Nerd Sesh - Real or Fake: Lakers DESTROY Thunder, Nuggets in FREE FALL - The Volume

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
The volume. No, Oh my god, how could he do that?

Speaker 2 (00:18):
What Charles Darwin? The nerves is where it's at.

Speaker 3 (00:23):
Welcome everybody back into Nerd session as always, I'm Carson Bradburn.
Alongside me is Logan Camden and we are officially into
the final week of the NBA regular season and we
had a pretty eventful penultimate weekend of the regular season.
You can look that one up in your dictionary. Logan, penultimate,
I mean second to last. I spoiled it for you.

(00:44):
Lot went down, and I think the biggest story to
come out of the weekend was the Los Angeles Lakers
just beating down the Oklahoma City Thunder, blowing them out.
And what do you make of that result? Logan? Was
that real or.

Speaker 4 (01:01):
I can't call it fake? And Carson, you're breaking out
these big syllable words. You're gonna make my brain overheat.

Speaker 3 (01:07):
Man, I'm sorry about that.

Speaker 1 (01:08):
I can't call it.

Speaker 4 (01:10):
Fake because it's something that I can't rule out happening again.
If these teams were able to do battle like I
think the Lakers have a superpower, and that superpower is
the ability to spray from beyond the arc. They out
shot Oklahoma City by thirty points from the three point line.
They were obliterating the OKC zone. They were attacking and abusing,

(01:32):
switching bigs on the perimeter, and they kept just spamming
high screens and handoffs, spraying threes. And I mean, this
is a Lakers team that we've talked about over the
last few weeks, had been in a bit of a skid,
and they were due to look way better, and I
think they got cranked up for one of the bigger
games in the back half of the season against the
best team in the West. Interrelated with that, I also

(01:53):
have to say I thought this was a piss poor
defensive effort from Oklahoma City.

Speaker 1 (01:58):
I have to lament them.

Speaker 4 (01:59):
Oklahoma City allowed one hundred and twenty six points in
this game. It's the second highest offensive rating allowed in
a game by OKC this year, and it's the ninth
time Oklahoma City is allowed one hundred and twenty five
or more points in a game this season. The most
staggering number to me about all this, though, was the
fact that Los Angeles generated thirty six open or wide

(02:20):
open threes in this game. They took forty on the night,
thirty six of them were classified as either open or
wide open. That's when a defender is four to six
feet away from the jump shooter. And they shot twenty
of thirty six on those looks fifty five percent. I mean,
we're just spraying all game long. So you know, I
thought LA had a really good game plan. I thought

(02:42):
they executed. I thought they killed them from behind the arc.
But also with that, I thought the Thunder were lazy,
a step slow all game and really sleep walking. And
that's just defensively. Offensively, I thought we got big letdown
games from the supporting cast from Jdubb sixteen points on
four four team Chet Holmgren in Foul Trouble had four

(03:03):
f twenty four minute hees on you know, kind of
a restriction only scores ten.

Speaker 1 (03:07):
Points in this game.

Speaker 4 (03:09):
So I can't say it was a fake result, because
in a hypothetical series against LA or something like this,
I could see LA doing this in a couple of games.

Speaker 1 (03:17):
Like this offense is legit.

Speaker 4 (03:19):
I'm not surprised at all that LA could do this
in an individual game. But there are things that I
expect in a playoff series to swing back in Oklahoma
City's favor. I expect JDub and Chet to be better.
I expect the surrounding shooters to shoot better, and I
really expect a much better defensive performance from Oklahoma City.
That's the biggest thing to me. This has been a

(03:39):
historic defense all year long. I don't think that's fake.
I think the sample size and what I've come to
no and believe from this group is real. I just
can't imagine Oklahoma City sleep walking through a game defensively
like this. Again, that was the most disappointing thing for
me from this Thunder team. But I can't say anything
negative about this I think it is among the best

(04:02):
in the NBA.

Speaker 3 (04:04):
It was a phenomenal offensive performance by the Lakers, for sure.
Part of that was outlier shot making. Like I'm glad
that you mentioned that this was a defensive performance by
okay See that is way below their standard. I thought
that a lot of the rotations were not as sharp
as normal. I thought a lot of the closeouts were
slower than normal. It was not a high effort performance.

(04:27):
And to be fair, they really have nothing to play
for other than pride. I mean, obviously they have the
one seed locked up by far, so LA was able
to generate a lot of open good looks from three
at the same time. They made them at a ridiculous clip.
And it wasn't just like open catch and shoot threes.
We're talking about their raining pull up threes. Luca cannot
miss on some tough step backs. Then you have Lebron

(04:50):
just like hitting turnaround over turnaround, like the two point
jumpers were all falling like it was insane. They became
the ninth team ever in the first half of this
game to have a half. This is actually before the
Austin Reeves heave where they made fifteen plus threes and
made at least seventy percent of them. So that is
the biggest difference in this game. Because you mentioned the

(05:11):
numbers specifically on open and wide open threes, where la
is shooting fifty five percent, the Thunder generated almost as
many open and wide open threes. They had thirty three
of them they made ten. So if one team's gonna
shoot fifty five percent on their good looks from three
and the other team is gonna shoot thirty percent on
their good looks from three, the team that shoots thirty
percent is just not going to win that game ever

(05:31):
in the NBA, and they're honestly going to struggle to
be competitive a vast majority of the time. I did
think that OKC was able to get some good looks
in this game that just did not fall from the perimeter.
And I also thought they're finishing was bad in this game.
They had more than double the restricted area attempts that
LA did, but just were not efficient at the rim.
And I thought that especially Jadab missed a whole lot

(05:53):
of layups in this one and just had a bad
offensive game overall. But although I thought LA's offense was
probably the most impressive aspect of this game, I mean
just the shot making, it was a ridiculous display. I
did think their defensive game plan was very effective and
was well executed. They mixed in a little bit of
zone and Okase he actually did fine against the zone

(06:14):
when Shay was on the floor. They had eleven points
on seven possessions against the zone. But what they consistently
did was sit in all of those gaps whenever SGA
has the ball, help very aggressively and basically just take
away any easy driving lanes for him so he can't
get all the way downhill. I thought that Shay was

(06:35):
actually great as a playmaker, making them pay with the
right reads and the right passes for dedicating so much
defensive attention and loading up the paint like that. And
I thought that Shay was excellent as a shot maker
in this game, Like they're forcing him into a little
bit more of a mid range heavy shot diet, but
he was phenomenal from the mid range and even on
a couple of tough drives, like just a pair of

(06:57):
ridiculous finishes in this game where you just see combination
of length in his control of the ball of English,
so so impressive. So I actually thought that Shay was
quite good all things considered. He had twenty six points,
nine assists, just one turnover, fifty two percent shooting from
the field. He just didn't get to line a single
time in this game. And I thought, honestly had a
pretty tough whistle. I thought he got fouled on a

(07:19):
couple drives in the third quarter and neither one was called.

Speaker 4 (07:22):
I didn't like, sorry, not just add allan real quick.
I didn't like Oklahoma City's whistle, like it all during
this game, I thought, in all phases.

Speaker 3 (07:29):
I would agree. I also thought that Jada needs to
finish better. But it looked like there was a driver
or two, where he got fouled, but also just like
other guys need to make shots around Shay, I thought
that he did a good job of attacking a coverage
that was designed to take away his own easy offense.
He's getting you the right looks. You just have to
make those shots. And that's where it's like, can I

(07:51):
call this result fake? I don't know the Lakers were
the better team, but is it like a long term
concern for me when the number one three point shooting
team by percentage in twenty twenty five has won really
bad three point shooting game and the Lakers, who are
a good shooting team, have won insane like historic shooting
half in overall great shooting performance. I'm not going to
panic about that and overreact to that in this one

(08:14):
game sample size. I do think one of the offensive
concerns that I'm seeing a lot of people bring up
for Oksey in this game was Jadub's performance, because that's
been a question for this team end to end. It
was a question last year. Can he be the consistent
second creator this team needs him to be if they
want to make a deep playoff run and win the title.
Can he carry the non Shay minutes and this was

(08:36):
a bad game by him. I thought that he really
really struggled to create any sort of advantage, particularly when
he was matched up with Vando, who is just such
a phenomenal perimeter defender. And like I said, he forced
some tough finishes on some drives and really was not
efficient as a scorer whatsoever. And he does have to
be better than this, obviously if they want to win
the title. He does have to be more consistent. But

(08:59):
I also think that there's just this dynamic with OKC
where every time anything goes wrong, it's like the biggest
story in the NBA. Honestly. It reminds me a lot
of Boston last year actually, and like people just hyper
fixate on, oh, this is the one thing that could
go wrong for them. But it's like, over his last
twenty five games, Jadob's giving you twenty two and a
half points, five boards, five assists on sixty percent true shooting.

(09:22):
He's been playing really well for an extended stretch since
he broke out of that shooting slump that he was
in earlier in the year. The offense was really struggling
in the minutes without Shay early in the season, and
post All Star Break, They've actually been really good in
those minutes when Jadub is out there without Shay. So
I'm just not going to overreact to that either, like
it's one bad game. The Thunder are capable of playing

(09:44):
bad games. They're allowed to play a bad game. I
do think the discourse after this game that I've seen
does reflect the fact that a lot of people, I
think are looking for those reasons to doubt Okac. I
would say, let's see how the rematch goes on Tuesday
before we're drawing any conclusions much bigger than that about
their struggles in this individual game.

Speaker 1 (10:04):
I think that's a pretty level headed way to look
at it.

Speaker 4 (10:07):
I mean, I'm not really surprised at the reaction just
because it's the Lakers.

Speaker 1 (10:12):
It's the number one team in the West.

Speaker 3 (10:13):
Because Wallace, Wallace and Gromitt come here in Palm, it
don't matter.

Speaker 1 (10:18):
Lakers in five.

Speaker 4 (10:20):
Yeah, man, I I'm not surprised at the reaction, But
I do think the Lakers kind of give you a
glimpse into what that recipe would look like again in
a single series. I think you're gonna have to generate.
I think you're gonna have to shoot the hell out
of the ball. I think I would be looking to
spray from behind the arc. I think it's easier to
shoot on Oklahoma City than it is trying to get

(10:42):
in the teeth of the defense and making things happen
like this is a really good defense at collapsing in
those driving lanes and forcing turnovers and so when you're
not even giving them an opportunity, right, I thought LA
did a really good job of switching Chedd and Hartenstein
out and picking on those guys more when they're on
the perimeter getting those switches. But also, like I said,

(11:03):
just not getting downhill. I feel like that plays into
against Oklahoma City and what they want to do because
they have so many guys that are good at forcing turnovers.

Speaker 1 (11:11):
And getting rid of the ball.

Speaker 4 (11:12):
But again, to me, this feels like an aberration where
if we're looking at a seven game series, it's just
hard for me to imagine all of these factors coming
together in four separate games for Oklahoma City to get
bounced in a fashion this ugly.

Speaker 1 (11:28):
The West is so.

Speaker 4 (11:29):
Damn strong, Carson, I'm not I don't even know, man,
I'm I'm more close to like this is just the wild,
wild West than anything else, Like the Oklahoma City is
my favorite, but every team is so damn good out there.

Speaker 3 (11:42):
But so you like Loop, They're still in my Tier
one and they're separated from every other team, but.

Speaker 1 (11:53):
Every other team is so good.

Speaker 4 (11:55):
It's like, I can imagine Oklahoma City dropping two or
three games. I can, you know, envision it being a
close series. But again, there's just there's isolated things in
this game that I think are anomalies.

Speaker 1 (12:06):
That it starts with the lasadaisical defensive.

Speaker 4 (12:09):
Effort, and it also starts with the outlier three point
shooting from from LA. So it's just I think people
are going to react like this. I think Oklahoma City
is the new kids on the block. I think people
want to find a chink in the arm or want
to be able to say this is why they're gonna
go down. I don't know, man, I'm just not there.
I think that I trust Jada Moore, I trust Chet Moore.

(12:32):
I think this team is way better than last year.
I think they addressed the biggest issues that sunk their
boat last season, and I think people want something to
talk about right now. Man. I think it's I think
people are gonna pile on I'm just I have a
lot more confidence in Oklahoma City that this is not
gonna happen over a seven game series.

Speaker 3 (12:50):
Yeah, I honestly think that this game has very little
to do with OKAC and like really shouldn't impact your opinion.
I think it says more just about how good the Lakers.

Speaker 4 (12:58):
Can be at their back, and I think that I
think JJ Reddick had a really good game plan on
both sides of the ball for Oklahoma City. Like their
execution was, yeah, flawless in they were so deliberate and
like they were just focused on the details in this game.
They kept screening like it seemed like it was a
point of emphasis, pulling those right wing threes, getting those

(13:20):
handoffs in that exact segan.

Speaker 1 (13:24):
I didn't say.

Speaker 4 (13:25):
Purpose, they they seemed like they had a really good
game a game plan for Oklahoma City, and I thought
they executed really well and they.

Speaker 1 (13:32):
Just played better. They would a better team in his game.
I can't deny it.

Speaker 3 (13:35):
JJ is a great coach for sure. I do think
that if we were to see this matchup over a
full series, OKAC is going to have to live with
switching defensively because you mentioned Luca was able to take
advantage of a lot of those possessions where Hartenstein and
Chet switched out on him, But a vast majority of
that was with tough shot making. It was with step

(13:57):
back threes over the top of the room especially, was
like getting great contests consistently, I just think that you
have to live with making him. But he was a
scorer at this point because Luca was phenomenal in this game.
I mean, he was absolutely nails. He was fantastic. But
we've seen him be inconsistent as a scorer in LA.

(14:18):
We've seen him struggle at times to punish switching by
getting by people and be very reliant on his pull
up shooting, which can be inconsistent. So if I have
to make the choice between living with one of my
bigs who I feel actually guard pretty well in space,
and trying to get those guys to force Luca to

(14:38):
beat them one on one with tough shot making compared
to like sending a panicked double as they did a
few times after Luca had been cooking them, but again
mostly just with really phenomenal shot making, Like if you
send that second defender at Luca, He's going to pick
you apart. And this isn't last year's Dallas team. We're
obviously okay. So he was crazy aggressive on Luca and
Kyrie with blitzing every pick and roll, consistently sending two

(15:01):
defenders at them and saying, Derek Jones Junior PJ. Washington
make shots. It's not Derek Jones Junior anymore. Now, it's
Rye ho Chi Murr, who's been one of the best
catch and shooters in basketball. It's Gabe Vincent, who's a
really good three point shooter, it's DFS who's a forty
percent three point shooter, or it's Austin Reeves. Like there's
just too much shooting around Luca and Lebron to be
sending two defenders at them. And I do think that

(15:24):
for both of them at this point, they're passing is
their absolute superpower, more so even than their scoring, because
like Lebron also when they were switching Cason Wallace Caruso
onto him, like, yeah, he made some great shots. He's
not just like walking to the rim. He's shooting tough
turnarounds over them. That's better than a wide open three

(15:45):
for a great catch and shooter or an easy look
at the rim for somebody. And I do think that, Like,
also they can play Luca better off the switches, especially Hartenstein.
I don't know why he's picking up Luca thirty five
plus feed out, like you're kind of begging to get
beaten off the ball. At that point you know that
he's gonna target you. And maybe Hartenstein is the defensive

(16:05):
weak point for OKC in this matchup, and maybe they
do kind of have to take him off the floor
more so they feel really comfortable switching all the way
one through five. But regardless, I just think and that
is the strategy for them, And like this was a
special Luca game as a scorer, but I am going
to make him prove that he could do that consistently
because he hasn't been doing that as consistently in LA.

(16:26):
Whereas with the passing, I know that he's gonna kill
you every time.

Speaker 4 (16:29):
Well, I think that's the appeal of adding in Isaiah
Hartenstein is because it gives you that positional versatility that
we've been talking about that's so important in specific matchups.
Right against Denver, you would want to run that chedd
and Hardenstein, look, because you need two big bodies to
match up with jokicen the pain in this matchup. I
think that, if it makes more sense, do that you're
not giving up a ton of size. Like LA is

(16:51):
a feisty rebounding team. They're gonna try hard on the glass,
but they don't have a ton of size. So it's like,
I don't think you're getting bullied by anybody on that team,
And if you need to make that adjustment.

Speaker 1 (17:00):
I would.

Speaker 4 (17:01):
I wanna go back to the point you just made
about Luca though, with these all time players sometimes it
really is a picture poison sort of deal. And I
think you're exactly right, Carson, because it's like, if you
give him the lane, what is Luca gonna do? We've
watched it for six years now.

Speaker 1 (17:18):
He's so strong.

Speaker 4 (17:20):
Now he's gonna beat a guy down right to that
little elbow spot. He's gonna work to his little touch
shot that's easy every time, and he's gonna make it.
And if you're asking me what I would rather settle
for Luca, take all the step back threes over my
seven footer that you want. Those are hard shots and
shots that if you look at his stats over you

(17:40):
know since he got to LA, there are shots that
he hasn't been making right I think he's looked a
little bit better, but on the whole, he's not the Luca.
He's not the Luca that I think he was like
last year. I still think this is a step down
from the Luca that he was in the playoffs even
last year beat up, Like, I don't think he's I
don't think he's at peaked lou level, and I would

(18:01):
tend to live with those shots in a series and
just give him. Like you said, man, you're blitzen two.
You're gifting the Lakers points. You just can't do that
against two players like Luca and Lebron. You can't give
them freebies. And I felt like Oklahoma City gave him
a lot in this game.

Speaker 3 (18:17):
My opinion after last year was that Luca wasn't even
better passer than a score. And with the guy who's
been in LA as a scorer where it's like twenty
seven a game on fifty six percent true, he's shooting
forty eight percent on two pointers. Like, I don't even
think it's close. I think he's a way better passer
than he is a score. But he's still capable of
these sort of nuclear scoring performances. And this is why

(18:39):
I can't quit the Lakers.

Speaker 1 (18:40):
Man.

Speaker 3 (18:40):
When they come with a good defensive game plan and
they engage defensively and you get the best version of Luca,
they're still so damn good. They have that elite superstar
superpower and then they have great shooting around them, and
if they can be a solid team defense, they are
really hard to beat. So that's why we had Tyler
hoop Venue on our last show and he was saying, like,

(19:02):
do you guys all agree that the two through four
in the West or the Clippers and the Warriors and
the Timberwolves. And I was like, I just don't know
if I can quit the Lakers, man. I can't put
the Timberwolves above them. I'll tell you that I don't
trust their offense enough. But it's just gonna hinge on
what level Lucas at and what level they can get
too defensively. And this was a really good performance for
them on both of those fronts. There was another team

(19:24):
that had a really good weekend logan, and that is
the Houston Rockets, who just cannot lose right now. They've
been on an absolute heater. They've pulled away from the
pack for the two seed and they beat both the
Thunder and the Warriors this past weekend. What did you
take away from their impressive weekend.

Speaker 4 (19:42):
I'm so impressed with Houston, man like. I like that
they don't let any of that noise affect them. Man, Houston,
don't listen to none of that nonsense. I really like
ima U Doka too. I think he's a I think
he's a good coach for young teams. But I was
really impressed with what they did against Golden State, and
they're Big three, specifically Steph.

Speaker 1 (20:00):
They held Steph to.

Speaker 4 (20:01):
Three points on one of ten from the field, one
to eight from deep with four turnovers. The Warriors Big
three as a hole together Steph, Jimmy and Dre eighteen
points six to twenty from the field with nine turnovers.
Remember this is also a game from Golden State in
which b Pods, who has been balling recently, gave you

(20:23):
nineteen and Buddy gave you twenty points on six of
eleven shooting. When the supporting cast does that for Golden State,
when you get any performance from two supporting members of
the cast for Golden State, that should be.

Speaker 1 (20:36):
A game that they win. Like shout out Looney for
how he battled on the glass.

Speaker 4 (20:40):
I think he would be imperative in a hypothetical series
against Houston. I think they need him to match them
on the glass, and he's really important.

Speaker 1 (20:48):
But they dogged.

Speaker 4 (20:50):
They dogged the Stars in Golden State, and that's the
thing with Houston.

Speaker 1 (20:54):
I think they can disrupt the opposing team.

Speaker 4 (20:56):
Superstar almost as good as anybody in the NBA, especially
if they're per are oriented making life hard on SGA.

Speaker 1 (21:03):
In Oklahoma City when they played, they got a rock
solid identity.

Speaker 4 (21:08):
They are all hard, all tenacity. And that's the thing
with Houston. Man, because we've been critical, Carson and I
don't look at Houston as a drastically different team. I
don't doubt that Houston has the talent and is capable
of winning a playoff series. I think they're there because
they have serious advantages that they can exert over other teams.

(21:29):
Size and athleticism, effort, energy, hustle, heart, just generating extra possessions.
This is stuff we've talked about all year long with Houston.
It is the hallmark, the bedrock of this basketball team.
They are fourth and defensive rating, their second defensive rating
post All Star Break. They're number one in rebounds per game,
and number one and rebound rate. They're number one in

(21:51):
offensive rebounds per game and offensive rebound rate. I mentioned
what they did defensively against Golden State on the glass.
Against Oklahoma City, they big forty eight to thirty three
in total rebounds, and they beat Oklahoma City fourteen to
seven on the offensive glass. It's like, I know what
I'm getting from Houston. The variable to me is still

(22:12):
the exact same the playoff series. Victory in a deep
playoff run is contingent on the consistency of Jalen Green
and Oprah and Sengoon on offense and when they can
give it to you. I think Houston can beat anybody
in the league. Oklahoma City, you get thirty four from
Jalen Green, you get thirty one from sing Gooon Boom.

Speaker 1 (22:30):
I ain't gotta worry.

Speaker 4 (22:31):
About the offense. We're dogging the other team against Golden State.
Jalen Green. What I felt like, not like nostre damins,
because Jayleen Green does this every other game. But last
episode I mentioned Jalen Green can just rip off ten
twelve point stretches by himself at times in the fourth
quarter against Golden State had ten straight. It's like They

(22:53):
are capable, they are talented, they can do it. It's
the consistency of it is what I'm still skeptical about with.
It's not a talent thing, man, it's just a reliability
of that offense and so of Courson. If I can
get this level from Jalen Green consistently, I'm not worried
about Houston right, Like, if they get that, they're gonna
be a team that could go on a deep playoff run.

(23:15):
The biggest question of that it is answered, is just
that one red flag. But we've said it. They're not
gonna be an easy out. Like, these are things that
make you hard to beat, and if you can't match
them on the glass, Houston could very well dog a
soft ass team.

Speaker 3 (23:32):
Yeah, this was like the best possible version of the
Rockets what we saw over the weekend. Because you mentioned
you're getting a really good version offensively of Jalen Green
and Shngon. You are getting a dominant overall defensive showing
and you're just dominating the possession game. You're dominating on
the glass, and that's what the Rockets do at an

(23:54):
unbelievable level. They are historically great on the offensive glass.
They had third the offensive boards over these two games,
and they were plus eighteen on the glass overall. So
that is something that is really important to acknowledge because
I do have major concerns about the Rockets half court
offense that I bring up a lot, but they are

(24:15):
an outlier in their ability to just generate more chances
for themselves than you, and you don't need to be
as efficient if you're just getting more chances. So that
is a real major advantage of theirs. And then defensively,
Aman Thompson is just one of the best on the
planet and my god, Logan, I love him so much,

(24:37):
but what an incredible weekend this was from him. Some
of the plays that he made across these two games
are just absolutely absurd, saving plays at the rim as
a shot blocker, blowing up a lob pass to Jimmy
Butler from an angle that just shouldn't have been possible,
stealing an inbound from Steph and then somehow saving it
to a teammate and blanketing Steph off ball for extended stretches.

(25:00):
He also had a block in the Thunder game on
SGA on a pull up jumper that was just insane,
and like the possession before that he made a pull
up jumper super super hard on him. It's just absurd.
The athleticism that he has at his size, with his
instincts and with his motor, He's just a one of
a kind defensive monster. And I always say one of

(25:20):
a kind with him, even though Asar is very similar
in a lot of ways, especially defensively, but they're just
two total outlier freak talents, and Amen has just been
the Rockets best player. Man, he just is their best player.
I understand a lot of people will look to Shengon
with the elite defensive value that he is bringing you,
the elite versatility, the elite perimeter defense, the elite rimp protection,

(25:42):
the elite on ball defense, the elite off ball defense,
the elite transition defense, the elite rebounding as a wing.
While offensively, in his forty one games as a starter
a men is averaging sixteen to nine to five on
sixty percent true shooting with three point three stocks per game.
He's just the most tactful player on winning for this team.
And he still has so much room for growth. He's

(26:04):
going to be an All Star next year. Stamp it.
And if they were gonna give an All start of
the Rockets this year. I get it that he wasn't
playing quite as much at the start of the year,
but sheng Gun just didn't deserve it, and like Amen,
has been their best player in totality this year. But
he is just a testament to their other superpower along
with their rebounding, which is that they can overwhelm you

(26:26):
athletically and they can overwhelm you defensively. I also think
Fred van Vliet so impressive his ability to just stay
attached to steph off ball, such an incredibly smart defensive
player and one of the best defenders ever at his size.
So like, collectively, their defensive versatility and athleticism is absolutely insane,
and you saw that in this one. My concern with

(26:48):
them remains the half court offense, and I can acknowledge
the things that they do at an incredibly high level.
I still just don't think that I can bet on
one of the worst half court offenses in the league,
which is what they are. They're like a twentieth percent
all half court offense winning a playoff series in a
conference that is so damn good. This is a rule
that I live by in the playoffs, I do not

(27:10):
bet on bad half court offenses, And maybe they could
be the exception, because we're talking about a lot of
the teams that we've seen walk into the playoffs with
bad half court offenses in recent years and then underperform.
But like the fact that the Rockets win the possession
game so convincingly so often could be the difference maker.
It could, but it still doesn't override the concern I

(27:33):
have just about who is manufacturing the clutch offense if
the game does slow down a bit, who is consistently
getting you those quality shots? Is the shot making good enough?
Is the offensive decision making good enough when you're looking
at a team that has these established offensive superstars and
elite shooting, because that's what you're running into, probably even
in a first round series. That's why I'm going to

(27:54):
remain lower on Houston than the consensus. And like Rockets fans,
if you got go out there and you win a
playoff series against the team that I picked to beat you,
or you make the conference finals, like throw rocks at me,
I think that you would be obviously totally entitled to
be furious with me, because I understand I have doubted
this team within the context of this season and They've

(28:16):
been so impressive. They're beating everybody right now. But I'm
going to continue to doubt them big picture until I
see them overcome what I consider to be the biggest
flaw that any team can have going into the playoffs.

Speaker 1 (28:26):
It is the biggest flaw.

Speaker 4 (28:27):
But I mean, like you said, they do have superpowers
and stuff that they hang their head on the thing, and.

Speaker 3 (28:32):
They're going to be hell to play. They are going
to suck to play.

Speaker 4 (28:35):
The thing that I'm glad you bring up Van Vleet
because it really is crazy when you watch Van vliet
Amen and Brooks. The word I would use with Houston
is just pressure. They apply pressure. They never let you
get comfortable.

Speaker 3 (28:48):
And of course Tarry Easton too.

Speaker 4 (28:51):
Yeah, dude it they just swarm you the whole game.

Speaker 1 (28:55):
They swallow you up.

Speaker 4 (28:56):
They they put you in a box and it's hard
when nothing's easy. It's like the one thing that blew
my mind was when I watched Steph airball that three.

Speaker 1 (29:04):
I think Looney was on the court.

Speaker 4 (29:07):
I think Looney sent him like a little uh like
pinned down screen at the right uh on the right wing,
and Steph curled around was pretty open and they recovered decently,
but it's still a pretty uncontested shot for Steph and
Steph airball is it? And I'm like, you just don't
see that. Like, sure, Steph will miss the three. Steph
takes hard shots every single game. Sometimes he's on, he'll

(29:30):
make all of them, sometimes he'll he's off, He'll miss some.
He airballed on a shot that wasn't tipped. It was
just contested. Like when you can make Steph Curry that
uncomfortable like that, that speaks volumes to me. Like they
had him I won't say rattled, but they had him
working and he couldn't get anything uncomfort And so when
I look at some of these hypothetical matchups, and I

(29:50):
don't want to get deep into any of them because
how close. Like every team has forty six at forty's
wins right now, so that's insane. There's no telling who
is gonna play Houston and Golden State. I don't think
it's gonna be a cakewalk for Golden State. I mean,
you just saw how hard they made life on this team,
Like Houston's got real advantages against them.

Speaker 1 (30:10):
Memphis.

Speaker 4 (30:10):
I think I might pick Houston to beat them just
because I like their identity more and I think they
have similar struggles when it comes to that half court offense.
So I don't want to get too much into any
of these battles, but I think regardless of who plays Houston,
I would give Houston a punching chance, and I would
say it's gonna go six or seven games. This team's

(30:32):
gonna fight and claw and scratch. And they just got
motor Man. They got a V eight V twelve for sure,
V sixteen, they got a Max motor Man.

Speaker 3 (30:40):
They never give up, insane athletes on the perimeter, insane
collective rim protection. Like they're one of the best perimeter
defenses and one of the best interior defenses. They're one
of the best transition defenses in basketball. And like you said, man,
they bring hell to you. They are as fiery as
any team Defensively, they do apply that next level pressure

(31:01):
and they forced a steph Curry klunker man, and I
do want to talk about that aspect of the Warriors
Rockets game for a bit, because the Warriors had themselves
a hell of a weekend where they're reeling off three
straight super impressive wins over Memphis, the Lakers, and then
Denver and then they come back to Earth with the

(31:21):
offense just getting really shut down like it did against Houston.
And like Steph for the entire stretch since Jimmy joined
the team twenty three games, was averaging twenty eight and
a half points per game on sixty seven percent through shooting.
He was looking like a top four player on the planet.
And then he has this game where he gives you
three points on one of ten shooting. The Warriors whole

(31:43):
offense only scores ninety six points. I will say it's
phenomenal defense by the Rockets, and they are doing everything
they can to keep Steph from beating them as a scorer.
They are blitzing every pick and roll, so the Warriors
had as many four on threes as they wanted in
this game. They are blanketing Steph off ball again, so

(32:05):
people have an opportunity to attack while all eyes are
on him away from the ball. So like the Warriors
as a team just weren't able to capitalize on that
enough against a defense that is so fast and athletic
as the Rockets, and with some of the limitations of
the Warriors supporting offensive pieces. But I also think even
though they were so devoted singularly to stopping Steph as

(32:29):
a scorer, Like you do see that Steph's scoring floor
against a team that has these sort of elite athletes
who are defending him elaciously like this, Like that scoring
floor is low. Now, man, he's got a two point
game this year, He's got a three point game this year.
He had a two point game last year. And that
just scares me a bit because I don't trust the

(32:52):
Warriors offense around him to pick up the slack and
to consistently punish teams for basically doing everything they can
to take away Steph as a scorer. Like Jimmy Butler's
seven field goal attempts is just not gonna cut it
in a playoff game. If you have a team devoting
so much attention to Steph like that, he's got to

(33:13):
step up at some point with the scoring volume. And
like I get it, it's the regular season. We've praised
him a million times for doing all the little things.
At some point he has to be that second star
scorer for this team and it hasn't happened. But maybe
it's just Brandon Pajemski logan. Maybe he's the second star,
because my god, he has been so good. He looks
so comfortable right now he is shooting at an elite

(33:34):
clip and that is really good news for the Warriors.
But I just still have that lingering concern about what
does their offense look like outside of Steph if he
can't be a superhero. And for twenty three games with Jimmy,
he was a superhero basically every night, and they were
winning basically every single game. And then you get a

(33:57):
reminder that, like, this is still possible, and uh, it's
just kind of like a cold bucket of water on
your head. Because I was feeling amazing about the Dubs
after the Nuggets game. I was like, this team is
humming in every possible way, and then you see the
floor and that is still something of a concern for me.

Speaker 1 (34:16):
B Pa kills me. Man.

Speaker 4 (34:17):
You can tell he ain't had a ton of big games, Bro,
the Nuggets one. When he hit that shrug, Bro, I
wanted to crawl out of my skin.

Speaker 1 (34:23):
I cringed so hard.

Speaker 3 (34:24):
How he couldn't miss? He could not miss?

Speaker 4 (34:27):
Dude, I've also thought about it long and hard. We
had that question on the mail bag a long time ago.

Speaker 3 (34:32):
Dude.

Speaker 1 (34:32):
Brandon Potziemski is one hundred percent of my NBA cop. Like,
it's not even the thought.

Speaker 3 (34:36):
How streaky he is or dub white boy streaky score
leftyft yep.

Speaker 4 (34:43):
Scoring probably isn't his first skill set, Like I was
thinking about it, It's like I just think, I don't know, man,
I think literally think that's my boy.

Speaker 1 (34:50):
He's just got too much hair. But that's like my
perfect NBA cop. Damn he's well balling uncontrollably.

Speaker 3 (34:58):
But that is the thing, Like, even though he followed
up the crazy games against the Lakers and the Nuggets
with another really good game, he played really well against Houston,
Like the Warriors' two biggest wins of the year, probably
against la and Denver, also happened to be POD's two
best games of the year. So that's why I was like,
this is amazing. But also what do we do with

(35:20):
the fact that Pods has given him twenty eight points
and twenty six points in back to back games and
isn't missing Because even though he's for a long stretch
been playing way better than he was at the beginning
of the year, you obviously can't expect that from him
night to night. So I feel like the Warriors ceiling
is crazy high when everything is going right. And then
I also feel like their floor is lower than some

(35:40):
of these other teams who are in a comparable range.

Speaker 1 (35:42):
I agree.

Speaker 4 (35:43):
I think that's due to the fact that this is
a limited athletic team overall, Like with some of their
certain lineups, right, if it's Steph on the floor, if
it's Podzimski, if it's Buddy Healed, Right, these really skilled guys,
none of them are high end.

Speaker 1 (35:57):
Athletes, often without a center exactly.

Speaker 4 (36:00):
If you're running Quinton Post or you're running Looney, right,
Looney's an actual physical exactly. They might be physical presences
at the least, but they're not athletes, and so I
think that's a real big limitation. The team is super
skilled though, if they can get hot, right, this is
a team that does have shooting, just not a ton
of isolation creators, guys that can do it by themselves

(36:22):
on ball. It's just stuff going to work, and so
I think you're right, man, I don't know. I think
it could be a mixed bag all playoffs long. I'm
hoping for better, but it could just be up and down.

Speaker 1 (36:33):
Man.

Speaker 4 (36:34):
Golden State seems like they could be a really hot
and cold team, and I think I was wrong last episode, man,
I was talking about you brought up a point about
the Warriors supporting cast and how you thought that was
the biggest question mark about this team, and I think
I kind of I was quick to brush down under
the rug. I think that is the biggest question mark
about this team, man.

Speaker 1 (36:52):
And it's not one guy. I think it's everybody.

Speaker 4 (36:55):
I think it's kaminga and filling in and doing his job,
because I think they desperately.

Speaker 1 (37:00):
Need come in to give them good minutes. Really, I
think they need that kind of.

Speaker 4 (37:04):
Athlete on the field, on the on the court, excuse me,
in some of these matchups like interesting, I think that
they need Moody to give them good defense and shooting.

Speaker 1 (37:13):
I think they need Buddy in his minutes to spray.

Speaker 4 (37:16):
I just think they need They don't need anybody to
go above and beyond, but they.

Speaker 1 (37:19):
Need everybody to pull their weight.

Speaker 4 (37:21):
And I think that if anybody leaves them short, it
could be it could be enough for the other team.

Speaker 1 (37:25):
Man.

Speaker 4 (37:25):
It's just gonna be how much can they get out
of them and how reliable the star is gonna be.

Speaker 1 (37:30):
Golden State just is a big variable.

Speaker 4 (37:34):
Man.

Speaker 1 (37:35):
I don't know. I don't know what to make of them.

Speaker 3 (37:37):
Man, Yeah, it's tough. I mean, when your entire team
changes at the deadline and then you have the best
record in the NBA basically from that point forward, but
the schedules lighter, Brandon Pajemski turns into Michael Jordan two
point zero. I think that Pods is probably the most
important player for them. I think that his consistency offensively
is vital because when he's an elite shooter, like you

(37:59):
feel pretty good about his ability to.

Speaker 1 (38:01):
He's you know, without the rock and working diss Like.

Speaker 3 (38:06):
I always say, Man, he does all the little things
all the time. It's just the scoring that comes and goes.
But when it's going, he is so good on the
Kaminga point, I honestly just lean towards like, don't play
him that much in the playoffs. I don't think it's
asking a lot for him to suddenly become a more consistent,
better basketball player with better feel, with better IQ, like

(38:29):
all the same things that have always been the problem
with Kaminga, the shot selection, the basketball IQ, the shot making,
the scoring efficiency, the consistency on the defensive end, terms
of effort, like they're all still the same problems. He
just doesn't get it. He just doesn't fit. And there
are moments and there are games where he does. But like,

(38:50):
I'm not using the playoffs as the period to be like,
all right, Johnny, let's see what you got. I think
it's fine to play him twenty plus minutes a night
in this final stretch of the regular season, just to
see what he has in him. But I'm not an
optimist about the role that he's gonna play for the
Warriors in this playoff run. And no, I don't think
that they necessarily need him. I see what you're saying
about the athleticism, but I do think they're starting five.

(39:13):
They're pretty fast, Dre and Jimmy are just such a
fearsome defensive duo that, like, I just don't think Kaminga
really does anything positive outside of his athleticism on the
basketball court. Like, I just think there's a whole lot
of negatives around that, and that's what's so frustrating about him.
He has so much raw physical ability but so little else.

Speaker 1 (39:35):
Honestly, theoretical, theoretical, Kaminga is a monster man.

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Speaker 3 (41:33):
The Dubs did get one big win over the weekend, though,
and that was over the Denver Nuggets, who everybody's beaten
right now. They've lost four straight. They're slipping in the standings.
There was a time where it looked like they very
well could be the two seed, and now they are
right in that group in the four through eight range,
who are separated by a total of half a game,
which is insane unprecedented. What needs to change for Denver

(41:56):
to make some playoff noise?

Speaker 4 (41:59):
Well, talking about Denver in this last stretch, over the
last four games, they have lost four straight. Over at
their nineteenth and offensive rating, twenty third in defensive rating
and twenty first in net rating. I think you got
to mention that they got to get their rotation right.
They haven't had Jamal Murray for the entire stretch. They
didn't play any of their starters against the Spurs. Against Minnesota,

(42:21):
they were shorthanded too, without a lot of starters. So
I think that's important. Yeah, I think that's important to preface.
First thing I can.

Speaker 1 (42:31):
Say is play some damn defense. I don't know, man,
I'm I'm just disappointed.

Speaker 4 (42:38):
I've been waiting for this defensive switch to click with
Denver all damn year, and it's just not gonna happen.
I don't think like I keep waiting for It's like
a Denver's in a deep sleep on defense and I
just keep waiting for him to.

Speaker 1 (42:50):
Pop up out of bed and snap out their dream.

Speaker 4 (42:53):
Jokic is sometimes a serious defensive liability at the five,
especially on an island versus teams with good primter shooting
outside of him, because I think sometimes he can get
too much blame.

Speaker 1 (43:04):
The whole team is just apathetic.

Speaker 4 (43:06):
At times because it hasn't changed with Denver on offense.
I know they've been in a bit of a skid,
but I trust Jokics in this team to generate really
good offense. I think the defense has just been pissed poor.
That being said, I don't know where you stand, Carson.
I'm kind of ready to punt on Denver. In the
big picture with this season, I think we have seen

(43:28):
serious regression from this title team.

Speaker 1 (43:31):
I think opponents have.

Speaker 4 (43:32):
Figured out a better game plan and not figured them out.

Speaker 1 (43:36):
You don't figure NICOLEA.

Speaker 4 (43:38):
Jokic out, but I think they have figured out ways
to work around them. You know, how to exploit their defense,
how to limit them a little bit offensively, and I
think their flaws have come to light, specifically the defense,
the depth, the offensive limitations around Jokic, and the lack
of volume three point shooting. And so I don't have

(43:59):
any big expectations anymore for Denver. Man, I'm as well
rounded as some of these other teams are in the
Western Conference. I'm moving closer to Denver is closer to
the bottom of the playoff teams in the West than
the top, or at least.

Speaker 1 (44:13):
Around the middle one.

Speaker 4 (44:16):
I always think this is important to say with Denver,
and I guess I gotta cover all my bases. Jokic
is such a problem that in a playoff series I
couldn't count Denver out from winning because if they don't
have the opposing team doesn't have the defensive personnel, I
could see Jokicic just big dogging the other team.

Speaker 1 (44:32):
That being said, I.

Speaker 4 (44:33):
Could also see this defense being poor enough in the
supporting cast, being poor enough that they could get bounced
in the first round. So I think Denver is a
double edged sword. But I don't think they're going on
a deep playoff run. I don't think they're going to
the Western Conference finals, and I increasingly, we talked about
this on a multitude of our last episodes. I'm ready

(44:53):
to focus on next year with this team. I don't
think they have the defensive personnel around Jokic, and that's
kind of the the biggest, harshest reality that I'm thinking
about with Denver is they just need to build up
the defense around Jokic.

Speaker 1 (45:09):
He is a liability at the five spot.

Speaker 4 (45:11):
He's or maybe not like necessarily like a complete liability,
but he's not a strength.

Speaker 3 (45:16):
He has big limitations that you need to be able to.

Speaker 1 (45:20):
That's a much better way of putting it, and.

Speaker 4 (45:22):
They need they need to compensate more for it, and
I think that starts with trading MPJ and Carson and
I have floated a lot of ideas over the past
few episodes. If it's getting in Andrew Wiggins right, if
it's getting a package deal to get one of these
defensive oriented wings. I am increasingly moving further and further
away from this team is really close to the title

(45:44):
to this team needs to make some major moves in
the offseason.

Speaker 3 (45:48):
I think you hit the nail on the head towards
the end there with just the unconscious shift that I've
gone through from being somebody who's defended Denver all year,
who said disc and absolutely be the second best team
in the West. They just need Jamal to be fully right,
they just need to play up to their defensive potential.
I've gone from that to thinking, Okay, how does this

(46:09):
team improve in the offseason, because clearly major changes are
needed and the season isn't over yet. So I think
that that tells you a lot about how I feel
about their chances to make a deep playoff run, and like,
maybe they could still make the conference finals with the
right matchups, with just an absolutely nuclear offensive run. But
the thing is they have to be perfect offensively because

(46:30):
the defense is that bad right now, and I don't
think you can expect the defense to get better at
this point in the year. So that is what is
so deeply concerning. You can look at a couple of
these losses and weirdly like clutch offensive breakdowns have been
part of it. Obviously, you have the Ross disastrous gaff
against the Timberwolves, and then this Pacers game, like just

(46:52):
a number of horrible passes down the stretch and pj
kind of forces one of Jolkics that Hallie makes a
really good play on in steels, and then a Pickett
just totally misses Jolkic on like a very simple close
range entry pass, and then they're just disorganized. On their
last real offensive possession, Christian Brown instead of coming over
top taking a handoff from Jokicic just like runs under

(47:14):
and into him, and then Jokic just kind of off
balance and he just like throws the ball away trying
to get it to Russ. So like they've had some
really bad execution in the clutch offensively, but that's outlier
stuff to me. This is a top three clutch offense
this year. It was a top three clutch offense last year.
You get Jamal on the floor that doesn't worry me,
but it has cost them a couple of these really

(47:35):
important games. But it's the defense that is so troubling.
And I saw a couple of great stats about this
pass game against Indiana and just how bad the Nuggets
defense was from two great follows on Twitter. First one
shout out Caitlin Cooper, who is probably the best person
I've seen at covering a single team. She covers the Pacers.

(47:57):
Indiana scored one point two nine points per chance when
Tyrese Haliburton passed out of blitz coverage against Denver. So
just absolutely picking the Nuggets apart. In four on threes.
They are such a good collective passing team, They're phenomenal
at capitalizing on those advantages. And Denver is really really
bad at defending for on threes in spite of the

(48:18):
fact that they put two on the ball basically every
possession out of pick and roll. Jason tim for Our
Good Friend tweeted out that Denver allowed twenty six unguarded
catch and shoot jumpers to Indiana. That's the second highest
total Indiana has generated all season. So like, you're just
bleeding wide open looks and this has been a consistent
problem for them. Because they bring Jokic up to the

(48:41):
level every time. They have to do that because he's
a bad drop defender, honestly, one of the worst drop
defensive bigs in the league, and he can't switch. He
doesn't have that sort of foot speed versatility on the perimeter,
and your point of attack defense sucks, your screen navigation sucks,
and the nugget, it's also suck at defending four on threes.

(49:02):
So they've been able to defend better within this scheme
in years past, but they've just completely fallen off a
cliff this year. I do think that the loss of
KCP has been devastating, and they just have no defensive versatility,
like they have to try to execute a scheme that
they are bad at basically regardless of matchup, and I

(49:23):
just don't see how that improves. I mean, I cannot
think of a player you could argue has been like
a legitimate positive defensively, and their whole starting five this year.
Even Aaron Gordon, I think, is at his worst defensive
seasons in years. Christian Brown I was optimistic about defensively,
but he's been a huge drop off from KCP, definitely

(49:44):
bigger than I even expected, and I was expecting a
drop off because I did think KCP was such a
great defensive guard last year. So this is what they're
walking into, man a postseason where you don't expect them
to be able to defend anybody, and they're just gonna
have to be like a whole time great offensively to
win series, which they're capable of. But that means Jamal

(50:05):
has to be healthy, which he's not right now, and
he has to be very good. That means Christian Brown
and PJ, Aaron Gordon all have to be shooting really well,
and Brown has been shooting quite well as of late.
Aaron Gordon has had a career shooting season has taken
a leap there. MPJ has been on and off at times.
But like I think people over state some of like

(50:28):
his shooting inconsistencies and like blame him too much for that.
When he's forty percent from DP, he's still an elite,
elite shooter, and then you know that Jokic is gonna
do his thing. And like, in spite of the fact
that they've lost the last three games that he's played in,
he's been unbelievable offensively, Like he's having the greatest offensive
season ever, and there's an argument this is the best
three game stretch of offense he's had this entire season.

(50:50):
Forty five twelve and eleven on seventy three percent true shooting,
like sixty point triple double against the Timberwolves, fifteen points
in the first quarter against the Warriors, and then there
was stretch in the third where he was just firing
threes and made three triples in like very short succession,
and then he had twenty in the first quarter against
the Pacers, like he's playing at that all time offensive level.

(51:12):
Their defense is just so bad, and that's why you
have to make perimeter defense by far your number one
priority this offseason. Perimeter defense, and also just like collective
athleticism and speed on the wings, guys who can make
plays on the back end, guys who can be more
effective in rotation and guarding some of those four on threes.

(51:36):
The whole perimeter defense just needs to get way better.
And the reason that I'm like at this point radicalized
to the position of trade MPG one hundred percent is
when Yolkicic is on the floor. Without MPJ, the Nuggets
have a one to twenty six offensive rating over the
last three years when yoll kicch is on the floor
without MPG, they have a plus nine relative offensive rating.

(51:58):
That's like one of the best offense is in NBA history.
That's what they do with Jokic without MPJ on the floor,
and that very clearly indicates to me, as does everything
over the last five years. I mean, if you think
back to the twenty twenty two season when Yokiic's out
there without both MPJ and Murray for basically that entire year,

(52:23):
like he can create all time great offensive results even
with inferior supporting talent offensively, because he's the best offensive
player that we've ever seen, but he has major limitations
and issues defensively. That's why you need to sacrifice some
offensive talent around him to go all in on your
defense and go all in on your depth because you're

(52:44):
going to be a great offense. Yokich is going to
make you a great offense, but you're not a complete
team right now. You're a team that's a plus on
one side of the ball and a D on the other,
and you're not going to win a title like that.

Speaker 4 (52:55):
Who are you willing to sacrifice in the offseason, What
rotation pieces and assets are you willing to move off
of MPJ.

Speaker 3 (53:02):
I mean, I think that he's obviously like the most
tradeable even though he's on a big contract. I still
think that Jamal is really really important to their formula,
and he's been playing so well offensively since his bad
start to the year. I'm keeping him. Aaron Gordon, I
still think is an excellent compliment to Jokic offensively, especially

(53:23):
with this improved shooting, and defensively I think has a
higher ceiling than what he's shown throughout this year. Christian
Brown is like such a great compliment to Jokic offensively
and just a really good basketball player. I'm not moving
him while he's on his rookie deal for sure. Else
they just need somebody at the two spot right now desperately,
So like it's MPJ who I'm dangling out there. And

(53:46):
then if somebody is like, hey, you need to give
me Peyton Watson to make this deal work, if it's
a really good deal, like I could see them making
that move. Although Peyton Watson does help their depth and
he does definitely help their defense with his athleticism, so
I'd be fully focused on just hey, what can we
get back for MPJ, and we'll take a lesser offensive player,

(54:06):
and ideally we would be able to get back like
a starting wing and then also a depth piece, so
we can address multiple needs at once. But IBJ is
still really talented. He is. I mean, he's an insane shooter.
He's a really good offensive player. They just don't need
that offense. It's like superfluous at this point when they're
great offensively with him off the floor, and they're desperately

(54:28):
needing defensive athleticism and talent.

Speaker 4 (54:31):
I wish the Nuggets could get somebody like DFS or
somebody like that, like a really really.

Speaker 3 (54:35):
I'm just thinking, man, I mean, he would make them
a better basketball team if they swapped MPJ straight up
for DFS to be a better basketball team today, which
is crazy when you think about what they were able
to do in the title run. But the defense has
just regressed so much since then, and now they desperately
need to get more athletic and they don't need mpj's offense,

(54:57):
even though I still think he's a phenomenal offensive fit
alongside Yokic, I really do. They just can't be dedicating
forty million dollars to a player who is as limited
as he is, and who you feel like you can
supplement a good bit of the offensive value and then
get way more defensive value for a cheaper price. Like
I really just feel like prioritizing depth around Jokic should

(55:19):
be your philosophy in general defense and depth man, because
he elevates everybody. See, you don't need to be super
invested in a ton of guys paying a number of
guys forty million dollars if you feel like you can
replicate their value in the agrig good.

Speaker 1 (55:33):
Good defenders, in spot up shooters and.

Speaker 3 (55:36):
Yeah, man, and you're gonna be really really good. And
the Nuggets did not execute that formula this year whatsoever.
So they can still do something in the playoffs, but
I just feel worse and worse about them as time
goes along. I want to ask you something that was
on my mind today, Logan. It's about great defense, unlike

(56:00):
what the Denver Nuggets have been doing this year. Who
do you think has been the most valuable non big
defender in the NBA this season. We're not including Draymond
because he basically is a big. I mean, he's been
his team's starting center for twenty some games now. I
had three dudes who came to the top of my mind,
Jalen Williams, A Men Thompson, Dyson Daniels. Who would you take?

(56:23):
You can go outside of that group if you want,
but who do you think has been that best non
big defender this year, the most valuable?

Speaker 1 (56:30):
I take your baby boy and men Thompson.

Speaker 3 (56:32):
Thank you very much. I think I kiss you on
the top of your head because you chose right, let's go.

Speaker 1 (56:38):
That's all I wanted.

Speaker 4 (56:41):
I mean, there's an athletic, a major, major athletic difference
I think between a man and both of these other guys.
I also think there's a significant rebounding gap between all
of them on the offensive and defensive glass.

Speaker 1 (56:55):
And that's why I think I prefer a men.

Speaker 4 (56:57):
I think a man is the best athlete out of
the bunch, but I also think he has the best
versatility defensively and how he can impact the game.

Speaker 1 (57:04):
You were mentioning.

Speaker 4 (57:04):
Earlier against the Warriors, just all the plays he blows
up that you just shouldn't be able to. A man
does it routinely, like every single night. I don't know
if I've ever seen as good a defender as a
man in transition, like he blows up stuff that should
just be like easy buckets for the opposing team, either
if he's slowing the fast breakdown if he's actually blocking

(57:27):
a shot or forcing a turnover in transition. He's really
good there. He's great on ball, he can pick up
ninety four feet, he can apply an elite ball pressure.
I think he's a really good off ball defender in
terms of engagement, and I think he can be an
impactful rim protector. And so this is no slight at
j Ubber Dyson Daniels. I think personally, I think there's

(57:49):
a pretty big chasm between Dyson and Jadevin a Men
as well, just because I think there's a significant gap
between how impactful Dyson can be as a low man
and rim protector. Dyson's a really good on ball defender
and one of the best defensive playmakers at his position,
but there's a significant athletic and rim protection gap between

(58:10):
the other two guys. And then I still think even
though Jadab I think is an elite defender, I think
there's an athletic and versatility gap between him and a Men.
I think Amen's one of the best defenders on the
planet today and he's so impactful in so many different roles,
and he's so smart. This is coming off like a
Men Thompson glaze fest. But what else do you expect

(58:31):
here at nerd sess Man.

Speaker 1 (58:32):
I mean, and.

Speaker 4 (58:33):
As we've previously stated, this is a glaze free zone.

Speaker 1 (58:37):
So if you don't like it, you can go kick
some rocks.

Speaker 3 (58:40):
This is a glaze free zone. No, no, no, no, it's
definitely my ball zone.

Speaker 1 (58:44):
We are proglazed. My fault, my fault.

Speaker 3 (58:45):
We are pro glaze, especially when it comes to a men.
Can I glaze myself in reference to glazing? Amends?

Speaker 1 (58:51):
Sure?

Speaker 3 (58:51):
Short The tweet from March twenty twenty four a little
over a year ago, and Men Thompson has been blowing
me away lately as legit best in the world in
several categories settle down, logan, overall athleticism, transition, offense, perimeter defense,
wing rebounding. I mean, dude, we're already talking about him
in the conversation for best perimeter defender, best wing rebounder

(59:12):
on the planet and he's doing that in year two.
What an absolute freak. That tweet is going to age
like wine. It already is. My choice is of men
here as well. Dyson, I kind of expected to be
the people's choice on this one, and maybe I have
a misrepresented Twitter following because maybe I've put together an

(59:33):
army of amen glazers. But I asked who's the more
valuable defensive player? And seventy two percent of people set
A men, twenty eight percent said Dyson Daniels. So like
the people are rocking with the men, and I do
think that that's correct, and like a lot of it
just comes down to positional value. That's why I say
who is the most valuable non big defender. You can

(59:57):
only impact the game so much as an elite point
of attack guard defender, and you can impact the game
a good bit and Dyson by far number one in
the league in deflections and steals, But when you can
provide that high level perimeter defense and that elite back
line defense as a bigger wing who is extremely versatile

(01:00:20):
in terms of the types of players you can guard,
who is extremely impactful on the glass, like, I just
can't pass that up. And that's what both A Men
and Jadub are I mean. Jadob is a really really
strong contender for this title. In my opinion, he's a
ninety fourth percentile isolation defender this year. He's seventh in deflections.
Extremely active, extremely aggressive, phenomenal hands on ball and blows

(01:00:45):
so many plays up as the low man. Is also
up there for the best rim protecting wing in basketball,
sell deposing players eleven percent below their average at the
rim this year. That's like an elite big man number.
And he's defended that's better than mobile. It's insane. It's insane,
well chilling, my boy, I am mobly. Listen. We comparison
to the Thief.

Speaker 1 (01:01:04):
Of joy lies just for content, just for content.

Speaker 3 (01:01:06):
No, it's incredible. And there was a stretch of the
year where he was actually anchoring the Thunder defense as
their center and they were still a pretty good defense
in that stretch. So like, he does have incredible versatility,
He's an incredibly smart defensive player. He's got those freakishly
long arms. With the seven to two wingspan, he and
the men bring similar value in a lot of areas.

(01:01:28):
And I do think that he's probably a little bit
smarter defensively than a men at this point. I do
think that he reads the game at a really high level,
but a man is still smart and has really good
instincts defensively, and then he's just a different level of
a freak athlete. Man, it's just absolutely insane traits that

(01:01:51):
put him in the conversation for being the best athlete
in the history of this game. His lateral quickness, his
insane vertical pop, his length at six foot seven, so
a Man is holding opposing players ten percent below their
average at the rim. I would say these have been
the two best rimp protecting wings in basketball this year.
While he is also capable of as we saw, hounding

(01:02:12):
Steph Curry off ball, giving Shay major trouble on ball
as an elite point of attack defender. There and Jade
Banemen both have really great matchup versatility on ball, but
I would say that a Men is pretty clearly the
more dominant on ball defender because his ability to overwhelm
you athletically, it's just next level, Like he's the best

(01:02:34):
on ball shot blocking wing in basketball. He can just
smother you. He does that even to flat out stars,
where he just destroys them. And he's got the craziest
motor of any of the players we're talking about. And
he's the best rebounder of this bunch, and he's the
best transition defender of this bunch. Absolutely insane there, and

(01:02:55):
like he just makes impossible defensive plays he does. He
does things that should not be possible and do not
look real. And it's not just like, oh, he's a
defensive highlight machine. Like no, he is so impactful play
to play and he's doing absolutely insane stuff every single game.
So he would be my choice. Jadeub is close, but

(01:03:18):
a man would be my choice, and I think he's
gotta be First team All Defense. Guy's absolutely insane.

Speaker 1 (01:03:24):
I think so too. I'm right there with you.

Speaker 4 (01:03:25):
Man.

Speaker 3 (01:03:26):
The regular season is almost over, Logan, so we're just
gonna be talking about the NBA elite for the rest
of the year. We're just gonna be talking about the playoffs.
But before we get into that mode, I want to
take one last chance to talk about the teams who
are gonna miss out on the Big Dance this year.
If you exclude the Spurs, who I think would obviously
be the choice for this question. Otherwise, which team who's

(01:03:49):
not even gonna make the play in this year? Logan,
do you think has the brightest future?

Speaker 4 (01:03:55):
For me? It's pretty simple, and we did a little
bit of this thought exercise about a week go on
front of the show on the Joel Moran Show, a
little bit of this or that. I think it's the
Portland Trail Blazers. I really liked what the Blazers are
cooking up. One.

Speaker 1 (01:04:11):
I thought they took a really major leap from last
season to this season.

Speaker 4 (01:04:16):
Not a Pistons level leap to where they're legitimately in
the playoffs, but.

Speaker 1 (01:04:21):
Competitive team night to night.

Speaker 4 (01:04:23):
Where last year, I mean, they were a bottom feeder,
rolled on by every team, nothing really to hang their
hat on. And I think that the Blazers have established
an identity for themselves.

Speaker 1 (01:04:33):
Most importantly, it's the.

Speaker 4 (01:04:35):
Defensive identity that they've cultivated.

Speaker 1 (01:04:38):
I really like some of the young personnel.

Speaker 4 (01:04:40):
I think the biggest guy that I'm most confident in
figuratively and literally is Donovan Klingon.

Speaker 1 (01:04:46):
I think Donovan Klingon is a stud.

Speaker 4 (01:04:49):
I really wish the Charlotte Hornets had drafted him in
the draft. I thought that he was the no brainer
pick for them for what they needed, but he slipped
to the Blazers at seven. I thought it was the
steal of the draft. He is an a lead, a
lead rebounder. He is an elite rim protector, and I
think has got more offensive game than some of the
numbers would suggest. I think he's a guy that you

(01:05:10):
can dump the ball to in the block and feed
for some easy post touches. On top of that, I
thought we saw a really great year from Toomani Kamara.
We were talking about really impactful defensive wings. Kamara has
to be there. I think he leads the NBA in
charges taken this year too.

Speaker 1 (01:05:27):
He's been excellent at that.

Speaker 4 (01:05:29):
And again, it's really hard. I want to emphasize that point.
I like their personnel, but it's really hard to get
young guys to buy in defensively and to get a
team to commit that much on this end, and those
two guys I think really really have.

Speaker 1 (01:05:43):
But it doesn't stop there.

Speaker 4 (01:05:44):
Denny Avdia has blossomed into this do it all wing
who I know you've loved since he was a prospect
Carson and we liked him as an asset from Washington.
I think he's played even better this year, where not
only is he's been a monster defensively, but you're seeing
some of the playmaking and some of the scoring now
more that he's been given more opportunity here in Portland,

(01:06:05):
and then on top.

Speaker 1 (01:06:06):
Of that, two guys that I think.

Speaker 4 (01:06:08):
A year ago, if you would ask, were probably the
building blocks for this team, they still got and I
think have had good years. I think Scoot Henderson and
Shade and Sharp still have a lot more to grow
in and to tap into offensively. Is real building blocks
for this team. And so there's just a lot of
young players that I like on this roster man and
there's a lot to work with here where I think

(01:06:29):
you can pick and choose for the future, right because
it's not just guys that are going to be here,
it's assets that you could move on to other teams.

Speaker 1 (01:06:37):
Right.

Speaker 4 (01:06:37):
If that's an Ant Simon's, if Avdia is one of
those guys that's gonna get moved on from, if it's
Jeremy Grant, I think they've got building blocks that I
like for the future, guys that you can build a
solid foundation on, and Clinging and Camara and Shade and Sharp.

Speaker 1 (01:06:53):
But they've also got assets that they.

Speaker 4 (01:06:54):
Coul dangle in front of teams and going out and
get future assets or going get win now players.

Speaker 1 (01:07:00):
For me, it's far and away Portland. I think they've got.

Speaker 4 (01:07:04):
If there was a team I was gonna pick that
would go from this non lottery or lottery to play
an area to a playoff team next year, I think
it would be Portland.

Speaker 3 (01:07:14):
Yeah, it sucks that all the good teams are in
the West though, man, except for like it does right
three of them, because it's hard to make the playoffs
in the Western Conference. But I also would take Portland
here pretty easily. And they just extended their GM Joe
Cronin today very appropriate because he's done a really nice
job with the rebuild there. You mentioned the three pieces

(01:07:39):
who are my favorites here, and like they're not necessarily
the shiniest, they're not necessarily the most offensively gifted.

Speaker 4 (01:07:47):
I think that the most they got the most winning
impact right now.

Speaker 3 (01:07:51):
They're dudes who are going to help any team win
basketball games, man. And that's Klingon, who was already one
of the best rim protectors and one of the best
rebounders on the planet, and I think can grow offensively.
I think he's got good touch, I think he's got
good feel as a passer, and his size is just
absolutely insane. He's gonna be super productive and impactful for
his entire career. Jimani Kamara all defense caliber wing, like

(01:08:13):
really really good team defender, as you mentioned, makes some
plays at the rim, takes charges, and also has insane
matchup versatility as an on ball defender. And he's a
really good rebounder. He's a great offensive rebounder, shooting over
thirty seven percent from deep, like has grown into a
very solid offensive player as well. I want that dude
on my team every single day of the week. And
then Danny, I have always been a real believer in

(01:08:37):
as a basketball player. And he's having a very good season.
He's averaging seventeen to seven and four on over sixty
percent through shooting, has legitimate on ball juice, is super
effective as a driver, gets to the line at a
really good rate, good passer, good rebounder, versatile defender shooting
almost thirty seven percent from three. So like, all those
guys are making two way impacts, they're versatile, and they're

(01:08:59):
winning basketball players fundamentally, And like this what's crazy logan.
When those three are on the floor together, the Blazers
have a plus seven point three net rating that is
by far the best three man lineup combo out of
any of their top twenty five lineup combinations by usage.
I didn't know that before. I highlighted those three as
like by far my favorite building blocks for this team.

(01:09:22):
But they have a defensive rating of sub one oh
seven in those minutes. It's such a great defensive corps
and I'm so optimistic about what they can be on
that side of the ball. And then offensively, like there's
some intriguing pieces. Shade and Sharp I do think is
the guy who has the highest ceiling out of this group. Like,

(01:09:43):
he's an excellent athlete and a really good finisher at
the rim. He was efficient as an isolation creator and
pick and roll creator. This year. He just has to
shoot better, a lot better. He had a really down
shooting year thirty percent from deep. That's really surprising, can
say during the level he shot at his first couple
of years in the league and the level of shooter
he was as a prospect, I think he's actually got

(01:10:05):
a pretty pretty special combination of slashing and outside shooting ability,
and you know, he's got to continue to definitely refine
his game and grow as a playmaker. So like, I'm
not as confident in him just being like a winning
basketball player as I am with the three dudes who
I mentioned, but I definitely see a lot of upside
with him. Offensively, He's gonna give you numbers no matter what.

(01:10:26):
The question is, how efficient is he? What level does
he get to in terms of enhancing other people around him?
And then like there's more good pieces here. We know
who ant Simon's is like bad defender, not gonna be
super efficient, hasn't grown as a playmaker to the level
where it's like you're gonna entrust him with really running

(01:10:47):
your offense. So he's probably a piece who you try
to move. I don't know, he's expiring next year.

Speaker 4 (01:10:55):
I think that's what makes Portland really really interesting though,
is that kind of blend of yeah, you know, they've
got like guys on bigger contracts, but they're maybe not
the most valuable assets. Like you know, I've been critical
of this guy and I thought he had a decent year,
But like DeAndre Ayden is another guy that I would
be willing to shop and see.

Speaker 1 (01:11:14):
All right, yeah, who wants them?

Speaker 4 (01:11:15):
Give me back, give me back a young piece, give
me back a pick, give me something like. That's what's
really fascinating about Portland to me is that they have
an abundance of assets that you know, don't necessarily fit
with their timeline, and I'm just really intrigued at what
they could do in the big time moves they could
make in this offseason to to get better, to get younger,

(01:11:38):
or to move around, because I would be chomping at
the bit to move off of Aiden and insert clinging
into that starting five.

Speaker 3 (01:11:46):
Hundred and both Simon's and Aiden are on expiring contracts
next year. They're both basically who they are at this point. Like,
I'm not really expecting growth from either one and uh
not pieces I would be super invested in long term,
and they're both a little bit older than the rest
of your timeline, so like I would definitely be looking
to try to get off of those two guys to

(01:12:08):
get some assets back. And you're right, I mean that
is definitely an advantage that this team does have. They've
got a lot of talented basketball players, and even if
they don't all perfectly align with their man it's a
very good problem to have. And Scoot, I think could
be a solid starting point guard. Right I don't think
that he has the star ceiling that I thought he

(01:12:29):
did as a prospect. He just honestly is not the
remarkable athlete that he seemed to be as a prospect
when you drop him into an NBA context, But he
got a little better as a shooter this year. I
still think is a very solid passer, has been capable
defensively this year. Definitely needs to get better scoring inside
the arc, and like again, I'm not seeing star upside

(01:12:52):
there with him. But really, when I look at this group,
they just need that number one talent because like they
already have so many of those plug and play winning pieces.
I really like if they got that dude who was
like your franchise talent, your real offensive number one, then
I'd be all in on Portland. But they don't have
that guy. And unfortunately, unless they get really lucky in

(01:13:15):
the lottery, they're not gonna be in a good position
to get him this year because they're too good.

Speaker 4 (01:13:20):
I think I'm I think I'm a little more optimistic
about Scoot, Like I don't know.

Speaker 3 (01:13:25):
I think they're number one.

Speaker 1 (01:13:27):
I think he could be a really good number two.
I don't know about a number one.

Speaker 4 (01:13:30):
I think I think we saw him be a little
bit more efficient this year. I think we saw him
improve as a jump shooter marginally.

Speaker 1 (01:13:37):
Like I don't know he didn't have like a he didn't.
He didn't get worse this year.

Speaker 3 (01:13:43):
I thought he definitely got better, but he had a
rough rookie year.

Speaker 4 (01:13:46):
He did have a really rough rookie season, but I
thought the circumstances were tough. Then I'm just not out
on him, Like I think you're about right. I think
he could be an above average starting point guard. I
think he could be good, but I think I fundamentally agree.
I still think they need that guy.

Speaker 1 (01:14:01):
Do you think do Shade and Sharp have that kind
of upside to you or No?

Speaker 3 (01:14:06):
I don't think that he'll ever be an offensive number
one to me, just because I don't see him growing
that much as a playmaker.

Speaker 1 (01:14:13):
As a score, he could.

Speaker 3 (01:14:16):
Be a really really good scorer of the basketball. So maybe,
but like if your aspirations are contending, I don't know,
i'd want him to be my number two. And then
you've got your wings who do it all, and you've
got your big who anchors your defense and cling in.
I'm still looking for like that really great lead playmaker
and scoring. Honestly, I think it's just a great point guard,
and unfortunately, I don't think Scoot is gonna be that guy.

(01:14:38):
I think he can be solid, but like he has
improved as a jump shooter, the rim pressure, the rim finishing,
it's just not what I thought it would be. It's
been better than last year, but it's still just not good. Honestly,
it's not good enough.

Speaker 4 (01:14:53):
I think a Men's closer to what I thought school
was gonna be. Not like defensively, but like I.

Speaker 3 (01:14:57):
Think a Men is what I thought a Men was
gonna be.

Speaker 1 (01:15:00):
Bars. I just thought Scoo was gonna be better athletically.

Speaker 3 (01:15:04):
Yeah, but amen, you could see it. Man's that's crazy
athleticism from the jump with him as a prospect. So
Portland shout out to you. Had a very good season,
I think, very encouraging season and excited to see what
the future holds. What does the future hold for us? Well,
we've got some awards to talk about later this week.

(01:15:24):
We're gonna do our final contender rankings later this week
before the playoffs gets started, and then you better believe
the two month push, it's gonna be something special, Logan
throughout the NBA playoffs. Cannot wait for that. But if
you want to see the stuff that we've already got
out there, lock in Logan lock in lest I catch
you tweaking. You would hate to be caught tweaking at
a time like this, It's not even an option. If
you want to see the stuff we've already got out there,

(01:15:44):
you can find all of our full shows on our
YouTube channel. You can also see all of our video
essays and video breakdowns that we do there. You can
listen to the podcast across all audio platforms, and you
can follow us across social media TikTok and Instagram at
nerd sessh, Twitter at nerd Underscore. You can also join
our discord if you want to become part of our
community there, and you can check out our merch if

(01:16:06):
you want. That is linked in our link tree, as
is our discord, and you can also find the merch
at breakingte dot com. So with that, as always, appreciate
you guys. I've been Carson.

Speaker 1 (01:16:16):
Braber, I've been looking Camden and

Speaker 3 (01:16:18):
This was nerd Sash

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Decisions, Decisions

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Nerd Sesh - Real or Fake: Lakers DESTROY Thunder, Nuggets in FREE FALL