QLS Classic: Charlie Wilson

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Of course, Love Supreme is a production of I Heart Radio.
This classic episode was produced by the team at Pandora
Yo Yo Yo. What's up, y'all? This is fonte Fontagelo
here with this week's q l S classic. This week
we talked to the Man, Uncle Charlie, the Legend Charlie
Wilson UH singer, songwriter, lead vocalist for the Gap Band.

(00:23):
Uncle Charlie Wilson talks about signing the snoop, showing Michael
Jackson the moonwalk in other ways, his work his influenced
music and pop culture with the shop We do, We Do,
We Let's go. This one was originally released seven nineteen
This week July nineteenth, seventeen. Long time ago, but still
just as good. Charlie Wilson, y'all, c L classic Fontello Right,

(00:52):
Suprema Suprema rod called Suprema Suprema rogu already call what's
the funkiest letter? Yeah or b Yeah? See your dah No, No,

(01:14):
it's Fremo roll. My name is Fante. Yeah, it ain't
no other. Yeah, I'm looking for my Wednesday love So

(01:34):
Fremo role. I'm gonna lose Primo roll called. My name
is sugar. I don't take no crap. Yeah. I listened
to the Gap band and I shot at the gap
roll call fremo roll If you were wondering, Yeah, what

(01:57):
was that sound. It's just Boss Bill, Yeah, humping around,
disgusting call some prima primo roll call my name yeah,
and I'm coming out. Yeah. Uncle Charlie makes me out.

(02:21):
So frema road call, so prema so fremo roll My
name is Chinnie, Yeah, last name Wilson. Yeah, that's no other. Yeah,
let's burn some rubber, some frema roll call prima son
sun supremo roll call, Frema su fremo roll call sub

(02:48):
prema so fremo roll call. All right, I just once
y'all know from the top that Li threatened us if
we use shot by that by Weedie and in our
roll call, ladies and gentlemen, this is another special educational
extravagancea episode of Course Love Supreme. I'm your host Course

(03:10):
Love Jenkins. Uh, and today I got Team Supreme with me.
We got h Fante Cool, Calculac Evans a fontigolo, and
then uh we have the Mike Master Steve Funk you
up Frasier a K Sugar, Sugar, Steve. That's right, That's
that's you. Now, I'll take it. Uh. We can't forget

(03:31):
boss Man over here. We he's uh William Knuckles, Sammiche Carter,
and Uh, last but not least, we got the very
lovely like a Margaret A. K. Clyde rounding out the
team are our guest today, I will say, is simply

(03:52):
without Pierre. Ladies and gentlemen, Uh, no words will really
ever describe uh the magic that exhumes from this man's
voice anytime he sings. He's Uh. He's basically the six
star General of vocalization of his generation of Yeah. Um,

(04:13):
you know he's literally inspired, and you know he has
R and B children all over the map, on and
off the books. You name him from Aaron Hall or
Kelly Wanny Morrison boys to mention you want, Uh, yes,
just name him literally. Uh these are his children. Uh.
He's the one time member of one of the baddest

(04:35):
funk bands ever of the seventies and the eighties, the
Gap Band. Uh. He's still criminally underpraised. Uh, still operating
now better than ever. Ladies and gentlemen, please welcome the
greatest Charlie, Uncle Charlie Wilson. Wow, man, I've been waiting

(04:56):
for this moment. I don't know's it feels like every episode.
Of course, he was gonna start with, I've been waiting
for this moment. But thank thank you for coming on
the show. I'm gonna ask you the one question I'm
certain that you've been tired of answering your whole career,
which is, how in the world is Tulsa, Oklahoma home

(05:21):
to one of the funkiest people of all time? I
grew up. That's I was born in Oklahoma City and
and and I think, oh, I thought it was Tulsa.
It was Oklahoma City, which is eighty miles away. Okay,
my my mom, we were just over visiting my grandmother,
her mom, and then I just she just actually just
delivered right there in Oklahoma City and we end up

(05:43):
going back to the next day. Yeah, I mean, I
mean I went to school and Tulsa, Oklahoma from from
Kinnygarden all the way and uh to high school and
then went from there to Linkston. But but Tulsa's where
I grew up, and I went to school there, and
it's great. How well the the history that I know
of Oklahoma, especially the history of black people in Oklahoma

(06:05):
from the Black Wall Street period, uh too even now,
like Oklahoma is one of the states that I don't
necessarily think of black folk, uh being. And I mean
maybe I'm ignorant of that fact, but I mean, was
there a high black population even despite the the clam

(06:25):
presence of of of the Jim Crow area, And was
there a high presence of that? Like how did you
even managed to? We had? We? Was? The in word
was used quite easily there. I was growing up a
little boy. You couldn't go in I remember this, uh

(06:46):
running into wold worse. Um. We we pulled up on
the side and and I just opened up the door
because the milksheck stand was like you know the ice
cream standards. You can see it through the the door.
So I just jumped out and ran before we can
get out, and it was like, don't go in that
door because we had our own interest here supposed to

(07:06):
go in the in the negro entrance, and so my
dad fulls up so we didn't. You could just get out,
so we could go around there, but he couldn't. That's
the one way street, so he couldn't turn to the right.
So we got out and I just ran through that door,
the first door I've seen, because the ice cream stand
is there, you know. So when I got out, I

(07:27):
just ran the door. And they were screaming not to me,
for not to go in there, but I just ran
and jumped up on the stool that spins around, and
I was spinning around and and the white guy had
his little white hat, white uniform and and by time
my mom and them got around to the other door
and and they was coming, and knew it was gonna
be something because I went in the wrong door. So
they was running and man, that that man. I think

(07:50):
he had his hand back and my mama was screaming,
don't you do it? And I remember I looked back.
They was running. She was dropping person everything, and my
dad said, you draw back a nub and so he was.
They was. He was getting ready to hit me, called
me into the inward little boy, and oh man, it
was terrible. I was frightening. The death was all I
wanted to was, you know, a milkshake guy. Ain't no

(08:11):
no difference in So that was the episode I would
never forget. And that environment was always treated that and
oh yeah, you had your own interests and and and
and you had your own uh you know, water fountains
to drink out of the water would barely come out.
And the white fountains, the water was like a crispin clean,
crisp clean. It's like a waterfall. So I would just

(08:33):
I would if this wouldn't come out, and go to
that one. My mom would always grab my hand and
snatch me away from it. About I he could read,
I was little. I just was. You know, this one
didn't work cause I went to this one. It was
not good, you know, somewhat. But uh. We had some uh,
some pretty good friends that lived across the street, which
was Mr. Rentals and you know the word and the

(08:56):
name Rentals, and so they had the luminum and all
of that stuff that. So we go and play in
his yard and it's his SOB factory yard. And and
when it was thunderstorms or tornadoes, we would go in.
We could go in that basement the underground. Now one
of course were empires from Oklahoma. H the Rentals wrapped that. Yeah,

(09:17):
they we had a that's weird. So we're not learning
that all masters of the Soul Empire had their their
corporation to last. When growing up, my dad would be
standing in water like three ft but we could use
it to get away from it. My mom would not
leave the house. Go ahead, I'm not going. I'm not

(09:37):
gonna stand in the water. She was pretty, uh, very outspoken,
but she wouldn't do it. Were you guys? Was it
a musical household? Musical? Yeah? My mom played piano and
she taught us all how to play everything. So you
actually play, you play pianos? Well, yeah, the first thing
I learned was that. And of course you know drums
and church. So your your main weapon of voice was

(10:00):
piano and drums or okay, So as far as like
it's it's just you and your three brothers in the household,
did you have more civiling have a sister? She was
that to its four of us? Okay all together? Um?
So what was the at least the band environment in
your high school or your your your school period? What

(10:21):
was what was that into man and band we were?
You know? Of course my lit his brother went first.
He was through all of the schools first, and it
was my sister to following him through all of the schools.
Brother Ronnie was there, and then my sister Loretta was second.
Then I was third, you know, so that already set
presence of you know, there was a musical family. So
when I got there, it was you, Wilson, you can sing,

(10:43):
and it's just oh, here's a microphone. And it was
just like just it's just like that and end up
being a pet, you know, like you know, the class pet,
the teacher's favorite or whatever. And then him sing and
you know, so it was like that all the way
through school and um, but when I got out, there's uh,
you know, I had some friends who were very gifted

(11:03):
and talented as well, so we would form my own
little group and um, and man, we was pretty pretty
it was. There was there a black radio presence in
Oklahoma at that time. No, So how did you I mean,
because you're your voice is I mean you just automatically
assumed that you literally came out the womb being raised

(11:27):
and braised and and smothered in soul. But in Oklahoma,
how did you receive your education and information? Well, first
of all, my mom saying better than me at that time,
you know, I was she had chops to wiggle her
voice any kind of way. And so when I first
heard Little Stevie one, I thought it was a girl,

(11:48):
and I said, hey, mom, let me say I can
beat her. I could beat the mom. I I swear
I could beat He said, boyna sit down, you ain't
be no girl ain't beating. And then I found out
it wasn't a girl was a little Stevie Wonder. But
I was like, I can do that. I can do that.
She was like, you're not singing the blues up in here,
so you know, so it was it was we went

(12:10):
next door to hear the records of all the Sam
Cook had a bear of fantee anything that was going
on because at that time, you know, it was just
one chart. It was one radio and James Brown. Everybody
was if you got on that chart, that means you
was a superstar. It was like no black radio. No,
it was just one radio and one chart, and all
of the big artists was on coming on down that

(12:31):
radio station, you know, white radio station. It's like pop
was it? So you're saying that your parents forbade you
to sing secular music in my household and he couldn't
do that. U we had to go next door. My
dad is preaching. My mom was a state minister of music,
and it's not you know what I'm doing that in there.
So what could you listen to? What would We don't

(12:52):
really have any you know, went too much to listen to.
I mean we have had a record player. We hear
some Hey Jackson, I hear some Shirley Sees or something,
you know, something like that, And of course I'll be
next door and listening to what I want to listen
to because they were the uh they weren't in church
over there, so I could go over there and and
uh and listen to whatever I wanted to the shiny
records and and you know, so I had a great time, man,

(13:15):
it was it was good and up agreeing the we
were brought up really good and the music scene was
Like I said, next door was just great for me
because I could hear anything that that was on the radio.
So besides, uh, I know Leon Russell's from the area,
but um was there. I know that you guys you

(13:39):
were his band at one point, correct, yes, So how
did that partnership come about? Well, we're playing this club
I think it's about fifty may hold about fifty people,
and uh we was playing late nights. We start about
eleven twelve o'clock and leave out of about five o'clock
in the morning, so it was. And they came in
the club one night and I was like, who was
the white I was back there just just as you know,

(14:02):
and they was back to back that party and and
did nobody seemed to know who they were. And then
the next weekend they came back all Harold's slick and
sitting up straight. So they wasn't drunk this weekend, okay.
So I went to the table, said you want to
beat Leon Russell. I was like, yeah, where's he at?

(14:23):
He's like out of here, and I was like, why
his hair combed? So he's sober. So I said, asked him,
why was uh why you came last week? You guys
were pretty drunk, and said, well, we was drunk. We
want to make sure we heard what we heard last week.
I heard it that it wasn't a fluke, it wasn't
a fluke, that we wasn't drunk. So when they I said, so,
what do you think is that we heard exactly what

(14:43):
we heard last week? It's just great? And so were
you performing as the gaping by that point? Okay? So
he didn't too much like that name. No, he was
trying to make exchange it what year was that I
was in the early seventy sometimes I didn't seventy one, seven,
seventy two win So this is like right when a
song for you was just starting. Uh yeah some w

(15:04):
now but so he were starting to make a name
from something we well and he just sort of like, um,
he said, you want to go to the studios. We
went to the studio and um and checked him out.
We played a little bit. It was you know, quite late.
Were just you know, recorded to about ten and eleven
something like that. And when finally went home, went to sleep,

(15:24):
but and uh he had a show coming up and
the invite us to the show. And I went to
seeing this his show, and and uh he I have
to show. He said, what do you think? I said, man,
you're band weak my being to keep your band. Yeah,

(15:45):
so um uh he said really I was like yeah.
So he says, okay, what to the studio? And he says,
if I know the studio He gave us about I
don't know, five or six albums here were learning these albums.
Learn this said what songs everyone on them on all
of the albums. But see previously had told us which
was what was the greatest things, the beginnings. It's the

(16:05):
beginnings and the endings of songs. What people remember. They
won't know what's in the middle of whatever. If you
can get them in the in the front. And you
got him. So what we did is we just learned
all of the intros of all of the songs, bridges,
you know what I'm saying. We just stopped where he went.
You know, he was fast enough to following. But and
so he started off on one sings on then he

(16:26):
went to a whole different album, and we just like
and had the keys that so and so when you
when you start playing they different keys. We just followed,
looked and followed the intros. And then then he just
stopped and looked at the side. You gotta be kidding me.
It's like, man, what else you want to do? Nothing?
I'm good, he said, So let me can ask you
a question. I said, yeah, I said, can I put
a drummer with your band? And can I put another
get tip with your band? I said, let's go, And

(16:48):
so he fired his other band and then we was
there and uh, just killing, killing, and I was on
keys and I was up dancing, which he didn't like
a lot because I was I was about. I was dangerous.
I was young, twenty one, fast feet and and and
and jumping on his piano. I would break all his

(17:09):
his head hip and steal the the microphones and I
would jump up on his piano, jump down, doing the
split and all kind of crazy stuff. And he started
taking the songs away from me and mcause I was
steal in this show. That's similar to uh, Jimi Hendricks
still in the spotlight from a little Richard. Yeah, Little Richard,

(17:29):
you gotta go, bro, I can't have that. Um. So,
how long was it until? Did you guys stay with
him until you recorded your debut record in seventy seven,
the one before when you went to uh no, we
was we was him. We did UM. We did one
album on Gap and we did Which Soul about maybe
sixteen records in the neighborhood, and then we then we

(17:51):
did UM um I stop all that jazz album with
him and UM and then UM and he wanted to
he wanted me. They wanted me to leave the band
and uh and UM. So they was and Elton John
was coming out and they wanted me to to to

(18:13):
take go after him, and I was like, because my
brother's coming it was like I just want you and
I was like, no, that's okay. So even then, did
you guys have a pack like we're gonna be man?
And I was the pack leader with that vibe. I
don't know what everybody else's motivation was, motive swear, but me,
I was like, let's stay together. And I was the

(18:34):
only one that was sought after was me. And I'm
the one saying let's stick. Okay, you see what I'm saying.
And uh, And I don't think they really really didn't
get that so many years I'm trying out. Yes, you
guys played on stop all that jassy if you look
at the end. Wait a minute, I have that record,

(19:01):
I think now I look again, I'm the one that
the little skinny went over him. That's me closer to him. Wait,
I'm about to tell Steve. You wouldn't know it, Steve,
because there's a bunch of Africans or the front cover.
I did not know that was him. That's all of us,
my brothers in the band, that we all all of us,
and the white girl and other ladies that that was
the background singers, all that there was all of us.

(19:22):
Now I gotta go to Philly to find that record.
It's I haven't when when Leon Russell passed recently, I
went out pretty much bought the entire catalog on vinyl,
and uh, that record stood out and not not because
of the Africans on the time of the music, the
music that that's it's a superbo it's a great record. Yeah, yeah, wow, Okay,

(19:44):
I did not know. Now which one are you? I
think I think I'm the ones right behind him, the
most skinny ones right closer to him. I think that
I think that's me right there. Oh, look at the baby. Okay, alright,

(20:09):
So I could assume that all this activity happened inside
of Oklahoma. So where does the association with Lonnie Simmons
come into play in my might to assume? For Sorry,
this hanging on the most obvious question. I know the answer,
but Gap, of course, is the abbreviation for Greenwood, Archer,

(20:32):
and pind. Yes, why were those particular three streets chosen
as the name of the band that was black Wall Street?
And all of the black owned businesses are were very
rich black people, entrepreneurs, bankers, hotel owners, everything was just
black owned and very very rich, and and they had

(20:52):
their owned bus lines, they owned cap service, they had,
they owned everything. And on Greenwood Archer was in this way,
Pam was running this way, which made an h So
it was called the green Wood watching Pine Street. Everything
in and it was just super barbers. Anything you could
any business today was there in that particular area. And um,

(21:13):
and they didn't need anybody or anything. They ran their
own thing, and just or Tulsa just didn't like that
to have these black all these black rich people and
didn't didn't use any of us system, didn't use their system.
They had their own system. So they burned them out.
So after that initial burning, was there ever an attempt
to research it throughout time and history. I think I've

(21:36):
only been to Oklahoma maybe once or twice. They tried
to rebuild and they burned them again. Yes, when the rebuild,
it was in the twenties. After they burned it, asked
they tried to rebuild again few years later and just
burn them out again. As simple as that. It's like, no,
you it was it was too it was too um.

(21:57):
They didn't need the outside world. It's like they didn't
need to outside Tulsa for anything. They had their own community,
owned everything. And so that was like the help was
being taken from the white world, is what I'm trying
to say without you know, cutting myself up. Yeah, so
they had their own system. The calves went everywhere, their
busses went everywhere. Uh, you know, all of the grocery

(22:21):
stores and banks. Everything they had. Didn't have to bank with, No,
they use their own banks. Can I met your parents
and your grandparents and parents before then? Were they all
in oloom at the grandmother my my my mother was
a very very very very little child. She's born in
twenty three stories around that time. So my grandmother um

(22:43):
knew about it really well and and told everybody, but
she they weren't allowed really to talk about it. It
was like a hush hush oh yeah, because you know,
that was too much information because the way they the
way they burned everybody out, and and it just wasn't
you're not supposed to talk about it. Yeah, you could

(23:04):
end up somewhere, cut up in a sack, or somewhere
missing because it was so many people missing, and they
never found those people that could see and actually say,
you know, what was really going on because there was
police come into houses and you know, and and just
get doing away with them families because getting away with it.

(23:26):
So it was pretty bad. Um well, I know that
Singleton's uh Rosewood was semi based on it. I mean
it's not all, but he said that he borrowed, you know,
bits of history from the black from from the Black
Wall Street experience. So, uh, how does Lonnie Simmons come

(23:52):
into the picture and you guys moved into l A.
It was years later. Um, we actually kind of was
so heartbroken that we were trying to figure out what
we're gonna do because I mean, you know, we've been
on tour with the guy. We was the band, we
cut the records, and we just thought everything was gonna
blossom from that platform and it's just didn't work out

(24:13):
that way. And man, I was just so hot, so heartbroken,
and uh the band was kind of like just nervous.
I said, Okay, we went to California. We came out
to Los Angeles and uh we was bumping around in
there for a year just trying to figure out what.
We ended up on Tattoo Records, which was a subsidiary

(24:34):
of our ci A at that time. Um, we tried
to m c A or um over there with Quincy Jones,
at A and M Yeah, which was we did a
single a deal and uh, he was trying to get
with him, but of course he had you know, he

(24:54):
had other Johns and all that stuff. Your hands was full.
So when end up we end up with Tattoo Records
and it's just okay did okay? Was not that that much.
So Tattoo Records wasn't real labeled because I remember when
Shaka Khan first signed her deal with Warner Brothers, at
least for the first two records, Tattoo Records was on it.

(25:15):
So who ran Tattoo I can't remember, um um, but
they had to deal through Warner or yeah, I think
sorry or just whatever label would pick up. Okay, Um,
it's actually weird' slight confession time. So even though uh,

(25:36):
at least by the second album with Oops up being
a national single. Uh, when I first heard of you,
I thought you were a chef because there's a feature.
One of your first features and right on magazine wasn't yes,

(25:58):
turn in my hand trying to cook eggs? So like
this is a thing in I mean now, I mean,
you know, millennials are very fortunate now to get you know,
a plethora of information on their favorite via the Internet.
But you know, in ninety you really truly have three

(26:22):
outlets if you're going to make it as a black person,
Jet Jet, ebony, and I'm occasionally black stars. They had
what CPIA, but yeah, in right on magazine they did
this this layout of of Charlie Wilson in the kitchen

(26:46):
like but like a very extensive, like twenty photo of
you know, first, I take the cinnamon. He made breakfast. Yo.
I told my mom, like yo, what I'm this, and
like we had the breakfast. I mean he managed traditional breakfast.
I forgot now, but like I was doing the cinnamon

(27:09):
and my friends still like jellywood. Like in my head,
I wasn't connecting the oops upside your head guy with
this is I mean, he had a clean feather. He
looked like Philip Ingram from Switch, Like he's feathered out, smooth, smooth,
got I thought he was a chef, So you know, like,

(27:32):
do you remember I remember the shooting. I remember burning
my hand to I was flipping the pancakes and my
hand with too closes and I remember going up and
I was and they caught the picture with my mouth
because I was I did that. Yeah, I gotta give
myself a reggae Yo. I burned my hand and I

(27:55):
did that. See, and yeah, you've probably think, like, you know,
I'm gonna read this is why gott I just talk
about my new single see Cynthia so well, I was
gonna say, uh, what was because I know that in

(28:17):
Los Angeles that time period, I mean, you can either
roll with Clarence Avant or uh Dick Griffy. Right. You know,
I don't know what Barry Gordon's vibe was. I mean
I know that his sister Irish Gory were sort of
taking over the reins of finding acts at motown between
like and UM and with Lonnie Simmons. So at least

(28:45):
what what was the initial like how did you guys
hook up with him? And it was me, I hooked
up with him and and I I said with everybody
the band just kind of fell apart, and there was
everybody after have nothing worked? You know, the tattoo recorded
thing didn't work, and so everybody was like, Okay, we
was in Los Angeles a whole year, and you know,

(29:06):
those guys took a leave of absence and I didn't
know where to leave. Leave of absence was I quit
my job. I quit my job and so did my
my my oldest brother, he quit his job because we
was basically trying to do this thing for real, and
everybody just how do you? Yeah, I was gonna say,
how do you survive? But it's it's it's it's do

(29:27):
a dit It's it's like, you know, man, it was
it's we I had cereal and water and uh, you know,
whatever breakfast would be. And we stayed fifteen in a
one two bedroom apartment with a lady who already had
four kids, and and we were all on the floor. Yeah,

(29:50):
we was all on the one bathroom. We was all
on the floor. We was in the jungle there. And
it's like she must have believed in this Harrison. Yeah
she Uh it was a connection. I went to school
with her two of her kids, and we were very
close and uh, and that was the connection we had.
In Los Angeles. They moved from Tulsa to Los Angeles.
So when we was coming out, we told him we're coming,

(30:11):
and she said, you come stay here. It was just
too many of us and I think she got almost
got kicked out her apartment because we was there. We
are rearing in that partent man. We played down by
the pood and blew out the circuit system trying to
get a man who owned the building a birthday party.
He come back, he was like, get out. You don't

(30:35):
get out. He was already married a woman. So that
was just blew it get out. So that that initial band, uh,
I guess you guys got your first Soul training appearance
in seventy nine. That initial band migrated from Tulsa. To
know that band didn't make it. That meant that our

(30:56):
that band did never make it to no TV shows,
no other records or none of that. So, like I said,
I I met Lonnie and Um and his club and
because d J Rogers was there doing those times and
and and of course DJ used to pull me on
stage and and let me sing and stun like that. Yeah,

(31:19):
the crowd club befoll it was was at the Total
Experience Club and where a lot of Shaka Khan dramatics.
Everybody used to play the Total Experience nightclub. Yeah, okay,
everybody that was anybody played his club. Yeah. I was
gonna say because I think even prior uh that Nigga's
Crazy album was was was Yeah, it was was taped there. Yeah,

(31:45):
it was a nightclub too. Yeah, it was He's had
a night his nightclub. That's the way he was. It
was known for that and um hm. Him and Dick
Griffly were cool. You know. I also played that they
were cool. But if you him and take it was

(32:05):
like it was, it wasn't cool to that part. I mean,
was he a nurturing guy or was he s knight
is Lonnie was? It was, I want to say, in
the category and maybe of a shield of the night
he was could have been the first one. But he
was very a smooth one. He didn't get if you

(32:26):
got it upset, he wouldn't come get you though they
did raised his voice. He just took action what the
guys around him would because you know what it's like
and it would just be like that. But we that's
how we started. It was from me and him. It
was our relationship that we did this whole thing about.
He would give me a contract or not keep it

(32:46):
a week and I give it back to him and
he keep it weak. He opened it and he would
would be sign, I don't know what that say. We
did that for a month two months, and but he
was like, man, once you come because he heard me
saying and was like, dude, that voice right there, and uh.
I won't say what he said about the other artists

(33:06):
that was there, but he was like, dude, me and
you that we could make this happen. And I was
just like, okay, whatever I said, I just gotta get
my brothers out here and so and he was like, wow,
how many. I was like too, So he says, okay,
go get him. So at the time, we'd uh, I
guess like Robert Goody Woodfield and Yarbor on People's were

(33:29):
they becoming part of the family. Oh, you have them too.
I brought them. I found founded everybody that was on
that label. I did. Wow, it was me who got
brought to everybody. Yeah, he brought nobody. It was me
brought everybody that I was experienced. That's all you got.

(33:55):
It was indeed a total experience. That's what that was.
But they went Texas and I was on the road
and I went to this club and I've seen y'all
brown People's and I and I, uh, a friend of mine.
It was. It was connected on the total experience size.
And name was Rudy Taylor at that time, Rudy Rudy Taylor,
and I asked Rudy to get on the phone and

(34:15):
call Liney right away, and he called him. I said,
I got a group just just incredible, and I think
we should sign him like tomorrow. And he was like, well,
I said, I've gotta go. You do it or not,
but they they're gonna end up with somebody else. And
then and he asked Rudy, Rudy, hi good? He said, man,
you know, if Child's Ears is good, and I'm telling
you they're good, they second live at the nightclub. So

(34:36):
he put them back on the phone. He said, okay, man,
you know, I was just tired of just waking up.
So if they're good, uh, I signed him. I said, okay,
you need to sign him. Then Goody came right after it,
you know, so it was all friends and so I
just put them all in there. So you know what
I mean is that that at one point in time,
if you had good ears, something sounds good, it was

(35:01):
worthy of getting signed. Like not once did he say, well,
you know, does the girl look good like what he
looked like our market? Have you had someone that he
passed on that eventually made it, or he didn't have anybody,
you know know, what I'm saying, was there somebody that he
didn't try to bring to the full that he didn't want.

(35:21):
There was nobody that I brought that he didn't want.
I mean, he just It's like I had a guy
named Dorrian Williams who who no, Okay, his name is
Paul Williams actually, but we called him Dorian and he
was it was like Luther andros at that time. And
it was like and I said, this kid, but everybody

(35:43):
he didn't It was afraid of of knocking, Like if
I was on the stand, something's gonna knock me off
the stand. But that what I wasn't looking at it
like that. I'm like, this guy can saying you need
to just get it done. So we did the album
on him and did an album on on on some
other act that I had then, and it just didn't
put the effort. Ok yeah, he just put the effort in.

(36:04):
So the same time, he was like rolling in money,
uh above above ground, so you know, nothing under the
table and was all it was all up a book.
So it was like, whatever, I don't want to do that.
So I have to ask how influential was Funkadelics. Let's

(36:26):
let's take it to the stage album to you because
I feel like, you know, seventy nine to eighty was
a transitional period that was really hard for a lot
of the seventy bands to cross over and to maintain.
Like you know, Ohio players imploded. Uh, you know, at
least a lot of the lead singers or particular acts

(36:48):
have left for solar careers. And then the left the
left behind group members imploded. Uh. But you kind of
just took the the p funk about uh, I'll say
baton and kept it alive. And so what was was

(37:10):
there any feelings on their end of of you guys
sort of taking their their modus operandi and and actually
running good with it. It was a couple of guys
and and in the band that you know if if Sam,
if you come up, George will call you up on
the stage, and if they don't like it, they start

(37:30):
doing the waltz, you know, and so George made him
stop doing the waltz. One time I came on stage,
but I already knew what the waltz was because I
was going with one of the girls that was from
the from the Parliament Pocademics. So I used to go
silver Now, Yeah, so I already knew what that whole
thing was. But so when the what's the he's washed
up or whatever, and so George would just go right

(37:52):
over there, just don't do that. Don't do that on him.
So everybody stops and I'll just take the mic and
just ripped the place apart. And then I think after
I I did that one time that they was like, oh,
he's not He's not a whim. But see, we was
on the road with with with the Parliament Funkadelic for
years before we really had the hit record, and then
after we came off that's what Side your Head was

(38:12):
sort of bomb boring, but the chap came from a
crowd that was in Pittsburgh and and ourselves, you know,
but it was chanting something, but the rhythm was the same.
So we came back and put the oops up side
the head because they you know, yeah, I was gonna
say it was chanting something and it wasn't what. We
couldn't understand it, so we actually chant chant the the

(38:35):
oops upside your head say oops because they were saying
gap band. They was I think they were saying gap
side your head, gap band, something like that. It was weird.
But it wasn't and it had the real the perfect rhythm.
So we had to go back and get that rhythm
and put it to that. But we were on the
road with them for a long time, man, and and

(38:56):
of course we was watching them every night, and George
became very protective and Boots seeing them, they came very
protective of us, and they made a push back and
give us room because I didn't had a room. I said,
I can't I'm having a room to work. So Joge said,
I haven't be seen it. What you mean? I said, Man,
I ain't got the room. So they said, I'll make
him pushing back. So he pushed the stage back for us,
and uh, and Boots his sauce a couple of times,

(39:17):
and then he give us some porters and stuff. So
quite naturally, Man, that funk that they had was infectious,
and so it rubbed off and I just loved them,
and uh, what those two some of it and ran
with it. What were those audiences? Like? Man, it was incredible.
And see Bootsy was so strong that that he was
kicking George's butt. Okay, so George sometimes had to let

(39:39):
Booty close. Yeah, because man, he would Bootsy would stump
all over Parliament Funkadelic and they had the same horn
section and everything, so but Boots it was Boots his band.
So so, speaking of which we kind of mentioned it,
what were your feelings to Uptown Funk and how did

(40:01):
you because you know, I mean there have been think
pieces on these twelve artists could also get a piece
of but you guys did it. So technically they had
to give it to me. Are you a Grammy winner
because it was a Record of the Year or is
that only for song of the Year if you're listening
to this song right, Okay, So it wasn't song it

(40:23):
was Record of the Years. That's for the performance it was.
It was I remember my manager, he's in there now.
He was, I mean, he called such a stink that's
what good he called a good manager. He called such
a stink man on everything, and so I think there
was about tire of looking at him and saying that
he was good. He went straight to the top with it,
and and then it was like then they just like, uh,

(40:47):
well we can't with well, song of the year what
whatever it is, So they moved things around, and so
he was just saying, it's not fair it's not fair
to the Gap band that they don't get the you know, recognition,
the recognition of it, and so I remember that point then.
So but anyway, man, it was it was I reck
it simple, and it was chatting it and so hey,

(41:08):
So it came to a quicker conclusion than the Robin
Thick Marvin Gay situation. We got paid for whatever. He's
happy alright, Mike. You know, also brought a another uh

(41:31):
what I would assume for you, a bucket list pairing,
uh you singing background one. I ain't going to stand
for it with Stevie. So I mean, I'm just assuming
that this guy's your hero, Yeah, assuming we can assume
that you don't have to assume the way it was,
it's one of my heroes. So what was that experience

(41:52):
like for you to work with prime Stevie, especially when, like,
I know how some artists could have. I've seen artists
ego trip and kind of shun out anyone that's removing
cabable of out seeing them or outshining them. And I

(42:13):
always wanted to know because there's two versions of I
ain't gonna stand for it. The version on forty five
goes about maybe thirty seconds longer than the album version.
And I was always impressed with the fact that you
you saying so discipline when you could easily just started,

(42:35):
you know, your your vocal acrobatics. What was that? What
was that whole experience like recording with him? Let me
tell you that is not the version at all. That
that's not the best version. There's another on the version
that we actually did in the beginning. You know what's
coming to Yeah, that version that he did, he couldn't
get that. We recorded that version embolic sound, which is

(42:59):
I turn a student though, really and that version with
the walk walk walk walk, Oh man, that one right there,
he had the thing around his neck to make himself
a microphone and we all singing around him. That was
the version. And I used to answer, where's that version?
He said, I couldn't, couldn't couldn't get the version of
the tape back from from Ike. I think that's the

(43:22):
it was. I was looking for my guns, saying, yeah,
we couldn't get that. He couldn't get that anyway. It
was something I never got the real story from why
we didn't use it. So he was trying to recreate
it after like years later, to try to recreate it.
I said, when when was the first one? Man, I

(43:44):
can't now, I can't remember the year now I'm a
little came out it was I assume he wasn't doing
nothing between seventies six and eight. If it was eight,
and then it came out, we did it. We did
it in seventy nine and seventy nine. And the version
I'm thinking, mhm uh something like that. Because how did

(44:08):
you meet Stevie? I met Stevie uh from the album
from from when I was with Shelter with Leon Russell.
We went out to Los Angeles to mix the record
Um Magician's Holiday, and he was still in the record plan,
just running over time like you always do. And he
was agne and he was our and half two hours old.

(44:32):
They had the record and this guy, uh Spike, who
was uh one of Inch Stephen's engineers. He had heard
the record. So they had told Stevie about this guy singing.
So Steve heard the record and uh and uh that
was my first time meeting. It was in the seventies something,
seventy five, someone like that. But anyway, I sit out
he's sitting me at the piano with him, and he

(44:53):
started playing and he asked me sing this, and I
sang that and he sang the part another part, and
we was going off each other like that. And then
he was like, hey man, you're bad man. I like you. Man,
what is that like? What was that like for you?
I couldn't need to say. I couldn't even get my

(45:14):
licks out, man, shaking and like a nervous like you know,
that was my first time and we've been friends ever
since then, that's what's up. Yeah, I just was just
nervous and uh and uh, you know, so that was
my first time meeting them. And then, like I said,
it happened again and he wanted to get being on
that record and then and we couldn't do it at

(45:35):
the time we was on tour. He offered to sent
up a plane a jet and and uh, of course
everybody was nervous. I ain't getting on chill. You're trying
to get rid of Childie Wilson, trying to get rid
of the choli with stupid people. Think about it was

(45:57):
young at the time, but those guys are they're probably
getting hid confused. I'm like, dude, he just wanted us
to sing on the record, get out of here. So anyway,
that next that next two days later, I just chopped
on a jet and uh, and then everybody followed me,
and I guessed right after that, I'm going, I see
y'all going to stay with Steve. And so I got
back and did the vocals, and but as I heard,

(46:21):
I said, where's the other version? And he was like,
that's a long story. It's like, okay, I think anything. Wait, uh,
you know what it's everything's coming to me now as
you're talking, I gotta go back to pe funk. Can
you please tell me the origin of new Spaceship? Was

(46:45):
that an old track that you sang one? Because there's
no way in hell? And we're referring to new Spaceship
on the on the George Clinton George Clinton All Stars
are awesome, but they called T A T whatever O
P P. Dude. When that record came out, you know,

(47:10):
we were skimming through it and you know, I do
the occasional ten second audition and dude, I'm saying like,
I don't even know if you remember the Steve. But
when we were recording uh Voodoo with the Angelo, it's

(47:31):
all he listened to. Man, that was like a where
did like was it the track that George just gave
you the sing over or just me I personally, I
don't even remember. You don't remember new Spaceship. I don't remember.
Oh Jesus Christ, here let me see, ladies and gentlemen. Uh,
this is new Spaceship. To hear it from the ABC

(47:55):
once three George, George Clinton and the Funk All Stars. Yes, uh,
on course of Supreme right here. This is one of
my favorite songs ever. I remember. Now, okay, listen, let

(48:26):
me tell you the story. Are you ready to hear
the story behind that? That was my version. We was
talking about sly Stone. This is how that. So I'm
going in. I'm like, I'm marking slide. We're talking about this,
and so he said, man, Charlie Whiston does a great

(48:48):
version of sly Stone. So I was I was like,
when I'm around slide back in the day, this is
how he would be. And that's where that vocal came.
And I started doing that. So all of that and
they kept it. They kept all of that. And then, uh,
because that's how we was doing it at the beginning,
before he got anything, I'm marking slide. And then I
turned to do my own thing with the with the
with the Charlie Wilson thing around it. So it was like, man,

(49:09):
this is great, some great ship right here. I think
I'm gonna keep this, and so he did. And I
wasn't paying on titches to it. I was I'm gone,
I'm I do my thing and I'm bone out. I'm done.
What year was that? I can't remember the year? Well,
I know that's when it came out. But was it
the old song that they It had to be. It
had to be, Uh had to be a ninety four

(49:31):
or ninety four, because I got but that I'm like,
it sounds like Jerome big Foot brillly. Yeah. Well, we
was recording that for that particular we was trying to
get something. He was trying to get this thing and
got it and we got and we just started. I

(49:52):
started acting like Slide. We was laughing about that, and uh,
he said, go, how was Slice singing? And I was
just like, that's how I started that voice that sounded
like that. I was mocking him. So I've had the
pleasure of from the nineties. Steve. Steve was one of

(50:13):
the engineers on d'angelos Voodoo. So like during the first
month of us recording out Electric Lady D had the CD.
George gave it to him before it came out, and
that's all he played for me all the time, and
like we were just flabbergast, like flabbergasted at you guys

(50:39):
kneeling Classic p funk. Years after that, after that time period,
I just I just I just was going, uh huh,
sometimes I have a problem um moderating of then I was,
you know, you put your self, he put you too

(51:00):
much on yours on yourself, put too much on yourself.
And I just never level like the fact that the
ad lives. It's just they just want me to just
be just be Charlie Wilson what it was like. And
so it was like, okay, uh what what is the

(51:21):
what is the what's the title? And what it was like, No,
you just you just you just give me something some
little sing whatever. Yeah, So I don't just don't like that.
But then I noticed that everybody always like that. So
it's always either shop but I would do It's just
always just go off the top of the head. But
this is the thing though, it's real. I'll be one
of the Okay, I'm I'll meant I'm one of those

(51:43):
people that's Okay, I took I took you for granted,
because the thing is that, I mean, when you grow
up in a time period and you just see all
this greatness, you know, it's just that's what he's great.
So you you've sat you've done uh the Falon Show

(52:03):
with us like maybe three or four times. You sat
him with us twice. And there's one point where you're
we can clearly hear you through the vents doing your
vocal warm ups, and we're all looking at each other
like it's it was the most it was like a

(52:24):
monster movie, like we just we're at the vocal event
like listening to him, and it was how do you
how do you warm up your your your your instruments
preserve because like you, I saw I saw clips of

(52:47):
your recently to show you to hear and like all
these songs are singing in the same key when I was,
when I was, when I was back when I was young.
And that's still saying I don't we didn't change the
keys for me and everybody just say, man, my brothers
may need to change the key. I said, Man, that
ain't gonna sound right. He's your key and the ease
my key. When from when I was when we was younger.
That was in my twenties, and that's we wrought all

(53:07):
the stuff and those keys and that was it. So
I still sing all the keys, the songs in the
same keys, and we wrote all of them. And it's
like I said, it won't sound right. My my push out.
I have to push to get it out. But why
would I change the keys? But but I war them up. Uh,

(53:34):
you know, night nighte, nighte night n N nine N
nine nine nine nine nine. Then I can do that
till till it's clear what added breaking, Because clear you
have to mucus and things. It's in there. You know.
You study with Seth Riggs or yeah, Michael Jackson. I
didn't go there very long, but I did study with him,

(53:55):
and he told me I had a great farce and
he was the one the game of those warm ups
and I never stopped using those warm ups. And Stevie
was going to him. And Stevie used to do a
with a note at the same time. Uh man is behind,
but he should do that, But it was more he
was was dead on accurate. Yeah, And so I would

(54:18):
used to try that all day and and why why
is Seth Riggs the go to guy. This guy had.
This guy was phenomenal him and his daughter too, that
they were just uh, he could warm you up and
then he could have you doing things that you didn't
ever think you could do. And I just didn't get
a chance to go back. I was devious two back
in those days, and so I started doing a lot
of other things to the going on the vocal coach

(54:39):
and uh, but he was. He was just the most
incredible dist guy I've ever being close to. While he
was warming me up and he started doing things that
I had never thought I could do, and he said,
so held warm me up, and then we got through
woman with warming me up. Then he would start doing
these things that he was doing before I got warmed up,
and then he told me to do it and I

(54:59):
would hidden, and I was like wow. He said, see,
it's it's just an instrument. It's gonna get you to
do everything. So from a non me being an obvious
non singer barely talking, uh, what is because I would
think that if you activate your voice uh for thirty

(55:20):
five to forty five minutes, you might wear it out.
So you you have to get it in motion and
exercise it just to keep the Yeah, you get it
warmed up, and then after you do the correct exercise
and for thirty minutes, then you can go and hit
the notes that you want to hit. Do you sing

(55:41):
from your diaphragm as all singers are supposed to be
supposed to do, Yeah, it comes sometimes and sometimes intertally
singing from your throat, But at the beginning and when
until I met him, and then he showed me how
to well, actually shopman told me that taught me that
in in high school and in college. But again, you know,
you're not listening to a lot of people. My mom

(56:01):
used to tell me that. And but this guy Seth,
he was telling me how how you supposed to sing?
And and I always want him to come to the
studios with me and work on my verses. When I'm
doing verses, um, I'm saying, you know, recording vocals because
he would do that with a lot of artists, superstars.
Make sure the breathing is right going into the next

(56:22):
phrase and stuff. How do you preserve like so like
after a show, what's your ritual like after after the
show was done? I have no rituals about nothing. I
don't have rituals at all. And the only ritual I
have is uh. If you want to use, the ritual

(56:43):
would be My wife is the ritual. She is the ritual.
That's she makes sure that I'm warm, and she makes
sure that I'm drinking something warm. And then my guy
at temporal, he's uh, he keeps some warm stuff with me,
hot water and honey and um. And that's it. Man
and I, when I get off the stage, I do
the wrong thing. I'm talking loud and I'm hollering and

(57:04):
I'm going crazy. It's never I'm talking soft. You know.
I come from one side of the family who talks loud.
And my father said, my mom's side talks aloud, and
my father's side talks off. And so I just stepped
the mom said, I'm just loud. I was gonna say,
this is not like a manual for all things, because
you're you're blessed, Yeah, numbeless. Yes, So it's not a

(57:26):
Arefa Luther thing where you have to turn off the well,
let me tell you something about about air conditions. It'll
rip you up. And if you gotta sing, I wouldn't
be serious. You're serious because this is the one thing
that Tarik and I Tarik is the it could be
the middle summer, and he'll make the driver turn off
the air conditions and make us all suffer in the car.

(57:48):
And he's like, I won't have a voice for a showtime.
You're absolutely cycle. That's whatever that Tarika hasn't smoked in
about five years now, Yeah, okay, listen, that is absolute
truth right there. You do not you want to have
uh the temperature in the car off just at least

(58:10):
seventy five degrees wow, at all times if you want
to sing, if you want to have good voice. Now,
if I had to sing the night, I wouldn't be
in this room. Oh you wouldn't. Okay, now that's too
cold in here. But um, it's you. It'll tell you out.
You notice I'm kicking, uh, clearing my throat because the

(58:31):
cold air is getting to it. But I'm just talking
so um. But it's not because studio, Yeah it's not.
It's always you know, when I'm in recording, I ain't
we don't have that. You don't shut that down, so
we won't be doing vocals in that studio. So by

(58:51):
the time that gap in three, four and five come out,
when you guys are really fully operational. Well, I always
wanted to know because when I when I spoke of
the let's take it to the stage character, which you
like provoking people like dance sucking, you know whatever. What
was your relationship like with your band contemporaries back then,

(59:15):
like we're there rivalries with Confunction or or you know
all these other bands like yeah, I'm gonna show y'all
what's upping? You know that sort of thing every single night.
So in in hindsight, what was the band that got
under your skin? Like, yo, man, we're going to It's

(59:35):
like it's like this we were. It was Confunction basically
because they went put from seriously methetically just throwing the
dark night. Let me tell you why. It's because they
went put fringes on their uniforms. And uh it was like, okay,
you know, we've been with cowboys, we've been wining fringes
smoking home, but they wouldn't put fringes on their uniform

(59:56):
and so we were thinking, like, okay, they already you know,
they got the big records from back in the day
and all of that stuff. But it's it's um, we
were still like this, but we were when it comes
time to stage, it was like do a Die. But
the worst, the worst rival with was Charlie Wilson and

(01:00:18):
Roger Troutman, Zapp and Gap because computer love. No, me
and Roger were like this I'm talking about when I
say tight, Me and him was like this. The brothers,
his brothers, his brothers and my brothers. They did not

(01:00:39):
like me and Roger to be tight. They did not
want it. Period. He tells about Larry because that's every
of every artist, of all the artists we've had on
this show, that could have told us Larry Troutman stories
we've not asked, especially with like because I know that
Zapp in the time had rivalries as well. What was

(01:01:04):
it like with with the Troutman clan and working with him?
And it was great? It was, I mean, you know,
just like I said, me and Roger was so tight.
It was. But Roger had the edge because he was
using a talk box and so a nice Tims, you're cheating,
you ain't singing out every night? No, he was had

(01:01:26):
had a talk box, so I mean, so he would
say he just grabbed my throat like this. Well he
would also do tricks like he were the the underwear
that lit up and he had they did crazy tricks
and concert Yeah, So why why is it that when

(01:01:47):
I want to hear Computer Love now it's I'm about
to say, Gwyn Guthrie, Shirley Murdoch singing your parts. There's
two versions of Computer Love, and for some reason your
your vocals are not on the They come in at
the end, they come into the ad libs even yeah

(01:02:08):
yeah on the fade out. Why is that? Well, it's
like this, oh God, the big beginning of the relationship
with that record and the way they took basically they
I went head a tape and I played it for
the total experience lining and it was like that ain't
never hit and so wait minute something? Uh? I said, Okay,

(01:02:33):
I think he was kind of little upset going on clock.
So they didn't. So who told you to go saying yeah?
But anyway, didn't like it? I said, So you don't
matter if it comes out there ain't gonna be no hit.
I was like, okay, we didn't have a hit at
the time. So the record came out about two about

(01:02:56):
a year and a half later, Yes it did, and
from the time I had got to the cassette it
was a year and a half later. But I thought
the record was gonna come out fast, and it did,
but it didn't. And then when it did, it's just
shooting up the church. But they didn't want to say
featuring Charlie Wilson because they hadn't gotten they no, you know,
so no Clearton things. So it's just me and just

(01:03:17):
so I'm on there. So it goes when it gets
to like number four or three somewhere, they suited him
and made him take my vocal off. Uh yeah. So
and then of course they had to scramp scram around
and try to get another version. And by that time
you're in the top five. Man, I mean, the record
is already, it's out there, beasts, And so they put

(01:03:39):
the Shirley Murdock version out and then um and it
stayed there for a minute, and I think it just
started on the way because people used to the other version.
You just can't just throw another version and having it
having having that doesn't doesn't matter who's singing it. And
no dispect to Shirley Marder, because she was killing that
was that was, but that version was already out, you know,

(01:04:01):
and to married to that version. So then it started
taking a die. But everybody always knew that record doesn't
matter when they stopped. But anyway, Uh, the record end
up being such a great record. And um, every time
Roger would see me, if if if he looked on
the side and saw me while he was doing the record,

(01:04:23):
he would stop to band boom, Okay, this record would
not be possible without this guy. It would not be
possible without this man. Right. He looking at me and
I'm like, don't do it, don't do it without this man.
So without further do on account three, I want you

(01:04:44):
all to hear me call his name. And so I
would go up there and kick my own ass because
we had to perform after that. So the man coming
together because it was a rap after that, Me and
Roger come on, Yeah, we just slaughtered the place. When

(01:05:08):
you talk about Shirley Murdoch, um incredible. Yeah. The producer
for STBV, Brian Allison the Morgan, was a huge fan,
and he talks about how his whole idea for s
w V was that he wanted to take your melody
and he kind of saw Coco as like a Shirley
Murdoch and like weak. He went weak for you. It

(01:05:32):
was for Charlie. Yeah, because we already had a song
was that same melody, We had a record already that
So he took that one and made it. Did you
catch that? And the initial inception like that sounds familiar?
Did he tell you in hindsight, you know, I wrote
this as a tribute to you. You are my huh yeah,

(01:05:57):
everything to me. You are my pride. So he so
weak at the knee. As as a Capitol record, so
I mean, I mean the last one of the last
Gap Band records, and so a total experience I think
seven six or seven seventh somewhere there. So he just
straight took that same melody and just I mean it,

(01:06:17):
GE's so weak. But Brian wanted to write for me
and we just never got a chance to get around
to that. But he had great success with the SWV
Man good so with Gap in four, with with Early
in the Morning, and and and you dropped the bomb
war me and very unlikely outstanding because it's weird because

(01:06:38):
I purchased I found my baby Well, no back that one. No,
but I'm saying that. You know at the time when
I when I got Gap in four, I didn't realize that,
you know, to me, outstanding was just quality, quality filler. Right.
I didn't see it as might be the biggest single

(01:07:01):
of his career. I was just like, oh, it's closing
side to when did you drop the side too? Let's
get to that. But I mean, how is that when
you wrote outstanding in your head? Did you realize that
this was going to dominate every two step barbecue in
the history of black gatherings when that record was Yeah,
I when I we was working on that record Men

(01:07:23):
the Drama Cat and when we was working on that record,
it felt so so so good to me that it
was like I couldn't believe that the vibe on it
that was that man and had so much emptiness love
that was there. It's just it was so you know,
it was that's the space and of it was just great.

(01:07:45):
And I didn't know it was gonna be around that long,
but I know it felt so good to me, and
it was sounding like the best record at that when
that album to me was like that was the best
record to me. But you know, and then it just
everybody started sampling and using it. Did you did you
guys work on both versions, like the remix and album
version at the same time. Uh? No, So you did

(01:08:08):
the remix in hindsight after the album was done, and yes, okay,
that's that's why I wanted to know. All right, I
have a question about you dropped the bomb on me.
So American Music Awards Night two, you guys are performing.
You dropped the bomb on me. Now I'm watching this

(01:08:29):
on a small black white television quest of supreme listeners.
At one time you everything wasn't in platte. We don't
say wow like you remember, all right, thank you. I
thought you're trying to disassociate yourself from my age. Anyway,
at the last twenty seconds of that performance, something so

(01:08:54):
miraculous happened, and I cannot believe the world didn't rave
over it. I thought it was you. I think he
told me he was your trumpet player. Someone did the moonwalk,
h and I'm looking at my mom and my dad
like do you see this? He's walking like this is
this is a year before Michael Jackson did at Motown.

(01:09:19):
At the very end, either was it you? Was it? Now?
I was this kid that I found. His name was
Baby Gap, and I named him Baby Gap. Okay because
he's also dancing on Deeper Free. Okay, now makes sense? Okay,
maybe he had the same outfit on you, but literally
he just grabs the mic stand and he does just
the most exaggerated moonwalk, like even more exaggerated than Michael Jackson.

(01:09:41):
And I was like, how's the world not seeing this
right now? Like why? And the next day in school
was like, did y'all see this there? Like it was
like snuffle up against like he was walking backwards but
from okay, yeah, and the way it's like, I don't
don't want to deflate Michael's but he used to come
to the shows and how in the corner on the

(01:10:01):
stage and watching watch and watch watch baby Gap do
it and how he did it and everything, and but
that told story was never never told. Did it first?
That the battle? Because dude from Shalimar he claims that
he created it too. I mean, yes he did. Daniels
went to this house. But I'm telling you, if they

(01:10:23):
did it on the American music World, then I'm like,
then they must have been doing a lot in the world,
must have seen that. But they That was the first
time I saw a commercial artist, not not like a
dancer on soul Train or whatever. It was the first
time that it was nationally and national, Yes, scene was
by us and we was the first at that particular show,

(01:10:46):
was the first black artist you ever had pyro as well,
we had power and other only somebody's had power was
Kissed and then they just for saying that we couldn't
use the pyro. And then that's when I said, well,
well why does kiss he use the pyro? And the
guy was like, so we're using pyro? Are you didn't
get the band? So it was like one of those
shook night moves and so we so we had pyro.

(01:11:10):
It was the first ones to have that on American
musical or black. I don't know if it's just contractual whatever,
but for some reason, Gap BM five is nowhere to
be found, like not on streaming, not on reissues. Is
it was that just like a in your eyes like
a stillborn child or it's party Train was on that

(01:11:31):
album and it was it's like some the big records
was there and I'm ready, you're ready, like yeah, that's
that's um, it's so hard to find. Yeah, it's I
don't quite no, it's just it's yeah, it's like controlled
it with gold. It was just like, is Lonnie Simmons

(01:11:53):
still alive now or he is still alive, for my force,
for my knowledge. So does he still control the masters
and all? It's not I don't like no. So he
sold it out okay, probably through Universal. So now we
gotta get to I'll Find My Baby. Yeah, so was
I Found My Baby? Was that a song? Where was

(01:12:16):
it like accidental words like you realize like, oh man,
I did the same song already or was it intentionally
trying to follow up outstanding? Well, it wasn't my idea
to do that, but it was somebody's ideas, like give
me another of course. And uh, you know, I was
telling like, dude, listen, that record is already too big.
You want to you don't want to fool that shoe

(01:12:37):
is big. Put your foot in that shoe two now
where sas ten is not gonna fit. He didn't understand
what I was talking about, but he tried it, so
I tried it with him, and and uh, I don't
know if you remember the video. Do you remember that?
I remember where someone's kid was missing. They were handing
out flyers. Yeah yeah, but did you see the street version?

(01:12:59):
I mean what we was in the street doing the charography.
Did you see the news clip when I got knocked
out you never seen that, boy, I see I remember
it long ago on video Jupox. Wait you got knocked out? Yeah, man,
so what so so listen, we're we're going down the street.

(01:13:22):
All the whole group is going. So baby Gap is flipping.
He's supposed to flip, right, so he's flipping. And so
when I back up, when it comes right down on
the top of my head with a flip, and uh, man,
I was just out. I was. I was more embarrassed.
I was more embarrassed that I hit this concrete than anything.

(01:13:44):
And they still on the video. I don't know they didn't.
It was on the news. It was on the news
because the news cameras there because we had shut the
street down and so the news was there and they
called it the on it And anyway, I remember laying there,
uh and I was like, and I watched everybody's feet

(01:14:07):
come but I was I was more embarrassed to get
up than anything. So I just laid there. So, okay,
there's there's there's another song on the Gap being sixth
record that I've been dying to know about, probably Boss
Bill too, not being Freak. I love being Freak. By
the way you do that dude, that was the soul
trained staple. That's my song. However, a very interesting song

(01:14:33):
and an even more interesting video. Now I had to
do some purple investigation and purple investigation and oh yeah,
you know, I know where you're going. Well, I forgot
about this until just now. Uh So there's a song
called Disrespectful that has a very interesting video depicting y'all

(01:14:58):
killing the stage and this rather height challenge. Height challenged
the rock star with the buffont and the two big
bodyguards acting disrespectful. I will never forget this video. The
second I saw Alan Leads, I was like, yo, the

(01:15:18):
Prince and Charlie Wilson ever have be for something, because
what's the Have you ever seen a disrespectful video? It's
it's like it's it's it's animated. It's not even lyrics.
It's I don't even think there's lyrics to it's sort
of like almost like there there, let's take it to
the stage song where he's talking sack And so I
asked Alan Leads, Princess store manager at the time, I

(01:15:39):
was like, okay, So the song came out in eighty four,
I said, did something happen between princes and Charlie Wilson
that made this song come up like disrespectful, and Alan
could remember. He's like, I don't know, it's maybe Charlie
wanted to sing on stage with princes something. What is
what is the origin of disrespectful? And can I do that?

(01:16:01):
It was directed every he your chance chance to dance
to disrespect you won't let me on. But what happened. Well,
I love Prince Man, we all love prince and this
is the hindsight and this is that song, this song
thirty years ago. So yeah, it's uh and so hey, man,
see this beef. We can talk about um. I mean

(01:16:28):
we always talked about He's always like, man, he's my
favorite band and all of that. And and then once
I saw him, I treated some young kids and and
it was just like, how is it. I was like,
you're not gonna even You're not gonna even take the picture.
You're not gonna. I was looking. I was like, that's wrong.
And then it was like I've seen things happen, and

(01:16:48):
I've seen it was like you walk past me and
don't say nothing, and you are just like and then
we're supposed to do some stuff together and and you
change your mind and it's like had me all hyped
and and it's like, okay, so like I gotta get
that you got. I gotta go on on cut you now.

(01:17:09):
Imout to cut you now because I know you. I
know you am about to cut you now, say and
so you know. And then somebody from my click, um,
some crew members he called and I think my room
or something, and some crew members answered the phone. I

(01:17:30):
had already left, and and they said something that was
to him that was not right. And I fired those
guys because when they said what they said, I filed
him right on the spot. But they shouldn't have said that.
And I think he might have took offense to that too,
so and um, hey man anyway, but it's just we

(01:17:54):
never not not not got along. Um. And he was
just like Stevios, you know you got the big head.
But anyway, y'all never had to come to Jesus moment
either though. No, no, not not really. I mean we
could have, we could have, but at the time I
was I was in my disease of getting high and um,

(01:18:17):
and it's like and he was waiting on me and
and I said, I'm coming, I promise you I'll beat
up are you coming from about covering? I'll bow my weight.

(01:18:39):
So five minutes turned into whatever. So when I did
get that, he was already gone and and so got
me back. So when we played Glam Slam and Prince
coming down, I said, okay, I forgot about when I
was getting half. But I was so many heads I went,
and I think he probably thought I was doing it
on purpose. That was not on purpose. It's like, hey,
So I sit there, looked at the door to body

(01:19:02):
steal there with his head phone. I said, he's coming,
See hey coming. He's notorious for that though. Yeah. So
finally I looked at the hallway and gone. Everybody was
going in the building. I was like, then I thought
back like two years ago, I was like, uh, you
got okay. So I never got a chance to talk
to him. I send message to him about it after
I was sober some of the years. Hey, man, that

(01:19:24):
wasn't done on purpose. Man, you know that part of
the process, right yeah, yeah, so hey, and then but anyway,
I'm gonna leave him alone right now because I got
caught up talking about him one time. His fans told
me up. So I don't want to go back to that.
I'm alive. I testified and tell people that I'm I
was on drugs and that that that's why I'm alive.

(01:19:45):
I remember you. It was this was a couple of
years ago when Casey and Jojo had uh their reality show,
and you were talking to them just about sobriety, and
you told him straight up, just like, listen, this is
gonna you're gonna be out on tour and it's gonna
be someone offering you a drink and you ain't gonna
be able to say no, you don't be able to
turn it down. How have you Because at the time
when when we met, this was years ago, the Grammys

(01:20:07):
in and you were performing at the Pretails and when
this is when my bendform Exchange nominated and we met
real briefly and then you performed at the Pretails and
killed it. And I remember at the end you was like,
you know, I beat prostate cancer twenty years old, Like
you were just going in, So, how have you you know,
enable to tour and everything? How what does that daily

(01:20:28):
walk of sobriety like for you? I got my wife
with me, so she's uh, she's rehab and so we
were just like and for so many years she was,
I guess known as the enemy, and uh, because she
was just stopping. Don't matter of family, people don't matter.
How long have you guys been married? Every single day,

(01:20:50):
twenty four hours a day, were together. But it's like,
it's like when she told me she would be with me,
you know, and whatever, no matter what that that. I
was young when I was heard those those words. But
you know, within young being like wanting to be in
love with somebody, for real love you. So, so when

(01:21:12):
I finally got it, I understood it, and so I
just let her have the way of whatever it is.
You know, hey, man, you who is that? Now? There's
no backstage. I don't care who it is. So and
so people used to come and sneak things and hide
them in my hand. I'm like, man, I don't get
hid no more. I heard that, but why are you
putting it in my hand? If you heard that? You know?

(01:21:33):
So after that, she heard me say that, so she
she cut everybody. Didn't matter who was, kids don't matter no. Now, y'all,
wright is she writing songs? You guys write songs together?
Then she writes like every song, Yeah, she's writing with me.
Now She's like, because I sometimes I have problems, you know,

(01:21:55):
trying to figure out what I want to say, and
she's she has something just saying she writes them for me,
and and like if I'm singing the vocals or something,
and um, I'm coming, and I'm I'm I'm, I'm going down,
I'm getting my things when i'm I'm really I'm getting
going into it fall as I'm concerned. Then I look
up and she's talking to the engineer and I'm looking.

(01:22:18):
I'm like, dude, you're not stopping, so you push the
button here, man, we gotta start over. I'm like, oh,
my man, you're serious. She's like a man, hey, talk
to your wife. She said, you ain't put it down right.
You ain't doing hard enough. So I'm like, wow, that's
better you be. That's bed half. So that was the
first time when I first heard dad, I was like, wow,

(01:22:39):
So can I just get warmed up first? I'm just
getting warmed up. She's like, no, you're gonna saying you're
saying so. So obviously, as as music fans and geeks
that we are, you know, a lot of the stuff
that we're talking about with you, you know, these are

(01:23:00):
like the highlights of our lives. But I mean for
every person's highlight, that could be your personal hell. How
you know I've read the part of your life when
you you were homeless, and like how how does it
get to that point where it's just like like what

(01:23:21):
was that first night light? That first night like for you?
When well, first of all, you don't probably you don't,
thank you, that's your homeless said that you might be
at somebody how smoking all night, and you might be somebody.
You're just there and some some some spot. You know
what I'm saying, you're there, and then then the next
day you don't even it's like nowhere to go left

(01:23:41):
that spot. So I ain't got one mo ago. So
you're just there and because of who you are, you
could be there un't even register at you. You don't
register that way until you feel guilty. And you're gonna
leave out of there now. If you leave out of
there now, where you're going? So now at nighttime, you
can probably get in any of those doings dope door
dope pimps whose ever doors, because they know who I

(01:24:04):
am and so and after you think you can where
you're welcome, my thin, then you go somewhere and pretty soon. Uh,
at the end of the day, then where you're gonna
because I didn't move by day it was about nine night,
you know, and so and so if you left there,
and then where you're going. So after you found the

(01:24:24):
found some cool place to lay down and nobody's looking
at you. So that's where you did it off. Somebody
was homeless and they had some perfect spot and between
some shopping carts and later put that brick there and
put a little piece of carpet and they said, going

(01:24:45):
there and put stuff around it so nobody can see.
It was me in there, and that's that's where I slept.
And how does it go from because we we spoke
briefly off air when you were saying, how y'all weren't
really making a lot of money off the total experience
stuff or none money? But so was this was pretty

(01:25:06):
much the only source of income just from touring and shows.
I handled him. Come wow, So not even the sampling
of outstanding back in the day, don't I'm talking, I
don't have it was coming so Jesus man, I see wow. Wow.
My questions I will read the fine print. Uh. One

(01:25:27):
question I have for you was in regards to like
covers of your songs when people cover your stuff. Um,
two of some of my favorite gap band songs I've
discovered through the cover and then I went back and
hear the original and uh Mary Mary j she covered
I'm in Love and then Jacket Edge they covered Wednesday
Love Him. What did you think of those covers? I
thought they were great, But what did you as the

(01:25:47):
songwriter within It's like it's it was. It made me
feel proud. I mean, when there's another generation is recording
your records. I was just really happy about the fact
that that that and then Mary So I don't know,
Mellia or two re records all for that albums. And
so my brother he was the primary writer, so he
was happy, and because they actually he got paid. But

(01:26:10):
at that time, some kind of way he was doing
this thing. And but um, Jacket Edge, of course that
was another group that was I had I hadn't, I
guess inspired. So I was happy about that that somebody
was recording now records. I mean I could rerecord those records.
I mean I can say that you were already done.

(01:26:31):
You don't go back and redo your own records. I
just didn't feel that way unless you was doing it
for um uh publisher, the ownership of the songs. You
could record them and just there now they belong to you,
you know, the re recorded version. Yeah, but I was,
I was. I enjoyed, man, I was glad that people
were doing it, and you know, I wasn't angry at all.

(01:26:54):
In two thousand four, I think it was two thousand
four you covered less Chill. Yeah, I'm not fool people
with that. When I do, I put it on and
they're like, right, well, the reason I did it is
because he had done Unine at one time, they did
Young Young, like, this is one of my favorite records,
So I'll do this one, and I just did it.

(01:27:17):
Do you have like, because I know you've done a
lot of features, do you have number one? Have you
said no? And is there requirements in your mind to
what you will not do? Uh? Uh? I've been pretty
I've stayed uh in my lane pretty much, um meaning

(01:27:38):
you know R and B adult contemporary, and that lane
is no. I paved a way of some what nobody
was really you know before um, that lane was just
really like being used a lot. Now I think we
came in and just busted the place up and so
I've been very happy there. And uh, I don't think

(01:28:00):
I would just be trying to do a hip hop
record so um, although I've sang on a lot of
hip hop records, but Charlie Wilson, I don't think I
would be doing a hip hop record or something for
some twelve years. I can't what is that for me?
And I won't do that. People. Well, I'm I was young,

(01:28:20):
oh you know, man, I was a kid. But basically,
but it won't be no young Charlie Wilson, like, now
we're not doing that. I wouldn't. I wouldn't. I wouldn't
cross that line. And to try to to do do
it for what, you know, just like to disappoint the
fans that by the physical sales all the time for
me are download of streams for me. They mean, why
would I do that? Now I would go and sing

(01:28:40):
with and he may are you know, you know, tied
up the curator just you know, because they asked me
to come sing on some records, I'll do that and
and and basically their fans are buying their there is
not my fans ain't going to try to look for
see what I'm saying. So in that moment, what I'm
gonna be what Tyler want me to be at that moment.

(01:29:03):
So whatever I have, whatever I'm saying, whatever it is,
then that's what we're doing together at that moment. He's
on the ground anyways, he got his own friend. So
how surreal is it? Too? I mean, you've done something
that not many rappers have been able to do. You've
actually transcended generations of hip hop artists, whereas you know,

(01:29:30):
doing the stuff with Snoop and and and and Death
Row Family then and now even twenty five years after that,
still going strong with stuff on Kanye's record and working
a girl that girl. Um yeah, So I mean, how
the how surreal is Are you ever surprised now when

(01:29:51):
you get a call like from a nineteen year old? Yeah? Yeah,
I mean I was. I've turned a few of them down.
I was like, man, and I know it's like they said,
but he's up and coming. I said, I'm up, still
up and coming, but I'm not gonna be I'm not
coming over there. So it's just like this, give me
a minute to just take a moment to relax and
breathe and let me see what it is that just

(01:30:12):
guys doing this kid's doing. You know what I'm saying,
I just don't want to be the hook guy for
every up and coming guy. So it's like, you know,
I mean, I I mean, I gotta understand what the
worth is here and and and for peoples, A man,
you just would you do it for me? And then
when they asked me what I do it for him?
And then I think about, okay, what I'm lending to them,
and I was like, this would be great for the kid,

(01:30:33):
and he wants to It's something he gonna never forget.
And that's the reason why I say yeah, Because if
I go to a room where nineteen year old kid
and and his mom or his mom are always talked
about me, and they listen to all the records that
I've done with Kanye of for Real or Snoop or
you know whoever you know, master p back in those days,
whoever it was, you know, so they get a chance

(01:30:53):
to have that same thing. So then I started obliging
because I would think about what I felt like when
somebody was to turn me down. And so that's the
reason why I go this is also a good problem
to have, though. It's a good problem because if they
don't call you at all? Then, then where you be?
Do you do you now feel as though you're in
somewhat of endangered species territory? Because singing right now isn't

(01:31:20):
really a factor in black music now, because I mean,
if you thought the top box was cheating and auto
tune is you know what I mean been talent? I
mean words, I mean just basic things that melody structure. Yeah,
it's it's it's almost as if it's kind of like

(01:31:41):
the things fall apart story with it. The warrior, the
very skilled warrior comes back to its homeland and recognize it.
It sees that you know, it's it's changed. So I mean,
do you now feel do you send? Do you do
you sing with a sense of purpose that like there's
only a few of us left. There's you, There's Ronald
eis Lee, there is Stevie. Stevie. I mean, how do

(01:32:05):
you how do you feel just in terms of your
craft and where it stands now in two thousand and sixteen,
Whereas personally you're fine, but just as the art and
the craft itself and where we're singing and the traditional

(01:32:28):
black singing is concerned might be an endangered species, Like
do you have thoughts about that, and well I have
never I haven't really really thought about it in that way,
but I do. I do saying to protect the brand.
I protect my brand and protect the R and B
vibe of of of of my life. That's what it is.
And R and B I saying to protect that. And

(01:32:49):
for those who are who can't get that done, then
I'm the only one out here doing it, and so
I have to protect it. And and I go hard
every time I go, and they try to make sure
I'm correct with it and not to try to to
let the our community down of of of R and
B and and what it is. And you haven't trust me,
you haven't, you you know, I just I'm just trying

(01:33:11):
to protect the brand. Man, It's my brand first and
then and then of course you know, I know how
it is what it is now this day, even compared
to like a couple of years ago, a few years ago,
are ten years ago, it's totally different now. And if
you're not smart enough to uh to grasp hold what's
going on now, man, you're gonna definitely left behind. And

(01:33:32):
so amen, streaming is in and and you know, come on, man,
anybody who foughty years or fifty years or ain't streaming.
Basically they screaming, but they ain't streaming. What did they
streaming at that? They're not even that they bare again
they've giving it stuff to their granddaughter to come on, man,

(01:33:53):
this is the technology is moving fast. And if you're
not moving fast with the technology and things, what things
are being done? I mean I have a number one
gospel record now because of the way things are done.
I was number one that I'm blessed. It was number
debut at number one, and you got these gospels, some
of these gospel always been on the trust for twenty
nine weeks and picking the number four and then I

(01:34:14):
gave you at number one. Hello. So is it safe
to say, on the back of his question that if
you when you are working with certain R and B
or soul artists, that they must be the ship thing,
because then you look at Layla Hath the way you
picked Layla, you pick Robin Thick. So in your mind,
these are people who to you might be on that
line of longevity. No, I only picked those people because
they always wanted to sing with me, and I just

(01:34:35):
never gave I never had the time to put them on.
And so when I was making these records, I started
naming the people that said asked me what I sing
with him? And so that's what I did. And so
you still got a little bit of a list left
to then because a lot of people we ain't done
the Charlie Wilson, I haven't. I haven't got you that here.

(01:34:56):
It's like it's I have I have a lot a
lot of people I still want to work with. It's
like I asked, I asked quest. He just I don't
know if you heard. He just said yeah. I asked him, last,
did it's gonna happen? Yeah? I asked him when we did?
When the fall in the last time, I said, man,
we gotta get this record on and said, you gott
We're gonna get that done. So I had really got

(01:35:16):
done that yet, you got You gotta understand that the
first time he came and sat him with us, there
wasn't even introductions, like we were just versing his songs,
like recapitulating his songs. Uh, and then he just stormed
like he stormed in our room like the cool aight man,
like through the wall and just grab him. It was

(01:35:49):
something like that, Yeah, you it wasn't even not because
you gotta understand, you know, the way they play, and
this room is small. And when I walked in, you
should you should hear how it sounds, man, everything it
sounds like a freaking record in for there. You know.
I'm like, hey, man, we got got right on top
of that. I was like, hey, to be like that

(01:36:18):
joker had that thing sounding good and it ain't no
lie he do. He hadn't sounded so good up and
I got it going on. Give him some props on that,
and and uh, you know, you know all those guys,
you know, Quiz got all those guys. Man, those guys
just playing up and then they're not fooling around and
um and so to hear that back like that, and
then they had a vocal on that year. I just
went in, not even warming up, but a little bit

(01:36:38):
warming up downstairs and uh and down the hall and
I just went in on it and so and he
should already recording and then uh he had and they
said get that. So it was the greatest entrance of
all time. There was no first name, Charlie, last name.
Will always was curious about I'm gonna get your sucker,

(01:37:01):
And yeah, I don't get your Sucker and uh, you're
so cute. I really like, how did that come about?
How did you We were in It was in the
studio and I forgot abou I'm Gonna Get your Sucker
movie was going and uh, they asked us to do
becauld we do this soundtrack? But then they said you
only have a few hours. Oh yeah. Man. It was

(01:37:26):
like it's like, okay, we want you to do it.
But I said, they don't really want us to do that. Man,
see you got like two hours to do it. You
say no. They were said, they probably say they can't
do it right. When this one was about this drugs,
They're not gonna be able to do it. Everybody said
get to get in. It's like because you know, uh,
the Wind Brothers they you know, it's like get the
get bit. You know, they do it. They said, well, okay,

(01:37:49):
give them two hours to do it. I said be
back and I was like we started on the Vibu.
It's like be back, be back in two hours, and
so on home. I mean when they came back within

(01:38:09):
an hour, the guy was like, are you kidding me?
It's like no, man, push play. And then it was
like I didn't really mind. I just turned and walked
off because I knew, did you you're trying to you know,
you're trying to underestimate me. Man. So me and my
brothers was like, let's get the thing done and then
the next record. Can you give another one? You don't know,

(01:38:29):
no time frame on it. Can you give me another record?
I was like, yeah. When I was at the house
there and had the studio inside the front room, and
then and I wanted to play move again so bad
to get to you. Did you know that thing I
wanted to play? And you know, yeah, never ever you know,

(01:38:54):
so I we did that one and hand that one
in and it was like we love them both, and
so just giving my day money. Wait a minute before
we stopped, I totally forgot we had mentioned Mercedes Boy. Yeah,
was what was that experience like? Because I initially thought
Ellian Face did it when? And I forgot that you

(01:39:16):
were you wrote that? Was she your artist? First store?
Thank you? I gotta figure out I'm sorry. I was
a great song. It was a great song, and that

(01:39:37):
was your first pop I mean, your first top ten Yeah,
and then and then you know was so and then
after she had went there, I caught pneumonia. Well, I
caught pneumonia and I went down and then she had
met them and then she was so she was initially
your artist. Well we were yeah at the time, okay, okay,

(01:40:01):
and then you intended on producing that whole way. I
produced the whole album produced. The only thing they put
was girlfriend and another record that Andre s okay, no shade,
but Babyface said it was another whole big dude, not
that I'm just just it was a big she had
another never mind it was popular. Yeah, yeah, yeah, take

(01:40:24):
a little right there. Unnecessarily because they heard the b
I rolling right now? Is everything right now? That w
he just killed the new stands. We had to getting
pepples on the show's over? Thank you? Ye? So you
did that record? You did? Did I did the whole album?

(01:40:46):
Have we everything? Any death real questions? Well? Yeah, I
was the dog father, like how because you was all
over that album. And to me, that was when I
guess I won't say come back, but I mean because
that wasn't a very successful record for Snoop, but that
was it was great. Yeah yeah, And it was shot
out his boss Bill for even bringing that back into

(01:41:08):
my parameter because I think none of us gave the
dog a chance because of this at giving a chance,
because Drey wasn't on it, and because New like consciously
turned down the whole gangster element of the record. So right,
and it was and I went back to it. It's
a great record. It's a really great record. And I
was like, man, Charlie all over this, he singing his hands.

(01:41:28):
How did you you guys hook up at that time? Well,
man Snoop was up and of course you know we
were close. And um, I met him in ninety five
ninety six, and I doesn't runt time. I was just
getting clean, sober, and when I was just s been
in his life since then. But while I was getting sober,

(01:41:51):
I was sober and just you know, my new life.
I'm living out this new life in the beginning parts
of it, I'm with him, And um, why Snoop, I'm Snoop.
I'm sorry you guys came smoke that around. He was like,
what it's like, you gotta put that out. Everybody that

(01:42:14):
was parking, everybody, she made everybody put it out. He's
not coming in there. You gotta put it all out.
So uh, just a beautiful thing. So we Um I
was there and I just started singing with him, and um,
of course, um, I just took over where um Nate
Dog you know left off. And basically, you know, it
was the whole thing was falling aparts, basically, and me

(01:42:39):
and Nate was to do to do a record together
that never happened that we never got a chance. And
he asked me like a couple of few times, and
I said, okay, let's do it. I was, of course,
you know, I'm I'm beginning to start working now and
and I didn't get a chance to get back over
there fast enough. And uh, we talked on the phone.

(01:43:00):
I said we're gonna do it. Let's do it next
week and he said okay. Then he had a struck.
Damn wow. I missed that, man. I missed that. Dude.
He was very and he had some great ideas of
how we could do it too, and it was would
have been the bomb, his vocal sound and my little sound.
It was just been like, are there any other collaborations

(01:43:23):
that we couldn't I did. I was pocket that was
there and when the day I was in the studio
and I think he had just mentioned my name with
like three seconds and I opened the door and when
they turned around, everybody was jumping up and down and
I was like, what's going on. I'm looking around and
he was like, I just called your name. Just now.

(01:43:43):
If Charlie will was here, we could fuck this place.
And then and I and I was like, he said
I got this idea and listened to and I was like, wow,
that's one of mine. It was like yeah, yeah, we're
flipping it. And he said can you do this? When
I was like yeah, but I mean it was snoopy
in three minutes. I can't do it in three And
I said I'll do it. And I went over there

(01:44:03):
with snooping and and uh again after that again then
podat kill you know, after that? Wow, sou So, what's
the future for Uncle Charlie Wilson. Do you like us
when we call you Uncle Charlie Wilson's yeah, it's okay, man,

(01:44:29):
listen quest man. I just I'm just so blessed to
be here at now. Of what I'm doing now, it
doesn't matter what it is. Um, I'm the only guy
that's ever come out of a group that late to
try to do something solo because everybody turned me down.
And it was like dude, come on there, you serious?

(01:44:51):
I'm like, yeah, but I mean that was really wells
way past the actual you know, of trying to do
something that I thought would happen and it ended up
had and in any way, and I've been having number
one since then and since two thousand and seventeen already,
so every year I was putting out a record, so
almost you know. So, but but it's I don't know

(01:45:13):
what's what's what's for me next? Man? I just I
just thank god. I just go from day to day
and and my management, P music group, my compare and
led by him, and and you know, it's just you know,
and Sonya Muckle and and and that whole staff and
and Michael and everybody is just doing things for me

(01:45:34):
and and I just get up when they put it together.
I get up and go do it. And I would
love to do this movie, you know, the movie. And uh,
and so I can tell all the other stuff that
I didn't sell in the book and stuff that I
didn't say today. It's just like it's so much, it's
so much to this to me and and that uh
haven't got a chance to to to say and get
out of my spirit and and uh not just just

(01:45:57):
cut my own face off or whatever. But hey, the
truth is the truth, and so if I'm gonna tell
the truth on you, it can help you tell the
truth on me, you see. So. But I'm not like
to point the thing. I'm just gonna tell the truth
and just have And it's gonna some of that's gonna
make me look bad. Hey, I can't make me. I
can't make me look bad because I'm looking too good
right now. So you're looking good, yeah, looking good? So

(01:46:20):
I can't make me look bad. You have children, You
have kids, man, the man kids and grown folks. How
many asks me for cars? And she asked me, I
ain't ask me. I want houses and cars. And I'm like, hey, god,
damn brother break holder held man. They old, No, I'm

(01:46:47):
just saying it might be a young man, young but um,
but you know, I'm I'm looking for him. I look
at their kids, like, what you want? Come on now,
I give you what you want? Can they thing too? Uh?
One of my daughters could say, and she just never did,
and the other one just toned deaf and their act

(01:47:07):
like she can say, I can't bull, I'm sorry. That's
like it's like a. It's like a dark skin in
the bar and I'm like, oh daddy, I'm like, okay,

(01:47:28):
that's just worse. Yeah, I'm sorry. You just can't be
right there with the dark all right. Well, thank you
uncle Charlie for doing my show. Shut up, it's been
a dream man. Thank you. Man. Should we even do reflections?
I mean I think, yeah, that's it. You know what
I'm saying. I can't look bad because I'm looking too good.

(01:47:49):
That's a life quote right there. That is well on
behalf of Fantacolo. Uh like yeah, Boss Bill, Unpaid Bill
and Sugar Steve and the great Charlie Bullson. This is
quest Love of Question of Supreme. Silent off. We'll see
you in the next ground. Thank you. And when we
do this Guy Damn Roots and Child Wilson project, We're
gonna see y'all next time. Until we do this. Rocket

(01:48:21):
Courts Love Supreme is a production of I Heart Radio.
This classic episode was produced by the team at Pandora.
For more podcasts from my heart Radio, visit the I
Heart Radio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you listen to
your favorite shows.

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