QLS Classic: Tito Jackson

This week, the world lost a music legend in Tito Jackson. In January of 2020, Questlove Supreme first broadcast this 82-minute interview with the heralded guitarist, vocalist, and member of The Jacksons. As our hearts are heavy in mourning, listen to this lighthearted discussion which was taped in-studio.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Question. Love Supreme is a production of I Heart Radio.
Do you turn me up a little bit? All right? Bet?
Suprema suprema role called suprema subprema role called subprema subprema
roll call subprema suprema role. We're making them chips or

(00:25):
should I say Frito's. Were the most laid back Jackson
of all Torrannio at Daryl Supreme Suprema road called Subprema
subprema rod called. My name is Sugar. Yeah, this shore
is nto to be right here on I Heart Radio.

(00:47):
Sama roll call such supremo roll call. It's m Yeah,
your favorite black one, Yeah with my man Tito. Yeah,
the finest Jackson roll call suprema so surema roll call,
sub prema sub prima role call boll schools. My name yeah,

(01:12):
Northern Indiana boy, Yeah, from the Jackson family. Yeah, brought
me a whole lot of joy. Call Sa su prema
roll call, SA surema road call. My name is Terry, Yeah,
my last name is Jackson. Yeah, I come with the action. Yeah,

(01:33):
that's a math faction surema roll call, so prema, so
su prema roll call sub prema son sub prima roll
call sub prema Son. Surema, roll call Wow, yeah, I

(01:53):
just recorded a song with the Jackson. Wait, this is
our second second going with the Jackson. Yeah. Yeah, so
we're experienced. Now we're honre Jackson's. Ladies and gentlemen, Welcome
to another episode of Quest Love Supreme. How are you doing? Uh?
And now we got sugar Steve. Hello, how's it going Steve?

(02:15):
It's going good? Now. I've never I've never seen all
thirty eight fifty thirty eight. That sounds like not enough? Well,
you know, just enough? Uh? Like how how's like? All right?
And uh, boss Bill? What's up? Wow? Even Boss Bill

(02:35):
is happy? Yeah? Jobs. You know usually start every Quest
Love Supreme episode with a barge of hyperbole and praise
that usually takes about seven minutes. But if you don't
know who are I guess this is the dailies and gentlemen,

(02:55):
and you listen to Quest Love Supreme's been under a rock?
Yeah something something something saying literally, I will say a
member probably one of the most love and respected musical dynasties, uh,
celebrating their fifty anniversary and show business just wow. I
remember that Soul Training episode where it was like their

(03:16):
tenth anniversary show Business now it's fifty. That's incredible, man,
that's that's a legacy for your ass ladies and gentlemen.
What else can I say but welcome Tito Jackson, Love Supreme,
Benjamin Button Jackson. Yeah, and I was about to say
regressing and you when I walked in the room, you

(03:36):
thought it was my nephew. Yeah, I was. You're taking
care of yourself. Man. We always knew that you and
your brother Jackie had proper government names that weren't your
stage names. Um so, how did you uh was Tito
your middle name or your mind? How did you get

(03:57):
your monica Tito? Papa Papa Joe name me after boxer
named Tito something? So Tito's on your birth certificate? No
it's not, Oh never mind. My birth certificate name is
Terry okay, terrana A Daryl Daryl Jackson. Wait, those are
so many names. Terrano, Darryl Jackson, Daryl, Daryl, just three

(04:19):
names the first, middle of the last, like everybody else, Margaret, Terry,
almost a Darrel. Okay, I'm sorry. So at what point
were you ever? Since? I can remember so all your life,
your siblings and Tito. Most people know me bot Tito,
and what surprised me. We have a corporation with the brothers,

(04:39):
and my brother handed me a credit card American Express
instead of having my real name Terry. I don't know
it had Tito Jackson, I said, Jackie, I can't use
this right. I don't have one piece of I d
that says Tito Jackson. Oh, I understand this because nobody
in my family has ever called me by my birth name,
like I've always been eat the junior of June Book.
Like really, yeah, only we call you Bill. Okay, only

(05:04):
my friends and and people I work with call me
by my real name. Everybody else. See, now that I've
put this on the internet, y'all gonna mess that up. Yes,
June Bug, I can call you a matter of fact,
you are a June Bug. So okay. So Tito was

(05:24):
your your nicknames so always unless it's time to take
out the garbage, then where you like didn't pay attention? Yeah,
let's see, Tito, I have no chores. I had plenty
of I Okay. So I know you're probably tired of

(05:47):
recapitulating the story over and over and over again. Okay,
Is there is there a question about Gary, Indiana that
you've not been asked that we don't know about. Well,
maybe I don't know. It depends on what you want
to ask. Well, what what I'm really curious about? Um,
I'm more curious about the creative process of how things

(06:11):
come together. And I know that and without the whatever,
under the watchful I of the iron hand of drill
Sergeant Joe or whatever. But I know that to get
to that level of perfection you have to put hours
and hours and hours and hours of practicing exactly. So,

(06:33):
could you give me what a typical itinerary was primo
town of you guys prepping for your talent shows. Of
course I can. Well, it was more like, go to school,
come home, put them books over in the corner. The
mics are already set up, all five microphones, amps are

(06:54):
on standby, and we're doing it and kids are still
walking home from school and then stop and by hearing
the music, pushing each other out the way to try
and take a look or whatever. And we rehearsed maybe
three or four hours prior to doing the show that night.
We usually go to Chicago, play the Peppermint Nounge of
the Hot Shop around something like that, then get home

(07:16):
like two in the morning. You know, and uh go
to school next day, wake up at six seven in
the morning, go school. Were you allowed any downtime from
when school let out to home or was it like
for me, the fear was you better be home before
the uperh theme comes on, which I had to be

(07:38):
home after three at three. Yeah, that that bell like
when Carlton starts dancing. My reactions when I hear that whistle,
it's just it's just like I had to be home
at three. Well, my father's thing was when we weren't
doing music, he said, don't let the street lights catch you.
If those street lights are on and you're not in
the house, you're in trouble. Yikes. Okay, so wait, can

(08:02):
I ask a question? How often did you did you
guys do the showcase or the talent, because well, we
rehearsed every day and we do our home break between breaks.
Oh yeah, so what kind of students were you guys?
Great students, great students. Yeah. We also travel with a
tutor after we had made it professionally, and they have

(08:23):
rules of course, uh state laws. The kids have to
work so many hours now he has to have so
many hours of a break. So we had a teacher
by the name of Rose Fine, and she talked. She
was so cool because she would let me smoke my
cigarette right in class. I was smoking as a team.

(08:45):
You know. Were you the rebellious Jackson? Some people say that,
but I don't think, like, who's the first to really
test the water? Is still like I'm gonna break curfew.
You're not gonna hit me with that belt. So it
was the myth true of the whole guitar thing, because
is that the way that was presented in in the

(09:06):
bio pick. You know, you were doing chords and stuff already.
So how long did it take you too, from the
first time you I had that guitar to learn chords
and all those things before the string broke. Oh, it
took a little while. It took it at least three
to four months. You know. I was just playing with it,
and I I used to go and my uncle Luth

(09:27):
and my father would play a lot of the blues
Jimmy Reid, B B. King, all these guys from old school,
and I just sit there and just stare. You know,
he knew I was interested, and I just stare and stare.
And when he would go to work, he go to
myself and Jermaine and he and Jackie. He would go,
I'm going to work. Don't none of you boys touch

(09:49):
my guitar. I'm putting it here in the closet, you know,
and we being being a kid, you don't say that,
you know, we want to touch it. Even more so
I will take to get how I played for hours.
My mom would let me play it all day long,
and she said, honey, your father's gonna be home soon.
Put it away, you know. So she was protecting me

(10:10):
until I broke that string. Didn't How long did the
Falcons last your father's I have no idea that because
I was so young at that time, you know. But
they were around a little while I was basically just
a kid trying to play some music with mom called
my father, and they would play blues all day and

(10:31):
they had me doing Doom, Doom Doom. Do they get
all the lead parts? And they give me maybe a
minute at the end of the jam section. Okay, you
can play now, you know. And I played whatever I could,
you know, mistakes at all, whatever, you know. That was it.
So by the time you guys were formed and the
Falcons weren't necessarily doing that, No, they weren't at that time. Okay,

(10:54):
I see, I just recently not discovered. I didn't realize
there was a whole message. I knew the steel Town
Recordings was forty five, but I didn't realize that there
were a collection of other songs in that era. But
I mean, of course, you know someone's gonna come up
like start cashing, and so half of it was just

(11:16):
rehearsals whatever. But at the time, when you guys got
your thing together with steel Town, was that like an
excitement thing like this is Jack Pott. It can't get
nobody than this. Oh yeah, we thought we had made
big time. You know, steel Town was the local label,
while to Gary, Indiana and their their reach wasn't very far.

(11:37):
I think we thought we made some noise in Texas,
and we made some noise and Gary and I can't
think of anywhere else in America that it was hidden.
So that was pretty much the success of that first record.
I'm a big boy now and knowing that you guys
played the I guess you could say that the Chitland

(12:00):
circuit of the day, we were some of the venues
that you well, you the major venues that we used
to do the Regal Theater in Chicago, and uh was
that equivalent to the Apollo Yes, as far as the pressure, yes, well,
Chicago's version of the Apollo. You know, Regal Theater. We've
seen and open up for Jackie Wilson, Gladys Night, Bobby

(12:23):
Taylor in the Vancouver's. We were basically a local band
that the pros used to come through Chicago and we
we were the opening act. And uh, every once in
a while we'll go to the Uptown in Philly and
we'll go to the Apollo Theater here in New York.
And uh, that was pretty much the big, big dates
for us. So I would assume that your dad would

(12:45):
do all the driving. We had this other man by
the name of Jack Richardson who was a friend of
my father. He would do a lot of the driving
because my father would work sometime and Jack Richardson would
take us to the performances. Why ask my father want
to work? I'm just trying to imagine how all the
equipment and there's no such thing as backline and all

(13:06):
that stuff. So yeah, we had a votewagon bus vowagon bus,
so would load everything in the bus and back then
you travel with your own PA system as well as
your amps and everything. That's what I'm saying, Like, how
did you guys squeeze? We slept on the amps. We
slept and sat on the amps. So we took all
the seats out of the car. Okay, I'm trying to

(13:30):
figure out the configuration and how did you get the
amps and the seats and there? I wish you guys
can see the look on his face. I mean, there's
a fift passenger van we run. No, no, no, they're
driving way further than you guys do in this uncomfortable situation.
In the beginning, we didn't get our first tour bus
to like our second album, so listen to compare in nineties. No,

(13:51):
I'm just saying, I get I've never thought about taking
out the seats. Okay, it makes sense you hello, uncomfortable,
but pre seat belts too, kind of middle passage jurish
pre seatbelts exactly? Do you remember us since you were
a teenager at this time, right, y'all are touring you're
a teenager, Yes, I was a young teenager, maybe twelve
thirteen years old. Do you remember what it was like

(14:13):
going to these different cities and this time of it
was exciting, you know. I remembers, oh yeah, I remember
all that. They used to put us in the back
of the hotel near the dumpsters. You know, we were
little kids making a lot of noise and they wanted
us away from the front desk. Really so oh yeah,

(14:34):
there in the hallways and exactly, and we did it all.
So can you finally put the official stamp on who
brought you the Motown? I understand that it was actually
it was two people. I say it's responsible for bringing

(14:54):
us to Motown, and that would be Gladys Night. Okay,
because she tells me the story every time. I'm you're
one of like twelve people. Now, No, Glad's Night, glad
It's night, big big instrumental uh and Bobby Taylor of
the Vancours and UH. Basically with Diana Ross, the story
with Dinah Ross were just basically she presented us through

(15:15):
the world market. Yes, she had just gone solo that
she was getting ready to her first solo record at
the time too, right, so that would have been like
she had did it or what getting ready? But they
used Dinah Ross presents to Jackson five. Yeah, Barry was
thinking of marketing and mind you Uh, Tommy Chong was
Oh yeah, Tommy Chong was a get our player. Then

(15:37):
Bobby Taylor. Um, so how long was it till after
that um audition at Motel at least the one that
we saw that where it was like official. Not long.
They got us in the studio pretty much right away.
You know, we were in the studio within a month.

(15:57):
And uh. But the thing about it where we had
did that audition, we didn't think we would be signed
because Barry was in a corner, very stern. He would
didn't show no expression, and we were like doing that
things say do he like us? And this and that?
And we had heard he don't want more children on
his label. He having a hard time with Stevie Wonder
with the social workers. He can't record you already had

(16:21):
him in the studio for four hours. I gotta take
him home. He got work, he got school tomorrow. Say
what I'm gonna do with five kids? I can't handle one?
And uh, I guess it was Gladys and Bobby that
convinced him that you have to hear these children because
I always wanted a thing on that tape. Michael asked,
how is that or something like, sir and I never
knew what the answer was like. Yeah, speaking of five

(16:46):
kids from the Chicago Land area, go back to promotean
a little bit. Were the Five Stairs Steps? Were you
guys like in competition with him constantly? We were friends,
you know, Our Stealth Steps is a great group. They
a young group like Jackson's War back then, and they
had a song out by the name of ou Chaw.
It was made a lout of noise at that time.

(17:07):
And they used to travel. We would travel right behind
them or with them or what have you. Yeah, I
was gonna say, um between the Silvers of Tennessee, especially
because they got such an early start. Um. Leon told
us that from Indiana to well he was born in
Indiana in Southend where I'm from. That I forgot about Leon. Yeah,

(17:30):
well I didn't know that. I totally forgot about that.
So I mean, I'll never forget that man. Of course,
everybody born in Indiana, I remember. So was it when
when it's time to do these shows? Um, and I
forgot even the emotions said that they were running to
you guys often. Oh yeah, the emotions, and said we

(17:50):
used to run into our emotions. And back in the
day it wasn't Earthwaring as far. They were called the
T Box Simmons. It was a band. Yeah, there was
in a band called T Box Simmons and they would
play the same place, uh, the Hushaparral. And yeah, we
came up with those guys as well and emotions. So

(18:12):
you're saying that a month after that audition, you guys
got the news that you got accepted to motewl Oh. Yeah,
we got that. Matter of fact that we got that
pretty much at the audition because he walked over to
us after he had we had finished our audition and
we didn't know what he was going to say. He
walked over and said, I'm going to take your first
three records number one. Oh okay, we said, what that

(18:35):
was unheard of, especially about black artists. You know, three
records number one in the country, you know all the
charts he did four times. Yeah, yeah, so he did
it four times. When do you officially consider like your
last day or period in Gary, Indiana as in rear

(18:56):
view mirror, never turning back, we're being too well. We
moved to California back in nineteen sixty nine, and uh,
it was funny because our neighbor, uh this young lady
by the name of Brenda White. She's always said, you
Jackson's all of you guys in that little house making
all that. No, y'all ain't going nowhere, So you know

(19:20):
our motivations Gary, Indiana, I was like, wait, who lived
in Beverly Hills. Brenda used to say, my friend sing that,
just keep watching, you'll see you'll see y'all. Ever circle
back to her, please tell me I haven't seen her
since well. I mean, of course, of my observations with

(19:50):
you guys is that your family was really the first
to reap the benefits of the I have a dreams beach.
I consider you guys really the first beneficiaries of kind
of the accumulated whatever was being fought for for the
civil rights movement. You guys were the beginning of that dream.

(20:14):
And then people see you guys and they want to
do great and so on and so on and so forth.
So but I know that being the first, and by
being the first, really being like the loan black faces
and a lot of white spaces and being first. How
fish out of water was your experience moving to Los Angeles.

(20:39):
I'm assuming that you guys lived in Beverly Hills first
or yeah, we lived in Hollywood first in this creek
called Queen's Road, and then we moved to Beverly Hills.
But it was really exciting. You know, We've never seen
a palm tree or anything like that, so just the
land in l a X Airport, it was like exciting
seeing the lights and the palm tree easing, the weather

(21:01):
so tropical and all these things. It was like paradise
to us. Nobody wanted to go back to Gary, Indiana
at that time, cole winners, you know, freezing and walking
to school and three and four foot snow, you know,
who want that? But was there ever a feeling like,
at least what my experiences where I know, like I'm
the loon shark in a odd situation. And I don't

(21:24):
mean like a NodD situation like everything's like rednecked now South,
but I just mean like showing up, you know, and
I'm the only black person here, or that that sort
of thing. We were always motivating and anxious and ready
to do whatever it took. And what you guys never
felt like, no, no, we've never had those feelings or
felt uncomfortable. No, not really until they put us in

(21:46):
the back by the garbage cast. Oh Motown period of touring.
Oh yeah, yeah, we was just loud. We deserved to
give it at this trash. So did you think at
that point be rigorous rehearsals and schedules would slow down

(22:08):
somewhat a little bit? They didn't. They increase, a matter
of fact, But did you think that it would. I
thought we made it and that means you don't have
to do too much of that type of thing, you know.
But of course you know quests as a musician that
you gotta keep it going, baby, you gotta rehearse. And
Motown rehearsed us very very very hard. They went through

(22:31):
every little move, every step everything. Okay, So in the
Motown period, what would now that you're in l A,
what is your typical itinerary? There? We would go to school,
whichol we went to private school. At first. I went
to public school, to school called Fairfax High and Los
Angeles and that only lasted so long until after the

(22:55):
Sullivan Show and the hit records, the students chase us away.
That we moved to Beverly Hills and I went to
another school by the name of Universal High School, and
that last I was in that school two months. Then
they figured out, we can't go to a public school.
So you guys were just that too famous to even do. Yeah,

(23:16):
we had a few hit records out and the kids
were like recognizing us and they would peak in the
class and that whole thing and screaming girls running down
the hall and that whole thing. How did I feel?
I mean, didn't feel like a goldfish or like it was.
It was kind of scary because all the all the
dudes wanted to your butt, jealousy, jealous and that whole thing,

(23:39):
you know. So they figured, these guys can't go to
school here, we got to put him in a private school.
How close was for your public school experiences? How close
was what we know as l a gang culture in
those public schools? Like did you have to worry about that? Well?
I remember, I remember my brother was dating this young

(23:59):
lady body and they Kathy Bockham and Dorsey High School
is in Gary as well, not Gary, I'm sorry, Los Angeles,
and talking about Jackie Jackie and this other guy from
Dorsey really dug this girl and he came over, brought
about four or five guys over to Fairfax, calling theirself

(24:19):
gonna whoop my butt, you know, and they didn't know
that we're from Gary and you may sing and talk
about ABC and girl, I think I love you, but
we can put some but when we have to, because
we grew up in the hood, you know, and my
father had always told us to take care of ourselves
because what he would do he would invite all the

(24:42):
kids in the neighborhood over on Saturdays and have boxing matches,
make us box the kids, and that wasn't I was
wondering how real that team was. Oh yeah, oh yeah.
I was gonna ask you, how much should we consider
of that story, the Jackson, the story that is referring
to the American Dream? How much a lot of it

(25:02):
is true? You know, my father was rough, but he
wasn't as rough as they portrayed him. They dramatized he's
a black daddy, right, I haven't left daddy anywhere. So yeah,

(25:25):
I was gonna say, how often was the That's the
thing I never had because you know, because the age
gap between me and my siblings. What your last name
is love? So that now I never I never had that,
Like you'nna get my brother, you know, like that's that's

(25:46):
the one thing you never mess You would never mess
with Yeah, you would never mess with the youngest person
on any block, because they could always say I'm gonna
get my cousin you Like, that's what that freshion on
Tito because he wanted to Oh yeah, I was about
to say. He always thought you were the oldest. Any
I'm not. I'm not I'm not your Yeah, I'm like
two and a half years younger than Jackie. But Jermaine

(26:08):
used to always start fights in the elementary school and
carry and he was started. He was started. Then leave
me there to fight his battle. Didn't run home and
say mother, Tito fighting. Yeah, he did that part a
few times. Socially, how do you guys pair off as

(26:29):
far as peers? Like who is your Yeah, I know
that all of you are close, YadA, YadA, YadA whatever,
but like who's your road dog? Who? Who are who
are the road dog groups in the Jackson family or
Jermaine and I hunger I hung out together, Um, Martin
and Michael course hung together. And Jackie just mingled damn

(26:51):
with all of us. He was like big brother telling
us what to do. It's time to rehearse. No, you
can't do that. We got to rehearse. You know, so
he's the alpha. Yeah, yeah, he was father figure, he
was older than everyone, the responsible, yes, okay, who was
the snitch in the family, the tattle tale? Hold, okay,
tell everything? He tells so much you tell on the South,

(27:14):
you don't even That's usually how it works out the family.
You know what, you're You're right about that, You're right
about that. There's um uh. Harry from Motown once played
me in tape of there's an ep K, well not
an ePK, but kind of an audio ePK of just

(27:36):
like you know, rapping with the Jackson five whatever, where
you guys are just talking for a half hour about
your hobbies and all that stuff. But Jermaine all of
his all of his portions were about like kind of
provoking the brothers like Michael, maybe that time when you
got in trouble for Dada Da Da and Tito. Remember

(27:56):
that time you got in trouble. I was like, yo,
like why he said, what the hell? Um what? I'm
also very curious about, uh, you and your brother Jermaine's
craft as um as guitarists and bass players. Now, I
know that Motown had a strict system, which, of course

(28:18):
you long to get away from once you went to Epic.
But I will say that based on the evidence of
a lot of live tapes that I've heard of the
concerts and uh, especially with going to Indiana, the special

(28:40):
going back to Indiana, that yeah, you two were at
the top of your game as far as like covering,
like really in and in fine form, what the Funk
Brothers would do on record and all those things. Because
back of the Jackson Five early days of doing concert tours,

(29:03):
our band contents consists of myself and Germaine and Ronnie
Ransoffer on oregon and Johnny Jackson on drums, and that
was the band. So how often were you who was
the m d of that particular of just being rehearsals?
Actually I was, you know, I was pretty much. How

(29:25):
were the early shows crafted? Not the adult period of
the Jackson's but like the early shows, Well, you're talking
prior to Motown, not prior to Motown like once you
guys were doing Motown. Because one one thing that I
think that our audience doesn't understand, like when you're on
your first two records, sometimes you have to do cover songs.

(29:45):
We did cover and we did a lot of the
album album songs we had, but a lot of those
songs were covers as well, So basically that's what we did.
We covered temptations or whether it was four Tops or whoever. Yeah,
we did a lot of covers. Then who were you, Well,

(30:06):
I'm curious about your record collection, like by the by
the time that you moved to l am certain that
you sort of cumulated and the Miracles of course, all
the Motown attempts and all that kind of stuff. Oh jays,
we follow who was your go to like your favorite
who were your Jackson's? Like, who is your favorite group?

(30:27):
Was the Temptationous really as far as a group, Yes,
Temptationous We love to sly Okay, So were you guys
at all thrown off being as though you were able
to see in real time? Were you kind of thrown
off by the Norman Whitfield period of that group, like
to go from what they were the smooth presentation of
what I assume that is the blueprint of what you

(30:48):
guys were. Two suddenly they're hippie. Let's keep up with
sly Stone period I think seventeen minute intros And yeah,
we were basically just trying to follow out you know, uh,
for Sly and the family Stone is very musical. You know,
they're a little different type of setup than a Temptations

(31:08):
Stations type of group. They're more musical, so and we
enjoyed that, you know, like songs like thank You and
all this stuff. You know, Sly was the man. You know,
we love Billy Preston as well. Were you able to
go to concert like how often would you see other
shows that weren't you any time off? Not that off
unless you're on the show or were running across some

(31:31):
somewhere somehow. Yeah, was there any act that not even
feeling like they might be a threat, but like that's
the level we need to get to. Like the stair
Steps five Stairsteps was one of those groups that we
used to look at and say, that's what we have
to be, like you know, or that was that rival

(31:52):
you know how you have a rival group or whatever?
Oh yeah, what was it? Because I've only seen like
maybe one or two performances of theirs, Like what was
it about their presentation that well? I think we love
the way they dressed, the way they carried themselves, and
they were professionals. You know, we were trying to get
to that stage in our game, you know, so they

(32:13):
had it already. They would come over to the policy
and just tear it up. The young ladies would scream
and holler and chased them all stage, and that's what
we want. How how frightening was the Apollo experience even
though I mean I'm talking about past amateur hour, once
you guys were even established, Like, was there still feel

(32:33):
fear of like we still better rocket or else? Yeah? Yeah,
we never really concentrated on, uh like trying to go
pass what we thought we could have been. We just
did what we can do, did our best at what
we could do, and that that usually turned out to
be pretty cool. So that's where that was. Um. I

(32:58):
know that in the vaults and Moved Town there are
hundreds like TUPAC level, Prince level of volume of finished
recorded songs, songs that are fully mixed in everything, um,
and not you know, the final nine or ten songs
that make it. Particular Jackson's album like I think at
last count, I saw at least somewhere like two hundred

(33:20):
plus songs. So what what is the process of how
songs were divided or like, how did you guys make decisions? Well,
we can make that those types of these sessions. They
just told you. We would come home from school right
in the studio every day if we didn't have a

(33:42):
concert or on the road, would go straight to the
studio studio and do our homework in the studio, get
home about ten o'clock at night, and that was it.
We used to do a song a day, you know,
background and lead vocals, and if we had any clean up,
do it on the weekend. So, I mean, whose decision
was it? Too? Like? Was it everything? Like? Okay, So

(34:05):
here's some ten songs and what do you guys, what
do you guys dig? And well, I think Motile pretty
much picked the songs that we were recorded, and Uh
with Hal Davis and the corporation, Freddy Parent and all
those guys, you know, they already had it laid out
for us. They had the keys and all those type
of things, and they cut the tracks and have us

(34:28):
to come in later and do the vocals on them.
So the various producers James Carmichael, Hal David, Uh, the
Mozelle brothers for a second, Richards France Mizelle, who did you?
Who did you were? The brothers particularly favor as a producer. Well,

(34:48):
we We loved working with Hal Davis because he was funny.
He's you know. He We would joke a lot in
in the studio, and he was so serious about it
and we're little kids just plan on the mic and
not serious. And he had pushed record waiting here. We
just started laughing and come on, guys, come on you

(35:12):
you know. He was really really a lot of fun.
But we also enjoyed the Corporation, which was Deep Richard's
fun my Zelle and Freddy parent and Barry Gordy they
called themselves the Corporation, and they were a lot of fun.
They were a lot of fun as well. They were
young men just finishing college with the musical scholarships, and

(35:33):
they were great writers. So how long were you guys
given a particular song to learn and absorb? We learned
on spot, learned in the studio. Okay, So like alright,
so home Along and Dance, which songs like twelve minutes
and all of you have designated parts. So would they

(35:54):
take you one by one or is it just certain
parts were taken one by one, Some projects were taken
as a room. And uh, like I said, we learned
that song right on the spot. You know, we're going
to the studio and uh in the control room sit
with the producer and he'll go through with this line
that this is your life, your main this your line, Michael,

(36:15):
your line, brothers, this you know, and that whole thing.
So wait, can you answer a question for me? I
always wanted to know this, Okay, be honest. When the
when you guys were recording Rhythm Child, mh was there
a feeling in the air like, Okay, it's gonna be
a bigger It's gonna be bigger than the Dance Machine

(36:37):
because basically it's the same narrative and the same DNA
as Dancing Machine. So in my mind, I felt like
you guys really felt like she's a rhythm child. It's
going to be like the new Dance Machine in the
nineteen seventy. Well, that's the machine is on this song.
You know that song is so magical. I love this
song and I didn't think that so I was just

(36:58):
doing what they told us to do, Okay. I always
wanted to know who brought in I'll bet you for
the ABC album Baby, Yeah, I bet you. I can't
remember that. I think that may have been Uh, I
can't remember. I'm sorry, Well, I think Barry was hands
on at least for the ABC record as far as

(37:20):
navigating it, very very would let the producers work with
us and they would send a copy of the track
or whatever we had did that day to him. He
would study it. Didn't give them corner notes and they
do you guys know George Clinton at all? Or was
it just like no here random funking delic song for
you guys that we didn't know George Clinton route. I'll

(37:42):
bet you actually it's a funk a dellic song too.
Thank you? You knew what I was thinking? Did you
all right? So you? I mean you were prominent Contrary
to uh opinion, all the brothers had parts on records,
including Marlon. I didn't realize to maybe like maybe ten
years ago, that that's him riffing on Mama God brand

(38:05):
New think don't say no. In my mind, always always
your main riffing. And then I realized it once I
listened closer. But um was it was it your desire being?
So you're the only minus Marland, you were the only
one that didn't do any solo projects. Yeah, I'm well,
you know, they give me those parts that nobody wanted

(38:29):
you know the low part. You know, I've always had
the low voice in the family. And so, like I said,
you said, nobody wanted like yeah, well, you know, you know,
Temptations was idolized group that we are Franklin exactly. So
they looked at me like Melvin Franklin and that's where

(38:50):
you stay now, you low voice. So I never got
that opportunity to sing. But I didn't only sing low parts.
I would all so double of the notes in the background.
Then they put me in and do a little base
bottom part or whatever. And sometimes I'll just make up
a part just so I can be on the record too. Okay, Okay,

(39:12):
So you did get to do that, because I was
sitting here wondering like when did you guys get to
touch the records, because you said for the longest time,
y'all just go in, you know your parts. At what
point were you able to have a voice and saying
what do we do this? How are you feeling watching
your label mets uh, Marvin Gay and Stevie Wonder especially

(39:32):
go through such a creative uh kind of blossoming blossoming
that you guys weren't able to have, Like how did
how did you feel in observing, like when you're getting
your copy of Intervisions and uh fulfilling this first finale,

(39:55):
It's like, this is what we want to do. Well,
you know, we are always uh idolized people like Stevie,
you know, and wanted to do stuff like him, and
we actually asked to be produced by him. We did Buttercup, Yeah, exactly,
we did Buttercup and uh and you're supposed to keep
you loving me. I didn't realize that was there's a

(40:17):
there's an original someone, let's get serious. I didn't know
Buttercup was released. Yeah, yeah, ten years ago now, yeh
finally yeah, once. But I have a follow up question
REGARDSS when they when the motown was putting that out.
I actually got invited over to the offices to um
hear a lot of the tracks that they were going through,
and one of the tracks that they played us, um

(40:40):
it was I think the title was something like Tito Steak.
It was. It was. It was introduced to us as
it was going to be a Tito solo track. I've
seen that real, but I've never heard it. Yeah, actually
I got to hear it. I got to hear I
can't remember what it sounds like, but I do remember
hearing it. So what what do you remember about that?
I don't remember anything. Yeah, don't even sound for him.

(41:03):
Maybe that was the last song that I recorded before
we left. So you're gonna go make my questions. I
wanna Well, I'm getting there. I'm getting to the bridge now.
My personal favorite period of the Jackson's is probably the
period that all of you kind of like strugg at,
which is seventy four Vegas Variety Show period predestiny. So

(41:28):
let's just say, like Vegas to Golden Places. What were
you personally feeling at that time as far as where
the brothers were concerned. I mean, your brother Michael expressed
that he felt like we were old hat and he
didn't enjoy doing the variety show and all those things.

(41:51):
And I'm pretty sure you heard it to be because
when you're in the midst this, you have what we
call haters and the people just after I think we
had our first four number ones, and then we started
having songs that didn't make it to the number one,
and people used to come up and say, you guys
have finished. You know you're not gonna Oh yeah, that

(42:15):
gave us motivation, of course, and we've always wanted to
write music and produce some of our own stuff, and
that was our reason for moving on to Columbia Records
at that time epic because they gave us that opportunity
to have a song or two on our our albums,

(42:35):
you know, like the Jackson's that was produced by Kenny
Gamble Leon Huff. You know, they worked with us with
the songs we had, you know, they and put it
their their involvement and made it happen. So that was
a very exciting moment for the brothers to know that
they were capable of writing songs that people would love

(42:58):
and mike and buy. So you yourself, you didn't enjoy
doing the variety show or it didn't bother me at all,
you know, I do. I was one of the members
that whatever it is, I'm going to be there, whether
we're playing in a in a closet or plan in
the arena, I'm going to be there. So is that
because you just loved it so much? Well? I just
wanted to be a team player. Yeah. And also, I mean,

(43:21):
like I think it would be like today if someone
got a reality show, then it's like, all right, we
gotta get a reality show. So I'm certain for you
guys it was like wait, Osman's have a variety show
and shows and Yard now and has our variety show.
And there was a point where last Night and the
Pips had a variety show, so Brady Bunch tried a
variety show exactly. No, I know you're trying to be funny,

(43:43):
but no, that's what I was. Was it dop As
drum break orang so um speaking of the variety or
not the right but the Veggas? What was it like?
You know, the Veggas residency started like two months after
you guys got back from Senegal, So what was what
was it like? You know the difference. Why do you
guys get your history from That's true, that's true. I

(44:07):
mean you guys know more about me that were following.
I never forgot everything. You know, it's been a long road.
But we uh was that the first time you guys
been to Africa? Or yes, she was. We went to
sink all about What was it like? It was very
exciting getting off the plane and that's where Michael got

(44:29):
that Mama say Mamasa, that's what they were chatting to us.
What we first went to Africa? They were singing, playing
the drums, Mama saying mamasa Michael, Mama saying mamasa masa.
You know what it means. I don't know how gonna say,
take out that garbage? Um. Well, also, are there any

(44:55):
memories whatsoever about um? Because there's an infamous vote. What
you guys hanging with the Marley's in Jamaica? Is there
any memories of that period? Did you guys know that
Bob Marley was royalty? Was it just like weird guy
with here? Well, we had did this show in Jamaica

(45:18):
with the Walers, and Bob Marley was there as courts
and the next day he invited us over to hang out.
And so we go to Bob Marley's compound and the
guys hanging out in the trees, smoking the dubes and
all this stuff, and it was really exciting, and he
took us through the whole compound, show this where he worked,

(45:38):
wrote this song, where he recorded and what have you.
And uh, I just remember that very very much. It
was a great period. And back then Bob Marley was popular,
but he's not. He wasn't last today. You know, he's
everywhere now because you're hanging out with the Marley's. But

(45:59):
from what we know, you guys are were a very
religious family, and you know, of course the legend of
your father being strict. How did you navigate or how
did did he ever say any give you disclaimers before
y'all did this or that, or I know he was
but but he did he say you better not do this?
You bet you know? Oh yeah, we know that black Daddy,

(46:20):
We knew, we knew what you know not? So so
do I guess that you Jackson's never got a taste
of the Bob Marley Ganja, No, we just asked that
they smoke. We well, that was the second question I
wanted to know. They tipped the Bob Marley and then
John just never got a taste of them. I never,
I just started smoking. And I'm like, I got bound

(46:41):
on me right now. So wait before I before I
jumped to Sony, before I jumped the epic um. By
this point, you're the Jackson five end quote. Um. And
I know that you were the first to get married
and have kids or whatnot, So I'm assuming that you
were domesticated. But I mean, I don't know. I just meant.

(47:07):
But the thing is is that you're the Jackson five,
so thrown at you. What was what was? How was
it hanging in Hollywood? Like I know you have a
massive car or had seemed like fosy U T K

(47:27):
card and everything like anti cars where you think, first
of all, yeah, how many I hate asking black questions.
That's the one that I never want to do, Like,
so how many mentions do you have? How many cars
do you? But I feel like you're the original Jay Leno?
Like what was it about antique cars? And because anytime
I've seen photos of you, it's like you're in a

(47:49):
garage with an antique car. So like, I just always
loved mechanics, you know, even when I was a young kid,
you know, built mom bicycle out the Junkyard and then
did a gold card and then got into cars. I love,
especially the older stuff like in the twenties and that.
So it's always been a love of mine. And how

(48:13):
easy was it to get access to that back then?
I'm just saying now, like if I buy a pair
of Jordan's, like my business managers like a man and
I'm kind of cool now, but still it's like, amen,
but how many cars were you for Jordan's? Just for sneakers.

(48:33):
But how many cars did you collect back then? Um?
I had about maybe a dozen. But I have a
warehouse that I put them in right right now, I
have about twenty cars. Can I have a car? And
how many do you let your kids drop? Well you're grown,

(48:56):
they do, but they don't have those cars, No, they don't.
They can buy the Yeah, yeah, he got some rare
stuffy But is it like, are there cars just to collect?
And I mean there are things I collect that I
would never utilize. I got pair of Jordan's I would

(49:17):
never wear because they will explode. But I'm just saying, yeah,
that's the that's the thing. You gotta know. Jordan's will
explode after thirty years. I get found out the hard way.
So I get a pleasure out of buying a car.
I'll find a car for seven hundred dollars and then
you'll hook it up. I'll redo it, take every nothing
vote out of it and have it powdered, blasted and

(49:40):
really the original Jay Leno And this is you your stuff? Like,
are you one of those people that can put together
that car? Kid? I got the carbureted. My hands have
probably got grease onto the finger nails. Now from from
some car I've worked out so even to this day,
like working on anti cars, like your hobby. Yeah, and
I've been building lately. I've been building a lot of

(50:01):
the surfer type sixties valse wagon buses. Yeah. I love
those things. Yeah, I got about nine. But you can
put the seats in them. Well, I'm just saying, you know,
January twenties my birthday. I'm just saying, he just said

(50:24):
he get away. Yeah, so well, never mind, Okay, how
I think of something? Okay, so going to Philadelphia, Um,
by the way, Uh, my elementary school was next to
Philly International and Broad Streets. So once once in a
blue moon, in second or third grade, i'd see you
guys like going and going out. It's gotta be freaky

(50:46):
as a kid to see that Jackson's going. Well, I've seen,
I've seen. Actually, what's weird is that you guys would
even visit to say hi, even after the fact. Like
I think once before a Destiny concert, you guys stopped
by Broad Street and I only knew because like every
human being in my school like was out in the

(51:06):
streets chasing you guys. That's how we know that Jackson's
are in proximity. Um, but in kind of the slow
process that eventually led to the Destiny album leaving uh Philadelphia. Um,
first of all, how how long were you guys physically infilially?
Were you only there for like studio time or did

(51:28):
you like live there? Now we are only there for
studio time and the week get called in and we're
do an album in two weeks and do everything and
move on. Okay, so there for two weeks? Oh yeah,
So how long did it take for you guys to
convince Ron Wisner and and I guess yeah, Freddie Dedman

(51:53):
and Walter get Nicough to like, okay, we got to
do this on our own, Like, how long did it? Well?
We went to Epic Records saying that we want to
write some music and produce are some of our songs?
And what had happened? We had a couple of songs
on the earlier albums, the Coin Place album and the

(52:14):
Jackson's album and they did very well, and uh, they
gave us the green light to do our next album,
and which was Destiny, and we wrote all the songs.
And so when you guys were doing the process, what
was the division of labor for that album? Because now

(52:35):
you guys have to answer to yourself, like did you
have a family meeting? And well, I think we already
had some songs. Maybe Jackie had a song or two.
I know I had a couple of songs, and Michael
had some stuff, and we get together and write the
lyrics and help each other out on the song, and uh,
write about situations, whether it was my mother and her

(52:57):
politeness or whatever, and that's pretty much how it came out.
He wait, wait, wait, wait, all right? Without getting personal
pan pizza, okay, I often felt I always wanted to

(53:20):
know what did you guys feel about the lyrics of Destiny,
because I personally felt that was kind of Michael's passive,
aggressive way of saying, guys, I want to do stuff
on my own, and I don't know how to tell
you guys, because to to look at the lyrical content,

(53:41):
I felt that that was his of all of all
the I want to break free themes that he's ever
had in his career, that that was the most explicit, direct,
but kind of underhanded. I mean, Destiny goes there, things
I do for you goes there, pushed me away, goes there.

(54:03):
Even though it's dis guy says a love song, but
espectly that's what you give for being polite, which I mean,
was there ever a moment where you guys were just
chilling one day and it's like listen, hey, wait a minute,
Like was it but you said that was about your
mom's Yes, yes, and and uh things I do for you? Yes, yes, yes,

(54:26):
we had that. I'm gonna go read those lios. I
mean as much as talking. Okay, since you kind of
opened that rabbit hole. Since you kind of opened that
rabbit hole and we're black, can I assume that since
you I don't know any successful black person that doesn't

(54:48):
go through survivor's guilt, do you understand what survivor's guild is?
As far as if someone's successful, then there's kind of
the unspoken obligat to worry, need to take people with
you mhm. And I know that there's friends and family

(55:11):
and cousin Ray Ray and the cat you went to
school with, and let me hold a little something, and
our phone bill is cutting off, our phones getting cut
off next week in dada da da da, Like how
are you able to matrix dodge or avoid? You know,
let me hold something real quick? Like, yo, man, can
can you help her, Like, am I assuming that if

(55:35):
these songs are factual in terms of people using and
that sort of thing, how are you able to avoid
or how easy are you with saying the word no?
You know how easy? How easy? How easy is it

(55:56):
to say the word no? Like again, like, hey, we're
down on luck? Da dada had school tuition next week? Yo,
can y'all help out? Ya da da da? Like I
just I know no successful black person that manages to
avoid And you're the Jackson's, which in everyone's mind in

(56:18):
America is like family royalty. So how hard is it
to avoid hanger ones or people that ask ask, ask, ask, ask, take, take, take,
take take That still happens today. You know that's comes
with the territory. As you know, you're going to meet

(56:39):
people that's hanging with you. Just meet another brother. I
don't mean strangers though, people people that you know just
think cousins. They haven't gotten the clue. Yeah, you've been
doing this for fifty years and the same people, they're
still the Jackson's. I'm saying people to still asking that's no.

(57:01):
You meet new people that still acts, but yeah you
can I have a car. Yeah, I mean I'm trying
to you know, I try to avoid got your journalism
or whatever, but I know that it has to be
awkward being a powerful family that you know, you guys

(57:24):
have a hard time just managing and navigating your own
thing without the eye roll of man is like, so
is it that you change your phone numbers a lot
where you're just on tour and you know that they
have cell phones back then, so you're lucky. But we

(57:45):
had a lot of protection from security and those type
of things. People look after, especially the people of Motown.
You know, even when we would go on the road
or whatever, and if the other other Motown people around,
they would be like our parents, you know, they would
give us advice, don't touch drugs, don't do this, do that.

(58:08):
So we were schooled by the Motown staff and the artists.
Is it easy to still go to family reunions or
your high school or hang with friends? Like are you
still friends with people you're friends with four years ago?
And I'm friends with friends that I have from Gary, Indiana.
That's a miracle. That's Tito. Is everybody friends with people

(58:32):
from Gary? Because I feel like we expect this from
Tito for some reasons. You don't know you and we
just feel like you still. I don't know, it's just
my whole buddies. Yeah. I lost a lot of people
in my life, a bunch of people. I just lost
one of my high school friends a couple of weeks ago. Sorry.
Another important element of your development as an entertainer is

(58:56):
the live show presentation. Be Jackson Liveshield presentation. So in
your in your mind with theatrics now entering the realm
like Earth on Fire with their theatrics and levitating and

(59:17):
uh Asley Brothers in smoke Machines in Parliament, Funkadelic. There
was theatrics. Were you seeing shows then? And wasn't like yo,
you gotta see blah blah blah like what it was.
It was a period when like you're saying, you know,
Earth winning Fire, they always had the great show, some
type of magic illusions or whatever, and uh we felt

(59:39):
that's where it's going. We got to do something too similar,
you know, to keep the concerts exciting, to make two
people want to come see you. And that's what it
was like back then. You know, we're playing arenas or
hopes in twenty thousand people. You know how you're gonna
get all these people uh in this arena, and you
had to have a show that offer more than just

(01:00:01):
the music. It had to be I candy as well.
So so what was that initial pitch, Like like, Okay,
we're gonna we're all gonna get in this box and
then it's gonna be like pitch dark, and then it's
gonna explode, and then we're gonna come out with new outfits.
Like you can have people in the business that have
these creative ideas that come up with the props and

(01:00:23):
things of that nature. Whatever you can imagine, they'll try
to make it happen. But this was new at the time,
so it's I mean, now it's nothing to do, you know,
for you to say, all right, Kanye West, we were
gonna levitate you on the stage throughout the stadium. But
back then, you guys were definitely like I thought my
cousins were lying, They're like yeah, and then they got
in a box and exploded. You just lying, Marky like,

(01:00:48):
how do you believe it? Until I saw my own
Jackson show, I was like, oh, they really are exploding.
So even at even Envy the initial days of of
those tours, like there wasn't I fear like, hey man, like,
there's too much like with the explosions and all that stuff. No, No,

(01:01:09):
it was exciting, you know the only thing that was
detrimental was the commercial we did, the Pepsi commercial. Have
you seen that final tape? I finally saw it like
two so's when it came online like two years ago.
I didn't really have you seen it? Do you know
what's crazy in whenever they listen to this, it's it's

(01:01:31):
people out. There's a whole generation who do not know
what you're talking about. Okay, So there was a Pepsi
commercial shot in which um said explosions that I was
speaking of. Uh Sparks went to Michael's hair and then
was it you that put your jacket on top of
his head? No, he called out my name. I was
on the other side of the stage. He called out

(01:01:53):
my name for help, but I was too far away.
I think it was one of the prop men who
thought that quickly. And like two or three years ago,
they finally put the actual with his hair on fire,
and I was I didn't realize it was that serious.
Like it was. It was seven seconds of that and

(01:02:15):
it would have been a whole new story. Yoh, like
what was well, of course, obviously, what was the feeling
of that? Like it was it hurt us very much.
You know, we knew he was hurting and that he
was had these serious burns to his scalp and that
whole thing. And from that point I felt that was

(01:02:37):
the beginning of a lot of problems for him. Yeah,
he needed he stayed in pain a long time. I
just never told us or but you guys knew that
he was. Yeah, I'm circling back on that's what you
get lyrics. I'm sorry, y'all. I just wanted Mama Catherine,

(01:03:04):
what did she have? Bigger things? What does she want?
I know she had a lot and she had nine children,
but was there more that she had wanted in her life?
Like what did you think she was? Kind of feels
like you're missing out on or can you know, well,
you know, I may have twisted that that song things
I do for you as my mom, that's what you get,

(01:03:25):
Like that's Johnny Jacks, Thank god, that's Johnny Jacks. Yeah,
oh wow, okay, that's better. Thank you? Come on, man,
why are you chopping these gyms? And then you know ambiguous,
I gotta go home and figure this movie Excube out.

(01:03:45):
That's crazy. Um so with with the Victory Tour leading
up to it and how mammoth it us what were
I mean, you know again, one person s having could

(01:04:06):
be another person's health. But to be on the inside
of what was then the biggest grand tour of all time, Like,
what are your memories of the Victory Tour? Was it
sort of like it's fun or was it like it's
getting to be too much? Or no? It was never

(01:04:29):
too much because being a black band and probably the
first black band to do those type of venues, it
was a pleasure to represent and do those. We would
go into a city like New York or wherever we too,
three shows at the stadium and sell them out, and

(01:04:51):
that was never heard of for black bands to do that,
you know. So we felt we were, you know, making
a name ourself, creating history, making landmark. About to say,
I gotta ask about we can change the world. Yes,
very uh, very okay. Speaking of Bob Marley, I always

(01:05:12):
felt that that was your kind of world music exactly.
I love rage right. Even on my Tito Times album,
I have a reggae song that I just sat there. Yeah,
so yeah, I was gonna say, was that your inspiration
is sort of do like a world music? Yes? Yes, yes,
the song is about changing the world. You've got a

(01:05:33):
lot of different styles in you. Because I was listening
to one song and I was like, you got the
country in You do country stuff too, you know, we
started out singing was like cotton Field exactly. When I
heard that, I was like, yo, what do they do
about that? But yeah, you know by my music is blues.
I love blues. Who do you consider like god? Especially

(01:05:54):
to be around in Chicago those times? Were you able
to see these legends? Uh? No? No, no really no,
So you guys never played blues clubs and Albert and
Now I never saw aber King or any of those
guys play. I would hear him on record. The albercallis

(01:06:16):
Aber King, Jamie Reid, Bob King? Such, who's your favorite
blues guitarist player as far as tone and Bob King
and Abercollins really love him? Yeah? Wow, okay, okay. I
have an article here from right On Magazine October nineteen
seventy one. You also mentioned Jamie Hendricks was one of

(01:06:38):
your favorites. Jimmie really, what were your thoughts or Ernie
Eisley and as far as the direction that the Isles took, well,
he's dope, Ernie Stope on the guitar. Yeah, I love
his tone. Okay, so I know that the fruit doesn't
fall far from the tree and that your son's would

(01:06:59):
be Yeah. Ever, miss not to mention your son's also,
uh have a you know, a successful scening career as well. Um,
were you a little skeptical and knowing what you know
what the businesses, We're skeptical and sort of uh encouraging

(01:07:20):
them to well, like you said, knowing the show business
and the ups and downs of the business. I want.
They were very good athletes. They played a lot of baseball.
My middle side was right number five in the state
for baseball pitching, and he was Barry Bond was very
looking at him and wanted to him to go to

(01:07:41):
the Giants training camp and trained with him. And at
the time he was recording his first album with the brothers,
his brothers and uh, they they hung up the gloves
and watered the prisoners pursue songs really and I felt
I used to tell them, I say, hey, you can
doing both. You know, when the baseball season ain't happen

(01:08:03):
getting under the microphone. You can do both things. Was
this t J or Trell? The t J was just
as as as brilliant as an athlete as well. Mh wow. Okay,
so they wanted to pursue sports, well, they didn't exercise that.
They wanted to be entertainers because of me and their

(01:08:25):
uncle's of course, how hard is it to keep them ground?
Didn't humble when they're family are superheroes, they're pretty easy.
You know. When did they realize like, oh shit, like, okay,
this isn't normal. That's a good question. I don't I

(01:08:46):
don't have the answer for you. But they always loved
the business and wanted to be a part of it.
You know, like they had gone to a Jackson concert
when they was super young, and they're looking at the
outfits picking off the Ryan songs and decided and then
come home and grab bronze and mops and put on
the record and yeah, and I take the record. Yeah,

(01:09:10):
trying to be like that, don't touch my guitar, didn't
have it. Don't touch my guitar mount No, No, that
didn't happen. I told him, if you're going to do this,
you're gonna do this we're not faking it and all that,
we're really playing the instruments and really singing. I'd say,
if you really want to do it, I'll let you

(01:09:32):
use my instruments. You can go in the studio and
mess around and get familiar with things. And they did.
Then they showed interests. I got them some lessons and
they've learned a few things here and there, and I
started putting them under the microphone in the studio. Are
there any second generation Jackson's that are just like doctor lawyers? Yeah? Yeah,

(01:09:53):
we have accountants and morning kids are accountants and lawyers
and like that. He don't want his kids in show business.
That's even more important. Yeah, like have some behind the
somebody got to count the money that you can trust.
I see that. Okay. So for you're why why did

(01:10:15):
it take you so long to finally like really developed.
I don't think it took you that long because long
after the the group had left Epic. I've seen you
a few times, like you've had your blues review at
various clubs. I've seen it a few times. So during
that period, uh, late nineties, mid nineties or whatever, like

(01:10:40):
what made you decide to like sort of scratch that
blues hitch that you had, Well, it's still there, you know,
it never goes away. It's part of me, you know.
But most of my fans aren't blues, so I was figured,
if I'm gonna so they still come to the show
like waiting for you to sell the funking yeah, the
whole thing. Absolutely, And I just figured I need to

(01:11:04):
do something to satisfy their ears, you know. So I
decided my first album it's going to be for them,
you know. And I just pretty much finished the blues
album that I'm not ready to release because I'm going
to do a Cheeto time too, and maybe third album
blues record. I just did a recording with George Benson

(01:11:29):
and we did we we we redid rock Me Baby
George mcras, I'm sorry, okay, So there's yeah yeah, so
and uh we have a baby stored on the record
as well. Does she play or is she? She's a singer.

(01:11:51):
She sounds fabulous too. Do you ever just go out
and surprise people to go to it like a jam session?
I mean just I haven't done that too much of
my life. I've done it before, but not too much.
Some jams sessions, Yeah, we welcome that. You know, well,
if the roots do some jams exactly My point were

(01:12:12):
you were you surprised at the reception of Tito time
And I'm not surprised at the positive response, but you know,
I'm it's always a risk out there too. I've always
been very quiet, like I said, and uh, never spoke out.
Never never let my you know, pants down or whatever

(01:12:33):
you however you want to put it. And uh, heir,
but pants is good too. Always hair hair when I
let my pants down too. But anyhow, but anyhow, I
think the fans accepted it very well, so I thank
them for that. How often how do you guys divide

(01:12:58):
your time now? Uh with touring and doing like festivals
all over the world and downtime. Well, people don't understand
is that people always say to me, you know, this
is the last time you've seen your brother I say, well,
it's been about two weeks, three weeks, two weeks, three weeks.

(01:13:18):
I say, yeah, are you tired of people asking like
when you're alone, like where's the you know, where's it?
Like you're attested the hip, you know, but that you've
been with them all And if I see my brothers,
you know, I might see them every day for a
month on the road. You know, when I'm not on
the road, I want to get away and enjoying my

(01:13:41):
life a little bit personally. Well, I see how the
schedule is now, um, and you guys are you know,
when it's festival time for Europe and all these other countries.
I mean, you guys are pretty much together. So I
saw you guys when you first started touring, uh like,
was it two thousand, thousand, eleven um? And compared to

(01:14:06):
what it is now some eight nine years later, you
guys are like a full fledged operating machine. How do
you How do you guys divide that time? Because I
know that I know that that could be tiresome. I'm
one of those people. I don't want to see the schedule,
you know, I don't want to know what I need

(01:14:27):
to do. I'm just gonna do it. Do it, yeah,
and you see easier that way easier. I need to
know how you prepare because I was I told the
guys once I was randomly on a Jackson's tour in
London about three or so years ago. And you guys
still move your bodies like you did fifty years ago,

(01:14:50):
and they're They're like, how many y'all do, like twelve
songs at least? How do you prepare physically for something
like that. It's called not taking drugs and not drink
and get in your sleep and your rest because Marlin
Marlin still, oh my god, Yeah, seriously. Not a stretch,
not a woman on a yoga, not a not a vegan,

(01:15:11):
not a not a not a keto, not a nothing.
Just Marlin. He said, he don't eat any red in me,
but he's healthy. You know. We have to, uh, just
do it. That's all we do. Just do it. Yeah,
not even a stretch or warm up or Marlin stretches.
Of course they stretched. I don't do anything. I look

(01:15:31):
at them. And when did you fall in love with
the derby? I've been wearing this thing for twenty five years? Maybe? Yeah,
back in the day when my kids were rolling around
the UK, I went into the hattery and I discovered bowlers,
that's what they Was I wrong in calling it the derby?

(01:15:53):
So you're traveling with them in the very early stages
of three t Yes, were the teenagers? Then? Yes? They were? Okay,
so I guess yeah, yeah, they were I think fifteen
sixteen and something like that in that age group genal teenagers.
I see, So what is your what besides the Tito
t time? What you're contemplating? What's your What is your future?

(01:16:17):
What do you well? My future is to continue doing
my solo thing and enjoy it. Of course, work with
the brothers. I like to do a blues album and
do that whole thing. And that's basically all I'm looking for,
just doing my music. I'm a musician singer, so I

(01:16:37):
want to have complete success in that area. I think
you're success in that area. I mean you're Jackson. For
God's sake, you're Jackson. Any other VAM request stive? What?
Oh no, no, okay, no, he's gonna give me the car.
I'm sure I don't need to request it again. What.

(01:17:00):
What's the car you've had the longest of your car?
I have a nineteen thirty cavallet Um Model A four
that I adore. That's your favorite? It's not my favorite
when I had the longest I've had that? Which one
is your favorite that you have? I have a nineteen
Lincoln convertible that I adore. He just made me feel normal.

(01:17:24):
Do you just have a regular Corolla, like just to
go to the corner Stoy to get toilet papers. He
go to Gilsen's. He want to go to Gilson's. That's
the grocery store. If he goes to about because I
live in l A now, so I just okay, yeah,
I feel you. What is your car? What's your what's

(01:17:47):
your store car? You're run around and do Errand's car?
Or do you have to stunt every time? I know,
I actually going in cart needle. I have a few cars,
I like, you know, I drive a Fiat and I
drive a Dodge Realm pickup truck. That's that's a download

(01:18:10):
Underratar car. Yeah, I still consider that stunting. What was
the waiting for? You say, like I have a scion
or something like he does. That's what that's what quest
keeps scion and a key on deck just in case
what my one fan chases me down the street before

(01:18:32):
I let you go. Can you just tell one random
is there? Is there just a random Jackson story? That's
a few that you can tell. Well, when we were
young back in the day and everybody knows what Jermaine

(01:18:52):
is like, Betty, just give me, give me a German story.
We used to have after the show you know the
girls were crazy on the stage. Chase us off stage
and come to the hotel. We have five girls running

(01:19:12):
through the Hotel's trump good to get up the stairs,
up the elevators. Put security on the stairwells and at
the elevators and everywhere. Somehow Jermaine got somebody through what
he told me back in the day aunties. Anyhow, Jermaine

(01:19:37):
that Jermaine and Michael shared rooms. And he told Michael
because he stutters a little bit. He don't do this
when he sings, but when he talks he stutters a little.
My god, I got a girl coming over. So when
she come here, I want you to hide. So so

(01:19:58):
I guess the girl knocks on the door. Okay, Michael, Hi, Hi, Mike.
Mike his under the bed, right. So the young lady
walks in the room and jam as enjoying her and uh,
and all of a sudden she goes, wait a minute,
I feel the third hand. Thank you very much, welcome here,

(01:20:26):
any ladies and gentlemen, or and behalf of Quest Love
Supreme Boss, Bill, June Bug, Sugar Steve. It's like shout
out to Fontacolo and I'm made Bill, Thank you very much,
Mr Jackson. Thank you. We didn't ask one question. Why
did you never get the curl? Well? I never get

(01:20:47):
why did you never get the curl? The curl in
the hair? Oh on me, I don't want that. Ladies
and gentleman, take you very much. This is a sure
supreme we We'll see you on the next ground. Check
out later. For more podcasts from my Heart Radio, visit

(01:21:14):
the I Heart Radio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you
listen to your favorite shows. H