September 29, 2011 • 30 mins
Thought Chuck and Josh had already covered every law enforcement agency? Think again. The Marshals Service is the oldest law enforcement branch in the land, dating back to 1789. Listen up for how to get a free ride courtesy the Marshals in this episode.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Brought to you by the reinvented two thousand twelve camera.
It's ready. Are you welcome to Stuff You Should Know?
From houseff Works dot Com. Hey, and welcome to the podcast.
I'm Josh Clark. There's Charles W. Chuck Bryant, which makes
(00:20):
this Stuff you should Know? Um, and we were about
to present part eighty in our series on law enforcement agencies.
Pretty soon we're going to just start profiling like X
cops and stuff like that. Dude, we we still haven't
done a t F for CIA or ADI. The CIA
article leaves a lot Not'm sure it needs some stuff.
(00:40):
So we're gonna do that week when we have extra
time to do a lot more research. Okay, well today
we're talking about the U. S. Marshals. That's right, So, Chuck,
have you ever seen the movie The Fugitive? I have? Well,
then we don't need to do this episode. Why is it?
That's it? It's the most accurate trail of the U. S.
(01:01):
Marshall ever created by man Tommy Lee Jones. Yes, he
was good in that. I'm a big fan. Yeah, I know,
he was great. It's really tough to go wrong with
Tommy Lee Jones. What was he in was he in
No Country for Old Man? And he's the last lines
and stuff like that. Yeah. He actually, if you've read
(01:21):
the book, is the main character is pretty much his character.
That's why when you see the movie and oh gosh,
I hate the spoilers spoiler alert when you see the
movie and and what's his face dies? H, have your
bar down now that the what you think is the
main character? Yes, uh, what's his face from the game
(01:44):
Josh Brolin Josh Roland in the movie, it's kind of like, wait,
he just kind of unceremoniously died and they didn't make
a big deal about it. Remember in the movie, but
if you read the book, he's not really the main character,
so it sort of makes more sense. Anyway. I love
the Coen Brothers, so they know what they're doing. God
the best. But again, Tommy Lee Jones, this is the
how Tommy Lee Jones works episode and he's a class act.
(02:08):
And chuck the we're talking about the Federal Marshals. Really
I was joking about Tommy Lee. Um, did you know
that they are the oldest law enforcement agency in the land. Yeah,
and most versatile they claim, Yeah, very proud of that fact.
They do a lot of stuff they really do. Um,
and in a lot of ways, they're very unsung. They
(02:29):
have a very long history. They were first created in
nine the first time Congress met, the Marshal Service was
literally created. Um. And they've had their highs and their
loves and the two hundred and twenty five years since
George Washington appointed the first thirteen marshals. That is very
(02:49):
cool right out of the gate. And Uh, basically they
set up the federal courts and they said, wow, we
need some people to kind of protect the courts. We
need some people that crack some heads. U S. Marshals done. Yeah,
And um, apparently as far as like law enforcement agencies
(03:09):
in the US goes, the federal marshals have kind of
had the short end of the stick traditionally. Um, especially
early on in the country's history when states rights wasn't
just relegated to like you know, you know, it was
a big deal that everybody right. UM, So you you
(03:30):
had this guy who was sometimes the only law enforcement
official in the entire land in your whole area, and
he's trying to shove federal laws down your throat when
you're all about states rights. And that was pretty much
the the the beginning of the Marshal Service was basically
(03:50):
being at odds with their friends and neighbors about the
stuff that they were doing. A lot of times it
was stuff that proved to be unconstitutional, like the Alien
and Sedition Act. Remember our buddy Eugene Debs who ran
for president and got a million votes from jail here
in Atlanta, the Socialists, He was jailed for the Alien
and Sedition Act. Yeah, I remember, Like you couldn't even
(04:11):
speak against the government publicly or else. It was considered
treason around World War One. Yeah, yeah, Yeah, Marcel's had
to arrest people like Eugene Debs for that kind of stuff.
So there have been plenty of points in the history
of this agency where like they haven't had to do
very good stuff, and uh, they've suffered for it. Yeah.
(04:32):
And the grabster Ed Grabanowski, who wrote this as well
as many other cool articles that we podcast on, pointed
out that the Civil War, or not the Civil War,
but slavery was kind of a contentious point because in
the South they had to enforce a slave trade bands
on slave imports, and then in the North they had
(04:55):
to prosecute people fugitives on the run and northern abligious
from like and in the South there like so camp
bring in our slaves. So yeah, the and the marshals
were like, man, no one likes me anywhere, I'm gonna
go out west. And they were liked in the West
in a lot of places. Probably yes, because literally out
(05:17):
west it was lawless in many many respects. And literally
and figuratively, there would be a marshal out there, and
the marshal is as you would see, just some guy
like sitting in an office in some boom town, right
like bat Masterson and that's it. Uh, And then he
would deputize the posse. That's extremely accurate. There's a there
(05:40):
would be a marshal out there, and if you needed
some extra help, you could grab some law abiding citizens
who had guns and say you're now an official of
the US government and you have to come crack heads
with me. Um. That's really how it happened. But yes,
like you said, in in situations like that, most of
the law abiding people are the people who are just
trying to mind some gold and leaving other people alone.
(06:00):
They were very happy that there was a marshal there.
Yea a little order for a change, right so there's
like a little uptick in a marshal appreciation in the
nineteenth century, the second half of it out West. Yeah,
that's kind of their heyday two from what I gather
if you don't count now. And I actually found too
that a lot of states still have a posse. But
it's like, you know, the Arkansas U. S. Marshall Posse,
(06:23):
and it's just the organization that helps to raise awareness
and stuff. It's like the p b A. Yeah, they'll
go around to schools and stuff like that. That's the
Marshal's Posse. Wow, it's very valuable job they do. Josh, well,
there's remember there's the posse Coomatatas Act that prevents posses,
doesn't it. I never heard of that. Yeah, we talked
about in the Delta Force episode. It's like it's it's
(06:46):
the law that prevents Delta Force from operating in the US. Ostensibly. Well,
in these days, you try to get a posse together
and people like dude, I'm watching Lost Boys come on nice. Uh.
Twenties century, early twentieth century, they were pretty close to
obscurity because um, they had a reputation for being fat,
(07:07):
lazy retired cops. Demoided grabbing. Owski puts it, I love
that that word. Dumb fat retired cops. Yeah, basically the
the UM. I don't know what led to that, but
they just kind of lost their their shape and um,
everybody knew it too. And then the respect for the
marshal service went down tremendously like that. It sounds like
(07:30):
it was a place where old cops go to die
or to retire. Um and uh. And then a guy
came along in the the ninety nine. His name is Frank Murphy,
and he became Attorney General of the United States, and
he said, you're gonna stop being so pudgy, c you.
We're gonna get you to work out. You're gonna be
good at arresting criminals. C. They said, whatever you say, Murphy. Yeah,
and that was that. Yeah, and they started taking shape again,
(07:53):
literally and figuratively, I guess. And uh, you know, throughout
the twentieth century made their aim for doing such brave
things like escorting black students to school during segregation. Those
were marshals when you see that famous picture. Um, although
I think some of them are National Guard as well. No,
the National Guard were ordered out by racist governors to
(08:16):
block the coming in and the Marshals odds with the
National Guard. Yeah, National Guards state. I feel like a dummy.
I don't, okay, I mean it just makes sense, you know,
like that, Well, the National Guard's gonna be out there protection.
No, no no, no, that's a big black eye on the
state of Alabama in particular and Mississippi. It's true. They
(08:36):
also um kind of mix it up with anti war
protesters during Vietnam and basically made more of a name
for themselves as the twentieth century advanced as hippie beaters. Yeah,
that's true. Uh so what what do they do though?
And also I just want to point out I don't
advocate the beating of hippies, and if you're gonna send
me an email, go back and listen to the whole
(08:57):
catalog first. Okay, except hippie Rob he deserves a good
beat down, but not really, not really, um so chuck. Finally,
we arrived to current day. As far as when this
article was written two thousand seven, and at a place
called Fort Smith, Arkansas, you will find the um National
(09:17):
Museum of the U. S. Marshals. Still to this day,
it's there four years later. I did not know that,
and they changed their their badge too. Used to be
a six point in star. Oh is it? It's five? Okay?
So okay, it did start out to being a six
silver star in a circle. Okay, so now it's a
(09:38):
five pointed star in a circle. But apparently up until
ninety one, so there's ninety four districts that UM coincide
with judicial districts federal judicial districts that Marshall served, and
every district was in charge of creating its own badge
until nineteen forty one when they standardized it. And each
district only has one marshal official marshal. The rest are
(10:00):
like deputies and things like that. Right, there's like about
four thousand deputies in ninety four marshals working that UM
three thousand. I saw that it said on their website
three thousand, nine hundred approximately three thousand, nine hundred and fifty,
and I was like, you know, we don't round up
the four thousand anymore when we hit that. Well, it's
(10:21):
better than having a ticker that's like takes one down
every time someone dies in the line of two up
one when one's born. Yeah, that's true, or a new
hire right, all right, So chuck Um, you said that
the Marshal services pretty versatile and for good reason. They
have UM at least four main areas of operation UM
(10:42):
and probably the best known one thanks to Mr Tommy
Lee Jones, the class act UM is catching fugitives, and
not just federal fugitives. They also support UM state and
local law enforcement groups in catching their fugitives too, So
the marshals are basically just big show offs. I got
a couple of stats here, Josh, Uh in two thousand ten,
(11:04):
I'm just gonna pepper your information with stats about that.
In two thousand ten they arrested more than eighty one thousand,
nine hundred state and local fugitives. That's when they're helping
everyone out. It was eighty nine thousand, nine hundred one
and UH. As far as federal federal fugitives, they arrested
more than thirty six thousand in two thousand ten alone.
(11:26):
That's a huge up tick in because state and local
because in two thousand seven in the article its sites
forty six thousand, eight hundred state and local fugitives, so
that's close to double. Yeah. Yeah, good work. Yes, well,
part of that was operating from Falcon Yeah, that was
mainly to UH, to nab unregistered sex offenders. Right, it
(11:47):
depends like it's it's it's a fugitive capture operation um
and in two thousand seven they were up to the
end of phase three. UM and I think each phase
would be a different part of the country and then
maybe a different emphasis. So Falcon three in two thousand
seven was launched to catch people who are supposed to
register as sex offenders but never did, making them fugitives
(12:08):
in the Eastern US and it nabbed ten thousand, seven
hundred and thirty three felons, sex offenders, the people we
do not want on the street, just a few, and
gang members more than gang members. And I think that's
a part of Operation Falcon right, I believe gang stuff, Yeah,
because ICE is responsible for um immigration. So although the
(12:34):
Marshall Service have four outposts Mexico, Jamaica and a couple
other places in the Caribbean, Yeah, Colombia and Dominican Republic,
I think that's all drug related. That's just a guess. Yeah,
But um so they would and they do arrest people
in those countries. Um One of the guys on their
most wanted list was arrested in Mexico. Um So they
(12:58):
can operate outside of the country, but they wouldn't. They
wouldn't have anything to do with immigration. Although I can't
see them not working with Ice. They might. Yeah, it
seems like they will work with whoever asked for their help.
You know, they're like, sure, we can send a team
down there. Um. One of the other big aspects of
their job is prisoner transport because they're they're in charge of, um,
(13:20):
basically looking over the court system, the federal court system,
anything that has to do with protecting a courtroom, transporting
a prisoner, the keeping the security aspect of the federal
judicial system functioning. That's what they do. And a big
part of that is shuffling prisoners from place to place. Yeah,
and they do that via the Justice, Prisoner and Alien
(13:41):
Transportation System. And that is literally their own bus line, airline,
van line, whatever they need. If you've seen them pretty
bad movie con Air that was those were marshals and uh,
every day they have sixty three thousand, roughly sixty three
thousand prisoners custody and then they transport these dudes and
(14:03):
ladies I guess, all over the all over the place
on planes. Yeah. Um, no beverage service and I'll bet not,
and I'll bet those um like the stuff on the
seatbacks where you rest your head. Yes, haven't been watched
in a while. No in flight movie. Yeah, it's no frills,
exactly what it is. Uh, if you want to see
(14:24):
a very frill laden aircraft, you should see Airport. I
think the third one, did you watch that recently? Has awesome?
You know what I watched the other day, Towering Inferno.
I've got the in my instant que It's pretty good, man.
I gotta say like it holds. It's way too long.
First of all, it's like two and a half hours long,
(14:45):
and it didn't need to be, Like they should have
cut out a lot of the plot points. But as
far as just like, uh, oh my god, what's gonna happen?
It was pretty big ranks still suspense. Yeah, that's that's
the word. Yeah it is. It's among it's among the
best of the seventies disaster flicks. Right. Yeah, and you
got Paul Newman and Steve McQueen in the same movie.
(15:06):
That's just off the tough guy meter. Yeah. Well, I
I didn't have my full attention last night, so I
didn't watch that. Instead. I punished me and you meet
with Beyond the Poseidon Adventure. That's so funny. We're on
this kick of old disaster. It's weird. Unbeknownst. Yeah, I
had no idea until just this moment. Towering Airports seventy eight. Um, so, chuck,
(15:29):
I think it's seventy eight. There's also seventies seven. Yeah,
there's a few seventy seventy seven. I think it's seventy seven.
It's the one where Jimmy Stewart owns a luxury airliner
is flying these people who end up beneath the surface
of the Atlantic in the Bermuda Triangle. Okay, and you
know who wasn't towering in front of Fredi Stair? Yeah,
(15:50):
when his last movie and he actually there's one small
Sceneri's dancing and my eyes were just like, oh my god,
Fredi stairs dancing. Well, apparently in the Tower of Inferno
they had like fifty something sets and all the eight
of them were like went up in flames. H wow. Yeah, geez,
that's a sidetrack. That's much more interesting. They got marshals,
I think, so they transport prisoners, they kept capture fugitives,
(16:13):
and then um we we did a whole podcast on
Witness Security Program wit SEC, the Witness Protection Program UM,
but we'll talk about it briefly here. Basically, it was
conceived in nineteen seventy and since then the Marshal Service,
which basically UM hides federal witnesses and keeps them hidden,
gives them new lives UM, or just you know, keeps
(16:37):
them in safe houses during trial, depending on the arrangement. Uh.
They say that since nineteen seventy, since the beginning, not
one witness has been harmed if they follow the rules.
Plenty of witnesses have been wax but went to a
movie or something with you know, look at me, I'm
Jimmy two legs Josh. They also, we we said protect
(17:00):
the courts. They still do that today, more than two
thousand judges and four courthouses nationwide. They install security systems,
they provide personal escort and watch over high risk trials.
And there's also a few other people they helped transport UM.
I think all federal judges, U S attorneys, personnel in jurors.
(17:25):
UM they provide protection for and they transport UM. The
Supreme Court justices outside of Washington, d C. I'm their
annual picnic I guess so, and I guess in d C.
And I'm not sure who it is. It may be
secret Service or something or maybe just I don't know
local local marshals, and we should point that out. Marshal
(17:47):
is a term that's used a lot, but unless you
are a U S. Marshal, then you're not part of
the U S. M say, like, you can be a
marshal like some countries have marshals. Is military ranks or
air marshals are not related to UM the Marshal Service
that yeah, I thought they were. I thought they were
U S. Marshals they or not UM. Also, we should
(18:09):
say if you are if you're a drug dealer and
you get popped for a beef by the FEDS and
they take your stuff, it's the marshals who have it.
They're in charge of ash st seizure, yes, and distribution
to like selling off stuff to give reparation to families
and victims and stuff, or to fund the Marshal Service
(18:29):
or to fund the Marshal Service picnic. What else can
they do, Josh. They have a SWAT group Special Operations Group,
which basically does the same thing that SWAT teams do,
but for federal stuff. Okay, that makes sense. And um,
they once arrested, arrested and making air quotes a fleet
of UM eighteenth century shipwrecks off the coast of Rhode
(18:54):
Island at the request of the governor UM to protect it,
to take it and take these to federal custody and
protect them from vandals and UM salvagers. Yeah, yeah, I
got a stat on the assets. They currently manage eighteen
thousand assets valued at three point nine billion bucks. It's
a lot of cigarette boats. And in two thousand ten
(19:16):
paid UM victims of crimes about three hundred and fifty
million dollars. So they do use it for reparation time
some of it. UM. They also made payments to state
and low local law enforcement agencies of five hundred and
eighty millions, So maybe they repay. Like if you wrect
your police cars in the pursuit of this guy, we'll
(19:37):
pay you back. Here's some money. We're sell off their
stuff and we'll pay you back. Just remember Uncle Sam
takes care of you. Uh what else, Josh, Well, the
we talked about how the MARS services set up within
the ninety four districts and the thirty nine fifty three
three thousand, nine fifty three deputies. Um, but how did
(19:58):
they get there? Chuck? Apparently I used to have an
exam and then now they used the standard federal Career
intern program, which it takes a couple of years to
get you to make sure that you're not just some
jerk too could fill out on application yeah, or once
a free gun. Yeah. So you gotta get a pay
your dues for a couple of years, and if you've
got the right stuff, then you have to go through
(20:21):
a seventeen and a half week training course at the U. S.
Marshall Service Training Academy in Glencoe, Georgia. Did you did
you know the Marshall's Training Academy is here? I didn't,
and I didn't even know actually, And it's down it's
sort of halfway between Jacksonville and Savannah. It's down on
the coast and your St. Simon's. It does ring a
(20:41):
slight bell. I think it was not even a place
until they put the thing there and they named it Glencoe.
I don't know if that stands for anything, but I
don't even think that was a legitimate town until they
set up a six acre campus that has its own
zip code. That's very neat. It's big, um chuck. If
(21:03):
you want to become a U. S. Marshal, there's some
Now you can't just fill out an application. You have
to go through the training program. But even to get
into the training program too, on the U S. Marshall track,
there's some um, some qualifications you have to have. You
have to be a US citizen. Check you have to
be between the ages of thirty six. Nope, Um, you
(21:27):
could still I could. I'd better hurry up. Being good
physical condition, I would say, I'm not, and you're you're
so so stuff. So would you say you're in good
physical conditions? I would? So you could pass these these tests,
I could. You could do the fifty chin ups and
run the mile in a certain time over a long
enough period of time, I could. A bachelor's degree check. Uh,
(21:53):
three years experience in law enforcement or other qualifying job experience. Uh.
Valid driver's license and a good driving record. Yeah, okay,
I'm good. Well, aside from the age limit, then you're
fine in the physical condition, in the experience. So pretty much,
I'm a US citizen and I have a driver's license.
(22:15):
That's what qualifies me. Uh. There's some famous Marshals besides
Tommy Lee Jones and Bat Masterson who I mentioned Did
you mention him? Yes? I just got threw him in earlier.
Was Marshall Dylan a real person Matt Dylon or was
he just a fictional character? I don't think he was
fictional character? Pretty sure h TV Baby White Earth was
(22:36):
real though. Yea and Virgil and Morgan Earp his brothers.
They were all Marshals, as was wild Bill Hickock. And
while Bill is the tie that binds the Marshall's podcast
and the Swords following podcast because he brought in a
Cowboys and Indians set up to the Three Worlds Fair
(22:57):
in Chicago. Ah, look at you up in both. Wow.
Frederick Douglas had no idea that he was a U. S. Marshall. No,
and the Marshall for d C two, which I imagine
it is probably a pretty busy district. Did you see
you don't watch Louis, do you? No? He had episode
of his daughter dressed up like Frederick Douglas for Halloween
(23:19):
and apparently that was what he wanted to be when
he was a kid one year, so he brought it
back years later for a show. Yeah. Um, what else, Josh,
they have the most wanted list that is different than
the FBI S. Yeah, I remember they caught that one
dude in Mexico. They caught one of their own dudes
in Mexico that went to the other side, I think too.
(23:42):
Oh yeah, that's right, he like went Randy Gaiden turned
into a drug dealing murderer allegedly, allegedly allegedly these days, Josh,
the director is a is a lady named Stacia Hilton,
and it was a really controversial nomination actually by Obama.
Well she was, um, she's a socialist. Yeah, she has
(24:07):
um had strong ties to the private prison industry and
the U. S. Marshals is also responsible for awarding contracts
to build federal prisons. Oh yeah. So basically it was
one of those deals where they're like, hey, she made
a lot of money as a consultant for all these companies.
You appoint her, and she's going to give her friends
(24:28):
the in the private prison industry fat contracts. So she
had petitions going around basically, but the nomination did go through,
and apparently it was kind of sped through. Huh. So
all those people out there we like to call out
folks on both sides. We're doing it could go and
chuck now, thanks um. And also I should say there's
(24:53):
between two hundred and four hundred marshals that have died
in the line of duty, since that's not a lot no, um.
And the first was a guy named Robert Forsyth, and
he went to go serve court papers for a civil
case to two brothers, Beverly and William Allen. And uh.
He took the Allen brothers aside to say, hey, I
(25:15):
don't want to embarrass you, but here's some papers. And
rather than come with them, they ran upstairs, locked themselves
in the door. When they heard um forsythe coming up
the stairs, they shot through the door and it hit
him in the head and killed him instantly. So here's
the first first marshal shot during the line of duty
in Augusta, Georgia. Yeah, and I actually saw that. He
(25:35):
was the first law enforcement officer ever killed in the
line of duty in the United States. And he wore
like powdered wigs and everything too. It was like old
timey colonial, just just post colonial. So that's it. That's
us marshals, right, that's right. They do a valuable service.
And now you know what that is thanks to Chuck
(25:56):
and his law enforcement crush. You know you and the
Grab story. You guys are kindred spirits for sure. I
do watch cops, yeah, do you? Yeah? I mean not
like I don't know when it comes on, but if
I'm in the right mood and i'm channel surfing and
I'll see it's on like nine times in a row,
I'll watch five or six of them. Do you ever
watch Real Stars of the Highway Patrol? Uh? Yeah, Real Stories?
(26:18):
Yeah yeah, I've watched all those shows occasionally not. I
just want to point that out. This happens like once
a month. It's not like a no one there. I
don't schedule my type and then Emily always bust me
and it's like, oh my god, how do you watch that?
I's like, well, these people make me feel better about myself.
They would make you a fan. Um. If you want
(26:40):
to learn more, and you I'm speaking to you the
listener now. Um. If you want to learn more about
the U. S. Marshals, you can type in Marshals one L.
I was looking up that show in plain sight, and
even on the USA Networks site they spelled Marshals with
two ls, which is a name, yeah of person, Yes,
(27:01):
it is too else. Um. So it's m A R
S A H A L I got it. Um. You
can type that in the search bar at how stuff
works dot com, which means it's time for a listener mail.
That's right, Josh. And this is a little Kiva related thing.
You want to tell everyone about Keeva real quick. We
have to keep the team. Uh, it's keepa dot org
(27:23):
k I v A right. And it's a micro lending
site where you can go on and lend twenty five
or more bucks two people in developing countries. They use
it to um ostensibly keep their businesses afloat and grow.
And basically you're fighting poverty and all sorts of other
problems through micro lending. And what what's our goal here?
(27:45):
Our goal is to get to I think six hundred
thousand or three quarters of a million seven fifty thousand
by when at the end of this year. Okay, yes, yes,
we're supposed to get to three quarters of a million
by the end of the year. Yes, And we have
to thank glennon Son for kind of heading that up.
Our fans who who set the goals for us, because
(28:08):
they're smarter than we are about figuring out if it's attainable.
They boss us around they too, So anyway, this is
from Aaron H in Denver. Hi, guys, wanted to write
in and let you know how glad I am to
support Kiva dot org along with you. I had found
the site before your micro lending podcasts, but didn't completely
understand it until then. Since the date of that podcast
(28:28):
almost two years ago, I've made twenty six loans and
I'm a member of the stuff you should Know lending team. Uh.
The other thing I wanted to share with you is
that I just started volunteering with Cuba. I applied over
a year ago to be on their volunteer editing team
and they finally had an opening last month invited me
to join. Long story short, they won't let me leave.
Please send help. My job is to get the loan
(28:50):
descriptions directly from the field partners and then edit them
before they go live on the web. Kind of cool.
I didn't know that they did that took volunteers like that.
We edit for grammar and clarity, and also check to
make sure that the loans UH details are correct. I
usually edit around ten to twenty five loans per week
and I love knowing that when I hit the submit button,
(29:11):
I'm directly improving someone's life. And that is from Aaron
H in Denver. Awesome, thanks Aaron. Pretty cool. She's given
money and she's loaning her time and expertise. That is
very neat. Um. If you want to learn more about
Kiva and micro lending, you can listen to our micro
Lending podcast or episode UM. You can also check out
(29:34):
our Kiva team k I v a dot org slash
team slash stuff you should know to join? That's right,
um and uh, let's see. You can also tweet to
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It's ready. Are you welcome to Stuff You Should Know?
From houseff Works dot Com. Hey, and welcome to the podcast.
I'm Josh Clark. There's Charles W. Chuck Bryant, which makes
(00:20):
this Stuff you should Know? Um, and we were about
to present part eighty in our series on law enforcement agencies.
Pretty soon we're going to just start profiling like X
cops and stuff like that. Dude, we we still haven't
done a t F for CIA or ADI. The CIA
article leaves a lot Not'm sure it needs some stuff.
(00:40):
So we're gonna do that week when we have extra
time to do a lot more research. Okay, well today
we're talking about the U. S. Marshals. That's right, So, Chuck,
have you ever seen the movie The Fugitive? I have? Well,
then we don't need to do this episode. Why is it?
That's it? It's the most accurate trail of the U. S.
(01:01):
Marshall ever created by man Tommy Lee Jones. Yes, he
was good in that. I'm a big fan. Yeah, I know,
he was great. It's really tough to go wrong with
Tommy Lee Jones. What was he in was he in
No Country for Old Man? And he's the last lines
and stuff like that. Yeah. He actually, if you've read
(01:21):
the book, is the main character is pretty much his character.
That's why when you see the movie and oh gosh,
I hate the spoilers spoiler alert when you see the
movie and and what's his face dies? H, have your
bar down now that the what you think is the
main character? Yes, uh, what's his face from the game
(01:44):
Josh Brolin Josh Roland in the movie, it's kind of like, wait,
he just kind of unceremoniously died and they didn't make
a big deal about it. Remember in the movie, but
if you read the book, he's not really the main character,
so it sort of makes more sense. Anyway. I love
the Coen Brothers, so they know what they're doing. God
the best. But again, Tommy Lee Jones, this is the
how Tommy Lee Jones works episode and he's a class act.
(02:08):
And chuck the we're talking about the Federal Marshals. Really
I was joking about Tommy Lee. Um, did you know
that they are the oldest law enforcement agency in the land. Yeah,
and most versatile they claim, Yeah, very proud of that fact.
They do a lot of stuff they really do. Um,
and in a lot of ways, they're very unsung. They
(02:29):
have a very long history. They were first created in
nine the first time Congress met, the Marshal Service was
literally created. Um. And they've had their highs and their
loves and the two hundred and twenty five years since
George Washington appointed the first thirteen marshals. That is very
(02:49):
cool right out of the gate. And Uh, basically they
set up the federal courts and they said, wow, we
need some people to kind of protect the courts. We
need some people that crack some heads. U S. Marshals done. Yeah,
And um, apparently as far as like law enforcement agencies
(03:09):
in the US goes, the federal marshals have kind of
had the short end of the stick traditionally. Um, especially
early on in the country's history when states rights wasn't
just relegated to like you know, you know, it was
a big deal that everybody right. UM, So you you
(03:30):
had this guy who was sometimes the only law enforcement
official in the entire land in your whole area, and
he's trying to shove federal laws down your throat when
you're all about states rights. And that was pretty much
the the the beginning of the Marshal Service was basically
(03:50):
being at odds with their friends and neighbors about the
stuff that they were doing. A lot of times it
was stuff that proved to be unconstitutional, like the Alien
and Sedition Act. Remember our buddy Eugene Debs who ran
for president and got a million votes from jail here
in Atlanta, the Socialists, He was jailed for the Alien
and Sedition Act. Yeah, I remember, Like you couldn't even
(04:11):
speak against the government publicly or else. It was considered
treason around World War One. Yeah, yeah, Yeah, Marcel's had
to arrest people like Eugene Debs for that kind of stuff.
So there have been plenty of points in the history
of this agency where like they haven't had to do
very good stuff, and uh, they've suffered for it. Yeah.
(04:32):
And the grabster Ed Grabanowski, who wrote this as well
as many other cool articles that we podcast on, pointed
out that the Civil War, or not the Civil War,
but slavery was kind of a contentious point because in
the South they had to enforce a slave trade bands
on slave imports, and then in the North they had
(04:55):
to prosecute people fugitives on the run and northern abligious
from like and in the South there like so camp
bring in our slaves. So yeah, the and the marshals
were like, man, no one likes me anywhere, I'm gonna
go out west. And they were liked in the West
in a lot of places. Probably yes, because literally out
(05:17):
west it was lawless in many many respects. And literally
and figuratively, there would be a marshal out there, and
the marshal is as you would see, just some guy
like sitting in an office in some boom town, right
like bat Masterson and that's it. Uh, And then he
would deputize the posse. That's extremely accurate. There's a there
(05:40):
would be a marshal out there, and if you needed
some extra help, you could grab some law abiding citizens
who had guns and say you're now an official of
the US government and you have to come crack heads
with me. Um. That's really how it happened. But yes,
like you said, in in situations like that, most of
the law abiding people are the people who are just
trying to mind some gold and leaving other people alone.
(06:00):
They were very happy that there was a marshal there.
Yea a little order for a change, right so there's
like a little uptick in a marshal appreciation in the
nineteenth century, the second half of it out West. Yeah,
that's kind of their heyday two from what I gather
if you don't count now. And I actually found too
that a lot of states still have a posse. But
it's like, you know, the Arkansas U. S. Marshall Posse,
(06:23):
and it's just the organization that helps to raise awareness
and stuff. It's like the p b A. Yeah, they'll
go around to schools and stuff like that. That's the
Marshal's Posse. Wow, it's very valuable job they do. Josh, well,
there's remember there's the posse Coomatatas Act that prevents posses,
doesn't it. I never heard of that. Yeah, we talked
about in the Delta Force episode. It's like it's it's
(06:46):
the law that prevents Delta Force from operating in the US. Ostensibly. Well,
in these days, you try to get a posse together
and people like dude, I'm watching Lost Boys come on nice. Uh.
Twenties century, early twentieth century, they were pretty close to
obscurity because um, they had a reputation for being fat,
(07:07):
lazy retired cops. Demoided grabbing. Owski puts it, I love
that that word. Dumb fat retired cops. Yeah, basically the
the UM. I don't know what led to that, but
they just kind of lost their their shape and um,
everybody knew it too. And then the respect for the
marshal service went down tremendously like that. It sounds like
(07:30):
it was a place where old cops go to die
or to retire. Um and uh. And then a guy
came along in the the ninety nine. His name is Frank Murphy,
and he became Attorney General of the United States, and
he said, you're gonna stop being so pudgy, c you.
We're gonna get you to work out. You're gonna be
good at arresting criminals. C. They said, whatever you say, Murphy. Yeah,
and that was that. Yeah, and they started taking shape again,
(07:53):
literally and figuratively, I guess. And uh, you know, throughout
the twentieth century made their aim for doing such brave
things like escorting black students to school during segregation. Those
were marshals when you see that famous picture. Um, although
I think some of them are National Guard as well. No,
the National Guard were ordered out by racist governors to
(08:16):
block the coming in and the Marshals odds with the
National Guard. Yeah, National Guards state. I feel like a dummy.
I don't, okay, I mean it just makes sense, you know,
like that, Well, the National Guard's gonna be out there protection.
No, no no, no, that's a big black eye on the
state of Alabama in particular and Mississippi. It's true. They
(08:36):
also um kind of mix it up with anti war
protesters during Vietnam and basically made more of a name
for themselves as the twentieth century advanced as hippie beaters. Yeah,
that's true. Uh so what what do they do though?
And also I just want to point out I don't
advocate the beating of hippies, and if you're gonna send
me an email, go back and listen to the whole
(08:57):
catalog first. Okay, except hippie Rob he deserves a good
beat down, but not really, not really, um so chuck. Finally,
we arrived to current day. As far as when this
article was written two thousand seven, and at a place
called Fort Smith, Arkansas, you will find the um National
(09:17):
Museum of the U. S. Marshals. Still to this day,
it's there four years later. I did not know that,
and they changed their their badge too. Used to be
a six point in star. Oh is it? It's five? Okay?
So okay, it did start out to being a six
silver star in a circle. Okay, so now it's a
(09:38):
five pointed star in a circle. But apparently up until
ninety one, so there's ninety four districts that UM coincide
with judicial districts federal judicial districts that Marshall served, and
every district was in charge of creating its own badge
until nineteen forty one when they standardized it. And each
district only has one marshal official marshal. The rest are
(10:00):
like deputies and things like that. Right, there's like about
four thousand deputies in ninety four marshals working that UM
three thousand. I saw that it said on their website
three thousand, nine hundred approximately three thousand, nine hundred and fifty,
and I was like, you know, we don't round up
the four thousand anymore when we hit that. Well, it's
(10:21):
better than having a ticker that's like takes one down
every time someone dies in the line of two up
one when one's born. Yeah, that's true, or a new
hire right, all right, So chuck Um, you said that
the Marshal services pretty versatile and for good reason. They
have UM at least four main areas of operation UM
(10:42):
and probably the best known one thanks to Mr Tommy
Lee Jones, the class act UM is catching fugitives, and
not just federal fugitives. They also support UM state and
local law enforcement groups in catching their fugitives too, So
the marshals are basically just big show offs. I got
a couple of stats here, Josh, Uh in two thousand ten,
(11:04):
I'm just gonna pepper your information with stats about that.
In two thousand ten they arrested more than eighty one thousand,
nine hundred state and local fugitives. That's when they're helping
everyone out. It was eighty nine thousand, nine hundred one
and UH. As far as federal federal fugitives, they arrested
more than thirty six thousand in two thousand ten alone.
(11:26):
That's a huge up tick in because state and local
because in two thousand seven in the article its sites
forty six thousand, eight hundred state and local fugitives, so
that's close to double. Yeah. Yeah, good work. Yes, well,
part of that was operating from Falcon Yeah, that was
mainly to UH, to nab unregistered sex offenders. Right, it
(11:47):
depends like it's it's it's a fugitive capture operation um
and in two thousand seven they were up to the
end of phase three. UM and I think each phase
would be a different part of the country and then
maybe a different emphasis. So Falcon three in two thousand
seven was launched to catch people who are supposed to
register as sex offenders but never did, making them fugitives
(12:08):
in the Eastern US and it nabbed ten thousand, seven
hundred and thirty three felons, sex offenders, the people we
do not want on the street, just a few, and
gang members more than gang members. And I think that's
a part of Operation Falcon right, I believe gang stuff, Yeah,
because ICE is responsible for um immigration. So although the
(12:34):
Marshall Service have four outposts Mexico, Jamaica and a couple
other places in the Caribbean, Yeah, Colombia and Dominican Republic,
I think that's all drug related. That's just a guess. Yeah,
But um so they would and they do arrest people
in those countries. Um One of the guys on their
most wanted list was arrested in Mexico. Um So they
(12:58):
can operate outside of the country, but they wouldn't. They
wouldn't have anything to do with immigration. Although I can't
see them not working with Ice. They might. Yeah, it
seems like they will work with whoever asked for their help.
You know, they're like, sure, we can send a team
down there. Um. One of the other big aspects of
their job is prisoner transport because they're they're in charge of, um,
(13:20):
basically looking over the court system, the federal court system,
anything that has to do with protecting a courtroom, transporting
a prisoner, the keeping the security aspect of the federal
judicial system functioning. That's what they do. And a big
part of that is shuffling prisoners from place to place. Yeah,
and they do that via the Justice, Prisoner and Alien
(13:41):
Transportation System. And that is literally their own bus line, airline,
van line, whatever they need. If you've seen them pretty
bad movie con Air that was those were marshals and uh,
every day they have sixty three thousand, roughly sixty three
thousand prisoners custody and then they transport these dudes and
(14:03):
ladies I guess, all over the all over the place
on planes. Yeah. Um, no beverage service and I'll bet not,
and I'll bet those um like the stuff on the
seatbacks where you rest your head. Yes, haven't been watched
in a while. No in flight movie. Yeah, it's no frills,
exactly what it is. Uh, if you want to see
(14:24):
a very frill laden aircraft, you should see Airport. I
think the third one, did you watch that recently? Has awesome?
You know what I watched the other day, Towering Inferno.
I've got the in my instant que It's pretty good, man.
I gotta say like it holds. It's way too long.
First of all, it's like two and a half hours long,
(14:45):
and it didn't need to be, Like they should have
cut out a lot of the plot points. But as
far as just like, uh, oh my god, what's gonna happen?
It was pretty big ranks still suspense. Yeah, that's that's
the word. Yeah it is. It's among it's among the
best of the seventies disaster flicks. Right. Yeah, and you
got Paul Newman and Steve McQueen in the same movie.
(15:06):
That's just off the tough guy meter. Yeah. Well, I
I didn't have my full attention last night, so I
didn't watch that. Instead. I punished me and you meet
with Beyond the Poseidon Adventure. That's so funny. We're on
this kick of old disaster. It's weird. Unbeknownst. Yeah, I
had no idea until just this moment. Towering Airports seventy eight. Um, so, chuck,
(15:29):
I think it's seventy eight. There's also seventies seven. Yeah,
there's a few seventy seventy seven. I think it's seventy seven.
It's the one where Jimmy Stewart owns a luxury airliner
is flying these people who end up beneath the surface
of the Atlantic in the Bermuda Triangle. Okay, and you
know who wasn't towering in front of Fredi Stair? Yeah,
(15:50):
when his last movie and he actually there's one small
Sceneri's dancing and my eyes were just like, oh my god,
Fredi stairs dancing. Well, apparently in the Tower of Inferno
they had like fifty something sets and all the eight
of them were like went up in flames. H wow. Yeah, geez,
that's a sidetrack. That's much more interesting. They got marshals,
I think, so they transport prisoners, they kept capture fugitives,
(16:13):
and then um we we did a whole podcast on
Witness Security Program wit SEC, the Witness Protection Program UM,
but we'll talk about it briefly here. Basically, it was
conceived in nineteen seventy and since then the Marshal Service,
which basically UM hides federal witnesses and keeps them hidden,
gives them new lives UM, or just you know, keeps
(16:37):
them in safe houses during trial, depending on the arrangement. Uh.
They say that since nineteen seventy, since the beginning, not
one witness has been harmed if they follow the rules.
Plenty of witnesses have been wax but went to a
movie or something with you know, look at me, I'm
Jimmy two legs Josh. They also, we we said protect
(17:00):
the courts. They still do that today, more than two
thousand judges and four courthouses nationwide. They install security systems,
they provide personal escort and watch over high risk trials.
And there's also a few other people they helped transport UM.
I think all federal judges, U S attorneys, personnel in jurors.
(17:25):
UM they provide protection for and they transport UM. The
Supreme Court justices outside of Washington, d C. I'm their
annual picnic I guess so, and I guess in d C.
And I'm not sure who it is. It may be
secret Service or something or maybe just I don't know
local local marshals, and we should point that out. Marshal
(17:47):
is a term that's used a lot, but unless you
are a U S. Marshal, then you're not part of
the U S. M say, like, you can be a
marshal like some countries have marshals. Is military ranks or
air marshals are not related to UM the Marshal Service
that yeah, I thought they were. I thought they were
U S. Marshals they or not UM. Also, we should
(18:09):
say if you are if you're a drug dealer and
you get popped for a beef by the FEDS and
they take your stuff, it's the marshals who have it.
They're in charge of ash st seizure, yes, and distribution
to like selling off stuff to give reparation to families
and victims and stuff, or to fund the Marshal Service
(18:29):
or to fund the Marshal Service picnic. What else can
they do, Josh. They have a SWAT group Special Operations Group,
which basically does the same thing that SWAT teams do,
but for federal stuff. Okay, that makes sense. And um,
they once arrested, arrested and making air quotes a fleet
of UM eighteenth century shipwrecks off the coast of Rhode
(18:54):
Island at the request of the governor UM to protect it,
to take it and take these to federal custody and
protect them from vandals and UM salvagers. Yeah, yeah, I
got a stat on the assets. They currently manage eighteen
thousand assets valued at three point nine billion bucks. It's
a lot of cigarette boats. And in two thousand ten
(19:16):
paid UM victims of crimes about three hundred and fifty
million dollars. So they do use it for reparation time
some of it. UM. They also made payments to state
and low local law enforcement agencies of five hundred and
eighty millions, So maybe they repay. Like if you wrect
your police cars in the pursuit of this guy, we'll
(19:37):
pay you back. Here's some money. We're sell off their
stuff and we'll pay you back. Just remember Uncle Sam
takes care of you. Uh what else, Josh, Well, the
we talked about how the MARS services set up within
the ninety four districts and the thirty nine fifty three
three thousand, nine fifty three deputies. Um, but how did
(19:58):
they get there? Chuck? Apparently I used to have an
exam and then now they used the standard federal Career
intern program, which it takes a couple of years to
get you to make sure that you're not just some
jerk too could fill out on application yeah, or once
a free gun. Yeah. So you gotta get a pay
your dues for a couple of years, and if you've
got the right stuff, then you have to go through
(20:21):
a seventeen and a half week training course at the U. S.
Marshall Service Training Academy in Glencoe, Georgia. Did you did
you know the Marshall's Training Academy is here? I didn't,
and I didn't even know actually, And it's down it's
sort of halfway between Jacksonville and Savannah. It's down on
the coast and your St. Simon's. It does ring a
(20:41):
slight bell. I think it was not even a place
until they put the thing there and they named it Glencoe.
I don't know if that stands for anything, but I
don't even think that was a legitimate town until they
set up a six acre campus that has its own
zip code. That's very neat. It's big, um chuck. If
(21:03):
you want to become a U. S. Marshal, there's some
Now you can't just fill out an application. You have
to go through the training program. But even to get
into the training program too, on the U S. Marshall track,
there's some um, some qualifications you have to have. You
have to be a US citizen. Check you have to
be between the ages of thirty six. Nope, Um, you
(21:27):
could still I could. I'd better hurry up. Being good
physical condition, I would say, I'm not, and you're you're
so so stuff. So would you say you're in good
physical conditions? I would? So you could pass these these tests,
I could. You could do the fifty chin ups and
run the mile in a certain time over a long
enough period of time, I could. A bachelor's degree check. Uh,
(21:53):
three years experience in law enforcement or other qualifying job experience. Uh.
Valid driver's license and a good driving record. Yeah, okay,
I'm good. Well, aside from the age limit, then you're
fine in the physical condition, in the experience. So pretty much,
I'm a US citizen and I have a driver's license.
(22:15):
That's what qualifies me. Uh. There's some famous Marshals besides
Tommy Lee Jones and Bat Masterson who I mentioned Did
you mention him? Yes? I just got threw him in earlier.
Was Marshall Dylan a real person Matt Dylon or was
he just a fictional character? I don't think he was
fictional character? Pretty sure h TV Baby White Earth was
(22:36):
real though. Yea and Virgil and Morgan Earp his brothers.
They were all Marshals, as was wild Bill Hickock. And
while Bill is the tie that binds the Marshall's podcast
and the Swords following podcast because he brought in a
Cowboys and Indians set up to the Three Worlds Fair
(22:57):
in Chicago. Ah, look at you up in both. Wow.
Frederick Douglas had no idea that he was a U. S. Marshall. No,
and the Marshall for d C two, which I imagine
it is probably a pretty busy district. Did you see
you don't watch Louis, do you? No? He had episode
of his daughter dressed up like Frederick Douglas for Halloween
(23:19):
and apparently that was what he wanted to be when
he was a kid one year, so he brought it
back years later for a show. Yeah. Um, what else, Josh,
they have the most wanted list that is different than
the FBI S. Yeah, I remember they caught that one
dude in Mexico. They caught one of their own dudes
in Mexico that went to the other side, I think too.
(23:42):
Oh yeah, that's right, he like went Randy Gaiden turned
into a drug dealing murderer allegedly, allegedly allegedly these days, Josh,
the director is a is a lady named Stacia Hilton,
and it was a really controversial nomination actually by Obama.
Well she was, um, she's a socialist. Yeah, she has
(24:07):
um had strong ties to the private prison industry and
the U. S. Marshals is also responsible for awarding contracts
to build federal prisons. Oh yeah. So basically it was
one of those deals where they're like, hey, she made
a lot of money as a consultant for all these companies.
You appoint her, and she's going to give her friends
(24:28):
the in the private prison industry fat contracts. So she
had petitions going around basically, but the nomination did go through,
and apparently it was kind of sped through. Huh. So
all those people out there we like to call out
folks on both sides. We're doing it could go and
chuck now, thanks um. And also I should say there's
(24:53):
between two hundred and four hundred marshals that have died
in the line of duty, since that's not a lot no, um.
And the first was a guy named Robert Forsyth, and
he went to go serve court papers for a civil
case to two brothers, Beverly and William Allen. And uh.
He took the Allen brothers aside to say, hey, I
(25:15):
don't want to embarrass you, but here's some papers. And
rather than come with them, they ran upstairs, locked themselves
in the door. When they heard um forsythe coming up
the stairs, they shot through the door and it hit
him in the head and killed him instantly. So here's
the first first marshal shot during the line of duty
in Augusta, Georgia. Yeah, and I actually saw that. He
(25:35):
was the first law enforcement officer ever killed in the
line of duty in the United States. And he wore
like powdered wigs and everything too. It was like old
timey colonial, just just post colonial. So that's it. That's
us marshals, right, that's right. They do a valuable service.
And now you know what that is thanks to Chuck
(25:56):
and his law enforcement crush. You know you and the
Grab story. You guys are kindred spirits for sure. I
do watch cops, yeah, do you? Yeah? I mean not
like I don't know when it comes on, but if
I'm in the right mood and i'm channel surfing and
I'll see it's on like nine times in a row,
I'll watch five or six of them. Do you ever
watch Real Stars of the Highway Patrol? Uh? Yeah, Real Stories?
(26:18):
Yeah yeah, I've watched all those shows occasionally not. I
just want to point that out. This happens like once
a month. It's not like a no one there. I
don't schedule my type and then Emily always bust me
and it's like, oh my god, how do you watch that?
I's like, well, these people make me feel better about myself.
They would make you a fan. Um. If you want
(26:40):
to learn more, and you I'm speaking to you the
listener now. Um. If you want to learn more about
the U. S. Marshals, you can type in Marshals one L.
I was looking up that show in plain sight, and
even on the USA Networks site they spelled Marshals with
two ls, which is a name, yeah of person, Yes,
(27:01):
it is too else. Um. So it's m A R
S A H A L I got it. Um. You
can type that in the search bar at how stuff
works dot com, which means it's time for a listener mail.
That's right, Josh. And this is a little Kiva related thing.
You want to tell everyone about Keeva real quick. We
have to keep the team. Uh, it's keepa dot org
(27:23):
k I v A right. And it's a micro lending
site where you can go on and lend twenty five
or more bucks two people in developing countries. They use
it to um ostensibly keep their businesses afloat and grow.
And basically you're fighting poverty and all sorts of other
problems through micro lending. And what what's our goal here?
(27:45):
Our goal is to get to I think six hundred
thousand or three quarters of a million seven fifty thousand
by when at the end of this year. Okay, yes, yes,
we're supposed to get to three quarters of a million
by the end of the year. Yes, And we have
to thank glennon Son for kind of heading that up.
Our fans who who set the goals for us, because
(28:08):
they're smarter than we are about figuring out if it's attainable.
They boss us around they too, So anyway, this is
from Aaron H in Denver. Hi, guys, wanted to write
in and let you know how glad I am to
support Kiva dot org along with you. I had found
the site before your micro lending podcasts, but didn't completely
understand it until then. Since the date of that podcast
(28:28):
almost two years ago, I've made twenty six loans and
I'm a member of the stuff you should Know lending team. Uh.
The other thing I wanted to share with you is
that I just started volunteering with Cuba. I applied over
a year ago to be on their volunteer editing team
and they finally had an opening last month invited me
to join. Long story short, they won't let me leave.
Please send help. My job is to get the loan
(28:50):
descriptions directly from the field partners and then edit them
before they go live on the web. Kind of cool.
I didn't know that they did that took volunteers like that.
We edit for grammar and clarity, and also check to
make sure that the loans UH details are correct. I
usually edit around ten to twenty five loans per week
and I love knowing that when I hit the submit button,
(29:11):
I'm directly improving someone's life. And that is from Aaron
H in Denver. Awesome, thanks Aaron. Pretty cool. She's given
money and she's loaning her time and expertise. That is
very neat. Um. If you want to learn more about
Kiva and micro lending, you can listen to our micro
Lending podcast or episode UM. You can also check out
(29:34):
our Kiva team k I v a dot org slash
team slash stuff you should know to join? That's right,
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