April 26, 2023 • 35 mins
Charly Arnolt had a blossoming career at ESPN. She worked on SportsCenter, First Take, the UFC...all very important brands to the Disney Company. But, something was missing. Charly felt stifled at ESPN. She wasn't able to share her real opinions about transgender athletes or the bashing of America. So, Charly decided to take her talents to Outkick where she will be featured on a weekday morning show debuting in late 2023. Charly joined Tudor to discuss a wide range of topics from sports to media and what she hopes to accomplish at Outkick. The Tudor Dixon Podcast is part of the Clay Travis & Buck Sexton Podcast Network - new episodes debut every Monday, Wednesday, & Friday. For more information visit TudorDixonPodcast.com.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
You're listening to the Tutor Dixon Podcast in the Clay
and Buck podcast Network. Welcome to the Tutor Dixon Podcast.
I'm Tutor Dixon, and I'm glad you're here with me today.
As some of you may know, but some of you
might not know, Clay Travis and Buck Sexton actually encouraged
me to do this podcast, and I was a little
(00:21):
bit unsure of whether or not this is what I
wanted to do. But there's such awesome encouragers of free speech.
They've been champions of free speech with people really across
the country. They launched the Clay and Buck Network here
on iHeart, and they also have OutKick, and my guest
today is actually leaving ESPN to join OutKick, So welcome
(00:43):
to this side of the world. Charlie Arnald, thank you
so much for being on the podcast.
Speaker 2 (00:49):
Teeter, thank you so much.
Speaker 3 (00:50):
And you know what, the transition has already occurred. I
have left ESPN. I am out at OutKick, and already
only a weekend. I'm so happy that I made decision.
I can already tell it was the perfect.
Speaker 2 (01:01):
One for me.
Speaker 1 (01:02):
OutKick is getting bigger and bigger right now. We see
people going more and more to OutKick. I mean OutKick
started mostly as sports, there is the ability to obviously
speak about political issues. Is that why you decided that
OutKick was the place to go after ESPN?
Speaker 3 (01:20):
Yeah, you know, there's so many different reasons why OutKick
was appealing to me, And I want to say that
Clay Travis was one of the large reasons why I'm
here today. Just like you said, it was your interactions
with him and Bach and in fact, I early on
when I was getting to learn about OutKick, This was
probably at this point, about six months ago, I had
dinner with Clay and Buck after being introduced to OutKick on.
Speaker 2 (01:45):
A pretty introductory level, and the.
Speaker 3 (01:47):
Things that they were saying about what they wanted the
network to be, what kind of talent they were looking for,
what they were encouraging from their talent, how the idea
of cancel culture didn't exist at OutKick, and Clay was,
you know, very steadfast when he told me, listen, if
something is said on OutKick and the talent stands behind it,
(02:08):
as long as they have done their research and there
are facts behind what they're saying, I will never ever
attempt to cancel anyone for standing up for what they
believe in and I know, did.
Speaker 1 (02:20):
You feel like that was happening at ESPN? I mean,
this seems really important to you to not have that
threat looming over you. But we hear political statements from
ESPN all the time. So did you feel like there
was only one side?
Speaker 2 (02:33):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (02:33):
Well, that's the thing is, there's so many issues in
sports that have now become politicized, whether or not we
want to admit it. We have seen so many different
sports just completely overrun by politics.
Speaker 2 (02:45):
And it's not like they're directly.
Speaker 3 (02:48):
Addressed, but they are because they're not talked about or
only one side of the argument is addressed. You know,
when you look at, for example, the trans issue, which
right now everyone's talking about.
Speaker 2 (03:00):
ESPN always says, you know, we want to keep politics.
Speaker 3 (03:03):
Out of our programming, but then on the same token,
during Women's Month, they ran a one minute tribute to
Leah Thomas, who is.
Speaker 2 (03:12):
Not even a woman biologically.
Speaker 3 (03:14):
So it just doesn't make sense when there are so
many incredible female athletes who have paved the way for
other females to do their things in the world of sports,
and just there's so many things that they should be
recognized for, and yet we're taking the time to recognize
a biological man for their success during Women's Month.
Speaker 2 (03:31):
It just makes absolutely no sense.
Speaker 3 (03:33):
But then again shows the rhetoric that ESPN is still
standing by.
Speaker 1 (03:37):
And don't you think if you have an iconic company
like ESPN, I mean, really, this is the name of
sports that we've all known growing up and little girls
look up to, little boys look up to for little
girls to see. Instead of honoring a woman who's done
something incredible in sports, you're honoring a biological male, an
(03:57):
intact male, saying that he's a woman. And I mean
it's just kind of mind blowing. But don't you think
that when that happens, it changes culture. That ESPN has
the power to change culture and changed the way people think.
Speaker 2 (04:12):
Absolutely.
Speaker 3 (04:13):
I think that there's a lot of women who feel
this way too, they just can't speak up about it.
Since joining OutKick and announcing the news all my social
media channels, I have quietly heard from several of my
colleagues from ESPN who have said, thank you so much
for speaking up for those of us who can't. And
that's so encouraging because there is a swell occurring.
Speaker 1 (04:33):
So when you see people getting fired on other networks.
Why do you think it is? I mean, over the
years for multiple forms of harassment, isn't this somewhat of
a form of harassment that women can't really speak their
minds when it comes to something so serious as their
achievements in sports? I mean, doesn't it kind of blow
your mind that people have to be so silent about this?
Speaker 3 (04:56):
I mean absolutely, because when you look at the Me
Too movement, there were so many women for decades who
are unable to speak up about their instances of sexual
harassment or what may have been in their pasts. And
now it's like the same thing, Like women are suppressed,
they feel uncomfortable coming forward, So we're allowing something that's
very uncomfortable to persist and women there's nothing they can
(05:17):
do about it. And it's like, you know, the Me
Too moment was so celebrated by men and women alike,
yet here we are further into the future and it's
just another example of women not being being able to
speak up.
Speaker 1 (05:29):
So what will you cover on al kik? How will
this change the way you talk about sports?
Speaker 3 (05:34):
It's an alternative way to look at different issues, and
it's a way to cover both sides of issues at hand.
You know, I think that I have one opinion on matters,
but I'm open to hearing other opinions. I don't think
that there's room for only one opinion in each debate.
So I would love to have a platform where other
(05:54):
people can come share, you know, what their takes on
things are, and we can have an open discussion, which
I think right now is not happening.
Speaker 2 (06:01):
In most places.
Speaker 3 (06:03):
We'll see issues that just don't relate to sports, but
also just culture and society in general, because a lot
of those do end up spilling into the world of sports.
Speaker 1 (06:13):
Of course. Yeah, we've seen President Trump go into fights
and people are like, oh, don't talk about this, don't
actually acknowledge. But he's incredibly popular. He was a former
president of the United States. Why is that something that
you can't celebrate that you have a former president. If
it were a George Bush, If for we're a Barack Obama,
(06:34):
how do you think it would be covered differently.
Speaker 3 (06:36):
Yeah, Well, that's the thing is UFC has done something right.
You know, they have appealed to the voices you have
not been heard for.
Speaker 2 (06:43):
So many years.
Speaker 3 (06:45):
A lot of Trump's fan base who felt like they
hadn't been heard for years, and that's why there was
such an uproar when you know, it was Dana White
and President former President Trump and Kid Rock and Mike
Tyson's all sitting octagon side the other night. And I
think it's just a testament to what people are looking
(07:05):
for out of sports. You know, they want to feel
like sports is a reflection of who they are and
also what they're looking for because at the end of
the day, here's the thing. Politics is getting inserted into
every little thing that we do. I mean, it's a
part of our lives. Any you try to look this way,
it doesn't matter. You can't avoid it. You look the
other way, it doesn't matter. It can't be avoided.
Speaker 2 (07:25):
Sports in politics don't need to go hand in hand.
Speaker 3 (07:29):
You know, you've looked throughout history and sports have always
been an escape for people, right through wartime depressions, downturns
of every shape and form. The pandemic a big example recently,
and people returning to sports as a way to distract themselves.
Whereas now when they watch sports, they're still being confronted
(07:50):
with the same issues that they're trying to get away
from in everyday life. I mean, even if you look
at the NBA bubble right, I mean that was for
us sports fans, it was so exciting because we had
been craving sports and craving competition. We finally got what
was actually a really decent setup by the NBA. You know,
it was it was the best that they could do,
and it was it was actually the most competitive basketball
(08:12):
I had seen in a really long time.
Speaker 2 (08:14):
I really enjoyed bubble play.
Speaker 3 (08:16):
But that also, at the same time is when they
started doing all of the social justice implementations, whether it
being you know, stamping a.
Speaker 2 (08:27):
Moniker on the court or allowing players to choose different
phrases for the backs of their jerseys.
Speaker 3 (08:34):
And it's like, suddenly, we're not watching basketball, we're being
confronted with politics. And that's when some people started getting
very turned off of the NBA, and you did see
the numbers start to drop. And even as recently as
this week, Phil Jackson, who's a legend in the NBA,
He's won thirteen championships as both the player and coach,
(08:54):
he even said he doesn't watch the NBA anymore because
I didn't hear that, Yeah, because he just says it's
just too politicized now and it's gotten to a point
where it's uncomfortable for him, and it's uncomfortable for many fans,
and that's not what it's supposed to be. And for
a guy like Phil Jackson to say he doesn't watch
the NBA when he has been a huge part of
(09:15):
why the NBA is what it is today, is saying something.
Speaker 1 (09:17):
Well, you said, something interesting. You said. For many of us,
sports is a reflection of who we are. And I
think that is the case for people who played soccer
when they were young, people who played football, people who
I think what people don't understand is that no matter
when you were connected to sports, that for a lot
of people is a lifelong connection. And I think that's
(09:38):
what we saw when we saw the football players starting
to kneel, and those people who saw football as a
reflection of them went well, wait, wait, no, this is
not who I am. Still patriotic, I still believe that
this country is a great place. We have flaws, but
we can work on them. And this was kind of
a statement, there's it's broken, there's no way to fix it.
(10:01):
We don't love it, and I think it turned so
many people off in that moment. They walked away. We
saw that the NFL started losing viewers and losing money.
Why they changed quickly. I think they came back and said,
you know what, we got to stop doing this or
the next season, we're not going to have any viewers,
and they brought their viewers back. Why wasn't that a
(10:22):
learning curve for the rest of sports.
Speaker 3 (10:23):
I think it's because of the athletes themselves. I think
it's not about the leagues anymore. The players have a
lot of power. They continuously are gaining more power each
and every year.
Speaker 2 (10:35):
I look at the NBA as the prime example of this.
Speaker 3 (10:38):
You look at guys like Lebron James, who's going down
as one of the greatest players of all time, but
he also has made himself the poster child for many
social justice issues and teams and the league doesn't have
any control over that, and a lot of fans who
love Lebron James then become obsessed with the things that
he's tweeting and the things that he said, and so
(11:00):
it doesn't just become about sports todaymore it becomes about politics.
And you know, when you're in a locker room, it's
like your family. Like I grew up an athlete and
a lot of my teammates I looked at as family members,
and so your mind is hard not to be persuaded
in one certain way. When you're hearing one of your
best friends and teammates preaching an issue constantly and talking
(11:22):
about it and standing up for something, it starts almost
brainwashing you a little bit because you're around them so
much and you feel so close to them and you
trust them. So now it's like, you know, it's uncomfortable
then to take a different position. So now you're seeing
a lot of players going in one direction, whereas I'm
sure there's a lot of people who have different opinions
and would love to stand up for themselves. But if
you even look at the recent Phil Jackson issue of
(11:44):
him speaking up against the NBA, Jalen Rose, who is
a broadcaster for ESPN also longtime NBA player one of
the greats as well, called Phil Jackson a racist because
he said that, you know, you're just being being racist
by saying that politics should be kept out of the
NBA and you don't like watching the NBA anymore.
Speaker 2 (12:02):
And Phil Jackson, I mean, look at what he's done.
He's clearly not a racist.
Speaker 3 (12:05):
And I just think It's unfortunate because it dissuades so
many people from being able to speak their mind, because
no one wants to be called that's that's.
Speaker 1 (12:12):
Hurtful, such a cruel word, but it's so effective at
silencing people. Let's take a quick commercial break. We'll continue
next on the Tutor Dixon Podcast. I look at what
we've seen happening in sports over the past few years,
and I think that you're absolutely right that young especially
(12:32):
young people, but I think people of all ages can
start to see somebody that they idolize, that they look
up to, and take their position as fact. And that's
where I wonder how challenging has sports reporting become because recently,
I mean not a few years ago, Lebron James was
the one out there defending China. And I think that
(12:53):
the geopolitical climate in the United in the world has
changed so significantly that whereas in a few years back
we felt comfortable doing business business with China, we now
know that in the political world, in the true political world,
China has become an incredible threat to the United States.
China has been talking to our oldest, our first and oldest. Ally,
(13:16):
they have been out there talking to Russia. We know
that they're supporting many of our enemies, true enemies out there,
and they're becoming an enemy. I mean, they want world domination.
So at what point, as a journalist for sports, do
you have to say, actually, I have to take this
into the political realm so that we make sure that
(13:36):
even though the sports personality is saying this, you understand
why there are dangers surrounding us.
Speaker 2 (13:42):
Well.
Speaker 3 (13:42):
I think that's the thing is if you are going
to bring politics into the equation, which, like I said,
a lot of people want to watch sports to avoid politics, Okay,
but if there are issues that need to be addressed
and you intend on addressing them, you need to address
them for both sides.
Speaker 2 (13:56):
And that's problem.
Speaker 3 (13:57):
As you're seeing from most of these sports organizations networks,
they aren't addressing it from both sides. I think another
big thing was the COVID mandates that started in twenty twenty.
You saw the requirement for athletes to be vaccinated. You
saw Aaron Rodgers get absolutely murdered.
Speaker 1 (14:17):
Yes, yeah, he.
Speaker 3 (14:18):
Wasn't vaccinated, even though at that point the efficacy of
the vaccine was being highly questioned. Yet people were like,
how could you this is outrageous when.
Speaker 1 (14:28):
Really, even in Tennis, look at what happened with the vaccine,
it wasn't.
Speaker 3 (14:32):
He missed his first US Open last year for the
first time since twenty seventeen, they wouldn't let him into
the country.
Speaker 2 (14:39):
It's just so outrageous because also.
Speaker 3 (14:41):
This is isn't there like such a thing as like
medical privacy. I just feel like people just feel like
they have right to know each and everything a little
thing about people these days, especially when we all know
at this point, like masks, we know they're not effective.
Yet they were making people wear masks for such a
long time. They were required to get into certain venues,
They were required for athletes to wear when they are
(15:01):
around their own teammates. It's just there's just so many
different things that were not questioned, but they reported on
as very straightforward fact. This is how it is, This
is how it should be, without anyone saying, but wait,
let's actually look at the other side of the coin.
If you're going to talk about politics, you got to
address both sides. But you know, when you look at
a place like a ESPN, that doesn't fit within their rhetoric,
(15:23):
It doesn't fit within Disney's rhetoric and so they continue
to turn their heads to that.
Speaker 1 (15:28):
So what is your take on I mean, Disney is
a very similar situation when it comes to I guess
I would say it's a little different because there is
no fighting back when it's Disney outside of you know people.
I mean, it's a capitalist country. You can unsubscribe, you
can step away from Disney, plus you cannot watch it.
But they really have kind of cornered that movement with
(15:51):
young people of slowly changing culture amongst young people. And
as a parent, I've watched this over the years because
we watched all the Disney shows and then and then
slowly they started to become more and more not I
wouldn't say we were going into some of the really
life changing stuff, but more empowering kids to disrespect adults
(16:13):
and creating a behavior of distraction and disruption. What what
is the answer to something like that? Do you think
at some point OutKick has started? Do you think there
will be entertainment that will be more conservative? Have American
values go back to that level of respect from children
to adults.
Speaker 3 (16:33):
Unfortunately? I mean I think that there are places that
can try. I think it's going to be up to
you know, they have like the parental controls and the
you know, parents can dictate what their kids see and
listen to. So you know, if they were to say,
you know, let's say outka release kids programming, Okay, this
is this is what we're raising you on and what
you get used to seeing, so you don't.
Speaker 2 (16:51):
Crave all of the other stuff.
Speaker 3 (16:53):
Perhaps, But the problem is is social media is so
ingrained in our culture and you look at so many
issues that being splattered all over social media.
Speaker 2 (17:02):
I mean, let's look at the trans issue. Right when
you see a guy.
Speaker 3 (17:05):
Or sorry I don't know even know the proper terminology anymore,
but just Dylan mulvaney all over the place on social
media representing women now and then you see kids who are.
Speaker 2 (17:16):
Watching Dylan mulvaney. It's it's a form of brainwashing.
Speaker 1 (17:21):
And you know it's interesting because.
Speaker 2 (17:23):
All they do is consume social media from morning until night.
Speaker 3 (17:25):
It's just unless you completely take it away, which I'll
tell you I don't have kids yet, but when I do,
I am going to do.
Speaker 2 (17:34):
My damnness, I'm not.
Speaker 3 (17:35):
They're not going to have access to screens until I
cannot control it.
Speaker 2 (17:39):
I have no choice.
Speaker 3 (17:41):
I am going to shelter them far beyond what I
ever thought I would.
Speaker 2 (17:46):
Because I want always wanted to be you know, I
want to be the cool mom.
Speaker 3 (17:49):
I am so scared to bring up a child in
this world because it is just it's not what it
was when I was younger. And if we're already heading
in this direction and it doesn't seem like things are
slowing down, I really fear for what the future looks like.
Speaker 1 (18:02):
Well, we've talked about how there are you know, we're
embracing men wearing makeup and when we were kids, the
nabling models, all of these makeup models, they were showing
how they were putting makeup on and commercials and it
was really kind of like the next stuff in life.
You know, this will someday be you putting makeup on.
(18:22):
And that made sense because it's marketing. You would think
that that's what the company wants, is little girls to say, yes,
I want to be putting makeup on, just like that,
similar to even Victoria's Secret. We've had this conversation on
here before I'm a mom, I've had four girls. I
actually when I walk past the lingerie store, don't want
to see my body in lingerie I want to think
(18:44):
that I can look like Giselle. You know, I don't
necessarily want to think I'm going to look like.
Speaker 2 (18:49):
It's not my thing.
Speaker 3 (18:49):
It never has been my thing. Give me some like
comfy swats. That's why I'm here.
Speaker 1 (18:54):
It's just hard to see that we've changed so much
that we are leaving the people out that actually want
to feel better about themselves. You know, We're leaving out
the people that want to the little girls that want
to say, oh, when I grow up, I'm gonna wear makeup.
And my girls have seen all of this. You know,
I have four girls, so I've watched them see this
(19:15):
and it hasn't been empowering to them. It's been confusing
to them. And I just think, why aren't people seeing
Why aren't these big marketing directors seen that this is
confusing rather than encouraging.
Speaker 3 (19:26):
Well, it's interesting that you bring up both lingerie and
makeup because we've just seen in the past couple weeks
Dylan mulvaney was used for a Maybe Lene ad. So
there's makeup something that women and young girls really identify
with it.
Speaker 2 (19:39):
It's like a part of their coming of age. Right.
Speaker 3 (19:41):
Oh my gosh, I get to wear makeup, Like I
finally get to wear some lip gloss, and I would
sneak my eyeshadow to sight and put it onto the
bathroom because my dad would never let me wear it
out of the house. And then there was just another
lingerie company this past week that used a biological man
to modelist lingerie, which again, like that's one of those
things like, ooh, you know, when I'm older, I'm gonna
(20:01):
I'm gonna buy a teddy, I'm gonna I'm gonna wear
some lingerie. And again it's it's something that really identifies
with women, and there's so many amazing women who would
be great models for lingerie or great models for any
makeup brand, and yet they're saying, you know what, forget
all of you actual women, Forget all of you who
have you know, actually gone through puberty as a girl
(20:22):
and really felt what it was like to transition from
girl to women. Forget all of you. We're gonna go
with a man for this ad. It's just it's a
huge insult to women, and it has crossed over into
the sports landscape with the trans athletes. It's such a
slap in the face to women that they would say
you know what.
Speaker 2 (20:40):
Everything you've worked for, everything that.
Speaker 3 (20:43):
You know Title nine has helped you to achieve, We're
just gonna forget about it all. And you know what, ultimately,
what are we looking for? Are we looking for just
complete co ed leagues? I don't understand, Like I don't
understand what.
Speaker 1 (20:54):
No, because because I don't think that the average male
wants to compete against women. I think they understand that
there are so many barriers, there's dangers. It's your men
are tougher than women. I mean, we've seen just the
volleyball player that was hit in the face with the
volleyball because a biological man can hit that volleyball much
(21:14):
harder than a biological woman can. It's tough. But we've
seen this kind of trending toward this pushing women aside.
Women have been pushed aside. There's not as much pride
in being a woman. And like you said, when you
see that the women who are being used for makeup,
that are being used for lingerie do not represent women,
(21:37):
it's disheartening. What about patriotism? Why is it that patriotism
is under attack? And that's something that I think that
we see a lot in the sports world. And how
can we how do we bring that back? How do
we say, well, no, it's you can love this country
and still believe that we can change things and make
things better on a constant basis.
Speaker 3 (21:57):
Well, I think the whole point is that there's just
such a confused mindset these days where people associate patriotism
with suppressing the rights of groups that are trying to
gain more traction right now, and people feel like, oh, well,
if I say I'm a patriot, it means I'm homophobic,
(22:19):
it means I'm transphobic, it means all these things, which
it doesn't mean that they don't go hand in hand.
But people have gotten very confused because there's one group that's,
you know, crying out that we're under attack, and if
you support America and it's traditional values, then you're not
progressing like the rest of us. The whole mindset of
(22:41):
the country has just gotten very skewed, and it's really
a shame.
Speaker 1 (22:45):
How long did it take you to make the decision
to go.
Speaker 3 (22:48):
To out kick It wasn't a tough decision for me,
you know, it's just you Also, it's just the wayhg
of what's going to be best for my career, what
direction do I want to go in? Because I also
realize by coming to a place like OutKick, there is
the possibility that some doors could be shut down the
road by some of the more traditional outlets. But you
(23:11):
also have to recognize, you know, what's my goal here
at the end of the day, Like do I want
to be able to have the freedom to speak my
mind and you know, have those that don't have a
voice to be able to look to me to say, okay, yes, yes,
I can.
Speaker 2 (23:25):
Agree with that.
Speaker 3 (23:25):
And actually you have encouraged me to stand up for
my beliefs as well, which I've been getting a lot
of from women. Like I said, I have had several
of my former colleagues, not just from ESPN, but from
former jobs even you know further down the line, reach
out and say I'm so proud of you, thank you
so much for standing up for the rest of us.
(23:46):
There's a lot more of us out there than people realize.
But it's going to take some time because people are scared.
People are scared to speak their minds, are scared to
stand up for themselves. Because the fact of the matter is,
there's a lot of places where if you do speak
up you're out of a job.
Speaker 1 (24:00):
Let's take a quick commercial break. We'll continue next on
the Tutor Dixon Podcast. What do you tell people that say,
how did you do it? And how can I do it?
I mean, you must have people constantly saying I feel
like I need to do this too, But I'm afraid.
Speaker 3 (24:16):
I think it's just going to take a lot of
women or different groups just saying, you know what, enough
is enough? And what are they going to do? Fire
the whole company? If every woman says, well I can't
do this anymore, what are.
Speaker 2 (24:31):
They going to do? Or at least they're going to be.
Speaker 3 (24:33):
Forced to address the issue. They're going to be forced
to talk about it. They'll be conversation about it. They'll
be equal and fair conversation about it. So I just
think it's one of those things that people just need
to really do some deep introspection and find out are
you okay with the world moving in this direction. I
think there's a lot of women in the broadcast industry
whose journeys into motherhood are a little bit delayed, right
(24:56):
because a lot of us put more time into our career.
Speaker 2 (24:58):
At the beginning.
Speaker 3 (24:59):
Having kids isn't something that we think about so early on,
but now that we're here, there's a lot of us
who are thinking, Okay, well, kids might be in my
future in the next few years, and is this something
I want for my children.
Speaker 2 (25:09):
It's not just about you, it's about the future generations
as well.
Speaker 3 (25:12):
So I think you really have to just realize what's
important to you, how do you want to live, how
do you want your families to live, and make a
decision from there.
Speaker 1 (25:19):
When you see someone like Megan Rapino, who was a
champion on the soccer field, was able, you know, fought
for women to get equal pay or higher pay, and
probably has her own endorsement deals now saying that she
thinks that men should be able to compete with women
on the soccer field and another sport where you're making
(25:40):
contact with people. I mean, it really is dangerous to
have a biological male on the field with women playing soccer.
What is your take on that?
Speaker 2 (25:49):
It doesn't make sense, It doesn't add up.
Speaker 3 (25:51):
You know a lot of people really applauded Megan Rapino
for taking a stand for women. You know, everyone wants
to see women treated the same as men and have
the same rights and a fair level of competition, which
is being wiped out by biological men now being able
to play with women on these same fields or arenas.
Speaker 2 (26:12):
So it doesn't really make sense. You have to wonder
what her incentive is to make this blatant switch in mentality,
because after fighting this fight for so many years, you know,
especially for you know, a lesbian woman too, who's probably
fought a lot of her own battles throughout the years.
You know, just seems like this would be something we
(26:34):
would be able to look to her and she would say, listen.
Speaker 3 (26:37):
I've fought a lot of battles. I've been there, done that,
and I think doing this to women is just the
worst possible case scenario.
Speaker 2 (26:45):
So it's really sad to see.
Speaker 1 (26:47):
I know, I think that was one of the more
shocking ones because I understand. I think I can understand
from her perspective being torn between the two because she
has been a champion for both women rights and lgbt
Q rights, and I guess we saw which one one
out there. But I think that that has been a
(27:09):
challenge for so many young people. They get caught in
that same trap. If I support one, do I not
love the other? And that's what I want people to
understand No, you can be supportive of both but still
say women deserve to be in a fair situation. I mean,
we certainly wouldn't want women to feel that they can't
be safe in their own sport. We heard a story
(27:32):
about one of the women who was in a locker
room with Leah Thomas that had been raped as a
young person, raped it in like a fourteen or fifteen
I think, and was just traumatized by the fact that
she was forced to be changing right next to a
biological mail. And that's where I think maybe we haven't
thought some of these things through. I understand wanting to
(27:54):
be loving and that a lot of like you said,
these young people can look at this and feel like, yeah,
I can be convinced by that, And I think that's
a lot of what's happening, and we're forgetting that there's
another group that still deserves to be held up and
kept in a fair situation and a safe situation.
Speaker 3 (28:12):
Yeah, I mean, fact is is right now, it's trendy
to be progressive. You know, if you're in the younger
you know the gen zers is that that's what's trendy,
that's what's cool.
Speaker 2 (28:22):
You know, they want to feel like Oh this is you.
Speaker 3 (28:25):
Know, I'm fighting for equal rights and they really don't
have any real understanding of what they're doing. They're completely
destroying the fabric of women's sports by championing these new beliefs,
and I just think ultimately we're going down a very
slippery slope. I mean, because like we said, we look
at swimming, Leah Thomas, you know, that's an individual sport,
still danger surrounding it, you know, even just the locker
(28:47):
room example being one of them. But and you kind
of alluded to this already, but soccer fields, basketball courts,
football fields, what happens when a man enters those arenas
and there's content and they're very aggressive.
Speaker 2 (29:02):
I mean, someone is going to get hurt.
Speaker 3 (29:03):
There's people getting hurt when women are playing other women, right,
So what happens when you put a man into the mix?
I mean it's just there's no way to avoid injury
like that.
Speaker 1 (29:11):
Because well, in the fighting, when we've seen the boxing
matches and the fighting that is that seems really outside
of the realm of common sense.
Speaker 3 (29:24):
Yeah, And I also it's just curious to me that
a lot of the people that I've been hearing from
since I started here last week and have started speaking
out for the first time. A lot of the people
who are coming after me on social media are clearly
not athletes, nor have they ever been athletes.
Speaker 2 (29:42):
So it's just interesting that people are trying to fight
this fight when they know nothing about it.
Speaker 1 (29:47):
I think that's the thing that is frustrating to us,
as women who've played sports, to hear men come out
and say, well, you're not being welcoming, or someone who
has never been involved to say well, you're not being inclusive.
It's like, no, I I am actually speaking from a
place of knowing and experiencing this myself, and I have
to say that this is a bad idea. But you're
(30:09):
not allowed to say it's a bad idea anymore.
Speaker 2 (30:11):
You're not allowed. And you know what, I was in
middle school. I was a huge tomboy and I was
I was so adamant. I was like, I'm playing football.
You can't keep me off the team. And so I told.
Speaker 3 (30:20):
Them, I was like, I'm playing on I'm playing on
the middle school boys football team. And it was you know,
it was a private school, so they had no cuts.
There weren't enough there weren't enough students, staff cuts, so
they're like, all right, come on out, and I'm telling
you tudor.
Speaker 2 (30:32):
I was out there one day and I was like,
never mind, thank you so much.
Speaker 1 (30:37):
I was good, ye any good?
Speaker 2 (30:39):
So you just don't really even.
Speaker 3 (30:40):
Though I was, I would like to say, the most
athletic girl in my class, I still.
Speaker 2 (30:46):
Could not hold a candle to these middle school boys.
Speaker 1 (30:49):
I mean, it just what that's what exactly right? I mean,
that's what you don't know until you know exactly.
Speaker 2 (30:54):
And it's nothing against me. I wasn't.
Speaker 3 (30:56):
I wasn't embarrassed or was I ashamed. It's just one
of those things like, yeah, I can run fast, but
can I run as fast as you know?
Speaker 2 (31:03):
I'm strong?
Speaker 3 (31:03):
But am I as strong as you know? It's just
do I have endurance?
Speaker 1 (31:07):
Yes?
Speaker 2 (31:08):
But do I have much endurance as you know?
Speaker 1 (31:10):
It's just there is different. I recently went to my
daughter's sixth grade basketball games, and she played basketball this year.
Her little friend is a boy played basketball on the
boys team. She wanted to go see him on the
boys team. I was used to going to the girls
basketball team for weeks, and I thought, really, honestly, even
though I talk about this stuff all the time, I
(31:31):
really thought, how much difference is sixth grade? You know
it's gonna be the same game, but it was a
totally different game. The boys just play in it much faster,
much more aggressive. It's just a different way of playing.
And that was surprising to me because they're so young.
But there's truly a difference in the way they play.
Speaker 3 (31:49):
Well. Yeah, and especially like once the testosterone kicks in,
you know what I mean, Like in football, once you
take a big hit, your body, it just goes into
the state where you're ultra fired up and right.
Speaker 2 (32:00):
It's something you control.
Speaker 3 (32:01):
It's an adrenaline rush, it's hormonal, and you suddenly you
just hit another level of play. And that's something that
women we experience in a sense of our own, but
it's not the same thing.
Speaker 1 (32:12):
I guess I had never thought about that before, But
that is really interesting. I mean that these are the
things that I feel like we are not free to
talk about. And I guarantee you that when this post,
somebody will say, you're not experts on these things, but
we have this experience. You certainly have had this experience,
You've watched it. What makes you an expert if you haven't,
(32:33):
If it's not that you've played, you've watched it, you've
reported on it. I mean, you are deeply into this
and you've seen the differences, and it's a shame that
you can't just safely say, okay, but can we think
about it? Can we think that maybe this isn't the
best idea?
Speaker 2 (32:46):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (32:46):
And you know, there was an example years ago of
the women's national soccer team doing a scrimmage against a
grade school boys team. I can't remember exactly what great
it was. They got completely demolished. You know, you're looking
at it completely different age group, professional female athletes versus
right grade school boys, and they still were And it's
(33:08):
just and it's not a knock on the women. It's
not to say they aren't phenomenal, fantastic athletes, but just
men and women are built differently. Their capabilities are different,
and that is never going to change.
Speaker 1 (33:21):
No, it will not. So okay, so tell us how
do people find you on OutKick? Tell us a little
bit about that really quick.
Speaker 3 (33:27):
Okay, So the show that I will be co hosting
does not launch until before football season, so realistically plot
probably sometime in July.
Speaker 2 (33:37):
We're looking up.
Speaker 3 (33:38):
But until then I'm gonna be plugged. Into all different
types of OutKick shows, filling in as a guest host,
doing guest appearances. I'll just also all over Fox News Channel,
coming on to talk about issues like this, So like
tomorrow night, I'll be on Sean Hannity, which is great today,
and then I'll be on Varney and Co.
Speaker 2 (33:57):
On Thursday, and then.
Speaker 3 (33:58):
You know, I'm sure if you if you go to
my social media, I'll keep you up to data where
you can find me, and my socials are at Charlie
on TV.
Speaker 2 (34:06):
So I'm so wonderful part of the family.
Speaker 3 (34:08):
It's been a great experience so far, and I'm super
happy to have my voice back.
Speaker 1 (34:12):
Well, we are so happy that you decided to do this,
and I think that you are an inspiration to so
many young women and really people all across the country.
Just know that as many of those nasty comments as
you get on social media, there's thousands more people behind
you saying, give me a break. This woman's amazing.
Speaker 3 (34:28):
Absolutely, and hopefully that voice that louder one you just
mentioned gets even louder.
Speaker 1 (34:32):
I agree, absolutely, you are inspiring it. Charlie Arnault, thank
you so much for being on the podcast today. I
really appreciate it, of course, thank you so much. Yeah,
congratulations too, and good luck. You don't need luck though,
because what you're doing is already amazing.
Speaker 2 (34:48):
Oh, thank you so much.
Speaker 1 (34:49):
Appreciate that, and thank you all for joining us on
the Tutor Dixon Podcast. For this episode and others, go
to Tutor dixonpodcast dot com. You can subscribe right there
and make sure you join us the next time on
the Tutor Dixon Podcast. Have a great day.
You're listening to the Tutor Dixon Podcast in the Clay
and Buck podcast Network. Welcome to the Tutor Dixon Podcast.
I'm Tutor Dixon, and I'm glad you're here with me today.
As some of you may know, but some of you
might not know, Clay Travis and Buck Sexton actually encouraged
me to do this podcast, and I was a little
(00:21):
bit unsure of whether or not this is what I
wanted to do. But there's such awesome encouragers of free speech.
They've been champions of free speech with people really across
the country. They launched the Clay and Buck Network here
on iHeart, and they also have OutKick, and my guest
today is actually leaving ESPN to join OutKick, So welcome
(00:43):
to this side of the world. Charlie Arnald, thank you
so much for being on the podcast.
Speaker 2 (00:49):
Teeter, thank you so much.
Speaker 3 (00:50):
And you know what, the transition has already occurred. I
have left ESPN. I am out at OutKick, and already
only a weekend. I'm so happy that I made decision.
I can already tell it was the perfect.
Speaker 2 (01:01):
One for me.
Speaker 1 (01:02):
OutKick is getting bigger and bigger right now. We see
people going more and more to OutKick. I mean OutKick
started mostly as sports, there is the ability to obviously
speak about political issues. Is that why you decided that
OutKick was the place to go after ESPN?
Speaker 3 (01:20):
Yeah, you know, there's so many different reasons why OutKick
was appealing to me, And I want to say that
Clay Travis was one of the large reasons why I'm
here today. Just like you said, it was your interactions
with him and Bach and in fact, I early on
when I was getting to learn about OutKick, This was
probably at this point, about six months ago, I had
dinner with Clay and Buck after being introduced to OutKick on.
Speaker 2 (01:45):
A pretty introductory level, and the.
Speaker 3 (01:47):
Things that they were saying about what they wanted the
network to be, what kind of talent they were looking for,
what they were encouraging from their talent, how the idea
of cancel culture didn't exist at OutKick, and Clay was,
you know, very steadfast when he told me, listen, if
something is said on OutKick and the talent stands behind it,
(02:08):
as long as they have done their research and there
are facts behind what they're saying, I will never ever
attempt to cancel anyone for standing up for what they
believe in and I know, did.
Speaker 1 (02:20):
You feel like that was happening at ESPN? I mean,
this seems really important to you to not have that
threat looming over you. But we hear political statements from
ESPN all the time. So did you feel like there
was only one side?
Speaker 2 (02:33):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (02:33):
Well, that's the thing is, there's so many issues in
sports that have now become politicized, whether or not we
want to admit it. We have seen so many different
sports just completely overrun by politics.
Speaker 2 (02:45):
And it's not like they're directly.
Speaker 3 (02:48):
Addressed, but they are because they're not talked about or
only one side of the argument is addressed. You know,
when you look at, for example, the trans issue, which
right now everyone's talking about.
Speaker 2 (03:00):
ESPN always says, you know, we want to keep politics.
Speaker 3 (03:03):
Out of our programming, but then on the same token,
during Women's Month, they ran a one minute tribute to
Leah Thomas, who is.
Speaker 2 (03:12):
Not even a woman biologically.
Speaker 3 (03:14):
So it just doesn't make sense when there are so
many incredible female athletes who have paved the way for
other females to do their things in the world of sports,
and just there's so many things that they should be
recognized for, and yet we're taking the time to recognize
a biological man for their success during Women's Month.
Speaker 2 (03:31):
It just makes absolutely no sense.
Speaker 3 (03:33):
But then again shows the rhetoric that ESPN is still
standing by.
Speaker 1 (03:37):
And don't you think if you have an iconic company
like ESPN, I mean, really, this is the name of
sports that we've all known growing up and little girls
look up to, little boys look up to for little
girls to see. Instead of honoring a woman who's done
something incredible in sports, you're honoring a biological male, an
(03:57):
intact male, saying that he's a woman. And I mean
it's just kind of mind blowing. But don't you think
that when that happens, it changes culture. That ESPN has
the power to change culture and changed the way people think.
Speaker 2 (04:12):
Absolutely.
Speaker 3 (04:13):
I think that there's a lot of women who feel
this way too, they just can't speak up about it.
Since joining OutKick and announcing the news all my social
media channels, I have quietly heard from several of my
colleagues from ESPN who have said, thank you so much
for speaking up for those of us who can't. And
that's so encouraging because there is a swell occurring.
Speaker 1 (04:33):
So when you see people getting fired on other networks.
Why do you think it is? I mean, over the
years for multiple forms of harassment, isn't this somewhat of
a form of harassment that women can't really speak their
minds when it comes to something so serious as their
achievements in sports? I mean, doesn't it kind of blow
your mind that people have to be so silent about this?
Speaker 3 (04:56):
I mean absolutely, because when you look at the Me
Too movement, there were so many women for decades who
are unable to speak up about their instances of sexual
harassment or what may have been in their pasts. And
now it's like the same thing, Like women are suppressed,
they feel uncomfortable coming forward, So we're allowing something that's
very uncomfortable to persist and women there's nothing they can
(05:17):
do about it. And it's like, you know, the Me
Too moment was so celebrated by men and women alike,
yet here we are further into the future and it's
just another example of women not being being able to
speak up.
Speaker 1 (05:29):
So what will you cover on al kik? How will
this change the way you talk about sports?
Speaker 3 (05:34):
It's an alternative way to look at different issues, and
it's a way to cover both sides of issues at hand.
You know, I think that I have one opinion on matters,
but I'm open to hearing other opinions. I don't think
that there's room for only one opinion in each debate.
So I would love to have a platform where other
(05:54):
people can come share, you know, what their takes on
things are, and we can have an open discussion, which
I think right now is not happening.
Speaker 2 (06:01):
In most places.
Speaker 3 (06:03):
We'll see issues that just don't relate to sports, but
also just culture and society in general, because a lot
of those do end up spilling into the world of sports.
Speaker 1 (06:13):
Of course. Yeah, we've seen President Trump go into fights
and people are like, oh, don't talk about this, don't
actually acknowledge. But he's incredibly popular. He was a former
president of the United States. Why is that something that
you can't celebrate that you have a former president. If
it were a George Bush, If for we're a Barack Obama,
(06:34):
how do you think it would be covered differently.
Speaker 3 (06:36):
Yeah, Well, that's the thing is UFC has done something right.
You know, they have appealed to the voices you have
not been heard for.
Speaker 2 (06:43):
So many years.
Speaker 3 (06:45):
A lot of Trump's fan base who felt like they
hadn't been heard for years, and that's why there was
such an uproar when you know, it was Dana White
and President former President Trump and Kid Rock and Mike
Tyson's all sitting octagon side the other night. And I
think it's just a testament to what people are looking
(07:05):
for out of sports. You know, they want to feel
like sports is a reflection of who they are and
also what they're looking for because at the end of
the day, here's the thing. Politics is getting inserted into
every little thing that we do. I mean, it's a
part of our lives. Any you try to look this way,
it doesn't matter. You can't avoid it. You look the
other way, it doesn't matter. It can't be avoided.
Speaker 2 (07:25):
Sports in politics don't need to go hand in hand.
Speaker 3 (07:29):
You know, you've looked throughout history and sports have always
been an escape for people, right through wartime depressions, downturns
of every shape and form. The pandemic a big example recently,
and people returning to sports as a way to distract themselves.
Whereas now when they watch sports, they're still being confronted
(07:50):
with the same issues that they're trying to get away
from in everyday life. I mean, even if you look
at the NBA bubble right, I mean that was for
us sports fans, it was so exciting because we had
been craving sports and craving competition. We finally got what
was actually a really decent setup by the NBA. You know,
it was it was the best that they could do,
and it was it was actually the most competitive basketball
(08:12):
I had seen in a really long time.
Speaker 2 (08:14):
I really enjoyed bubble play.
Speaker 3 (08:16):
But that also, at the same time is when they
started doing all of the social justice implementations, whether it
being you know, stamping a.
Speaker 2 (08:27):
Moniker on the court or allowing players to choose different
phrases for the backs of their jerseys.
Speaker 3 (08:34):
And it's like, suddenly, we're not watching basketball, we're being
confronted with politics. And that's when some people started getting
very turned off of the NBA, and you did see
the numbers start to drop. And even as recently as
this week, Phil Jackson, who's a legend in the NBA,
He's won thirteen championships as both the player and coach,
(08:54):
he even said he doesn't watch the NBA anymore because
I didn't hear that, Yeah, because he just says it's
just too politicized now and it's gotten to a point
where it's uncomfortable for him, and it's uncomfortable for many fans,
and that's not what it's supposed to be. And for
a guy like Phil Jackson to say he doesn't watch
the NBA when he has been a huge part of
(09:15):
why the NBA is what it is today, is saying something.
Speaker 1 (09:17):
Well, you said, something interesting. You said. For many of us,
sports is a reflection of who we are. And I
think that is the case for people who played soccer
when they were young, people who played football, people who
I think what people don't understand is that no matter
when you were connected to sports, that for a lot
of people is a lifelong connection. And I think that's
(09:38):
what we saw when we saw the football players starting
to kneel, and those people who saw football as a
reflection of them went well, wait, wait, no, this is
not who I am. Still patriotic, I still believe that
this country is a great place. We have flaws, but
we can work on them. And this was kind of
a statement, there's it's broken, there's no way to fix it.
(10:01):
We don't love it, and I think it turned so
many people off in that moment. They walked away. We
saw that the NFL started losing viewers and losing money.
Why they changed quickly. I think they came back and said,
you know what, we got to stop doing this or
the next season, we're not going to have any viewers,
and they brought their viewers back. Why wasn't that a
(10:22):
learning curve for the rest of sports.
Speaker 3 (10:23):
I think it's because of the athletes themselves. I think
it's not about the leagues anymore. The players have a
lot of power. They continuously are gaining more power each
and every year.
Speaker 2 (10:35):
I look at the NBA as the prime example of this.
Speaker 3 (10:38):
You look at guys like Lebron James, who's going down
as one of the greatest players of all time, but
he also has made himself the poster child for many
social justice issues and teams and the league doesn't have
any control over that, and a lot of fans who
love Lebron James then become obsessed with the things that
he's tweeting and the things that he said, and so
(11:00):
it doesn't just become about sports todaymore it becomes about politics.
And you know, when you're in a locker room, it's
like your family. Like I grew up an athlete and
a lot of my teammates I looked at as family members,
and so your mind is hard not to be persuaded
in one certain way. When you're hearing one of your
best friends and teammates preaching an issue constantly and talking
(11:22):
about it and standing up for something, it starts almost
brainwashing you a little bit because you're around them so
much and you feel so close to them and you
trust them. So now it's like, you know, it's uncomfortable
then to take a different position. So now you're seeing
a lot of players going in one direction, whereas I'm
sure there's a lot of people who have different opinions
and would love to stand up for themselves. But if
you even look at the recent Phil Jackson issue of
(11:44):
him speaking up against the NBA, Jalen Rose, who is
a broadcaster for ESPN also longtime NBA player one of
the greats as well, called Phil Jackson a racist because
he said that, you know, you're just being being racist
by saying that politics should be kept out of the
NBA and you don't like watching the NBA anymore.
Speaker 2 (12:02):
And Phil Jackson, I mean, look at what he's done.
He's clearly not a racist.
Speaker 3 (12:05):
And I just think It's unfortunate because it dissuades so
many people from being able to speak their mind, because
no one wants to be called that's that's.
Speaker 1 (12:12):
Hurtful, such a cruel word, but it's so effective at
silencing people. Let's take a quick commercial break. We'll continue
next on the Tutor Dixon Podcast. I look at what
we've seen happening in sports over the past few years,
and I think that you're absolutely right that young especially
(12:32):
young people, but I think people of all ages can
start to see somebody that they idolize, that they look
up to, and take their position as fact. And that's
where I wonder how challenging has sports reporting become because recently,
I mean not a few years ago, Lebron James was
the one out there defending China. And I think that
(12:53):
the geopolitical climate in the United in the world has
changed so significantly that whereas in a few years back
we felt comfortable doing business business with China, we now
know that in the political world, in the true political world,
China has become an incredible threat to the United States.
China has been talking to our oldest, our first and oldest. Ally,
(13:16):
they have been out there talking to Russia. We know
that they're supporting many of our enemies, true enemies out there,
and they're becoming an enemy. I mean, they want world domination.
So at what point, as a journalist for sports, do
you have to say, actually, I have to take this
into the political realm so that we make sure that
(13:36):
even though the sports personality is saying this, you understand
why there are dangers surrounding us.
Speaker 2 (13:42):
Well.
Speaker 3 (13:42):
I think that's the thing is if you are going
to bring politics into the equation, which, like I said,
a lot of people want to watch sports to avoid politics, Okay,
but if there are issues that need to be addressed
and you intend on addressing them, you need to address
them for both sides.
Speaker 2 (13:56):
And that's problem.
Speaker 3 (13:57):
As you're seeing from most of these sports organizations networks,
they aren't addressing it from both sides. I think another
big thing was the COVID mandates that started in twenty twenty.
You saw the requirement for athletes to be vaccinated. You
saw Aaron Rodgers get absolutely murdered.
Speaker 1 (14:17):
Yes, yeah, he.
Speaker 3 (14:18):
Wasn't vaccinated, even though at that point the efficacy of
the vaccine was being highly questioned. Yet people were like,
how could you this is outrageous when.
Speaker 1 (14:28):
Really, even in Tennis, look at what happened with the vaccine,
it wasn't.
Speaker 3 (14:32):
He missed his first US Open last year for the
first time since twenty seventeen, they wouldn't let him into
the country.
Speaker 2 (14:39):
It's just so outrageous because also.
Speaker 3 (14:41):
This is isn't there like such a thing as like
medical privacy. I just feel like people just feel like
they have right to know each and everything a little
thing about people these days, especially when we all know
at this point, like masks, we know they're not effective.
Yet they were making people wear masks for such a
long time. They were required to get into certain venues,
They were required for athletes to wear when they are
(15:01):
around their own teammates. It's just there's just so many
different things that were not questioned, but they reported on
as very straightforward fact. This is how it is, This
is how it should be, without anyone saying, but wait,
let's actually look at the other side of the coin.
If you're going to talk about politics, you got to
address both sides. But you know, when you look at
a place like a ESPN, that doesn't fit within their rhetoric,
(15:23):
It doesn't fit within Disney's rhetoric and so they continue
to turn their heads to that.
Speaker 1 (15:28):
So what is your take on I mean, Disney is
a very similar situation when it comes to I guess
I would say it's a little different because there is
no fighting back when it's Disney outside of you know people.
I mean, it's a capitalist country. You can unsubscribe, you
can step away from Disney, plus you cannot watch it.
But they really have kind of cornered that movement with
(15:51):
young people of slowly changing culture amongst young people. And
as a parent, I've watched this over the years because
we watched all the Disney shows and then and then
slowly they started to become more and more not I
wouldn't say we were going into some of the really
life changing stuff, but more empowering kids to disrespect adults
(16:13):
and creating a behavior of distraction and disruption. What what
is the answer to something like that? Do you think
at some point OutKick has started? Do you think there
will be entertainment that will be more conservative? Have American
values go back to that level of respect from children
to adults.
Speaker 3 (16:33):
Unfortunately? I mean I think that there are places that
can try. I think it's going to be up to
you know, they have like the parental controls and the
you know, parents can dictate what their kids see and
listen to. So you know, if they were to say,
you know, let's say outka release kids programming, Okay, this
is this is what we're raising you on and what
you get used to seeing, so you don't.
Speaker 2 (16:51):
Crave all of the other stuff.
Speaker 3 (16:53):
Perhaps, But the problem is is social media is so
ingrained in our culture and you look at so many
issues that being splattered all over social media.
Speaker 2 (17:02):
I mean, let's look at the trans issue. Right when
you see a guy.
Speaker 3 (17:05):
Or sorry I don't know even know the proper terminology anymore,
but just Dylan mulvaney all over the place on social
media representing women now and then you see kids who are.
Speaker 2 (17:16):
Watching Dylan mulvaney. It's it's a form of brainwashing.
Speaker 1 (17:21):
And you know it's interesting because.
Speaker 2 (17:23):
All they do is consume social media from morning until night.
Speaker 3 (17:25):
It's just unless you completely take it away, which I'll
tell you I don't have kids yet, but when I do,
I am going to do.
Speaker 2 (17:34):
My damnness, I'm not.
Speaker 3 (17:35):
They're not going to have access to screens until I
cannot control it.
Speaker 2 (17:39):
I have no choice.
Speaker 3 (17:41):
I am going to shelter them far beyond what I
ever thought I would.
Speaker 2 (17:46):
Because I want always wanted to be you know, I
want to be the cool mom.
Speaker 3 (17:49):
I am so scared to bring up a child in
this world because it is just it's not what it
was when I was younger. And if we're already heading
in this direction and it doesn't seem like things are
slowing down, I really fear for what the future looks like.
Speaker 1 (18:02):
Well, we've talked about how there are you know, we're
embracing men wearing makeup and when we were kids, the
nabling models, all of these makeup models, they were showing
how they were putting makeup on and commercials and it
was really kind of like the next stuff in life.
You know, this will someday be you putting makeup on.
(18:22):
And that made sense because it's marketing. You would think
that that's what the company wants, is little girls to say, yes,
I want to be putting makeup on, just like that,
similar to even Victoria's Secret. We've had this conversation on
here before I'm a mom, I've had four girls. I
actually when I walk past the lingerie store, don't want
to see my body in lingerie I want to think
(18:44):
that I can look like Giselle. You know, I don't
necessarily want to think I'm going to look like.
Speaker 2 (18:49):
It's not my thing.
Speaker 3 (18:49):
It never has been my thing. Give me some like
comfy swats. That's why I'm here.
Speaker 1 (18:54):
It's just hard to see that we've changed so much
that we are leaving the people out that actually want
to feel better about themselves. You know, We're leaving out
the people that want to the little girls that want
to say, oh, when I grow up, I'm gonna wear makeup.
And my girls have seen all of this. You know,
I have four girls, so I've watched them see this
(19:15):
and it hasn't been empowering to them. It's been confusing
to them. And I just think, why aren't people seeing
Why aren't these big marketing directors seen that this is
confusing rather than encouraging.
Speaker 3 (19:26):
Well, it's interesting that you bring up both lingerie and
makeup because we've just seen in the past couple weeks
Dylan mulvaney was used for a Maybe Lene ad. So
there's makeup something that women and young girls really identify
with it.
Speaker 2 (19:39):
It's like a part of their coming of age. Right.
Speaker 3 (19:41):
Oh my gosh, I get to wear makeup, Like I
finally get to wear some lip gloss, and I would
sneak my eyeshadow to sight and put it onto the
bathroom because my dad would never let me wear it
out of the house. And then there was just another
lingerie company this past week that used a biological man
to modelist lingerie, which again, like that's one of those
things like, ooh, you know, when I'm older, I'm gonna
(20:01):
I'm gonna buy a teddy, I'm gonna I'm gonna wear
some lingerie. And again it's it's something that really identifies
with women, and there's so many amazing women who would
be great models for lingerie or great models for any
makeup brand, and yet they're saying, you know what, forget
all of you actual women, Forget all of you who
have you know, actually gone through puberty as a girl
(20:22):
and really felt what it was like to transition from
girl to women. Forget all of you. We're gonna go
with a man for this ad. It's just it's a
huge insult to women, and it has crossed over into
the sports landscape with the trans athletes. It's such a
slap in the face to women that they would say
you know what.
Speaker 2 (20:40):
Everything you've worked for, everything that.
Speaker 3 (20:43):
You know Title nine has helped you to achieve, We're
just gonna forget about it all. And you know what, ultimately,
what are we looking for? Are we looking for just
complete co ed leagues? I don't understand, Like I don't
understand what.
Speaker 1 (20:54):
No, because because I don't think that the average male
wants to compete against women. I think they understand that
there are so many barriers, there's dangers. It's your men
are tougher than women. I mean, we've seen just the
volleyball player that was hit in the face with the
volleyball because a biological man can hit that volleyball much
(21:14):
harder than a biological woman can. It's tough. But we've
seen this kind of trending toward this pushing women aside.
Women have been pushed aside. There's not as much pride
in being a woman. And like you said, when you
see that the women who are being used for makeup,
that are being used for lingerie do not represent women,
(21:37):
it's disheartening. What about patriotism? Why is it that patriotism
is under attack? And that's something that I think that
we see a lot in the sports world. And how
can we how do we bring that back? How do
we say, well, no, it's you can love this country
and still believe that we can change things and make
things better on a constant basis.
Speaker 3 (21:57):
Well, I think the whole point is that there's just
such a confused mindset these days where people associate patriotism
with suppressing the rights of groups that are trying to
gain more traction right now, and people feel like, oh, well,
if I say I'm a patriot, it means I'm homophobic,
(22:19):
it means I'm transphobic, it means all these things, which
it doesn't mean that they don't go hand in hand.
But people have gotten very confused because there's one group that's,
you know, crying out that we're under attack, and if
you support America and it's traditional values, then you're not
progressing like the rest of us. The whole mindset of
(22:41):
the country has just gotten very skewed, and it's really
a shame.
Speaker 1 (22:45):
How long did it take you to make the decision
to go.
Speaker 3 (22:48):
To out kick It wasn't a tough decision for me,
you know, it's just you Also, it's just the wayhg
of what's going to be best for my career, what
direction do I want to go in? Because I also
realize by coming to a place like OutKick, there is
the possibility that some doors could be shut down the
road by some of the more traditional outlets. But you
(23:11):
also have to recognize, you know, what's my goal here
at the end of the day, Like do I want
to be able to have the freedom to speak my
mind and you know, have those that don't have a
voice to be able to look to me to say, okay, yes, yes,
I can.
Speaker 2 (23:25):
Agree with that.
Speaker 3 (23:25):
And actually you have encouraged me to stand up for
my beliefs as well, which I've been getting a lot
of from women. Like I said, I have had several
of my former colleagues, not just from ESPN, but from
former jobs even you know further down the line, reach
out and say I'm so proud of you, thank you
so much for standing up for the rest of us.
(23:46):
There's a lot more of us out there than people realize.
But it's going to take some time because people are scared.
People are scared to speak their minds, are scared to
stand up for themselves. Because the fact of the matter is,
there's a lot of places where if you do speak
up you're out of a job.
Speaker 1 (24:00):
Let's take a quick commercial break. We'll continue next on
the Tutor Dixon Podcast. What do you tell people that say,
how did you do it? And how can I do it?
I mean, you must have people constantly saying I feel
like I need to do this too, But I'm afraid.
Speaker 3 (24:16):
I think it's just going to take a lot of
women or different groups just saying, you know what, enough
is enough? And what are they going to do? Fire
the whole company? If every woman says, well I can't
do this anymore, what are.
Speaker 2 (24:31):
They going to do? Or at least they're going to be.
Speaker 3 (24:33):
Forced to address the issue. They're going to be forced
to talk about it. They'll be conversation about it. They'll
be equal and fair conversation about it. So I just
think it's one of those things that people just need
to really do some deep introspection and find out are
you okay with the world moving in this direction. I
think there's a lot of women in the broadcast industry
whose journeys into motherhood are a little bit delayed, right
(24:56):
because a lot of us put more time into our career.
Speaker 2 (24:58):
At the beginning.
Speaker 3 (24:59):
Having kids isn't something that we think about so early on,
but now that we're here, there's a lot of us
who are thinking, Okay, well, kids might be in my
future in the next few years, and is this something
I want for my children.
Speaker 2 (25:09):
It's not just about you, it's about the future generations
as well.
Speaker 3 (25:12):
So I think you really have to just realize what's
important to you, how do you want to live, how
do you want your families to live, and make a
decision from there.
Speaker 1 (25:19):
When you see someone like Megan Rapino, who was a
champion on the soccer field, was able, you know, fought
for women to get equal pay or higher pay, and
probably has her own endorsement deals now saying that she
thinks that men should be able to compete with women
on the soccer field and another sport where you're making
(25:40):
contact with people. I mean, it really is dangerous to
have a biological male on the field with women playing soccer.
What is your take on that?
Speaker 2 (25:49):
It doesn't make sense, It doesn't add up.
Speaker 3 (25:51):
You know a lot of people really applauded Megan Rapino
for taking a stand for women. You know, everyone wants
to see women treated the same as men and have
the same rights and a fair level of competition, which
is being wiped out by biological men now being able
to play with women on these same fields or arenas.
Speaker 2 (26:12):
So it doesn't really make sense. You have to wonder
what her incentive is to make this blatant switch in mentality,
because after fighting this fight for so many years, you know,
especially for you know, a lesbian woman too, who's probably
fought a lot of her own battles throughout the years.
You know, just seems like this would be something we
(26:34):
would be able to look to her and she would say, listen.
Speaker 3 (26:37):
I've fought a lot of battles. I've been there, done that,
and I think doing this to women is just the
worst possible case scenario.
Speaker 2 (26:45):
So it's really sad to see.
Speaker 1 (26:47):
I know, I think that was one of the more
shocking ones because I understand. I think I can understand
from her perspective being torn between the two because she
has been a champion for both women rights and lgbt
Q rights, and I guess we saw which one one
out there. But I think that that has been a
(27:09):
challenge for so many young people. They get caught in
that same trap. If I support one, do I not
love the other? And that's what I want people to
understand No, you can be supportive of both but still
say women deserve to be in a fair situation. I mean,
we certainly wouldn't want women to feel that they can't
be safe in their own sport. We heard a story
(27:32):
about one of the women who was in a locker
room with Leah Thomas that had been raped as a
young person, raped it in like a fourteen or fifteen
I think, and was just traumatized by the fact that
she was forced to be changing right next to a
biological mail. And that's where I think maybe we haven't
thought some of these things through. I understand wanting to
(27:54):
be loving and that a lot of like you said,
these young people can look at this and feel like, yeah,
I can be convinced by that, And I think that's
a lot of what's happening, and we're forgetting that there's
another group that still deserves to be held up and
kept in a fair situation and a safe situation.
Speaker 3 (28:12):
Yeah, I mean, fact is is right now, it's trendy
to be progressive. You know, if you're in the younger
you know the gen zers is that that's what's trendy,
that's what's cool.
Speaker 2 (28:22):
You know, they want to feel like Oh this is you.
Speaker 3 (28:25):
Know, I'm fighting for equal rights and they really don't
have any real understanding of what they're doing. They're completely
destroying the fabric of women's sports by championing these new beliefs,
and I just think ultimately we're going down a very
slippery slope. I mean, because like we said, we look
at swimming, Leah Thomas, you know, that's an individual sport,
still danger surrounding it, you know, even just the locker
(28:47):
room example being one of them. But and you kind
of alluded to this already, but soccer fields, basketball courts,
football fields, what happens when a man enters those arenas
and there's content and they're very aggressive.
Speaker 2 (29:02):
I mean, someone is going to get hurt.
Speaker 3 (29:03):
There's people getting hurt when women are playing other women, right,
So what happens when you put a man into the mix?
I mean it's just there's no way to avoid injury
like that.
Speaker 1 (29:11):
Because well, in the fighting, when we've seen the boxing
matches and the fighting that is that seems really outside
of the realm of common sense.
Speaker 3 (29:24):
Yeah, And I also it's just curious to me that
a lot of the people that I've been hearing from
since I started here last week and have started speaking
out for the first time. A lot of the people
who are coming after me on social media are clearly
not athletes, nor have they ever been athletes.
Speaker 2 (29:42):
So it's just interesting that people are trying to fight
this fight when they know nothing about it.
Speaker 1 (29:47):
I think that's the thing that is frustrating to us,
as women who've played sports, to hear men come out
and say, well, you're not being welcoming, or someone who
has never been involved to say well, you're not being inclusive.
It's like, no, I I am actually speaking from a
place of knowing and experiencing this myself, and I have
to say that this is a bad idea. But you're
(30:09):
not allowed to say it's a bad idea anymore.
Speaker 2 (30:11):
You're not allowed. And you know what, I was in
middle school. I was a huge tomboy and I was
I was so adamant. I was like, I'm playing football.
You can't keep me off the team. And so I told.
Speaker 3 (30:20):
Them, I was like, I'm playing on I'm playing on
the middle school boys football team. And it was you know,
it was a private school, so they had no cuts.
There weren't enough there weren't enough students, staff cuts, so
they're like, all right, come on out, and I'm telling
you tudor.
Speaker 2 (30:32):
I was out there one day and I was like,
never mind, thank you so much.
Speaker 1 (30:37):
I was good, ye any good?
Speaker 2 (30:39):
So you just don't really even.
Speaker 3 (30:40):
Though I was, I would like to say, the most
athletic girl in my class, I still.
Speaker 2 (30:46):
Could not hold a candle to these middle school boys.
Speaker 1 (30:49):
I mean, it just what that's what exactly right? I mean,
that's what you don't know until you know exactly.
Speaker 2 (30:54):
And it's nothing against me. I wasn't.
Speaker 3 (30:56):
I wasn't embarrassed or was I ashamed. It's just one
of those things like, yeah, I can run fast, but
can I run as fast as you know?
Speaker 2 (31:03):
I'm strong?
Speaker 3 (31:03):
But am I as strong as you know? It's just
do I have endurance?
Speaker 1 (31:07):
Yes?
Speaker 2 (31:08):
But do I have much endurance as you know?
Speaker 1 (31:10):
It's just there is different. I recently went to my
daughter's sixth grade basketball games, and she played basketball this year.
Her little friend is a boy played basketball on the
boys team. She wanted to go see him on the
boys team. I was used to going to the girls
basketball team for weeks, and I thought, really, honestly, even
though I talk about this stuff all the time, I
(31:31):
really thought, how much difference is sixth grade? You know
it's gonna be the same game, but it was a
totally different game. The boys just play in it much faster,
much more aggressive. It's just a different way of playing.
And that was surprising to me because they're so young.
But there's truly a difference in the way they play.
Speaker 3 (31:49):
Well. Yeah, and especially like once the testosterone kicks in,
you know what I mean, Like in football, once you
take a big hit, your body, it just goes into
the state where you're ultra fired up and right.
Speaker 2 (32:00):
It's something you control.
Speaker 3 (32:01):
It's an adrenaline rush, it's hormonal, and you suddenly you
just hit another level of play. And that's something that
women we experience in a sense of our own, but
it's not the same thing.
Speaker 1 (32:12):
I guess I had never thought about that before, But
that is really interesting. I mean that these are the
things that I feel like we are not free to
talk about. And I guarantee you that when this post,
somebody will say, you're not experts on these things, but
we have this experience. You certainly have had this experience,
You've watched it. What makes you an expert if you haven't,
(32:33):
If it's not that you've played, you've watched it, you've
reported on it. I mean, you are deeply into this
and you've seen the differences, and it's a shame that
you can't just safely say, okay, but can we think
about it? Can we think that maybe this isn't the
best idea?
Speaker 2 (32:46):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (32:46):
And you know, there was an example years ago of
the women's national soccer team doing a scrimmage against a
grade school boys team. I can't remember exactly what great
it was. They got completely demolished. You know, you're looking
at it completely different age group, professional female athletes versus
right grade school boys, and they still were And it's
(33:08):
just and it's not a knock on the women. It's
not to say they aren't phenomenal, fantastic athletes, but just
men and women are built differently. Their capabilities are different,
and that is never going to change.
Speaker 1 (33:21):
No, it will not. So okay, so tell us how
do people find you on OutKick? Tell us a little
bit about that really quick.
Speaker 3 (33:27):
Okay, So the show that I will be co hosting
does not launch until before football season, so realistically plot
probably sometime in July.
Speaker 2 (33:37):
We're looking up.
Speaker 3 (33:38):
But until then I'm gonna be plugged. Into all different
types of OutKick shows, filling in as a guest host,
doing guest appearances. I'll just also all over Fox News Channel,
coming on to talk about issues like this, So like
tomorrow night, I'll be on Sean Hannity, which is great today,
and then I'll be on Varney and Co.
Speaker 2 (33:57):
On Thursday, and then.
Speaker 3 (33:58):
You know, I'm sure if you if you go to
my social media, I'll keep you up to data where
you can find me, and my socials are at Charlie
on TV.
Speaker 2 (34:06):
So I'm so wonderful part of the family.
Speaker 3 (34:08):
It's been a great experience so far, and I'm super
happy to have my voice back.
Speaker 1 (34:12):
Well, we are so happy that you decided to do this,
and I think that you are an inspiration to so
many young women and really people all across the country.
Just know that as many of those nasty comments as
you get on social media, there's thousands more people behind
you saying, give me a break. This woman's amazing.
Speaker 3 (34:28):
Absolutely, and hopefully that voice that louder one you just
mentioned gets even louder.
Speaker 1 (34:32):
I agree, absolutely, you are inspiring it. Charlie Arnault, thank
you so much for being on the podcast today. I
really appreciate it, of course, thank you so much. Yeah,
congratulations too, and good luck. You don't need luck though,
because what you're doing is already amazing.
Speaker 2 (34:48):
Oh, thank you so much.
Speaker 1 (34:49):
Appreciate that, and thank you all for joining us on
the Tutor Dixon Podcast. For this episode and others, go
to Tutor dixonpodcast dot com. You can subscribe right there
and make sure you join us the next time on
the Tutor Dixon Podcast. Have a great day.
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