December 3, 2015 • 40 mins
In part two of the series on HIV/AIDS, Chuck and Josh explore how the battle against the disease is being fought and won thanks to new treatments and possible cures.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to Stuff you should know from house Stuff Works
dot com. Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh Clark,
There's Charles W Chuck Bryant. Uh, nobody's in here with us,
so it's just two of us and you, dear listener.
We're just free Leal and Bob Dylan whoever that is
(00:24):
Bob Dylan? Who come on? And um this is part
two of two of a special two part series that's
right on HIV aids. Yeah, if you didn't listen to
first one, I would suggest you do that. Yeah, you're
you're gonna be lost. There's probably gonna be a lot
of in jokes and referential jokes back to the first one.
We explained it in the first one. Yeah, that's very
(00:46):
important and like the actual nuts and Bolts disease, some
skip ahead, don't be lazy. UM So Chuck we left
off you were talking. We talked originally about UM, you know,
the different varying levels of risk depending on the type
of intercourse, depending on the tie of UM uh group
you remember of UM. We talked about how it works,
where it came from, what what could possibly be left
(01:09):
to talk about as far as HIV can is concerned.
There's a lot. Oh yeah, yeah, because we did not
touch on and I know you're being coy because I
see all your notes in front of you. Oh yeah,
look at all. But one thing we didn't talk about
that we're going to start with is uh treatment. Yeah,
that's a big one. That's a big one. Uh you
want to go and talk about the AIDS cocktail? Yeah. So. Um.
(01:32):
Back in a very very very famous basketball player named
Irvin Magic Johnson played for the l A Lakers, announced
that he was retiring from the NBA because he had
been diagnosed with HIV. I remember the day. That was
a huge deal. I was at Georgia Southern for some
weird reason that weekend. That is weird. It was a
(01:52):
big deal. Um. I mean you talked I think last
episode about Easy catching it and you know that was
that was a big deal. This was probably even bigger.
I think Magic Johnson was a bigger name than Easy.
Were more widely recognized him among more people. He was
a sports figure, he was straight what the heck is
going on? And I remember thinking, like many people at
(02:13):
the time, oh my gosh, Magic Johnson is dying. Yes,
I think a lot of people, most people who are
familiar with this thought, well, he's a goner in a
couple of years. But he kept living, and he kept living,
and he kept living. He came back and played more basketball.
Even I didn't know that, and you gotta be pretty
fit for that, sure, And he kept living. And everybody thought,
(02:35):
what the heck happened with Magic Johnson? And it turned
out that he had access to what's now known as
the highly active anti retroviral therapy a k A HEART,
which is now the standard of treatment for HIV um
and he had access to it a couple of years
before it became widespread in the I think, and it
(02:57):
has helped keep him alive. He recently he was thirty
two when he announced that he was diagnosed with HIV,
and he turned fifty six and two. It's a very
very long lifespan, especially for somebody who was diagnosed in
the early nineties when people were still like, what is
going on here? So correct? Uh, Magic Johnson got a
(03:18):
head start. Not because he's super famous. Well, that had
something to do with it. I think I'm very rich, well,
but he was he was willing to It was still
in the in the experimental phase at that point. Yeah,
but I'm sure there were plenty of HIV patients who
are like, do whatever you need to do to cure me,
but didn't have the money, so he got a jump
on it. But he has not. I think a lot
(03:40):
of people think that he is getting some other special
treatments that no one else is getting, or he's paying
his way into something. It supposedly there's a Kenyan witch
doctor rumor. Yeah, he's getting the same treatment that other
people are getting. And there are plenty of people that
have lived much longer than him. Oh yeah, and uh,
he's just the most famous. Uh, and that's a good
(04:01):
thing because he's HIV activists and activists. Yeah yea, not
to disparage anything about magic Jacks, and he definitely took
that that label at a time when it was that
was a gay disease, and uh, he became an HIV activist.
We should say specifically, he does not, never has had aids.
(04:22):
His um T helper cell count never got to the
UM two hundred thousand or less mark. So he's HIV
positive and he is still UM Like we said in
the last episode, it's a chronic disease because reservoirs developed
UM and I believe it was a couple of years
between diagnosis and treatment for him, So those reservoirs had
(04:44):
a chance to get a foothold, but he got it
early enough that he his lifespan is it's it's basically
that what was it twenty four years that he's been
alive since diagnosis. That's pretty normal for people who were
treated with the hard cocktail in a reasonable time after
being uh diagnosed, which they're finding that window of time
(05:06):
is intensely important. Oh yeah, we're gonna get to that man.
That was a great article ascent. So we're talking heart. Yeah,
heart or cart or just art whichever you want to
call it. I call it art with or heart with
the double A. I call it the AIDS cocktail. Oh yeah,
that's another word for uh. So, each one of these
drugs and we talked about in part one is very
(05:28):
specific to its task um to basically disrupt as many
stages of the process as possible. Uh, should we go
through these um in r t I S nucleo side
reverse transcript as inhibitors, they basically blocked the ability to replicate. Yeah,
(05:51):
remember the reverse transcript as takes the r n A
instructions for the viral UM creation and turns it into
d NA, which is then inserted into the c D
four plus T cell nucleus. Right, so you block that.
It's a big problem for the HIV virus. It's a
big problem. It is UH in n R T I
(06:15):
S non nucleoside reverse transcription inhibitors, they disable a protein
another protein requiring it to replicate another disruption p I
S prote s inhibitors, So proteas was UM that was
the one that actually cut the polypeptides into their individual components. So, yeah,
(06:36):
you had a long chain of enzymes that made up
these viruses. That's the party didn't get right, and then
you cut them up. So the thing that cuts them
up isn't there. You just have all these long chains
and they build up and it's basically like um lucy's
running the chocolate factory assembly line or something there. Uh.
Then you have entry fusion inhibitors. They blocked the ability
(06:58):
to enter those c D for our cells to begin
with UH, and then finally integrays inhibitors UM once they
get in that c D four cell. UH. We talked
about the insert of that genetic material, and it basically
blocks the ability to do that. So the current cocktail
recommended cocktail are two in r T I s in
(07:20):
the shaker, one in a r T I and the
p I and then either a integrays inhibitor or a
right tone neighbor, which I don't know what that is,
do you know, let's just say it's the key. Let's
say it's the the bidders in the cocktail and makes
it right. You put it all in there, you shake
(07:41):
it up. You've got your AIDS cocktail. Once you put
that into place, if you catch it early enough, you
can bring your mortality rate just about to normal. Yeah.
Like it's just it's a chronic disease. Yeah. Yeah, And
and your immune system will probably not become so compromise
that you're gonna from something. You need to be on
(08:02):
it for life. Uh. And everyone is supposed to be
on this cocktail. Uh. Although if you have b um,
have a recent CD four count below five, or if
you are pregnant, then you are given a priority. And
it's all gonna cost you about ten to twelve thousand
dollars a year, although that is supposed to increase. And
(08:24):
the reason why you have to stay on it indefinitely
because we said in the last episode that um HIV
produces reservoirs of inactive varyans that just spread throughout the
body and accumulate. And even when you're treating what amounts
to one outbreak, another one can come very soon afterward.
And that's what makes it chronic. Right with heart it
(08:46):
will eventually get all these reservoirs, but it takes I
think we said sixty to eighty years. It's a very
long time, right. So there's been some suggestions as to
how to eradicate UM this disease a little faster, yet
different ideas, which is great. I mean, they're really smart.
(09:06):
People are coming up with different strategies. One of them
is kind of nuts. But also which one the one
that uses pro Stratton I believe is what it's called.
It basically goes in and says, um, oh, you're an
inactive HIV, so well, I'm going to activate you. It's
basically making an HIV outbreak take place, but you're doing
(09:28):
it while you're under heart care, right. Yeah. The way
I thought of it was, it's like flushing out those
invisible reservoirs, but the only way to flush them out
is to activate them to get them going. So the
T cells actually know it's there. So that scary sounding
it is that the heart treatment also disrupts their function,
so it starts them up, and apparently they don't stop
(09:50):
and go back to sleep or go dormant again once
they start up, so it starts them up. The heart
treatment um keeps them from doing what they want to
do normally. And then also the cell that they're infecting
will die sooner than later and just get it over with.
So it's basically a way they're trying to figure out
to accelerate an HIV infection while in the presence of
(10:13):
highly active anti retroviral therapy. So it keeps you from
actually dying from this accelerated HIV infection. It's pretty cool. Yeah,
So that's one strategy. Does even that they call it anything,
that should call it something cool? Uh the gun Slinger, Yeah,
the gun Slinger hid. All right, I think we should
get to this next. This is uh. You sent an
(10:36):
awesome article from the Pacific Standard called getting to zero
very close to a cure for AIDS, and the city
of San Francisco is doing something. Uh there, they're pretty
radical out there in San Francisco. Sure you know all
those hippies out there. So what they're trying to do
is they're trying to make their city the first city
(10:56):
with no new infections, no deaths, and no stigma. And
they called the program getting to zero, and they're doing
this in a in a lot of ways. Um, some
of the background here is there. Historically over the past
few decades hasn't been a ton of money allocated toward
finding a cure for AIDS. Yeah, and not because for
(11:16):
various reasons. I think a lot of people, especially initially
are like, well, because it was gay disease, yeah, I
think is its spread out and started infecting more non
gay people and more non gay white people. It started
to get a lot more funding, but it also didn't
get a lot of funny because a lot of people
were like, we can't cure this, it's an incurable disease. Yeah,
(11:37):
and I think, um, I think cynics might also say, like,
it's you make a lot more money to keep people
on drugs for life than you do caring something. But
from what I could tell, the main reason was because uh,
it was such a new scary thing. They put all
of their efforts into trying to save people who got HIV.
(11:59):
And coming up with these these this drug cocktail. However,
things are changing, which is good. Um. In two thousand
and eight and two thousand nine, that was a very
cool case. Timothy ray Brown. He was, Yeah, the second
Berlin patient. There was another one in the mid nineties. Yeah,
(12:19):
there was, I know everything. That was an anonymous Berlin
patient in the mid nineties who I think, uh got
HIV and then no longer had HIV. But what's up
with Berlin? I know, seriously, it's cool city. But Timothy
ray Brown was a special case. He's an American that
(12:42):
was living there as a translator. HIV positive and started
taking medications. Uh, and then about a decade later find
out he had leukemia. So his doctor, very clever person,
Gero Hooter or Hero, call him Hero. I think Hero.
(13:02):
He said. He had a very weird unique I D idea.
He said, why don't we see if we can take
there are these people out there one percent of Caucasians, Yeah,
one percent of people who have a protein Caucasian people
uh CCR five, which basically makes them immune to HIV.
They lack that protein. Yeah, that's a protein on the
(13:23):
surface of your t helper sell that the HIV virus
docks with can doc can infect and very few people
have this one percent. He said, why don't we try
and find someone like that who can donate their bone
marrow which is where stuff like that is produced, and
to this guy and basically basically replace his immune system
with with this one percenter and not that kind of
(13:46):
one percenter. He's like, I'm gonna be rich. I got
rich bow. So he did that. They found someone UH
that had that that was a good match, and it worked.
It worked like he was funk only cured of HIV
I think like fully cured. Is was like, they keep
testing him and testing him. This is I think two
thousand eight or two thousand nine UM, and they testing
(14:09):
no signs UM. I don't know that enough people have
been cured of HIV AIDS so that they It's like
with UM with cancer. I think if you're five years
without UM any kind of growth, it's considered remission. I
don't think they have a standard like that yet. UM.
But so they keep testing this guy and he's it's
not coming back. These reservoirs are not becoming active again.
(14:32):
It doesn't appear that he has HIV or AIDS any longer.
And The doctor was excited, obviously, but he also knew like, well,
we obviously can't go around replacing you know, people's immune
systems with these one per cent. But what it did
was it kick started new hope and now all of
a sudden, all of a sudden, there was new funding
for trying to find a cure. And it was what
(14:53):
they call a proof of concept. I think we mentioned
last episode it showed that AIDS can be cured. Yeah,
before this, only about three percent of AIDS and HIV
funding went to cure research. Um. Now there are new
grants totally fourteen point six million a year in Obama
in two thousand and thirteen said you know what, how
about another hundred million towards a cure over three years?
(15:18):
What is that funny? It's just what a hundred million
used to be and what it is today. You know. Yeah,
it just sounds like sure, just throwing money around. Um,
go get yourself some nice funding. Uh. So we talked
to Believe in the first episode about catching it early. Um,
there's another story here. Basically, how it works now is
(15:41):
you can get diagnosed with HIV and until you're t
cell count falls below a certain number, you're just like
not on any drugs, like you have to get sick
before you get treated in most cases. Is well, yeah,
that was the old I mean that's what it says
in this thing. Oh that was the old, the old. Yeah,
(16:01):
that was the old guard I got you. Yeah, the
the new the the bleeding edge right now, leading edge O,
the leading edge um is quite the opposite of that. Yeah,
Because they found if you get to it super early,
like those first few days and weeks after you get
HIV in the bloodstream is when it's most dangerous, very critical,
(16:23):
most easily spread. And they found that if people who
take these drugs right then are less likely less likely
to pass it on to a sexual partner. Here's why. Again,
one of the insidious, pernicious characteristics of HIV infection is
that inactive reservoirs build, which makes it a chronic disease.
(16:45):
And again, when you first stre exposed to HIV, your
immune system can mount a pretty decent defense on its own. Yeah,
you don't have those reservoirs just yet, right, And it's
those reservoirs that eventually overwhelm your immune system and can
lead to your death if you're treated with heart very
early on after or infection, those reservoirs never have a
chance to build and that infection that you do have
(17:06):
is helped with this extra therapy and your immune system
can defend against it. And it's these these people feel
like the time is such a critical essence that award
eighty six, which is a legendary the um United States
at least first UH dedicated AIDS ward AIDS Clinic in
San Francisco General the very cutting edge. They've led a
(17:29):
lot of treatment programs for UM HIV and AIDS over
the years, but they have this program now where they
will pay for a cab for you to be brought
from your doctor's office where you were just diagnosed to
Ward eighty six to be treated right then with heart
to begin treatment. Yeah. It's a doctor researcher called Hero
(17:50):
You hatano another hero another hero, You're right, And the
program is rapid UH, which the first letter also stands
for a rapid Yeah, I know, I don't think that's okay,
Well we'll give it to him. Rapid is the Rapid
Anti Retroviral Program Initiative for new diagnoses And like you said,
(18:10):
basically it's a treat and test and treat program where
as soon as you know you've got it. They want
to knock down any obstacle in your way, including that
first cab ride to get there and just go get
going on that stuff so you're not spreading the disease.
So we've got more on treatment and stuff like that. Uh,
and we'll get to it right after this message. All right, Chuck.
(18:54):
There's another UM. There's a group out there running around
too who are saying that they are working on an
AIDS or it's saying HIV vaccine. Yeah, you sent me
this one. UM. They are studying what are called controllers.
And these these controllers, they'll they get infected with HIV,
(19:14):
it's in their body and they never get sick from it. Yeah.
They're called long term non progressors or elite controllers, elite
of it. They prefer to be called elite controllers. Uh.
And they've estimated anywhere from one and two hundred to
one in five people. Uh. They don't think Magic Johnson
is one of these people, which we talked about. No,
(19:35):
he just responded, well the part, but there was the
thought that he might be. UM. And there's a project
called the Immunity Project. It's a nonprofit that seeks a
cure by stutting the blood of these elite controllers UM,
which I don't know why it's controversial, but I have
seen that other researchers are saying, like, don't do that,
it's not gonna work, or yeah, maybe that's it. Maybe
(19:55):
they think it's not resourced. Well, but they figured I mean,
they feel like they figured out what makes elite controllers,
what gives them that trait um. Apparently there's some proteins
that UM show these people signal proteins in their body
that that show the immune system where the best place
to attack in HIV viruses. Yeah, so that's genetic it is.
(20:19):
But it's also like it's not like there's something weird
with their own cells. It's like they're antibodies are UM
specialized to search and destroy HIV viruses, which is weird,
But that's definitely who you want to study. Why not
throw an extra hundred millionaire? Uh. This other part of
(20:40):
this article article from Pacific Standards, So it was interesting.
There was a case of the French girl she's now eighteen.
She was infected with HIV from her mother during pregnancy
or delivery. Immediately started started on the anti viral drugs.
Uh stayed on them for six years, and then she
stopped taking the medications for almost a year. Usually when
(21:01):
that happens is HIV just like really gets going again
and it's back on the move because of the reservoirs. Yeah,
it didn't happen in her case. Um, and so she
stayed off them for and she's been undetectable for twelve years.
So now they're thinking maybe one thing we can do
is get people on the drugs super soon, and then
wean them off of the drugs at a certain point
(21:23):
and see if that works. Basically like keeping good close
eye on them obviously not just being like, all right,
we'll see in a decade, let me know how it goes.
I mean, why not? So that's pretty promising too. Uh.
There's another uh potential strategy which is called shock and kill,
and that is flushing out the particles into the circulatory system.
(21:48):
So is that part of the one we talked about earlier?
I think so the pro stratton where is that the
same thing it activates dormant HIV cells to get them
to attack. I would say if it's not the same
drug or the same research group, it's the same principle,
you know, trying to awaken the sleeping beast and may
give us some big problems. Uh, Patient zero. We tease
(22:12):
that in the first episode. Yeah, I thought this was
super interesting. You referenced the book and movie and the
band played on by the book was Randy Schiltz about
the early days of AIDS and HIV, and um it
is there's now a book out called Plane Queer. Uh
and that is plane as an Airplane airplane terrible. Yeah,
(22:35):
I know colon labor, sexuality and AIDS. In the history
of male flight attendants and um, there was a man
named Guton Dougas Gayton m. I was in an a Yeah,
g A E T A N Gayton Dougas. He's Canadian
flight attendant. He's kebec Qua. It's Canadian people in compactus
(23:01):
maybe a national hero. Uh. They in this book. Basically
there was a big fear that this book wasn't going
to sell and get any attention. So the book publishing
because it's like six pages of methodical reporting on the
area of HIV eight Yeah, and um, the the the
editor now or the publisher has come out and said,
(23:23):
you know what, we kind of um resorted to yellow
journalism by allowing and leaking this supposed patient zero, this
gay flight attendant, good looking guy who was very sexually active.
He claimed to have more than partners over a ten
year span from the early seventies of the early eighties,
(23:45):
flying all over the world. Yeah, obviously it's a flight attendant. Um.
And they let the story leak to the New York Times.
Was at New York Times and New York Post. But
not only did they leak the story, they really they
really built up or overstated the guy's role as depicted
in the book too. Yeah. Basically, like this guy brought
(24:07):
AIDS to the United States. This guy is patients zero.
They they I think in the book he does compare
him to Quebec quaw typhoid Mary right away, because he did.
He did say, like I'm not gonna not have sex
or you nuts, like there are some stuff that this
guy definitely did do and he was one of the
early patients. But to lay the AIDS epidemic in America
(24:30):
at this one guy's feet it patently unfair. Yeah, and
untrue because he was not the first person. Uh he was.
They did trace early on, when they were tracing it
around the country. They labeled patients with l A as
in Los Angeles or New York like l A four
in Y three is what patient number and where they were.
(24:52):
And originally they said that his designation was OH for
out of California. Eventually that became zero. Uh. And he
unfairly pinned with spreading AIDS. He was he was part
of a smallish group, a very traveled, promiscuous gay men
that did help spread AIDS. But um, he was not
(25:14):
the reason he was not patients here. He was a reason.
He was right, but unfairly labeled. Um. But in the
end it ended up bringing a lot of attention to
it at a vital time. So that's why the conundrum,
that's why the editors of the editor of the book
is admitting and now he's saying, like you know, ultimately
it was a good move because it helped brought a
(25:37):
lot of bringing a lot of attention to this through
promotion of the book. But it was at the expense
of this one guy. And he died in um March
of kidney failure. Very sad. Uh. I think we need
one more break, correct, Yeah, and then we'll come back
and we'll talk about um. Some other celebrity who have
(26:00):
helped put a face to AIDS and the AIDS quilt. Yeah,
right for this, all right, Chuck, We're back. Yes, so
(26:32):
you tease celebrities. I love celebrities. Everyone does love celebrities,
And someone who is a celebrity who dies of AIDS
is no more important than um any other person who
dies of AIDS. But they are vital to putting a
face on things, into getting media attention and basically slapping
(26:53):
people in the face who think I can never get AIDS.
You know, easy we mentioned, Yeah, it definitely makes people.
What gives people pause? I didn't know, I don't I
didn't remember that some of these people died of AIDS.
Um Rock Hudson was a big one. Absolutely, Arthur ashe
had forgotten about that. Oh yeah, uh, Freddie Mercury. Honestly,
(27:13):
I was watching, Uh have you ever seen Queen live
in Montreal? I don't know. Maybe was he wearing um,
like white jumpsuit, white jeans and the Superman tank top.
It's just like it's like Queen's famous sponsort movie that
was on Palladium the other night. And I've seen that
thing probably a dozen times. Every time I'm knocked out.
(27:35):
Oh yeah, the Queen was great, and Freddie Murcury was
just such a rock star. Dude. It was like and
at the time when I was a little kid, I
didn't know what gay was, you know, just knew you
like Freddie Mercury. Absolutely. Yeah. I was the same kid
who drew the village people in crayon and my mom
was like, what's going on there? Um? But Freddiemurkey just
(27:55):
he still blows me away. What what a fantastic, awesome
rock star. I wonder how that he's gonna be Sasha
Baron Cohen's working on. He dropped out of that, he
came back back on baby. Well, I think he he
looks enough like him and he can do great impressions.
But he's just tall and lanky. So that's the only
thing that bothers me. It wasn't Freddie Mercury pretty tall.
(28:18):
He was a little guy. Oh really, Yeah, I didn't
know that. Yeah, spit fire, so you know whatever. It's
not like Christoph Waltz playing a guy from Nebraska into
Big Guys. Did you see that pile of do? That
movie bugged me so much every moment of it. I'm
just a nice man from the Brascot it was so
(28:40):
like he didn't even tried to copy. He didn't try
to hide his exit at all. He didn't because Tim
Burton probably wasn't even on set most of the time.
Why because he's phoning it in. Yeah he stinks now.
I did look up though, like, why in the world
did he cast him and Tim Burton? Because he got
some flak for it, and he was like, I just
it was more about the spirit of the guy, not
that he had heavy Austrian accent. Missed it a little bit,
(29:04):
Maybe re redo the character a tad then there's all
sorts of stuff you can do or um was it
Cameron Crow who cast? Um? What is her name? The
White Girl? Is an Asian character? What in it? Like
the most recent like his most recent movie? I didn't see, Yes, who?
I can't remember her names? A very famous actors the Redhead.
(29:27):
Yes from Birdman. Yes she plays an Asian character. Yes, yes, really,
all right, I'm gonna to look that up. Yeah, let's
go read about it after this. Alright, there was the
one tangent for the two parter. Yeah, we got a
lot in there. So back to celebrities who have passed
from aids Um Liberacci of course. Uh, Gia. That was
(29:49):
another thing too. Have you seen behind the candelabra? Are
you gonna say g of the model? Yeah, that was
a big one because that was a woman from hers
was from Needles, I think, so it's a pretty big
heroin addict. Uh Perry Ellis fashion designer, Mr Brady himself.
Oh yeah, Robert Reid, yep, I remember Pedro Zamora from
(30:12):
the Real World. That was a big deal because I
think each one of these cases kind of opened the
eyes of a different segment. UM and Pedro he was,
you know MTV's Real World before he got really bad.
He was one of the UM. I guess it was
the San Francisco and uh he helped up in the
lines for a lot of teenagers and kids because it
unfolded in real time on television. Oh. I didn't know
(30:36):
about that at all. Yeah, it was a really big
big thing. UM. Anthony Perkins yea psycho. UM, Brad Davis
from Midnight Express. He was straight, but he was a
drug user. So that kind of shone a light on that. Uh.
And then Keith Herring, the artist Tom Fogerty of Credence,
(30:56):
John Fogerty's brother got it through a blood transfusion. Man,
So between he and Ryan White, You're right, like, those
are all really different segments. Yeah, and I think, I
mean that's why I'm mentioning them because I think each segment, like, uh,
it just shines a light to a different group of
(31:16):
people who might be fans of theirs. Um, So you're saying,
we're going to talk about the aids quilte, Right, Yeah,
are you there? You got any more celebrities? No, I
mean there are more celebrities than that, but we just
went through a handful the aids quilt So have you
ever seen the movie Milk? Yeah, the UM One of
(31:37):
the main characters, Clive Jones, UM, is a real life person,
as was Harvey Milk, who played Cleive Jones in the movie.
I don't remember. I want to say it was like
the dude from UM Big Bang Theory, but it's not.
I've never seen that show, but it looks a little
bit like him. I don't really watch it either, but
you know, I'm aware of pop culture, you know what
(31:58):
I'm saying. So anyway, UM, Clive Jones was a guy
who was a friend of Harvey Milks, and UM, Harvey
Milk was very famously assassinated by Dan White the Twinkie Defense.
I recognize the guy, but I don't know what else
he's been in. He was from the Dogtown in z
Boys movie and among many other things. Um So, uh,
(32:20):
Harvey Milk was killed and in his honor, starting in
nineteen seventy eight, I think Clive Jones organized the candlelight
vigil for him and George Muscone, the mayor who was
also killed by Dan White. Um but Harvey Milk was
He was I think the first openly gay politician in
San Francisco. So here's a gay rights hero for sure.
(32:41):
Um So, to honors memory, they would hold Clive Jones
would organize these candlelight vigils and um at one in
five he found out that um about like more than
a thousand in San Franciscans had died of AIDS and uh.
He during organizing the candlelight vigil, he asked people to
write the names of those people down on little cards, right,
(33:06):
and then he took the cards he and some other
volunteers at the end of the vigil and posted them
on the Federal Building wall. And apparently it looked a
lot like a patchwork quilt boom, and he thought the
little light bulb went off his head. And Clive Jones said,
I think we should make a quilt because they've been
trying to figure out a memorial for um uh, people
(33:27):
who had died of AIDS. Yeah. I didn't know how
organic it was and how it started. And I just
think it's such a neat story that is so it's
very cleeve. Uh. In June seven, he um Well the
first panel he created in memory of his friend Marvin Feldman.
And in June of eighty seven he teamed up with
a guy named Mike Smith and some other folks to
(33:49):
organize the Official Names Project Foundation, and uh they started
pouring in these these pieces of quilt, these patches started
coming in from all over the country, then all over
the world. And in October of nine they displayed it
for the first of what would be uh one, two, three, four,
five times in its full glory in Washington, d C. Yeah,
(34:14):
the first big deal. The first time, it was the
size of a football field. The last time they displayed
at Chuck Woods wind uh with the last time, and
it was much bigger, it wasn't it. Yes, it covered
the entire National Mall. That really drives at home. Well,
which is the whole point, Like, look how massive this
thing is. Uh. It has been on tour um more
(34:38):
than a half a million people visited the first weekend
and since then it's gone on many tours all over
the country, all over the world, and uh has raised
a lot of money I think so far over three
million dollars. Is that right? Oh yeah, easily. It seems
like it would be more than that, sure, but it's
just through this one project. It says the Names Project
(34:59):
found Asian has raised over three million dollars. I'm surprised.
That's all. Um. In nineteen eighty nine it was nominated.
The quilt itself was nominated for a Nobel Peace Prize
and it's still the largest community art project in the world.
And if you have not seen the documentary Common Threads
Colon Stories from the Quilt, you should. One Academy Award
(35:21):
for Best Documentary. And it has become a symbol and
it all grew out of that one neat little idea
from that candlelight vigil. Pretty cool, pretty cool indeed. And
the reason they're not showing it in full anymore, I
think it's because it's too big, which is sad, you know,
like there's no space large enough to hold it. Well,
that's not true. You could probably go out to the
(35:41):
desert somewhere. Oh yeah, you know, yeah, but then it
get all sandy. Yeah, you don't want to do that,
go to the beach. It's been weeks shaking that thing out. Yeah,
it would be tough. God, they can't imagine like transporting that. Yeah,
I don't know how they do it. I'm sure it's
in pieces. Yeah, I guess they may rease the whole
thing back together every time. I don't think they saw it.
(36:04):
They probably just put it together. Oh, I see, that's
that's my guess. I'm not sure. Okay, I doubt if
they folded up as one piece though, throw it in
the truck, you know. Yeah, well it would very quickly
reach to the moon. Have you ever heard that? You know,
like you can fold the paper, normal sized paper, several
times and very quickly it reaches right into outer space. Wait,
(36:25):
I thought something couldn't be folded more than a certain
amount of times. That's a lie, is it was? That?
It don't be dune? What was the number of times?
It was supposedly seven? And this girl in high school, Uh,
somewhere in like the early two thousands proved it is possible.
She did over like eleven or something. But the paper
that she used like went from you know, paper thin
(36:47):
to that after you know, ten folds, and so she
did the math to see um after like twenty or
fifty folds or something like that, it would hit the
moon after like a hundred and twenty folds, it would
expand further than the visible universe? Is that cool? And
now she volunteers with the AIDS quilt holding it. That's right? Ah,
(37:07):
you got anything else? Nope? No, I think you're right. Though.
We could have made a whole entire podcast series out
of this, right, Yeah, I hope you did a good job.
We tried. We definitely did. H If you want to
know more about HIV AIDS, UM, you should go research that,
especially for this Aid's Day week. UM. You can start
(37:28):
by typing the word AIDS into the search bar at
how stuff works dot com. And since I said search bar,
it's time for listener men. Yes, and if you are
sexually active, go get tested. Yeah, that's a great way
to celebrate um AS day. No reason not to um celebrate, observe.
(37:48):
How about observe, observe. Ye. Yeah, it's a little more
solemn than celebrating AID to day, I think celebrating awareness
is okay, that's all right. Thanks, I know what, man,
thanks for letting me off the hook. All right, this
is gonna be called listener mail. At the end of
the HIV AIDS series. Hey, guys, just recently came across
your podcast thanks to recommendation from Holly and Tracy. Stuff
(38:11):
you miss in history class. It's nice. Just finished listening
to ten most disturbing medical procedures, and I have a story.
My husband recently was diagnosed with uh minyars disease. While
he was being diagnosed, he was sent to an audiologist.
An audiologist took him to a room no bigger than
a closet and strapped him into a chair. The lights
were then turned off in the chair of spun while
(38:33):
the audiologist audio logist audio. Yeah that's right, Yeah, you
had it right. Uh. The chair was then whilst um
She asked him questions. The chair was then reversed in direction.
He was asked you the more questions. These were basic
questions like what's your wife's name, children's names, et cetera.
He was even asked at one point to say a
boy's name for each letter of alphabet starting with A
(38:55):
and ending in Z. It would be a fun little test,
Zeke and on. I found it amusing because you had
mentioned in the podcast how the worldly chair is no
longer in use and you couldn't find anything about it. Well,
today it's called a rotary chair and is used to
study the workings of the inner ear. While you would
find it even more amusing after airing that show, while
(39:16):
some people are treating the rotary chair as a new invention,
me so, I think Heather here is saying that the
rotary chair is the same thing as the Worldly chair.
It's alive and well, yeah, thanks Heather. Yeah, thanks a lot, Heather,
and the best of luck to your husband. Yeah, it's
still stuck in the worly chair going uh David Elias Frank,
(39:38):
She's like, Frank doesn't count the short for France's start over.
If you want to get in touch with us, you
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(40:03):
thousands of other topics, visit how Stuff Works dot com.
M
Welcome to Stuff you should know from house Stuff Works
dot com. Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh Clark,
There's Charles W Chuck Bryant. Uh, nobody's in here with us,
so it's just two of us and you, dear listener.
We're just free Leal and Bob Dylan whoever that is
(00:24):
Bob Dylan? Who come on? And um this is part
two of two of a special two part series that's
right on HIV aids. Yeah, if you didn't listen to
first one, I would suggest you do that. Yeah, you're
you're gonna be lost. There's probably gonna be a lot
of in jokes and referential jokes back to the first one.
We explained it in the first one. Yeah, that's very
(00:46):
important and like the actual nuts and Bolts disease, some
skip ahead, don't be lazy. UM So Chuck we left
off you were talking. We talked originally about UM, you know,
the different varying levels of risk depending on the type
of intercourse, depending on the tie of UM uh group
you remember of UM. We talked about how it works,
where it came from, what what could possibly be left
(01:09):
to talk about as far as HIV can is concerned.
There's a lot. Oh yeah, yeah, because we did not
touch on and I know you're being coy because I
see all your notes in front of you. Oh yeah,
look at all. But one thing we didn't talk about
that we're going to start with is uh treatment. Yeah,
that's a big one. That's a big one. Uh you
want to go and talk about the AIDS cocktail? Yeah. So. Um.
(01:32):
Back in a very very very famous basketball player named
Irvin Magic Johnson played for the l A Lakers, announced
that he was retiring from the NBA because he had
been diagnosed with HIV. I remember the day. That was
a huge deal. I was at Georgia Southern for some
weird reason that weekend. That is weird. It was a
(01:52):
big deal. Um. I mean you talked I think last
episode about Easy catching it and you know that was
that was a big deal. This was probably even bigger.
I think Magic Johnson was a bigger name than Easy.
Were more widely recognized him among more people. He was
a sports figure, he was straight what the heck is
going on? And I remember thinking, like many people at
(02:13):
the time, oh my gosh, Magic Johnson is dying. Yes,
I think a lot of people, most people who are
familiar with this thought, well, he's a goner in a
couple of years. But he kept living, and he kept living,
and he kept living. He came back and played more basketball.
Even I didn't know that, and you gotta be pretty
fit for that, sure, And he kept living. And everybody thought,
(02:35):
what the heck happened with Magic Johnson? And it turned
out that he had access to what's now known as
the highly active anti retroviral therapy a k A HEART,
which is now the standard of treatment for HIV um
and he had access to it a couple of years
before it became widespread in the I think, and it
(02:57):
has helped keep him alive. He recently he was thirty
two when he announced that he was diagnosed with HIV,
and he turned fifty six and two. It's a very
very long lifespan, especially for somebody who was diagnosed in
the early nineties when people were still like, what is
going on here? So correct? Uh, Magic Johnson got a
(03:18):
head start. Not because he's super famous. Well, that had
something to do with it. I think I'm very rich, well,
but he was he was willing to It was still
in the in the experimental phase at that point. Yeah,
but I'm sure there were plenty of HIV patients who
are like, do whatever you need to do to cure me,
but didn't have the money, so he got a jump
on it. But he has not. I think a lot
(03:40):
of people think that he is getting some other special
treatments that no one else is getting, or he's paying
his way into something. It supposedly there's a Kenyan witch
doctor rumor. Yeah, he's getting the same treatment that other
people are getting. And there are plenty of people that
have lived much longer than him. Oh yeah, and uh,
he's just the most famous. Uh, and that's a good
(04:01):
thing because he's HIV activists and activists. Yeah yea, not
to disparage anything about magic Jacks, and he definitely took
that that label at a time when it was that
was a gay disease, and uh, he became an HIV activist.
We should say specifically, he does not, never has had aids.
(04:22):
His um T helper cell count never got to the
UM two hundred thousand or less mark. So he's HIV
positive and he is still UM Like we said in
the last episode, it's a chronic disease because reservoirs developed
UM and I believe it was a couple of years
between diagnosis and treatment for him, So those reservoirs had
(04:44):
a chance to get a foothold, but he got it
early enough that he his lifespan is it's it's basically
that what was it twenty four years that he's been
alive since diagnosis. That's pretty normal for people who were
treated with the hard cocktail in a reasonable time after
being uh diagnosed, which they're finding that window of time
(05:06):
is intensely important. Oh yeah, we're gonna get to that man.
That was a great article ascent. So we're talking heart. Yeah,
heart or cart or just art whichever you want to
call it. I call it art with or heart with
the double A. I call it the AIDS cocktail. Oh yeah,
that's another word for uh. So, each one of these
drugs and we talked about in part one is very
(05:28):
specific to its task um to basically disrupt as many
stages of the process as possible. Uh, should we go
through these um in r t I S nucleo side
reverse transcript as inhibitors, they basically blocked the ability to replicate. Yeah,
(05:51):
remember the reverse transcript as takes the r n A
instructions for the viral UM creation and turns it into
d NA, which is then inserted into the c D
four plus T cell nucleus. Right, so you block that.
It's a big problem for the HIV virus. It's a
big problem. It is UH in n R T I
(06:15):
S non nucleoside reverse transcription inhibitors, they disable a protein
another protein requiring it to replicate another disruption p I
S prote s inhibitors, So proteas was UM that was
the one that actually cut the polypeptides into their individual components. So, yeah,
(06:36):
you had a long chain of enzymes that made up
these viruses. That's the party didn't get right, and then
you cut them up. So the thing that cuts them
up isn't there. You just have all these long chains
and they build up and it's basically like um lucy's
running the chocolate factory assembly line or something there. Uh.
Then you have entry fusion inhibitors. They blocked the ability
(06:58):
to enter those c D for our cells to begin
with UH, and then finally integrays inhibitors UM once they
get in that c D four cell. UH. We talked
about the insert of that genetic material, and it basically
blocks the ability to do that. So the current cocktail
recommended cocktail are two in r T I s in
(07:20):
the shaker, one in a r T I and the
p I and then either a integrays inhibitor or a
right tone neighbor, which I don't know what that is,
do you know, let's just say it's the key. Let's
say it's the the bidders in the cocktail and makes
it right. You put it all in there, you shake
(07:41):
it up. You've got your AIDS cocktail. Once you put
that into place, if you catch it early enough, you
can bring your mortality rate just about to normal. Yeah.
Like it's just it's a chronic disease. Yeah. Yeah, And
and your immune system will probably not become so compromise
that you're gonna from something. You need to be on
(08:02):
it for life. Uh. And everyone is supposed to be
on this cocktail. Uh. Although if you have b um,
have a recent CD four count below five, or if
you are pregnant, then you are given a priority. And
it's all gonna cost you about ten to twelve thousand
dollars a year, although that is supposed to increase. And
(08:24):
the reason why you have to stay on it indefinitely
because we said in the last episode that um HIV
produces reservoirs of inactive varyans that just spread throughout the
body and accumulate. And even when you're treating what amounts
to one outbreak, another one can come very soon afterward.
And that's what makes it chronic. Right with heart it
(08:46):
will eventually get all these reservoirs, but it takes I
think we said sixty to eighty years. It's a very
long time, right. So there's been some suggestions as to
how to eradicate UM this disease a little faster, yet
different ideas, which is great. I mean, they're really smart.
(09:06):
People are coming up with different strategies. One of them
is kind of nuts. But also which one the one
that uses pro Stratton I believe is what it's called.
It basically goes in and says, um, oh, you're an
inactive HIV, so well, I'm going to activate you. It's
basically making an HIV outbreak take place, but you're doing
(09:28):
it while you're under heart care, right. Yeah. The way
I thought of it was, it's like flushing out those
invisible reservoirs, but the only way to flush them out
is to activate them to get them going. So the
T cells actually know it's there. So that scary sounding
it is that the heart treatment also disrupts their function,
so it starts them up, and apparently they don't stop
(09:50):
and go back to sleep or go dormant again once
they start up, so it starts them up. The heart
treatment um keeps them from doing what they want to
do normally. And then also the cell that they're infecting
will die sooner than later and just get it over with.
So it's basically a way they're trying to figure out
to accelerate an HIV infection while in the presence of
(10:13):
highly active anti retroviral therapy. So it keeps you from
actually dying from this accelerated HIV infection. It's pretty cool. Yeah,
So that's one strategy. Does even that they call it anything,
that should call it something cool? Uh the gun Slinger, Yeah,
the gun Slinger hid. All right, I think we should
get to this next. This is uh. You sent an
(10:36):
awesome article from the Pacific Standard called getting to zero
very close to a cure for AIDS, and the city
of San Francisco is doing something. Uh there, they're pretty
radical out there in San Francisco. Sure you know all
those hippies out there. So what they're trying to do
is they're trying to make their city the first city
(10:56):
with no new infections, no deaths, and no stigma. And
they called the program getting to zero, and they're doing
this in a in a lot of ways. Um, some
of the background here is there. Historically over the past
few decades hasn't been a ton of money allocated toward
finding a cure for AIDS. Yeah, and not because for
(11:16):
various reasons. I think a lot of people, especially initially
are like, well, because it was gay disease, yeah, I
think is its spread out and started infecting more non
gay people and more non gay white people. It started
to get a lot more funding, but it also didn't
get a lot of funny because a lot of people
were like, we can't cure this, it's an incurable disease. Yeah,
(11:37):
and I think, um, I think cynics might also say, like,
it's you make a lot more money to keep people
on drugs for life than you do caring something. But
from what I could tell, the main reason was because uh,
it was such a new scary thing. They put all
of their efforts into trying to save people who got HIV.
(11:59):
And coming up with these these this drug cocktail. However,
things are changing, which is good. Um. In two thousand
and eight and two thousand nine, that was a very
cool case. Timothy ray Brown. He was, Yeah, the second
Berlin patient. There was another one in the mid nineties. Yeah,
(12:19):
there was, I know everything. That was an anonymous Berlin
patient in the mid nineties who I think, uh got
HIV and then no longer had HIV. But what's up
with Berlin? I know, seriously, it's cool city. But Timothy
ray Brown was a special case. He's an American that
(12:42):
was living there as a translator. HIV positive and started
taking medications. Uh, and then about a decade later find
out he had leukemia. So his doctor, very clever person,
Gero Hooter or Hero, call him Hero. I think Hero.
(13:02):
He said. He had a very weird unique I D idea.
He said, why don't we see if we can take
there are these people out there one percent of Caucasians, Yeah,
one percent of people who have a protein Caucasian people
uh CCR five, which basically makes them immune to HIV.
They lack that protein. Yeah, that's a protein on the
(13:23):
surface of your t helper sell that the HIV virus
docks with can doc can infect and very few people
have this one percent. He said, why don't we try
and find someone like that who can donate their bone
marrow which is where stuff like that is produced, and
to this guy and basically basically replace his immune system
with with this one percenter and not that kind of
(13:46):
one percenter. He's like, I'm gonna be rich. I got
rich bow. So he did that. They found someone UH
that had that that was a good match, and it worked.
It worked like he was funk only cured of HIV
I think like fully cured. Is was like, they keep
testing him and testing him. This is I think two
thousand eight or two thousand nine UM, and they testing
(14:09):
no signs UM. I don't know that enough people have
been cured of HIV AIDS so that they It's like
with UM with cancer. I think if you're five years
without UM any kind of growth, it's considered remission. I
don't think they have a standard like that yet. UM.
But so they keep testing this guy and he's it's
not coming back. These reservoirs are not becoming active again.
(14:32):
It doesn't appear that he has HIV or AIDS any longer.
And The doctor was excited, obviously, but he also knew like, well,
we obviously can't go around replacing you know, people's immune
systems with these one per cent. But what it did
was it kick started new hope and now all of
a sudden, all of a sudden, there was new funding
for trying to find a cure. And it was what
(14:53):
they call a proof of concept. I think we mentioned
last episode it showed that AIDS can be cured. Yeah,
before this, only about three percent of AIDS and HIV
funding went to cure research. Um. Now there are new
grants totally fourteen point six million a year in Obama
in two thousand and thirteen said you know what, how
about another hundred million towards a cure over three years?
(15:18):
What is that funny? It's just what a hundred million
used to be and what it is today. You know. Yeah,
it just sounds like sure, just throwing money around. Um,
go get yourself some nice funding. Uh. So we talked
to Believe in the first episode about catching it early. Um,
there's another story here. Basically, how it works now is
(15:41):
you can get diagnosed with HIV and until you're t
cell count falls below a certain number, you're just like
not on any drugs, like you have to get sick
before you get treated in most cases. Is well, yeah,
that was the old I mean that's what it says
in this thing. Oh that was the old, the old. Yeah,
(16:01):
that was the old guard I got you. Yeah, the
the new the the bleeding edge right now, leading edge O,
the leading edge um is quite the opposite of that. Yeah,
Because they found if you get to it super early,
like those first few days and weeks after you get
HIV in the bloodstream is when it's most dangerous, very critical,
(16:23):
most easily spread. And they found that if people who
take these drugs right then are less likely less likely
to pass it on to a sexual partner. Here's why. Again,
one of the insidious, pernicious characteristics of HIV infection is
that inactive reservoirs build, which makes it a chronic disease.
(16:45):
And again, when you first stre exposed to HIV, your
immune system can mount a pretty decent defense on its own. Yeah,
you don't have those reservoirs just yet, right, And it's
those reservoirs that eventually overwhelm your immune system and can
lead to your death if you're treated with heart very
early on after or infection, those reservoirs never have a
chance to build and that infection that you do have
(17:06):
is helped with this extra therapy and your immune system
can defend against it. And it's these these people feel
like the time is such a critical essence that award
eighty six, which is a legendary the um United States
at least first UH dedicated AIDS ward AIDS Clinic in
San Francisco General the very cutting edge. They've led a
(17:29):
lot of treatment programs for UM HIV and AIDS over
the years, but they have this program now where they
will pay for a cab for you to be brought
from your doctor's office where you were just diagnosed to
Ward eighty six to be treated right then with heart
to begin treatment. Yeah. It's a doctor researcher called Hero
(17:50):
You hatano another hero another hero, You're right, And the
program is rapid UH, which the first letter also stands
for a rapid Yeah, I know, I don't think that's okay,
Well we'll give it to him. Rapid is the Rapid
Anti Retroviral Program Initiative for new diagnoses And like you said,
(18:10):
basically it's a treat and test and treat program where
as soon as you know you've got it. They want
to knock down any obstacle in your way, including that
first cab ride to get there and just go get
going on that stuff so you're not spreading the disease.
So we've got more on treatment and stuff like that. Uh,
and we'll get to it right after this message. All right, Chuck.
(18:54):
There's another UM. There's a group out there running around
too who are saying that they are working on an
AIDS or it's saying HIV vaccine. Yeah, you sent me
this one. UM. They are studying what are called controllers.
And these these controllers, they'll they get infected with HIV,
(19:14):
it's in their body and they never get sick from it. Yeah.
They're called long term non progressors or elite controllers, elite
of it. They prefer to be called elite controllers. Uh.
And they've estimated anywhere from one and two hundred to
one in five people. Uh. They don't think Magic Johnson
is one of these people, which we talked about. No,
(19:35):
he just responded, well the part, but there was the
thought that he might be. UM. And there's a project
called the Immunity Project. It's a nonprofit that seeks a
cure by stutting the blood of these elite controllers UM,
which I don't know why it's controversial, but I have
seen that other researchers are saying, like, don't do that,
it's not gonna work, or yeah, maybe that's it. Maybe
(19:55):
they think it's not resourced. Well, but they figured I mean,
they feel like they figured out what makes elite controllers,
what gives them that trait um. Apparently there's some proteins
that UM show these people signal proteins in their body
that that show the immune system where the best place
to attack in HIV viruses. Yeah, so that's genetic it is.
(20:19):
But it's also like it's not like there's something weird
with their own cells. It's like they're antibodies are UM
specialized to search and destroy HIV viruses, which is weird,
But that's definitely who you want to study. Why not
throw an extra hundred millionaire? Uh. This other part of
(20:40):
this article article from Pacific Standards, So it was interesting.
There was a case of the French girl she's now eighteen.
She was infected with HIV from her mother during pregnancy
or delivery. Immediately started started on the anti viral drugs.
Uh stayed on them for six years, and then she
stopped taking the medications for almost a year. Usually when
(21:01):
that happens is HIV just like really gets going again
and it's back on the move because of the reservoirs. Yeah,
it didn't happen in her case. Um, and so she
stayed off them for and she's been undetectable for twelve years.
So now they're thinking maybe one thing we can do
is get people on the drugs super soon, and then
wean them off of the drugs at a certain point
(21:23):
and see if that works. Basically like keeping good close
eye on them obviously not just being like, all right,
we'll see in a decade, let me know how it goes.
I mean, why not? So that's pretty promising too. Uh.
There's another uh potential strategy which is called shock and kill,
and that is flushing out the particles into the circulatory system.
(21:48):
So is that part of the one we talked about earlier?
I think so the pro stratton where is that the
same thing it activates dormant HIV cells to get them
to attack. I would say if it's not the same
drug or the same research group, it's the same principle,
you know, trying to awaken the sleeping beast and may
give us some big problems. Uh, Patient zero. We tease
(22:12):
that in the first episode. Yeah, I thought this was
super interesting. You referenced the book and movie and the
band played on by the book was Randy Schiltz about
the early days of AIDS and HIV, and um it
is there's now a book out called Plane Queer. Uh
and that is plane as an Airplane airplane terrible. Yeah,
(22:35):
I know colon labor, sexuality and AIDS. In the history
of male flight attendants and um, there was a man
named Guton Dougas Gayton m. I was in an a Yeah,
g A E T A N Gayton Dougas. He's Canadian
flight attendant. He's kebec Qua. It's Canadian people in compactus
(23:01):
maybe a national hero. Uh. They in this book. Basically
there was a big fear that this book wasn't going
to sell and get any attention. So the book publishing
because it's like six pages of methodical reporting on the
area of HIV eight Yeah, and um, the the the
editor now or the publisher has come out and said,
(23:23):
you know what, we kind of um resorted to yellow
journalism by allowing and leaking this supposed patient zero, this
gay flight attendant, good looking guy who was very sexually active.
He claimed to have more than partners over a ten
year span from the early seventies of the early eighties,
(23:45):
flying all over the world. Yeah, obviously it's a flight attendant. Um.
And they let the story leak to the New York Times.
Was at New York Times and New York Post. But
not only did they leak the story, they really they
really built up or overstated the guy's role as depicted
in the book too. Yeah. Basically, like this guy brought
(24:07):
AIDS to the United States. This guy is patients zero.
They they I think in the book he does compare
him to Quebec quaw typhoid Mary right away, because he did.
He did say, like I'm not gonna not have sex
or you nuts, like there are some stuff that this
guy definitely did do and he was one of the
early patients. But to lay the AIDS epidemic in America
(24:30):
at this one guy's feet it patently unfair. Yeah, and
untrue because he was not the first person. Uh he was.
They did trace early on, when they were tracing it
around the country. They labeled patients with l A as
in Los Angeles or New York like l A four
in Y three is what patient number and where they were.
(24:52):
And originally they said that his designation was OH for
out of California. Eventually that became zero. Uh. And he
unfairly pinned with spreading AIDS. He was he was part
of a smallish group, a very traveled, promiscuous gay men
that did help spread AIDS. But um, he was not
(25:14):
the reason he was not patients here. He was a reason.
He was right, but unfairly labeled. Um. But in the
end it ended up bringing a lot of attention to
it at a vital time. So that's why the conundrum,
that's why the editors of the editor of the book
is admitting and now he's saying, like you know, ultimately
it was a good move because it helped brought a
(25:37):
lot of bringing a lot of attention to this through
promotion of the book. But it was at the expense
of this one guy. And he died in um March
of kidney failure. Very sad. Uh. I think we need
one more break, correct, Yeah, and then we'll come back
and we'll talk about um. Some other celebrity who have
(26:00):
helped put a face to AIDS and the AIDS quilt. Yeah,
right for this, all right, Chuck, We're back. Yes, so
(26:32):
you tease celebrities. I love celebrities. Everyone does love celebrities,
And someone who is a celebrity who dies of AIDS
is no more important than um any other person who
dies of AIDS. But they are vital to putting a
face on things, into getting media attention and basically slapping
(26:53):
people in the face who think I can never get AIDS.
You know, easy we mentioned, Yeah, it definitely makes people.
What gives people pause? I didn't know, I don't I
didn't remember that some of these people died of AIDS.
Um Rock Hudson was a big one. Absolutely, Arthur ashe
had forgotten about that. Oh yeah, uh, Freddie Mercury. Honestly,
(27:13):
I was watching, Uh have you ever seen Queen live
in Montreal? I don't know. Maybe was he wearing um,
like white jumpsuit, white jeans and the Superman tank top.
It's just like it's like Queen's famous sponsort movie that
was on Palladium the other night. And I've seen that
thing probably a dozen times. Every time I'm knocked out.
(27:35):
Oh yeah, the Queen was great, and Freddie Murcury was
just such a rock star. Dude. It was like and
at the time when I was a little kid, I
didn't know what gay was, you know, just knew you
like Freddie Mercury. Absolutely. Yeah. I was the same kid
who drew the village people in crayon and my mom
was like, what's going on there? Um? But Freddiemurkey just
(27:55):
he still blows me away. What what a fantastic, awesome
rock star. I wonder how that he's gonna be Sasha
Baron Cohen's working on. He dropped out of that, he
came back back on baby. Well, I think he he
looks enough like him and he can do great impressions.
But he's just tall and lanky. So that's the only
thing that bothers me. It wasn't Freddie Mercury pretty tall.
(28:18):
He was a little guy. Oh really, Yeah, I didn't
know that. Yeah, spit fire, so you know whatever. It's
not like Christoph Waltz playing a guy from Nebraska into
Big Guys. Did you see that pile of do? That
movie bugged me so much every moment of it. I'm
just a nice man from the Brascot it was so
(28:40):
like he didn't even tried to copy. He didn't try
to hide his exit at all. He didn't because Tim
Burton probably wasn't even on set most of the time.
Why because he's phoning it in. Yeah he stinks now.
I did look up though, like, why in the world
did he cast him and Tim Burton? Because he got
some flak for it, and he was like, I just
it was more about the spirit of the guy, not
that he had heavy Austrian accent. Missed it a little bit,
(29:04):
Maybe re redo the character a tad then there's all
sorts of stuff you can do or um was it
Cameron Crow who cast? Um? What is her name? The
White Girl? Is an Asian character? What in it? Like
the most recent like his most recent movie? I didn't see, Yes, who?
I can't remember her names? A very famous actors the Redhead.
(29:27):
Yes from Birdman. Yes she plays an Asian character. Yes, yes, really,
all right, I'm gonna to look that up. Yeah, let's
go read about it after this. Alright, there was the
one tangent for the two parter. Yeah, we got a
lot in there. So back to celebrities who have passed
from aids Um Liberacci of course. Uh, Gia. That was
(29:49):
another thing too. Have you seen behind the candelabra? Are
you gonna say g of the model? Yeah, that was
a big one because that was a woman from hers
was from Needles, I think, so it's a pretty big
heroin addict. Uh Perry Ellis fashion designer, Mr Brady himself.
Oh yeah, Robert Reid, yep, I remember Pedro Zamora from
(30:12):
the Real World. That was a big deal because I
think each one of these cases kind of opened the
eyes of a different segment. UM and Pedro he was,
you know MTV's Real World before he got really bad.
He was one of the UM. I guess it was
the San Francisco and uh he helped up in the
lines for a lot of teenagers and kids because it
unfolded in real time on television. Oh. I didn't know
(30:36):
about that at all. Yeah, it was a really big
big thing. UM. Anthony Perkins yea psycho. UM, Brad Davis
from Midnight Express. He was straight, but he was a
drug user. So that kind of shone a light on that. Uh.
And then Keith Herring, the artist Tom Fogerty of Credence,
(30:56):
John Fogerty's brother got it through a blood transfusion. Man,
So between he and Ryan White, You're right, like, those
are all really different segments. Yeah, and I think, I
mean that's why I'm mentioning them because I think each segment, like, uh,
it just shines a light to a different group of
(31:16):
people who might be fans of theirs. Um, So you're saying,
we're going to talk about the aids quilte, Right, Yeah,
are you there? You got any more celebrities? No, I
mean there are more celebrities than that, but we just
went through a handful the aids quilt So have you
ever seen the movie Milk? Yeah, the UM One of
(31:37):
the main characters, Clive Jones, UM, is a real life person,
as was Harvey Milk, who played Cleive Jones in the movie.
I don't remember. I want to say it was like
the dude from UM Big Bang Theory, but it's not.
I've never seen that show, but it looks a little
bit like him. I don't really watch it either, but
you know, I'm aware of pop culture, you know what
(31:58):
I'm saying. So anyway, UM, Clive Jones was a guy
who was a friend of Harvey Milks, and UM, Harvey
Milk was very famously assassinated by Dan White the Twinkie Defense.
I recognize the guy, but I don't know what else
he's been in. He was from the Dogtown in z
Boys movie and among many other things. Um So, uh,
(32:20):
Harvey Milk was killed and in his honor, starting in
nineteen seventy eight, I think Clive Jones organized the candlelight
vigil for him and George Muscone, the mayor who was
also killed by Dan White. Um but Harvey Milk was
He was I think the first openly gay politician in
San Francisco. So here's a gay rights hero for sure.
(32:41):
Um So, to honors memory, they would hold Clive Jones
would organize these candlelight vigils and um at one in
five he found out that um about like more than
a thousand in San Franciscans had died of AIDS and uh.
He during organizing the candlelight vigil, he asked people to
write the names of those people down on little cards, right,
(33:06):
and then he took the cards he and some other
volunteers at the end of the vigil and posted them
on the Federal Building wall. And apparently it looked a
lot like a patchwork quilt boom, and he thought the
little light bulb went off his head. And Clive Jones said,
I think we should make a quilt because they've been
trying to figure out a memorial for um uh, people
(33:27):
who had died of AIDS. Yeah. I didn't know how
organic it was and how it started. And I just
think it's such a neat story that is so it's
very cleeve. Uh. In June seven, he um Well the
first panel he created in memory of his friend Marvin Feldman.
And in June of eighty seven he teamed up with
a guy named Mike Smith and some other folks to
(33:49):
organize the Official Names Project Foundation, and uh they started
pouring in these these pieces of quilt, these patches started
coming in from all over the country, then all over
the world. And in October of nine they displayed it
for the first of what would be uh one, two, three, four,
five times in its full glory in Washington, d C. Yeah,
(34:14):
the first big deal. The first time, it was the
size of a football field. The last time they displayed
at Chuck Woods wind uh with the last time, and
it was much bigger, it wasn't it. Yes, it covered
the entire National Mall. That really drives at home. Well,
which is the whole point, Like, look how massive this
thing is. Uh. It has been on tour um more
(34:38):
than a half a million people visited the first weekend
and since then it's gone on many tours all over
the country, all over the world, and uh has raised
a lot of money I think so far over three
million dollars. Is that right? Oh yeah, easily. It seems
like it would be more than that, sure, but it's
just through this one project. It says the Names Project
(34:59):
found Asian has raised over three million dollars. I'm surprised.
That's all. Um. In nineteen eighty nine it was nominated.
The quilt itself was nominated for a Nobel Peace Prize
and it's still the largest community art project in the world.
And if you have not seen the documentary Common Threads
Colon Stories from the Quilt, you should. One Academy Award
(35:21):
for Best Documentary. And it has become a symbol and
it all grew out of that one neat little idea
from that candlelight vigil. Pretty cool, pretty cool indeed. And
the reason they're not showing it in full anymore, I
think it's because it's too big, which is sad, you know,
like there's no space large enough to hold it. Well,
that's not true. You could probably go out to the
(35:41):
desert somewhere. Oh yeah, you know, yeah, but then it
get all sandy. Yeah, you don't want to do that,
go to the beach. It's been weeks shaking that thing out. Yeah,
it would be tough. God, they can't imagine like transporting that. Yeah,
I don't know how they do it. I'm sure it's
in pieces. Yeah, I guess they may rease the whole
thing back together every time. I don't think they saw it.
(36:04):
They probably just put it together. Oh, I see, that's
that's my guess. I'm not sure. Okay, I doubt if
they folded up as one piece though, throw it in
the truck, you know. Yeah, well it would very quickly
reach to the moon. Have you ever heard that? You know,
like you can fold the paper, normal sized paper, several
times and very quickly it reaches right into outer space. Wait,
(36:25):
I thought something couldn't be folded more than a certain
amount of times. That's a lie, is it was? That?
It don't be dune? What was the number of times?
It was supposedly seven? And this girl in high school, Uh,
somewhere in like the early two thousands proved it is possible.
She did over like eleven or something. But the paper
that she used like went from you know, paper thin
(36:47):
to that after you know, ten folds, and so she
did the math to see um after like twenty or
fifty folds or something like that, it would hit the
moon after like a hundred and twenty folds, it would
expand further than the visible universe? Is that cool? And
now she volunteers with the AIDS quilt holding it. That's right? Ah,
(37:07):
you got anything else? Nope? No, I think you're right. Though.
We could have made a whole entire podcast series out
of this, right, Yeah, I hope you did a good job.
We tried. We definitely did. H If you want to
know more about HIV AIDS, UM, you should go research that,
especially for this Aid's Day week. UM. You can start
(37:28):
by typing the word AIDS into the search bar at
how stuff works dot com. And since I said search bar,
it's time for listener men. Yes, and if you are
sexually active, go get tested. Yeah, that's a great way
to celebrate um AS day. No reason not to um celebrate, observe.
(37:48):
How about observe, observe. Ye. Yeah, it's a little more
solemn than celebrating AID to day, I think celebrating awareness
is okay, that's all right. Thanks, I know what, man,
thanks for letting me off the hook. All right, this
is gonna be called listener mail. At the end of
the HIV AIDS series. Hey, guys, just recently came across
your podcast thanks to recommendation from Holly and Tracy. Stuff
(38:11):
you miss in history class. It's nice. Just finished listening
to ten most disturbing medical procedures, and I have a story.
My husband recently was diagnosed with uh minyars disease. While
he was being diagnosed, he was sent to an audiologist.
An audiologist took him to a room no bigger than
a closet and strapped him into a chair. The lights
were then turned off in the chair of spun while
(38:33):
the audiologist audio logist audio. Yeah that's right, Yeah, you
had it right. Uh. The chair was then whilst um
She asked him questions. The chair was then reversed in direction.
He was asked you the more questions. These were basic
questions like what's your wife's name, children's names, et cetera.
He was even asked at one point to say a
boy's name for each letter of alphabet starting with A
(38:55):
and ending in Z. It would be a fun little test,
Zeke and on. I found it amusing because you had
mentioned in the podcast how the worldly chair is no
longer in use and you couldn't find anything about it. Well,
today it's called a rotary chair and is used to
study the workings of the inner ear. While you would
find it even more amusing after airing that show, while
(39:16):
some people are treating the rotary chair as a new invention,
me so, I think Heather here is saying that the
rotary chair is the same thing as the Worldly chair.
It's alive and well, yeah, thanks Heather. Yeah, thanks a lot, Heather,
and the best of luck to your husband. Yeah, it's
still stuck in the worly chair going uh David Elias Frank,
(39:38):
She's like, Frank doesn't count the short for France's start over.
If you want to get in touch with us, you
can tweet to us at s Y s K podcast.
You can join us on Facebook dot com slash stuff
you should know. You can send us an email to
Stuff podcast at how stuff worst dot com and has
always joined us at our home on the Web. Stuff
you Should Know dot com. For more on this and
(40:03):
thousands of other topics, visit how Stuff Works dot com.
M
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