April 19, 2012 • 38 mins
Do you know that up until July 2011 an ambitious hacker with a good software program could deduce your social security number based on your date and place of birth? In this episode, the boys examine some of the lesser-known details of the Social Security system in the U.S.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Brought to you by the reinvented two thousand twelve camera.
It's ready. Are you welcome to Stuff you should Know
from house Stuff Works dot com? Hey, and welcome to
the podcast. I'm Josh Clark, There's Charles W. Chuck Bryant
(00:21):
A K A to eight six five four seven five
two three D. You can't get out you're so so
security number. I thought about that. I thought about what
if I like ended up when we were describing like
what the different numbers and were, I was like, well,
my why happened to be this one? If you listen
to the whole podcast, you can put together and so
security number. That's like, don't do that, Josh, don't. We
(00:43):
should probably beef out what I said anyway, because that
might be someone else's Social Security number. Yeah, I don't.
I don't want to be responsible for that. Okay, we'll
go back and beat that out. That's really some c
o A right there. Why how do you know that
that person had been like, yes, you know, its called
me out Serial number one. I want a contest. I
(01:03):
can pay for my own hotel in Atlanta to go
see the guys, but just me so um, Jerry like that? Uh, so,
chuck ah, do you know much about social security? A bit?
You're about to chuck um. The Social Security Act is
(01:28):
created by our old timey forbears. Um basically created a scheme,
and not scheme in the way of like a carbon
trating scheme or something like that. I know you don't
like that word, but it's a legitimate word. It doesn't
necessarily mean something nefarious. But under this scheme, social security
um is given to retiring workers in the in the
(01:52):
form of a monthly payment, where basically it says, hey,
good job, you did a good job working. Go take
care of yourself. We don't want you to die on
the street. This should hopefully sustain you in your retirement years. Right.
This is before the advent of four oh one case
and the like this, this thirty five bucks a month. Right. Well,
(02:12):
the whole, the whole basis of it is that the
workers of today pay into the Social Security fund and
it is immediately taken and distributed dispersed two workers who
have retired today. Yeah, so the workers of today are
taking care of the workers of yesterday. That's the whole
(02:35):
point to what This has led some people to claim
that the Social Security program is nothing more than a
Ponzi scheme where you're taking the money of these people
to pay off other people for socialism. Even Oh, it's total,
totally different. It is socialism. Yeah, but people cry socialism
a lot these days, and they don't think about things
(02:57):
like social security in all the different ways we do
have socialism that people are like, oh, that's fine, right, sure, yeah,
but well but you can make a case that it
is a Ponzi scheme. But Stephen Goss, chief actuary for
the Social Security Administration, would take issue with that. I'm
sure he would. He would say it's not a Ponzi
(03:18):
scheme because the Ponzi scheme is not sustainable. Some might
argue that social security is not sustainable, and that is,
as we say here in the South, that's a whole
another show. Okay, well I want to talk about it anymore. Well,
what do you have some numbers on its sustainability? Well,
we can chat about it. Here's the thing. So if
you if you just if you had zero population growth,
(03:39):
this thing would work forever, right, and it would work
completely efficiently with no changes whatsoever. Unfortunately, we don't have
zero population growth, and we actually had a spike in
population that we know of as the baby boom, right,
which means that very shortly and starting now, I think
um more, there will be way more retired workers than
(04:00):
there are workers, Which means that the workers of today
are going to have a far greater burden placed on
them taking care of these retired workers than any other
workers ever have our will. But Stephen goss chief Actuary
for the Social Security Administration, says this will eventually work
itself out. The government has taken steps to address this.
And what is done is raise the amount of money
(04:22):
that people throw into this, and they're taking the extra
money and the government is buying treasury bonds investing in itself. Now,
here's the weird thing. When they come mature these bonds,
the government pays these things off with other tax money.
So the government is going to pay the Social Security
(04:43):
Fund back with other tax money. Now, this will drive
people crazy, conservatives, libertarians, umbers right leaning liberals, right fiscally
conservative liberals especially, But Stephen Gossa shares it's just a
little bump. We're probably not gonna have another population spike
for a while, and so security will go right back
(05:04):
to normal. It just yes for us right now, Right,
the other thing that I never really thought about is
it could not have been a sustainable program even to
begin with, because you start Social Security and when when
was it people started getting paying It paid out, you know,
a year later, two years later, and so they weren't
(05:26):
paying in that long. So immediately you've got a problem
on your hands because people are starting to get payouts
that didn't pay in for twenty years. Yes, that is
the case, but the payoffs were smaller at first. Yeah,
but it still creates a bit of a wrinkle. I
think that would a wrinkle in time for the future.
I think so. But it was a hump that had
(05:46):
to be gotten over, and it was gotten over. Like basically,
the first people just got screwed. Yeah. Well, well but
they didn't pay in that much either though, So no,
and that's true, So they were rightly screwed. Okay, so
let's talk about the history of all this chuck. And
and by the way, I guess the takeaway from that
intro Social Security is considered a what upon CI scheme.
(06:10):
I think people are just sitting there like, I know,
all right, well you already you already blew the big
secret there the act of um it was coined. The
name social Security was coined by Abraham Epstein Um, who
led the American Association for Social Security. And they began
(06:33):
paying out in thirty seven, Like you said, yeah, just
just for workers. Right. It was the the the biggest
wage earner of a household, basically the dad um got
the money as the retiree. Yeah, and it was a
lump sum, right. They didn't pay it in monthly uh buckets.
Back then, tell him what the first guy who got
(06:54):
social Security got his slump sum? Yeah, his lumpsom was
uh was it seventeen cents in January nine, thirty seven.
He was the first guy that gets Social Security benefits
And I looked it up. That's two dollars and fifty
five cents in two thousand ten money. Oh well, so
even back then he was just like, hey, federal government
(07:16):
gets that in my pocket for you. Yeah. Um, Josh
just made an obscene gesture. We should just say that. Um.
In nine, just two years later, they added survivors benefits
and benefits two spouses and children. Uh flashboard of fifty six,
they had a disability of benefits. Sixty five, Medicare was
(07:38):
signed into law, and in sixty one the I'm sorry.
In sixty two, the Civil Service Commission in the I
r S adopted the Social Security number as your official
federal I D number and taxpayer I D number, respectively,
which is a kind of a thing because the first
(07:58):
Social Security cards cifically said on them not to be
used as identification. Yeah, but they never made a follow
up law to enforce it, and so everybody's like, no,
this is perfect for identification. Yeah, I always, I'll always
remember it because of this card in my wallet. We'll
use the mark of the beast is identification. Um, the
first numbers, because this is not just about Social Security
(08:21):
but more about the numbers, which is more interesting than
I thought. Slightly. Yeah, um, it was. They were distributed
to the post office because they didn't have field offices yet.
So ye, post offices took the initial task. Two. Uh
type up. These cards are called typing centers. Yeah. So
(08:41):
basically this is, um, this is what I This is
the part I entitled bureaucracy. How right. Yeah. The Social
Security Um Administration contacted all employers in the United States
and said, hey, uh, this is a form SS four
and on it you just list the number of employees
you have working for you. Mail it back to us.
(09:02):
And so all the employers filled out I have fifteen employees,
and then mailed the S S four back to the
Social Security Administration. So Security Administration opened up the S
S fours and they said, okay, this employer has fifteen employees,
so we're going to mail him fifteen S S five forms,
which are basically signing up for your Social Security number. Right.
(09:25):
So they mailed the fifteen back, probably in one package,
to the employer, and the employer distributed them among his employees.
Employees filled out the S S five forms and they
sent them back to the Such Security Administration. Such Security
Administration said, okay, now we have these and we're going
to assign social security numbers. Right the um they said, hey,
(09:48):
go to your post office. The post office gave them
the social security numbers. The post office then sent that
duplicate form to the Social Security Administration, who created the
master file of all of these documents put together, which
was your so Security number file, and that was sent
to Maryland. Yes, and then in Maryland is where it
all came together. That's right. Uh, well what came together there?
(10:13):
The numbers, the numbering, the whole thing, your whole file,
the block the block file. That's right. So let's talk
about the first numbers. Since we're there. Who has it?
And is it zero zero one zero one zero zero
zero one? Is it the first number? No? Well we
should first say that no one knows for sure who
got the very first card in the very first number,
(10:34):
because they they reckon about several hundred thousand people applied
in that first November of ninety six. So I didn't
do the math, but there's some I'm sure you could
figure out statistically, and I'd be interested to hear how
to do this. But um, if a hundred thousand people
all got their card that day and the post offices
(10:56):
were open from like eight to five, how many people
or handed their Social Security number card um simultaneously that day?
How many first people were there? There's got to be
some awesome math equation to figure that out. Somebody should
do that for us. Since the UM so they don't
(11:17):
know officially who it was, but their first official record, uh,
they do know. UM it was a guy named John
David Sweeney Jr. And he had the social Security number
oh five five O nine O one and by oh
I mean zero of course or aught and he got
(11:37):
his because the head of the Social Security Administration took
it off the top of the stack, yeah, and said
this is the first one. That's right, So there you go.
But they did offer that to um oh no, sorry,
zero zero one number, the lowest number right on record.
Right before we get to there, though, John David Sweeney
ironically died before he could collect his uh social Security payments.
(12:01):
John David Tweeney is the one with the first security number.
So that is very ironic. That's the fact of the
podcast if you ask me. Yeah, because retirement age was
sixty five and he died at sixty one. Today they
handle it differently. It's a little confusing, but actually it's
not that confusing. You just have to be good at math.
Benefits are reduced by five nights of one per cent
(12:22):
for every month you retire before the age of sixty
five or rich person. Yeah, it's good for you. So um,
so back to the number one oh one or whatever. Yeah,
the all time low number holder, who always will be
until we start recycling numbers if we ever need to,
(12:43):
We we may, we may. Her name is um Grace
d Owen. She is of Concord, New Hampshire, or conquered
okay um and uh yeah, because we always get mail
from people it's like, oh, you pronounced it Nevada, it's Nevada.
Or if we say Vada, they say, hey, you pronounced
Nevada incorrectly. It's Nevada. No, it is Nevada. But I
(13:06):
tell everyone that writes in from Nevada, only people from
Nevada say Nevada. Everyone else says Nevada, especially people in Missouri.
So um, Chuck Gracedo and of Conquord, New Hampshire got
the lowest number zero zero one zero one zero zero
zero one number. It was UM. And she got that
(13:28):
not because she was first in line, as we've said,
different guy got that low number. Uh, or a different
guy got the first number and it wasn't low. Um.
She got it because of where she lived. Originally, the
number scheming was based on well, the first two numbers
were based on the state you lived in, um and
starting northeast, moving westward, and so you had less than
(13:53):
fifty possible primary numbers, the first two first through renas. Yeah,
well not even they didn't even have fifty at the time,
did they know? That's what I'm saying. So this is
a total waste of digits. They figured out very quickly,
so they started assigning them to zip codes instead. And
we should talk about these numbers. Do you want here?
(14:13):
Are we there now? Well, we are almost there. But
um you didn't mention that Grace Owen got that number.
They actually offered it as an honor to um John
g Winnt these Social Security Board chairman, and John Campbell,
the Federal Bureau of Old Age Benefits rep for the
Boston They offered them both the number oh one oh
(14:36):
one oh one and they no, no thanks. We are
true bureaucrats and that would be against the bureaucracy's rules.
That's right. And seventeen cents to Ernest Ackerman, the first
guy to get a payment. Yes, but um iidem A
Fuller made out like a bandit. This is exactly the problem.
(14:56):
This is not the problem. Mrs Fuller did good things
with her money. She brought herself in edzel Um, she
uh invested in um uh web band. She did great things.
She did um so id to a. Fuller retired in
November nineteen thirty nine, and she was the first person
(15:19):
to start collecting monthly benefits. So by the time she
by the time social Security payments or by the time
you had to start paying and because another fact is
that you can't opt out UM and the time she retired,
she contributed a total of twenty four dollars and seventy
five cents because of the Social Security scheme. UM. By
(15:40):
the time she died at age one hundred, nineteen seventy five,
she collected a total of twenty two thousand, eight hundred
and eighty eight dollars and nine two cents. She made
out she wore like a bandanna around her face like
the rest of her life she did. Yeah, she was
a Social Security bandit. Okay, back to the numbers. Enough history,
(16:04):
I think so. Um So, the first three numbers they're
called what the area numbers, and like you said, they
were originally from northeast to west. So like if you
were if you lived in New Hampshire, um, you your
first three numbers were gonna be zero, zero one. Then
they figured out that, well that's stupid, like we're gonna
(16:24):
have fifty states tops, so there's a whole number that
we're not using. Eventually we're gonna need it. Because social
Security numbers aren't recycled, they're retired after the person dies, right,
that is true. So then they started assigning them to
zip code, so that started using up a lot more numbers, right, yeah,
zip code on the mailing address on the application form,
(16:44):
which didn't necessarily indicate your residents. It's just wherever the
mailing address was where you applied, right, exactly when you
were living. Uh right, And it doesn't, Yeah, it doesn't.
Mailing in residents is not the same address most times
it is, but even still, like the place where I
was born, it's not where I live now, so right,
(17:04):
So I mean you have a lot of um weird
numbers for the beginning in the early seventies, since seventy
two is when they started the zip code. So I
believe that I actually am one of the last years
since I was born in seventy one, last people to
get uh the one based on the state. Cool, so
(17:28):
I'm old timing, seriously, that is something. Um. The next
two numbers are group numbers, so you have your area
number and then the area numbers broken into groups zero
one through Yeah, and this makes sense. So the two
numbers in the middle are the you are that group
(17:48):
of that zip code or that state, depending on how
old you are. It was just a means to break
it up and make it simpler for accounting and filing
and all that stuff. Right, because instead of UM just
one group from an area, or what nine ninety nine
possible areas, you now have nine groups of nine ninety
(18:10):
nine possible areas, nine nine groups each to allow us
for a lot more. Because the the eight ball that
the Social Security number UM is always behind is basically
running out of numbers. I don't think it will happen.
It will there well, eventually, but there's what they says,
a billion combinations. But consider this, there's been more than
(18:31):
four hundred million numbers issued since so what sixty five
seventy seven years? Right, I have a feeling that does
take into account the baby boom that ate up a
lot of numbers, But I mean I have a feeling
that we could we could reach that and what another
hundred hundred years, the US will be around I'm sure
(18:52):
longer than then, hopefully. Yeah, China is rising, well, it'll
be at the very least not in our lifetime. Oh no,
so who cares. I would have agreed with you had
you qualified it like that. Yeah, what they'll probably do
is UM and I'm guessing here, but they'll probably start
reassigning numbers from dead people, which will be weird. I
use so security number. Yeah, imagine they go back. I mean,
(19:16):
it would make sense to me that they would start
from the beginning again almost so like you're using someone's
number from and the year. Yeah, you got a stinky
old mothball number. It's like a wicker um wicker wheelchair
or something like that, like leather leg breaks is something weird,
(19:36):
like from the thirties. What are you talking about? You
know exactly what I'm talking about. Okay, the last four
digits are the serial numbers, and uh they number consecutively
from triple O one through So that's just saying, well,
we're gonna extend the number the possible numbers we can
(19:58):
come up with exactly. You've the more billion, and you
know what, you don't even necessarily have to recycle even
if you add like an extra attempt digit. How much
would that change everything? I mean, they have to rewrite
all their programming and all their accountings, and then we
wouldn't have to recycle numbers. Good point they have. Luckily,
(20:20):
they have people much smarter than that's deciding how to
handle that. I don't know. We're pretty sharp, all right, Josh,
common questions, These are actually pretty good. Okay, Chuck, here's
a question for you. Does everyone have to have a
Social Security number? If you're over eighteen, then yes, you do. UM.
And you if you receive an income and you're over eighteen, UM.
(20:42):
If you're interested in starting up a bank account, being
a deduction on your parents, income taxes, all sorts of
things like that, metal getting medical coverage, taking advantage of
government services, then you're gonna need that. So there's a
lot of people who just you that that you have
to have that. Practically speaking, you do, like any bank
(21:07):
can be like I'm not doing business with you, and
then you say, okay, well I can't force you to
by law, but I'll try your competitor, and you go
on down the line and maybe you find a bank.
From what I understand, there's banks that are set up
in the Midwest, um for people who don't have Social
Security numbers, Like who've said I'm not gonna have one,
I don't trust the government, don't want to have a
(21:28):
serial number, and I'm not going to have this no,
but they're still paying in Oh yeah, yeah, I think
they're still paying in but they don't have a Social
Security number, so that means they're not gonna get benefits
at the end. I don't think they think they're going
to get benefits anyway. I could get that, UM. But yeah,
they don't have a Social Security number. I think there
are there are people who don't pay Social Security as well.
(21:51):
It's like a whole Yeah, there's that's like a whole
topic along the fringe of whether or not you need
to have one, whether or not you actually do have
to pay in the constitution, a reality of it, all
that stuff, but for all practical purposes, your life is
exponentially easier if you have a so Security number. Right,
And you also said you have to pay because you
can't tell the government, you know what, I'm setting up
(22:11):
for my own retirement and I want to take all
the available money that I make to do that because
my retirement plan is much better than whatever you yokels
are working on. Yeah, because I mean, if you you
have to pay in fifteen point three percent, I don't
know if that's current. I haven't looked, but as of
the writing of this UM, this article, it was fifteen
(22:32):
point three seven point six paid by you out of
your gross pay and seven point six five paid by
your employer. It is staggering how much we pay in
taxes in this country. So if you took fifteen point
three percent of your gross pay and put it into
a four oh one k over the same course of years,
(22:53):
you would have so much more money. Yeah, barring another
stock market catask t fee before you could get your
money out of your formal one k um, you would
have way more than you have from the Social Security
Administration As as benefits. You know, what I'm meant to
look up is if the government uses this money for
(23:13):
other things in the meantime or is it strictly like here,
it's in this little pool and all we're doing is
paying people out with it. Well, supposedly, before the baby
boom problem arose, it was going in and right back out,
and I'm sure any surplus was invested in treasury bonds.
Now um, all of the surplus is invested in treasury bonds,
(23:36):
which is just such a shell game. It's so crazy,
and no one has any idea if this is gonna work.
I swear to God, I'm not paranoid, but don't live
in the Midwest. I'm not a fringe dweller. This is
not something I like keep up with a lot um.
I don't read World net daily. There's nothing like that
in my life. But I'm telling you this is like
there there's no guarantee that this social secure a UM
(24:01):
I guess bandage for the baby boom populations, like if
it's gonna work, it's it's really at the very least,
it's interesting. Yeah. And the troubling, I would say, at
the very least say, uh, they let you. They make
it real easy for you to slap a number on
your little brand new baby. Yes, do you have to
have a number for your child? Well, like I said,
(24:21):
if you want them to get medical coverage and UM
open up a savings account in their name for like
their future college or trade school or travels around the world,
or you want to claim it as a deduction on
your tax filing, Yeah, then they they're gonna need one,
and they make it pretty easy on you to get
one for your new, little, uh smelly baby. They do again. UM,
I'm not a fringe dweller, but they have a very
(24:44):
sinister sounding Enumeration at birth program that's pretty bad. Yeah.
It was started in UM and basically, it just made
it very easy for you to get a source of
security number for your infant as part of their birth
record forms enumeration at birth. You know, I used to
I think I mentioned this before. I used to carry
my card around in my wallet when I was a
(25:06):
teenager because I thought it was I don't know, I
thought it made me, uh legitimate or adult, like it's
interesting everyone else's everyone else is out drinking, and I
was like, no, no, I got my self a security card.
It keeps keeps the urges away. Hey, speaking of Social
Security cards and wallets, do you want to talk about that, lady? Oh, yeah,
(25:30):
I can't. Yeah. This in uh nineteen thirty seven, dude
named Douglas Patterson had a wallet company. Yeah, he was
the vice president and treasurer of this wallet company, and
he said, you know what we should do. We should
include a fake Social Security card and every wallet, but
(25:50):
we'll make it look really, really realistic by copying yours secretary. Yeah.
He basically assigned these little fake cards, like you know,
you get a picture frame with a fake picture in it.
They gave out wallet or they sold wallets with a
fake SOL Security card with a real number. I don't
know why he thought that was a good idea or
why she went along with it. What was her name,
(26:12):
Hilda Straighter Whitcher? She went along with this? Maybe she
didn't know, No, she knew she did. Yeah, um, and uh,
I guess she didn't feel like she could assert herself
at the time. But um, what over forty years something
like forty thou people used her social Security number? Yeah,
they gave her new and yeah, and people are still
(26:34):
using it as as recently his nineteen seventies seven, there
were twelve people using that as their own because of
this wallet. Yeah. In in defense of the dude, he
did have the word uh, spitchammen on the bottom of it,
Spaceman specimen. But it was, you know, in small print,
and it looked like the real deal. It had the
little emblem that. Um who was the guy who designed that? Uh?
(26:58):
Fred Happele That's right? And what else did he design?
The flying Tiger's logo? Yeah? Which what was that? Like
a B two bomber logo? Well, who knows? World War two?
I guess, uh, some sort of gunner plane or something. Okay,
that'd be my guess. The fighting hell cats. Yeah, finding
health fish, healthfish the health fish with the Simpsons. Okay, um, Josh,
(27:24):
can you get a new number? Yes, but only in
very extreme cases like stalking, like talking, or fraud, a
bad case of fraud. I guess yeah. I would imagine
that the FBI can probably get you one if you're
part of the Witness Protection program. Oh sure, which we've
talked about. Yeah, you don't have to pay for that.
(27:45):
There's no fee from the s s A. But um
you uh what what you should be wary of his
companies that claim that they can get you a new
number to absolve your credit, Like, hey, have you let
an awful bad life become a new person, We'll get
you a new Social Security number, which is hilarious if
you think that that's that's crazy. Following for that, it's
(28:10):
like buying an elevator pass in high school as a
freshman or something like, Yeah, except way you worse when
you have a single floor high school, because I'm sure
they're like, not only do we charge you a feed,
but give us your so Security number because we have
to go in and like make sure that it's wiped out.
Right where are we here? Uh? You know? The title
(28:33):
of the section was why does it matter? If someone
knows my Social Security number, I think it's pretty obvious. Yeah,
identity theft it's a big problem these days. Back in
the old days it wasn't as much. It's actually gone
down since this article, what four thousand years what they
said here, right SEV. Now, well that's the ones that
(28:53):
the FTC gets reports of, which are probably the lion
share of them. But it was supposedly increasing like by
some crazy percentage year. It's it's up eleven. So it's
gone down. So I think people have just gotten scared
of it, more wary about it. But um, I mean
it's still obviously a pretty big problem. Part of the
(29:15):
problem though, is that we shouldn't be using so security
numbers for identification for a reason. They're just way too
publicly available. Even the last four digits, Um, don't use
that as like your pin number. No, But I mean,
even if somebody asks you your last four digits, how
many people do have your last four digits? How many
(29:36):
companies A lot? And they also have your birth date,
they also have where you're born, your mother's maiden name.
It's just kind of like it's all out there, and
basically there's no really good scheme two. I guess uses
as a pass code as a past basically a way
of saying I am me, because if we all just
(29:59):
relied on some other number or something like that, then
people could find that out. There's really no good way
to do it. But um, so security numbers are definitely
not the answer. Yeah. I always get a little creeped
out when some business, you know, what are the last
like Comcast or something like my cable company. We'll say
what are your last words of your social and I'll
spit it out and they'll go, okay, right. You can
(30:20):
say I don't want to tell you, I want to
answer everything else, and they'll they'll run you through your paces.
But they know it because they're asking you for identific
like for verification exactly because you've given it to them already. Um,
you don't. There's basically most companies don't have any legal
right to ask you what you're so security number is.
(30:41):
But they can also say, well, we don't trust you,
so if you don't give it to us when you
open your account or whatever, then um, you're out of luck. Um.
With government agencies, you can ask for the UM Privacy
Act of nineteen seventy four, disclosure notice, which says like, hey,
(31:01):
we have a legal right to ask you this, or
we don't, and then you can say you can't ask
me that, bob. But um, all the protection advice I've
given here is pretty basic. You know, don't carry your
card in your wallet. Uh, cancel credit cards you don't use,
don't share what don't we just cancel credit cards you
(31:23):
don't use. There are things you should do, like keep
an eye on your accounts, your credit card accounts, even
though you don't use them. But that's not necessarily good advice,
especially credit wise, because there's this thing called the available
credit to um debt ratio. It's one of the ratios
that they figure credit score with. And if you have
a clean credit card you're not using that has like
(31:45):
five or ten grand of available credit on it, that counts,
and that's that makes you very attractive to people who
are selling new houses or cars or whatever. So don't
necessarily go do that, keep them in a safe deposit box,
keep an eye on all your out even if you're
not using them. Yeah, boy, my credit rating is so
good right now. That's awesome, dude. It's like top five
(32:06):
percentile somehow, and that is I say that as a
testament to you out there who may have bad credit.
You can repair it over time. Yeah you you you
animially did good. Huh uh. Well, yeah, she's the one
that helped me get my good credit back. That's good.
That's CFO. Congratulations, man, it's a big deal. Thank you.
It is good. And my debts, you know, from the
(32:28):
past were I don't want to get into it, but
they had less to do with me and more to
do with like books, Heroin, like bad roommates and getting
screwed over by you know, like, hey, you were supposed
to pay this Georgia power bill eight years ago and
it's still in my name and I didn't even know
about it. That kind of thing, and just being lazy
(32:50):
in college. Yeah, I missed my credit card payment. No
big deal, I'll just pay it next month. I'm just
kidna go buy some Heroin instead. I know it's you're
doing in college, Chuck, not that, So I guess that's
about it. Huh yeah. Um. One more piece of advice,
which is actually good. Every few years, go uh to
(33:13):
the ss A website and request a copy of your
earnings and Benefit Estimate statement. Yeah, have you heard of this? Before,
and I've never done it, and I'm gonna go do
it today. Alright, let's go do it together. We'll both
go do years together. We'll be like what. I've been
working since I was thirteen, so I imagine I'm doing
pretty good. Nice. Oh, we didn't talk about that. Um.
The system is waited. The whole reason it was instituted
(33:38):
was to help um, make sure that people don't fall
through the cracks or whatever, and to help the poor
more than the wealthy. Um. Although you get more money
out the more money you put in, right, which is
based on your income, so the money you make, the
more you ban. But it's also disproportionately waited so that
the people who are earning the least get a disproportionate
(34:03):
amount out to help them correct amundo. Which is great.
It's socialism at it's fine est, as you said. So
uh yeah, that's about it. That's social security numbers and
pretty much so security. I don't think I'm going to
do that again. Hats off the FDR for ah new deal,
(34:25):
great society. UM, chicken in every pot that was hoover
a number on every forehead. Nice check, thank you. We'll
end it with that one. If you want to know
more about social security numbers, you can read this exhaustive
article about them um by typing in social security in
the search bart how stuff works dot com, which means
(34:46):
it time for listener mail Josh, I'm gonna call this
following up on zero. That one got a lot more
uh attention than I thought. All the math nerds came
out like zero, very happy that we did that. And
one such nern email this um, Stephen, and he says,
(35:08):
I think I might be able to put your mind
to rest on a couple of those zero properties. And
a lot of people try to explain this, and I
think he did the best. Uh first, dividing by zero,
I find it helpful to think of division as separating
objects into containers. See this guy is like talking up
my alley. Yeah, I can visualize stuff a lot better
(35:28):
this way. So, if you have five objects and five containers,
you would put one object in each container. You still
have the same number of objects, but divided evenly across containers. Now,
if you have five objects and no containers, in other words,
dividing by zero, you still have all the same objects,
(35:49):
but they have not been put anywhere. You can't say
that you'd put zero per container because it's not a
lack of items, but rather a lack of containers. So
dividing by zero means you have things but nothing to
contain them. So our ratio cannot be formed makes sense? Right? Um?
As for the raising to the zero zero power, um,
(36:14):
this is one because our basis of numerology is the
number one. All things larger are functions of how many
ones it holds, and all things larger to find how
many need to be combined to form a one. This,
combined with the fact that exponents don't describe a multiplication,
(36:34):
but rather a number of times a base measurement will
be multiplied by a factor, means that if the base
measurement is never multiplied by the factor, you're left with
the base alone. So there you have it. It's tempting
to think of these numbers as one to the power,
but unfortunately this is wrong. You can keep go over
that again, now I can't. Uh. That is from Stephen,
(36:58):
a junior software engine here. Thanks Stephen, so I will
take him at his word. Yeah, he sounds like he's
gotta do. Yeah, the containers. That makes total sense to me. Now,
so there you have it. So Thanks Stephen, junior software engineer.
We are looking forward to you becoming a senior software engineer,
likely in the near future. From your email. UM, and
(37:21):
if you have some sort of illumination UM about a
previous podcast, doesn't matter how old it is. We always
like hearing new stuff about old stuff. UM. You can
send it in an email to uh well, first tweet
to us Okay, that's why sk podcast Facebook dot com,
slash Stuff as you know, and then the email Stuff
(37:42):
podcast at Discovery dot com. Be sure to check out
our new video podcast, Stuff from the Future. Join how
Stuff Work staff as we explore the most promising and
perplexing possibilities of tomorrow. Brought to you by the reinvented
(38:02):
two thousand twelve Camry. It's ready, are you
Brought to you by the reinvented two thousand twelve camera.
It's ready. Are you welcome to Stuff you should Know
from house Stuff Works dot com? Hey, and welcome to
the podcast. I'm Josh Clark, There's Charles W. Chuck Bryant
(00:21):
A K A to eight six five four seven five
two three D. You can't get out you're so so
security number. I thought about that. I thought about what
if I like ended up when we were describing like
what the different numbers and were, I was like, well,
my why happened to be this one? If you listen
to the whole podcast, you can put together and so
security number. That's like, don't do that, Josh, don't. We
(00:43):
should probably beef out what I said anyway, because that
might be someone else's Social Security number. Yeah, I don't.
I don't want to be responsible for that. Okay, we'll
go back and beat that out. That's really some c
o A right there. Why how do you know that
that person had been like, yes, you know, its called
me out Serial number one. I want a contest. I
(01:03):
can pay for my own hotel in Atlanta to go
see the guys, but just me so um, Jerry like that? Uh, so,
chuck ah, do you know much about social security? A bit?
You're about to chuck um. The Social Security Act is
(01:28):
created by our old timey forbears. Um basically created a scheme,
and not scheme in the way of like a carbon
trating scheme or something like that. I know you don't
like that word, but it's a legitimate word. It doesn't
necessarily mean something nefarious. But under this scheme, social security
um is given to retiring workers in the in the
(01:52):
form of a monthly payment, where basically it says, hey,
good job, you did a good job working. Go take
care of yourself. We don't want you to die on
the street. This should hopefully sustain you in your retirement years. Right.
This is before the advent of four oh one case
and the like this, this thirty five bucks a month. Right. Well,
(02:12):
the whole, the whole basis of it is that the
workers of today pay into the Social Security fund and
it is immediately taken and distributed dispersed two workers who
have retired today. Yeah, so the workers of today are
taking care of the workers of yesterday. That's the whole
(02:35):
point to what This has led some people to claim
that the Social Security program is nothing more than a
Ponzi scheme where you're taking the money of these people
to pay off other people for socialism. Even Oh, it's total,
totally different. It is socialism. Yeah, but people cry socialism
a lot these days, and they don't think about things
(02:57):
like social security in all the different ways we do
have socialism that people are like, oh, that's fine, right, sure, yeah,
but well but you can make a case that it
is a Ponzi scheme. But Stephen Goss, chief actuary for
the Social Security Administration, would take issue with that. I'm
sure he would. He would say it's not a Ponzi
(03:18):
scheme because the Ponzi scheme is not sustainable. Some might
argue that social security is not sustainable, and that is,
as we say here in the South, that's a whole
another show. Okay, well I want to talk about it anymore. Well,
what do you have some numbers on its sustainability? Well,
we can chat about it. Here's the thing. So if
you if you just if you had zero population growth,
(03:39):
this thing would work forever, right, and it would work
completely efficiently with no changes whatsoever. Unfortunately, we don't have
zero population growth, and we actually had a spike in
population that we know of as the baby boom, right,
which means that very shortly and starting now, I think
um more, there will be way more retired workers than
(04:00):
there are workers, Which means that the workers of today
are going to have a far greater burden placed on
them taking care of these retired workers than any other
workers ever have our will. But Stephen goss chief Actuary
for the Social Security Administration, says this will eventually work
itself out. The government has taken steps to address this.
And what is done is raise the amount of money
(04:22):
that people throw into this, and they're taking the extra
money and the government is buying treasury bonds investing in itself. Now,
here's the weird thing. When they come mature these bonds,
the government pays these things off with other tax money.
So the government is going to pay the Social Security
(04:43):
Fund back with other tax money. Now, this will drive
people crazy, conservatives, libertarians, umbers right leaning liberals, right fiscally
conservative liberals especially, But Stephen Gossa shares it's just a
little bump. We're probably not gonna have another population spike
for a while, and so security will go right back
(05:04):
to normal. It just yes for us right now, Right,
the other thing that I never really thought about is
it could not have been a sustainable program even to
begin with, because you start Social Security and when when
was it people started getting paying It paid out, you know,
a year later, two years later, and so they weren't
(05:26):
paying in that long. So immediately you've got a problem
on your hands because people are starting to get payouts
that didn't pay in for twenty years. Yes, that is
the case, but the payoffs were smaller at first. Yeah,
but it still creates a bit of a wrinkle. I
think that would a wrinkle in time for the future.
I think so. But it was a hump that had
(05:46):
to be gotten over, and it was gotten over. Like basically,
the first people just got screwed. Yeah. Well, well but
they didn't pay in that much either though, So no,
and that's true, So they were rightly screwed. Okay, so
let's talk about the history of all this chuck. And
and by the way, I guess the takeaway from that
intro Social Security is considered a what upon CI scheme.
(06:10):
I think people are just sitting there like, I know,
all right, well you already you already blew the big
secret there the act of um it was coined. The
name social Security was coined by Abraham Epstein Um, who
led the American Association for Social Security. And they began
(06:33):
paying out in thirty seven, Like you said, yeah, just
just for workers. Right. It was the the the biggest
wage earner of a household, basically the dad um got
the money as the retiree. Yeah, and it was a
lump sum, right. They didn't pay it in monthly uh buckets.
Back then, tell him what the first guy who got
(06:54):
social Security got his slump sum? Yeah, his lumpsom was
uh was it seventeen cents in January nine, thirty seven.
He was the first guy that gets Social Security benefits
And I looked it up. That's two dollars and fifty
five cents in two thousand ten money. Oh well, so
even back then he was just like, hey, federal government
(07:16):
gets that in my pocket for you. Yeah. Um, Josh
just made an obscene gesture. We should just say that. Um.
In nine, just two years later, they added survivors benefits
and benefits two spouses and children. Uh flashboard of fifty six,
they had a disability of benefits. Sixty five, Medicare was
(07:38):
signed into law, and in sixty one the I'm sorry.
In sixty two, the Civil Service Commission in the I
r S adopted the Social Security number as your official
federal I D number and taxpayer I D number, respectively,
which is a kind of a thing because the first
(07:58):
Social Security cards cifically said on them not to be
used as identification. Yeah, but they never made a follow
up law to enforce it, and so everybody's like, no,
this is perfect for identification. Yeah, I always, I'll always
remember it because of this card in my wallet. We'll
use the mark of the beast is identification. Um, the
first numbers, because this is not just about Social Security
(08:21):
but more about the numbers, which is more interesting than
I thought. Slightly. Yeah, um, it was. They were distributed
to the post office because they didn't have field offices yet.
So ye, post offices took the initial task. Two. Uh
type up. These cards are called typing centers. Yeah. So
(08:41):
basically this is, um, this is what I This is
the part I entitled bureaucracy. How right. Yeah. The Social
Security Um Administration contacted all employers in the United States
and said, hey, uh, this is a form SS four
and on it you just list the number of employees
you have working for you. Mail it back to us.
(09:02):
And so all the employers filled out I have fifteen employees,
and then mailed the S S four back to the
Social Security Administration. So Security Administration opened up the S
S fours and they said, okay, this employer has fifteen employees,
so we're going to mail him fifteen S S five forms,
which are basically signing up for your Social Security number. Right.
(09:25):
So they mailed the fifteen back, probably in one package,
to the employer, and the employer distributed them among his employees.
Employees filled out the S S five forms and they
sent them back to the Such Security Administration. Such Security
Administration said, okay, now we have these and we're going
to assign social security numbers. Right the um they said, hey,
(09:48):
go to your post office. The post office gave them
the social security numbers. The post office then sent that
duplicate form to the Social Security Administration, who created the
master file of all of these documents put together, which
was your so Security number file, and that was sent
to Maryland. Yes, and then in Maryland is where it
all came together. That's right. Uh, well what came together there?
(10:13):
The numbers, the numbering, the whole thing, your whole file,
the block the block file. That's right. So let's talk
about the first numbers. Since we're there. Who has it?
And is it zero zero one zero one zero zero
zero one? Is it the first number? No? Well we
should first say that no one knows for sure who
got the very first card in the very first number,
(10:34):
because they they reckon about several hundred thousand people applied
in that first November of ninety six. So I didn't
do the math, but there's some I'm sure you could
figure out statistically, and I'd be interested to hear how
to do this. But um, if a hundred thousand people
all got their card that day and the post offices
(10:56):
were open from like eight to five, how many people
or handed their Social Security number card um simultaneously that day?
How many first people were there? There's got to be
some awesome math equation to figure that out. Somebody should
do that for us. Since the UM so they don't
(11:17):
know officially who it was, but their first official record, uh,
they do know. UM it was a guy named John
David Sweeney Jr. And he had the social Security number
oh five five O nine O one and by oh
I mean zero of course or aught and he got
(11:37):
his because the head of the Social Security Administration took
it off the top of the stack, yeah, and said
this is the first one. That's right, So there you go.
But they did offer that to um oh no, sorry,
zero zero one number, the lowest number right on record.
Right before we get to there, though, John David Sweeney
ironically died before he could collect his uh social Security payments.
(12:01):
John David Tweeney is the one with the first security number.
So that is very ironic. That's the fact of the
podcast if you ask me. Yeah, because retirement age was
sixty five and he died at sixty one. Today they
handle it differently. It's a little confusing, but actually it's
not that confusing. You just have to be good at math.
Benefits are reduced by five nights of one per cent
(12:22):
for every month you retire before the age of sixty
five or rich person. Yeah, it's good for you. So um,
so back to the number one oh one or whatever. Yeah,
the all time low number holder, who always will be
until we start recycling numbers if we ever need to,
(12:43):
We we may, we may. Her name is um Grace
d Owen. She is of Concord, New Hampshire, or conquered
okay um and uh yeah, because we always get mail
from people it's like, oh, you pronounced it Nevada, it's Nevada.
Or if we say Vada, they say, hey, you pronounced
Nevada incorrectly. It's Nevada. No, it is Nevada. But I
(13:06):
tell everyone that writes in from Nevada, only people from
Nevada say Nevada. Everyone else says Nevada, especially people in Missouri.
So um, Chuck Gracedo and of Conquord, New Hampshire got
the lowest number zero zero one zero one zero zero
zero one number. It was UM. And she got that
(13:28):
not because she was first in line, as we've said,
different guy got that low number. Uh, or a different
guy got the first number and it wasn't low. Um.
She got it because of where she lived. Originally, the
number scheming was based on well, the first two numbers
were based on the state you lived in, um and
starting northeast, moving westward, and so you had less than
(13:53):
fifty possible primary numbers, the first two first through renas. Yeah,
well not even they didn't even have fifty at the time,
did they know? That's what I'm saying. So this is
a total waste of digits. They figured out very quickly,
so they started assigning them to zip codes instead. And
we should talk about these numbers. Do you want here?
(14:13):
Are we there now? Well, we are almost there. But
um you didn't mention that Grace Owen got that number.
They actually offered it as an honor to um John
g Winnt these Social Security Board chairman, and John Campbell,
the Federal Bureau of Old Age Benefits rep for the
Boston They offered them both the number oh one oh
(14:36):
one oh one and they no, no thanks. We are
true bureaucrats and that would be against the bureaucracy's rules.
That's right. And seventeen cents to Ernest Ackerman, the first
guy to get a payment. Yes, but um iidem A
Fuller made out like a bandit. This is exactly the problem.
(14:56):
This is not the problem. Mrs Fuller did good things
with her money. She brought herself in edzel Um, she
uh invested in um uh web band. She did great things.
She did um so id to a. Fuller retired in
November nineteen thirty nine, and she was the first person
(15:19):
to start collecting monthly benefits. So by the time she
by the time social Security payments or by the time
you had to start paying and because another fact is
that you can't opt out UM and the time she retired,
she contributed a total of twenty four dollars and seventy
five cents because of the Social Security scheme. UM. By
(15:40):
the time she died at age one hundred, nineteen seventy five,
she collected a total of twenty two thousand, eight hundred
and eighty eight dollars and nine two cents. She made
out she wore like a bandanna around her face like
the rest of her life she did. Yeah, she was
a Social Security bandit. Okay, back to the numbers. Enough history,
(16:04):
I think so. Um So, the first three numbers they're
called what the area numbers, and like you said, they
were originally from northeast to west. So like if you
were if you lived in New Hampshire, um, you your
first three numbers were gonna be zero, zero one. Then
they figured out that, well that's stupid, like we're gonna
(16:24):
have fifty states tops, so there's a whole number that
we're not using. Eventually we're gonna need it. Because social
Security numbers aren't recycled, they're retired after the person dies, right,
that is true. So then they started assigning them to
zip code, so that started using up a lot more numbers, right, yeah,
zip code on the mailing address on the application form,
(16:44):
which didn't necessarily indicate your residents. It's just wherever the
mailing address was where you applied, right, exactly when you
were living. Uh right, And it doesn't, Yeah, it doesn't.
Mailing in residents is not the same address most times
it is, but even still, like the place where I
was born, it's not where I live now, so right,
(17:04):
So I mean you have a lot of um weird
numbers for the beginning in the early seventies, since seventy
two is when they started the zip code. So I
believe that I actually am one of the last years
since I was born in seventy one, last people to
get uh the one based on the state. Cool, so
(17:28):
I'm old timing, seriously, that is something. Um. The next
two numbers are group numbers, so you have your area
number and then the area numbers broken into groups zero
one through Yeah, and this makes sense. So the two
numbers in the middle are the you are that group
(17:48):
of that zip code or that state, depending on how
old you are. It was just a means to break
it up and make it simpler for accounting and filing
and all that stuff. Right, because instead of UM just
one group from an area, or what nine ninety nine
possible areas, you now have nine groups of nine ninety
(18:10):
nine possible areas, nine nine groups each to allow us
for a lot more. Because the the eight ball that
the Social Security number UM is always behind is basically
running out of numbers. I don't think it will happen.
It will there well, eventually, but there's what they says,
a billion combinations. But consider this, there's been more than
(18:31):
four hundred million numbers issued since so what sixty five
seventy seven years? Right, I have a feeling that does
take into account the baby boom that ate up a
lot of numbers, But I mean I have a feeling
that we could we could reach that and what another
hundred hundred years, the US will be around I'm sure
(18:52):
longer than then, hopefully. Yeah, China is rising, well, it'll
be at the very least not in our lifetime. Oh no,
so who cares. I would have agreed with you had
you qualified it like that. Yeah, what they'll probably do
is UM and I'm guessing here, but they'll probably start
reassigning numbers from dead people, which will be weird. I
use so security number. Yeah, imagine they go back. I mean,
(19:16):
it would make sense to me that they would start
from the beginning again almost so like you're using someone's
number from and the year. Yeah, you got a stinky
old mothball number. It's like a wicker um wicker wheelchair
or something like that, like leather leg breaks is something weird,
(19:36):
like from the thirties. What are you talking about? You
know exactly what I'm talking about. Okay, the last four
digits are the serial numbers, and uh they number consecutively
from triple O one through So that's just saying, well,
we're gonna extend the number the possible numbers we can
(19:58):
come up with exactly. You've the more billion, and you
know what, you don't even necessarily have to recycle even
if you add like an extra attempt digit. How much
would that change everything? I mean, they have to rewrite
all their programming and all their accountings, and then we
wouldn't have to recycle numbers. Good point they have. Luckily,
(20:20):
they have people much smarter than that's deciding how to
handle that. I don't know. We're pretty sharp, all right, Josh,
common questions, These are actually pretty good. Okay, Chuck, here's
a question for you. Does everyone have to have a
Social Security number? If you're over eighteen, then yes, you do. UM.
And you if you receive an income and you're over eighteen, UM.
(20:42):
If you're interested in starting up a bank account, being
a deduction on your parents, income taxes, all sorts of
things like that, metal getting medical coverage, taking advantage of
government services, then you're gonna need that. So there's a
lot of people who just you that that you have
to have that. Practically speaking, you do, like any bank
(21:07):
can be like I'm not doing business with you, and
then you say, okay, well I can't force you to
by law, but I'll try your competitor, and you go
on down the line and maybe you find a bank.
From what I understand, there's banks that are set up
in the Midwest, um for people who don't have Social
Security numbers, Like who've said I'm not gonna have one,
I don't trust the government, don't want to have a
(21:28):
serial number, and I'm not going to have this no,
but they're still paying in Oh yeah, yeah, I think
they're still paying in but they don't have a Social
Security number, so that means they're not gonna get benefits
at the end. I don't think they think they're going
to get benefits anyway. I could get that, UM. But yeah,
they don't have a Social Security number. I think there
are there are people who don't pay Social Security as well.
(21:51):
It's like a whole Yeah, there's that's like a whole
topic along the fringe of whether or not you need
to have one, whether or not you actually do have
to pay in the constitution, a reality of it, all
that stuff, but for all practical purposes, your life is
exponentially easier if you have a so Security number. Right,
And you also said you have to pay because you
can't tell the government, you know what, I'm setting up
(22:11):
for my own retirement and I want to take all
the available money that I make to do that because
my retirement plan is much better than whatever you yokels
are working on. Yeah, because I mean, if you you
have to pay in fifteen point three percent, I don't
know if that's current. I haven't looked, but as of
the writing of this UM, this article, it was fifteen
(22:32):
point three seven point six paid by you out of
your gross pay and seven point six five paid by
your employer. It is staggering how much we pay in
taxes in this country. So if you took fifteen point
three percent of your gross pay and put it into
a four oh one k over the same course of years,
(22:53):
you would have so much more money. Yeah, barring another
stock market catask t fee before you could get your
money out of your formal one k um, you would
have way more than you have from the Social Security
Administration As as benefits. You know, what I'm meant to
look up is if the government uses this money for
(23:13):
other things in the meantime or is it strictly like here,
it's in this little pool and all we're doing is
paying people out with it. Well, supposedly, before the baby
boom problem arose, it was going in and right back out,
and I'm sure any surplus was invested in treasury bonds.
Now um, all of the surplus is invested in treasury bonds,
(23:36):
which is just such a shell game. It's so crazy,
and no one has any idea if this is gonna work.
I swear to God, I'm not paranoid, but don't live
in the Midwest. I'm not a fringe dweller. This is
not something I like keep up with a lot um.
I don't read World net daily. There's nothing like that
in my life. But I'm telling you this is like
there there's no guarantee that this social secure a UM
(24:01):
I guess bandage for the baby boom populations, like if
it's gonna work, it's it's really at the very least,
it's interesting. Yeah. And the troubling, I would say, at
the very least say, uh, they let you. They make
it real easy for you to slap a number on
your little brand new baby. Yes, do you have to
have a number for your child? Well, like I said,
(24:21):
if you want them to get medical coverage and UM
open up a savings account in their name for like
their future college or trade school or travels around the world,
or you want to claim it as a deduction on
your tax filing, Yeah, then they they're gonna need one,
and they make it pretty easy on you to get
one for your new, little, uh smelly baby. They do again. UM,
I'm not a fringe dweller, but they have a very
(24:44):
sinister sounding Enumeration at birth program that's pretty bad. Yeah.
It was started in UM and basically, it just made
it very easy for you to get a source of
security number for your infant as part of their birth
record forms enumeration at birth. You know, I used to
I think I mentioned this before. I used to carry
my card around in my wallet when I was a
(25:06):
teenager because I thought it was I don't know, I
thought it made me, uh legitimate or adult, like it's
interesting everyone else's everyone else is out drinking, and I
was like, no, no, I got my self a security card.
It keeps keeps the urges away. Hey, speaking of Social
Security cards and wallets, do you want to talk about that, lady? Oh, yeah,
(25:30):
I can't. Yeah. This in uh nineteen thirty seven, dude
named Douglas Patterson had a wallet company. Yeah, he was
the vice president and treasurer of this wallet company, and
he said, you know what we should do. We should
include a fake Social Security card and every wallet, but
(25:50):
we'll make it look really, really realistic by copying yours secretary. Yeah.
He basically assigned these little fake cards, like you know,
you get a picture frame with a fake picture in it.
They gave out wallet or they sold wallets with a
fake SOL Security card with a real number. I don't
know why he thought that was a good idea or
why she went along with it. What was her name,
(26:12):
Hilda Straighter Whitcher? She went along with this? Maybe she
didn't know, No, she knew she did. Yeah, um, and uh,
I guess she didn't feel like she could assert herself
at the time. But um, what over forty years something
like forty thou people used her social Security number? Yeah,
they gave her new and yeah, and people are still
(26:34):
using it as as recently his nineteen seventies seven, there
were twelve people using that as their own because of
this wallet. Yeah. In in defense of the dude, he
did have the word uh, spitchammen on the bottom of it,
Spaceman specimen. But it was, you know, in small print,
and it looked like the real deal. It had the
little emblem that. Um who was the guy who designed that? Uh?
(26:58):
Fred Happele That's right? And what else did he design?
The flying Tiger's logo? Yeah? Which what was that? Like
a B two bomber logo? Well, who knows? World War two?
I guess, uh, some sort of gunner plane or something. Okay,
that'd be my guess. The fighting hell cats. Yeah, finding
health fish, healthfish the health fish with the Simpsons. Okay, um, Josh,
(27:24):
can you get a new number? Yes, but only in
very extreme cases like stalking, like talking, or fraud, a
bad case of fraud. I guess yeah. I would imagine
that the FBI can probably get you one if you're
part of the Witness Protection program. Oh sure, which we've
talked about. Yeah, you don't have to pay for that.
(27:45):
There's no fee from the s s A. But um
you uh what what you should be wary of his
companies that claim that they can get you a new
number to absolve your credit, Like, hey, have you let
an awful bad life become a new person, We'll get
you a new Social Security number, which is hilarious if
you think that that's that's crazy. Following for that, it's
(28:10):
like buying an elevator pass in high school as a
freshman or something like, Yeah, except way you worse when
you have a single floor high school, because I'm sure
they're like, not only do we charge you a feed,
but give us your so Security number because we have
to go in and like make sure that it's wiped out.
Right where are we here? Uh? You know? The title
(28:33):
of the section was why does it matter? If someone
knows my Social Security number, I think it's pretty obvious. Yeah,
identity theft it's a big problem these days. Back in
the old days it wasn't as much. It's actually gone
down since this article, what four thousand years what they
said here, right SEV. Now, well that's the ones that
(28:53):
the FTC gets reports of, which are probably the lion
share of them. But it was supposedly increasing like by
some crazy percentage year. It's it's up eleven. So it's
gone down. So I think people have just gotten scared
of it, more wary about it. But um, I mean
it's still obviously a pretty big problem. Part of the
(29:15):
problem though, is that we shouldn't be using so security
numbers for identification for a reason. They're just way too
publicly available. Even the last four digits, Um, don't use
that as like your pin number. No, But I mean,
even if somebody asks you your last four digits, how
many people do have your last four digits? How many
(29:36):
companies A lot? And they also have your birth date,
they also have where you're born, your mother's maiden name.
It's just kind of like it's all out there, and
basically there's no really good scheme two. I guess uses
as a pass code as a past basically a way
of saying I am me, because if we all just
(29:59):
relied on some other number or something like that, then
people could find that out. There's really no good way
to do it. But um, so security numbers are definitely
not the answer. Yeah. I always get a little creeped
out when some business, you know, what are the last
like Comcast or something like my cable company. We'll say
what are your last words of your social and I'll
spit it out and they'll go, okay, right. You can
(30:20):
say I don't want to tell you, I want to
answer everything else, and they'll they'll run you through your paces.
But they know it because they're asking you for identific
like for verification exactly because you've given it to them already. Um,
you don't. There's basically most companies don't have any legal
right to ask you what you're so security number is.
(30:41):
But they can also say, well, we don't trust you,
so if you don't give it to us when you
open your account or whatever, then um, you're out of luck. Um.
With government agencies, you can ask for the UM Privacy
Act of nineteen seventy four, disclosure notice, which says like, hey,
(31:01):
we have a legal right to ask you this, or
we don't, and then you can say you can't ask
me that, bob. But um, all the protection advice I've
given here is pretty basic. You know, don't carry your
card in your wallet. Uh, cancel credit cards you don't use,
don't share what don't we just cancel credit cards you
(31:23):
don't use. There are things you should do, like keep
an eye on your accounts, your credit card accounts, even
though you don't use them. But that's not necessarily good advice,
especially credit wise, because there's this thing called the available
credit to um debt ratio. It's one of the ratios
that they figure credit score with. And if you have
a clean credit card you're not using that has like
(31:45):
five or ten grand of available credit on it, that counts,
and that's that makes you very attractive to people who
are selling new houses or cars or whatever. So don't
necessarily go do that, keep them in a safe deposit box,
keep an eye on all your out even if you're
not using them. Yeah, boy, my credit rating is so
good right now. That's awesome, dude. It's like top five
(32:06):
percentile somehow, and that is I say that as a
testament to you out there who may have bad credit.
You can repair it over time. Yeah you you you
animially did good. Huh uh. Well, yeah, she's the one
that helped me get my good credit back. That's good.
That's CFO. Congratulations, man, it's a big deal. Thank you.
It is good. And my debts, you know, from the
(32:28):
past were I don't want to get into it, but
they had less to do with me and more to
do with like books, Heroin, like bad roommates and getting
screwed over by you know, like, hey, you were supposed
to pay this Georgia power bill eight years ago and
it's still in my name and I didn't even know
about it. That kind of thing, and just being lazy
(32:50):
in college. Yeah, I missed my credit card payment. No
big deal, I'll just pay it next month. I'm just
kidna go buy some Heroin instead. I know it's you're
doing in college, Chuck, not that, So I guess that's
about it. Huh yeah. Um. One more piece of advice,
which is actually good. Every few years, go uh to
(33:13):
the ss A website and request a copy of your
earnings and Benefit Estimate statement. Yeah, have you heard of this? Before,
and I've never done it, and I'm gonna go do
it today. Alright, let's go do it together. We'll both
go do years together. We'll be like what. I've been
working since I was thirteen, so I imagine I'm doing
pretty good. Nice. Oh, we didn't talk about that. Um.
The system is waited. The whole reason it was instituted
(33:38):
was to help um, make sure that people don't fall
through the cracks or whatever, and to help the poor
more than the wealthy. Um. Although you get more money
out the more money you put in, right, which is
based on your income, so the money you make, the
more you ban. But it's also disproportionately waited so that
the people who are earning the least get a disproportionate
(34:03):
amount out to help them correct amundo. Which is great.
It's socialism at it's fine est, as you said. So
uh yeah, that's about it. That's social security numbers and
pretty much so security. I don't think I'm going to
do that again. Hats off the FDR for ah new deal,
(34:25):
great society. UM, chicken in every pot that was hoover
a number on every forehead. Nice check, thank you. We'll
end it with that one. If you want to know
more about social security numbers, you can read this exhaustive
article about them um by typing in social security in
the search bart how stuff works dot com, which means
(34:46):
it time for listener mail Josh, I'm gonna call this
following up on zero. That one got a lot more
uh attention than I thought. All the math nerds came
out like zero, very happy that we did that. And
one such nern email this um, Stephen, and he says,
(35:08):
I think I might be able to put your mind
to rest on a couple of those zero properties. And
a lot of people try to explain this, and I
think he did the best. Uh first, dividing by zero,
I find it helpful to think of division as separating
objects into containers. See this guy is like talking up
my alley. Yeah, I can visualize stuff a lot better
(35:28):
this way. So, if you have five objects and five containers,
you would put one object in each container. You still
have the same number of objects, but divided evenly across containers. Now,
if you have five objects and no containers, in other words,
dividing by zero, you still have all the same objects,
(35:49):
but they have not been put anywhere. You can't say
that you'd put zero per container because it's not a
lack of items, but rather a lack of containers. So
dividing by zero means you have things but nothing to
contain them. So our ratio cannot be formed makes sense? Right? Um?
As for the raising to the zero zero power, um,
(36:14):
this is one because our basis of numerology is the
number one. All things larger are functions of how many
ones it holds, and all things larger to find how
many need to be combined to form a one. This,
combined with the fact that exponents don't describe a multiplication,
(36:34):
but rather a number of times a base measurement will
be multiplied by a factor, means that if the base
measurement is never multiplied by the factor, you're left with
the base alone. So there you have it. It's tempting
to think of these numbers as one to the power,
but unfortunately this is wrong. You can keep go over
that again, now I can't. Uh. That is from Stephen,
(36:58):
a junior software engine here. Thanks Stephen, so I will
take him at his word. Yeah, he sounds like he's
gotta do. Yeah, the containers. That makes total sense to me. Now,
so there you have it. So Thanks Stephen, junior software engineer.
We are looking forward to you becoming a senior software engineer,
likely in the near future. From your email. UM, and
(37:21):
if you have some sort of illumination UM about a
previous podcast, doesn't matter how old it is. We always
like hearing new stuff about old stuff. UM. You can
send it in an email to uh well, first tweet
to us Okay, that's why sk podcast Facebook dot com,
slash Stuff as you know, and then the email Stuff
(37:42):
podcast at Discovery dot com. Be sure to check out
our new video podcast, Stuff from the Future. Join how
Stuff Work staff as we explore the most promising and
perplexing possibilities of tomorrow. Brought to you by the reinvented
(38:02):
two thousand twelve Camry. It's ready, are you
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