Into the Nether Regions

On this episode, Kay-B is joined by Superfan & TV studies professor, Brandy (@Brandybeephd) to chat about GREY'S ANATOMY season 3 episode 21 "Desire." We discuss George & Izzie's torrid affair, Cristina's lack of wedding motivation, Meredith's mental health, Addison's inability to be forthcoming, and Alex's good guy image! Later, Kay-B chats with Dr. Milhouse (@drmilhouse) aka #YourFavoriteUrologist, a Board Certified Urologist, about this profession choosing her, her first experience with GREY's, the realistic & unrealistic parts of this case & info on this instance of Candirú or fish in a man's urethra, and so much more!

On-Call with Kay-B is an iHeart production with lead editing by Randie Chapman of Wordie Productions (@wordieproductions on IG). Please follow Executive Producer & Host, Kay-B, on Instagram & Twitter @TheLadyKayB.

For more information about Candirú highlighted in this episode, read these articles: https://academic.oup.com/jtm/article/20/2/119/1881714 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8008855/ https://www.auajournals.org/doi/10.1016/j.juro.2015.02.481 

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:14):
Welcome everyone to a brand new episode of On Call
with KP. I am your host k B and today
I am thrilled to be giving you all of the
show tea about episode twenty one from season three of
Gray's Anatomy called Desire with a super fan and TV
Studies professor Brandy. Welcome, Brandy. Hi, k be excited to

(00:36):
be here and thanks for having me on to discuss
all things Grays. Oh my gosh. Yes, So we are
chatting today about the episode of Gray's Anatomy that features Larry,
who is a board member. Um, he is kind of brash, um,
kind of rude. He wants Richard to stay on as chief.
But he's also having an affair with his assistant. And
that's important to know because this episode is filled with

(01:00):
affairs and people having lots of opinions on affairs. Um.
So his wife, Larry's wife actually knows. Um. But it's
a mess because Larry goes to the Amazon for two weeks,
he goes on vacation, he takes his girlfriend, and he
ends up with a fish and his urithrea. So, um,
Meredith likes to call it karma. I'm like girl, Now
we're gonna get into it. But girl, not you, you know,

(01:23):
hooking up with Derek when he has a whole wife
and now you talk about karma, like what is the truth? Um?
But then we also have Ava um Eva gives birth
and her and Alex's friendship is above board right now, Um,
it's PC right now. You know, Addison is a little
scared because of what transpired with Denny Duquette and Izzy. Um,

(01:43):
but for now he's all right, and you know she's
really trying to convince him and encourage him and tell
him that he's a really good guy. UM. And Marcus
still not having sex per Addison's request, but Addison is
really stringing him along. You know, she doesn't really see
a future with him. She wants kids, she wants kind
of a quieter life, and she doesn't think Mark is
that guy. And this seems really unfear to him to

(02:03):
make him kind of buy into this no sex proposition.
But also while she's sleeping with who she wants to
sleep with, and also when she knows that she just
doesn't want to be with him long term, like girl,
cut the cord. Um. Meredith is kind of annoying this
episode because she's like mocking Derek with her over communication
when Derek is like genuinely concerned about her well being.

(02:23):
And I'm like, Meredith, if you're not gonna communicate in
the way that you should, girl, go focus on work
in these exams because also you're kind of failing at
being a doctor right now. That's also what I've noticed
in season three is Meredith is not doing that well. Um.
And we have Burke and Christina. Oh my gosh, Um,
Burke is not reading between the lines because we did

(02:44):
don't want to get married, Hony. She does not care
about being a wife. She cares about being a surgeon
and that is her top priority and he is just
not getting it. Uh. And last, but not least, Izzy
and George I said, we're gonna talk about affairs. We
are going to dive into it. Um. This is just
a reminder that for me in this series, they definitely
did a lot of romantic liberties with the romantic relationships

(03:07):
on this show, and this was one of them, because boy,
did I hate the easy and George Perry. I mean, like,
I get the natural progression of best friends to lovers trope,
but this was not for me. Um. And who Callie
knows that something is happening, but she doesn't quite know,
but Addison is also kind of giving her a hint.
Even though Addison cannot confirm or deny, she can only
go based on her own experiences as someone who has

(03:28):
cheated on their spouse. And so you know, I'm like,
what is the truth? So you know what, let's get
into it. So my first question to you, Brandy is
you know when did you first fall in love with
Ray's anatomy? Oh gosh, um, So Gray's premiered during my
college years, and I remember gathering with friends in the

(03:49):
common area of our dorm and watching episodes weekly, and
I've always been drawn to the melodrama of it all
as a primetime soap, right. Um, all of the relationships
of some Mayor dre Selexi are my ultimate ship, uh,
in terms of their romance. I shed my fair share
of tears on this show. You know. I think it's

(04:11):
actually why I continue to watch, because it's really cathartic,
even when my favorite characters are dying and they all die,
but most of them to die. Um. I also continue
to endure the show honestly because it is the longest
running medical drama of the twenty first century, right, you know,
before Grace there was R right and then Mash. But

(04:34):
really they don't make them like this anymore. And I
actually just recently wrote about the COVID nineteen very special season,
which I thought was really well done in its approach
to the pandemic and apply to healthcare workers. And also
you know, you don't get that season without having eighteen
plus seasons before it, right, uh in terms of sort

(04:56):
of what transpires, uh, and the kind of bringing of
characters back, and again the catharsist of it all. Um.
So that's why I keep hanging on against all odds.
It's like the show that literally won't die. It's like
the show that never ends. Yet I think that you're
right though, like the COVID nineteen season would not have

(05:16):
worked without kind of the build up of the prior
seasons before um and kind of having certain staples and
a certain reputation, I guess is the best way to
put it. As to your point, the longest standing medical
drama you know of the twenty one century, um So,
you know, every single episode has a lot of relationship drama,
but I felt like this one in particular maybe had more.

(05:38):
Um So I'm gonna start with Izzy and O'Malley because
I find that they are at the center of this week.
And that's mostly because, you know, one thing that I
have said over and over again is that I adore
the way Grace does parallels between their their medical case
and their patients and also their doctors. And so the theme, um,
you know, the parallel of this week is a fair

(06:00):
like that. That's just what it is. And so it
seems like everyone has one or has had one, or
has an opinion on it. And you know, we have
Leary from the board, as I mentioned, um in his
affair and you know, kind of getting that fishonist penis
um really in his urethra in the Amazon, and we
see how how George is kind of forced to interact

(06:20):
with his assistant, with Larry, his assistant and his wife,
and that is kind of bringing up what's happening between
him and Izzy and Callie, and so you know, um,
he and Izzy kind of had this this toward moment,
uh and this affair. And Callie, you know, is feeling
a lot of things right now, so she doesn't know

(06:41):
for sure that they're having an affair, but she knows
that Izzy and George are too close. And it's interesting
because this sexual relationship that transpired between the two of
them has made them even closer than before. So much
show that by the time we get to the end
of the episode, our boy George is kind of down
that leg I'll just go to another hospital to or
what like what relax? So, um, you know? And what

(07:05):
are also what are you gonna tell your wife when
you're like, Oh, I'm just gonna transfer, yeah, and you
feel like your life is just going to go back
to normal, empy what it is? She's going to be
wildly suspicious when you come to her and you're like, oh,
I need to get change hospitals in the middle of
my internship. What no? So um you know. It's interesting
because Izzy is not She's not capable really of separating

(07:26):
her feelings from a scenario, like it's just not it's
just not who she is. So this affair is literally
eating her alive, um, you know. And this is why
she's stuffing her face with all these cakes and she
kind of spits it out to Burke because she has
to tell someone. So what do you think about Izzy
and O'Malley and this affair? Because I will be honest,
this was like I was like, y'all are down bad.

(07:48):
This relationship is not for me at all. So much
mess Amy s s Um. I've always struggled with the
Izzy George affair. Um. This is no respect to tr Night,
but I, in general, UM find a lack of desire
for him. I mean I just find George incredibly a

(08:11):
sexual um in a in a totally fine way, right, Um.
And so with Izzy and George, I just have no
patience for that affair. UM. You know, I think that
Izzy has established yourself as being, you know, someone who
is highly codependent. Um. And so you know it's just
for me, not not a good look for her. Um.

(08:33):
Callie is absolutely justified in wanting Izzy to fall back,
uh and create a boundary with her husband. But again,
it's also just the struggle for me to even sort
of see George as this optical affection for like so
many women. I mean, he's very nice and sweet and
it's it's great, but I see no kind of sex
appeal with him. This episode is called desire, right, Like

(08:55):
I I see no desire on the part of George. Um.
But again, you know, Izzy and George obviously have a
connection and you know, it's it's unfortunate that Callie sort
of has to you know, be explicit with Izzy about um,
you know, saying that she can't compete with her. Um.
I think that's a really hard place for a wife

(09:17):
to be in, right to sort of you know, especially
when your husband is very close with another woman, right, UM,
you don't want those feelings of jealousy. But obviously right
after it's you know, become sexual. Uh. You know, Callie
is still trying to fight for this relationship, uh, which
you know I have questions about. But at the same time,

(09:41):
is he has to recognize that there are boundaries, right,
and and that you know, maybe she needs to think
about how she can you know, relate to George differently
um in this in this moment where he is with
someone else. You know. Someone say that Izzy is used
to crossing boundaries and not having repercussions for boundaries, and

(10:05):
so I think it's because of that that's why this
is so challenging for her. But let's talk about Mark.
Because Mark Mark Mark Mark moved from New York to Seattle,
which like, really, you left all the money in New
York plastics to come to Seattle. Plastics, which like, truly
obviously this is a TV show for a reason. But
Mark left really to follow Addison, right like he believes

(10:28):
that she's the love of his life a little does
he know he's gonna meet Lexi. That's gonna change. I
actually did really like Mark and Lexi, so that is
one of the couples that I do enjoy on this show.
But he's following Addison, and Addison essentially is just trying
to change him. Thank girl. The first rule is don't
try to change your partner. You know who Mark is
when you met him like that, that's the truth. You

(10:50):
also know how incredibly sexual he is. He's just a
sexual being. He enjoys sex, and you are trying to
like cut that out and make him into a house
husband in my mind, and I'm like, girl, just let
him be who he is. So why do you think
that kind of Addison won't just be transparent with Mark
and be like, listen, I don't see a future with you.
This isn't it. And why does Mark have to be

(11:12):
the one to tell her what he thinks she wants
to hear in the end by basically saying, oh, I
had sex with someone else, which Keith lying, but I
had sex with someone else to give her kind of
an out versus just kind of them having an adult
conversation and getting to the root of it, which is Mark,
you are about to be rejected by Addison because she
doesn't find that you have a parental bone in your

(11:33):
body at this juncture in your life, and that's why
she doesn't want to be with you. Like why can't
they just have that adult conversation, like what are they
afraid of? I mean, I think with with Mark, it's
a bit of a turning point for him and the
sense that you know, I think that Mark, he's he's
sort of understood since you know that episode as like

(11:54):
mixed team and there's really nothing else to him. And
obviously because I'm biased, right, like when Lexie comes you,
you know, we opened up this whole new kind of
like mark uh personality, right that we hadn't necessarily seen before.
And so I actually appreciated him being straight with her
um about kind of what was happening and what she
really wanted or or or or didn't want. And so

(12:16):
you know, I saw a little bit of growth for
him in this episode that I hadn't seen before and
I think for for Addison and Alex, I mean it
goes back to the kind of you know, her performing maturity,
right has She's never seen with the type to be
with an intern um, and so I think that that is, uh,

(12:37):
that's kind of in her head. Um. And she's you know,
been sort of floundering, right like, post Derek. And I
think that she will find her footing, you know, when
she leaves and goes to private practice. Um. But certainly,
you know, she's in this kind of mush moment, and
I don't think she actually knows what she ultimately wants

(12:58):
in this kind of post break up uh face you
know what, That's the perfect point. And that's exactly what
I was just about to say. She doesn't know what
she wants. And here's the thing. Addison hasn't been single
for a long time, right, And when you mess up
and you have this affair. She worked so hard to
try to get Derek to forgive her, She worked so

(13:19):
hard to try to pick up the pieces and and
kind of you know, put her marriage back together. That
didn't work. Then here's Mark in the corner professing his
love to her. And I think a part of her
feels obligated to give Mark a shot because she blew
up her marriage. Like she feels like this has to
have been more than just a carnal physical affair. It

(13:43):
had to have meant more. It has to be more.
I have to succeed at this because that one thing
didn't work out. And then she sees Alex, and Alex's yeah,
Alex is like a fun time, but he's also a
good guy. He also has emotions. He's not really showing
them right now, right, but he does. And so she's
like just bouncing from person to person I think, really
trying to find out what it is that she wants,

(14:06):
and she's having a hard time. So to your point,
you're right, which private practice a fantastic spinoff Lips so good.
She eventually comes into the woman that she wants to be.
And now even coming back to Grace, she she's having
her kind of full circle moment, but it took her
a long time to get there, and it takes her
a while to just kind of sit with her failure.

(14:27):
I don't know any other way to say it, but
it's kind of like a girl, just own your failure.
That's okay. You don't have to jump to another relationship.
You could just kind of take the time to figure
out who you are now, who it is that you
want to be, and kind of own that. Um. But
stop destroying these men in the process. I'm like, is
right now you're sending Mark down a rabbit hole of issues, um,

(14:50):
and you're creating new issues and Alex that weren't there before.
So like, relax, absolutely, um. But something that I did
enjoy about this episode and that I you enjoy um
about this season, it's kind of the progression of Addison
and Callie's friendship. But it is funny about Addison giving
kind of advice like she wasn't in an affair just

(15:11):
last year. It's like, girl, yeah, okay, girl, so what
do you think about her giving advice to Callie about cheating?
And it is funny because I loved when they were
talking about Mark. It's just the irony of it because
you never know where life is going to take you.
Because Kelly is giving her advice on Mark, and you know,
Callie and Mark end up having a baby, and so
it's just like, oh, not you giving her advice And

(15:32):
that's definitely not the trajectory that life will go down,
especially on Gray's right, right, right, Yeah, so what do
you what do you think about their their friendship and
her giving her advice about cheating. Yeah, I like their friendship.
I mean, I just like it when the interns talk
with the interns and have their relationships, and the attendees

(15:53):
and the residents right like have their own kind of click. Um,
because they're a little bit older, right, and you know,
they're able to engage on a different kind of level. Uh.
And so I really like Addison and Callie's friendship. Um.
I like that they're able to chat with each other.
Although maybe Addison, as you said, should not be giving

(16:14):
Callie advice about cheating. Uh. You know, that's the pot
calling the kettle black. But whatever that's saying is But yeah,
it's really funny that, you know, in the kind of
permutational relationships that this show has offered over the course
of the decades, right that then you know, uh, Mark
will will sort of have a child with Callie. Um.

(16:35):
So yeah, it's you know, it's a breath of fresh
air to see different characters talking to each other. Uh.
And and so I enjoyed their conversation. Yeah, because it's
glaring who doesn't have any friends um and one of
them is Burke. It's glaring, glaring that he doesn't have
friends at this hospital. It's glaring every single season to me,

(16:58):
So we have broken Christina. Burke is not reading the
right the writing on the wall. He can't get Rosina
to commit to anything about the wedding. But in this
particular episode, it's about the cake, and instead of Burke
having friends to go to, he just takes the cake
to the hospital, lets a bunch of people try it,
and gets their opinions over. You know, Christina is essentially

(17:19):
because she doesn't care. Now here's the thing. She actually
doesn't care because she doesn't want to be married and
she definitely wants to be a surgeon over a wife.
Like that's very clear. But also I will say she
is an intern, which Burke knows. She is legitimately busy.
She has her exams coming up, so asked her to
choose a wedding cake when she needs to be studying

(17:39):
for the exams. That are I believe they said in
two weeks. It's also kind of problematic, like also, so
you kind of set yourself up for failure, Like it's
a lot of things happening on on both sides. But
also I do find that Burke should not have to
pull teeth with his partner and things like this. So
should Burke Christina now and save himself. Now we know

(18:01):
that does not actually happen, but I want to know,
you know, if this where he should have saved himself
and ran. You know, I've always liked Burke. I'm a
bit of a birk apologist, variety of reasons. But in
this moment, you know, he's looking for anything, however miniscule,
that will indicate that Christina is all in on the

(18:24):
relationship as much as he is. Right. So, you know,
the little cute moment with the red velvet cake at
the end, right where she kind of off handedly says right,
like that's my favorite, and he's like yes, like you
know we are meant to be right. Um, he's looking
for any affirmation from her, um about the future of

(18:46):
their relationship. And that's not a great place to be, um,
if you're thinking about your your life partner. UM. So
I think that those little moments are what he him
in that relationship. Even as Christina is you know, highly empowered,

(19:06):
highly driven in terms of her professional career. Um, he
clearly enjoys that about her as well, and I don't know,
there are like moments in that relationship where they're very
fun that I think he wants to hold onto but
you're right, he doesn't have anyone to talk to. Um,
we'll probably get to this, but I mean, I think

(19:27):
there's a there's a moment where, you know, he talks
to Derek and it's funny there Darren explationship with Burke,
not only in terms of their career, but also in
terms of them dealing with these I don't know if
they coined the term twist twisted sisters yet, but like,
I think that that is an interesting kind of connection
that he has, right, So they're always he and Derek

(19:48):
are always like commiserating about like how they both fall
in love with these women who like can't be tamed, right,
and they're kind of you know, in these dark places,
these dark and twisty places. So again I think it
he likes that about her, but also wants to see
her softer side. He wants to kind of mold her

(20:08):
into being the kind of wife that he imagines that
she can be, but she obviously doesn't necessarily want to be.
So yeah, I found the cake part him itching to
sort of give her a reason to sort of stay
in in this with him, however minuscule and yeah, yeah,

(20:30):
they're definitely not on one of core and Burke Lesbie
really now, you know, darn well, she didn't pick that cake.
You know about this and she literally just said Wren
and was like, okay, I mean, I don't know. I
see in that moment, I think that she like tried
it and was like yeah, and he like took that
as oh my gosh, like we're perfect. But but it

(20:52):
clearly wasn't that for her, Like it was very I
don't think that she cares um, but for him it
was like, you know, yes, I I am recommitted to
to this at all. She excuse me, she doesn't care
at all. And I think honestly she just picked the
first thing that came to her mind because he was
on studying and she's not even thinking about it. But

(21:13):
I will say it is interesting how Derek and Burke
eventually begin to bond. But I even kind of find
that that is only because to your point, the twist
and sisters, the women that they're dating, but otherwise doesn't
have any of friends in this hospital that he can
just go to to talk about his own life. And
it's interesting because when you think about it, a lot

(21:35):
of men on these shows don't have people that they
can just go talk to, you know, Um, Derek has Mark,
and they eventually kind of get back to that space
of being friends. It's not ever like it was, you
know what I mean, Like I mean, there's just a
level of betrayal that I think, you know, it's like okay,
like we'll be friends, but we will never be as

(21:56):
close as we once were. But it's hard because even
George and Alex I wouldn't really consider friends, do you
know what I mean? Like, it's true, they have different personalities. Yeah,
the men just are not friends with each other. They're
friends with the women on the show. And think about Webber.
Webber kind of sits, you know, off to the side
by himself. It's just hard. And even when we get

(22:17):
into like the introduction of Jackson Avery, like who are
Avery friends? Right there? It's really like the men here
are not friends with each other. You know, it's true,
And I but I think that that's like part of
the like you know, feminist element of the show right
where you can show women's relationships and their sociality but

(22:38):
not but not men. With Burke, it's even a bit
more complex because he's a strange by way of race.
But season three is still when they're you know, this
is my TV studies had on now, they're still in
this kind of post racial utopia, so they can't really
talk about right like Webber and Burke can't really discuss
things right Miranda, Um, you know along those lines, and

(23:00):
so yeah, he's really a man on his own kind
of island. Yeah, and it's so wild to see, um,
and even the progression now as you brought it up,
kind of this post racial society like now being able
to when George Floyd happened and kind of breaking open
the doors of of what could be discussed on television
and that kind of shifting how Gray's kind of talked

(23:21):
about race in a lot of ways. Things have expanded
so much. So, um, yeah, it's an interesting dynamic to see.
But let's talk about Alex because Alex has, in my opinion,
the most dynamic character growth on this show. I would say, yes,
he has the best there there is literally and and
one of the best on TV and my personal opinion,
but there's no growth like Alex is up until the

(23:42):
end where you know, all that essentially went down the
drain and he left his wife are Izzy and the
kids that he knew nothing about. That was a journey.
But I appreciate seeing season three Alex because he is
so oblivious to the things that are to come right
and he's running. He's running from who he actually is, which,

(24:04):
to Ava's point, is a good guy. So when you
watch this episode, did you see him in Ava becoming
a thing you know? Um later on? Um? Or did
you kind of only see this as a platonic friendship?
You know, I always my Spidy since has always went
up with Ava. I mean, she's fine, but I mean,
as we realized, I mean, Coreb is such a romantic

(24:25):
at heart. Um. He likes to take care of people.
And we learned much later why this is right due
to his home life. Right. Um, he has a tough exterior,
but he's really sensitive. I don't know. There's the moment
in this episode when she's she's in surgery and he
asks her to keep breathing and caresses her forehand. That
was also a woman where Addison kind of looked like

(24:47):
slightly weirdly jealous. Um, but I think that you know,
he likes to be he is a caretaker. Um. And
this it runs throughout all of his serious relationships, whether
that be with Izzy or or anyone else. And so
you know, I I love that character growth for him. Um.

(25:07):
You know, it only makes it weirder when at the
end of his sort of character journey, right, he sort
of does his kind of bizarre one eighty or or
what have you. So, yeah, I mean I definitely saw
sparks between Ava and Alex during this episode. Um. It's

(25:28):
hard to distinguish between those kinds of romantic sparks and
again the kind of caretaking sparks. Uh. And certainly I
think Ava blends the two and it doesn't end well.
But but certainly, you know, in that moment, I was like, oh, this,
this might be something special. You know. It's interesting because

(25:49):
Alex has a couple of issues. He has his care
taker spear because he's the oldest child. His mother, you know,
had a lot of medical issues and he was used
to take care of taking care of her and taking
care of his younger siblings because he had to. So
this is why, really at the heart of it, he

(26:11):
went into medicine, right, because he's good at it and
he knows it and this is what he wants to do.
But it's hard for Alex because I think to in
this kind of caretaker responsibilities, it's also a form of
control because he lacked the ability to be able to
control his situation of how he grew up, in all
of the things that happened to him, and he wants

(26:32):
to be able to control the situation, which is also
why it takes a really long time for him to
be vulnerable and allow other people to care for him.
And so Ava the entire time, even in this episode,
is actually trying to convince him to kind of let
go of control a little bit, and you know, she's
sharing secrets with him, and he just like he actually

(26:54):
can't do it. So it's interesting to even see in
their dynamic as the show progress is how he kind
of like lays that down now he gets burned by Eva.
I was just saying, well, you know, he has a type, right,
and I think it's because I think it's because of
this kind of like impulse towards caretaking that he then
like you know, falls in love with these women who

(27:17):
you know, for better or for worse, end up it
ends up backfiring on him, um in in ways that
are out of his control, right. Uh. And then he
sort of you know, becomes really injured. H and so,
which makes his final kind of you know move all
the more perplexing, but you know, wildly perplexing. Please please

(27:38):
all right. So the big mystery case here is Larry
has his enlarge testicles. He has urinated in three days,
which is also wild. Um. And you know, we come
to find out that a fish swim up his uithreat.
So how did you feel about this realistic case? You know,
you did say that the medical cases are intriguing and
it is part of the reason why you stick around.
So how did you feel about this case in particular?

(28:01):
Did it hook you the most or was there another
case in this episode that entreat you more? Yeah? I
mean I had totally forgotten about this case, and so rewatching,
I was like, oh I remember, I mean I remembered
Larry right as this kind of you know, recurring character sometimes,
and so this one was interesting too. I mean I

(28:21):
wish I actually would have seen more of it. I
think they were focused on, as you were saying earlier,
the kind of parallels between the the affairs, right, and
the kind of interpersonal drama. Um. So we saw a
lot of Larry's affair, uh and you know, slightly less
of the of the kind of medical situation. But it

(28:43):
was really I mean, yeah, my draw was on the
floor when they first introduced that. And obviously they had
this kind of funny, you know, hokey music. Uh. And
so it was a really interesting case. And you know, I,
like I said, I liked the moment where they had
to sort of deliver Ava's baby um as well during

(29:04):
this you know, kind of surprise complication with her conditions.
So so yeah, the fish definitely now will be like
seared into my my memory. I mean, Larry is honestly
like just such a brash and like harsh human being
that I mean to marry to this point, She's like,
Larry deserved it. Now I'm not gonna say he deserved it,

(29:26):
but I will say I'm not surprised it was Larry
who had a fish in this penis I guess that's say, yes, um,
for sure. Yeah, I think that was really interesting. I
think the high stakes of Ava and seeing how Ava's
surprise delivery impacted Alex and what that does for the
trajectory of his career impedes. I think it's also very

(29:47):
interesting to see because he just keeps getting deeper and
deeper and when he thinks it's not gonna happen, or
when he thinks he's not going to when he thinks
he's going to temporarily be impedes. I guess that's the
best way to putting like this is just a stop
on my journey, but really, honey, you in it for
the long haul, which she doesn't even see. I think
even this case is kind of one of those turning
points for him to where you're like, how this is it?

(30:08):
Like this is your life, this is your specialty, this
is what you're doing, and this is who you're going
to be. So let's let's lean in. So okay, last question,
who's your favorite character this episode? And why? Who? Yeah?
I mean actually Yang, she's not in it, you know,
as much as as she's been. But I just liked

(30:29):
how driven she was, Like she was like I am
studying and I need to get this material. Like when
what was she trying to get from Calie the notebooks
for something? Right? Like she trying to get her study
cards or card study cards? Yes, and I just love
that for her, right, I love that she, you know,
had her eyes on the ball, not not Larry Festaicles,

(30:53):
but she had her eyes on you know, the prize
and to do well, you know, on her Sam. So
I was very much into Yang being Yang. And also
I will say, I mean correct, right, like I think
that he Um, we just love him being a sensitive king,

(31:13):
you know what. So, yeah, my my favorite characters episode
hands out with Alex um and I think it's because
Alex in this point, in this juncture on this show
is the only person who is honest to other people
with other people. The only person he's not honest with
right now is himself, which Alex, come on, we gotta
do the self work and be honest that we're a
good guy. But he's honest with other people, which I appreciate. Um.

(31:35):
And you know what, Alex just softens, like you can
see the layers kind of unfold with him episode after episode,
particularly in season three, you just see how the walls
come down and how he's allowing space for change and growth.
And I don't know, you know, he will forever be
my favorite character growth on the series. I don't care

(31:57):
when the series ends. I don't care how many new
people they get, it will always be Alex for me
because his journey is just so robust. Again, let's pretend
like the end didn't count, but it was up until
that point. And even when he meets Joe and they
have they're essentially kindred spirits when it comes to the
level of trauma that they've had as you know, growing

(32:19):
up as kids, as young adults, um, and so they
share that, but it's something about the level of intimacy
that it creates between the two of them that is
unlike anything Alex has had before, you know, um and
not even Izzy. And also I appreciated him because honestly
in this episode he's at least annoying. Meredith was on
my annoying, right, Christina was on my nerves. I was like,

(32:40):
and George, George and Izzy were on my nerves. I'm like, listen, y'all,
and as it was all my nerves too. So really
it also comes down to come down annoying. And I
also think, you know, going back to Alex's you know,
trajectory and his growth, I mean, this is the seeds
of him becoming a pediatric surgeon, right like he you know,

(33:02):
he loves babies. He wants to deliver babies. So yeah,
I love it, love it, love it. Well, you know,
just thank you so much for joining the show. This
was really fun. I always love talking with fans of
Grays about Grays because it's just I mean, being able
to kind of relive these moments is very very interesting
for me. And being able to just kind of dive

(33:24):
in a little bit deeper and now knowing also, I
think it's just so different, like now knowing what happens
with these characters, to see where they started and rewatch
it and be like if you only knew what's coming
down your way, like yes, you only absolutely so yes.
Thank you so much for joining on call with Kabe.
Had a lovely time. Thank you for having me on

(33:50):
today's segment. I have board certified gurologists who is very
very active on social media and loves to educate people
at prewere, but primarily does this work in the Chicago area.
I have Dr Millhouse. Welcome, Dr Millhouse. Thank you, k B.
I'm excited to be on this show. And as she stated,

(34:12):
I am Dr Fenmo Millhouse, I'm board certified, and I'm
Fellowship trained and I love love, love what I do
as eurologist. A lot of people don't know about eurology,
and that's okay. So we're here to like talk a
bit about what that means, what we do, and about
this interesting case that was featured like or dramatized, I

(34:32):
should say, on Grey's Anatomy. Yes, yes, So first, please
tell the listeners a little bit about your life, Dr Millhouse,
and how did you get into eurology? You know, yeah,
so I definitely think the profession chose me. I uh
was born in Nigeria, so I'm an immigrant. My family
is an immigrant family and raised predominantly in Texas, and Um,

(34:55):
from you know, early age new I wanted to help people,
wanted to be in health air and ultimately that met
medical school for me. UM. So, when I got to
medical school, one of my early medical school friends that
I met UM said he was going to become a urologist.
And I didn't actually know what the heck that was.

(35:18):
I kind of was like, okay, cool, I was like,
I don't know for sure. I think maybe germ or guiney.
And and then I you know, played it off like
I knew what he was saying. In reference to eurology,
and I went back home and looked it up. And
when I looked it up, I thought, oh, this is
like a male gynecologist. You know, they deal with men's
private areas, and it's kind of mostly men that go

(35:41):
into this field for men by men, and I crossed
that off my list. You know, I was like, Nope,
not something I think I would have any desire to
be to do. And I don't even think there's a
place for a woman, especially a black woman like me,
in this field. So that all changed when I was
given a lecture by a urologist and in walks a

(36:03):
black woman. And so here I was, um seeing this
specialist that I could see myself in and in the
specialty that I would have like picked the last thing
I picked or assumed for her to be. Just looking
at her as a doctor, Um, you don't think that
when you see the eurologists, it's going to be a woman,

(36:25):
and certainly a woman of color. And so I was
fascinated and totally intrigued and amazed, and I wanted to
learn more about this field that she chose, and in
doing that, I discovered a field that I just had
my name written all over it. That I really liked.
I felt at home. Um, there's a certain personality that

(36:45):
comes with urologist is obviously being very general, but you know,
by and large, eurologists tend to be you know, humorous.
We tend to not take ourselves so seriously. We tend
to be very jovial and you know, enjoy talking to people.
We have to talk to people about a lot of
sensitive things and so we uh, it lends ourselves to that.

(37:07):
And so I enjoyed the company of neurologists that I
was shadowing, and I you know, I would not have
become your favorite neurologist, which is what I like to
talk call myself online. Um, had it not been for
that encounter. You know, it's so interesting because it sounds
like there was a lot of peace around the decision,

(37:29):
which is how you knew, you know, kind of this
was the right fit for you, Like you know, you're
engaged with this woman of color who just made such
a large impact. But it also was just seems like
it was just an easy fit, which is how you
know you're like kind of walking in your purpose. And
so I love that. I love that. And it's funny
too because on Grey's Anatomy. They have a black women neurologist,

(37:50):
Dr Fox. Dr Katherine Fox, drained by Debbie Allen. And so, um,
it's interesting because you're right, I don't know very many
women neurologists, let alone black women urologists. Um. And she definitely,
for sure was probably the first one that I've seen
depicted on television. Um, kind of in that regard. And
so it is just, uh, you know, it's interesting to

(38:13):
to see that you are definitely definitely flourishing. So I
have to ask, because I always ask all of my guests. UM,
and I've had guests come on here never having watched
a single episode until they until right before the show.
So what is your relationship with Gray's Anatomy? You know, like,
were you a fan from the beginning? Did you just
pick it up for this show? You know? Um? And

(38:35):
and when was the first episode that you watched? And
how did that make you feel? So? I like it
was the first time I watched the whole episode from
start to finish, was right before this show. So three,
this desire episode of a season three episodes when one
is the only fool lead. Uh, the Gray's Anatomy episode

(38:55):
that I have watched personally, I don't really like watching
medical shows as a as a physician. I just it's
I'm like the opposite of the spectrum. I'm like, that's
the last thing I want to see like entertaining me
on TV. I want to see something else that has
nothing to do with like people working in a hospital

(39:17):
or following physicians or whatever. Um, even if it's in
like a dramatic way as it is presented. Uh, and
Gray's Anatomy. So this is the first time. That's so funny.
But you know, you're not the first person to tell
me that. I mean, some people are like, please give
me a legal drama, or like, please give me reality TV, Like,
please give me something else that's me reality TV if

(39:40):
it's reality TV. Yes, But you know, Gray's Anatomies is
so successful and so popular that I knew about like
some of the references I knew. I totally knew about
the black woman urologists on Gray's Anatomy, which I thought
was so cool. That that's that's one thing about the
show is like it delivers a diverse representation what it
means to be surgeons, and I absolutely freaking love that.

(40:04):
You know, Um, so I knew about and I certainly
know about Mick dreaming and you know, Meredith all the mix,
all of the mix come through Seattle Grace. But this
makes it interesting for me. So just generally, how did
you feel about the episode overall? And maybe not from
a scientific or medical perspective, you know, taking off that lens,
but as a first time viewer, you know, I think

(40:27):
it's a little too much going on. I liked the show,
I think it's a little bit too much happening, Like
there's too many relationships stuff happening. It was really hard
for me as the first time viewer. It was hard
to follow. And maybe because I'm plopping in at the
middle of season three, right, yeah, man, episode of season three. Yeah,
so like I was like, okay, who's with who? And

(40:50):
you know you I kind of started to understand, oh,
they're they're married, but they cheated, okay, and then she
wants him, but she's with him, okay. But then they're
like there's a lot of people dating each other in
this hospital. Like it much. That was my initial impression,
like there's just a lot of people dating one another. Um,

(41:11):
But overall, I think it's it's well done. I think
we'll get into like how realistic some of the scientific stuff.
I think in the spectrum of like medical dramas that
it's you know, not again not wearing my urology lens,
because I saw a lot of things that I'm like,
this doesn't make any sense, but it's reasonably like realistic

(41:31):
to medicine. Okay, reasonably for somebody who's you know, just
looking on the surface, it's reasonably realistic to medicine. And um,
you know, you get to see some of that, like training,
what it means to be training to become a surgeon.
So that's kind of interesting for to have that on
a show for the public. Yeah, it's true. You know,

(41:52):
it's very weird that we see kind of the interns perspective,
you know, that we see the residents perspective. Yes, I
mean truly, it's her show. And when she starts, that's
where she starts, and then she rises through the ranks
to become an attending um and then she like owns
the hospital and and now she's not even there anymore.
I mean, like truly, so like beings escalated, she's done
groundbreaking medicine, but you get to see it from her

(42:14):
perspective from start to finish, which is something that doesn't
really happen, you know, kind of very often on these
television depictions of these shows. So U in this case specifically,
like I mentioned, Larry board member in the Amazon for
two weeks with his girlfriend while his wife is back home. UM,
and he asked for discretion from Richard Webber, not because
of the affair obviously, but because of the nature of

(42:37):
his case. So he only wants to talk to Richard
because one he wants him to stay on board, but
too he really trusts him with his medical care. He
thinks Richard is the best physician for the job in
the hospital. UM. Naturally word gets out right. Every other
attending wants to take Richard's job as chief, and so
they're mostly concerned like who is this you know, kind

(42:58):
of v I P top secret pay ship here because
they're worried about their careers less about patient care. UM.
And Larry's just like, I really only want to talk
to Richard mostly because he's who I would trust with
my life. And this is very sensitive. So like you
mentioned before, you know, having working in neurology, you have
to have very tough and interesting conversations with patients all

(43:20):
the time, you know, he has a swollen penis or
swollen testicles, he has a swollen nether region um, and
he is very very much kind of concerned with what's
happening down there, and he doesn't want a lot of
people don't know. So can you talk a little bit
about instances like this when people have your logical issues
where they really don't know where to start kind of

(43:42):
what some of the emotional impacts are for those patients
and how you navigate that in your career. So going
back to your question like sensitive, like the the emotional
impact of your logic issues. I mean, obviously this is
you know, the private part area that other regions, you know,
bodily personal bodily functions occur. Repee for men, they ejaculate,

(44:08):
you know, for for both women and men. Like it's
it's intimate with our genitalia and our orogenous zones, and
so anything that happens in this region is going to
be more you know, sensitive nature. If you will, then
let's say my arm or my eye or you know,
my elbow or something, you know what I'm saying, my toe, um,

(44:31):
you know, talking about it will be a little more
understandably embarrassing and as eurologists, you already know like patients
rarely come full on direct and say my penis is
blase blase or you know, my yourred throat or this,

(44:52):
and that. They kind of kind of tippy toe around
it because they're nervous and ashamed, maybe quite embarrassed about
what's happening to their body. A lot of times they
have no control over what has happened to their body.
Sometimes they feel like maybe they did something to cause this,
and there are too embarrassed to say what they did.

(45:12):
And certainly sometimes it involves us asking about their sexual
life and practices, which is deeply personal and so it
is quite emotional when things go wrong, especially in this area,
what the impact it has. So it's really important to
be sensitive to this, to not as the physician, as

(45:32):
the care person, to not make that person feel more shame,
more guilt, more nervous than they already are. Part of
my job is to be able to create an environment
where patients nerves and calm down, that where they feel safe,
creating a safe, no non judgmental environment. I kind of

(45:53):
like to say, this is a no judgment zone. Please.
There's hardly anything that I can imagine you're gonna say
that is gonna make me make me feel like, oh,
you know, I feel uncomfortable. You know, Um, if you're
just talking about what's happening to your body, Um, there's not.
So that's really important. And a part of with this episode,

(46:13):
which that kind of we didn't see, is that happening
between Richard and Larry or with Larry and everybody else
who was involved in his care And that's part and
partial because this is a TV show, and part of
the humor that comes with the show is this whole
thing that's happened to him in the first place, which
is kind of like, you know, humorous, you know when

(46:36):
you think about it. But then, um, you know, just
the fact that everybody wants to see what's happening to
to you know, what's happening down there. In real life,
we would have approached him with a lot more tact
and sensitivity. Yeah, I mean, you know, I think they
definitely leaved in this episode to the physical comedic portions
because great as a drama, but like they definitely have
a lot of comedy, especially in the early years. Um,

(46:57):
season three is kind of one of those years. But
for sure there would have been much more care and honestly,
Richard wouldn't have allowed any of them to burst in
the room, you know, like that would have never happened
to begin with. If this is his patient, this his patient. Correct,
And meanwhile all of them just kind of staring, and
then Addison saying, well, I definitely cannot help you with
this issue because you are not a woman and this

(47:20):
is not my expertise. There would have been no reason
at all for Addison to even have wanted to be
involved at all with this, Like she wouldn't even first
of all, Addison, and that her specialty wouldn't even be
involved in this part of like nowhere near it at all,
which is why she was like, oh, I need to leave.

(47:40):
I mean, naturally they didn't know who the VP patient was,
but once they got out, you know, it was kind
of like, all right, we need we need to go
somewhere else because this is not for us. So interestingly enough,
I am really intrigued that they picked this to be
kind of the focal case, because there's always in Gray's anatomy,
there are always parallels between you know, the medical case

(48:02):
at hand and the central character in their relationships, and
so in this instance, the parallels with the storyline are
between Larry and and his you know affear with his
assistant and Izzy and George, right because you know they're
on the case and um, both are kind of navigating
how to manage their affairs. And Larry's kind of enlarged

(48:24):
penis or testicles as they found out, because at first
we truly don't know. The camera obviously does not show that,
but yeah, when we have, they don't really say, they
don't come out completely. I think it's most likely it's
his testicles that are so scrolled on that swollen. Because
they talk about the testicular ultrasound and they talk about
some other things that make me think that's the that's
where they're headed. So right, So, because they don't like

(48:46):
outwardly say it, we don't see it, but we know
something is there. Larry is supposed to represent kind of
the honestly, the physical representation of cheating, Like that sounds wild,
but in this episode that's what it is. He's kind
of he goes on this journey to the Amazon and
because he's having an affair, you know, like I think
Meredith even says in this episode like this is almost

(49:06):
like his penance, which you know is wild because also
Meredith had an affair with Derek and everyone's like, girl,
what are you talking about? But sure, um and yes, yes,
and and to be fair, everyone has affairs with everyone
on this show, like it is not truly happening NonStop.
So it's also like really no one can talk about this,

(49:26):
and like no one. But it's interesting because you know,
I found a few cases, you know, just kind of
highlighting the kangaroo. But it's interesting because for the most part,
this fish is almost like an urban legend in the Amazon,
like they know that the fish exists, but in terms
of its interactions with the human bodies, there are a

(49:48):
lot of quote unquote reports around it. And so the
only case I was able to find was twenty five
years ago in and this case was reported by a
man in Brazil of having a candaroo in his urethra.
So the patient reported urethro bleeding, um, difficulty passing urine
fever for three days, you know, kind of after suffering

(50:09):
this attack. And so this the the only thing that
was really kind of confirmed scientifically was a systoscope that
showed the fish launched in the anterior urethra, and even uh,
that that fish had to be removed indoscopically. So even
that is still twenty five years you know, um, prior
to now, which is wild that there have been no

(50:31):
more reported cases. Um. And the simple fact that I
believe it was the early like eighteen thirties almost when
you know, we first kind of started hearing about this,
where the urban legends and the myths around the candaroo
started to come to fruition. So you know, they were
saying that candora are known to attack various body parts

(50:52):
um to get the blood. And you know, I was
reading a report that said that, you know, someone reported
that you know, they've seen kandaroo and women's vaginas, and
that they've also seen um, you know, candaroo in rectums
and anal rectums. So uh, and most recently that the
candaroo have been shown kind of biting humans on their
backs in order to get that blood supply. So my

(51:15):
question to you is, you know, apart from the case
which literally is the only one that has some physical
evidence around actually having been occurring, why is this so
intriguing to people? I mean, why would this be. It's
it's a fish. Fish are living their life, They're doing
what they're doing Why would this kind of urban legend
in mid scenario exists from the eighteen hundreds up until

(51:39):
now for this fish, Like, I just think it's wild that,
you know, it's been twenty five years since the only
case was reported, So I think again, like the idea
that there's this animal, there's this you know, biological thing
that has an affinities for human attacks or or human

(51:59):
body a part in this case, assuming the urethra is
fascinating to us. It's fascinating whether you're a scientist, a physician,
or just a you know, lay person. You know, it's
coming out of the Amazon and that's a fascinating area.
There's species we probably have not have not discovered there.
So I think it lends itself to like, oh this,

(52:21):
you know, this could be it. A lot of the
UM reports are second third hand reports, and we know
how that goes to get, you know, sensationalizing. The credibility
is really really if he like, did this really go
in the wrecked um? Is it? You know? Um? I
think even with the well, it seems like there's actual evidence.

(52:43):
There's a physician who has systems, has it on video
systoscopically removing it. The report is from the patient that
it occurred, is that the fish literally jumped out of
water and like jumped in his urethra. And that just
doesn't seem plausible, you know, very child and we you know,
the part of the urban legend is like, oh they

(53:04):
have an affinity too for urine, and that has not
been proven. I personally think it's much more plausible that
people are sticking things in them that on purpose. We
I mean, we see that to this day. That is
a known thing. I mean, you talk to any urologist
or general surgeon. Yeah, have you heard of a patient
sticking something foreign in their urethrow or the rectum or

(53:27):
their vagina. Oh yeah, we all know we've heard of
a case or have had the case ourselves. So personally me,
I think, what is happening. This fish is trying to
mind their own business, all right, and they don't really
care to attack us, But we provoked them, or we
go after these in these cases like they've gone after

(53:48):
them in a way that has led to maybe you know,
this candaroo fish landing in this guy's your w or
these attacks on the back. That's kind of where I'm at.
I think that there's just too much too many scientific
details that don't add up that this thing has a
particular affinity for a male urethra just because it's there.

(54:10):
Now wait wait wait wait wait, we have to back up.
You've had patience that sticks something in their urethra. If
there's a hole, people will put something in it. Oh
my gosh, I just kids put stuff in their nose. Um. Yes,
people stick all sorts of things that will try to
stick all sorts of things in their rrethra. Marty grab beads.

(54:32):
I've seen. I've heard of like the charging chords. I've
heard of like the ends of a toothbrush or the
end of a fork. Um. I've heard of pen pencils
and pens and insert pen inserts. Um oh yes, And
I mean in the anus. It's even more like a
free for all, um of what people will stick in

(54:55):
their anus. So I hopefully that would make more sense
to me. But the ure throw like, oh my goodness,
there's a hole in the body, people will try to
stick something in it. Wow. Wow. Yeah, Because when you
were saying, you know, it's much more plausible that you
know these individuals are sticking something up there and the
fishes that's not supposed to go and the fishes kind

(55:16):
of I don't want to say along for the ride,
but for a lack of a better fresh So they're
here on this journey for a lack of a race. Yea,
that's what I was about to say. I was about
to say, you know, they're kind of here against their will,
and uh, look at what's happening now, Oh my goodness,

(55:37):
I cannot imagine. Well that ships everything. I mean, like,
now you have to be thinking about this. This gentleman
in seven who who knows what he was doing in
the Amazon, you know before before that occurred. Now, my
mind's going to all different types of places for sure. Correct.
I'm just again as a urologist who've been on the
end of trying to you know, get things out of people,

(55:59):
like you know, it's just it's something about human behavior, curiosity.
There's potential for like deriving some sexual pleasure, you know,
a boredom, whatever. There's something about the human behavior and
experimenting for whatever reason or or thing that they're trying
to get out of it that they stick things in

(56:20):
holes in their body. Wow. Okay, well you touched on
this briefly, but let's get into it. Did you find
this episode to be a realistic depiction of this condition.
And I know that you said there are moments you
were like, this doesn't make sense. What are we talking about? Like,
what is that? What is happening in this ueroogy case
that we're seeing? So as a viewer and as a doctor,

(56:43):
as a physician, what would you have wanted to see
more of that may have elevated this particular case. Okay,
So one is he has this fish stuck in his
your rethrow, and let's forget about whether that's plausible or not.
Let's assume it is. First thing is he's like, I
haven't paid for three days. Okay, you're not going to

(57:06):
be laying there, haven't paid for three days and saying
this calmly. In fact, if you haven't paid for three days,
you're probably going to be an horrendous amount of pain,
if not completely sick. Um, you just cannot your bladder,
just cannot hold your ine for three days and not
release it without a lot of you know, pain and

(57:28):
other bad things happening. He just would not seem as
well appearing and talking and you know, arguing with his
doctors in that scenario. Um number two, they would immediately
put a catheter in him and drain his bladder. They
didn't attempt to do that. They didn't know anything about
a fish or whatever, and so there was that. We

(57:49):
should have seen them attempting to try to put a
catheter in him and then maybe been like, wow, it's
not going maybe something's blocking him. Let's get an x
ray and see what's going on. It was weird. He
comes with he can't pee and then he has this
in large scrolled um or penis, which are seemed like
two different things happening. Even if there's something large in

(58:11):
a man's uriitra and he can't pee, you wouldn't expect
to see swelling in the scroll um or the penis
because of that, you know what I'm saying. So something
there's like something else going on, you know, that's not
being explained by this fish and his urrethra. And then
they like just randomly get these tests. Oh let's get
an x ray, Oh let's get an oftras, and let's
get this. You know, some of the the X ray

(58:34):
at that time didn't make any sense. Now turns out
they get this. They choose the X ray because then
you can see this fish that's in on the X ray,
you know, and so uh then they go in and
they are trying to get this fish out through the urethra,
and you see them in the operating room again with
the camera. Unrealistic part is you've got all these different specialties, right,

(58:58):
all these different surgical specialty is in this very much
urology case. Like, there is no reason for a cardiothoracic
surgeon to be in this case. There's no reason for
and I guess Dr Larry he's like the chief of
the whole surgery department. Like, so Dr Webber, that's Richard, Yeah,
he's the chief of Yeah, but you also have Derek

(59:20):
there because the neurosurgeon, which you're like, why is he here?
Why is he there? Why is he there? All the
chief of the whole surgeon department. He's not a urologist.
He shouldn't even be in the case. Even though the patient,
the happy patient might have been like I only trust you,
but he would have been like, Okay, well, yeah, you
can only trust me, but this is a urology case.
Let me get my neurologist that I trust. You know

(59:40):
what I'm saying like that, you know the people who
are doing the procedure. I don't think any one of
them are neurologist. I don't even know if the guy
that was helping dr is neurologist. So no, there's no
neurologist actually doing this, and that's completely like not a
thing to be in this. And so then they try
to get it through the ure throat. They can't, and
so then they make an incision in his belly. So

(01:00:04):
the urethra and the bladder are different approaches. If the
thing is stuck in his urithra and you can't get
it through the cystoscope or through the camera in his
in his urithro, then you would cut in the perineum,
which is the part of the body that is between
on a man, it's underneath the scrotum and the anus
that taint area. You wouldn't be cutting in the man's belly.

(01:00:25):
You would be having his legs up wayne way high
in the air like he's in childbirth position or methotomy,
and you would be cutting right under his his scrotum.
And that's how you would get to the urethra if
that's where the fish is stuck. But the fish suddenly
becomes stuck in the eure thro but then they go
into the bladder and they pull it out through the
urethro through the bladder, which is like not possible. If

(01:00:47):
that would be not really possible unless the majority of
the fish was partially hanging into the bladder and partially
in the urethra. I don't know. There's just a lot
of different maneuvers going on. Some of the instruments that
they showed like how it was and this has been
very particular, so I don't as a urologist, right, I

(01:01:08):
think only eurologist would catch this, But some of the
instruments that they were using, I was like, that's not
even like the right instrument there, um. So, But yeah,
the the the thing I would have liked them to
have done more is like more of like getting us
to there's something stuck in as your rethrow, um besides
just oh let's get a random X right. Oh there

(01:01:29):
it is. You know what I'm saying. That would have
been more and less of everybody in the operating that
doesn't you're like many people in here who are not eurologists.
What do your thoractic surgeon being in the world was
like absolutely did not make any sense. And then he's
he's doing like the job of the anesthesiologist almost and
I'm just like, what are you doing? This is not,

(01:01:50):
this is not But you know, they finally got there.
But you're right, they took a lot of twists and
turns that would not happen if you know, this man
presented into you know, an e er now absolutely not
as soon as he said, I have impeded one day, right, okay,
get a catheter in him, stat superstat you know. Um.

(01:02:13):
So I was thinking he is quite rude. Maybe it's
because he hasn't irrinated and you know, like he he
was so upset and he was very rude. So I
was thinking, maybe it's because he just is in so
much pain from the fact that he has not urinated
in three days that he cannot control himself. But he
did have you know, enough energy in there to yell
at Richard, that is for sure. Yeah, if you haven't

(01:02:35):
feed in three days, you don't have that energy, you know.
So for you, Dr Melhouse, tell me kind of what
is the future of urology. What do you want to
see in the future, and how do you see yourself
contributing in that way? We eurology is at you know,
is a great field in surgery. It's one of the
fields and surgery that really tends to be at the

(01:02:57):
forefront of like surgical advancement UM innovation. So we'll continue
to do that, We'll continue to see new newer ways
to approach surgery and neurology, you know, being a part
of the forefront of that UM. You know, the thing
about eurology is it's still one of the least diverse
fields in medicine. It is still largely male predominated. It

(01:03:20):
is racially homogeneous UM and lacks diversity. And so you know,
for instance, there's two percent black eurologists. There's probably less
than one percent black women eurologists. Women in neurology make
about eight to nine percent. We are seeing some changes
very slowly as we look at trainees, so the residents

(01:03:43):
getting into eurologists, there are definitely a better percentage of
of women being represented. We still have a ways to
go with representation as far as underrepresented minorities, and we
are working towards that. We are that's for the you know,
doctor facing side of things. On the patient face inside

(01:04:03):
of things. There are health care disparities within our field,
chiefly the prostate cancer health care disparity that has a
proportional burden on African American or Black patients. We are
with COVID, I think um highlighting how great our health
care disparities are everywhere. We are putting renewed strength and

(01:04:27):
energy into closing that gap, and so that's exciting for
the future. And I think also what's exciting is that,
you know, the public is getting more acquainted with eurology.
Urology used to be this specialty that again, like you
really barely knew. You thought it was just for old men.
And I like to say all the time, is urologies

(01:04:47):
for everyone? If you make urine urologies for everyone. And
I think people the patients are seeing that, oh, like,
it's not just for men, it's not just for old
it's not you know, I'm there, you know, your logic
issues are being talked about in a way that is
humanizing and de stigmatizing. So yeah, I think that's important

(01:05:10):
because there are so many sigmas around a lot of
different issues that we have with our bodies, which has
always been wild to me, just because if you're a
human being, you have a body. If you have a body,
it's capable of doing almost anything. So like we need
to just kind of dismantle all of these stigmas because
anything is possible in this remarkable vessel. And you know,

(01:05:31):
I always say it is the most kind of unique
thing I've ever seen, the human body, but it is
also the most fragile and like things can go left
very quickly, and you know, we just we all need help.
I mean, they're always there. There's always something in the
human body that we need help for, regardless of who
you are. That is for sure correct. And we don't

(01:05:53):
oftentimes have direct control, you know, and so the whole
shaming some buddy, you know, or whatever, feeling guilt you know,
over what happens to our body, our bodies. Obviously there
are lifestyle things that we can improve upon and that
sort of stuff, but largely things happen, you know, things
happen so and they're doing a lot of work. You know,

(01:06:15):
we gotta give these bodies some grace because it is
not easy to maintain day in and day out. For sure,
it's remarkable that well, to be fair, yes, so you
know we have to do it. Well. Thank you so
much for joining the show. I had a great time.
I love getting first timers because the perspectives are so

(01:06:35):
great and I love that you work it all down
like this is not we would not do this, you know,
like this is about patient, So I appreciate that. But
before we get out of here, is there anything else
that you'd like to share about your work and or
your social media platform with the listeners. Yeah? First of all,
thank you, Kabe. I've enjoyed myself. It's fun talking about this.
I enjoyed watching the episode. And there's other urology episodes

(01:06:59):
on this raising anatomy, I know. So if you ever
need a neurologist to comment, I'm your I'm your girl. Um.
This was fun. And as far as my work my platform,
I am very visible on social media. I am on
Instagram at Dr Millhouse with one L M I L
h O U s E. Literally, if you just search
your favorite eurologists on Instagram, on TikTok or on YouTube,

(01:07:23):
you'll find my channels and my platform. I like to
make eurology accessible and learning about it for everyone. I
do use humor, but I am a big proponent of
like destigmatizing things, and I am starting my own practice.

(01:07:43):
That is the biggest news in my life right now.
I'm in Chicago, and so I'm excited to open up
a practice that is serving patients in a way that
I have a full control over and I cannot wait
to share that with the world. Oh I love that. Well, congratulations,

(01:08:03):
I love that you are you going to be able
to service you know, the patient population that you want
to uh and help them the most. So congratulations and
all of this success. And yes, of course you're welcome
back on en Call with Kab at any time because
this was so fun. So thank you so much. Thank you.
Have a good one. Well that's it for this episode

(01:08:29):
of On Call with Kab. Join us each and every
Thursday for brand new episodes where I chat with an
expert and a super fan about the science behind the scenes.
Until then, listen to On Call with KB on the
I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get
your podcasts.