In this conversation, Karol interviews Tiana Lowe Doescher, an economics columnist for the Washington Examiner. They discuss the state of the economy, the impact of government spending, and the connection between spending and inflation. They also touch on cultural issues and the importance of personal growth. Tiana shares her perspective on marriage and the value of asking for what you want and saying no when necessary. The Karol Markowicz Show is part of the Clay Travis & Buck Sexton Podcast Network - new episodes debut every Monday & Thursday.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:08):
Hi, and welcome back to the Carol Markowitz Show on iHeartRadio.
I'm home in Florida after a full month away. I
was in Bangkok, Hanoi, and Singapore, my first ever trip
to Asia. I posted some stuff about it on my
Instagram Carol in Public, and then I was in New
York with our family. Getting home to Florida has just
(00:29):
been amazing. The plane landed and I took this deep
breath and was just like, I get to live here.
I drive around with a smile on my face. I
have to admit to some summer winds and losses. I
largely failed at analog summer. I would say, it's really
(00:50):
not my fault. I'd wake up in Asia to one
thousand plus texts that President Trump had been shot or
Trump has picked jd Vance for his vice president. I've
wanted to disconnect like I'd done on previous years, but
I never had the news come and get me and
bring me back in such a way before. My friend
Dave Rubin of the Amazing Rubin Report does a very
(01:13):
serious version of this for the month of August every year,
where he locks his phone in a drawer and just
doesn't consume any news. No matter how big. I respect this,
obviously I do, and I wish I could do that
maybe someday. But I have a summer win and that's that.
I've been reading fiction, which was my overall goal for
(01:34):
this year. I'm eight books in and about halfway through
two other books. I know. That's just how I do it,
Like I have a book in my bag for when
I travel and then a book for when I'm home.
I need different books in different places. Honestly, it's been
a bit of a slog. I'm not going to lie
to you. I might just be picking the wrong books
(01:55):
because I only have one really recommendable book for you all.
The one book that I really loved so far is
City of Thieves by David Benioff. And it's not like
I'm only reading highbrow stuff either. I have beat reads.
I have more serious novels. It's a real mix of stuff.
So it's August first, and there are still a few
(02:17):
weeks left of summer. So if you have fiction recommendations
for me, please send them in Carol Markowitz Show at
gmail dot com. It's a bunch of weird spelling. K
A r O l M A r ko W I
C as and Charlie Zias and Zebra Show at gmail
dot com. And if you made summer resolutions for yourself,
(02:38):
as I know some of you did, because I've heard
from you, I'd love to hear how you're doing with them.
I heard from some people before the summer began who
were planning to do a dating app, Detox. If you
did one, I'd love to hear how it's going. Coming
up next, and interview with Tianna Lodsher join us after
the break. Hi, and welcome back to the Carol Markowitz
(03:01):
Show on iHeartRadio. My guest today is Tiana low desher
economics columnist for the Washington Examiner. I'm sorry I had
to say it so many times. Welcome Tiana.
Speaker 2 (03:12):
Hi. I know it's a lot of names and like
a big title.
Speaker 1 (03:15):
I for some reason struggled with the word economics, really struggled.
But thank you for hanging in there, and we're really
happy to have you on.
Speaker 2 (03:22):
Oh my gosh, of course, no, thank you for having me.
Speaker 1 (03:25):
So I love talking to people in kind of you know,
who write about the economy or finance, because it's really
not my world. And so my first question to you,
as it is to a lot of people who write
about this kind of stuff is how is it going?
Is it going to get any better?
Speaker 2 (03:43):
How?
Speaker 1 (03:43):
You know, where are we as a country on this?
Speaker 2 (03:46):
Oh man? I mean the funny thing about starting my
career in the Trump era and like at the end
of that, like Obama era, Trump era, the economy was
pretty boring to cover. You know, you had that slow
recovery from the Great Recession, but you had that sweet
spot of ultra low inflation, right, jump average below two
(04:07):
percent inflation target all four years, right, you had really
low interest rates, and you also did it while slowly
creeping up to what economists called full employment. Now you
know it was it was started with the massive with
the massive COVID spending, and then Biden really just lit
the economy on fire, because you know, when you add
up the Bipartisan Infrastructure Bill, American Rescue Plan, which alan
(04:30):
was like two trillion dollars.
Speaker 1 (04:33):
And.
Speaker 2 (04:36):
Inflation Reduction Act altogether, that's like an extra four trillion
on top of just the COVID spending and on top
of the trillions that we spend each year on just entitlements.
So on the meta perspective, it's great that we haven't
hit a recession yet, because the FED has done a
much better job than like say, in the seventies when
(04:58):
they dialed back those those you know, interest rate hikes,
they yo yod a lot, and then you got a
lot of rebound inflation. And they're not doing it. But
the issue is that right now we're dealing with a
president that is diametrically opposed to what the FED is doing.
Likely in the eighties you had Paul Volker who gets
like a lot of the credit, but he was working
(05:18):
with Ronald Reagan that was willing to dial back spending
and engage in like a lot of pro growth policies.
You have Joe Biden that is actively working against the
Federal Reserve right now. Like there's the way in which
everyone in Congress is complicit, and that's Republicans that refuse
to touch entitlements, Republicans that voted along for let's say,
the infrastructure package. But like still Joe Biden is taking
(05:41):
it a dramatic step further with you know, just just
something that's incredibly recent, these student loan bailouts. The CBO
just came out with their updates, so they did one
debt projection in February since February. So what is that
four months ago they have in crease their projection for
(06:01):
this year's deficit by four hundred billion dollars just because
of the student loan bailouts and the big bank bailouts
from like the FBIC had to be have to had
to backstop this year and last year. And so it's
not that my fear is, oh, we're going to hit
a recession, but that the big picture is is that
(06:25):
as long as the spending continues like this, even if
the Fed can keep that inflation, because it is we're
finally getting signed that it's going very very very slowly,
it's finally slowing down to that two percent rate. It's
that the interest rate environment I don't think is ever
going to get normal again. There's there's this collective delusion
(06:45):
that like we're going to go back to the era
of like those people who locked in a two point
seven percent individ rate in March of twenty twenty, They're
going to be in those homes foreverever. It's going to
be like a futal England because we're just never going
to get those into streets again. I don't see it,
like if you just look at how much we're already spending,
(07:05):
Like the amount the rate at that the government spends
on paying you know, interest on the national debt has
more than doubled in the last two years. So like,
if that's how bad the bond markets are, everything trickles
down from that, Like there's there's not much the Fed
can do. They can they can try and just keep
that overnight interest rate lower, but really it it when
(07:30):
the spending is this bad, you know, back in the day,
Ross Perrot is able to run as a populist by
explaining how government spending trickled down into not just inflation
but also high interest rates. And I'm waiting for you know,
for all the populous furor right now, I'm waiting for
there to be i mean more realistically going to come
(07:51):
from someone on the right than on the left, but
someone to take up that mantle of like populist fiscal responsibility.
We are all for this, Like refusing to do nothing
about social security is not benevolent to not just our
generation but our children and our grandchildren. They're gonna have
to fuck the both for that.
Speaker 1 (08:10):
Do you feel like people understand the connection between spending
and like how expensive things are in stores. I feel
like you're You're absolutely right. I don't think anybody is
making those connections. I completely don't think anybody's touching entitlements.
I think that's so off the table. I think Republicans
have to begin to brag about how they would never
touch entitlements, which is really different than it was, you know,
(08:33):
not that long ago, but so taking that off the table.
But just the general connection. Do you think the average
person understands that the amount that the government spends is
related to what happens to them at the grocery store.
Speaker 2 (08:49):
I think they understand it, or at least on like
a gut level, they feel it a lot more than
they did four years ago, because you see, like the
fact that voters not just to rate the economy in
general poorly rate their own finances pretty poorly or at
best mediocre, and also blame Biden's policies in particular, right,
(09:11):
because yeah, world leaders across the West, the G seven,
they're all pretty poorly rated. But Biden gets hammered in
the particulars like people specifically say that his spending is
in part to blame. Did they understand the minutia of it?
I don't think so. But I was shocked to see
(09:32):
how badly the student debt relief, not just how badly
it polls explicitly, like when people ask like do you
approve of this? Because like that you kind of expect,
but just it has not made a difference when it
comes to the youth vote, like his key is. Harryenton
from CNN was breaking down the polling among African American
(09:53):
voters by age, and it's like African American voter is
over fifty, they have basically stayed with Biden and like
the same amount. It's all those younger than fifty that
have been running away from him. Trump could be doing
better with Black voters in this election than any Republican
since Richard Nixon, which tells you something about how bad
these things are.
Speaker 1 (10:13):
So, what's your if you had to guess today what
the percentage of the Black vote that Donald Trump's gonna get?
Do you have a number? I like to take overs
and unders, so you know, set the bar for me.
Speaker 2 (10:26):
I mean if it's twenty. If he gets twenty percent,
it's game over.
Speaker 1 (10:30):
Oh if he gets twenty percent, I think that's the
end of the Democratic Party.
Speaker 2 (10:33):
Yeah, how do you rebuild that coalition? I've never seen
so many like own goals made. Biden his mandate in
office was come into office, be nice, otld uncle Joe,
don't be a jerk like Trump, and just do nothing.
Trump made the vaccines, the pandemic was over, and he could,
(10:55):
you know, just take credit saying I'm distributing the vaccines,
and you know.
Speaker 1 (10:58):
Pass.
Speaker 2 (11:00):
Quarter trillion dollar green nuclear jobs guarantee or something. You know,
it would be the biggest climate package ever passed. You
get credit for it, and then just make way for
someone else to take over in four years and instead
come and spend all this money. Give Americans the like
(11:20):
for for most of the electorate, they have never experienced
real inflation before, and they have decided they hate it.
Theoretically again, yeah, you people in the past. You know,
the big the big thing in the twenty tens was
income inequality, income inequality, income inequality.
Speaker 3 (11:35):
Has We've reversed something like the last forty years of
income inequality expansion since like the Reagan era, just post COVID,
and Americans have decided to hate it.
Speaker 1 (11:47):
Right, So it's it's because then the incomes have gone down.
It's not like our spending power has gone down. Nobody,
nobody got lifted up. Everybody you know equal always ends
up being the helvist common denominator, and it's every it's
gotten poorer, and you feel it. You feel like shocked
at the stores and you see it all the time.
And I asked, like my Twitter following recently, you know
(12:08):
where they feel inflation the most, and the number one
answer was obviously food. But then you have these stories
like you constantly see sort of the messaging on the
left becoming well, look, America spends the lowest number percentage
of on average, the lowest percentage of their income on
groceries compared to like Russia and Europe and lots of
(12:31):
other places that they looked at. But that doesn't make
me feel better when right you said the grocery store
is insanely high. It's like, it's these arguments kind of
don't make sense to me.
Speaker 2 (12:42):
No. And also, we are the whole point of America
of US bankrolling the medical R and D for the world. Right,
we're four percent of the world's population, and we and
we and we invest forty four percent of all global
medical R and D of US funding more than the
next twenty largest militaries combined. Part of that is supposed
(13:05):
to be like the return on that investment is a
higher quality of life then you would get in let's
say a Scandinavian country where yeah, they report really high
life satisfaction, but they are in large part there's there's
somewhat of free riders when it comes to global stability.
Global supply chains now unfortunately a very relevant thing when
(13:25):
we talk about Biden letting HOUTI pirates takedown ship. Yeah no, yeah,
that that crap on those boats. We actually need that,
like when you're able to when when we were able
to spend three years with people in the laptop class
being like, oh this isn't a lockdown. I can still
order things on Amazon and get them in two days.
Speaker 1 (13:44):
How breeds comes to my door? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (13:46):
How do that? That happens because we secure the supply chains.
And if you just let over a bunch of eighth
century warlord pirates take over the Red Sea, oh no,
that goes away, and then you learn free trade is
not nothing, it's free.
Speaker 1 (14:02):
So a question that I ask all of my guests,
and I'm wondering what you're gonna say here, because a
lot of times I know what the answer is going
to be, but I don't know yours. What do you
think is our largest cultural problem? Like if you had
to pick something that we are just in trouble over.
Speaker 2 (14:18):
Yeah, So I really thought about this because my instinct
is always to go to the economic. But I know
you say cultural, and I actually, to an extent, think
that there's someone interconnected. This is knowing your background. I
have a feeling you'll say yes to this. Are you
familiar with the Kurt Vonnegut short story Harrison Vergeron, Yeah,
so Harrison Verseron to listeners who aren't familiar with it.
(14:40):
It's a dystopian fictional short story where there's effectively a
Marxist Lendonist government where no one can be better than anyone.
So I need to Vallerina. Yeah, and you're beautiful, you
have to weight on your ankles. And if you're beautiful,
you need to wear a mask. And the intelligency I
have to have, like your pieces in that buzz really
loudly every fifteen seconds so they can't p straight, so
(15:00):
that no one's smarter, no one's more beautiful, no one's
more skilled. And I kind of think the Harrison there
is a Harrison bergeron mindset that despite the fact that
we've never had it better in like the meta perspective literacy,
child mortality, poverty, hunger. You know, on a global we've
(15:22):
proven you know, the Malfusian method is wrong. Growth is
everything and everyone's better off. A rising tide lifts all
both Culturally, we've never adopted this Harrison bruiseron type mentality
at all levels of society. You see it in San
Francisco where they say, in the name of equity, we
(15:42):
have to engage in d tracking so Asian, so poor
Asian students can't take algebra in eighth grade because everyone
to be equal. You know, you see it in the
idea of the Coalition of the dispossessed backing Hamas even
though if you're you know, transgender, queer, lesbian, who you're
like me, you're a girl that likes to wear short experts.
But they would behead us in an instant if we
(16:03):
stepped foot in Gaza, right, But they have decide because
they can't see Israel being wealthy and Gaza being very poor,
and they have to blame Israel. They can't blame it
on poor governance and a backwards ideology It's the same
thing as the de Growthers, the Greta Thunberg's saying that
no nuclear and Elon Musk aren't going to save us
(16:24):
from climate change.
Speaker 3 (16:25):
We need to just stop all economic advancement.
Speaker 2 (16:28):
And the same thing as you know, unions themselves, unions
which used to be champions of the people within them,
we now see them dramatically just shifted inwards. They're just
the Coldian circle and firing squads where the New York
Times Guild make sure that you know, disproportionately Jews or
(16:50):
people can perceived as right leaning get ousted from the
New York Times. You saw what they did for Barry Weiss,
putting an act next to her name and all of
it to tether together my very highbrow and are not
very high more hybro analogy with a much lower brow analogy.
It's like, to me, the most important scene in the
(17:11):
movie Mean Girls, the timeless classic starring Lindsay Lohan.
Speaker 1 (17:14):
That's a good one.
Speaker 2 (17:15):
Doesn't matter if you are sitting across from a girl
and you call her ugly, or you call her stupid,
or you say she's less popular. You can say all
those things, and you can even make them true. But
it doesn't make you any better looking, it doesn't make
you any smarter, and we've forgotten that lesson despite all
the abundance that we see and that we see that
I benefit from trading with people in other countries, and
(17:38):
I benefit from when my coworkers get other professional opportunities
because that makes our brand and our magazine get more viewership.
Just cultures. It's a sick, sad thing, and I think
it does kind of permeate a vast swath of the
political sector because it disproportionately and most in a most
(17:59):
toxic form is on the left, but I do see
it a bit on the right. And that's what scares
me a bit about some of the national conservative rhetoric
when it comes to economics and trade, because no, like, obviously,
you know, screw China, let's punish China, let's try let's
punish you wrong. But put us trading with France and
US trading with Germany. That makes us all wealthier.
Speaker 1 (18:20):
We're going to take a quick break and be right
back on the Carol Marcowitch Show. So it's interesting. I
almost never curse, especially on the show, but I have
to say this line. It's a Jay Z line, and
he has this line that I always like, really relate to,
and it's what you eat don't make me shit. And
I just always found that to be such a great
(18:41):
kind of outlook on life, Like you succeeding is not
making me not succeed. That's got nothing to do with anything.
And also, I think you should write a book on
all of this. I think that the analogies that you
just put together are really interesting. I would I'm like,
I would like to read more about this, but you know,
I really think that you you should pitch a book
(19:01):
on this because this is it's an interesting concept that
I haven't heard of before. You know, tie it to
Vana got In. Uh. I think that that's the way
to go.
Speaker 2 (19:09):
Mary. High praise from the best selling author herself.
Speaker 1 (19:13):
Do you have a book in the works?
Speaker 2 (19:15):
Oh my, well, that's that's like one of my goals,
and that like really has been you know. I I
actually did pitch a book where the concept was somewhat decent,
but it was right as COVID hit because I was
just going to talk about the birth and death slash
suicide of me too from Bill Clinton to the Grek
(19:36):
Kavanaugh confirmation. But there was the paper shortage that came
at like the beginning of COVID and my book because
of that. Yeah, and so the agent I was talking
to was like, yeah, if you if you have never
published anything and you don't have like a big muscle
behind you, it's impossible. And so I was like, and
that moment just passed because now you know, I think once,
(19:58):
once the Vice President went to go visit Jacob Blake,
a convicted domestic abuser, in the name of BLM, it
really proved me too, was dead, stomped on, would be
sacrificed for BLM, would be sacrificed for you know, Queers
for Palestine, all that so so fast.
Speaker 1 (20:15):
Yeah, what was me too? Who could even remember?
Speaker 2 (20:19):
It was just some collective drug dream we all had together.
Speaker 1 (20:23):
So you you're a columnist at the Washington Examiner. You're
recently married. How long are you're married now?
Speaker 2 (20:30):
A year and two months, two months, a year and two.
Speaker 1 (20:33):
Months, how's newlywed life?
Speaker 2 (20:37):
I Okay, this might sound like I'm bsing, but it
is dramatically easier than pre married life. Like I was.
I was never someone that like fantasized about like my
wedding day itself, because I when it comes to things
with like a lot of people, I can be like
a bit of a control freak. You know, you've multiple
(20:57):
people coming to live in. I was like, you know,
I you know, I had a great wedding. It was
a little bit more low key, just because we're like
we in this economy, what else could we do? But
also I was just like I'm just so excited just
to be married. And I was talking to my husband
one day where I was like, I had a great
time on our wedding. It was great to have. You know,
(21:17):
he's from Detroit, I'm from Los Angeles. Like we don't
usually have all of our families and all of our
friends in one place. But I was like, in a
strange way, it feels like every day that has come
after has been better than our wedding day, just because
I mean I.
Speaker 1 (21:31):
I got to do it. You know that that means
something good?
Speaker 2 (21:35):
Yeah, and classic you know, urban sex and the city generation.
Young's millennial becomes progressively more socially conservative as she settles
down and gets married.
Speaker 1 (21:47):
And all that.
Speaker 2 (21:48):
It happens, but there is something to be said about,
like like how much time did I waste on like
being sing? Not that I have any regrets because everything
I did me to my guy and he's just like
my person.
Speaker 1 (22:02):
So yeah, I've got a I've got a great video
of you doing karaoke in New York, and you know,
I really can't be replaced, and I, oh will I
will be holding that at Ransom self.
Speaker 2 (22:15):
Oh man, oh MyD I can say I mostly remember
that night.
Speaker 1 (22:19):
So you are married now, you have, you know, a
great career. Do you feel like you've made it?
Speaker 2 (22:25):
You know, it's funny maybe even like a year ago,
I would have just instinctively said, like categorical no, because
I do think it's important to like keep on hustling.
And you know, I have so many professional ambitions that
I that I see on my horizon, you know, like
writing a book Carol right, living at my dream. You know,
(22:46):
we we do want to have kids at some point.
Like so, so there are those things. But like just
to be a little bit oh god, I'm gonna sound
so sappy and millennial, just to be like a little
bit kinder to myself, I would like to say I've
made it in like a state of like me being
(23:09):
very happily married in a home that I love and
I have like the mental energy to actually like decorate
and keep really nice and host fun dinner parties. Yeah,
Like I just mentally was not in that place five
years ago. Like I was just internally way too chaotic.
I wouldn't have made a good spouse to anyone. So,
like I do kind of want to say I've made
(23:30):
it in some respect of just of being the person
that is worthy of those things and you know, continually
trying to better myself constantly. Yeah, But like I think
it's important to compartmentalize, like the difference between making it
in our goals here on earth and making it from like.
Speaker 3 (23:51):
A spiritual perspective.
Speaker 2 (23:53):
Some people more like I'm making it in like a
you know, if I'm in a car crash tomorrow and
like I meet my maker, I forbid, They'll be like,
you know, Tiana, you've actually done to done a good
deal to make yourself a better person. Yeah, And look, personal.
Speaker 1 (24:09):
Growth is what it's all about, right, Like, yeah, I
love that you Also, it's very very relatable. I was
also kind of chaotic before I settled down and got married.
I mean, look, it's a stabilizing force. It's not just
a stabilizing force for men. I think a lot of
people make that mistake, and they think that only men
are kind of made better by the institution of marriage.
(24:30):
But I think very much women too, you know, we better,
we become our better selves.
Speaker 2 (24:35):
Absolutely, Like I have a couple of very stereotypical like
female characteristics. I'm agreeable to a fault, like in a
way where it makes me in conflict resolution historically not
super effective. I am highly neurotic, and marriage has totally
improved me on both fronts. And in the same way
(24:56):
I would say, you know, I think my husband and
I are both much better people today than we were,
you know, a year and two months ago. So I'm
I'm I almost like hate the fact that weddings get
such hype and like marriage itself, and just like the
fun of like we aren't focusing on two rents, Like
(25:16):
all of our friends are kind of shared at this point,
Like when we throw a dinner party, it's our dinner party.
Like just all like these little things that I think
are especially in this era where people just aren't getting married,
which I know you've talked about a billion times. And
Tim Carney, my colleague, has written multiple books about but like.
Speaker 1 (25:34):
He's been on the show.
Speaker 2 (25:35):
Yeah, yeah, and now that I and now that I
like am living at him like ah, okay, I see
the other side, right, like that one tweet that was
like dating as gen Z or is like getting married
as gen Z, like like writing at the last, like
the last chopper leaving the last right. Probably I never
I never had to use a dating app, thank god,
(25:56):
because I'm I'm twenty eight, so like I was still
in the era where like, you know, guys asked you
out and girls actually said yes and didn't just say
like me to me, to me too.
Speaker 1 (26:07):
So yeah, yeah, and totally I missed the dating app.
I mean, you know, I sometimes feel like that would
have been fun, but no, you know, then you hear
the stories. The stories are like, no, it's actually not
at all fun. It's hell on earth, and you know
that's I'm sure that that's true. So and here with
your best tip for my listeners on how they can
(26:29):
improve their lives.
Speaker 2 (26:30):
Okay, So I actually I've been thinking about this because
I'm bad with self help stuff because I'm very hypercritical.
But I think no one to ask for something, no
one to say yes, and no one to say no,
just because when I see a lot of young people
they're just in this state of inertia where they don't
(26:52):
do any of these things. It's they don't ask to.
Like one of the things I love about my husband
is like when he moved out to DC many moons ago,
because he's like ten years older than me, he literally
worked in the Bush White House he moved out here,
he would go to church and just introduce himself to
people and say like, hey, I'm new here. I kind
of need like some like male mentorship, and that's amazing.
(27:14):
He has friends everywhere on the planet. He has friends
in Albany, have friends in New Zealand, and I just
love that. And like, I'm a similar ish person, Like
I'm less forward maybe like in that way, but I've
always been someone that like has asked for things if
I don't have what I want or what I need,
and also have always been very forceful and saying no
if I don't want something. And I just especially with God,
(27:36):
I think I see it with men. They don't ask
for things. They don't ask girls out, they don't ask
for promotions, they don't ask for jobs. And I'm speaking
more specifically to younger people because I don't know how
much advice I have for people who are older than me.
That feels presumptuous, but like for girls also like make
your yeses mean yes and your nose me no, like
don't And that was like a big conversation, you know,
(27:56):
with like Christine Emba's book when she was talking about
like was sexual revolution of failure or not? Like consent
can't be the only thing that matters, of course, not
like like your pleasure and agency also matter if you're
on a date, like don't just passively just say, oh, well,
I guess I should like make your guests mean yes,
yes because I want to do something and no because
no I don't want to. And I guess my second
(28:19):
thing this is more pertinent to like everyone is you know,
this country was built by pioneers that left home, and
like I know you and I have done, especially in
your childhood, but like even now, you did New York
to Florida. I did after university. He did Los Angeles
to DC, My husband did Detroit to DC. And I see,
(28:41):
like moving far from family getting like a pretty bad
rap these days. And like, of course, when we talk
about like a political sense, like places that are left behind,
that is not good when we use bad government policy
to rig against certain states or certain like that is
not good. But on like an individual level, if you
(29:01):
don't like your life, you know, don't abandon your spouse
and kids. But if you're single and you don't love
your job, change it, go somewhere else. You can always
make new friends, you can always find a new career.
If you're not finding you know, the romantic partner you like,
go like, just just just have agency. Just know, like,
this country is successful because we brought in millions of
(29:24):
those archetypes of people that left home to find something better.
Speaker 1 (29:27):
I love that, And you know it doesn't only apply
to single people. You can also I think you know,
if you're if you're not loving the place that you're
raising your kids, and moving is hard, it's expensive. I
get all of that, but do it. Your life is short,
you know, especially childhood is short. I think I'm all
about that. Thank you so much for coming on. Love
talking to Tiana lodsher. Check her out, She's really fantastic.
(29:50):
Her Twitter is Tiana the First Right, Yes, and check
her out of The Washington Examiner. Thank you so much,
Thank you, Caro, thanks so much for joining us on
the Carol Markowitz Show. Subscribe wherever you get your podcasts.
Hi, and welcome back to the Carol Markowitz Show on iHeartRadio.
I'm home in Florida after a full month away. I
was in Bangkok, Hanoi, and Singapore, my first ever trip
to Asia. I posted some stuff about it on my
Instagram Carol in Public, and then I was in New
York with our family. Getting home to Florida has just
(00:29):
been amazing. The plane landed and I took this deep
breath and was just like, I get to live here.
I drive around with a smile on my face. I
have to admit to some summer winds and losses. I
largely failed at analog summer. I would say, it's really
(00:50):
not my fault. I'd wake up in Asia to one
thousand plus texts that President Trump had been shot or
Trump has picked jd Vance for his vice president. I've
wanted to disconnect like I'd done on previous years, but
I never had the news come and get me and
bring me back in such a way before. My friend
Dave Rubin of the Amazing Rubin Report does a very
(01:13):
serious version of this for the month of August every year,
where he locks his phone in a drawer and just
doesn't consume any news. No matter how big. I respect this,
obviously I do, and I wish I could do that
maybe someday. But I have a summer win and that's that.
I've been reading fiction, which was my overall goal for
(01:34):
this year. I'm eight books in and about halfway through
two other books. I know. That's just how I do it,
Like I have a book in my bag for when
I travel and then a book for when I'm home.
I need different books in different places. Honestly, it's been
a bit of a slog. I'm not going to lie
to you. I might just be picking the wrong books
(01:55):
because I only have one really recommendable book for you all.
The one book that I really loved so far is
City of Thieves by David Benioff. And it's not like
I'm only reading highbrow stuff either. I have beat reads.
I have more serious novels. It's a real mix of stuff.
So it's August first, and there are still a few
(02:17):
weeks left of summer. So if you have fiction recommendations
for me, please send them in Carol Markowitz Show at
gmail dot com. It's a bunch of weird spelling. K
A r O l M A r ko W I
C as and Charlie Zias and Zebra Show at gmail
dot com. And if you made summer resolutions for yourself,
(02:38):
as I know some of you did, because I've heard
from you, I'd love to hear how you're doing with them.
I heard from some people before the summer began who
were planning to do a dating app, Detox. If you
did one, I'd love to hear how it's going. Coming
up next, and interview with Tianna Lodsher join us after
the break. Hi, and welcome back to the Carol Markowitz
(03:01):
Show on iHeartRadio. My guest today is Tiana low desher
economics columnist for the Washington Examiner. I'm sorry I had
to say it so many times. Welcome Tiana.
Speaker 2 (03:12):
Hi. I know it's a lot of names and like
a big title.
Speaker 1 (03:15):
I for some reason struggled with the word economics, really struggled.
But thank you for hanging in there, and we're really
happy to have you on.
Speaker 2 (03:22):
Oh my gosh, of course, no, thank you for having me.
Speaker 1 (03:25):
So I love talking to people in kind of you know,
who write about the economy or finance, because it's really
not my world. And so my first question to you,
as it is to a lot of people who write
about this kind of stuff is how is it going?
Is it going to get any better?
Speaker 2 (03:43):
How?
Speaker 1 (03:43):
You know, where are we as a country on this?
Speaker 2 (03:46):
Oh man? I mean the funny thing about starting my
career in the Trump era and like at the end
of that, like Obama era, Trump era, the economy was
pretty boring to cover. You know, you had that slow
recovery from the Great Recession, but you had that sweet
spot of ultra low inflation, right, jump average below two
(04:07):
percent inflation target all four years, right, you had really
low interest rates, and you also did it while slowly
creeping up to what economists called full employment. Now you
know it was it was started with the massive with
the massive COVID spending, and then Biden really just lit
the economy on fire, because you know, when you add
up the Bipartisan Infrastructure Bill, American Rescue Plan, which alan
(04:30):
was like two trillion dollars.
Speaker 1 (04:33):
And.
Speaker 2 (04:36):
Inflation Reduction Act altogether, that's like an extra four trillion
on top of just the COVID spending and on top
of the trillions that we spend each year on just entitlements.
So on the meta perspective, it's great that we haven't
hit a recession yet, because the FED has done a
much better job than like say, in the seventies when
(04:58):
they dialed back those those you know, interest rate hikes,
they yo yod a lot, and then you got a
lot of rebound inflation. And they're not doing it. But
the issue is that right now we're dealing with a
president that is diametrically opposed to what the FED is doing.
Likely in the eighties you had Paul Volker who gets
like a lot of the credit, but he was working
(05:18):
with Ronald Reagan that was willing to dial back spending
and engage in like a lot of pro growth policies.
You have Joe Biden that is actively working against the
Federal Reserve right now. Like there's the way in which
everyone in Congress is complicit, and that's Republicans that refuse
to touch entitlements, Republicans that voted along for let's say,
the infrastructure package. But like still Joe Biden is taking
(05:41):
it a dramatic step further with you know, just just
something that's incredibly recent, these student loan bailouts. The CBO
just came out with their updates, so they did one
debt projection in February since February. So what is that
four months ago they have in crease their projection for
(06:01):
this year's deficit by four hundred billion dollars just because
of the student loan bailouts and the big bank bailouts
from like the FBIC had to be have to had
to backstop this year and last year. And so it's
not that my fear is, oh, we're going to hit
a recession, but that the big picture is is that
(06:25):
as long as the spending continues like this, even if
the Fed can keep that inflation, because it is we're
finally getting signed that it's going very very very slowly,
it's finally slowing down to that two percent rate. It's
that the interest rate environment I don't think is ever
going to get normal again. There's there's this collective delusion
(06:45):
that like we're going to go back to the era
of like those people who locked in a two point
seven percent individ rate in March of twenty twenty, They're
going to be in those homes foreverever. It's going to
be like a futal England because we're just never going
to get those into streets again. I don't see it,
like if you just look at how much we're already spending,
(07:05):
Like the amount the rate at that the government spends
on paying you know, interest on the national debt has
more than doubled in the last two years. So like,
if that's how bad the bond markets are, everything trickles
down from that, Like there's there's not much the Fed
can do. They can they can try and just keep
that overnight interest rate lower, but really it it when
(07:30):
the spending is this bad, you know, back in the day,
Ross Perrot is able to run as a populist by
explaining how government spending trickled down into not just inflation
but also high interest rates. And I'm waiting for you know,
for all the populous furor right now, I'm waiting for
there to be i mean more realistically going to come
(07:51):
from someone on the right than on the left, but
someone to take up that mantle of like populist fiscal responsibility.
We are all for this, Like refusing to do nothing
about social security is not benevolent to not just our
generation but our children and our grandchildren. They're gonna have
to fuck the both for that.
Speaker 1 (08:10):
Do you feel like people understand the connection between spending
and like how expensive things are in stores. I feel
like you're You're absolutely right. I don't think anybody is
making those connections. I completely don't think anybody's touching entitlements.
I think that's so off the table. I think Republicans
have to begin to brag about how they would never
touch entitlements, which is really different than it was, you know,
(08:33):
not that long ago, but so taking that off the table.
But just the general connection. Do you think the average
person understands that the amount that the government spends is
related to what happens to them at the grocery store.
Speaker 2 (08:49):
I think they understand it, or at least on like
a gut level, they feel it a lot more than
they did four years ago, because you see, like the
fact that voters not just to rate the economy in
general poorly rate their own finances pretty poorly or at
best mediocre, and also blame Biden's policies in particular, right,
(09:11):
because yeah, world leaders across the West, the G seven,
they're all pretty poorly rated. But Biden gets hammered in
the particulars like people specifically say that his spending is
in part to blame. Did they understand the minutia of it?
I don't think so. But I was shocked to see
(09:32):
how badly the student debt relief, not just how badly
it polls explicitly, like when people ask like do you
approve of this? Because like that you kind of expect,
but just it has not made a difference when it
comes to the youth vote, like his key is. Harryenton
from CNN was breaking down the polling among African American
(09:53):
voters by age, and it's like African American voter is
over fifty, they have basically stayed with Biden and like
the same amount. It's all those younger than fifty that
have been running away from him. Trump could be doing
better with Black voters in this election than any Republican
since Richard Nixon, which tells you something about how bad
these things are.
Speaker 1 (10:13):
So, what's your if you had to guess today what
the percentage of the Black vote that Donald Trump's gonna get?
Do you have a number? I like to take overs
and unders, so you know, set the bar for me.
Speaker 2 (10:26):
I mean if it's twenty. If he gets twenty percent,
it's game over.
Speaker 1 (10:30):
Oh if he gets twenty percent, I think that's the
end of the Democratic Party.
Speaker 2 (10:33):
Yeah, how do you rebuild that coalition? I've never seen
so many like own goals made. Biden his mandate in
office was come into office, be nice, otld uncle Joe,
don't be a jerk like Trump, and just do nothing.
Trump made the vaccines, the pandemic was over, and he could,
(10:55):
you know, just take credit saying I'm distributing the vaccines,
and you know.
Speaker 1 (10:58):
Pass.
Speaker 2 (11:00):
Quarter trillion dollar green nuclear jobs guarantee or something. You know,
it would be the biggest climate package ever passed. You
get credit for it, and then just make way for
someone else to take over in four years and instead
come and spend all this money. Give Americans the like
(11:20):
for for most of the electorate, they have never experienced
real inflation before, and they have decided they hate it.
Theoretically again, yeah, you people in the past. You know,
the big the big thing in the twenty tens was
income inequality, income inequality, income inequality.
Speaker 3 (11:35):
Has We've reversed something like the last forty years of
income inequality expansion since like the Reagan era, just post COVID,
and Americans have decided to hate it.
Speaker 1 (11:47):
Right, So it's it's because then the incomes have gone down.
It's not like our spending power has gone down. Nobody,
nobody got lifted up. Everybody you know equal always ends
up being the helvist common denominator, and it's every it's
gotten poorer, and you feel it. You feel like shocked
at the stores and you see it all the time.
And I asked, like my Twitter following recently, you know
(12:08):
where they feel inflation the most, and the number one
answer was obviously food. But then you have these stories
like you constantly see sort of the messaging on the
left becoming well, look, America spends the lowest number percentage
of on average, the lowest percentage of their income on
groceries compared to like Russia and Europe and lots of
(12:31):
other places that they looked at. But that doesn't make
me feel better when right you said the grocery store
is insanely high. It's like, it's these arguments kind of
don't make sense to me.
Speaker 2 (12:42):
No. And also, we are the whole point of America
of US bankrolling the medical R and D for the world. Right,
we're four percent of the world's population, and we and
we and we invest forty four percent of all global
medical R and D of US funding more than the
next twenty largest militaries combined. Part of that is supposed
(13:05):
to be like the return on that investment is a
higher quality of life then you would get in let's
say a Scandinavian country where yeah, they report really high
life satisfaction, but they are in large part there's there's
somewhat of free riders when it comes to global stability.
Global supply chains now unfortunately a very relevant thing when
(13:25):
we talk about Biden letting HOUTI pirates takedown ship. Yeah no, yeah,
that that crap on those boats. We actually need that,
like when you're able to when when we were able
to spend three years with people in the laptop class
being like, oh this isn't a lockdown. I can still
order things on Amazon and get them in two days.
Speaker 1 (13:44):
How breeds comes to my door? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (13:46):
How do that? That happens because we secure the supply chains.
And if you just let over a bunch of eighth
century warlord pirates take over the Red Sea, oh no,
that goes away, and then you learn free trade is
not nothing, it's free.
Speaker 1 (14:02):
So a question that I ask all of my guests,
and I'm wondering what you're gonna say here, because a
lot of times I know what the answer is going
to be, but I don't know yours. What do you
think is our largest cultural problem? Like if you had
to pick something that we are just in trouble over.
Speaker 2 (14:18):
Yeah, So I really thought about this because my instinct
is always to go to the economic. But I know
you say cultural, and I actually, to an extent, think
that there's someone interconnected. This is knowing your background. I
have a feeling you'll say yes to this. Are you
familiar with the Kurt Vonnegut short story Harrison Vergeron, Yeah,
so Harrison Verseron to listeners who aren't familiar with it.
(14:40):
It's a dystopian fictional short story where there's effectively a
Marxist Lendonist government where no one can be better than anyone.
So I need to Vallerina. Yeah, and you're beautiful, you
have to weight on your ankles. And if you're beautiful,
you need to wear a mask. And the intelligency I
have to have, like your pieces in that buzz really
loudly every fifteen seconds so they can't p straight, so
(15:00):
that no one's smarter, no one's more beautiful, no one's
more skilled. And I kind of think the Harrison there
is a Harrison bergeron mindset that despite the fact that
we've never had it better in like the meta perspective literacy,
child mortality, poverty, hunger. You know, on a global we've
(15:22):
proven you know, the Malfusian method is wrong. Growth is
everything and everyone's better off. A rising tide lifts all
both Culturally, we've never adopted this Harrison bruiseron type mentality
at all levels of society. You see it in San
Francisco where they say, in the name of equity, we
(15:42):
have to engage in d tracking so Asian, so poor
Asian students can't take algebra in eighth grade because everyone
to be equal. You know, you see it in the
idea of the Coalition of the dispossessed backing Hamas even
though if you're you know, transgender, queer, lesbian, who you're
like me, you're a girl that likes to wear short experts.
But they would behead us in an instant if we
(16:03):
stepped foot in Gaza, right, But they have decide because
they can't see Israel being wealthy and Gaza being very poor,
and they have to blame Israel. They can't blame it
on poor governance and a backwards ideology It's the same
thing as the de Growthers, the Greta Thunberg's saying that
no nuclear and Elon Musk aren't going to save us
(16:24):
from climate change.
Speaker 3 (16:25):
We need to just stop all economic advancement.
Speaker 2 (16:28):
And the same thing as you know, unions themselves, unions
which used to be champions of the people within them,
we now see them dramatically just shifted inwards. They're just
the Coldian circle and firing squads where the New York
Times Guild make sure that you know, disproportionately Jews or
(16:50):
people can perceived as right leaning get ousted from the
New York Times. You saw what they did for Barry Weiss,
putting an act next to her name and all of
it to tether together my very highbrow and are not
very high more hybro analogy with a much lower brow analogy.
It's like, to me, the most important scene in the
(17:11):
movie Mean Girls, the timeless classic starring Lindsay Lohan.
Speaker 1 (17:14):
That's a good one.
Speaker 2 (17:15):
Doesn't matter if you are sitting across from a girl
and you call her ugly, or you call her stupid,
or you say she's less popular. You can say all
those things, and you can even make them true. But
it doesn't make you any better looking, it doesn't make
you any smarter, and we've forgotten that lesson despite all
the abundance that we see and that we see that
I benefit from trading with people in other countries, and
(17:38):
I benefit from when my coworkers get other professional opportunities
because that makes our brand and our magazine get more viewership.
Just cultures. It's a sick, sad thing, and I think
it does kind of permeate a vast swath of the
political sector because it disproportionately and most in a most
(17:59):
toxic form is on the left, but I do see
it a bit on the right. And that's what scares
me a bit about some of the national conservative rhetoric
when it comes to economics and trade, because no, like, obviously,
you know, screw China, let's punish China, let's try let's
punish you wrong. But put us trading with France and
US trading with Germany. That makes us all wealthier.
Speaker 1 (18:20):
We're going to take a quick break and be right
back on the Carol Marcowitch Show. So it's interesting. I
almost never curse, especially on the show, but I have
to say this line. It's a Jay Z line, and
he has this line that I always like, really relate to,
and it's what you eat don't make me shit. And
I just always found that to be such a great
(18:41):
kind of outlook on life, Like you succeeding is not
making me not succeed. That's got nothing to do with anything.
And also, I think you should write a book on
all of this. I think that the analogies that you
just put together are really interesting. I would I'm like,
I would like to read more about this, but you know,
I really think that you you should pitch a book
(19:01):
on this because this is it's an interesting concept that
I haven't heard of before. You know, tie it to
Vana got In. Uh. I think that that's the way
to go.
Speaker 2 (19:09):
Mary. High praise from the best selling author herself.
Speaker 1 (19:13):
Do you have a book in the works?
Speaker 2 (19:15):
Oh my, well, that's that's like one of my goals,
and that like really has been you know. I I
actually did pitch a book where the concept was somewhat decent,
but it was right as COVID hit because I was
just going to talk about the birth and death slash
suicide of me too from Bill Clinton to the Grek
(19:36):
Kavanaugh confirmation. But there was the paper shortage that came
at like the beginning of COVID and my book because
of that. Yeah, and so the agent I was talking
to was like, yeah, if you if you have never
published anything and you don't have like a big muscle
behind you, it's impossible. And so I was like, and
that moment just passed because now you know, I think once,
(19:58):
once the Vice President went to go visit Jacob Blake,
a convicted domestic abuser, in the name of BLM, it
really proved me too, was dead, stomped on, would be
sacrificed for BLM, would be sacrificed for you know, Queers
for Palestine, all that so so fast.
Speaker 1 (20:15):
Yeah, what was me too? Who could even remember?
Speaker 2 (20:19):
It was just some collective drug dream we all had together.
Speaker 1 (20:23):
So you you're a columnist at the Washington Examiner. You're
recently married. How long are you're married now?
Speaker 2 (20:30):
A year and two months, two months, a year and two.
Speaker 1 (20:33):
Months, how's newlywed life?
Speaker 2 (20:37):
I Okay, this might sound like I'm bsing, but it
is dramatically easier than pre married life. Like I was.
I was never someone that like fantasized about like my
wedding day itself, because I when it comes to things
with like a lot of people, I can be like
a bit of a control freak. You know, you've multiple
(20:57):
people coming to live in. I was like, you know,
I you know, I had a great wedding. It was
a little bit more low key, just because we're like
we in this economy, what else could we do? But
also I was just like I'm just so excited just
to be married. And I was talking to my husband
one day where I was like, I had a great
time on our wedding. It was great to have. You know,
(21:17):
he's from Detroit, I'm from Los Angeles. Like we don't
usually have all of our families and all of our
friends in one place. But I was like, in a
strange way, it feels like every day that has come
after has been better than our wedding day, just because
I mean I.
Speaker 1 (21:31):
I got to do it. You know that that means
something good?
Speaker 2 (21:35):
Yeah, and classic you know, urban sex and the city generation.
Young's millennial becomes progressively more socially conservative as she settles
down and gets married.
Speaker 1 (21:47):
And all that.
Speaker 2 (21:48):
It happens, but there is something to be said about,
like like how much time did I waste on like
being sing? Not that I have any regrets because everything
I did me to my guy and he's just like
my person.
Speaker 1 (22:02):
So yeah, I've got a I've got a great video
of you doing karaoke in New York, and you know,
I really can't be replaced, and I, oh will I
will be holding that at Ransom self.
Speaker 2 (22:15):
Oh man, oh MyD I can say I mostly remember
that night.
Speaker 1 (22:19):
So you are married now, you have, you know, a
great career. Do you feel like you've made it?
Speaker 2 (22:25):
You know, it's funny maybe even like a year ago,
I would have just instinctively said, like categorical no, because
I do think it's important to like keep on hustling.
And you know, I have so many professional ambitions that
I that I see on my horizon, you know, like
writing a book Carol right, living at my dream. You know,
(22:46):
we we do want to have kids at some point.
Like so, so there are those things. But like just
to be a little bit oh god, I'm gonna sound
so sappy and millennial, just to be like a little
bit kinder to myself, I would like to say I've
made it in like a state of like me being
(23:09):
very happily married in a home that I love and
I have like the mental energy to actually like decorate
and keep really nice and host fun dinner parties. Yeah,
Like I just mentally was not in that place five
years ago. Like I was just internally way too chaotic.
I wouldn't have made a good spouse to anyone. So,
like I do kind of want to say I've made
(23:30):
it in some respect of just of being the person
that is worthy of those things and you know, continually
trying to better myself constantly. Yeah, But like I think
it's important to compartmentalize, like the difference between making it
in our goals here on earth and making it from like.
Speaker 3 (23:51):
A spiritual perspective.
Speaker 2 (23:53):
Some people more like I'm making it in like a
you know, if I'm in a car crash tomorrow and
like I meet my maker, I forbid, They'll be like,
you know, Tiana, you've actually done to done a good
deal to make yourself a better person. Yeah, And look, personal.
Speaker 1 (24:09):
Growth is what it's all about, right, Like, yeah, I
love that you Also, it's very very relatable. I was
also kind of chaotic before I settled down and got married.
I mean, look, it's a stabilizing force. It's not just
a stabilizing force for men. I think a lot of
people make that mistake, and they think that only men
are kind of made better by the institution of marriage.
(24:30):
But I think very much women too, you know, we better,
we become our better selves.
Speaker 2 (24:35):
Absolutely, Like I have a couple of very stereotypical like
female characteristics. I'm agreeable to a fault, like in a
way where it makes me in conflict resolution historically not
super effective. I am highly neurotic, and marriage has totally
improved me on both fronts. And in the same way
(24:56):
I would say, you know, I think my husband and
I are both much better people today than we were,
you know, a year and two months ago. So I'm
I'm I almost like hate the fact that weddings get
such hype and like marriage itself, and just like the
fun of like we aren't focusing on two rents, Like
(25:16):
all of our friends are kind of shared at this point,
Like when we throw a dinner party, it's our dinner party.
Like just all like these little things that I think
are especially in this era where people just aren't getting married,
which I know you've talked about a billion times. And
Tim Carney, my colleague, has written multiple books about but like.
Speaker 1 (25:34):
He's been on the show.
Speaker 2 (25:35):
Yeah, yeah, and now that I and now that I
like am living at him like ah, okay, I see
the other side, right, like that one tweet that was
like dating as gen Z or is like getting married
as gen Z, like like writing at the last, like
the last chopper leaving the last right. Probably I never
I never had to use a dating app, thank god,
(25:56):
because I'm I'm twenty eight, so like I was still
in the era where like, you know, guys asked you
out and girls actually said yes and didn't just say
like me to me, to me too.
Speaker 1 (26:07):
So yeah, yeah, and totally I missed the dating app.
I mean, you know, I sometimes feel like that would
have been fun, but no, you know, then you hear
the stories. The stories are like, no, it's actually not
at all fun. It's hell on earth, and you know
that's I'm sure that that's true. So and here with
your best tip for my listeners on how they can
(26:29):
improve their lives.
Speaker 2 (26:30):
Okay, So I actually I've been thinking about this because
I'm bad with self help stuff because I'm very hypercritical.
But I think no one to ask for something, no
one to say yes, and no one to say no,
just because when I see a lot of young people
they're just in this state of inertia where they don't
(26:52):
do any of these things. It's they don't ask to.
Like one of the things I love about my husband
is like when he moved out to DC many moons ago,
because he's like ten years older than me, he literally
worked in the Bush White House he moved out here,
he would go to church and just introduce himself to
people and say like, hey, I'm new here. I kind
of need like some like male mentorship, and that's amazing.
(27:14):
He has friends everywhere on the planet. He has friends
in Albany, have friends in New Zealand, and I just
love that. And like, I'm a similar ish person, Like
I'm less forward maybe like in that way, but I've
always been someone that like has asked for things if
I don't have what I want or what I need,
and also have always been very forceful and saying no
if I don't want something. And I just especially with God,
(27:36):
I think I see it with men. They don't ask
for things. They don't ask girls out, they don't ask
for promotions, they don't ask for jobs. And I'm speaking
more specifically to younger people because I don't know how
much advice I have for people who are older than me.
That feels presumptuous, but like for girls also like make
your yeses mean yes and your nose me no, like
don't And that was like a big conversation, you know,
(27:56):
with like Christine Emba's book when she was talking about
like was sexual revolution of failure or not? Like consent
can't be the only thing that matters, of course, not
like like your pleasure and agency also matter if you're
on a date, like don't just passively just say, oh, well,
I guess I should like make your guests mean yes,
yes because I want to do something and no because
no I don't want to. And I guess my second
(28:19):
thing this is more pertinent to like everyone is you know,
this country was built by pioneers that left home, and
like I know you and I have done, especially in
your childhood, but like even now, you did New York
to Florida. I did after university. He did Los Angeles
to DC, My husband did Detroit to DC. And I see,
(28:41):
like moving far from family getting like a pretty bad
rap these days. And like, of course, when we talk
about like a political sense, like places that are left behind,
that is not good when we use bad government policy
to rig against certain states or certain like that is
not good. But on like an individual level, if you
(29:01):
don't like your life, you know, don't abandon your spouse
and kids. But if you're single and you don't love
your job, change it, go somewhere else. You can always
make new friends, you can always find a new career.
If you're not finding you know, the romantic partner you like,
go like, just just just have agency. Just know, like,
this country is successful because we brought in millions of
(29:24):
those archetypes of people that left home to find something better.
Speaker 1 (29:27):
I love that, And you know it doesn't only apply
to single people. You can also I think you know,
if you're if you're not loving the place that you're
raising your kids, and moving is hard, it's expensive. I
get all of that, but do it. Your life is short,
you know, especially childhood is short. I think I'm all
about that. Thank you so much for coming on. Love
talking to Tiana lodsher. Check her out, She's really fantastic.
(29:50):
Her Twitter is Tiana the First Right, Yes, and check
her out of The Washington Examiner. Thank you so much,
Thank you, Caro, thanks so much for joining us on
the Carol Markowitz Show. Subscribe wherever you get your podcasts.
Host
Karol Markowicz
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