his recent discovery.
I am really pleased to welcome my guest, Tony Romeo,
(01:30):
CEO of Deep Sea Vision, a marine robotics company specializing
in deep ocean exploration and survey. Tony, welcome and thank
(01:51):
you for joining me on News World.
Speaker 2 (01:54):
Thank you, speaker. I appreciate that.
Speaker 1 (01:55):
So before we talk about your discovery, I just want
to start by talking about Amelia Earhart. You have a
great quote in the Wall Street Journal quote. For her
to go missing was just unthinkable. Imagine Taylor Swift just
disappearing today. I mean, Earhart really had a level of
international fame that was astounding for that time period. Why
(02:19):
was she so famous? Man? Can you talk about aviation
and the role of this pioneering woman during the time
that she was there.
Speaker 3 (02:27):
Sure, that's a great question. I appreciate all the questions
have been asked over the last couple of days. I
think that's one of the best because the story is
about her. She is America's favorite missing person, right not
Jimmy Hoffa, but he's famous too. But Emilia Art is
our favorite missing person. And you know, as long as
she's missing, there's gonna be someone out there looking for
She came from a humble upbringing. She was a nurse
(02:47):
in World War One in Toronto, and she just fell
in love with flying. And she seemed like you're just average,
normal American and she was tapped on the shoulder to
do something great and she ran with it, and to
do it she did then, flying across the Atlantic, flying
across the Pacific solo, and setting these speed records, distance records,
flying records were just unheard of, and especially for women.
(03:10):
And it's just so impressed with what she did. There's
a lot of people wouldn't do what she did then,
They wouldn't do it now, certainly not with the technology
that she used. Just a fascinating person. And by the way,
you know, aviation pioneer, early advocate for women's rights, but
also tremendous author. She wrote a book called for the
Fun of It, one of the best books you've never
heard of.
Speaker 1 (03:28):
It's called for the Fun of It.
Speaker 3 (03:30):
Yep, terrific. She was so gracious, She was incredibly gracious.
She never said anything bad about anyone. I mean, you
knew when she didn't like somebody, but she never said
anything bad. She is so clever, so witty. She actually
wrote four books. I feel like of all the things
known about Meli are, that's one of the most unknown things.
Tremendous author and just very intelligent women.
Speaker 1 (03:47):
As late as nineteen thirty there were still only two
hundred female pilots. That it really had been a field
that females had not been very accepted in. So she
was really outstanding as a pioneer at a time when
it was very rare.
Speaker 3 (04:02):
And here's another fact for you, Knut that is very interesting,
I think is she was the first woman to cross
the Atlantic right, solo. But she was the first woman
to fly across the Atlantic. Said, but she was actually
the second person. I mean, of course, you know it
was Charles Lindbergh was the first one, but she was
the second one to do it, and there were no
other men that did it. It was her. She was
the second person to do it. So and solo, by
the way, I mean, just incredible, incredible thing to do.
Speaker 1 (04:24):
I think now that we do it routinely in large
passenger ships, we don't realize back then, But I mean
everything about whether the engine could work, whether you run
out of fuel, whether your navigation was good enough. I mean,
these were real pioneers and they were taking real risks.
Now it's interesting, though, because I think because she was
(04:45):
so daring and because she was breaking these records, she
really became sort of a symbol and attracted a lot
more women into becoming pilots.
Speaker 3 (04:55):
Totally agree, absolutely for sure, and not just in the aviation.
Encouraged women to break the barriers of all sorts of professions,
and she called her the cockpit, her kitchen. Basically, she
was encouraging women to get out there and pursue careers,
and I think it was a wonderful message and it resonated.
Speaker 1 (05:12):
Part of that process. She became a friend of Eleanor Roosevelt,
the first lady who herself had really strongly advocated women's
rights and women pursuing careers and women making a contribution.
And she became the first woman vice president of the
National Aeronautic Association, which actually kept the official records and races,
(05:33):
and she convinced them to have separate female records because
women did not have the money or planes to fairly
compete against men. For world titles. The other thing that
you were talking about. She wrote, but in addition to writing,
she also gave lectures all over the country. She was
a person who was a star in her own right,
and people came there. And I didn't know this, but
(05:56):
she designed a whole line of women's clothing, dresses, blouses, pants, suits, hats,
using her own sewing machine, her own dress form, her
own seems just. She modeled them for promotional things, and
so people could actually sort of read her books, listen
to her speech, and then wear her clothing. This wasn't
(06:16):
a cultural phenomenon.
Speaker 2 (06:17):
That's right.
Speaker 3 (06:18):
And a luggage line, and they also had her at
one point, I think, promoting cigarettes, which she absolutely hated
because she didn't smoke.
Speaker 1 (06:25):
You mentioned that she designed this line of lightweight, canvas
covered plywood luggage. I didn't realize this Earhart luggage was
sold into the nineteen nineties.
Speaker 2 (06:34):
I didn't know that either. That's wow.
Speaker 1 (06:36):
Incredible talk about lasting as an impact. And of course
she became a household name. People knew who she was.
I was amazed. Now she broke the women's attitude record
when she got to fourteen thousand feet. That's in nineteen
twenty two, and then, as you point out, six years later,
she crosses the Atlantic in twenty hours and forty minutes.
(06:56):
I mean again and again, she's just doing stuff. Is remarkable.
Did she have a close relationship with the aircraft manufacturers.
Speaker 2 (07:05):
She did. With the Lockheed Martin folks. She did.
Speaker 3 (07:08):
They kind of specially designed the aircraft for her. It
was Purdue University. You mentioned that she was a teacher
and a professor. She actually was a teacher at Purdue
University who in large part ended up buying and giving
to her as a gift the aircraft, the Lockheed Martin Electra.
So yeah, she had a very close relationship with them
and Gary Johnson, so yeah.
Speaker 2 (07:27):
A very close relationship.
Speaker 3 (07:28):
And she knew most of all the pilots and aircraft
manufacturers at the time, and she was obviously so well known.
She knew the president. She was invited to numerous events
with FDR. I mean, she was really a worldwide celebrity.
Speaker 1 (07:38):
She goes coast to coast, setting a women's record. I
didn't realize this. She flies from Honolulu to Oakland, which
is a twenty four hundred mile trump. I mean, it's
comparable to crossing the Atlantic.
Speaker 2 (07:50):
Sure, yep.
Speaker 1 (07:52):
And apparently that was also the first flight where a
civilian aircraft carried a two way radio. So here you
have somebody who was a pioneer in technology, a pioneer
in achievements, pioneer in women's roles, in a variety of ways.
She flew from Los Angeles to Mexico City. That took
thirteen hours back then with the equipment, that's a long
(08:13):
time to stay awake.
Speaker 2 (08:15):
And you're a funny part with that story.
Speaker 3 (08:16):
She was flying in Mexico City and somehow she got
lost or she wasn't sure where she was at, and
she just landed in this ranch land and got off
and there was a guy and a horse there, and
she stopped and asked him how to get to Mexico City,
and he told her, yeah, it's that way, just a
little bit further, and she got back in the plane,
took off the guy's farm, and finished the flight.
Speaker 1 (08:33):
You can't quite imagine how really on the edge she
was living. And when she began her worldwide flight around
the world in thirty seven, she becomes the first person
man or woman to fly from the Red Sea to India.
That is a long flight and it's the same thing
you're talking about earlier with Mexico. I mean, here you
are in an area. Nowadays we have all of these
(08:54):
electronic devices and they're sort of electronic highways in the sky.
These folks are doing at the hard way totally different.
So from your perspective, when did you get interested in
a milliar are heart?
Speaker 2 (09:07):
Oh?
Speaker 3 (09:08):
Since I was a kid, I've always been fascinated with
the story. My dad flew for Pan American for over
forty years, and my brother is a pilot in the
Air Force. My other brother has his past license, my
sister has a past license. I have my past life.
So it's been a story that's just always from early
age growing up, that we always talked about.
Speaker 2 (09:23):
You know.
Speaker 3 (09:23):
It's just recently that you know, he really got deep
into researching and I said, why has this not been
solved yet? All the information is there, and you know,
as a dug deeper, it wasn't necessarily that people don't
know where she went down. We all know generally the area.
The problem was logistically how difficult and challenging it is
to get to Howland Island. It's a very deep ocean
out there in the Pacific. It's days away from anything else.
(09:45):
So to mount an expedition go out there and do
a search is extremely expensive and it's challenging. There's only
been five serious attempts at finding an airplane deep ocean searches.
David Jordan one of the greats in the history of Amilliard,
He's done three of them, and Ted Waite of Gayweight Computers,
Found to Get with Computers has done another one. And
so it's not an easy thing to do, and so
it's just for us. It was can we do this?
(10:05):
Can we actually put this together? If I can get
into it. My tactic on the tackling this problem was
not to do it as a lease, go out and
lease equipment, but actually set up a business deep sea
vision where we buy the equipment and then we turn
into a larger kind of operation where we can use
this equipment for other contracts and jobs out in the Pacific.
And there's a backlog of work out there between pipe surveys,
(10:26):
wind farm jobs, other rec surveys. So if we could
buy this equipment, we could bring the cost way down
and then work in our Amelia airhard searches and other projects.
Isn't the only one we're interested in? World War two stuff.
So for me, this was a perfect opportunity of switching
careers out of real estate get into something a little
bit more adventurous and exciting.
Speaker 1 (10:43):
How far is it from Holland Island to other larger places.
Speaker 3 (10:48):
It's about three days away. I mean the closest island
is care Body. If you look at it looks like
but it's pronounced careboss. There's another island that's Tuvalu American
samoas a couple of days away, So it's really in
the middle of nowhere. I mean she was flying there.
It was right on the equator. She was flying there
as a stopping point on her next leg to Whii.
She needed to refuel, so the US Coast Guard had
put some fuel there for her and built a runway
(11:10):
actually for so she could land and refuel and then
take off and fly to Hawaii and finish off the trip.
Speaker 1 (11:14):
When I was reading about you to work, I was
really surprised. I mean, if you get the Coast Guard
to go all that way to build a runway and
to bring aviation fuel, she was really getting significant support
to try to help her succeed. That's a pretty big deal.
Speaker 3 (11:29):
Oh yeah, I know, And I think the President was involved,
FDR was involved on a few of the requests. They
built a runway on Helland Island for especially for her
to land there, and they had people stationed there for
waiting for her rival. And there was another ship halfway
between Papa New Guinea and Holland also trying to help
her track her way to Helland Island.
Speaker 2 (11:45):
So there was a lot of support. It was a
big deal. It was a worldwide event.
Speaker 3 (11:48):
I mean, it was an opportunity, I think, to showcase
American innovativeness, American bravery. Somebody, an American could fly around
the world, American women could fly on the world, So
I mean, I think it was a great opportunity for
the country to show case a true American hero.
Speaker 1 (12:01):
They also have been that having been personal friends with
Elin Roosevelt didn't exactly hurt and getting the President to
say to the Coast Guard, g wouldn't you like to
go down to Holland Island?
Speaker 2 (12:13):
She absolutely leveraged don yep which is.
Speaker 1 (12:16):
Just kind of remarkable. Now. She leaves Miami on June first,
nineteen thirty seven, in what is a planned program, which
given things like what they were doing in Holland, they
must have really thought this through and planned it out
as around the world project.
Speaker 2 (12:32):
Imagine that.
Speaker 3 (12:33):
Imagine doing something like that today, buying the tickets and
figuring out your visas. And I mean, you're talking about
a time when flying in some of these airports, you
didn't even know what to expect. There were some countries
that had required vaccinations, there were countries that were having
malaria outbreaks. There were maps that didn't even have accurate
roads and navigational guides for her. All this was done
through telegrams, right. They weren't texting each other and emailing
(12:54):
and figuring this out. This is all telegrams. And a
lot of people fault her for this communication plan and
not being better on the radios, and I'm like, you
can't do that, It's not fair. This is nineteen thirty seven.
People weren't talking to each other on the radios back then,
Between aircrafts, it was all in its infancy. She was
breaking ground in so many different ways.
Speaker 2 (13:11):
It's incredible.
Speaker 1 (13:30):
It strikes me that when she did go missing, people
had this wide range of explanations of what happened. I
remember one time there was a period where they thought
maybe the Japanese had forced her down because she had
gotten near the islands that they were in charge of
in the South Pacific. People were looking for all sorts
of explanations, and I think for a long time people thought,
(13:52):
you know, she might be found alive, even though during
World War Two we were all.
Speaker 2 (13:56):
Over the region right right right.
Speaker 1 (14:00):
Well, the search itself, they had nine vessels with four
thousand crew and sixty six aircraft out there looking for
it cost over four million dollars, which back then was
real money.
Speaker 3 (14:13):
Yeah, it was the largest search and rescue operation of
its time, and there's been a lot of debate on
that number you just read out there. I mean, these
are servicemen that were already in the military, already in
the navy. So I mean, you know, you add up
their salaries and say, okay, it's four million dollars search,
But I mean, like they could have been sitting at
Pearl Harbor. You know a lot of these guys were
pulled from Pearl Harbor to go out and.
Speaker 2 (14:32):
Do the search.
Speaker 3 (14:32):
So they're still in the Navy, they're still getting paid.
So to say that the money was spent for meli
are is not I don't think that's I mean, the
efforts could have been done better on training. I guess
you could say, but there probably were fuel costs that
were used. But I mean an enormous amount of resources
were put into finding her. But I will say this
interesting thing that came out of the search was that
our maps got better. And one of the things we've
(14:53):
learned since she had the wrong map, Helen Island was
plotted incorrectly on her map by off by six miles.
Some folks say that could have contributed to her. But
by going out there, the Navy learned a lot about
the Pacific, about a lot of the islands, and you know,
I think some of that was used in preparation for
World War Two.
Speaker 1 (15:08):
What people need to realize is if you're off by
six miles and you don't know which way you're lost,
it's not like, oh, let's just have a mid course correction. Well,
I noticed that that a battleship which was going to
go on a cruise for ROTC Midshipman. So they sent
a battleship all the way down. They sent the aircraft
carrier of Lexington, which was one of the two biggest
(15:31):
carriers we had at the time. Then that particular carrier
had sixty three aircraft. I mean, they really went all
out trying to see if they could find her. It
gives you a sense of how famous she really was. Yep.
So all of this has happened. She becomes very famous,
and there's a great mystery here. Her husband, George Putnam,
(15:55):
financed his own search until October thirty seven. She was
finally declared officially dead after being lost at sea. It's tragic,
but then the searches start and people have never given up.
As you're an example. Tell us about you in a sense.
I mean, you're out here, you have created this company.
(16:15):
You're off doing something which has to be just totally absorbing.
Speaker 3 (16:19):
Yeah, it's been a fascinating adventure. It's start to finish.
It's been eighteen months or so. I mean, I thought
this would be an easy thing to plan, and the
more I got into it, the more I realized how
complex this is. Organizing vessels and people and equipment, you know,
mobilizing to get out to a very remote area of
the world has been extremely challenging.
Speaker 1 (16:37):
Part of what makes it possible from your standpoint is
that you have deep sea vision. Can you describe the
company and what it does and what its unique strengths are.
Speaker 3 (16:47):
So we have the latest AUV ever built in An
AUV is an autonomous underwater vehicle and it's this red
submarine looking thing. There's nobody inside of it. It's completely autonomous, unmanned,
and it's called the Huguen six thousands.
Speaker 2 (17:00):
Built by Kongsberg.
Speaker 3 (17:01):
And what it does is it goes down six thousand
meters almost all the way down to the full ocean
depth to the seafloor about fifty meters off the seafloor.
And what it does is basically mosalon and just goes
back and forth, back and forth, back and forth, and
it just scanning everything it's looking at using sound, and
then it's recording all of that and then it comes
back to the surface. It's untethered, it's not connected to
the ship. We're not seeing a real time video of anything.
(17:22):
And so for thirty six hours, we don't know what
it's looking at. We have no idea what it's seen.
Comes back up, we put in the computer and then
we analyze all this data. And I mean it is
an enormous amount of data. Imagine looking at I don't
know what Long Island is, but like the area of
Long Island hundred fifty square miles and picking through it
to find one object that's twelve by eighteen meters, And
so our strength is we've got this deep water sonar.
(17:44):
And then also I knew I would need the best
talent to basically launch this, and I hired a guy
named Craig Wallace who built the Huguen six thousand in Norway,
and we ran into each other at a bar in
Norway while I was out there training on the system,
and he was just so excited and fell in love
with the idea. Finding Miliart worked for Kongsberg for almost
twenty years, and I said, why don't you come with
us and help us make this a success, And about
(18:06):
a week later it was done. He was on board,
so it was having him along out there, and we
specially modified the system so it could scan even wider,
and we had a great team of guys. I mean,
we came at this from a business perspective. Everything was
about fine tuning the cost, getting a fuel efficient boat
because the fuel you're burning out there is not negligible,
and having a small crew so things go wrong, you're
(18:27):
not having to deal with a lot of problems. The
formula was to maximize our time out there, scan the
most area if possible, and do this as smartly as
possible so we could be successful.
Speaker 1 (18:36):
One of the things that you use is synthetic aperture sonar.
What is synthetic aperture so far.
Speaker 3 (18:45):
So it's this idea of stretching the array out a
normal side scan. You're just sending a ping and you're
listening back a ping and you're listening back and he
creates an image of synthetic aperture sonar is you're sending
a ping numerous pings out and as the submarine is
traveling through the water, there's an antenna basically as an
array and is listening for the return sound comes, so
(19:05):
it hits the wall, it hits the plane, and then
it comes back right and you're creating an image. Well,
what this does is it's ping A goes out. You're
sending ping, B ping, PC ping, and you're listening as
the array. As the submarine is going through the water,
the antenna is almost like making it longer and longer,
so it's not actually that long, but based on where
its starting point was and where it's listening, you've created
(19:26):
a longer antenna and You can therefore listen to more
pings and you can create a mesh of the sound
and make a better image basically, and you can look
out further.
Speaker 1 (19:37):
Is the ability to use that at the depth you
were at a new capability.
Speaker 3 (19:42):
SaaS is a new thing within the last I don't know,
I say a decade. I'm not really sure it is new.
It's changed the game for sonar for sure.
Speaker 1 (19:50):
What depth were you operating at?
Speaker 3 (19:52):
About five thousand meters? About fifteen thousand feet? Yeah, everything
the ocean is measured in meters.
Speaker 1 (19:57):
Well, actually, i'll probably about sixteen thousand feet.
Speaker 2 (19:59):
Yeah, that's right.
Speaker 1 (19:59):
Yeah, it's not as deep as the Mariana Trench, but
it's deep.
Speaker 2 (20:02):
It's deep.
Speaker 3 (20:03):
And for reference, you have about forty five hundred feet
deeper than the Titanic.
Speaker 1 (20:06):
That's wild. So you're looking for something deeper and you're
looking for a smaller.
Speaker 2 (20:10):
Thing, that's right.
Speaker 1 (20:11):
Yeah, well put yeah, So and what you do is
you just scan a grid back and forth.
Speaker 2 (20:18):
That's it.
Speaker 1 (20:18):
So how long were you scanning? How many weeks did
it take?
Speaker 2 (20:21):
We were out there about three months.
Speaker 3 (20:22):
We came about this mathematically and a little bit statistically, right,
we've divided the area. We wanted to search into sectors,
and we assigned probabilities to each of those sectors, and
then we also, as sign a difficulty, leveled each of
those sectors based on the terrain that we knew was
on the seafloor. And then once we could mesh those
two together, we could say, well, we want to tackle
the most equal probability stuff the fastest, even if it's
(20:44):
equal probability. But it's harder to do because you have
ravines and valleys. We'll save that for the end, but
let's cover as much territory as we can if it's
the same probability. And that was our approach, and I
think it was a good one.
Speaker 1 (20:55):
When you're doing that, did you find other stuff?
Speaker 3 (20:59):
We didn't find a lot. To be honest with you,
We've got a question a few times. No shipwrecks, no
other planes.
Speaker 1 (21:04):
That's interesting.
Speaker 2 (21:05):
Yeah, there's no shipping lanes out there.
Speaker 1 (21:07):
I guess it was an area that many people went to.
Speaker 3 (21:09):
Now a lot of people know this, but it was attacked.
Holand Island was attacked. I believe this a couple of
days after Pearl Harbor. Just one of those weird quirks
in history. We had colonized, and use that word very loosely,
but we had colonized the line islands, Polin Island, Baker Island,
and Jarvis Island with I think five or six folks.
I think that was our signal to Japan saying, hey,
these are our islands out here, and Japan came by
(21:29):
with some of their zeros, some of their fighter planes
and straight the island killed a couple of Americans on
the island, believe it.
Speaker 1 (21:35):
Or not, which is their way of saying, no, it's.
Speaker 2 (21:37):
Not, it's not. That's right exactly.
Speaker 1 (21:57):
In terms of your own background, which is fascinating. Dad
was a pilot, as you point out earlier for pan Am,
you and all of your siblings have pilot's licenses, so
it must really be in the family.
Speaker 2 (22:08):
That's right.
Speaker 3 (22:09):
We definitely were encouraged to fly. I was flying in
high school. I was fourteen or fifteen. My sister was
teaching at the Air Force Academy actually, and her husband
was two. So I ended up going to the academy. Basically,
right at the end, I decided I didn't want to fly.
It was stressing me out. I liked flying, don't get
me wrong. I had my license and I've flown a
fair amount since I graduated, but it just wasn't Being
a professional or commercial pilot was just not my thing.
Speaker 1 (22:29):
You went to the Air Force Academy and spent six
years a lot of it with an F sixteen squadron,
so you got a fair amount of flight time.
Speaker 2 (22:38):
In Yeah, I did get a couple of flights F sixteen.
That was a lot of fun.
Speaker 1 (22:41):
You leave the service, you create a company. I'm assuming
it's called Quickly. It's kwkly, did I.
Speaker 2 (22:47):
Guess right, that's right?
Speaker 1 (22:49):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, and it's using mobile phones to connect
home buyers with agents. And then the company, which now
is Zillo, actually bought your startup. That's right, classic contraship.
And then you go all the way across the country,
having grown up in Washington State, and you end up
attending the Charleston School of Law and marrying your wife,
(23:10):
Melissa Moss. I mean, you're in Mount Pleasant in North Charleston.
It was a very nice area. That's a good quality
of life. But then after COVID you start thinking about
something different, which is called magnet fishing. What is magnet fishing?
Speaker 3 (23:27):
So, yeah, so it was the article in read in
the Wall Street Journal. It's about I had not heard
anything about this. This is an activity that kind of
got started during COVID, But it's basically, you have a
big magnet, powerful magnet, and you have a rope tattoo,
and you just drop it off a bridge or peer
or whatever, and you just drag it along the bottom
of the ground and then you pull it up and
you see what sticks to it.
Speaker 2 (23:47):
I mean you get.
Speaker 3 (23:48):
Scissors and fishing gear and some people pulling guns and safes,
I mean, bicycles, I mean all kinds of crazy stuff.
And so our kids were not going to school, which
wasn't long down you're in South Caroline, by the way.
Speaker 2 (24:00):
They ended up pretty quickly, but I went up going
out with my five.
Speaker 3 (24:02):
Year old son, and this was like treasure hunting for him, right,
I mean didn't matter we were pulling up, you know,
a screwdriver.
Speaker 2 (24:07):
It was like cool.
Speaker 3 (24:08):
And so that got me thinking about what else is
out here in the oceans that could be pulled up
and that could be found, and that the idea of
finding Amelia Earhart with magnets was like the original idea.
But then I quickly realized this was isn't practical obviously,
but you know, it got me thinking, like, why has
this one not been solved? We're eighty seven years on,
We've got the technology to find it. My brother made
(24:28):
the comment that I think was very memories, said, this
isn't going to last much longer. It's about maybe about
five or ten more years on this one, and somebody's
going to find this.
Speaker 1 (24:35):
So you decided why not?
Speaker 2 (24:36):
You why not?
Speaker 3 (24:37):
And I was doing commercial real estate, So after law
school I got into commercial real estate. I like, do
these chapters in my life, the Air Force tech stuff
and law and then commercial real estate and so now
we got the deep sea expiration. I like the different chapters.
It's fun and maybe one point get into policy. That's
one of the things i'd follow in your footsteps. And
I'm not sure what fashion, but I'd like to do that.
Speaker 1 (24:56):
At some point, you're sort of moving beyond the magnets
of the concept of underwater and you end up dealing
with a company in Norway. What takes you to Norway?
Speaker 3 (25:07):
Congsberg, the company that makes these equipments, the Huguen six thousand.
They're basically the gold standard in sub sea equipment. They're
basically the only ones if you want a subse submersible
capable of going down six thousand meters. You have to
get it from them, and actually we bought it. Funny story,
it took eight months just to have them release the
equipment because it was such sensitive. Equipment's usually only sold
(25:28):
to militaries. And so here's this guy, random guy from
South Carolina. We were contacting the US embassy, folks that
I knew in the Pentagon, and finally they released it
on all this list of conditions. I mean, it just
kind of threw them, is like, this is not a
common request for somebody just coming randomly buy a deep
sea submersible equipment. We had to go to Norway and
do some training for about a month out there in
(25:48):
the Fjords, which was in December, which was super cold.
Speaker 1 (25:51):
It's a pretty expensive piece of equipment, isn't it.
Speaker 2 (25:53):
That's right, nine million dollars. Yeah, you were.
Speaker 1 (25:55):
All in at this point. I have to ask you,
in passing, what's your wife's reaction?
Speaker 2 (26:05):
Great question?
Speaker 4 (26:06):
Skeptical, maybe less so now that you may have actually
found the plane. Yeah, so you take this remarkable modern technology,
you go to the Pacific, you spend three months, and
you find a reflection which looks like it has the
(26:27):
same dimensions and shape of a Lockheed Electra, which is
the plane that Erhart was what what was your reaction
when you're sitting there looking at the screen and you
suddenly see this.
Speaker 2 (26:39):
I mean, it's surreal.
Speaker 3 (26:40):
It was right the last day of the expedition and
everyone's frustrated, and it was a moment of realization for me.
I remember sitting down. Some folks said a few words,
you know, we're producing documentary. You have to watch the documentary.
Hear those words. I don't know what I'm can or
can't say on in the podcast, but it was one
of those Eureka moments. I remember thinking it, this is
the first time anybody seen the plane. If this is it,
(27:00):
this is the first time her plane has been seen
in eighty six, eighty seven years, and it was incredible
to know that there was. It's not a ghost, it's
not Bigfoot, it actually exists.
Speaker 1 (27:10):
It's interesting that you feel that having three pilots thinking
this through was actually an advantage over having people who
are primarily mariners dealing with ocean events. What do you
think was the advantage of being pilots.
Speaker 3 (27:25):
I appreciate you asking that we came about this with
a pilot mindset. A lot of folks they dissect her
final thirty minutes and say, well, she would have done
this nice neat search grid, and she would have done this,
and she thought she was out of gas. Every turn
she made. She thought that was the last turn that
she had. You know, one comment that she makes at
the very end of she's low on gas. It's one
of the last things that she tells us, she's low
(27:46):
on gas. And I can tell you no pilot is
going to admit they're low on gas. I can promise
you that, because when you tell people that you just
admitted you've made the biggest mistake. You take off with
enough gas and you're saying I'm low on gas, you're
admitting a huge, huge mista. And that's a huge clue
for us because it tells us she's not low on gas,
she's out of gas. She's basically out of gas. That's
(28:06):
why she's selling. And there's been cases of commercial airliners
that have gone into the ground because the pilots are
too embarrassed to call the air traffic controller. They're polding
for weather and they're just too embarrassed to tell their
air traffic controller that we're out of gas. And I
mean there's more than one time that's happened, and so
for her to tell us that, and as a pilot,
I mean immediately recognize she's saying she's long gas. She's
admitting a huge mistake here. And I think folks, and
(28:27):
not the disparage in bates come before us. But if
you're in mariner, you don't think about that low and gas.
Well I'm out of gas. Well I just flowed for
the rest of them. That's a big problem being out
of gas as a pilot. The other thing was the winds,
you know. I mean you're coming into an airport. The
first thing you want to know as a pilot is
what's the wind speed? I need to know which direction
to land.
Speaker 2 (28:44):
She did not know.
Speaker 3 (28:45):
She said she was flying a thousand feet. She didn't
know what the winds were at that surface. She couldn't
communicate with the boat. And that's also something I don't
think a lot of folks have keyed in on, which
helped us with our analysis.
Speaker 1 (28:54):
To that point. Though given the echo you're getting back,
it looks like she landed well enough that the plane
didn't break up.
Speaker 2 (29:05):
That's right.
Speaker 3 (29:06):
We always believe that she landed softly on the surface
and it didn't crack up, and I think that's a
very reasonable conclusion. There's been other exact aircraft blockheyed electors
that have landed on the water and did not. It
is a structurally very strong She was trying to fly
from Hawaii to Howland. That was for her first attempt,
and she crashed on takeoff. The plane was actually still
in good condition. And then of course she tried and
(29:26):
then she switched around decided to fly the other way
around the world. And we all agree that if this
is a debris field, we're not going to find it.
We had not tuned and filtered our sonar for small targets.
Speaker 1 (29:35):
I'm very curious Tony, what it is they had done
with the elector that made it unique and that enabled
you to sort of check off that it was probably
her plane.
Speaker 3 (29:46):
There was a couple key characteristics, these twin vertical stabilizers
in the back that was very distinctive of her aircraft.
There have been others that have been built that way,
but this was very distinctive of hers. They don't really
make planes that way anymore. The center gravity is very
far forward on the aircraft in relationship to the nose,
and we see that with the sunar image. And thirdly,
the dimensions of the plane are very similar of the
sunar image are very similar to what her aircraft was.
Speaker 1 (30:08):
So what is your next step, Yeah.
Speaker 3 (30:10):
To get out there and confirm it and then get
all the interested parties involved.
Speaker 2 (30:14):
We've invited the Earhart family.
Speaker 3 (30:15):
To come out with us, in which they've agreed to,
and they're excited about anybody else that we feel has
an interest in being a part of the confirmation and
the verification and then ultimately, I hope the salvage of
the plane. I mean, I'd like to bring it off
and bring her home.
Speaker 1 (30:28):
If you get it to the surface. Does that set
off a whole series of legal questions?
Speaker 3 (30:33):
It absolutely does. It's a complex one. There's a lot
of interested parties. The plane was not insured and it
was a private plane, so privately owned that puts them
in a certain category. The area that's found is going
to make a difference. You know, how it's sitting in
the sand actually also makes a difference. So these are
things that we're going to have to kind of work through.
We're going to expect to get all the interested parties
together and we'll sort it out.
Speaker 1 (30:55):
When do you think you'll go back.
Speaker 3 (30:56):
Twenty twenty four? You know, hopefully we can make an
announcement on your podcast when we do.
Speaker 1 (31:00):
If we can work out the details, we would love
to talk to you at some point on the boat
out there. That would be a great podcast, wouldn't that
be fun?
Speaker 2 (31:09):
That would be sort of a report to the country.
Speaker 3 (31:11):
Say what you walk about Elan must But he has
changed the world with Starlink. I tell you what when
we were out there in Tuvalu. He's given Starlink to
these islands out in the Pacific on the condition they
go out and clean up the beaches and all the pollution,
all the stuff, this garbage, and they come back every
month and if there's garbage and not taking care of
the waste properly, that he.
Speaker 2 (31:29):
Pulls the starlink away from him.
Speaker 3 (31:30):
And that, to me is just brilliant and I love
seeing that is a great example of a private sector solution.
Speaker 1 (31:36):
Entrepreneurs actually solve.
Speaker 3 (31:37):
Problems absolutely one hundred percent. It's this organic ground swell
of absolutely yep, you.
Speaker 1 (31:42):
Know, and you might real entice a whole generation of
young people to decide to become entrepreneurs.
Speaker 2 (31:48):
I hope, so you're.
Speaker 1 (31:49):
Doing fun things when you get out there. Let's find
out a data and we'll do an interim report while
you're out there, and then another one after you get back.
I think people will be fascinated by what you're doing
and how you're doing it. You'll be in our prayers
and you'll be on our best wishes. I think what
you're doing is exactly what America is all about. You're
(32:09):
going into the unknown, you're trying something that's a big risk,
and you're using your mind and science and technology to
solve something which has not been solved for almost nine decades.
Speaker 3 (32:20):
Thank you a lot of the inspirations Amelia herself. She
was the ultimate entrepreneur, innovator. We're making a documentary on this.
It's called why Not Us? Why can't five unknown guys
solve aviation's greatest mystery? You know, whether it's the plane
or not. I hope it's inspiration for folks. There's this
one thing you've always wanted to do, Go do it.
If you're inspired, go do it.
Speaker 1 (32:37):
Tony ownA, thank you for joining me on news World.
The explanation you're doing is fascinating. You are, frankly a
fascinating guy. I really hope that you have found her plane.
I look forward to being part of talking with you
as you go back. We look forward very much to
continuing to brief our listeners about what you're doing. So
thank you for being with us.
Speaker 2 (32:57):
Thank you, speaker, I appreciate it. Thanks Having on.
Speaker 5 (33:02):
This modern world of science and invention is of particular
interest to women, for the lives of women have been
more affected by its new horizons than those of any
other group. Profound and stirring as have been accomplishments in
the remoter fields of pure research, it is in the
home that the applications of scientific achievement have perhaps been
(33:24):
most far reaching, and it is through changing conditions there
that women have become the greatest beneficiaries in the modern schemes.
Science has released them from much of the age old
grudgery connected with the process of living. Candle dipping, weaving,
and crude methods of manufacturing necessities are things of the past.
(33:47):
For an increasing majority today, light, heat and power may
be obtained by pushing buttons, and cunningly manufactured and appealing
products of all the world are available at the house
vice door. Indeed, beyond that door she need not go.
Thanks to the miracles of modern communication and transportation, not
(34:09):
only has applied science decreased the toil in the home,
but it has provided undreamed of economic opportunities for women. Today,
millions of them are earning their living under conditions made
possible only through a basically holed industrial system. Probably no
scientific development is more startling than the effect of this
(34:32):
new and growing economic independence upon women themselves. When the
history of our times is written, it must record as
supremely significant the physical, psychic, and social changes women have
undergone in these exciting decades. The impetus of the sociological
(34:53):
evolution of the last halst century should be largely credited
to those who have toil and laboratory, and those who
are translated into practical use the fruits of such labors.
Among all the marvels of modern invention, that with which
I am most concerned is, of course, air transportation. Flying
(35:15):
is perhaps the most dramatic of recent scientific attainment. In
the brief span of thirty odd years, the world has
seen an inventor's dream, first materialized by the Wright brothers
at Kitty Hawk, become an everyday actuality. Perhaps I am prejudiced,
but to me it seems that no other phase of
(35:36):
modern progress contrives to maintain such a brimming measure of
romance and beauty coupled with utility as does aviation. Within itself,
this industry embraces many of those scientific accomplishments which yesterday
seem fantastic impossibilities. Aviation, this young modern giant, exemplifies a
(35:59):
possible relationship of women and the creations of science. Although
women as yet have not taken full advantage of its
use and benefits, air travel is as available to them
as to men. As so often happens in introducing the
new or changing the old, public acceptance depends peculiarly upon
(36:21):
women's friendly attitudes in aviation. They are arbiters of whether
or not their families shall fly, and as such are
a potent influence. And lastly, there is a place within
the industry itself for women who work. While still greatly outnumbered,
they are finding more and more opportunities for employment in
(36:43):
the ranks of this latest transportation medium. May I hope
this movement will spread throughout all branches of applied science
and industry, and that women may come to share with
men the joy of doing those can appreciate the world
most who have helped create.
Speaker 1 (37:06):
Thank you to my guest Tony Romeo. You can learn
more about deep Sea Vision on our show page at
newtsworld dot com. Newtsworld is produced by Gingrish three sixty
and iHeartMedia. Our executive producer is Guernsey Sloan and our
researcher is Rachel Peterson. The artwork for the show was
created by Steve Penley. Special thanks to the team at
(37:29):
ginglestree sixty. If you've been enjoying Newtsworld, I hope you'll
go to Apple Podcast and both rate us with five
stars and give us a review so others can learn
what it's all about. Right now, listeners of Newtsworld can
sign up for my three free weekly columns at gingrishtree
sixty dot com slash newsletter. I'm newt Gingrich. This is Newtsworld.
On this episode of Nuts World. Amelia Earhart was a
pioneer in aviation. In nineteen twenty eight, publisher George Putnam
picked Earhart to become the first woman to cross the
Atlantic by plane as a passenger. When her flight landed
in Wales, she became a media sensation and a symbol
of what women could achieve. In nineteen thirty two, she
(00:26):
became the first woman to fly solo across the Atlantic
as a pilot. Her awards included the American Distinguished Flying
Cross and the Cross of the French Legion of Honor. However,
Earhart would not live to her fortieth birthday. During an
attempt of becoming the first woman to complete a circumnavigational
flight of the globe in nineteen thirty seven, Earhart and
(00:49):
her navigator Fred Noonan disappeared over the Central Pacific Ocean
near Holland Island. The two were last seen in Lay
in New Guinea on July second, nineteen thirty seven, on
the last landstop before Holland Island and one of their
final legs of their flight. Her disappearance remains one of
(01:10):
the great unsolved mysteries of the twentieth century. For eighty
seven years, people have been trying to find her plane,
a twin engine Lockheed ten E Electra. Here to talk
about the search for Earhart's plane and his recent discovery.
I am really pleased to welcome my guest, Tony Romeo,
(01:30):
CEO of Deep Sea Vision, a marine robotics company specializing
in deep ocean exploration and survey. Tony, welcome and thank
(01:51):
you for joining me on News World.
Speaker 2 (01:54):
Thank you, speaker. I appreciate that.
Speaker 1 (01:55):
So before we talk about your discovery, I just want
to start by talking about Amelia Earhart. You have a
great quote in the Wall Street Journal quote. For her
to go missing was just unthinkable. Imagine Taylor Swift just
disappearing today. I mean, Earhart really had a level of
international fame that was astounding for that time period. Why
(02:19):
was she so famous? Man? Can you talk about aviation
and the role of this pioneering woman during the time
that she was there.
Speaker 3 (02:27):
Sure, that's a great question. I appreciate all the questions
have been asked over the last couple of days. I
think that's one of the best because the story is
about her. She is America's favorite missing person, right not
Jimmy Hoffa, but he's famous too. But Emilia Art is
our favorite missing person. And you know, as long as
she's missing, there's gonna be someone out there looking for
She came from a humble upbringing. She was a nurse
(02:47):
in World War One in Toronto, and she just fell
in love with flying. And she seemed like you're just average,
normal American and she was tapped on the shoulder to
do something great and she ran with it, and to
do it she did then, flying across the Atlantic, flying
across the Pacific solo, and setting these speed records, distance records,
flying records were just unheard of, and especially for women.
(03:10):
And it's just so impressed with what she did. There's
a lot of people wouldn't do what she did then,
They wouldn't do it now, certainly not with the technology
that she used. Just a fascinating person. And by the way,
you know, aviation pioneer, early advocate for women's rights, but
also tremendous author. She wrote a book called for the
Fun of It, one of the best books you've never
heard of.
Speaker 1 (03:28):
It's called for the Fun of It.
Speaker 3 (03:30):
Yep, terrific. She was so gracious, She was incredibly gracious.
She never said anything bad about anyone. I mean, you
knew when she didn't like somebody, but she never said
anything bad. She is so clever, so witty. She actually
wrote four books. I feel like of all the things
known about Meli are, that's one of the most unknown things.
Tremendous author and just very intelligent women.
Speaker 1 (03:47):
As late as nineteen thirty there were still only two
hundred female pilots. That it really had been a field
that females had not been very accepted in. So she
was really outstanding as a pioneer at a time when
it was very rare.
Speaker 3 (04:02):
And here's another fact for you, Knut that is very interesting,
I think is she was the first woman to cross
the Atlantic right, solo. But she was the first woman
to fly across the Atlantic. Said, but she was actually
the second person. I mean, of course, you know it
was Charles Lindbergh was the first one, but she was
the second one to do it, and there were no
other men that did it. It was her. She was
the second person to do it. So and solo, by
the way, I mean, just incredible, incredible thing to do.
Speaker 1 (04:24):
I think now that we do it routinely in large
passenger ships, we don't realize back then, But I mean
everything about whether the engine could work, whether you run
out of fuel, whether your navigation was good enough. I mean,
these were real pioneers and they were taking real risks.
Now it's interesting, though, because I think because she was
(04:45):
so daring and because she was breaking these records, she
really became sort of a symbol and attracted a lot
more women into becoming pilots.
Speaker 3 (04:55):
Totally agree, absolutely for sure, and not just in the aviation.
Encouraged women to break the barriers of all sorts of professions,
and she called her the cockpit, her kitchen. Basically, she
was encouraging women to get out there and pursue careers,
and I think it was a wonderful message and it resonated.
Speaker 1 (05:12):
Part of that process. She became a friend of Eleanor Roosevelt,
the first lady who herself had really strongly advocated women's
rights and women pursuing careers and women making a contribution.
And she became the first woman vice president of the
National Aeronautic Association, which actually kept the official records and races,
(05:33):
and she convinced them to have separate female records because
women did not have the money or planes to fairly
compete against men. For world titles. The other thing that
you were talking about. She wrote, but in addition to writing,
she also gave lectures all over the country. She was
a person who was a star in her own right,
and people came there. And I didn't know this, but
(05:56):
she designed a whole line of women's clothing, dresses, blouses, pants, suits, hats,
using her own sewing machine, her own dress form, her
own seems just. She modeled them for promotional things, and
so people could actually sort of read her books, listen
to her speech, and then wear her clothing. This wasn't
(06:16):
a cultural phenomenon.
Speaker 2 (06:17):
That's right.
Speaker 3 (06:18):
And a luggage line, and they also had her at
one point, I think, promoting cigarettes, which she absolutely hated
because she didn't smoke.
Speaker 1 (06:25):
You mentioned that she designed this line of lightweight, canvas
covered plywood luggage. I didn't realize this Earhart luggage was
sold into the nineteen nineties.
Speaker 2 (06:34):
I didn't know that either. That's wow.
Speaker 1 (06:36):
Incredible talk about lasting as an impact. And of course
she became a household name. People knew who she was.
I was amazed. Now she broke the women's attitude record
when she got to fourteen thousand feet. That's in nineteen
twenty two, and then, as you point out, six years later,
she crosses the Atlantic in twenty hours and forty minutes.
(06:56):
I mean again and again, she's just doing stuff. Is remarkable.
Did she have a close relationship with the aircraft manufacturers.
Speaker 2 (07:05):
She did. With the Lockheed Martin folks. She did.
Speaker 3 (07:08):
They kind of specially designed the aircraft for her. It
was Purdue University. You mentioned that she was a teacher
and a professor. She actually was a teacher at Purdue
University who in large part ended up buying and giving
to her as a gift the aircraft, the Lockheed Martin Electra.
So yeah, she had a very close relationship with them
and Gary Johnson, so yeah.
Speaker 2 (07:27):
A very close relationship.
Speaker 3 (07:28):
And she knew most of all the pilots and aircraft
manufacturers at the time, and she was obviously so well known.
She knew the president. She was invited to numerous events
with FDR. I mean, she was really a worldwide celebrity.
Speaker 1 (07:38):
She goes coast to coast, setting a women's record. I
didn't realize this. She flies from Honolulu to Oakland, which
is a twenty four hundred mile trump. I mean, it's
comparable to crossing the Atlantic.
Speaker 2 (07:50):
Sure, yep.
Speaker 1 (07:52):
And apparently that was also the first flight where a
civilian aircraft carried a two way radio. So here you
have somebody who was a pioneer in technology, a pioneer
in achievements, pioneer in women's roles, in a variety of ways.
She flew from Los Angeles to Mexico City. That took
thirteen hours back then with the equipment, that's a long
(08:13):
time to stay awake.
Speaker 2 (08:15):
And you're a funny part with that story.
Speaker 3 (08:16):
She was flying in Mexico City and somehow she got
lost or she wasn't sure where she was at, and
she just landed in this ranch land and got off
and there was a guy and a horse there, and
she stopped and asked him how to get to Mexico City,
and he told her, yeah, it's that way, just a
little bit further, and she got back in the plane,
took off the guy's farm, and finished the flight.
Speaker 1 (08:33):
You can't quite imagine how really on the edge she
was living. And when she began her worldwide flight around
the world in thirty seven, she becomes the first person
man or woman to fly from the Red Sea to India.
That is a long flight and it's the same thing
you're talking about earlier with Mexico. I mean, here you
are in an area. Nowadays we have all of these
(08:54):
electronic devices and they're sort of electronic highways in the sky.
These folks are doing at the hard way totally different.
So from your perspective, when did you get interested in
a milliar are heart?
Speaker 2 (09:07):
Oh?
Speaker 3 (09:08):
Since I was a kid, I've always been fascinated with
the story. My dad flew for Pan American for over
forty years, and my brother is a pilot in the
Air Force. My other brother has his past license, my
sister has a past license. I have my past life.
So it's been a story that's just always from early
age growing up, that we always talked about.
Speaker 2 (09:23):
You know.
Speaker 3 (09:23):
It's just recently that you know, he really got deep
into researching and I said, why has this not been
solved yet? All the information is there, and you know,
as a dug deeper, it wasn't necessarily that people don't
know where she went down. We all know generally the area.
The problem was logistically how difficult and challenging it is
to get to Howland Island. It's a very deep ocean
out there in the Pacific. It's days away from anything else.
(09:45):
So to mount an expedition go out there and do
a search is extremely expensive and it's challenging. There's only
been five serious attempts at finding an airplane deep ocean searches.
David Jordan one of the greats in the history of Amilliard,
He's done three of them, and Ted Waite of Gayweight Computers,
Found to Get with Computers has done another one. And
so it's not an easy thing to do, and so
it's just for us. It was can we do this?
(10:05):
Can we actually put this together? If I can get
into it. My tactic on the tackling this problem was
not to do it as a lease, go out and
lease equipment, but actually set up a business deep sea
vision where we buy the equipment and then we turn
into a larger kind of operation where we can use
this equipment for other contracts and jobs out in the Pacific.
And there's a backlog of work out there between pipe surveys,
(10:26):
wind farm jobs, other rec surveys. So if we could
buy this equipment, we could bring the cost way down
and then work in our Amelia airhard searches and other projects.
Isn't the only one we're interested in? World War two stuff.
So for me, this was a perfect opportunity of switching
careers out of real estate get into something a little
bit more adventurous and exciting.
Speaker 1 (10:43):
How far is it from Holland Island to other larger places.
Speaker 3 (10:48):
It's about three days away. I mean the closest island
is care Body. If you look at it looks like
but it's pronounced careboss. There's another island that's Tuvalu American
samoas a couple of days away, So it's really in
the middle of nowhere. I mean she was flying there.
It was right on the equator. She was flying there
as a stopping point on her next leg to Whii.
She needed to refuel, so the US Coast Guard had
put some fuel there for her and built a runway
(11:10):
actually for so she could land and refuel and then
take off and fly to Hawaii and finish off the trip.
Speaker 1 (11:14):
When I was reading about you to work, I was
really surprised. I mean, if you get the Coast Guard
to go all that way to build a runway and
to bring aviation fuel, she was really getting significant support
to try to help her succeed. That's a pretty big deal.
Speaker 3 (11:29):
Oh yeah, I know, And I think the President was involved,
FDR was involved on a few of the requests. They
built a runway on Helland Island for especially for her
to land there, and they had people stationed there for
waiting for her rival. And there was another ship halfway
between Papa New Guinea and Holland also trying to help
her track her way to Helland Island.
Speaker 2 (11:45):
So there was a lot of support. It was a
big deal. It was a worldwide event.
Speaker 3 (11:48):
I mean, it was an opportunity, I think, to showcase
American innovativeness, American bravery. Somebody, an American could fly around
the world, American women could fly on the world, So
I mean, I think it was a great opportunity for
the country to show case a true American hero.
Speaker 1 (12:01):
They also have been that having been personal friends with
Elin Roosevelt didn't exactly hurt and getting the President to
say to the Coast Guard, g wouldn't you like to
go down to Holland Island?
Speaker 2 (12:13):
She absolutely leveraged don yep which is.
Speaker 1 (12:16):
Just kind of remarkable. Now. She leaves Miami on June first,
nineteen thirty seven, in what is a planned program, which
given things like what they were doing in Holland, they
must have really thought this through and planned it out
as around the world project.
Speaker 2 (12:32):
Imagine that.
Speaker 3 (12:33):
Imagine doing something like that today, buying the tickets and
figuring out your visas. And I mean, you're talking about
a time when flying in some of these airports, you
didn't even know what to expect. There were some countries
that had required vaccinations, there were countries that were having
malaria outbreaks. There were maps that didn't even have accurate
roads and navigational guides for her. All this was done
through telegrams, right. They weren't texting each other and emailing
(12:54):
and figuring this out. This is all telegrams. And a
lot of people fault her for this communication plan and
not being better on the radios, and I'm like, you
can't do that, It's not fair. This is nineteen thirty seven.
People weren't talking to each other on the radios back then,
Between aircrafts, it was all in its infancy. She was
breaking ground in so many different ways.
Speaker 2 (13:11):
It's incredible.
Speaker 1 (13:30):
It strikes me that when she did go missing, people
had this wide range of explanations of what happened. I
remember one time there was a period where they thought
maybe the Japanese had forced her down because she had
gotten near the islands that they were in charge of
in the South Pacific. People were looking for all sorts
of explanations, and I think for a long time people thought,
(13:52):
you know, she might be found alive, even though during
World War Two we were all.
Speaker 2 (13:56):
Over the region right right right.
Speaker 1 (14:00):
Well, the search itself, they had nine vessels with four
thousand crew and sixty six aircraft out there looking for
it cost over four million dollars, which back then was
real money.
Speaker 3 (14:13):
Yeah, it was the largest search and rescue operation of
its time, and there's been a lot of debate on
that number you just read out there. I mean, these
are servicemen that were already in the military, already in
the navy. So I mean, you know, you add up
their salaries and say, okay, it's four million dollars search,
But I mean, like they could have been sitting at
Pearl Harbor. You know a lot of these guys were
pulled from Pearl Harbor to go out and.
Speaker 2 (14:32):
Do the search.
Speaker 3 (14:32):
So they're still in the Navy, they're still getting paid.
So to say that the money was spent for meli
are is not I don't think that's I mean, the
efforts could have been done better on training. I guess
you could say, but there probably were fuel costs that
were used. But I mean an enormous amount of resources
were put into finding her. But I will say this
interesting thing that came out of the search was that
our maps got better. And one of the things we've
(14:53):
learned since she had the wrong map, Helen Island was
plotted incorrectly on her map by off by six miles.
Some folks say that could have contributed to her. But
by going out there, the Navy learned a lot about
the Pacific, about a lot of the islands, and you know,
I think some of that was used in preparation for
World War Two.
Speaker 1 (15:08):
What people need to realize is if you're off by
six miles and you don't know which way you're lost,
it's not like, oh, let's just have a mid course correction. Well,
I noticed that that a battleship which was going to
go on a cruise for ROTC Midshipman. So they sent
a battleship all the way down. They sent the aircraft
carrier of Lexington, which was one of the two biggest
(15:31):
carriers we had at the time. Then that particular carrier
had sixty three aircraft. I mean, they really went all
out trying to see if they could find her. It
gives you a sense of how famous she really was. Yep.
So all of this has happened. She becomes very famous,
and there's a great mystery here. Her husband, George Putnam,
(15:55):
financed his own search until October thirty seven. She was
finally declared officially dead after being lost at sea. It's tragic,
but then the searches start and people have never given up.
As you're an example. Tell us about you in a sense.
I mean, you're out here, you have created this company.
(16:15):
You're off doing something which has to be just totally absorbing.
Speaker 3 (16:19):
Yeah, it's been a fascinating adventure. It's start to finish.
It's been eighteen months or so. I mean, I thought
this would be an easy thing to plan, and the
more I got into it, the more I realized how
complex this is. Organizing vessels and people and equipment, you know,
mobilizing to get out to a very remote area of
the world has been extremely challenging.
Speaker 1 (16:37):
Part of what makes it possible from your standpoint is
that you have deep sea vision. Can you describe the
company and what it does and what its unique strengths are.
Speaker 3 (16:47):
So we have the latest AUV ever built in An
AUV is an autonomous underwater vehicle and it's this red
submarine looking thing. There's nobody inside of it. It's completely autonomous, unmanned,
and it's called the Huguen six thousands.
Speaker 2 (17:00):
Built by Kongsberg.
Speaker 3 (17:01):
And what it does is it goes down six thousand
meters almost all the way down to the full ocean
depth to the seafloor about fifty meters off the seafloor.
And what it does is basically mosalon and just goes
back and forth, back and forth, back and forth, and
it just scanning everything it's looking at using sound, and
then it's recording all of that and then it comes
back to the surface. It's untethered, it's not connected to
the ship. We're not seeing a real time video of anything.
(17:22):
And so for thirty six hours, we don't know what
it's looking at. We have no idea what it's seen.
Comes back up, we put in the computer and then
we analyze all this data. And I mean it is
an enormous amount of data. Imagine looking at I don't
know what Long Island is, but like the area of
Long Island hundred fifty square miles and picking through it
to find one object that's twelve by eighteen meters, And
so our strength is we've got this deep water sonar.
(17:44):
And then also I knew I would need the best
talent to basically launch this, and I hired a guy
named Craig Wallace who built the Huguen six thousand in Norway,
and we ran into each other at a bar in
Norway while I was out there training on the system,
and he was just so excited and fell in love
with the idea. Finding Miliart worked for Kongsberg for almost
twenty years, and I said, why don't you come with
us and help us make this a success, And about
(18:06):
a week later it was done. He was on board,
so it was having him along out there, and we
specially modified the system so it could scan even wider,
and we had a great team of guys. I mean,
we came at this from a business perspective. Everything was
about fine tuning the cost, getting a fuel efficient boat
because the fuel you're burning out there is not negligible,
and having a small crew so things go wrong, you're
(18:27):
not having to deal with a lot of problems. The
formula was to maximize our time out there, scan the
most area if possible, and do this as smartly as
possible so we could be successful.
Speaker 1 (18:36):
One of the things that you use is synthetic aperture sonar.
What is synthetic aperture so far.
Speaker 3 (18:45):
So it's this idea of stretching the array out a
normal side scan. You're just sending a ping and you're
listening back a ping and you're listening back and he
creates an image of synthetic aperture sonar is you're sending
a ping numerous pings out and as the submarine is
traveling through the water, there's an antenna basically as an
array and is listening for the return sound comes, so
(19:05):
it hits the wall, it hits the plane, and then
it comes back right and you're creating an image. Well,
what this does is it's ping A goes out. You're
sending ping, B ping, PC ping, and you're listening as
the array. As the submarine is going through the water,
the antenna is almost like making it longer and longer,
so it's not actually that long, but based on where
its starting point was and where it's listening, you've created
(19:26):
a longer antenna and You can therefore listen to more
pings and you can create a mesh of the sound
and make a better image basically, and you can look
out further.
Speaker 1 (19:37):
Is the ability to use that at the depth you
were at a new capability.
Speaker 3 (19:42):
SaaS is a new thing within the last I don't know,
I say a decade. I'm not really sure it is new.
It's changed the game for sonar for sure.
Speaker 1 (19:50):
What depth were you operating at?
Speaker 3 (19:52):
About five thousand meters? About fifteen thousand feet? Yeah, everything
the ocean is measured in meters.
Speaker 1 (19:57):
Well, actually, i'll probably about sixteen thousand feet.
Speaker 2 (19:59):
Yeah, that's right.
Speaker 1 (19:59):
Yeah, it's not as deep as the Mariana Trench, but
it's deep.
Speaker 2 (20:02):
It's deep.
Speaker 3 (20:03):
And for reference, you have about forty five hundred feet
deeper than the Titanic.
Speaker 1 (20:06):
That's wild. So you're looking for something deeper and you're
looking for a smaller.
Speaker 2 (20:10):
Thing, that's right.
Speaker 1 (20:11):
Yeah, well put yeah, So and what you do is
you just scan a grid back and forth.
Speaker 2 (20:18):
That's it.
Speaker 1 (20:18):
So how long were you scanning? How many weeks did
it take?
Speaker 2 (20:21):
We were out there about three months.
Speaker 3 (20:22):
We came about this mathematically and a little bit statistically, right,
we've divided the area. We wanted to search into sectors,
and we assigned probabilities to each of those sectors, and
then we also, as sign a difficulty, leveled each of
those sectors based on the terrain that we knew was
on the seafloor. And then once we could mesh those
two together, we could say, well, we want to tackle
the most equal probability stuff the fastest, even if it's
(20:44):
equal probability. But it's harder to do because you have
ravines and valleys. We'll save that for the end, but
let's cover as much territory as we can if it's
the same probability. And that was our approach, and I
think it was a good one.
Speaker 1 (20:55):
When you're doing that, did you find other stuff?
Speaker 3 (20:59):
We didn't find a lot. To be honest with you,
We've got a question a few times. No shipwrecks, no
other planes.
Speaker 1 (21:04):
That's interesting.
Speaker 2 (21:05):
Yeah, there's no shipping lanes out there.
Speaker 1 (21:07):
I guess it was an area that many people went to.
Speaker 3 (21:09):
Now a lot of people know this, but it was attacked.
Holand Island was attacked. I believe this a couple of
days after Pearl Harbor. Just one of those weird quirks
in history. We had colonized, and use that word very loosely,
but we had colonized the line islands, Polin Island, Baker Island,
and Jarvis Island with I think five or six folks.
I think that was our signal to Japan saying, hey,
these are our islands out here, and Japan came by
(21:29):
with some of their zeros, some of their fighter planes
and straight the island killed a couple of Americans on
the island, believe it.
Speaker 1 (21:35):
Or not, which is their way of saying, no, it's.
Speaker 2 (21:37):
Not, it's not. That's right exactly.
Speaker 1 (21:57):
In terms of your own background, which is fascinating. Dad
was a pilot, as you point out earlier for pan Am,
you and all of your siblings have pilot's licenses, so
it must really be in the family.
Speaker 2 (22:08):
That's right.
Speaker 3 (22:09):
We definitely were encouraged to fly. I was flying in
high school. I was fourteen or fifteen. My sister was
teaching at the Air Force Academy actually, and her husband
was two. So I ended up going to the academy. Basically,
right at the end, I decided I didn't want to fly.
It was stressing me out. I liked flying, don't get
me wrong. I had my license and I've flown a
fair amount since I graduated, but it just wasn't Being
a professional or commercial pilot was just not my thing.
Speaker 1 (22:29):
You went to the Air Force Academy and spent six
years a lot of it with an F sixteen squadron,
so you got a fair amount of flight time.
Speaker 2 (22:38):
In Yeah, I did get a couple of flights F sixteen.
That was a lot of fun.
Speaker 1 (22:41):
You leave the service, you create a company. I'm assuming
it's called Quickly. It's kwkly, did I.
Speaker 2 (22:47):
Guess right, that's right?
Speaker 1 (22:49):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, and it's using mobile phones to connect
home buyers with agents. And then the company, which now
is Zillo, actually bought your startup. That's right, classic contraship.
And then you go all the way across the country,
having grown up in Washington State, and you end up
attending the Charleston School of Law and marrying your wife,
(23:10):
Melissa Moss. I mean, you're in Mount Pleasant in North Charleston.
It was a very nice area. That's a good quality
of life. But then after COVID you start thinking about
something different, which is called magnet fishing. What is magnet fishing?
Speaker 3 (23:27):
So, yeah, so it was the article in read in
the Wall Street Journal. It's about I had not heard
anything about this. This is an activity that kind of
got started during COVID, But it's basically, you have a
big magnet, powerful magnet, and you have a rope tattoo,
and you just drop it off a bridge or peer
or whatever, and you just drag it along the bottom
of the ground and then you pull it up and
you see what sticks to it.
Speaker 2 (23:47):
I mean you get.
Speaker 3 (23:48):
Scissors and fishing gear and some people pulling guns and safes,
I mean, bicycles, I mean all kinds of crazy stuff.
And so our kids were not going to school, which
wasn't long down you're in South Caroline, by the way.
Speaker 2 (24:00):
They ended up pretty quickly, but I went up going
out with my five.
Speaker 3 (24:02):
Year old son, and this was like treasure hunting for him, right,
I mean didn't matter we were pulling up, you know,
a screwdriver.
Speaker 2 (24:07):
It was like cool.
Speaker 3 (24:08):
And so that got me thinking about what else is
out here in the oceans that could be pulled up
and that could be found, and that the idea of
finding Amelia Earhart with magnets was like the original idea.
But then I quickly realized this was isn't practical obviously,
but you know, it got me thinking, like, why has
this one not been solved? We're eighty seven years on,
We've got the technology to find it. My brother made
(24:28):
the comment that I think was very memories, said, this
isn't going to last much longer. It's about maybe about
five or ten more years on this one, and somebody's
going to find this.
Speaker 1 (24:35):
So you decided why not?
Speaker 2 (24:36):
You why not?
Speaker 3 (24:37):
And I was doing commercial real estate, So after law
school I got into commercial real estate. I like, do
these chapters in my life, the Air Force tech stuff
and law and then commercial real estate and so now
we got the deep sea expiration. I like the different chapters.
It's fun and maybe one point get into policy. That's
one of the things i'd follow in your footsteps. And
I'm not sure what fashion, but I'd like to do that.
Speaker 1 (24:56):
At some point, you're sort of moving beyond the magnets
of the concept of underwater and you end up dealing
with a company in Norway. What takes you to Norway?
Speaker 3 (25:07):
Congsberg, the company that makes these equipments, the Huguen six thousand.
They're basically the gold standard in sub sea equipment. They're
basically the only ones if you want a subse submersible
capable of going down six thousand meters. You have to
get it from them, and actually we bought it. Funny story,
it took eight months just to have them release the
equipment because it was such sensitive. Equipment's usually only sold
(25:28):
to militaries. And so here's this guy, random guy from
South Carolina. We were contacting the US embassy, folks that
I knew in the Pentagon, and finally they released it
on all this list of conditions. I mean, it just
kind of threw them, is like, this is not a
common request for somebody just coming randomly buy a deep
sea submersible equipment. We had to go to Norway and
do some training for about a month out there in
(25:48):
the Fjords, which was in December, which was super cold.
Speaker 1 (25:51):
It's a pretty expensive piece of equipment, isn't it.
Speaker 2 (25:53):
That's right, nine million dollars. Yeah, you were.
Speaker 1 (25:55):
All in at this point. I have to ask you,
in passing, what's your wife's reaction?
Speaker 2 (26:05):
Great question?
Speaker 4 (26:06):
Skeptical, maybe less so now that you may have actually
found the plane. Yeah, so you take this remarkable modern technology,
you go to the Pacific, you spend three months, and
you find a reflection which looks like it has the
(26:27):
same dimensions and shape of a Lockheed Electra, which is
the plane that Erhart was what what was your reaction
when you're sitting there looking at the screen and you
suddenly see this.
Speaker 2 (26:39):
I mean, it's surreal.
Speaker 3 (26:40):
It was right the last day of the expedition and
everyone's frustrated, and it was a moment of realization for me.
I remember sitting down. Some folks said a few words,
you know, we're producing documentary. You have to watch the documentary.
Hear those words. I don't know what I'm can or
can't say on in the podcast, but it was one
of those Eureka moments. I remember thinking it, this is
the first time anybody seen the plane. If this is it,
(27:00):
this is the first time her plane has been seen
in eighty six, eighty seven years, and it was incredible
to know that there was. It's not a ghost, it's
not Bigfoot, it actually exists.
Speaker 1 (27:10):
It's interesting that you feel that having three pilots thinking
this through was actually an advantage over having people who
are primarily mariners dealing with ocean events. What do you
think was the advantage of being pilots.
Speaker 3 (27:25):
I appreciate you asking that we came about this with
a pilot mindset. A lot of folks they dissect her
final thirty minutes and say, well, she would have done
this nice neat search grid, and she would have done this,
and she thought she was out of gas. Every turn
she made. She thought that was the last turn that
she had. You know, one comment that she makes at
the very end of she's low on gas. It's one
of the last things that she tells us, she's low
(27:46):
on gas. And I can tell you no pilot is
going to admit they're low on gas. I can promise
you that, because when you tell people that you just
admitted you've made the biggest mistake. You take off with
enough gas and you're saying I'm low on gas, you're
admitting a huge, huge mista. And that's a huge clue
for us because it tells us she's not low on gas,
she's out of gas. She's basically out of gas. That's
(28:06):
why she's selling. And there's been cases of commercial airliners
that have gone into the ground because the pilots are
too embarrassed to call the air traffic controller. They're polding
for weather and they're just too embarrassed to tell their
air traffic controller that we're out of gas. And I
mean there's more than one time that's happened, and so
for her to tell us that, and as a pilot,
I mean immediately recognize she's saying she's long gas. She's
admitting a huge mistake here. And I think folks, and
(28:27):
not the disparage in bates come before us. But if
you're in mariner, you don't think about that low and gas.
Well I'm out of gas. Well I just flowed for
the rest of them. That's a big problem being out
of gas as a pilot. The other thing was the winds,
you know. I mean you're coming into an airport. The
first thing you want to know as a pilot is
what's the wind speed? I need to know which direction
to land.
Speaker 2 (28:44):
She did not know.
Speaker 3 (28:45):
She said she was flying a thousand feet. She didn't
know what the winds were at that surface. She couldn't
communicate with the boat. And that's also something I don't
think a lot of folks have keyed in on, which
helped us with our analysis.
Speaker 1 (28:54):
To that point. Though given the echo you're getting back,
it looks like she landed well enough that the plane
didn't break up.
Speaker 2 (29:05):
That's right.
Speaker 3 (29:06):
We always believe that she landed softly on the surface
and it didn't crack up, and I think that's a
very reasonable conclusion. There's been other exact aircraft blockheyed electors
that have landed on the water and did not. It
is a structurally very strong She was trying to fly
from Hawaii to Howland. That was for her first attempt,
and she crashed on takeoff. The plane was actually still
in good condition. And then of course she tried and
(29:26):
then she switched around decided to fly the other way
around the world. And we all agree that if this
is a debris field, we're not going to find it.
We had not tuned and filtered our sonar for small targets.
Speaker 1 (29:35):
I'm very curious Tony, what it is they had done
with the elector that made it unique and that enabled
you to sort of check off that it was probably
her plane.
Speaker 3 (29:46):
There was a couple key characteristics, these twin vertical stabilizers
in the back that was very distinctive of her aircraft.
There have been others that have been built that way,
but this was very distinctive of hers. They don't really
make planes that way anymore. The center gravity is very
far forward on the aircraft in relationship to the nose,
and we see that with the sunar image. And thirdly,
the dimensions of the plane are very similar of the
sunar image are very similar to what her aircraft was.
Speaker 1 (30:08):
So what is your next step, Yeah.
Speaker 3 (30:10):
To get out there and confirm it and then get
all the interested parties involved.
Speaker 2 (30:14):
We've invited the Earhart family.
Speaker 3 (30:15):
To come out with us, in which they've agreed to,
and they're excited about anybody else that we feel has
an interest in being a part of the confirmation and
the verification and then ultimately, I hope the salvage of
the plane. I mean, I'd like to bring it off
and bring her home.
Speaker 1 (30:28):
If you get it to the surface. Does that set
off a whole series of legal questions?
Speaker 3 (30:33):
It absolutely does. It's a complex one. There's a lot
of interested parties. The plane was not insured and it
was a private plane, so privately owned that puts them
in a certain category. The area that's found is going
to make a difference. You know, how it's sitting in
the sand actually also makes a difference. So these are
things that we're going to have to kind of work through.
We're going to expect to get all the interested parties
together and we'll sort it out.
Speaker 1 (30:55):
When do you think you'll go back.
Speaker 3 (30:56):
Twenty twenty four? You know, hopefully we can make an
announcement on your podcast when we do.
Speaker 1 (31:00):
If we can work out the details, we would love
to talk to you at some point on the boat
out there. That would be a great podcast, wouldn't that
be fun?
Speaker 2 (31:09):
That would be sort of a report to the country.
Speaker 3 (31:11):
Say what you walk about Elan must But he has
changed the world with Starlink. I tell you what when
we were out there in Tuvalu. He's given Starlink to
these islands out in the Pacific on the condition they
go out and clean up the beaches and all the pollution,
all the stuff, this garbage, and they come back every
month and if there's garbage and not taking care of
the waste properly, that he.
Speaker 2 (31:29):
Pulls the starlink away from him.
Speaker 3 (31:30):
And that, to me is just brilliant and I love
seeing that is a great example of a private sector solution.
Speaker 1 (31:36):
Entrepreneurs actually solve.
Speaker 3 (31:37):
Problems absolutely one hundred percent. It's this organic ground swell
of absolutely yep, you.
Speaker 1 (31:42):
Know, and you might real entice a whole generation of
young people to decide to become entrepreneurs.
Speaker 2 (31:48):
I hope, so you're.
Speaker 1 (31:49):
Doing fun things when you get out there. Let's find
out a data and we'll do an interim report while
you're out there, and then another one after you get back.
I think people will be fascinated by what you're doing
and how you're doing it. You'll be in our prayers
and you'll be on our best wishes. I think what
you're doing is exactly what America is all about. You're
(32:09):
going into the unknown, you're trying something that's a big risk,
and you're using your mind and science and technology to
solve something which has not been solved for almost nine decades.
Speaker 3 (32:20):
Thank you a lot of the inspirations Amelia herself. She
was the ultimate entrepreneur, innovator. We're making a documentary on this.
It's called why Not Us? Why can't five unknown guys
solve aviation's greatest mystery? You know, whether it's the plane
or not. I hope it's inspiration for folks. There's this
one thing you've always wanted to do, Go do it.
If you're inspired, go do it.
Speaker 1 (32:37):
Tony ownA, thank you for joining me on news World.
The explanation you're doing is fascinating. You are, frankly a
fascinating guy. I really hope that you have found her plane.
I look forward to being part of talking with you
as you go back. We look forward very much to
continuing to brief our listeners about what you're doing. So
thank you for being with us.
Speaker 2 (32:57):
Thank you, speaker, I appreciate it. Thanks Having on.
Speaker 5 (33:02):
This modern world of science and invention is of particular
interest to women, for the lives of women have been
more affected by its new horizons than those of any
other group. Profound and stirring as have been accomplishments in
the remoter fields of pure research, it is in the
home that the applications of scientific achievement have perhaps been
(33:24):
most far reaching, and it is through changing conditions there
that women have become the greatest beneficiaries in the modern schemes.
Science has released them from much of the age old
grudgery connected with the process of living. Candle dipping, weaving,
and crude methods of manufacturing necessities are things of the past.
(33:47):
For an increasing majority today, light, heat and power may
be obtained by pushing buttons, and cunningly manufactured and appealing
products of all the world are available at the house
vice door. Indeed, beyond that door she need not go.
Thanks to the miracles of modern communication and transportation, not
(34:09):
only has applied science decreased the toil in the home,
but it has provided undreamed of economic opportunities for women. Today,
millions of them are earning their living under conditions made
possible only through a basically holed industrial system. Probably no
scientific development is more startling than the effect of this
(34:32):
new and growing economic independence upon women themselves. When the
history of our times is written, it must record as
supremely significant the physical, psychic, and social changes women have
undergone in these exciting decades. The impetus of the sociological
(34:53):
evolution of the last halst century should be largely credited
to those who have toil and laboratory, and those who
are translated into practical use the fruits of such labors.
Among all the marvels of modern invention, that with which
I am most concerned is, of course, air transportation. Flying
(35:15):
is perhaps the most dramatic of recent scientific attainment. In
the brief span of thirty odd years, the world has
seen an inventor's dream, first materialized by the Wright brothers
at Kitty Hawk, become an everyday actuality. Perhaps I am prejudiced,
but to me it seems that no other phase of
(35:36):
modern progress contrives to maintain such a brimming measure of
romance and beauty coupled with utility as does aviation. Within itself,
this industry embraces many of those scientific accomplishments which yesterday
seem fantastic impossibilities. Aviation, this young modern giant, exemplifies a
(35:59):
possible relationship of women and the creations of science. Although
women as yet have not taken full advantage of its
use and benefits, air travel is as available to them
as to men. As so often happens in introducing the
new or changing the old, public acceptance depends peculiarly upon
(36:21):
women's friendly attitudes in aviation. They are arbiters of whether
or not their families shall fly, and as such are
a potent influence. And lastly, there is a place within
the industry itself for women who work. While still greatly outnumbered,
they are finding more and more opportunities for employment in
(36:43):
the ranks of this latest transportation medium. May I hope
this movement will spread throughout all branches of applied science
and industry, and that women may come to share with
men the joy of doing those can appreciate the world
most who have helped create.
Speaker 1 (37:06):
Thank you to my guest Tony Romeo. You can learn
more about deep Sea Vision on our show page at
newtsworld dot com. Newtsworld is produced by Gingrish three sixty
and iHeartMedia. Our executive producer is Guernsey Sloan and our
researcher is Rachel Peterson. The artwork for the show was
created by Steve Penley. Special thanks to the team at
(37:29):
ginglestree sixty. If you've been enjoying Newtsworld, I hope you'll
go to Apple Podcast and both rate us with five
stars and give us a review so others can learn
what it's all about. Right now, listeners of Newtsworld can
sign up for my three free weekly columns at gingrishtree
sixty dot com slash newsletter. I'm newt Gingrich. This is Newtsworld.
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
Las Culturistas with Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang
Ding dong! Join your culture consultants, Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang, on an unforgettable journey into the beating heart of CULTURE. Alongside sizzling special guests, they GET INTO the hottest pop-culture moments of the day and the formative cultural experiences that turned them into Culturistas. Produced by the Big Money Players Network and iHeartRadio.