October 10, 2023 • 49 mins
Rosie's guest this week is Amy Nelson.
In 2020, while the entire world suffered the catastrophe of Covid, the Nelson family was under an even bigger added attack. Amazon accused her husband of several unfounded crimes and felonies, and used the DOJ and FBI hoping to get him to plead guilty anyway. FBI agents knocking on their door with guns drawn; their bank accounts emptied by the DOJ; their employees subpoenaed; threats of family members also being arrested; and still to this day, not one single charge has been filed against him. Why? And what is Amazon's end game as this nightmare of injustice and exorbitant cost to the Nelson family still goes on? In an eye opening, absolutely alarming conversation, listen to Amy's utterly herculean effort to keep her family safe and whole, fighting against Amazon by sharing her story wherever it can be heard.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:09):
Hey, everybody, it is me Rosie O'donald Starr the Flintstones.
How are you? You made it here to onward my podcast?
How's it going by you in your life? Things good?
We're at a really exciting time in the fifth grade,
month two. My kid is having some adjustment issues in
(00:34):
the classroom, but you know, we're working with the school.
I really really love the school that they're attending and
the help that you get with your kid. They're doing good,
They're doing good. Today is a big day for both
Dakota and I. We're today getting to meet an actual
(00:56):
guide dog for an autistic child, Guide Dogs of America,
which is a wonderful and free organization. The adoption process
is pretty intense, the application process to get the dog,
and of course they have so many more applications than dogs,
but one of the final stages of your application is
(01:18):
they bring the guide dog to your house and see
how your child does with the concept in general. So
that's today and that should be very exciting and the
guide dog from America. People were asking me if there
was a preference for color of the dog, and I
(01:39):
was like, I don't think so, you know, And I
asked Dakota when I got home, and they said they'll
know the right one for me. I don't care if
it's brown or black or beige. After you get approved,
you have to go to a ten day session learning
all the commands. And then when that's done. As soon
(02:01):
as that's done, I'm going to jump in the car
and pick up some friends and we're going to see Pink. Yes,
you know, Pink man. Let's get this party started. She
was so young. She was on my TV show. You know,
I used to have a TV show on television, And
Dakota said to me one day, was it back in
black and white? No, but it kind of feels like it.
(02:27):
But she was on Pink and she was only twenty two,
and she was on a bunch of times. And I
just think she's so authentic, she's so artistic, she's so beautiful.
She's such a great family person, and I admire her
and how she runs her life and the arc that
she makes and she's just fantastic. So I'm going to
(02:50):
report back on Pink next week. And what else can
we say? You know, Donald Trump broke the gag order
with a racist whiney v The Wow Wow Wa posts
on his truth social which is not truthful at all.
How is he allowed to break the law? How is
he allowed to break the gag order and not go
(03:13):
right directly to jail? Do not pass, go, do not
collect two hundred dollars. That's what I'd like to know.
We're supposed to show that no one is above the law,
and that includes him. So he's broken the gag order
many times. Let's put him in jail. That's what I think.
Maybe controversial, but that's what I feel honestly, that we
(03:36):
have to show the consequences of his action to everyone
in the nation so the nation can heal and understand
what we have been dealing with for the last eight years.
All Right, we have a wonderful, wonderful show today. Amy
Nelson is my guest, and you probably don't know who
she is. Well, she's a wonderful woman on TikTok and
(03:58):
I've been following her for a while now, over a year,
maybe almost two years. She is here to tell you
what happened to her family to avoid losing money from
breaking a contract. Amazon not only made up unfounded charges
against Amy's husband, but Amazon got the Department of Justice
(04:23):
and the FBI involved in this matter, and you're not
gonna believe what happened to Amy and her family, and
it is still happening. It's still happening. She can explain
what happened better than I can. So take a listen
to me having a conversation with my friend and kick
(04:46):
ass woman, Amy Nelson. Hey, everybody, please welcome my guest today,
Amy Nelson. Amy. I can't even tell you how much
(05:07):
I admire you.
Speaker 2 (05:09):
Oh, thank you, Rosie. That means a lot.
Speaker 1 (05:11):
Now, listen, I met you on TikTok. I was going
through and I was hearing the story about your family
and the pictures, and every day there were, you know,
such specific detailed versions of what happened to you, like
so that it was like a movie coming to life
(05:31):
in my head. Like you know, I almost see it
as like, Oh, I can't wait till I get to
the part where you know, they get to sue Amazon.
Speaker 2 (05:39):
I would like to fix that part too, right.
Speaker 1 (05:43):
Well, tell, let's start at the very beginning. Your husband
worked for Amazon, or he worked for somebody who had
a contract with Amazon. Explain exactly what he did.
Speaker 3 (05:53):
So, my husband worked at Amazon Web Services, which is
part of Amazon and Amazon Web services build data centers,
which is where the Internet lives. And I think we
all think of the Internet as being in the cloud,
but it's actually in these big warehouses that are all
over the world. And my husband worked there for eight years,
had really an incredible experience in a pressure cooker. But
(06:14):
he worked on the real estate side, and so he
helped Amazon buy land to build data centers or lease
data centers. And then he left in twenty nineteen and
went out on his own. He had set up the
business while he was still at Amazon, which is allowed
by Amazon's employment contract.
Speaker 2 (06:31):
And when he left, he started working with that company.
Speaker 3 (06:34):
And about ten months after he left, the FBI and
knocked on our door at six forty five in the morning.
Speaker 1 (06:41):
Now before that point was he aware in any capacity
that they were even after him, or that they thought
he had done something or they were going to a
que et new He knew nothing. He was off in
his new job. Yeah, And knock, knock, knock, Yeah.
Speaker 2 (06:56):
He was off on his new job.
Speaker 3 (06:57):
And you know, my husband had hired a lot lawyer
when he set up his new company to review everything
and make sure everything was on the up and up.
And he was working with his lawyer all the time,
and so he really had no idea that this could happen.
And in fact, the day that the FBI showed up
at our house, my husband had his attorney call Amazon
(07:18):
and say, hey, I'd love to talk to you, Like,
I don't know what's going on, but I'm more than
happy to talk to you. And the lawyers told my
husband's lawyer, Amazon said, we'll only talk to you if
you're pleading guilty to.
Speaker 2 (07:29):
A federal crime. And that was just mind blowing.
Speaker 1 (07:34):
And what was the crime that they accused him of?
Speaker 3 (07:37):
So I always want to save this upfront, but my
husband's never even been charged with the crime. So when
you hear this wild story, just keep in mind that
he's never been charged with any crime. But Amazon accused
him of a crime called private sector honest services fraud,
which means a private employee is alleged to have deprived
(07:57):
his private employer of his quote honest services.
Speaker 1 (08:02):
Okay, so so in common speak, that means they're saying
that he did what.
Speaker 3 (08:09):
They Amazon said that my husband accepted kickbacks during and
after his time at Amazon in order to steer real
estate transactions to certain real estate developers.
Speaker 1 (08:21):
And this is a completely fabricated charge.
Speaker 2 (08:24):
Completely.
Speaker 1 (08:25):
Yeah, how did the FBI get involved in this? Because
knowing your story and hearing how all of this transpired
and how many years it's been going on, it seems
as though Amazon uses the DOJ as their personal law firm.
Speaker 3 (08:43):
It really feels that way. So I'll tell you how
it happened. And it's wild because we didn't know any
of this for years. We were in the dark. And
that's one of the scariest things. I think a lot
of people are accused of a crime, you know, don't
have a lot of information about how it's happened or
why it's happening, and that was certainly our situation. We
now know, and we only know this because Amazon leader
(09:05):
sued my husband and there was a civil discovery process
whereby Amazon had to hand over their communications with the
Department of Justice. But we learned through that process that
Amazon had gone to the Department of Justice over one
hundred times lobbying for the Department of Justice to charge
my husband with a crime. Amazon had broken a contract
(09:25):
with a real estate developer. They had done that with
their business partner named IPI, and the terms of the
contract that were broken required that the certain real estate
developer named Brian Watson plead guilty or be convicted of
a felony, or Amazon and its business partner, we're going
to owe Brian Watson hundreds of millions of dollars. And
(09:47):
so they broke the contract and the very next day
they were at the Department of Justice in Washington, DC
meeting with federal prosecutors.
Speaker 1 (09:54):
Okay, so you've three kids, right, four three girls or
four girls, but when they knocked on you door, you
had just had a baby, or it was similar. It
was right around that time.
Speaker 3 (10:04):
Yeah, my baby, Holland was eight months old when they
knocked on our door, and my oldest daughter, Sloan was five.
Speaker 2 (10:11):
I had a bunch of kids in four and a
half years.
Speaker 1 (10:13):
And not only did they come to your house, they
seized all of your money.
Speaker 3 (10:20):
Yeah, so this is something else I had no idea
existed in America. And I think that's a reflection of
my privilege and my skin color, which is white.
Speaker 2 (10:28):
There is something in America.
Speaker 3 (10:29):
Called civil forfeiture, and through civil forfeiture, federal, state, and
local governments can seize the assets of any American based
on the suspicion of a crime. They don't have to
prove a crime, let alone even charge you with one,
right because my husband was never charged with any crime.
But despite that, in May of twenty twenty, so, in
six weeks after the FBI knocked on our door, I
(10:50):
got an alert that my Wells Fargo account was overdrawn.
And I was like, what, because I had money in
my Wells Fargo account. You know, I was running my startup,
worked full time like my husband did. And I went
and signed onto my bank account and there was a
line you know where you.
Speaker 2 (11:06):
Would see like your Gaspers talents.
Speaker 3 (11:09):
Yeah, there was a line that said that the Federal
Bureau of Investigation had taken the money out of my
bank account. And we quickly learned that every single bank
account we had had been emptied, and also the government
had seized all of the money my husband had paid
his attorneys as well from the attorney's bank accounts.
Speaker 1 (11:27):
We'll be right back with more from Amy Nelson. How
(11:52):
is this legal? Amy Nelson?
Speaker 3 (11:55):
So, civil forfeiture actually goes back to the very beginning
of America. They start because of pirates, like ships would
come in, not pay their taxes, take their ships away,
and so we would go like seize the ships on
the open sea to get our taxes, and it's typically
used in America today for drug crimes, so it's really abusive.
(12:15):
Like even if, like if you're pulled over and they
found a dim bag of weed and you're in a
state where marijuana is still illegal, they could say, oh,
we're taking the whole car because the car is now
a crime. And it's used to really pressure people and
it's a really horrifying process. And one of the most
horrifying parts about it is like in our situation, because
they never charged my husband with a crime, the government
(12:36):
held our money for twenty two months. There was literally
nothing we could do, and then they just gave it
back one day.
Speaker 1 (12:42):
Did they tell you why they gave it back.
Speaker 3 (12:45):
I mean, I assume they gave it back because they
didn't want to have to prove anything. Because they finally
reached a time where a judge said, okay, government, you've
taken this money. Give these people a chance to fight
back and say they did nothing wrong. And at that
exact moment, the government just gave it back. As long
as we promised not to sue them. We had to
sign something saying we would not see the Department of justice.
Speaker 1 (13:05):
Wow, So what does a family of six do when
the government takes their money out of their bank account
when their spouse has not even been charged with a crime.
What do you do? Where do you go? How do
you live? How do you pay for your food for
your children? What do you do?
Speaker 2 (13:26):
So we were making money every month.
Speaker 3 (13:28):
I was working for my startup, and my husband was
consulting and working for his company.
Speaker 2 (13:32):
And we were mid.
Speaker 3 (13:33):
Forties, professionals of graduate degrees, you know, really in the
heart of our career. We were making a good living
and so we were able to for a while, you know,
pay for pay for our lives with.
Speaker 2 (13:44):
What we were earning month to month.
Speaker 3 (13:47):
Then our legal fees got too big to do that.
We've spent over three million dollars in legal fees. And
which is I can't it's mind blowing, but sort a
certain point, about five months after the government took our
bank accounts, I said to my husband, we have to
sell our house.
Speaker 2 (14:05):
We owned a home in Seattle, and.
Speaker 3 (14:06):
I said, we have to sell it, and we have
to sell it really quickly or we won't be able
to pay lawyers.
Speaker 2 (14:10):
And so we did that. I called our realtor, who'd
helped us buy the house.
Speaker 3 (14:15):
It was the first house we'd ever bought, put down
ten percent because we couldn't afford the twenty percent down
payment at the time. And she was really helpful and kind,
and we packed five bags for all six of us.
Speaker 2 (14:27):
We put everything else in storage.
Speaker 3 (14:29):
And we got in our minivan and drove away to
my sister's house in California and stayed with her and
her family and our household. And that gave us enough
money to pay for the next part of life and lawyers,
and then.
Speaker 2 (14:46):
Yeah, a lot of things. Eventually, I had to take
a job.
Speaker 3 (14:48):
I had to leave my company and take a job
in a different state, away from my four daughters in
order to pay our legal bills and keep our family going.
But we just we just did every single thing you could.
We raised money, we borrowed money, everything.
Speaker 1 (15:02):
And your mom, I was reading your mom told you
when you were so I guess in shock and crushed
at the beginning, and defeated and depressed. I imagine your
mom told you to fight.
Speaker 2 (15:14):
Oh she did.
Speaker 3 (15:15):
Yeah, my mom is the most amazing woman. She paid
her way through college working as a janitor and did
a bunch of other things. And you know she called
me and it was all during COVID, right, So this
is this all started in the April of twenty twenty,
right when COVID was exploding and the lockdowns were happening.
So I couldn't see my parents who they were in
Ohio and I was in Seattle, and I knew my
(15:37):
mom was just dying kind of watching this happen across
the country and not able to help. And my parents
couldn't help financially, they don't have the means to do that.
But you know, my mother facetimed me one day and
I was literally sitting on my bathroom floor, I think,
just hiding from my reality, and she said, you've got
to get up. You've got to get up, and you
got to fight because not just for your kids, not
(15:57):
just for yourself, but for your husband. Like, get up,
you know how to do this.
Speaker 2 (16:01):
Get up?
Speaker 1 (16:02):
Wow? And you did. You got up, and you decided
you were going to put this all out on TikTok
and you didn't ask anyone. You just turned on your
phone and started talking about the truth of what had
happened to one family in America. And it's kind of
an unbelievable truth that you know Amazon, Why does Amazon
(16:26):
have so much power?
Speaker 3 (16:30):
So I did eventually decide to tell the story. And
I think, you know, storytelling is incredibly important, right We
live and die by the stories of hear you know,
it's people falling in love, companies being built like these
are the things that inspire us and make us feel
And I felt so alone when I felt like I
couldn't tell anybody what was happening. But there is a
(16:50):
sense of you're accused of a crime in America that
you're supposed to be quiet. But my husband's case, like
we knew what happened. You know, he wasn't afraid of
the truth. I wasn't afraid of the truth, and so
I felt that it was the most powerful thing to
do would be to share the story, because when you're silent,
I think people assume that you're you're guilty of something.
Speaker 2 (17:08):
And I thought the best person as hell the story would.
Speaker 3 (17:12):
Be me because I knew it and because I was
living it, and because in today's world, we all have
the ability to get out there and stand up and
tell our truth and maybe someone will listen, maybe they won't.
I mean, I you know, I've been on Instagram for
a very long time and have a following of around
twenty five thousand people. And I had never been on TikTok.
Speaker 2 (17:30):
I watched it. I thought it was a dancing app.
Speaker 1 (17:32):
But you know what me too. At the beginning, I
totally thought that, like, why would I want to go
on there and dance? I don't want to dance, you.
Speaker 3 (17:39):
Know, I can't really dance talking about the FBI raids
of my home. But like, but wonderous, I don't want
screw it.
Speaker 2 (17:46):
I'm just going to go on there.
Speaker 3 (17:47):
And I think my first video was like, I'm just
going to share the story of what happened to my family,
and I just talked into the camera and people really
started to listen, and that was remarkable to me, and
it made me feel so much less alone, which was
really I mean, but I think you know the question
you asked of why does Amazons have.
Speaker 2 (18:04):
So much power? Amazon is a behemoth. It's in every
part of our lives.
Speaker 3 (18:09):
And Amazon has billions of dollars in contracts with the
federal government.
Speaker 2 (18:15):
And listen, I'm not a conspiracy theorist. I was deeply.
Speaker 3 (18:18):
Involved in politics for most of my life. I was
on Barack Obama's National Finance Committee. I worked for Jimmy
Carter on elections around the world. I am like a
tried and true progressive in sometimes I hear that things
coming out of my mouth and I'm like, oh, you
sound like a right wing conspiracy theorist, and I'm not.
But Amazon has very close relationships with many federal government institutions.
Speaker 1 (18:39):
Which is so obvious with your story. Yeah, it's almost
like they got to call up and say, we're going
to lose billions unless we can get this guy to break,
So let's do everything to break him and his family
to you know, didn't they threaten to come and have
your husband arrested and taken out in cuffs in front
of your four girls.
Speaker 2 (19:00):
Yeah, over and over and over again.
Speaker 3 (19:02):
I mean they, I mean, and they like they There
was one moment where, like, you know, they subpoenaed are
We were very fortunate in fivilege that we had in
home childcare because we had four little kids and my
husband and I both worked, and at a certain point
the DOJ sabpoenad our former nanny who we paid over
(19:24):
the table and paid you know, payroll taxes for through
an LLC, because if we hadn't that would have been
a pressure tactic because they could have said, we'll charge
Amy Nelson with the crime along with their husband because
of false tax filings.
Speaker 1 (19:37):
Right, it's scary. It's so scary to think that this
is the reality and that you would have this occur
and continue to occur to this day. It's still going on.
Speaker 2 (19:52):
It is.
Speaker 3 (19:52):
When Amazon couldn't get criminal charges against my husband, they
then sued him, and a federal judge recently throughout Amazon's
claims saying my husband hadn't committed to racketeering. I mean
they literally said my husband was like a mafia racketeer guy,
you know under the rout Go Act.
Speaker 2 (20:10):
And the judge said that's not true.
Speaker 3 (20:12):
And they said my husband hadn't even violated his employment contract.
And the judge throughout all these claims before a civil trial.
So imagine that the dj was trying to get my
husband to plead guilty to a crime for years based
on Amazon's allegations that a federal judge said couldn't survive
to a civil trial. Jury didn't need it, didn't even
need to hear it.
Speaker 2 (20:33):
Wow.
Speaker 1 (20:34):
Yeah, Now what did this do to your marriage? And
what did this do to your mental state? For both
you, your husband and your girls. What what What has the
damaging effects been emotionally?
Speaker 2 (20:48):
Yeah, that's a hard one.
Speaker 3 (20:50):
I mean, I think part of it it's hard to
answer in some ways because it is still happening, and
so you don't really know how the trauma has impacted
you while you're still in it, right, But I mean
it's been almost impossible to deal with. I mean I
have been I always kind of pride myself. I'm like, oh,
(21:11):
I would have survived really well in eighteen hundreds. I'm
very sturdy and you know, I'm a workhorse, and this
really brought me to my knees physically.
Speaker 2 (21:19):
I know, my hair fell out.
Speaker 3 (21:21):
I had grew tumor in my thyroid which I had
to get out, and I just I lost the ability
to like to dream and hope. Right, you're just in
survival mode, Like what is the next thing I can
do to survive the next hour, the next day, the
next week. I can't think beyond that because it's too
scary for my husband, I mean, and also like I
(21:43):
lost jobs because of this, right, Like it's right, and
my husband lost his career, which was so much of
his identity.
Speaker 2 (21:49):
You know, he he just loved what he did.
Speaker 3 (21:52):
He loved building, and he's he is slowly rebuilding his career,
but it took that away from him, and that was
really really hard to watch. As to our marriage, I mean,
I think the stress of raising four little kids while
both working is hard on any marriage when your kids
are little. I mean that alone was really hard. To
layer this on top of it has been heartbreaking. I mean,
(22:15):
I don't know what our marriage is, Rosie, Like, I
love him to death, he loves me, and we've been
on a.
Speaker 2 (22:20):
Battlefield and until we have frot that battlefield.
Speaker 3 (22:24):
Like sometimes, the way I envision it is that I'm
trying to set at dinner table and my husband's trying
to do the dishes, and our little kids are sitting
there and there are like snipers surrounding our house and
we live a normal life and it doesn't feel normal
right right.
Speaker 1 (22:42):
And I see again in the movie version, which I
can see in my head, you know, you could see
those little red lights, you know, from the laser scopes
going on as you go about your life, you know.
I mean, it's just it's shocking to me that they
could get away with this. And maybe that's naivete. But
people now are following your story. You have a lot
(23:03):
of followers, You have people who are very interested in this. Yeah,
wouldn't you think that Amazon would be afraid of the
bad press and that they would try to appease you
and make it all go away and say I'm sorry
and give you, you know, compensations. That's the musical ending
(23:24):
of this, right.
Speaker 3 (23:25):
I think there's like a lot of things here. I
think that Amazon, do you play poker? Yes, okay, so
you know the big stack bully when you get so
many chips, it's just yes, or it doesn't matter, you're
going to win.
Speaker 2 (23:35):
You can bully write like. I think that Amazon thinks
of itself like that.
Speaker 3 (23:39):
Like if you look at what's happening right now with
the Federal Trade Commission and they're going to file an
anti trust lawsuit against Amazon. When companies are facing anti
trust lawsuits, they get to meet with the DOJ and
they can make some concessions. Right, they can be like, well, DJ,
you know, or FTC, like we'll do X, Y or z.
In this situation, Amazon has offered zero concessions. I think
they're like, screw it, we can do what we want Amazon, Right,
(24:01):
and I feel like they think that every step of
the way. And you know, we're not the only family.
That Amazon has done this too, and they've gone after
seller consultants through the Department of Justice with criminal charges.
They've gone after vendors through the Department of Justice of
criminal charges. All are evolving around these allegations that people
are violating internal Amazon policy and so I feel like
(24:23):
they just think they can do this. And I think
right now they're so far into this that like what
are they going to do? And the real estate developer
Brian Watson, you know, because of the allegations they made
and what they've done in the courts, his company, which
had one point seven billion in assets under control, has
been destroyed one point seven billion dollars. So like what happens?
(24:45):
Like what is their endgame? I think about it all
the time, like what are they doing?
Speaker 1 (24:48):
Like what is you know, what are they doing? And
they're just trying to continue business as usual? Is this
something that they do so often that they don't even
think of it anymore as as criminal? Have they become
so empowered by, you know, a government that doesn't tax
them enough and you know, I don't know, it seems
(25:10):
to me that it's the most absurd story you've ever heard,
and how could they get away with it?
Speaker 3 (25:16):
Yeah, And I think, like, I mean, I also think
they're really angry at me, Like they've sent me letters
telling me to like take down my TikTok or else
to some kind of like guys like you pulled the
nuclear option really early and sent the FBI to my
house with guns.
Speaker 2 (25:30):
Like a letter doesn't scare me at this point.
Speaker 3 (25:32):
Cor this in February telling me to take down my
TikTok or else and then I wrote back like no,
and then averywhere.
Speaker 1 (25:38):
Else what I'm not going to get the prime delivery special?
Speaker 3 (25:43):
But I think that like they just they you know,
like if you go back to the beginning of this,
I didn't know this, but I'd like taken a deep
dive into this. Ninety eight point two percent of Americans
who are accused of a federal crime plead guilty.
Speaker 2 (25:55):
They played the odds.
Speaker 1 (25:56):
Ninety eight point two percent.
Speaker 3 (25:59):
Well, yeah, Rosie, because if you're accused of tedral crime,
you have to have millions of dollars to fight it.
I mean, that's just a reality, Like you have to
have millions of dollars to survive a criminal trial, Like,
we don't have a fair jury system in America. We
have like a plea bargaining system. Like it's kind of
a farce. The whole thing doesn't make sense. So you
have to have millions of dollars. And there's something called
a trial penalty where if you don't plead and you
(26:20):
take a case to trial, they can put you in
prison for much longer. They can penalize you for exercising
your right to a jury trial.
Speaker 1 (26:31):
Wow. Yeah, wow, So what is what is your end game?
I would love to hear that you're going to make
this into a podcast on its own, just this topic,
because it's it's so compelling amy and it's so outlandishly
overreaching from Amazon and into the DOJ and the FBI.
(26:55):
It's crazy making.
Speaker 3 (26:57):
It is crazy making, And there will be storytelling about
this with some projects that I'm working on, and I
think it's really important to tell the story for a
bunch of different reasons. For me personally, you know, as
somebody who's always worked in politics, like I can't walk
away from this without trying to change something so it
doesn't happen to other people.
Speaker 2 (27:17):
And for me, the two.
Speaker 3 (27:17):
Pieces of that are civil forfeiture, I mean just has
to go. We should not be able to take money
on the suspicion of a crime. It particularly impacts folks
of color and immigrants, not not white people like me.
It disproportionately impacts people who don't look like me. And
it's devastating. And you know, if your money, your home
is taken by civil forfeiture, you have to pay lawyers
(27:39):
to fight to get it back. It's a ridiculous system.
We don't need it. Like back in the time of pirates, fine,
the ship went away, it was hard to find. But
like we live in an age where you can find
anybody anywhere. You know how to get them, like, you
don't need to take their money before you prove a crime.
And then second, I really think that you know, in
my husband's situation, Amazon hired former federal prosecutors from the
(28:00):
Eastern District of Virginia to go and lobby their former
colleagues who are still prosecutors in the Eastern District of Virginia.
Speaker 2 (28:06):
And that has got to stop. That is not open.
Speaker 3 (28:08):
And Amazon has hired hundreds of former prosecutors, so they
have this in everywhere across the country and like, I
don't have that in so they're gonna you know, they're
listening to Amazon. Like my husband didn't ever even get
the chance to talk to the prosecutors.
Speaker 2 (28:21):
They just listened to Amazon and believe them.
Speaker 1 (28:24):
Wow. Wow, So the next steps for your family, the
next steps you're kind of waiting in at their mercy.
Speaker 3 (28:33):
Amazon lost against my husband in federal court, and so
Amazon is now appealing that. So we have to go
through that whole process where they appeal what they lost,
which means Amazon will spend many more millions of dollars
to do that. I think that Amazon has spent over
fifty million dollars on lawyers, and that's holy shit. And
like the weird thing about it is, this is about
(28:55):
something that a federal judge said, Amazon hasn't proven a
dollar of damages about, Like Amazon, this is all about
some real estate. Amazon kept all the real estate. They're
selling cloud computing from it and making billions of dollars.
So like they've benefited from what they say was a crime.
So it's super bizarre what they're doing. But so we
wait for the appeal and then you know, my husband
(29:16):
has already sued Amazon in Washington State and one part
of it, and I'm sure he'll continue that lawsuit once
Amazon's appeal is over. You know, I think I've been
very much injured, and so I have my four daughters,
and I really want my daughters to have a voice
in this.
Speaker 1 (29:29):
Yes, you know, so how do they talk about it?
Speaker 3 (29:34):
So it's you know, it's interesting. They were so young
when it started. And my littlest is just four now,
but this has been her whole life. But she doesn't
have any comprehension of it yet that I know. But
my oldest daughter, Sloan is nine now, and she knows enough.
And one day she asked me. She said, Mom, I
is said, okay to hate someone. I said, why are
(29:55):
you asking that, Sloan? She was, I think I hate
Jeff Bezos And I said, you know, hates a really
strong word, but i'd like to talk.
Speaker 1 (30:05):
About Wow, Mom, that took a lot of restraint. I
would have said, yes him, we can hate. That's what
I totally would have said.
Speaker 3 (30:14):
But I said, you know, I think I can understand
why you would feel that way. I said, I hate him.
I'll be honest with you, but I'd like to talk
about why you feel that way, and we talked about it,
and you know, she knows that Jeff Bezos had a
company that was trying to put her daddy in jail,
and that's a bit, that's a heavy thing for a
nine year.
Speaker 1 (30:34):
Old totally, and imagine how terrified she is of the
possibility that that's going to happen. Imagine what it does
to the safety and psyche of your home when armed
guards come in, you know, swat team. What does that
do to a baby's sense of life and safety?
Speaker 3 (30:52):
I mean, I hope they feel as safe as they can,
because all I've ever told them when we talk about
it is like mommy and Daddy will fight as hard
as they can and as long as they can to
keep you safe because because we know the truth, and
it's really important to fight for the truth. And you know,
their grandparents believe that we all like that is this
is how I was raised, It's how they'll be raised.
Speaker 2 (31:10):
And you know it's important for them to.
Speaker 3 (31:12):
See it, but it is true, like when you lose
that sense of safety, it is incredibly, incredibly hard. And
one thing that was really important to me in fighting back.
And I hope my girls see this because you know,
their names got dragged into this. My name got dragged
in my husband's name, right like Amazon named all these people.
And what Amazon wanted to do is say, but we're
(31:34):
just Amazon. But Amazon technically has done nothing to me.
And I've tried to explain that to my daughters. Amazon
didn't do anything to you. Amazon is a logo. People
did this to you. Human beings with names. And it's
not just Jeff Bezos. It's the current CEO, Andy Jassey,
It's the general counsel David Sapolski, it's the lawyers Matt
jadin U see Omar. You know, they have names, and
(31:55):
these names are in public quort documents that Amazon has
put into the world, and those people are responsible. Those
people have families. Have they ever thought about what it's
like for us to be asked? Have they ever thought
about my daughters and whether they can sleep at night?
Speaker 1 (32:10):
I would say no. I would say no. I think
you know, when a company or a person becomes a
multi billionaire, their soul leaves their body. It's almost as
though if you measure in money for long enough, you
will be swallowed by it whole. You know it. It
(32:31):
amazes me the power that these billionaires have, and it's
very depressing.
Speaker 3 (32:42):
It's so depressing, and then like you see these like
people profiles where it's like Lauren Sanchez steps out in
a glowing literary dress with her ten billion carrot engagement ring,
and you're like, why is that news?
Speaker 2 (32:54):
Right?
Speaker 1 (32:54):
Why?
Speaker 2 (32:54):
Why are we Why are we so obsessed with this?
Speaker 1 (32:58):
Right?
Speaker 3 (32:58):
Because the obsession with it gives it the power in
the fuel. And I can assure you that the billionaires, yeah,
don't care about us.
Speaker 2 (33:05):
So it's just it's a weird. It's a weird.
Speaker 1 (33:08):
I think that they just are so removed from humanity.
They're so removed, you know, and people will say this
about me, I'm a millionaire, right, am I removed from humanity?
I guess in some ways I definitely am.
Speaker 3 (33:21):
But I think that like it is this thing too,
right that you're still here sharing stories like you did
on the show, right, And that's giving voice to people,
And that's something that I think it could. It has
to prevent you from being completely disconnected because you're you're listening,
and to your point, like with billionaires, they just don't listen,
they're not you know, they're kind of like I think
(33:41):
they can ice themselves up because no one wants to
have set Jeff Bezos that makes a lot of money
off of him.
Speaker 2 (33:46):
No one's going to sit down and tell him the truth,
right like that.
Speaker 3 (33:49):
I know, I've I've worked, I've been around other billionaires,
and like, I think it's a similar thing, right that,
Like people are just like a pee, like the court
gesters in a way like appease the guy. It's always
I've always been men in that capacity, like appease the guy, right,
Like what does he need? What will make him happy?
How do we give him what he wants? Because then
we'll get we want right and so.
Speaker 1 (34:08):
Right right and what you know, and when everyone starts
doing that around you, even though you don't think they are,
they are, you know they are. But but if that
becomes the way people interact with you, you start to feel
kind of a lofty disconnection. I'd imagine, right, and uh
an ability to sort of think only of yourself, you know, yeah, I.
Speaker 3 (34:29):
Mean I think that would be exactly where you'd end up.
I as think it's funny and like it's particularly American.
We always talk about like Russian oligarchs and an oligarch. Right,
it is like I'm a person of extreme wealth who's
very close to the government. And I'm like, guys, like
we might have that same issue here in America.
Speaker 1 (34:44):
Yeah, yeah, exactly.
Speaker 3 (34:46):
We don't ever want to admit that Elon Musk is
a ton of ties to the American governments all like Starlink,
like he like has some sway over what's happening in
Ukraine with his satellites, Like that is wild. He is
a man, right, He's a man who can sway geopolitical issues.
Speaker 2 (35:04):
It doesn't even make any.
Speaker 1 (35:05):
Sense, No, it really doesn't.
Speaker 3 (35:08):
It's so easy to be such a hero when you
have that much money, and yet none of them are
and that is so weird, and we don't demand it.
Speaker 2 (35:17):
We don't ask that were like, let.
Speaker 1 (35:18):
No, I mean, can you can you think of one
billionaire philanthropist that it does give billions away? I don't know,
can you think of one?
Speaker 2 (35:27):
I mean, other than Mackenzie Scott?
Speaker 1 (35:29):
No, yeah, other than her? No? And I love what
she's doing. I think all the more power to her,
you know, Yeah.
Speaker 3 (35:35):
I mean I think like the Gates Foundation has done
a lot in the world, but it is so it's
the Gates Foundation to the point of like naming things.
Speaker 2 (35:41):
It's the Gates Foundation, and it's.
Speaker 3 (35:42):
Their work, right, Like it's their work. It's not just
giving it to people who are doing the good work.
I mean, there are so many charities in this country
doing so many good things.
Speaker 4 (35:52):
And well with experts. Yeah, just I don't know. It's
weirdo boy, and it's really weird. What the what is
the platform you're going to use to do this podcast thing?
Speaker 1 (36:05):
Do you know yet? Or is it too early to talk?
Speaker 2 (36:07):
Too early to talk about it? Okay, oh, that'd be great.
Speaker 3 (36:09):
And then I'm also I have a I have a
book proposal out right now, which is fantastic.
Speaker 2 (36:15):
Yeah, so it's a.
Speaker 3 (36:18):
I'm excited about it, worked on it for a long time,
and I think it's the right time to start telling
the story in a book as well.
Speaker 1 (36:25):
Well. I think that would be wonderful. And I can
see you selling the rights and hopefully getting some of
the money that you uh, you know, spent on this
catastrophe of your life. This no charges ever against your
husband and four years of hell and harassment from the
DOJ and the lawyers of Amazon. It makes no sense
(36:47):
in uh, in my mind, you know.
Speaker 3 (36:50):
It really doesn't. I would say the one thing that
I think has been helpful. I really learned though that
I wish other people could learn.
Speaker 2 (36:56):
I would.
Speaker 3 (36:56):
I hope people don't have to learn it, but if
they had to, is that you know, it can be
really terrifying to use your voice with really powerful people
and institutions are coming at you. But if you have
the truth, like you can use your voice, and you should.
And that is the remarkable thing about TikTok.
Speaker 1 (37:12):
I think, I agree. There are so many, you know,
instances where women don't get voice of a microphone. You know,
they don't get the chance to. If you have access
to a microphone and you're somehow in the public eye,
use it, even if that's TikTok. Only use it. So
say what your your piece, say what you feel needs
(37:34):
to be said. What's happening, you know, I mean, authenticity
and truth have been so damaged in the last you know,
ten years and maybe even more. And I think it's
all people crave, it's all humans need. It's all that
we really want, but we haven't known where to get
(37:57):
it or how to get it yet.
Speaker 3 (37:59):
Yeah, I think that's completely right. And I think, you know,
it's made worse by the fact that, like the news
is hard to digest and you you don't know if
you're ever really getting the story. And I think that,
you know, the ability to tell your own story is
a remarkable thing. I think about the Violet Revolution, how
Twitter allowed that.
Speaker 2 (38:18):
To happen in twenty.
Speaker 3 (38:18):
Elevens by allowing people to gather together, and I think that,
you know, social media has given us all a voice
and it's it's a remarkable thing.
Speaker 2 (38:26):
TikTok is, it's an incredible platform.
Speaker 1 (38:29):
Well, and I'm so glad to have met you on there.
I feel like i'm your friend that when I see
you pop up, I'm always like leaving a little comment
like keep going because you know you're you're a really
remarkable woman, Amy or you should be played by Jennifer
Garner as it goes to a series and you know,
kick ass like Alias. You know what I'm saying, Like,
(38:49):
I'd love for you, like to get into training and
become an MMA star and become the champion and then
fight Jeff Bezos. So exactly. Well, thank you so much
for coming on this podcast, and I will totally totally
look forward to whatever truth you want to put out
(39:11):
there in whatever form, because people need to know what's
happened to your family and how it could happen to
them if it could happen to you, And it's pretty terrifying.
And thank you for sharing it and alerting people and
warning people that this is a reality that happens to
people and mostly you never hear about it.
Speaker 3 (39:32):
Thank you so much, Rosie. It means the world that
you've listened and that you have me on today.
Speaker 1 (39:37):
Well my pleasure, Amy Nelson. Find her on TikTok. Ladies
and gentlemen. We will be back with questions right after
this Isn't that insane? Can you even believe that happened
(40:07):
to this family and it's still happening. I would like
to add that since we tape this podcast, the government,
supported by seventeen state attorneys general, finally filed a long
awaited antitrust lawsuit against Amazon. That's right, they're saying it's
a monopoly. The government alleged that the etailer uses a
(40:28):
set of interlocking, anti competitive and unfair strategies to illegally
maintain its monopoly power. Wow. That is a huge thing
for us as a nation and a huge thing for
Amy Nelson and her family. We are definitely going to
have her on again and do a follow up when
(40:49):
this is all finally resolved for her, and I hope
she gets to file her own lawsuit against Amazon and
Jeff Bezos for what they have done to her family.
That's just a little personally anecdote right there. Okay, now
we have some questions and comments from you, the loyal listeners.
Thank you so much. I think we have two today.
I haven't heard them. I never do. We just go
(41:11):
for it as we go for it, and go ahead,
go for it.
Speaker 5 (41:14):
Hi, Rosie, my name is Annie. I'm from Quebec, Canada.
I just want to tell you that it's a couple
of times now that I watch your show that I
listened to your podcast with the Doctor Rosen and about
we Go videos and pick and everything, and it really
changed the way I think about it. I mightpy you
did that because you're doing your service to people, because
(41:36):
nobody in around me talks about these things. I tak
ozempic for like six months now. I lost like thirty
six pounds about a pound a week, which is very good.
And it changed my life. But not just because it
my weight is lower on the scale. It's because it
changed my life. I can move more. I don't think
about food. But I realized that when I listen to you,
(41:59):
and I listened to the episode like for the fourth
time today because I was taking a walk and listening
it to it again, and I was thinking, my god,
nobody explained it like that to me, and it really
changed something inside me that I accept myself more because
I was thinking that I was doing the taking the
(42:21):
easy way, taking ozembic. But it's not that. It's just
the way it's working for my body. I have the
freaking thrifty gene and nothing will change for me. I'm
almost fifty now and it's changing my life and I'm
so happy and I'm a new person. And I'm happy
to see that you talk about it, because if you
(42:44):
talk about it, other people will understand that it's not
a question of laziness. It's a question of being ready
to change your life. And obesity is an illness like
any other any other illness. If you have a cancer,
you're going to take medication, but it's the same thing
(43:05):
if you're a beast. You need the medication to help you.
It's changing my life and I find it amazing. So
I just want to thank you because I was looking
for ways to talk to you because it really changed
my life and I just wanted you to know, so
I have a good day. Goodbye.
Speaker 1 (43:21):
First of all, what a beautiful message. And second of all,
I love your accent. I really love your accent. I
could listen to you all day. But yes, I mean
I have been on Munjaro since December and it's changed
my life too, Honey. You know what, I'm going to
be sixty two in March, and I fought with Waite
(43:42):
my whole life, my whole family, my extended family. Everyone
has the O'Donnell shape, the big beer belly kind of
and but you know, you always felt like something was
wrong with you, and you were lazy, and you had
a will power, and it's you do a real big
job of beating yourself up if you're an overweight person
(44:03):
in this world, because societal stigma is still so prevalent
and so intense, and I think the truth is what
people want and need, and self love is part of
the journey of healing. And I think anyone who says
that taking munjarro or any of these drugs is the
(44:25):
easy way out is lying or doesn't understand or is
lacking the compassion that one would hope you are able
to give yourself. So thank you. I would love to
talk to you about it. And I think this drug
is going to be used to help millions more people,
not just people with diabetes and obesity, which is a disease.
(44:46):
So thank you, thank you, thank you. All Right, do
we have another one? The last one for the day,
and then we're done? Hit it?
Speaker 6 (44:57):
Hi, Rosie. This is Nick from Chicago. I'm a longtime
fan and first time caller. I had to call because
I am turning forty this year and my husband had
asked what did I want for my birthday, and the
only thing I could think of was I wanted a
Rosie O'Donnell showcake. So next weekend, I turned forty on
(45:17):
October thirteenth, and I am getting my Rosie cake. I
can't wait to see it. I have no idea what
it's going to look like, but I am thrilled. And
the reason that is is because your show has meant
so much to me. Not only in the years that
I would run home from school watching it after school
and learning about Broadway and learning about TV and New
York life and all the things, but it taught me
(45:40):
so much about empathy and doing good for others with
all the super kids always being charitable with no matter
if you had a little or if you had a lot,
but just always looking out for others. And it's really
paved away from me in life to be what I
would consider it a good person. I just can't thank
(46:01):
you enough. And I had the opportunity to see your
show in Chicago when you were here, and it was
such a thrill and just a dream to finally see
you do a show in person and everything, and it
was just a thrill. And then to have you living
in Chicago was even better. It was just awesome. So
thank you for everything. You've meant so much to me.
And my question for today is with the Rossi O'Donnell show,
(46:25):
I was curious if you have any props or any
of the set pieces that were part of it. This
set was such an integral part to that show and
just set the tone and was so fun and it
just even when the desks were being switched out after
any Lasagna won the trivia contest, it was just a
ball to see what was going to happen next, and
it was always just such a familiar, happy place. So
(46:48):
I would love to hear if you have anything, love you,
and thanks again for everything.
Speaker 1 (46:53):
That is the sweetest. You are the sweetest, and happy
birthday to you. That's such a it's so it's unbelo
be to be my age and have lived my life
and to get to hear comments like this. I have
to say, I always tell the producers it sounds like
I'm picking the questions because they're all so nice. So
(47:14):
I'm like, you know, it can't be they're all nice,
but they are. You're all nice, So thank you for that.
You're all nice. You know. I don't have anything from
the actual set. I didn't keep that stuff. I have
specific things that people gave me. I have an amazing,
(47:36):
amazing scrap book that has every letter of every celebrity
who wrote me when the show premiered, and it is
unbelievable to read through Bob Hope and you know, Carol Channing,
and it's just it's hard to believe that it's even
my life. I have to say, I'm so glad it
affected you in such a positive way. I'm so glad
(47:57):
that you sound like such an empathy, kind hearted person
and that you credit me with any of that. I
beg to differ, but I thank you for what your
words mean to me. Thank you for saying them and
for leaving the message, and thank you for loving with
a big heart. I appreciate it. Hey, keep these questions
(48:21):
and comments coming. Suggestions, all your thoughts and opinions to
onward Rosie at gmail dot com. That's onward Rosie at
gmail dot com. Next week, right here, my friend, the
magical singer songwriter Sophie B. Hawkins joins me for a
wild and fun conversation. She's got a brand new album out,
(48:43):
she's been touring, and she's a pretty enchanted human. Sophie B.
Hawkins next week right here. Thanks, byebye,
Hey, everybody, it is me Rosie O'donald Starr the Flintstones.
How are you? You made it here to onward my podcast?
How's it going by you in your life? Things good?
We're at a really exciting time in the fifth grade,
month two. My kid is having some adjustment issues in
(00:34):
the classroom, but you know, we're working with the school.
I really really love the school that they're attending and
the help that you get with your kid. They're doing good,
They're doing good. Today is a big day for both
Dakota and I. We're today getting to meet an actual
(00:56):
guide dog for an autistic child, Guide Dogs of America,
which is a wonderful and free organization. The adoption process
is pretty intense, the application process to get the dog,
and of course they have so many more applications than dogs,
but one of the final stages of your application is
(01:18):
they bring the guide dog to your house and see
how your child does with the concept in general. So
that's today and that should be very exciting and the
guide dog from America. People were asking me if there
was a preference for color of the dog, and I
(01:39):
was like, I don't think so, you know, And I
asked Dakota when I got home, and they said they'll
know the right one for me. I don't care if
it's brown or black or beige. After you get approved,
you have to go to a ten day session learning
all the commands. And then when that's done. As soon
(02:01):
as that's done, I'm going to jump in the car
and pick up some friends and we're going to see Pink. Yes,
you know, Pink man. Let's get this party started. She
was so young. She was on my TV show. You know,
I used to have a TV show on television, And
Dakota said to me one day, was it back in
black and white? No, but it kind of feels like it.
(02:27):
But she was on Pink and she was only twenty two,
and she was on a bunch of times. And I
just think she's so authentic, she's so artistic, she's so beautiful.
She's such a great family person, and I admire her
and how she runs her life and the arc that
she makes and she's just fantastic. So I'm going to
(02:50):
report back on Pink next week. And what else can
we say? You know, Donald Trump broke the gag order
with a racist whiney v The Wow Wow Wa posts
on his truth social which is not truthful at all.
How is he allowed to break the law? How is
he allowed to break the gag order and not go
(03:13):
right directly to jail? Do not pass, go, do not
collect two hundred dollars. That's what I'd like to know.
We're supposed to show that no one is above the law,
and that includes him. So he's broken the gag order
many times. Let's put him in jail. That's what I think.
Maybe controversial, but that's what I feel honestly, that we
(03:36):
have to show the consequences of his action to everyone
in the nation so the nation can heal and understand
what we have been dealing with for the last eight years.
All Right, we have a wonderful, wonderful show today. Amy
Nelson is my guest, and you probably don't know who
she is. Well, she's a wonderful woman on TikTok and
(03:58):
I've been following her for a while now, over a year,
maybe almost two years. She is here to tell you
what happened to her family to avoid losing money from
breaking a contract. Amazon not only made up unfounded charges
against Amy's husband, but Amazon got the Department of Justice
(04:23):
and the FBI involved in this matter, and you're not
gonna believe what happened to Amy and her family, and
it is still happening. It's still happening. She can explain
what happened better than I can. So take a listen
to me having a conversation with my friend and kick
(04:46):
ass woman, Amy Nelson. Hey, everybody, please welcome my guest today,
Amy Nelson. Amy. I can't even tell you how much
(05:07):
I admire you.
Speaker 2 (05:09):
Oh, thank you, Rosie. That means a lot.
Speaker 1 (05:11):
Now, listen, I met you on TikTok. I was going
through and I was hearing the story about your family
and the pictures, and every day there were, you know,
such specific detailed versions of what happened to you, like
so that it was like a movie coming to life
(05:31):
in my head. Like you know, I almost see it
as like, Oh, I can't wait till I get to
the part where you know, they get to sue Amazon.
Speaker 2 (05:39):
I would like to fix that part too, right.
Speaker 1 (05:43):
Well, tell, let's start at the very beginning. Your husband
worked for Amazon, or he worked for somebody who had
a contract with Amazon. Explain exactly what he did.
Speaker 3 (05:53):
So, my husband worked at Amazon Web Services, which is
part of Amazon and Amazon Web services build data centers,
which is where the Internet lives. And I think we
all think of the Internet as being in the cloud,
but it's actually in these big warehouses that are all
over the world. And my husband worked there for eight years,
had really an incredible experience in a pressure cooker. But
(06:14):
he worked on the real estate side, and so he
helped Amazon buy land to build data centers or lease
data centers. And then he left in twenty nineteen and
went out on his own. He had set up the
business while he was still at Amazon, which is allowed
by Amazon's employment contract.
Speaker 2 (06:31):
And when he left, he started working with that company.
Speaker 3 (06:34):
And about ten months after he left, the FBI and
knocked on our door at six forty five in the morning.
Speaker 1 (06:41):
Now before that point was he aware in any capacity
that they were even after him, or that they thought
he had done something or they were going to a
que et new He knew nothing. He was off in
his new job. Yeah, And knock, knock, knock, Yeah.
Speaker 2 (06:56):
He was off on his new job.
Speaker 3 (06:57):
And you know, my husband had hired a lot lawyer
when he set up his new company to review everything
and make sure everything was on the up and up.
And he was working with his lawyer all the time,
and so he really had no idea that this could happen.
And in fact, the day that the FBI showed up
at our house, my husband had his attorney call Amazon
(07:18):
and say, hey, I'd love to talk to you, Like,
I don't know what's going on, but I'm more than
happy to talk to you. And the lawyers told my
husband's lawyer, Amazon said, we'll only talk to you if
you're pleading guilty to.
Speaker 2 (07:29):
A federal crime. And that was just mind blowing.
Speaker 1 (07:34):
And what was the crime that they accused him of?
Speaker 3 (07:37):
So I always want to save this upfront, but my
husband's never even been charged with the crime. So when
you hear this wild story, just keep in mind that
he's never been charged with any crime. But Amazon accused
him of a crime called private sector honest services fraud,
which means a private employee is alleged to have deprived
(07:57):
his private employer of his quote honest services.
Speaker 1 (08:02):
Okay, so so in common speak, that means they're saying
that he did what.
Speaker 3 (08:09):
They Amazon said that my husband accepted kickbacks during and
after his time at Amazon in order to steer real
estate transactions to certain real estate developers.
Speaker 1 (08:21):
And this is a completely fabricated charge.
Speaker 2 (08:24):
Completely.
Speaker 1 (08:25):
Yeah, how did the FBI get involved in this? Because
knowing your story and hearing how all of this transpired
and how many years it's been going on, it seems
as though Amazon uses the DOJ as their personal law firm.
Speaker 3 (08:43):
It really feels that way. So I'll tell you how
it happened. And it's wild because we didn't know any
of this for years. We were in the dark. And
that's one of the scariest things. I think a lot
of people are accused of a crime, you know, don't
have a lot of information about how it's happened or
why it's happening, and that was certainly our situation. We
now know, and we only know this because Amazon leader
(09:05):
sued my husband and there was a civil discovery process
whereby Amazon had to hand over their communications with the
Department of Justice. But we learned through that process that
Amazon had gone to the Department of Justice over one
hundred times lobbying for the Department of Justice to charge
my husband with a crime. Amazon had broken a contract
(09:25):
with a real estate developer. They had done that with
their business partner named IPI, and the terms of the
contract that were broken required that the certain real estate
developer named Brian Watson plead guilty or be convicted of
a felony, or Amazon and its business partner, we're going
to owe Brian Watson hundreds of millions of dollars. And
(09:47):
so they broke the contract and the very next day
they were at the Department of Justice in Washington, DC
meeting with federal prosecutors.
Speaker 1 (09:54):
Okay, so you've three kids, right, four three girls or
four girls, but when they knocked on you door, you
had just had a baby, or it was similar. It
was right around that time.
Speaker 3 (10:04):
Yeah, my baby, Holland was eight months old when they
knocked on our door, and my oldest daughter, Sloan was five.
Speaker 2 (10:11):
I had a bunch of kids in four and a
half years.
Speaker 1 (10:13):
And not only did they come to your house, they
seized all of your money.
Speaker 3 (10:20):
Yeah, so this is something else I had no idea
existed in America. And I think that's a reflection of
my privilege and my skin color, which is white.
Speaker 2 (10:28):
There is something in America.
Speaker 3 (10:29):
Called civil forfeiture, and through civil forfeiture, federal, state, and
local governments can seize the assets of any American based
on the suspicion of a crime. They don't have to
prove a crime, let alone even charge you with one,
right because my husband was never charged with any crime.
But despite that, in May of twenty twenty, so, in
six weeks after the FBI knocked on our door, I
(10:50):
got an alert that my Wells Fargo account was overdrawn.
And I was like, what, because I had money in
my Wells Fargo account. You know, I was running my startup,
worked full time like my husband did. And I went
and signed onto my bank account and there was a
line you know where you.
Speaker 2 (11:06):
Would see like your Gaspers talents.
Speaker 3 (11:09):
Yeah, there was a line that said that the Federal
Bureau of Investigation had taken the money out of my
bank account. And we quickly learned that every single bank
account we had had been emptied, and also the government
had seized all of the money my husband had paid
his attorneys as well from the attorney's bank accounts.
Speaker 1 (11:27):
We'll be right back with more from Amy Nelson. How
(11:52):
is this legal? Amy Nelson?
Speaker 3 (11:55):
So, civil forfeiture actually goes back to the very beginning
of America. They start because of pirates, like ships would
come in, not pay their taxes, take their ships away,
and so we would go like seize the ships on
the open sea to get our taxes, and it's typically
used in America today for drug crimes, so it's really abusive.
(12:15):
Like even if, like if you're pulled over and they
found a dim bag of weed and you're in a
state where marijuana is still illegal, they could say, oh,
we're taking the whole car because the car is now
a crime. And it's used to really pressure people and
it's a really horrifying process. And one of the most
horrifying parts about it is like in our situation, because
they never charged my husband with a crime, the government
(12:36):
held our money for twenty two months. There was literally
nothing we could do, and then they just gave it
back one day.
Speaker 1 (12:42):
Did they tell you why they gave it back.
Speaker 3 (12:45):
I mean, I assume they gave it back because they
didn't want to have to prove anything. Because they finally
reached a time where a judge said, okay, government, you've
taken this money. Give these people a chance to fight
back and say they did nothing wrong. And at that
exact moment, the government just gave it back. As long
as we promised not to sue them. We had to
sign something saying we would not see the Department of justice.
Speaker 1 (13:05):
Wow, So what does a family of six do when
the government takes their money out of their bank account
when their spouse has not even been charged with a crime.
What do you do? Where do you go? How do
you live? How do you pay for your food for
your children? What do you do?
Speaker 2 (13:26):
So we were making money every month.
Speaker 3 (13:28):
I was working for my startup, and my husband was
consulting and working for his company.
Speaker 2 (13:32):
And we were mid.
Speaker 3 (13:33):
Forties, professionals of graduate degrees, you know, really in the
heart of our career. We were making a good living
and so we were able to for a while, you know,
pay for pay for our lives with.
Speaker 2 (13:44):
What we were earning month to month.
Speaker 3 (13:47):
Then our legal fees got too big to do that.
We've spent over three million dollars in legal fees. And
which is I can't it's mind blowing, but sort a
certain point, about five months after the government took our
bank accounts, I said to my husband, we have to
sell our house.
Speaker 2 (14:05):
We owned a home in Seattle, and.
Speaker 3 (14:06):
I said, we have to sell it, and we have
to sell it really quickly or we won't be able
to pay lawyers.
Speaker 2 (14:10):
And so we did that. I called our realtor, who'd
helped us buy the house.
Speaker 3 (14:15):
It was the first house we'd ever bought, put down
ten percent because we couldn't afford the twenty percent down
payment at the time. And she was really helpful and kind,
and we packed five bags for all six of us.
Speaker 2 (14:27):
We put everything else in storage.
Speaker 3 (14:29):
And we got in our minivan and drove away to
my sister's house in California and stayed with her and
her family and our household. And that gave us enough
money to pay for the next part of life and lawyers,
and then.
Speaker 2 (14:46):
Yeah, a lot of things. Eventually, I had to take
a job.
Speaker 3 (14:48):
I had to leave my company and take a job
in a different state, away from my four daughters in
order to pay our legal bills and keep our family going.
But we just we just did every single thing you could.
We raised money, we borrowed money, everything.
Speaker 1 (15:02):
And your mom, I was reading your mom told you
when you were so I guess in shock and crushed
at the beginning, and defeated and depressed. I imagine your
mom told you to fight.
Speaker 2 (15:14):
Oh she did.
Speaker 3 (15:15):
Yeah, my mom is the most amazing woman. She paid
her way through college working as a janitor and did
a bunch of other things. And you know she called
me and it was all during COVID, right, So this
is this all started in the April of twenty twenty,
right when COVID was exploding and the lockdowns were happening.
So I couldn't see my parents who they were in
Ohio and I was in Seattle, and I knew my
(15:37):
mom was just dying kind of watching this happen across
the country and not able to help. And my parents
couldn't help financially, they don't have the means to do that.
But you know, my mother facetimed me one day and
I was literally sitting on my bathroom floor, I think,
just hiding from my reality, and she said, you've got
to get up. You've got to get up, and you
got to fight because not just for your kids, not
(15:57):
just for yourself, but for your husband. Like, get up,
you know how to do this.
Speaker 2 (16:01):
Get up?
Speaker 1 (16:02):
Wow? And you did. You got up, and you decided
you were going to put this all out on TikTok
and you didn't ask anyone. You just turned on your
phone and started talking about the truth of what had
happened to one family in America. And it's kind of
an unbelievable truth that you know Amazon, Why does Amazon
(16:26):
have so much power?
Speaker 3 (16:30):
So I did eventually decide to tell the story. And
I think, you know, storytelling is incredibly important, right We
live and die by the stories of hear you know,
it's people falling in love, companies being built like these
are the things that inspire us and make us feel
And I felt so alone when I felt like I
couldn't tell anybody what was happening. But there is a
(16:50):
sense of you're accused of a crime in America that
you're supposed to be quiet. But my husband's case, like
we knew what happened. You know, he wasn't afraid of
the truth. I wasn't afraid of the truth, and so
I felt that it was the most powerful thing to
do would be to share the story, because when you're silent,
I think people assume that you're you're guilty of something.
Speaker 2 (17:08):
And I thought the best person as hell the story would.
Speaker 3 (17:12):
Be me because I knew it and because I was
living it, and because in today's world, we all have
the ability to get out there and stand up and
tell our truth and maybe someone will listen, maybe they won't.
I mean, I you know, I've been on Instagram for
a very long time and have a following of around
twenty five thousand people. And I had never been on TikTok.
Speaker 2 (17:30):
I watched it. I thought it was a dancing app.
Speaker 1 (17:32):
But you know what me too. At the beginning, I
totally thought that, like, why would I want to go
on there and dance? I don't want to dance, you.
Speaker 3 (17:39):
Know, I can't really dance talking about the FBI raids
of my home. But like, but wonderous, I don't want
screw it.
Speaker 2 (17:46):
I'm just going to go on there.
Speaker 3 (17:47):
And I think my first video was like, I'm just
going to share the story of what happened to my family,
and I just talked into the camera and people really
started to listen, and that was remarkable to me, and
it made me feel so much less alone, which was
really I mean, but I think you know the question
you asked of why does Amazons have.
Speaker 2 (18:04):
So much power? Amazon is a behemoth. It's in every
part of our lives.
Speaker 3 (18:09):
And Amazon has billions of dollars in contracts with the
federal government.
Speaker 2 (18:15):
And listen, I'm not a conspiracy theorist. I was deeply.
Speaker 3 (18:18):
Involved in politics for most of my life. I was
on Barack Obama's National Finance Committee. I worked for Jimmy
Carter on elections around the world. I am like a
tried and true progressive in sometimes I hear that things
coming out of my mouth and I'm like, oh, you
sound like a right wing conspiracy theorist, and I'm not.
But Amazon has very close relationships with many federal government institutions.
Speaker 1 (18:39):
Which is so obvious with your story. Yeah, it's almost
like they got to call up and say, we're going
to lose billions unless we can get this guy to break,
So let's do everything to break him and his family
to you know, didn't they threaten to come and have
your husband arrested and taken out in cuffs in front
of your four girls.
Speaker 2 (19:00):
Yeah, over and over and over again.
Speaker 3 (19:02):
I mean they, I mean, and they like they There
was one moment where, like, you know, they subpoenaed are
We were very fortunate in fivilege that we had in
home childcare because we had four little kids and my
husband and I both worked, and at a certain point
the DOJ sabpoenad our former nanny who we paid over
(19:24):
the table and paid you know, payroll taxes for through
an LLC, because if we hadn't that would have been
a pressure tactic because they could have said, we'll charge
Amy Nelson with the crime along with their husband because
of false tax filings.
Speaker 1 (19:37):
Right, it's scary. It's so scary to think that this
is the reality and that you would have this occur
and continue to occur to this day. It's still going on.
Speaker 2 (19:52):
It is.
Speaker 3 (19:52):
When Amazon couldn't get criminal charges against my husband, they
then sued him, and a federal judge recently throughout Amazon's
claims saying my husband hadn't committed to racketeering. I mean
they literally said my husband was like a mafia racketeer guy,
you know under the rout Go Act.
Speaker 2 (20:10):
And the judge said that's not true.
Speaker 3 (20:12):
And they said my husband hadn't even violated his employment contract.
And the judge throughout all these claims before a civil trial.
So imagine that the dj was trying to get my
husband to plead guilty to a crime for years based
on Amazon's allegations that a federal judge said couldn't survive
to a civil trial. Jury didn't need it, didn't even
need to hear it.
Speaker 2 (20:33):
Wow.
Speaker 1 (20:34):
Yeah, Now what did this do to your marriage? And
what did this do to your mental state? For both
you, your husband and your girls. What what What has the
damaging effects been emotionally?
Speaker 2 (20:48):
Yeah, that's a hard one.
Speaker 3 (20:50):
I mean, I think part of it it's hard to
answer in some ways because it is still happening, and
so you don't really know how the trauma has impacted
you while you're still in it, right, But I mean
it's been almost impossible to deal with. I mean I
have been I always kind of pride myself. I'm like, oh,
(21:11):
I would have survived really well in eighteen hundreds. I'm
very sturdy and you know, I'm a workhorse, and this
really brought me to my knees physically.
Speaker 2 (21:19):
I know, my hair fell out.
Speaker 3 (21:21):
I had grew tumor in my thyroid which I had
to get out, and I just I lost the ability
to like to dream and hope. Right, you're just in
survival mode, Like what is the next thing I can
do to survive the next hour, the next day, the
next week. I can't think beyond that because it's too
scary for my husband, I mean, and also like I
(21:43):
lost jobs because of this, right, Like it's right, and
my husband lost his career, which was so much of
his identity.
Speaker 2 (21:49):
You know, he he just loved what he did.
Speaker 3 (21:52):
He loved building, and he's he is slowly rebuilding his career,
but it took that away from him, and that was
really really hard to watch. As to our marriage, I mean,
I think the stress of raising four little kids while
both working is hard on any marriage when your kids
are little. I mean that alone was really hard. To
layer this on top of it has been heartbreaking. I mean,
(22:15):
I don't know what our marriage is, Rosie, Like, I
love him to death, he loves me, and we've been
on a.
Speaker 2 (22:20):
Battlefield and until we have frot that battlefield.
Speaker 3 (22:24):
Like sometimes, the way I envision it is that I'm
trying to set at dinner table and my husband's trying
to do the dishes, and our little kids are sitting
there and there are like snipers surrounding our house and
we live a normal life and it doesn't feel normal
right right.
Speaker 1 (22:42):
And I see again in the movie version, which I
can see in my head, you know, you could see
those little red lights, you know, from the laser scopes
going on as you go about your life, you know.
I mean, it's just it's shocking to me that they
could get away with this. And maybe that's naivete. But
people now are following your story. You have a lot
(23:03):
of followers, You have people who are very interested in this. Yeah,
wouldn't you think that Amazon would be afraid of the
bad press and that they would try to appease you
and make it all go away and say I'm sorry
and give you, you know, compensations. That's the musical ending
(23:24):
of this, right.
Speaker 3 (23:25):
I think there's like a lot of things here. I
think that Amazon, do you play poker? Yes, okay, so
you know the big stack bully when you get so
many chips, it's just yes, or it doesn't matter, you're
going to win.
Speaker 2 (23:35):
You can bully write like. I think that Amazon thinks
of itself like that.
Speaker 3 (23:39):
Like if you look at what's happening right now with
the Federal Trade Commission and they're going to file an
anti trust lawsuit against Amazon. When companies are facing anti
trust lawsuits, they get to meet with the DOJ and
they can make some concessions. Right, they can be like, well, DJ,
you know, or FTC, like we'll do X, Y or z.
In this situation, Amazon has offered zero concessions. I think
they're like, screw it, we can do what we want Amazon, Right,
(24:01):
and I feel like they think that every step of
the way. And you know, we're not the only family.
That Amazon has done this too, and they've gone after
seller consultants through the Department of Justice with criminal charges.
They've gone after vendors through the Department of Justice of
criminal charges. All are evolving around these allegations that people
are violating internal Amazon policy and so I feel like
(24:23):
they just think they can do this. And I think
right now they're so far into this that like what
are they going to do? And the real estate developer
Brian Watson, you know, because of the allegations they made
and what they've done in the courts, his company, which
had one point seven billion in assets under control, has
been destroyed one point seven billion dollars. So like what happens?
(24:45):
Like what is their endgame? I think about it all
the time, like what are they doing?
Speaker 1 (24:48):
Like what is you know, what are they doing? And
they're just trying to continue business as usual? Is this
something that they do so often that they don't even
think of it anymore as as criminal? Have they become
so empowered by, you know, a government that doesn't tax
them enough and you know, I don't know, it seems
(25:10):
to me that it's the most absurd story you've ever heard,
and how could they get away with it?
Speaker 3 (25:16):
Yeah, And I think, like, I mean, I also think
they're really angry at me, Like they've sent me letters
telling me to like take down my TikTok or else
to some kind of like guys like you pulled the
nuclear option really early and sent the FBI to my
house with guns.
Speaker 2 (25:30):
Like a letter doesn't scare me at this point.
Speaker 3 (25:32):
Cor this in February telling me to take down my
TikTok or else and then I wrote back like no,
and then averywhere.
Speaker 1 (25:38):
Else what I'm not going to get the prime delivery special?
Speaker 3 (25:43):
But I think that like they just they you know,
like if you go back to the beginning of this,
I didn't know this, but I'd like taken a deep
dive into this. Ninety eight point two percent of Americans
who are accused of a federal crime plead guilty.
Speaker 2 (25:55):
They played the odds.
Speaker 1 (25:56):
Ninety eight point two percent.
Speaker 3 (25:59):
Well, yeah, Rosie, because if you're accused of tedral crime,
you have to have millions of dollars to fight it.
I mean, that's just a reality, Like you have to
have millions of dollars to survive a criminal trial, Like,
we don't have a fair jury system in America. We
have like a plea bargaining system. Like it's kind of
a farce. The whole thing doesn't make sense. So you
have to have millions of dollars. And there's something called
a trial penalty where if you don't plead and you
(26:20):
take a case to trial, they can put you in
prison for much longer. They can penalize you for exercising
your right to a jury trial.
Speaker 1 (26:31):
Wow. Yeah, wow, So what is what is your end game?
I would love to hear that you're going to make
this into a podcast on its own, just this topic,
because it's it's so compelling amy and it's so outlandishly
overreaching from Amazon and into the DOJ and the FBI.
(26:55):
It's crazy making.
Speaker 3 (26:57):
It is crazy making, And there will be storytelling about
this with some projects that I'm working on, and I
think it's really important to tell the story for a
bunch of different reasons. For me personally, you know, as
somebody who's always worked in politics, like I can't walk
away from this without trying to change something so it
doesn't happen to other people.
Speaker 2 (27:17):
And for me, the two.
Speaker 3 (27:17):
Pieces of that are civil forfeiture, I mean just has
to go. We should not be able to take money
on the suspicion of a crime. It particularly impacts folks
of color and immigrants, not not white people like me.
It disproportionately impacts people who don't look like me. And
it's devastating. And you know, if your money, your home
is taken by civil forfeiture, you have to pay lawyers
(27:39):
to fight to get it back. It's a ridiculous system.
We don't need it. Like back in the time of pirates, fine,
the ship went away, it was hard to find. But
like we live in an age where you can find
anybody anywhere. You know how to get them, like, you
don't need to take their money before you prove a crime.
And then second, I really think that you know, in
my husband's situation, Amazon hired former federal prosecutors from the
(28:00):
Eastern District of Virginia to go and lobby their former
colleagues who are still prosecutors in the Eastern District of Virginia.
Speaker 2 (28:06):
And that has got to stop. That is not open.
Speaker 3 (28:08):
And Amazon has hired hundreds of former prosecutors, so they
have this in everywhere across the country and like, I
don't have that in so they're gonna you know, they're
listening to Amazon. Like my husband didn't ever even get
the chance to talk to the prosecutors.
Speaker 2 (28:21):
They just listened to Amazon and believe them.
Speaker 1 (28:24):
Wow. Wow, So the next steps for your family, the
next steps you're kind of waiting in at their mercy.
Speaker 3 (28:33):
Amazon lost against my husband in federal court, and so
Amazon is now appealing that. So we have to go
through that whole process where they appeal what they lost,
which means Amazon will spend many more millions of dollars
to do that. I think that Amazon has spent over
fifty million dollars on lawyers, and that's holy shit. And
like the weird thing about it is, this is about
(28:55):
something that a federal judge said, Amazon hasn't proven a
dollar of damages about, Like Amazon, this is all about
some real estate. Amazon kept all the real estate. They're
selling cloud computing from it and making billions of dollars.
So like they've benefited from what they say was a crime.
So it's super bizarre what they're doing. But so we
wait for the appeal and then you know, my husband
(29:16):
has already sued Amazon in Washington State and one part
of it, and I'm sure he'll continue that lawsuit once
Amazon's appeal is over. You know, I think I've been
very much injured, and so I have my four daughters,
and I really want my daughters to have a voice
in this.
Speaker 1 (29:29):
Yes, you know, so how do they talk about it?
Speaker 3 (29:34):
So it's you know, it's interesting. They were so young
when it started. And my littlest is just four now,
but this has been her whole life. But she doesn't
have any comprehension of it yet that I know. But
my oldest daughter, Sloan is nine now, and she knows enough.
And one day she asked me. She said, Mom, I
is said, okay to hate someone. I said, why are
(29:55):
you asking that, Sloan? She was, I think I hate
Jeff Bezos And I said, you know, hates a really
strong word, but i'd like to talk.
Speaker 1 (30:05):
About Wow, Mom, that took a lot of restraint. I
would have said, yes him, we can hate. That's what
I totally would have said.
Speaker 3 (30:14):
But I said, you know, I think I can understand
why you would feel that way. I said, I hate him.
I'll be honest with you, but I'd like to talk
about why you feel that way, and we talked about it,
and you know, she knows that Jeff Bezos had a
company that was trying to put her daddy in jail,
and that's a bit, that's a heavy thing for a
nine year.
Speaker 1 (30:34):
Old totally, and imagine how terrified she is of the
possibility that that's going to happen. Imagine what it does
to the safety and psyche of your home when armed
guards come in, you know, swat team. What does that
do to a baby's sense of life and safety?
Speaker 3 (30:52):
I mean, I hope they feel as safe as they can,
because all I've ever told them when we talk about
it is like mommy and Daddy will fight as hard
as they can and as long as they can to
keep you safe because because we know the truth, and
it's really important to fight for the truth. And you know,
their grandparents believe that we all like that is this
is how I was raised, It's how they'll be raised.
Speaker 2 (31:10):
And you know it's important for them to.
Speaker 3 (31:12):
See it, but it is true, like when you lose
that sense of safety, it is incredibly, incredibly hard. And
one thing that was really important to me in fighting back.
And I hope my girls see this because you know,
their names got dragged into this. My name got dragged
in my husband's name, right like Amazon named all these people.
And what Amazon wanted to do is say, but we're
(31:34):
just Amazon. But Amazon technically has done nothing to me.
And I've tried to explain that to my daughters. Amazon
didn't do anything to you. Amazon is a logo. People
did this to you. Human beings with names. And it's
not just Jeff Bezos. It's the current CEO, Andy Jassey,
It's the general counsel David Sapolski, it's the lawyers Matt
jadin U see Omar. You know, they have names, and
(31:55):
these names are in public quort documents that Amazon has
put into the world, and those people are responsible. Those
people have families. Have they ever thought about what it's
like for us to be asked? Have they ever thought
about my daughters and whether they can sleep at night?
Speaker 1 (32:10):
I would say no. I would say no. I think
you know, when a company or a person becomes a
multi billionaire, their soul leaves their body. It's almost as
though if you measure in money for long enough, you
will be swallowed by it whole. You know it. It
(32:31):
amazes me the power that these billionaires have, and it's
very depressing.
Speaker 3 (32:42):
It's so depressing, and then like you see these like
people profiles where it's like Lauren Sanchez steps out in
a glowing literary dress with her ten billion carrot engagement ring,
and you're like, why is that news?
Speaker 2 (32:54):
Right?
Speaker 1 (32:54):
Why?
Speaker 2 (32:54):
Why are we Why are we so obsessed with this?
Speaker 1 (32:58):
Right?
Speaker 3 (32:58):
Because the obsession with it gives it the power in
the fuel. And I can assure you that the billionaires, yeah,
don't care about us.
Speaker 2 (33:05):
So it's just it's a weird. It's a weird.
Speaker 1 (33:08):
I think that they just are so removed from humanity.
They're so removed, you know, and people will say this
about me, I'm a millionaire, right, am I removed from humanity?
I guess in some ways I definitely am.
Speaker 3 (33:21):
But I think that like it is this thing too,
right that you're still here sharing stories like you did
on the show, right, And that's giving voice to people,
And that's something that I think it could. It has
to prevent you from being completely disconnected because you're you're listening,
and to your point, like with billionaires, they just don't listen,
they're not you know, they're kind of like I think
(33:41):
they can ice themselves up because no one wants to
have set Jeff Bezos that makes a lot of money
off of him.
Speaker 2 (33:46):
No one's going to sit down and tell him the truth,
right like that.
Speaker 3 (33:49):
I know, I've I've worked, I've been around other billionaires,
and like, I think it's a similar thing, right that,
Like people are just like a pee, like the court
gesters in a way like appease the guy. It's always
I've always been men in that capacity, like appease the guy, right,
Like what does he need? What will make him happy?
How do we give him what he wants? Because then
we'll get we want right and so.
Speaker 1 (34:08):
Right right and what you know, and when everyone starts
doing that around you, even though you don't think they are,
they are, you know they are. But but if that
becomes the way people interact with you, you start to feel
kind of a lofty disconnection. I'd imagine, right, and uh
an ability to sort of think only of yourself, you know, yeah, I.
Speaker 3 (34:29):
Mean I think that would be exactly where you'd end up.
I as think it's funny and like it's particularly American.
We always talk about like Russian oligarchs and an oligarch. Right,
it is like I'm a person of extreme wealth who's
very close to the government. And I'm like, guys, like
we might have that same issue here in America.
Speaker 1 (34:44):
Yeah, yeah, exactly.
Speaker 3 (34:46):
We don't ever want to admit that Elon Musk is
a ton of ties to the American governments all like Starlink,
like he like has some sway over what's happening in
Ukraine with his satellites, Like that is wild. He is
a man, right, He's a man who can sway geopolitical issues.
Speaker 2 (35:04):
It doesn't even make any.
Speaker 1 (35:05):
Sense, No, it really doesn't.
Speaker 3 (35:08):
It's so easy to be such a hero when you
have that much money, and yet none of them are
and that is so weird, and we don't demand it.
Speaker 2 (35:17):
We don't ask that were like, let.
Speaker 1 (35:18):
No, I mean, can you can you think of one
billionaire philanthropist that it does give billions away? I don't know,
can you think of one?
Speaker 2 (35:27):
I mean, other than Mackenzie Scott?
Speaker 1 (35:29):
No, yeah, other than her? No? And I love what
she's doing. I think all the more power to her,
you know, Yeah.
Speaker 3 (35:35):
I mean I think like the Gates Foundation has done
a lot in the world, but it is so it's
the Gates Foundation to the point of like naming things.
Speaker 2 (35:41):
It's the Gates Foundation, and it's.
Speaker 3 (35:42):
Their work, right, Like it's their work. It's not just
giving it to people who are doing the good work.
I mean, there are so many charities in this country
doing so many good things.
Speaker 4 (35:52):
And well with experts. Yeah, just I don't know. It's
weirdo boy, and it's really weird. What the what is
the platform you're going to use to do this podcast thing?
Speaker 1 (36:05):
Do you know yet? Or is it too early to talk?
Speaker 2 (36:07):
Too early to talk about it? Okay, oh, that'd be great.
Speaker 3 (36:09):
And then I'm also I have a I have a
book proposal out right now, which is fantastic.
Speaker 2 (36:15):
Yeah, so it's a.
Speaker 3 (36:18):
I'm excited about it, worked on it for a long time,
and I think it's the right time to start telling
the story in a book as well.
Speaker 1 (36:25):
Well. I think that would be wonderful. And I can
see you selling the rights and hopefully getting some of
the money that you uh, you know, spent on this
catastrophe of your life. This no charges ever against your
husband and four years of hell and harassment from the
DOJ and the lawyers of Amazon. It makes no sense
(36:47):
in uh, in my mind, you know.
Speaker 3 (36:50):
It really doesn't. I would say the one thing that
I think has been helpful. I really learned though that
I wish other people could learn.
Speaker 2 (36:56):
I would.
Speaker 3 (36:56):
I hope people don't have to learn it, but if
they had to, is that you know, it can be
really terrifying to use your voice with really powerful people
and institutions are coming at you. But if you have
the truth, like you can use your voice, and you should.
And that is the remarkable thing about TikTok.
Speaker 1 (37:12):
I think, I agree. There are so many, you know,
instances where women don't get voice of a microphone. You know,
they don't get the chance to. If you have access
to a microphone and you're somehow in the public eye,
use it, even if that's TikTok. Only use it. So
say what your your piece, say what you feel needs
(37:34):
to be said. What's happening, you know, I mean, authenticity
and truth have been so damaged in the last you know,
ten years and maybe even more. And I think it's
all people crave, it's all humans need. It's all that
we really want, but we haven't known where to get
(37:57):
it or how to get it yet.
Speaker 3 (37:59):
Yeah, I think that's completely right. And I think, you know,
it's made worse by the fact that, like the news
is hard to digest and you you don't know if
you're ever really getting the story. And I think that,
you know, the ability to tell your own story is
a remarkable thing. I think about the Violet Revolution, how
Twitter allowed that.
Speaker 2 (38:18):
To happen in twenty.
Speaker 3 (38:18):
Elevens by allowing people to gather together, and I think that,
you know, social media has given us all a voice
and it's it's a remarkable thing.
Speaker 2 (38:26):
TikTok is, it's an incredible platform.
Speaker 1 (38:29):
Well, and I'm so glad to have met you on there.
I feel like i'm your friend that when I see
you pop up, I'm always like leaving a little comment
like keep going because you know you're you're a really
remarkable woman, Amy or you should be played by Jennifer
Garner as it goes to a series and you know,
kick ass like Alias. You know what I'm saying, Like,
(38:49):
I'd love for you, like to get into training and
become an MMA star and become the champion and then
fight Jeff Bezos. So exactly. Well, thank you so much
for coming on this podcast, and I will totally totally
look forward to whatever truth you want to put out
(39:11):
there in whatever form, because people need to know what's
happened to your family and how it could happen to
them if it could happen to you, And it's pretty terrifying.
And thank you for sharing it and alerting people and
warning people that this is a reality that happens to
people and mostly you never hear about it.
Speaker 3 (39:32):
Thank you so much, Rosie. It means the world that
you've listened and that you have me on today.
Speaker 1 (39:37):
Well my pleasure, Amy Nelson. Find her on TikTok. Ladies
and gentlemen. We will be back with questions right after
this Isn't that insane? Can you even believe that happened
(40:07):
to this family and it's still happening. I would like
to add that since we tape this podcast, the government,
supported by seventeen state attorneys general, finally filed a long
awaited antitrust lawsuit against Amazon. That's right, they're saying it's
a monopoly. The government alleged that the etailer uses a
(40:28):
set of interlocking, anti competitive and unfair strategies to illegally
maintain its monopoly power. Wow. That is a huge thing
for us as a nation and a huge thing for
Amy Nelson and her family. We are definitely going to
have her on again and do a follow up when
(40:49):
this is all finally resolved for her, and I hope
she gets to file her own lawsuit against Amazon and
Jeff Bezos for what they have done to her family.
That's just a little personally anecdote right there. Okay, now
we have some questions and comments from you, the loyal listeners.
Thank you so much. I think we have two today.
I haven't heard them. I never do. We just go
(41:11):
for it as we go for it, and go ahead,
go for it.
Speaker 5 (41:14):
Hi, Rosie, my name is Annie. I'm from Quebec, Canada.
I just want to tell you that it's a couple
of times now that I watch your show that I
listened to your podcast with the Doctor Rosen and about
we Go videos and pick and everything, and it really
changed the way I think about it. I mightpy you
did that because you're doing your service to people, because
(41:36):
nobody in around me talks about these things. I tak
ozempic for like six months now. I lost like thirty
six pounds about a pound a week, which is very good.
And it changed my life. But not just because it
my weight is lower on the scale. It's because it
changed my life. I can move more. I don't think
about food. But I realized that when I listen to you,
(41:59):
and I listened to the episode like for the fourth
time today because I was taking a walk and listening
it to it again, and I was thinking, my god,
nobody explained it like that to me, and it really
changed something inside me that I accept myself more because
I was thinking that I was doing the taking the
(42:21):
easy way, taking ozembic. But it's not that. It's just
the way it's working for my body. I have the
freaking thrifty gene and nothing will change for me. I'm
almost fifty now and it's changing my life and I'm
so happy and I'm a new person. And I'm happy
to see that you talk about it, because if you
(42:44):
talk about it, other people will understand that it's not
a question of laziness. It's a question of being ready
to change your life. And obesity is an illness like
any other any other illness. If you have a cancer,
you're going to take medication, but it's the same thing
(43:05):
if you're a beast. You need the medication to help you.
It's changing my life and I find it amazing. So
I just want to thank you because I was looking
for ways to talk to you because it really changed
my life and I just wanted you to know, so
I have a good day. Goodbye.
Speaker 1 (43:21):
First of all, what a beautiful message. And second of all,
I love your accent. I really love your accent. I
could listen to you all day. But yes, I mean
I have been on Munjaro since December and it's changed
my life too, Honey. You know what, I'm going to
be sixty two in March, and I fought with Waite
(43:42):
my whole life, my whole family, my extended family. Everyone
has the O'Donnell shape, the big beer belly kind of
and but you know, you always felt like something was
wrong with you, and you were lazy, and you had
a will power, and it's you do a real big
job of beating yourself up if you're an overweight person
(44:03):
in this world, because societal stigma is still so prevalent
and so intense, and I think the truth is what
people want and need, and self love is part of
the journey of healing. And I think anyone who says
that taking munjarro or any of these drugs is the
(44:25):
easy way out is lying or doesn't understand or is
lacking the compassion that one would hope you are able
to give yourself. So thank you. I would love to
talk to you about it. And I think this drug
is going to be used to help millions more people,
not just people with diabetes and obesity, which is a disease.
(44:46):
So thank you, thank you, thank you. All Right, do
we have another one? The last one for the day,
and then we're done? Hit it?
Speaker 6 (44:57):
Hi, Rosie. This is Nick from Chicago. I'm a longtime
fan and first time caller. I had to call because
I am turning forty this year and my husband had
asked what did I want for my birthday, and the
only thing I could think of was I wanted a
Rosie O'Donnell showcake. So next weekend, I turned forty on
(45:17):
October thirteenth, and I am getting my Rosie cake. I
can't wait to see it. I have no idea what
it's going to look like, but I am thrilled. And
the reason that is is because your show has meant
so much to me. Not only in the years that
I would run home from school watching it after school
and learning about Broadway and learning about TV and New
York life and all the things, but it taught me
(45:40):
so much about empathy and doing good for others with
all the super kids always being charitable with no matter
if you had a little or if you had a lot,
but just always looking out for others. And it's really
paved away from me in life to be what I
would consider it a good person. I just can't thank
(46:01):
you enough. And I had the opportunity to see your
show in Chicago when you were here, and it was
such a thrill and just a dream to finally see
you do a show in person and everything, and it
was just a thrill. And then to have you living
in Chicago was even better. It was just awesome. So
thank you for everything. You've meant so much to me.
And my question for today is with the Rossi O'Donnell show,
(46:25):
I was curious if you have any props or any
of the set pieces that were part of it. This
set was such an integral part to that show and
just set the tone and was so fun and it
just even when the desks were being switched out after
any Lasagna won the trivia contest, it was just a
ball to see what was going to happen next, and
it was always just such a familiar, happy place. So
(46:48):
I would love to hear if you have anything, love you,
and thanks again for everything.
Speaker 1 (46:53):
That is the sweetest. You are the sweetest, and happy
birthday to you. That's such a it's so it's unbelo
be to be my age and have lived my life
and to get to hear comments like this. I have
to say, I always tell the producers it sounds like
I'm picking the questions because they're all so nice. So
(47:14):
I'm like, you know, it can't be they're all nice,
but they are. You're all nice, So thank you for that.
You're all nice. You know. I don't have anything from
the actual set. I didn't keep that stuff. I have
specific things that people gave me. I have an amazing,
(47:36):
amazing scrap book that has every letter of every celebrity
who wrote me when the show premiered, and it is
unbelievable to read through Bob Hope and you know, Carol Channing,
and it's just it's hard to believe that it's even
my life. I have to say, I'm so glad it
affected you in such a positive way. I'm so glad
(47:57):
that you sound like such an empathy, kind hearted person
and that you credit me with any of that. I
beg to differ, but I thank you for what your
words mean to me. Thank you for saying them and
for leaving the message, and thank you for loving with
a big heart. I appreciate it. Hey, keep these questions
(48:21):
and comments coming. Suggestions, all your thoughts and opinions to
onward Rosie at gmail dot com. That's onward Rosie at
gmail dot com. Next week, right here, my friend, the
magical singer songwriter Sophie B. Hawkins joins me for a
wild and fun conversation. She's got a brand new album out,
(48:43):
she's been touring, and she's a pretty enchanted human. Sophie B.
Hawkins next week right here. Thanks, byebye,
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