QLS Classic: Stephen Hill

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Quest Love Supreme is a production of iHeartRadio. This classic
episode was produced by the team at Pandora. Ladies and Gentlemen,
My name is Questlove. That this is q LS classic.

Speaker 2 (00:13):
When we look back at classic Quest Love Supreme episode,
this one was a doozy. This is from December seventh,
twenty sixteen. However, the night that we've recorded this was
the night of the presidential elections. Kind of came to
the door thinking that then Senator Hillary Clinton had it

(00:35):
in the bag.

Speaker 1 (00:37):
And midway through the episode you.

Speaker 2 (00:39):
Just hear are yeah, And that's because, yeah, we found
out whose winner was going to be that night, and
we didn't know what America was in for anyway. Stephen Hill,
a good friend of the show, per former, et executive
and now you know general Love of Music, shares this

(01:01):
journey with us and it's an amazing show.

Speaker 1 (01:04):
I hope you enjoy.

Speaker 2 (01:05):
This is Stephen Hill or Quest Love Supreme Classic from
December seventh, twenty sixteen.

Speaker 3 (01:18):
Suprema Su Su Suprema Roll Call, Suprema.

Speaker 1 (01:23):
Sun Sun Supremo.

Speaker 4 (01:25):
Role Call.

Speaker 3 (01:26):
Suprema Sun Sun Supremo Roll Call, Suprema Sun Sun Supremo
Roll Call.

Speaker 1 (01:33):
My name is Quest Love. Yeah you're resident. Yeah nothing
the President.

Speaker 3 (01:43):
Sun Suprema Roll call Suprema Sun Sun.

Speaker 1 (01:47):
Suprema roll call. My name is Fonte. Yeah. My style
so elegant. Yeah.

Speaker 5 (01:53):
Some even say, yeah, I'm too intelligent, right, Suprema.

Speaker 1 (02:03):
My name is Stephen. Yeah, just like I guess. Yeah,
the only difference, Yeah, he's more well dressed.

Speaker 3 (02:14):
Supremo Supreme roll call Supreme Suprema.

Speaker 6 (02:20):
Ro still is my first name. Yeah, my middle name
is Earl. Yeah, waiting for some reruns yea of Cedar's World.

Speaker 3 (02:29):
Supreme Supreme roll called Supreme son So Supremo roll.

Speaker 7 (02:38):
Yeah, and I'm a little sad, Yeah because Obama gone. Yeah,
I miss her.

Speaker 3 (02:44):
Roll call Supremo something Supreme roll call Supremo Supreme roll.

Speaker 8 (02:53):
My name is Stephen, Yeah, I got that base.

Speaker 4 (02:56):
Yeah, I'm about to put Yeah, Supreme Supreme Suprema roll
Supreme Suprema roll.

Speaker 1 (03:20):
Give yourself? How you doing? Still ain't got fired yet?
Now we're still here. I'm shocked we are still here
after all this time. Ladies and gentlemen, what's up? Welcome
to another episode of Quest Love Supreme. I am your host,
Amir quest Lov Thompson, and we have another great show
for you this week. On the show, today, we have

(03:41):
the president of Programming at BT Networks, mister Stephen Hill.
We'll bring him on in a minute, but before we
do that, let's check in quickly with Team Supreme. How
you doing.

Speaker 5 (03:52):
Man, I'm good man. I had some foolish to jump
off at the crib. Yeah, some foolish to jump off
at the crib the day my uncle got shot. Whoa,
and so I gotta I gotta go home and like,
see what's up? He was shot in the stomach exit
through his back, and so.

Speaker 1 (04:13):
Yeah, just another day in the life, my brother. How
y'all doing? Forget about how are you doing? How's your
uncle doing? Right?

Speaker 4 (04:21):
Well?

Speaker 5 (04:21):
I mean he's he's well, he's in critical condition and
he's he's on a respirator I think. And so he
had a surgery and now he has I have another
surgery because it got h What was it hit is
it took some of his They had to take some
small intesting I think, and it hit some of it.

Speaker 1 (04:41):
But it exit, which is a good thing if it exits.

Speaker 5 (04:44):
But if it stays, that's like you're totally fucked if
it stays.

Speaker 1 (04:48):
But they had to take something small Intestine.

Speaker 5 (04:50):
But he's sixty four five and he already has like
some other health issues, so it's a lot so but
uh but no, but no that I mean, you know
this praise up for my uncle, you know what I mean?
And but but I'm good man. Everything else is everything
else is cool.

Speaker 1 (05:07):
Well, it's just that Fante is still spot on with
his dead pan humor. If you were just.

Speaker 6 (05:12):
Waiting for the punch on, my first response was to laugh. Yeah,
my uncle got shot.

Speaker 1 (05:19):
Yeah, I was like, wait a minute, no, I mean
you got no laughter.

Speaker 5 (05:25):
But but nah, man, he's uh, praise up for him.
But other than that, I'm cool, you know what I mean.
I'm in New York City. How's your family, Steve.

Speaker 1 (05:32):
They're not shot. I've not been shot, okay, No, just
you know, I want to make sure everyone's family. That's good.
It's good, Bill, you gouts.

Speaker 7 (05:43):
Yeah, everybody is alive, you know, and excited about this
new year.

Speaker 1 (05:48):
Yes, that's what it is. That's what we call it
new year.

Speaker 7 (05:52):
And I'm excited.

Speaker 1 (05:52):
What is this new year going to bring us? We
don't know. No, I'm just saying, you know, January special
for you. Well, it's you and I that's right, it's
special for you and I yeah.

Speaker 7 (06:04):
Well it's not here because as a woman when you
turn babies and no husband, it's a little different. But
quest love what your birthday?

Speaker 1 (06:12):
What was you gonna be like how I'm always out
of the country the way anybody wants to say gifts.
Here's the thing though, because usually around inauguration time, Uh,
my birthday falls on MLK Day and Inauguration Day, so
people just naturally forget it's my birthday. And uh, one

(06:32):
time when I turned thirty, I thought, oh, okay, you remember, okay,
light and I go way back to Philadelphia. So the
tasty treats collective, Yes, I thought, like, y'all mean and
Stacey were like, set me up for like a thirty birthday,
bast They were like, yeah, we used to spend next
next Sunday because you know, special night on Monday. And
you know, I thought it was my birthday, so I
wore suit, I was all happy, walked in the room

(06:54):
like surprise, there's no one in the room to embarrass
myself in front of my girls. I was just like
they so let's go and we went to VIP and
then I was like, oh, y'all really wanted me to
DJ tonight and there was like three people there, and I.

Speaker 7 (07:12):
Was like, that's the story of January twentieth, and our
birthday is what it is.

Speaker 1 (07:15):
Even even when Obama got inaugurated, not one person remembered
it was my birthday except for my mom my mom. No,
But I mean it was a historic day. So I forgive.

Speaker 5 (07:27):
That's almost like you know what, man, I had something
similar heavening to do me. That was almost like I
was married once in a former life, and our anniversary
just so happened to fall on the same day that
Michael Jackson died. Oh no, And so we went out, Yeah,
we went out. And we went out one night. I
used to throw a party downtown Raleigh and it was

(07:49):
just a regular, just just a dance party. And so
Mike died that day, and so and my party was
on Thursday. It was always on Thursday night. And so
Mike died that day, and so it was also our anniversary,
and so my wife at the time wanted to go out,
and she wanted to come with me to the party.
I said, Okay, cool, we'll come out, we'll celebrate whatever.
But Mike had died, and so I'm fucking Bill boss Bill.

(08:10):
He had a gig somewhere in Atlanta. He was in Atlanta,
and so he damn crying and shit, I'm in the phone.
I'm on the phone fucking like just cry. I'm like, dude,
why am I crying over Michael Jackson? But I was
fucked up? So we go out. Now, So we come
to the party. Everybody shows up. They got the Black
high Waters on with the white socks and the loafers
and everything, and so we just playing Mike all night

(08:32):
going in and my wife didn't really get that much attention.
So then later on as we divorced, as you probably
could gather, later on, she brought that up as a
bone content. She was like, I remember we went out
that night and it wasn't even our anniversary. Y'all was
celebrating Michael Jackson. And I just remember telling her. I
was like, yo, she tried to blame. She was celebrating

(08:54):
the Michael's life as well. No, no, it's not that that
was a callisquar divorce, but just as to say, well,
I f I wasn't. I didn't get my attention that night,
and I was and I was just like, listen, that's
Michael Jackson like, I mean we will hopefully have other anniversaries.
I mean we're not, but there's only one Michael Jackson like,
are you fucking kidding me? Like you didn't make Thriller?

(09:19):
I mean you brought me a son into the world.

Speaker 1 (09:21):
Okay?

Speaker 7 (09:21):
Cool?

Speaker 5 (09:21):
Like right, you brought you gave me a son, all right?
That ship wasn't off the wall though, so that was
kind of you know, you could see why Barrys maybe
didn't last.

Speaker 1 (09:32):
But we're great friends now and it's cool. But but nah,
I hear you.

Speaker 5 (09:35):
Whenever big events happened, you kind of can't compete with that,
and you just got to accept it.

Speaker 1 (09:39):
Wait, I didn't know that I can compare real life
relationship matters with our classic albums. Look at my face
light up right now? I had kind of this dinner
was okay, but you know it wasn't no purple. You
know it might have been love sex. You know, chicken

(10:00):
was real love. Joe.

Speaker 7 (10:01):
Wait, you you gotta announce this, this amazing laugh that
we got in the room because I don't think we
didn't said about our guest is up in here with us?

Speaker 1 (10:09):
Listen, yes, where is Yes, let's do it? Like, well,
since you.

Speaker 7 (10:15):
Oh, don't make me do it.

Speaker 1 (10:16):
The man, because I know you're like ladies and.

Speaker 7 (10:20):
Gentlemen, boys and girls. The man who has shaped the
narrative of one of the first black TV channel in
our nation. The man that gave us the Real Prince Tribute.

Speaker 1 (10:33):
Hello.

Speaker 7 (10:34):
The man that kept Team some of the life for
a little bit, because I'm sure he was there for
that long, gave us Sita, the man, Rap City, Joe Claire,
Chris Thomas, Rachel Caribbean rhythms, jam b E t So
Uh real husbands of Hollywood. Uh, step Hills here, y'all? Wow,

(10:57):
I mean see.

Speaker 1 (11:00):
Yeah, can we call you mister president?

Speaker 8 (11:02):
So you got to call me something because there's another
step in here. So we got to figure out sugar Steh,
Sugar Steve.

Speaker 9 (11:08):
You want to know why we can hold on to
that name tightly?

Speaker 1 (11:13):
Do you want to know why we call short version
short version? He has diabetes? There you go, so he's down.
You can laugh, we laugh about it.

Speaker 8 (11:24):
Okay, Okay, all right, We're five minutes in and so
far we have a guy who has diabetes and somebody
whose uncle got shot this.

Speaker 7 (11:34):
And might I just say, mister Hill, congratulations on being
the most successful radio person ever to go to TV,
like I mean, I you know, people have dreams, some
of us and you have lived it. So congratulations, we're
making out the radio story.

Speaker 1 (11:49):
So you're saying that's a hard transistion.

Speaker 7 (11:51):
Yep. That excuse excuse me for calling you this when
niggas say they have successful TV careers. I can't wait
to get back to radio.

Speaker 1 (11:58):
Really, you want to go back to radio?

Speaker 8 (11:59):
I love rate.

Speaker 1 (12:00):
Come on, I've loved no no.

Speaker 8 (12:01):
I grew I grew up. I wanted to be Donna
Simpson when I grew up. I I grew up in
d I grew up in DC.

Speaker 1 (12:05):
I go back to the idea of radio. I want
to go back.

Speaker 8 (12:09):
I want to have listen to Deven Love Supreme. That's
what I like to have at some point in time.
So the idea of radio, the idea of music and
personality and having discussions about music. That's what it was
when I was in radio. I loved that.

Speaker 1 (12:22):
You want to know something, I'd spent two days in
d c UH previously. You know. I love the fact
that Howard station is still.

Speaker 7 (12:33):
The best station in the world. Yes, I said it loud.
W h u R is the best every radio station
in the work.

Speaker 8 (12:40):
That's because it's it's independent. Independent, it's not it's not
owned by one of the Kings.

Speaker 1 (12:44):
Are they the last Mohican in a black music in
the United States? Close to it or besides Steven st Stevie.

Speaker 7 (12:50):
Stevie's that has such good positioning on your radio dial.
I feel like everybody else is eighty something when that's college.

Speaker 8 (12:56):
College is when you're below ninety two point three. If
you're below ninety two point three, you're you're either publicly
funded or college above that is where you start playing
with the money.

Speaker 1 (13:05):
That's amazing.

Speaker 8 (13:05):
Yeah, so h R hu R. But HUR is not
owned by any of the big you know people who
own five hundred radio stations so they can channels.

Speaker 1 (13:14):
Yep, they aren't.

Speaker 8 (13:14):
So they aren't beholden to any contracts to play this
certain song this many times a day so the artist
will show up at their station.

Speaker 1 (13:20):
Why do you have these romantic visions of radio as
it was in your childhood.

Speaker 8 (13:26):
Because it was that way when I was in radio.

Speaker 1 (13:28):
That's all like I missed.

Speaker 8 (13:29):
It's like it'd be like the Rip van Winkle of radio,
Like I got out of it a certain time then
fell asleep for twenty some id years and then go
back and expect it to be exactly the same.

Speaker 1 (13:37):
But it wouldn't be right.

Speaker 8 (13:39):
First of all, my voice would be a tape another city.

Speaker 7 (13:43):
Yeah yeah, yeah, you be in a computer.

Speaker 1 (13:46):
What is the question?

Speaker 6 (13:47):
Would you go back to terrestrial radio or would you
try satellite or a pandora?

Speaker 8 (13:52):
I would try anybody who would have me and be
playing great music and talk to great folks.

Speaker 7 (13:56):
Oh yeah, well what is great music? Stephen Hill. That's
a fascinating statement you made there.

Speaker 1 (14:01):
Well, this is the thing, because I know the thing
is is that you know I understand that it's I mean,
this is almost like a relationship like do you think
with your heart or do you think with your brain?
And you know, lately I've been accused of this like
cats always kind of joke like, oh, you know, you're

(14:22):
such a suit your suit meaning really.

Speaker 6 (14:27):
Yeah yeah, yeah, no, just well i'll tell you why
after you after you do you think I'm a suit?

Speaker 1 (14:34):
Yeah? I think you think like a suit?

Speaker 7 (14:35):
Yeah, Oh okay, that's interesting.

Speaker 1 (14:38):
It's whear that my suit is accusing me of being
a suit.

Speaker 7 (14:43):
In a suit the same sweatshirt on.

Speaker 1 (14:46):
Wow, So you get the suit say, where does that
come from? What do they mean by that? Here's the thing, Well,
number one, I'm I see I don't I get offend.
The idea of me being over calculating or overthinking really

(15:07):
didn't come into play until, like I think, like a
Pitchwork review of the Tipping Point. Ok. And then slowly,
and only because Pitchfork was such the Emperor's new clothes
of record criticism, that other critics would see what Pitchfork
was saying and then they would start that was like
the forecast, right, And then slowly, between like two thousand

(15:29):
and five and two thousand and eight, I started seeing, well,
you know, he overthinks everything and da da da da
da da da, which I mean, Okay, granted, like it's
that's lazy journalism when you just see what they say
and then you paraphrase it. But then I personally got
offended because I just felt like, why does the black
guy like, why do I have to be accused of

(15:51):
thinking too much? But the thing is that I feel
like life is science. Like you're either going to go
on science or you're going to go on faith. Okay,
you're even Christianity or science. And I'm not saying I
don't believe in faith, but I believe in science. I
believe in numbers, and I believe in occurrences, and I
believe in circles, and I believe in patterns. Yeah, patterns,

(16:13):
And somehow I don't know. I feel as though it
might read less authentic if it's planned ahead of time
as opposed to people, just like the narrative of the
spontaneity of magic happening, and it does have flat like
a guy like Prince. And this is from a coming

(16:34):
from a scientist that is listened to at least I'll
say that I put in a good one hundred and
fifty hours of listening to Prince rehearsals. And I mean
stuff that the average guy would run out of patients
of listening to. I mean George Clinton's greatest quote about
princes like damn man, even that cat rehearsals is spontaneity,

(16:55):
you know, and it's just like to me, I mean
that might seem sudi like the the idea of over
preparing and that sort of thing. So it reads less
authentic because it's scientific and not.

Speaker 5 (17:11):
Just I think it would be that doesn't read scientifically
that just the reason of a person just putting into
work for the craft.

Speaker 1 (17:16):
You know what I'm saying.

Speaker 5 (17:17):
I think Sudi would be all right, We're gonna get
Max Martin to produce the new Roots album, Like that
would be a suit thing, if you know what I mean.

Speaker 1 (17:25):
Let's get Scott Storts to do the first single for
our next record. That happened. Scott Storch was a member
of the Roots, right, But Scott stor did the first single,
things Fall Apart, But he hadn't been a member a
member of the Roots for yeah, but Scott Storch did
the most loved all the time.

Speaker 6 (17:43):
But okay, Scott Storch being considered a member of the Roots,
I'm trying to think of a great analogy. Is it's
like he never left, Like the thing is that you
never leave the Roots, Malik, Okay, So is Kalie still
a Route?

Speaker 7 (17:56):
Kalise? Was she a Root?

Speaker 1 (17:59):
She was like six months? But I thought, all see,
But the thing is is that the Roots are like
Steely Dan, you know it's it's it's fake session and
then a bunch of session players. But I but I
understand the romantic attachment to members, like why do I
love the Revolution? Like Princess had better more technical musicians.

(18:22):
But my heart's always with the revolution. Yeah, and I
understand people's attachments to it, but I mean on the
real like I mean, James Poyser has been a route
since Do You Want More, but really hasn't been officially
what I said.

Speaker 6 (18:40):
Scott wasn't hasn't been a root for a long time.
It's like he wasn't really a constant presence on the records.

Speaker 1 (18:45):
He's always been just his Yeah, but I mean Scott
was Therefore it ain't saying nothing new and you got
me and then adrenaline. Scott Storte is all over things
fall apart.

Speaker 7 (18:56):
Just formulas. You're basically saying that you're not a suit
just because you have a formula. Did you think would work? Yeah?

Speaker 1 (19:01):
But I never went out like, hey, let's get it
hit with Scott storage. It was just like the sooth
thought concerning the tipping point. The sooth thought was fall
back a mirror and let's do something well, let's do
something normal. Only because Jimmy and Ivean was like he

(19:21):
really didn't get and didn't have the time to absorb
and come and observe and all that stuff, Like he's
dealing with nineteen other platinum artists, so it was just like,
let's just do the most normal. I got to put
my two cents on Star and maybe like which was
my favorite song, some other joints. But really it was
just like that was my most hands off. Okay, what

(19:43):
do I do? And let you guys do the work.
But yeah, I don't think there's anything calculating on that level.
So anyway, Stephen, I'm sorry.

Speaker 8 (19:53):
I'm still trying to fgure out who the Jeff Skunk
Baxtra of.

Speaker 1 (19:56):
The Roots is. A man that would be uh would
it be Kurt?

Speaker 7 (20:00):
Did I figure out what Jeff Skunk Baster is.

Speaker 1 (20:02):
Or brother effort? Steely Dan had at least nineteen revolving
musicians around the planets of Fagin and Becker and a
few other people.

Speaker 7 (20:15):
But when you learn you're just a surface Steely Dan fan. Okay,
thank you guys.

Speaker 1 (20:19):
No, but this is what the show watch, y'all.

Speaker 7 (20:20):
Watch Michael Jackson tapes over.

Speaker 8 (20:22):
All, right, I could do that for Eff you know
I could do that?

Speaker 7 (20:26):
Is he your favorite?

Speaker 1 (20:28):
Yeah?

Speaker 8 (20:29):
It's tough when you have it's tough when it's princes
in the room.

Speaker 1 (20:31):
It's tough. It's tough.

Speaker 8 (20:33):
You talk about practicing spontaneity. I didn't know that much
about Prince, but Michael Jackson felt like he rehearsed a
lot of spontaneity, Like there was whatever it was like.

Speaker 1 (20:42):
Can I come down there and sing? You know, it
was the same point at the same show. I assure
you everyone probably maybe George Clinton's p funk mom because
they were too hard to control. But I assure you
I've seen repetition even with like listen, Coltrane outtakes his

(21:02):
entire Temple University series of like nine shows right after
Love Supreme came out. Even his his his scaling of
solos were the same level. So it's like, I think
anyone that great just you know, has a pattern they
follow due to hours of practice.

Speaker 7 (21:19):
But that's funny because anybody that great, most fans just
don't know that they have a pattern. And so maybe
the people who call you a suit they just you know,
know you behind the scenes so well.

Speaker 1 (21:28):
But I don't mind being called to suit old suit
or wait, I had to look to the left to
see what Bills response was. So Steve back to you
and your your humble beginnings in radio, Can I can
I assume that you, uh, kind of your curiosity about

(21:52):
radio started with like making up your own radio programs
at the house and tape recorders.

Speaker 8 (21:57):
And absolutely absolutely, I just same thing. I was grew
up in d C, where I thought the radio. I
didn't realize it then, but the radio there was so
crazy great, the w p g C, which eventually came
an urban station, but it used to be a station
where you'd hear earth wind and fire next to Barry
Man a low next to the Jackson five like it was.

Speaker 1 (22:17):
It was just all this is is a pop station?
Was this like pe D Green, Dewey Hughes, was this? Yeah?

Speaker 8 (22:23):
Ol Oil is the station I listened to in the
car in my dad's Mustang when you drive drive through Southeast,
you know, during the weekend.

Speaker 7 (22:30):
Melvin Lindsay was a little later.

Speaker 8 (22:32):
I think Melvin Lindsay a little later. Yeah, But Peter Green,
Peter Green was around.

Speaker 1 (22:36):
Bobby.

Speaker 8 (22:37):
I can't think of Bobby's last name, Bobby Burner. I
can't think Bobby Burner something Burner.

Speaker 1 (22:42):
All right, Well, explain where did you grow up? Was
it DC? Southeasts you were.

Speaker 7 (22:46):
Born in d C, Yo, that's the only part of
DC that's still not one hundred percent gentrified.

Speaker 8 (22:51):
Yet they're getting close, tough, getting very they got as
an acostia bridge. It's gonna be an issue.

Speaker 1 (22:59):
Describe specifically what black radio was like.

Speaker 8 (23:02):
It was AM, It was w O L.

Speaker 1 (23:05):
It was AM.

Speaker 8 (23:05):
It was am w ok.

Speaker 1 (23:08):
Your visions and romantic visions of what radio was has
an AM frequency to it. Yeah, I mean not at
the beginning, at the beginning. Now it's now it's FM.

Speaker 8 (23:18):
At the beginning where I learned to love music, it
was absolutely AM radio w O L, w OK, w
E E M for a pop station PGC, I think
was FM by then it was actually AM and FM,
but it was. It was It was sound coming out
of my father's nineteen sixty six Mustang fake convertible, you

(23:38):
know they had it had like the cool green color,
but there was a black but it wasn't really a convertible.
It made it look like it convertible.

Speaker 1 (23:44):
Yeah, that's just kind of the Chrysler three hundred of
its exactly exactly. This is Quest Love, Supreme, Wor and
Pandua And if you're just tuning in, we're chatting with
our guests. The head of programming at BT Networks. Stephen Hill. Okay,
I guess you're the first guest that was born on
the far east of the United States, where a lot

(24:06):
of our Midwestern guests told stories of just being one
radio station and maybe two hours of soul music. Whereas
Plus it's.

Speaker 7 (24:14):
Still the stop. Remember DC's below the mazing Dixon line
and very black. So it was one of those rare
cities four black radio stations. It still does.

Speaker 8 (24:22):
Yes, Okay, So WEIM wasn't their black station. WPGC wasn't
black then that was the pop station. But that's the
one that would play Barry man Low and Earth wind
Fire and Wild Cherry and O L and Okay, We're
am and then okay became FM one hundred point three.

Speaker 1 (24:42):
You could trust radio back then?

Speaker 8 (24:44):
Oh yes, absolutely. I trusted it with my heart absolutely.

Speaker 1 (24:48):
So were you DJ at heart or just like you
wanted to be a personality?

Speaker 8 (24:52):
I just wanted to be around music as much as
I possibly could, Like there was I'm sure everybody had
that experience of getting in the car and like the
first thing you do is turn on the radio, like
the biggest, the biggest thrill I ever had. When we
got a car that we could turn the radio on
before the engine came on. I remember that there was
a Volkswagen that came out of Mom got a Volkswagen. Yeah,
and the radio would turn on. Now this caused challenges,

(25:14):
of course, when you go to listen to the radio
in the car. Sometimes I would just look outside and
listen to radio in the car without going anywhere, and
then leave the radio on and the battery be out
and but yeah, so that that's the first part of music,
and it was motown. It was James Brown. James Brown

(25:34):
was my first, uh, musical crush ever, like that was
my first idol, like that when we saw James Brown
on TV move and he was in the middle of
his going from process to Afro phase. So say it,
say that Loud's transition. He was transitioning. Say it Loud
was I think I was like seven or eight years old,
but that meant something to me. I didn't know what
I didn't know what black and White was at that

(25:55):
point in time, but I knew something about that song
spoke spoke to me.

Speaker 1 (26:00):
Were you attending concerts by this point or.

Speaker 8 (26:04):
First concert was July second, nineteen seventy Temptations. Temptations right
after the right after Psychdelic. Yeah, it was after one
album after that. Ballic Confusion was on the album That's
Skyt's limmit right.

Speaker 1 (26:18):
I got a check to get I have to check
was that?

Speaker 7 (26:20):
Like, Howard did you go see that?

Speaker 1 (26:21):
No?

Speaker 8 (26:21):
No, I was actually came out to My dad had
to work in LA for the first half of that year,
so we came out at the end of June.

Speaker 1 (26:28):
I remember this very well. What did your parents do?
My dad worked with the Census Bureau.

Speaker 8 (26:32):
He was a statistician for years and mom was a mom,
raised us and then was a part time teacher, music teacher. Yeah,
so that was my That was my parents there.

Speaker 1 (26:40):
But your mom was a music teacher.

Speaker 8 (26:43):
She was that explained teacher. She was a taught piano.

Speaker 1 (26:46):
Sop to me. But did you ever want to learn?
Or did? But I had never had the patience for it.

Speaker 8 (26:52):
That was the problem, and it's I have very few
regrets in my entire life. That's the biggest regret. We
didn't stay with the piano that I didn't stay with
the drums. I tried, but I just didn't have the
patience at eleven and twelve years old to stick with it.
It's the biggest regret, but I learned how to play
some things about my own, right, So I can play
first part of Purple Rain on a piano.

Speaker 1 (27:14):
I can play MacArthur Park. Oh oh wait a minute, really.

Speaker 8 (27:17):
I can play I can play the first part of
MacArthur Park on a piano. And I used to be
able to play father song.

Speaker 1 (27:23):
Really, I used to be able to play father song. Well.
But the first part of MacArthur's part, that's hilarious record
shopping Steve and I discovered on the forty five we
had a radio promo of MacArthur's part. What you have
to know about MacArthur's Park is that by Donna Summit
or no no, no, no, no, Richard Arthur.

Speaker 8 (27:41):
Oh there is Richard Harris.

Speaker 1 (27:42):
Richard Harris, right, yeah, So MacArthur's Part is sort of
like a hell Mary throw into the world of radio,
which each song should be about three minutes and thirty seconds,
and the idea of telling radio programmers to let this
seven minute.

Speaker 8 (27:59):
It's about seven it's seven seven seven seven.

Speaker 1 (28:02):
Yeah, like seven oh two or something like that. So
it's very unusual one for a forty five to have
a seven minute song. But the actual artwork of the
forty five of MacArthur's Park. It's more about the record
label telling you the listener that you know, sometimes you
have to let songs breathe and get to you. And

(28:24):
you know, what's a seven minute song? Sit down and
absorb this music like I've never seen a selling point
of such an epic song. And and and of course
you know what is MacArthur's part really about. I mean,
just the idea of wasting cake in the ring. You've
heard MacArthur's part.

Speaker 7 (28:45):
Like you know, I haven't. You know you hear me
being quiet over here. I was just gonna act like
I did.

Speaker 1 (28:50):
Well, you've heard the Melting and the Dog. It's the
same as the summer version.

Speaker 7 (28:57):
I got it because I was sweating over year written.

Speaker 8 (29:01):
By Jimmy Jimmy Webb.

Speaker 7 (29:02):
Okay, if not, I'm going to google it now.

Speaker 1 (29:05):
My dad used to do that song in the show.
And yeah, I just wondered about leaving Cake out and
the Raine.

Speaker 9 (29:11):
And so it's funny think about that every time because
it was my mother's favorite song for a very long time.

Speaker 8 (29:17):
Something about that song really talk to her, and I
try to figure out what it was. I couldn't figure
with it, but I always had the idea of a
cake out in the rain, and I could see it
vividly that there's lime green. It's lime green with some
kind of strawberry, and then was just melting down. It's
such a visual to me.

Speaker 5 (29:37):
But that's the song though, I mean, Jimmy Webb, I think,
if I'm not mistaking, I think he's just saying got
a wrote Witchity Lineman.

Speaker 1 (29:42):
Yes, I think that's like one of my favorite songs.
He's a great songwriter.

Speaker 8 (29:46):
I don't think did Richard Harris ever sing any song
beside that, Like Richard Harris the actor. By the way,
Richard Harris the actor sang MacArthur parkon problem was that
was on a forty five and trying to get seven
minutes worth a sound of the forty five if you.

Speaker 6 (30:00):
Wrong all of a sudden, Yeah, I remember my mom
had a Dell Stany in my corner and that was
like six sixty.

Speaker 4 (30:08):
Boy.

Speaker 1 (30:08):
Yeah, I was like, how they get on? So it's
here for long forty five? Good mastering? All right? So Steve,
where do you at least get the curiosity on how
to enter radio? Like was this dreams you had as
a kid or just this come to you as a

(30:28):
teenager or an adult, or.

Speaker 8 (30:31):
Mostly as a teenage. But really, I mean it really
it turned around in my first year in college. My
first year I went to Brown and oh, because it's
so tied back. So Brown University had a radio station
has a radio station, sorry WBRU, but it is ninety
five point five. So even though it is a college
radio station, it is in the it is in the
you got to make that money sector of the spectrum, right,

(30:52):
It is not a college below ninety two point three.
So it was a commercial radio station and it was rock, alternative, rock, away,
whatever you call it back in eighty four, but on
Sunday it was a three hundred and sixty degree black
experience in sound. If you hashtag that you've used up
all one, it's done.

Speaker 1 (31:10):
I gotta tell you a story about BRU. It's a
little dishonest, but I'll say that after a few a
lot of root shows at Brown University, because we would
frequent a lot of the upper echelone colleges and get
that money. Sometimes at these radio interviews, the DJs would

(31:33):
sort of just let me rummage through.

Speaker 8 (31:37):
No I know where this is going, by the way,
because it's still on it's still in the I know
where this is going.

Speaker 1 (31:42):
I know where it's going. Okay, I'll say that I
have a lot of wbr U records in my possession.

Speaker 8 (31:52):
So if there if they are BRU records in the
upper left corner, it says R and B you wrote
it has a date on them. If you turn them around,
you'll see the writing on the back and they'll say.
We used to call it marketing records. And so we
just go through like one, you know, the side one
side too, and so you probably have some.

Speaker 1 (32:12):
Of the market records, like what the good joints were.

Speaker 8 (32:15):
Like Mark, and we always try to figure out like, okay,
that's a single, so we're gonna mess with what that happened,
but here's what should be the next single. And so
we would go through every like all the.

Speaker 1 (32:23):
Like imagine that because that doesn't happen today in the
cutting piece. So all right, what is the process of
Because I know how important college radio was to the
development of a new artist, especially in the eighties and
in the nineties, so you know, they would try to
woo you just as important or as much as a

(32:46):
top five station or you know, like the local conglomerates
so give us an example of an unheard of talent
coming to you first at at Brown You okay.

Speaker 8 (32:59):
All right, A rather a rather greasy haired gentleman came down.
I can see I can see it. It came down.
I don't know. I still to this day don't know
how he got into the studio. But he's like, hey,
I got this group. I got this group right, and
he like, I got this group and this record, and

(33:19):
you know the Jackson five was Thursday fart, but they're
just like the Jackson five.

Speaker 1 (33:22):
They're just like the Jackson five. I think the blow
up good for you.

Speaker 8 (33:27):
You know exactly where it's going. And I swear to
god he came in on a Sunday because it was
that was that was three hundred sixty degree black experience
of sound. And I'm like, okay, we'll give it a shot.
We'll give it a shot, because you know people would
do that if you if you can get through and
you you're not gonna kill us, we'll play the record.
We're good, and we put and it was a it
was a new edition candigir it was it was.

Speaker 1 (33:47):
I'm thinking Michael Johnson.

Speaker 8 (33:49):
Maurice, Yeah, well, what I can't think it was a
real name. That was no, Johnson's the last name, because.

Speaker 5 (33:55):
I'm thinking of Michael Johnson john Johnson Crew. That was
his partner, was it not? Okay?

Speaker 1 (34:01):
Brother? In this day and age, a lot of people
approached me about, you know, check this out. This this
gentleman included, you know, and maybe my record is probably
zero and nine million for at least the patients to
actually take said product and press play and listen to

(34:22):
it and absorb it. Like but in radio, I mean,
how do you know who's worth listening to? Or I
mean do you have to accept everyone's Like if a
person comes to you and they seem rather shady or whatnot,
do you still give that product a chance? And so
I try to.

Speaker 8 (34:41):
Again, I'm big on that not getting killed thing, right,
because it's happened when people walk in like, yo, man,
you won't listen to what?

Speaker 1 (34:48):
Yeah, I was about to say, Like what if you
don't like a product.

Speaker 8 (34:53):
I'm sorry. You try to never listen to it in
front of them. You always try to get it like, hey,
can't listen to it now, I'll listen to it later.
You avoid that danger, right, then? Seriously, you try to
You try to unless you know the person, If you
know somebody and you can give honest feedback, you want
to be able to absorb it because we've all heard
things where the first time we hear it is like, eh,
that's not working. But by the third time you understand

(35:14):
or you feel, you feel a different way about it.

Speaker 1 (35:16):
And if you really.

Speaker 8 (35:16):
Respect them, music gonna get You're gonna give it that
two or three times before you before you come to
that judgment, before you're ready to share that judgment. That's
probably the best way to put it. And so even
in college, we'd sit around, well, it was more like
there are more people, there'd be a music meeting. We
take all the albums and everybody was a sign, like
two or three albums and they come back and say, okay,
here here's the cuts we should play on three hundred
and sixty Black Experienced It sounds okay. We did call
it three sixty. Just sometimes it's funny. Just keep running

(35:39):
it all the way down.

Speaker 1 (35:43):
Who's who did?

Speaker 8 (35:44):
Don't go dun dunkan no no, no, no no. They
tried to be like the time right after Time came out,
Oh o zone no no no dum dream Boy, dream boy, Yeah,
dream Boy, dream boy, So I'm you can.

Speaker 1 (36:00):
Hear the activator dripping on the floor.

Speaker 8 (36:03):
Yes, yes, there were a couple of groups that came out,
like the Time That Struck My Head because that's one
of those songs I remember that. That was that that
we played on like WBR. You was one of the
first people to play that song and it.

Speaker 1 (36:13):
Was you gave them a chance.

Speaker 8 (36:14):
It was huge, It was huge.

Speaker 1 (36:22):
We're here with our guest president of Programming Beach Heat Networks,
Stephen Hill. We're talking about as humble beginnings going to
college radio back in the eighties.

Speaker 7 (36:33):
Did y'all have like any bear like no hose barges whatever,
black soul or what was okay so whatever?

Speaker 8 (36:39):
Yes, which was yeah, we go. Yeah, it's college radio,
but it was real radio. But it was college radio.
But we can play whatever we wanted to as long
as getting curse obviously.

Speaker 7 (36:46):
So did it hurt when you had to leave that situation.
I guess it didn't hurt because you you know, more
money and commercial radio, but uh, that life is different
college radio.

Speaker 1 (36:54):
Yeah, you only get three to four years to run it.

Speaker 8 (36:57):
Right, you do. Yeah, I was there for I did
it all for you because it was one of the things.
You go on campus. You go on campus, like in
the back then they had all the come join the
press club, right for the paper, come join the you know,
the poker club.

Speaker 1 (37:11):
And what year? What period was this between what brown
was eighty to eighty four? From me?

Speaker 8 (37:16):
Wow, okay at eighty four, so I remember where so
the cool thing is like I remember, like, I remember
where I was when nineteen ninety nine came out.

Speaker 1 (37:23):
The day that, the day that, the day that Thriller
came out. Oh man, November thirtieth, nineteen absolutely two.

Speaker 8 (37:30):
I went straight from there to music one forty two
with Professor Kleman was her name. I remember just having
to the album just like this. I'm like, I'm gonna
try to pay attention to this class. I'm gonna try.
I'm gonna try.

Speaker 1 (37:40):
But yeah, so you were one of those people that
were like cut school for a record or loose sleep
the night before for a record.

Speaker 8 (37:48):
Oh yeah, yeah. I remember being mad because because do
you know the date? What day did Triumph come out?
Became a fall of eighty. I don't know the dated.

Speaker 1 (37:56):
It was September because I remember being in in fifth grade.
It was definitely September of right, So.

Speaker 8 (38:05):
I had just gotten to Brown. I remember going to
like my first or second dance and Shannon Harris. I
remember how fun find Shannon Harris. She had I saw
an album. I say, wait, is that Mike hold On?
She had the Triumph album. I left the party. Really,
I left the party to try to go to the
record store before because it was it was early. I

(38:26):
left to try to get to the record store before closed,
like one o'clock in the morning, two I could get Trump.
I was mad that somebody had a Jackson all before
I did.

Speaker 1 (38:34):
When someone had a record before you did. Oh oh man,
you just took me back with you. You described my
wife right there. I used to cry. My aunt had
asked Rufus by Rufus and for some reason, even there's
like an asterisk mark when I think of the Rufous discography.

(38:55):
Even though I was six, I was still musically an
adult in that household. So she flawing it like like
what twenty three year old person, It's like a mere
luke what I got. And she put on that midnight,
and I was like mad. I was angry see them
with anger like she would flaunt when she got records
before I did. I hate it. Yeah, when some one got.

Speaker 8 (39:14):
Family is worse. The worst trick I ever played with
my brother because I loved my brother more than cook food. Right,
my brother is my guy. But when I was nine
and he was six. So we got the first two
Jackson five records on the same day, right, Dania Ross
presents an ABC and I because I wanted the newer one,
wanted ABC. I wanted ABC. I wanted so, so we

(39:36):
go into the record store. I can remember this, I said,
what I god nor exactly what was? It was panmar
in Southeast DC, on on Pennsylvania Avenue up near the
near the Maryland line. We go in there and my
little niney old self goes, hey, okay, let's go try
to find them. And we were both trying to find ABC.
I said, hey, maybe if yould go look under it's
fouled under the under ABC.

Speaker 1 (39:56):
We're the artists.

Speaker 8 (39:57):
We're the artists, are looking at ABC, and I feel daughter.
I said, you go look over there.

Speaker 1 (40:02):
That's bad, that's bad, that was wrong. But you misled
your brother. I did. I did. I did, just so
he had his own collection. You had your own.

Speaker 8 (40:10):
Now he stopped after that one. He's stopped like like
that was just like, I don't know's brother competitive, but
he wasn't me. He's the sports guy. He loves sports. Okay, uh,
you know he's just now like he's the guy I
uses a test to find out what songs are really
good and really gonna hit because the idiot factor all
completely and I don't know.

Speaker 1 (40:29):
You never tell the idiot factor the idio factor.

Speaker 8 (40:32):
And I keep him away like he you know, he
wants to take us shows and stuff. I can get that,
but but I don't want him to get anywhere close
because I used him as the is the test? Like
is this you know, he's the guy who's sitting in
the back of the car with the kids singing happy
like he's he's the guy. He's he's that guy. I
know if it you know, always be my Baby is
his favorite Mariah Carey song, Like that's the that's the
that's the he's the he's the pop guy.

Speaker 1 (40:55):
Your litmus test. Like what do you think about this? Listen?

Speaker 8 (40:58):
Yeah, so I'm starting to use his kids.

Speaker 1 (40:59):
Now, no kids are your an rs? That's like that's
the kids are yes?

Speaker 5 (41:06):
No, Well, I want when I say an RS, it
just means if your kids can sing it. That's when
you know, it doesn't mean if they don't like it
that it's not good or it still won't jam.

Speaker 1 (41:16):
But if your kids are singing it, yeah, that's the way.

Speaker 8 (41:18):
I won't to go back to. Which, So do you
remember any of the any of the albums you took
from you took from I'm sorry you borrowed from Brown University? No, no, no, no,
no no no, just curious, you know what?

Speaker 1 (41:31):
Because I was heavily looking into samples and things, I
believe that I was more given access to the jazz.
Oh yeah, sort of the seventies jazz stuff. So I know,
like there's I think maybe the Virgo Red album from

(41:51):
roy Aers, you know what, Tony Williams Ego, those two records.
Like I took a lot of the seventies jazz jazz
stuff like that's in my collection.

Speaker 8 (42:02):
And then and there's still The cool thing is I
go back and visit every once in a while, just
and sometimes it let me go on the air for
a minute, which is just I have such a rush
after that. But the album is still on the wall.
The albums are they still have the album on the
wall haven't been used for years.

Speaker 1 (42:15):
They still keep up there. I love that really, Wow,
I gotta make a return, find a new home for it.

Speaker 5 (42:25):
So how do you go from how do you use
a person like that loves music, you know, wanting to
be on radio?

Speaker 1 (42:30):
How do you get from radio to TV?

Speaker 8 (42:32):
Like?

Speaker 1 (42:32):
How did you?

Speaker 7 (42:33):
Oh?

Speaker 1 (42:33):
Yeah, how do you go there? Your major? I assume
that was your major.

Speaker 8 (42:38):
My major was applied math in economics. Applid math and economics, brilliant.
I spent more time at the radio station. Love you mom,
love you dad. But yeah, I got out, but I
did graduate. I good, I could graduate. Go ahead, ask it.

Speaker 5 (42:54):
No.

Speaker 7 (42:54):
I was just gonna say, don't you find because people
are always I was a communications major, So it's not like
you really wanted to switch play with me because I
always tell people, young people, you know what, take be
a business major economics and then just have an internship
learn radio that way because you're really not going to
learn a lot of it in the classroom. So you perfect, right.

Speaker 1 (43:10):
Yeah, I was communications major too. I was communications major too.
I'd say the same thing.

Speaker 7 (43:14):
Yeah, yeah, internships is where you learn everything.

Speaker 1 (43:17):
Because but isn't that FV like fall back on this
just in case it doesn't. No, which one for communications majors?

Speaker 6 (43:25):
Really, I mean you do a lot of stuff in class,
but really the only way to learn how to do
to do it, you have to.

Speaker 9 (43:30):
Actually do it and be around people who would right right.
So like I was a communications major, Yeah, I do
the thing of it, so was to Yeah. I did
three and a half years at the college radio station.
You know, I worked on television shows at the campus
TV station. And that was the only way we could
learn how to do stuff because it was to actually
do it.

Speaker 1 (43:45):
So what was your major?

Speaker 10 (43:46):
Steve Journalism? Actually interned at DC one on one I
went to Maryland, So I was interned.

Speaker 8 (43:53):
Well, you got DC route was how it was starting
there when you were there?

Speaker 1 (43:57):
No, No, I was with the grease Man.

Speaker 8 (43:58):
Okay a long time.

Speaker 1 (44:01):
Who's the grease man?

Speaker 10 (44:03):
He knows the Howards turned down in d C. Basically
in the Lady Wild Morning Guy. Well it wasn't the
morning show, but he was just like he was just
that you know.

Speaker 8 (44:13):
Crazy Greechman, at least in some circles, is best known
for the horrible, horrible joke that I will tell if
you want me to. But it's really it's a horrible,
originally offensive please please offensive. It was around the time
that they were talking about m l K getting a holiday.

Speaker 1 (44:29):
I remember, okay, remember that?

Speaker 8 (44:31):
Do you remember? So it was like, uh so, let
me get the straight m OK is going to get
all we get a holiday for m OK. If I'd
known that, I'd have shot four more and gotten a
whole week off.

Speaker 1 (44:44):
That was the grease Man.

Speaker 7 (44:49):
That must have been. That must have been a day
Donnie Simpson got his fifty million dollar contract.

Speaker 8 (44:55):
DC Radio, DC Radio has it was was was was,
There was the variety.

Speaker 1 (45:01):
Howardzs.

Speaker 8 (45:01):
Thurne was on DC one on one before he went national,
before he came to New York, like he cut his
teeth there. Greaseman was kind of like Howard's thurnish as
you can probably tell them by that.

Speaker 10 (45:10):
And by the time I got there, I don't know,
eighty nine or something like that, and it was all
computer generated playlists and you know nothing. I was like, well,
I'm too late to this game.

Speaker 8 (45:21):
It was past my romanticized version of radio.

Speaker 1 (45:24):
Yeah, So what was your first radio station outside.

Speaker 8 (45:27):
Of wild Boston? It was an AM daytimer station. What
an AM daytimer station is? We just call it solar powered.
There's this crazy. There's this crazy rule. The SCC had
that certain because they were trying to make when radio,
they were trying to make radio grow. People were allowed
to have local stations, but there were these superstations that

(45:48):
went everywhere at night, like WOWO out of Fort Wayne, Indiana.
I don't know how I remember that WBAL out of Baltimore.
There were these superstations that jacked their power up at
night so they could be heard nationwide. Because radio, you know,
when they were trying to build the radio business really
and so every other every other if you were on
that frequency, you had to get off that frequency at night.
So WBAL had the frequency ten nine to zero out

(46:10):
of Baltimore, and so at night we were wild.

Speaker 1 (46:13):
We had to get off.

Speaker 8 (46:14):
So we were only allowed to be up from sunrise
to sunset.

Speaker 1 (46:18):
Oh wow.

Speaker 8 (46:19):
Right, So that was my first radio station. And the
short version of how I got there. I got out
of Brown University. I tried to get a job in radio.
I couldn't do it. I failed miserably. A year and
a half later, a guy named Robert Hartley was sick.
He was during cristification at WBRU. They called me said,
can you come fill in for four hours. I said, sure,
I have been on the radio on a year and
a half. I'll come down. But as I did always,

(46:40):
I prepared and made sure I knew what was going on.
When did a four hour show, thought nothing of it,
went back to my job where I was teaching at
Groton School. Two months later, I get a call saying,
is this Stephen Hill. Yes. I happened to be driving
through Providence, Rhode Island a couple of months ago heard
you on the radio, and I wanted to know if you
want to come in. And I got a part time
gig at w I l D. El Roy Smith, who

(47:02):
was is a wonderful program director, wonderful program former boss.

Speaker 7 (47:06):
He was your he was my boss when he left Chicago,
he came to Field, I was morning show.

Speaker 8 (47:11):
El Roy Smith was the program director. Yeah, Elroy Smith
was after Kobe.

Speaker 1 (47:17):
Yeah.

Speaker 8 (47:18):
Yeah, at w I l D. And so I always
I tell people like my career, like if if Robert
Hartley doesn't get sick, if I'm not home to answer
the phone because there were no cell phones at the time, right,
if I if I don't you know, if I can't
go down there and do those four hours, we're not
sitting here because I found out el Roy only did
that drive twice in five years. Man, And it just happened,

(47:38):
and it happened to me. I hadn't been on the
radio for a year and a half. I was on
there those four hours. He happened to be driving through
track me down and hips is not for that. I'm
somewhere either teaching or applying math and economica.

Speaker 1 (47:51):
Now, as as a DJ, did you have total control of.

Speaker 8 (47:56):
What?

Speaker 4 (47:57):
No?

Speaker 8 (47:57):
No college is over?

Speaker 1 (48:00):
Is this?

Speaker 8 (48:00):
What?

Speaker 1 (48:01):
What year is this? What year is this? Is a
this is a spring of eighty six? Okay, spring of
eighty six? At this point, the WYLD this is.

Speaker 8 (48:08):
Like wild is it now? Even though it's a daytime station,
it's a real money, real money commercial radio.

Speaker 1 (48:14):
Stak got back up a little bit because you said
your previous experience was a fail? How was that a fail?
Which one you said? When you?

Speaker 8 (48:21):
Oh, what I tried to get I tried to get
a job in a radio when I left Brown in
eighty four. But I couldn't.

Speaker 1 (48:25):
I could you could like it was just a bad experience, DJ.

Speaker 8 (48:31):
I couldn't get a job I was. I couldn't get
a job in radio radio or or record labels or anyplace.

Speaker 1 (48:37):
Man back then, what were the requirements to to woo
over a radio programmer that would bring you aboard? Like
what was required?

Speaker 8 (48:47):
I don't know, because I didn't get a job. Seriously,
I don't know. I thought, you know, I don't know.
I think it was just talking on the air naturally
that appealed to l Roy. Like I knew the music
back then, it was good to have some kind of
radio voice. And thanks to my mother, who has the
deeper voice of my parents, I happened to get it.

(49:11):
So I think it's just that and being able to
relate and being able to and he didn't know that
that I knew or was obsessed with music, but I
think that helped in the interview and as I got
to grow at WLD.

Speaker 1 (49:22):
I mean I would think, at least in my head
or you know, this is a very naive you know,
thought like I would figure that, okay, well, I would
want people to be knowledgeable about music and all that stuff,
because I don't even know what the criteria for today is.
But I would think like there were least some standards
thirty years ago, whereas like, you know, you know, it's

(49:45):
funny I think went to that era and where the
radio DJ was well, what you're saying when it end.

Speaker 8 (49:56):
I think the real challenge was when they changed the
ownership rules of radios, right, it was ninety six. They
changed it two fms, two ams, that's all you can own.
That's all you can own, even in the market, right,
And so now people were buying radio stations. They had
to service all this debt. And so to service that debt,
you got to play commercials, and to play more commercials

(50:17):
you have to have less talk. And so the less
talk you have, the more commercials you can play. And
so you play the music and you play just a
little bit. Hey, that was the That was the jacks
was chaking about it down the ground right back after this,
you get in and out, so you play more music,
like it was just servicing debt. It feels like the
way record companies with like Warner Brothers was It seemed
to be about like an artist development and movement, and
then all of a sudden, you know, you got to

(50:37):
service your debt. So you got to sell more records.
And sometimes you don't get two or three shots at
it make it, making it big.

Speaker 1 (50:43):
So quest Love Supreme would be their worst nightmare because
we're more talk less music now.

Speaker 8 (50:48):
So so when you know when I listened to this,
I'm going to laugh because my speech pattern, even in
this broadcast has slowed down once I realized your pace,
which is a good thing because my radio kicks back
in and like you're supposed to get in, get out
to go and so so in. So even in these
this time we've been on, I've slowed it down and

(51:09):
I can go with the conversation and the speed, y'all go.

Speaker 1 (51:11):
I want to go to a song and have Steven
introduce it. Okay, radio style, radio style, all right, I
want you to introduce the Jackson shake your body down
to the ground now. Just no, there's a rule where
you have to do it before like the lyrics starting
on it.

Speaker 8 (51:25):
It's called hitting the Post. It's called hitting the Posts.
The best song ever Hit the Post two Anita Baker
sweet Love. Yeah, and you talk about your radio station,
You talk about what the sunshine is outside and having
to make it We love on w I L dude.

Speaker 1 (51:50):
We're going to have your intro that one. So wait,
what is what is what is a nightmare song? Then?
Like a song that would let us short intro.

Speaker 8 (51:59):
Yes, either got no intro. I'm trying to think that
there was this song that that just would come in
with the vocals and they edited and.

Speaker 1 (52:06):
Get down on it. Is an example of a song
that crazy crazy by a crazy uh Barkley, I don't know.
Yeah boom boom, yeah boom.

Speaker 8 (52:17):
You can't talk of that.

Speaker 1 (52:18):
Yeah, it's just a three snare hit. And then right
and the rules of.

Speaker 7 (52:21):
Radio, you have to pray that the song before had
a long outro.

Speaker 8 (52:25):
Yeah yeah, right, oh yeah.

Speaker 1 (52:27):
But at the radio station, you see like a reverse time.
You get to see the clock of No. I would
not that was my you look you.

Speaker 8 (52:35):
I would research, I would time it myself. I would
tie it myself, not much. And then certain songs us
new the feeld like for me you got to feel.

Speaker 6 (52:43):
I mean, oh yeah, back to day, like well back
in the day, like on the promo forty five, on
the timing you would have the intro seven second intro,
you know, it would tell you, yeah, you would still.

Speaker 7 (52:54):
Have your body rip like he's a rhythm. You would
just know the records and it feels better when you
know the rhythm.

Speaker 1 (52:59):
Which when we're doing five Sweet Love four three two
man I am so happy to be here on Quest
Love Supream this.

Speaker 8 (53:06):
Man, Stephen Hill, this is my girl, Anita Baker. I
hope everything's going well in your world today and that
you have exactly what she's talking about in this song
from the Fantastic nineteen eighty six c D Rapture, This
is a Needy Baker with sweet love Yo Yo. That

(53:36):
is the best of all the songs I've ever heard
in my entire life. It's absolutely my favorite song.

Speaker 1 (53:40):
Why do you think have doom rhymes over that?

Speaker 4 (53:41):
Man?

Speaker 1 (53:44):
Wow? So man, I was really.

Speaker 7 (53:49):
American shock because he doesn't know that there's a method
to radio madness.

Speaker 1 (53:53):
I respect that. I respect that. This is what I've
been trying to impart upon him for the last several
months in our fiftieth episode.

Speaker 8 (54:06):
But it's different. Now you don't have to do that anymore,
inspite me thirteen nah, But but I think it's different.
People want the information. Like when we when we talked
through don't go. Then my first visual reaction like, oh,
you can't do that, well, you can't do that. But
then when you know we're in a culture where you
want to hear the information, and there you know, you know,
kind of pop up video started started that where you
want the information during the middle of the song because

(54:26):
you've heard the song, you know, countless times before. So
if you can get something new while you're listening to it,
that's that's great. But viscerally when you when.

Speaker 1 (54:34):
You what are you doing talking over the song? I'm
sure there's times where you made a mistake and maybe
played a radio editing Oh yeah, well, like if the
vocals coming, do you still continue or is it like, uh,
let me cut off?

Speaker 8 (54:49):
You go straight to the call letters?

Speaker 11 (54:51):
What caut cool sting outside of WB are you once
you hear a voice?

Speaker 1 (55:02):
It's just like and was your boss always on you
about back selling and front selling?

Speaker 8 (55:07):
And ye, no, look absolutely yeah it was part of
the format you either. I always thought it was cool
to backsell a song because when I listened to a song,
when you listen to a song and you like it,
you you listen to the end and you'll pay attention
because you're looking to find out what that is. I'll
never forget the first time I heard another one bites

(55:27):
the Dust by Queen Right. It was on w k
Y S and Washington d C. It was on w
k Y. Yes, I'm like, oh, this sound is this
song is fantastic, sounds a little bit like she but
I'm good. And I waited for them to back sell
and they didn't. I called the radio station. I called
the radio station. What's that song? It's I know there

(55:48):
has the lyrics? Another one bites the dust? Who's that buye? Like?
And somehow I don't know how I got through the studio.
I remember.

Speaker 1 (55:56):
Song, there's another one? What do you call another one?

Speaker 8 (56:01):
Yeah? It's my queen.

Speaker 1 (56:02):
Yeah.

Speaker 8 (56:03):
But there was a there was an excitement about like
first of all hearing the song, but then getting through it,
like yeah, but like like I knew it before the
DJ did, because the DJ whoever's coming on next didn't
know it.

Speaker 1 (56:13):
Yeah, I'm learning now that about back selling and front selling. Words.
I never heard of my life yet until this radio
show started, and I didn't know the importance of doing that.
You know, So to you, that's not a nightmare or.

Speaker 8 (56:29):
Enjoy it, because look, the reason I loved radio was
a lot of it was because you play music and
you hope they're really attracted to it, so you want
them to go out. And then it was that you
want to go out and buy it. But not because
I didn't profit from it. I just like I liked
being responsible for you discovering something you dug right, and
so w ild is urban or as black but straight

(56:53):
up kind of R and B not go outside the lines.
It could be before I got there, And then you know,
Seal had the nerve to put out a record when
I was there, so the Living Color head Head and
Tracy chap Tracy Chapman came up with the original personal
Baby Can I Hold You Right? And I remember I
would play these songs and the record. The labels themselves

(57:14):
would be like, that's not the single. Why are you
playing this? Or you're not playing our song by the
other rack, but you're playing this. I'm like, oh, that's
the that's the They wouldn't want you to play no, no,
it was like, that's not the single we're working. Oh
oh please, oh please, that's not that's not the single working.
But the reason why you playing the second cut.

Speaker 6 (57:33):
But the reason why I used to listen to radio
was to hear all the stuff, you know that wasn't
on everything.

Speaker 1 (57:38):
You know.

Speaker 6 (57:38):
I loved when they would play all the album cuts,
so you know, I would love when they would dig
out the twelve inch versions of songs and let the
whole seven minute version of Kids play on the radio.

Speaker 1 (57:45):
So when Sign of the Times comes out, you're not
looking to play House Quake.

Speaker 8 (57:49):
And we heard how the exact song you picked, the
exact song that I once on a Saturday played and
got a call on the hotline from El Royd. I
want to be clear, I don't want to be clear.
I followed the rules pretty well. This is I'm sorry
I forgot to say so wild. Either was eighty six
to eighty eight when I was a weekend DJ and
I filled in in the mornings and stuff, and then

(58:10):
in eighty eight to ninety three I was the program director,
so I was the boss then, but in eighty seven,
when the Times came out, I was.

Speaker 1 (58:15):
Not the boss.

Speaker 8 (58:15):
I was the weekend guy. But I still followed the
rules have decently, so much so that when I played
house Quake and I got a call on the hotline,
which doesn't ring you're in the radio studio. So just
the big bright red light goes and there's like two
people who have that phone number too, here's the program
director and the owner. And when that goes off when
you're playing, there's no good news coming. There's just no

(58:39):
and you know you did something wrong, so you.

Speaker 1 (58:40):
Just know it.

Speaker 8 (58:43):
So I was hoping he wasn't home or listen, he
wasn't in the car yet. But Housequake was the exact
song that I played in eighty seven.

Speaker 1 (58:50):
How old is Erroy at this point?

Speaker 8 (58:51):
Oh, that's a good question.

Speaker 7 (58:53):
Oh it's got a big difference between the two.

Speaker 8 (58:55):
Oh no, No, I was twenty seven, so he was maybe
thirty two, maybe thirty.

Speaker 1 (58:59):
Two, and he didn't get it.

Speaker 8 (59:02):
No, no, no, no, Elroy's that he's the format guy. He's
he's he's got success because of this.

Speaker 1 (59:08):
So what's his mind?

Speaker 7 (59:09):
Uh?

Speaker 1 (59:10):
Process of Okay, he hears house Quake and it was.

Speaker 8 (59:14):
Not on his list. He knows, he knows that that
is not in the cards, but.

Speaker 1 (59:18):
He doesn't know that some fifteen year old at the
laundry Matt is hearing this for the first sign and
going out of his mind and no, I gotta buy
that record. No, he don't care.

Speaker 8 (59:25):
No, it's not the format.

Speaker 1 (59:26):
So what does he want? What is he in? What
is his what is his idea of success? In nineteen
eighty seven?

Speaker 8 (59:32):
No, I want to say it because Elroy was really
good at playing album cuse that he thought were good.
That just wasn't one of the ones that he picked out. Really,
that was right, That just wasn't he That wasn't when
he that wasn't That wasn't.

Speaker 1 (59:42):
So he questioned some Prince's artistic integrity. No, no, no, no,
no no no no no.

Speaker 8 (59:47):
Part of it was playing the singles game that every
radio station was playing then. But for example, he was
into let's chill and I like while the record company
was still doing groove me forgot forgot right. He had
no problem digging into some stuff, just not everything and
how And Prince wasn't his thing. Prince was when it
came to that station, I was. Prince was completely my thing.

Speaker 7 (01:00:07):
And that was the art of the PD too, right,
don't you think like the RT, the PD was when
you went outside the box you usually and you picked
something that popped, the record company would go, oh, well
maybe Steve and you have something yes, And let me
remind you that el Roy Smith is the same person
that almost fired me for an interview on Rafael's Deep Live.
He didn't play that shit really, yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:00:24):
Oh that's very fun. Well, you didn't clear it through
him first?

Speaker 7 (01:00:28):
All I mean, I cleared it. They just want the
true story. They wanted me to pre record it. We
Rafael agreed to do a music conference with us. This
is when his Stacks album came out, remember like that,
and they did the radio line to me. They were
like like, okay, so record the interview and we're gonna
play it. After we start playing the record, and my
life your mine went, y'all ain't never playing this shit.

(01:00:49):
This is we are hot hot one old you know whatever.
So when he walked in the door late, I was like,
this is the god Rafael Sadik, let's go. And it
was a really great interview.

Speaker 8 (01:01:00):
But it just gets the rules, that's it. And sometimes
in management you just gotta you just have to manage
in the rules or else everybody will break the rules.
The reason I knew I could play House Quake is
because I managed myself within the rules for like a
full year and I was I was a good I
was a good employee because I didn't want to lose
that gig.

Speaker 1 (01:01:20):
I loved that gig. So wait, since we have two
d C elites of radio, I interned at DC one
on one three and a half.

Speaker 8 (01:01:38):
We got to cover up.

Speaker 1 (01:01:40):
All I want to I want to go off script
for a second and do the radio introduction contest between
set this out.

Speaker 5 (01:01:51):
No, no, you already I was not on the air, that
was getting coffee.

Speaker 1 (01:01:56):
I was in charge of the prize room.

Speaker 8 (01:01:57):
And what's the introduction contest?

Speaker 4 (01:01:58):
Was this?

Speaker 7 (01:01:59):
I don't know?

Speaker 1 (01:02:00):
All right, we will start with Stephen Hill. You're doing
an introduction, okay, okay, when we let people know that
I have no idea. What song about this?

Speaker 8 (01:02:10):
Okay, we should, we should set let's set the expectation.

Speaker 1 (01:02:13):
Here we go.

Speaker 8 (01:02:16):
Hi, my name is Stephen Hill. You are listening to
the best music in the world on Quest Love Supreme.
Yes you should have this song. Just no two ways
about that.

Speaker 4 (01:02:29):
Flashback?

Speaker 1 (01:02:30):
Who's that?

Speaker 6 (01:02:30):
Oh yeah? Oh all right, that was good. I knew
that was coming too.

Speaker 1 (01:02:44):
I knew that was coming. Okay, here we go. This
is for you, like here we go?

Speaker 7 (01:02:52):
Heyes, Love Supreme. I'm like EO on your Sunday afternoon
and what better way to cruise through the road with
a little marry on your mind?

Speaker 1 (01:03:01):
So no, oh ship, oh red light, red light red,
it's say it's fake, it's faces can do over, it's
fain avoid to avoid Stephen won, even the engineers, even

(01:03:26):
the engineers at the studio.

Speaker 7 (01:03:27):
Life, So does that mean we're even though? Since we
both sucked up?

Speaker 1 (01:03:30):
That was the one? Is that?

Speaker 7 (01:03:31):
Zero zero zero zero?

Speaker 8 (01:03:32):
Right?

Speaker 1 (01:03:33):
I want to crack it this. Give me say I
did college radio for three years. All right, so you
all right, if you were on a radio program, will
probably the Friday night rap gyms? Maybe wait, do the
same rules? The same rules apply for all fourmats, Like,
were you guys more lenient on? Absolutely the midnight wrap show?

Speaker 8 (01:03:52):
So it wasn't midnight because remember we're a daytimer, so
our midtime is like six pm, so midnight is six pm.

Speaker 1 (01:03:59):
No save Harbor hours.

Speaker 8 (01:04:00):
You Max Mix? I had Max Mix doing the thunderstorms.
Well actually one of the first first mix shows where
I gave I said, like, dude, just don't get us arrested. Right,
it was like an hour at the end of the day,
nineteen eighty six, eighty seven. That's pretty early for that's
pretty early for hip hop hip hop show.

Speaker 1 (01:04:17):
All right? So in Boston you ready, you're ready? Y
yea yeah, yeah, let's get it. You're ready? Here we go, yo, yeah,
y'oll what up?

Speaker 5 (01:04:27):
This man Fonte font ticlet ticttle ticleo right here on
Quest Love Supring, be gonna get into.

Speaker 1 (01:04:32):
Something real fun. You know what I'm saying, Some real fly,
some real funking. This is some randow music, you know
what I'm saying.

Speaker 5 (01:04:36):
And I'm gonna just play it and I'm gonna come back
and I'm a back.

Speaker 1 (01:04:38):
Seller because I just want to get into this record.

Speaker 5 (01:04:40):
I've been playing this ship right here on Quest Springs.

Speaker 1 (01:04:43):
Let's go.

Speaker 7 (01:04:45):
The audience. I'm gonna do. I'm gonna be like the people.
I don't know what a backsell? What is a back sell?

Speaker 1 (01:04:52):
I was like, I was waiting. I was like, what
the fuck is this from the Bob Power episode? That's
a sentence.

Speaker 7 (01:04:57):
Did you not get the song right?

Speaker 4 (01:04:59):
No?

Speaker 1 (01:05:00):
I didn't know, but I didn't get it wrong. I
sure was. I didn't get it wrong.

Speaker 8 (01:05:05):
Something new you could back sell something, so try.

Speaker 1 (01:05:09):
It's been a while, all right, all right, I got
one for you all sook and sooking. Now you're listening
to Quest Love Supreme.

Speaker 6 (01:05:17):
This is Boss Bill coming into you Live.

Speaker 1 (01:05:22):
Ship red Light. We're gonna get into some oj.

Speaker 7 (01:05:34):
Are you trying to figure out what the artist was? No?

Speaker 1 (01:05:36):
I just got lost in my words. Scott coming, Scott,
how you doing? You're there? Yes, I'm here. What's up?
All right, ladies and gentlemen, this is Scott yayo or
our boss boss, Bill's boss. Uh. And also deep in
the radio. Uh do you do? You do? You know
what we're doing? I do?

Speaker 12 (01:05:56):
Yeah, better be alternative these early two thousands. Alternative would
be helpful, really well, put.

Speaker 1 (01:06:03):
Some silver, put some cake on it.

Speaker 6 (01:06:06):
I think, yeah, yeah, you're going disc well, no, because
that one starts straighten writ in the Lyric't but I'm.

Speaker 1 (01:06:12):
Saying that I'm not. Object isn't stumping you with the song?

Speaker 7 (01:06:16):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (01:06:16):
Object is seeing how quick you adjust to whatever.

Speaker 12 (01:06:21):
To be clear, you if you were DJ, and you
wouldn't be a just you would know what it was.
I would listen to it beforehand. I would know my
run up.

Speaker 8 (01:06:27):
Time well, to be fair. To be fair, I think
rock radio had a different rules as well, Like you
didn't want to step on the music as much as
you didn't want to talk over the music as much
as as much as you did in like an R
and B. No, the music a lot of us started cold,
at least in radio stations.

Speaker 1 (01:06:45):
And by the way, if you.

Speaker 12 (01:06:46):
If you were as good as Steven was earlier when
he hit that post, we'd call him a postmaster general.

Speaker 1 (01:06:53):
Nice, okay, postmaster in general.

Speaker 7 (01:06:56):
You're right, you do know you'll be doing this last, right, boss?

Speaker 1 (01:06:59):
I'm doing this too. Yeah, yeah, I'm doing this as well.
Oh yeah, you thought you were going to get away,
get away? Yeah? I thought I was going to get
away with this? All right? You ready? Yeah? Here we go?

Speaker 8 (01:07:08):
Red light, red light, red light?

Speaker 1 (01:07:13):
What's going on? It's Scott Riggs. How you doing?

Speaker 12 (01:07:15):
It's crazy Wednesday morning.

Speaker 1 (01:07:17):
Let me tell you.

Speaker 12 (01:07:17):
The weather out there is nuts. But we've got some
good music for you. It's Quest Slap Supreme. Here is
the Gorillas.

Speaker 8 (01:07:26):
Red light, red light that he's picking your songs?

Speaker 1 (01:07:34):
All right, bottle?

Speaker 7 (01:07:36):
Who's doing it right now?

Speaker 1 (01:07:39):
Because I give him blur song too?

Speaker 13 (01:07:42):
Actually I'll say give him blur song too, or give
him or give him Peter Murphy cuts you up, which
is about a three minute leading for him.

Speaker 1 (01:07:54):
No, that's hard. Like, if anything, I think the the
longer the show is you have to talk.

Speaker 8 (01:08:02):
There's a perfect there's a there's like a ten to
twelve like a perfect there's a perfect amount of time
like it's too short, it's too bad, too long, it
is ridiculous.

Speaker 1 (01:08:12):
But do you have to talk until the vocals start?

Speaker 8 (01:08:14):
You don't have to, but you want you want to
be post master general. Yeah, post master General comes with
a star.

Speaker 1 (01:08:20):
And so do you practice this at home? Do you
practice this at home? There who teaches you this?

Speaker 12 (01:08:26):
No in between songs when you're playing music.

Speaker 1 (01:08:28):
I'm really glad you did the show because I forgot
you are post master general, Like, yeah, you hit that post,
your yoda of postmaster in general.

Speaker 12 (01:08:36):
Well, and by the way, you also, it gets hard
to make it interesting every time, right, Like you can't
throw out the weather every time. You can't throw out
the time every time. Sometimes you're pulling facts about the band.
Sometimes you're saying what's going on in the city, But
you got to fill that with something interesting.

Speaker 8 (01:08:50):
And also you got to know the music. But you know,
part of the reason I got hired when when word
was driving through is because I'd gone through the paper,
like I loved hitting the post. That was one of
the things I love doing. And to your point, you've
got to think of different thing. So I had to
know what was going on, something about the music. And
so you kind of plan on what you're gonna say,
or the you don't you don't script it out, but
you know here the here a the beats I want
to hit in this intro, or before I start this intro, or.

Speaker 7 (01:09:12):
You got a little note right there, a couple of
little things you want to say, or.

Speaker 8 (01:09:16):
Giving away tickets to the circus.

Speaker 7 (01:09:18):
It's really easy. This is I got a liner.

Speaker 1 (01:09:21):
I gotta give away a liner.

Speaker 7 (01:09:23):
A liner is Uh. Quest Love is being brought to
you by boost Mobile.

Speaker 1 (01:09:27):
Oh where you is?

Speaker 7 (01:09:34):
It's like it's like the station business is like, Uh,
don't forget. We got this festival coming up and we'll
be having tickets in the next hour.

Speaker 12 (01:09:42):
Make sure we got free comedy tickets to the show
coming up this weekend. Come out to NAPA Auto Parts
on Saturday, right right, we'll give you some stickers.

Speaker 1 (01:09:53):
All right, I'm ready, I got you ready. You let
me meditate?

Speaker 7 (01:10:01):
All right?

Speaker 1 (01:10:02):
Okay, bring on the panic. That's right, ladies and gentlemen,
this is Quest Love of quest Love Supreme. It is
the midnight hour, and we are paying tribute to the
great Broad Temperton. That's right, ladies and gentlemen. Uh, free
hot dogs to the ninth caller, who can guess some
of the greatest music. This is love, Time's love? All right?

(01:10:28):
That wass that was? That was c minus? That was minus.

Speaker 7 (01:10:34):
All of us who went to school.

Speaker 10 (01:10:37):
Well, you know, radio is my school. I have a question. Yes,
that's sort of philosophical question. Almost now, the intro to
a song and theoretically the fade out are those specifically
meant for radio, for a DJ to be posting up
or whatever it's called.

Speaker 1 (01:10:52):
Do I think that?

Speaker 8 (01:10:53):
Do I think that some creators went into the studio
to so that that could happen.

Speaker 10 (01:10:57):
I'm saying, if you're making a song that you want
to be on the radio, do you create intros specifically
for so for what we're talking about.

Speaker 1 (01:11:05):
Right now I'm going to talk about.

Speaker 8 (01:11:06):
I have no idea because I've never created a record,
but I would not be surprised if, like, maybe that's
some people out, if there were there were people I
want to I almost want to think of the Motown area, right.
I almost think Barry Gordy, sitting there with the with
the transistor speaker in his office is thinking like that
intro is too long? Like that were the interests too long?
Or the intro is just right. They'll they'll talk about

(01:11:28):
my record going right up to it. But by the way,
But then I thought I was stopping the name of love,
and I was like, probably not.

Speaker 12 (01:11:32):
Well, posting is all about it's something like that was
invented by DJs, because your board as hell when you're
in that studio for fourner.

Speaker 10 (01:11:42):
Once it was invented, then we're people who are making.

Speaker 8 (01:11:46):
Songs, specifically, specifically.

Speaker 10 (01:11:48):
Creating intros with that kind of time, I wouldn't they
probably could be.

Speaker 12 (01:11:51):
I know that at least an alternative and rock they
started telling us to step out. They were like, don't
even talk even if there is an intro, just let
it go, or we'll get edit and I'll chop that
off and it'll just start with the vocals.

Speaker 1 (01:12:03):
So yeah, was there because I grew up or at
least became of age where I started hearing you know,
more music, let's talk, or there was a I remember
an issue in Billboard magazine like during the George Michael
faith period, so like eighty eight eighty nine where it
was like the pay to play thing or like pay

(01:12:23):
us to sell your song, or I remember this issue
coming up like eighties, near early nineties so dependent promoters. Well,
just the idea of like, you know, we're not going
to back sell or front sell the song anymore. Was
there a period in which you got a memo which
was like, okay, you no longer have to sell the song.

Speaker 8 (01:12:47):
Or no, no, I've but I you know, I was
at a kind of a black man owned station that
daytime in Boston. They would have said no to that
any other because there's no way they would have not
try to promote promote the music, right, And I think
there were some people who were trying to figure out
we'll call them more shady ways of getting paid around

(01:13:07):
the music. And so that's what that sounds like. And
so ken Nash was never about that.

Speaker 1 (01:13:12):
Okay. So again this is me asking from the most
naive standpoint whatever, because I really never spoke to a
seasoned radio person. Is radio's existence or is its purpose
to promote music? No? What is radios? What is radio's purpose?

Speaker 8 (01:13:34):
It is to increase shareholder wealth. That's what it's there for.
That's what it's there for. Okay. Now, so there are
people who are in radio who love music, who want
to make sure that music thrives and gets a thrill
out of finding the new and exposing to other folks.
But radio's purpose itself is to increase shareholder wealth, and

(01:13:54):
it became more and more of that as more of
these conglomerates popped up, and they found wonderful ways of
doing it, and there's some cool creative stuff that's come
out of it, but that's not what they're there for.

Speaker 1 (01:14:03):
So the cheery on top is that you know, a
cat like you and I can discover Return to Forever,
or weather report or craft work you know along the way.
But radio is really about how Chrysler or Toyoda or
whatever company it is can sell their products now for

(01:14:26):
a kid. For me, listening to radio at thirteen is
the object that you'll play the songs that I love
so much that I'll control the dial in the car
so that when Dad hears that cool in the Gang
Slitch Want Liquor commercial, He'll like, yeah, I want some
you know, some beer or whatever like.

Speaker 8 (01:14:45):
So it depends depends on the station. Das was probably
trying to appeal to your dad. You can da, You're
probably trying to appeal to your dad at the right.

Speaker 1 (01:14:53):
But what I'm saying is that is the radio targeting
a twelve and thirteen year old depends on station. I mean,
well today, I know they're because of the artists that
are winning now. I mean, I'm sure the Rihanna's of
the world and the Tailor Swifts of the world are
hitting the eleven year olds in the twenty but.

Speaker 8 (01:15:08):
I guarantee you they're trying to hit eighteen to twenty four.
Maybe sixteen, but that's not one of the sellable demos.
But eighteen to twenty four is probably as low as
you're going. And they believe that, you know, the song
appeal to a thirteen or sixteen can can travel upward
as well.

Speaker 1 (01:15:21):
So your sweet spot is the sixteen to twenty five.

Speaker 8 (01:15:24):
Year old for certain stations. For other for like adult contemporary,
it's older.

Speaker 1 (01:15:29):
What's the station that was your highest listenership? Who had
the biggest audience?

Speaker 8 (01:15:33):
WBRU On Sundays we were in Providence, Rhode Island, and
no one else was playing black music at all. On
Sundays we would kill it.

Speaker 1 (01:15:40):
But you weren't thinking about demographics then, were you.

Speaker 8 (01:15:42):
We always think about demographics. We were ninety five point five,
so therefore we were on a commercial part of the dial.
We were always thinking about demographics always and we were
selling eighteen to thirty four at that time, so we
really wanted to make sure that we were hitting eighteen
to thirty four.

Speaker 1 (01:15:55):
We were.

Speaker 8 (01:15:56):
That's I mean, that's one of the great things about
that station. We had to think like a professional radio station.
But in doing that, we still did you have a
much looser format?

Speaker 1 (01:16:05):
Did you play candy Girl? If that's the case, absolutely,
but eighteen and thirty.

Speaker 8 (01:16:09):
Four the great here's the thing, here's the thing. So
we were able to cheat a little bit because there
was no other competition, so we had a we had
a captive audience and a loyal audience in a in
a good way. And you can kind of sell anything, right,
So for example, for for Candy Girl, we would go
on there and say, hey, I know you missed the
Jackson five or having these talented brothers out of Boston,

(01:16:31):
so you hit on the emotion of they used to
like their local and you hope they do well. So
that's the way you make something like Candy Girl work,
even though it's not necessarily for eighteen thirty four.

Speaker 1 (01:16:41):
So just was about, hey, this is a really good song, and.

Speaker 8 (01:16:44):
That as well. You want to find a really good song,
but you also want to find a way that did
it make it relevant, to make it relevant and make
it attach them to.

Speaker 7 (01:16:51):
They stay and don't turn the channel because they don't
recognize the song.

Speaker 1 (01:16:53):
So if thirty four is the closing get then for
for b are you at the time. But I would
think the older you are, the more you control the
purse strings in the house. So are you not thinking
a forty five year old, like if you're in a
household the dad who might be forty two, forty three
years old.

Speaker 8 (01:17:12):
So there's money at every level, Okay, there's there's just
you know, there's money at every level because especially eighteen
thirty four, you're controlling your own per springs, even though
it's not as much as the older, older audience, but
that's why they have I can't think of any station
that's a that's ah like the light stations. Yeah, like
anything that says light FM.

Speaker 7 (01:17:31):
You can just you just tattoo fifty four.

Speaker 1 (01:17:34):
I live there all right. The radio edumacation portion of
the show, I can stay on forever, but we kind
of have to go to DC a little bit and
go to BET. So what did you make your excess
from radio to television.

Speaker 8 (01:17:46):
Said ild I left IOD in ninety three. I went
to Dallas to go work at the Tom Joining Morning Show.
Was the first executive I was the first executive producer
of the Tom join of Morning Show for a year
and then was that like.

Speaker 1 (01:17:59):
It was what I learned.

Speaker 8 (01:18:00):
I learned. I learned how to do Selector, which is
a great, great music program one select Selector is a
music programming well I use it as a warehouse some
people use to program their stations. Like it's like you
put all of your songs in a computer in different
categories and then most people ask the computer to spit
out right.

Speaker 1 (01:18:18):
So you in categories in different categories.

Speaker 8 (01:18:20):
So in an hour, if you play twelve songs, you'll
play five heavies, four mediums, one brand new and one classic.

Speaker 1 (01:18:31):
Does that make sense? Oh no, that's how fradio has
been formated. Did you feel conflicted, Like no, no, no, no,
But that's what I'm saying.

Speaker 8 (01:18:39):
So what you do is you put in all the
number of heavies you have, which is probably which is
maybe ten, I'm way off of the numbers. But the
idea is you put in the computer and then it'll
spit out in the order that you asked wanted to
be in music, and most programmers program their stations that way.

Speaker 1 (01:18:54):
So when you say heavies, are you talking about heavy rotation?

Speaker 8 (01:18:56):
Yes, heavy rotation.

Speaker 7 (01:18:57):
It minds you. Every radio station uses this, saying.

Speaker 1 (01:19:00):
Program so ninety four, if you're talking about five heavies
in a month's time, are you singing that this song
will get played thirty times a day? And no?

Speaker 8 (01:19:11):
Okay? So can I do it differently? Once every two hours?
So once every two hours are heavy would get played?

Speaker 1 (01:19:17):
Right?

Speaker 8 (01:19:18):
And then now a heavy gets played like what once
every thirty five minutes?

Speaker 1 (01:19:22):
Like I could hear Marias Fantasy at least three times
in a two hour period on radio or belief.

Speaker 8 (01:19:28):
Yeah, that's true. I mean that that's probably about the time.

Speaker 1 (01:19:31):
Maybe two hours, right, maybe twice yep.

Speaker 8 (01:19:34):
But now it's like it lives won every thirty five minutes,
once every forty five minutes.

Speaker 1 (01:19:37):
Yikes.

Speaker 8 (01:19:37):
Because the measure the way they measure it is how.

Speaker 1 (01:19:39):
Did you feel about that? Like did you feel as
though the was it just like let's go with the
times or was it.

Speaker 8 (01:19:45):
Well, in ILD when I was a programmer, it was
you still had to do that because we still wanted
to keep the audience. But the fun wasn't the two
new records you got to play, right, because right, the
fun was the two.

Speaker 1 (01:19:56):
The fun was the new you want to play with hour.

Speaker 8 (01:19:58):
It's true, like so you know, and when you pick,
especially when it's either an album cut that nobody else
is playing or like still Seal and Tracy Chapman and
like Living, that was like it was like putting on
something that the other won't dare right, right, That's what
it was like.

Speaker 1 (01:20:12):
Okay, so here's a question. How long would a song
have been on the station before it hits heavy rotation?

Speaker 8 (01:20:16):
Oh my gosh, you to test my memory. Ten weeks?

Speaker 1 (01:20:19):
Okay, so ten weeks?

Speaker 8 (01:20:20):
What works itself up from light medium to heavy rotation?

Speaker 1 (01:20:23):
And it would stand for heavy rotation for like on average.

Speaker 8 (01:20:27):
If it was what was the Tony Terry song with
You With You Tony Terry stayed on for like half
a year. Oh my god, Tony Terry till to this
day is that song would not need to put bullets
in that thing, and it would not it would not
go down.

Speaker 1 (01:20:41):
Well, who determines the life of a heavy rotation?

Speaker 8 (01:20:44):
So you do research once you once you have a
song on there you no more call out research. You
call different people and play hooks for them over the phone,
and you find out how it's selling down at a
Nubian Notion UH in Dudley Square in Boston and find
out how it's selling its strawberries and town and so
you find out how people are engaging with the song.

Speaker 6 (01:21:03):
So, if you've ever gotten a promo seating and wondered
why call out research, hook was tracks two and three
and they were only seventeen seconds song, that's why.

Speaker 1 (01:21:10):
Yes, wow, So because.

Speaker 8 (01:21:12):
We always want to find out, like we're playing this stuff,
but do they like it? Do they not like it?

Speaker 1 (01:21:16):
I'm sorry I can't get off radio acause I.

Speaker 7 (01:21:19):
Was about to ask a radio but kind of still
transitioning your career question. So once you became a producer
for the Tom join and Morning Show, were you feeling
a little bit more? Is it more free less stress situation?
Because no more boss.

Speaker 8 (01:21:31):
But ninety four it was more stress around music because
if you remember, a lot of people do it now,
but back then, only Howard Stern was doing multiple shows,
multiple stations in multiple cities. Right, Tom Joyner was the
first black shock to do it. So it was really pioneering.
And what you have to do is we started off
from twelve stations, if I'm not mistaken, So on those

(01:21:53):
twelve stations, what you have to do is take all
the music from those twelve stations and you have to
find a common denominator for those twelve stations, which is
just a very very small subset of the music that's
being played or the music that's out that time. So
being the music person or one of the people put
together the music for that was stressful for the times
on the show because I would get a call from
who are programming Miami because we put on a song

(01:22:15):
that Chicago like, but they don't like it. So it
was really a restricted, restricted playlist, and when it came
to uptempo songs, it was it was.

Speaker 1 (01:22:23):
It was difficult. Sounds like a headache.

Speaker 8 (01:22:25):
It sounds like twelve headaches.

Speaker 7 (01:22:27):
So then you were ready for b ET because.

Speaker 8 (01:22:29):
So yeah, anyhow, so I was there for a year
and then I got an opportunity to go to MTV
because MTV was hiring people who did radio. They like,
we don't care if you don't have any TV experience.
We're looking for people who know how to program radio.

Speaker 1 (01:22:43):
So when were you at.

Speaker 8 (01:22:45):
I was an MTV ninety five to ninety nine. February
ninety five to April ninety.

Speaker 1 (01:22:50):
Nine, Oh right, when were you there doing Fred's period?
Fred got us? He did?

Speaker 8 (01:22:56):
He did?

Speaker 1 (01:22:57):
He did? Fred he did? Fred was Fred Jordan.

Speaker 8 (01:23:01):
Of course, of course I'm not. I'm not never mind,
I was not connecting that very obvious dot.

Speaker 1 (01:23:05):
Yeah, Fred Jordan was Fred Jordan, the late great Fred Jordan.
Like one of his last acts of greatness was I'm
not just babing, I'm like, please play my video. Yeah,
and Fred got you got me on like medium MTV rotation.

Speaker 8 (01:23:23):
Well you're instantly nineteen ninety nine, and it's hard one
nine trying to think I was there everywhere.

Speaker 1 (01:23:30):
It took MTV a second. By April of nineteen ninety nine,
they finally jumped aboard and that really that started. That's
when we were like, oh my god, like five hundred
thousand people brought this record like we couldn't believe it.

Speaker 8 (01:23:45):
Like I'll tell you the record where I realized the
power of MTV.

Speaker 1 (01:23:49):
What Skilo I Wish.

Speaker 8 (01:23:51):
Oh Man, ski Loo I Wish was shortly after I
got there.

Speaker 1 (01:23:55):
I still love this song. I love that song.

Speaker 8 (01:23:57):
I was like, oh my Like it was just fun.
It was everything a video should be like it was.
And one of the things I loved it was inexpensive
right now was that was the time when when budgets
on videos were starting to go up. And what I
loved about it, I was like, no, no, no, show
people that if you just have a great concept, the
cool song, you can spend little money, don't have to
spend crazy money. I love that about it. And Skilo

(01:24:18):
went gold, like Skilo I Wish went gold, and I
was like, Oh, that's that's what MTV can do.

Speaker 1 (01:24:25):
Yeah. Shortly after I got there, during that time period,
I mean, MTV gave you regular rotation for at least
two or three months. Your life literally literally changed. But
what was it like in that system once you got there?
What was your position once you.

Speaker 8 (01:24:41):
I was a director of music program. Yes, I was
director of music, not the director because there was there
was a bunch of us, myself, Lewis Largent, Kurt Stephik,
Fred Jordan was a manager. Patti Galuzzi ran the rand
the apartment along with Andy Shown was there when I
was there.

Speaker 7 (01:24:56):
So were you the black guy?

Speaker 8 (01:24:58):
I was the black guy? I was a black guy, Yes,
but I was. I was like the black scenior.

Speaker 1 (01:25:04):
Were you the ear to the streets?

Speaker 8 (01:25:05):
No? Fred was always the ear to the streets, right,
I was the streets?

Speaker 1 (01:25:10):
Yeah, yeah, yes, Baltic Avenue. Yes.

Speaker 8 (01:25:12):
And Jack Benson to Jack Benson, who was a producer,
he wasn't on the music team Jack Jack Benson. Jack
Benson as well, was like, yeah, yeah, Jack is Jack was.
Jack was fighting the good fight long before I got there.

Speaker 1 (01:25:23):
How would you guys arm wrestled space of what got
to I haven't thought about this at all, like the
Motown system where the whole staff sits there and watches
the video. Yeah.

Speaker 8 (01:25:36):
Absolutely, Monday we'd have the video meetings. We'd see what
got accepted, like this is for yo, this is for
one hundred and twenty minutes, this is for regular rotation.
And on Tuesday we'd have the music meeting. Fred eventually
came into the meeting. FREDA wasn't in the meeting when
I first got there. Kurt Lewis, Paddick Lutzi, Sherry Howe
and we'd all kind of have it out for what
what music should be where, and it wasn't. It wasn't

(01:25:57):
unlike radio, and that's why they I think it had
had radio folks come in and do a lot of
work on MTV, especially when it came to programming the music.
There are some great ones. I thought we'd you know,
there's some real misses we had, and one mentioned. Julie
Greenwald from Atlantic Records, who formerly of Deaf Jam, mentioned
one at the Revolte conference the other day and she

(01:26:18):
put on Instagram and actually commented behind it.

Speaker 1 (01:26:20):
Wait, I want to guess good because I'm trying to
figure out the mine of Julie.

Speaker 8 (01:26:23):
It was a miss.

Speaker 1 (01:26:24):
It was on Atlantic. No, no, no, it wasn't.

Speaker 8 (01:26:25):
Remember she was Deaf Jam at the time, and they
really wanted to come on the MTV. I remember New
York's Times called it the love song of.

Speaker 1 (01:26:31):
The of the Summer els. What year is this? I
think it was ninety five. N one sweet Day. Nope,
method of Mary Oh, okay, the method of Mary Oh.
I need to get by it. Wow.

Speaker 8 (01:26:47):
And they brought that video up. They tried to get
on regular rotation and I was brand new, so I
didn't know my way around. One of the stories of the
biggest regrets, and I remember somebody on the team said,
I remember these words, it's too.

Speaker 1 (01:26:57):
Dark in street. Oh my god.

Speaker 8 (01:27:01):
I was like, I didn't know what to do with
at the time.

Speaker 1 (01:27:02):
I just I was brand new.

Speaker 7 (01:27:04):
You didn't know what to say in that room at
the time, right, Like what do you say to that?

Speaker 1 (01:27:08):
Too early to raise my fist? Like so and so
we it was.

Speaker 8 (01:27:14):
It was in yo MTV, but it never really got
on a full rotation that it deserved while it was
on there.

Speaker 1 (01:27:18):
But but remember it being played a lot. But you're
saying that it could have been. It could have been
played more, could it wasn't?

Speaker 8 (01:27:24):
It really was that it wasn't. You didn't get played
on regular rotation that much on MTV.

Speaker 6 (01:27:29):
How many how many videos would MTV keeping in heavy
rotation at the time.

Speaker 8 (01:27:33):
I can't remember. It's somewhere in the low teens, I think.
I don't think of because Cake was one of those.
Something about that video and about that.

Speaker 1 (01:27:40):
Song was great. Yeah, I love that song and video.
So you weren't dealing with just quote urban videos as well.
You you were dealing.

Speaker 8 (01:27:48):
With absolutely yeah, with all formats, all formats.

Speaker 1 (01:27:52):
How did labels feel about that?

Speaker 8 (01:27:54):
What do you mean?

Speaker 1 (01:27:55):
Well, Sylvia Rone told me some stories about how Metallica
felt about being their boss. But you know, what's what
a label feel about you if you don't think that
it's not necessarily working. They kind of want to be like, uh, well,
let me see what I think. So they they call, uh,

(01:28:17):
who's the president?

Speaker 8 (01:28:18):
Was not Andy Shoon was running at them. Judy Judy, Judy,
Judy McGrath was kind of overdall and.

Speaker 1 (01:28:23):
It was sort of like, I want to talk to
your boss and see what she thinks.

Speaker 8 (01:28:27):
And that happened every once in a while, but it
wasn't It wasn't a regular occurrence. And I think people
understood and respected all different types of music. I think
people were surprised that I was that that the black
guy like stuff other than black and music as well.
I think that came to a shocker to some folks
at first of the labels. But that was that was
short lived. It was a great time. That was a

(01:28:49):
great time, and at a time when music was was
was was kind of booming. It was it was you know,
post Nirvana. But uh but read how Chili Pepper is
still going and so but how is it dealing?

Speaker 1 (01:28:59):
I mean, how's that for you? Personally? At least trying
to not speak two languages. I know, like as a
black person. Yeah, I mean everyone has to naturally know
two languages. The Great Dave Chappelle says that you know
black men speak uh English, Well no, we and yeah

(01:29:19):
job interview. So I mean you found yourself often in
positions in the boardroom having to prove your pedigree as
far as your music knowledge is just well beyond knowing,
you know what what the black artists are doing, and.

Speaker 8 (01:29:37):
Just with anything in any job, you just got to prove.
You got to prove that you belonged there. It wasn't
I don't felt like. I don't think it was. I
had to prove myself anymore, just had to prove that
I belonged there. I had to talk the language that
like I know my music. I know I know my rock,
I know my I know my you know my hip
hop thinks to and some of that was like I
also knew what I didn't know, right, And that's why

(01:29:58):
I have such a such a place for Fred, because Fred,
Fred got it, Fred got stuff.

Speaker 1 (01:30:04):
Fred was.

Speaker 8 (01:30:06):
It hurts to talk about him sometimes he was just
he was other not otherworldly, but he was just a
very special guy. And that artists loved him, and he
understood music, and he knew what was the next trend
was he called he called cash money like a good
year and a half before it really popped off. He
called master p before that popped off. He was DiAngelo

(01:30:27):
long before d popped off.

Speaker 4 (01:30:30):
Uh.

Speaker 8 (01:30:30):
And I know they had a very very very special relationship.
And so also so part of what was me knowing
knowing what I didn't know. But so sometimes Fred would
Fred would come with the Uh. Fred would come with
the knowledge, and I'm like, great, I'm gonna take this
in the meeting and and let's see, let's see what
we can do with it.

Speaker 1 (01:30:48):
Okay.

Speaker 8 (01:30:49):
Favorite thing is that Fred Fred I'm the guy who
liked the slow version of him my Bed by Drew Hill,
and Fred was like, nah, dude, the remakeer.

Speaker 1 (01:31:01):
So how at this level? Now got to ask, at
this level, how do artists handle rejection at this level
of your career, people that know that you're connected to
the label. I'm not asking for Suge Night stories. I'm
just saying that, you know, by this point in the

(01:31:24):
mid nineties, there's definitely a more hostile environment, especially with
the uprising of hip hop and where it's come to
where you know, it's about dollars and cents in the
popularity of you know, are you allowed to express I

(01:31:45):
don't know if I'm feeling this video or not. And
you know, then you're somewhere at dinner in lam and
you have to see an executive and you know, how
come you ain't playing it? Like how do you because
you were so active between that period in the mid
to mid ninety to the early arts, like how did
you handle the juggling act of artists and executives egos?

Speaker 8 (01:32:11):
So two things I think One is that MTV we
always try to find a place for something, even if
it was just one spin on MTV on YOUO, MTV raps,
the weekend version, right, we always try to find a
place for something that was that was that was our
that was our mantra, that was our mindset, like there's
got to somebody's gonna love this. You know, an alternative
rock could get a play one hundred and twenty minutes.

(01:32:34):
So I think people understood were always trying to find something.

Speaker 1 (01:32:36):
That's one.

Speaker 8 (01:32:37):
Two is that I found it was advantageous to establish
very early that this is a long game. I know,
I plan on being around for a while, so we
not we're not going to have this conversation. We're gonna
have this conversation, but we're not gonna lose our relationship
over one song because you're gonna come back again and
you know, so we're let's let's do this dance for
a long term, because there's sometimes we're gonna be able

(01:32:58):
to do stuff, do stuff the way you want it,
and other times we're not gonna. We're not going to
So I think, and I think everybody.

Speaker 1 (01:33:03):
I think. So you're saying that they knew not to
bite the hand that feeds them.

Speaker 8 (01:33:11):
I don't see I mean I don't.

Speaker 1 (01:33:16):
Think.

Speaker 8 (01:33:16):
I don't I don't see it that way because it's
not a matter of biting the hand, Like what what
could they do, like, you know, not give us the
videos or we were especially then you know, there was
still a lot of music being played on m t V.
And so it just didn't make it didn't make any
and can't remember it came. It came, but.

Speaker 1 (01:33:33):
Someone's ego had to get shattered. That was that big.
I mean at some point.

Speaker 6 (01:33:38):
Like if Kanya had been around, no, I mean, okay,
let's take uh okay.

Speaker 1 (01:33:43):
You weren't you were going by the time Forever came out.
Uh when when when the Puffies Forever album come out?
I want to say, no, what came up?

Speaker 8 (01:33:57):
Which is, uh, did Forever have a which was hate
Me Now?

Speaker 1 (01:34:01):
That was? That was But do you have a hate
Me Now story?

Speaker 4 (01:34:07):
Oh?

Speaker 7 (01:34:08):
That was a Stout?

Speaker 1 (01:34:11):
So is there a good.

Speaker 8 (01:34:13):
Steve Stout story, Steve Stout story I think has been
told that.

Speaker 1 (01:34:17):
Is there a good Puffy story? Well, my last week.

Speaker 8 (01:34:22):
My last week get MTV, there was an executive from
Bad Boy that while puff was going his route, they
were right across the street, actually in the building that
we exist in right now, and came across to fifteen
fifteen Broadway with a couple of very very large gentlemen. Uh,
to facilitate his movement. Executive came over to try to

(01:34:45):
you know, to intimidate, to intimidate people in the music department.
Now I don't want to use any proper nouns, but
there was there was a guy will we'll call him Bob,
Bob who was who was new and was running the
department and and wasn't used to this type type of activity,

(01:35:05):
right was used the.

Speaker 1 (01:35:06):
Type of activity and so.

Speaker 8 (01:35:10):
I and Fred understanding that this activity was not going
to bode well for the long term. Again, this is
about a long term play. Yes, there was a mistake
made about playing and this was about playing the video
with Nas and Puff and someone he was on a
cross and they weren't supposed to.

Speaker 1 (01:35:28):
Yeah, I was going to say the controversy was the
fact that Puffy didn't want to be seen as on
the cross. That is correct, That is that was controversy.
That was the controversy.

Speaker 8 (01:35:36):
He did not want to be seen on the cross.

Speaker 1 (01:35:39):
Why did you shoot it?

Speaker 8 (01:35:41):
Well, because by the way, and I support that, you
don't edit in the field. You edit in the room, right,
and you make so you can make decisions' You can't
go like, oh we should have shot that.

Speaker 1 (01:35:49):
So he didn't get final say he did.

Speaker 8 (01:35:52):
There was a mistake, There was an there was a
there was a so there were standards issues where standards
means like, oh, you can't do that because that's going
to get us, you know, in trouble, and there's creative issues.
So in that all the standards issues were taken care
of in the edit. Puff being on a cross wasn't
a standards issue. It was a creative issue. The creative
issue didn't get taken care of, and so it aired

(01:36:13):
with puff on the cross, you know, right, the puff
stouts thing. I don't I can't talk about that because
I wasn't there that that's documented, But a couple of
folks came across the street and.

Speaker 1 (01:36:24):
Like what went on.

Speaker 8 (01:36:25):
Now, the part the problem, of course, was there's nothing
that could have been done. You can't untake it off,
you can't have un people unsee it. So that wasn't
really that wasn't a good use of force. It just
wasn't a smart use of force. It was just a
use of force out of anger, not out of intelligence
or thinking it.

Speaker 1 (01:36:40):
Well, I was going to say, why were the unsavory
gentlemen at fifteen to fifty Broadway and not at the
editor's post or.

Speaker 8 (01:36:48):
Closer access?

Speaker 1 (01:36:50):
So are you saying that they called you guys and
said stop playing the video, and you guys said nope.

Speaker 8 (01:36:56):
No, that's the point. The point is all they had
to do is say, don't play the video. Wouldn't play
the video again the first The fact they played in
the first place was a mistake. We knew that it was.
It was out of emotion, So it was Sonny qualleone,
not Michael. That's the best way to put it.

Speaker 6 (01:37:08):
So the video came had the video had to have
come from the label, right, yes, So somebody at the
label screwed up so or in a way yes, so
like did the label does not have the right they
did not have the final version?

Speaker 1 (01:37:25):
Or did they said too?

Speaker 8 (01:37:27):
I think if I remember correctly, you test my memory,
I think we had two versions. The wrong one got
played because I remember it was a creative issue, not
a standards issue. So we had the one that that
and the one that got played was the one that
took care of all the standards issues. And so that's
how the that's how the wrong got played. But I
think that was the one and only time it was played.
There was no there was actually nothing to be gained
by coming over and doing that, right because except and

(01:37:48):
and sure enough I've talked about it. You know, you
play for the long you play for the long ball.
That damaged the relationship. And that was literally my last
week at MTV. Not because of that, it was just
it was scheduled at all. We're rid of the last
week and I've always I'll take this moment and say
I was I loved MTV and being there.

Speaker 1 (01:38:05):
It was very cool.

Speaker 8 (01:38:06):
Even after I announced where I was leaving and where
I was going, they let me stay, like I remember,
let me finish out the week. It wasn't like close
up your laptop and close computering to leave right now.
And I've always I was. I always had a loft
foot up for that.

Speaker 1 (01:38:17):
So at the time, was BT part of the uh
Viacom conglomerate over the independent.

Speaker 8 (01:38:23):
BT was independently owned, was privately owned. Bob Johnson, of course,
is the person who founded it. He had taken it
public and then taken it private again, so he he
was the major shareholder or it was. It was privately
owned at that point in.

Speaker 1 (01:38:36):
Time, and you felt like that was a better move
or a better at that's what you know.

Speaker 8 (01:38:40):
I I here's where I put it. I put I
decided to put my job where my mouth was right.

Speaker 1 (01:38:45):
I looked at it.

Speaker 8 (01:38:46):
I looked at it and said like, oh, maybe could be
a little bit better or do a little bit different.
And I knew that there was some different ways that
labels were treating BT and and MTV at the time,
and so there was just an opportunity to to make
a change and so it was some of the in.

Speaker 1 (01:39:04):
The beginning, what were your thoughts of BT, Like, did
you see it as the kind of the kid redhead
step style of the videos.

Speaker 7 (01:39:13):
Showing immediately say I have to change that, or.

Speaker 1 (01:39:19):
Like we can step this up a little bit or
that sort of.

Speaker 8 (01:39:22):
I think it was more we can we can step
this up? You know, I knew it was it was.
It was handcuffed by being in d C. Being in
DC was a great thing for because when Bob needed
to get stuff done on Capitol Hill, that was the
perfect place to be. But to be to really be
an entertainment a player in the entertainment world, it was
tough being in DC.

Speaker 1 (01:39:41):
So it was kind of the motown Detroit.

Speaker 8 (01:39:46):
Yeah, yeah, but except except the talent lived in Detroit,
so that was great. The talent coming to d C
was always a bit of a challenge, like it was,
you know, it's out of the way, right and so
one of the first things in my interview I was like,
but what do you think about moving some parts of
your stuff to New York?

Speaker 1 (01:40:04):
And so were they receptive or yeah?

Speaker 8 (01:40:06):
Within within a year we I got there and I
got there in June April April May of ninety nine
and we kicked off one of six park on September
September eleventh, two thousand. I was in the room, like
there was a bunch of us but yeah, but but yeah,
there was a.

Speaker 1 (01:40:25):
I remember there was talk amongst us, you know, my peers,
that you know, they're going to have a black TRL.
I was like, how is that going to work? And
you know I could have I couldn't imagine such a thing,
and so yeah, yeah, it actually worked.

Speaker 8 (01:40:42):
It was. It was yeah, it was. It was live
TV New York.

Speaker 1 (01:40:47):
A J and Free a J.

Speaker 8 (01:40:48):
Was actually supposed to be a J was actually we
were we were getting a J to help us find posts.
And then I saw how we how we how we
work with people and how people reacted to him. I'm like, no,
that that's.

Speaker 7 (01:40:58):
You because AJ and he went to like Howard is
stuff because I J and ali Al used to work
against the wall right on Howard Who's yeah, yeah, we
used to go in high school. We went to Bannkers,
so we would go down there. But he would make
us laugh.

Speaker 8 (01:41:14):
Yeah he's still doing it. He's still doing that today.
And then Free Free actually was a Free was an
intern at w I L d in Boston. I know,
I knew free Seen she was fifteen, sixteen years old,
oh wow, and always had that personality. She was down
with the qua clefs.

Speaker 1 (01:41:27):
Clue with it. She was, yes, she was, Oh yeah,
she was marine. That's right, Mariet, that's right. Yeah, the free.

Speaker 3 (01:41:38):
Girl.

Speaker 8 (01:41:38):
WPGC sister absolutely absolutely shout to a j N free Wow,
what damn?

Speaker 7 (01:41:44):
There must be something, you know what, you must be
very proud. You have some some great talent that's come through.
And all my kids like AJ has really done it, Rocky.

Speaker 8 (01:41:52):
Has done it, Roxy, Terrence is killing Terrence is killing it.

Speaker 7 (01:41:56):
I mean really Tickets killing it on his own little
way too, you know what I'm saying. So wow, yeah, a.

Speaker 1 (01:42:01):
Lot so where kids? So at this point, like how
do you besides the New York recommendation, Like what's the
reception to you kind of coming in shaking things up?
Or was it it was Jed read like the art
of war to figure out? Like can you even talk
about this?

Speaker 8 (01:42:22):
I can't because because it was it was people wanted
to you know, Deborly and and and and and Bob
Johnson really wanted to want to change. They wanted to
be a kind of a. They want to be bigger player,
bigger players in the game, and so they were absolutely
open to change and and and and and and uh
you know, for example, there only used to be like
like six months a year, and the rest of them

(01:42:43):
were repeats throughout the summer, so you could you could
change the videos, but the but the but the interviews
were sometimes like four months old. And so one of
the first things we did was was, Okay, was going
to keep some of the music up all year. Get
great personalities, Hits from the street, you know, Hits from
the Streets still one of my favorite people in the world.
Hits from the Street literally came from like second week there.
I'm having meetings with people and have this meeting with

(01:43:05):
a group of people and uh, everybody leaves accept him.
I'm like, oh, you in this department saying no, I
just came in for the meeting. I heard you knew,
I'm your guy. I'm funny, and I do this and
I'm like, and somebody's told me not to kick him
out of the office. And so I said, Okay, here's
what I need you to do. I need you to
take get a cam quarter, big ass cam quarters in
the day and just go somewhere and for half an hour,

(01:43:26):
just play with people, right, just just just get's interact
with people. He said, I don't have a camcram quarter,
And I said, if you really want this gig, you'll
find a cam quarder, right, And so he went and
got a cam quarter and went down to Union Station.
And I don't remember every one of his bits. Number one,
I never watched the whole tape. Number two, one of
his bits was going to somebody, you know, play listen,

(01:43:49):
I'm getting I'm getting the I'm getting my friend a
birthday gift. You look about the side, would you mind
trying it on for me? Just see see if it fits.
There's no problem, and he pulls out a condom and
so literally the first fifteen minutes, first fifteen minutes of
that tape were so fun. I never looked at the

(01:44:09):
last fifteen minutes and we we Oh my gosh, I'm
just remembering. So when I came there, they had already
ad sales. The ad sales team had already sold the
titles of the shows, and so I was stuck with
the titles of the shows. But I could do whatever
I wanted to with them, right, So Hits from the
Street was a title I had to had to use.
It didn't matter what the show was. The show had
to be called Hits from the Streets. And so since

(01:44:31):
I had that title, I just called him hits. We
just called him hits. The show hits from the streets,
And so we sent him on the streets and so
we becme Hits from the Streets. Ceta's original name was
jam Zone Jam Zone Time. It was way ahead of
her time.

Speaker 1 (01:44:46):
Yeah, she was like the black Max head Room yet
of Okay, bad reference, but okay, I always watch your
face to see if it was too.

Speaker 7 (01:44:57):
No, I agree, but she's a little bit more comfortab.

Speaker 8 (01:45:00):
Yeah, she got she she got away with saying stuff that, like,
you know, a live person couldn't have done, couldn't have done,
couldn't have done because there was somebody coming and break
the mystery.

Speaker 7 (01:45:09):
Who was she?

Speaker 1 (01:45:10):
I met her, you know, Troy. Her name is Cally Troy.
She told me close my eyes and then she started
talking like yeah, but her voice is like nothing like that.

Speaker 7 (01:45:21):
No, no, no, no.

Speaker 8 (01:45:23):
The name Ceda came from the person who actually drew
the design for the for for the character Cita.

Speaker 1 (01:45:28):
That was her name it's time for a Cedar revival.
I'm sorry, I wouldn't look.

Speaker 8 (01:45:33):
Different more like you saw, by the way, and it
was I thought it was brilliant the person somebody put
together the B T Harlem shake when that was the
big thing, and all of a sudden, the dude the
Harlem shake and Ceda comes in going from left and right.

Speaker 1 (01:45:44):
I was like, that's championship move right there.

Speaker 7 (01:45:51):
Yo, I gotta ask you because one thing about you.
I mean, people watch BT, they see you periodically, but
you always look like you are having a ball. Like
when was the first time and this gig when it
was like official, you were having a ball. You were
loving this job.

Speaker 1 (01:46:04):
This is it. He's always like always from the beginning,
because I always see you at concerts. Yes, yes, even
at the Police when the Police reunited. That's right, when
the police, Yes, two black guys in the audience jumping
their asses off and the whole audience was like too
cool for school, And that's right. And by the way,

(01:46:24):
and man, because because Stuart Copeland wasn't playing it like
you did on the record, I know, but they were,
you know, these something they I was waiting for that
just for the fact that they were there. That was
enough for me.

Speaker 8 (01:46:39):
It was so how do you do this?

Speaker 7 (01:46:41):
Steve? And this is interesting because you have such a
dynamic like music taste and now you're at BT Like
it was different when you were a MTV you had this,
you had that. Now it's a little bit more of
a box. It's just a big box, but it's a
little bit more. But how do you survive in that?
And then at the same time you have to create
standards for what you're going to do in that box
because it wasn't like it was like your college show

(01:47:01):
where you just played black music, you know what I mean?
You had standards. So how did you survive with this
mentality of free music life in this box?

Speaker 8 (01:47:12):
I'm not sure I understand.

Speaker 5 (01:47:13):
I think he's trying to ask, like, how do you
reconcile the ship you like versus the ship you have?

Speaker 7 (01:47:17):
Yeah, that was trying to make it sound real pretty.

Speaker 8 (01:47:20):
There's a lot of there's a lot of people who
who have to work. Now, that's not gonna sound right
like I love this music thing. I love this music,
I love I love television, but my heart is my
heart is in music. And so the fact that I
get to work in music at all is just the
greatest thing in the world. I still have hobby, you know,
I'm still going to go see you know, Radiohead. Traveling

(01:47:43):
around the world to see Radiohead is my thing.

Speaker 1 (01:47:45):
That's my thing.

Speaker 8 (01:47:45):
It will never be my it won't be my job anymore.
It was when as an MTV I could make that
that but but it's I just love doing it.

Speaker 7 (01:47:53):
So so you're really living still living your life. Like
basically I feel like like a black radio person whereas
like we do have other tastes. But however, at my job,
this is what you do.

Speaker 8 (01:48:02):
Oh yeah, absolutely absolutely, But also you try to you
try to try to put not my taste but part
of the cool thing. I never never lose the desire
and the love of like, oh shoot this brand new
like Anderson pack on the on the BET Awards year,
not painting many people who knew who Anderson.

Speaker 7 (01:48:20):
Yeah, I was thankful for Thank you for that.

Speaker 8 (01:48:22):
No, no, no, no, that it's the It's the thing
we love to do. Do we put on the BT
Awards like we want to find two people that nobody
knows about and hopefully people will put people will people
will pick up on it.

Speaker 5 (01:48:33):
Do you think that you know, because uh, I had
a group at one time, Little Brother, not ringing ringing, uh,
you know use and at the time there was a
we had a video and it was.

Speaker 1 (01:48:53):
The rumor was that it was we we got from
BT that was too intelligent for the listeners.

Speaker 8 (01:48:58):
I spent years trying to track that down, like like
literally they just did no joke, no, no, for real,
because that made no sense to me because given and
I don't remember the exact time period, but like this
part about always wanting to expose and go new directions
of music is not new, and so for us to
anybody say that's too intelligent just flies in the face
of everything that I had done in my career and
that that our team wanted to do. So and I

(01:49:22):
swear to go except like, who said to anybody on
the team that was too intelligent? I never found out
who that was.

Speaker 5 (01:49:26):
No, I mean we didn't either, And I mean after
a while, it was just whatever on the internet. It
really could have just been something that came out of
a fucking internet form or form or whatever. Yet, right,
so my question was, do you think now you know
a group like a Little Brother. I mean, it's not
about me, but just like a group like that, do
you think they have more because from what I've seen,

(01:49:47):
it seems to me like y'all have more leeway now
in terms of like getting the Anderson Park and the
stuff y'all doing with the Ciphers, you know what I mean.
It seems like y'all have more leeway now to really
put new people on than you did, say ten years ago,
like when we were kind of doing I mean, that's
how it seems to me.

Speaker 8 (01:50:03):
So we have to do it in a different form
because again, like like radio, when we were doing you know's,
there's tons of videos that I've loved that we just
couldn't play there. There's far more good music than there
are slots to put it in when you're trying to
programming it on radio. You know, I saw, I saw
you crinkle your eyebrows when I say like twelve and
twelve specific an hours, five heavies. But that's that's just

(01:50:24):
the reality of the business. But on the Ciphers, on
those music matters slots that we that we did, that
we do on the BT Awards, that's when we get
to like, Okay, we can't do it repeatedly like we
do with videos, But we can show people like this
is some dope stuff. You should know?

Speaker 5 (01:50:41):
Yeah, you should you should know this. What is the
challenge for y'all in terms of like staying relevant which
is a word that I hate, but I think you
understand the context of what I mean. You know, in
a in an era where we live in where you know,
videos and stuff are pretty much on demand now and
you know, just the way that people consume music is
totally different, and there's so much more. You know, you're

(01:51:05):
a network, but you're competing with celebrities on Snapchat, you
know what I mean?

Speaker 1 (01:51:10):
How how do you adapt to that? We've had?

Speaker 8 (01:51:13):
I mean, when it comes to music, there's there's the
music on BT right now is really it's in our
It's our tempoles and our award shows, a lot of
there's some stuff on Centric. We have BT Jams, which
is still completely video uh BT Soul as well. But
the idea of playing videos on on BET propers is
it's a tough thing to do now. We don't have

(01:51:34):
any video shows on on BT like V Yeah, yeah,
because because to your point, everything's moved online. You know,
you used to sit around with man Man when that
new Little Bow Wow video comes on, We're sitting right
in front of that TV. I'm gonna be right there,
and now it's like, you.

Speaker 1 (01:51:49):
Know, I can use exactly you see it. There's there's
no As a result, you lose some of the discovery
that comes along with.

Speaker 8 (01:51:57):
But I'm fascinated by folks like like like Chance the Rapper.
I love seeing here what I love. I love seeing
Chance the Rapper at the top of the this thing
comes out that you know, the top songs being played
at radio, and it has the name the song and
the artist and the number of weeks it's been on.

Speaker 1 (01:52:12):
And the label it's on. Right.

Speaker 8 (01:52:14):
I love seeing Chance the Rapper and having no late label.

Speaker 1 (01:52:17):
That was That was fantastic.

Speaker 8 (01:52:19):
The last thing I remember that happening was Drake, the
best I ever had before before he signed. Right, that's
the last number one without a label. So there's just
different ways, you know. I think somebody's going to make
a whole bunch of money when they figure out how
to harness that. Okay, how do you how do you
reach critical mass at the same time on the internet.

(01:52:40):
I don't think anybody's really done that successfully repetitively yet.
But there's these things that break through and it's just
it's fantastic to see hurts our business as a music lover,
and I'd love to have more music on B E
T proper. You know it's above for me, but I
love but for the game I love the people can
do that. I love the people don't have to be
dependent on a distribution source to get their music.

Speaker 1 (01:53:02):
Hurt So in your world, what is the perfect what
what's the what's your vision of Okay, now, especially now
that you're president, Like, what is the vision two? Make
it perfect? Like what is your perfect vision of B

(01:53:22):
E T? It's good to.

Speaker 8 (01:53:25):
Make to make entertaining programming. The people are either doubled
over in laughter with or all up engaged in the drama. Right,
if I can do being married Jane times three and
Real Husbands of Hollywood times four while doing things like
Charged the DA versus Black America, which we did last night,
you'd be stunned how many people don't know what a

(01:53:47):
DA does, who their d d A is or or
or how they can elect them.

Speaker 1 (01:53:52):
Right, and yet the DA.

Speaker 8 (01:53:54):
Has more to do with how people, how people go
to get charged and go to jail than the police.
Everybody's focused on the police. And for an American interaction,
it's all about the DA. All the police do is
deliver you to the door, right. The DA decides whether
what you have in your pocket is going to get
you probation or a twenty year or get charged for
twenty years. And so when we get to do programs

(01:54:15):
like that, I love that as well. We did we
did I think a great show on on OJ Simpson
when we talking about OJ Simpson and we went back
to the hood where O. J. Simpson came from and
went from that perspective. So if you can get people
to think about your programming plus double over laughter and
be involved with the drama, that's the thing.

Speaker 1 (01:54:31):
And then of course the big award show.

Speaker 7 (01:54:32):
So how do you on a smaller note, I'm just curious,
how do y'all decide what you're gonna syndicate because I
know you guys have like Wendy Williams and I think
you do scandal.

Speaker 8 (01:54:41):
I thought you used to do scan.

Speaker 7 (01:54:43):
Yeah, but that's just interesting too, because I always thought
it was interesting what shows you decide to do that,
which is BT now had so many original programming, But.

Speaker 8 (01:54:50):
How did you There's a lot of hours in the
day and you gotta fiell. I think every kind of
all cable stations are building that model of you. You
you you syndicate a bit, you do a little bit
of original programming, and then sometimes you do do some
tenpoles and so you know, with that same thing we wanted,
you know, we got scandal because that was drama that
everybody was all up in at the time.

Speaker 6 (01:55:06):
Uh yeah, I thought that was really soon that that
started was being syndicated because it was like.

Speaker 1 (01:55:12):
One of the Yeah.

Speaker 8 (01:55:14):
But but but that's the way, that's the way it's happening. Now,
things are coming on, things are coming on getting syndicated sooner.
But but there's challenges around that because now you can
find almost like with with videos, you can find them
wherever you want to on your device or wherever. Yeah,
well I would have lost that. I don't have lost
that fight. I would I would have lost that beat.
Ten years ago, someone said, ten years ago, I'm gonna
give you something the size of your phone, and you're

(01:55:35):
gonna watch a video, not just a video, but you're
gonna watch something for in half an hour, two hours
straight on this No, no, no, it's not gonna happen.

Speaker 1 (01:55:43):
But I lost that I lost that I lost that one. Yeah,
I like scandal you did.

Speaker 7 (01:55:51):
It's not an original program in Steve, you gotta.

Speaker 1 (01:55:54):
It's syndicated, alright, he likes it. Hey, Mikey, be like,
so I would be remiss if I didn't bring up
kind of the the the contra well not the controversy,
but I mean, obviously in some people's eyes, they you know,

(01:56:17):
there's people that like, Thank God for BT, and they
focus on stuff I want to see, and then there's
another Yeah, the critics, the criticism.

Speaker 5 (01:56:28):
First of all, I hate that BT Young Cut went away, know,
and I'm gonna tell you why.

Speaker 1 (01:56:34):
I'm gonna I'm just keep on hunting with you.

Speaker 5 (01:56:37):
I like BT Young Cut because it came on at
a time when no children should be up anyway, you
know what I mean, And so like it came on.

Speaker 1 (01:56:45):
So I was one of the supporters, you know, regardless
of whatever.

Speaker 5 (01:56:49):
I was one of the people that defended BT for
I'm like, listen, we all watch these songs.

Speaker 1 (01:56:55):
It birthed us some of the greatest songs. What that
Thing Smell Like? Come On by Black Jesus On the
personal favorite of mine, you know what I mean.

Speaker 7 (01:57:02):
They had a whole open episode about y'all like, that's amazing. Yeah,
I mean they brought on the.

Speaker 6 (01:57:09):
Girls, and there was there was a rumor, like I
guess a year or so ago that BT.

Speaker 1 (01:57:16):
Cut was coming back.

Speaker 8 (01:57:19):
April Fool's joke. But it split between people who are like, ah,
that's very funny, people like I can't believe way back.

Speaker 6 (01:57:27):
But wait, wait, wait the way cable television is now
actually because I mean, like the Fax and A, A
and E are being very very more relaxed about language nudity.

Speaker 8 (01:57:45):
It would never work because you get it online right now.
That's that's the only reason it would never work. It's
it's available everywhere now. That's that's the that's the you know,
it wouldn't be a surprise now, it wouldn't be a
shock now if it were on, But it just wouldn't
rate well.

Speaker 1 (01:57:58):
And that's the thing. Look.

Speaker 8 (01:58:00):
Bt Uncut was created because there were all these videos
we were editing, and and again I come from place
on I want people's artistics. They're right, I don't know
if the laughter is about them.

Speaker 5 (01:58:12):
No, No, I'm thinking about you because I had a
vision in my head of you editing Neddy Nellie's tip
to video.

Speaker 8 (01:58:23):
We'll come back to Nellie tip. But the idea was like,
there's all these videos coming, we have to edit them
so people can watch them during the daytime. But you
want to say they have artistic, artistic expression and then
to your point, like, let's put them on later so
they're just uncut. Right, this is just it that you know,
we can't put porn on but but but but you know,
we don't want to. But so it was for videos

(01:58:46):
that it kind of existed but in there and we
play them in the natural form during uncut and then
the edited form during the day. The challenge came when
people started making videos for specifically for uncut, and so
that was the that was the challenge that people were like, oh,
that's the way we're going. We're not even gonna work
because everybody wanted to get on daytime. People were like, no,

(01:59:07):
worried about daytime. I just want to get on cut
and uncut was it whatever, it was a rating success,
it was a rating.

Speaker 1 (01:59:13):
It was it happened.

Speaker 8 (01:59:18):
That was great. But so Chip Drill is the one
that looks at as the is the video that was
kind of made for uncut, and and it was and
that kind of.

Speaker 1 (01:59:27):
That kind of it was the point it was.

Speaker 8 (01:59:32):
But the other point was when I realized how popular
it was. Was on one O six in Park, Peddler
Bell came on one O six and Park and said,
my favorite show was B T and cut and we shot.
We thought she was doing as a joke, and and
so I forget what she I think she just offered
and said, oh yeah, I watched that.

Speaker 1 (01:59:50):
My favor what was her favorite jam favorite?

Speaker 8 (01:59:56):
My favorite video is what that thinks about?

Speaker 1 (02:00:00):
Won't be right back commercial, right back?

Speaker 7 (02:00:05):
We can get all ages. Man.

Speaker 1 (02:00:09):
That was the Negro Spiritual. I love it from Indiana,
Thank you very much.

Speaker 8 (02:00:13):
But I think, you know, people people have criticized BT
in the past, and I gotta say that when people
bring up BT, I'll cut them like we took that
off like eight years ago, seven years ago. And usually
when it comes to people that things that people criticize,
it's things that like we're seven or eight years ago.
So it's telling, you know, you know, I think people
who watch it now and that may be when people

(02:00:34):
checked out, so I don't I don't follow them. If
you check out at a certain time, then that's you know,
I checked out a radio twenty years ago. I still
think I can play whatever I want to and.

Speaker 7 (02:00:42):
Y'all diversified too, So now I don't have to watch
Bett proper. I can watch BT jams.

Speaker 8 (02:00:47):
Or if you want videos, you've got we got them.
You know, if you want you hip hop, you want
BET jams. You got your soul for BT soul. Black
woman who got the black got Centric?

Speaker 7 (02:00:56):
Congratulations about can you can we just have a moment
for Centric when you just I'm guessing when you decided
to really make it the Black woman channel, Like that's
it's only.

Speaker 1 (02:01:06):
Like a year ago.

Speaker 8 (02:01:06):
Wi y'all did a year and a half, year and a.

Speaker 7 (02:01:09):
Half fantastic campaign.

Speaker 1 (02:01:11):
Yeah.

Speaker 7 (02:01:11):
No, I try to get a job there, auditioned and everything,
but that's a whole other thing. But I want to
hear now you're here and now I'm here, thank you, mister.
But why but explain?

Speaker 8 (02:01:23):
I mean, you know, because because there's no there's no
other entity out there really focused on black women exclusively. Right.
So the point is for Centric is whenever you go
to Centric, no matter what time of day it is,
no matter when it is, if you're a black woman,
you're going to go go there and find something that
appeals to you. And while there's other shows on different channels,

(02:01:44):
you know, every once in a while, like you go
to Centric and you're gonna find that hopefully twenty four
hours a day. That's the that's the goal behind Centric.

Speaker 7 (02:01:50):
I appreciate that. I'm glad y'all made to switch.

Speaker 8 (02:01:53):
So you know, anybody who's who you know, bashes bat
I think or or criticizes. I love criticism. I want
to be clear, like honest criticism. You you get sharper,
you understand what people folks. I love that. But if
it's from eight or seven years ago, seven eight years ago,
I'm just like, well watch it now. If you still
have the same criticism, let me know.

Speaker 6 (02:02:13):
I'm gonna say I used to be one of the
heavy criticizers of BET. Still I'm but I've started watching
a lot more recently because I got cable again and gradulations, Yeah,
thank you.

Speaker 1 (02:02:25):
Pretty much. I got a job.

Speaker 6 (02:02:27):
The programming definitely has changed quite a bit, and I
think the big difference is just the music videos aren't there,
and I think that actually might have made the channel better.

Speaker 8 (02:02:34):
Well if you don't, yeah, that's hard, that's hard.

Speaker 1 (02:02:39):
That wasn't a question. So I don't feel like that
was called gotcha compliments.

Speaker 6 (02:02:48):
I'm saying that because you know, you would turn on
BT all times a day and it was just almost
always all music video.

Speaker 1 (02:02:53):
So now there's a lot more variety of you know,
I don't want to listen to music all the day,
you know, so you know I can turn on Catch
the House Painting Run.

Speaker 5 (02:03:02):
Yeah, and two I think too it was something to
be said, you know, like a Buddy Man, you know
we were talking.

Speaker 1 (02:03:07):
He has the theory of like.

Speaker 5 (02:03:08):
How you kind of just grow out of things, right,
So it's it's a funny thing with BT where it
was for me. It was a thing where when I
was a kid, I watched BT like all day like
that was I mean I was Rap City Video, LP Video,
Vibrations Midnight like our screen scene, screen scene, Oh my god.

Speaker 9 (02:03:28):
I was.

Speaker 1 (02:03:29):
Yeah.

Speaker 6 (02:03:30):
I don't want to even take it back for you
remember telling me something good was that it was a
game show.

Speaker 1 (02:03:36):
It was a game show where people would call in.
You know I missed that. Yes, this was like eighty
seven eighty talking about this is this is late.

Speaker 7 (02:03:48):
I'm passing Angel Stripling.

Speaker 1 (02:03:51):
This is Angel Stripling years yea Robin Breeden.

Speaker 7 (02:03:55):
Who was back on the radio.

Speaker 5 (02:03:57):
The radio, they would show the reruns of the show Desmonds,
There's the Jamaican I have like four seasons, but it's syndicated.
Some of it's on DVDs. So yeah, it was, Yeah,
it was from back in the day. But I will
watch it as a kid, and like that was all
I would do. But then it got to a point
where I kind of just grew out of it, you
know what I'm saying. But now as an adult, like

(02:04:19):
in my you know, thirties, you know what I'm saying,
Now I watch it again. So it's like there's content
for me there. But it was just that middle fund,
that funny part like hunting in your twenties, where it
kind of it kind of lost me. Maybe it's kind
of us just growing out of it and you know
just what he just.

Speaker 1 (02:04:36):
Said, growing up.

Speaker 5 (02:04:37):
But then you.

Speaker 7 (02:04:39):
Is it because your video has never really played on
there too?

Speaker 1 (02:04:41):
Or no, I didn't. I don't want to watch the
ship just to watch, you know, I don't. I don't
have any regrets of the Tortoise in the Hair Journey
only because like you know, I look at all my
peers that did get instant rotation, love and they're kind
of on the side of the road, broken down vehicles,

(02:05:02):
and it's about the longest admire Well yeah, yeah, the
the your your your, your, your, childlike enthusiasm for uh
music when I see you in concerts and everything all
that stuff. But having witnessed you at several BT Awards,

(02:05:25):
I wonder how you keep so cool, especially this year. Now,
hold on this. I was.

Speaker 6 (02:05:33):
I was randomly on Facebook the other day and somebody
posted a video of Actually the Jackson's posted a video
of their performance at the their final performance at Michael's
fiftieth anniversary thing, and halfway halfway way through, halfway through,
there is the clearest day shot of.

Speaker 1 (02:05:49):
Stephen Hill just going crazy in the crowd.

Speaker 7 (02:05:53):
I remember that one.

Speaker 1 (02:05:54):
Yeah, I mean I always know you are because you're
the most enthusiastic audience member ever. It's true. But okay,
now this is where the suit and me wants to know. Like,
when you're at the BET Awards, I would be losing
my mind every second only because it's like it's such

(02:06:14):
a down to the wire. Is this going to work?
Is this not going to work? Because you know you
can't be there as a fan watching this this performance.
You have to trust in your director. You have to
trust in the creative people. You have to trust the talent.
I mean, do you not have anxiety on whether or
not blah blah blah made their plan or not, or

(02:06:34):
if there's a Plan B or Plan C, or you know,
we got to cut this part of the show. We
have to edit that part of the show. Like just
the things that I now know in television production that
drive proprietors and bosses crazy. You never have that on
your face.

Speaker 8 (02:06:52):
But I know for this year, anybody, anybody, anybody.

Speaker 1 (02:06:57):
Who works with me or who's hearing this is like,
perhaps he doesn't know who Stephen Hill is.

Speaker 8 (02:07:00):
Maybe he's looking at somebody else's face.

Speaker 1 (02:07:02):
No, no, because it's always it's always poker face time.
Now for instance, now this year with the with the
passing of our king, mister Hill, you you took a
very no, I mean you took a very bold stance

(02:07:23):
with the tweet. That was the best thing. Yeah, yeah,
the shade. But here's the thing.

Speaker 7 (02:07:32):
Mirror was on stage.

Speaker 8 (02:07:34):
You know, he was off, he had cleared the stage.

Speaker 1 (02:07:38):
And the way you insinuated that, I just meant it wasn't.
I wasn't on stage with them. I introduced them, and
can we not say what this is in regards to oh,
are we allowed to? I don't know. I'm asking you.

Speaker 7 (02:07:52):
It's in the past, isn't.

Speaker 1 (02:07:54):
It because he's my manager. No, we're referring to the
Madonna performance.

Speaker 8 (02:08:02):
Of perform Stevie. Can I clear something up. I wasn't
talking about the Madonna No no, no, no no no
no no no, no, no no no. What I was
talking about is if you're going to you're gonna be
really honest about it, if you're gonna, if you're gonna
tribute Prince, if Madonna.

Speaker 1 (02:08:19):
Had been, I'm gonna give myself in trouble.

Speaker 8 (02:08:23):
If Madonna had her tribute, But it would be awesome
to have someone else cover another aspect and has to
have someone else cover another aspect.

Speaker 1 (02:08:34):
Okay, now here's this thing that's so so so.

Speaker 8 (02:08:36):
People took it it was me against another person. It
was just like as a tribute as a whole we
got you it was it was it was really liked.
That's that's how that came out.

Speaker 1 (02:08:47):
I didn't take I didn't take your tweet as something
to Madonna or Stevie, but I understood where you were going.
But Here's the thing though, and you know, I know
the timing was Uncan you know Prince well in the audience?
You know Prince well? You know what I mean, you
know his music well? And being as though it's slim

(02:09:12):
Pickens out there, when you said we got you, I
instantly got worried because it was like, wow, okay, now
the pressure's on and everybody is betting on Black and
now all I'm thinking is who who do you have

(02:09:35):
in mind that can even come close to what Prince
really means? Fourth letter of the alphabet.

Speaker 8 (02:09:43):
In nineteen sixty one or sixty two, John F. Kennedy
went to Rice University gave a speech said, guess what,
by the end of this.

Speaker 1 (02:09:56):
Decade, We're gonna put a man on the moon. Cheer.
Oh yeah yeah.

Speaker 8 (02:10:00):
People at NASA were like, what, we don't have the technology,
we don't have the capability, we don't have the people.
We cannot get a man on the moon by by
by by sixty nine. But sure enough, in faith and
like you believe in your people, that that happened. I
had a feeling that you would be.

Speaker 1 (02:10:21):
No, no, no, I had a feel no, I had
a feeling that you'd be on board.

Speaker 7 (02:10:25):
That's that's that's the We all had that feeling.

Speaker 8 (02:10:27):
That's the that's the and that was the that was
the that's the foundation. I'm serious, that's true. The foundation
was was that I had a feeling that some other
people would come on board, and with our knowledge and
our respect for that guy and knowing how much our
audience was going to want it, I just we just
we didn't have the tools at the time, but we
knew what we knew that it existed, right, and so.

Speaker 1 (02:10:52):
Janelle we knew would be on board.

Speaker 8 (02:10:54):
Right. We knew Janelle would be on board.

Speaker 7 (02:10:56):
So are you saying none of these people working firm?

Speaker 8 (02:10:57):
When you said no, no, no, no, no, no, nobody
was confirmed. We had our first conversation. No, we you were.

Speaker 1 (02:11:07):
It wasn't even board. But the thing was when he
did that, I just I sat in my room for
like almost two days, like I was like wow, like
you just thought you weren't asked who? No, no, no,
I knew I was going to be part of it.
I instantly got an m D mode, which was like who.

(02:11:27):
Because the thing is is that the people that I
feel that are close to Prince's talent aren't names and
as a suit. The suit in me was like, who
has a name that will really bring him justice? He
was just so obvious, right, But it was itself. It

(02:11:51):
was a risky all right. When I brought the laud
to it was. I didn't bring him to you personally,
but I brought him to the producers and everything. But
was it a Okay, he's going to hit out the
park or was it a I don't know if our
audience is ready for him yet, or like, what what
are you thinking in your head as we're bringing this? How? Okay,

(02:12:17):
Dangelo was a part of this?

Speaker 8 (02:12:18):
Okay, how how.

Speaker 1 (02:12:19):
Deep do you want to forgot?

Speaker 8 (02:12:21):
Oh?

Speaker 1 (02:12:21):
Let's let's talk about it. Okay, we're good, We're good.

Speaker 8 (02:12:24):
Sure, yeah, okay, alright, that's why we had we had,
we had, we had, we had, we had we and
so Dianzel couldn't couldn't make it. And so there was
I remember exactly where it was. We were on the
phone having this call. Let me, let me, let me,
let me, let me back up. I love that John F.
Kennedy story because it's just a story of faith and
a sort of desire and like, if you can get

(02:12:46):
people together, you can go towards that goal, and I
knew enough people loved Prince that we would be able
to go towards that goal. And and the Prince was
the star.

Speaker 1 (02:12:53):
Faith versus science. By the way, fair enough, now I'm
thinking of calculations or or believing.

Speaker 8 (02:12:59):
That the science exists, we just haven't found it yet, right, right,
And that's what it was. That's exactly what that was.
I'm glad you phrased it that way. It was having
the faith that the science is going to follow that faith, right,
And that's exactly what this was with with with the
Prince thing. But knowing that you were on board, I'm
not true. Was it was a big part of the
foundation and that Prince was the star and that we

(02:13:21):
knew you No, I'm not picking my words. It's just
it's just watch happy, happy, and I'll say this now
a happy accident. Look, the tweet was we had a
feeling that that it was going to be that the
that the that that tribute was going to be was

(02:13:41):
not going to be fulfilling. It was not going to
fulfill all the things that you want around that. So
we thought that maybe to get a little air press,
Prince is the star. And now you just got to
find people who love and respect them enough to pull
off the to pull it off. They don't have to
be that. They don't have to be We didn't need
the biggest names in the world, right, We need the
people who respected their music. We started that tribute with

(02:14:02):
and I love that people picked up on it. We
started that tribute with Ballad of Dorothy Parker, right.

Speaker 1 (02:14:08):
Which is as an album.

Speaker 8 (02:14:10):
It's an album. It's a deep album cut. There wasn't
any history onics around it, like Erica just saying, sat
there and did it. Because we were setting like, Okay,
this is going to be a Prince View for real,
this is for real Prince fans, but we're still going
to get deliver you top notch talent. And you were
the person who I never thought of it before. You know,
it's just one long verse.

Speaker 1 (02:14:28):
There's no curve.

Speaker 8 (02:14:28):
There's just that's the thing. By the way, Well you
said that, I was like, I had known this song
for freaking thirty years and I've never thought about that.
It's just one long verse.

Speaker 1 (02:14:36):
I was the suit and he was the greated one.
Because when they said yeah, let's do Ballad Dorothy Parker,
I'm like, wait, there's no hook to it, Yeah, what
part do I take? You guys won't let me do
three minutes. I know, like I'm instantly thinking in suit
television producer mode and not in creative mood. So it
was just but you were so cool about it.

Speaker 8 (02:14:55):
Like break the rules for that one. And then and
then once once was the Angelo left out. We actually,
if I remember correct, we we both came to blow
independently and we're surprised that the other one was going
to co coke.

Speaker 1 (02:15:07):
It was I was shocked that you were going to
let me do it, and you were like.

Speaker 7 (02:15:13):
Great, And is that what a revolution took the league
because ever since then has been doing like gigs.

Speaker 8 (02:15:18):
Oh no, no, we knew that. We knew that was
gonna change it.

Speaker 1 (02:15:20):
We knew the second that happened. Then every member of
the revolution uh minus Brown Mark uh hit me up
and was just like.

Speaker 7 (02:15:29):
That was so dope, thank you for that.

Speaker 1 (02:15:31):
And I felt like super justified and at least like
I don't want to say it like I wanted to
dodge the bullet. I wanted to hit the target.

Speaker 7 (02:15:41):
But y'all felt the whole country go yes, yes, yes,
but it.

Speaker 1 (02:15:44):
Was risky because the thing is is like I'd rather,
in my mind, I would have rather done non popular
print standards so that I wouldn't get judged. Like it's
hard for you to have an opinion about slow love
of ort.

Speaker 6 (02:16:03):
Just stop trying to impress the orders the Prince orger
people man, not even I.

Speaker 1 (02:16:09):
Mean, but yeah, yeah, yeah, but I mean, but I
think it's harder if you just say, all right when
doves cry in nineteen ninety nine, like I felt more
for Shila than anything because she was going for the hits.
She was going for the juggernauts, so.

Speaker 8 (02:16:25):
She and Janel and Janel put that. I thought she
put great artistry and great show personship to it as well,
uh with costumes and danced across the stage and you know,
it's great music performed by it, like when Blaud did
Beautiful Ones and got down on that floor, like we
knew vocally, well you know what.

Speaker 1 (02:16:47):
I really, you knew it, but America didn't know. America
didn't know.

Speaker 8 (02:16:50):
Yes, but but but but And that's the point of
the cool thing is we talk about exposing new artists
like he's not a new artist, but like people understood
who he was that night, right the same way, you know,
Candley the year before it was Tory Kelly. Tory Kelly
was the one no one knew, and then she stepped
out to saying Who's loving You were like, oh got it?

Speaker 1 (02:17:08):
Yo?

Speaker 7 (02:17:08):
Is it getting more challenging because you know, the one
of the things that people look forward to with the
BET Awards are the tributes, not so you have pretty
much like I mean, I just remember the year you
had Alexander O'Neill come out with sharl S. Is it
getting more challenging or is it getting more fun? Or
is it more is it combo of both trying to
decide who are you gonna do and then who's going

(02:17:30):
to sing?

Speaker 8 (02:17:31):
It's always fun, It's always fun. It gets a little
more challenging. We love the you know, we love the
reunions get.

Speaker 1 (02:17:36):
But surely you're planning it now, Like how far in
advance do you you have to plan seven months in.

Speaker 8 (02:17:41):
The yeah, oh yeah, yeah, absolutely, there's conversations being had already.

Speaker 1 (02:17:45):
Here's here's a good idea.

Speaker 8 (02:17:45):
I'm gonna give you way the biggest secret more than
anything else, more than anything else on that show You
Know what You Know? And we mentioned him earlier or
a member of the band earlier. Uh, in this conversation,
I'm gonna get Tony Tony Tony back together.

Speaker 1 (02:17:58):
It's the thing.

Speaker 8 (02:17:58):
It's the thing. It's please the thing.

Speaker 1 (02:18:01):
It's the thing.

Speaker 8 (02:18:02):
It's not worked out yet, and I don't give away secrets,
but but if if anybody out there, if you can
get Tony to help me get Tony Tony Tony together,
I'm all the way, all the way. I want to
pick the step list too.

Speaker 7 (02:18:15):
Is that it you got?

Speaker 3 (02:18:16):
Like?

Speaker 7 (02:18:16):
You got three of those?

Speaker 1 (02:18:16):
Like?

Speaker 7 (02:18:17):
Is it Tony Tony Tony?

Speaker 1 (02:18:18):
Is it gonna play my ex girlfriend? Oh? My god,
girl friend, it's a whole Sorry, Steve, you have to
be there. Wait a minute, you don't know that?

Speaker 7 (02:18:35):
Is that before Walter?

Speaker 13 (02:18:36):
That?

Speaker 7 (02:18:38):
Oh yeah, no, I know you didn't just look at.

Speaker 4 (02:18:40):
Me like that.

Speaker 1 (02:18:41):
That was that was the album with Anniversary. I know
you know that one.

Speaker 7 (02:18:44):
Do you gotta play me with a single?

Speaker 1 (02:18:46):
Yoke? Because she was six years old when it came
out sixteen.

Speaker 7 (02:18:52):
But I know all the Lucy Pearl album. I'm just joking.
That's a joke. I'm just I'm I said, hey, little
Walter Jail, give me.

Speaker 1 (02:19:00):
Some credit a joke, if anything, or who else would
you like to reunite? Is it too way for Ready
for the World?

Speaker 7 (02:19:10):
Yes, that sight like Ready for the World with like surface.

Speaker 1 (02:19:15):
Well it's gonna be the thirtieth anniversary of New Jack Swing,
so I would imagine can we talk.

Speaker 6 (02:19:21):
About New Jack Swing for a second. Yeah, let's do it,
because I feel like the John or that period of
music has been.

Speaker 5 (02:19:28):
Sorely overlooked. I think it was something that you had
to be there for. Like it's a hard sell to
people in twenty sixteen, you know what I'm saying. Because
the music was great, but like I mean, it was
kind of hockey, you know what I mean it now,
like listen to the baselines and the drum program like
I mean, like for example, like the Foreign Exchange, the

(02:19:50):
cover we did of Steve on the If She Brickshard.
One of the main reasons why I wanted to do
that song was because I thought it was a great song.

Speaker 1 (02:19:56):
Took the New Jackie out. Yeah, just take the Chunkle Fever,
you know.

Speaker 5 (02:20:00):
But those are great songs, but just the production of
the time, it you know, it didn't serve them well,
didn't It didn't age well?

Speaker 1 (02:20:08):
Side note. Yeah, that's the one thing I big from
Stevie Wonder's people, like, can I have the masters to
jungle feeble just so I can take the drums away
and put what I think he would do in nineteen
seventy three to it.

Speaker 5 (02:20:24):
Lighting up the candles could be God lighting up the
candles without jack drums.

Speaker 7 (02:20:28):
Yeah, like all so effect get back together. We could
just make the new jack swings we got.

Speaker 8 (02:20:36):
We got them back together for the soul training wars
att while yeah, we didn't make for the soul trains.

Speaker 1 (02:20:40):
How do you determine what soul train will get versus what?
Very good, very good question? It's a very good And
what is your Are you allowed to say what your
your what your baby is, and what your step son
is in terms of war shows? Yeah?

Speaker 7 (02:20:54):
Because then hip Hop Honors is my.

Speaker 8 (02:20:57):
Favorite, my favorite, I don't mean disrespect my favorite celebration
of gospel because if you can't sing, don't come.

Speaker 1 (02:21:03):
Oh wait a minute, I don't come. That was the
fourth category. I wasn't even thinking celebration of gospel.

Speaker 8 (02:21:09):
If you can't sing, don't come anytime.

Speaker 1 (02:21:11):
I actually, yo, wait has got well into the room
where we might lose good singers. I don't know. I
love God. You heard that song. No, it's it's it's
it was.

Speaker 8 (02:21:24):
It was a choice by a good singer to do
a song that I respect that that's fine, but but
you got to sang got celebration of gospel, right, That's
that's we just called.

Speaker 1 (02:21:33):
I just want to call it.

Speaker 8 (02:21:34):
Landa Adams shown so. But to my eye when when
I when I see Elanda Adams walk into a room,
my eyes smile because I know my ears are next.

Speaker 1 (02:21:44):
She is. She just is just a gift to sound.
So between BT Awards and Soul Train Awards, how do
you and both of them are your responsibility?

Speaker 8 (02:21:57):
Yes, but shout out to I'm going to say this
earlier we all you talked about how to keep calm head.
We have the best production crew in the business with
Jesse Collins Entertainment and Jay and Knyie Orlando who.

Speaker 1 (02:22:09):
Oversees it for most directly for for for B E T.

Speaker 8 (02:22:12):
It's just the best in the business. Like so when
I'm not worried about people missing flights because if they do,
Jesse will find a way to rends a prop plane
to go pick him up.

Speaker 1 (02:22:22):
You got to get a I forgot who he did
that to, but he told me a story of getting
someone last minute.

Speaker 8 (02:22:28):
Absolutely, they get it private, they get it done. No
crop dusters, I said, I said properly, I say private,
I said, prop.

Speaker 1 (02:22:38):
Back.

Speaker 8 (02:22:40):
But soul Training. Here's what trying to do with Soul Train.
Soul Train is really about it the soul like it's
it's it's it's pretty hip hop free and it should
have a groove. That's why I rote. James worked so
well on it this year. Anderson Pack, who's kind of
in between, works on it. Una worked on it. Drew Hill,
We're yep, Eric, I do get it.

Speaker 7 (02:23:04):
I don't know how.

Speaker 8 (02:23:05):
Oh my god. This year we had Drew Hill. We
had a tribute to Teddy Riley uh Yuna Rode, James,
Eric Bennet because that song Sunshine is just.

Speaker 1 (02:23:19):
Speaking of which Okay, I kind of know the answers
since I'm working for them, But is there any chance
in hell, even if it's not on BT proper, for
you to really develop I want you to develop a

(02:23:39):
midlife crisis BT channel for me.

Speaker 8 (02:23:44):
All right, what are the elements of that show?

Speaker 1 (02:23:45):
Well, I just I need living single reruns. I mean, yeah,
I forget the rerun list that we have that's endless.
But I need the anxiety of eleven fifty eight am
on a Saturday, no one in two minutes that the
Soul Trained animations coming on is one of the most

(02:24:08):
thrilling moments of my childhood. And I know twelve occasionally
twelve sometimes one in the morning, But yeah, I just
I need a a What VH one was to MTV
back in the eighties, what it was meant to be?
Oh my god, can you imagine that? Like one time

(02:24:30):
VH one.

Speaker 7 (02:24:30):
When playing Paul Simon and it was the video Hits
one was the Chevy Chase video.

Speaker 1 (02:24:37):
Yeah, the conservative White Guys channel.

Speaker 7 (02:24:39):
Now it's like, don't worry, be happy all the time.

Speaker 1 (02:24:42):
That's funny. Yeah, But I just I don't I feel
like Soul Train and the interests of Soul Trained could
still have life into it.

Speaker 8 (02:24:53):
It's possible, And I know you, I knew I was
not going to escape without having that question answered. But
it is possible, as you know that b ET and
Soul Training are joined joined. Now, yes, you need anything,
let me know.

Speaker 7 (02:25:06):
So we're talking about new episodes of soulcirating and if
you're talking about classics, do you stop at them more
years or where do you stop.

Speaker 1 (02:25:13):
Soul Trained to Me is nineteen seventy one to the
last episode The Commodore's episode of nineteen ninety three, which
was Don's last show. The Commonists were still around in
ninety three, What.

Speaker 5 (02:25:24):
Was the jog?

Speaker 1 (02:25:25):
What was their last song? Their last song was.

Speaker 5 (02:25:30):
I Think I'd locked off Breakouse nineteen ninety Oh it
was a very don't play it, Please don't play it, No,
please play it.

Speaker 1 (02:25:39):
I've never heard this song on my life.

Speaker 7 (02:25:40):
You can't find it.

Speaker 8 (02:25:41):
Just played night Ship Please say yeah. A by the
Commodore was yeah, So I don't.

Speaker 1 (02:25:47):
I don't mean for my personal collection though I'm talking about.

Speaker 6 (02:25:50):
I still think there should be a Soul Trained app
for for Apple TV and Roku and smart till.

Speaker 8 (02:25:55):
You're exploring all sorts of opportunities with Soul Trained brand
or do you understand how i it is and how
much it means to so many people who only experienced it,
but I just heard about it from.

Speaker 1 (02:26:06):
Their their their elder generation.

Speaker 7 (02:26:08):
So there's there's, you know, nice statement, mister President.

Speaker 1 (02:26:12):
Unfortunately Don didn't have clearances.

Speaker 7 (02:26:16):
Or or you know, so there's licensing issues.

Speaker 1 (02:26:20):
We've been working on it. It's like four years already.
I think maybe wonder years of black television, maybe like
three hundred some some episodes have been totally cleared. But
I think the whole goal is just to have the entire.

Speaker 8 (02:26:33):
We would be great to have the whole entire catalog cleared.

Speaker 7 (02:26:37):
But after the Soul Train episode goes off on your
Midlife Crisis channel, what's what those you just I think
he just wants you just want all soul trained all
the time. Is that what you're saying?

Speaker 1 (02:26:45):
Just two episodes of Soul Training a week, that eye
program and then what else is.

Speaker 7 (02:26:51):
On the channel?

Speaker 1 (02:26:51):
Right? What else? Whatever? Y'all want kung fu flicks and
you know, so basically you want it to be Bounced TV.
Oh yeah, but like that. I can get that.

Speaker 7 (02:27:05):
I can get you know, has has a Viceland and
Revolt had any effect on I mean, I don't want
to say effect or impression or have you guys, it's
a matter is it an your peripheral at all? Does
it matter? Is it anything that they're doing that you like?

Speaker 6 (02:27:19):
I would suggest you watched Jesus and Mirro on Viceland?
What Jesus and Miro on Viceland? Yeah, it's a future
of black comedy right there.

Speaker 1 (02:27:30):
He's actually telling the truth.

Speaker 7 (02:27:33):
So has Viceland or revolt question?

Speaker 8 (02:27:37):
Yeah, I was getting that because I appreciate a vice's
different approach to media, and I'm hoping, you know, to
freshen things up. I think they freshened things up to
use that term revolt is. I think it's an awesome
exhibition around music.

Speaker 1 (02:27:56):
We just not do that.

Speaker 8 (02:27:57):
We do that on kind of jams and soul, but
not the main one anymore.

Speaker 7 (02:28:01):
I was just curious. It is funny because we were
talking about Noisy the other day and it's it's funny.
It's a really great show in a way. However, as
my mother said, when she walked in and then walked
out when she saw what was going on, it feels like,
what do you call that? Cultural tourism? So I was
just asking because there are some things that you know,
we could do without it.

Speaker 8 (02:28:19):
Feeling that way. We we we you know, we we
over use this term, but you know, absolutely authentically black
as what we what we are? We we we we
are we are the culture folks other folks read about it.

Speaker 1 (02:28:32):
Speaking of which, you went to the White House this year? Yes, actually, yes,
I forgot we Okay, I was talking about going you know,
us going to the world, but then I forgot you

(02:28:52):
were actually there to witness everything. Okay, let's talk about
the actual production of the show, but I really want
I wanted to talk about the afterwards after Love and Happiness.
Did they approach you or how did you? How did you?

Speaker 13 (02:29:14):
So?

Speaker 8 (02:29:14):
Shout to Janine Library from b E two, who really
has been who's been working with the White House? Look
the White House. You may not, I guess you can.
You believe it now, but White House has this great
collection of Black women who work there.

Speaker 7 (02:29:29):
I've seen the article.

Speaker 8 (02:29:30):
Is a great collection of black women with whom like
a bunch people woul be to your friends, especially Janine,
And so it was like, look, we really want to win,
you know, the thick of the election is over. We
want to air something. It's like just a great goodbyeparty,
just a throw down. There's no there's no rhyme or
reason to it. Just just have fun. And so two
years in the making, they were like yes, and so

(02:29:52):
we were honored to go to the White House to
be part of the last musical celebration they've had them
over the years for Country and I think they're going
from from from Memphis, from Memphis, and you know backrack
and how David had won and so this was just
one for for for be eating and so a man

(02:30:12):
it was was on board Roots and and Jane Monet.

Speaker 1 (02:30:17):
And and and Soul.

Speaker 8 (02:30:20):
They lost Soul requested by the President of the United States.

Speaker 1 (02:30:23):
Crazy.

Speaker 7 (02:30:25):
I think almost a tear when I told him that
who else was requested?

Speaker 1 (02:30:31):
Well, we all were requested, but this okay. So I
guess the rumor is that you know what's on his iPod,
and you know he wanted to see that come to life.
But it's kind of weird knowing that the leader of
the free world has a Roots song on his iPod
when he works out at the gym in the morning.
And I'm trying to figure that one out because I'm like,

(02:30:54):
probably aren't we aren't we the Sunday Sunday afternoon, I
can count maybe four songs that are over like one
hundred bpms, like I thought were the relaxing evening songs kind.

Speaker 8 (02:31:07):
Of maybe maybe part of his cool down, maybe on
this on the on the tape of part of.

Speaker 1 (02:31:12):
Maybe who Knows? Yeah, who knows? Who knows? Yeah?

Speaker 8 (02:31:15):
But we were there and we had a good time.
We had a good time. It was one of the
last He said he wasn't going to sing, and then
he sang. At the end, I think he grabbed somebody's mike.
Mike like love it happiness.

Speaker 1 (02:31:27):
Wait. My favorite moment though, was Okay, So I'm sitting
in this section with de La Soul and with Common
and we're watching BBD do Poison and so at the
White House at the White House, and like all seven

(02:31:48):
of us are collectively looking at each other like, well,
we know there isn't a radio edit version of this,
so how are they going to handle the low pro hope? Dog?

Speaker 7 (02:32:02):
Oh, that's the only one I was watching.

Speaker 1 (02:32:05):
I was watching first Lady. Oh, I know, she said, Dog.
It was the most magical moment of my life.

Speaker 4 (02:32:15):
It was.

Speaker 1 (02:32:15):
It was kind of watching her.

Speaker 7 (02:32:16):
It was our movements too, right, the local host she
cut afro Like, all.

Speaker 1 (02:32:21):
I know is that obviously in nineteen ninety that must
have been their jam when they were dating each other
in Chicago, because there was this levels of Roger Rabbit Thom.

Speaker 7 (02:32:33):
Going on that I like doing the did he get
on the back? Did he get on it?

Speaker 1 (02:32:39):
Let's not make it do a comedy moment, but not
a comedy moment. Yeah. Look, I'm just saying that that
was the realest moment I've ever seen Potus and Flotus.
And she mounted the words and I was just.

Speaker 7 (02:32:53):
Like, did she like let me ask? I'm sorry, I
just have many questions. So she mounted the words so
mouthing the whole song she was, she's singing the song,
and then she just.

Speaker 1 (02:33:03):
Mounted The crew used to do it right. So you
will never see it on TV. You will never see it.

Speaker 8 (02:33:10):
You will never see that on TV.

Speaker 7 (02:33:12):
But you guys filmed it.

Speaker 8 (02:33:14):
You will never see it on TV.

Speaker 7 (02:33:16):
You will film what I meant to stay with y'all.
I mean, we saw us, we saw on social media, so.

Speaker 8 (02:33:29):
There was so much energy around that. You know, you
were like it was it was it was palpable, it
was undeniable, it was I think you're right. That hadn't
been their song at some point in time, and that's
why that was their song. We kind of introduced this like, well,
you know, the first movie was do the right thing,
but you know, we imagine at some point in time,
you guys dance to this and they jumped up.

Speaker 7 (02:33:51):
Yeah, so y'all had a full I'm sorry, So y'all
are not telling this story, you know, and listen your turns.
So let me ask you said you introduced it. So
you introduced BBD to the crime out like they're literally
you're on the stage and you're like, okay, coming up next.

Speaker 1 (02:34:04):
We got a song. I thought that was obvious.

Speaker 7 (02:34:05):
No, no, it's not.

Speaker 1 (02:34:07):
No, yeah, yeah yeah, because we said it, Yeah they said.

Speaker 7 (02:34:11):
It, but I didn't believe that you said it like that, like, yes,
that's exactly how you said it.

Speaker 1 (02:34:15):
We talked about their first date and then we imagine
that at sometime doing your courtship, this was your song,
and but we didn't know it was true because because
once it happened, because the tone of the night was
like yes Jill, Yes, yes you're the yes John l
and yes yes common yes think you know. It was
a very positive and then when them snare drum hit,

(02:34:40):
it was like like a pajama Jimmy jim.

Speaker 7 (02:34:44):
So am I to understand there is going to be
a televised part of this which which will have the
Jill and all of that and stuff. And then that
other stuff was like their after party.

Speaker 1 (02:34:53):
For later there were there was the after party.

Speaker 7 (02:34:57):
Was not the after party.

Speaker 1 (02:34:58):
Yeah, BD was the.

Speaker 7 (02:35:01):
Okay, so you say, that's why you're saying that she
didn't see that.

Speaker 1 (02:35:03):
Wow. Wow, you really couldn't figure that out.

Speaker 7 (02:35:05):
I really did not. I love you, Layah, thank you,
because somebody at home is with me, aren't you. That's okay? No,
you'd be safe in your zone. Another dumb question. No,
I'm talking to the people right now.

Speaker 1 (02:35:17):
Or it's fevers at an all timeline. But my point
is that there were three versions of that performance. There
was BET's uh, there was BBD's performance of it, which
was flawless, and there was us looking at each other.
I wish there was a camera just looking a reaction

(02:35:39):
camera at between pass mace me, treak, common, uh, Dave,
true boy, everyone spouses, everyone's like. We were just looking
at each other like is this supposed to happen? Are
they allowed to say it? And then looking at her,
is she she's mouthing at work? Oh my god? They
no poison? Like it was just it was the craziest

(02:36:01):
moment I've ever seen in my life. Thanks, thanks, No,
it was bedtime. It was BT and cut time. About
the video, it was a video vibrations.

Speaker 7 (02:36:14):
Yes, the fact that Usher did not have to take
that video down just show the rest of the world
that you know what he.

Speaker 1 (02:36:19):
Read to go and he don't give a what he
gonna be audited next year, But let that happen, all right,
So Fante, man, I learned that what do we learned?

Speaker 5 (02:36:35):
Man? I learned Stephen Hill as a lot more musical
uh appreciation than I realized.

Speaker 1 (02:36:43):
You know what I'm saying.

Speaker 5 (02:36:43):
This is the first time that me and you have
ever really have to have a conversation and uh, you know,
you know, it's it's always funny.

Speaker 1 (02:36:52):
And again you know you answered earlier.

Speaker 5 (02:36:54):
Just you know, the people who are in position, who
are in power in their program and it's like the
things that they have to program a lot of times,
it's very different from the stuff that they appreciate in
their real lives, you know what I'm saying. So I just,
you know, really appreciate the opportunities to sit and uh
clear the air and just to really just talk about
music just as fans.

Speaker 1 (02:37:15):
You know what I mean. When you talked about going
to see Radiohead, I mean, dude, like.

Speaker 8 (02:37:20):
Bruh England Aly fourth and July fifth, Oh.

Speaker 1 (02:37:23):
Man, Yeah, yeah, you got your tickets already. Wow.

Speaker 8 (02:37:27):
No, I'm sorry, No, I'm gonna get them.

Speaker 6 (02:37:31):
I hope you have better luck than I did with
the New York shows. Oh they sold out, like I
think the server crash or something and by the time
it was back up, it was sold out.

Speaker 1 (02:37:39):
Yeah. So no, man, no, no, no, I want to
be clear.

Speaker 8 (02:37:42):
I got online. That's why I want to go see
him in Amsterdam.

Speaker 1 (02:37:45):
Oh so you don't know pros and that.

Speaker 8 (02:37:49):
Takes the fun out of it.

Speaker 1 (02:37:52):
I'm sorry. Getting free tickets is the fun part for me.

Speaker 8 (02:37:56):
You trying to tell me sometimes you're just a fan though, right,
So sometimes I was online at four because.

Speaker 1 (02:38:03):
They went on to say at ten am in every place,
So I was up at four a m.

Speaker 8 (02:38:07):
On Wasiste dot org? I think.

Speaker 1 (02:38:11):
Waiste dot org get.

Speaker 8 (02:38:12):
My tickets for Radiohead for Amsterdam last May. Absolutely, But dude,
sometimes you do it as a fan. I'm like, I'm
a fan of music. Like, there's sometimes I'm not going
to say, like I never dial in for tickets. I'm
going to see Maxwell and Mary. I'm dialing in for tickets, right,
But there's sometimes you just want to have the entire
fan experience, and with Radiohead, you know.

Speaker 1 (02:38:34):
I do.

Speaker 8 (02:38:35):
I do, absolutely, But.

Speaker 1 (02:38:36):
If it sells out, you're gonna call them, right.

Speaker 8 (02:38:39):
If stub Hub and everything else fails and I really
want to go, then I will, but that last resort.

Speaker 1 (02:38:44):
That's last.

Speaker 8 (02:38:45):
But that's last resort because there's with them. It's just
like I'm a fan, Damn.

Speaker 1 (02:38:48):
That's what I learned. I learned that Stephen Hill really
is a fan.

Speaker 10 (02:38:53):
Wants to pay for it? Uh, Sugar, Steve, how you doing?
I learned a lot about Stephen Hill, learned a lot
about radio. I learned a lot about pet. What I
found interesting was your It seems like from day one
you got this charge out of breaking new artists or
new songs or new music from your college radio days,
and now still even up until now, it sounds like

(02:39:15):
you're doing that still and still getting that same rush
from it.

Speaker 1 (02:39:19):
So I found that cool and interesting. That's that amount
of breath amazing. Okay, I'm gonna save Laya for last,
because no, you'r DC's finest, you know, So, boss Bill? Yes,
what did you learn today? Bruther?

Speaker 6 (02:39:35):
I learned about hitting the post. I didn't know there
was a term for that. I did not know there's
a term for that, and postmaster general, yeah, post master.
So miir is going to be hearing a lot about
hitting the post in the future. I can't be FedEx
or no, he can't work in the mail room hitting
the posts. Hitting the post.

Speaker 1 (02:39:50):
Well, thank you Steve for introducing. You got another task
for me to master.

Speaker 8 (02:39:55):
You got my pleasure.

Speaker 1 (02:39:56):
Gosh, all right, Layah, let's have it.

Speaker 7 (02:40:01):
You do such a build up that if I don't
do something, I feel like an idiot. I was gonna say,
I'm learning. I'm learning that you can leave radio and
go to greater and better things. However, I'm still learning
how to do that, because it's interesting. It was when
you said it was a time when like people really
appreciated radio, people's opinion like MTV, and those times have change.

(02:40:21):
So I am learning that I am appreciating quest love.
I think that that was leaving radio and transitioning to
something better. That's what I meant.

Speaker 1 (02:40:35):
Oh, okay, you met me as the radio show, not
me as an Emir Thompson.

Speaker 7 (02:40:39):
Yeah, And I learned you should never lose your passion
and your spirit about radio about music in that way,
because most radio people we start out that way, but
you know, sometimes the business jade you a little bit,
and you know you don't listen to music for a while,
and that's what I've been doing. So you kind of
encourage me to.

Speaker 1 (02:40:57):
Like the music.

Speaker 7 (02:40:58):
Yeah, in the music business. Then you've been hurt and
fired a couple of times. As you know, you're like,
I'm gonna take a break, but no, I'm gonna keep
it going.

Speaker 1 (02:41:05):
I learned the importance of front selling. I learned the
importance of that. Finally, finally I learned that all of
my authority figures at at Pandora are relieve that I've
learned those things. I've learned that this too shall pass

(02:41:29):
word and we will have a prosperous New Year's and
we will have a prosperous year and a prosperous decade
and a prosperous life. And you know, life goes on.
Life ain't over. Which is still in with all right?

Speaker 6 (02:41:47):
By Kendrick, I was gonna say, outcast, hold on, be strong,
word up?

Speaker 1 (02:41:52):
Can we who are we going to throw? Just a
inter wait? Do me favorite?

Speaker 4 (02:41:58):
Can you?

Speaker 1 (02:41:58):
Can you front? All right? You want me to hit
try and hit the post? I want you because that
one start it fades in. Okay, here we go. You're
gonna front and back Celle outcast, hold On Be Strong.

Speaker 6 (02:42:17):
That'd be like one of the same thing, right, Yeah,
you gotta by the time, minute twelve seconds, you ready?

Speaker 1 (02:42:24):
Why tell me front, tell me it's plain. It is.

Speaker 6 (02:42:30):
Good evening, ladies and gentlemen, you're tuned in the Quest
Love Supreme. As we wrap up this fine, fine episode
with our guest Stephen Hill, tonight, we want to leave
you with some uh some uplifting words from the cast
about outcasts.

Speaker 1 (02:42:44):
This is hold On Be Strong on Pandora. That was
out hold On Be Strong, and I'm taking over. Join
us next week for another episode of Quest Supreme. Yes,
we hope you enjoyed us. Thank you very much, Stephen Hill.

(02:43:05):
This has been a black Thank you very much. Bus
hold body up, hold On Be Strong, hold On Be Strong.
Quest Love Supreme is a production of iHeartRadio. This classic
episode was produced by the team at Pandora. For more
podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or

(02:43:28):
wherever you listen to your favorite shows.

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