February 2, 2022 • 71 mins
Questlove and Team Supreme present, a conversation with Will Smith. Thank you and you are welcome.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Quest Love Supreme is a production of I Heart Radio, Man,
I better make the Central special, right, Okay, ladies and gentlemen.
Everybody's searching for a hero. People need someone to look
up to, and I'm only no actually to be frank,
(00:21):
our our guest is a true hero. There's literally no
human being on earth who has not heard of our guest.
Uh Like, seriously, you don't even need to hear my
voice anymore, but uh, just for form, now these six yests,
we can go hip hop legend, the first hip hop
Grammy winner. Uh, sitcom legend on one of the most
(00:44):
beloved important family shows in TV history, a golden Oh yeah,
that's new skipping. You didn't think that that was one
now I'm playing. Um No, but seriously, he like, let's
let's not take it lightly that um he has been
(01:04):
a premier action hero, one of the most highest paid actors.
I believe seventeen of his films that grows past at
least combined eight billion dollars, which is nothing to stop at.
You know, when I say this man has his own money,
I mean he has his own money. Um No, Seriously,
(01:24):
I swear to God, I'll put it this way. Steve
you remember my infamous rat story, the one I heard
thousand times? Y, I think I can remember it right,
So before before you came in the picture, I will say,
even his foot even the footnotes of his life become
other people's highlights. And I mean he invided me to
the Millennial back in December thirty one something. I'm sure
(01:48):
he doesn't remember that, Yes, exactly. Do you know how
many times I've told the story of Mary Tyler Moore
running over Liz Taylor's wilch air, or my Jordan or
my corns. That was my original rat story. Anyway, I can.
I can talk and talk, talk, talk about achievements until
(02:09):
the cows come home. But literally what hit home for
me personally was his his really brave, rigorous act of
complete honesty and vulnerability, which is a word you don't
often hear, especially in the black community. Um and his
book will amongst other things that he's achieved. This intro
(02:31):
is now ninety minutes long, and the show's over. Ladies
and gentlemen, please welcome Smith. Yes, you're you're like, wait,
have you set up lights in your apartment? Huh? Where
you set up flights? Right now here? So here's the thing.
Here's the thing. I took this interview seriously, right, No,
(02:56):
this is the cleanest zoom display I've ever seen in
my life. Like I'm very ashamed right now. Like I
was like, it's my man. You know, he asked me
to you know, to come on. It's Philly, it's all
of that. It's like I gotta make you know, I
don't know what he needs, what he wants to use,
Like I want to be I want to represent properly.
(03:17):
I want to audio. You could have been on the
couch anyway. So actually I want to start off and
I'm gonna go against format and just sort of make
this a free round for everyone on the show, all
of us here. Hello Team Supering by the way, anyway,
(03:39):
so I wanna know what did you do this morning?
Me or Team Supreme? So you I'm just curious what
your average warning is like nowadays. So I usually I
wake up about uh four am, So like four to
(04:01):
six is my private quiet time, like no phone, no nothing,
I think, I meditate, I read. It is like the
my favorite time of the day that there there's very
few days I'm not awake at four am, and four
(04:23):
to six is how I get just centered and clear
about what I'm gonna do in in the course of
a day. And uh, some days I'll go I'll go
back to sleep from six to seven thirty or something
like that and start my day. And uh, some days,
if I'm energized, I'll get on the treadmill at at
(04:46):
six and start my day. See, I already feel like
I'm doing this wrong. No, because Grace told me, like,
Grace's time is five am, and that's the one promise
that I sort of like backtracked on, you know, Yes,
we'll get up together and you know, and then I
(05:09):
went back to my normal ten m routine. But man, man,
you can't underestimate the power of watching the sunrise. There's
something that that energizes a human body about seeing the sunrise.
It like wakes you up with it. It's like you
get in sync with with like how the world is moving.
(05:32):
How long has that been a practice for you? Probably
about three years it started happening. I'm not a big sleeper.
I'm I rarely, if ever, sleep for you know, five
hours straight, you know, yeah, rarely rarely. You know. I'll
sleep for four hours, up for a couple of hours,
(05:55):
and then sleep for three hours, three more hours like,
but very rarely will I sleep that. I never sleep
eight right, I'll sleep a combination of four up for
a couple of hours and then back for four, but
never eight hours straight. Okay, So can I ask you now,
that's where that's where I have excelled in life. Do
(06:15):
you feel like you've slept eight hours or more? Do
you feel like you wasted the day? And I know
from reading your book, I know that for you, the
idea of hard work, performative hard work is like job one.
So letting the idea of that go, I'll give an example.
This Saturday, I've never gotten up at two in the afternoon.
(06:38):
I slept for fifteen hours. I've never I've never slept
for fifteen hours ever. And I don't even feel tired.
That's just oh my eyes. And I was like, wait,
it's still in the afternoon. What the fun? And she
let me sleep in fifteen hours? Like for you, is
sleeping eight hours? Like that's that's a wasted I could
have saved world in the last hour. I used to
(07:03):
I used to feel like that. It used to feel like,
you know, I didn't want to be sleep. I always
felt like I was yeah, but yeah, that that was
a Quincy Jones joint. You know, boy, you have enough
time to sleep when you did, you know, So, so
I prefer like I'll I take naps right, you know,
(07:25):
I'll lay down for for thirty minutes at lunch, you know,
and you know, get a get a third, and I
can I'll be refreshed the thirty thirty minute nap at lunch.
I'm like, really refreshed. But I don't like the feeling
of sleeping all the way through in that way. But
(07:46):
every couple of months, I'll definitely get one of those
fifteen hour jones. Like you know, if you do that
every couple of months, I'll get that full day where
you just shut it down and return that sleep debt.
But the the that that four to six practice is
a new thing. I wouldn't miss that for anything like
that up and the whole world belongs to me and
(08:07):
it's private and it's quiet. It's like that's when I
do my my best uh thinking. And you're still able
to do that while you're taking movies and stuff to
while you're shooting. Yeah, So usually with a movie, if
I if if I have an early call, it works
perfectly because I'm up a couple of hours before anyway,
and I'll just continue my day. And usually on those
kind of days, I'll sleep at lunch, I take a
(08:29):
I take a nap at least. What does meditation look
like to you? Because we talk about meditation a lot
on this show. Um, the big thing for me with
meditation is no pressure. I don't pressure myself too, uh
do anything but just watch my mind to just be
aware of all of the things that are coming up
(08:51):
to just notice. Damn. I hate meditating today, right, and
I just I kind of take the time to just
notice what's going on with my mind. I don't wrestle
with it. I let it. I let it do what
it do. Baby, do you do trans meditation? No, I don't.
I don't go that far like I. You know I
have you know, you read the book, so you know
(09:14):
I've done ayahuasca and things like that. Which is you
know it's a form that you know for me, that's
a form of meditation. I didn't read it. What can
you just tell me? A man, it don't spoil it,
you don't. I don't want you to spoil it. But
I'm so curious. I was gonna I was gonna tell
you will Um I am when I hit you the
(09:35):
last time, I was telling you that I was waiting
for this very specific I wanted my first ayahuasca journey
to be with this African couple that that does it.
And a funny thing happened to them, which is they
were now like, you know what's happening. This Will Smith
(09:57):
book has just come out and suddenly we're in the
in So now I gotta payote. Mushrooms are all family, right,
So i ahuasca is really really different. So you know
the the the the scene in Black Panther, right, yeah,
(10:22):
ancestral plane, right, so that's the African that's taken from
the African version of ayahuasca, uh Eboga. Right. So it
is as vivid as they depicted in the movie. You
you like, actually go meet see talk to people, you
come back right like that's the movie is not an
(10:43):
exaggeration of what the experience it is. Wow? Right? Um.
The only the only thing that was was uh potentially
a little bit of of an exaggeration is the directing
of the experience. The the it takes you where it
wants to take you. You don't get to like pick
(11:04):
maybe at higher levels people can pick, right, but yeah,
I never got to pick. I got dragged right, So
what did you drag you into? Who did you get
to talk to? Did you talk to any people from
your past or whatever? My father came to me, you know,
So that's what I was saying. So I had that
that experience my father, Uh, he came to me and
(11:25):
showed me where he was living. You know, I will
say to you like that sort of on that path.
I think the lightest version of it is, well, their
sounds journeys you can take um for some people step
up from that is sound journeys with mushrooms. Some people
(11:49):
do Iowaska Mike Tyson talks about, uh doing toad, which
is even more Yeah, yeah, extreme, But basically it's almost
like you should really be open for me at least
and trying to heal like a lot of the childhood trauma.
(12:09):
First of all. I mean there's literally no human alive,
especially black human that has not dealt with trauma, real trauma,
and for I think for a lot of us, um,
we sort of normalized the trauma, Like I normalized like, well, yeah,
that's supposed to be jass until you know that I'm
(12:30):
a good person. Now does my dad be my ass
um And it's only it's really only until like maybe
a year and a half ago, where I just had
to settled that yes, even though my dad loved me,
that that was the highest form, the highest form of abuse,
and really like damnit. So I mean as a right,
(12:53):
but that's the thing, like, as black people, a lot
of what we hold on to for how we were reared,
it comes from slavery and that's sort of the one
aspect that we can't let go, which for me, at
least in in reading Will's book, the reason why I say,
like the vulnerability and the honesty, it's really unpreced in it,
(13:16):
especially like I really want black people and I know
like people are you know, attracted to the fact that,
like you know, everything that's happened in the last year
or so, and Will is life that if they're coming
there for that, like that dirt or whatever, and it's
really not about that, it's about really coming to grips.
(13:36):
You guys, remember on past episodes where I told you
about the laughing song, right, George Johnson, h how it
just hit me that emotions were literally illegal for three years.
You couldn't laugh and if you you know the reason
why they invented the terminology, uh, barrels of laughs was
(14:00):
because slaves are built a barrel full of water. So
if you felt yourself about the laugh on the plantation,
instead of meeting the ire and the anger of the overseers,
you would dunk your head in the water to suppress
the sound. Same same for anger. Who are you sassin that?
Who are you getting smart with? You? Better not crying
(14:20):
if I give you something to cry about, like all
those things that we attribute to black parents, like all
that ship came from slavery, so we literally could not
show emotions it was illegal or else he faced lashes
and as a result, I think the defensive thing that
we invented, like the same way we invented soul food
out of the worst food ever, black people invented cool
(14:43):
who as a defensive mechanism like not showing, not showing emotions,
not being too affected, holding back, not not drawing, you
know what I mean? And as a result, it's really
damaged us. Like if you really think about the last
black person that I started really on display of this
(15:04):
vulnerability was the last thirty seconds, and she's out of
my life, like who would willing? Who's willing to be
that open about about their life? And so for me,
why why did you feel as though now is the time?
Because when I read this book, I was when I
was relieved because someone went before, you know, like given
(15:25):
the Three Stooges, where there they do the army thing
like who's the first volunteer and everyone steps backwards and leaves,
like seriously, like every one in my life's like, you know,
we can't wait to stop writing these bullshit as music
books and really no, not for real. It's like you know,
(15:46):
everybody were like, yo, no more music books, like tell
us some real shit about your life. And literally, when
Will's book came out, I felt like, okay, maybe it
is safe to cross the street a little bit without
getting run over. So why did you build like now
is the time to really share your story and to
(16:09):
be as honest and open about it? Yeah? I think, Um,
I'm sure you all have been watching me publicly for
the for the last uh dirty years. I mean, come on,
you know, I think first and foremost, I can feel
(16:32):
the wave coming right, So there's a there's a consciousness
shift that is happening right now, right, So, so a
couple of things are happening. More people are realizing that
there is no happiness to be derived from any material
(16:54):
conditions that you can put together. Right. People are starting
to realize, at no matter how great your job is,
no matter how great your family is, no matter no
matter how uh perfectly you cultivate your material conditions, they
(17:16):
are unsustainable. You you have a perfect marriage and family,
and then there's a storm and three people in your
family get killed when cod covid and shuts down and
shuts it down. Right, So people are realizing, at material
(17:39):
circumstances are unsustainable. Right. So if that's the case, if
it's the case that I can lose anything, how can
I possibly enjoy my time here? Right? And more people
are waking up slowly to that idea. And people are
(18:00):
starting to realize that you are the only problem you
have to solve, right, that your your mind and how
you are with this world is the answer. Right, How
to be with your circumstances is the answer, Not trying
(18:23):
to get your circumstances perfect. Right. Okay, So and this
is this is the first time I've been asked this
question this way. So I'm struggling to like to to
to to say it. Right. This is the first time
you've been asked this question in this way. So I'm
not like I've never been asked a question. The answer
I want to give, I'm I'm trying to form it
(18:44):
in my mind right now. Right. So, the the realization
that I that I had is, it doesn't matter so
much what happens to me. It doesn't matter what happens
in my life. It doesn't matter what happens with my family,
It doesn't matter what happens with my career, doesn't matter
(19:06):
what happens in my life as much as it matters
how I think about what happens to me and how
I manage myself in interacting what what happens to me. Right, So,
the answer that I realized is you can't create loving
(19:31):
interactions from unloving behavior. You can't. You can't. You can't.
You can't. You're trying to love and be loved. At
the deepest part of your being. You want to love
and be loved. You can not create it. If you're scared,
(19:57):
if you're angry, if you're resentful, if you're hungry and craving,
if you're holding any of those poisons in your heart.
You can't create what you want. You can only create
the opposite of what you want. Rights. So all of
that to say, I knew that if I was going
(20:20):
to be happy, I couldn't be scared of what people
were going to say. That I had to thoroughly and
comfortably be me just as I am, with no fox
given about what anybody thinks or means. So being so
(20:41):
to that point, in terms of being you and in
writing this book, how did you decide what to tell
and what not to tell? You know what I'm saying,
and not necessarily in terms of being having any shame
about any parts of your life, but just as an artist,
having that line of saying, listen, these are some parts
of myself that I choose to keep to myself. And
(21:02):
I have the right to own myself, you know, so
as to not let these things define me. You know,
how do you decide what was take me through the
process of deciding how you wanted to tell your story?
So the the the only thing I was prepared and
still am prepared to say anything and everything that's true
for me, because I only get stronger by being vulnerable.
(21:26):
I used to think I got weaker by being vulnerable.
I only get stronger by being comfortable to share who
and what I am freely. On the line that I
drew is I didn't want my words to be weaponized
against people I love, right, So I wanted to tell
(21:49):
my story. And the difficulty I was having was telling
my story without telling Jada's story, right to you know,
to tell yeah, without you know, telling Alfonso's story, or
we're telling Jeff's story, you know. So what I did
(22:11):
is when I finished the book, I had what I
was calling a writer's camp, and for two weeks I
called everybody that I mentioned in the book down to Miami,
and I read every word of the book to all
of the people in the book so they would know
what I was saying about them. And then I let
them respond and made adjustments and and things like that. Everybody. Yeah,
(22:37):
though it was it was a FORU well there there
there were a couple of people who declined um. Declined um.
But it was the first time my mother and I
had ever talked about my father being abusive. We literally
(22:58):
I was I was fifty two years old at the time,
and my mother and I literally never talked about the
fact that my father beat her up and her hearing
me read the chapter was the first time that the
conversation came up between us, and you know, it was
(23:19):
it was gut wrenching, but it was deeply purifying. And
you know, when I was talking about that idea of
blocks to love, it's like the fact that my mother
and I couldn't talk about that there was a barrier
between us, right, and we loved each other, but we
(23:40):
weren't really connecting in honesty and authenticity, right, So there's
always a little bit of a facade because we both
know we're just not going to talk about it. So
it just creates a little bit of a barrier. And
neither one of us wants that. We want to love
each other wide open and vulnerably, you know. So from me,
it was cleaning out all of the barriers and the
(24:03):
blocks that I had to loving the people in my life,
you know. And it's and it's those traumas make us
close our hearts. You know, the worst crime you can
commit against another human being is to assassinate them in
your heart. And you know, one once your heart is
(24:26):
closed to somebody, as nice as you think you're being,
as cordial as you pretend to be, all all I said,
was yeah, right, but you said it with a closed heart,
which the person understands clearly that you don't give a
funk about them, right, And it's like you can't hide it. Right,
(24:51):
it's because you're not you're you're you're not showing that
you're open to seeing them in a different way. Right.
You'll be surprised how much your heart is closed to
people you say you love, right, And it's like they
know it and they can feel it, and sometimes we
can't feel it. We think if we treat someone nicely
(25:13):
and respectfully that we're being loving, But if your heart
is closed to him, it's not. Behind every word is
I really don't give a fuck. And they hear right,
They hear it no matter what you try to say,
and no matter how much you try to cover it up.
(25:35):
All Right, So let me ask you something because I'm
this is the one. This is probabbly my major downfall
and the journey I'm in right now, Like I'm literally
I'm in amazed with my eyes with blinders on. And
if I could just figure out this one thing, I
(25:58):
think the world opened. But when I tell you, I
literally now there's there's a book I just discovered like
maybe last week called um I think it's called the
Big Step where the author speaks of how we uh
set limitations for ourselves and for me though, I am
(26:21):
trying to figure out and the problem is I'm trying
to figure out how to open my heart. Um. And
this is stuff I kind of shared on the show before.
But you know, like when you when you live, I
feel like when you live in fight or flight mode mhm,
that you can either go with your brain or your heart.
And I found that it was way safer for me
(26:43):
to go with my brain. Right. I gotta be the
smartest guy. I gotta be the most achieving guy. I
gotta be the provider. I gotta be, you know, the
hero that everyone And I'm currently in a situation now
where I'm hitting a brick wall because I'm almost like
the tin man, like I technically don't know the first
(27:08):
steps and how to open my heart. So the fundamental
premises flawed. The fundamental premise that you're safer using your
head is wrong. That's not true, right, So you can
you can only make an intellectual mess with that fundamental premise. Right. So,
(27:34):
going all the way back to the beginning, the belief
system that has to grow is that the only safety
is in you're well wishing and the authentic care and
concern for whoever is in front of you. You see
(27:57):
a samurai kill somebody and then pray over the body
the samurai, it's not like, you know, fuck him. You
know that motherfucker shouldn't have been tripping, right. It's like
the samurai is prepared to kill. You know that that's
what they do. But they spend half their lives learning,
(28:20):
you know, the techniques of kill for the purpose of
defending people, and then they spend the second half of
their life learning how to not have to. You absolutely
positively want to be able to defend people, and you
want to be able to build, and you want to
be able to create, and you want to do all
of that. If you're doing it with your heart clothes,
(28:42):
if you're doing it where you don't give a fuck
about people, it can't go well. And you and you
can have all the money and you can do all
of that. People are your greatest resources. It's like peoples.
When people know that you care, right, they give you
(29:04):
so much room to make mistakes and stuff like that,
and your only responsibility is for people to be able
to see in your eyes that you legitimately care and
you might have to make hard decisions, you know, as
somebody's mind might be so defiled that they can't respond
(29:25):
well and you got to go Samurai, right, but you
don't do it joyfully. You hate that you had to,
you know, cut that instead off right, you know what
I mean? All right, So let me let me ask
you a question because for me, like I put myself
(29:45):
in almost every situation that you spoke about in the book,
but there's one particular situation that I felt that you
handled with ease that I otherwise I wouldn't have handled
now only starting maybe three year yars ago, really not
even three years ago, like two years ago, I finally
decided to do something on my own without you know,
(30:09):
the collaborative narrative that I do. You know, everything I've done,
it's been the collaborative with everything. And so I'm thinking
that if I'm getting a phone call in Detroit and
it's Quincy Jones telling me to come out to his
birthday party, and you're asked to audition in front of
(30:30):
all those people at his birthday party, and he happens
to have your current lawyer still with you now, I
believe like too, you know, draw up the papers and
make this show happen. I would have instantly not only
thought of millions of reasons to say no, chances are
(30:53):
I'm like, thank you very much, but you know, you
know I have something. I I'm going back to Detroit
to go back to my group and stay with my group.
And I wouldn't have even gotten the freshman's of bel
air because I would have instantly, out of obligation, chosen
that first step in my career, which is just the group.
(31:14):
And so how did and you, I don't know if
you just glossed over or whatever, but did you realize
that that was the first paradigm shift that your life
is not going to be the same. Like once you
stepped on that airplane and went back to Detroit, how
do you explain to Jeff and you know, how do
(31:40):
you explain to these people that you made it a
life changing decision? And of course it's twenty four hours. Well,
we were, we were we were in a really desperate
financial situation, right, so like we we were, you know,
we had gone from Grammy Winners back to one hotel room.
(32:01):
By the way, I hate how, I really hate how
you sort of separate yourself from and in this Corner,
which my favorite record, I'm sorry, yeahorite that's crazy? Yeah,
that that one. That one hurt bad. I don't know,
I'm not driving you like I feel like and then
(32:23):
she beat me. It was like, that's one of my
favorite Halloween songs ever. But I like and Jeff was
on the beat box I did anyway, there was there
was one. There was one or two one. Unfortunately the
public did not concur. But it worked out for you
(32:44):
because if Quincy and Benny don't see that performance of
Mike Tyson on our Sina's Yeah yeah, yeah, So that
album still holds heavy for you because that's the moment
that changed you know. Yeah. But I looked back at it,
I can see I can see the value. Uh, definitely
when I when I look back. But to the first
(33:05):
question about so, for me, I've never been the kind
of person that felt like I had to stay with
my friends to be loyal. I felt like my loyalty
was to their growth and expansion. My loyalty was y'all
got to keep up original Lebron. You're right, yeah, you
(33:29):
know it's like no, no, No, it's like, yeah, when
what what was Robin Harris had a joke, what was it?
What was it? You're talking about robbing? Robbing? When you
get your famous, you're gonna change, you got damn right.
I'm going right, ain't gonna have no change change. But
(33:54):
the the idea, the idea is for for me, it's like,
we gotta climb. Not note none of us loved our childhoods,
none of us loved what our current situations were at
the time. Then if that's the case, we gotta climb.
We gotta grind right. And it was always painful for
(34:15):
me when somebody couldn't keep up, but I would much
rather keep going and send them some help then slow
down and let them pull us all down right, right.
So I've always felt like a responsibility to my to
my squad. But we gotta we gotta go right, we
(34:38):
gotta climb right. And for me at that time, that
that meant no drugs. Everybody gotta train. If you if
you want to do something different, you can, you just
can't do it here because like we are a crew
of dreamers and we want to see how close to
the sun we can get, you know. So, and and
(34:58):
that mentality, you know. You know, Charlie Mack, it was
so good to see you. Charlie and Jeff had at
I G conversation mid Covid is funny. I wasn't about
to say this, but I kind of did. Called Charlie
and get some some cheating things before we did this conversation.
But I wanted you to speak on that friendship between
y'all three men, because really that was kind of like
the the greatest way to see the three of you.
(35:20):
I don't think it was no other interview, no big
you know networks. Y'all three just busted Charlie Mack first
out the limouse people. You know, we we talked about that,
um and the I G live and I talked about
it a little bit in the book. It's like Charlie
is a dreamer. Charlie is a big giant dreamer. Thank
(35:44):
God for it. Right, you know, Um, Jeff is a
little more cocoon, right, Like Jeff wants his his spot
and if everybody agrees to go, Jeff is gonna go, right.
But Jeff climbs in another way. Jeff climbs with talent.
(36:04):
He spends you know, sixteen hours a day behind his
his turntable, so his his climbing was in a different way.
And you know j L who's as my manager, is
like one of the most well read people that I've
ever met. We gravitated to each other, you know, growing
(36:27):
up in in Philly, and it was like we were
doing the stuff that that that everybody else was doing,
and we was getting into trouble to everybody else was
getting into. But we all kind of had our eyes
on a different a different future for ourselves. We all
knew we were doing more than this. And you know,
(36:49):
your your friends are critical. It's like one bad friend
can blow your whole ship in one night. One time
you gave a speech. I never will forget this. Um.
Shout outs to your baby sister Alan, who's a great woman.
I came to a party you threw for when the
Beckups came to l A for the first time, and
(37:10):
you gave a speech about friendship and why it's so
important to be meticulous about friends. Can you just people
need to hear that at four a second, cause it
ain't just the rich and the famous, it's everybody. It's
it is. You know, there's a couple of quotes I've
heard around that and it's uh, it's attributed to Confucius.
(37:30):
He says, it looks look at the five people you
spend the most time with, and that's who you are.
That's who you are who you are, right, And you know,
I heard that. I was probably eighteen the first time
I heard that, and I was like, oh, it was like, okay,
(37:50):
well if that's it. If that's the case, then I
want this one, two, three, you know. But it's like,
who who your friends are is is you know, one
of the most critical decisions, you know, especially as a teenager,
that's one of the most critical decisions that you can make.
If the five friends that you associate with are straight
(38:14):
A students, you're probably gonna learn how to be a
straight A student. If the five friends you associate with
carry guns and sell drugs, you're probably gonna end up
carrying a gun and selling drugs. Right. So it's like,
you know, human beings are creatures of a example, and
(38:36):
we fall into those lines of who we're with, who
you laid down with, who you're who you share at
bed with is probably the most important decision life ever make,
(38:57):
you know what I mean? Right, So it's like choosing
your friends and your closest associates is how you fertilize
your dreams. Right, you can't have a life that's better
than your associations, Like it's it's impossible. Your life is
(39:20):
a team effort, right, so you can't have a better
life than your team. I gotta admit when when I
finished the book, that part of me felt not quasi deflated,
but the fact that I made a decision. I made
(39:43):
a decision like maybe two years ago, that Okay, I'm
really going to concentrate and get my thing together. I'm
a direct this movie, and I'm gonna go higher and
higher and achieve and achieve and earned and achieve and achieve.
And then you know, you told the the last six chapters.
(40:04):
You know, it's a doozy of the book again those
spoiler words, but you know, something happens in September two
thousand eleven that sort of changes the whole trajectory of
your life and whatnot. And when I read, when I
read that you had to take, you know, like you
had to take in a total assessment of everything that
you were. And it wasn't about how much you made
(40:25):
and how much you know, how many records you broke
or whatnot, and you kind of had to start all
over again, Like what, I know that that level of
achievement and that level of fame can be somewhat addicting.
So now in ten years after the fact that you
(40:46):
had that, there there's a story you tell about Jada's
forty birthday party and which I kind of feel that's
that's your paradigm shift to lead you to where you
are right now. Well, for starters, it's almost what are
your life goals right now? Because else well more than that,
(41:10):
I think he discovered that none of that matters. And
to me, I actually felt like, oh ship, wait a minute,
like I'm trying to win this Oscar so I could
do more movies and get more power and get more
power and get more money and get more power. And
then I realized, oh man, that's not gonna make me happy,
because this book is basically like a cheat sheet of
(41:33):
you know him five years and two where I want
to be right. So for you now, like what is important?
Because I know you're not saying throw the baby out
with the bath water, no, no, no, forgetting my achievements,
forget my career, not at all, But what's what's what's
the priority now. So what happened is all of my
(41:54):
climbing and all of my achieving and everything that I
was trying to build is I was trying to fill
an internal hole with external achievements, right, And it's impossible. Right.
You can't make enough money, you can't have enough sex,
(42:16):
you know, you can't um win enough championships that to
to fill a traumatic void inside yourself and my traumatic void.
So you're saying at internally, at one point you felt like, well,
should I made eight point five billion in movies? Like
(42:37):
I should? You're right? And that's so that's the carrot
on the stick that with there there is no end
to achieving. There's no end. It's an infinite there's an
infinite amount of money and beautiful women and yachts and right,
(42:58):
you know, So what I realize is that what I
was trying to to fill is at the end of
the day, I didn't like me right, So at the
end of the day I didn't feel good about me,
(43:20):
and I needed those things so I could feel good
about me, right, And all the way back to being
a little boy in chapter one is you know, watching
my father beat up my mother, and I didn't do
anything really got me. It really like it really damaged
(43:41):
something inside of me. You know the the opening line
of the book, you know that that I talked about.
I've always felt like a coward, right, And people would look, what, dude,
you did this, and you did that, and you did
this and all that, and none of the external stuff
fixes your internal impression of yourself. Right, initial wound, that
(44:07):
initial wound. Right, So the journey for me came down to, well,
if I don't have all of those things, like who
am I? If people don't clap with my movie, if
people don't cheer when I walk in? What if people
booed when I walked in? Would that would that change
(44:28):
who I am? Right? And I realized that I had
given away my self esteem is supposed to be self esteem,
but I had given away my self esteem to achievements
and to what my woman feels about me, to how
other people view me and what they say about me.
(44:51):
And I had trapped myself in trying to uphold an
image of who I was rather than being who who
I really was. I wasn't comfortable being who I really
was because I felt like the world would punish me
for that. You end up acting in real life, just pretending.
(45:14):
You're just pretending all the time, right, So one of
the things for me, every time I've walked out on
the Tonight Show and I hear y'all plan, invariably I
have a little bit of a little boy insecurity because
the roots are the real Philly group. No, don't say
(45:43):
this will because literally, no, no, no, no, no, this
is what I have to say, literally when I'm in
any situation that's fearful. Lately it's been giving speeches. I
hate giving speeches, and the moment, the thing that I
think about, you're literally the most confident curtain walker of
(46:07):
the Tonight Show that like, literally when you like, I
know this, I know who looks down. There are people
that run to the couch because they're so insecure that
people look down. Like you're the first person I know
that takes a second to walk out. You come out
like you know, like you're you're you're in Rome and
(46:28):
the Colosseum like you're ready to So literally, when I
get to my small space before before I give any
speech whatsoever, I think I literally have to vicariously do
a what woolf Smith. So please don't even tell me
then some time, every time I've ever walked out on
(46:54):
that show, and I hear y'all playing, I cannot do
anything but get myself together other to try to look
cool for the Roots. So you're psyching yourself up, do you? Literally?
We're literally yeah, you're always in your poker face, right,
(47:15):
So I'm looking at you. I'm looking at you trying
to get the like, and you know, you give me
the nod and you're right there, and I was like,
it's the poker face. He's doing the poker face. I
can't put that one. The worst one of all was
remember the one where I did like the five entrances. Yes,
that's my favorite of all time. All I could think was,
you thought I was the corney ist motherfucker that has
(47:36):
ever walked out on the show. This is so funny
because in my mind, in my mind, I literally right.
So just just a recap for everyone. There was a
period after if you remember the Michelle Bachman incident, Yes, uh,
(47:56):
we're suddenly they understand that, oh the Roots customer walk
ons for people. Suddenly people wanted to do these epic
as walk ons, like literally Will Smith and Steve Martin
all their walk ons are very epic. Now that's funny
because I felt unworthy. Like when you walk out, I
(48:17):
felt like a man. We're just the millions from West Pilly.
That isn't real quick because well, how does it feel
you just kind of started this wave, I mean outside
of Philadelphia International Gamma, huh, but this huge wave of
like Philly talent? What does it look like? Fast forward?
To not just see the roots, right, but to see
(48:38):
Kevin Hart like Billy is like killing it. What does
it feel like to be like the kind of daddy
all of this? You know? And it's so funny because
like and and this is this is why working on
your mind is the only work to do. Right. We
need to talk more right. Right? For me, I perceived
(49:03):
myself as an outcast from that group. Right that he
was to me, but hey, I hey, I was the
real Philly dude. But he wasn't from Philly. It wasn't Fulfilly,
but he was holding it down that a repping for Philly.
(49:23):
A mirror is the look of repping fulfilling. But you
to look making it from Philly? Right, Yeah, but you
know what, but I will say this, I will integect
as a non Philly person as an outside perspective to
give you a little context on that. Will, I think
for you, you just became to like you just became
to embody like so much other things, Like you became
(49:46):
bigger than Philly. You became bigger than you know what
I'm saying in the United States, Like you just became
Will Smith. It was not though, this is Will from Philly.
It's just no, this is Will Smith. So I think
and maybe from the standpoint of you know, maybe you
may not didn't see that you were getting that love.
And so it's like like you said the cool factor
quote unquote that a mirror might have had or a
(50:09):
I might have had. I just think you were just
in a whole another stratosphere and people funk with you.
I mean we all because even now, like when I
have conversations about your career and stuff, I'm like, bro
Independence Day and all that ship aside. He's the DJ,
I'm the rapper that is a classic kill pop album
like this is Bigger Guy, a legit classic under his belt,
(50:29):
like don't get it sucked up? And I always wonder
did you ever feel that you weren't respected as an MC?
You know what I'm saying once you went so crazy
and movies and your career he took off. Wait, let
me add on to that and let you answer. Will
I just want to let you know that I was
one of those listeners you and Jeff had went to
(50:50):
d A S the night that He's the DJ and
I'm the rapper came out and you had a battle
with Steady B Man. Listen, Tarik, and I heard that
munchi chee line. I don't know this free style whatever,
but like that's the first time I heard someone like
(51:12):
play the Dozens and Ryan at the same time. Yeah,
and he called st B like you big munchy cheet
and that that moment was the first bonding that Tarik
and I ever had, Like we called each other like
did you hear that he called him a munchy cheek
like and it was it was all over school the
(51:33):
next day like after then was almost like you could
do no wrong, like so there was never a thing
like oh that boy corny whatever, Like literally that battle.
I wish I had that on tape. But answer the
question because I want to know, yes, yeah, yeah, do
you feel you get those respects? That respect as an
MC more now, than during during that time, I feel
(51:56):
like when people look back with with a little bit
of history, Yeah, that was kind of that was kind
of interesting. Yeah, he wouldn't have bad. What it was
is Jeff and Ready Rock would body anybody. So that's
really so I was in between Jeff and Ready Rock,
so uh, I felt supported in that way, like nobody
(52:20):
could beat Jeff right and what Ready Rock was doing
was just you know, he was one of one right
in in in terms of BeBox, so there was like
nobody really even to to battle him. So I always
felt like as a crew we would win, Like if
people wanted to go head up, I felt like as
(52:41):
a crew we would win. But I never felt like
because the acting came in so quick, I felt like
I never developed the level of um rhyme skill that
I felt like I could if I had had stayed
in it. Just stay in it, you know, and it's
(53:01):
like and then then I got scared, so I was
trying to make hit records instead of making what I
was feeling, right, So I got I got twisted in
there in a way that that jammed me up. But
Charlie said that nobody was there, not even trying to
battle you on the streets because you was killing it
so hard. And then not to mention the battling lyrically.
But then when he came to this, the cuffs you
(53:23):
wasn't a game neither. No, that was unless I had to.
I had to learn how to fight quick, so you
know that was That was the one thing that was
always a surprise to people. It's like I had so
much you know, anger and resentment build up. I would
suck up punch somebody quick, right, So I like, I
(53:45):
was like, just fight me, then fight me then, right.
I don't think they know they have no idea. Can
I ask a random Westbrook question? Please? Because I know
we can't type with time, But you got a couple
(54:06):
of my favorite shows that's either coming on the on
right now. I wanted to throw it out real quick. God,
I forgot about Will Smith the business this. I'm trying
to get the most random of randoms, which is Cobra Kai. Hey, listen,
let me tell you something. Let me tell you something, bro, Hey,
let me tell you something. Man, Look Cobra Kai even
(54:27):
without them to stop, man, listen, listen the whole boy.
When he went to that draw and he pulled out
that goddamn top his pony and listen when when Homer
pulling that scrunching out when he put out the hare time,
I said, boy, and let's go. Let's go. Terry Silver
is bad me and my wife. No, I'm not giving
those promise. I mean he's in the trailer like no.
(54:49):
Season was the best one. Caleb Caleb pain At my
brother in law. Yeah. So Caleb Caleb is uh. You
know I trained him for about five years and he
started his own company. He's producing. So he brought in
uh Cobra Kai to the to the family. So yeah,
(55:10):
that he's uh. They just got nominated. They got nominated
for uh sag Awars uh last night Coper guys nominated
and eight these Babies Dreams Come True. Oh my god. Yeah, man,
that show is great. I love that show because Caleb
brought it in. I was like, Cobra Kai the Karate Kid, right,
(55:31):
because you know, we had done the Karate Kid with Jaden.
We were already working with the I P. I was wondering,
are we gonna get in future seasons of Cobra could
we get we need? I mean, that's a great idea,
that's a good question, that's a really cool, right, they're
(55:58):
going to really world Earth. Welcome to Earth, Welcome to Okay,
So From to Earth just finished all the episodes Brother
Brother Brother. First of all, can you break down to
the world how National Geographic makes that ship look like that? Yes?
I know you had to be in all. Me and
my boyfriend were like, what in the go pro do
(56:19):
they do? How it looks gorgeous? You know, there's a
company called Neutopia that that Westbrook we partnered with, and
you know it's just not GEO knows how to do it.
It's like, you know, they're they're getting us into some
really uh beautiful places, some places that are untapped. It
(56:43):
was like that the and they just know how to
shoot it. I don't even know what they're doing. And
you're honest, I love because we can see your fear.
So when you circle back on the fear episode, I
was like, thank you because I was gonna say that
they presented you something that you're like, I'm not ready
this season, like maybe next Yeah, there's one. There's one
(57:04):
that we pushed to next year. It was um a
trek to the South Pole and it takes nine days
and it's tense, tense all the way for nine days
to to the South Pole. And I don't want to
pick you up for having so many explorers of color. Yes, yes, exactly,
(57:25):
but and you know what, that's all I'm gonna shout
out that Geo and and new Topia. You know that
that is a part of their demand for the show.
They like, they are specifically mandating that the all of
the episodes be representative. So yeah, they are the truth
(57:47):
and then it's about to be crazy as as evidence
by even though you know the globes have been blacked out. Yeah. Uh,
are you ready with your acceptance speech for the Oscars? Hey, man,
(58:09):
you can't. You're not supposed to talk about that's kind
of stuff, now, I was, I was talking. I was
talking earlier about that. Uh. For another thing, we had
the Women of the Movement. Women of the Movement, we
have that. Yeah that Yeah, that's uh with jay Z
produced that. Yeah, so that that that's coming out too.
But I was just talking about the you know, the
(58:32):
idea of uh, I'm trying to be uh spiritually above
the desire to win awards. I get it, But I
told you, but I told you I predicted. Did I
believe that Beyonce is gonna win that night. M hmmm.
(58:53):
I believe that you're gonna win. Love it, and I
won't say no if they if they at, I won't
be like n. I believe it don't matter because the
people love you and that's what counts first. So there,
I love me, which is the new thing that I've
gotten to. It's like I feel good about me with
(59:13):
or without an Academy award. One thing I want to
ask you will um that I think it would be
helpful for a lot of people. Um, when you talk
about just your journey of just you know, growing and
you know kind of you know, learning to love yourself
and be happy and everything. You know, a lot of
people can look and say, we will that's easy. And
you made iron legend. I mean you know what I mean, right,
(59:36):
you know what I'm saying. You got a team, you
got therapist, you got chef. You gota counts that you
got all that. So to someone that's you know, not
in your position, UM, what would you say? It is
just that taking what is step one of wanting to
just be better and have a healthier relationship with yourself?
What is step one, regardless of money whatever, what's the
first step you can take. I think. I think the
(59:57):
first thing is to take an honest look at your
life and how much of it do you like? Right,
Just take a really good look at your life, right,
because it is a journey. You do have to make
a journey. And the journey is from you know, unpleasant
(01:00:20):
and unwanted circumstances to circumstances that you desire, right, and
all the learning that you will have to do will
be on your journey. Right. So the first thing is
to commit to transformation. Right. There's no easy road. There's
(01:00:46):
no easy road you're gonna have want the work is
still yours. The work is yours, and the work can
be done in any circumstance. There's like, you know, my
Grandma's used to say, God is everywhere, right, so you
can find it anywhere. You just have to commit to
(01:01:06):
transforming your life. First and foremost, you have to decide,
you know what I'm done, and I'm making a change.
And the first changes are always going to be really obvious, right,
the first changes of how you eat, or who you
associate with, or a job you're doing that makes your
(01:01:30):
fucking stomach hurt, right, you know what I mean. It's
like the first couple of changes are gonna be really
really obvious, and it's the courage to make the first
change right where people of that are in bad relationships,
you're you know, you're in a bad physical condition, you don't,
(01:01:53):
you're you're in a neighborhood, you don't like, you're, you're
you're doing things that you know are hurting yourself. And
it's like, just the first step. Just find that first
thing that you know, damn well does not need to
be in your life that you are babysitting the book.
Is there a book that you recommend there? Well, I
(01:02:15):
mean there's a there's a couple of things. It's really hard.
I mean, other than Will, I think Will is one
of the best books um on the market right now
for the trans relation of your life of everything. I
really let me just let our listeners know and for
all the like, I don't read it whatever, I no, no, no, no, no,
(01:02:35):
I'm gonna let you know what time it is. It's
weird enough. Having written six books myself, I didn't consider
myself a reader. However, when I started, you know, when
the pandemic started, I started doing my Morning Walks Christmas podcast. Man,
I've read I've read so many books audiobook style, which
is still reading like whatever for you snobs, like you
(01:02:57):
have to read it first in order to read a book. Now,
I believe the way that you should take in Will's book,
your first thing is I definitely believe that you should
listen to the audiobook because it's different when it's coming
from his voice, and not to mention he peppers the
soundtrack that makes it feel like it's a podcast or whatever,
like there's down effects, re enactments and him imitating Charlie
(01:03:20):
Mack and all that stuff. I feel, and it makes
it endearing, especially those last six chapters. So fante, I
would actually recommend you once you listen to that that
old you know. I think it's important that people really
taking this book and hear what what Will is saying.
(01:03:42):
And I don't think it's a hashtag like only rich
people stuff or whatever like it's it's literally having the
will to know you want to change, and especially where
we are now where a lot of us and what
I mean us hip hop Nation, a lot of these
cats are expiring in their fifty yeah, before they make sixty,
(01:04:04):
And I think a lot of that just has to
do with the will to not want to move on.
I think it's one thing. It's like when you get
past twenty, you're like, Okay, I didn't get shot, so
now I'm good. And then there's a point where we,
you know, try to not have a stroke or make
sure our health is right. Now. I'm realizing that sixty
(01:04:25):
on it's going to be a crazier battle for us
to have the will to to live in and all
those things. So I would actually recommend Will's audiobook first
um as a central reading. I was just gonna ask
the craziest question of all. I was just gonna say,
hold on, battle Fresh Prince and Jazzy Jeff in the verses, Well,
(01:04:49):
he said, who's going to Who's going to battle Fresh
Prince and Jazzy Jeff? And the verses it was a
job Who's battle Jazz Jeff? I was like, battles. I
was that's having that conversation with somebody the other day
and somebody was like, you know, y'all, y'all should go
with l. L was like l L YEA, all right,
(01:05:12):
I'm not gonna have me getting bodied by L's. You
know you know what I actually think, you know what
I think your match would be I would I would
think that Jazzy Jeff in the Fresh Prince versus Naughty
by Nature be a good person. Okay, okay, okay, that
might be fun. I'm not mad. I think I think
(01:05:35):
evenly matched. Yeah, yeah, it's like I think that would
be Got like twenty albums like that boy Got Hello
and Buster I think are more of a match. I
don't care if they feel that they're outclassed each other,
but I feel like LLL and Buster almost Yeah, yeah, yeah,
I was glad as you will. So do you ever
get a point in terms of when you talk about
(01:05:56):
like always striving and striving and climbing and like build
in your team and keeping them like always want to elevate,
do you ever get to a point where you just realize,
you know what, I'm good? Like, does I'm good? Ever
happened in the mind of Will Smith. I've looked at
the first half of my life. I think about it
in terms of, uh, climbing and collecting, and now the
(01:06:22):
second half of my life is going to be given away, right,
It's gonna be giving it back, right. So it was,
you know, all of the things that that I gathered
through the you know, striving and climbing, and now my
attention is on developing my heart and developing my mind
(01:06:48):
through giving and relating. Right. So part of the discovery
for me is my true happiness was never going to
be achieved through collecting, and I'm realizing that the deepest
joy that I experiencing is through giving, right, And it
(01:07:09):
was like, that's the real magic of love is giving,
And it's in helping, It's in using what you are
to assist someone else to become what they were meant
to become. Right. Do you think that's Do you think
(01:07:30):
that's what's kept you and Jada together for so long?
Is that that sounds like a foundational part of y'all? Yeah, yeah,
we are. We are full on climbers and seekers. We
are developing our comprehension of what love is. And like
(01:07:51):
everybody wants love, but nobody knows what it actually is. Right,
So you want something but you don't you don't know
what it is, right, And it's like the Marines always
there's a marine quote. Everybody wants to go to heaven,
but nobody want to die, right, And it's like there's
a there's a certain amount of self reconstruction that has
(01:08:17):
to happen in order to have any possibility at love.
Your life has to be focused on transforming and correcting
the false beliefs, the flawed perceptions, the poisonous ideas in
(01:08:38):
your mind. Your entire life has to be centered on
removing those things in order that you can hold the
love that you're asking for from someone else. Smith, It's
(01:09:00):
not as big, man, Yeah, that's big. That's like literally
I thought, like, you know, okay, Jimmy Jams episode was
six hours, so but we'll literally drop so much potent
magic in this interview. And I really want to thank
(01:09:23):
you for um giving us, uh letting us be the artiens,
not even giving us this artience. Man, seriously, man, and
thank you too. I mean I can't I have no
idea what it would be like to have spent you know,
the last thirty five years of my life is one
of the most famous people on the planet, you know
(01:09:43):
what I mean. So, you know, just for you, we
appreciate you just sharing, just being so transparent about your journey,
and you know, you and Jada's like like everything, Like
y'all have been through ship that would have broke a
whole bunch of other people. But I understand that y'all
live incredible lives, and um, just for you to be
so transparent about this man, it's really inspiring. And we
(01:10:03):
just thank you just for everything, Bro, for real and
for always coming back to Philly because doing those weekends
he hasn't but still when he was doing them, he
was always there, always cleaning up the neighborhoods. Thank you,
appreciate y'all, man, Thank you, Thank you well on behalf
of like Sugar Steve, I'm paying Bill and Fante and
(01:10:25):
myself well Smith, thank you very much. This is question
up Supreme. We will see you on the next ground.
Thank you. M quesch Love. Supreme is a production of
(01:10:56):
I Heart Radio. For more podcasts from my heart Radio,
visit the I heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever
you listen to your favorite shows.
Quest Love Supreme is a production of I Heart Radio, Man,
I better make the Central special, right, Okay, ladies and gentlemen.
Everybody's searching for a hero. People need someone to look
up to, and I'm only no actually to be frank,
(00:21):
our our guest is a true hero. There's literally no
human being on earth who has not heard of our guest.
Uh Like, seriously, you don't even need to hear my
voice anymore, but uh, just for form, now these six yests,
we can go hip hop legend, the first hip hop
Grammy winner. Uh, sitcom legend on one of the most
(00:44):
beloved important family shows in TV history, a golden Oh yeah,
that's new skipping. You didn't think that that was one
now I'm playing. Um No, but seriously, he like, let's
let's not take it lightly that um he has been
(01:04):
a premier action hero, one of the most highest paid actors.
I believe seventeen of his films that grows past at
least combined eight billion dollars, which is nothing to stop at.
You know, when I say this man has his own money,
I mean he has his own money. Um No, Seriously,
(01:24):
I swear to God, I'll put it this way. Steve
you remember my infamous rat story, the one I heard
thousand times? Y, I think I can remember it right,
So before before you came in the picture, I will say,
even his foot even the footnotes of his life become
other people's highlights. And I mean he invided me to
the Millennial back in December thirty one something. I'm sure
(01:48):
he doesn't remember that, Yes, exactly. Do you know how
many times I've told the story of Mary Tyler Moore
running over Liz Taylor's wilch air, or my Jordan or
my corns. That was my original rat story. Anyway, I can.
I can talk and talk, talk, talk about achievements until
(02:09):
the cows come home. But literally what hit home for
me personally was his his really brave, rigorous act of
complete honesty and vulnerability, which is a word you don't
often hear, especially in the black community. Um and his
book will amongst other things that he's achieved. This intro
(02:31):
is now ninety minutes long, and the show's over. Ladies
and gentlemen, please welcome Smith. Yes, you're you're like, wait,
have you set up lights in your apartment? Huh? Where
you set up flights? Right now here? So here's the thing.
Here's the thing. I took this interview seriously, right, No,
(02:56):
this is the cleanest zoom display I've ever seen in
my life. Like I'm very ashamed right now. Like I
was like, it's my man. You know, he asked me
to you know, to come on. It's Philly, it's all
of that. It's like I gotta make you know, I
don't know what he needs, what he wants to use,
Like I want to be I want to represent properly.
(03:17):
I want to audio. You could have been on the
couch anyway. So actually I want to start off and
I'm gonna go against format and just sort of make
this a free round for everyone on the show, all
of us here. Hello Team Supering by the way, anyway,
(03:39):
so I wanna know what did you do this morning?
Me or Team Supreme? So you I'm just curious what
your average warning is like nowadays. So I usually I
wake up about uh four am, So like four to
(04:01):
six is my private quiet time, like no phone, no nothing,
I think, I meditate, I read. It is like the
my favorite time of the day that there there's very
few days I'm not awake at four am, and four
(04:23):
to six is how I get just centered and clear
about what I'm gonna do in in the course of
a day. And uh, some days I'll go I'll go
back to sleep from six to seven thirty or something
like that and start my day. And uh, some days,
if I'm energized, I'll get on the treadmill at at
(04:46):
six and start my day. See, I already feel like
I'm doing this wrong. No, because Grace told me, like,
Grace's time is five am, and that's the one promise
that I sort of like backtracked on, you know, Yes,
we'll get up together and you know, and then I
(05:09):
went back to my normal ten m routine. But man, man,
you can't underestimate the power of watching the sunrise. There's
something that that energizes a human body about seeing the sunrise.
It like wakes you up with it. It's like you
get in sync with with like how the world is moving.
(05:32):
How long has that been a practice for you? Probably
about three years it started happening. I'm not a big sleeper.
I'm I rarely, if ever, sleep for you know, five
hours straight, you know, yeah, rarely rarely. You know. I'll
sleep for four hours, up for a couple of hours,
(05:55):
and then sleep for three hours, three more hours like,
but very rarely will I sleep that. I never sleep
eight right, I'll sleep a combination of four up for
a couple of hours and then back for four, but
never eight hours straight. Okay, So can I ask you now,
that's where that's where I have excelled in life. Do
(06:15):
you feel like you've slept eight hours or more? Do
you feel like you wasted the day? And I know
from reading your book, I know that for you, the
idea of hard work, performative hard work is like job one.
So letting the idea of that go, I'll give an example.
This Saturday, I've never gotten up at two in the afternoon.
(06:38):
I slept for fifteen hours. I've never I've never slept
for fifteen hours ever. And I don't even feel tired.
That's just oh my eyes. And I was like, wait,
it's still in the afternoon. What the fun? And she
let me sleep in fifteen hours? Like for you, is
sleeping eight hours? Like that's that's a wasted I could
have saved world in the last hour. I used to
(07:03):
I used to feel like that. It used to feel like,
you know, I didn't want to be sleep. I always
felt like I was yeah, but yeah, that that was
a Quincy Jones joint. You know, boy, you have enough
time to sleep when you did, you know, So, so
I prefer like I'll I take naps right, you know,
(07:25):
I'll lay down for for thirty minutes at lunch, you know,
and you know, get a get a third, and I
can I'll be refreshed the thirty thirty minute nap at lunch.
I'm like, really refreshed. But I don't like the feeling
of sleeping all the way through in that way. But
(07:46):
every couple of months, I'll definitely get one of those
fifteen hour jones. Like you know, if you do that
every couple of months, I'll get that full day where
you just shut it down and return that sleep debt.
But the the that that four to six practice is
a new thing. I wouldn't miss that for anything like
that up and the whole world belongs to me and
(08:07):
it's private and it's quiet. It's like that's when I
do my my best uh thinking. And you're still able
to do that while you're taking movies and stuff to
while you're shooting. Yeah, So usually with a movie, if
I if if I have an early call, it works
perfectly because I'm up a couple of hours before anyway,
and I'll just continue my day. And usually on those
kind of days, I'll sleep at lunch, I take a
(08:29):
I take a nap at least. What does meditation look
like to you? Because we talk about meditation a lot
on this show. Um, the big thing for me with
meditation is no pressure. I don't pressure myself too, uh
do anything but just watch my mind to just be
aware of all of the things that are coming up
(08:51):
to just notice. Damn. I hate meditating today, right, and
I just I kind of take the time to just
notice what's going on with my mind. I don't wrestle
with it. I let it. I let it do what
it do. Baby, do you do trans meditation? No, I don't.
I don't go that far like I. You know I
have you know, you read the book, so you know
(09:14):
I've done ayahuasca and things like that. Which is you
know it's a form that you know for me, that's
a form of meditation. I didn't read it. What can
you just tell me? A man, it don't spoil it,
you don't. I don't want you to spoil it. But
I'm so curious. I was gonna I was gonna tell
you will Um I am when I hit you the
(09:35):
last time, I was telling you that I was waiting
for this very specific I wanted my first ayahuasca journey
to be with this African couple that that does it.
And a funny thing happened to them, which is they
were now like, you know what's happening. This Will Smith
(09:57):
book has just come out and suddenly we're in the
in So now I gotta payote. Mushrooms are all family, right,
So i ahuasca is really really different. So you know
the the the the scene in Black Panther, right, yeah,
(10:22):
ancestral plane, right, so that's the African that's taken from
the African version of ayahuasca, uh Eboga. Right. So it
is as vivid as they depicted in the movie. You
you like, actually go meet see talk to people, you
come back right like that's the movie is not an
(10:43):
exaggeration of what the experience it is. Wow? Right? Um.
The only the only thing that was was uh potentially
a little bit of of an exaggeration is the directing
of the experience. The the it takes you where it
wants to take you. You don't get to like pick
(11:04):
maybe at higher levels people can pick, right, but yeah,
I never got to pick. I got dragged right, So
what did you drag you into? Who did you get
to talk to? Did you talk to any people from
your past or whatever? My father came to me, you know,
So that's what I was saying. So I had that
that experience my father, Uh, he came to me and
(11:25):
showed me where he was living. You know, I will
say to you like that sort of on that path.
I think the lightest version of it is, well, their
sounds journeys you can take um for some people step
up from that is sound journeys with mushrooms. Some people
(11:49):
do Iowaska Mike Tyson talks about, uh doing toad, which
is even more Yeah, yeah, extreme, But basically it's almost
like you should really be open for me at least
and trying to heal like a lot of the childhood trauma.
(12:09):
First of all. I mean there's literally no human alive,
especially black human that has not dealt with trauma, real trauma,
and for I think for a lot of us, um,
we sort of normalized the trauma, Like I normalized like, well, yeah,
that's supposed to be jass until you know that I'm
(12:30):
a good person. Now does my dad be my ass
um And it's only it's really only until like maybe
a year and a half ago, where I just had
to settled that yes, even though my dad loved me,
that that was the highest form, the highest form of abuse,
and really like damnit. So I mean as a right,
(12:53):
but that's the thing, like, as black people, a lot
of what we hold on to for how we were reared,
it comes from slavery and that's sort of the one
aspect that we can't let go, which for me, at
least in in reading Will's book, the reason why I say,
like the vulnerability and the honesty, it's really unpreced in it,
(13:16):
especially like I really want black people and I know
like people are you know, attracted to the fact that,
like you know, everything that's happened in the last year
or so, and Will is life that if they're coming
there for that, like that dirt or whatever, and it's
really not about that, it's about really coming to grips.
(13:36):
You guys, remember on past episodes where I told you
about the laughing song, right, George Johnson, h how it
just hit me that emotions were literally illegal for three years.
You couldn't laugh and if you you know the reason
why they invented the terminology, uh, barrels of laughs was
(14:00):
because slaves are built a barrel full of water. So
if you felt yourself about the laugh on the plantation,
instead of meeting the ire and the anger of the overseers,
you would dunk your head in the water to suppress
the sound. Same same for anger. Who are you sassin that?
Who are you getting smart with? You? Better not crying
(14:20):
if I give you something to cry about, like all
those things that we attribute to black parents, like all
that ship came from slavery, so we literally could not
show emotions it was illegal or else he faced lashes
and as a result, I think the defensive thing that
we invented, like the same way we invented soul food
out of the worst food ever, black people invented cool
(14:43):
who as a defensive mechanism like not showing, not showing emotions,
not being too affected, holding back, not not drawing, you
know what I mean? And as a result, it's really
damaged us. Like if you really think about the last
black person that I started really on display of this
(15:04):
vulnerability was the last thirty seconds, and she's out of
my life, like who would willing? Who's willing to be
that open about about their life? And so for me,
why why did you feel as though now is the time?
Because when I read this book, I was when I
was relieved because someone went before, you know, like given
(15:25):
the Three Stooges, where there they do the army thing
like who's the first volunteer and everyone steps backwards and leaves,
like seriously, like every one in my life's like, you know,
we can't wait to stop writing these bullshit as music
books and really no, not for real. It's like you know,
(15:46):
everybody were like, yo, no more music books, like tell
us some real shit about your life. And literally, when
Will's book came out, I felt like, okay, maybe it
is safe to cross the street a little bit without
getting run over. So why did you build like now
is the time to really share your story and to
(16:09):
be as honest and open about it? Yeah? I think, Um,
I'm sure you all have been watching me publicly for
the for the last uh dirty years. I mean, come on,
you know, I think first and foremost, I can feel
(16:32):
the wave coming right, So there's a there's a consciousness
shift that is happening right now, right, So, so a
couple of things are happening. More people are realizing that
there is no happiness to be derived from any material
(16:54):
conditions that you can put together. Right. People are starting
to realize, at no matter how great your job is,
no matter how great your family is, no matter no
matter how uh perfectly you cultivate your material conditions, they
(17:16):
are unsustainable. You you have a perfect marriage and family,
and then there's a storm and three people in your
family get killed when cod covid and shuts down and
shuts it down. Right, So people are realizing, at material
(17:39):
circumstances are unsustainable. Right. So if that's the case, if
it's the case that I can lose anything, how can
I possibly enjoy my time here? Right? And more people
are waking up slowly to that idea. And people are
(18:00):
starting to realize that you are the only problem you
have to solve, right, that your your mind and how
you are with this world is the answer. Right, How
to be with your circumstances is the answer, Not trying
(18:23):
to get your circumstances perfect. Right. Okay, So and this
is this is the first time I've been asked this
question this way. So I'm struggling to like to to
to to say it. Right. This is the first time
you've been asked this question in this way. So I'm
not like I've never been asked a question. The answer
I want to give, I'm I'm trying to form it
(18:44):
in my mind right now. Right. So, the the realization
that I that I had is, it doesn't matter so
much what happens to me. It doesn't matter what happens
in my life. It doesn't matter what happens with my family,
It doesn't matter what happens with my career, doesn't matter
(19:06):
what happens in my life as much as it matters
how I think about what happens to me and how
I manage myself in interacting what what happens to me. Right, So,
the answer that I realized is you can't create loving
(19:31):
interactions from unloving behavior. You can't. You can't. You can't.
You can't. You're trying to love and be loved. At
the deepest part of your being. You want to love
and be loved. You can not create it. If you're scared,
(19:57):
if you're angry, if you're resentful, if you're hungry and craving,
if you're holding any of those poisons in your heart.
You can't create what you want. You can only create
the opposite of what you want. Rights. So all of
that to say, I knew that if I was going
(20:20):
to be happy, I couldn't be scared of what people
were going to say. That I had to thoroughly and
comfortably be me just as I am, with no fox
given about what anybody thinks or means. So being so
(20:41):
to that point, in terms of being you and in
writing this book, how did you decide what to tell
and what not to tell? You know what I'm saying,
and not necessarily in terms of being having any shame
about any parts of your life, but just as an artist,
having that line of saying, listen, these are some parts
of myself that I choose to keep to myself. And
(21:02):
I have the right to own myself, you know, so
as to not let these things define me. You know,
how do you decide what was take me through the
process of deciding how you wanted to tell your story?
So the the the only thing I was prepared and
still am prepared to say anything and everything that's true
for me, because I only get stronger by being vulnerable.
(21:26):
I used to think I got weaker by being vulnerable.
I only get stronger by being comfortable to share who
and what I am freely. On the line that I
drew is I didn't want my words to be weaponized
against people I love, right, So I wanted to tell
(21:49):
my story. And the difficulty I was having was telling
my story without telling Jada's story, right to you know,
to tell yeah, without you know, telling Alfonso's story, or
we're telling Jeff's story, you know. So what I did
(22:11):
is when I finished the book, I had what I
was calling a writer's camp, and for two weeks I
called everybody that I mentioned in the book down to Miami,
and I read every word of the book to all
of the people in the book so they would know
what I was saying about them. And then I let
them respond and made adjustments and and things like that. Everybody. Yeah,
(22:37):
though it was it was a FORU well there there
there were a couple of people who declined um. Declined um.
But it was the first time my mother and I
had ever talked about my father being abusive. We literally
(22:58):
I was I was fifty two years old at the time,
and my mother and I literally never talked about the
fact that my father beat her up and her hearing
me read the chapter was the first time that the
conversation came up between us, and you know, it was
(23:19):
it was gut wrenching, but it was deeply purifying. And
you know, when I was talking about that idea of
blocks to love, it's like the fact that my mother
and I couldn't talk about that there was a barrier
between us, right, and we loved each other, but we
(23:40):
weren't really connecting in honesty and authenticity, right, So there's
always a little bit of a facade because we both
know we're just not going to talk about it. So
it just creates a little bit of a barrier. And
neither one of us wants that. We want to love
each other wide open and vulnerably, you know. So from me,
it was cleaning out all of the barriers and the
(24:03):
blocks that I had to loving the people in my life,
you know. And it's and it's those traumas make us
close our hearts. You know, the worst crime you can
commit against another human being is to assassinate them in
your heart. And you know, one once your heart is
(24:26):
closed to somebody, as nice as you think you're being,
as cordial as you pretend to be, all all I said,
was yeah, right, but you said it with a closed heart,
which the person understands clearly that you don't give a
funk about them, right, And it's like you can't hide it. Right,
(24:51):
it's because you're not you're you're you're not showing that
you're open to seeing them in a different way. Right.
You'll be surprised how much your heart is closed to
people you say you love, right, And it's like they
know it and they can feel it, and sometimes we
can't feel it. We think if we treat someone nicely
(25:13):
and respectfully that we're being loving, But if your heart
is closed to him, it's not. Behind every word is
I really don't give a fuck. And they hear right,
They hear it no matter what you try to say,
and no matter how much you try to cover it up.
(25:35):
All Right, So let me ask you something because I'm
this is the one. This is probabbly my major downfall
and the journey I'm in right now, Like I'm literally
I'm in amazed with my eyes with blinders on. And
if I could just figure out this one thing, I
(25:58):
think the world opened. But when I tell you, I
literally now there's there's a book I just discovered like
maybe last week called um I think it's called the
Big Step where the author speaks of how we uh
set limitations for ourselves and for me though, I am
(26:21):
trying to figure out and the problem is I'm trying
to figure out how to open my heart. Um. And
this is stuff I kind of shared on the show before.
But you know, like when you when you live, I
feel like when you live in fight or flight mode mhm,
that you can either go with your brain or your heart.
And I found that it was way safer for me
(26:43):
to go with my brain. Right. I gotta be the
smartest guy. I gotta be the most achieving guy. I
gotta be the provider. I gotta be, you know, the
hero that everyone And I'm currently in a situation now
where I'm hitting a brick wall because I'm almost like
the tin man, like I technically don't know the first
(27:08):
steps and how to open my heart. So the fundamental
premises flawed. The fundamental premise that you're safer using your
head is wrong. That's not true, right, So you can
you can only make an intellectual mess with that fundamental premise. Right. So,
(27:34):
going all the way back to the beginning, the belief
system that has to grow is that the only safety
is in you're well wishing and the authentic care and
concern for whoever is in front of you. You see
(27:57):
a samurai kill somebody and then pray over the body
the samurai, it's not like, you know, fuck him. You
know that motherfucker shouldn't have been tripping, right. It's like
the samurai is prepared to kill. You know that that's
what they do. But they spend half their lives learning,
(28:20):
you know, the techniques of kill for the purpose of
defending people, and then they spend the second half of
their life learning how to not have to. You absolutely
positively want to be able to defend people, and you
want to be able to build, and you want to
be able to create, and you want to do all
of that. If you're doing it with your heart clothes,
(28:42):
if you're doing it where you don't give a fuck
about people, it can't go well. And you and you
can have all the money and you can do all
of that. People are your greatest resources. It's like peoples.
When people know that you care, right, they give you
(29:04):
so much room to make mistakes and stuff like that,
and your only responsibility is for people to be able
to see in your eyes that you legitimately care and
you might have to make hard decisions, you know, as
somebody's mind might be so defiled that they can't respond
(29:25):
well and you got to go Samurai, right, but you
don't do it joyfully. You hate that you had to,
you know, cut that instead off right, you know what
I mean? All right, So let me let me ask
you a question because for me, like I put myself
(29:45):
in almost every situation that you spoke about in the book,
but there's one particular situation that I felt that you
handled with ease that I otherwise I wouldn't have handled
now only starting maybe three year yars ago, really not
even three years ago, like two years ago, I finally
decided to do something on my own without you know,
(30:09):
the collaborative narrative that I do. You know, everything I've done,
it's been the collaborative with everything. And so I'm thinking
that if I'm getting a phone call in Detroit and
it's Quincy Jones telling me to come out to his
birthday party, and you're asked to audition in front of
(30:30):
all those people at his birthday party, and he happens
to have your current lawyer still with you now, I
believe like too, you know, draw up the papers and
make this show happen. I would have instantly not only
thought of millions of reasons to say no, chances are
(30:53):
I'm like, thank you very much, but you know, you
know I have something. I I'm going back to Detroit
to go back to my group and stay with my group.
And I wouldn't have even gotten the freshman's of bel
air because I would have instantly, out of obligation, chosen
that first step in my career, which is just the group.
(31:14):
And so how did and you, I don't know if
you just glossed over or whatever, but did you realize
that that was the first paradigm shift that your life
is not going to be the same. Like once you
stepped on that airplane and went back to Detroit, how
do you explain to Jeff and you know, how do
(31:40):
you explain to these people that you made it a
life changing decision? And of course it's twenty four hours. Well,
we were, we were we were in a really desperate
financial situation, right, so like we we were, you know,
we had gone from Grammy Winners back to one hotel room.
(32:01):
By the way, I hate how, I really hate how
you sort of separate yourself from and in this Corner,
which my favorite record, I'm sorry, yeahorite that's crazy? Yeah,
that that one. That one hurt bad. I don't know,
I'm not driving you like I feel like and then
(32:23):
she beat me. It was like, that's one of my
favorite Halloween songs ever. But I like and Jeff was
on the beat box I did anyway, there was there
was one. There was one or two one. Unfortunately the
public did not concur. But it worked out for you
(32:44):
because if Quincy and Benny don't see that performance of
Mike Tyson on our Sina's Yeah yeah, yeah, So that
album still holds heavy for you because that's the moment
that changed you know. Yeah. But I looked back at it,
I can see I can see the value. Uh, definitely
when I when I look back. But to the first
(33:05):
question about so, for me, I've never been the kind
of person that felt like I had to stay with
my friends to be loyal. I felt like my loyalty
was to their growth and expansion. My loyalty was y'all
got to keep up original Lebron. You're right, yeah, you
(33:29):
know it's like no, no, No, it's like, yeah, when
what what was Robin Harris had a joke, what was it?
What was it? You're talking about robbing? Robbing? When you
get your famous, you're gonna change, you got damn right.
I'm going right, ain't gonna have no change change. But
(33:54):
the the idea, the idea is for for me, it's like,
we gotta climb. Not note none of us loved our childhoods,
none of us loved what our current situations were at
the time. Then if that's the case, we gotta climb.
We gotta grind right. And it was always painful for
(34:15):
me when somebody couldn't keep up, but I would much
rather keep going and send them some help then slow
down and let them pull us all down right, right.
So I've always felt like a responsibility to my to
my squad. But we gotta we gotta go right, we
(34:38):
gotta climb right. And for me at that time, that
that meant no drugs. Everybody gotta train. If you if
you want to do something different, you can, you just
can't do it here because like we are a crew
of dreamers and we want to see how close to
the sun we can get, you know. So, and and
(34:58):
that mentality, you know. You know, Charlie Mack, it was
so good to see you. Charlie and Jeff had at
I G conversation mid Covid is funny. I wasn't about
to say this, but I kind of did. Called Charlie
and get some some cheating things before we did this conversation.
But I wanted you to speak on that friendship between
y'all three men, because really that was kind of like
the the greatest way to see the three of you.
(35:20):
I don't think it was no other interview, no big
you know networks. Y'all three just busted Charlie Mack first
out the limouse people. You know, we we talked about that,
um and the I G live and I talked about
it a little bit in the book. It's like Charlie
is a dreamer. Charlie is a big giant dreamer. Thank
(35:44):
God for it. Right, you know, Um, Jeff is a
little more cocoon, right, Like Jeff wants his his spot
and if everybody agrees to go, Jeff is gonna go, right.
But Jeff climbs in another way. Jeff climbs with talent.
(36:04):
He spends you know, sixteen hours a day behind his
his turntable, so his his climbing was in a different way.
And you know j L who's as my manager, is
like one of the most well read people that I've
ever met. We gravitated to each other, you know, growing
(36:27):
up in in Philly, and it was like we were
doing the stuff that that that everybody else was doing,
and we was getting into trouble to everybody else was
getting into. But we all kind of had our eyes
on a different a different future for ourselves. We all
knew we were doing more than this. And you know,
(36:49):
your your friends are critical. It's like one bad friend
can blow your whole ship in one night. One time
you gave a speech. I never will forget this. Um.
Shout outs to your baby sister Alan, who's a great woman.
I came to a party you threw for when the
Beckups came to l A for the first time, and
(37:10):
you gave a speech about friendship and why it's so
important to be meticulous about friends. Can you just people
need to hear that at four a second, cause it
ain't just the rich and the famous, it's everybody. It's
it is. You know, there's a couple of quotes I've
heard around that and it's uh, it's attributed to Confucius.
(37:30):
He says, it looks look at the five people you
spend the most time with, and that's who you are.
That's who you are who you are, right, And you know,
I heard that. I was probably eighteen the first time
I heard that, and I was like, oh, it was like, okay,
(37:50):
well if that's it. If that's the case, then I
want this one, two, three, you know. But it's like,
who who your friends are is is you know, one
of the most critical decisions, you know, especially as a teenager,
that's one of the most critical decisions that you can make.
If the five friends that you associate with are straight
(38:14):
A students, you're probably gonna learn how to be a
straight A student. If the five friends you associate with
carry guns and sell drugs, you're probably gonna end up
carrying a gun and selling drugs. Right. So it's like,
you know, human beings are creatures of a example, and
(38:36):
we fall into those lines of who we're with, who
you laid down with, who you're who you share at
bed with is probably the most important decision life ever make,
(38:57):
you know what I mean? Right, So it's like choosing
your friends and your closest associates is how you fertilize
your dreams. Right, you can't have a life that's better
than your associations, Like it's it's impossible. Your life is
(39:20):
a team effort, right, so you can't have a better
life than your team. I gotta admit when when I
finished the book, that part of me felt not quasi deflated,
but the fact that I made a decision. I made
(39:43):
a decision like maybe two years ago, that Okay, I'm
really going to concentrate and get my thing together. I'm
a direct this movie, and I'm gonna go higher and
higher and achieve and achieve and earned and achieve and achieve.
And then you know, you told the the last six chapters.
(40:04):
You know, it's a doozy of the book again those
spoiler words, but you know, something happens in September two
thousand eleven that sort of changes the whole trajectory of
your life and whatnot. And when I read, when I
read that you had to take, you know, like you
had to take in a total assessment of everything that
you were. And it wasn't about how much you made
(40:25):
and how much you know, how many records you broke
or whatnot, and you kind of had to start all
over again, Like what, I know that that level of
achievement and that level of fame can be somewhat addicting.
So now in ten years after the fact that you
(40:46):
had that, there there's a story you tell about Jada's
forty birthday party and which I kind of feel that's
that's your paradigm shift to lead you to where you
are right now. Well, for starters, it's almost what are
your life goals right now? Because else well more than that,
(41:10):
I think he discovered that none of that matters. And
to me, I actually felt like, oh ship, wait a minute,
like I'm trying to win this Oscar so I could
do more movies and get more power and get more
power and get more money and get more power. And
then I realized, oh man, that's not gonna make me happy,
because this book is basically like a cheat sheet of
(41:33):
you know him five years and two where I want
to be right. So for you now, like what is important?
Because I know you're not saying throw the baby out
with the bath water, no, no, no, forgetting my achievements,
forget my career, not at all, But what's what's what's
the priority now. So what happened is all of my
(41:54):
climbing and all of my achieving and everything that I
was trying to build is I was trying to fill
an internal hole with external achievements, right, And it's impossible. Right.
You can't make enough money, you can't have enough sex,
(42:16):
you know, you can't um win enough championships that to
to fill a traumatic void inside yourself and my traumatic void.
So you're saying at internally, at one point you felt like, well,
should I made eight point five billion in movies? Like
(42:37):
I should? You're right? And that's so that's the carrot
on the stick that with there there is no end
to achieving. There's no end. It's an infinite there's an
infinite amount of money and beautiful women and yachts and right,
(42:58):
you know, So what I realize is that what I
was trying to to fill is at the end of
the day, I didn't like me right, So at the
end of the day I didn't feel good about me,
(43:20):
and I needed those things so I could feel good
about me, right, And all the way back to being
a little boy in chapter one is you know, watching
my father beat up my mother, and I didn't do
anything really got me. It really like it really damaged
(43:41):
something inside of me. You know the the opening line
of the book, you know that that I talked about.
I've always felt like a coward, right, And people would look, what, dude,
you did this, and you did that, and you did
this and all that, and none of the external stuff
fixes your internal impression of yourself. Right, initial wound, that
(44:07):
initial wound. Right, So the journey for me came down to, well,
if I don't have all of those things, like who
am I? If people don't clap with my movie, if
people don't cheer when I walk in? What if people
booed when I walked in? Would that would that change
(44:28):
who I am? Right? And I realized that I had
given away my self esteem is supposed to be self esteem,
but I had given away my self esteem to achievements
and to what my woman feels about me, to how
other people view me and what they say about me.
(44:51):
And I had trapped myself in trying to uphold an
image of who I was rather than being who who
I really was. I wasn't comfortable being who I really
was because I felt like the world would punish me
for that. You end up acting in real life, just pretending.
(45:14):
You're just pretending all the time, right, So one of
the things for me, every time I've walked out on
the Tonight Show and I hear y'all plan, invariably I
have a little bit of a little boy insecurity because
the roots are the real Philly group. No, don't say
(45:43):
this will because literally, no, no, no, no, no, this
is what I have to say, literally when I'm in
any situation that's fearful. Lately it's been giving speeches. I
hate giving speeches, and the moment, the thing that I
think about, you're literally the most confident curtain walker of
(46:07):
the Tonight Show that like, literally when you like, I
know this, I know who looks down. There are people
that run to the couch because they're so insecure that
people look down. Like you're the first person I know
that takes a second to walk out. You come out
like you know, like you're you're you're in Rome and
(46:28):
the Colosseum like you're ready to So literally, when I
get to my small space before before I give any
speech whatsoever, I think I literally have to vicariously do
a what woolf Smith. So please don't even tell me
then some time, every time I've ever walked out on
(46:54):
that show, and I hear y'all playing, I cannot do
anything but get myself together other to try to look
cool for the Roots. So you're psyching yourself up, do you? Literally?
We're literally yeah, you're always in your poker face, right,
(47:15):
So I'm looking at you. I'm looking at you trying
to get the like, and you know, you give me
the nod and you're right there, and I was like,
it's the poker face. He's doing the poker face. I
can't put that one. The worst one of all was
remember the one where I did like the five entrances. Yes,
that's my favorite of all time. All I could think was,
you thought I was the corney ist motherfucker that has
(47:36):
ever walked out on the show. This is so funny
because in my mind, in my mind, I literally right.
So just just a recap for everyone. There was a
period after if you remember the Michelle Bachman incident, Yes, uh,
(47:56):
we're suddenly they understand that, oh the Roots customer walk
ons for people. Suddenly people wanted to do these epic
as walk ons, like literally Will Smith and Steve Martin
all their walk ons are very epic. Now that's funny
because I felt unworthy. Like when you walk out, I
(48:17):
felt like a man. We're just the millions from West Pilly.
That isn't real quick because well, how does it feel
you just kind of started this wave, I mean outside
of Philadelphia International Gamma, huh, but this huge wave of
like Philly talent? What does it look like? Fast forward?
To not just see the roots, right, but to see
(48:38):
Kevin Hart like Billy is like killing it. What does
it feel like to be like the kind of daddy
all of this? You know? And it's so funny because
like and and this is this is why working on
your mind is the only work to do. Right. We
need to talk more right. Right? For me, I perceived
(49:03):
myself as an outcast from that group. Right that he
was to me, but hey, I hey, I was the
real Philly dude. But he wasn't from Philly. It wasn't Fulfilly,
but he was holding it down that a repping for Philly.
(49:23):
A mirror is the look of repping fulfilling. But you
to look making it from Philly? Right, Yeah, but you
know what, but I will say this, I will integect
as a non Philly person as an outside perspective to
give you a little context on that. Will, I think
for you, you just became to like you just became
to embody like so much other things, Like you became
(49:46):
bigger than Philly. You became bigger than you know what
I'm saying in the United States, Like you just became
Will Smith. It was not though, this is Will from Philly.
It's just no, this is Will Smith. So I think
and maybe from the standpoint of you know, maybe you
may not didn't see that you were getting that love.
And so it's like like you said the cool factor
quote unquote that a mirror might have had or a
(50:09):
I might have had. I just think you were just
in a whole another stratosphere and people funk with you.
I mean we all because even now, like when I
have conversations about your career and stuff, I'm like, bro
Independence Day and all that ship aside. He's the DJ,
I'm the rapper that is a classic kill pop album
like this is Bigger Guy, a legit classic under his belt,
(50:29):
like don't get it sucked up? And I always wonder
did you ever feel that you weren't respected as an MC?
You know what I'm saying once you went so crazy
and movies and your career he took off. Wait, let
me add on to that and let you answer. Will
I just want to let you know that I was
one of those listeners you and Jeff had went to
(50:50):
d A S the night that He's the DJ and
I'm the rapper came out and you had a battle
with Steady B Man. Listen, Tarik, and I heard that
munchi chee line. I don't know this free style whatever,
but like that's the first time I heard someone like
(51:12):
play the Dozens and Ryan at the same time. Yeah,
and he called st B like you big munchy cheet
and that that moment was the first bonding that Tarik
and I ever had, Like we called each other like
did you hear that he called him a munchy cheek
like and it was it was all over school the
(51:33):
next day like after then was almost like you could
do no wrong, like so there was never a thing
like oh that boy corny whatever, Like literally that battle.
I wish I had that on tape. But answer the
question because I want to know, yes, yeah, yeah, do
you feel you get those respects? That respect as an
MC more now, than during during that time, I feel
(51:56):
like when people look back with with a little bit
of history, Yeah, that was kind of that was kind
of interesting. Yeah, he wouldn't have bad. What it was
is Jeff and Ready Rock would body anybody. So that's
really so I was in between Jeff and Ready Rock,
so uh, I felt supported in that way, like nobody
(52:20):
could beat Jeff right and what Ready Rock was doing
was just you know, he was one of one right
in in in terms of BeBox, so there was like
nobody really even to to battle him. So I always
felt like as a crew we would win, Like if
people wanted to go head up, I felt like as
(52:41):
a crew we would win. But I never felt like
because the acting came in so quick, I felt like
I never developed the level of um rhyme skill that
I felt like I could if I had had stayed
in it. Just stay in it, you know, and it's
(53:01):
like and then then I got scared, so I was
trying to make hit records instead of making what I
was feeling, right, So I got I got twisted in
there in a way that that jammed me up. But
Charlie said that nobody was there, not even trying to
battle you on the streets because you was killing it
so hard. And then not to mention the battling lyrically.
But then when he came to this, the cuffs you
(53:23):
wasn't a game neither. No, that was unless I had to.
I had to learn how to fight quick, so you
know that was That was the one thing that was
always a surprise to people. It's like I had so
much you know, anger and resentment build up. I would
suck up punch somebody quick, right, So I like, I
(53:45):
was like, just fight me, then fight me then, right.
I don't think they know they have no idea. Can
I ask a random Westbrook question? Please? Because I know
we can't type with time, But you got a couple
(54:06):
of my favorite shows that's either coming on the on
right now. I wanted to throw it out real quick. God,
I forgot about Will Smith the business this. I'm trying
to get the most random of randoms, which is Cobra Kai. Hey, listen,
let me tell you something. Let me tell you something, bro, Hey,
let me tell you something. Man, Look Cobra Kai even
(54:27):
without them to stop, man, listen, listen the whole boy.
When he went to that draw and he pulled out
that goddamn top his pony and listen when when Homer
pulling that scrunching out when he put out the hare time,
I said, boy, and let's go. Let's go. Terry Silver
is bad me and my wife. No, I'm not giving
those promise. I mean he's in the trailer like no.
(54:49):
Season was the best one. Caleb Caleb pain At my
brother in law. Yeah. So Caleb Caleb is uh. You
know I trained him for about five years and he
started his own company. He's producing. So he brought in
uh Cobra Kai to the to the family. So yeah,
(55:10):
that he's uh. They just got nominated. They got nominated
for uh sag Awars uh last night Coper guys nominated
and eight these Babies Dreams Come True. Oh my god. Yeah, man,
that show is great. I love that show because Caleb
brought it in. I was like, Cobra Kai the Karate Kid, right,
(55:31):
because you know, we had done the Karate Kid with Jaden.
We were already working with the I P. I was wondering,
are we gonna get in future seasons of Cobra could
we get we need? I mean, that's a great idea,
that's a good question, that's a really cool, right, they're
(55:58):
going to really world Earth. Welcome to Earth, Welcome to Okay,
So From to Earth just finished all the episodes Brother
Brother Brother. First of all, can you break down to
the world how National Geographic makes that ship look like that? Yes?
I know you had to be in all. Me and
my boyfriend were like, what in the go pro do
(56:19):
they do? How it looks gorgeous? You know, there's a
company called Neutopia that that Westbrook we partnered with, and
you know it's just not GEO knows how to do it.
It's like, you know, they're they're getting us into some
really uh beautiful places, some places that are untapped. It
(56:43):
was like that the and they just know how to
shoot it. I don't even know what they're doing. And
you're honest, I love because we can see your fear.
So when you circle back on the fear episode, I
was like, thank you because I was gonna say that
they presented you something that you're like, I'm not ready
this season, like maybe next Yeah, there's one. There's one
(57:04):
that we pushed to next year. It was um a
trek to the South Pole and it takes nine days
and it's tense, tense all the way for nine days
to to the South Pole. And I don't want to
pick you up for having so many explorers of color. Yes, yes, exactly,
(57:25):
but and you know what, that's all I'm gonna shout
out that Geo and and new Topia. You know that
that is a part of their demand for the show.
They like, they are specifically mandating that the all of
the episodes be representative. So yeah, they are the truth
(57:47):
and then it's about to be crazy as as evidence
by even though you know the globes have been blacked out. Yeah. Uh,
are you ready with your acceptance speech for the Oscars? Hey, man,
(58:09):
you can't. You're not supposed to talk about that's kind
of stuff, now, I was, I was talking. I was
talking earlier about that. Uh. For another thing, we had
the Women of the Movement. Women of the Movement, we
have that. Yeah that Yeah, that's uh with jay Z
produced that. Yeah, so that that that's coming out too.
But I was just talking about the you know, the
(58:32):
idea of uh, I'm trying to be uh spiritually above
the desire to win awards. I get it, But I
told you, but I told you I predicted. Did I
believe that Beyonce is gonna win that night. M hmmm.
(58:53):
I believe that you're gonna win. Love it, and I
won't say no if they if they at, I won't
be like n. I believe it don't matter because the
people love you and that's what counts first. So there,
I love me, which is the new thing that I've
gotten to. It's like I feel good about me with
(59:13):
or without an Academy award. One thing I want to
ask you will um that I think it would be
helpful for a lot of people. Um, when you talk
about just your journey of just you know, growing and
you know kind of you know, learning to love yourself
and be happy and everything. You know, a lot of
people can look and say, we will that's easy. And
you made iron legend. I mean you know what I mean, right,
(59:36):
you know what I'm saying. You got a team, you
got therapist, you got chef. You gota counts that you
got all that. So to someone that's you know, not
in your position, UM, what would you say? It is
just that taking what is step one of wanting to
just be better and have a healthier relationship with yourself?
What is step one, regardless of money whatever, what's the
first step you can take. I think. I think the
(59:57):
first thing is to take an honest look at your
life and how much of it do you like? Right,
Just take a really good look at your life, right,
because it is a journey. You do have to make
a journey. And the journey is from you know, unpleasant
(01:00:20):
and unwanted circumstances to circumstances that you desire, right, and
all the learning that you will have to do will
be on your journey. Right. So the first thing is
to commit to transformation. Right. There's no easy road. There's
(01:00:46):
no easy road you're gonna have want the work is
still yours. The work is yours, and the work can
be done in any circumstance. There's like, you know, my
Grandma's used to say, God is everywhere, right, so you
can find it anywhere. You just have to commit to
(01:01:06):
transforming your life. First and foremost, you have to decide,
you know what I'm done, and I'm making a change.
And the first changes are always going to be really obvious, right,
the first changes of how you eat, or who you
associate with, or a job you're doing that makes your
(01:01:30):
fucking stomach hurt, right, you know what I mean. It's
like the first couple of changes are gonna be really
really obvious, and it's the courage to make the first
change right where people of that are in bad relationships,
you're you know, you're in a bad physical condition, you don't,
(01:01:53):
you're you're in a neighborhood, you don't like, you're, you're
you're doing things that you know are hurting yourself. And
it's like, just the first step. Just find that first
thing that you know, damn well does not need to
be in your life that you are babysitting the book.
Is there a book that you recommend there? Well, I
(01:02:15):
mean there's a there's a couple of things. It's really hard.
I mean, other than Will, I think Will is one
of the best books um on the market right now
for the trans relation of your life of everything. I
really let me just let our listeners know and for
all the like, I don't read it whatever, I no, no, no, no, no,
(01:02:35):
I'm gonna let you know what time it is. It's
weird enough. Having written six books myself, I didn't consider
myself a reader. However, when I started, you know, when
the pandemic started, I started doing my Morning Walks Christmas podcast. Man,
I've read I've read so many books audiobook style, which
is still reading like whatever for you snobs, like you
(01:02:57):
have to read it first in order to read a book. Now,
I believe the way that you should take in Will's book,
your first thing is I definitely believe that you should
listen to the audiobook because it's different when it's coming
from his voice, and not to mention he peppers the
soundtrack that makes it feel like it's a podcast or whatever,
like there's down effects, re enactments and him imitating Charlie
(01:03:20):
Mack and all that stuff. I feel, and it makes
it endearing, especially those last six chapters. So fante, I
would actually recommend you once you listen to that that
old you know. I think it's important that people really
taking this book and hear what what Will is saying.
(01:03:42):
And I don't think it's a hashtag like only rich
people stuff or whatever like it's it's literally having the
will to know you want to change, and especially where
we are now where a lot of us and what
I mean us hip hop Nation, a lot of these
cats are expiring in their fifty yeah, before they make sixty,
(01:04:04):
And I think a lot of that just has to
do with the will to not want to move on.
I think it's one thing. It's like when you get
past twenty, you're like, Okay, I didn't get shot, so
now I'm good. And then there's a point where we,
you know, try to not have a stroke or make
sure our health is right. Now. I'm realizing that sixty
(01:04:25):
on it's going to be a crazier battle for us
to have the will to to live in and all
those things. So I would actually recommend Will's audiobook first
um as a central reading. I was just gonna ask
the craziest question of all. I was just gonna say,
hold on, battle Fresh Prince and Jazzy Jeff in the verses, Well,
(01:04:49):
he said, who's going to Who's going to battle Fresh
Prince and Jazzy Jeff? And the verses it was a
job Who's battle Jazz Jeff? I was like, battles. I
was that's having that conversation with somebody the other day
and somebody was like, you know, y'all, y'all should go
with l. L was like l L YEA, all right,
(01:05:12):
I'm not gonna have me getting bodied by L's. You
know you know what I actually think, you know what
I think your match would be I would I would
think that Jazzy Jeff in the Fresh Prince versus Naughty
by Nature be a good person. Okay, okay, okay, that
might be fun. I'm not mad. I think I think
(01:05:35):
evenly matched. Yeah, yeah, it's like I think that would
be Got like twenty albums like that boy Got Hello
and Buster I think are more of a match. I
don't care if they feel that they're outclassed each other,
but I feel like LLL and Buster almost Yeah, yeah, yeah,
I was glad as you will. So do you ever
get a point in terms of when you talk about
(01:05:56):
like always striving and striving and climbing and like build
in your team and keeping them like always want to elevate,
do you ever get to a point where you just realize,
you know what, I'm good? Like, does I'm good? Ever
happened in the mind of Will Smith. I've looked at
the first half of my life. I think about it
in terms of, uh, climbing and collecting, and now the
(01:06:22):
second half of my life is going to be given away, right,
It's gonna be giving it back, right. So it was,
you know, all of the things that that I gathered
through the you know, striving and climbing, and now my
attention is on developing my heart and developing my mind
(01:06:48):
through giving and relating. Right. So part of the discovery
for me is my true happiness was never going to
be achieved through collecting, and I'm realizing that the deepest
joy that I experiencing is through giving, right, And it
(01:07:09):
was like, that's the real magic of love is giving,
And it's in helping, It's in using what you are
to assist someone else to become what they were meant
to become. Right. Do you think that's Do you think
(01:07:30):
that's what's kept you and Jada together for so long?
Is that that sounds like a foundational part of y'all? Yeah, yeah,
we are. We are full on climbers and seekers. We
are developing our comprehension of what love is. And like
(01:07:51):
everybody wants love, but nobody knows what it actually is. Right,
So you want something but you don't you don't know
what it is, right, And it's like the Marines always
there's a marine quote. Everybody wants to go to heaven,
but nobody want to die, right, And it's like there's
a there's a certain amount of self reconstruction that has
(01:08:17):
to happen in order to have any possibility at love.
Your life has to be focused on transforming and correcting
the false beliefs, the flawed perceptions, the poisonous ideas in
(01:08:38):
your mind. Your entire life has to be centered on
removing those things in order that you can hold the
love that you're asking for from someone else. Smith, It's
(01:09:00):
not as big, man, Yeah, that's big. That's like literally
I thought, like, you know, okay, Jimmy Jams episode was
six hours, so but we'll literally drop so much potent
magic in this interview. And I really want to thank
(01:09:23):
you for um giving us, uh letting us be the artiens,
not even giving us this artience. Man, seriously, man, and
thank you too. I mean I can't I have no
idea what it would be like to have spent you know,
the last thirty five years of my life is one
of the most famous people on the planet, you know
(01:09:43):
what I mean. So, you know, just for you, we
appreciate you just sharing, just being so transparent about your journey,
and you know, you and Jada's like like everything, Like
y'all have been through ship that would have broke a
whole bunch of other people. But I understand that y'all
live incredible lives, and um, just for you to be
so transparent about this man, it's really inspiring. And we
(01:10:03):
just thank you just for everything, Bro, for real and
for always coming back to Philly because doing those weekends
he hasn't but still when he was doing them, he
was always there, always cleaning up the neighborhoods. Thank you,
appreciate y'all, man, Thank you, Thank you well on behalf
of like Sugar Steve, I'm paying Bill and Fante and
(01:10:25):
myself well Smith, thank you very much. This is question
up Supreme. We will see you on the next ground.
Thank you. M quesch Love. Supreme is a production of
(01:10:56):
I Heart Radio. For more podcasts from my heart Radio,
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you listen to your favorite shows.
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Laiya St. Clair
Questlove
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