22. What are we fighting for - The Psychology of Conflict

Why do we fight and how can we resolve conflict in a healthy manner? We’re talking about interpersonal conflict today and answering some of the big questions around fighting with those we love.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:05):
Hello, and welcome back to the Psychology of Your Twenties,
the podcast where we talk through some of the big
changes and transitions of our twenties and what they mean
for our psychology. Big topic this week, big topic for
our twenties as well, we're talking about interpersonal conflict of

(00:27):
all sorts. On this episode, we're talking about fighting. We're
talking about the drama of arguments, of fights with family
and friends. It's pretty normal to have conflict with people
as we're figuring ourselves out, but also in general, not
just in our twenties. We fight and we start conflict
when we misunderstood, when we feel underappreciated, slighted, betrayed, and

(00:50):
for no reason at all. Really, I think fights between
our friends, our partners, maybe our colleagues, definitely our families.
It's a real normal part of daily life, maybe not
daily life, but life in general. So today I really
want to discuss the psychology behind why we have conflict
with people, maybe some more than others, Why we can't

(01:13):
let things go, why we rehearse arguments in our head,
and how to release anger towards another person. Psychology has
so much to say about interpersonal conflict. It's a massive
part of social psychology, so let's dive right in. I

(01:35):
don't think we need a definition of conflict unless you
are the most peaceful person in the world. I'm sure
we've all had a fight with someone or a disagreement
of some kind that went a little bit too far.
It's a pretty nasty feeling. It's an anxious feeling to
be fighting with someone close to us, especially when we
don't really know how it's going to work out or

(01:57):
if things can be fixed. I don't think that fighting
with others interpersonal conflict is avoidable, but we can make
it easier on ourselves and others and have happy outcomes
rather than disastrous bonds. I guess so there are many
reasons that conflict in our interpersonal relationships may arise, maybe

(02:18):
even more common with people we love or who we're
close to, because we feel comfortable enough to express our
anger and our insecurities. We're also more likely to feel
misunderstood by the people we believe should understand us, so
that perception of feeling misunderstood. Perhaps it's not the reality
that they don't understand you, they probably understand you more

(02:39):
than most people, but that perception that they should know
they should know how you'd be feeling, they should know
how you'd react to their words, to their actions. So yeah,
I think when we have people close to us, it's
probably more common that we have that conflict with them.
And I think although there's a lot of dialogue around
how fighting is healthy for your relationship and ships, which

(03:00):
it is, and we'll discuss why it doesn't always lead
to the best outcomes in the moment or in the
long run. If you're screaming at somewhere, you're probably not
listening to their perspective. If you're really mad, it's very
hard to see where they might be coming from, and
it's hard to express where you're coming from as well.
Arguing and fighting can actually lead to worse outcomes because

(03:22):
we don't sit back and think about both sides of
the narrative. Take this study for example, So a study
of nurses found that when they argued about patient care
on the treatment floor, they were less likely to arrive
at a good decision and lost focus on the task
at hand in favor of the interpersonal conflict. That's a

(03:43):
pretty real world example. You know, they're not able to
actually provide care as well. If fighting and conflict is
getting in the way. So where does this kind of
nastiness not so much nastiness, I don't want to use
the word conflict again, these disruptions to the harmony of
our relationships. Yeah, where does fighting come from? Why does

(04:06):
it occur? Anger at someone can come from quite a
few places, obviously, and there's a few main reasons that
psychologists have kind of identified as the leading causes of
arguments amongst people. So, firstly, and we've already mentioned this,
but you feel misunderstood. Misunderstandings are common, and they're often innocuous,

(04:26):
yet they can create conflict, as I'm sure we're all aware.
Perhaps someone has misheard something you've said and now they're
anger with you. Perhaps they heard your words correctly but
comprehended them in a manner that did not align with
your intent. Or perhaps they interpreted your silence in a
way that was consistent or inconsistent with the message you

(04:49):
wanted to send. Importantly, people aren't mind readers. My therapist
says this to me all the time. Perception and intention
are completely different, and our intentions aren't always clear, and
it's an effort to always have to deliberately signpost exactly
what you mean, and it's difficult for people to pick
up on what we're really saying if we're not being clear.

(05:12):
So similar to this, feeling misunderstood in a more general sense,
maybe the way someone has treated you or something they've
said really contradicts how you see yourself in aspects of
your identity that you think are important. So you feel
attacked by what you perceive their kind of idea of

(05:32):
you as being. You feel misunderstood by how you believe
they see you, regardless of their source. Misunderstandings can really
damage relationships if they're not handled swiftly. First, you should
really ask yourself if you're actually being misunderstood or if
the other person's read of the situation is maybe warranted.

(05:53):
I think often we privilege our viewpoints and presume objectivity,
when in fact what we said can indeed be interpreted
in so many ways, even slight changes in tone. Another
study that was done that I found really interesting was
they gave this script of three lines or to the

(06:16):
same individuals or the same script to different individuals, sorry,
and they asked them to read out their lines to
a partner, not someone they were closer to, someone they
were partnered with, for the experiment, and then afterwards they
asked their partner to rate the tone or the attitude

(06:37):
of the person or the meaning of what they were saying,
the emotion behind what they were saying on a scale,
and they gave them different kind of scale. So how
happy do you think this person was? Do you think
this person was angry? Do you think this person was upset?
And there were like so many different interpretations. And I
think when that happens, we need to communicate. Tell someone

(06:57):
how you felt, but also take on board what they
believe their intentions were. Asked them why did you say that?
Why did you think that was appropriate? And let them
explain themselves, give them a platform to maybe actually fix
what is started. Like I said, people can't read your mind,
so if you're not clear about your reaction to their

(07:19):
actions or words, resentment, it can start to build. This
leads us to the second reason. You may find yourself
fighting or in conflict with someone you care about. Something
has been building for a while. Maybe it's a comment
you can't let go of, or a pattern of behavior
that you haven't called out before, believing that the other

(07:40):
person will maybe recognize your disappointment themselves. Someday this really happens.
People aren't going to wake up and be like, oh,
I think that person is mad at me, and they're
probably not going to even know where it's started. Instead,
if you hold on to every slight and start keeping
a mental list of everything they said, everything they've done

(08:01):
that they should know is wrong, soon you'll crack, and
inevitably the outcome will be worse than if you had
just said something. The moment you recognize you're feeling hurt,
the explosion of emotions that we all probably understand after
the fact is never helpful because it's likely your partner,
or your friend or your family member doesn't even remember

(08:23):
what caused you to be upset in the first place.
They can't remember that comment. They may they can't remember
that time you know, you looked away or you rolled
your eyes, and they'll feel attacked and immediately on the defensive.
And we're going to discuss why people react this way
to confrontation in a few minutes. But finally, the last
reason that psychologists have found we fight for you feel

(08:46):
hurt by someone's actions. This is probably the most obvious reason.
Maybe they have done something deliberately and you feel betrayed
or lied to and hurt, and that's completely valid. Sometimes
times fighting in these situations can be useful, especially in
romantic relationships. Obviously it has its limits, but not talking

(09:06):
about resorting to physical violence, but expressing your emotions right
away is probably a good practice to have rather than
waiting for that volcanic volcanic eruption of anger and resentment
and attacks. Heaps of studies have found that fighting with
a partner, a boyfriend, or a girlfriend might actually be

(09:28):
quite healthy. I always remember this one scene from the Office.
I don't know why it's really stuck with me, but
if you are in office, an office CONSTI like myself.
If you've watched it a few times or maybe just once,
you'll know Jim and Pam, even if you haven't watched
The Office. Jim and Pam the couple, you know, the

(09:48):
star couple of the show. And after they've been married
for a couple of years, they start to have these
this sense of misunderstanding that their needs aren't being met
and Jim, they're at this of climax of this, you know,
they're almost at the point where they just need to fight,
and they Jim says to Pam you know, I don't
want to go home because if we go home, we're

(10:09):
just going to find Pam says, I want to fight.
I really want to. And that's kind of a really
healthy way of seeing it. She's not avoiding it another
minute longer. She's not saying, oh, this can wait, because
it can't. And she knows that if things build up,
I guess it's just going to lead to worse outcomes.
So she says, I want to have that argument. A
couple goals, honestly, and when you fight with someone, I

(10:32):
think the reason it's healthy is because it shows that
you both care. If you didn't, you wouldn't be concerned
with feeling like your perspective had to be understood or
that you needed the conflict to resolve. When I guess
partners fight within an environment that allows clear expression, this
can help strengthen their bond, with partners both kind of

(10:55):
actively participating to resolve the disagreement. There's comfort as well,
a learned comfort in knowing that conflicts can be maturely
and warmly handled without risking the relationship's future. It's kind
of a really good way to avoid anxiety around upsetting someone,
or avoid anxiety around, you know, are they mad at me?

(11:17):
If you get into that practice of just speaking your
mind early, and I think with this, partners can freely
bring up disappointments, unhappiness without leaving room for resentment. Ultimately,
this can kind of help to strengthen the relationship and
probably improve its odds of lasting. I would say so,

(11:38):
I don't know any couple who would have lasted a
long time who wouldn't have had an argument. It's like,
once you get over that first few arguments, you know,
it makes you a lot stronger and you learn more
about the other person. Because I think somewhere in the
process of listing out your grievances and offering your partner's
clarification in uncertain areas or accepting your partner's clarification, you

(12:00):
both learn new things about each other. You learn what
upsets them, You learn what maybe triggers them, what behaviors
they don't like, how you can treat them better. It
might also be things like communication methods, So maybe your
partner's voice goes lower when they are feeling particularly hurt,
and that's something you can pick up on in the future.
And it could also be knowing that certain practices like

(12:23):
cuddling before bed and non negotiable for their happiness, because
if they're bringing it up with you, they know what's
best for them, and they know what they like and
what they don't like and what makes them happy. And
other times it may simply be learning about their hopes
for the relationship, but also your fears, like if you're
worried about fighting, are you fearful that you know your
partner might leave you? Are you fearful that something's wrong?

(12:53):
So so far those kind of ones we just talked about.
We've been talking about conflict or fights that seem to
have a purpose us or which are trying to get
us to a place of deeper understanding. And I know
I used intimate relationships are like you know, partners as
an example, but I can also apply to friends as
well and to family getting to you know, having the
opportunity to strengthen your bond and understand what's okay and

(13:16):
what's not in your relationship. But what about the times
when we really don't need to be arguing. Why do
we start fights when we don't want to have a
fight and we don't want to argue. Sometimes we can
get into these argument cycles, especially with intimate partners, and
this is something that social psychology has seen a lot
when we look at married couples, or we look at

(13:39):
partners who are in long distance or long term relationships.
So this happens when we're arguing about the same thing
over and over again, even when we don't want to,
even when we feel like previously we've come to a
good conclusion. So these argument cycles are usually caused by
negative communication patterns that restrictstanding and respect in a relationship,

(14:02):
or that kind of force that understanding to only be
in the short term. You know, maybe you're just accepting
that person's viewpoint just to finish the argument and you
never actually do reach a good understanding of where they're
coming from. On a deeper level, it's not really the
topic of the argument that matters. It's what the need
to argue represents. And that might be poor communication, it

(14:25):
might be unresolved problems, but I might also just be
that you didn't you didn't listen the first time. Apart
from argument cycles, which if you're interested in you should google,
it's if you're finding yourself in that situation, it's completely
normal and it's yeah, there's a lot of interesting research
behind it. So if you're interested, have a Google. But

(14:46):
there are other reasons we may argue just for the
sake of it. So if you've followed the science of
sleep at all, you know that missing sleep has all
kinds of negative effects. I'm such a proponent of this.
Everyone knows if you don't get enough sleep, if you
don't get those seven eight hours, what are you doing?
Go back to bed? How now call in sick. It's

(15:07):
bad for your health, your brain, and your ability to
get things done. And I think sleep also plays an
important role in arguments as well, even when you kind
of weed out the effects of related issues like stress
and anxiety. And a study that looked at couples in
a laboratory found that even just one partner had gotten

(15:27):
two little sleep, both partners were less likely to act
warmly towards one another or resolve problems, and more likely
to get into fights. And it's this idea of like
a self fulfilling prophecy or reciprocation effect, which we've talked
about a few times. So reciprocity, I can never pronounce it. Reciprocity. Yeah,

(15:48):
the reciprocity. I don't know why I keep saying it.
But that effect where if someone is treating you warmly,
you'll respond warmly, and if someone is cranky and in
a bad mood, you'll probably respond in the same way.
Conflict may also arise because you're irritated or you're projecting
on someone close to you, so Freud's idea of projection

(16:08):
is super important when we consider interpersonal conflict, especially amongst
people close to us. Projection it occurs when we place
our unwanted emotions and feelings onto someone else who was
not the intended target. We displace our feelings onto them
because we may be frustrated at someone else or another situation,

(16:30):
but feel like we can't really voice our anger or
frustration to the person or to the situation who really
deserves it. And I had this happened to me the
other day. I was really frustrated at this person. I
was saying, I can't remember why. It's probably reasonable though,
and I was in a bad mood, and my sister
asked me to drive her somewhere, and I didn't want

(16:51):
to because I was irritated, and she pushed it and
I just got really upset and we ended up having
like a bit of a screaming match. We had a
bit of an argument. But the thing is I wasn't
mad at her, like I wasn't upset. She just wanted
to drive to office works. I was mad at that
other person, but couldn't express it to them, So I
found a new target, someone close to me. And projection

(17:12):
could be the reason why you keep snapping at people
who you really don't have the main problem with, and
it can leave you feeling really guilty. You know, maybe
it's like a close friend or your housemate and you're
just in such a rotten mood, you've had a bad
day at work, and they're the ones who kind of
the sharp end of it. We're going to talk about

(17:35):
what to do on those situations. What you shouldn't do
in a fight. If you want to have a healthy
and happy conclusion, so you and someone are fighting, what
shouldn't you do? That's a really big question. I think
people ask the therapist or other people a lot. What

(17:57):
shouldn't you do? What's not effective? And the first thing
is criticism. You really shouldn't criticize someone when you're arguing
with them. Criticism happens when you're critical of your partner's
personality rather than the action or behavior or trying to
talk through And there's a distinction between a criticism and
a complaint. They argue that expressing a complaint today being

(18:19):
this person that I was reading this from. So this
author argues that expressing a complaint is an important component
of a healthy relationship and it reduces the likely of
built up suppressed anger, which we've talked about. Expressing a criticism, however,
involves making an accusation against the person's personality. A complaint
often starts with I, whereas a criticism starts with you. So,

(18:42):
for example, a complaint might be I'd love to eat
I don't want to eat leftovers for dinner every week,
whereas a criticism might be you always order too much food.
Contempt or commonly follows criticism, and it's problematic because it
can be poisonous to any kind of relationship. You have,
so want to keep contempt out of our fights. So contempt,

(19:03):
according to this Scotman model, which is really interesting if
you want to google it, is statements made with the
intention of insulting or psychologically wounding your partner. So common
ways in which contempt is often expressed in a relationship
is through sarcastic remarks, antagonistic commentary, mocking behavior, or hostility,
and it's such a strong emotion, but you would be

(19:25):
surprised how often it's used against others and used against
your otherwise well meaning partner. Contempts hurt. Contempt hurts the
person you're arguing with, and it hurts your relationship, so
it's good to keep it out. I think couples are
often so focused on feeling defensive that it can become
an instinctual reaction. So this Gootman model, it's said to

(19:47):
kind of try to not feel defensive, try and just
get your point across, but accept what the other person
is saying. It doesn't matter what was said or what
was intended when they said it. The other person and
feels hurt and reacts defensively, so effectively, defensive reactions means
you're like, you're pre guessing, you're not listening, You're just

(20:08):
looking for a way to defend yourself, and it's not
going to make you very good at solving real problems
in real time. The other thing you really shouldn't do,
And this fucking annoys me so much. Stonewalling. Stonewalling happens
in a relationship when one or both people in the relationship,
and I'm not just talking about romantic It could be
with a friend, with a housemate, with a family member.

(20:30):
But it happens when one party stops reacting or responding
to the other. And this occurs most often after all
the other communication patterns criticism, contempt, and defensiveness have been
a standard part of your relationship for some time. So
likely you're feeling overwhelmed by the problems in your relationship
with the other person, so you just withdraw emotionally from

(20:52):
each other. Stonewalling is an active gesture in that it
clearly intends to convey a lack of care or interest.
And we talk about this. Fighting is good. It shows
you still interested. So if you're stonewalling someone, it shows
to them that you don't really give a damn, And
it's an indication that your relationship is probably becoming a
little bit unstuck. If you're not even willing to talk

(21:13):
about it, let the other person speak. Take time away
from the argument. And that's the other big one. I
saw this TikTok about this couple and when they argue,
they have this time out simbol one. It's just the
timeout symbol, and it means that they need a break
and they should go on a walk or do something
that they like doing together. And I thought that was

(21:34):
so smart. I was like, Wow, I wish I could
do that with someone, Like I'm having an argument with
my mom. I'm like, my god, mom, time out. I
wish that was something we could do, which we probably could.
It's a really really healthy strategy. There are some people, though,
who seem to always be having conflict, maybe with you
or with others. Maybe you have a friend who seems

(21:55):
to always have some grievance with your mutual friends, or
is arguing with their partner in and week out, and
although the latter sounds like more of a problematic relationship
than anything else, these kinds of people are known as
high conflict individuals, people who have a pattern of high
conflict behavior that increases fighting in arguments with others rather

(22:16):
than reducing or resolving conflict. This pattern usually happens over
and over again in many different situations with many different people.
It's not just that when they're cranky and tired they
start conflict, or it's just with their boyfriend. It's kind
of a universal pattern and the issue that seems in
conflict at the time, it's not what's increasing the conflict.
This person could argue about anything. The real issue is

(22:39):
the high conflict personality and how the person approaches problem solving.
So with these high conflict individuals, the pattern of behavior
might include blaming others, all or nothing, thinking, unmanaged emotions,
extreme behaviors, stonewalling, and it can be really hard to
maintain relationships with these people as your friends, as people

(22:59):
in your lives. We don't like being in conflict, we
don't like being threatened, and in general, people tend to
want to avoid a confrontation. So if you've got someone
who seems to almost get joy out of it or
seems to make it a ritual, you don't really not
going to want to be around them. Very often, yelling
at someone, fighting with someone, expressing anger immediately places someone

(23:22):
on the defensive, which we already kind of mentioned, and
this is important to understand on a deeper level from
a psychological perspective because it leads to worse outcomes into personally. So,
how does our brain react when we feel threatened. When

(23:43):
we perceive a threat, The amygdala, which is an area
of the old brain deep in the olympic system, it's
responsible for fear and fear responses. The amigduala sounds in alarm,
releasing a cascade of chemicals in the body, stress hormones
like add adrenaline and cortisol. They fly our system, immediately
preparing us to fight or to flee. So when this

(24:05):
deeply instinctive function takes over, we call it what Daniel
Coleman coined as amygdala hijack. So the act of amigdoala
almost immediately shuts down the neural pathway to our prefrontal cortex.
Prefrontal cortex is where we make decisions and we problem solve,
so we become disorientated in a heated discussion, and like

(24:28):
I said, complex decision making disappears, as does our access
to multiple perspectives. As that's kind of a way. Our
frontal lobe is also responsible for empathy, so being able
to kind of step into someone's else's shoes. So as
our attention narrows, we find ourselves trapped in one perspective
that makes us feel the most safe. You know I'm

(24:49):
right and you're wrong, even though we ordinarily would be
able to see the other person's side. And if that
wasn't enough, our memory becomes untrustworthy as well, because this
old brain, it shuts down all of the kind of
accessory functions, just focuses on the thing that's happening in
the moment, the threat in the moment. So have you
ever been in a partner with a friend or your partner,

(25:11):
been in a fight with a partner or your friend,
and you literally cannot remember a single positive thing about them?
You know, you're in this fine and you're like, oh
my god, I fucking hate this person. It's as though
our brain drops the memory function altogether in an effort
to survive the immediate threat. And when our memory is

(25:31):
compromised like this, we can't recall something from the past
that might actually help us calm down. In fact, we
can't really remember much of anything, perhaps even how we
even got there. Instead, we're simply filled with this flashing
red light of the amygdala indicating danger, danger, protect attacked react,
and in the throes of amigdala hijack, we can't choose

(25:52):
how we want to react because of those instinctual protective
mechanisms in the nervous system, or more specifically, the limbic system.
So that's kind of an explanation as to why we
don't like confrontation, But there's a way that our brain
kind of prepares us for it. So have you ever
found yourself rehearsing arguments in your head. I'm sure that

(26:13):
you have fantasizing about what you would say to someone
to really get to them, what you would say to
someone to win the argument or to shock them. There
is a reason why our minds do this and why
it can feel so satisfying to lie in bed or
sit in the shower and rehearse hypotheticals or play conflict
out in our minds, when in reality those situations would

(26:37):
be quite stressful. So by rehearsing conversations, we're trying to
get our meads net. If we're not good at assertive communication.
Sometimes rehearsing those conversations in advance can be a way
of becoming more confident when difficult chats kind of approach.
It can also provide a release without requiring us to

(26:59):
actually have the argument it. So, sometimes rehearsing the arguments
in our head distracts us from the real source of distress,
you know, like is my relationship going to end? But
it also provides an outlet so that we kind of
release some of the tension that might be building up.
So it's kind of a way of avoiding the other
problem or the obvious problem and instead focusing on the

(27:21):
minute details of the argument at hand and evading the
bigger picture and its implications to give our brain not
only practice but a sense of release before the actual storm. Anyway,
I thought that was really interesting, a small tidbit for
those who find themselves rehearsing or imagining hypothetical arguments in
the shower and the car. I do that all the time.

(27:41):
It's so it's kind of fun but makes sense from
a psychological perspective. My brain kind of gets off on
it because it's like a little treat without having to
do the real thing. But we do. We start fights
for so many reasons, and it's so important not to fester,
take time to calm down and tap into what we're

(28:02):
genuinely upset about before projecting and fighting that aftermath of guilt, shame,
and anxiety that might accompany a conflict, perhaps even when
we didn't even want to have in the first place.
We've all been there. I've been there, You've been there.
But changing from a defensive to a receptive state like
we've talked about, can really be helpful in minimizing the

(28:25):
conflict we have with others. Obviously, I'm not a trained psychologist.
I'm just kind of researching this stuff. But definitely a
lot of these things I bring into my own life
next time I find myself, you know, arguing with someone
or not. I don't really find myself in fights, and
I find that I'm not very confrontational, but someone was

(28:45):
upset at me. I feel like instead of getting defensive,
a lot of these strategies would be really useful, Like
that timeout strategy. I'm gonna do that. Thank you TikTok
for showing me the way. Anyhow, I hope you guys
learned something about why we fight, why we have arguments,
the people in our lives who have arguments more than others,
and how to kind of release that anger and get

(29:07):
to a better outcome, Especially with someone you might be
dating or in a long term relationship with. You don't
really want to lose that person. You've invested time and
energy and love for a reason. So I hope you
enjoyed this episode and you've got something out of it.
If you've listened all this way. I always say this
at the end, but if you do feel called, or

(29:28):
if you've liked this episode and you feel called to
leave a review, I would greatly appreciate it. You can
leave a review on Spotify or Apple Podcasts, and it
helps the community of listeners grow, helps people find this
episode or other episodes that might be interesting to them.
If you don't want to do it, that's fine. Thanks
for listening, thanks for tagging along, and I will see

(29:52):
you guys next week or maybe even in a few
days when we record our Valentine's Day edition of Loveline.
Thank you so much, and have a lovely evening, morning,
afternoon wherever you are in the world.