October 5, 2017 • 60 mins
Martha Stewart has dominated all things domestic for nearly 35 years. But what about the woman behind the empire? Katie and Brian pay a visit to Martha's pristine office for a candid conversation over some apple-cranberry crisp. Martha recalls what it was like growing up in New Jersey as one of six kids, getting her first book deal, serving time in prison and what it was like to work on a TV show with Donald Trump. Plus, she discusses her new cookbook and her collaboration with Snoop Dogg. Nothing is off-limits. It's a good thing.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:05):
Hi Brian, Hi Katie, and hello lovely listeners. This week,
we are very excited because we're taking you all with
us to Martha Stewart headquarters. Literally, well literally we interviewed
Martha at her company headquarters, Martha Stewart Living Omni Media,
and had a really wonderful time, didn't we We did.
(00:27):
The offices are incredible. They take up a giant city
block in Chelsea, right on the Hudson River, and they
definitely passed the white glove test. They were beautiful and
so clean Martha, Ladies and gentlemen, no surprise here is
not particularly messy. But we also walked around the joint
afterwards and that place is stocked, isn't it. It's amazing,
(00:48):
from color coded design books to a five thousand dollar
cappuccino machine that she talks about to test kitchens. And
also they have tons of props for when they do shoot.
They have a million different shares and napkins and tablecloths
and even a bin that said Hanky's. There's even a
Martha Stewart cafe in the lobby. As Martha herself might say.
(01:10):
It's a good thing. Brian. Anyway, for nearly thirty five years,
she has dominated all things domestic. She has lent her
good taste and her name to everything from TV shows
to cookbooks, to carpet tiles, meal kits, magazines, and much
much more. She's like a cottage industry. And I think
she has actually made elegance accessible and said to the
(01:33):
average homemaker, male, female, whatever, somebody who wants to nest
and make their home their castle, that it's doable and
actually affordable. And Martha, after all, is the woman who
New York Magazine once called an emblematic figure of our times.
And in our conversation today, we wanted to get a
better sense of the woman behind the empire, things like
(01:56):
how on earth does she stay so productive? What motivates her?
I mean, she's incredible. I think she's got a new
cookbook out, the Slow Cooker Cookbook, which is her eighty
ninth book, and we should mention she's seventy six years old.
She looks amazing. But her energy, I mean she is
indefatigable and no signs at all of slowing down. Just
(02:16):
as ambitious as ever. That's right. In her latest foray
into the entertainment world is a show with Snoop Dogg
called pot luck dinner, which is a bit of a
double Entendre came up with that name herself. Funny funny
funny stuff is Johnny Carson might say. Anyway, here's our conversation,
and please ignore the chewing, because we did enjoy some
(02:39):
delicious apple Crisp. I said that like Julia Child, didn't
I like Martha delicious apple? Chris. Here's our conversation with
the one and only Martha Stewart. Brian, your dream finally
came true. We're sitting here air with the one and
(03:00):
only Martha Stewart, not only doing our podcast, but we're
actually in Martha's office. I wanted to be in my office.
You wanted to be in some dingy conference room someplace.
Now we actually wanted to be on your farm in Bedford,
or your estate in Maine, or your house in East Hampton.
But this is much easier. I'd rather be in any
(03:23):
of those places to spend the whole weekend with you.
Another dime. Let's do a block that that would be great,
a podcast in real time for a weekends. Tell us though,
about this office. It's very cool, very industrial, and very white. Yes,
well this was this is the st Lee High building,
(03:43):
one of seven buildings in New York City that is
one city block in size, and it was at the
time it was built, it was a storage warehouse building.
And when I found the space, which was almost twenty
years ago, this floor, the ninth lore was about a
hundred different little like switch shops. There was a letter press.
(04:07):
There are a lot of really loud industrial kinds of
company switch shops, but they were not just one big switch.
That's right, it was. It was a dollar a square foot,
that's what people. That was the rent whole. We have
the whole floor soon to be just the south side
of the floor and how many people um right now
(04:31):
it'll be about three d people on this floor. But
we have satellite offices to for other ones. I'm part
of Sequential Brands Group now and the Martha brand is
now licensed through Sequential, but it is but we still
do our TV shows, and we still do our various
and sundry other appearances, and make all our products for
(04:52):
Macy's and and Home Depot and Michael's. And actually working
harder now that I probably worked ten years ago, although
who knows. I mean, I don't keep track. Before Brian
interjects and has a question. I just want to mention
if people here a little noise. I'm drinking a delicious
(05:12):
Martha Stewart cappuccino and that's a Martha coffee. That's still
say coffee that we sell in our cafe down on
the first floor. Did you see the cafe? Did? It
was so cool? What's it like walking into no building
and seeing the Martha Stewart cafe. I want the Katie
currentt cafe. Well, you should have one. You should have
one on the coffee. Oh yes, you can buy the
coffee downstairs at the cafe nowhere else and online I
(05:35):
went on it is Martha Stewart. Martha Stewart cafe, UM
dot com. We're working on a whole line of these
cafes now. The whole team is down the hall working
away today people from all over the country or in today,
looking at and tasting samples of different things that we're
going to be selling at the kind of Howard Schultz
run for his money. UM. It's a very different concept
(05:56):
as a smaller footprint. Basically in office buildings like this one.
This this building has I think over five hundred people
working in it, and there was no cafe. Well, looking
at this wall of Emmy's that I'm staring at. I
wouldn't bet against you. But before we we delve into
your bio, which is something we do on this show.
(06:19):
We do, we do, we do, But before we go
all the way back. It was interesting you just mentioned
your company being sold, and I think a lot of
people remember that moment when Martha Stewart Living on the
Media went public and you served homemade briyosh at the
New York stock Et. Tell us a little bit about
(06:39):
the journey of the company since then to the point
that you're sort of selling it now you're no longer.
That was the probably one of the most exciting days
in my life, except for the day that my daughter
Alexis was born. Uh, and maybe the day I got married,
and then two days that my grandchildren were born. Uh uh,
(07:00):
maybe my cats and my dogs, But most exciting day
of your life. But I have a lot of I
have a lot of pets. So this was a very
exciting day going public because I had worked really hard
to build a superb company, Martha Stewart Living Omnimedia, and
it was kind of a cutting edge company, and this
was a company that actually took into consideration the Internet,
(07:25):
the television, the printed word, the media as well as merchandising.
So it was really truly on the media. And we
still are. We're still on the media. I love I
love the idea of being omni media. And we took
ourselves away from publishing the magazine with Time Inc. We
started publishing on our own uh And that day, um,
(07:48):
we went public at a share of I think it
was eighteen dollars a share, which went up to about
thirty two dollars. I was a multibillionaire at that day.
It was so day. And I drove up Madison Avenue
after after the long day, and I said, I said, God,
I can buy pretty much anything. Did you know? I
(08:11):
was so stupid. I should have I should have spent
it all then because everything was much cheaper then than
it is now. And I, well, I should have bought,
could have, should have, would have, could have. That's a
whole chapter in my autobiography, which I am penning right now.
You are making one too. We're gonna I'm not gonna
(08:33):
tell you anything else then because you'll you'll copy me,
my sister. But that should would could is I'm sure
it's a big chapter in your life too, And it's
one of those things that happens to everybody. I mean you.
I remember every single antique that I didn't buy it,
(08:53):
every single auction I went to from the time I
was married in nineteen sixty one. Can you imagine seem
to expend of at the time. No, it just seemed
though I can't afford it, or maybe it will fit.
And I should have bought everything. I should have been
the biggest consort because but I am a very frugal
person and I still, Oh my god, and my daughter
(09:16):
is more frugal than you are. My daughter points out
all the time, why don't you have your own airplane? Mom?
Why don't you have your own yacht? And the river?
And you know, she she knows. I could have had
pretty much anything. I still actually I've done pretty well
in the real estate department, and I should still do
some of those things. But I'm not an extravagant liver.
(09:37):
I live simply personally, although I do have you know,
I live on a farm up. I know, but it's simple.
I don't know. I I looked at your blog the
last few days preparing for this interview, and I thought,
who lives like this, maybe the Queen of England. No,
I think the Queen of England and Martha I don't
have fault, but we have a lot of staff anyway. Well,
(10:04):
I think the thing about Martha's that, you know, I've
always thought that you have made elegance accessible and I
think you predated sort of this whole notion of nesting
and of making beautiful things and making a house a
home and all that, And what what made you realize
that there was an appetite for that in this country.
(10:25):
I was brought up by a mother who really took
the art of homemaking to the next level. She made everything,
She sewed our clothes, she canned the tomatoes, she made
a delicious meal three times a day for eight people.
My mom was you know, she was a very good
example to me of wanting to elevate a simple life
(10:50):
into a good, really good life, healthy life. And we
were simple, I mean we I lived in a in
a three bedroom house on Elm Place and the New
Jersey see which I go back to see sometimes that
people almost had a heart attack when I knocked on
the door the last time, And did you bring them
some cookies? At least? So I just went to I said,
you know, I used to live here. They said, we
(11:11):
know you used, and uh, could I please see my
old bedroom which I shared with my sister Kathy, And
I would put Kathy on the right hand side of
the bed, which had the night light where I could read.
I would make her go to sleep on that side
to warm the bed because we didn't keep it. We
kept the house pretty cold, saving fuel all that stuff. Um.
And so then I would drag her to her side
(11:31):
of the bed. Before Martha was in, she had six
years younger. She she has not forgiven me. Believe me. Um,
it sounds like your your mom was like the CEO
of the house. Well she was. She was pretty much
my dad was the CEO of the garden and the
fixture upper of the place. Uh. And we had an
(11:52):
next door neighbors. We could throw a stone and hit
the next door neighbors door, you know, but we were
friends with our neighbors. We had. It was a nice street.
It was a very pleasant place to grow up. And
I think a lot of people imagine you're like this
major wasp, and I know I'm I'm a daughter of
two Polish American people. They were born here but my grandparents,
(12:13):
all four grandparents were born in Poland, and they came
to the United States on ships, and you know, they
could see the island where they landed, right here in
New York Harbor, and they signed in and two went
to Buffalo, New York. My grandfather was a trained in
My grandfather was ski My mother's father was a trained
iron monger decorative iron work, and uh, and my other
(12:38):
my father's family all moved to Jersey City. I think
about you because I know how close you were to
your mom, Big Martha, unbelievably close. And and did you
ever come on the Today Show with me? You know,
I don't know. I feel like she might have, but
I feel like I've met her definitely, and I know
you always spoke of her. And it was really really
(13:00):
great mother. Uh, and one of those mothers who had
six kids and every child was equal, no matter what,
no matter what the bad things we did, we were
all equal. And then my parents and that was until
the day she died. We were all equally all around
her bed when she died. And she died at four
and almost ninety four years old. So she's she had
(13:22):
a great life, never sick. She just finally decided it
was time. How many years ago was that that was about?
I don't. I don't remember things like years, um, which
is a good thing. Do you remember things are years? Well?
I remember, I do. My mom died three years ago
on day and and and so I remember everything, but
(13:43):
not I just I think about my mom so much,
and I missed her so much. So I wondered if
you felt the same. I missed my mother a lot,
and I wonder, I wonder, you know, what would mother
think about this or that? Um, when I'm making a
delicious meal. She would come over on Sundays, pretty much
every Sunday from from Western Connecticut where she lived with
(14:03):
my sister Laura. She would drive herself and then when
she got in past ninety, I used to sit and
send somebody to pick her up. Um, and she would
come to my house and eat the healthiest, delicious lunch.
She had a great appetite that she'd take a walk
with me. Then she'd have a massage. I always got
my massure over for mom, and uh, and we'd go
(14:24):
to a movie and she'd have a fabulous day and um,
but she was What I really loved about her was
that egalitarian attitude towards all of her children, and so
even though her daughter was rich and famous, the other
five kids were just as famous, just as successful in
(14:44):
her eyes. Yeah, So it occurred to me as we
were preparing for this that you know, you were a
model early in your career. You were a stockbroker for
several years, and you didn't really become quote Martha Stewart
until you were in forty. I was a late bloomer,
which is like Julia Child. Actually that's who it reminded
me of. I was a late bloomer. And my gynecologist,
(15:08):
uh there, I don't know he even called me a
late bloomer. So in what context? And because said that
I was a late bloomer in terms of my in
terms of my business life. And isn't that funny that
your doctor would call you a late bloomer? I thought
it was great, like like my gardener calling me a
(15:29):
late bloomer. So when your first book came out, well,
I Martha didn't really answer that earlier question though, which is,
how did you know that this was a really potentially
huge market for what you were saying After being a
stockbroker and and working with people's money. I then retired
(15:50):
to Westport, and I did started looking around for what
you were doing, a catering business, and I started a
catering business with a friend called Norma Collier, and she
was a famous mall it at the time, and she
wanted to have a business too, So we started this
catering business dealing with people's appetites other than their and
not their pocketbooks really but the same thing. And they
were very similar. I mean, people could be real nasty
(16:13):
or real nice, money or appetite. And then Norma had
to retire early because she was way too hard the work.
And I liked the physical labor. I liked the building
a restaurant every night and then breaking it down and
cleaning the cards. I mean, believe me, I'm a glutton
for punishment worker. I am. I am a worker. B
(16:34):
I just brought up like that. But um, I realized
that the art of homemaking really and truly had not
been celebrated in an appropriate way. And I thought of
my mother all the time. Here's this fabulous woman who
was also a very hard worker, but she hadn't been
celebrated as a homemaker. And to be able to raise
(16:54):
the kids on they were making when my when my
mother wasn't teaching, my father was working. They were living
on a salary of about eleven thousand a year. And
this is a long time ago, but still that's very
little money to manage. That's why the garden was so good. Yeah,
that's why the garden was so big. That's why the
clothing was made by hand. The sewing machine was always busy.
(17:16):
Mom didn't get very many hours of sleep, you know,
the whole thing. And we were not poor. We did
not consider ourselves poor in any way. So when did
you realize that this thing you were doing, that homemaking
and cooking and sewing and gardening, could become a business.
And well, I started writing books in two And I'm
sure you have my Entertaining Book, because I probably and
(17:37):
I actually still remember the pretty picture of you on
the cover. Your hair was long and I think it
was maybe in a half updo or something, and I yes,
and I remember your basket weave um with frosting. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
it wasn't that in there? Oh yeah, definitely. Well I
think I read that before I started. I started to
write books because I started, I started to realize that
(17:59):
my friends were just like me. We all needed some
encouragement to entertain better. We needed better recipes that could
be done, that aren't weren't too complicated, And there were
no at that time, very few illustrated cookbooks. And I,
you know, I consider myself as crazy, I know, but
I considered myself kind of a really good cook at
(18:21):
the time. And so I wrote this book entertaining and
my publisher I remember saying, if you sell ten thousand copies,
you should be happy. I said, I know twenty five
thousand people who will buy this book, because I have
been catering for a while and I had all South
Bese clients. I had the museums in New York hired
my me for my services. I did parties at the
(18:42):
Metropolitan Museum of Art. How many didn't. So it's it's
way way over a million copies. So um, I don't
know the latest. I should, I should know the exact number.
But you don't wake up in the morning and say,
let's look and see. I'm sure. I'm sure it's way
over because by the way, that was for the first
of what over a Well, we're up to we're up
(19:05):
to ninety now, and we just published here this is
the right. That's what a new one called Slow Cooker nine.
And then the Newlywed cookbooks coming out very shortly, and
that will be our nine. And then Martha's Flowers comes
out in February. I'm excited about that. So does that
teach you how to arrange flowers? How to grow and arrange?
(19:25):
It's growing, enjoying and arrange flowers. What's your favorite flower?
I like fragrant flowers. I like lilacs. Oh, I love
I like true lips, I like roses, I love you know.
I I love piannies. But I feel like they become
everybody's favorite flowers, so that makes me not like them.
(19:45):
Don't don't feel like that. Now you know what I'm
meant to Martha? Well, obviously hydranges, I don't. My hydranges
were on steroids. They needed this year. This was the
big year for hydranges, right, Oh my go apples like apple.
It was crazy. But I'm really into dahlia's right now.
Are fabulous. They're so pretty. They're so gigantic. Dahlias and zinnias,
(20:09):
I think together they're pretty. They're pretty. Brian. Yes, every
now and then I can surprise you. It's time to
take a quick break. We'll be back with more surprises
and more Martha right after this. And now back to
(20:32):
our conversation with the one and only Martha Stewart. You're
so incredibly productive, all these books and TV shows and magazines,
and I ready only need four to five hours of
sleep per night. Can you walk us through a typical
Martha day? I mean, what did you do today? For example,
Today's today's like New York, So that's not so interesting.
(20:52):
Yesterday was a good day. Okay, Okay, so yesterday I
have I don't have live in help, but I do
require that my housekeeper or keepers. Sometimes I have to
come in at seven, so I can't be in bed
if my housekeeper comes. I just don't do that. So
I get I'm up before they're up, and I take
um the covers off the bird cages, and I have
(21:15):
read factor canaries in my house. They're beautiful and they're singing.
And then I have three cats and five dogs in
Bedford and where I live most of the time I
can I commute to New York and so um, they're
they're all kindness. Am I taken care of? By the
time the housekeeper comes on a Sunday. I only have
one housekeeper and I have a driver who also comes.
(21:37):
I read somewhere you have four drivers. Well yeah, but
not all the same time. No, no, I know, but
I have my days are days are so long and
you can only they can only we can't forty hours
a week and they can't be tired. So that's why.
All right, but um, but is just jealous. But all right,
so we've we've taken care of them. So then, um
(21:59):
and so then I I make breakfast for everybody. So
I made the cappuccinos for everybody, because the eggs come
from your chickens. Right, Yes, yes, you've mentioned. We have
salmon for breakfast because some a friend had sent me
two beautiful big salmon's. A lion caught salmon's from Alaska
last week and I had to eat them. So I
poached salmon. I'm doing I'm doing a little blog on
(22:20):
that on how to poach the salmon and its oats,
pretty pictures, and so I photographed the blog and I
make the salmon. No, no, we just eat it with
lemon juice. It's so tasty. Yeah, like yogurt, cucumbers, nothing,
nothing for breakfast. That this is breakfast and then for
lunch and so then so then after that I and
(22:42):
my green juice. We have green juice every morning. Everybody
drinks green juice because it's like power. So what do
you put in your green So it's spinach, celery, parsonally mint,
maybe a piece of fruit of some sort, like a pear.
Green pear is good. Um, a piece of melon or
to papaya or mango. Whatever. It's very good juice. Everybody's
(23:04):
delicious and very drink that. Then I went on a
horseback ride, and that was at ten o'clock. I was
ready for the horseback right after doing you know, getting
make sure everybody's doing lots of horses and I have
six horses. And so yesterday I rode Rins and my
uh and my horse groom Sarah, she rode Ramon and
(23:26):
we went off property and two and a half hours
later came home. I was dying, as is a long
horseback ride, and we were doing a lot of trotting.
And that we went down Maple Avenue and through the woods,
and Bedford has a has a series of bridle trails
about three hundred miles, so you can get lost, you
(23:47):
can have a good time does Ralph Lauren live up there?
He was extraor to me, we like, hey, Ralph, Martha, Hi,
Ralph riding by. I'm I'm the farm at to Ralph's stay. Eat.
I'm the farm at Okay, yes, the modest farm next
to Ralph, a very nice neighbor. And then, oh, I
(24:10):
should have told you. Then then I'll tell you about
Friday night afterwards. But and then I came back from
the horseback ride. I made the lunch, so I sautade
some onions from the garden, fresh onions, and some red
and yellow peppers, and I made a for Tata, delicious
for Tata, studded with little lots of cream cheese, which
I like for Tata. I don't know why, but I
(24:31):
just like it. And I we had little cheese puffs
that were left over from Friday night supper. And that
was a salad of dark red and green lettuce um
from a night's supper, the one that was on the blog.
But you, and then when I didn't finish my day though,
then sorry, then can I just interrupt and ask a question?
(24:52):
How many people did you prepare lunch for? And did
you have no? No, it was just just the people
who were hanging, you know, working around in the place.
So Carlo's Jama and Frank and who else was there yesterday?
A dawa. Then we made fifty gallons of apple cider,
(25:13):
or would you bring some of that apple cider over here?
Fifty gallons of this and you know how hard it
is to crush the apples. It's delicious apple. Take a sip,
it's so good. What kind of apples did you use?
Who knows? On my property? We must have fifty varieties
(25:34):
of apps, so delicious I've ever had. We compare it
to other I think it's really what makes it so good,
just the variety of apples, I think. Um. So we
did that. And while they were doing that, I shucked
and scraped the corn off, about maybe sixty ears of corn.
And I searched and I saw tade all the kernels
(25:57):
and a little bit of butter with some some water,
and then I froze. I think I froze ten quarts
of corn kernels. And then I made a great pot
of from again, there's so many tomatoes. I made a
great pot of tomato soup, just tomatoes and onions. Just
threw them all in this giant pot and cooked and
(26:17):
cooked and cooked until then put it through the food
so you get all the seeds and skits on. I
think we made eight quarts of tomato soup and relaxing Sunday.
So then I went, Oh, my friend called Memory. My
friend Memory called and said, you have to go see
this garden. It's on the open days and Greenwich open
Days is the Garden Conservancy, which is a very fantastic organization.
(26:41):
I belonged to that, and people who belong open their
gardens to other gardeners. So I went to see Mr
Landman's garden and Greenwich, which is incredible, fifteen acre garden.
Made me sick because because if I feel jen we're
happy for him. When I when I get jealous, the
only time I ever jealous, it's not envy, it's just jealous.
(27:03):
I it's anyway. His garden is so beautiful. Then I
went to see my friend Memory, who was lying in
bed because she has a cut on her leg. Who knows.
And then I left there. I got in a bad
mood because she was in bed. And then I went
home and I went we searched for my missing peacocks.
Were always missing two peacocks. They were out eating with
the it's a busy day. It is a busy day.
(27:24):
It sounds fun, it is fun. The peacocks were hanging
out with the wild turkeys. Now there's a gang of
five wild male turkeys and my two male peacocks that
I allow out of their enclosure. Uh, they have kind
of befriended the wild turkeys. And is there any nookie
going on? Peacocks a band of boys and uh, so
(27:50):
we could tell her forever. I mean, you don't know,
these are so silly. I hope this is not boring
to you. Love you love. I went to get a massage.
I went to a Chinese reflexology and did something where.
Then I went home and I did a little bit
more cooking. But I had a column do this morning,
so I had to work on my column on the
(28:11):
restoration of furniture. So I had to write that, and
then I went and watched the Emmys. Thank god the
Emmys were on, because I had such a good time
watching the Emmy's and that relaxed me. And that's that
was my day. See, that's the Sunday. So speaking of
Donald Trump, right, because that was the topic when he
absolutely should have won. And by the way, didn't Alec
(28:34):
look good. Lass he looks so good. I thought he
looks so it's a couple of and he looked great. Yeah. Yeah,
you were there and that was a fun night and
opening night of the the US Open. But can I
ask you about him seriously because after um, well there's
another topic. But after your release from prison, you did
(28:57):
Martha Stewart the Apprentice or the apprent to Martha Stewart
and this office. It was right here in this office.
We built their bedrooms, here, their kitchens. The whole thing
was the most monstrous production you have ever seen. And
Donald Trump was the executive producer of it. Well, yes,
one with Mark Burnett. And Mark Burnett promised me when
I agreed to do it, that I would fire Donald
(29:20):
at the end of my show, that Donald, we're going
to replace him. Yes, and Donald did not want to
be replaced. By the time of Blind President, I know,
he maligned my show so badly. He was nasty. Well, no,
who knows why he wanted. He wanted to stay on TV.
(29:41):
He had he had, you know, he drank the kool
aid and he loved it so much. I show did
really well in Europe, and it did really well in Japan.
But um, but the ratings in America were not as
good as Donald's ratings. But I was as outrageous as
Donald either. I think people like outrage and as know,
after this whole year, Um and so so. But he
(30:05):
but we remained, uh some semi cordial. And what did
you learn about him from working with him? Well, he
had very little to do with my show. What did
you learn about him from what he said about you around?
I was not happy and my daughter. He said nasty
things about my daughter and she was on the radio
at the time he was, and she was on the
(30:25):
Apprentice for a little bit and I did not like that,
and none of us did, and it was not nice.
I would never say anything untoward of his about his children.
You don't talk about people's children, but he does. How
do you think he's doing as president? Do we have
to really get there? I was not. I was not.
(30:46):
I'm not happy at the state of things at all.
You were a big Hillary Clinton supporter. Did you have
you read her new book yet? No? I haven't. I've
I've listened to many of the interviews and have you
have you interviewed here? We had an interviewed or where
hoping to get her on our podcast. You know, she
had known her. I did her first interview when she
became First Lady in the early I remember, I remember,
(31:10):
and I saw her in the attempt. And she was
walking on Louie Pond Lane the other day, really, and
I was walking my dogs and she I bumped into
I saw the black van's first and I thought, oh God,
who's coming? And it was Hillary. She know, she was
with a friend, Liz Robbins, and we talked for quite
a while standing there in the middle of the street.
(31:30):
And uh, and she looked well and she told me
her book was just about to be released. It was right,
I guess it was a week before her book came out.
And um, so I haven't read it yet, but but
she has to speak out, she has to say what
she said. And uh, and you know, it's a it's
too bad. She's really damned if she does. Damned if
she does. And I mean I've been, I've been, I guess,
(31:53):
not surprised, but it's still I'm always taken aback at
the vitriol and hatred that is directed at her. And
you know, well, today I saw Bernie Sanders on Morning
Joe now he I don't know if he was on
there or they were just they were just showing film
with Bernie. Nobody has pointed out Bernie saying, oh, I
(32:15):
did so much to support Hillary this. Why isn't anybody
pointing out that Bernie Sanders lost the election. Well, a
lot of his supporters are kind of of the view
that she stole it with the super delegates, and nothing
could be more wrong. She actually beat him fifty in
terms of the popular vote in the primaries, but that's
(32:36):
not the that's not the approach. Like he he really
disturbed the election by being the third kendidate, Bernie Sanders,
and I never felt as if he really supported her
fully And all those shots of her, of Bernie at
the convention, he looked like he'd been sucking on a limit, right,
I mean, he did not look particularly pleased or supportive.
(33:00):
I mean, I wouldn't want my supporters that she is.
If she had put him on the ballot as the
vice president, that would have helped a lot. So you've
been on the receiving end of some sexist treatment and behavior.
How big of a role do you think sexist and
played in the election last year? A lot a lot. Obviously,
(33:22):
I think people still are not comfortable. Not all, not
all people, but many people are still uncomfortable with the
notion of a woman in power very much. So. I'm
sure you've dealt with that, oh, of course, But but
I'm strong enough to sort of brush it off. And
when you're running for president's pretty hard just to brush
(33:42):
it off. Although I probably would have behaved a lot
differently than Hillary did on those debate stages, what would
you have done? I told him to get lost. I mean,
she she was calling her names, and she wasn't calling
him names. Call him some names. Really, I don't know.
Do you catch her decor? Room did not, She didn't.
I don't think people have to be so decorous to
(34:03):
ugly people. What's the what's the old line about you
get into a mud pit with a pig and the
pig is gonna win. Let me ask you. The one thing,
uh many questions we had, Martha, is and I don't
think you've talked about it that much, is you know,
I look at you and everything you've accomplished, and then
(34:25):
you had this moment in your life when you were
in prison, and I imagine in my mind's eye that
was sal I went to Yale for five months. I
read a lot, I learned a lot. And what was
that like for you mean, was that sort of like?
It was horrifying. It was horrifying. And no one, no
(34:45):
one should have to go through that kind of indignity,
really except for murderers, and and you know there are
a few other categories, but no one should have to
go through that. It's a very very awful thing. Having
said that, I mean, was it a growth experience in
any way? I know that you would read out to
a lot of the other women, and you can make
(35:07):
lemons out of lemonade, and what what? What hurts you
makes you stronger? No, none of those adages fit at all.
It's a horrible experience. Nothing is good about it. Nothing
was What was so horrible about it? Oh, being taken
away from your family, being maligned, being treated the way
(35:28):
you were treated, it's horrible, um, and especially when one
does not feel one deserves such a thing. I mean,
I was not a bad person. Well, I think a
lot of people are under the misconception that you were
convicted of insider trading. You were You were not. I
wasn't even accused of insider trading. But I don't want
to get into that either. I mean, it's just like
(35:49):
like and one thing I do not ever want is
to be identified or I don't want that to be
the major thing of my life. It's just not it's
just not fair. But um, but it's not a good
experience and it doesn't make you stronger. I was a
strong person to start with, and thank Heavens, I was,
(36:09):
and I can still hold my head up high and
know that I'm fine. Did you get to know any
of your fellow inmates and what was that like? I
know you helped them with certain things and become friendly
with them. Um, No, I'm not really friendly. I wouldn't
say that. As much as I tried. I've tried to
help certain of them. Um, there are lots and lots
(36:32):
of odd stories and disturbing things that go on in
a in a incarceration like that, even a minimum security, well,
you couldn't walk in minimum security. Still couldn't walk out
the gate, you know, across the river. Um it was. Um,
there's still guards and they're still it's still nasty and
(36:53):
it's still but but that's that's America has so many
people in prison. You go to Finland and there's about
I think there's like a hundred people in prison in
Finland or some tiny number. Uh. They don't believe in
in that kind of incarceration. Uh, And I don't think
we should have the numbers of people in prison. And
(37:15):
the most of the women that were in this in
this institution were there because of the New York state
drug laws. And now we have legalized marijuana in seven states.
I think it is Uh, that's incredible. And those and
people who had a few ounces of marijuana on them
and are in there for twenty years, it just doesn't
(37:38):
make sense to some of those people get to be
released as as a result. I know that there was
a big movement with President Obama to change sort of
minimum mandatory. Much was done, not not enough was done.
So on a happier note, you've had this friendship with
Snoop Dogg. But I think as uh surprised and delighted
(38:01):
some of your some of your fans more just surprised
others of your people. People seem to really like our
public dinner party. Yeah no, there of course there's a
double one ding Sarcastic. That was my name. I came
up with that name. He did just very get to
(38:22):
know each other. The green we had the green meal,
we had all kinds of stuff, funny names. Well, he
was on My show a couple of times, and he
was always just a pleasant guest and fun and made
people and and the response was always good. Did you
get a contact high from the green room after he
came not in New York? He didn't. He didn't partaken,
(38:43):
and he was on my my show once and honestly,
I opened the door and it was like one of
those cartoons where this smoke just billowed down. I think,
I think, I don't. I think that's probably why he
doesn't come to New York very much, because he's not
free to just that's true. This was in California, yea,
oh no, California, and then um, and then you go
to then Um we did the Justin Bieber Roast together
(39:06):
and that was that which is hilarious for anybody. It was.
It was hilarious. And there I did get a contact
high sitting next to him for four hours on the stage.
Oh you couldn't help it. I mean he had these
you know, he was smoking for four hours right next
to us. Oh yeah, soun doing the show with him. Yeah,
(39:27):
it really is fun and it's um. I call it
a melding of cultures. I mean, here's Compton and Nutley
probably not so probably not so different. Way down under.
I met his mother. He brought his mother to the show.
She's a lovely lady, very intelligent, very well spoken. He
(39:47):
had other family members there. I mean, it's it's kind
of an interesting situation. And then we have these great
guests and we cook, and he's a fun cook. He
and he is his uncle Rio, who is this jovial um,
very fancily dressed on gentlemen, who wears very jazzy clothes,
you know, spats and gold suits and whatever and hats
(40:11):
and anyway, Uncle Rio kind of creates all the recipes
for Snoop and my my straight laced team of Thomas,
Joseph and uh and the rest of the kitchen here
they're they're all like but it's fun. I mean, it's fun.
I think, what's so great about you? You you're always
reinventing yourself. You're always Change is good. That's one of
(40:34):
my mottos. Change is good. And when you're through changing,
you're through in my book, So and you've done that
you've changed, You've changed so nicely and evolved, and I've tried,
but you do you do, You're you're You're prettier now
than you were when I first met you, by the way,
And uh, I think it's because I had such a
(40:56):
fat pace when I was younger, and aging makes you
kind of hollow at a little bit. But had had
enough excess that I don't look on you not now
look normal, right, you look great, And so I think
all of that is uh, is good and um, and
it's been it's been interesting to also challenge myself. I mean,
(41:17):
it's hard to go on the stage with Jamie Foxx
and um Puff Daddy or PGTT or whatever his name
is now and uh us sure and all those guys
and and uh a little YACHTI And it's extraordinary the
talent that comes on our show. Really amazing challenge. Yeah,
that's fun. And meanwhile, UM, as a business person, I'm curious,
(41:38):
as a hugely successful woman in business, what do you
think are the most important lessons you've learned along the way,
Because I don't know, I'm at the point in my
career that I want to mentor more young women, and
so what would you tell them, well, it's UM. It's
all about having ideas, having energy to grow those ideas
(42:00):
into something UM, and having the wherewithal, whether it be
personal or borrowed or education, to build something of lasting value.
And I think just my library of books is of
lasting value. Many of the other things that I've done also,
(42:21):
I think will have a lasting value. Building a brand
is interesting, but it's unless it's a really good brand
and has a wide audience. Uh. What the heck, I'm
not a Bill Gates. I didn't I didn't invent software.
I wish I had. But in the meantime, I utilize
what's available and and learning how to use what's new
(42:43):
and different has made a big difference in my business.
And I think learning you know, when I started my business,
the internet was a baby uh and but I had
a computer. I learned how to use that computer. I
learned how to to to write and and uh and
use the internet to do research to do all of
(43:04):
the things. Now, social media is another challenge for all
of us. How do we how do we maneuver and
uh and uh and negotiate social media to make a
difference without wasting a tremendous amount of time doing so,
so a lot of plays open to open to new
ideas and to and to I was I'm one of
(43:24):
the early adopters of the computer. Believe it or not.
I mean, isn't that crazy? But I am. And two,
I got my first computer. When did you get your computer?
Were you born yet? I was when I was just born.
When did I got my first computer? I think it
was in the late eighties at some point. I got
my adrink in the early nineties. Well when I oh, no, yeah,
(43:45):
I think in the early or even late eighties, when
broadcasting wasn't using computers in We were the first magazine
to design on an Apple and that's why I wanted you.
I wanted to make sure that we were doing it
in the new and different way. It was no cutting
and pasting on the big tables, so it's a it's
(44:08):
that So making use of what's available currently available was
very important to me. My dad used to say that
you really had to stay on top of this ever
changing world. And I think now more than ever it's
a good thing. As you would say, Martha, By the way,
do you remember when I gave you the Matrix Award?
So I you know, I worked so hard on this poem,
(44:29):
and I have to just repeat the first couple of
verses and in communications, and Martha was, of course so deserving.
I remembered. I was terrified because the dais was full
of very impressive women that year. Of course you and
then Whoopi Goldberg, and I think Amy tan and and
Richards and all these people. But I was what went
(44:50):
before me, and I was like, oh, I'm I'm screwed
because she's so funny and relaxed, and I was a
nervous wreck. But I had worked really hard on a
poem for Martha, and it went like this, Martha, Dear Martha,
what should I do? These people have asked me to
introduce you. I haven't eaten, I haven't slept. Talk about
making a girl fill in at anything I can do,
(45:10):
you can do better dipping a candle, knitting a sweater.
A room needs repainting, you'll make it, saying with Robin's
a blue because it's a good thing. And only a
woman who's in your position makes a gingerbread house. This
air condition tartar ta marsi, pacco vent to, bruschetta panchetta
is not all you can do your holiday meals are
a feast for the eyes. Why can't you use stovetop?
And Mrs smiss pies anyway, went on and on anyway,
(45:36):
why heart, Well, you know what I think what. I
worked so hard on this and it was so much
fun to do and I was so honored to be
asked to present it to you. Um. So that's one
of my my favorite poems because my dad said I write.
My dad used to say I write dogg rol, not poetry. Um.
(45:58):
By the way, before we go, we have a listener
voicemail question. We have a listener who called in with
a question for Martha. Okay, I am calling from St. Pete, Florida,
where I'm reading Martha Stewart Living by the Light of
a lantern because I'm still without power. But I've always
been curious about whether or not Martha Stewart has ever
(46:20):
done something she shouldn't have done, like stood up on
a chair instead of a ladder, or didn't we have
the safety glasses she was supposed to do. She's trying
to have all how to do things right, but I'm
just wondering about where she's made some goose that taught
her a lesson. Well, Oh, my gosh, that's a good one.
That's your biggest screw up. My biggest grew up was
(46:42):
riding under the branch of a tree on my giant
horse and getting knocked off because I thought I could
bend backwards under it. That was a stupid thing because
then I broke my arm. But were there any other
things where? Well? Now, when she says standing on a
chair and seat of the ladder, um, I would never
(47:02):
do that because I have taught everyone. I mean, you know,
as as an employer of people, you have to teach
good lessons. So I'm very strict about having a ladder
available in most places, so that if you have to
reach a high shelf, you step on a ladder. Um
in the garden there, they must wear their ear muffs
(47:24):
when they're using loud machinery. Uh, they have to have
safety lessons for chain sauce because I know how I
know how to use chain sauce. I mean, I really
do practice good healthy living well or either that or
your control free. No, no, no, I practice safety for
our safety. Well no I'm not. I mean, I'm not
(47:48):
a nut nudge about it, but I'm serious about it.
But you're so um, you're so good at everything. It's
and I gave a big gift to the emergency room
both in Westport and in Mount Kisco, just in case,
Just in case. They're They're always taken care of. But
what is the biggest Have you ever screwed something up terribly?
(48:08):
Please tell me you have? Like, what is the biggest thing?
You messed my marriage by being a caterer? Really? Probably?
Do you know? I think about you? I'm thinking that
I was attractive enough or something like that. I I
see you at some social events, are passed across on
a number of occasions, and you never remarried. I have not,
(48:31):
um are you? Are you sorry if I could have
married the next guy or the next guy, but I didn't.
I'm not I'm not unhappy about that. I don't. And
now when I see some of my friends with her husbands,
I'm so happy that are they? Are they unhappy? And
that makes you happy that you're not unhappy? Or do
(48:51):
you just feel like who needs it? No? None of
the above. When Mr Wright comes along, I'll marry And
are you still open to datings? How do we have
some librant woman? You are and you're beautiful? How does
somebody do you go to match. Do you go on
match dot com? Or I think you went on for
(49:11):
today's show. Can you imagine the algorithm just doesn't fit me.
It doesn't know. Maybe you could go on Farmers dot com.
Maybe that might be a match made in heaven, Martha.
They could help you with your garden, my farm. I don't,
I don't want I want I want them. I don't
want them to help me with my farm. I want
not going to be hoping on Farmers dot com. It's
(49:32):
sorry O'Brien to talk about your new cook books before
we go, because it's your eighty nine. Is that Martha Cooker?
We laugh because in the intro you said you'd never
really used a slow cooker before, but you knew that
they were really popular and they are now. Isn't this
what people used to call a crock pot? Yeah, this
(49:54):
is the evolution of a croc pot and um, and
it is so the food is so delicious. And this
book we we set out with no holds barred and
no preconceptions because it's not just dump a bunch of
meat and vegetables in a pot and add some water
and turn it on like creem of mushroom soup. No, no,
(50:14):
it isn't any of that. So you can make savory,
you can make sweet, you can make cinnamon buns. You
can make apple crisp. And made apple crisp from start.
Some of that. Our producer Gianna is standing next to
the everything. I don't think, Brian, I don't know. No,
I'm not coming. It's okay. You can share it with me. Yeah, anyway,
(50:40):
so you had did you have fun making this? This
cookbook as usual? So much fun. I mean, I'm excited
because I have to walk a few miles a day
back and forth from the kitchens here. This is a
block long and long block eleventh twelfth Avenue. But to
eat all this food here, give that to Katie. It's
apple cris and this is I just picked so many
(51:03):
apples for something to do with my Brian. You take
a taste, okay, okay, that is so good. And it's
the apples. See fresh apples. The apples are delicious. Here,
I'm gonna get that to Martore. You have, Brian, and
(51:24):
I can care you guys have some. There's a whole
croc butter, cramberries in it, dried crabbers, and now, um,
that's amazing. Isn't that good? So did that dryed? I
take it back, it's fresh crambers. This is the best
interview we've ever done. I know, I know this. And
(51:46):
Nose made us, uh these really delicious crampled eggs that
were so slowly with truffle butter and a brioche toe. Yeah.
When I brought my house in Easthampton, I know what
had still had the barefoot contests to shop in town
(52:11):
and we became friends and I started her TV show.
Did you know that I knew? Imagine? She said that
you were. She forgot that I started her television. Actually,
I think she did mention that. Martha. She said that
you wrote the introduction to her first cookbook and you
were enormously helpful to her. So we have a lightning round. Okay, yeah,
(52:34):
but I was going to ask Martha about what iinus said,
how she couldn't understand if somebody who didn't cook why
they would watch her show. But Brian and I were saying,
we love to watch cooking shows because even if we're
not cooking, whatever is being made you learn and they're
so relaxing. There's something that they're kind of hypnotic and eat. Yeah,
(52:58):
you get hungry. These apples are They are delicious? This
whole thing is super yummy. All right, well I eat Brian.
Why don't you start the lightning wrap. You're making a
simple dinner at home just for you. What are you cooking? Well?
Because I have so many eggs, um, I will oftentimes
make something out of the eggs. But I will also
(53:20):
just bake a fresh potato that's just freshly dug. I
love baked potatoes and um um, just just butter and
sour cream or crime fresh so good um and lots
of chopped herbs. Um. I will um cook a whole
head of cauliflour or broccoli because I love that too.
(53:43):
I'm healthy. Yeah. And what do you put on the
cauliflower or broncoli? Oh? Just cooking and salted water, heavily
salted water, and maybe a dab of butter. Are there
any recipes you hate making? Anything? You hate cooking? I
won't do it. Why? Why ball many food? You hate brains?
I won't eat brains. I don't that's wait. Weight breads
(54:06):
are intestines. They're they're finest glance or something. I don't know.
They're nasty. That's all I have to say that in
shad Row, which my dad used to I know, but
the eggs are so big and it's in this and
millions of little eggs inside the sacks. You're eating the
sack of eggs. Okay, what's your biggest strength and your
(54:28):
biggest weakness? Um? I think my biggest strength is my curiosity,
and probably my biggest weakness is also my career, because
you want to do too many things? Yeah? Probably. Um
do you think marijuana should be legal? Um? Yeah, I
think so. I think so, but I worry about but
(54:49):
it should be controlled by parents because I just think that,
you know, there's too much in gender. I'm understanding that
that school children are partaking too much and it's her
their studies. I don't. I don't like anything that interferes
with growing up in a healthy, vibrant environment. I agree,
I feel like you don't. Why do you? I mean,
(55:11):
I understand would train drugs, but you know, because what
does the child need that for? I don't understand having
sort of this artificial Why worry about all the prescription
drugs that kids are getting in school as well? Like
little in adderall and all of that. Anyway, we have
a listener question that's very quick. It's the longest podcast
I ever did. Messages the Martha Stewarts. What is the
(55:33):
best way to cook pork chops? I want to know,
thank you? The best way to put cook pork chops? Um? Well,
I think pork chops should be. Um. You could bread
them if you want, but I just I just dredge
them in in a salty peppery flower and then I
(55:54):
just cook them lightly in um, a little olive oil
and a little bit of butter until they are pretty
much done. And then I squeeze fresh oranges over them
and let the juices sort of caramelize. They're the best.
It's hard to make a juicy pork chop. Yeah, but
that's that's the best way to something my mom was
(56:16):
never able to do. I'll tell you that. Don't broil them, yeah,
because they get dried out. What's your favorite thing to
do with your grandkids? Oh? Explore? I mean these kids
are such explorers. Sore how old now Martha five and six.
But they are great travelers. And we went to the
Galapagos already, we bunch of Botswana. We go to Maine.
(56:37):
They're climbing rock walls now. Um. They the boys, a
girl and a boy. Girl and a boy, and they're
they're very, very fun to be with. And how's your daughter?
Alexis is great, she's a very good mother. And these
children are the result of close attention. Now we talked
about reinventing. So as we bring this to a close,
(56:58):
what what would you like to do mark that that
you haven't done yet? Like would you like to be
in Martha the musical? I mean, actually can to do that? Actually? No,
actually that would be really music. Um, I'm gonna be
h Yeah, I have I have some business kind of
things to give us a little hint. Well, I've I've
(57:20):
been working on an organizer for for the homemaker and
I'm going to build that. Always fun to see what
Martha does next. Mary, thank you that was really young.
If you're going to produce for sure, Well that was
very delicious. And your new cookbook is called slow Cooker
and I'm excited to have one. And I guess I'm
(57:40):
gonna have to buy a slow cooker now. Thank you, Martha,
thank you Katie. Thank you brilliant, and I'm glad you
came to my office. Thank you for having us, and
thank you for making Apple cider and apple Chris the cappuccino.
Thanks as always to our production team, the intrepid, brilliant
Gianna Palmer, our producer that was Virgianna's dad who fast
(58:03):
forwards to the credits totally. I hope that still counts
as a listen. Nora Richie are wonderful production assistant, and
especially Jared O'Connell, our audio engineer, who helped us take
our show on the road for this episode. Thanks also
to Alison Bresnik for all she does to shine a
light on our podcast via her social media mastery, and
(58:25):
to Emily Beena from Katie Currik Media for her production
prowess as well. Thanks Mark Phillips for our theme music. Wow,
we are laid it on thick today. Ladies, gentlemen, we
heard from a lot of you who left voicemails and
wrote in with your questions for Martha Stewart for this episode.
It was great. We loved it, so remember you can
email us your questions for Marie Condo too. You may
(58:48):
have heard of her best selling book, The Life Changing
Magic of Tidying Up, and if you're a slob like me,
you're going to have a lot of questions or if
you just want to say hi, or that you're enjoying
our podcast, be starting a little pathetic you you want
to know, you know, like what Brian's hobbies are when
he's not reading eight thousand newspapers and newsletters. You can
(59:11):
do so at comments at currect podcast dot com or
leave us a voicemail at nine to four or six
three seven. The lines are open seven. And yes, I
do think we sound a little pathetic, like we don't
have any don't we don't have any friends. If you
want to further cyber stock us, I'm Katie Curic on Twitter,
(59:32):
um and actually read my comments and UM, if you're
a jerk, I block you, so please don't be a jerk. Also,
I'm on Instagram and Katie dot curric on Snapchat. Find
me on Facebook as well, and Brian is at goldsmith
b on Twitter. And last but not least, if you
like the show, please please subscribe. I figured we're pathetic already,
so might as well just lean into it. Subscribe, rate
(59:55):
and review the show over at Apple podcast and helps
us out. Someone stop us. Talk to you next time,
and we promised to be less beggy and whiny and pathetic.
Have a good day, yeah,
Hi Brian, Hi Katie, and hello lovely listeners. This week,
we are very excited because we're taking you all with
us to Martha Stewart headquarters. Literally, well literally we interviewed
Martha at her company headquarters, Martha Stewart Living Omni Media,
and had a really wonderful time, didn't we We did.
(00:27):
The offices are incredible. They take up a giant city
block in Chelsea, right on the Hudson River, and they
definitely passed the white glove test. They were beautiful and
so clean Martha, Ladies and gentlemen, no surprise here is
not particularly messy. But we also walked around the joint
afterwards and that place is stocked, isn't it. It's amazing,
(00:48):
from color coded design books to a five thousand dollar
cappuccino machine that she talks about to test kitchens. And
also they have tons of props for when they do shoot.
They have a million different shares and napkins and tablecloths
and even a bin that said Hanky's. There's even a
Martha Stewart cafe in the lobby. As Martha herself might say.
(01:10):
It's a good thing. Brian. Anyway, for nearly thirty five years,
she has dominated all things domestic. She has lent her
good taste and her name to everything from TV shows
to cookbooks, to carpet tiles, meal kits, magazines, and much
much more. She's like a cottage industry. And I think
she has actually made elegance accessible and said to the
(01:33):
average homemaker, male, female, whatever, somebody who wants to nest
and make their home their castle, that it's doable and
actually affordable. And Martha, after all, is the woman who
New York Magazine once called an emblematic figure of our times.
And in our conversation today, we wanted to get a
better sense of the woman behind the empire, things like
(01:56):
how on earth does she stay so productive? What motivates her?
I mean, she's incredible. I think she's got a new
cookbook out, the Slow Cooker Cookbook, which is her eighty
ninth book, and we should mention she's seventy six years old.
She looks amazing. But her energy, I mean she is
indefatigable and no signs at all of slowing down. Just
(02:16):
as ambitious as ever. That's right. In her latest foray
into the entertainment world is a show with Snoop Dogg
called pot luck dinner, which is a bit of a
double Entendre came up with that name herself. Funny funny
funny stuff is Johnny Carson might say. Anyway, here's our conversation,
and please ignore the chewing, because we did enjoy some
(02:39):
delicious apple Crisp. I said that like Julia Child, didn't
I like Martha delicious apple? Chris. Here's our conversation with
the one and only Martha Stewart. Brian, your dream finally
came true. We're sitting here air with the one and
(03:00):
only Martha Stewart, not only doing our podcast, but we're
actually in Martha's office. I wanted to be in my office.
You wanted to be in some dingy conference room someplace.
Now we actually wanted to be on your farm in Bedford,
or your estate in Maine, or your house in East Hampton.
But this is much easier. I'd rather be in any
(03:23):
of those places to spend the whole weekend with you.
Another dime. Let's do a block that that would be great,
a podcast in real time for a weekends. Tell us though,
about this office. It's very cool, very industrial, and very white. Yes,
well this was this is the st Lee High building,
(03:43):
one of seven buildings in New York City that is
one city block in size, and it was at the
time it was built, it was a storage warehouse building.
And when I found the space, which was almost twenty
years ago, this floor, the ninth lore was about a
hundred different little like switch shops. There was a letter press.
(04:07):
There are a lot of really loud industrial kinds of
company switch shops, but they were not just one big switch.
That's right, it was. It was a dollar a square foot,
that's what people. That was the rent whole. We have
the whole floor soon to be just the south side
of the floor and how many people um right now
(04:31):
it'll be about three d people on this floor. But
we have satellite offices to for other ones. I'm part
of Sequential Brands Group now and the Martha brand is
now licensed through Sequential, but it is but we still
do our TV shows, and we still do our various
and sundry other appearances, and make all our products for
(04:52):
Macy's and and Home Depot and Michael's. And actually working
harder now that I probably worked ten years ago, although
who knows. I mean, I don't keep track. Before Brian
interjects and has a question. I just want to mention
if people here a little noise. I'm drinking a delicious
(05:12):
Martha Stewart cappuccino and that's a Martha coffee. That's still
say coffee that we sell in our cafe down on
the first floor. Did you see the cafe? Did? It
was so cool? What's it like walking into no building
and seeing the Martha Stewart cafe. I want the Katie
currentt cafe. Well, you should have one. You should have
one on the coffee. Oh yes, you can buy the
coffee downstairs at the cafe nowhere else and online I
(05:35):
went on it is Martha Stewart. Martha Stewart cafe, UM
dot com. We're working on a whole line of these
cafes now. The whole team is down the hall working
away today people from all over the country or in today,
looking at and tasting samples of different things that we're
going to be selling at the kind of Howard Schultz
run for his money. UM. It's a very different concept
(05:56):
as a smaller footprint. Basically in office buildings like this one.
This this building has I think over five hundred people
working in it, and there was no cafe. Well, looking
at this wall of Emmy's that I'm staring at. I
wouldn't bet against you. But before we we delve into
your bio, which is something we do on this show.
(06:19):
We do, we do, we do, But before we go
all the way back. It was interesting you just mentioned
your company being sold, and I think a lot of
people remember that moment when Martha Stewart Living on the
Media went public and you served homemade briyosh at the
New York stock Et. Tell us a little bit about
(06:39):
the journey of the company since then to the point
that you're sort of selling it now you're no longer.
That was the probably one of the most exciting days
in my life, except for the day that my daughter
Alexis was born. Uh, and maybe the day I got married,
and then two days that my grandchildren were born. Uh uh,
(07:00):
maybe my cats and my dogs, But most exciting day
of your life. But I have a lot of I
have a lot of pets. So this was a very
exciting day going public because I had worked really hard
to build a superb company, Martha Stewart Living Omnimedia, and
it was kind of a cutting edge company, and this
was a company that actually took into consideration the Internet,
(07:25):
the television, the printed word, the media as well as merchandising.
So it was really truly on the media. And we
still are. We're still on the media. I love I
love the idea of being omni media. And we took
ourselves away from publishing the magazine with Time Inc. We
started publishing on our own uh And that day, um,
(07:48):
we went public at a share of I think it
was eighteen dollars a share, which went up to about
thirty two dollars. I was a multibillionaire at that day.
It was so day. And I drove up Madison Avenue
after after the long day, and I said, I said, God,
I can buy pretty much anything. Did you know? I
(08:11):
was so stupid. I should have I should have spent
it all then because everything was much cheaper then than
it is now. And I, well, I should have bought,
could have, should have, would have, could have. That's a
whole chapter in my autobiography, which I am penning right now.
You are making one too. We're gonna I'm not gonna
(08:33):
tell you anything else then because you'll you'll copy me,
my sister. But that should would could is I'm sure
it's a big chapter in your life too, And it's
one of those things that happens to everybody. I mean you.
I remember every single antique that I didn't buy it,
(08:53):
every single auction I went to from the time I
was married in nineteen sixty one. Can you imagine seem
to expend of at the time. No, it just seemed
though I can't afford it, or maybe it will fit.
And I should have bought everything. I should have been
the biggest consort because but I am a very frugal
person and I still, Oh my god, and my daughter
(09:16):
is more frugal than you are. My daughter points out
all the time, why don't you have your own airplane? Mom?
Why don't you have your own yacht? And the river?
And you know, she she knows. I could have had
pretty much anything. I still actually I've done pretty well
in the real estate department, and I should still do
some of those things. But I'm not an extravagant liver.
(09:37):
I live simply personally, although I do have you know,
I live on a farm up. I know, but it's simple.
I don't know. I I looked at your blog the
last few days preparing for this interview, and I thought,
who lives like this, maybe the Queen of England. No,
I think the Queen of England and Martha I don't
have fault, but we have a lot of staff anyway. Well,
(10:04):
I think the thing about Martha's that, you know, I've
always thought that you have made elegance accessible and I
think you predated sort of this whole notion of nesting
and of making beautiful things and making a house a
home and all that, And what what made you realize
that there was an appetite for that in this country.
(10:25):
I was brought up by a mother who really took
the art of homemaking to the next level. She made everything,
She sewed our clothes, she canned the tomatoes, she made
a delicious meal three times a day for eight people.
My mom was you know, she was a very good
example to me of wanting to elevate a simple life
(10:50):
into a good, really good life, healthy life. And we
were simple, I mean we I lived in a in
a three bedroom house on Elm Place and the New
Jersey see which I go back to see sometimes that
people almost had a heart attack when I knocked on
the door the last time, And did you bring them
some cookies? At least? So I just went to I said,
you know, I used to live here. They said, we
(11:11):
know you used, and uh, could I please see my
old bedroom which I shared with my sister Kathy, And
I would put Kathy on the right hand side of
the bed, which had the night light where I could read.
I would make her go to sleep on that side
to warm the bed because we didn't keep it. We
kept the house pretty cold, saving fuel all that stuff. Um.
And so then I would drag her to her side
(11:31):
of the bed. Before Martha was in, she had six
years younger. She she has not forgiven me. Believe me. Um,
it sounds like your your mom was like the CEO
of the house. Well she was. She was pretty much
my dad was the CEO of the garden and the
fixture upper of the place. Uh. And we had an
(11:52):
next door neighbors. We could throw a stone and hit
the next door neighbors door, you know, but we were
friends with our neighbors. We had. It was a nice street.
It was a very pleasant place to grow up. And
I think a lot of people imagine you're like this
major wasp, and I know I'm I'm a daughter of
two Polish American people. They were born here but my grandparents,
(12:13):
all four grandparents were born in Poland, and they came
to the United States on ships, and you know, they
could see the island where they landed, right here in
New York Harbor, and they signed in and two went
to Buffalo, New York. My grandfather was a trained in
My grandfather was ski My mother's father was a trained
iron monger decorative iron work, and uh, and my other
(12:38):
my father's family all moved to Jersey City. I think
about you because I know how close you were to
your mom, Big Martha, unbelievably close. And and did you
ever come on the Today Show with me? You know,
I don't know. I feel like she might have, but
I feel like I've met her definitely, and I know
you always spoke of her. And it was really really
(13:00):
great mother. Uh, and one of those mothers who had
six kids and every child was equal, no matter what,
no matter what the bad things we did, we were
all equal. And then my parents and that was until
the day she died. We were all equally all around
her bed when she died. And she died at four
and almost ninety four years old. So she's she had
(13:22):
a great life, never sick. She just finally decided it
was time. How many years ago was that that was about?
I don't. I don't remember things like years, um, which
is a good thing. Do you remember things are years? Well?
I remember, I do. My mom died three years ago
on day and and and so I remember everything, but
(13:43):
not I just I think about my mom so much,
and I missed her so much. So I wondered if
you felt the same. I missed my mother a lot,
and I wonder, I wonder, you know, what would mother
think about this or that? Um, when I'm making a
delicious meal. She would come over on Sundays, pretty much
every Sunday from from Western Connecticut where she lived with
(14:03):
my sister Laura. She would drive herself and then when
she got in past ninety, I used to sit and
send somebody to pick her up. Um, and she would
come to my house and eat the healthiest, delicious lunch.
She had a great appetite that she'd take a walk
with me. Then she'd have a massage. I always got
my massure over for mom, and uh, and we'd go
(14:24):
to a movie and she'd have a fabulous day and um,
but she was What I really loved about her was
that egalitarian attitude towards all of her children, and so
even though her daughter was rich and famous, the other
five kids were just as famous, just as successful in
(14:44):
her eyes. Yeah, So it occurred to me as we
were preparing for this that you know, you were a
model early in your career. You were a stockbroker for
several years, and you didn't really become quote Martha Stewart
until you were in forty. I was a late bloomer,
which is like Julia Child. Actually that's who it reminded
me of. I was a late bloomer. And my gynecologist,
(15:08):
uh there, I don't know he even called me a
late bloomer. So in what context? And because said that
I was a late bloomer in terms of my in
terms of my business life. And isn't that funny that
your doctor would call you a late bloomer? I thought
it was great, like like my gardener calling me a
(15:29):
late bloomer. So when your first book came out, well,
I Martha didn't really answer that earlier question though, which is,
how did you know that this was a really potentially
huge market for what you were saying After being a
stockbroker and and working with people's money. I then retired
(15:50):
to Westport, and I did started looking around for what
you were doing, a catering business, and I started a
catering business with a friend called Norma Collier, and she
was a famous mall it at the time, and she
wanted to have a business too, So we started this
catering business dealing with people's appetites other than their and
not their pocketbooks really but the same thing. And they
were very similar. I mean, people could be real nasty
(16:13):
or real nice, money or appetite. And then Norma had
to retire early because she was way too hard the work.
And I liked the physical labor. I liked the building
a restaurant every night and then breaking it down and
cleaning the cards. I mean, believe me, I'm a glutton
for punishment worker. I am. I am a worker. B
(16:34):
I just brought up like that. But um, I realized
that the art of homemaking really and truly had not
been celebrated in an appropriate way. And I thought of
my mother all the time. Here's this fabulous woman who
was also a very hard worker, but she hadn't been
celebrated as a homemaker. And to be able to raise
(16:54):
the kids on they were making when my when my
mother wasn't teaching, my father was working. They were living
on a salary of about eleven thousand a year. And
this is a long time ago, but still that's very
little money to manage. That's why the garden was so good. Yeah,
that's why the garden was so big. That's why the
clothing was made by hand. The sewing machine was always busy.
(17:16):
Mom didn't get very many hours of sleep, you know,
the whole thing. And we were not poor. We did
not consider ourselves poor in any way. So when did
you realize that this thing you were doing, that homemaking
and cooking and sewing and gardening, could become a business.
And well, I started writing books in two And I'm
sure you have my Entertaining Book, because I probably and
(17:37):
I actually still remember the pretty picture of you on
the cover. Your hair was long and I think it
was maybe in a half updo or something, and I yes,
and I remember your basket weave um with frosting. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
it wasn't that in there? Oh yeah, definitely. Well I
think I read that before I started. I started to
write books because I started, I started to realize that
(17:59):
my friends were just like me. We all needed some
encouragement to entertain better. We needed better recipes that could
be done, that aren't weren't too complicated, And there were
no at that time, very few illustrated cookbooks. And I,
you know, I consider myself as crazy, I know, but
I considered myself kind of a really good cook at
(18:21):
the time. And so I wrote this book entertaining and
my publisher I remember saying, if you sell ten thousand copies,
you should be happy. I said, I know twenty five
thousand people who will buy this book, because I have
been catering for a while and I had all South
Bese clients. I had the museums in New York hired
my me for my services. I did parties at the
(18:42):
Metropolitan Museum of Art. How many didn't. So it's it's
way way over a million copies. So um, I don't
know the latest. I should, I should know the exact number.
But you don't wake up in the morning and say,
let's look and see. I'm sure. I'm sure it's way
over because by the way, that was for the first
of what over a Well, we're up to we're up
(19:05):
to ninety now, and we just published here this is
the right. That's what a new one called Slow Cooker nine.
And then the Newlywed cookbooks coming out very shortly, and
that will be our nine. And then Martha's Flowers comes
out in February. I'm excited about that. So does that
teach you how to arrange flowers? How to grow and arrange?
(19:25):
It's growing, enjoying and arrange flowers. What's your favorite flower?
I like fragrant flowers. I like lilacs. Oh, I love
I like true lips, I like roses, I love you know.
I I love piannies. But I feel like they become
everybody's favorite flowers, so that makes me not like them.
(19:45):
Don't don't feel like that. Now you know what I'm
meant to Martha? Well, obviously hydranges, I don't. My hydranges
were on steroids. They needed this year. This was the
big year for hydranges, right, Oh my go apples like apple.
It was crazy. But I'm really into dahlia's right now.
Are fabulous. They're so pretty. They're so gigantic. Dahlias and zinnias,
(20:09):
I think together they're pretty. They're pretty. Brian. Yes, every
now and then I can surprise you. It's time to
take a quick break. We'll be back with more surprises
and more Martha right after this. And now back to
(20:32):
our conversation with the one and only Martha Stewart. You're
so incredibly productive, all these books and TV shows and magazines,
and I ready only need four to five hours of
sleep per night. Can you walk us through a typical
Martha day? I mean, what did you do today? For example,
Today's today's like New York, So that's not so interesting.
(20:52):
Yesterday was a good day. Okay, Okay, so yesterday I
have I don't have live in help, but I do
require that my housekeeper or keepers. Sometimes I have to
come in at seven, so I can't be in bed
if my housekeeper comes. I just don't do that. So
I get I'm up before they're up, and I take
um the covers off the bird cages, and I have
(21:15):
read factor canaries in my house. They're beautiful and they're singing.
And then I have three cats and five dogs in
Bedford and where I live most of the time I
can I commute to New York and so um, they're
they're all kindness. Am I taken care of? By the
time the housekeeper comes on a Sunday. I only have
one housekeeper and I have a driver who also comes.
(21:37):
I read somewhere you have four drivers. Well yeah, but
not all the same time. No, no, I know, but
I have my days are days are so long and
you can only they can only we can't forty hours
a week and they can't be tired. So that's why.
All right, but um, but is just jealous. But all right,
so we've we've taken care of them. So then, um
(21:59):
and so then I I make breakfast for everybody. So
I made the cappuccinos for everybody, because the eggs come
from your chickens. Right, Yes, yes, you've mentioned. We have
salmon for breakfast because some a friend had sent me
two beautiful big salmon's. A lion caught salmon's from Alaska
last week and I had to eat them. So I
poached salmon. I'm doing I'm doing a little blog on
(22:20):
that on how to poach the salmon and its oats,
pretty pictures, and so I photographed the blog and I
make the salmon. No, no, we just eat it with
lemon juice. It's so tasty. Yeah, like yogurt, cucumbers, nothing,
nothing for breakfast. That this is breakfast and then for
lunch and so then so then after that I and
(22:42):
my green juice. We have green juice every morning. Everybody
drinks green juice because it's like power. So what do
you put in your green So it's spinach, celery, parsonally mint,
maybe a piece of fruit of some sort, like a pear.
Green pear is good. Um, a piece of melon or
to papaya or mango. Whatever. It's very good juice. Everybody's
(23:04):
delicious and very drink that. Then I went on a
horseback ride, and that was at ten o'clock. I was
ready for the horseback right after doing you know, getting
make sure everybody's doing lots of horses and I have
six horses. And so yesterday I rode Rins and my
uh and my horse groom Sarah, she rode Ramon and
(23:26):
we went off property and two and a half hours
later came home. I was dying, as is a long
horseback ride, and we were doing a lot of trotting.
And that we went down Maple Avenue and through the woods,
and Bedford has a has a series of bridle trails
about three hundred miles, so you can get lost, you
(23:47):
can have a good time does Ralph Lauren live up there?
He was extraor to me, we like, hey, Ralph, Martha, Hi,
Ralph riding by. I'm I'm the farm at to Ralph's stay. Eat.
I'm the farm at Okay, yes, the modest farm next
to Ralph, a very nice neighbor. And then, oh, I
(24:10):
should have told you. Then then I'll tell you about
Friday night afterwards. But and then I came back from
the horseback ride. I made the lunch, so I sautade
some onions from the garden, fresh onions, and some red
and yellow peppers, and I made a for Tata, delicious
for Tata, studded with little lots of cream cheese, which
I like for Tata. I don't know why, but I
(24:31):
just like it. And I we had little cheese puffs
that were left over from Friday night supper. And that
was a salad of dark red and green lettuce um
from a night's supper, the one that was on the blog.
But you, and then when I didn't finish my day though,
then sorry, then can I just interrupt and ask a question?
(24:52):
How many people did you prepare lunch for? And did
you have no? No, it was just just the people
who were hanging, you know, working around in the place.
So Carlo's Jama and Frank and who else was there yesterday?
A dawa. Then we made fifty gallons of apple cider,
(25:13):
or would you bring some of that apple cider over here?
Fifty gallons of this and you know how hard it
is to crush the apples. It's delicious apple. Take a sip,
it's so good. What kind of apples did you use?
Who knows? On my property? We must have fifty varieties
(25:34):
of apps, so delicious I've ever had. We compare it
to other I think it's really what makes it so good,
just the variety of apples, I think. Um. So we
did that. And while they were doing that, I shucked
and scraped the corn off, about maybe sixty ears of corn.
And I searched and I saw tade all the kernels
(25:57):
and a little bit of butter with some some water,
and then I froze. I think I froze ten quarts
of corn kernels. And then I made a great pot
of from again, there's so many tomatoes. I made a
great pot of tomato soup, just tomatoes and onions. Just
threw them all in this giant pot and cooked and
(26:17):
cooked and cooked until then put it through the food
so you get all the seeds and skits on. I
think we made eight quarts of tomato soup and relaxing Sunday.
So then I went, Oh, my friend called Memory. My
friend Memory called and said, you have to go see
this garden. It's on the open days and Greenwich open
Days is the Garden Conservancy, which is a very fantastic organization.
(26:41):
I belonged to that, and people who belong open their
gardens to other gardeners. So I went to see Mr
Landman's garden and Greenwich, which is incredible, fifteen acre garden.
Made me sick because because if I feel jen we're
happy for him. When I when I get jealous, the
only time I ever jealous, it's not envy, it's just jealous.
(27:03):
I it's anyway. His garden is so beautiful. Then I
went to see my friend Memory, who was lying in
bed because she has a cut on her leg. Who knows.
And then I left there. I got in a bad
mood because she was in bed. And then I went
home and I went we searched for my missing peacocks.
Were always missing two peacocks. They were out eating with
the it's a busy day. It is a busy day.
(27:24):
It sounds fun, it is fun. The peacocks were hanging
out with the wild turkeys. Now there's a gang of
five wild male turkeys and my two male peacocks that
I allow out of their enclosure. Uh, they have kind
of befriended the wild turkeys. And is there any nookie
going on? Peacocks a band of boys and uh, so
(27:50):
we could tell her forever. I mean, you don't know,
these are so silly. I hope this is not boring
to you. Love you love. I went to get a massage.
I went to a Chinese reflexology and did something where.
Then I went home and I did a little bit
more cooking. But I had a column do this morning,
so I had to work on my column on the
(28:11):
restoration of furniture. So I had to write that, and
then I went and watched the Emmys. Thank god the
Emmys were on, because I had such a good time
watching the Emmy's and that relaxed me. And that's that
was my day. See, that's the Sunday. So speaking of
Donald Trump, right, because that was the topic when he
absolutely should have won. And by the way, didn't Alec
(28:34):
look good. Lass he looks so good. I thought he
looks so it's a couple of and he looked great. Yeah. Yeah,
you were there and that was a fun night and
opening night of the the US Open. But can I
ask you about him seriously because after um, well there's
another topic. But after your release from prison, you did
(28:57):
Martha Stewart the Apprentice or the apprent to Martha Stewart
and this office. It was right here in this office.
We built their bedrooms, here, their kitchens. The whole thing
was the most monstrous production you have ever seen. And
Donald Trump was the executive producer of it. Well, yes,
one with Mark Burnett. And Mark Burnett promised me when
I agreed to do it, that I would fire Donald
(29:20):
at the end of my show, that Donald, we're going
to replace him. Yes, and Donald did not want to
be replaced. By the time of Blind President, I know,
he maligned my show so badly. He was nasty. Well, no,
who knows why he wanted. He wanted to stay on TV.
(29:41):
He had he had, you know, he drank the kool
aid and he loved it so much. I show did
really well in Europe, and it did really well in Japan.
But um, but the ratings in America were not as
good as Donald's ratings. But I was as outrageous as
Donald either. I think people like outrage and as know,
after this whole year, Um and so so. But he
(30:05):
but we remained, uh some semi cordial. And what did
you learn about him from working with him? Well, he
had very little to do with my show. What did
you learn about him from what he said about you around?
I was not happy and my daughter. He said nasty
things about my daughter and she was on the radio
at the time he was, and she was on the
(30:25):
Apprentice for a little bit and I did not like that,
and none of us did, and it was not nice.
I would never say anything untoward of his about his children.
You don't talk about people's children, but he does. How
do you think he's doing as president? Do we have
to really get there? I was not. I was not.
(30:46):
I'm not happy at the state of things at all.
You were a big Hillary Clinton supporter. Did you have
you read her new book yet? No? I haven't. I've
I've listened to many of the interviews and have you
have you interviewed here? We had an interviewed or where
hoping to get her on our podcast. You know, she
had known her. I did her first interview when she
became First Lady in the early I remember, I remember,
(31:10):
and I saw her in the attempt. And she was
walking on Louie Pond Lane the other day, really, and
I was walking my dogs and she I bumped into
I saw the black van's first and I thought, oh God,
who's coming? And it was Hillary. She know, she was
with a friend, Liz Robbins, and we talked for quite
a while standing there in the middle of the street.
(31:30):
And uh, and she looked well and she told me
her book was just about to be released. It was right,
I guess it was a week before her book came out.
And um, so I haven't read it yet, but but
she has to speak out, she has to say what
she said. And uh, and you know, it's a it's
too bad. She's really damned if she does. Damned if
she does. And I mean I've been, I've been, I guess,
(31:53):
not surprised, but it's still I'm always taken aback at
the vitriol and hatred that is directed at her. And
you know, well, today I saw Bernie Sanders on Morning
Joe now he I don't know if he was on
there or they were just they were just showing film
with Bernie. Nobody has pointed out Bernie saying, oh, I
(32:15):
did so much to support Hillary this. Why isn't anybody
pointing out that Bernie Sanders lost the election. Well, a
lot of his supporters are kind of of the view
that she stole it with the super delegates, and nothing
could be more wrong. She actually beat him fifty in
terms of the popular vote in the primaries, but that's
(32:36):
not the that's not the approach. Like he he really
disturbed the election by being the third kendidate, Bernie Sanders,
and I never felt as if he really supported her
fully And all those shots of her, of Bernie at
the convention, he looked like he'd been sucking on a limit, right,
I mean, he did not look particularly pleased or supportive.
(33:00):
I mean, I wouldn't want my supporters that she is.
If she had put him on the ballot as the
vice president, that would have helped a lot. So you've
been on the receiving end of some sexist treatment and behavior.
How big of a role do you think sexist and
played in the election last year? A lot a lot. Obviously,
(33:22):
I think people still are not comfortable. Not all, not
all people, but many people are still uncomfortable with the
notion of a woman in power very much. So. I'm
sure you've dealt with that, oh, of course, But but
I'm strong enough to sort of brush it off. And
when you're running for president's pretty hard just to brush
(33:42):
it off. Although I probably would have behaved a lot
differently than Hillary did on those debate stages, what would
you have done? I told him to get lost. I mean,
she she was calling her names, and she wasn't calling
him names. Call him some names. Really, I don't know.
Do you catch her decor? Room did not, She didn't.
I don't think people have to be so decorous to
(34:03):
ugly people. What's the what's the old line about you
get into a mud pit with a pig and the
pig is gonna win. Let me ask you. The one thing,
uh many questions we had, Martha, is and I don't
think you've talked about it that much, is you know,
I look at you and everything you've accomplished, and then
(34:25):
you had this moment in your life when you were
in prison, and I imagine in my mind's eye that
was sal I went to Yale for five months. I
read a lot, I learned a lot. And what was
that like for you mean, was that sort of like?
It was horrifying. It was horrifying. And no one, no
(34:45):
one should have to go through that kind of indignity,
really except for murderers, and and you know there are
a few other categories, but no one should have to
go through that. It's a very very awful thing. Having
said that, I mean, was it a growth experience in
any way? I know that you would read out to
a lot of the other women, and you can make
(35:07):
lemons out of lemonade, and what what? What hurts you
makes you stronger? No, none of those adages fit at all.
It's a horrible experience. Nothing is good about it. Nothing
was What was so horrible about it? Oh, being taken
away from your family, being maligned, being treated the way
(35:28):
you were treated, it's horrible, um, and especially when one
does not feel one deserves such a thing. I mean,
I was not a bad person. Well, I think a
lot of people are under the misconception that you were
convicted of insider trading. You were You were not. I
wasn't even accused of insider trading. But I don't want
to get into that either. I mean, it's just like
(35:49):
like and one thing I do not ever want is
to be identified or I don't want that to be
the major thing of my life. It's just not it's
just not fair. But um, but it's not a good
experience and it doesn't make you stronger. I was a
strong person to start with, and thank Heavens, I was,
(36:09):
and I can still hold my head up high and
know that I'm fine. Did you get to know any
of your fellow inmates and what was that like? I
know you helped them with certain things and become friendly
with them. Um, No, I'm not really friendly. I wouldn't
say that. As much as I tried. I've tried to
help certain of them. Um, there are lots and lots
(36:32):
of odd stories and disturbing things that go on in
a in a incarceration like that, even a minimum security, well,
you couldn't walk in minimum security. Still couldn't walk out
the gate, you know, across the river. Um it was. Um,
there's still guards and they're still it's still nasty and
(36:53):
it's still but but that's that's America has so many
people in prison. You go to Finland and there's about
I think there's like a hundred people in prison in
Finland or some tiny number. Uh. They don't believe in
in that kind of incarceration. Uh, And I don't think
we should have the numbers of people in prison. And
(37:15):
the most of the women that were in this in
this institution were there because of the New York state
drug laws. And now we have legalized marijuana in seven states.
I think it is Uh, that's incredible. And those and
people who had a few ounces of marijuana on them
and are in there for twenty years, it just doesn't
(37:38):
make sense to some of those people get to be
released as as a result. I know that there was
a big movement with President Obama to change sort of
minimum mandatory. Much was done, not not enough was done.
So on a happier note, you've had this friendship with
Snoop Dogg. But I think as uh surprised and delighted
(38:01):
some of your some of your fans more just surprised
others of your people. People seem to really like our
public dinner party. Yeah no, there of course there's a
double one ding Sarcastic. That was my name. I came
up with that name. He did just very get to
(38:22):
know each other. The green we had the green meal,
we had all kinds of stuff, funny names. Well, he
was on My show a couple of times, and he
was always just a pleasant guest and fun and made
people and and the response was always good. Did you
get a contact high from the green room after he
came not in New York? He didn't. He didn't partaken,
(38:43):
and he was on my my show once and honestly,
I opened the door and it was like one of
those cartoons where this smoke just billowed down. I think,
I think, I don't. I think that's probably why he
doesn't come to New York very much, because he's not
free to just that's true. This was in California, yea,
oh no, California, and then um, and then you go
to then Um we did the Justin Bieber Roast together
(39:06):
and that was that which is hilarious for anybody. It was.
It was hilarious. And there I did get a contact
high sitting next to him for four hours on the stage.
Oh you couldn't help it. I mean he had these
you know, he was smoking for four hours right next
to us. Oh yeah, soun doing the show with him. Yeah,
(39:27):
it really is fun and it's um. I call it
a melding of cultures. I mean, here's Compton and Nutley
probably not so probably not so different. Way down under.
I met his mother. He brought his mother to the show.
She's a lovely lady, very intelligent, very well spoken. He
(39:47):
had other family members there. I mean, it's it's kind
of an interesting situation. And then we have these great
guests and we cook, and he's a fun cook. He
and he is his uncle Rio, who is this jovial um,
very fancily dressed on gentlemen, who wears very jazzy clothes,
you know, spats and gold suits and whatever and hats
(40:11):
and anyway, Uncle Rio kind of creates all the recipes
for Snoop and my my straight laced team of Thomas,
Joseph and uh and the rest of the kitchen here
they're they're all like but it's fun. I mean, it's fun.
I think, what's so great about you? You you're always
reinventing yourself. You're always Change is good. That's one of
(40:34):
my mottos. Change is good. And when you're through changing,
you're through in my book, So and you've done that
you've changed, You've changed so nicely and evolved, and I've tried,
but you do you do, You're you're You're prettier now
than you were when I first met you, by the way,
And uh, I think it's because I had such a
(40:56):
fat pace when I was younger, and aging makes you
kind of hollow at a little bit. But had had
enough excess that I don't look on you not now
look normal, right, you look great, And so I think
all of that is uh, is good and um, and
it's been it's been interesting to also challenge myself. I mean,
(41:17):
it's hard to go on the stage with Jamie Foxx
and um Puff Daddy or PGTT or whatever his name
is now and uh us sure and all those guys
and and uh a little YACHTI And it's extraordinary the
talent that comes on our show. Really amazing challenge. Yeah,
that's fun. And meanwhile, UM, as a business person, I'm curious,
(41:38):
as a hugely successful woman in business, what do you
think are the most important lessons you've learned along the way,
Because I don't know, I'm at the point in my
career that I want to mentor more young women, and
so what would you tell them, well, it's UM. It's
all about having ideas, having energy to grow those ideas
(42:00):
into something UM, and having the wherewithal, whether it be
personal or borrowed or education, to build something of lasting value.
And I think just my library of books is of
lasting value. Many of the other things that I've done also,
(42:21):
I think will have a lasting value. Building a brand
is interesting, but it's unless it's a really good brand
and has a wide audience. Uh. What the heck, I'm
not a Bill Gates. I didn't I didn't invent software.
I wish I had. But in the meantime, I utilize
what's available and and learning how to use what's new
(42:43):
and different has made a big difference in my business.
And I think learning you know, when I started my business,
the internet was a baby uh and but I had
a computer. I learned how to use that computer. I
learned how to to to write and and uh and
use the internet to do research to do all of
(43:04):
the things. Now, social media is another challenge for all
of us. How do we how do we maneuver and
uh and uh and negotiate social media to make a
difference without wasting a tremendous amount of time doing so,
so a lot of plays open to open to new
ideas and to and to I was I'm one of
(43:24):
the early adopters of the computer. Believe it or not.
I mean, isn't that crazy? But I am. And two,
I got my first computer. When did you get your computer?
Were you born yet? I was when I was just born.
When did I got my first computer? I think it
was in the late eighties at some point. I got
my adrink in the early nineties. Well when I oh, no, yeah,
(43:45):
I think in the early or even late eighties, when
broadcasting wasn't using computers in We were the first magazine
to design on an Apple and that's why I wanted you.
I wanted to make sure that we were doing it
in the new and different way. It was no cutting
and pasting on the big tables, so it's a it's
(44:08):
that So making use of what's available currently available was
very important to me. My dad used to say that
you really had to stay on top of this ever
changing world. And I think now more than ever it's
a good thing. As you would say, Martha, By the way,
do you remember when I gave you the Matrix Award?
So I you know, I worked so hard on this poem,
(44:29):
and I have to just repeat the first couple of
verses and in communications, and Martha was, of course so deserving.
I remembered. I was terrified because the dais was full
of very impressive women that year. Of course you and
then Whoopi Goldberg, and I think Amy tan and and
Richards and all these people. But I was what went
(44:50):
before me, and I was like, oh, I'm I'm screwed
because she's so funny and relaxed, and I was a
nervous wreck. But I had worked really hard on a
poem for Martha, and it went like this, Martha, Dear Martha,
what should I do? These people have asked me to
introduce you. I haven't eaten, I haven't slept. Talk about
making a girl fill in at anything I can do,
(45:10):
you can do better dipping a candle, knitting a sweater.
A room needs repainting, you'll make it, saying with Robin's
a blue because it's a good thing. And only a
woman who's in your position makes a gingerbread house. This
air condition tartar ta marsi, pacco vent to, bruschetta panchetta
is not all you can do your holiday meals are
a feast for the eyes. Why can't you use stovetop?
And Mrs smiss pies anyway, went on and on anyway,
(45:36):
why heart, Well, you know what I think what. I
worked so hard on this and it was so much
fun to do and I was so honored to be
asked to present it to you. Um. So that's one
of my my favorite poems because my dad said I write.
My dad used to say I write dogg rol, not poetry. Um.
(45:58):
By the way, before we go, we have a listener
voicemail question. We have a listener who called in with
a question for Martha. Okay, I am calling from St. Pete, Florida,
where I'm reading Martha Stewart Living by the Light of
a lantern because I'm still without power. But I've always
been curious about whether or not Martha Stewart has ever
(46:20):
done something she shouldn't have done, like stood up on
a chair instead of a ladder, or didn't we have
the safety glasses she was supposed to do. She's trying
to have all how to do things right, but I'm
just wondering about where she's made some goose that taught
her a lesson. Well, Oh, my gosh, that's a good one.
That's your biggest screw up. My biggest grew up was
(46:42):
riding under the branch of a tree on my giant
horse and getting knocked off because I thought I could
bend backwards under it. That was a stupid thing because
then I broke my arm. But were there any other
things where? Well? Now, when she says standing on a
chair and seat of the ladder, um, I would never
(47:02):
do that because I have taught everyone. I mean, you know,
as as an employer of people, you have to teach
good lessons. So I'm very strict about having a ladder
available in most places, so that if you have to
reach a high shelf, you step on a ladder. Um
in the garden there, they must wear their ear muffs
(47:24):
when they're using loud machinery. Uh, they have to have
safety lessons for chain sauce because I know how I
know how to use chain sauce. I mean, I really
do practice good healthy living well or either that or
your control free. No, no, no, I practice safety for
our safety. Well no I'm not. I mean, I'm not
(47:48):
a nut nudge about it, but I'm serious about it.
But you're so um, you're so good at everything. It's
and I gave a big gift to the emergency room
both in Westport and in Mount Kisco, just in case,
Just in case. They're They're always taken care of. But
what is the biggest Have you ever screwed something up terribly?
(48:08):
Please tell me you have? Like, what is the biggest thing?
You messed my marriage by being a caterer? Really? Probably?
Do you know? I think about you? I'm thinking that
I was attractive enough or something like that. I I
see you at some social events, are passed across on
a number of occasions, and you never remarried. I have not,
(48:31):
um are you? Are you sorry if I could have
married the next guy or the next guy, but I didn't.
I'm not I'm not unhappy about that. I don't. And
now when I see some of my friends with her husbands,
I'm so happy that are they? Are they unhappy? And
that makes you happy that you're not unhappy? Or do
(48:51):
you just feel like who needs it? No? None of
the above. When Mr Wright comes along, I'll marry And
are you still open to datings? How do we have
some librant woman? You are and you're beautiful? How does
somebody do you go to match. Do you go on
match dot com? Or I think you went on for
(49:11):
today's show. Can you imagine the algorithm just doesn't fit me.
It doesn't know. Maybe you could go on Farmers dot com.
Maybe that might be a match made in heaven, Martha.
They could help you with your garden, my farm. I don't,
I don't want I want I want them. I don't
want them to help me with my farm. I want
not going to be hoping on Farmers dot com. It's
(49:32):
sorry O'Brien to talk about your new cook books before
we go, because it's your eighty nine. Is that Martha Cooker?
We laugh because in the intro you said you'd never
really used a slow cooker before, but you knew that
they were really popular and they are now. Isn't this
what people used to call a crock pot? Yeah, this
(49:54):
is the evolution of a croc pot and um, and
it is so the food is so delicious. And this
book we we set out with no holds barred and
no preconceptions because it's not just dump a bunch of
meat and vegetables in a pot and add some water
and turn it on like creem of mushroom soup. No, no,
(50:14):
it isn't any of that. So you can make savory,
you can make sweet, you can make cinnamon buns. You
can make apple crisp. And made apple crisp from start.
Some of that. Our producer Gianna is standing next to
the everything. I don't think, Brian, I don't know. No,
I'm not coming. It's okay. You can share it with me. Yeah, anyway,
(50:40):
so you had did you have fun making this? This
cookbook as usual? So much fun. I mean, I'm excited
because I have to walk a few miles a day
back and forth from the kitchens here. This is a
block long and long block eleventh twelfth Avenue. But to
eat all this food here, give that to Katie. It's
apple cris and this is I just picked so many
(51:03):
apples for something to do with my Brian. You take
a taste, okay, okay, that is so good. And it's
the apples. See fresh apples. The apples are delicious. Here,
I'm gonna get that to Martore. You have, Brian, and
(51:24):
I can care you guys have some. There's a whole
croc butter, cramberries in it, dried crabbers, and now, um,
that's amazing. Isn't that good? So did that dryed? I
take it back, it's fresh crambers. This is the best
interview we've ever done. I know, I know this. And
(51:46):
Nose made us, uh these really delicious crampled eggs that
were so slowly with truffle butter and a brioche toe. Yeah.
When I brought my house in Easthampton, I know what
had still had the barefoot contests to shop in town
(52:11):
and we became friends and I started her TV show.
Did you know that I knew? Imagine? She said that
you were. She forgot that I started her television. Actually,
I think she did mention that. Martha. She said that
you wrote the introduction to her first cookbook and you
were enormously helpful to her. So we have a lightning round. Okay, yeah,
(52:34):
but I was going to ask Martha about what iinus said,
how she couldn't understand if somebody who didn't cook why
they would watch her show. But Brian and I were saying,
we love to watch cooking shows because even if we're
not cooking, whatever is being made you learn and they're
so relaxing. There's something that they're kind of hypnotic and eat. Yeah,
(52:58):
you get hungry. These apples are They are delicious? This
whole thing is super yummy. All right, well I eat Brian.
Why don't you start the lightning wrap. You're making a
simple dinner at home just for you. What are you cooking? Well?
Because I have so many eggs, um, I will oftentimes
make something out of the eggs. But I will also
(53:20):
just bake a fresh potato that's just freshly dug. I
love baked potatoes and um um, just just butter and
sour cream or crime fresh so good um and lots
of chopped herbs. Um. I will um cook a whole
head of cauliflour or broccoli because I love that too.
(53:43):
I'm healthy. Yeah. And what do you put on the
cauliflower or broncoli? Oh? Just cooking and salted water, heavily
salted water, and maybe a dab of butter. Are there
any recipes you hate making? Anything? You hate cooking? I
won't do it. Why? Why ball many food? You hate brains?
I won't eat brains. I don't that's wait. Weight breads
(54:06):
are intestines. They're they're finest glance or something. I don't know.
They're nasty. That's all I have to say that in
shad Row, which my dad used to I know, but
the eggs are so big and it's in this and
millions of little eggs inside the sacks. You're eating the
sack of eggs. Okay, what's your biggest strength and your
(54:28):
biggest weakness? Um? I think my biggest strength is my curiosity,
and probably my biggest weakness is also my career, because
you want to do too many things? Yeah? Probably. Um
do you think marijuana should be legal? Um? Yeah, I
think so. I think so, but I worry about but
(54:49):
it should be controlled by parents because I just think that,
you know, there's too much in gender. I'm understanding that
that school children are partaking too much and it's her
their studies. I don't. I don't like anything that interferes
with growing up in a healthy, vibrant environment. I agree,
I feel like you don't. Why do you? I mean,
(55:11):
I understand would train drugs, but you know, because what
does the child need that for? I don't understand having
sort of this artificial Why worry about all the prescription
drugs that kids are getting in school as well? Like
little in adderall and all of that. Anyway, we have
a listener question that's very quick. It's the longest podcast
I ever did. Messages the Martha Stewarts. What is the
(55:33):
best way to cook pork chops? I want to know,
thank you? The best way to put cook pork chops? Um? Well,
I think pork chops should be. Um. You could bread
them if you want, but I just I just dredge
them in in a salty peppery flower and then I
(55:54):
just cook them lightly in um, a little olive oil
and a little bit of butter until they are pretty
much done. And then I squeeze fresh oranges over them
and let the juices sort of caramelize. They're the best.
It's hard to make a juicy pork chop. Yeah, but
that's that's the best way to something my mom was
(56:16):
never able to do. I'll tell you that. Don't broil them, yeah,
because they get dried out. What's your favorite thing to
do with your grandkids? Oh? Explore? I mean these kids
are such explorers. Sore how old now Martha five and six.
But they are great travelers. And we went to the
Galapagos already, we bunch of Botswana. We go to Maine.
(56:37):
They're climbing rock walls now. Um. They the boys, a
girl and a boy. Girl and a boy, and they're
they're very, very fun to be with. And how's your daughter?
Alexis is great, she's a very good mother. And these
children are the result of close attention. Now we talked
about reinventing. So as we bring this to a close,
(56:58):
what what would you like to do mark that that
you haven't done yet? Like would you like to be
in Martha the musical? I mean, actually can to do that? Actually? No,
actually that would be really music. Um, I'm gonna be
h Yeah, I have I have some business kind of
things to give us a little hint. Well, I've I've
(57:20):
been working on an organizer for for the homemaker and
I'm going to build that. Always fun to see what
Martha does next. Mary, thank you that was really young.
If you're going to produce for sure, Well that was
very delicious. And your new cookbook is called slow Cooker
and I'm excited to have one. And I guess I'm
(57:40):
gonna have to buy a slow cooker now. Thank you, Martha,
thank you Katie. Thank you brilliant, and I'm glad you
came to my office. Thank you for having us, and
thank you for making Apple cider and apple Chris the cappuccino.
Thanks as always to our production team, the intrepid, brilliant
Gianna Palmer, our producer that was Virgianna's dad who fast
(58:03):
forwards to the credits totally. I hope that still counts
as a listen. Nora Richie are wonderful production assistant, and
especially Jared O'Connell, our audio engineer, who helped us take
our show on the road for this episode. Thanks also
to Alison Bresnik for all she does to shine a
light on our podcast via her social media mastery, and
(58:25):
to Emily Beena from Katie Currik Media for her production
prowess as well. Thanks Mark Phillips for our theme music. Wow,
we are laid it on thick today. Ladies, gentlemen, we
heard from a lot of you who left voicemails and
wrote in with your questions for Martha Stewart for this episode.
It was great. We loved it, so remember you can
email us your questions for Marie Condo too. You may
(58:48):
have heard of her best selling book, The Life Changing
Magic of Tidying Up, and if you're a slob like me,
you're going to have a lot of questions or if
you just want to say hi, or that you're enjoying
our podcast, be starting a little pathetic you you want
to know, you know, like what Brian's hobbies are when
he's not reading eight thousand newspapers and newsletters. You can
(59:11):
do so at comments at currect podcast dot com or
leave us a voicemail at nine to four or six
three seven. The lines are open seven. And yes, I
do think we sound a little pathetic, like we don't
have any don't we don't have any friends. If you
want to further cyber stock us, I'm Katie Curic on Twitter,
(59:32):
um and actually read my comments and UM, if you're
a jerk, I block you, so please don't be a jerk. Also,
I'm on Instagram and Katie dot curric on Snapchat. Find
me on Facebook as well, and Brian is at goldsmith
b on Twitter. And last but not least, if you
like the show, please please subscribe. I figured we're pathetic already,
so might as well just lean into it. Subscribe, rate
(59:55):
and review the show over at Apple podcast and helps
us out. Someone stop us. Talk to you next time,
and we promised to be less beggy and whiny and pathetic.
Have a good day, yeah,
Host
Katie Couric
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Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies! Crime Junkie is presented by audiochuck Media Company.