April 17, 2024 • 10 mins
Passing notes in class used to be the biggest distraction for kids, but now they’re texting and posting on social media!
Should kids be allowed to have phones in class? What’s the right age to give your child a cell phone?
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
This is the most dramatic podcast ever and iHeartRadio podcast.
Speaker 2 (00:08):
Okay, so a few things we wanted to get into
in the headlines.
Speaker 3 (00:12):
I mentioned the cell phones thing. Yes, so there's this.
It was discussed.
Speaker 2 (00:16):
It was one of the first topics with the launch
of Merritt Street Media this week. One of the first
topics they handled on the morning news. Should cell phones
be banned in schools? And part of why this is
coming out is there's this new book out Jonathan his
last name is Haidt, but he's a psychologist and he
just wrote this book, The Anxious Generation. It just came
(00:38):
out and it was instantly a New York Times bestseller.
And he's writing in this book all about these principles
of like how we've created this generation for as much
as our mental health awareness seems to be up and look,
you and I are big advocates for mental health, but
that we've created a mentally struggle generation. But he talks
(01:01):
about the cell phone and the impact of it, and
he has what he thinks should be the four new norms.
One no smartphones before high school, two no social media
before age sixteen, three phone free schools, and four emphasizing
more independence free play and responsibility in the real world
(01:25):
amongst kids. Now, I have to say I'm behind all that,
but I wanted to talk to you because even though
I parent with you with the kids, I didn't come
into Josh and Taylor's lives until they were teenagers. You
had younger kids obviously, So what do you think? No
smartphones before high school, no social media before sixteen, and
phone free schools.
Speaker 3 (01:47):
Should cell phones be banned in schools?
Speaker 1 (01:49):
One hundred percent? I agree with everything. That should be
a law mandate, send it right now. I so agree.
Speaker 2 (01:58):
By the way, we would be a little behind on this,
like France, I believe it's illegal and I don't know
how much it's really enforced, but for kids to have
phones before age thirteen, to have them at all.
Speaker 1 (02:09):
Doctor Phil talks about this all the time, that you
can really draw a very direct line to ninety five
percent of the problems going on with the youth over medicated,
to the pharmaceuticals and suicide, loneliness up, yeah, all of it,
all of it. You can draw a direct line to
the time when we invented and brought out smartphones, period,
(02:32):
social media, et cetera. Everything that has ailed this generation
and really the previous one. You can go right back
to the cell phones. It is so well.
Speaker 2 (02:42):
And I would say the smartphone because I do think
like I grew up get a flip phone, right, I
grew up with a cell phone where I had calling.
And I remember when texting was invented. I was in
high school and at the time, I actually thought, it's
funny how I've changed. I remember thinking this texting thing
is so dumb.
Speaker 3 (02:57):
I will never do it.
Speaker 2 (02:58):
Why wouldn't you just call someone? And I don't think
cell phones and texting were bad. I mean maybe it
made us all a little overly communicative. Like you know,
it's funny when you tell me that you like called
your parents once a week from college. Sometimes I think, like,
should I be talking to the kids more? Should I
call them more? Just because I miss them? And then
I also want to make sure that while they're like
away at college, we maintain a good relationship. But then
(03:18):
sometimes I think, no, you know, quality over quantity, Like
I got dinner with Taylor this week. You had a
business dinner and I wanted to check in with Taylor
and see her, and a two hour dinner with her,
I was like, this was so great, Like we connected
and we had really good conversation, and I would rather
have that than like forty texts I sent her during
(03:39):
the week.
Speaker 1 (03:39):
You know that, just because now they mean nothing and
it's not not nothing, that's too strong of a word,
but they just become less meaningful because you get thousands
of them a day and they just kind of roll.
Even if you say something really demonstrative and important, it's
just it's a text and you're going to get and
it may mean something just to that moment, and then
(04:00):
that high and the dopamine and all that's gone because
you're going to get fifty thousand more techts that day.
Speaker 2 (04:05):
Well, I do think we all live really people live
more spread out lives now than they used to. I
think people used to kind of stay where they grew
up more and now we all move around the world
and we travel more, and so it is great to
be able to stay in touch. But I would put
it at social media and at smartphones number one.
Speaker 1 (04:21):
If the kids need you, trust me, they're going to
call you. I talked to Taylor this morning because she
had a really big day, and we facetimed and talked
to each other face to face for a good thirty
minutes about something and it was good news, but she
wanted to share it that if she had texted me,
I would have texted back, great, babe, I love you.
I'm so proud of you. Boom, it's gone. Instead, we
(04:42):
had a meaningful conversation your dinner. The kids will reach
out again. Yeah. I had to pay long distance phone
bills when I was in college, and so we couldn't
afford it. So I called my grandmother and I and grandparents,
and I called my mom and dad on Sundays. That
was like my day, Sunday afternoon. I would call.
Speaker 3 (04:58):
Everybody, but you made the time.
Speaker 1 (05:00):
But we made the time and we had those conversations.
And by the way, I was fine. I didn't need
to talk to them six days a week. So yeah,
and so I agree that, you know, if people are
out there and I think to get to a point
you were about to make, I don't know what happened
with your kids. The divorce definitely advanced things, and so
I kind of empathize with those people that are going
(05:22):
through divorces because you lose contact and you lose control
over your kids, and so therefore that often speeds up
the delivery of phones. I would have loved to have
been able to say, here's a flip phone you can
or a phone that doesn't have any capability other than
texting and a phone call period. And if you want
to give kids a smartphone that can absolutely do nothing,
(05:44):
you could put a lock on it that they can't
do anything. That's fine by me too. But they didn't
need to ever have social media, and they didn't for
quite some time. But the divorce is what sped that up.
They were thirteen or fourteen, because that's when we got divorced.
Speaker 2 (06:00):
Because you're like thinking, okay, I need to be able
to pick them up from soccer practice, or like if
they have to stay late after school they.
Speaker 3 (06:05):
Got a call and you want to stay in touch too.
Speaker 4 (06:09):
And saying well, and I hope that exists, Like there
should be some version of like I don't know, call
it kid phone where you just can make calls or
even only just one number, call parents, call emergency, and.
Speaker 2 (06:23):
Like send texts. Maybe I don't know, but I do think.
And I was sitting here wondering, like, why hasn't this
happened sooner? And maybe it's just because over the past
decade the research has been done, and now we have
the research to back it up and show something I
think we can all feel and kind of know, which
is that social media, while it can connect us also
(06:44):
and while it can expose us to new information into
seeing new things, can also be very negative. It dumps
dopamine in our brain and then we get addicted to
that dopamine. It can be very isolating in terms of
like it makes you feel like everyone else is living
this life that you're not living. And kids' brains aren't
formed for that yet, their identities aren't formed for that yet. Like,
(07:07):
I think social media is potentially toxic enough for adults.
When I think about the fact that like young kids
are on it, I can't even imagine. And Bo Burnham,
who was this guy who got really big on Vine
and then has since gone on to be like an
Oscar nominated screenwriter, he said he's very anti social media,
and he said this thing that always sticks with me.
(07:28):
He's like, when you put a kid on social media,
you're asking them to declare who they are to the world.
Speaker 3 (07:34):
And they don't know who they are yet. And I thought, God,
that's so true.
Speaker 2 (07:38):
Imagine if you're trying to figure out who you are
in front of the world. It's like we've made everybody
a child star, like child stars talk about how bad
their childhood was.
Speaker 3 (07:47):
And that's what social media does to everyone.
Speaker 1 (07:49):
The algorithm that they've created, and obviously the documentary about
this and it's been found, but these are you know
that this is damaging, it's driving kids to all kinds
of horrible things. These are facts we know this. Congress
knows this, the President knows this, everybody knows that this
is harmful and bad. But these are billion dollar companies,
(08:12):
so they have people fighting for them in Congress, people
fighting for them on every level. So nothing changes. You know,
you'll hear about cases here and there. They get hauled
before Congress and they do the dog and pony show.
But at the end of the day, nothing's going to
change because of money. It's not even debatable. It's not
(08:32):
going to change because these people have the money, they
have the purse strings, and so I don't know where
you go from that other than this lies within the parents'
hands and we're the ones that will have to decide
and make these hard choices.
Speaker 2 (08:48):
And I understand how hard that can be, because when
you're a parent you're also having a parent based on
what other parents are doing, because your kids coming home
and they're like, well, everybody else has a phone, and
I can't keep in touch with everyone, and you feel
like you're isolating your kid. But I do think we're
just at that tipping point now where like it's not
even that you're speculating or you're sensing, it's that the
(09:10):
research is showing.
Speaker 3 (09:11):
And I mean I'm seeing all these like headlines.
Speaker 5 (09:15):
Research shows kids need more risky play, Research shows kids
should get outside more. Research shows kids need to be
more independent. Like I I do, I wish and I
hope that our government would do things like I think
what I compare it to a lot is I grew
up with DARE, the DARE program, like resist drugs at school.
(09:36):
It's getting to the point that we know that social media.
Speaker 2 (09:39):
Is addictive like a drug, and like we might I think,
I wish the government would step in and regulated, but
like you said, maybe with money they won't.
Speaker 1 (09:47):
The lobbyists that they have the power that they have
over these companies. And it's also you can go so
deep on this about you know, favored nations of like, look,
we're not going to do this but we have an
election coming up. We need you to censor this or
say this or The algorithm works in a lot of
different ways, and you know, obviously all that got exposed
when Elon Musk took over, then Twitter, now X and
(10:09):
so it goes deep and they know they know what
they're doing, they know they're harming kids, but they're not
going to turn These are public companies and they have
shareholders to answer to, and so I ultimately all of
this comes back to the choices you make as a parent,
and you you know it's it's you fight that fight
as hard as you can for as long as you can.
(10:30):
Thanks for listening. Follow us on Instagram at the most
dramatic pod ever and make sure to write us a
review and leave us five stars. I'll talk to you
next time.
This is the most dramatic podcast ever and iHeartRadio podcast.
Speaker 2 (00:08):
Okay, so a few things we wanted to get into
in the headlines.
Speaker 3 (00:12):
I mentioned the cell phones thing. Yes, so there's this.
It was discussed.
Speaker 2 (00:16):
It was one of the first topics with the launch
of Merritt Street Media this week. One of the first
topics they handled on the morning news. Should cell phones
be banned in schools? And part of why this is
coming out is there's this new book out Jonathan his
last name is Haidt, but he's a psychologist and he
just wrote this book, The Anxious Generation. It just came
(00:38):
out and it was instantly a New York Times bestseller.
And he's writing in this book all about these principles
of like how we've created this generation for as much
as our mental health awareness seems to be up and look,
you and I are big advocates for mental health, but
that we've created a mentally struggle generation. But he talks
(01:01):
about the cell phone and the impact of it, and
he has what he thinks should be the four new norms.
One no smartphones before high school, two no social media
before age sixteen, three phone free schools, and four emphasizing
more independence free play and responsibility in the real world
(01:25):
amongst kids. Now, I have to say I'm behind all that,
but I wanted to talk to you because even though
I parent with you with the kids, I didn't come
into Josh and Taylor's lives until they were teenagers. You
had younger kids obviously, So what do you think? No
smartphones before high school, no social media before sixteen, and
phone free schools.
Speaker 3 (01:47):
Should cell phones be banned in schools?
Speaker 1 (01:49):
One hundred percent? I agree with everything. That should be
a law mandate, send it right now. I so agree.
Speaker 2 (01:58):
By the way, we would be a little behind on this,
like France, I believe it's illegal and I don't know
how much it's really enforced, but for kids to have
phones before age thirteen, to have them at all.
Speaker 1 (02:09):
Doctor Phil talks about this all the time, that you
can really draw a very direct line to ninety five
percent of the problems going on with the youth over medicated,
to the pharmaceuticals and suicide, loneliness up, yeah, all of it,
all of it. You can draw a direct line to
the time when we invented and brought out smartphones, period,
(02:32):
social media, et cetera. Everything that has ailed this generation
and really the previous one. You can go right back
to the cell phones. It is so well.
Speaker 2 (02:42):
And I would say the smartphone because I do think
like I grew up get a flip phone, right, I
grew up with a cell phone where I had calling.
And I remember when texting was invented. I was in
high school and at the time, I actually thought, it's
funny how I've changed. I remember thinking this texting thing
is so dumb.
Speaker 3 (02:57):
I will never do it.
Speaker 2 (02:58):
Why wouldn't you just call someone? And I don't think
cell phones and texting were bad. I mean maybe it
made us all a little overly communicative. Like you know,
it's funny when you tell me that you like called
your parents once a week from college. Sometimes I think, like,
should I be talking to the kids more? Should I
call them more? Just because I miss them? And then
I also want to make sure that while they're like
away at college, we maintain a good relationship. But then
(03:18):
sometimes I think, no, you know, quality over quantity, Like
I got dinner with Taylor this week. You had a
business dinner and I wanted to check in with Taylor
and see her, and a two hour dinner with her,
I was like, this was so great, Like we connected
and we had really good conversation, and I would rather
have that than like forty texts I sent her during
(03:39):
the week.
Speaker 1 (03:39):
You know that, just because now they mean nothing and
it's not not nothing, that's too strong of a word,
but they just become less meaningful because you get thousands
of them a day and they just kind of roll.
Even if you say something really demonstrative and important, it's
just it's a text and you're going to get and
it may mean something just to that moment, and then
(04:00):
that high and the dopamine and all that's gone because
you're going to get fifty thousand more techts that day.
Speaker 2 (04:05):
Well, I do think we all live really people live
more spread out lives now than they used to. I
think people used to kind of stay where they grew
up more and now we all move around the world
and we travel more, and so it is great to
be able to stay in touch. But I would put
it at social media and at smartphones number one.
Speaker 1 (04:21):
If the kids need you, trust me, they're going to
call you. I talked to Taylor this morning because she
had a really big day, and we facetimed and talked
to each other face to face for a good thirty
minutes about something and it was good news, but she
wanted to share it that if she had texted me,
I would have texted back, great, babe, I love you.
I'm so proud of you. Boom, it's gone. Instead, we
(04:42):
had a meaningful conversation your dinner. The kids will reach
out again. Yeah. I had to pay long distance phone
bills when I was in college, and so we couldn't
afford it. So I called my grandmother and I and grandparents,
and I called my mom and dad on Sundays. That
was like my day, Sunday afternoon. I would call.
Speaker 3 (04:58):
Everybody, but you made the time.
Speaker 1 (05:00):
But we made the time and we had those conversations.
And by the way, I was fine. I didn't need
to talk to them six days a week. So yeah,
and so I agree that, you know, if people are
out there and I think to get to a point
you were about to make, I don't know what happened
with your kids. The divorce definitely advanced things, and so
I kind of empathize with those people that are going
(05:22):
through divorces because you lose contact and you lose control
over your kids, and so therefore that often speeds up
the delivery of phones. I would have loved to have
been able to say, here's a flip phone you can
or a phone that doesn't have any capability other than
texting and a phone call period. And if you want
to give kids a smartphone that can absolutely do nothing,
(05:44):
you could put a lock on it that they can't
do anything. That's fine by me too. But they didn't
need to ever have social media, and they didn't for
quite some time. But the divorce is what sped that up.
They were thirteen or fourteen, because that's when we got divorced.
Speaker 2 (06:00):
Because you're like thinking, okay, I need to be able
to pick them up from soccer practice, or like if
they have to stay late after school they.
Speaker 3 (06:05):
Got a call and you want to stay in touch too.
Speaker 4 (06:09):
And saying well, and I hope that exists, Like there
should be some version of like I don't know, call
it kid phone where you just can make calls or
even only just one number, call parents, call emergency, and.
Speaker 2 (06:23):
Like send texts. Maybe I don't know, but I do think.
And I was sitting here wondering, like, why hasn't this
happened sooner? And maybe it's just because over the past
decade the research has been done, and now we have
the research to back it up and show something I
think we can all feel and kind of know, which
is that social media, while it can connect us also
(06:44):
and while it can expose us to new information into
seeing new things, can also be very negative. It dumps
dopamine in our brain and then we get addicted to
that dopamine. It can be very isolating in terms of
like it makes you feel like everyone else is living
this life that you're not living. And kids' brains aren't
formed for that yet, their identities aren't formed for that yet. Like,
(07:07):
I think social media is potentially toxic enough for adults.
When I think about the fact that like young kids
are on it, I can't even imagine. And Bo Burnham,
who was this guy who got really big on Vine
and then has since gone on to be like an
Oscar nominated screenwriter, he said he's very anti social media,
and he said this thing that always sticks with me.
(07:28):
He's like, when you put a kid on social media,
you're asking them to declare who they are to the world.
Speaker 3 (07:34):
And they don't know who they are yet. And I thought, God,
that's so true.
Speaker 2 (07:38):
Imagine if you're trying to figure out who you are
in front of the world. It's like we've made everybody
a child star, like child stars talk about how bad
their childhood was.
Speaker 3 (07:47):
And that's what social media does to everyone.
Speaker 1 (07:49):
The algorithm that they've created, and obviously the documentary about
this and it's been found, but these are you know
that this is damaging, it's driving kids to all kinds
of horrible things. These are facts we know this. Congress
knows this, the President knows this, everybody knows that this
is harmful and bad. But these are billion dollar companies,
(08:12):
so they have people fighting for them in Congress, people
fighting for them on every level. So nothing changes. You know,
you'll hear about cases here and there. They get hauled
before Congress and they do the dog and pony show.
But at the end of the day, nothing's going to
change because of money. It's not even debatable. It's not
(08:32):
going to change because these people have the money, they
have the purse strings, and so I don't know where
you go from that other than this lies within the parents'
hands and we're the ones that will have to decide
and make these hard choices.
Speaker 2 (08:48):
And I understand how hard that can be, because when
you're a parent you're also having a parent based on
what other parents are doing, because your kids coming home
and they're like, well, everybody else has a phone, and
I can't keep in touch with everyone, and you feel
like you're isolating your kid. But I do think we're
just at that tipping point now where like it's not
even that you're speculating or you're sensing, it's that the
(09:10):
research is showing.
Speaker 3 (09:11):
And I mean I'm seeing all these like headlines.
Speaker 5 (09:15):
Research shows kids need more risky play, Research shows kids
should get outside more. Research shows kids need to be
more independent. Like I I do, I wish and I
hope that our government would do things like I think
what I compare it to a lot is I grew
up with DARE, the DARE program, like resist drugs at school.
(09:36):
It's getting to the point that we know that social media.
Speaker 2 (09:39):
Is addictive like a drug, and like we might I think,
I wish the government would step in and regulated, but
like you said, maybe with money they won't.
Speaker 1 (09:47):
The lobbyists that they have the power that they have
over these companies. And it's also you can go so
deep on this about you know, favored nations of like, look,
we're not going to do this but we have an
election coming up. We need you to censor this or
say this or The algorithm works in a lot of
different ways, and you know, obviously all that got exposed
when Elon Musk took over, then Twitter, now X and
(10:09):
so it goes deep and they know they know what
they're doing, they know they're harming kids, but they're not
going to turn These are public companies and they have
shareholders to answer to, and so I ultimately all of
this comes back to the choices you make as a parent,
and you you know it's it's you fight that fight
as hard as you can for as long as you can.
(10:30):
Thanks for listening. Follow us on Instagram at the most
dramatic pod ever and make sure to write us a
review and leave us five stars. I'll talk to you
next time.
Hosts And Creators
Lauren Zima
Chris Harrison
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