QLS Classic: Alan Leeds (Part 3 of 3)

We conclude our interview with Alan Leeds by talking about his one of his biggest clients, Prince, and Alan reflects on his time on the road working with Chris Rock and D’Angelo.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:01):
This is umpay Bill from Team Supreme, here to give
you the latest Quest Love Freme Classic episode. Back in October,
Alan Leaves was our fifth guest on q LS. That conversation,
which I encourage you all to check out, has been
re released. But even three hours Allan was not enough.
He came back for a two part interview. Last week.
We ran part two, which you also need do here

(00:22):
Now Here's Allen's third QLs episode, first aired March. In
this final of three parts, Allen talks a lot about
as James Brown. There's some really great stuff, especially if
you're a fan of Prince D'Angelo and Chris Rock. Alan
leads definitely deserved three QLs episodes, and we're happy to
share the leading episode one O two in Jodan. Okay,

(00:50):
see you. You walked us thoroughly through UH prime early
younger James Brown in the in the beginning, So no, no, no, Well,
I actually want to skip because it's more about the
business of tour managing than anything um and this stuff

(01:11):
I really didn't get to touch upon the last time
you were here. So I mean, assuming that by the numbers,
I would I would think that Prince was your biggest
artist at least by the numbers. Yeah, touring wise, So
when you're okay, so when it's like okay, we're going

(01:32):
to tour, what is step number one in tour managing
at least by the eighties contemporary version, which I which
I assume hasn't changed much now except for the communication.
Probably not, but it's a lot of it depends on
your relationship with the artist and his person, his or

(01:54):
her personal manager. Because you take three tours in the chemistries,
that can be three different things. Um. Most tour managers
don't get involved in routing. We're dealing with the agents.
I did. Um. I knew routing from having done it
for five years with Brown. I knew arenas at new buildings.

(02:16):
So for not only let me deal with Rob Light
and we would sit and agent at the time and
the tour promoters, which were usually Jeff Sharp and Quentin
Perry has partners. Wait, Jeff Sharp, he can goes back
to the early eighties, Damn. Okay. I know Jeff started

(02:39):
from my my days of like smoking grooves and whatnot.
But I didn't realized that he was early eighties into
the Yeah. Yeah, because he was he was independent on
the had his own company. It was long before a
e g. Which is now Latin. But and we would

(03:00):
sit down and talk about, Okay, you know, how many
days do we want to play in certain cities? And
you know, Sharpen the agent would do their research and
come back and say, okay, Baltimore is worth two nights,
bill these worth three nights, Detroits worth six nights. And
then we would sit there and digest that, and then
we would decide what we wanted to do with that information.

(03:22):
Do we want to underplay it? Do we want to
sit in Detroit for a week? Um? And didn't you
know we would route a tour. So most two managers
don't do that. They just get an itinerary from the
agents and says, this is where you're going. I know,
I know with an artist like Prince who was kind
of hands off as far as you're getting to know him,

(03:45):
and so you I guess the last time you're you're
saying that chick was like if you asked him any questions,
he'll think you don't know what you're doing. But it's like, well,
one the narrative of the of the Purple Rain phenomenon,
what I assume was unprecedented to everyone on how successful

(04:08):
this is going to be or not. I mean, the
movie could have came out and did Cherry Moon numbers
and then it's like, well does he have life? I
would assume that the success of the movie meant more
dates had to be added, and it was crazy. So
then I'm I'm thinking, are you like, Okay, well this

(04:29):
guy likes to do these man in three hour shows. Uh,
maybe we'll let him do three nights and then get
time off the rest. Or would he say no, work
me to the bone? I want to know he would
he would? You know? I mean what you described about
not asking too many questions applied when I was new,
before he really got to know me. Okay, but from

(04:52):
then on it was like what the problem? I mean,
we would talk about anything that was necessary to talk about.
Would no hesitation? I mean the tiptoe. So when I
started with him, as in how many nights do you
want to do? How many nights do you want off?
And a person that's addicted to recording would would he
want equal time off to like, Okay, well let's do

(05:15):
four nights on the road. And but then you have
this large tour on your back. You have to make
money exactly exactly. Yeah, every every night, off the meter
is still running, everybody's in hotels, the trucks and busses
are still running. Everything. Was he fin was he financially aware?
What was he sort of it pays for itself somehow? Yeah,
he wasn't really financially aware in those in the days

(05:38):
I was there. I mean he'd radically changed that in
time past. You think, Um, I wish I could see
the erow we just did, here's a here's a latitude
in my room, because we used to begging to try
to cut costs and because I mean, you're doing this phenomenal.
I mean, I'll flash forward to Love Sexy, a tour

(06:01):
that barely broke even if in fact it did probably
lost money, and saw the final accountings of the tour,
but you know it's a very very expensive tour to
mount and um, you know he can't get rich off
that tour. I mean it's a legendary tour for the
production value, but it was financially not successful. Purple ring was.

(06:24):
I mean, that phenomenon was beatlesque. It was crazy, just
car around. True. I would I would also think that, uh,
he didn't care his his attitude towards money. Every time
we go to say we can't afford he said, but
I pay you guys to find the money. I want this,

(06:48):
so figure it out. So there wasn't logic at all.
Just make it happen. Yeah, pretty pretty much. This is
what I want. Make it happen. I see, okay, So
not to compare the two. One of the one of
the prevalent problems of the Voodoot tour was that if de'

(07:09):
angela ever went super hard with his voice, there might
be the risk of us canceling the next night. Whereas Prince,
well known for his screaming and use of his voice.
I mean, were there ever problems of like his voice
gave out tonight, we have to cancel the show. And
it was never a major concern. I mean, having said that,

(07:29):
it probably were times where his voice was in shape
than it was, like I mean the trap of a feather,
Daniel was like, I cancel the ship. But where Prince
was Prince Moore Rider died. James Brown like, I don't
care that I could be sick. Yes, So he did
purple rain shows, even absolutely with a hurt knee and

(07:51):
you know what cold and you know I mean, which
nothing stopped it was. I think it was a TV
performance where like he hits himself in the face with
the yeah, like he did the whole set with like
a mouthful of blood or something like that. Well, yeah,
he Susanna said that he busted his lip doing that. No,

(08:12):
he was a trooper. I mean you had to give
him so many days off. I mean, I don't think
we ever did more than three on before we took
an off date. And we tried to do to one
to one, but there were threes, but I don't really
think we did more than three. I'm starting with Purple
Rain two, where he was doing five and six a week.
But um, but starting with Purple Rain, it was a

(08:35):
little less often because it was it was a strain
you were sure to do. I see. So then how
do you you You were out at the beginning, so
you built that into the routing and assuming that okay, well,
I know that those Christmas shows were in Minnesota, so
you assume that he wanted to be home for Christmas
and accident of course, okay, and and gave a band,

(09:01):
assuming that the band also lived in Minnesota well as well,
so and afternoon shows up to think like we did
do a couple of mats. I think and I know
we did one. It was either Christmas eve Day or
Christmas Day. I have to go look and don't remember.
So even then it was like not take Christmas off.
It was no, because that's that's that's a big ticket.

(09:25):
And again you can I think we were off Christmas Day.
I think that mattinate was Christmas. I don't know. It
was either Christmas Day or Christmas eve Day. But you
know this is when you're on tour, you know this,
and in the meter's running, you gotta be very strategic
about where your up dates are because okay, so but

(09:48):
thank you sir, the thing is very the most organized.
That's why he's here. Wait wait, I just had an
important question about so. Well, what I'm trying to get
at is when handling uh what I call monkey wrenches
or eleventh hour avoid uh disaster. So I think with

(10:14):
Purple Rain, uh the when did he get the ideas
that he wanted to take off days to to do
shows at for deaf children at death at death schools
that we kind of built in from the beginning. I mean,
it wasn't it wasn't wasn't just death. We we did
Gallant at College in Washington, d C. Which is a

(10:36):
university for hearing a prayered people. Well, hearing it parents
not become in this woke era. You know it's supposed
to say hearing it proods. So can you say that, um,
what do you say? I always said that I didn't
know hearing a parent was trust me. Tristan corrects me
on a regular basis. It's like, dadda, don't say that.

(10:56):
That's not cool. Was it his relationship with Tristan that
it often wondered if that influence did because certainly he
can do Tristan by then, and there was a possibility
that maybe because Trison would hang out, they shoot hoops
sometimes and you go into the students with him. How
is Tristan now? Wait what in my mind Tristan is

(11:16):
still like sixty, I wasn't ready for this. Ship is
a man, Yes, Tristan, Oh, he acts like it. It's
no mistaking he's a man. When you talk to him, dude,
he's he's d's eh. That's how in my mind Tristan is.

(11:42):
I think he would be like he's twenty nine now,
like forty freaking five. Ship, I didn't realize that. Okay,
so at the beginning of this happening, like was he
aware of lu Prince was, Like was Tristan Well, even
at the time he was, I mean if he's five
years than men, yeah he was seven eight If he wasn't,

(12:08):
he became a word pretty quickly, I mean certainly by
like he was. He was born in seventy four, so
Purple was, and he knew who Prince was. Definitely, And
Dad's in a movie. Okay, you know ten year old kid,
Dad's in a movie. I see, so it's up the time.

(12:32):
But but his relationship, I mean, Prince had seen him
and met him, but it was later that they got
close when once Paisley Park was up, which is of
course several years past Purple. But once Paisley Park goes
up and Tristan started spending more time with us in Minneapolis.
He would come out with me and do you not
be going to work? And he's like, can I hang out?

(12:52):
And yeah, come on if you want, and he'd spend
the whole Yes, he'd take him in the studio and
play him stuff and sitting ask him like, okay, what
do you hear? What if this track can you feel
the base part. Can you hear the drums? Can you
hear the guitar? Because he was always interested in what
is his degree? His degree of hearing, because quite deaf

(13:13):
in the higher registers, but his hearing is maybe fifty
fifty and low registers. Okay, it's perfect for hip hop.
Heaby and and I'll never forget. This is really off
the beating path, but I'll never forget. We were riding
in a car and Alexander's O'Neill's fake, fake, fake fake

(13:38):
came on the radio. Can I gets base? We're listening
to came? O j was another you can hear that
song coming from a mile away, and don't talk. Tristan
would hear that open being his low teens, ten eleven,
twelve years old, and He's like that, that sounds like fake,

(13:58):
and Alan's drove off the road. Uh. And that's when
I realized that he had not just enough hearing, but
also the musical sensibility to recognize a song just based
on and it wasn't even jacked up loud, so it
was definitely base and drops, whatever the patterns were. And

(14:20):
it really it changed our lives because from that point on,
you know, it was. It was very awkward to have
somebody who lives and breathes a passion for music. You
can't have a child that you can't share that with.
And more importantly, it's not about me, it's about him,
because you don't want it to appear that something that

(14:42):
he can't get into is so important to dad, because
that creates a void. It creates a feeling of inadequacy,
which is the last thing you want him to have,
because the whole, the whole idea of raising a child
who has a hearing problem is that you can do
anything except here. And we're not going to give you

(15:03):
a pass because of that. You're gonna get out of
the car and go into the store and get what
you want. And if you have to write a note,
whatever the hell you have to do to communicate with
the store clerk or wherever the hell we are, you're
gonna do that. And that's how we raised him, and
and is totally self sufficient, and you know as a result,
and you're not gonna get any sympathy. It's like, you know,

(15:25):
this is this is the world, this is the world,
and you gotta function and I ain't gonna be here
forever okay. So the idea that music was so important
to me was awkward because I didn't want him to
sense how important it was so as to feel like
an outsider or that he was somebody inadequate. So when

(15:49):
he started recognizing songs, I'm like, oh, I mean this, this,
this was the kid. When he was like five years old.
We would look it up. He would see a Funkadelic
album cover. Of course, he was a track the Parliament
Delic album Carrots because of the graphics and every and
he's five years old, and god, that crazy George. Crazy George.

(16:10):
So he had the disease it was in And now
he sends me YouTube clips of bands that I've never
heard of. If he turns me onto Mortarship that I mean,
it's it's it's crazy. Um. But then we were totally
off the beat and path. No, I'm wow. I'm still
mind blowing. That he's in his forties, so it's crazy.

(16:33):
So okay. So I'm also it's hard to explain to
people that I could have a son forty five and
that that he was born when I was only ten.
That's there you go. Also, I guess I have to
take into account that Prince rarely got a no in
the eighties if he wanted something done correct or okay,

(16:56):
I pay you to figure it out. Just yeah, you
would have to figure it out, give you a story.
And I don't know if we if you cut me off,
if we did this before. But but this is this
is a metaphor for everything about Prince. Remember the Alphabet
Street video. Yeah you did tell us a story? I did. Okay, okay,
you can go back and listen to that one in

(17:17):
the quest. Yes, so all right, So that's that's a
prime Is there any other Well, there was at least
one a day. When when when did the after shows?
I mean the earliest after show I've heard was, well
the sign, Well there was a parade. There's a few
parade ones in Europe, but what was There was one

(17:40):
in a hotel bar in I have that one. Well
where he just crashed a hotel bar that had a
band and just decided to take over and they were
fine with that. It was Prince, Yeah, it was Prince.
Was the Prince was like, who's this guy? No, it
was Prince Okay, yeah, okay, no, we we have a

(18:02):
I think one of the earliest ones we have is
a there's a Sam's Club. He debutsed all the critics
love you in New York and remember he said this
is this is just a dance. Yeah, so obviously, oh yeah,
that was an after show from that. That's a great
shop by the way. Yeah, it was. I'm trying to
find I don't know if it exists, but there's one. Uh.
I think job Wobble was playing at First Avenue that

(18:24):
night and he got up on stage with Prince got
up on stage with him in the base. Yeah, it
was like, yeah, he licked the guitar. Yeah, Prince, we
were in a club in Paris. This was in the
pre Cheering Moon experiment of going to Paris to see

(18:46):
if he liked it and would we shoot in France
and we were. It was Farnoi and Prince and me
and don't forget who else, maybe Jerome, and we spent
a week in Paris just to hang out and see
if Prince might survive it. Yeah, and he spent most
of the time in his hotel suite with the keyboard

(19:06):
that we went on bought the first day we got there.
Um writing music, most of which ended up this party.
The Cherryman and Parade Elements on. Um. Long story short,
we were in some crazy club that was like a
low rent version of Mulan Rouge. They had they had

(19:27):
dancing girls that were exacted. Was it wasn't an outright
titty bar. I mean it wasn't you know, it wasn't sleazy,
but they were hot girls who were abbreviated outfits abbreviated.
I don't know how did you say that? I mean
they had clothes on, but barely. Okay anyway, Um, but

(19:49):
it was. It was just a little Parisian lounge and
it it, you know, and for some reason he liked it,
and so we went there a couple of times and
they had little combo and I I think it was like
a three piece combo of three local musicians that played
corny stuff. They were terrible, and he just one night

(20:11):
he looked at me and he said, would you ask
me if I could play? And I don't think those
musicians really knew who he was. I mean they were
they were older guys, and they were like the French
version of the De Polie trio or something. They were
just really really cheesy, and he just decided he wanted
to play. I don't know if he wanted to impress
one of the dancers or what. And he got up

(20:32):
there and he played and sang two or three songs.
I can't even tell you what they were. He just
started band leading. No, no, no, he just went up
there and a almost he knew those songs. Oh he
did a solo. Oh ship, Yeah damn. That was a
treat at Maxims in Paris, France. It wasn't. It was

(20:53):
actually called La Milia dere Oh. Okay, okay, that one's
not here. No nobody knows. It was just off the
comp the first time it's ever been mentioned. Yeah, there's
so in one of those rehearsal tapes, I realized that
his level of wanting to play no matter who was
on instruments. Uh, there's all right. So there's there's a

(21:20):
tape of a forty five minute jam. Like, here's the thing.
I love and respect the three of you in this room,
but I don't know if I would put two hour
efforts for us to have a jam session, because I
could sort of imagine what the result would be with
just the four of us in this room. Put me

(21:40):
on drums, I'll be all right. But alright, so Vanity
is on keyboards Jamie shop is on drums. I think
Jamie shoopers on drums, Vanity is on keyboards. I think
Fink is on another keyboard, and Princess basically trying to
teach them how to jam or how to play. Okay,

(22:03):
what if the three of us were cute girls. I
never met Jamie Shoop until so in her heyday, Jamie
Shoop was Are you saying she's not fine now in
a non me two wish way? No, no, no, I
don't I don't know what I don't know. I mean,

(22:24):
Jamie was hot and she had a cool person that
I looked she was. She was going to be one
of the Hookers, wasn't she. Yeah, that's right, she had
to be hot. I forgot that she was a word.
Okay for those that don't know, those that do not know.
Before before, before they were called Vanity six. Before Vanity
six was formed, Prince was going to perform a group

(22:45):
called the Hookers and the lead yes and our older
sister yes and um the lead the lead singer was
gonna Their stage name was going to be the Vaginas
Vagina I guess or that yeah wow yeah. That obviously
did not work, so they changed it, Yeah, exactly so.
But the thing is is that he sounds just as

(23:08):
happy and he's got al Bolo about how do you say,
I see? I thought that was no. No, it's Alan
bol the photographer, petographer. He's also playing as well. He's
playing bass. But so that obviously means he has photos
from that probably ship, and it also means that his
story of him coming up with the river Let's go

(23:28):
Crazy is probably true as well. Damn good one, good one,
good one. Yeah. But my whole thing is that, well,
if who was there, they probably were shooting something. It
could have been promote pictures for god knows what, because
he wouldn't I mean, they weren't that close that he
was just gonna be hanging out house and play bass.

(23:50):
I mean, that wasn't gonna happen. So then he must
have been there with a with a photographic purpose that
then turned into you know, maybe they drank a little.
But my question is that he just for him any
jam session was the equivalent of talking or I'd rather
be trying to play music with you than the small talk,

(24:13):
or maybe maybe after your tape runs out, he starts
making fun of him not being able to play you know.
It's also that I don't know. There's the famous Spruce
Springsteen Camy on one of his shows and way back
to the dressing room, he's looking at me and he's
bouncing up and down. I don't he can't play guitar.

(24:35):
There's that I have that I thought he was cool.
I mean, Bruce hung in there. But okay, in your observations,
I always thought that major towns were not as good
as the smaller towns as far as show is concerned,

(24:57):
because you think specifically for princes or in general in general,
but yes, also for princes. Uh. Based on the Purple
Rain shows. None of the l A shows we're exciting.
To me. I have a theory. I think that if
people are watching you, and this has been for every
show I've ever done in l A, and stars come

(25:20):
out girls you like her movies and on television show,
they're in the audience. Yeah. I always think that shows
in front of celebrities freezes the artists, whereas towns that
you have little expectations, you bring out your your A game.
I don't think it's the artist. I think it might
be you know, the major publications are there, you know

(25:42):
they you know, new York Times may send a reviewer
out or Rolling Stone or somebody in that case in
Minnesota must be a nightmare because John Breen is there watching.
Was that was the rivalry with John Breen really real?
Or was it like playful and he got tired John
brute at one point and they kissed him, you know,

(26:04):
you know, because it was like it wasn't a it
was it was kind of a Trumpish moment. It was like,
you're not loyal. You actually wrote something negative. If you're
not loyal, fake news. Okay, you know you of all people, John,
you were there at the beginning, you got you're supposed

(26:24):
to stay loyal. Nelson George can write something bad, I
might make a record about it, but well you know,
I expect it, but not from you, not from uh
like John's from the hometown. Yeah, you're supposed to. You
were there from the beginning, and you wrote great things
from the beginning, and you were way ahead of everybody
else and recognizing I see whatever. So I'm just you know,

(26:45):
I'm surmising. But I mean, in your years of tour managing,
what was your favorite period, Like, do you have a
fine memory? The travel was great. I didn't have to,
you know, fa a situation. It was, you know, I
can I hit your pause button for minutes and rewind

(27:08):
for a second, back to the intimidation factor of playing
big cities, And I think Bill's right. I mean, certainly,
the fact is you can't unless you're remarkably disciplined. If
you know there's a media focus on what you're doing,
if you know there's people in the audience whose opinions
you care about or trying to impress for one reason

(27:30):
or another, then you're going on stage with all of
that somewhere in your head. Even if you can kick
it to the rear burner, it's still there. So instead
of going on stage in your normal zone where all
you're thinking about is the music and who you're playing,
It was m that it just makes sense that that

(27:52):
would affect you. Now, there's some people who could overcome that,
um but I think about Miles Davis used to say,
and this was in Quincy Cher, the Miles Davis autobiography,
talks about the fact that he could always tell when
anybody in his band either we're looking at a girl
in the audience of their old lady was there because
they'd show off they played different they'd overplay, and he said,

(28:15):
you it's a driving crazy out of the point where
told Jack Dgent it do not bring a woman into
these clubs. Really. Now it's Miles probably exaggerating a little
bits the truth, but but yeah, he's telling the truth.
And particularly in the context of a jazz quintet, where
it's so much of it is improvisational, as opposed to

(28:40):
a Prince concert where the band is pretty much playing
the same thing that after night, Um, it would be
that much more noticeable. And I suppose it's human nature.
It's it's you know, you're right, you know, we all
look in the mirror once or twice extra if you're
gonna see somebody you really care about. Okay, So anyway
back to your question, what was your favorite period of

(29:03):
tour managing or what was the easiest? Alright, alright, okay,
what was the easiest? Like, just I suppose physically you
would say, Chris Rock. Okay, I can see that because
there's just there's five grown men who are responsible, mature,

(29:26):
flying on private jets, staying in for its Carton's and
nobody has to wake anybody up, nobody misses the plane. Um,
the only time we'd ever spat was who gets the
art section of the New York Times first on the flight?
You know? Um? Now the gig was was you think

(29:49):
the gig is easy because it's stand up. There's no production,
there's at least very little. But the other side of
that point is what that with that tour you're wearing
because you don't have the staff, you're out there by
yourself in terms of management, and you're wearing every hat.
So you're overseeing the production. You're overseeing the local crews

(30:13):
that do sound in lights, you're overseeing, um, the promoters,
you're overseeing the settlements. You're doing the settlements. Um. I
would assume that you do and you do settlements anyway though, right, yeah?
But or do you send someone But here, here's here's
the point. If I'm on the Angelo to or not

(30:35):
gotta who do settlement? I just tell Bill Reeves, I
won't be around for a now, or I'm going in front.
If you need to be be hit me, text me I'm
in the box office. Okay. But with Chris, you're scared
to leave because who's in Terence? There's no backup? I see, okay,
you know. So it got to the point where his
personal assistant who really had nothing to do with the

(30:58):
shows themselves, but was just his personal assistant. Um, I
would always have him. If I'm going up front, I
would say, Okay, you gotta keep your eyes on the stage.
But also, I mean, Chris is a level celebrity, so
it's just the five of you. Yeah, but he's a list.

(31:20):
So like he's he's got a personal security. He's got
one security. Okay, he's got his personal assistant. There's Chris,
there's the opening comic. He usually travels with us, the
support act and myself. Okay, that's it. Okay, that's it.
And and I'm still doing the other things that too

(31:42):
were manager does, which is do all the advancing with
the venues we're headed next, and making sure this is
set up and set up and make sure the cars right,
and make sure that the staying in touch with the
pilots and airports and knowing what the flight conditions, you know,
all the ship that goes with the logistics and hotels
and and is that always having a plan. B. You're

(32:02):
looking at the weather app and it's raining in Tennessee
and we might have to take a bus. Yeah, or
either we're just gonna sit here and wait for the
rain depending on forecast. So yeah, you always have to
keep your on the weather. Okay, that's just part of it.
So that's the easiest. What's the most historical Let me

(32:23):
say this, it's it's it's a lot of work. It's
long days, and Chris is one of the few comics
I know who actually in system doing sound checks. As
you know, because you've been there, so you know. So
the day it starts at three or four o'clock in
the afternoon, it doesn't end till midnight. Um, by the
time you've unsettlement. Frequently the show would be down, but

(32:44):
I would still have business and to stay back and
wouldn't get to the hotel until that later. So there
was there was a workload, curious workload, but it was.
But it was not stressful because you didn't have to
worry about knucklehead bass player who won't get up, disappears

(33:04):
and you know, damn that Palladina and I'm playing. No,
that's actually the one band where it wasn't the bass player.
Historically it's always been the bass player that's a knucklehead.
I can never really yeah, not the case we do, okay, Yeah,
in that case, the base was the responsible person. Yeah, Rumber,

(33:27):
it was pretty good. He wouldn't he wouldn't. We'll see,
he had his days, right, But yeah, right? What was
what did you feel was the most historical in hindsight?
What was the most historical run you did? It had
to be purple, right, so you consider that more historable

(33:50):
than the night that like sex Machine came together or
well you're comparing him six months two or two a
one night gig. I have a yeah, I mean it's
you know, it was there a historical significant success of course,
but you know, what did you feel was historical as
it was happening, because that's rare to know that capturing

(34:13):
So for you, I was relieved that he could take
this new band that had its weaknesses and go in
and cut what so obviously was going to be a
smash hit. So it was really relief. Okay, because because
the jury still out on whether or not they were
still good or exactly. I mean, we knew Boots and
Captures were keepers. That wasn't hard. But Clayton Connal's and

(34:37):
all those cats were Yeah, right, I see, I see.
Do you have any regrets or places that you haven't
gone to or things that you haven't done yet tour wise,
or what's well damn Okay, I know, with the exception

(34:58):
of the D word, you where, but what stopped you
from the next level? Like what kept you at tour
manager as opposed to let me get a nine to
five at you could easily worked at William Morris. No,
I'll tell you a conversation ahead with Bob Cavallo. When
I took over Paisley Park Records, Bob called me and

(35:20):
he was on the way out because it was around
the same time, and it Pritts cleaned house a little
bit after I took over the label. I know. Let
me I'm rewind when he cleaned house and fired his lawyers,
his business managers and his personal managers, Steve Farnoli and

(35:40):
Bob Cavallo. When he fired them, that's when I actually
went to him and said, Okay, I need a votal
confidence if I next you're cleaning house and just need
to know what's else going on. I told you you're fired. No,
but you know what time out? What do you do?
The firing it was Jane you were he second of

(36:02):
nineteen after Graffiti Bird, Before Graffiti, it was after look
sexy for Batman. But I'm saying, would he himself do it? Now?
He said he sent he had he had another attorney
who sent ledgers. He had already cooked up the deal
with Albert made Nolie to be as manager. They had

(36:25):
hatched this plan. Magnoli introduced him to a new lawyer,
who then issued the seas and his sisters or whatever
you want to call him, the notifications that I'm breaking
away from you guys. I'm only asking because all right,
I've maybe the last two years, I've had to fire
six people from my camp, and that's one of the
most painstaking, especially when you're like super close to them.

(36:48):
This week alone, last Saturday, I had to fire someone
that's worked for me for like ten years. And it
was like it was like asking for a divorce. I
always wanted to know, like literally, like is he going around?
Asked of advice, like how do you let someone go?
How do you because he first of all, he didn't
personally do it. Oh that's easy. I thought you had

(37:09):
to do it yourself. Like no, he was a pump
like that, wait should you? If you were all right?
So he had me fire people. I was gonna say,
you've I'm sure you've had to fire many a person,
not many, but yeah, right sure, But is there what's
the proper way to do so? Because the thing is

(37:31):
you're such you're such a paternal It really litherly figure.
It depends on who it is and what the relationship is.
It really does. Um. We had a road manager on
a tour and I'm not going to say which one,
who was out from the beginning of the tour and
he was going to be the road manager of my
tour manager. Can you say the tour or that would
give it away? That gives it away? Yeah, and just

(37:53):
as soon poor guys no longer Whether he since passed away,
but he was totally qualified, had worked on other major tours,
was a good guy, but for one reason or another,
Prince Chick didn't like him, dropped the dime on and
Prince didn't like him. The band loved him, and we

(38:15):
were about two or three weeks into the tour if that,
and Prince called me to his dressing room before show
Who and he said, don't want you to fire us
on so And I actually sucked it up and tried
to make up a case because I felt it was
totally unfair. That was he just playing for whatever stupid reason,
just didn't like him. The guy hadn't done anything wrong.

(38:37):
It was perfectly qualified. It was gonna give me personally
a headache because now I had to replace him in
the middle of a tour. I was gonna say, how
do you find a b person? You know? Um, well,
we did you do. I mean, it's part of having
something filed away in the back of your head just
in case. But the long june of it is is
I had to go to this guy and you basically

(38:58):
didn't speak to me for two years, and and he
actually and if he knew that you weren't the person
that pulled the trigger, or you're not allowed to say,
look I love you, but dog no, that's exactly what
I said that you gotta know this isn't coming from you.
The band and they adore you, but there's a problem
with the boss and he wants somebody else, and I
worked for him, and I don't have his choice. And

(39:21):
it was really really uncomfortable because I cared about Scott.
It was it was unfair, okay, but he was the
gold makes the girls, and I mean, deep down the
guy understood, he got it. But from that point one
and he actually ended up opening a business in l A.
And Um I would occasionally drop by his business and

(39:43):
it was always awkward, and he was close to Gwen.
I mean it was really awkward. Um. On the other hand,
on the Purple Rain tour, Princess business manager found a
tour accountant that he assigned to the tour. And this
guy came on the road and he too had worked

(40:05):
on other tours. He had a resume. None of us
knew him, but you know, it's gonna be the zour
accountant and that's fine. You know, the business manager who
we all knew and not a close relationship, was trusted him,
so no reason not to trust him. So this was
Purple Rain. We played Detroit. We ended up in Greensboro,

(40:26):
which I think was the second stop, and Big Chick
comes to me and he says, hey, buddy, what do
you know about this accountant. Dude, nothing, I guess he's okay.
He said, Well, he was chatting with being talking about
he thinks you're overpaid, and he was talking about that
that they could get a good tour manager for less

(40:47):
money and this one and he didn't like Bill Reeves.
He thought he was overpaid and some of the bands
was overpaid, and he was just I said, chick, you
just don't like him. You're dropping a dime on him
by saying this, or you sirid he actually is just
discussing people's salaries with you. And he says, no, I mean,
I don't really have a horse in this race. But

(41:07):
the guy ain't cool. Um m hmm. I called the
business manager in l A and I said, I need
somebody else. We were going to Philly Thanksgiving, yep, and
we we actually where did we go first? I think
we went to d C next, because we we we

(41:28):
we busted from DC to Philly. I'll never forget. We
busted as as opposed to find. And I called the
business manager from d C and said, I want this
guy out of here. He said, what happened? Did you verify?
Did you verify? Yeah? Yeah, I mean I went to

(41:49):
me denied it. But because my first thought was all right,
it's chicken agitator and he could be. But I went
to the guy and talked to him, and who was
obvious that he his whole attitude. He's like, well, you know,
I was just thinking that, you know, you need to
streamline this, and you know, all I'm doing is trying
to protect the artist. And I'm like, okay, you're the

(42:09):
one guy in this whole crew. The artist doesn't even
know right and this is my house. And if you
want to streamline something because you think it's the right
thing to do, then you should have come to me
at the bodyguard and I'll have that conversation with you
because I'd appreciate it if you can help us make
more money. But don't be coming in my house behind

(42:33):
my back. He's like, okay, I'm sorry, pop up. I
call the business manager and said I don't want to
see him after tomorrow. He rode the bus with us
to d C to Philly. We got to the hotel
in Philly and there was a message waiting for him
to get on the first plane out the next morning.
Everybody said what time did he come? M hm. So

(42:58):
it totally to pay ends. It just totally depends. And
the first lesson is don't hire your friends, son, you
out now starting fire people. That's the key. Let me

(43:20):
just mark this off. Do not ask for a raise
because because I have I have had a situation um
in the last ten years where I hired a friend
who was qualified but for whatever reason, didn't satisfy the
situation and or the artist, and I hesitated to fire him,

(43:43):
and I should have. If it had been anybody else,
I would have replaced him right um, And I didn't
because I pumped out next subject before we wrapped up.

(44:05):
I've heard quasi heard step Gordon's version of this, only
because he's owner of Carlos and Charlie's. And we've had
Huey Lewis on the show, and we're just discovering that
Huey Lewis saying what was supposed to be Princess parts
on We Are the World? Can you I've never asked

(44:30):
you this question? What the hell actually happened the night
of American Music Awards and why? How did you get
the word that there was a song called we Are
the World? And he's expected to participate, Like I assume
that the call would have came to you first, Okay, okay,

(44:53):
not to you? Yeah, I mean I was involved into
conversations and farnly pitched it to him. So do what
Quincy's doing. He's reached out. He really wants you on this.
Here's who everybody else is gonna be there in prison. No,
he was just not interested. It's just I'm not gonna
be like everybody else. But he did contribute a song

(45:14):
ultimately to that, and and he offered to do that
at the beginning. He's like, I'll give my song for
the album, but I'm just not that guy. I don't
do group things that I don't have everything controlled over. Yeah, okay,
you know that's understandable. Okay, but but but that night
at Carlos and Charley's, like what happened that? What what

(45:35):
happened is is we tried to convince him like, okay,
you're not going to do that, but understand something, this
recording session is bigger than the ords show. This is
like the biggest thing of the year because everybody's there,
and by you not doing it, you can't go out clubbing.

(45:58):
That was the actual concern of you guys back then.
It was a huge consitent This could be a pr disaster,
Like why are you not singing for starving children? Yeah? Exactly,
you I would think, like now just been like Rianna
didn't make it. Well maybe now, but but there wasn't
No Prince couldn't make it because um Quincy was pissed.
He's like, who does he think The reaction was from him?

(46:21):
Midtalanto Routie was, who does he think he is? Michael's here?
Diana Ross is here, fucking Ray Charles is here? Is here? Okay?
Left right? And the Canadian, the Canadian who was part

(46:45):
of USA for Africa. Um, but no, it was a
serious concern. So they just literally thought that he would
jump at this opportunity. I suppose. I mean, you know,
who does he think he is? Park here? He goes
at the door? Everybody else who's famously private and diva ish,

(47:06):
no more than Donna Ross, right, Michael was no joke.
So I mean, if they can do it, why can't
he do it? Not to mention the fact that it's
a cause he should be associated with. So I still
think decision. I'm not saying it wasn't. But the issue

(47:28):
wasn't whether he did it. It was to Quincy because
he took it personally, because that's just how exactly. But
the issue was don't go out drinking in clubs when
everybody else is doing that. Because the media was out there,
I mean, this was a big event and everybody at

(47:52):
the Oars was talking about it. See at the studio.
You know, this was huge. It's never been a an
assemblage of the Empany people to make one record on
on that level. It was crazy. It was unamagine somebody said,
you're gonna have all of those people in a recording
studio at the same time, You'd be like, what, I

(48:14):
don't think so, so we begged him and we had
a plan. We were staying at the Westwood Markuee out
in Westwood. Yeah, it was kind of one of the
hot hotels at that point, and it was also off
the beaten path because it was all the way west.
And we went back to the hotel to celebrate and

(48:37):
we got Bobby, and Vickie was there and Gwen was there,
and we all went up to his suite and hung
out and I said, Okay, none of us are going
to paid early tonight. We're gonna hang out with him
because we gotta keep him in the hotel. So we
got to create your was absolutely a plan. Is that
a party with six people? Well there were more, the

(48:57):
whole band was there, a few other people, and you know,
but it was basically in the house. Because that's not
really like socialized. It doesn't let any nobody come hang
in the hotel suite. But the whole point was just,
you know, let's let's keep the talk going. It was
a great night. We won awards, and to celebrate, and
let's toast and even have a couple of extra drinks

(49:19):
or maybe he'll fall asleep because he wasn't a drinker.
He was like, he'd have two drinks in Carloston Charlie's
and be sitting on the floor gagling literally literally, Um
yeah when it come to drinking. Absolutely so that that
was the whole plan. And I guess it got to
be about one o'clock, maybe one three. I can't tell

(49:42):
you exactly what time. And um, we finally figured okay,
and it was a piano in his sweet and he
was playing, and you know, it was, you know, big
party the in house, all of us celebrating because it
has been a great night. And um, so finally figured
it was safe and I was exhausted, so Gwen and

(50:04):
I went to our room and the little party broke up,
and I'm thinking mission accomplished. It's all good. About three
o'clock in the morning, the phone rings in my room
and it's chick buddy. We got a problem. That's how
it always starts. How many times wait, wait with pause?
How many times have you gotten a call from Chick

(50:26):
where it's buddy, we got a problem. Knock that often.
We didn't have a lot of problems. But so you
already were bracing yourself. No, I thought we were cool.
I thought mission accomplished. Said he's had a couple of drinks,
he's getting sleepy, he's you know, he had his his
fun was his with his posse, and we gave him

(50:46):
all the props he needed to feel important. Didn't feel
good about the night, you know, and he was already
talking about the song he was gonna do for the album.
It's Steve reminded us of So I'm thinking we're good. Well,
not only did he called Chick to go out after
we all disappeared, and they also had I think Wally

(51:09):
was with him, Wally Stafford and another bodyguard named Larry,
and they went to Carlos and Charlotte's, and some paparazzi
mobbed the car and they got into a pushing. I
guess they tried to stick the camera in the window

(51:30):
of the car window or something. And and at any rate,
there was a spat and the photographer said that he
had been attacked, and um um, I guess Larry the
bodyguard who was like twice your size. I mean, the
guy was freaking huge. He's like he was like Tyson

(51:51):
Fury huge. And um, I guess he did push him
or shove him or smack him or something. I don't
know what he did. At any rate, the police locked
up Larry. So it wasn't just about Princes having this
issue that is now going to be in the press.
But you also had our bodyguard dudes on tour with

(52:12):
us in jail, so I had to deal with that
how to get him out? And sure enough USA today
and a lot of the papers that they're talking about
prints attacking and photographer at Carlos and Charley's, while the
whole record industry is doing, We're in the world and
it's exactly what happened. So do you think it was
ego that made him not want to participate in that,

(52:34):
or like he's notorious for not letting people watch him
record his vocals. Do you think that might have been
played a part of it. I never thought that that
might have been part of it. But he wasn't going
to be doing really lead vocals. So I don't think
that was that big of an issue. It's like he
never never wanted to be part of anything that that
he didn't have control over. I mean, if you if

(52:55):
you think of all the other people's records that he
appeared on, they were almost was tracks he produced or
head input or head control. He just the same goes
with you're gonna play like this, Yeah, but then you
guys mix him like so you can't hear him? So

(53:15):
is he even really there? Yes, he's there that you
know what now that HUEI So Huie reveals that, um,
I didn't know Chef Carloson Charley. Yeah, so he has
a story like he he has a Eddie Murphy. Yeah,

(53:36):
he chef was part owner of Carlson Charles. He tells
the story of Eddie Murphy getting into a tussle with
a fan the night before his first day of shooting
Beverly Hills cop and so Eddie actually has to go
to the Beverly Hills jail and it took method acting

(54:05):
and it took I guess the president of Paramount had
to call up Sheep to see if chef could pull strings.
Chef had like pulled with the Beverly opd back then
or whatever, and said, look, this guy has to be
on set tomorrow at five am. Yeada YadA woo, and
took a lot of easing into that. But Sheep also remembers,

(54:30):
uh that night, that's how I knew that he owned
was part owner Carlos and Charlie. The thing is is
that when Huey lewis Revelle, so there's a point when
you's like telling what the experiences like. And I think
at the last minute they realized, ship, we don't know
everbody's singing Prince's part. And just at the last minute,

(54:53):
Quincy looking from the huie, you sing it. And then
I realized, oh, Michael Jackson, you slide devil like you
purposely set up this, this this game of horse once
again for Prince to follow you. And it's done in

(55:13):
a key. Prince rarely sings in in uh e minor.
It's it's it's too high for him to sing, it's
too low for like he rarely sings. It was shokodels
in e minor like I can count like and and
Dorothy Parker he changed the speed of his voice on

(55:33):
that song too, exactly That's what I'm saying is done
in that. And you know, Dorothy Parker is more him
going all over the place but not sticking in that key.
So I can't imagine him singing. I've never heard him
singing a song. So when I realized that, I was like,
oh damn, Michael Jackson set him up again. Oh wait,

(55:55):
I don't want to end it on a bad prince.
All right, that's enough, no, okay for you. Purple Rain
was the most historical, and yeah, I mean it's as
a tour, it had to be. I mean, what James Brown,
We didn't tour. We worked. It's so there were certain

(56:17):
gigs that were more significant than others. But but it's
it's it's hard to isolate a tour because we just
worked all the time out of the year exactly. Okay,
So my last question is what do you think you
have a top three? Damn, this show is good moment

(56:38):
and I know that most of the time your backstage,
you know, handling business, preparing for Like do you have
you ever watched any of your clients shows from beginning
to end from the front of the house occasion, sure,
just for nothing to do or just just to make
sure that nothing goes wrong, like are you looking at

(56:59):
the lights of and or are you just They're like, okay,
I trust that for the next hour and a half,
the world's not gonna come to an end and blah
blah blah. Has this backstage? Or there was a James
Brown show at the at the Old Spectrum in Philly
and the Cells were on the show right and the

(57:19):
Dells were red hot at the time, and they killed
and James was backstage. I tell the story in the book.
He was backstage pacing, going berserk. He told Danny Ray
to go out there and pull him off stage. They're
staying on too long. They had they had the crowd
in the poplar hands. Now they're blown it because they didn't.
They're not professionals. They don't know when to come off.

(57:40):
And it was all because they were killing. The place
was going to preserve m hmm. And wait, was there
stage though that good? Or is this the Hits or
just Marvin Jr. Was just God of singing. They could sing.
The Dells were no joke. I mean, they had the
typical choreography and they were good at it. But but
and a couple of more decent looking guys. But I

(58:02):
mean they weren't the Temptations, but goddamn they could sing Marvin. Yeah,
neither was Johnny cart exactly. And their harmonies, they their
group harmonies tended to be a little more sophisticated than
the average duop group. Right. Um and they and they

(58:22):
had they had a string of great sun Stepney before
he did their biggest hits. Um, and they were killing.
This was right at the peak of their their thing.
James was going crazy. I've never seen him like that,
and it really was remarkable to me because I had
never seen him actually show any nerves like that. And

(58:47):
I mean he was dressed and pacing and smoking a cigarette,
which you never did until he would he would smoke.
He didn't smoke, but he would smoke a cigarette as
he walked to this age and then hand it to
somebody as he walked onto the stage. And I guess
it had something to do with his voice, and he

(59:07):
believed it did something for his voice that raps came from.
Unless it was just a nervous happened or is this
nineteen seventy, This is seventy or seventy one, I can't remember.
This is super prime James yeah. Oh yeah, that guy
was good. Yeah. I think he meant mustache. No no, no, no,
no no no, no, no no no, this was this

(59:27):
was no facial hair James. This was a James. And
this is nineteen seventy. My parents are at this show
because my mom said that my first kicks were at
a Dell's concert. Anyway, Okay, so you were there, Yeah,
suffice it to say, if you remember the Spectrum, the

(59:50):
stage was in the round, in the middle of the arena,
and it actually revolved through it slowly revolved. So the
idea was that every seat would get a front review
at some point. Spectrum or Valley Forge Music Fair, Spectrum, yeah,
they have one, not the only place that had it.
But yeah, anyway, long story short places soldier. It's packed,

(01:00:12):
it's really big show. And he comes out and in
order to get to the stage because it's in the
middle of the green and you got to create a
space to get from the locker rooms across to the stage,
and of course as security, and you create a human

(01:00:34):
fence with security and so on and so on, and
and I mean he got mopped. I mean they were
people were diving over the security just to tear at him.
He got to the stage, his jacket was already torn.
I mean literally he hit the stage with it was
kind of a shirt jacket and it was like a
jumpsuit type town or seventies and and it was torn.

(01:00:58):
And he looked a little bit disheveled because he going
through this. And it was probably the most intense show
I've ever seen him too before since. I mean, it
was just absolutely on fire and memorably so. And who
was the band probably so it was it was boosting
them and I can't remember if they don't have any um,

(01:01:26):
but I mean, he was just amazing. He was just
just just the Bambo was tight. Clyde was there. He
had come back, so we had Clyde and Jabbo both
on stage. I can't remember if Pinkney was back yet,
probably because he was he had come back. But it
was just and in the place, and of course a
lot of it had to do with the audience was amped.

(01:01:48):
It was just people weren't preserved um. So that's memorable.
But quite honestly, and Princeman Annex will hate me for this.
The most musically gratifying shows I've been part of since
my James Brown years. Thank you very much, Dalter, don't

(01:02:13):
do that. Don't do that. That's not true. That's not
good man. Yeah, seriously, dude, but no question. Our show
was just by the transitive accium. This show was a parade. Parade.
Now do you see how he says our show? He
doesn't realize I could be talking about the more recent
shows with Chris. Are you telling me good ones? Good one? No? Seriously,

(01:02:43):
I played agree with you. I played tapes of those shows.
Like their new records, they're in steady constant rotation in
my house. We're never gonna get that live album? Are
we that voodoo live albums? No, we aren't. That silence there,

(01:03:07):
there were some coded words there. It's always a possibility, never,
never say never. That's the That's the one moment in
my life where I felt I was living history in
real time, like something historical. And it wasn't that because
it wasn't because like that was my first taste of

(01:03:32):
something major, you know, because by that point, like we
had just broken through the other side as the roots
and you know, like just slowly started to creep to
a satisfactory level of celebrity whatever. But um, you know,
for me, nothing will ever beat that Minneapolis show and

(01:04:00):
got Prince Fans will kill me. It was just it starts.
See the Minneapolis show starts with we. We were summoned
to the park at one m. At one M. Well,
are you talking about that experience? Are you're talking about

(01:04:21):
the actual gig? No? No, no no, But that experience
leads to the gig. And you know, it was a
really weird night with him. I've had great nights wood prints,
I've had weird nights wood prints. We had nights wood prints.
But it's like we we were there for three hours,

(01:04:42):
and to me, the highlight of the whole night. Now,
we played with him for an hour. We sat in
the studio with him for an hour, listen to music
for an hour, And to me, the best part of
the whole night was the forty five minutes we took
out to watch an HBO special by a comedian named

(01:05:02):
Dave Chappelle that was on rotation in his nightclub. You know,
this guy is really funny, you said, And we sat
and watched it. He had Dave on that one on
the Beach one special, which one the Love for One
Enough other special. Yeah, Dave comes out like in the
middle of it and does like a five minutes see
or something like that. I was disinvited from that, remember,

(01:05:23):
were then I became disinvited. Even Richie the driver, who's
the driver, Robbie the driver like couldn't drive us in
the gates because he had been banned from Like we
had to walk through the snow to get there, not
the snow, like I just remember he could. It was
the summertime, right or honestly, no, I started the show

(01:05:45):
started in March. Yeah, it was summertimes or early fall. Yeah,
but I just remember that Robbie was like, I'm not
allowed to drive through, so you guys to walk through. Yeah,
that's weird. And that's where the night got weird. But
he had worked for him for years, right, old person assistant,
you know we know. So wait, don't we saw that, Robbie?

(01:06:06):
Yeah we do? Yeah? Yeah. And that was August of
two damn. What the internet is amazing? Damn? And this
the show I saw? It was two days after that.
What did you see Indiana the expo? No, I'm you're anyway?
So uh we left is that there must be a

(01:06:27):
Perkins restaurant or some sort of pancake house that's near
there and Robbie took us to it, and me and
d were our first words was like, yo, man, I
feel like we didn't know how to feel because the
night was just weird, Like he was talking weird. What
didn't you call me? And I don't remember who? And
you said, We've been quiet in the car all the

(01:06:48):
way and I feel like I need a bath. Yeah,
I said, never forget it. It was such a weird
violation because I'd never experienced. You know, now, I'm very
careful about like, oh, don't meet your idols, they might
disappoint you. But that was such an ambush that we
weren't ready for. And we sat there for like three minutes.

(01:07:13):
I was like, yo, like wait, was he trying to
diss us or what do you what do you think?
That's what? Like? We just sat there like not knowing
what happened to us. It was like some aliens side
in your heads. He he didn't get in our heads?
Yeah he did, you just said he did? Basically, it
wasn't he. I was disappointed he tried to get in

(01:07:33):
our heads because you know, I mean, no no secret.
I know he was like, you know, dude, watch out
for like you whatever, and yeah, all that stuff label,
but I bootlegged old stuff that's out there, and so
we said, I don't know. The next day, like you know,

(01:07:58):
we we went to our rooms next day, and then
backstage I was he was like, how do you feel, man,
I don't know, and I was just like, yo, man,
let's just let's do it. Because the thing was we
wanted to know was he gonna come to this and
he had conveniently Well, we should also preface that John

(01:08:21):
Breen didn't help at all with this one. Like John
Breen probably wrote the most scathing Prince taunt, and I
felt like he thought he was doing something good but
like trying to provoke Prince into or no, just to
return to his yeah, that sort of thing. So he

(01:08:44):
wrote this whole he wrote yeah, but he wrote this
whole thing about like you know, like a new Kings
in town. And I read the article and I was like, oh,
this is so over the top, Like John, you're not helping,
You're making people hate us. And I don't know. It's
just when we performed, when he performed Devil's Pie, he

(01:09:04):
brought that halle Berry energy and by the time we
got to we asked your brother to uh Solong lady,
and it was just like I felt we were on fire,
like I thought we were going to levitate, and the

(01:09:26):
audience was dead, and I was nervous about all that,
like we're in his town and we know his spies
are here and whatnot. I don't even believe that he
went to Egypt that day. I just think he just
told us that, just know he knew enough to know

(01:09:46):
you were gonna kill and he didn't want to be
man I was. You know, it's it's that's that's the
side of him. God rest assult just as so annoying
and not necessary. It's it's just like an a really
brief comparison. Talk about this in the book too um

(01:10:08):
for him to talk to you and d And I
remember D told me because John had also done a
story about me becoming Deed's part manager co manager and
you know, it's small media towns and that's a big deal.
And Prince sent the Deeds all only it's your manager,

(01:10:30):
you know, just kind of like what's wrong with two?
And I'm like, what, didn't you think that he would
be proud that somebody who learned the business a great
part of the business through him with him goes on

(01:10:51):
and their career grows the same way that he hires
you because you And this is the comparison when Purple
Rain Blue Up, James Brown did an interview with MTV
for whatever reason, and one of the questions they asked
him was, how do you feel about the fact that
you're playing clubs and you've got Michael Jackson and particularly
Prince who are selling out to reading us all over

(01:11:12):
the world and they're basically this generation's version of you.
And Brown says, well, there's a lot of my people
over there in Princess Camp, you know, namely Alan Leads.
And I was like, thank you, godfather, you know. But
now that was also him trying to take credit for

(01:11:33):
you know. It's like, well, that's because I let him
have my people. But but he was the next time
I saw I might tease him about that, and he
was like proud. I mean, he was like, you know,
when I hired your kids, I knew you were going
places and you gotta be careful now you you're in
a fast track now. And he gave me fatherly advice.
But he was actually proud that somebody who was a

(01:11:57):
novice under him had worked his way at to the
point where he was on the biggest freaking tour in
the decade, and you know that ain't gonna be Prince.
And it was just unnecessary because Prince and I never
really fell out. He called me, you know, usually when
he's through with somebody's through, but he called me back

(01:12:18):
to set up a Japanese tour for him in the nineties.
He needed somebody to deal with the promoters. I didn't
go on the tour, but at that particular time, he
didn't have a tour worthy staff of of of back
line people, and he said, I need you to find
me a production manager and I needs you to negotiate
the deal with Hudo, the promoter in Japan. I owed

(01:12:39):
him some dates, but I just need you to set
up the crew and do some of the do the
tour managers stuff. But you don't need to go on
the tour. Just hire somebody to go. And he's like,
you know, it can't be like it used to be.
You can't be calling me all the time. We're not
going to hang out. But I'll pay you well and
just do what you do. You know. I'm like, okay, cool,

(01:13:01):
you know that's good for me, right, And then a
couple of years later, he called me. Didn't ask me
to do the liner notes for the Hits package UM,
which was the first ever collection of his records outside
of sequenced albums and UM, and he said, and I
said okay, but he said, well there's certain things I
once said, and I said, okay, so let me interview you.

(01:13:21):
And he said, great, let's do that. And of course
he had bright of approval or the finished products. You
you interally said on the phone, and most of what's
in those liner notes, all the little tidbits about each
song came from him. You recorded this, damn it Allen,
because you know, I was glad man. It was all impromptu.

(01:13:45):
If we had set it up in advance, I would
if you don't men the famous phone stuff. But no,
it was just like we're talking about and he says, well,
just interview me, come on, do it now, and I'm like, well,
tell me once telling you you know something, And with
no preparation, we just just and you telling me stuff.

(01:14:09):
So it's you know, there was some respect there and
we were cool. And occasionally I run into him on
the road. I dropped in and released party once what
used to be the Village Gate that it was life
for a minute, and so on. And you were there
that night. We were there with Chris ship I didn't

(01:14:32):
know you. That was I didn't know you. That's right,
that's the night I first met him and I was
not then listened and there was a problem getting it
and Chris, Chris said it me, you got a let
him in and just pulled one of those things and
Prince gave me a huge hug and we talked for
a few minutes. You know, um, and you know so,

(01:14:53):
I mean it's I don't get it. I just don't
get it, and us don't know the out of me,
because that means that you did some beef. That means
you did something right. Like if you weren't a threat,
there's an artist now, that's that's that's it. That's it.
And and and you gotta understand when we came through

(01:15:14):
with Voodoo, and particularly in light of the video and
how everybody was obsessing over the video, which became MTVS
Video of the Year. Yes, I'm sorry, and you know
that that was a threat to him. He didn't know
how far this was going to go. There was a

(01:15:35):
threat because this is this is a kind of commotion
that he got when he broke out exactly the same
kind of commotion. It's like, here's this sex symbol, this
this crazy guy that girls are going reserk over. And
he wears you know, tights and crazy clothes that men
don't wear. And the song was obviously influenced by well

(01:15:58):
what wasn't Yeah, you know, but I mean that one
was almost like a rewriter. She's just a baby. Let's
be honest. We didn't know that then, really, I'll be honest,
we didn't know that. We didn't know that. Then maybe
it's a deep too. I mean I I didn't know
who cares? No, they didn't, who cares? You know? It worked? Um,

(01:16:19):
so I think he really did. And that's that's why
the that's why the weird news that night. So, uh,
your third one, Black Massariah tours over anything. We're prints. Yeah,
that's just about personal where my spott is musically, Um okay,

(01:16:43):
it's it's about the churchiness. It's about the fact that
he had amazing bands that had more freedom to play
than princess bands did. Princess bands were always scripted. It's
not they weren't good bands. It's not that they couldn't play.
Eight but everything he did was scripted. Mhm. It feels

(01:17:05):
like D was going for more the after show Vive
m hmm. Yeah, but even that I don't think gives
a credit because there's a there's a jazz mentality that
goes with um. The Voodoo Tour was a little more
scripted than the stuff that we did later, because the

(01:17:26):
stuff we did after Black Massiah was a little looser.
And actually we would change sett lists from night to
night for a bit, and and and he he didn't
have the same relationship with Chris Dave that he had
with you. So as a result, Chris would go rogue
occasionally and it might drive d crazy. And then there

(01:17:47):
were nights where d would be like, yo, I love
that ship. That's dope, And the next night Chris would
do something crazy and he would be like, man, would
you tell him to just keep time not need a mirror?
You know? It was that kind of thing Yang and Yang.
But at some music head, I'm loving this ship because
I'm sitting there watching him and Pinot every night, and
it's like every night they surprised me with something, so

(01:18:11):
I'm I'm like pretending it's jazz and I'm not even
listening to everybody else, I'm just listening to the rhythm section,
and Sharky is like amazing. Um, you know. So, so
here's an artist who has had two landmark bands now
overall Soultronic. It's that's the band of the the era.

(01:18:31):
That's no, there won't be a better better for lack
of a better way of putting its soul band. Um,
probably in our lifetime. Um the Roots and his next
band are probably next. And it's a lot of the
same people. So duh. But that's what Matt see. What

(01:18:54):
got me into James Brown wasn't just James Brown? Who
was the band love music and and And I'm the
person who listens to her record And it doesn't even
hear the singing until I hear the track. And if
the track doesn't move me, I don't care what the
singing is. And I don't care if I like the
singer or not. If the track is smoking, I like

(01:19:15):
the record, And forget lyrics. I don't even know what
lyrics are. The lyrics always come last for me too. Um,
sometimes they may even come at all to because I
don't even care unless they're unusually profound. I mean, you
know what's going on. Sometimes I find out the lyrics
and I was like, oh, maybe I should just continue
ignoring them, right, all right, So when is your next

(01:19:36):
book coming out? I gotta figure out what it is first,
And I had a couple of ideas, have actually started
on one, but I'm I don't know. It's it's it's
like I'm the angel loads I think I want to
do the most is not the most commercially viable. So
I've got to figure out, like, Okay, the one I

(01:19:59):
want to write, it couldn't actually get published, and is
there a chance somebody would publish it? A and B
you could sell a few copies? Um, you know, as
opposed to everybody says, right, a Prince book, that's the
fastballs down in the middle, because there's more of a
market and for the kind of things I would write about,
it's probably the most marketable idea. But there's so many

(01:20:21):
Prince books. But I will say that, but you you
and Gwen's take in wax Poetic, I've read that ten
fifteen times at least, Like I think, really, I feel
like if there's someone that would give us the definitive

(01:20:42):
oral history of at least the I mean, I'm limited
by just saying the Purple Rain Tour or whatever I
think all Revolution members which trust you to talk to them,
or whatever I feel like you could get and now
or maybe ladies and gentlemen, you know the guyfather of

(01:21:08):
all tour management, Quest Love Supreme, the Quiet Edition, We
miss you all right and so more with Allen Lee's
definitely check out our interview from with him in the archives, Yes,
the archives. Yeah, well, thank you. Uh, and uh, hopefully

(01:21:28):
you'll be here for a third round of course. Love
Supreme beat Jimmy Jams record. Yes, because I think we're
not tied now. Yes, you're so tired with him? All right,
I wanna be up of Sugar Steve and Boss Bill
and I'm paid Bill and Fonte and lay Brood here. Yeah,
they're they're they're coming on one day. Uh, this question Love,

(01:21:51):
Thank you all. I appreciate it. And this Supreme Heart
Radio see all the next go round. Quest Love Supreme
production of I Heart Radio. This classic episode was produced
behind the team at Pandora. For more podcasts from my
Heart Radio, visit the I heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts,

(01:22:13):
or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.