Black Music Month QLS Classic: Dyana Williams

For Black Music Month, Questlove Supreme is doing a special 30 days of programming from the QLS archives and new episodes alike. There is no place to begin than the Godmother of Black music, Dyana Williams. In this 2020 conversation, Dyana talks about growing up in the Bronx, getting her start in radio as Ebony Moonbeams, and coaching artists like Kanye West, Lil' Kim, and Dave Matthews Band. QLS celebrates Black Music all year, but join us in this honorary programming series.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Quest Love Supreme is a production of iHeartRadio. This classic
episode was produced by the team at Pandora.

Speaker 2 (00:09):
What up, y'all is Layah from Team Supreme. Okay, So
it's June, and you know it is Black Music Month. Now,
This month and its cause was started by my godmother,
Dianna Williams, the legendary Kenny Gamble, and the great and
right back in nineteen seventy nine after being invited to
the White House along with the Black Music Association. Now,
the Black Music Association was a group of black folks

(00:31):
that were the best of the best of the music industry.
I'm talking record execs, I'm talking radio people, I'm talking artists.
I'm talking to everybody from Clarence Avon and Frankie Crocker
to Percy Sutton, everybody in the middle right. So they
all get invited to this big party on the White
House lawn June seventh, nineteen seventy nine. And before the
performances started, President Carter said many things addressing and reminding

(00:53):
people of the importance of Black Music Month, and one
of the things he said was end quote in many ways,
the feelings of our own black citizens throughout the history
of our country has been accurately expressed in the music,
and it presents a kind of history of our nation
when you go back and see.

Speaker 3 (01:09):
The evolution of black music words.

Speaker 2 (01:13):
So we've spoken a lot about Black Music Month on
Questlove Supreme, and this June we are running a different
episode from the QLs archives every single day in the name,
Spirit and Cause of Black Music Month. We're kicking things
off with the Godmother, herself, mine and yours. I'm talking
about Miss Dianna Williams.

Speaker 4 (01:33):
Now.

Speaker 2 (01:33):
This is from our twenty nineteen conversation live in person
at Larry Gold Studios.

Speaker 5 (01:40):
Enjoy Suprima Sun Sun Supremo Role called Subprima Sun sub
Prie Mo Role call Supremeau Sun Suprema roll call Supremo

(02:02):
Sun Sun Up Breme my roll.

Speaker 4 (02:04):
What's love in the place?

Speaker 2 (02:06):
Yeah?

Speaker 4 (02:06):
With the end and the fan Yeah, is that so cool?

Speaker 6 (02:10):
Yeah?

Speaker 4 (02:10):
I am Supreme, Roll came up, Brave Up Supremo role.
My name is Fante, Yeah, and I can say our
hung Yeah with that beautiful lady. Yeah from Unsung Roll Up.

Speaker 5 (02:29):
Brave Son Supreme roll called Suprema Sun Sun.

Speaker 7 (02:35):
Supreme A roll call.

Speaker 8 (02:36):
My name is Sugar, Yeah, and I hope that one day. Yeah,
I can be a guest. Yeah on Soulful Sunday Up.

Speaker 5 (02:45):
Brave Supreme Roll Supreme, Supreme Role.

Speaker 9 (02:52):
My name is Bill, Yeah to the extreme. Yeah, oh
well that's with Yeah every moonbeas.

Speaker 4 (03:01):
Suprema Son Supremo.

Speaker 5 (03:03):
Roll called Suprema Son Son Supremo.

Speaker 4 (03:07):
Roll called Bill.

Speaker 2 (03:10):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (03:10):
And here's the thing.

Speaker 8 (03:12):
Yeah, last night, Yeah, too many Chicken.

Speaker 4 (03:19):
Supremo. Roll call Suprema So Supremo.

Speaker 3 (03:23):
Roll call.

Speaker 2 (03:24):
It's like yeah, and my god mother Dianna, Yeah mother
black music mom.

Speaker 3 (03:30):
Yeah, nobody knows it better.

Speaker 5 (03:31):
Roll call Suprema Son Sign Supremo. Roll call Suprema Son
Son Supremo.

Speaker 9 (03:39):
Roll call.

Speaker 10 (03:40):
My name is Dianna, Yeah, not Banana. Yeah, light skinning
like one. Yeah, but I'm Danna.

Speaker 5 (03:47):
Roll So Supremo, roll Suprema So So Suprevo. Roll call
Suprema Son Son Supremo.

Speaker 4 (03:59):
Roll Nice, nice one. Ladies and gentlemen, Welcome to another
episode of Questlove Supreme. We are officially back home. We
are back home, Steve. We are back Steve, back where

(04:23):
we below? How do you feel to be bad?

Speaker 10 (04:24):
Ladies?

Speaker 4 (04:25):
We are live, okay, we are recording right, We are
recording right now at Milk Boy Studio formerly known and
still sort of conduct currently known as the Studio. We
are actually in the room where the lyrics of You
Got Me, the Song that Changed My Life was was recorded.

(04:48):
The vocals were done all the things while a part
vocals were done here, as subsequently every Roots album afterwards,
from Phrenology on down to Rising Down. But we are
in studio A a lot of a lot of Philadelphia history. Wow. Yeah,
in this room smells like yeah PTSD Steve Man.

Speaker 8 (05:07):
I'm telling you, it's gritty here, it's got the grit.

Speaker 9 (05:13):
And this is one of the places that Rich made
me cut vocals like verse like thirty damn times.

Speaker 4 (05:17):
Like it was. Yeah. I told like this it's all
Rich Nichols here.

Speaker 7 (05:21):
Yeah, yeah, this is this is the spirit of the Rich.

Speaker 2 (05:25):
Nichols episode showed me poring in the room. Next you're
first born, not my first, but my first Rich Nichols.

Speaker 7 (05:32):
Oh no, wow, okay, Nate Saturday morning.

Speaker 4 (05:42):
Can we do this right now? We have yes in
the room.

Speaker 7 (05:49):
Oh wait a minute, would you like the honor?

Speaker 2 (05:54):
Ya?

Speaker 10 (05:55):
Don't do that to me.

Speaker 3 (05:56):
You prepared and you wrote it down.

Speaker 4 (05:57):
I'd have to see.

Speaker 7 (05:59):
I'll come like like, uh what do you call it?

Speaker 10 (06:02):
Uh, you can do the cleanup?

Speaker 3 (06:04):
Can I do it?

Speaker 10 (06:04):
But you have to do the No.

Speaker 4 (06:05):
I think this. I think it's only apropos and and
for you, I agree to introduce our guest today. Okay,
if i'm if, i'm if I'm based on you're talking,
I feel like I feel like this is the chip
off the old block here.

Speaker 3 (06:23):
So yeah, it's a it's a small chip of a
big block.

Speaker 10 (06:27):
How about it.

Speaker 2 (06:27):
I'm the small ship of a blick box. You're gonna
make me be boxes, all right? So, ladies and gentlemen,
boys and girls. The woman who wait, you know what
it is, Deanna.

Speaker 4 (06:38):
You have a way. You have a way to make
everyone who lose their cool. Yo, I'm good over here.

Speaker 3 (06:53):
What it's just me and a mirror.

Speaker 4 (06:55):
I'm literally I feel I can be in the room
with any human being and just be like, no big deal,
President Obama, Michael Jordan's whatever, Stevie and I'll be down
on the second like. But with Deanna, there's there's a
very regal like I always sit up stravery regal collegemen.

(07:25):
All right, So that yeah, this this we we are
in the presence of royalty right now. This is gonna
be the longest introduction ever, the most eloquent when I've
ever done in the.

Speaker 7 (07:38):
History of the show. Yes, exactly from the No.

Speaker 4 (07:47):
Seriously, this woman has history in the city of Philadelphia.
I've I'm in my career took uh uh a. I
can't even talk. It's hard to describe. Have some barriers
and relax, listen, start with your you can start with

(08:12):
that way. I will. Yeah, I will say that I first,
my my first real entrance into the non nepotism Le
Andrews world that I came from, really started with I
am and interning.

Speaker 2 (08:24):
And network International Association of African American Music.

Speaker 4 (08:27):
Yes, she wow, she is about No one know what
I am. You're talking about NAS album?

Speaker 7 (08:33):
Yes, where is this going?

Speaker 4 (08:38):
Oh my god, I'm not gonna let it be ten
minutes before I say, Ladies and jon.

Speaker 10 (08:46):
I'm thrilled and honored to be with you and Radio
Legend officially welcome you to the city of brotherly love
sisterly affects.

Speaker 3 (08:54):
So she also coined that term.

Speaker 2 (08:56):
I forgot to mention that the sisterly affection part. Yes,
animations and things like that.

Speaker 10 (09:02):
Yeah, inclusion right, women have been part of the fabric
of Philadelphia and everywhere every place for as long as.

Speaker 7 (09:11):
I've listened to Philly radio. Right now, her voice is
very soothing.

Speaker 4 (09:15):
Yeah it is.

Speaker 7 (09:17):
I feel like she's going to turn around and interview
us any moments.

Speaker 10 (09:22):
It's discourse, it's conversation with human exchange.

Speaker 4 (09:26):
Always spoke. I was about to say, the one area
that you have not affected is because sometimes you clean
up for a company and then you're like the Lenny
Kravits episode, which yeah, god for we did get which
we did that one episode.

Speaker 7 (09:45):
You cleaned up nicely, you know. But I'm just saying that.

Speaker 2 (09:49):
It was.

Speaker 6 (09:52):
Right.

Speaker 10 (09:53):
Sound like whatever I raised right there, she.

Speaker 4 (09:58):
Knew when when this voice come to be? When did you?
I feel like you're always in regal honey milk. I
feel like the term honey milk or whatever.

Speaker 10 (10:12):
No, that's not what my lover says when we're fighting,
not at all.

Speaker 2 (10:19):
No.

Speaker 10 (10:21):
I grew up, first of all. I'll take you back
to the beginning. I was born in Queens, raised as
a small young girl in the Bronx and ten my
family moved to Puerto Rico. My mother's Puerto Rican. I'm
half Puerto Rican, so my mother was a college professor
So we moved to pr to bayamong which is where

(10:42):
a lot of my family is, and I spent two
years perfecting my non Spanish, my new Yurekan Spanish.

Speaker 4 (10:50):
So you had a new Yurekan voice.

Speaker 10 (10:52):
Uh well, well no, just no accent if you're talking
about I read it, write it, and speak it. And
I learned to do that. I learned how to speak it.
I learned Spanish before I learned English because my mother
was in school, my father was working, but my grandmother,
who spoke no English whatsoever, was my caretaker. So I

(11:14):
learned Spanish before I learned English, or probably simultaneously. And
it's mom, my mother's mom. My maternal side of the
family is Puerto Rican. My father's from Culpeper. My father
has transitioned, but my people were from Culpeper, Virginia. So yeah, Spanish, English,
but New York. And then when we moved back to
the States, I grew up in Harlem as a teenager.

(11:37):
So I was informed by this amazing upbringing that I
had in New York, a cosmopolitan city with people from
all you know, spectrums, all parts of the world, and
all social economic backgrounds. So my, when I consider my formulation,

(11:57):
my development. It's as a result of being in this
gumbo of humanity in New York City.

Speaker 7 (12:04):
You were how old when you came back to I
was about.

Speaker 10 (12:07):
Twelve twelve, So I spent my formative teenage years in Harlem,
the Schomberg And I have a.

Speaker 4 (12:14):
Question the hollow. Yes, okay, I'm curbly I have I'm
currently working on a project right now that I didn't
even know existed until about a year ago. But the
world doesn't seem to know.

Speaker 2 (12:35):
That.

Speaker 4 (12:36):
On the summer of nineteen sixty nine, a festival was
thrown in Harlem with I mean, in short, we called
it black Woodstock. It was Nina Simone, sly On, the
Family Stone, the Stables, singers, Jesse Jackson. Literally like when
you see the footage, it's forty thousand people in a

(12:58):
Harlem park in the summer of sixty nine.

Speaker 10 (13:01):
Was it Mount Morris Park?

Speaker 4 (13:03):
Yep?

Speaker 10 (13:03):
Mount Morris Park?

Speaker 4 (13:04):
Yes, okay, I recollection of Mount Morris Park that period.

Speaker 10 (13:09):
And well no, sixty nine, No, but Mount Morris Park absolutely,
because I spent many times there for free concerts. Really yeah, absolutely?

Speaker 4 (13:20):
What was the environment musically in Harlem? Like, because I
mean as much as I hear about the folklore of Harlem,
not even in the jazz since but post jazz, I
don't have a feel of what the culture was like
it was.

Speaker 10 (13:41):
I mean, we're talking about the birthplace of the Harlem Renaissance.
Harlem has always been a capital, a mecca of music
and culture. So I grew up hearing music everywhere in Harlem.
It was blasting out of people's radios, in their cars
and their homes, the free concerts. I had a program
in Harlem called Jazzmobile that was founded by are you

(14:03):
familiar with this doctor? Billy Taylor was the founder of
Jazzmobile and it provided free lessons to inner city youth.
So for me, I studied the flute and my teacher
was the legendary Jimmy Heath. What yes, Yes, Jimmy Heath
was my flute teacher. And ironically, years later I ran

(14:28):
into him in Saint Louis. He was with his brothers,
the Heath brothers. Yeah, and he was We were in
the Ritz Carlton. I was there to attend Steve mckeever's wedding.
Steve mckever, the founder of Hidden Beach who signed Jill
Scott and many others from Philadelphia.

Speaker 4 (14:44):
Kindred such a radio person, I wouldn't have trying to
get you there.

Speaker 10 (14:48):
That's okay. So anyway, I saw Jimmy, and Jimmy calls
me over and he says to his brothers, Deanna was
my best student.

Speaker 2 (14:57):
I wanted to bore a whole go through the floor
because I am so bad, horrible, talent less. You probably
was the prettiest, well lovely, but honey, I could not.
You know, you have to be able to improvise, and
I just did not have those skills.

Speaker 10 (15:13):
I had an appreciation of sensitivity, a passion for the music,
but I just don't have any talent.

Speaker 7 (15:20):
So I always hear about.

Speaker 4 (15:23):
Maybe like from the generation that came before I came up,
and I guess, like, I'm I'm one of the last
people that like the idea of like music appreciation and
who knows what this uh instrument it is? And oh,
I want to try that a viola, you know that
sort of thing. But was it just expected even if
you didn't have musical talent. Was it just expected like

(15:47):
for a non musical person you just saw the flute
and was like, okay, No.

Speaker 10 (15:52):
Actually, my first boyfriend that I lost my virginity too,
from Brooklyn, Lethal he played the flute. So as a
result of being around him in intimate circumstances, one day
I just picked up his instrument. I'mad and I.

Speaker 3 (16:13):
Started remember super class and.

Speaker 10 (16:26):
I'm telling you what happened anyway, That's how I came
to study the flute. Yeah, but interesting, So to your question,
a mirror the question about music. Music and Harlem was everywhere,
and even people who did not have talent or could
play an instrument had an appreciation. We used to when
we got music, we would sit together in a group

(16:50):
and devour an album. We would read the liner notes,
because back in the day everybody did liner notes for
their music. We would read where it was recorded, who
was the engineer, where everything, all of the details the
minutia of a record. Not just did we absorb the music.
Of course, we were smoking weed at that time, okay,

(17:17):
all right, yeah, and we would just we were very
knowledgeable when it came to music. That was expected of us,
especially growing up in Harlem. That was the expectation that
you were down whatever was new coming out, that you
were going to their shows, that you were up on
what was happening musically.

Speaker 4 (17:34):
Do you have any siblings.

Speaker 10 (17:35):
I'm an only child.

Speaker 4 (17:37):
What yeah, cousins.

Speaker 10 (17:43):
Exactly, I've got tons of cousins.

Speaker 4 (17:45):
So how did now this is unusual because usually, uh,
it's the trickle cultural trickle down, a system of the
older sibling puts the youngest one onto something and you
absorb it. So who was your jaddy?

Speaker 8 (18:00):
My father?

Speaker 10 (18:03):
My father played the radio all the time. We listened
to w ABC, the good Guys, and we also listened
to w w r L, which was the African American
AM station. So I grew up hearing, you know, all
the mixed sounds because back in the day when I
grew up, they played black and white artist on w ABC.

(18:23):
But then wwr L only all black music. So that's
where I got my ears. My daddy big on music.

Speaker 2 (18:32):
But the only all black station was the AMWWRL, Yeah,
the AM station.

Speaker 11 (18:37):
Who were the personalities of the day, Well, Enoch Gregory,
just you know, the good guys.

Speaker 10 (18:45):
I can't remember all the names, cousin Bruce. I mean,
there were a ton of radio personalities. But the first
woman that I ever heard on the radio, Vy Higginson.
Vy Higginson, Well, she was on WBLS. Frankie Crocker and
we're talking early seventies because I graduated from high school
seventy one, the year that Marvin Gay released What's Going

(19:10):
On That That is the soundtrack to My Life. That's
the musica Franklin.

Speaker 7 (19:16):
That's what I just came out as you regret because
that was yeah, yeah, yeah, it did.

Speaker 10 (19:20):
That's when it came out.

Speaker 4 (19:21):
Can you imagine going out into the world and wow.
So yeah.

Speaker 10 (19:29):
Then w l I b FM became WBLS and that's
where I heard Vy Higginson. And when I heard her,
I just fell in love. I was enamored with her voice,
her her style. It sounded like you were in her bedroom.
It sounded very intimate, and that's what I went back to.
Absolutely absolutely she.

Speaker 4 (19:49):
Was on air personality.

Speaker 10 (19:50):
Like she was an on air personality. She's still on
the radio now on the station that's online in New
York and what but she was Doris Troy's sister her
and she did the play Mama I Want to Sing.
That's by Higginson who produced it, and Doris Troy just
well and look that was her sister Higginson. Okay, yeah,

(20:13):
And Frankie Crocker. I'm a graduate of Frankie Crocker University,
but I kind.

Speaker 7 (20:18):
Of want to go to school the Frankie Crocker School.

Speaker 4 (20:22):
Okay, So besplaying the magnitude of the power that Frankie
Crocker had on New York and nationwide.

Speaker 10 (20:30):
Frankie Crocker was a radio personality and a programmer. I
would say he was the dean of FM Black Radio
at its at the beginning, and he programmed WBLS one
oh seven point five in New York and later other
stations around the country. But he had the most effortless style,
very commanding presence on the radio, and he introduced New

(20:53):
York audiences to Barry White disco, the sound of Philadelphia.
But he would all so mix and maybe he would
throw in some Frank Sinatra. He could do that because
he was the program director. But it was an eclectic sound,
and he said it was three hundred and sixty degrees
of the total experience of black music. So Frankie Crocker

(21:14):
hired me after I spent two years in Washington, DC
at w h u R ninety six point three, which
is also a very important radio station in the history
of music and black radio because it was the home
of the original Quiet Storm as created by Kathy Hughes,
who is my best friend. Also the founder of Radio one,

(21:36):
TV one Interactive one Urban one. Melvin Lindsay was He
wasn't the first host, but he became. Yeah, there was some.

Speaker 2 (21:44):
There were I think two other hosts. Yeah, also from
BT exactly Video Soul, like our.

Speaker 3 (21:49):
First black celebrities who passed from HIV exactly.

Speaker 10 (21:53):
That's very true, Layah. But Melvioyn was also my protege
because he was a student. Howard University owned the radio station,
but it was a commercial outlet in the middle of
the dial, and Frankie Crocker liberally borrowed from what we
were doing in Washington d C. Okay GC, Yeah, that's

(22:14):
true after a while, but that's where I started as
Ebony Moonbeams at w h U R and d C.
I did not go to Howard. I was very very silly.
I was very caught up. I was hired on the
eve of my nineteenth birthday by a gentleman named Bob
Nighthawk Terry, who's also another legendary if you saw the

(22:36):
movie Talk to Me Labasaid's character. But that was the
gentleman who hired me and gave me my break in
radio in d C. So two years after being Ebny
Moonbeams and being in DC, I got a call on
the hotline from Frankie Crocker offering me a job first
in Saint Louis. That didn't work out too well. I

(22:57):
went to Saint Louis. In all due respect to Saint Louis,
it was just too small for me. Okay, it just wasn't.

Speaker 2 (23:03):
Man.

Speaker 10 (23:03):
My mama went with me and she was like, oh,
not too much culture here. We gotta go. We have
to go someplace else. It's true, it is. My mom
is from there.

Speaker 3 (23:11):
I used to get my Oh my god, no Jerry
Curls until like two thousands.

Speaker 10 (23:16):
Yeah, that wasn't That wasn't working for me. And then
he offered me a job in Chicago. That didn't work
either because the owners called me and said the money
that mister Crocker offered you, we cannot afford to pay you.
And I was like, okay, deuces. And then he called
me again on the hotline at w h R. At
this point I was doing mid days and he said,
come come to New York, come come to be La,

(23:37):
come home, come home.

Speaker 4 (23:39):
Wow, this is this is the episode I've been waiting
for and all the questions I've had about every city,
Can you explain why DC is such an important mecca
for black music and being the Chocolate City and even
even now to day like shows that we do in

(24:02):
DC are way different. Maybe Detroit comes in a comes
in a close second, But what is it about d C?
So I'm assuming that the musical diet that the city
is raised on that determines the the caliber of artists that.

Speaker 7 (24:25):
That come through the city.

Speaker 4 (24:26):
Am I correct?

Speaker 10 (24:28):
Yeah, you mentioned Chocolate City. It was definitively Chocolate City
when I was there. It's been ultra gentified gentrified now,
so it is no longer Chocolate City. But the DC
that you're referring to, you know, it's the DMV, so
it's the district of Columbia, Virginia and Maryland. But this
you had the migration.

Speaker 2 (24:47):
You have people coming from the South, even the Midwest,
moving to d C for government jobs.

Speaker 10 (24:52):
It's a government city. It's the you know, the nation's capital,
largest black middle class in the country. There you go,
So it created this middle class, but it people who
had disposable income, and you know, music is at the
core of our DNA for black folks, all due respect
to everybody else, but for us, I think we're born
in our DNA with a sponge that can absorb all

(25:14):
the genres of our creation. And so in DC you
had this middle class, You had people who had disposable income.
They bought tickets to every show, they went to the clubs.
You know, it was just part of our culture to
embrace music and the artists that came through town. Not
to mention Go Go, well, Go Go of course the

(25:36):
genre that was born exclusively in DC and Chuck Brown,
all of those people were my friends.

Speaker 4 (25:43):
Can we finally have this conversation about go Go? Yes?

Speaker 12 (25:47):
Yes, yeah, you know what point I'm about to bring up? Well,
I just wanted to what year would you say was
the origin the beginning of Go Go?

Speaker 10 (25:55):
Early seventies. By the time I got to d C
in nineteen seventy three, when I got there, it was
in full swing. Trouble fun, all of that was in
full swing.

Speaker 4 (26:06):
I think the thing is is that, Okay, I know
that early soul searcher forty five's I have for more breakbeat, traditional,
right and all that stuff that that Chuck Brown did before.

Speaker 7 (26:18):
Like, Okay, this is authentic Go Go.

Speaker 4 (26:21):
However, I truly believe and this is where this my
This is a very unpopular take on the history of
Go Go, but I believe the DNA of Go Go
starts with Grover Washington Junior's Mister Magic.

Speaker 7 (26:42):
I've heard that.

Speaker 4 (26:43):
I've heard that before. I've heard that before. The rhythm
palette of Go Go is.

Speaker 3 (26:50):
Ye, Mister Magic seventy three, And so.

Speaker 4 (26:57):
I'm just saying that I I would assume that with
that sort of backdrop, we definitely played it a lot. Fact,
many bands have played it and played it and played
and put it into the repertoire.

Speaker 3 (27:17):
Yeah, it was about ship in DC.

Speaker 4 (27:20):
So I wonder if any DC music historians will back
me up in the fact.

Speaker 2 (27:30):
That they're gonna do what I did with it. I
started in seventy two, right there, that's possible. But when
I got there in seventy three, it was it was
everybody everywhere. I mean, you could not go to a
club and not hear Go Go music.

Speaker 3 (27:49):
It was just so could they have been an influence
on him? Could possibly?

Speaker 4 (27:53):
You know what I mean?

Speaker 10 (27:53):
In the reverse though?

Speaker 4 (27:54):
I okay, I'm just saying that most Go Go that
I know of, like The first example that it was
truly played to me was around seventy eight, seventy nine.
But I've investigated, I've investigated many of those DC funk
bands and all my record collections, and that kind of

(28:17):
the music was still post soul, post p funk ish,
that sort of thing. And so I'm just saying I'm
putting it out there. I'm going to find somebody the best.

Speaker 10 (28:29):
But we're also talking about the home of Marvin Gay,
Boom drop to Ellington, Duke Ellington.

Speaker 4 (28:36):
I mean, just ye, that's right, when Marvin Gay got
his band, Who do you come to Philadelphia again?

Speaker 3 (28:44):
But when you want to play weekend shows?

Speaker 10 (28:46):
Where you go DC?

Speaker 4 (28:47):
When you want to do a Saturday and a Sundakay, Okay, okay,
I'm I'm not going to find anybody back up this argument.
So of your formative years, what city, what city do
you feel I had the most culture as far as
impact in richness in black music? Is it DC? Is

(29:11):
it New York?

Speaker 10 (29:13):
Philadelphi is a combination. So again, I grew up in Harlem,
I spent radio formative years in DC in Chocolate City
with black folks, and then I came to Philadelphia and
Philadelphia at the point when I came to Philadelphia, I
came because I started dating Kenny Gamble and instantly fell
in love with him. So when I came to Philadelphia,

(29:35):
the sound of Philly was in full throttle, and we're
talking Harold Melvin and the Blue Notes. Teddy was still
in the group when I came. He started as the
drummer and then moved into the lead position. But it
was Patti LaBelle and the People's Choice and the tramps
and the Delphonics and the stylistics and all of that

(29:59):
was going on when I initially came to Philly in
the mid seventies, And the first time I really came
here was with Gene Karn, who is the godmother to
my oldest son, Khalif Jane was about to sign her
deal with Gamble. But I had met Gamble a year
earlier in DC when I was hosting an OJ's concert

(30:19):
and we formed our friendship. But when I first visited Philadelphia,
international was with Gene when she signed her deal.

Speaker 4 (30:26):
Was it always on three thirteen Broad Street?

Speaker 10 (30:28):
It was three or nine?

Speaker 4 (30:30):
I'm sorry, Yeah, three thirteen was my high school. Oh, okay,
performing arts.

Speaker 12 (30:36):
Yeah, just to go back to the Chuck Brown, go go,
mister Matcha think I found a quote from Chuck Brown
about that. Yes, and he basically admits that he got
it from Grover, but says it Grover they both got
it from somewhere else. And the quote is all I
did was break the beat in half. I got it
from Grover, for sure, but we really both got that
from the spirit from gospel. It's an old church beat.

Speaker 10 (30:57):
Oh sucks, look at that.

Speaker 7 (31:00):
I'll give you half a Okay, all right, okay, I'll let.

Speaker 4 (31:07):
That one go.

Speaker 10 (31:09):
Thank you for that clarificationtimes.

Speaker 4 (31:11):
Yeah, I gotta get the truth out there.

Speaker 7 (31:13):
Yeah, So Philadelphia in in the well really at the
height of it.

Speaker 4 (31:26):
First of all, do you credit Gamble and Huff for
being the proprietors of disco? Many have said that absolutely. Well,
Isaac started first because he had strings, and very white
because he's the first to go to one hundred and
twenty and b bms. But you know, as far as

(31:47):
the thechine and the class, and plus you know young Earl,
young young, I don't get you.

Speaker 10 (31:54):
Earl will not let you get out of a room
without giving him his pops the drum to the second
it was very second and forever and Earl Young the
founder of the Tramps and the drummer but also the
studio drummer for many, not all, of the Gamble Hooff songs.
So I definitely give them credit acknowledge he did. He

(32:17):
played with everybody, but he was a primary drummer for
many of the Gamble Hoff sessions. So yeah, So when
I came here, initially it was hetty because there was
all kinds of music. It was jazz. It wasn't just
Gamble and huff on what they were doing. It was
you know, I knew of the tradition of great gospel artists,
the Dixie Hummingbirds. I met Ira Tucker when I first

(32:39):
moved here. Ira Tucker Senior. You know that we're talking
about the Ward Singers, all of that. Rosetta Thorpe, you know,
Fonte and I were talking about that yesterday. Rosetta Thorpe,
the mother of rock and roll here Philadelphia.

Speaker 4 (32:54):
Really, yes, did not know that what no I help
inducted in a rock and roll I did not know that,
don't you know? King Britt and he was on his
Big Sister.

Speaker 10 (33:05):
Yeah project project on. She wasn't born here, but she
lived here lived, she lived here, and she died here.

Speaker 4 (33:14):
So yes, each one teacher, while we're at it, to
the person that keeps on putting Beachy Thompson from the
Dixie Hummingbirds as my great grandfather, he is not true,
and I'm the one that keeps erasing it. So yeah, Like,
I just want to put that out there too, Wikipedia,

(33:38):
because every journalist is like, you know, three generations and
I'm like, no, Beachie Thompson is not my grandfather.

Speaker 7 (33:45):
So I just want to put that out there. That's important.

Speaker 4 (33:51):
So any like, are there any notable historical Philadelphia h
musical stories that you've seen firsthand? That so many? Oh?

Speaker 10 (34:15):
Well, Teddy was my neighbor. He was my physical borrow
cup of sugar neighbor and also one of my closest
friends to his transition. In fact, I delivered the obituary
at his memorial watching Teddy Pendergrass leave the situation with
Harold because they were fighting. They were duking it out.

(34:36):
I mean, they were having physical fights. It was abusive
and out of control by the time he left the group.
But to see Teddy Pendergrass go from being with the
group and then becoming one of the biggest artists in
soul music and and he was crossing over pop. He
was going to become a movie star. He had a

(34:57):
Teddy Jeans line. Gambell, Yes, Teddy Jeans. But to witness
that was pretty spectacular. Just to see the energy that
happened as a result of the sound of Philadelphia worldwide,
that was pretty heady. I mean, I have tons of
stories with the jelly artists.

Speaker 4 (35:14):
Did you have any influence in getting him to finally
settle down with a natural as opposed.

Speaker 10 (35:19):
To what Teddy? No, absolutely not. Teddy had many hairstyles
during the duration. Yeah, that was before me, And had
I known him at the time, I would have said,
your hair prettier than mine.

Speaker 4 (35:36):
You need to all that.

Speaker 10 (35:38):
No, Teddy, Teddy was quite something, quite extraordinary. You met
him a mirror. Yeah, yeah, you were in the room
with him. You know, he had a magnetic energy unlike
which same thing that Marvin had. There's only a few people.
Sam Cook had it that, that Jennison Qua, Miles Davis
had it. Miles Davis, my good friend, Miles Davis. He
definitely hasty. Okay, okay, we're talking early seventies when I

(36:10):
was in d C and am to May who is
a beloved of mine, a connection another Heath. Well, that's
how I met him through his father, Jimmy Heath. But
he was playing percussions. He was playing conga's with Miles
and they came to d C and I was on
the air at w HR. He said, come by check
out the show. So after the set, he introduces me

(36:32):
to Miles and he says, Miles me Deanna. Deanna, meet Miles,
and Miles says, marry me. I'm standing there looking at
him like no, and he says, well why not? And
I said, because I just met you. I don't know
you like that. But I had on this long white

(36:54):
dress and a white gaylea my head wrap. And he
says to me, but you look like a motherfuck can bribe.
So from there we developed a very dear friendship and
went on for years until I started dating Kenny Gamble

(37:15):
and Gamble was like, I'm not having Miles Davis around
my woman, and it's not happening. It's not going down
like that. So but we we stayed friends for years.

Speaker 4 (37:25):
You were the original coffee shop check. That's what what
is that? The the the the the Nubian goddess that
we would think of head wraps and since Yeah, but

(37:45):
she was ne It was like me, but I was after.
It was a mirror.

Speaker 10 (37:50):
It was the post civil rights era. It was say
it loud, I'm black and I'm proud. So that, Yeah,
it was that period of awakening with black folks when
we were like, you know, no more, no more dogs
biting us, no more. It was past Montgomery and the
boycotts where we were like, we recognize our economic power
and our beauty and strength. We know whence we came from.

Speaker 4 (38:13):
But once the Nixting era sort of set in, and
you know the leaders were killed in sixty eight, a
lot of that just cools off. And you know the
seventies was mad hedonism.

Speaker 10 (38:25):
Oh I.

Speaker 4 (38:29):
Disagree.

Speaker 10 (38:29):
It was Mina Simone, Aretha Franklin, say it loud, I'm
black and I'm proud. That happened in the seventies. James Brown,
All of that was the seventies.

Speaker 7 (38:39):
So you know my uncle Butcher who stole my Grandma'm Stevien.

Speaker 10 (38:44):
Yeah, but here we go. You had you had brothers
coming back from Vietnam. Okay, they were distressed, and many
of them came back with habits heroin. I mean you know,
so we were starting to deal with the crack and
all of that happening in our communities. So it was
a lot going on.

Speaker 4 (39:03):
Were you discouraged at all with as I will say
that afro centricity had its second way eighty six eighty
seven with the hip hop generation. But was there a
period between yeah, seventy nine eighty post disco, between eighty

(39:26):
and eighty five where you just felt like, oh, okay,
we're we're done this and now we're bourgeois, we're getting jobs,
we're perming our hair, nose stopping now. Yeah.

Speaker 10 (39:40):
No, because I recognize that we're not monolithic. We're all
we're shades and variations, We're not all one thing.

Speaker 2 (39:48):
So and Deana's always been this black so I know,
I mean black music moms started in the seventies and
it continues on.

Speaker 10 (39:55):
So that's a whole you know, that's a yeah, not
the thing. No, we're not monolithic. So I saw all
type Some folks were bougie, some were still wearing their
hair natural, some were wearing braids. It was a whole
lot of stuff going.

Speaker 4 (40:06):
On, right, But I'm just saying that you are unapologetically black,
and what else could I be.

Speaker 7 (40:11):
But that's the thing for some people to.

Speaker 4 (40:16):
Kind of spook that sat by the door their way
into society. They might have to change clothes a little bit.

Speaker 2 (40:25):
Now.

Speaker 10 (40:25):
First of all, remember so for me, I talked about
graduating from Frankie Crocker University. But then I was greatly
influenced by one of the blackest people I know, Kenny Gamble.
He was my man. So I was raised up as
a woman by a strong black man. That was my education.

(40:49):
And then again my parents, my family. I'm very clear
where I come from and who I am and so,
and it was very black. And my mother, although she
was poored, she recognized that she's an African woman. First
time I went to Africa, I went with my mama.
We went to Senegal to Ghana, and my mother disappeared
one day and we were like, where's Nancy, where's Nancy. Well,

(41:12):
my mother went to the marketplace and got her garb,
she got some sisters to meet, and she came back
garbed up okay, and had several outfits. And my mother
was like, yo, I'm an African woman. I know this,
And that's the spirit in which I was raised. I
was raised with a great deal of consciousness and exposure
to black folks. So growing up in Harlem, for me,

(41:33):
it was the Schomberg, it was Langston Hughes, it was
the Negro Ensemble Company. It was all this great energy
about blackness around me.

Speaker 2 (41:43):
Do you think that's a little bit of a some
Northeast privilege when it comes to black folks in a
way too to be able to continue that because I
see what Amir is saying, and sometimes it depends on.

Speaker 10 (41:51):
Where you are too physically.

Speaker 2 (41:54):
Possibly, Yeah, I mean me and have that black conversation
all the time about the difference between the South and
the Northeast, And no.

Speaker 10 (42:00):
There are differences, were definitely, but I celebrate our commonalities.
I recognize the differences. But you know, I just came
from a wellspring of black culture growing up in Harlem
and the Bronx, the home of hip hop a rap,
so you know for me early so let me tell
you this too. Also, when I was a teenager, I
met Royeers. I met a woman named Myrna Williams who

(42:23):
managed Royers. So I was fifteen meeting Royeers and hanging
out with people like Royeers and then Jimmy Heath, who
I mentioned to you, and then when I was about seventeen,
a girlfriend of mine named Brenda introduced me to Stevie Wonder.
So I met Stevie. I call him Stevelan. I met

(42:43):
Stevelan before I even got into radio, and he invited
me into the studio. He was doing music of my Mind. Yeah,
music of my Mind. So I was exposed.

Speaker 4 (42:56):
And then I.

Speaker 10 (42:57):
Mentioned the flute. I decided to take flute lessons because
I still was trying to trying to develop my talent
as a musician, and I met Bobby. I met Bobby,
but then I approached a gentleman to take flute lessons.
And his name is Hubert Laws all the greatest floutest
of all time. I will tell you that I never

(43:19):
got a flute lesson, but he taught me a lot.
So I started dating Hubert laws and as a result
of that relationship, I was exposed even greater too. He

(43:40):
would take me to Rudy Van Gelder's studio in Jersey.
I was signed to c t I at the time.
So who did I meet?

Speaker 7 (43:51):
My favorite?

Speaker 10 (43:51):
You love Pree Taylor. So I met Cree Taylor, Rudy
Van Gelder, Hank Crawford, Esther Phillips, Grover Washington Junior Freddie Hubbard, right,
and they performed with each other, they recorded with each other,
So I would go with Hubert to the sessions. But
one of my favorite sessions I think you can all
appreciate this is one day Hubert said he had a

(44:13):
session and he took me, deposited me in the control room.
And who was in the control room Quincy Jones and
Donnie Hathaway. Wow, so it was my first time meeting
Donnie and Charleston Blue is what they were recording. And
Hubert was on that session. So I sat in the
control room with them, and of course at that point

(44:34):
I knew who Donnie was. He was very shy, demure, quiet,
and Quincy calls Aretha Franklin and introduces Donnie to Aretha
on the phone and he tells Aretha you got to
hear him, you know, Donnie Hathaway. And of course he
was signed to Atlantic Records. So yeah, at this life,
these things aren't phasing you like I'm young. I'm young.

(44:59):
I'm taking it.

Speaker 4 (45:00):
All in righteous Forrest Gump. But you know what I say,
it set the bar for me.

Speaker 10 (45:07):
It set an appetite for me because what I have
discovered over time is that I am most intrigued and
attracted to the exceptional. And that's what I have had
all of my life. I have been involved friendships, romances
with people who are supremely gifted. I would say, that's

(45:29):
what I like.

Speaker 4 (45:30):
I've to hear your opinion on life in twenty nineteen.

Speaker 10 (45:37):
And where music is going, well, I say, never a
dull moment. That's how I approach life daily.

Speaker 4 (45:43):
With human beings.

Speaker 10 (45:44):
There's seven billion of us, right, Fante. We were talking
about this last night, but sliin the family Stone said,
everybody is a star. We all have our unique shine,
we have our individuality. We contribute to this energy that
keeps our planet around.

Speaker 8 (46:00):
The song, I don't have to tell me I'm sugar, Steve.

Speaker 2 (46:04):
You know that sugar and that Deanna is already You're
already forced to listen to everything from twenty eighteen and
back because she's a media coach.

Speaker 4 (46:13):
So when you are going to say are you going
to be blue faces media, you know, it's like she
walked out on ya.

Speaker 10 (46:21):
I did not so what so what was well? He
was disrespect You're still doing media coaching?

Speaker 4 (46:26):
Yeah, and it's hardest development.

Speaker 9 (46:29):
Yes, can you talk about that all entails because I
don't think a lot of people know. Could you teach
I had this this?

Speaker 4 (46:36):
Okay, you just didn't you?

Speaker 7 (46:38):
I got media coach?

Speaker 2 (46:40):
Uh?

Speaker 10 (46:43):
Did they not keep yourself in the mouth?

Speaker 7 (46:49):
Yeah, because I was.

Speaker 2 (46:50):
I was.

Speaker 6 (46:50):
I did this thing for NBC, uh Sunday morning and
then immediately there afterwards.

Speaker 7 (46:59):
But they told the guy.

Speaker 4 (47:00):
He told me it did a good job.

Speaker 7 (47:01):
But it's it's a lot. I'll be honest with you guys.

Speaker 4 (47:06):
After episode ten, was like, nah, man, you say it
too much like Obama. I'm gonna get you. You were
you were, you were so like there was there was
actually a point back then when I was editing out
all of the us.

Speaker 10 (47:20):
Those are called fillers. I call those fillers. They're all
part of natural conversation. But yeah, the overuse of it
is like all of us.

Speaker 2 (47:28):
You know what I'm saying interesting because it's not a
lot of media coaches. I'm like, dang, who'd you get
great guy?

Speaker 10 (47:33):
Mother?

Speaker 3 (47:33):
Because really there's it's a handful of people who do.

Speaker 10 (47:35):
It's a very niche part of the industry, but I do.
I call it artists development, human development with an emphasis
on media. But for me, it's I get a lot
of young artists, so I'm schooling them on what I
feel are the rudiments of things they need to know.
Going to Kanye's tea teach Kanye, Kanye, Kanye was one
of your students. She had to lead that one too. Yeah,

(47:58):
that was.

Speaker 4 (47:58):
That was.

Speaker 10 (47:59):
I was approached by Lee or Cohen called me directly
after the Taylor Swift incident and asked me. He said,
my friend needs help. Can you meet with Kanye. This
was months after he had already gone to Hawaii he
was recording. He came back and I met with him
at his home in New York, and he really didn't well.
First of all, I was approached to coach him when

(48:20):
his first album was coming out, and he didn't want
any coaching. And I ran into him someplace and I said,
I was supposed to coach you. He says, Oh, I
know how to handle the media.

Speaker 2 (48:29):
I know what to do.

Speaker 10 (48:30):
I got this. I don't need any any I was like,
I'll do this back, brother, I love your music, piece
and blessings. But later I went to his home and
spent the afternoon with him and we talked about Taylor Swift.
We talked about life in general. I took him a
black obelisk and I gave that to him as a gift,
and he was like, well, what is this? I said,
it's an oblisk and it's Egyptian and you'll see it

(48:51):
in Rome, and you'll see it in Europe, in South America,
you'll see it everywhere. But it's Egyptian.

Speaker 7 (48:56):
I'm looking at up right now.

Speaker 10 (48:57):
The obliss. Yes, okay, d C. Washington Monument.

Speaker 2 (49:03):
Okay, Yeah, like symbol, it's a fact.

Speaker 10 (49:08):
But we wound up not working together. He really did
not want it. It was le Or who wanted it
for him and felt that he needed it. But Kanye
is the type of artist you don't. He's yeah, you don't, right.

Speaker 4 (49:19):
All right, so can you give us?

Speaker 2 (49:20):
Uh?

Speaker 4 (49:22):
What do I do? Never does this? But I hope
you do. Yeah, because even now I still feel like
an amateur and doing this. We're gonna have to give
her a check after we'd done.

Speaker 7 (49:35):
You know that, right, thank you. It's like a mere
drum on my record for free.

Speaker 4 (49:43):
I do that.

Speaker 7 (49:44):
I never charged for drummy.

Speaker 4 (49:45):
Oh for really, you shouldn't have said that on the end.
Come on, my son, I literally.

Speaker 10 (49:48):
Don't what do you whether is there something else you
charge for walking in or not?

Speaker 4 (49:52):
I mean when you I'm at a place now where
you know, like druman is my passion, DJing is my
passion showing. Won't let me dj for free? But like
you know, if I like the person, I'll drummer. And
I think about it.

Speaker 7 (50:05):
Okay, what am I going to do with the two
thousand bucks?

Speaker 10 (50:08):
Like, yeah, two thousand bucks for the average person, there's
a whole lot of money in there. Thinking about it,
I see.

Speaker 4 (50:23):
What he said. Let's also say that half of my
salary and this show is going to the staff.

Speaker 7 (50:27):
So I'm huge just saying.

Speaker 9 (50:30):
I like, for you, that would not be a lot
of money, but to the person that's giving it, it
would be a lot. So it's like, yeah, I just
keep your money. Yeah, I get I'm saying, But so,
what would be a better way Deanna to clean that up?

Speaker 4 (50:45):
It's already done.

Speaker 2 (50:46):
Diana worked with t I since the beginning, so I
know you know how to clean after the fact as well.

Speaker 10 (50:52):
It's different with every artist. It's different. I tailor. I
have a program. I call it the influence system, and
it's influenced, meaning the ability to prevail upon the thoughts
and feelings of others, and that's what artists do. And
I don't just work with artists. I've also worked with
athletes like Alan Iverson, heavyweight boxer Roy Jones Junior. I
worked with executives. I worked with Michael Vick as well

(51:14):
when he came out of prison, and that was t
I called me one day and had Michael Vick on
the phone and said, Deanna is my person. You need
to get with Deanna. But Michael was not very happy
when he came out of jail because everybody kept asking
about the dog fighting and he was like, look, I
just served two years in jail. I don't want to
talk about this anymore. And I was like, Michael, let

(51:37):
me bring you to reality. You will be talking about
this for the rest of your life. It doesn't matter
even though you went to prison. This is part of
your story now. And you know people are very attached
to their dogs, and you were involved in the situation.

Speaker 7 (51:53):
I hate dogs.

Speaker 10 (51:54):
People. One of the many so different people Taylor, for instance,
I'll give you the Little Kim story. So Little Kim
was on the red carpet and Howard Stern asked her
what was it like to have sex with a big, fat,

(52:15):
ugly guy like big and small.

Speaker 4 (52:17):
Now Kim is from the Brooks.

Speaker 10 (52:20):
She wanted she just wanted to fight him, but she
was on the red carpet. It was I think the
MTV Music Awards, and so she kept it moving, but
she was very upset, very angry. At this time. She
was signed to Atlantic a little later and they said,
you have to do Howard Stern. This is when he
was still doing terrestrial radio before Sirius XM. And Kim
didn't want to do it, and they said, okay, we've

(52:41):
got the perfect person to help prep you for the
interview with Howard Stern. I went to the Trump Tower.
She was getting her face beat at five in the morning,
and we sat and worked on how to approach Howard,
what to say me anticipating the questions that he would
ask her, and and also I protected her. I was like,

(53:02):
if we're not going to let him ask you about Biggie,
you're going to bring up Biggie before he does, providing
control the narrative and providing the strategy and how we
were going to deal with that. So very early in
the interview, she says to Howard, you know you and
Biggie would have been boys. I think y'all would have
been friends. And he says, really, like, why why do

(53:23):
you say that? And she said, because you have a
big personality, and so did it big and I could
see the two of you being boys. So at that
point she disarmed him. Yeah, he did not say anything
negative about him, and that was her concern because she
was like, if he attacks my man one more time,
we're going to be fighting up in that studio. And

(53:43):
she just took control of the interview and the narrative
and she just had Howard Stern purring and in the
palm of her hand. That's because we prepared for him.
In fact, on that particular album, she had done a
song where she shouted him out and she said, Howard,
you paid the way for me as an artist who

(54:04):
deals with sexual issues. You paid the way with your
fights with the FCC, talking about sex all of that.
So Howard, thank you. That is part of how we prepped.
And when we left, I was in the green room,
Kim came in, hugged me high five. She was happy
with the results. Atlantic was happy. She was pleased Howard also,

(54:27):
So yeah, so it depends when Charlie Wilson came out
of rehab. I worked with him on how to talk
about the rehab experience and his path moving forward. Usher
I only worked with him on he wanted to talk
about being dyslexic. He had never discussed it publicly. Yeah,

(54:52):
and that's what we worked on. He was a big
star at the point where I worked with him, So
it varies. But I also work with new up and
coming emerging artists, and they don't know anything about how
to go to radio, how to go to television, they
don't know. They know how to create, they know how
to perform, but oftentimes they can't talk about what they do.

(55:12):
So back to your question, there was a woman at
Motown named Missus Powell, Missus Maxine Powell. She did the
artist development at Motown and Barry Gordy, right, Barry Gordy's
sisters recommended her because she had an etiquette charm school
in Detroit and prepared people to be models and what

(55:32):
have you. But remember many of the artists that Barry
Gordy signed out of Motown came straight from the hood,
from the projects, and they didn't know which fork to use.
They didn't have any idea of what to expect especially
with Barry taking them all over the world. So Missus
Powell prepped them, so I consider her the mother of

(55:54):
artist development and coaching. And then Suzanne DePass came in
later and took over from Missus Powell, and she worked
on prepping the Jackson five specifically, So I also credit
Suzanne to pass as being another mother of artist development.
So I studied everything that they did.

Speaker 4 (56:14):
Who do you feel your greatest student was. I'm really
impressed with Yeah, that's where he got. I'm very impressed with.

Speaker 10 (56:28):
Tip. But I give Tip a lot of credit. I mean,
he we worked together for eight years. Anytime he released
a record, anytime he did a book, a film, TV show, whatever,
he would call me go to Atlanta to his home.
We would lock up, or I'd go on the road
wherever he was and we would sit lock up talk
and just what I do what I did with Tip

(56:50):
is I would give him language and thoughts. I would
let him talk to me first express how he felt
about whatever it was, the music, the book, the film,
and then I would give a some language and ways
to discuss what he had done.

Speaker 2 (57:03):
Because you're also proud of the Dave Matthews work too, right,
But I didn't work with Dave.

Speaker 10 (57:07):
I worked with the band. I worked with the rest
of the band. Yes, they do talk. And this was
in preparation for the Sunday Morning show that you did
CBS Sunday Morning. They were doing a special one of
their members had died in a tragic accent. Remember that
they did not know how to talk about the passing
of their member even with each other. They had not

(57:30):
discussed the death with each other. So when I came in,
I've met with the members individually and then collectively. So yeah,
and so it varies.

Speaker 9 (57:41):
What is something that you would say to an artist
that is an absolutely like talking dues and don'ts of
interviewing or whatever. What are the things that you would
say to artists like okay, absolutely, like do not.

Speaker 10 (57:53):
Do this, Yeah, don't be on your phone, don't be disrespectful,
don't make do not not make eye contact. First of all,
I encourage my clients to do their homework, just like
I did with you, guys. I read up on you individually.

Speaker 7 (58:07):
No, what did you find on.

Speaker 10 (58:10):
You know, I'm scared, No, nothing to be scared of.
But you know, you do your homework. That's the beginning.
And that's the first tenant that I teach his preparation.
So do your homework, know where you're going, know who
you're speaking with. I'll listen to what they've done. If
they're a print journalist, read something they've written. So I
give them basic humnn ectquette and respect.

Speaker 7 (58:31):
So how do you did?

Speaker 12 (58:31):
You pretty much prepare for your first meeting with a
client the same way you do. You do your research,
you know, find out everything, you watch old interviews and
like do you come up with like a list of
you know, I saw this interview, I didn't like what
you said here.

Speaker 10 (58:43):
Yeah, I'll sit with them. It depends on how many
interviews they've done. Some artists i'll sit For instance, bow
Wow bow Wow started, as you know, as a teenager.
Chat He started as a teenager, and by the time
his mother, who was his managed and his publicist, Patty
Webster at the time, brought me in. He was angry

(59:05):
with Jermaine Dupree and every interview that he was doing
he was hostile, angry, upset, and so they brought me
in to calm him down and to give him a
way to express his disappointment and his love for Jermaine
so initially he was like, I don't need I'm a star,
I don't need any coaching. The very first time I

(59:25):
went to his home and he just wasn't in the
frame of mind. So I won't work with someone if
they're not willing, if they're not open to the process,
and so I left. However, the next time I saw
him was up at the Sony Building, and when I
got off the elevator, he was standing there and he
ran away. I never had a man run away from me.

(59:47):
But when he came back, I said, give me fifteen minutes,
fifteen minutes and then you can leave. And I had
ordered all of his interviews, and we sat and watched
his interviews, and I said, all we're gonna do today
is count how many times you say you know what
I mean, you know what I'm saying, and then.

Speaker 7 (01:00:09):
Watch a video of yourself.

Speaker 10 (01:00:11):
There you go.

Speaker 6 (01:00:12):
Because when I did the media training, he made me
watch me. He filmed me having an interview with this guy,
and then we watched it, and it's really uncomfortable and
it's really hard to watch yourself. And then you stop
because I kept on like not dropping my eyes and
like playing with my hands and looking like an idiot,
and I was like, oh, I look like an idiot.

Speaker 10 (01:00:29):
Yeah yeah, So watching yourself, hearing yourself you're absolutely correct,
allows you to. But Rome wasn't built in a day,
so you don't change overnight. But mindfulness, being aware of
your tics, of your body language, of your lack of
eye contact, whatever it is, So studying it, if you
really applying yourself, will help. So that day we watch,

(01:00:52):
I said, just count. That's all I want you to
do is count how many times you say you know
what I mean, you know what I'm saying. And of
course when he counted up to about fifty after watching
all of these things, that was right minutes, he turns
around and says, okay, Deanna help me. He recognized at
that point that he had a problem and an issue,
and he was amenable to the process issues.

Speaker 4 (01:01:16):
Valid question, Yes, how did you get into doing this?

Speaker 10 (01:01:20):
Well, my background is radio. As I said, I started,
what was the is it?

Speaker 4 (01:01:28):
Because rappers are known as rappers.

Speaker 10 (01:01:33):
I've worked with heavy metal artists. I've worked with pop
artist I mean, I worked with Justin Bieber on his
first album. I worked with Rihanna on her very first album.
So I've worked with artists and all genres. Yeah, we all,
I mean we all need help you. Influence Entertainment is
my company, and it is me. I am the one

(01:01:54):
that does the coaching. People are hiring me for my
expertise and my ability and must success getting people to
be better. I am about inspiration. I am constantly drawing
inspiration everywhere, and I like helping people be their best
because that's what I aspired to be.

Speaker 2 (01:02:13):
But follow up on what Bill said. What was the
moment though, god mother, because even I don't know when
you were like, I'm.

Speaker 10 (01:02:19):
Going to do this all right? So I was managing
an artist named Gary Taylor. He's a songwriter, just gets
better with That's right exactly. I was managing asshole Gary.

Speaker 4 (01:02:41):
Gets the fact that in the coolest manner, I'm just being.

Speaker 10 (01:02:54):
Yeah, I.

Speaker 7 (01:02:59):
Want to be your friend.

Speaker 10 (01:03:00):
Okay, we can work.

Speaker 4 (01:03:03):
Yeah, that's right.

Speaker 10 (01:03:04):
I offered to appreciate your wedding. I've officiated two weddings,
so yeah, well, well.

Speaker 4 (01:03:12):
Get married.

Speaker 6 (01:03:14):
A ride or die ceremony, not to get meiciate our rider.

Speaker 2 (01:03:22):
Yeah.

Speaker 10 (01:03:23):
So where were we helped me? Although you know I
will tell you. So I managed him and I got
dragged into managing I don't like management. It's just not
my skill set is not you did Carol. I managed
Carol Ritick as well Philadelphia's own Carol Ritick. But with Gary,
it was just hard talking with him. In fact, we

(01:03:44):
were in Chattanooga, Tennessee, in the back of his limousine
on a promo tour. We couldn't afford a road manager
road manager, so I went out with him and he
was so difficult the entire trip. And I said to him,
you know, Gary, you write these great love songs. Part
of your problem is you you need good love.

Speaker 4 (01:04:03):
You need some loving.

Speaker 10 (01:04:04):
You need somebody to you really.

Speaker 4 (01:04:07):
Do, because you're lacking asshole.

Speaker 10 (01:04:12):
And you're an asshole. And you know how, He goes
to the record label says, I don't want to work
with her anymore. She reminds me of my ex wife
all stuff. I'm like, okay, well, I don't want to
work with you either. And furthermore, here's the number four,
not a psychologist, but a psychiatristic medicine. And then my

(01:04:33):
partner at the time plays a tape for me. Gary
sent this to you. He wants to make up. And
she puts a cassette in the car and it's Anita Baker.

Speaker 8 (01:04:44):
Good Love Wow.

Speaker 10 (01:04:46):
And he wrote the song inspired by me telling him
because in the song he says, I want to know
what good love feels like, good love, good love, good
morning to night. So yeah, Gary Taylor, but he was
signed to Virgin Music. I'm sorry Virgin.

Speaker 4 (01:05:04):
Yes.

Speaker 10 (01:05:04):
And the woman who was the head of the Black
music division, Sharon Haywood, why.

Speaker 7 (01:05:09):
Do I know that?

Speaker 4 (01:05:12):
Yes, yeah, I think that.

Speaker 10 (01:05:17):
Encyclopedia. Sharon Haywood takes me to lunch one day and
she says, this is after the Gary Taylor debacle. She says,
you get along with artists, you overstand them. Well, I
use the word overstand. She said, you get them, they
get you. You should do artist development. I have never
considered it until that day when Sharon says to me,
you should do that. And I was like, my first

(01:05:40):
job Jimmy jam and Terry Lewis. I worked with a
group called Solo, So Jimmy and Terry Vertical hold Stone,

(01:06:02):
and my third was D'Angelo.

Speaker 4 (01:06:04):
Wow.

Speaker 10 (01:06:05):
I coached D'Angelo. He was my third artist and he
remains to this day my most precious person. Yes, yeah,
so that's how it started twenty five years ago. So
I've been coaching twenty five years.

Speaker 7 (01:06:22):
Wait, we didn't even bring up the origins of black music.

Speaker 10 (01:06:28):
We skipped the seventies, but we went in the seventies.

Speaker 4 (01:06:30):
Let's go back in time. Okay, So you are the proprietor,
the inventor of black music.

Speaker 10 (01:06:36):
Month Gamble Okay, ed wright myself.

Speaker 4 (01:06:41):
So why did you feel that it was necessary? And
when when was it first officiated?

Speaker 10 (01:06:48):
Or nineteen nineteen seventy eight nine? We went to the
White House, We petitioned the White House to President Jimmy
Carter was in the House. White, Yeah, black music then, yes, Georgia,
Georgia Farmer and so Gamble had gone to Nashville and
was very impressed with Music City and the power of

(01:07:09):
the CMA and what they were doing. They literally had
established a geographic region and made music the core of
what was going on there. So he said, we need
to do that in the black music industry. So that
was the beginning of the BMA, the Black Music Association,
And part of that endeavor was to have a period
of time where we celebrate the outstanding contributions of people

(01:07:32):
in the past, this generation and ones coming up. So
it was really Gamble's Brainchild, and then you know, we
were together at the time, I think we were on
baby number two. We'd been together for years and there
were local chapters established around the country. But what happened
was some years later when I was producing I am

(01:07:53):
that you referenced earlier mire the International Association of African
American Music, which was it is a non UH, non
membership advocacy organization dedicated to the preservation promotion of black
music worldwide. So I wrote President Bill Clinton asking him
to host a reception very similar to what Jimmy Carter

(01:08:16):
had done on the White House lawn where we had
Evelyn King and tons of people. I want to do
to break down that date, took some historic photos Ronla,
Evelyn Champagne, King Berry, Chuck Berry was there as well.
Williams was there. It was an interesting.

Speaker 9 (01:08:36):
I felt Williams Rezai yeah, yeah, yeah, it's.

Speaker 4 (01:08:53):
Got to be the same guy.

Speaker 5 (01:08:54):
Yeah.

Speaker 10 (01:08:55):
So anyway, I went to Clinton. I wrote the White
House and asked them to hold us some reception, and
they said, well, we see where Jimmy Carter held this
reception back in the seventies, but he did not sign
a presidential proclamation. So just go get some legislation, come
back to us, and we'll do stuff in the White
House and recognize June Black Music Month. So it took

(01:09:16):
me a few years. I had Senator Arlen Spector, who
was a Republican from Pennsylvania. I had Congressman Shaka Fatah.
I literally put my most comfortable pair of shoes, not
these manolos, and walked around.

Speaker 2 (01:09:33):
Capitol Hill and petitioned and bagued and you know, brought
statistics about the power of black music.

Speaker 10 (01:09:41):
That we're a multi billion dollar entity, not just feel good.
You know, it's a business, it's an economy. And took
a few years, but we got legislation passed saying June
is Black Music Month. And then I went back to
the White House. And at that point I had several

(01:10:01):
private meetings in the Oval Office with Bill Clinton and
took delegations of people in the industry, artist as well
as executives to the White House. And so yeah, so
Gamble and I and we worked together even after we separated.
We are partners in life. We have three kids, we

(01:10:21):
have a grandson. He's the head of my family, the
love of my life. And this was part of our
mission in our work. We are about making people aware
of black music and its potency not just economically, but
how it informs everything and everybody change your life.

Speaker 9 (01:10:44):
How about that I want to ask you was in
regards to unsung because that was how I first came
about your work, and I told you about it when
we were speaking last night. How I just kept seeing
you pop up in every unsung and I was like, Wow,
I gotta figure out who she is. Yes, she was
the Unsung lady.

Speaker 7 (01:11:01):
That was really well.

Speaker 4 (01:11:02):
I was like, oh, yeah, that's the Unsung lady.

Speaker 9 (01:11:03):
So when we first met at World Cafe Live after
Things after Foreign Shange show and Nick brought you backstage,
I was like, oh it's done, Sung lady.

Speaker 4 (01:11:11):
Oh shit, so one thing, yeah.

Speaker 9 (01:11:15):
Right, so it's even crazy one thing and every unsung
like every every storyline and unsung is and then hip
hop they were doing so great and then hip hop.
So what were your personal feelings and when rap started,
you know, dominating? Uh, what was your personal feelings on

(01:11:38):
on rap music and how did you make that transition?
Whereas maybe some of your other peers was just like, ah,
this is this is bullshit. You seem just from you know,
our conversations, you seem to be really open to not
just working with rappers, but also just really embracing the
culture and you know, and accepting it.

Speaker 4 (01:11:59):
So what was like for you.

Speaker 10 (01:12:00):
I grew up in the Boogie Dann Bronx. I come
from where rap music was born, and furthermore, growing up
in the late sixties seventies in New York in Harlem.
Who did I hear? I heard the last poets. I
heard the last poets.

Speaker 2 (01:12:18):
And for folks who are not up on the last poets,
listen to them and you will hear the seeds, the.

Speaker 10 (01:12:24):
Beginnings Nikki Giovanni.

Speaker 2 (01:12:28):
That's what I grew up on, in addition to hearing
rap in the Bronx and then of course the Sugar
Hill Gang.

Speaker 10 (01:12:35):
That was revolutionary. So I embraced it, and as it evolved,
as a rap evolved, I kept up with it.

Speaker 2 (01:12:44):
And a lot of the people that I worked with
in the industry came out of rap. They came out
of that, so it was never difficult for me. And
as far as Unsung is concerned, it started in two
thousand and eight.

Speaker 10 (01:12:56):
The first season was the Donnie Hathaway Phyllis High, then
the Clark Sisters. I didn't do the Clark sisters, but
I did the other ones. Well. First of all, I
knew Philip Symon, I'd met Donnie Hathaway. I played his
music from the beginning of him releasing music. So oftentimes
in these stories that are shared on UNSUNG, I have

(01:13:16):
first hand knowledge of these people, and I'm able and
many of them my friends.

Speaker 3 (01:13:20):
Philip Symon was there, Mr. She was there to year
you intern and I am. Do you remember that? Do
you remember seeing Philip Symon walking around?

Speaker 7 (01:13:27):
I remember, yes, that was ninety one.

Speaker 10 (01:13:31):
Yeah, ninety one is when we did the first I
AM celebration. Yeah, what were your remembrances? What are your
recollections of me in ninety one? Amir umm?

Speaker 4 (01:13:40):
Because I was frantic to see everything I learned early. Well,
now I kind of make the I always used the
Ray Kroc Ronald McDonald example of Ray Kroc is the
power behind the movement, whereas people knew Ronald McDonald and

(01:14:01):
think that he runs McDonald's, but it's really the person
in power. So I knew you were the person in power.
And I've just always been one to observe from afar.

Speaker 7 (01:14:13):
So I was about to say, this is.

Speaker 4 (01:14:15):
Probably the most we've ever been in a room together
speaking in our decade's history.

Speaker 10 (01:14:24):
So usually.

Speaker 4 (01:14:32):
Hands down, you scare the ship out.

Speaker 10 (01:14:39):
No, I.

Speaker 4 (01:14:41):
Study people. I'm getting truth be told. I'm working on that.
I'm so insular and in my shell that I don't
even with Stevie one. I mean, they're they're luminaries who like, hey,
let's go out to dinner, let's hang it. I'm like,
I'm cool.

Speaker 3 (01:15:00):
I'm cool.

Speaker 4 (01:15:01):
I've been that way for a long time. I'm just
slowly getting out of that that that that Rapunzel protective
phase of my life.

Speaker 7 (01:15:10):
So but no, back then, I.

Speaker 4 (01:15:15):
Used it for everything it was worth. I mean I
made I think that was the day that I became
friends with Chuck and Hank Uh Chuck d and Hank
Shockley of Public Enemy Public.

Speaker 10 (01:15:29):
I am yeah, oh really I was off. Yeah, okay, yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:15:36):
I tried to explain that because Meir, you like what
every year I am, you like evolved and matriculated like
you was intern one year, then I remember you did
like the Showcase. Another year you went the Roots. Yeah,
and then next year you did a tribute to like
Jazzy Jeff or something.

Speaker 4 (01:15:48):
Yeah.

Speaker 10 (01:15:48):
You remember when when I had the Roots at the
Kennedy Center.

Speaker 4 (01:15:52):
Do you remember, Yes, I remember that was speaking to
a group.

Speaker 10 (01:15:55):
You performed and talked to a group of kids.

Speaker 4 (01:15:56):
I think that was the Public Enemy performing thing. Yes,
I remember all four of my I ams. They were crucial.
I will say, probably the greatest night of my life. Okay,
I've seen you.

Speaker 10 (01:16:12):
And where did you meet? Where did you meet? In
my in your penthouse suite? And was on the piano.
It was post an event that I honored.

Speaker 4 (01:16:21):
I was going to say that was probably the first
magical night for for a career at that point where
it was sort of like, uh, I don't belong in
the room, that sort of thing that was. That was
a moment where the best part of that night was
sitting with Andre Fisher UH drummer of Rufus and uh

(01:16:45):
married and then later Nat he was there with Natalie,
so I sat. I basically had my first quest love
Supreme with Andre Fisher and Natalie Cole while Stevie Wonders
is casually going through his calvic o hits in the
in the in the piano in this week it was

(01:17:05):
like three hours, like to the point where you go
all the boy like, hey, he's doing creeping when you
go sit down. When I come back, maybe he'll.

Speaker 10 (01:17:13):
Be on the sirt Duke, and I think we should explain.

Speaker 8 (01:17:16):
I am did.

Speaker 10 (01:17:17):
I produced an annual music celebration, a conference that had panels, luncheons,
and gala, a gala where we honored everybody from Little
Jimmy Scott to Shaka Khan, Stevie Wonder, Babyface La Read
New Edition, tons of people and this went on for

(01:17:37):
sixteen years.

Speaker 4 (01:17:39):
I gotta ask, Okay, how hard is it to organize?
Because I don't feel like you're the peron. I don't
feel like you're the Ray Crock in the position of
they got this. I feel like your hands on you
talk to people, I mean you talk to us, and
we were not through, you know, like then, so I

(01:18:01):
felt as though you had your imprint on literally every
aspect of from the smallest talking session to the networking
part of the night to the big gallad dinner. How
hard was it to manage, micromanage whatever? How hard was

(01:18:23):
it to organize that event?

Speaker 10 (01:18:24):
It was challenging, but I also had a lot of
energy and again the passion and commitment to preserve and
promote our music. And like you said, I wasn't even
aware that Hank Shockley was there.

Speaker 2 (01:18:35):
I mean there was so everybody came, Teddy Wiley, every
Jimmy Caster, everybody came.

Speaker 10 (01:18:41):
It was just the magnet for artist. And again because
of me being on the radio one two, because of
my relationship with Gamble three. My partner at the time
also had a lot of relationships, so it facilitated. And
I'm a passionate letter writer. I'm a letter writing motherfucker. Okay,

(01:19:05):
So my letters just again the passion that I have
for our culture music. So I got all those people.
I paid no one. All the years that people came
in and distributes, I did not pay anybody.

Speaker 4 (01:19:18):
Is it important to remember names and make connections?

Speaker 10 (01:19:22):
Absolutely, it's you know this, it's a relationship business. Think
of all of us. It's all about your.

Speaker 2 (01:19:28):
Relationships and how you connect with people. It's a give
and take.

Speaker 9 (01:19:32):
So relationships can get you places sometimes where even money can't.

Speaker 10 (01:19:36):
Absolutely, at the end of the day, it is how
you feel about another.

Speaker 4 (01:19:39):
You don't want to fuck with somebody, it don't even
matter the check is so good.

Speaker 10 (01:19:42):
So with for instance, with the Roots, I mean, you know,
and you know, Rich was a tough one, but I
went passionately, and I thought you guys were very talented.
I recognize that's the other thing. I have a good year,
and I for talent. Back to m two May, who
I know that you guys have had on the show,
and too. May introduced me to Spike Lee. We were

(01:20:03):
at a party in Brooklyn. He had just finished shooting
She's Got to Have It Wow, just finished and I
met Spike and I love cinema, so immediately I was
interested in his film and him, and that's when we
started developing our friendship. And then at one point he's like,
you and Stevie Wonder are friends. I was like, yeah,

(01:20:24):
he said, I would love to meet Stevie.

Speaker 4 (01:20:26):
You hook him up.

Speaker 10 (01:20:27):
He wrote about it in his books. I introduced Spike
Lee to Stevie Wander, I wrote, Stevie and I said,
I called him. I said, Steve Lan talented filmmaker. I
think he is going to be one of the most
brilliant directors of our time. And of course that has
come to pass. So yes, I'm very proud of that introduction.

Speaker 4 (01:20:45):
So you are a bridge. What other bridge connections have you?

Speaker 10 (01:20:49):
Many? Many, many many many? Really, I mean, I'm I
want I just I like us connecting. I like us
being productive from the energy that we create. I love that.
Like I said, I think what makes me a great
artist development coach is that I'm interested in seeing people
reach their maximum potential. So a lot of connections. I mean,

(01:21:11):
I feel, as I mentioned earlier in our conversation, I
am attracted to the gifted. I am attracted to the talented.
Tenth I'm attracted to people who are exceptional, and I
have been blessed to have had relationships with these people
through the course of my experience, and it feeds me.

(01:21:31):
It gives me the energy to propel me further to
help others. I believe I was put on this planet
to inspire. I'm amused. I'm real clear on what I am.
I am immused.

Speaker 3 (01:21:49):
Somebody Donald Doland, baby, what does that well?

Speaker 10 (01:21:51):
I've been told that that was written for me.

Speaker 4 (01:21:59):
That's the version of.

Speaker 10 (01:22:05):
Just crushed a lot, Yeah, yeah, lots of songs. I mean,
George Cables wrote Ebony Moonbeams. He's a piano player, and
I was told that he heard my saw my my
show and wrote it. And then Bobby Hutchison recorded Ebony Moonbeams,
and then Freddie Hubbard, who was a friend recorded Ebony Moonbeams. So,

(01:22:27):
uh yeah, so where's that name Moonbeams come from? I
was walking down the street in New York. I was
starting a TV show while I was at City College
in New York. I went in as a major. Had
to change that real quick, I told you, because that
wasn't working. And I saw a spotlight going through the
moon and I needed a name for my show, and
I was like, ooh, there's a moonbeam, and everything at

(01:22:47):
that time was black, right ebony, So I just put
Ebony Moonbeams together and that was the birth of my
radio handle while I was in DC, and it's just
kind of followed me all my life. In fact, Gamble
calls me Moonbeams to this day, so that's kind of
like his name for me. But yeah, and you know,
I always wanted and I've met presidents and leaders and

(01:23:10):
all manner of celebrity and people, but the person that
I wanted to meet the most was Gordon Parks. As
a young girl, I saw an exhibition called Harlem on
My Mind at the Metropolitan Museum and that just I
saw the photographs of Gordon Parks for the first time,
and James Vandersey and I just became totally enamored with

(01:23:32):
their narrative and how they document it, not just black people,
but people period. And so for me, my mission became
meeting Gordon Parks. And I spent an inordinate amount of
time trying to figure out who I knew, who could
introduce me to him and what have you. And I
was not very successful. Yes, yes, absolutely absolutely did you

(01:23:58):
ever get to meet him? Well, again I told told
you I'm a passionate letter writer. Yes, I kept writing him.
I kept writing until one day he had a vicious gatekeeper.
Her name is Joanna Fiora Fiori. She is a photographer,
but she was his assistant as well, and she was like, well,
mister Parks is busy, mister Parks is sick. Mister It

(01:24:18):
was always an excuse. And then finally one day, because
I never stopped writing him, kept writing him, telling him
how his photography, his art. For many who do not know,
Gordon Parks directed Chaff The Learning Tree. He's he was
a great director in addition to being a fabulous photographer
and a writer. And then one day I got the call,

(01:24:40):
mister Parks would like to invite you to his home
for lunch and so, needless to say, the day he
opened the door and I saw him just is pinching myself.

Speaker 3 (01:24:51):
And wearing a white button down as she sure was.

Speaker 10 (01:24:54):
Yeah, he sure was. His shirt was kind of open.
He was just looking real sexy.

Speaker 2 (01:24:59):
And we became really good friends, to the point where
the day of his memorial service, I went and his
daughter came over to me and said, you know, my
father spoke very fondly of you, and that meant everything
to me because he was very dear to me.

Speaker 10 (01:25:14):
We were very very close friends.

Speaker 4 (01:25:16):
Gordon Park's hip hop historians. You shouldn't know that Gordon
Parks shot the Great Day in Harlem.

Speaker 3 (01:25:24):
Yes, did he shoot you All Remix? No, was the
Double Remix?

Speaker 4 (01:25:29):
Yeah he shot that.

Speaker 10 (01:25:30):
Wow, that one he did.

Speaker 7 (01:25:33):
Yeah, that was wow.

Speaker 4 (01:25:34):
That was his shot. It was really weird, like it
was that day September twenty eighth, nineteen ninety eight, the
whatever a Kum and I Day, Black Star, Black and
Love movement, Like that day was such a surreal day
in hip hop history, and he just stayed he first

(01:25:58):
of all, I think the camera at the time. Sheena
Lester was still editor at Double Excel, so you know,
again you want to mean miss wart No, I just
want to watch him. So I just like watched him
from Afar and it was so chaotic that day because

(01:26:22):
that was really the day that classic hip hop and
kind of current hip hop was meeting for the first time.
So you're watching like rock him, rock Him losing over
Tarik was one of the weirdest things in my life
ever seeing and like the Locks meeting, like all these
grand Master Flash and all them. But he just stood

(01:26:43):
there so cool and behind a camera that was easily
I forget, I forget what Brandon was like.

Speaker 10 (01:26:54):
That's what I was just about to say.

Speaker 6 (01:26:55):
I like her.

Speaker 7 (01:26:56):
Yeah, it was a seventy one.

Speaker 10 (01:26:58):
I believe it was large format, yeah camera, and.

Speaker 4 (01:27:02):
He just he took eight shots and then walked. He
packed his things and walked off in the sunset.

Speaker 10 (01:27:10):
He was one of the most humble people that I
ever met for being put him in the genus category
for real. I mean he could play the piano, he did,
he did orchestrations, wrote symphonies.

Speaker 4 (01:27:21):
What was it about his work that attracted you?

Speaker 7 (01:27:23):
Because in what particular area?

Speaker 4 (01:27:25):
Because he did so many things.

Speaker 10 (01:27:26):
Photography again, I saw Harlem on my mind as a
young girl the photographs captured what I what I knew,
what I could relate to seeing our people. I just
think he had a tremendous eye for capturing the pain,
the sorrow, the love, the tenderness, all of that I
just got from him. It was just so black, you know,

(01:27:49):
just so black and so Yeah.

Speaker 9 (01:27:51):
One question I had, going back to just your artist
development work, how in twenty nineteen with Twitter?

Speaker 4 (01:28:00):
Who how do you manage that?

Speaker 9 (01:28:03):
It being a time where artists can literally I can
be three o'clock in the morning, drunk off my ass
at home in my.

Speaker 4 (01:28:10):
Not me personal get drunk. Well, let me be let
me good.

Speaker 7 (01:28:14):
I ain't gonna get drunk.

Speaker 4 (01:28:15):
And go on Twitter.

Speaker 7 (01:28:16):
Let's say that.

Speaker 10 (01:28:16):
There you go.

Speaker 9 (01:28:17):
But you know where people can artists can literally get canceled,
say what they want and get canceled with no filter,
and there's a direct line from them to the rest
of the world.

Speaker 4 (01:28:27):
How do you manage that in twenty nineteen?

Speaker 9 (01:28:30):
And what is your advice to artists in this era
where one tweet can get your shaky down?

Speaker 4 (01:28:36):
You ot it?

Speaker 10 (01:28:37):
Yeah, I review my client's Twitter, their's social media before
I work with them, and I'll go in very early
and say to them, you need to stay off of
social media. I had to do that with Nikki Gilbert.
She was doing the show and she was fighting with everybody.
It was a constant fight in her social media, and

(01:28:57):
I said, you need to stay off social media thirty days.
That's all I'm asking is stay off. And she she
later told me, she said, thank you for that. You
saved my life because she was so stressed out fighting
with people and bickering and arguing. So I'll review. Some
people are really good with their social media, but I
warned them, and I tell them, as you just said, Fante,
you can ruin your career in one tweet. So when

(01:29:20):
you write it, look at it. I've had to do
that many many times, haven't you. Where you write something
and you're like, what are the implications or consequences? You
end up not hitting sins. I don't just delete that shit.
Soy ya.

Speaker 6 (01:29:39):
Wow.

Speaker 2 (01:29:39):
Speaking of twenty nineteen, that's where we are. I was
going to ask you about being in a me Too era,
current Joe Biden era, where you have relationships with men
of all different kind of eras and for women, I
was going to ask you advice on that, because especially
post Joe Biden where we're trying to figure out what's appropriate. Yes, yeah, yes,

(01:30:02):
and you've been through it all because you know you
are made. Yeah, you have to gauge and check people.
If you are not that person that likes a hug,
just extend your hand. Be real clear, this is not
a hug. This is a handshake.

Speaker 10 (01:30:16):
You know, your body language tells volumes, speaks volumes about
you know, you can set boundaries with people, and you
have to do that sometimes. But sometimes people do not
respect the boundaries.

Speaker 2 (01:30:27):
And they'll come in for a hug, and if you
don't want it at that point, you just have to
you know, you have to speak up and be very honest.
You just cannot if you feel that you're being offended
or people are doing something that is disturbing to you. Hey,
the closed mouth does not get fed.

Speaker 10 (01:30:40):
You got to speak up.

Speaker 7 (01:30:42):
They're gonna get the point.

Speaker 9 (01:30:43):
Yeah, you have to let them know too, because you
can't assume that a you can't assume they know and
then be I think it's unfair to assume that they're
doing it with bad intentions. You know what I'm saying.
If someone comes in for a hug and you're not
with it, you. I feel like you just have to
say that.

Speaker 10 (01:30:57):
Because exactly speak up. Like today, you know, when I
arrived at the studio, Fante gave me a hug that
I did not want to release. I mean, who does
not want that kind of hug? I mean you feel
like you're being hugged? Okay, I accepted it.

Speaker 4 (01:31:17):
Definitely. People know, I can't place it boomerang.

Speaker 10 (01:31:31):
See how they have cut together the Biden videos. It
looks creepy. You know, he's like this touching the child's forehead,
the chin, under the.

Speaker 3 (01:31:39):
Neck and he's still the and it's still he was
the vice president.

Speaker 2 (01:31:42):
So it's also for some women who don't say stuff,
it's like, well, can he affect my life?

Speaker 3 (01:31:45):
If I tell this motherfucker to get off me? Is
he gonna be like hey?

Speaker 10 (01:31:49):
Right again? You have to decide your what, your space
and you and if you don't speak up, then that's
kind of on you. If you are feeling uncomfortable with
some wanted any.

Speaker 2 (01:32:00):
Time man woman anything like I went over to a
girlfriend's house recently and her dog kept humping me, you know,
and I had to be like, yo, get your dog,
get your dog, and she put the dog in the cage.

Speaker 10 (01:32:12):
You know, Michael big Point, I would.

Speaker 4 (01:32:18):
Just like to.

Speaker 7 (01:32:20):
Dog was your din on the the Beyonce kiss.

Speaker 10 (01:32:25):
The Mari's a friend?

Speaker 4 (01:32:30):
I was like, opened, was that some awards show and
double a.

Speaker 9 (01:32:37):
Uh?

Speaker 7 (01:32:38):
MARII Hardwick.

Speaker 9 (01:32:39):
He greeted Beyonce and first he came in and he
gave her kiss on the cheek, hugged and it was
like no problem, and then he went back for the
double tap.

Speaker 4 (01:32:46):
He kissed her again and it looked kind of.

Speaker 3 (01:32:50):
Addressed Jay Z right who was sitting.

Speaker 10 (01:32:52):
That is not accurate. It started with jay Z he
first and then walked around him to Beyonce, hugged her,
kissed her.

Speaker 7 (01:33:01):
Were they in the movie together?

Speaker 4 (01:33:03):
No? I don't think so.

Speaker 10 (01:33:05):
No, I don't think so, but.

Speaker 4 (01:33:08):
I don't know.

Speaker 10 (01:33:10):
Maybe they know each other some kind obviously. But it
was a double kiss and the double to the double tap.
But you know what happened she I think she kind
of moved so it almost when he kissed her, it
looked like he was kissing her close to her mouth.

Speaker 2 (01:33:23):
So I think a black woman says power. Yeah, yeah, no,
I think it just but he people the Beehive came
for him. They were like, yo, you're wrong, that's about.
But our man was standing right there. He is not
a disrespectful person.

Speaker 10 (01:33:43):
I know, Amari. He's a good guy. And Layah, that
wasn't nice. It wasn't but it wasn't.

Speaker 11 (01:33:53):
And I got it from her, Okay, get it from Okay.
So before we wrap, Yes, what is next for you?

Speaker 4 (01:34:04):
You've she's going to media coach Bill Sherman.

Speaker 3 (01:34:10):
At Harvard. You've traveled to South Africa for.

Speaker 2 (01:34:14):
What do you?

Speaker 4 (01:34:15):
Isn't pict next?

Speaker 10 (01:34:17):
No, not at all, not at all. That's just too confining.
That's not a book.

Speaker 8 (01:34:22):
You haven't written books, but I've approached.

Speaker 10 (01:34:25):
Yeah, write letters, I should collective letters.

Speaker 4 (01:34:29):
But if you write a book, well people feel certain.

Speaker 10 (01:34:32):
Nois well, you know, I respect that. Like even the
stories I shared with you there, there's I didn't tell
you anything super private and nothing that I don't think
my clients would be adverse to me sharing. But I
have been approached to write a book. I'm interested in documentaries.
My long game always was producing documentaries. So that's why

(01:34:54):
Fante being on Unsung suits me. I did executive produce,
the co executive produce the episode on Teddy Pendergrass.

Speaker 4 (01:35:03):
And that was your thoughts on the Teddy documentary.

Speaker 7 (01:35:06):
Mm hmm, oh, hit me. I just watched because I
watched it, and I mean.

Speaker 10 (01:35:15):
Nothing lest I watched it. I think I should give
you contexts. I watched it with his widow, Joan Pendergrass,
who is a dear friend. I watched it with Olivia Linchenstein,
who is the director, her associate Tyreese and the sister
who runs his company, and Charlie Mack. We had a

(01:35:35):
private screening. Yes, absolutely well. He was like a son
to Teddy and Teddy had picked him. Charlie Mack is
the one who approached Teddy and said, need to do
your biopic, and he introduced Tyreese to Teddy. Tyrees slept
in the room in the hospital. Teddy was in the

(01:35:57):
hospital nine months in intensive care before his passing. Tyrese
came from California slept in the room with him. I
will forever love him for his devotion, his dedication to Teddy.
It was more than a movie. They developed a very
strong bond and Teddy gave his blessings to have Tyrese
portray him in the biopic, which is now official Lee

(01:36:20):
Daniels as directing. But back to the documentary, I watched it,
and I was extremely happy to hear my friend's voice,
to see him when he was able body walking. All
of that, there was footage that I had never previously seen.
But at the end of the day I read Olivia.
At the end of the documentary, I felt very disrespected

(01:36:44):
for my ex Kenny Gamble. I felt that Shep Gordon
made comments suggesting that Gamble and Huff abandoned Teddy, which
is the furthest thing from the truth. Teddy did not
think he could sing anymore. Teddy didn't want to live.
Teddy wanted to commit suicide. So when Gamble and Hoffs
severed their relationship recording wise with Teddy, what what The

(01:37:08):
man was on the edge of life and didn't think
he could sing, So that's what happened. But the way
Sheep was representing it and the way she was representing
I also didn't like the amount of time they spent
on the taz Lang murder. That was bothering bothersome because Teddy.

Speaker 7 (01:37:26):
It left.

Speaker 2 (01:37:30):
A little inference here that Teddy was involved or who
had the most to gain from her death.

Speaker 4 (01:37:36):
So what were your feelings on Sonny Hopson's comments.

Speaker 2 (01:37:40):
About the same thing, Same thing, Sonny's been running around
for years making allegations in the windows or suggestions that
Teddy was involved and that, so of course I have
problems with that as well, And.

Speaker 10 (01:37:54):
So you know, I let her know, and Joan Pendergrass
opened up her husband's archives to Olivia. They made three
separate trips to Boston, which is where Teddy's widow lives,
where she opened up the archives. So it was nice
to hear Teddy's voice because he pretty much guided the documentary.
He narrated it because she had access to those tapes.

(01:38:17):
She did not mention Joan. She interviewed Joan, but decided
to exclude reference to Joan. And meanwhile, I saw I
didn't know all of Teddy's girlfriends, but I knew the
main ones, and I saw a bunch of random chicks
up in that documentary that Joan never knew of. I
didn't know anything about. It was crazy. So at the

(01:38:38):
end of the day, it had value because it did
tell some of his story. But I felt disrespected because
of how she treated Joan and the inferences or suggestions
that Teddy was involved in Tazz's murder, and that Gamble
and Huff abandoned Teddy Gamble helped pay for Teddy's funeral.

(01:38:59):
Gamble went to the hospital. I would bump into Gamble
with our children in Brynmar hospital. I never once saw
Shep Gordon, nor did I ever see Danny Marcus in
the hospital. However, Danny knew how to find his way
to a telephone to ask Joan when Teddy died, could
he represent the estate the same person Danny Marcus was

(01:39:24):
manager a manager with Shep Gordon of ty Yeah, and
when Teddy needed financial help and went to Danny, but
when he died they wanted to be in control of
the estate. I have problems with those people, and I'm
happy to have this opportunity to go on the record
and say again parts of the documentary had value and

(01:39:46):
were good, and then the parts just negated a lot
of it. To me and with Joan. I told the director,
I said, you could have kirnned at the end, because
they kirned at the end of the film that Teddy
went on to have four gold albums. But not only
did Teddy go on to have four albums, he got
his ged, he went to Drexel University, he fell in

(01:40:08):
love again and he married Joan. Yes, sir, he went
to college. He did not graduate, but he attended at
Trexel University. She could have chir on that. And he
established a foundation to help other paralygics and quads. He
was a quadriplegic. So I just felt like, you know,
she said, oh, we decided to ended it Live Aid.

(01:40:29):
By the way, I went with him that day to
Live Aid. That was his first public performance post his accident.
He was terrified, but he got through it. So I
encourage people to still see the doc.

Speaker 2 (01:40:41):
But at the same time, you know, now you're hearing
my notes, there's a lot of behind the scenes.

Speaker 7 (01:40:47):
Wait ask you.

Speaker 4 (01:40:48):
Okay, since we kind of brought up Tesz, is there
anything can you explain what the environment was like in
Philadelphia at least with the legend of was the was
the junior Black Mafia trying to get in the music

(01:41:10):
business or like I mean again, I'm I only hear
things in hindsight, like thirty years forty years after the fact,
But what was the presence of them in Philadelphia at all?
Is there anything you can speak on?

Speaker 10 (01:41:27):
No, I just I mean everywhere you got Black Mafia's,
you got them. You got the Mafia everywhere you got
organized crime, involved in unorganized and organized living.

Speaker 4 (01:41:39):
But I'm just saying that it was so different back
especially Okay Joe and Sylvia Robinson. Yeah, I was.

Speaker 10 (01:41:44):
Pretty sheltered from all of that a mirror. I just didn't.

Speaker 4 (01:41:47):
I didn't so even in Dillian radio and stuff.

Speaker 10 (01:41:50):
Yeah, but I didn't. They didn't mess with me. I
was kind of Gamble's woman. I didn't. I was insulated
from that. I didn't have to deal with that.

Speaker 4 (01:42:01):
But I mean, was there, it was.

Speaker 10 (01:42:04):
I'm saying it was there, it is, it is here,
it is everywhere. Yes, yeah, but I was a little,
as I said, protected and insular. Oh okay, it's just
part of life. Good answer.

Speaker 7 (01:42:17):
I don't know.

Speaker 10 (01:42:18):
That's real talk, actual good You don't you know what
I'm saying, but you know what I mean. I want
to take a moment to thank you all for having
me today because I respect what you do. Having an
opportunity to have long form discussions about the history and
the culture is significant. So the role that each of
you play with this broadcast, with your podcast is significant.

(01:42:42):
And personally, I'm so very proud of Laiah because I
changed her diapers.

Speaker 4 (01:42:48):
I was.

Speaker 10 (01:42:59):
The fact that she holds her own with you, gentlemen,
because you're all formidable, as is she.

Speaker 4 (01:43:05):
But you do it, but you do it.

Speaker 10 (01:43:08):
And I'm very proud of her because in the entertainment game,
she has so many capacities as a woman in this business,
as a professional, and I love her. I love listening
to her on the radio, I love watching her on TV.
And I think that's promise. Well you guys, yeah, well
that's fine, And I'll take some of the credit because

(01:43:29):
I support her. I believe in her. She represents the
now in the future for me as a woman in
this game. So I'm very proud of you. I love
you dearly, and all.

Speaker 7 (01:43:42):
Guest has done the sign.

Speaker 2 (01:43:48):
I can't wait to officiate your wedding. I'm available, amir
if you should ever get married. I'm willing to do
that last already.

Speaker 4 (01:44:00):
Oh you mean.

Speaker 10 (01:44:08):
How about that?

Speaker 2 (01:44:09):
I love Fontage and when he was talking about Nicola
because I loved the foreign exchange, and so I developed
a friendship with Nicole and that's how I met Fontage.

Speaker 4 (01:44:18):
Him back crazy, did you?

Speaker 10 (01:44:20):
So?

Speaker 4 (01:44:21):
Can I tell the DM story? Is that or just that?

Speaker 10 (01:44:23):
Go ahead?

Speaker 4 (01:44:25):
This is the moment I really met Diana Williams.

Speaker 9 (01:44:29):
Okay, and she revealed more about me, revealed more about
her than any interview, any anything.

Speaker 7 (01:44:35):
Okay.

Speaker 9 (01:44:36):
So we had met backstage at the at the World
Cafe Live thing, and so from that point on, like
we follow each other on Twitter and everything. So we're
talking on Twitter one night and it was late one night,
and I don't remember what we were talking about, but
it was talking about something on the timeline and then
we like we got into the d MS and so
we were laughing about something.

Speaker 7 (01:44:55):
So I just said her.

Speaker 9 (01:44:55):
I was like, oh, sorry, you been It was good
meets everything, and she was like, fante, I'm tired, and
I you know, immediately I was just saying, I said, okay, well,
I'm thinking, I'm Eve been working so hard, you know,
like what's what's going on? And she gives me the
greatest response that let me know that she was the illest.
She said, I'm tired of niggas.

Speaker 5 (01:45:20):
I said.

Speaker 3 (01:45:22):
I said, I am to.

Speaker 4 (01:45:25):
Say so much that let me know.

Speaker 9 (01:45:28):
I said, yo, yo, she the realers one out. From
that point on, we've been cool. I said, listen because
she's so eloquent, and so you know, because you said,
like her alreadyything, she just said, I'm tired of niggas.

Speaker 4 (01:45:40):
Boy, I felt that ship in my soul on behalf
of Light Fante, Boss Bill, Unpaid Bill, Sugar, Steve and myself. Niggas.
Thank you coming on the shelf. You's been a long

(01:46:00):
time this Quests Loves Supreme only on Pandora. We will
see you on the next go round. Thank you.

Speaker 1 (01:46:07):
Quest Love Supreme is a production of iHeartRadio. This classic
episode was produced.

Speaker 4 (01:46:12):
By the team at Pandora.

Speaker 1 (01:46:16):
For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,
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