August 18, 2011 • 32 mins
The U.S. Government's Consolidated Terrorist Watch List keeps track of people who are known or suspected terrorists. But what how do people end up on it, and what happens if your name is similar to a suspected terrorist? Tune in to find out.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Brought to you by the reinvented two thousand twelve camera.
It's ready. Are you welcome to stuff you should know
from house Stuff Works dot Com. Hey, and welcome to
the Chuck Show. I'm Josh with me always of course
this Chuck Charles w Chucker's Bryant. That's weird. It sounded
(00:23):
the Chuck Show. It sounds like you said the Chuck Show.
You should be Chuck Show. Did you hear at that time?
I did, How you do? Chuck? Get out of here?
You fire? I'm waiting for this day for that would
be awful and such like I don't even want to
say relief. That sounds awful, but you know how it is.
(00:44):
It would be devastating and also like, ah, my brain
can relax, and then the next day I'd be all
upset again. I know what you're talking about. What I'm saying.
I used to have an alternative weekly newspaper, and whenever
we were up on deadline, deadline, deadline, deadline, and we'd
missed the deadline, there was a sense of abject failure
that was encapsulated by the greatest sense of relief you
(01:08):
ever experienced. I don't want to I know exactly what
you're talking about. I don't think I feel relieved here
because we got this. We got this all right, Yes,
say reassure me again, you got it good? Um, Chuck Josh. Okay,
we should probably chill out a little bit because what
we're about to talk about is uh, to some a
(01:33):
a necessary evil. To others, it's brain dead national security
that we should have been doing since seventeen seven. Uh,
And to others, it's an egregious affront to civil liberties
of citizens. Yeah, but you know what I found. I
did some research on the a c l You. I
(01:54):
haven't found anyone that says like we shouldn't have a
watch list. No, but it's just like, hey, if you're
gonna have a watch list, you're gonna you're gonna do
it better than this. Yes, from the a c l
U as well. Um, And I think everybody just assumed
I was talking about the A c l U and
I said that some people find it to civil liberties. Um.
(02:17):
I was when we were researching this, like I had
this um little tick in the back of my head,
right and I was burning and saying like there was
something about nine eleven and I was like, oh, yeah,
there were all these different warnings, all these different agencies
had information about al Qaeda. Apparently Bush was briefed before,
(02:41):
like the month before in the New York Times reported
back in two thousand four, Um, and it Alkada was
being watched. There. We were aware that there was a
hijacking plot, and they are all of these people, most
of them at least were on watch lists. But the
problem was is all of these agencies were in the
midst of like some serious turf wars, and no one
(03:04):
was talking to one another, No agency was sharing this
information with one another, which kind of part of the
course from what I understand. Yeah, but I think that
changed in large part after nine eleven. Right, if it
didn't change in spirit, at the very least it changed
in practice on paper because all those different lists after
(03:26):
nine eleven happened were consolidated pretty quickly. After nine eleven happened. Um.
I think May of two thousand three, Bush signed something
called Homeland Security Presidential Directive six, and the first one,
signed in two thousand one, I believe, established Homeland Security
as an agency. Two years later he signed six basically
(03:50):
saying have you read it, uh, two, three, four and
five or six? Six, is there, two, four and five,
there's a there's one. It loses focused towards the end.
The last one was signed on bushes last day in office,
and uh, it basically says all those international treaties we
signed that say the Arctic and the Antarctic are belonged
(04:11):
to everybody. No one can claim on we were invoked
a part about the Arctic. We decided that the US
is quote an Arctic nation and therefore it has to
protect its Arctic interests, specifically natural resources as a matter
of national security. Yeah, so it kind of lost focused
for the end. But early on with with the Presidential
Directive six that said we need to take all of
(04:34):
these watch lists and create a central watch list, and
we need to actually administer it or administrate it properly.
And that created chuck, the consolidated a terrorist watch list.
Because it's consolidated, it makes a lot of So that's
the government list that everyone is long joked about. There
(04:59):
were lists before were but the one that everybody thought
about prior to two thousand one or two thousand three,
um didn't bear any resemblance to this one. This is
the list. Anyone who's ever been even remotely suspected of
being a terrorist. What's the language, um, engaging in terrorist activities? Right, Uh,
(05:19):
suspected to have engaged in conduct constituting in preparation for
an aid of or related to terrorism. Yes, And apparently
associating with a known terrorists isn't enough to get you
on that list. Yeah, because after September eleven, there were
not many guidelines. It was just sort of let's just
put a bunch of names on the list. I mean,
not that will annially obviously, but um, they realized they
(05:43):
needed to refine it over the years, and I think
in two thousand nine was the last major revision, seventy
two page memorandum. Yeah, in February o nine. That's that
clarified what the minimum substantive derogatory criteria was. What is Well,
it's a seventy two page or mirandum, but associating with
(06:04):
an known terrorist, suspected terrorists is not enough. There had
to be evidence of that you actually supported terrorism, and
it generally requires more than a single single source, which
is good. Really Yeah, like, hey, this one guy said
you were so boom, you're on the list. So they
refined it some over the year prior to two thousand nine.
(06:26):
I think it was a little more, a little easier
to get on there. And that's when a lot of
the press um was generated about this. A lot of
the media was up in arms or reporting about people
being up in arms. There are tons of stories and
all that. Yeah. Um, And you can kind of tell
like how open it was, um by just the sheer numbers.
(06:47):
Right in two thousand three, I think the thing opened
up for business, um with thousand people, three names. Yeah,
that was a no. Six two thousand six. Yeah, Now
there's over a million supposedly. See, that number is highly disputed.
So the a c l U says a million or more. Um.
(07:08):
A lot of people reported that, but that's just the
a c l USE estimate. The T s A says
it's less than four hundred thousand. And they threw in
that of those people are foreign nationals and and even
in the country even they say, see I I can
see them Like. That struck me as the same as
(07:30):
saying like one of your buddies being like I'm ninety
nine nine nine percent positive. You know, I wonder how
how accurate that is. Yeah, it's hard to get stats
on this stuff because a lot of it is kept
under wraps for a good reason, including the criteria. Um
who's on there? And yeah, like you said, for good reason,
there is. It's a very it's Orwellian circular logic. And
(07:54):
of course I think everyone who has play on this
knew that the word Orwellian was going to come up
at least once, knowing us right. But um, they are
saying that they can't release information on this list because
then you know how to beat the list. And I'm
a defender of civil liberties and I will even admit
that this is a tough situation because you can't just
(08:16):
do everything behind closed doors, but you also can't open
it wide open because then it kind of defeats the
system in a lot of ways. So this is a
tough one. It is very tough when it comes to that, uh,
that number of the names on there. Um, it's not
necessarily individual people. That's different spellings of single name. Yeah,
that's aliases of these people. So there could be a
(08:40):
fraction of that number of actual people that are on
this list, But there's all these different spellings or whatever.
Countries are on the list, not like entire countries, well
entire countries, but not saying your entire country is on
the list. It's just I think country from that country. Yeah,
then you then you, I think the red flag is raised.
(09:02):
Not necessarily, you're because Israel was on the list recently
and they said, oh, that was a big mistake. Israel
shouldn't be on the list obviously. So yeah, but that
just happened I think within the past few months, is there, right,
that would have made a great intro. Yeah, I like
your intro. Yes, So with nominating, right, he said, Now,
it takes more than one source to get you on there.
(09:24):
That's what they say. Apparently before that revision, UM, somebody
from the FBI, the n s A, the c i A,
the f d A, the SEC, pretty much any government
agency could say NASA, hey, yeah, hey, I think any
government agency, anybody from a government agency, UM could nominate you.
(09:48):
And you're nominated, right, yes, And that that means you're
put before or you physically are, but your name is
put before the Terrorist Review and Examination Unit and they'd
start checking things out and then pass you along to
the Terrorist Screening Center and the watch list if you
are deemed by their criteria to be a threat. Right.
And the Terrorist Screening Center is a branch of the FBI,
(10:11):
and they're the ones who are responsible for um administering
this the watch list, right, um, and it's it's it's
most closely associated with flying. It's a no fly list,
is is what it's often called. Well, no, those are
two different lists, oh are they? Yeah, there's a no
fly list, there's a selectee list, and then there's the
(10:32):
terrorism watch list. Okay, laying on me, Well, the no
fly list only has like five thousand people on it. Okay,
but it's it's different. Um, but if you're on the
no fly list, obviously you're also on the terrorism watch list,
right But I as I understand it, if you're on
the terrorism watch list, you may pop up when you
go through a t S A screening. Yeah. Yeah, so
like if you're on this terrorism watch So if you're
(10:53):
on a no fly list, like they they your name
pops up and they just take you to prison essentially. Well,
they do a range of things from take you away
to be investigated in first and never heard from again,
or the people have been arrested. Okay, so that's but
these are people who are probably like known terrorists or not. Okay,
(11:15):
but on the no fly list, Yeah, both. That's what
that's what created a lot of the problems. Is that
is that you know, like an eight year old boy
was on the no fly list and this lady researched
a Muslim woman from I can't remember where she's from,
but she was a Stanford duct toil candidate. And you
can get placed on the no fly lists while you're
(11:37):
while you're on vacation, and then you can't come back
into the country. There are Army veterans stranded in Colombia
and other countries that can't come back because their name
is erroneously on the no fly list. And it takes
a long time to get it off. I would imagine
sixty seven days to get off the terrorist watch list.
That's the average. But I don't know about that. I
(11:59):
bet it takes more than that. Okay, Um, so chuck,
I guess with when you fly? Also, um, there's this
program called safe Flight that's administered by the Terrorists Screening
Center where every flight manifest is um checked against the lists.
That's good, it is good. That's the first step, I
(12:21):
gast um. But so the terrorist Screening centers there there
in charge. So are they in charge of the select
list and the no fly lists as well. It's all
under Homeland Security. Okay, um, but this is FBI, right okay,
so um, they they're maintaining these lists, but they're also
tracking the people who are on the list, hopefully the
(12:45):
right people. But if your name apparently is on the
terrorist watch list, there is a screen in northern Virginia.
No one knows where, well, no one can say where
anyone who knows, and you are a red dot on
that screen and you're tracked constantly apparently, Um, I don't
know if the dot is read necessarily, but the color
(13:06):
changes depending on the length of time it's been since
you made contact or a law enforcement officer made contact
with you, like since the last time you flew, last
time you got pulled over for a ticket, the last
time they came into your house, whatever, Um, the color changes.
But there's someone who watches you, uh, when you get
pulled over and you're on this list, Well, if you
(13:29):
or I get pulled over, your name's run right if
it gets if it pops up, then the law enforcement
officers alerting the terrorist Screening Center. From what I read,
most of the time, the terrorist Screening Center already knows
you just got pulled over. Yeah, well that's anto and
that's MPRS reporting too, And it was Dean and Temple
(13:51):
Raston who actually went to the center, So it's not
that's not like yeah, and I hope we don't come
across the sea and like, oh they shouldn't do like
police terrorists and things like that, because it's not the case.
I don't think so. Although John Lewis, the name John
Lewis was on the no fly list, John Lewis, he's uh.
I think he's still a representative here, isn't he. Yeah, Okay,
I think so. From from Georgia, from Atlanta. I believe
(14:14):
he was a civil rights leader as well, and his
name was on there. He kept getting hassled going through
the airport. Um, and not because he was suspected of
any kind of terrorist activity, but because his name matched
one of the spellings of the name of somebody on
the terrorist watch list, right, as did every other John Lewis.
(14:35):
So right, So if you are, um, that's one good
way to find out that your name is likely on
the terrorist watch list is getting held up at the airport.
John Lewis isn't the only one. Very Famously, there was
a nun named Sister Glenn and McPhee right, And she
apparently spent a lot of time getting interrogated. Um so
(14:59):
much so the Council of Bishops called the White House
and said, you gotta take her off. How much was
she flying? Is what I wanted to know. I don't know,
since she's hassled a lot. It's like, didn't I didn't
know nuns like traveled that much. The sister of the
Flying Cross of the Flying Nuneah uh. And as I mentioned,
there's an eight year old famously in New York. And
even though they came out and said there are no
(15:20):
eight year olds on the list, it's a myth. There
is an eight year old on the list. I don't
know if he still is, but the parents said, now
he's right here, come meet him. He's a boy scout.
And the first time he was pulled aside and frist
was when he was two wow, at an airport. Two
years old on the terrorist watch list was first. Yeah,
pretty pretty neat. So that's led to a lot of
calls about UM reducing the watch list, making it uh
(15:44):
more UM focused. Yeah uh. And apparently it sounds like
Obama made those changes in two thousand nine, Right, what
what was that? What happened there? Well, what you were
talking about, like, it's the criteria's narrowed a lot more
like it takes two sources to get you on the list.
Just associating with somebody will keep you off the list.
(16:06):
And then, Um, I wonder if redress is gotten any easier.
I don't know, redresses the process of of like sort
of applying to get off the list. And um, that's
for the terrorism watch list. Apparently the no fly list,
there's not much of a process going on there, and
it's led to a lot of frustration from people like
(16:26):
John Lewis. But yeah, now you apply and they I
think you have to apply through it the agency. You
can't just call the FBI or no, you can't call
Homeland Security. You have to apply through the agency that
gave you trouble, like the t s A or whoever it.
And then they give you what's called a redress number.
So when you book travel you you include that. Yeah,
(16:48):
and it's like it's basically like I've been cleared. There's proof.
I'm sure you're not on any list. Then, um, so, Chuck,
how do you get on this list? Aside from the
obvious of being a terror a known terrorist, or a
suspected terrorists, well appropriately suspected terrists. You could be, UM,
a member of some sort of extremist organization, like even
(17:11):
a hardcore like environmental organization might land you on the list,
Like ELF, Yeah, what what are they? Earth Liberation Front? Yes,
they like to burn down subdivisions, UM that are built
over clear cut forests. Really, they like to burn down
any subdivision where any trees or sacrificed or whatever, you know,
the kind where they go in and cut all the
(17:32):
trees down, build everything and then go replant like little saplings,
those kind of subdivisions. ELF likes to go in before
they're populated and burn them all to the ground, really,
and then maybe leave a garage standing and spray paint
e LF on it. That's that's domestic terrorism, really, I mean, yeah,
this twelve the Order of the Twelve Monkeys, it is,
(17:52):
isn't it. Yeah? So yeah, if you remember ELF, if
you're UM, like a member of I would imagine any
group that's been deemed the hate group or an extremist group,
the domestic group, you might be on that list. You're
probably on the list. But again, I think most people
except that at the very least, Um, American citizens are
(18:14):
in the minority on the government terrorist watch list. Right, yeah,
which is what I was trying to say, Which is
why it's easy for of the people or to say like, oh,
what's the big deal? Wait till you're one of those
first you know what I'm saying. Um, you found some
other ways to though, some like more mundane ways. Yeah, sadly, Um,
I shouldn't say sadly. I found it on Maxim. There's
(18:38):
some good magazine. Yes, there was some. Um, I just
did a Google search. It's not like I was like,
what does Maxim have to say about this? Right? Um?
There was There are four that I found that I
thought were pretty good. One is, um, searching using Google
well could get you flagged. We can be watched under
the Patriot Act. Certain was searching for certain terms. I
(18:59):
guess yeah, Okay, Um, we do a lot of research. Man,
that's kind of scary to think about. Well I imagine that,
Like if that's the case, then yeah, just just researching
for this podcast. Um, last minute flights Apparently after a
certain number of last minute flights, you will be flagged
and even just doing your your immediate flight, like just
(19:21):
the first time you do it, they're gonna pay extra
attention to you because you're booking a last minute flight. Um.
And apparently patterns the government loves patterns, and if you're
operating within a normal pattern, you're likely going to be
less scrutinized. Um. When you suddenly book of last minute flight,
then they're gonna be like, wait, that's abnormal and we're
(19:43):
gonna pay attention to you. Or if you pay with cash,
that's abnormal, we're gonna pay attention to you. There there's
certain patterns that the normal, average person does without even thinking, um,
and when you act outside of that, then you're gonna
invite more scrutiny. Um. Apparently email as well is also
(20:04):
under the Patriot Act likes to be watched, so if
you say something stupid on there, so basically you and
I are on the list. Uh. They also the Homeland
Security this week said that the terror watch list is
exempt from the Privacy Act, which was brought about after Watergate.
It basically permit citizens to obtain files about them with
(20:28):
the intent of correcting it, which is what this would
be all about. And they said, no, we're not under
the Privacy Act, and that was that's the biggest problem
with a c l u IS is put a system
in place. First of all, like you said, they think
it's bloated and thirty two thousand nine Justice Department Inspector
(20:48):
General report, Yeah, I found that thirty of the nominations
to the lists were outdated. So it's like it's counterproductive.
Even it's not like they're just saying it's not fair,
it's not in the job that it should be doing
if it's bloated. But their whole point is just have
a system in place, a transparent system in place where
you can go. I mean, I guess redresses that for
(21:10):
the terrorism watch list, but it doesn't sound like a
very good system. Well, they also have a really big
um bone of contention in that this is technically unconstitutional.
There's something um against unlawful search and seizure, search and
seizure without due process or at least probable cause. And
if you're an eight year old boy scout, there's really
no way of justifying the fact that you're being searched
(21:34):
without probable cause. You know, just because some just because
there's terrorists out there doesn't give probable cause to some
individual who's not a terrorist to be searched. It's kind
of that simple. Yeah. But again, as you say, it's
really tough to to say, all, we need to just
do away with this. I just I don't think that's
(21:57):
the cases. Think there's better ways to do it. Yeah.
On this had a couple of more startling things on
the state level. You know, you can't profile. Federal policies
prohibit that, and you can't on the state level either,
but they allow states to. Um, they have different criteria
for each state on what is deemed suspicious at least
not necessarily this will get you nominated, but red flags
(22:19):
at least and uh in Ohio, Um, any immersion and
I'm sorry, immersion in a purely Muslim environment could get
you red flagged. Uh. They advise landlords in some states
to be alert on tenants who preferred ground floor apartments
and who have little furniture. And then uh, anyone the
(22:40):
study of technical subjects like engineering, just engineering. Huh. It's interesting. Um.
Do you remember when the Patriot Act was first being
discussed for the three minutes Um. One of the one
of the mandates in it was that postal employees were
expected to spy and report on people on their route.
(23:03):
And the post office actually pushed back and said we're
not doing that. Oh yeah, that's right, and they won.
It was taken out, but it was in there like
they wanted to deploy the postal service as a as
domestic spies. They're like, dude, we just don't want to
get bit by dogs. Just we've got enough on her
plate as it is. I gotta redress stat for you
(23:25):
to alright that Conger found. This is written by Kristen
Konger from Stuff Mom Never told you. Yeah, and she's
got a new host. We should mention, yes, new co
host Molly is no longer there and she and they're
doing a great job with you know, and best of
elect to Molly. Of course she's she's writing her heart
out right now. Yeah, sitting right next to you. Anyway. Uh.
(23:45):
Conger found this stat and from two thousand five to
two thousand seven, thirty five of people who complained that
we're on the redress list I guess filed for redress,
were kept on the list, were either had lower security
or removed. And that's only how many. The other twenty
(24:07):
were never heard from. Again, That's what I wondered it
didn't have anything about the other And I mean it's
funny and all that, like it's but again, it would
stink if you're on that accidentally. But at the same time,
we're also talking about the same government that operated like
secret prisons overseas two for a while. Yeah. Or if
you're one of these veterans that's stuck in Colombia, who
(24:27):
are you talking about. There's this one a c l
U article I mentioned found there are two Army veterans
that are stuck outside the United States. And then the
New York Times article was that lady with her fourteen
year old daughter was stuck in Malaysia for a while,
and a UK officer, because different countries have their own
watch list and Britain has one, he got his wife
(24:49):
put on the list so she couldn't come home. Wow,
she's been in Turkey for three years until they found
out about it. Wow, And then he was fired, like
he was set to get promoted, and they were like,
wait a minute, they're doing their research. They're like, your
wife's on the the no fly list and he's like, what, bloy,
(25:09):
She's been in Turkey for three years. So that's funny.
It's an interesting way to get out of whatever he
didn't want to do. Yeah, taking out the garbage, that's
what it was. He just got t trash piled up.
Now he's like Sylvia, Sylvia plaths no shel Silverstein poem
(25:31):
where the girl doesn't want to take the garbage out. Yeah,
Sylvia's something silver suits now or something like that. Yeah, well, um,
and then chuck. Lastly, what do you want to like
if you want to know? Obviously we're not on the list,
or we weren't the last time we flew, because we flew, Um,
nobody took us aside. Although, um, you and I now
(25:53):
always get pat downs. Really, I just don't trust that
backscatter thing. I don't think everybody knows enough about it.
I'm sure it could be fine. Question, and you request
the path every time? Yeah, interesting, And I have to
say they almost never use the metal detector anymore never,
so Yeah, we always see the pat down now, and
(26:14):
it's stice you get to know the t s A
Agent a lot more more closely, as they're padding you
down with the backside of their hands and telling you
what they're doing ahead of time. It's like I'm going
to set your waist how to build up a sense
of tension, don't you. Um, so what do you if
you if you want to know if you're on this list,
you can just fly right, try to go fly. That's
(26:36):
gonna do something. It is if you're if you've been
pulled over and not detained UM for like speeding or
something like that, if you've just gotten a standard ticket,
your your name is not on this list, not on
this list, UM, and if you are, you can uh
apply for information about yourself, not through the terrorist watch list,
(26:59):
but UM through something called the UM specifically Designated Nationals
and Black Persons list that the Treasury has that means
you can't do business right exactly, you can't get alone,
you can't Yeah, you can't do business with these people.
It's it's a way of freezing somebody out of dealing
in the United States, making money in the United States,
(27:20):
usually because there's some sort of criminal right. If your
name is on that list, there may be a high
likelihood that you are on the terrorist watch list. And
even if you're not, you want to get your name
off that list because if you want to do business, yeah,
eventually somebody's gonna be like, I can't loan you this money, Josh,
I thought it was good. It was not good. I
(27:41):
wasn't prepared. I think you saved us. No, I think
this was It always gets so tricky with these uh
Civil Liberties podcasts because it's you want it both ways.
You don't want terrorists coming into the country, but you
also don't want your friend who's just a friendly Muslim
to be on the list. Alright, stricky ground. I don't
know how I feel about it, you, uh, personally between
(28:06):
you and me, if any other um that as long
as it's amounting to little more than an inconvenience and
there's still pressure to make it better, to do a
better job of this, I'm I'm for the list before
I'm maintaining a list, but being stuck in another country
(28:28):
is yeah. Again, it's my personal experience until some terrorists
named Josh Clark ends up on the list, and I'm
j Smith from Iowa. Uh. If you want to know
more about the Terrorists watch List and probably end up
on the Terrorists watch List yourself, j k um, you
can type in government watch list in the search bar
(28:51):
at how stuff works dot com. UM. You can also
probably search that on maxim too. It'll bring up some stuff. Um,
and since I said axim, that means it's time for
listener mail. I thought it was gonna be time for
top ten sexiest broad on reality TV. I'm sure it
(29:12):
is on Maxim if this is fro a Maxim podcast,
for sure. What I can't believe they had. I bet
you that article that they had had like not clip art,
but the stock photo of some guy like kind of
half drunk on a plane, some bachelor like arguing with
the steward. That's that's in um the uh it's in
the last one about email. That's saying that like if
(29:33):
the plane on the way to spring break is delayed,
you feel like bomb or fire so they can get
off and then write drink Yeah, which is a very
maxim thing to do. That's a maximum if I ever
heard one. All right, Josh, I'm gonna call this. Did
you call for the listener mail? Yeah? Here is do
we hear the day? Yeah it was in there. Someone
let me call this very sweet email from a from
(29:54):
a sister about her sister. Oh. I was hoping we
would do this fine items se. I've been meaning to
write for a while now, but haven't found an episode.
I thought it could contribute to Then I realized how
much the entire podcast means to me. My twin sister
is married to a marine. They move all over the country.
She's currently in Hawaii. We miss each other dearly, and
(30:15):
it may sound funny, but your show makes us feel
a little closer. We especially enjoyed the Shrunken Heads episode.
You've had a good flow, and we're both very witty.
We even call each other skull bag as an inside joke. Uh.
The Spam episode made us laugh. My sister's name is
Towards Tony Ann. In high school, she was nicknamed Tony
Spam because of the rhyme and her affinity for the
(30:37):
can pork broughtuct. She actually went to Spam Jam last spring,
I guess in Hawaii, of course, and was a little
disappointed that it wasn't as much fun as she expected.
That's a very serious event, so is it. I don't
know what she was expecting, right. We have so many
inside jokes pertaining to your show. We run with Josh
and Chuck, We hang at home with Josh and Chuck,
(30:59):
and I think our friends are starting to think we
are actually friends with Josh and Chuck anyway, Although we
are six thousand miles in six hour time difference apart,
we love to listen to the show each week and
talk about all the jokes and the content. Thanks for
bringing my other half a little closer every Thursday. I
wonder if he does about Tuesdays. He's missing out on
a half the fund. If you could read this letter,
(31:21):
I know it would mean the world to my twin.
If not, I'm just happy though. You all know that
your show helps make our separational easier. One half of
the stuff you should know. Fan of Melissa from Babylon,
New York, and I guess Tony Inn in Hawaii, Tony Spam. Yeah,
thanks a lot, Tony Spam and Melissa for listening to
us and discussing what we say that's still after three years,
(31:44):
is just out there to me. What the people talk
about things that you and I say, Yeah, that's crazy.
We're in a bubble in here. Um, if we are
overlooking some huge pratfall to being on a government watch list,
or there even being a government watch list, let us know.
(32:05):
We want to hear. You're stuck on the no fly list, stories,
the terrorists, watchless stories, whatever you got, Um, you can
tweet to us S y s K podcast. That's our
Twitter handle, Visit us on Facebook. That's Facebook dot com,
slash stuff you should Know, and you can always send
a good old fashioned email to us via Stuff Podcast
(32:26):
at how stuff works dot com. Be sure to check
out our new video podcast, Stuff from the Future. Join
how Stuff Work staff as we explore them as promising
and perplexing possibilities of tomorrow, brought to you by the
reinvented two thousand twelve camera. It's ready, are you
Brought to you by the reinvented two thousand twelve camera.
It's ready. Are you welcome to stuff you should know
from house Stuff Works dot Com. Hey, and welcome to
the Chuck Show. I'm Josh with me always of course
this Chuck Charles w Chucker's Bryant. That's weird. It sounded
(00:23):
the Chuck Show. It sounds like you said the Chuck Show.
You should be Chuck Show. Did you hear at that time?
I did, How you do? Chuck? Get out of here?
You fire? I'm waiting for this day for that would
be awful and such like I don't even want to
say relief. That sounds awful, but you know how it is.
(00:44):
It would be devastating and also like, ah, my brain
can relax, and then the next day I'd be all
upset again. I know what you're talking about. What I'm saying.
I used to have an alternative weekly newspaper, and whenever
we were up on deadline, deadline, deadline, deadline, and we'd
missed the deadline, there was a sense of abject failure
that was encapsulated by the greatest sense of relief you
(01:08):
ever experienced. I don't want to I know exactly what
you're talking about. I don't think I feel relieved here
because we got this. We got this all right, Yes,
say reassure me again, you got it good? Um, Chuck Josh. Okay,
we should probably chill out a little bit because what
we're about to talk about is uh, to some a
(01:33):
a necessary evil. To others, it's brain dead national security
that we should have been doing since seventeen seven. Uh,
And to others, it's an egregious affront to civil liberties
of citizens. Yeah, but you know what I found. I
did some research on the a c l You. I
(01:54):
haven't found anyone that says like we shouldn't have a
watch list. No, but it's just like, hey, if you're
gonna have a watch list, you're gonna you're gonna do
it better than this. Yes, from the a c l
U as well. Um, And I think everybody just assumed
I was talking about the A c l U and
I said that some people find it to civil liberties. Um.
(02:17):
I was when we were researching this, like I had
this um little tick in the back of my head,
right and I was burning and saying like there was
something about nine eleven and I was like, oh, yeah,
there were all these different warnings, all these different agencies
had information about al Qaeda. Apparently Bush was briefed before,
(02:41):
like the month before in the New York Times reported
back in two thousand four, Um, and it Alkada was
being watched. There. We were aware that there was a
hijacking plot, and they are all of these people, most
of them at least were on watch lists. But the
problem was is all of these agencies were in the
midst of like some serious turf wars, and no one
(03:04):
was talking to one another, No agency was sharing this
information with one another, which kind of part of the
course from what I understand. Yeah, but I think that
changed in large part after nine eleven. Right, if it
didn't change in spirit, at the very least it changed
in practice on paper because all those different lists after
(03:26):
nine eleven happened were consolidated pretty quickly. After nine eleven happened. Um.
I think May of two thousand three, Bush signed something
called Homeland Security Presidential Directive six, and the first one,
signed in two thousand one, I believe, established Homeland Security
as an agency. Two years later he signed six basically
(03:50):
saying have you read it, uh, two, three, four and
five or six? Six, is there, two, four and five,
there's a there's one. It loses focused towards the end.
The last one was signed on bushes last day in office,
and uh, it basically says all those international treaties we
signed that say the Arctic and the Antarctic are belonged
(04:11):
to everybody. No one can claim on we were invoked
a part about the Arctic. We decided that the US
is quote an Arctic nation and therefore it has to
protect its Arctic interests, specifically natural resources as a matter
of national security. Yeah, so it kind of lost focused
for the end. But early on with with the Presidential
Directive six that said we need to take all of
(04:34):
these watch lists and create a central watch list, and
we need to actually administer it or administrate it properly.
And that created chuck, the consolidated a terrorist watch list.
Because it's consolidated, it makes a lot of So that's
the government list that everyone is long joked about. There
(04:59):
were lists before were but the one that everybody thought
about prior to two thousand one or two thousand three,
um didn't bear any resemblance to this one. This is
the list. Anyone who's ever been even remotely suspected of
being a terrorist. What's the language, um, engaging in terrorist activities? Right, Uh,
(05:19):
suspected to have engaged in conduct constituting in preparation for
an aid of or related to terrorism. Yes, And apparently
associating with a known terrorists isn't enough to get you
on that list. Yeah, because after September eleven, there were
not many guidelines. It was just sort of let's just
put a bunch of names on the list. I mean,
not that will annially obviously, but um, they realized they
(05:43):
needed to refine it over the years, and I think
in two thousand nine was the last major revision, seventy
two page memorandum. Yeah, in February o nine. That's that
clarified what the minimum substantive derogatory criteria was. What is Well,
it's a seventy two page or mirandum, but associating with
(06:04):
an known terrorist, suspected terrorists is not enough. There had
to be evidence of that you actually supported terrorism, and
it generally requires more than a single single source, which
is good. Really Yeah, like, hey, this one guy said
you were so boom, you're on the list. So they
refined it some over the year prior to two thousand nine.
(06:26):
I think it was a little more, a little easier
to get on there. And that's when a lot of
the press um was generated about this. A lot of
the media was up in arms or reporting about people
being up in arms. There are tons of stories and
all that. Yeah. Um, And you can kind of tell
like how open it was, um by just the sheer numbers.
(06:47):
Right in two thousand three, I think the thing opened
up for business, um with thousand people, three names. Yeah,
that was a no. Six two thousand six. Yeah, Now
there's over a million supposedly. See, that number is highly disputed.
So the a c l U says a million or more. Um.
(07:08):
A lot of people reported that, but that's just the
a c l USE estimate. The T s A says
it's less than four hundred thousand. And they threw in
that of those people are foreign nationals and and even
in the country even they say, see I I can
see them Like. That struck me as the same as
(07:30):
saying like one of your buddies being like I'm ninety
nine nine nine percent positive. You know, I wonder how
how accurate that is. Yeah, it's hard to get stats
on this stuff because a lot of it is kept
under wraps for a good reason, including the criteria. Um
who's on there? And yeah, like you said, for good reason,
there is. It's a very it's Orwellian circular logic. And
(07:54):
of course I think everyone who has play on this
knew that the word Orwellian was going to come up
at least once, knowing us right. But um, they are
saying that they can't release information on this list because
then you know how to beat the list. And I'm
a defender of civil liberties and I will even admit
that this is a tough situation because you can't just
(08:16):
do everything behind closed doors, but you also can't open
it wide open because then it kind of defeats the
system in a lot of ways. So this is a
tough one. It is very tough when it comes to that, uh,
that number of the names on there. Um, it's not
necessarily individual people. That's different spellings of single name. Yeah,
that's aliases of these people. So there could be a
(08:40):
fraction of that number of actual people that are on
this list, But there's all these different spellings or whatever.
Countries are on the list, not like entire countries, well
entire countries, but not saying your entire country is on
the list. It's just I think country from that country. Yeah,
then you then you, I think the red flag is raised.
(09:02):
Not necessarily, you're because Israel was on the list recently
and they said, oh, that was a big mistake. Israel
shouldn't be on the list obviously. So yeah, but that
just happened I think within the past few months, is there, right,
that would have made a great intro. Yeah, I like
your intro. Yes, So with nominating, right, he said, Now,
it takes more than one source to get you on there.
(09:24):
That's what they say. Apparently before that revision, UM, somebody
from the FBI, the n s A, the c i A,
the f d A, the SEC, pretty much any government
agency could say NASA, hey, yeah, hey, I think any
government agency, anybody from a government agency, UM could nominate you.
(09:48):
And you're nominated, right, yes, And that that means you're
put before or you physically are, but your name is
put before the Terrorist Review and Examination Unit and they'd
start checking things out and then pass you along to
the Terrorist Screening Center and the watch list if you
are deemed by their criteria to be a threat. Right.
And the Terrorist Screening Center is a branch of the FBI,
(10:11):
and they're the ones who are responsible for um administering
this the watch list, right, um, and it's it's it's
most closely associated with flying. It's a no fly list,
is is what it's often called. Well, no, those are
two different lists, oh are they? Yeah, there's a no
fly list, there's a selectee list, and then there's the
(10:32):
terrorism watch list. Okay, laying on me, Well, the no
fly list only has like five thousand people on it. Okay,
but it's it's different. Um, but if you're on the
no fly list, obviously you're also on the terrorism watch list,
right But I as I understand it, if you're on
the terrorism watch list, you may pop up when you
go through a t S A screening. Yeah. Yeah, so
like if you're on this terrorism watch So if you're
(10:53):
on a no fly list, like they they your name
pops up and they just take you to prison essentially. Well,
they do a range of things from take you away
to be investigated in first and never heard from again,
or the people have been arrested. Okay, so that's but
these are people who are probably like known terrorists or not. Okay,
(11:15):
but on the no fly list, Yeah, both. That's what
that's what created a lot of the problems. Is that
is that you know, like an eight year old boy
was on the no fly list and this lady researched
a Muslim woman from I can't remember where she's from,
but she was a Stanford duct toil candidate. And you
can get placed on the no fly lists while you're
(11:37):
while you're on vacation, and then you can't come back
into the country. There are Army veterans stranded in Colombia
and other countries that can't come back because their name
is erroneously on the no fly list. And it takes
a long time to get it off. I would imagine
sixty seven days to get off the terrorist watch list.
That's the average. But I don't know about that. I
(11:59):
bet it takes more than that. Okay, Um, so chuck,
I guess with when you fly? Also, um, there's this
program called safe Flight that's administered by the Terrorists Screening
Center where every flight manifest is um checked against the lists.
That's good, it is good. That's the first step, I
(12:21):
gast um. But so the terrorist Screening centers there there
in charge. So are they in charge of the select
list and the no fly lists as well. It's all
under Homeland Security. Okay, um, but this is FBI, right okay,
so um, they they're maintaining these lists, but they're also
tracking the people who are on the list, hopefully the
(12:45):
right people. But if your name apparently is on the
terrorist watch list, there is a screen in northern Virginia.
No one knows where, well, no one can say where
anyone who knows, and you are a red dot on
that screen and you're tracked constantly apparently, Um, I don't
know if the dot is read necessarily, but the color
(13:06):
changes depending on the length of time it's been since
you made contact or a law enforcement officer made contact
with you, like since the last time you flew, last
time you got pulled over for a ticket, the last
time they came into your house, whatever, Um, the color changes.
But there's someone who watches you, uh, when you get
pulled over and you're on this list, Well, if you
(13:29):
or I get pulled over, your name's run right if
it gets if it pops up, then the law enforcement
officers alerting the terrorist Screening Center. From what I read,
most of the time, the terrorist Screening Center already knows
you just got pulled over. Yeah, well that's anto and
that's MPRS reporting too, And it was Dean and Temple
(13:51):
Raston who actually went to the center, So it's not
that's not like yeah, and I hope we don't come
across the sea and like, oh they shouldn't do like
police terrorists and things like that, because it's not the case.
I don't think so. Although John Lewis, the name John
Lewis was on the no fly list, John Lewis, he's uh.
I think he's still a representative here, isn't he. Yeah, Okay,
I think so. From from Georgia, from Atlanta. I believe
(14:14):
he was a civil rights leader as well, and his
name was on there. He kept getting hassled going through
the airport. Um, and not because he was suspected of
any kind of terrorist activity, but because his name matched
one of the spellings of the name of somebody on
the terrorist watch list, right, as did every other John Lewis.
(14:35):
So right, So if you are, um, that's one good
way to find out that your name is likely on
the terrorist watch list is getting held up at the airport.
John Lewis isn't the only one. Very Famously, there was
a nun named Sister Glenn and McPhee right, And she
apparently spent a lot of time getting interrogated. Um so
(14:59):
much so the Council of Bishops called the White House
and said, you gotta take her off. How much was
she flying? Is what I wanted to know. I don't know,
since she's hassled a lot. It's like, didn't I didn't
know nuns like traveled that much. The sister of the
Flying Cross of the Flying Nuneah uh. And as I mentioned,
there's an eight year old famously in New York. And
even though they came out and said there are no
(15:20):
eight year olds on the list, it's a myth. There
is an eight year old on the list. I don't
know if he still is, but the parents said, now
he's right here, come meet him. He's a boy scout.
And the first time he was pulled aside and frist
was when he was two wow, at an airport. Two
years old on the terrorist watch list was first. Yeah,
pretty pretty neat. So that's led to a lot of
calls about UM reducing the watch list, making it uh
(15:44):
more UM focused. Yeah uh. And apparently it sounds like
Obama made those changes in two thousand nine, Right, what
what was that? What happened there? Well, what you were
talking about, like, it's the criteria's narrowed a lot more
like it takes two sources to get you on the list.
Just associating with somebody will keep you off the list.
(16:06):
And then, Um, I wonder if redress is gotten any easier.
I don't know, redresses the process of of like sort
of applying to get off the list. And um, that's
for the terrorism watch list. Apparently the no fly list,
there's not much of a process going on there, and
it's led to a lot of frustration from people like
(16:26):
John Lewis. But yeah, now you apply and they I
think you have to apply through it the agency. You
can't just call the FBI or no, you can't call
Homeland Security. You have to apply through the agency that
gave you trouble, like the t s A or whoever it.
And then they give you what's called a redress number.
So when you book travel you you include that. Yeah,
(16:48):
and it's like it's basically like I've been cleared. There's proof.
I'm sure you're not on any list. Then, um, so, Chuck,
how do you get on this list? Aside from the
obvious of being a terror a known terrorist, or a
suspected terrorists, well appropriately suspected terrists. You could be, UM,
a member of some sort of extremist organization, like even
(17:11):
a hardcore like environmental organization might land you on the list,
Like ELF, Yeah, what what are they? Earth Liberation Front? Yes,
they like to burn down subdivisions, UM that are built
over clear cut forests. Really, they like to burn down
any subdivision where any trees or sacrificed or whatever, you know,
the kind where they go in and cut all the
(17:32):
trees down, build everything and then go replant like little saplings,
those kind of subdivisions. ELF likes to go in before
they're populated and burn them all to the ground, really,
and then maybe leave a garage standing and spray paint
e LF on it. That's that's domestic terrorism, really, I mean, yeah,
this twelve the Order of the Twelve Monkeys, it is,
(17:52):
isn't it. Yeah? So yeah, if you remember ELF, if
you're UM, like a member of I would imagine any
group that's been deemed the hate group or an extremist group,
the domestic group, you might be on that list. You're
probably on the list. But again, I think most people
except that at the very least, Um, American citizens are
(18:14):
in the minority on the government terrorist watch list. Right, yeah,
which is what I was trying to say, Which is
why it's easy for of the people or to say like, oh,
what's the big deal? Wait till you're one of those
first you know what I'm saying. Um, you found some
other ways to though, some like more mundane ways. Yeah, sadly, Um,
I shouldn't say sadly. I found it on Maxim. There's
(18:38):
some good magazine. Yes, there was some. Um, I just
did a Google search. It's not like I was like,
what does Maxim have to say about this? Right? Um?
There was There are four that I found that I
thought were pretty good. One is, um, searching using Google
well could get you flagged. We can be watched under
the Patriot Act. Certain was searching for certain terms. I
(18:59):
guess yeah, Okay, Um, we do a lot of research. Man,
that's kind of scary to think about. Well I imagine that,
Like if that's the case, then yeah, just just researching
for this podcast. Um, last minute flights Apparently after a
certain number of last minute flights, you will be flagged
and even just doing your your immediate flight, like just
(19:21):
the first time you do it, they're gonna pay extra
attention to you because you're booking a last minute flight. Um.
And apparently patterns the government loves patterns, and if you're
operating within a normal pattern, you're likely going to be
less scrutinized. Um. When you suddenly book of last minute flight,
then they're gonna be like, wait, that's abnormal and we're
(19:43):
gonna pay attention to you. Or if you pay with cash,
that's abnormal, we're gonna pay attention to you. There there's
certain patterns that the normal, average person does without even thinking, um,
and when you act outside of that, then you're gonna
invite more scrutiny. Um. Apparently email as well is also
(20:04):
under the Patriot Act likes to be watched, so if
you say something stupid on there, so basically you and
I are on the list. Uh. They also the Homeland
Security this week said that the terror watch list is
exempt from the Privacy Act, which was brought about after Watergate.
It basically permit citizens to obtain files about them with
(20:28):
the intent of correcting it, which is what this would
be all about. And they said, no, we're not under
the Privacy Act, and that was that's the biggest problem
with a c l u IS is put a system
in place. First of all, like you said, they think
it's bloated and thirty two thousand nine Justice Department Inspector
(20:48):
General report, Yeah, I found that thirty of the nominations
to the lists were outdated. So it's like it's counterproductive.
Even it's not like they're just saying it's not fair,
it's not in the job that it should be doing
if it's bloated. But their whole point is just have
a system in place, a transparent system in place where
you can go. I mean, I guess redresses that for
(21:10):
the terrorism watch list, but it doesn't sound like a
very good system. Well, they also have a really big
um bone of contention in that this is technically unconstitutional.
There's something um against unlawful search and seizure, search and
seizure without due process or at least probable cause. And
if you're an eight year old boy scout, there's really
no way of justifying the fact that you're being searched
(21:34):
without probable cause. You know, just because some just because
there's terrorists out there doesn't give probable cause to some
individual who's not a terrorist to be searched. It's kind
of that simple. Yeah. But again, as you say, it's
really tough to to say, all, we need to just
do away with this. I just I don't think that's
(21:57):
the cases. Think there's better ways to do it. Yeah.
On this had a couple of more startling things on
the state level. You know, you can't profile. Federal policies
prohibit that, and you can't on the state level either,
but they allow states to. Um, they have different criteria
for each state on what is deemed suspicious at least
not necessarily this will get you nominated, but red flags
(22:19):
at least and uh in Ohio, Um, any immersion and
I'm sorry, immersion in a purely Muslim environment could get
you red flagged. Uh. They advise landlords in some states
to be alert on tenants who preferred ground floor apartments
and who have little furniture. And then uh, anyone the
(22:40):
study of technical subjects like engineering, just engineering. Huh. It's interesting. Um.
Do you remember when the Patriot Act was first being
discussed for the three minutes Um. One of the one
of the mandates in it was that postal employees were
expected to spy and report on people on their route.
(23:03):
And the post office actually pushed back and said we're
not doing that. Oh yeah, that's right, and they won.
It was taken out, but it was in there like
they wanted to deploy the postal service as a as
domestic spies. They're like, dude, we just don't want to
get bit by dogs. Just we've got enough on her
plate as it is. I gotta redress stat for you
(23:25):
to alright that Conger found. This is written by Kristen
Konger from Stuff Mom Never told you. Yeah, and she's
got a new host. We should mention, yes, new co
host Molly is no longer there and she and they're
doing a great job with you know, and best of
elect to Molly. Of course she's she's writing her heart
out right now. Yeah, sitting right next to you. Anyway. Uh.
(23:45):
Conger found this stat and from two thousand five to
two thousand seven, thirty five of people who complained that
we're on the redress list I guess filed for redress,
were kept on the list, were either had lower security
or removed. And that's only how many. The other twenty
(24:07):
were never heard from. Again, That's what I wondered it
didn't have anything about the other And I mean it's
funny and all that, like it's but again, it would
stink if you're on that accidentally. But at the same time,
we're also talking about the same government that operated like
secret prisons overseas two for a while. Yeah. Or if
you're one of these veterans that's stuck in Colombia, who
(24:27):
are you talking about. There's this one a c l
U article I mentioned found there are two Army veterans
that are stuck outside the United States. And then the
New York Times article was that lady with her fourteen
year old daughter was stuck in Malaysia for a while,
and a UK officer, because different countries have their own
watch list and Britain has one, he got his wife
(24:49):
put on the list so she couldn't come home. Wow,
she's been in Turkey for three years until they found
out about it. Wow, And then he was fired, like
he was set to get promoted, and they were like,
wait a minute, they're doing their research. They're like, your
wife's on the the no fly list and he's like, what, bloy,
(25:09):
She's been in Turkey for three years. So that's funny.
It's an interesting way to get out of whatever he
didn't want to do. Yeah, taking out the garbage, that's
what it was. He just got t trash piled up.
Now he's like Sylvia, Sylvia plaths no shel Silverstein poem
(25:31):
where the girl doesn't want to take the garbage out. Yeah,
Sylvia's something silver suits now or something like that. Yeah, well, um,
and then chuck. Lastly, what do you want to like
if you want to know? Obviously we're not on the list,
or we weren't the last time we flew, because we flew, Um,
nobody took us aside. Although, um, you and I now
(25:53):
always get pat downs. Really, I just don't trust that
backscatter thing. I don't think everybody knows enough about it.
I'm sure it could be fine. Question, and you request
the path every time? Yeah, interesting, And I have to
say they almost never use the metal detector anymore never,
so Yeah, we always see the pat down now, and
(26:14):
it's stice you get to know the t s A
Agent a lot more more closely, as they're padding you
down with the backside of their hands and telling you
what they're doing ahead of time. It's like I'm going
to set your waist how to build up a sense
of tension, don't you. Um, so what do you if
you if you want to know if you're on this list,
you can just fly right, try to go fly. That's
(26:36):
gonna do something. It is if you're if you've been
pulled over and not detained UM for like speeding or
something like that, if you've just gotten a standard ticket,
your your name is not on this list, not on
this list, UM, and if you are, you can uh
apply for information about yourself, not through the terrorist watch list,
(26:59):
but UM through something called the UM specifically Designated Nationals
and Black Persons list that the Treasury has that means
you can't do business right exactly, you can't get alone,
you can't Yeah, you can't do business with these people.
It's it's a way of freezing somebody out of dealing
in the United States, making money in the United States,
(27:20):
usually because there's some sort of criminal right. If your
name is on that list, there may be a high
likelihood that you are on the terrorist watch list. And
even if you're not, you want to get your name
off that list because if you want to do business, yeah,
eventually somebody's gonna be like, I can't loan you this money, Josh,
I thought it was good. It was not good. I
(27:41):
wasn't prepared. I think you saved us. No, I think
this was It always gets so tricky with these uh
Civil Liberties podcasts because it's you want it both ways.
You don't want terrorists coming into the country, but you
also don't want your friend who's just a friendly Muslim
to be on the list. Alright, stricky ground. I don't
know how I feel about it, you, uh, personally between
(28:06):
you and me, if any other um that as long
as it's amounting to little more than an inconvenience and
there's still pressure to make it better, to do a
better job of this, I'm I'm for the list before
I'm maintaining a list, but being stuck in another country
(28:28):
is yeah. Again, it's my personal experience until some terrorists
named Josh Clark ends up on the list, and I'm
j Smith from Iowa. Uh. If you want to know
more about the Terrorists watch List and probably end up
on the Terrorists watch List yourself, j k um, you
can type in government watch list in the search bar
(28:51):
at how stuff works dot com. UM. You can also
probably search that on maxim too. It'll bring up some stuff. Um,
and since I said axim, that means it's time for
listener mail. I thought it was gonna be time for
top ten sexiest broad on reality TV. I'm sure it
(29:12):
is on Maxim if this is fro a Maxim podcast,
for sure. What I can't believe they had. I bet
you that article that they had had like not clip art,
but the stock photo of some guy like kind of
half drunk on a plane, some bachelor like arguing with
the steward. That's that's in um the uh it's in
the last one about email. That's saying that like if
(29:33):
the plane on the way to spring break is delayed,
you feel like bomb or fire so they can get
off and then write drink Yeah, which is a very
maxim thing to do. That's a maximum if I ever
heard one. All right, Josh, I'm gonna call this. Did
you call for the listener mail? Yeah? Here is do
we hear the day? Yeah it was in there. Someone
let me call this very sweet email from a from
(29:54):
a sister about her sister. Oh. I was hoping we
would do this fine items se. I've been meaning to
write for a while now, but haven't found an episode.
I thought it could contribute to Then I realized how
much the entire podcast means to me. My twin sister
is married to a marine. They move all over the country.
She's currently in Hawaii. We miss each other dearly, and
(30:15):
it may sound funny, but your show makes us feel
a little closer. We especially enjoyed the Shrunken Heads episode.
You've had a good flow, and we're both very witty.
We even call each other skull bag as an inside joke. Uh.
The Spam episode made us laugh. My sister's name is
Towards Tony Ann. In high school, she was nicknamed Tony
Spam because of the rhyme and her affinity for the
(30:37):
can pork broughtuct. She actually went to Spam Jam last spring,
I guess in Hawaii, of course, and was a little
disappointed that it wasn't as much fun as she expected.
That's a very serious event, so is it. I don't
know what she was expecting, right. We have so many
inside jokes pertaining to your show. We run with Josh
and Chuck, We hang at home with Josh and Chuck,
(30:59):
and I think our friends are starting to think we
are actually friends with Josh and Chuck anyway, Although we
are six thousand miles in six hour time difference apart,
we love to listen to the show each week and
talk about all the jokes and the content. Thanks for
bringing my other half a little closer every Thursday. I
wonder if he does about Tuesdays. He's missing out on
a half the fund. If you could read this letter,
(31:21):
I know it would mean the world to my twin.
If not, I'm just happy though. You all know that
your show helps make our separational easier. One half of
the stuff you should know. Fan of Melissa from Babylon,
New York, and I guess Tony Inn in Hawaii, Tony Spam. Yeah,
thanks a lot, Tony Spam and Melissa for listening to
us and discussing what we say that's still after three years,
(31:44):
is just out there to me. What the people talk
about things that you and I say, Yeah, that's crazy.
We're in a bubble in here. Um, if we are
overlooking some huge pratfall to being on a government watch list,
or there even being a government watch list, let us know.
(32:05):
We want to hear. You're stuck on the no fly list, stories,
the terrorists, watchless stories, whatever you got, Um, you can
tweet to us S y s K podcast. That's our
Twitter handle, Visit us on Facebook. That's Facebook dot com,
slash stuff you should Know, and you can always send
a good old fashioned email to us via Stuff Podcast
(32:26):
at how stuff works dot com. Be sure to check
out our new video podcast, Stuff from the Future. Join
how Stuff Work staff as we explore them as promising
and perplexing possibilities of tomorrow, brought to you by the
reinvented two thousand twelve camera. It's ready, are you
Stuff You Should Know News
Hosts And Creators
Chuck Bryant
Josh Clark
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