Black Music Month QLS Classic: Philip Bailey

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Questlove Supreme is a production of iHeartRadio. This classic episode
was produced by the team at Pandora. Hey, what's up, y'all?
This is Quest Love And as you noticed throughout June,
we are celebrating black musical by releasing an episode every day.

(00:21):
So every day you're even going to hear especially pick
Ls Classic. And on Wednesdays we're dropping a new two
part episodes with Wayne Brady and James Poyser, both of
which were filmed in studio, so make sure you also
watch this on YouTube. Here's a conversation with Philip Bailly
of Earth, Wind and Fire. But don't don't screw up

(00:49):
Philip Billy.

Speaker 2 (00:51):
Supreme Supremo, roll call, Suprema su su supreme O, roll call,
Suprema Suprema roll call, Suprema Suprema roll call not confrontational.

Speaker 1 (01:08):
Yeah, I throw no shade. Yeah a Philip and I
about to fight. Yeah for his opinions on race.

Speaker 2 (01:15):
Supreme Supreme, roll called, Suprema Son Son Suprema.

Speaker 1 (01:21):
Roll My name is Fante.

Speaker 3 (01:23):
Yeah, and this is how I ball. Yeah when I
go walking. Yeah on the Chinese Wall.

Speaker 2 (01:30):
Suprema son Supremia, roll car, Suprema Suck soun Suprema role called.

Speaker 4 (01:38):
My name is Sugar, Yeah, Sugar, Steve, Yeah, before you
know it.

Speaker 1 (01:43):
Yeah, you'll be on your knee.

Speaker 2 (01:50):
Suprema Supreme roll call.

Speaker 1 (01:54):
It was my name.

Speaker 5 (01:55):
Yeah, treats Russian as the bomb. Yeah, the Earth, Wind
and Fire didn't play my prom Supreme.

Speaker 2 (02:03):
Much Supreme roll Supreme Supreme roll call.

Speaker 6 (02:10):
It's like yeah, and mister Bailly, yes please, yeah, I
love you so much. Yeah, I'm just trying to make you.

Speaker 1 (02:17):
See roll Supreme Supreme roll call.

Speaker 7 (02:26):
Well I'm here, yeah, and you know yeah that I
can go, yeah, and I can flow.

Speaker 1 (02:33):
Roll call Supreme Supremo role car.

Speaker 8 (02:40):
Supreme roll call, Supremo Supremo roll call, Suprema Suprema roll call,
like real quick, Who's that?

Speaker 6 (02:54):
I totally I was trying to find some one of
my favorite lyrics that he's loving, and you messed it up.
Steve messed up, did the easy level reference and I
was and I was just trying to make you see.

Speaker 1 (03:04):
All right, yeah Steve as basically, I mean, he's done
everything but tattooed the forty five into his chest. You
had to know that Steve was going to give so
Phil Collins.

Speaker 9 (03:22):
Yeah, it was Yeah, this song changed my life, I'm sure, but.

Speaker 6 (03:26):
He did the whole album. You could have picked any song.

Speaker 1 (03:30):
Really. Yeah, but you know, I think you have a
deeper well of Earth Wind and Fire and Philip Bailey
Nowedge than Steve here. You should have left the easy
level to me. Yeah, like the consensus.

Speaker 3 (03:42):
Yeah, you had to beat with that was my song
you got with the I'm with you on the raid.
I'm ready, I'm ready for the Raise to beat.

Speaker 1 (03:47):
Yeah. Because yeah, yeah this anyway, uh raise heat? Yeah exactly,
Ladies and gentlemen, my tied my entire goals and dreams
of this plot. Yes, is basically to educate and enlighten
you all as listeners, But mostly it is basically for
the five of us to just nerd out a whole

(04:09):
bunch of questions that only a few of y'all going
to get when we ask them, as you see during
the Jimmy Jam episode, in the Ray Parker episode and
Babyface and Greg fill and gains. But the time has
come upon us to make our dreams come true. Here
at QLs. We are truly blessed to be of the
presence of Royalty bar None. I believe that our guest

(04:31):
today is one of the most skilled vocalists of his generations.
And I'm not talented, not gifted, but skilled, absolutely skilled
of all the silky falsetto vocal gods of seventies funk
soul outfits. Our guest today resides personally and my number
one slot in my personal list. He's a seven time

(04:54):
Grammy Award winner, a member of the Songwriters Hall of Fame,
and a member of one of the most sharis beloved
supergroups and the entire history of music. Yes, even my
hyperbolegue is understated this particular episode. Uh, ladies and gentlemen,
please give flowers and respect and love to our guest today.

(05:14):
We've been dying to get on the show since its inception,
the one and only Philip Bailey. Yes, yeah, wow, Well
that was amazing. That was a great interest that I've
been waiting for this moment.

Speaker 7 (05:32):
Whenever my self esteem is low, I'll just play Oh man,
thank you, thank you for doing this. Okay, so why
do you hate raise? No, let's just go ahead and
get No. No, no, please, I gotta start now. I'm
want to make sure I do this the right way. Well,

(05:53):
thank you for coming on the show man. I'm honored
to be here. Really, this this is like you. This
show was tailing me.

Speaker 1 (05:59):
Just for you to be straight up and down very cool,
very cool. All right, So I'm quickly started at your beginnings. Yes,
you have a history that we got to get through everything.
So Denver, Denver, Colorado. What is life like in Denver
when you're in your formative years? My high city?

Speaker 7 (06:19):
Now, you know, amazingly, there was so much talent in
the Denver area, you know. You know, Diane Reeves is
from from Denver too. I actually brought brought her out
to Los Angeles. She was in a group that I
was producing called Free Free Life, Okay, And I had
to talk to her mother and tell her mother, don't worry.

(06:40):
I'm gonna take care of her. Everything's gonna be cool.
She had just gotten out of high school. Really yeah,
but there's like, there was so much talent. I always
tell people that basically I was just wanted to pack,
you know, and I got an opportunity. Uh but you know,
I played drums through school, you know, from the fourth
grade through through college because I was gonna be per

(07:00):
and so I was doing gigs and stuff.

Speaker 1 (07:03):
You know, you know that scene.

Speaker 7 (07:06):
The regular gigs and then the late night stuff, you know,
and I would sing on one gig and I would
play or sing on another.

Speaker 1 (07:14):
Right, yeah, so wait wait you mentioned something and just
set off many a rabbit hole that's about to happen
on this show. Does dian Reeves still live in Denver? Yes,
she does. You want to know something, Okay, the very
first time, the first day that the Roots recorded at
Battery Studio, a tripod quest was in Studio B and

(07:38):
they were doing a version of Grant Greens down here
on the ground. They were it was that blue right.
But the thing was, I never knew, like the technology
was so new at the time to have someone in
a whole nother state singing their vocals. So they made it.
There was something wrong with the whatever communication they were

(07:58):
using for Diane Reeves to sing her right, this is
nineteen ninety three, though, you know what I mean. So
like she was singing in Denver, like we were like amazed,
like wow, Trackwalk Questions producing Donna Reeves live at Denver
and you know that that whole thing. So okay, So
was this the time you you had this group when

(08:18):
you were already established phil a Billy or now that
she's like up here like you.

Speaker 7 (08:23):
No, yeah, I was already established. I was already out
in Los Angeles, you know, with the band and every Okay.

Speaker 1 (08:28):
Yeah, so yeah, I'll say that Denver isn't the spot
I think of when I think of usually a lot
of our our great singers, and especially in the era
of soul, their experience is down south or sometimes Midwest Chicago,
that right, that sort of thing. But how does soul

(08:49):
reach the Mile High City?

Speaker 7 (08:52):
Yeah, well, you know, everybody everybody from the south some
kind of way, right, right, So basically, you know, all
the blues and jazz and and uh, you know, we
didn't we didn't have no R and B or jazz
radio stations and stuff.

Speaker 10 (09:10):
You know.

Speaker 7 (09:10):
Like so I grew up listening to the country and
you know, middle middle country, you know, rock and all
that kind of stuff. Love me some bluegrass and all
that kind of stuff.

Speaker 1 (09:24):
Because I was about to say, because usually people, uh,
usually earth wind and Fire is the answer for people
when they're in the middle of nowhere America, and earth
wind and Fire is usually like the one group that
somehow seeps through the system of of you know, radio
or whatever reaches people. But it's like what does a

(09:45):
member of Earth Wind and Fire listen to when Earth
Wind and Fire doesn't exist. I'm dousing to you. I'm
listening to all kind of stuff that you're doing. And no, no, no,
I just met when you were when you were a
kid growing up, do you remember the first album purchased?

Speaker 7 (10:01):
Well, you know, everybody was listening to Jackie Wilson and
and people like that. But I grew up in rummaging
through my friend's mother's music music selections, so, uh, she
was a jazzer and her boyfriend was a jazz bassist,
So I grew up listening to you know, straight up jazz,

(10:24):
you know, straight ahead. Was there a black church experience
in oh yeah, oh yeah, I know. I was raised Catholic,
but I did. I sang with a group called Echoes
of Youth and uh in Denver, and uh, you know
there there was a lot of talented singers, but also
the choir director, Mss Joanne Ryan. She also would have

(10:48):
different entertainers to come and teach us how to sell
a song and you know, just give us input on,
you know, how to perform and all that stuff. So
you know, actually Pam Greer was in that group with me. Really, yeah,
what other notable dim rights do we not know that?

Speaker 1 (11:08):
Well?

Speaker 7 (11:09):
Bill Bill Fazelle okay, oh really yeah, he was, he was,
he was in We were in the same orchestra, and
he was the first clear clarinet player. I didn't even
know he played guitar until until I was out gone
and famous and Natives talking about Bill Fazelle and he's
on guitar and I said, you mean clarinet player first.

Speaker 1 (11:29):
Yeah, okay, So how does now I'm thinking, like again,
the way we are today with technology, you know, I
can know of a soulful singer in Indian like two seconds.
But how does word how does word even spread about

(11:50):
who or what you do that gets the attention of
I assume that your was earth winder Fire, your first
professional group.

Speaker 7 (11:58):
Or well first recording professional group, because you know, like
back then there were clubs. So I started playing at
clubs when I was like fifteen and stuff. So you know,
I was performing and all that kind of stuff and
traveling and you know, not extensive traveling going to Kansas City,
you know. But a guy named Perry Jones, who yeah, yeah,

(12:23):
Perry Jones was the one that got that that that
was kind of mentoring our group that that Larry Dunn
was in Friends of Love and Andrew wolf Folk and
he went out to be the first promotion man for
Warner Brothers. And when he he came back and with

(12:43):
a with an album that was just white and he
gave it to us, to me and Carl and the
rest of a bunch of guys, and it was earth
wind Fires first record.

Speaker 1 (12:54):
So you were not there for the Warner period. I
wasn't there for the Warner period or the Sweet Sweet
No can you can you settle the rumor that Bill
Cosby was the one that No, okay, I'm thinking of
Charles Stephane, Bill. No, no, no, Bill. Now, let's talk
about Bill Cosby for a little while. He had a

(13:14):
history before his history anyway. No, it was Bill express
yourself Charles all right, but uh, Sweet Sweetback is uh
Melvin he was, and that's what they said, right, So
was connected to Charles, okay, and he was connected to

(13:35):
Sweet Sweet Back right somewhere. I'm getting it all mixed up.

Speaker 7 (13:40):
So well, you know, Jim Brown is part of the
history of the Fire really because he was actually managing
the band for a minute before before I got in
it Jim Brown, Yeah, Jim and and then Bill Uh
Ruffalo and Cavallo, you know kind of they they actually

(14:02):
paid him a little bit to you know, get the band.

Speaker 1 (14:06):
Oh really, Yeah, So Rufblo and Cavallo were a thing
even in the early seventies.

Speaker 7 (14:11):
Yeah, because they you know, they used to run clubs
and all that kind of stuff together before they actually
moved out to Los Angeles.

Speaker 3 (14:20):
I always wanted to know what their story was, right,
and Ruffalo Cavallo they were princes managers.

Speaker 7 (14:26):
Yeah, they were our managers. And that that was the
Perry Jones Hoo hook up because Perry Jones was actually
what you know, was introduced to Prince. Prince is the
one that that turned him on him on to Cavala
Ruffalo because Prince wanted to do what Earth onony Fire
was doing, and so he said, I want to meet

(14:46):
those guys that managed Earth onony Fire.

Speaker 1 (14:49):
I had heard that that Verdin was supposed to produce
Princess Ars. Was that had you ever heard anything about Like, No,
I didn't. I didn't hear that. His name came up
in like a wishless for the uh for the label.
So Perry Junes, like I always from Renowlum credits always
wondered would he always introduce your shows for something?

Speaker 7 (15:12):
You know, one thing is just leading into the other.
And uh, Perry did that and and it happened to
be on that Gratitude album. Okay, so that's what actually
just gave him that that fame. Okay, yeah, because he
didn't do it all the time.

Speaker 1 (15:29):
Oh okay, I see. So so you said that Larry
Done and Andrew Wolfolk was there.

Speaker 3 (15:35):
Yeah, they were in bed Yeah, in my band, right,
So Larry's also from Denver or Denver yep.

Speaker 1 (15:41):
Oh, I never knew that. I never knew that. So
how did you guys?

Speaker 7 (15:45):
Okay, well, we were we were in school together, you know,
and Larry was in the ninth grade and I was
in the eleventh grade. We were playing in the band together,
and uh, andrew family moved to Denver there he was
a service brat. So we had we had a group

(16:06):
that was playing in clubs and colleges and all that
kind of stuff.

Speaker 1 (16:10):
What type of music we would do everything?

Speaker 7 (16:12):
Actually, we would do Top forty, but then we'd also
do Carol Kinge. We'd do Three Dog Night, Rare Earth.
We you know, we would you know, we could do
pretty much anything that was on the radio. Okay, so
pretty much early seventies, well sixties stuff, you know. Oh

(16:33):
and then I had a you know, i'd do quartet
stuff where you know, it was Jimmy Smith kind of stuff,
you know, because we'd have bands where you know, this
guy named al Hammond Moore who would play, you know,
play the bass with you know, with his feet, you know,
right right on on the V three and I was

(16:55):
either playing drums or or singing in it.

Speaker 1 (16:58):
Okay, So I was gonna wait till you guys got
to Columbia, but I might as well ask, now, how
many octaves is your voice? Because of course you're you're
your golden gift is in your fellow stuff. Right.

Speaker 7 (17:17):
Actually, I'm a baritone. I studied operatic baritone in school. Yeah,
in German and stuff. I remember that stuff.

Speaker 1 (17:27):
Yeah.

Speaker 7 (17:27):
So, but I grew up listening to you know, uh
Seavon and dining in Washington off because you hear that
stuff at the house, and I kind of mimicked those
voices because of the passion, you know, the lyrical sense.

(17:47):
But then growing up, I would, you know, I would
I could sing, you know, whatever genre I was. We
were doing on stage and stuff. So I was playing
a gig and a teacher from one of the colleges
was there and said, wow, you have an amazing falsetto.

Speaker 1 (18:07):
I said, huh, that's what that is. I didn't even
know what a falsetto was. So what what is your
daily routine? Is this one of those like, oh, national
gift from God? Or are you Seth Riggs? You know
I did study with Seth? Really yeah, I did study
with Seth. And you know, Seth can only he can

(18:33):
only teach what's there, you know, but you know everyone
that has taught with study with him gets get something.
You know, how long is this average session? How long
does it do you just go with you?

Speaker 7 (18:50):
You wouldn't go probably past two hours, but he would
just go with you until you you know, until you
know there was a real breakthrough. I remember when Stevie
was studying with him and then that song came out
and he goes, oh, I am saying for tomorrow. I

(19:11):
was like this, like what oh, But that was like
right around the time he was studying with with Seth.

Speaker 1 (19:18):
How how does word about Seth Riggs get around because
for listeners that study with them really so seth riggs. Uh.
For you q l US listeners out there, it's pretty
much the ve go to standard of vocal vocal culture,
probably most famously his his Michael Jackson warm up sessions

(19:42):
are on YouTube just a Google Michael Jackson Sethwriggs, of
which there are various exercises. No no no no no
no no no no no, Like what what what's what
is the purpose of doing those scales? But with different annunciations,
Well you could, well you can hear you know, where

(20:02):
you're speaking, where your voice is speaking from, you know,
and he just connects you know that with singing. You know,
it just shows you where where to place different things
and the that goes, it's showing you how to get
it to your head, your head voice, you know. Yeah,

(20:25):
because you gotta. If you do that, you have to
you have to go. There's no way other you can't go.
If you're you can't do anything but go to your head. Okay,
So they're very various. So for various ranges, you have
to pick up a certain body. Part two because I

(20:46):
always heard, like teachers in my school say, like sing
from your diet, right, But I always find myself when
I'm naturally singing what I always sing from my throat
and they always say that's wrong.

Speaker 7 (20:56):
Yeah, but how you hear your talk? You're speaking voice?
Like what you just right there? You spoke from down here.

Speaker 3 (21:03):
So but is it natural instinct for you to do
the right thing or like it's it's natural. It's very
natural now, but back then you were.

Speaker 7 (21:15):
Yeah, but you know, back then, if you if you
lose your voice a few times and all that kind
of stuff, obviously you know you're you're you're singing from
the wrong place or you know, or straining the door
doing certain things.

Speaker 1 (21:26):
For Jesus Christ, I didn't even ask, like what if
your horse were night and you can't do reasons or
just can't do it.

Speaker 7 (21:34):
That happened last year, Yeah, in Vegas, man, for I
was like, there was you know, there was this curtain
on the stage that they hadn't taken down for eons
and they and they they lowered it and brought it
back up, and they said there was dust all over
the instruments and stuff. You know, that's really fine, got

(21:54):
into my my you know, my voice, and man, three nights,
really man, I couldn't sing. I couldn't sing too much
in nothing at all.

Speaker 1 (22:05):
Okay, so is I'm so glad we have a singer.
Singer on the show always okay, I always kind of side.
I'm a straight up musician. I'd never consider myself a
singer or whatever. So I mean, I'm respecting the fact
that singing is an instrument, but having dealt having dealt

(22:27):
with the demands of Wreatha Franklin and Luther vandros REITHA.
Franklin famously, she can't go into any building that's under yeah,
under seventy eight degrees. So whenever she would visit late
night because we had a universal uh no, she would

(22:50):
have these like these four dudes that pretty much Steve
Harvey Detroit pimp dress looking cats, but they would have
like secrets service, like earpieces and everything. They would come
in around ten pm the night before and they would
rotate sitting by the master thermometer thing like one in

(23:14):
the basement, literally so that if someone comes in like
it's not as hell you can't do it. So literally,
anytime Aretha Franklin was everyone on the Tonight Show, a
guy would come in and do three hours sitting by
wherever the master thermostat is for the entire six flour
to make sure that no one touches it. Trinity, I

(23:34):
want that happening for me. But this is what I'm
really asking. And Luther Vangels also famously like would make
all air conditioning off in any stadium that he's ever
been in. I just want to know. It's part of
that psychosomatic No, it's definitely not. That's real. It's definitely not.

(23:57):
It's like I try, you know, I try.

Speaker 7 (24:01):
But I laid down, like on a couch like that
at a gig and stuff, and the air conditioning was on,
you know, and I started to tell him, y'all, you
should probably turn it off and stuff. And I laid
down and putting my jacket over my head and I
did go to sleep. I couldn't sing for three days.

(24:21):
It's the it's the free on, you know that that
messes with the vocal with vocals, some vocal cords, some
people some people can you know, can do it. But
it's the same with me. Like when you get on
that tour bus or whatever. My my the back bay
is a it's it's a sauna, all right.

Speaker 1 (24:40):
That's also the real reason why there was a Griffin
Doordan slndering bus between Tarika and I because Tarka's doctor Africa.

Speaker 6 (24:47):
Like and a smoke box and hot box. It's crazy.

Speaker 1 (24:51):
Yeah, so it's it's like, you know, it has to
be one hundred degrees to do that, so that that
is not psychosomatic. That's why.

Speaker 6 (25:00):
So let me ask this question, and do you have
a daily routine of maintenance for you?

Speaker 1 (25:04):
Not really? Not really?

Speaker 6 (25:07):
Do you the dairy?

Speaker 1 (25:09):
Yeah?

Speaker 6 (25:09):
Yeah, so you know none of that stuff.

Speaker 7 (25:11):
I tell you what I cannot do, and and I
tried it a couple of times. Coca Cola. No, it's
kryptonite for me.

Speaker 1 (25:21):
I can't I can't even I can't say any I
can't sing a note. I can't sing. Ah. Really, it
just goes no soda, nothing, no soda, just Coca cola.
Did they know that at the time commercials?

Speaker 7 (25:37):
You know, I was doing this gig outside and it
was hot, and you know, somebody was drinking co cola
and I just needed something to drink and I grabbed some.

Speaker 1 (25:48):
Man. It was done. There was no singing whatsoever not
that night.

Speaker 7 (25:54):
And so it happened again, and I just thought, okay
that you know what the heck, same thing happened.

Speaker 1 (26:04):
Couldn't sing a word. Well, since we're here already, I'm
gonna just skip two two reasons. Do you regret that
the live version of reasons is our standard for what
we expect you to do to the day you die,

(26:26):
Like if you don't do those exact andrew together everything right,
Like is there a night where you don't reach that?
And it's like the audience is kind of side eye
and you like before your answers.

Speaker 5 (26:40):
Can I tell you when I was probably like maybe
twelve or thirteen when I first heard that, and I
could hit those notes then, and then when my voice cracked,
I was so upset I could not It was like
it was that song in Prints on the Most Beautiful
Girl in the World when he hits that high note
at the end.

Speaker 1 (26:55):
I used to be able to hit both of those notes.
Not no more. I was so upset, up, so upset.
So you set such a high goal for yourself that
you now want to have to live up to.

Speaker 7 (27:08):
Uh, you know, you know what people come to hear,
so you know I always do that, even if I'm
just gonna go off and then at live do some
other stuff.

Speaker 1 (27:20):
Okay, I'll do that, all right, all right?

Speaker 6 (27:23):
Got a dumb question somebody told me to ask you this,
and I'm gonna ask the room, what are the reasons.

Speaker 1 (27:31):
Interesting enough that song?

Speaker 7 (27:32):
Let's let's talk about that song yourself bit because you
know that, you know the lifestyle of you know, the
road dogs and all that kind of stuff. Memory used
to have a conversation about, you know, infidelity and stuff,
and so you know, well, I'm gonna go all the
way back gets a little bit. We go into we Land,
I think it was in Philly, yay, and and there's

(27:57):
this there's this really really fine female. Okay, that that
that is like everybody's looking at when we come off
the plane. Now, at that time, we would take a
whole floor in a hotel and stuff and have security
and all that kind of stuff. So we go to
the and we would just you know, like if you
wanted to see somebody, you would just give our road

(28:21):
manager an eye.

Speaker 1 (28:22):
You know.

Speaker 7 (28:23):
You know, I do not know, so I do not
get to the hotel. I get to the hotel. The
ladies at the hotel all right, and you know the
next day, you know, she makes his phone call and

(28:44):
she's talking to her guy.

Speaker 1 (28:46):
You know, just like.

Speaker 6 (28:49):
Just like.

Speaker 1 (28:52):
So Marisa having this conversation. So I felt like.

Speaker 7 (28:57):
A deflated and stuff was like, oh so I was
talking to Maurice. So we had this conversation. So that's
how we started to write Reasons. Okay, now writing that
song and then Charles Debney came in with the music
and stuff. People say that they used that song for

(29:18):
their wed You're saying you wrote that song without a melody? No, no,
that's that was we'd already had. We had the music.
We had the music.

Speaker 1 (29:32):
So you just how do you and Maurice's collaborating on?
So do you talk?

Speaker 6 (29:36):
It was?

Speaker 7 (29:38):
It was, you know, different all the time. You know,
it was different all the time, you know, whatever resonated
with you at that time. But that's how Reason was,
you know, was was was crafted. But basically, you know,
the song says that you know, your reasons were a lie,
reasons had no pride, you know, love was left aside
and all this stuff. And people said, are you that

(30:00):
song reasons for my wedding?

Speaker 1 (30:02):
Oh? My goodness not what did I hear a rumor
once that someone offered you guys to come perform the
song at a wedding, and one of you had to reveal, like,
it's a song about unfair like why, well, you know
what we do.

Speaker 7 (30:18):
We do some very expensive corporate dates, you know, you know,
and if someone says to do reasons, I will decline.

Speaker 1 (30:30):
Been specifically for like a love.

Speaker 7 (30:31):
Yeah, if it's for a wedding, if you know, if
it's if it's your wedding night and you know we're
doing the music after it, and I won't do I
probably I don't want to do after the lover is
gone either.

Speaker 1 (30:43):
Right, yeah, you know.

Speaker 7 (30:50):
Your wedding night, wedding night, your wedding night, and you know,
like this is your big party.

Speaker 1 (30:57):
No, you know, I'm not on singing all that. Ye wait,
why is it that all of our quote, our songs,
our side chicks, sweet thing? I just someone just hit
me saving all my love? Did I know? Yeah? She
say it.

Speaker 6 (31:15):
And now.

Speaker 1 (31:17):
But what's the world You got your family? Oh? No, God,
and they need you to she knows you know what
it is, dude. Black people listen to the lyrics.

Speaker 6 (31:32):
No, no, I think we translate them differently in our head,
Like we listened because we sing along, But then somewhere
in the translation is the feeling.

Speaker 3 (31:40):
The feeling feeling Maxwell said had the same thing with
pretty Wings, where people were saying they wanted him to
like do that at his wedding and so many people
come and say, that's our wedding song. And he was
just like, yo, this is a song about a breakup,
but wait it is. Yeah, pretty Wings is totally about
the break See. I thought, you're pretty wings so you
can fly away, you're about to get out of here,

(32:01):
something like pretty slow, Yeah, pretty means.

Speaker 1 (32:04):
The breakup song. I did not know that.

Speaker 3 (32:07):
Yeah, I played it all the time and part deal
like it's it's a feeling, and he was just like, listen,
if that's what it means to that person.

Speaker 1 (32:15):
You know, it's pretty arrogant of you to say, oh,
that's not with it, but if that's how they feel
about it, I didn't do it because I want I
wouldn't want to jinx your relationship. Wow, I thought, I.

Speaker 6 (32:26):
Just want to say, we still don't know the reasons,
but the conversation I'm looking I'm sitting here reading the lyrics,
like the reasons that we feared that Even.

Speaker 1 (32:33):
Then, I was gonna say, most Earth Wind and Fire
slow songs really don't deal with besides be ever wonderful,
wonderful man, I'm thinking like all, even like I would
consider Devotion a slow song even though it has nothing
to do with a romantic relationship.

Speaker 3 (32:50):
But it's really slow, so it is not really slow.
That's I don't consider that. It's not a ballot.

Speaker 1 (32:55):
Well it's yeah, it's it's not required about the album
version of Devotion I consider a slow song, whereas I'll
DJ the live for it, like as a jam. But yeah,
that's so weird. Okay, so can you how are you officially?
Uh well wait, what what were your impressions of Earth

(33:18):
Wind and Fire when you handed that record?

Speaker 7 (33:20):
I was blown away, first of all, because we didn't
didn't have any pictures of them, so I couldn't conceive
of them being an African American group. Yeah, because I
had never heard anything like that ever before. And this
is the first this is their Warner Brothers, this is
the Warner Brothers stuff, and uh, you know, like I'm gonna,

(33:43):
I couldn't have I couldn't imagine what they looked like
because I'd never been introduced to afrocentric you know, music
and all that kind of stuff, and and you know,
it was no very much so very much so, I mean,
and it was esoteric and you know, I was like, whoa,

(34:05):
what is this? And then there was a merge of
all of of the different genres in the music, and
I'm like, what these guys look like?

Speaker 1 (34:16):
You know?

Speaker 7 (34:16):
And then Perry brought them to Denver on a promotional
tour and that's when Verdin came down to the club,
saw me and and Carl play and stuff, and we
actually opened the show for them, and on their promotional tour,
and I met Maurice on the elevator. Okay, yeah, he

(34:39):
had coconut oil. That's the first time I never knew.

Speaker 1 (34:44):
I never heard. I never smelled no oils, and I
just I smelled coconuts. You know. It's like yeah, and
he had a cowboy hat on. You know. Wow, So your.

Speaker 6 (34:57):
First tour or whatever you went on, your first tour
must have been pretty mind blowing. To see how the
rest of.

Speaker 1 (35:02):
Like mind blowing? Wait before it. See, the thing is
that if you're not involved with Warner era Earth, when
and fired who was like a moment of truth.

Speaker 7 (35:13):
I swore that was you singing no, No, that was
that was That was the first group. All the first
group was around Maurice's age, ten years older than us.
So come a Columbia time, he totally got the whole band.

Speaker 1 (35:26):
The whole band.

Speaker 7 (35:27):
It was only they left, and it was only him
and Verdein and and so. In that time period they
had met me through the Denver experience and I was
out in Los Angeles. I was a musical director of
percussions for a band called the Stove All Sisters, which
was yeah, and so I would play and rehearse the

(35:53):
band and stuff, so they knew I could sing and stuff.
They broke up and I was going to send, you know,
my wife at the time, Janet, and my first son, Sir,
back to Denver he had just been born. And Maurice
and Vernein came over and said, do you want to
be in the band? And I said, on one condition.

(36:13):
They said what I said, I want to be in
the best band in.

Speaker 1 (36:16):
The whole world.

Speaker 10 (36:18):
Wow.

Speaker 1 (36:19):
And they looked at each other and they said, you're
that's a mighty demand. Then we ate oatmeal for next Wait.

Speaker 7 (36:29):
Every time we thought we was going on the road,
we'd get ready to get we'd get in the car
and be on the way and some of them somebody
would call and they'd go, yeah, it's counselor. I was
gonna God, So I was thinking, I was, I was,
I was debating on if I should go to you know,
to some training school or whatever. And the guy I

(36:50):
was living with said, look, either you're gonna, you know,
do that. Are you gonna do this. If you're gonna
do this, go back in there and you know, practice
your music and stuff.

Speaker 1 (37:00):
But that happened. That was our testing grounds. And then
you know, once we got on.

Speaker 7 (37:04):
The road, we got out here, we got to Philly,
and then is that the infamous booing night yep staring
out to Philly got to Philly.

Speaker 1 (37:14):
The story.

Speaker 7 (37:15):
We got to Philly uptown and all the do wop
groups and stuff, and we had on you know, we
had on tights and all that kind of stuff different
And so then we had that colimba and and Rilly
Loss playing the soprano saxophone.

Speaker 1 (37:31):
He ain't never seen none of that.

Speaker 7 (37:33):
And so we got on the stage and the whoo
y'all stink, you know, it's you know, throwing little stuff
up there. More he told us all to sit down
on the ground and the lotus position, so we all, yeah,
oh yeah in Philly after uptown, So we just sat,
he said, and just be still and so just and

(37:53):
just stare at him.

Speaker 1 (37:55):
So so we did.

Speaker 7 (37:56):
We in Philly after uptown, sitting in the lotus position
with you know, with tights on, you know, you know,
and staring at the ordinance as they curse at us.
And they kept on and they kept only kept on,
and then they calmed down a little bit and Maury
started playing that colimba.

Speaker 1 (38:16):
How did y'all at them? Man?

Speaker 7 (38:18):
We at least ten minutes they they Then then he
started playing the colimber and Ronnie Larve started improvising over
that colimber. Larry Dunn went to that keyboard started playing
them chords and we run into a rhythm. When we
got finished with that show, it was nothing like it
gives me chills to this day.

Speaker 1 (38:39):
Really we were so it.

Speaker 7 (38:41):
Was like Philly Love, Earth Wind and Fire. They was
the It was the first that was and we got
it was so monumental that when we got done, we
went back to the hotel where he said, we're gonna
have a meeting, you know, and we all got together
and he's and we all recognized something special had happened

(39:01):
that night. You know, we all recognize it and we
just have to affirm it. You know, he said they're
gonna eat either love you or hate you, but they
can't be.

Speaker 1 (39:11):
In the middle. Wow. Side note, I am trying to
buy the town. Really yeah, I've been you know, that's
that's one of my life goals with Sirah Live Nation.

(39:32):
Shout out to Sorgy.

Speaker 6 (39:33):
Oh before they get it, don't partner, just take it off.

Speaker 3 (39:37):
It's not the man he is, but he's the man
the company. No, it's still there, control on the rock.
It's still it's still, it's still there. It's still a shell.
And you know it's it's been The Uptown has been
closed since eighty nine. I think, oh yeah, like thirty

(39:58):
years now, that's a full I.

Speaker 6 (40:00):
Was just thinking I was a full circle moment. I
remember Fourth of July what was that ten years ago
when earth went and fire came to Philly and you
guys did the curation for the welcome American things. Yeah,
and it was just like a full circle moment of
seeing them after.

Speaker 1 (40:17):
So okay with the first record, First of all, can
you please tell us about Charles.

Speaker 3 (40:26):
Stephanie and we had emotions on the show like a
while back, and they were kind of really yeah, we
had them in La.

Speaker 7 (40:35):
But the closest thing thing I could say about Charles
is Quincy Jones. You know that type of person. But
he was also like just such a humble he was.
He was an orchestrator and the ranger, vibist, pianist, ah,

(41:03):
and you know, a songwriter and and a lover of
his family, you know, and a teacher and a very
very humble, understated person. And uh, all he did was
just make music and and all those sounds and stuff

(41:24):
before everything got multi tamborled and stuff.

Speaker 1 (41:27):
He would record note for note.

Speaker 7 (41:32):
Then you know, do the octaves change him, harmonize him,
all that harmony stuff that that was on since before
you know they got they got multi times.

Speaker 1 (41:43):
Say you have to play one at the time. I
have one of my life goals was try to find
the all about love stems to see how he crafted
the interlude that comes at the end, all right, that's
eventually celebrate. Can you speak on that for a second.

(42:04):
How the the ending of right? So basically that's his
plate backwards right. I realized that now because on the
Master rel when I heard it, I was like, oh,
this is celebrate And then I realized that, Okay, you
guys must have just played it, but it still sounds

(42:26):
the same, like back and forth. Okay, So initially he
was demoing what would have been Celebrate, which is on
the Gratitude album. Can you describe what the what's the
jamming process or how does a seed of a song
or an idea form into Like do you guys take

(42:49):
rough ideas to Charles and then he'll stretch it out
because I've heard I mean, in the reissues of a
lot of these albums, you'll hear super rough demos of
of Shining Star and various earth Wind and Fire songs
when they're just like jamming ideas.

Speaker 7 (43:06):
Right well, like on that song Charles had really if
I remember right, there was a lot of that song
that was already there before me and Maurice started writing
lyrics and stuff and everything that that he would bring

(43:27):
Maurice and Charles had. They they worked really really well together,
and al McKay was the key was a lot really Yeah,
It's just like I could take a complicated whatever, complicated
musical you know, piece or passage and make it groove

(43:50):
really whatever whatever, because you know, that's a lot of
music going on right there. You know, all those changes
and all that kind of stuff.

Speaker 1 (43:58):
But you can so you feel that album. Ka is
a guitar player, was the he was someone of the
epicenter or you know, he's the lock. He was. He
was a lock because he he played with you know,
watch hundred and third Street, and he was an R
and B keing. He just.

Speaker 7 (44:21):
Out even wanted to be complicated, you know. He he
was about the funk and so whatever idea that Maurice
would have filters through him, filtered through him and he
would lock it up with with with Verdein and the drummer.

(44:41):
You know, if Maurice wasn't playing, because if Maurice is playing,
it was a lot simple, simpler because Maurice pocket had
a pocket, you know, so in.

Speaker 1 (44:49):
The studio, Maurice would play drums most of the time. Yeah,
Maurice is playing on that okay, wow. Yeah. He played
on most of the stuff until until fred Eddy, until
Ralph was initially in the Last Days in Time, was
Ralph drumming on that album. Then Freddy came along.

Speaker 7 (45:09):
For Maurice on the on the records, it was Maurice
until Freddy came. Ralph did play on That's the Way
of the World. Okay, Okay, what was the relationship with
Clive Davis, Like just very supportive and and unlike his

(45:36):
experience with under like unlike a lot of the experiences
that I've heard with other artists.

Speaker 1 (45:43):
He never we didn't have those basically the only thing
you're talking about blessed wat.

Speaker 7 (45:50):
And he didn't he didn't and he didn't get into
the artistic thing. He didn't get into the art.

Speaker 1 (45:57):
But you guys were the blueprint of art, right, that's the.

Speaker 7 (46:01):
Thing like get into you know, like he likes this
song and getting this da da da da. He was
just you know, Marris's give him the record when he
got finished.

Speaker 1 (46:09):
But how okay. But the thing is is that the
legacy of Clive Davis is okay, quote the greatest ears
in music or whatever. His his mantra is like I
have the best ears of music. You guys, though, were
so artsy, like literally reintroducing or establishing afrocentristic afro jazz,

(46:35):
but fil but still with the pop sens like you
guys were so pop but so black at the money
ass hooks. Cause yeah, so like what you know, would
like the whole idea of like don't boris gets the
course and all that stuff like, who's the disciplinarian that
knew Oh.

Speaker 7 (46:53):
Okay, we're going all over the place. Really yeah, he
had total a time me. He just you know he
because he his background too was we worked at Chess
Records in the in the in the advertisement, uh commercial department,
and so like they would have contests with all the

(47:14):
different writers, and Charles Stepney was arranger and he named
Maurice Rooney tunes. That's how we you know, that's what
we all call him Maurice Rooney because Maurice had this
sense of getting getting a hook. So he was the
hook man definitely. And he also believed that the hooks

(47:37):
shouldn't just be in the choruses, but they should be
in the music itself, you know, and in the grooves
and all that kind of stuff.

Speaker 1 (47:44):
So so how did you guys avoid not that I
thought that there was cliche one on one and sold
music in the early seventies, Like you're on my mind
all the time. I can't stop thinking about you, like
this just the typical rhyme scheme that is in every
I mean, Motown basically wrote the book on that. But

(48:06):
how like you guys are talking about mysticism and spirituality
and and things that aren't necessarily you know, day to
day conversation. Yeah, what were you smoking?

Speaker 6 (48:21):
No?

Speaker 1 (48:22):
But like how would you is it books that you
guys would read. And then Maurice was reading a lot
of stuff. He was reading a lot of stuff. And because.

Speaker 7 (48:32):
He had traveled with Ramsey Lewis and they had traveled
to the Orient, different things like that, you know, and
he was reading he changed his whole his whole lifestyle,
diet and all the cast because I went to I
went to Ramsey's house and saw a picture of Reese
where he was thirty pounds thirty five pounds, bigger and

(48:53):
stuff and looked, you know, looked a lot older. And
I'll resiute, you know, really, yeah, that's when I used
to drink, you know, oh wow, you know, but since
when some from the time that I knew Maries, he
never he didn't drink and stuff or smoke or anything
like that.

Speaker 1 (49:11):
And so you know, you know that that kind of
discipline was it hard doing that in the seventies, Like
now food is more like science has made food very
easy to you know, for a kind of not a
connoisse or a kind of war like me to follow
It is way easier now in today's society. But you know,

(49:34):
back then a diet soda might taste like the worst
thing in the world. But you know, how how hard
was it to really maintain that discipline? Then he want
the whole entire band to also follow the diet, and well, no,
that's not true. He wasn't.

Speaker 7 (49:53):
He wasn't like controlling like that, you know, like you know,
it's like what's good for him? You know, it was
just more example kind of situation. You know, you you
try different things, or you watch somebody doing something, you
see how it's working for them or whatever, and you know,
if it's cool, you know, you might try it.

Speaker 1 (50:13):
I mean even today, like if I go to Alabama,
like I doubt, I mean only recently. It's so, how
does one survive a healthy he wants lifestyle in you
know areas making choices, you know, just just making choices.
He wasn't you know, at certain points he did have

(50:36):
you know, different people cooking for him or whatever. Okay, but.

Speaker 6 (50:45):
I'm more, I'm more I'm confused to how you guys were.
It sounds like you were a drug free band in
the seventies. Not really, ok, But you said he wasn't
that much of a discipline.

Speaker 1 (50:56):
He wasn't he wasn't speaking about him, all right, Okay,
so open our Eyes man, Now here's the thing, Open
our Eyes. I believe it was written by Yeah because
Eddie sings you mean that song? Yes, it's it's a
no good go you go. No, No, I don't want

(51:18):
to mess it up. No.

Speaker 7 (51:20):
Open Our Eyes was a song that Maurice Uh this
this uh guy used to play in Chicago on his
going off. He used to you know all the time,
and the and I want to I forget the actual
artists who actually had it first. You might can look

(51:43):
that up. No, you mean father, but that not the No,
it wasn't No, that wasn't them. That was I forget
the guy's name, but you could probably look it up
father father Opened our Eyes. And so Maurice decided, you
know how much I'm gonna do that song because it
was just in his head because he heard it all
the time.

Speaker 1 (52:03):
See, I thought that funkin Delic also covered that song
on I was basically trying to lead into the fact
that they do they do Okay, So okay, I knew
Yeah Funkadelic also covered I thought they wrote it, but
most most most most soul historians have made once on

(52:25):
the fact that you know, Earth Wind and Fire versus
p Funk is sort of Beatles versus Rolling Stones. Well,
I mean, you guys the Beatles in that is clearly
the Beatles. Yeah, yeah, Okay, like you guys were never
seen as the bad boys of soul music.

Speaker 3 (52:44):
Okay, you know, I was thinking Funkadelic is sort of.
But the thing is is that both of them have
the same ideology, Like you guys have your version of
spiritualism and afro futurism as far as the concepts.

Speaker 1 (52:59):
That you'll later explore, at least with the you know,
with pyramid technology and future technology. Were you guys aware
of each other's existence in the early period before you
guys became superpowers. Were you guys even aware of what
was happening in Detroit Ends seventy two to seventy four?

(53:22):
I would assume that seventy four is kind of the
year where both acts finally got their engines waring. But
like in the Buzziers seventy two seventy three, were you
guys even aware of each other at all? Yeah, we
were aware of each.

Speaker 7 (53:36):
Other, and you know, both bands were so busy trying
to really carve out their own destinies and be true
to their identity. You know that we didn't take a
lot of time.

Speaker 1 (53:52):
But I know.

Speaker 7 (53:54):
The one experience that we always talked about to this
day is we played with the funk Cacadelics at the Armory.
And it's not New York car, no no d C
in d C at the Armory and we that was
before we we we hadn't found no funk yet, and

(54:15):
so we went on there talking about you know, I
think about love, right, and so we had our little
we had our little polite applause, and then the funk Aadelics.
First you saw the smoke come out of the room,
open the door, and you saw because they were smoking

(54:36):
right right, and then you hear it.

Speaker 1 (54:41):
Right right, man.

Speaker 7 (54:44):
They funked us out of there so bad until Maurice said,
we going back to l A. We're gonna rehearse, you
know really.

Speaker 1 (54:51):
Yeah, So we went.

Speaker 7 (54:52):
We we went from there wherever we were on the road,
we checked into wherever we were, and we had a rehearsal.

Speaker 1 (54:59):
We gotta find the one, you know, really really wow,
oh yeah, And then we went.

Speaker 7 (55:09):
Back to Los Angeles and we rehearsed and stuff, and
that's when Reese changed and went and got al McKay. Okay, okay,
he said, you know because Johnny was just there Johnny Graham, yep,
cousin of Larry Graham.

Speaker 1 (55:26):
I didn't know if his cousin. Yeah, I didn't. Wait,
how do you not know that I know that Larry
Graham discuss it?

Speaker 3 (55:33):
I never knew that really, never Johnny double check that
I've read many never talked It's book.

Speaker 1 (55:43):
He never talked very much to anybody. Okay, So it
is a lot of you, and I know, to make it,
to make life work, you kind of have to be friends.
Or who are the clicks in the group? Like who
do you who's your running buddy versus? You know, did

(56:03):
the Horns just hanging with each other? That Maurice and
Verdin just like who well, you know, like if you say,
and I'm talking classic lineup, okay.

Speaker 7 (56:13):
Clicks, you would say the Phoenix Horns. You definitely they
hung together because they were crazy.

Speaker 1 (56:22):
Boy oh boy? And who who are those guys? Who
are the.

Speaker 7 (56:29):
Michael Harris, Don Myrick and lou Sadderfield.

Speaker 1 (56:35):
Okay, Steve is waking up because of course Phoenix horns Phoenix. Also, yes,
we'll get to that. Reese was a loner.

Speaker 7 (56:47):
Unless he was he'd hang with me, he'd hang with
with Verdein. I think my my my hanging buddies were
probably Ralph and Larry Dunn because I grew up with
him and Andrew, you know, and they Me and Ralph
had to meet room together too, you know, back in

(57:09):
the day when you have to.

Speaker 1 (57:10):
Back in the day two two in the motel. Ok. Wow,
how Also, this is what I really want to know.
What is standard for survival when you're in such a
large scale group. The reason why so many AXCO solo
course is to get the biggest piece of the pie,
their own pie. But when you are one ninth of

(57:36):
a superpower and you're not touring twenty four to seven
or making your own direct money, like when touring stops
and it's like I gotta go home and pay these
bills and you still got responsibilities, right. So if I'm
I know what it takes to survive like that in
twenty nineteen because I'm oh shit, I'm in my own

(57:58):
earth room and fire with eleven eleven, you know, when
the roots this out, like four members ye yeah, why
how do we get to eleven? So I know what
it takes for you know, eleven people to make a
good living out of this. But if it's nineteen seventy three,
seventy four, seventy five, what is good living? What is it?

(58:22):
What is a good living weekly pay? Is it making
six hundred dollars a week or well? And you guys
did that baller mentality, So it wasn't like you had
rap videos to look at to be like I need that.
So yeah, you figure that was a different time.

Speaker 7 (58:41):
Diff you know, we weren't we weren't balling, We weren't
trying to buy you know, a thousand dollars pairs of
shoes and all that kind of stuff, you know, And
you figure that everybody that was there at that time,
except for maybe Al McKay, we're coming straight from their

(59:03):
collective environments. Me from Denver, Johnny Graham from Kentucky, Ralph
from Los Angeles. You know, So what impressed us then
didn't take a whole lot, you know, it didn't take
a whole lot.

Speaker 1 (59:22):
And so you know, it was years you know before
you know, we really.

Speaker 7 (59:29):
Had any kind of understanding of really how much money
was being made.

Speaker 1 (59:36):
What was okay? But what was the dream? I'll say,
like in ninety four, my version of the dream was,
you know, if I could do this for a living,
have all my bills paid, move out my parents' crib,
and move in a nicer you know. I was doing
that nice, humble thing, and that lasted me good until

(01:00:01):
all right, I started making role money like maybe like
twenty ten, and then I was like, oh, okay, I'm
gonna be corrupt like the rest of rich America because
now I you know, I never thought I'd get to
this level of, Oh, let me burn this one hundred
dollars bill with a cigar like that sort of you
did what? No, I'm just I always had I always

(01:00:22):
imagine a fat cat lighting up a cigar with one
hundred dollars bill. But I'm just saying that in the
in the seventies, what was just the dream? And was
it easy to make make a weekly living as a
full time singer? Because we know based on some of
these like unsung episodes, and from what I heard, pimping

(01:00:46):
was actually the DJ gig of the seventies. Really, Harold
Melvin James Brown, like I can name.

Speaker 6 (01:00:54):
At least ten to I'm sorry, did you say pimping
just like just like.

Speaker 1 (01:00:58):
With rappers taking your money and investing it in the cocaine?

Speaker 6 (01:01:05):
Okay, I don't.

Speaker 1 (01:01:07):
Yeah, I mean my version of that is the DJ gig.
For the longest, the roots was like my my, no money,
like whatever, like that's the prestige thing and that's that's
his legacy. But you know, I make a real living
off of DJ gigs because one and I don't have
to share it with eleven people. So true. So I'm

(01:01:27):
just asking what was just the life goals of like
I'm satisfied.

Speaker 7 (01:01:33):
And well, yeah, you have to remember that we were
just coming out the Peace of Love era and we
were very idealistic. So for us, we we we believed
the whole spiell. We we really believed that we were family, okay,

(01:01:56):
you know, and we really believed that, you know, where
everything that Marias was doing was taking care of all
of us, and we really did believe that we were
you know that, Oh it's just gonna because you know,
we were living our dream I see what you're saying,
We're living our dreams. So it's like, you know, if

(01:02:17):
anybody did raise up to say what you know, everybody
would have to remind him of how blessed we really were,
you know, to be you know, doing what we were doing.

Speaker 1 (01:02:30):
So I guess it's it's it's financially impossible to have
a unit that size and not come out the gate
making millions. Because even for us, we did that. We did,
we did, we did community thing like for the least

(01:02:51):
the first fifteen years of the roots, like me and
Tury didn't start taking salaries until super late, like two
thousand and eight.

Speaker 6 (01:02:59):
But see, there was a point when everything changed. That's
why I'm wondering how that worked.

Speaker 1 (01:03:02):
Well, we started making more money, but I'm just saying
that in the beginning, when we get a check, it
goes to everyone's rent, everyone's gas, everyone's that sort of thing.

Speaker 7 (01:03:13):
So well, that wasn't what was happening, though, I don't
want during the period, I don't want you to think
that because that's not true. See what, See, the first
group left because they knew that they would never be
an equal part or take an equal share in the

(01:03:34):
ban earth, Wind and Fire. They they they left, Okay,
they knew because they had you know, they were older,
they had more experience, they knew, Okay, we came in,
we ain't know nothing.

Speaker 1 (01:03:48):
Okay, so we were it was years before we knew that.
Basically we were just employees, you know, and the Lion's
share of everything was more.

Speaker 6 (01:04:04):
So you guys didn't notice as you were going to
his house to visit and things of that nature like that,
like this was huge.

Speaker 1 (01:04:10):
And I'm no, we didn't. We didn't know that. But
I have to say, though we all had houses, we
you know, we weren't like I wasn't trying to comfort
the angle. It wasn't the money, but I just wanted
to know.

Speaker 7 (01:04:22):
Yeah, it wasn't like it wasn't like we you know,
we were in the apartments and he was you know,
you know his his his mansions were bigger than our houses.
But you know, yeah, we all had houses, and that
was something that we never thought that we would have.

Speaker 1 (01:04:39):
But growing up, I would I would think growing up, like,
all right, let's take a group like Mandrel, even though
I know there's blue collar musicians and people that work
for a living. But in my five year old head,
I'm looking at Mandrail and I'm like, yeah, they're on
soul Tree. Yeah those guys are millionaires, and that that's
the and that's the impression that everyone has about who

(01:05:00):
whatever they see on TV or here on the radio.
So what I'm just saying is like, in nineteen seventy five,
could a trombone player just make fifty to seventy five
thousand a year and be cool for that period?

Speaker 7 (01:05:18):
Back in those days, a trouble player if he made
fifteen thousand dollars a year.

Speaker 1 (01:05:24):
Fifteen thousand year, Wow, whoa whoa?

Speaker 7 (01:05:28):
Back then, if he made fifteen thousand dollars a year,
he could be cool. You gotta gotta look it up.
So that's a hand of mount thing. Like still even
with all and on stuff on the radio.

Speaker 1 (01:05:41):
Like, it's still like you guys were blue collar musicians
having to go to work every day. And I didn't
know that.

Speaker 7 (01:05:48):
I didn't know that that musicians made the kind of
money that they made until I was talking to the
Mouse one time, to the who feeling games?

Speaker 1 (01:05:56):
Filling games?

Speaker 6 (01:06:00):
Oh that's not a physical thing, is it?

Speaker 10 (01:06:01):
No?

Speaker 1 (01:06:02):
No, that's that's that's that's his nickname. Kay. You know
Quincy called everybody called him mouse. He put you on
the game Wow.

Speaker 7 (01:06:11):
Look where I was at at at A and M
and he was at a and m and we were talking.
See we used to go to the same church and
stuff giving me and Mouse and so like, Mouse told
me that he was making ten thousand dollars a week

(01:06:32):
with Michael back then.

Speaker 1 (01:06:35):
Wow, way back then, way back then. And I said,
that's good. Whoa ten dollars a week? She said, yeah,
what you make? Oh Lord, before you answer this question,

(01:06:57):
I thought it was gonna be a sound of frek
Fee show all right with me?

Speaker 7 (01:07:07):
I said, what, I had no idea that, because look, man,
we're playing five nights sellouts at the Forum by ourself.
We're playing you know, Whimley five nights, you know, by ourselves.
Come on, come on, do the math.

Speaker 1 (01:07:26):
I am you know.

Speaker 3 (01:07:27):
It's like we we got we got plaques for for
the for the Massive Square Garden, you know now now
by you know, by ourselves, we got three four double
double triple platinum albums.

Speaker 6 (01:07:45):
You know, I'm like, what, So, how do you have
that conversation with the man who's kind of like your brother?

Speaker 1 (01:07:52):
Now? How do you how do you how do you
Maurice talk about that? Or do you You don't? Okay,
you know, I understand the.

Speaker 6 (01:08:06):
Why do you rectify?

Speaker 1 (01:08:09):
Sometimes? Sometimes you do sometimes you don't, you know, hopefully
now is the you know, the glory period or whatever.

Speaker 7 (01:08:19):
Like it was one of those kinds of situations where
you know, like because like you was if you read
the book, it was one of those kind of situations
where you know, like, oh, and you were gonna ask
me why I didn't like.

Speaker 1 (01:08:32):
Raise Okay, okay, because it was no because it was
it was in that period where you.

Speaker 7 (01:08:43):
Know, everybody was coming of age and their eyes were
open and their eyes were being open, and you know,
the the chemistry was terrible, and he was using other
musicians to do the pretty much do the record, you know,
except for you know, me and him. We were doing
and we were like session musicians to come in and

(01:09:05):
do it. So it's like power light and all that.
Oh my god. I was like, I could not I
could not listen to that record.

Speaker 1 (01:09:14):
I remember.

Speaker 3 (01:09:16):
The first time I mentioned and that's the first record
you said, you like, I looked at you and you said,
you mean you don't like that record.

Speaker 1 (01:09:26):
Dude, about yesterdamn one record.

Speaker 7 (01:09:31):
I mean I probably could, you know, I could listen
to it now, you know, But I think it was
just a matter of you know, you can't listen to
it without you know, taking you back into you know,
all the craziness that was going on.

Speaker 1 (01:09:48):
All right, before I get deep in in financial hole,
there's still more I gotta ask. Can you talk about
Caribou Wrench. You guys chose Caribou Wrench to record.

Speaker 7 (01:09:59):
Your records because they were ghosts in the in the
in the in the place. For reals, really, man, and
I no joke, there were ghosts and they told us
there were ghosts there, and you know, I didn't believe
it until I saw one.

Speaker 1 (01:10:14):
Did you bring it up? Because it was in Colorado? Like,
how did you guys up? Yeah, you know, the Colorado
has a great connection.

Speaker 7 (01:10:20):
But it was a place where there were like about
five or six different cabins. All the cabins had you know,
three bedrooms in them with the kitchens and it was
really a fabulous place, horses everything, you know, it was
like a you know, it was large enough for it

(01:10:41):
to be a little city.

Speaker 1 (01:10:43):
Yeah.

Speaker 7 (01:10:44):
And the groups would go up there, and we were
the only you know, African American band that you know,
ever worked up there.

Speaker 1 (01:10:51):
You know, we did two records up there. Open our
eyes and that's the way of the world. Okay, okay,
can you talk about the uh that's the way in
the world with the Harvey Hotel. Oh yeah, it wasn't
that terrible. I thought it was enjoyable. Man. What you
guys had distant so much really that when I finally

(01:11:12):
got the DVD and watched it, Man, we went to
the opening was a high standards.

Speaker 7 (01:11:21):
Were always all excited. We went to the opening and
stuff because we thought, oh man, we're on the move.
We're going to the opening. We got there, man, nobody
was there first of all, and then we saw it
and we was like, so, how how did you guys
manage to But it was a catalyst for some great writing,

(01:11:42):
I know.

Speaker 1 (01:11:42):
But the thing was is that because the fonts the
print was so small, that was where he said, look,
that's what we're gonna do.

Speaker 7 (01:11:54):
He called Bob and Joe and he said, I want
that writing on there to be so little really from
the movie.

Speaker 1 (01:12:03):
From the movie. That's the way I wanted them to
have to look for it to see that. I thought
you guys were just being clever, like you made up of.

Speaker 7 (01:12:11):
Like he he did that once we saw it, because
he's like, man, that's what that's what he said.

Speaker 1 (01:12:19):
So the album was released way in advance before the
movie came out.

Speaker 7 (01:12:23):
I'm not I don't, yeah, I think it was released before. Okay,
so he was already a hit.

Speaker 1 (01:12:29):
Yeah, So what was the what was the feeling of finally,
I mean, being as though that was the breakthrough album?
What was the feeling? Well, I mean you slowly heard
Evil and Mighty Mighty and all that stuff on the
radio or whatnot. But was it?

Speaker 3 (01:12:43):
Was it?

Speaker 1 (01:12:44):
What was the main difference between Shining Star success as
opposed to hearing Mighty Mighty.

Speaker 7 (01:12:52):
And and well by the time we got the charity
start because we had like about five number one records
on that record.

Speaker 1 (01:13:00):
But we.

Speaker 7 (01:13:02):
We were we were then, we were we were doing
you know, big gigs. You know, we're doing we're doing
big gigs. And we had started to add you know,
the production and all that kind of stuff to to
our our presentation and stuff.

Speaker 1 (01:13:19):
Okay, the the inner Sleeve of Gratitude where it's this
bird's eye view, it's a bird's eye view shot of
you can see the band on stage, but it looks
like you're performing for at least one hundred thousand people.
M h. Was that a music festival or was that

(01:13:40):
a typical earthwinind fire show. I'm assuming there's a lot
of white faces there, Like how I was thinking that
I was I could be wrong. I was thinking that
was Oakland, but I could be wrong. Yeah, it was.

Speaker 7 (01:13:56):
It was just that was a very unfair. I know
we did several we did. We recorded Oakland, we recorded Atlanta,
and I think we might have recorded Los Angeles.

Speaker 1 (01:14:12):
So you guys went from relative underground favorite to like
it looked like a festival, like it was outdoors. It
had to been somewhere between seventy five to one hundred
thousand people all packed in this photo right what happened?
Like is is that the magic of Clive Davison the

(01:14:37):
radio system we're doing.

Speaker 7 (01:14:38):
You know, it was a different time, different day when
everything everything collides together, you know everything the record company
was probably you know, at their at the top of
their game, advertisement and publishing radio every when everything goes right,
everything the music, that product, and people were you know,

(01:15:00):
that's when music was very, very valuable to people. You know,
they didn't have all these other entertainment situations that buying
for their attention and stuff. So you know, a record
came out, man, people were around the corner around the
block to get your record when it came out, and
David Foster was one of them out there.

Speaker 1 (01:15:21):
Well, I want to ask about spirit versus songs in
the kid Life battle. Well I'm gonna get to do that.
Just one thing about gratitude. How set my mind of
these how much live how many? How much? How much
background overdubbing was done on gratitude? Because I refuse to

(01:15:46):
believe that you guys were that perfect in your harmony
game end concert without breaking the sweat, like, well, we didn't.
We we didn't mess with the with the leads.

Speaker 7 (01:15:58):
But me and Maurice he had a you know, clause
and all the stuff that we if we did something
on television, because we we did all the vocals on
the on all the records.

Speaker 1 (01:16:09):
It was just me and him.

Speaker 7 (01:16:10):
So we just you know, molten doubled, you know, all
the harmonies, all the different stuff. One question about your harmonies, man, well,
just your vocals. Would y'all sing them together? We were
singing together, We were singing. It was it was very
very easy, you know, we you know, and we would
sing all the up stuff, you know, all the vocals
we would do so like it was hard for us

(01:16:32):
to duplicate on the on the road. So if we
did something, we did a recording, uh of something, me
and him would go and fix the backgrounds. Okay, yeah,
Wait a minute, Wada mentioned Justica Cleves oh man?

Speaker 1 (01:16:53):
Was she MV? How did she join the the Last
Days and Times? Right? And then when did she leave
for Friends?

Speaker 10 (01:17:02):
Have you?

Speaker 1 (01:17:03):
No? Friends of Stinction was before? Yeah?

Speaker 7 (01:17:06):
That was before she was in She was Friends of Distinction.
That's how we discovered her. I mean we found her. Yeah,
it's Lynny Smith.

Speaker 1 (01:17:14):
And did she go to the Funkadelic Empire after she.

Speaker 7 (01:17:17):
Went to Funkadelics after after she left Earth Wind Fire?

Speaker 1 (01:17:24):
Okay, well all right, speaking of it is one thing
I forgot. Did you guys have any response to Let's
take It to the stage or you just took it
as playful ribbing? You say, what, did you guys have
any any response or or feelings about the song Let's
take It to the stage? Or did you consider that

(01:17:45):
just playful ribbing of Funkadelic calling out all the soul
bands of the I don't, I don't, I'm not familiar.
It's does he call them again? Earth No? Like he
you know slipping the family brick snoofs tell me something good.
He's basically saying, let's take it to the stage, let's battle. Uh,

(01:18:10):
and names like you know, six or seven acts. But
I mean, you know, where was that seventy six, seventy four,
seventy four on the Let's Take It to the Stage album?

Speaker 6 (01:18:26):
Was never too late for a battle though George is.

Speaker 1 (01:18:29):
About to retire, Yeah, it is too late for late before. Yeah,
but I always wanted to know if if you guys,
like ever you know, took serious offense to that or
you know, was it just but you didn't know until
right now this No one ever mentioned that scene. No, wow,

(01:18:52):
Johnny Graham, Let's take it into stage. It's just weird
that nobody's ever mentioned that because I remember the first
time I heard Let's take it the Stage, I was like,
WHOA called him out? I was like, I was like,
I was like, what did everybody think about this?

Speaker 2 (01:19:05):
Well?

Speaker 1 (01:19:06):
Yeah, I always wanted to know if there were Well,
how did you guys feel about other bands in the day, Like, say,
did you name a band name, a band that you
felt some sort of way about, Like, man, we gotta
we just didn't that was we just didn't beef like
that back, you know, like like nobody guys kept you

(01:19:27):
guys on your toes.

Speaker 7 (01:19:28):
Everybody, you know, everyone wanted to be original, you know,
we were kind of being out of shape when Ohio
players been on on our music a lot, you know,
really yeah, you know, like just like almost verbatim, you know, like,
but but up from that to that point, there were

(01:19:49):
like very few bands that wanted to sound.

Speaker 1 (01:19:53):
Like the other band. You know, you would we would
do it ribbing each other, you know, or something. You know,
I would say Barka's more than but literally in every
bar case. But they admitted that they were by the
forty five of whatever band it was, and then switched,
which is why Shine sounds like on your face or whatever.

(01:20:16):
So the battle of Spirit versus Songs in the Key
of Life, of course, uh, I think one of the
first event moments in black music. I remember because I
was five at the time, but a lot of my
dad's bandmates were speaking of this. Of course. Both I

(01:20:40):
think Spirit and Songs in the Cay of Life were
released within a week of each other. Wow, right, yeah,
right of each other. Wow. And I think you guys
came out the the day before. I'm not certain, but

(01:21:02):
were you were you at all? Did you have any
investment whatsoever, like expectation investments to debut at number one.
The end result, of course, the songs in the Kiev
Life debut at number one. You guys debuted at number two.
But I mean, was there a feeling of competition at
the time, Like the most important artists in the history

(01:21:27):
of black music is releasing their their definitive statement. No,
there's just another day to you.

Speaker 7 (01:21:37):
You know, you got to remember that it's a different time.
You know, a lot of a lot of the things
that you're talking about right now have kind of been
ingrained in culture as culture has moved a longiness, you know.
But for for us, I mean, Stevie has always been beloved,

(01:21:57):
you know, as an artist, and I'm sure that he
feels the exact same way about us, you know, And
so you know, we were inspired by one another, you know,
because like when he said, when he heard shine a Star,
then he went home and wrote, Sir Duke, Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,

(01:22:24):
the thing oh I wish, Yeah, he went home and
wrote I wish, you know. But yeah, it was just
one of those kinds of situations where we know, it
was like we we had admiration society. You know, we're
happy for him, and I'm sure he was happy for us.

Speaker 1 (01:22:40):
Okay, is there a particular reason why, Uh, this is
a nerd question, a serious nerd question. Uh, why you
guys dropped the original intro off of Getaway the Do
you remember the fifteen second No, there's uh it's a man.

(01:23:03):
When I heard that, I was like, yo, and we
play that, we play that now, you still do it? Now?
We do it now in our show. They took it
off for radio, and I always wanted to know why
you guys never kept that on the album. I'll actually
say that imagination. Listen, man, let me tell you something, man,

(01:23:23):
what was you on that day? Because I feel like
that look, even that.

Speaker 3 (01:23:28):
Angels mix, it's like the mix there's like an a
cappella mix of it that it was on the reissue
re issue?

Speaker 1 (01:23:32):
Yeah, oh my god, man, y'all vocals. That's what I
was asking. What do you feel? Yeah? What do you
feel your best performances?

Speaker 7 (01:23:40):
I think that probably was one of my best, you know,
even more than I write a song for you probably
just be thinking about it, you know, like cause you
know how you know you're still all the time, and
so you think you remember how you felt in different
situations and stuff, and uh, you know, I do remember

(01:24:02):
the imagination vamp.

Speaker 1 (01:24:05):
How do you charte out your ad libs? Because they're
so well, no, they're just so nuanced and so I mean,
they're they're they're they're there their own universe that even
in listening to it, like I feel as though you
really mastered. That's why I said skilled, you mastered the

(01:24:29):
the perfect pacing of an ad lib, because I mean
people would think like, oh, yeah, just do you know?
And I'm I'm guilty of that a lot where I'd
tell singers like, okay, just ad lib at the end
and see what happens, and no magic ever happens, but
you like, you know, raise it and then lowered? Lais
it lowered? And how do you do you take?

Speaker 7 (01:24:50):
I'm a musician too, you know, so, and yeah, you know,
loving the a musician part of you know, a musician
part of me. You know, it's just like it's a solo,
you know. So like when you're taking a solo, there's
a beginning, a middle, and then end.

Speaker 1 (01:25:12):
You know. So I'm you know, I'm not thinking that way.

Speaker 7 (01:25:15):
But you know, just the the artistic arc is, you
know the energy I say, you know it's you know
you ain't gonna start, you know, just.

Speaker 1 (01:25:28):
Nowhere to go? You know, nowhere to go? You know
it's the thing a lesser, a lesser singer normally, like
today cats go zero to sixty instantly giving themselves like
no room to to build up to that point. And
yet you know, I mean you're given sixteen bars to

(01:25:53):
figure out how to get a point aid to Z
and a very skillful like Navin gation. So how long
does is the recording of like do you do your
main vocals versus you don't lose your voice? And then
do you come back to do the at limbs because
that's some hard singing you're doing, or imagination on some songs.

Speaker 7 (01:26:21):
We would I would sing it and then go home
and listen to it and know that, Okay, I was
gonna have to you know, do do the vamp MH.
I remember, because doing, I mean, the vamps are the

(01:26:42):
art is there's an art of doing in doing the vamps.
I remember, you know some of the emotions we have conversations,
they call and I got to do my vamp tomorrow
on this or that, you know, and we might you know,
tell me, you know, listen to it, you know, give
them some points, you know, you know, because at the

(01:27:07):
end of a song, Jackson, Michael Jackson is the king
of at libin. At the end of a song, I
mean you know, you know the rhythm, the rhythm, you know, yes,
that's the rhythm, the rhythm and how he builds you know,
those songs.

Speaker 1 (01:27:23):
But the thing is that Mike, Mike will tend to
get locked into a thing like the end of the
things I do for you could also be the end
of working day and night. Like he has this default
go to thing where people and that's the thing. You
don't have a default, That's what I'm saying, skilled, because
you are one of the few at livers that now

(01:27:44):
when Felipe won first, the only reason why I feel
as though he's so masterful is because half the time
that's the only part of the song he's allowed to sing.
Because we I'm just slowly discovered, especially now having all
the Soul Train episodes that ain't singing the lyrics. They
just like, all right, Felipe, go and clean up. And

(01:28:05):
you know, if you're giving like thirty seconds a sign
you're gonna you're gonna go for it, say any and everything,
but you never have a a route where it's like
you repeat yourself or have a line. Actually, wait, can
you explain to me what is the genesis of the

(01:28:25):
body eye?

Speaker 6 (01:28:27):
I was waiting for you to ask that.

Speaker 1 (01:28:28):
No, I'm not talking about Bio the song, because I
also want to know how that song did not make
it and yet you guys found that little thirty second
gem that, of course now everyone's favorite interlude of all time.
But I'm just saying in general, the earth wind and
Fire at lib is always a body out. Oh why

(01:28:51):
why that specific.

Speaker 7 (01:28:52):
Memblee love Brazil sixty six? Oh we love we love,
we love us some Brazil six six and we and
we love Brazilian music.

Speaker 1 (01:29:03):
And we studied, you know, we studied that stuff, you
know a lot.

Speaker 7 (01:29:07):
And you know in research, like you know, if if
it's grooving, you know, he wouldn't wouldn't mess with it,
you know, and it sings, you know it, you know
it sings you know like you know, like a phrase
on a horn or whatever.

Speaker 1 (01:29:23):
You know. Wow, So the actual song behl or how
did you bayo b e I j bo? Yeah, yeah,
I gotta find it. That was Milton, not some mental
you know, because we were we were.

Speaker 7 (01:29:44):
He actually played with us when we were in in Brazil,
you know, we played the stadium and stuff. We were
big fans of his and stuff. But with the song
and we did it, we did that song was with him.
We did a song, but we didn't use a song. Yeah,
why did that song make it? It goes all over
the place. I could probably see why it made the

(01:30:04):
cutting room floor.

Speaker 1 (01:30:05):
But more importantly is whose idea was it to find
the right elements that led to the interlude of what
we now know as the Wow Phil.

Speaker 3 (01:30:21):
How did y'all decide which songs will go to other
artists and which will stand in the band?

Speaker 7 (01:30:26):
One song that didn't go to another to the artist
who they had cut it for. Was it was it
the Chambers Brothers or something? What was was Bookie Wonderland?
It was like it was our had produced it on
another group and Maurice heard it, you like come here, yeah,

(01:30:50):
and you know that's how that's how we ended up doing.

Speaker 1 (01:30:56):
Charles also dies during the did he die before the
spirit we were in it? M yeah? Midwait, so what
did that do to the band's chemistry and hm hmm.
What pressure was that on you guys to now take
over the car now that you had no more driver.

Speaker 7 (01:31:20):
Yeah, I mean it was immant really because Maurice was
so much in his zone with Charles, because see, he
could think, he could think as far as he wanted
to think, as fast as he wanted to think, and
Charles musically was able to galvanize things and and then

(01:31:44):
make it help and and Al McKay could put make
a groove, so it was it was a team, you know,
and Larry Dunn could make it sweet, you know, me
do the vocals.

Speaker 1 (01:32:00):
So it was a great team. You know.

Speaker 7 (01:32:03):
When Charles left, there was a serious void because the
only other person that that we found that he really
respected like that, that we had success with was was
David Foster.

Speaker 1 (01:32:20):
So it's essentially David Foster Charles's replacement. Like no Maurice
figure or just an equal. He didn't need.

Speaker 7 (01:32:29):
He really the issue was, you know, really didn't respect
a lot of different a lot of people, Okay, you know,
definitely didn't need no father figure, you know, but he needed.

Speaker 1 (01:32:39):
So Charles wasn't the father figure, well, but he was
the only one.

Speaker 7 (01:32:43):
He was the only you can say, really, get that
ship out of here, you know, that's how you talk,
you know, you know he could. He's the only one
that talked how Reese talked to us. That's how the
Charles talked to Rees. Really really get this shut out
of here, you know, no, you know, but because he
really respected Charles in that in that kind of way,

(01:33:05):
so nobody ever replaced him.

Speaker 1 (01:33:08):
You know, no one ever replaced him.

Speaker 7 (01:33:10):
But David did have that same musical ability, not the same,
but he had you know, had had a creditible music.

Speaker 3 (01:33:22):
Ability that Maurice respected. So we were able to besides
besides wild was it.

Speaker 1 (01:33:31):
For new birth? Uh? Wild flower? Besides Wildflower? What? What
did David have that at least got his rap out
there with people like, yo, I'm gonna mess with him?

Speaker 7 (01:33:43):
Or well he you know, he has a really good
sense of songs and you know, like and he was
accomplished as a as a as a pianist. So him
and Marie were able to you know, to craft you know,
like in the Stone and all that kind of stuff,

(01:34:05):
and Maurice was able to make it commercial.

Speaker 1 (01:34:09):
Okay, okay, but David didn't come for all and nod
he what is the serpentine fire. Serpentine fire is the
is the male sex drive?

Speaker 6 (01:34:23):
Viagrap No, that's something you take for the drive.

Speaker 1 (01:34:34):
Was how is passion? You know? You know LUs okay
on the on the male side, serpentine.

Speaker 6 (01:34:46):
That's what you'reposed to have naturally.

Speaker 7 (01:34:48):
Word Okay, thank you anyway, But then all those lyrics
will make sense to you now and you go read
the lyrics now well.

Speaker 1 (01:34:55):
No, just seeing the commercial again with the with the
whole you know, pyramids and stuff. I just thought you
guys are just on because I had to ask for
you the same thing what he certain fire? Okay, I'm
a sing this, but so in seventy seven with the

(01:35:17):
dawning of disco and you guys absolutely at your your
your the highest heights of of your creativity. Serpentine Fire
was such a risky song to uh put out. First
of all, it's I mean it's half speed, so it's
like seventy two bpms. I mean it's a hard funk song.

(01:35:39):
But are you guys even aware of four on the
floor culture and we hated it? Oh wow, so you
made a because this we hated it. I'm just saying
to this day, I can't even play. Yeah, what do
you you don't like? Well, you can missing with trap rap.

Speaker 7 (01:36:01):
Like it wasn't going to where we we hated it,
but wasn't going to place, so Reese we had to
you know, there was nothing we could do, you know.

Speaker 1 (01:36:08):
You know Donna Summers had all those hits and.

Speaker 7 (01:36:12):
Maroder with his name, yeah Joe, and so our answer
to uh disco was Boogie Wonderland.

Speaker 1 (01:36:24):
But that's seventy nine. But I'm saying in seventy seven,
like was Walter Yetnakoff saying likes record? Yeah, like I
gotta no one ever, no one ever.

Speaker 7 (01:36:38):
Executives didn't ever get in Maurice's artistic thing. You know,
they never you know that to my knowledge, no one
ever came and said, you know, okay, yeah, you know
you should do.

Speaker 1 (01:36:50):
This that or the other.

Speaker 7 (01:36:53):
You know, I don't know who talked him in. I
was probably bobbing caval and Ruffalo talked him into the
power like though.

Speaker 1 (01:37:01):
I didn't even wasn't talking, wasn't talking to me. Do
you remember do you remember recording running? Do you remember
what that was like? Yes? Yeah, yep. What was the

(01:37:22):
vibe like in that? Who was it supposed to be lyrics. No, okay,
that would have messed that song totally, man too much.
I would assume that Body Eye songs are songs that
will later be added lyrics. Well, hence what's your name?
Telling me? Ali willis telling that about well, no, when
she grows September September, that's right. She said that Body

(01:37:44):
Eye was just a placement and then they were going
to think of something later and it never got to it,
so they just left it, right. I just okay, So.

Speaker 3 (01:37:55):
Yeah, Running is one of my favors. I love that song. Man,
y'all sounded that. I love that record.

Speaker 1 (01:37:59):
How did you guys get a relationship with Doug Henning
because I'm totally forgetting that. You guys damn near invented
black theater and Doug Henning is Doug Henning the magician.
He would have been the David Blaine of his day.
So a big part of black music culture is taking

(01:38:20):
the Chitlin Circuit or Motown. I guess the Motown Review
was the height of black excellence in concert and what
many will credit Earth Would and Fire to do that
will later inspire Parliament, Funk, Cadelic and then further inspire
the Jacksons is introducing theater. So the idea of verdein

(01:38:44):
levitating during his bass silo or explosions and the drums,
we did the drums where the spinning drums. Yeah, if
Philly wants my aunt cried, you're I guess doing that
all the Yeah, you remember this.

Speaker 7 (01:39:00):
Night where we go into that pyramid thing and then
you know, it disappears and then the the androids or
whatever come up to the state that put us in
there and they take their hats.

Speaker 1 (01:39:13):
Off and us. But I think during the intro of
the All and altour, you guys came down these tubes. Yeah,
and you're on the same.

Speaker 7 (01:39:22):
Or so it's on the same that's on the same
concert the tubes and the pyramid disappearing and right, well.

Speaker 1 (01:39:33):
I guess in the Philly show your tube they can
go up, so like guys had to run and manually
lift you out or whatever, like the smoking, you know,
added exaggeration. I guess you thought you were gonna die
or something. I don't know. But who, like, how do
you guys rehearse that stuff or who conceptualizes is that

(01:39:53):
all duck inning or.

Speaker 7 (01:39:56):
Now you know Vernon with no exactly because he's the
totally historian. I don't remember if Doug did that particular
show because we were working with several people at that time,
all right, but I mean we was working with Doug Henny,

(01:40:19):
David Copperfield.

Speaker 1 (01:40:22):
Really right, right, And so did you feel a certain
way did you guys feel a certain way when other
acts the Jacksons.

Speaker 3 (01:40:33):
Were starting to levint eight as well and explode and
h let me you think, yeah, would you go see shows? Okay, yo,
for sure.

Speaker 1 (01:40:43):
So if you're watching the Jackson's like, oh yeah, because I.

Speaker 7 (01:40:45):
Went to kans I flew to Kansas City to watch
the Jackson's and all that stuff. Yeah, man, but and
it was that was one of the best shows I've
ever seen, you know, just timing the production, performances and
all this stuff.

Speaker 1 (01:41:01):
It was like crazy. But did you guys feel like
that this is your thing and suddenly everyone else is
taken a cue?

Speaker 7 (01:41:10):
Like, well, it really wasn't our thing though, to be
quite honest about we were maybe we're the first African
American band to start doing it, but you got to
remember that the rock groups were doing.

Speaker 1 (01:41:23):
I forgot doing it. They were doing stuff all right. Now,
I am what are your feelings on I am. If anything,
I figure you have a feeling about I AM more
than Race. No, I am was still everybody was steal
in pocket. The team was still together pretty much. I am.

Speaker 7 (01:41:46):
It's probably the last great earth wind Fire records in
your opinion, in my opinion, So in your mind, your
classic cannon it ends with with I am, Yeah, because
it's all in all before that, well, all in all

(01:42:09):
I Am.

Speaker 1 (01:42:09):
Then Faces.

Speaker 7 (01:42:10):
Oh no, but Faces, no faces, I will say a
couple of jam I think, you know, I thought I
was just I was really disappointed that Faces didn't do
better because I did think it was what happened.

Speaker 1 (01:42:23):
Because all the elements were there, like love goes on, Yeah,
all the elements are there. Oh yeah, no pun intended,
but yeah, all the elements were there. Do you thing
go to that? Fair better if you guys just made
it a single album or yeah?

Speaker 7 (01:42:40):
Probably for that, you know when you're thinking about it now.
They still wren't gold. So it wasn't a failure and
it was a double record. It might have been better
if they had done it. Who knows, But I thought
that I thought the record was was sound.

Speaker 1 (01:42:58):
It wasn't better. It had movement, They had moments to it.

Speaker 3 (01:43:02):
My first my first actual win. If I record that
I own, I got for Christmas. My uncle brought me
Touch the world, believe it or not.

Speaker 1 (01:43:16):
That was my first official A young buz fire to babies.
But when you have the boys come out for heritage,
come on, y'all, y'all official, y'allll official with me at
that point, man, I'm glad you said that we got
the work. We got dogs. Oh my god. Yeah, it

(01:43:40):
works for me. It worked, It worked on me, It worked.
You had me. I was like, because heritage was ninety
age I was twelve. I definitely feel as though that
album is responsible for why they are the sons of
what are they now? Yeah? You know where they are now?

(01:44:01):
Like they're they're they like fire.

Speaker 6 (01:44:04):
They moved Africa, they moved to the continent.

Speaker 1 (01:44:06):
They moved to Africa. They they're the suns of light.

Speaker 6 (01:44:09):
They have locks, long locks.

Speaker 1 (01:44:11):
And where did you guys had an effect on them
with with the Herodage album?

Speaker 3 (01:44:16):
Because if somebody plays the flute, one of them, yeah yeah,
one of uh talk about the Illumination album, the one
because y'all worked with Brian McKnight on the record.

Speaker 1 (01:44:28):
Raphael, Yeah, what was that record, like and someone else record, No,
just a Japan edition. I think it was right.

Speaker 3 (01:44:40):
Back before record labels realized there was only one internet,
right the dude, this will be out by midnight. No,
it's out everywhere. But talk about that record, that was
for a lot of people considered like a quote unquote
comeback record. But what was it like, what was the
chemistry like with you and Maurice working.

Speaker 7 (01:45:01):
It was Our chemistry was okay, but that was it
was a very tough time for us yet because he
you know, his Parkinson's disease had really set set in
and it taken the ability his ability to perform and sing,
you know, so he wasn't singing nearly as strong or

(01:45:21):
or you know, in the way that he would want to.

Speaker 1 (01:45:23):
You know, they had he had in the past.

Speaker 7 (01:45:26):
So you know, a lot of you know, I did
a lot of singing on that record, and then we
started you know, using other people to in in the
in the backgrounds and stuff. So it was you know,
it had mixed emotions about it, you know, but it

(01:45:47):
was fun working with everybody that was on you know,
we worked with on a project, especially Flowa Tree Floaty
is on that project too, right, right, and music so
child and yeah it was it was fun. That was fun.

Speaker 1 (01:46:03):
Okay, So now let's reach back just a little bit.
We we definitely have to get to your solo career
because there's a generation of people. You're also an MTV
Award winner. I forgot he's the number one man walking
on Chinese. Well that was the best of both fields.

(01:46:24):
It was the best of both fields. What but you
work with George Duke on continuation, right, I know that's
my joint. Uh, that's my cut. Yes. So stepping away
from the band, did you think at the time after

(01:46:46):
Electric Universe did that Okay, well I'm leaving the band
or it's just like what what? What took you so
long to do a solo record?

Speaker 7 (01:46:55):
I didn't actually take me a long time because I
was always doing other stuff, especially after the you know,
the extensive touring and all that kind of stuff, just
to have a different outlet to really, you know, just

(01:47:17):
have my own autonomy.

Speaker 3 (01:47:20):
You were on a Polino da Costa album. Yeah, yeah,
and then you know, I did three gospel albums and.

Speaker 1 (01:47:26):
I was going to ask because you got a lot
of play.

Speaker 3 (01:47:29):
Yeah, I want to grab me for one of them.
For triumph on Philly Christian radio. You were a mainstay.

Speaker 1 (01:47:35):
But why weren't the Christian albums on CBS as well?

Speaker 7 (01:47:40):
It was subsidiary. Oh no, it was on their own
word and one. Yeah they were saying, yeah, you know
that was a different time, and the yeah, they gave
me the right to go and do that on a
Christian label.

Speaker 3 (01:47:59):
They didn't have a right marketing Christian distribution and all that.

Speaker 1 (01:48:05):
Okay, I see, So what in promoting those records, how
was the the circuit different? Like, well, I toured with
Amy Grant, you know that was that was that was fun.
That was fun too. I got I got all, I
got all my equipment.

Speaker 7 (01:48:23):
So stole the second data of the of the concert
YEP in the in Florida, they backed, they backed to
the truck up against the h the actual hotel and
stuff and took the mission out.

Speaker 1 (01:48:40):
You know, because they because they knew that.

Speaker 7 (01:48:41):
They said, you know this in Florida they were notorious
for stealing you know those you know those trucks and stuff. Man,
they told that truck away. Wow, they told the whole
truck away. And and I had to I was in
debt for three four years. What had Yeah, because I
had to pay for everybody's equipment. That was my fir

(01:49:02):
of my first solo experience, no no touris.

Speaker 1 (01:49:09):
I think Michael W. Smith did it. He was so funny. Sorry, okay,
Michael W. So you gotta tell like, yeah, that was
her first husband. Oh I'm sorry first.

Speaker 6 (01:49:29):
Oh yeah, cause she's married. Okayeah, she married to Vince somebody? Yeah,
thank you? Whoa what Vince Gil You've ever been married
for like over decades?

Speaker 1 (01:49:36):
What? I never knew that. Yo. As soon as they
did that song House I Love you remember that, I
was like, there's something going on between them two because
that song was too good for just, you know, just
to be a random question. Yeah yeah, oh, Amy grant Man.
It was a period where only Christian radio was on
my household, like my parents are just only did Christian radio.

Speaker 5 (01:49:56):
Same here, so same here, and let me back that.
That introduced me to Bailey's voice by way of Andre Crouch,
I've got the best, Come on, brother. I used to
play that song to death when I was a kid.

Speaker 1 (01:50:08):
That's right. I forgot that. And Martins did something with
the Hawkins family. Yeah, we both did on their anniversary record. Okay, Okay, Steve.

Speaker 9 (01:50:19):
Okay, I'm sure everybody here and there's the same amount
as I do.

Speaker 1 (01:50:24):
But I know, but I feel horrible like all the
Phil Collins. No, so.

Speaker 9 (01:50:30):
You and Phil Collins both have the same first name.
Was that what's going on? That a coincidence or the
marketing scheme?

Speaker 1 (01:50:41):
Why? Okay? Why did you want Why was he your
chosen producer for Chinese Wall Wall?

Speaker 2 (01:50:49):
Oh?

Speaker 7 (01:50:49):
Okay, two questions, because actually the Phoenix Horns were playing
with him on his you know, on his uh record
and tour, and when they played in Los Angeles. I
went to the show and and I wasn't really that
familiar with Phil's music, but I was very impressed with

(01:51:12):
the songs and stuff, and I was getting ready to
do my second record, and so I said, man, it's
crazy idea, but let's see if Phil has any songs
that I could do on my second record. And the
company and my manager says, well, why don't we talk
to me about producing your you know, your second record?

(01:51:35):
I know that was his dream, yeah, because so we Yeah,
that always imagined a fun Time.

Speaker 1 (01:51:41):
That's the fifteenth member of house fun Time. Fun Time.

Speaker 7 (01:51:46):
From the video, it looked like it was fun. It
was very it's very natural, I mean, and nothing, but
none of that was staged. They picked me up and
from in the helicopter and to the studio site. Cameras
were running, cameras running everything, and you know everything. They

(01:52:07):
just filmed everything and we got finished. We sang the
song a couple times. They said, Okay, yeah, that's it.
I said, well, we're gonna do the video. You just
y'all just did it. You ever see the video.

Speaker 1 (01:52:16):
Line are you out of your.

Speaker 6 (01:52:22):
I'm not the y'all, but it's usually the dance moves,
like I know, and then when they do believe it.

Speaker 5 (01:52:30):
Back in the day when HBO used to show music
videos in between movies, they did, we want an MTV
Award for that too. Yes, you're an MTV Award winner
as well.

Speaker 3 (01:52:38):
No, I was saying that Phil Collins is notorious for
making all of his videos videos about making videos.

Speaker 1 (01:52:48):
He's done it four times. I can't dance like video
directors explained to him in the video what you should do, baby,
don't you lose my number? The same thing where a
video director trying to explain to him, well, let's do
it like this, let's do it like that. An easy
Lover is basically very like Candid just him and phil

(01:53:10):
uh Philip, Wow, you're right, they both have the same name.

Speaker 6 (01:53:18):
It's like one of the best videos of our time
Easy Lover.

Speaker 3 (01:53:22):
Like, man, I remember that song would come on and
like when I realized it was both feels I lost
my mother?

Speaker 1 (01:53:33):
Do you right give it up? Because that's one of
the greatest song intros ever to Wait did we do it?
We tried that once. Yeah, he sat in on this
on the show. No, no, I'm talking about we uh
samp or something. I think during Game Theory we tried
to figure out a way to incorporate that intro best

(01:53:57):
intro ever? Are you are? Are your songs allowed to ever?

Speaker 3 (01:54:04):
Be?

Speaker 1 (01:54:04):
Messing and earth Wind and fire shows are not, Like,
I'm sure you haven't contingency of people asking for easy
Lover during fire You know, we we did for a
little while. I mean, like a few shows or something
like that, back when Morris Pleasure was in the band.

Speaker 7 (01:54:24):
Because Morris is a keyboardist and a bass player. Okay,
so and on that he would play the bass. But yeah,
there's so many songs to do until we haven't done it.

Speaker 10 (01:54:36):
So I have one more question about easy Lover. No, No,
But were there other Phil Collins songs on Chinese Wall
that you can contribute to them?

Speaker 7 (01:54:48):
No, that was the only That was the only one
that we We wrote that at the end of the
project because it was listening back to everything.

Speaker 1 (01:54:56):
Always the case.

Speaker 7 (01:54:57):
That's always a narrative always, you know, because you know
what needs to happen. And so Nathan started that base
thing and we just kind of figured it out.

Speaker 1 (01:55:08):
Who are the other musicians on that album set? Let
me just look, it's right here in front of me.
A special shout out to Children of the Ghetto. I
love that record too. So yeah, well you have all
the monsters on here. Well you have a lot of okay,
of course you have the the Phoenix Orens, wait are

(01:55:33):
Reef Martin? Digit strings? So now now that you're leader
by default, right, how many shows do you and you
do a lot of shows with Chicago.

Speaker 7 (01:55:49):
Yes, well we've done We've done a lot of tours,
uh with them over the last.

Speaker 1 (01:55:58):
Fifteen years or so. Peter sa Terra still singing with it.

Speaker 5 (01:56:01):
No, guy who's singing singing with him now is kind
of like a ringer. Though I saw the show in
twenty fifteen it was a great show. I'm wearing the
shirt I bought at the show. Wait, I do have
a question. I saw something that was kind of crazy.
I saw earth Winding Fire on ice. Wow, oh right,

(01:56:23):
the production thing?

Speaker 1 (01:56:24):
How did that come to be?

Speaker 7 (01:56:26):
Like, let me see, I don't I don't even remember
how how that actually, I don't remember how it came
to be.

Speaker 1 (01:56:34):
Yeah, it was just crazy. I was turning the channel
one day and at one point, when I think September
is playing, I was like, wow, it's it's a weird
backing track. And then I realized that earth Wind and
Fire was actually a part of earth Wind and Fire
were nice question about September. History is showing that that's

(01:56:54):
probably the most loved earth Wind and Fire song. But
at the time I wouldn't have called, oh, September is
gonna be the.

Speaker 7 (01:57:04):
Well, we must be brothers of the same lives then,
because when they got finished with it and they played
it for me, I was like, crickets, crickets, Wow, okay,
all right, I said, sounds so simple to me. That's
the way, you know, because it was just that, you know,

(01:57:24):
because we were so used to having all kinds of the.

Speaker 1 (01:57:26):
Formula by then, and but I was totally wrong. Yeah,
people were chosen. It's kind of a controversial question. Is
there a fan favorite that you just don't like flat out?
Not really besides reasons at weddings? Yeah, not really.

Speaker 3 (01:57:44):
Were any other records in y'all cat out that you
thought would be bigger that like you really like but
maybe they didn't do as as well as you thought.

Speaker 1 (01:57:51):
Hmm uh. You know a song I really like you
should and Love Goes On? Yes, that was off of Faces.
I love that song.

Speaker 3 (01:58:04):
Yeah, Now I thought that that was you know, I
thought the energy on that was really it's really that
to me is classic earth wind Fire.

Speaker 1 (01:58:14):
Actually, I have some questions from a friend of mine
who's probably the biggest earth wind in Fire on the planet.
Here's one. I'll give you the easiest question. First, how
did Brenda Russell come into the picture to write song
in my Heart for the Faces album? Oh? I got
a song with my heart that one?

Speaker 7 (01:58:33):
Well, and you know, Brenda's iconic as a lyric writer,
and I was. I was so excited about I've worked
with her quite a few times. Fact, have a little
crush on it really, but no, she's very, very talented
and uh uh Maurice, uh actually called her. That's how

(01:59:02):
we begin, you know, to work together and stuff. But yeah,
and now for the more more difficult questions. Astrology played
a big part in the presentation in the name of
the band, where the other members of the band as
observant of the philosophy as as Maurice.

Speaker 1 (01:59:16):
Was, No, not at all, not at all, and just
this must be deep. So let's roll with it. What
do you ever like call you know, let's talk about
you know, this and that, or like where their meetings,
where he was, you know, kind of explain things that
he was thinking, or you know, this is what the
album cover means, or because there's a lot of symbolism

(01:59:37):
going on on there. So no, no, he never he
never did explain.

Speaker 3 (01:59:44):
Uh no, no, you just saw it after it was conceived,
Like anytime did the band was like, you know, what
the what's all this crap?

Speaker 1 (01:59:55):
You know? Or did it You guys were just used
to it. Yeah, we were.

Speaker 7 (02:00:00):
We were pretty much used to it because you got
under you guys. You have to understand that Reese had
he had the experience, and he had the tenure. You know,
he'd been on the road, he had been touring, he
had been successful as a writer, producer, recording with with
Chess and performed with with with Ramsey. We were just

(02:00:25):
coming from mama, you know what I'm saying. You know
in college, you know, so you know, every day was
a good day for us. You know, it's like, okay,
which way we go now?

Speaker 1 (02:00:37):
You know, here's another easy one besides Milton Nacimento, is
am I saying that? Right? Okay? Were there were there
any other Afro Latin musicians that inspired you guys? Like
what were you guys all listening to Phil? Yes?

Speaker 3 (02:01:01):
Were you guys aware of him in real time or like, no,
we were just recent We know we were aware of
him back in the seventies.

Speaker 1 (02:01:10):
How many did you guys go to Africa during the
heyday of earth Wind and Fire. No, just to visit?
Never right, never to play Wow. Wow, I imagine an
earth Wind and show and Egypt Dude, dude, that's crazy.

(02:01:31):
I saw you guys like went there so all those
like interlusing and stuff that's just like visiting Marie's visiting
or that sort of thing. And no, no, we went
to to We went to Egypt, you know with all
the stuff that in the pyramid stuff that you're talking
freaking up. No, we were there. We went there just
to visit. Wow, as you know, yeah, we went to visit.

Speaker 6 (02:01:55):
Is that the only country you guys visited in the.

Speaker 1 (02:01:59):
Yeah, to visit. Okay, okay, So today you're you're working
on Chilo uh material right now? You have a project
coming up. Yeah.

Speaker 7 (02:02:11):
Yeah, it's it's called Love for Finding a Way and
it's a collective project of some like great friends Chick
Corea and Christian.

Speaker 1 (02:02:22):
McBride Christian went high school Christian.

Speaker 7 (02:02:26):
Yeah, yeah, Camasi Washington, you know, Christian Scott More Jazz
Leanings or well, you know, it's a it's a record
that we took a couple of blouse on the record.

Speaker 1 (02:02:45):
Wow.

Speaker 7 (02:02:47):
We we took a couple of songs that kind of
reflect at the times that we're that we were struggling,
uh in the sixties and stuff because we did some
uh Curtis Mayfield joints, but Robert Glasberg flipped him, so
Roberts you know, on the project, and uh, it's a

(02:03:09):
it's a hot it's a hot project, it really is.
It's it's gonna come out on Verve when well we're
trying to get a release date.

Speaker 1 (02:03:19):
We had. We were just with them today actually, but
it's it was, it's a It's probably one of the projects.

Speaker 4 (02:03:26):
I've usually asked somebody about their new stuff and it's like,
this sounds it sounds good.

Speaker 6 (02:03:35):
Who? Who? Who comes to mind after I stutter that
impresses you vocally today? Like not not, they don't have
to be a new artist. I just mean when you
think presently of who's alive and who's still impressing you vocally.

Speaker 1 (02:03:51):
Shoot, you know a lot a lot of you.

Speaker 6 (02:03:57):
It's not new. I mean it could be you know
you you you named some names on your album.

Speaker 1 (02:04:02):
Who are your go to? Like when you just want
to hear some music? And you know I love Laylah
Okay you and of course Balao and who else I
listened to attorney. Shoot, it's.

Speaker 7 (02:04:21):
I'm trying to think of who just really sticks out
that it's young Goss. Yeah, this is a lot of
gospel and I and list allow of jazz stuff, all
the young jazzer's.

Speaker 1 (02:04:34):
You're on Astro World. Uh, how did Travis Scott uh
come to get you for the album? Well?

Speaker 7 (02:04:44):
It was very quick and really yeah, it it was
just kind of one of one of those things that
we have the same manager, and so Damien's been managing
me for a long long time. In the fact, he
was his best friend with my oldest son, you know,
back in Denver. Huh sir, yes, sir, Yeah, he's doing well.

Speaker 1 (02:05:08):
Give give him hello, yeah, thank you all.

Speaker 7 (02:05:11):
So anyway, so yeah, you know that uh song stopped
turning to be got that me and Stevie guessed on
a little bit. That's that's how that came about actually,
and uh, you know, rest is history.

Speaker 1 (02:05:25):
Really Wow, impressive, You're still going strong and hypothetical situation
because I think as I was going to earlier, I forgot.
I forgot I forgot about that. But this is a
hypothetical situation. I am going to ask about that though.
I'm giving you a blank check.

Speaker 5 (02:05:47):
You can do whatever you want with it, Like you
can record whatever you want with whoever you want, wherever
you want.

Speaker 1 (02:05:54):
What do you think you would do with that? Wow?
That's so huge, Like what what is what is your
dream project?

Speaker 7 (02:06:02):
I actually think that I just did it, you know,
on this project that that we just did. I definitely
think that I that I just did it. You know,
to be able to to do what you want to
do with the people that you've always respected and stuff,
and and to finish it, and people that are listening

(02:06:23):
or saying or having comments that you're hoping when in
your in your creating the project, that they'll you'll have
you know, it's very gratifying and stuff.

Speaker 3 (02:06:34):
So you know, yeah, I think we we just did it.
I can save my money then, yeah, I'm checking that one.
And by the way, I loved off the last from
twenty thirteen Splashes.

Speaker 1 (02:06:46):
I really love that song. Oh yeah, are you going
to ask the Twins question? No, I was.

Speaker 9 (02:06:57):
Any any chance of reuniting with the other Phil for
a follow up?

Speaker 1 (02:07:03):
I can't believe you brought up Oh wow. Only bring
it up because whenever a set of Twins comes on tonight,
you guys play that. That's always the song we played.
So we know Twins left and right. Man, how do
you you know?

Speaker 7 (02:07:22):
Let me ask you this off cuff, but when I
when I was came on the show, how do you
guys just like look like you guys are going like
one thousand miles a minute.

Speaker 1 (02:07:33):
In real time. Yeah, I mean, I'm sure that you
haven't with the band as well, but there's a point
after maybe ten years where you guys, just you know,
you know each other so well that you're talking like,
we're to the point now, I would I would probably
say that maybe in five years we get the roots

(02:07:56):
the roots, and I can probably have a conversation without
speaking a word. We're now to the point where we
know how to communicate with each other with rhythm, like
if someone if someone like real bad enters the room
like whatever, like we have a rhythm for that, and
all of a sudden it stands of attention like which

(02:08:18):
one And then if it's a like I have to
do a code to let you know, third row four
ups and then no, no, literally, but it's it's we
have a language, like we're just you do it. I
think the whole point of the whole ten thousand hours

(02:08:41):
of Eagles genius practice thing is that when you do
it so much that you're able to do other things
and have other forms of communications. Right, Yeah, that's what
it really seems like. Yeah, I mean, we have fun
doing it, and you know, I guess this is the
point where we're just in the zone with each other
and we're actually friends. We're friends now more than we've

(02:09:03):
ever been in the thirty years that we've known each
other or I'm in a combination of we've all the
configuration you see now has as somewhere between like ten
to twenty years into it. Yeah, I think there's a
point where you just you grow up and then you're

(02:09:24):
you're just friends. So what was it like doing that
thing with you that you did with us? You know? Okay,
here's the thing. I have two experiences. Okay, so I
had the pleasure of working with the earth We're in
fire back in two thousand, I think the Voodoo Tour
was doing like a week in La so uh, and

(02:09:47):
I had two experiences, one with you in sir, and
then one with Maurice. Now, the thing is, is that
really really being like green and wet behind the ears
and still like new that sort of thing, and talking
to Maurice and just like you know, going through our

(02:10:10):
whole fan out thing, and of course I know like
how many Columbus you got. It was like that sort
of situation where you know, I was basically set myself
up for a fall, but you know, Maurice has said that,
you know, I want what's in the future, And now
I was like talking about sound and everything. The first
thing you mentioned was like your your your snare drum

(02:10:31):
sound is real low, and in my mind I'm like, well,
that's the sign of class. That's the sound of classic
earth wind and fire like you know, deep snare. And
he's like, oh man, I won't like give me to day,
give me what you want. And I remember being just
a little heartbroken the fact that he didn't trust the

(02:10:52):
process that we today are looking to what you know, like, yeah,
what y'all were doing, Like that's not what he over?

Speaker 5 (02:11:01):
That shit right, And then I did that. It'd be
like if somebody asked you to, you know, get an
upright base of roads.

Speaker 1 (02:11:09):
But here's the thing though, now, the difference between you
tell me this now and maybe you tell me this
back in two thousand and two. I almost feel as
though when artists are likesh like I used to do
that or that's the old Well, first of all, no
one likes agism, you know what I mean, So no
one wants to feel like, ah, man was my best

(02:11:30):
work thirty years ago, and I just don't want to
admit it. I feel as though maybe it's a fear
of not matching up, you know, do I have a
fear of not being twenty two year old a mirror
that was working on do you want More? In Hiladelph
Half Life. So a lot of times we just tend
to go linear and go for it, but I feel

(02:11:53):
as though you should go circular. So yes, now today
I will totally get an upright bait, he said infinitive Rhodes.
And I mean, I damn near work with the same equipment.
So I'm lucky enough to one be cheap enough to
not have upgraded. Y'all have an upgrade pro tools. Did
y'all finally do that? No, it's see Steve one and

(02:12:14):
a half. Steve has convinced me to not upgrade so
that we don't lose the vibe. But what we've averaged
for twenty years a digital vibe. So I'm saying with
you and sir though y'all kind of gave me room
to do my thing, so I you know, I'm still

(02:12:39):
pleased with the song. I wish we we we could
have fleshed out the song idea some more so, but
you know it was enjoyable. I'm always gonna have a
great story to tell and it's the Yeah, it is
on the promised record. Yeah, So I will say that
on behalf is there anything else before? No, no more,

(02:13:01):
I'm trying. Yeah.

Speaker 6 (02:13:02):
I don't let mister Bailey go an see him again.

Speaker 1 (02:13:07):
Hey man, we want to give our heroes they flowers. Yes,
no for we we appreciate you coming on the show
and this is definitely one of them. No, man, this
is the honor. Your music has been the soundtrack of
my entire life.

Speaker 7 (02:13:19):
And just be thank you, well, thank you. Let me,
I gotta say one thing for before we go to Mouse.
That now I hear that Mouse was saying that Earth
Wind and Fire don't play their music.

Speaker 3 (02:13:36):
Oh okay, let me no one's wondering was gonna get
brought up? Let me say, let me say Mouse's ass. No,
what I was saying I brought up. I brought up
the difference between.

Speaker 6 (02:13:50):
What on a previous episode a quest.

Speaker 1 (02:13:55):
We were talking about. Okay, so he's talking about the
drafting of Heartbreak Hotel by the Jackson and now initially
the the base tones and the bass sounds of Fantasy
like all those inflections. There have been rumors or whatnot

(02:14:22):
that again that that Earth Wind and Fire was more
like a Beach Boys situation where Maurice White, as as
Brian Wilson using the recond crew, like using his house
musicians to record Earth Wind and Fire records versus the

(02:14:42):
people whom we saw on stage. So we were discussing
that theory. But he he didn't say that you guys
weren't playing on your records. But we did delve into
that for at least five minutes on whether or not
that was true or not. No, no, no, But I mean,
for the most part, that's that's one of the biggest

(02:15:02):
smoking mirror tricks that a lot of music fans don't know.
I mean, for this case in point, James Poyser might
as well be an original Route member because he's been
there since the beginning. He just finally, like you know,
gave up. I wore him out and just like all right,
well now you're in the group. But for the longest

(02:15:22):
James Poyser has I was rereading.

Speaker 5 (02:15:25):
The Things Fall Apart liner on the other day and
there was all these James, y'all gonna pay me this time, right.

Speaker 1 (02:15:32):
Exactly exactly, So that was it. Mouse. Mouse did not
insinuate that, all right, Mouse, you're off the hook. Good,
all right, well, thank you very much on be having
Moon Ticcolo boss Bill unpaid Bilvison in Action and Sugar
Steve and the Sugar Steve Network and it's like, yeah,

(02:15:52):
this is quest Love. Thank you very much Philip Bill
for coming on the show God and we will see
you next week on Court Love Supreme only on Pandora.

(02:16:15):
Course Love Supreme is a production of iHeartRadio. This classic
episode was produced by the team at Pandora. For more
podcasts from iHeart Radio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,
or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.

All Episodes

Episode Transcript

Hosts And Creators

Laiya St. Clair

Questlove

Popular Podcasts

Stuff You Should Know

Dateline NBC

Las Culturistas with Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang

.css-15opob5{left:0;position:absolute;top:0.8rem;} All Episodes

.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Black Music Month QLS Classic: Philip Bailey