July 29, 2024 • 54 mins
She went from looking for love on The Bachelor and The Bachelorette to looking to score big on Season 32 of DWTS!
Charity Lawson gets emotional chatting with Cheryl about her time on the show and the social media bullying and threats she endured, thoughts on the judges' comments, her relationship with Artem, and why reality shows should consider having mental health experts on staff.
Plus, the celeb who was a 'ball of sunshine' on the show, conspiracy theories, and Charity answers fan questions!
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
This is Sex, Lies and spray Tands with Me Cheryl
Burke and iHeartRadio Podcast. Welcome back to your favorite dancing podcasts.
So I'm so excited about our next guest because she's
the first celebrity contestant that competed last season to do
the pod. So let's just get right into it. She
is someone who has captured the hearts of many through
(00:22):
her journey on both reality television and the dance floor.
She first came into the spotlight with being a part
of the Bachelor franchise and her graceful presence and genuine personality,
she quickly became a fan favorite. Her search for love
was one of the most heartfelt and memorable stories, leading
to a beautiful and inspiring outcome. Last season, she dazzled
(00:43):
us with her incredible performances on Dancing with the Stars,
showcasing her talent and dedication. Please join me in welcoming
the beautiful Charity Lawson to the show. Hi, welcome to
the podcast, Charity.
Speaker 2 (00:56):
Hello. Oh my goodness, fun we meet you.
Speaker 1 (01:00):
I know we did run into each other I think
at the variety event right.
Speaker 3 (01:04):
Yes, yes, it was very like brief and passing.
Speaker 2 (01:07):
There's a lot.
Speaker 1 (01:10):
And I was like so nervous. I get really nervous
speaking in general. I'm used to dance obviously, so I
was like freaking out. My manager was with me, know
like oh God, like where's the nearest exit. But I
am again so happy to meet you via zoom, even
if it has to be via zoom. And let's just
(01:30):
start out with you know, we talk a lot about
Dancing with the Stars obviously, but there's a lot that
I mean, I'm an advocate for mental health and I
know you're a therapist, which is I mean, I love therapist,
like I love my gravitate towards anyone that has studied
psychology or therapy or whatever anything to do with mental health.
(01:51):
What do you think people's biggest misconceptions are about you?
Speaker 2 (01:56):
Ah, it's crazy because I feel like, obviously, like now
I'm being in the public light. I never had to
worry about that or like even think about that. But
I think, like obviously, coming off of like two big
shows like Being Bachelorette and Dancing with the Stars, I
think people really, I feel like, don't obviously know me
and they just see like what they see on TV.
(02:16):
So probably the fact that I'm like more conceited or
like my confidence comes off as like I'm entitled, and
I think that's something that I've like really had to
work hard to get over because I know, like who
I am at my core, and obviously, like the people
that are in my life, my friends, my family, and
my fiancee, they like always describe me as probably being
(02:38):
like the most humbling, most compassionate person, and so like
when I have these two contrasting views of like the
people in my life know me one way, but then
the internet or the world preceivees me another way, it's
like a clashing.
Speaker 1 (02:51):
Yeah, I'm sure, how do you stay grounded and not
gaslight yourself?
Speaker 2 (02:55):
Yeah? No, I think it's just like obviously, before I
even step into the world of like reality, like I
took a lot of time before just like really getting
to know myself.
Speaker 3 (03:04):
So I was like in therapy and actively in therapy.
Speaker 2 (03:07):
But also it's just like I think just not being
intimidated by my own confidence and being really secure in myself.
I think I know that. So it's like people have
these opposing views of who they think I am, and
I'm like that could be like the furthest thing from
the truth. So I think knowing that in itself is
like it's easy for me to discard that and be
like that makes no sense because that's like literally not
(03:27):
even accurate about myself. But also, yeah, it takes a
lot of like just reflecting, journaling, Like I mean, even
there are some times where I'm like I read something
and then I'm like is that me? And then I
have to sit with myself. But like, it is a
lot of just reflecting and journaling.
Speaker 1 (03:41):
And yeah, do you think that if you were to
get into this industry prior to you studying psychology, would
that have been different?
Speaker 2 (03:50):
Oh? Yes, one percent. I'd say that all the time.
If I was asked to be bachelor, like even two
years before, yeah what I got, I don't know, it
just would.
Speaker 1 (04:01):
Have been another version.
Speaker 3 (04:02):
Yeah, oh exactly, Yeah, yes.
Speaker 1 (04:05):
Yeah, I mean I can't imagine just being in a
house full of I mean girls, I mean I I yeah,
girl power, Like, don't get me wrong, but it's got
to be a different experience. Would you like to explain
what it was like? I mean, were you everyone's therapist.
Speaker 2 (04:21):
Or oh so obviously on the Bachelor Zach season, I
feel like when I told everyone like, oh what do
I do for a living or what did I do
before I came on the show. And it's like the
moment that people like found out I was like a therapist,
It's like, Okay, now everyone's coming to me. It's like,
how do I process this? Like can we talk this out?
Like you're just so nice and all this. So like
(04:41):
I didn't mind it, but it got to the point
where I think also producers like started to play into that,
and so then like I was like being brought in
for like girl chats and like trying to level and
ground everyone.
Speaker 1 (04:51):
I'm like, you're like this is gonna cost you?
Speaker 2 (04:53):
Yeah, Like am I getting compensated for this?
Speaker 3 (04:54):
I don't think so. So that was a little tricky.
Speaker 2 (04:58):
But I also obviously I didn't mind me because it's
just I just love helping people and trying to help
them like navigate things, and even for my own self.
Like it was chaotic, Like it's not anything like people
think it's like a sorority house. It's not like we're
obviously all dating the same guy. It's a lot of
emotions were disconnected from everything that we know in life,
So it's nothing like a sorority house.
Speaker 1 (05:19):
Yeah, yeah, it's not the glitz and glamour that we
all see. And I would say, similar to Dancy with
the Stars. But we'll get there. Let's go back to
little Charity. What was your very first memory as a kid,
you know, Oh.
Speaker 2 (05:32):
My goodness, I would have to say, like, obviously, my
dad was in the military, so we traveled a lot.
So I feel like a lot of my like earlier
memories were attainted just because we were moving a lot
and switching like you know, friend groups and stuff. But
when we moved to Fort Benning, which is in my
home are close to my hometown of Columbus, Georgia.
Speaker 3 (05:53):
I went to the elementary school on base.
Speaker 2 (05:57):
And when I say, like my pre k years, my
kindergarten years, just like the friends that you make and
the families that you meet in like, military life is
just so impactful. I wish I was still like connected,
but obviously people move, Yeah, people move a lot. But
I would have to say my best memories was just
being on that school on base and like having just
(06:17):
a really good school like school years. My teachers were
the best.
Speaker 1 (06:21):
Yeah, what is that like to be on like because
that was your first was that first the first years
of school, like the beginning years.
Speaker 3 (06:29):
Yeah really yeah, it was like pre k and kindergarten.
Speaker 1 (06:32):
Yeah, so no bullying, I'm assuming, right, No, Like when.
Speaker 2 (06:35):
I say it's like a top tier, I'm like everyone
should follow after military schools like public schools. Like it was,
I mean just top tier, like honestly, like had the
best memories experiencing just like friend groups. Like it was
very like a tight knit community because we all lived
on Yeah, we all lived on base, so it's like
we come and like encounter with each other a lot.
We played out outside a lot. So for me, it
(06:57):
was like all these like a little core things that
just shaped me obviously into who I am, but like
understanding like people and how they work, and at a
very young age, I was able to see that and
be like connected in so many ways.
Speaker 1 (07:09):
Young Your parents have been married for forty seven years.
Speaker 2 (07:13):
Yeah, for eight forty eight years.
Speaker 1 (07:15):
Yeah, I guess my research was a year later. Okay, Yeah,
that is it's insane, right, Like, yeah did that in
a way. I mean I'm sure that has a lot.
Like I come from a divorce family. I know so
many people that have come from broken families, which seems
to be kind of normal nowadays. Yeah, and I think
with that there's effects right when it comes to mental health,
but when when there's not, Like my little sister, she
(07:38):
you know, my stepdad and my mother are her parents,
and there's a huge, huge difference, Like yes, and I'm
just saying, like, she's definitely benefited from the fact that,
right she has had two stable adults in her life.
Do you think that has helped when it comes to
picking you know, before Dawton obviously, but when you were
(08:00):
dating and like the you know, boundaries that you've set
versus not or were you a rebel?
Speaker 2 (08:10):
A little bit of both, which is kind of interesting
because coming from a family where I have two like
perfect examples are not perfect, but two great examples of
of what love or what a marriage could look like. Obviously,
my parents met when they were so young and they
got married super young, so that like obviously credits them
having so many years added on. But I think just obviously,
(08:31):
like witnessing like my dad, I always say, like now
or when I stepped into the role of bachelorette, and
when I was dating, I always wanted a guy to
kind of model like the characteristics that my dad embodied,
which was like he's like the most selfless person that
I know, incredibly hard working, like so driven, compassionate, and
I was like, those are literally like all I need
and like just someone who's secure. He lets my mom
(08:53):
kind of just be her, and like my mom is
kind of similar to me. So it's like and it's
similar to I'm like, I noticed that with me and
DOT relationship.
Speaker 1 (09:00):
Yeah, it's true. You know, you end up like with
the person that reminds you of one of your parents
at least. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (09:07):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (09:07):
But also like coming from the South or living in
the South, there's like this immense pressure to like get
married young or like to be with your partner from
like high school, and so a lot of like that
for me was like, oh, the guys that I dated
in high school like kind of transitioned over to like
us rekindling things in college, and it's like everyone knows
(09:27):
each other. Yeah, yes, it's like everyone knows each other,
you know, everyone's family. So it's like people are just
like playing off of that. And I'm like, there's no
way my soulmate is in this town like circle exactly.
He is not here. And I think I learned that
the hard way. But yeah, I mean I think I
just had this dream too of like, oh my parents
(09:48):
got married young, like it could happen for me. They
stayed together so long, and so I think I like
personally even limited myself to that like idea. And I
was like, now I'm destined for more. I know who
I am as a person, and like this is not
odd that I need to see in life.
Speaker 1 (10:03):
Yeah, yeah, no, that is very healthy. Let's move on
to the Bachelor Bachelorette. So your friend was the one? Yes,
I got you on. Were you pissed?
Speaker 2 (10:15):
I was.
Speaker 3 (10:16):
I was like yes and no, But I was.
Speaker 1 (10:18):
Like you can tell me, Like initially were like you
must have been shocked. You're like, what is this phone call?
Speaker 2 (10:24):
She literally did not tell me. And it was crazy
because like the time that I got the phone call,
I had so much going on in my life, like
literally like graduating grad school. It was a week after
I graduate, like literally walked across the stage. So I'm
like packing up my life, packing up my apartment, getting
ready to move to like my next location, start my career,
and then I'm like blindsided by this like phone call
(10:44):
from a producer from a number that I didn't even have,
and they're like, are you saying.
Speaker 1 (10:48):
A three one zero.
Speaker 2 (10:49):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (10:49):
I was like yeah, I am, like what's up?
Speaker 2 (10:52):
And they're like, we got an application for you to
be on the Bachelor, and I was like, well, I
didn't submit it, so who did? And then like that's
when I found out it was my best friend And
I literally called her right after I got off that phone.
I was like, did you submit this application for me?
She was like yeah, you had no idea, no idea,
no idea none.
Speaker 1 (11:09):
She wasn't even joking, like I'm going to do this
if you don't.
Speaker 2 (11:12):
Well, okay, So the thing is like I got out
of a relationship, a really bad relationship, like a year
and a half got prior, and she was like, you
need to like just like you know, explore, like you
needed like try dating in like different capacities, different ways.
And I was like, okay, like I don't know what
that means for me, but like I'm literally at that time,
I was still like I was in Arburn, Alabama, like
a small town, finishing up grad school.
Speaker 1 (11:32):
Like I've dated everybody exactly.
Speaker 3 (11:34):
I literally have dated no, truly, I really have.
Speaker 2 (11:37):
And she was like no, I just think like you
like should be like on like a show or something.
So she casually mentioned it, but like she doesn't even
watch The Bachelor. She knows like just from like conversations
and like obviously things in the media, but she didn't
even watch the show. So I was like, what makes
you think that, like I would be the perfect candidate
for this? And she submitted it without telling me.
Speaker 1 (11:57):
That she called that one eight hundred number and that
was all his just sued it. Yeah, yeah, that's amazing. Okay,
so we talked a little bit about The Bachelor, but
now let's move on to the Bachelorette. So how long?
So Jesse Palmer was the one that announced it was live.
Speaker 2 (12:12):
Yes it was, well, it wasn't live, but it was,
and it was at the Woman Tell also our reunion
for Zach season, so I didn't know, Like I just
showed up thinking like, Okay, I'm going to do the
reunion with the rest of the other cast of girls.
Speaker 1 (12:24):
But you knew a little bit, no, like a little
I only.
Speaker 2 (12:26):
Knew because obviously they interview multiple people, so it's like
I was one of the multiple girls that they interviewed,
but like just from talks of like kind of what
like I feel like people at the time wanted, and
then obviously, like myself, like I struggled a lot with
like imposter syndrome. I was like, there's no way to me,
and so I like literally kind of discredit like discounted it,
(12:47):
like oh my gods in it. And I just like
went along to just like obviously do the interviews and
like did the whole process. But the thing is is
like obviously they don't tell you like where you stand
in all of this. It's just like you're just in
the interview and you have to wait.
Speaker 1 (13:01):
So it was the interview happening when you were still
filming for The Bachelor? Yeah, well I was still airing,
m oh airing, but you were done filming, Yeah yeah,
got it?
Speaker 2 (13:09):
Yeah done filming.
Speaker 3 (13:10):
Yeah yeah yeah it was airing.
Speaker 2 (13:12):
So yeah, I'm still like watching all this back trying
to make sense of it, and then obviously getting brought
in to do the interview, and I was like, I
don't know, like I don't even know if I'm ready,
Like I don't know what's like, what's the outcome of
this is going to be?
Speaker 1 (13:25):
How does one be ready?
Speaker 2 (13:27):
You aren't? You were literally not ready, And so I
remember just doing it, completing the interview, and I waited
and waited, and I was like, you know what, my
life cannot literally be put on hold for this show,
Like you must move on.
Speaker 3 (13:40):
And I went to the reunion and that's when they
told me.
Speaker 2 (13:43):
And obviously at that time, I did not know that
they were going to announce me at the reunion and
I was like, Lord, clearly.
Speaker 1 (13:49):
How long did you have to pack? Like how what
was the turnaround?
Speaker 2 (13:53):
It was crazy? I had, like I want to say,
I had like two weeks because mine's happened super quick.
So we had the reunion union and then I left
for filming two weeks. So Zach season when I started
filming was still airing, So that's how quick it was.
Speaker 3 (14:06):
I was like, well, I can't even finish how this
all ends.
Speaker 1 (14:09):
What a crazy story, right, Like are you thinking your
friend a little bit, just a little bit to this day.
Speaker 2 (14:15):
I am.
Speaker 3 (14:15):
I always say, like we always joke about it.
Speaker 2 (14:17):
I'm like, I credit, like, I owe you my life honestly,
because like you made it real kind of.
Speaker 1 (14:23):
At least an invite to the wedding or whatever exactly.
So I heard you say that when you're filming The
Bachelorette that you had to demand for some downtime, which
I can only imagine how. I mean, I've never done
a reality show like that. I've you know, I've done
Dancing with Stars for one hundred and five years.
Speaker 3 (14:40):
Hard.
Speaker 2 (14:40):
But we'll get to that.
Speaker 1 (14:43):
Saving the best for last.
Speaker 2 (14:44):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (14:46):
But then but it wasn't. It was like I thought
that was too much. I can't imagine like cameras waiting
for you outside the bathroom if you have time to
do any of your mental health practices like meditate or
whatever you do.
Speaker 2 (15:00):
Journal I specifically like asked for that because I knew
just from like understanding how scheduling and you know, time
worked as a contest and I was like, it's going
to be Times twenty as a lead because you get
downtime as a contestant. If you're not on a date,
you're sitting around at the house, You're like, obviously the
cameras are still there, but you have so much more
(15:21):
freedom to just kind of maneuver how you want. As
a lead, you're always being pulled, You're always being ONFS interviews, yes.
Speaker 3 (15:28):
Yes, yes, yes, NonStop.
Speaker 2 (15:30):
And it became so draining for me to the point
where I was like, I you know, I told the
therapist on staff. I was like, I need time like
to just journal in the morning. I need to like
collect my thoughts. I need to be able to go
back and like remember what happened this day because like
the time just moved so fast. You're like, wait, who
did I talk to?
Speaker 3 (15:46):
Like you know, you're just trying to have yours of everything?
Speaker 1 (15:48):
What's his name? Yeah?
Speaker 3 (15:49):
Piece everything together? And that was incredibly hard for that
for me.
Speaker 2 (15:54):
So I told them I was like, listen, I need
like at least like thirty minutes before I go in
here and makeup to like journal.
Speaker 3 (15:59):
I need to like just sit down and like have
just a zen moment.
Speaker 1 (16:02):
And they were cool, Yeah, I was.
Speaker 2 (16:04):
Like, leave me alone, don't come in, do not wake
me up until I'm done with this. Good for you
trying to say that in the nicest way possible.
Speaker 1 (16:10):
Well yeah, I mean, but also like boundaries, buddy.
Speaker 3 (16:14):
No, no, that's the thing. But you know, you know
how that is.
Speaker 1 (16:18):
I heard you say that there's there was a therapist,
which I think is brilliant. And don't you like do
you believe so like, first of all, do you use
that like did you use that to your And I'm
sure everybody uses that, right.
Speaker 2 (16:30):
Oh when I say I used her to be like, honestly,
probably still like anywhere, I adore her so much. Really
like if she wasn't on my seat, then I always like,
and I tell her this, we talked about all the time,
like I don't know how like it all would have
worked out at the end, just because you're emotionally exhausted
(16:52):
and like she was like probably the only person that
was with me from literally day one to where I'm
at now.
Speaker 1 (16:57):
The Bachelor as well. Mm hm wow that's a journey.
Speaker 3 (17:02):
Yeah, so she she knows, she absolutely knows.
Speaker 1 (17:04):
Yeah, that's amazing. Do you think that Dancing with the
Stars should provide that as well?
Speaker 2 (17:20):
I'm so glad you asked me that. I'm so glad
you have to be that.
Speaker 1 (17:25):
I've always said it like it is full on.
Speaker 2 (17:28):
I'm actually surprised, and maybe I can say this here.
I'm surprised you guys don't, like, honestly, I'm very surprised
because quite literally, yeah, I mean, while Dancing with the
Stars was great, I literally went through hell and that
with my mental health in that show.
Speaker 1 (17:42):
Let me just tell you something. This space is obviously
safe and I'm sure you've heard rumblings about this podcast,
but it's like, you know, again, with all due respect,
we're just talking about our truths and our story. So
but we love the show. There's nothing wrong, like it
could be both.
Speaker 3 (17:56):
Right, yeah as yeah for sure.
Speaker 1 (17:58):
Yeah, so yeah, feel free to say anything. You can swear,
you can punch your laptop, like whatever you need to do,
just like, don't hold in the feelings because that's not healthy.
But yeah, no, I've always wondered, like I've always in
a way pitch like there needs to be a dance doctor,
like if we want to make it all like television friendly,
but really, like I spent a lot of money and
I I mean, like I've been in therapy in my
(18:20):
whole life, even prior to the show. I'm not going
to say the show is it's because of the show,
but like, yeah, you know, like you need someone to
talk to that is not biased, and because like it
needs to be a couple's therapist, like they did this
segment many seasons ago for TV. They never aired it,
and we all went to go see a couple's therapists
(18:41):
and it was brilliant. It was brilliant and it was needed.
Speaker 2 (18:44):
Honestly, I feel like that would have like worked wonders
for everyone. But like again, like even as like an individual,
not even like coupling, like speaking out of my partner,
like as an individual, it is and it's just so much,
you know. It's like the time I'm constraints, like mentally
and physically and emotionally, they're all connected. So I literally
(19:05):
went into this and I was like, oh my goodness,
it's just gonna be like a physical like thing for me.
Speaker 1 (19:08):
Wait wait, wait wait, you didn't like Trista.
Speaker 2 (19:11):
No, I asked Caitlyn, and like, I feel like they
all like that's what I'm saying when I people ask me. Now,
there's no way.
Speaker 1 (19:17):
Caitlyn was like it's great, you know.
Speaker 2 (19:19):
She was like it's hard, but like it was almost
like it's like it's like she was very happy about it.
Speaker 3 (19:23):
Like when I tell people how hard this is, I'm like,
forget it's hard. Yeah, I'm like, I don't.
Speaker 2 (19:28):
I don't sugarcoat anything because I want I want people
to be like warned as much as possible so you
can make the best decision. And like before I even
started all of this, I was very hesitant because I
was like, I don't know if I'm going to be
able to like handle this, and Dalton was obviously like
my best supporter and biggest supporter, but he was like, yeah,
do it, Like go for it. I'm gonna be like
(19:49):
be there with you every step of the way. But like,
little did I know, Like it was like it hit
me like a ton of bricks week like three or four.
Speaker 1 (19:56):
I was like, I feel like I'm I don't know, yeah,
you know, I'm kidding, but like you did really well though,
but hold on before we even get to there to
the judges because there's a lot of different layers here.
When so when you were pitched this, were you already
doing Were you taping the Bachelorette?
Speaker 2 (20:15):
Yeah? So are not taping? I was My season was airing,
so yeah, so you had already.
Speaker 1 (20:22):
Withdotten and you did you ask him like if this
is something that you feel comfortable with.
Speaker 3 (20:27):
Or because obviously they like warn every bachelor.
Speaker 1 (20:31):
iNTS curse, they were like.
Speaker 2 (20:34):
Don't do this, and I was like, you're like, okay,
Like I'm very secure with myself but also secure in
the man that I chose and I know how he's.
Speaker 1 (20:41):
Going to hand, which is not not often.
Speaker 2 (20:43):
I know that's the thing.
Speaker 3 (20:45):
I was like, it's a very rare situation that we
have here, but I'm.
Speaker 2 (20:48):
Grateful for it.
Speaker 1 (20:48):
It's great though.
Speaker 2 (20:49):
So we talked about it a lot, like I almost
probably like irritated him just bringing it up so many
times of like just wanting to make sure because I
was like, I don't want to sacrifice like what we
just build and what we have, like for an opportunity,
like obviously this is like a once in a lifetime
and I would be honored to do it, but like
if it's going to create this like barrier distance between us,
(21:10):
I don't want that. And he was again like just
encouraging me. He was like, this is something I know
you want to do, Like you need to do it.
I'm going to be here, Like, don't worry about that.
Speaker 1 (21:20):
Honestly, did you request Ardam?
Speaker 2 (21:23):
I requested Ardam.
Speaker 1 (21:24):
I have like a list.
Speaker 3 (21:26):
I was like Ardam, Brandon Val and then Alan.
Speaker 1 (21:30):
Yeah, so Ardam was first.
Speaker 3 (21:33):
I don't think I necessarily put him like first, yeah
yah yah.
Speaker 2 (21:36):
I was just like maaze, these are the ones.
Speaker 1 (21:38):
Right, like one of the four yeah yeah yeah. And
after getting to know these like I, by the way,
fun fact, Ardam lived in my poolhouse when we were teenagers,
like this is how yoh my god. We like I
met him when he couldn't speak in like not a
one word wow. So I'm from the Bay Area, so
like we know each other. I think he's the longest
out of all the pros that I know. Yeah, it's
(22:00):
insane anyway, but out of all the pros now and
after you know, dancing with someone like Ezra, would you
say that Artam's teaching style suited you best?
Speaker 2 (22:12):
Yeah, I would have learned. I don't think I would
have learned half of what I know if I had
any other teacher. You're right, And I think people can
argue obviously like chemistry like between me and Artam, and
that's fair, but I think I like, obviously I respect Artam,
and his teaching definitely suited me the best. I think
our relationship one percent was like way more professional than
(22:33):
it was like it was like goof around like my
my banter with Ezra's day and night from me in Artam.
But I'm like, if I was have to learn, like
who's going to get me to the finals, Like it's
going to be Ardam because he is so much about
like just his work and his work ethic. Yeah, and
I'm like he doesn't play, so I love that.
Speaker 1 (22:51):
Yeah, and he's the real deal, Like I mean, I
love Ezra. I think Osra should be a pro. However,
teaching and experience when it comes to teaching, like this
is two separate things on the show. It's like if
you're a great dancer, great, like as far as the
pros go, but like if you can't teach, yours just screwed.
Like there's just no way that you're going to succeed
unless you're marrying a dancer who's been on the show
(23:11):
for many years, which is it often the case, which
is never which was not my case ever, But like, yeah, anyway,
what talk more about your guys chemistry because like I
believe that. Look, I think if for the long haul,
like if we're talking long term, this was the best
situation for you, right, and just because you have chemistry,
(23:32):
what someone doesn't mean like oh there's stuff happening after No,
but it's like either have it or you don't, And
you really can't fool anybody, do you think that? Though
he's an amazing teacher, Like I'm not even he would
agree with me as well, Like you know, at the
end of the day. Do you believe that that was
the reason why carrying Inn kept repeating herself every week?
(23:55):
I don't.
Speaker 2 (23:56):
That's the thing that's like, I don't know if it
was necessary.
Speaker 1 (23:59):
Did you feel like there was chemistry or.
Speaker 2 (24:02):
Like I guess I don't want to say no, but
I don't want to say.
Speaker 1 (24:05):
Like yes, no, But it's not offending anyone, like you
have it or you don't, you know.
Speaker 3 (24:09):
I think it's like how I describe it is like
how we viewed each other.
Speaker 2 (24:12):
We just had so much like mutual respect, so it
was more like a respect thing. It's like like a
professional relationship, like I said, so I think in that terms,
like yeah, like that part of it.
Speaker 1 (24:24):
Maybe it's like you want to Ezra, like do you
feel like you had chemistry with Ezra more in a
little in a weird but not the technique site, but
like Ezra just As like his energy, Yeah.
Speaker 2 (24:34):
Because As was just like he's young and like he's
gonna say off the wall things like Artam is like
you're hot here to like run jokes like like let's
get to work, and I'm like okay, I'm about it,
like you know, but As was like he's on command.
Speaker 3 (24:45):
He's on like tell me like your ass, yeah exactly, exactly,
like you would never would do that with anyone.
Speaker 2 (24:52):
So it's not even just a me thing, you know.
Speaker 1 (24:54):
But A was shaking his ass the way he did
what I just saw because I watched again recently. I
was dyeing dead, so I'm sure was like, can you
take or can you not do that? But he probably
didn't say that.
Speaker 3 (25:06):
We would face when he was out for COVID that week.
Speaker 2 (25:08):
We face had him like all throughout the rehearsals and
he was like I added this then.
Speaker 1 (25:12):
And was like, you're like, you're dancing with the stars
of my friend. Okay, so now let's move on to
the judges, because okay, this is the thing. It's it's
this whole formula. Whoever I keep saying this, but whoever
made this up is smart because like, damned if you
do damned if you don't write. I've tried it all
(25:34):
in twenty six seasons that I've done the show. It's like,
you know what, I'm just not gonna put my whole
life into this, Like I'm going to take it as
like a job and then not obsessed about it afterwards.
Doesn't that didn't work, And then it's like I'm going
to obsess and just care so much that didn't work,
you know, like and so then also it's television, so
then there's like a fine line. But but the difference
(25:56):
is like you can eliminate me on any other show,
but when you put your blood, sweat into your into something,
and yet you're not getting anything that you can take
back with you into the studio and work on because
the comments are just the same. It's the same comment,
and you're not even gonna call me and like tell
me off camera or like call Artam. Like they definitely
know each other, you know what I'm saying, Like I
(26:17):
have history. It's like it's got to be discouraging, right.
Speaker 2 (26:21):
Oh it was. It was probably like that became uh yeah,
the hardest part for me kind of where like all
of this like took a turn, I would say, obviously
with like Artam, and like Artem knew all along too,
obviously like how this works. But I think he was
just trying to like be like the best teacher for
me and like get me to a point like dance
(26:42):
and technique wise, but like it got to the point
where I was like Okay, this is the comment that
I'm consistently getting from the judges of like, oh, like
I need promotion, I need to like connect more. And
I'm like, yeah, like I've really never danced before, and
I don't really know what this means. And I think
even for Artum, like he was struggling, I think to
a certain point of like trying to get that out
of me, but like as you know it, it's like
(27:03):
we don't. We also don't have enough time for that,
Like I don't know. I think for me, it was
going to take a lot longer than just like three
days for me to like really for that to like sing.
So the music, That's what I'm saying on like certain songs,
like if it was more upbeat, like I obviously performed
better like you saw like the Chaw Chaw dance off
with like Soshi, Like I did so much better than
I did any other day. Like it's crazy, It's like
(27:23):
certain things just made sense for me.
Speaker 1 (27:25):
But your contemporary was like I was crying when I
watch your contemporary and look did I also like I
also do rewatches and I'm not even gonna be fully
transparent with you. Yes, there were times where I wanted
you to be more into your partner than to the camera.
But again like unless like these are fine details that
you do not really unless your partner hounds you. And
(27:48):
by the way, yeah, so much easier because I'm not
in it. Like when I'm in it with somebody, you
don't have a mentor with you, which is another thing
they should add, like they need a third eye, like
how the hell are we supposed to see everything when
we're the one teaching it and dancing with you and everything. Yeah,
and look, and I'm pretty sure because I know this production.
(28:08):
They were like looking to bink into camera one. You're
like what, like my head is this way? And then
you're like you want me to yes this Like you're
like this is not natural?
Speaker 2 (28:18):
No, yes, I remember like expecting you saying that. It's
so funny because like obviously camera blocking. They're like this
camera looking and I would come up to arm and
I was like, I don't know which camera to look at.
He was like, don't worry about that, and I was like, Okay,
you're right, honestly, like don't worry about it. But it's
just like I got so in my head of just
trying to do like these little things, cause I knew,
like for myself, like it's almost like you see like
(28:40):
a clock countdown and it's like each week I'm like
I'm running out of time. I'm running out of time.
I'm not doing enough, And like that was so so
crushing for me of like telling myself or even like
having those thoughts in my head of like I'm not
doing enough when I knew that I was actually doing
my all of like what I was capable of and
what I had the resources to work with at the time. Yeah,
I can't believe.
Speaker 1 (29:01):
You that you haven't danced, like at all.
Speaker 2 (29:03):
You literally never dance. And Ardam said that, like, I
mean some of these things are left out, but if
you like look at interviews Ardam did after the show,
I'm like, I wish this was in our package, but
like maybe the audience would understand that. But it's like
he would say, like he saw the first time that
I walked in, he was like, no, this girl's like
too left me, like I don't, like I don't have
any dance experience. And it was such a journey for him,
(29:26):
Like I think I helped him this whole season too,
of just like really having to teach me really having
to like connect so much past just like technique wise,
but yeah, it was really really hard.
Speaker 1 (29:38):
Okay, let me just tell you. But if I don't
feel like if I'm dancing, like they're giving me a
country song and I have to do a ramba, I
am so sorry. I am not inspired, Like I'm just
not inspired by that. And yeah, for example, like with you,
when I saw all of your dances the second time around,
there were a few that popped out. The contemporary was
one because there was a story, but you're also like,
(30:01):
did you ever tell Ardam like you need to give
me a story or like or I did? Was that
something because you're not an actor but actors do that
a lot.
Speaker 2 (30:09):
Yeah, that's the thing. It was like that was the
biggest like conversation piece this season of like Tyrty's like
the one that hasn't done television enough or she hasn't
done acting, like she doesn't have any training. But like
I would tell Ar was like I connect when there's
like lyrics or things that I'm like, Okay, let's create
a Whitney Houston. Yes, like there's a story that I
can like you know, apply to something either in my
(30:32):
life or I can like kind of transport myself there.
I couldn't do that with all the songs. And I
even remember, like Alfonso, he gave me like homework that
actually helped me. Think it was I forget which week,
maybe like week eight or nine, But.
Speaker 1 (30:45):
He's gonna be a pro dancer next season.
Speaker 3 (30:47):
Yeah he's the best.
Speaker 2 (30:49):
But he gave me like homework to be like like
take each lyrics of the song and like apply like
the dance move, but like don't think about the move,
think about like how it connects your life, and like
that was like I wish I was like why didn't
you tell me that five weeks earlier? But like it
was helpful for me, so like I think like having
those little things or those little devices to help me
(31:09):
in the dance obviously made the world of a difference.
But yeah, if it's not the right song, I just
like I don't know.
Speaker 3 (31:15):
I'm just like okay, I'm just doing it.
Speaker 1 (31:18):
Did you ever say, like, look, guys like you want
feeling like you're gonna have to change my music? Was
Ardam good with that? Did he like I because you
have to you have to like pick and choose on
the show, right, Yeah, I guess you can't change every week,
like there's right.
Speaker 2 (31:32):
I don't even think I ever. I think there was
maybe one song that I think, like the tempo or something,
we were like, this isn't gonna work and we ended
up switching. But that only happened like once once or
twice every other song. I was just like, okay, like
I like kept and I didn't want to be like difficult,
which I hate even saying I didn't want.
Speaker 1 (31:49):
To get real. They couldn't say anything else. No, oh no,
I'm so sorry.
Speaker 2 (31:56):
Okay, thank you, actually, thank you for saying that, because
I was going to tell you that.
Speaker 1 (31:59):
What else they're gonna say your arm? Like what, it's
perfect girl, you try it, you should.
Speaker 3 (32:03):
Say literally that. I was like, maybe that's it.
Speaker 2 (32:06):
Maybe it's just like the technique is really ten out
of ten and we we have to just only talk
about that.
Speaker 1 (32:10):
I mean, are they not going to have another Bachelorette
win or like right, like wasn't ardam didn't he? Just
like I don't know. Yeah, this is all conspiracy theories,
and I love my conspiracy theories. I'm just saying this
is true. But after being on for seventy five thousand seasons,
like there's patterns that I'm seeing. Yeah, okay, So did
Carrie ever tell you off camera like what I mean
(32:32):
by feeling something.
Speaker 2 (32:33):
It's like it was only until like the finale when
we had like the Redemption dance, which she was a person.
Speaker 3 (32:40):
Yeah, she like came in she was.
Speaker 2 (32:42):
Like the coach for that week, and that's the only
time I really ever got to like talk to her
about like what that.
Speaker 1 (32:49):
Meant and like obviously, like did it make sense?
Speaker 2 (32:52):
It did, but like I think like a lot of
it was like she like even felt like just like
the trust or like the connection between me and Artem
And granted I trust Artem, like that's not the case,
but I think it was like trusting him like on
a vulnerable level with like my emotions. Like that was
the piece I think she picked up on. And I
was like, you guys keep saying like it's like about acting,
it's about performing, But I'm like, yeah, so, like there's
(33:13):
so many more layers and pieces to this that everyone
is literally missing the mimo like everyone's missing it exactly.
Speaker 1 (33:19):
I got it and that's all that matters really, But
also it's not acting, Like there's not one time I've
danced out there that I'm like, let's pretend to be happy.
It's like if I'm pissed and I'm dancing a jive,
I'm dancing a pissed jive. Like it's just the way
it is, Like I can't and it's the music. It's
like it's all the music anyway. Yeah, you experience bullying
(33:50):
a lot, Okay, I first of all, like it's shocking. Yeah,
can you say more?
Speaker 2 (33:57):
Is it shocking? I don't know, Like that's it. And
I'm like I don't know if it's shocking. I think
to a certain degree it was like expected. And that's
why I say, like coming off a Bachelorette like I
was like, oh, I can handle it because I mean
obviously we know like that's a very like conservative very
like go in Gun's a.
Speaker 1 (34:14):
Lace very conservative.
Speaker 2 (34:15):
Yeah, they're very harsh, and so I was like I've
experienced on the Bachelor Bachelorette. I'm good and so like
I came into like the Dancing with the Star Wars
fan base and I was like, this is going to
be a piece of cake, and like only to be
like almost to the point where it was like so
much worse than Bachelor and Bachelorette. Yeah, like to the
point where I was getting like death threats for like existence,
what Yeah.
Speaker 1 (34:38):
For what for?
Speaker 2 (34:39):
What for not performing enough? For not for being conceited,
for being entire seated, for being the biggest bitch on
the cast. No, it's crazy, Like I'm telling it. I'm
telling you this, and not for anyone who doesn't know,
Like I'm saying this too, Like this is the first
time I'm like openly talking about it, because I would
just the only thing I've ever shared in terms of
like the treatment that I got on the show was
the statement that my brother put out at the end
(35:01):
of the season.
Speaker 1 (35:02):
By the way, he's amazing your brother, he is.
Speaker 3 (35:04):
No, I love him so much.
Speaker 2 (35:05):
But I never talked about it because it got to
the point where I was like, I have to choose
to protect my piece and not even give any like
attention to this. It was so damaging.
Speaker 3 (35:15):
Night and Night Out was so terrible.
Speaker 2 (35:18):
Oh yeah, it was awful to the point where I
even had to, like I talked about it with art
like nobody knew, the pros didn't know, Like nobody knew
what was going on until I was like, go, just
go look at my comment whenever my posts or like
something about me and Artum is shared on the Dance
and with the Stars page, Oh, it's.
Speaker 1 (35:34):
On the Dancing with the Stars page.
Speaker 2 (35:36):
Oh, and then my personal So whenever I posted something personal,
like if I posted a dance, I like blocked and
filtered my stuff to where like I did not have
that come on. But if you go in the actual
Dance with the Stars.
Speaker 1 (35:46):
Page, did they not block or filter?
Speaker 2 (35:48):
Of course not. I'm sorry, of course, what m m.
Speaker 1 (35:51):
That is not okay?
Speaker 2 (35:53):
Yeah, so you.
Speaker 1 (35:54):
Didn't feel protected obviously.
Speaker 2 (35:56):
Yeah, so that was like the big that that's where
like the emotional and mental came in. It was really hard.
So I had to like tell Artem I was like,
this is like, unfortunately, what we're dealing with and what
we're up against. Like if you look in comparison to
every other contestant on the season, they don't have this
underneath their comments, like of course obviously Harry. But it
was like because obviously Harry, and like the dancing like
(36:18):
ability and then just like proficiency of where he was
at at a certain week.
Speaker 1 (36:21):
And his reputation and all of it, you know, wheah,
which is nothing similar to.
Speaker 2 (36:26):
Yeah, I'm like I'm not going out there. I'm not
forgetting my dances. I'm performing. I'm just literally existing. But
like being called, yeah, being called like a bitch, being
called I'm so conceited, I'm entitled. I have the most
like stanked up attitude on the on the it was
so like insane to like see and I didn't understand,
(36:46):
and I was like I don't know like how to
like maneuver and navigate this, and like Artem, sorry, like
kind of makes me emotional.
Speaker 4 (36:54):
Okay, Okay, I'm so sorry. Sorry, No, no, don't apologize. Please,
this is horrendous.
Speaker 1 (37:04):
Act is horrible, Like I can't even like you would
think that the comments would be shut off.
Speaker 2 (37:10):
Yeah, it got to the point where like I had
to tell Artem and he was just like so confused,
like he didn't even like he didn't even know because
I just like kind of.
Speaker 1 (37:18):
Can't talk to the executive.
Speaker 2 (37:20):
Yeah, to a certain point, but at that point, I
think it was just like it was too far gone.
Speaker 1 (37:26):
My god, this is so crazy to me.
Speaker 2 (37:28):
Yeah, but that's why I said, it's not really surprising
because like I mean, someone like messaged me and said
like the same thing kind of happened to like Simon
when she competed, and I was like, it's just honestly
a trend, which is kind of frustrating, but like, I mean,
I'm only speaking out about my experience and like how
I feel, like obviously like just being in existing, but
(37:50):
also like the difference that I have and go through
this life as like.
Speaker 3 (37:54):
A black woman and being on a reality TV show.
It's like the same things are just not protected.
Speaker 1 (37:59):
Like this is the difference. I think, like when Vivica
Fox was on, it was seasoned. Yeah, there was no
such thing as social media, but I do remember like
these message boards were cruel, like cruel, so maybe it's similar.
The thing is, I just like I stopped. I don't
scroll anymore because it really messes with my.
Speaker 3 (38:15):
Mental I know. That's literally, Yes, when.
Speaker 1 (38:21):
You're on a show like Dancing with the Stars, of
course you're scrolling, like of course we all want feedback
and of course we focus on you know, but that's shit,
Like I'm so sorry, I'm not even saying that you
only focus on the No, no, no, that is not okay.
And I'm just like really upset at the way production
(38:41):
didn't protect or protect you or at least hear you, Yeah,
did you talk to the exact you talked to Dina.
Speaker 2 (38:49):
Or I did a little bit about it, But I
just like I think I just tried at that point. Yeah,
I tried to just have like the the best attitude
I could about it, but really like obviously the art
and like he was great and then and he really
did like offer as much support as he could, and
he like obviously came to my defense at the end
of the season, which I'm like incredibly grateful for. But yeah,
(39:10):
I mean it was just this whole thing of like
I just had to like suppress it, and like honestly
got to the point where I'm like I'm just trying
to survive, like I'm just trying to like make it
out out of the season.
Speaker 1 (39:19):
Yeah, I know that feeling for different reasons, but yeah,
this is where the therapists would have come in.
Speaker 2 (39:26):
And this is what I'm saying, Like I'm only like
advocating for that and speaking out about that because I'm like, sure,
God forbid, someone else has to go through this and
then they're like just you know, like stuck in this rut.
Like I literally and I'm telling you this, I told
dot in this like there was weeks where I come
home from rehears and I'm like, I literally don't even
like I hope I forget my steps and like I
get voted all like I did. Yeah I know that.
Speaker 1 (39:47):
I mean one season I asked, I begged, I said,
can you please vote me? All They're like, sorry, we don't.
Speaker 3 (39:53):
Yeah, like literally and it was and.
Speaker 1 (39:56):
That was like, oh it was not worth it anymore.
Speaker 2 (39:58):
Yeah, it's like a really dark, dark place and my god,
but like the biggest thing was like I got and
told me it's just like I work this hard and
like I know, I'm like, yeah, it would be defeating
and so fusherting looking back on it. If I knew,
I like just quit or like just walked out, and
I would be really upset with myself, which I'm grateful
that I stuck it out, but yeah, yeah, to get
to get creasifact for just existing in your character on
(40:20):
the show, which didn't even match up, I don't know,
Like I'm like, this is a competition.
Speaker 1 (40:25):
On top of it, the judges are not encouraging.
Speaker 2 (40:28):
Yeah, I was like, this is a competition show. If
I'm supposed to just walk around and just be like
la la la la la, like I'm sorry, but like also,
I just felt at times that my confidence and like
my work ethic was interpreted as like I think that's
where like the viewers kind of got the whole idea
and like concept of like, oh, she is entitled, she
is like you know this, she has this very like
(40:49):
bitchy above me attitude. But I'm like, no, I'm working
hard because I don't want to like go home. I
don't want to like be worse and where I came
in and started off. So I'm like, if that is
intimidating to y'all, then I'm sorry. That's a you thing,
not a me thing. Like you don't have to like me,
you don't have to like my dancing, but one thing
you are, you're going to respect me. And that's just it,
like good for you.
Speaker 1 (41:07):
Did you ever like call them out?
Speaker 2 (41:10):
No, because I don't want to give them an attention
to it. I look at it. Yeah, I was just
like I'm.
Speaker 1 (41:13):
Not even kind to be tempting though it is.
Speaker 2 (41:16):
Oh listen, I'm like that's my big nap shot that
yeah go off, Like yeah, I should just out some
of the people that are just like being so nasty, but.
Speaker 1 (41:24):
You're handling it. I mean, honestly, the fact that you
didn't react, I mean, it's so hard. But do you
think the packages have a lot of influence in the politics.
I would say that the packages are part of the politics,
and I would want to pay that it's more important
than your dance.
Speaker 2 (41:39):
Yeah, And I didn't realize that until yeah, like halfway
in I think week six, that's when I started really
fasing off and like how the things that were being
shown in my package was always me talking about like
my scores. But I was like, okay, that's the question
that literally every one of us is asked, you know
how these itear Master interviews. Yes, yes, everyone wants what
(42:00):
was the scores you got last week? I got two
sevens and two eighths, and so I'm like yes, But
then they use that and it makes seem like I
got two sevenths and two eight's, but I want to
tend this week. So then it's like shape in this
way where like you're kind of boasting and bragging about
your scores, but I'm only talking about them because you
guys asked me, and I'm not.
Speaker 1 (42:18):
A sentence like I have to repeat what your question was.
Speaker 2 (42:21):
Yeah, So that was really frustrating when I started to
see like my packages were painted in this way of like, yes,
it almost is skewing the viewers to like Chris see
me in this way of like all she cares about
is scores all she cares about, or she thinks she's
better than everyone. But I'm like, at the end of
the day, I don't think I'm better than anyone. I'm
just trying to get to the point where I feel
like I should be or like, honestly, where my hard
(42:43):
work has taken me to this point. But yeah, like I.
Speaker 1 (42:47):
Don't know so many it's so manyulative like I'm so sorry, Okay,
I've always said this, like did I'm sure Arden warned
you too, Like the order of first of all importance
is so asked backwards. So you've got like the packages,
then you're like, I have two second shots. And if
you're not smiling and like I have a natural resting
bitch face, like there's no way I can, like you
can't get it out of me. That was me, yep,
(43:09):
But it doesn't mean I'm not I'm freaking happy, like
I'm not, but I'm not like.
Speaker 2 (43:13):
Oh my god, yes, yes that was literally me, And
it's because like obviously, you know, like I'm in like
focus mode, Like I'm not. I'm so sorry. It's not
like trying to find the cameras trying to smell and
make the perfect I could care, I could give a
shit literally just trying to like, Okay, where are my
steps like get in the zone, Like that's just me,
(43:33):
Like I'm in, like honestly, competition mode.
Speaker 3 (43:35):
I'm in, like how I need to regulate myself.
Speaker 1 (43:37):
For real, And you're an athlete, Like we're athletes at
this time, like we need to focus.
Speaker 2 (43:42):
Yes, and for me to like get these clips every
time when I'm like seriously so focused, it does come
off like I have a resting bitch face. And that
would be like the same clip that was circulating social
media saying like Kurt, he's never happy when the camera's panter.
Speaker 3 (43:56):
I'm like, I'm fucking tired. I'm sorry, Like like.
Speaker 1 (44:00):
I just dance a jive in a skeleton outfit.
Speaker 2 (44:02):
I am hi, Lar, thank you, I am tired. Sorry,
I'm not smiling, Like what It's the craziest like thing.
Speaker 1 (44:18):
Now that you've had some space away from the show, yeah,
do you just like how do you filter? So like
obviously unfortunately social media, Like we I know, girl, Like
I'm like, can we go back to message boards? Can
it all be illegal?
Speaker 2 (44:33):
Truly?
Speaker 1 (44:33):
Can everything be banned soon? Because like this is just
I'm just like chasing something after something that I'm just like,
what am I chasing after? Like what happened? Yea, I
was on TV for seventy five years? What happened? Like, No,
we're starting over? Okay, cool, but this is fine, But
like this is the hard part is like I do
believe that after you've been on TV for a while,
(44:54):
of course you want you're looking for the reaction, of course,
because it you know, for the most part, like especially dancing,
it's your art. Yeah you do. I don't know if
maybe I'm addicted to the negative comment. I don't know
what it is, but like it's really That's why I'm like,
I'm an addict, right, Yeah, sure, I'm an addict. And
it's either all or nothing. So like either I'm going
(45:15):
to scroll till I die or I'm just gonna stop.
And what have you done to help with your mental
health during and after the show?
Speaker 2 (45:23):
Oh? I just stopped. I completely stop.
Speaker 1 (45:25):
Yeah, like unfollowed Dancing with the Stars Instagram and all
of it.
Speaker 2 (45:29):
I have them, but I think I muted. I muted
it just like obviously, like so I don't have to
see it. Yeah, and it wasn't Yeah, I mean it
was really just like their page because of just the comments.
And then for my own self, like unfortunately, like I
got to the point where I was like I only
shared like the really major highlights. I didn't share like
anything in between, because I was like, I just don't
even want to invite like people the opportunity to come
(45:49):
on my page because it was just too much to
the point.
Speaker 1 (45:51):
Where rehearsals like yeah, like you guys are all shooting tiktoks.
Speaker 2 (45:54):
Yeah, it's too much for me to have to like
consistently and actively like be conscious of, like I need
to block this per because they left something nasty on
my page. I was like, I'm just I don't I
don't have to worry about it if I don't post,
so like there's that, but yeah, I mean obviously I
still follow like the cast.
Speaker 3 (46:10):
I love like the cast, like the pros, like it's
nothing really with them, it's.
Speaker 1 (46:14):
No they the trolls.
Speaker 2 (46:16):
Yeah, unfortunately, and then obviously how like the editing department,
how I was edited, so yep.
Speaker 1 (46:22):
And it is a powerful thing. Okay, so let's talk
about the camaraderie. First of all, Yeah, I was Tyson Beckford.
Is he as hot and is he as much of
a googer as he was portraying during the premier because
I was like, you gotta stop, like you gotta stop
jumping up.
Speaker 2 (46:35):
And down literally, yes, yes, yes, yes, and yes he
is so funny. Honestly, it's crazy because I was like
when I first saw the cast, I was like, oh,
these are the people that I think I'm gonna be
closest with, and like, honestly like it's Tyson, but I
did not like point him out from a lineup and
I and then like the first two weeks like while
he was there, we were so close, like so close,
(46:56):
and it was crazy. Yeah. No, he's just he's such
a ball of like sunshine and so funny, like you know,
just has no filter. And I'm like I love that,
Like he made everything just feel so like.
Speaker 1 (47:08):
Like just like everyone needs to chill out. It's just
a dance shop.
Speaker 3 (47:13):
He was there for a good time.
Speaker 1 (47:15):
I loved it, like look at me, look at my dancing.
Speaker 2 (47:19):
But I was like we were also sad when he
like laughed obviously, but I loved Tyson.
Speaker 1 (47:24):
So there was quickly before we do rapid Fire, there was.
There's this huge controversy right now. So there's this show
that originated this whole Dancing with Stars franchise called Surely
Come Dancing. I don't know if you've heard of it. Yes,
So right now they're under huge just like watch because
two of the dancers, pro dancers that are very popular
(47:46):
there got fired for allegedly abusing their celebrity partners. And
it's been really insane. So like my friend when I
say that these celebrities have used their platforms obviously to
talk about the PTSD, which just shows me and I
haven't read like everything in detail about what I know
is like I've been celebrities that are coming out of
the woodwork from years ago saying that they're suffering from
(48:09):
PTSD and that their solution now to this is because
they're about to go into the twentieth anniversary. So like
it's like it was supposed to be. It's a massive
it's a massive show there. It's bigger than like the
show ever was here in the States. But their solution
is to hire chaperones to be in their studio during rehearsals,
(48:33):
which is so odd to me because I'm just like,
first of all, we have our camera crew there.
Speaker 3 (48:38):
Yeah, they're they're doing it while they're there, So.
Speaker 1 (48:41):
Yeah, were they there the whole time when you were
doing the show? Like were they never not there there?
Speaker 2 (48:47):
I mean it depends on like if we had like
if we came in for maybe like then an evening
shift or like the leadership obviously they go home at
a certain point like we always practice primarily like either
in the morning or like middle of the day. They
were always there.
Speaker 1 (49:02):
Like you guys are at the dancing with the Star.
Speaker 2 (49:04):
State watching it.
Speaker 1 (49:05):
Yeah yeah yeah, and you've got like Dave the security guy,
like you've got people.
Speaker 2 (49:09):
Like everyone is there. Yeah wow.
Speaker 1 (49:11):
So like okay, can you just talk about the intensity, like,
I know you've only done one season of the show, Yeah,
why is it so intense? And what like have you
witnessed any pro dancers? Just like because in the heat
of the moment, like, of course we're going to fight,
but obviously there's no excuse for abuse, right, Like absolutely.
Speaker 3 (49:32):
I think that.
Speaker 2 (49:32):
I mean for me, like to even hear that, it's
like really disheartening. And I can say, like I never
had like abuse, and I don't think anyone on our
season ever did that, but like that's like really fortunate,
and yeah, I can only imagine because that would just
probably be that would just I would have to walk
away from.
Speaker 1 (49:49):
The show real.
Speaker 2 (49:53):
But I think it's like, yeah, I mean obviously there's
like disagreements or I think even just like in teaching strategies.
Speaker 3 (49:59):
I think that was probably one of the things.
Speaker 2 (50:01):
That was like really brought up a lot on our
season of just like like certain drills that like we
would have to do or things like that to like
get something like mastered in our brain. But it was never, yeah,
like it was never to the point where it's like, oh,
this is like abusive, like or this is something that
like I'm going to go home and like be like
extremely traumatized.
Speaker 1 (50:21):
Front Like you didn't get kicked by Art of like
oh my god, now this is what happened over there.
One of the pro dancers kicked.
Speaker 3 (50:28):
That's awful.
Speaker 1 (50:31):
Art would never or wouldn't kick anything like not even a.
Speaker 2 (50:34):
Wrong That's what I'm saying. He's too gentle, you know.
Speaker 1 (50:36):
But like that's what like these allegations and look like
from my experience, it's just interesting because like I think
it's starting to unveil itself. And also like let's not
get it twisted, like the pro dancers have a lot
of pressure, but there's no excuse for abuse, Like I
don't give a shit who you are.
Speaker 2 (50:52):
Never I don't think it's ever really been that serious.
Speaker 1 (50:55):
I'm so sorry for real, it is just a dance show. Yeah, right,
I frustrating. It's like it's both Okay, what do you think?
One more question? Because you're a therapists, Yeah, what's the
psychology you think behind the show? What is the psychology?
Like have you thought about why certain things happen?
Speaker 2 (51:13):
Yes? And no, Well, I think pairings obviously like pairings.
I think it's a lot less with like personality types.
I think it's more like obviously like work ethic and
what they know. And I think I like, I think
I kind of like paired myself unintentionally with Ardam because
when I like first initially was like brought in for
like just the interests of the show and like talking
(51:35):
about it and who I would want, I was like,
I really am a hard worker and I'm extremely competitive.
So then like I was like, after like knowing that,
I'm like, who were like the most like outwardly like
we know that those are their personality types or work
ethics types that are milk pros on the show, And
I was like val Alan Ardam, I was like, they're
like the ones that are like I literally was like, okay,
I think I set myself up for that, but with Ardam,
(51:57):
I would have to say one hundred percent, like after
seeing us work together and even my parents said this,
they're like my mom was like, you got paired with
him because you guys have the same like work ethic
totally is like very about his very professional, like comes out,
works hard, and.
Speaker 1 (52:11):
I realized that the best one, like for real, Yeah, I.
Speaker 3 (52:14):
Literally realize that. So I think, like, obviously.
Speaker 1 (52:16):
Work and no drama and he's no drama.
Speaker 2 (52:19):
That's not as I think God truly, thank God for
real didn't need that for myself.
Speaker 1 (52:24):
You had a lot of fan questions, Oh.
Speaker 2 (52:26):
I did okay?
Speaker 1 (52:27):
Okay, so I'm gonna ask you a couple I know
you have to go okay, so let me just see
here because there's so many of them, Okay, being partnered
with This is from at Double A Angelus fourteen being
partnered of married pro versus a single pro Would your
relationship have been tested differently? You think.
Speaker 3 (52:46):
No, because I mean I'm very good with boundaries, so
I think.
Speaker 2 (52:50):
I would have like probably been the same.
Speaker 3 (52:52):
I think he gives a little bit more freedom.
Speaker 2 (52:54):
But I think the fact that I was with Artam
he's married, I had gotten like it was just mutual. Mutual.
Speaker 1 (52:59):
Yeah, yeah, okay. And last one at Elephants for Amy,
did you feel like your race had an influence on
the outcome of Dancing with the Stars, which is crazy? Yeah, yeah, okay, Yeah,
We're going to end on a higher note. This is
from at Sasha Farber. I'm not kidding. How cool is Sasha?
(53:20):
One to ten?
Speaker 2 (53:21):
Sasha is a twelve?
Speaker 1 (53:24):
That's right, Sasha. If you're listening, if you've listened till
the end, like, congratulations.
Speaker 2 (53:28):
Anyway, I would never forget him for his pranks during
Halloween Week pranks. He's the biggest.
Speaker 1 (53:34):
Oh he almost gave me. He actually gave me almost
a heart attack. I was dead saying yeah, Charity, thank you.
I didn't even ask you about your wedding, like are
you also getting married is a whole thing, but I'm
thank you for being so vulnerable. I really truly appreciate it,
and I think it's important for people to hear.
Speaker 2 (53:52):
So thank you. It was a good chat. You made
this like easy to talk about, even though obviously in
some parts aime, yeah that's just the the experience of
all of this. But thank you so much for having
me on.
Speaker 1 (54:05):
And yeah, thank you so much. Thank you guys so
much for listening. Please take a moment to rate and
review this episode wherever you're listening. It's key to the
podcast success as your feedback is invaluable. And remember we're
now dropping three episodes every single week Mondays, Wednesdays, and Fridays,
so make sure to look out for the next rewatch
(54:25):
episode this Wednesday. Until next time, Love you guys. Bye,
This is Sex, Lies and spray Tands with Me Cheryl
Burke and iHeartRadio Podcast. Welcome back to your favorite dancing podcasts.
So I'm so excited about our next guest because she's
the first celebrity contestant that competed last season to do
the pod. So let's just get right into it. She
is someone who has captured the hearts of many through
(00:22):
her journey on both reality television and the dance floor.
She first came into the spotlight with being a part
of the Bachelor franchise and her graceful presence and genuine personality,
she quickly became a fan favorite. Her search for love
was one of the most heartfelt and memorable stories, leading
to a beautiful and inspiring outcome. Last season, she dazzled
(00:43):
us with her incredible performances on Dancing with the Stars,
showcasing her talent and dedication. Please join me in welcoming
the beautiful Charity Lawson to the show. Hi, welcome to
the podcast, Charity.
Speaker 2 (00:56):
Hello. Oh my goodness, fun we meet you.
Speaker 1 (01:00):
I know we did run into each other I think
at the variety event right.
Speaker 3 (01:04):
Yes, yes, it was very like brief and passing.
Speaker 2 (01:07):
There's a lot.
Speaker 1 (01:10):
And I was like so nervous. I get really nervous
speaking in general. I'm used to dance obviously, so I
was like freaking out. My manager was with me, know
like oh God, like where's the nearest exit. But I
am again so happy to meet you via zoom, even
if it has to be via zoom. And let's just
(01:30):
start out with you know, we talk a lot about
Dancing with the Stars obviously, but there's a lot that
I mean, I'm an advocate for mental health and I
know you're a therapist, which is I mean, I love therapist,
like I love my gravitate towards anyone that has studied
psychology or therapy or whatever anything to do with mental health.
(01:51):
What do you think people's biggest misconceptions are about you?
Speaker 2 (01:56):
Ah, it's crazy because I feel like, obviously, like now
I'm being in the public light. I never had to
worry about that or like even think about that. But
I think, like obviously, coming off of like two big
shows like Being Bachelorette and Dancing with the Stars, I
think people really, I feel like, don't obviously know me
and they just see like what they see on TV.
(02:16):
So probably the fact that I'm like more conceited or
like my confidence comes off as like I'm entitled, and
I think that's something that I've like really had to
work hard to get over because I know, like who
I am at my core, and obviously, like the people
that are in my life, my friends, my family, and
my fiancee, they like always describe me as probably being
(02:38):
like the most humbling, most compassionate person, and so like
when I have these two contrasting views of like the
people in my life know me one way, but then
the internet or the world preceivees me another way, it's
like a clashing.
Speaker 1 (02:51):
Yeah, I'm sure, how do you stay grounded and not
gaslight yourself?
Speaker 2 (02:55):
Yeah? No, I think it's just like obviously, before I
even step into the world of like reality, like I
took a lot of time before just like really getting
to know myself.
Speaker 3 (03:04):
So I was like in therapy and actively in therapy.
Speaker 2 (03:07):
But also it's just like I think just not being
intimidated by my own confidence and being really secure in myself.
I think I know that. So it's like people have
these opposing views of who they think I am, and
I'm like that could be like the furthest thing from
the truth. So I think knowing that in itself is
like it's easy for me to discard that and be
like that makes no sense because that's like literally not
(03:27):
even accurate about myself. But also, yeah, it takes a
lot of like just reflecting, journaling, Like I mean, even
there are some times where I'm like I read something
and then I'm like is that me? And then I
have to sit with myself. But like, it is a
lot of just reflecting and journaling.
Speaker 1 (03:41):
And yeah, do you think that if you were to
get into this industry prior to you studying psychology, would
that have been different?
Speaker 2 (03:50):
Oh? Yes, one percent. I'd say that all the time.
If I was asked to be bachelor, like even two
years before, yeah what I got, I don't know, it
just would.
Speaker 1 (04:01):
Have been another version.
Speaker 3 (04:02):
Yeah, oh exactly, Yeah, yes.
Speaker 1 (04:05):
Yeah, I mean I can't imagine just being in a
house full of I mean girls, I mean I I yeah,
girl power, Like, don't get me wrong, but it's got
to be a different experience. Would you like to explain
what it was like? I mean, were you everyone's therapist.
Speaker 2 (04:21):
Or oh so obviously on the Bachelor Zach season, I
feel like when I told everyone like, oh what do
I do for a living or what did I do
before I came on the show. And it's like the
moment that people like found out I was like a therapist,
It's like, Okay, now everyone's coming to me. It's like,
how do I process this? Like can we talk this out?
Like you're just so nice and all this. So like
(04:41):
I didn't mind it, but it got to the point
where I think also producers like started to play into that,
and so then like I was like being brought in
for like girl chats and like trying to level and
ground everyone.
Speaker 1 (04:51):
I'm like, you're like this is gonna cost you?
Speaker 2 (04:53):
Yeah, Like am I getting compensated for this?
Speaker 3 (04:54):
I don't think so. So that was a little tricky.
Speaker 2 (04:58):
But I also obviously I didn't mind me because it's
just I just love helping people and trying to help
them like navigate things, and even for my own self.
Like it was chaotic, Like it's not anything like people
think it's like a sorority house. It's not like we're
obviously all dating the same guy. It's a lot of
emotions were disconnected from everything that we know in life,
So it's nothing like a sorority house.
Speaker 1 (05:19):
Yeah, yeah, it's not the glitz and glamour that we
all see. And I would say, similar to Dancy with
the Stars. But we'll get there. Let's go back to
little Charity. What was your very first memory as a kid,
you know, Oh.
Speaker 2 (05:32):
My goodness, I would have to say, like, obviously, my
dad was in the military, so we traveled a lot.
So I feel like a lot of my like earlier
memories were attainted just because we were moving a lot
and switching like you know, friend groups and stuff. But
when we moved to Fort Benning, which is in my
home are close to my hometown of Columbus, Georgia.
Speaker 3 (05:53):
I went to the elementary school on base.
Speaker 2 (05:57):
And when I say, like my pre k years, my
kindergarten years, just like the friends that you make and
the families that you meet in like, military life is
just so impactful. I wish I was still like connected,
but obviously people move, Yeah, people move a lot. But
I would have to say my best memories was just
being on that school on base and like having just
(06:17):
a really good school like school years. My teachers were
the best.
Speaker 1 (06:21):
Yeah, what is that like to be on like because
that was your first was that first the first years
of school, like the beginning years.
Speaker 3 (06:29):
Yeah really yeah, it was like pre k and kindergarten.
Speaker 1 (06:32):
Yeah, so no bullying, I'm assuming, right, No, Like when.
Speaker 2 (06:35):
I say it's like a top tier, I'm like everyone
should follow after military schools like public schools. Like it was,
I mean just top tier, like honestly, like had the
best memories experiencing just like friend groups. Like it was
very like a tight knit community because we all lived
on Yeah, we all lived on base, so it's like
we come and like encounter with each other a lot.
We played out outside a lot. So for me, it
(06:57):
was like all these like a little core things that
just shaped me obviously into who I am, but like
understanding like people and how they work, and at a
very young age, I was able to see that and
be like connected in so many ways.
Speaker 1 (07:09):
Young Your parents have been married for forty seven years.
Speaker 2 (07:13):
Yeah, for eight forty eight years.
Speaker 1 (07:15):
Yeah, I guess my research was a year later. Okay, Yeah,
that is it's insane, right, Like, yeah did that in
a way. I mean I'm sure that has a lot.
Like I come from a divorce family. I know so
many people that have come from broken families, which seems
to be kind of normal nowadays. Yeah, and I think
with that there's effects right when it comes to mental health,
but when when there's not, Like my little sister, she
(07:38):
you know, my stepdad and my mother are her parents,
and there's a huge, huge difference, Like yes, and I'm
just saying, like, she's definitely benefited from the fact that,
right she has had two stable adults in her life.
Do you think that has helped when it comes to
picking you know, before Dawton obviously, but when you were
(08:00):
dating and like the you know, boundaries that you've set
versus not or were you a rebel?
Speaker 2 (08:10):
A little bit of both, which is kind of interesting
because coming from a family where I have two like
perfect examples are not perfect, but two great examples of
of what love or what a marriage could look like. Obviously,
my parents met when they were so young and they
got married super young, so that like obviously credits them
having so many years added on. But I think just obviously,
(08:31):
like witnessing like my dad, I always say, like now
or when I stepped into the role of bachelorette, and
when I was dating, I always wanted a guy to
kind of model like the characteristics that my dad embodied,
which was like he's like the most selfless person that
I know, incredibly hard working, like so driven, compassionate, and
I was like, those are literally like all I need
and like just someone who's secure. He lets my mom
(08:53):
kind of just be her, and like my mom is
kind of similar to me. So it's like and it's
similar to I'm like, I noticed that with me and
DOT relationship.
Speaker 1 (09:00):
Yeah, it's true. You know, you end up like with
the person that reminds you of one of your parents
at least. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (09:07):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (09:07):
But also like coming from the South or living in
the South, there's like this immense pressure to like get
married young or like to be with your partner from
like high school, and so a lot of like that
for me was like, oh, the guys that I dated
in high school like kind of transitioned over to like
us rekindling things in college, and it's like everyone knows
(09:27):
each other. Yeah, yes, it's like everyone knows each other,
you know, everyone's family. So it's like people are just
like playing off of that. And I'm like, there's no
way my soulmate is in this town like circle exactly.
He is not here. And I think I learned that
the hard way. But yeah, I mean I think I
just had this dream too of like, oh my parents
(09:48):
got married young, like it could happen for me. They
stayed together so long, and so I think I like
personally even limited myself to that like idea. And I
was like, now I'm destined for more. I know who
I am as a person, and like this is not
odd that I need to see in life.
Speaker 1 (10:03):
Yeah, yeah, no, that is very healthy. Let's move on
to the Bachelor Bachelorette. So your friend was the one? Yes,
I got you on. Were you pissed?
Speaker 2 (10:15):
I was.
Speaker 3 (10:16):
I was like yes and no, But I was.
Speaker 1 (10:18):
Like you can tell me, Like initially were like you
must have been shocked. You're like, what is this phone call?
Speaker 2 (10:24):
She literally did not tell me. And it was crazy
because like the time that I got the phone call,
I had so much going on in my life, like
literally like graduating grad school. It was a week after
I graduate, like literally walked across the stage. So I'm
like packing up my life, packing up my apartment, getting
ready to move to like my next location, start my career,
and then I'm like blindsided by this like phone call
(10:44):
from a producer from a number that I didn't even have,
and they're like, are you saying.
Speaker 1 (10:48):
A three one zero.
Speaker 2 (10:49):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (10:49):
I was like yeah, I am, like what's up?
Speaker 2 (10:52):
And they're like, we got an application for you to
be on the Bachelor, and I was like, well, I
didn't submit it, so who did? And then like that's
when I found out it was my best friend And
I literally called her right after I got off that phone.
I was like, did you submit this application for me?
She was like yeah, you had no idea, no idea,
no idea none.
Speaker 1 (11:09):
She wasn't even joking, like I'm going to do this
if you don't.
Speaker 2 (11:12):
Well, okay, So the thing is like I got out
of a relationship, a really bad relationship, like a year
and a half got prior, and she was like, you
need to like just like you know, explore, like you
needed like try dating in like different capacities, different ways.
And I was like, okay, like I don't know what
that means for me, but like I'm literally at that time,
I was still like I was in Arburn, Alabama, like
a small town, finishing up grad school.
Speaker 1 (11:32):
Like I've dated everybody exactly.
Speaker 3 (11:34):
I literally have dated no, truly, I really have.
Speaker 2 (11:37):
And she was like no, I just think like you
like should be like on like a show or something.
So she casually mentioned it, but like she doesn't even
watch The Bachelor. She knows like just from like conversations
and like obviously things in the media, but she didn't
even watch the show. So I was like, what makes
you think that, like I would be the perfect candidate
for this? And she submitted it without telling me.
Speaker 1 (11:57):
That she called that one eight hundred number and that
was all his just sued it. Yeah, yeah, that's amazing. Okay,
so we talked a little bit about The Bachelor, but
now let's move on to the Bachelorette. So how long?
So Jesse Palmer was the one that announced it was live.
Speaker 2 (12:12):
Yes it was, well, it wasn't live, but it was,
and it was at the Woman Tell also our reunion
for Zach season, so I didn't know, Like I just
showed up thinking like, Okay, I'm going to do the
reunion with the rest of the other cast of girls.
Speaker 1 (12:24):
But you knew a little bit, no, like a little
I only.
Speaker 2 (12:26):
Knew because obviously they interview multiple people, so it's like
I was one of the multiple girls that they interviewed,
but like just from talks of like kind of what
like I feel like people at the time wanted, and
then obviously, like myself, like I struggled a lot with
like imposter syndrome. I was like, there's no way to me,
and so I like literally kind of discredit like discounted it,
(12:47):
like oh my gods in it. And I just like
went along to just like obviously do the interviews and
like did the whole process. But the thing is is
like obviously they don't tell you like where you stand
in all of this. It's just like you're just in
the interview and you have to wait.
Speaker 1 (13:01):
So it was the interview happening when you were still
filming for The Bachelor? Yeah, well I was still airing,
m oh airing, but you were done filming, Yeah yeah,
got it?
Speaker 2 (13:09):
Yeah done filming.
Speaker 3 (13:10):
Yeah yeah yeah it was airing.
Speaker 2 (13:12):
So yeah, I'm still like watching all this back trying
to make sense of it, and then obviously getting brought
in to do the interview, and I was like, I
don't know, like I don't even know if I'm ready,
Like I don't know what's like, what's the outcome of
this is going to be?
Speaker 1 (13:25):
How does one be ready?
Speaker 2 (13:27):
You aren't? You were literally not ready, And so I
remember just doing it, completing the interview, and I waited
and waited, and I was like, you know what, my
life cannot literally be put on hold for this show,
Like you must move on.
Speaker 3 (13:40):
And I went to the reunion and that's when they
told me.
Speaker 2 (13:43):
And obviously at that time, I did not know that
they were going to announce me at the reunion and
I was like, Lord, clearly.
Speaker 1 (13:49):
How long did you have to pack? Like how what
was the turnaround?
Speaker 2 (13:53):
It was crazy? I had, like I want to say,
I had like two weeks because mine's happened super quick.
So we had the reunion union and then I left
for filming two weeks. So Zach season when I started
filming was still airing, So that's how quick it was.
Speaker 3 (14:06):
I was like, well, I can't even finish how this
all ends.
Speaker 1 (14:09):
What a crazy story, right, Like are you thinking your
friend a little bit, just a little bit to this day.
Speaker 2 (14:15):
I am.
Speaker 3 (14:15):
I always say, like we always joke about it.
Speaker 2 (14:17):
I'm like, I credit, like, I owe you my life honestly,
because like you made it real kind of.
Speaker 1 (14:23):
At least an invite to the wedding or whatever exactly.
So I heard you say that when you're filming The
Bachelorette that you had to demand for some downtime, which
I can only imagine how. I mean, I've never done
a reality show like that. I've you know, I've done
Dancing with Stars for one hundred and five years.
Speaker 3 (14:40):
Hard.
Speaker 2 (14:40):
But we'll get to that.
Speaker 1 (14:43):
Saving the best for last.
Speaker 2 (14:44):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (14:46):
But then but it wasn't. It was like I thought
that was too much. I can't imagine like cameras waiting
for you outside the bathroom if you have time to
do any of your mental health practices like meditate or
whatever you do.
Speaker 2 (15:00):
Journal I specifically like asked for that because I knew
just from like understanding how scheduling and you know, time
worked as a contest and I was like, it's going
to be Times twenty as a lead because you get
downtime as a contestant. If you're not on a date,
you're sitting around at the house, You're like, obviously the
cameras are still there, but you have so much more
(15:21):
freedom to just kind of maneuver how you want. As
a lead, you're always being pulled, You're always being ONFS interviews, yes.
Speaker 3 (15:28):
Yes, yes, yes, NonStop.
Speaker 2 (15:30):
And it became so draining for me to the point
where I was like, I you know, I told the
therapist on staff. I was like, I need time like
to just journal in the morning. I need to like
collect my thoughts. I need to be able to go
back and like remember what happened this day because like
the time just moved so fast. You're like, wait, who
did I talk to?
Speaker 3 (15:46):
Like you know, you're just trying to have yours of everything?
Speaker 1 (15:48):
What's his name? Yeah?
Speaker 3 (15:49):
Piece everything together? And that was incredibly hard for that
for me.
Speaker 2 (15:54):
So I told them I was like, listen, I need
like at least like thirty minutes before I go in
here and makeup to like journal.
Speaker 3 (15:59):
I need to like just sit down and like have
just a zen moment.
Speaker 1 (16:02):
And they were cool, Yeah, I was.
Speaker 2 (16:04):
Like, leave me alone, don't come in, do not wake
me up until I'm done with this. Good for you
trying to say that in the nicest way possible.
Speaker 1 (16:10):
Well yeah, I mean, but also like boundaries, buddy.
Speaker 3 (16:14):
No, no, that's the thing. But you know, you know
how that is.
Speaker 1 (16:18):
I heard you say that there's there was a therapist,
which I think is brilliant. And don't you like do
you believe so like, first of all, do you use
that like did you use that to your And I'm
sure everybody uses that, right.
Speaker 2 (16:30):
Oh when I say I used her to be like, honestly,
probably still like anywhere, I adore her so much. Really
like if she wasn't on my seat, then I always like,
and I tell her this, we talked about all the time,
like I don't know how like it all would have
worked out at the end, just because you're emotionally exhausted
(16:52):
and like she was like probably the only person that
was with me from literally day one to where I'm
at now.
Speaker 1 (16:57):
The Bachelor as well. Mm hm wow that's a journey.
Speaker 3 (17:02):
Yeah, so she she knows, she absolutely knows.
Speaker 1 (17:04):
Yeah, that's amazing. Do you think that Dancing with the
Stars should provide that as well?
Speaker 2 (17:20):
I'm so glad you asked me that. I'm so glad
you have to be that.
Speaker 1 (17:25):
I've always said it like it is full on.
Speaker 2 (17:28):
I'm actually surprised, and maybe I can say this here.
I'm surprised you guys don't, like, honestly, I'm very surprised
because quite literally, yeah, I mean, while Dancing with the
Stars was great, I literally went through hell and that
with my mental health in that show.
Speaker 1 (17:42):
Let me just tell you something. This space is obviously
safe and I'm sure you've heard rumblings about this podcast,
but it's like, you know, again, with all due respect,
we're just talking about our truths and our story. So
but we love the show. There's nothing wrong, like it
could be both.
Speaker 3 (17:56):
Right, yeah as yeah for sure.
Speaker 1 (17:58):
Yeah, so yeah, feel free to say anything. You can swear,
you can punch your laptop, like whatever you need to do,
just like, don't hold in the feelings because that's not healthy.
But yeah, no, I've always wondered, like I've always in
a way pitch like there needs to be a dance doctor,
like if we want to make it all like television friendly,
but really, like I spent a lot of money and
I I mean, like I've been in therapy in my
(18:20):
whole life, even prior to the show. I'm not going
to say the show is it's because of the show,
but like, yeah, you know, like you need someone to
talk to that is not biased, and because like it
needs to be a couple's therapist, like they did this
segment many seasons ago for TV. They never aired it,
and we all went to go see a couple's therapists
(18:41):
and it was brilliant. It was brilliant and it was needed.
Speaker 2 (18:44):
Honestly, I feel like that would have like worked wonders
for everyone. But like again, like even as like an individual,
not even like coupling, like speaking out of my partner,
like as an individual, it is and it's just so much,
you know. It's like the time I'm constraints, like mentally
and physically and emotionally, they're all connected. So I literally
(19:05):
went into this and I was like, oh my goodness,
it's just gonna be like a physical like thing for me.
Speaker 1 (19:08):
Wait wait, wait wait, you didn't like Trista.
Speaker 2 (19:11):
No, I asked Caitlyn, and like, I feel like they
all like that's what I'm saying when I people ask me. Now,
there's no way.
Speaker 1 (19:17):
Caitlyn was like it's great, you know.
Speaker 2 (19:19):
She was like it's hard, but like it was almost
like it's like it's like she was very happy about it.
Speaker 3 (19:23):
Like when I tell people how hard this is, I'm like,
forget it's hard. Yeah, I'm like, I don't.
Speaker 2 (19:28):
I don't sugarcoat anything because I want I want people
to be like warned as much as possible so you
can make the best decision. And like before I even
started all of this, I was very hesitant because I
was like, I don't know if I'm going to be
able to like handle this, and Dalton was obviously like
my best supporter and biggest supporter, but he was like, yeah,
do it, Like go for it. I'm gonna be like
(19:49):
be there with you every step of the way. But like,
little did I know, Like it was like it hit
me like a ton of bricks week like three or four.
Speaker 1 (19:56):
I was like, I feel like I'm I don't know, yeah,
you know, I'm kidding, but like you did really well though,
but hold on before we even get to there to
the judges because there's a lot of different layers here.
When so when you were pitched this, were you already
doing Were you taping the Bachelorette?
Speaker 2 (20:15):
Yeah? So are not taping? I was My season was airing,
so yeah, so you had already.
Speaker 1 (20:22):
Withdotten and you did you ask him like if this
is something that you feel comfortable with.
Speaker 3 (20:27):
Or because obviously they like warn every bachelor.
Speaker 1 (20:31):
iNTS curse, they were like.
Speaker 2 (20:34):
Don't do this, and I was like, you're like, okay,
Like I'm very secure with myself but also secure in
the man that I chose and I know how he's.
Speaker 1 (20:41):
Going to hand, which is not not often.
Speaker 2 (20:43):
I know that's the thing.
Speaker 3 (20:45):
I was like, it's a very rare situation that we
have here, but I'm.
Speaker 2 (20:48):
Grateful for it.
Speaker 1 (20:48):
It's great though.
Speaker 2 (20:49):
So we talked about it a lot, like I almost
probably like irritated him just bringing it up so many
times of like just wanting to make sure because I
was like, I don't want to sacrifice like what we
just build and what we have, like for an opportunity,
like obviously this is like a once in a lifetime
and I would be honored to do it, but like
if it's going to create this like barrier distance between us,
(21:10):
I don't want that. And he was again like just
encouraging me. He was like, this is something I know
you want to do, Like you need to do it.
I'm going to be here, Like, don't worry about that.
Speaker 1 (21:20):
Honestly, did you request Ardam?
Speaker 2 (21:23):
I requested Ardam.
Speaker 1 (21:24):
I have like a list.
Speaker 3 (21:26):
I was like Ardam, Brandon Val and then Alan.
Speaker 1 (21:30):
Yeah, so Ardam was first.
Speaker 3 (21:33):
I don't think I necessarily put him like first, yeah
yah yah.
Speaker 2 (21:36):
I was just like maaze, these are the ones.
Speaker 1 (21:38):
Right, like one of the four yeah yeah yeah. And
after getting to know these like I, by the way,
fun fact, Ardam lived in my poolhouse when we were teenagers,
like this is how yoh my god. We like I
met him when he couldn't speak in like not a
one word wow. So I'm from the Bay Area, so
like we know each other. I think he's the longest
out of all the pros that I know. Yeah, it's
(22:00):
insane anyway, but out of all the pros now and
after you know, dancing with someone like Ezra, would you
say that Artam's teaching style suited you best?
Speaker 2 (22:12):
Yeah, I would have learned. I don't think I would
have learned half of what I know if I had
any other teacher. You're right, And I think people can
argue obviously like chemistry like between me and Artam, and
that's fair, but I think I like, obviously I respect Artam,
and his teaching definitely suited me the best. I think
our relationship one percent was like way more professional than
(22:33):
it was like it was like goof around like my
my banter with Ezra's day and night from me in Artam.
But I'm like, if I was have to learn, like
who's going to get me to the finals, Like it's
going to be Ardam because he is so much about
like just his work and his work ethic. Yeah, and
I'm like he doesn't play, so I love that.
Speaker 1 (22:51):
Yeah, and he's the real deal, Like I mean, I
love Ezra. I think Osra should be a pro. However,
teaching and experience when it comes to teaching, like this
is two separate things on the show. It's like if
you're a great dancer, great, like as far as the
pros go, but like if you can't teach, yours just screwed.
Like there's just no way that you're going to succeed
unless you're marrying a dancer who's been on the show
(23:11):
for many years, which is it often the case, which
is never which was not my case ever, But like, yeah, anyway,
what talk more about your guys chemistry because like I
believe that. Look, I think if for the long haul,
like if we're talking long term, this was the best
situation for you, right, and just because you have chemistry,
(23:32):
what someone doesn't mean like oh there's stuff happening after No,
but it's like either have it or you don't, And
you really can't fool anybody, do you think that? Though
he's an amazing teacher, Like I'm not even he would
agree with me as well, Like you know, at the
end of the day. Do you believe that that was
the reason why carrying Inn kept repeating herself every week?
(23:55):
I don't.
Speaker 2 (23:56):
That's the thing that's like, I don't know if it
was necessary.
Speaker 1 (23:59):
Did you feel like there was chemistry or.
Speaker 2 (24:02):
Like I guess I don't want to say no, but
I don't want to say.
Speaker 1 (24:05):
Like yes, no, But it's not offending anyone, like you
have it or you don't, you know.
Speaker 3 (24:09):
I think it's like how I describe it is like
how we viewed each other.
Speaker 2 (24:12):
We just had so much like mutual respect, so it
was more like a respect thing. It's like like a
professional relationship, like I said, so I think in that terms,
like yeah, like that part of it.
Speaker 1 (24:24):
Maybe it's like you want to Ezra, like do you
feel like you had chemistry with Ezra more in a
little in a weird but not the technique site, but
like Ezra just As like his energy, Yeah.
Speaker 2 (24:34):
Because As was just like he's young and like he's
gonna say off the wall things like Artam is like
you're hot here to like run jokes like like let's
get to work, and I'm like okay, I'm about it,
like you know, but As was like he's on command.
Speaker 3 (24:45):
He's on like tell me like your ass, yeah exactly, exactly,
like you would never would do that with anyone.
Speaker 2 (24:52):
So it's not even just a me thing, you know.
Speaker 1 (24:54):
But A was shaking his ass the way he did
what I just saw because I watched again recently. I
was dyeing dead, so I'm sure was like, can you
take or can you not do that? But he probably
didn't say that.
Speaker 3 (25:06):
We would face when he was out for COVID that week.
Speaker 2 (25:08):
We face had him like all throughout the rehearsals and
he was like I added this then.
Speaker 1 (25:12):
And was like, you're like, you're dancing with the stars
of my friend. Okay, so now let's move on to
the judges, because okay, this is the thing. It's it's
this whole formula. Whoever I keep saying this, but whoever
made this up is smart because like, damned if you
do damned if you don't write. I've tried it all
(25:34):
in twenty six seasons that I've done the show. It's like,
you know what, I'm just not gonna put my whole
life into this, Like I'm going to take it as
like a job and then not obsessed about it afterwards.
Doesn't that didn't work, And then it's like I'm going
to obsess and just care so much that didn't work,
you know, like and so then also it's television, so
then there's like a fine line. But but the difference
(25:56):
is like you can eliminate me on any other show,
but when you put your blood, sweat into your into something,
and yet you're not getting anything that you can take
back with you into the studio and work on because
the comments are just the same. It's the same comment,
and you're not even gonna call me and like tell
me off camera or like call Artam. Like they definitely
know each other, you know what I'm saying, Like I
(26:17):
have history. It's like it's got to be discouraging, right.
Speaker 2 (26:21):
Oh it was. It was probably like that became uh yeah,
the hardest part for me kind of where like all
of this like took a turn, I would say, obviously
with like Artam, and like Artem knew all along too,
obviously like how this works. But I think he was
just trying to like be like the best teacher for
me and like get me to a point like dance
(26:42):
and technique wise, but like it got to the point
where I was like Okay, this is the comment that
I'm consistently getting from the judges of like, oh, like
I need promotion, I need to like connect more. And
I'm like, yeah, like I've really never danced before, and
I don't really know what this means. And I think
even for Artum, like he was struggling, I think to
a certain point of like trying to get that out
of me, but like as you know it, it's like
(27:03):
we don't. We also don't have enough time for that,
Like I don't know. I think for me, it was
going to take a lot longer than just like three
days for me to like really for that to like sing.
So the music, That's what I'm saying on like certain songs,
like if it was more upbeat, like I obviously performed
better like you saw like the Chaw Chaw dance off
with like Soshi, Like I did so much better than
I did any other day. Like it's crazy, It's like
(27:23):
certain things just made sense for me.
Speaker 1 (27:25):
But your contemporary was like I was crying when I
watch your contemporary and look did I also like I
also do rewatches and I'm not even gonna be fully
transparent with you. Yes, there were times where I wanted
you to be more into your partner than to the camera.
But again like unless like these are fine details that
you do not really unless your partner hounds you. And
(27:48):
by the way, yeah, so much easier because I'm not
in it. Like when I'm in it with somebody, you
don't have a mentor with you, which is another thing
they should add, like they need a third eye, like
how the hell are we supposed to see everything when
we're the one teaching it and dancing with you and everything. Yeah,
and look, and I'm pretty sure because I know this production.
(28:08):
They were like looking to bink into camera one. You're
like what, like my head is this way? And then
you're like you want me to yes this Like you're
like this is not natural?
Speaker 2 (28:18):
No, yes, I remember like expecting you saying that. It's
so funny because like obviously camera blocking. They're like this
camera looking and I would come up to arm and
I was like, I don't know which camera to look at.
He was like, don't worry about that, and I was like, Okay,
you're right, honestly, like don't worry about it. But it's
just like I got so in my head of just
trying to do like these little things, cause I knew,
like for myself, like it's almost like you see like
(28:40):
a clock countdown and it's like each week I'm like
I'm running out of time. I'm running out of time.
I'm not doing enough, And like that was so so
crushing for me of like telling myself or even like
having those thoughts in my head of like I'm not
doing enough when I knew that I was actually doing
my all of like what I was capable of and
what I had the resources to work with at the time. Yeah,
I can't believe.
Speaker 1 (29:01):
You that you haven't danced, like at all.
Speaker 2 (29:03):
You literally never dance. And Ardam said that, like, I
mean some of these things are left out, but if
you like look at interviews Ardam did after the show,
I'm like, I wish this was in our package, but
like maybe the audience would understand that. But it's like
he would say, like he saw the first time that
I walked in, he was like, no, this girl's like
too left me, like I don't, like I don't have
any dance experience. And it was such a journey for him,
(29:26):
Like I think I helped him this whole season too,
of just like really having to teach me really having
to like connect so much past just like technique wise,
but yeah, it was really really hard.
Speaker 1 (29:38):
Okay, let me just tell you. But if I don't
feel like if I'm dancing, like they're giving me a
country song and I have to do a ramba, I
am so sorry. I am not inspired, Like I'm just
not inspired by that. And yeah, for example, like with you,
when I saw all of your dances the second time around,
there were a few that popped out. The contemporary was
one because there was a story, but you're also like,
(30:01):
did you ever tell Ardam like you need to give
me a story or like or I did? Was that
something because you're not an actor but actors do that
a lot.
Speaker 2 (30:09):
Yeah, that's the thing. It was like that was the
biggest like conversation piece this season of like Tyrty's like
the one that hasn't done television enough or she hasn't
done acting, like she doesn't have any training. But like
I would tell Ar was like I connect when there's
like lyrics or things that I'm like, Okay, let's create
a Whitney Houston. Yes, like there's a story that I
can like you know, apply to something either in my
(30:32):
life or I can like kind of transport myself there.
I couldn't do that with all the songs. And I
even remember, like Alfonso, he gave me like homework that
actually helped me. Think it was I forget which week,
maybe like week eight or nine, But.
Speaker 1 (30:45):
He's gonna be a pro dancer next season.
Speaker 3 (30:47):
Yeah he's the best.
Speaker 2 (30:49):
But he gave me like homework to be like like
take each lyrics of the song and like apply like
the dance move, but like don't think about the move,
think about like how it connects your life, and like
that was like I wish I was like why didn't
you tell me that five weeks earlier? But like it
was helpful for me, so like I think like having
those little things or those little devices to help me
(31:09):
in the dance obviously made the world of a difference.
But yeah, if it's not the right song, I just
like I don't know.
Speaker 3 (31:15):
I'm just like okay, I'm just doing it.
Speaker 1 (31:18):
Did you ever say, like, look, guys like you want
feeling like you're gonna have to change my music? Was
Ardam good with that? Did he like I because you
have to you have to like pick and choose on
the show, right, Yeah, I guess you can't change every week,
like there's right.
Speaker 2 (31:32):
I don't even think I ever. I think there was
maybe one song that I think, like the tempo or something,
we were like, this isn't gonna work and we ended
up switching. But that only happened like once once or
twice every other song. I was just like, okay, like
I like kept and I didn't want to be like difficult,
which I hate even saying I didn't want.
Speaker 1 (31:49):
To get real. They couldn't say anything else. No, oh no,
I'm so sorry.
Speaker 2 (31:56):
Okay, thank you, actually, thank you for saying that, because
I was going to tell you that.
Speaker 1 (31:59):
What else they're gonna say your arm? Like what, it's
perfect girl, you try it, you should.
Speaker 3 (32:03):
Say literally that. I was like, maybe that's it.
Speaker 2 (32:06):
Maybe it's just like the technique is really ten out
of ten and we we have to just only talk
about that.
Speaker 1 (32:10):
I mean, are they not going to have another Bachelorette
win or like right, like wasn't ardam didn't he? Just
like I don't know. Yeah, this is all conspiracy theories,
and I love my conspiracy theories. I'm just saying this
is true. But after being on for seventy five thousand seasons,
like there's patterns that I'm seeing. Yeah, okay, So did
Carrie ever tell you off camera like what I mean
(32:32):
by feeling something.
Speaker 2 (32:33):
It's like it was only until like the finale when
we had like the Redemption dance, which she was a person.
Speaker 3 (32:40):
Yeah, she like came in she was.
Speaker 2 (32:42):
Like the coach for that week, and that's the only
time I really ever got to like talk to her
about like what that.
Speaker 1 (32:49):
Meant and like obviously, like did it make sense?
Speaker 2 (32:52):
It did, but like I think like a lot of
it was like she like even felt like just like
the trust or like the connection between me and Artem
And granted I trust Artem, like that's not the case,
but I think it was like trusting him like on
a vulnerable level with like my emotions. Like that was
the piece I think she picked up on. And I
was like, you guys keep saying like it's like about acting,
it's about performing, But I'm like, yeah, so, like there's
(33:13):
so many more layers and pieces to this that everyone
is literally missing the mimo like everyone's missing it exactly.
Speaker 1 (33:19):
I got it and that's all that matters really, But
also it's not acting, Like there's not one time I've
danced out there that I'm like, let's pretend to be happy.
It's like if I'm pissed and I'm dancing a jive,
I'm dancing a pissed jive. Like it's just the way
it is, Like I can't and it's the music. It's
like it's all the music anyway. Yeah, you experience bullying
(33:50):
a lot, Okay, I first of all, like it's shocking. Yeah,
can you say more?
Speaker 2 (33:57):
Is it shocking? I don't know, Like that's it. And
I'm like I don't know if it's shocking. I think
to a certain degree it was like expected. And that's
why I say, like coming off a Bachelorette like I
was like, oh, I can handle it because I mean
obviously we know like that's a very like conservative very
like go in Gun's a.
Speaker 1 (34:14):
Lace very conservative.
Speaker 2 (34:15):
Yeah, they're very harsh, and so I was like I've
experienced on the Bachelor Bachelorette. I'm good and so like
I came into like the Dancing with the Star Wars
fan base and I was like, this is going to
be a piece of cake, and like only to be
like almost to the point where it was like so
much worse than Bachelor and Bachelorette. Yeah, like to the
point where I was getting like death threats for like existence,
what Yeah.
Speaker 1 (34:38):
For what for?
Speaker 2 (34:39):
What for not performing enough? For not for being conceited,
for being entire seated, for being the biggest bitch on
the cast. No, it's crazy, Like I'm telling it. I'm
telling you this, and not for anyone who doesn't know,
Like I'm saying this too, Like this is the first
time I'm like openly talking about it, because I would
just the only thing I've ever shared in terms of
like the treatment that I got on the show was
the statement that my brother put out at the end
(35:01):
of the season.
Speaker 1 (35:02):
By the way, he's amazing your brother, he is.
Speaker 3 (35:04):
No, I love him so much.
Speaker 2 (35:05):
But I never talked about it because it got to
the point where I was like, I have to choose
to protect my piece and not even give any like
attention to this. It was so damaging.
Speaker 3 (35:15):
Night and Night Out was so terrible.
Speaker 2 (35:18):
Oh yeah, it was awful to the point where I
even had to, like I talked about it with art
like nobody knew, the pros didn't know, Like nobody knew
what was going on until I was like, go, just
go look at my comment whenever my posts or like
something about me and Artum is shared on the Dance
and with the Stars page, Oh, it's.
Speaker 1 (35:34):
On the Dancing with the Stars page.
Speaker 2 (35:36):
Oh, and then my personal So whenever I posted something personal,
like if I posted a dance, I like blocked and
filtered my stuff to where like I did not have
that come on. But if you go in the actual
Dance with the Stars.
Speaker 1 (35:46):
Page, did they not block or filter?
Speaker 2 (35:48):
Of course not. I'm sorry, of course, what m m.
Speaker 1 (35:51):
That is not okay?
Speaker 2 (35:53):
Yeah, so you.
Speaker 1 (35:54):
Didn't feel protected obviously.
Speaker 2 (35:56):
Yeah, so that was like the big that that's where
like the emotional and mental came in. It was really hard.
So I had to like tell Artem I was like,
this is like, unfortunately, what we're dealing with and what
we're up against. Like if you look in comparison to
every other contestant on the season, they don't have this
underneath their comments, like of course obviously Harry. But it
was like because obviously Harry, and like the dancing like
(36:18):
ability and then just like proficiency of where he was
at at a certain week.
Speaker 1 (36:21):
And his reputation and all of it, you know, wheah,
which is nothing similar to.
Speaker 2 (36:26):
Yeah, I'm like I'm not going out there. I'm not
forgetting my dances. I'm performing. I'm just literally existing. But
like being called, yeah, being called like a bitch, being
called I'm so conceited, I'm entitled. I have the most
like stanked up attitude on the on the it was
so like insane to like see and I didn't understand,
(36:46):
and I was like I don't know like how to
like maneuver and navigate this, and like Artem, sorry, like
kind of makes me emotional.
Speaker 4 (36:54):
Okay, Okay, I'm so sorry. Sorry, No, no, don't apologize. Please,
this is horrendous.
Speaker 1 (37:04):
Act is horrible, Like I can't even like you would
think that the comments would be shut off.
Speaker 2 (37:10):
Yeah, it got to the point where like I had
to tell Artem and he was just like so confused,
like he didn't even like he didn't even know because
I just like kind of.
Speaker 1 (37:18):
Can't talk to the executive.
Speaker 2 (37:20):
Yeah, to a certain point, but at that point, I
think it was just like it was too far gone.
Speaker 1 (37:26):
My god, this is so crazy to me.
Speaker 2 (37:28):
Yeah, but that's why I said, it's not really surprising
because like I mean, someone like messaged me and said
like the same thing kind of happened to like Simon
when she competed, and I was like, it's just honestly
a trend, which is kind of frustrating, but like, I mean,
I'm only speaking out about my experience and like how
I feel, like obviously like just being in existing, but
(37:50):
also like the difference that I have and go through
this life as like.
Speaker 3 (37:54):
A black woman and being on a reality TV show.
It's like the same things are just not protected.
Speaker 1 (37:59):
Like this is the difference. I think, like when Vivica
Fox was on, it was seasoned. Yeah, there was no
such thing as social media, but I do remember like
these message boards were cruel, like cruel, so maybe it's similar.
The thing is, I just like I stopped. I don't
scroll anymore because it really messes with my.
Speaker 3 (38:15):
Mental I know. That's literally, Yes, when.
Speaker 1 (38:21):
You're on a show like Dancing with the Stars, of
course you're scrolling, like of course we all want feedback
and of course we focus on you know, but that's shit,
Like I'm so sorry, I'm not even saying that you
only focus on the No, no, no, that is not okay.
And I'm just like really upset at the way production
(38:41):
didn't protect or protect you or at least hear you, Yeah,
did you talk to the exact you talked to Dina.
Speaker 2 (38:49):
Or I did a little bit about it, But I
just like I think I just tried at that point. Yeah,
I tried to just have like the the best attitude
I could about it, but really like obviously the art
and like he was great and then and he really
did like offer as much support as he could, and
he like obviously came to my defense at the end
of the season, which I'm like incredibly grateful for. But yeah,
(39:10):
I mean it was just this whole thing of like
I just had to like suppress it, and like honestly
got to the point where I'm like I'm just trying
to survive, like I'm just trying to like make it
out out of the season.
Speaker 1 (39:19):
Yeah, I know that feeling for different reasons, but yeah,
this is where the therapists would have come in.
Speaker 2 (39:26):
And this is what I'm saying, Like I'm only like
advocating for that and speaking out about that because I'm like, sure,
God forbid, someone else has to go through this and
then they're like just you know, like stuck in this rut.
Like I literally and I'm telling you this, I told
dot in this like there was weeks where I come
home from rehears and I'm like, I literally don't even
like I hope I forget my steps and like I
get voted all like I did. Yeah I know that.
Speaker 1 (39:47):
I mean one season I asked, I begged, I said,
can you please vote me? All They're like, sorry, we don't.
Speaker 3 (39:53):
Yeah, like literally and it was and.
Speaker 1 (39:56):
That was like, oh it was not worth it anymore.
Speaker 2 (39:58):
Yeah, it's like a really dark, dark place and my god,
but like the biggest thing was like I got and
told me it's just like I work this hard and
like I know, I'm like, yeah, it would be defeating
and so fusherting looking back on it. If I knew,
I like just quit or like just walked out, and
I would be really upset with myself, which I'm grateful
that I stuck it out, but yeah, yeah, to get
to get creasifact for just existing in your character on
(40:20):
the show, which didn't even match up, I don't know,
Like I'm like, this is a competition.
Speaker 1 (40:25):
On top of it, the judges are not encouraging.
Speaker 2 (40:28):
Yeah, I was like, this is a competition show. If
I'm supposed to just walk around and just be like
la la la la la, like I'm sorry, but like also,
I just felt at times that my confidence and like
my work ethic was interpreted as like I think that's
where like the viewers kind of got the whole idea
and like concept of like, oh, she is entitled, she
is like you know this, she has this very like
(40:49):
bitchy above me attitude. But I'm like, no, I'm working
hard because I don't want to like go home. I
don't want to like be worse and where I came
in and started off. So I'm like, if that is
intimidating to y'all, then I'm sorry. That's a you thing,
not a me thing. Like you don't have to like me,
you don't have to like my dancing, but one thing
you are, you're going to respect me. And that's just it,
like good for you.
Speaker 1 (41:07):
Did you ever like call them out?
Speaker 2 (41:10):
No, because I don't want to give them an attention
to it. I look at it. Yeah, I was just
like I'm.
Speaker 1 (41:13):
Not even kind to be tempting though it is.
Speaker 2 (41:16):
Oh listen, I'm like that's my big nap shot that
yeah go off, Like yeah, I should just out some
of the people that are just like being so nasty, but.
Speaker 1 (41:24):
You're handling it. I mean, honestly, the fact that you
didn't react, I mean, it's so hard. But do you
think the packages have a lot of influence in the politics.
I would say that the packages are part of the politics,
and I would want to pay that it's more important
than your dance.
Speaker 2 (41:39):
Yeah, And I didn't realize that until yeah, like halfway
in I think week six, that's when I started really
fasing off and like how the things that were being
shown in my package was always me talking about like
my scores. But I was like, okay, that's the question
that literally every one of us is asked, you know
how these itear Master interviews. Yes, yes, everyone wants what
(42:00):
was the scores you got last week? I got two
sevens and two eighths, and so I'm like yes, But
then they use that and it makes seem like I
got two sevenths and two eight's, but I want to
tend this week. So then it's like shape in this
way where like you're kind of boasting and bragging about
your scores, but I'm only talking about them because you
guys asked me, and I'm not.
Speaker 1 (42:18):
A sentence like I have to repeat what your question was.
Speaker 2 (42:21):
Yeah, So that was really frustrating when I started to
see like my packages were painted in this way of like, yes,
it almost is skewing the viewers to like Chris see
me in this way of like all she cares about
is scores all she cares about, or she thinks she's
better than everyone. But I'm like, at the end of
the day, I don't think I'm better than anyone. I'm
just trying to get to the point where I feel
like I should be or like, honestly, where my hard
(42:43):
work has taken me to this point. But yeah, like I.
Speaker 1 (42:47):
Don't know so many it's so manyulative like I'm so sorry, Okay,
I've always said this, like did I'm sure Arden warned
you too, Like the order of first of all importance
is so asked backwards. So you've got like the packages,
then you're like, I have two second shots. And if
you're not smiling and like I have a natural resting
bitch face, like there's no way I can, like you
can't get it out of me. That was me, yep,
(43:09):
But it doesn't mean I'm not I'm freaking happy, like
I'm not, but I'm not like.
Speaker 2 (43:13):
Oh my god, yes, yes that was literally me, And
it's because like obviously, you know, like I'm in like
focus mode, Like I'm not. I'm so sorry. It's not
like trying to find the cameras trying to smell and
make the perfect I could care, I could give a
shit literally just trying to like, Okay, where are my
steps like get in the zone, Like that's just me,
(43:33):
Like I'm in, like honestly, competition mode.
Speaker 3 (43:35):
I'm in, like how I need to regulate myself.
Speaker 1 (43:37):
For real, And you're an athlete, Like we're athletes at
this time, like we need to focus.
Speaker 2 (43:42):
Yes, and for me to like get these clips every
time when I'm like seriously so focused, it does come
off like I have a resting bitch face. And that
would be like the same clip that was circulating social
media saying like Kurt, he's never happy when the camera's panter.
Speaker 3 (43:56):
I'm like, I'm fucking tired. I'm sorry, Like like.
Speaker 1 (44:00):
I just dance a jive in a skeleton outfit.
Speaker 2 (44:02):
I am hi, Lar, thank you, I am tired. Sorry,
I'm not smiling, Like what It's the craziest like thing.
Speaker 1 (44:18):
Now that you've had some space away from the show, yeah,
do you just like how do you filter? So like
obviously unfortunately social media, Like we I know, girl, Like
I'm like, can we go back to message boards? Can
it all be illegal?
Speaker 2 (44:33):
Truly?
Speaker 1 (44:33):
Can everything be banned soon? Because like this is just
I'm just like chasing something after something that I'm just like,
what am I chasing after? Like what happened? Yea, I
was on TV for seventy five years? What happened? Like, No,
we're starting over? Okay, cool, but this is fine, But
like this is the hard part is like I do
believe that after you've been on TV for a while,
(44:54):
of course you want you're looking for the reaction, of course,
because it you know, for the most part, like especially dancing,
it's your art. Yeah you do. I don't know if
maybe I'm addicted to the negative comment. I don't know
what it is, but like it's really That's why I'm like,
I'm an addict, right, Yeah, sure, I'm an addict. And
it's either all or nothing. So like either I'm going
(45:15):
to scroll till I die or I'm just gonna stop.
And what have you done to help with your mental
health during and after the show?
Speaker 2 (45:23):
Oh? I just stopped. I completely stop.
Speaker 1 (45:25):
Yeah, like unfollowed Dancing with the Stars Instagram and all
of it.
Speaker 2 (45:29):
I have them, but I think I muted. I muted
it just like obviously, like so I don't have to
see it. Yeah, and it wasn't Yeah, I mean it
was really just like their page because of just the comments.
And then for my own self, like unfortunately, like I
got to the point where I was like I only
shared like the really major highlights. I didn't share like
anything in between, because I was like, I just don't
even want to invite like people the opportunity to come
(45:49):
on my page because it was just too much to
the point.
Speaker 1 (45:51):
Where rehearsals like yeah, like you guys are all shooting tiktoks.
Speaker 2 (45:54):
Yeah, it's too much for me to have to like
consistently and actively like be conscious of, like I need
to block this per because they left something nasty on
my page. I was like, I'm just I don't I
don't have to worry about it if I don't post,
so like there's that, but yeah, I mean obviously I
still follow like the cast.
Speaker 3 (46:10):
I love like the cast, like the pros, like it's
nothing really with them, it's.
Speaker 1 (46:14):
No they the trolls.
Speaker 2 (46:16):
Yeah, unfortunately, and then obviously how like the editing department,
how I was edited, so yep.
Speaker 1 (46:22):
And it is a powerful thing. Okay, so let's talk
about the camaraderie. First of all, Yeah, I was Tyson Beckford.
Is he as hot and is he as much of
a googer as he was portraying during the premier because
I was like, you gotta stop, like you gotta stop
jumping up.
Speaker 2 (46:35):
And down literally, yes, yes, yes, yes, and yes he
is so funny. Honestly, it's crazy because I was like
when I first saw the cast, I was like, oh,
these are the people that I think I'm gonna be
closest with, and like, honestly like it's Tyson, but I
did not like point him out from a lineup and
I and then like the first two weeks like while
he was there, we were so close, like so close,
(46:56):
and it was crazy. Yeah. No, he's just he's such
a ball of like sunshine and so funny, like you know,
just has no filter. And I'm like I love that,
Like he made everything just feel so like.
Speaker 1 (47:08):
Like just like everyone needs to chill out. It's just
a dance shop.
Speaker 3 (47:13):
He was there for a good time.
Speaker 1 (47:15):
I loved it, like look at me, look at my dancing.
Speaker 2 (47:19):
But I was like we were also sad when he
like laughed obviously, but I loved Tyson.
Speaker 1 (47:24):
So there was quickly before we do rapid Fire, there was.
There's this huge controversy right now. So there's this show
that originated this whole Dancing with Stars franchise called Surely
Come Dancing. I don't know if you've heard of it. Yes,
So right now they're under huge just like watch because
two of the dancers, pro dancers that are very popular
(47:46):
there got fired for allegedly abusing their celebrity partners. And
it's been really insane. So like my friend when I
say that these celebrities have used their platforms obviously to
talk about the PTSD, which just shows me and I
haven't read like everything in detail about what I know
is like I've been celebrities that are coming out of
the woodwork from years ago saying that they're suffering from
(48:09):
PTSD and that their solution now to this is because
they're about to go into the twentieth anniversary. So like
it's like it was supposed to be. It's a massive
it's a massive show there. It's bigger than like the
show ever was here in the States. But their solution
is to hire chaperones to be in their studio during rehearsals,
(48:33):
which is so odd to me because I'm just like,
first of all, we have our camera crew there.
Speaker 3 (48:38):
Yeah, they're they're doing it while they're there, So.
Speaker 1 (48:41):
Yeah, were they there the whole time when you were
doing the show? Like were they never not there there?
Speaker 2 (48:47):
I mean it depends on like if we had like
if we came in for maybe like then an evening
shift or like the leadership obviously they go home at
a certain point like we always practice primarily like either
in the morning or like middle of the day. They
were always there.
Speaker 1 (49:02):
Like you guys are at the dancing with the Star.
Speaker 2 (49:04):
State watching it.
Speaker 1 (49:05):
Yeah yeah yeah, and you've got like Dave the security guy,
like you've got people.
Speaker 2 (49:09):
Like everyone is there. Yeah wow.
Speaker 1 (49:11):
So like okay, can you just talk about the intensity, like,
I know you've only done one season of the show, Yeah,
why is it so intense? And what like have you
witnessed any pro dancers? Just like because in the heat
of the moment, like, of course we're going to fight,
but obviously there's no excuse for abuse, right, Like absolutely.
Speaker 3 (49:32):
I think that.
Speaker 2 (49:32):
I mean for me, like to even hear that, it's
like really disheartening. And I can say, like I never
had like abuse, and I don't think anyone on our
season ever did that, but like that's like really fortunate,
and yeah, I can only imagine because that would just
probably be that would just I would have to walk
away from.
Speaker 1 (49:49):
The show real.
Speaker 2 (49:53):
But I think it's like, yeah, I mean obviously there's
like disagreements or I think even just like in teaching strategies.
Speaker 3 (49:59):
I think that was probably one of the things.
Speaker 2 (50:01):
That was like really brought up a lot on our
season of just like like certain drills that like we
would have to do or things like that to like
get something like mastered in our brain. But it was never, yeah,
like it was never to the point where it's like, oh,
this is like abusive, like or this is something that
like I'm going to go home and like be like
extremely traumatized.
Speaker 1 (50:21):
Front Like you didn't get kicked by Art of like
oh my god, now this is what happened over there.
One of the pro dancers kicked.
Speaker 3 (50:28):
That's awful.
Speaker 1 (50:31):
Art would never or wouldn't kick anything like not even a.
Speaker 2 (50:34):
Wrong That's what I'm saying. He's too gentle, you know.
Speaker 1 (50:36):
But like that's what like these allegations and look like
from my experience, it's just interesting because like I think
it's starting to unveil itself. And also like let's not
get it twisted, like the pro dancers have a lot
of pressure, but there's no excuse for abuse, Like I
don't give a shit who you are.
Speaker 2 (50:52):
Never I don't think it's ever really been that serious.
Speaker 1 (50:55):
I'm so sorry for real, it is just a dance show. Yeah, right,
I frustrating. It's like it's both Okay, what do you think?
One more question? Because you're a therapists, Yeah, what's the
psychology you think behind the show? What is the psychology?
Like have you thought about why certain things happen?
Speaker 2 (51:13):
Yes? And no, Well, I think pairings obviously like pairings.
I think it's a lot less with like personality types.
I think it's more like obviously like work ethic and
what they know. And I think I like, I think
I kind of like paired myself unintentionally with Ardam because
when I like first initially was like brought in for
like just the interests of the show and like talking
(51:35):
about it and who I would want, I was like,
I really am a hard worker and I'm extremely competitive.
So then like I was like, after like knowing that,
I'm like, who were like the most like outwardly like
we know that those are their personality types or work
ethics types that are milk pros on the show, And
I was like val Alan Ardam, I was like, they're
like the ones that are like I literally was like, okay,
I think I set myself up for that, but with Ardam,
(51:57):
I would have to say one hundred percent, like after
seeing us work together and even my parents said this,
they're like my mom was like, you got paired with
him because you guys have the same like work ethic
totally is like very about his very professional, like comes out,
works hard, and.
Speaker 1 (52:11):
I realized that the best one, like for real, Yeah, I.
Speaker 3 (52:14):
Literally realize that. So I think, like, obviously.
Speaker 1 (52:16):
Work and no drama and he's no drama.
Speaker 2 (52:19):
That's not as I think God truly, thank God for
real didn't need that for myself.
Speaker 1 (52:24):
You had a lot of fan questions, Oh.
Speaker 2 (52:26):
I did okay?
Speaker 1 (52:27):
Okay, so I'm gonna ask you a couple I know
you have to go okay, so let me just see
here because there's so many of them, Okay, being partnered
with This is from at Double A Angelus fourteen being
partnered of married pro versus a single pro Would your
relationship have been tested differently? You think.
Speaker 3 (52:46):
No, because I mean I'm very good with boundaries, so
I think.
Speaker 2 (52:50):
I would have like probably been the same.
Speaker 3 (52:52):
I think he gives a little bit more freedom.
Speaker 2 (52:54):
But I think the fact that I was with Artam
he's married, I had gotten like it was just mutual. Mutual.
Speaker 1 (52:59):
Yeah, yeah, okay. And last one at Elephants for Amy,
did you feel like your race had an influence on
the outcome of Dancing with the Stars, which is crazy? Yeah, yeah, okay, Yeah,
We're going to end on a higher note. This is
from at Sasha Farber. I'm not kidding. How cool is Sasha?
(53:20):
One to ten?
Speaker 2 (53:21):
Sasha is a twelve?
Speaker 1 (53:24):
That's right, Sasha. If you're listening, if you've listened till
the end, like, congratulations.
Speaker 2 (53:28):
Anyway, I would never forget him for his pranks during
Halloween Week pranks. He's the biggest.
Speaker 1 (53:34):
Oh he almost gave me. He actually gave me almost
a heart attack. I was dead saying yeah, Charity, thank you.
I didn't even ask you about your wedding, like are
you also getting married is a whole thing, but I'm
thank you for being so vulnerable. I really truly appreciate it,
and I think it's important for people to hear.
Speaker 2 (53:52):
So thank you. It was a good chat. You made
this like easy to talk about, even though obviously in
some parts aime, yeah that's just the the experience of
all of this. But thank you so much for having
me on.
Speaker 1 (54:05):
And yeah, thank you so much. Thank you guys so
much for listening. Please take a moment to rate and
review this episode wherever you're listening. It's key to the
podcast success as your feedback is invaluable. And remember we're
now dropping three episodes every single week Mondays, Wednesdays, and Fridays,
so make sure to look out for the next rewatch
(54:25):
episode this Wednesday. Until next time, Love you guys. Bye,
Host
Cheryl Burke
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