Erick Sermon Part 2

In Part 2 of this incredible 1-on-1 interview between Questlove and Erick Sermon, Ahmir asks for definitive answers about the EPMD breakup. Erick also speaks about a grocery list of hits, album cuts, and remixes from the 1990s and 2000s. This conversation intersects with stories about LL Cool J, Redman, Keith Murray, Too Short, and others. Happy 2025 from QLS.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Quest Love Supreme is a production of iHeartRadio.

Speaker 2 (00:05):
Happy New Year everyone. This is Sugar Steve from Questlove Supreme.
We are here with Part two or Quest Loves one
on one interview with Eric Shermon. If you haven't done
so yet, please check out Part one, where Amir and
Eric speak about the formation of EPMD, Eric's pioneering rap
delivery and funky production, and a hometown rivalry between EPMD
and Eric B and rock Him. It's a great episode

(00:27):
you can't miss. Now QULS is back with part two.

Speaker 3 (00:31):
Enjoy the Dos Effects album the first album. Who did
the production on that record? Was that your finger Prince?

Speaker 1 (00:47):
Or was that?

Speaker 4 (00:47):
Now? People talk about God best to day because one
of the guys is dead, so Chris and Derek was
they are two people from school, right right, But as
you can hear the drums, Roger the whole nine of course.

Speaker 1 (01:02):
But everything was Snaps.

Speaker 4 (01:05):
Was used three times because again after I left the
records in there from what the album, because I used
snow on Redman, you know the record you know, watch
a Nugget, those records were there, and then all the
Roger Troutman that DOS Effects used again.

Speaker 5 (01:21):
So anyway, it was the crew.

Speaker 4 (01:23):
I wouldn't get the credit for it too like that,
but Christen and Derek was part of their solid scheme.
Team was the ones who really put the stuff together,
especially the single Now my voice is some live effects,
snapper neck for some live effects, but the father them
getting that James Brown thing going, that was deffly the
Derek and Chris.

Speaker 3 (01:43):
So when they joined the crew, were they more Team
Parish or Team Eric? Like, how did you guys discover
them and brought them into the fold?

Speaker 4 (01:52):
Well, we met them at a rap contest in Virginia,
Me and Pratts was doing the show and then there
was an after party. There was a rap contest and
and they was on it, but we let some other
two dudes win because the other two dudes was nice too.

Speaker 5 (02:05):
But we knew that we was going to sign dos effects.

Speaker 1 (02:08):
And did they have that style when when you.

Speaker 4 (02:10):
Heard yeah, that was something that they did. They they
met in the lunch room cafeteria.

Speaker 1 (02:17):
Right, okay, yeah, and Dre.

Speaker 4 (02:20):
Was rhyming on one side and School was vombing on
one side. I heard the story and said his man
brung them over and said, yo, my man raps. So
they start rhyming together, not knowing that dre would be
like say something like yo, he would be like, oh
that's dope.

Speaker 5 (02:35):
School was saying, but oh that's dope. Not knowing.

Speaker 4 (02:38):
I don't know who had the iggity style first between
the two, but the story's never been told.

Speaker 5 (02:45):
And just the fact that they met up and they
became them.

Speaker 3 (02:49):
And as I said at the top, sometimes a pioneer
does get there just too. But from your point of view,
no lyrical style to me came and washed hip hop
like a tsunami. Then the iggity style of ninety one
ninety two with DOS Effects.

Speaker 5 (03:09):
You have to make that clear.

Speaker 4 (03:12):
Not because those are my boys, but people can talk
about who changes different errors or different moments in time
and hip hop, and their name is not bought up,
meaning that when it goes to DOS Effects and Rex
and effect heavy d Laws is the underground ice crew
called them for check yourself. I mean, I've never seen

(03:35):
that before Christy.

Speaker 5 (03:38):
It was phenomenal.

Speaker 4 (03:40):
They changed a landscape in the industry and nobody says it.

Speaker 3 (03:45):
The day that they want Effects came out. You know,
it's like a local Philly Drexel radio show. Shout out
to Cosmic Kevin aj Shin keV and Man literally like
that brought hip hop into hyper speed. So not since

(04:06):
rock Kim have I seen one person literally make everyone
change their rhyming style. I mean even even uh On
can't trust it. Chuck Deeven caught a little glimpse of it.
You know, don't be dumb, thinking dumb.

Speaker 6 (04:21):
And yeah, yeah, the thing that I have grips with
is like they changed the game and then we just
disposed of them like it never happened.

Speaker 3 (04:34):
And I always wanted to know did they feel a
certain way about that, or the ep m D organization
feel a certain way about that. I didn't see that
as a fad or a trend. I saw it as
like really intricate rhyme and I mean, fu jay Z
came into the game with original flavor, with that tikeny
tongue twisting.

Speaker 4 (04:55):
He stuttered, I don't know if you want to go
back to only common sense, go back to Thomson was
a big DOTS Effects fan totally.

Speaker 5 (05:05):
Oh we all were dude right, right, But why.

Speaker 3 (05:09):
Weren't they able to keep the momentum up? And yeah, look,
I love what Premo did with them with the real
hip hop, but I almost felt like we took from
them and just threw them away right and just never
gave them.

Speaker 4 (05:20):
Yeah, I think that the pre Rock and the Premo
Records really kept their stuff going because it could have
got worse where they could have not made no records
after that, But that Primo was huge for them to
at least stay somewhat alive. But I think that once
the his part broke up, I think it tanged stuff
because that's like told me one time, you're ed, why

(05:41):
did you leave us? I said, I left y'all because
y y'all went with Paris, so I figured that's where
y'all wanted to be at. So I think that the
breakup messed a lot of things up on that side.

Speaker 1 (05:51):
Okay, let's get into it.

Speaker 3 (05:52):
So right now I'm speaking to you from my dressing
room at the Tonight Show. I happened to know that
EPMD and dis Effects did microphone checka on The Tonight
Show with Jay Leno when Jay Leno finally took over

(06:14):
for Johnny Carson in nineteen ninety two. Obviously, the producers like, yo,
the first thing we gotta do is start getting on
our sinios act because our senior was like way ahead
of the game, like our Senio changed the.

Speaker 1 (06:30):
Game and made the old guard leave. You know what
I mean.

Speaker 3 (06:34):
I believe in jay Leno's first week Night number three
because even though it was our Senio head, I wanted
to see what jay Leno was about to do. And yo,
y'all did Humming coming at you on the Tonight Show.

Speaker 4 (06:47):
I did not know that was a part of that
politic thing you're saying just now.

Speaker 5 (06:51):
I was I thirty.

Speaker 3 (06:53):
There were no hip hop acts. Y'all were the first
hip hop act on the Tonight Show.

Speaker 5 (06:57):
I did not know that, yes, And I know that.

Speaker 3 (07:00):
They were trying to cut into our seniors ratings and
it worked because I was like, oh, epmds on the
Tonight Show doing humber coming action.

Speaker 4 (07:08):
But but I was and let me tell the politics
on that, because I'm like, Dag, we have Coursover and
we got a headbanger, and we got were all these
other songs. But Doctor pres was so big, yes, that
they was like, let's put these two together and do
it like this, you know, for the purpose of it.

Speaker 5 (07:29):
Because I'm glad group and Doctor Prex was the new pop.
I gotta say pop because they cost.

Speaker 4 (07:36):
You see that new thing that's out right now with
them at the beach with about eighty thousand people doing
they want effects.

Speaker 1 (07:43):
Yes, I was like yes on social media, Yo, what
the hell?

Speaker 3 (07:47):
I'm so glad that came out so people get know,
so people can know, so people can know.

Speaker 1 (07:52):
Was it the hit Squad first before it was the.

Speaker 5 (07:54):
Depth Squad first? Yeah?

Speaker 3 (07:56):
Okay, So how did y'all come into to Reggie's strateg.

Speaker 4 (08:00):
Yeah, well, we did the show in New New Jersey
called Club Sensations, And if people know about Club Sensation,
you just can't go there. They're gonna rob every they
gonna disrespect you. Just don't go and perform that Club Sensation.
I don't care who you are.

Speaker 1 (08:14):
That was another Latin quarter.

Speaker 5 (08:15):
Now it was a small club.

Speaker 4 (08:17):
But but yeah, but and not mean oh yes, yes definitely,
or the Apollo or whatever you want to say. So anyway,
that night, Do it All from Lords of the Underground
comes in my dressing room and he starts rapping, and
Do it All is dope too from whatever.

Speaker 5 (08:34):
So he wasn't lost the Underground yet.

Speaker 4 (08:35):
He was just Do it All, you know, trying to
get on and then he says, oh my DJ rap too,
and his DJ was Redman really. I heard Redman rhyme
that night, and I put Regie on stage that night.

Speaker 5 (08:50):
Didn't even know him.

Speaker 4 (08:51):
I was so impressed by his metaphause I put him
on stage that night. And plus also to be like,
YO were in this place, I'm gonna put somebody on
from out here so we can. He's saying so, and
that's how y'all meant, And God damn. And then I
gave Reggie my phone number, but he didn't write it down.
He said it took him two weeks to memorize. Reggie

(09:14):
memorized my number and called me two weeks.

Speaker 1 (09:17):
Damn.

Speaker 4 (09:17):
He said he was writing down the number, writing down,
writing down to whatever.

Speaker 5 (09:21):
He kept trying, kept trying. Now, what type of determination.

Speaker 1 (09:24):
Is that they talk about? K Solo?

Speaker 5 (09:28):
Na speaks about K Solo. Michael Bimins speaks about K Solo.

Speaker 4 (09:31):
Now speaks about Kevin, saying that Kevin was was before
his time, his story telling, the way that he put
it together, the way that he would use third party,
like you, it wasn't me. The rhyme did it, so
nobody was doing that before so, but Kevin was.

Speaker 5 (09:45):
I told you it was already Parish's friend. Don't forget.
He was in that group before with Parish, So that's
how I met Kevin.

Speaker 1 (09:51):
Got it okay, okay, yeah, man, the whole Telworm name.

Speaker 5 (09:55):
Ship, Yeah yeah, tells the crack side.

Speaker 1 (09:59):
I was say, tells the crack side. So like, yeah,
drums and death, honest.

Speaker 5 (10:05):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (10:06):
Did you do any production on that record? Yeah? The
spell Bounce Okay, of course the.

Speaker 4 (10:12):
First single I had to get done because they were
trying to figure out what to go with. So I
was in there with power Play with Doc and Doc
had the SB twelve hundred. I'm like, listen, let me
show you this to program these drums and that.

Speaker 5 (10:25):
Don't forget if you listen to when.

Speaker 4 (10:27):
I did If You Love Me by Brownstone, the bottom
drums is spell Bound.

Speaker 5 (10:32):
Uh you know? Yeah that's so yeah.

Speaker 1 (10:35):
I know what happens after the fade.

Speaker 4 (10:38):
It's the same that like kept going on you right now, California,
kd K made that. I don't know what was with
that record that made K and l A loved that
song so much. That record was played in LA on
that station like it was no Tomorrow. It was something

(11:02):
about that record. I can't I still can't explain it.

Speaker 1 (11:05):
Greg.

Speaker 4 (11:07):
Yes, I gotta say something about Craig Matt real quick
too too. I'm gonna say somebody crank Matt said. I
got to go back to when we when we claim
the records, when I first heard rock Camp. Every weekend,
Craig Matt's mother would drop him off to my grandmother's
house and me and Craig was sitting in the living
room and check out the new records. I heard publicating

(11:28):
number one with Craig and I heard Nobody Beat the
Biz with Craig Mac at Grandma's house. Really, yes, that's
a weird story. People like you used to hang out
with Craig. Yeah, that was my boy.

Speaker 1 (11:40):
How did Hurricane G getting the squad?

Speaker 5 (11:43):
Was my baby mother? So I know.

Speaker 4 (11:47):
A remether as a girl. I met in the club
with Llo coo J. Llo Coo J was was dancing
with her. After after he stopped dancing, I went over
there and talked to her. So so after that then
so then?

Speaker 1 (11:58):
But was she always that?

Speaker 4 (12:00):
Like she was Cardi B for Cardi B. Was Cardi
B exactly? Tone loud right, but she was already rhyming too.
I was like, are you guys? Said yeah, rhyme And
then Redman took a whole tour and then they became
sister and brother. So that's what the whole thing of

(12:22):
her being in the squad. And then when I went
to stretch on Barbtos and gave him that milky song,
they it blew up with them. I'm like, it's a
demo that she had. So but when I did tonight tonight,
I wasn't in the session when they was recording, Gloria
went with Reggie and my cousin Jamel, so you hit

(12:44):
that the snap background the records, so they was all
three in there. So whatever happened, Redman didn't want to
be soft and be like Mike check I can get
smooth to any group, but let so he stopped it.

Speaker 5 (12:56):
So I guess they came up with that whole thing.

Speaker 4 (12:58):
I was like to take credit for that, but it
wasn't me, it was them.

Speaker 3 (13:06):
All Right, I'm gonna ask you the million dollar question
that I never ever got a satisfactory answer belt And
when I interviewed John Schecter, I've collected almost every copy
of the Source magazine. Okay, but you gotta tell me
why and how did EPMD break up the first time?

Speaker 5 (13:30):
Yeah, the first time again? It was the breakup. It
was the home invasion. So the home in bad was real.
The home invasion that went down was real. So but
again it was blamed on me.

Speaker 4 (13:43):
So after you know, you know, if you watch Beef two,
the stories out there, they blamed.

Speaker 5 (13:48):
It on me.

Speaker 1 (13:49):
I didn't see that.

Speaker 5 (13:50):
Okay, they had the witnesses and the whole non.

Speaker 3 (13:52):
So after a while, like, at what point was it
ever just like, Okay, you just show up and do
shows together, y'all friends this whole time.

Speaker 1 (14:01):
Or is it like.

Speaker 5 (14:02):
You're a five year breakup?

Speaker 3 (14:05):
Well I know that, but I'm saying something leads to
a breakup, is a miscommunication?

Speaker 1 (14:11):
Is it?

Speaker 5 (14:12):
Like that was the breakup?

Speaker 4 (14:14):
So if somebody that I robbed them, so that's a breakup,
was in your house and tied niggas up in the whole,
not that's a breakup.

Speaker 3 (14:20):
So he literally believed that you orchestrated a breakup or
a break in.

Speaker 1 (14:26):
Yes, and you went on a record to say that
was not you, right.

Speaker 5 (14:30):
But it didn't matter.

Speaker 4 (14:32):
No, everybody when you got same to rock Kim shit
smacked me and I smack you back. Once people are
already saying this is what it is, and you believe,
and they giving you all types of things. You believe
that this is true. So five years of that went.
That's how it happened.

Speaker 1 (14:46):
It was just like that legacy down the dream, like
they came and.

Speaker 4 (14:50):
Got me once, they come and get you, and you
get arrested as old they're coming back from that, and.

Speaker 1 (14:55):
You got arrested for that.

Speaker 5 (14:56):
Yeah, I went, yeah, I toldally, they picked me up.

Speaker 1 (14:59):
I'm in the arc about this. That's the thing.

Speaker 3 (15:01):
Like I read a sore story like back in ninety
three or whatever.

Speaker 1 (15:05):
But I don't know, man, It's just like.

Speaker 5 (15:07):
They picked me up. They picked me up, and I
fled to Atlanta.

Speaker 1 (15:11):
So that's how you wound up in Atlanta, right.

Speaker 3 (15:13):
I remember you telling me a story about like you
called Dallas Austin and he gave you a look.

Speaker 5 (15:19):
I called that.

Speaker 4 (15:20):
My boy hooked me up with Dallas and brught me
to Dark Studios and I met Dallas and Dallas like, yo,
you could have studio beat.

Speaker 5 (15:27):
I didn't know who that. I didn't know who he was.
My boy Greg knew him.

Speaker 1 (15:30):
Okay, So why did you choose Atlanta?

Speaker 5 (15:33):
Because I went there before.

Speaker 1 (15:34):
I liked it, Okay.

Speaker 4 (15:37):
So and my grandmother was there, My aunts were there,
so I had family there too.

Speaker 3 (15:42):
But for you to leave New York, like, was that
a heartbreak or you know I had to leave. He's
even that to go to jail. So I was, I
trust so you were on the run, right. I didn't realize.
I thought you just like, hey, man, I gotta get
out of New York.

Speaker 1 (15:57):
Shit. I did not know that.

Speaker 4 (15:59):
Yo, that's why you got You got to watch it
and the guy was like, yo, they at the end
of the day, they really believed it. So I told
my mother, I said, my I should go to Georgia.
I don't want to just sit around here and just wait.
So I left something you're not supposed to do.

Speaker 3 (16:14):
I did anyway, And so you're making no pressure while
everyone's looking for you.

Speaker 4 (16:19):
No, I made that when I got there, like later on,
like like when Russell called me and said no, first
I got to call from Puffy to make a record
for Who's the Man. That's when I made Hitting Switches
my first single. After Russell heard that, Russell was like, Yo,
you want to.

Speaker 3 (16:34):
Make an album it switches. I forgot that with that
into with the beat box, right.

Speaker 4 (16:40):
So then when Russell came Russell said, you want to
make an album. I said, yeah, sure, because you knew
that the group wasn't getting back together. So I made
the album. I spent new years in the studio by
myself at Dark so I was just happy just to
be there without having that pressure on me.

Speaker 5 (16:56):
So then I started making the album. Afterwards, no pressure
got it.

Speaker 3 (17:02):
So I mean, at the time, when you're making this,
what's your thoughts about what a solo Eric sermon?

Speaker 1 (17:08):
The album sounds.

Speaker 4 (17:09):
Like, Oh, I wasn't even worried about dang a lot
of you. I knew what I was. I knew that
I knew how to make I was making the beats.
I knew that, you know, Red Men had success. I
knew that Keith Murray was coming, you know, like I
knew like I had things. So I wasn't really worried
about what the people are going to say. Because again,
he wasn't worried about selling records or seeing who was

(17:30):
the top person or who was out or what was coming.
Even though the chronic had came, everything was out there came.
I was so comfortable and so relaxed. I really didn't care.

Speaker 5 (17:40):
I just was making it. Because Russell asked me to
make an album, so I did it.

Speaker 4 (17:43):
I wasn't worrying about people asked me what it's going
to sound like or not or mad because EPMD broke up.

Speaker 5 (17:50):
I was just doing what I thought. As long as
it was hip hop, I was okay.

Speaker 4 (17:54):
And once Hitting Switches came out and I went home
and DJ Twrimmer was like, Eric, you were on fire
out here, and I was like, for real, It's like yo,
his switch is doing fire.

Speaker 5 (18:05):
So that was it so I needed.

Speaker 3 (18:07):
Even though I like Stay Real, My join was Eric sermon,
that whole bit I want to know if you want
to know you that to me?

Speaker 5 (18:16):
That song like yeah, ah.

Speaker 4 (18:20):
You know what's the buck down to I was those
songs I had that first when Redman told me to
turn and I made Hitting Switches. I had those songs
before that, but I thought that was more Eric's sermon
because the hey ever I was doing on so.

Speaker 5 (18:36):
I was trying to make sure that.

Speaker 4 (18:37):
I kept it, and all Stay Will was was a
new crossover. It's the same subject, you know, So I
was trying to keep it into play to where even
though his Hitting Switches was so hard, even though I
wasn't a West Coast person, I was doing the hitting
switches as the off is on, but not knowing that

(18:58):
the West Coast took it for this, I'm doing this,
So I'm like, okay, because now they're thinking I'm I'm
hitting switches, but I'm really talking about off and on
is on?

Speaker 3 (19:08):
Right, I see so, but they felt you were talking
about Yeah, yo, did I hear correct? Did you open
up a car business in Atlanta?

Speaker 5 (19:18):
Yeah?

Speaker 4 (19:19):
The rim shot. The rim shot was the biggest thing
happened at the time, you know, And that's how everybody
got this. See that room shop was so huge that
once it came out and stay real video and people
saw it. So don't forget. I was doing Shaquille in
the shop. I was doing Jam and Rose in the shop,
Chris Webber. So then I would Jake, Dave Justice would

(19:41):
be in the shop. Tupac would be in the shop,
don't forget. And back in the back of the shop
was one twelve Jagged in Goodie Mob outcast Usher Raymond
David Banner. These people was not even famous yet. My
place where everybody came to chill at. And if I
was a person that wasn't it wasn't secure. I could

(20:01):
have had half of them all this signed to me.

Speaker 3 (20:04):
Man.

Speaker 1 (20:05):
All right.

Speaker 3 (20:05):
So when we first went to Atlanta, our street rep,
you know, the guy that takes you to the college
stations and takes you to radio or whatever, takes you
to the record stores. There was a record store that used
to be a gas station. I forget the name of it.
They shut down. There's like a big record shot there. Okay,
but he was like, yo, we got to take you
to Eric's. And I think we were there at a

(20:26):
time when it wasn't open.

Speaker 1 (20:28):
It was like after hours or something. We never got
to go in there.

Speaker 3 (20:31):
But okay, what year was that, ninety four, ninety four,
ninety five.

Speaker 4 (20:38):
I think, so it was still popping, that was it
was still on fire at that time.

Speaker 3 (20:43):
Yeah, but we were like on tour and had to
leave and couldn't go by there. But we always heard
that you gotta go buy the restrict spot. And of
all the businesses, why was that the one that called
you the most?

Speaker 5 (20:57):
It wasn't.

Speaker 4 (20:57):
It was the guy I met from Detroit and Detroit,
my boy G from Detroit. He had this shop. So
when I met him, I met the girl that was
with his girl. So by the shoping, me and G
got closed. But but not knowing that. Again, being Memphis
in the shop every day, I didn't know who Big
Meach was. But now it makes sense because she and
them was Detroit people. So the dude with the poontytail

(21:20):
was always meet in the shop. I didn't even know that.

Speaker 1 (21:23):
Oh okay, and that was a lucrative business you back.

Speaker 4 (21:27):
Then, Nah, I didn't care about that money that was
I was. Don't forget, I'm a producer. I'm on death chair,
so everything is mine. Reggie's mind epm D is mind
from his mind then all of a sudden run of
Memphis mind.

Speaker 5 (21:41):
So that wasn't where I made the money.

Speaker 4 (21:43):
For money was being made, but that wasn't what I
I wasn't doing. I was just making sure that this
was I was in something that was new, it had
the hype attached to it, so fucking oh you know.

Speaker 3 (21:56):
All right, So probably the second most important thing I'm
a mention in this interview. I want to talk about
the Rockefeller remix and also Man Above and Man Above
on double or nothing. So you know, as I told you,
we connected at Clark Kent's homecoming services, right, and I

(22:21):
told you, I was like, dog, you don't know how
important Redman's Rockefeller Remix and Man Above on your Double
or Nothing record, right, was what I call the movement,
and the movement I was speaking of was the soul

(22:42):
quarium movement and the amount of times where like Dyla
and I would talk about how you really pioneered, like
the texture that both of us really put our feet in,
and it made our living, you know, that was our bread,

(23:06):
that texture, and as dope as it was, it's also
a very radical left turn for hip hop, a genre
which thrives on high testosterone, you know, this aggressive.

Speaker 1 (23:27):
Energy.

Speaker 3 (23:29):
Okay, so let's start with the Rockefeller remix because the
polar opposite of it, the the the the album version
of Rockefeller, which was the first single from Redman's There's
Dark Side record, was Redman Eric Sermon one on one
like a chunky, heavily sampled.

Speaker 4 (23:52):
Dense But but don't forget that was Reggie got it
by himself. And while I told him, don't do it
because g thing, he was like, don't do it, but
Reggie did anyway.

Speaker 3 (24:04):
And I want to talk about There's a Dark Side
as an album, but that remix though, But what was
on your mind when you did that?

Speaker 1 (24:12):
Shit?

Speaker 3 (24:13):
Because that was just probably the same way that shut
him down. Shut me down when I heard it, like
looking at the stereo, like, what the fuck is this?

Speaker 1 (24:23):
I've never like that.

Speaker 3 (24:25):
Shit called me like, this is your destiny for the
next thirty years of your life.

Speaker 1 (24:31):
This style of production what made you want to go esoteric.

Speaker 4 (24:37):
It was a keyboard in there, right, and the keyboard
had no regular keyboard, but it was a rose keyboard.
But if you listen to the record, the record is
off a cassette. That's why it doesn't sound like nothing
like for you to hear it and it's hissing like
that and there's no bottom or nothing like. It was
so weird that it was even taken as a rem

(25:00):
mix because.

Speaker 1 (25:01):
You did that remix on a cassette.

Speaker 5 (25:03):
I made it live to a cassette.

Speaker 1 (25:04):
There was no lady, and you mastered it from the cassette.

Speaker 4 (25:07):
Yes, oh wow, that's why it sounds like that. It's
gritty as it's not. It wasn't done on purpose. It
comes from off of a cassette. So when I lined
it up to the regular one, I'm like, oh, ship,
this does sound kind of cool. But the boom boom boom,
But the the the road things was not really a

(25:29):
road sounds. I'm not really a player. I learned how
to play later on. So I heard what I wanted
to hear by you press the keys and you be okay, Okay,
I found the court.

Speaker 5 (25:39):
Okay, here's the chord boom.

Speaker 4 (25:41):
So I'm gonna do that same thing with the most
beautifulness when when I did the Assie butters over, it's
still what I wanted to hear. My version of what
make sheets sound like? What keyboard was that it was
something that ate, something like the the Roland, the whatever
it was out that was out in ninety two.

Speaker 3 (26:02):
That patch show I could never billions of times I've
tried to.

Speaker 1 (26:08):
I thought it was a lead. I thought it was
you know what.

Speaker 5 (26:12):
You know what?

Speaker 4 (26:13):
That might be what see it was one of the
popular name It could have been that, it could have
been a too could have but listen.

Speaker 1 (26:20):
Because it's just the text.

Speaker 4 (26:22):
It probably was you know what. You probably definitely right.
It probably was the Great Norley. It probably was a
black one. But the drums were programming the W thirty,
so I already had the drums going, and my W
thirty doesn't have a baseline sound like that.

Speaker 5 (26:37):
All roads, so.

Speaker 4 (26:39):
The keyboard were just sitting there. So I said, I'm
just gonna do this live. I'm gonna do the base.
I don't forget. I didn't have no looping. All the
stuff you hear and accept the drums is played live
all the way through the whatever four minutes I played
at the time, it's you.

Speaker 1 (26:56):
Just played the keyboard. All the cores in the.

Speaker 5 (27:00):
Everything is live. I didn't lay nothing down.

Speaker 4 (27:03):
I was recording to cassette, ah Man, so it was
made and it was being programmed at the same time.
So once it was being programmed, all I did was
like one, two, three, four, and then press play on
the no lead whatever that was, and then play on
the W thirty and that that was it.

Speaker 3 (27:29):
How much production did you have in the hand of
Redman's first record versus There's a Dark Side?

Speaker 5 (27:36):
Yeah, mostly all of it, even high the blunt was
Pete Rock. The second one.

Speaker 4 (27:40):
I didn't do it second one. I did you know?
Mine's Rockefeller remix. I can't wait exactly.

Speaker 3 (27:47):
In your opinion, what do you think of there as
the dark side? As far as Reggie's whole canon is concerned.

Speaker 4 (27:55):
Okay, I'm put like this. People on the the ground
loved that album. They chose There's a Dark Side underground
hardcore people. They chose that record. Now there's a dark side.
The stuff on that I love was the intro was
one of my favorites. But again, that's why Muddy Waters

(28:17):
was so effective because because people people did not like
There's a Dark Side, as far as it's not.

Speaker 3 (28:25):
That I didn't like it, but there was something missing.
And now I feel like what was missing was your input.

Speaker 5 (28:31):
Yeah I didn't do it. No, I didn't do it.

Speaker 1 (28:33):
Did you not want to do that record? Or he's
just like, I want to do it on my own.

Speaker 4 (28:38):
I want to do it because Reggie had got the
NPC and then he met Rockwaller two, so he figured that,
you know, he had this sound and he was nice
of what he did or.

Speaker 5 (28:48):
You know whatever, this what he was making.

Speaker 4 (28:50):
Because again, it ain't like I didn't think that There's
a Dark Side was dope. I don't think to me
that's my favorite album, but to other people's is I
know that what the album? And when it did come out,
Muddy Waters hit so hard because people was waiting for it.

Speaker 3 (29:07):
Okay, I was lukewarm on There's a Dark Side, like
I didn't think it held up to what the album. However,
when Muddy Waters came out, I was so shocked that
it was like beyond I know, yep, oh shit. The
funny thing was, so when I got Muddy Waters, when

(29:28):
I first heard the intro.

Speaker 1 (29:30):
Right it is it?

Speaker 5 (29:31):
Yeah? I was like, way it up? Man?

Speaker 1 (29:35):
Yeah, But between the intro and is he for real?

Speaker 5 (29:39):
Right?

Speaker 1 (29:40):
I got admit. Man.

Speaker 3 (29:42):
I was so happy that we got sampled because the
thing is is that by that point, the Roots have
made three records, right, and you know, everybody was like, well,
y'all band, so y'all gonna put out records, and motherfucker's
gonna sample for y'all. You know, I was like leaving
drums here and there and not stuff like okay, and
let me let this part bear because people want to
take that, and nobody was taken to us. And you know,

(30:06):
by third time around, I was like, yo, we might be.

Speaker 1 (30:10):
Rudolph the Red Nose Reindeer of hip hop.

Speaker 3 (30:13):
Like I don't know if motherfuckers are fucking with us
like that because no one's grabbing these drums, no one's
grabbing the loops or whatever.

Speaker 1 (30:21):
So when we heard our song section.

Speaker 3 (30:27):
Right, yeah, sample Anyboddy artists joined me personally, I was
so happy to be acknowledged that, like, yo, like all right,
so real hip hops know who we are?

Speaker 1 (30:42):
Is shit? Like That's what it felt like that I.

Speaker 4 (30:46):
Was understand, man, you got to understand when you play
what we do. To me, it's crossover as far as
just the fact that we're telling people that this right
here is not right, this is not what you should
be doing this year. Right here is crazy. All y'all
doing is talking about the same bullshit, same stuff, the
same whatever like that. So y'all was bold. Now I

(31:07):
thought you was getting ready to tell me yo, Eric,
since we went that route, people like, yo, these.

Speaker 5 (31:12):
Motherfuckers, is this in the game?

Speaker 4 (31:15):
So I thought, I know, But I thought that's what
made it kind of for y'all. But again I thought, no,
I'm the same because listen, nobody did what y'all did
at that time to put the industry on blast. No
matter what you say, y'all put the industry on blasts.

Speaker 5 (31:31):
You know.

Speaker 3 (31:31):
It's funny though, when we made that video for first
of all, it was like we came at the train
platform a little too late, Like we were raised on YOMTV.

Speaker 1 (31:42):
Raps and all that stuff.

Speaker 3 (31:44):
So had like the YOMTV raps stratosphere lasted another like
five years, like really like it ended in like ninety
six ninety seven, right, But the effect where something new
could come on MTV and instantly get picked up. We
didn't have that tailwind that a lot of groups had

(32:06):
between eighty eight and ninety six at the height of
your TV raps, and so it was hard for us
to get on BT. I mean, you know, we do
rap City or whatever, but like we moved to Europe.
So the thing is is that our approach to videos

(32:27):
by that point it was such a kind of a shrug, man,
motherfuckers ain't going to catch this anyway, so okay whatever.
So it was almost like we told all right, and
I explained this before on the show. Do you remember
in Boomerang when Eddie Murphy was so depressed about Jacqueline

(32:48):
he told Jeffrey Holder to make whatever he wants to
on that strong Z thing, like he didn't approve it, just.

Speaker 1 (32:54):
Like, hey, dude, do whatever you want. I don't give it.

Speaker 5 (32:57):
Buck And he came back with all that shit, so so.

Speaker 3 (33:00):
Kind of and I know it seems like a cop out,
like a word, y'all just gonna tell us someone hell
to gun to your head and said make this video.
Like really, it was more like we showed up, all right,
show us where we stand, all right, roll it, cut
be out. But what they do was not the And

(33:21):
that's the thing people come up all the time like, yo, man,
I'm glad y'all took a stand.

Speaker 1 (33:26):
Da da da da da, And you know, I'd just.

Speaker 5 (33:28):
Be like, sure, yeah, it wasn't about that. Why you
had me food to.

Speaker 1 (33:33):
Tell you the truth?

Speaker 5 (33:33):
Bro?

Speaker 3 (33:34):
The director had did a similar video that was more
humorous for a rock group, and the rock group rejected
it and we went in the reject pile of get
from records, like, yo, what about this video?

Speaker 1 (33:48):
He's like, yeah, I could do that for you now.

Speaker 3 (33:50):
I'm certain for him it was a chance to sort
of take a dig at the industry and even then
seeing the final thing because we were in Europe so
much and it's not like they can email you or
look on your dropbox. It's not like now where I
could send somebody a clip and get you to approve it.
It was just basically like all right, we shot a

(34:11):
video and all right, the video's ready and we thought
we were trying to be funny in a fish out
of waterway, and it turned out that we were being
like instigators and suddenly we got beefour on our hands
because Biggie thought we were even that one more chanshit,

(34:32):
Like I didn't know that was the one more Champion shit.
So yes, I do believe in integrity in your artistry.
But we weren't really on the soapbox preach in the
way that I think people thought we were. We were
just lazy and didn't know what the video was about.
It was just like, why make a video. It ain't
like I'm going to play us anyway. All Right, We

(34:54):
done and we left. So that's kind of where we
went with it. But no, but in the terms of
money with waters. But like one of the funniest stories
I have in embarrassment. So when we got the credit
for a section on the is he real?

Speaker 1 (35:11):
Join? Is he for real? On the intro?

Speaker 3 (35:13):
That was the first time I ever got a gold record.
Girls used to come out of the crib. You worked
on that Redman record.

Speaker 1 (35:20):
I'd be like, well, yeah, you know he kind of
sampled this.

Speaker 3 (35:27):
Yay, Hey, this was like it wasn't it wasn't until
two thousand in which we finally started going golden platinum.
But like between the Redman record and who am I
sim Sima? Who got the people they sampled it as well?
Like right, the amount of people that have sampled.

Speaker 4 (35:44):
That that that intro thing of course, But nah, man,
I'm thinking y'all for that, so that you know that
yo dog for me that.

Speaker 3 (35:57):
Jesus Christ, those two songs along like the wave that
Dylan would talk about.

Speaker 5 (36:02):
Why you said Man Above.

Speaker 3 (36:03):
Man Above had the same texture, right, the same sort
of bounce. I assume that was made on the same
instrument or the same keyboard.

Speaker 5 (36:14):
That was made in a different place, because that's why
it's more cleaner.

Speaker 1 (36:19):
But Man Above, production wise, same shit, right.

Speaker 5 (36:23):
It was crazy. I was doing the Mary J. Blige
remix from the Dead for the.

Speaker 1 (36:28):
Man but ah, okay, okay, okay.

Speaker 5 (36:32):
So this all my life. I was gonna do a
my life remix.

Speaker 4 (36:37):
So that's how I had those acapellas because there wasn't
no acapellas back then.

Speaker 5 (36:40):
I was getting ready to do my life remix.

Speaker 1 (36:42):
That's the music that it was going to be for.

Speaker 4 (36:45):
I don't know, I just know that I never ended
up doing the remix, but I had them vocals.

Speaker 5 (36:51):
I used them.

Speaker 3 (36:52):
Of all your productions outside of yourself, EPM D, what
what do you feel are your top five all time
Eric Sermon productions outside of yourself and in your group.

Speaker 4 (37:07):
I know the best beat is gonna be so what
you're saying, though, but I'm gonna get off of that.
I'm gonna say, of course, how High. I'm gonna say,
the most beautifulest.

Speaker 1 (37:18):
There's two versions of how High? I did both of them.

Speaker 3 (37:21):
Why was the other version, the non the non silver
connection version pushed more like I didn't even get the
version that we now know as how High until like
maybe a month later.

Speaker 1 (37:34):
Like all we heard was the.

Speaker 4 (37:38):
First or on the Russell Simmons the show documentary that
was on the show first, and I heard they wanted
to shoo a video I called Lee. I was like,
oh wait, wait a second, let me you're going see
the video. Let me change the beat up, because you know,
there was this rhymen. You know how many bars there
was this rhymen and this ship was just it wasn't

(37:59):
If I'm gonna I'd rather met on the record. I
want to make sure that I gave them an opportunity.
I wasn't about radio. It was just making a better
record to me, you know what I mean. So I
made a better record, speaking of which you gotta talk about.
Buy you some yo, We're too Short. I didn't have
no idea that I was gonna come home in New
York and it's gonna be just as big as Atlanta.

(38:21):
I brung Too Short to the Apollo with me that night,
and he almost was crying, like Eric, I'm like, short,
they gonna love you out here, man, you you were
selling artists. And he didn't believe it until he hit
that stage and it was pandemonium. I get me in, Short,
who's playing guitar on that?

Speaker 1 (38:39):
Like that's a guitar?

Speaker 4 (38:41):
A guy named it was too short boy started jay,
but one or two short boys from the from the
Dangers Click he played it.

Speaker 3 (38:50):
Yeah, very unorthodox. That's basically live correct live.

Speaker 4 (38:56):
Yeah, all of the drums, the whole nine, the base,
the whole nine.

Speaker 5 (39:00):
His name is Shorty be Shorty Beef did it.

Speaker 4 (39:02):
And got it and me and short was just in
Atlanta as guests.

Speaker 5 (39:07):
Short had a lab the East Coast, West Coast.

Speaker 4 (39:10):
Beef was at the height of the time and we
thought that we can do something just to ease up,
ease up to talk, you know, to one guy from
the west, one guy from the east, and and that
and that came into play.

Speaker 5 (39:21):
I did that thing that night, one take and that's it.

Speaker 4 (39:24):
And I was like, yo, next thing, you know, Greg
Street had it and it was over and the last
I was jealous.

Speaker 1 (39:30):
Man.

Speaker 5 (39:30):
It lasted in Atlanta.

Speaker 4 (39:31):
For like at least told about, like talking about seven years,
six years, seven years straight of it being constantly played
every single day.

Speaker 1 (39:41):
My boy used to rip me.

Speaker 3 (39:43):
He's like, yo, man, how are you gonna let Eric
Sermon come in with a broken junkie sounded drum set
and I have to.

Speaker 1 (39:53):
Guitar and out do the roots?

Speaker 3 (39:57):
Like literally, My manager was like, he was like, remember
when y'all used to sound that raw?

Speaker 1 (40:02):
I was like, what should you talking about?

Speaker 3 (40:03):
It's like many y'all trying to do all these intrigate
jash it, but you need to get back to a
broken sound and drum set and a fucked up guitar
sound and ship and that's it.

Speaker 5 (40:14):
I couldn't but believe me, I'm just as shocked as you. Man.

Speaker 4 (40:17):
I was just doing the beat because it was me
and short. So I just did a rhyme. Man, I'm
not thinking this record's gonna do something. And then I
get home and fun Master Flex got it and it's
just as big as New York as it isn't and
you saying you had a Philly I'm like, man, this is.

Speaker 3 (40:31):
Crazy cos mccaff used to always play that ship and
and you know with the with the DMZL remix coming
after that.

Speaker 4 (40:37):
Oh listen, listen, David Sigerson said, Eric, dreamy Eys is
not doing well.

Speaker 5 (40:44):
So what do you mean?

Speaker 4 (40:45):
He said, Yo, it's not moving the way we thought
it was to be moving. It was it was a
thing called R and R back then on that whatever whatever.
So he said, can you remix it for me? So
automatically when I tell you a quest, it wasn't even
no thought. I knew what I was using, you know,
I didn't know that that was gonna take off neither,

(41:06):
but I go grab my partner, your Reggie.

Speaker 5 (41:08):
I knew you real quick. You see, I grab Readie
for everything you're read yo, right whatever.

Speaker 4 (41:12):
So after that, it was like, you know, and and
don't forget the music that was in the original record,
the band ban Then I had that sample to go on.
So I had some of the stuff, the ingredients from
the original Dreamy Eyes to put into my version. Not
that the angel is gonna be like yo, nigga, God

(41:33):
damn nigga.

Speaker 5 (41:34):
Like I mean he was. He was like, you know, yo,
thank you, whatever you need, I got you.

Speaker 3 (41:39):
So I mentioned to him like a year ago, like yo, man,
I said, Yo, how can we never thought about redoing
that live yo? And he was just like I forgot
about it. That that one's with the record books, but
wait where are the other for.

Speaker 5 (41:55):
Four three two one?

Speaker 4 (41:58):
And that's outside because I would say Headbanger too, because
that because when I sampled the Boosy Collins you know
again that yeah, yeah, you know, I sampled Boosi also
in Most Beautifulness too. But I made Headbanger for ice Cube.
I couldn't get it to him. So doing the last
two records, the last two records on business the person

(42:21):
that was Crossover and Headbanger because Russell said, if y'all
dropped that album the way it is, you're gonna fail.
So I so I went back and made Crossover and Headbanger.

Speaker 3 (42:31):
Last, did you trust Russell's ears on that one?

Speaker 5 (42:35):
I trust more Leo but Russell for some.

Speaker 4 (42:38):
Reason, Conder knew, and I gotta give him praises because
I heard that before I heard that that's not something
that Russell will do.

Speaker 5 (42:46):
Like, so you what a record and then you would
go with what he said.

Speaker 4 (42:50):
But believe me, he was adamant about if you in
Paris drop that album the way it is now, you're
gonna be in trouble.

Speaker 1 (43:02):
All right, let me ask you about crossover now.

Speaker 3 (43:05):
And you know, once bad Boy comes into play, all
rules early bad Boy, all rules out the window. I
was under the impression that if you sample something, it
has to be at least twenty years old, thirty years old,
like it has to be the vintage, a whole generation
before it can be sampled.

Speaker 1 (43:27):
Right.

Speaker 3 (43:28):
However, so I used to work in a record shop,
so I was very much familiar with Roger Trautman's girl
You Should Be Mine, of course, which was like his
new Jack Swingey attempt, which weird enough. Also like him
sampling Boutie Collins' Rubber Band r U B B e er.

(43:53):
You know it's a contemporary song right with samples in it.
Look after I met Dylan, he told me all bets
are off like anything could be sampled. It could be
made yesterday. Yes, I'll flip it.

Speaker 1 (44:08):
Yes. But back in the early nineties, I thought a record.

Speaker 5 (44:12):
Had to be old it did it?

Speaker 6 (44:15):
Did it? You?

Speaker 3 (44:18):
Basically sampled in crossover a somewhat Newish Roger Troutman song
that wasn't wanted new it was It wasn't even two
years old yet yet, so it was in the record store.
It wasn't old, the body wasn't warm yet. Like, what
made you want to sample that?

Speaker 4 (44:36):
I'm a fan of. I resembered watching my whole life.
So after I get picked up from Bron Guidry from
Sony whatever, he has the Sipus Hills album on him.
So from the airport were playing Cypus Hills. That's how
I caught Q and Cube knew about them, and how
Cube got in the video. Cube know by siplus to me.

Speaker 3 (44:57):
So he came to the Apollo to shoot just kill
a man because.

Speaker 4 (45:01):
Yo, yeah, but I think he heard don't forget I've
brung the cassette tape to a Q video in Cali,
and He's like, holy shit.

Speaker 5 (45:09):
So when I got home, who was in New York
shoot in the video. But but anyway, got it you
was asked me about.

Speaker 3 (45:17):
Let me explain to our listeners what I'm asking him
is basically for him to sample. You got to chill
for EPMD. That to me is a vintage song that
we all know, and if it's vintage, that means it's
been oven long enough to be sample. However, we're crossover.
That song was like not even two years old yet,

(45:40):
and you know, like I was like wow when I
heard it. I was like, yo, are we allowed to
sample something that's brand new, that isn't even vintage yet
before it's ready to be sampled. And for you, there
wasn't a difference.

Speaker 4 (45:54):
Well, I thought it was new because I didn't. I
never saw it yet, so to me, I think it
probably was even a year old. But I saw the
hem on the thing with the globe all I saw
so on the cover, So it wasn't my intentions to sample.

Speaker 5 (46:10):
I just saw a new Roger album, don't forget.

Speaker 4 (46:13):
When I got to the hand the album then Russell
was like, if you hand the album then y'all gonna fail, right,
So I went and made crossover. Happened to have the
consette tape on me, right, and I went through it
and baby with you be mine? I let it play.

(46:35):
It said, well, I'm bearing back to you whatever you are.

Speaker 5 (46:41):
I said, holy ship.

Speaker 3 (46:43):
Here's the thing though, and this is another deal with
thing now, anyone else me included, I would have thought
that first part, the baby won't you be My like
if my boss is telling me my album's gonna fail
if I don't have a hit single. Of all the

(47:03):
parts to sample on that record, I would have never
thought sample the bridge. I would have sampled the other part.
What made you choose the the lesser of two evils?
The part that I wouldn't think the sample. You just
wanted the texture. You wanted the texture quarter. It was,

(47:24):
that's Roger. So when you hit a more.

Speaker 4 (47:26):
Balanced you got the chill, but both boom boom bow quarter.

Speaker 5 (47:30):
So I got to bring that back. That's the whole thing.

Speaker 3 (47:34):
And all of your bass assault songs, especially the way
you flip the Adriz mohammed shit, that to me is
like whatever you cooked up for the verse, that is
prime Eric SimMan like perfection to me, man, that that's
just that's my ship, all right.

Speaker 1 (47:51):
So what are your last.

Speaker 5 (47:52):
Two reservoir dogs?

Speaker 3 (47:55):
You did res dogs Man, No, the Reservoir Dogs on
Jay's record.

Speaker 5 (48:00):
Me and Rock Waller did ves Dogs.

Speaker 4 (48:03):
Yes, you look at the credits of Eric Sermon and
pop rock name not even on that on there.

Speaker 5 (48:08):
But he did it with me.

Speaker 1 (48:10):
Damn. I didn't even know that shit. Yo. Talk about
the four three two one session.

Speaker 5 (48:14):
There was no session. I did that with nobody being there.

Speaker 4 (48:17):
It was a record that was done by track masters
at first though quest and the record I didn't like it,
and they had look going first and whatever go on
this part, this is going that part. It wasn't nothing
that you heard. So I told Kevin Lows, Yo, give
me the song.

Speaker 5 (48:32):
I'm gonna make.

Speaker 4 (48:32):
Let me see if I could do something with it.
And put your hands were so hot. So I made
my own version of push your hands while forty two
one came out. See if you listen to forty two
one and put your hands, it's the same drum pattern.

Speaker 5 (48:46):
I followed the same drum pattern. Set it going. Oh,
I tell you're going, but boom boom. I did boom
boom boom. That's it. I did nothing different.

Speaker 1 (49:00):
A I didn't realize that till right the fuck now.

Speaker 3 (49:04):
Damn. So by the time you got it, they all
did their verses already.

Speaker 4 (49:11):
Did their verses and the only one that we added
on was cannabis and then the master p. But the
verses were done, so of course I got to put
retting MEP together. They didn't have running MEP together. I
put reverting MEP together. And then I'm like, Yo, the
new kid dnx, I gotta make sure that it comes
in so farward.

Speaker 5 (49:26):
Stay out the door.

Speaker 4 (49:27):
So whoever, so when he comes, I got to make
sure that this is highlighted because I.

Speaker 5 (49:33):
Know he's the next of the next. So and then llokuja.

Speaker 4 (49:37):
You see how I was putting in the ll cooj
or stopping because Llo first didn't go like that. He
was rhyming so fast through the whole verse. I was
breaking it up for it to make sense to me.
And that's why I was add living and cannabis. Got mad,
said Yo, man, I thought you was. I thought I
was squawed. You know you added on everybody only verse

(49:57):
you add libble doing with Llo cujas verse. I said,
I was add living to fill the holes in Ah.

Speaker 1 (50:04):
I got it. I got it.

Speaker 3 (50:06):
So did you realize like what was brewing underneath as
far as like what was happening between l and and Cannabis.

Speaker 1 (50:15):
At the time.

Speaker 4 (50:17):
Nah, I didn't realize. I thought that Cannabis would never
dissed him. But Llokoj is like that.

Speaker 3 (50:22):
Ll explained like on this podcast that okay, I might
have taken it too far.

Speaker 4 (50:29):
And I think that LLOJ got us on Rampage too.
You think he's busting shots females rappers too. I don't
give a fuck fool he got fucking Foxy on u Shota.

Speaker 5 (50:39):
Like it don't matter be Lookoja is a battle rapper
at heart.

Speaker 1 (50:47):
So even though in his own posse cut that's.

Speaker 4 (50:50):
Benefiting him, Yes, you and your squad, but to face
the real guard, the undertaking that's in Rampage, it's only
one squad and that's the hit squad.

Speaker 5 (51:03):
There's no other person calling them selves squads but that.

Speaker 4 (51:06):
And again, if you look at Paris when he says,
I know they all met Dick l but that's okay. See,
somebody would take take it like Paris is telling Ello
Cuja that see what I'm saying, you gotta watch what
the what the people do. I know you don't look
at it like that, but they do.

Speaker 3 (51:23):
Damn man, you're gonna make me go back and listen
to your entire canvon to see subliminal digs. I mean,
I'm thinking that if someone's on your record that y'all family,
y'all squad, I don't know it.

Speaker 5 (51:36):
Don't go like that.

Speaker 4 (51:37):
I just told you what the Foxy Brown with with
who shot you? Nigga like yo, like he might not
say it again. But two you're saying that.

Speaker 5 (51:46):
I'm not mad at him. That's the He's the battle
ultimate battle rapper.

Speaker 4 (51:50):
Wow, that's why he came back and probably detracted to cannabis.
Cannabis loved that. Why would he just llokoja? He wouldn't
do that.

Speaker 3 (51:59):
At the time when he Burray came to you, did
he have an actual MC name? Because I love the
fact that.

Speaker 5 (52:05):
And then it was Keith it Keith.

Speaker 3 (52:06):
But what made what made him use his government name
instead of his his MC name me. I mean, I
thought it was smart. I thought it was ironic.

Speaker 4 (52:15):
He said, he said, Eric, I'm gonna use my name,
you use your name. I'm calling myself Keith Murray. Sounded
like an R and B artist exactly.

Speaker 1 (52:23):
Yep. The irony of it, yep.

Speaker 3 (52:26):
Okay, So what's the decision behind with the Insomnia Project
and the Erico NASA's album. Oh my god, man, hey man,
I'm like Ard War You're you're Eric servant.

Speaker 1 (52:38):
I have to ask.

Speaker 5 (52:39):
But I wish I could go back.

Speaker 4 (52:41):
I wish I could not with funk Orama because I
love that Q Tips showed up and met them in
the video. Was so dope like that. But I just
think that I was on in the scope and Jimmy
I Bean was playing the record for Dre back and forth,
and Dre were like, Yo, not yet, not ready yet,
not ready yet, not yet ready yet?

Speaker 5 (52:59):
So when when the product that you heard, Dre okay it?

Speaker 4 (53:03):
But when I go back, I'd be like, man, I
could have made it more like the Chronic where it
had me. I could have made it more like my
production as far as like what I really wanted to
make for it and not make records for the groups
that I had. I could have did the Chronic and
then had those rappers on the type chronic, type of mode.

(53:25):
And that's all I felt about that funk Orama was
where I was supposed to go the whole album.

Speaker 1 (53:32):
Got it? Yo? Did you do any production on Jamal's
record at all?

Speaker 5 (53:36):
I just did. I told you I did situation and
I did keep it real.

Speaker 1 (53:41):
Jamal's you Didn't You didn't do Jamon did you?

Speaker 5 (53:44):
Mom? Was on My Rockwaller.

Speaker 4 (53:45):
Jamal's album is one of the most underrated for him
having Diamond.

Speaker 1 (53:51):
D say it, Eric Simon say.

Speaker 4 (53:54):
It, Rockwader Man, Mike Dean, I mean he it was.
It was put together man, Jesus Christ, it was put together.
Phill Duphies was doing Molly Jim Yo. Why do you
think he was on Buster? He was on on Junior
markea like, but he Reggie, he was a problem.

Speaker 1 (54:14):
Oh he should have been way bigger, should have been
way bigger.

Speaker 5 (54:16):
Way, bigger way, bigger.

Speaker 3 (54:18):
Music just came out of nowhere. No one saw music
coming right. No, no cats was ready to count you out.
And I don't mean like personally counts you out. Yeah,
it's just like you know, with you don't expect someone
that was first hitting like thirteen years ago to be
even a big to be even a a bigger factor.

Speaker 5 (54:39):
I know, I know. It was crazy.

Speaker 4 (54:41):
It was again, man, I still again, but No, I saved,
gave me all that life again for him, still in
that record, for my basement, and trusting that the world
had to.

Speaker 5 (54:53):
Hear it because I didn't make it for the world.

Speaker 4 (54:55):
I made it because Midnight Love was my favorite albums,
and I was just saying that if I was had
Marvin Gate, here's what I would make on him.

Speaker 5 (55:02):
That's what I was doing. I was saying that I
would make something like this with him.

Speaker 1 (55:07):
She said music was not supposed to come out.

Speaker 5 (55:09):
It was stolen from my basement. It was not supposed
to come out.

Speaker 1 (55:12):
How people stealing ship from your basement and bringing.

Speaker 5 (55:14):
It on it It was it was my best friend.

Speaker 4 (55:17):
The fact that I played it for him and he
took it, and then like I didn't know that he
took it. And when I got to the w Hotel
it was a clear channel music seminar and Steve was like, yo,
he played it for him, And when they all came
back into your eric, your new song with Marvin Gate
is fantastic.

Speaker 5 (55:37):
So it was he stole it. It was never going
to leave my basement.

Speaker 3 (55:41):
How hard was it to clear the or at least
to get blessings from.

Speaker 4 (55:46):
I paid them. I paid two one thousand dollars. I
paid one fifty to the state and fee down to
the lawyer. Well, I knew that the time of Toler
Clive Davis was battling on the table. So once Tommy
came with his off and we went to climb and said, Yo,
time you offer X, Y and Z. So I knew
that that four million was coming. So again the best

(56:07):
thing to do is to pay for it.

Speaker 3 (56:09):
Got it okay? And talk about working with just Blaze
for uh for React?

Speaker 5 (56:15):
Oh my god, this is some stuff.

Speaker 1 (56:16):
But you missed did you see did you.

Speaker 5 (56:18):
See the right I ain't right back with it.

Speaker 1 (56:22):
Did you see the post about React?

Speaker 5 (56:25):
No?

Speaker 1 (56:27):
Okay, send it to me. There's I gotta find it.

Speaker 3 (56:32):
But and I always wanted to know, so I don't
know exactly what's happening. So the part that you got
sampled like whatever she says, and now I'm mean whatever
y'all sampled is And I don't know the language or whatever,
but it is. It is a very depressing song. I

(56:53):
heard about heartbreak. It's like the opposite of it, and
I get it. Like with hip hop, you can take
anything and make it. But there was someone's like, you know,
like Eric Sermon, just happens to choose like the most
depressing song about.

Speaker 4 (57:08):
Yeah, I know about death suicide. I know I heard
about that. I heard about that.

Speaker 1 (57:13):
Yeah, that's crazy, So yeah, how did you look up
with Just Blaze?

Speaker 5 (57:17):
After music dropped?

Speaker 4 (57:19):
People was like, yo, you know again to come back
with another one after something like Marvin Gabe Man, like
I said for and I know Just Blaze got in
trouble from Dame Dash with that, Like yo, you how
you gonna give somebody say without putting it past us?
Nigga Jermaine Duprix had that beat where Meth had that beat.

Speaker 5 (57:37):
Nobody knew what to do with the record. If you
watch the jay.

Speaker 4 (57:40):
Z documentary from Redder Mephis in the limousine, you couldn't
hear that record in the background.

Speaker 5 (57:45):
They had to be playing, but again, nobody knew what
to do with it.

Speaker 4 (57:49):
I just heard it and was like, yo, whatever she
said that, I'm not so once I had a concept.

Speaker 5 (57:54):
I'm ready to go, you know what I'm saying.

Speaker 4 (57:55):
And the verse that that Reggie's that you hear Reggie,
It was an old verse. I put Reggie on the
record like I always do, and then when Reggie heard it,
he did the verse over. But that was a demo
that I played for Clide Davis after the music for
the second album. I played it with a demo Reggie
and then Reggie did the verse so over for the

(58:16):
South Cleara.

Speaker 3 (58:18):
You know what, I feel like, I'm Hot should have
been even further than music, Like, why wasn't I'm Hot
fully promoted?

Speaker 1 (58:26):
You know what?

Speaker 4 (58:26):
I think that, you know, it wasn't just you, man,
I think that Clive and then was getting ready to
jump to the second album really quick because music had
did what it did. And then I'm Hot came and
we shot the video and the twin towers had got hit.
So the video started with the fire, the fire truck,
the whole nine.

Speaker 5 (58:49):
So the politics of I'm Hot, you.

Speaker 4 (58:51):
Know, I'm hot, just like so, you know, with the
people burning up the whole nine.

Speaker 5 (58:56):
I think that's what stopped it from going.

Speaker 4 (58:58):
I really think that because because the video was banned
and the record was just bad timing. But but again
I thought too, and I thought that maybe I said, Okay,
well he going back to the Marvin Gaye again. It's
not that and this, But I felt how you felt.
I think it was more politics.

Speaker 3 (59:12):
Got it, yo, man, there's so much of your remixes.
I want to ask, but you know, it's already three.

Speaker 5 (59:20):
Hours, it's already a part to us. Three hours. But listen.

Speaker 4 (59:23):
I did three and a half hours with Drink Champs too, Like,
no matter what, No, you wouldn't the same thing you doing.
He's like, Eric, I could still keep going. I'm like, yeah,
you're right. This is thirty seven years of me being
this game, doing what I do and producing almost half
the entire hip hop industry and the third of R
and B music. I produced it, so I get it.
I know it's I know you can go. You can

(59:44):
keep going because I put it in.

Speaker 3 (59:47):
So I'm not going to ask you the usual like
are you still hungry? I know you're still hungry because
even the records we'd have mentioned, like the esp Joint hitting,
the breath of fresh airs you even then, like like
what keeps you?

Speaker 1 (01:00:06):
What keeps you going?

Speaker 5 (01:00:08):
I feel like Nas.

Speaker 4 (01:00:09):
You know how Nas just put the Fall five albums
out and nobody again. No, Like he didn't get the
response that he wanted, but he didn't want that response.
He just wanted the rhyme. He felt like, I got
this rude with hip boy. I'm gonna do four albums
with him, do one whatever, And That's why I'm at.
I'm at though, two yo. I like what I'm doing.

(01:00:30):
I like this craft. I like making records, you know
what I'm saying. Of course, if I was in it
where I had to make money from it and survive, oh,
I'll be brought up a little bit more different. But
right now like like I still I like, you know,
making records and being able to do certain stuff and
then being able to be like, Okay, well I watched

(01:00:53):
my colleagues and I'd be like, yo, listen, question.

Speaker 5 (01:00:55):
You ain't gonna tell me to stop, nigga. I know
when it's over.

Speaker 4 (01:00:58):
I know when the shit there than when when our
colleagues and went too far and it's over for them.
But you ain't gonna tell me that, you know, I
would know that, like when I dropped Brunner in twenty nineteen,
I was ahead of my time. I know the fact
that when it comes down to it, I'm blessed with
what I know how to do, and that's.

Speaker 5 (01:01:16):
Make records and do music. So I choose not to
do it.

Speaker 4 (01:01:20):
If I choose not to, but nobody gonna stop me,
and nobody gonna know you and being gonna tell me
that's over for me.

Speaker 5 (01:01:25):
I tell myself is over.

Speaker 1 (01:01:27):
You tell the truth, Like.

Speaker 5 (01:01:30):
You said that age stuff.

Speaker 4 (01:01:32):
You can write, nigga write a rhyme, enough with you,
Nigga's mad because you still here nigga.

Speaker 3 (01:01:38):
Right, rhyme, how do you exercise the muscles in the gym?
Like making beats? Like how many do you make a day?

Speaker 4 (01:01:45):
Well, I don't make this many productions as that dude
like I used to. But I stayed with the rhyme.
My sister even say, yo, my brother's always exercising, meaning
that no matter what, like I still keep the rhymes going.

Speaker 5 (01:01:58):
And she was like, you're ericant.

Speaker 4 (01:01:59):
I've been around you a long time, and I tell
it everybody. I said, my brother keeps the exercise on
that mic, like, no matter what, he always constantly writing rhymes.
I make beats when I have to, and I want
to get back into that in twenty twenty five where
I'm making the least a couple of beats today, I
really really stopped doing that, Like right now. I got

(01:02:21):
a whole bunch of shit that I got called for
just today, que someone Walker, Beyondce, a couple of others
the game everybody that called in for records, and I'd
be like, Okay, what damn do I have it? Or
do I not have it? And if I don't have it,
then I gotta go make it. So that's when you
know too. But I did so much stuff in between,

(01:02:42):
because you see COVID was here, that was three years
of making music before that.

Speaker 5 (01:02:48):
Jazzy Jeff says something that was so prolific.

Speaker 4 (01:02:51):
He says, get everything out of your laptop because it's
doing shit in there. So that whole mentality now though
two quest is like I'm letting all this shit go.

Speaker 5 (01:03:04):
You know about that?

Speaker 4 (01:03:05):
If I have to make volumes to put out on
the web for niggas just to have, it's not gonna
do me no good inside that laptop.

Speaker 3 (01:03:13):
You right, you are right, yo, man, Just with I'm
trying to figure out that there's anything you.

Speaker 5 (01:03:22):
Can always get me again.

Speaker 4 (01:03:24):
You gotta come back, you know, you do, I know,
I know, I know, I know, But I feel like
it's one of the moments where it's like someone's going
to be like you, what the fuck you ask him about?
Oh yeah, I think that you started off with the
correct answers and you ended off with everything that I
didn't expect the records to mention, the ones you brought up.

Speaker 5 (01:03:44):
All of it is difference.

Speaker 4 (01:03:44):
It's gonna be very different from every other interview I
did because the questions that you asked.

Speaker 1 (01:03:49):
Well, those are my favorite. Man.

Speaker 3 (01:03:51):
But thank you, bro. Like you're you're definitely one of
my aspirations. Like not not just like empty talker, Oh
you a leged, you legend, like literally, man, the amount
of times that I've heard your ideas and like, yo, man,
I gotta try that ship out. But do man, You're
you're such an inspiration to us in the movement. Man,

(01:04:12):
I just want to I want to thank you for that, man,
And I'm.

Speaker 4 (01:04:14):
Glad you told me about the Jay Diller thing because
I would never thought that again. I hear people Jay
Diner speak about other people's names.

Speaker 5 (01:04:22):
I never heard him talk about me. And I'm baseline driven.

Speaker 4 (01:04:24):
But for you to say, Eric, nah nigga, the neo
soul movement was started by you.

Speaker 5 (01:04:30):
This other movement was started by you.

Speaker 4 (01:04:32):
You making these records, made these sounds, and we was listening.

Speaker 3 (01:04:38):
You were the guy of that man and we we
we thank you for that ship.

Speaker 1 (01:04:41):
Man.

Speaker 3 (01:04:41):
So okay on behalf of the squad, y'all. I hope
you have a good year until the next time. Question Love,
Eric Servant, question of Supreme check out thank you for
listening to Question of Supreme posted by air Quest, Loft Thompson,
Liah Saint Clair, Sugar, Steve Mandel, and unpaid Bill Sherman.

(01:05:06):
Executive producers are Amir Quest, Love Thompson, Sean g and
Brian Calhoun. Produced by Brittany Benjamin Cousin, Jake Payne and
Liah Saint Clair. Edited by Alex Convoys. Produced by iHeart
by Noel Brown.

Speaker 1 (01:05:34):
Quest Love Supreme is a production of iHeart Radio.

Speaker 3 (01:05:41):
For more podcasts from iHeart Radio, visit the iHeart Radio app,
Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.