October 2, 2014 • 33 mins
Almost three percent of Americans suffer from a debilitating disorder that causes them to suffer intense fear seemingly without reason and science hasn't yet figured out what causes it. Join Josh and Chuck as they get to the bottom of panic attacks.
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
Welcome to you Stuff you should Know from House Stuff
Works dot com. Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm
Josh Clark. There's Child's w Chuck Bryant, and Jerry Stuff
you should know. Yep, Wide Spread Panic. Did you see
(00:22):
that video which one there was a dude this was
just like two days ago that went up on stage
and attacked the band. Oh no, I didn't see that. Yeah,
and they've got the whole thing and it was during
one of the really repetitive droning parts of a song.
And uh, I haven't seen an explanation but that there was.
I went to the Widespread Panic Facebook thing because there
was a big thread about people talking about it, and
(00:43):
I just said, Hero, did you really hate people gang
filing me? Going Hero, that's hilarious danger Stroll. I thought
it was pretty funny. He attacked the members of the band, yeah,
like physically, and I couldn't quite the drummer and he
was upset, and I don't know if that part of
(01:03):
the song made him snap, but it was definitely one
of those repetitive thank thank you, it's like stop. But
he was at the show, so that'd be weird unless
he went there to attack them. Yeah, that's probably the
bath salts maybe, so, so we're not talking about that
kind of panic. That's more a psychotic break. And this
(01:25):
is not widespread at all. It's very individualized panic, it is.
But it turns out people suffering from this is kind
of widespread. How about that? So it fits a little
bit sure. Instead, Um, we're talking about panic attacks and
the combination of panic attacks or the culmination of panic
(01:46):
attacks that can lead to something called panic disorder, and
it is a sucky mental condition that about two point
eight percent of Americans, which is a pretty significant amount
of people. Yeah, that's that's more than bipolar, which we've
covered in schizophrenia, Yeah, and o c D, which we well,
we've covered all three of this. Yeah. Um, so that's
(02:09):
a pretty significant amount of people who suffer from panic disorder. Right,
But that's different than just plain old panic attacks. Even
though to have panic disorder you have to have panic attacks,
but if you have panic attacks, you don't necessarily have
panic disorder exactly. And I've had two experiences which I'll
talk about at some point through the show, not personally,
(02:29):
but Emily had a panic attack once and uh friend
in college had a panic attack a roommate and neither
one of them have panic disorders. It was just an
isolated incident. Yeah, so apparently that's I don't know if
commons the right word, but people do have panic attacks
and they but they they that might be the only
one they ever have for their entire lives, hope, which
(02:51):
makes the whole thing kind of mysterious. And we should
say like science does not know what exactly is going
on here. That's some theory, but there's there's no there's
no way to predict what's happening now even know if
it's genetic or what environmental. Well, they finally isolated a
gene last year, Uh, I guess and go and talk
(03:14):
about that. Now in December they isolated the gene and
you know, genes are always so boring with their names,
unless it's a Simmons. That's right. The n k r
T three uh they think may be responsible um because
its presence appears to cause an over estimation of fear
and danger in an overactivation of the hippocampus and amygdala.
(03:37):
So basically, if you have this gene, you're gonna exaggerate
your fear overall. But it's not like they're saying they
prove that's the cause. But that is a good step
in scientifically in the right direction. That's a huge step,
because I mean that does sound very much like what
a panic attack is. A panic attack is where you
experience a very pronounced sense of fear and basically your
(04:02):
fight or flight symptoms response and really, from what I
can understand, your flight response. Yeah, like you're not in
a position to fight or freeze because you know now
these days it's fight, flight or freeze. Really yeah, I
don't think I knew that. Yeah, there's a third option now,
um like kind of oh no, wait, those aren't options
(04:23):
sets a sequence, right, This is these are options. So
when you're confronted with danger. Nick Thune, our buddy, the comedian, dude,
have you seen his hand of fit ads? Yeah, those
are awesome. I was like, that's Nick Thune and he's
on like Miss America. Yeah. The first thing I always
think about is good for you cash those checks baby.
Uh yeah. He has that funny bit on stop dropping rolling,
(04:45):
like they they needed to continue that, like keep rolling.
He's like, that's kind of key. Don't stop dropping roll
because you'll be consumed by fire. You need to keep rolling.
Right until you get to a door. Yeah, it's very
funny stuff. So this is a little different fight flight
or freeze? Yeah? What what's freeze factor in? Like you
just freeze up and toast? Yeah, at least beneficial of
(05:08):
all of the these adaptations to danger. But basically, when
you're when you're confronted with danger, you can either fight, fly,
or freeze. That makes total sense. I don't know why
freeze was never in there to begin with, because so
many people freeze. They just added on the last couple
of years. I think I'm a flyer or a freezer
for sure. It depends. I don't know if do you
(05:29):
think there's a personality type? Oh boy, I don't know. Um,
you know, don't you think it's possibly like just what
your body chemistry happens to be doing? Right then? No?
I think some people are more inclined to fight for sure. Okay, Well,
with panic attacks, you're flying like that's your only that's
your jam right there. Um, and you're experiencing it in
(05:49):
the exact same way that somebody's coming to mug you
or has pulled a knife on you and you're running away,
or there's a lion chasing you. Accept This is the
key to panic attack. There is no lion, there is
no mugger, there's no knife, there's no discernible reason for
you to be experiencing this sudden onset of crippling fear. Um.
(06:12):
But you're experiencing it nonetheless, that's right. No, no tangible
thing happening right in that moment. So when you come
out of it, and these things can they peak within
about ten minutes, but these the symptoms can last for
an hour more. Um. When you come out of it,
you're like, I don't ever want that to happen again.
(06:34):
The place that this just happened to, say, the park,
I'm never going back to because now I associated with
this because what you're doing when you experience fear, you're
learning to stay away from something. So whether you want
to or not, you've just been conditioned to fear the
place that you just were because you had a panic attack. Um.
And then lastly, you think possibly you're crazy, yeah, or
(06:57):
having a heart attack. Yeah that's uh. Both both of
the my wife and my friend both thought they were
having heart attacks, which is super scary. And we'll get
the difference later on. But um, I guess we should
talk about just some of the initial symptoms of a
panic attack. The old d s M Diagnostic and Statistical
Manual Mental Disorders lists, Uh, it looks like about ten
(07:20):
symptoms and if you have at least four of these,
you may be having a panic attack, which is heart pounding, shaking, dizziness, sweating, choking,
feeling nausea, shallow or short breath, chest pain, numbness or
tingling chills, and hot flashes, feeling of unreality, feeling like
you're going crazy, or feeling like you're about to die.
(07:41):
You got four of those, you're having a panic attack, yes, Um.
And if you have four panic attacks within four weeks,
or you have one panic attack and then fear having
another panic attack for about a month or so, then
you can be die diagnosed with what's called panic disorder. So, uh,
(08:03):
if you listen to our fear podcast, which was a
really good one, UM, it's kind of the same as
a panic attack. UM. We covered your Your autonomic nervous
system is what maintains all the functions in your body,
the involuntary functions in your body, that is, and it's
gonna take signals from your central nervous system. It's gonna
(08:23):
regulate your organs. That's why you don't have to tell
your heart to beat or your kid needs to work.
It's all your pancreas to secrete stuff. That's right. It's
your autonomic nervous system. And it has two parts, the
sympathetic and parasympathetic. And your parasympathetic controls like I said,
your your heart beat and stuff like that. You're the
normal aspect. Yeah, it's just right. Yeah, that balance that
(08:48):
we all seek that we don't know we're seeking. And
then the sympathetic is if you have that fight or flight,
if you become excited, uh in any way, really, that's
when that's gonna kick in. Yeah. It's like normal gear
and then high gear. Yeah, but it's not always fear,
you know, just any kind of excitement. Right, you could
be super happy, it could be sexual arousal. That's all
your sympathetic nervous system, right, And those two components make
(09:11):
up the autonomic nervous system, which it kind of switches
from one to the other depending on your state of arousal. Right,
that's right. Um, But when fear has aroused you, um,
your sympathetic nervous system kicks into high gear. Um. And
adrenaline is released, which is a huge factor in causing
the symptoms of a panic attack. Like you you start
(09:33):
breathing very heavily and shallowly, um, your pupils dilate you. Uh.
We always used to say if you're digesting food, you
stop doing that. Basically, all of your energy is transferred
over to either fighting or flying, and in the case
of a panic attack, is transferred over to get you
to be able to run away as fast as possible. Yeah,
(09:55):
which can be a little scary, but in a real
fear situation, if in danger, your parasympathetic nervous system is
going to kick in and calm you down. But that
is not what happens, uh, in the case of a
panic attack, which is really perplexing. So let's recap this.
A panic attack is when you experience this incredibly intense fear,
(10:16):
so much so that you run away but there's nothing
there to be afraid of. And then and then, to
make everything a million times worse, your parasympathetic nervous system
doesn't kick in and calm you down like it would
under normal circumstances, so you get to experience this horrible
thing even longer. That's right, and after this break, we
(10:39):
are going to get into some of the potential causes
of panic attacks. All right, So, like I said before,
breaking news from December last year, they think they've isolated
a gene. Previous to that, they've some research has said
it could be genetic because identical twins experience it more
(11:00):
than fraternal twins. But it's always been sort of up
in the air. They's been contradictions as well the genetic basis.
They think it's also possibly epigenetic or environmental like um.
Apparently one study found that a lot of people who
have panic disorder had some sort of traumatic incident happened
in their childhood. My friend from college did, Is that right?
(11:22):
So they're thinking like possibly it had some sort of
effect and set up like a time bomb for later
on in life. Yeah, the stored uh feelings that maybe
you've never dealt with about some traumatic event are gonna
they're gonna rear their head at some point in your
life in some way. Yeah, Or it just rearranged the
neural output in your brain so that one day you're
(11:45):
just set up when everything is just right, that chemistry
is flooding your brain in a certain way, and then Bam,
it comes out of nowhere, you have a panic attack. Yeah.
Another theory is that they think if you have an
over active fear system, like you've basically have been scared
(12:05):
too much in life, or you're a scared person, then
it's just gonna make it a hair trigger for something
to set it off, which makes a lot of sense.
I think it could be a combo with a lot
of things as usual. Yeah. I wonder though, what what
it will end up being that if we'll find that
there is one thing that that leads to this predictably
like built up, but then there's the actual trigger. Yeah,
(12:29):
and that's another thing too. So they don't know what
triggers these things. They do know that a panic attack.
Being worried about having a panic attack can actually trigger
a panic attack. Absolutely. I feel so bad for people
a panic disorder. This is like a terrible affliction because
you do become very much afraid that you're going to
have another panic attack. So that can set off a
(12:51):
panic attack, but it also can set off a code
morbidity called agoraphobia, where you are afraid to leave your house,
but you're also afraid to be alone. And I read this,
um this article that was from the eighties seven, and
they were saying, like, the the freudis the Freudists, followers
(13:14):
of Sigmund Freud. We're saying, um, oh, well, clearly, if
you're in a gooraphobic you don't want to go outside
because that's where sexual desire is, and you don't want
to be alone because you're worried that you will like
abuse yourself, So agoraphobia. And everybody went boom, sit down
and shut up. Yeah, and um, so nowadays they have
(13:36):
realized that agoraphobia is almost almost exclusively the result of
panic disorder. Yeah, and it's because you you fear the
place that you had a panic attack, so you don't
want to go there again. And then maybe it happened
again at the grocery store, so you don't want to
go there, and it happened. You don't want to be alone,
(13:58):
but you don't want to be around strangers, so you
into your family members and now all of a sudden,
you're not living your life anymore. Yeah, you're developing phobias
because of your panic attacks in your association with them.
Like if you're on an elevator and you have a
panic attack, you're not getting on an elevator again, you've
just developed a phobia for elevators, and so all of
a sudden, you're not going to be working at a
(14:18):
place where you might normally work because you have to
take the elevator to to get there. Or do you
develop a love of stairs? Right? But then what if
you're you don't like confined spaces at all, like a
stairwell either. Yeah you ever been locked in the stairwell
here at the building? Yeah? I mean you just walk
down however many flights until you're at the lobby. Oh,
you can get out down there? Yes, okay, yeah, yeah,
(14:41):
you're not actually locked in, you just have to walk
all the way down to Usually just call you and
say lee. Another theory is that when you're super tired,
um and overworked was when a lot of times when
these are set off, your brain is producing sodium lactate
or c O two and when those increase, your brain
(15:01):
uh says you know what, I think you're suffocating, and
so I'm going to send a signal to get you
a lot more oxygen. And I found this uh really
sad case of this woman, a university student who died
from a severe asthma attack like three days ago. Uh,
and she had had a history of asthma, and then
(15:24):
told the medics that she was going through like final
exams and she had been having panic attacks uh for
in the weeks like proceeding. So breathing is a huge
part of panic attacks. And as evidenced by her, if
you have asthma, it's can be deadly, which is super
super scary and sad. Yeah. Um. Then one other I
(15:47):
guess there's a neurological basis they believe for people who
have panic attacks. People who suffer from panic disorder tend
to have fewer serotonin receptors and apparently also UM gabba
which helps us get to sleep. It's called a gamma
immuno beautyic acid. Let's call it gabba gabba. Um. Those
(16:10):
two have some sort of role in UM panic disorder.
Like you don't have enough serotonin and your body is
not producing enough gabba, you may be prone to panic disorder. Uh.
They you know, there isn't like a specific type of
person that necessarily gets a panic attack. It can happen
to anyone, but um, usually it happens if you're you're
(16:31):
in your twenties. Although they say kids can get it
as well have a panic attack or a disorder. Um,
twice as many women have a panic disorder developed one
as men, which is pretty interesting. Um. And like you said,
just the fear like having had one before, that fear
can lead to more. So it's very cyclical, yes. And
you know, um that one paper from seven. I can't
(16:55):
tell if it was arguing in favor of panic disorder
being like an evolutionary adaptation and like possibly beneficial, or
if they were saying, like some people think this, can
you believe this? But they were. One of the points
that this guy made was well, twice as many women
have panic disorders as men, So clearly it's an evolutionary
(17:17):
adaptation because women wouldn't have had to have gone as
far away from camp while they were gathering food as men.
For men couldn't stand to have a panic attack, or
they couldn't, it wouldn't be an adaptation for men, it
would be for women. Plus women can't run as fast
when they have kids to carry, so they need to
be on alert a little more. It's just smelled like
(17:39):
bunk bunk. That was a big year for bunk. Yeah. Um,
if you do have a panic disorder. You may have
a hard time getting your family to understand it. UM.
Sometimes they overreact and think it's like way more severe
than it is. UM. Sometimes they underreact and say, uh,
(18:01):
you know, it's all in your head, like just calm down. UM.
But either way it's saying, boy, you're nuts or you
just need to relax. Neither one of those is going
to help out the loved one. Chill out, there's no lion.
One thing I've learned in arguments and fights with my
wife is and I'm boilerning this early on is saying
(18:23):
telling someone to relax never causes someone to relax. It's
like the worst thing you can do if something's heated
is to say just relax. That's just gonna ramp it up.
So that's my advice for couples out there in any relationship.
Really good, Thank you. UM. There is a silverlying to
all this in that panic disorder is actually highly treatable.
(18:47):
It's the treatments that they've come up with are pretty successful,
and we will talk about those treatments right after this.
All right, So you mentioned that they are treatable. They
have found success rates through medication and therapy, which seemed
(19:10):
to be about the same as far as how affective
they are between sixty and of the time. That's pretty good. Yeah,
that's not bad at all. So that's the good news.
So there's three. There's three UM typical methods of treatment
UM antidepressants, anti anxiety, pills, and therapy. And you might
use them, you know, independent of what another in conjunction
(19:33):
with one another. I also saw beta blockers. Some people
use beta blockers to treat them, but they're not quite
sure what's going on with that. I've used those before
live performances. Those are the ones I read about that UM,
you gave me one, and I was like a useless worm. Yeah,
it didn't affect me like that. I I was, I
just like totally lost my personality. I wasn't nervous, but
(19:53):
I didn't do anything. Well, I've gotten used to live
performing now, so I don't need them anymore. But I
got that to from apparently a bunch of musicians, like
in symphonies and stuff use And I was like, well,
if first chair of Violinist, if it's good for them
to give me some beta blockers. But it worked for me.
But like I said, I'm over all that. I enjoy
(20:14):
being on stage. Now. So with s SR eyes, which
is what you moved on too from beta blockers, right, No,
I'm not on it. So with SSR eyes, UM, those
are selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors, and they do exactly what
they sound like. You've got a bunch of serotonin receptors
in your brain. If you have panic disorder, you may
(20:35):
have fewer serotonin receptors in your brain. Serotonin is a
neurotransmitter that helps basically stabilize your mood by either causing
a neuron to fire or inhibiting a neuron to fire
in this really beautiful, perfectly balanced chemical reaction. Right, So
if you have a few of these receptors the normal,
(20:56):
you're going to be comparatively out of balanced. What an
SSR I, an antidepressant, does is it allows the serotonin
to kind of stay in your synaps is a little
longer than as normal, so that you are releasing a
little more serotonin than you would under normal circumstances. And
it's proven pretty effective for UM for panic disorder. Yeah,
(21:18):
I mean, they'd work wonders for a lot of people
for a lot of reasons, UM, but not everyone. And
they can cause a lot of negative side effects. Uh.
So obviously, you know, work with your doctor on a program,
and it takes them a little while, like two to
four weeks to begin working. Uh for a panic attack. Um,
an anti anxiety drug like xan x might be a
(21:40):
little more effective because that is immediately hits you. It
is a tranquilizer benzodiazepine, right yeah, and it's um, you know,
the zanex is going to help chill you out immediately,
but you can get hooked on those things pretty quick. Yeah,
and they're dangerous to quit cold turkey and um, yeah,
(22:02):
it's it's not the best thing to go to xanex
a lot. Well, yeah, they say that you should, um
basically if you if you undertake an ssr I regimen,
you can conceivably stay on it for years. If you
undertake anti anxiety or benzo diazepine regimen, like it shouldn't
last for more than a couple of weeks or month
(22:24):
from what I understand, because of the dependency. And again,
you want to like really do all of this with
like a um qualified competent doctor's assistants, not a doctor's assistant,
doctor's assistant. It depends if it's a qualified competent doctor's
assistant who can write prescriptions, who trust go for it,
(22:45):
that's true. Uh. And then there's therapy of course, the
old CBT cognitive behavioral therapy, which we've talked about a bunch,
but um, that is Uh, they're gonna sort of the
processes is gonna play out like this. They're gonna teach
you out your panic disorder, which is a big step.
If you understand something, uh, you can overcome it more easily.
(23:06):
I think they're gonna monitor you and you're gonna self
monitor and record your symptoms and when they happen and
why they happen, what the circumstance was. Breathing, like we mentioned,
is a huge part of it. Um, anything from meditation
to just regular breathing exercises which will give you some
tips on that in a minute too, are going to
help you out. And then the old exposure two uh situations.
(23:31):
Then this is once you've rethought, like your what your
approach is going to be, Like here's your new outlook
and now here's a situation that might give you a
panic attack. How do you feel? Yeah, or like if
you had a panic attack and an elevator, like they
may tell you to imagine you're in an elevator. Your
therapy might progress until you're actually in an elevator and
you're chilling out. And the hope is that if if
(23:53):
you can undergo exposure therapy to that degree, it will
get you over your panic attacks in general. Another aspect
of it, Chuck, is rethinking, uh, and that is basically
accepting the fact that you have panic attacks. Apparently if
you can say I'm having a panic attack or I
have panic attacks and you acknowledge it to yourself and
(24:15):
to other people, it immediately turns down the volume on
the whole thing. Yeah, I noticed some similarities and uh,
someone guiding through someone through an LSD trip and guiding
someone through a panic attack. It's interesting. A lot of
it is like understanding, like I am having an acid trip,
I am not having a good time. It's the same
(24:35):
thing as I'm having a panic attack and this is
no good And if I understand that, then I can
calm down more easily and keeping it in just lead
you to freak out more exactly. Um, So that's CBT
cognitive behavioral therapy and um, if you if you undergo
therapy and you're still suffering from panic attacks. The apparently
(24:58):
being discouraged as a a real problem with people with
panic disorder because you can still suffer them even if
you're doing everything right. Um, and so a lot of
people have learned to cope, and there's some pretty common
coping techniques for a panic disorder. And like you said,
the heart of the whole thing is breathing. Like when
you suffer a panic attack, you start breathing shallowly and quickly,
(25:22):
and um, you can hyperventilate. What you want to do
is breathe from your diaphragm and that you can actually
practice this in the times when you're not having a
panic attack. Yeah, if you're a singer, you know how
to breathe with your diaphragm. But if you're not, what
you can do is lie down on your back, put
some pillows on your head and knees, and um, put
(25:43):
a hand on your stomach and a hand on your chest,
and then practice breathing, uh, and making your hand on
your stomach move without the hand on your chest moving
and then tap the hand on your stomach while you
make a circle with a hand on your chest. When
you're really advanced. Wow, it's pretty impressive. Uh. And then
another thing you can do is just literally like put
(26:06):
a weight on your stomach and make sure to heavy
like a book. Yeah, like a nice something that you
can see going up and down when you're breathing with
your diaphragm, that's right. Um, And you want to just
kind of breathe in the good exhale the bad. Yeah,
Like I'm having a panic attack. This will pass, you know,
this will subside. This is a temporary feeling. That's what
(26:29):
you should be saying to yourself. And if you're a
person who's like out in public and you see somebody
having a panic attack, you basically want to do the
same thing that they're trying to do for themselves. You
want to remain calm. You want to tell them that
it's going to be over with pretty soon, that everything's okay,
they have nothing to fear. Um. Yeah, you don't want
to tell them to chill out, though. Uh. Guiding someone
(26:53):
through relaxation is different than saying chill out, by the way, right,
very different. Uh. They do recommend that you, um, if
you have a problem with with attacks in general, or
if you have a disorder, you should exercise a lot.
You should practice Um, they don't call it meditation, but
that's really what it is, is deep breathing and relaxation.
It's called mindfulness these days, isn't it. I don't know.
(27:15):
I think that's what they call it, because meditation turns
people off, right, guess interesting? Uh cut cut out the
caffeine and sugar and nicotine. Yeah, that's not gonna help
you at all, Uh doing all those things. Uh. And
you know, if this stuff is stuff that's building up
inside of you, which it often is, learn how to
express yourself a little more and um and talk about
(27:37):
your issues. Um. I know that in both of my cases.
My buddy in college, it was during finals week and
I had gone to bed and my roommate and another
dude had were out in the living room staying up,
and one of them came and woke me up and
he's like, dude, he's having a heart attack. He's having
a heart attack. And um, I didn't know anything about
panic attacks. So we took him the hospital, of course,
(28:00):
and that's all it was. It was a panic attack.
He calmed down. I think, um, I think it might
have given him something there. I met some sort of
medication to calm him down. Probably Benzo. Yeah, probably like
a good shot in the arm of that stuff. And
he was like, I'm fine. Right With Emily's case, she
had been under a lot of stress and was and
(28:21):
driving back from Akron, Ohio to Atlanta. I think she
went to get I think she had to get some
furniture or something. So she was in a truck, like
a moving truck, had been drinking caffeine like crazy, like
she does, and um, basically, uh started to have trouble
breathing on the highway going like e d down the
(28:41):
highway and had to pull over. Called me, and you know,
I calmed her down. I was like, all right, now,
let's get back on the road. See how you do.
She got back on the highway and immediately freaked out again.
And Uh, I flew to Cincinnati and went to a
hotel and drove her home. Yeah, I mean there was
really no choice at that point. Uh. You know, when
(29:01):
it's your wife, you Plus, it was a good opportunity
to get on the white horse, you know, and right
in and save the day. I think everyone loves those opportunities,
you know. And it's and I've always also wanted to
run to the airport, like give me a one way
ticket this somewhere I have time for your body scan.
(29:22):
Pretty much. That's how it happened. So she checked herself
into a hotel and I went there and had some
nice Cincinnati Skyline chili, and then the next morning we
hit the road. Yeah, that was good, and she hasn't
had one since then, despite like, uh, you know, she
she has a lot of anxiety just as a human,
but um, no panic attacks. So I definitely have seen
(29:44):
the things I saw in this article and both of them,
whether it was during finals, like the things going on
in her life at the time, we're super stressful. I
think the trigger was she doesn't like see great at
night or in the rain when she's driving, and I
think all these things compounded, um and just played out
to where she felt like she's having a heart attack,
and so did my friend. But I guess we should
(30:06):
mention that there are some tailtale signs of a heart attack. Yeah,
that's a big yeah, that you can recognize the difference,
because you don't want to actually be having a heart
attack and be like it's just a panic. Just breathe,
just breathe while you're dying. Um. Here are a few
tips from the American heart association. Pressure in the center
(30:29):
of your chest that persists longer than a couple of minutes,
or goes away then returns, shortness of breath, pain in
the arm or upper body. You might feel nauseous or faint.
And of course, if you're ever in doubt, call because,
like you said, you don't want to be having a
heart attack thinking it's will subside, there will be a
guy in your face. Well to say the last exactly, Uh,
(30:54):
If you want to know more about panic attacks and
panic disorder, type either one of those sets of words
into the search part how stuff works and it'll bring
up this article. And since I said that it's time
for a listener mail, I call this basement fear. Hey, guys,
I know most listeners know your podcasts great for learning
(31:14):
and entertainment, but I found another purpose distraction from stress
induced irrational fears. This sounds familiar. We were just talking
about this kind of thing. Oh yeah, And I didn't
even realize that when I picked this out. How about
that serendipity. Um, I grew up in a house with
a creepy, gross basement where we did laundry, and it
never bothered me. My fiance James, and I recently moved
(31:35):
into a house with a non creepy and non gross basement.
But I think the stress of planning a wedding is
getting to me because when I need to go down
into the basement to do laundry, I nearly have a
panic attack imagining a person lurking in the basement. I've
started playing an episode of Stuff You Should Know on
my iPhone and carrying it in my pocket when I
need to go down to the basement, stay back Spirit exactly,
(31:58):
so we literally accompanied her into the basementch I think
is hysterical. I am busy enough enjoying your humor and
information that I don't get us overwhelmed by this irrational fear.
I think it may even be waning now, so I
continue to make myself go down into the basement and
see that my fear is not really based in any
reality at all. Uh. That's CBT, that's exposure therapy boom.
(32:21):
Also before this weird basement, if you're popped up, I
long called you guys my cleaning crew because I listened
to episodes while doing my chores. And that is from
Kelsey in Kansas City, Kansas, not Kansas City, Missouri, Missouri.
And uh, Kelsey, good luck with that, and just don't
look behind that door over near the washing machine. That's
(32:42):
very helpful. Just getting Kelsey, there's nothing down there, and
just take us with you. Well, we will protect you
because spirits don't like us. The podcast is coming from
inside the house. If you want to get in touch
with Chuck or me, you can tweet to us at
s y s K podcast. You can join us on
Facebook dot com, slash stuff you Should Know. You can
(33:04):
send us an email to Stuff Podcast at how stuff
Works dot com and has always joined us at our
home on the web, Stuff you Should Know dot com.
For more on this and thousands of other topics, is
it how stuff Works dot com.
Welcome to you Stuff you should Know from House Stuff
Works dot com. Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm
Josh Clark. There's Child's w Chuck Bryant, and Jerry Stuff
you should know. Yep, Wide Spread Panic. Did you see
(00:22):
that video which one there was a dude this was
just like two days ago that went up on stage
and attacked the band. Oh no, I didn't see that. Yeah,
and they've got the whole thing and it was during
one of the really repetitive droning parts of a song.
And uh, I haven't seen an explanation but that there was.
I went to the Widespread Panic Facebook thing because there
was a big thread about people talking about it, and
(00:43):
I just said, Hero, did you really hate people gang
filing me? Going Hero, that's hilarious danger Stroll. I thought
it was pretty funny. He attacked the members of the band, yeah,
like physically, and I couldn't quite the drummer and he
was upset, and I don't know if that part of
(01:03):
the song made him snap, but it was definitely one
of those repetitive thank thank you, it's like stop. But
he was at the show, so that'd be weird unless
he went there to attack them. Yeah, that's probably the
bath salts maybe, so, so we're not talking about that
kind of panic. That's more a psychotic break. And this
(01:25):
is not widespread at all. It's very individualized panic, it is.
But it turns out people suffering from this is kind
of widespread. How about that? So it fits a little
bit sure. Instead, Um, we're talking about panic attacks and
the combination of panic attacks or the culmination of panic
(01:46):
attacks that can lead to something called panic disorder, and
it is a sucky mental condition that about two point
eight percent of Americans, which is a pretty significant amount
of people. Yeah, that's that's more than bipolar, which we've
covered in schizophrenia, Yeah, and o c D, which we well,
we've covered all three of this. Yeah. Um, so that's
(02:09):
a pretty significant amount of people who suffer from panic disorder. Right,
But that's different than just plain old panic attacks. Even
though to have panic disorder you have to have panic attacks,
but if you have panic attacks, you don't necessarily have
panic disorder exactly. And I've had two experiences which I'll
talk about at some point through the show, not personally,
(02:29):
but Emily had a panic attack once and uh friend
in college had a panic attack a roommate and neither
one of them have panic disorders. It was just an
isolated incident. Yeah, so apparently that's I don't know if
commons the right word, but people do have panic attacks
and they but they they that might be the only
one they ever have for their entire lives, hope, which
(02:51):
makes the whole thing kind of mysterious. And we should
say like science does not know what exactly is going
on here. That's some theory, but there's there's no there's
no way to predict what's happening now even know if
it's genetic or what environmental. Well, they finally isolated a
gene last year, Uh, I guess and go and talk
(03:14):
about that. Now in December they isolated the gene and
you know, genes are always so boring with their names,
unless it's a Simmons. That's right. The n k r
T three uh they think may be responsible um because
its presence appears to cause an over estimation of fear
and danger in an overactivation of the hippocampus and amygdala.
(03:37):
So basically, if you have this gene, you're gonna exaggerate
your fear overall. But it's not like they're saying they
prove that's the cause. But that is a good step
in scientifically in the right direction. That's a huge step,
because I mean that does sound very much like what
a panic attack is. A panic attack is where you
experience a very pronounced sense of fear and basically your
(04:02):
fight or flight symptoms response and really, from what I
can understand, your flight response. Yeah, like you're not in
a position to fight or freeze because you know now
these days it's fight, flight or freeze. Really yeah, I
don't think I knew that. Yeah, there's a third option now,
um like kind of oh no, wait, those aren't options
(04:23):
sets a sequence, right, This is these are options. So
when you're confronted with danger. Nick Thune, our buddy, the comedian, dude,
have you seen his hand of fit ads? Yeah, those
are awesome. I was like, that's Nick Thune and he's
on like Miss America. Yeah. The first thing I always
think about is good for you cash those checks baby.
Uh yeah. He has that funny bit on stop dropping rolling,
(04:45):
like they they needed to continue that, like keep rolling.
He's like, that's kind of key. Don't stop dropping roll
because you'll be consumed by fire. You need to keep rolling.
Right until you get to a door. Yeah, it's very
funny stuff. So this is a little different fight flight
or freeze? Yeah? What what's freeze factor in? Like you
just freeze up and toast? Yeah, at least beneficial of
(05:08):
all of the these adaptations to danger. But basically, when
you're when you're confronted with danger, you can either fight, fly,
or freeze. That makes total sense. I don't know why
freeze was never in there to begin with, because so
many people freeze. They just added on the last couple
of years. I think I'm a flyer or a freezer
for sure. It depends. I don't know if do you
(05:29):
think there's a personality type? Oh boy, I don't know. Um,
you know, don't you think it's possibly like just what
your body chemistry happens to be doing? Right then? No?
I think some people are more inclined to fight for sure. Okay, Well,
with panic attacks, you're flying like that's your only that's
your jam right there. Um, and you're experiencing it in
(05:49):
the exact same way that somebody's coming to mug you
or has pulled a knife on you and you're running away,
or there's a lion chasing you. Accept This is the
key to panic attack. There is no lion, there is
no mugger, there's no knife, there's no discernible reason for
you to be experiencing this sudden onset of crippling fear. Um.
(06:12):
But you're experiencing it nonetheless, that's right. No, no tangible
thing happening right in that moment. So when you come
out of it, and these things can they peak within
about ten minutes, but these the symptoms can last for
an hour more. Um. When you come out of it,
you're like, I don't ever want that to happen again.
(06:34):
The place that this just happened to, say, the park,
I'm never going back to because now I associated with
this because what you're doing when you experience fear, you're
learning to stay away from something. So whether you want
to or not, you've just been conditioned to fear the
place that you just were because you had a panic attack. Um.
And then lastly, you think possibly you're crazy, yeah, or
(06:57):
having a heart attack. Yeah that's uh. Both both of
the my wife and my friend both thought they were
having heart attacks, which is super scary. And we'll get
the difference later on. But um, I guess we should
talk about just some of the initial symptoms of a
panic attack. The old d s M Diagnostic and Statistical
Manual Mental Disorders lists, Uh, it looks like about ten
(07:20):
symptoms and if you have at least four of these,
you may be having a panic attack, which is heart pounding, shaking, dizziness, sweating, choking,
feeling nausea, shallow or short breath, chest pain, numbness or
tingling chills, and hot flashes, feeling of unreality, feeling like
you're going crazy, or feeling like you're about to die.
(07:41):
You got four of those, you're having a panic attack, yes, Um.
And if you have four panic attacks within four weeks,
or you have one panic attack and then fear having
another panic attack for about a month or so, then
you can be die diagnosed with what's called panic disorder. So, uh,
(08:03):
if you listen to our fear podcast, which was a
really good one, UM, it's kind of the same as
a panic attack. UM. We covered your Your autonomic nervous
system is what maintains all the functions in your body,
the involuntary functions in your body, that is, and it's
gonna take signals from your central nervous system. It's gonna
(08:23):
regulate your organs. That's why you don't have to tell
your heart to beat or your kid needs to work.
It's all your pancreas to secrete stuff. That's right. It's
your autonomic nervous system. And it has two parts, the
sympathetic and parasympathetic. And your parasympathetic controls like I said,
your your heart beat and stuff like that. You're the
normal aspect. Yeah, it's just right. Yeah, that balance that
(08:48):
we all seek that we don't know we're seeking. And
then the sympathetic is if you have that fight or flight,
if you become excited, uh in any way, really, that's
when that's gonna kick in. Yeah. It's like normal gear
and then high gear. Yeah, but it's not always fear,
you know, just any kind of excitement. Right, you could
be super happy, it could be sexual arousal. That's all
your sympathetic nervous system, right, And those two components make
(09:11):
up the autonomic nervous system, which it kind of switches
from one to the other depending on your state of arousal. Right,
that's right. Um, But when fear has aroused you, um,
your sympathetic nervous system kicks into high gear. Um. And
adrenaline is released, which is a huge factor in causing
the symptoms of a panic attack. Like you you start
(09:33):
breathing very heavily and shallowly, um, your pupils dilate you. Uh.
We always used to say if you're digesting food, you
stop doing that. Basically, all of your energy is transferred
over to either fighting or flying, and in the case
of a panic attack, is transferred over to get you
to be able to run away as fast as possible. Yeah,
(09:55):
which can be a little scary, but in a real
fear situation, if in danger, your parasympathetic nervous system is
going to kick in and calm you down. But that
is not what happens, uh, in the case of a
panic attack, which is really perplexing. So let's recap this.
A panic attack is when you experience this incredibly intense fear,
(10:16):
so much so that you run away but there's nothing
there to be afraid of. And then and then, to
make everything a million times worse, your parasympathetic nervous system
doesn't kick in and calm you down like it would
under normal circumstances, so you get to experience this horrible
thing even longer. That's right, and after this break, we
(10:39):
are going to get into some of the potential causes
of panic attacks. All right, So, like I said before,
breaking news from December last year, they think they've isolated
a gene. Previous to that, they've some research has said
it could be genetic because identical twins experience it more
(11:00):
than fraternal twins. But it's always been sort of up
in the air. They's been contradictions as well the genetic basis.
They think it's also possibly epigenetic or environmental like um.
Apparently one study found that a lot of people who
have panic disorder had some sort of traumatic incident happened
in their childhood. My friend from college did, Is that right?
(11:22):
So they're thinking like possibly it had some sort of
effect and set up like a time bomb for later
on in life. Yeah, the stored uh feelings that maybe
you've never dealt with about some traumatic event are gonna
they're gonna rear their head at some point in your
life in some way. Yeah, Or it just rearranged the
neural output in your brain so that one day you're
(11:45):
just set up when everything is just right, that chemistry
is flooding your brain in a certain way, and then Bam,
it comes out of nowhere, you have a panic attack. Yeah.
Another theory is that they think if you have an
over active fear system, like you've basically have been scared
(12:05):
too much in life, or you're a scared person, then
it's just gonna make it a hair trigger for something
to set it off, which makes a lot of sense.
I think it could be a combo with a lot
of things as usual. Yeah. I wonder though, what what
it will end up being that if we'll find that
there is one thing that that leads to this predictably
like built up, but then there's the actual trigger. Yeah,
(12:29):
and that's another thing too. So they don't know what
triggers these things. They do know that a panic attack.
Being worried about having a panic attack can actually trigger
a panic attack. Absolutely. I feel so bad for people
a panic disorder. This is like a terrible affliction because
you do become very much afraid that you're going to
have another panic attack. So that can set off a
(12:51):
panic attack, but it also can set off a code
morbidity called agoraphobia, where you are afraid to leave your house,
but you're also afraid to be alone. And I read this,
um this article that was from the eighties seven, and
they were saying, like, the the freudis the Freudists, followers
(13:14):
of Sigmund Freud. We're saying, um, oh, well, clearly, if
you're in a gooraphobic you don't want to go outside
because that's where sexual desire is, and you don't want
to be alone because you're worried that you will like
abuse yourself, So agoraphobia. And everybody went boom, sit down
and shut up. Yeah, and um, so nowadays they have
(13:36):
realized that agoraphobia is almost almost exclusively the result of
panic disorder. Yeah, and it's because you you fear the
place that you had a panic attack, so you don't
want to go there again. And then maybe it happened
again at the grocery store, so you don't want to
go there, and it happened. You don't want to be alone,
(13:58):
but you don't want to be around strangers, so you
into your family members and now all of a sudden,
you're not living your life anymore. Yeah, you're developing phobias
because of your panic attacks in your association with them.
Like if you're on an elevator and you have a
panic attack, you're not getting on an elevator again, you've
just developed a phobia for elevators, and so all of
a sudden, you're not going to be working at a
(14:18):
place where you might normally work because you have to
take the elevator to to get there. Or do you
develop a love of stairs? Right? But then what if
you're you don't like confined spaces at all, like a
stairwell either. Yeah you ever been locked in the stairwell
here at the building? Yeah? I mean you just walk
down however many flights until you're at the lobby. Oh,
you can get out down there? Yes, okay, yeah, yeah,
(14:41):
you're not actually locked in, you just have to walk
all the way down to Usually just call you and
say lee. Another theory is that when you're super tired,
um and overworked was when a lot of times when
these are set off, your brain is producing sodium lactate
or c O two and when those increase, your brain
(15:01):
uh says you know what, I think you're suffocating, and
so I'm going to send a signal to get you
a lot more oxygen. And I found this uh really
sad case of this woman, a university student who died
from a severe asthma attack like three days ago. Uh,
and she had had a history of asthma, and then
(15:24):
told the medics that she was going through like final
exams and she had been having panic attacks uh for
in the weeks like proceeding. So breathing is a huge
part of panic attacks. And as evidenced by her, if
you have asthma, it's can be deadly, which is super
super scary and sad. Yeah. Um. Then one other I
(15:47):
guess there's a neurological basis they believe for people who
have panic attacks. People who suffer from panic disorder tend
to have fewer serotonin receptors and apparently also UM gabba
which helps us get to sleep. It's called a gamma
immuno beautyic acid. Let's call it gabba gabba. Um. Those
(16:10):
two have some sort of role in UM panic disorder.
Like you don't have enough serotonin and your body is
not producing enough gabba, you may be prone to panic disorder. Uh.
They you know, there isn't like a specific type of
person that necessarily gets a panic attack. It can happen
to anyone, but um, usually it happens if you're you're
(16:31):
in your twenties. Although they say kids can get it
as well have a panic attack or a disorder. Um,
twice as many women have a panic disorder developed one
as men, which is pretty interesting. Um. And like you said,
just the fear like having had one before, that fear
can lead to more. So it's very cyclical, yes. And
you know, um that one paper from seven. I can't
(16:55):
tell if it was arguing in favor of panic disorder
being like an evolutionary adaptation and like possibly beneficial, or
if they were saying, like some people think this, can
you believe this? But they were. One of the points
that this guy made was well, twice as many women
have panic disorders as men, So clearly it's an evolutionary
(17:17):
adaptation because women wouldn't have had to have gone as
far away from camp while they were gathering food as men.
For men couldn't stand to have a panic attack, or
they couldn't, it wouldn't be an adaptation for men, it
would be for women. Plus women can't run as fast
when they have kids to carry, so they need to
be on alert a little more. It's just smelled like
(17:39):
bunk bunk. That was a big year for bunk. Yeah. Um,
if you do have a panic disorder. You may have
a hard time getting your family to understand it. UM.
Sometimes they overreact and think it's like way more severe
than it is. UM. Sometimes they underreact and say, uh,
(18:01):
you know, it's all in your head, like just calm down. UM.
But either way it's saying, boy, you're nuts or you
just need to relax. Neither one of those is going
to help out the loved one. Chill out, there's no lion.
One thing I've learned in arguments and fights with my
wife is and I'm boilerning this early on is saying
(18:23):
telling someone to relax never causes someone to relax. It's
like the worst thing you can do if something's heated
is to say just relax. That's just gonna ramp it up.
So that's my advice for couples out there in any relationship.
Really good, Thank you. UM. There is a silverlying to
all this in that panic disorder is actually highly treatable.
(18:47):
It's the treatments that they've come up with are pretty successful,
and we will talk about those treatments right after this.
All right, So you mentioned that they are treatable. They
have found success rates through medication and therapy, which seemed
(19:10):
to be about the same as far as how affective
they are between sixty and of the time. That's pretty good. Yeah,
that's not bad at all. So that's the good news.
So there's three. There's three UM typical methods of treatment
UM antidepressants, anti anxiety, pills, and therapy. And you might
use them, you know, independent of what another in conjunction
(19:33):
with one another. I also saw beta blockers. Some people
use beta blockers to treat them, but they're not quite
sure what's going on with that. I've used those before
live performances. Those are the ones I read about that UM,
you gave me one, and I was like a useless worm. Yeah,
it didn't affect me like that. I I was, I
just like totally lost my personality. I wasn't nervous, but
(19:53):
I didn't do anything. Well, I've gotten used to live
performing now, so I don't need them anymore. But I
got that to from apparently a bunch of musicians, like
in symphonies and stuff use And I was like, well,
if first chair of Violinist, if it's good for them
to give me some beta blockers. But it worked for me.
But like I said, I'm over all that. I enjoy
(20:14):
being on stage. Now. So with s SR eyes, which
is what you moved on too from beta blockers, right, No,
I'm not on it. So with SSR eyes, UM, those
are selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors, and they do exactly what
they sound like. You've got a bunch of serotonin receptors
in your brain. If you have panic disorder, you may
(20:35):
have fewer serotonin receptors in your brain. Serotonin is a
neurotransmitter that helps basically stabilize your mood by either causing
a neuron to fire or inhibiting a neuron to fire
in this really beautiful, perfectly balanced chemical reaction. Right, So
if you have a few of these receptors the normal,
(20:56):
you're going to be comparatively out of balanced. What an
SSR I, an antidepressant, does is it allows the serotonin
to kind of stay in your synaps is a little
longer than as normal, so that you are releasing a
little more serotonin than you would under normal circumstances. And
it's proven pretty effective for UM for panic disorder. Yeah,
(21:18):
I mean, they'd work wonders for a lot of people
for a lot of reasons, UM, but not everyone. And
they can cause a lot of negative side effects. Uh.
So obviously, you know, work with your doctor on a program,
and it takes them a little while, like two to
four weeks to begin working. Uh for a panic attack. Um,
an anti anxiety drug like xan x might be a
(21:40):
little more effective because that is immediately hits you. It
is a tranquilizer benzodiazepine, right yeah, and it's um, you know,
the zanex is going to help chill you out immediately,
but you can get hooked on those things pretty quick. Yeah,
and they're dangerous to quit cold turkey and um, yeah,
(22:02):
it's it's not the best thing to go to xanex
a lot. Well, yeah, they say that you should, um
basically if you if you undertake an ssr I regimen,
you can conceivably stay on it for years. If you
undertake anti anxiety or benzo diazepine regimen, like it shouldn't
last for more than a couple of weeks or month
(22:24):
from what I understand, because of the dependency. And again,
you want to like really do all of this with
like a um qualified competent doctor's assistants, not a doctor's assistant,
doctor's assistant. It depends if it's a qualified competent doctor's
assistant who can write prescriptions, who trust go for it,
(22:45):
that's true. Uh. And then there's therapy of course, the
old CBT cognitive behavioral therapy, which we've talked about a bunch,
but um, that is Uh, they're gonna sort of the
processes is gonna play out like this. They're gonna teach
you out your panic disorder, which is a big step.
If you understand something, uh, you can overcome it more easily.
(23:06):
I think they're gonna monitor you and you're gonna self
monitor and record your symptoms and when they happen and
why they happen, what the circumstance was. Breathing, like we mentioned,
is a huge part of it. Um, anything from meditation
to just regular breathing exercises which will give you some
tips on that in a minute too, are going to
help you out. And then the old exposure two uh situations.
(23:31):
Then this is once you've rethought, like your what your
approach is going to be, Like here's your new outlook
and now here's a situation that might give you a
panic attack. How do you feel? Yeah, or like if
you had a panic attack and an elevator, like they
may tell you to imagine you're in an elevator. Your
therapy might progress until you're actually in an elevator and
you're chilling out. And the hope is that if if
(23:53):
you can undergo exposure therapy to that degree, it will
get you over your panic attacks in general. Another aspect
of it, Chuck, is rethinking, uh, and that is basically
accepting the fact that you have panic attacks. Apparently if
you can say I'm having a panic attack or I
have panic attacks and you acknowledge it to yourself and
(24:15):
to other people, it immediately turns down the volume on
the whole thing. Yeah, I noticed some similarities and uh,
someone guiding through someone through an LSD trip and guiding
someone through a panic attack. It's interesting. A lot of
it is like understanding, like I am having an acid trip,
I am not having a good time. It's the same
(24:35):
thing as I'm having a panic attack and this is
no good And if I understand that, then I can
calm down more easily and keeping it in just lead
you to freak out more exactly. Um, So that's CBT
cognitive behavioral therapy and um, if you if you undergo
therapy and you're still suffering from panic attacks. The apparently
(24:58):
being discouraged as a a real problem with people with
panic disorder because you can still suffer them even if
you're doing everything right. Um, and so a lot of
people have learned to cope, and there's some pretty common
coping techniques for a panic disorder. And like you said,
the heart of the whole thing is breathing. Like when
you suffer a panic attack, you start breathing shallowly and quickly,
(25:22):
and um, you can hyperventilate. What you want to do
is breathe from your diaphragm and that you can actually
practice this in the times when you're not having a
panic attack. Yeah, if you're a singer, you know how
to breathe with your diaphragm. But if you're not, what
you can do is lie down on your back, put
some pillows on your head and knees, and um, put
(25:43):
a hand on your stomach and a hand on your chest,
and then practice breathing, uh, and making your hand on
your stomach move without the hand on your chest moving
and then tap the hand on your stomach while you
make a circle with a hand on your chest. When
you're really advanced. Wow, it's pretty impressive. Uh. And then
another thing you can do is just literally like put
(26:06):
a weight on your stomach and make sure to heavy
like a book. Yeah, like a nice something that you
can see going up and down when you're breathing with
your diaphragm, that's right. Um, And you want to just
kind of breathe in the good exhale the bad. Yeah,
Like I'm having a panic attack. This will pass, you know,
this will subside. This is a temporary feeling. That's what
(26:29):
you should be saying to yourself. And if you're a
person who's like out in public and you see somebody
having a panic attack, you basically want to do the
same thing that they're trying to do for themselves. You
want to remain calm. You want to tell them that
it's going to be over with pretty soon, that everything's okay,
they have nothing to fear. Um. Yeah, you don't want
to tell them to chill out, though. Uh. Guiding someone
(26:53):
through relaxation is different than saying chill out, by the way, right,
very different. Uh. They do recommend that you, um, if
you have a problem with with attacks in general, or
if you have a disorder, you should exercise a lot.
You should practice Um, they don't call it meditation, but
that's really what it is, is deep breathing and relaxation.
It's called mindfulness these days, isn't it. I don't know.
(27:15):
I think that's what they call it, because meditation turns
people off, right, guess interesting? Uh cut cut out the
caffeine and sugar and nicotine. Yeah, that's not gonna help
you at all, Uh doing all those things. Uh. And
you know, if this stuff is stuff that's building up
inside of you, which it often is, learn how to
express yourself a little more and um and talk about
(27:37):
your issues. Um. I know that in both of my cases.
My buddy in college, it was during finals week and
I had gone to bed and my roommate and another
dude had were out in the living room staying up,
and one of them came and woke me up and
he's like, dude, he's having a heart attack. He's having
a heart attack. And um, I didn't know anything about
panic attacks. So we took him the hospital, of course,
(28:00):
and that's all it was. It was a panic attack.
He calmed down. I think, um, I think it might
have given him something there. I met some sort of
medication to calm him down. Probably Benzo. Yeah, probably like
a good shot in the arm of that stuff. And
he was like, I'm fine. Right With Emily's case, she
had been under a lot of stress and was and
(28:21):
driving back from Akron, Ohio to Atlanta. I think she
went to get I think she had to get some
furniture or something. So she was in a truck, like
a moving truck, had been drinking caffeine like crazy, like
she does, and um, basically, uh started to have trouble
breathing on the highway going like e d down the
(28:41):
highway and had to pull over. Called me, and you know,
I calmed her down. I was like, all right, now,
let's get back on the road. See how you do.
She got back on the highway and immediately freaked out again.
And Uh, I flew to Cincinnati and went to a
hotel and drove her home. Yeah, I mean there was
really no choice at that point. Uh. You know, when
(29:01):
it's your wife, you Plus, it was a good opportunity
to get on the white horse, you know, and right
in and save the day. I think everyone loves those opportunities,
you know. And it's and I've always also wanted to
run to the airport, like give me a one way
ticket this somewhere I have time for your body scan.
(29:22):
Pretty much. That's how it happened. So she checked herself
into a hotel and I went there and had some
nice Cincinnati Skyline chili, and then the next morning we
hit the road. Yeah, that was good, and she hasn't
had one since then, despite like, uh, you know, she
she has a lot of anxiety just as a human,
but um, no panic attacks. So I definitely have seen
(29:44):
the things I saw in this article and both of them,
whether it was during finals, like the things going on
in her life at the time, we're super stressful. I
think the trigger was she doesn't like see great at
night or in the rain when she's driving, and I
think all these things compounded, um and just played out
to where she felt like she's having a heart attack,
and so did my friend. But I guess we should
(30:06):
mention that there are some tailtale signs of a heart attack. Yeah,
that's a big yeah, that you can recognize the difference,
because you don't want to actually be having a heart
attack and be like it's just a panic. Just breathe,
just breathe while you're dying. Um. Here are a few
tips from the American heart association. Pressure in the center
(30:29):
of your chest that persists longer than a couple of minutes,
or goes away then returns, shortness of breath, pain in
the arm or upper body. You might feel nauseous or faint.
And of course, if you're ever in doubt, call because,
like you said, you don't want to be having a
heart attack thinking it's will subside, there will be a
guy in your face. Well to say the last exactly, Uh,
(30:54):
If you want to know more about panic attacks and
panic disorder, type either one of those sets of words
into the search part how stuff works and it'll bring
up this article. And since I said that it's time
for a listener mail, I call this basement fear. Hey, guys,
I know most listeners know your podcasts great for learning
(31:14):
and entertainment, but I found another purpose distraction from stress
induced irrational fears. This sounds familiar. We were just talking
about this kind of thing. Oh yeah, And I didn't
even realize that when I picked this out. How about
that serendipity. Um, I grew up in a house with
a creepy, gross basement where we did laundry, and it
never bothered me. My fiance James, and I recently moved
(31:35):
into a house with a non creepy and non gross basement.
But I think the stress of planning a wedding is
getting to me because when I need to go down
into the basement to do laundry, I nearly have a
panic attack imagining a person lurking in the basement. I've
started playing an episode of Stuff You Should Know on
my iPhone and carrying it in my pocket when I
need to go down to the basement, stay back Spirit exactly,
(31:58):
so we literally accompanied her into the basementch I think
is hysterical. I am busy enough enjoying your humor and
information that I don't get us overwhelmed by this irrational fear.
I think it may even be waning now, so I
continue to make myself go down into the basement and
see that my fear is not really based in any
reality at all. Uh. That's CBT, that's exposure therapy boom.
(32:21):
Also before this weird basement, if you're popped up, I
long called you guys my cleaning crew because I listened
to episodes while doing my chores. And that is from
Kelsey in Kansas City, Kansas, not Kansas City, Missouri, Missouri.
And uh, Kelsey, good luck with that, and just don't
look behind that door over near the washing machine. That's
(32:42):
very helpful. Just getting Kelsey, there's nothing down there, and
just take us with you. Well, we will protect you
because spirits don't like us. The podcast is coming from
inside the house. If you want to get in touch
with Chuck or me, you can tweet to us at
s y s K podcast. You can join us on
Facebook dot com, slash stuff you Should Know. You can
(33:04):
send us an email to Stuff Podcast at how stuff
Works dot com and has always joined us at our
home on the web, Stuff you Should Know dot com.
For more on this and thousands of other topics, is
it how stuff Works dot com.
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