February 20, 2025 • 26 mins
In this episode, Lisa welcomes with Dr. Nicole Saphier, a radiologist and director of breast cancer imaging at Memorial Sloan Kettering, FOX News Health Expert, and more. The discussion spans key health topics, including the nuanced conversation around vaccines, the resurgence of measles outbreaks due to declining vaccination rates, and the rising incidence of breast cancer among younger women. Dr. Saphier emphasizes the importance of informed, balanced health dialogues and advocates for personal choice in vaccination. She also offers practical health tips, such as engaging in enjoyable physical activities, consuming a diet rich in fruits and vegetables, and minimizing hormone and antibiotic intake. The Truth with Lisa Boothe is part of the CLay Travis & Buck Sexton Podcast Network - new episodes debut every Tuesday & Thursday.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:05):
So what if I told you that my next guest
wrote about making America Healthy Again before it was a thing,
before it was a national movement. She actually wrote the
book about it back in April of twenty twenty. We'll
talk about why she wrote the book and what she
thinks about the movement today. She's also starting another important
conversation on X or Twitter or tweet, whatever you want
(00:27):
to call it these days.
Speaker 2 (00:28):
But she posted about it.
Speaker 1 (00:30):
She said this, She said, vaccines have saved lives, vaccines
have also ruined lives, So why can't we have that
conversation as a country, that more nuanced conversation about it.
Speaker 2 (00:42):
I'll dive into that question with her.
Speaker 1 (00:44):
Also, we're saying that measles are rearing its ugly head
across the nation. So what's driving this outbreak?
Speaker 2 (00:52):
What do you need to know about it? What can
we do about it? We'll talk to her about that.
Speaker 1 (00:57):
We'll also discuss the alarming increase of breast cancer rates,
particularly in younger women, what's driving that? And finally we'll
talk about what we can do to reclaim our healthiest lives.
What steps can we take to be healthier to live healthier?
So stay tuned for my brilliant friend and my Fox
News colleague, doctor Nicole Sapphire. And in addition to doing
(01:18):
the Fox thing, she does like a billion things. She's
a mom, she's a wife, she does all the things.
But she also has a day job as a radiologist
and the director of breast cancer Imaging at Memorial Sloan Kettering.
She also started a new company called drop r Ex.
So we'll get into all of this with doctor Nicole Sapphire.
Trust me, you don't want to miss it.
Speaker 2 (01:35):
Stay tuned well, doctor Sapphire. It's great to have you on.
Speaker 1 (01:41):
I always love being on air with you, and it's
great to have you on the podcast.
Speaker 3 (01:47):
Thanks so much for having me on, Lisa, I also
love being on air podcasts on everything with you. Your
personality is just incredible.
Speaker 2 (01:54):
Well, and you're awesome. We always have so much fun together.
Speaker 1 (01:57):
I feel bad for the show because, like in commercial breaks,
probably be like you guys, you're like doing television, so
lock it up.
Speaker 3 (02:04):
Do you know where I like to be with you
the most?
Speaker 1 (02:06):
Though?
Speaker 3 (02:07):
I mean, obviously we're very giggly during commercial breaks, but
you're so knowledgeable about so many things that I don't
even think about. And I think that, you know, put
us together and we cover we have We kind of
have this knowledge power where we kind of cover a
lot of different topics and I love it. You complete me,
is what I'm trying to Lisa.
Speaker 2 (02:25):
You complete me. Well, you're brilliant, which is why I
want to do on the show.
Speaker 1 (02:29):
Yeah, it's always funny because you know, obviously people aren't
privy to like what's happening during the commercial breaks, but
basically we're always like giggling together and having fun and
then you know, they get in our ear and they're like, oh,
you guys are about to go live.
Speaker 2 (02:42):
Get seriously, I get serious. But you know that's what
That's what the beautiful.
Speaker 1 (02:48):
Thing about working at Fox is. You know, we get
to be friends with each other and have fun but
also dive into the substance and cover things that are
obviously important to the audience in the country. So and
that's what I love about you is but we can
have fun but then also be serious as well.
Speaker 2 (03:04):
So in that note, I.
Speaker 1 (03:06):
Saw your tweet recently, Well, I guess it's an.
Speaker 2 (03:08):
X is a post? Are we say post?
Speaker 3 (03:09):
Now?
Speaker 2 (03:10):
I don't even know we say tweet?
Speaker 3 (03:11):
I mean, yeah, why not take that away?
Speaker 2 (03:13):
I know, I don't like. I don't like.
Speaker 1 (03:15):
I saw your ex like, I don't even know what
it's called these days, but anyway, I saw your post,
your tweet whatever on X and you you wrote that
vaccines have saved lives, vaccines have also ruined lives. Why
why can't we have that nuanced conversation as a country,
Because that's right. I mean, it can be both and
(03:35):
both are worthy of discussion. So why don't we have
that discussion as a country?
Speaker 3 (03:40):
Well, LI say, you know, the conversation surrounding vaccine, vaccine
safety and hesitancy. It has always been there, but obviously
it is now in the limelight with RFK Junior in
the Make America Healthy Again movement getting ready joining the
Trump administration and really going full throttle right now. And
one of the biggest criticisms are pushback of our junior
(04:00):
and the proposed agenda is how is it going to
affect vaccines? Now? All we have to do is look
back to COVID. I mean, you know better than anybody else.
I mean, there was a lot of controversy around the
vaccine ruleout. Yes, we went through the Emergency Use Authorization.
Operation WARP Speed was an incredible thing. President Trump got
rid of a lot of that red tape to really
(04:20):
try to get vaccines to market, anything that we could
possibly do as the world was in crisis, and he
was able to do that. Now, where they missed the
mark was the mandates with the vaccine and not being
wholly transparent when they started seeing that the efficacy or
the ability of the vaccine to prevent infection, how quickly
(04:42):
that began to wane. And as soon as they started
seeing that signal, they should have been in front of
the camera. You should have seen doctor Fauci and everyone
else saying, hey, guys, what we're seeing is this is
not going to be preventing infection. So let's change our
talking points and say this vaccine should be targeted for
the that are highest risk, because we are still seeing
(05:02):
that it's keeping some people out of the hospital and
we're not having nearly as many deaths from COVID. Unfortunately,
they did not see that, and they left it to
the American public to realize, Hey, I just got the vaccine,
but why do I have COVID all of a sudden,
and so the American people had to put it together ourselves,
and all of a sudden that created this massive distrust.
All the while, you still had the CDC recommending vaccination
(05:25):
for everybody, even in kids young adults, who are our
healthiest population. And then we started seeing safety signal alerts
in these younger populations for the cardiac inflammation as well
as other inflammation. And again it was we were having
to hear from anecdotes online people who were being negatively
affected by these vaccines instead of just coming out and saying, hey, guys,
(05:48):
you know what, we're going to roll back these vaccines
in these healthy population because there are some side effects
and when we're weighing the risk and benefits, you know,
maybe it's not there. But they doubled down on their
mail and they continued on to the point where the
COVID vaccine was added to the childhood vaccination schedule, just
like it was equivalent to measles, mumps, mubella, and polio
(06:11):
and some of these other things. And that's the biggest issue.
So when people are saying RFK Junior is the biggest
anti vaccine history and he's the reason that we have
declining vaccination rates, I call bs on that. No way
the CDC did it to themselves Okay, they're the reason
(06:31):
there is massive distrust in the United States right now
when it comes to vaccines. Now we're seeing in Texas
and we're seeing in New Mexico these outbreaks of measles. Now,
we do see outbreaks of meases every year for the
last several years. Unfortunately, a couple of decades ago, measles
had essentially been eradicated in the United States because of
(06:51):
a large uptake in the MMR vaccines. Over ninety six
percent of children had been vaccinated. Well, global cases of
mess have risen recently, and our vaccination rates against measles
in the United States have started decreasing. So when you
have those opposing factors, you're going to start seeing measles outbreaks,
(07:13):
especially in little pockets of the country where there's a
high rate of unvaccinated individuals. We saw that in New
York right before COVID, and now we're seeing that in Texas.
It popped up in one of these communities where there's
a you know, a higher unvaccinated rate compared to the
rest of the country. Now, the measles doesn't just come
out of nowhere. It has to be introduced somewhere. Now,
(07:36):
is it possible. Usually actually one hundred percent of our
cases in the United States have always been from foreign travel,
whether an individual.
Speaker 1 (07:43):
We also had an influx of you know, open borders
over the past four years. So do you think did
that play a role in sort of you know, bringing
you know, measles you know, across the southern border more
or less.
Speaker 3 (07:55):
Yeah, So that's exactly what we're talking about. We're talking
about Florier states, right, so West Texas. So usually in
the United States you can identify the patient zero, they
traveled abroad and they were exposed to it abroad, and
then they brought it back here. We have yet to
receive information about where it actually came from. They said
they actually don't know. But so the question is, you
(08:16):
do have a lot of immigrants in Texas maybe who
are coming across the border or someone else who has
traveled abroad, so they had to introduce it to that community,
and then from that community, with the low vaccination rate,
it has continued to spread. What I'm finding interesting is
about twenty percent of these cases are an in vaccinated individuals.
So that brings a question to me, is what is
(08:38):
the waning immunity of these measles vaccines, because historically, the
data that we have quoted is if you have two
doses of that MMR vaccine that has a ninety seven
percent rate of preventing infection, ninety seven percent is pretty
dang good. It's nowhere near what we saw with the
COVID vaccine, where essentially was zero that it prevents to infection.
(09:01):
But so if these two noses of the MMR vaccine
prevents infection ninety seven percent of the time, how are
we seeing twenty percent of these cases in Texas and
New Mexico in vaccinated individuals where they just have a
very high exposure. Did they have waning immunity from the vaccine?
You know, these are some questions that I have. But
(09:21):
one thing that I want to point out to people.
You know, when you see people going on television right now,
they're saying, you know, one in five people who get
measles are going to be hospitalized, and there's a one
in one thousand who will have encephalitis or an even
greater or even more smaller number who will die from measles. Yes,
there are some terrifying consequences of measles. I don't wish
(09:43):
it on anybody, but The good news is we have
a lot more modern medical marvels these days then we
did historically when we were collecting all of this data.
So the mortality rates that we have been quoting probably
are outdated. And again, while I don't I won't be
taking my kids to measles exposure parties anytime soon, you know,
(10:07):
because there are serious consequences. Measles likes to infect the
brain and it can be awful. But I do think
that we're not going to see nearly the mortality of
these measles cases as we had seen historically in the past.
Speaker 2 (10:19):
Well, that's a great point.
Speaker 1 (10:20):
And then also like even on the questioning of vaccines,
you know, particularly the COVID vaccine, I think it's hell
for you to be able to have discussion. You know,
science changes, right, and you adapt and you modernize. And
then even with that, I mean you look at the
measles vaccine as well as poliomy. They went through different
iterations throughout time, right, and so I think it's perfectly
fair to you know, question things and to have that
(10:42):
conversation as well, you know. And on that note, you know,
you had talked about how the COVID vaccine was added
to sort of the childhood vaccine schedule. I mean, I
think there's something like fifteen different immunizations, you know, shots
or drops.
Speaker 2 (10:55):
Do is that necessary? Or are we over vaccinating kids?
You know?
Speaker 1 (11:00):
I mean clearly, you know, you pointed out the dangers
of measles Polio also I think has a high fatality
rate for adults.
Speaker 3 (11:06):
You know.
Speaker 1 (11:06):
So there's purpose and things like that, But are we
overdoing it or do we have it right?
Speaker 3 (11:11):
You know? So I'm a nerd, and so I was
live streaming all I like you, confirmational hearings while I
was working in the hospital, like in between patients. I
was listening to all the testimony because I found it
wildly fascinating. And Senator Ran Paul brought up this exact
brought up this exact concept of are we over vaccinating
(11:31):
our children? And I can tell you as a mom,
you know, I believe in the childhood vaccinations and I
certainly have vaccinated my children. Have I given them one
hundred percent of the vaccines on that recommended vaccination schedule? No?
I have not, And that is because I do believe
in individual choice, and I do believe that vaccines should
(11:52):
be based on risk assessment and risk versus benefit when
it comes to measles, monks and rubella and polio etheria
and some of those that really just historically had very
high fatality rates that we had really eradicated. Those are
the ones that I found to be very important. When
you are looking at some of the other things that
are on the recommendated schedule, like hepatitis B, covid and
(12:16):
flu and some of these others, I mean, those are
really for risk based populations. Hepatitis B. As a mother,
you when you are pregnant, you're tested to see if
you have hepatitis B, and so therefore your child upon birth.
If you're negative, your child upon birth is going to
be negative as well. The reason this was added to
the vaccination schedule is just in case you don't know
(12:37):
the hepatitis B status of the mother, Well, if the
mother received routine of stetrical care, you know the status
of her. So rather than just being a knee jerk
reflex that the child should be vaccinated against hepatitis B,
why don't you just ask what the mothers status is
and if it's unknown, you can test the mother. Like
why do we have to preemptively vaccinate our children now
(12:58):
hepatitis B. Certain populations are high risk for contracting hepatitis B.
Healthcare workers for one, intravenous drug users for two. And
so if you fall into these populations as an adult,
then you can make that decision whether or not you
feel that you should be vaccinated against this because now
you're a higher risk individual. But as a child, these
(13:20):
children are not high risk for hepatitis B. Now, you
don't want a child to get hepatitis B. It can
have devastating consequences. But if you know the mother's status,
then you should feel confidently not giving the newborn that vaccine.
Speaker 1 (13:35):
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Speaker 2 (14:46):
In addition, I really don't know how you do it all.
Speaker 1 (14:48):
In addition to being a great mom and wife and
doing the fox stuff and an author, and you just
started a company drop our X, you're also the radiologist
and director of breast imaging at Memorial Sloan Kettering. And
you know what, we have seen increased rates of breast cancer,
particularly in younger women.
Speaker 2 (15:10):
Why why is it increasing? And you know what do
you think is behind that?
Speaker 3 (15:16):
Oh? Well, I mean that is something that is obviously
in my day to day life and of course it's
important that I point out all of these opinions are
my own and not of that of my employer. However,
as someone who delivers a cancer diagnosis to people every
single day of my professional career, which you know most
people don't realize.
Speaker 2 (15:36):
But I do work, that'd be really hard.
Speaker 3 (15:38):
Yeah. Yeah, So breast cancer incidents, or the number of
breast cancer cases is undoubtedly on the rise. And yes,
a part of that is we are screening more, we're
diagnosing more, that's all absolutely true, So therefore we're finding
more cases. However, we are starting to see more aggressive
cases in younger people. And when we look at this,
(15:59):
yesterday I saw two patients in their thirties with aggressive
breast cancer. I feel like I am starting to see
more breast cancer in thirty to forty year olds than
I have ever found before. And so you have to
take a step back and say, well, why is this?
And the reality is it's our environment. There's no black
and white answer. But this goes along with part of
(16:20):
the Make America Healthy Again movement. You know, you mentioned
I wrote the book Make America Health.
Speaker 2 (16:26):
T twenty twenty, So that's the right. Yeah, you're ahead
of the curve, my friend.
Speaker 3 (16:31):
But that whole thing, how bad behavior and big government
is called a trillion dollar crisis. There is an entire
chapter dedicated to cancer and how about fifty percent of
all cancers could potentially be prevented if we just take
certain steps to make sure that we're living our healthiest
lives and we remove some of the toxins around us.
(16:52):
So it's the microplastics, it's the chemicals that we're ingesting,
whether it's from our cosmetics, the lotions. I mean, think
about this, Lisa. So the largest organ in your body
is your skin. Okay, your skin surface. It is highly absorbable, right.
You like to put on lotion because it's absorbed to
the skin. Well, have you ever looked at the ingredients
in your lotion? If there's just one or two, I
(17:15):
don't know what you're putting on because the majority of
ingredients that are in mind, I can't even pronounce. So
we are literally wiping these chemicals all over our bodies
and it's being absorbed into our skin. And not to
mention the stuff that we consume through our foods, through
our drinks, our beverages, just the pollution all around us
and the air I mean, it's no wonder that we
(17:38):
have so much illness. It's not just people not getting
to the gym enough. And but but by the way,
that's a big part of it. And so it's a
huge concern. It's a huge concern when you look at
all of the factors that have contributed to.
Speaker 2 (17:52):
It, you know.
Speaker 1 (17:53):
And I feel guilty right now because I'm drinking water
out of a plastic bottle, which I feel like after
you're saying that is probably pretty dumb.
Speaker 3 (18:03):
We do want to say one that you know me,
you know, and to the fact that you don't have
to be a nutritional expert. You don't have to be
a gym rat. You have to live your life because
I'll tell you, I see patients who are living their
healthiest life. They are, you know, super green, there's no chemicals,
they're not drinking alcohol, they're not smoking, they're exercising five
(18:26):
days a week like they're living their best, healthiest life.
And bad things can still happen. They can still get
a breast cancer because something in their genetic makeup. They
can still get a lymphoma because who knows why. So
what you have heard me say at nauseum is we
can all be doing a little better than we're doing
right now. We can all be being a little bit healthier,
(18:47):
moving our body a little bit more. But at the
end of the day, we need to enjoy your life
because we only have one of them.
Speaker 1 (18:54):
What I appreciate about you, and this is something that
I kind of realized during COVID, particularly because they would
have doctors try to convince me to get the COVID
vaccine or you know, even after try to convince me
to get the flu vaccine, and I'm like, or flu shot. Rather,
it's not a vaccine, but and I'm like, I'm young
and healthy. I'd rather just build up my natural immunity
and tackle it that way. But there seems to because
(19:16):
what I love about you is obviously you have the
medical background. You know, went to school, you did all
the things, you look at the studies, but you also
play common sense and logic in that aspect.
Speaker 2 (19:28):
You know, this is probably you know, a broad accusation, but.
Speaker 1 (19:30):
That seems to be more lost nowadays in the medical community.
Speaker 2 (19:34):
Would would you agree with that? And if so, why
do you like? What would you attribute that to? You know?
Why is that?
Speaker 3 (19:41):
I The reality is I think a lot of people
have common sense, but they will not admit to it publicly.
So what these positions may say to you publicly and
on the record maybe something completely different of what they're
telling their family and friends off the record. I think
that people are definitely afraid of being.
Speaker 2 (20:00):
Because we've had, you know, conversation.
Speaker 1 (20:01):
Obviously we're friends, we texted, we've talked offline, But then
I've also heard this stuff. So I will give you
credit for you know, you tell the truth and regardless where.
Speaker 2 (20:10):
It is, So I appreciate that about you.
Speaker 3 (20:12):
I appreciate that. Yeah, no, it it can be really hard.
You can absolutely so that you mentioned a tweet or
a post I put on X a little while ago,
and I said, vaccines have saved lives, vaccines have ruined lives.
Do you know what the beauty of that tweet was?
I got attacked from both sides.
Speaker 2 (20:33):
You're making no friends with that one.
Speaker 3 (20:37):
If you can't acknowledge that truth, you're part of the
problem and you will no way be able to help
with the solution. And that was the issue that I had.
The biggest issue I had with the COVID vaccine was
I was, okay, you know, adults, I understood that it
was decreasing. It was decreasing severity in the older cases.
When we thought it was reducing transmission, I'm like, you
(20:58):
know what, let's all be a part of this big
you know, let's kumbaya, hold our hands together and try
to get this under control so we can all get
back to our lives. The moment they became readily apparent
it was not preventing transmission, it's like, all right, that's
an off pullback. And I'll tell you I always said
I do not believe we should be vaccinating our children.
(21:21):
I wrote about it over and over and over again.
I was very concerned about the inflammatory effects of that
vaccine on kids. And because of that, I was called
by a lot of people to be part of the
anti VAXX movement. But the reality is you can be
anti mandate and still support vaccines. And that was the
problem people. You had to be all or nothing. You
(21:43):
had to be all in or you were outcast during
that time, and that became amplified during COVID and it
still is. And I'll tell you a lot of these
people that are going on TV, I would say ninety
percent of them are saying one thing to the public,
but maybe they're a little bit more loosey goose to
their family and friends, but they do not want to
be boxed out as supporting any sort of vaccine hesitancy.
Speaker 1 (22:08):
And before we go, you know, I've had doctor Martin McCarey,
another former colleague of ours, but he has left us.
Speaker 3 (22:14):
But he's but you know what, I'm glad he's going
where he's going maybe overhaul.
Speaker 1 (22:19):
Yeah, and he'll be great with the Trump administration. But uh,
or is it CDC off the top of my head, right,
f D A f D A FDA.
Speaker 2 (22:28):
Rather who's is? No, that's NaHg about a chart?
Speaker 1 (22:31):
Okay, I'm going through my mind all right, But anyways,
he is moving on. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (22:34):
But so he had mentioned that.
Speaker 1 (22:36):
In medical school that they that you study like an
old food pyramid and like you very briefly talk about,
you know, food health and in that aspect of the equation,
and that's like outdata, not even you know, scientifically sound anymore.
Speaker 2 (22:50):
But if you had to lay out three of.
Speaker 1 (22:52):
The most important things to try to be healthy, to
try to stay healthy, what would your guidance be?
Speaker 3 (22:58):
Yeah, so I don't even think we've saw the food
pyramid when I was in medical school. I think I
remember that from elementary school. Really medical school is about
being able to understand disease and knowing the medications to
prescribe to treat it. And that's the reality. But mind you,
I did go to medical school a while ago, so
maybe things have evolved. I know there's a lot more
DEI classes. I didn't have those. But for me living
(23:21):
my healthiest life, and I really do try to lead
by example. I post a law on Instagram. You know,
a little bit less on x some of the things
that we do at our household, but I for me
and my family, you have to get your body moving.
I mean we are. We exercise and not in sensives
like gym rats. Like we'll go to the trampoline park.
(23:41):
You know, we'll go and play tag outside. We have
we have paintballs. We run out and play like paintball wars.
So making sure your body is moving is probably one
of the best possible things that you can do. It
doesn't mean you have to go be a gym rat,
because I find the gym to be very boring. The
other thing is you have to increase your fruits and
vegetable intake. I mean it is so vital. There are
(24:04):
so many nutrients in fruits and vegetables. You don't want
to just be popping a multi vitamin because I can
tell you you're not getting the nutrition from those multivitamins
as you are from fresh fruits and vegetables. And so
I have a garden, and I'm not saying everybody needs
to create a garden, but you need to maintain yourself
on the periphery at the grocery store because that's where
all the healthy stuff is. Once you start going to
(24:25):
the center of the grocery store, that's where all the
crap is. So if you can just stay on the
perifery of the grocery store and get your vegetables, your fruits,
then you go to your meats and your dairies. For me,
I really do try to decrease the amount of hormones
and antibiotics that my family consumes, because I think that's
a huge part in why we're seeing colon cancer, antibiotic resistance,
(24:48):
and even some breast cancers because of our intake of
hormones and the antibiotics. So I really try to look
for hormone free antibiotic free, and I also have chickens
now because I want my my own eggs, and so
I'm not a farmer by any stretch of the imagination.
But I do have hens, and I do have my
own eggs, and that is how I guarantee that there
(25:09):
are no hormones in those eggs, there are no antibiotics
in those eggs, and so I feed my hens the
same thing I feed my family. Just this morning, I
went out and gave them some fresh chopped basil and
asparagus and strawberries because I'm consuming then. So it's kind
of your circle of life.
Speaker 2 (25:25):
Love that.
Speaker 1 (25:26):
Also, the paintball advice, my older brother would have loved
growing up, because he would be like, I'm being healthy
by like tagging my sister with like nailing with the paintball.
Speaker 3 (25:36):
Well, I have three sons, you know, I don't have
any There's no pink happening in my household, so I
have to adapt.
Speaker 2 (25:43):
Fair enough, all right, Doctor Nicole Sapphire. I love you,
appreciate it. You're a busy woman.
Speaker 1 (25:47):
I don't know how you do it all, but you
do it all very well and graciously.
Speaker 2 (25:51):
So appreciate you for coming on.
Speaker 3 (25:54):
Thanks so much for having me, Lisa.
Speaker 1 (25:55):
That was doctor Nicole Sapphire. Appreciate her for making the time.
Appreciate you guys at home for listening every Tuesday and Thursday,
but you can listen throughout the week. I also want
to think John Cassio and my producer were putting the
show together until next time.
So what if I told you that my next guest
wrote about making America Healthy Again before it was a thing,
before it was a national movement. She actually wrote the
book about it back in April of twenty twenty. We'll
talk about why she wrote the book and what she
thinks about the movement today. She's also starting another important
conversation on X or Twitter or tweet, whatever you want
(00:27):
to call it these days.
Speaker 2 (00:28):
But she posted about it.
Speaker 1 (00:30):
She said this, She said, vaccines have saved lives, vaccines
have also ruined lives, So why can't we have that
conversation as a country, that more nuanced conversation about it.
Speaker 2 (00:42):
I'll dive into that question with her.
Speaker 1 (00:44):
Also, we're saying that measles are rearing its ugly head
across the nation. So what's driving this outbreak?
Speaker 2 (00:52):
What do you need to know about it? What can
we do about it? We'll talk to her about that.
Speaker 1 (00:57):
We'll also discuss the alarming increase of breast cancer rates,
particularly in younger women, what's driving that? And finally we'll
talk about what we can do to reclaim our healthiest lives.
What steps can we take to be healthier to live healthier?
So stay tuned for my brilliant friend and my Fox
News colleague, doctor Nicole Sapphire. And in addition to doing
(01:18):
the Fox thing, she does like a billion things. She's
a mom, she's a wife, she does all the things.
But she also has a day job as a radiologist
and the director of breast cancer Imaging at Memorial Sloan Kettering.
She also started a new company called drop r Ex.
So we'll get into all of this with doctor Nicole Sapphire.
Trust me, you don't want to miss it.
Speaker 2 (01:35):
Stay tuned well, doctor Sapphire. It's great to have you on.
Speaker 1 (01:41):
I always love being on air with you, and it's
great to have you on the podcast.
Speaker 3 (01:47):
Thanks so much for having me on, Lisa, I also
love being on air podcasts on everything with you. Your
personality is just incredible.
Speaker 2 (01:54):
Well, and you're awesome. We always have so much fun together.
Speaker 1 (01:57):
I feel bad for the show because, like in commercial breaks,
probably be like you guys, you're like doing television, so
lock it up.
Speaker 3 (02:04):
Do you know where I like to be with you
the most?
Speaker 1 (02:06):
Though?
Speaker 3 (02:07):
I mean, obviously we're very giggly during commercial breaks, but
you're so knowledgeable about so many things that I don't
even think about. And I think that, you know, put
us together and we cover we have We kind of
have this knowledge power where we kind of cover a
lot of different topics and I love it. You complete me,
is what I'm trying to Lisa.
Speaker 2 (02:25):
You complete me. Well, you're brilliant, which is why I
want to do on the show.
Speaker 1 (02:29):
Yeah, it's always funny because you know, obviously people aren't
privy to like what's happening during the commercial breaks, but
basically we're always like giggling together and having fun and
then you know, they get in our ear and they're like, oh,
you guys are about to go live.
Speaker 2 (02:42):
Get seriously, I get serious. But you know that's what
That's what the beautiful.
Speaker 1 (02:48):
Thing about working at Fox is. You know, we get
to be friends with each other and have fun but
also dive into the substance and cover things that are
obviously important to the audience in the country. So and
that's what I love about you is but we can
have fun but then also be serious as well.
Speaker 2 (03:04):
So in that note, I.
Speaker 1 (03:06):
Saw your tweet recently, Well, I guess it's an.
Speaker 2 (03:08):
X is a post? Are we say post?
Speaker 3 (03:09):
Now?
Speaker 2 (03:10):
I don't even know we say tweet?
Speaker 3 (03:11):
I mean, yeah, why not take that away?
Speaker 2 (03:13):
I know, I don't like. I don't like.
Speaker 1 (03:15):
I saw your ex like, I don't even know what
it's called these days, but anyway, I saw your post,
your tweet whatever on X and you you wrote that
vaccines have saved lives, vaccines have also ruined lives. Why
why can't we have that nuanced conversation as a country,
Because that's right. I mean, it can be both and
(03:35):
both are worthy of discussion. So why don't we have
that discussion as a country?
Speaker 3 (03:40):
Well, LI say, you know, the conversation surrounding vaccine, vaccine
safety and hesitancy. It has always been there, but obviously
it is now in the limelight with RFK Junior in
the Make America Healthy Again movement getting ready joining the
Trump administration and really going full throttle right now. And
one of the biggest criticisms are pushback of our junior
(04:00):
and the proposed agenda is how is it going to
affect vaccines? Now? All we have to do is look
back to COVID. I mean, you know better than anybody else.
I mean, there was a lot of controversy around the
vaccine ruleout. Yes, we went through the Emergency Use Authorization.
Operation WARP Speed was an incredible thing. President Trump got
rid of a lot of that red tape to really
(04:20):
try to get vaccines to market, anything that we could
possibly do as the world was in crisis, and he
was able to do that. Now, where they missed the
mark was the mandates with the vaccine and not being
wholly transparent when they started seeing that the efficacy or
the ability of the vaccine to prevent infection, how quickly
(04:42):
that began to wane. And as soon as they started
seeing that signal, they should have been in front of
the camera. You should have seen doctor Fauci and everyone
else saying, hey, guys, what we're seeing is this is
not going to be preventing infection. So let's change our
talking points and say this vaccine should be targeted for
the that are highest risk, because we are still seeing
(05:02):
that it's keeping some people out of the hospital and
we're not having nearly as many deaths from COVID. Unfortunately,
they did not see that, and they left it to
the American public to realize, Hey, I just got the vaccine,
but why do I have COVID all of a sudden,
and so the American people had to put it together ourselves,
and all of a sudden that created this massive distrust.
All the while, you still had the CDC recommending vaccination
(05:25):
for everybody, even in kids young adults, who are our
healthiest population. And then we started seeing safety signal alerts
in these younger populations for the cardiac inflammation as well
as other inflammation. And again it was we were having
to hear from anecdotes online people who were being negatively
affected by these vaccines instead of just coming out and saying, hey, guys,
(05:48):
you know what, we're going to roll back these vaccines
in these healthy population because there are some side effects
and when we're weighing the risk and benefits, you know,
maybe it's not there. But they doubled down on their
mail and they continued on to the point where the
COVID vaccine was added to the childhood vaccination schedule, just
like it was equivalent to measles, mumps, mubella, and polio
(06:11):
and some of these other things. And that's the biggest issue.
So when people are saying RFK Junior is the biggest
anti vaccine history and he's the reason that we have
declining vaccination rates, I call bs on that. No way
the CDC did it to themselves Okay, they're the reason
(06:31):
there is massive distrust in the United States right now
when it comes to vaccines. Now we're seeing in Texas
and we're seeing in New Mexico these outbreaks of measles. Now,
we do see outbreaks of meases every year for the
last several years. Unfortunately, a couple of decades ago, measles
had essentially been eradicated in the United States because of
(06:51):
a large uptake in the MMR vaccines. Over ninety six
percent of children had been vaccinated. Well, global cases of
mess have risen recently, and our vaccination rates against measles
in the United States have started decreasing. So when you
have those opposing factors, you're going to start seeing measles outbreaks,
(07:13):
especially in little pockets of the country where there's a
high rate of unvaccinated individuals. We saw that in New
York right before COVID, and now we're seeing that in Texas.
It popped up in one of these communities where there's
a you know, a higher unvaccinated rate compared to the
rest of the country. Now, the measles doesn't just come
out of nowhere. It has to be introduced somewhere. Now,
(07:36):
is it possible. Usually actually one hundred percent of our
cases in the United States have always been from foreign travel,
whether an individual.
Speaker 1 (07:43):
We also had an influx of you know, open borders
over the past four years. So do you think did
that play a role in sort of you know, bringing
you know, measles you know, across the southern border more
or less.
Speaker 3 (07:55):
Yeah, So that's exactly what we're talking about. We're talking
about Florier states, right, so West Texas. So usually in
the United States you can identify the patient zero, they
traveled abroad and they were exposed to it abroad, and
then they brought it back here. We have yet to
receive information about where it actually came from. They said
they actually don't know. But so the question is, you
(08:16):
do have a lot of immigrants in Texas maybe who
are coming across the border or someone else who has
traveled abroad, so they had to introduce it to that community,
and then from that community, with the low vaccination rate,
it has continued to spread. What I'm finding interesting is
about twenty percent of these cases are an in vaccinated individuals.
So that brings a question to me, is what is
(08:38):
the waning immunity of these measles vaccines, because historically, the
data that we have quoted is if you have two
doses of that MMR vaccine that has a ninety seven
percent rate of preventing infection, ninety seven percent is pretty
dang good. It's nowhere near what we saw with the
COVID vaccine, where essentially was zero that it prevents to infection.
(09:01):
But so if these two noses of the MMR vaccine
prevents infection ninety seven percent of the time, how are
we seeing twenty percent of these cases in Texas and
New Mexico in vaccinated individuals where they just have a
very high exposure. Did they have waning immunity from the vaccine?
You know, these are some questions that I have. But
(09:21):
one thing that I want to point out to people.
You know, when you see people going on television right now,
they're saying, you know, one in five people who get
measles are going to be hospitalized, and there's a one
in one thousand who will have encephalitis or an even
greater or even more smaller number who will die from measles. Yes,
there are some terrifying consequences of measles. I don't wish
(09:43):
it on anybody, but The good news is we have
a lot more modern medical marvels these days then we
did historically when we were collecting all of this data.
So the mortality rates that we have been quoting probably
are outdated. And again, while I don't I won't be
taking my kids to measles exposure parties anytime soon, you know,
(10:07):
because there are serious consequences. Measles likes to infect the
brain and it can be awful. But I do think
that we're not going to see nearly the mortality of
these measles cases as we had seen historically in the past.
Speaker 2 (10:19):
Well, that's a great point.
Speaker 1 (10:20):
And then also like even on the questioning of vaccines,
you know, particularly the COVID vaccine, I think it's hell
for you to be able to have discussion. You know,
science changes, right, and you adapt and you modernize. And
then even with that, I mean you look at the
measles vaccine as well as poliomy. They went through different
iterations throughout time, right, and so I think it's perfectly
fair to you know, question things and to have that
(10:42):
conversation as well, you know. And on that note, you know,
you had talked about how the COVID vaccine was added
to sort of the childhood vaccine schedule. I mean, I
think there's something like fifteen different immunizations, you know, shots
or drops.
Speaker 2 (10:55):
Do is that necessary? Or are we over vaccinating kids?
You know?
Speaker 1 (11:00):
I mean clearly, you know, you pointed out the dangers
of measles Polio also I think has a high fatality
rate for adults.
Speaker 3 (11:06):
You know.
Speaker 1 (11:06):
So there's purpose and things like that, But are we
overdoing it or do we have it right?
Speaker 3 (11:11):
You know? So I'm a nerd, and so I was
live streaming all I like you, confirmational hearings while I
was working in the hospital, like in between patients. I
was listening to all the testimony because I found it
wildly fascinating. And Senator Ran Paul brought up this exact
brought up this exact concept of are we over vaccinating
(11:31):
our children? And I can tell you as a mom,
you know, I believe in the childhood vaccinations and I
certainly have vaccinated my children. Have I given them one
hundred percent of the vaccines on that recommended vaccination schedule? No?
I have not, And that is because I do believe
in individual choice, and I do believe that vaccines should
(11:52):
be based on risk assessment and risk versus benefit when
it comes to measles, monks and rubella and polio etheria
and some of those that really just historically had very
high fatality rates that we had really eradicated. Those are
the ones that I found to be very important. When
you are looking at some of the other things that
are on the recommendated schedule, like hepatitis B, covid and
(12:16):
flu and some of these others, I mean, those are
really for risk based populations. Hepatitis B. As a mother,
you when you are pregnant, you're tested to see if
you have hepatitis B, and so therefore your child upon birth.
If you're negative, your child upon birth is going to
be negative as well. The reason this was added to
the vaccination schedule is just in case you don't know
(12:37):
the hepatitis B status of the mother, Well, if the
mother received routine of stetrical care, you know the status
of her. So rather than just being a knee jerk
reflex that the child should be vaccinated against hepatitis B,
why don't you just ask what the mothers status is
and if it's unknown, you can test the mother. Like
why do we have to preemptively vaccinate our children now
(12:58):
hepatitis B. Certain populations are high risk for contracting hepatitis B.
Healthcare workers for one, intravenous drug users for two. And
so if you fall into these populations as an adult,
then you can make that decision whether or not you
feel that you should be vaccinated against this because now
you're a higher risk individual. But as a child, these
(13:20):
children are not high risk for hepatitis B. Now, you
don't want a child to get hepatitis B. It can
have devastating consequences. But if you know the mother's status,
then you should feel confidently not giving the newborn that vaccine.
Speaker 1 (13:35):
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Speaker 2 (14:46):
In addition, I really don't know how you do it all.
Speaker 1 (14:48):
In addition to being a great mom and wife and
doing the fox stuff and an author, and you just
started a company drop our X, you're also the radiologist
and director of breast imaging at Memorial Sloan Kettering. And
you know what, we have seen increased rates of breast cancer,
particularly in younger women.
Speaker 2 (15:10):
Why why is it increasing? And you know what do
you think is behind that?
Speaker 3 (15:16):
Oh? Well, I mean that is something that is obviously
in my day to day life and of course it's
important that I point out all of these opinions are
my own and not of that of my employer. However,
as someone who delivers a cancer diagnosis to people every
single day of my professional career, which you know most
people don't realize.
Speaker 2 (15:36):
But I do work, that'd be really hard.
Speaker 3 (15:38):
Yeah. Yeah, So breast cancer incidents, or the number of
breast cancer cases is undoubtedly on the rise. And yes,
a part of that is we are screening more, we're
diagnosing more, that's all absolutely true, So therefore we're finding
more cases. However, we are starting to see more aggressive
cases in younger people. And when we look at this,
(15:59):
yesterday I saw two patients in their thirties with aggressive
breast cancer. I feel like I am starting to see
more breast cancer in thirty to forty year olds than
I have ever found before. And so you have to
take a step back and say, well, why is this?
And the reality is it's our environment. There's no black
and white answer. But this goes along with part of
(16:20):
the Make America Healthy Again movement. You know, you mentioned
I wrote the book Make America Health.
Speaker 2 (16:26):
T twenty twenty, So that's the right. Yeah, you're ahead
of the curve, my friend.
Speaker 3 (16:31):
But that whole thing, how bad behavior and big government
is called a trillion dollar crisis. There is an entire
chapter dedicated to cancer and how about fifty percent of
all cancers could potentially be prevented if we just take
certain steps to make sure that we're living our healthiest
lives and we remove some of the toxins around us.
(16:52):
So it's the microplastics, it's the chemicals that we're ingesting,
whether it's from our cosmetics, the lotions. I mean, think
about this, Lisa. So the largest organ in your body
is your skin. Okay, your skin surface. It is highly absorbable, right.
You like to put on lotion because it's absorbed to
the skin. Well, have you ever looked at the ingredients
in your lotion? If there's just one or two, I
(17:15):
don't know what you're putting on because the majority of
ingredients that are in mind, I can't even pronounce. So
we are literally wiping these chemicals all over our bodies
and it's being absorbed into our skin. And not to
mention the stuff that we consume through our foods, through
our drinks, our beverages, just the pollution all around us
and the air I mean, it's no wonder that we
(17:38):
have so much illness. It's not just people not getting
to the gym enough. And but but by the way,
that's a big part of it. And so it's a
huge concern. It's a huge concern when you look at
all of the factors that have contributed to.
Speaker 2 (17:52):
It, you know.
Speaker 1 (17:53):
And I feel guilty right now because I'm drinking water
out of a plastic bottle, which I feel like after
you're saying that is probably pretty dumb.
Speaker 3 (18:03):
We do want to say one that you know me,
you know, and to the fact that you don't have
to be a nutritional expert. You don't have to be
a gym rat. You have to live your life because
I'll tell you, I see patients who are living their
healthiest life. They are, you know, super green, there's no chemicals,
they're not drinking alcohol, they're not smoking, they're exercising five
(18:26):
days a week like they're living their best, healthiest life.
And bad things can still happen. They can still get
a breast cancer because something in their genetic makeup. They
can still get a lymphoma because who knows why. So
what you have heard me say at nauseum is we
can all be doing a little better than we're doing
right now. We can all be being a little bit healthier,
(18:47):
moving our body a little bit more. But at the
end of the day, we need to enjoy your life
because we only have one of them.
Speaker 1 (18:54):
What I appreciate about you, and this is something that
I kind of realized during COVID, particularly because they would
have doctors try to convince me to get the COVID
vaccine or you know, even after try to convince me
to get the flu vaccine, and I'm like, or flu shot. Rather,
it's not a vaccine, but and I'm like, I'm young
and healthy. I'd rather just build up my natural immunity
and tackle it that way. But there seems to because
(19:16):
what I love about you is obviously you have the
medical background. You know, went to school, you did all
the things, you look at the studies, but you also
play common sense and logic in that aspect.
Speaker 2 (19:28):
You know, this is probably you know, a broad accusation, but.
Speaker 1 (19:30):
That seems to be more lost nowadays in the medical community.
Speaker 2 (19:34):
Would would you agree with that? And if so, why
do you like? What would you attribute that to? You know?
Why is that?
Speaker 3 (19:41):
I The reality is I think a lot of people
have common sense, but they will not admit to it publicly.
So what these positions may say to you publicly and
on the record maybe something completely different of what they're
telling their family and friends off the record. I think
that people are definitely afraid of being.
Speaker 2 (20:00):
Because we've had, you know, conversation.
Speaker 1 (20:01):
Obviously we're friends, we texted, we've talked offline, But then
I've also heard this stuff. So I will give you
credit for you know, you tell the truth and regardless where.
Speaker 2 (20:10):
It is, So I appreciate that about you.
Speaker 3 (20:12):
I appreciate that. Yeah, no, it it can be really hard.
You can absolutely so that you mentioned a tweet or
a post I put on X a little while ago,
and I said, vaccines have saved lives, vaccines have ruined lives.
Do you know what the beauty of that tweet was?
I got attacked from both sides.
Speaker 2 (20:33):
You're making no friends with that one.
Speaker 3 (20:37):
If you can't acknowledge that truth, you're part of the
problem and you will no way be able to help
with the solution. And that was the issue that I had.
The biggest issue I had with the COVID vaccine was
I was, okay, you know, adults, I understood that it
was decreasing. It was decreasing severity in the older cases.
When we thought it was reducing transmission, I'm like, you
(20:58):
know what, let's all be a part of this big
you know, let's kumbaya, hold our hands together and try
to get this under control so we can all get
back to our lives. The moment they became readily apparent
it was not preventing transmission, it's like, all right, that's
an off pullback. And I'll tell you I always said
I do not believe we should be vaccinating our children.
(21:21):
I wrote about it over and over and over again.
I was very concerned about the inflammatory effects of that
vaccine on kids. And because of that, I was called
by a lot of people to be part of the
anti VAXX movement. But the reality is you can be
anti mandate and still support vaccines. And that was the
problem people. You had to be all or nothing. You
(21:43):
had to be all in or you were outcast during
that time, and that became amplified during COVID and it
still is. And I'll tell you a lot of these
people that are going on TV, I would say ninety
percent of them are saying one thing to the public,
but maybe they're a little bit more loosey goose to
their family and friends, but they do not want to
be boxed out as supporting any sort of vaccine hesitancy.
Speaker 1 (22:08):
And before we go, you know, I've had doctor Martin McCarey,
another former colleague of ours, but he has left us.
Speaker 3 (22:14):
But he's but you know what, I'm glad he's going
where he's going maybe overhaul.
Speaker 1 (22:19):
Yeah, and he'll be great with the Trump administration. But uh,
or is it CDC off the top of my head, right,
f D A f D A FDA.
Speaker 2 (22:28):
Rather who's is? No, that's NaHg about a chart?
Speaker 1 (22:31):
Okay, I'm going through my mind all right, But anyways,
he is moving on. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (22:34):
But so he had mentioned that.
Speaker 1 (22:36):
In medical school that they that you study like an
old food pyramid and like you very briefly talk about,
you know, food health and in that aspect of the equation,
and that's like outdata, not even you know, scientifically sound anymore.
Speaker 2 (22:50):
But if you had to lay out three of.
Speaker 1 (22:52):
The most important things to try to be healthy, to
try to stay healthy, what would your guidance be?
Speaker 3 (22:58):
Yeah, so I don't even think we've saw the food
pyramid when I was in medical school. I think I
remember that from elementary school. Really medical school is about
being able to understand disease and knowing the medications to
prescribe to treat it. And that's the reality. But mind you,
I did go to medical school a while ago, so
maybe things have evolved. I know there's a lot more
DEI classes. I didn't have those. But for me living
(23:21):
my healthiest life, and I really do try to lead
by example. I post a law on Instagram. You know,
a little bit less on x some of the things
that we do at our household, but I for me
and my family, you have to get your body moving.
I mean we are. We exercise and not in sensives
like gym rats. Like we'll go to the trampoline park.
(23:41):
You know, we'll go and play tag outside. We have
we have paintballs. We run out and play like paintball wars.
So making sure your body is moving is probably one
of the best possible things that you can do. It
doesn't mean you have to go be a gym rat,
because I find the gym to be very boring. The
other thing is you have to increase your fruits and
vegetable intake. I mean it is so vital. There are
(24:04):
so many nutrients in fruits and vegetables. You don't want
to just be popping a multi vitamin because I can
tell you you're not getting the nutrition from those multivitamins
as you are from fresh fruits and vegetables. And so
I have a garden, and I'm not saying everybody needs
to create a garden, but you need to maintain yourself
on the periphery at the grocery store because that's where
all the healthy stuff is. Once you start going to
(24:25):
the center of the grocery store, that's where all the
crap is. So if you can just stay on the
perifery of the grocery store and get your vegetables, your fruits,
then you go to your meats and your dairies. For me,
I really do try to decrease the amount of hormones
and antibiotics that my family consumes, because I think that's
a huge part in why we're seeing colon cancer, antibiotic resistance,
(24:48):
and even some breast cancers because of our intake of
hormones and the antibiotics. So I really try to look
for hormone free antibiotic free, and I also have chickens
now because I want my my own eggs, and so
I'm not a farmer by any stretch of the imagination.
But I do have hens, and I do have my
own eggs, and that is how I guarantee that there
(25:09):
are no hormones in those eggs, there are no antibiotics
in those eggs, and so I feed my hens the
same thing I feed my family. Just this morning, I
went out and gave them some fresh chopped basil and
asparagus and strawberries because I'm consuming then. So it's kind
of your circle of life.
Speaker 2 (25:25):
Love that.
Speaker 1 (25:26):
Also, the paintball advice, my older brother would have loved
growing up, because he would be like, I'm being healthy
by like tagging my sister with like nailing with the paintball.
Speaker 3 (25:36):
Well, I have three sons, you know, I don't have
any There's no pink happening in my household, so I
have to adapt.
Speaker 2 (25:43):
Fair enough, all right, Doctor Nicole Sapphire. I love you,
appreciate it. You're a busy woman.
Speaker 1 (25:47):
I don't know how you do it all, but you
do it all very well and graciously.
Speaker 2 (25:51):
So appreciate you for coming on.
Speaker 3 (25:54):
Thanks so much for having me, Lisa.
Speaker 1 (25:55):
That was doctor Nicole Sapphire. Appreciate her for making the time.
Appreciate you guys at home for listening every Tuesday and Thursday,
but you can listen throughout the week. I also want
to think John Cassio and my producer were putting the
show together until next time.
Host
Lisa Boothe
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