Meghan Trainor ON: Breaking Generational Trauma & How to Be Confident From the Inside Out

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
All day long. Your body is saying fire alarm, fire alarm, fireflight, run,
And I was like, mmm, Like I was sitting with him,
in my back felt like it was on fire. I
was like, see, it's crazy, it's happening right now. It's
feel it. I think it's really hot. He's like, no,
your chemicals are so messed up that your body doesn't
know where you're supposed to be here adrenals are on fire.

(00:27):
Hey everyone, Welcome back to On Purpose, the number one
health podcast in the world. Thanks to each and every
single one of you who come back every week to listen, learn,
and grow. And I am so excited to be talking
to you today. I can't believe it. My new book,
Eight Rules of Love is out and I cannot wait
to share it with you. I am so so excited

(00:48):
for you to read this book, for you to listen
to this book. I read the audiobook. If you haven't
got it already, make sure you go to eight Rules
of Love dot com. It's dedicated to anyone who's trying
to find, keep, or let go of love. So if
you've got friends that are dating, broken up, or struggling
with love, make sure you grab this book and I'd

(01:09):
love to invite you to come and see me for
my global tour Love Rules. Go to Jay shettytour dot
com to learn more information about tickets, VIP experiences and more.
I can't wait to see you this year. Now, you
know that I love sitting down with people from different backgrounds,
different walks of life who are adding meaning, impact and
purpose into the world, that have an incredible presence and

(01:32):
use it to do so much good in the world.
And today's guest is someone who has been so kind
to me, so gracious to me online and offline. And
our first interaction was actually this January when I announced
me being the Chief Purpose Officer at Calm and we
did a series of lives and when this guest today
said yes, I was over the moon because I love

(01:54):
her energy. I followed her for a long long time,
admire her work, and for her to say yes was
dream come true. So today's guest is none other than
Megan Trainer. And Megan first made history in twenty fourteen
with her Diamonds certified hit single All About That Bass.
Since then, the award winning singer, songwriter and multi instrumentalist

(02:14):
has garnered a Grammy for Best new artist, achieved eight
multi platinum singles and two platinum albums, sold out three
world tours, penned multi platinum hits for peers across pop
and country, and received countless industry awards and nominations. Now
on top of all of that, last fall, we got
to watch Megan as the host of Top Share Family

(02:37):
Style on Peacock and as a judge on Clash of
the Cover Bands on e In September of twenty twenty one,
she also launched her podcast Working on It, which she
hosts alongside her brother Ryan. Megan has recently released her
new single bad for Me, which by the way, my
producer has been singing and listening to all week, featuring
Teddy Swims, along with the announcement of her fourth full

(03:00):
length album, Taking It Back, arriving October twenty first, twenty
twenty two, mark the date. Welcome Megan, Training Up, Megan,
thank you for being here. You're amazing. You're amazing. You
did all of that. You had to you had to
live it, you had to create it, you had to
write it. I mean it's incredible. Wow. Congratulation, Thank you.

(03:21):
I sound so cool. You are you say it? Yeah?
Even just your energy. Walking in today and I saw
you come out in the car and just your presence,
your energy, everything that you said. I was just like,
this is my kind of human, Like, this is the
kind of person that I want to be around. You
will adopt me. Okay, yeah, thank you. Thank you for
being here. Honestly, thanks for having me. I'm honored that

(03:41):
you are. You're like, Oprah, You're amazing what you do
for everyone in the world, and I'm honored and I'll
do whatever you tell me to do. So thank you.
Thanks for letting me be here. I'm humbled and touched
by that. I actually got to say that Oprah because
she I grew up watching her and so for me
when I finally got to interview her, her book was

(04:01):
coming out and we got to do the first interview,
is very exciting for me, and I said her afterwards.
I said, hey, Oprah, you know, I think I do
what I do because I grew up watching you, and
you showed me that you can make meaningful stuff really
powerful and it can be really mainstream. It doesn't have
to be in this little box over here. And what
she said to me is really special. She said that
Maya Angelou said to her that her best work will

(04:24):
not be the impact she makes, but the impact that
the people she impacts make. And I just thought that,
so anyway, I appreciate, but I'm passing it on to Oprah.
And but I want to dive into so many things
with you today because you just such an interesting, fascinating persona.
But the first thing I want to ask you is

(04:45):
you have a secret door in your home? I do.
I want to know all about it because because to me, yeah,
of course, because to me, secret doors like that's the
guy when you just showed me your garden too. And
I'm not going to give anything away, but those are
the kind of homes I get fascinated about because they're
the kind of homes you dreamed of as a kid. Yeah. Literally,
so tell me about this. I'm creating my dream house

(05:06):
for when I was a child. Yeah, that's what I'm
doing right now for my future four children. I have
one now, but he can barely walk, so we'll get there. Um.
But I have a secret door in my house. And
the house I bought is really cool. Not a lot
of houses in LA have addicts in basement, and I
have both in this house. And my husband we did
so much construction, and he was like, the only thing

(05:27):
I want. I'm like, oh, yes, what would you like?
Maybe he's like a secret door so it looks like
a bookshelf. And I was like, done, Absolutely, we're doing that.
Um And it's the best part of our tour. When
we give tours of our house, Everyone's like, what, um
an attic and that I'm turning into like the best
kids playground ever that I want to do like homeschooling

(05:49):
eventually in so Yeah, we got like slides up there
and that's incredible. I'm inviting myself over just right now. Yeah,
my house is going to be sick one day when
it's done. I love it. I'm very excited. I went
to home when I first moved to La I think
I was living here already, and it's the coolest house
I've ever been to. His name's Frank Learns, and he's

(06:12):
a speech writer for most of the presidents of the
United States and that's his career to write speeches teach
people communication. And we spoke at a conference together in
Singapore and his presentation was amazing, and somehow he liked
mine and so we became friends over it at the
end and we got connected and he lives in La
two and he was like, all right, when you back,
come over to my house. I was like, great, he's
in his mid fifties or something, and so I went

(06:35):
over for dinner at his house. And his house is
like a museum, Like he has the first shirt that
Nelson Mandela wore to the United States, and he has
like all of these incredible documents, like the invite that
JFK received before the assassination, like he has He's just
like these really amazing things. And we went into this
room and it had this It wasn't the Titanic, it
was another famous boat, like a structure of it, and

(06:58):
there was a little Winston Churchill in the corner. And
he asked me to stroke Winston Churchill's head. And that's
when things got really weird. And then I looked at
my phone. I had no data and no signal. I
was really scared. And so I saw the little Winston
Churchill and he goes, yeah, stroke his head three times,
and I was like, this is getting really weird. But okay,
I stroked Winston Churchill's head three times, and this trapdoor
open and it was so cool. And I'll say the

(07:21):
rest of it later, but anyway, my point being, I
love trapdoors. You also have you also have not trapdoors?
I love. I love dungeons. Dungeons. I'm from London. Dungeons
are a big thing in London. The London Dungeons is
a great attraction for anyone is wondering. But you also
have two toilets? Can you? Can you explain that too? Wow?

(07:41):
You really got to come over my house. Yeah, I'm
very fascinated by esthetic. Okay, So in our bedroom upstairs,
there's one bathroom and the other bedrooms are farther away,
and my husband and I get up all night long
with the baby. We used to. Now he sleeps, he's great,
but we used to get up all night long and

(08:01):
every time I had to pee, Darrel would have to
pee at the same time, and I'd be like, get oh,
there's my turn. And I remember in this new house,
we literally like built rooms from scratch, and they had
a bidet next to the bathroom and I was like,
we'll never use that, but there was an extra hole.
And then I saw the dream and I was like,
I have an extra toilet. And I was to the plumber.

(08:21):
I was like, can you pop both of these next
to each other, and he was like, what are you
talking about. I was like, just right there, right next
to each other, and he like laughed and thought I
was joking. I was like, get it done, and he did.
And it was the best decision ever. Like, if you're
really close to your husband, like my like we're tight,
we're close to the most. We like pee together and
it's the best bonding time ever. I don't know, we're

(08:44):
not nasty with it, but like it blew up and
the whole world was like, oh, and I have couple
friends that are they're older than Daryl and I are.
Were young. We got lucky we met each other like
twenty two, but they're like, you pee in the same
room as your has been. I'm like, oh, he'll chill
with me if I'm going number two, Like we hang out,

(09:05):
you know, like we don't do it at the same time. Yeah.
I loves well, thank you. We wanted to start. Now
everything goes deep, but no, I love it. Thank you
and thank you for learning us into your home. I've
been loving following you on TikTok for that real It's
just it's so nice getting to know someone and then
meeting someone in person and going, oh you're you're even
more wonderful. Investment is a great feeling. So but but

(09:29):
I want to go through parts of your journey that
that I thought it would be interesting to us and
you and just everything you talk about when it comes
to mental health and you talk about like toxic relationships,
and I just love your openness and vulnerability in a
way that I know my community and audience really needs
that insight. But I want to go all the way
back to Nantucket, which is where you grew up, right,

(09:50):
and then yea, yeah, like you know the feedback that
I always hear about it's the cutest town or you know,
it's like tell me about what it was like growing
up there for you, and you know what you dreamed
of at that time. The world was so small. Everything
was so small. The buildings are small. So when we
would go off island, which was like travel anywhere else,
we're like, oh, are you going off island? Like the

(10:12):
buildings were huge, and there's like traffic lights were used
to stop signs, so everywhere else felt huge. And I
still get scared when I go to New York. I'm like, well,
these buildings are way too tall. And like when we
park in a parking garage, I have full panic because
I'm like, oh, well, we're gonna be late. We have
to find a parking spot and get a ticket. It's
the whole thing. But Nantucket was great and growing up there,

(10:33):
though there's there's no mall, there's no place for kids
to hang out, so you start drinking and doing drugs
at like fourteen, wow, and like hooking up at a
very young age. And like, when I look back at
stuff that we did, I'm like, how is I not
murdered or kidnapped? Or like, how am I not a
full blown drug addict? A lot of my friends are,

(10:54):
and even my brother had problems with alcohol and drugs,
but he managed it so well that we were like,
you don't have a problem. You're just fun, you know.
And then recently he was like, okay, I need to
be sober. Wow. So it was it's like if you
made it off that rock, like you won, you survived.
So it was a crazy place to live. It's it's
so different when I grew up in London, which is

(11:15):
obviously this big city and you're always around big buildings,
And then I moved to New York and I've lived
in Mumbai and now I live in La So I've
always been moving from big city to big city. You
get that tough like you can handle it well, you
can handle the city, but there's there's also it takes
a lot more effort to feel grounded or to be
in nature or you know. That took a lot of training.
Took a lot of training for me to adapt to that.

(11:37):
And I also find that you know when you when
you're talking about I went to Montana recently, and that's
where when I was speaking to a lot of the
people that lived in the area, and a lot of
the kids there were saying they'd never left, and they
were saying that they all went to the same salon
on a Saturday evening, and they that one of them
went to Nyu for the summer, but then she moved

(11:58):
back and she'd like she'd never seen a Chipotle before,
she'd moved out of town. Stuff. And it's always interesting
to me because we grow up in such bubbles where
you think everyone thinks like you and everyone's living like you.
When was the first time that that bubble kind of
was burst or changed or switched. What was the experience
where you're like, oh wow, there's a whole world and
people who think differently. And um, I mean when my

(12:20):
parents started bringing me to songwriting conventions like songwriting competitions,
and I would travel, like my my brothers got a gift. Well,
it'd be a whole family thing. I have two brothers,
So for Christmas one year, they're like, we're going to
go to California and have Megan go to this songwriting
thing with ASCAP and the boys would get to go
to the zoo. You know, it would always be a

(12:41):
family thing, but they would make sure the boys got
to do something fun too. But I remember like traveling
with my family and seeing Hollywood and I was like
you but like I was like, oh, it's it's a
little different than the movies. But then I lived in
Nashville for a year by myself and that was my college.
I was nineteen and I was like a songwriter. I
would drive to work at noon and I'd write a

(13:03):
song and I'd come home by myself. And I did
that for a year and then wrote all about that
bass and got signed and like had to move to
la at nineteen. So a lot of my friends were
like in college and went home for the summer and
I was like, I didn't. I don't know. I feel
like I missed a lot of learning steps and relationships,
Like there's a whole friend group out there that I

(13:26):
would have had that I don't know them, you know,
because I just went to work. But I wouldn't have
it any other way. Like we did it. That's it, Yeah,
that's yeah. But there's there's definitely differences that I'm frustrated with,
Like I don't know how to do taxes. I don't
know how to do many things because at nineteen, all
of a sudden, there was a team that did it

(13:46):
for me. Yeah, and so when like I don't know,
there's simple tasks that I'm like, I can't I can't
imagine doing that that I feel. I'm working with my
therapist on I feel stupid. Sometimes I feel silly and
like and she's like, you're not stupid, like look around,
and I'm like, yeah, but there's simple things. I can't
figure out geography. I don't know where anything is. I

(14:08):
don't know. I want to I want to share something
with you. I promise you that most people who went
to college don't know how to do their taxes. Okay,
I know what, you know what the problem, I'll be
honest with me included and I went I went to
cast Business School, Like I don't know how to do
my own taxes because because and the reason I say
that is because you just never trained in the simple thing.

(14:28):
Like it's it's sad, but no one knows how to
get a mortgage or how to you know, how to
get taxes, Like you don't know these until you have
to do it. Yeah, and then when you have to
do it, you figure it out. Like for me, I
had to learn a whole new system when I moved
to the US, so just about when I figured it.
So I moved to the US when I was twenty eight,
and so at twenty eight, Yeah, there we go. Yeah,

(14:49):
you moved to when you were nineteen, so yeah, experience.
But yeah, no, I moved to the US six years
ago when I was twenty eight, and it was like
I just figured out how to do taxes in London
that I moved and had to figure it all out again.
And so I you know, I don't think you should
be so hard on yourself because because I'd be honest
with the and I don't think most people know how

(15:10):
to do the things you just mentioned. Yeah, yeah, everyone.
But when you look at that experience, when you talk
about going into songwriting competitions, Yeah, it's really interesting because
competition often turns people off art and it can often
be a challenger. It's like you're competing at something and
then often you lose taste for I remember I swam

(15:31):
a lot when I was in college and high school,
and I was a pretty good swimmer, and my parents
really wanted me to be a competitive swimmer, and I
hated the competitive side of swimming. I love competition and
other areas of my life, I just didn't enjoy it
in the water. For you, what was that experience like
of because that was even younger than nineteen, right, you
going to the competition with other kids, but it wasn't

(15:51):
even kids, it was adults. Oh wow. Like it ranged
from my age seventeen to like fifty five, where they're like,
I still want to be a songwriter and here's my chance,
and I would like always write on my CDs before
we played it. I'd be like I produced it myself,
like be easy on the production. And I was like
just a young girl, I don't know what I'm doing here,
And they would critique your songs in front of everyone,

(16:13):
so it wasn't like we were competing first songwriting and
if you won, you got signed. And my second year
I did it and I was like, Dad, I don't
want to go back, and he's like, your album's way better. Now,
let's go back. The second year I got signed and
everyone's like, Megan's the one that got picked this year,
and I was like, that's amazing. Do you remember any

(16:35):
feedback from the first year that like stage with me, Yeah,
my lyrics didn't make sense because they didn't um my
production was bad, but they saw potential. They're like it's
in there. You just gotta be better at like maybe
you shouldn't have said that here or this doesn't really
rhyme and blah blah blah, and I was like they
don't know anything. I'm like, Dad, they suck. But then
I went home and I wrote a whole new album

(16:56):
and sent it in and then it was like night
and day and they're like, wow, he took our notes
and you came back. So it was great and everyone
should do it. And it sucked and it was great,
but my parents would make fun of me because I'd
be like, oh, want to go, and they would drag me.
And then when I'd be like when I go, I'd
be like, that was the best thing ever I rock
and like, see, how do people get that courage though?

(17:18):
Because I feel that supportive parents, that was it. Really
My parents blew to me so much and I was bad,
Like I wasn't horrific, but I was bad. Like I
hear the songs now and I'm like, what were you
guys thinking? And my mom like nowadays, she's like she's
still trying to get those fifteen year old songs cut,
like they're sorry, not cut. A lot of people don't

(17:40):
know what that's what that means. When I say like
get a song cut, I mean another artist sing it.
So she's still trying to like sell those songs and
I'm like, mom, they're embarrassing, Like there's sometimes those songs
will get pitched and they'll get cut and she's like
I knew it, like I knew you were good back then,
and I'm like, wow, you really believed in me. And
my parents are those parents that are like every one
should go to college, and for me, they were like

(18:02):
go to work, like, go be a songwriter. This is
what you're good at You're gonna do this forever. How
do you think they noticed that? Like, what was it
in you? Because obviously, and that's wonderful to hear that,
but they obviously saw something yea, And they saw a habit,
a trait, a pattern, some work ethic. What did they see?
I think my worth ethic at a young age, Like

(18:22):
I wasn't getting all a's in school, but I'd get
like B minuses and season whatever. But I would come
home after school every single day and I would use
the production that my dad would get me at Christmas time.
I'd use my computer and I would be in garage
band to logic and I would write a song after
school every day and I'd play it for them by
dinner time. So in like four hours, I would write

(18:42):
and produce a whole song and be like check this out.
And it was me like loving what I'm doing. It
didn't feel like work, but it was also me showing
my parents like thank you for buying this for me,
and like I'm gonna make you proud of with us someday.
And my dad, my dad was like, this is a
credit card where I'm buying all your stuff on you
can pay them back later when you're successful songwriter, I'm like,

(19:04):
I bought you a house, so there you go. How
does it feel now that you're a mom? Like how
does that feel? How are you taking pots of those
gifts that your parents gave you to him on? And
like my parents were and are the best, Like my mom,
she would be here today, but like, yeah, I know what.

(19:24):
We're trying to be nice with COVID and like keep
like we're always like take one person and yeah, but she, uh,
she's my assistant, full blown now, like, uh, what is
that light? It's the best. It's a great I'm lucky
and I have a cool mom. A lot of people
don't like their mom's but my mom is my best friend,
my husband's best friend. They're the same person. I think
I married my mom. Wow, And they like can finish

(19:48):
each other's sentences. It's crazy love. But she's really yeah,
it's a they she's my full assistant because when I
had like assistance, I've only had two. One was my
best friend and then the second one became a best friend.
And it's I's just like it gets uncomfortable. It's like
I don't want to ask you to go get my
grosser rays. But my mom's like, I'm getting grossries. You
want to get something for you? I'm like, yes, please,

(20:10):
Like she's doing it anyways. You know, my mom was
always my assistant forever, but she's not She's just a
loving mom. Yeah, but it's the greatest. And I think
having the supportive family is the only reason why I'm here.
I mean, I know it is. Yeah, that's why I
keep him close. And how do you try and do
that in your own way? Now? Like, how are you
doing that few kids? Apart from building them amazing? My

(20:31):
kid sees his uncle's every day because they live in
my house, So I'm he's surrounded by family all the time,
and I think that's a part of his speech delay.
Is like like literally, they're like, it's he the only
baby here. I'm like, it's all adults and we all
give him whatever he wants immediately. They're like, so, let's
wait till he asks, and then you may give him

(20:54):
his snack. I'm like that, Yeah, it's a matter of
too much love. But I also want to give him
three siblings immediately. Yes, So you're working on that, working
on that. I think December, I'm gonna try to get
knocked up. I love. Yeah. I feel like for so
many people, family is their contention point, right, Like that's

(21:15):
where they experienced toxicity. It's where they experience generational negative
patterns and trauma. Whereas you have this beautiful setup and
you're working on it. Obviously it's not just like that.
What do you think your parents or your family has
done right over time to maintain that? When you just
said that, you're your kids surrounded by uncles and like,

(21:35):
that's so beautiful when it works, and then there's so
many people who what is it that differently or what
have you observed? I'm intrigued because I think that could
be huge for people. I'm breaking a lot of uh,
generational trauma and generational patterns which I've learned with my therapist.

(21:56):
Up we were shout out my therapists, Um my new song.
I said. My therapist told me to write you would
Letta and she's like, you put what Yeah, I wrote
about it. But as I've learned about like why I
am who I am, it makes sense through my parents,
like no one's perfect in my family. We look great,
but there is some darkness, there's some clouds, and I've

(22:18):
just trying my very best to break all of that.
And my mom is so good at adjusting and learning
and seeing like, oh we can change. We're not like
this forever. Like my mom's side of the family, they
never talk about what's bothering them. We call it. Her
last name was Jakanowski, so we call it the Jakanowski secrets.

(22:38):
And they never bring up how they really feel. And
I'm like, we're not going to Jakanowski's secret this, We're
gonna talk right about it. Here's how you make me feel.
And that has my mother has changed significantly. The only
category where she's still slacking is the self talk, self love,
bad bad, which is where I got it from. And
she knows. She's like I'm sorry, I'm ti, I'm tired,

(23:00):
Like she won't take a picture, like she'll say the
camera will break. I'm like, well, that's so aggressive, Like
she's so mean, her hard on herself and I And
she's a part of that generation too that like refuses
to get therapy and my dad I told them recently,
I was like, you would both benefit very well if
you had therapy, and they were like, I know what's

(23:20):
wrong with me. I don't need to talk about it,
and I'm like, oh my god, you're so lost. Like
so I'm trying to slowly get them into therapy. And
and I've noticed my brothers now they're all close to
their thirties, they have all woken up and seen like, oh,
we have alcohol abuse in our family. I should be sober.
And that's what my brother has done. And he's like

(23:40):
an amazing human. Now he was great before, but he
was poisoned, you know. And then even my younger brother,
like he's just there. They've grown up so much. And
I think it's by watching me change my ways and
change the patterns of the family and break those bad
habits that we can all nails. We're doing some work.

(24:02):
It's exhaustion with someone's going to do it because I
will not have my kids have these bad patterns. Yeah
you know what I mean. Those are some other ones
now because yeah, yeah no, But that's I love hearing that,
and it's it's wonderful to understand that everyone is needing
help from an individual if you want to change an

(24:22):
area of your life. Like I just feel like one
of the things I'm certain about is that if I'm
serious about something, I better be accountable to someone else
in that area of my life, whether that's a therapist,
a coach, or personal trainer or whatever it may be. Yeah,
And I think if your privilege enough and accessible enough
to have that help in your life, it can make
a huge difference. But knowing that your parents aren't doing

(24:45):
it yet yet they are using the language my mom's yeah, yeah,
she's much better. Yeah, she's using the language. My dad's
twenty years older than my mom. Well, so yeah, he's
like seventy four and she's fifty four, so she's like
full young hip kids like this out that. I'm like,
oh no, Bunny's sweet and great. I love that. In

(25:06):
the beginning of your journey in music today, we know
that a lot of your relationships inspire you just said that.
You know, your therapist told you to write a letter
and said, like you you hear the toxic or poor
relationships you've been in that have inspired music. What was
different about what inspired you back then and what inspires
you now? Like do you do you ever think about that?
Like what inspired your songwriting then and now? Well, back then,

(25:31):
I was a songwriter writing for other artists, so I
was thinking, like what's not on the radio and what
could be on the radio. But I when I wrote
all about that bass, it was like a joke. Like
it was like I was like, no one's going to
cut this. We've wasted a day at work and we'll
just write a therapy song for us, like because the
co writer was like a man, and it was the

(25:53):
first time meeting him, so it's kind of like a
blind day and you're like, where'd you grow up? Power?
And then we were we were like we were chubby
kids and we had to learn how to love ourselves.
And I was like, how funny it would it be?
That was like I ain't, no says too, but I
can't shake it, shake it. And I'm like, I'm not
a confident dancer that dances in front of everyone, but
imagine if I was. And I remember being like, I'll

(26:15):
sing the demo who cares? And it was like a
raw demo with no auto tune and nothing, but the
lyrics hit so many people that they're like, this is
gonna be huge. Who's singing it? We'll just let her
do it. So it was really from like a weird,
raw place, like I wasn't chasing radio. I wasn't and
I fell into that before when you're talking about competition,

(26:36):
I didn't know about charts and all that stuff. When
they're like you're number one, I was like fantastic, Like
what is that? Like? Number one everywhere? They're like everywhere?
I was like, well that was easy. So then anytime
I did another song, I was like, it's not number
one everywhere? What do you mean? And then I was like, well,
maybe I'm not doing what's on the radio. And then
I caught myself chasing radio and just falling on my face.

(26:58):
So with this new im taking it back. I was like,
I'm gonna go back to when I did do op
and just didn't care about any charts and anything and
just do me. Yeah, and you'll hear that come out.
And the first song they put out was a emo
toxic relationship song. I was like, oh, okay, coming out passionate. Yeah,
And so it sounds like it's always been a roy
emotion that that's going out, and now you're taking it

(27:20):
back and you're going back to that and you're really
owning that, like with this with this new album, would
you say that we're hearing you through the healing process?
Are we hearing you healed? Are we hearing you. I
think you're you're hearing, You're hearing a healed what's your mother? Who?
Um is just ruthlessly honest. You know, Like one song

(27:42):
don't I Make It Look Easy? That I tease today
on my Instagram, UM is like talking about don't I
make this Look easy? Like everything's perfect because everyone who
interviews me it is like you are so fun and
you have the best family, in the best life. And
I'm like, I cry so much. You just don't know
it because I don't film myself and post it, you know.
So I say in the first verse, like I posted
a picture, I read all the comments, I hearted the

(28:03):
good ones, and if I'm being honest, I probably spent
an hour on it. Yeah, and then I'm like foo,
And it's just like a fun way of being ruthlessly honest,
ruthlessly that brutally honest. Yeah. Yeah, what's your take on that?
What you just said? If like, there's a lot of
people who will say, oh, well, if we're not taking

(28:24):
pictures of ourselves crying, in our videos of usselves crying
and posting it, we're only posting the highlight reel, Like
we hear this all the time. Yeah, what's your personal
take on what's showing up authentically means to you. Ah,
I just noticed when I do talk about my fun
private personal stuff like my bathrooms goes viral. People love it.
People are like, wow, she's goofy. I'm like mmma, and

(28:45):
it's always a good reaction, which feels great. Yeah. Like
I use that as my therapy of like, oh, the
world likes me for just who I am, so I'm
just gonna do that. And the more I did that,
like literally, the more popular I got or the more
people wanted to talk to me, the more I just like,
That's why I did the podcast, because we talk about
per iv it stuff that I'm like, normalize it, like
I have hard poops, you know, like, and it's just

(29:08):
it makes I think it's more relatable and people are like,
I have that problem too. That's in the first place
I saw that was my mental health. When I saw
Carson Daily on the Today Show explain a full panic attack.
My mom didn't understand what was happening to me. My
best friend, she couldn't understand. She couldn't help me when
I said, I need to go to the emergency room
because I can't breathe and she was like, just come here,

(29:29):
I'll rub your head. I'm like, you don't get me
right now. I sent her that article and she was
sobbing and was like I finally get it because I
couldn't put it into words. And when Carson did it,
I was like, you don't know what you did for
my whole family. Oh yeah, every time, save my life.
You saved my family relationship. Yeah, because I resented them
for that. I was like, how do you not understand

(29:52):
what I'm going through? You're my mother, Like you're my
favorite human being on this earth. Like and and now
she still cries about it. She's like I didn't were
you going there? And then she'll look back at her
life and go, oh, I had a panic attack that day.
I thought I was just having a meltdown, but my
heart was stopping that day, like I thought I was
going to die. And I was like, yeah, we're riddled
with anxiety and you guys weren't allowed to talk about it,

(30:13):
but we are. Yeah, here we are help. I'm like
the biggest fan of screaming for help. Yeah, absolutely, like
something's wrong, somebody helped me. What was your worst experience
the panic that you remember so strongly, where you didn't
feel anyone was there to help and you were screaming
out for it. I was in New York City. My
first like big real panic attack was four AM. It's

(30:35):
one of those like never forget four Am. I was
in glam getting ready to announce the Grammy nominees for
the year after I won. It's like a thing you
do when you win, you go announce them. And it
was going to be live with Gail King and my assistant,
who's my best day still is. She was reading me
my schedule for that week and it was like sing here,

(30:56):
performed there after all my vocal issues were happening, and
I'm just like, if I do that, this will my
voice will die and none of you will make money,
you know, like we're all going down. So I was
reading this calendar and I was like, but how would
I if I go from there to There's no way
I'm going to make that. And then I started getting light.
I get a little tingly. Every time I talk about it.

(31:18):
You start dissociating, like you start leaving your body like
a ghost and like breathing. You start thinking about it
and full panic comes in and I started crying because
I was like, I think I'm dying and I was like,
what's going on? And I just had to scream, cry
and breathe and my husband, who was my boyfriend at
the time, and my assistant looked at me and said,

(31:39):
this is a panic attack. And I almost wish they
never said that, because I was like, what this is?
What that is? Because I didn't know. I didn't really
know what people were saying, like how they felt. You
don't know until it's happening, and then when it ended,
they were telling me what's this? I was like a lamp,
a TV, a rug and that like snaps you back
into your body. And once I calmed down, they were like,

(32:03):
I was like, can that happen whenever? And they were like,
m I wish I didn't say that either. Ye screwed
me for the rest of the day because I was
exhausted and I went on live TV and I haven't
watched that clip since, but I remember I blacked out
on the TV and was just on autopilot and I
was like, don't pass out, don't pass out, don't die, like,
don't have a freak out Live on TV with Gail King,

(32:26):
And as soon as they were like done. I sat
down on a chair and I lost it. And all
the people on the Gail King show saw me and
they looked at me like I was a crazy person,
and they're like, a she okay. And my team looked
at me and they're like, we need to stop. I
was supposed to go do like eight more interviews, a
whole day work, and they just said stop. I went
back to the hotel room and I literally would run

(32:48):
to the bathroom thinking I would have diarrhea. I was like, no, guys,
it's cool. I just have the flu, and they were
like and I would explain it to people like it
was like the movies, like when a demon takes over
my body and I had no control anymore. And when
a doctor tells you it's your own brain, You're like, well,
then I'm going to be in a psychord like this
every day because I can't control that I don't know

(33:10):
how to. And then also I overdosed on edibles, which
like you can't really do, but I did it. I
usually would take I was self medicating myself with five
milligrams a weed with edibles at night, and it really
helped in the beginning, and it would help me sleep.
And one day I ran out of the specific edibles
that I took and I ate like a lollipop that

(33:32):
was twenty five milligrams. Then I was so high that
I forgot I ate that and I ate another one,
and I usually take five. Right, I was up to
fifty day fifty milligrams in one day. I was doing
a puzzle and I was like, I'm not breathing like
so I'd tell people my soul left my body and
I said bye bye, and I was dry heaving all night,
and that is very similar to what you feel in

(33:55):
a panic attack. So going to those places twice, my
brain was like, we've been there, and we could take
you there wherever, whenever we want. And so I was
really unbalanced. My chemicals were off for a long time,
months trying to figure out like some days would be horrific,
couldn't get up, and I was madly in love. My

(34:16):
career was great. I would tell doctors like, I'm not depressed.
I didn't feel depressed. I just sometimes if I like
sometimes I'll just feel like I have a migraine for
the rest of the day. I'd have ice packs on
my head. I'd have my mom check my temperature and
was like, no, I just have a flu. Again. It
says crazy. And then I finally went to a psychiatrist
and he explained to me, your chemicals are like this,

(34:38):
and all day long, your body is saying fire alarm,
fire alarm, firefly run And I was like mmm. Like
I was sitting with him, in my back felt like
it was on fire. I was like, see, it's crazy,
it's happening right now. It's feel it. I think it's
really hot. He's like, no, your chemicals are so messed
up that your body doesn't know where you're supposed to
be here adrenals are on fire. So I went on

(35:01):
my first ever antidepressants and I used to get complimented
like wow, you're the only pop star not on antidepressants.
And I used to be like, well look at me.
And now I'm like, that's messed up that they said
that to me, and like it made me judge people
and it was horrible. And now when I was on
when I was finally on the medication, I'm on like

(35:23):
the lowest dose and after a month or two, I
was like it's quiet, Like everything stopped and it was amazing,
and I like would talk to my psychiatrist. I like,
I only had one panic attack this month and it
slowly went down. And it's been like five years now
and I haven't had a terrible one since. I'll have

(35:45):
nights if I'm over exhausted or am I'll say, my
body's trying to trick me right now and trying to
pretend I'm in a panic attack, and I know what
you're doing. You can't basket with me right now. And
my husband knows too, He knows the drill like it
saved my life and I don't know what I would
do without those pills. And I'm sorry I'm blabbing, but
I carry on. When I was pregnant and I told

(36:07):
people I want to get pregnant, so my doctor, I um,
they were saying this pill is safe that you're on,
but this low dose of atavan's not safe. Get off
of that. So I did get off of that. And
when I walked into my doctor appointment pregnant, like day
one pregnant, as I brought my medicine, was like, this
saved my life. And he was like, oh, you could
throw those candies away and I was like what, Like

(36:31):
I didn't know what to say I was so scared
and I was like, it was COVID time, so I
couldn't hide. Then my husband I was like what And
I was in shock. And I stayed with that doctor
for like weeks and just got worse, and I cried
to everyone of like he just wants me to throw
them away, but they saved my life. And my other
doctor said it's totally safe to be on these, So

(36:51):
I don't know what to do. And I eventually changed
doctors and she was I had a woman doctor, and
she was like, that's insane that he said that to you.
These are perfectly safe to be on. Your fine, and
a happy mom is a happy baby. And I've been
trying to tell every pregnant mom or anyone who's going
to have a baby and on antidepressants, like you can

(37:11):
safely stay on them and nothing bad will happen to
your baby. And I never had any postpartum I didn't
have any depression all pregnant, and my pregnancy was obnoxious.
I had justational tabetes, but we did it. We crushed
it with a good diet, diet well pregnant. I was like, what, yeah,
but like it's still like the stigma's in some of

(37:34):
the doctors and it's like, and my baby came out
c section because he was sideways and my baby was
in the Nikkeu for five days, and all those nurses said,
were you on antidepressants? And I'm I just got soft open.
I'm on drugs like trying to heal. I feel horrible.
I don't get to see my prize that I went

(37:54):
through all that more. And I'm in there trying to
look at him in the NIKEU tank and they're like, well,
it's because you're antidepressants. That's why he won't wake up.
I'm like what. And I asked all my doctors and
they're all like, dude, there's no science that backs at
They're just pointing so they don't get sued. They're just saying, well,
it's because you're onepressants and that's why. And it was

(38:15):
the most discouraging thing. And I'm writing a book about
it because it was. It messed me up. And I
still talk to my doctor my psychiatrists recently because I'm
trying to get lower on my antidepressants in case I
want another baby. Even though there's no science that backs
that that can hurt that baby happen my doctor's like,
I got the charts later because doctor Aymon's like, what, like,

(38:38):
show me, show me how they proved that. And all
the charts said was like, he's sleepy, he's not waking up.
It wakes up on his own time. But it was
a C section, that's it is traumatic for a baby
come out. Anything could happen, and it wrote mom twenty
seven on antidepressants doesn't And I was like, you know,
it's the worst thing you could tell a person who

(38:59):
just had a C section. It was like, it's your
fault that this kid's not awake. Wow, but I can't
wait to have three more kids. But yeah, thank you
for sharing that. You weren't bloving at all. It was
actually really no, not at all. Honestly, it was so
thank you for taking us there because I think, yeah,
it's very easy to closs over some of the detail,
but actually to hear the details what allows us to

(39:21):
really empathize in the best way possible. But also just
to recognize how much stigma there is. Even hearing the
statement where you were saying that, oh, you're the only
music artist that's not on these Yeah, and now it's like, oh,
these are going to no one in my family is
on them. They should be, Yeah, they could be. I
have like plenty of people in my family that I'm like, oh, bipolar, undiagnosed,

(39:44):
like for facts, and like sometimes they know it and
they use booze to help it, and I'm like, there's
better ways. I take my pill and a half at
night every night and I feel great and I don't
have to chug a bottle of booze or eat edibles.
Like there's a way, that a safer way that you
could do this. So yeah, those pills helped me about

(40:05):
my whole family that they come from place it's like,
you need medicine, yeah, make you feel better. I'm like,
uh huh. And the best is when like a doctor
said to me, well, you have asthma, right, and I
was like m, He's like you have an inhaler. I
was like, M, It's like, why can't you have medicine
for your brain totally? Period? What do you think it
was for you that drew you in that direction of

(40:26):
wanting to change your habits, because, like we see with
so many musicians, with so many artists as well, it's
so easy to go down the other road and like
you're saying, it's not about looking down on those people,
it's just they didn't have a family, but they didn't
have the support. But what was it for you, because obviously,
like you're saying that, the majority of a family may
not really understand why you need medicine, but you've met

(40:47):
a psychiatrist, You've been very proactive here. Yeah, what made
you so convinced that you had to make this change
and that you wanted to find this way out because
it's so easy and natural for you to turn towards alcohol.
Was for sure spooked, and I knew something was wrong,
Like I knew my chemicals were off, but I didn't
know my chemicals are off. I was like, my body's broken,

(41:08):
my brain is broken, and I need help. And I
was scared. I was scared. I've saw me in a
psych ward forever for the rest of my life. And
I was like, well, I don't want that. I want children,
I want a family, I want a career, I want
to keep going. Like finally all my dreams scared true
and this is happening. No way I'm going to fight this.
So I wanted to fight it. But also it really
really helped me, which is another reason why I talk

(41:30):
about all my stuff in case it helps someone is
people like Carson, but also my older brother Ryan. He
used booze and drugs for his anxiety, and he's had
huge panic attacks that he never told us about. Like
he lived in our in our house, and in his room.
He would he told me, oh my god, I would

(41:51):
I was pretty sure I was having a heart attack,
thinking it was the drugs, but it would be like
a hangover. Convinced, and he would call it scary Sundays,
And I was like, this whole time, you just crazy
panic disorder. But you've been like smothering yourself with booze
and drugs flying through it. He's like, yeah, stuff it down,
eat some drugs, you'll be fine. Like drink your medicine.
That's what do you say. I'm gonna drink my mess

(42:12):
and I'm gonna go to bed. Like he has sleeparalysis,
he has the most His brain's way worse than mine was.
So when I would have my panic attacks, I would
go to everyone in the house. He lives in my house,
and I'd be like, something's wrong, and he go, I've
been there, I know what you're feeling. Go to the
emergency room. Asked for the lowest dose of medicine that
you can get. Do not let them give you xanex

(42:32):
and then come home and you're gonna be fine. And
having him like my older soldier brother that could get
through anything, look at me and be like, I've done this,
You're okay. Instead of my mom being like, what are
you talking about. You don't need a hospital, he'd be like,
go go to the hospital, they'll tell you're fine, they'll
give you oxygen, you'll come home, you'll be great. And

(42:53):
having that like acceptance but also not be alone feeling
was like he saved me. Wow. And that's why I
do this podcast with him, because he's he's now trying
to be sober. And in our first episodes of the podcast,
he like you can see him freaking out and he's like,
I don't get to have my medicine and I and

(43:13):
he did it cold turkey. He didn't go to any
AA and nothing, no no therapy, no help. He did
it by himself, which is so dangerous. Don't ever do that.
Now we're hearing like he could have had a heart
attack in his sleep. I'm like, oh my god, Like yeah,
he he's I would tell him I'm like, you're you're
on extra time, bar you're on borrow time. I guy,
But he's my hero, very looking forward to me. Now

(43:36):
you're gonna love him him. Yeah. Wow, what an incredible
story and to have you both go through that. And
we we've had like amazing guests like doctor Drew on
our podcast and he loves like he's so funny. He
loves celebrity rehab. So he loved Doctor Drew. So when
doctor I've been like, mine, you gotta go to therapy.
Have demons in here, like, let's go treat them this trauma.

(43:56):
He was like, no, you're obnoxious. I'll never do therapy.
Doctor Drew him on our podcast and was like, brains
heal brains. You need another brain to heal you. Yeah.
He was like, you're absolutely right, went to trauma, went
to trauma therapy that week. I was like, so, whatever
you tell him, he'll be like, yes, sir, I will
do that. So you're gonna have to write me a
little list. Yeah, but it is true. We all need

(44:20):
to hear it from different voices, different faces, different brains.
Can't be a little sister. But but now you're doing
that for everyone who's listening. And watching us, like, I
can't imagine everyone who just heard what you just shed
and everyone's watching this, It's like there's no one who
could have heard that note be transformed, like genuinely hope,

(44:40):
because like what Carson did for me is what I'm
just trying to do for anyone out there, beautiful, because
there's still parents out there that are like mine, that
are uneducated and don't know, and they're raising babies like
me who didn't know and had that stigma forever. Yeah,
and I look at my family and I'm like, oh, man,
like my grandparents would really needed this, you know, like

(45:01):
there is there's real crazy trauma back then in my family. Yeah,
And that just goes down the line. Yeah, And I
feel you only saw it on the public figures, So
I just what's the Elvis movie that just came out?
And then obviously Bohemian Rhapsody about Freddie Mercury few years
ago that came out. And you start studying the stories
of all these incredible icons and artists and you see

(45:22):
alcohol and you see drugs, you know, and you see
that go to a bitter end, you know, and it's
it's painful when your heroes and your inspirations go that way,
but now when you see them go the other way,
it's it's so didn't It's so cool though that now
it's like the rock stars that were like our heroes,
but they died of an overdose. We're like, oh, we

(45:42):
can't do that Nowaday's like health is in right now.
I hope, So I hope. I know. I want to
make it more in even body type. So it's like
it is hot. I'm like, I want to work tot
be hot, you know, been healthy, not like and strong. Yeah,
i want to be strong. I want muscles. I see
muscles and my thighs now and I'm like, oh my god,
I'm so hot, Like what do you think that got

(46:05):
you to that place of your And it's so interesting
how so much of it is chemical. And I've been
thinking about that a lot lately that I know so
many people who get into a negative rhetoric in their
head where it's like I'm the worst, I'm that, and
there's spirals and they think there's something wrong like mentally
or psychologically, and there are changes they're needed, but so
much of it is chemical, Like I had I've spoken

(46:28):
about this a few times. It sounds so average, but
when I heard it from my doctors and my teams,
it fascinated me. So I went recently, I was not
Probably in the last twelve months twenty four months, I
was feeling more tired. And there's plenty of reasons for that.
We were renting a house during No No, no, there's that,
But we were renting a home during COVID. During the daytime,

(46:48):
it was beautiful, and at nighttime it didn't feel so beautiful,
and it was like there were animals in the floorboards
and animals in the walls and like so you could
hear scratching at night and like steps and like it.
It was hard to sleep. And we just rented it
during COVID to have a bit more space, and so
I was dying to move out, and hence we got
this place and moved. But during that time, I don't

(47:09):
think my sleep quality was good. And I always sleep
eight hours a night. I'm very I don't negotiate with
my sleep. I sleep ten pm to six am, very
important to me. But at that time, even though I
was in bed for that long, I wasn't getting good
quality sleep. Yeah, and so I was feeling exhausted. So
I started checking with my doctor and they said, you're
vitamin D levels I were at a ten. Healthy is
one hundred and average is sixty. And my doctor said

(47:32):
to me, and my nutrition is to my health team
that I have, they said to me, they said, Jay,
we don't know how you're not depressed. And I was like,
I'm not depressed at all. I'm absolutely fine and like
with your chemicals in your body show completely And I
was like that's fascinating to me. That sure, because of
my meditation and mindfulness, I was able to not be
but you could be depressed just because you don't have
enough vitamin D in your body, Like it can be

(47:53):
as simple as that. Well, I got a dietitian who
transform my life to help me healthily lose sixty pounds,
which was like one pound a week of changing my lifestyle.
But food is poison, you know, like bad foods. I
just saw TikTok where this guy was like I had
anger issues and I was mean and I was in

(48:15):
high school and even though I was like a smart kid,
I remember I ate like the burger and the cafeteria
food every day and no matter how smart I was,
I was like, I'm gonna go fight today because I
was angry, and when I started eating healthy, I was
less angry. Like, yeah, I have a cousin who has
really anger issues, but I also know he eats fast

(48:37):
food because it's like food's expensive and they can't go
to whole foods like me all the time. And so
and there's three of the three kids, so Mom's trying
to feed all of them. But I know that that
food is just feeding his anger and his you know.
So it's super sad watching that knowing like, oh my god,
the rest of the world, you know. Yeah, yeah, I

(48:57):
mean that's a challenge, right, It's how can we make
food affordable, accessible, healthy, taste my dietitians She's like, don't
even get me started on like the food in cafeterias
though for kids. For children, it's like, how do you
expect them to work all day? And like I have energy? Yeah,
Like I would come I remember now when I would
come home from school nap every day. Bro, I'd nap.

(49:19):
My mom be like it's dinner, wake up. I'm like, okay,
no wonder. I was like she'll bey and depressed and
sad like yeah, and it's hard again because it's all
habits yeah. I was saying recently to someone like our
biggest crisis is a crisis of habits. Yea. Our life
is defined by habits. Yeah, and we've just adopted a
ton of bad habits mentally, physically, emotionally, and now we

(49:40):
keep repeating though. That's what growing up is breaking. All
these dietitians like you have to am my therapist. It's
like you have to rewire your whole brain. Yes, everything
you knew it's wrong. And I'm like, oh my god.
And even poor mom, like she was even trying to
help us, like we were that family. We're all chubby,

(50:00):
and my mom was like, we're gonna do wait watcher snacks.
But like back then, like it's still crap, Like it's
still like what are you eating? And she tried, she
tried to get all the low calorie orange juice, and
we're like, it's the orange juice is the issue. But
they tried. They're uneducated, they don't know. So my mom

(50:21):
was just doing her very best. But when I look back,
I'm like, oh my god, I was eating boys in. Yeah,
chocolate products a day, like I see chocolates every day,
chocolate bar, chocolate yogurt, and a chocolate ice cream every
single day you've had, yes, And it was amazing. It
was amazing. It was like you know Boys and Girls Club. No,

(50:43):
it's like a place where kids can go after school. Okay,
we have it on Nantucket and we had our little
snack thing we had. I had cheese. It's Reeese's blue powerade.
Every day. Oh my god, horrific. Yea, after school, I
go eat that and then play. Yeah, and that's where
and the ages. My wife had to powerfully train me

(51:03):
out of my addiction to chocolate. And I know that
sounds so like, no, I need to do that. I
was literally addicted to sugar. He's addicted to sugar. I
was addicted to sugar and my wife had to completely
train me out of it. And it's been an amazing
journey for me because it sounds like a sugar who cares.
It's like sugars non get really bad. But yeah, it's
like sugar is like the one that everyone gets away with. Yeah,
like people like when someone gets sober from alcohol and drugs.

(51:25):
We're like my brother, he's like, I'm love sugar. I'm
like careful, but depending on sugar for so many years
and it took ages to get off of it, and
even now I found I'm now at the other side,
which is really beautiful, where now even when my mind
still tricks me into wanting really unhealthy food, when I
have it, I actually don't enjoy it. Oh and you
get sick, yes, yeah, I notice anytime I cheat now

(51:46):
I get ill. And I'm like, like when you drink
a bunch of booze and you're like again, it's like that,
and I'm like, oh, this is poison. I forgot. Yeah,
and you have to remember that. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,
tell me about you're you're in such a and you've
spoken about this into you already. You're in a healthy
relationship now, you know, and you have been for a
long period of time obviously with Darryl with food, and yeah,

(52:10):
I got lucky, and I'm so grateful I got to
me Daryld today because it's always funny and yeah, it's amazing.
How did you know that that was how you were
meant to be treated? Because I think so many people
get into a pattern of accepting a certain level of treating. Yeah.
I always I figured like because of like relationships I've
seen in my family, and like she'll deal with it
and I'll just train him to be better. And when

(52:33):
I met Darryl, he still to this day like opens
every door, drives me wherever I need to go because
he knows I'm scared to drive, takes care of me.
No one's ever taken care of me like that except
my parents, and he says, I'll take care of you
so to this day. And that's when I was like,
oh my god, I want to only be with you
for the rest of my life. I want to be

(52:54):
one hundred and five and die next to you while
holding your hand. And it's taught me how to care
for someone and and love them like that. But yeah,
it was like the chivalry, whatever it's called it. It
was the kindness and the simple things of opening doors
and making sure I was okay. And he came on
tour day eleven. After day six when we said I

(53:16):
love you. Day eleven, I was like, I have to
do a tour now, would you like to come with me?
And he was like, well, I got nothing else to do.
And he stayed on my bus and did the whole
tour with me, and after every show he caught me
off stage. He would carry me to the little golf
cart and he would help me take my wig off
and he massaged my feet. Like month one meeting this person,

(53:38):
and I was like, you're gonna take care of me forever.
And he went through me when I had vocal surgery,
Like four months of dating, I had vocal surgery. I
couldn't talk, I couldn't say I love you back. I
was mute for months and he still loved me. The
way he treated me through my pregnancy was insane, just
like and it makes me like as much as I
tell the world like hey be a mentall to ask

(54:00):
for help, I also want to say, hey, don't set off,
you know, because there's a guy out there that will
rub your nasty feet after a two hour show and
will worship the ground you walk on. They exist, and
I know it's hard in La to find him, but
I found him, and if I can find him, you
can find them, you know, Like they are real and
it's the people you want to procreate with. But he

(54:21):
never saw himself as a father because his father left
their family when he was one years old. So he
was like, I'm gonna be a dad. I don't know
what dad is. He saw me and was like I
want babies with you, like I want to procrate. I
want to make more of us, and I was like,
we should make more of us. It's like that's I
think that's when they're like, you know when you know
that whole thing is like, oh, I want forever and

(54:44):
I want more abuse. I want to make more abuse. Yeah,
I figured out where did you get to a point
where it was like it sounds like you were in
you early as using your body as a way of validation. Yeah,
like when or where are you now at in terms
of validating yourself? Like where are you looking for your
validation from now? Where is it coming from? At this point,

(55:07):
I'm still super hard on my body, Like I've lost
all this weight and I still feel exactly the same.
I'm still like, ah, I can't wear shorts or I
can't wear sleeveless things, and my husband catches me and
it's like you've been so mean to yourself. Look how
gorgeous you are. And it's a thing you have to work.
I have to reprogram my brain to be like, no,

(55:28):
I look good today. And the only thing that I
saw actually make a difference, which I truth lishally don't
do is because I gotta do it more because it's
so hard. My therapist told me, stand in the mirror
naked for five minutes, put a time around, and just
look at yourself. Day one, I was literally shaking because
I was like, like, it was already tough for me
to love my body. But after the C section scar

(55:50):
with all the stretch marks, my family's like smothered in
stretch marks, like it's genetics. So I'm gonna get it.
Got it. So the stretch marks go up, the C
section goes across. Now I'm on myself like a lawnmower
ran over me, like I've been hacked and so and
there's no fix in that. So I was like staring
at that, like oh and all that trauma that comes

(56:10):
with it. But after and I was just looking at
the clock like please be done. But day three, when
I did it, I was like, you know what, her
thighs are cute? You know. I started complimenting her, and
I was like, oh, I see my brain changing already,
And if I did it more, I'd probably be better
at it. But like our bathroom, we have a giant
mirror in it. So when I when I get naked
every day, I see it and I think that helps

(56:32):
my mom like avoids mirrors and avoids she doesn't want
to like have my my father be anywhere near the
shower when she's in it. I'm like, oh my god,
I used to shower with dary Are Like what, Like
she's very hot, And I think that's what keeps her insecurity.
Is stuck there. You know, you have to like literally
get naked and start looking at yourself because like this

(56:54):
is our shell, you know, this is our our body,
this is it is what we got, so like let's
treat it well. Yeah, And I think that's the idea
that if we can't look in the mirror and say
I'm happy with what I see today, yeah, it's really
hard to think tomorrow you're gonna wake up and say
I feel really happy with what I see tomorrow. In
a sense of even if you've changed, whether you lose

(57:14):
weight or gain weight, whatever you're trying to do, if
you're not happy with where you are now, it's never
going to feel different. On the other side, it's like
because that's just a repetitive pattern. Yeah, when people are like,
how are you so confident in love yourself, I'm like, oh,
I'm working on it every day. Yeah, exactly. I wrote
a song called working on It, which is why our
podcast is that, because it's about when you go to
compliment and you're like you like befole, You're like shut up, you,

(57:37):
I'm disgusting. It's like, whoa, I'm gonna work on not
doing that and go thank you. Yeah, and like try
to believe what they're saying. You're not saying it, They're
not lying, you know. Yeah. When I was a monk,
we got trained beautifully and how to receive compliments. It
was like a big podcast thing. Ever, Yeah, and it was,
but it was taught to us so wonderfully. The first
thing was always to receive from the other person. So

(58:00):
what you just said like thanking the other person, because
what you're doing is you're rewarding them from noticing something good.
So you get an opportunity to say, wow, like they're
noticing something good. Whether it's in me or not, it
doesn't matter for now. For now, it's just we should
really acknowledge someone who decided to compliment you versus criticize you.
The second step. The second step was, now that you've

(58:21):
done that, think about who gave you that quality, Think
about how you learned it, Did you get it from
your parents, did you get it from your teachers? Who
was it in your life that gave you that gift?
And now you get to turn that compliment into gratitude
and you get to thank that person. So internally, when
you when you receive a thank you, not only do
you get to receive it, you now get to thank
someone else and pass that gratitude on. And it's just

(58:44):
this beautiful process of compliments to gratitude, which we know
are great for the brain. And it's all good. And
so yeah, I love that you brought that up. It's
really special. I love it. This has been even more
than I expected. Yes, this has been thank you. I
knew it's gonna be fun, but it's like we've done
this beautiful thing where like we've gone really deep and
then you're just hilarious and then and then adorable and

(59:07):
then really deep and then hilarious, and I'm like, you've
been playing with my emotions that in the most beautiful way.
We end every episode of On Purpose with a final five.
So this is the rapid fire to answer in one
word to one sentence maximum. I'm so bad at that. Okay,
we'll probably go off piece because you're so interesting that

(59:27):
I'm gonna be like, oh, tell me more so yeah, yeah, anyway,
we'll start, all right. Question number one, what is the
number one thing you're working on in your relationship? And
what's the number one thing Daryl's working on? Understanding his feelings?
That sounds good. The boy can feel. He's got a
lot of feelings. And I'm like doctor Phil Tammy, perception
is reality. So even though it seems like he's being irrational, yeah,

(59:51):
because he is. I have to realize, like, oh, he's
in that moment right now, and I have to take
care of him as if that's real and then pull
him out of it. I always do. I love that,
And what's he trying to do for you? That's like
the toughest part for us because I'm so I'm sorry,
I'm using so many words, but I'm so Massachusetts, like

(01:00:12):
sack up, bro, Like I'm raised by brothers, Like why
are you so emotional? Why are you crying? And he's like, oh,
you know, so he's trying to communicate better, yea, his
feelings to me and trying to Yeah, I guess ask him.

(01:00:32):
He'll tell you to ask him. It's that it's the
very I'm cold and he's soft. Ye, but it works, man,
it works. Question number two, what is your daily routine
for your anxiety today? My husband transcendental meditations every day.
That's not how I say, but twenty minutes morning and night.
I do that sometimes, especially when I need it. Today,

(01:00:58):
I'm gonna, oh I therapy today at four pm. We
love and I'm gonna try to work out. I love that.
That's beautiful. There's nice and simple. Yeah, easy, all right.
Question number three, what's the best advice you've ever received?
Life will get better if you let it from my father? Nice?
Question number four, what's the worst advice you've ever received?
I mean, this isn't the worst advice. I can't think

(01:01:19):
of anything. But you know what we got a lot
of when we were getting married and when we were
having babies. We would ask older couples like, that's the
worst thing to do. We're like, how do you have
a marriage so long? And the men would say son,
surrender or just like keep your head down, and I
was like, oh, well, don't do that. And then having
babies they'd be like, wow, your life's over now and

(01:01:40):
now it's theirs and I'm like, that's not in my life.
It's just begun. Yeah, so we hated that advice definitely.
That's I'm glad you shared that. It can be really
it can be so literally opposite. Yeah, it's it can
be really really detrimental. Yeah. Yeah, I remember that when
I when I left the monastery and I decided to
start doing what I do today, and I was was
my biggest fear internally was that I wouldn't be able

(01:02:02):
to serve in the way I wanted to serve. And
everyone's just like, oh, now you can't. You're gonna get
a real job, You're gonna get married, like said, You're
not gonna serve the world anymore. And I was just like,
you know, now I look back and I'm like, I'm
so glad I didn't accept that. Yeah. And same with
when I got married. Everyone was like, oh, you're gonna
have less time to do impact in the work in
the world, and I was like, you're gonna have a
partner now to help you with it exactly. Yeah. No,
I'm glad you raised that all right. Fifteen final question,

(01:02:23):
If you could create one law that everyone in the
world had to follow, what would it be You cannot
bully online. No, I actually like that's a great law. Yeah,
we've never had a comments. We've never had a va
imagine it was all positive comments. Oh yeah, my Instagram's
pretty positive. But I'm like, this is great. When they're like,

(01:02:44):
do you read comments, I'm like yeah, because they're nice sometimes,
Like I need that a little commentables everyone, Megan Trainer.
The new album is arriving October twenty first, twenty twenty two.
Very very pumped to get to know you better, to
deepen our relationship, deep enough friendships, meditate, um and just yeah,
genuinely so so in awe of the journey you've been on,

(01:03:08):
the steps you've taken, and how you're passing that on
to everyone else. It's really powerful. So thank you so
much for doing that. Thanks love it

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Jay Shetty

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